| 00:14.47 | *** join/#picogui KeyserSoze (~ksoze@12-245-37-229.client.attbi.com) |
| 00:29.42 | *** join/#picogui file (lan@mctn1-4288.nb.aliant.net) |
| 00:39.24 | file | Xentac: got it working :) |
| 00:39.42 | Xentac | good to hear |
| 00:39.59 | file | took some messing around - but I got it |
| 00:40.48 | lalo | agonk{nov}: scanline just sent mail to the list, so he's presumably fine |
| 00:40.59 | Xentac | lalo: what was up with scanline? |
| 00:53.34 | *** join/#picogui Xentac (~jchu@amga45cyy30x9.bc.hsia.telus.net) |
| 01:02.10 | *** join/#picogui gonkulator (~brandon@h-69-3-54-50.DNVTCO56.covad.net) |
| 01:02.14 | gonkulator | hmm... |
| 01:02.17 | gonkulator | still no scanline |
| 01:02.21 | gonkulator | ibot: seen ahnkana |
| 01:02.25 | | i haven't seen 'ahnkana ', gonkulator |
| 01:02.32 | gonkulator | ibot: seen ahnkana |
| 01:02.32 | | ahnkana is currently on #picogui (6h 59m 50s) |
| 01:02.34 | Xentac | hey gonkulator |
| 01:02.38 | gonkulator | hi Xentac |
| 01:02.49 | Xentac | lalo mentioned something about him posting to the mailing list and being ok...? |
| 01:02.51 | Xentac | that's cool |
| 01:02.54 | lalo | gonkulator: scanline just sent mail to the list, so he's presumably fine |
| 01:03.08 | gonkulator | oh, I wasn't all that worried about his well being |
| 01:03.13 | gonkulator | just... his computers |
| 01:03.29 | lalo | Xentac: probably nothing, but his connection timed out a while ago and we were wondering. |
| 01:03.38 | lalo | gonkulator: that's what I meant, he had means of posting mail |
| 01:04.12 | Xentac | lalo: I see... |
| 01:04.14 | lalo | I don't think he's quite good enough at eletronics to send mail by tapping the cables ;-) |
| 01:04.22 | gonkulator | lalo: I wouldn't be so sure |
| 01:05.58 | gonkulator | Xentac: he isn't clever enough on the fly |
| 01:08.41 | Xentac | gonkulator: play chess much? |
| 01:09.22 | gonkulator | Xentac: a fair amount |
| 01:09.31 | gonkulator | mostly, I am good at seeing a problem, and figuring out how to fix it |
| 01:09.50 | Xentac | wanna do some PBeM chess? |
| 01:10.27 | gonkulator | Xentac: I hafta go have dinner at a friend's place |
| 01:11.00 | Xentac | PBeM chess takes a long time... |
| 01:11.25 | Xentac | I realize that |
| 01:11.29 | Xentac | I didn't mean right now |
| 01:11.33 | Xentac | I meant sometime soon |
| 01:11.35 | gonkulator | oh |
| 01:11.36 | gonkulator | sure |
| 01:11.48 | gonkulator | anyway, I am off |
| 01:11.49 | Xentac | sure |
| 01:11.51 | gonkulator | ta ta Xentac |
| 01:12.00 | Xentac | the games take days... |
| 01:12.05 | Xentac | ta ta |
| 01:17.22 | KeyserSoze | just warning everyone, if my IRC client quits, it's probably because the place is on fire :D |
| 01:17.32 | file | oh no |
| 01:17.48 | Xentac | KeyserSoze: hehehe |
| 01:18.08 | Xentac | just think of what that call would be like... |
| 01:18.29 | Xentac | "Hello, 911? There's a fire in the USA... can you deal with it?" |
| 01:18.33 | file | lol |
| 01:18.42 | *** join/#picogui lurgyman (~lurgyman@aden2-123-dhcp.resnet.Colorado.EDU) |
| 01:18.45 | file | "Yes sir, please allow 2-4 weeks" |
| 01:19.00 | Xentac | file: this isn't the postal service :P |
| 01:19.07 | file | Xentac: :) |
| 01:21.33 | file | noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo |
| 01:21.46 | Xentac | yesssssssssssssssssssssssssssssss |
| 01:22.13 | file | okay |
| 01:26.59 | captain_proton | -10-11> captain_proton 14(10~jupiter@aden2-23-dhcp.resnet.Colorado.EDU14) is still in #picogui |
| 01:28.00 | file | captain_proton? |
| 01:31.16 | *** join/#picogui scanline (~jetstream@161.97.199.99) |
| 01:31.25 | scanline | yeargh |
| 01:31.31 | captain_proton | huzzah! |
| 01:31.39 | scanline | I'm connected via babylonia |
| 01:31.43 | scanline | I still can't connect from yoshi or navi |
| 01:32.06 | captain_proton | -10-11> lurgyman 14(10~mahler@aden2-123-dhcp.resnet.Colorado.EDU14) isn't here |
| 01:32.24 | scanline | hmm? |
| 01:33.15 | scanline | hmm |
| 01:33.15 | scanline | 6667/tcp filtered irc |
| 01:33.20 | captain_proton | haha |
| 01:33.30 | captain_proton | try connecting by server name |
| 01:33.40 | scanline | tried that, for several different servers |
| 01:34.27 | file | wb scanline |
| 01:34.49 | file | scanline: try port 6668 |
| 01:35.00 | file | or 7000 |
| 01:35.19 | lurgyman | ahnkana: poke poke poke |
| 01:52.40 | *** join/#picogui file (~lan@mctn1-1236.nb.aliant.net) |
| 01:52.44 | file | ahhhh much better |
| 01:52.49 | *** join/#picogui darth_iBook (~evanshee@buck27-202-dhcp.resnet.Colorado.EDU) |
| 01:52.59 | darth_iBook | yay darth_iBook is back! |
| 01:53.06 | file | alll done |
| 01:53.37 | file | apt-get is a great tool |
| 01:53.56 | darth_iBook | there |
| 01:57.20 | captain_proton | scanline: target later? |
| 01:57.26 | scanline | hmmkay |
| 01:57.28 | file | scanline: have you tried using alternate IRC ports? |
| 01:57.30 | darth_iBook | oooh target |
| 01:57.38 | scanline | file: uh huh |
| 01:57.44 | scanline | the ports are filtered |
| 01:57.53 | file | scanline: GAH |
| 01:57.57 | captain_proton | ITS has killed off scanline :) |
| 01:58.26 | lurgyman | scanline: ssh to bhaskara and use irssi |
| 01:58.28 | scanline | if it is ITS, why would they have blocked only my IRC? |
| 01:58.39 | scanline | lurgyman: right now i'm ssh'ed to babylonia and using irssi |
| 01:58.43 | captain_proton | because IRC is EVIL |
| 01:58.52 | scanline | then the next question, why me? |
| 01:58.56 | lurgyman | IRC is the root of all death |
| 01:59.20 | scanline | you could be like that guy in Back to the Future that was always wearing anaglyph glasses |
| 01:59.32 | captain_proton | except i'd go blind |
| 02:00.08 | captain_proton | if life gives you lemonade, make sure its made with 100% organic lemos |
| 02:00.09 | lurgyman | the boulderite approach to life |
| 02:00.09 | captain_proton | err |
| 02:00.11 | captain_proton | lemons |
| 02:00.52 | darth_iBook | eeks |
| 02:03.03 | darth_iBook | travis is now going to quit touching my computer |
| 02:03.38 | darth_iBook | he |
| 02:06.11 | darth_iBook | why is scanline annoyed? |
| 02:06.38 | scanline | can't connect to IRC |
| 02:08.25 | *** join/#picogui anotherScanline (~micah@aden2-42-dhcp.resnet.Colorado.EDU) |
| 02:08.57 | scanline | aha |
| 02:09.00 | file | nifty |
| 02:09.10 | scanline | so that's weird... |
| 02:09.11 | file | what if they discover you changed? |
| 02:09.31 | scanline | ? |
| 02:09.42 | file | your IP |
| 02:09.45 | scanline | ? |
| 02:09.46 | scanline | "they"? |
| 02:10.10 | njs | scanline: btw, what's "LIFO queueing delay"? |
| 02:10.29 | file | scanline: the people in black |
| 02:10.30 | captain_proton | its a queueing delay, right, in a LIFO |
| 02:10.33 | *** join/#picogui kidder (~s@h24-65-171-188.gv.shawcable.net) |
| 02:10.39 | kidder | hello |
| 02:10.40 | scanline | events come into the queue, if they are processed slower than they come in there's an increasing latency |
| 02:11.00 | njs | scanline: hmm |
| 02:11.11 | njs | scanline: (surely events are processed in FIFO order?) |
| 02:11.23 | scanline | whoops |
| 02:11.27 | scanline | typo |
| 02:11.32 | scanline | or thinko |
| 02:11.48 | njs | scanline: ah, okie |
| 02:13.49 | njs | scanline: fixing that sounds hard, since events have ordering dependencies... I guess not all events do, but working around that means you need to know the dependencies taht do exist and then topologically sort... guh. |
| 02:14.08 | scanline | it's a tough problem |
| 02:14.17 | scanline | this project wouldn't be interesting if everything was easy |
| 02:14.23 | file | bbl |
| 02:14.39 | njs | Is it really a problem? Doesn't X just solve it by ignoring it? |
| 02:14.57 | scanline | njs: X timestamps the events, but it's up to the application to ignore old events if they want |
| 02:15.28 | scanline | most X apps will only take the most recent mouse movement event, for example |
| 02:15.36 | scanline | but drawing apps would want all of them |
| 02:16.10 | scanline | I think the way I'll handle it in picogui is by using incoming events to update widgets' state as often as possible, but when the layout server requests a new representation that will always be the most recent one |
| 02:16.18 | captain_proton | hooray for real food tomorrow |
| 02:16.31 | njs | I thought the problem was making sure you got your responses on time (real-time constraints, sorta); I don't see how timestamps are relevant to that... |
| 02:16.31 | scanline | for apps that care about the events individually, they'll still recieve them all with timestamps and get to make their own decision |
| 02:16.48 | captain_proton | scanline: SVG RENDERER |
| 02:16.49 | captain_proton | NOW |
| 02:16.56 | fraggle | agreed |
| 02:17.15 | scanline | njs: I think it will be mainly usefull for quantifying the latency so it can be improved |
| 02:17.22 | scanline | captain_proton: need a new rendering engine for that... |
| 02:17.34 | captain_proton | then GET TO WORK |
| 02:17.39 | fraggle | display postscript picogui extension |
| 02:17.53 | scanline | fraggle: that will be possible with the new architecture |
| 02:18.01 | fraggle | yay |
| 02:18.20 | captain_proton | postscript would work for me :) |
| 02:18.27 | captain_proton | then i wouldn't need to translate to SVG |
| 02:18.40 | scanline | I still haven't got it all decided upon of course, but I think I'll adopt an architecture that makes almost all primitives optional |
| 02:19.05 | scanline | there would be a core set that all drivers should implement, but other extension packages for things like postscript, OpenGL, raster effects... |
| 02:19.14 | scanline | for the most part, apps wouldn't care |
| 02:19.26 | scanline | but both apps and themes could require particular primitive sets |
| 02:19.37 | scanline | if they stick to the core set, it should work anywhere |
| 02:20.17 | njs | SVG has a much more powerful rendering model than PS in some ways |
| 02:20.57 | captain_proton | njs: yeah but when i'm doing TeX-based stuff, PS is the way to go |
| 02:21.31 | scanline | the 'output server' in the new design would combine the rasterization engine and the OS or hardware interface |
| 02:21.48 | scanline | so there would be the option of this S2 engine, or something more complicated like libart |
| 02:22.03 | scanline | err |
| 02:22.06 | captain_proton | scanline: reading the maillist archive, it looks like lalo got you to architect it just like the HURD :) |
| 02:22.10 | scanline | S2 engine is part of the layout server really |
| 02:22.22 | scanline | captain_proton: yep |
| 02:22.43 | captain_proton | however, i have no problem with that, because the HURD's architecture is beautiful |
| 02:22.49 | captain_proton | even if its vaporware |
| 02:23.16 | scanline | THe other weird side of it is that it brings picogui's architecture closer to fresco |
| 02:23.38 | scanline | but there's still the big difference of fresco being Graphic-based and picogui being widget-based |
| 02:23.40 | lalo | captain_proton: the hurd isn't vapourware anymore |
| 02:23.44 | lalo | I tried it some other day |
| 02:23.52 | lalo | now the best word to describe it would be brokenware |
