| 09:48:23 | johnix | hi |
| 10:22:00 | Inertia | Tangent :) |
| 10:22:20 | Tangent | Inertia : Hi |
| 10:23:21 | Inertia | Do I remember correctly in thinking that you installed Linux on your iPaq - or was that Chris? |
| 10:24:07 | Tangent | Inertia : Probably both of us actually |
| 10:25:46 | Inertia | oh right - fair enough - that would explain my confusion |
| 10:26:15 | Inertia | so then - should I? |
| 10:26:57 | Tangent | Inertia : Depends if you want a useable PDA, or a geek toy ;) |
| 10:34:50 | Inertia | ooh - im a compsci - now lets think |
| 10:35:31 | Inertia | so how do you go about it? |
| 10:35:33 | Tangent | Inertia : Your choice should be easy then.... get that bootloader installed |
| 10:35:40 | ctr | linux rocks because, you can run the same shit on your [insert device here] as you can on your desktop |
| 10:36:10 | Tangent | Inertia : You want to follow the install instructions for familiar 0.5.1 at http://familiar.handhelds.org/ |
| 10:38:15 | Tangent | ctr : linux also sometimes sucks because you run the same shit on your [insert device here] as you do on the desktop ;) |
| 10:38:40 | Tangent | KDE2.2 runs dog slow on my iPAQ |
| 10:38:49 | johnix | lol |
| 10:39:05 | ctr | fair enough |
| 10:39:27 | johnix | so it *might* need some tuning to run on my S5;) |
| 10:39:44 | Tangent | johnix : Erm... possibly a little |
| 10:40:09 | ctr | of course you have to be sensible to run certain things and not others |
| 10:40:25 | johnix | Oh darn, the sun is shining so bright out there, and I'd like to go out |
| 10:40:31 | ctr | basicallly the ability to use mutt,term,vim/jed etc etc is so powerfull |
| 10:40:43 | johnix | but all I do is sit in a dark room in front of a computer... |
| 10:40:53 | Inertia | hehe |
| 10:40:57 | johnix | (of a laptop computer) |
| 10:40:59 | Inertia | btw - do I need a serial port? |
| 10:41:42 | Tangent | ctr : vim on the iPAQ sucks... that's a classic example of using the wrong app for the job... vi.. designed to make really efficient use of a keyboard, but no mouse input... iPAQ... no keyboard.. mouse only |
| 10:42:04 | ctr | Tangent: it was an example, but yes i agree |
| 10:42:09 | Tangent | N.B. I use vi on the ipaq |
| 10:43:21 | Tangent | ctr : My big problem with my iPAQ is.... I got the microdrive.. and the expansion sleeves.. and the network cards... and installed linux onto the disk.. and now.. after all that... it's about as good as the computer I owned 8 years ago |
| 10:43:39 | Tangent | ctr : When it had CE on it, it made a shiney new top of the range PDA.. |
| 10:43:46 | ctr | but a computer you owned 8 years ago wont fit in your pocket :) |
| 10:43:54 | ctr | sure |
| 10:43:56 | Tangent | ctr : By adding linux to it, I've reduced it to an 8 year old PC with no keyboard |
| 10:44:05 | ctr | you can't build kernels on it or something |
| 10:44:08 | ctr | but it's usefull |
| 10:44:34 | Tangent | ctr : Ah.. that's my problem.. I've yet to make handhelds linux do something useful for me |
| 10:44:47 | Tangent | ctr : I can build half a kernel on it before the batteries die |
| 10:44:59 | johnix | lol |
| 10:45:14 | johnix | have you seen the Royal Lin@x? |
| 10:45:38 | ctr | Tangent: i suppose it's a case of what you want to do with it |
| 10:45:44 | johnix | That may be a nice geek toy, with an useful PDA included |
| 10:46:26 | Tangent | ctr : It's not linux's fault... it's my fault... but now I can't help seeing my iPAQ as either a badly configured linux on an old PC, or on overpowered CE machine (i.e. waste of space) |
| 10:46:30 | johnix | and it should be pretty cheap compared to the Zaurus (if it's not vaporware) |
| 10:46:49 | Tangent | ctr : At least I have a specific use for my Tuxscreens |
| 10:47:00 | ctr | yep |
| 10:47:19 | ctr | well if you dont want your ipaq, *wink *wink *nudge *nudge |
