IRC log for #sc2mapster on 20120716

15:10.24*** join/#sc2mapster purl (~purl@rikers.org)
15:10.24*** topic/#sc2mapster is http://sc2mapster.com | sc2mapster bnet2 channel | Themed Creature Contest: http://bit.ly/l1EbS5 | Patch 1.3.X Undocumented Changes: http://bit.ly/ejywRQ | We want your broken maps! http://bit.ly/aU9AgC | Join #sc2replayed for SC2Replayed
15:10.29Eldrazorit's not necessary anyways, really
15:10.45CheekythingI mean you could just remove it
15:10.50Cheekythingand replace them with custom ones
15:11.12Eldrazorit?
15:11.18Cheekythingthe bar
15:11.43Cheekythingyou could make it so that you see their health when you click them
15:11.57Cheekythingand the game visually shows you
15:12.01Eldrazorthat would be pretty complicated
15:12.09Cheekythingnot really
15:12.25Eldrazorhow would i replace them
15:12.28Eldrazorui editor/triggers?
15:12.46Cheekythingkinda
15:12.55CheekythingI'm not too clued up on how to remove them
15:13.03Cheekythingsomeone showed me
15:13.07CheekythingI think there is a flag for it
15:13.29Cheekythingand then the UI someone used was on the left side of the screen if your hp
15:13.39Cheekythingand when you select a unit it displays theirs
15:14.17Cheekythingon the right side
15:14.49*** join/#sc2mapster Eldrazor_ (5353a42b@gateway/web/freenode/ip.83.83.164.43)
15:15.14Eldrazor_did you say anything after my last message?
15:15.28CheekythingCheekything: kinda
15:15.28Cheekything[4:12pm] Cheekything: I'm not too clued up on how to remove them
15:15.30Cheekything[4:13pm] Cheekything: someone showed me
15:15.31Cheekything[4:13pm] Cheekything: I think there is a flag for it
15:15.33Cheekything[4:13pm] Cheekything: and then the UI someone used was on the left side of the screen if your hp
15:15.33Cheekything[4:13pm] Cheekything: and when you select a unit it displays theirs
15:15.34Cheekything[4:14pm] Cheekything: on the right side
15:16.21Eldrazor_hmm
15:16.24Eldrazor_that wouldn't really work
15:16.50Eldrazor_i'm best off just replacing the actor to one that doesn't have a visible healthbar
15:17.06Eldrazorfor that
15:17.08Eldrazori need actors
15:17.10Cheekythingok
15:17.30Cheekythingerg
15:17.44Cheekythingok anyone know why when you make a unit in a mod
15:17.51Cheekythingit wont move or anything
15:20.54*** join/#sc2mapster Eldrazor_ (5353a42b@gateway/web/freenode/ip.83.83.164.43)
15:20.57Eldrazor_i have such great connection
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15:28.00Cheekythingyay
15:28.08Cheekythingso I have an issue
15:28.14CheekythingI made a new move in a mod
15:28.16Cheekythingmover*
15:28.20Cheekythinga new unit in the mod
15:28.29Cheekythingand when I put that unit on the map it freaks out on me
15:28.35Cheekythingand wont let me move it
15:29.15Cheekythingactually it's deciding to not use the mover I put and it wants to use Core :/
15:29.41Eldrazorodd
15:29.44Eldrazori
15:29.48Eldrazorthis is annoying
15:29.56Eldrazortimers don't use game time
15:30.02Eldrazorwhile everything else i have does use game time
15:30.08Eldrazoractor timers
15:32.24Eldrazorpfoo i'll have to use triggers
15:32.59Cheekythingoh yes
15:33.17Cheekythinggame time thats the biggest lol ever xD
15:35.17Eldrazorit's annoying :(
15:35.21Eldrazorlike
15:35.25Eldrazorthe blend time
15:35.31Eldrazorfrom 100 to 5% alpha of the actor
15:35.34Eldrazori've set it to 5 seconds
15:35.35Eldrazorit uses game time
15:35.40Eldrazorbut when i create an actor
15:35.44Eldrazorit acts weird
15:35.46Eldrazortimer* instead of actor
15:35.51Goahmm how do I implement easily that a unit cant take damage from front. (aka cant take damage coming from +/-90° from the angle its facing?)
15:36.14Eldrazorvalidator
15:36.18Eldrazordamage response
15:37.12Eldrazorvalidator - location arc
15:37.18Eldrazorgive the unit a buff
15:38.08Goaohh I realize more and more that validators make life easy.D
15:38.42Eldrazorand you'll have to find something like "offset by unit angle"
15:38.43Eldrazoras a flag
15:38.44Eldrazorsomewhere
15:41.35Eldrazorharhar
15:41.36Eldrazorsuccess
15:41.38Eldrazor:D
15:45.10Goahmm
15:45.25Goawhere do I set the validator?
