| 01:19.39 | A1win | got WASD controls for the ships now, but damn this code turned out ugly ;p |
| 01:25.58 | Otixa | A1win, like yo momma! |
| 01:30.14 | A1win | I had to close SC2 that was running on background because I started hearing music from among the ambient noise that it was playing while paused |
| 01:30.23 | A1win | it's not supposed to have any music in it D: |
| 01:30.38 | Otixa | lay off the drugs ;p |
| 01:32.36 | A1win | I need a name for this map |
| 01:33.29 | Otixa | which? |
| 01:33.43 | A1win | space ships in space |
| 01:33.44 | Otixa | got a fuckton of spare CPU power? ;p |
| 01:33.50 | Otixa | oh, that thing |
| 01:34.07 | Otixa | GALACTIC SCAVENGERS |
| 01:34.11 | Otixa | Tada! |
| 01:34.27 | A1win | I don't think there will be any scavenging |
| 01:34.41 | Otixa | not after I'm done with it ;p |
| 01:34.55 | Otixa | iunno |
| 01:35.01 | Otixa | just make it galactic something |
| 01:35.04 | Otixa | people love galactic |
| 01:35.06 | Otixa | ;DD |
| 01:35.15 | Otixa | it's like polygons |
| 01:35.17 | Otixa | but less shiny |
| 01:35.52 | A1win | galactic pew pew |
| 01:36.22 | Otixa | yup :> |
| 01:36.37 | Otixa | hnrgh |
| 01:36.40 | Otixa | 100 frames to go ;/ |
| 01:36.42 | A1win | cosmic pew pew |
| 01:36.54 | A1win | pew pew |
| 01:37.00 | A1win | I made a PP |
| 01:37.08 | Otixa | ;\ |
| 01:37.10 | Otixa | ;/ |
| 01:37.17 | Otixa | punches A1win in the shoulder |
| 01:37.20 | Otixa | Go make Unity stuff |
| 01:37.33 | A1win | I should finish this |
| 01:37.51 | Otixa | noe |
| 01:38.06 | Otixa | gimmie yer spare CPU cycles |
| 01:38.11 | A1win | noo |
| 01:38.23 | Otixa | but I need em for rendering >:C |
| 01:38.39 | Otixa | also lost my lighter again >;/ |
| 01:38.53 | Stewox | boy, you don't see this in the news everyday http://www.infowars.com/last-year-president-obama-reportedly-told-his-aides-that-hes-really-good-at-killing-people/ |
| 01:39.01 | Stewox | it's getting silly |
| 01:39.16 | A1win | yes it is... in here |
| 01:39.21 | Stewox | oh dammit wrong channel |
| 01:39.33 | Otixa | I'm sure |
| 01:39.59 | Otixa | 75 frames to go! |
| 01:40.23 | A1win | I want hearthstone beta key D: |
| 01:40.32 | Otixa | Not for you! ;p |
| 01:40.49 | Otixa | go make games |
| 01:40.57 | Otixa | and find me a cohost |
| 01:42.09 | A1win | have a flying sausage http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M74KNV2qMnE |
| 01:42.42 | Otixa | what kind of stoner music is this? D: |
| 01:42.57 | A1win | it's epic |
| 01:43.11 | A1win | some kinda psy |
| 01:43.33 | Otixa | too trippy |
| 01:43.41 | Otixa | barely sane as it is |
| 01:43.55 | A1win | it has cool melodies too |
| 01:44.21 | Otixa | eh, not bad |
| 01:44.26 | Otixa | but not my thing |
| 01:46.08 | Otixa | should prolly pre-render the outro... |
| 01:46.24 | Otixa | kinda shit having to wait 20min for every draft >;/ |
| 01:53.09 | A1win | uugh the clock is late, should've been here by now |
| 01:54.24 | Otixa | who? ;p |
| 01:54.29 | A1win | the clock |
| 01:55.04 | Otixa | clocks can walk? ;P |
| 01:55.09 | A1win | I'm just trying to be silly |
| 01:55.29 | A1win | more trippy music http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nWoQ9SZBhWs |
| 01:55.51 | Otixa | 10 frames! |
| 01:59.06 | Otixa | WOO! |
| 02:00.52 | JademusSreg | Back. |
| 02:02.36 | Otixa | wb |
| 02:02.40 | Otixa | JademusSreg A1win |
| 02:02.41 | Otixa | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4NEG4IfJc6Y |
| 02:02.46 | Otixa | Any thoughts? ;p |
| 02:02.53 | Stewox | jademussreg wanna see something funny ? |
| 02:03.00 | Otixa | (titles are placeholders) |
| 02:03.31 | JademusSreg | Love the tron-spooge, Otixa. Quite stylish. |
| 02:03.40 | Otixa | :> |
| 02:03.42 | Stewox | otixa couldn't handle it |
| 02:04.55 | A1win | whenever Stewox says "can't handle" I read "doesn't care" |
| 02:05.39 | A1win | I should sleep D: |
| 02:05.41 | JademusSreg | Stew, depends on the nature of the content. By default, my response to that query is "Sure", but given that you're on the bitbucketing list, I'll need some qualification first. |
| 02:05.43 | Stewox | he joined the crowd of those ... well i kind of can't think of a term |
| 02:06.15 | Otixa | Why is he even still here? ;/ |
| 02:06.21 | Stewox | well it was just kind of a, good night story |
| 02:06.25 | Stewox | of all the news and now this |
| 02:06.40 | Stewox | and i kind of mentioned it already, though it wasnt my intention |
| 02:07.14 | Stewox | so i'll send you on PM, ... i probably gather this falls into dat category |
| 02:12.17 | JademusSreg | Otixa, seconds 3 to 7, basically wasted. The white circle transition looks like MS Home Movies & Shit. The text-warp transitions are sexy, but they exist in a vaccuum, nothing else going on in the sequence; should instead have some visual content onto which the text is projected and which transforms along with the text. |
| 02:12.22 | A1win | JademusSreg, we tried the space map with 6 players last night or friday or something... lag wasn't too bad anymore although there were some performance drops for some players... everything moved way too fast, was insanely chaotic, no one could hit anything they wanted, and the game mode was extremely boring 8x |
| 02:12.53 | Otixa | JademusSreg, yeah, will be adding stuff to it still. And as I said, titles are placeholders :P |
| 02:13.03 | Otixa | thanks for feedback ;> |
| 02:13.37 | A1win | so my attempt to fix this is 1) make ship maximum velocity like 25% of what it was (limited by "speed of light") 2) make the ships die when they explode |
| 02:14.10 | A1win | also trying out WASD controls |
| 02:14.14 | A1win | for thrusters |
| 02:14.24 | JademusSreg | A1, yay for iterative design process. =D |
| 02:15.57 | A1win | not sure how to fix the performance drops though, if nothing else I just have to decrease the maximum possible number of projectiles by making ships shoot less frequently or make projectiles time out faster |
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| 02:19.27 | JademusSreg | Otixa, transformations not entirely unlike this scene, but using your tron-spooge visual aesthetic. http://youtu.be/9IwwG0fq3JU?t=11m21s |
| 02:19.45 | JademusSreg | =D |
| 02:20.09 | Otixa | mebbeh, if it doesn't take ages to do :P |
| 02:20.46 | Otixa | tweaking the outro scene a bit |
| 02:21.09 | Otixa | a bit meaning: fucking up the colors entirely |
| 02:21.33 | JademusSreg | Haha |
| 02:24.00 | JademusSreg | A1, another option is to not use missile units, and instead make the actors and control them via code. |
| 02:24.44 | JademusSreg | Unit instances can eat a lot of memory all by themselves. |
| 02:24.47 | A1win | nnf |
| 02:24.52 | JademusSreg | Haha |
| 02:25.06 | JademusSreg | Love that response. |
| 02:25.07 | A1win | well all I really use the units for is the movement |
| 02:25.25 | A1win | can it be as smooth by just using actors? |
| 02:25.29 | JademusSreg | Yep. |
| 02:25.41 | A1win | should probably do that then |
| 02:26.47 | A1win | oh and I also use unit groups, would have to script a data structure for them |
| 02:27.01 | A1win | which I can do but... nnf |
| 02:27.40 | A1win | I'll do those later, need to even get this game fun first |
| 02:29.25 | JademusSreg | DataTable may be the best way to go for arbitrary data group. |
| 02:29.39 | A1win | mm... |
| 02:30.20 | A1win | now I'm back to the deathmatch problems too x\ |
| 02:31.11 | JademusSreg | Since you'd be iterating an abstract group, you'd assign them a common name string and concatenate an index to iterate. Weee. |
| 02:31.28 | A1win | yeah I know ;x |
| 02:32.09 | A1win | I'd just actually have to do it |
| 02:33.41 | JademusSreg | My apologies. As for the game mode, if well-reasoned concepts and contextually-appropriate mechanics & objectives are making for dull gameplay, just be completely fucking ridiculous. If that sounds terrible, you're forgetting the lessons demonstrated by Adult Swim and Rodrigo. |
| 02:35.09 | A1win | your goal is to make ships explode as close as possible to every 14.7 seconds of game time |
| 02:35.32 | JademusSreg | Excellent. Drone war, easy. |
| 02:37.08 | JademusSreg | Take a note from Saints Row and make the elements and mechanics entertaining in their own right. =D |
| 02:37.18 | A1win | hehe |
| 02:37.50 | A1win | they're only entertaining for a moment ;p |
| 02:38.19 | JademusSreg | Naw, I mean beyond the superficial humor of a given gag or cultural reference. |
| 02:38.47 | JademusSreg | That's the surface level, beneath which one finds the joy of playing with the mechanic. |
| 02:39.10 | JademusSreg | Taken together, the humor inspires the novelty of the mechanic. |
| 02:42.24 | JademusSreg | Slow-moving Impregnator Drones seek out enemy ships. On impact, they start a little timer; once the duration expires, it explodifies the ship and releases secondary high-velocity Bouncing Baby Mines, able ricochet off planets. |
| 02:44.41 | A1win | what if weapon firing sound effects were clips from a dubstep song |
| 02:46.23 | JademusSreg | Alright. That's a presentational element. Unless the weapon's purpose is to get players to quit the game by annoying them, it needs a mechanic. |
| 02:46.37 | A1win | ;p |
| 02:47.26 | A1win | I just have wubwubwub stuck in my head and it was the only thing I could think of |
| 02:48.37 | A1win | been playing D3 with 4 wizards from lvl 1 with dubstep in the background, 4x disintegrate is funny |
| 02:48.41 | JademusSreg | It's cool, just need to consider what it does. Does it latch on to ships and vibrate them dealing DoT? |
| 02:50.01 | A1win | you sound like you're trying to turn my lack of ideas into an asset |
| 02:50.16 | JademusSreg | Flavor text: "Bass line intensity: LETHAL" |
| 02:51.31 | A1win | I guess this can work as pure deathmatch if I simply make it fun as hell, ezpz |
| 02:52.08 | JademusSreg | A1, I'd expect you to know I'm able to spin shit into games. A veritable Rumplestiltskin of design. |
| 02:52.26 | A1win | ;x |
| 02:53.23 | JademusSreg | On a related note, "Rumplestiltskin" is among the greatest veiled cock-jokes? |
| 02:53.29 | JademusSreg | Definitely. |
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| 02:55.15 | A1win | what if when you die, you get a random weapon loadout from a few weapons that you've chosen before the game |
| 02:55.35 | A1win | like two different weapons, one for each mouse button |
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| 02:56.34 | A1win | and you rarely live very long |
| 02:56.56 | A1win | which would probably have to mean that there is little you can do to restore health |
| 02:56.59 | A1win | dunno |
| 03:00.04 | A1win | that's a bit like Half-Life DM worked too, you spawn into random spot and need to grab weapons along your way |
| 03:00.17 | A1win | (and I guess many other DMs too) |
| 03:00.31 | A1win | so you kind of have a random weapon |
| 03:01.44 | JademusSreg | remembers playing Counter-Strike with friends, then revisiting Half-Life DM and dominating obscenely with crossbows. |
| 03:04.29 | A1win | sleep time -> |
| 03:17.20 | JademusSreg | bbl |
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| 04:02.45 | Ownage | anyone know about unit tags? |
| 04:03.15 | Ownage | specifically, are they useful for using for array index? or are they huge |
| 04:05.20 | Ownage | also what is 'unit is valid' condition? |
| 04:07.01 | Ownage | also I noticed theres no class type for 'commandable', is there a simple way to check that via trigger |
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| 04:28.23 | Otixa | oi |
| 04:28.28 | Otixa | do we have a sound guy? ;p |
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| 05:42.18 | Zandose | hi |
| 05:58.50 | JademusSreg | Otixa, I figured, you being (eastern) european, you'd know demoscene people. =D |
| 05:59.04 | Otixa | huhwut |
| 05:59.09 | Otixa | I don't deal with people ;p |
| 06:00.02 | JademusSreg | Ah. You're the sovereign nation of Otixa. |
| 06:00.15 | Otixa | nods |
| 06:00.16 | Otixa | :> |
| 06:00.42 | Otixa | On the more serious side, don't know any ;p |