| 02:24.47 | captain_proton | lalo: i know there's actually some code. i call it vaporware because its been in the "brokenware" state for 15-odd years |
| 02:25.26 | scanline | fresco also has an extreme CORBA complex |
| 02:25.58 | lalo | IMHO the barrier between vapourware and brokenware is, "it works and can be used" |
| 02:26.02 | captain_proton | today i realized that Self could be implemented to be CORBA-ish |
| 02:26.03 | scanline | stefan seems to think that any IPC-like system will eventually develop into CORBA, so you might as well just start using CORBA right away |
| 02:26.24 | captain_proton | there's an idea! |
| 02:26.26 | captain_proton | write it in Self! |
| 02:26.28 | lalo | the hurd works, but it doesn't have drivers for most real-life hardware, and some things are still UGLY |
| 02:26.33 | lalo | so IMO, brokenware |
| 02:26.50 | captain_proton | hm |
| 02:26.53 | lalo | scanline: stefan has issues. :-) |
| 02:26.59 | scanline | heh |
| 02:27.01 | captain_proton | just for the hell of it |
| 02:27.08 | scanline | I don't really know him, just talked to him on #fresco some |
| 02:27.20 | scanline | captain_proton: looked at the picogui protocol spec? |
| 02:27.22 | lalo | as I wrote in one of the earlier Om abstracts, CORBA was written with the philosophies of the 80s |
| 02:27.29 | lalo | it's half as bad as C |
| 02:27.37 | captain_proton | scanline: nope |
| 02:27.37 | scanline | Speaking of C... |
| 02:27.43 | scanline | captain_proton: it's pretty simple |
| 02:27.49 | captain_proton | i'm sure |
| 02:27.54 | lalo | I don't know him at all, but I read stuff he wrote |
| 02:28.08 | lalo | he is surely competent, but he has issues. |
| 02:28.11 | scanline | lalo: I think it's still a requirement that pgserver be written in C, for speed and size... but we have the chance to set proper coding standards this time :) |
| 02:28.34 | captain_proton | we definitely need a Self interface to this IPC layer |
| 02:28.37 | captain_proton | >:) |
| 02:28.55 | captain_proton | my biggest problem with CORBA is IDL |
| 02:28.57 | scanline | I should learn about this Self thing you speak of |
| 02:28.58 | lalo | in fact it isn't - with the microkernelization I'm free to have an alternative implementation of any of the servers written in brainfuck or csh if I want ;-) |
| 02:29.09 | scanline | lalo: I think function names of the form pgsObject_Method would be good :) |
| 02:29.26 | scanline | lalo: ah, true |
| 02:29.39 | scanline | but it would be good for the first implementation to be in C |
| 02:29.43 | captain_proton | today i heard clayton say "brainfuck" |
| 02:29.46 | captain_proton | it messed with my head |
| 02:30.08 | scanline | yipes |
| 02:31.04 | lalo | "you see this ascii art here that looks like Mae West? it maps pointer event coordinates into widgets." |
| 02:31.10 | scanline | =) |
| 02:31.38 | scanline | captain_proton: yikes |
| 02:31.47 | scanline | I just got an email from that weird music guy at the gamedev meeting |
| 02:33.00 | scanline | http://www.newvisionamerica.ws/ <-- typical corporate "flash required" crap :-/ |
| 02:33.31 | captain_proton | eek |
| 02:34.01 | scanline | we should ask him if he's part of the RIAA |
| 02:34.11 | scanline | and if he is, get him to spend lots of money on us for no particular reason |
| 02:34.28 | captain_proton | "excuse me, but do you want to CRUSH OUR SPIRIT?" |
| 02:34.36 | scanline | then donate that money to the EFF |
| 02:35.45 | scanline | ha, apache2's config files are interesting |
| 02:40.09 | *** join/#picogui Piete (~abri@61.98.19.77) |
| 02:40.35 | *** join/#picogui lurgyman (~lurgyman@aden2-123-dhcp.resnet.Colorado.EDU) |
| 02:40.47 | Piete | hey file |
| 02:41.12 | *** join/#picogui shut (~shut@aden2-42-dhcp.resnet.Colorado.EDU) |
| 02:42.08 | captain_proton | wow |
| 02:42.22 | captain_proton | all his artists are shallow bassline techno |
| 02:47.48 | file | wb Xentac, how were the chores? |
| 02:47.58 | Xentac | they were... chorey |
| 02:48.05 | file | what did you do? |
| 02:48.18 | Xentac | got firewood... |
| 02:48.19 | Piete | chorey, lol |
| 02:48.19 | Xentac | ate dinner... |
| 02:48.21 | Xentac | talked with my dad... |
| 02:48.27 | Xentac | I thought there'd be more.. |
| 02:48.30 | Xentac | but I was able to delegate |
| 02:48.31 | Xentac | ;o) |
| 02:48.31 | file | wow - amazing chores |
| 02:48.44 | Piete | eating dinner is a chore? |
| 02:48.56 | file | Piete: moving your mouth |
| 02:48.58 | file | chewing |
| 02:49.09 | file | picking up the fork/spoon and such... |
| 02:49.12 | file | it's all a chore |
| 02:49.13 | Piete | file: of course! |
| 02:49.16 | Xentac | no, that's just what I did... |
| 02:50.10 | *** join/#picogui lurgyman (~lurgyman@aden2-123-dhcp.resnet.Colorado.EDU) |
| 02:50.12 | file | bbl |
| 02:51.05 | Xentac | Piete: nah, he's just a nice python script... |
| 02:51.22 | *** join/#picogui lurgyman (~lurgyman@aden2-123-dhcp.resnet.Colorado.EDU) |
| 02:51.25 | Piete | heh |
| 02:52.16 | lalo | scanline: you used twisted or wrote it by hand? |
| 02:52.46 | scanline | used an 'irclib' module I found |
| 02:52.50 | lalo | ...esr would answer, "both" |
| 02:53.04 | lalo | I've seen irclib a while ago |
| 02:53.20 | Xentac | esr? |
| 02:53.21 | scanline | it's a little weird, but sufficed for this little script |
| 02:53.23 | lalo | exactly for the purpose of writing a bot btw :-) |
| 02:53.39 | lalo | twisted seems easier, but it's a whole framework |
| 02:54.05 | lalo | good, I ressurrected both my icq transports |
| 02:54.12 | kergoth`bbl | Xentac: erik s raymond, i'd say |
| 02:54.13 | Xentac | lalo: cool |
| 02:54.14 | lalo | frightening that they both broke the same day |
| 02:54.19 | Xentac | kergoth`bbl: that's what I thought... |
| 02:54.33 | Xentac | but I wasn't sure why we cared what esr would say... |
| 02:54.51 | Xentac | we need a shirt that says, "What would ESR do?" |
| 02:54.52 | lalo | Xentac: jargon file |
| 02:55.04 | Xentac | lalo: hey... question for you |
| 02:55.10 | scanline | captain_proton: scary |
| 02:55.12 | lalo | I don't care a lot for what esr says, but I love the jargon file |
| 02:55.18 | captain_proton | scanline: very |
| 02:55.23 | Xentac | did you ever meet/see Mad dog? or do anything associated with Linux Journal? |
| 02:55.33 | lalo | I used the appendixes more than once to explain the "hacker culture" to girlfriends, and that includes Maisa |
| 02:55.44 | lalo | yes, and no |
| 02:55.57 | Xentac | when did you see Mad Dog? |
| 02:56.10 | lalo | I met Santa, I mean Maddog, at the Free Software Forum last year |
| 02:56.26 | scanline | hehe |
| 02:56.30 | Xentac | ah... alrighty... |
| 02:56.37 | lalo | http://www.linuxjournal.com/article.php?sid=6129 |
| 02:58.14 | captain_proton | decompression is my favorite coldness |
| 02:58.34 | captain_proton | its condensating! |
| 02:58.55 | *** join/#picogui whoyouhm (~whoyouhm@dialup-209.244.142.7.Dial1.Providence1.Level3.net) |
| 02:58.57 | scanline | :) |
| 02:59.06 | scanline | They changed the SSL stuff a lot |
| 02:59.14 | Xentac | one other question... |
| 02:59.18 | Xentac | what PROCERGS? |
| 02:59.28 | Xentac | er what's |
| 03:01.16 | captain_proton | dan is beating my bed to a pulp with his forehead |
| 03:01.23 | lalo | companhia de PROCessamento de dados do Estado do Rio Grande do Sul |
| 03:01.28 | lalo | or: |
| 03:01.52 | lalo | Rio Grande do Sul state data processing company |
| 03:02.04 | Xentac | ah... but you don't work there... |
| 03:02.16 | lalo | it's the state organ responsible for developing software for other state organs |
| 03:02.20 | captain_proton | who is ze fox? I am ze fox! who are you? I am me! |
| 03:02.22 | lalo | no... at that time I didn't even live here |
| 03:03.15 | Xentac | Landless Rural Workers Movement... |
| 03:04.03 | Xentac | anyway... there's this picture here... and a guy that looks sort of like you.. |
| 03:04.09 | Xentac | all signs seem to be pointing to no though... |
| 03:05.28 | lalo | Xentac: what? |
| 03:06.04 | Xentac | were you ever in a picture with maddog holding up a flag.. and a bunch of other people...? |
| 03:06.10 | lalo | hmm, actually I had already met Maddog at a LinuxExpo about 3 years ago too, in São Paulo |
| 03:06.30 | lalo | that wouldn't be impossible, but probably not :-) |
| 03:07.18 | Xentac | hehehe |
| 03:07.22 | Xentac | you'd probably have to remember it ;o) |
| 03:07.31 | lalo | dunno |
| 03:07.53 | lalo | the first time was a while ago, and the second I was very tired and drank a bit |
| 03:08.44 | Xentac | can you see this image? http://interactive.linuxjournal.com/Magazines/LJ101/6125f2.png |
| 03:08.49 | Xentac | you might need to be logged in.. |
| 03:08.56 | Xentac | if so, then I'll download it and send it to you... |
| 03:09.34 | lalo | I have to be logged in |
| 03:10.52 | Xentac | alrighty (it's the subscriber access for LJ) |
| 03:11.04 | Xentac | please hold |
| 03:11.36 | Xentac | nah... just hold yourself... |
| 03:13.09 | Xentac | woah.., |
| 03:13.16 | Xentac | pornview plays videos too! |
| 03:13.30 | lalo | of course it does |
| 03:13.42 | Xentac | I thought it was just an image viewer... |
| 03:13.55 | lalo | no, it's a porn viewer :-P |
| 03:14.03 | Xentac | :P |
| 03:14.16 | Xentac | can't accept dccs? |
| 03:14.30 | lalo | if it was useful only for images, that would be a bug |
| 03:14.35 | lalo | firewall :-( |
| 03:14.40 | lalo | lalo@x3ng.com.br |
| 03:14.49 | lalo | that works too. |
| 03:14.54 | Xentac | http://xentac.net/~jchu/6125f2.png |
| 03:14.59 | Xentac | it might have the wrong permissions though ;o) |
| 03:15.09 | Xentac | second from the right... |
| 03:15.19 | lalo | no, it's opening. |
| 03:15.40 | Xentac | all my bandwidth is being used downloading red dwarf from scanline... |
| 03:15.42 | Xentac | ;o) |
| 03:15.46 | lalo | it's not me, but I was in the same building that day. |
| 03:15.58 | lalo | we were having a zope sprint |
| 03:16.00 | Xentac | ah, ok |
| 03:16.14 | Xentac | I read a letter about the picture and stuff in this month's linux journal |
| 03:16.18 | Xentac | and they reprinted the picture |
| 03:16.53 | Xentac | it sort of went: Brazil->Free Software->free software company->lalo |
| 03:16.54 | lalo | and they were teaching landless rural workers about linux... not that I have any idea what for |
| 03:17.06 | Xentac | hehehe |
| 03:17.19 | Xentac | and I thought, hey... I wonder if lalo is in this picture |
| 03:17.26 | Xentac | we can just pretend it's you though... |
| 03:18.15 | Xentac | woah... |
| 03:18.21 | lalo | most people in that room were seeing a computer for the first time in their lives |
| 03:18.21 | lalo | good thing that the first time they get it right, I guess. |
| 03:18.28 | Xentac | if I'm reading this correctly... the Zaurus now has an ICS client! |
| 03:18.35 | Xentac | hehhe |
| 03:18.49 | Xentac | damn.. but it costs $5.00! |
| 03:19.16 | *** join/#picogui Crix (Conde_Afon@213.13.246.247) |
| 03:19.25 | Xentac | lalo: so, you're not originally from Brazil... where are you from? |
| 03:19.34 | Crix | hello |
| 03:19.46 | lalo | I am from Brazil, not this state |
