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| 18:09.18 | gkwhc | Hi everyone! I'm very interested in freerunner and I'd like to know if it can access wireless internet without paying the service provider? |
| 18:10.16 | PaulFertser | gkwhc: hi |
| 18:10.22 | PaulFertser | gkwhc: what exactly do you mean? |
| 18:11.05 | gkwhc | PaulFertser: most phones in the US require users to pay in order to access the internet |
| 18:11.35 | SpeedEvil | If you connect to their network, you have to pay. |
| 18:11.40 | gkwhc | which is through a kind of GPS/satellite technology i think |
| 18:11.43 | PaulFertser | gkwhc: i'm not sure what you're talking about. Do you mean you've to pay extra for HSD/UPA? |
| 18:11.54 | SpeedEvil | If you use wifi, you don't have to pay your cellular provider. |
| 18:12.16 | gkwhc | SpeedEvil: is this for all phones or the freerunner? |
| 18:12.16 | SpeedEvil | You can never get free data service from cellphone radio. |
| 18:12.19 | SpeedEvil | All. |
| 18:12.35 | PaulFertser | SpeedEvil: does he really mean the question you're answering? ;) |
| 18:12.43 | SpeedEvil | I don't know. |
| 18:12.58 | SpeedEvil | It's not a very well written question. |
| 18:14.00 | PaulFertser | :) |
| 18:14.41 | gkwhc | hm |
| 18:15.01 | gkwhc | i thought most phones disable wifi if you have data service for cellphone radio |
| 18:15.02 | aloniv | gkwjc: you don't need to pay the cellular provider to access wifi but you might need to pay whoever is providing the internet (e.g. a hotel). |
| 18:15.57 | aloniv | Also airports provide wifi but it might cost money. |
| 18:15.59 | gkwhc | SpeedEvil: dont most phones disable wifi capability if you have a dataplan? |
| 18:16.13 | DocScrutinizer | gkwhc: access to internet is either via landline cable plus any of USB or WiFi, or via GSM (phone) provider's dataservice |
| 18:16.45 | gkwhc | DocScrutinizer: I see |
| 18:16.53 | DocScrutinizer | gkwhc: this applies to all sorts of devices (except the really fringe case WiMAX) |
| 18:16.54 | aloniv | gkwhc: I had a data plan on my previous phone but I could use wifi as well. |
| 18:17.52 | gkwhc | aloniv: oh! so its possible to access the internet via wifi and not have a data plan correct? |
| 18:18.03 | aloniv | Yes. |
| 18:18.24 | gkwhc | i see. are you in the US too? |
| 18:18.30 | PaulFertser | How on Earth it can be any different?.. |
| 18:18.30 | aloniv | In fact on my freerunner and on my previous phone wifi works even without a sim card. |
| 18:18.57 | aloniv | Both phones 'complain' that a SIM card is missing. |
| 18:19.11 | DocScrutinizer | gkwhc: your provider may or may not offer a broad variety of differing data transport services over "phone network", from most slow cheap to "faster than DSL" |
| 18:19.32 | DocScrutinizer | gkwhc: you'll have to pay for each of them, on any provider |
| 18:19.53 | gkwhc | okay |
| 18:20.37 | aloniv | I'm not in the US. I used the freerunner is Israel and in Europe. |
| 18:20.55 | gkwhc | so are there any benefits to using freerunner other than the ability to customize? |
| 18:21.09 | DocScrutinizer | this however is completely unrelated to the case where you operate your own wireless local network and connect this via your DSL or whatever cable to internet |
| 18:21.27 | DocScrutinizer | gkwhc: no |
| 18:21.49 | aloniv | gkwhc: there are other benefits as well like testing new mobile operating systems such as Android... |
| 18:22.13 | aloniv | And running GNU/Linux command line applications... |
| 18:22.37 | gkwhc | mhm |
| 18:22.39 | aloniv | and a few desktop applications such as Pidgin and Midori browser. |
| 18:22.51 | aloniv | and Arora browser. |
| 18:23.20 | gkwhc | oh nice! |
| 18:23.30 | aloniv | After using Android for 5 minutes I realised that I do not want an Android phone. |
