IRC log for #openmoko on 20090307

`00:04.56`	`*** join/#openmoko teythoon (n=teythoon@pD950F44D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)`
`00:09.29`	`*** join/#openmoko fradeve (n=fradeve@87.18.30.130)`
`00:10.11`	`*** join/#openmoko batti112 (n=batti@blfd-4db0e7b4.pool.einsundeins.de)`
`00:11.21`	`badcloud`	`anyone know how to install usbnet on the FR?`
`00:13.17`	`tomboy64`	`badcloud, you have to enable it in the kernel`
`00:13.25`	`tomboy64`	`badcloud, along with cdc_ether`
`00:13.43`	`*** join/#openmoko KenYoung (n=Ken@pool-129-44-172-155.bos.east.verizon.net)`
`00:15.13`	`badcloud`	`thanks, but could you go more into detail? I've never done that`
`00:15.58`	`tomboy64`	`badcloud, zcat /proc/config.gz \| egrep -i '(usbnet\|cdc)'`
`00:16.24`	`*** join/#openmoko merriam_ (n=merriam@wmerriam.gotadsl.co.uk)`
`00:16.35`	`*** join/#openmoko jeffszusz (n=jeffszus@d57-150-122.home.cgocable.net)`
`00:17.14`	`Dave`	`zcat!`
`00:17.20`	`tomboy64`	`badcloud, i have usbnet: y, cdcether: m, cdc_subset: m`
`00:17.28`	`tomboy64`	`composite is not set`
`00:17.38`	`tomboy64`	`and all on 2.6.28`
`00:17.45`	`tomboy64`	`same since 2.6.24, iirc`
`00:18.43`	`*** join/#openmoko vininim_ (n=vininim@pdpc/supporter/student/vininim)`
`00:19.15`	`tomboy64`	`Dave, ?`
`00:19.42`	`badcloud`	`tomboy, login as: root`
`00:19.42`	`badcloud`	`root@192.168.1.242's password:`
`00:19.42`	`badcloud`	`root@om-gta02 ~ $ zcat /proc/config.gz \|`
`00:19.42`	`badcloud`	`egrep -i '(usbnet\|cdc)'`
`00:19.42`	`badcloud`	`CONFIG_USB_USBNET=y`
`00:19.42`	`badcloud`	`CONFIG_USB_NET_CDCETHER=m`
`00:19.42`	`badcloud`	`CONFIG_USB_NET_CDC_SUBSET=m`
`00:19.42`	`badcloud`	`# CONFIG_USB_CDC_COMPOSITE is not set`
`00:19.43`	`badcloud`	`root@om-gta02 ~ $`
`00:20.10`	`badcloud`	`might have been a bit too much, sorry`
`00:20.40`	`tomboy64`	`nah`
`00:20.43`	`tomboy64`	`looks fine to me`
`00:21.45`	`Dave`	`:D`
`00:21.51`	`Dave`	`success?`
`00:22.23`	`badcloud`	`not really, no`
`00:24.10`	`badcloud`	`arrrg`
`00:25.14`	`badcloud`	`what am I missing...?`
`00:25.21`	`Dave`	`:\|`
`00:25.38`	`tomboy64`	`badcloud, do you have the modules cdc_ether and cdc_subset loaded?`
`00:25.46`	`tomboy64`	`badcloud, what does ifconfig -a print?`
`00:27.06`	`*** join/#openmoko huassuahsu (n=assa@189.17.84.163)`
`00:27.12`	`*** join/#openmoko alx}- (n=alx}--@AToulouse-151-1-20-99.w83-203.abo.wanadoo.fr)`
`00:27.40`	`tomboy64`	`badcloud, ignore my former question`
`00:27.40`	`badcloud`	`http://pastebin.com/m3b96ff93`
`00:27.50`	`badcloud`	`too late`
`00:27.54`	`badcloud`	`;)`
`00:28.25`	`tomboy64`	`badcloud, try ifdown usb0 && ifup usb0`
`00:29.03`	`badcloud`	`HELLO!!!`
`00:31.04`	`tomboy64`	`i reckon that did something good?`
`00:31.16`	`badcloud`	`I think it did the trick`
`00:31.26`	`tomboy64`	`well`
`00:31.36`	`tomboy64`	`then i suppose you started with the usb-cable plugged in`
`00:31.42`	`tomboy64`	`don't do that :-D`
`00:31.45`	`badcloud`	`but I'm still working at trying to ssh to it`
`00:31.51`	`badcloud`	`actually, yeah`
`00:31.54`	`tomboy64`	`can you ping it?`
`00:35.05`	`badcloud`	`shit, can't ssh to the router now`
`00:36.03`	`badcloud`	`one sec`
`00:37.37`	`*** join/#openmoko Digital_Pioneer (n=digitalp@h17.200.255.206.cable.srcy.cablelynx.com)`
`00:44.23`	`Dave`	`:x`
`00:46.19`	`*** join/#openmoko badcloud (n=bla@ti400720a342-0678.bb.online.no)`
`00:46.25`	`badcloud`	`back`
`00:46.36`	`badcloud`	`and no, I can't ping it`
`00:47.52`	`badcloud`	`ifdown usb0 && ifup usb0 didn't produce any errors, but I'm not sure ifit did anything`
`00:47.58`	`badcloud`	`*if it`
`00:48.43`	`tomboy64`	`ifconfig -a shows it now?`
`00:48.45`	`Dave`	`Welcome back :p`
`00:49.11`	`badcloud`	`nope`
`00:49.36`	`badcloud`	`thanks Dave, it sure is swell to be back`
`00:50.23`	`badcloud`	`is there a verbose switch for ifuo/down?`
`00:50.28`	`badcloud`	`*ifup`
`00:51.18`	`Dave`	`<PROTECTED>`
`00:51.19`	`max_posedon`	`might be some NetworkManager do some bad things?)`
`00:51.31`	`Dave`	`yeah, that sounds more likely`
`00:51.34`	`Dave`	`but what is this, Ubuntu?`
`00:51.44`	`badcloud`	`openwrt`
`00:51.45`	`max_posedon`	`e.g if you up interface, he down in a moment)`
`00:51.50`	`Dave`	`(that's probably what's causing all the problems) :D`
`00:52.17`	`badcloud`	`I'm gonna restart the network, one sec`
`00:56.40`	`*** join/#openmoko badcloud (n=bla@ti400720a342-0678.bb.online.no)`
`00:56.44`	`badcloud`	`oot@OpenWrt:~# ifup -v usb0`
`00:56.44`	`badcloud`	`ifconfig: invalid hw-addr v_macaddr`
`00:56.44`	`badcloud`	`Interface type v_proto not supported.`
`00:57.32`	`badcloud`	`that should shed some light`
`01:00.25`	`badcloud`	`chello?`
`01:00.46`	`badcloud`	`~_~`
`01:00.55`	`apt`	`STOP DOING THAT!`
`01:01.08`	`*** join/#openmoko badcloud (n=bla@ti400720a342-0678.bb.online.no)`
`01:01.09`	`Dave`	`-_-`
`01:01.20`	`badcloud`	`oot@OpenWrt:~# ifup -v usb0`
`01:01.20`	`badcloud`	`ifconfig: invalid hw-addr v_macaddr`
`01:01.20`	`badcloud`	`Interface type v_proto not supported.`
`01:01.27`	`Dave`	`:(`
`01:01.31`	`Dave`	`I am bewildered.`
`01:01.41`	`badcloud`	`sorry if that's double`
`01:01.42`	`Dave`	`seems like some unsupported shit`
`01:01.47`	`badcloud`	`~_~`
`01:01.48`	`apt`	`STOP DOING THAT!`
`01:02.01`	`badcloud`	`good to hear your voice, apt`
`01:02.26`	`Piet`	`say moo, come on, do it!`
`01:02.31`	`KenYoung`	`I bought one of the TuxBrain Freerunner leather cases. It is very nice. ~_~`
`01:03.07`	`Dave`	`Ken!`
`01:03.15`	`KenYoung`	`Hi Dave!`
`01:03.18`	`badcloud`	`this is upsetting`
`01:03.20`	`Dave`	`:)`
`01:03.26`	`Dave`	`Badcloud, you're telling me`
`01:03.27`	`Dave`	`!`
`01:03.54`	`Dave`	`Ken, is it quality?`
`01:04.22`	`KenYoung`	`Yes, in my opinion. Nice feel, good fit.`
`01:04.31`	`badcloud`	`drools`
`01:04.33`	`Dave`	`Great :)`
`01:07.40`	`badcloud`	`faq fock fek phoc fhac`
`01:07.55`	`badcloud`	`FUUUUUCK`
`01:08.20`	`Dave`	`:X`
`01:09.08`	`badcloud`	`I didn't install debian to stare at console login prompt...`
`01:09.29`	`badcloud`	`as cool as it is that it actually booted`
`01:10.08`	`badcloud`	`this is familiar on my ipaq all over again`
`01:10.20`	`Dave`	`hahahahhahahahahahahahahaha`
`01:11.38`	`badcloud`	`I should have just given Steve Blowjobs 400 bucks for a phone that works`
`01:12.34`	`Piet`	`i suppose you read through the debian wiki entry already?`
`01:12.42`	`badcloud`	`sure`
`01:12.43`	`Piet`	`dunno if that would help, but could`
`01:13.22`	`Piet`	`:-/`
`01:13.26`	`KenYoung`	`badcloud, Then what would you have to do on Friday nights?`
`01:14.31`	`Dave`	`:D`
`01:14.31`	`badcloud`	`get slapped by all the good looking girls in a bar, two if I'm not tired`
`01:14.50`	`tomboy64`	`why would you want to pay 400$ for a phone you can't ssh into?`
`01:14.53`	`tomboy64`	`uhhh`
`01:14.55`	`tomboy64`	`nvm`
`01:15.19`	`max_posedon`	`badcloud, I see you big openmoko fun, sit hope instead in bar with 2 girls!`
`01:15.26`	`max_posedon`	`sit at home`
`01:15.28`	`badcloud`	`ummm, because it would at least run as expected, albiet its limitations`
`01:15.41`	`tomboy64`	`hah`
`01:15.52`	`badcloud`	`2 bars, not girls`
`01:15.57`	`tomboy64`	`i once owned an imac g3`
`01:16.07`	`badcloud`	`hey, me too`
`01:16.11`	`tomboy64`	`didn't run as expected`
`01:16.18`	`tomboy64`	`so i installed gentoo on it`
`01:16.20`	`badcloud`	`ditto`
`01:16.22`	`tomboy64`	`then it ran as expected :-D`
`01:16.29`	`badcloud`	`ubuntu 4 me`
`01:17.02`	`Dave`	`failure`
`01:17.18`	`badcloud`	`is there anyway to activate wifi in debian before prompt?`
`01:19.34`	`Dave`	`like on bootup/init?`
`01:20.02`	`badcloud`	`yeah`
`01:20.06`	`Dave`	`a la rc.local? :P`
`01:20.17`	`badcloud`	`then I could just ssh via wifi`
`01:21.23`	`Dave`	`huhu`
`01:22.35`	`badcloud`	`won't auto eth0 work?`
`01:22.59`	`badcloud`	`in /etc/network/interfaces?`
`01:23.00`	`Dave`	`or whatever it is, yes, probably`
`01:23.08`	`Dave`	`so long as that's configured properly, yes`
`01:26.01`	`badcloud`	`I'll try that then`
`01:30.35`	`badcloud`	`here goes nothing`
`01:33.21`	`badcloud`	`hey Dave, what's the right config to be able to dropbear to debian via wifi?`