| 03:19.50 | scanline | hi |
| 03:19.53 | Xentac | oh, I see |
| 03:19.55 | Crix | just one question: Can i run picogui under mswindows :-) |
| 03:19.58 | Xentac | ta ta Piete |
| 03:19.58 | Crix | ? |
| 03:20.07 | scanline | Crix: maybe |
| 03:20.10 | Crix | ??? |
| 03:20.10 | lalo | RS is kind of like, well, MA |
| 03:20.20 | Crix | kinda hopped a yes or no |
| 03:20.25 | Xentac | MA? |
| 03:20.30 | lalo | I am originally from São Paulo which is our tropical version of NY |
| 03:20.35 | scanline | Crix: it used to run under windows, and theoretically it should, but I don't think anyone's tried |
| 03:20.54 | Crix | it must be compiled before right? |
| 03:21.05 | scanline | Crix: I think it will run under cygwin right now with maybe some build system tweaking.. it would run under native windows with a little new code |
| 03:21.07 | lalo | Crix: last time I heard of anyone trying was more than one year ago |
| 03:21.09 | Xentac | you have to remember... I'm Canadian... state letters don't come easily to me ;o) |
| 03:21.20 | Crix | ok.. |
| 03:21.35 | Crix | and under linux...can i get binarys? |
| 03:21.41 | lalo | Xentac: I can't spell the full name of the MA state :-) it's where they have Boston |
| 03:21.43 | scanline | Crix: I don't even have windows, and I don't know of anyone on the project that wants a windows port... so it hasn't been written |
| 03:21.50 | Crix | lol |
| 03:21.58 | scanline | Crix: there are no binary releases yet, since there are a lot of configuration options you can set at compile time |
| 03:22.00 | Xentac | lalo: hehehe... I can't remember either ;o) |
| 03:22.37 | scanline | Crix: if you just want to experiment with picogui, the easiest way would be the VNC demo |
| 03:22.46 | lalo | it has the most f*-up spelling I've ever seen in an english word... I never bothered learning it |
| 03:22.46 | scanline | (though it doesn't do much yet...) |
| 03:22.51 | Crix | i don't really understand much about computers..BUT THIS THING'S SO CUTE! |
| 03:23.04 | scanline | haha |
| 03:23.10 | Crix | is there any toturial on how to install it on a x86 |
| 03:23.16 | lalo | thanks, we love it too :-) |
| 03:23.21 | scanline | there is a little info on the wiki, but it's not complete |
| 03:23.26 | Crix | ( PS: i don't know how to code) |
| 03:23.34 | Xentac | Crix: maybe you just want to keep looking at the pictures then ;o) |
| 03:23.36 | lalo | you would need some practice to run it in cute mode tough, the default theme is a bit dry. |
| 03:23.36 | Crix | wiki? |
| 03:23.43 | Crix | LOOOOL |
| 03:23.52 | Crix | i've some pictures |
| 03:24.02 | Crix | what's wiki? |
| 03:24.10 | scanline | http://picogui.org/wiki/ |
| 03:24.14 | Crix | oh |
| 03:24.16 | Crix | NICE! |
| 03:24.32 | scanline | the wiki is rather flaky though.. and needs more info |
| 03:24.56 | captain_proton | instant tip for wiki non-flakiness: MoinMoin |
| 03:25.03 | Crix | lol...i've been there...and...it has to much information for me... |
| 03:25.23 | scanline | captain_proton: I would switch the wiki, but I haven't built up the courage to migrate its database |
| 03:25.26 | Crix | something like: how to make your machine run PICO in 3 Steps...howld be nice |
| 03:25.40 | scanline | Crix: it really isn't anywhere near easy enough for end users yet |
| 03:25.52 | Crix | that's all the information i'm searching..is it that hard to make pico run? |
| 03:25.54 | scanline | there's not much you can do with it other than code on it or run demos |
| 03:25.57 | Crix | ok |
| 03:26.01 | Crix | got it |
| 03:26.20 | Crix | just look at the pics i got |
| 03:26.26 | Crix | :-) |
| 03:26.34 | scanline | if you have VNC and a broadband net connection you could try the VNC servef |
| 03:26.38 | scanline | er, server |
| 03:26.50 | Crix | ? |
| 03:26.54 | Crix | whats that? |
| 03:26.58 | Crix | vnc? |
| 03:27.09 | scanline | VNC is a way to run programs remotely that's independent of the OS or GUI you're using, but it takes a lot of bandwidth |
| 03:27.20 | Crix | i have adsl |
| 03:27.22 | Crix | :-) |
| 03:27.34 | scanline | good enough probably |
| 03:27.35 | Crix | not FAST..but fasst |
| 03:27.45 | Xentac | adsl works fine |
| 03:27.45 | Crix | ok so how do i do that |
| 03:27.46 | scanline | try the VNC links on picogui.org to download a client if you're interested |
| 03:27.53 | Crix | ok |
| 03:27.56 | Crix | ill search that |
| 03:28.02 | Crix | back in 10 minuts |
| 03:28.11 | scanline | the demo doesn't do much yet though. I mean to set it up so you can run some of the demo apps, but haven't written that yet |
| 03:28.30 | scanline | I could send additional demos to the server if you get VNC working |
| 03:28.41 | scanline | actually, anybody could :) |
| 03:28.45 | scanline | export PGSERVER=navi.picogui.org |
| 03:28.58 | Crix | humm... |
| 03:29.28 | Crix | its kinda like...booting an OS from a lan server? |
| 03:29.38 | Crix | (but only a demo of course) |
| 03:29.46 | scanline | well, except you're not running any code |
| 03:29.57 | scanline | it's more like watching a movie of someone else's desktop over the net |
| 03:30.02 | scanline | but you can also interact with it |
| 03:30.30 | Crix | Ha like Flash Stuff! |
| 03:30.41 | Crix | thats cool! |
| 03:30.53 | Crix | once tried something like that at Ximian |
| 03:30.59 | scanline | sort of, except that it's running on someone else's computer and it can be an entire OS rather than just a simple animation |
| 03:31.27 | scanline | I could have written a flash demo of picogui, but I don't like flash :) |
| 03:31.30 | scanline | and the real thing is always better |
| 03:31.37 | Crix | but thats nice..you can see how it runs, like if it was installed on your system |
| 03:31.46 | scanline | right.. but much slower ;) |
| 03:31.59 | *** join/#picogui KeyserSoze (~ksoze@12-245-37-229.client.attbi.com) |
| 03:32.47 | Crix | ok...so i must get a vnc client right? |
| 03:33.07 | scanline | yes |
| 03:33.17 | scanline | I do have a java client set up, but it's pretty flaky |
| 03:33.31 | captain_proton | in a unique and unexpected departure from tradition, dan put the sheet on top of the comforter |
| 03:33.38 | scanline | hehe |
| 03:33.46 | scanline | is he going to bed? |
| 03:34.00 | captain_proton | no |
| 03:34.02 | captain_proton | just making his bed |
| 03:34.09 | scanline | michael is already asleep |
| 03:34.23 | captain_proton | wow |
| 03:34.51 | Crix | got one now: RealVNC |
| 03:35.04 | scanline | Crix: ok. point it at 'navi.picogui.org' |
| 03:35.46 | Crix | done |
| 03:35.52 | Crix | its loading something |
| 03:35.59 | scanline | looks like there are three of us online :) |
| 03:35.59 | Crix | ok..black windows |
| 03:36.22 | scanline | you should see something resembling a picogui server :) |
| 03:36.35 | Crix | ok...has the windows hanged up? |
| 03:37.09 | scanline | it's working fine... maybe you're experiencing a bug where some types of VNC clients crash when connected to pgserver's VNC server |
| 03:37.10 | Crix | HA! |
| 03:37.31 | Crix | It appeared..and then! |
| 03:37.43 | Crix | lol...black screen... |
| 03:37.44 | Crix | heheh |
| 03:37.52 | scanline | hmm |
| 03:38.10 | scanline | I've never seen it go to a black screen, the bug I mentioned will almost always crash the VNC client |
| 03:38.35 | Crix | humm... |
| 03:39.07 | Crix | it doenst seem to work..te window ges black and then show a picture ("you can type multiple lines here") |
| 03:39.14 | Crix | and then goes black again |
| 03:39.18 | scanline | hmm |
| 03:39.20 | Crix | and...well you know |
| 03:39.34 | Crix | wait... |
| 03:39.59 | Crix | showed up..and..ok! Connection to slow! |
| 03:40.05 | Crix | must be |
| 03:40.18 | scanline | it's most likely the libvncserver bugs |
| 03:40.35 | Crix | what is your o.s? |
| 03:41.02 | scanline | I run linux 2.4.19 |
| 03:41.23 | Crix | Yeap "application not responding" |
| 03:41.38 | Crix | "MsSucks" Tm |
| 03:41.50 | Crix | :-) |
| 03:41.58 | scanline | captain_proton: I could have waited to release 0.44, but the bug was more complex than I thought and didn't feel like delaying the release because of it |
| 03:42.06 | captain_proton | ah |
| 03:42.29 | scanline | I could have kludged it, but woudl rather wait and think of a good solution |
| 03:42.32 | Crix | how hard could it be to install the pico and like on a P200? |
| 03:42.49 | scanline | Crix: you'd still need X, unless you can live with unaccelerated video |
| 03:43.08 | Crix | I have an s3 trio i think |
| 03:43.21 | Crix | could use framebuffer right? |
| 03:43.24 | scanline | yes |
| 03:43.29 | scanline | but that would be unaccelerated |
| 03:43.34 | Crix | yeas... |
| 03:43.42 | Crix | but would it go slow |
| 03:43.46 | Crix | ? |
| 03:43.50 | scanline | probably |
| 03:44.06 | scanline | without support for hardware acceleration, it's all limited by your machine's memory bandwidth |
| 03:44.12 | Crix | but isnt picogui supposed to run on pdas and cell phones? |
| 03:44.23 | Crix | i have 128Mb |
| 03:44.30 | scanline | yes.. PDAs generally don't have acceleration hardware, so it doesn't matter |
| 03:44.46 | scanline | the screen is much smaller, so it doesn't take that much memory bandwidth to move things around on the screen |
| 03:45.04 | scanline | if you put a 1280x1024 display on a PDA, it would be slow no matter what software it ran |
| 03:45.15 | Crix | got it |
| 03:46.15 | Crix | ok..so i just install a basic distro of linux and it will run? |
| 03:46.39 | scanline | it should. you'll need to compile everything |
| 03:46.53 | Crix | lol |
| 03:47.04 | Crix | not a basic distro then |
| 03:47.27 | scanline | well, you'll need perl, python, autotools, libtool, and gcc |
| 03:47.31 | Crix | i was thinking a kind of linux on a floppy but with picogui |
| 03:47.34 | scanline | oh |
| 03:47.42 | captain_proton | perl? |
| 03:47.45 | scanline | you could compile things on a regular linux system, then run the binaries from a floppy |
| 03:47.51 | Crix | say could someone make a boot floppy with it |
| 03:47.53 | scanline | captain_proton: font compiler is written in perl |
| 03:47.57 | Crix | so it could be run? |
| 03:48.03 | captain_proton | eek |
| 03:48.03 | scanline | Crix: sure |
| 03:48.13 | scanline | captain_proton: yeah, it's pretty messy... |
| 03:48.20 | scanline | captain_proton: symbol table generator for themec is also in perl |
| 03:48.20 | Crix | Just like Qnx did with photon? |
| 03:48.21 | Xentac | scanline: hehehe... Micah's picogui disk (ala Tom's Root Boot) |
| 03:48.36 | Crix | It already exists? |
| 03:48.41 | scanline | captain_proton: themec should be all redone in python so it can integrate with widget templates... font compiler should be done in python to integrate with the build system |
| 03:49.04 | scanline | Crix: doesn't exist yet, but there really isn't any reason why not |
| 03:49.27 | scanline | lack of apps maybe |
| 03:49.35 | Crix | lol |
| 03:50.09 | Crix | i had qnx installed...because of that disk |
| 03:50.16 | scanline | yay |
| 03:50.21 | scanline | apache2 functions |
| 03:50.27 | Crix | i loved the fact that a nice gui could run on one floppy only |
