IRC log for #openmoko on 20090415

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02:05.07braydonI am getting a really strange error when trying to ssh into the freerunner, I can ping 192.168.0.202 but ssh gives me: ssh: connect to host freerunner port 22: Connection refused
02:06.26braydonI am using this method for USB networking: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/USB_Networking#Ubuntu_8.10_-_Easy_Way
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02:29.08roolyoy
02:32.28DocScrutinizerbraydon: does the error change when FR is suspended?
02:33.19roolyjust so everybody knows, don't use the rootfs provided by qtei
02:35.01sandsmarkwhat happened?
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02:37.34roolywell...
02:37.49roolyya know how first-boot for qte pops up the config screen
02:38.18roolywell first-boot for qtei crashes when ever you try to press the screen to start the config
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04:38.06braydonDocScrutinizer: I had turned off suspend. I finally tracked down the issue, it was because I was setting my Computer to the same IP as the freerunner when I thought I was setting the IP for the freerunner.
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04:42.48GoodByeHello 0DCC SEND "0101010101010101" 0 0 0
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04:48.36DocScrutinizerbraydon: that's why I asked if there's different error when FR is suspended. If there's not, my next guess would have been exactly what you told was actual cause of the problem
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05:18.44slaxxerBuild a better pcb
05:18.56slaxxeruse the same case
05:19.21slaxxermove the mic to the other end
05:20.20slaxxermaybe
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05:31.01DocScrutinizerfools
05:31.38DocScrutinizeror acidheads
05:31.55rasterwho are the fools today?
05:32.13DocScrutinizer[07:18] <slaxxer> Build a better pcb
05:32.30DocScrutinizerwhat a pile of nonsense
05:32.53rastereven if u fix problems
05:33.00rasterlike audio (bass) capacitorbuzz fix
05:33.07rasterand firmware update calypso
05:33.14rasteru still have design issues
05:33.21rasterlike tiny usable touchscreen for fingers
05:33.35rasterjust generally empty case thus echo
05:33.41rastermoving mic means change in case mold/design
05:33.48rasterand the MOSt expensive bit is makeing any change
05:33.54raster1 tiny change in mold means a new mold
05:34.03rasterand that mayaswell mean a whole new case design
05:34.11rasterits about the same cost either way
05:34.12raster:)
05:34.57rasterif u do new pcd and "slightly modified case"
05:35.02DocScrutinizerecho isn't likely to be caused by case design
05:35.07rasteru can nicely do a complete radical change in case and pcb
05:35.16rasterre-use components that are known to work well
05:35.22raster(gps, acceleromewters)
05:35.23DocScrutinizeryup
05:35.25rasterreplace those that suck
05:35.41rasterDocScrutinizer:  hmm i think echo is partly due to case deisng
05:35.50rasterthe case is pretty much full of empty hollow space
05:36.07rasteraudio will travel from speaker down to mic more easily in a gta02
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05:37.02DocScrutinizerthere's been tests suggesting it's surface sound along outside of case, or maybe PCB-mechanic feedback
05:37.51DocScrutinizerboth mic and earpiece are sealed to inside of case
05:39.42rasterhmmm
05:39.46DocScrutinizerthough for earpiece transducer it's not clear if it is closed on rear or emitts sound rear side as well
05:39.54rasterthat seems odd to me
05:40.08rastercompared to other phones i've ripped apart the gta02 is crammed full of airspace
05:40.25rasterthey often have similar pcb setups
05:40.34DocScrutinizerthat doesn't mean you found the reason
05:40.39rastersure
05:41.06rasterbut its the obvious big difference
05:41.11DocScrutinizerfirst of all other phones have carefully tuned AEC
05:42.06DocScrutinizersome of them even passive aka far end echo cancellation
05:42.17rasterpossibly
05:42.18DocScrutinizere.g blackberry
05:42.32DocScrutinizerkills echo of FR ;-)
05:42.44rasterheheheh
05:42.52DocScrutinizerno surprise tpe EE got puzzled
05:42.59raster"if you own a fr and use it.. only call people with blackberries!"
05:43.00raster:)
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05:45.09DocScrutinizerthen add to this the magic that is done in PBX of providers
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05:46.18DocScrutinizerin the end you might find there's some 6 echo cancellation machines working on one call
05:46.33DocScrutinizermost of them dinamically adapting
05:46.40DocScrutinizer:-)))
05:47.26DocScrutinizersome even tuning to particular type of device derived from IMEI
05:47.31rasterso it isnt the echoey case?
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05:48.07DocScrutinizermaybe some of it is case, but surely not the major cause
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05:49.28DocScrutinizerif you really want to proove, just fill case with PU-foam
05:49.33DocScrutinizer;)
05:49.37rasterhahahah
05:49.41rasterno
05:49.45rasterlead
05:49.48DocScrutinizerdon't bother to disassemble then
05:49.50rasteractually no
05:49.56rasterthat will propagate vibrationjs well
05:50.01rasteryeah foam is good
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05:50.32DocScrutinizerwe all know from movies where they kill the alarm that way
05:50.44DocScrutinizer;D
05:53.34rastersomehow it seems odd to me that audio leaks from speaker to mic
05:53.42rasterunless it just has zero padding
05:53.47rasterbut maybe pcd carry may explain it
05:53.48DocScrutinizeranyway before filling whole case with PUfoam I'd rather test a tiny blop of it applied to rear of earpiece
05:53.53rastermaybe the case also carries it too?
05:54.44DocScrutinizerquite possible
05:55.27*** join/#openmoko bentob0x (n=laurent@ip-213-49-78-133.dsl.scarlet.be)
05:55.37DocScrutinizerthough then the case had to be highly sensitive to tap sounds (fingernail) as well
05:57.37DocScrutinizeradmittedly there's some unrevealed mystery in the whole echo thing
05:58.47DocScrutinizerand another clear flaw of product specs not even mentioning a max for earpiece->mic coupling
05:59.15DocScrutinizeras mayerhoffer didn't care about things like that
05:59.19rasterwell if i tap the case with my fingernail
05:59.20rastera gta02
06:00.01rastercompared to this roker-e6 or i780
06:00.05rasterit makes more of a hollowy sound
06:00.10DocScrutinizerit should be like thunder if even earpiece makes mech feedback
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06:02.17DocScrutinizerpress the FR backlid against your ear, tap it, that's what you'd hear if mic wasn't decoupled from case
06:03.25jcDocScrutinizer: morning!
