| 00:00.12 | *** join/#openmoko peepsalot (n=peeps@cpe-70-116-14-46.austin.res.rr.com) |
| 00:02.22 | rooly | 's great |
| 00:03.15 | orzo | what's FLUID ? |
| 00:04.19 | rooly | something that should not be shared between opposite genders unless offspring are wanted |
| 00:05.14 | rooly | and so i leave |
| 00:05.44 | orzo | its something to do with flashing the gsm modme |
| 00:07.12 | slaxxin | would be a bad time for a power outage |
| 00:08.47 | orzo | well i'll flash from a laptop |
| 00:17.43 | Wonka | just have enough charge in the battery... |
| 00:18.28 | orzo | i'm going to flash shr first |
| 00:18.34 | orzo | because i dont have fluid |
| 00:18.48 | orzo | i unfortunatley downlaoded the gta02 image for shr earlier |
| 00:18.53 | orzo | instead of gta01 |
| 00:20.33 | orzo | its a 64 bit debian laptop |
| 00:20.40 | orzo | i guess that'll probably be an issue |
| 00:23.40 | orzo | teh Flashing page looks freerunner specific now |
| 00:23.46 | orzo | you guys really hate gta01 users eh |
| 00:24.49 | mwester | Just wait until the gta03 is out and support for the gta02 ends up like the gta01. |
| 00:26.35 | marius_ | i had a greenphone and felt even crappyer support... |
| 00:27.40 | marius_ | not the same... but suddenly unsupported... |
| 00:33.37 | ronny | mwester: sounds nasty |
| 00:38.12 | orzo | well |
| 00:38.17 | orzo | its got about 50% of battery |
| 00:38.24 | orzo | is that ok for flashing kernel and rootfs? |
| 00:41.31 | orzo | hm |
| 00:41.34 | orzo | i have it in uboot now |
| 00:41.42 | orzo | is it charging the battery or not? |
| 00:41.46 | orzo | does uboot do that? |
| 00:43.15 | mwester | yes |
| 00:43.37 | *** join/#openmoko valos[fr] (n=valos@mar92-6-82-227-150-198.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 00:44.44 | orzo | "No DFU capable USB device found |
| 00:44.45 | orzo | " |
| 00:46.14 | *** join/#openmoko batti (n=batti@p5B148E24.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 00:48.18 | slaxxin | do it again |
| 00:49.22 | *** join/#openmoko Amorphous (i=jan@unaffiliated/amorphous) |
| 00:49.56 | orzo | i needed root |
| 00:50.07 | orzo | do i need to keep hitting aux to keep it alive while its flashing? |
| 00:50.25 | orzo | i always do that when i'm flashing because i'm paranoid it will time out |
| 00:50.26 | *** join/#openmoko jas4711 (n=jas@c80-216-27-189.bredband.comhem.se) |
| 00:51.20 | slaxxin | well if its charged 50 % then its not an issue |
| 00:51.46 | dent | orzo: afaik when flashing is in progres that's not needed |
| 00:51.56 | slaxxin | a newer u-boot proly would be good |
| 00:52.10 | orzo | well i've never flashed u-boot |
| 00:52.19 | *** join/#openmoko dwb (n=david@72-11-234-10.static-ip.telepacific.net) |
| 00:52.23 | orzo | and theres always warnings about how it could lead to a paper weight with gta01 |
| 00:52.44 | orzo | so if the current u-boot works, flashing seems an unjustifiable risk |
| 00:53.46 | slaxxin | did u buy it new? |
| 00:53.53 | orzo | ya |
| 00:54.18 | dent | lamer Q: what's "jbt6k74" pls? |
| 00:54.30 | slaxxin | was it u that said u have no wall charger? |
| 00:55.20 | orzo | slaxxin: yes |
| 00:55.35 | orzo | gta01 did not come with a wall charger |
| 00:55.59 | dent | ok, google helped, ignore my question :) |
| 00:57.13 | *** join/#openmoko mrgarlic (n=mrgarlic@67.108.207.162) |
| 00:58.11 | *** join/#openmoko playya__ (n=playya@g228066031.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 00:59.03 | *** join/#openmoko cga (n=cga@94.36.88.11) |
| 01:07.18 | orzo | it failed to flash rootfs |
| 01:07.26 | orzo | it got most of the way through and then failed with error -62 |
| 01:07.29 | orzo | damn it |
| 01:11.36 | *** join/#openmoko dotmef (n=mef@mx1.bitwise.org) |
| 01:11.37 | *** part/#openmoko dotmef (n=mef@mx1.bitwise.org) |
| 01:18.20 | *** join/#openmoko Toaster` (n=toaster@bas10-kitchener06-1176213698.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 01:20.04 | *** join/#openmoko badcloud (n=bla@ti400720a342-0283.bb.online.no) |
| 01:20.18 | badcloud | apt, tell a joke |
| 01:20.37 | badcloud | nuts |
| 01:21.51 | badcloud | so when the crap is 03 gonna come out? :> |
| 01:22.33 | marius_ | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/GTA03 |
| 01:22.52 | *** join/#openmoko weihsiu (n=walter@220-134-133-103.HINET-IP.hinet.net) |
| 01:23.58 | badcloud | doesn't really even speculate on a release date, does it? |
| 01:26.53 | mwester | why do we want the gta03 to come out, when the 02 doesn't even work yet!? |
| 01:27.08 | badcloud | good point |
| 01:27.13 | mwester | Om did that once already, with the 01 -- let's not encourage them! |
| 01:27.14 | Toaster` | mwester: it's shiny? |
| 01:27.20 | mwester | Oooooh |
| 01:27.37 | mwester | speaking of shiny, anyone seen the beagleboard? |
| 01:27.45 | mwester | now *thats* cool embedded tech. |
| 01:27.47 | badcloud | what's still iffy under debian, for example? |
| 01:27.59 | hozer | hrrm... where the heck do I get obexftpd |
| 01:28.07 | badcloud | oh, bb looks a'good... |
| 01:28.12 | hozer | waits for the "install debian" answer |
| 01:28.22 | badcloud | aside from not having an ethernet card |
| 01:29.00 | mwester | has a couple of ethernet dongles. no problem. |
| 01:29.10 | badcloud | cool fix |
| 01:29.28 | badcloud | might get one... |
| 01:29.31 | Toaster` | Anyone available to help me get into some code hacking? I have the toolchain setup (I believe) but I'm not sure where to get the 2008.testing illume files in the svn? |
| 01:29.52 | mwester | what I *don't* have is an embedded device that can drive a standard flat panel display :) |
| 01:31.06 | badcloud | but really, what's not fully functional with the 02 at this point? |
| 01:31.17 | Toaster` | badcloud: reliable wifi |
| 01:31.25 | hozer | mwester: the beagleboard might be my next desktop |
| 01:31.30 | orzo | damn |
| 01:31.34 | badcloud | gps still an issue? |
| 01:31.35 | orzo | i get download error again |
| 01:31.43 | orzo | error -62 |
| 01:31.44 | badcloud | hozer, me too |
| 01:31.49 | marius_ | badcloud: yeah |
| 01:31.49 | orzo | this time from a 32 bit linux |
| 01:32.08 | badcloud | crap |
| 01:32.20 | Toaster` | badcloud: gps works fine on my end. I do my OSM work with my FR |
| 01:32.23 | badcloud | 03 will not be for a looooong time then |
| 01:33.37 | Toaster` | are all the 2008 files loaded in git or svn? |
| 01:35.09 | badcloud | is the wifi more a software thing or hardw? |
| 01:36.08 | Toaster` | badcloud: my understanding is that it's a sw thing. I've had it connect to open APs, but only to an encrypted AP once. |
| 01:36.27 | Toaster` | and tha was back under 2007.2 |
| 01:36.57 | badcloud | hmmm |
| 01:37.55 | badcloud | oh, well |
| 01:38.03 | Toaster` | Is anyone able to help me and point out to this clueless soul where I might find the 2008-testing illume sources? |
| 01:41.45 | *** join/#openmoko DieMumie1 (n=DieMumie@W3231.w.pppool.de) |
| 01:45.12 | *** join/#openmoko dotmef (n=mef@mx1.bitwise.org) |
| 01:50.01 | *** join/#openmoko rmoravcik (n=rmoravci@ip-89-102-255-171.karneval.cz) |
| 01:57.37 | *** part/#openmoko slchen (n=slchen@122-116-241-177.HINET-IP.hinet.net) |
| 01:58.13 | orzo | ok |
| 01:58.19 | orzo | this has consumed my day |
| 01:58.22 | orzo | heh |
| 01:58.44 | orzo | i've tried three times to flash shr-image-om-gta01.jffs2 |
| 01:58.59 | orzo | it takes forever, getting most of the way through and then fails with download error -62 |
| 01:59.18 | Weiss | Toaster`: svn.enlightenment.org (the Bitbake configuration tells it which revision to use) |
| 01:59.27 | orzo | try 1: using 64-bit debian dfu-util |
| 01:59.33 | orzo | try 2: using 32-bit debian dfu-util |
| 01:59.48 | Toaster` | Weiss: Thanks |
| 01:59.52 | orzo | try 3: using dfu-util binary downloaded from openmoko wiki in 32 bit debian |
| 02:00.16 | orzo | is there somethign wrong with my shr-image-om-gta01.jffs2 file? |
| 02:00.39 | Weiss | Toaster`: you have just the toolchain, or the full bitbake environment? |
| 02:00.46 | orzo | it would be nice if there was an md5 available |
| 02:02.24 | orzo | is shr-image-om-gta01.jffs2 equivelent to openmoko-shr-image-glibc-ipk--20081208-om-gta01.rootfs.jffs2 |
| 02:02.30 | orzo | because i'm downloading the later now |
| 02:03.59 | orzo | can anybody help |
| 02:04.11 | *** join/#openmoko Staticwave_Ace (n=Ace@d57-135-60.home.cgocable.net) |
| 02:04.20 | orzo | shoudl i use shr-lite instead? |
| 02:05.26 | *** part/#openmoko rmoravcik (n=rmoravci@ip-89-102-255-171.karneval.cz) |
| 02:05.57 | *** join/#openmoko azaghal_ (n=azaghal@91.148.112.4) |
| 02:06.06 | *** join/#openmoko merriam (n=merriam@wmerriam.gotadsl.co.uk) |
| 02:06.20 | *** join/#openmoko Defiant-_ (i=erik@c202191.adsl.hansenet.de) |
| 02:07.28 | *** join/#openmoko jcazor (n=juan62@200.31.75.14) |
| 02:12.00 | *** join/#openmoko zash (n=zash@zash.se) |
| 02:20.09 | *** join/#openmoko mrgarlic (n=mrgarlic@pool-70-19-60-228.ny325.east.verizon.net) |
| 02:25.11 | orzo | i think i need to resize partitions |
| 02:36.02 | *** join/#openmoko everslick (n=clemens@212-183-115-83.adsl.highway.telekom.at) |
| 02:36.21 | Toaster` | Weiss: just the toolchain. I'm trying to learn the setup |
| 02:36.30 | orzo | i have a 60mb partition for the rootfs |
| 02:36.34 | orzo | and the shr image is 70 meg |
| 02:36.41 | orzo | i dont see how this is going to work |
| 02:36.48 | orzo | it says its for the gta01 though |
| 02:36.52 | orzo | so there must be some way |
| 02:37.20 | orzo | is my rootfs partition not filling all of the space that it could? |
| 02:43.26 | Toaster` | Where does opkg store the downloaded ipk files? |
| 02:45.44 | Toaster` | or, how does one install a particular version of a file |
| 02:50.28 | zash | [1;2A |
| 02:50.30 | zash | gah |
| 02:50.32 | orzo | it'd be nice if packages allowed to install somewhere under /media/card |
| 02:50.52 | orzo | while leaving the rootfs intact |
| 02:50.53 | orzo | and usable without the sd card |
| 02:54.05 | mrgarlic | under OM does the battery icon fill up as it charges? |
| 02:57.29 | *** part/#openmoko dotmef (n=mef@mx1.bitwise.org) |
| 03:00.24 | *** join/#openmoko TimRiker (n=timr@rikers.org) |
| 03:00.50 | orzo | mrgarlic: not with gta01 device, maybe for freerunner |
| 03:04.35 | mrgarlic | i am charging free runner. (my first week. i am noobish) had battery run down. had to boot with nokia battery and then switch to open moko battery. just monitoring behavior. |
| 03:05.21 | mrgarlic | of the indicator. been charging 45 minutes and is still empty red icon. |
| 03:06.59 | *** join/#openmoko bamccaig (n=bamccaig@pppoe-66-186-88-1.vianet.ca) |
| 03:07.22 | orzo | maybe its not drawing full power |
| 03:08.42 | mrgarlic | its on AC not USB |
| 03:08.56 | orzo | well i cant help |
| 03:09.21 | mrgarlic | orzo you have helped |
| 03:09.41 | orzo | the gta01 doesnt even show an indicator for the battery |
| 03:09.53 | orzo | it just says charging if its charging |
| 03:10.06 | orzo | you have to unplug it to see the level of charge |
| 03:15.06 | *** join/#openmoko jserv-- (n=jserv@220-130-182-222.HINET-IP.hinet.net) |
| 03:17.11 | *** join/#openmoko alphabeat (n=nick@123-243-190-207.static.tpgi.com.au) |
| 03:17.11 | *** join/#openmoko chouchen (n=chatzill@125.115.161.21) |
| 03:19.23 | Toaster` | question, does mixing the angstrom and 2008-testing repos cause severe breakage? |
| 03:19.31 | *** join/#openmoko azaghal_ (n=azaghal@91.148.112.174) |
| 03:20.25 | Toaster` | I'm assuming yes, I'm just wondering what others experiences were. |
| 03:22.09 | bamccaig | Is it possible to open the splash for viewing as an image (I hate the boots and am curious what the "latest" image looks like)? |
| 03:32.52 | bamccaig | :( |
| 03:35.15 | bamccaig | Well, that's MUCH better than boots. :D |
| 03:35.40 | *** join/#openmoko swc|666 (n=swc|666@unaffiliated/swc666/x-4934821) |
| 03:36.16 | bamccaig | Is anybody around? :) |
| 03:36.24 | swc|666 | around what? 0o |
| 03:36.42 | slaxxin | latest om testing? |
| 03:37.12 | bamccaig | Heh. I'm just curious about the status of OM now... |
| 03:40.17 | bamccaig | Have there been improvements to the text entry yet? Can you finally type [again]? |
| 03:41.03 | bamccaig | ssh root@neo |
| 03:41.10 | bamccaig | Fack... :P Stupid irssi. >_< |
| 03:42.22 | bamccaig | Aww, man... :( My script apparently isn't working anymore to get my neo out to the Internet through USB... Now I gotta figure that out again. :-X |
| 03:45.41 | slaxxin | i just use iptables |
| 03:46.32 | *** join/#openmoko dyf (n=ad@bas2-guelph22-1279594438.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 03:47.06 | dyf | hello |
| 03:47.18 | bamccaig | Yeah... I haven't really figured out iptables yet... I had trouble the first time. >_< |
| 03:47.34 | bamccaig | Ugh, the screen sleeps to quickly and takes too long to wake up. :( |
| 03:48.21 | dyf | i would like to know about the openmoko software.. whether or not it plays mp3s, videos.. etc.. where should i go? |
| 03:48.52 | dyf | also how does it compare to android |
| 03:49.22 | bamccaig | I would say ATM that is very optimistic... I just want to enter text! \o/ |
| 03:49.55 | bamccaig | I tried to build Android for my FreeRunner to test *it*, but I started to encounter compiler errors... :( |
| 03:52.16 | dyf | when i buy it, i have the option to let them install and configure android |
| 03:52.40 | dyf | but i don't know what the default OS on openmoko even called |
| 03:53.42 | bamccaig | Umm... It's call Openmoko... ;) The latest "release", AFAIK, is Om2008.9 (AKA Om is OpenMoko). Of course, that's just one of several distributions. |
| 03:54.29 | bamccaig | I would say there's no harm in getting them to install android for you... You can always change it afterward if you want (and even install a different system to the microSD card if you want). |
| 03:54.36 | dyf | isn't that kinda dump.. how can you tell whether someone means the phone or the OS when they say openmoko |
| 03:54.49 | bamccaig | However, if you expect it to play music and video, I think I should warn you that it likely won't do that for a while... |
| 03:55.02 | dyf | yeah, i want more info on the default OS and its programs |
| 03:55.19 | dyf | it can't play audio? :o |
| 03:55.48 | bamccaig | Right now, even making calls or texting is unstable for most people. At least, the last I heard... And I just installed the latest update that I could find and it's still giving me problems for simple stuffz. |
| 03:56.28 | bamccaig | I don't even think there is a good onscreen keyboard yet for typing. Essentially, the Neo FreeRunner is still a very develop-oriented phone. I don't think it's ready for user consumption yet. |
| 03:56.32 | dyf | well, that sucks.. it costs a few hundred dollars with no good software? |
| 03:56.36 | bamccaig | Maybe android changes that, but I can't know because I couldn't build it. >_< |
| 03:57.10 | bamccaig | dyf: It's still in development. It isn't ready for actual use yet. |
| 03:57.56 | dyf | bamccaig: then it's not worth the money |
| 03:58.37 | bamccaig | Well I don't regret it. I'm learning from it... And supporting a good cause. And eventually, hope to have a fully capable "handhelp with GSM". :D |
| 03:59.06 | bamccaig | If you're not a programmer or expect to actually use the phone I think I should warn you that you probably won't be getting what you expect. |
| 03:59.28 | dyf | well, that's what i had in mind myself.. supporting a good cause, but i thought there was at least some good grounds |
| 04:00.12 | bamccaig | Yeah... I had hoped too... :-X That was a few months ago and from a user's perspective I don't see much different... It would help if I could connect to the Internet to install new packages and test things... |
| 04:00.22 | bamccaig | But that's my failing, not my freerunners. :P |
| 04:01.40 | bamccaig | I still think it's a good cause to support. Just... Do it knowing what you get in return. :P |
| 04:02.03 | orzo | hello |
| 04:02.13 | orzo | i just installed SHR |
| 04:02.30 | orzo | but i cant seem to make it do anything |
| 04:02.36 | orzo | i have a sim card i believe it wont be compatible with due to bug 666 |
| 04:02.36 | orzo | i want to verify that |
| 04:02.46 | orzo | i dont know how |
| 04:03.16 | dyf | well, thanks for the warning |
| 04:03.24 | dyf | i'll give it a second thought now |
| 04:09.21 | bamccaig | But hey, it has sudoku!! |
| 04:09.54 | bamccaig | I had fun myself toggling the LEDs with special files... :P |
| 04:10.05 | bamccaig | I haven't actually touched my freerunner in a month or two though... |
| 04:10.16 | *** join/#openmoko Ken_Young (n=Ken@pool-68-160-9-193.bos.east.verizon.net) |
| 04:14.27 | slaxxin | orzo u have at*t? |
| 04:14.36 | orzo | slaxxin: how do i find out? |
| 04:14.37 | orzo | oh |
| 04:14.45 | orzo | yea, my provider is at&t |
| 04:14.52 | slaxxin | your phone service provider |
| 04:15.07 | swc|666 | 's prover is T & A |
| 04:15.13 | slaxxin | take the sim out an read the numbers |
| 04:15.24 | orzo | why |
| 04:15.43 | orzo | i'm pretty sure its not working |
| 04:15.54 | orzo | i just want a commandline way to verify that its not |
| 04:16.06 | orzo | something low level for just reading the sim or something |
| 04:16.11 | slaxxin | well theres this one sim card they have been sending that is incompatable with the phone |
| 04:16.25 | orzo | is the sim a /dev/* device? |
| 04:16.34 | orzo | just one? |
| 04:16.50 | orzo | even now that bug 666 is fixed? |
| 04:17.07 | orzo | i was under teh impression that i'd be able to flash my gsm modem |
| 04:17.07 | slaxxin | its a card u insert into the phone so at(t can controll u |
| 04:17.22 | orzo | heh |
| 04:17.38 | orzo | is there a wiki page about this? |
| 04:17.46 | swc|666 | yep |
| 04:17.54 | orzo | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Carriers/ATT <-- out of date |
| 04:18.13 | slaxxin | well the 71234G sim is not a good deal |
| 04:18.45 | bamccaig | OMFG, my FreeRunner sees my network!! |
| 04:18.56 | slaxxin | yea haa |
| 04:18.56 | bamccaig | (WiFi) |
| 04:19.01 | slaxxin | hook up |
| 04:19.10 | bamccaig | However, it's WPA2 secured..... |
| 04:19.20 | slaxxin | unsecure it |
| 04:19.30 | bamccaig | I suppose. ;) |
| 04:21.30 | slaxxin | if u put a wifi gadget on yout shelf it appears u can control your wifi/lan connection |
| 04:22.19 | slaxxin | ie switch back an forth |
| 04:22.24 | slaxxin | <PROTECTED> |
| 04:22.24 | bamccaig | Hmm... I can't tell if I'm connected or not... :-/ |
| 04:22.32 | slaxxin | terminal? |
| 04:22.48 | bamccaig | Not installed yet. And since my PC isn't routing properly I can't install it. >_< |
| 04:23.11 | slaxxin | oo u got 2008.9? |
| 04:23.18 | orzo | i dont have libgsmd-tool |
