| 00:04.11 | fraz | anyone |
| 00:04.43 | Ivnedar | check out the addon black chat |
| 00:05.05 | Ivnedar | it creates a black box behind the chat windows |
| 00:05.09 | Ivnedar | should give you a starting point |
| 00:05.31 | Ivnedar | http://www.riftui.com/downloads/info226-BlackChat.html |
| 00:07.29 | fraz | i've been looking at that |
| 00:07.38 | fraz | i don't follow how strata works |
| 00:09.30 | Ivnedar | strata are collections of layers |
| 00:09.55 | Ivnedar | so strata will be the major tiers of frames from back to front |
| 00:10.11 | Ivnedar | then layers and rendering order determine which is on top inside a strata |
| 00:10.51 | fraz | what can you set them to? |
| 00:11.27 | Ivnedar | call :GetStrataList() on your frame and it will return the list in order |
| 00:12.37 | fraz | return where? |
| 00:12.53 | Ivnedar | <PROTECTED> |
| 00:12.54 | Ivnedar | as an example |
| 00:18.05 | fraz | ok you run that as a macro sorry im new to this |
| 00:18.37 | Ivnedar | yeah, sorry, that can be run from the chat window and will dump the result to the chat window |
| 00:19.55 | fraz | got that, there is no "bottommost" i assume the first one "hud" is farthest behind |
| 00:20.48 | Ivnedar | yup |
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| 00:24.12 | fraz | i tried changing the blackbar addon's strata to hud and the dimensions so that the box covered my actionbars and it did not go behind them, or the chat |
| 00:33.22 | fraz | tried all of the stratas in the list and none seem to go behind the actionbars 2-7 |
| 00:34.49 | Ivnedar | what strata are the action bars? |
| 00:35.01 | fraz | i dont know |
| 00:35.05 | Noshei | think of strata and layer as the z axis in a 3d plane |
| 00:35.27 | Ivnedar | <PROTECTED> |
| 00:35.49 | fraz | returns hud |
| 00:35.50 | Noshei | you need to position the black box on the x and y axis to be behind the action bars, then use strata to position it "below" the action bars |
| 00:36.01 | Ivnedar | <PROTECTED> |
| 00:36.18 | fraz | layer 3 |
| 00:36.23 | Ivnedar | so actionbar is already at the backmost strata |
| 00:36.31 | Ivnedar | so you need to set your layer to be behind layer 3 |
| 00:36.33 | fraz | i understand noshei, trying to do that |
| 00:36.45 | fraz | ok i will try that |
| 00:36.48 | Imhothar | a UI context has a strata too |
| 00:37.02 | Noshei | so SetPoint is used to control the x and y axis for frames |
| 00:37.57 | Noshei | Ivnedar: I'm pretty sure layers are dependent on parentage, so you also need to have the same parent or you will get undefined results. |
| 00:38.26 | fraz | how exactly do i set strata to a frame? |
| 00:38.36 | Noshei | you don't |
| 00:38.45 | Noshei | you set the strata on a context |
| 00:38.51 | Ivnedar | so fraz would need to make the action bar the parent of the black box before layer would make any difference? |
| 00:39.25 | Noshei | no Ivnedar, he would need to use :GetParent on the action bar and set that as the parent of the black box |
| 00:39.50 | Imhothar | which he won't be able to do with native frames |
| 00:39.56 | Noshei | ^ |
| 00:41.10 | Ivnedar | why would it need the same parent instead of using the native frame as the parent? |
| 00:42.21 | Noshei | layering is only relative within the scope of a frames direct parent, so you can have you're parent on layer 5000, and a child of that on layer 5, but the parent will always be behind it |
| 00:42.35 | Noshei | *child of that frame |
| 00:43.11 | Ivnedar | ah, had assumed it was within the strata, not within one hierachy level like that |
| 00:43.15 | fraz | got it to work, so simple lol |
| 00:43.33 | fraz | set strata to hud and layer < 3, thanks guys |
| 00:43.47 | Noshei | it may not work every time |
| 00:43.59 | fraz | whys that? |
| 00:44.23 | Noshei | because it is an undefined behavior |
| 00:44.51 | fraz | you mean the default layer could change? |
| 00:44.53 | Noshei | since layer really doesn't apply in this case since you have a different parent on your frame than the native UI has |
| 00:48.19 | Ivnedar | curious why it's working now then |
