| 00:43.41 | Imhothar | so that guy explaining cache architecture assumes the reader knows about computers AND cars |
| 00:43.43 | Imhothar | yay |
| 00:43.53 | Noshei | lol |
| 01:25.34 | seebs_ | Well, I would argue that he assumes the reader knows about *neither* computers nor cars. |
| 01:26.23 | Imhothar | well, when you start explaining system A using analogy from system B there isn't really a point if both A and B are unknown |
| 01:27.14 | seebs_ | Yes. But if you understand either of them, nothing he says makes any sense. :) |
| 01:27.44 | seebs | okay, been up 32 hours (i have a cold and sometimes that makes my sleep-clock reset), going to sleep now |
| 02:17.33 | Imhothar | oh my... so I just watched the iOS 7 preview video and I gotta say... it's barely possible to stuff more self-adulation and exaggaration into an advertising video |
| 02:18.23 | Imhothar | it's like "we removed all textures from the OS, look how awesome we are" |
| 02:23.53 | Noshei | Imhothar: did you see the new iCan? |
| 02:24.11 | Imhothar | the oversized coke can with wires inside? yes |
| 02:24.42 | Imhothar | the only thing that impresses me is they actually managed to cram all that stuff in such a tiny space |
| 02:25.46 | Noshei | you should see Cisco UCS Blade Servers |
| 02:25.57 | Noshei | they can cram 500 GB of memory in those things |
| 02:26.06 | Imhothar | I don't really care much about server blades |
| 02:27.09 | Imhothar | but the only reason I would never buy a Apple desktop solution is simply the lack of extensibility or component replacement |
| 02:30.44 | Noshei | so I hate eye drops |
| 03:43.44 | Ivnedar | oh nice work, addon api dev will be seperate forum to addon/macro/ui usage |
| 03:45.48 | Ivnedar | and something related to Noshei's question about addon dev forum title :P |
| 03:54.03 | Ivnedar | lol, seebs, let loose your dread vengeance on the world |
| 03:55.23 | Ivnedar | They should make an item in the cash shop called "Seebs' Dread Vengeance". It costs $10 in credits and gives you rift boxset item bundle |
| 03:57.34 | Ivnedar | there, my suggestion is up :P |
| 04:04.35 | Ivnedar | seebs: I had an idea that may work with your remote shell one |
| 04:04.57 | Ivnedar | I was considering creating a free account, make a toon in it, invite that toon to my guild |
| 04:05.20 | Ivnedar | I can then use that toon to log into the mobile service and consume the guild chat feed |
| 04:05.32 | Ivnedar | Which could then be displayed on the guild forums in a members only area! |
| 04:05.54 | Ivnedar | Adding onto that, may be the ability to control that toon via your remote shell option |
| 04:06.22 | Ivnedar | oooor, make it into a crafting bot |
| 04:06.49 | Ivnedar | if we could craft stuff with the api, d'oh! |
| 04:26.24 | Noshei | Noshei; Something related is in the works; we want to make sure people who contribute to the community are awarded for it, but Elrar and I have had our hands full! |
| 04:26.39 | Ivnedar | yup yup :D |
| 04:26.41 | Noshei | from Morgana in regards to a RIFT Addon Dev title on forums |
| 04:32.14 | *** join/#riftuidev Imhothar (miranda@ppp-93-104-168-39.dynamic.mnet-online.de) |
| 04:33.42 | Imhothar | ugh, now I have to track two forums darnit |
| 04:56.08 | Ivnedar | lol, popped in quickly to say that :D |
| 06:00.46 | Ivnedar | so there's a group of people on seastone who are planning on spawn camping the new f2p players |
| 06:00.57 | Ivnedar | no wonder that shard is almost dead :( |
| 07:32.12 | ZorbaBeta | seebs, that's a great example of how someone can kind of come to the right conclusion despite having extremely dubious logic. he's not entirely right, but he's not entirely wrong either. |
| 07:32.22 | ZorbaBeta | cache really is a lot more important on modern computers than people expect, though. |
| 07:35.35 | Ivnedar | I wonder if more people will multibox with the f2p model |
| 07:36.03 | Ivnedar | much easier to experiment with it if you can create more accounts as needed |
| 07:38.32 | ZorbaBeta | ivnedar, it's honestly a great example of why open-world pvp doesn't work. people have memories of great balanced fights, but . . . those just don't happen without a lot of coincidence or a whole ton of smoke and mirrors |
| 07:39.04 | ZorbaBeta | the tricky part about pvp is getting players to fight each other, since most of the time, they'd happily not fight each other, then complain that they're not fighting each other. |
| 07:39.15 | Ivnedar | yeah, there's a group of pvpers who's idea of fun game play is killing players like they kill mobs |
| 07:39.29 | Ivnedar | they want an infinite supply of people to kill with no real chance of getting killed themselves |
| 07:40.26 | ZorbaBeta | I think the problem comes down to one of those nasty tragedy-of-the-commons prisoner's-dilemma deals |
| 07:40.40 | ZorbaBeta | for most people, they'd rank preferred PvP encounters in this way, from best to worst: |
| 07:40.44 | ZorbaBeta | * close fight, I win |
| 07:40.47 | ZorbaBeta | * close fight, I lose |
| 07:40.52 | ZorbaBeta | * complete domination, I win |
| 07:40.55 | ZorbaBeta | * complete domination, I lose |
| 07:41.18 | ZorbaBeta | the problem is that no individual player has the ability to turn a complete domination into a close fight - only the ability to join the winning team |
| 07:41.27 | ZorbaBeta | which inevitably means that every encounter turns into complete domination |
| 07:41.48 | Ivnedar | pretty much sums up conquest |
| 07:43.33 | Ivnedar | I loved the old tarren mill/south shore pvp |
| 07:43.50 | Ivnedar | both sides had enough people that the combat just kept going on and on, neither side ever winning |
| 07:44.09 | Ivnedar | so no one really won, but everyone had fun |
| 07:44.23 | Ivnedar | a "win" was "can we push them back 5 meters ... yes!" |
| 07:45.09 | Ivnedar | that was also fun in conquest, when the kill rewards outweighed the objective rewards by so much that all three sides just constantly zerged one point on the map |
| 07:45.39 | ZorbaBeta | that'd get boring after a while, though :) you really need breaks in the action or it's just mentally exhausting |
| 07:45.56 | ZorbaBeta | look at all the most popular PvP games today, you'll find that they have carefully planned brain-cooldown points |
| 07:46.12 | Ivnedar | yup, drop out of the fray, go do something else, come back, it's still going |
| 07:46.38 | Ivnedar | no ultimate win objective, the reward was from participating |
| 09:06.01 | seebs | I noticed a long time ago, people kept saying flying mounts broke PvP. |
| 09:06.20 | seebs | But really, when I have flying (both in WoW and CoH), it doesn't mean that I avoid content I want to do... |
| 09:06.46 | Ivnedar | It breaks pvp as it means it's harder for people to gank/spawncamp people |
| 09:07.31 | Ivnedar | If I can't sneak up behind someone and spoil their day, it's all broken!! |
| 09:09.28 | seebs | I have sort of formed that opinion. |
| 09:09.51 | seebs | I still summarize open world PvP in the words of some nameless victim in Eastern Plaguelands. "HEP THEYS GANKIN" |
| 09:30.53 | seebs | And yeah, cache is important, but that description of the mechanism of its importance was… surreal, I think. |
| 09:31.07 | Ivnedar | woah, kingdom hearts 3 |
| 10:23.45 | ZorbaBeta | for the curious, I'm starting up my gamedev livestream :V http://www.twitch.tv/zorbathut - not exactly working on a Rift-budget game, but :) |
| 10:24.53 | Ivnedar | waves at ZorbaBeta |
| 10:34.22 | ZorbaBeta | if anyone here is in twitch, can they type something in twitch chat? I have no idea if it's working |
| 10:34.41 | Ivnedar | I'll log in |
| 10:34.47 | Ivnedar | it's greyed out for me since I'm not logged in |
| 10:34.50 | Ivnedar | goes looking for account details |
| 10:34.52 | ZorbaBeta | ah, fair enough |
| 10:39.03 | Ivnedar | Chat works! |
| 10:40.46 | ZorbaBeta | many thanks, only now it's broken for me so I can't reply :V oy this thing is annoying |
| 10:41.12 | Ivnedar | I've been watching the feed full screen, so there's no chat window then anyway |
| 10:47.40 | seebs | ZorbaBeta: I don't think I have access to a bug tracker for the launcher, but I found a stupid bug in it. |
| 10:47.56 | seebs | When you are *not yet logged in*, the launcher has a "Settings" button which lets you decide to run in a window. |
| 10:48.02 | seebs | Once you log in, there is no such button. |
| 10:48.16 | seebs | So by the time the game downloads enough to be playable, you no longer have that option... |
| 10:50.21 | ZorbaBeta | hah, whoops. well . . . there's always start the game, then access settings through that |
| 10:50.25 | ZorbaBeta | but that's certainly not ideal |
| 10:50.57 | Ivnedar | same with all the other settings like language isn't it? |
| 10:51.26 | Ivnedar | 'cause it turns into the recover button |
| 10:58.22 | seebs | Yeah. |
| 10:58.38 | seebs | Also, apparently if you download most of the game, then change regions, you have to redownload nearly everything. |
| 10:58.49 | Ivnedar | hrrm, really? |
| 10:58.59 | Ivnedar | it's only been a ~200mb each time I've switched |
| 10:59.00 | ZorbaBeta | I think that will depend on the patch levels between the regions - sometimes they're a bit out of sync |
| 10:59.03 | ZorbaBeta | or a lot out of sync |
| 10:59.08 | ZorbaBeta | but it might also break if you're mid-download |
| 10:59.20 | Ivnedar | true, I've let mine complete each time |
| 10:59.22 | seebs | ahh. |
| 11:00.35 | Ivnedar | I'm talking about languages though, not regions |
| 11:00.44 | Ivnedar | eg. english->german->french |
| 11:00.46 | Ivnedar | not na->eu |
| 11:01.49 | Ivnedar | Can you get "at developing Orthos" added to the list of games twitch supports? |
| 11:03.32 | ZorbaBeta | nope, not a real game :) |
| 11:03.58 | ZorbaBeta | they've had a few requests to add development to the list, so people can find gamedevs, but that hasn't happened yet |
| 11:04.21 | Ivnedar | Game Development Studio? :) |
| 11:04.25 | Ivnedar | that's a real game |
| 11:04.45 | ZorbaBeta | haha, I might do that |
| 11:05.13 | seebs | Huh. |
| 11:05.23 | Ivnedar | we're watching ZorbaBeta code :) |
| 11:05.28 | seebs | PTS says it hasn't been updated so I have to redownload. |
| 11:05.46 | seebs | Also, my friend in England has managed to break the game about five different ways trying to play in NA. |
| 11:05.46 | Ivnedar | should only download a small patch |