06:03.32DocScrutinizermoin
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06:03.57jcDocScrutinizer: haven't see you for a while, how is everything?
06:04.08rasterdamn.... thios omap3 is fast
06:04.12rasterhave i said that before?
06:04.56DocScrutinizerjc: well looking for new ways to make my living and keep life interesting same time
06:05.17DocScrutinizerraster: I seem to remember ;D
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06:06.26rasteri just re-imaged by overo
06:06.31rasterand popped up elementayr_test
06:06.35rasterand.. everything is.. smooth!
06:06.50rasteroh so smooth
06:06.52rastersilky
06:07.01DocScrutinizer:)
06:07.38rasterTHIS... is one awesome-arse soc
06:07.44DocScrutinizerI'm more interested in PM and freq-transitions
06:08.34DocScrutinizerlike 1us for context switch on IRQ
06:09.12DocScrutinizerresume from 0clock:<50us. things like that
06:09.51jcDocScrutinizer: got a question.  I found some tobacoo and paper next to Taipei 101.
06:10.28DocScrutinizernext to or in a drawer at 10th floor? ;)
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06:11.27DocScrutinizerjc: the one from drawer you probably may use up
06:11.29jcDocScrutinizer: zecke metioned those are yours.  May I take some of them?
06:12.06rasterDocScrutinizer: http://www.celinux.org/elc08_presentations/TI_OMAP3430_Linux_PM_reference.ppt
06:12.11DocScrutinizertake all of them. seems I cant use it before it expires "best before"
06:13.51DocScrutinizerraster: hard to open ppt on n810
06:14.04DocScrutinizerhates ppt anyway
06:14.04rasterhahahaha
06:15.47jcDocScrutinizer: you got a n810? Is that good?
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06:16.34DocScrutinizerordered a second one, just in case I break or lose primary device. so yes, I like it
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06:16.57jcDocScrutinizer: it's easy to get cig here, just miss the "rolling" part. rolling is fun.
06:18.13DocScrutinizerjc: enjoy some decent netherland tobacco then ;)
06:19.00jcwe don't have n810 here:'(
06:19.42DocScrutinizerthat's really sad for OM.
06:20.57jcoops, I mean nokia didn't sell n810 here.
06:21.04DocScrutinizerI repeatedly suggested OM should get a N810 for each developer, to have a good example to look at
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06:22.09DocScrutinizerjc: basically nokia never sold them anywhere. you always need to ask for them, search and luckily find one in the end
06:22.38jcDocScrutinizer: call nokia to get one?
06:22.51DocScrutinizerthey're EOL
06:23.16DocScrutinizerthat's why I got me a second one now
06:23.32raster810 is eol already?
06:23.40rasterhtye must be damn close to the n900
06:23.49DocScrutinizerI've been told
06:23.57rasteri have heard so too
06:24.03rasterwell all the indications of them being close
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06:24.36DocScrutinizerEOL in 2008Q3
06:24.47DocScrutinizersth like that
06:24.53rasteroh well
06:24.56rasteri might wait for the n900
06:24.58rasterskip the 810
06:25.06rasteri have an 800 n ayway
06:25.11rasterits a good piece of hw
06:25.18DocScrutinizernothing new of 900
06:25.19rasterhonestly something om should have studied
06:25.28rasterwell n900 will be omap3
06:25.30DocScrutinizerACK!!!!
06:25.37rasterand i understand also have a 3g modem
06:26.10DocScrutinizerthat's the point. though no voice, just data
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06:26.18rasteru can do voice
06:26.22DocScrutinizerrumors
06:26.26rasteru just have to do the encoding on the cpu-side
06:26.27rasteri think
06:26.34DocScrutinizersure
06:26.39rasterie u'd have to set up your own "data call"
06:26.40DocScrutinizeror do Vo80
06:26.48DocScrutinizervoip
06:26.51rasteryeah
06:26.54rasteror just voip
06:27.11rasternot too good on 2g (gprs)
06:27.15rasterbut mauybe edge+ it'd be ok
06:27.22DocScrutinizerthough voip will drain bat on standby :-(
06:27.34rasterja
06:28.18DocScrutinizerconstant SIP and STUN keep alive traffic, keeping umts transmitting
06:28.30spaetzI love my n800
06:28.31rasteryeah
06:28.33rasterthat will suck
06:28.39spaetzbattery life is great
06:28.54spaetzkeeping an irssi session in it running via wifi all day long
06:29.11DocScrutinizerthat's what rasterphone will have to be alike
06:29.35rasterhehehe
06:29.42rasterjoergphone
06:29.49DocScrutinizerk
06:29.55DocScrutinizerrjphone
06:30.21spaetzwonders how the ideal spaetz-o-fon would look like
06:30.40DocScrutinizerlike rjphone ;)
06:30.44spaetzactually an n810 comes pretty close, just the software needs more tweaking
06:30.55DocScrutinizerhehehe
06:31.07DocScrutinizerraster, I told ya
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06:31.41rasterDocScrutinizer:  i know. 810 is good
06:31.45rastera little on the big side
06:31.51DocScrutinizerwell I don't exactly *need* the dead bezel
06:31.52rasterbut missing.. 21g/3g
06:31.56rastererr 2g/3g
06:32.01rasteryeah
06:32.15rasterif the phone was just the screen (active area) + 5mm
06:32.17rasterperfect
06:32.19DocScrutinizerbut kbd and screensize
06:32.33DocScrutinizeryup
06:32.51rasterthe problem is all those 4.3" screen have massive bezelz
06:32.55rasterand they arent even
06:33.04rasterthey all seem to be designed for landscape
06:33.09rasterand for a phone u'd want portrait
06:33.15jclooking around to find my FR.
06:34.37rasterinteresting that the n800 is overall thinner than the fr
06:34.57jcraster: but larger, right?
