| 15:02.50 | *** join/#riftuidev purl (~purl@rikers.org) |
| 15:02.50 | *** topic/#riftuidev is http://pastebin.com for code snippets || PIL: http://www.lua.org/pil || Rift AddOn Policy: http://t.co/7xXd4LL || AddOn Wiki: wiki.riftui.com/ || RiftUI.com || rift.curse.com || Git now avail on RiftUI http://bit.ly/xggloz || Don't forget to change your clocks tonight (if your Country does Daylight Savings), and change your Smoke & Carbon Monoxide Detector batteries |
| 15:27.14 | *** join/#riftuidev Kreiri (~kreiri@193.108.249.252) |
| 15:38.23 | *** join/#riftuidev Kreiri (~kreiri@193.108.249.252) |
| 16:00.10 | *** join/#riftuidev Mere (~Mere@buzzbee.plus.com) |
| 16:03.19 | Mere | Hi |
| 16:47.35 | *** join/#riftuidev Mere (~Mere@buzzbee.plus.com) |
| 16:50.23 | *** join/#riftuidev Nivlix (~Nivlix@pool-72-84-80-142.nrflva.fios.verizon.net) |
| 17:27.58 | *** join/#riftuidev Kreiri (~Miranda@109.227.113.100) |
| 17:38.46 | Mere | hmm, anyone else found they get coin locked quite a bit when playing with addons? |
| 17:41.55 | Nivlix | i havent yet, but im always on the same PC and IP address so |
| 17:42.04 | Nivlix | anyways im out for a bit, be back this evening |
| 17:57.08 | *** join/#riftuidev starlon (~starlon@tx-71-2-120-54.dhcp.embarqhsd.net) |
| 18:02.05 | seebs | I haven't. Except in that I tend to take my laptop out places. |
| 18:12.31 | Mere | yeah, I just had it come up on my desktop, I logged out and back on |
| 18:12.43 | Mere | odd given that account has an authenticator on it as well... |
| 18:18.36 | seebs | Coin lock happens regardless of authenticator. |
| 18:18.42 | seebs | And while it is sort of annoying, I gotta say: |
| 18:18.59 | seebs | Since coin lock went in and got debugged, the total number of people I've talked to in Rift who lost all their stuff to an account break-in? Zero. |
| 18:19.01 | Nivlix|afk | i like the fact that its there honestly |
| 18:19.05 | seebs | In WoW it happened to one or two friends a week. |
| 18:19.47 | Mere | I agree it's a great feature |
| 18:20.09 | Mere | just puzzled to see it trigger on a re-login from the same IP & computer |
| 18:20.35 | Mere | and yeah in WoW we constantly told guildies get an authenticator... |
| 18:21.59 | Mere | *sigh* I'm going to end up spending more time writing a config UI then on the actual addon body |
| 18:22.05 | ZorbaBeta | it's generally a much better solution to solve the problem conclusively if possible :V |
| 18:22.21 | ZorbaBeta | here's a fun one: how often have you seen the old "hit alt-f4 to get epic gear" troll in-game? |
| 18:22.36 | Mere | yes |
| 18:22.53 | Mere | or in bgs, : reported you afk, type /afk to remove the flag |
| 18:22.53 | ZorbaBeta | I'm gonna guess the answer is "never", because it doesn't work in Rift. alt-f4 brings up the 20-second logout dialog. |
| 18:23.29 | Mere | WoW strangly has these ancient flaws that they don't fix.... |
| 18:23.45 | Torhal|work | WoW has outstanding bugs which are 6 years old. |
| 18:23.52 | Torhal|work | SImple UI bugs, even. |
| 18:24.03 | Mere | rift appears to have gone, well that's rubbish, here's the right way to handle it |
| 18:24.10 | Torhal|work | Just some Lua tweaks, which members of the community have pointed out/submitted. |
| 18:24.19 | ZorbaBeta | in fairness, the only reason Rift doesn't have outstanding six-year-old-bugs is because Rift isn't six years old - it's real easy to end up with bugs that are simply not worth the effort to fix |
| 18:24.23 | Mere | coin lock is so simple a concept... |
| 18:24.31 | ZorbaBeta | I've got a few bugs on my list that I will probably never get to |
| 18:24.54 | Torhal|work | I just blame seebs. |
| 18:24.55 | Torhal|work | :D |
| 18:24.56 | Mere | heh, I've shipped products that probably now count as 12 year old bugs ;) |
| 18:26.15 | seebs | The thing about that alt+f4 thing... |
