IRC log for #openmoko on 20081023

`00:02.25`	`Kensan`	`raster: don't know what's up ther`
`00:02.26`	`Kensan`	`e`
`00:02.30`	`Kensan`	`raster: need to shleep`
`00:02.32`	`*** part/#openmoko white_gecko (n=natanael@91.65.91.60)`
`00:04.17`	`Kensan`	`raster: hm I am missing some error messages in the log... does logread only show kernel syslog messages?`
`00:04.18`	`raster`	`ok so shleep`
`00:04.20`	`raster`	`nite!`
`00:06.40`	`SpeedEvil`	`ponders.`
`00:06.49`	`SpeedEvil`	`Does raster dream of shaded sheep.`
`00:06.59`	`*** join/#openmoko Isajha (n=Isajha4@wrzb-4d00ccaa.pool.mediaWays.net)`
`00:07.02`	`SpeedEvil`	`Through a perfectly rendered mist.`
`00:07.25`	`*** join/#openmoko Isajha (n=Isajha4@wrzb-4d00ccaa.pool.mediaWays.net)`
`00:07.33`	`*** part/#openmoko readytoinvade (n=readytoi@67.61.51.184)`
`00:08.07`	`Kensan`	`SpeedEvil: hehe, I bet as long as the sheeps have eye-candy he doesn't care`
`00:09.00`	`Kensan`	`well I am off.`
`00:09.04`	`Kensan`	`good night`
`00:09.28`	`*** join/#openmoko DrRabbit (n=tuna@ip70-176-117-108.ph.ph.cox.net)`
`00:10.24`	`*** part/#openmoko FilipLinux4BE (n=Filip@77.109.123.60)`
`00:10.49`	`raster`	`nite!`
`00:11.39`	`*** join/#openmoko Proton23 (n=proton@p57BA6CC8.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`00:11.53`	`*** join/#openmoko neldoreth (n=ascot@unixboard/users/neldoreth)`
`00:18.13`	`*** join/#openmoko freelock (n=john@logan.freelock.com)`
`00:18.17`	`*** join/#openmoko DieMumie1 (n=DieMumie@W19ac.w.pppool.de)`
`00:21.48`	`*** join/#openmoko euud (n=chatzill@60-249-99-148.HINET-IP.hinet.net)`
`00:32.43`	`*** join/#openmoko emacsen (n=serge@pool-141-156-49-33.washdc.btas.verizon.net)`
`00:38.36`	`johngay`	`Is it possible to mount the FR as a USB memory device?`
`00:39.39`	`*** join/#openmoko slaxxin (n=brian@ip70-178-27-23.ks.ks.cox.net)`
`00:40.48`	`BobOfDoom`	`johngay: search the wiki for "USB mass storage"`
`00:41.51`	`*** join/#openmoko CVirus (n=Satan@41.196.148.252)`
`00:50.17`	`slaxxin`	`yay android`
`00:50.41`	`johngay`	`Except I don't have the modules listed at http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Using_the_Neo_as_a_Mass_storage_device ???`
`00:52.10`	`*** join/#openmoko Kt_ (n=Kirsat@c-24-98-184-147.hsd1.ga.comcast.net)`
`00:52.15`	`*** join/#openmoko NevinBi__ (n=chatzill@219.131.199.212)`
`00:56.32`	`*** join/#openmoko CVirus (n=Satan@41.196.148.252)`
`01:00.46`	`*** join/#openmoko Staticwave_Ace (n=Ace@d57-135-60.home.cgocable.net)`
`01:13.15`	`*** join/#openmoko Nameeater (i=subspace@priss.segfault.nl)`
`01:19.36`	`*** join/#openmoko behdad1 (n=behdad@CPE001217b19226-CM0012c9c84bc4.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)`
`01:19.53`	`*** join/#openmoko CVirus (n=Satan@41.196.148.252)`
`01:20.22`	`*** join/#openmoko CVirus (n=Satan@41.196.148.252)`
`01:23.51`	`*** join/#openmoko ChandleWEi (n=chandle@210.13.121.62)`
`01:25.16`	`*** join/#openmoko xcasex (n=rrg@ua-83-227-156-234.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se)`
`01:29.47`	`*** join/#openmoko felipe_ (n=felipe@my.nada.kth.se)`
`01:37.43`	`*** join/#openmoko GunsNRose (n=GunsNRos@222.212.53.107)`
`01:38.34`	`slaxxin`	`http://www.aftermarketcellular.com/ic/MOTV3CLA.html`
`01:38.45`	`*** join/#openmoko daMaestro (n=jon@fedora/damaestro)`
`01:48.46`	`Dave`	`boo`
`01:49.19`	`gurugentoo`	`fairly cheap`
`01:52.37`	`techiem2-r`	`http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16868995002`
`01:52.41`	`techiem2-r`	`I just got one of those`
`01:54.18`	`Dave`	`Congratulations. What is it?`
`01:54.58`	`techiem2-r`	`2 port wall or car charger`
`01:55.32`	`*** join/#openmoko everslick (n=clemens@212-183-117-69.adsl.highway.telekom.at)`
`01:56.18`	`techiem2-r`	`it's not a "smart" usb device, so you have to kick your FR into fast charge mode`
`01:56.30`	`Dave`	`oh oh`
`01:56.33`	`Dave`	`heh, nice`
`01:56.42`	`techiem2-r`	`yeah`
`01:56.45`	`Dave`	`Whip it, Indiana Jones style!`
`01:56.50`	`Dave`	`whaaapissssssh`
`01:56.51`	`techiem2-r`	`lol`
`01:57.00`	`Dave`	`>:)`
`01:57.07`	`techiem2-r`	`I figured a wall/car would be nice and handy`
`01:57.27`	`techiem2-r`	`5v, 2 port, 500mA/port`
`01:57.49`	`Dave`	`damn right!`
`01:57.54`	`Dave`	`not bad :)`
`01:58.07`	`techiem2-r`	`yeah`
`01:58.14`	`techiem2-r`	`ideally 1mA/port, but not surprising that it's not`
`01:58.20`	`techiem2-r`	`hehe`
`01:58.26`	`Dave`	`heh`
`01:58.28`	`Dave`	`good`
`02:00.06`	`Dave`	`yeah, I just run multiple hubs in the lab, two to a channel`
`02:00.54`	`Dave`	`or just self-powered for charging`
`02:00.56`	`Dave`	`woo`
`02:01.00`	`Dave`	`tech, how much was it?`
`02:01.59`	`techiem2-r`	`@$27 including shipping`
`02:02.05`	`Dave`	`not bad`
`02:02.13`	`Dave`	`and I'm assuming shipping was roughly half :p`
`02:02.16`	`techiem2-r`	`yeah`
`02:02.21`	`techiem2-r`	`lol`
`02:02.22`	`Dave`	`good`
`02:02.24`	`Dave`	`:P`
`02:02.26`	`techiem2-r`	`@$7`
`02:02.28`	`Dave`	`:P`
`02:02.42`	`Dave`	`was that the shipping or the product price? ;D`
`02:02.46`	`slaxxin`	`will a razr cord work properly?`
`02:02.46`	`Dave`	`laughs`
`02:02.52`	`Dave`	`slaxxin, no`
`02:02.55`	`Dave`	`I tried it`
`02:02.58`	`Dave`	`regrettably`
`02:03.02`	`techiem2-r`	`lol`
`02:03.05`	`techiem2-r`	`shipping`
`02:03.05`	`rooly`	`just discovered opkg.org`
`02:03.08`	`Dave`	`though it might depend on which cord you're talking about specifically`
`02:03.13`	`Dave`	`rooly, heh`
`02:03.14`	`slaxxin`	`i tries a cheap walmart cord'`
`02:03.18`	`Dave`	`hah`
`02:03.35`	`Dave`	`fucking redneck usb protocols`
`02:03.43`	`techiem2-r`	`lol`
`02:03.52`	`Dave`	`yeehaw`
`02:03.56`	`slaxxin`	`dykes`
`02:03.59`	`*** join/#openmoko swc\|666 (n=swc\|666@unaffiliated/swc666/x-4934821)`
`02:04.04`	`Dave`	`lookie here ma, I dun charged mah deevice`
`02:04.09`	`rooly`	`wetbacks and sandiggers`
`02:04.11`	`slaxxin`	`shrink tube`
`02:04.56`	`*** join/#openmoko charlie137 (n=charlie@firewall.tw.openmoko.org)`
`02:05.17`	`Dave`	`throws defunt calypsos at mwester`
`02:05.24`	`slaxxin`	`so are there some schemetics to build the perfect 12v charger?`
`02:05.49`	`rooly`	`nah man, why would there be. you know how proprietary this company is`
`02:05.52`	`Dave`	`yes`
`02:05.58`	`Dave`	`hahaha`
`02:06.02`	`Dave`	`nice`
`02:06.34`	`Dave`	`yeah, they're clearly worse than android, right? :p`
`02:07.27`	`rooly`	`impossible to deal with, ya know?`
`02:07.32`	`rooly`	`no community contact`
`02:07.38`	`rooly`	`kill switches for every app`
`02:07.40`	`rooly`	`etc`
`02:07.48`	`rooly`	`wait`
`02:07.54`	`rooly`	`am i talking about openmoko or apple`
`02:08.26`	`techiem2-r`	`lol`
`02:09.25`	`rooly`	`jesus h christ on a pogo stick, batman`
`02:09.29`	`rooly`	`it's STILL installing...`
`02:09.37`	`rooly`	`that's a bit much considering how little i put in there`
`02:19.13`	`*** join/#openmoko Proton24 (n=proton@p57BA59E3.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`02:20.15`	`*** join/#openmoko jones (i=jones@svalbard.freeshell.org)`
`02:21.52`	`*** join/#openmoko alephnull (n=alok@122.167.79.248)`
`02:22.02`	`*** join/#openmoko wildnux (n=wildnux@cpe-76-187-41-118.tx.res.rr.com)`
`02:22.31`	`wildnux`	`i get "ssh: connect to host 192.168.0.202 port 22: No route to host" while i try to ssh my neo.`
`02:22.50`	`rooly`	`did you boot with the usb cable in?`
`02:23.13`	`wildnux`	`rooly: nope. i connected it after booting both device`
`02:23.22`	`rooly`	`do you have a firewall active?`
`02:23.45`	`wildnux`	`rooly: yes but i have usb0 under internal`
`02:25.12`	`*** join/#openmoko swc\|666 (n=swc\|666@unaffiliated/swc666/x-4934821) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`02:25.13`	`*** join/#openmoko jzk2 (i=jzk@gateway/shell/rootnode.net/x-caf094cf0ea61ca8) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`02:25.14`	`*** join/#openmoko micm_ (n=micm@p5087268C.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`02:25.14`	`*** join/#openmoko balrog-k1n (n=balrog@ckf132.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`02:25.14`	`*** join/#openmoko ixs (n=andreas@lacht.ueber.gattinnen-im-netz.de) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`02:25.14`	`*** join/#openmoko Kero (n=kero@i66203.upc-i.chello.nl) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`02:25.14`	`*** join/#openmoko [JT] (n=justin@c-24-20-75-90.hsd1.or.comcast.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`02:25.14`	`*** join/#openmoko techiem2-r (n=techiem2@c-71-60-33-168.hsd1.pa.comcast.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`02:25.14`	`*** join/#openmoko weirdedout (n=gonePost@220-253-14-131.VIC.netspace.net.au) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`02:25.14`	`*** join/#openmoko dwmw2_gone (i=ctrlprox@90.155.92.195)`
`02:25.14`	`*** join/#openmoko k-s (n=gustavo@enlightenment/developer/k-s)`
`02:25.14`	`*** join/#openmoko drjnut (i=proxy@caladan.darksnow.org)`
`02:25.15`	`*** join/#openmoko bipolar (i=bflong@216-164-162-138.pa.subnet.cable.rcn.com)`
`02:25.15`	`*** join/#openmoko mwester (n=mwester@nslu2-linux/mwester)`
`02:25.15`	`*** join/#openmoko rtp (n=rtp@sat78-7-88-166-121-96.fbx.proxad.net)`
`02:25.15`	`*** join/#openmoko diogenes (i=diogenes@xob.kapsi.fi) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`02:25.15`	`*** join/#openmoko pepin__ (n=yann@pat35-3-82-245-140-228.fbx.proxad.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`02:25.16`	`*** join/#openmoko Kasjo_screen (i=kasjo@matrix.csk.pl) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`02:25.16`	`*** join/#openmoko Weiss (i=taw27@pip.srcf.societies.cam.ac.uk) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`02:25.16`	`*** join/#openmoko wejp (n=wejp@moon.spacetechnology.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`02:25.24`	`*** join/#openmoko _wejp (n=wejp@moon.spacetechnology.net)`
`02:25.25`	`wildnux`	`wow what was that? all of them left the server at once and joined all at once???`
`02:25.26`	`rooly`	`netsplit`
`02:25.30`	`wildnux`	`what does that mean?`
`02:25.48`	`rooly`	`freenode suffers from what they call netsplits`
`02:26.00`	`*** join/#openmoko diogenes_ (i=diogenes@xob.kapsi.fi)`
`02:26.04`	`*** join/#openmoko k-s[WORK] (n=gustavo@201.82.39.16)`
`02:26.05`	`*** join/#openmoko poutine (n=frankyd@ip72-193-146-126.lv.lv.cox.net)`
`02:26.05`	`rooly`	`when a server in the chain gets out of sync, it has to relogon to the network`
`02:26.07`	`*** join/#openmoko Kero_ (n=kero@i66203.upc-i.chello.nl)`
`02:26.09`	`*** join/#openmoko Kasjo_sc1een (i=kasjo@matrix.csk.pl)`
`02:26.13`	`wildnux`	`oh`
`02:26.23`	`*** join/#openmoko techiem21r (n=techiem2@c-71-60-33-168.hsd1.pa.comcast.net)`
`02:26.35`	`rooly`	`so it appears to us the users that dozens or hundreds of people are leaving and joining right back again`
`02:26.44`	`*** join/#openmoko Weiss_ (i=taw27@pip.srcf.societies.cam.ac.uk)`
`02:27.26`	`wildnux`	`rooly: so what should i do with this ssh thing. i have tried to upgrade the FDOM in neo but it messed up my home screen : tiny icons, no mofi icon, no terminal icon, no config icon. I can do nothing at all without ssh`
`02:27.44`	`rooly`	`i know what you mean`
`02:27.50`	`rooly`	`how many times have you tried rebooting`
`02:28.08`	`rooly`	`try temporarily disabling your firewall too`
`02:28.11`	`wildnux`	`ok`
`02:28.14`	`wildnux`	`lets see`
`02:28.17`	`wildnux`	`brb`
`02:29.48`	`*** join/#openmoko pepin (n=yann@pat35-3-82-245-140-228.fbx.proxad.net)`
`02:29.48`	`*** join/#openmoko ixs (n=andreas@lacht.ueber.gattinnen-im-netz.de) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`02:29.48`	`*** join/#openmoko swc\|666 (n=swc\|666@unaffiliated/swc666/x-4934821) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`02:29.48`	`*** join/#openmoko jzk2 (i=jzk@gateway/shell/rootnode.net/x-caf094cf0ea61ca8) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`02:29.48`	`*** join/#openmoko micm_ (n=micm@p5087268C.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`02:29.48`	`*** join/#openmoko balrog-k1n (n=balrog@ckf132.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`02:29.48`	`*** join/#openmoko Kero (n=kero@i66203.upc-i.chello.nl) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`02:29.49`	`*** join/#openmoko [JT] (n=justin@c-24-20-75-90.hsd1.or.comcast.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`02:29.49`	`*** join/#openmoko weirdedout (n=gonePost@220-253-14-131.VIC.netspace.net.au) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`02:29.49`	`*** join/#openmoko dwmw2_gone (i=ctrlprox@90.155.92.195)`
`02:29.49`	`*** join/#openmoko k-s (n=gustavo@enlightenment/developer/k-s) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`02:29.49`	`*** join/#openmoko drjnut (i=proxy@caladan.darksnow.org) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`02:29.49`	`*** join/#openmoko mwester (n=mwester@nslu2-linux/mwester)`
`02:29.49`	`*** join/#openmoko rtp (n=rtp@sat78-7-88-166-121-96.fbx.proxad.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`02:29.59`	`rooly`	`is it feasible to make the sd card have a swap partition?`
`02:31.12`	`*** join/#openmoko bipolar (i=bflong@216-164-162-138.pa.subnet.cable.rcn.com) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`02:31.31`	`*** join/#openmoko jones_ (i=jones@svalbard.freeshell.org)`
`02:32.13`	`*** join/#openmoko wildnux (n=wildnux@cpe-76-187-41-118.tx.res.rr.com)`
`02:32.18`	`swc\|666`	`rooly: i run swap`
`02:32.43`	`rooly`	`how do i tell fdisk to make a partition as swap`
`02:32.44`	`swc\|666`	`it helps, but dont kill urself with massive space == it isn't worth more that 2x he ram`
`02:32.58`	`rooly`	`i have an 8G card`
`02:33.02`	`rooly`	`i think i can spare a little`
`02:33.13`	`rooly`	`now`
`02:33.26`	`rooly`	`how do i make that swap in the fr`
`02:40.59`	`*** join/#openmoko Mek (n=marijn@93.157.1.37)`
`03:01.59`	`*** join/#openmoko arndtroide (n=arndt@port-92-196-3-94.dynamic.qsc.de)`
`03:04.26`	`*** join/#openmoko Flyser__ (n=flyser@dialin-212-144-064-071.pools.arcor-ip.net)`
`03:05.04`	`rooly`	`you know what`
`03:05.06`	`rooly`	`wait`