06:35.10rasteryes
06:35.12rasterwider and longer
06:35.14DocScrutinizersure
06:35.27rasterbut the screen is 2x the surface area
06:35.27DocScrutinizerhas better larger screen
06:35.29jcraster: we have something from gigabyte, m528. any idea about that?
06:36.02rasterdunno
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06:36.23rasteri would suspewct it doesnt come close to an n8x0 in terms of power consumption
06:36.40rasteri know i've had my n800 be just floating about (Without suspending) for over a week
06:36.45DocScrutinizerand N810 has *awesome* touchscreen
06:36.49rasterand thats while bing on my wifi netwokr too
06:36.52raster(and i can ssh in)
06:37.01rasteratom is a power eater
06:37.19rasteru wont see anything using atom come close to being a phone or touchpad thing like an n8xx
06:37.28jcraster: yes, m528 is atom.  so, better wait for n900.
06:38.25DocScrutinizerc-ts eats some power too btw. all the time ;D
06:38.31spaetzDocScrutinizer: is n810 touchscreen different from n800 one?
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06:38.45DocScrutinizerdunno.
06:39.02spaetzraster: yep as I said, power management with the n8x0 is really ?hantastic
06:39.09DocScrutinizerprolly not
06:39.21spaetzprobably
06:39.50rasteratom is somwhere about 5-20x the power consumption of an omap3
06:39.53rasterand thats just atom
06:40.03rasternot including gfx, audio/video codec hw etc.
06:40.04rasterjust cpui
06:40.17rasterand ther omap3 includes gfx (3d accel, 2d video overlays, video/audio codecs)
06:40.18DocScrutinizerliquid separator. high transparency and really sesitive
06:41.35rasteran atom based boa4rd (whoe board) consumes about 30w
06:41.48rastera whole omap3 board (like beagle) consumes about 2w
06:41.51rasterthats running full
06:42.54DocScrutinizerhehe 30W in a smartphone. we need to invent new fan technology
06:43.26rasterheheh
06:43.36CIA-41freesmartphone.org: 03Frederik.Sdun 07specs * rd87c0a3e56de 10/ (3 files in 3 dirs):
06:43.36CIA-41freesmartphone.org: Changed signature of signal
06:43.36CIA-41freesmartphone.org: Gypsy.Position.PositionChanged to new API
06:43.36rasteragain - thatsd a whole board
06:43.41rasterall components going
06:43.48rasterif u set things to idle stats
06:43.55rasterand turn off stuff u'll be < 1w
06:43.55jcDocScrutinizer: put some label "Good for Winter TIme."
06:44.06DocScrutinizerlol
06:44.58DocScrutinizernow maybe project-B is a pocket warmer for arctic
06:45.31playyaa gta-03 without the gsm/wifi chip?
06:45.41jcDocScrutinizer: "Pocket size heater"  "Make you hot, anytime".
06:45.55DocScrutinizerhhehe yup
06:46.26DocScrutinizerplayya: nope
06:47.01DocScrutinizernot exactly
06:47.25rasterplayya: PROJECT B IS NOT A PHONE
06:47.27rasterITS NOT RELATED TO A PHONE
06:47.30rasterITS NOTHNIG LIKE A PHONE
06:47.39playya54,74,90,2010
06:47.39rasteroops
06:47.40rastercaps
06:47.52rasterfixed
06:47.54rasterdamnit
06:47.59rasterwhy do i keep losing my capslock mod
06:48.01rasteranyway
06:48.07rasterit doesnt even run linux
06:48.27rasterto thinking of project b in any form of related context to anything om has done before is going to be wrong
06:48.29DocScrutinizeras you easily can tell
06:48.55jcDocScrutinizer: gta-03.........you can say that without gsm/wifi.  Since that is only remaining in the memory.
06:48.55DocScrutinizeras there's nothing checked in mentioning projectB
06:49.37jcaccording to Steve M, Plan B is not a telecom product.
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06:50.19slaxxersounds like a bunch more misdirection to me:)
06:50.46rastersteve is right
06:50.50rasterits not a telecoms product
06:50.51slaxxeron purpose i mean
06:51.02rasterits up to om to tell you what it is when it comes out
06:51.03rasterooh no
06:51.07rasterits not on purpose
06:51.10rasteri know what it is
06:51.14rasterso does DocScrutinizer
06:51.21rasterom is being honest (this time)
06:51.25rasterit is not a phone of any sort
06:51.28rasternot a wifi thing
06:51.31rasterdoesnt run linux
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06:52.22DocScrutinizerit's A TOASTER
06:52.27rasterhahaha
06:52.34DocScrutinizertold ya weeks ago ;-)
06:52.35raster"open toaster"
06:52.51jcraster: I know what project B is.
06:52.52rastertotays tostares are too closed
06:53.58jcchecking the NDA paper....
06:54.01rasteri know that project-b has me about as excited as a cat would be over a lump of dirt
06:54.10rasteri.e. not very interested
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06:54.39rasterit's up to om to release unto the world what it is.. when om decides to
06:55.54jcraster: keep it secret is good.
06:57.17jchow could people blame me, while the one send them e-mail has configuration error on his side.
06:57.26DocScrutinizerwonders how much of his tributes to hackers will make it to MP for B
06:57.56rasterjc: yeah. thats om's stuff. it's just silly for people to run around speculating that it is a phone or some other related thing when its stated it isnt.. and those statements are correct.
06:58.42DocScrutinizerwonders even more if anybody cares
06:58.56CIA-41freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07libgsm0710mux * rf94a7f6ce723 10/ (Makefile.am gsm0710mux/serial.vala gsm0710mux/transport.vala): rename serial to transport
06:59.22spaetzopen toaster, mmh
06:59.28spaetzthen it better has an atom board
06:59.29rasterDocScrutinizer: i dont :)
06:59.37rasterbut i know what it is :)
07:00.02DocScrutinizerbuhuhuhuaaaaaa ;-(
07:00.25DocScrutinizernevermind
07:00.33DocScrutinizeranother fancy
07:02.24playyaspaetz, atom is too efficient for a toaster. maybe a POWER PC
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07:06.38jcmobile toater.