| 10:47:25 | Tangent | ctr : How's the buildroot stuff going? |
| 10:47:30 | ctr | i just wish there was a |
| 10:47:33 | ctr | psi-paq |
| 10:47:46 | ctr | which was a cludge of the ipaq and psion5mx |
| 10:47:48 | Tangent | I see that Linux runs on the Jordana 720 now |
| 10:47:53 | ctr | so you had the power and kb |
| 10:48:10 | Tangent | That's a close contender for the 'Psion with all the stuff I want' category |
| 10:48:21 | johnix | yup |
| 10:48:42 | johnix | what about coupling an iPaq-like device with a keyboard? |
| 10:49:06 | johnix | apart from the screen size, it should be pretty cool too... |
| 10:49:14 | Tangent | Actually, I have a Targus Stowaway keyboard to go with my iPAQ, but it's only seen about 2 mins use so far |
| 10:49:41 | johnix | and apart from psion's unbeatable battery life. Darn, you can't ever get everything at once... |
| 10:49:45 | Tangent | It takes up quite a lot of space when it's unfolded... probably about the same as my laptop.. maybe a little more |
| 10:50:07 | johnix | Tangent: funny... |
| 10:50:30 | Tangent | I'm hoping that they'll bring out a 400MHz Xscale Jordana 720 (or something similar made by someone) |
| 10:50:43 | Tangent | Would be quite a rocking little machine |
| 10:51:00 | ctr | you could get one of those amstard kb's and rig it to the ipaq |
| 10:51:07 | johnix | has anybody here ever used a netboot/s5? |
| 10:51:31 | johnix | I think that with a nice kbd and color monitor, they must be pretty cool too. |
| 10:52:04 | johnix | Couple that with a big microdrive, and you can almost get rid of the desktop PC |
| 10:52:12 | Tangent | Every time I pick up my Psion I wish for a colour screen and a faster cpu |
| 10:52:30 | Tangent | I wonder if the 36MHz CPU in the 5mx can be overclocked |
| 10:52:41 | johnix | Tangent: and you'd have to give up battery life |
| 10:52:56 | Tangent | johnix : Pah... battery life.. smattery life ;) |
| 10:53:35 | johnix | Tangent: taht's still a compromise to me |
| 10:54:11 | johnix | and the S5's screen resolution is still hard to beat, even in grayscale |
| 10:54:19 | Tangent | johnix : I'd actually like to do a series of feasible upgrades to my Psion... I know that I can take the memory up to 28Mb.. which would be nice... |
| 10:54:44 | Tangent | I'd also like to replace the dull poor contrast screen with a better one... and a better backlight too |
| 10:54:55 | Tangent | and get rid of those AAs and replace with Li-Ion |
| 10:55:03 | johnix | I don' |
| 10:55:08 | johnix | t like li-ion |
| 10:55:22 | Tangent | What's wrong with li-ion? |
| 10:55:23 | johnix | I think AA is a huge advantage |
| 10:55:35 | johnix | you can replace the batteries!!! |
| 10:56:03 | johnix | I use 2 sets of Ni-Mh AAs, and I have some spare non-rechargeable ones in my pocket |
| 10:56:18 | Tangent | Nod.. but you could have one li-ion battery that filled the same space as 2XAA, and provided the same voltage.. but about 6 times the lifespan... if it's flat, you can still use AAs |
| 10:56:23 | johnix | so I *never* have to worry about battery live |
| 10:56:34 | johnix | err battery charge level |
| 10:56:59 | Tangent | Charging the Psion once a week/month wouldn't be too bad |
| 10:57:16 | johnix | Mmh, maybe |
| 10:58:20 | johnix | but I wouldn't feel as confident w/o having a second battery set at hand (which can't be cheap) |
| 10:58:39 | johnix | has anybody used the Zaurus here? |
| 10:58:58 | Tangent | shakes head |
| 11:01:22 | Inertia | so then - after all this discussion - should I try it? - I have the bluetooth sleve - a 64mb cf and a stowaway keyboard...? |
| 11:01:47 | Tangent | Inertia : Yep.. you should definately try it |
| 11:02:49 | Inertia | do I need a serial cable for it though? - I read this somewhere?!? :S |