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| 07:11.00 | Ownage | does the editor have a list or set type of variable |
| 07:11.15 | Ownage | any way to natively store a list of for example integers |
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| 07:28.27 | Ownage | I'm just trying to think of one single way that "Unit Tag" could be useful ever |
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| 08:42.14 | JademusSreg | Oops. |
| 08:42.43 | JademusSreg | Own, can you clarify? You're asking about generic data structures, yeah? |
| 08:49.19 | JademusSreg | http://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/1pkq5y/depth_of_micro_a_detailed_critique_on_the/ Replace every use of the word "hardcoded" with "softcoded". |
| 08:55.06 | JademusSreg | Also, numerous misconceptions for a self-styled "data editor". |
| 09:01.06 | JademusSreg | Difficult to spot something that's not wrong in the op comment. |
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| 09:07.02 | Bommes | wait, you talking about the OP video from Lalush or the comment on top from decemberscalm? |
| 09:07.38 | JademusSreg | Comment. |
| 09:08.22 | JademusSreg | Pardon the confusion, I'm not acquainted with reddit lexicon. |
| 09:09.05 | JademusSreg | Specifically, decemberscalm is a fountain of errors. |
| 09:13.43 | ArcanePariah | About to say, first line, "Turrets have no way to track targets in range". Wtf? |
| 09:14.17 | ArcanePariah | Its called... require attack command on the weapon to not have them autoshoot.. |
| 09:14.45 | ArcanePariah | Acquring target makes them stop.... lol weapon, allowed movement = moving |
| 09:15.01 | ArcanePariah | And apparently he hasn't heard of strafe weapons |
| 09:15.02 | JademusSreg | See also TargetSorts |
| 09:15.18 | ArcanePariah | Aka interceptor/muta weapons, fire on the move and keep moving |
| 09:15.24 | Bommes | it would be kind of cool to have an easy to implement option for turrets/weapons to save the last target that was in the attack command queue and only attack that |
| 09:15.37 | Bommes | so there is a middle ground between autoattack and stop to shoot |
| 09:15.46 | Bommes | dunno if there is, maybe I just don't know |
| 09:15.51 | ArcanePariah | There is... have it not reacquire |
| 09:16.04 | ArcanePariah | Set acquire fliters to nothing or maybe scan filters |
| 09:16.11 | JademusSreg | Of course, would be a bother to post on reddit, but figured folks here could enjoy the comment there. |
| 09:16.37 | Bommes | I already enjoyed it a couple of days ago :D |
| 09:16.43 | Bommes | Lalush's original video is pretty good though |
| 09:17.03 | JademusSreg | =D |
| 09:17.06 | JademusSreg | brb |
| 09:17.14 | ArcanePariah | This one is hilarious "Warp Prisms have a small amount of accelleration."... NO SHIT, EVERYTHING FOR MOVEMENT CAN BE CHANGED... jesus... |
| 09:17.41 | Bommes | like not great, it also makes some false assumptions imo |
| 09:18.11 | ArcanePariah | Also... No backswing according to him... I guess I'm purely imagining the field in weapons called... backswing |
| 09:18.18 | ArcanePariah | *Facepalm* |
| 09:18.24 | Bommes | :D |
| 09:18.46 | Bommes | but I also think the way flying units handle in SC2 feels pretty sluggish as soon as they move in a squad |
| 09:18.52 | Bommes | it could definitely be improved |
| 09:19.13 | ArcanePariah | Literally a wealth of fail in that thread, like they guy not understanding how collision works and how push priority works |
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| 09:20.06 | Bommes | I think the best thing about it is the reddit bandwagon of people who have no idea of the whole thing just agree with it as if that form of validation has any meaning |
| 09:21.59 | Bommes | does SC2 backswing work the same as BW or WC3 backswing? I haven't modified either of these games so I don't know |
| 09:23.24 | Bommes | like SC2 backswing as far as I know can be cancelled by an order that the player gives to the unit, right? Is that the case for WC3 or BW backswing as well? |
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| 09:29.06 | ArcanePariah | So I'm back, some better stuff in that thread, but still the original post was fail |
| 09:32.06 | Bommes | I think people should just ignore the points in the comment, the video is what is important for the most part |
| 09:32.52 | Bommes | it makes some interesting points about separation radius and units stopping instead of gliding when issued an attack command with overkill involved |
| 09:33.50 | ArcanePariah | Yeah, that has been discussed quite a bit, how the better AI pathing + smaller separation radii have made for deathballs (along with unlimited unit selection) |
| 09:34.21 | Bommes | separation radius is an air unit value, it's not even about the small unit radiuses in general |
| 09:34.33 | Bommes | more about how separation radius interacts with for example attack commands |
| 09:34.54 | ArcanePariah | IMO, BW and SC2 are opposite extremes, BW you had 2 opponents, the enemy and the UI/Game engine, in SC1, that 2nd enemy is gone, so people Amove after macroing like mad |
| 09:35.06 | Bommes | how the attack command isn't issued immediately but rather units are separated first and only then the attack command is issued |
| 09:35.28 | Bommes | which means air units feel more and more sluggish the more you are controlling at the same time |
| 09:36.27 | ArcanePariah | Welp... I can see why that is an issue, but... wouldn't that simply encourage using small tactical groups for better micro, instead of a 30+ of single air units (Mutas/Voids) |
| 09:36.48 | ArcanePariah | Because if that was removed, Mutas become even more powerful, no? |
| 09:38.31 | Bommes | theoretically it would, but you don't see that in reality because it's super easy to shut down single air units and they are no real threat |
| 09:38.56 | JademusSreg | Stututututter step marine micro, an product of minimal backswing. |
| 09:39.23 | Bommes | isn't that more a product of a low damage point? I thought the SC2 backswing is cancellable anyways |
| 09:39.32 | ArcanePariah | Fair point, I don't keep up much with melee, but I had heard that Mutas were regularly massed due to their speed and thus hit and run attacks that were difficult to counter |
| 09:39.35 | Bommes | and only applies to queued orders |
| 09:40.06 | Bommes | yeah obviously a change like that would affect balance and mutas among other units would have to be made weaker in return |
| 09:40.14 | Bommes | mutas are massed because they are strong and fast |
| 09:40.21 | Bommes | not because you can micro them well |
| 09:40.55 | Bommes | the whole video is not about balance, it's about how much fun it is to micro units and how much encouragement and value players get out of it |
| 09:41.14 | JademusSreg | Backswing is the duration following application of weapon effect during which the attack order is still active. Not to be confused with the attack animation. |
| 09:41.56 | Bommes | but the attack order can be replaced by a move command input from the player, right? |
| 09:43.01 | ArcanePariah | Bommes: Yes, sadly people flat out want action games, they don't want strategy games. Strategy is boring because it leads to winning the game long before the actual end |
| 09:43.22 | ArcanePariah | In the extreme, it is know as Win at Chracter Select |
| 09:43.43 | ArcanePariah | IE, I made a better pregame choice, therefore I will almost certainly win |
| 09:44.09 | Bommes | So, chess is no strategy game for you? |
| 09:45.05 | ArcanePariah | Umm, chess has a very very limited set of choices, and more importantly, the game is symmetrical, both players start on equal footing (actually not, but close enough) |
| 09:45.34 | ArcanePariah | It is a strategy game because you can choose on a general style of play |
| 09:45.35 | Bommes | SC2 also has a limited set of choices |
| 09:45.50 | ArcanePariah | Nope, because it is assymetrical |
| 09:45.59 | ArcanePariah | Also it has far far more variables |
| 09:46.23 | Bommes | chess is also assymetrical since one player is white and always begins |
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| 09:46.27 | ArcanePariah | Let me be more correct: SC2 does have limited choices, but the set of choices for an average sc2 game far exceeds chess |
| 09:46.28 | ArcanePariah | Yes |
| 09:46.35 | Bommes | how does that prevent a limited set of choices |
| 09:46.40 | ArcanePariah | Which is why, mathemtaically, black can at best hope for a draw |
| 09:47.05 | ArcanePariah | Well the other important aspect is the asymeetry of information in sc2 |
| 09:47.21 | ArcanePariah | In chess, both players know everything about the game state at all times |
| 09:47.31 | ArcanePariah | In sc2, there is massive amounts of unknowns |
| 09:48.01 | Bommes | yeah but I don't see how that contributes to it being an action game, it actually emphasizes the strategy based on history and cultural context where strategy is always connected to warfare with assymetric information |
| 09:48.41 | Bommes | as in "what do you do with the knowledge that you have based on the knowledge of what you think could be beyond your knowledge" |
| 09:48.47 | ArcanePariah | That was my point, people do NOT like that, see the constant QQ over various protoss all ins, good strategies that remove action/tactics |
| 09:49.26 | ArcanePariah | It becomes rather binary: Did you anticipate/plan for that strategy (All in)? If yes, game continues, if no, you lose right then and now |
| 09:49.29 | Bommes | people qqing over something is not a good indication that they don't like it, it just indicates provoking an emotional reaction |
| 09:49.50 | JademusSreg | Composition and economy are not the domain of SC2's competitive play; SC2 is a contest for awareness. |
| 09:50.12 | ArcanePariah | Well, a better example would be MTG, there have been 3x in its history where certain decks were so powerful, they won regardless of what they played against, except mirrors ofc |
| 09:50.16 | Bommes | yeah, which brings us back to chess where most of learning and getting better at the game is the knowledge of what can happen and learning specific sets of actions that happen in order to get to a certain outcome |
| 09:50.44 | Bommes | and not really some sort of "strategic talent" in your brain or something which is not a real thing |
| 09:50.47 | ArcanePariah | Correct, because of the nature of Chess (Symmetrical Total information awareness), it is a solved game |
| 09:51.08 | JademusSreg | And solvable in principle, more importantly. |
| 09:51.16 | ArcanePariah | Yes |
| 09:51.23 | ArcanePariah | Its a fairly small decision tree |
| 09:52.05 | Bommes | so SC2 becomes an inferior strategic game because it is not solved? |
| 09:52.06 | ArcanePariah | There does exist a game that is similar, but is unsolved due to the symmetry of the pieces (all pieces are the same) and the simple rules and the much large board |
| 09:52.16 | Bommes | man, you must hate GO |
| 09:52.22 | JademusSreg | Go is solvable in principle, so it's only a matter of time before computational resources catch up to solve for all possible parameters. |
| 09:52.23 | Bommes | I hope you never travel to asia |
| 09:52.31 | ArcanePariah | No, i think GO is fascianting |
| 09:52.40 | ArcanePariah | fascinating* |
| 09:53.21 | ArcanePariah | Since it has a a massive decision tree, arising from the the limited conditions and also the fact that because all pieces are equal, the decision tree can not be optimized since it is unweighted |
| 09:53.46 | ArcanePariah | Unlike in chess, where moving a Queen has more weight then a pawn |
| 09:54.31 | ArcanePariah | What I was mostly saying was that SC2 is a Strategy game, but people do not like when the strategy trumps the actions/tactical play |
| 09:55.17 | ArcanePariah | For example, people like seeing units being microed, as we were discussing above. But what is the point of such skill micro if its 10 tanks against 4 immortals? |