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`01:42.18`	`tomboy64`	`badcloud: http://dpaste.com/8390/`
`01:42.21`	`tomboy64`	`pah!`
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`01:45.48`	`tomboy64`	`badcloud: http://dpaste.com/8390/`
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`04:43.14`	`slaxxin`	`<PROTECTED>`
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`07:20.59`	`pabs3`	`is there a 2.6.28 image that can be used with Qt Extended?`
`07:21.21`	`pabs3`	`heard 2.6.28 increases the standby time to several days`
`07:28.22`	`*** join/#openmoko Heinervdm (n=thomas@pD9E1646E.dip.t-dialin.net)`
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`07:58.18`	`ColdFyre`	`SHR uses 2.6.28`
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`08:06.57`	`pabs3`	`I'm looking for a uImage+modules, not a whole distribution`
`08:07.24`	`*** join/#openmoko DocScrutinizer (n=jr@p5493E0D9.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`08:07.25`	`pabs3`	`anyways, using the unstable one (2.6.29-rc2)`
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`08:52.20`	`rhkfin_`	`Anyone here hear a very high, silent noise when the screen is in horizontal mode (in 2008.12 at least)?`
`08:55.17`	`sakkara`	`rhkfin_: yes, also noticed it...`
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`09:25.51`	`rhkfin_`	`sakkara: on what distro?`
`09:27.24`	`\|Leto\|`	`sheeesh`
`09:27.32`	`\|Leto\|`	`no sound at all from my openmoko`
`09:27.41`	`\|Leto\|`	`shr-testing remains silent`
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`09:44.02`	`sakkara`	`rhkfin_: shr`
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`09:44.12`	`rhkfin_`	`ok`
`09:45.06`	`rhkfin_`	`interesting though.. I'd guess it has something to do with hardware.. I don't think it's the speaker that makes it and if it was, it's weird that screen and speaker would be connected some way..`
`09:45.39`	`sakkara`	`rhkfin_: also by touching screen sometimes i notice this very high tone`
`09:46.06`	`sakkara`	`i think it is hardware related`
`09:49.03`	`rhkfin_`	`want to post it to the mailing lists to see if more have it & then create a trac item?`
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`09:59.39`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`trac item won'tfix, for sure ;-)`
`09:59.47`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`what kinda bug is that?`
`10:00.20`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`s/won'tfix/invalid/`
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`10:07.00`	`rhkfin_`	`DocScrutinizer: bug/feature/whatever but when you rotate the screen to horizontal (xrandr) there's a silent, very high tone you can hear`
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`10:08.39`	`DocScrutinizer`	`when I listen to the charger of my logitech mouse there's also a slight high tone. I don't think I can make a point it is a bug though`
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`10:12.19`	`DocScrutinizer`	`you'd be amazed what tones you could notice quite a lot of devices are emitting if you could hear up to 20 or even 40kHz. Each CRT is creating tones at hsync and vsync. TV this is even ~16kHz. Is it a bug? no as long as it won't hurt your ear in normal usage`
`10:16.04`	`DocScrutinizer`	`so please don't pester trac maintainer by filing a "bug" where trac has no appropriate severity and priority setting for`
`10:17.39`	`DocScrutinizer`	`you know it's BUG trac not wiki "funny observations" page`
`10:17.46`	`rhkfin_`	`On some distro/kernel combinations people don't hear it`
`10:20.06`	`DocScrutinizer`	`sigh so what's your suggestion??? should I create a beepfix similar to buzzfix SOP???`
`10:21.01`	`DocScrutinizer`	`as if there wasn't enough other topics in trac`
`10:21.40`	`rhkfin_`	`heh :) Patience, patience :)`
`10:23.41`	`rhkfin_`	`No, I don't think a HW fix SOP is required but if someone has the time & skills & interest to have a look at it I suppose it wouldn't be too bad to have a (human-ear) silent phone. Not everyone having this tells me that it's possible. And if it's a HW thing then maybe it could be addressed in the future HW versions with very little effort or something?`
`10:23.58`	`rhkfin_`	`(and generally I think discouraging people to write bug reps is bad policy..)`
`10:24.03`	`shellevil`	`probably`
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`10:24.28`	`shellevil`	`it's likely to be some inductor vibrating due to load or something.`
`10:24.53`	`shellevil`	`Then again - 03 is a pretty much - clean sheet.`
`10:25.08`	`DocScrutinizer`	`(addressed)no cant. ceramic caps have piezo properties`
`10:25.31`	`shellevil`	`and the likelyhood of reworking 02s is small`
`10:26.02`	`DocScrutinizer`	`btw emphasis on BUG`
`10:27.40`	`DocScrutinizer`	`wtf is it so loud you hear it during call or while half a meter away? or do you just plan to use your FR for a pillow? ;-)`
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`10:28.39`	`rhkfin_`	`half a meter away yes, during a call yes (having your ear right next to the phone)`
`10:28.56`	`DocScrutinizer`	`then it's actually a bug`
`10:29.10`	`rhkfin_`	`(TOLD YOU!!!) :)`
`10:29.16`	`DocScrutinizer`	`please go ahead file one right away`
`10:29.18`	`DocScrutinizer`	`sorry`
`10:29.24`	`rhkfin_`	`Thanks for listening :)`
`10:29.29`	`DocScrutinizer`	`np`
`10:30.51`	`rhkfin_`	`I suppose it would be worth trying newer kernels than 2.6.24 for 2008.12?`
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`10:33.55`	`DocScrutinizer`	`i guess it's interference to audio section and amp not powered down in some (most) of the rootfs/kernel-alsadrivers`
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`10:35.03`	`DocScrutinizer`	`maybe you could insert hp and check if you can hear it as well ?`
`10:35.49`	`shellevil`	`also - the exact frequency could be of use`
`10:35.54`	`DocScrutinizer`	`or explicitly shut down amp?`
`10:35.58`	`shellevil`	`in tracing stuff down`
`10:36.07`	`shellevil`	`if you've got that sort of test gear`
`10:36.14`	`rhkfin_`	`how do I shut down amp?`
`10:36.21`	`DocScrutinizer`	`a way to reproduce is more important`
`10:36.33`	`shellevil`	`yes, true`
`10:36.41`	`rhkfin_`	`DocScrutinizer: flash & DISPLAY=:0 xrandr -3 :)`
`10:36.48`	`rhkfin_`	`Writing a trac ticket`
`10:37.07`	`rhkfin_`	`-o 3`
`10:37.11`	`DocScrutinizer`	`alsamixer or sysfs maybe or gpio`
`10:37.33`	`DocScrutinizer`	`no time to elaborate right now`
`10:37.58`	`rhkfin_`	`ok, thanks`
`10:38.13`	`DocScrutinizer`	`pull AMP_SHUT to speak hw-talk`
`10:39.24`	PaulFert`	`rhkfin_: s3c24xx-gpio J1=1 (to pull up, 0 to pull down)`
`10:39.56`	`rhkfin_`	`and the command would be....?`
`10:40.01`	`DocScrutinizer`	`there should be a alsa.control as well, no?`
`10:40.07`	PaulFert`	`rhkfin_: "s3c24xx-gpio J1=1"`
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`10:40.34`	`DocScrutinizer`	`somewhere around #90`
`10:40.45`	PaulFert`	`Yes, look like it's "Amp Spk Switch" 94`
`10:41.24`	`rhkfin_`	PaulFert`: command not found.. I'll try with alsamixer
`10:41.41`	`DocScrutinizer`	`better`
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`10:42.05`	`rhkfin_`	`amp spk switch doesn't have any effect`
`10:42.50`	PaulFert`	`rhkfin_: no wonder, you're using inferior distro :p`
`10:42.55`	`rhkfin_`	`I know :)`
`10:43.14`	PaulFert`	`rhkfin_: as to the actual problem... Hm, do you hear the noise with the main speaker detached?`
`10:43.36`	`rhkfin_`	`I'd think yes but I'll check`
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`10:44.30`	PaulFert`	`rhkfin_: Are you using .24 kernel?`
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`10:45.24`	`rhkfin_`	PaulFert`: yes
`10:45.38`	`rhkfin_`	`went through all mute options in alsamixer, no effect`
`10:45.39`	PaulFert`	`rhkfin_: If yes, then probably there's no sense in trying to reproduce it, as LCM handling changed quite a lot since then.`
`10:45.48`	`rhkfin_`	`LCM being?`
`10:45.55`	PaulFert`	`rhkfin_: display`
`10:45.58`	`rhkfin_`	`oh, ok`
`10:46.06`	`DocScrutinizer`	`liqiud cristal module`
