| 02:47.37 | *** join/#openmoko vitaminPaani (4a3297fc@gateway/web/freenode/ip.74.50.151.252) |
| 02:47.40 | vitaminPaani | hello |
| 02:47.51 | vitaminPaani | 1. Can you still buy openmoko phones |
| 02:48.10 | vitaminPaani | 2. Are openmoko phones totally open source, even the baseband adapter? eg. no backdoors? |
| 02:48.37 | vitaminPaani | 3. Can you make DIY openmoko phones if anyone is not selling the boards/phones or mostly impossible for novice people? |
| 04:45.29 | PaulFertser | vitaminPaani: 1. yes, mostly used; 2. no, but there's a leaked sources baseband firmware, "freecalypso"; 3. nearly impossible |
| 04:45.40 | PaulFertser | vitaminPaani: I suggest you check the neo900 project |
| 04:46.19 | vitaminPaani | hi PaulFertser |
| 04:46.47 | vitaminPaani | PaulFertser: so just for the open source baseband adapter, I will need to pay $700 for neo900 or librem purism? |
| 04:46.51 | vitaminPaani | this is bullshit |
| 04:47.16 | PaulFertser | vitaminPaani: is librem providing open source baseband? |
| 04:47.32 | vitaminPaani | I think so |
| 04:47.36 | PaulFertser | I doubt so |
| 04:47.41 | vitaminPaani | Android fans have ruined everything |
| 04:47.59 | PaulFertser | Or use freecalypso illegal fw on gta02. |
| 04:48.14 | vitaminPaani | so openmoko phones can be remotely turned on? eg. famous FBI backdoor |
| 04:48.19 | vitaminPaani | via baseband as im told |
| 04:48.40 | vitaminPaani | gta02 boards are out of stock for long time and wont come back im guessing |
| 04:48.42 | PaulFertser | Check the schematics, calypso has no control over the PMU, so no. |
| 04:48.48 | PaulFertser | You can buy used gta02 |
| 04:49.21 | vitaminPaani | I wanted to get many |
| 04:49.50 | PaulFertser | You might get some boards from gta04 guys I think. |
| 04:50.42 | vitaminPaani | is it possible to just make a DIY phone with the phone parts, and put together the rest? |
| 04:50.57 | vitaminPaani | phone parts, baseband adapter, modem or wahtever they are in order to have a secure phone |
| 04:50.59 | PaulFertser | But you say you need open source baseband... |
| 04:51.01 | vitaminPaani | dont care about the size... |
| 04:51.45 | vitaminPaani | freecalypso on gta02, but if gta02 is unavailable, can the board be remade in a DIY way ? |
| 04:51.58 | vitaminPaani | eg. not spending 100's of thousands or millions for the pcb development |
| 04:52.19 | PaulFertser | There was gta02-core project. But the hardest problem is sourcing the components, not manufacturing itself. |
| 04:53.13 | vitaminPaani | hmmm if gsm/cdma is out of the question, can you use a sim card and a phone w/o modem or break the modem and just be secure via wifi? eg. openvpn or soemthing |
| 04:53.35 | PaulFertser | You do not need a simcard then :) |
| 04:53.50 | vitaminPaani | need sim card so I can have wifi access wherever I go |
| 04:53.58 | PaulFertser | But, wifi, hm. Have you read about the broadcom fullmac firmware vulns yet? |
| 04:54.00 | vitaminPaani | i mean net access* |
| 04:54.08 | vitaminPaani | lol no |
| 04:54.31 | vitaminPaani | all wifi chipsets are backdoored im guessing |
| 04:54.48 | vitaminPaani | broadcom has known to be an asshole |
| 04:54.59 | PaulFertser | vitaminPaani: https://googleprojectzero.blogspot.nl/2017/09/over-air-vol-2-pt-1-exploiting-wi-fi.html |
| 04:55.32 | vitaminPaani | sheesh |
| 04:55.41 | PaulFertser | vitaminPaani: wifi can't use any simcard anyway. |
| 04:56.25 | vitaminPaani | hmmm |
| 04:56.26 | PaulFertser | vitaminPaani: it's either you really need the connectivity "everywhere" and thus find a way to deal with gsm/umts/lte or you structure your activities in a way that doesn't require it... |
| 04:56.42 | vitaminPaani | structure in way, meaning like meshnet? |
| 04:57.20 | PaulFertser | vitaminPaani: if you really care, I suggest using Qubes OS on laptop + USB UMTS/LTE modem. That would be close to reasonable, verifiable and controllable security measures. |
| 04:57.44 | PaulFertser | vitaminPaani: no, I mean rethinking your activities so they do not depend on cell network operators. |
| 04:58.42 | vitaminPaani | usb lte modem with sim card? |
| 04:58.46 | PaulFertser | Yes |
| 04:59.06 | PaulFertser | But with Qubes OS you can sufficiently isolate it from the rest of the system. |
| 04:59.30 | vitaminPaani | hmmmmmmmm so a rpi with qubes os with usb modem would be the DIY portable version im guessing? |
| 04:59.42 | PaulFertser | You clearly haven't read about Qubes OS yes ;) |
| 05:00.15 | vitaminPaani | damn its got snowden recommneding it lol, to me thats a flag |
| 05:00.24 | PaulFertser | A flag of what? |
| 05:00.28 | vitaminPaani | the matrix has no heroes |
| 05:00.34 | vitaminPaani | honeypot or something |
| 05:00.45 | vitaminPaani | to think people are fighting for you |
| 05:00.55 | PaulFertser | Just get more familiar with the devs. They're real security researches, lots of work published. |