| 09:55.31 | ArcanePariah | The micro in that case achieves nothing |
| 09:55.59 | Bommes | well it's a real time strategy game, the strategy that should be emphasized is not the strategy prepared and learned beforehand but rather the strategy chosen on the spot by the player based on the circumstances he is confronted with |
| 09:56.31 | ArcanePariah | At the base level, agreed (Tech switches, tech path choices based on current information) |
| 09:56.40 | Bommes | and since more opportunites for tactical/micro play lead to more interesting circumstances |
| 09:56.48 | Bommes | you get more interesting strategic decisionmaking out of it |
| 09:57.12 | JademusSreg | SC2 states are not finite by the game's logic, and is not solvable in principle, but can be solved given sufficient burden of assumptions. =D |
| 09:58.19 | JademusSreg | Which is to say technical limitations, time limits, and such. |
| 09:58.19 | ArcanePariah | JademusSreg: Why not finite? Its a computer program, its finite by that definition, though it may be huge |
| 09:58.42 | JademusSreg | Because that is an external limitation, not a logical limitation. |
| 09:59.01 | ArcanePariah | Ok, so techincally not feasible to solve, but mathemtically solvable |
| 09:59.03 | Bommes | I would assume the assumptions include things like allowed map sizes etc. |
| 09:59.12 | Bommes | if you increase the map size to infinity |
| 09:59.20 | ArcanePariah | Well yeah, that is one factor in the defining the problem space |
| 09:59.24 | Bommes | you get some problem |
| 09:59.25 | Bommes | s |
| 09:59.29 | JademusSreg | Though, actually, given the melee stalemate doom-timer, that may change things, might make it finite. |
| 09:59.47 | ArcanePariah | Well, you probably can define in the problem definition in terms of the those variables |
| 09:59.57 | ArcanePariah | since map size dictates number of possible unit positions |
| 10:00.17 | ArcanePariah | But yes, the definition of the problem would be a task unto itself |
| 10:00.33 | ArcanePariah | As evidences by the complexity of the editor :P |
| 10:00.40 | ArcanePariah | evidenced* |
| 10:00.45 | JademusSreg | Ah, I don't include the computational substrate in the problem space because that undermines substrate neutrality. |
| 10:01.02 | *** join/#sc2mapster Zolden (~a@88.135.0.21) |
| 10:01.52 | ArcanePariah | Good point |
| 10:02.28 | JademusSreg | ♥ |
| 10:02.28 | ArcanePariah | I'm actually surprised no one has solved GO yet, since from the apppearance of it, it seems like something that could be easily parallized |
| 10:02.48 | *** join/#sc2mapster ElectricPrism (~Loren@unaffiliated/electricprism) |
| 10:02.51 | ArcanePariah | Since the decision tree is unweighted |
| 10:03.03 | JademusSreg | Funny you mention that. |
| 10:03.04 | ArcanePariah | Each move can be considered in independence of any other move |
| 10:04.12 | JademusSreg | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Computer_Go#Recent_results |
| 10:04.19 | Zolden | AI will solve it before killing all ppl |
| 10:04.55 | JademusSreg | Remembered that part last time I checked in the article. =D |
| 10:05.30 | JademusSreg | And a few years before that, it was restricted to very small boards. |
| 10:05.31 | ArcanePariah | Interesting, it does seem the algorithims, along with CPU performance, are starting to add up |
| 10:10.02 | ArcanePariah | I do find it interesting why humans are better, and I think it boils down to the nature of GO means throughout the game, the human is doing simple pattern matching, and with black/white pieces, it is easy for a skilled human to evaluate the board, whereas a computer can not do that efficiently |
| 10:10.49 | JademusSreg | Neural plasticity + |
| 10:10.57 | ArcanePariah | Not to mention the human capacity for induction (look at just a small part of something, and be able to ignore the rest of a larger part, based on the conclusions of the smaller) |
| 10:11.40 | ArcanePariah | Or more concisely: Humans are very fast and mostly accurate with short circuit evaluations |
| 10:12.59 | JademusSreg | Allows us to optimize complex, focus-demanding processes to effortless sub-routines. =D |
| 10:13.33 | ArcanePariah | Mmhmm |
| 10:15.35 | dvzon | Hello, can anyone give me some initial direction as what to use to make an aura orbitate around a unit? |
| 10:16.06 | dvzon | I've been playing with a lot of things, and no luck yet, but I've discovered a lot of other unintended things as well, hehe |
| 10:17.02 | Zolden | dvzon aura is behavior that periodically executes a search effect |
| 10:17.22 | dvzon | let me re-phrase |
| 10:18.17 | dvzon | I created the aura, and it's working perfectly. I guess Im looking for an actor/animation to orbitate around the unit that has the aura. Range indicator, if you will, but a "cool" range indicator |
| 10:18.32 | JademusSreg | Site ops. |
| 10:18.51 | dvzon | Thank u sir, I will go and play around |
| 10:18.56 | dvzon | try it out, that is |
| 10:18.58 | dvzon | yes indeed |
| 10:19.02 | ArcanePariah | You will probably want a range actor, and change the edge model, and then use a rotation site ops for the range actor |
| 10:19.27 | JademusSreg | I think dvz refers to a range indicator akin to the PDD. |
| 10:19.47 | JademusSreg | The model with the rotating set of circles. |
| 10:20.05 | dvzon | now that I actually see it, I believe you are right |
| 10:20.30 | JademusSreg | One can achieve that kind of motion with other models using the correct site operations. |
| 10:20.32 | ArcanePariah | Yeah, a Range actor creates a circle, it can do it for behaviors/ablites/effects/something else |
| 10:20.48 | ArcanePariah | Then change the model used from the arrow things that are the default |
| 10:20.53 | ArcanePariah | and then set that actor to rotate |
| 10:22.04 | ArcanePariah | I still need to learn how to use Actor Queries, since those are the key to making actors scales to the correct size of stuff, like an animation scaling to the size of a search area effect |
| 10:23.04 | ArcanePariah | Meanwhile, finished templating my inventory abilites for NotD |
| 10:23.32 | JademusSreg | Woo. |
| 10:23.58 | ArcanePariah | On to multi level ability effect chains... sigh.. |
| 10:25.27 | ArcanePariah | At some point I'm going to call it quits on templating/optimizing stuff since I think I'm hitting diminishing returns, |
| 10:25.31 | JademusSreg | With proper use of parents, it's less that complete agony. =D |
| 10:25.39 | JademusSreg | *than |
| 10:26.02 | ArcanePariah | Well yeah, that's what I'm having to do, define said parents, and yeah, doing it after the fact = uggghhh... |
| 10:26.21 | ArcanePariah | I'm effectively doing refactoring of the data |
| 10:26.34 | ArcanePariah | Mostly for practice |
| 10:26.53 | JademusSreg | There is an alternative. |
| 10:27.06 | JademusSreg | Pretty sure it's in the Kubi Heroes demo. |
| 10:28.16 | ArcanePariah | Not sure how their is an alternative lol, since it amounts to: FInd common parts of effects, make template/default value, and set all child effects parents to newly created parent |
| 10:28.32 | JademusSreg | 1 primary effect tree trunk used by all the ability levels, with level-specific differences diverging from ability level-checks. |
| 10:28.37 | ArcanePariah | Rinse repeat ad nauseum |
| 10:28.53 | ArcanePariah | Yes, that's what I'm doing right now |
| 10:29.17 | ArcanePariah | Looking at each effect chain, and defining the parent for each effect in the chain, for multi leveled abilites (3 levels typically) |
| 10:29.23 | JademusSreg | As opposed to each level getting its own effect tree. =D |
| 10:29.30 | ArcanePariah | Oh |
| 10:29.55 | ArcanePariah | I considered that... but that means creating dozens of validators |
| 10:30.09 | ArcanePariah | Namely, 1 per ablity level |
| 10:30.42 | ArcanePariah | Also, unless my memory is horribly flawed, that validator doesn't work all that well, since level 1 of an ability = level 0 |
| 10:30.45 | JademusSreg | Ideal for diverging end-points, which is usually the case I observe. |
| 10:31.02 | ArcanePariah | Fair point |
| 10:31.13 | JademusSreg | But also illogical and hacky. |
| 10:31.25 | ArcanePariah | That too, it makes it rather inflexible |
| 10:31.46 | ArcanePariah | Means I have to add effects/validators if I want to add any additional level specific effects |
| 10:32.15 | ArcanePariah | Ultimately the template approach is best for the trade off of performance, and flexilbility |
| 10:32.43 | ArcanePariah | Esp since you can change the base valeus just as easy, and just hit "Apply to children" |
| 10:32.44 | JademusSreg | Yup. Merely pointing out an alternative to provide an illusion of choice. |
| 10:33.46 | ArcanePariah | It is amazing how much work could be done/saved if proper planning/design is laid out and template devised first, before coding everything up |
| 10:34.03 | ArcanePariah | But even among software people, that skill is rare |
| 10:36.43 | JademusSreg | I consistently encourage the same, but perhaps people prefer to avoid design abstraction? |
| 10:37.18 | ArcanePariah | Ok, this really made my night, the genius in that thread said turret tracking doesn't exist... but the damm turret data objects DOES do it, it actually has 6 different options lol |
| 10:38.07 | ArcanePariah | Actually... nvm that is for idle tracking |
| 10:38.10 | ArcanePariah | when no target |
| 10:38.39 | ArcanePariah | ... but if thats the case, wth is he talking about for turret tracking? |
| 10:38.47 | JademusSreg | Or to put it differently, some people have a place for their toothpaste, hairbrush, car keys, and such, and some people are always looking for such things. |
| 10:39.57 | ArcanePariah | Yeah well, abstraction is the entire damm point of programs, by their very nature they are a mathematical abstraction... |
| 10:40.23 | ArcanePariah | Mind you, there is a common pitfall of people abstracting for the sake of abstraction |
| 10:40.29 | ArcanePariah | Which is just... belh |
| 10:40.32 | ArcanePariah | bleh* |
| 10:42.04 | JademusSreg | Which also analogous to top-down / bottom-up development, and also relevant to APIs, and also relevant to graphic design, et cetera. |
| 10:42.55 | ArcanePariah | Isn't the best option really to do a mix of both (Top/Down, Bottom/Up) |
| 10:43.37 | ArcanePariah | Since IIRC, Top Down is writing all the function call you need in main, and writing the functions later? |
| 10:44.05 | JademusSreg | A bit skewed; that's one possible interpretation. |
| 10:46.07 | ArcanePariah | I'm still not understanding the tracking turrets things |
| 10:46.25 | ArcanePariah | Do turrets not track the target as they fire on them or some such? |
| 10:46.49 | JademusSreg | Rather, one should design the systems, code each level of the system's dependencies until one gets down to the logically irreducable code units. |
| 10:47.05 | ArcanePariah | Or is it the turret immediately goes idle once the target goes out of acquistion range? |
| 10:47.32 | JademusSreg | Overlaps with coding what you need when you need it, rather than what you think you might need later. |
| 10:48.14 | JademusSreg | Busy time. bbl |
| 10:49.17 | Bommes | ArcanePariah: You mean in the default SC2 melee settings? |
| 10:49.32 | ArcanePariah | Yeah, now I get it, they want the unit turret to not reset on moving |
| 10:49.48 | ArcanePariah | Which for many sc2 turrets, that is the set option |
| 10:49.58 | Bommes | it's more of a weapon problem really |
| 10:50.08 | Bommes | since most weapons don't attack while moving |
| 10:50.23 | Bommes | even if they are used as a turret |
| 10:50.41 | Bommes | but they should be able to do that |
| 10:51.25 | ArcanePariah | Well, the complaint raised in that threads was the fact that turrets in BW apparently tracked targets, despite the unit moving (BW tank) and sc2 ones don't, Nearly all of them have idle turret behavior set to "Reset if moving" |
| 10:51.40 | Bommes | I don't exactly know how turrets behaved in BW though, did they "auto"attack when in range or did they require a former attack command? |