| 18:26.30 | seebs | It doesn't happen on Macs. So I had all my keybindings and stuff set up in WoW. Been using them for years. |
| 18:26.39 | seebs | And I ended up switching to Linux, using the Windows port. |
| 18:26.48 | seebs | And suddenly I could NOT heal myself. The game would just crash. |
| 18:26.55 | seebs | Hint: Self-cast modifier was alt. |
| 18:27.11 | Nivlix|afk | got my pet frame working for the most part, need to add the text and such, and find a better place to put my cast bar since the pet frame is now in the way |
| 18:27.24 | seebs | I would love the option of completely disabling the special treatment of alt+f4, so I could just use it for keybindings. :) |
| 18:28.14 | seebs | Mere: It is odd for it to retrigger from the same IP. A few people have had that, and the standing thing seems to be "let support know when this happened". They then stare at their logs, cast chicken bones, and Change Something. |
| 18:28.38 | Nivlix|afk | Zorba, I would like to make a suggestion if i may |
| 18:28.40 | seebs | I agree that Rift will likely end up with some very old bugs, but anything significantly annoying seems to get fixed. |
| 18:28.57 | Mere | or those that find the bug annoy significantly? |
| 18:29.19 | seebs | The bugs that currently annoy me most are the auto-flag thing, which is new, the armor color changes, which is very rare, and that sometimes when you change roles after gaining a level you don't see your new points until you refresh the role interface. |
| 18:29.40 | Nivlix|afk | dont want access to any calcs, but would it be possible to get access to the end result on the %s for stuff like dodge and crit? knowing the ratings is great, but it doesnt do much to tell you what that rating is actually giving you |
| 18:30.00 | seebs | The auto-flag thing is, I'm pretty sure, less than six months old, and appears to be moderately sporadic. |
| 18:30.02 | ZorbaBeta | nivlix, hmm, is that being shown in the base UI right now? |
| 18:30.10 | seebs | It is. |
| 18:30.17 | ZorbaBeta | I'll toss that into my todo then |
| 18:30.20 | seebs | Mouseover crit rating or hit rating, and you see the numbers. |
| 18:30.31 | seebs | BTW, this reminds me of a peeve from WoW land. |
| 18:30.43 | seebs | Mouseover armor, get "reduces damage by X% against targets of <your level>". |
| 18:30.53 | seebs | Well, yeah, but what about attackers of OTHER levels? |
| 18:31.11 | Mere | I know they changed hit to cover other levels |
| 18:31.15 | ZorbaBeta | I seem to recall that WoW finally started showing the stats versus bosses as well |
| 18:31.23 | Mere | and I think it's just a flat damage reduction |
| 18:31.32 | Nivlix|afk | ok thanks zorba, gotta run, be back later |
| 18:31.35 | seebs | That's an improvement. :) |
| 18:31.38 | Mere | wow keeps on simplifing stuff |
| 18:31.39 | ZorbaBeta | nivlix, np |
| 18:31.52 | seebs | Hmm. I found some gorgeous UI problem recently, but I can't remember what it was. |
| 18:31.56 | ZorbaBeta | mere, armor was flat damage reduction, hit and expertise were a little stranger |
| 18:32.06 | Mere | I expect to see pandaland needing 1 stat |
| 18:32.24 | Mere | hit definetly shows your level, +1, +2, +3 |
| 18:32.43 | seebs | I am unhappy with the improved tooltips in Rift, because they make it really hard to explain the game to people who don't happen to remember what the numbers were. |
| 18:32.49 | Mere | although it doesn't tell you the cap, just your chance to miss, once you reach the cap it's says 0, so you've no clue you're over cap |
| 18:33.05 | seebs | The tooltips for LGV and LBV are identical except for the "intended for tank healing" language. |
| 18:33.27 | seebs | And it turns out, the difference between 110% of damage and 30% of damage is not well reflected by "a small portion of the damage done". |
| 18:35.30 | Mere | mmm, that's not really small... |