| 18:23.56 | gkwhc | i presume android cant really run desktop apps? |
| 18:23.57 | aloniv | The fonts are tiny and they cannot be increased. There is a bug about this that hasn't been resolved. |
| 18:24.18 | Wonka | has anyone analyzed google goggles? is that service available without the android app? |
| 18:24.31 | gkwhc | aloniv: tiny fonts in freerunner or android? |
| 18:24.34 | aloniv | Wonka: you can use f-droid. |
| 18:24.42 | aloniv | gkwhc: yes. |
| 18:24.51 | aloniv | in android in general. |
| 18:25.08 | aloniv | Other distros let you change and enlarge the fonts. |
| 18:25.31 | aloniv | On QtMoko all you need is to edit a text file. |
| 18:25.53 | Wonka | aloniv: I want to use goggles with a non-android (and non-iOS) device |
| 18:26.10 | gkwhc | i see. i really like the freeunner for the fact that it can run linux desktop apps, but the screen is quite small compared to droid, etc |
| 18:26.59 | Wonka | gkwhc: that's not a droid thing. |
| 18:27.19 | gkwhc | Wonka: what do you mean? |
| 18:27.20 | Wonka | gkwhc: there is android for the freerunner, there is SHR for non-freerunner devices |
| 18:27.43 | aloniv | I have no idea what Google's goggles is. I thought it was a proprietary application. Anyway there seems to be a hack to get the market on the freerunner... |
| 18:28.15 | Wonka | http://www.google.com/mobile/goggles/ |
| 18:28.29 | aloniv | gkwhc: some desktop apps aren't bad such as Pidgin and FBReader. |
| 18:29.49 | gkwhc | aloniv: do those apps need modification? i might be running heavier things like wine, an IDE, etc |
| 18:30.09 | aloniv | Wonka: as you can see you need the market. The market isn's available on the freerunner but someone on the internet said he managed to get it to work - of course the legality of this is questionable. |
| 18:30.25 | Wonka | mh-mh |
| 18:30.44 | aloniv | gkwhc: The apps are already compiled for the freerunner and appear in the repositories of the distributions. |
| 18:30.59 | gkwhc | aloniv: i see |
| 18:36.42 | gkwhc | anyways I guess my original question applies to US service providers, since even if you access the internet via wifi, you still need a dataplan. so that's why i was asking if on the freerunner you can access wifi without having a dataplan. |
| 18:38.41 | aloniv | gkwhc: the wifi works without a SIM card so it should work with one as well. |
| 18:39.12 | aloniv | The SIM card cannot (as far as I know) disable your phone's wifi. |
| 18:39.19 | gkwhc | okay |
| 18:40.08 | aloniv | gkwhc: I think the only way in US for you to get a phone with wifi might be via a data plan which is something different. |
| 18:40.43 | gkwhc | right |
| 18:44.35 | aloniv | gkwhc: Maybe you can get a non data plan and just put the SIM in the freerunner? |
| 18:45.18 | gkwhc | aloniv: i hope that will work |
| 18:46.13 | gkwhc | but i dont see any freerunner distributers in the US |
| 18:46.21 | aloniv | On the version of QtMoko that I'm using (v26) there is a neat thing - whenever I use wifi a blue light appears. |
| 18:46.44 | aloniv | That way I don;t accidently leave it on as it will kill my battery. |
| 18:47.08 | gkwhc | oh cool! |
| 18:47.49 | aloniv | Yes unfortunately I only noticed this recently as I hardly use wifi. I just use it to check sports results when I'm out. |
| 18:48.30 | gkwhc | ah |
| 18:49.26 | aloniv | gkwhc: Just make sure you don;t get a non buzz fixed Openmoko or the A7 version. Mine is A6 and people hear a terrible echo when they talk to me (which admittedly keeps the phone bill down). |
| 18:49.46 | PaulFertser | aloniv: echo is totally unrelated to buzz |
| 18:50.00 | gkwhc | aloniv: haha okay, thanks for the tip! |
| 18:50.07 | aloniv | Really? Then how do I fix it? |
| 18:50.44 | PaulFertser | aloniv: echo can be fixed by fine-tuning the mixer settings. |