| 10:52.20 | ArcanePariah | They auto attacked |
| 10:52.35 | Bommes | yeah I know the thread, it's still a weapon and not a turret issue |
| 10:52.43 | ArcanePariah | If we are referring to turret data types, like siege tank, dragoon, etc. |
| 10:53.07 | ArcanePariah | Yeah, but that is also easily solved in weapons |
| 10:53.12 | Bommes | yeah so the weapons for siege tanks / immortals etc would have to be set up like the phoenix one to get tracking turrets |
| 10:53.14 | JademusSreg | (Think of it this way: bottom-up development is like navigating a labyrinth, whereas top-down development is like solving a maze printed on a sheet of paper.) |
| 10:53.32 | ArcanePariah | Which is 1 field: Allowed Movement |
| 10:53.37 | ArcanePariah | Done |
| 10:55.07 | ArcanePariah | Oh and Set the flag: Only fire when Attacking |
| 10:55.38 | Bommes | but that wouldn't work I think since you can't have an acquired attack target and a move command at the same time |
| 10:56.08 | Bommes | so allowed movement is pointless if you flag only fire when attacking? |
| 10:56.15 | ArcanePariah | Actually, you can, if you set the continous scan flag, so the weapon is always scanning and looking to acuquire targets |
| 10:56.41 | ArcanePariah | Let me see if I can duplicate what I think they are looking for |
| 11:01.01 | Bommes | I don't know how BW tanks behaved so I don't even know what they are looking for |
| 11:03.09 | ArcanePariah | Well, they are looking for the turret to stay locked on to a target when the tank moves, so it doesn't have to swivel to a target after every mover order, so you can do stop and move shooting |
| 11:05.24 | Bommes | but does it always target the nearest enemy, does it target the previous attack target, does it pick the nearest target and then lock on it until it dies? |
| 11:05.28 | Bommes | how does it behave? |
| 11:06.49 | Bommes | does it even require a previous attack command to work? |
| 11:06.55 | Bommes | I have no idea how the BW tank worked |
| 11:08.06 | ArcanePariah | It stayed locked on to the current acquired target, it would reset if the original target was killed/out of range |
| 11:08.11 | ArcanePariah | I think |
| 11:08.41 | ArcanePariah | I'll stir on this later today, time to get some sleep lol |
| 11:17.56 | *** join/#sc2mapster turtles1 (~dave3@d27-99-25-111.bla802.nsw.optusnet.com.au) |
| 11:33.20 | *** join/#sc2mapster duckies (50e88a7e@gateway/web/freenode/ip.80.232.138.126) |
| 11:36.17 | *** join/#sc2mapster Thenarden (~Miranda@HSI-KBW-078-043-227-063.hsi4.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de) |
| 11:36.54 | Zolden | draws "quack me" on duckies back |
| 11:37.33 | *** join/#sc2mapster Raziel (Raziel@2a01:388:201:4190:bd42:557c:9f36:7bc4) |
| 11:54.21 | duckies | quacks out |
| 11:55.57 | grim001 | ... |
| 12:11.32 | Bommes | stop this quackery |
| 12:24.59 | *** join/#sc2mapster Delphinium (jifengxian@60.166.117.116) |
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| 15:09.18 | Delphinium | Am I still online? Since long long time nobody said anything. |
| 15:16.29 | Dustin | Nope |
| 15:16.34 | Dustin | You're def offline |
| 15:33.45 | Zolden | what is average state between on and off? |
| 15:34.45 | Delphinium | Maybe a frog still with a tail |
| 15:40.18 | *** join/#sc2mapster duckies (4d26cd7a@gateway/web/freenode/ip.77.38.205.122) |
| 15:40.43 | *** part/#sc2mapster turtles1 (~dave3@d27-99-25-111.bla802.nsw.optusnet.com.au) |
| 15:43.22 | Zolden | or a catepillar with wings |
| 15:44.24 | Kueken | Zolden: that would be onf |
| 15:48.11 | Ahli | is it possible to send actor messages to a game region for a specific player group? |
| 15:49.00 | Kueken | there are a couple of filter options afaik, not sure if player is among them |
| 15:50.00 | Kueken | do you want to affect actors for each player individually, as in asynchronous changes? or actors belonging to certain players, like actors beonging to units owned by that player? |
| 15:50.19 | Kueken | *l |
| 15:53.46 | Ahli | async changes, yes... |
| 15:54.04 | Ahli | team color stuff changes that only appear for spectators |
| 15:54.14 | Ahli | like colored forcefield |
| 15:54.27 | Ahli | well that is a unit, different example.... |
| 15:54.40 | Ahli | uhm.... colored fungal |
| 15:55.15 | Ahli | players need to see normal sc2 game, spectators would like to see something modded |
| 15:58.08 | Kueken | well, not sure how far the native async actor messages support goes, but you can always fall back on renee's method |
| 15:58.49 | Ahli | but renees method requires units to work? |
| 15:59.02 | Kueken | it does? o_0 |
| 15:59.22 | Ahli | hmmm |
| 15:59.23 | Ahli | ;D |
| 15:59.47 | Kueken | pretty sure it provided some sort of ActorSendAsync function |
| 16:00.03 | Kueken | which could send any actor message asynchronously to any actor |
| 16:00.04 | Ahli | yes, but we don't have a reference to the actors |
| 16:00.19 | Ahli | it would need to be an actor region :S |
| 16:00.36 | Ahli | a signal wouldn't be a problem |
| 16:00.37 | Kueken | k |
| 16:01.29 | Kueken | the actor region stuff is native? |
| 16:01.39 | Kueken | or does it do some sort of pick loop |
| 16:01.50 | Kueken | so we can get individual actors |
| 16:02.49 | Ahli | well, you deliver a message to all actors in a region with a specific class and a term |
| 16:03.20 | Ahli | the term thing could check for the flyer helper setting |
| 16:03.35 | Kueken | yes, just asking if its a native function or if it is constructed |
| 16:03.39 | Kueken | but its native |
| 16:03.41 | Kueken | kk |
| 16:04.17 | Kueken | oh, the comments to the function are helpful |
| 16:04.34 | Kueken | The Terms parameter is used to specify a condition that an actor in the region must meet in order to receive the message. The format for Terms is a list of semi colon delimited actor terms. |
| 16:05.03 | Kueken | which means, these are probably the same terms that can be used in actor events |
| 16:05.11 | *** join/#sc2mapster G0A (~hookah604@91.83.53.22.pool.invitel.hu) |
| 16:05.22 | Kueken | not sure if that is helpful.. |
| 16:05.27 | Ahli | oh renee has a function in new gax mod |
| 16:06.31 | *** join/#sc2mapster ElectricPrism (~Loren@unaffiliated/electricprism) |
| 16:09.58 | Bommes | there's a new gax mod? |
| 16:11.00 | Ahli | no idea how old, but it's newer than the default gax mod |
| 16:12.25 | Kueken | gax4 now? :D |
| 16:17.42 | kingTD | is there a way to hide Attribute for specific unit? |
| 16:17.45 | Ahli | dunno... but now I'm converting her galaxy code into GUI and put it into my actor visibility map |
| 16:24.08 | Ahli | we need a mod that contains all galaxy functions that don't appear in GUI |
| 16:24.17 | Ahli | like "ActorRegionCreate" |
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| 16:37.48 | Stewox | looks like it's totally into the false flag territory |
| 16:38.25 | Stewox | 2 of those guys in the back acting strange when he said "we played this same exact scenario 3 weeks ago" |
| 16:38.38 | Stewox | ah fuck wrong channel |
| 16:44.21 | Ahli | can one validate the actor ID in actor "terms"? |
| 16:47.39 | Delphinium | http://www.sc2mapster.com/media/attachments/44/861/7.jpg |
| 16:47.42 | Zolden | we can have actor ID in target field |
| 16:48.30 | Zolden | there's a human inside marine |
| 16:48.36 | Zolden | marine ate it |
| 16:48.51 | Ahli | well, I want to send a message to all actors of the ID "blablablaActor" in a region... |
| 16:49.08 | Ahli | atm the only filter is class and the validation is a signal |
| 16:49.18 | Kueken | that you can do with the Class Filter I think |
| 16:49.30 | Kueken | in Class Filter you can just type the id |
| 16:49.32 | Ahli | but without that, the messages could be send without altering the stuff in an actor |
| 16:49.34 | Kueken | afaik |
| 16:49.56 | Delphinium | The Face is Mike Morhaime~ |
| 16:50.04 | Delphinium | Not so clear... |
| 16:50.17 | Zolden | never heard of |
| 16:50.31 | Kueken | blizzard founder |
| 16:50.34 | Kueken | or something |
| 16:50.37 | Kueken | ceo? |
| 16:50.40 | Kueken | not sure |
| 16:50.47 | Kueken | someone of the important guys |
| 16:50.57 | Ahli | loves starcraft, hosted barcraft at his house for recent wcs stuff |
| 16:51.08 | Kueken | anyway, not really recognize him on the picture |
| 16:51.16 | Kueken | might as well be denzel washington |
| 16:51.23 | Zolden | what's barcraft? |
| 16:51.39 | Kueken | starcraft public viewing |
| 16:51.41 | Kueken | in a bar |
| 16:52.15 | Zolden | sounds nerdy |
| 16:52.26 | Zolden | very nerdy |
| 16:52.51 | Kueken | nah, nerdy is watching starcraft alone on your pc |
| 16:53.04 | Kueken | very nerdy is making maps for starcraft |
| 16:53.14 | Ahli | I was at one yesterday |
| 16:53.20 | Dustin | god damn i must be super nerdy then |
| 16:53.29 | Kueken | the barcraft guys are like the cool guys among the nerds |
| 16:53.29 | Zolden | Ahli waht town? |
| 16:53.39 | Ahli | I was at Unna, yesterday |
| 16:53.40 | Kueken | because they meet people and drink etc |
| 16:53.43 | Dustin | I would love some barcrafting |
| 16:53.57 | Ahli | on 30th November I'm at Münster's one |
| 16:54.03 | JademusSreg | Fargunkle. |
| 16:54.22 | Zolden | so, it's like soccer fans in sport bars, but sc2 instead? |
| 16:54.28 | Kueken | damn, I would love to have an appropriate response to that, Jade |
| 16:54.38 | Ahli | I didn't know parking houses have opening durations :S so my car was locked in >_> |
| 16:54.41 | Kueken | but I would need some sort of reference point |
| 16:54.49 | Zolden | Kueken try Gundurburgalgbo |
| 16:55.06 | Kueken | as answer or as point of reference? |
| 16:55.10 | Ahli | Gorgonzola |
| 16:55.23 | JademusSreg | It's gibberish, but thematic gibberish. |
| 16:55.59 | Kueken | hm |
| 16:56.03 | Kueken | I cannot do that |
| 16:56.12 | Kueken | I could try senseless gibberish |
| 16:56.31 | Zolden | try phonetical association |
| 16:56.57 | Zolden | sense is not the only dimention of links between objects |
| 16:57.08 | JademusSreg | Related, at some level humans form associations between phonic qualities and non-phonic qualities. =D |
| 16:57.22 | Kueken | jade, for the send actor message to actor region function, the class filter parameter, can you just input an actor id there? |
| 16:57.22 | JademusSreg | But in this case, the theme is gnome. |
| 16:57.35 | Kueken | I think I saw that being utilized at some point, but not sure |
| 16:57.39 | JademusSreg | Let me check. |
| 16:58.53 | JademusSreg | Hm. |
| 16:59.04 | Delphinium | http://www.sc2mapster.com/media/attachments/44/862/126.jpg |
| 16:59.06 | Delphinium | hmmmm |
| 16:59.38 | Zolden | bold nova? |
| 16:59.47 | Kueken | dustin, mike, who are the othersß |
| 16:59.56 | Kueken | chris metzen? |
| 17:00.00 | Zolden | *bald |
| 17:00.02 | JademusSreg | I'd need to do some research, and am a tad busy. I'll follow up when I get back, but taking an id by itself would be limiting, more likely takes a list of ids and/or aliases. |
| 17:00.04 | JademusSreg | brb |
| 17:03.27 | Kueken | that would be good, I think Ahli could work with that |
| 17:04.42 | Delphinium | David Kim and Brett Wood who show in the Hots interview |
| 17:04.53 | Kueken | ah |
| 17:05.11 | Kueken | David Kim was the asian guy, the balance expert, right? |
| 17:05.17 | Kueken | don't know the other guy |
| 17:06.38 | Kueken | hard to see the resemblance, though, besides Dustin :D |
| 17:06.59 | Ahli | google says that teamliquid says that Bratt Wood is the Map Editor Designer and Community Map Maker |
| 17:07.56 | Ahli | most likely the person that wrote most of the editor stuff on its own |
| 17:08.02 | Kueken | :D |
| 17:08.12 | Ahli | (as Deletarius told us that the editor was mostly created by a single person) |
| 17:09.09 | Bommes | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3LeNU2Gvdqg this fine gentleman |
| 17:09.38 | Bommes | note his name is spelled "Brett" |
| 17:10.01 | Ahli | ah, the person whose bnet name wasn't censored in all places in that movie ;D |
| 17:10.05 | Bommes | which is like the most awesome name combination for us germans! |