| 11:05.55 | Ivnedar | if it's the same problem other people have mentioned in the last day or so |
| 11:06.12 | seebs | Interesting. Because it does seem to be downloading only a small patch, despite saying it needed a full download. |
| 11:06.18 | Ivnedar | *nod* |
| 11:06.48 | seebs | I'm trying to test some stuff out as guest. |
| 11:07.14 | Ivnedar | ZorbaBeta: Game Dev Story, Game Dev Tycoon |
| 11:07.16 | Ivnedar | yup, you got it :) |
| 11:08.03 | seebs | Huh. |
| 11:08.13 | seebs | The daily login rewards work for guest accounts. |
| 11:08.54 | Ivnedar | because they're tied to real accounts? |
| 11:08.59 | Ivnedar | or because the f2p stuff isn't live yet? |
| 11:09.20 | seebs | I think just because why not let them work, it's not as though it breaks the game. Hmm. |
| 11:09.27 | seebs | Well, it could if you could automate farming them. |
| 11:10.08 | Ivnedar | I'm definitely making an account for guild chat proxy |
| 11:12.27 | seebs | Did something change to make names only show over some NPCs, or have I just forgotten about a setting? |
| 11:13.13 | seebs | Because I'm not seeing naems over a ton of the random soldiers and stuff in Meridian except on mouseover. |
| 11:13.31 | Ivnedar | when they changed the nameplate stuff that all changed I think |
| 11:14.29 | ZorbaBeta | seebs, if you're using multisampling, there have been *cough* some interesting bugs. which should be fixed, but may not have been :/ |
| 11:14.41 | Ivnedar | seebs: are you on pts? |
| 11:14.41 | ZorbaBeta | there's also a checkbox for "show nameplates only on mouseover", I think it defaults to true |
| 11:15.18 | seebs | Not nameplates, just the normal names. |
| 11:15.21 | Ivnedar | kinda amusing to know when ZorbaBeta's about to say something in here by his furious typing |
| 11:15.21 | seebs | And yes, on PTS. |
| 11:15.35 | Ivnedar | pts nameplates are "behind" invisible shadows now |
| 11:15.47 | Ivnedar | so if you move your camera around, some will come back |
| 11:16.00 | Ivnedar | and you can see the shapes of the things casting the invisble shadows if they're oddly shaped |
| 11:16.06 | seebs | What I was seeing was, in Meridian, only named-character NPCs had names over them, but if I moused over a guard or aspirant, they'd show up suddenly. |
| 11:16.21 | Ivnedar | hrrm, maybe the checkbox ZorbaBeta mentioned is on for you now? |
| 11:16.36 | seebs | I can check by using a normal account, which has different settings. |
| 11:18.13 | seebs | Oh, wait. Same settings because this isn't the machine on which my PTS settings are the same as live. |
| 11:19.40 | seebs | Okay, it's a setting. |
| 11:19.50 | seebs | If I /importui, suddenly always names. But I can't *find* the setting. |
| 11:20.19 | seebs | Oh! |
| 11:20.31 | seebs | "smart nameplates" applies to names, not just nameplates. I had not realized this. |
| 11:20.43 | Ivnedar | yeah, that's the bit I was talking about sorry |
| 11:20.47 | Ivnedar | when they put that in |
| 11:20.56 | seebs | And some named NPCs get their name/title anyway. |
| 11:21.07 | seebs | I might use it but the fade time is too long. :P |
| 11:26.33 | seebs | Baanano: You were right, the item was hidden. |
| 11:35.37 | seebs | Is there a mouselook toggle somewhere? |
| 11:38.05 | Ivnedar | right mouse click and hold? |
| 11:38.19 | Ivnedar | though left does the same |
| 11:41.24 | seebs | A "toggle" would be "hit this key, then you are in mouselook mode until you hit it again". |
| 11:41.33 | seebs | And left moves camera but doesn't turn player. |
| 11:48.55 | seebs | ZorbaBeta, one of my friends found a bug in the shiny new tooltips for armor/resistance that show effect on things +/- 2 levels. |
| 11:49.10 | seebs | If you are level 2, resistance against things at -2 level is shown as VERY SMALL because 0 is magic. |
| 11:51.23 | *** join/#riftuidev Alystin (~Alystin@ip-5-146-170-242.unitymediagroup.de) |
| 11:51.33 | Alystin | Good morning :) |
| 11:51.38 | Ivnedar | morning :) |
| 11:52.27 | Alystin | Does anyone know the addon Hand Me down? |
| 11:53.09 | Alystin | essentially, it helps sending artifacts to other toons |
| 11:54.10 | seebs | I don't, but I'm really curious about addons to do that. |
| 11:54.20 | seebs | I would LOVE a tracker that would tell me who still needs a given artifact. |
| 11:54.20 | Alystin | i'm trying to rewrite it a bit, so that you get a button on the native mail window... but i can't seem to find a way to find out if the window has opened |
| 11:55.20 | Alystin | There is... http://www.riftui.com/downloads/info315-IndianasArtifactCatalogueofDoom.html |
| 11:56.46 | Alystin | but handmedown is just a tool to automatically(ish) send artifacts around |
| 11:57.48 | Alystin | sooo... any idea if the api reports the opening and closing of the native mail frame? |
| 11:58.01 | ZorbaBeta | if it doesn't, it's a bug :) |
| 11:58.08 | Alystin | xD |
| 11:58.19 | ZorbaBeta | it used to, though! I had a personal addon that relied on it |
| 11:58.25 | ZorbaBeta | and I don't *think* that would have broken lately |
| 11:58.35 | Alystin | admittedly i have some difficulties browsing the documentaion |
| 11:58.37 | ZorbaBeta | it'd be under UI.Native.Mail, and you'd want to look through the events attached to that |
| 12:00.06 | Alystin | may be a dumb question, but howdo i do that? |
| 12:00.50 | ZorbaBeta | I'm gonna hope someone else answers that because I'm hoping my api is understandable :V but if nobody around wants to go into the details, definitely post on the addon forum, people are very helpful there |
| 12:01.43 | Alystin | waah maintenance xD |
| 12:02.28 | Alystin | i only recently started to look at the addon api... and even though i know some programming, the information on the api is a little... let's say, scattered |
| 12:02.42 | Ivnedar | which api reference are you using? |
| 12:02.53 | Ivnedar | http://www.seebs.net/rift/pts/ is what I use mainly |
| 12:02.56 | seebs | https:… yeah |
| 12:02.59 | Ivnedar | and /live/ |
| 12:03.07 | seebs | Only /rift/live, although that will be wrong tomorrow for a while. |
| 12:03.28 | Alystin | i've used that, yeah |
| 12:04.47 | Alystin | but where do i find the events attached to UI.Native.Mail? |
| 12:05.03 | Alystin | guess i'm blind again... ^^ |
| 12:05.25 | Ivnedar | I've never needed to look, so I'm attempting to work it out :) |
| 12:06.22 | Ivnedar | and yeah, with the forums down for the restructure, some of my other resources are gone too :) |
| 12:07.03 | Alystin | ^^ |
| 12:07.49 | seebs | It's so weird to me comparing Trion to other MMO devs. |
| 12:07.52 | Alystin | uh, wait... UI.Native.Mail:GetLoaded() |
| 12:07.54 | seebs | I'm used to two-day forum downtimes for updates. |
| 12:08.15 | Ivnedar | they'd be listed in UI.Native.Mail.Event.Loaded I'd imagine |
| 12:08.19 | Ivnedar | attaches one to try it |
| 12:08.35 | Alystin | well, actually, it's the first time i see the devs being active in the forums and irc and stuff |
| 12:09.14 | Alystin | i've been playing rift for only about three months now, and i can't complain (yet :P) |
| 12:24.45 | Alystin | i can hook functions to events, right? |
| 12:24.50 | Ivnedar | yeah |
| 12:25.04 | Ivnedar | Command.Event.Attach() |
| 12:25.17 | Ivnedar | I haven't managed to attach a function to a native frame event yet though |
| 12:28.27 | Alystin | hm... i'm using EasyMail as a kind of reference, because thats more or less exactly what i'm trying to acieve... |
| 12:28.46 | Alystin | but i don't seem to find what i'm looking for |
| 12:29.07 | seebs | Event API has changed, too, so the old one is deprecated. |
| 12:29.22 | Alystin | i see |
| 12:29.54 | ZorbaBeta | yeah, both APIs will work in parallel for some time |
| 12:30.04 | ZorbaBeta | but if you're using the old API you'll need to convert over by 2.5 |
| 12:30.07 | Ivnedar | ahhh, Event.Interaction was the one I was trying to remember |
| 12:30.24 | Ivnedar | you can hook into that event to know when ah/bank/mailbox/etc become interactable |
| 12:30.40 | Ivnedar | so if you hook in and look for "mail" interaction and check the state, you're set |
| 12:30.48 | Alystin | aaah cool :D |
| 12:30.51 | ZorbaBeta | yep, that might work |
| 12:31.12 | ZorbaBeta | another option is hooking Event.UI.Native.Loaded on UI.Native.Mail, which will tell you whether the mail dialog is loaded and visible or not |
| 12:31.13 | Ivnedar | I keep getting restricted state errors if I try attaching to UI.Native.Mail.Event.Loaded |
| 12:31.18 | ZorbaBeta | in this case they're sort of equivalent |
| 12:31.34 | Alystin | well, UI.Native.Mail:GetLoaded() works |
| 12:31.38 | Ivnedar | cool :) |
| 12:31.57 | seebs | huh, that's odd. |
| 12:32.08 | seebs | my charge-and-apply-dots only sometimes works. |
| 12:32.19 | Alystin | xD |
| 12:32.35 | seebs | hypothesis, the macro with that and another charge is sometimes betraying me. |
| 12:34.44 | Alystin | gotta love ridiculous if statements xD |
| 12:39.38 | Alystin | so in theory, http://pastebin.com/k5WpB3rb should do something, right? |
| 12:40.29 | Ivnedar | that should print poit whenever you open the mailbox |
| 12:40.57 | Alystin | huh |
| 12:41.40 | Thorarin | Dang, I missed your live stream Zorba? :< |
| 12:41.45 | Ivnedar | it's stoll going Thorarin |
| 12:41.50 | Ivnedar | he's cat-wrangling at the moment |
| 12:41.59 | Ivnedar | still going even |
| 12:42.06 | Thorarin | Hmm, see if I can get it to work @work |
| 12:42.08 | ZorbaBeta | http://www.twitch.tv/zorbathut - probably not much longer |
| 12:42.27 | Alystin | bleh twitch hates me |
| 12:43.03 | Ivnedar | Alystin: did it do anything? |
| 12:43.08 | Alystin | no |
| 12:43.30 | Alystin | but at least it doesn't give me any errors, either^^ |
| 12:43.35 | Ivnedar | try dropping the "and UI.Native.Mail:GetLoaded()" bit |
| 12:43.46 | Ivnedar | I'm wondering if that event fires before the native frame finishes loading |
| 12:43.48 | Ivnedar | probably does |
| 12:44.18 | Alystin | yep |
| 12:44.36 | Alystin | just realized, it's redundant anyway |
| 12:45.41 | Ivnedar | if you're wanting to know when the mail frame appears on the screen, you'll need to hook into the loaded event on the native mail frame |
| 12:45.52 | Ivnedar | you'd do that if you were going to make a ui that attaches to that frame somehow |
| 12:46.12 | Ivnedar | if you only care about whether or not you can interact with the mail system, Event.Interaction would be all you need |
| 12:46.43 | Alystin | well, i just tried to create a button which is positioned according to the mail frame, and it works |