`10:46.45`	`rhkfin_`	`So I'll try a newer kernel (any recommendations for 2008.12?) and see what happens..`
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`10:47.52`	`rhkfin_`	`that's funny, changing between xrandr -o 3 adn -1 the frequency changes`
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`10:48.13`	PaulFert`	`rhkfin_: I think any kernel will allow you to boot unless bootscripts are too picky. I'm not sure what state stable is currently is, but Andy was going to maintain it for the "testing team", probably it will have all the recent fixes soon. Try latest andy-tracking.`
`10:49.01`	`rhkfin_`	`ok`
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`10:50.03`	PaulFert`	`rhkfin_: if it doesn't work, try b9de904e7aadd7b37c4035fd5d6f59e5f80089b6`
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`10:52.52`	`DocScrutinizer`	`anyway this might be of relevance to better understand WSOD and related issues`
`10:54.55`	`DocScrutinizer`	`I really wonder if it's LCM itself as there are few other components involved in screen orientation that can actually make any noise at all`
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`11:00.31`	`shellevil`	`Umm...`
`11:00.47`	`shellevil`	`LCM should be driven just the same whatever the rotation surely?`
`11:01.05`	`shellevil`	`It's the glamo that does the rotation, the LCM timings stay just the same.`
`11:02.57`	`shellevil`	`and the framebuffer RAM is inside the glamo - so it makes no sense at all.`
`11:03.51`	`shellevil`	`rhkfin_: couldn't be the way you're holding it differing with xrandr, making you hear it one way round?`
`11:04.28`	`rhkfin_`	`I have it on the table all the time, not moving (me or the phone)`
`11:05.42`	`Bane^`	`didn't hear anything with my shr-testing`
`11:06.08`	`rhkfin_`	`Bane^: what kernel`
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`11:08.55`	`Bane^`	`Linux om-gta02 2.6.28-rc4 #1 PREEMPT Fri Feb 27 07:52:39 EET 2009 armv4tl unknown`
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`11:09.01`	`rhkfin_`	`ok`
`11:11.25`	`Bane^`	`could be my hearing, though :)`
`11:13.03`	`rhkfin_`	`I'd like to measure the frequency or compare.. hey, I have a hifi test cd :)`
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`11:17.46`	`Bane^`	`actually, keeping the phone next my ear and messing with xrand, i can hear it.`
`11:18.04`	`rhkfin_`	`..`
`11:20.18`	`Bane^`	`you must have some kind of superpowers if you hear that when not you're not keeping the phone next to your ear`
`11:20.36`	`rhkfin_`	`superears :)`
`11:20.54`	`rhkfin_`	`Does it change when you switch between 3 and 1`
`11:21.27`	`rhkfin_`	`or maybe just not-damaged ears..`
`11:21.41`	`Bane^`	`could be ;)`
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`11:22.30`	`badcloud`	`hey pips`
`11:23.38`	`Bane^`	`i didn't notice anything different with 3 and 1`
`11:23.46`	`rhkfin_`	`Bane^: ok`
`11:25.10`	`Bane^`	`i don't even hear it unless i push my ear right next to the display. When keeping my ear next to the speaker i can't hear anything`
`11:25.22`	`Bane^`	`but seems normal to me`
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`11:26.56`	`badcloud`	`anyone know how to run apt-get without running the debian installer?`
`11:27.07`	`DocScrutinizer`	`that's why I was so reluctant to accept a bug here`
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`11:27.59`	`rhkfin_`	`hmm..`
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`11:28.15`	`shellevil`	`Bane^: rhkfin_ - how old are you - roughtly`
`11:28.31`	`shellevil`	`people under 20 or so have lots better HF hearing.`
`11:28.40`	`rhkfin_`	`27 roughly :)`
`11:29.07`	`DocScrutinizer`	`rhkfin_: could you reduce screen light to 5% and check for change?`
`11:29.25`	`rhkfin_`	`DocScrutinizer: will ty`
`11:29.28`	`rhkfin_`	`try`
`11:29.41`	`DocScrutinizer`	`shellevil: not nowadays ;P`
`11:30.05`	`Bane^`	`I'm 22`
`11:30.29`	`badcloud`	`ah, Fawlty Towers... I can't remember laughing so hard`
`11:30.48`	`rhkfin_`	`DocScrutinizer: no change no matter what's the backlight brightness`
`11:31.47`	`DocScrutinizer`	`rhkfin_: i assume screen content isn't changing massively as well`
`11:32.15`	`DocScrutinizer`	`between distros or orientation`
`11:32.28`	`DocScrutinizer`	`like white theme vs black`
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`11:33.29`	`rhkfin_`	`I have illume-theme installed. I'll try the white flashlight of orrery..`
`11:33.43`	`DocScrutinizer`	`rhkfin_: does firmly pressing the screen change anything?`
`11:34.11`	`rhkfin_`	`(haven't yet been able to install a newer kernel.. Need to update uboot -> qi, kernel & distro...)`
`11:35.03`	`rhkfin_`	`DocScrutinizer: white screen, no effect.`
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`11:36.05`	`rhkfin_`	`It's very well focused / only in one direction, away from the screen. Taking it away as far as my hand reaches I can hear it, turning it a bit away from my head's direction it gets quieter`
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`11:37.18`	PaulFert`	`rhkfin_: uboot can boot any kernel`
`11:37.20`	`DocScrutinizer`	`rhkfin_: dunno if it's feasible to tweak X.conf for a little higher frequency`
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`11:38.25`	PaulFert`	`rhkfin_: btw, i've booted 2007 (as i never flashed the rootfs) with andy-tracking without issues ;)`
`11:38.42`	`rhkfin_`	PaulFert`: not bad!
`11:38.59`	`rhkfin_`	`Are there images forandy-tracking somewhere. takes ages to compile it..`
`11:39.13`	PaulFert`	`rhkfin_: (without issues == allowed me to ssh in and change uSD card contents, haven't tried GSM or anything else :) )`
`11:39.19`	`rhkfin_`	`:)`
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`11:40.08`	`DocScrutinizer`	PaulFert`: prolly sysfs changed fubar
`11:40.15`	PaulFert`	`rhkfin_: http://people.openmoko.org/andy`
`11:40.52`	PaulFert`	`DocScrutinizer: It's ironic how calling a kernel "Andy's" is ok, while calling uSD image yours is not.`
`11:41.38`	`DocScrutinizer`	`I somehow managed to avoid this answer, though I thought the same immediately`
`11:42.08`	`DocScrutinizer`	`nevermind, not worth the keyboard wear`
`11:43.39`	`shellevil`	`DocScrutinizer: But. Surely the LCM is driven at exactly the same speed - the only thing that changes is the bit inside the glamo that says 'read out the framebuffer sideways' ?`
`11:43.55`	`shellevil`	`may be confused again.`
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`11:44.35`	`DocScrutinizer`	`I know we switch mode in jbt4711.c lcm controller chip driver`
`11:44.38`	`shellevil`	`votes for filling rhkfins ears with beeswax.`
`11:45.39`	`rhkfin_`	`shellevil: then the 'very low volume during calls' becomes an issue :)`
`11:45.41`	PaulFert`	`votes for convincing rhkfin_ to join the SHR development`
`11:46.12`	`DocScrutinizer`	`so I suspekt LCM to expose another flaw here`
`11:46.20`	`rhkfin_`	`votes for convincing rhkfin_ to forget 2008.12`
`11:46.21`	`DocScrutinizer`	`like with WSOD`
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`11:47.03`	`shellevil`	`Hmm. I know raster said glamo can do rotation.`
`11:47.12`	`DocScrutinizer`	`rhkfin_: fix R3004/5 and low volume of call will never again be an issue ;-)`
`11:47.14`	`rhkfin_`	`DocScrutinizer: pressing the screen doesn't affect`
`11:47.16`	`shellevil`	`I don't recall any statements that it does do rotation.`
`11:47.21`	`rhkfin_`	`DocScrutinizer: :)`
`11:47.28`	`shellevil`	`(n the xrandr case)`
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`11:48.31`	`shellevil`	`rh: does it do this on battery and off?`
`11:48.32`	PaulFert`	`DocScrutinizer: btw, i'm starting to miss my audible GSM interference, starting to check for incoming messages in a paranoid once-a-minute way (in case frameworkd fails to generate a sound). A good idea for the next device: special path to receive interference (with kill-switch of course).`
`11:48.45`	`shellevil`	`rhkfin_: on battery and usb`
`11:49.09`	`DocScrutinizer`	PaulFert`: ;P
`11:49.14`	`shellevil`	passes PaulFert`an unshielded amplified speaker.