| 17:10.13 | Bommes | Brett and Wood. How fitting. |
| 17:10.24 | Ahli | ;D |
| 17:10.50 | Ahli | Board Wood |
| 17:12.28 | Ahli | so, filter doesn't take the actorID |
| 17:12.31 | Kueken | pretty sure he had german ancestors who found that very funny |
| 17:12.35 | Ahli | seems like class only |
| 17:13.04 | Kueken | what would be a valid class? |
| 17:13.07 | Kueken | besides null |
| 17:13.36 | Ahli | I made a typo above... his forename is Brett... not bratt ;S |
| 17:15.57 | Delphinium | http://www.sc2mapster.com/media/attachments/44/824/QQ20131104015428.jpg |
| 17:16.16 | Delphinium | Just cut some more shorts |
| 17:16.19 | Delphinium | shoots |
| 17:16.28 | Delphinium | http://www.sc2mapster.com/media/attachments/44/863/39.jpg |
| 17:17.08 | Delphinium | :) |
| 17:17.47 | Kueken | i could say that the models are awesome, but at some point that must bore you, right? :p |
| 17:19.09 | Delphinium | Some of the models are really hard to design, and that is sometime boring me. |
| 17:19.27 | *** join/#sc2mapster ArcanePariah (~ArcanePar@99-8-167-11.lightspeed.futnca.sbcglobal.net) |
| 17:20.05 | Delphinium | The units are much easier, so that don't cost much time and not so boring I guess. |
| 17:24.09 | Delphinium | It's very lucky that I have a wonderful partner, she always likes my models, and can handle those models which are really complex. |
| 17:25.23 | Zolden | yea, she does great |
| 17:25.47 | Zolden | why chinese females so smart? |
| 17:26.14 | Zolden | 2 amazing mapmakers, chess world champion is also chinese between females |
| 17:27.25 | JademusSreg | avoids making an insensitive joke about cunning suvival skills acquired in utero. |
| 17:27.52 | ArcanePariah | Well 2 reasons. 1) Pure statistical favor, more chinese then any other ethnic group on earth and 2) China has emphasized education for over 2 thousand years. The tenets of Confucisinism and meritrocracy are still the foundation of Chinese society |
| 17:28.42 | ArcanePariah | Also, good morning Jade |
| 17:28.55 | ArcanePariah | and good evening zolden |
| 17:29.00 | Delphinium | 0.0 |
| 17:29.02 | Zolden | good evening |
| 17:29.22 | JademusSreg | (Hi thar.) |
| 17:30.50 | Zolden | JademusSreg joke would be ok |
| 17:31.00 | ArcanePariah | Meanwhile, internet gaming communities proved their collective stupidity once more |
| 17:31.05 | JademusSreg | (Oh, and good [local georotational temporal phase] to you, as well, Arc.) |
| 17:31.17 | Delphinium | Besides, Nanakey is good at cocking, it is said she can make delicious food... |
| 17:31.41 | ArcanePariah | Umm... I'll assume you meant Cooking |
| 17:31.48 | Delphinium | But I just don't have chance to get some 0.0 |
| 17:31.51 | Zolden | lol |
| 17:31.56 | Delphinium | yes~ |
| 17:32.25 | Delphinium | I only good at eating... |
| 17:32.36 | Zolden | who isn't good at eating? |
| 17:33.08 | Zolden | maybe only hitler's prisoners in death camps |
| 17:33.11 | Ahli | crashed sc2 :D |
| 17:33.22 | ArcanePariah | Well... everyone is... but aren't Russians better at drinking then eating? |
| 17:33.24 | G0A | Zolden you wanna move to your eastern neighbor for brides? :) |
| 17:33.27 | Zolden | Ahli uncrash it, not nice towards blizz |
| 17:33.42 | Zolden | G0A i'd prefer jews |
| 17:33.56 | Ahli | I try to uncrash it, but I'm only tinkering with the "Subname" term |
| 17:34.03 | Zolden | they have 15 IQ points higher than surrounding population |
| 17:34.16 | Ahli | maybe it's the code I created from renee's galaxy code |
| 17:34.21 | G0A | most of the jew girls look bad. |
| 17:34.59 | Zolden | brain makes chicks sexy |
| 17:35.04 | G0A | Its not hard to achieve that 15 point in that surrounding |
| 17:35.16 | Delphinium | Russia is too cold for a little tree frog, it will be frozen. |
| 17:35.51 | ArcanePariah | To paraphrase, for women, smart, good looking, emotionally stable, choose 2 |
| 17:35.54 | Zolden | maybe it will be warmer in 50-100 years |
| 17:36.04 | Delphinium | And also too cold for many insects, so no food for frog 0.0 |
| 17:36.10 | JademusSreg | (As I recall, at least one study indicates that individuals in a social context score about 10 IQ higher.) |
| 17:36.24 | G0A | Zolden more like sexysm make good looking chicks stupid... |
| 17:37.10 | Kueken | Delphinium: I meant that it has to be boring if everyone keeps saying the models are awesome |
| 17:37.16 | Zolden | in my village there are so many frogs, you can climb to the sky on the wall of their nigh croacking in may |
| 17:37.22 | Kueken | maybe we should add some variation |
| 17:37.28 | Kueken | a casual "it sucks" |
| 17:37.50 | Ahli | crashed it with subname term :( |
| 17:38.03 | Zolden | G0A actually smartness correlates with beauty |
| 17:38.12 | ArcanePariah | Ahli: Expert SC2 Crasher |
| 17:38.12 | Zolden | it's just a genetical harmony |
| 17:38.21 | G0A | I want a hypnotoad frog |
| 17:38.24 | ArcanePariah | So what are you tryign to do Ahli ? |
| 17:38.40 | Kueken | so Zolden if I mess up my face I get smarter? |
| 17:38.50 | Kueken | and working out makes me dumb |
| 17:38.55 | Ahli | I'm trying to find a cool way to send a message only to specific actors in a region |
| 17:38.56 | G0A | Zolden hmm, from where did you read that? |
| 17:39.02 | Zolden | Kueken I didn't say it's a negative correlation |
| 17:39.22 | JademusSreg | (Arc, not -that- would be an interesting competiton; I'd expect to be a contender.) |
| 17:39.27 | JademusSreg | (*noq) |
| 17:39.29 | Kueken | ah so I cannot be ugly and smart |
| 17:39.30 | Ahli | the goal is to do as little as possible data additions to make it work |
| 17:39.34 | JademusSreg | (*now, haha) |
| 17:39.50 | Zolden | G0A don't remember... maybe it's only my hypothesis... but maybe it was an article somwhere |
| 17:39.51 | ArcanePariah | Ahli: Querey region, with alias filters/ |
| 17:39.53 | ArcanePariah | ? |
| 17:40.25 | Ahli | ? |
| 17:40.28 | ArcanePariah | Maybe it support validators too, I still need to learn Actor queries |
| 17:40.39 | ArcanePariah | YOu can use an actor query to get actors in a region |
| 17:40.42 | Zolden | Kueken being ugly and smart is rather social effect, not genetical |
| 17:40.48 | Zolden | a compensation |
| 17:40.52 | G0A | Zolden hmmm http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/the-scientific-fundamentalist/201012/beautiful-people-really-are-more-intelligent |
| 17:41.25 | Ahli | sending a message to a region delivers a message, too... I just need to filter them better than just "Doodad" or "Model" or what they will have |
| 17:41.58 | ArcanePariah | Well yeah, more phycially fit individuals tend to have better biological functionality, including production of chemicals for brain operation |
| 17:42.18 | ArcanePariah | and thus more intelligent/mentally effective |
| 17:42.20 | Zolden | G0A I may be mistaken, but that model Borat fell in love with, has a PhD |
| 17:42.57 | Zolden | ArcanePariah yea |
| 17:43.33 | Kueken | damn, and I always thought I was smart |
| 17:43.37 | Kueken | at least a little :D |
| 17:44.35 | ArcanePariah | Ahli: If you want to send messages to specific actors in a region, you use an actor query with a query response |
| 17:44.56 | ArcanePariah | The query response can then send the actual messages based on filters and terms |
| 17:44.56 | G0A | I always thought I was ugly, but it seems like I am not:) |
| 17:45.05 | Zolden | don't think there are much ppl who think they are not smart... maybe even the smarter a person is, the less chances it is happy about his intellectual skills |
| 17:45.21 | Kueken | G0A and I have come to a different conclusion based on the same situation |
| 17:45.34 | JademusSreg | (Everyone is an idiot, without exception.) |
| 17:45.40 | Ahli | ArcanePariah: how do I use that? |
| 17:45.43 | G0A | Zolden the smarter are you, the more you will think you are not smart... |
| 17:45.49 | ArcanePariah | Zolden: Correct, its called dunning kruger effect |
| 17:46.20 | ArcanePariah | Ahli: A good example is the Nuke, and how it correctly find and burns up trees |
| 17:47.21 | Ahli | interesting |
| 17:47.31 | Kueken | I have an example map for this, I think |
| 17:47.43 | kingTD | what or how to make Arrow mover to have parabola trajectory and would follow the target unit |
| 17:47.45 | Kueken | a marine who makes nearby trees grow :D |
| 17:48.02 | Ahli | where is that query used in the code? or is it just working by adding a query response to the game data? |
| 17:48.18 | G0A | ArcanePariah ehh I didnt know that Dunning and Kruger even got Nobel for it |
| 17:48.22 | Kueken | the query stuff is pure data |
| 17:48.27 | ArcanePariah | Ahli: Pure data |
| 17:48.29 | Kueken | not sure how to use it in code |
| 17:48.57 | ArcanePariah | What happens is on the Nuke damageeffect, it creates a circle region at the effect point, and has the radius hardcoded |
| 17:49.04 | Ahli | hmm, it needs to be trigger controlled as it can be turned off/on in the game based |
| 17:49.24 | Ahli | on an attribute and the stuff needs to be async between the players (actor phasing) |
| 17:49.26 | Kueken | you can probably just create the query via trigger |
| 17:49.42 | ArcanePariah | In that case, use terms to control the creation |
| 17:50.00 | Kueken | https://www.dropbox.com/s/3ysgu9w7y2i8cgu/TreeGrow.SC2Map |
| 17:50.06 | Kueken | in case you need it |
| 17:50.45 | Kueken | its essentially the same as the nuke stuff, though |
| 17:50.49 | Kueken | I use the same alias |
| 17:52.43 | Ahli | can you burn the plants in your test map? |
| 17:53.03 | ArcanePariah | You could do it like the nuke, but not have message to create the circle region and simply create it from triggers |
| 17:54.01 | Kueken | ahli: sure |
| 17:54.24 | Ahli | not needed |
| 17:55.07 | *** join/#sc2mapster Bibendus (Bibendus@ip-80-249-36-63.static.adsl.cheapnet.it) |
| 17:57.18 | Zolden | kingTD maybe imitate parabola with a behavior? |
| 17:58.07 | kingTD | not possible fuck it then.. Its not wc3 :( |
| 17:58.25 | kingTD | * not possible easy way |
| 18:00.18 | ArcanePariah | kingTD: Set mover driver to Parabola? |
| 18:00.34 | ArcanePariah | and set the parabola clearance and distance fields |
| 18:00.35 | kingTD | but then it doesnt tracks missile to target? |
| 18:01.47 | ArcanePariah | Well, is Tracking set to Actual? |
| 18:03.19 | ArcanePariah | Let me give it a spin |
| 18:03.36 | kingTD | surely i havent did that :D just set parabola and watching whats happening = nothing >>> complain! :O |
| 18:04.05 | kingTD | + previous experiences |
| 18:06.22 | Kueken | tracking to actual won't help |
| 18:07.43 | Kueken | the common approach is to approximate a parabola with multiple mover phases, one throw that launches in an upward trajectory, one guidance and then adjusting blend time and type to somewhat match the desired result |
| 18:07.44 | Ahli | hmm, I've no idea how to do that with triggers :S |
| 18:08.53 | Kueken | Ahli: what if you just create the region actor with the trigger and let data handle the rest? |
| 18:09.01 | ArcanePariah | ^ |
| 18:13.25 | Ahli | sooo, let's see if that works ^^ |
| 18:14.53 | Ahli | could not create actor |
| 18:15.09 | Ahli | " Actor - Create actor AAAA at point (Center of (Entire map))" doesn't work :S |
| 18:15.32 | Ahli | oh well, it's the query actor |
| 18:15.56 | kingTD | hmm well it damages target but it flies like a rocket while speed only 4 |
| 18:15.57 | JademusSreg | Twod, use a parabola, transition into a guidance. |
| 18:16.42 | kingTD | how does that work? |
| 18:17.40 | JademusSreg | Two motion phases. |
| 18:18.56 | kingTD | when does guidance will get into effect in ID 1 (while parabola 0)? |
| 18:19.28 | JademusSreg | First a parabola driver, with an outro of -1 or 0, then a guidance driver with an intro of, say, -1. |
| 18:20.56 | JademusSreg | Or set the guidance phase intro to match the parabola preapex distance. |
| 18:23.01 | JademusSreg | Oh wait, are you using AdaptableParabola or Ballistic? |
| 18:24.05 | kingTD | first variant |