| 00:48.35 | Noshei | because it is undefined |
| 00:48.53 | Noshei | it could work 100% of the time, but there is no guarentee that it will |
| 00:49.00 | fraz | i can't seem to get the parent of mainbar? |
| 00:49.09 | Noshei | you can't |
| 00:49.27 | Ivnedar | you won't be able to, that's off in the part of the frame hierachy we can't see |
| 00:50.28 | fraz | noshei said to use :GetParent on the action bar and then set that as the parent? |
| 00:50.57 | Ivnedar | then Imhothar said that wasn't possible and Noshei agreed |
| 00:51.14 | fraz | so what then |
| 00:51.14 | Noshei | in this case it is more likely to either consistently work or consistently not work. This is due to the fact that it is mainly dependent on when each element is loaded. |
| 00:51.54 | fraz | is that why the black bar chat addon has a toggle feature and doesn't load when you log in? |
| 00:52.28 | Imhothar | figure out what strata the frame has, then set your context's strata to one lower |
| 00:52.37 | Ivnedar | there isn't any lower |
| 00:52.40 | Noshei | I have no idea, seebs might have put that in for any number of reasons |
| 00:52.52 | Imhothar | then you're screwed |
| 00:53.06 | fraz | is there a way to set the load order or put a delay until it does? |
| 00:54.06 | Noshei | In this case, because you are on the lowest strats and because you are dealing with a simple single frame and a Native UI element, you are entirely dependent on when each element is loaded, which we have no control over. |
| 00:54.21 | Ivnedar | hook into the bar's Loaded event? |
| 00:54.32 | Noshei | then it is most likely too late |
| 00:55.14 | Noshei | as it currently is I believe addons are loaded before the Native is loaded, so that is the best way to go. |
| 00:56.07 | Ivnedar | if you set it to hud strata and layer 5000, is it still behind? |
| 00:56.45 | fraz | yes |
| 00:57.18 | fraz | so layer is not important? |
| 00:57.29 | Ivnedar | nope, just load order |
| 00:59.34 | Noshei | *in this case |
| 01:00.04 | Ivnedar | *nod* |
| 01:00.40 | Noshei | if it is working for you now that is the best you can expect. Just know that it may not always work and that is just an unfortunate part of how the Rift Addon API currently functions |
| 01:04.10 | fraz | yep im still trying things, thanks again |
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| 02:51.26 | fraz | hello again, is it at all possible to create a new minimap without the border/buttons - just the graphics? |
| 02:53.54 | Ivnedar | nope |
| 02:54.32 | fraz | no access to minimap ? |
| 02:54.48 | Ivnedar | correct |
| 02:54.53 | fraz | not even to rotate it? |
| 02:55.18 | Ivnedar | the only interaction we have is to attach things around the frame and to get a list of the objects shown on it and their coords |
| 02:55.33 | Ivnedar | we can't tell which way it's pointing or what it's showing otherwise |
| 02:55.33 | fraz | oh well, thanks. |
| 02:55.44 | fraz | hopefully they add that sometime |
| 02:55.57 | Ivnedar | hopefully :) |
| 03:19.29 | Ivnedar | hrrm, interesting, if you run rift from steam, it doesn't crash on win8 |
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| 07:42.38 | ZorbaTHut | layer is actually defined on contexts - it works how you'd expect |
| 07:42.59 | ZorbaTHut | (and natives) |
| 07:56.31 | Ivnedar | apparently not how I expected :D |
| 07:58.36 | Ivnedar | so would it be possible to do what fraz wanted? |
| 07:59.12 | Ivnedar | ie. always display under a native frame that's at strata hud |
| 08:06.45 | Ivnedar | gah, really hate spending an hour doing something by hand thinking it would take 5 mins to do so wasn't worth spending the 5-10 minutes working out how to script it |
| 08:07.35 | ZorbaTHut | yep, should be - just set the layer to something really low |
| 08:07.46 | ZorbaTHut | it'll be automatically brought to front if it's clicked on, but as long as it's not possible to click on it, that'll be fine |
| 08:08.05 | Ivnedar | so layer scope is strata? |
| 08:08.13 | Ivnedar | not frame hierachy parent? |