| 18:36.00 | seebs | Yeah. But both tooltips say exactly the same thiing. |
| 18:36.04 | seebs | thing. |
| 18:36.18 | seebs | Similarly, we no longer know how big, or how long, the damage buff from stalker phase is, etc. |
| 18:36.31 | ZorbaBeta | chloromancer's been problematic from the beginning just thanks to how different it is |
| 18:36.37 | seebs | It's arguably better in that the previous tooltips were occasionally incorrect. :) |
| 18:36.44 | ZorbaBeta | that's always what happens when you're doing something really novel |
| 18:36.59 | seebs | Yeah. Also misleading; unless you have nature's touch, and probably also 3/3 natural fusion, LBV is *worse* for tank healing until about level 40. |
| 18:37.03 | Mere | thought the stalker thing showed up on the tooltip of the buff? |
| 18:37.06 | seebs | Even with NT, it's probably worse until the late 20s. |
| 18:37.40 | seebs | It only really gets good past 32, though, when you have the 1.5% improvement per level in base healing from LBV. |
| 18:38.27 | seebs | It can be "fixed" by lowering the rate of improvement and moving some of that into the base heals of LBV to start with, then LBV is a good choice for tank healing if you have Synthesis pretty much. |
| 18:39.20 | seebs | BTW, Zorba, an amusing thing, speaking of relatively novel stuff: |
| 18:39.34 | seebs | Back in 2010, before I'd ever heard of Rift, a friend of mine and I attempted to invent a Melee Healer. |
| 18:40.07 | seebs | We ended up designing what was at the time conceived of as a WoW class that could either heal or tank, where the healing procced as splash heals and self-heals from attacks. And if you specced for tank, that was a big part of your threat generation. |
| 18:40.37 | seebs | When I was going over the list of things I wanted in WoW that Rift had in beta, that was the one that really shocked me. |
| 18:42.58 | Mere | hmm, would it be acceptable for a test addon to have a commandline config, rather than a pretty ui? |
| 18:43.06 | Mere | I mean alpha not test |
| 18:46.20 | seebs | I don't see why not. |
| 18:46.27 | seebs | BTW, that is a lot of what LibGetOpt is for. |
| 18:48.08 | Mere | hmm, ah another library without a license on it.... |
| 18:49.21 | Mere | oh now, it does have terms :) |
| 18:52.42 | Torhal|work | No license is automatic All Rights Reserved. |
| 18:52.46 | seebs | It does! I was careful to ensure that my libraries have specific terms. |
| 18:53.00 | seebs | Which are as close to "do whatever you want, don't bother me" as I can get them. :) |
| 18:53.01 | Mere | it does, it's hiding in the bottom of the readme :) |
| 18:53.24 | Mere | as torhal said, by default it's all rights reserverd, in which case can't redist it |
| 18:53.33 | Mere | which most addons will for libraries :) |
| 18:54.09 | seebs | Yeah. There should be a nice obvious COPYRIGHT file or something. If not, remind me after working hours and I'll improve it and upload cleaned up versions. |
| 18:54.11 | Mere | (I once went through 2-3 months of license audit of opensource code for work, was not a good time, and has made me paranoid about these things :) |
| 18:54.20 | seebs | LGO needs a pass anyway to add quoting options. |
| 18:55.18 | Torhal|work | Well, unless an author specifies a license (at least in WoW), the All Rights Reserved for libs usually implies that it's okay to redistribute IN an AddOn, but not as a 'Hey, I wrote this!' type deal. |
| 18:55.40 | Mere | yeah, try having that conversation with a lawyer :) |
| 18:55.48 | Torhal|work | Hehe, yeah |
| 18:56.00 | Torhal|work | Community convention, but I'm sure someone could find a way to futz it up. |
| 18:56.05 | Mere | about a product we're already shipping... |
| 18:56.14 | Torhal|work | Yar |
| 18:56.29 | Mere | well in theory you redist an all rights reserved, you're now sueable for copyright infringement |