`03:05.08`	`rooly`	`wrong channel`
`03:05.53`	`Dave`	`haha`
`03:05.54`	`slaxxin`	`tell us rooly`
`03:05.55`	`swc\|666`	`fdisk /dev/sdx`
`03:06.02`	`swc\|666`	`del al partitions..`
`03:06.05`	`swc\|666`	`all*`
`03:06.06`	`rooly`	`it's a facebook thing`
`03:06.09`	`rooly`	`you guys wouldn't care`
`03:06.11`	`*** join/#openmoko zeno_ (n=andrew@97-112-155-60.clsp.qwest.net)`
`03:06.14`	`Dave`	`true`
`03:06.22`	`Dave`	`go away then; shoo :p`
`03:06.22`	`zeno_`	`will gthe next version have 3g?`
`03:06.31`	`rooly`	`zeno_: no`
`03:06.39`	`rooly`	`sighs...it's all dialup damnit`
`03:06.53`	`rooly`	`why do people care so damn much about their 3g`
`03:07.35`	`zeno_`	`well i would use it for web/music a lot and need better speed`
`03:08.57`	`rooly`	`streaming music over gprs...`
`03:09.16`	`rooly`	`i don't think that was what it was designed for...of course i could be quite wrong`
`03:10.24`	`zeno_`	`well would do other stuff too, but thats just what would use a lot of bandwidth (and voip i guess)`
`03:12.16`	`rooly`	`believe me, i know the usefulness of a generic data plan`
`03:12.30`	`rooly`	`however...as of right now, you're better off waiting till the next version of the phone`
`03:12.51`	`gurugentoo`	`wimax would be an interesting addition, anyone know its power requirements?`
`03:13.13`	`rooly`	`a billion dollars`
`03:13.33`	`gurugentoo`	`depends where you live`
`03:14.16`	`*** join/#openmoko kishore (n=quassel@218.248.35.118)`
`03:16.38`	`gurugentoo`	`can voip be used reliably on 3G or gprs?`
`03:16.45`	`gurugentoo`	`how's the latency?`
`03:17.56`	`mwester`	`rooly: Don't waste any time with partitioning the SD card -- just use a swapfile.`
`03:18.05`	`Dave`	`Mwester!`
`03:18.10`	`mwester`	`No.`
`03:18.30`	`mwester`	`is quite contrary.`
`03:18.57`	`gurugentoo`	`no that's Mary`
`03:19.10`	`raster`	`swap files`
`03:19.11`	`Dave`	`hah :p`
`03:19.12`	`raster`	`meh!`
`03:19.12`	`mwester`	`Oh yeah, the one with the garden.`
`03:19.15`	`gurugentoo`	`how does your garden grow by the way`
`03:19.16`	`raster`	`the weak way out`
`03:19.16`	`Dave`	`oh no, raster`
`03:19.19`	`gurugentoo`	`hehe yes`
`03:19.20`	`rooly`	`it's too late`
`03:19.21`	`Dave`	`Mwester, indeed :)`
`03:19.28`	`rooly`	`i already have swap setup`
`03:19.33`	`raster`	`it is entirely lame to have swap on a phone`
`03:19.50`	`raster`	`shows that't u've given up ever trying to make anything efficient`
`03:19.50`	`raster`	`:)`
`03:19.54`	`rooly`	`you could implement deep sleep easy`
`03:19.59`	`mwester`	`goes off to find a visual metaphor to respond to raster's comment.`
`03:20.37`	`mwester`	`Here it is. This applies to swap on a phone as well: http://xkcd.com/463/`
`03:20.49`	`Soulnoob`	`yay, an xkcd!`
`03:21.17`	`raster`	`mwester: HAHAHAHHAHAHA`
`03:21.25`	`gurugentoo`	`perfect`
`03:21.53`	`raster`	`http://icanhascheezburger.files.wordpress.com/2007/05/cheez_doing_it_wrong.jpg`
`03:21.59`	`raster`	`that also applies`
`03:22.43`	`mwester`	`:) I love that site.`
`03:24.49`	`Soulnoob`	`mwester: I thought it would be this one, http://xkcd.com/85/`
`03:25.36`	`Soulnoob`	`I havent figured out the path for adding more swap tho`
`03:26.00`	`*** join/#openmoko icman (n=icman@123-240-172-254.cctv.dynamic.lsc.net.tw)`
`03:27.08`	`rooly`	`HOLY SHIT`
`03:27.13`	`rooly`	`just tried dillo`
`03:27.15`	`rooly`	`and like i said`
`03:27.19`	`rooly`	`HOLY SHIT`
`03:27.34`	`raster`	`?`
`03:27.37`	`Soulnoob`	`light speed achived?`
`03:27.44`	`raster`	`dillo is cool`
`03:27.51`	`rwhitby`	`can't work out whether rooly likes it or not`
`03:28.00`	`raster`	`as long as u only want to browse... a subset of the intranudes`
`03:28.01`	`rooly`	`i do like it`
`03:28.04`	`*** join/#openmoko vinicius (n=vininim@pdpc/supporter/student/vininim)`
`03:28.04`	`rooly`	`light speed`
`03:29.37`	`Soulnoob`	`I like that it render before downloading the whole page.`
`03:29.48`	`Soulnoob`	`(contrary to konqueror)`
`03:30.20`	`rooly`	`i like that it starts, renders the default page, and quits faster than any other browser i've ever seen, all on a 400mhz processor`
`03:30.58`	`raster`	`anything with stylesheets aint going to get u far`
`03:30.59`	`raster`	`:)`
`03:31.20`	`raster`	`ro try real pages`
`03:31.22`	`raster`	`seriously`
`03:31.25`	`raster`	`dilloi is cool`
`03:31.33`	`raster`	`until u find out how much it cant do`
`03:31.37`	`raster`	`this is 2.0.0`
`03:35.19`	`*** join/#openmoko d-b (n=alias@203-158-55-67.dyn.iinet.net.au)`
`03:38.25`	`rooly`	`raster: i don't really use the internet all THAT much`
`03:38.32`	`rooly`	`on my phone at least`
`03:38.53`	`raster`	`seriously`
`03:38.57`	`raster`	`try dillo on site`
`03:38.59`	`raster`	`sites`
`03:39.05`	`raster`	`most stuff sure - iut displays`
`03:39.08`	`raster`	`but its not rpetty`
`03:41.57`	`rooly`	`raster: i didn't buy this thing for pretty`
`03:42.04`	`rooly`	`anyone who does is a fool`
`03:42.26`	`rooly`	`i bought it to contribute to the initial developement of the first open-source phone/phone os`
`03:44.30`	`raster`	`no`
`03:44.36`	`raster`	`i mean the sites look like arese`
`03:44.39`	`raster`	`ie not usabel`
`03:44.42`	`raster`	`or just dont work at all`
`03:44.49`	`raster`	`as there is no stylesheet or javasc ript support`
`03:44.58`	`*** join/#openmoko mbuf (n=user@61.16.248.242)`
`03:44.58`	`rooly`	`well maybe not to the kind of person that can't live without 3g`
`03:45.22`	`rooly`	`but i can live without my igoogle page every so often`
`03:45.26`	`*** join/#openmoko Pyrasi (n=dan@74-140-180-181.dhcp.insightbb.com)`
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`04:16.09`	`walrustown`	`Hello`
`04:16.25`	`walrustown`	`Does anyone want to buy a mint Freerunner + 8 gig micro SD card for $250?`
`04:16.43`	`SpeedEvil`	`Is it extra-strong mint?`
`04:16.50`	`SpeedEvil`	`And have you licked it much?`
`04:16.50`	`walrustown`	`More like Andes mint`
`04:17.00`	`walrustown`	`Nope no phone-to-tongue contact`
`04:17.11`	`rooly`	`hmm`
`04:17.24`	`rooly`	`walrustown: if you keep that on hand, i might be able to get my school to buy it from you`
`04:17.56`	`walrustown`	`rooly: how long?`
`04:18.02`	`nemik`	`walrustown: i'm intested`
`04:18.16`	`rooly`	`meh, nemik will beat me to it`
`04:18.24`	`nemik`	`:( sorry`
`04:18.37`	`walrustown`	`nemik: what would be the best way to do the deal?`
`04:18.53`	`nemik`	`paypal ok? easy for you to ship to the USA?`
`04:18.59`	`walrustown`	`nemik: yeah I'm in AZ`
`04:19.12`	`walrustown`	`nemik: I think I have a paypal acct, if not I can make one`
`04:19.15`	`nemik`	`cool, i'm in chicago. does it come with box/accessories and all?`
`04:19.29`	`walrustown`	`nemik: yup, everything`
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`04:19.40`	`nemik`	`perfect. i'll /msg you`
`04:19.44`	`walrustown`	`k`
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`04:26.37`	`ieatlint`	`well, i just learnt that a little bluetooth gps reciever i have from garmin uses a battery that is identical in size and shape as the FR`
`04:26.51`	`ieatlint`	`and thus, i now have an external battery charger that can charge dead batteries`
`04:27.01`	`rooly`	`nice`
`04:27.55`	`nemik`	`nice. is it a holux one?`
`04:28.10`	`ieatlint`	`holux?`
`04:28.22`	`ieatlint`	`it's a garmin gps 10x`
`04:28.22`	`nemik`	`i loved those because the used the same (very cheap and very plentiful) batteries that came from old nokia 3310 phones`
`04:28.39`	`nemik`	`oh, sorry. missed thr garmin part`
`04:29.11`	`ieatlint`	`i think this battery is made by fic... it looks 100% identical`
`04:29.32`	`ieatlint`	`even seemingly useless notches on the plastic match`
`04:30.14`	`rooly`	`interesting`
`04:30.49`	`*** join/#openmoko soman (n=somnath@61.16.248.242)`
`04:32.11`	`gurugentoo`	`walrustown: I wish you'd been around when I bought mine`
`04:32.43`	`gurugentoo`	`$250 is a good deal`
`04:33.38`	`nemik`	`yea i can't resist. i've been on the fence for buying one for a while. this is great`
`04:34.46`	`gurugentoo`	`just don't expect good usability initially hehe`
`04:34.55`	`gurugentoo`	`it took a bit of tinkering`
`04:37.56`	`nemik`	`haha, yea i'm well aware`
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`05:53.16`	`noaXess`	`is theer a way to empty the whole datebook?`
`05:55.40`	`geaaru`	`hi, i have this error when i try to upgrade kernel from testing tree: Package kernel md5sum mismatch.`
`05:55.55`	`geaaru`	`is there a way to avoid md5 check?`
`05:56.23`	`geaaru`	`(kernel for neo1937/gta01)`
`05:58.04`	`geaaru`	`where are downloaded opkg packages? on /tmp directory?`
`05:58.29`	`*** join/#openmoko Sonicadvance1 (n=Sonic@24-116-252-18.cpe.cableone.net)`
`05:59.42`	`*** part/#openmoko NevinBi__ (n=chatzill@219.131.199.212)`
`05:59.52`	`*** join/#openmoko ccube_ (n=ccube@ssh.ccube.de)`
`06:02.46`	`*** join/#openmoko opentrinity (i=59764e0a@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-7a924037e4124a5f)`
`06:03.14`	`*** join/#openmoko pazante (n=patrik@user113.77-105-224.netatonce.net)`
`06:03.15`	`*** join/#openmoko israr (n=israr@203.99.187.192)`
`06:03.48`	`israr`	`any plans to port android to openmoko?`
`06:03.59`	`*** join/#openmoko johncylee (n=john@firewall.tw.openmoko.org)`
`06:05.13`	`rhkfin`	`israr: check the mailing lists, some people are working on it`
`06:06.10`	`israr`	`thanks`
`06:07.35`	`LuYu`	`i thought android already worked on the openmoko`
`06:07.48`	`LuYu`	`arent we just waiting for google to release it for use?`
`06:08.47`	`LuYu`	`i heard a claim that it worked back in may`
`06:08.59`	`LuYu`	`i havent seen it, of course`
`06:10.06`	`opentrinity`	`i i have a problem, i have an internet connection with pppoe...with OM i ping google, debian.org but when i try to opkg update seems to happen nothing...is it possible?`
`06:10.13`	`*** join/#openmoko Cervajz (n=Cervajz@45.215.broadband4.iol.cz)`
`06:10.54`	`*** join/#openmoko polaru (n=polaru@193.138.97.30)`
`06:11.04`	`Cervajz`	`Hello`
`06:11.43`	`Cervajz`	`Do you have problems with "qpe" ? On my FR (Om2008.9) takes 80-100% of CPU :(`
`06:12.37`	`*** join/#openmoko zmedico (n=zmedico@gentoo/developer/zmedico)`
`06:18.44`	`*** join/#openmoko vinicius (n=vininim@189.26.192.88.adsl.gvt.net.br)`
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`06:36.22`	`Rupert_`	`Morning all the daily build of 2008, from the other day, would not boot in my FR so I installed FSO instead. Oh my God how intuitive is this interface. I'll have to go search the wiki to find out how you switch the phone off. In Zone I've now got four screen boxes: Keep pressed, let go, suspending and wake up. If you press the power button it goes straight from let go to suspending. Still love the idea of FSO and want to delve into Dbus but`
`06:36.22`	`Rupert_`	`not too keen on the power button's action`
`06:37.47`	`lindi-`	`Rupert_: well, change it?`
`06:38.22`	`*** join/#openmoko RedFlash (n=sog@217.221.131.126)`
`06:41.18`	`Rupert_`	`lindi: I have every intention of when I find the piece of code that controls it`
`06:41.35`	`lindi-`	`Rupert_: which version of zhone is it?`
`06:41.48`	`lindi-`	`this is 0-git20080909-1`
`06:43.30`	`Rupert_`	`lindi-: like I said first time with FSO as 2008 would not boot. Used a testing build I downloaded yesterday. So not idea which version of zhone`
`06:44.13`	`*** join/#openmoko vinicius (n=vininim@189.26.192.88.adsl.gvt.net.br)`
`06:45.44`	`*** join/#openmoko anno^da_ (n=anno^da@p5B07F65B.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`06:46.58`	`*** part/#openmoko Quadduc (n=quadduc@90.149.196.137)`
`06:47.12`	`*** join/#openmoko Tupeco (i=tuomom@bot.kapsi.fi)`
`06:47.29`	`*** join/#openmoko max_posedon (n=max_pose@212.98.171.13)`
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`06:49.58`	`methril`	`morning`
`06:55.34`	`*** join/#openmoko bentob0x (n=laurent@ip-213-49-75-74.dsl.scarlet.be)`
`06:58.12`	`*** join/#openmoko jeffszusz (n=jeffsz@d57-97-215.home.cgocable.net)`
`07:00.23`	`lindi-`	`Rupert_: it's bit hard to help if i don't even know what version of zhone you have`
`07:00.35`	`lindi-`	`Rupert_: maybe you can send me a copy?`
`07:04.00`	`lindi-`	`any idea how to disable pin code in the sim card?`
`07:06.24`	`*** join/#openmoko trickie\|work (n=trickie@a5061.upc-a.chello.nl)`
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`07:10.22`	`AJuOnLiNE`	`is it possible to connect a printer to the phone and take printouts of documents?`
`07:10.34`	`lindi-`	`AJuOnLiNE: sure why not?`
`07:14.09`	`AJuOnLiNE`	`lindi-: ok .. was confirming. thanks :)`
`07:14.31`	`AJuOnLiNE`	`one of the devs builidng a new module to sahana asked me to look into this possibility`
`07:15.03`	`AJuOnLiNE`	`of having a label generatingfeature too in the application i am working on..`
`07:15.09`	`AJuOnLiNE`	`so that they can take print outs`
`07:16.34`	`*** join/#openmoko mickey\|munich (n=mickey@p549A07CF.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)`
`07:23.01`	`*** join/#openmoko Bubbi (n=Miranda@78.111.161.100)`
`07:26.02`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: 03charlie 07framework * rd9cea9e637f6 10/framework/subsystems/opimd/pimd_contacts.py:`
`07:26.02`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: opimd: fix a few problems in pimd_contacts`
`07:26.03`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: * use DBus path intead of uri`
`07:26.03`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: * disable query.check_new_contact`
`07:27.38`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: 03charlie 07framework * rcf248ba49fe2 10/tests/opimd.py:`
`07:27.38`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: tests: updated opimd test`
`07:27.39`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: Add checking that added contact appears into the query for the same name`
`07:33.37`	`*** join/#openmoko edje2 (n=chatzill@ckpceka.ipv6.kapitein.org)`
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`07:43.24`	`PBeck`	`hallo`
`07:44.03`	`beni_`	`hi`
`07:46.16`	`*** join/#openmoko israr[a] (n=israr@119.152.2.221)`