`11:49.43`	PaulFert`	`shellevil: how am i supposed to fit it in FR's case? ;)`
`11:50.28`	`DocScrutinizer`	`rhkfin_: shellevil's questin is a good point`
`11:51.38`	`shellevil`	`also - does it start or stop making noise if at teh same time you do md5sum /dev/zero`
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`11:54.12`	`DocScrutinizer`	`s/zero/random/ ;-)`
`11:58.09`	`rhkfin_`	`md5sum /dev/zero - no effect`
`11:59.46`	`rhkfin_`	`on battery or battery+usb, no effect`
`12:00.03`	`rhkfin_`	`starts to look crazy to everyone here :)`
`12:00.23`	`DocScrutinizer`	`slightly press the cans' lids?`
`12:02.05`	`rhkfin_`	`Putting my ear right next to the phone & pressing the LCD and I can hear a bit lower (still ~high) voice (a very silent one) that stops when I remove my finger`
`12:02.23`	`rhkfin_`	`But other than that pressing around the phone/screen has no effect`
`12:02.38`	`rhkfin_`	`has a headache with this beeping :/`
`12:02.53`	`rhkfin_`	`I'll try now to flash a newer kernel..`
`12:03.13`	`DocScrutinizer`	`strange`
`12:05.21`	`rhkfin_`	`I'll try to remember all these tests & add to the track ticket..`
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`12:09.47`	`SpeedEvil`	`rhkfin_: have you tried plugging in headset?`
`12:10.37`	`rhkfin_`	`SpeedEvil: I did but it itself has no effect`
`12:11.05`	`rhkfin_`	`Bu I also can't hear anything through the headphones (though not sure, should check`
`12:11.27`	`SpeedEvil`	`Try submerging the phone in extra-virgin olive oil.`
`12:11.34`	`rhkfin_`	`:)`
`12:12.07`	`DocScrutinizer`	`werner recommends liquid copper`
`12:12.17`	`rhkfin_`	`hmm.. stable from here won't start http://people.openmoko.org/andy/`
`12:12.22`	`rhkfin_`	`(installed the modules too..`
`12:13.07`	`DocScrutinizer`	`you could try the fso-console image for gsm-flashing`
`12:13.27`	PaulFert`	`DocScrutinizer: does it include X at all?`
`12:14.00`	`DocScrutinizer`	`hmm dunno, maybe you need to install a few packages`
`12:15.11`	`DocScrutinizer`	`no X`
`12:15.58`	`SpeedEvil`	`you haven't dropped the phone?`
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`12:17.08`	`rhkfin_`	`SpeedEvil: not more than usual..`
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`12:20.03`	`\|Leto\|`	`what can i do if i want to build with libsdl-x11 instead of libsdl-native in the toolchain?`
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`12:21.10`	`DocScrutinizer`	`If it's not via audio/speaker, the only components I see that could cause a noise are B1801/2/3 and the whole gang of 1uF C1801..1814`
`12:21.11`	`DocScrutinizer`	`plus LCM itself of course`
`12:23.16`	`DocScrutinizer`	`I don't however see any difference between distris/kernels wrt LCM-timing or -controlling`
`12:24.37`	`rhkfin_`	`I'd like to be able to measure the frequency. It can be above the hearing of some`
`12:25.35`	`DocScrutinizer`	`anyway, really time for a breakfast now. 36h late`
`12:25.53`	`rhkfin_`	`heh :)`
`12:27.13`	`rhkfin_`	`Hmm.. I have a tool (jaaa) to test the frequency.. Now I only hope my mic can hear it and I need a working kernel...`
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`12:27.40`	`rhkfin_`	`Any ideas why the stable modules & kernel from http://people.openmoko.org/andy/ won't start?`
`12:32.46`	`rhkfin_`	`Isn't it enough to download the modules-GTA02_stable.....tar.gz and untar it in root, then flash the newer kernel and start?`
`12:34.39`	`SpeedEvil`	`doesn't do anything?`
`12:35.01`	`rhkfin_`	`Doesn't start..`
`12:35.23`	`SpeedEvil`	`blank screen?`
`12:36.05`	`rhkfin_`	`returns to NOR`
`12:36.32`	`rhkfin_`	`(I always use NOR, my NAND tries to start from µSD that currently doesn't have an OS installed..)`
`12:37.08`	`rhkfin_`	`But if needed I can flash in anything (Kustomizer helps me to return go 'normal stage' :)`
`12:38.07`	`\|Leto\|`	`can someone enlighten me upon the differences between libsdl-x11 and libsdl-native?`
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`12:46.42`	`PBeck`	`ahoi`
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`12:47.27`	`rhkfin_`	`Nice, switched to QI - boot takes 1min20s!`
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`12:59.21`	`slaxxin`	`can u use guitar tuner to get the frequency?`
`12:59.50`	`slaxxin`	`it may not go that high`
`13:00.05`	`SpeedEvil`	`record a sound`
`13:00.13`	`SpeedEvil`	`load it into any FFT tool`
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`13:08.43`	`rhkfin_`	`Comparing it to my hifi test cd it's somewhere between 11-12KHz. It's not loud enough to be recorded by my headphone-mic (not the openmoko HF)`
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`13:46.42`	`rhkfin_`	`So can anyone point me to a new kernel that works witn 2008.12`
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`13:50.00`	PaulFert`	`rhkfin_: i'm afraid nobody was really interested to make that work.`
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`13:55.08`	`badcloud`	`yoze`
`13:57.57`	`badcloud`	`how's it going?`
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`14:04.36`	`rzr`	`for curious : http://digg.com/linux_unix/Video_demo_of_Freerunner_running_Android_Cupcake_Tutorial`
`14:06.48`	`CVirus`	`dugg`
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`14:17.57`	`\|Marco\|`	`is there anyonw here willing to test my little gprs gui to see if the last change works ?`
`14:18.39`	`\|Marco\|`	`http://marco.cakebox.net/?topic=dls&pkid=26`
`14:26.41`	`\|Marco\|`	`I can't get the gprs modem up and running now on my moko as of late, so i need someone willing to be a guinea pig :P`
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`14:29.20`	`sylar91`	`hi, I have a problem with shr. In the settings' app the "mass storage" usb option doesn't run correctly... anyone could help me please?`
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`14:36.17`	`Dave`	`badcloud, hvodan gÃ¥r det? :x`
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`14:40.57`	`muxe`	`hi, is there a simple way to get the qwerty button and illuzme keyboard in 2008.12 yet? All the instructions in the wiki seem to fail`
`14:43.17`	`rhkfin_`	`muxe: Kustomizer (maybe even the devel version). The first run installs those (with illume-theme)`
`14:43.56`	`muxe`	`thx, ill have a look at this`
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`14:46.05`	`rhkfin_`	`Ho, now my 2008.12 is grayscaled!`
`14:46.13`	`SpeedEvil`	`:)`
`14:49.27`	`rhkfin_`	`https://docs.openmoko.org/trac/ticket/2235 <- grayscaled trac discussion`
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`14:52.09`	`Defiant-_`	`Any recommendations for a Calendar-app?`
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`15:31.27`	`kalden`	`Hello, where do I have to put photos of my contacts to display them next to their phone number ? I'm using OM2008.12, Contacts`
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`15:45.44`	`kalden`	`Anyone ?`
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`15:46.55`	PaulFert`	`kalden: you do understand that OM2008.x is not supported and not developed anymore, don't you?`
`15:47.09`	`kalden`	`No I don't`
`15:47.50`	PaulFert`	`kalden: Ok, no you do :)`
`15:48.01`	PaulFert`	`s/no/now/`
`15:48.17`	`kalden`	`he he... Didn't see it on the wiki`
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`15:50.05`	`kalden`	`And it's gonna be replaced by what ?`
`15:51.21`	`kalden`	`OK, OM2009 I guess`
`15:53.44`	PaulFert`	`kalden: yes, but it will be entirely different distro.`
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`16:04.02`	PaulFert`	`kalden: it occures that i know too little about end-users (or don't care about enough) to give any meaningful advice. I've heard that shr-testing works good for many. I think mwester can give you a better advice about user-usable distro.`
`16:04.04`	`kalden`	PaulFert`: thanks for your advice
`16:04.04`	`mwester`	`Paul is right - shr-testing is probably the best one, going forward. Android also has some good stuff, if you happen to think Android is suitable.`
`16:04.05`	`mwester`	`I used to advocate qt extended, but that seems to have died, and it is undetermined if the community will pick that up and continue development. So really, SHR is the only distro remaining.`
`16:04.05`	`Dave`	`Hello Mister Wester`
`16:04.06`	`kalden`	`Ok, thx for putting me in the right direction.`
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`16:05.35`	PaulFert`	`rhkfin_: So, why don't you try to just flash SHR testing for your "terminator" testing (and also probably you'll finally change your mind)?`
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`16:36.46`	`PBeck`	`ahoi`
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`17:16.36`	`DocScrutinizer`	`mwester: well nokia bought troll. so maybe...`
`17:18.39`	`SpeedEvil`	`ponders the best case for sw development.`
`17:18.58`	`SpeedEvil`	`Apple buys OM, kills it, and the community pitches in and produces a polished phone stack.`
`17:19.17`	`SpeedEvil`	`Infuriated at apples tactics.`
`17:19.20`	`SpeedEvil`	`Or not.`
`17:19.37`	PaulFert`	`Best strategy ever :)`
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`17:33.11`	`\|Leto\|`	`:-D`
`17:33.17`	`\|Leto\|`	`cheers for that`
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`17:35.24`	`Na\|L`	`hello, i have problem with SD card`
`17:35.25`	`Na\|L`	`glamo-mci glamo-mci.0: Error after cmd: 0x4122`
`17:35.26`	`Na\|L`	`mmcblk0: error -84 sending read/write command`
`17:35.26`	`Na\|L`	`glamo-mci glamo-mci.0: Error after cmd: 0xc302`
`17:35.26`	`Na\|L`	`end_request: I/O error, dev mmcblk0, sector 52208`
`17:36.25`	`Na\|L`	`i read it's driver problem`
`17:36.51`	`Na\|L`	`but, i can't find kernel without this problems`
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`17:37.13`	PaulFert`	`Na\|L: and the latest kernel you tried is?`
`17:37.39`	`Na\|L`	`2.6.24 form 2008.12`
`17:37.56`	PaulFert`	`Na\|L: nobody bothers about it. Deprecated long time ago.`