| 04:23.18 | bamccaig | Oh: "Error. Unable to join network." :( |
| 04:23.26 | bamccaig | Yeah, 2008.9. |
| 04:23.26 | slaxxin | so u wanna try iptables? |
| 04:23.33 | orzo | i need help |
| 04:23.46 | bamccaig | Might as well. :) |
| 04:23.54 | bamccaig | I had it working... I can't understand why it would stop. :( |
| 04:26.12 | slaxxin | http://pastebin.com/m31397ec5 |
| 04:26.24 | orzo | i need a baby talking howto for getting things working on SHR |
| 04:26.24 | slaxxin | run three commands as root |
| 04:26.59 | slaxxin | i use shr |
| 04:26.59 | orzo | okay |
| 04:26.59 | orzo | well |
| 04:27.05 | orzo | can you opkg update? |
| 04:27.11 | orzo | i just flashed shr lite |
| 04:27.17 | orzo | and when i run update, it fails 404 on all teh srevers |
| 04:27.39 | slaxxin | well if u have the latest image thers not an upgrade |
| 04:27.55 | slaxxin | hmmm |
| 04:28.03 | orzo | i would expect teh servers to hit tho |
| 04:28.12 | slaxxin | yes |
| 04:28.59 | orzo | i can ping google.com |
| 04:28.59 | slaxxin | did u use iptables or what orzo |
| 04:28.59 | orzo | and i can ping the servers |
| 04:28.59 | orzo | where? |
| 04:28.59 | orzo | on teh neo? |
| 04:28.59 | slaxxin | yup |
| 04:29.07 | orzo | not since flashing |
| 04:29.21 | orzo | but i did set up some routing magic on teh computer its plugged into |
| 04:29.26 | slaxxin | whats in /etc/resolv.conf? |
| 04:29.40 | orzo | nameserver 208.67.222.222 |
| 04:29.40 | orzo | nameserver 208.67.220.220 |
| 04:29.46 | slaxxin | on the freerunner |
| 04:29.46 | orzo | i'm surprised it got that |
| 04:29.58 | orzo | it is not a freerunner |
| 04:30.04 | vinicius | also, I think the default ip should change |
| 04:30.10 | orzo | i'm using the neo1973 gta01bv04 |
| 04:30.17 | slaxxin | its 202 |
| 04:30.26 | vinicius | I mean, the default network |
| 04:30.38 | slaxxin | is it not 200? |
| 04:31.01 | orzo | my computer is 192.168.0.200 on usb0 and the phone is the same but .202 |
| 04:31.52 | slaxxin | u can ping google from the openmoko? |
| 04:32.17 | orzo | yes i can |
| 04:32.55 | slaxxin | i cant help then |
| 04:33.20 | orzo | i downloaded google's page |
| 04:33.25 | orzo | and viewd it |
| 04:33.25 | orzo | its correct |
| 04:33.29 | bamccaig | http://pastebin.com/d26441b9b |
| 04:33.34 | orzo | the neo is connected to the internet |
| 04:33.54 | bamccaig | Oh... I know why!!! \o/ |
| 04:33.54 | zash | orzo: check opkg repo-settings |
| 04:34.22 | bamccaig | I flashed my neo so I gotta redo my /etc/resolv.conf file!!! \o/ |
| 04:34.38 | slaxxin | yay |
| 04:34.42 | bamccaig | I betchu that's it! |
| 04:34.46 | bamccaig | hopes. |
| 04:35.08 | slaxxin | an if u use wifi u might need to reboot to get back to the lan |
| 04:35.42 | bamccaig | Yeah, that explains why my pastebin doesn't see usb0 anymore. |
| 04:35.42 | bamccaig | I'm rebooting now. |
| 04:36.16 | bamccaig | Is there a usable input yet for Om? :-/ |
| 04:36.28 | bamccaig | An onscreen keyboard.* |
| 04:36.51 | slaxxin | an something about enableing usb_ether_gadgets in your kernel |
| 04:37.09 | slaxxin | yup |
| 04:37.09 | orzo | http://rafb.net/p/BHm0Rz48.html |
| 04:37.15 | orzo | there is my output form opkg update |
| 04:37.30 | slaxxin | thats it |
| 04:37.48 | orzo | you say to check the repo-settings, but i do not know what the repo settings should say |
| 04:38.59 | *** join/#openmoko alephnull (n=alok@122.167.87.139) |
| 04:39.11 | zash | orzo: they don't appear to have any signature-files there |
| 04:39.24 | zash | orzo: can you install stuff? |
| 04:40.04 | orzo | well i want to install fluid |
| 04:40.04 | orzo | but it is not seen |
| 04:40.14 | orzo | whats something small to test? |
| 04:41.33 | bamccaig | Success! \o/ google.com |
| 04:45.06 | bamccaig | Is there a Web address to browse the repository? It's annoying not being able to read the whole package name from the neo.. |
| 04:45.16 | bamccaig | I suppose I could use the command line + ssh.. |
| 04:46.48 | *** join/#openmoko Sargun (n=Sargun@atarack/staff/sargun) |
| 04:49.03 | bamccaig | Hmmm... AUX seems to lock the screen now and power just seemed to shutdown... What happened to the menu? |
| 04:50.07 | bamccaig | I feel like I have to _pet_ my freerunner to keep it awake... |
| 04:51.48 | Ken_Young | It's like a Tamagotchi pet. |
| 04:52.29 | *** join/#openmoko Stroller (n=Stroller@213-152-39-89.dsl.eclipse.net.uk) |
| 04:55.55 | bamccaig | Haha. |
| 04:56.35 | *** join/#openmoko cdm (n=cdm@adsl-69-107-58-255.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net) |
| 04:57.30 | bamccaig | Isn't there a way to disable the screen sleeping all the time (or at least lengthen the timeout). |
| 04:57.54 | Ken_Young | bamccaig, What distribution are you using? |
| 04:58.13 | *** join/#openmoko TimRiker (n=timr@bzflag/projectlead/TimRiker) |
| 04:58.28 | bamccaig | Om2008.9 |
| 04:58.46 | Sargun | TimRiker, What are you doing here? |
| 04:59.03 | Ken_Young | bamccaig, Have you tried firing up "settings" and turning off suspend? |
| 04:59.33 | TimRiker | making obscene gestures in qwest's general direction. |
| 04:59.39 | bamccaig | Guess not. >_< |
| 04:59.41 | Sargun | TimRiker, haha |
| 04:59.46 | Sargun | TimRiker, No, really? |
| 04:59.55 | TimRiker | getting 5-15 second (yes second, not ms) latency and 30% packet loss. |
| 05:00.04 | Sargun | whoa. |
| 05:00.15 | Sargun | Well, I was more asking, why are you in #openmoko |
| 05:00.22 | Ken_Young | bamccaig, Giv that a shot. It allows you to sellect different timeout, or "off". SOunds like you want "off". |
| 05:00.26 | Sargun | TimRiker, Is it to first hop, or beyond? |
| 05:00.37 | TimRiker | I'm often in here. just listening in. I have a neo. |
| 05:01.12 | TimRiker | Sargun: very first hop. atm issues with msn. my isp is trying to give qwest a clue, but alas, they are clueless. |
| 05:01.33 | TimRiker | s/msn/qwest/ I think. |
| 05:01.41 | bamccaig | I would be OK with a decent time, but 60 seconds is far too short when it takes as long as it does to wake up. :( Thanks though. >_< It's been a while. |
| 05:02.01 | Sargun | TimRiker, what ISP do ou have? |
| 05:02.18 | Sargun | TimRiker, Neo 1973? I didn't think you were a Neo kind of guy |
| 05:02.40 | TimRiker | hehe |
| 05:02.43 | Ken_Young | bamccaig, There is a way to add additional timeout interval selections to that list, but I've fogotten it, I'm afraid. |
| 05:03.14 | bamccaig | Ah, well if it's out there I should be able to find it. :D Thanks for the tip. |
| 05:03.36 | TimRiker | isp is the very clueful xmission.com Highly recommended. unfortunately they don't run the line or the CO. Qwest claims they do that. and they do, now and then. |
| 05:03.40 | bamccaig | Ooh! \o/ The timezone map has local areas in the middle of nowhere, Canada! |
| 05:03.54 | Sargun | TimRiker, I'd wait a couple days. |
| 05:04.42 | TimRiker | yeah, was the same last night. qwest "fixed" the issue, and it went away for a few hours. now it's back again. |
| 05:04.45 | slaxxin | hit zoom bottom right |
| 05:04.48 | TimRiker | apt: lag? |
| 05:04.49 | apt | it has been said that lag is very bad here :( |
| 05:04.56 | slaxxin | babcc |
| 05:05.25 | Sargun | TimRiker, have you tried burning down the CO? ;-P |
| 05:06.06 | TimRiker | I asked them where it was and for some reason they won't tell me. |
| 05:06.13 | slaxxin | that would do it |
| 05:06.30 | TimRiker | well.. back to the movie. if apt is slow, you know why. |
| 05:06.43 | slaxxin | brand new pre-2000 euip. |
| 05:07.11 | bamccaig | Ok... Hmmm... o_O I have set my timezone, now how do I _save_? |
| 05:07.27 | slaxxin | 2 buttons on left |
| 05:07.35 | slaxxin | i think |
| 05:07.44 | bamccaig | Oh, nvm, back worked when automatic was off.. |
| 05:07.47 | slaxxin | 1 or the other |
| 05:08.27 | slaxxin | fdom has a lot of stuff |
| 05:08.38 | Ken_Young | bamccaig, For where I live (New ENgland) I do ln -s /usr/share/zoneinfo/America/New_York /etc/localtime and that's permanent for a timezone change. |
| 05:08.47 | slaxxin | we need an updated fdom |
| 05:09.00 | bamccaig | Ah, yeah, the command line is always best. :D |
| 05:11.24 | bamccaig | Seems the GUI worked though (but it copied it instead of linking it). IIRC, from the Gentoo handbook copying is recommended so that if /usr is inaccessible during boot the timezone information is still available. |
| 05:11.55 | bamccaig | Whether that would ever be an issue on a freerunner is beyond me... :-/ |
| 05:11.55 | slaxxin | is shr and 2009.X going to merge or what? |
| 05:12.15 | Ken_Young | bamccaig, I think if /usr is unavailable, the timezone is the least of your problems. |
| 05:13.20 | bamccaig | On a neo perhaps, but on a server or desktop you'd probably prefer to see localtime when diagnosing the problem. :P |
| 05:19.07 | *** join/#openmoko Sup3rkiddo (n=sudharsh@unaffiliated/sudharsh) |
| 05:23.33 | bamccaig | Is anybody famliar with openmoko-set-root-password? :-/ |
| 05:23.39 | bamccaig | s/famliar/familiar/ |
| 05:23.54 | slaxxin | orso |
| 05:24.20 | slaxxin | orzo opkg install nano? |
| 05:24.38 | slaxxin | yea just passwd |
| 05:24.42 | *** join/#openmoko Isajha (n=Isajha4@wrzb-4d00cf6a.pool.mediaWays.net) |
| 05:24.48 | slaxxin | then do it |
| 05:24.55 | bamccaig | I just installed it and am now faced with a GUI prompt for the password... However, there is no onscreen keyboard to type with... |
| 05:25.16 | slaxxin | well see qwerty top left? |
| 05:25.23 | bamccaig | Further, if I do apply one will I get an onscreen keyboard when my neo boots or will I just get locked out? >_< |
| 05:25.38 | bamccaig | Top left of what? :-/ |
| 05:25.51 | slaxxin | the neo |
| 05:25.56 | bamccaig | I do not see anything in the top left. :P |
| 05:26.04 | slaxxin | see qwerty anywhere |
| 05:26.13 | bamccaig | No... |
| 05:26.21 | slaxxin | pull down the meny |
| 05:26.36 | slaxxin | is it 2008.9? |
| 05:26.51 | bamccaig | Yep. |
| 05:27.04 | slaxxin | latest testing? |
| 05:27.23 | slaxxin | no? |
| 05:27.52 | slaxxin | anything? |
| 05:27.54 | bamccaig | Ummm... Not sure. http://downloads.openmoko.org/releases/Om2008.9/ |
| 05:27.59 | bamccaig | The 20081117 kernel and rootfs. |
| 05:28.27 | slaxxin | so the keyboard IS there |
| 05:28.40 | bamccaig | How do I _see_ it? :D |
| 05:29.04 | bamccaig | I just launched xterm too and no keyboard.. |
| 05:29.04 | slaxxin | top middle |
| 05:29.42 | slaxxin | should be top left "QQQQWERTY" |
| 05:29.52 | slaxxin | well |
| 05:29.57 | bamccaig | The menu from the top middle currently has "Home", "Installer", and "xterm" in it... (I just entered a blank password for root so openmoko-set-root-password closed). |
| 05:30.22 | bamccaig | I don't see anything about querty... :-X Does it need to be installed first? |
| 05:30.29 | bamccaig | Like from the package manager? |
| 05:30.38 | slaxxin | <PROTECTED> |
| 05:30.45 | bamccaig | :-/ |
| 05:30.51 | slaxxin | nope its there |
| 05:30.53 | bamccaig | Which one has a keyboard? |
| 05:31.50 | slaxxin | i saw one image that did have the keyboard on the right i think on the dropdown menu |
| 05:32.23 | slaxxin | but all of 2008.9 have keyboards by default |
| 05:32.35 | slaxxin | no need to install |
| 05:34.10 | slaxxin | illume-config-ilume is a keyboard |
| 05:34.52 | slaxxin | its shr that has the qwerty on the right |
| 05:36.14 | slaxxin | ok maybe a icon at the middle right when terminal is open |
| 05:36.22 | bamccaig | illume-config-illume appears to be installed according to `opkg list_installed` :-/ |
| 05:36.42 | slaxxin | i think i would reinstall |
| 05:36.49 | bamccaig | XTerm? |
| 05:36.58 | slaxxin | unless u wanna play around |
| 05:37.22 | bamccaig | I just installed today.. O_O I can't see any reason why it wouldn't have worked... dfu-util seemed to think everything went happily... |
| 05:37.55 | slaxxin | well theres no md5sums to check the media |
| 05:38.48 | bamccaig | I suppose... Why is that anyway? :P |
| 05:38.57 | bamccaig | Still, you'd think if it was corrupt it wouldn't actually run... |
| 05:39.52 | slaxxin | ooo yea |
| 05:41.29 | slaxxin | http://downloads.openmoko.org/daily/testing/ |
| 05:41.37 | slaxxin | im going to do this |
| 05:42.02 | bamccaig | Hmmm, illume-config mentions qwerty button for manual keyboard calling... I'm going to install that.. ^^ |
| 05:44.28 | slaxxin | i hear theres a volume bar for the call volume in the latest :) |
| 05:47.28 | *** join/#openmoko kd8ikt (n=kd8ikt@we.trekbeyond.org) |
| 05:48.29 | bamccaig | `df` doesn't seem to list as much memory as I would expect.... O_O |
| 05:50.29 | bamccaig | Nevermind... -h helps clarity. :D |
| 05:54.06 | slaxxin | got a keyboard now? |
| 05:55.33 | slaxxin | ok now lets see what they been up to here |
| 05:56.43 | bamccaig | The installing of illume-config is taking a while....... :( |
| 05:57.14 | slaxxin | u using the installer or opkg? |
| 05:57.21 | bamccaig | Anybody know the repository URL (or the file system location for such information)? |
| 05:57.23 | bamccaig | The installer. |
| 05:57.39 | slaxxin | i think it fails |
| 05:57.55 | slaxxin | <PROTECTED> |
| 05:58.41 | bamccaig | Fail.. :( Restart Assasin recommended... |
| 05:58.48 | bamccaig | What is assasin? O_O |
| 05:59.02 | slaxxin | its me keyboard killer:) |
| 05:59.26 | bamccaig | :P |
| 05:59.39 | slaxxin | ::_:: |
| 05:59.45 | bamccaig | Awww, WTF... >:( The shutdown splash is still the ugly boots! |
| 05:59.46 | vinicius | wat |
| 06:00.26 | slaxxin | u need a newer image |
| 06:00.57 | vinicius | slaxxin: there is one annoying thing about daily though |
| 06:01.13 | vinicius | if one at any time decide to switch profile to silent, it will remain silent at answering |
| 06:01.15 | slaxxin | it has boots to? |
| 06:01.26 | bamccaig | I flashed the new splash... :-/ < http://downloads.openmoko.org/releases/Om2008.9/Om2008.9.splash.gz > |
| 06:01.49 | bamccaig | Unless that's really the boots one... |
| 06:01.55 | *** join/#openmoko charlie137 (n=guillaum@114-45-168-212.dynamic.hinet.net) |
| 06:02.13 | bamccaig | The splash seemed to be new (at first)... Now I see that I'm still getting those goddamned boots. |
| 06:02.24 | slaxxin | latest has fastboot:) |
| 06:05.46 | bamccaig | <ugh/> The damn screen shut off again before I could do anything!? >:( |
| 06:05.58 | bamccaig | Now it won't wake up. >:( |
| 06:06.14 | Sargun | hehh |
| 06:06.16 | Sargun | bahaha |
| 06:06.21 | Sargun | I think the Freerunner god likes me |
| 06:06.27 | slaxxin | change the suspend to off |
| 06:06.34 | Ken_Young | It's very sensitive to criticism about its boots. |
| 06:06.58 | slaxxin | thosse are some very fine boots |
| 06:07.00 | bamccaig | I did that already last boot... Apparently it didn't persist though... :( |
| 06:07.07 | bamccaig | This time I didn't get a chance! |
| 06:07.52 | slaxxin | opkg install gpsd |
| 06:08.54 | bamccaig | Shouldn't this stuff (The suspend setting) be stored in a text file somewhere? :-/ This is Linux, ffs! |
| 06:09.13 | d-b | bamccaig: nar of course not ^^ |
| 06:09.19 | d-b | that would make sense |
| 06:09.43 | bamccaig | :P |
| 06:09.46 | slaxxin | whats wrong with the gui |
| 06:10.09 | bamccaig | Nothing when it's working. I just *trust* the command line more. |
| 06:10.24 | bamccaig | That goes for all GUIs/command lines... |
| 06:10.33 | slaxxin | well it works |
| 06:10.55 | bamccaig | When the GUI has trouble you're basically fukt... When the command line does you can usually tell and kill it... |
| 06:11.17 | orzo | okay |
| 06:11.24 | orzo | well i did it |
| 06:11.26 | orzo | i flashed teh gsm firmware |
| 06:11.42 | orzo | and the GSM indicator shows AT&T with 4 bars |
| 06:11.58 | bamccaig | \o/ |
| 06:12.02 | orzo | but dialer doesnt work (shr lite distro) |
| 06:12.11 | Sargun | orzo, Moko10? |
| 06:12.14 | bamccaig | /o\ |
| 06:12.16 | orzo | Sargun: yes |
| 06:12.35 | Sargun | is that FSO? |
| 06:12.43 | orzo | no |
| 06:12.45 | orzo | SHR |
| 06:12.49 | orzo | shared hybrid release |
| 06:12.58 | orzo | i flashed moko10 to the gsm hardware |
| 06:13.12 | orzo | moko10 is firmware for the gsm chip, not a distro for the phone |
| 06:13.39 | orzo | now |
| 06:13.47 | orzo | anybody around to help me trouble shoot the dialer? |
| 06:13.52 | orzo | i did something nasty too |
| 06:13.55 | bamccaig | Anybody know what "Blank time" means? |
| 06:14.01 | orzo | i moved /usr/share onto my /media/card/ |
| 06:14.08 | orzo | and when i tried to move it back, it wouldnt fit |
| 06:14.11 | orzo | heh |
| 06:14.14 | *** join/#openmoko peter-b (n=peter_b@p54978754.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 06:14.26 | bamccaig | orzo: >_< |
| 06:14.52 | orzo | i had to do that becausae the damn gsm flasher installs in /usr/sbin and expects the firmware file to be in the same directory |
| 06:14.59 | orzo | and i didnt have enough space to put it there |
| 06:15.37 | orzo | so now i'm stuck with /usr/share being a symlink to a directory on my sd card |
| 06:15.54 | slaxxin | orzo did u take the sim card out an get the number off it |
| 06:16.02 | orzo | slaxxin: no |
| 06:16.11 | orzo | but it apparently works |
| 06:16.17 | orzo | it detected AT&T and shows 4 bars |
| 06:16.54 | orzo | so now how to make dialer work |
| 06:17.02 | orzo | to do the real test |
| 06:17.07 | orzo | or maybe how to dial from the command line |
| 06:17.15 | orzo | just to verify |
| 06:17.51 | *** part/#openmoko charlie137 (n=guillaum@114-45-168-212.dynamic.hinet.net) |
| 06:19.31 | rooly | orzo, check the front page of the wiki |
| 06:19.33 | orzo | Failed to handle dbus error: type: <class 'framework.resource.ResourceNotEnabled'> |
| 06:19.35 | rooly | should be something on that |
| 06:19.37 | orzo | , 69 (dbus-glib-error-quark), code 32 |
| 06:20.54 | Sargun | orzo, Use FSO |
| 06:21.22 | orzo | why |
| 06:21.26 | mwester | Or just flash a newer kernel (it is a gta01, right? |
| 06:21.26 | mwester | ) |
| 06:21.32 | orzo | yes its gta01 |
| 06:21.50 | mwester | Ok, known issue -- the Om kernel is too old |
| 06:22.11 | orzo | i flashed teh uImage-2.6.24-oe1+git kernel |
| 06:22.16 | mwester | http://moko.mwester.net/dl.html#kernel |
| 06:22.24 | *** join/#openmoko bamccaig_ (n=bamccaig@dsl-66-185-205-89.vianet.ca) |
| 06:22.41 | mwester | Grab that kernel and those modules. |
| 06:24.30 | orzo | okay |
| 06:24.44 | orzo | so flash teh kernel and then expand that modules tarball in /lib/ ? |
| 06:24.48 | orzo | oh |
| 06:24.53 | orzo | expand the modules tarball in / |
| 06:24.57 | mwester | yep |
| 06:25.05 | orzo | but i'll probably run out of space |
| 06:25.07 | orzo | heh |
| 06:25.21 | Ken_Young | Does anyone know how to fix the Enlightenment Segv crashes that happen roughly once per minute if you apply the FDOMizer to the 2008.9 rootfs? |