`07:46.17`	`opentrinity`	`hi, i have a problem, i have an internet connection with pppoe...with OM i ping google, debian.org but when i try to opkg update seems to happen nothing...is it possible?`
`07:47.30`	`lindi-`	`opentrinity: strace?`
`07:48.49`	`opentrinity`	`lindi-: i'm at work :-( now i can't`
`07:49.20`	`*** join/#openmoko hanez (n=hanez@213.61.87.197)`
`07:49.21`	`opentrinity`	`lindi-: is it normal?`
`07:49.38`	`lindi-`	`opentrinity: ?`
`07:49.47`	`*** join/#openmoko bipak_ (n=bip@p57B83828.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`07:50.00`	`*** join/#openmoko mac2k (n=mac2k@ip-88-152-132-78.unitymediagroup.de)`
`07:50.27`	`opentrinity`	`that ping but cant' do opkg update`
`07:51.07`	`viq`	`ping is icmp, the other is tcp, that could make a difference`
`07:51.47`	`opentrinity`	`viq: wget works`
`07:52.45`	`*** join/#openmoko Xilent (n=mnskv@unaffiliated/xilent)`
`07:55.18`	`*** join/#openmoko qi_ (n=chi@173.8.107.9)`
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`07:57.05`	`Hopscotch`	`good morning`
`07:57.44`	`lindi-`	`opentrinity: better ask when you can debug it`
`07:58.45`	`*** join/#openmoko evolux (n=evolux@win4077.informatik.uni-wuerzburg.de)`
`07:59.42`	`*** join/#openmoko zogg_ (n=zogg@78-62-16-160.static.zebra.lt)`
`08:01.38`	`opentrinity`	`ok tx`
`08:02.32`	`zogg_`	`morning`
`08:02.43`	`*** join/#openmoko HauDyr (n=kim@wnn73219.wireless.dtu.dk)`
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`08:27.33`	`geaaru`	`anyone could be fix md5sum problem with testing/om-gta01 tree`
`08:27.39`	`geaaru`	`, please?`
`08:29.16`	`*** join/#openmoko vininim (n=vininim@pdpc/supporter/student/vininim)`
`08:29.41`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`mickey\|SYSTEMS: hi! how are you?`
`08:30.07`	`mickey\|SYSTEMS`	`my feet are aching ;)`
`08:30.34`	`mickey\|SYSTEMS`	`good, otherwise`
`08:30.42`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`:-)`
`08:31.13`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`lots of mokies?`
`08:31.19`	`*** join/#openmoko max_posedon (n=max_pose@leased-line-250-127.telecom.by)`
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`08:35.14`	`mickey\|SYSTEMS`	`some`
`08:35.21`	`*** join/#openmoko piksi (n=piksi@vipunen.hut.fi)`
`08:35.22`	`mickey\|SYSTEMS`	`U-Block rocks btw.`
`08:35.25`	`mickey\|SYSTEMS`	`http://scap.linuxtogo.org/files/95b5267cad5640eb125fc8a098284148.png`
`08:35.40`	`*** join/#openmoko Juice__ (n=jorutila@vipunen.hut.fi)`
`08:36.57`	`*** part/#openmoko rawtatoor (n=rawtatoo@c-67-163-214-238.hsd1.pa.comcast.net)`
`08:38.28`	`*** join/#openmoko alfatangoxt (n=michele@host163-55-dynamic.9-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it)`
`08:39.00`	`*** join/#openmoko aloril (n=aloril@dsl-tkubrasgw1-fe25fa00-28.dhcp.inet.fi)`
`08:40.09`	`*** join/#openmoko mrmoku (n=mok@ppp-93-104-111-53.dynamic.mnet-online.de)`
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`08:42.45`	`Kensan_`	`mickey\|SYSTEMS: did you take the boat? ;)`
`08:47.51`	`pb__`	`no, he walks along the bed of the river and breathes through a hollow reed`
`08:48.32`	`cjb_ie`	`because breathing through a solid one is tricky :-)`
`08:49.09`	`mickey\|SYSTEMS`	`Kensan_: heh`
`08:49.11`	`pb__`	`right. always a man to learn from his mistakes, he won't be trying that again.`
`08:49.11`	`BobOfDoom`	`with the FR in a plastic bag`
`08:49.51`	`mickey\|SYSTEMS`	`that's not a river, but the freeway`
`08:49.54`	`Kensan_`	`pb__: it's actually an interstate road I believe ;)`
`08:50.31`	`BobOfDoom`	`it's a river with exit lanes :D`
`08:50.56`	`pb__`	`Kensan: oh dear, in that case he must have looked rather foolish`
`08:51.23`	`pb__`	`let's hope there was not too much traffic at the time`
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`08:52.16`	`pb__`	`mickey\|SYSTEMS: right, I have erased my rootfs. reflashing now, fingers crossed.`
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`09:01.42`	`pb__`	`mickey\|SYSTEMS: hm, better. but still not so good. no jffs2 errors this time, and I do at least see "INIT: version 2.85 booting", but that's as far as it goes.`
`09:01.45`	`pb__`	`evidently something is still broken`
`09:02.12`	`pb__`	`gotta go to a meeting with our lawyers now but I will look at it again later`
`09:04.18`	`mickey\|SYSTEMS`	`ok, cool`
`09:04.20`	`mickey\|SYSTEMS`	`good speed`
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`09:11.58`	`trickie\|work`	`torindel: is your OM gentoo overlay available ATM?`
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`09:33.51`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: 03charlie 07framework * r4536568f9471 10/framework/subsystems/opimd/pimd_contacts.py:`
`09:33.52`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: opimd: fix a few things`
`09:33.52`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: * return DBus path instead of uri`
`09:33.52`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: * GetMultipleResults actually returns a list`
`09:33.54`	`beni_`	`how do you do updates? from ssh or do you type that "opkg upgrade" within the terminal?`
`09:35.25`	`viq`	`Either shouldwork, but you need network connection, so you might just as well do it over ssh`
`09:35.29`	`*** join/#openmoko polaru (n=polaru@193.138.97.30)`
`09:36.31`	`*** join/#openmoko hannes-s (n=Hannes_S@d019130.adsl.hansenet.de)`
`09:36.40`	`trickie\|work`	`beni_: if you are updating your ssh server it will restart so be mindful of that`
`09:36.57`	`lindi-`	`openssh does not kill the connections fortunately`
`09:37.13`	`*** join/#openmoko toggles_w (n=toggles@tommywatson.com)`
`09:37.24`	`trickie\|work`	`no but dropbear does, not sure if that is still default`
`09:37.27`	`*** join/#openmoko KenSentMe_ (n=KenSentM@145.93.104.149)`
`09:38.09`	`trickie\|work`	`if you have a dropbear, then a 'nohup opkg upgrade dropbear & ' will work from a ssh login, then once it restarts you can reconnect`
`09:38.10`	`dns53`	`use screen if you are concerned with drop outs`
`09:38.35`	`trickie\|work`	`yes or that :)`
`09:38.46`	`Kensan_`	`dns53: +1`
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`09:44.49`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: 03charlie 07framework * r9eded9bb80c6 10/tests/opimd.py: tests: added test for opimd ContactQuery.GetMultipleResults`
`09:54.41`	`Weiss`	`wonders if he's the only one who REALLY doesn't like Trac`
`09:54.43`	`*** join/#openmoko laBrute (n=wax@218.1.111.178)`
`09:54.48`	`laBrute`	`hi guys`
`09:55.02`	`laBrute`	`when will openmoko be released for general consumers normally ?`
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`09:56.15`	`Kensan_`	`laBrute: when the software is stable and ready I guess.`
`09:56.48`	`Weiss`	`laBrute: you can't tell "general consumers" what they're going to like, so i guess "when the general consumers decide it's ready for them" is the best possible answer`
`09:57.02`	`laBrute`	`Kensan_, i know, but is there any deadline, and approximately ?`
`09:58.08`	`Kensan_`	`laBrute: judging by the state of the software it's still going to be a while... you would need to ask somebody inside Openmoko.`
`09:58.55`	`*** join/#openmoko hipitihop (n=denis@203.221.91.97)`
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`09:59.31`	`hipitihop`	`waves good evening to the inmates`
`10:00.34`	`hipitihop`	`wonders if android is any closer to running on the FR`
`10:00.55`	`Kensan_`	`Weiss: well what they like/don't like is one thing but the product must meet certain criteria to be considered "ready", meaning there's functionality that consumers expect of the product. Stability for example is one of these things..`
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`10:01.15`	`Kensan_`	`hipitihop: you might want to read openmoko-kernel.`
`10:01.16`	`cjb_ie`	`Kensan_: have you /used/ any commercial phones? :-)`
`10:01.40`	`Kensan_`	`cjb: yes, and I can place phonecalls and write sms reliably.`
`10:01.51`	`cjb_ie`	`out of my last four, only the non-PDA ones have been anything like what i'd call stable`
`10:02.00`	`cjb_ie`	`actually make that my last six.`
`10:02.38`	`cjb_ie`	`treo 680, sonyericsson p910i, sonyericsson p800, visorphone. all had major usability and stability issues.`
`10:02.47`	`Kensan_`	`cjb_ie: that may very well be but the consumers are not happy with that. This is no excuse for the FR to have the same issues.`
`10:03.01`	`cjb_ie`	`only the nokia "just a phone" phones have actually been stable.`
`10:03.28`	`cjb_ie`	`Kensan_: the horrid unstable stuff still manages to sell, though :(`
`10:04.04`	`cjb_ie`	`there's a book, the design of everyday things (aka the psychology of everyday things) which explores related issues a bit`
`10:04.15`	`Kensan_`	`cjb_ie: sure, if you have an established company which is already in the market you have the power to push crappy products to some extent.`
`10:04.50`	`cjb_ie`	`people don't buy what will actually be good for them (usability, stability); they buy what they think will be good for them (i.e. big feature list).`
`10:05.15`	`Kensan_`	`gotta run bbl`
`10:05.49`	`cjb_ie`	`me too. later`
`10:09.42`	`laBrute`	`Kensan_, thx`
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`10:26.17`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: 03vesa.pikki 07gsmd2 * rbcd538ebac69 10/ (25 files in 4 dirs):`
`10:26.18`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: Updated dbus Call and SIM interfaces to newer ones`
`10:26.18`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: All existing changed methods have been updated. Method stubs for the new ones have been added.`
`10:26.18`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: Applied Keith Mok's patch on sending messages with odd phone number length`
`10:27.30`	`spyre`	`a long overdue commit for gsmd2 :)`
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`10:45.59`	`ieatlint`	`ok, i can confirm beyond any doubt that the garmin gps-10x uses a compatible battery to the OM, and can charge OM batteries (including deep discharged ones)`
`10:47.00`	`*** join/#openmoko Hire (n=hire@host131-236-dynamic.33-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it)`
`10:47.33`	`Elleo`	`ieatlint: cool`
`10:47.48`	`*** join/#openmoko rddDavid51 (n=roudoudo@gar31-1-82-224-8-235.fbx.proxad.net)`
`10:48.37`	`tomer_work`	`ieatlint: do you mean that i can use Garmin's battery with my FR?`
`10:48.47`	`tomer_work`	`or just that i can use it's charger`
`10:48.54`	`ieatlint`	`yes, to both`
`10:48.54`	`tomer_work`	`its*`
`10:49.02`	`tomer_work`	`oh, cool`
`10:49.10`	`ieatlint`	`however, using the garmin's battery with the freerunner has disadvantages`
`10:49.23`	`tomer_work`	`:\|`
`10:49.23`	`ieatlint`	`it will not report it's capacity (that's a specific feature of the OM battery)`
`10:49.31`	`*** join/#openmoko odlg (n=od@0x4dd4ced5.adsl.cybercity.dk)`
`10:49.41`	`ieatlint`	`and i am unsure if it will charge the garmin battery... my guess is it will, but i haven't tested`
`10:49.53`	`tomer_work`	`ieatlint: i'll just count 4 hrs from the time i unplug it ;)`
`10:50.37`	`ieatlint`	`you don't need to`
`10:51.10`	`ieatlint`	`if you monitor the current to the battery from the pmu... there won't be a negative charge (ie, battery sucking power) if it can't/won't charge`
`10:51.20`	`ieatlint`	`i can test this, give me a couple min`
`10:51.47`	`tomer_work`	`this should be on the wiki... good stuff`
`10:52.48`	`odlg`	`Hi! I am using fso-testing - recently I have had major problems getting a GPS fix, am I the only one?`
`10:53.55`	`cjb_ie`	`odlg: is the link in the topic relevant to you?`
`10:54.56`	`odlg`	`Dont think so, it worked just fine until 1-2 weeks ago`
`10:55.15`	`odlg`	`There has been a couple of kernel updates, suspecting that is the cause`
`10:59.09`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`ieatlint: (garminbat) could U add to wiki?`
`10:59.14`	`*** join/#openmoko opentrinity (i=59764e0a@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-2791761b577b274c)`
`10:59.52`	`ieatlint`	`apparently the pmu just seems to freak out when it can't read bat stats`
`11:00.19`	`ieatlint`	`so yeah, the only way to see if it can charge the garmin battery is to plug it in with the phone on and see if it dies, hah`
`11:01.31`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`ieatlint: re PMU: no, won't care`
`11:02.37`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`ieatlint: readout isn't even done via PMU`
`11:02.42`	`*** join/#openmoko leachim_dot_eu (n=Leachim@78.43.157.40)`
`11:03.21`	`*** join/#openmoko alephnull_ (n=alok@122.167.70.159)`
`11:03.29`	`toggles_w`	`ieatlint: so the battery display will not work with the gps-10x bat?`
`11:03.45`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`nope`
`11:03.56`	`ieatlint`	`DocScrutinizer2, when i try to cat "current_now" in sys, i get a "Timer Error"`
`11:04.12`	`toggles_w`	`DocScrutinizer2: thankx`
`11:04.19`	`toggles_w`	`^x^s`
`11:04.21`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`i'd guess that's bat readout`
`11:04.29`	`*** join/#openmoko HauDyr (n=kim@wnn73219.wireless.dtu.dk)`
`11:04.38`	`ieatlint`	`ok, i added the garmin battery for the gps 10x to the wiki`
`11:04.43`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`obviously cant work with alien bat`
`11:04.53`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`tnx`
`11:05.01`	`ieatlint`	`i'm currently charging an OM battery in the garmin gps 10x... i'm going to wait for it to finish/explode before reporting it as viable`
`11:05.10`	`toggles_w`	`lol`
`11:05.13`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`lol`
`11:05.27`	`*** join/#openmoko Ainulindale (n=ainu@calaquendi.org)`
`11:05.38`	`ieatlint`	`it's ok, the fire department has excellent response times for my house, and i've excellent medical insurance`
`11:05.52`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`worst thing might be internal protection cutoff`
`11:06.00`	`BobOfDoom`	`IIRC the OM battery has overcharge prevention builtin itself`