| 12:47.11 | Alystin | could be coincidence |
| 12:47.22 | *** join/#riftuidev seebs (~seebs@home.seebs.net) |
| 12:47.22 | *** mode/#riftuidev [+o seebs] by ChanServ |
| 12:47.52 | Ivnedar | does it go away when the mail window does? |
| 12:47.58 | Ivnedar | if so, not a coincidence :) |
| 12:47.58 | Alystin | sadly, no^^ |
| 12:48.01 | Ivnedar | awwh |
| 12:48.29 | Alystin | well, "away" in a way xD it attaches to the far left side of the screen :P |
| 12:48.34 | Ivnedar | if you make the native mail frame the parent of your button, it should inherit the visibility state change |
| 12:48.37 | Thorarin | Broadcast seems to have stopped just now :p |
| 12:48.47 | Ivnedar | still going for me :D |
| 12:49.15 | Thorarin | Stupid proxy didn't allow Twitch to stream ofc, on phone it said someone was broadcasting until I tried to view.. |
| 12:49.16 | Thorarin | Weird |
| 12:49.21 | Alystin | so instead of creating a custom context, i'd use the mail frame? |
| 12:49.32 | Ivnedar | Alystin: worth a try :D |
| 12:49.41 | Ivnedar | in my head, that should work |
| 12:49.44 | Ivnedar | I haven't tested it though |
| 12:50.22 | Thorarin | Okay, this works... |
| 12:50.30 | Thorarin | Watching video over RDP ftl :( |
| 12:50.51 | Ivnedar | This also saves me from deciding what music to listen to :) |
| 12:52.06 | Thorarin | true.dat |
| 12:54.16 | Thorarin | Bed? Sheesh :P |
| 12:55.27 | Ivnedar | ZorbaBeta: if you drop a message in here when you start a stream, I'll see that more readily than a twitch alert :) |
| 12:57.01 | ZorbaBeta | I'll probably do that as long as people in here aren't being annoyed by it :V |
| 12:57.05 | Thorarin | Hmm, perhaps my phone will complain about it now that I'm actually logged into twitch there |
| 12:57.27 | Ivnedar | they'd probably be more interested than annoyed |
| 12:57.31 | Thorarin | But then, you started during my lunch break, so hmm :P |
| 12:57.34 | ZorbaBeta | it's probably not actually bedtime for me yet, there's a video game event I want to do at 7 ;) but I want to do some twitch updating and play a little games |
| 12:57.41 | ZorbaBeta | on the cellphone, need to figure out how to make that streamable |
| 12:57.51 | Alystin | hm. Apparently, i have to create a context... Because even though the function says createFrame(type, name, parent) i can't use UI.Native.Mail as parent |
| 12:57.59 | Alystin | or did i miss something there...? |
| 12:58.06 | Ivnedar | d'oh, worth a try |
| 12:58.23 | Thorarin | You need at least 1 context for your addon |
| 12:58.27 | Ivnedar | so you can position against a native frame, but not use one as a parent |
| 12:58.27 | ZorbaBeta | alystin, yes, for various internal reasons you can't attach extra frames to native frames :/ gotta make your own context |
| 12:59.40 | Ivnedar | I'm still failing to see how to attach more than one function to a native frame event |
| 12:59.48 | Ivnedar | Will need to look on the forums when they're back |
| 12:59.51 | Thorarin | Hmm, just realized... no shouting about improperly converted alert sets yet :P |
| 12:59.58 | ZorbaBeta | ivnedar, that can only be done through the new event system |
| 13:00.04 | ZorbaBeta | (one of the advantages of it :V) |
| 13:00.18 | Alystin | Hm, so all there's left to do is remove the button as soon as the mail window is gone again |
| 13:00.32 | Ivnedar | using Command.Event.Attach() ? |
| 13:00.35 | Thorarin | I still need to convert to the new event system :( |
| 13:00.54 | ZorbaBeta | ivnedar, using Frame:EventAttach, I believe |
| 13:01.00 | ZorbaBeta | Command.Event.Attach is for global events |
| 13:01.01 | Ivnedar | oh, that makes more sense |
| 13:01.04 | Thorarin | But there's things I cannot do with the new API that were possible before :/ |
| 13:01.07 | ZorbaBeta | thorarin, you've got time, but not infinite time |
| 13:01.13 | ZorbaBeta | thorarin, hmm, like what? |
| 13:01.27 | Thorarin | I have some of my own controls with new event types |
| 13:01.35 | ZorbaBeta | oh, right, creating your own events |
| 13:01.40 | ZorbaBeta | I'll see if I can get that in soon, it should be pretty easy now |
| 13:02.03 | ZorbaBeta | also has the advantage that you'll get the entire bubble framework, as well as the ability to call your own events on other frames |
| 13:02.11 | Ivnedar | so you'd want UI.Native.Mail:EventAttach(Event.UI.Native.Loaded, functionname, "description") |
| 13:02.34 | Thorarin | Like a dropdown list with a SelectionChange event |
| 13:02.50 | Thorarin | The name would need to change under the new scheme I guess :) |
| 13:03.15 | Ivnedar | <PROTECTED> |
| 13:03.18 | Ivnedar | yup, works great, thanks :) |
| 13:03.29 | *** join/#riftuidev Noshei (~quassel@c-24-9-171-99.hsd1.co.comcast.net) |
| 13:03.37 | Thorarin | But anyway, I should at least start reworking the simple UI controls *sigh* |
| 13:03.46 | Thorarin | I need to plan some more "holidays" |
| 13:09.32 | Alystin | hm. EventAttach is to be used in a function, or instead of table:insert()? |
| 13:09.43 | Ivnedar | instead of table.insert() |
| 13:10.02 | Alystin | thought so |
| 13:10.32 | Ivnedar | so you'd make a function that you want to fire each time the mail ui loads or unloads |
| 13:10.59 | Ivnedar | UI.Native.Mail:EventAttach(Event.UI.Native.Loaded, functionname, "description") |
| 13:11.03 | Alystin | UI.Native.Mail:EventAttach(Event.UI.Native.Loaded, CreateSendBtn(), "MailOpen") gives me "Incorrrect function usage" :/ |
| 13:11.06 | Ivnedar | then put that at the end instead of your table.insert |
| 13:11.21 | Ivnedar | don't put the () after the function name |
| 13:11.31 | Alystin | uh -.- right |
| 13:12.13 | Ivnedar | and you'll need to add another variable to your function, it'll pass in the handle of what called it as the first var |
| 13:12.35 | Noshei | actually it is more like |
| 13:12.35 | Noshei | Command.Event.Attach(Event.Mail, MailAvailable, AddonId .. "_MailAvailable" ) |
| 13:12.50 | Ivnedar | nah, working on the mail native ui frame appearing |
| 13:13.07 | Ivnedar | then creating a button positioned relative to that native frame |
| 13:13.15 | Ivnedar | then removing the button when the native frame goes away |
| 13:13.25 | Noshei | ah |
| 13:13.33 | Alystin | the last part is bugging me atm |
| 13:14.03 | Ivnedar | inside that function, you'll need to run handle:GetLoaded() to see if it's appearing or disappearing |
| 13:14.10 | Ivnedar | that function will be called in both cases |
| 13:14.15 | Alystin | yep |
| 13:15.00 | Ivnedar | you could keep that button around, call :SetVisible(false) on it when the native frame goes away |
| 13:15.06 | Ivnedar | and :SetVisible(true) when it comes back |
| 13:15.32 | Ivnedar | actually, calling :SetVisible(handle:GetLoaded()) would work too :D |
| 13:15.45 | Alystin | well, since it seems that i can't destroy the button... |
| 13:15.53 | Ivnedar | you can't destroy frames |
| 13:15.54 | Alystin | that's what i'm doing :P |
| 13:15.56 | Thorarin | Depends, when are you creating the button? |
| 13:15.58 | Ivnedar | only make them disappear |
| 13:16.06 | Ivnedar | so you'll want to only create one if it doesn't exist yet |
| 13:16.12 | Thorarin | You might need to create it the first time |
| 13:16.18 | Ivnedar | then keep a reference to it so you can show/hide it as needed |
| 13:16.29 | Thorarin | Right |
| 13:18.13 | Ivnedar | so outside of the functions you could put in "hmd.MailButton = nil" |
| 13:18.28 | Ivnedar | then inside the function, if it's set to nil, create the button and assign it to that variable |
| 13:18.40 | Ivnedar | then you can set its visibility and should be good from there |
| 13:31.49 | Thorarin | *headdesk* I'm explaining an "ICT professional" what a command prompt is :< |
| 13:31.54 | Alystin | http://pastebin.com/fRX6BDLr this should work, shouldn't it? |
| 13:31.59 | Alystin | uh ouch |
| 13:32.12 | Alystin | narf typo -.- |
| 13:33.02 | Alystin | k now it works... only the button is behind the native frame^^ |
| 13:33.54 | Thorarin | I don't see the typo :S |
| 13:34.15 | Alystin | i had SendButton as global and created it as SendBtn |
| 13:34.15 | Thorarin | But the way you asked the question suggested it didn't work :) |
| 13:34.27 | Thorarin | Oh duh |
| 13:34.38 | Alystin | so "SendButton" was nil all the time^^ |
| 13:34.49 | Ivnedar | :D |
| 13:36.25 | Alystin | hm. Seems like the native mail window hasa pretty high layer.... |
| 13:36.48 | Thorarin | You probably need to use a different stratum.. |
| 13:37.08 | Thorarin | But I can't remember exactly how from the top of my head |
| 13:37.40 | Thorarin | http://www.seebs.net/rift/live/Frame_index.html#Frame:SetStrata |
| 13:38.19 | Thorarin | Using the appropriate strata should allow you to put it on top, regardless of layer |
| 13:38.27 | Alystin | kk |
| 13:40.53 | Alystin | is there a way to^get the contents of the "to:" field in the native window? ^^ |
| 13:42.07 | Thorarin | I don't think you can access anything but the top level frame, but I have to admit I've never even tried |
| 13:42.44 | Ivnedar | you can use Command.Mail.Send to set the to, subject, body, etc |
| 13:42.45 | Alystin | hehe. That's me again... give me an api and i ask for the source code xD |
| 13:43.27 | *** join/#riftuidev Noshei (~quassel@c-24-9-171-99.hsd1.co.comcast.net) |
| 13:43.32 | ZorbaBeta | giving it a different strata is a little iffy because then it'll be on top of *all* windows. works, though |
| 13:43.46 | Alystin | yup... So i'd use the button to open a window with a field for the recipient, i guess |
| 13:44.20 | ZorbaBeta | unfortunately you can't really set mail fields right now - you can send an entire mail through the addon system. but in general, interoperability between the native frames and the addon system is rather limited right now |
| 13:45.15 | Alystin | that's alright... I guess it would open a world of exploits i you can get too deep into the native frame stuff |
| 13:45.37 | ZorbaBeta | well, some would, some wouldn't. the real reason is just that it's a colossal task and I haven't even finished the main API yet :/ |
| 13:45.43 | Alystin | ^^ |
| 13:45.59 | Alystin | i think it's great that there is an api we can work with in the first place |
| 13:46.33 | ZorbaBeta | and it's turning out quite useful, for many addons :) |
| 13:46.39 | ZorbaBeta | not ideal, but good enough for now |