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`17:38.04`	`Na\|L`	`?`
`17:38.13`	`\|Leto\|`	`lol`
`17:38.21`	`\|Leto\|`	`Na\|L, 2.6.24 is old`
`17:38.27`	`sylar91`	`Hi, How can I make the phone vibrating with dbus?`
`17:38.43`	`Na\|L`	`ok ok, i try 2.6.28 BUT!`
`17:39.02`	`Na\|L`	`i cant call it "stable" :)`
`17:39.51`	PaulFert`	`sylar91: you can explore the FSO dbus interface with mdbus -s or look at the web page with API specs.`
`17:40.02`	`Na\|L`	`now i try "andy" kernel, but it's 2.3MB = uboot can't boot it (i thing its kernel size problem)`
`17:40.14`	`Na\|L`	`im right?`
`17:40.25`	PaulFert`	`Na\|L: uboot can boot this kernel.`
`17:40.28`	`sylar91`	`PaulFert: thanks`
`17:40.54`	`Na\|L`	`http://people.openmoko.org/andy/`
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`17:41.06`	`Na\|L`	`i try this:`
`17:41.08`	`Na\|L`	`uImage-moredrivers-GTA02_stable-b749274fadec33a6.bin`
`17:41.15`	`Na\|L`	`and this uImage-moredrivers-GTA02_andy-tracking-15ca3dafb2662db4.bin`
`17:41.41`	PaulFert`	`Na\|L: if you're going to boot it from NAND with u-boot don't forget to tweak your u-boot env.`
`17:42.56`	`Na\|L`	`eh, can be, ok ill try`
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`19:48.40`	`Na\|L`	`hmm i change bootcmd to setenv bootcmd setenv bootargs \${bootargs_base} \${mtdparts}\; nand read.e 0x32000000 kernel 0x300000\; bootm 0x32000000 saveenv`
`19:49.46`	`Na\|L`	`2.3MB kernel boot fine, but when I reboot uboot again want boot kernel larger then 2MB`
`19:49.55`	`Dave`	`:o`
`19:55.02`	`Na\|L`	`funny, iye`
`19:56.00`	`*** join/#openmoko esa-petri (n=esa-petr@dsl-kpobrasgw1-ff71c100-40.dhcp.inet.fi)`
`19:56.10`	`Na\|L`	`removing battery revert to default uboot settings?`
`19:59.51`	`esa-petri`	`uboot is saved on nand mermory, and if you revorve battery it will do samething than rebooting`
`20:01.00`	`Na\|L`	`so, why is bootcmd changed back to default ?`
`20:01.21`	`*** join/#openmoko CVirus (n=Satan@41.196.51.204)`
`20:02.56`	`*** join/#openmoko greentux (n=lemke@p54BC63AE.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`20:06.32`	`*** part/#openmoko emsyr (n=emsyr@ppp079166067054.dsl.hol.gr)`
`20:06.41`	PaulFert`	`Na\|L: Ok, there're 2 uboots on FR.`
`20:06.51`	PaulFert`	`Na\|L: one in the NAND, one in the NOR.`
`20:07.02`	PaulFert`	`Na\|L: if you boot from NOR, the default env is always used.`
`20:07.16`	`Na\|L`	`hmm`
`20:07.20`	PaulFert`	`Na\|L: if you boot from NAND, you need to issue "saveenv" to save your custom environment.`
`20:07.47`	`Na\|L`	`some site/wiki about it? but, something more then just 10 lines of text :))`
`20:08.02`	`Na\|L`	`i use saveenv 3times`
`20:08.32`	`Na\|L`	`(last world in command, just wrong formating, when pasting)`
`20:09.46`	PaulFert`	`Na\|L: if you issued saveenv after booting NAND u-boot, it should save your tweaked env.`
`20:09.58`	PaulFert`	`Na\|L: wiki has info about booting and about u-boot.`
`20:10.35`	PaulFert`	`Na\|L: your saveenv has no effect, i guess.`
`20:10.55`	`Na\|L`	`this one?`
`20:10.56`	PaulFert`	`Na\|L: as it's not separated by a semicolon. (which should be without escaping!)`
`20:10.58`	`Na\|L`	`http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Uboot`
`20:11.46`	`*** join/#openmoko polymar_ (n=polymar@vpn.yellowpages.com)`
`20:11.48`	PaulFert`	`Na\|L: "setenv bootcmd setenv bootargs" doesn't make sense to me either`
`20:11.53`	`Na\|L`	`as i say, it;s on same line as setenv only in irc`
`20:12.27`	`Na\|L`	`hmm, that right :)`
`20:12.39`	PaulFert`	`Na\|L: so, have you got access to your uSD with a new kernel?`
`20:12.41`	`Na\|L`	`ok, i try remove second setenv :D`
`20:12.59`	`Na\|L`	`yes`
`20:13.01`	`mwester`	`bets Na\|L is in the NOR boot.`
`20:17.57`	`Na\|L`	`hmmm fok, i need new sdcard :)`
`20:21.08`	`esa-petri`	`what should do because I get kernel banic: not foun init. I am booting from uSD. I have 2 partions on it first root ext3 and another fat32 for usbdisk purpose .`
`20:21.30`	`*** join/#openmoko Zorkman (i=Zorkman@dD576909C.access.telenet.be)`
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`20:22.28`	PaulFert`	`esa-petri: and how do you boot?`
`20:28.30`	`*** join/#openmoko Slyon (n=lukas@p4FDB193A.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)`
`20:28.47`	`*** join/#openmoko azaghal (n=azaghal@91.148.112.40)`
`20:30.20`	`Na\|L`	`if boot via AUX+power i boot from NOR or NAND?`
`20:31.22`	PaulFert`	`Na\|L: if the SoC is powered on while AUX is pressed, you're booting to NOR of course.`
`20:32.41`	PaulFert`	`mwester: looks like you're right again.`
`20:32.49`	`Na\|L`	`hmm i change sdcard and problems are gone.....`
`20:34.02`	PaulFert`	`Na\|L: using .24 is asking for troubles anyway.`
`20:34.05`	`*** join/#openmoko bergelin (n=bergelin@c80-216-149-138.bredband.comhem.se)`
`20:34.20`	`Na\|L`	`no no, with latest andy kernel`
`20:34.36`	`Na\|L`	`some IO errors ....`
`20:34.58`	PaulFert`	`Na\|L: try to lower the SD frequency with a kernel parameter, it's needed for some cards.`
`20:35.08`	`Na\|L`	`now do dd in desktop PC,if card is bad`
`20:35.32`	`Na\|L`	PaulFert`: i read about it, i try it if "ddtest" go well
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`21:33.06`	`GNUtoo`	`hello, if I bitbake libgtkstylus would I have the right-click on SHR? and will it work on non-gtk applications?`
`21:33.37`	`ColdFyre`	`can't wait for the gta04`
`21:37.44`	`*** join/#openmoko Sharwin_F (n=Sharwin_@90.163.55.85)`
`21:41.42`	`*** join/#openmoko Inc_Vega (n=dpopov@91.195.136.14)`
`21:41.55`	`Inc_Vega`	`good`
`21:42.00`	`Inc_Vega`	`Hi all`
`21:43.28`	`Inc_Vega`	`wich modem version actual on GTA2 ?`
`21:44.13`	PaulFert`	`Inc_Vega: please rephrase, and i'll be able to answer`
`21:45.38`	`Inc_Vega`	`I mean, last image version GSM modem on GTA2 ?`
`21:46.53`	`mwester`	`moko-11`
`21:47.50`	PaulFert`	`Inc_Vega: and it's the same for GTA01, btw. Yes moko11 is the latest and the greatest.`
`21:47.51`	`Inc_Vega`	`Problem with noise and echo fixed today or ?`
`21:48.05`	PaulFert`	`Inc_Vega: the gsm buzz is fixed only by hardware rework.`
`21:48.25`	PaulFert`	`Inc_Vega: the echo is fixed by using a rootfs that issues appropriate commands at appropriate time.`
`21:48.57`	`Na\|L`	`hmm`
`21:48.58`	`Na\|L`	`saveenv`
`21:48.58`	`Na\|L`	`Saving Environment to NAND...`
`21:49.02`	`Na\|L`	`Erasing Nand...`
`21:49.04`	`Inc_Vega`	`can you send me last image for GTA2 ? I want to update.`
`21:49.10`	`Na\|L`	`so it's not NOR`
`21:49.15`	`Na\|L`	`no?`
`21:49.26`	`Na\|L`	`i boot to uboot boot menu via aux+power`
`21:49.27`	PaulFert`	`Inc_Vega: can you download it yourself from http://people.openmoko.org/joerg ?`
`21:49.42`	`Inc_Vega`	`good`
`21:49.48`	PaulFert`	`Na\|L: what is written on the top of LCD (near the u-boot version)?`
`21:50.32`	`Na\|L`	`nor`
`21:50.48`	`Na\|L`	`funny, really`
`21:50.52`	`*** join/#openmoko greentux (n=lemke@p54BC63AE.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`21:51.01`	PaulFert`	`Na\|L: NOT REALLY FUNNY`
`21:51.14`	PaulFert`	`Na\|L: the wiki has a page where booting is explained in detail.`
`21:51.15`	`mwester`	`waits to collect on the bet.`
`21:51.25`	PaulFert`	`mwester: you won, i've already told that`
`21:51.32`	`mwester`	`Na\|L owes me a beer. :D`
`21:51.33`	PaulFert`	`always looses`
`21:51.46`	`Na\|L`	PaulFert`: give me link, please, i try find uboot information, but good information
`21:51.48`	`mwester`	`Na\|L owes you _two_ beers.`
`21:52.19`	PaulFert`	`Na\|L: is http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Booting_the_Neo_FreeRunner ok?`
`21:53.10`	`Na\|L`	`hmm, cool site :)`
`21:53.47`	`Na\|L`	`ok nothing new`
`21:53.54`	PaulFert`	`If only beers could make me happy... I'd be an alcoholic!`
`21:54.01`	`mwester`	`hehehe!`
`21:54.07`	`*** join/#openmoko azaghal_ (n=azaghal@91.148.114.4)`
`21:54.11`	`mwester`	`What _would_ make you happy, then?`
`21:54.46`	`GNUtoo`	`the bitbake of libgtkstylus has finished...but how does it work...does it work only for GTK applications?`
`21:54.47`	PaulFert`	`If i knew that, i'd probably was already happy by now, because "everything's in your head, you know".`
`21:54.52`	`Na\|L`	`ok, again, because, this is make me sick more then i am already`
`21:55.18`	PaulFert`	`Na\|L: boot to NAND. For that follow the white rabbit^W^W wiki page.`
`21:58.16`	`Na\|L`	`hmm`
`21:58.27`	`Na\|L`	`this script explain more then wiki`
`21:58.28`	`Na\|L`	`http://pkg-fso.alioth.debian.org/freerunner/configure-uboot.sh`
`21:59.07`	`*** join/#openmoko azaghal__ (n=azaghal@host-105-104.kbcnet.co.yu)`
`21:59.39`	`*** join/#openmoko orzo (n=orzo@adsl-074-236-102-092.sip.bct.bellsouth.net)`
`21:59.56`	`orzo`	`is it possible to turn control-up into pg up using xmodmap?`
`22:00.59`	PaulFert`	`It's all in the mind, y'know`
`22:01.42`	`mwester`	`Depends on which color pill you take.`
`22:03.28`	PaulFert`	`Or which Quantum Physics interpretation you prefer`
`22:03.33`	`mwester`	`But to be far, far too serious for this channel, I can tell you from experience that it's a whole lot less in an individual's mind, when that individual has kids to raise and feed; suddenly happiness can be measured in very different ways).`
`22:04.36`	`Na\|L`	`onemore question`
`22:04.46`	`Na\|L`	`one time uboot say:`
`22:05.00`	`Na\|L`	`GTA02v6 # saveenv`
`22:05.00`	`Na\|L`	`Saving Environment to NAND...`
`22:05.01`	`Na\|L`	`Erasing Nand...GTA02v6`
`22:05.15`	`Na\|L`	`this time:`
`22:05.15`	`Na\|L`	`GTA02v6 # saveenv`
`22:05.16`	`Na\|L`	`Saving Environment to NAND...`
`22:05.16`	`Na\|L`	`Erasing Nand...Writing to Nand... done`
`22:05.16`	`Na\|L`	`GTA02v6 #`
`22:05.55`	`*** join/#openmoko mmp (n=mmp@158.195.169.244)`
`22:06.24`	`mmp`	`Hello; any idea why SHR unstable doesn't show any applications on desktop and doesn't allow me to even shutdown/suspend device?`
`22:06.50`	`Inc_Vega`	`wellcom to club )`
`22:06.52`	PaulFert`	`mmp: yes, it was just fixed`
`22:07.01`	`\|Marco\|`	`oh ?`
`22:07.35`	`mmp`	PaulFert`: so opkg upgrade should fix that?