`11:06.12`	`ieatlint`	`wouldn't surprise me`
`11:06.19`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`thats it`
`11:06.26`	`ieatlint`	`but it's a li-ion charger to begin with... it shouldn't be an issue at all`
`11:06.36`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`yup`
`11:06.49`	`ieatlint`	`fine, i'll add it now and remove it if it explodes`
`11:07.02`	`*** join/#openmoko polaru_ (n=polaru@193.138.97.30)`
`11:07.06`	`BobOfDoom`	`XD`
`11:07.16`	`ieatlint`	`hmm... come to think of it, it's charging next to two monitors totalling $3k... that'd be worse than acid burns on meself`
`11:07.27`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`as long as it doesn't rely on special function of third pin`
`11:07.39`	`*** join/#openmoko jas4711 (n=jas@c80-216-18-41.bredband.comhem.se)`
`11:08.23`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`ieatlint: usually won't explode :-)`
`11:09.14`	`ieatlint`	`seeing as the garmin device itself i believe is incapable of reporting capacity...`
`11:09.39`	`*** join/#openmoko datachaos (n=datachao@189.6.250.25)`
`11:09.43`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`gta01 bat had temp sensor`
`11:09.51`	`ieatlint`	`plus that'd be the most idiotic thing ever... rely on the battery saying "okay, 100%" ... and then even stupider, blindly charge it when it doesn't report any capacity info`
`11:10.54`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`so 01 won't charge 02 because of missing temp feedback`
`11:11.19`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`maybe garmin is similar`
`11:11.48`	`ieatlint`	`hmmm, actually... i haven't tested it fullz`
`11:11.50`	`ieatlint`	`fully`
`11:12.01`	`ieatlint`	`i can only confirm that the charge light is on, lol`
`11:12.22`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`thats a good sign`
`11:12.43`	`ieatlint`	`except that the charge light remained on after i removed the battery from it`
`11:12.44`	`*** join/#openmoko Stroller (n=Stroller@213.152.39.89)`
`11:12.52`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`duh`
`11:12.53`	`ieatlint`	`i killed a battery to test it (ran it dead)`
`11:13.01`	`ieatlint`	`left it in the garmin for about 15min now`
`11:13.17`	`ieatlint`	`and previously i couldn't get into uboot, it's not mostly booted the phone after 15min`
`11:13.50`	`ieatlint`	`11% charged... excellent`
`11:13.58`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`15 min should suffice to boot 02`
`11:14.32`	`ieatlint`	`unfortunately the garmin gps10x is $76`
`11:14.38`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`so this means garmin charging 02bat confirmed?`
`11:14.48`	`ieatlint`	`yes, confirmed`
`11:14.55`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`:-)`
`11:14.58`	`ieatlint`	`and on the wiki`
`11:15.10`	`ieatlint`	`it's a nice bt gps device though`
`11:15.13`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`:-) *2`
`11:15.26`	`ieatlint`	`i use to use it with my nokia n80, and have used it with some laptops`
`11:16.24`	`ieatlint`	`i'm still convinced a generic li-ion charger will work with the FR bats`
`11:16.38`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`sure`
`11:17.07`	`dns53`	`possible yes, safe who knows`
`11:17.08`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`its generic, its universal`
`11:17.26`	`ieatlint`	`the ER knows`
`11:18.06`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`dns53: theres always bat internal prot to keep it safe`
`11:18.36`	`dns53`	`i would not trust it if you are using another charger but it's up to you`
`11:18.42`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`livetime and wear might see impact`
`11:18.42`	`*** join/#openmoko Varox (n=Varox@p4FD4797A.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`11:18.50`	`ieatlint`	`sparkfun sells generic li-ion chargers for as low as $17`
`11:19.17`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`~docscrutinizer`
`11:19.18`	`apt`	`rumour has it, docscrutinizer is jOERG, a HW-developer and engineer of Openmoko`
`11:20.14`	`ieatlint`	`rumours are always true -- politics have taught me so`
`11:21.08`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`dns53: there is decent prot in 02 bat`
`11:21.22`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`~docscrutinizer`
`11:21.23`	`apt`	`i heard docscrutinizer is jOERG, a HW-developer and engineer of Openmoko`
`11:21.43`	`ieatlint`	`let's see...`
`11:21.46`	`ieatlint`	`~ieatlint`
`11:22.02`	`ieatlint`	`all sorts of useful info on me`
`11:22.09`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`:-D`
`11:23.00`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`apt: ieatlint is the garmin guy`
`11:23.01`	`apt`	`okay, DocScrutinizer2`
`11:23.08`	`ieatlint`	`hardly`
`11:23.27`	`ieatlint`	`i now how more non-garmin gps devices than garmin`
`11:23.45`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`~ieatlint`
`11:23.45`	`apt`	`hmm... ieatlint is the garmin guy`
`11:23.46`	`ieatlint`	`2x FR, 1x htc dream and 2x garmin ... see!`
`11:24.07`	`ieatlint`	`apt: ieatlint is a 15 year old girl looking for a good time`
`11:24.08`	`apt`	`...but ieatlint is already something else...`
`11:24.10`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`;-)`
`11:24.14`	`ieatlint`	`damn you!`
`11:25.20`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`~ieatlint`
`11:25.24`	`*** join/#openmoko Morge (n=mt@062016213048.customer.alfanett.no)`
`11:26.31`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`apt: ieatlint is a 15 year old girl looking for a good time`
`11:26.32`	`apt`	`okay, DocScrutinizer2`
`11:26.42`	`ieatlint`	`hehe`
`11:26.53`	`ieatlint`	`imagine the paedophiles i'll meet now..`
`11:27.44`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`apt: forget ieatlint`
`11:27.45`	`apt`	`DocScrutinizer2: i forgot ieatlint`
`11:28.03`	`ieatlint`	`i've been told that's a pretty easy task`
`11:30.17`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: 03sudharsh 07openmoko-gsoc2008 * rfa687d022e2a 10/fsod/ (7 files in 4 dirs):`
`11:30.17`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: Add Python Plugin Manager skeleton. Still TODO, does nothing. Just some`
`11:30.17`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: GOB stuff`
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`12:07.50`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`joerg`
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`12:08.34`	`DocScrutinizer2`	`mpf talking to myself`
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`12:38.22`	`dolf1074`	`all busy with compiling android?`
`12:38.36`	`dns53`	`will it work with an arm 4?`
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`12:38.46`	`dolf1074`	`yes`
`12:38.54`	`dns53`	`cool`
`12:38.55`	`dolf1074`	`the source is released`
`12:38.58`	`snp_`	`as I understood it was just a recompile..`
`12:39.14`	`dolf1074`	`snp_: it's more than a recompile`
`12:39.26`	`dolf1074`	`all the specific function for arm5 has to be rewritten`
`12:39.35`	`snp_`	`yuck`
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`12:40.10`	`dolf1074`	`I've heard the kernel is already done (or is almost don)`
`12:40.22`	`Kensan_`	`see openmoko-kernel ml`
`12:41.10`	`dolf1074`	`Is it true the kernel is almost done?`
`12:41.15`	`toggles_w`	dolf1074: it's simple; `find /andriod \| xargs -n 1 sed -e 's/clz/nop/g'`
`12:41.26`	`Shlee`	`Android would be an interesting port.. if they can it functional without the keyboard`
`12:41.59`	`dns53`	`android does support touch screen only devices i believe`
`12:42.07`	`dolf1074`	`toggles_w: but it's should be handy if I know what other people already has done, because from there I should start`
`12:42.25`	`dolf1074`	`dns53: Yes but android is build with in mind that there is a real keyboard included`
`12:42.30`	`toggles_w`	`dolf1074: ask mwester`
`12:42.32`	`snp_`	`http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-kernel/2008-October/005966.html sounds promising`
`12:42.45`	`dolf1074`	`dns53: So there isn't an onscreen keyboard`
`12:43.11`	`dolf1074`	`toggles_w: on email?`
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`12:48.32`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: 03daniel 07framework * r1a6d390f796c 10/framework/subsystems/ogpsd/om.py:`
`12:48.32`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: ogpsd: Clean up the GPS time calculation (Thanks Jan)`
`12:48.32`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: The previous time calculation code was a mess and in the end only worked`
`12:48.32`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: because two errors cancelled each other out.`
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`12:51.28`	`snp_`	`dolf1074: there exist something called ShapeWriter WritingPad, but how it actually work I don't know..`
`12:51.55`	`dolf1074`	`snp_: maybe there was a better way to contact him`
`12:52.27`	`snp_`	`http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-kernel/2008-October/006010.html email the adress on the top? :9`
`12:54.22`	`Kensan_`	`dolf1074: you can talk to bricode`
`12:54.43`	`dolf1074`	`ok, thanks. Will do it`
`12:56.02`	`Kensan_`	`dolf1074: he's working on the Android port for Koolu. Maybe he will be in later`
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`12:56.39`	`dolf1074`	`So they are the two who are basically working on porting the android?`
`12:57.31`	`Kensan_`	`dolf1074: Sean and Brian both have the kernel up and running afaik. I believe they will pool ressources on all further ports since they are working towards the same goal.`
`12:58.05`	`Kensan_`	`dolf1074: the patches against the openmoko kernel tree are also on the ML if you are keen on building the kernel yourself.`
`12:58.19`	`dolf1074`	`I've already found that :)`
`12:58.23`	`Shlee`	`I assume they are going to push the patches towards the android git`
`12:58.47`	`dolf1074`	`They will try to push it on the openmoko kernel (that's what i've read)`
`12:58.58`	`Shlee`	`Isn't that backwards`
`12:59.31`	`dolf1074`	`It's how you look`
`13:00.11`	`dolf1074`	`if you start with the android kernel, you have to strip the android specific things and pull in the openmoko things. and vice versa`
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`13:00.45`	`Dave`	`:p`
`13:01.06`	`dolf1074`	`Let me explain it different: The 2 kernels have to same base, so where you put the patches, it doesn't care`
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`13:32.52`	`bricode`	`Good morning...`
`13:33.22`	`bricode`	`Android stack changes will be pushed back to Google. Patches for the kernel will be pushed to Openmoko.`
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`13:34.08`	`dolf1074`	`thanks for the clarity ;)`
`13:34.17`	`bricode`	`I've been in contact with Sean, have had a reply, and am waiting for some more information.`
`13:34.50`	`bricode`	`The patches I've got for the kernel are somewhat big and ugly, so I'm in the process of making them a little more palatable to integrate into the Openmoko tree.`
`13:35.15`	`dolf1074`	`nice`
`13:35.29`	`dolf1074`	`and they will come in the stable branch?`
`13:38.36`	`swetland`	`yawns`
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`13:41.13`	`bricode`	`Sean actually submitted a patch last night/this morning, so it will probably be in stable soon.`
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`14:02.25`	`Kensan_`	`dolf1074: the ultimate goal is not to push it in either android or openmoko but to mainline kernel.`
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`14:28.19`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: 03daniel 07framework * r3901ed206df4 10/tools/cli-framework: cli-framework: Crop readline history to 1000 lines`
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`14:35.58`	`rebelThor`	`how in the world do you suspend FSO ? :(`
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`14:39.33`	`mwester`	`rebelThor: Send the correct DBus message.`
`14:40.14`	`rebelThor`	`mwester: yeah, i figured that, but shouldn't it work by pressing the button?`
`14:40.31`	`mwester`	`Well, that depends on what you think the FSO image is.`
`14:40.54`	`mwester`	`From the FSO team's point-of-view, FSO is a framework, and provides no GUI -- zhone (the gui) is just a test tool.`
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`14:41.22`	`mwester`	`So you need to have a real GUI to drive FSO --- that's what the SHR project (among others I suspect) is trying to build.`
`14:41.26`	`CVirus`	`mwester: I don't think people will ever understand this`
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`14:42.00`	`mwester`	`CVirus: I am coming around to mickey\|munich's thinking that perhaps they should have stuck with command line tools for testing instead of Zhone.`
`14:42.25`	`toggles_w`	`no wah, zhone rocks`
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`14:42.28`	`mwester`	`But what is funny is that in as much as Zhone is just for testing, it is still better than the 2008.9 stuff shipping from Om!`
`14:42.52`	`CVirus`	`true`
`14:42.56`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: 03daniel 07framework * r6c103070b07b 10/framework/subsystems/ogpsd/nmea.py: ogpsd: Remove dbus imports from nmea.py`
`14:42.57`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: 03daniel 07framework * r77f722f03a88 10/framework/subsystems/ogpsd/gpschannel.py:`
`14:42.57`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: ogpsd: Save the path in FileChannel constructor`
`14:42.57`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: After introducing initializeChannel and shutdownChannel methods we need`
`14:42.59`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: to save the path in the constructor so we can access it in`
`14:43.01`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: initializeChannel. This functionality should probably go to the base`