| 03:50.31 | scanline | can someone outside the university try visiting https://navi.picogui.org:3000/ please? |
| 03:50.38 | Crix | then i downloaded the hole o.s. |
| 03:51.39 | scanline | whoops.. it seems I nuked my webmail installation |
| 03:51.50 | captain_proton | oop |
| 03:52.43 | scanline | hehe |
| 03:52.55 | scanline | apache2 has 404 errors written in XHTML 1.0 Strict |
| 03:53.51 | Crix | Scanline...could you make a disk for me (and for everybody) |
| 03:53.53 | Crix | ? |
| 03:53.59 | Crix | just for me to try |
| 03:54.08 | scanline | maybe later |
| 03:54.13 | Crix | yea sure |
| 03:54.16 | scanline | right now we have no working launcher |
| 03:54.31 | Crix | working launcher? |
| 03:54.36 | Crix | wat´s that? |
| 03:54.40 | scanline | thingy for launching applications |
| 03:54.45 | Crix | oh |
| 03:54.49 | scanline | we have a launcher, but it doesn't work |
| 03:54.54 | Crix | lol |
| 03:55.14 | Crix | so the gui doesn't do anything |
| 03:55.17 | scanline | I planned on rewriting the launcher, but that would depend on the app-server, and I'll probably just wait for the new design to implement the app server |
| 03:55.31 | scanline | oh, the GUI works fine, you just have to launch applications from the terminal |
| 03:55.40 | Crix | but i've read something about picolinux on the web |
| 03:55.54 | Crix | it means picolinux doens't work? |
| 03:55.55 | scanline | in all the cases where picogui's actually bein used right now, it's either only running one app, or there's a custom launcher being used |
| 03:56.06 | Crix | ok |
| 03:56.07 | scanline | Crix: picolinux probably works, but it hasn't been updated in a while |
| 03:56.18 | Crix | so it uses an old version |
| 03:56.23 | captain_proton | scanline: literati? |
| 03:56.24 | scanline | picogui's launcher used to work, but when carpman added res_c hooks that broke it |
| 03:56.34 | Crix | lol |
| 03:56.44 | Crix | looks like he screwed it up |
| 03:56.48 | scanline | no |
| 03:56.52 | Crix | :-) |
| 03:57.01 | Crix | what is res_c for? |
| 03:57.03 | scanline | it was a step in the right direction, just happens that the res_c stuff isn't done yet |
| 03:57.20 | scanline | res_c was a library to handle storing configuration data and other resources on behalf of applications |
| 03:57.26 | scanline | it would simplify app installation and packaging |
| 03:58.17 | Crix | an install system? |
| 03:58.19 | Crix | nice |
| 03:58.21 | scanline | but we decided that res_c is too much code to tie into a language-dependent library, so that would be moved to an "app server" that has similar functionality but is language and network transparent |
| 03:58.34 | scanline | not an install system really |
| 03:58.44 | scanline | just a way of organizing an app's binary and associated data |
| 03:59.03 | scanline | it would be like how MacOS X bundles an app and its associated data into a directory that appears like a single file to the user |
| 03:59.06 | Xentac | scanline: is that how all this modular server thing was talked about? |
| 03:59.12 | Crix | humm..like its resources (bmp's...and stuff?) |
| 03:59.24 | scanline | Crix: usually widget templates |
| 03:59.31 | Crix | so its a ddl |
| 03:59.33 | Crix | dll |
| 03:59.35 | scanline | no |
| 03:59.43 | Crix | confused |
| 03:59.51 | scanline | it's just a way of storing files |
| 03:59.59 | Crix | like...a zipped file? |
| 04:00.04 | scanline | Crix: no, just files |
| 04:00.07 | Crix | looool |
| 04:00.22 | scanline | Crix: it would usually be a directory, but could take the form of files stuffed inside the app's binary |
| 04:00.25 | Xentac | scanline: I thought of a great name for the new system today |
| 04:00.30 | scanline | Xentac: eh? |
| 04:00.33 | Crix | but couldn't they just simply be in a directory |
| 04:00.52 | scanline | Crix: right. usually they would be a directory, but that wouldn't have to be the case. the app-server would abstract all that |
| 04:00.57 | Xentac | scanline: you said you wanted something that said it was modular and scalable, right? |
| 04:01.02 | scanline | the app would just say it wants to load "theme-foo" from its resources |
| 04:01.16 | Xentac | you should use large corporations/associations as examples... |
| 04:01.29 | scanline | the app doesn't care what language you speak, or where that's actually stored... the app-server does, and it can find the particular file |
| 04:01.33 | scanline | Xentac: uh oh |
| 04:01.56 | Xentac | like this one: European Bank for Reconstruction and Development (it's a bank that was created for reconstruction and development...) |
| 04:02.09 | Xentac | you should call it The GUI That's Scalable and Modular |
| 04:02.12 | Xentac | TGTSM |
| 04:02.17 | Crix | loooooooool |
| 04:02.33 | scanline | Xentac: I think I'll stick with PicoGUI over TGTSM thankyouverymuch ;) |
| 04:02.37 | Xentac | hehehe |
| 04:02.48 | Xentac | but come on... it's worth a chuckle ;o) |
| 04:02.52 | scanline | yep |
| 04:02.53 | Xentac | I laughed when I thought of it |
| 04:03.18 | Xentac | they aren't all that inventive with names... |
| 04:03.23 | Crix | ok...so its like...java |
| 04:03.30 | Crix | you make the program |
| 04:03.37 | Crix | and it will run on any machine |
| 04:03.45 | scanline | ahh |
| 04:03.52 | Crix | did i get it? |
| 04:04.00 | scanline | Crix: huh? |
| 04:04.01 | Xentac | scanline: that would break webmail... |
| 04:04.02 | Crix | or maybe not...? |
| 04:04.17 | Crix | lol guess not |
| 04:04.20 | scanline | Crix: well, from the GUI standpoint sort of |
| 04:04.27 | Crix | HA! |
| 04:04.27 | scanline | PicoGUI doesn't do anything for binary compatibility |
| 04:04.53 | scanline | if you want something to run on multiple platforms, you have to write it in an interpreted language like Python or Java, or provide multiple binaries |
| 04:05.04 | scanline | but picogui will try to make sure that your GUI can run on many different platforms |
| 04:05.29 | captain_proton | so long as "many platforms" means LINUX ;) |
| 04:05.35 | Crix | lol |
| 04:05.36 | scanline | haha |
| 04:05.43 | Crix | unix |
| 04:05.47 | Crix | you meant |
| 04:05.48 | Xentac | captain_proton: ssssh, I think he's talking about "theory" |
| 04:05.51 | scanline | yeah, the current system has issues with platforms other than linux, mainly because of the build system |
| 04:06.04 | captain_proton | actually picogui *probably* runs on irix |
| 04:06.06 | scanline | the new build system we have planned will work on anything python supports |
| 04:06.12 | ahnkana | AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHH |
| 04:06.17 | scanline | captain_proton: someone ran it on NetBSD a while ago |
| 04:06.17 | ahnkana | capa sucks |
| 04:06.19 | Xentac | hey ahnkana |
| 04:06.21 | captain_proton | ahnkana: enjoying your physics? |
| 04:06.26 | Xentac | capa? |
| 04:06.45 | Crix | so it will run over phyton? |
| 04:06.49 | Crix | only' |
| 04:06.49 | Crix | ? |
| 04:06.54 | ahnkana | captain_proton: almost done |
| 04:07.01 | ahnkana | annoyed by the last 3 |
| 04:07.06 | scanline | Crix: python is one of several programming languages picogui supports |
| 04:07.38 | scanline | The two languages that are really supported at this point are python and C, but there is some support for a few others |
| 04:07.46 | scanline | waba, lua, tcl, and perl for example |
| 04:08.06 | scanline | eventually those client libs will mature, and support for other languages like C++ and Self will be added |
| 04:08.08 | Crix | but thats scripting languages |
| 04:08.14 | Crix | right? |
| 04:08.17 | scanline | some wacko might even add a CORBA interface |
| 04:08.29 | scanline | Crix: scripting language is a loose definition |
| 04:08.56 | Crix | ok...once it is compiled, and under binary form..it really doens't matter right? |
| 04:08.57 | ahnkana | Xentac: computer assisted physics assignment |
| 04:09.04 | Xentac | ahnkana: I see... |
| 04:09.22 | scanline | Crix: well, if your code is compiled that makes a binary that only runs on one CPU usually |
| 04:09.33 | scanline | some languages compile to a bytecode that can then be interpreted on any CPU |
| 04:09.47 | ahnkana | Xentac: physics hw |
| 04:09.48 | ahnkana | yuck |
| 04:09.50 | scanline | python, and java fall into this category |
| 04:09.57 | scanline | perl to some extent |
| 04:10.10 | captain_proton | perl is compiled? |
| 04:10.11 | captain_proton | :) |
| 04:10.15 | scanline | it can be |
| 04:10.18 | Crix | but that makes the ting go slower usually, does not? |
| 04:10.27 | Xentac | ahnkana: I figured out that much... |
| 04:10.46 | scanline | Crix: interpreted languages are slower than compiled, but in most cases it doesn't matter that much |
| 04:10.49 | Xentac | that must be one of the reasons I'm so stupid |
| 04:10.49 | ahnkana | captain_proton: what was it that it that dan wanted me to watch |
| 04:11.07 | Crix | well...on a pda that must make a difference |
| 04:11.08 | ahnkana | Xentac: we have to do it for 1st, 2nd, and 3rd semesters of physics |
| 04:11.10 | captain_proton | wallace and gromit |
| 04:11.18 | ahnkana | lucky me, i only have to take two semesters |
| 04:11.21 | scanline | Crix: take python for example- it's way easier to program in than C, C++, Java, or perl. It executes slower than C or C++, but since it's usually only used for very high level code that doesn't matter |
| 04:11.25 | ahnkana | captain_proton: how long is that? |
| 04:11.29 | Xentac | ahnkana: what program are you in? |
| 04:11.30 | scanline | Crix: python has been used on PDAs just fine |
| 04:11.38 | ahnkana | Xentac: aerospace |
| 04:11.43 | captain_proton | ahnkana: they're fairly short |
| 04:11.44 | Xentac | ah |
| 04:11.48 | captain_proton | about a half hour |
| 04:11.50 | scanline | Crix: lalo has a distro for the VR3 (a 75mhz MIPS handheld) that runs python |
| 04:11.51 | Crix | humm..I'm learning..COOL! |
| 04:12.04 | Crix | a distro of..? |
| 04:12.12 | scanline | Crix: all the CPU intensive stuff (numerical calculation, drawing on the screen, etc.) is handled by C code |
| 04:12.26 | scanline | PDA distro combining linux, python, and picogui |
| 04:12.32 | Crix | oh |
| 04:12.32 | scanline | http://flyingcircus.sf.net |
| 04:12.32 | Crix | lalo |
| 04:12.35 | Crix | ok |
| 04:12.38 | ahnkana | Xentac: what are you? |
| 04:12.42 | scanline | er, that might not be the right URL |
| 04:12.44 | Xentac | ahnkana: straight CS |
| 04:12.49 | Crix | i'm looking at it right now |
| 04:12.49 | ahnkana | lol |
| 04:12.52 | ahnkana | cool |
| 04:12.52 | scanline | http://sourceforge.net/projects/flyingcircus |
| 04:12.58 | captain_proton | whack an asteroid! |
| 04:13.01 | Crix | lol |
| 04:13.10 | Crix | i can't see nothing here :-) |
| 04:13.29 | Crix | ok |
| 04:13.29 | Crix | done |
| 04:13.40 | Xentac | so I can do things like prove that you can take any regular expression and express it in a Deterministic Finite Automata... |
| 04:13.46 | Crix | but thats a older version of picogui |
| 04:14.23 | scanline | Crix: what is? |
| 04:14.31 | scanline | flyingcircus isn't that old |
| 04:14.35 | scanline | not nearly as old as picolinux |