15:46.05GoaBehavior: Validators (Disable) +(that will be triggered by damage response?)
15:47.04Eldrazoror not
15:47.07Eldrazorput it in damage response
15:47.16Eldrazorshould be validator field in there
15:48.47Cheekything-.-" dependacies so not update when you ask them to
15:50.03Goaalso location arc dont have compare field? so that means it will only be validated if its equal? (that would be bad and stupid)
15:51.32Goadamage response dont have validator field:D
15:52.48CheekythingOk fun time still getting "Unit cannot handle that command"
15:53.03Cheekythingand "Can't attack while weapons are disabled"
15:54.16Eldrazorhmm
15:54.31Eldrazoryou'd expect the damage response to have validator field :(
15:56.43GoaI think Behavior: Validators (Disable) +  will work with damage response...
15:57.05Eldrazorit might
15:58.31Goastill arc validator works only with 1 arc value or atleast I think so.
16:00.23Goaahh
16:00.40GoaI give up on it:D
16:07.06*** join/#sc2mapster Eldrazor_ (5353a42b@gateway/web/freenode/ip.83.83.164.43)
16:17.07Eldrazor_aww yea it's all working :D
16:19.22Cheekything*headdesk*
16:19.25Cheekythingit makes no sense
16:19.45Cheekythingwhy can't I have a unit in a mod without it refusing to do stuff  like move :/
16:24.34Vail|Goneno clue my mods all work right
16:25.29CheekythingI mean I can copy a unit fine
16:25.42Cheekythingbut I want to have it so the map only uses the mod and core
16:25.54Cheekythingso that I can use the mod on different maps
16:26.17Vailrethwhat dependencies does your mod use?
16:26.38Cheekythingall 4 defaults
16:26.45Vailreththats why
16:27.18Vailrethyou dont need a dependency that uses those AND have core
16:28.22CheekythingI'm confused
16:28.39CheekythingI want to access the models and other things from the game using the mod
16:28.53Cheekythingand Core you can't not have
16:29.07Vailreththink of it as a programtical hierarch... all of the blizzard dependencies are based on core
16:29.35Cheekythingok
16:29.37Vailrethso you can not have core if its in the hierarchy of a compoenet mod
16:30.41Vailrethwhen you have dependancies in a map that are reffecned by it directly and the other mods the map contains it causes conflicts
16:30.52Eldrazorwhat's wrong with using all dependencies?
16:31.31Cheekythingoh fun fun
16:31.36Cheekythingyou can on a map eld
16:31.44Cheekythingbut a mod is different
16:32.31Vailrethits map with a and b and b uses a as well will have conflicts
16:33.49Vailrethas long as b has a in it then a map just needs b to have access to both b and a
16:34.40Vailrethi hope that is understandable
16:45.45Cheekything-.- why is default movement speed 0
17:07.09Eldrazorah
17:07.10Eldrazori get it
17:15.11*** join/#sc2mapster MindWorX (~MindWorX@188.176.196.178)
17:17.01Cheekythingok
17:17.04Cheekythingso fixed all that
17:17.14Cheekythingnow my buildings will place on top of each other
17:20.27Eldrazorwhy do you want that?
17:20.36CheekythingI dont xd
17:20.39CheekythingxD*
17:20.43CheekythingI want it to stop
17:21.01CheekythingI made a footprint so I could build on ramps
17:21.16Cheekythingi'll compare it to the default one
17:32.15Cheekythingok it's not to do with the footprints
17:32.16Cheekythingthats good
17:32.23Cheekythingbad part is I have no clue why xD
17:33.11Vailrethcheck the collision?
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17:34.40Cheekythingdoing that now
17:35.08Cheekythingcool it was that
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19:46.51Bommescan you apply turrets to turrets?
19:47.19Bommesas in both turrets shoot independently but if the host moves the attached turret moves too
19:48.48*** part/#sc2mapster Goa (~hookah604@adsl-125-160.globonet.hu)
19:52.58XenoX101hey guys has anyone ever had baclk stripes in terrain?
19:53.10XenoX101black*
19:54.57Ahlidid you hide terrain cells?
19:56.07XenoX101?
19:56.36XenoX101oh hide lowest terrain level?
19:57.51Ahlino, hidden terrain cells = black
19:58.32XenoX101if I did I have no idea how or how to fix it
20:02.09XenoX101fuck
20:02.15XenoX101I cant edit my map now
20:02.38XenoX101it just creates drivels of black bullshit everywhere
20:03.02XenoX101ok for some reason now its fine
20:04.03XenoX101this editor I swear
20:14.15*** join/#sc2mapster RazielZ (~Raziel@78.97.99.188)
20:21.33XenoX101hm, does anyone know how to fix bugs with tooltips when adding mods to maps?