`14:43.03`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: class instead.`
`14:43.05`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: 03daniel 07framework * r82e4b025af14 10/framework/subsystems/ogpsd/gpschannel.py: ogpsd: Fix shutdown logic of the SerialChannel`
`14:43.06`	`mwester`	`(er, I should qualify that -- personal opinion).`
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`14:51.48`	`rebelThor`	`mwester: SHR wouldn't suspend either`
`14:52.31`	`mwester`	`Ok :( Bug or did they not yet implement that?`
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`14:53.05`	`mwester`	`It might be that suspend isn't high on the priority list. Suspend works perfectly -- but resume often fails on the freerunner.`
`14:54.20`	`Kensan_`	`mwester: afaik mickey\|munich contemplated on removing all UI stuff from the FSO images just to make clear, that it's a devel image.`
`14:56.10`	`rebelThor`	`so anyone knows the dbus message for suspending?`
`14:56.16`	`rebelThor`	`been searching for it for a while`
`14:57.06`	`mickey\|munich`	`org.freesmartphone.Usage.Suspend()`
`14:57.32`	`Raigedas`	`i see that zhone is responsible for dimming (making blank) the screen. where is the configuration so that i could turn off this feature? i installed debian on my FR and want to read ebooks but screen turns off after few seconds.`
`14:59.13`	`mwester`	`Raigedas: zhone is python -- so just edit it!`
`14:59.25`	`Kensan_`	`mickey\|munich: Just a quick remark about your oe-commit that was just shown by CIA-25. Is that your "official oe commit" emailaddress?`
`14:59.28`	`Raigedas`	`mm.. ok`
`15:00.54`	`mickey\|munich`	`Raigedas: zhone no longer does dimming`
`15:00.59`	`mickey\|munich`	`oevents does it`
`15:01.02`	`mickey\|munich`	`see the rules.yaml file`
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`15:01.13`	`mickey\|munich`	`timings can be edited in frameworkd.conf`
`15:01.43`	`mickey\|munich`	`Kensan_: oooh`
`15:01.45`	`Raigedas`	`thanks very much, i will check`
`15:01.50`	`mickey\|munich`	`Kensan_: that#s wrong, thanks`
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`15:03.43`	`Kensan_`	`mickey\|munich: yeah, I just saw it and thought somebody should give you a heads up :)`
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`15:37.07`	`PBeck`	`hallo`
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`16:17.56`	`Gast_951_`	`hi`
`16:18.02`	`*** part/#openmoko Gast_951_ (n=Gast_951@xdsl-213-196-253-188.netcologne.de)`
`16:18.39`	`*** join/#openmoko mgregson (n=mgregson@129-97-136-104.uwaterloo.ca)`
`16:23.35`	`slaxxin`	`http://www.tuxbrain.com/fdom_en.html`
`16:23.43`	`slaxxin`	`so im waiting`
`16:26.29`	`slaxxin`	`nothing yet`
`16:26.56`	`Kensan_`	`slaxxin: what are you waiting for?`
`16:27.39`	`*** join/#openmoko hobitti (n=hobitti@a91-153-191-67.elisa-laajakaista.fi)`
`16:27.57`	`toggles_w`	`xmas, it's coming`
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`16:38.18`	`slaxxin`	`download`
`16:39.59`	`slaxxin`	`no file yet`
`16:41.08`	`*** join/#openmoko freelock (n=john@dsl081-165-076.sea1.dsl.speakeasy.net)`
`16:41.09`	`slaxxin`	`wheres the jffs2 file?`
`16:41.20`	`*** join/#openmoko Basheri (n=Arttu@hehz.net)`
`16:43.25`	`slaxxin`	`how do i operate the fdomizer script?`
`16:43.53`	`Kensan_`	`slaxxin: http://www.tuxbrain.com/fdom/Fat_and_Dirty_OM.200809_20081023.rootfs.jff2`
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`16:46.46`	`slaxxin`	`which kernel the same old 1?`
`16:48.02`	`*** join/#openmoko opentrinity (n=opentrin@host219-62-dynamic.15-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it)`
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`16:53.13`	`Cervajz`	`Hello, how can I change a default volume of speaker ? Because it's too quiet when I'm calling`
`16:53.18`	`Cervajz`	`I have Om2008.9`
`16:55.18`	`Cervajz`	`When I set volume through alsamixer, it's automaticlly set to 77 % when I start a call`
`16:55.24`	`Cervajz`	`(i'm sorry for my English)`
`16:55.44`	`opentrinity`	`hi i have a problem with opkg update....i ping www.google.it but opkg don't download anything`
`16:56.08`	`mattl`	`opentrinity: can you wget http://www.google.it/ ?`
`16:56.58`	`opentrinity`	`yes`
`16:57.23`	`opentrinity`	`(not google ;-)`
`16:57.50`	`opentrinity`	`i have donloaded a script in a forum`
`16:58.09`	`opentrinity`	`(i have a pppoe connection)`
`17:01.04`	`Cervajz`	`Nobody, please? :(`
`17:01.41`	`*** join/#openmoko alfatangoxt (n=michele@host61-206-dynamic.9-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it)`
`17:02.18`	`Cervajz`	`I know, that i must change some default values for qtopia-dialer, but I don't know where :(`
`17:02.30`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: 03daniel 07framework * r1dffd1aad91c 10/framework/subsystems/ogsmd/gsm/const.py: ogsmd: Fix typo in const.py`
`17:02.30`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: 03daniel 07framework * ra978a13b41bc 10/framework/subsystems/ogsmd/ (gsm/sms.py modems/abstract/mediator.py):`
`17:02.30`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: ogsmd: Introduce PDUAddress.guess for guessing number types and use it`
`17:02.31`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: PDUAddress.guess() will try to figure out what kind on address`
`17:02.33`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: (international number, national number, alphanumeric) is called and set`
`17:02.35`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: the numbertype appropriately.`
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`17:11.52`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: 03daniel 07framework * r1c9a049dc1c1 10/framework/subsystems/ogpsd/gpsdevice.py: ogpsd: Log info for the DBus Signals`
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`17:14.21`	`mani\|work`	`Bye`
`17:18.08`	`*** join/#openmoko df_aldur (n=df@aldur.torak.ewdc.nl.bowerham.net)`
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`17:21.17`	`df_aldur`	`what's the latest available version of qtopia / qte?`
`17:24.34`	`donomo`	`df_aldur: http://qtextended.org/modules/devices/openmoko.php says 4.3.2`
`17:26.08`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: 03daniel 07framework * re908b182261c 10/framework/subsystems/ogsmd/modems/ti_calypso/unsolicited.py:`
`17:26.08`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: ogsmd: [TI Calypso] Return False in _reactivateDeepSleep`
`17:26.09`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: This function is added as a timer from _checkRecampingBug in order to`
`17:26.09`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: reenable deep sleep. Not returning False leads to many`
`17:26.10`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: _reactivateDeepSleep being scheduled over time (if you're suffering from`
`17:26.12`	`CIA-49`	`freesmartphone.org: Bug #1024).`
`17:26.32`	`df_aldur`	`yep, which puzzles me because I have 4.3.3 installed, and I'm sure 4.3.4 was announced a while back`
`17:26.48`	`*** join/#openmoko vallor (i=scott@pdpc/supporter/monthlygold/vallor)`
`17:27.40`	`slaxxin`	`yay the link is working`
`17:30.59`	`*** join/#openmoko kirun (n=kirun@207.88.125.91.rb4.adsl.brightview.com)`
`17:32.19`	`slaxxin`	`anybody have fdom_latest running?`
`17:33.27`	`Tig\|`	`slaxxin: I think so`
`17:33.39`	`slaxxin`	`the community has recieved the ball ,,and are now starting to turn upfield`
`17:34.04`	`Tig\|`	`unless there have been fresh images since yesterday`
`17:34.14`	`slaxxin`	`just now`
`17:34.15`	`*** join/#openmoko jpieper (n=jpieper@207-180-187-171.c3-0.smr-ubr3.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com)`
`17:34.20`	`Tig\|`	`ah`
`17:34.25`	`*** join/#openmoko ajbrun (n=ajbrun@host81-159-5-72.range81-159.btcentralplus.com)`
`17:34.25`	`*** join/#openmoko open\|FAiDA (i=opentrin@host23-7-dynamic.0-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it)`
`17:34.34`	`slaxxin`	`http://www.tuxbrain.com/fdom_en.html`
`17:35.37`	`slaxxin`	`as soon as i get done installing im going to have a 2 hout power outage`
`17:35.45`	`opentrinity`	`someone could help me to understand why i can ping and wget but opkg update doesn't worg?`
`17:35.48`	`slaxxin`	`for repairs`
`17:36.40`	`slaxxin`	`can u dns?`
`17:36.58`	`slaxxin`	`ie.. www.google.bla`
`17:37.08`	`opentrinity`	`yes`
`17:37.33`	`slaxxin`	`does opkg just exit quietly?`
`17:37.44`	`opentrinity`	`no do nothing`
`17:37.59`	`sicu`	`opentrinity: what distro? correct feeds ... repositories ?`
`17:38.04`	`slaxxin`	`did ya just flash the latest image?`
`17:38.09`	`*** join/#openmoko pleemans (n=toi@d54C2AAB7.access.telenet.be)`
`17:38.20`	`opentrinity`	`Downloading http://downloads.openmoko.org/repository/Multiverse/Packages.gz`
`17:38.23`	`opentrinity`	`2008.9`
`17:38.51`	`opentrinity`	`i have a pppoe connection (i don't have a router)`
`17:39.18`	`slaxxin`	`well get 1`
`17:39.36`	`opentrinity`	`?`
`17:39.44`	`slaxxin`	`cause its crazy to have a computer act as a router`
`17:39.53`	`opentrinity`	`:-(`
`17:40.17`	`df_aldur`	`meh, iptables is easier to configure than most routers`
`17:40.33`	`opentrinity`	`i can solve the problem?`
`17:40.44`	`opentrinity`	`(u can hal me :-( )`
`17:40.48`	`opentrinity`	`help*`
`17:40.50`	`df_aldur`	`can you wget that file?`
`17:41.24`	`opentrinity`	`no`
`17:41.33`	`opentrinity`	`Connecting to downloads.openmoko.org (88.198.93.219:80)`
`17:41.44`	`df_aldur`	`but you can wget other stuff?`
`17:41.51`	`opentrinity`	`remains in that line`
`17:42.17`	`*** join/#openmoko ascot (n=ascot@81-223-127-237.stpeter.xdsl-line.inode.at)`
`17:43.11`	`opentrinity`	`yes for example wget http://blog.tugulab.org/wp-content/uploads/2008/08/om-internet.sh`
`17:43.14`	`opentrinity`	`works`
`17:43.16`	`df_aldur`	`weird`
`17:43.18`	`df_aldur`	`dns is fine`
`17:43.33`	`Dave`	`How are we today, gentlemen?`
`17:43.33`	`opentrinity`	`df_aldur, port 80 ?`
`17:43.36`	`Dave`	`and slaxxin`
`17:43.37`	`df_aldur`	`and the site's up because I just tried myself`
`17:43.41`	`*** join/#openmoko cga (n=cga@94.36.121.222)`
`17:44.18`	`slaxxin`	`20081023 FDOM comencing launch XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX`
`17:44.40`	`df_aldur`	`might replace qtopia with fdom, seems more active`
`17:44.41`	`*** join/#openmoko GISM (n=GISM@p5B09D1BD.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`17:45.06`	`slaxxin`	`i like qtx but i got bored`
`17:45.11`	`opentrinity`	`:-(`
`17:45.27`	`*** join/#openmoko kuzgun (n=deniz@unaffiliated/kuzgun)`
`17:45.32`	`df_aldur`	`I'm dual booting debian for when I want something geekier`
`17:45.33`	`slaxxin`	`bkRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR`
`17:45.44`	`*** part/#openmoko c0d3x42 (n=vince@cpc3-barn5-0-0-cust613.brnt.cable.ntl.com)`
`17:46.10`	`df_aldur`	`opentrinity: what does the NAT config on your computer look like?`
`17:46.10`	`slaxxin`	`yea it needs some buttons`
`17:46.22`	`Dave`	`more like slaxxin needs to get rid of that cat :p`
`17:46.35`	`slaxxin`	`mooo`
`17:47.42`	`Dave`	`mÃ¸Ã¸Ã¸Ã¸Ã¸Ã¸Ã¸Ã¸`
`17:47.43`	`slaxxin`	`i sii`
`17:47.43`	`slaxxin`	`<PROTECTED>`
`17:47.44`	`opentrinity`	`df_aldur, sorry but ...i don't know:-8`
`17:47.52`	`slaxxin`	`boots an a green racing stripe`
`17:47.54`	`df_aldur`	`didn't you set it up?`
`17:47.54`	`slaxxin`	`<PROTECTED>`
`17:48.00`	`opentrinity`	`no`
`17:48.10`	`df_aldur`	`er, who did?`
`17:48.23`	`Dave`	`silences slaxxin`
`17:48.33`	`opentrinity`	`is standard settings`
`17:48.37`	`opentrinity`	`debian*`
`17:48.50`	`slaxxin`	`<PROTECTED>`
`17:48.52`	`slaxxin`	`<PROTECTED>`
`17:48.53`	`almien`	`hi. how do you clear the screen, restart the level, etc. in numpyphysics?`
`17:48.59`	`df_aldur`	`did you follow the instructions on the USB networking page?`
`17:49.12`	`slaxxin`	`<PROTECTED>`
`17:50.18`	`opentrinity`	`df_aldur, aldur yes iptables -A POSTROUTING -t nat -j MASQUERADE -s 192.168.0.0/24`
`17:50.18`	`opentrinity`	`sysctl -w net.ipv4.ip_forward=1`
`17:50.19`	`slaxxin`	`whip out the keyboard`
`17:50.39`	`df_aldur`	`right, ok`
`17:50.49`	`df_aldur`	`that first line is your NAT config`
`17:50.49`	`Dave`	`throws cats at slaxxin`
`17:50.55`	`opentrinity`	`k :-/`
`17:51.06`	`slaxxin`	`bubba_rue like cats`
`17:51.09`	`df_aldur`	`do you see any other lines if you type iptables-save?`
`17:51.30`	`slaxxin`	`fdom has mooookooo`
`17:51.45`	`*** join/#openmoko Quadduc (n=quadduc@216-145-97.211110.adsl.tele2.no)`
`17:51.49`	`opentrinity`	`df_aldur, aldur yes`
`17:52.18`	`opentrinity`	`:PREROUTING ACCEPT [285:19872]`
`17:52.18`	`opentrinity`	`:POSTROUTING ACCEPT [158:8574]`
`17:52.18`	`opentrinity`	`:OUTPUT ACCEPT [156:8456]`
`17:52.18`	`opentrinity`	`-A POSTROUTING -s 192.168.0.0/24 -j MASQUERADE`
`17:52.18`	`opentrinity`	`COMMIT`
`17:52.18`	`slaxxin`	`or maybe it just left my programs on?`
`17:52.35`	`opentrinity`	`etc`
`17:52.43`	`df_aldur`	`no other rules though?`
`17:52.47`	`df_aldur`	`ie lines starting with -A`
`17:52.59`	`opentrinity`	`no`
`17:53.20`	`df_aldur`	`can you wget the file from the computer?`
`17:53.40`	`opentrinity`	`i try`
`17:53.59`	`Dave`	`iptables \o/`
`17:54.37`	`opentrinity`	`df_aldur, :-/ how`
`17:55.04`	`opentrinity`	`whit scp or wget?`
`17:55.09`	`*** join/#openmoko lewis (n=lewis@189.120.110.183)`
`17:55.10`	`opentrinity`	`with-+`
`17:55.24`	`df_aldur`	`I mean can you successfully wget it from the computer?`
`17:55.30`	`*** join/#openmoko Jeti (n=chatzill@78-20-186-137.access.telenet.be)`
`17:55.58`	`opentrinity`	`i use wget with interner url...how i can wget something in pc?`
`17:56.31`	`slaxxin`	`set time in clock works correctly`
`17:56.38`	`gurugentoo`	`opentrinity: I have an apache server running, but scp is more convenient`
`17:56.47`	`Jeti`	`bricode: ping`
`17:56.56`	`*** join/#openmoko Schugy (n=chris@vpn7.hotsplots.net)`
`17:57.43`	`*** join/#openmoko drath (n=vmaster@p5B07F4D8.dip.t-dialin.net)`
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`17:58.16`	`Jeti`	`bricode: What does Sean mean with 'Android nearly fully functional' in http://n2.nabble.com/Android-codebase---Patch-set--1-tp1368755p1368755.html`