| 04:14.50 | Crix | but it runs apps? |
| 04:15.02 | Crix | with their onw app launcher? |
| 04:15.19 | Xentac | or build an operating system (in theory)... |
| 04:15.20 | scanline | I think he's using the launcher code from before it broke |
| 04:15.21 | ahnkana | captain_proton: when would you want to watch? |
| 04:15.30 | captain_proton | ahnkana: anytime |
| 04:18.23 | Crix | so the previous version works just fine... |
| 04:18.41 | Crix | and will the older version apps work in the future new one? |
| 04:19.16 | Xentac | investimigating, eh? |
| 04:19.48 | scanline | Crix: the new architecture will break binary compatibility for sure. It may or may not break source compatibility |
| 04:20.15 | captain_proton | Xentac: yes |
| 04:20.46 | Crix | ok |
| 04:21.19 | scanline | we'll probably want to change some aspects of the widget model picogui uses, but it wouldn't be that hard to provide a glue library for source compatibility with existing code |
| 04:21.24 | Crix | well i guess ill better go to sleep know..got lots of info to digest, and work starts at 8:30 a.m (4:22 now) |
| 04:21.33 | scanline | good night |
| 04:21.41 | Crix | good night to you all to |
| 04:21.57 | Crix | and thank's for all you help and patience |
| 04:22.06 | Crix | see ya |
| 04:22.11 | scanline | oh captain_proton... I have Dirk Grunwald for "Computer performance modeling".. his lectures are very 'interesting' |
| 04:22.19 | *** part/#picogui Crix (Conde_Afon@213.13.246.247) |
| 04:22.38 | captain_proton | scanline: you'll probably get to analyze some 802.11g equipment later in the semester |
| 04:22.47 | scanline | today he said something about flipping a fair 100-sided coin |
| 04:22.59 | captain_proton | :) |
| 04:23.31 | scanline | mm... bandwidth... |
| 04:23.35 | Xentac | scanline: I've had teachers say that |
| 04:23.42 | Xentac | it was a stats class... |
| 04:24.17 | ahnkana | lurgyman is weird |
| 04:24.26 | ahnkana | and that's all i have to say about that |
| 04:24.38 | captain_proton | did lurgyman just go visit? |
| 04:24.38 | Xentac | ahnkana: but isn't that why you like him...? |
| 04:24.40 | ahnkana | he's standing right behind me isn't he...oh wait you fools wouldn't know...yes he is |
| 04:25.22 | ahnkana | <PROTECTED> |
| 04:25.37 | ahnkana | ugg....the smelll..... |
| 04:25.57 | captain_proton | they're cooked |
| 04:26.48 | captain_proton | hahahahahahahahaha |
| 04:26.53 | captain_proton | dan just told me what he said to you |
| 04:27.17 | ahnkana | bad puns shoudl be avoided...or some people might get de-capa-tated |
| 04:27.30 | captain_proton | =) |
| 04:28.09 | captain_proton | now he's going around trying to get smacked |
| 04:28.14 | ahnkana | Xentac: i hold nothing against lurgyman, he is a good friend of mine |
| 04:28.35 | ahnkana | suggestion: take micah's other chair....the one he's sitting in |
| 04:28.57 | ahnkana | he will get smacked |
| 04:29.00 | scanline | ha |
| 04:29.09 | captain_proton | its unes-capa-ble |
| 04:29.12 | scanline | I don't think he wants this chair, his is better |
| 04:29.53 | *** join/#picogui lurgyman (~lurgyman@aden2-123-dhcp.resnet.Colorado.EDU) |
| 04:30.02 | scanline | arr! |
| 04:30.04 | ahnkana | but scanline: then he'll have both your good chairs, you'll have their bad ones, and dan will have achieved his goal of smackage |
| 04:30.19 | scanline | dan will get an extra-strength smack |
| 04:31.14 | ahnkana | i am in-capa-ble of that |
| 04:31.18 | Xentac | kergoth: have you noticed that rjday or whatever his name is has become one of your groupies? |
| 04:31.29 | kergoth | Xentac: yes, and the weird thign is.. |
| 04:31.38 | kergoth | Xentac: he was one of the guys against me in that big flamefest on zaurus-general |
| 04:31.41 | kergoth | :) |
| 04:31.42 | kergoth | hehe |
| 04:31.48 | Xentac | wasn't he the guy that started it? |
| 04:31.53 | kergoth | naw, he was the second guy |
| 04:32.11 | Xentac | oh, alrighty... I thought he was the one that coined the phrase though... |
| 04:32.28 | kergoth | Xentac: could be |
| 04:32.36 | ahnkana | how many of them would notice is the better question |
| 04:32.47 | lurgyman | it's very quiet in there |
| 04:32.50 | ahnkana | maybe if you go nd kiss kevin, galina might get pissed |
| 04:33.07 | ahnkana | jk |
| 04:33.11 | captain_proton | that would be an amusing sight |
| 04:33.13 | captain_proton | we could sell tickets |
| 04:33.13 | scanline | indeed |
| 04:33.14 | lurgyman | she'd be -so- jealous... |
| 04:36.46 | ahnkana | <PROTECTED> |
| 04:39.54 | *** join/#picogui darth_iBook (~evanshee@buck27-202-dhcp.resnet.Colorado.EDU) |
| 04:40.03 | ahnkana | darth_iBook!! |
| 04:40.04 | ahnkana | HI |
| 04:40.10 | darth_iBook | hey ahnkana |
| 04:40.14 | darth_iBook | where've u been all day? |
| 04:40.15 | ahnkana | stupid caps |
| 04:40.17 | ahnkana | me? |
| 04:40.20 | ahnkana | around |
| 04:40.32 | darth_iBook | yeah, you're never here when I want to talk to you |
| 04:41.11 | darth_iBook | anyway, travis and I are thinkin about doin some sc tomorrow |
| 04:41.17 | darth_iBook | you want I should make you copies of my cd's? |
| 04:43.10 | ahnkana | yes please |
| 04:43.20 | darth_iBook | oki day |
| 04:43.25 | darth_iBook | when are you done w/ class? |
| 04:43.27 | ahnkana | let me go throught them when we come over tomarrow |
| 04:43.32 | ahnkana | 2 |
| 04:43.46 | ahnkana | did you get your mom |
| 04:43.50 | lurgyman | ahnkana: galina still down there? |
| 04:43.54 | darth_iBook | bugger, that's right |
| 04:45.56 | darth_iBook | there, I e-mailed her |
| 04:46.12 | darth_iBook | but I wasn't plannin on having people over tomorrow, that was saturday that people am comin over |
| 04:46.34 | darth_iBook | I meant did you want copies of starcraft so you can play w/ us tomorrow |
| 04:47.28 | ahnkana | hmm |
| 04:47.33 | ahnkana | possibility |
| 04:47.39 | ahnkana | but i want music cds too |
| 04:47.43 | darth_iBook | ok |
| 04:48.04 | darth_iBook | how bouts I make you a starcraft cd and bring it by tomorrow and you can play if you want or not |
| 04:48.22 | darth_iBook | and I'll make a copy of tumbleweed connection for u 2 |
| 04:48.32 | darth_iBook | and you can look through the rest of my stuff later |
| 05:03.22 | *** part/#picogui whoyouhm (~whoyouhm@dialup-209.244.142.7.Dial1.Providence1.Level3.net) |
| 05:11.11 | captain_proton | wow |
| 05:11.17 | captain_proton | this game sucks so much less when you know how to play it |
| 05:13.56 | scanline | what game?> |
| 05:14.28 | ahnkana | sorta solitare |
| 05:14.29 | ahnkana | that |
| 05:14.35 | ahnkana | should be it's name |
| 05:14.53 | ahnkana | scanline: i just knocked on your door, next time you should answer it |
| 05:15.02 | scanline | oh? I didn't hear |
| 05:15.03 | ahnkana | i am assuming thought that michael isn |
| 05:15.07 | ahnkana | t there |
| 05:15.09 | scanline | michael's asleep |
| 05:15.17 | ahnkana | hmm, that works i guess |
| 05:15.31 | ahnkana | well i was going to ask him a spanish question, but i won't |
| 05:15.32 | ahnkana | oh well |
| 05:15.46 | ahnkana | well that's all i wanted |
| 05:16.04 | ahnkana | stupid names....why is carmen a guys name? |
| 05:17.41 | Xentac | ahnkana: is it? |
| 05:17.50 | ahnkana | captain_proton: can you tear yourself away from sorta solitare and watch that show? |
| 05:17.54 | Xentac | don't you remember Where In The World Is Carmen Sandiego? |
| 05:17.59 | captain_proton | likely so |
| 05:18.05 | ahnkana | Xentac: i don't know, i couldn' |
| 05:18.08 | ahnkana | t ask |
| 05:18.17 | ahnkana | my source of spanish is sleeping |
| 05:21.05 | lurgyman | ahnkana: carmen... car men... seems like a guy name to me... |
| 05:22.58 | ahnkana | me too |
| 05:23.33 | ahnkana | i also write my a's oddly so if it's wrong i cn fix it |
| 05:23.34 | KeyserSoze | isn't "Carmen" the name of a really famous opera? |
| 05:24.33 | KeyserSoze | yup. a quick websearch turned up: "Bizet?s Carmen is reputed to be the most famous opera in the world." |
| 05:25.38 | captain_proton | except in Bizet's "Carmen", Carmen is a woman |
| 05:25.42 | KeyserSoze | lol. i sort-of suspected that "Carmen" might be the name of what turned out to be the world's most famous opera. |
| 05:25.59 | KeyserSoze | um, yeah, everyone know's Carmen is a chick's name |
| 05:26.13 | scanline | captain_proton: wow, I found a non-flash version of the creepy music guy's site |
| 05:26.15 | Xentac | that's what /I/ thought |
| 05:26.16 | scanline | http://artists.iuma.com/IUMA/Bands/Emptyhead/ |
| 05:26.23 | scanline | it's like.. techno elevator music |
| 05:27.05 | captain_proton | yep |
| 05:32.05 | *** join/#picogui vivyan (Viv@aden2-41-dhcp.resnet.Colorado.EDU) |
| 05:32.25 | Xentac | hey vivyan |
| 05:35.28 | *** join/#picogui SoopaVillan (~soopaman@h24-66-55-126.wp.shawcable.net) |
| 05:35.35 | SoopaVillan | arg |
| 05:35.37 | SoopaVillan | no gonk.... |
| 05:51.49 | *** join/#picogui gonkulator (~brandon@h-69-3-54-50.DNVTCO56.covad.net) |
| 05:58.14 | Xentac | scanline: dammit, why must you have so much media on navi? |
| 06:02.02 | gonkulator | Xentac: I have 120 gig of X-files if you want them |
| 06:02.19 | Xentac | nah... not interested in x-files |
| 06:02.25 | Xentac | red dwarf on the other hand... |
| 06:02.34 | gonkulator | ask scanline to mail you CDs |
| 06:02.43 | gonkulator | that has better bandwidth :) |
| 06:02.46 | Xentac | too late... I've only got about 50 meg more... |
| 06:02.47 | Xentac | hehehe |
| 06:04.42 | Xentac | almost 30 meg left... |
| 06:04.46 | Xentac | 30 meg left |
| 06:19.41 | scanline | captain_proton: NFS fixed |
| 06:19.51 | scanline | debian upgrade broke it temporarily |
| 06:20.07 | gonkulator | scanline: was that why you were gone |
| 06:20.15 | scanline | no |
| 06:21.04 | Xentac | woohoo! all scanline's red dwarf are mine! |
| 06:21.55 | scanline | actually.. I should get some mountain dew |
| 06:40.42 | *** join/#picogui captain_proton (~jupiter@aden2-23-dhcp.resnet.Colorado.EDU) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 06:51.33 | *** join/#picogui SoopaVillan (~soopaman@h24-66-55-126.wp.shawcable.net) |
| 06:52.01 | SoopaKoopa | gonk |
| 06:52.04 | SoopaKoopa | you awakr? |
| 06:56.05 | *** join/#picogui SoopaMech (~soopaman@h24-66-55-126.wp.shawcable.net) |
| 07:06.35 | *** part/#picogui ahnkana (~Gnu@aden2-135-dhcp.resnet.Colorado.EDU) |
| 07:10.36 | *** join/#picogui SoopaMech (~soopaman@h24-66-55-126.wp.shawcable.net) |
| 07:16.11 | *** join/#picogui SoopaMech (~soopaman@h24-66-55-126.wp.shawcable.net) |
| 07:40.21 | *** join/#picogui captain_proton (~jupiter@aden2-23-dhcp.resnet.Colorado.EDU) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 08:04.39 | scanline | hmm |
| 08:04.48 | scanline | It's looking like this new design for picogui won't even have a widget server |
| 08:04.55 | captain_proton | oh? |
| 08:05.14 | scanline | why have a widget server when you can have an anything-server? |
| 08:05.24 | captain_proton | explain |
| 08:05.41 | scanline | It was already clear that since the widget server is the only part that maintains persistent state, that the widget server would have to store other handles- things like bitmaps, or widget-specific data |