| 11:03:22 | Tangent | Inertia : Yep.. you need to use a serial console to get it all started |
| 11:03:35 | Inertia | hmm - anythoughts on where to get a serial cable? |
| 11:03:37 | johnix | Tangent: I never used mine... |
| 11:04:04 | Tangent | johnix : How did you do the 'load root' part ? |
| 11:04:18 | Inertia | so guys - how do I install it with only a usb cable? |
| 11:04:41 | johnix | Are you talking about a Psion Series5? |
| 11:05:06 | Tangent | johnix : Nope.. iPAQ |
| 11:05:13 | johnix | Oops, sorry;) |
| 11:05:23 | johnix | I don't have one |
| 11:05:39 | Tangent | Inertia : You can actually do everything with a usb cable and a bit of imagination |
| 11:05:53 | Inertia | Tangent - why does that not fill me with confidence?> |
| 11:05:56 | Tangent | Inertia : I've got a kernel+initrd that you can use from CE |
| 11:06:14 | Inertia | Tangent? |
| 11:06:17 | Tangent | Inertia : But that's as far as it gets... no install procedure.. no finished product.. no power management etc |
| 11:06:49 | Tangent | Inertia : You can double click something in CE.. and end up with linux running on.. erm.. a serial console... Hrm.. not much use really |
| 11:07:17 | Tangent | Inertia : If you have an old mouse lying around, you can always add serial support to your USB cable/cradle |
| 11:07:17 | Inertia | but Tangent - you can get full working systems no? |
| 11:07:33 | johnix | Tangent: you can always arrange to run a dumb terminal on your Psion;) |
| 11:07:43 | Tangent | Inertia : Yep.. I had linux on my 1Gb microdrive.. full gcc etc... running KDE (dog slow) |
| 11:08:01 | johnix | Tangent: (maybe even export an X display, or something like that) |
| 11:08:26 | Tangent | johnix : You could use the VNC client certainly ;) |
| 11:08:38 | johnix | Tangent: yup... |
| 11:08:40 | Tangent | remote control the iPAQ from the Psion ;) |
| 11:09:08 | johnix | now *THAT* would be an neat geek toy;) |
| 11:09:36 | johnix | ok, time to heat the soup |
| 11:10:05 | Tangent | johnix : Watch in awe as I control my Fast Colour PDA from 6ft away using this slower greyscale machine... ;) |
| 11:10:38 | Inertia | :S |
| 11:10:56 | Tangent | Hrm.. maybe run the two machines in parallel and pass tasks to each other at 115200 via IrDA ;) |
| 11:11:30 | johnix | or even set up a mosix cluster, or a dual-screen setup;) |
| 11:11:37 | Tangent | Actually, that could make a neat app... Psion = Keyboard +Extension Display for iPAQ via IrDA... |
| 11:11:59 | Tangent | Damn it... I'm gonna have to get me another CF card... |
| 11:12:24 | johnix | now, let's see who's the first guy to get that running |
| 11:12:39 | Tangent | can't be bothered today... |
| 11:12:47 | johnix | and I'll vote for him as the geek-of-the-month |
| 11:12:53 | johnix | ;) |
| 11:38:02 | ungrzna | hi |
| 11:39:28 | Inertia | heya |
| 11:40:07 | Tangent | ungrzna : Hey |
| 11:44:03 | Inertia | so then - Tangent - how does one get a really good working linux system on an iPaq (with only a USB cable) -> dense persons guide please :D |
| 11:44:58 | Tangent | Inertia : 1.) Get soldering iron... 2.) Dismantle old mouse for it's cable... 3.) Add serial cable to USB, making a dual cable/cradle 4.) Proceed with normal linux install |
| 12:28:36 | Inertia | errm Tangent - Ive been contemplating that one for some time now and its a little bemusing |
| 13:24:34 | George- | Hey guys |
| 13:24:55 | George- | johnix: Are you Thomas Tempe? |
| 13:25:05 | George- | your nick is.. familiar |
| 13:26:20 | johnix | George-: yes I am |
| 13:26:38 | johnix | nice to meet you |
| 13:27:16 | George- | How's the PsiLinux port going? |
| 13:27:19 | ctr | i'm chris, hi :) |
| 13:27:26 | George- | I've er.. been hiding under a rock for ages :) |
| 13:28:22 | johnix | well, the 4bbp fb driver is supposed to work at least on thr |