`17:59.32`	`*** join/#openmoko vallor (i=scott@pdpc/supporter/monthlygold/vallor)`
`17:59.34`	`*** join/#openmoko alfatangoxt (n=michele@79.23.203.173)`
`18:00.35`	`Jeti`	`Does he mean that Android starts, but the hardware specific things (like gsm modem) isn't working OR does he mean the full Monty?`
`18:01.15`	`lewis`	`Hi`
`18:01.39`	`lewis`	`I have one question about the kernel, does it uses initrd?`
`18:01.48`	`lindi-`	`lewis: depends on the distro`
`18:02.01`	`lewis`	`FDOM and Debian`
`18:02.29`	`lindi-`	`lewis: debian is soon going to use initramfs`
`18:02.33`	`*** join/#openmoko alex-weej (n=alex@host86-151-121-212.range86-151.btcentralplus.com)`
`18:02.36`	`lindi-`	`lewis: i have not found source code for FDOM so i don't know`
`18:02.36`	`slaxxin`	`dillo browser`
`18:03.08`	`Dave`	`pesky slaxxins`
`18:03.17`	`lewis`	`looks like use the same kernel than OM2008.08`
`18:06.31`	`*** join/#openmoko rddDavid51 (n=roudoudo@gar31-1-82-224-8-235.fbx.proxad.net)`
`18:06.44`	`*** join/#openmoko viq (n=viq@unaffiliated/viq)`
`18:07.50`	`*** join/#openmoko milos_ (n=mikici@92.36.129.8)`
`18:08.19`	`milos_`	`!logs`
`18:08.19`	`cdbot2`	`Channel logs for #openmoko are archived at:`
`18:08.20`	`cdbot2`	`http://hentges.net/tmp/logs/irc/%23openmoko`
`18:08.21`	`cdbot2`	`Live-logs are available at`
`18:08.23`	`cdbot2`	`http://hentges.net/tmp/logs/irc/livelogs/%23openmoko.livelog`
`18:08.25`	`cdbot2`	`See ?? help-logs for usage instructions`
`18:08.37`	`*** join/#openmoko abattis_ (n=abattis@eduroam-28-206.rdg.ac.uk)`
`18:09.06`	`abattis_`	`hi, i think i bricked my freerunner`
`18:09.11`	`abattis_`	`i did, sudo ./dfuscript.sh fr u-boot gta02v5_and_up-u-boot.bin`
`18:09.12`	`SpeedEvil`	`Oh noes!`
`18:09.19`	`SpeedEvil`	`abattis_: however.`
`18:09.31`	`abattis_`	`and it booted up fine the first time`
`18:09.36`	`SpeedEvil`	`abattis_: if you have a functioning recovery flash, then you can unbrick it.`
`18:09.36`	`abattis_`	`battery was well charged`
`18:09.41`	`abattis_`	`and now when i hit the power button, nothing happens`
`18:09.48`	`SpeedEvil`	`A)`
`18:09.49`	`*** join/#openmoko hannes-s (n=Hannes_S@d039160.adsl.hansenet.de)`
`18:10.03`	`SpeedEvil`	`Unplug USB and battery for 60s, plug in, and see what happens.`
`18:10.23`	`abattis_`	`i got it just last week, and used dfuscript to update to Fat_and_Dirty_OM.200809_20080927.rootfs.jffs2`
`18:10.42`	`abattis_`	`i tried 10 seconds, will try now :)`
`18:11.05`	`abattis_`	`and then used dfuscript to update kernel to Om2008.9.uImage.bin`
`18:11.16`	`abattis_`	`and then u-boot to gta02v5_and_up-u-boot.bin`
`18:12.10`	`*** join/#openmoko ScarEye (n=scareye@12.27.87.125)`
`18:12.14`	`abattis_`	`hahahaha hmm it now boots!`
`18:12.14`	`abattis_`	`lol`
`18:12.14`	`abattis_`	`how bizarre`
`18:12.31`	`abattis_`	`i think it might have been a suspend problem actually, since i didnt shut it down, thikning about it :)`
`18:13.13`	`*** join/#openmoko RedFlash (n=RedFlash@host103-106-dynamic.5-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it)`
`18:13.15`	`*** join/#openmoko lymeca (n=lymeca@unaffiliated/lymeca)`
`18:13.29`	`*** join/#openmoko froksen (n=froksen@87.54.254.190)`
`18:14.33`	`*** join/#openmoko lymeca (n=lymeca@unaffiliated/lymeca)`
`18:15.32`	`*** join/#openmoko Heinervdm (n=thomas@pD9E16268.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`18:16.34`	`*** join/#openmoko Schugy (n=chris@Q0800.q.pppool.de)`
`18:18.20`	`*** join/#openmoko micm_ (n=micm@p5087235E.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)`
`18:18.41`	`*** join/#openmoko hklein (n=hklein@i59F776E1.versanet.de)`
`18:19.09`	`*** join/#openmoko fale (n=fale@89-96-108-175.ip12.fastwebnet.it)`
`18:19.57`	`abattis_`	`sweet`
`18:20.01`	`abattis_`	`thanks SpeedEvil! :)`
`18:20.28`	`*** join/#openmoko Raigedas (n=OpenSour@hst-241-40.splius.lt)`
`18:20.59`	`SpeedEvil`	`:)`
`18:21.01`	`*** join/#openmoko RedFlash (n=RedFlash@host103-106-dynamic.5-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it)`
`18:21.16`	`*** join/#openmoko pb_ (n=pb@88-111-134-150.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com)`
`18:22.31`	`*** join/#openmoko ScarEye_ (n=scareye@12.27.87.66)`
`18:25.38`	`*** join/#openmoko leachim_dot_eu (n=Leachim@78.43.156.117)`
`18:28.08`	`Dave`	`Speedevil :)`
`18:28.23`	`*** join/#openmoko daMaestro (n=jon@fedora/damaestro)`
`18:31.40`	`*** part/#openmoko davi (i=davi@57.Red-88-2-100.staticIP.rima-tde.net)`
`18:33.07`	`*** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@139.84-48-212.nextgentel.com)`
`18:34.17`	`*** join/#openmoko Zoup (n=Zoup@91.98.73.252)`
`18:34.50`	`Zoup`	`i have upgraded uboot , result is lack of splash screen and unability to boot because lack of mtdparts variable , when i try loadenv i get "*** Warning - bad CRC or NAND, using default environment" , any idea ?`
`18:36.14`	`*** join/#openmoko alex-weej_ (n=alex@host86-151-121-212.range86-151.btcentralplus.com)`
`18:36.59`	`*** join/#openmoko drrk (n=kimball@aldur.torak.ewdc.nl.bowerham.net)`
`18:37.51`	`*** join/#openmoko ScarEye_ (n=scareye@12.27.87.66)`
`18:38.23`	`*** join/#openmoko alex-weej__ (n=alex@host86-151-121-212.range86-151.btcentralplus.com)`
`18:41.02`	`*** join/#openmoko apol (n=apol@84.78.178.63)`
`18:42.48`	`*** join/#openmoko johncylee (n=john@firewall.tw.openmoko.org)`
`18:43.17`	`*** join/#openmoko baze (n=baze@g226198058.adsl.alicedsl.de)`
`18:44.03`	`*** join/#openmoko vivijim (n=vivijim@unaffiliated/vivijim)`
`18:44.45`	`donomo`	`Zoup: just curious, why did you upgrade uboot?`
`18:45.16`	`*** join/#openmoko mickey\|munich (n=mickey@ppp-82-135-88-220.dynamic.mnet-online.de)`
`18:47.40`	`Zoup`	`donomo: good question`
`18:47.54`	`Jeti`	`bricode: ping`
`18:48.49`	`*** part/#openmoko drrk (n=kimball@aldur.torak.ewdc.nl.bowerham.net)`
`18:49.53`	`donomo`	`Zoup: heehee. seems dangerous to me`
`18:50.24`	`Zoup`	`donomo: keep that in mind! ;)`
`18:54.55`	`*** join/#openmoko snp (n=snp@c-4f668d48-74736162.cust.telenor.se)`
`18:55.24`	`*** join/#openmoko opentrinity (n=opentrin@79.0.241.43)`
`19:00.42`	`*** join/#openmoko ccube_ (n=ccube@ssh.ccube.de)`
`19:01.11`	`*** join/#openmoko Ainulindale (n=ainu@calaquendi.org)`
`19:03.14`	`*** join/#openmoko jancona (n=jancona@38.97.74.254)`
`19:04.28`	`*** join/#openmoko HauDyr (n=kim@82.211.215.147)`
`19:05.58`	`*** join/#openmoko open\|FAiDA (i=opentrin@host204-57-dynamic.2-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it)`
`19:08.22`	`*** join/#openmoko mrmoku_ (n=mok@ppp-88-217-70-148.dynamic.mnet-online.de)`
`19:14.13`	`*** join/#openmoko Sargun (n=Sargun@atarack/staff/sargun)`
`19:15.08`	`*** join/#openmoko slaxxin (n=brian@ip70-178-27-23.ks.ks.cox.net)`
`19:15.29`	`slaxxin`	`yay linwifi works on fdom`
`19:16.29`	`Dave`	`lintwifi?`
`19:17.19`	`slaxxin`	`lint-wifi`
`19:17.31`	`Dave`	`heh`
`19:17.37`	`Dave`	`Guess he's still in the game then...`
`19:18.36`	`*** join/#openmoko opentrinity (n=opentrin@host41-105-dynamic.116-80-r.retail.telecomitalia.it)`
`19:20.55`	`Gnutoo`	`hello, i've an adaptator for usb keyboard...how do i use it in debian...I don't find the ohci-hcd module...`
`19:21.45`	`*** join/#openmoko emilis_info (n=emilis@clt-84-32-58-67.vdnet.lt)`
`19:23.02`	`lindi-`	`Gnutoo: uname -r`
`19:23.06`	`*** part/#openmoko Hire (n=hire@host131-236-dynamic.33-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it)`
`19:23.46`	`Gnutoo`	`lindi-, ok (it's rebooting)`
`19:24.02`	`opentrinity`	`no one could help me...i ping www.google.com but opkg update doesn't work`
`19:24.13`	`Gnutoo`	`lindi-, it's the standard debian...did they made a new release?`
`19:24.41`	`Gnutoo`	`opentrinity, what connection are you using? wifi?`
`19:24.45`	`*** join/#openmoko hannes-s (n=Hannes_S@d039160.adsl.hansenet.de)`
`19:24.48`	`lindi-`	`Gnutoo: just tell me the output so i know what standard you have :)`
`19:24.51`	`opentrinity`	`Gnutoo, usb`
`19:24.57`	`opentrinity`	`whit my pc`
`19:25.01`	`opentrinity`	`with*`
`19:25.16`	`cjb_ie`	`Gnutoo: are you supplying power to the keyboard adaptor?`
`19:25.30`	`Gnutoo`	`opentrinity, try wifi...it's simplier...so you won't have to handle internet connection sharing`
`19:25.56`	`Gnutoo`	`cjb_ie, i'm supplying power to the USB keyboard...`
`19:26.07`	`opentrinity`	`Gnutoo, says me to enter password...i write wep...but says unabl to join`
`19:26.24`	`Gnutoo`	`opentrinity, that's normal`
`19:26.30`	`*** join/#openmoko tomboy64 (n=tomboy64@e178056230.adsl.alicedsl.de)`
`19:26.55`	`Gnutoo`	`opentrinity, it normally join even if it tell it coudn't but you'll need to udhcpcd after that`
`19:27.28`	`Gnutoo`	`lindi-, 2.6.24`
`19:27.30`	`*** join/#openmoko christooss (n=matic@BSN-30-72-90.dial-up.dsl.siol.net)`
`19:28.06`	`lindi-`	`Gnutoo: apt-get install linux-image-2.6.24-openmoko-gta02`
`19:28.19`	`Gnutoo`	`lindi-, ok thanks`
`19:30.37`	`opentrinity`	`Gnutoo, what?`
`19:31.07`	`*** join/#openmoko rooly\|away (n=chris@130.70.9.46)`
`19:31.41`	`Gnutoo`	`opentrinity, i have an open wifi, in om2008.9 i join my wifi network...at the end it says unable to join but you have a wifi icon on the bar that appeared`
`19:32.06`	`Gnutoo`	`opentrinity, after the icon appeared ...you open a console and do: udhcpc eth0`
`19:32.15`	`opentrinity`	`ok`
`19:32.28`	`opentrinity`	`i have to rebbot...later i try`
`19:32.34`	`opentrinity`	`bbl`
`19:33.52`	`*** join/#openmoko ayeuu (n=ayeuu@tss37-1-82-228-161-185.fbx.proxad.net)`
`19:37.01`	`*** join/#openmoko Cervajz (n=Cervajz@r9ha50.net.upc.cz)`
`19:38.07`	`*** part/#openmoko ptitjes (n=didier@93.2.7.240)`
`19:38.19`	`Gnutoo`	lindi-, it says: error creating symbolic link `./boot/uImage.bin : Operation not permitted and i'm root
`19:39.08`	`balrog_`	`what filesystem is that on?`
`19:39.34`	`Gnutoo`	`ah yes...vfat on the /boot`
`19:39.42`	`Gnutoo`	`right...vfat = no simlinks`
`19:39.54`	`Gnutoo`	`mabe i'll umount /boot and it will go well`
`19:40.46`	`*** join/#openmoko Torikun (n=rusher@gateway.penguincomputing.com)`
`19:40.53`	`Torikun`	`anyone know how to put android on the openmoko`
`19:40.59`	`lindi-`	`Gnutoo: which version is it trying to install?`
`19:41.06`	`lindi-`	`Gnutoo: noo, don't umount /boot of course`
`19:41.18`	`cjb_ie`	`Torikun: hush, you'll make mwester cry`
`19:41.25`	`Torikun`	`lol`
`19:41.36`	`Torikun`	`ASU is not going as fast as I though`
`19:41.37`	`Torikun`	`lol`
`19:41.49`	`Gnutoo`	`lindi-, too late but i can copy the uImage from /boot to the boot partition manually`
`19:41.53`	`*** join/#openmoko tomboy64 (n=tomboy64@e178056230.adsl.alicedsl.de)`
`19:42.03`	`Gnutoo`	`as it's on a sd-card`
`19:42.11`	`mwester`	`Torikun: Yes. You'll have to get the kernel patches, build a custom kernel, then get the user-space patches, apply and build those, then get the google sources, build those, build a flash image, and flash it to your phone.`
`19:42.16`	`lindi-`	`Gnutoo: again, which version is it installing?`
`19:42.29`	`Torikun`	`wow`
`19:42.40`	`Torikun`	`Are there plans to make it easier`
`19:42.40`	`Torikun`	`lol`
`19:42.42`	`Gnutoo`	`lindi-, 20080808`
`19:42.56`	`Gnutoo`	`mabe i should apt-get update`
`19:43.01`	`lindi-`	`Gnutoo: full version number please`
`19:43.11`	`lindi-`	`or is that the full version?`
`19:43.21`	`lindi-`	`Gnutoo: in any case you should have 20080903.git2ea34171-1`
`19:44.03`	`Gnutoo`	`20080808.git43620428`
`19:44.10`	`Gnutoo`	`ok i'll update`
`19:44.12`	`lindi-`	`yep`
`19:44.35`	`bricode`	`Jeti: Howdy. Just taking a look through it right now.`
`19:45.07`	`Jeti`	`ok, will wait till you know the answer on my question`
`19:46.33`	`bricode`	`Jeti: Looks extensive so far...`
`19:47.08`	`*** join/#openmoko henkie (n=henkie@5571fddc.ftth.concepts.nl)`
`19:47.14`	`Jeti`	`what do you mean by extensive?`
`19:47.25`	`henkie`	`anybody got a fast mirror with the latest fdom?`
`19:48.00`	`Jeti`	`bricode: define extensive in ubiquity gave me the answer ;)`
`19:48.49`	`bricode`	`libc stuff looks like it checks out (note: I haven't integrated and compiled with them.`
`19:49.13`	`*** join/#openmoko mickey\|munich (n=mickey@ppp-82-135-88-220.dynamic.mnet-online.de)`
`19:49.50`	`Jeti`	`nice`
`19:50.25`	`*** join/#openmoko valos[fr] (n=valos@mar92-6-82-227-150-198.fbx.proxad.net)`
`19:50.27`	`*** join/#openmoko cesarb (n=cesarb@grumari.nitnet.com.br)`
`19:50.58`	`Kensan`	`cesarb: ping`
`19:53.18`	`Jeti`	`bricode: but you don't know what Sean meant by having android almost working?`
`19:53.45`	`emilis_info`	`How can I add a link to my own app in Om2008.8 / FDOM ? I found /usr/share/applications, but I see that creating .desktop file there is not enough`
`19:54.06`	`bricode`	`Jeti: Said mostly everything save for a few corner bits.`
`19:54.13`	`Kensan`	`Jeti: he means the "full stack"`
`19:54.25`	`Kensan`	`Jeti: at least that's what I gather by looking at the patches.`
`19:54.31`	`Jeti`	`wow`
`19:54.41`	`bricode`	`Jeti: This patch is for the libc and dalvik (vm) plus some GCC. There are some other places that have ARMv5 specific code.`
`19:55.01`	`Jeti`	`ok`
`19:55.53`	`Jeti`	`but nice job, almost everything ported in 2 days. (I forget the hardware related things like the gsm modem for a while :p)`
`19:56.16`	`Kensan`	`Jeti: it was not done in 2 days`
`19:56.38`	`Jeti`	`Had Sean the code already before it came opensource?`
`19:56.40`	`Kensan`	`Jeti: Sean has had prior access to the source afaik.`
`19:56.43`	`bricode`	`However, that being said, Benno (Ben Leslie) had some patches to enable generic (ie: C code) code in the other modules.`
`19:56.56`	`bricode`	`Yes. He did.`
`19:57.08`	`Jeti`	`Sean, you're a cheater :p ;)`
`19:57.31`	`bricode`	`Even without the patches though, there have been many people who have contributed work and/or analyses.`
`19:58.01`	`*** join/#openmoko Proton23 (n=proton@p57BA59E3.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`19:58.53`	`Jeti`	`I read about some. I like the opensource sprit that many people have`