| 08:08.28 | ZorbaTHut | in effect, all contexts and natives are in the same scope |
| 08:08.40 | Ivnedar | gah, so it does work how I expected it to! |
| 08:09.49 | Ivnedar | since layer can be "any number" do negative numbers work? :D |
| 08:09.54 | ZorbaTHut | yep :) |
| 08:10.01 | Ivnedar | lol, oh dear :D |
| 08:11.08 | Ivnedar | sooo, what did you think of my mount throttle idea? :D |
| 08:12.23 | ZorbaTHut | I think it's an entertaining idea but I doubt we'll get around to implementing it, unfortunately |
| 08:12.27 | Ivnedar | Hrrm, my suggestion post didn't go up, must have been when my network died |
| 08:15.05 | Ivnedar | which is about to happen again, bbl :) |
| 08:15.13 | Ivnedar | wife is waving bye too ;) |
| 08:15.23 | ZorbaTHut | hah, cya ^^ |
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| 17:46.14 | Thorarin | Eep, no more Elrar :/ |
| 17:48.01 | seebs | Just saw that. |
| 17:48.02 | seebs | WTF. |
| 17:49.00 | seebs | I may have picked the right minute to jump. More than one person has expressed the belief to me that dahanese has been sort of in conflict with the traditional attitude of the Rift community team. Thus, +dahanese, -Elrar, -Walsingham, -Zann. |
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| 17:52.35 | seebs | I mean, okay, Zwillinger remains my all-time favorite. But Elrar, Walsingham, Amary, and Zann would be in my top five or so game community reps I've ever dealt with. |
| 17:53.32 | Thorarin | Seeing dahanese's post, I don't think so |
| 17:53.58 | seebs | How so? |
| 17:54.43 | Thorarin | http://forums.riftgame.com/general-discussions/general-discussion/380856-updates-about-rift-community-3.html#post4453916 |
| 17:55.26 | seebs | Maybe. Lots of people SAY stuff like that. But Elrar was a pretty hands-on community guy. |
| 17:55.40 | Thorarin | Zargar used to be ftw, for DAoC players :P |
| 17:55.51 | Thorarin | Been at Blizzard for ages now tho :) |
| 17:57.17 | Noshei | ZorbaTHut: your still here I hope (as in working at trion)? |
| 17:58.10 | Thorarin | I sure hope they're not stupid enough to fire just about the only guy that knows about the gfx engine in the middle of a refactoring :P |
| 17:58.36 | Noshei | at this point I would not be surprised if they are |
| 17:59.35 | Thorarin | I suppose not :S |
| 18:00.27 | Thorarin | Getting rid of French and German CMs was also not a great move, to say the least.. |
| 18:09.48 | seebs | Yeah, that seems sort of not-encouraging. I mean, obviously Trion as a whole has money problems, but I am very concerned with the decision to reduce investment in the part that's been paying off the best. |
| 18:19.41 | Thorarin | Well, marketing in EU has always been kinda non-existant, but to me the current decisions don't make sense.. of course I don't have any information to speak of, but still |
| 18:46.23 | seebs | Well, I have written Elrar a recommendation on LinkedIn. This being about the extent of my ability to help. |
| 19:45.40 | ZorbaTHut | noshei, yep, I'm still around. Most are, honestly, I think this was just a community rep deal :/ |
| 19:47.39 | Thorarin | I was thinking about doing a recommendation... instead I poked an old friend at Perfect World, just in case they have something |
| 19:48.21 | seebs | I dunno what is up, and it may well be that nothing is particularly up, but something's felt weird about Trion official interactions recently. |
| 19:48.51 | seebs | I am also bothered just because, well, that's now 4/4 of the community reps I originally got to know who are gone. |
| 21:32.11 | Thorarin | Tsssk Noshei :P |
| 21:32.20 | Noshei | ? |
| 21:50.54 | Thorarin | The duel :) |
| 21:51.26 | Thorarin | And as expected, they're not saying anything about Elrar :P |
| 22:06.54 | Noshei | um |
| 22:18.19 | Thorarin | Not much info from Elrar either unfortunately.. |
| 22:18.27 | Thorarin | "Thanks Marcel - they are not that far away indeed, I definitely have some options :) |
| 22:18.27 | Thorarin | Appreciate you thinking of me - will miss you all!" |
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