| 00:00.55 | EntityEnigma | it looks like the devil dog model uses some kind of model on top of the normal firebat model called "incinerator" |
| 00:01.11 | EntityEnigma | and theres a separate texture declaration for it already in events |
| 00:02.50 | EntityEnigma | can i just click on that declaration and add adaptions like i would for adding textures to a model norrmaly? |
| 00:03.23 | EntityEnigma | if i want to change the textures for that model |
| 00:04.29 | Kueken | not sure what exactly you are referring to, but yes, the model for the devil dog consists of 2 parts using separate textures |
| 00:05.06 | Kueken | they need individual declarations, but if they already exist for whatever reason, yes, you should be able to use them |
| 00:05.25 | EntityEnigma | sweet |
| 00:05.45 | Kueken | I might misunderstand what you are saying, though |
| 00:06.48 | EntityEnigma | i'll try it first |
| 00:06.58 | EntityEnigma | oh wtf |
| 00:07.25 | EntityEnigma | why is there a devil dog model on top of every other model in my map?? |
| 00:07.41 | EntityEnigma | uh has anyone ever experienced anything like that? |
| 00:08.36 | Kueken | yeah, happens |
| 00:08.57 | Kueken | usually when an actor of yours has a unitbirth.* -> create event |
| 00:09.23 | EntityEnigma | hmm |
| 00:10.26 | EntityEnigma | oh yeah... i think i found it |
| 00:10.33 | EntityEnigma | the event text is all red |
| 00:12.12 | Teratron | apalling stuff in school http://www.infowars.com/sixth-grade-assignment-destroy-the-bill-of-rights/ |
| 00:12.49 | Teratron | oops, wrong chat |
| 00:16.53 | EntityEnigma | if i just right click on the events field and select a reset to parent value will it fix it? |
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| 00:31.23 | *** mode/#sc2mapster [+b *!~chatzilla@cpe-86-58-34-166.static.triera.net] by Torhal |
| 00:31.24 | *** kick/#sc2mapster [Teratron!~Torhal@li234-119.members.linode.com] by Torhal (Your behavior is not conducive to the desired environment.) |
| 01:38.28 | *** join/#sc2mapster Serashin (4ff358a0@gateway/web/freenode/ip.79.243.88.160) |
| 01:38.47 | Serashin | i suck i suck i suck i suck i suck |
| 02:10.11 | JademusSreg | ? |
| 02:29.45 | Triceron | ? |
| 02:31.20 | JademusSreg | Curious why one would repeatedly assert "i suck", as Sera did just above. |
| 02:32.03 | JademusSreg | Well, I suppose advertising is a possible purpose, but this is hardly the time or place to offer such services. |
| 02:34.56 | JademusSreg | Tri, ever tried to get shaders to load from a SC2 map/mod? |
| 02:40.12 | Triceron | what do you mean get shaders to load? |
| 02:40.56 | Triceron | shaders are part of the .m3's |
| 02:41.14 | JademusSreg | Well, SC2 shaders are all right there in the Shaders directory, and I'm curious if anyone has managed to coax the game client into loading custom shaders from a map or mod. |
| 02:41.39 | Triceron | in that case, no I haven't. I didn't even know about the shaders directory |
| 02:41.45 | JademusSreg | Ah. |
| 02:41.55 | Triceron | are they preset shaders? |
| 02:42.25 | Triceron | stuff for 'metal' or 'glass'? Or something more specific? |
| 02:42.30 | JademusSreg | Easiest way to see all the files, launch editor, open Console window, browse commands, search filter Shaders\ |
| 02:43.33 | JademusSreg | I extracted them all to browse at my leisure, and the editor doesn't make obvious that the files are plaintext, but sure enough, right click, Export file, and you can open it with a text editor. |
| 02:44.28 | JademusSreg | And shader compiles are performed as needed, so custom shaders seem quite doable, provided they can be loaded from a map or mod. |
| 02:45.06 | Triceron | I see a bunch of files as *.fx, is this what you were referring to? |
| 02:45.10 | JademusSreg | Yep. |
| 02:45.34 | Triceron | I have no clue how these files are used |
| 02:45.40 | Triceron | first time I've seen em |
| 02:46.27 | JademusSreg | It's just shader code, more or less. |
| 02:46.43 | Triceron | ahh |
| 02:50.48 | JademusSreg | Not unusual to see (with frame rate display enabled) mention of shader compiles, seems all the necessary functionality is there (including a native to restart the engine and recompile shaders), so the only open question is how one might load custom shaders. Would enable some novel visuals. |
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| 05:11.26 | EntityEnigma | can anyone help me with a model texture question? |
| 05:22.59 | twdoei | k |
| 05:23.14 | twdoei | afk |
| 05:27.05 | Otixa | JademusSreg, .FX? |
| 05:27.10 | Otixa | isn't that HLSL? |
| 05:28.33 | Otixa | pastebin teh smallest one you see pl0x |
| 05:29.00 | Otixa | if we can actually add our own, it might make for some interesting shit |
| 05:29.14 | Otixa | or some new looks to maps at least |
| 05:29.27 | Otixa | like... sobel edge detection for wow model maps |
| 05:29.31 | Otixa | could be interesting |
| 05:44.21 | *** join/#sc2mapster someguy (438ea617@gateway/web/freenode/ip.67.142.166.23) |
| 05:45.05 | someguy | Hey everyone, how do you check of a variable is even through conditions? I'm using a for each integer action and need to know when the integer is even without adding every possiblity. |
| 05:47.56 | Otixa | even as in? |
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| 05:56.32 | someguy | As even, 2, 4, 6, 8 |
| 05:56.35 | someguy | and so on |
| 05:57.00 | someguy | as even-> as in* |
| 05:58.30 | JademusSreg | Zarglefarg. |
| 05:58.45 | JademusSreg | Otixa, still there? I was busy? |
| 05:58.48 | JademusSreg | *. |
| 05:58.58 | Otixa | someguy, modulate by 2 |
| 05:58.59 | Otixa | derp |
| 05:59.01 | Otixa | JademusSreg, ya |
| 05:59.04 | JademusSreg | var % 2 |
| 05:59.29 | someguy | Mdoulate? |
| 05:59.33 | someguy | as in use increment 2? |
| 05:59.46 | someguy | modulate* |
| 05:59.58 | Otixa | no, as in modulate |
| 06:00.03 | JademusSreg | Alright, will prepare a paste. And yeah, it's almost certainly HLSL, D3DX shader code. |
| 06:00.08 | JademusSreg | modulo operator. |
| 06:00.26 | Otixa | JademusSreg, we can have some fun with that if it can be shoehorned in then :D |
| 06:00.37 | JademusSreg | Aka remainder from division as taught in primary school. |
| 06:00.40 | Otixa | Also, is LinkedIn worth it? ;p |
| 06:01.19 | someguy | what would the divisor be? 2? You'll have to excuse me I never got much math and am pretty bad at it. |
| 06:01.22 | JademusSreg | Otixa, not unless you feel Facebook is "worth it". |
| 06:01.36 | Otixa | shrugs |
| 06:01.50 | Otixa | [08:58] <Otixa> someguy, modulate by 2 |
| 06:02.06 | JademusSreg | "n % 2" is like asking "what is the remainder of n divided by 2". |
| 06:02.35 | Otixa | if(x % 2 == 0) print("even number"); |
| 06:02.54 | someguy | Oh |
| 06:03.02 | someguy | but what if the number is 4 |
| 06:03.10 | someguy | then it'd find a remaindor of 1 right? |
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| 06:03.14 | Otixa | ¬¬ |
| 06:03.27 | Otixa | Too early for this shit |
| 06:03.32 | someguy | like i said math isnt my strongsuit you'll have to forgive me |
| 06:04.01 | Otixa | if modulation by 2 gives 0 it is an even number |
| 06:04.06 | Otixa | if it doesn't then it's odd |
| 06:04.52 | someguy | so it will always give 0 if the number is even |
| 06:04.52 | someguy | right? |
| 06:05.00 | Otixa | ...yeah |
| 06:06.17 | JademusSreg | https://pastee.org/qqpnq |
| 06:06.59 | JademusSreg | Instead of doing as you asked, I pasted one I thought might be interesting. |
| 06:07.04 | Otixa | JademusSreg, seems pretty standard :D |
| 06:07.41 | Otixa | my main concern is actually getting the engine to call it |
| 06:08.07 | JademusSreg | Yep, that's what I've been saying. |
| 06:08.26 | JademusSreg | Clearly I'm not asking "how do I shot shader". =D |
| 06:08.38 | Otixa | I mean... It should be somewhere in both the model file |
| 06:08.44 | Otixa | And somewhere in the code |
| 06:09.05 | Otixa | The model file we can prolly just hexedit |
| 06:09.42 | JademusSreg | I figure testing shader overriding is the most direct route to determining the viability of custom shaders. |
| 06:09.54 | Otixa | http://code.google.com/p/ogre-toon-shading/source/browse/trunk/OgreApp/bin/Media/materials/programs/SobelFilter.hlsl?r=4 |
| 06:10.00 | Otixa | see if you can shoehorn this in |
| 06:10.28 | Otixa | you'll need to edit out the var names for the one SC2E uses |
| 06:10.40 | ArcanePariah | Jade, since you mentioned the part about that code compiling shaders and engine restart. That stuff is indeed hardcoded, the associated triggers to run that code are restricted functions |
| 06:11.08 | Otixa | ArcanePariah, a direct replace shouldn't be an issue imo |
| 06:11.25 | JademusSreg | Like importing it to a map/mod in Core.SC2Mod/Shaders/ |
| 06:11.44 | Otixa | It should just recompile them without noticing it's swapped |
| 06:11.53 | Otixa | unless it keeps hashes or whatever |
| 06:12.32 | ArcanePariah | Well, I tried exporting and changing values, and then reimporting, the game instantly removed the entire mpq and redownloaded it |
| 06:12.43 | ArcanePariah | when i attempted to launch sc2 |
| 06:12.59 | JademusSreg | Again, must not be a modification of the standard MPQs. =D |
| 06:13.01 | ArcanePariah | So I do belive all file in Core.MPQ are have checksums |
| 06:13.13 | ArcanePariah | Then in that case, it probably will straight ignore them |
| 06:14.42 | JademusSreg | The entire point being to get a portable container, like a map or mod, to get em loaded, if possible. |
| 06:15.33 | ArcanePariah | Because the engine restart function and shader recompile are both functions that are native/restricted, so I figure those are hardcoded paths and thus the game will ONLY use the Core.MPQ shader code |
| 06:16.27 | Otixa | Worth a try ;p |
| 06:16.42 | ArcanePariah | I just don't see them letting us upload our own shader code, since we have 0 idea how it fits into the engine |
| 06:16.45 | Otixa | If it's actually doable, there will be much win |
| 06:17.01 | Otixa | the same way any shader code fits into any angine |
| 06:17.06 | Otixa | i.e. not directly linked |
| 06:17.09 | ArcanePariah | I'm just curious, what would be the advantages to writing and letting us have custom shader code? |
| 06:17.29 | JademusSreg | Sometimes there are ways around such restrictions. I recall there were a few restricted natives that could be used if called before map init, which is to say before the main thread finishes the call stack (typically reserved for GUI initialization of shit). |
| 06:17.30 | Otixa | We wouldn't have to use their shitty derp shaders ;P |
| 06:17.58 | ArcanePariah | Are the blizzard shaders terrible or something (poor quality, poor performance0? |
| 06:18.12 | Otixa | Well, they're technically not bad |
| 06:18.28 | Otixa | Altho I somwhat dislike their base asset shader |
| 06:18.38 | Otixa | But there's 0 variety ;p |
| 06:18.47 | Otixa | We can make shinies! |
| 06:18.47 | ArcanePariah | I assumed Blizzard made some compromises on the shaders to compensate for the sheer number of units that are expected on screen. |
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| 06:18.59 | someguy | Hey if I modulate by 1 will I get odd numbers or do I have to do something else? |
| 06:19.06 | Otixa | Hell, we can port my crosshatch shader ;P |
| 06:19.38 | Otixa | digs around dropbox |
| 06:19.42 | JademusSreg | Custom shader at work: http://youtu.be/JpksyojwqzE |
| 06:19.43 | JademusSreg | =D |