`19:59.05`	`Jeti`	`Or the spirit to get things ported`
`19:59.06`	`balrog_`	`had prior access but wasn't interested...`
`19:59.23`	`Jeti`	`balrog_: why?`
`20:00.09`	`balrog_`	`Jeti: cause it doesn't seem like android is the distro i dreamt of`
`20:00.13`	`balrog_`	`ui wise or code wise`
`20:00.23`	`Kensan`	`Jeti: I guess he has other interesting projects he is working on.`
`20:01.03`	`*** join/#openmoko tomer (n=tomer@89-138-43-235.bb.netvision.net.il)`
`20:01.16`	`Jeti`	`I would ask: because of you don't like the android or hadn't time enough to start on it`
`20:01.26`	`Jeti`	`but I know my answer already`
`20:01.32`	`balrog_`	`and yeah, if you can spend your time on some collaborative, open effort, then it's better spent`
`20:01.47`	`*** join/#openmoko bumbl (n=thomas@dslb-088-072-029-120.pools.arcor-ip.net)`
`20:02.01`	`bumbl`	`#neo1973-germany`
`20:02.45`	`Jeti`	`I just want the android be ported, because then I have a UI that work and have many options. (ps. I know the lowlevel bugs will be the same as om)`
`20:03.55`	`ronny`	`as long as you are ok with google uninstalling your apps`
`20:04.15`	`Kensan`	`ronny: your are mixing things.`
`20:04.37`	`Jeti`	`having the possibility and be able to do things are 2 different things`
`20:04.52`	`balrog_`	`i'm sure it'll work, without much porting even, maybe MokoMakefile will be able to build android images in some time`
`20:05.02`	`Jeti`	`*having the possibility and do some things are 2 different things`
`20:05.05`	`Kensan`	`ronny: with the source all there you can build your own image and obviously leave out the bits you don't like. Phones that come with android preinstalled that's a whole different story.`
`20:05.18`	`ronny`	`Kensan: hmk`
`20:05.30`	`Kensan`	`balrog_: I think rwhitby was working on building it.`
`20:06.13`	`*** join/#openmoko TimRiker (n=timr@bzflag/projectlead/TimRiker)`
`20:06.19`	`*** join/#openmoko dougt (n=dougt@c-69-181-65-222.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)`
`20:06.50`	`*** join/#openmoko cesarb (n=cesarb@grumari.nitnet.com.br)`
`20:06.51`	`balrog_`	`it would make sense for him to wait until Sean McNeal posts all his findings / work, i think`
`20:07.42`	`balrog_`	`or did he already?`
`20:07.58`	`Jeti`	`I think he has posted most of his work`
`20:08.43`	`Jeti`	`but the 'patchset #1' after his post on the devel mailling list, gives me the suspicion there is more`
`20:09.20`	`Kensan`	`balrog_: he checked out the source and tried to build the source without any patches. Afaik he just wanted to build vanilla android as a first step :)`
`20:09.48`	`Kensan`	`balrog_: too see if it was even in a buildable state.`
`20:09.55`	`*** join/#openmoko Proton23 (n=proton@p57BA59E3.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`20:10.19`	`*** join/#openmoko FredFokan (n=fred@39-15.105-92.cust.bluewin.ch)`
`20:10.32`	`*** part/#openmoko FredFokan (n=fred@39-15.105-92.cust.bluewin.ch)`
`20:11.29`	`balrog_`	`Kensan: cool`
`20:13.01`	`Kensan`	`balrog_: he also mentioned he had some android-related domains registered where he will probably host images etc.`
`20:13.30`	`Kensan`	`balrog_: but I don't know much about that so you would have to talk to him directly.`
`20:14.06`	`*** join/#openmoko mmontour (n=mmontour@S01060016b606e65a.vc.shawcable.net)`
`20:14.29`	`mwester`	`is very perplexed about why everyone is in such a hurry to get android, when the basic hardware and low-level operating system for the Freerunner is in such a shambles...`
`20:14.31`	`balrog_`	`wonders if andro.id is free :)`
`20:14.33`	`*** join/#openmoko arzej (n=arzej@dgt202.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl)`
`20:15.06`	`bumbl`	`mwester_: buzzzzzzwordbingo`
`20:15.21`	`bumbl`	`android == no problems`
`20:15.29`	`bumbl`	`from one daay to another :p`
`20:15.39`	`df_aldur`	`I dunno tbh, the reason I got an fr was because of a conscious rejection of android because of the corporate control`
`20:15.42`	`mwester`	`I fear it's more probably described by the old analogy of drowning men clutching at straws.`
`20:16.17`	`df_aldur`	`I still think fso has the potential to be the better system, at least for hackers`
`20:16.24`	`mwester`	`df_aldur: There's no need for any control on the FR; it doesn't work well enough to require any.`
`20:16.25`	`Jeti`	`crappy lowlevel + good UI OR crappy lowlevel + little UI: What do you prefer?`
`20:16.32`	`*** join/#openmoko Isajha (n=Isajha4@wrzb-4d00ccaa.pool.mediaWays.net)`
`20:16.47`	`df_aldur`	`heh`
`20:16.49`	`bumbl`	`Jeti: second one`
`20:16.51`	`mwester`	`Jeti: I prefer the community as a unified whole force Om to fix the low-level.`
`20:17.13`	`bumbl`	`om community is a commuity of (hobby)developers`
`20:17.23`	`df_aldur`	`mwester: have you given up on openmoko then, or are you expecting better things from gta03?`
`20:17.29`	`mwester`	`Total focus on the low-level is the only way this will get addressed, and having the entire user community all fixate on the latest GUI is not going to do anything.`
`20:17.45`	`df_aldur`	`how low-level? hardware?`
`20:17.47`	`mwester`	`df_aldur: I expect the gta03 to be perfect in every regard, it will even solve world hunger.`
`20:17.53`	`bumbl`	`df_aldur: drivers`
`20:17.54`	`Jeti`	`mwester: Was that not the thing they are doing right now?`
`20:17.56`	`*** join/#openmoko Proton23 (n=proton@p57BA59E3.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`20:18.06`	`mwester`	`low-level means hardware if they cannot fix it in software.`
`20:18.10`	`balrog_`	`oh, you can't register anything.id domains, only .co.id and .web.id :(`
`20:18.19`	`df_aldur`	`as I understand it there are hardware issues with the gta02 that can't be fixed by the drivers`
`20:18.19`	`mwester`	`Jeti: I no longer believe.`
`20:18.30`	`mwester`	`Yes.`
`20:18.47`	`mwester`	`But they better find software workarounds, like they did with the GPS and SD card.`
`20:18.54`	`df_aldur`	`well tbh I think the hardware is in openmoko's hands`
`20:18.55`	`bumbl`	`mwester_: att least the fso and the swisscomm team do good work`
`20:19.04`	`Jeti`	`mwester: And you believe they will if we go as unified whole ?`
`20:19.11`	`viq`	`balrog_: andr.co.id ;)`
`20:19.19`	`df_aldur`	`the community doesn't have a lot of input into it`
`20:19.20`	`bricode`	`Note that Swisscom is a commercial entity, with money to back developers.`
`20:19.23`	`mwester`	`Jeti: no, but I KNOW that if they are not pressured, they will not do it.`
`20:19.40`	`bumbl`	`bricode: yeah`
`20:19.41`	`bricode`	`I would argue that Android will provide similar backing to the platform.`
`20:19.45`	`bumbl`	`fic is an company too`
`20:19.47`	`mwester`	`Jeti: Are YOU prepared to throw $400 worth of GTA02 in the trash can, and spend another $400 on the GTA03?`
`20:19.53`	`mwester`	`That's what Om did with the GTA01`
`20:19.55`	`balrog_`	`viq: i'm checking out andro.it now :)`
`20:19.59`	`*** join/#openmoko rmoravcik (n=rmoravci@ip-89-102-255-171.karneval.cz)`
`20:20.01`	`df_aldur`	`I am, actually`
`20:20.10`	`mwester`	`bricode: Android will fix the wifi ?`
`20:20.12`	`Jeti`	`no: therefore I want a android interface and hope om will fix the backend`
`20:20.13`	`df_aldur`	`I didn't buy the gta02 expecting it to be a perfect phone`
`20:20.22`	`balrog_`	`Not Available :(`
`20:20.26`	`Kensan`	`mwester: well the community is not a homogenous crowd so there's always people with different interest etc. sure android has a lot of publicity now but it's not like everybody starts contributing just because android is on the map.`
`20:20.29`	`Jeti`	`Than om will not have to do the frontend anymore`
`20:20.31`	`mwester`	`df_aldur: then it meets your needs as is?`
`20:20.39`	`df_aldur`	`but I would want to know that the hardware issues identified in the gta02 are fixed in the gta03`
`20:20.44`	`mwester`	`Good for you - I'm happy that some folks find it worth the money!`
`20:20.48`	`df_aldur`	`mwester: as a phone, no`
`20:20.54`	`df_aldur`	`as a tech toy, most certainly`
`20:21.03`	`mwester`	`Kensan: That's fine, but I don't believe that's the driver.`
`20:21.35`	`bumbl`	`df_aldur: i want gta02 fixed`
`20:21.41`	`mwester`	`Kensan: I put forward that people are clamoring for Android in the false hope that with Android they will be able to use the device as a day-to-day phone ---- and that's not a good thing to belive.`
`20:21.42`	`bumbl`	`because that's the unit i paid for`
`20:21.45`	`df_aldur`	`I think if people buy freerunners with android preinstalled they will be pretty disappointed`
`20:21.47`	`bricode`	`mwester: It may not for this version of the phone, I don't know, but I do know money fixes a lot of issues.`
`20:22.03`	`mwester`	`bricode: I'm not following you -- who's money?`
`20:22.13`	`df_aldur`	`bumbl: yep, but you have to accept it's possible that some things cannot be fixed in software`
`20:22.18`	`df_aldur`	`although some can and have`
`20:22.31`	`df_aldur`	`some people seem quite happy using the thing as a real phone with qtopia`
`20:22.33`	`Jeti`	`mwester: I agree on that we don't have to tell the people that android will be more stable than om 2008.8`
`20:22.40`	`Jeti`	`because it won't`
`20:22.41`	`mwester`	`bricode: are you saying that there will be money exchanged between Android and Om? Or that we, the community, need to pay Om more moeny?`
`20:22.41`	`df_aldur`	`I expect android to be at least as good as that`
`20:22.54`	`Kensan`	`mwester: yes that is true, but there are people genuinly interested in porting android to openmoko hardware and those people are working on stuff.`
`20:23.03`	`*** join/#openmoko HellDragon (n=jd@modemcable100.136-203-24.mc.videotron.ca)`
`20:23.06`	`mwester`	`I have no problem with that.`
`20:23.16`	`bricode`	`Indirectly, Android will give money to OM by expanding their market.`
`20:23.17`	`mwester`	`I'll certainly try Android when it's available.`
`20:23.22`	`Kensan`	`mwester: those people from the community who believe Android will save us all are rather naive and should be educated.`
`20:23.26`	`mwester`	`But I know that Android won't fix my battery life problem.`
`20:23.31`	`mwester`	`Or make the FR resume.`
`20:23.46`	`df_aldur`	`are those hw issues?`
`20:23.50`	`Jeti`	`I and Kenson know to (I hope)`
`20:23.57`	`Kensan`	`df_aldur: no.`
`20:23.58`	`mwester`	`bricode: Ok, but how does that help those who hae GTA01 and GTA02 hardware?`
`20:23.59`	`bricode`	`mwester: No, but it may expand the community, or provide enough sales for OM to hire more internal staff for such issues.`
`20:24.02`	`gurugentoo`	`mwester: what's wrong with resume?`
`20:24.02`	`Jeti`	`df_aldur: no, but lowlevel things`
`20:24.06`	`df_aldur`	`I'm more concerned with the audio quality tbh`
`20:24.23`	`mwester`	`bricode: I'm completely selfish -- if "X" doesn't solve MY problem with the phone, then "X" is not a solution for me.`
`20:24.29`	`Jeti`	`mwester: doesn't work always that right`
`20:24.37`	`bricode`	`mwester: Provide a different, perhaps enhanced, user experience.`
`20:24.38`	`Jeti`	`sorry was for gurugentoo`
`20:25.05`	`df_aldur`	`mwester: well one good thing about low-level stuff is that people can work on it whatever distro they choose to run on their phone`
`20:25.11`	`df_aldur`	`it's all basically the same in the end`
`20:25.13`	`bricode`	`mwester: It should be noted that you decided to purchase and become involved with a Freerunner.`
`20:25.14`	`balrog_`	`gurugentoo: something wrong with the display after resume i hear`
`20:25.23`	`Kensan`	`mwester: yes, but I think you agree that for some people android is an interesting project and they want to work on porting that.`
`20:25.26`	`df_aldur`	`so expanding the community by porting android isn't going to hurt`
`20:25.34`	`balrog_`	`gurugentoo: only in the recent kernels though, it worked ok for me in older kernels`
`20:25.46`	`Kensan`	`df_aldur: that's exactly why OM should focus on that.`
`20:25.47`	`bricode`	`In addition, Google has been known to provide developer resources to various projects, so it's not impossible that they would help out with the lower level stuff.`
`20:25.56`	`gurugentoo`	`balrog_: I really haven't noticed anything, maybe I have an older kernel`
`20:25.59`	`mwester`	`Kensan: absolutely - I have nothing against Android at all. I'm just perplexed how everyone seems convinced that Android will solve all their problems.`
`20:26.11`	`df_aldur`	`otoh, on the application front we'll have yet another platform`
`20:26.16`	`Jeti`	`gurugentoo: Not all people are affected`
`20:26.24`	`Kensan`	`mwester: yes, but it comes with all the media coverage is got.`
`20:26.26`	`df_aldur`	`people who want to write applications for the fr just don't know where to start`
`20:26.32`	`mwester`	`bricode: ;) Ok. And I have a bridge in Brooklyn for sale.`
`20:26.43`	`kirun`	`Android will solve my problem "Need some new cool thing to show to the iphone users" :P`
`20:26.58`	`Kensan`	`mwester: those people joining this channel because of android are not the ones who will stay long enough to see it till "the end"...`
`20:27.01`	`*** join/#openmoko fobos (n=fobos@78.90.88.244)`
`20:27.03`	`Jeti`	`kirun: hopefully :p`
`20:27.22`	`df_aldur`	`yeah, maybe it's more the case that we all want to try out something new and cool, than expect it to make the phone work magically`
`20:27.39`	`mwester`	`df_aldur: Yep - you're right -- and that reminds me that nothing anywhere seems to be solving the techinical problems with the really cool hardware that those apps might be written for : the glamo, the motion detectors...`
`20:27.47`	`df_aldur`	`after all, most fr owners have them because they like playing with new and cool things`
`20:28.01`	`balrog_`	`kirun: what are the iphone killer features in android? :p`
`20:28.04`	`mwester`	`Kensan: Do you think, then, that the users on this channel can fix these technical issues with the GTA02?`
`20:28.07`	`Kensan`	`mwester: I believe android will not have an impact on whether OM will fix the low-level issues.`
`20:28.34`	`*** part/#openmoko dwb (n=david@pdpc/supporter/active/dwb)`