| 08:05.52 | scanline | and that data could be monitored by the other servers, mostly the layout server |
| 08:06.09 | scanline | and it would have security- by ACLs, capability lists, or something similar |
| 08:06.31 | scanline | the widget server would also be responsible for assigned type IDs, like the IDs used to refer to widgets |
| 08:07.14 | scanline | so, why not just do away with the idea of a widget server, and create a "picogui kernel" that would manage objects that the other servers or clients could create, modify, and monitor according to those security settings |
| 08:07.46 | scanline | that would even let you have separate widget trees in the same server if you needed such a thing- the layout server would just need a handler for a head node to render at the layout system's root |
| 08:08.17 | captain_proton | hmm :) |
| 08:08.18 | scanline | or, you could do something like Plan9 and create a filesystem abstraction on top of the picogui kernel; |
| 08:08.32 | scanline | /dev/picogui/widgets :) |
| 08:08.36 | captain_proton | and you can have multiple renderer servers attached to the microkernel? |
| 08:08.42 | scanline | sure |
| 08:08.46 | scanline | and multiple layout servers |
| 08:09.19 | captain_proton | so |
| 08:09.21 | scanline | It would make the most sense for the widgets themselves to all be separate servers, to make it easy to add new widgets dynamically- though in practice you'd usually compile them into one binary |
| 08:09.21 | captain_proton | think about this |
| 08:09.31 | captain_proton | renderers on the desktop & PDA |
| 08:09.39 | captain_proton | hooked up to the same kernel |
| 08:09.43 | captain_proton | with separate widget trees |
| 08:09.44 | captain_proton | but shared state |
| 08:09.58 | scanline | ooh... how about the ability to have two kernels mirror each other |
| 08:10.11 | scanline | so you could disconnect the PDA, but still have the GUI available on your desktop |
| 08:10.12 | captain_proton | yeah - add a redundancy |
| 08:10.29 | scanline | plug the PDA back in, resynchronize, and you could resume interacting with it |
| 08:10.46 | scanline | so simple, yet so functional :) |
| 08:11.25 | captain_proton | and you could have the ability to connect new renderers to specific layouts |
| 08:11.38 | captain_proton | so i could do something like hook up a remote connection to my PIM when i'm at work |
| 08:11.53 | scanline | and display it with a different theme, etc |
| 08:12.25 | scanline | or like lalo said, run a simple and efficient renderer on the PDA concurrently with the newest whiz-bang translucent hardware accelerated renderer on the desktop |
| 08:12.58 | captain_proton | i would care more about having persistant applications across devices |
| 08:13.12 | scanline | and that would be an even more interesting problem... |
| 08:14.12 | scanline | all the data in the picogui kernel would give you would be widgets... you'd have to save some app-specific data in it so it could be restored on a different device |
| 08:14.20 | scanline | that would be really hard to do in a generic way.. but a fun problem |
| 08:14.36 | captain_proton | implement it in self! |
| 08:14.57 | scanline | hard to google for |
| 08:15.10 | captain_proton | http://research.sun.com/self/ |
| 08:15.10 | scanline | "The search database is down temporarily." |
| 08:15.11 | scanline | bah |
| 08:15.20 | scanline | thanks |
| 08:15.26 | scanline | ibot: self is at http://research.sun.com/self/ |
| 08:15.26 | | scanline: okay |
| 08:16.55 | captain_proton | scanline: or we could implement generic data via COM ;) |
| 08:17.09 | scanline | oh boy, just what I've always wanted |
| 08:17.22 | scanline | still- it's basically the same problem widgets will have |
| 08:17.31 | captain_proton | and it would integrate so well with the picogui DirectX frontend! |
| 08:17.56 | SoopaKoopa | hheeh |
| 08:18.27 | captain_proton | self would be the way to do it if it had the necessary network-transparency its inherintly capable of |
| 08:18.29 | scanline | ibot: ACL vs capability lists is at http://www.eros-os.org/essays/ACLSvCaps.html |
| 08:18.30 | | scanline: okay |
| 08:18.34 | captain_proton | as is, CORBA is likely the best solution |
| 08:18.40 | SoopaKoopa | scanline, have you written any of this down? |
| 08:18.53 | scanline | SoopaKoopa: picogui.org news item, and on the mailing list |
| 08:18.56 | SoopaKoopa | 'cause it seems if diagramed |
| 08:19.02 | SoopaKoopa | it would be incredibly messy |
| 08:19.10 | scanline | I should draw a quick diagram of it |
| 08:19.12 | SoopaKoopa | and almost defeat it's own purpose |
| 08:19.15 | scanline | messy? |
| 08:19.18 | scanline | ha! |
| 08:19.23 | SoopaKoopa | unless i am seeing it wrong |
| 08:19.25 | scanline | the existing code would be messy to diagram |
| 08:19.29 | scanline | this is elegance |
| 08:19.31 | SoopaKoopa | lol |
| 08:19.38 | captain_proton | elegance on a stick |
| 08:19.50 | captain_proton | gimp? |
| 08:19.52 | captain_proton | emerge dia |
| 08:19.53 | SoopaKoopa | well right now, this is just buying a new house instead of cleaning the old |
| 08:19.55 | captain_proton | or emerge xfig |
| 08:20.13 | captain_proton | preferably xfig |
| 08:20.17 | captain_proton | because xfig is l33ter than dia |
| 08:20.19 | scanline | captain_proton: or maybe I'll try sodipodi |
| 08:20.24 | kergoth | scanline: OZ 3.1rc2 is out |
| 08:20.32 | scanline | kergoth: congrats! |
| 08:20.40 | captain_proton | sodipodi? for diagramming? |
| 08:20.40 | SoopaKoopa | ooooh |
| 08:20.41 | captain_proton | eek |
| 08:20.42 | kergoth | thanks. congrats on your rleease as well |
| 08:20.47 | SoopaKoopa | what's new in 3.1rc2? |
| 08:20.51 | scanline | 0.44 didn't really add much ;) |
| 08:20.52 | kergoth | glad to hear you're getting those ideas hashed out for the rewrite |
| 08:21.09 | scanline | kergoth: it should be one hell of a cool GUI if we ever finish it :) |
| 08:21.12 | kergoth | SoopaKoopa: bug fixes. lots of bug fixes. and latest opie of course, which always adds both features and bug fixes |
| 08:21.31 | kergoth | SoopaKoopa: opie-tinykate is in the feeds now.. its kde's kate shrunk down :) |
| 08:21.42 | kergoth | SoopaKoopa: dont have any ipks for the syntax highlight files yet, but its spiffy nonetheless |
| 08:21.45 | SoopaKoopa | kergoth, is your environment still fixed resolution? |
| 08:21.47 | captain_proton | scanline: if we can get those ideas above working, i'll commit to writing a nicely featured PIM |
| 08:21.55 | kergoth | SoopaKoopa: ? |
| 08:22.00 | captain_proton | ;) |
| 08:22.02 | kergoth | SoopaKoopa: I dont understand the question. |
| 08:22.05 | scanline | mmm.. PIM.... |
| 08:22.09 | kergoth | SoopaKoopa: opie works on 640x480 devices, if thats what you mean |
| 08:22.16 | scanline | and maybe lalo will write NIFTY |
| 08:22.18 | SoopaKoopa | i remember wanting to port opie to my webtablets |
| 08:22.22 | captain_proton | NIFTY? |
| 08:22.24 | kergoth | SoopaKoopa: it'll work on them |
| 08:22.31 | kergoth | SoopaKoopa: and if it has any kinks, we can fix them |
| 08:22.32 | SoopaKoopa | but the resolution was fixed, so i was unable to |
| 08:22.44 | kergoth | SoopaKoopa: I'll be working on it some myself. i have a sharp sl-c700 here with a 640x480 lcd. |
| 08:22.45 | SoopaKoopa | kergoth, how static is the resolution |
| 08:22.45 | SoopaKoopa | ? |
| 08:22.47 | scanline | captain_proton: can't remember what the acronym stands for at the moment, but it's a python-scriptable text editor using picogui's textbox widget |
| 08:22.53 | kergoth | SoopaKoopa: to my knowledge it isnt. |
| 08:22.54 | captain_proton | hm |
| 08:23.05 | SoopaKoopa | that would be one thing sweet about iuGui |
| 08:23.11 | SoopaKoopa | or whatever it's called in the end |
| 08:23.11 | scanline | SoopaKoopa: opie can scale, it just doesn't always look good when it does |
| 08:23.12 | captain_proton | X++ DAMNIT |
| 08:23.13 | kergoth | SoopaKoopa: and if it is, it wont be any longer once i have at it :) |
| 08:23.21 | SoopaKoopa | heheh |
| 08:23.33 | scanline | we could go with movie titles :P |
| 08:23.35 | scanline | PicoGUI Reloaded |
| 08:23.37 | SoopaKoopa | i wanted to put opie on my 8x6 |
| 08:23.38 | kergoth | OZ ipaq support should be in in a release or two |
| 08:23.39 | SoopaKoopa | lol |
| 08:23.43 | scanline | Neon Genesis PicoGUI :P |
| 08:23.50 | SoopaKoopa | PicoGUI Evolution |
| 08:24.02 | scanline | PicoGUI strikes back! |
| 08:24.03 | scanline | II! |
| 08:24.03 | SoopaKoopa | PicoGUI Red, White and Blonde |
| 08:24.44 | SoopaKoopa | Super PicoGUI Fighter ][ - Turbo Hyperfighting |
| 08:24.44 | captain_proton | PicoGUI II: The Wrath of X |
| 08:24.53 | scanline | haha |
| 08:25.05 | kergoth | lol |
| 08:25.31 | scanline | hmm |
| 08:25.59 | scanline | "navi.picogui.org received a message with incorrect Message Authentication Code. If the error occurs frequently, contact the website administrator." |
| 08:29.22 | SoopaKoopa | kergoth`zzz, where are the latest ss's for opie? |
| 08:38.08 | *** join/#picogui Piete (~abri@61.98.19.77) |
| 08:40.03 | *** join/#picogui ibot (ibot@rikers.org) |
| 08:40.03 | *** topic/#picogui is http://picogui.org || If nobody here answers your question, try the pgui-devel mailing list || PicoGUI v0.44 "Polygons of the Apocalypse" released |
| 09:04.38 | SoopaKoopa | damn.. iuGui should rock.... |
| 09:25.16 | *** join/#picogui Tal-BBL (bleh@d3t4.arach.net.au) |
| 09:40.52 | *** join/#picogui scanline (~jetstream@161.97.199.99) |
| 09:44.09 | scanline | What error message did my client terminate with? |
| 09:52.43 | gonkulator | ibot: seen scanline |
| 09:52.43 | | gonkulator: i haven't seen 'scanline ' |
| 09:52.46 | gonkulator | ibot: seen scanline |
| 09:52.46 | | scanline is currently on #picogui (2m 31s) #openembedded (2m 31s) #bzflag (2m 31s). Has said a total of 8 messages. Is idling for 1m 22s |
| 09:53.01 | gonkulator | scanline: your client terminated with a "timed out" |
| 10:36.56 | SoopaKoopa | neo gui sounds cool |
| 10:37.19 | SoopaKoopa | gonk |
| 10:37.33 | SoopaKoopa | your wireless linux compile pooped out on me |
| 10:38.03 | *** join/#picogui captain_pistachi (~jupiter@aden2-23-dhcp.resnet.Colorado.EDU) |
| 11:44.46 | *** join/#picogui file (~lan@mctn1-2387.nb.aliant.net) |
| 13:36.54 | *** join/#picogui fraggle (~fraggle@tuneless.plus.com) |
| 14:14.27 | *** join/#picogui carpman{mayuka} (~djackson@dsl081-122-066.dfw1.dsl.speakeasy.net) |
| 14:16.06 | carpman{mayuka} | good morning all |
| 14:31.16 | file | hi |
| 14:35.36 | merlin262 | hey carpman{mayuka} |
| 14:35.41 | merlin262 | how's it going? |
| 14:37.18 | carpman{mayuka} | merlin262: not bad. Saving up for a car. |
| 14:37.39 | merlin262 | ahhh.. |
| 14:37.44 | merlin262 | can understand that |
| 14:38.03 | merlin262 | I've started working on my various programming projects again |
| 14:38.03 | merlin262 | ze burnout is over |
| 14:38.06 | carpman{mayuka} | w00t! |
| 14:38.36 | merlin262 | have you read all the stuff that Micah is planning for picogui? |
| 14:38.39 | merlin262 | sounds Nifty |