| 18:56.45 | Mere | along with IP of some kind and a whole mess |
| 18:57.33 | Mere | that's why I want to find out the role icon names in the data files, so I can use them, rather than my current method of a letter with a background of the right(ish) colour |
| 18:58.36 | Mere | seebs: any objections if I bump the version in the .toc to 0.5 to match everything else saying .5 ? :) |
| 18:58.52 | seebs | Huh. Lemme go look. |
| 18:59.01 | seebs | It's possible that this denotes a Bug. |
| 18:59.19 | seebs | LGO was last updated before some of the changes to my addon distribution code. |
| 18:59.37 | Mere | ah |
| 18:59.46 | Mere | the change log says 0.5 |
| 19:00.01 | seebs | huh |
| 19:00.12 | seebs | ohh |
| 19:00.18 | seebs | my, I'm up to 0.8 internally. |
| 19:00.36 | seebs | And of course, the version numbers disagree with the changelog, which says .05 instead of .5 |
| 19:00.57 | Mere | lol |
| 19:01.12 | Mere | too many places with version numbers :_) |
| 19:01.15 | Mere | :)* |
| 19:01.30 | seebs | It's autogenerated, in theory, now. And I just found an error in the current readme. |
| 19:03.08 | Mere | hmm, am I right in think it's possible to make getopt work with multiple tables, eg options for different subcommands? |
| 19:03.36 | Mere | basically I parse the first param, pick the right options table and throw it into getopt? |
| 19:03.46 | seebs | Huh! |
| 19:03.56 | seebs | Oh, that's interesting. I had not thought of this, but in principle, yes. |
| 19:04.16 | seebs | You could take the first word out of leftover_args, strip that from leftover, and pass it to getopt again. |
| 19:04.30 | Mere | well with only one registered /cmd, I want to be able to process different config areas |
| 19:04.42 | seebs | Interesting idiom. I hadn't thought of this, but it's probably worth adding real support for later. |
| 19:04.45 | Mere | eg, spells have no interest in buff names, or layout widths |
| 19:05.22 | Mere | so /mhf spells --button left --modifier none "spellname" |
| 19:05.36 | seebs | New 0.9 version up. |
| 19:06.01 | Mere | and /mhf layouts --add --name "Tankers" --roles "tank" |
| 19:06.12 | Mere | would go through different tables |
| 19:06.15 | seebs | Yeah. If you did that, you'd initially get leftover_args = { "spells", "--button", "left", "--modifier", "none", "spellname" } |
| 19:06.43 | seebs | And come to think of it. Grab the first one, table.remove(leftover_args, 1), and you can pass the resulting table into a getopt with a different options table. |
| 19:06.55 | Mere | yeah that's what I'm thinking |
| 19:07.14 | seebs | Because it already works with a table of arguments. It takes either a string or a table. Neat! |
| 19:07.18 | Mere | I don't want to try and handle 3-4 different sets of options as one huge table |
| 19:07.41 | seebs | Makes sense. |
| 19:07.52 | seebs | Really clever. I may update the Readme to point this out. |
| 19:08.04 | seebs | I mean, half the point of this is just the dequoting stuff. |
| 19:08.20 | Mere | yeah, even just handlnig quotes saves me work ;) |
| 19:08.32 | Mere | I'm a developer I'll do massive amounts of work to be lazy :) |
| 19:08.38 | seebs | Note: Currently it knows about Unix-style " and \. It doesn't know about ' yet. |
| 19:08.53 | Torhal|work | ~lazy |
| 19:08.53 | purl | Hard work may pay off later, but LAZINESS pays off now! Work hard at hardly working! |
| 19:09.00 | Torhal|work | ~laziness |
| 19:09.00 | purl | LAZINESS: The quality that makes you go to great effort to reduce overall energy expenditure. It makes you write labor-saving programs that other people will find useful, and document what you wrote so you don't have to answer so many questions about it. Hence, the first great virtue of a programmer. |
| 19:10.00 | seebs | There is a design flaw, in that leftover shows the text after dequoting, which may not be what you really want. |