| 06:19.45 | ArcanePariah | Oh... ahh I see, you want shader code more geared toward RPG/FPS, with higher detail, with the expectation of fewer objects on screen, whereas Blizzard wrote shader code geared towards an RTS |
| 06:19.45 | IndrickBoreale | We have not failed... the Emperor! |
| 06:20.29 | Otixa | hrm |
| 06:20.31 | ArcanePariah | I'll admit, my knowledge of shaders is limited at best |
| 06:20.36 | Otixa | can't find crosshatch |
| 06:20.38 | Otixa | but https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/10032576/FYP/FauxNoir/wip4.jpg |
| 06:21.05 | ArcanePariah | goes to Wikipedia for shader overview |
| 06:21.11 | IndrickBoreale | The Codex Astartes names the Galaxy language inferior. |
| 06:21.17 | Otixa | same scene, different shader: |
| 06:21.17 | Otixa | https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/10032576/FYP/Contrast/Contrast.jpg |
| 06:21.50 | Otixa | moar shader example: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/10032576/FYP/Painted/wip3.jpg |
| 06:22.15 | someguy | How do I find odd numbers? I've been messing around with modulation on my calculator but can't find a sure-fire number that always modulates the same number for an odd number. |
| 06:22.30 | IndrickBoreale | StarCraft II is dying! This is inexcusable. |
| 06:22.41 | someguy | err prints I suppose is more accurate, not modulates. |
| 06:22.43 | ArcanePariah | someguy, a number is odd if the number modulus 2 = 1 |
| 06:22.48 | someguy | oh |
| 06:22.50 | someguy | duh |
| 06:22.58 | ArcanePariah | so for a number N, odd is N % 2 == 1 |
| 06:23.04 | ArcanePariah | even is just 0 |
| 06:23.10 | ArcanePariah | instead of 1 |
| 06:23.16 | someguy | Right yeah. |
| 06:23.19 | someguy | My bad. |
| 06:23.58 | Otixa | Didn't we already tell you like... over 10 times? >;/ |
| 06:24.03 | JademusSreg | Ind, wat? |
| 06:24.11 | ArcanePariah | It is fine, we all have our moments, plus that is the ultimate joy of logic, discovering how simple something can be :D |
| 06:24.16 | IndrickBoreale | Ah. You must know my name. |
| 06:24.28 | IndrickBoreale | I am Indrick Boreale, Force Commander and Captain of the Blood Ravens Second Company of the Adeptus Astartes. |
| 06:24.50 | Otixa | slaps IndrickBoreale with a brick |
| 06:24.51 | someguy | otixa, yeah, that was my bad. I wasn't connecting the dots. |
| 06:24.57 | ArcanePariah | Otixa, you probably did, but language is an incredibly imprecise tool, and each of us respond differently, I can say the same thing 5 different ways :D |
| 06:25.06 | IndrickBoreale | Heretic! You shall feel the wrath of the Emperor! |
| 06:25.14 | Otixa | I haz brick ;p |
| 06:25.22 | ArcanePariah | declares an Exterminatus |
| 06:25.22 | IndrickBoreale | Indeed? |
| 06:25.34 | IndrickBoreale | What? |
| 06:25.36 | IndrickBoreale | WHAT?! |
| 06:25.38 | IndrickBoreale | Impossible! |
| 06:25.39 | Otixa | Anyway, let's get some shaders up in that bitch |
| 06:25.58 | ArcanePariah | Hey, you said Wrath of the Emperor, whats more wrathful then an Exterminatus? |
| 06:26.03 | IndrickBoreale | A crusade of glory and fire... |
| 06:26.07 | IndrickBoreale | The situation does not warrant it. |
| 06:26.16 | someguy | I'm curious and I hope you don't mind me asking but, what are you all up to? I hear something of a shader, is this some new game? |
| 06:26.18 | IndrickBoreale | The Inquisition is without tact. |
| 06:26.36 | Otixa | someguy, fully changing the graphics of SC2 ;p |
| 06:26.38 | IndrickBoreale | The cleansing fire of what the Codex Astartes suggests... is what the situation warrants. |
| 06:26.45 | ArcanePariah | someguy, shaders are a kind of programming logic, it is what is used to covert the code into the graphics you see |
| 06:27.11 | ArcanePariah | It is a process of determining the vertexes/orientation/color/zorder of stuff on screen |
| 06:27.16 | someguy | otixa: Ah, got it. ArcanePariah: haha yeah, I was just curious. |
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| 06:28.19 | ArcanePariah | On the same topic, Otixia, JademusSreg , does AA happen before or after shading or is it incorporated into the shader pipeline? |
| 06:28.31 | JademusSreg | Otixa, feel free to tinker and test. I'm preoccupied (and prefer to get others to test), but if it proves doable, it would be quite useful. |
| 06:28.53 | Otixa | I haven't opened the editor in like 3 years ;p |
| 06:29.14 | JademusSreg | Arc, would need to check the shaders to determine such. =D |
| 06:29.21 | Otixa | ArcanePariah, it depends, but it's generally a shader applied over the rest of them |
| 06:29.31 | ArcanePariah | Ahh, so it would be application specific choice |
| 06:29.41 | ArcanePariah | or if not that, driver determined |
| 06:29.45 | Otixa | yeah |
| 06:29.54 | JademusSreg | I see shader code dedicated specifically to anti aliasing, though, in some fashion. |
| 06:30.05 | Otixa | Well, some engines do it directly throught the GPU interface |
| 06:30.14 | ArcanePariah | Well, it is probably the most costly operation of rendering |
| 06:30.23 | Otixa | kinda |
| 06:30.29 | Otixa | it's pretty heavy, yeah |
| 06:30.46 | ArcanePariah | True, depends on how you do it, I know of now like 6 different AA techiques, each with pros and cons |
| 06:30.51 | Otixa | but reflection mapped water with alpha, vertex displacement etc is heavier |
| 06:31.19 | Otixa | FXAA is pretty decent imo |
| 06:31.23 | Otixa | Not perfect, but eh |
| 06:31.26 | ArcanePariah | I wonder if we ever progress to using ray tracing as opposed to shaders |
| 06:31.30 | IndrickBoreale | does tainted whisp still come here |
| 06:31.59 | Otixa | ArcanePariah, not yet ;p |
| 06:32.01 | ArcanePariah | ray tracing is so much nicer, but the performance hit.... its brutal |
| 06:32.17 | Otixa | Well, UE4 has realtime GI |
| 06:32.21 | Otixa | So we're getting there |
| 06:32.54 | ArcanePariah | Yeah, but still, it fundamentally is more expensive, since you have to vector calculus, instead of whole lot of algebra |
| 06:32.55 | Otixa | (with indirect illumination) |
| 06:33.24 | Otixa | Well |
| 06:33.34 | Otixa | We technically don't NEED actual raytracing |
| 06:33.50 | Otixa | It can be a cheap approximation on top of texture maps and still look awesome |
| 06:34.02 | ArcanePariah | Well, the example I remember from way back was a Billard set being illuminated from above, with a Nvidia 9800 GX2, the shader/rasterrized version looked worse, but had like 100x the FPS |
| 06:34.12 | ArcanePariah | and that was with no motion |
| 06:35.05 | ArcanePariah | GPU's have gotten a bit more powerful since then, but stilll, the performance hit is so extreme... I agree we will probably use it in limited places where it makes a difference, but probably never full on replacing rasterization |
| 06:35.08 | Otixa | ArcanePariah, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fAsg_xNzhcQ |
| 06:35.54 | Otixa | Problem? :D |
| 06:36.37 | ArcanePariah | No, just watched it, very nice, interesting technique |
| 06:37.01 | Otixa | So yeah, don't really need actual raytracing |
| 06:37.05 | Otixa | Just a half-decent approximation |
| 06:37.06 | Otixa | ;p |
| 06:37.28 | ArcanePariah | And yeah, one reason rasterization performs better is they have done enomourus research into it, and optimized drivers/hardware for it, ray tracing or approximations of it like this just need time and some math done on them |
| 06:37.58 | ArcanePariah | Yeah, this is just like AA, you can 80% of the gain for 50% of the performance hit |
| 06:38.05 | ArcanePariah | No need to go full blown |
| 06:38.11 | ArcanePariah | (Yet) |
| 06:38.23 | ArcanePariah | wonders when he will get his Holodeck |
| 06:38.26 | ArcanePariah | :D |
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| 06:39.42 | Otixa | needs moar shinies |
| 06:41.35 | ArcanePariah | Arguably games no longer need better graphics, they already tread into the Uncanny Valley a bit, but stuff for real time modeling for teaching surgical procedures or other complex real world tasks could use better graphics, would be nice to do stuff on models digitally instead of real life ones, cheaper, and can serve as good practice for the basics |
| 06:41.41 | JademusSreg | "<IndrickBoreale> does tainted whisp still come here" This is something only Taint would ask. |
| 06:41.53 | ArcanePariah | lol |
| 06:42.49 | Otixa | Well, not really |
| 06:42.58 | Otixa | Would be nice if we could afford higher res textures |
| 06:43.02 | Otixa | Then I'd be happy |
| 06:43.04 | Otixa | ;> |
| 06:43.25 | Otixa | I often lose a lot of the detail from sculpts when baking down the textures |
| 06:43.31 | Otixa | Very sad :< |
| 06:43.47 | Triceron | i'm loving the retro trend in gaming. there's a certain charm to 8-bit |
| 06:43.59 | Otixa | Triceron, you heretic >:[ |
| 06:44.20 | Otixa | I dunlike you anymore </3 |
| 06:45.46 | JademusSreg | The aesthetics should complement the gameplay. Enough said. |
| 06:46.01 | Otixa | smacks JademusSreg |
| 06:46.33 | JademusSreg | http://the-witness.net/news/2013/09/on-the-rocks/ |
| 06:46.56 | Otixa | ooh shinies |
| 06:47.10 | Otixa | me gusta :3 |
| 06:47.38 | Otixa | Half lambert is awesome ;D |
| 06:47.53 | Otixa | Tho, they have some other shit mixed into it |
| 06:47.59 | Otixa | stares at the pixels |
| 06:48.21 | Otixa | Clever |
| 06:48.23 | JademusSreg | Paragraph 4 starts the stimulating portion. |
| 06:48.33 | Otixa | They clipped their shadow falloff |
| 06:49.26 | Otixa | Nice find :> |
| 06:49.36 | Otixa | bookmarks and pats JademusSreg on the head |
| 06:57.30 | Triceron | 8 bit is awesome, don't hate |
| 06:57.45 | Otixa | Neh, I preder moar shiny |
| 07:24.52 | JademusSreg | Base on the above, I suspect Otixa would add several layers of extraneous detail to a tea kettle, whereas Tri would, out of nostalgia, make an adorable over-simplified tea kettle. |
| 07:26.14 | Triceron | with beady black eyes for added cuteness |
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| 07:43.14 | MoonEater | Jade |
| 07:53.31 | JademusSreg | Oh, and here's some random stuff that I think about, in case one wonders: https://pastee.org/fbqrm |
| 07:53.52 | JademusSreg | Moon, wat? |
| 08:01.41 | MoonEater | sorry |
| 08:01.44 | MoonEater | spaced out |
| 08:02.13 | MoonEater | jade i ripped a map from cashe to examine it (not to steal) and for some reason this particular map doesnt want to load in editor |
| 08:02.39 | JademusSreg | Are you sure it's not a -mod-? |
| 08:04.09 | MoonEater | not 100% |
| 08:04.10 | MoonEater | but |
| 08:04.15 | MoonEater | i see t3 files |
| 08:04.20 | MoonEater | which are terrain right? |
| 08:06.12 | JademusSreg | Yes. |
| 08:06.41 | JademusSreg | Describe the process you used, I'll tell you if it's wrong. |
| 08:07.32 | MoonEater | well |
| 08:07.36 | MoonEater | i mpq opened it |
| 08:07.50 | MoonEater | then i copied the t3 and anything with .version |
| 08:07.56 | MoonEater | or has the sc2 editor icon |
| 08:08.00 | MoonEater | and also |
| 08:08.13 | MoonEater | the things with the same name as .version but not .version |
| 08:08.16 | MoonEater | if that makes sense |
| 08:08.20 | MoonEater | that didnt wokr |
| 08:08.29 | MoonEater | i did some xmls and such like bank |
| 08:10.58 | *** join/#sc2mapster Kueken (~Kueken@brsg-4dbba31f.pool.mediaWays.net) |
| 08:11.04 | Kueken | Shark |
| 08:12.05 | twdoei | Snake |
| 08:12.08 | twdoei | SNAKE |
| 08:12.14 | twdoei | SNAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAKKKKKKKKKKKKKKEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE |
| 08:18.13 | Bommes | Helloah. |
| 08:25.06 | *** join/#sc2mapster Kueken (~Kueken@brsg-4dbba31f.pool.mediaWays.net) |