`22:07.45`	PaulFert`	`e-wm-utils was using the old EFL_SRCREV`
`22:07.55`	`\|Marco\|`	PaulFert`: I'm just starting to build a package of an app I'm working on, it'd help a lot to actually see if the desktop icon etc is in the right place
`22:07.59`	PaulFert`	`mmp: not sure packages are ready`
`22:08.15`	`*** join/#openmoko freelock (n=john@logan.freelock.com)`
`22:08.16`	`mmp`	PaulFert`: sorry for asking that lame question, but I'm going to leave tomorrow and be offline for few days :)
`22:08.47`	PaulFert`	`mrmoku: ping. Please give your users a ETA of icon fixes in unstable :)`
`22:08.56`	`mmp`	`(with GPS at hand, if possible, so I'm trying to get some working distro :)`
`22:10.38`	`\|Marco\|`	`mmp, you can get back some of the icons by going to "Launcher" in the settings in the pulldown at the top of the screen and setting "Display Type" to "Slider"`
`22:10.46`	PaulFert`	`mmp: probably e-wm-utils from http://openmoko.opendevice.org/build/ will work for you`
`22:10.51`	`\|Marco\|`	`not pretty, but it works`
`22:11.45`	`*** join/#openmoko morricone (n=foobar@dslb-088-066-103-136.pools.arcor-ip.net)`
`22:11.56`	`\|Marco\|`	PaulFert`: looks like there are a few upgrades now, let's see if it helps :P
`22:12.03`	`\|Marco\|`	`downloading`
`22:12.40`	`*** join/#openmoko janrikard (n=janrikar@79.138.172.243.bredband.tre.se)`
`22:15.19`	`\|Marco\|`	`wah, a lot of packages`
`22:15.33`	`mmp`	`btw, did anyone have a look into /etc/resolv.conf after few reboots? :)`
`22:16.40`	`\|Marco\|`	`multiple copy's of the same 2 dns servers ?`
`22:16.44`	`mmp`	`yes`
`22:16.53`	`\|Marco\|`	`hehe, I've seen that a few times ;P`
`22:17.04`	`mmp`	`I guess count of lines divided by two actually counts number of reboots :-)`
`22:18.00`	`\|Marco\|`	`hehehe, YEah, I'd belive taht :)`
`22:19.20`	`Na\|L`	`aa, know i understand, fok, i shouldnt do anything, when i am sick, my brain is not working`
`22:19.31`	`*** join/#openmoko janrikard1 (n=janrikar@79.138.162.139.bredband.tre.se)`
`22:19.40`	`\|Marco\|`	`hm, let's see if a reboot gives me back zer desktop icons..`
`22:20.07`	`mmp`	`Na\|L: same goes for coding at 2am :-)`
`22:20.28`	`*** join/#openmoko JanC (n=janc@lugwv/member/JanC)`
`22:20.39`	`\|Marco\|`	`sigh still no dice :\|`
`22:20.53`	`mmp`	`:-/`
`22:22.18`	PaulFert`	`mmp: get the necessary package from http://openmoko.opendevice.org/build/ if you need it urgently, i think it should be there, just check the date.`
`22:22.40`	`mmp`	PaulFert`: I already started whole upgrade
`22:23.21`	`mmp`	`(and finished, as well....)`
`22:23.31`	`mmp`	`lots of python upgrades, but no e`
`22:24.24`	`mmp`	`weird, there is even to e-wm-utils package`
`22:25.19`	`mmp`	PaulFert`: so I guess it isn't there yet
`22:25.39`	`*** join/#openmoko Digital_Pioneer (n=digitalp@h17.200.255.206.cable.srcy.cablelynx.com)`
`22:26.31`	`*** join/#openmoko fredrin (n=workingn@186-212-231-201.fibertel.com.ar)`
`22:27.10`	`mmp`	`btw, any idea how quickly after GPS poweron should tangogps start showing current time?`
`22:27.58`	`\|Marco\|`	`that usually depends on the weather`
`22:28.25`	`*** join/#openmoko janrikard2 (n=janrikar@94.191.134.62.bredband.tre.se)`
`22:28.51`	`*** join/#openmoko alphabeat (n=nick@123-243-190-207.static.tpgi.com.au)`
`22:29.00`	PaulFert`	`Also on the time passed since last fix. If it's about 2 hours, ephemeris are still valid and so you'll even get a fix very soon.`
`22:30.16`	`mmp`	PaulFert`: I've not been able to get a fix with FR for ~two weeks, from some weird reason
`22:30.35`	`Digital_Pioneer`	`Ahh, another massive round of E updates. Have they fixed the icons in SHR-unstable?`
`22:31.00`	`mmp`	`and I flashed unstable just now, so there's no place where ephemeris/almanac could survive :)`
`22:31.25`	PaulFert`	`mmp: so you should be able to get a fix in some 1-2 minutes provided weather is not bad.`
`22:31.49`	PaulFert`	`mmp: also ensure you have system time properly set.`
`22:32.25`	`mmp`	PaulFert`: well, running most recent unstable SHR...
`22:32.28`	`Digital_Pioneer`	`No...`
`22:32.44`	`Digital_Pioneer`	`Why can't they fix those stpuid icons?? :(`
`22:32.53`	PaulFert`	`Digital_Pioneer: the reason was found and will reach users really soon`
`22:32.57`	`mmp`	`the problem is that I don't event get proper time (which should be displayed instanteously, because satellites broadcast it)`
`22:33.12`	`Digital_Pioneer`	PaulFert`: Ahh, good. :)
`22:33.17`	`mmp`	`Digital_Pioneer: they want to know how many users actually use SHR :)`
`22:33.25`	`Digital_Pioneer`	`Hahahah`
`22:33.39`	`Digital_Pioneer`	`Count the number of hate mails that come in, ehh?`
`22:33.46`	PaulFert`	`mmp: set it by hand or by ntp first.`
`22:34.01`	`mmp`	PaulFert`: the system time itself is correct
`22:34.02`	`Digital_Pioneer`	`So is the *#06# for IMEI supposed to work?`
`22:34.16`	PaulFert`	`mmp: so you should be able to get a fix`
`22:34.31`	`mmp`	PaulFert`: what bothers me is the time in TangoGPS, which should be derived from NMEA sentences (or whatever UBX sends)
`22:35.07`	`\|Marco\|`	PaulFert`: do you know what the reason for the desktop icons disappearance ?
`22:35.14`	`Digital_Pioneer`	PaulFert`: So do you know by any chance what the problem was, and if I can fix it myself without too much trouble? Or where to go to find out?
`22:35.22`	`\|Marco\|`	`:P`
`22:35.30`	`\|Marco\|`	`Digital_Pioneer: you ow me a soda :D`
`22:35.31`	`mmp`	PaulFert`: uhm, weird... got fix, but GPS time is still invalid
`22:36.17`	`mmp`	`(and also, my FR, which is sitting on the room's window, moves by speed 1.1km/h :)`
`22:36.29`	`Digital_Pioneer`	`\|Marco\|: Oh do I? :P`
`22:36.48`	`\|Marco\|`	`hehehe`
`22:37.21`	PaulFert`	`Digital_Pioneer: sure, the reason is that e-wm-utils were build for an old EFL_SRCREV.`
`22:37.28`	`*** join/#openmoko weirdedout (n=gonePost@114-198-35-20.VIC.netspace.net.au)`
`22:37.32`	`*** join/#openmoko CVirus (n=Satan@41.196.51.204)`
`22:37.40`	PaulFert`	`Digital_Pioneer: if you're building SHR from source, just pull the latest updates and rebuild.`
`22:38.29`	PaulFert`	`mmp: i guess until the receiver knows at least some approximate location of a sat, it can't get any time from it.`
`22:38.41`	`Digital_Pioneer`	`Nope, I have no toolchain for ARMv4t`
`22:39.33`	`*** join/#openmoko Fougner (n=alex@81-234-228-127-no32.tbcn.telia.com)`
`22:39.36`	`mmp`	PaulFert`: ahh, I thought that satellites broadcast time information directly...
`22:39.38`	`Fougner`	`Dave!!!!!`
`22:40.12`	`Fougner`	`open source is about to conquer the world!!!!! :D`
`22:40.22`	PaulFert`	`mmp: i think that receiver can't get it until he knows where the sat is. I might be wrong though.`
`22:40.25`	`Dave`	`Fougner! :D`
`22:40.30`	`Dave`	`Oh, is it?`
`22:40.34`	`Fougner`	`haha`
`22:40.36`	`Fougner`	`yeah`
`22:40.38`	`Dave`	`This is the first I've heard of this. :P`
`22:40.54`	`mmp`	PaulFert`: logical from some PoV -- it should be able to find out the timezone somehow as well...
`22:41.10`	`Fougner`	`we must work together to defeat the dark forces of bad software engineering companies!`
`22:41.14`	`mjr`	`If the receiver can get any signal from any sat whether it knows where it is or not, it gets the time.`
`22:41.43`	`Fougner`	`so, what are you guys talking about anyway?`
`22:41.51`	`Fougner`	`GPS I assume?`
`22:42.02`	PaulFert`	`mjr: how long does it take for a receiver if it doesn't know even almanac?`
`22:42.10`	`Dave`	`The usual`
`22:42.17`	`mjr`	`though if it doesn't know anything about the sats and its own position, it might have to scan a bit to find a sat that is visible`
`22:42.24`	`Dave`	`How much OM sucks, and how there is no chance to survive make our freerunners... yadda yadda`
`22:42.29`	`Fougner`	`I SCAN SATS! :D`
`22:42.35`	`*** join/#openmoko khorben_ (n=dont@port-83-236-217-161.static.qsc.de)`
`22:42.39`	`*** join/#openmoko azaghal_ (n=azaghal@91.148.112.228)`
`22:42.42`	`*** join/#openmoko Slyon (n=lukas@p4FDB193A.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)`
`22:42.48`	`mmontour`	`About 3 minutes for the GTA01 GPS, dunno about the Freerunner`
`22:43.00`	`Fougner`	`I can measure the time for you!`
`22:43.04`	`Fougner`	`just tell me what to do`
`22:43.05`	`Dave`	`Mmontour!`
`22:43.10`	`Fougner`	`~_~`
`22:43.22`	`apt`	`STOP DOING THAT!`
`22:43.22`	`mmontour`	`Dave!`
`22:43.22`	`Dave`	`Yes!`
`22:43.23`	`Digital_Pioneer`	`So does anyone know why my phone is obsessed with the EST time zone? I can't get it to change.`
`22:43.31`	`Dave`	`haha`
`22:43.34`	`Dave`	`apt, you're lagged.`
`22:43.37`	`*** join/#openmoko DorX (n=freak@p5B3B1977.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`22:43.38`	`Dave`	`poor apt is slow`
`22:43.40`	`Dave`	`how cute`
`22:43.40`	`Fougner`	`apt: a little lazy today, are we?`
`22:43.42`	`apt`	`Fougner: okay`
`22:43.46`	`Dave`	`pets apt`
`22:44.03`	`Fougner`	`apt get Fougner a working mp3-player for the FR`
`22:44.04`	`apt`	`ACTION fetches Fougner a working mp3-player for the FR`
`22:44.13`	`Fougner`	`FOSS, that is`
`22:44.25`	`Na\|L`	`mp3?`
`22:44.43`	`Fougner`	`Na\|L, yes, have you heard of it yet? :)`
`22:44.49`	`Dave`	`FOSS? here? pfft :p`
`22:45.08`	`Fougner`	`I've heard it's a evil audio format developed and patented by the dark f0rc3s`
`22:45.45`	PaulFert`	`Dave: i think i know`
`22:45.51`	`Fougner`	`hmm, is it just me or has the standby time increased with the latest updates in the software?`
`22:46.01`	PaulFert`	`Dave: was meant for Pioneer :)`
`22:46.16`	`Mononoke`	`I wonder hows the progress with GTA03`
`22:46.29`	`Dave`	`What progress?`
`22:46.36`	`Dave`	`You mean the backwards development that happens here?`
`22:46.48`	`*** join/#openmoko Digital_Pioneer (n=digitalp@h17.200.255.206.cable.srcy.cablelynx.com)`
`22:46.58`	`Mononoke`	`just if there will be any I think`
`22:47.01`	PaulFert`	`Digital_Pioneer: i think i know the trick with the timezone`
`22:47.11`	`*** join/#openmoko nezza-_- (i=troth@unixforge.de)`
`22:47.11`	`Digital_Pioneer`	PaulFert`: Please tell!