| 19:10.18 | seebs | But leftover_args is nearly always what you want. |
| 19:10.23 | Torhal|work | ~hubris |
| 19:10.23 | purl | HUBRIS: Excessive pride, the sort of thing Zeus zaps you for. Also the quality that makes you write (and maintain) programs that other people won't want to say bad things about. Hence, the third great virtue of a programmer. |
| 19:10.42 | Torhal|work | I forget the second. |
| 19:10.43 | Torhal|work | Damn it. |
| 19:11.11 | Mere | lol |
| 19:11.22 | starlon | Anyone know how I'm supposed to launch a movie in Netflix for Android? |
| 19:11.33 | starlon | I click and the screen dims. |
| 19:11.41 | starlon | Then I click again and it lights up again. |
| 19:11.51 | starlon | None of that launches the movie. |
| 19:12.16 | starlon | oh had to keep tapping over and over lol |
| 19:12.50 | Mere | the faster you tap, the quicker it downloads? |
| 19:15.10 | seebs | Starlon: Usually if I click on the play-looking icon in the middle it plays. |
| 19:34.48 | starlon | There was no play button in the middle. |
| 19:35.07 | starlon | And my tablet's too slow to play movies.:( |
| 19:36.51 | Mere | seebs: getting an error from libgetopt |
| 19:37.45 | Mere | libgetopt.lua:144: bad argument #2 to 'sub' number expected, got no value |
| 19:38.10 | starlon | Now it's popping up. Guess my tablet's crap. heh |
| 19:38.36 | starlon | I think it was an app called Cooltool. |
| 19:38.52 | Mere | heh, I keep thinking about tablets, but there's always a new shinier one coming "real soon now" |
| 19:38.55 | starlon | I uninstalled it. It runs in the background and places system stats up in top-left corner. |
| 19:39.03 | starlon | No it's still slow. :\ |
| 19:39.37 | starlon | I probably ruined the tablet with my app development. |
| 19:39.53 | starlon | because it used to play fine |
| 19:40.03 | Mere | lol |
| 19:40.04 | starlon | I tried it out when I first got it. |
| 19:40.30 | Mere | someone was shocked my phone can last more than a day, they've installed lots of battery saving stuff, it dies in about 12 hours.... |
| 19:40.39 | Mere | mine is pretty much clean of any of that crap... |
| 19:40.52 | starlon | My friend said to wait to get a Nexus S 4g because they'll be cheaper. I told him then I'd be waiting for the next one to get cheap. |
| 19:41.47 | Mere | yeah, I've got the nexus |
| 19:41.51 | Mere | got it the week it came out |
| 19:42.07 | seebs | hmm |
| 19:42.10 | Mere | figured if I'm jupming on the bandwagon of smartphones I may as well go with one of the better ones at the time |
| 19:42.12 | seebs | Mere: Usage example? |
| 19:42.42 | Mere | seebs: think the line should be o_f[2], not o_f.sub(2) |
| 19:42.48 | starlon | rebooted and it seems fine now |
| 19:43.06 | Torhal|work | The logic there escapes me. |
| 19:43.12 | Kreiri | Have you seen shady goods merchants on your servers yet? |
| 19:43.23 | Torhal|work | I"m going to install this software, which will use MORE CPU, in order to save battery..." |
| 19:43.41 | Torhal|work | Mere: Send your friends here - http://www.downloadmoreram.com/ |
| 19:43.45 | Mere | seebs: options are {{"name", "n", ":", "layout name},} |
| 19:43.46 | starlon | hmm? |
| 19:43.56 | Mere | and then used -? to display them |
| 19:43.59 | starlon | Torhal|work: Are you referring to my comments? |
| 19:44.16 | Torhal|work | starlon: [14:40:30] <Mere> someone was shocked my phone can last more than a day, they've installed lots of battery saving stuff, it dies in about 12 hours.... |
| 19:44.36 | Mere | doh, mis-typed, "layout name" needs closing " |
| 19:44.39 | starlon | I didn't type that. |
| 19:44.41 | starlon | wtf |
| 19:44.46 | Torhal|work | starlon: I know you didn't |
| 19:44.48 | Torhal|work | Read it again |
| 19:44.54 | starlon | Oh |
| 19:44.54 | Torhal|work | Mere typed it! |
| 19:44.57 | Torhal|work | lol |