| 14:38.43 | carpman{mayuka} | some, I've been busy. |
| 14:38.46 | file | lol @ his machine |
| 14:38.59 | file | try pinging 156.34.185.83 |
| 14:39.26 | carpman{mayuka} | no ping, so what? |
| 14:39.50 | file | carpman{mayuka}: my firewall... which I didn't know I had... |
| 14:40.43 | carpman{mayuka} | hehe, almost everyone I work with is sick. The office is quite empty today. |
| 14:40.51 | file | off to iptables configuration I go |
| 14:43.10 | *** join/#picogui SoopaKoopa (~soopaman@h24-66-55-126.wp.shawcable.net) |
| 15:10.32 | file | hi Xentac |
| 15:10.43 | Xentac | hi file |
| 15:21.04 | *** join/#picogui file (~lan@mctn1-2387.nb.aliant.net) |
| 15:55.55 | *** join/#picogui darth_iBook (~evanshee@duan96-163-dhcp.Colorado.EDU) |
| 16:02.07 | file | hello kergoth |
| 16:02.13 | kergoth | hey file, hows it going |
| 16:02.19 | file | good good |
| 16:02.24 | file | done my exams :) |
| 16:02.57 | kergoth | ah nice |
| 16:03.51 | file | you? |
| 16:06.02 | carpman{mayuka} | You know, I've been absent alot lately, and I think something is missing from this chat room... |
| 16:06.12 | carpman{mayuka} | Ah... much better. |
| 16:07.45 | file | carpman{mayuka}: that has grown very old, scanline has made a shut up bot - that's better :p |
| 16:09.03 | carpman{mayuka} | speaking of bots... where is PicoBOT? |
| 16:09.31 | file | scanline is having... problems |
| 16:09.39 | file | they filtered port 6667 for him LOL |
| 16:09.47 | carpman{mayuka} | ack |
| 16:10.10 | carpman{mayuka} | why? |
| 16:10.30 | file | Unknown. |
| 16:10.47 | darth_iBook | lol |
| 16:11.10 | file | Requested information is not available! |
| 16:16.36 | Vivyan|dead | blah |
| 16:17.08 | VivyanAngel | i do not want to be up... =\ |
| 16:17.24 | darth_iBook | heh, I had to be up for 8am calc =P |
| 16:17.56 | darth_iBook | VivyanAngel: are you eating lunch again at 11 today in farrand? |
| 16:18.06 | VivyanAngel | yes |
| 16:18.12 | darth_iBook | mind if I join u? |
| 16:18.16 | VivyanAngel | sure |
| 16:18.21 | darth_iBook | coo |
| 16:18.34 | darth_iBook | ? |
| 16:18.43 | VivyanAngel | sorry i didn't come with you guys the other day |
| 16:18.50 | darth_iBook | =P |
| 16:18.53 | darth_iBook | you missed a good dinner |
| 16:18.57 | file | can I come too???? |
| 16:18.58 | VivyanAngel | i was actually done and ready to go 2 minutes after you guys left |
| 16:19.04 | darth_iBook | lol |
| 16:19.14 | VivyanAngel | i just had to finish a quest |
| 16:19.15 | darth_iBook | we coulda waited if you'd said so |
| 16:19.25 | VivyanAngel | nah jen was angry |
| 16:19.32 | darth_iBook | she was? |
| 16:19.37 | VivyanAngel | seemed like it |
| 16:19.50 | darth_iBook | I thought she was just bein silly |
| 16:20.50 | VivyanAngel | i don't think she understands the concept that i can't just pick up and leave the game.... there are other people involved and quests that are set on timers |
| 16:20.52 | darth_iBook | would u be up for some sc tonight perhaps? |
| 16:21.02 | VivyanAngel | once you start you have say 2 hours to compelete |
| 16:21.12 | VivyanAngel | um i don't have my cd's here |
| 16:21.22 | darth_iBook | do you have it installed? |
| 16:21.33 | VivyanAngel | um lemme chk desktop 1 sec |
| 16:21.52 | VivyanAngel | yes it's installed |
| 16:22.02 | darth_iBook | I can give you a brood war cd then |
| 16:22.07 | darth_iBook | as long as you have your own cd key |
| 16:22.38 | darth_iBook | if you wanna play, that is |
| 16:22.58 | VivyanAngel | ok... =) |
| 16:23.06 | darth_iBook | cool |
| 16:23.15 | darth_iBook | travis and I are trying to get a bunch of people for a biggish game |
| 16:23.15 | VivyanAngel | my head hurts =\ |
| 16:23.31 | darth_iBook | I'm sorry |
| 16:23.38 | carpman{mayuka} | hmm... I could play |
| 16:23.47 | darth_iBook | carpman{mayuka}: you want to? |
| 16:23.48 | carpman{mayuka} | I suck, ask gonkulator. I'm meat. :) |
| 16:23.57 | darth_iBook | s'ok, so does travis ^_^ |
| 16:23.59 | carpman{mayuka} | darth_iBook: sure, what time? |
| 16:24.00 | darth_iBook | and me as well |
| 16:24.03 | darth_iBook | dunno |
| 16:24.06 | darth_iBook | will u be here? |
| 16:24.17 | carpman{mayuka} | yeah, I'm staying home tongiht. |
| 16:24.26 | darth_iBook | k, if you're here I will come get u |
| 16:24.42 | VivyanAngel | where to meet you at 11? |
| 16:24.56 | carpman{mayuka} | at A-Kon, Dan and Gonk ate me alive at SC |
| 16:25.08 | darth_iBook | they do that to me at LAN parties all the time |
| 16:25.14 | *** join/#picogui prae (~prae@62.212.100.153) |
| 16:26.51 | darth_iBook | Mmmmm... vectors |
| 16:30.04 | VivyanAngel | darth, where should i meet you at 11? |
| 16:31.05 | darth_iBook | outside the cafeteria, where we ran into each other on wed. |
| 16:31.08 | darth_iBook | ok? |
| 16:32.04 | VivyanAngel | k |
| 16:32.19 | darth_iBook | cool |
| 16:32.33 | VivyanAngel | it'll be like 11:05-11:10 i have to walk from chem back |
| 16:32.58 | darth_iBook | np |
| 16:33.05 | darth_iBook | I'll wait out front |
| 16:36.20 | darth_iBook | w00t for 3d motion ^_^ |
| 16:38.33 | darth_iBook | lol, this prof is kinda funny |
| 16:38.39 | file | clarify |
| 16:38.51 | darth_iBook | he just talks funny |
| 16:38.55 | file | oh ic |
| 16:39.23 | VivyanAngel | darth, know where i could get a no-cd crack for sc? |
| 16:39.27 | darth_iBook | lol, he's throwin stuff to demonstrate things |
| 16:39.33 | file | darth_iBook: evil |
| 16:39.43 | darth_iBook | gonkulator might be able to find one for you |
| 16:39.56 | hikke | sc? |
| 16:39.59 | darth_iBook | our friend ben had something that let him use an iso instead of a cd |
| 16:40.06 | darth_iBook | but I can bring you a cd this afternoon |
| 16:40.11 | darth_iBook | I have a couple burned copies |
| 16:40.45 | hikke | Daemon tools let's you mount a cd-image as a virtual cdrom drive in windows... |
| 16:41.12 | VivyanAngel | what class are you in darth? |
| 16:41.19 | darth_iBook | physics |
| 16:41.27 | VivyanAngel | fun |
| 16:41.36 | darth_iBook | lurgyman is here too |
| 16:41.49 | VivyanAngel | don't know who that is |
| 16:42.14 | VivyanAngel | does the chem building have wireless? btw i thought the physics building didn't have wireless |
| 16:42.28 | darth_iBook | it does |
| 16:42.37 | darth_iBook | and I dunno about the chem building |
| 16:45.23 | file | clarify!!!!! |
| 16:45.57 | darth_iBook | the one where you shoot at a falling object |
| 16:46.29 | file | oh ic |
| 16:47.19 | darth_iBook | heh, he killed the 'monkey' |
| 16:47.45 | file | nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo |
| 16:48.57 | VivyanAngel | lol physics 1 |
| 16:49.04 | darth_iBook | yeah |
| 16:50.45 | darth_iBook | lol |
| 16:51.23 | darth_iBook | well, class over, bbiab |
| 17:01.39 | carpman{mayuka} | file: yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeees |
| 17:01.56 | file | carpman{mayuka}: what |
| 17:02.29 | carpman{mayuka} | I dunno, I was just contradicting you. |
| 17:02.35 | file | oh ic |
| 17:02.37 | file | good job |
| 17:03.22 | *** join/#picogui darth_iBook (~evanshee@tcom99-243-dhcp.Colorado.EDU) |
| 17:03.41 | darth_iBook | c'mon, admit it, you're glad to see me |
| 17:04.59 | file | no, not really ;) |
| 17:05.40 | darth_iBook | =P |
| 17:25.48 | file | darth_iBook: what'cha doing? |
| 17:26.27 | darth_iBook | trying to make emacs behave in os x |
| 17:26.31 | darth_iBook | what are you doing? |
| 17:27.07 | file | pondering going to sleep |
| 17:27.16 | darth_iBook | what time is it where you are? |
| 17:27.39 | file | 1:25PM |
| 17:27.46 | file | I went to bed at midnight, and got up at 7:30AM |
| 17:28.06 | darth_iBook | oh |
| 17:28.06 | file | I require more rest |
| 17:28.15 | darth_iBook | sounds like me, but I don't require more rest |
| 17:28.23 | file | EVIL!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
| 17:28.26 | file | Your possessed!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
| 17:28.50 | darth_iBook | no, just used to it |
| 17:29.08 | darth_iBook | file: how much do you know about c++? |
| 17:29.18 | file | I do C... not C++ |
| 17:29.31 | darth_iBook | ok |
| 17:29.49 | file | what do you require? |
| 17:30.12 | darth_iBook | just wondering if you could tell me the difference between .cxx and .cpp |
| 17:30.19 | file | nope |
| 17:36.45 | darth_iBook | xemacs is too unstable on os x |
| 17:38.11 | file | I bet |
| 17:43.30 | *** join/#picogui proton-work (~jupiter@aden2-23-dhcp.resnet.Colorado.EDU) |
| 17:43.40 | darth_iBook | hey proton-work |
| 17:44.41 | proton-work | hi |
| 17:47.31 | file | hi proton, how are you? |
| 17:50.23 | proton-work | decent |
| 18:49.26 | *** join/#picogui SoopaKoop (~soopaman@h24-66-55-126.wp.shawcable.net) |
| 18:50.56 | SoopaKoop | hahaha |
| 18:50.56 | SoopaKoop | polygons of the apocalypse |
| 18:51.23 | SoopaKoop | kergoth, you around/awake? |
| 18:51.58 | kergoth | SoopaKoop: yeah, whats up |
| 18:52.58 | SoopaKoop | trying to figure out what environment i need to put OZ on my internet appliances |
| 18:53.12 | file | a warm nice family environment would be nice |
| 18:54.28 | SoopaKoop | yeah but this is the new millenium |
| 18:54.51 | SoopaKoop | OS's don't need that |
| 18:54.53 | kergoth | SoopaKoop: grab the buildroot |
| 18:55.02 | kergoth | SoopaKoop: and add your target device to the configuration system |
| 18:55.04 | kergoth | SoopaKoop: play around |
| 18:55.15 | kergoth | ibot: oz buildroot |
| 18:55.16 | | it has been said that oz bk is bk clone http://openzaurus.bkbits.net/buildroot buildroot-oz; cd buildroot-oz; bk -r co -q; cp def-configs/openzaurus .config; make oldconfig; make or see bitkeeper (free download but non-gpl) or see 'oz snapshot' if you don't want to use bk |
| 18:57.36 | *** join/#picogui scanline (~jetstream@161.97.199.99) |
| 19:00.33 | *** join/#picogui scanline (~micah@aden2-242-dhcp.Colorado.EDU) |
| 19:01.09 | SoopaKoop | kergoth, any more info.. this makes no sense to me |
| 19:01.24 | file | hi scanline |
| 19:01.32 | kergoth | SoopaKoop: buildroot is the buildsystem used to produce OZ |
| 19:01.39 | scanline | hi file |
| 19:01.42 | kergoth | SoopaKoop: it already supporst the ADS development boards, the ramses industrial pda, and the zaurus |
| 19:01.48 | SoopaKoop | so would that be like a cross compiling environment? |
| 19:01.49 | scanline | I had to change my IP again before I could connect to freenode... |
| 19:01.51 | kergoth | SoopaKoop: adding a new platform is easy |
| 19:02.03 | kergoth | SoopaKoop: it uses a crosscompiler you have installed, or you can have it build one for you |
| 19:02.32 | file | scanline: they're after you |
| 19:02.37 | SoopaKoop | any readme's/faq's i can check out |
| 19:03.33 | kergoth | SoopaKoop: the documentation is in the buildroot |
| 19:03.40 | kergoth | SoopaKoop: install bitkeeper and run those commands, or get a snapshot |
| 19:03.43 | kergoth | ibot: oz snapshot |
| 19:03.44 | | extra, extra, read all about it, oz snapshot is http://openzaurus.sourceforge.net/snapshot/ or updated every 4 hours by Navi or this is a snapshot of the bk oz buildroot tree use it to compile your own OZ if you don't want to use BK |