| 08:29.13 | Bommes | Whenever I read anything that Jade wrote ever: http://i.imgur.com/9x75g7O.png |
| 08:33.22 | JademusSreg | Moon, any editor-read data the cached map lacks, you must add. If it lacks, say, a list of shit to load, add such a list. |
| 08:39.12 | twdoei | i guess there is no event that detects if unit is moving or not as the Move ability isnt something that will show if the target still moving somewhere |
| 08:39.28 | JademusSreg | ? |
| 08:40.24 | twdoei | ? Unit moving, changes coordinates > actions |
| 08:40.29 | Kueken | you can check for current order, which should cover all uses of move, if you want to cover other sources of movement, a periodic check for position might be in order |
| 08:41.51 | Bommes | you could also use a dummy effect with a validator |
| 08:41.52 | twdoei | y seems like will have to go with last option |
| 08:42.43 | JademusSreg | Or explain the purpose for such a thing, perhaps there's a better approach. |
| 08:43.25 | twdoei | ships |
| 08:45.54 | JademusSreg | =| |
| 08:46.31 | twdoei | what? |
| 08:47.33 | JademusSreg | The insight provided by the response was surpassed only by how uninformative it was. |
| 08:47.40 | Bommes | An obvious case of sea sickness. |
| 08:58.25 | twdoei | http://youtu.be/PL6vP4eDmEQ |
| 09:18.22 | twdoei | hmmm creating new pathing layer with triggers |
| 09:19.03 | twdoei | or the mover itself |
| 09:22.10 | JademusSreg | Cryptic. |
| 09:25.44 | *** join/#sc2mapster ElectricPrism (~Loren@unaffiliated/electricprism) |
| 09:27.50 | twdoei | hehe, collisions, well that must be fun shit to make |
| 09:28.05 | JademusSreg | "Fun", yes. |
| 09:30.20 | twdoei | limit of queueing the commands? |
| 09:31.21 | JademusSreg | Some power of 2, I expect. |
| 09:34.06 | twdoei | +30 |
| 09:34.51 | JademusSreg | Test 32, 64, 128, 256. =D |
| 09:35.19 | twdoei | tested it manually |
| 09:36.47 | ArcanePariah | twdoei: There is no direct event for detecting movement, however what you can do as a workaround that will work just as well is to add a behavior to all units that you need to detect, and for this behavior, have its disable validator be set to a Unit Compare Speed Validator. In this way, the behavior will activate when the unit speed is greater then 0 (moving), and you can then use the Event... |
| 09:36.49 | ArcanePariah | ...checking for the activation of that behavior |
| 09:37.31 | ArcanePariah | Hopefully that helps you |
| 09:37.40 | twdoei | yes it does! thanks |
| 09:39.03 | ArcanePariah | No problem, I had a similar issue when working with my AI, I wanted an ability to be only casted when the units were moving, that validator came quite in handy |
| 09:39.30 | Kueken | the compare speed validator works properly now? |
| 09:39.38 | Kueken | when I tested it, it didn't |
| 09:39.41 | ArcanePariah | ... it didn't? |
| 09:39.51 | ArcanePariah | Well, for me it does |
| 09:39.55 | Kueken | that was a couple of patches ago |
| 09:40.00 | Kueken | might be fixed |
| 09:40.08 | ArcanePariah | Well its been fixed for quite some time now |
| 09:40.12 | Kueken | or I might have messed up |
| 09:40.18 | Kueken | always a possibility |
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| 10:03.31 | twdoei | http://snag.gy/QF6OK.jpg |
| 10:06.24 | *** join/#sc2mapster Moorhsum (~scraft@dsl-kpobrasgw1-54fac5-136.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 10:12.22 | duckeis | hey goa, how's your hero map doing? |
| 10:15.04 | Goa | I fixed the bugs but I am not working on it, making a html5 game instead |
| 10:15.16 | duckeis | >.> |
| 10:15.18 | duckeis | what game |
| 10:15.31 | duckeis | sighs |
| 10:15.33 | Goa | rpg:D |
| 10:15.40 | Goa | simple one |
| 10:15.42 | duckeis | quadrasighs |
| 10:16.23 | duckeis | about ships and space and random elements I presume? |
| 10:16.43 | Goa | none is really true |
| 10:16.54 | Goa | no ships, no space |
| 10:17.03 | duckeis | what, a fantasy stuff with swords and fireballs? |
| 10:17.15 | Goa | nope |
| 10:17.20 | duckeis | or more like corporations and shotguns? |
| 10:17.26 | Goa | I want it to be popular, so zombies.D |
| 10:17.55 | duckeis | but... but corporations is much more awesome |
| 10:18.11 | duckeis | though you can combine it.. into corporate zombies! |
| 10:18.16 | Goa | it is, but that would make the game compley |
| 10:18.17 | Goa | x |
| 10:18.52 | duckeis | so, mapnight this friday? |
| 10:19.21 | twdoei | we can start friday this night |
| 10:19.44 | Goa | :D |
| 10:19.54 | Goa | I might not attend the map night:( |
| 10:19.55 | JademusSreg | Farglezarg? |
| 10:19.55 | duckeis | I can't, I've got plans, they involve sleeping |
| 10:20.06 | duckeis | =/ |
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| 10:36.26 | JademusSreg | Slarp? Plurrrt, slarparg urk flur thurk wurg nerthurg lurf terg derk. |
| 10:40.36 | JademusSreg | performs a traditional festive gnome dance. Dice roll indicates the dance failed to illicit festivity. |
| 10:44.05 | Serashin | Why do those Bunkers keep in this map in editor stay Bunkers even through they are ingame ColonistHuts , editor model is changed to Colonist hut ? And why does give me that bridge control not working error even through i copied all parts from JadesmusSreg´s demo ? |
| 10:44.07 | Serashin | https://docs.google.com/file/d/0Bwn-8yJveltkQXphTksyXzJ5a00/edit?usp=drive_web |
| 10:56.45 | twdoei | Can u send me map? |
| 10:56.57 | twdoei | or its a link of it? |
| 10:57.10 | Serashin | This is the maplink |
| 10:58.09 | *** join/#sc2mapster Zolden (~a@88.135.0.21) |
| 10:58.30 | twdoei | Zolden where you shitty around? |
| 10:58.38 | Serashin | Im currently trying to figure out how to make my own techtrees . I have written down what i want . But i cant seem atm to be able to implent it . My first approach was to copy Terrans building into other workers , because i want all races to have the need of 1 worker creating their buildings . Terran like . Makes it less messy to balance |
| 10:59.02 | Serashin | But it didnt appear at other workers at all. |
| 10:59.38 | twdoei | http://youtu.be/jBHXcSkgILI what song name from this one first 15 sec I may hear with woman voice in the song and much slower tempo |
| 11:00.02 | Zolden | twdoei i'm reading |
| 11:01.02 | twdoei | Serashin I opened your map without HotS dependancies and it shows in Editor the Colonist Huts |
| 11:01.39 | Serashin | My map has HOTS dependencies . I will also need those for models and default stuff i use. |
| 11:02.08 | twdoei | Well I dont have hots, but main point that MB your editor bugged? |
| 11:02.11 | Serashin | The only thing i changed midway about general data is to add swarm campaign to data tree |
| 11:03.23 | Serashin | I couldnt tell im a novice in the mapeditor. |
| 11:03.40 | twdoei | tried deleting dependacy? |
| 11:04.29 | Serashin | Shouldnt that limit my amount of models + data i have to use ? |
| 11:04.34 | Serashin | If so id prefer not try it |
| 11:05.05 | twdoei | just save as new map and delete in this temporare map those dependencies |
| 11:05.10 | twdoei | to test if that would change anything |
| 11:09.14 | Serashin | Dependencies cant be removed . because they are currently in use. |
| 11:09.41 | twdoei | not closed documents |
| 11:09.46 | twdoei | before opening new? |
| 11:10.48 | Serashin | I have been saving the removal of swarm multi , and closed it . reopened it then . wanted remove other swarm stuff . didnt let me |
| 11:11.07 | Serashin | And if it says me that is in use . It wont work |
| 11:11.13 | Serashin | Need another way of fixing it. |
| 11:11.21 | twdoei | just remove it |
| 11:11.33 | Serashin | I cant remove it. |
| 11:11.43 | twdoei | its only OK option? |
| 11:11.55 | Serashin | Only OK option. |
| 11:39.46 | *** join/#sc2mapster EntityEnigma (629696b2@gateway/web/freenode/ip.98.150.150.178) |
| 11:40.43 | EntityEnigma | im having so much trouble retexturing a devil dog |
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| 11:45.33 | EntityEnigma | I don't know if im supposed to make the texture id as FireBat_Diffuse, FirebatMercenary_Diffuse, incinerator_diffuse, or merc_incinerator_Diffuse |
| 11:45.43 | EntityEnigma | confusing as fuk |
| 11:47.24 | twdoei | open your model that you making textures change in Prieviewer right click on the model show details and there are materials section with what textures it uses |
| 11:47.45 | EntityEnigma | there are 2 |
| 11:48.07 | EntityEnigma | FireBat_Diffuse and FirebatMercenary_Diffuse |
| 11:48.19 | twdoei | not in the model |
| 11:49.33 | Kueken | EntityEnigma: both of them are used |
| 11:50.25 | EntityEnigma | how is it possible to have more than one? |
| 11:50.25 | Kueken | FireBat_Diffuse is the lower part of the body, and FirebatMercenary_Diffuse covers the upper part, the additional stuff that has been added to distinguish it from the default Firebat model |
| 11:50.41 | Kueken | models can use as many textures as they like |
| 11:51.02 | Goa | Zolden http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-10-08/bitcoin-1-0-fbi |
| 11:51.07 | Kueken | and you can usually swap all of them individually, by adding declarations for all of them |
| 11:51.37 | Kueken | and using separate textures and actor messages as well, also all of these should use different slots |
| 11:51.55 | EntityEnigma | i tried different combinations but i cant ever seem to modify both the upper and the lower parts |
| 11:52.06 | EntityEnigma | the textures only apply to one or the other |
| 11:53.00 | Kueken | the foolproof way is usually to use the entire file name as both prefix and substring |
| 11:53.22 | Bommes | well, are you using different slots for them? |
| 11:53.30 | EntityEnigma | can you give me an example? |
| 11:53.35 | EntityEnigma | i tried that too |
| 11:53.37 | Kueken | sec |
| 11:55.08 | Kueken | never noticed the devil dog model has premade declarations |
| 11:55.30 | Kueken | that was what you were referring to when you were talking about "incineratior" |
| 11:55.35 | EntityEnigma | yes |
| 11:55.42 | EntityEnigma | wtf do you do with those? |
| 11:55.43 | Kueken | I had no idea what you were talking about back then :D |
| 11:55.49 | EntityEnigma | can you just delete them? |
| 11:56.14 | Kueken | well, the model doesn't have any textures called like that |
| 11:56.16 | EntityEnigma | what are they for? |
| 11:56.20 | Kueken | so they should be useless |
| 11:56.20 | EntityEnigma | right |
| 11:56.34 | Kueken | maybe a remnant of an earlier implementation or something |
| 11:56.36 | EntityEnigma | x_X |
| 11:57.08 | EntityEnigma | ok ill just try getting rid of them |
| 11:59.12 | Kueken | http://pastebin.com/BuDPu0Gp |
| 12:00.02 | Kueken | thats both of them in a seperate declaration using the full texture name as prefix and substring, also fully typed out slots and subslots |
| 12:00.43 | Kueken | in this specific case, that might not be needed, but in general this ensures that the correct texture is swapped. |
| 12:01.18 | EntityEnigma | is it possible to paste this into the xml view so i can see what it looks like in table view? |
| 12:01.23 | Kueken | yes |
| 12:02.14 | Kueken | either paste the whole model, or just the declarations part and press "commit XML changes" or save the map, then switch back to table view |
| 12:02.40 | Kueken | you will get an error if you messed up syntax |
| 12:05.44 | EntityEnigma | it seems to have worked |
| 12:05.58 | EntityEnigma | the paste i mean |
| 12:06.11 | EntityEnigma | i see you typed out the full slot name |