| 19:45.02 | starlon | I thought I was responding to Mere |
| 19:45.05 | starlon | lol |
| 19:45.08 | Mere | lies, it was starlon, clearly says it ;) |
| 19:45.12 | Torhal|work | Hah |
| 19:45.14 | starlon | lol |
| 19:45.27 | starlon | I was lost. I thought you were talking about Cooltool. |
| 19:46.12 | starlon | Now that audio doesn't match up with lip synch. :( |
| 19:46.28 | starlon | Oh well. |
| 19:46.29 | Mere | you mentioned cooltool, I mentioned friend installing battery saving app that didn't, torhal then said you can download ram :) |
| 19:46.45 | starlon | Ah I see it now. |
| 19:46.55 | starlon | <-- ID10T |
| 19:47.38 | seebs | I have almost never used the options-table mode. :) |
| 19:47.41 | seebs | I'll look into it. |
| 19:48.05 | Mere | seebs: ah I was going to be lazy and put them all in a table, as you'll handily print out a help table from that :) |
| 19:48.30 | *** join/#riftuidev kergoth (~kergoth@covenant.kergoth.com) |
| 19:48.32 | seebs | Yes, it should work. |
| 19:48.55 | kergoth | i just managed to install a combination of addons that makes rift crash at login, that was fun |
| 19:49.13 | Mere | I think it's just a typo, it's looking if the option takes params, and if it takes multiple, so is trying to look for '+' |
| 19:49.45 | seebs | o_f is the flags field, which should be ":" in your case, and o_f.sub(2) should be an empty string, I thought? |
| 19:49.56 | seebs | ohh |
| 19:50.01 | seebs | string.sub(o_f, 2) |
| 19:50.06 | seebs | or o_f:sub(2) |
| 19:50.32 | seebs | it's not "foo".sub, it's "foo":sub |
| 19:50.42 | seebs | because sub needs the first argument to be the string to operate on. |
| 19:51.00 | Mere | same on the line below it then, o_f.sub(2,2) |
| 19:51.06 | seebs | Yes. |
| 19:51.10 | seebs | My bad! |
| 19:51.38 | ZorbaBeta | kergoth, what's the combination? |
| 19:51.41 | Mere | seems long options don't work from a table |
| 19:52.06 | kergoth | ZorbaBeta: isolating now |
| 19:52.30 | ZorbaBeta | cool, thanks :) |
| 19:52.32 | Mere | it's easy to crash rift with addons |
| 19:52.44 | kergoth | heh, that's sad, if true |
| 19:52.52 | Mere | seems that any addon that makes rift spend too long in lua causes rift to crash |
| 19:52.53 | ZorbaBeta | mere, it's easy to do it intentionally, but if it's happening accidentally it's probably my fault |
| 19:53.05 | seebs | heya, kergoth! |
| 19:53.12 | seebs | Welcome to rift. :) |
| 19:53.13 | Mere | I tried to dump the current docs to log, and it crashed out... |
| 19:53.17 | kergoth | seebs: :) |
| 19:53.18 | ZorbaBeta | mere, yeah, I haven't come up with a good fix for that yet. |
| 19:53.22 | seebs | Mere: See my DocExport addon. |
| 19:53.25 | ZorbaBeta | Return within a few seconds. Coroutines help with this. |
| 19:53.44 | seebs | back later |
| 19:53.49 | Mere | seebs: another addon :) |
| 19:53.50 | ZorbaBeta | mere, there's a few addons that cause Trion Dev Tools's /dump to infinite-loop and crash. I've actually got a fix for that going through the pipeline |
| 19:54.16 | Mere | yeah, it was /dump that did it, it was fine when I used it without /log, but with /log |
| 19:54.25 | ZorbaBeta | huh, that's a bit odd |
| 19:54.28 | Mere | I suspect the i/o overhead made it take longer |
| 19:54.34 | ZorbaBeta | yeah, I could believe that |
| 19:54.38 | Mere | I didn't retry it though |
| 19:54.49 | ZorbaBeta | do it on an SSD next time? :V |
| 19:54.55 | Mere | well I'm sad panda if it did, I've got SSDs stripped.... |
| 19:55.04 | ZorbaBeta | (really I just need to come up with a way to fix the performance watchdog issues) |
| 19:55.40 | Mere | I guess the problem is how do you achieve that, although I guess the worst case is you end up forcing a /reloadui rather than crashing |
| 19:59.39 | Mere | seebs: if you're there, line 304 also needs fixing, currently reads: if GetOpt.find(long) then should read, if GetOpt.find(options, long) then |