| 18:51.04 | aloniv | I hear perfectly well even when the phone isn't close to my ear (it's like a walkie talkie). |
| 18:51.12 | PaulFertser | aloniv: and by using the "harsher" variant of AT%Nxxxx command (the way to set it depends on the distro). |
| 18:51.31 | aloniv | OK I'm using QtMoko v26 should I change the default settings? |
| 18:51.46 | PaulFertser | No idea, you've to ask a QtMoko user/developer :) |
| 18:51.48 | aloniv | Or what else should I do? |
| 18:51.56 | PaulFertser | aloniv: mixer settings |
| 18:52.01 | aloniv | Unfortunately SHR doesn;t work with my SIM... |
| 18:52.21 | aloniv | Yes there is a Neocontrol utility... |
| 18:53.54 | aloniv | PaulFertser: Playback is on 116, Sidetone is on 6 and MIC2 is on 2. Should I change them? |
| 18:54.33 | PaulFertser | aloniv: probably yes, since you have complaints about the echo. But i can't really suggest anything except searching on the wiki. |
| 18:54.38 | gkwhc | by the way, whats the average battery life of freerunner? |
| 18:55.11 | aloniv | gkwhc: I'm getting about a day and a half if on suspend mode. |
| 18:55.37 | aloniv | If the screen is always on then much less. |
| 18:55.39 | gkwhc | aloniv: oh, thats rather power hungry |
| 18:56.09 | aloniv | gkwhc: but I can charge it via any computer using a standard mini usb to usb cable. |
| 18:56.35 | gkwhc | i guess this is something most phones arent capapble of? |
| 18:57.03 | aloniv | Most Nokia phones don;t provide this despite having a mini or micro usb port. |
| 18:57.18 | gkwhc | i see |
| 18:59.43 | aloniv | Anyway this cable is very cheap and all my friends have computers so I never need to worry about my battery dying. |
| 19:00.28 | gkwhc | yeah i really like this feature |
| 19:04.12 | PaulFertser | gkwhc: gta02 can stay in suspend for ~140 hours (with gsm actually connected and waiting for events). |
| 19:04.29 | aloniv | gkwjc: It's one of the best features of the phone. The internet sharing feature (using your computer's internet to install software via SSH) is pretty neat as well. |
| 19:05.53 | gkwhc | sounds great! |
| 19:05.56 | aloniv | PaulFertser: on which distro? I tried using deep sleep on QtMoko but the phone doesn't wake up when someone calls. |
| 19:06.09 | PaulFertser | aloniv: do you have #1024 fix? |
| 19:06.12 | gkwhc | does gta02 have the buzz fix? |
| 19:06.33 | aloniv | It does if you get the A7 version. |
| 19:07.01 | aloniv | I'm not sure. How do I check? |
| 19:07.03 | gkwhc | i see |
| 19:07.35 | PaulFertser | gkwhc: gta02a7 has the factory buzz fix, some earlier revisions were fixed by the distris. |
| 19:07.48 | PaulFertser | aloniv: if you never did it, it's not there :) |
| 19:08.56 | PaulFertser | aloniv: and that means you can't use deep sleep unless you do it. |
| 19:09.13 | PaulFertser | aloniv: without deep sleep it should be about 70 hours in suspend. |
| 19:10.11 | aloniv | I found this thread |
| 19:10.16 | aloniv | http://docs.openmoko.org/trac/ticket/1024 |
| 19:10.25 | PaulFertser | An obvious place, isn't it :) |
| 19:10.33 | PaulFertser | aloniv: there's a summary in the end. |
| 19:10.44 | aloniv | Anyway the phone works fine when suspended - I never drop any calls (as far as I know). |
| 19:11.30 | aloniv | I see it's a hardware fix. Does any Openmoko manufacturer supply this? |
| 19:17.22 | PaulFertser | aloniv: some distris do that, yes. |
| 19:36.18 | khorben | alexxy: nikolaus schaller of goldelico maybe still takes care of hardware fixes |
| 19:36.34 | khorben | http://goldelico.com/ |
| 19:36.42 | khorben | aloniv: for you, sorry |
| 19:38.00 | aloniv | Too bad they don't do it for Israel. |
| 19:38.33 | PaulFertser | aloniv: come on, find some local guy who can do that... |
| 19:38.42 | aloniv | :) |
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| 19:39.09 | aloniv | It will probably be more expensive though unless I find a friend. |