| 13:28:30 | George- | thr? |
| 13:28:34 | johnix | the S5, |
| 13:28:38 | George- | ahhh |
| 13:28:42 | George- | When was that done? |
| 13:28:56 | George- | I remember having a long discussion with a (Russian?) guy about that |
| 13:29:03 | George- | "stanson" I think he was |
| 13:29:08 | johnix | and there has been some talking about porting linux 2.4 to the S5 too |
| 13:29:27 | George- | yea.. I saw thta |
| 13:29:30 | johnix | well, a few weeks ago. Don't ask me;) |
| 13:31:16 | George- | heh |
| 13:31:31 | George- | I've had to pull outa devel until I get a cross devel env going on my PPC machine |
| 13:31:41 | George- | Which'll prolly never happen.. :( |
| 13:35:00 | johnix | is doing some tricky soldering right on top of his laptop keyboard |
| 13:35:36 | George- | johnix: Are.. you.. mad? :) |
| 13:36:02 | George- | lol |
| 13:36:07 | johnix | George-: probably |
| 13:37:18 | George- | heh |
| 13:38:36 | johnix | darn headphones |
| 13:39:02 | johnix | cheap, good sound, but breaks after a year, and so tricky to solder back to work |
| 14:23:20 | George- | ping all |
| 14:48:48 | George- | hey |
| 14:48:49 | George- | wb |
| 15:02:04 | johnix | I was thinking about something |
| 15:07:30 | johnix | If Emacs is everyting you ever need (including a kitchen sink, calendar, search tool, MUA, windowing system, development environment and interpreter, and the ever-missing quality text editor), |
| 15:07:58 | johnix | if all Emacs needs is a keyboard, |
| 15:08:30 | johnix | then _why on earth_ are we bothering with things like PicoGUI??? |
| 15:09:18 | johnix | Ok, Emacs takes up disk space. So *what*? A 64Mo CF should be enough for a running OS + GNU Emacs... |
| 15:12:31 | George- | GNU emacs can span up to 80MB =P |
| 15:13:01 | George- | GNU Emacs is bloated, in comparison to luvly vi :) |
| 15:13:12 | George- | GNU emacs contains useless psychiatrists |
| 15:13:13 | George- | ... |
| 15:14:21 | johnix | now, I got an installation of GNU Emacs running in less than 45Mo on my school's NT account |
| 15:14:37 | George- | heh] |
| 15:14:45 | George- | I'm a stupid little boy :) |
| 15:15:08 | johnix | Psychiatrists and 200Ko history files and maya calendars can be removed easily. |
| 15:15:30 | George- | psyciatrists :) |
| 15:15:37 | George- | YOU go and make an emacs distro |
| 15:15:42 | George- | *I'LL* stick with QPE |
| 15:15:43 | George- | =P |
| 15:16:03 | johnix | and if you remove the pre-compiled files, you can cut down by another 5-10 Mo |
| 15:16:51 | johnix | now think about it: if we fit a feature-full (well, I'll keep the psychiatrist and zippy quotes) Emacs run on your psion, |
| 15:17:13 | George- | EMACS IS CRAP |
| 15:17:15 | johnix | then write some synchro stuff and put all your todo lists and calendar items in plain text files, |
| 15:17:16 | George- | VI RULEZ! |
| 15:17:31 | johnix | then what *else* would you *ever* need? |
| 15:17:38 | johnix | (apart from eye-candy) |
| 15:17:51 | George- | Aqua |
| 15:17:58 | George- | AQUA |
| 15:18:23 | johnix | Hey! If we use GNU Emacs 21, we'll ever get *syntax-coloring* |
| 15:18:42 | George- | on a monochrome screen? |
| 15:18:56 | johnix | When's the release of the next syntax-coloring programmers editor awaited for PicoGUI? |
| 15:19:10 | johnix | well, syntax-grey-scaling;) |
| 15:20:22 | johnix | now *that* is THE ULTIMATE geeks toy, and it comes with a psychiatrist and a PDA included;) |
| 15:20:36 | johnix | *has* to do just that |
| 15:21:02 | johnix | Hell with homework. Let's get down to the *real* thing |
| 15:21:12 | johnix | is hysteric |
| 15:21:54 | johnix | (well, after another one of those tasty jelly sandwich) |
| 15:40:00 | johnix | the sun is shining... |
| 15:40:08 | johnix | I'm going out! |
| 16:23:06 | johnix | hi |
| 21:54:25 | johnix | hi |