| 12:08.10 | EntityEnigma | is it possible to add an emissive to the upper body portion? |
| 12:08.22 | Kueken | it is not necessary usually, it will use the appropriate subslot based on type, usually. But I had some issues with it when textures were used for multiple types, like Blizzard likes to do (like a _specular texture used for emissive and specular) |
| 12:08.51 | EntityEnigma | hmm |
| 12:08.52 | Kueken | if it doesn't have an emissive by default, you would need model editing |
| 12:09.04 | Kueken | if it does have one, you can swap it |
| 12:09.11 | EntityEnigma | ok |
| 12:09.33 | Kueken | (for the record: It does have one) |
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| 12:34.00 | EntityEnigma | thank god |
| 12:34.05 | EntityEnigma | its working now |
| 12:34.12 | EntityEnigma | thx kuek |
| 12:46.26 | Zolden | Goa 5% of all bitcoins? feels like bitcoins were initially created for nothing, but drugs |
| 12:49.07 | Goa | you could say the same for cash these days.D |
| 12:50.42 | Dustin | Zolden, Bitcoins are the future! |
| 12:52.04 | Zolden | Goa most cash is in banks, they are the main attractor for it. For bitcoins drug dealer's wallet si main attractor |
| 12:52.13 | Zolden | Dustin they are presence yet |
| 12:52.32 | Zolden | *present |
| 12:53.59 | Zolden | but it's jsut sick, drugs should become legal, inventing bitcoins will add more reasons for it by making illegality useless |
| 12:54.51 | Zolden | and then we will see bitcoins out of its playground - will they die or play another role |
| 12:56.21 | Goa | Zolden I think there is far more cash in curculation than in bank reserves |
| 12:56.44 | Goa | I mean real cash, not just some notes... |
| 13:02.18 | Zolden | Goa banks generated 90% of air cash, like debt instruments, loan securities, other papers that work as money, but is actually air. They are in circulation, world is breathing with this air. While banks slowly generating real money inside them. They use money to attract more money, it's a pure exponent. No matter, what the world do with its money, banks just get richer and richer. They are the final destinatioon of all money. |
| 13:03.04 | Zolden | money is like mass in universe, it has gravity, it's a law since humans invented credits |
| 13:03.37 | Zolden | but credits are natural, so it's just the fundamental property of money |
| 13:04.13 | Dustin | ^ |
| 13:04.19 | Dustin | Bitcoin = federation credits |
| 13:04.20 | Dustin | :D |
| 13:04.43 | JademusSreg | Zooop. |
| 13:04.55 | JademusSreg | Hi thar Dustin. |
| 13:05.02 | JademusSreg | Hallo Zol. |
| 13:05.04 | Dustin | ello o/ |
| 13:06.48 | Zolden | hey Ja |
| 13:07.30 | JademusSreg | No time for Terraria (aka Meh-it's-not-Starbound) today; youngest girl has an insufferable headcold. |
| 13:07.46 | Goa | Zolden thats why I said real cash |
| 13:08.04 | Kueken | Good Zooping JademusZoop |
| 13:08.11 | Zolden | real cash is air too btw |
| 13:08.21 | Kueken | nah, its paper |
| 13:08.34 | Goa | yeah its a worthless paper |
| 13:08.36 | JademusSreg | Zol, your remarks on money reminds me of my errant thoughts I pasted earlier. |
| 13:09.26 | Goa | you know Zolden, its all part of a huge conspiracy.D |
| 13:10.11 | Zolden | JademusSreg yea, it's errant, i'm not a specialist |
| 13:10.41 | Zolden | Goa no, money were invented to be information, to not have price, but to imitate it |
| 13:10.43 | Zolden | for trading |
| 13:11.03 | Bommes | it's actually not really a conspiracy when it's tur |
| 13:11.04 | Bommes | true |
| 13:11.43 | Bommes | the whole banking & finance system is pretty flawed from the ground up and just doesn't work on a scale like it operates on today |
| 13:12.23 | Zolden | the fact that gold had its own price and was used as money is because it was useful for our ancestors, they had problems believing that something useless can imitate price of useful things |
| 13:13.05 | JademusSreg | Probably less than intelligible, since I don't provide much context, but whatever. https://pastee.org/fbqrm |
| 13:13.39 | Bommes | to be fair, you didn't provide much context when you posted it for the first time hours ago either ;) |
| 13:13.47 | Bommes | I enjoyed reading it though |
| 13:13.49 | Zolden | JademusSreg is ther word wrap? |
| 13:14.08 | JademusSreg | Correct. I should check my logs and compile previous discussions. |
| 13:14.09 | Bommes | apart from feeling like http://i.imgur.com/9x75g7O.png |
| 13:14.19 | JademusSreg | Not on pastee, sadly. |
| 13:14.27 | JademusSreg | Copypaste to notepad, I guess. |
| 13:14.51 | Kueken | maybe we should ask Stewox about it |
| 13:14.51 | Dustin | [08:08] <JademusSreg> No time for Terraria (aka Meh-it's-not-Starbound) today; youngest girl has an insufferable headcold. <-- ya I gotta go into the office today anyway |
| 13:16.24 | Dustin | Also, you used a semi colon, that's awesome. |
| 13:17.03 | JademusSreg | Haha. |
| 13:17.21 | twdoei | why the fuck EU map night timer still broken? :/ |
| 13:17.22 | Kueken | pretty low threshold for being awesome nowadays |
| 13:17.41 | Kueken | ;;; |
| 13:17.43 | Dustin | Hey |
| 13:17.49 | Bommes | see, now Kueken is crying |
| 13:17.49 | Kueken | now I am 3 times as awesome |
| 13:17.51 | Dustin | Semi colons show you went to college. |
| 13:17.52 | Bommes | well done Dustin.. |
| 13:18.02 | Dustin | Bes respect! |
| 13:18.08 | Kueken | ;) |
| 13:18.11 | Dustin | s/Bes/Best |
| 13:18.19 | Kueken | does that count as use of a semicolon? |
| 13:18.50 | Dustin | No |
| 13:18.51 | Dustin | :P |
| 13:19.22 | Bommes | Wow, ":P" is not even a word. Did you even college? |
| 13:19.54 | Kueken | Y U NO COLLETSCH |
| 13:20.11 | Bommes | *kolletsch |
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| 13:22.15 | Zolden | what's colletsch? |
| 13:22.30 | Zolden | oh, nvm |
| 13:22.32 | JademusSreg | When To Colon: Enumeration, Subject Elaboration, Rhetorical Response |
| 13:22.37 | Zolden | i shouldn't even alttab here |
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| 13:32.40 | duckies | aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaargh |
| 13:32.53 | duckies | damn, those frogs models are awesome |
| 13:32.59 | JademusSreg | Oh yes, Zol, remembered what I wanted to ask. Do you enjoy modeling with particles? |
| 13:33.07 | duckies | I can't belive I just found that thread =D |
| 13:33.29 | Zolden | JademusSreg I do |
| 13:33.34 | JademusSreg | I have a request which you may enjoy. |
| 13:33.49 | Zolden | go on |
| 13:33.56 | JademusSreg | Are you familiar with the WarpInDeath.m3 model? |
| 13:34.28 | Zolden | i can check |
| 13:37.07 | Zolden | JademusSreg ok, checked |
| 13:37.43 | JademusSreg | Anyway, the part that interests me is the little cubic, voxel-imitating sprite particles. |
| 13:38.03 | Zolden | what about them? |
| 13:38.08 | Zolden | liked them jumping? |
| 13:39.41 | Kueken | Spontaneously, I want to try to texture swap that thing and see what happens :D |
| 13:40.19 | Zolden | swap it with biodomebubble_diffuse.dds |
| 13:40.27 | JademusSreg | I'd like a model with spawns physically-responsive particles like those, ideally which react to force actors. In other words, when a Photon Cycle is destroyed, it should be replaced with a flurry of little cubes spilling in the direction of its velocity. =D |
| 13:40.30 | Kueken | I assume the shape of the particles is dependant on the used texture |
| 13:41.44 | JademusSreg | So, yeah, a model which randomly spawns a volume of such particles within the relative dimensions of 2.5m*0.6m*0.7m |
| 13:41.46 | Zolden | Kueken yea |
| 13:42.30 | Zolden | JademusSreg ok |
| 13:42.51 | JademusSreg | Should be stimulating. =D |
| 13:43.50 | Zolden | do you wnat them to spread in relative x direction? or in any directions? or just fall? |
| 13:44.57 | Zolden | I think it's even possible to make the cubes roll after touching the ground |
| 13:46.23 | Zolden | also, guess it's 0.6m*2.5m*0.7m, becasue forward is y |
| 13:47.17 | JademusSreg | Neato, but getting them to respond to physics forces is most significant. A cycle could be drifting a sudden turn and smash into something, and the voxel-stuff going forward wouldn't make sense. =D |
| 13:48.06 | Bommes | Can you make particles that have a physics body? |
| 13:48.16 | Bommes | I'd have a lot of cool ideas for that |
| 13:48.24 | Kueken | Zolden: its making soap bubbles now |
| 13:48.32 | JademusSreg | They'd only need to be simple physics hard bodies, I expect. Many sparks and such already respond to shit like terrain. |
| 13:48.50 | Zolden | Kueken well, we don't have soap penis texture unfortunately |
| 13:48.59 | duckies | and you could also drive over just-crashed-bike to push them in diff directions :D can it be done too? |
| 13:49.12 | Kueken | thats fine |
| 13:49.21 | duckies | I might just play again for the sole reason of desecrating graves =D |
| 13:49.32 | Kueken | I don't know if I am ready to see a penis explode into soap bubbles |
| 13:49.33 | Zolden | Bommes particles can react to physics, forces, ground |
| 13:51.12 | Zolden | JademusSreg do you plan to have the unit keep moving at the moment od model swap? If so, I'll make it inherit velocity |
| 13:51.36 | JademusSreg | Yes, that would be very desirable. |
| 13:57.46 | EntityEnigma | if the materials for a model say Emissive = MarauderMercenary_Specular.dds i need to make the declaration with the _Emissive substring, keep the texture ID MarauderMercenary_Specular, and make sure the slots are set to main emissive? |
| 13:59.51 | JademusSreg | Oh, that reminds me of another, less interesting request. Basically making team-colored versions of the hex, quad, and tri plane models you made for me, as that may be useful. Not a high priority for me, though. |
| 13:59.53 | Zolden | that texture has emissive channel, that is used in that model's material. I'm not sure that the emissive texture you plan to swiitch it with will have the same emissive channel |
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| 14:07.46 | Zolden | JademusSreg how many particles do you think you would need to be created in the first frame? should it be "death" animation? |
| 14:09.15 | Zolden | JademusSreg also, does force actor have "channels"? I gave it, for example, channel 1. Is it fine? |
| 14:10.18 | Zolden | also, I made terrain collision friction 30%, so the particle looses 30% of speed on each bounce |
| 14:10.27 | Zolden | alsok, what should be particle lifetime? |
| 14:10.28 | JademusSreg | Death animation will suffice unless I think of a novel alternative. Spawn enough to look awesome, but not so much as to make your client framerate to shit the bed. |
| 14:10.33 | JademusSreg | I |
| 14:10.54 | JademusSreg | I'm not certain if force actors have channels, feel free to use whatever for the time being. |
| 14:12.25 | JademusSreg | Lifetime should be 2800ms; good starting place. |
| 14:12.54 | *** join/#sc2mapster NickG365 (~Nick@cpe-71-74-246-43.neo.res.rr.com) |
| 14:13.17 | JademusSreg | If a range is available, 2600-3000ms is good. |
| 14:14.52 | *** join/#sc2mapster Kueken1 (~Kueken@brsg-4dbbfd30.pool.mediaWays.net) |
| 14:15.59 | Kueken | EntityEnigma: the declarations always use the file name, the type is more or less irrelevant |
| 14:16.35 | EntityEnigma | ah ok ty |
| 14:16.37 | Kueken | if the texture is called _Specular, you swap it with _Specular, even if the type is Emissive and you use a Diffuse slot |
| 14:16.55 | EntityEnigma | why a diffuse? |
| 14:17.03 | Kueken | just because you can :D |
| 14:17.18 | Kueken | the slot is arbitrary, you can use whatever slot you want |