| 18:24.48 | JademusSreg | For an arrow that seeks the target, should use AdaptableParabola, wouldn't expect the guidance phase be needed. But whatever. |
| 18:25.08 | JademusSreg | Ah, silly me. Paste the xml. |
| 18:25.17 | JademusSreg | I have a minute to take a look. |
| 18:25.18 | Ahli | Kueken: ArcanePariah yaaaay |
| 18:26.09 | kingTD | heh |
| 18:27.30 | JademusSreg | I expect some easily overlooked field hasn't been configured (because the motion phase field dialog is a goddamn mess). |
| 18:28.47 | kingTD | http://pastebin.com/Np4K0JSi |
| 18:29.34 | JademusSreg | NBow compare that to this: https://pastee.org/dxtdm |
| 18:29.41 | JademusSreg | This is from DehakaLeapMissile. |
| 18:31.01 | JademusSreg | The important fields here are AdaptableParabolaClearance, AdaptableParabolaDistances, and AdaptableParabolaAccels. |
| 18:31.44 | kingTD | dont see a difference |
| 18:32.20 | JademusSreg | You don't have your values configured. |
| 18:34.59 | JademusSreg | I'll explain what this data does. =D |
| 18:36.06 | Fate_ | i need a terran melee hero model |
| 18:37.05 | kingTD | no need!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
| 18:37.18 | JademusSreg | Yay. |
| 18:37.50 | JademusSreg | Fate, Ghost hero model Echo. |
| 18:37.50 | *** join/#sc2mapster rtschutter (~rtschutte@ip174-68-90-32.sd.sd.cox.net) |
| 18:38.21 | JademusSreg | Has an animation with a glowy energy blade/baton. |
| 18:38.23 | JademusSreg | bbl |
| 18:39.36 | kingTD | looks funny this thing :d |
| 18:40.13 | kingTD | as arrow doesnt face itself directly down.. |
| 18:40.14 | Fate_ | hm it will be the hero model for a space marines hero |
| 19:01.17 | kingTD | my nigga my nigga |
| 19:11.59 | Fate_ | http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/forum/topic/10388379084?page=1 u guys noticed that? |
| 19:14.45 | Delphinium | Good night |
| 19:14.47 | Delphinium | ~ |
| 19:14.54 | *** join/#sc2mapster Dzuke911 (86115533@gateway/web/freenode/ip.134.17.85.51) |
| 19:16.19 | *** join/#sc2mapster Triceron (~Triceron@S0106000c41aae21d.vc.shawcable.net) |
| 19:16.43 | *** join/#sc2mapster sc2println (~flo@2a02:810d:680:243:f66d:4ff:fe93:2e29) |
| 19:20.59 | Bommes | is there a way to automatically replace cliffs with other textures/meshes? |
| 19:21.21 | Bommes | I could probably change the cliff data but then I'd have to look up all the textures and models and stuff |
| 19:22.17 | Triceron | well one 'cheap' way would be to use a texture that's named the same as the cliff one, whcih technically could overwrite. I guess you can't use texture select by id on cliffs |
| 19:23.07 | Bommes | mmh, that's not really the problem, I want to use existing cliffs |
| 19:23.45 | Bommes | but they are alraedy placed on the map and as far as I can tell I can't just replace them? and there is a maximum number of different cliff types I can have, like 4 or something |
| 19:27.09 | Kueken | you can replace textures, but not cliffs? |
| 19:28.20 | Bommes | yeah I think so |
| 19:28.21 | Bommes | hmm |
| 19:29.29 | Bommes | changing the texture and the mesh in the terrain cliff data worked though |
| 19:31.17 | Bommes | still a stupid way to replace cliffs |
| 19:31.48 | Bommes | maybe it was just a bug though and I'd have to reload the whole editor for it to show up, hmmm |
| 19:31.52 | Bommes | I'll test some more |
| 19:35.26 | Bommes | oh nvm |
| 19:35.38 | Bommes | I was just using the wrong terrain type all along that's not actually used by my map :O |
| 19:35.39 | Bommes | wow |
| 19:35.41 | Bommes | I'm so dumb |
| 19:37.39 | *** join/#sc2mapster Telshin (~textual@2001:408:0:100:9ce8:39d6:d444:b30b) |
| 19:38.25 | Triceron | doh! |
| 19:43.11 | kingTD | blizz nights! |
| 19:43.17 | kingTD | or hour |
| 19:44.47 | Fate_ | or minute^^ |
| 20:03.54 | Zolden | or minette |
| 20:08.14 | *** join/#sc2mapster Thenarden (~Miranda@HSI-KBW-078-043-227-063.hsi4.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de) |
| 20:10.00 | JademusSreg | StarMUD: SC2 melee played entirely via text commands. |
| 20:14.42 | *** join/#sc2mapster Dustin (~Dustin@ip68-102-170-78.ks.ok.cox.net) |
| 20:16.44 | kingTD | . |
| 20:19.20 | Dustin | . |
| 20:23.02 | Fate_ | ! |
| 20:26.13 | Zolden | guys, don't turn this place into a circus |
| 20:26.20 | Zolden | it's a serious discussion place |
| 20:26.25 | Zolden | we solve problems here |
| 20:26.45 | Fate_ | Zolden ur so right. |
| 20:26.46 | ArcanePariah | Mmhmm... like what to drink tonight, or how to solve the game of GO |
| 20:27.10 | ArcanePariah | Or how to bribe Otixa (easy) or JademusSreg (Hard) |
| 20:27.12 | Fate_ | My apologies |
| 20:30.16 | Otixa | wot |
| 20:30.35 | ArcanePariah | passes Otixa a pint of scotch |
| 20:30.49 | Otixa | :> |
| 20:31.38 | ArcanePariah | Gr... sooo impatient, can someone devise a timemachine and fastforward me to Blzzcon and then to the 2.1 patch ptr? |
| 20:32.10 | ArcanePariah | Payment can be in any form, including: winning lotto numbers, sports finals results, etc. |
| 20:33.28 | Otixa | oi Zolden |
| 20:34.31 | Lajjla | JademusSreg, do you know something about editing cliff meshes? |
| 20:43.14 | Zolden | what "oi" means? sounds frenchy |
| 20:44.02 | Zolden | checks his time machine |
| 20:44.13 | Zolden | sry, ArcanePariah it's out of fuel |
| 20:45.45 | ArcanePariah | Damm... can't you go steal some uranium or maybe just pour some vodka down there to jump start it? |
| 20:46.05 | Bommes | Lajjla: You mean like 3D Editing with 3DS Max? |
| 20:46.20 | ArcanePariah | Oh well, I guess I have to do things the old fashion way: Trudge through time in a straight line |
| 20:46.24 | Bommes | or editing cliffs in the editor? |
| 20:46.34 | Zolden | I can't replenish it for years, because the fuel is fun sc2 arcade maps |
| 20:47.15 | ArcanePariah | :( , then go play NotD, its fun (shameless plug) |
| 20:48.59 | Otixa | Zolden, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s6dlCOSd0X8 |
| 20:49.00 | Otixa | :B |
| 20:49.14 | Zolden | why notd? i'd prefer yestd... it's even souns like a fuel for a time machine |
| 20:49.49 | ArcanePariah | lawl, because its not a TD? I swear we used to troll newer players by saying it was a TD |
| 20:50.09 | Zolden | Otixa gj |
| 20:50.12 | ArcanePariah | Besides, the dead may have good advice on time travel |
| 20:50.16 | Zolden | kingTD r u with us? |
| 20:50.23 | ArcanePariah | Assuming you don't torch them first :P |
| 20:50.38 | Otixa | Just need to do the rest of the titles ;p |
| 20:50.57 | Triceron | stabs Otixa |
| 20:51.11 | Otixa | evades, stabs back |
| 20:51.16 | Otixa | sup |
| 20:51.32 | Otixa | cohost the show, you weenie |
| 20:51.38 | Zolden | ok, i'll try |
| 20:51.42 | Zolden | hope it's not addictive |
| 20:51.45 | Triceron | have the show, you meanie |
| 20:51.46 | kingTD | Zolden about what Im should consider being with you? |
| 20:52.22 | Zolden | kingTD being with us when we do the modelling thing, you will tell your usual nonsense and it will be fun |
| 20:53.12 | kingTD | well it depends on timing |
| 20:53.30 | Lajjla | Bommes, in a 3D program yeah |
| 20:53.44 | Lajjla | Specifically, I want to edit the cliff meshes to create bridges from cliffs |
| 20:53.59 | Zolden | Otixa tell kingTD about the timing |
| 20:54.08 | Otixa | what timing |
| 20:54.13 | Zolden | of day |
| 20:54.21 | kingTD | of dday |
| 20:54.27 | Otixa | oh |
| 20:54.32 | Otixa | prolly friday/saturday |
| 20:54.38 | kingTD | hour? |
| 20:54.48 | Otixa | around 6-8GMT |
| 20:54.52 | Otixa | going for 2-3 hours |
| 20:55.12 | Bommes | Lajjla, I don't think Jade is an expert in 3DS Max or Blender or whatever. |
| 20:55.30 | Bommes | That said, I think in the tutorial files included in the SC2 Arttools there are some cliffs included |
| 20:55.52 | Bommes | although in the documentation there doesn't seem to be a tutorial about cliffs, but the files themselves might still be helpful for you |
| 20:57.50 | JademusSreg | Backish. |
| 20:58.19 | Otixa | smacks Bommes |
| 20:58.52 | Triceron | smacks Otixa |
| 20:59.13 | Otixa | hi ;p |
| 20:59.49 | JademusSreg | If it's a data question, I can certainly help. If it's a modeling question, it's probably* beyond my current knowledge. |
| 21:00.18 | Otixa | polygons lol \o/ |
| 21:00.38 | A1win | hmmh any ideas how to make WASD controls translate into an angle? like D is 0, W is 90, A is 180 etc. (with 8 different angles) |
| 21:00.53 | A1win | now I just have a huge if-then-else block |
| 21:01.43 | JademusSreg | Porygons. ◄@ |
| 21:01.43 | ArcanePariah | JademusSreg: In the region actors, it makes reference to a Set Query Caster message, yet I can not find that anywhere |
| 21:01.44 | Otixa | If you use a vector2 for velocity you can just add to it ;p |
| 21:02.24 | JademusSreg | Arc, in script, GUI, or data? |
| 21:02.44 | Bommes | A1win: if you use custom script you can actually set/read the bits of an integer directly to indicate which buttons of WASD are pressed at any given moment |
| 21:03.24 | A1win | how does that help |
| 21:03.38 | ArcanePariah | GUI |
| 21:04.13 | Bommes | well the if then else is not that large |
| 21:04.17 | Bommes | 8 different states |
| 21:04.21 | JademusSreg | A1, bool takes a byte, int takes 4 bytes, so bitmasking the input state is more efficient, is what Bom means. |
| 21:04.54 | A1win | ah, I don't care what's efficient, just need it to make sense ;p |
| 21:04.58 | JademusSreg | HAha |
| 21:05.04 | A1win | (in this case) |
| 21:05.13 | ArcanePariah | When examining the fields: Notify Radius Key or any of the Query Abil Cmd, or Query Effect |
| 21:06.39 | JademusSreg | rummages around in the extracts. |
| 21:06.41 | Dustin | A1win, I would just use a simple Switch/Case |
| 21:07.08 | Bommes | A1win: Bitmasking would help it to make sense since it would look something like "0000" (no input) or "1010" (w+s pressed) and you could process the actions based on that |
| 21:07.21 | Bommes | well in my opinion at least, dunno |
| 21:07.34 | JademusSreg | I stepped into this discussion late; wat about wads, A1? |
| 21:07.49 | Dustin | You only travel in 1 direction at a time, so a simple fall through would more more "efficient" than all if checks. |
| 21:08.03 | A1win | I just need the wasd direction as an angle in degrees |
| 21:08.10 | JademusSreg | Ah, solved. |
| 21:08.33 | kingTD | Well about that timing of modelling I probobly should be available to be around |
| 21:08.53 | JademusSreg | https://pastee.org/k3kz8 |
| 21:09.09 | JademusSreg | Controller_ExecuteMovement(player,ATan2(up-down,right-left)+CameraGetYaw(player)+Controller.angleOffset); |
| 21:09.15 | kingTD | what the porpuse of me being there appart from spaming shit and making no sense for you humans? |
| 21:09.37 | A1win | I'd rather the axis didn't snap to 0 if both are pressed |
| 21:09.57 | JademusSreg | Both? |
| 21:10.13 | A1win | A/D and W/S |
| 21:10.39 | JademusSreg | Why's that? |
| 21:10.58 | A1win | feels better if it uses the latest pressed key |
| 21:11.13 | JademusSreg | Ah. |
| 21:11.14 | A1win | so you don't need to "remember" to release the other key before you press the next one ;p |
| 21:11.28 | Dustin | How's the map coming A1win? |
| 21:11.31 | Bommes | #dementiagaming |
| 21:11.31 | A1win | not sure if I read your script correctly though |
| 21:11.47 | A1win | Dustin, last test was pretty chaotic, I need to slow ships down a lot |
| 21:12.03 | Dustin | Ahh fun! |
| 21:12.38 | A1win | JademusSreg, this basically does it? ATan2(up-down,right-left) |
| 21:12.59 | JademusSreg | Pretty much. |
| 21:13.05 | A1win | what's atan(0,0) ? |
| 21:13.48 | Zolden | i just played something named notd |
| 21:13.48 | *** join/#sc2mapster herolief (~herolief@wireless-218-87.wireless.umbc.edu) |
| 21:15.13 | kingTD | Zolden so what I will have to do there in your event? |
| 21:17.26 | Zolden | just say nonsense |
| 21:17.26 | A1win | yay it works ;p |
| 21:17.40 | JademusSreg | Haha |
| 21:18.01 | JademusSreg | Sooo it was useful? |
| 21:18.37 | kingTD | Zolden heh then no thank you for your invitation |
| 21:18.38 | A1win | yeah I already thought of using angle between points, forgot how the math goes though |