| 20:02.07 | ZorbaBeta | mere, if I'm reading the docs right, luajit allows a separate thread to enable debug hooks in an environment |
| 20:02.15 | ZorbaBeta | if I can do that, I can just force an error |
| 20:02.51 | ZorbaBeta | realistically what I'll end up doing is having two thresholds, one soft-error threshold where it just prints an ugly warning, then one hard-error threshold where it kills the current execution thread via generating errors |
| 20:03.55 | Mere | well in theory it should only really catch things that have gone badly wrong :) |
| 20:04.06 | Mere | most addons probably won't notice |
| 20:04.28 | ZorbaBeta | in theory, but of course there are always going to be awkward edge cases. I mean, I've got an auction addon I use that freezes up the client for 3 or 4 seconds while thinking :V |
| 20:04.42 | ZorbaBeta | I'll probably have to move some logic into a coroutine |
| 20:04.58 | Mere | I guess it depends on what you're working on |
| 20:05.15 | Mere | I know that some ah addons with WoW used to eat the CPU alive, but over time they did more in background threads |
| 20:05.35 | Mere | (background timer is probably more accurate) |
| 20:12.38 | ZorbaBeta | I partially want to add Lua Lanes into the mix so people can do true multithreading, but I'm not sure it'd be worth the effort |
| 20:13.16 | ZorbaBeta | kind of the same bucket as adding sqlite - it's technically an awesome feature, but very few people would use it |
| 20:14.47 | Mere | let alone the mess of people really understanding multi-threading |
| 20:16.10 | ZorbaBeta | yeah, it'd be a bit easier because it wouldn't be true multithreading - it'd be a parallel but separate lua environment |
| 20:16.19 | ZorbaBeta | with no access to Inspect.* Command.* Event.* UI.* |
| 20:16.36 | ZorbaBeta | but in the end that means it would be useful for bulk processing only, and very few addons actually do that |
| 20:16.53 | Mere | ah, yeah, ah addons that kind of thing |
| 20:17.12 | ZorbaBeta | I totally could have used it for questhelper but that was sort of an anomaly of an addon anyway :V |
| 20:17.38 | *** join/#riftuidev Torhal (~callahan@c-71-207-224-241.hsd1.al.comcast.net) |
| 20:17.45 | *** mode/#riftuidev [+v Torhal] by ChanServ |
| 20:18.05 | Mere | questhelper was an awesome addon :) |
| 20:18.20 | Mere | but not really needed these days |
| 20:18.28 | ZorbaBeta | I had a lot of fun working on it ^^ and it sort of indirectly got me this job, so, hey |
| 20:18.30 | Mere | rift and wow both have something "good enough" built in |
| 20:18.50 | ZorbaBeta | yeah, I was always expecting WoW to just do questhelper on their own someday |
| 20:19.04 | ZorbaBeta | I had a bunch of ideas for how to expand functionality before that happened but none of 'em ended up panning out. such is life. |
| 20:19.37 | Mere | well the rewrite of the 1-60 quests must have pretty much broken questhelper |
| 20:19.53 | Mere | as fewer people will us it as it's not accurate, and so it can't become accurate |
| 20:20.24 | ZorbaBeta | nah, that wouldn't have been a big problem. it was very good at deriving quests from limited information |
| 20:20.31 | ZorbaBeta | probably would've worked fine in a month or two |
| 20:20.49 | ZorbaBeta | the real problem was that it was no longer paying my bills and I had to move on to something else |
| 20:21.22 | Mere | yeah, I guess this world of cheap/free apps means people expect the same with addons |
| 20:21.24 | ZorbaBeta | in retrospect I was doing an awful job at collecting donations - I'd do far better if I could do it over again - but that was the really critical issue. |
| 20:21.43 | Mere | that said I'm writing an addon with no plans to take donations |
| 20:22.20 | Mere | I'm mainly writing the addon because I wanted to, and because I didn't like the existing healing frames that were available |