| 05:01.04 | PaulFertser | Check commit log. Etc. |
| 05:02.25 | PaulFertser | vitaminPaani: snowden also recommends GPG and strong TLS, so are you ignoring https websites now? ; |
| 05:02.28 | PaulFertser | ) |
| 05:02.58 | vitaminPaani | I dont ignore them, but I think its all brroken |
| 05:03.25 | vitaminPaani | so qubes...im not familiar with XEN and all that stuff |
| 05:03.40 | vitaminPaani | but im guessing it a VM? meaning it runs on top of whatever OS you want |
| 05:03.51 | vitaminPaani | I mentioned rpi re: portable |
| 05:04.01 | vitaminPaani | vs laptop (bigger) |
| 05:04.30 | vitaminPaani | did you see taht psyop with openbsd and FBI |
| 05:06.22 | vitaminPaani | linux community let openmoko die... |
| 05:06.25 | PaulFertser | vitaminPaani: rpi cpu doesn't support facilities that Qubes relies on to provide isolation. |
| 05:06.25 | vitaminPaani | cant believe this shit |
| 05:06.36 | PaulFertser | vitaminPaani: what psyop, no? |
| 05:06.47 | vitaminPaani | not die but how Android is supported...openmoko should have gotten it |
| 05:07.04 | vitaminPaani | its just that Google uses open source and abuses it and spends money on marketing to make it seem they give a shit |
| 05:07.05 | PaulFertser | vitaminPaani: duh, those that need cell networks are happy enough with android and other shit. |
| 05:11.15 | PaulFertser | vitaminPaani: btw, interesting to note that despite all the research regarding firmwares, there's lots of signs that they're very low quality code, and zero signs of explicit backdoors. |
| 05:15.22 | vitaminPaani | its all controlled |
| 05:15.57 | vitaminPaani | Google sealed the deal with getting people not to demand open hardware |
| 05:16.01 | vitaminPaani | via marketing |
| 05:16.39 | PaulFertser | I do not think it works like that. |
| 05:16.59 | PaulFertser | The hardware is sufficiently open for research. |
| 05:19.34 | vitaminPaani | im not a one man army |
| 05:19.35 | vitaminPaani | lol |
| 05:21.46 | vitaminPaani | sneakernet like johnny nemoninc i guess |
| 05:37.58 | PaulFertser | vitaminPaani: you can get a smartphone where you can physically cut the power to avoid tracking. |
| 05:38.17 | vitaminPaani | its not about tracking |
| 05:38.23 | vitaminPaani | its about remotely being turne don |
| 05:39.16 | PaulFertser | vitaminPaani: and that too, as no power -> no chance to be turned on anyhow. Anyway, if you're into real security and not conspiracy theories, start with preparing a detailed sophisticated enough threat model. Then use it to evaluate the possible solutions. |
| 05:39.16 | vitaminPaani | i bet sneakernets will take off |
| 05:40.14 | vitaminPaani | its not conspiracy theory, its called not being fooled |
| 05:40.23 | vitaminPaani | and naive |
| 05:40.49 | PaulFertser | However you call it. A phone can't work without a battery. |
| 05:41.24 | vitaminPaani | true |
| 05:42.01 | vitaminPaani | but need battery on |
| 05:42.04 | vitaminPaani | to get calls |
| 05:42.10 | vitaminPaani | but thats how they got the mafia dude |
| 05:42.13 | vitaminPaani | turned his mic on |
| 05:42.25 | vitaminPaani | https://www.cnet.com/g00/news/fbi-taps-cell-phone-mic-as-eavesdropping-tool/?i10c.encReferrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuZ29vZ2xlLmNvbS8%3D |
| 05:42.45 | PaulFertser | So do not count on getting calls, do not plug in the battery until you really need to make a call yourself. |
| 05:45.24 | PaulFertser | You won't be carrying a gun in the open where it's prohibited, right, so you make a policy for yourself to avoid that. Same can be done regarding IT security, i.e. establish good reliable policies when technical measures alone are not trustworthy enough. |
| 05:45.41 | PaulFertser | But you need a threat model first regardless. |
| 05:46.18 | vitaminPaani | hmm true |
| 05:47.46 | vitaminPaani | PaulFertser: thanks for talking to me |
| 05:52.38 | PaulFertser | vitaminPaani: good luck man |
| 05:53.03 | vitaminPaani | thanks |
| 05:53.11 | vitaminPaani | PaulFertser: have you seen the movies SNEAKERS and JOHNNY NMUMONIC?> |
| 05:57.13 | PaulFertser | vitaminPaani: probably yes for the latter, but I can't really remember. Guess I should watch then when I get bored. |
| 05:58.23 | vitaminPaani | do you remeber cray computer |
| 05:58.26 | PaulFertser | vitaminPaani: have you seen Wag the Dog? ;) At least it has Knopfler's tunes in it. |
| 05:58.26 | vitaminPaani | computers |
| 05:58.40 | vitaminPaani | yes, i have seen wag the dog, and i believe they do they every month |
| 06:02.34 | vitaminPaani | im going to go watch tv |
| 06:02.37 | vitaminPaani | and get programmed |
| 06:02.39 | vitaminPaani | goodnight |
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| 23:24.37 | *** join/#openmoko vitaminPaani (4a3297fc@gateway/web/freenode/ip.74.50.151.252) |
| 23:24.41 | vitaminPaani | PaulFertser: sup |