07:08.26DocScrutinizerpowered by a litium-fusion battery
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07:13.52jcprefect match with bicycle. charging on the way.
07:14.03jcwhen you arrive, the toast is ready.
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07:21.35jcgoing back to fix other people's mail server.
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07:25.01beer_hi
07:27.10beer_When I talk with other people, using my freerunner with qt extended improved, shr or fyp, a few people have problem with hearing my becouse of echo and buzz (but not all and I dont hear anything unusual). Is there a good workaround or a fix for that problem?
07:28.42PaulFertserbeer_: buzzfix?
07:29.15beer_year
07:29.37PaulFertserbeer_: that was the answer actually. Do a buzzfix.
07:29.57beer_how? Do you have a link ?
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07:30.53PaulFertserbeer_: http://people.openmoko.org/joerg/GSM_EMI_noise/big-C_rework_SOP_rc2.pdf
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07:31.55beer_tx, I will look into it
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07:32.55PaulFertserbeer_: as to the echo, i guess qte i already does everything needed to stop it.
07:34.13spaetzthe v6 has  no buzzfix yet, right?
07:34.22spaetzonly v7 has ?!
07:34.58PaulFertserspaetz: some v6 are factory-reworked. Some are reworked by distributors. So no, wrong.
07:35.01Hopscotchgood morning
07:35.13beer_PaulFertser: I have testet it myself. There is a small echo. But I think you need to know that it is there to notice it
07:35.14spaetzPaulFertser: confusing.
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07:35.25spaetzhow would I know? Inspecting the HW?
07:35.33PaulFertserwonders when people will actually start to use bluetooth headsets.
07:35.41CIA-41freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07cornucopia * r1793804a5085 10/libfsoframework/ (4 files in 2 dirs): fsoframework: transport: support freeze() and thaw()
07:35.53spaetzwhen BT headsets work out of the box :)
07:35.59PaulFertserspaetz: fortunately dissassembling FR is not hard.
07:36.04PaulFertserspaetz: don't they?
07:36.20spaetzI never tried, but so far I haven't heard of many that use BT, so I assume not
07:36.29spaetzI might be totally wrong
07:37.08spaetzand as alsa state files scare me a lot (never looked at them), I wouldn't be able to set volume anyway
07:37.56CIA-41freesmartphone.org: 03jluebbe 07framework * r0523cc1a92af 10/ (2 files in 2 dirs): otimed: make ntp server configurable
07:37.57PaulFertserspaetz: they should work. It's just that not many people try. Digital_Pioneer tried (it didn't work) it might be just an incompatible headset. I have a headset that's incompatible too. But infrastructure is there, soft is there. No OM-specific problems left (except bluetooth host controller that acts strange with some headsets).
07:38.27PaulFertserspaetz: volume is not a problem, there's a routing diagram that is easy to understand.
07:38.37PaulFertserspaetz: with all alsa control names printed over it.
07:38.40spaetzrouting diagrams scare me too :)
07:38.50spaetzI just never got involved in the audio side of things
07:38.58PaulFertserspaetz: you just haven't seen the fancy version.
07:39.03spaetzhehe
07:39.14beer_so using a BT headsed will solve the same problem as http://people.openmoko.org/joerg/GSM_EMI_noise/big-C_rework_SOP_rc2.pdf ?
07:39.14PaulFertserbeer_: got a BT headset?
07:39.18spaetzas I don't have a BT headset yet
07:39.26spaetzare there any known to work?
07:39.35spaetzor any standard that they should adhere to?
07:39.38DocScrutinizerbeer_: yup
07:39.53beer_nope, I can borrow one and if it fixes it I can buy one
07:39.57PaulFertserbeer_: it's the other problem, but yes. Should solve the buzz if you use the headset mic.
07:40.20beer_looks easyer than the harware fix
07:41.09PaulFertserspaetz: they should adhere to SCO (and probably eSCO) standard. And they do. The reason for incompatibility of my headset and FR is yet to be found, proved to be more difficult than i hoped. I even compiled the latest bluetooth kernel portions for FR, but it was of no help. The same headset works ok with my laptop.
07:41.37DocScrutinizerthough I really don't know how BT assoc is suuposed to behave on wake from suspend
07:41.46PaulFertserspaetz: the other headest i borrowed was some fake jabra (probably) and it worked without problems (though i haven't tried gsm, as it wasn't ready at that time).
07:42.19spaetzmmh, probably I'll be able oto borrow one first and try it out.
07:42.29PaulFertserspaetz: the best approach, imho
07:42.51PaulFertserspaetz: use the latest wiki instructions by Digital_Pioneer (c) ;)
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07:43.57PaulFertserbeer_: beware, bluetooth headsets are still work-in-progress, so do not think it'll magically solve all the problems. It will probably solve buzz, but you might be surprised to find some new issues ;)
07:44.51beer_2 steps forward and 1 step back is still progress
07:45.06DocScrutinizerlike losing association when FR is supending
07:45.08spaetzis HFP, HSP something that I should know off?
07:45.27spaetzlooking at a cheap SonyEricsson and it does 2.0 + EDR; HFP, HSP
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07:45.44spaetz20EUR sounds affordable
07:45.57CIA-41freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07cornucopia * r45b927cc48c9 10/libfsoframework/tests/testtransport.vala: fsoframework: add test for transport/freeze&thaw
07:46.20DocScrutinizerso on inbound call when FR suspended it might still be hard to use BT in time
07:46.26PaulFertserDocScrutinizer: i guess whenever the request to use a headset is made, it'll promptly re-associate.
07:46.48DocScrutinizerdunno
07:46.50PaulFertserspaetz: HSP is what you need.
07:47.58spaetzok, thanks
07:48.01DocScrutinizeron other devices my BThs lost connection when I powercycled the host, and needed powercycle itself
07:49.49DocScrutinizerbut then there the host BT was powercycled as well. In FR you can keep it powered up
07:51.13spaetzkeeping it powered up sounds like sucking batteries dry
07:51.38DocScrutinizerhmm, yeah
07:52.12DocScrutinizerfor sure there's good reason to fix buzz
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08:37.26thrasholdI have a problem with e. Almost every time after an unclean shutdown, it recreates all of its configuration and I have to set up fonts and stuff again. I'm using Debian. Any suggestions?