| 19:47.56 | aloniv | I found a file called libneovendor.so. Should I edit it with ghex? |
| 19:50.11 | PaulFertser | aloniv: for AT%Nxxxx hack? What value does it have now? |
| 19:50.28 | aloniv | Checking. |
| 19:50.57 | aloniv | Unfortunately no room to install ghex on my freerunner so am doing this on my computer instead... |
| 19:51.34 | PaulFertser | hexedit should be pretty lean |
| 19:52.31 | aloniv | On Trisquel I only need 8 MB. On QtMoko over 50... |
| 19:52.49 | PaulFertser | aloniv: gtk dependency. |
| 19:53.01 | aloniv | Indeed. |
| 19:59.54 | aloniv | STRING NOT FOUND |
| 20:00.00 | aloniv | sorry abot caps. |
| 20:00.03 | aloniv | about |
| 20:01.04 | aloniv | n0187 was found though... |
| 20:01.24 | aloniv | AT%N0187 |
| 20:01.53 | aloniv | So I guess I just need to tweak the settings then? |
| 20:03.59 | PaulFertser | aloniv: 0187 is the harshest already, so yes, you've to tweak mixer settings. |
| 20:04.25 | aloniv | What are your settings? |
| 20:06.03 | *** join/#openmoko fsteinel (~fsteinel@fedora/fsteinel) |
| 20:06.58 | PaulFertser | aloniv: http://paste.debian.net/121713/ but some people say they do not hear me well (the volume's too low) |
| 20:07.19 | aloniv | cheers. Hopefully this works. |
| 20:09.33 | aloniv | Will changing 5,12,48 be enough? |
| 20:13.00 | PaulFertser | aloniv: i'm not sure but studying http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973_audio_subsystem might hlep |
| 20:15.06 | aloniv | Well a friend says he still hears an scho but less... |
| 20:15.09 | aloniv | *echo |
| 20:15.20 | aloniv | He says before it was unbearable... |
| 20:15.46 | PaulFertser | aloniv: you can play with the settings more. There were different revisions. |
| 20:17.01 | aloniv | I'll ask other Israeli users what settings they use... |
| 20:17.20 | PaulFertser | aloniv: wrong idea |
| 20:17.33 | aloniv | why is that? |
| 20:17.54 | aloniv | or other QtMoko Israeli users :) |
| 20:17.57 | PaulFertser | aloniv: it's not about the country, it's about the hardware revision. There were too many, and even manufacturer now doesn't tell for sure which one should have which settings. |
| 20:18.07 | PaulFertser | Because nobody knows. |
| 20:18.10 | aloniv | ah OK. |
| 20:18.16 | PaulFertser | aloniv: you've to experiment by yourself. |
| 20:18.19 | aloniv | my hardware is A6. |
| 20:19.33 | aloniv | All this to get a free phone working :) Writing a Hebrew keyboard was easier... |
| 20:24.17 | aloniv | how come other phones just work? |
| 20:26.35 | SpeedEvil | Lots and lots of effort. |
| 20:26.52 | PaulFertser | aloniv: i guess the folks responsible for the hw changes between revisions there are saner then some of the OM employees... |
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| 20:27.22 | DocScrutinizer | audio once again?? |
| 20:27.28 | DocScrutinizer | ducks and covers |
| 20:27.44 | PaulFertser | DocScrutinizer: yep, aloniv can't yet find the best mixer settings. |
| 20:27.45 | aloniv | PaulFertser: thanks for your help. Hopefully people won't complain anymore when speaking to me. |
| 20:27.55 | PaulFertser | DocScrutinizer: btw, neither me, i often get complaints as well, heh. |
| 20:29.19 | aloniv | So I guess changing 5,6,12 and 48 is enough then? |
| 20:29.53 | DocScrutinizer | well, let me tell you sth: nobody literally NOBODY bothered about such elementary things like input sensitivity of calypso mic input vs level and impedance of wm8753 mixer chip output |
| 20:30.00 | DocScrutinizer | so, any more questions? |
| 20:30.54 | DocScrutinizer | I wasn't even able to find a single person who got the faintest idea about calypso input sensitivity |
| 20:31.18 | DocScrutinizer | not to mention anything in the 80MB of calypso docs |