| 06:25.23 | orzo | i guess i should expand the modules first |
| 06:25.26 | orzo | and then flash and boot |
| 06:28.46 | bamccaig_ | Wow, this qwerty keyboard is so great... I wanna cry... :( |
| 06:28.52 | bamccaig_ | In a happy way!! :D |
| 06:29.09 | slaxxin | yay |
| 06:30.04 | bamccaig_ | Now to work on getting GSM and Wifi... |
| 06:31.10 | bamccaig_ | I bought a SIM card a few months ago and bought $20 worth for it... But Rogers (I'm in Canada) fukt me when I tried to activiate and I didn't have the energy to deal with them, especially when I wasn't even sure if the freerunner was working right, so I just put it off. |
| 06:34.40 | rooly | rogers is a collection of horrible business practices bundled into an over-the-top pricing system |
| 06:34.46 | rooly | so...we feel your pain |
| 06:38.57 | *** join/#openmoko polymar (n=polymar@ip72-219-149-151.oc.oc.cox.net) |
| 06:40.43 | bamccaig_ | Yeah... I'm stuck with them in Canada for now, it seems. :-[ |
| 06:41.03 | bamccaig_ | Hopefully I can get past that and get on the network and shit anyway... :P |
| 06:41.10 | orzo | mwester: i flashed your kernel, and now some things in settings apprently work better, but i no longer can get it to see AT&T |
| 06:41.13 | bamccaig_ | I told the rogers store guy about the neo when I got my SIM card... |
| 06:41.45 | bamccaig_ | He seemed interested, probably either in a "I have to be nice to the customer" sort of way, or a "fuck off, you're going to ruin my sales" sort of way. :D |
| 06:42.00 | rooly | thats what i did with the people in the at&t lot |
| 06:42.05 | rooly | same attitude |
| 06:42.22 | rooly | however, people at best buy loved it |
| 06:42.22 | bamccaig_ | I offered to bring my neo by to show him, but like you said, evil... I don't know if I want to draw too much attention. :D |
| 06:42.23 | rooly | and people at a small airport mobile store loved it too |
| 06:43.24 | bamccaig_ | rooly: :D |
| 06:43.31 | rooly | yessir |
| 06:44.01 | orzo | mwester: cat /dev/ttySAC0 returns immediately |
| 06:44.22 | orzo | mwester: do i need to load a module? |
| 06:45.26 | bamccaig_ | Has svn been ported to the freerunner yet? :D |
| 06:45.49 | rooly | if its in the angstrom repo's, yes |
| 06:46.03 | rooly | and i'm pretty sure svn would be something in the angstrom repo's |
| 06:46.37 | nemik | so where are the newest FSO images? the sources seems to change |
| 06:46.42 | orzo | damn |
| 06:46.51 | mwester | orzo: No, you need nothing -- it's the same kernel as you had a few minutes ago, except it has a battery driver so that SHR doesn't crash with that same erorr any more. |
| 06:47.02 | orzo | well |
| 06:47.11 | orzo | why dont i have a working /dev/ttySAC0 |
| 06:47.14 | mwester | orzo: you may have some other error now, but that one is fixed. |
| 06:47.28 | mwester | What makes you think /dev/ttySAC0 isn't working?? |
| 06:47.30 | orzo | i had a working /dev/ttySAC0 before i flashed your kernel |
| 06:47.37 | orzo | because when i cat it, it quits immediately |
| 06:47.38 | mwester | what does "working" mean to you? |
| 06:47.50 | mwester | That's meaningless. |
| 06:47.56 | *** join/#openmoko polymar_ (n=polymar@vpn.yellowpages.com) |
| 06:47.56 | orzo | there's test code that invoves cat /dev/ttySAC0 & |
| 06:48.07 | rooly | iirc, isn't it /dev/ttySAC1? |
| 06:48.09 | orzo | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/GSM/Flashing |
| 06:48.17 | orzo | well maybe it is now |
| 06:48.19 | orzo | i dont know |
| 06:48.20 | rooly | oh, but he wants the gsm |
| 06:48.22 | rooly | nvm |
| 06:48.26 | mwester | Right. But you need to do a lot more to get it to work, and you have to make sure that nothing else (like SHR) is using it. |
| 06:49.04 | mwester | I thought your problem was that SHR was crashing? |
| 06:49.05 | mwester | No? |
| 06:49.49 | orzo | no |
| 06:49.52 | orzo | just the dialer was crashing |
| 06:50.03 | orzo | i had gsm indicator saying at&t with four bars |
| 06:50.05 | orzo | but couldnt dial |
| 06:50.07 | mwester | Ok, ok that's part of SHR and is what I meant. |
| 06:50.26 | orzo | now that i flashed your kernel, i dont see at&t with four bars anymore |
| 06:50.27 | *** join/#openmoko nio_ (n=nio@5571ef58.dsl.concepts.nl) |
| 06:50.30 | orzo | and i cant seem to get gsm to work |
| 06:51.01 | mwester | Right. Others have had a similar problem. IIRC correctly, another part of SHR has crashed and needs to be restarted. |
| 06:51.08 | bamccaig | qtopia-phone-x11-photoedit...? O_O photo *edit* ? :P |
| 06:52.42 | rooly | bamccaig, yes |
| 06:52.46 | pjz | heya mwester, whatcha up to? |
| 06:52.47 | rooly | you can zoom, crop, and rotate |
| 06:52.53 | pjz | mwester: what distro you using these days? |
| 06:52.56 | rooly | and draw too, i believe |
| 06:53.56 | mwester | pjz: Qt Extended 4.4.3, and SHR. |
| 06:54.26 | rooly | 443 is out? |
| 06:54.39 | mwester | ls |
| 06:54.50 | pjz | mwester: cool. |
| 06:54.52 | mwester | no, but there were/are source snapshots |
| 06:55.05 | rooly | is it any more stable than 441 and 2? |
| 06:55.43 | mwester | I haven't done a lot of testing. I've been focussing on SHR lately |
| 06:55.53 | rooly | do you have it in use as a part-time phone? |
| 06:55.55 | pjz | upgraded from Qt 4.3.3 to 4.4.2 - big mistake |
| 06:55.55 | nemik | is that better for app development than FSO? |
| 06:55.58 | pjz | kernel is lame |
| 06:56.04 | pjz | no suspend & resume |
| 06:56.07 | rooly | because i can hardly stand 4.3.2 |
| 06:56.14 | rooly | but its the most stable available |
| 06:56.40 | orzo | well |
| 06:56.44 | mwester | rooly: I did use it as a part-time phone for a while, but at this moment, absolutely nothing is stable enough for that. |
| 06:56.46 | bamccaig | rooly: That's awesome. :D |
| 06:56.48 | orzo | how do if find what needs to be restarted |
| 06:56.52 | orzo | i just rebooted and came back |
| 06:57.03 | pjz | mwester: 4.3.2 is stable enough for that, with a hack or two |
| 06:57.08 | orzo | then sshed into the neo and ran /etc/init.d/gsm0710muxd start |
| 06:57.09 | pjz | mwester: or was |
| 06:57.18 | mwester | pjz: Yep. |
| 06:57.22 | orzo | now the settings program says that gsm is on |
| 06:57.26 | pjz | mwester: just the phone bits - no wifi, no gps |
| 06:57.30 | orzo | but the indicator at the top does not show AT&T |
| 06:57.46 | pjz | mwester: Android is my next big hope |
| 06:57.52 | *** join/#openmoko anno^da_ (n=anno^da@p5B07FC26.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 06:57.57 | pjz | we need a voting app |
| 06:58.00 | mwester | orzo: yep, that was the one they mentioned. And the indicator on the top may be wrong, so use with care. |
| 06:58.14 | pjz | where people can post image/kernel pairs and rate them as to stability |
| 06:58.23 | mwester | pjz: don't hold your breath for android. It has a bad "vibe" to it right now. |
| 06:58.30 | pjz | mwester: howso? |
| 06:58.33 | mwester | closed. |
| 06:58.34 | rooly | agrees |
| 06:58.50 | pjz | mwester: I thought it was buildable from source now? |
| 06:58.53 | *** join/#openmoko anno^da_ (n=anno^da@p5B07FC26.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 06:58.56 | nemik | well there's a more open one now for same price as openmoko |
| 06:59.09 | orzo | android doesnt let you have root |
| 06:59.12 | pjz | koolu is basing a business on it |
| 06:59.30 | mwester | It used to be people would throw rocks at Qtopia because it wasn't "open" enough, but android is far worse. At least we get regular code snapshots from ljp, we get nothing from the Android guys. |
| 06:59.35 | pjz | mean android for the openmoko, not the silly G1 |
| 07:00.19 | mwester | And then the stupid SD card partitioning restrictions -- that just tells you that either somebody doesn't "get it", or they are too busy to fix it -- both can be corrected with a bit of help from the community. |
| 07:00.53 | pjz | admits he hasn't paid that much attention to it, has been waiting for the soft kbd to finish materializing |
| 07:01.00 | mwester | If they would let the community help -- put up an open git repo, get active on the IRC channel, and get people excited and feeling like they are contributing to Android -- that works for SHR! |
| 07:01.03 | orzo | mwester: what should i search |
| 07:01.29 | orzo | to find other people's fix |
| 07:01.31 | orzo | for this |
| 07:01.36 | nemik | mwester: why SHR over FSO in your opinion? |
| 07:01.52 | pjz | and why SHR over FDOM? |
| 07:02.00 | orzo | FDOM not available for gta01 |
| 07:02.03 | mwester | nemik: FSO is a foundation; SHR is the set of apps that use FSO. |
| 07:02.32 | *** join/#openmoko vininim (n=vininim@pdpc/supporter/student/vininim) |
| 07:02.32 | pjz | didnt realize we were talking distros for gta01 |
| 07:02.37 | mwester | FDOM is just the Om 2008.x distro with stuff added. It's still a conceptually flawed distro. |
| 07:02.39 | rooly | mwester, do your bosses just completely ignore past iterations of hardware and software? |
| 07:03.03 | nemik | mwester: ahhh sorry, didn't know it was based on FSO. thanks |
| 07:03.40 | mwester | rooly: Right now I have no boss, but no -- quite the contrary -- unlike Om, my employers have always valued customers and their investments. I cannot understand why Om does not... |
| 07:04.24 | rooly | is the project lead at OM the same guy who started it oh so long ago? |
| 07:04.25 | vininim | possibly understaffed |
| 07:04.41 | mwester | hopes rooly doesn't think he works for Om. |
| 07:05.01 | rooly | nope. but ya shur do contribute alot |
| 07:05.02 | mwester | rooly: I don't know who the project lead is; I think that's part of the problem! |
| 07:05.06 | orzo | the SHR pages shoudl be a wiki |
| 07:05.30 | vininim | mwester: it seems Sean is one of the higher in the chain |
| 07:05.32 | bamccaig | Nooooo! :'( |
| 07:05.36 | vininim | *highest |
| 07:05.40 | bamccaig | I can't find the qwerty keyboard anymore! What did I do!? |
| 07:05.57 | rooly | remembers jumping on the OM bandwagon when it first appeard off of digg and the likes 4 5 or 6 years ago |
| 07:06.17 | orzo | /usr/sbin/gsm0710muxd and /usr/sbin/gsm0710muxd -x /sys/bus/platform/devices/neo1973-pm-gsm.0 -f 100 are both running |
| 07:06.22 | orzo | does that make sense? |
| 07:12.55 | *** join/#openmoko emilis_info (n=emilis@clt-84-32-58-67.vdnet.lt) |
| 07:15.45 | orzo | http://rafb.net/p/6LuGKw87.html |
| 07:15.53 | orzo | that is the output of running the gsm daemon |
| 07:16.02 | orzo | i dont think it is seeing the modem |
| 07:16.56 | bamccaig | :( |
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| 07:19.57 | orzo | how do i found out what crashed if somethign crashed, mwester ? |
| 07:20.03 | Dave | Joerg |
| 07:20.16 | DocScrutinizer | mooo |
| 07:20.34 | orzo | do you use SHR, Joerg? |
| 07:20.45 | mwester | orzo: you just have to poke about for the log files, or look to see if there are any missing processes. It's not well defined yet; SHR is unfinished. |
| 07:20.56 | Dave | :D |
| 07:21.08 | Ken_Young | Hi Dave. |
| 07:21.25 | mwester | orzo: have you tried the qt extended images? |
| 07:21.27 | *** join/#openmoko Lijian (n=lijian@218.58.59.73) |
| 07:21.33 | orzo | no |
| 07:21.38 | DocScrutinizer | orzo: I use assembler ;-) |
| 07:21.39 | *** join/#openmoko wildnux (n=wildnux@cpe-76-187-113-188.tx.res.rr.com) |
| 07:22.15 | mwester | orzo: I think perhaps you might find those to be a bit more what you're looking for -- there are gta01 images available. |
| 07:22.34 | DocScrutinizer | orzo: and I even love to *print* my schematics to A3 :-D |
| 07:22.44 | wildnux | anyone has the old splash image file? or any other new splash image? can i get it? |
| 07:22.52 | pjz | OM really didnt need the mp3 patent troll hassles though |
| 07:22.56 | mwester | orzo: I'm not sure, but it doesn't sound like you'r having fun debugging this stuff! |
| 07:22.57 | rooly | i have a copy sitting in my storage |
| 07:23.05 | rooly | of 2k711 |
| 07:23.09 | bamccaig | I managed to get it back again, but don't ask me how or why... I followed this: < http://www.unixarea.de/openmoko.txt Step 1 > |
| 07:23.23 | bamccaig | Clarication: qwerty keyboard. |
| 07:23.23 | wildnux | rooly: can you plz give it to me? |
| 07:24.15 | slaxxin | illume |
| 07:24.15 | pjz | mwester: do you have a recent kernel that will do suspend and reume with QtE ? |
| 07:25.29 | mwester | pjz: all the ones linked to by the Qt Extended site will do suspend/resume... any problems in that area would be either the WSoD problem on the GTA02, or QtE problems. |
| 07:25.49 | pjz | mwester: even with 4.4.2? |
| 07:26.12 | mwester | pjz: I haven't back-ported the latest WSoD workarounds for the GTA02. |
| 07:26.23 | pjz | mwester: okay, good to know; I think my last one was a patched kernel for the bounce problem that doesn't do suspect/resume |
| 07:26.26 | mwester | pjz: you'll have to be more specific about any issues you have with 4.4.2 |
| 07:26.41 | pjz | mwester: right now it's just that the kernel doesn't do suspend/resume at all |
| 07:26.44 | mwester | The suspend/resume problem has not changed status since the qtopia days. |
| 07:26.53 | pjz | mwester: probably an old kernel though |
| 07:26.55 | mwester | at least in terms of the kernel. |
| 07:27.13 | mwester | pjz: why do you assume that suspend/resume issues are all kernel? |
| 07:28.11 | pjz | mwester: b/c, as I said, I think I used a non-stock one to get an early version of the calypso bounce fix |
| 07:28.26 | pjz | mwester: it's quite possible the stock ones pointed there do suspend/resume just fine |
| 07:28.54 | pjz | mwester: or maybe you're right - maybe I just have suspend turned off |
| 07:29.14 | mwester | One of the big problems that Om has with some of these bugs, incl the WSoD bug, is that their kernel people don't run any phone software at all. So when users report issues, they can't duplicate them - because all they can duplicate is the basic, bare X suspend/resume and the kernel. There's a lot more to it. |
| 07:29.27 | pjz | yah |
| 07:29.29 | pjz | idiots |
| 07:29.34 | pjz | dogfooding your product is basic |
| 07:30.31 | mwester | At this point, all Om employees should have a GTA02, and the company policy needs to be that no company phone calls or data comms can be done on anything except the gta01 or gta02. |
| 07:30.42 | pjz | yup |
| 07:30.47 | mwester | We'd have a basic, working phone in three weeks. |
| 07:30.54 | pjz | yeah |
| 07:31.02 | pjz | no kidding |
| 07:31.30 | pjz | I write software for a living, and yes, we internally use the software we develop |
| 07:31.37 | pjz | the prerelease version |
| 07:31.41 | *** join/#openmoko mlpug_ (n=username@a88-115-168-225.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 07:31.42 | orzo | me2 |
| 07:31.42 | pjz | so it gets more testing |
| 07:32.13 | pjz | and some of the sharp edges get blunted because they hurt us first |
| 07:33.03 | pjz | and heck, it's such a mess right now that even if i wanted to help, it's unclear where I can actually do so |
| 07:33.34 | pjz | 200x ? FSO ? kernel work? illume? |
| 07:34.32 | pjz | QtE ? uboot? qi? |
| 07:34.36 | mwester | pjz: The mess is clearing up. It's getting much better for community help. Basically, 2008.x (and FDOM) is dead. FSO is the future for the community, and that means FSO if you do "framework" stuff, and SHR if you do "GUI" stuff. |
| 07:35.36 | pjz | has most experience with framework stuff, or non-gui apps |
| 07:35.42 | mwester | Android is, well, it's... it's android. Om wants android on the FR very badly, at least certain people at Om, but it doesn't do what FSO does. |
| 07:35.52 | pjz | lately in java, but also a couple years of python |
| 07:36.20 | pjz | what I really want is something that can make and take calls and SMS |
| 07:36.32 | pjz | and suspends and resumes |
| 07:36.37 | pjz | the rest is optional |
| 07:36.54 | pjz | I don't care (for the moment) about wifi or bluetooth or gps or anything else |
| 07:37.10 | pjz | ideally that thing would be FSO or SHR so that I could help out on it in my free time |
| 07:37.14 | mwester | bluetooth is the solution to both the echo and the buzz problem. |
| 07:37.45 | mwester | I think way too many folks have overlooked that... a $25 bluetooth headset fixes those major outstanding issues. |
| 07:37.46 | *** join/#openmoko wd (n=wd@php.suxx.org.ru) |
| 07:37.57 | mwester | we just need to get bluetooth working right. |
| 07:38.02 | rooly | yeah... |
| 07:38.08 | nemik | but it ruins battery life, no? |
| 07:38.10 | rooly | it needs to be properly implemented in hardware |
| 07:38.17 | orzo | i got the AT commands to work with mikyterm |
| 07:38.20 | pjz | the echo problem I've heard on my phone on QtE seemed to be caused by the incoming call showing up on the speakerphone speaker instead of the ear speaker |
| 07:38.20 | mwester | Heck, even the crappy audio quality problem can be avoided with a bluetooth sterio headset! |
| 07:38.21 | orzo | mickyterm |
| 07:38.32 | orzo | it apparently recognizes gsm device |
| 07:38.46 | rooly | nemik, it should work plenty fine if the OS correctly handles the bluetooth |
| 07:39.03 | mwester | orzo: mickeyterm talks to one of the channels on the mux, which talks to the GSM. |
| 07:39.19 | orzo | okay |
| 07:39.26 | orzo | i dont really know what a mux is |
| 07:39.47 | vininim | multiplexer? |
| 07:40.17 | *** join/#openmoko poco (n=neil@vau06-1-89-85-32-52.dsl.club-internet.fr) |
| 07:40.58 | mwester | nemik: yes, battery life is another issue - but that's acedemic until the device actually does something useful! And the working bits are rather limited right now... |
| 07:41.14 | mwester | But there's still a lot of room for improvement there as well. |
| 07:41.38 | pjz | mwester: okay, so how's SHR these days? |
| 07:41.45 | orzo | i tried an old fashioned modem command, ATDT to dial |
| 07:41.47 | mwester | coming along very nicely. |
| 07:41.47 | orzo | heh |
| 07:41.57 | orzo | i dont know if that makes sense for gsm, but its not working |
| 07:41.58 | pjz | mwester: what works? what doesn't? |
| 07:42.55 | mwester | pjz: I haven't tested the latest versions -- but isn't somebody reviewing the images regularly? |
| 07:43.16 | pjz | mwester: not that I know of - if I'm wrong I'd be more than happy to hear about it |
| 07:43.32 | swc|666 | so when will OM give me a 3/4g modem equipped phone with a =>624mhz proc / =>256 ram and a qwerty, with usb hostmode (minus the fucktard anteris crapola)? |
| 07:43.34 | mwester | There's another job the community can tackle, then. :) |
| 07:43.46 | pjz | mwester: indeed |
| 07:44.14 | *** join/#openmoko cdm (n=cdm@adsl-69-107-84-86.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net) |
| 07:45.59 | slaxxin | neopwn is the good stuff |
| 07:46.04 | neopwn | for sure |
| 07:46.13 | Sargun | neopwn? |
