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| 10:30.45 | Gabrys | I'm compiling stuff with distcc on Neo FreeRunner now but linking needs much memory |
| 10:30.55 | Gabrys | do you recommend swap on uSD or on USB stick? |
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| 10:46.17 | max_posedon | swap via nfs is good too |
| 10:48.54 | Gabrys | I have a lame NFS server at home :-) |
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| 11:00.48 | dns53 | does anyone here use android? |
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| 11:31.19 | occ4m | hey.. i have sort of a license / commercial question. Is it possible to "prevent" any copy-cats / take-overs by a bigger commercial company for a open source hardware device? Something like the protective aspect of the GPL2. Or how did OpenMoko deal with that issue, if thats any... |
| 11:39.48 | Weiss | occ4m: the schematics are licensed under CC-BY-SA, which include an analogous "share-alike" clause |
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| 11:42.57 | occ4m | Weiss: ok, but lets say Company XY would re-create a WikiReader from scratch, new layout of the schematics, it could do so? There isn't anything like the bad and common patent mechanism to prevent this? |
| 11:43.13 | occ4m | like a CC-BY-SA for "ideas" |
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| 12:24.30 | Weiss | occ4m: nothing to protect against that, because the whole point is that companies have that freedom |
| 12:24.53 | Weiss | they would have to give you the same rights as they have, AIUI |
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| 14:52.33 | rhkfin | occ4m: protect yourself by being so good at what you do, that even if you release everything, there's no other to understand it :) |
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| 15:19.50 | Weiss | rhkfin: I once had to use some software which used exactly the opposite strategy.. |
| 15:20.13 | Weiss | i.e. it was so **** that noone would want to copy it |
| 15:20.27 | Weiss | but still it had a parallel port dongle |
| 15:22.14 | Weiss | but, it's often possible to prove beyond reasonable doubt that you created something by means other than patents and the like |
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| 15:24.59 | rhkfin | Weiss: right, that's why when doing Open Source, you need to do the opposite & make it so good :) |
| 15:25.28 | SpeedEvil | And then not infringe a patent granted next year. |
| 15:27.40 | occ4m | how open is openmoko to new ideas for new devices and what would be the best place and time to discussion such ideas? is there any conference or such thing? |
| 15:27.57 | SpeedEvil | 2008 maybe |
| 15:28.05 | mickeyl | heh |
| 15:28.16 | SpeedEvil | There is no forseeable likelyhood of new devices. |
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| 15:28.59 | SpeedEvil | What sort of device were yo uthinking of? |
| 15:30.41 | rhkfin | occ4m: right, they will not do it anyway so you might as well tell us what you're thinking about.. |
| 15:30.45 | rhkfin | ;) |
| 15:32.09 | occ4m | the WikiReader is rather successful isn't it? And it's also not directly related to a mobile phone.. thats why i was wondering how much discussion is going on for new devices |
| 15:32.36 | mickeyl | wikireader is relatively successful, yes |
| 15:32.53 | SpeedEvil | I question how much it's still selling though. |
| 15:33.01 | SpeedEvil | Would be interested. |
| 15:33.02 | mickeyl | no matter how big |
| 15:33.11 | mickeyl | OM is not going to do mobile phones again |
| 15:33.15 | mickeyl | once bitten, twice shy... |
| 15:33.33 | SpeedEvil | There was a gap in the market for mobile phones opensource. |
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| 15:33.52 | SpeedEvil | Relatively early on - android partially filled that. |
| 15:34.02 | SpeedEvil | Then n900 came along later, and is more open. |
| 15:34.04 | mickeyl | yep. timeframe over, thanks for playing |
| 15:34.16 | SpeedEvil | The remaining opportinities in the mobile space are elsewhere. |
| 15:34.27 | mickeyl | too few crazy people for whom full openness does matter |
| 15:34.37 | mickeyl | the big mob is satisfied with semiopen |
| 15:34.43 | mickeyl | that pretty much kills every business plan |
| 15:35.13 | occ4m | right... and more or less for the same reason, i would like to discuss this idea in a rather private environment, to have that advantage of something new |
| 15:35.31 | SpeedEvil | Is it a mobile phone type computer? |
| 15:35.32 | occ4m | and rather in real life as well |
| 15:35.35 | occ4m | no |
| 15:36.02 | SpeedEvil | You may find ##electronics and #edev a worthwhile place to ask questions in. |
| 15:36.26 | SpeedEvil | In short - any computer that can run linux is a fairly non-trivial project to design. |
| 15:37.01 | occ4m | what about devices that run erlang? |
| 15:37.46 | occ4m | (i know, its not a OS, i wonder if there are low-level implementations by ericson |