| 14:17.23 | EntityEnigma | what if you are already using a diffuse? |
| 14:17.34 | EntityEnigma | can you have 2? |
| 14:17.35 | Kueken | it might make sense to follow conventions, but its not required |
| 14:17.45 | Kueken | what do you mean? slots? |
| 14:17.54 | EntityEnigma | yeah |
| 14:18.03 | Kueken | if main.diffuse is already used, you cannot use main.diffuse again for the same model |
| 14:18.09 | Goa | wow, this game looks awesome: http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/tynansylvester/rimworld?ref=category |
| 14:18.12 | Kueken | but you could use body.diffuse or something |
| 14:18.22 | EntityEnigma | hmm ok |
| 14:20.36 | *** join/#sc2mapster Thels (~gamebot@c11032.upc-c.chello.nl) |
| 14:23.18 | Zolden | JademusSreg http://www.sc2mapster.com/media/attachments/44/256/jade_cubes.gif |
| 14:23.33 | Zolden | i kinda moved it my bouse to imitate byke velosity |
| 14:30.47 | *** join/#sc2mapster Serashin (4ff358a0@gateway/web/freenode/ip.79.243.88.160) |
| 14:32.50 | *** join/#sc2mapster Dustin|Work (~Dustin@64.39.213.168) |
| 14:38.51 | *** join/#sc2mapster Ownage (proprietar@192.161.167.50) |
| 14:39.20 | Ownage | given an actor which checks a validator at create, can I later using triggers cause that check to happen again |
| 14:39.47 | Ownage | or do I need to destroy and recreate the actor, or change the events to check at interval or something |
| 14:40.33 | Ownage | I have protoss buildings, which check at creation time for dark protoss upgrade. however I want to give dark protoss upgrade later in the game, causing the buildings to instantly change to the dark version |
| 14:44.37 | *** join/#sc2mapster turtles1 (~dave3@d27-99-24-48.bla802.nsw.optusnet.com.au) |
| 14:49.01 | Kueken | Ownage: Most dark protoss buildings have events for that |
| 14:49.25 | Kueken | they have one check on creation and an event for upgrade.finished or whatever its called |
| 14:49.25 | Ownage | they check at actor creation |
| 14:49.34 | Ownage | nah |
| 14:49.54 | Ownage | with nexus I did a modelswap message |
| 14:50.06 | Ownage | with cannons they do all these texture swapping, no seperate model |
| 14:50.22 | Ownage | giving the upgrade does nothing, as they are only on create checks |
| 14:51.15 | Kueken | k, maybe I was only checking units |
| 14:51.32 | Kueken | the Zealot definitely has Upgrade.DarkProtoss.Add -> ModelSwap |
| 14:51.39 | Kueken | and some death customization |
| 14:52.30 | Kueken | cannons do the same thing on upgrade.add that they do on creation |
| 14:52.37 | Kueken | just looking at their events |
| 14:53.31 | Kueken | I wonder why they added all the stuff twice |
| 14:53.56 | Ownage | wow hmm |
| 14:54.11 | Kueken | and not just did one check on actor creation and one upgrade event and then used a signal to trigger swaps |
| 14:54.13 | Ownage | now I'm wondering why it doensn't do anything |
| 14:54.26 | Ownage | let me confirm before going deeper in the rabbit hole |
| 14:56.32 | *** join/#sc2mapster duckies (4d26cd7a@gateway/web/freenode/ip.77.38.205.122) |
| 14:56.47 | Kueken | just checked, they change properly when the upgrade is applied |
| 14:57.01 | Kueken | they don't change back though, no support for that |
| 14:57.56 | Ownage | how are you doing it? |
| 14:57.59 | Ownage | doesn't work for me |
| 14:58.14 | Ownage | I did add 1 Dark Protoss to player |
| 14:58.27 | Ownage | buildings look exactly the same |
| 14:58.47 | Ownage | let me confirm double twice |
| 14:59.22 | Kueken | same here |
| 14:59.35 | Kueken | but it works |
| 14:59.59 | Kueken | <PROTECTED> |
| 15:00.35 | Kueken | or TechTreeUpgradeAddLevel(1,"DarkProtoss",1); |
| 15:00.48 | Kueken | if one prefers galaxy |
| 15:01.27 | Ownage | very strange |
| 15:02.19 | Kueken | so, potential error sources |
| 15:02.26 | Kueken | wrong player? |
| 15:02.39 | Kueken | wrong upgrade? (unlikely :p) |
| 15:02.41 | Kueken | dependencies? |
| 15:02.49 | Kueken | is your trigger called correctly? |
| 15:03.18 | Ownage | :/ hmm |
| 15:05.52 | Ownage | definitely not work |
| 15:06.09 | Ownage | trigger runs, gives upgrade to player by static reference |
| 15:06.22 | Ownage | actors still the same |
| 15:06.36 | Kueken | yay |
| 15:06.42 | Kueken | give me the map |
| 15:06.54 | Ownage | ill make a trigger which tells me how many dark protoss upgrades current clicked player has |
| 15:09.45 | JademusSreg | Oh, extracted this from my logs. May provide some context: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1049551/My%20Fiction%20-%20A%20Conceptual%20Mental%20Sandbox.txt |
| 15:10.13 | Zolden | JademusSreg react on the gif pls |
| 15:10.15 | JademusSreg | Zol, that's pretty badass. |
| 15:10.21 | Zolden | ok |
| 15:10.44 | JademusSreg | A little flat, but sexy potential. |
| 15:11.06 | Zolden | because i'm watching from high distance |
| 15:11.11 | JademusSreg | Ah. |
| 15:11.18 | Zolden | size is what you said |
| 15:11.23 | JademusSreg | Cooool. |
| 15:12.01 | Ownage | definitely has the upgrade. gonna preplace some stock buildings to see if they work |
| 15:12.10 | Kueken | alright skimmend over the text in one second, all that sticked was a paragraph called "On Demigods and Cosmic Masturbation" |
| 15:12.18 | Zolden | JademusSreg http://www.sc2mapster.com/media/attachments/44/257/jade_cubes.m3 |
| 15:12.24 | Kueken | but I probably misread that |
| 15:12.49 | JademusSreg | Kueken, maybe, maybe not. |
| 15:12.55 | Zolden | should react on force (it reacts on force, created in max, not sure about forrce actors) |
| 15:13.31 | Kueken | too much text for my attention span |
| 15:13.47 | JademusSreg | Hope so. I'll let you know when I get around to testing. =D |
| 15:13.51 | Zolden | ok |
| 15:14.27 | JademusSreg | [gratitude is occuring here] |
| 15:14.29 | Zolden | also, i'd see how the beam look as a barrier, it will not look as a square, but still need to see it to know what else to modify |
| 15:17.02 | Ownage | the preplaced units do change |
| 15:17.05 | Ownage | interesting |
| 15:17.20 | *** join/#sc2mapster Fate_ (~IceChat77@g231188126.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 15:17.24 | Ownage | the preplaced stock structures, I should say |
| 15:18.25 | Goa | rofl terran vs zerg rts moba: http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/starworksart/universum-war-front-fps-rts-moba-rpg-in-one-space?ref=category |
| 15:22.18 | Kueken | Ownage: what do you mean? If a struture is created on the fly it doesn't work? |
| 15:22.26 | bobbytables567 | "Warhammer by its atmosphere, RTS elements." Ah, yes, all those RTS elements of a turn-based tabletop game... |
| 15:22.28 | Ownage | all of them are preplaced |
| 15:22.34 | Ownage | two of them are stock and two are dupes |
| 15:22.37 | Ownage | the dupes dont work |
| 15:22.45 | Ownage | even though near as I can tell the actor events are right |
| 15:22.50 | Ownage | let me check some stuff |
| 15:23.00 | turtles1 | There was a Warhammer RTS. Maybe he means that |
| 15:23.10 | Kueken | do the duplicates use duplicate models as well? |
| 15:23.20 | Fate_ | thatdoes not look like a moba to mie |
| 15:23.27 | duckies | huh, we still haven't dropped that whole armor-that-protects-everything-but-vital-spots thingy? :/ |
| 15:23.32 | Fate_ | but thats good since i dont like moba |
| 15:23.35 | bobbytables567 | Yeah, but that's not what Warhammer is known for... |
| 15:23.53 | bobbytables567 | There have been Warhammer MMORPGs as well, maybe he means that? |
| 15:23.55 | Fate_ | did i read warhammer? |
| 15:24.12 | bobbytables567 | In that link, yes. |
| 15:24.12 | Fate_ | there is a Warhammer mmo in dev |
| 15:24.17 | bobbytables567 | Another one? |
| 15:24.27 | bobbytables567 | Or a 40k? |
| 15:24.34 | Fate_ | http://www.eternalcrusade.com/ |
| 15:24.50 | bobbytables567 | Ah, a 40k MMO. |
| 15:25.24 | Fate_ | bobby do u like warhammer?^^ |
| 15:26.02 | bobbytables567 | Not really. I enjoyed the miniatures as a kid, but I never really got into the actual game, and I never got into the lore. |
| 15:26.15 | Fate_ | played dawn of war? |
| 15:26.37 | Kueken | bobby, its a trap! |
| 15:26.40 | bobbytables567 | I think I tried it many many years ago. |
| 15:26.41 | Fate_ | XD |
| 15:26.47 | Kueken | he just wants you to play his map |
| 15:27.05 | bobbytables567 | I'll play his map. |
| 15:27.13 | Fate_ | haha kueken^^ |
| 15:27.13 | Goa | Zolden Mother Russia Space opera RPG. |
| 15:27.18 | Goa | http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1964463742/the-mandate?ref=category * |
| 15:29.49 | Fate_ | maping question: how do i allow a tower to shot while he is morphing to an other tower? |
| 15:31.01 | Dustin|Work | Never used morphing, but maybe try to make the morph ability transient? |
| 15:31.29 | Fate_ | what do u use? |
| 15:31.29 | Serashin | The first link of Goa is disguisting how it even gets supported . |
| 15:31.58 | Fate_ | u dont like it serashin? |
| 15:32.24 | Goa | Serashin its a 1 man project |
| 15:32.29 | Fate_ | y not? i think it looks interresting |
| 15:35.49 | Serashin | To much on every point to not like about it , personaly not worth even thinking about combining those game concepts into one . If you want play a game of 1 type genre u can do so . The finished product will be something messy . Out of a professional gamer PoV its about efficiency . U cant do effitient stuff from changing those PoVs . Controlling more units instead of 1 is always better . And if units gain special stuff from FPS |
| 15:36.16 | Serashin | That guy proly combines Vodka / Fireworks / Seaweed |
| 15:36.34 | Goa | yeah, its totally fucked up on the game design side |
| 15:36.53 | Fate_ | it looks meanly like a rts to me |
| 15:36.54 | Zolden | Goa why mother russia? |
| 15:37.28 | Goa | didnt you see those red posters? |
| 15:37.38 | Zolden | where |
| 15:37.39 | Goa | they are aiming for soviet like empire art.D |
| 15:37.49 | Goa | Zolden http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1964463742/the-mandate?ref=category |
| 15:38.15 | Goa | how the fuck did this get 500k: http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1661802484/hyper-light-drifter?ref=category |
| 15:39.02 | JademusSreg | Magic. |
| 15:39.42 | Fisker | Saul |
| 15:39.43 | Zolden | Goa 1. nostalgia 2. it's a realy nice pixel art work |
| 15:40.27 | JademusSreg | Better question: Why does David Cage make games? =\ |
| 15:40.44 | *** join/#sc2mapster Tomura (~Tomura@HSI-KBW-149-172-119-31.hsi13.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de) |
| 15:41.05 | Goa | who is David Cage? |
| 15:41.23 | JademusSreg | Heavy Rain. Heavy on the QTEs. |
| 15:41.29 | Fate_ | i still have a problem with my tower, and what is transient? |
| 15:42.30 | JademusSreg | Orders for transient abilities don't prevent other orders from executing. |
| 15:43.37 | Fate_ | problem is i dont know what it means in german^^ i have german editor |
| 15:43.56 | Serashin | Actually the last one was the best link Goa , the other ones felt like they drag your IQ down. |
| 15:44.45 | JademusSreg | Say your Tauren Chieftan current order is Move (To Mound of Shit). If it's Shockwave ability is transient, it will execute the ability and continue to follow the move order. If not, Shockwave interrupts the move order. |
| 15:44.53 | Dustin|Work | vorübergehend |
| 15:45.06 | Dustin|Work | vergänglich |
| 15:45.12 | JademusSreg | *Chieftain |
| 15:45.26 | Dustin|Work | should be translations of transient |
| 15:45.27 | Goa | Serashin I like the space rts one, I always wondered why arent there more redish mother russia arted games. |