| 13:46.57 | Alystin | so... setting the stratum, i tried context:SetStratum("tutorial"), but that doesn't change anything |
| 13:47.22 | Alystin | and if i try to change the stratum of the button directly, it gives me an error |
| 13:48.28 | Alystin | dunno about the "tutorial" part-though... it's used in the EasyMail-Addon, and there it works |
| 13:48.53 | Ivnedar | SetStrata it should be? |
| 13:49.04 | Alystin | er yes |
| 13:50.11 | Alystin | that's what i have in the addon^^ |
| 13:50.15 | Ivnedar | cool :) |
| 13:50.28 | Ivnedar | GetStrataList() will give you the list of possible strata |
| 13:51.17 | Ivnedar | tutorial should work, that's one level above the mail window |
| 13:52.14 | Alystin | http://pastebin.com/Guv1jymx |
| 13:54.13 | Alystin | doesn't work :/ am i missing something again? ^^ |
| 13:55.24 | Ivnedar | is the button appearing? |
| 13:55.45 | Alystin | yeah, i can see it lagging behind if i push the mail window around |
| 13:56.02 | Ivnedar | try setting the strata on the button itself |
| 13:58.02 | Alystin | like hmd.SendBtn:SetStrata? Says "Incorrect function usage" |
| 13:58.37 | Ivnedar | hmd.SendBtn:SetStrata("tutorial") says incorrect function usage? |
| 13:58.56 | Alystin | yeah |
| 13:59.24 | Ivnedar | probably isn't valid because the context it's in is set to tutorial |
| 13:59.43 | Ivnedar | dump(hmd.SendBtn:GetStrataList()) |
| 13:59.50 | Ivnedar | see what it will let you set it to |
| 13:59.57 | Alystin | aaah "dump" not "print" xD |
| 14:00.24 | Noshei | strata doesn't matter on individual frames |
| 14:00.29 | Ivnedar | ok |
| 14:00.33 | Noshei | strata only matters on your context |
| 14:01.17 | Noshei | so you want to do :GetStrataList() against your context |
| 14:01.18 | Alystin | ah. Tried dump(UI.Native.Mail:GetStrataList()) |
| 14:01.37 | Ivnedar | that'll list out all of them from hud to modal |
| 14:01.42 | Alystin | yep |
| 14:01.53 | Ivnedar | dump(UI.Native.Mail:GetStrata()) will tell you what it is now |
| 14:01.58 | Ivnedar | "dialog" usually I believe |
| 14:02.00 | Noshei | that will most likely give you the same list as doing it against your context would give |
| 14:04.51 | Alystin | funny... tried hmd.context:SetStrata("menu") |
| 14:05.27 | Alystin | dump(UI.Native.Mail:GetStrata()) says dialog, my context is set to menu |
| 14:05.42 | Alystin | still, the button is behind the mail window xD |
| 14:05.43 | Ivnedar | oooh |
| 14:05.46 | Ivnedar | I see your problem :D |
| 14:05.52 | Ivnedar | hmd.SendBtn = UI.CreateFrame("RiftButton", "SendBtn", context) |
| 14:05.56 | Noshei | you want SetStrata("tutorial") to be infront of the mail window |
| 14:06.11 | Ivnedar | you're using context, not hmd.context |
| 14:06.21 | Alystin | *headdesk* |
| 14:06.29 | Ivnedar | so you're using some other random context that's floating around from someone else polluting the namespace :D |
| 14:06.39 | Alystin | ROFL |
| 14:06.48 | Alystin | you're right of course^^ |
| 14:07.08 | Alystin | there we go^^ |
| 14:07.10 | Ivnedar | gotta love those typos that end up referencing someone else's variable so you don't find them |
| 14:07.16 | Alystin | xD |
| 14:07.37 | Ivnedar | if you want to avoid that yourself, make hmd local |
| 14:07.39 | Alystin | I'll never get why ppl don't stick to simple programming rules |
| 14:07.49 | Ivnedar | and make CreateSendBtn hmd.CreateSendBtn |
| 14:07.54 | Ivnedar | so they're all within your own scope |
| 14:08.09 | Alystin | yeah, was going to tidy up code as soon as the general idea works^^ |
| 14:08.32 | Alystin | ... shot my own foot with that comment, didn't i^^ |
| 14:10.48 | Alystin | is it still possible to size a frame to it's content? |
| 14:11.06 | Ivnedar | that I don't know |
| 14:11.15 | Alystin | like GetFullWidth before? |
| 14:11.23 | Ivnedar | That's meant to be automatic now |
| 14:11.29 | Alystin | ah, okay |
| 14:11.57 | Alystin | so i don't need to specify the width if i want to make it match the contents? |
| 14:12.24 | Ivnedar | I honestly don't know |
| 14:12.40 | Ivnedar | you'll have to try it to see |
| 14:12.49 | Ivnedar | unless one of the others notices the question and can respond :) |
| 14:12.53 | Alystin | ^^ |
| 14:13.07 | Alystin | btw you guys are the best :D Thanks for bearing with me being a complete newbie to this |
| 14:14.00 | Ivnedar | no probs, I'm learning too :) |
| 14:14.48 | Alystin | some peeps, especially those seasoned in programming, tend to be quite rude toward newbies asking questions^^ |
| 14:14.58 | seebs | I know. |
| 14:15.22 | Alystin | especially if you're a girl xD |
| 14:15.25 | seebs | One time, I had some problem, I forget what. So I went to a suitable IRC, and explained what was wrong, what I had tried so far, and what I'd found through search results. |
| 14:15.38 | seebs | I got a lmgtfy link on the search terms I'd already stated I'd searched on. |
| 14:15.46 | seebs | I try never to be That Guy. |
| 14:16.02 | Alystin | i love that, yeah... forums are stuffed with "ask google" answers |
| 14:16.37 | Ivnedar | I like learning new stuff, I'm interested in the addon stuff, so it works out when I get an excuse to learn something new, and bonus if it helps someone else |
| 14:17.02 | seebs | I occasionally encounter people who are absolutely convinced there is no sexism in the programming community. |
| 14:17.07 | Alystin | google tends to become quite useless for searching for "popular" programming questions |
| 14:17.16 | Alystin | oh, there is, let me tell you -.- |
| 14:17.21 | seebs | I encourage them to try registering on a forum with a feminine-sounding handle and see what they think. |
| 14:17.22 | Thorarin | Hmm, rather than put everying in hmd, I tend to use more locals |
| 14:17.38 | Alystin | sometimes you can smell the fear xD |
| 14:17.50 | Thorarin | Little point in making CreateSendBtn available from elsewhere if it's just an event hander |
| 14:18.12 | Ivnedar | true |
| 14:18.27 | Ivnedar | I guess I like drawing a box and putting everything in it |
| 14:18.29 | Alystin | so local function CreateSendButton() it is |
| 14:19.01 | Thorarin | <sarcasm>OMG you're a girl, no wonder you're such a big n00b</sarcasm> :P |
| 14:19.02 | Alystin | the difference being that another addon can access the non-local stuff? |
| 14:19.13 | Alystin | yeah right^^ |
| 14:19.16 | Ivnedar | the addons all live in the one sandbox |
| 14:19.21 | Ivnedar | so they can interact with each other |
| 14:19.35 | Ivnedar | unless you make the variable local, someone else can reference it, as you found out with context |
| 14:20.00 | Alystin | kk then it's like i thought |
| 14:20.03 | Thorarin | Quite easy to make variables global by accident in Lua :( |
| 14:20.19 | Alystin | ^^ |
| 14:20.55 | Thorarin | In general the language is kinda "meh", but I guess it works :) |
| 14:21.20 | seebs | I rather like Lua, although I am not super happy about the automatic global creation. |
| 14:22.37 | Alystin | it's not like in c, is it? |
| 14:23.01 | Alystin | i think i remember the variables were local unless they're outside blocks |
| 14:23.24 | seebs | No, it's not very much like C. :) |
| 14:23.37 | Thorarin | I guess it would be okay if I used it more, but every time I have time to do some work in it, the setmetatable crap does my head in |
| 14:23.53 | Alystin | so if i create , say, a counter variable inside a function, its global unless i tell it to be local? |
| 14:24.08 | Alystin | the what? |
| 14:24.11 | seebs | Yeah. |
| 14:24.28 | seebs | setmetatable is Deep Magic, it's how you change the behavior of lua objects. |
| 14:24.32 | Thorarin | I would have preferred some more conventional object orientation :) |
| 14:24.47 | seebs | But yeah. "x = 3", by default, creates a global named x, unless there's already an x in scope. |
| 14:24.55 | seebs | I actually really *like* the table thing. Now that I'm used to it. |
| 14:25.45 | Thorarin | I don't think I'll ever really like it, but I can enjoy working with it |
| 14:26.34 | Thorarin | When I'm not being frustrated with problems that would have been evident when you had access to things like strong typing, compilers and static analysis :P |
| 14:26.53 | Alystin | dunno... the only table i worked with are the tables in the runecraft helper-thingie |
| 14:26.55 | seebs | Yeah. |
| 14:27.06 | Alystin | but it was quite frustrating... |
| 14:27.24 | Alystin | i'd love to see some other way than the plain aray-tables |
| 14:27.29 | Thorarin | tables as tables are easy... |
| 14:27.35 | Alystin | but apparently there isnt |
| 14:27.42 | Baanano | my favourite Lua feature is being able to pass functions around |
| 14:27.47 | Alystin | yeah easy, but not very convenient^^ |
| 14:27.48 | Thorarin | But objects are tables... okay fine |
| 14:28.05 | Thorarin | Then when you want to do inheritance it starts to get annoying :P |
| 14:28.28 | Alystin | hehe guess i'm not that deep into lua yet^^ |
| 14:28.30 | seebs | Yeah. |
| 14:28.38 | Ivnedar | reminded me to clean up some of my leaked globals |
| 14:28.44 | Alystin | i'm still scratching the surface |
| 14:28.47 | Ivnedar | before I push out new versions for 2.3 |
| 14:29.00 | Thorarin | It's very powerful Baanano :) |
| 14:29.27 | Thorarin | If there wasn't something like a "function" variable, Lua wouldn't work at all |
| 14:29.52 | Alystin | ah Baanano you're the author of BananAH, right? |
| 14:30.07 | Baanano | yes |
| 14:30.23 | Alystin | great stuff |
| 14:30.29 | Ivnedar | wow, only one global, nice |
| 14:31.00 | Ivnedar | found a "i = ..." |
| 14:31.18 | Thorarin | hehe |
| 14:31.29 | Alystin | Oh i'm blind xD Noshei did the EasyMail-Addon |
| 14:31.32 | Ivnedar | first addon had heaps though |
| 14:31.51 | Thorarin | Easiest way I found was to just touch all your code with just your addon running, then checking the _globals table or tevr |
| 14:31.55 | Noshei | that i did |
| 14:32.06 | Alystin | i've got a question for you^^ |
| 14:32.34 | Alystin | your addon doesn't seem to play nice with the global scale thing |
| 14:32.42 | Thorarin | Unfortunately that only revealed a bunch of global leaks in dependencies like some KBM libs :( |
| 14:33.00 | Ivnedar | oops |
| 14:33.24 | Ivnedar | hassle him about them :D |
| 14:33.34 | Thorarin | I wish Zorba would have thought of something better for persistance of data, tbh, right now it relies on globals |
| 14:33.36 | Noshei | Alystin: it doesn't, global scaling can be a huge pain in the ass. I've got a fix in for the issue with bags though, just waiting until tomorrow to release it because it has a bit of code for 2.3 in there. |