`22:47.14`	`fredrin`	`any pictures of the current GTA03 design?`
`22:47.18`	PaulFert`	`Digital_Pioneer: have you disabled automatic update in the frameworkd.conf?`
`22:48.00`	`Digital_Pioneer`	PaulFert`: I haven't touched frameworkd.conf
`22:48.05`	`Fougner`	`ehm, do any of you guys happen to be friend with SVN?`
`22:48.40`	PaulFert`	`Digital_Pioneer: then most probably frameworkd changes your timezone, it's the default.`
`22:48.41`	`Fougner`	`Digital_Pioneer, you shouldn't have to 'touch' framework.d, it should already be there ;)`
`22:48.53`	PaulFert`	`Fougner: no, unless you're using git-svn ;)`
`22:48.57`	`Digital_Pioneer`	`Fougner: Hahah`
`22:48.58`	`ColdFyre`	`i don't understand, if i switch to qi for my gta02, i can't use dfu-util anymore?`
`22:49.06`	`Fougner`	`I'm funny :D`
`22:49.12`	`Digital_Pioneer`	`:)`
`22:49.20`	`Digital_Pioneer`	PaulFert`: So what do I change?...
`22:49.21`	PaulFert`	`ColdFyre: you can, but after booting to NOR u-boot, isn't it obvious?!`
`22:49.25`	`Fougner`	`ColdFyre, nope, what I've heard, it doesn't have the DFU things`
`22:49.33`	`Digital_Pioneer`	`I don't see anything in it that looks like a timezone...`
`22:49.44`	PaulFert`	`Digital_Pioneer: remove GSM from the ZoneSources in [otimed] section`
`22:49.46`	`Fougner`	PaulFert`, I assume you're right ^^
`22:49.58`	`Fougner`	PaulFert`, git-svn?
`22:50.01`	`Digital_Pioneer`	PaulFert`: There is no otimed section...
`22:50.11`	PaulFert`	`Fougner: yes, it's the only sane way to use svn nowadays ;)`
`22:50.40`	`Fougner`	`for everyone?`
`22:51.06`	PaulFert`	`Digital_Pioneer: http://pastebin.com/m611ab620 don't forget to restart frameworkd after that`
`22:52.02`	`Fougner`	`oh, git makes use of SHA1 for making up the 'reversions', right?`
`22:52.18`	PaulFert`	`Fougner: no, really, git is so much better than SVN, no wonder almost all free software projects switched to it (or to Mercurial).`
`22:52.18`	`Fougner`	`uhm, *versions`
`22:53.04`	`Fougner`	PaulFert`, look, I'm really new to scm, please explain why :)
`22:53.06`	PaulFert`	`Fougner: so, if one _has_ to use svn, git-svn will make the process more comfortable, giving some of the git strength.`
`22:53.09`	`Digital_Pioneer`	PaulFert`: It still thinks I'm EST...
`22:53.09`	`*** join/#openmoko tg (i=tg@x-net.hu)`
`22:53.25`	PaulFert`	`Digital_Pioneer: no wonder, have you changed your /etc/timezone?`
`22:53.38`	PaulFert`	`Digital_Pioneer: after you prohibited frameworkd to mess with it?`
`22:53.39`	`Fougner`	PaulFert`, I'm reading about it now, please tell me about your personal thoughts..
`22:53.51`	`Digital_Pioneer`	PaulFert`: lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 34 Feb 28 02:13 /etc/timezone -> /usr/share/zoneinfo/Canada/Central
`22:54.48`	PaulFert`	`Fougner: There was plenty of articles written about why DVCS's are better than traditional centralised VCS's, so i don't think i can say something more. Just look at the statistics.`
`22:54.54`	`Digital_Pioneer`	`As you can see, it's been set correctly since February. :P`
`22:55.11`	PaulFert`	`Digital_Pioneer: most likely the file was overwritten. Check the contents.`
`22:55.17`	`Fougner`	PaulFert`, okay, well as I said I don't know much about it, but I have to stick with the facts then ;P
`22:55.46`	`Dave`	`F-F-F-F-F-F-FOUGNER!`
`22:55.52`	`Fougner`	`Dave :D`
`22:56.07`	`Digital_Pioneer`	PaulFert`: It's a lovely blob of binary.
`22:56.12`	PaulFert`	`Fougner: the facts are: almost any new free software project uses DVCS, usually git or Mercurial. And even SVN dev recommends that (there was some interesting blog post).`
`22:56.54`	`Fougner`	`so, let's see if I got this right`
`22:57.06`	`*** join/#openmoko booxter (n=booxter@night02.sml.by)`
`22:57.22`	`Digital_Pioneer`	PaulFert`: Ahh, relinked it to Chicago instead of Central and it WORKS!! :D Thank you very much!
`22:57.26`	`Fougner`	`SVN has a central server, with 'clients' (devs) connecting to it. it merges the progress`
`22:57.27`	PaulFert`	`Digital_Pioneer: Yes, but... Try to reinstall the package.`
`22:57.46`	`Fougner`	`and Git, is like bittorrent then?`
`22:57.52`	PaulFert`	`Digital_Pioneer: ok, glad it works for you :)`
`22:58.09`	PaulFert`	`Fougner: no, every dev has it's own repository, keeping all content and history. Completely independent.`
`22:58.17`	PaulFert`	`s/it's/his/`
`22:58.37`	`Fougner`	`uhm`
`22:58.44`	`Fougner`	`:)`
`22:58.51`	`Fougner`	`oH!`
`22:59.24`	`Fougner`	`Linus is third most contributing developer, by commits! then is MUST be good :D`
`22:59.34`	PaulFert`	`Digital_Pioneer: can you add the unbreaking timezone info to some shr wiki or post to the mailing list for the other users to benefit?`
`22:59.58`	`Fougner`	`s/then is/then it`
`23:00.04`	`Fougner`	`humph.`
`23:00.06`	`Fougner`	`apt!`
`23:00.09`	`Fougner`	`do as I please!`
`23:00.10`	`Digital_Pioneer`	PaulFert`: Does SHR keep a separate wiki from wiki.openmoko.org?
`23:00.21`	`Fougner`	`Digital_Pioneer, check out shr-project.org`
`23:00.47`	`*** join/#openmoko weirdedout (n=gonePost@220-253-53-72.VIC.netspace.net.au)`
`23:00.57`	PaulFert`	`Digital_Pioneer: the thing is: when i encountered it, i was a bit surprised, but didn't care. After i started to care, i quickly checked the sources and found the reason. Asked the dev to make an option to disable it.`
`23:01.50`	`Digital_Pioneer`	`So frameworkd was ignoring /etc/timezone?`
`23:02.02`	PaulFert`	`Fougner: you should have supplied the trailing slash ;)`
`23:02.29`	PaulFert`	`Digital_Pioneer: no, it was overwriting it taking the first timezone for the country your cell operator is supposed to be in.`
`23:02.37`	`Fougner`	PaulFert`, oh sorry :O
`23:02.57`	`Digital_Pioneer`	`Ahh.`
`23:02.58`	`Fougner`	PaulFert`, for the moment I'm starting out with SVN + trac
`23:03.09`	`Fougner`	`is there an alternative for that?`
`23:03.12`	`Digital_Pioneer`	`So why can't it just pull the time from the network like most phoens?`
`23:03.13`	`Digital_Pioneer`	`*phones`
`23:03.34`	PaulFert`	`Fougner: i strongly advice you to study DVCS instead. If you feel git is too hard, go Mercurial (and it has a very nice Trac plugin).`
`23:04.21`	`Fougner`	`for a one man project, is version control good ?`
`23:04.52`	PaulFert`	`Digital_Pioneer: (time from network) Not all networks give that. Some networks give the timezone, btw, but not in a useful way (only difference with GMT, but it's obviously not enough, because of local DST rules etc).`
`23:04.53`	`Fougner`	`maybe it's just me, but I think it's more structured that way`
`23:05.20`	PaulFert`	`Fougner: Yes, even for a one man project it's better to use a VCS, and modern DVCS will perfectly fit as well.`
`23:06.09`	`Digital_Pioneer`	PaulFert`: True, I'm sure, but I have yet to see a cell phone here in America that doesn't pull time from the network. I'm surprised the FR can't do it.