| 07:46.19 | neopwn | yup |
| 07:46.43 | Sargun | neopwn, 4-5 ears |
| 07:46.45 | Sargun | eyars |
| 07:46.46 | Sargun | years |
| 07:46.54 | neopwn | no longer available to the masses unfortunately |
| 07:47.01 | slaxxin | what? |
| 07:47.11 | slaxxin | noooo |
| 07:47.16 | neopwn | yah |
| 07:47.24 | slaxxin | what happened? |
| 07:47.26 | Sargun | Have you ever been by a window, and unsure of the actual weather looked at your computer? |
| 07:47.32 | orzo | i expect the only process to use /dev/ttySAC0 to be gsm0710muxd |
| 07:47.36 | neopwn | r&d |
| 07:47.39 | Sargun | neopwn, are you the creator of neopwn? |
| 07:47.42 | orzo | is that not what you'd expect, mwester ? |
| 07:47.44 | neopwn | yep |
| 07:48.05 | Sargun | neopwn, neat |
| 07:48.17 | neopwn | ~10k hours of pwning *nix to pda's / htc's later... :/ |
| 07:48.54 | slaxxin | http://www.neopwn.com/store.php |
| 07:48.58 | rooly | sighs |
| 07:49.06 | Sargun | neopwn, you should write tools to "pwn" gsm |
| 07:49.09 | rooly | why in god's name don't they just let it boot in non-debug mode |
| 07:49.20 | rooly | that takes off a good minute of the boot time BY ITSELF |
| 07:49.21 | Sargun | rooly, what? |
| 07:49.33 | neopwn | Sargun: already been done |
| 07:49.37 | rooly | why does uboot start the kernel in debug mode by default |
| 07:49.44 | Sargun | neopwn, ? Link ? |
| 07:49.50 | neopwn | sec |
| 07:50.14 | Sargun | I've taken out towers before (well, not completely, but took out a chunk of capacity) |
| 07:50.32 | Sargun | cdm |
| 07:50.44 | slaxxin | http://www.neopwn.com/store.php |
| 07:50.56 | neopwn | meh - google |
| 07:50.56 | neopwn | David Hulton |
| 07:51.31 | neopwn | slaxxin: yah - getting ready to update that now that its the weekend |
| 07:51.35 | neopwn | sec |
| 07:52.13 | *** join/#openmoko chouchen_ (n=chatzill@125.115.161.21) |
| 07:52.26 | neopwn | btw... funny how many ppl try to ftp brute for a filesystem that isnt on there :p |
| 07:53.04 | slaxxin | so why can we not buy ? |
| 07:55.52 | neopwn | because |
| 07:55.52 | rooly | night |
| 07:56.52 | neopwn | 1 = no time for the current sales cycle - 2 = can't tell you |
| 07:57.16 | neopwn | there will be an OSS release soon tho |
| 07:58.11 | *** join/#openmoko PloenK (n=tscholz@gw-ka-01-ext.vpn.ploenk.net) |
| 07:59.27 | *** join/#openmoko gecco (n=carlo@host13-147-static.12-87-b.business.telecomitalia.it) |
| 07:59.32 | gecco | good morning |
| 08:03.43 | cdm | Sargun? |
| 08:04.15 | Sargun | cdm, where are ou |
| 08:05.17 | cdm | physically? |
| 08:12.09 | *** join/#openmoko madwoota (i=mad@woota.net) |
| 08:12.54 | *** join/#openmoko ShadowHatesYou (i=shadow@tourian.jchost.net) |
| 08:13.19 | Dave | mentally? :P |
| 08:15.20 | Wonka | temporally? |
| 08:16.05 | Dave | :D |
| 08:16.54 | *** join/#openmoko DocScrutinizer (n=jr@118-166-67-1.dynamic.hinet.net) |
| 08:18.08 | cdm | Metaphysically? |
| 08:21.30 | *** join/#openmoko richy (n=Richy@77.23.96.1) |
| 08:21.49 | Dave | Alright, that's enough existentialism for one night. :p |
| 08:28.37 | *** join/#openmoko pleemans (n=toi@d54C2AAB7.access.telenet.be) |
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| 08:32.52 | orzo | mwester: i was able to make a call by restarting frameworkd and dbus and using a cli-framework command to register |
| 08:33.01 | orzo | so your kernel is fine |
| 08:33.08 | orzo | which i guess you knew :P |
| 08:36.54 | Sargun | cdm, no, physically |
| 08:36.56 | Sargun | like the bay area? |
| 08:40.30 | *** join/#openmoko tsdogs (n=tsdogs@net70-17.metalit.net) |
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| 08:48.47 | PBeck | ahoi |
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| 08:55.41 | orzo | ./gllin: line 10: lib/ld-linux.so.2: not found |
| 08:55.51 | orzo | gllin apparently doesnt work on SHR |
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| 08:58.27 | Sargun | orzo, buy a GTA02 |
| 08:58.39 | orzo | no |
| 08:58.52 | orzo | i hear its less that great too |
| 08:59.47 | *** join/#openmoko swc|666 (n=swc|666@unaffiliated/swc666/x-4934821) |
| 09:00.06 | *** join/#openmoko wildnux (n=wildnux@cpe-76-187-113-188.tx.res.rr.com) |
| 09:00.12 | Sargun | better than a GTA01 |
| 09:00.53 | wildnux | any one using qtextended here? i have problem getting keyboard at password text box in webpag |
| 09:01.01 | cdm | Sargun -- yep. Been here since I did my stint at Apple. |
| 09:03.17 | Sargun | cdm, ewww, you're an apple employee. |
| 09:03.48 | vininim | lol at alarm waking phone and not ringing |
| 09:04.05 | *** join/#openmoko mbuf (n=shakthim@94.191.174.3.bredband.tre.se) |
| 09:04.10 | cdm | sure -- one of the first people working on iPhone. |
| 09:06.44 | Sargun | oh, you should have killed the team in the beginning |
| 09:08.42 | cdm | hehehe |
| 09:08.45 | cdm | it's a great product. |
| 09:08.52 | cdm | still use mine... |
| 09:08.56 | cdm | not much longer though. |
| 09:12.11 | cdm | Got something else to use soon... |
| 09:14.41 | swetland | ship ship ship! |
| 09:16.28 | cdm | hehehehe |
| 09:16.34 | cdm | damn right! |
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| 09:37.47 | polz | orzo: it works for me. Did you install the latest gllin from the .ipk ? |
| 09:38.09 | *** join/#openmoko baze (n=baze@g227019172.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 09:38.31 | orzo | i have now |
| 09:38.38 | orzo | and then i also needed to run fso-gpsd |
| 09:39.01 | orzo | and set +np in /etc/defaults/gllin |
| 09:41.20 | *** join/#openmoko laen (n=laen@82-197-201-24.dsl.cambrium.nl) |
| 09:42.52 | swc|666 | man wtf happened to gpsd :s |
| 09:43.36 | swc|666 | but dbus zwns |
| 09:44.12 | beni | morning |
| 09:44.17 | beni | how can i listen to mp3? |
| 09:44.35 | swc|666 | A note to OM: QWERTY / RAM [256+} / A NON-BULLSHIT WLAN CARD | BATTERY TO POWER IT ALL!!!!!!!!! |
| 09:44.49 | *** join/#openmoko esthar (n=esthar@student164-247.hampshire.edu) |
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| 10:00.14 | beni | could it be that headphones dont work? |
| 10:02.23 | kamathln | Are there any plans to ship openmoko with keyboard ? |
| 10:02.34 | kamathln | s/openmoko/freerunner |
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| 10:07.00 | beni | if i plug in my headset, the speakers wont go off |
| 10:11.51 | azaghal | Hm... Maybe trying to fiddle with alsamixer a bit? |
| 10:12.34 | *** join/#openmoko CIA-24 (n=CIA@208.69.182.149) |
| 10:12.57 | beni | azaghal: already did |
| 10:13.02 | beni | and it should not be a hardware thingy |
| 10:13.14 | beni | since the same headphones worked with 2007. |
| 10:13.19 | azaghal | Ah |
| 10:13.26 | beni | its a sony ericson headset |
| 10:13.41 | beni | i f i plugged that in on 2007.X it turned of the speakers |
| 10:13.50 | beni | but now i dont hear anything |
| 10:13.55 | beni | ah |
| 10:14.09 | *** join/#openmoko walkie__ (n=walkie@ppp85-140-50-235.pppoe.mtu-net.ru) |
| 10:14.11 | beni | if i plug out the headphone a bit (jack half inserted) it works |
| 10:14.15 | beni | i hear audio on the headset |
| 10:14.19 | beni | but still the speakers are on |
| 10:14.20 | beni | :( |
| 10:18.33 | *** join/#openmoko bentob0x (n=laurent@ip-213-49-64-162.dsl.scarlet.be) |
| 10:27.28 | beni | GREAT |
| 10:27.30 | beni | found it |
| 10:27.36 | beni | alsamixer |
| 10:28.07 | azaghal | Told you so ;) |
| 10:28.33 | beni | <Amp Spk> == Speaker out on/off and <Amp Stat> == Headphones on/off |
| 10:29.00 | beni | if i now put the headphone jack in fully, i hear music |
| 10:29.35 | beni | hm no, not exactly |
| 10:29.45 | beni | <Amp Stat> = ON |
| 10:30.01 | beni | now i can swith using <Amp Spk> if the audio goes to speaker or headphones |
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| 10:35.05 | KaZeR | hi there. i'm testing latest OM with 2.6.28 kernel from andy-tracking but my sd card doesn't mount.. is it a known issue? |
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| 10:41.43 | beni | azaghal: however the autodetect and switch to headphones" does not work. |
| 10:43.30 | azaghal | beni: This is what gets emitted on dbus when I plug them in (I'm on Debian atm, though) - (dbus.String(u'HEADSET'), dbus.String(u'pressed'), dbus.Int32(0)) |
| 10:43.42 | beni | dont know |
| 10:43.44 | beni | im not that deep in |
| 10:43.45 | beni | ;) |
| 10:43.57 | beni | just dont know if i should file a bug or not |
| 10:44.15 | *** join/#openmoko zedstar (n=john@fsf/member/zedstar) |
| 10:44.48 | *** join/#openmoko kamathln (n=lax@122.167.148.76) |
| 10:44.52 | azaghal | beni: http://pastebin.com/d4e7b8356 - try running this and plugging in the headphones, see if it outputs something :) |
| 10:45.21 | beni | roger sir |
| 10:45.22 | *** join/#openmoko mgww_ (n=mgww@193.170.135.167) |
| 10:46.38 | beni | azaghal: |
| 10:46.41 | beni | root@benis-gta02v6:~# ./test.audioswitch.py |
| 10:46.41 | beni | Traceback (most recent call last): |
| 10:46.41 | beni | <PROTECTED> |
| 10:46.41 | beni | <PROTECTED> |
| 10:46.41 | beni | ImportError: No module named gobject |
| 10:46.56 | beni | unplug: nothing happens, this is from replug |
| 10:47.00 | azaghal | Well, that module's not installed on the image :/ |
| 10:47.11 | beni | ok, where to grab, how to install |
| 10:47.12 | beni | ? |
| 10:49.34 | azaghal | beni: cat /dev/input/event0 - see if it spits out some garbage when you plug in/out. |
| 10:50.12 | *** join/#openmoko everslick (n=clemens@212-183-113-50.adsl.highway.telekom.at) |
| 10:51.26 | beni | will do |
| 10:51.31 | azaghal | Anyway, something should be listening to key presses on the device, just no idea where it is :) |
| 10:51.47 | azaghal | I'm still getting familiar with Neo as well ;) |
| 10:52.13 | *** join/#openmoko kamathln (n=lax@122.167.139.148) |
| 10:52.41 | *** join/#openmoko d-b (n=alias@203-214-148-113.perm.iinet.net.au) |
| 10:52.42 | beni | azaghal: OU="E¢CIE¢CI²" IN="K¢CIæ"K¢CI" |
| 10:52.48 | beni | however thats really cryptic |
| 10:52.51 | beni | but there are events |
| 10:53.01 | beni | it looks like they are not catched somewhere |
| 10:53.09 | azaghal | Ok, so it works - no idea what's listening to it, though. |
| 10:53.56 | beni | yes |
| 10:54.05 | beni | i also dont know what reads that |
| 10:54.12 | beni | maybe just some software is missing |
| 10:54.16 | beni | i think i file a bug |
| 10:54.43 | azaghal | Check if the bug has been filed already, though. |
| 10:58.02 | beni | di that found notinh |
| 10:59.49 | *** join/#openmoko sebbs (n=sebbs@66.Red-83-33-178.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net) |
| 10:59.57 | sebbs | aww pingu is not playable |
| 11:02.24 | beni | azaghal: thanks for your help |
| 11:06.11 | *** join/#openmoko Mirrakor (n=linuser@p57B2EF28.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 11:06.28 | Mirrakor | Do I really want a Freerunner? |
| 11:07.07 | beni | azaghal: where can i get that gobject py module? |
| 11:07.08 | max_posedon | Mirrakor, no, you don't |
| 11:07.14 | Mirrakor | why not? :P |
| 11:07.15 | beni | i think this info will be helpful in the bug ticket |
| 11:07.30 | azaghal | Mirrakor: Depends on whether you want a phone or not :D |
| 11:07.39 | max_posedon | Mirrakor, because you are still asking, and haven't it yet. |
| 11:07.42 | *** join/#openmoko Hire (n=hire@host50-53-dynamic.40-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 11:07.45 | Mirrakor | hehe |
| 11:08.27 | Mirrakor | I've got an old Nokia 3410 (monochrom thingy :) ), now I'm wondering.. I mean this thing is sooo cool, but it's quite expensive if you already have a working phone :D |
| 11:08.28 | azaghal | I got dissappointed at first by the state of software, but now I'm a bit more positive once I've seen the FSO capabilities on Debian :) |
| 11:08.43 | azaghal | Mirrakor: Don't expect it to work too well (yet) :) |
| 11:09.08 | Mirrakor | I'm used to OSS :P |
| 11:09.22 | azaghal | Well, then buy it. |
| 11:09.24 | max_posedon | Mirrakor, if you want a phone for everyday use - neo isn't for you. |
| 11:09.28 | azaghal | Or wait for GTA03 |
| 11:09.50 | max_posedon | but if you want phone for "everyday programming" - neo is the bes) |
| 11:09.53 | max_posedon | *best |
| 11:10.14 | Mirrakor | hm.. are there plans for a model with a camera? |
| 11:10.21 | azaghal | Yep, GTA03 |
| 11:10.26 | azaghal | At least according to wiki. |
| 11:10.29 | *** join/#openmoko badcloud (n=bla@ti400720a342-0283.bb.online.no) |
| 11:11.37 | sebbs | Mirrakor: i had a old nokia |
| 11:11.43 | sebbs | Mirrakor: or the n958gb |
| 11:11.51 | Mirrakor | An Asus Eeepc is cheaper :D |
| 11:11.54 | sebbs | i am in the switch to RF |
| 11:12.03 | sebbs | FR |
| 11:12.11 | *** join/#openmoko emsyr (n=emsyr@ppp079166081193.dsl.hol.gr) |
| 11:12.15 | sebbs | i dont like the eeepc |
| 11:12.37 | sebbs | anyway, i think this phone fits me alot better then the n95 |
| 11:12.50 | sebbs | the n95 had really good hardware (like 5mp camera etc) |
| 11:13.02 | sebbs | but for me, the FR is alot better |
| 11:13.06 | Mirrakor | I don't have one at all :D |
| 11:13.10 | sebbs | software wise there is a loooong way to go |
| 11:13.14 | *** join/#openmoko ecraven (n=nex@140.78.42.103) |
| 11:13.25 | sebbs | if you think you will be happy with a working phone you wont |
| 11:13.32 | Mirrakor | Well, but if the GTA03 has this hardware feature, I might wait |
| 11:13.35 | ecraven | how is fso for phone/text? |
| 11:14.04 | sebbs | Mirrakor: i would recomend you to wait unless you really really want a terminal and are willing to give up on a camera and all the "cool new" web2.0 stuff |
| 11:14.31 | sebbs | ecraven: i dont know ive not tried fso yet |
| 11:14.31 | vininim | buy gta02 |
| 11:14.39 | vininim | and then buy gta03 |
| 11:14.39 | Mirrakor | nah, I don't need web 2.0, but a camera would be nice I think - not for real pictures I got my real camera for that but for snapshots |
| 11:14.49 | sebbs | vininim: everybody dont have the money |
| 11:14.51 | vininim | the proper way to do it, imho |
| 11:14.56 | leinirAWAY | And for barcodes and other such things ;) |
| 11:14.58 | sebbs | vininim: yes it is though |
| 11:15.00 | sebbs | leinirAWAY: haha |
| 11:15.05 | sebbs | barcodes are a joke |
| 11:15.10 | badcloud | vininim, why? |
| 11:15.10 | sebbs | they works very well but nobody is using them |
| 11:15.39 | sebbs | i acctually think barcodes could be the shit if people started using them, cos you wont ever need to write a url on your phone which is pretty neat |
| 11:15.53 | Mirrakor | :D |
| 11:15.56 | vininim | badcloud: you'll die sometime in the next 100 years (I'm not that faithfull with science) and this plan will make you spend more time with a hackable phone |
| 11:16.11 | sebbs | haha |
| 11:16.49 | sebbs | would be such a cool thing if a person solved like a nobel prize thing on a openmoko |
| 11:16.54 | *** join/#openmoko thrashold (n=europan@3mhz.net) |
| 11:17.09 | sebbs | he was on the buss and started coding on something and it ends up solving cancer or something |
| 11:17.13 | sebbs | that will be the day |
| 11:17.14 | ecraven | what are the specs for gta03? and the eta? |
| 11:17.17 | *** join/#openmoko sleipnir (n=Sleipnir@p4FDD4ACC.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 11:17.18 | vininim | see, one more reason to buy gra02 |
| 11:17.23 | sebbs | ecraven: they are on the wiki |
| 11:17.29 | vininim | cure to cancer! |
| 11:17.30 | sebbs | ecraven: ETA what i heard is 6 months |
| 11:17.33 | sebbs | but i would not trust that |
| 11:17.35 | Mirrakor | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/GTA03 |
| 11:17.54 | sebbs | opensource == almost never on time |
| 11:18.02 | *** join/#openmoko badcloud_ (n=bla@ti400720a342-0283.bb.online.no) |
| 11:18.08 | badcloud_ | vininim, word |
| 11:18.09 | sebbs | except the really anal peoples code its always done on time |
| 11:18.21 | ecraven | nice, no more glamo |
| 11:18.26 | badcloud_ | but as was said before, not everyone has the dough |
| 11:18.29 | ecraven | will the graphics bus be faster / non-shared? |
| 11:18.43 | sebbs | pingu laggs on my phone :( |
| 11:18.52 | sebbs | on my n95 i had quake3 |
| 11:19.08 | sebbs | it worked _very_ well except the loading times |
| 11:19.33 | badcloud_ | what's the processor on the n95? |
| 11:19.39 | sebbs | A9 |
| 11:19.41 | sebbs | 2 dual core i think |
| 11:19.46 | sebbs | around 200mhz |
| 11:19.50 | sebbs | and 128 ram |
| 11:19.55 | sebbs | it should be doable |
| 11:20.12 | badcloud_ | sounds feesable |
| 11:20.39 | sebbs | it has a 3dcard though |
| 11:20.41 | sebbs | which is pretty slick |
| 11:20.49 | sebbs | http://www.javasymbian.com.ar/2008/11/quake-iii-symbian-s60-v3-fp1-tutorial.html |
| 11:20.49 | *** join/#openmoko alephnull (n=alok@122.167.87.139) |
| 11:21.06 | sebbs | just midlets |
| 11:21.09 | sebbs | i think |
| 11:21.12 | badcloud_ | wouldn't it be wild if they could base the 03 on the beagleboard? |
| 11:21.36 | sebbs | i think this phone needs a hardware keyboard |
| 11:22.02 | sebbs | like the new n97 has both, i think its pretyy nice hardware design |
| 11:22.32 | sebbs | but i am supprised by the size of the screen and some aspects of FR too, its alot better then i though |
| 11:22.53 | sebbs | i dont wanna play quake3 on the phone though, i just need a z interpreter |
| 11:22.56 | sebbs | and im all set |
| 11:23.05 | sebbs | perhaps scummvm cos this phone has touchscreen |
| 11:23.06 | vininim | z wat |
| 11:23.21 | sebbs | z interpreter |
| 11:23.25 | sebbs | zmachine |
| 11:23.32 | sebbs | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Z-machine |
| 11:23.52 | sebbs | i wanna play BOFH again been too long |
| 11:23.52 | *** join/#openmoko badcloud (n=bla@ti400720a342-0283.bb.online.no) |
| 11:24.10 | badcloud | achhh, my ir keyboard keeps bugging on me |
| 11:24.19 | sebbs | my main issue now is whether i should use debian/gentoo or if i should help out on openmoko |
| 11:24.30 | sebbs | (compiling packages) |
| 11:24.40 | badcloud | I'm not sure how great a hw keyboard would be on the fr |
| 11:24.51 | badcloud | would add a bit of bulk |
| 11:25.01 | sebbs | depends on how you build it |
| 11:25.05 | sebbs | but your fear is valid |
| 11:25.11 | badcloud | and/or reduce the screen size |
| 11:25.18 | sebbs | ? why |
| 11:25.37 | badcloud | blackberry style keyboards take up almost have the height of the device |
| 11:25.50 | sebbs | no no not like that |
| 11:25.56 | sebbs | lemmie find you a example |
| 11:26.08 | badcloud | so, more like HTC? |
| 11:26.10 | leinirAWAY | n810 style slider keyboard? |
| 11:26.25 | sebbs | http://www.which.co.uk/media/images/in-content/nokia-n97-white-keyboard-163584.jpg |
| 11:26.30 | sebbs | like that would be nice i think |