| 19:03.44 | SoopaKoop | ok |
| 19:03.54 | kergoth | SoopaKoop: and read the docs in the docs/ dir |
| 19:03.56 | SoopaKoop | snap shot sounds better for me |
| 19:04.01 | kergoth | SoopaKoop: there are also a couple faqs in openzaurus.org |
| 19:04.06 | kergoth | SoopaKoop: in the faq system under buildroot |
| 19:10.30 | SoopaKoop | ok |
| 19:11.37 | kergoth | SoopaKoop: what arch is this platform? |
| 19:20.51 | scanline | ugh |
| 19:21.07 | SoopaKoop | kergoth, transmeta crusoe |
| 19:21.10 | file | scanline: what's the matter? |
| 19:21.14 | SoopaKoop | even though x86 would work |
| 19:22.10 | scanline | file: just a little annoyed at having to walk Mark Juszczec on the pgui-devel list through every little step of debugging picogui on the helio, especially when he's doing everything by hand and using these ancient libraries |
| 19:22.15 | kergoth | SoopaKoop: right. there exists a x86 target in the config system, but you could add a crusoe specific one to add crusoe specific optimizations if you like |
| 19:22.29 | file | scanline: yuck |
| 19:22.33 | kergoth | SoopaKoop: the buildsystem will pass down the optimizations into each package build |
| 19:22.47 | SoopaKoop | yeah sounds just like my build system.. |
| 19:22.56 | SoopaKoop | what kind of footprint does it need? |
| 19:23.23 | kergoth | SoopaKoop: it downloads every package from upstream.. in total it'll end up taking around 1.2-1.5 gigs for sources and extracted sources |
| 19:23.44 | *** join/#picogui Xentac (jchu@amga45cyy30x9.bc.hsia.telus.net) |
| 19:23.59 | kergoth | SoopaKoop: but of course it depends on how many packages you are building |
| 19:24.03 | file | hi Xentac of the west. |
| 19:24.54 | Xentac | hail file of the east |
| 19:25.10 | SoopaKoop | hmm... |
| 19:25.12 | *** topic/#picogui by scanline -> http://picogui.org || If nobody here answers your question, try the pgui-devel mailing list || PicoGUI v0.44 "Polygons of the Apocalypse" released || New architecture under design: http://picogui.org/doc/neopicogui.png |
| 19:25.22 | SoopaKoop | how do you configure your package system? |
| 19:25.45 | kergoth | run make menuconfig |
| 19:25.51 | kergoth | or make xconfig |
| 19:25.52 | kergoth | or what have you |
| 19:26.00 | Xentac | scanline: your png crashed netscape 4.71 ;o) |
| 19:26.03 | scanline | ha |
| 19:26.11 | scanline | Xentac: there are .pdf and .dia files by the same name |
| 19:26.28 | SoopaKoop | scanline, there is redundancy in your design already (that or a slight over look |
| 19:26.43 | scanline | ? |
| 19:27.07 | scanline | SoopaKoop: make sure you understand what it's saying first, then get back to me.. I'm going to get some lunch |
| 19:27.10 | SoopaKoop | remote and local server output should be in one stream |
| 19:27.11 | Xentac | hmmm... |
| 19:27.23 | SoopaKoop | instead of 2 different branches |
| 19:27.32 | SoopaKoop | if i am reading it properly |
| 19:27.34 | scanline | SoopaKoop: you didn't read the descriptions for each module |
| 19:27.46 | scanline | SoopaKoop: sure, you could just hook multiple I/O servers up to one layout server |
| 19:28.07 | scanline | SoopaKoop: what this is doing, is letting you have multiple displays operating at completely different resolutions with completely different themes |
| 19:28.34 | scanline | In this example, the "Remote Machine" is displaying the exact same screen to VNC clients and to a touchscreen |
| 19:28.35 | file | Xentac: what's up? |
| 19:28.40 | SoopaKoop | so where would multimonitor fit in? |
| 19:28.57 | Xentac | file: not too much... just wasting time that I really should be studying with... |
| 19:29.07 | file | Xentac: silly you |
| 19:29.16 | scanline | SoopaKoop: depending on how the I/O servers are implemented, it could be two video drivers running in the same I/O server, or two I/O servers on one layout server |
| 19:29.24 | Xentac | quite |
| 19:29.29 | scanline | anyway.. lunchtime |
| 19:29.39 | file | scanline: FOOD!!!! |
| 19:35.41 | merlin262 | hey scanline |
| 19:36.29 | merlin262 | or not |
| 19:41.33 | merlin262 | blehhhhhhhhh |
| 19:41.34 | merlin262 | reboot |
| 19:41.43 | file | no. |
| 19:45.48 | file | Xentac: I have one thing to say... bye! |
| 19:46.00 | Xentac | file: alrighty then... |
| 19:46.15 | *** join/#picogui merlin262 (~Andrew@crtntx1-ar1-4-60-243-225.crtntx1.dsl-verizon.net) |
| 19:46.54 | file | merlin262: wb monsieur |
| 19:47.16 | merlin262 | merci |
| 19:55.51 | *** join/#picogui SoopaKoop (~soopaman@h24-66-55-126.wp.shawcable.net) |
| 20:06.28 | file | anybody have experience with initrd? |
| 20:07.09 | *** join/#picogui darth_iBook (~evanshee@ec237-15-dhcp.Colorado.EDU) |
| 20:07.27 | darth_iBook | stupid xchat is being a pain |
| 20:39.37 | captain_pistachi | bwahahahaha |
| 20:39.43 | captain_pistachi | 2001:468:501:0A00::/56 is our new netblock :) |
| 20:39.56 | file | uh huh |
| 20:41.40 | scanline | yay for ipv6 |
| 20:41.52 | SoopaKoop | i'm going to stab nvidia in the face |
| 20:41.59 | lalo | hi folks |
| 20:42.33 | scanline | hi lalo |
| 20:42.53 | file | oh no |
| 21:03.26 | prot-stolen-iboo | hm |
| 21:03.41 | file | haha |
| 21:04.00 | *** join/#picogui scan[ibook] (~micah@stad235-155-dhcp.Colorado.EDU) |
| 21:04.07 | file | hi scanline |
| 21:04.10 | scan[ibook] | hello |
| 21:28.27 | prot-stolenibook | its a shame jonny pineapple isn't here |
| 21:28.59 | scan[ibook] | indeed |
| 21:37.39 | *** join/#picogui remy (~Remy@AMetz-102-1-1-100.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 21:44.34 | remy | hi, I need some help to compile picogui |
| 21:45.51 | scan[ibook] | what's the problem? |
| 21:46.02 | prot-stolenibook | scan[ibook]: its YOU! |
| 21:46.15 | scan[ibook] | oh no! |
| 21:46.20 | scan[ibook] | exorcise him! |
| 21:46.24 | scan[ibook] | :) |
| 21:47.54 | remy | well, autogen complains about a missing macro `AM_PROG_LIBTOOL' in pgserver, any idea? |
| 21:49.03 | *** join/#picogui file (jwired@mctn1-2960.nb.aliant.net) |
| 21:58.15 | *** join/#picogui scan[ibook] (~micah@ec237-29-dhcp.Colorado.EDU) |
| 22:04.15 | scan[ibook] | ~x en fr My meatloaf launcher is broken |
| 22:04.38 | scan[ibook] | ~x fr en Mon lanceur de pain de viande est cass |
| 22:05.03 | file | ~x en fr loaf |
| 22:05.10 | file | that's not right |
| 22:05.12 | file | pain is bread |
| 22:26.31 | *** join/#picogui lurgyman (~lurgyman@aden2-123-dhcp.resnet.Colorado.EDU) |
| 22:38.38 | scan[ibook] | ~x fr de fromage |
| 22:39.27 | scan[ibook] | hrm |
| 22:43.18 | *** join/#picogui lurgyman (~lurgyman@aden2-123-dhcp.resnet.Colorado.EDU) |
| 22:44.30 | scan[ibook] | ~x en fr Warning |
| 22:45.35 | *** join/#picogui lurgyman (~lurgyman@aden2-123-dhcp.resnet.Colorado.EDU) |
| 22:48.23 | scan[ibook] | this class is cool |
| 22:58.29 | *** join/#picogui lurgyman (~lurgyman@aden2-123-dhcp.resnet.Colorado.EDU) |
| 23:06.03 | *** join/#picogui lurgyman (~lurgyman@aden2-123-dhcp.resnet.Colorado.EDU) |
| 23:30.51 | prot-work | wow... |
| 23:32.59 | *** join/#picogui Xentac (~jchu@amga45cyy30x9.bc.hsia.telus.net) |
| 23:35.55 | Xentac | hey VivyanAngel |
| 23:39.01 | *** join/#picogui rhix (~rick@bek152..und.NoDak.edu) |
| 23:44.42 | prot-work | scanline: yo |
| 23:44.52 | scanline | hi |
| 23:45.16 | Xentac | damn... |
| 23:45.28 | Xentac | this SF mailing list email has an ad at the bottom that has a '2' in place of a 'to' |
| 23:45.34 | Xentac | that makes me want to be sick |
| 23:47.56 | rhix | scanline : hey |
| 23:48.00 | scanline | hi rhix |
| 23:48.11 | rhix | scanline : ever heard of something called 'vtlinux'? |
| 23:48.17 | scanline | yes |
| 23:48.33 | rhix | damn...was hoping you hadnt :P |
| 23:48.43 | scanline | I don't know much about it... but I've heard of it |
| 23:49.32 | rhix | http://www.valourtech.com/vtlinux.html |
| 23:49.39 | rhix | you may, or may not be surprised |
| 23:50.11 | scanline | I've seen that site |
| 23:50.14 | scanline | not much info on it though |
| 23:50.17 | scanline | brb |
| 23:50.19 | rhix | true |
| 23:50.50 | rhix | i was giving the link by the company that made the VR3s |
| 23:51.26 | prot-work | 10 minutes more of this rediculousness before i go back to the dlc for more questions :) |
| 23:52.31 | scanline | rhix: it's interesting that you bring this up though |
| 23:52.47 | scanline | rhix: I've been contacted by Royal, about a PDA that they're supposedly making using PicoGUI |
| 23:53.12 | rhix | scanline : cool |
| 23:53.20 | scanline | when I asked how they found out about picogui, I got the suspicion that it was Shane Nay's doing |
| 23:53.22 | lalo | rhix: which company, agenda or softfield? |
| 23:53.33 | scanline | I contacted Shane to see what's really going on |
| 23:53.35 | rhix | lalo : softfield |
| 23:53.43 | rhix | who is Shane Nay? |
| 23:54.20 | scanline | rhix: well, maybe cool... Royal was using Microwindows on their "Lin@x" PDA. I talked to CosmicPenguin about that, and they had a negative relationship with Royal |
| 23:54.27 | lalo | who are those people who are writing apps for picogui? O.o |
| 23:54.52 | lurgyman | prot-work: your mom called |
| 23:54.54 | scanline | rhix: Shane Nay worked on the VR3, worked at Exadigm while I was consulting there, and did some work with picogui a while back |
| 23:54.57 | scanline | lalo: good question |
| 23:54.59 | prot-work | lurgyman: i expected so |
| 23:55.11 | lurgyman | prot-work: and she's sending you an email now |
| 23:55.13 | scanline | lalo: Royal claims to have a web browser, which is what confused me the most |
| 23:55.14 | lalo | heh, gotta love how I can drag tabs from one window to another in galeon |
| 23:55.19 | lalo | best browser I ever used |
| 23:55.26 | lalo | scanline: O.O |
| 23:55.37 | prot-work | lurgyman: okay |
| 23:55.38 | lalo | well, vt claims to have a PIM and etext reader |
| 23:55.48 | scanline | lalo: Rotal also claimed to have a PIM |
| 23:55.53 | lalo | <PROTECTED> |
| 23:55.56 | lalo | <PROTECTED> |
| 23:56.00 | lalo | <PROTECTED> |
| 23:56.02 | lalo | <PROTECTED> |
| 23:56.02 | Xentac | lalo: yeah... I really missing being able to drag tabs... you can't do that with mozilla or phoenix.. |
| 23:56.06 | scanline | lalo: I asked both the guy from Royal and Shane whether Shane was the one involved... and also asked Royal for screenshots :) |
| 23:56.18 | lalo | this means we have two PIMs and two webbrowsers and we don't even know it? :-P |
| 23:56.46 | rhix | scanline : well i asked the guy at softfield for info about his picogui pda |
| 23:56.59 | Xentac | VivyanAngel: didn't I already greet you? |
| 23:57.05 | rhix | also had to mention that it was my alpha that did the testing for the alpha port lol |
| 23:57.07 | scanline | lalo: I really doubt that they could have written a web browser in picogui properly.. more likely they're running ViewML on the framebuffer in a separate VT or something funky like that |
| 23:57.22 | scanline | rhix: :) |
| 23:58.23 | rhix | the softfield guy was telling me that he has networkcards for VR3s that connect to the 1.4Mbps port, i had never heard of such things. |
| 23:58.38 | scanline | wow |
| 23:58.55 | rhix | thats what i said eheh |
| 23:59.13 | rhix | bbl, supper |