| 20:32.00 | PaulFertser | DocScrutinizer: one should have just measured it probably in the lab... |
| 20:32.27 | DocScrutinizer | and then there's this huge black mystery in calypso itseld, called audio-pages or sth like that |
| 20:32.42 | PaulFertser | Doesn't sound that hard to attach a sin-wave generator to determine the possible input voltage range. |
| 20:33.04 | DocScrutinizer | using what exactly as indicator output? |
| 20:33.16 | DocScrutinizer | the moment when blue smoke escapes? |
| 20:33.57 | PaulFertser | DocScrutinizer: during an ongoing call by listening on the other side, even that would help a lot i'd say. |
| 20:34.10 | DocScrutinizer | I did that |
| 20:34.28 | PaulFertser | But? |
| 20:34.57 | DocScrutinizer | but you know well enough about the eleventyseven parameters that interfere with GSM OTA overall performance |
| 20:35.57 | PaulFertser | DocScrutinizer: ok, but where does the difference between revisions (mic-input wise) come from? (i remember about the silly caps in the earpiece) |
| 20:36.24 | DocScrutinizer | and all this designed by an EE crew that thought Line-out R and Line-out L are a differential signal |
| 20:37.32 | PaulFertser | Yeah, that tells a lot about the insanity level of too many members of the EE crew... :( |
| 20:37.37 | DocScrutinizer | there's basically no similar nonsense difference in mic, except the ever changing dimensioning of the micbias series resistors |
| 20:38.54 | PaulFertser | There must be a solid reason so many people have such a different results with different statefiles, i'd bet on the hardware differences. |
| 20:39.15 | DocScrutinizer | and we never got a decent description of how to initialize and kick ass of calypso DSP either |
| 20:39.59 | DocScrutinizer | quite possible audiopages (actually page0) in calypso are massively random |
| 20:40.09 | PaulFertser | It looks like the whole story of relationship with TI sucked to say the least. |
| 20:40.21 | DocScrutinizer | maybe even no page loaded to DSP registers at all |
| 20:40.39 | DocScrutinizer | sucked? that euphemism |
| 20:41.11 | DocScrutinizer | It's been frankestein from day 0 |
| 20:41.58 | DocScrutinizer | OM inherited calypso from FIC, literally and physically |
| 20:42.29 | DocScrutinizer | that's been the reason we "departed" finally |
| 20:42.42 | DocScrutinizer | s/departed/divorced/ |
| 20:43.30 | DocScrutinizer | PaulFertser: Taiwan is China, when it comes to licencing et al |
| 20:44.29 | DocScrutinizer | so relationship OM<->TI never was especially fraternal |
| 20:44.29 | PaulFertser | DocScrutinizer: meaning one can basically ignore licensing issues? |
| 20:44.56 | DocScrutinizer | "can" is a relative term |
| 20:45.42 | DocScrutinizer | TI will teach you that you can *not* |
| 20:46.08 | DocScrutinizer | MentoGraphics will do the same :-P |
| 20:46.44 | PaulFertser | DocScrutinizer: but i thought OM intended to be rather clean and nice in that regard. |
| 20:46.46 | DocScrutinizer | Wolfgang did a hell of a job to put things straight, but damage done... |
| 20:47.10 | DocScrutinizer | FIC legacy |
| 20:47.17 | PaulFertser | Yep, i get it now... |
| 20:48.11 | PaulFertser | Well, anyway OM should have known better to not hire incompetent engineers, that's probably the most important reasons of being "not that successful" in the end. |
| 20:48.26 | DocScrutinizer | FIC legacy as well |
| 20:48.34 | DocScrutinizer | :-P |
| 20:49.34 | DocScrutinizer | you for sure can figure the rest of the story |
| 20:50.01 | aloniv | Should I run alsamixer during a call to twaek the settings? |
| 20:50.05 | aloniv | *tweak |
| 20:50.06 | PaulFertser | aloniv: sure |
| 20:50.10 | DocScrutinizer | yes |
| 20:50.16 | aloniv | before the call or during? |
| 20:50.21 | PaulFertser | aloniv: during |
| 20:50.24 | DocScrutinizer | doesn't matter |