| 14:33.44 | Thorarin | But it could have easily been another private table |
| 14:33.58 | Alystin | great :D I'm looking forward to that |
| 14:34.33 | Noshei | well basically it is just an option to turn off the bag overlay. I haven't had the time to work on scaling. |
| 14:34.48 | Ivnedar | like pushing the saved vars to us via the Inspect.Addon.Detail or ... bit? |
| 14:34.57 | Alystin | i was quite confused about that ... |
| 14:35.00 | Thorarin | Something like that |
| 14:35.23 | Alystin | I'm using ImhoBags, so my standard bags weren't open |
| 14:36.21 | Noshei | yeah and that makes it that much more of a pain in the ass |
| 14:36.30 | Alystin | ^^ |
| 14:36.49 | Alystin | dunno, i can't get used to those five bags scattering all my stuff about |
| 14:37.20 | Alystin | btw i tested the button resize behaviour... seems that if you don't specify the size, it's just a standard sized button |
| 14:37.22 | seebs | YAY! |
| 14:37.34 | Alystin | it doesn't scale |
| 14:37.35 | seebs | New forums now distinguish between addon development and UI settings/addon use. |
| 14:37.43 | Ivnedar | seebs: yup yup :) |
| 14:37.58 | Ivnedar | and murmurings of something related to an addon dev title :O |
| 14:38.01 | Alystin | very nice :D |
| 14:38.43 | seebs | I wonder whether I can get the addon dev title on my second account, since I apparently can't both be community ambassadors. |
| 14:38.55 | Thorarin | Hmm, with the new forum structure, should we move all our [Addon] threads to a different forum? |
| 14:39.08 | seebs | Someone in-game was accusing me of being an anti-rift troll who was only playing Rift to try to trick people into playing TSW. |
| 14:39.29 | Ivnedar | Thorarin: may need to maintain two threads |
| 14:39.35 | Alystin | lol seebs |
| 14:39.37 | Ivnedar | one for general use and one for technical? |
| 14:41.10 | Alystin | hm. seems i have to set the width manuall |
| 14:41.12 | Alystin | *y |
| 14:41.27 | Thorarin | Yes... |
| 14:41.58 | Thorarin | UI elements don't scale very well though, so you have to design UI accordingly |
| 14:42.19 | Thorarin | Basically things are just ripped out of proportion if you make them wider :) |
| 14:42.30 | Alystin | pah. i'll just use "HMD" as a caption in all languages :P |
| 14:42.51 | Thorarin | What does it stand for anyway? |
| 14:43.25 | Alystin | Dunno... Hand Me Down seems to be a proverb of some kind |
| 14:43.39 | Alystin | i'm from germany, so i don't know |
| 14:43.57 | Thorarin | Oh, your English is pretty good |
| 14:44.09 | Alystin | thanks :) |
| 14:44.15 | Thorarin | Unlike some other Germans, no offense -.- |
| 14:44.22 | Alystin | ^^ I know what you mean |
| 14:44.23 | Ivnedar | hand me downs are items that are no longer needed by someone but are still useful to someone else |
| 14:44.35 | Alystin | aaah, makes perfect sense |
| 14:44.39 | Ivnedar | like when kids grow out of clothing that would now fit their younger brothers/sisters |
| 14:44.56 | Alystin | or Artifacts that you already collected ^^ |
| 14:45.00 | Ivnedar | yup yup :) |
| 14:45.08 | Ivnedar | and an alt still needs |
| 14:45.17 | Ivnedar | or another player if you're doing it that way |
| 14:45.21 | Alystin | Yep |
| 14:45.44 | Alystin | Meh... mustn't forget to ask Bombshelly for permission if i'm going to release that thingy |
| 14:46.09 | Thorarin | So, no big rivers near I hope? :P |
| 14:46.20 | Alystin | huh? |
| 14:46.34 | Thorarin | Germany was having some probs with floods the other week |
| 14:46.36 | Alystin | well, rhine is about 20 kilometers from here, but... |
| 14:46.44 | Alystin | ooh i see |
| 14:46.59 | Alystin | there's only one cable provider who has issues |
| 14:47.03 | Alystin | not mine ^^ |
| 14:47.25 | Alystin | i'm with unitymedia, so everything is shiny |
| 14:47.47 | Thorarin | Don't know them... I'm not in Germany that often |
| 14:47.58 | Alystin | they're actually american, i think |
| 14:48.07 | Thorarin | Once had a bit of a fight with some GMX guys or whatever, for a german friend |
| 14:48.35 | Alystin | they only recently acquired some other big provider here and got their foot in the door |
| 14:49.11 | Alystin | can't complain so far... we got no tv, so the 30M are all for streaming por... i mean, the internet |
| 14:49.44 | Alystin | so where are you from, if i may ask? |
| 14:49.58 | Thorarin | Tssk :p |
| 14:50.08 | Thorarin | The Netherlands |
| 14:50.16 | Alystin | ah, not so far away then^^ |
| 14:50.25 | Thorarin | Imhothar is from Germany |
| 14:50.32 | Thorarin | Not sure where in Germany tho |
| 14:51.33 | Thorarin | OMFG now that he's using a command prompt I have to explain that he needs to put double quotes around file names with spaces |
| 14:51.42 | Alystin | oO |
| 14:52.54 | Thorarin | Uhh sorry, just annoyed with these Indian people |
| 14:53.04 | Alystin | nvm^^ |
| 14:53.13 | Thorarin | I was there for a few weeks recently, doing some knowledge transfer.. now they keep bugging me :P |
| 14:53.21 | Alystin | lol |
| 14:55.43 | Alystin | hmm... if i have a new variable in a local function, is it local or global? |
| 14:55.57 | Thorarin | global |
| 14:56.02 | Alystin | thought so |
| 14:56.08 | Thorarin | Unless you explicitly make it local |
| 14:56.16 | Thorarin | That's what I was ranting about earlier :) |
| 14:56.30 | Alystin | ^^ |
| 14:56.33 | Ivnedar | only time it'll be local is if it's a temporary one created in a loop I think? |
| 14:56.46 | Ivnedar | for k, v in pairs(tablename) do |
| 14:56.46 | Ivnedar | etc |
| 14:56.47 | Thorarin | Yep |
| 14:56.52 | Ivnedar | k and v are local to that block |
| 14:57.07 | Thorarin | Luckily, would be a f'ing mess otherwise |
| 14:57.13 | Alystin | ^^ |
| 14:57.50 | Ivnedar | though, I haven't tried creating a k just before a block like that, then looked to see what it was like at the end |
| 14:58.19 | Alystin | so theoretically, if i know what variables i'm going to use, it'd be nice to put them all in a local array (?) |
| 14:58.51 | Alystin | like local hmd = { var1 = bla, var2= nil} etc? |
| 14:59.14 | Ivnedar | only really if you're using them outside of functions |
| 14:59.34 | Ivnedar | if you want them to be "global" in that file only, then you can do it like that |
| 14:59.46 | Ivnedar | if they only need to exist in a function, make them local in that function |
| 15:00.07 | Alystin | oh wait i think i confused myself xD |
| 15:01.19 | Ivnedar | and yeah, it's fine if you set k to 5, then loop over something setting k each time, printing out k inside that loop, then after the loop |
| 15:01.34 | Ivnedar | outside the loop it's 5, inside the loop it's whatever that iteration sets it to |
| 15:01.52 | Ivnedar | which is how it should work, so that's good :D |
| 15:03.37 | Thorarin | Hmmm, I would prefer my compiler to whine about that actually :P |
| 15:03.52 | Thorarin | redefining k inside the scope |
| 15:04.04 | Thorarin | Can make code harder to read |
| 15:04.18 | Ivnedar | oh, I'm definitely not suggesting it should be ever done |
| 15:04.34 | Ivnedar | Was more a "I wonder what happens when I ..." type thing |
| 15:05.48 | Ivnedar | would make life very confusing if you had nested loops all using the same variable names :D |
| 15:08.30 | Alystin | sometimes i feel like i lack some basic understanding of how things work... |
| 15:09.37 | Alystin | when i want to bind a function to a button, i do that with function hmd.SendBtn.Event:LeftPress() rifht? |
| 15:10.03 | seebs | So, the tooltips on pet summons: Consistently, reliably, confusing players. |
| 15:10.15 | seebs | Because they give a max level value which is not the actual max that spell will scale to. |
| 15:10.43 | Alystin | meh there's worse in the translations |
| 15:11.36 | Thorarin | I guess that would be the old event method actually Alystin |
| 15:11.55 | Alystin | the rogue has a talent where it says that "incoming healing and damage" are 15% more... What they're trying to say is "get 15% more heal, do 15% more damage" |
| 15:12.07 | Alystin | ah right, there's the new method |
| 15:12.23 | Thorarin | See here: http://forums.riftgame.com/technical-discussions/addon-api-development/340909-event-api-redesign.html |
| 15:12.59 | Alystin | ty |
| 15:14.40 | Thorarin | Should be more like hmd.SendBtn:EventAttach(Event.UI.Input.Mouse.Left.Down, myfunction) |
| 15:15.05 | Alystin | yup |
| 15:15.59 | Thorarin | I still have all that rewriting to do myself *sigh* |
| 15:16.15 | Thorarin | I did the non-frame events, but that was easier :) |
| 15:18.22 | Thorarin | Hmm, come to think of it, why is this guy still bugging me.. it's almost 9pm in Chennai |
| 15:18.36 | Thorarin | Poor guy -.- |
| 15:20.26 | Alystin | hmmm... i may not use the eventAttach in a function? |
| 15:21.06 | Alystin | because my button isn't there before i opened the mailbox once |
| 15:21.09 | Thorarin | I don't see why not |
| 15:21.17 | Thorarin | Oh right |
| 15:21.25 | Alystin | dunno... says incorrect function usage xD |
| 15:21.34 | Thorarin | You should do the attaching in your CreateSendButton function |
| 15:21.41 | Alystin | that i did |
| 15:21.50 | Alystin | after actually creating the button |
| 15:23.19 | Thorarin | Hmm, perhaps the other parameters are mandatory |
| 15:23.26 | Thorarin | There are 4 in total I think |
| 15:24.01 | Alystin | doc says handle, callback, label |
| 15:24.22 | Alystin | hmd.SendBtn:EventAttach(Event.UI.Input.Mouse.Left.Click, ShowNamePrompt, "ShowRecipient") |
| 15:24.40 | Thorarin | I was just about to say, you should probably use Event.UI.Input.Mouse.Left.Click |
| 15:25.00 | Thorarin | The Press one was just the first I ran into :) |
| 15:25.06 | Alystin | ^^ |
| 15:26.33 | Thorarin | But hmm, not sure why it gives you an error |
| 15:26.58 | Ivnedar | incorrect function usage should give you the variables you passed into it and what it expected |
| 15:27.11 | Thorarin | True :) |
| 15:27.26 | Alystin | one sec... |
| 15:27.49 | Alystin | http://pastebin.com/h13KHZyi |
| 15:28.27 | Alystin | I think soemthing is wrong with the event |
| 15:28.43 | Thorarin | Oh, your ShowNamePrompt function is undefined |
| 15:29.27 | Thorarin | It doesn't make sense to attach an event with a nil event handler, so I can understand it complains about that :) |
| 15:29.38 | Alystin | ugh |
| 15:29.45 | Alystin | one local too much xD |
| 15:29.58 | Alystin | i should stop rewriting old functions -.- |