| 15:45.47 | Bommes | vorübergehend |
| 15:45.49 | Bommes | and vergänglich |
| 15:45.52 | Bommes | is what you want to say! |
| 15:45.55 | Fate_ | i googlet that myself^^ problem is that the editor translations are sometimes somewhat strange |
| 15:46.07 | Fate_ | i need to know the flag |
| 15:46.26 | Serashin | ra 3 was enough for me , dont need to dirten other games with something that doesnt belong somewhere . Who loves the art fine . i dont |
| 15:46.28 | Dustin|Work | If I had my editor open I'd just give you the array number of the field |
| 15:47.27 | Fate_ | found it |
| 15:47.48 | Fate_ | its in english with raw data |
| 15:48.53 | JademusSreg | observed someone's feelings informing its position, rather than arriving at its position from a well-reasoned principle. Position excluded from consideration. Beepboop |
| 15:48.56 | Fate_ | O.o |
| 15:49.03 | Fate_ | its sofort in german O.o |
| 15:49.19 | bobbytables567 | What does it mean? |
| 15:49.27 | Fate_ | instandly |
| 15:49.57 | Serashin | instanD nooTles |
| 15:50.12 | Fate_ | hm but that doent work |
| 15:51.26 | JademusSreg | "instanD nooTles: FastrD thaNyour aveRge nooTles" |
| 15:51.43 | Fate_ | ah every td ues that it must be easy to make -.- |
| 15:51.57 | Serashin | Tech trees are fucking my mind in editor . It says its opening something "in that button window" but when i click on the button itself or want to change what i can build nothing can be found. |
| 15:53.14 | JademusSreg | Sounds like what one would configure from the Build abilities. |
| 15:54.07 | *** join/#sc2mapster Eimtr (3ef56778@gateway/web/freenode/ip.62.245.103.120) |
| 15:54.20 | Eimtr | hi dudes and dudettes |
| 15:54.40 | Eimtr | can any1 tell me how to fix some triggz |
| 15:54.41 | JademusSreg | Cowabunga. |
| 15:54.52 | Serashin | I cant find even the list there |
| 15:55.18 | Serashin | in the button section it just says it makes simple , or advanced buildings but nowhere i can click on it or read next to it the list of units |
| 15:55.25 | Serashin | hence mindfucking |
| 15:55.42 | Fate_ | what do u want to do serashin? |
| 15:56.01 | JademusSreg | Eim, did you shake it vigorously? Curse, kick, and scream at it? Power cycle? Update your OS and power cycle again? Forget to plug in your fire wall? And the fire moat? |
| 15:56.24 | Serashin | Just want to for every race use as basic principle of Terran way of building . Then add in the buildings i want to use for it . |
| 15:57.03 | Serashin | Wich is why i started of with SCV copy and searching for that list of buildings . |
| 15:57.05 | Fate_ | so u need a build ability |
| 15:57.16 | Eimtr | Jademus, no but btw did you remember one map i sent u, the broodlords didnt wanbna attack |
| 15:57.35 | Serashin | Well i can use it from SCV its just i can nowhere decide which buildings i want in that particular list |
| 15:57.38 | JademusSreg | I remember. =D |
| 15:57.50 | JademusSreg | Is that still an issue? |
| 15:58.05 | Eimtr | yes, if i place escorts they attack but they are liek separate units |
| 15:58.15 | JademusSreg | Well, yeah. |
| 15:58.20 | Eimtr | and if i placed my own broodlord withotu excorts it can attack |
| 15:58.35 | Fate_ | well is u use the nomal scv build ability you can only build the nomal terrain buildings |
| 15:58.42 | JademusSreg | Guess I should look at the map. Need to send me a new copy or will the old one suffice? |
| 15:59.14 | Fate_ | u need to modifiy the build ability to be able to build other buildings |
| 15:59.27 | Eimtr | the old one should be fine, ive done no changes there, there was also some issues with death sounds but never mind the sounds, i would get into too unimportant things |
| 16:00.55 | JademusSreg | What was the name of the map, or when did ya send it? |
| 16:01.14 | Serashin | Now i just found in detailview all buildings listed ., but it doesnt explain how all those buildings get seperated into the 2 buttons |
| 16:01.45 | Fate_ | u mean normal build and acvanced build for terran? |
| 16:01.48 | Eimtr | i just disable the sound channel for few sec then enable em, most death sounds are muted but sometimes it's heard but it's overall fine |
| 16:01.54 | JademusSreg | I've got roughly 2-and-a-quarter bazillion maps, need some help remembering which map you sent. |
| 16:02.19 | Serashin | The abbility is Terran building , and it has listed within all 16 buildings |
| 16:02.55 | Fate_ | well take a look at the unit and the sub command cards |
| 16:03.11 | Fate_ | command card 1, 2, 3 |
| 16:03.26 | Eimtr | let me see where i posted it lol |
| 16:03.29 | Serashin | So much connected stuff for 1 simple thing . |
| 16:04.00 | Fate_ | normal build should linkt to command cart 2, advanced card 3 |
| 16:05.36 | Kueken | pfff.. Jade you cannot trick us with pretending you wouldn't know the exact amount of maps you have |
| 16:06.34 | Fate_ | i am still looking for a way to make my tower shot while updating |
| 16:07.00 | JademusSreg | I could get a precise count, but then I wouldn't get to enjoy personally detailing a classic gross exaggeration of quantity. |
| 16:07.45 | Serashin | Well Goa made a Tower defence ^^ , but his towers update instantly o.O |
| 16:07.59 | Fate_ | that cheater^^ |
| 16:08.59 | Goa | what? |
| 16:09.24 | JademusSreg | Anything interesting about the aforementioned tower defense? |
| 16:09.35 | Goa | about my td? |
| 16:09.39 | Fate_ | u know a way to solve my question goa? |
| 16:09.53 | Goa | dont know your question |
| 16:10.29 | Fate_ | i want to update a tower, it shall still shot while updating |
| 16:10.35 | Goa | is it about morphs |
| 16:10.43 | Goa | ahh:D |
| 16:10.53 | Eimtr | so my actual issue with triggs, I use Elpased Time Events and at many different times I have to check if a specific unit is under construction and the number of (unit type) units on the map |
| 16:11.21 | Goa | I just use triggers to replace towers, morph abilities are too complicated |
| 16:11.35 | Fate_ | XDDDDDDD |
| 16:11.36 | Kueken | Fate_: does morph have a transient flag? |
| 16:11.47 | Dustin|Work | That's what I tried to get him to do |
| 16:11.53 | Dustin|Work | Check that out |
| 16:12.10 | Fate_ | FeldUpgardetoMissleTower (Upgarde to Missle Tower) |
| 16:12.10 | Fate_ | (Einfach) Stats: e_abilMorphFlagTransient1 |
| 16:12.27 | Fate_ | means sofort = instandly |
| 16:12.37 | Fate_ | doesnt work |
| 16:12.45 | JademusSreg | Tragic. |
| 16:12.45 | Eimtr | so to post my triggs.. what was the GUI bin online some site with DE domain |
| 16:12.51 | Kueken | otherwise just don't use morph for the duration, just ability with cast time into instant morph |
| 16:12.59 | Goa | Fate you could do it with triggers, set unit opacity to 0 and change the unit to someone without footprint then play upgrade animation or unit over it and when thats finished just remove the 0 opacity unit |
| 16:12.59 | Goa | :D |
| 16:12.59 | Kueken | or behavior or w7e |
| 16:13.04 | Fate_ | hmm |
| 16:13.30 | Fate_ | sound good to me but then i can chancle it |
| 16:13.33 | Fate_ | *cant |
| 16:13.44 | Fate_ | w7e? |
| 16:13.52 | Serashin | w/e |
| 16:14.23 | JademusSreg | Dear void, that is horrifying, Goa. |
| 16:14.36 | Fate_ | Goa i dont want to use tirggers here |
| 16:14.44 | Goa | still better than morphs:D |
| 16:15.00 | Fate_ | i dont trust in tirggers that much |
| 16:15.12 | Serashin | maybe u can do something |
| 16:15.15 | Dustin|Work | You fail then :P |
| 16:15.15 | Serashin | in the weapon list |
| 16:15.20 | Goa | I dont trust data at all |
| 16:15.20 | Serashin | of your data |
| 16:15.41 | Goa | just make dummy unit while it morphing and add the weapon to it |
| 16:15.44 | Dustin|Work | Data is a lot more fragile and untrustworty thant triggs |
| 16:15.50 | Dustin|Work | and harder to debug problems |
| 16:15.53 | Kueken | Fate_: Pretty sure you can make it cancelable |
| 16:16.13 | Fate_ | or maybee i can use a train ablity and a dummy unit |
| 16:16.17 | Fate_ | ah yes? |
| 16:16.20 | Dustin|Work | Eimtr, |
| 16:16.26 | Dustin|Work | Hold on Ill get the link |
| 16:16.45 | Dustin|Work | http://peeeq.de/gui.php?game=sc2 |
| 16:18.42 | Eimtr | there is one site to post your triggers GUI, do you rememebr it? |
| 16:18.50 | Eimtr | ah saw it thx |
| 16:19.13 | Dustin|Work | That is GUI triggers :P |
| 16:19.21 | Dustin|Work | np |
| 16:22.49 | Eimtr | http://peeeq.de/gui.php?id=3229 so basically the actions wont work like that, they would work if I had a 'Pick each unit in Refinery then If (Picked) unit is under construction - yes but throughut my Elpased Time Event triggers I will have a lot of unit types and more than one to check, what is the best way to do it? |
| 16:26.51 | Eimtr | http://peeeq.de/gui.php?id=3230 here is actually the difference, the one below would work |
| 16:31.11 | Kueken | ((Random Living unit from (Refinery units in (Entire map) owned by player 1 matching Excluded: Missile, Dead, Hidden, with at most Any Amount)) is under construction) == True |
| 16:31.32 | Kueken | that might not do exactly what you want it to |
| 16:31.55 | Kueken | also why are you nesting multiple ifs, if you can just put all the conditions in one? |
| 16:35.21 | Kueken | ah, I am late to the party |
| 16:35.25 | Kueken | nvm then |
| 16:38.16 | Zolden | http://ic.pics.livejournal.com/snova_17/42505524/456969/456969_original.gif |
| 16:47.25 | Eimtr | Kueken, because |
| 16:47.48 | Eimtr | if the supply isnt reached, the whole thing should not happen but if it is reached then another two cases follow |
| 16:48.38 | Eimtr | anyway this is not the prob, thats my question, how to get a number of units at a certain time if === X amount or if it is under construction |
| 16:48.51 | Eimtr | and how to detect if a unit is being trained |
| 16:48.54 | Kueken | that condition will pick 1 random unit on the map matching the filter and check, if that one random unit and only that unit is under construction |
| 16:49.12 | Eimtr | yeah but when there is only 1 unit on the map it should detect it |
| 16:49.20 | Eimtr | and yet the actions wont run with that |
| 16:49.37 | Dustin|Work | Have you tried setting that value to a variable and exporting the name of the unit? |
| 16:50.10 | Eimtr | what do you mean name of the unit and exporting> |
| 16:50.39 | JademusSreg | What is this even? |
| 16:50.50 | Dustin|Work | Set a variable to the random unit and then try to display that units name |
| 16:50.57 | Dustin|Work | To make sure it's getting the unit you want |
| 16:51.08 | Kueken | I can think of a few words you would describe it with, Jade |
| 16:51.10 | Kueken | :) |
| 16:51.15 | Dustin|Work | JademusSreg, we're teaching Eimtr how to debug |
| 16:51.20 | JademusSreg | Haha. |
| 16:51.45 | JademusSreg | Preferences > Test Document > enable debugger |
| 16:51.47 | Kueken | does the Jade |
| 16:51.55 | Kueken | What is the design? |
| 16:51.59 | JademusSreg | ^ |
| 16:52.07 | Eimtr | ive been there but on that debug window i dont see anywhere errors to be shown |
| 16:52.43 | JademusSreg | That means the code is owrking correctly; it's a failure of the program logic. |
| 16:52.47 | JademusSreg | *working |
| 16:53.13 | Dustin|Work | You need to start adding a lot of feedback messages to your logic Eimtr |
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| 16:53.24 | JademusSreg | So what is the purpose of such a trigger? |
| 16:53.27 | Dustin|Work | So you knwo where the loop gets to and what variables are set, and what they are set to |