`23:06.36`	`Digital_Pioneer`	`(That's certainly not to say there AREN'T phones here that won't pull time from the network, but I've not heard of it)`
`23:07.37`	`Digital_Pioneer`	`OK, so how do you make a new page on the SHR wiki?`
`23:07.59`	`Dave`	`Digital_Fougner`
`23:08.00`	`Fougner`	`Digital_Pioneer, ask Bill Gates :D`
`23:08.07`	`Fougner`	`Digital_Dave!`
`23:08.22`	`Fougner`	`apt shoot Dave`
`23:08.23`	`apt`	`ACTION shoots Dave in the foot with a quantum singularity weapon!`
`23:08.34`	`Digital_Pioneer`	`Digital_Digits`
`23:08.35`	PaulFert`	`Digital_Pioneer: is it done in any standardised way?`
`23:08.49`	`Digital_Pioneer`	`No idea...`
`23:09.09`	`DocScrutinizer`	`nope`
`23:09.14`	`Fougner`	`oh, DocScrutinizer`
`23:09.14`	`Fougner`	`:D`
`23:09.18`	`Fougner`	`good evening!`
`23:09.26`	`DocScrutinizer`	`moo`
`23:09.31`	`Fougner`	`mooko`
`23:09.38`	`Fougner`	`moocow :D`
`23:09.44`	`Fougner`	`openmoocow!`
`23:10.04`	`Fougner`	`apt-get install moocow`
`23:12.32`	`fredrin`	`I need to do this to get gprs working on shr-testing? http://shr-project.org/trac/wiki/Tweaks#EnableGPRS`
`23:14.32`	`Fougner`	`gah`
`23:14.40`	PaulFert`	`For guys waiting for e-wm-utils update: probably it will appear at openmoko.opendevice.org and you can check the current status at http://tinderbox.openembedded.net/builders/openmoko.opendevice.org/`
`23:15.25`	`Fougner`	`my sound is ungood`
`23:15.58`	`slaxxin`	`so my 03072009 shr doesnt have icons?`
`23:15.59`	`Fougner`	`I hear nothing but crackling`
`23:16.10`	`Fougner`	`slaxxin, congratulations :D`
`23:16.22`	`slaxxin`	`its still booting`
`23:16.59`	`Dave`	`slaxin!`
`23:17.05`	`Dave`	`Oh, and hello again Joerg :)`
`23:17.05`	`Fougner`	`slaxxin, haven't they moved the 'unstable' branch to 'testing', just a few days ago?`
`23:17.07`	`slaxxin`	`SuperDave`
`23:17.14`	`Dave`	`Yes!`
`23:17.32`	`slaxxin`	`o i got todays unstable booting`
`23:17.51`	`slaxxin`	`so i can play media on me trip`
`23:18.14`	`slaxxin`	`firefox?`
`23:19.42`	PaulFert`	`"And I'll say it again, I need a brand new friend"`
`23:19.47`	`fredrin`	`what's fso-settings good for? Why do I need it for gprs?`
`23:21.32`	PaulFert`	`Ok, see you guys. 'night.`
`23:21.50`	`Digital_Pioneer`	PaulFert`: OK, I made this: http://shr.bearstech.com/trac/wiki/Timezone
`23:21.57`	`*** join/#openmoko m0nt0 (n=monto@151.57.204.88)`
`23:22.02`	`Digital_Pioneer`	`First wiki page I ever made, so I'm sure there's something wrong with it... :P`
`23:22.39`	`esa-petri`	`is this right way to untar sudo tar -xvvzf '/home/esa-petri/OpenMoko/fyp/fyp_3.01_GTA02.tar.gz' -v -k`
`23:22.59`	`Fougner`	`Digital_Pioneer, that's why all users have the rights to change your work, doin' it even better =)`
`23:23.09`	`Digital_Pioneer`	`Fougner: Yup. :)`
`23:23.11`	`Fougner`	`also, that's real development`
`23:23.16`	`Fougner`	`not competition`
`23:23.27`	`*** join/#openmoko toggles (n=tommy@pool-70-20-79-172.pitbpa.east.verizon.net)`
`23:23.44`	`Fougner`	`and that's why linux is quite stable =)`
`23:24.06`	`Fougner`	`hehe`
`23:24.21`	`fredrin`	`esa-petri: don't know what hte -k is about, but looks right, maybe -p to preserve permissions`
`23:24.22`	`Fougner`	`so, what are you guys up to?`
`23:24.23`	`Fougner`	`Dave? :D`
`23:24.39`	`toggles`	`Dave: !!`
`23:24.53`	`Fougner`	`toggles, :D`
`23:25.10`	`toggles`	`Fougner: w00t!!`
`23:25.13`	`Sharwin_F`	`Dave was finally uninstalled from the system :D`
`23:25.23`	`slaxxin`	`opkg install e-wm-utils`
`23:25.27`	`toggles`	`emerge Dave`
`23:25.59`	`Fougner`	`toggles, what are you doin? :D`
`23:26.03`	`toggles`	`/etc/init.d/Dave restart`
`23:26.35`	`toggles`	`Fougner: hating life... spend 6 hrs fighting with javas serialising of maps..`
`23:26.37`	`Sharwin_F`	`ifup Dave`
`23:26.38`	`slaxxin`	`D A V EY`
`23:26.39`	`Digital_Pioneer`	`<PROTECTED>`
`23:26.41`	`toggles`	`yay for my wasted day!!`
`23:27.42`	`fredrin`	`ok, how can I test gprs settings?`
`23:27.43`	`Fougner`	`toggles, you seem to be happy =)`
`23:28.09`	`toggles`	`Fougner: yeah, finally figured it all out and we are back on track for delivery`
`23:29.06`	`Fougner`	`oh,`
`23:29.06`	`slaxxin`	`iconage yea`
`23:29.11`	`Fougner`	`you're a software engineer? :P`
`23:29.21`	`slaxxin`	`GQview?`
`23:29.46`	`slaxxin`	`ok thats what i needed`
`23:30.11`	`slaxxin`	`firefox XMMS`
`23:30.27`	`slaxxin`	`Audacity`
`23:30.35`	`toggles`	`Fougner: haha, engineer.. haha.. i like to say 'prefesional' because i get paid ;-)`
`23:31.33`	`Fougner`	`toggles, you have to explain that more in detail I think`
`23:31.44`	`Fougner`	`engineers do get paid, don't they?`
`23:31.58`	`Sharwin_F`	`Will I be able to fly with new E environment? xD`
`23:32.17`	`Fougner`	`Sharwin_F, yes, but take a cup of coffee before you do =)`
`23:32.38`	`toggles`	`yeah, i guess engineering to me is more like building bridges ;-)`
`23:32.43`	`Sharwin_F`	`Fougner, hmm good to know... opkg install cup-of-coffe?`
`23:33.05`	`Fougner`	`Sharwin_F, something like that yeah =)`
`23:33.13`	`*** join/#openmoko cga (n=cga@94.36.110.25)`
`23:33.46`	`*** join/#openmoko alphabeat (n=nick@123-243-190-207.static.tpgi.com.au)`
`23:33.58`	`ColdFyre`	`does anyone know if there are any android images with a somewhat more stable gsm(as opposed to beta 3)`
`23:34.10`	`Fougner`	`toggles, today they probably do much of that with computers and lots of advanced programming and simulation, don't you think?`
`23:34.32`	`Fougner`	`ColdFyre, beta 3 from koolu is the last known 'stable' to me`
`23:35.03`	`ColdFyre`	`i don't mind unstable releases`
`23:35.23`	`toggles`	`Fougner: true, i just think engineering involves steel and concrete...`
`23:36.16`	`toggles`	`Fougner: well, if i think about it my work keeps iron ore trains moving around the world, so i guess that pretty close to steel, the rails are steel anyway ;-)`
`23:36.56`	`Fougner`	`toggles, maybe, but there are a lot of people out there, put out to be 'software engineers'`
`23:37.19`	`*** join/#openmoko khorben (n=dont@port-83-236-217-161.static.qsc.de)`
`23:38.00`	`Fougner`	`ColdFyre, sorry, I've tried out koolu's releases, nothing else`
`23:38.26`	`Fougner`	`toggles, simply, you're a programmer?`
`23:38.42`	`*** join/#openmoko alx} (n=alx}--@83-155-196-78.rev.libertysurf.net)`
`23:39.19`	`toggles`	`Fougner: yeah, networking/communications hacker`
`23:39.33`	`Fougner`	`cool`
`23:39.48`	`Fougner`	`I guess you've done some nice things along the way then?`
`23:40.00`	`toggles`	`Fougner: when the software works ;-)`
`23:40.04`	`Fougner`	`haha`
`23:40.21`	`toggles`	`yeah, seen some pretty remote/neat places along the way too, it's been a cool ride so far`
`23:40.48`	`Fougner`	`oh, you're on the ore train? :P`
`23:40.59`	`Fougner`	`well then the software better work!`
`23:42.00`	`toggles`	`Fougner: yeah, that was some fun a while back, we removed all the signals form the track and bought all the info into the cab and hooked the brakes up to the software`
`23:42.43`	`toggles`	`200 miles into the desert we hopped on the train and turned the system on for the first time, train was over 2km long full of iron ore, if the software applied the brakes wrong the train would oscillate and rip apart`
`23:42.56`	`toggles`	`made for a very interesting ride to the coast a 3am in the morning ;-)`
`23:43.13`	`Fougner`	`oh god.`
`23:43.26`	`Fougner`	`I guess this is done in the US?`
`23:43.41`	`toggles`	`this was hamersly iron in australia`
`23:45.10`	`*** join/#openmoko khorben (n=dont@port-83-236-217-161.static.qsc.de)`
`23:45.12`	`Fougner`	`hah`
`23:45.12`	`toggles`	`haha there is you tube http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Sy9pK2J24U`
`23:45.29`	`amarsh04`	`waves from Adelaide`
`23:45.59`	`toggles`	`waves to amarsh04`
`23:47.35`	`*** join/#openmoko hiciu (n=hiciu@host-91-200-27-218.leon.com.pl)`
`23:47.40`	`amarsh04`	`I remember the television coverage when they set the world's longest train record`
`23:48.25`	`toggles`	`yeah, bhp, now they are all one, the trains are mosters out there, it was a fun couple of years working on that`
`23:49.40`	`toggles`	`well, it's time for me to try and find a beer, have fun people, i'll think of you while i enjoy my stubby...`
`23:49.44`	`toggles`	`waves night`
`23:49.47`	`amarsh04`	`longest passenger train I've been on was 665 metres long`
`23:49.54`	`amarsh04`	`bfn toggles`
`23:51.46`	`*** join/#openmoko alx} (n=alx}--@83-155-196-78.rev.libertysurf.net)`
`23:54.05`	`\|Marco\|`	`sigh`
`23:54.11`	`\|Marco\|`	`misses a working desktop :/`
`23:58.06`	`amarsh04`	`uses kde 3.5.10 on his 11 year old pc`
`23:58.40`	`*** join/#openmoko alphabeat1 (n=nick@123-243-190-207.static.tpgi.com.au)`
`23:59.36`	`esa-petri`	`howdo you do those *name stuf (new to irc)`
`23:59.47`	`esa-petri`	`things`

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