| 21:19.23 | Zolden | kingTD it was an order, not invitation |
| 21:19.39 | kingTD | well i bail out |
| 21:19.46 | A1win | now let's see how these wasd controls feel on bnet |
| 21:19.56 | Zolden | A1win there's action "angle between poin ts" |
| 21:19.59 | Zolden | no math required |
| 21:20.16 | A1win | not sure if that accepts points with negative coordinates |
| 21:20.25 | Zolden | it accepts any |
| 21:20.34 | A1win | anyway the math is just ATan2(horizontal axis, vertical axis) |
| 21:20.39 | Zolden | yea |
| 21:22.56 | JademusSreg | Every good production needs a buffoon. |
| 21:23.17 | JademusSreg | Whoops. |
| 21:23.28 | A1win | hmm this might be just fine |
| 21:23.29 | kingTD | boobs |
| 21:23.48 | Fate_ | ahh damm you space marines, ill make eldar |
| 21:24.44 | Kueken | :p |
| 21:25.02 | Kueken | easier to make a melee eldar hero, I suppose |
| 21:25.09 | Fate_ | yes |
| 21:25.34 | Fate_ | and there are more fitteing models overall |
| 21:25.35 | Kueken | what do you pick? zealot? preserver? zeratul? |
| 21:26.14 | Kueken | oh for the high priestess you could use the protoss chick from the HotS campaign |
| 21:26.22 | Fate_ | not sure yet^^ |
| 21:26.37 | Kueken | the one that got killed alien-style by that facehugger zergling |
| 21:28.06 | JademusSreg | Arc, only explicit reference to QueryCaster listed here: https://pastee.org/4dv5y |
| 21:28.11 | Fate_ | Larassa |
| 21:28.20 | Fate_ | she will be the worker^^ |
| 21:29.30 | A1win | these controls are so awesome in local game now ;( |
| 21:31.09 | *** join/#sc2mapster Kueken1 (~Kueken@brsg-4dbbd580.pool.mediaWays.net) |
| 21:34.49 | JademusSreg | Or if you enjoy browsing string dumps, the whole actor section: https://pastee.org/exb24 |
| 21:35.28 | ArcanePariah | Jade, thanks, now I understand |
| 21:35.50 | ArcanePariah | THe region actor derives its info from its host if the subject is set to the QuereyCaster |
| 21:35.58 | JademusSreg | =D |
| 21:36.39 | JademusSreg | wonders if there are any hidden events, terms, or messages. |
| 21:37.04 | *** join/#sc2mapster ElectricPrism (~Loren@unaffiliated/electricprism) |
| 21:37.27 | JademusSreg | Sure enough, there is a message QuerySetCaster. |
| 21:37.40 | JademusSreg | Line 1053 |
| 21:39.12 | JademusSreg | Missed it before, silly me. Should have used better regex logic. |
| 21:39.36 | ArcanePariah | Odd that I did not see it before |
| 21:39.44 | ArcanePariah | I wonder if it only shows in certain received messages |
| 21:41.05 | JademusSreg | Hm, Terms are contextually sensitive, but as I recall events and messages are not. |
| 21:42.11 | JademusSreg | bbl |
| 21:42.16 | ArcanePariah | Hmm... a bug then, I can not find QuerySetCaster among events or messsages (Mind you, events = messages, just direction of travel) |
| 21:43.54 | grim001 | It's taking me as long to prove thread-safety on every class I've written as it took to write them... |
| 21:44.01 | *** join/#sc2mapster ElectricPrism1 (~Loren@c-50-174-39-186.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 21:46.36 | Dustin | Sup grim001 |
| 21:46.47 | grim001 | hi there |
| 21:52.44 | grim001 | hmm... if a mutable object (such as a Position) is modified in only one thread, and read in multiple other threads, then being backed by volatile doubles should be fine, so long as no intermediate values are assigned to the variables mid calculation within the methods |
| 21:54.05 | grim001 | but if a Position needed to be modified and read from any thread at any arbitrary time, you would need both volatile backing variables and synchronized methods. |
| 21:54.36 | grim001 | synchronizing every method in one of the most commonly-utilized classes will probably have an adverse performance effect... |
| 21:55.37 | grim001 | I could write an assert-based mechanism to enforce that fundamental data-containing classes are only mutated by one thread... |
| 21:56.00 | grim001 | Or I could make all of them immutable. Probably the best approach... |
| 21:56.54 | grim001 | Lots of wasted allocations, but supposedly it's fine for small objects, and pooling them would only annoy the garbage collector. |
| 21:59.17 | grim001 | however, immutable Positions would not require volatile backing variables, so the memory cost could be the tradeoff for increased read/write speed. Only the variables containing references to the positions would need to be volatile. |
| 21:59.59 | grim001 | end spam |
| 22:00.12 | JademusSreg | (Hah) |
| 22:01.48 | grim001 | the main reason for all these issues is the fact that input is asynchronous from rendering |
| 22:03.26 | grim001 | and I'm splitting CPU intensive tasks into their own threads... currently, the main one is mouse movement handling. |
| 22:03.56 | ArcanePariah | grim001: Is this in SC2 editor or something else? |
| 22:04.09 | grim001 | java. |
| 22:04.23 | ArcanePariah | Ahh... it doesn't have critical sections? |
| 22:04.23 | JademusSreg | I'd like to point out that while it's vital to understand such trade-offs, without knowing anything about the design or implementation it sounds like excessive focus on the system independent of what it actually needs by design. So a little context would generate better responses. |
| 22:04.55 | ArcanePariah | Critical Sections/Semaphores/Mutexes? |
| 22:05.04 | grim001 | I'm mostly talking to myself... I'm not adept enough at this multithreaded thought proccess yet to do it all in my head. |
| 22:05.29 | ArcanePariah | Ahh... yeah, I feel your pain, took a Theory of OS class and that was the very first subject area, multithreading |
| 22:05.34 | grim001 | arcane: java has some excellent concurrent collection classes that mostly handle those things for you, although you have to be aware of what it's doing behind the scenes. |
| 22:06.12 | ArcanePariah | Ahh good, and yeah, you have to know, multithreading/processing is frustrating even when it goes right... |
| 22:06.19 | grim001 | so far I have avoided the needed for any explicit mutexes or synchronization. |
| 22:08.33 | grim001 | well, I knew nothing of the topic about two weeks ago, and it's all been trial by fire since then. I was getting a lot of deadlocks until I started to figure it out. |
| 22:09.13 | ArcanePariah | Ahh yeah, deadlocks/livelocks both are nasty :P |
| 22:09.45 | ArcanePariah | I'm trying to remeber the other condition that causes infinite waiting and thus program failure |
| 22:10.00 | A1win | anyone up for a test? |
| 22:10.09 | grim001 | and the whole "liveness" issue can result in big framerate drops. I have to use non-blocking collections to communicate data from the event dispatch thread |
| 22:11.40 | grim001 | you could actually write a multithreaded program that's slower than single threaded if you aren't careful about that |
| 22:14.48 | Zolden | ArcanePariah is notd about marines killing infested marines? |
| 22:16.20 | ArcanePariah | About marines killing zombies on the moon |
| 22:16.34 | Zolden | i played it |
| 22:17.04 | A1win | hehe if I make ship acceleration slower, lag feels less bad |
| 22:17.10 | Zolden | and there is no chance you reduce your travelling distance to blizzcon |
| 22:17.10 | A1win | shouldn't make it too low though |
| 22:17.22 | *** part/#sc2mapster G0A (~hookah604@91.83.53.22.pool.invitel.hu) |
| 22:17.27 | A1win | Zolden, come test o: |
| 22:17.30 | Zolden | ok |
| 22:17.31 | Zolden | us? |
| 22:17.34 | A1win | EU |
| 22:17.37 | Zolden | ok |
| 22:19.00 | Fate_ | A1win may i jion too? |
| 22:19.17 | JademusSreg | Anyway, I prefer thread-safe wrapper classes for instanced classes, synchronization for singletons. |
| 22:20.07 | A1win | Fate_, just a quick test, we're about done already ;p |
| 22:20.22 | Fate_ | okey ill watch some porn then |
| 22:20.34 | JademusSreg | Oops |
| 22:23.21 | Otixa | ikilu |
| 22:24.52 | JademusSreg | Correction: thread-safe wrapper classes for instanced classes of more generic data structures, immutable returns for application-specific code, and synchronization for singletons which need state (otherwise immutable). |
| 22:27.29 | JademusSreg | I can explain the rationale behind each, if necessary, but seems obvious. |
| 22:28.42 | A1win | whee finally the controls are starting to feel bearable ;p |
| 22:30.04 | JademusSreg | A1's Development Motto: "When success isn't an option, settle for not-failure." |
| 22:30.17 | A1win | :P |
| 22:30.21 | JademusSreg | =D |
| 22:30.28 | A1win | I won't settle for not-failure |
| 22:30.50 | JademusSreg | A1's New Development Motto: "I won't settle for not-failure." |
| 22:30.57 | Otixa | xD |
| 22:33.25 | Triceron | that's quality assurance right there |
| 22:36.44 | A1win | what I should've said is "success is always an option" but I guess that's fine too |
| 22:38.27 | A1win | it's still kinda difficult to actually aim because of the lag |
| 22:38.57 | A1win | so need something to help with that, can't speed the projectiles up too much anymore |
| 22:39.10 | JademusSreg | I imagine the automotive industry subscribes to the maxim: "If it ain't broke, contract out component manufacture to the cheapest poor quality providers permitted by cost benefit analysis." |
| 22:39.22 | JademusSreg | brb |
| 22:41.30 | A1win | mmh actually these collisions are still very accurate, I guess I can make the projectiles quite a lot faster |
| 22:45.25 | A1win | <.< even if I reduce collision accuracy by 50% they still seem to hit precisely |
| 22:45.30 | A1win | probably a good idea to do that then :P |
| 22:45.36 | A1win | might help a bit with the performance issues |
| 22:47.06 | Zolden | A1win how about to make a 3 ways weapons? |
| 22:47.19 | Zolden | 3 projectiles, about 5-10' to each other |
| 22:47.42 | A1win | lie the pew pew weapon but split into different angles? |
| 22:47.43 | Zolden | and 20 other weapons types |
| 22:47.49 | A1win | ;> |
| 22:48.17 | *** join/#sc2mapster ElectricPrism (~Loren@unaffiliated/electricprism) |
| 22:48.23 | Zolden | have you seen a demo someone recently posted about a laser in a game like tyours, and that laser was bending |
| 22:48.24 | A1win | I will start making weapons as soon as this gameplay feels fun with just these weapons |
| 22:48.37 | A1win | might have |
| 22:48.52 | Zolden | a guy was asking for a beam model there there |
| 22:50.22 | A1win | I'm just skeptical on how fun a beam weapon would be |
| 22:50.59 | Zolden | being skeptical is a correct attitude in your position |
| 22:51.01 | A1win | but I guess it needs one just because... lasers |
| 22:51.18 | Zolden | you wouldn't implement all ideas ppl suggest |
| 22:51.24 | Zolden | yea |
| 22:51.26 | Zolden | lasers |
| 22:51.30 | Zolden | you got the point :) |
| 22:51.56 | Zolden | shouldn't be perfomance consuming |
| 22:52.19 | A1win | hmm right the gravity calculations are very simple now that I'm using a grid |
| 22:52.26 | Zolden | just check each ship's distance between laser line |
| 22:52.45 | Zolden | you can make a laser-line, no grav involved |
| 22:53.00 | A1win | yea that would be super simple ;p |
| 22:53.18 | A1win | I guess I'll go with that first, then if it's useful enough, I'll add bending later |
| 22:53.19 | Zolden | but laser that reacts to gravity would be great |
| 22:54.01 | grim001 | it's annoying how deficient java's mouse movement event is by default |
| 22:54.12 | grim001 | I shouldn't have to write my own mouse handling thread |
| 22:54.48 | grim001 | but it's partly the fault of windows for not providing per-pixel mouse movement notifications to the JVM |
| 22:54.48 | A1win | I wonder how I should make healing in a death match |
| 22:54.53 | A1win | just pick ups on planets? |
| 22:55.40 | A1win | or I guess similar pick ups than this green stuff is now |
| 22:55.59 | A1win | so that there are "crates" on planets and they spit out health kits and stuff when you break them |
| 22:57.16 | Zolden | probably |
| 22:57.27 | Zolden | grim001 and in java chat you talk about sc2 mapmaking? |
| 22:57.46 | grim001 | sure, why not |
| 22:57.55 | Stewox | anyone watched X-files as a kid ? |