| 16:54.26 | Eimtr | Jademus, I use Elapsed Time events but even in the current case with 'Supply Made changed' event I want when at e.g 14 supply made to detect of a unit is under construction or not |
| 16:54.46 | Kueken | Dustin|Work: There is a loop? |
| 16:54.51 | Kueken | must have missed it |
| 16:54.58 | JademusSreg | =\ |
| 16:55.12 | Dustin|Work | I didn't mean loop |
| 16:55.32 | Dustin|Work | replace loop with If then statements |
| 16:56.00 | Kueken | now I present: A comment by Jade on the topic: "What is a design and how to describe it" |
| 16:56.12 | Eimtr | or basically I have the conditions - Supply made changes, if Supply made <=14, and Random Refinery unit from units in entire map is Under construction (or NHumber of Refinery units in entire map =1). then do actions - actions dont wanna work in such case |
| 16:56.23 | Kueken | (I hope you are typing, Jade) |
| 16:56.26 | JademusSreg | I didn't ask what the trigger is doing or how it does whatever, I ask about its purpose. Why does it exist? To what problem is it a solution? What gameplay mechanic does it concern? |
| 16:56.31 | Kueken | yes! |
| 16:56.58 | JademusSreg | Yep, Kueken could probably draw a flowchart of my responses to such things. |
| 16:57.20 | Kueken | my timing was a little off, though |
| 16:57.36 | Eimtr | it's a system that trains specific build orders and checks whether a certain building is started (under construction) after definite Elpased Time event |
| 16:57.57 | JademusSreg | Er, why wouldn't you use an AI script for that? |
| 16:58.10 | Eimtr | and if later than that it is not started - Boom! |
| 16:58.46 | Eimtr | I havent done AI and how would AI help me? It;'s not for computers to build it but for the player to train it |
| 16:58.58 | Eimtr | computers dont need to do it, onlty the one player who uses itr |
| 16:59.25 | JademusSreg | Er, so it's a mechanic that obliterates the player for not following a prescribed build order? Or is this intended for the opponent? |
| 16:59.58 | Eimtr | exactly Jademus, the player needs to follow a biold order |
| 17:00.50 | Eimtr | by boom i mean getting negative poiints and in the end basic a victory on that, it does not mean BOOM : ) |
| 17:01.59 | Eimtr | the prob is that too many times I will have to check if a certain building is under construction after X Elapsed time, sometimes more than 1 type should be checked |
| 17:02.56 | JademusSreg | You're using elapsed time rather than a periodic event? |
| 17:03.14 | JademusSreg | Or a timer event? |
| 17:03.23 | Eimtr | Elapsed time |
| 17:03.38 | Eimtr | and then Wait triggers for any minutes close to that time |
| 17:03.45 | Eimtr | that happen after it reaches the elapsed time |
| 17:04.09 | Kueken | could also use the reversed approach, use start construction events and save constructed building with current time, then compare with given build order |
| 17:04.09 | JademusSreg | And you're asking for help on a specific bug? |
| 17:04.48 | Eimtr | well, it's generally wrong cause without pick each unit it wont work |
| 17:05.02 | Eimtr | okay i guess i will pick each unit and then check |
| 17:05.28 | Eimtr | i have 2 more general questions, these are not specific to error in my code |
| 17:06.26 | Eimtr | <PROTECTED> |
| 17:07.28 | Eimtr | and the other question - how do I detect if a unit type is being trained - Number of Reaper units in entire map to detect a unit trained in a Rax is not the way obviously |
| 17:07.57 | JademusSreg | Requirements can detect such things, yeah, since otherwise they wouldn't be able to block the option. =D |
| 17:09.15 | Eimtr | well, since my method that seems hard to explain works with Pick each unit, i will use it that way but what about the above 2 ways to detect an Upgrade that is started (aka in progress) and to detect a unit under training |
| 17:09.22 | Eimtr | are these the conditions?: |
| 17:09.47 | JademusSreg | On unit train event, check the unit queues. |
| 17:10.08 | Eimtr | it all is with Elapsed time event :/ that's where i have to check if a unit is trained |
| 17:10.24 | JademusSreg | string UnitQueueItemGet (unit inUnit, int inItem, int inSlot); |
| 17:16.09 | Eimtr | i will just pick each unit action above every check for number of units or if under construction and that should work |
| 17:16.17 | Eimtr | and what you say translkated in GUI? |
| 17:16.20 | Eimtr | translated |
| 17:16.40 | JademusSreg | Dunno, but I would expect the GUI name to be similar. |
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| 17:24.11 | Fate_ | i finaly did it :) |
| 17:24.20 | Fate_ | stupid tower update |
| 17:24.38 | JademusSreg | A tower that makes enemies stupid? Neato. |
| 17:25.23 | twdoei | how that stupid really changes the behavior of the target? |
| 17:25.32 | twdoei | or even the tower itself? |
| 17:25.55 | twdoei | starts killing its own friendly units? |
| 17:26.20 | Dustin|Work | It starts earning less money cause it can't get a good job anymore |
| 17:26.21 | JademusSreg | Maybe the tower is stupid? Like it just spins the turret wildly, screaming shrilly "Wooooo wooooo wooooo woooo" |
| 17:26.50 | JademusSreg | Firing off rounds at random. |
| 17:27.01 | JademusSreg | That would be amusing/ |
| 17:27.06 | twdoei | i hope disco ball appears too |
| 17:27.10 | Dustin|Work | I would enjoy it |
| 17:29.57 | twdoei | Need word for map name: "Horde : *word* siege " something something dark side |
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| 17:30.36 | JademusSreg | Dark Horde Siege Beach Side Resort |
| 17:31.29 | twdoei | Light Horde: Beach Siege |
| 17:32.34 | JademusSreg | Siege Horde: Invasion's Torment |
| 17:33.25 | ArcanePariah | JademusSreg: I know directly you can not add abilites to units, but can catalog functions be used to do it anyhow, or does it block manipulation of that field? |
| 17:34.08 | JademusSreg | Dark Invasion: Cursed Knoll Siege |
| 17:34.09 | twdoei | Horde Siege : Torment |
| 17:34.46 | JademusSreg | Arc, ya know, I'm not entirely certain. It's been a long time since I saw it last tested. |
| 17:35.45 | twdoei | Horde Siege: Plague Rises |
| 17:36.11 | JademusSreg | I suppose one could test changing the field or changing the reference. If those don't work as desired, one may simply change the ability's effect. |
| 17:36.25 | JademusSreg | I confirmed that works just fine. |
| 17:37.33 | JademusSreg | Twod, my suggestions are perfect. =D |
| 17:38.06 | JademusSreg | Who wouldn't want to play in some SiegeHordeInvasionT |
| 17:38.14 | JademusSreg | *Invasion'sTorment? |
| 17:38.54 | JademusSreg | Who could turn down an opportunity to get together and hop on some DarkInvasionCursedKnollSiege? |
| 17:39.13 | twdoei | idk |
| 17:39.20 | twdoei | maybe vaginas |
| 17:39.52 | JademusSreg | Phew, was worried the gag wasn't obvious enough. |
| 17:40.55 | twdoei | it wasnt |
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| 17:50.27 | Ownage | what's the setting which can make tassadar unit walk on ground level? |
| 17:51.53 | Kueken | UI - Height |
| 17:53.41 | Ownage | where is that? |
| 17:53.44 | twdoei | unit |
| 17:53.50 | ArcanePariah | On the unit |
| 17:54.22 | Ownage | I don't find anything called height in unit, actor or model |
| 17:54.40 | ArcanePariah | Also, to be more correct/through/pendantic, the actor of Tassadar has events that check for his height, and based on that, sets a status flag, and based on that status, determines how he moves (floating movement or walking animation) |
| 17:54.52 | ArcanePariah | Ownage, are you in table mode? |
| 17:55.10 | ArcanePariah | Table View* |
| 17:55.36 | Ownage | ah |
| 17:55.46 | Ownage | turns out height is spelled height and not hieght |
| 17:55.58 | Kueken | what a shocker! |
| 17:56.07 | Kueken | Blizzard and their misspellings |
| 17:56.29 | ArcanePariah | Also, if you want tassadar to truly move on the ground, you will need to alter his mover, his starting mover is fly, and has flying collision |
| 17:56.45 | ArcanePariah | so you would need to change his mover and collision flags |
| 17:56.56 | ArcanePariah | might look awkward as he walks up cliffs :P |
| 17:57.11 | Ownage | actually they do suck at spells |
| 17:57.18 | Ownage | spelling* |
| 17:57.27 | twdoei | :D |
| 17:57.30 | Ownage | freindly -> official spelling according to blizz |
| 17:57.33 | Kueken | yeah the infamus GuassRifleDamage |
| 17:57.45 | Kueken | *imfamous |
| 17:58.01 | ArcanePariah | lol |
| 17:58.02 | Kueken | *doing that totally on purpose |
| 17:58.02 | twdoei | wtf so much miss spelling |
| 17:58.05 | Kueken | >.< |
| 17:58.15 | Ownage | "Thermal Lances Freindly CP" |
| 17:58.25 | Ownage | gj with the spell check :) |
| 17:59.07 | twdoei | Horde Enemy Migration |
| 17:59.14 | ArcanePariah | Ikr, and the effect immediately after it is spelled correctly |
| 17:59.49 | ArcanePariah | O and get this, the actual identifier has it spelled correctly, lawl |
| 18:02.14 | ArcanePariah | JademusSreg: Another random question, how does the marker in all the effects work? I get the impression it is used for manipulating how effect trees are applied, since markers are used to prevent mutalisk weapons from bouncing back to a target (say with 2 units), or from the Hellion weapon from applying the damage effect multiple times to a single unit in the flame, even if overlapping aoes hit it |
| 18:03.10 | Kueken | sounds about right |
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| 18:04.14 | ArcanePariah | Now they use a dedicated validator for it, but what does the actual flags do (Match, Mismatch, etc.) |
| 18:05.05 | Kueken | I experimented with these a LOT, and I can say with confidence: |
| 18:05.11 | Kueken | I have not the slightest idea |
| 18:07.31 | ArcanePariah | Wait..... I think the flags are used to controls how manymarkers are applied by multiple instances of the effect tree. For instance, if the Match flags has Casting Unit set, then the marker will be applied for each unit that applies the effect |
| 18:08.33 | Kueken | yep, that sounded logical to me as well |
| 18:09.13 | ArcanePariah | And... Match might be that the marker can only be applied by same effect tree from the same unit maybe? So for example, if a unit does a damage effect 3 times, with match flag casting unit set, it will apply 3 markers, but if 3 copies of the unit hit with the same effect only once each, they will only apply 1 marker between them all |
| 18:09.20 | Kueken | unfortunately, when I tried it, it didn't seem to work all that well |
| 18:09.54 | ArcanePariah | Well, I think it is meant to be used in conjunction with the marker count validator |
| 18:10.00 | Kueken | feel free to try again, though, my experiments were something like 2 or 3 years ago, a lot of things could have changed since then |
| 18:10.13 | ArcanePariah | As a simple way to evaluate the number of times a unit is under a given effect |
| 18:10.43 | ArcanePariah | So in the mutalisk case, it can be used to see what units have already been hit by the current mutalisk attack, and ignore them for future bounces |
| 18:10.53 | Kueken | yeah, I can use it to limit units being hit by a spell multiple times easily |
| 18:11.07 | Kueken | interesting thing about the mutalisk attack: |
| 18:11.15 | Kueken | it only works if you use it as a weapon |
| 18:11.27 | Kueken | if you use the exact same effect chain on an ability |
| 18:11.38 | Kueken | and use the same markers for the ability the weapon uses |
| 18:11.42 | Kueken | it won't work |
| 18:12.03 | Kueken | and I have not the slightest idea why not |