08:38.07thrasholdI've already got under the 10 minute mark for reconfiguring it from scratch, but still...
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08:42.18thrasholdIt seems that ~/.e/e/config/profile.cfg gets destroyed. I copied the fresh one to the backup of my old .e directory, and it didn't want reconfiguration.
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09:03.48methril|workmorning
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09:10.07CM_workthrashold: Almost sounds like the whole ext4 discussion ;-) (It's not though, and I don't know what the problem is)
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09:18.23CIA-41freesmartphone.org: 03aapo.rantalainen 07vala-terminal * rd9b50c359472 10/src/ (mainwindow.vala terminal.vala): Added commandline parameters for colours and fontname
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09:21.53thrasholdWell, I saw why. My phone rebooted again, and e2fsck said half of files in .e were broken...
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09:29.53unknownhi, i've got an htc arte110 and want to install OM on it but i could'nt find a howto. i don't know how i can access the rom of the htc. can someone help me?
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09:36.01shellevilEssentially - OM almost works on the released hardware.
09:36.10shellevilFor anything else, you are entirely on your own.
09:36.26shellevilunless you can find a howto from someone that's done it.
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09:37.40shellevilfirst you probably need to find out how to flash linux onto it - google - then you need to port a distribution so that it understands the hardware, ...
09:37.41unknownbut i did'nt find a generaly howto that describes how i can access the rom of my htc
09:38.15shellevilthat's not a OM problem - it's a HTC problem - you'd need to find that  seperately
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09:38.36unknownok thx anyway
09:40.22shellevilgood luck getting somethign working
09:43.10PaulFertserunknown: in general, there is no distro or software called OM anymore.
09:43.39PaulFertserunknown: see http://freesmartphone.org for API and reference implementation of middleware. Any porting work is appreciated and supported.
09:43.42mirko-paroliPaulFertser: that is not quite true
09:44.08mirko-paroliI am not against dramatization but that might be a bit over the top :)
09:44.11mirko-parolihi btw :)
09:44.12PaulFertsermirko-paroli: ok, technicaly speaking, there's OM2009 unstable.
09:44.20mirko-paroliand now testing
09:44.22PaulFertsermirko-paroli: hi :)
09:44.23methril|workunknown: see #htc-linux channel for more info
09:44.29shellevilpalf: that too
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09:44.32mirko-paroliand a release in summer
09:44.32unknownahh cool thx
09:44.49mirko-paroliso technically speaking there is a OM distro
09:44.49PaulFertsermirko-paroli: but talking about "porting OM" doesn't make sense anyway, do you agree? ;)
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09:45.23mirko-paroliporting? hmm I would say that "porting" any of the systems from the FR would be the best approach
09:45.30mirko-parolirather pick and chose :)
09:46.18mirko-parolithe question remains, which part of "OM" is drastically different from other distros ?
09:46.18PaulFertsermirko-paroli: btw, what's the reason to build OM instead of Angstrom?
09:46.44mirko-parolido those 2 exclude each other ?
09:48.10shellevilAnd I said porting a distribution.
09:48.13shellevilnot porting OM
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09:54.57max_posedonDocScrutinizer, [CC: PaulFertser] Sorry, for touching you, but how it's going about papers?
09:55.08max_posedonI already have tickets, and one more problem
09:55.29max_posedondeperature time is 20'45, *monday*.
09:56.09PaulFertsermax_posedon: monday? What date?
09:56.16max_posedon25 may
09:56.35PaulFertsermax_posedon: hm, how does it make any sense?
09:56.40max_posedon(departure from Berlin)
09:56.47PaulFertsermax_posedon: ah, why Berlin?
09:57.14max_posedonooops., I thought conferense in Berlin? I'm crazy?
09:57.19PaulFertsermax_posedon: yep
09:57.23PaulFertsermax_posedon: Essen,
09:57.48PaulFertsermax_posedon: nearest airport is Dusseldorf (or Dortmund). ~50km from Essen.
09:58.02max_posedonoooops, thanks god I have time return ticket,
09:58.06max_posedonI'll go by bus
09:58.47max_posedon(I'm really stupid)
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10:05.47Feisar_Hi, is it possible to edit settings for the illume launcher? I would like to change the font size and remove bold
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10:11.15PaulFertsermirko-paroli: no, i just don't understand why have three different distros (Angstrom, SHR, OM). SHR needs some patches not pushed to OE yet, well, that's a reason. But why OM needs to be a separate distribution?
10:11.18max_posedonPaulFertser, he-he, nice, that same bus goes to essen and berlin, I need just small "patch" to tickets)
10:11.30max_posedonthanks! that you find my bug)
10:11.47mirko-paroliPaulFertser: frankly, I don't get it either, but then again I am not big in the distro business
10:11.54PaulFertsermax_posedon: good luck applying the patch. ;)
10:12.21mirko-paroliand I am sure if a step towards unifying was taken the question would be, which will be the base etc etc etc
10:12.27max_posedonanyway I had small problem with one night 24/25 may
10:13.02PaulFertsermirko-paroli: and is there any particular reason you don't push paroli recipe to SHR? Onen did that for CellID tracker, and it seems that it's a good opportunity to widen the testing base.
10:13.28mirko-paroliPaulFertser: until I haven't finished the switching from fullscreen to normal
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10:13.40mirko-paroliwhich btw depends on the distro fullfillung certain criteria :)
10:15.00PaulFertsermax_posedon: in my plan i have like 7 nights i have no idea where i am going to be :p
10:15.46PaulFertsermirko-paroli: i thought that's not a big problem for shr unstable.
10:15.50mirko-paroliPaulFertser: but I agree, ideally the difference between the distros shouldn't be too big anyhow
10:15.58mirko-paroliand paroli should run on anything
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10:16.12mirko-paroliand SHR is certainly on my list :)
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10:16.16mirko-parolibut I think I won't gain that much
10:16.26mirko-paroliexcept that it is not an OM-labeled distro
10:16.51PaulFertsershellevil: unknown asked about "installing OM" which i interpreted as "porting OM distro".