| 15:30.06 | Thorarin | local should be fine, unless you're separating in different files |
| 15:30.20 | Alystin | no i dont |
| 15:30.20 | Thorarin | Perhaps the order of the code is wrong? |
| 15:30.26 | Alystin | hahaaa |
| 15:30.43 | Alystin | if i call a function, the compiler should know it you say? |
| 15:30.44 | Thorarin | define the function above the CreateSendButton function |
| 15:30.46 | Alystin | ridiculous ^^ |
| 15:31.02 | Alystin | he should be able to look into the future! |
| 15:31.03 | Thorarin | You're not actually calling it yet |
| 15:31.10 | Thorarin | Just passing a reference to the function |
| 15:31.12 | Alystin | well but i'm referencing it^^ |
| 15:31.59 | Alystin | you're right ofc |
| 15:32.30 | Alystin | sometimes i can understand that people start to be grumpy xD |
| 15:33.37 | Thorarin | I tend to fuss over how people express the meaning of code, professional habit I guess :) |
| 15:33.56 | Thorarin | I like to be sure people understand what they're writing :) |
| 15:34.04 | Alystin | true |
| 15:34.22 | Alystin | makes it less likely that they come back with the same problem twice |
| 15:34.38 | Thorarin | That's an important part of it :D |
| 15:36.05 | Thorarin | By the way, have you posted in the API development forum yet? I don't know if you use the same nick on the forums, but people there can also be helpful... sometimes :) |
| 15:36.26 | Alystin | no, i haven't... |
| 15:36.45 | Alystin | i'm just bugging you guys until you stop responding :P |
| 15:36.59 | Alystin | girls habit, i guess |
| 15:37.00 | Thorarin | heh |
| 15:37.13 | Thorarin | Not necessarily girls |
| 15:37.21 | Alystin | or until i achieved what i'm trying to do... looks good though |
| 15:37.26 | Alystin | i think i'm nearly finished |
| 15:38.14 | Thorarin | But well, I don't mind explaining things, in general |
| 15:38.40 | Thorarin | Problem is that my Lua and Rift API knowledge is virtually non existant :) |
| 15:38.59 | Alystin | well, i like irc more than the forums, because most of the time it's way faster |
| 15:39.05 | Thorarin | I look up so much it's embarrassing, but somehow the end result is okay :) |
| 15:39.23 | Alystin | if i'm posting on the forums with some minor problem, i might be stuck for a while |
| 15:39.26 | Alystin | and that bothers me^^ |
| 15:39.38 | Thorarin | As long as you know where to look, and to judge the quality of a solution :) |
| 15:39.43 | Alystin | Nothing wrong with looking up things |
| 15:39.58 | Thorarin | Hmm well, sometimes it's very quiet here |
| 15:40.09 | Thorarin | I don't usually hang in this channel during work hours, lol |
| 15:40.15 | Alystin | xD |
| 15:40.32 | Ivnedar | I'm usually here ~18 hours a day :P |
| 15:40.34 | Thorarin | I blame ZorbaBeta for doing his live stream during my work day |
| 15:40.51 | Ivnedar | it's another window in my client that follows me around |
| 15:41.01 | Ivnedar | so when there's activity, I'll look in |
| 15:41.01 | Alystin | i'd love to see it, but somehôw none of my browsers like twitch |
| 15:41.52 | Thorarin | I used to do IRC all over the place, but just IM is enough for me nowadays :P |
| 15:42.00 | Alystin | ^^ |
| 15:42.15 | Thorarin | Although I cannot decide which IM... |
| 15:42.30 | Thorarin | Everyone using different stuff, it's annoying |
| 15:42.37 | Alystin | ooh yeah |
| 15:42.50 | Alystin | msn, irc, icq, jabber, xmmp... |
| 15:43.04 | Alystin | some ppl even tend to use skype as im |
| 15:43.06 | Ivnedar | I end up running the one client with all my accounts on it |
| 15:43.08 | Thorarin | jabber is xmmp ;) |
| 15:43.15 | Alystin | ah bleh |
| 15:43.19 | Ivnedar | and msn is now skype |
| 15:43.20 | Alystin | i use trillin |
| 15:43.23 | Alystin | *a |
| 15:43.25 | Ivnedar | I use pidgin |
| 15:43.27 | Alystin | oh right |
| 15:43.28 | Thorarin | I use Trillian as well |
| 15:44.28 | Thorarin | Not many people do unfortunately, but I managed to get my GF on there |
| 15:44.38 | Thorarin | Astra works okay :> |
| 15:44.45 | Alystin | never used that |
| 15:44.58 | Thorarin | I like how it syncs history |
| 15:45.13 | Thorarin | I chat on my phone, ends up in chat history at home :) |
| 15:45.47 | Thorarin | Microsoft needs to hurry up and update their Skype SDK though |
| 15:45.51 | Alystin | yeah that's quite cool |
| 15:46.12 | Thorarin | Trillian still doesn't understand Skype with microsoft accounts |
| 15:46.59 | Thorarin | Which will become more important with MSN disappearing -.- |
| 15:47.23 | Thorarin | I don't like the Skype UI for IM, but integrated into Trillian I guess I don't care :> |
| 15:47.55 | Alystin | kinda |
| 15:48.08 | Alystin | i don't like the constant skypekit process in the background tho |
| 15:48.14 | Thorarin | true :/ |
| 15:48.47 | Thorarin | And when you actually do a video call with Skype, you kinda need Skype :/ |
| 15:48.58 | Thorarin | I never do that normally, but hey |
| 15:49.05 | Alystin | yeah |
| 15:49.18 | Thorarin | Being in India for a few weeks for work made it more appealing :) |
| 15:49.50 | Thorarin | Anyway, I'm heading home.. back in 20 minutes or so |
| 15:50.05 | Alystin | alrighty :) |
| 16:03.42 | *** join/#riftuidev Noshei_ (~quassel@c-24-9-171-99.hsd1.co.comcast.net) |
| 16:09.40 | Ivnedar | I might go sleep too |
| 16:09.41 | Ivnedar | nite :) |
| 16:09.49 | Alystin | good night :) |
| 16:16.36 | Thorarin | Sleep -.- |
| 16:16.54 | Thorarin | Sometimes I forget we're in wildly different timezones here :) |
| 16:17.07 | Alystin | xD |
| 16:17.24 | Alystin | reminds me of my time in eve |
| 16:17.49 | Thorarin | I've played Eve, but I was a bit of a loner in there :S |
| 16:18.00 | Alystin | everytime i come online, most of the people i was in a corporation were about to leave^ |
| 16:19.19 | Thorarin | Hmm, from what I understood some corporations were 24/7, while others were strictly one time zone |
| 16:19.52 | Alystin | well, mine had to be 24/7, because we had big ambitions for null space |
| 16:20.14 | Thorarin | 3 friends of mine played, but only 1 did so seriously, and he was kinda far ahead and I never joined his corp |
| 16:20.21 | Alystin | we were supported by the cva though... but nevertheless, we had to be on our heels |
| 16:20.26 | Thorarin | So I guess I never really got into the game |
| 16:20.34 | Thorarin | The tournaments were fun to watch tho :) |
| 16:20.39 | Alystin | yeah^ |
| 16:20.43 | Alystin | so... what does "consume a hardware event" in terms of the rift api mean? |
| 16:20.55 | Alystin | didn't find anything useful for that |
| 16:20.56 | Thorarin | Some click or button press |
| 16:20.58 | Alystin | hm |
| 16:21.10 | Alystin | so i can't send a series of mail without clicking something? |
| 16:21.25 | Thorarin | Only 1 at a time I think |
| 16:21.35 | Alystin | k that explains things |
| 16:21.44 | Thorarin | But I think even a mouse move is a hardware event |
| 16:21.51 | Alystin | xD |
| 16:22.17 | Thorarin | Not entirely sure, but I thought Noshei was saying something like that once |
| 16:22.33 | Thorarin | When he was figuring out how to send more mails probably :P |
| 16:22.38 | Alystin | guess so |
| 16:22.51 | Alystin | actually, i'm trying to achieve the same |
| 16:23.21 | Alystin | mainly i try to emulate the sending of more than 6 items |
| 16:23.33 | Alystin | well, at least the feeling |
| 16:23.53 | ZorbaBeta | I can't remember if sending a mail message requires a hardware event |
| 16:23.59 | ZorbaBeta | I don't think it does |
| 16:24.06 | Noshei_ | It does |
| 16:24.07 | Alystin | th error message i get says so^^ |
| 16:24.15 | ZorbaBeta | it does? huh. alright, guess it does |
| 16:24.16 | Noshei_ | I'm 100% positive it does |
| 16:24.18 | ZorbaBeta | probably an anti-spam measure |
| 16:24.19 | Alystin | xD |
| 16:25.02 | Thorarin | Gods Zorba, you still awake? :P |
| 16:25.03 | Noshei_ | thats why I had to add a pop up to confirm sending multiple messages, 1 popup for each additional message after the first |
| 16:25.13 | ZorbaBeta | just going to bed, seriously :V |
| 16:25.20 | Thorarin | Right :) |
| 16:25.34 | ZorbaBeta | noshei, now that I'm thinking about it, when I wrote my batch mail script I just had a "click frantically on this box to send your mails" zone |
| 16:25.46 | Thorarin | hehe |
| 16:25.50 | Alystin | xD |
| 16:26.00 | ZorbaBeta | and the addon would discard or consume hardware events as necessary to get mails out efficiently :V |
| 16:26.18 | Thorarin | I think seebs was talking about making it a mini-game :) |
| 16:26.30 | ZorbaBeta | that could be fun ^^ |
| 16:26.39 | Alystin | hehe "Here, play a game of tetris while we send your mails" xD |
| 16:26.41 | seebs | Heh. |
| 16:26.47 | Alystin | or "shoot the duck" |
| 16:26.54 | seebs | I would really like to be able to send larger numbers of items on a message. |
| 16:27.01 | seebs | Well, get some sleep, Zorba. |
| 16:27.12 | Alystin | yeah, maybe only certain types of items |
| 16:27.13 | seebs | BTW, congrads to the forum team on an excellent and smooth conversion over. |
| 16:27.33 | Alystin | like artifacts xD |
| 16:27.54 | Alystin | Good night, Zorba : |
| 16:28.05 | seebs | I remember one of the early Vanilla WoW addons that basically consumed any old input event to intelligently cast spells. |
| 16:28.19 | seebs | So you'd just bind it to all your movement keys or something and then, hey, as long as you're moving Stuff Happens. |
| 16:28.36 | Thorarin | I did that for my tank rotation :P |
| 16:28.40 | Alystin | oh lol |
| 16:28.42 | Thorarin | Just mash R :P |
| 16:28.59 | Thorarin | Only used it on slacking alt runs, but still :) |
| 16:29.02 | Alystin | i had autorun on r |
| 16:29.08 | seebs | Back when I first started playing WoW, I didn't know what autorun was. |
| 16:29.14 | Thorarin | I usually have autorun on a mouse button |
| 16:29.17 | seebs | So I thought it was some toggle for walking or running, and ignored it. |
| 16:29.20 | Alystin | ^^ |
| 16:29.23 | seebs | And MAN did I hate running places. |
| 16:29.25 | seebs | Hurt my hands. |
| 16:29.35 | Thorarin | lol |
| 16:29.36 | Noshei | lol |
| 16:29.37 | seebs | It simply hadn't occurred to me that there'd be such a thing. |
| 16:29.48 | seebs | And I moved autorun to 'r' back then, and still tend to have it there by habit. |
| 16:29.56 | Alystin | nah my mouse has to be clean... short of interrupts or panick ports^^ |