| 20:50.51 | aloniv | So I just SSH, type alsamixer then make a call and adjust settings? |
| 20:50.56 | DocScrutinizer | to be on the absolutely safe side start it after call established |
| 20:50.58 | PaulFertser | After the call is established, another scenario gets loaded, so you should tweak during the call, getting feedback from the other party. |
| 20:51.03 | PaulFertser | aloniv: basically, yes. |
| 20:51.13 | PaulFertser | aloniv: you can start alsamixer before too. |
| 20:51.16 | PaulFertser | It's safe. |
| 20:51.35 | aloniv | Hopefully this will solve it once and for all... |
| 20:51.35 | DocScrutinizer | whatever, it starts quickly |
| 20:52.04 | PaulFertser | DocScrutinizer: why couldn't OM pay the salary to those incompetent they had to keep anyway while not allowing them to actually work on anything to not screw up the design? |
| 20:52.08 | aloniv | Bugs like this are the reason this phone failed unfortunately... |
| 20:52.10 | DocScrutinizer | aloniv: DO NOT MISS to run alsactl store -f mynewsettings.state PRIOR to ending call! |
| 20:52.38 | DocScrutinizer | aloniv: the settings are not sticky as set by alsamixer |
| 20:52.48 | PaulFertser | ^^ nice advice ++ :) |
| 20:52.55 | aloniv | Doesn;t this just save my new settings? Cos if so I can just write em down as I do them. |
| 20:53.45 | PaulFertser | aloniv: -f store simply stores the current mixer setup to a file, yes. |
| 20:54.19 | DocScrutinizer | aloniv: you can not write down all 98 controls |
| 20:54.37 | aloniv | Indeed but I thought only 3 or 4 matter. |
| 20:54.50 | DocScrutinizer | that's the big PITA of audio management as it's still now in all distros for FR |
| 20:55.13 | DocScrutinizer | they never handle single controls, and have no idea which ones are relevant or not |
| 20:56.07 | DocScrutinizer | aloniv: (3 or for) basically right, if all is set correctly. There are another 10 or 15 that MUST have a certain value and you can't fiddle with them |
| 20:57.30 | aloniv | As far as I know I only need controls 5,12,48 and maybe also 6... |
| 20:58.15 | DocScrutinizer | sounds about right, it's been a while since I wrote the wiki page |
| 21:00.12 | aloniv | DocScrutinizer: do people hear you properly? |
| 21:00.23 | DocScrutinizer | o.O |
| 21:00.31 | DocScrutinizer | too many assumptions ;-D |
| 21:00.38 | aloniv | ??? |
| 21:01.05 | DocScrutinizer | my pile of gta02 is collecting dust since almost years |
| 21:01.16 | aloniv | Which phone do you have now? |
| 21:01.23 | DocScrutinizer | N900 |
| 21:01.29 | aloniv | Cool. |
| 21:01.32 | DocScrutinizer | soon N950 |
| 21:01.40 | aloniv | I'm thinking of getting a cheap Nokia. |
| 21:02.08 | PaulFertser | I have n900 too but i can't use it at all. Nokia 1100 is something i can use. And it has a great battery life too. But i prefer my FR. |
| 21:02.19 | aloniv | They sell C3 here for 530 NIS which is 90 pounds or so... |
| 21:02.28 | DocScrutinizer | but yes, usually I was able to have proper voice calls on FR back when |
| 21:02.39 | aloniv | It even has wifi and a radio... |
| 21:02.52 | aloniv | and it's also 2.5 G |
| 21:03.31 | PaulFertser | BTW, after i learned n9 and n950 both have no USB OTG functionality (while n8 has), i can't hear the word "nokia" without frustration :/ |
| 21:03.37 | aloniv | it should also work better with RTL languages - N900 doesn't align Hebrew correctly either... |
| 21:03.56 | aloniv | at least that's what I heard... |
| 21:04.03 | DocScrutinizer | wait a minute, the uSD card is in my new phone, let me pick the gsmhandset.state for you :-) |
| 21:04.58 | DocScrutinizer | PaulFertser: there's nothing definitive known yet about OTH on either of both devices |
| 21:05.06 | aloniv | but then again a family member got HTC sensation which doesn;t align Hebrew properly either - it also didn;t receive SMS messages immediately (there was a delay and two messages arrived together). |