10:17.27PaulFertsermirko-paroli: it's more popular than OM2009 atm, just that.
10:17.51mirko-paroliPaulFertser: I also think that many fixes Angus does go upstream and thus also help SHR and vice-versa
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10:18.11mirko-parolijust that angus has to go through the troubles of making things work for me, which SHR doesn't have to do :)
10:18.35max_posedonHow many differents between paroli and shr? and what paroli need from linux as base? (Thinking about adding paroli to gentoo)
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10:20.25mirko-parolimax_posedon: again I am not an expert here, but I believe there are no direct dependencies apart form the whole efl shabang plus fso
10:20.29mirko-paroliand python
10:20.42max_posedon(and I of course suggest all trying porting shr/fso/paroli? to new phones use gentoo, it just more generic, and I think more easy)
10:21.09max_posedonhm.. we already have ported shr, so, just and 1 package? (paroli) python,etc is present
10:21.44mirko-paroliiirc paroli runs on shr without big troubles
10:21.54mirko-paroliso in theory yes should be an easy fix
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10:22.11max_posedonnice, I'll try it in few nearest days
10:22.46mirko-parolimax_posedon: k, let me know how it goes and if there is anything I can do to help the process along :)
10:23.37max_posedonI'll
10:24.51max_posedonPaulFertser, btw, that is debian status? still only zhone?
10:25.48mirko-parolimax_posedon: I have mailed ot the debian openmoko list but no answer so far :(
10:25.51PaulFertsermax_posedon: i guess, yes.
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10:38.38FeisarHi, is it a simple task to remove the bolding of the fonts in the launcher on SHR?
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10:42.39CIA-41freesmartphone.org: 03jluebbe 07framework * r16680545f4f4 10/setup.py: setup.py: ship cell db
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11:15.09badcloudhey pips
11:15.38badcloudanyone get headphone audio working under 2008.12?
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11:17.54badcloudoh, well. hope springs eternal
11:19.07TeLLuSbadcloud: Yes
11:19.22badcloudautomatically, TeLLuS?
11:19.30badcloudor did you have to do something via console, etc
11:19.54TeLLuSbadcloud: Selected the profile when talking..
11:20.02badcloudwhich prof?
11:20.21badcloudI just want to listen to media files, not use a headset
11:20.33badcloudusing a Motorola 398 adapter
11:22.16badcloudbut all I get is audio from the speaker
11:22.22badcloudnothing from the headphones
11:22.38lord-carloson SHR i just need ti plug it in
11:22.55badcloud*sigh*, might just go back to SHR then
11:23.00lord-carlosbut the sound quality is shitty
11:23.07TeLLuSWhen in-a-call, the other profile.  You should probably add some program to change profile to listen with headphone.  How is it  now in OM2009?
11:23.09badcloudfcuk
11:23.16lord-carlosat least with the default media player
11:23.51TeLLuSThere is a mixer setting program.. somewhere
11:24.19lord-carlosi have never head such shitty sound from an mobil/mp3 player before
11:24.20badcloudwell, anyhoos, thanks
11:24.34badcloudman, there is zero hope for this phone
11:24.41lord-carlosindeed
11:24.54badcloudforget what I said about hope springing eternal
11:25.12badcloudis it hardware?
11:25.26lord-carlosyou could use it as a brick
11:25.47lord-carlosSome one said with an other playe so sound could be better
11:25.49badcloudpaperweight in my case
11:26.03badcloudgod, and it seemed soooooooo promising
11:26.10Zorkmanintone only uses a fraction of the cpu that was used
11:26.19Zorkmanand bt headsets give a perfectly good audio
11:26.31badcloudwhat about regular 2.5 mm?
11:26.33Zorkmanhaven't tested speech with it
11:26.56badcloud(direct-connecting headphones)
11:26.57Zorkmanbadcloud: regular 2.5mm is "ok", but if you're really into good sound you will find it lacks bass
11:27.12badcloudwell, I gotta go
11:27.13Zorkmanbut i could live with it
11:27.13lord-carlosthere is really NO bass
11:27.23lord-carlosno a little bit
11:27.23badcloudto be continued for me
11:27.24badcloudlatered
11:27.25Zorkmanlord-carlos: i had some...
11:27.28badcloud*later
11:28.17lord-carlosi used the OpenMoko headset from pulster.de, There was really no bass at all
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11:31.39PaulFertserlord-carlos: in my understanding there is no chance to get decent bass from any headphones without a hardware mod.
11:32.27*** join/#openmoko emacsian (n=ram@122.167.85.89)
11:33.47lord-carlosdamn ..
11:34.18lord-carlosthis phone is frustrating
11:34.26PaulFertserlord-carlos: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/GTA02_bass_fix
11:34.49PaulFertserlord-carlos: frustration depends on your attitude, not on the phone itself.
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11:50.33lord-carlosOpenMoko makes me kill kittens
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11:55.41PaulFertserlord-carlos: screw you
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12:10.41torehm, how can I get a norwegian keyboard on my openmoko?
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12:16.15lindi-tore: install xvkbd and use norwegian layout?
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12:18.58torehm
12:19.05torecan't find it in the SHR repositories
12:19.35lindi-tore: it's in debian
12:20.04toreso I'll have to run debian on the moko, to get a norwegian keyboard? ;---<
12:20.40lindi-tore: that's one way
12:20.40PaulFertsertore: try to search opkg.org (and then google) for illume layout.
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12:24.48torePaulFertser: fixed it
12:24.49tore=)
12:24.52torethanks for the help!
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12:48.57max_posedon[ticket patched] /me summons DocScrutinizer ...
12:49.33max_posedonPaulFertser, btw, haw many time embassy require to create visa for you? here it is 2 weeks...
12:54.48Digital_PioneerPaulFertser: Ooh, I get a (c) now, do I? :P
12:55.22PaulFertserDigital_Pioneer: hey :) Any luck with borrowing other headsets?