| 15:37.49 | SpeedEvil | Erlang is a high-level language? |
| 15:38.04 | SpeedEvil | GEnerally few HLLs have been implemented in hardware |
| 15:38.17 | SpeedEvil | The few attempts to do so have been at best commerical failures. |
| 15:38.37 | SpeedEvil | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intel_iAPX_432 springs to mind. |
| 15:40.57 | occ4m | erlang was build for the telecommunication sector, i think, so i was wondering on what hardware it actually runs |
| 15:41.34 | SpeedEvil | I would suspect none. |
| 15:41.41 | SpeedEvil | For example, there are no C++ machines |
| 15:41.53 | SpeedEvil | and no java machines |
| 15:42.08 | SpeedEvil | there are java bytecode interpreter machines - which is something quite different |
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| 15:55.19 | rhkfin | Anyone remember what software creates gps track files like this: http://pastebin.com/ZHrujpXk - My guess is it's a Moko app.. |
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| 15:58.05 | SpeedEvil | tangogps? |
| 15:58.23 | SpeedEvil | IIRC you can make gpsbabel read files like tha |
| 15:59.21 | rhkfin | no, isn't tango.. |
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| 16:00.46 | Wonka | tangogps creates logs with (only) lines like this: 54.406871,9.968737,12.9,1.1,343.8,1.3,2009-05-09T07:38:25Z |
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| 16:01.48 | rhkfin | maybe omgps.. but can't try, it won't start.. "right |
| 16:02.04 | rhkfin | My guess is that those tracks are from omgps.. |
| 16:06.01 | Wonka | tangogps track logs can be converted like this: gpsbabel -x simplify,error=0.001k -x discard,hdop=3.1 -i xcsv,style=../tangogps.style -o gpx $1 $1.gpx |
| 16:06.37 | Wonka | does someone need the style file? |
| 16:09.57 | rhkfin | I'm ok with the tangogps converter.. I guess i could try to build a stylefile for omgps to get the tracks.. |
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| 17:33.07 | brian_ | watisit |
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| 17:58.55 | |if3_ | changes away reason from "I'm afk!" to "I'm afk!" |
| 18:07.23 | |if3_ | changes away reason from "I'm afk!" to "asdf" |
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| 18:32.54 | almien | anyone using android on neo, know how to install apps? is it done via browser? |
| 18:39.18 | PaulFertser | almien: this channel's not dead unlike the android port on FR. |
| 18:39.29 | rhkfin | ;) |
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| 18:44.52 | almien | oh i just followed a link saying android was N'th most popular distro on OM, and installed it to test. did I miss some history? |
| 18:46.11 | brian_ | is there not an app app |
| 18:46.21 | brian_ | :) |
| 18:48.07 | slaxxer | digg around in there with the arm of an android an find it |
| 18:48.15 | almien | well I assumed you just view market.android.com in android's web browser, but there's no install button on those apps' pages |
| 18:48.46 | slaxxer | android on a freerunner is arm4 |
| 18:49.19 | slaxxer | <PROTECTED> |
| 18:49.52 | almien | aren't apps written in java? what's the significance of processor type? |
| 18:50.21 | PaulFertser | almien: yes, the apps should work on FR too. |
| 18:50.43 | PaulFertser | almien: but should might mean anything. Google sucks so much that one can expect anything from them. |
| 18:51.48 | almien | ok, so original question: should you see an 'install' button on the market.a.com web page or am I looking in wrong place |
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| 18:55.07 | slaxxer | its saterday here so maybe ask again later |
| 18:58.31 | mickeyl | unblessed devices such as the FR are not allowed to participate on the market |
| 18:58.35 | mickeyl | android market, that is |
| 18:58.56 | mickeyl | you can't even get in with the official developer devices from google :) |
| 18:59.29 | mickeyl | (paid apps, that is. free should work) |
| 19:01.10 | almien | ok it looks like the market website was a red-herring: there should be an "android market" application in the list of default programs, but on the openmoko there isn't such an app installed |
| 19:05.06 | almien | (looks like downloading .apk files from browser works though!) |
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| 20:07.40 | Gabrys | android market is not available for non-Google-branded devices |
| 20:08.18 | Gabrys | you can at most get the app from an emulator running custom Android image |
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| 20:25.58 | slaxxer | except for these http://code.google.com/p/android-on-freerunner/wiki/Applications |
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| 20:33.31 | lindi- | slaxxer: 'A full featured video player that plays mp4 format files. There is a free trial version you can download from the home page.' sounds non-free. |
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