| 16:30.04 | seebs | So, thanks to the one-frame-chat-lag, I very often try to reply to someone and end up running. |
| 16:30.14 | seebs | … after which I can't stop because the chat window has focus. |
| 16:30.29 | Thorarin | Used to it being "Face target" from DAoC RvR :p |
| 16:30.29 | Alystin | oh i know that... particularly funny during raids |
| 16:30.37 | Thorarin | But Rift has no such thing |
| 16:31.06 | Alystin | er... sometimes i forget that i bound r to autorun... or shift doesn't do its job |
| 16:31.31 | Alystin | then i start running into raid encounters yelling awasdawe |
| 16:31.50 | Thorarin | heh |
| 16:31.51 | Noshei | patiently awaits the delivery of his new computer case :) |
| 16:32.00 | Thorarin | Wondering why you cannot move -.- |
| 16:32.05 | Alystin | Exactly |
| 16:32.41 | Thorarin | I can never be patient after buying something, especially computer hardware :P |
| 16:32.44 | Alystin | until i frantically hamer the enter key, but it's too late already so everynoe thinks i'm drunk and asleep on my keyboard xD |
| 16:33.09 | Thorarin | Hmm, you have a reputation? lol |
| 16:33.12 | Noshei | I got the Corsaid 900D, can't wait for it to get here |
| 16:33.20 | Alystin | me? naah |
| 16:33.37 | Thorarin | Looks nice Noshei |
| 16:33.46 | Alystin | it's way too easy for girls to get a gaming reputation anyway |
| 16:33.52 | seebs | I am really annoyed with my quest for a keyboard. |
| 16:33.55 | Noshei | yeah, it is a pretty nice case, and it is HUGE |
| 16:34.03 | seebs | I want a small keyboard (no keypad) for my windows machine. |
| 16:34.14 | Thorarin | A gaming reputation? I'm not sure I follow |
| 16:34.15 | Noshei | UPS says the package is just over 50 pounds |
| 16:34.22 | Alystin | reputation in games |
| 16:34.28 | seebs | The bluetooth keyboard I found helpfully changes into having a numeric keypad instead of the right half of the alphabet if I turn on numlock. |
| 16:34.41 | seebs | But I have a mouse bound to number pad keys. So they don't work if I don't have numlock on. |
| 16:34.56 | Alystin | first action you take either marks you "cool" or a bitch |
| 16:35.03 | seebs | And I have an Apple bluetooth keyboard, which works fine except that it hasn't got a delete key, only a backspace. |
| 16:35.14 | seebs | Oh, come now, Alystin. |
| 16:35.26 | Alystin | so if you talk while a little drunk in teamspeak, you're automatically "always drunk" ^^ |
| 16:35.35 | seebs | Surely there's nothing bad about people loving you as long as they think you'll have sex with them, and otherwise hating you and calling you names? |
| 16:35.44 | seebs | I mean. It's complimentary! Some guy on the forums said so. |
| 16:35.54 | Alystin | i may be exaggerating a bit, but i don't really mind because ususally i'm on the "cool" side^^ |
| 16:36.00 | Thorarin | Hmm well, I guess that may be true :P |
| 16:36.01 | seebs | Some guy spent like four hours trying to hit on me in Rift the other day. |
| 16:36.12 | Noshei | lol |
| 16:36.18 | seebs | I remain convinced that he's underage, so my sole response was to point out that I was not interested in felony charges. |
| 16:36.20 | Thorarin | Although pretty much the same goes for guys |
| 16:36.22 | seebs | So he accused me of being a lesbian. |
| 16:36.23 | Alystin | i usually respond with "wait until my gf comes online" |
| 16:36.25 | seebs | Also of being a guy. |
| 16:36.29 | seebs | Also he said I was pregnant. |
| 16:36.33 | Alystin | lol |
| 16:36.36 | Noshei | gah seebs, I told you not to tell anyone about that! |
| 16:36.46 | Thorarin | "Oh, friday night raid, our guild leader is probably halfway the whiskey bottle now..." |
| 16:36.50 | seebs | I think if he'd just gone for PMS, we'd have had the complete set of mutually-exclusive theories. |
| 16:36.53 | Thorarin | "Yep" |
| 16:36.56 | Alystin | ^^ |
| 16:37.24 | Noshei | lol |
| 16:38.35 | Alystin | so how exactly do i make the mail functin "consume" a hardware event? I mean, it's not like "Here you go, have this chunk of mouse click", isn't it? ^^ |
| 16:38.42 | seebs | Ahh, that I can answer. |
| 16:38.57 | seebs | If a hardware event triggers an event handler, it *has* "a hardware event". |
| 16:39.16 | seebs | The first thing it executes which "consumes" a hardware event means that that thread of code execution *no longer has* a hardware event. |
| 16:39.40 | seebs | So future calls in that event handler or the things it calls will not work if they need a hardware event. |
| 16:39.47 | Noshei | basically you have to make the use click a button with their mouse. |
| 16:39.53 | Alystin | a-ha. so if the first thing ma clicking does is sending a mail, that helps? |
| 16:40.12 | Noshei | yes and no |
| 16:40.15 | seebs | That would then consume a hardware event. You could continue doing other code in your handler, as long as none of it needed a hardware event. |
| 16:40.29 | Noshei | you can do other stuff, just not stuff that consumes a hardware event |
| 16:40.30 | seebs | So you could set up a "process queue" button which, when pressed, does the "consume a harwdware event" thing. |
| 16:41.16 | Noshei | here is how easymail does this |
| 16:42.19 | Noshei | User click send - first message with 6 attachments send - popup to confirm sending additional attachments - user click OK - next message send with 6 attachments - new popup to confirm sending additional attachements - etc |
| 16:42.56 | Noshei | that continues until all attachments have been sent |
| 16:43.55 | Noshei | there is a bir of rearanging of tables that happens so as to package the message to what is required, but none of that will consume the hardware event. |
| 16:44.55 | seebs | hah |
| 16:45.14 | seebs | so okay, if you have more than 12 months of sub time remaining, you get $5/month in credits for the months past 12 remaining. |
| 16:45.24 | seebs | I know a guy who used to work at Trion. He has a 10-year sub. |
| 16:45.45 | seebs | Which is … roughly $400 worth of credits. |
| 16:46.03 | Noshei | nice |
| 16:46.22 | Noshei | bet it cost him a shit ton more than $400 though |
| 16:46.35 | seebs | No. |
| 16:46.44 | seebs | It was "you work here, you get a 10-year sub". |
| 16:47.20 | seebs | There's some complexity because the devs have to not reveal who they are when they aren't being official. |
| 16:48.00 | Noshei | yeah |
| 16:49.13 | seebs | Whereas, as a green name, I can show off in game. |
| 16:49.26 | seebs | BTW: "the Friendly" means "community ambassador". |
| 16:50.14 | Thorarin | Used to be quite fun |
| 16:50.25 | Thorarin | In DAoC I knew who most of the GMs were |
| 16:50.36 | Thorarin | I even had some of their passwords, lol |
| 16:50.52 | Noshei | well screw that bs seebs, I want my title for Alpha testing SL, dang it |
| 16:50.57 | Thorarin | And ofc they were all day preaching NEVER GIVE ANYONE YOUR PASSWORD :p |
| 16:51.31 | seebs | I never get to alpha test stuff. It is a source of tragedy. |
| 16:51.40 | seebs | I am a natural bug magnet, too. |
| 16:52.27 | Thorarin | That's good then :) |
| 16:52.31 | Thorarin | Less bugs for us |
| 16:52.43 | Noshei | I'm still rather upset that trion hasn't and didn't do anything for the 30 or people that were in the initial Alpha group for SL. |
| 16:53.17 | Noshei | We all put a shit TON of time into SL. Including a ton of time testing specs. |
| 16:53.41 | Noshei | I probably spent an easy 10+ hours just parsing specs on a dummy |
| 16:54.38 | Noshei | not to mention the countless hours spent on the Alpha forums and even more hours leveling toons. |
| 16:54.49 | seebs | Yeah. That seems like it ought to get a title, I agree. |
| 16:55.03 | Noshei | I still want my crucia mount! |
| 16:55.12 | Thorarin | But then so should making addons ;) |
| 16:55.14 | Noshei | ^bit of an inside joke |
| 16:55.35 | seebs | I'ma go post a suggestions thread on it just so it's not only people who would get the title asking. |
| 16:55.41 | Thorarin | They're a good timesink :P |
| 16:56.21 | Noshei | So before SL launched I posted a thread in the private Alpha forums basically saying that I felt trion should reward the Alpha testers somehow. And at some point the suggestion of a Crucia mount was brought up. |
| 16:56.25 | seebs | Huh. I wonder whether we could get an in-game title for addon devs. :) |
| 16:56.54 | Noshei | well if they do forums titles then in-game should be easy enough |
| 16:57.04 | Thorarin | AFK'ish, food |
| 16:57.20 | seebs | So, I've had like five friends try Rift so far this week. |
| 16:57.29 | seebs | So far, four of them have complained about Stripper Armor. |
| 16:57.43 | Noshei | lol |
| 16:57.46 | seebs | I have to admit, it is sort of a legit gripe. See also, [Unseen Chain Greaves]. |
| 16:58.21 | Noshei | I'm ok with it |
| 16:58.54 | Noshei | If I wanted realistic armor I wouldn't be playing a fantasy based game |
| 16:59.06 | seebs | I would be more okay with it if it weren't so very one-sided. |
| 16:59.34 | seebs | With the very one-sided thing, it sorta rubs me the wrong way, because it creates a world in which men wear armor to protect themselves from injury, and women wear armor to highlight their figure. |
| 17:01.01 | Noshei | women just get the armor with the invisible force field built in, so they get the "better" armor really |
| 17:03.46 | seebs | Huh, Best Buy won't let me buy more than one copy of Rift. That's odd. |
| 17:07.00 | seebs | Well, found a place that'd ship me four copies for $3.25 each. … and $15 shipping for the set, which is funny. |
| 17:07.36 | Noshei | at some point I'm going to convince one of the decs to go to daglar and tell him "Noshei wanted me to remind you about that crucia mount for the Alpha testers" |
| 17:07.47 | Noshei | wow |
| 17:08.03 | Noshei | *devs |
| 17:08.28 | seebs | I have been unable to find anyplace else that will sell (1) more than one copy (2) for $10 or less. Meh. |
| 17:32.52 | Alystin | personally i think women should get some kind of natural aggro reduce... as a balance to essentially nothing lifesaving in terms of clothing |
| 17:33.26 | Alystin | http://www.tor.com/blogs/2013/05/boob-plate-armor-would-kill-you |
| 17:33.39 | Alystin | and yes, i kinda know this first hand ^^ |
| 17:34.27 | Alystin | kk i'll refrain from continuing to bother you for now... but i'll be back. *evil laugh* |
| 18:02.17 | Thorarin | back :) |
| 18:05.24 | *** part/#riftuidev Alystin (~Alystin@ip-5-146-170-242.unitymediagroup.de) |
| 18:10.39 | *** join/#riftuidev Imhothar (miranda@ppp-93-104-168-39.dynamic.mnet-online.de) |