| 11:26.41 | thrashold | sebbs: scummvm ran for year ago with OM2007, but it was crashing. Now I'm using Debian and its unusable (no screen rotation), but it doesn't crash. I had problems with finding all packages for OpenMoko, and compiling them myself was a PITA. Debian has them all, ScummVM included. |
| 11:26.43 | sebbs | another keyboard layout though |
| 11:27.14 | ecraven | thrashold: i used Xfbdev on debian, then you have rotation |
| 11:27.17 | sebbs | thrashold: yea, im gonna install debian on my phone today i think, just too many packages i am dependant on, i want mutt and wyrd and stuff |
| 11:27.22 | *** join/#openmoko zash__ (n=zash@zash.se) |
| 11:27.25 | vininim | boy, if it gets a keyboard I can see people recommeding operating the phone throught dbus calls |
| 11:28.18 | sebbs | i would really like a hardware keyboard, cos if something gets "stuck" like you have a SDL game or whatever and it takes your keyboard away from you |
| 11:28.19 | badcloud | sebbs, like I said before, bulk |
| 11:28.20 | thrashold | ecraven: Will try this, too, at some point. I had rotation with xglamo there, but it's crashing for me. :) |
| 11:28.21 | sebbs | your screwed |
| 11:28.33 | Mirrakor | btw. what happens if the chinese people copy the phone? :D |
| 11:28.35 | sebbs | badcloud: that is a design issue, but again i see your point |
| 11:28.38 | ecraven | thrashold: rotation with xglamo never worked well for me, but that was 4 months ago |
| 11:28.44 | sebbs | Mirrakor: then weird things will happend |
| 11:28.56 | thrashold | sebbs: Hm, you would need the keyboard to get out of Monkey Island's copy protection, too :D |
| 11:29.00 | *** join/#openmoko bluelightning (n=blueligh@pdpc/supporter/active/bluelightning) |
| 11:29.02 | badcloud | why not just carry around a thin rollup? |
| 11:29.10 | sebbs | thrashold: hehe |
| 11:29.15 | sebbs | and quit some games |
| 11:29.22 | vininim | sebbs: doesn't even need to be a game, epdf fullscreen gets you stuck |
| 11:29.33 | sebbs | vininim: yeah, that sucks hard |
| 11:29.43 | thrashold | Not to mention save them. :) |
| 11:29.43 | Mirrakor | sebbs: honestly, the development team will lose valuable income, won't they? |
| 11:29.45 | badcloud | or a foldup bt keyboard |
| 11:29.52 | vininim | but it's a software |
| 11:29.55 | sebbs | Mirrakor: why? |
| 11:30.10 | sebbs | badcloud: btkeyboard == battery |
| 11:30.16 | vininim | associating aux button to main menu or application close, like android does |
| 11:30.30 | *** join/#openmoko spydon (n=spydon@h208n5c1o1036.bredband.skanova.com) |
| 11:30.34 | badcloud | right, but I think it's a small price to pay for sleekness |
| 11:30.36 | Mirrakor | sebbs: I don't know the current businessmodel, but don't the development team gets their income from selling those phones? |
| 11:30.41 | sebbs | vininim: hmm, or like a (hold 5 seconds to get into the menu) |
| 11:31.20 | sebbs | ah Mirrakor yes i think so, i dont know really either, ive not read up on it very much, but i have head the same thing you are saying |
| 11:31.45 | sebbs | s/head/heard |
| 11:32.22 | sebbs | badcloud: http://content.zdnet.com/2347-9595_22-253451-253463.html?seq=8 |
| 11:32.29 | sebbs | badcloud: its not very bulky |
| 11:33.58 | sebbs | anyway, terminal is good enough for me and that raster keyboard has the button on thetop to make it appear |
| 11:34.03 | sebbs | its good enough for me |
| 11:34.14 | *** join/#openmoko cga (n=cga@94.36.88.11) |
| 11:38.17 | *** join/#openmoko edistar_ (n=edistar@ip503ddd09.speed.planet.nl) |
| 11:41.24 | *** join/#openmoko azaghal (n=azaghal@91.148.115.39) |
| 11:42.31 | gecco | i have release the version 0.4.1 of TwitterMoko http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/TwitterMoko |
| 11:43.12 | *** join/#openmoko loca| (n=tux@196.203.53.221) |
| 11:43.45 | *** join/#openmoko badcloud_ (n=bla@ti400720a342-0283.bb.online.no) |
| 11:43.57 | badcloud_ | god, I f-ing hate wm2003 |
| 11:44.26 | badcloud_ | if I got a dime for every soft reset, I'd buy you all a round of FR's |
| 11:44.35 | *** join/#openmoko jonsmith1982 (n=jon@82-38-88-58.cable.ubr01.donc.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 11:45.50 | gecco | buy a freerunner... :) |
| 11:46.32 | Wonka | wtf is "wm2003"? |
| 11:46.33 | badcloud_ | windows mobile |
| 11:46.41 | Wonka | aah! the bad word! |
| 11:47.07 | badcloud_ | sorry |
| 11:47.50 | Wonka | :) |
| 11:48.18 | badcloud_ | I'm waiting on the 03 for some features, and I guess I'm paying the price :) |
| 11:48.45 | Wonka | i have the gta02 and am cursing on some stuff... |
| 11:48.55 | Wonka | seems some dbus messages take ages sometimes |
| 11:49.02 | badcloud_ | yikes |
| 11:49.04 | Wonka | gps related ones |
| 11:49.16 | Wonka | sometimes they arrive in fractions of seconds |
| 11:50.06 | Wonka | sometimes, after rxerrs on the gps serial device, they arrive after minutes - with luck it catches up (messages for 5 seconds in one), but sometimes not |
| 11:50.15 | *** join/#openmoko ARZEJ (n=user@dgd127.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl) |
| 11:50.17 | Wonka | still looking into that |
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| 12:10.41 | DocScrutinizer | Dave: >:-( no kerneldriver for my new umts-stick |
| 12:11.47 | DocScrutinizer | Dave: probably have to use Eee as a router for my laptop ;-) |
| 12:17.23 | sebbs | does qtopia have a terminal? |
| 12:17.30 | *** join/#openmoko DerHorst (n=Horst@e176107162.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 12:18.18 | *** join/#openmoko Openfree (n=df@222.65.143.118) |
| 12:23.45 | *** join/#openmoko TAsn (n=tasn@89.1.41.59.dynamic.barak-online.net) |
| 12:25.26 | *** join/#openmoko jonkristian (n=jonkrist@15.84-48-197.nextgentel.com) |
| 12:25.36 | gecco | badcloud_: 03? do you want to wait a lot o years? :) |
| 12:26.16 | *** join/#openmoko reinouts (n=reinout@s559355fe.adsl.wanadoo.nl) |
| 12:26.16 | SpeedEvil | <PROTECTED> |
| 12:28.54 | *** join/#openmoko billk (n=billk@203-206-82-197.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 12:29.05 | *** join/#openmoko baze (n=baze@g227019172.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 12:30.02 | *** join/#openmoko lawn (n=mower@h19n1fls32o1017.telia.com) |
| 12:31.39 | sebbs | what does moko mean |
| 12:31.50 | sebbs | such weird thing to pronounce |
| 12:31.50 | sebbs | moko |
| 12:32.09 | Weiss | sebbs: one hypothesis is "mobile communicator" |
| 12:32.09 | mjr | mobile kommunications, or somesuch thing |
| 12:32.19 | sebbs | hehe |
| 12:32.25 | sebbs | oh that makes sense |
| 12:32.31 | sebbs | moco though |
| 12:32.38 | Weiss | just like GTA is supposed to sort-of mean "GNU Telephony Appliance" |
| 12:32.47 | sebbs | ah |
| 12:33.02 | sebbs | nice to get uptodate on OM lingo ;) |
| 12:33.21 | *** join/#openmoko TAsn (n=tasn@85-250-167-73.bb.netvision.net.il) |
| 12:35.32 | gecco | pronunciation in italian language is good :) |
| 12:36.24 | sebbs | alas i do not speak italian |
| 12:36.44 | gecco | :) |
| 12:37.07 | *** join/#openmoko ericthefish (n=ivan@82-71-36-214.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk) |
| 12:37.49 | sebbs | ^^ i live with a italian though |
| 12:37.55 | sebbs | so i get points for that |
| 12:39.14 | *** join/#openmoko billk (n=billk@203-206-82-197.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 12:41.36 | badcloud_ | gecco, you're joking, right? |
| 12:41.39 | badcloud_ | years?? |
| 12:42.29 | *** join/#openmoko The_Osterhase (n=unknown@6.233.80.212.static.versanetonline.de) |
| 12:43.38 | *** join/#openmoko Wiedi (n=wiedi@newton-air.w.fruky.net) |
| 12:43.38 | badcloud_ | educated guesses of time of arrival for 03? |
| 12:44.04 | *** join/#openmoko ayeuu (n=ayeuu@80.125.173.55) |
| 12:44.24 | badcloud_ | I mean, I personally could do without a camera, but something about not having video out, any resolution, is reason enough for me to wait |
| 12:47.15 | badcloud_ | or would any guess be just a shot in the dark? |
| 12:47.27 | SpeedEvil | shot in the dark |
| 12:48.06 | SpeedEvil | I would personally be astonished at 6 months |
| 12:48.06 | badcloud_ | right |
| 12:48.22 | badcloud_ | but is there anyway to use an external display without cracking and hacking the hardware? |
| 12:48.56 | badcloud_ | *cracking the case open, I mean |
| 12:48.56 | SpeedEvil | no |
| 12:49.00 | badcloud_ | bugger |
| 12:49.06 | SpeedEvil | Well - USB1.1, and VNC or similar |
| 12:49.19 | *** join/#openmoko jas4711 (n=jas@c80-216-27-189.bredband.comhem.se) |
| 12:50.15 | SpeedEvil | or bluetooth display - but AFAIK, those don't exist |
| 12:51.01 | badcloud_ | sounds like setting up vnc would be quite a hassle |
| 12:51.01 | soltys | na #openmoko-cdevel potruc Ainulindale czy komus albo na liste shr namazac |
| 12:51.01 | soltys | ;P |
| 12:51.01 | soltys | czy cos |
| 12:51.05 | soltys | ups sorry bad channel |
| 12:52.37 | SpeedEvil | badcloud_: it depends - it's not really bad IME. |
| 12:53.44 | badcloud_ | in that case you would need a guest box |
| 12:53.59 | badcloud_ | so it's not pure expansion |
| 12:54.01 | SpeedEvil | badcloud_: or an xterm |
| 12:54.06 | badcloud_ | right |
| 12:54.28 | badcloud_ | but you do see my point |
| 12:54.35 | SpeedEvil | Sure. |
| 12:54.58 | SpeedEvil | The fundamental problem is that unless the SoC supports it, you're not getting an external display. |
| 12:55.08 | badcloud_ | yup |
| 12:55.42 | *** join/#openmoko apol (n=apol@84.78.178.63) |
| 12:55.49 | ecraven | does angstroem use glibc? or can it switch to dietlibc or uclibc? |
| 12:56.02 | *** join/#openmoko xyzzy (n=xyzzy@77.95.8.34) |
| 12:56.04 | badcloud_ | I'm sure it will be quite a while for cell phones to be as periferally expansive as say, beagleboard |
| 12:56.04 | SpeedEvil | Also, for other than composite (tv) out, you have teh _major_ problem of the massive connector |
| 12:56.38 | SpeedEvil | For composite out, you can use the USB with an adaptor. |
| 12:56.52 | badcloud_ | doesn't sound too bad |
| 12:56.54 | SpeedEvil | Though even that costs $1 or so on the BOM of the phone. |
| 12:57.25 | SpeedEvil | Probably $2 on the price |
| 12:57.25 | badcloud_ | BOM? |
| 12:57.25 | badcloud_ | even though composite out is almost at the bottom of the barrel, no? |
| 12:57.26 | billk | badcloud_: something like http://www.usbgear.com/USB-Video-Card.html (result of a quick google!) |
| 12:57.28 | SpeedEvil | badcloud_: price |
| 12:57.34 | SpeedEvil | bii: USB2 only |
| 12:57.37 | badcloud_ | thanks |
| 12:57.50 | *** join/#openmoko chouchen (n=chatzill@125.115.160.190) |
| 12:58.00 | SpeedEvil | badcloud_: Bill Of Materials. The USB/video switch and associated components will cost at least $1 |
| 12:58.22 | badcloud_ | right |
| 12:58.34 | badcloud_ | "at least"... I like that |
| 12:58.46 | *** join/#openmoko sindre (n=sindre@212251182058.customer.cdi.no) |
| 12:59.11 | SpeedEvil | $1-$2 - it depends on details |
| 13:00.10 | badcloud_ | what about PAL NTSC compatibility? |
| 13:00.20 | SpeedEvil | That again depends on the SoC |
| 13:00.29 | badcloud_ | gotcha |
| 13:00.37 | SpeedEvil | It's probable - certain - if it supports on it'll support the other tho |
| 13:01.14 | SpeedEvil | But any other solution - such as a HDMI - or miniturised HDMI or VGA or ... connector is right out |
| 13:01.18 | Wonka | i want usb displayport adapters |
| 13:01.34 | SpeedEvil | It will add at the very least $5 to the price, and be prone to damage. |
| 13:02.23 | *** join/#openmoko Deubeuliou (n=david@AFontenayssB-151-1-69-60.w81-48.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 13:02.39 | SpeedEvil | As far as I understand it, USB2 is required for all display adaptors |
| 13:02.58 | badcloud_ | so how is it that composite would fly on 1.1? |
| 13:02.58 | SpeedEvil | And the SoC chosen putatively for GTA03 does not support USB2 |
| 13:03.04 | SpeedEvil | It doesn't. |
| 13:03.22 | SpeedEvil | you have a little switch that selects either video or USB, and routes it through the connector |
| 13:03.35 | SpeedEvil | one pin video, one sound |
| 13:03.59 | badcloud_ | is it something that has to be configured manually? |
| 13:04.19 | badcloud_ | or can you make the switch via terminal |
| 13:04.26 | SpeedEvil | it's software |
| 13:04.41 | badcloud_ | sounds almost promising then |
| 13:05.04 | Wonka | i've seen cameras with s-video via 3.5mm connector |
| 13:05.12 | SpeedEvil | Wonka: that too |
| 13:05.24 | SpeedEvil | Wonka: the headset adaptor can be fitted with a similar switch |
| 13:05.31 | badcloud_ | naaah |
| 13:05.33 | badcloud_ | wow |
| 13:05.39 | Wonka | eeeh... the headset connector should output audio |
| 13:05.45 | Wonka | video needs to be parallel to that |
| 13:06.12 | Wonka | instant presentation device! just connect to TV with adaptor cables! |
| 13:06.15 | SpeedEvil | headset could output L+R, and the video on the mic |
| 13:06.28 | Wonka | oh, okay, yes |
| 13:06.29 | viq | just add water! ;) |
| 13:06.33 | badcloud_ | ok, now you're just fucking with me |
| 13:06.36 | Wonka | would not be s-video then, but who cares? |
| 13:07.07 | Wonka | the connector will have GND, L, R, MIC anyway, nor? |
| 13:07.17 | *** join/#openmoko Isajha (n=Isajha4@wrzb-4d00cf6a.pool.mediaWays.net) |
| 13:07.23 | *** join/#openmoko kW (n=kW@unaffiliated/kw) |
| 13:07.45 | *** part/#openmoko xyzzy (n=xyzzy@77.95.8.34) |
| 13:08.24 | badcloud_ | but in all seriousness |
| 13:08.31 | kW | Hello... are there any rumors on the amount of RAM of the GTA03? |
| 13:08.39 | badcloud_ | if I can get even composite, I'm buying one |
| 13:09.17 | badcloud_ | can you give me a non-joking answer? |
| 13:09.53 | SpeedEvil | badcloud_: I would be astonished if GTA03 had composite out. |
| 13:10.01 | SpeedEvil | badcloud_: it's a very minority feature. |
| 13:10.03 | Wonka | me too |
| 13:10.24 | ronny | hmm |
| 13:10.27 | badcloud_ | so the whole usb->composite business=complete bull? |
| 13:10.29 | Wonka | i know some mobiles have such stuff... |
| 13:10.35 | ronny | my charger went missing |
| 13:10.43 | Wonka | 3.5mm to cinch |
| 13:10.56 | Wonka | ronny: charge on your PC then? |
| 13:11.01 | *** join/#openmoko kirun (n=kirun@78-86-140-200.zone2.bethere.co.uk) |
| 13:11.02 | SpeedEvil | kW: Practically. It's going to be at least 6 months, probably a year. Dueing that period, pin compatible variants of the SoC will be introduced with differing ROM and RAM. |
| 13:11.21 | SpeedEvil | kW: these can easily be slotted into the new phone, at the last minute. |
| 13:11.38 | SpeedEvil | badcloud_: no, it's an in principle what could happen on a phone, given current tech. |
| 13:11.47 | ronny | Wonka: i want to charge it as fast as possible, its allmost deep-discharged and it kinda sucks to have that charger lost anyway |
| 13:11.57 | ronny | hmm |
| 13:11.58 | SpeedEvil | badcloud_: there are existing parts to do this switching, and it's done on some phones already. |
| 13:12.13 | Wonka | ronny: mmh |
| 13:12.22 | SpeedEvil | kW: 128M RAM at least is safe to say, I wouldn't be surprised at 256M |
| 13:12.37 | kW | SpeedEvil: I see... it looks like my freerunner is suffering from RAM shortage... |
| 13:12.39 | badcloud_ | ok, so you weren't yanking my chain |
| 13:12.46 | *** join/#openmoko tick35 (n=tick@118-168-105-172.dynamic.hinet.net) |
| 13:12.48 | SpeedEvil | No. |
| 13:12.51 | kW | SpeedEvil: that is, if I have tangogps running, I can barely run anything else due to "swapping" |
| 13:12.57 | badcloud_ | good to know |
| 13:13.05 | kW | (that is, re-loading program code from flash) |
| 13:13.12 | badcloud_ | that's all I need. I'm bloody getting one |
| 13:13.20 | ronny | hmm |
| 13:13.21 | SpeedEvil | GTA03 is at the moment - I get the impression - a CPU dev board, probably not shaped like a phone |
| 13:13.41 | ronny | i really dont think that gta02 is short of ram |
| 13:13.59 | ronny | but the programs are bloated |
| 13:14.06 | SpeedEvil | I personally found swapon of help on GTA01 |
| 13:14.10 | SpeedEvil | onto the SD |
| 13:14.17 | kW | SpeedEvil: or do you know whether there would be a big-RAM-version of the freerunner? Like with 1GB? RAM is so cheap nowadays... |
| 13:14.22 | Wonka | i am thinking about getting a generic 5V PSU capable of more than 1A and then building adaptor cables for GTA02 and/or this usb dvd burner (which seems to need more than 500mA) |
| 13:14.26 | azaghal | Has anyone been playing with making deb packages for illume? |
| 13:14.27 | kW | SpeedEvil: I see |
| 13:14.31 | kW | I should try this |
| 13:14.31 | SpeedEvil | kW: cheapness of RAM isn't so much the issue |
| 13:14.35 | ronny | if a mobile phone needs swap, something has gone wrong |
| 13:14.40 | SpeedEvil | kW: you absolutely can't put a SIM in tehre. |
| 13:14.41 | kW | SpeedEvil: is it energy consumption? |
| 13:14.43 | SpeedEvil | ronny: I know. |
| 13:14.46 | Wonka | azaghal: not me, but if you find some, tell me please! ;) |
| 13:14.49 | kW | SpeedEvil: sure |
| 13:15.02 | SpeedEvil | kW: the CPU and the RAM and the ROM are all together in the same chip, that comes from samsung. |
| 13:15.02 | leinirAWAY | ronny: Good thing the freerunner isn't a phone, then ;) |
| 13:15.06 | azaghal | Wonka: I'm thinking of trying to build it myself - the wm is really great for this kind of device :) |
| 13:15.12 | SpeedEvil | kW: probably about 14mm*14mm*2mm |
| 13:15.13 | leinirAWAY | It's a low-power computer with a GSM chip ;) |
| 13:15.18 | kW | SpeedEvil: I see |
| 13:15.48 | ronny | leinirAWAY: its a fscking smartphone, not next supercomputer |
| 13:15.52 | Wonka | azaghal: i like e and illume, but e17 is only in experimental and illume is not there at all |
| 13:16.09 | SpeedEvil | kW: and you're largely stuck with what samsung will supply you, unless you want to make your own modules, which is quite possible - but will cost a fair bit to setup. Also - there is a cost. Suspend-RAM power use depends on installed RAM |
| 13:16.13 | azaghal | True. But the pull-down menu on top is great. |
| 13:16.13 | leinirAWAY | ronny: who said supercomputer? i said, specifically, low-powered computer - note the difference :) |
| 13:16.29 | azaghal | illume-keyboard is also great. |
| 13:16.34 | *** join/#openmoko Stroller (n=Stroller@213-152-39-89.dsl.eclipse.net.uk) |
| 13:16.44 | leinirAWAY | Run Qt Extended, it's a smartphone. Run Debian, it's a computer. Everything in between them, up for debate ;) |
| 13:16.52 | azaghal | As for e17 being experimental, well, that'll always be the case it seems :P |
| 13:17.07 | ronny | its mainly build as a phone |
| 13:17.32 | azaghal | Actually, GSM on Freerunner looks just like an extra to me currently :) |
| 13:17.40 | kW | SpeedEvil: I see... could there be something like half-hibernation? Like, swap userspace memory to SD such that just 128MB are remaining, and then switch off all the memory cells except the first 128MB? |