| 18:15.32 | ArcanePariah | Interestingly, in HotS mutalisk, they do not use markers, they simply exclude Outer and Target from the searches for each bonce, I guess outer refers to anything Target in the effect chain that was not caster or source? |
| 18:15.49 | Dustin|Work | That is interesting |
| 18:16.06 | Bommes | so even Blizzard doesn't use markers anymore? |
| 18:16.15 | Bommes | Maybe they have no clue themselves what to do with them and just ignore them out of shame |
| 18:16.22 | Bommes | similar to how they handle the whole cliff situation |
| 18:16.52 | ArcanePariah | Not uncommon, stuff is added, and ripping it out takes time/effort, and thus is left in (See Microsoft OS for infinite examples) |
| 18:17.15 | ArcanePariah | Not to mention, they wouldn't remove it since some people may still use it (who knows) |
| 18:18.19 | ArcanePariah | But markers are still used, they have an explicit validator for them. Current in HotS they are used 2 places, 1 for hellion damage, so large units still only get hit once, and medivac healing, to stop multiple medivacs from healing 1 unit |
| 18:19.56 | ArcanePariah | I guess for mutalisk, they simply redid it as a more effective and simpler solution. Which makes sense, Blizzard takes a long time to do patches, and HotS development was obviously more mature, with them leveraging more of the data editor (See the entire campaign section, un used in WoL, with hardcoded presets in trigger libraries, in HotS, used heavily, libraraie much more lightweight) |
| 18:20.20 | Bommes | so, I need some ppl who have an opinion |
| 18:21.13 | Bommes | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CVhYNpfyLSU the white bar on top which is linked to the ability (you hold shift+rightclick and the ability basically charges)... the UI is clearly not finished and I would add some things to it, but from a gameplay perspective, is it even necessary? |
| 18:21.26 | Bommes | I made it because I thought it might be cool |
| 18:21.40 | Bommes | but now that it's half-way done I think it's pretty unnecessary and doesn't add anything... |
| 18:23.19 | Bommes | I would add some kind of cooldown indication and markers at which point of the bar the ability "fires" |
| 18:23.28 | Bommes | any opinions? |
| 18:23.50 | Fate_ | ah yout the one with that map |
| 18:25.15 | Eimtr | looks like detecting number of units even under construction at certain time when supply used ==X is reached works... maybe some stupid error in making it >= didn't detect it, o need for Pick each unit Refinery.. NUmber of Refinery unit works alone |
| 18:25.41 | Fate_ | so u have some seconds to mark the target positons right? |
| 18:25.48 | Bommes | yeah exactly |
| 18:25.59 | Bommes | For me it feels kind of unnecessary because I'm so used to the ability |
| 18:26.13 | Bommes | but you also have a little bit of indication on the cursor, so I'm not sure if it would help ppl who are new to the map |
| 18:26.20 | Bommes | I guess its hard to tell by just watching... hmm |
| 18:26.25 | Fate_ | is it a fixed number of attacks? |
| 18:26.33 | Bommes | it is a maximum of 6 |
| 18:26.38 | Bommes | but any number below 6 works as well |
| 18:27.00 | Fate_ | so u have about 5 seconde for 6 shots right? |
| 18:27.39 | Bommes | about 2.5 seconds, but yeah |
| 18:28.11 | Fate_ | why not 6 shots in general? |
| 18:28.41 | Fate_ | why the time? |
| 18:28.54 | Bommes | it's nice to have the option, because it's an attack with a long delay |
| 18:29.14 | Bommes | so you have to see where the enemies are and how they will move, and if you shoot less than 6 it will shoot faster |
| 18:29.53 | Bommes | basically it has a delay of 1.1 seconds and then every shot adds time to how long it takes to "charge up" |
| 18:30.00 | Bommes | up to about 2.5s |
| 18:30.17 | Fate_ | hm i think it interresting but unusal |
| 18:30.25 | Bommes | that's why I thought the bar would be nice to have, because it's not really intuitive how the ability works and I could add indications on the bar when the shots fire |
| 18:30.42 | Bommes | but I'm not really sure it would help |
| 18:30.53 | Fate_ | the bar should be there |
| 18:31.38 | Fate_ | maybee a text "mark 6 targets" or sth like that |
| 18:32.39 | Fate_ | but once u know how the abi works it might bug you |
| 18:32.42 | twdoei | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pHRqdadj6r8 |
| 18:32.54 | Bommes | I mean it automatically fires 6 shots as long as you hold the button |
| 18:33.19 | Bommes | so that doesn't need explanation, I also have a tutorial, I'm confident the players will figure it out how it "kind of" works |
| 18:33.43 | Bommes | but mmh... the bar probably helps so I'll stick with it and finish it |
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| 18:41.50 | Serashin | Yo , can anyone tell me . Why when i add Terran way of building to toss . aka the abbility wich gives me the Command buttons wich i added , dont appear ingame ? I want to make the way Terran builds for every worker . but want to keep their sounds etc |
| 18:41.58 | Serashin | So i simply added the abbility to another worker |
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| 18:44.14 | Eimtr | how do I detect if a barracks is producing a unit? Because if i use (Unit type of (Random Living unit from (Barracks units in (Entire map) owned by player 1 matching Excluded: Missile, Dead, Hidden, with at most Any Amount)) training queue slot 1 item 1) == Reaper and if there is no unit trained at all the ELSE triggers still run :/ |
| 18:44.40 | Eimtr | so i need a condition to make sure that the ELSE will run only if the Barracks is actually producing something |
| 18:45.02 | Eimtr | or better yet, the whole trig will run only if the baracks is producing something |
| 18:45.27 | Serashin | Im a noob mapmaker , but what u say is sounding very weird . logically speaking |
| 18:45.44 | Serashin | The animation of producing something of a barracks is added to the barracks by default |
| 18:46.40 | Eimtr | i have the cases - if a unit is a reaper, then do this, if not a reaper do THAT, but when there is no training in the rax at all, the THAT aka ELSE actions still runb |
| 18:47.57 | Eimtr | i guess my ELSE will be if the training unit is marine or maraud |
| 18:48.01 | Serashin | so u basicly want to add a visual that only runs out of the barracks . if its a reaper |
| 18:48.32 | Eimtr | nope, im not talking about animation and visual at all., just some trig to turn on based on which is the trained unit in the rax at a given moment |
| 18:49.37 | Serashin | That is out of my league ^^ |
| 18:51.25 | Eimtr | ^^ |
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| 19:04.26 | Eimtr | string UnitQueueItemGet (unit inUnit, int inItem, int inSlot); what is the GUI for that? |
| 19:13.39 | ArcanePariah | Eimtr, gimme a sec and I'll look it up |
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| 19:28.45 | twdoei | 0001 |
| 19:31.35 | Eimtr | man.. is there even a way to detect a unit type currently in training progress from a barracks on the map and if a unit is being trained from barracks at the moment? |
| 19:32.31 | Ahli | I stored that info in custom values in gameheart :X |
| 19:32.43 | twdoei | well by ability link you should |
| 19:32.54 | Dustin|Work | Loop through all the barraks, then loop through each one's que |
| 19:33.09 | Ahli | (Unit type of (Triggering unit) training queue slot 1 item 1) |
| 19:39.08 | Eimtr | Ahli isnt this only for an event with training |
| 19:39.16 | Eimtr | cause for other type of event |
| 19:39.18 | Eimtr | ? |
| 19:39.50 | Dustin|Work | No, that's for checking a units training que |
| 19:40.02 | Dustin|Work | You need to make your own event to check the units |
| 19:41.11 | Eimtr | meaning? if there is only 1 barax on the map, if I replace Triggering unit with Random Barracks on Entire map... == and this unit type specified in this barracks, the actions dont work |
| 19:42.11 | Dustin|Work | Man you need to work on your logic behind how you do things |
| 19:42.39 | Eimtr | i think it is fine usually i get what i want even with doing things for the 1st time |
| 19:42.43 | Dustin|Work | You need some sort of system to continually check this kind of stuff and make some functions to grab specific unit types to itterate through |
| 19:42.47 | Eimtr | but my logic tells me this had to work : )0 |
| 19:44.09 | Eimtr | generally said ok, i need such a system but since i cant imagine what the system must look like, how exactly |
| 19:45.06 | Eimtr | custom events didnt work as far as i remember |
| 19:46.46 | Dustin|Work | Have you used functions before |
| 19:47.28 | Dustin|Work | You'll want to make some helper functions to perform the unit checking and itterations for you |
| 19:49.42 | Dustin|Work | So you can do things like if getAllBuildings("Barracks", "Completed") or returnBuildingTrainingMarine(getAllBuildings("Barraks", "Completed")) |
| 19:50.22 | Dustin|Work | That way you only have to call these functions when you need them, and they will control your looping through units and etc and allow you to have better logic in your main game code |
| 19:54.36 | Dustin|Work | So instead of doing Random Unit each time, your functions will grab all of the units in the map and you can run specific checks against each one and then only return at most 1 that matched the requirements |
| 19:58.25 | Eimtr | sounds good, though I do it in GUI, still not sure how the code for this should be like |
| 19:59.06 | Dustin|Work | I use gui too, that was just psuedo code |
| 19:59.51 | twdoei | Stewox taking now the SC2mapster :D |
| 19:59.56 | Dustin|Work | Add all your units in the function to a group, then loop through that group and make your checks, then if they pass, add them to a seperate group and then return either unit 1 from that group or a random unit from that group |
| 20:00.14 | Dustin|Work | that'll be the basic code usage in your function |
| 20:01.25 | ArcanePariah | Dustin, can I assume from everything I've read from you, you do programming as a living? |
| 20:02.00 | Dustin|Work | Correct |
| 20:04.24 | Ownage | how can I select all interceptors owned by a carrier? |
| 20:06.39 | ArcanePariah | Ownage: That is a tricky one, since they are created as part of an Arm Magazine ability |
| 20:43.18 | Eimtr | ok will see what i can do with functions, thx gtg now |
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| 22:22.21 | PusH | does anyone know if morph abilities carry through behaviors? |
| 22:23.43 | Kueken | they should |
| 22:23.53 | PusH | i was hoping they don't |
| 22:23.56 | Kueken | just try it, not too hard to give a siege tank a behavior |
| 22:24.05 | PusH | good idea |
| 22:25.35 | Ahli | AM down? |
| 22:25.45 | Ahli | AM = Americas aka NA |
| 22:27.26 | PusH | perfect; looks like a no |
| 22:32.01 | Ahli | kueken, can you connect to NA? |
| 22:32.06 | DeadZergling | I'm almost positive there is a setting that can be make the behaviors carry over |
| 22:32.13 | DeadZergling | *that can make |
| 22:32.29 | Ahli | oh it wants to update to connect to NA? :X |
| 22:33.45 | Ahli | or verify my files |
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| 22:55.21 | *** join/#sc2mapster Vindicator (~Vindicato@cpe-76-183-15-188.tx.res.rr.com) |
| 23:04.18 | *** join/#sc2mapster Thenarden (~Miranda@HSI-KBW-078-043-227-063.hsi4.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de) |
| 23:06.44 | *** join/#sc2mapster Repo (~repo@76.164.170.2) |
| 23:51.29 | *** join/#sc2mapster Necromoni (bec52995@gateway/web/freenode/ip.190.197.41.149) |