20:21.53XenoX101like Unit\blahblah\blah\tooltip\highlight
20:33.56Eldrazorlocales
20:34.26Eldrazoradd whatever locale you use in your map to the mod
20:34.30Eldrazorthen import the mod
20:34.48Eldrazorthen remove the locales that you don't use
20:35.15XenoX101ah
20:35.17XenoX101you're right
20:35.23XenoX101cause it only applies to this one unit which I havent localed for
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22:51.36*** join/#sc2mapster tordy (627449b7@gateway/web/freenode/ip.98.116.73.183)
22:51.55tordyis blizz gonna ever put up a map contest again w/ $5000 prize?
22:52.04tordythat was so cool
23:08.34tordyis there a topic or list that shows all the limitaitons to consider before making a large ambitious map?
23:08.43tordyit would be really really convenient if someone compiled a list
23:08.58tordyincludes script limit, bank limit, & bunch of other limits
23:11.24tordyfine i'll post a topic
23:21.53*** join/#sc2mapster Torhal (~torhal@c-71-207-224-241.hsd1.al.comcast.net)
23:24.34Ahliignore script limit as it is very big now (changelog said 4 to 8 times bigger... before it was approx 3mb, if you had no computer used in the map. With computer, it was approx 2mb). I hope that Blizzard fixes their banks soon. Else it is at approx 8kb for every player.
23:28.53tordyI'd imagine for large RPGs, script limit could still be a thing
23:29.03tordymaybe really badly implmented RPGs
23:29.11tordyor RPGs with massive amounts of content
23:29.35tordyif the developer(s) can have the motivation to get that much content implemented in the first place
23:29.48Ahlilike me, yeah
23:30.32tordywant some close approx / exact numbers & easily testable cases so it could be convenient for people early in the project
23:30.39tordy;prob compile the list in the topic
23:33.52Ahlidon't expect your map to have 9k+ units on the map. That eats a ton of FPS. if you have 9k images of structures in the fog, it will reduce the player's FPS by a ton.
23:34.22AhliBut I figured a way around these problems in my map ;D
23:34.42tordyhow
23:35.11tordyi mean in the case of an RPG, obv you should have all the units placed at once
23:35.23tordyyou generate/load only the ones near the player
23:36.08tordyand then you might deal with memory constraints if you're planning on saving all the coordinates, status, attributes of the units in distant areas
23:36.21AhliI remove unnecessary units on the map and save their stuff in the data table. My dungeon layout creates images of the walls in the fog. I remove them by hiding the actors which sets the FPS cost of these to approx 0.
23:36.36AhliBasically I unload levels that aren't required.
23:36.54Ahliand recreate them, if they are required again.
23:37.14tordyhide the actors? you dont need to hide the unit?
23:38.15AhliI need to destroy the unit. I hide the actor because the scouting info isn't lost.
23:38.33Ahliduring load, recreate the units out of the data table and show all actors in the region again
23:38.46Ahliit looks like it has never been unloaded, if you do it properly ;D
23:39.01Ahlithat's happening in my map on the arcade beta ^^
23:39.15tordywhat triggers are these?
23:39.19tordyfunctions
23:39.32tordyand what data table are you talking about?
23:40.02tordyis your map separated in small visible regions by the player?
23:40.05tordyor is the entire map seen?
23:40.14Ahlidata table = a huge storage where you can store values and leave a string as the key. But it has a worse performance than variables
23:41.36tordyin the case of one giant map with multiple players with multiple units, is there an efficient way of hiding AI units that don't need to be seen?
23:44.53*** join/#sc2mapster Ahli_ (~casdasdqq@dslb-092-073-212-065.pools.arcor-ip.net)
23:45.13Ahliirc, y u drop me ;S
23:45.54Ahliso, tordy. did you have more questions?
23:47.25tordywassup
23:48.36Ahliwe talked about limits, etc, a few minutes ago and I told you how I "unload" models and actors in an area to improve the performance of the map.
23:48.51Ahliand you asked something about which functions
23:50.34tordywhat functions "unload" the models and actors
23:54.09Ahliremove unit & Send actor message to all actors in region: set visibility 0
23:54.39tordyif you remove the unit, why do you need to set all the actors to visibility 0?
23:54.56tordydoesnt removing the unit remove everything already? including the actors
23:55.26Ahlisome actors like builidngs create a snapshot in the fog, if they have been seen by a player. You just hide these snapshot actors for the player with that.
23:56.12Ahlitook me some time to figure out that these images in the fog ate all the performance in my map ;D
23:56.40tordyoh ok
23:56.48tordyi wanna test this out
23:57.03tordygonna need  a reminder

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