| 13:17.52 | ronny | and i think it was a major stupid misstake to put desktop stacks on it in the first place |
| 13:17.56 | SpeedEvil | kW: yes, that can be done in some cases |
| 13:18.10 | SpeedEvil | ronny: I disagree. |
| 13:18.20 | SpeedEvil | ronny: 2/400MHz is _fast_. |
| 13:18.26 | SpeedEvil | ronny: if you pick the right software. |
| 13:18.38 | SpeedEvil | And don't go with crap like alpha blending or transparancy. |
| 13:18.39 | ronny | desktop stacks are bloated |
| 13:19.00 | SpeedEvil | ronny: pick a window manager and toolkit that's nice and fast on a pentium 100, and you're golden. |
| 13:19.44 | ronny | mostly cause desktop developers get away with too much crap these days |
| 13:19.54 | kW | SpeedEvil: when you talk about speed, can you recommend a software setup|distribution which is really responsive? |
| 13:20.04 | SpeedEvil | kW: not that's on OM at the moment |
| 13:20.11 | SpeedEvil | kW: I mean running on the hardware. |
| 13:20.13 | ronny | fast cpus and shitloads of ram are a curse if you want them to write efficient crap |
| 13:20.18 | kW | SpeedEvil: I see |
| 13:20.23 | kW | what a pity ;-) |
| 13:20.40 | SpeedEvil | kW: I just mean that it's comparable to a pentium 100MHz, or a 200MHz for GTA02 |
| 13:20.45 | kW | because I like the freerunner, but it is more sluggish in speed than the old motorola accompli from the year 2001 or so |
| 13:20.57 | SpeedEvil | And you can have nice fast window managers on those at 640*480 unaccellerated. |
| 13:21.08 | *** join/#openmoko pluto (n=pranshug@59.95.67.58) |
| 13:21.17 | lindi- | kW: i use icewm |
| 13:21.20 | SpeedEvil | So (barring the glamo issue), it's not a problem in principle. |
| 13:21.48 | SpeedEvil | You just will find it slugs if you try to do fancy crap like alpha blending, or too much animation, or ... |
| 13:21.55 | kW | lindi-: do you have a functioning phone (address book, call list, calling, ...) under icewm? |
| 13:22.10 | ronny | im being more & more sad that i actually brought a freerunner |
| 13:22.20 | *** part/#openmoko pluto (n=pranshug@59.95.67.58) |
| 13:22.24 | SpeedEvil | :/. |
| 13:22.37 | lindi- | kW: icewm is my window manager, it does not care about those |
| 13:23.00 | lindi- | kW: i use a simple python program as my call UI |
| 13:23.08 | ronny | SpeedEvil: there was tonns of time, but the software stack is still a pile of major pain causes |
| 13:23.17 | lindi- | kW: the address book is just a text file i can edit with text editor |
| 13:23.22 | SpeedEvil | ronny: stacks :/ |
| 13:23.51 | ronny | to me it seems like most of the history of the software stacks for openmoko is a series of major missdecissions |
| 13:23.53 | kW | lindi-: so you are not "fast" in selecting a contact and calling a number of that contact (not due to program slowness, but due to amount of manual steps involved...)? |
| 13:24.46 | lindi- | kW: i am |
| 13:24.53 | ronny | SpeedEvil: i would be much less disappointed if i hand asked a few years ago why they use slow gtk instead of e and they did spend a few more years in gtk fail before actually switching to e |
| 13:25.00 | lindi- | kW: the phone UI does automatic completion based on the phonebook |
| 13:25.15 | lindi- | kW: http://iki.fi/lindi/openmoko/kapula.png |
| 13:25.18 | ronny | s/hand/hadnt/ |
| 13:25.41 | ronny | is there a way to disable that bot for me? |
| 13:25.41 | sebbs | kW: zphone |
| 13:25.52 | ronny | apt: !ignore me |
| 13:25.57 | kW | lindi-: nice :-) |
| 13:26.49 | kW | sebbs: I can't find a zphone homepage, what is zphone? |
| 13:26.56 | lindi- | zhone |
| 13:26.58 | SpeedEvil | gtk isn't that slow. |
| 13:26.59 | sebbs | ah |
| 13:27.02 | sebbs | my bad |
| 13:27.05 | *** join/#openmoko Varox (n=Varox@p4FD479D3.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 13:27.10 | sebbs | im still new to this ;) |
| 13:27.47 | ronny | SpeedEvil: gobject, gtk, gdk , cairo & co arent exactly efficient - compared to e it is that slow |
| 13:28.15 | sebbs | kW: i forgot the url |
| 13:28.25 | SpeedEvil | By not slow, I mean, it's quite fast enough on my PII/300 laptop, which is of a comparable speed. |
| 13:28.30 | kW | sebbs: I found a zhone page |
| 13:28.38 | sebbs | nice |
| 13:28.40 | sebbs | oh a |
| 13:28.48 | sebbs | is it debian related? |
| 13:28.53 | SpeedEvil | A well designed phone has nice high contrast pages, with little animation IMO. |
| 13:28.59 | SpeedEvil | But, I may be alone on this :/ |
| 13:29.22 | sebbs | kW: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Zhone |
| 13:30.47 | kW | sebbs: so you would recommend FSO as distribution... is it more responsive than FDOM? |
| 13:30.59 | *** join/#openmoko tjikkun_ (n=tjikkun@195-240-122-237.ip.telfort.nl) |
| 13:31.05 | sebbs | no i am not recomending anything just pointing you to documentation |
| 13:31.37 | kW | sebbs: okay |
| 13:31.42 | sebbs | i am new to this phone and the distrubutions that come along with it. i am not in a postition to recommend anything as of yet. |
| 13:31.56 | sebbs | ;) got the phone 2 days ago |
| 13:32.10 | sebbs | but my point was |
| 13:32.16 | sebbs | you can run debian and zhone on it |
| 13:32.24 | sebbs | thus you have the stuff you where wondering about |
| 13:33.13 | sebbs | who stable it is i dont know. but as it says in the docs "Since it mainly only sends commands over dbus to the daemons that actually do the work it is rather stable and even able to do multitasking like allowing you to read an SMS whilst using the phone." i would give it a try if i wanted a phonebook and whatever you asked for |
| 13:33.17 | ronny | SpeedEvil: im not happy with "fast enoug" |
| 13:33.22 | sebbs | s/who/how/ |
| 13:33.34 | sebbs | aww thanks apt *pets apt on the head* |
| 13:33.45 | ronny | base toolkits should be *really fast* |
| 13:34.49 | sebbs | apt: why arent you packaged for openmoko installing all your stuff into a /opt folder or whatever |
| 13:34.58 | apt | why not? |
| 13:35.24 | sebbs | logical error mr bot |
| 13:35.59 | sebbs | why indeed would have been a more neutral awnser. |
| 13:36.20 | sebbs | does anyone know what kind of bot apt is? |
| 13:36.32 | sebbs | infobot |
| 13:36.39 | sebbs | *googles* |
| 13:38.03 | kW | apt: who are you? |
| 13:38.04 | apt | kW: what are you talking about? |
| 13:38.10 | sebbs | hehe |
| 13:38.15 | kW | apt: you. |
| 13:38.16 | apt | [apt] apt, or kinky. A Pretty_Cool Tool. APT package handling utility -- command-line interface |
| 13:38.39 | sebbs | Pretty_Cool[tm] |
| 13:38.48 | kW | ah... not very informformative... |
| 13:39.00 | *** join/#openmoko almien (n=almien@87-194-198-122.bethere.co.uk) |
| 13:39.03 | sebbs | it comes with factpacks |
| 13:39.24 | sebbs | admin |
| 13:39.29 | sebbs | i dont now how to use it though |
| 13:39.32 | sebbs | @admin |
| 13:39.36 | sebbs | it should have jargons |
| 13:39.52 | sebbs | they look pretty funny/informative |
| 13:40.53 | sebbs | banana problem => n. [from the story of the little girl who said "I know how to spell `banana', but I don't know when to stop"]. Not knowing where or when to bring a production to a close (compare {fencepost error}). One may say `there is a banana problem' of an algorithm with poorly See: banana problem2 |
| 13:46.02 | *** join/#openmoko esthar (n=esthar@student164-247.hampshire.edu) |
| 14:03.34 | sebbs | yay i am using all my ram |
| 14:03.43 | sebbs | An error ocurred, return value: 2. |
| 14:07.55 | *** join/#openmoko salman (n=salman@81.22.19.190) |
| 14:08.17 | salman | greetings |
| 14:08.54 | sebbs | ho ho ho salman |
| 14:09.13 | salman | there haven't been any new distribution image since a long time... I am eager to try the developments :-) |
| 14:10.10 | beni | hi there |
| 14:10.11 | beni | alsa again |
| 14:10.12 | *** join/#openmoko valos[fr] (n=valos@mar92-6-82-227-150-198.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 14:10.15 | mwester | You should install Qi! It's seems to be the latest craze. (for no really good reasons, but...) |
| 14:10.26 | beni | with earphones i only have sound on the right speaker |
| 14:10.34 | beni | in alsa everything is on "stereo" etc |
| 14:11.17 | sebbs | beni: is feels so weird to change volumes in alsamixer on my phone |
| 14:11.35 | sebbs | i mean doing it on a phone |
| 14:11.55 | salman | mwester: you mean qt> |
| 14:11.56 | beni | well there is a mixer app but that dont display all values |
| 14:12.00 | *** join/#openmoko Cervajz (n=Cervajz@62.245.91.25) |
| 14:12.19 | mwester | salman: no, qi -- the bootloader. |
| 14:12.21 | sebbs | no i like it |
| 14:12.36 | mwester | (and no, don't take me seriously - don't install it!) |
| 14:12.57 | sebbs | i do alot of playing around with audio, i love the fact that i can install jack on my phone |
| 14:13.10 | sebbs | im gonna have years of fun with this |
| 14:13.36 | beni | so, then you could easily fix my problem :) |
| 14:13.43 | beni | im sure it is only a alsa state problem |
| 14:14.49 | sebbs | i dont get why i have muted the speakers but there is still sound coming out |
| 14:14.53 | sebbs | beni: whats your issue |
| 14:15.12 | sebbs | oh |
| 14:15.24 | sebbs | sound in your right speaker only |
| 14:15.25 | beni | i only hear sound on the right side of my earphones |
| 14:15.27 | *** join/#openmoko kirsch (n=kirsch@p5DCE5CC0.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 14:15.35 | sebbs | yea there is a slider for that |
| 14:15.45 | kirsch | hi all |
| 14:15.46 | sebbs | right <-> left |
| 14:15.59 | kirsch | python doesnt find the "string" module, is this a bug? |
| 14:16.00 | sebbs | i dont know how to access it from alsamixer though, i never touch it |
| 14:16.06 | kirsch | i also installed python-misc |
| 14:16.22 | sebbs | gnome-volume-control ive seen it in, but not alsamixer, but they are both backends to one command |
| 14:16.29 | beni | sebbs: ok, where can i find that slider then? |
| 14:16.29 | sebbs | frontends |
| 14:16.32 | kirsch | the "string" module should be in the standart library |
| 14:16.35 | sebbs | wait a sec |
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| 14:17.27 | beni | i have om2009.X testing |
| 14:17.38 | beni | and that mixer app |
| 14:18.15 | sebbs | beni: ah |
| 14:18.17 | sebbs | its amixer |
| 14:18.32 | sebbs | it will tell you about the % on right and left speaker |
| 14:18.37 | beni | yes |
| 14:18.39 | sebbs | look at it and check if they are correct or not |
| 14:18.41 | beni | i have 74 each |
| 14:19.02 | beni | in "headphone" |
| 14:19.13 | sebbs | hmm |
| 14:19.18 | sebbs | then its prolly notthat |
| 14:19.19 | beni | maybe it causes probs that the mp3 playing is stereo? |
| 14:19.29 | beni | but well, again that should only be a mixer issue |
| 14:19.32 | sebbs | how would that be a prob? |
| 14:19.47 | sebbs | the device allowes stereo |
| 14:19.55 | beni | ah ok |
| 14:20.20 | sebbs | hmm have you tried with other headphones? |
| 14:20.27 | sebbs | perhaps you jack is faulty |
| 14:20.32 | sebbs | your |
| 14:20.54 | sebbs | mine break all the time |
| 14:21.32 | beni | the jack is ok |
| 14:21.37 | beni | it works with 2007.9 installed |
| 14:21.43 | sebbs | ok |
| 14:22.20 | sebbs | if the volume balence is ok then i dont know |
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| 14:22.36 | sebbs | you could try flicking over to mono sound, perhaps try something other then alsa |
| 14:22.51 | sebbs | i mean use somthing ontop of it |
| 14:22.54 | sebbs | like jack |
| 14:23.01 | sebbs | it wont fix your problem though |
| 14:23.02 | beni | switching the "stereo" stuff to "mono" does not work either :( |
| 14:23.16 | sebbs | strange though, what are you running? |
| 14:23.18 | sebbs | 2008.9? |
| 14:23.26 | beni | 2008.X testing |
| 14:23.29 | beni | upgraded today |
| 14:23.48 | sebbs | im running that and its working fine, my problem is that its playing though the speaker evne though the speaker is set to mute in alsamixer |
| 14:23.51 | sebbs | :) |
| 14:24.32 | *** join/#openmoko fo (n=alias@203-214-148-113.perm.iinet.net.au) |
| 14:24.38 | sebbs | i keep getting ram issues when my 128 fill up |
| 14:24.58 | sebbs | i think i need to add swapping |
| 14:25.01 | lindi- | sebbs: what consumes all that? |
| 14:25.12 | sebbs | lindi-: well different things |
| 14:25.19 | sebbs | i guess i could not run as much |
| 14:25.24 | sebbs | but basically supercollider |
| 14:25.49 | lindi- | sebbs: $ ps -eorss,cmd|sort -n|nc paste.dyndns.org 1234 |
| 14:25.50 | lindi- | http://rafb.net/p/lOFpJL97.html |
| 14:26.15 | sebbs | its not running now though |
| 14:26.26 | *** join/#openmoko vaiursch (n=erwin@84-75-29-96.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 14:26.44 | DocScrutinizer | if amp is switched to speaker mode, there's audio only in one headset-channel |
| 14:27.51 | DocScrutinizer | speakermode isn't supposed to be active as long as a headset jack is inserted |
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| 14:28.21 | Mirrakor | hm.. the GTA04 is even better than GTA03 :D |
| 14:28.34 | sebbs | Mirrakor: duh? |
| 14:28.38 | sebbs | ^^ |
| 14:28.50 | DocScrutinizer | alsactl restore /user/share..../stereoheadset.state |
| 14:28.52 | mwester | I'll bet the GTA05 is better still! |
| 14:28.59 | *** join/#openmoko d-b (n=alias@unaffiliated/d-b) |
| 14:29.00 | Mirrakor | you know I thought about waiting for the GTA03 and now I figured out I'd have to wait even longer :D |
| 14:29.01 | sebbs | i wonder what they will do at GTA99 |
| 14:29.16 | Mirrakor | btw. are there any pictures of the GTA03? |
| 14:29.20 | sebbs | s/at/after |
| 14:29.21 | DocScrutinizer | or gsmheadset.state, uh and the other is stereoheadphones i guess |
| 14:29.59 | mwester | sebbs: Maybe by then they'll have a working phone stack. |
| 14:29.59 | DocScrutinizer | Mirrakor: there's no gta03, so how could there be a photo ? |
| 14:30.10 | Mirrakor | yeah, but I thought they already figured out the design? |
| 14:30.27 | DocScrutinizer | we're still about to do that ;-) |
| 14:31.21 | sebbs | mwester: maybe not |
| 14:31.28 | mwester | a) start with gta02. b) throw gta02 into the nearest river, if environmentally acceptable, of course c) start again with designing the gta03 based on the gta01 this time. :-D |
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| 14:31.54 | DocScrutinizer | mwester: that's ot fair :-D |
| 14:31.59 | DocScrutinizer | not |
| 14:32.05 | sebbs | when i get the gta03 i will use my gta02 as a weapon against crime |
| 14:32.36 | mwester | I'm going to frame it. When the book comes out about what *REALLY* led to the decision to use the glamo, then it'll be a collector's item. :P |
| 14:32.39 | sebbs | perhaps for crime, depending on what my personality will look like when the gta03 comes out |
| 14:32.55 | SpeedEvil | DocScrutinizer2: the 'hardware' is basically a SoC dev-board, not actually shaped as a phone ATM? |
| 14:32.58 | sebbs | naw gta01 i can think will be a collecters item but not 02 u think? |
| 14:32.58 | DocScrutinizer | already works like this, tricks thiefs into stealing objects they can't use or get rid of ;-D |
| 14:33.20 | sebbs | :) would be funny if someone stole it and was not able to use it |
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| 14:33.26 | sebbs | but its not very hard to use |
| 14:33.32 | mwester | sebbs: Evil has it's own collectors. I think there will be a market for the gta02 |
| 14:33.42 | sebbs | mwester: ah true ^^ |
| 14:33.49 | sebbs | i have a nintendo 8bit and 30 games |
| 14:33.58 | sebbs | i even gots the orange gun and duckhunt |
| 14:34.03 | sebbs | bang bang |
| 14:34.14 | SpeedEvil | If I was buying electronics stuff, I'd pay ~$80 for a GTA01/2 |
| 14:34.26 | SpeedEvil | just without concrete stuff to do with it. |
| 14:34.33 | mwester | But seriously -- the gta01 lacks some features, but it is remarkable in stability. I find my gta01 is the better phone with almost all the phone software distros. |
| 14:34.39 | SpeedEvil | Mainly as a handy embedded thing |
| 14:34.39 | sebbs | ill give my daughter my 02 when if i get a daughter one day |
| 14:34.55 | SpeedEvil | mwester: I agree, unfortunately. |
| 14:35.25 | mwester | SpeedEvil: It's a very nice embedded device indeed. With a usb hub and an external power source, it's a very capable little ARM device. |
| 14:35.40 | sebbs | i dont know what the gta01 has, i wanted to buy one but it was out of stock by the time i came down off my high and ordered one. |
| 14:35.49 | DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvil: you mustn't be THAT cruel on your kids ;) |
| 14:36.03 | SpeedEvil | sebbs: basically the same as GTA02 - but one more speaker, no wifi, more sane graphics. |
| 14:36.12 | mwester | sebbs: there haven't been many 01's on eBay either. |
| 14:36.13 | sebbs | no wiki :O |
| 14:36.19 | sebbs | wifi |
| 14:36.20 | sebbs | haha |
| 14:36.25 | DocScrutinizer | ahh, sorry. sebbs |
| 14:36.29 | almien | DocScrutinizer "the good news is, it can do anything. the bad news is you have to write the software to make it do anything"? |
| 14:36.33 | sebbs | thats kinda crap |
| 14:36.45 | sebbs | wifi is the single most importnat thing on this phone |
| 14:36.51 | SpeedEvil | sebbs: err... |
| 14:36.52 | mwester | Yeah, but who needs wifi? We've not had wifi until just a few days ago (Werner fixed it, I think)... |
| 14:36.54 | sebbs | that is what makes it a weapon against crime |
| 14:37.11 | sebbs | wifi on a phone with cron == leathal weapon |
| 14:37.11 | SpeedEvil | sebbs: BEING A WORKING PHONE WITH DECENT BATTERY LIFE is the most important thing. |
| 14:37.17 | sebbs | bah |
| 14:37.20 | sebbs | its not for me |
| 14:37.22 | sebbs | ;D |
| 14:37.38 | mwester | SpeedEvil: You are correct. It is most unfortunate that there are some at Om who do not share that understanding of the device! |
| 14:37.41 | DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvil: I prefer BEING HAPPY :-) |
| 14:37.58 | sebbs | for me its that i can run mutt+wyrd+cron+bash+vi+mc+awk+sed+yaawns+screen |
| 14:38.32 | sebbs | + receive phone calls when i have to, and make them if im near dying |
| 14:38.41 | sebbs | i have 2 batterys so its no biggy for me |
| 14:38.53 | lindi- | sebbs: yaawns? |
| 14:38.55 | SpeedEvil | I don't see what's so hard about all this. |
| 14:39.03 | sebbs | and the battery time is still alot better then my old nokia |
| 14:39.09 | SpeedEvil | I wrote the entire UI for my phone in about 10 minutes. |
| 14:39.13 | sebbs | lindi-: i yawned while i was writing |
| 14:39.19 | lindi- | SpeedEvil: same here |
| 14:39.24 | lindi- | sebbs: ah :) |