| 21:05.32 | DocScrutinizer | and it's me who tries to bring proper hostmode to N9 ootb |
| 21:05.56 | aloniv | That's why I prefer the Nokia ones as they at least work as phones even if the software isn't great... |
| 21:06.00 | DocScrutinizer | s/OTH/OTG/ |
| 21:06.18 | PaulFertser | DocScrutinizer: if it lacks proper AB connector, that's enough for me to get frustrated... |
| 21:06.39 | DocScrutinizer | indeed, but even that's unclear yet for N9 |
| 21:07.06 | aloniv | Does the freerunner have USB on the go? I know it supports host mode not sure it is the same...? |
| 21:07.15 | DocScrutinizer | it might be Nokia's way to say "F*** you USB cert board" |
| 21:07.33 | SpeedEvil | Host mode is not OTG. |
| 21:07.43 | SpeedEvil | Host mode is one element of OTG |
| 21:07.43 | DocScrutinizer | aloniv: FR has proper fullsize hostmode, but no OTG |
| 21:08.02 | aloniv | what is on the go? |
| 21:08.13 | DocScrutinizer | automatic hostmode |
| 21:08.17 | DocScrutinizer | basically |
| 21:08.28 | SpeedEvil | On the go is a agic protocol to negotiate direction of which device is host and which is device |
| 21:08.40 | DocScrutinizer | where devices can swap roles on the fly |
| 21:09.13 | DocScrutinizer | also has weird suspend states and whatnot |
| 21:09.17 | aloniv | And doesn;t the freerunner do it as well? |
| 21:09.22 | DocScrutinizer | nope |
| 21:09.39 | DocScrutinizer | FR acts just like you PC |
| 21:09.49 | DocScrutinizer | no PC can do OTG either |
| 21:09.55 | SpeedEvil | My PC can't do device mode. |
| 21:10.00 | SpeedEvil | Which would be handy sometimes. |
| 21:10.21 | DocScrutinizer | yeah, FR *can* do device mode as well |
| 21:10.23 | DocScrutinizer | :-) |
| 21:10.32 | aloniv | OK so the freerunner either lets you connect cameras or ssh into/from another compuiter? |
| 21:10.41 | DocScrutinizer | still hostmode plus devicemode << OTG |
| 21:10.54 | DocScrutinizer | aloniv: exactly |
| 21:10.55 | aloniv | *computer |
| 21:11.27 | aloniv | usb otg also requires usb 2.0 which freerunner lacks... |
| 21:11.39 | DocScrutinizer | tbh I don't know of one single device that actually exploits OTG to full extent |
| 21:12.33 | aloniv | doesn;t n8 have it? (the one with 12 mp camera) |
| 21:12.45 | DocScrutinizer | I'm not sure about the USB2.0 part. On paper probably, technically OTG doesn't need USB2.0 |
| 21:13.07 | DocScrutinizer | yes, N8 has OTG allegedly |
| 21:13.54 | DocScrutinizer | whether or not it's a comprehensive implementation of OTG is questionable |
| 21:14.18 | DocScrutinizer | hard to test when there's not a single device to use any of the OTG additional tricks |
| 21:20.42 | aloniv | will Meego run on freerunner? |
| 21:25.45 | SpeedEvil | Really not enough RAM. |
| 21:25.54 | SpeedEvil | And no gles |
| 21:26.14 | DocScrutinizer | no way |
| 21:28.58 | aloniv | shame none of the android devices have usb on the go or radio... |
| 21:29.16 | PaulFertser | Shame none of the android devices have a sane distro ;) |
| 21:29.38 | aloniv | that too...shame sms messages reach the wrong person... |
| 21:33.22 | SpeedEvil | That's the carriers problem |
| 21:33.35 | SpeedEvil | your cell modem can only recieve what's specifically addressed to it |
| 21:34.26 | aloniv | apparently it's an android bug |
| 21:34.55 | aloniv | https://code.google.com/p/android/issues/detail?id=9392 |
| 21:36.05 | aloniv | which distros are you guys using atm? |
| 21:36.15 | SpeedEvil | That's a sending, not a recieving issue |
| 21:36.28 | aloniv | indeed but it's stil a nasty bug... |
| 21:36.32 | aloniv | *still |
| 21:37.04 | aloniv | hence sms messages reach the wrong person comment... |
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