| 18:14.48 | Imhothar | huh can't log into forums with my old account? |
| 18:15.13 | Thorarin | Ehm, haven't needed to log in yet |
| 18:15.48 | Thorarin | Seems to work here |
| 18:16.48 | Imhothar | agh, should type my password slower |
| 18:16.49 | Imhothar | nvm |
| 18:21.31 | *** join/#riftuidev Wildtide (~quassel@host31-52-98-144.range31-52.btcentralplus.com) |
| 18:33.24 | *** join/#riftuidev Imhothar (miranda@ppp-93-104-168-39.dynamic.mnet-online.de) |
| 19:45.47 | Wildtide | hey ZorbaBeta, you're gonna need a bigger monitor soon to fit all your desktop icons on :D |
| 20:06.28 | Imhothar | what's that thing with the PTS offline? |
| 20:07.59 | Noshei | Imhothar: they took it offline so they could get all of the credits straight for tomorrow |
| 20:08.18 | Imhothar | credits? |
| 20:08.43 | Noshei | yeah any credits you spent on the PTS you get refunded +100% extra |
| 20:09.12 | Imhothar | what credits? did I miss something |
| 20:09.22 | Noshei | credits are what you buy with money |
| 20:09.31 | Noshei | and spend in the new store |
| 20:09.48 | Imhothar | why is the damn store available on PTS |
| 20:10.01 | Imhothar | sigh |
| 20:10.13 | Noshei | testing |
| 20:11.05 | Noshei | the bigger problem is that trion has their test shard connected to their live environment. We all know that is stupid and horrible |
| 20:11.33 | Imhothar | great |
| 20:11.54 | Noshei | wonders where the fuck is UPS! I want my new computer case! |
| 20:12.08 | Imhothar | Wildtide where did you see Zorba's desktop? I feel like missing out on all the good stuff |
| 20:12.08 | Thorarin | strong thread highjacking Noshei ;) |
| 20:12.19 | Thorarin | hijacking too |
| 20:12.25 | Thorarin | *need coffee* |
| 20:13.08 | Baanano | imhothar: http://www.twitch.tv/zorbathut/b/415498025 |
| 20:13.09 | Wildtide | Imhothar: i have a secret webcam installed in ZorbaBeta's house |
| 20:13.20 | Imhothar | I knew it |
| 20:13.25 | Wildtide | beat me to it, Baanano :) |
| 20:13.30 | Imhothar | Wildtide is the real PRISM |
| 20:13.31 | Wildtide | was just finding the link |
| 20:13.33 | Wildtide | lol |
| 20:13.43 | Imhothar | spying on game devs from the UK |
| 20:13.52 | Noshei | hijacking what Thorarin? |
| 20:14.09 | Thorarin | KaruulAlert thread :P |
| 20:14.49 | Wildtide | yeah, we're gonna totally derail it :D |
| 20:14.50 | Imhothar | that twitch thing won't be working for me |
| 20:15.01 | Imhothar | anyway, espionage ftw |
| 20:15.05 | Wildtide | hehe |
| 20:15.08 | Imhothar | and since we;re hijacking already |
| 20:15.16 | Imhothar | it's great the US government knows more about me than our own |
| 20:15.38 | Noshei | got in CQ 2 seconds before timer ended |
| 20:15.43 | Wildtide | nice |
| 20:15.51 | Noshei | your suprised Imhothar |
| 20:15.59 | Imhothar | not really, no |
| 20:16.14 | Imhothar | all foreigners get their finger prints scanned when visiting the US |
| 20:16.22 | Imhothar | all 10 fingers |
| 20:16.31 | Imhothar | I only have my index fingers on my ID |
| 20:16.54 | Noshei | thats a bit crazy |
| 20:17.00 | Imhothar | it's no news the US treats every foreigner as a criminal ;) |
| 20:17.20 | Noshei | not just foreigners |
| 20:17.50 | Imhothar | yeah, but US citizen don't get their fingerprints recorded until committing a crime |
| 20:17.52 | Imhothar | (at least officially) |
| 20:18.37 | Imhothar | ahh, I got to do something else to distract me from this topic or I could go on ranting forever |
| 20:19.14 | Wildtide | watch Zorba break Notepad++ on Twitch :) |
| 20:19.37 | Imhothar | the twitch thing doesn't work |
| 20:19.41 | Wildtide | how come? |
| 20:19.45 | Imhothar | dunno |
| 20:19.52 | Imhothar | get a blank gray screen |
| 20:20.18 | Noshei | which browser? |
| 20:20.30 | Imhothar | chrome |
| 20:20.38 | Imhothar | probably a cookie thing, I got them disabled |
| 20:20.55 | Wildtide | tbh, it's disappointing anyway. contrary to popular belief, it turns out Zorba's only got one head |
| 20:21.03 | Noshei | might be a flash thing |
| 20:21.09 | Noshei | they use adobe flash |
| 20:21.45 | Wildtide | and i've yet to see him lose it and start beating his head on the keyboard... |
| 20:21.46 | Imhothar | that did the trick |
| 20:22.02 | Noshei | flash? |
| 20:22.06 | Imhothar | cookies |
| 20:22.31 | Imhothar | that's a big ass screen |
| 20:24.33 | Imhothar | from the amount of head movement I gather it's not the only screen on his desk |
| 20:24.46 | Imhothar | oow inception |
| 20:25.52 | Wildtide | inception? |
| 20:26.23 | Imhothar | when he opens hit twitch channel and you see an infinite loop in the video |
| 20:26.56 | Imhothar | is that still live or am I watching a recording here |
| 20:27.09 | Wildtide | recording |
| 20:27.14 | Imhothar | ahh |
| 20:28.40 | Imhothar | makes me wonder whether some rift players would watch us develop addons |
| 20:30.15 | seebs | I have done live coding demos a couple of times. |
| 20:30.25 | seebs | Once by accident. |
| 20:30.34 | Noshei | lol |
| 20:30.34 | Wildtide | i'm interested in seeing the way people work; the tools and methods they use, etc... but i have to admit, i would struggle to sit and watch for hours |
| 20:30.38 | Wildtide | rofl seebs |
| 20:30.43 | seebs | Loooong ago (like, 1997), I did a presentation at work about how CGI worked. |
| 20:30.50 | seebs | And I didn't have a demo, so I wrote one on the fly in ksh. |
| 20:32.21 | Wildtide | CGI in ksh? |
| 20:32.57 | Wildtide | as in korn shell? |
| 20:33.03 | seebs | HTTP scripts, not computer graphics. But yeah. |
| 20:33.06 | seebs | #!/bin/ksh |
| 20:33.13 | seebs | echo "Content-Type: text/http" |
| 20:33.15 | seebs | give or take. |
| 20:33.22 | Wildtide | ah, cool :) |
| 20:33.23 | Noshei | so I'm updating Firefall right now |
| 20:33.29 | seebs | What's Firefall? |
| 20:33.37 | Noshei | and the updater is pulling 55 Mbps download |
| 20:33.51 | Noshei | mmofps |
| 20:34.05 | Noshei | still in beta |
| 20:39.37 | Thorarin | lol @ Zorba Yak shaving about backspace key :) |
| 20:39.54 | Imhothar | well I usually don't talk while coding so it would be rather boring |
| 20:55.07 | Thorarin | Neither do I, added to that most of the time I spend making typos ;) |
| 20:58.06 | Thorarin | I've done some live coding demo a few weeks ago, went pretty well :> |
| 20:58.32 | Thorarin | Other than the laptop being too slow, most of the time I was waiting for tools :/ |
| 20:59.41 | Thorarin | But I tried most of it out beforehand, used some addins to generate some code :P |
| 21:06.25 | Wildtide | sigh... my unit-frame rendering CPU usage has gone through the roof, and as far as i know I've made no changes to cause it |
| 21:07.42 | Wildtide | really wish we could see inside that "render time" statistic |
| 21:09.18 | Wildtide | i've also had to hack in a fake SetEffectGlow, and everything looks horrible :) |
| 21:09.31 | Thorarin | hehe |
| 21:09.38 | Thorarin | For lack of a PTS? :P |
| 21:09.40 | Wildtide | yup |
| 21:10.12 | Thorarin | I haven't looked at the effects yet, can I find the docs anywhere? |
| 21:10.25 | Thorarin | The forum post was a bit terse :) |
| 21:10.26 | Wildtide | i ripped out all of the 4-fonts-per-bit-of-text stuff, and replaced them with glows |
| 21:10.28 | Wildtide | hehe |
| 21:13.14 | Wildtide | http://www.seebs.net/rift/pts/Text_index.html#Text:SetEffectGlow |
| 21:13.31 | Thorarin | I think I use up to 6 extra text fields to do the shadows :S |
| 21:13.58 | Wildtide | i went with 3 shadow texts in a triangle shape, plus the main text |
| 21:14.01 | Thorarin | Or well, the outline |
| 21:14.06 | Noshei | goes and opens his new computer case, that finally arrived! |
| 21:14.07 | Wildtide | but it's all gone now |
| 21:14.10 | Wildtide | gz :D |
| 21:15.49 | Thorarin | I guess I will still need multiple text fields |
| 21:16.03 | Thorarin | With both an outline AND a shadow |
| 21:17.23 | Thorarin | I'm kinda glad that I chose to release a version that makes limited use of 2.3 |
| 21:17.44 | Thorarin | I'll make a 2.3 optimized version later :p |
| 21:18.03 | Thorarin | For now it at least runs on 2.2 as well :) |
| 21:24.47 | Noshei | oh you didn't get a chance to play around with the glow effect Thorarin? |
| 21:30.39 | Wildtide | i haven't played with blur - does that blur the main text? |
| 21:31.10 | Wildtide | as in SetEffectBlur(), i know what blur does to the glow |
| 21:33.12 | Thorarin | I was doing some other stuff first :) |
| 21:33.43 | Thorarin | wonders why Zorbas project dir is called C:werk |
| 21:35.59 | Noshei | I didn't play with blur at all Wildtide |
| 21:36.22 | Noshei | but I'm guessing it blurs the actual text |
| 21:36.28 | Wildtide | aye, would make sense |
| 21:36.36 | Wildtide | not sure why you'd want to do it |
| 21:36.51 | Wildtide | i never even wondered until now, when the PTS is down :) |
| 21:37.23 | Wildtide | Lego LotR is £5 on Steam... tempted to try it |
| 21:38.51 | Noshei | you could do a really cool animated text squence where it starte way blured on the x-axis and huge and shrinks and sharpens up, like when you complete a quest |
| 21:39.07 | Noshei | how rift displayed the Completed text |
| 21:39.19 | Wildtide | oh yeah, that could be pretty cool |
| 21:39.32 | Noshei | yeah |
| 21:40.00 | Noshei | can even do the glow behind the text as well |
| 21:40.13 | Noshei | though it would take a decent little function to do it |
| 21:41.57 | Noshei | The harvest left no food for you to eat |
| 21:41.58 | Noshei | You cannibal, you meat-eater, you see |
| 21:42.16 | Noshei | good song |
| 21:43.15 | Imhothar | this game here has a nice comic as "intro" http://christophermpark.blogspot.de/2013/05/nick-trujillo-presents-skyward-collapse_23.html |
| 22:04.56 | seebs | That game looks fun. |
| 22:05.11 | Imhothar | it's pretty difficult |
| 22:06.10 | seebs | I can live with that. |
| 23:47.06 | Wildtide | ZorbaBeta: are you aware of any changes that could be increasing CPU load for rendering frames? |
| 23:47.25 | Wildtide | i've been seeing high numbers for quite a while, but not really thought much of it |
| 23:48.20 | Wildtide | but i've just created a new raid frame template which has nothing except for a single health bar, not even a name, and i'm getting 5% render CPU |
| 23:48.36 | Wildtide | i'm sure that's a lot higher than i used to get |
| 23:49.29 | Wildtide | either that, or you've optimised the client so well that the relative time to draw our addons now looks lots higher :) |