| 22:57.56 | grim001 | not many people talk about sc2 map making here though |
| 22:58.34 | Stewox | well i just happened to close off the editor for today |
| 22:59.31 | ArcanePariah | ??? |
| 23:00.05 | ArcanePariah | Well... mapmaking directly, perhaps not, but related topics (models, game design, game theory), absouletly |
| 23:01.04 | ArcanePariah | Most people here are already comfortable with the editor, at to the degree that most help amounts to pointing them to the right trigger or right data section |
| 23:01.09 | Zolden | nerds have too many thoughts to not share them |
| 23:01.15 | ArcanePariah | That too |
| 23:01.21 | ArcanePariah | Tangents abound in here |
| 23:01.33 | ArcanePariah | slips Otixa another scotch |
| 23:01.35 | Zolden | ArcanePariah notd said there are 6 ppl participated |
| 23:01.45 | Otixa | What |
| 23:01.57 | ArcanePariah | Zolden: Hmm? |
| 23:02.00 | Otixa | Too lazy to read up |
| 23:02.05 | Zolden | on loading screen |
| 23:02.07 | Otixa | Need input on someshit? |
| 23:02.35 | A1win | damn, I thought I had virtualdub installed but I guess it was on the old hard drive... |
| 23:03.00 | ArcanePariah | Yes, those were earlier people, originally NotD was conceived by 3 people. The original coder and writer have left since, and in their place, I'm the current coder and another person is the lead designer. Also various people have helped out with artwork |
| 23:03.15 | ArcanePariah | THe original concept guy is still around |
| 23:03.37 | ArcanePariah | He acts more in an executive role, leaving the coding and desiging up to me and the other designer |
| 23:03.43 | Zolden | so projects of multiple developers are possible? |
| 23:04.04 | ArcanePariah | Well yes, why not? |
| 23:04.25 | ArcanePariah | If anything multiple people are needed. I am terrible at actual game design, but can code/do data with ease |
| 23:04.26 | Zolden | i thought ppl just hardly work together |
| 23:04.42 | ArcanePariah | Oh no, we got a decent crew, with occasional people joining in and leaving |
| 23:04.54 | ArcanePariah | We use Whatsapp to stay in contact |
| 23:05.08 | ArcanePariah | Got another guy to run our Mumble server, another to handle website affairs |
| 23:05.09 | Otixa | Whatsapp your face |
| 23:05.09 | Otixa | :D |
| 23:05.51 | Triceron | what project you working on arcanepariah? |
| 23:06.01 | ArcanePariah | We have another guy who is intermittent, he does model works (not art tools, uses siteops and creaative lighting to make new models) |
| 23:06.04 | ArcanePariah | Night of the Dead |
| 23:06.10 | ArcanePariah | Its the only project I do |
| 23:06.22 | Triceron | ohhh nice |
| 23:06.25 | Triceron | i love that map |
| 23:06.28 | ArcanePariah | :D |
| 23:06.38 | Zolden | there are alot of light sources on the map |
| 23:06.51 | Zolden | is it why it's laggy? |
| 23:06.52 | ArcanePariah | Currently I'm mostly spending time doing code refactoign/bug fixing |
| 23:07.00 | Triceron | mostly trigger stuff then? |
| 23:07.06 | ArcanePariah | Trigger/Data/AI |
| 23:07.18 | Triceron | how complex is the AI in notd? |
| 23:07.34 | ArcanePariah | Depends, for the most part fairly simple, but I'm changing that slowly |
| 23:07.49 | Zolden | very complex: a monster pursued me until i reached another player, and then monster attacked that guy and I survived |
| 23:08.19 | Triceron | it probably couldn't stand the smell |
| 23:08.28 | ArcanePariah | Some spawns attack towards the team position, others use the actual in game AI so they choose a target from the players and attack them |
| 23:08.51 | ArcanePariah | Some scenarios have the mobs attacks straight at team, one or 2 have the mobs spread out first then come in |
| 23:09.12 | ArcanePariah | I'm planning on randomizing some of the attack waves in their direction |
| 23:09.13 | Triceron | so is the AI defined by data, triggers or something else entirely? |
| 23:09.17 | Stewox | what's NotD |
| 23:09.24 | ArcanePariah | Triggers mostly |
| 23:09.34 | ArcanePariah | AI is always done in data or triggers |
| 23:10.11 | ArcanePariah | Threre are a few predefined AI triggers that Blizzard wrote. Also I've been toying with writing my own AI scripts for each enemy unit |
| 23:10.21 | ArcanePariah | But going to probably save that for NotD 2 |
| 23:10.34 | ArcanePariah | Oh yeah, were working on a sequel, the designer guy is working on that |
| 23:10.39 | ArcanePariah | along with terrain |
| 23:11.01 | ArcanePariah | As for the lag Zolden, sheer number of doodads, lighting, effects, weapons, triggers |
| 23:11.13 | ArcanePariah | The code is 41.5k lines long |
| 23:11.17 | ArcanePariah | Its massive |
| 23:11.22 | ArcanePariah | Used to be 55k |
| 23:11.27 | Zolden | yea, i had the same kind of lag in homm where there were alot of everything on 255x255 map |
| 23:11.37 | Triceron | there's gonna be a notd2? |
| 23:11.41 | ArcanePariah | Yes |
| 23:11.56 | Triceron | what do you guys have planned for that? |
| 23:12.00 | ArcanePariah | Currently designer guy is working on it, has most of the concept stuff fleshed out |
| 23:12.10 | Triceron | what's new, basically |
| 23:12.24 | ArcanePariah | Well its going to be more like NotD's from Wc3, randomzied story progression instead of the currrent pick a story |
| 23:12.30 | ArcanePariah | Also, more factions |
| 23:12.44 | ArcanePariah | each with their own AI/flavor |
| 23:13.13 | ArcanePariah | Humans will operate in small tactical groups, flanking, usinga abilites to flush players out |
| 23:13.16 | ArcanePariah | Zombies = mindless |
| 23:13.29 | ArcanePariah | Mech = Glass cannons, but good strategy |
| 23:13.37 | ArcanePariah | And one other, can't rmbr |
| 23:13.38 | Zolden | glass cannons? |
| 23:13.45 | ArcanePariah | high DPS, low hp |
| 23:13.55 | Zolden | will the be made of glass? |
| 23:14.09 | ArcanePariah | Possibly, we have the guy who did custom modeling for UA3 on board |
| 23:14.25 | Zolden | what's ua3? |
| 23:14.31 | ArcanePariah | Dunno who he is, but that's the word from my designer guy. |
| 23:14.35 | ArcanePariah | Undead Assault 3 |
| 23:14.40 | ArcanePariah | Similar game, same genre |
| 23:14.59 | Zolden | can he create glass cannon? |
| 23:15.18 | ArcanePariah | Also planning on more player customization, specialty weapons, named weapons/custom name units (instead of generic class names) |
| 23:15.56 | ArcanePariah | With my experience with the editor, should make creating stuff far easier then the first time round |
| 23:16.03 | ArcanePariah | Esp with templating |
| 23:17.35 | ArcanePariah | Also we got some custom artwork done as well by nicolas chaussois |
| 23:17.43 | Zolden | And what was your previous map? |
| 23:17.50 | ArcanePariah | ??? |
| 23:17.57 | Zolden | or you started with this one? |
| 23:18.09 | ArcanePariah | This is the only map I've ever worked on |
| 23:18.20 | Zolden | oh |
| 23:18.30 | Zolden | must be noobly made :) |
| 23:19.31 | A1win | uploading a video of this... |
| 23:19.46 | ArcanePariah | Here's something that will be in our new loading screen |
| 23:19.49 | ArcanePariah | <PROTECTED> |
| 23:21.39 | ArcanePariah | He did wallpapers for all the classes, all of them are sick :D |
| 23:21.43 | ArcanePariah | https://imgur.com/a/KFamY |
| 23:22.16 | A1win | nice |
| 23:22.37 | A1win | lot of work for an SC2 map D: |
| 23:23.18 | ArcanePariah | *Shrug* It's fun, I spent.. 3000+ hours on it before starting to help code? |
| 23:23.29 | ArcanePariah | I had 3000 games at least, according to my stats |
| 23:23.49 | A1win | hehe |
| 23:23.50 | Zolden | nicep ics |
| 23:24.12 | Zolden | you mean played 3k+ hours? |
| 23:24.16 | ArcanePariah | Yeah |
| 23:24.22 | ArcanePariah | That was before I started coding |
| 23:24.31 | Zolden | is it that fun? |
| 23:24.45 | A1win | that's 125 days |
| 23:24.47 | Zolden | why didn't you create your own map based on that one? |
| 23:24.58 | A1win | you played 8 hours a day for a year? |
| 23:25.07 | ArcanePariah | I played for 2.5 years |
| 23:25.14 | A1win | ah |
| 23:25.16 | ArcanePariah | I started playing october after WoL came out |
| 23:25.29 | ArcanePariah | Really got into it Nov/December of that year |
| 23:25.42 | ArcanePariah | Started coding... about a year ago now |
| 23:25.47 | A1win | I wish I could still get as passionate about something ;[ |
| 23:26.33 | ArcanePariah | Zolden: 3 storylines, 8 classes per story, 14 in all, and you can random out of story classes, plus grind based perks, credit shop to buy long term or game specfici stuff |
| 23:26.47 | ArcanePariah | Each class, 2 trees, hybrids are possible with a few |
| 23:26.59 | ArcanePariah | Been meaning to doing a hybrid recon... |
| 23:27.11 | Zolden | alot of shit you mean? |
| 23:27.18 | ArcanePariah | Yeah, there is a just a ton to do |
| 23:27.42 | ArcanePariah | Game is somewhat static, but there are random events that can happen |
| 23:27.46 | A1win | alot of shit http://i.imgur.com/RPGD1zG.jpg |
| 23:28.01 | Zolden | :) |
| 23:28.05 | ArcanePariah | Most importantly, the game keeps you on edge, most of the time, you blink for a few seconds on higher difficulties, you die |
| 23:28.13 | ArcanePariah | Teamwork is crucial |
| 23:28.35 | ArcanePariah | Also the enemies each have thier own little perk/thing you have to remember |
| 23:29.03 | ArcanePariah | All in all, its jsut very very complex |
| 23:29.08 | ArcanePariah | Takes a long time to master it |
| 23:29.21 | ArcanePariah | We do have a tutorial |
| 23:29.27 | A1win | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CIBwai3WcCk |
| 23:29.32 | ArcanePariah | So new players aren't quite just thrown into the fire |
| 23:29.48 | A1win | damn, description failed to update |
| 23:31.50 | Zolden | i played a bit, even got level 5 or so, but then was killed rapidly by a monster ;/ |
| 23:34.14 | ArcanePariah | Yeah, that is one thing about NotD that sometimes can be frustating, you can die VERY easily, no matter the class, no matter how many perks you have |
| 23:36.50 | ArcanePariah | Also, I guess one thing that keeps stuff interesting is each story has a distinct flavor to it. One is the Tank and Spank, another is about applying massive damage, and the last is about crowdcontrol and positioning. |
| 23:37.49 | ArcanePariah | Between the 14 classes, there is a class for anyone playstyle, and some people go super specialized. One guy pretty much only played Medic, has over 800 wins with it |
| 23:38.54 | Zolden | maybe he's a doctor in real life |
| 23:39.25 | ArcanePariah | Nah, hes a uni student, though I think hes doing premed? can't rmbr |
| 23:40.43 | ArcanePariah | As for me, I kind of rotated among like 5 different classes throughout the years |
| 23:40.59 | ArcanePariah | Nowadays I play Marksman |
| 23:43.44 | Otixa | puts flamexin in ArcanePariah's eyes |
| 23:44.20 | ArcanePariah | googles flamexin |
| 23:44.52 | ArcanePariah | tells Dr. Otixia hes holding it wrong |
| 23:45.26 | Otixa | It's fine |
| 23:45.27 | Otixa | Man up |
| 23:45.34 | Otixa | And learn to spell my name right |
| 23:45.34 | Otixa | >;[ |
| 23:53.07 | *** join/#sc2mapster Bounty (45f8f26f@gateway/web/freenode/ip.69.248.242.111) |
| 23:53.29 | Bounty | Is there anyway to attach one end of a beam model and another end to something else in triggers? |
| 23:55.31 | Zolden | yea |
| 23:55.40 | Ahli | gax mod has triggers for beam stuff |
| 23:55.42 | Zolden | gax does it, you can check |
| 23:55.57 | Bounty | hmm |
| 23:56.05 | Zolden | it just creates sites |
| 23:56.25 | Bounty | Don't think I'm allowed to use it though sadly |
| 23:56.30 | Zolden | what map are you working on Bommes |
| 23:56.32 | Bounty | Since the project I am on is a paid position |
| 23:56.34 | Zolden | what map are you working on Bounty |
| 23:56.48 | Bounty | cognitive research project for North Carolina State University |
| 23:57.14 | Zolden | sounds like an interesting map |
| 23:59.29 | Bounty | It is |
| 23:59.39 | Bounty | It failed miserably on our first group of Alpha testers |
| 23:59.42 | Bounty | lol |
| 23:59.48 | Bounty | Its for older adults |