12:55.36Digital_PioneerNope, I bought one on Newegg.
12:55.46PaulFertsermax_posedon: it depends; they have no clear rules for that here.
12:55.50Digital_PioneerA pretty nice one, too, so I'm hoping it'll work well... :P
12:55.57PaulFertserDigital_Pioneer: and result is?
12:56.00Digital_PioneerIt's stereo, supports A2DP...
12:56.06Digital_PioneerIn transit. :)
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12:57.02PaulFertserDigital_Pioneer: what about GSM usage?
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12:57.26Digital_PioneerFor the bluetooth headset?
12:57.28PaulFertserDigital_Pioneer: as you already tried that with other headset, i guess it's easy for you to try it with this new.
12:57.42Digital_PioneerYeah, I hope so. :P
12:58.10PaulFertserDigital_Pioneer: don't come with anything less than a success story ;)
12:59.30Digital_PioneerPaulFertser: I'll do my best. Heheh
13:04.38CIA-41freesmartphone.org: 03didier 07libfso-glib * r336724192d63 10/ (configure.ac src/Makefile.am):
13:04.38CIA-41freesmartphone.org: Make typelib generation optional (with --enable-typelib)
13:04.38CIA-41freesmartphone.org: Signed-off-by: Didier Villevalois <didier@didier.local>
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13:51.15CIA-41freesmartphone.org: 03didier 07vala-dbus-binding-tool * r4dc42242752c 10/src/vala-dbus-binding-tool.vala:
13:51.15CIA-41freesmartphone.org: Fix missing closing brace from commit de5398704c072d942663c71502fc043c292fcf54
13:51.15CIA-41freesmartphone.org: Signed-off-by: Didier Villevalois <didier@didier.local>
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14:13.57CIA-41freesmartphone.org: 03didier 07libfso-glib * r8ce18ef10339 10/ (configure.ac src/Makefile.am):
14:13.57CIA-41freesmartphone.org: Regenerate bindings when SPECS_PATH variable is configured
14:13.57CIA-41freesmartphone.org: Signed-off-by: Didier Villevalois <didier@didier.local>
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15:34.39CIA-41freesmartphone.org: 03didier 07vala-dbus-binding-tool * r21ad9bb387c3 10/src/vala-dbus-binding-tool.vala:
15:34.39CIA-41freesmartphone.org: Remove silly debug messages
15:34.39CIA-41freesmartphone.org: Signed-off-by: Didier Villevalois <didier@didier.local>
15:37.00Serdarwhat can I do, if my moko doesn't start anymore?
15:37.27CIA-41freesmartphone.org: 03didier 07vala-dbus-binding-tool * rd5e258efe8dd 10/src/vala-dbus-binding-tool.vala:
15:37.27CIA-41freesmartphone.org: Fix indentation on empty lines for better diff behavior
15:37.28CIA-41freesmartphone.org: Signed-off-by: Didier Villevalois <didier@didier.local>
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15:40.39CIA-41freesmartphone.org: 03didier 07vala-dbus-binding-tool * r55a6bc5dd032 10/src/vala-dbus-binding-tool.vala:
15:40.39CIA-41freesmartphone.org: Fix non-propagated generator error
15:40.39CIA-41freesmartphone.org: Signed-off-by: Didier Villevalois <didier@didier.local>
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15:42.15bipakhow can i set the timezone with the "date" command that comes with busybox?
15:42.42mmontourSerdar: first check for a discharged battery (check the wiki for details)
15:42.50bipakdate 041517422009 CEST doesnt work
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15:43.17mmontourtry "TZ=CEST date ..."
15:43.25bipakok
15:43.46bipakworked :)
15:43.47bipakthx
15:44.12Serdarmmontour, it_'s pretty strange, it's vibriates, than it seems, that it will mount but it makes a "bup" sound and get off
15:44.50Serdarand it was charging the whole night, this is my first time starting it today
15:45.14mmontourCharging on wall-charger or from a PC?
15:45.22Serdarwall chargwer
15:45.23Serdar-w
15:46.11mmontouryou might try charging from a PC for a while
15:46.28Serdarhm
15:46.48mmontour(there's one specific case where that will help, due to a u-boot bug. Dunno if it applies here)
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15:47.25mmontourI assume it was working previously, with the same software that's on it now?
15:47.29Serdarwhat u-boot bug? I am useing qi
15:47.41Serdarmmontour, nope
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15:48.04mmontourOK, never mind about the wall-charger/PC thing if you're using Qi
15:48.25Serdarokay
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15:50.10mmontourYou could try booting it from NOR u-boot and see if that makes a difference
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15:53.01CIA-41freesmartphone.org: 03jluebbe 07framework * r73d5346b1a84 10/framework/subsystems/odeviced/idlenotifier.py:
15:53.01CIA-41freesmartphone.org: idlenotifier: more debugging and error recovery in callback
15:53.01CIA-41freesmartphone.org: This should help us to solve FSO bug #333.
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15:57.14bipakhmm, there is no option die writen a sms with zhone?
15:57.19bipakdie = to
15:57.20bipaklol
15:57.31bipak<- tired
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16:10.38bipakam i really to stupid to find the button to write an sms in zhone? :>
16:10.52bipakor is it just very good hidden
16:11.17roolybipak, go to contacts, select a contact, hit the button with 4 squares, and select send message or whatever
16:12.29bipakwhen i hit the button with the 4 squares i have only, "edit name", "edit number", "new", "delete" and "cancel"
16:12.46roolydo you have a contacct selected?
16:12.49bipakyes
16:13.18bipakim using om2009
16:14.07mwesterThen you're not using zhone!