| 20:24.19 | Mere | actually I see someone did a questhelper lite, using the wow provided data to do the pathing, rather than having a database |
| 20:24.28 | ZorbaBeta | yeah, I honestly think it's a bad idea to write an addon for money. too much work, not predictable enough |
| 20:25.02 | ZorbaBeta | I probably would have used that data as a fallback, though it had major problems - it wouldn't show all waypoints for a quest, for example, only the closest ones |
| 20:25.23 | Mere | again it's that "good enough" thing |
| 20:25.43 | ZorbaBeta | the routing was always my favorite part, personally, so :) |
| 20:25.55 | Mere | yeah, having a sane path was nice |
| 20:26.38 | Mere | I think my biggest annoyance was that it didn't look ahead though, eg you turn in quest x, gives y, then z, so it gave you the current optimal path, not one that would make sense for what you'll then hand |
| 20:26.40 | Mere | in |
| 20:26.55 | ZorbaBeta | I was always entertained when it got me to take a shortcut through Shattrath so it could use the portals |
| 20:27.02 | ZorbaBeta | yeah, I always wanted to add that, but I never had time |
| 20:27.13 | Mere | yeah portal usage was nice |
| 20:27.17 | ZorbaBeta | and I was pushing the bounds of the WoW environment as it was |
| 20:27.41 | Mere | so that's why someone said to you, go make an environment to be pushed? :) |
| 20:27.53 | ZorbaBeta | that's one of the reasons Rift uses LuaJIT ;) |
| 20:28.33 | Mere | yeah, I've been fairly happy with the cpu usage bcpu shows for my healing addon, in a 5 man group in combat I'm eating 1.5% cpu with the odd spike to 2.5% |
| 20:29.03 | Mere | that's with buff tracking, health and mana/energy bars, and text on them with x/y (z%) |
| 20:29.50 | Mere | I'm not in any raiding guilds so hard to test out in a large env |
| 21:11.45 | seebs | Mere, thanks! |
| 21:12.37 | seebs | Really appreciate the feedback, I love the idea of getting people used to using a standard library so we don't have eight million command line interfaces. |
| 21:12.47 | Mere | no probs :) |
| 21:13.03 | Mere | it's simplified what I have to do in the short term to get the addon out there |
| 21:14.31 | seebs | Huh. |
| 21:14.42 | seebs | When did #foo enter Lua, anyway? I have a ton of old table.getn() |
| 21:16.53 | Mere | 5.1 i think |
| 21:17.07 | Torhal | Yup |
| 21:17.10 | seebs | I don't remember when my addon stuff mostly dates back to, 5.0 or 5.1. |
| 21:17.24 | seebs | But probably some's old enough to predate 5.1, thus my belief that geten and string.len were super important. |
| 21:18.19 | Torhal | I don't even thing .getn() will work with 5.2 |
| 21:18.30 | seebs | It still works now in Rift. |
| 21:18.35 | seebs | But I'm taking it out anyway. |
| 21:21.00 | seebs | wahh |
| 21:21.13 | seebs | I moved my office upstairs for the winter. Now it's nearly 80 out, so I have to move back to the basement. |
| 21:21.14 | Torhal | lol |
| 21:21.18 | Torhal | Ouch |
| 21:21.19 | seebs | Moving my office is a big hassle. |
| 21:21.42 | seebs | I sort of want to wait a few days or something and get furniture from the office-which-is-closing. |
| 21:21.49 | seebs | But it's too hot to work *now*. |
| 21:22.51 | Mere | I'm off to watch eat dinner and maybe fire up ME3 for a bit, cya later |
| 22:22.16 | seebs | ugh |
| 22:22.27 | seebs | I need furniture. It's too hot to work in my office now, so I have to move back to the basement. |
| 22:41.55 | seebs | meh |
| 22:41.58 | seebs | this turns out to be hard |
| 22:42.12 | seebs | Office stores mostly sell ordering-furniture, their in-stock selection can be limited. |
| 22:50.21 | *** join/#riftuidev Aurorus_ (~Aurorus@ppp121-45-161-41.lns20.syd6.internode.on.net) |
| 23:36.10 | Torhal | Lawn chair and a 6' white plastic table, IMO. |
| 23:47.27 | seebs | heh |