| 14:39.26 | mwester | As I've said many times -- make *every* Om employee use the gta01 or 2 as their *only* phone and data comm device for day-to-day use, and we would see this nonsensical kernel-chasing go away, we would see a maniacal focus on the remaining issues, and we would see a phone stack with the basic functionality -- probably within a few weeks. |
| 14:39.30 | SpeedEvil | (Admittedly, it has one button, and dials one number only, with no display.) |
| 14:39.36 | sebbs | lindi-: :) hehe |
| 14:39.58 | sebbs | i wish it had a keyboard so i could quit simon the sorcerer when playing |
| 14:40.06 | lindi- | mwester: that's a good recipe for me at least |
| 14:40.09 | sebbs | now i have to ssh to my phone from the computer or restart it |
| 14:40.20 | lindi- | mwester: i have backup phone that logs all incoming calls so i can call back if i miss a call |
| 14:40.38 | lindi- | mwester: but the display and speaker of the backup phone do not work reliably so i can't really answer the calls with it |
| 14:40.40 | DocScrutinizer | away. Mwester is in mood to kick people - I don't need ;-) |
| 14:40.56 | Mirrakor | ah, who needs money anyway? with a smartphone that cool :o |
| 14:41.01 | mwester | DocScrutinizer doesn't like to hear the truth when it is spoken. |
| 14:41.35 | sebbs | if you really need a phone why not just use qtopia |
| 14:41.45 | *** join/#openmoko dwb (n=david@72-11-234-10.static-ip.telepacific.net) |
| 14:41.50 | Mirrakor | I don't need a phone, that's my problem :D |
| 14:41.53 | Mirrakor | I got a phone :D |
| 14:41.55 | *** join/#openmoko jserv-- (n=jserv@118-169-97-2.dynamic.hinet.net) |
| 14:42.05 | mwester | But, hey -- when I've invested hundreds and hundreds of hours of my time debugging stuff the Om should have fixed but ignored, I figure I have a right to point out the issues. |
| 14:42.09 | sebbs | i have not had any problems with getting calls |
| 14:42.30 | sebbs | but then again i do most of my communication though email |
| 14:42.36 | *** join/#openmoko [-zeno-] (n=zeno@host3-33-dynamic.6-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 14:42.41 | mwester | heh! I even have suggestions to fix the issues -- Om just doesn't want to hear it. |
| 14:42.42 | SpeedEvil | counts out mwesters wages for his time. |
| 14:42.52 | SpeedEvil | makes that 954 peanuts. |
| 14:42.53 | sebbs | mwester: really? |
| 14:43.00 | SpeedEvil | Now, where should I send them? |
| 14:43.07 | [-zeno-] | hi all |
| 14:43.10 | mwester | eagerly looks forward to buying lunch with the wages one earns on open source! |
| 14:44.39 | beni | DocScrutinizer: well, none of the state files in /usr/share/openmoko/scenarios/ work here |
| 14:44.40 | SpeedEvil | http://b3ta.com/questions/gullible/post226247 utter, utter genius |
| 14:44.49 | SpeedEvil | oops |
| 14:44.59 | SpeedEvil | mischan, and not commentary on openmoko |
| 14:45.00 | beni | /usr/share/openmoko/scenarios/headset.state works like mine settings |
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| 14:48.33 | kirsch | when i try to install a python thing via setuptools, i get the following error "error: invalid command 'build_py'" |
| 14:48.36 | kirsch | any ideas? |
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| 15:04.10 | d-b | hi there -> my phone lately has 0 battery |
| 15:04.23 | d-b | is there a bug related to charging the phone? |
| 15:04.42 | *** join/#openmoko cesarb (n=cesarb@wikipedia/cesarb) |
| 15:07.16 | lindi- | d-b: which kernel? |
| 15:08.37 | d-b | it would be an old one |
| 15:08.46 | d-b | i have to update my phone its way old |
| 15:09.01 | lindi- | you don't know what kernel you run? |
| 15:09.06 | d-b | lindi-: if i use the debian 2.6.24 it should charge right ? |
| 15:09.13 | d-b | lindi-: the stock om 2008.9 one |
| 15:09.15 | lindi- | d-b: yeah |
| 15:09.35 | lindi- | d-b: i don't know what kernel that has |
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| 15:13.04 | sirkha_top | anyone know how/why pushing the button for a few seconds won't suspend the freerunner, using FSO milestone 4? |
| 15:15.41 | d-b | well its not showing the blue / orange light which it used to -> when i have it on power |
| 15:15.56 | lindi- | d-b: that is not very reliable indicator at all |
| 15:16.05 | d-b | lindi-: yes i know |
| 15:16.35 | lindi- | d-b: run http://iki.fi/lindi/openmoko/energy-logger2 |
| 15:16.45 | d-b | lindi-: wil l do |
| 15:16.58 | lindi- | and as normal user, not root |
| 15:17.08 | d-b | lindi-: why not as root btw ? |
| 15:17.21 | lindi- | d-b: since it is experimental |
| 15:17.23 | *** join/#openmoko uzi18 (n=uzi@gfb34.internetdsl.tpnet.pl) |
| 15:17.24 | d-b | oh ok |
| 15:17.30 | d-b | well my orange light came on |
| 15:17.37 | d-b | and its charging |
| 15:17.49 | lindi- | energy-logger2 should not change anything |
| 15:18.04 | lindi- | unless you have binaries named usbhost-start :) |
| 15:18.05 | d-b | lindi-: yeah that happened before |
| 15:18.08 | d-b | the script i ran after |
| 15:18.14 | d-b | (the light came one) |
| 15:18.16 | d-b | on* |
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| 16:23.40 | DocScrutinizer | beni: seems to be a hw-problem then |
| 16:23.52 | DocScrutinizer | probably hs |
| 16:24.42 | igor321 | beagleboard playing hd video, 10% cpu utilisation: http://felipec.wordpress.com/2008/12/12/gst-openmax-demo-on-the-beagleboard/ |
| 16:25.36 | DocScrutinizer | lindi-: ll - as nrmal user *is* root on fr |
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| 16:25.40 | DocScrutinizer | lol |
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| 16:26.08 | lindi- | DocScrutinizer: not here |
| 16:26.15 | DocScrutinizer | igor321: sounds like good gfx-core then |
| 16:27.01 | igor321 | DocScrutinizer: yeah, it has an dsp core, really happy with it |
| 16:27.12 | DocScrutinizer | :-) |
| 16:27.13 | igor321 | for $150 it does _a lot_ |
| 16:27.24 | DocScrutinizer | yup |
| 16:28.08 | SpeedEvil | wishes it was suitable for a phone. |
| 16:28.20 | SpeedEvil | And 1/10th of the price. |
| 16:28.35 | igor321 | why isn't it suitable for a phone? |
| 16:28.51 | DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvil: plug in a umts-stick which has no drivers beyond xy.ko for debian |
| 16:28.54 | SpeedEvil | Power consumption I think. |
| 16:29.06 | SpeedEvil | Also dimensions, and stuff. |
| 16:29.16 | SpeedEvil | Sure, you can make a brick-phone :) |
| 16:29.45 | igor321 | SpeedEvil: nah, the soc is really small, what makes the board "big" are the connectors and some hdmi stuff |
| 16:29.46 | DocScrutinizer | I for one love more a pandora-brick |
| 16:29.56 | SpeedEvil | igor321: that too |
| 16:30.01 | igor321 | well the beagle and pandora have the same soc |
| 16:30.09 | SpeedEvil | igor321: Obviously the core could be made lots smaller. |
| 16:30.19 | igor321 | and i was under the impression that pandora is more energy conservative than gta02 |
| 16:30.42 | SpeedEvil | igor321: energy conservation is almost unimplemented on FR/GTA01 |
| 16:30.47 | DocScrutinizer | not much of a surprise, as pandora got no gsm-modem |
| 16:31.01 | igor321 | yeah, but still |
| 16:31.28 | mwester | Isn't the beagleboard based on the OMAP? |
| 16:31.30 | DocScrutinizer | well, need some TPE nightlive now |
| 16:31.35 | SpeedEvil | mwester: yes |
| 16:31.36 | igor321 | mwester: yes it is |
| 16:31.38 | mwester | has very good power management. |
| 16:31.58 | mwester | of course,the problem is the *other* chips... |
| 16:32.12 | igor321 | well both the omap and the samsung 6410 are very powerful chips |
| 16:32.21 | DocScrutinizer | ducks away as mwester is entering the discussion once more |
| 16:32.22 | DocScrutinizer | bye |
| 16:32.26 | SpeedEvil | wave. |
| 16:32.34 | igor321 | wish there was some kind of comparison though |
| 16:32.46 | igor321 | bencharmark if you will |
| 16:32.51 | igor321 | *chmark |
| 16:33.08 | mwester | thinks it's probably good that DocScrutinizer ducks away, if he's just gonna make trouble some more ;-) |
| 16:33.22 | Dave | :p |
| 16:33.47 | Dave | EvilDoc |
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| 16:39.41 | DocScrutinizer | goes to celar fetching the railgun |
| 16:40.07 | DocScrutinizer | own design, controlled by GTA02 ;-) |
| 16:40.23 | DocScrutinizer | GTA04-prototype |
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| 16:41.09 | mwester | **loves** the railgun. |
| 16:41.25 | SpeedEvil | mwester: yes. 200mm cannon, mounted on rails ++ |
| 16:41.45 | [Rui] | waves |
| 16:42.00 | mwester | I was thinking more along the lines of the Quake version of railgun, not the "railway gun" |
| 16:42.03 | mwester | :p |
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| 16:43.48 | SpeedEvil | Meh. |
| 16:45.19 | kirsch | does anyone know in which opkg package i can find all the libc headers? |
| 16:45.36 | kirsch | assert.h, stdio.h, .... |
| 16:47.20 | beni | DocScrutinizer: it was the headset |
| 16:47.27 | beni | incompatible sony ericson |
| 16:47.43 | beni | now i got one that works, so i can listen to music tomorrow |
| 16:47.45 | DocScrutinizer | beni: glad to hear that |
| 16:47.51 | beni | on my nice train ride (7 hours) |
| 16:47.58 | DocScrutinizer | :-) |
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| 16:53.51 | kirsch | kirsch: libc6-dev |
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| 17:23.11 | sebbs | now i have a cronjob that plays "don't worry, be happy" every workday at 9am. |
| 17:23.50 | viq | Or you could put "death is the only way out" from mortal kombat ;) |
| 17:24.06 | sebbs | ive not played mortal combat for ages |
| 17:24.13 | sebbs | sub zero wins |
| 17:24.17 | sebbs | flawless victory |
| 17:24.22 | sebbs | finish him |
| 17:24.30 | sebbs | that game rawks |
| 17:24.32 | viq | Well, it was from a movie ;) |
| 17:24.34 | viq | hehe |
| 17:24.54 | sebbs | i dont remember that song though |
| 17:25.01 | sebbs | im thinking about the intro |
| 17:25.13 | sebbs | mortalcombat 1 |
| 17:25.21 | viq | I think it was from the 2nd movie |
| 17:25.38 | sebbs | i never was fond of the movies |
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| 18:29.52 | Pyrasi | hi all |
| 18:30.29 | jc | hello |
| 18:30.42 | Pyrasi | if I was looking to install navit on my debian install....is there a package set up for that somewhere? I heard mention of a new navit package...but im not sure where to find it |
| 18:31.02 | jc | dunno |
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| 18:44.30 | jc | lol ext2 code for qi is stolen from grub |
| 18:44.43 | Dave | so? :p |
| 18:44.52 | jc | so nothing, good to see familiar code :) |
| 18:45.26 | jc | btw. calling a dead loop 'unhappy' is so funny :) |
| 18:45.49 | jc | I'll start doing that too :) |
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| 18:47.30 | jc | nice code |
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| 18:56.44 | sebbs | 19:45 < jc> btw. calling a dead loop 'unhappy' is so funny :) |
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| 18:56.46 | sebbs | lol |
| 18:56.47 | sebbs | yes |
| 18:57.48 | jc | I will sooo sjmp unhappy in all my avr code from now on :)) |
| 18:58.31 | jc | dammit I got it confused again, I meant rjmp |
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| 19:22.10 | mwester | jc: we call that "re-use", not "stolen" in this industry -- and we reward developers for it! :P |
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| 19:23.37 | jc | mwester if its GPL and they don't mind then whatever ;) |
| 19:23.51 | jc | I use avr-usb too |
| 19:23.57 | mwester | Well, yes, there are rules... :D |
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| 19:24.17 | jc | writing everything from scratch is crazy |
| 19:25.07 | jc | the qi code is pretty good but I'd add a possibility to compile without the serial console stuff since its useless for people without debug boards |
| 19:25.56 | jc | some #ifdefs to dummy out the debugging functions for nops or something |
| 19:26.22 | jc | also the jtag detection is useless for us :) |
| 19:27.44 | SpeedEvil | debug over GPRS. It's the only way. |
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| 19:28.05 | SpeedEvil | SMS-console. |
| 19:28.15 | mwester | jc: why? |
| 19:29.01 | jc | mwester we can't hook to jtag because we can't unscrew the proprietary screws |
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| 19:29.05 | mwester | tries to imagine the difference 30 microseconds might make in the init, or how 100 bytes of flash might be useful? |
| 19:29.21 | SpeedEvil | jc: torx is _not proprietory_. |
| 19:29.28 | Mirra | mwester: oh it is :) |
| 19:29.31 | SpeedEvil | mwester: but it's all got to be optimised! |
| 19:29.31 | jc | if you want to make qi as small as possible... |
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| 19:29.42 | mwester | jc: 1 flash block is the smallest useful. |
| 19:29.46 | SpeedEvil | mwester: someone might steal all the flash in the night! |
| 19:29.49 | mwester | smaller than that is a waste of effort. |
| 19:30.26 | mwester | and since it waits a minimum of 300 milliseconds for the uSD card anyway, a few microseconds to init the UART is hardly a problem. |
| 19:30.37 | mwester | so #ifdefs would just clutter the code! |
| 19:30.39 | Mirra | you've to think about the principal and the mass production, if you can use a smaller cpu which only saves you 3 cent per pice, but try it imagine that multiplied by a million |
| 19:30.47 | mwester | Mirra: ? |
| 19:30.53 | SpeedEvil | Mirra: no you don't |
| 19:31.02 | SpeedEvil | Mirra: this code is running on the main CPU |
| 19:31.05 | Mirra | it's the principal :P |
| 19:31.18 | Mirra | ah, sorry - didn't follow the whole conversation |
| 19:31.18 | SpeedEvil | Mirra: any sane bootloader will not tax a CPU capable of running DOOM II at speed. |
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| 19:31.34 | Mirra | :) |
| 19:31.34 | jc | I'd make a global debug def or something that would disable all that stuff |
| 19:31.50 | mwester | jc: Ok, but it's just clutter. |
| 19:32.50 | jc | maybe |
| 19:32.58 | jc | still its a lot smaller than u-boot anyway |
| 19:33.00 | SpeedEvil | And it means more code options and code-paths. |
| 19:33.09 | jc | but I see its currently limited to ext2 so unsuable from the nand, right ? |
| 19:33.11 | mwester | Is it bigger than a single flash block? |
| 19:33.13 | SpeedEvil | You don't want multiple ways for things to go wrong |
| 19:33.34 | mwester | jc: Yes, it cannot read a jffs2 filesystem. |
| 19:33.46 | jc | shame |
| 19:34.00 | mwester | jc: in reality, what would be worth ripping out of it would be all the baloney that handles the uSD card. |
| 19:34.21 | jc | well since it can only be used on usd presently, why do that ? |
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| 19:34.36 | jc | but in future, I agree |
| 19:34.50 | jc | handle as little stuff as possible, only what is necessary to load and execute the kernel |
| 19:34.53 | mwester | jc: It should read in a kernel + initrd from a flash location, if that fails go to a backup location -- then boot that kernel. That kernel should do the job of reading the real rootfs, and booting the real kernel. |
| 19:35.03 | jc | so like setup clocks, memories and thats all |
| 19:35.29 | SpeedEvil | jc: yes. Minimal stuff. Clocks, memories, mpeg-4 boot-animation. |
| 19:35.41 | jc | mwester but that location has to be continuous without errors right ? |
| 19:35.56 | SpeedEvil | jc: no - you just need to understand the ECC |
| 19:35.59 | jc | maybe there could be just a simple badblocks header or something |
| 19:36.01 | mwester | jc: Yep, that's the problem with NAND flash, and where things get ugly real quick. |
| 19:36.35 | jc | SpeedEvil about the animation: seriously hope you were kidding :) |
| 19:36.51 | SpeedEvil | jc: As a simple solution, you might do your own ECC. It's not especially hard. |
| 19:36.53 | mwester | missed the animation bit... |
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| 19:37.17 | SpeedEvil | jc: if you don't care about RAM usage, and you don't. |
| 19:37.26 | mwester | You could even do something like three copies, and vote on each block... |
| 19:37.26 | jc | I got tired of the boots, next time I'm getting pure text :D |
| 19:37.57 | jc | or have kernel in NOR |
| 19:38.03 | jc | which you can't program.. |
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| 19:40.36 | jc | btw. what tools do you use for low level nand access in linux ? |
| 19:40.50 | jc | like erase, read, write, check and stuff |
| 19:41.06 | balrog | mtd-utils i think |
| 19:41.21 | lindi- | jc: nandwrite |
| 19:41.36 | jc | thanks :) |
| 19:42.03 | jc | and has someone done some statistic on how many errors commonly occur and where ? |
| 19:42.17 | lindi- | haven't heard |
| 19:42.33 | SpeedEvil | jc: you don't design like that |
| 19:42.43 | SpeedEvil | jc: you design to teh most paranoid interpretation of the spec. |
| 19:43.05 | jc | SpeedEvil: well I was thinking of this: |
| 19:43.16 | jc | you have for example a 1MB block of nand |
| 19:43.43 | jc | you serch it for a location that has sizeof(error_struct) subsequent good bytes |
| 19:44.06 | SpeedEvil | bytes may go dead randomly |
| 19:44.11 | SpeedEvil | or bits even |
| 19:44.17 | jc | and there you fit your error information header (that says which blocks are bad in your region) |
| 19:45.19 | jc | when writing or even when reading ? |
| 19:45.25 | SpeedEvil | when off |
| 19:45.30 | jc | thats ugly |
| 19:45.38 | SpeedEvil | That's why it's got ECC |
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| 19:46.58 | *** join/#openmoko Simon1 (n=smartel@modemcable253.210-203-24.mc.videotron.ca) |
| 19:50.42 | Simon1 | Hi, I dropped my FreeRunner, and the AUX button stopped working. I opened the device, and found that the switch was loose. Any idea where I could get a replacement switch I could solder in? The "component placement" document show the switch as number SW1501 |
| 19:50.57 | SpeedEvil | The switch is loose, or detached? |
| 19:51.04 | SpeedEvil | rattling around the case? |
| 19:52.08 | Simon1 | The switch wasn't soldered anymore... |
| 19:52.09 | balrog | o_O i thought they were shock-testing the freerunners at the factory |
| 19:52.26 | Simon1 | I guess I droped it one time too many... |
| 19:52.29 | lindi- | Simon1: can you take a few photos of the interior btw? i have not found a torx screwdriver to open mine yet |
| 19:52.40 | SpeedEvil | Simon1: Do you have a soldering iron? |
| 19:52.48 | Simon1 | Well, you can find all the photos you want on the wiki... |
| 19:53.15 | Simon1 | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Disassembling_Neo1973 |
| 19:53.38 | lindi- | Simon1: but that's different device |
| 19:53.38 | SpeedEvil | Simon1: and a DMM? |
| 19:54.01 | Simon1 | The Neo1973 and the FreeRunner are pretty much identical inside... |