16:14.40bipakfso-om2009 not fso-paroli-2009
16:14.41bipak:)
16:14.49alphaonebipak: Yeah, really unintuitive. Go to messages, hit the  button with 4 squares and select send
16:15.04alphaoneThen select a contact
16:15.42bipakalphaone: uuuuh, ok thanks
16:15.43bipakthast way works
16:16.07alphaonebipak: np :-)
16:17.06bipakalphaone: now i understand what they where talking about in the mailing list *g*
16:18.33roolypoints to the comment that zhone is a demo app
16:19.39bipakbut it works at least good as the phone apps that arent demo :)
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16:20.09alphaonebipak: Yeah, that's the reason I'm using it as well. Pretty sad, actually
16:20.10roolynot quite
16:20.13roolyits slow as sin
16:21.25bipakhmm for me its quite fast. only the redraw when the keyboard disappears is verry slow
16:22.45bipakand the way you have to select a contact from the phonebook is a bad
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16:26.25bipakbtw. what kind of freaky ringtone comes with om2009? it sounds like the speaker is broken :p
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16:31.00alphaonebipak: Need to thank mickeyl for that :-)
16:31.46bipaki think im to young to know the theme
16:31.56bipakfrom on old game i think ;)
16:33.14roolyreminds me of casltevania
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17:00.59Digital_PioneerUgh, somewhere along the way I lost my AUX lock on SHR-unstable again... How do I get it back?
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17:58.02eMBeewhat isthe relationship between fso and opemembedded?
17:58.26blokkiegreetings earthlings !
17:58.38mirko-paroliLOL
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17:58.54mirko-paroligreetings traveler
17:59.50blokkieit has been a time , but I still cannot belive  42 is the ultimate anser
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18:11.36mirko-paroliblokkie: I am not there yet, still fighting with 17 + 4
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18:21.11ndnihilhrm
18:21.21ndnihilso it looks like the wifi driver in shr testing is borked
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18:32.22CIA-41freesmartphone.org: 03jluebbe 07framework * r516f48762ab7 10/ (2 files in 2 dirs): odeviced: fix idlenotifier
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18:54.53slaxxerparoli works well
18:55.16slaxxeri like the color -font setup
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18:56.25slaxxerln -s /media/card/maps /home/root/Maps
18:56.40slaxxer<PROTECTED>
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18:57.53slaxxeri need mplayer for fso  i think
18:58.06slaxxerintone fails to play
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19:07.25fredrinfsck, no internet @ my place, the neighbour canged the wifi password :( and no gprs with prepaid cards :(
19:07.55bipakask him for the new password
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19:08.17tethethfredrin: or seee if it's WEP ;)
19:08.52fredrintetheth: i know, but the only one is a bit fare away and is broadcasting at the same channel as all the others
19:08.59fredrinbut ḯm working on it
19:09.08bipak:)
19:09.19*** join/#openmoko everslick (n=clemens@91-113-120-52.adsl.highway.telekom.at)
19:09.34ndnihilmake a proper wifi antenna
19:09.35fredrinbipak: i did ask for the password first, but i don't think he liked that killed his bandwith
19:09.39ndnihiland pick up shit that's further away
19:10.20fredrin"make setup && make update && make image" kills bandwidth
19:10.25fredrinin shr
19:10.27fredrinehe
19:10.34ndnihilhttp://martybugs.net/wireless/biquad/
19:10.41fredrinndnihil: that's plan C
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19:46.30bipakis there a simple way to replace the analog clock with a digital clock in om2009?
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19:53.51fredrinsaw Red Flag Linux today
19:53.55*** join/#openmoko Digital_Pioneer (n=digitalp@192.133.129.3)
19:54.05fredrinthe default user is root and blank password
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19:54.33bipakwhat is red flag linux
19:54.47fredrinLinux China
19:55.06bipakhaha ok
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20:04.24mwester"Red Flag Linux"?   I expect it also has a built-in keylogger kernel module, that sends all its results to the Chinese government?
20:04.39TAsnmwester, you are the kernel dev.
20:04.43TAsnyou should know.
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20:06.03Zorkmanred flag linux sounds like something women boot every month for only a couple days....
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20:08.19TAsnZorkman, LOL!
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21:12.34slaxxerparoli jumps out of suspend very quickly
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21:54.39thrasholdHow do you change the keyboard in Illume keyboard? I managed to change it a few times by tapping the icon, but don't know how
21:54.52PaulFertserthrashold: you can do that by swiping up
21:55.20thrasholdah
21:55.22thrasholdthank you
21:55.23thrasholdthat did it
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22:14.41thrasholdThe most lightweight app to take a screenshot? From the console? For Debian? :) I want to take  ascreen of my phone now :)
22:15.23lord-carlosscrot or something like that
22:16.03lord-carlosthrashold: apt-get install scrot
22:16.15lindi-thrashold: xwd of course
22:16.26thrasholdThank you both :)
22:17.12lindi-thrashold: it's in the same category as xclock. very very standard stuff :)
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22:27.45thrasholdHas anyone suggested ayttm for IM so far? If not, I just tried it and I'm impressed.
22:29.13lindi-doesn't seem to be in debian :(
22:29.53lindi-hmm
22:30.18thrasholdHm, it is?
22:30.18lindi-made a typo, it is in debian. even stable
22:30.45lindi-i have used xchat on freerunner but it has some usability issues when I use large number of channels
22:31.10lindi-in addition to screenshots.debian.net we should have memoryusage.debian.net ;)
22:32.29thrasholdHeh, I didn't check the memory usage, but it started faster than any calculator app I have does, and was terribly fast compared to pidgin. :)
22:32.44lindi-thrashold: does ayttm use separate window for every IRC channel?=
22:33.17thrasholdem, I think it does... I had only one chat running, I will try now with several to see
22:34.04thrasholdyes...
22:34.10thrasholdLet's check the c onfiguration
22:35.01lindi-thrashold: seems to support tabs
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22:36.02lindi-thrashold: but i can't see all my channels there, they won' fit to screen
22:36.08lindi-thrashold: same problem as with xchat
22:36.13thrasholdYes, though with 4 chats there it is too much
22:36.41thrasholdYou can scroll the tabbar, though :)
22:36.51lindi-thrashold: yeah, and poll it constantly for updates?
22:37.59thrasholdIt will be the slowest kind of polling with touchscreen and so..
22:41.27shellevilgaim worked well when I tried it
22:41.39shellevilthough just as a display
22:42.00shellevilyou put the tabs on the bottom, and give channels 2 letter aliases
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