| 19:54.02 | sleipnir | is there a way to manually tell the FR to charge? e.g. some /sys magic? |
| 19:54.10 | balrog | lindi-: most of the pics you won't notice a difference |
| 19:54.42 | Simon1 | SpeedEvil; I won't be doing the soldering myself; I don't have the equipment nor the skils to do that... |
| 19:54.45 | balrog | sleipnir: there is, but i can't tell you how right now |
| 19:55.36 | sleipnir | balrog: hmmm i boot my phone over NFS and i think it would be difficult to replug it just to set the charge mode... |
| 19:55.37 | SpeedEvil | Simon1: Look closely at teh switch |
| 19:55.50 | SpeedEvil | Simon1: does it have bits ripped off it, or have the solder joints just sheared? |
| 19:56.19 | Simon1 | The legs are broken... |
| 19:56.30 | SpeedEvil | Simon1: :/ |
| 19:56.44 | SpeedEvil | Simon1: annoyingly the schematic doesn't have part numbers |
| 19:56.48 | SpeedEvil | Simon1: so you can't easily order a new one |
| 19:57.14 | Simon1 | Does the number, SW1501, mean anything at all? |
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| 19:57.50 | SpeedEvil | no |
| 19:58.04 | SpeedEvil | that's just a part number in the schematic |
| 19:59.02 | Simon1 | nice; random numbers :P That's usefull... |
| 20:02.01 | sebbs | i dont like that splash image, is there any way to remove it? |
| 20:04.16 | Simon1 | I guess the part numbers aren't in the CAD files either? |
| 20:04.33 | SpeedEvil | Simon1: those are as far as I know simply ythe |
| 20:04.40 | SpeedEvil | Simon1: the case plastics |
| 20:04.55 | sebbs | are the partnumbers not documented? |
| 20:05.00 | sebbs | that would be weird if they where not |
| 20:05.04 | SpeedEvil | Simon1: digikey.com -> 'online flash catalog' -> look at all the switch |
| 20:05.05 | lindi- | balrog: i would still have appreciated bit higher quality photos that would show the individual chips |
| 20:05.07 | SpeedEvil | es |
| 20:07.51 | balrog | lindi-: i'm sure i've seen some on the wiki |
| 20:08.19 | balrog | sebbs: you can upload a different one |
| 20:08.30 | balrog | flash it onto the "splash" partition |
| 20:08.31 | sebbs | balrog: can i remove it? |
| 20:08.36 | lindi- | balrog: hmm |
| 20:08.42 | sebbs | or i know i can but are there any docs on how |
| 20:08.50 | sebbs | im guessing its not using the normal splash utils |
| 20:08.50 | lindi- | balrog: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Disassembling_Neo1973 for example does hot show what the GSM chip looks like |
| 20:09.05 | balrog | sebbs: hmm, lemme check something |
| 20:09.34 | sebbs | i really just need the name of the splash loader and i should be able to get it myway |
| 20:09.46 | balrog | sebbs: setenv splashimage '' should stop the splash from being loaded at all |
| 20:09.57 | sebbs | thing is debian is not booting up, im just getting that openmoko screen then it whites out. im wondering why |
| 20:10.02 | sebbs | ah sweet |
| 20:10.06 | balrog | sebbs: oh, the one on the rootfs? |
| 20:10.14 | sebbs | yes |
| 20:10.20 | balrog | i thought the u-boot one |
| 20:10.32 | sebbs | oh |
| 20:10.35 | balrog | the debian one should be easier to change but i don't know how :P |
| 20:10.38 | sebbs | no i mean yes the uboot one |
| 20:10.51 | balrog | perhaps remove on of the /etc/init.d/ scripts |
| 20:11.01 | sebbs | im having probs with rootfs installation |
| 20:11.10 | sebbs | and im not getting any debugs on why |
| 20:11.47 | balrog | the u-boot splashscreen doesn't hide any information though |
| 20:12.00 | balrog | as soon as the framebuffer initialises it wipes the image from the screen |
| 20:12.04 | sebbs | ah |
| 20:12.23 | sebbs | i dont mean the u-boot splash screen i acctually dont know which one i mean |
| 20:12.26 | sebbs | the openmoko one |
| 20:12.28 | sebbs | the orange |
| 20:12.35 | sebbs | aftre that one i get a white screen |
| 20:12.38 | sebbs | then the openmoko one again |
| 20:12.40 | sebbs | and over and over |
| 20:12.52 | sebbs | booting from the normal memory works fine though, just not sd |
| 20:13.37 | sebbs | im pretty sure the issue is in the boot loader, but since i cant get a error on why its not working i dont know what to do. ive done what the wiki says, so i guess i will redo it step by step manually instead |
| 20:14.12 | sebbs | openmoko debian had a uboot configuration thingy i wonder how to reset it |
| 20:14.32 | sebbs | im gonna go thorugh the scripts manually instead |
| 20:15.21 | lindi- | sebbs: it does not backup the old menu entries |
| 20:16.04 | sebbs | lindi-: so a reflash is the way to go about it?, ill not do that though, ill let it be, was just wondering |
| 20:16.29 | lindi- | sebbs: reflash of what? |
| 20:16.55 | sebbs | where is the acctual menu entries located? |
| 20:17.07 | sebbs | or nevermind its all in the scripts |
| 20:17.08 | *** join/#openmoko azaghal (n=azaghal@91.148.115.39) |
| 20:17.13 | sebbs | ill find it :) |
| 20:17.33 | lindi- | sebbs: mtd2 |
| 20:18.08 | *** join/#openmoko dnk (n=deniska@89.151.161.68) |
| 20:18.31 | sebbs | mtd2? |
| 20:19.25 | sebbs | ah |
| 20:19.26 | sebbs | got it |
| 20:20.05 | lindi- | $ netcat paste.dyndns.org 1234 < /proc/mtd |
| 20:20.05 | lindi- | http://rafb.net/p/kM1ZrK94.html |
| 20:20.40 | sebbs | yea i found it |
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| 20:33.53 | sebbs | why was uboot chosen over grub? |
| 20:34.16 | sebbs | or perhaps it does other things, i should read up on uboot |
| 20:35.35 | SpeedEvil | I vaguely recall grub to be x86 only |
| 20:35.58 | sebbs | its in the debian repo |
| 20:36.07 | sebbs | so it has to be compiled for everything |
| 20:36.15 | sebbs | otherwise its not allowed in the debian repo |
| 20:36.23 | sebbs | everything meaning their list of i think 13 archs |
| 20:36.27 | SpeedEvil | Just because it will compile, does not mean it'll work |
| 20:36.33 | sebbs | oh |
| 20:36.39 | sebbs | i see your point |
| 20:38.46 | sebbs | ah |
| 20:38.50 | sebbs | yay i found my fix |
| 20:38.59 | sebbs | i love wikis |
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| 20:43.43 | sebbs | kickass |
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| 20:54.29 | quatrox | hey |
| 20:54.50 | quatrox | what does the WSOD look like? |
| 20:54.58 | quatrox | I got a gray screen |
| 20:56.01 | sebbs | thats funny |
| 20:56.05 | quatrox | yeah |
| 20:56.18 | sebbs | ;) |
| 20:56.22 | sebbs | well a WSOD is white |
| 20:56.31 | sebbs | sorry for stating the obvious |
| 20:56.43 | quatrox | well |
| 20:56.57 | quatrox | I can see the pixels moving |
| 20:57.00 | quatrox | all gray |
| 20:57.24 | sebbs | in my 2 days of having a freerunner i have never seen it. |
| 20:57.24 | quatrox | with a vertical stripe in the middle that is less gray |
| 20:57.28 | sebbs | but that does not say very much |
| 20:57.34 | quatrox | well |
| 20:57.40 | quatrox | I never seen WSOD |
| 20:57.49 | quatrox | but this is as close as I get |
| 20:57.52 | quatrox | using SHR |
| 20:58.05 | sebbs | ive seen a white one i just resolved my issues i had with a WSOD+debian |
| 20:58.15 | quatrox | the phone has been on and untouched for a few days |
| 20:58.26 | sebbs | strange, do any other dists work |
| 20:58.42 | sebbs | when do you see your gsod |
| 20:59.11 | quatrox | well |
| 20:59.19 | quatrox | I never seen this before |
| 20:59.55 | quatrox | I believe it could be some kind of screen saver that is not displayed correctly |
| 21:01.05 | quatrox | everything is gray |
| 21:01.05 | *** join/#openmoko jserv--- (n=jserv@118-169-97-162.dynamic.hinet.net) |
| 21:01.18 | quatrox | but pixels are moving.... cannot ssh over wifi anymore, so I will check with usb |
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| 21:11.07 | quatrox | hmm |
| 21:11.15 | quatrox | ssh over usb does not work |
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| 21:11.42 | quatrox | and the blue light is on |
| 21:11.47 | quatrox | no matter what |
| 21:11.48 | *** part/#openmoko alphabeat (n=nick@123-243-190-207.static.tpgi.com.au) |
| 21:11.55 | quatrox | even if I take out the charger |
| 21:12.11 | quatrox | so I guess I got a GSOD |
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| 21:14.47 | cga | hi all, i want to change. i got fed up with 2008.9, any advice on distros to use?? any news on their state? please thanks. |
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| 21:17.00 | quatrox | cga: did you try SHR? |
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| 21:45.00 | pieterc | is there a decent mail client for SHR? |
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| 22:18.00 | quatrox | sebbs: you can see a picture of the gsod at http://om.quatrox.org/pictures/ |
| 22:19.41 | cga | hi quatrox, no i didn't try shr yet |
| 22:19.54 | cga | i might give it a spin if it works at least as a phone |
| 22:20.12 | cga | can you confirm that? |
| 22:20.18 | quatrox | cga: I think SHR works good |
| 22:20.38 | cga | is the distributions wiki page up to date with features for shr? |
| 22:20.46 | quatrox | I guess |
| 22:20.57 | cga | any other site to gather info? |
| 22:21.13 | quatrox | you find the images at http://shr.bearstech.com/shr-testing/images/neo1973/ |
| 22:21.29 | quatrox | that includes the Freerunner images |
| 22:21.50 | cga | thanks |
| 22:22.00 | quatrox | no problem:) |
| 22:23.35 | cga | Dave: !!! |
| 22:26.11 | *** join/#openmoko LostInSpace (n=Pix@dsl-140-255.aei.ca) |
| 22:26.57 | LostInSpace | pb_: hi |
| 22:28.48 | Dave | WHO? WHAT? |
| 22:30.35 | cga | Dave: it's me!!! your italian friend cga! XD |
| 22:30.45 | cga | jokes apartr |
| 22:30.47 | Dave | hahahaha, it's-a-me |
| 22:30.50 | Dave | ;P |
| 22:30.54 | cga | how are things ? |
| 22:30.56 | Dave | It's-a me, cga! |
| 22:31.00 | Dave | Things are well! |
| 22:31.06 | Dave | Well, getting there, anyway :0 |
| 22:31.08 | Dave | :) |
| 22:31.16 | cga | i don't get that it's-a me joke |
| 22:31.40 | Dave | Simply playing upon a well-defined italian stereotype |
| 22:32.00 | cga | oh got it, you gotta a pizza face ah! |
| 22:32.26 | cga | what's the matter you? why do you lokka so sad? |
| 22:32.55 | cga | you gatta no respect!! you gotta a pizza face!! shutuppa yo' face! |
| 22:33.05 | cga | (i love that song. it makes me laugh) |
| 22:33.17 | Dave | ;P |
| 22:33.40 | cga | do you know who it is? |
| 22:33.51 | cga | i'm in the mood of listening to it |
| 22:34.12 | Dave | :p |
| 22:34.19 | cga | no rly |
| 22:34.31 | cga | you know that "singer" or song name? |
| 22:34.42 | Dave | I do not. |
| 22:34.49 | Dave | Why not search for the lyrics online. |
| 22:35.00 | cga | ok |
| 22:36.23 | Wonka | http://unix.rulez.org/~calver/pictures/marianoitaliano.jpg |
| 22:36.26 | Wonka | *duck* |
| 22:36.33 | Dave | :D |
| 22:36.51 | cga | Dave: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sFacWGBJ_cs |
| 22:37.15 | cga | loool |
| 22:37.55 | cga | Wonka: oh thanks. that teaches me how to live. thanks my dear God. |
| 22:38.03 | cga | (anyway it's fun) |
| 22:38.39 | cga | Wonka: and ok... irc is not meant to talk to people.. just techie here please.... |
| 22:38.48 | *** join/#openmoko CVirus (n=Satan@196.205.122.67) |
| 22:39.09 | Dave | imakeadapizza! |
| 22:39.22 | quatrox | Wonka: hahaha "never ever install pizza script" |
| 22:39.55 | Dave | o_o |
| 22:40.13 | Dave | IT'S A TRAP! |
| 22:40.36 | CVirus | RUN |
| 22:40.37 | quatrox | Dave: use /put_pizza |
| 22:40.46 | cga | makes the dough |
| 22:42.10 | Dave | :D |
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| 22:52.02 | Dave | Hi Ken |
| 22:52.20 | KenYoung | Howdy Dave. What's new? |
| 22:55.23 | zedstar | remembers when that joe dolce song was no.1 in the UK |
| 22:55.59 | Dave | Certainly not the universe or the stars within them :) |
| 22:56.35 | cga | zedstar: that's so sad... how can it be possible??? -.- i mean... that songs sucks big time (i like to listen to it from time to time just for fun... but that's all) |
| 22:56.46 | KenYoung | There's about 1 new star per year in the Milky Way. Some galaxies pump out many more new ones than that. |
| 22:57.10 | zedstar | cga: dont shoot the messenger but it was no.1 in the UK for like weeks on end |
| 22:57.45 | cga | zedstar: oh no don't get me wrong. i wasn't shooting at you nor saying that you like it. it was just colloquial. |
| 22:58.31 | Dave | :) |
| 22:58.57 | cga | anyway. gotta get food and pills. see you later folks. need energies for a long night. |
| 22:59.45 | cga | ps: shuddup you face!!! here itsa nicea place! :P |
| 22:59.47 | zedstar | cga its ok i have recovered from those years but italians still haunt me check out zedstar.net |
| 22:59.53 | Wonka | cga: didn't mean to offend you, just had that URL flying around... |
| 23:00.21 | cga | Wonka: too late i now hate you personally :P (j/k) |
| 23:00.30 | Wonka | cga: :) |
| 23:00.40 | cga | goes for food |
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| 23:20.17 | kirsch | why i cant connect to my wifi?: |
| 23:20.19 | kirsch | root@om-gta02:~# iwconfig eth0 key s:XXX |
| 23:20.19 | kirsch | Error for wireless request "Set Encode" (8B2A) : |
| 23:20.19 | kirsch | <PROTECTED> |
| 23:20.23 | kirsch | any ideas? |
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| 23:26.31 | rooly | so guys |
| 23:26.33 | rooly | guess what |
| 23:26.36 | *** join/#openmoko goldie83 (n=goldie@host-68-11.drama.pl) |
| 23:26.39 | rooly | i found a car charger that works with mah phone |
| 23:29.01 | quatrox | me too:) |
| 23:29.15 | balrog | try switching to host mode and see if you can power the car with the phone |
| 23:29.17 | Wonka | any charger producing 5V on mini-USB B should work... |
| 23:29.40 | rooly | lmao |
| 23:29.57 | quatrox | ... it should provide at least 500mA |
| 23:30.05 | rooly | Wonka, yeah, well i've tried about 2 dozen different car chargers, all wiht miniusb, and this is the first that works |
| 23:30.20 | rooly | they all supply power, but this is the first capable of supplying enough to charge on |
| 23:30.39 | Wonka | more than 0.5A would only be drawn if there's 47k5kOhm on the ID pin... |
| 23:31.11 | rooly | okay, fine, don't believe me that i've only found 1 car charger capable of charing my phone |
| 23:31.18 | Wonka | i do |
| 23:31.24 | Wonka | but i don't really understand. |
| 23:31.31 | rooly | neither do i |
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| 23:31.58 | Wonka | i meant "47k5 ohm" up there, of course. |
| 23:32.10 | quatrox | rooly: when you search for chargers, you should check how much current it can supply |
| 23:32.16 | rooly | sighs |
| 23:32.33 | rooly | you think i'm an idiot? of course i did that |
| 23:32.52 | quatrox | and the chargers did not work? |
| 23:32.56 | rooly | did not |
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| 23:33.03 | quatrox | hmm |
| 23:33.09 | quatrox | that is very strange |
| 23:33.33 | rooly | i even looked it up in apm |
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| 23:33.54 | rooly | all of them would register and give power, but it would do nothing more than supplement the battery |
| 23:34.06 | quatrox | rooly: You should document this on the wiki |
| 23:34.26 | quatrox | there should be a place where we can add unsupported chargers |
| 23:34.41 | rooly | the phillips one from any retail store doesn't work |
| 23:35.38 | quatrox | I bought a charger with a USB A socket |
| 23:35.51 | quatrox | so I just use my normal USB cable |
| 23:36.00 | quatrox | which I need to bring anyway |
| 23:36.12 | quatrox | those chargers should always work |
| 23:36.26 | rooly | i tried doing the same, as well as using the included cable |
| 23:36.33 | rooly | didn't work |
| 23:36.43 | rooly | i could very well be a special case |
| 23:36.59 | quatrox | that means that someone does not follow the specs |
| 23:37.04 | rooly | haven't had any other problems as of yet, so i'm about due for one |
| 23:39.03 | rooly | wait, lemme be specific, this car charger is recognized without the whole force charge thing |
| 23:39.56 | quatrox | ohh |
| 23:40.29 | rooly | couldn't tell ya the actual part name tho...gonna try and look that up |
| 23:40.37 | quatrox | you mean it talks USB or has a 47k Ohm resistor on the ID pin? |
| 23:40.46 | rooly | probably talks usb |
| 23:40.58 | rooly | but, i wouldn't be able to tell you |
| 23:41.07 | rooly | all i know is it charges my phone |
| 23:41.31 | rooly | considering apm told me it would take an hour to charge at 75%, i'm guessing it talks usb |
| 23:44.59 | rooly | http://www.letstalk.com/accessories/productdetail.htm?prId=34245 |
| 23:46.49 | quatrox | rooly: how many A can it supply? |
| 23:47.06 | rooly | doesn't say, any way for me to find out from the neo? |
| 23:47.21 | rooly | ...hmm...it's got a 2A fuse |
| 23:48.15 | quatrox | nice |
| 23:48.21 | *** join/#openmoko dwb1 (n=david@72-11-234-10.static-ip.telepacific.net) |
| 23:53.21 | *** join/#openmoko jonsmith1982_ (n=jon@82-38-88-58.cable.ubr01.donc.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 23:53.53 | mwester | rooly: can you pastebin your dmesg, after you plug it in (and unplug it) from that charger? That'll tell if it attempts to enumerate the USB... if it does, that's a cool little charger... |
| 23:54.34 | rooly | that may be a little difficult, mwester, but lemme see |
| 23:54.50 | mwester | ok, np |
| 23:55.04 | mwester | when you get a chance :) |
| 23:55.13 | rooly | actually, i'm doing it now |
| 23:55.25 | rooly | just kinda hoping the data stayed in memory |
| 23:55.52 | quatrox | mwester: did you ever see anything like this: http://om.quatrox.org/pictures/neo/gsod.jpg ? |
| 23:56.58 | quatrox | it caused kernel panic |
| 23:57.01 | cga | quatrox: it happens to me all the time after a while in standby |
| 23:57.08 | cga | this with 2008.9 |
| 23:57.13 | quatrox | ohh |
| 23:57.15 | cga | that's why i'm fed up |
| 23:57.34 | quatrox | it is not WSOD, but GSOD |
| 23:57.35 | rooly | you sure thats not the wsod? |
| 23:57.39 | rooly | right... |
| 23:57.40 | cga | G? |
| 23:57.44 | rooly | gray |
| 23:57.45 | quatrox | gray |
| 23:57.47 | quatrox | yes |
| 23:57.49 | cga | oh ok |
| 23:58.01 | quatrox | first time I have seen it |
| 23:58.03 | cga | well the pic it's not so clear it seemd WSOD to me |
| 23:58.14 | quatrox | ohh |
| 23:58.16 | quatrox | thanks |
| 23:58.24 | quatrox | then it is nothing new |
| 23:58.34 | quatrox | that was what I wanted to know |
| 23:58.35 | cga | mumbles about *SODs |
| 23:58.43 | quatrox | never had WSOD |
| 23:58.49 | quatrox | before now |
| 23:59.01 | quatrox | that phone had run SHR for some days |
| 23:59.16 | quatrox | just left alone |
| 23:59.29 | quatrox | and after 2-3 days, I got this |
| 23:59.29 | cga | good |
| 23:59.37 | cga | gonna flash with shr later |