`20:28.46`	`balrog_`	`kirun: i heard it wan't very innovative and didn't have much new things, but i'd like to be wrong (never ran androdi myself)`
`20:29.04`	`Kensan`	`mwester: There's >350 people in here I believe that some of them could truly help solving the issue be it by testing etc.`
`20:29.14`	`kirun`	`balrog_: Well, the iphone user in question is in the Google reality distortion field... so it must have something to show off`
`20:29.15`	`df_aldur`	`I don't think android is particularly an iphone killers, it's just open and standard`
`20:29.18`	`df_aldur`	`but then so is fso...`
`20:29.43`	`balrog_`	`ah ok :p`
`20:29.51`	`mwester`	`Ok, interesting to hear so many viewpoints on it all -- and good also to know that not everyone believes that Android will magically make the phone into a usable phone. :) Now let's keep the pressure up on Om to keep working on this. Because note this:`
`20:30.00`	`*** join/#openmoko fobos (n=fobos@78.90.88.244)`
`20:30.03`	`*** join/#openmoko FredFoka1 (n=fred@39-15.105-92.cust.bluewin.ch)`
`20:30.10`	`mwester`	`THe ONLY improvements we've seen int he past 30 days are the impressive`
`20:30.19`	`Kensan`	`mwester: I believe that in the end OM will need to fix those issues. If they don't, it will be very bad for this whole project.`
`20:30.19`	`mwester`	`work done by Harald (swisscom), and the`
`20:30.28`	`mwester`	`SLEEP problem workaround that I found.`
`20:30.36`	`mwester`	`Other than that, we've nothing but an announcement.`
`20:30.38`	`Kensan`	`mwester: I totaly agree`
`20:30.46`	`Jeti`	`mwester: I agree`
`20:30.50`	`Kensan`	`mwester: OM needs to come forth with some results.`
`20:30.53`	`mwester`	`And contineud emails telling us that they are making progress on the GTA03 (!!!!)_`
`20:31.16`	`Kensan`	`mwester: and I don't mean the support for s3c6410...`
`20:31.19`	`Kensan`	`mwester: or qi`
`20:31.33`	`bricode`	`mwester: Dumb question. What do you suppose OM's business model is?`
`20:31.34`	`mwester`	`(Which is good stuff, btw - just not what they need to do)`
`20:31.57`	`df_aldur`	`how many people are OM employing these days?`
`20:32.10`	`df_aldur`	`I noticed a lot of the high-profile hackers they started out with have now left`
`20:32.15`	`mwester`	`bricode: I could make some smart-a** remark about that, but I'll be completely honest and say that I have no idea what their business model is, and I'm not even sure that they do anymore.`
`20:32.53`	`*** part/#openmoko FredFoka1 (n=fred@39-15.105-92.cust.bluewin.ch)`
`20:33.01`	`mwester`	`df_aldur: :( Yes, one of the danger signs IMO is when people with those sort of reputations int he industry leave. :(`
`20:33.37`	`bricode`	`High profile hackers tend to have very strong viewpoints, and when those viewpoints diverge, they leave.`
`20:33.47`	`mwester`	`Don't anyone get me wrong please -- I very much want (and NEED) Om to be successful, and Android needs to be successful too.`
`20:34.10`	`df_aldur`	`you NEED om to be successful?`
`20:34.10`	`Kensan`	`mwester: we all understand :)`
`20:34.12`	`*** join/#openmoko apol (n=apol@84.78.178.63)`
`20:34.25`	`bricode`	`mwester: Well, OM makes their money selling hardware, I'm trying to enable that one of the best ways I know possible: piggyback on a giant.`
`20:34.27`	`Jeti`	`mwester: Me to, Om has to be succesfull. Else I have a $400 hardware brick`
`20:34.34`	`Kensan`	`mwester: your patches/contributions speak for themselves.`
`20:34.35`	`*** join/#openmoko vallor (i=scott@pdpc/supporter/monthlygold/vallor)`
`20:34.43`	`bricode`	`err, with should be in there.`
`20:34.58`	`mwester`	`df_aldur: Yes. my toys budget is going to frozen if I don't show the person in charge of finances in my household that at least one fo the three units here can be used as a phone. ;)`
`20:35.07`	`df_aldur`	`:)`
`20:35.14`	`df_aldur`	`aw, no pandora?`
`20:35.23`	`mwester`	`Ooh that's cool hardware.`
`20:35.23`	`*** join/#openmoko TAsn (n=tasn@85-250-23-250.bb.netvision.net.il)`
`20:35.41`	`gurugentoo`	`mwester: wish it could be a phone hehe`
`20:35.48`	`mwester`	`But I'm playing with a Treo 650 and FSO at the moment.`
`20:36.05`	`bricode`	`btw, S3C6410 looks pretty sweet.`
`20:36.37`	`mwester`	`It has promise, although I personally prefer the OMAP (for power consumption reasons)`
`20:36.46`	`balrog_`	`mwester: buy one of those small nokia phones, fit it in the GTA02 case, fill the empty space with that plastic foam thing and show your wife :p`
`20:36.53`	`df_aldur`	`heh`
`20:37.03`	`mwester`	`I think the S3C6410 has HW floating point, that'll be awesome for multimedia.`
`20:37.42`	`mwester`	`balrog_: :D`
`20:38.31`	`df_aldur`	`I would like a pandora, but I just bought an aspire one and a freerunner in swift succession and I don't think I can justify it on the grounds that I need something between the two :(`
`20:39.26`	`mwester`	`Well, you another angle on it then... or you need someone to buy one of the two other devices.`
`20:40.05`	`Kensan`	`mwester: it also has some HW-crypto which I think is cool :)`
`20:40.16`	`*** join/#openmoko Sonicadvance1 (n=Sonic@24-116-252-18.cpe.cableone.net)`
`20:40.37`	`df_aldur`	`naw, I like them both :)`
`20:40.39`	`mwester`	`I'm not sure what one would use that for on a phone though. Wifi?`
`20:41.13`	`mwester`	`I suppose that digitally signing SMS messages doesn't make any sense, does it?`
`20:41.15`	`df_aldur`	`maybe I haven't reached your level of cynicism yet, but I'm pretty happy to have a phone I can run debian on, even if it doesn't actually work as a phone`
`20:41.15`	`bricode`	`Wifi, ssl`
`20:41.48`	`df_aldur`	`you could probably think of uses for signed SMS`
`20:41.49`	`gurugentoo`	`df_aldur: what, no zhone love?`
`20:41.56`	`df_aldur`	`system administration?`
`20:42.06`	`*** join/#openmoko christooss1 (n=matic@BSN-30-72-90.dial-up.dsl.siol.net)`
`20:42.14`	`mwester`	`df_aldur: Well, cynic or realist... hard to tell... and a sad state of affairs when the difference between the two is so difficult to discern.`
`20:42.37`	`balrog_`	`you don't need hw crypto for encoding sms since you're not trying to send a million SMSes per second :p`
`20:42.44`	`Kensan`	`mwester: there's many many possibilities.`
`20:42.54`	`balrog_`	`it could be useful for cracking passwords maybe :p`
`20:43.00`	`Kensan`	`balrog_: heh`
`20:43.04`	`df_aldur`	`gurugentoo: yes, the debian archive for the freerunner includes fso+zhone?`
`20:43.15`	`bricode`	`carries rainbow tables in his pocket :)`
`20:43.21`	`balrog_`	`(omap also has hw crypto but i don't know if anybody has made use of it yet)`
`20:43.22`	`df_aldur`	`or are you suggesting that zhone can function as a real phone`
`20:43.27`	`*** join/#openmoko Ko_deZ (n=mt@062016213048.customer.alfanett.no)`
`20:43.28`	`Kensan`	`balrog_: if you use the phone to acces a vpn e.g.`
`20:43.31`	`mwester`	`ignores balrog_ ... as long as he doesn't start spelling works funny.`
`20:43.48`	`Kensan`	`balrog_: oh, that sounds interesting.`
`20:44.06`	`gurugentoo`	`df_aldur: well I'll admit it's missing a few things at the moment, but I'm happy to use it as my dialer`
`20:44.19`	`Kensan`	`balrog_: do you know if there's some "real" info (=not just info brochures) on that on the net?`
`20:44.27`	`df_aldur`	`I don't have a sim in my fr atm`
`20:44.32`	`df_aldur`	`when I did, I mostly used qtopia`
`20:45.02`	`*** part/#openmoko leachim_dot_eu (n=Leachim@78.43.156.117)`
`20:45.22`	`balrog_`	`Kensan: on omap hw support? it's in the kernel afaik, it should be present since omap2, i don't know what the standard linux way of accessing hw crypto is but it should be using that`
`20:46.16`	`*** join/#openmoko anno^da_ (n=anno^da@p5B07F65B.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`20:47.14`	`Kensan`	`balrog_: there would be hw-drivers for that...`
`20:47.26`	`Kensan`	`balrog_: like hifn etc`
`20:48.13`	`balrog_`	`omap2420 has DES3DES, SHA1MD5 (whatever this is), PKA, MG support in hardware`
`20:48.41`	`Kensan`	`balrog_: hm I don't see anything in drivers/crypto ...`
`20:49.04`	`balrog_`	`maybe it's in the -omap tree, lemme look up`
`20:49.19`	`Kensan`	`balrog_: is that on git.kernel.org ?`
`20:49.38`	`balrog_`	`Kensan: yep`
`20:49.42`	`Kensan`	`balrog_: well it's not in crypto/cryptodev`
`20:50.39`	`balrog_`	`there's this: http://git.kernel.org/?p=linux/kernel/git/tmlind/linux-omap-2.6.git;a=blob;f=drivers/crypto/omap-sha1-md5.c;h=6d7770325f79ce33eefc1ddca5484a73d3bb5e91;hb=HEAD`
`20:51.20`	`Kensan`	`balrog_: ah cool`
`20:52.14`	`Kensan`	`balrog_: I wonder why this has not made it to the crypto-ml ...`
`20:53.27`	`balrog_`	`Kensan: the -omap tree always has many drivers local changes, i think their current focus is to upstream beagleboard support and n800 audio`
`20:53.34`	`balrog_`	`s/drivers//`
`20:54.06`	`Kensan`	`balrog_: hm ok.`
`20:54.35`	`Kensan`	`balrog_: well it looks fine so they should just submit it to Herbert.`
`20:56.08`	`mwester`	`wonders if balrog_ or Kensan work with the n800 at all`
`20:56.37`	`Kensan`	`mwester: I don't have one :(`
`20:57.59`	`mwester`	`I am very impressed by the N800; I was rather skeptical at first, but despite a few closed drivers, Nokia has done a good job, I think.`
`20:58.08`	`balrog_`	`i don't either, i had an n810 but they took it away from me later :p`
`20:58.24`	`Kensan`	`balrog_: are you following -omap development?`
`20:58.57`	`Kensan`	`mwester: hm I somehow never got all that interested and so I never bought one...`
`20:59.10`	`mwester`	`I think that maemo set my expectations for what I thought Openmoko was intending to create, and the 2007.x stuff seemed to be going in such a direction...`
`20:59.21`	`balrog_`	`Kensan: i was for some time but i don't read their list much anymore :p all the new patches are currently for hardware i've never seen`
`20:59.24`	`Kensan`	`mwester: besides the fact that I have to many such devices lying around here :)`
`20:59.52`	`lpotter`	`heh. you should see my office`
`20:59.57`	`Kensan`	`balrog_: ah ok. What are you currently following then? pandora seems interesting.`
`21:00.04`	`lpotter`	`_thats_ too many devices laying around`
`21:00.17`	`Kensan`	`lpotter: yeah, but you get paid to do "R&D" ;)`
`21:00.23`	`Kensan`	`I assume`
`21:00.25`	`balrog_`	`was maintaing support for one omap1 based palmtop but can't even charge the device anymore :P`
`21:01.29`	`mwester`	`lpotter just brought back horrible memories of Mrs Land -- a High School english teacher who would go off on a huge rant everytime someone got lying/laying mixed up... :)`
`21:01.38`	`lpotter`	`Kensan: yep. we are part of "R&D" :)`
`21:02.24`	`mattl`	`relaxing and drinking? ;)`
`21:03.01`	`mwester`	`That's on Fridays. Is it Friday in AU yet?`
`21:03.22`	`Kensan`	`mwester: I always mix those up that's why I don't care anymore...`
`21:03.49`	`mwester`	`She frightened me so much I just try to avoid those words ;)`
`21:03.54`	`df_aldur`	`er`
`21:04.09`	`lpotter`	`yes. its friday`
`21:04.11`	`df_aldur`	`hmm`
`21:04.30`	`df_aldur`	`'lying' sounds right to me in that context`
`21:04.45`	`df_aldur`	`possibly I am just poorly educated`
`21:04.58`	`*** join/#openmoko fale_ (n=fale@89-96-108-175.ip12.fastwebnet.it)`
`21:05.01`	`mwester`	`All I remember was that she (the teacher) would be shouting about chickens, beds, and such...`
`21:05.05`	`Kensan`	`balrog_: and that's the reason you passed along maintainership? heh`
`21:05.39`	`mwester`	`oops late for ameeting - back in a bit`
`21:06.16`	`df_aldur`	`she went on about laying chickens?`
`21:09.11`	`*** join/#openmoko Flyser_ (n=flyser@dialin-145-254-178-245.pools.arcor-ip.net)`
`21:10.27`	`balrog_`	`Kensan: it's unmaintained and there are very few users complaining :)`
`21:10.38`	`balrog_`	`so everyone is happy`
`21:11.07`	`Kensan`	`balrog_: haha, fair enough :)`
`21:11.31`	`Kensan`	`balrog_: are you currently maintaining other stuff?`
`21:11.45`	`Kensan`	`balrog_: just being curious`
`21:11.48`	`*** join/#openmoko vivijim (n=vivijim@unaffiliated/vivijim)`
`21:12.40`	`balrog_`	`Kensan: in kernel land, nope, i was sending some fixes for gta02 only lately`
`21:13.06`	`balrog_`	`well... no so lately even`
`21:13.15`	`Kensan`	`balrog_: ah ic. didn't you start on some mplayer related things?`
`21:13.27`	`gurugentoo`	`what is the actual wifi chip used in the FR?`
`21:13.27`	`Kensan`	`balrog_: I think it was your blog I stumbled upon the other day...`
`21:14.20`	`Kensan`	`gurugentoo: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo_FreeRunner_Hardware#WiFi_Module`
`21:14.31`	`balrog_`	`Kensan: i did, but i have no use for it personally`
`21:14.32`	`Jeti`	`mwester: You said we should begin pressuring openmoko? http://onlinedev.blogspot.com/2008/10/is-openmoko-working-on-there-back-to.html`
`21:14.41`	`gurugentoo`	`Kensan: thanks`
`21:15.44`	`*** join/#openmoko morricone (n=foobar@dslb-088-067-082-119.pools.arcor-ip.net)`
`21:16.25`	`Kensan`	`Jeti: well the nand patches were not from OM, they came from harald who did this on contract work from swisscom...`
`21:17.07`	`Jeti`	`ow I though harald was working for OM`
`21:17.23`	`Kensan`	`Jeti: he quite some time ago.`
`21:17.23`	`Jeti`	`Quickly changed it`
`21:17.42`	`Jeti`	`also :(`
`21:20.56`	`Kensan`	`Jeti: http://laforge.gnumonks.org/weblog/2007/11/16/#20071116-leaving_openmoko`
`21:22.12`	`*** join/#openmoko vaiursch (n=erwin@adsl-89-217-144-199.adslplus.ch)`
`21:22.16`	`*** join/#openmoko Sonicadvance1 (n=Sonic@24-116-252-18.cpe.cableone.net)`
`21:22.35`	`*** join/#openmoko opentrinity (i=opentrin@host92-14-dynamic.2-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it)`
`21:22.48`	`Jeti`	`it's very long ago. There wasn't even an gta02 :o`
`21:23.38`	`*** join/#openmoko dougt (n=dougt@c-69-181-65-222.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)`
`21:24.23`	`Kensan`	`Jeti: is onlinedev your blog?`
`21:24.30`	`Jeti`	`yup`
`21:24.41`	`Jeti`	`I'm mostly dolf1074 on this channel`
`21:25.04`	`Jeti`	`but now I had to boot in xp and there my nick is Jeti`
`21:25.19`	`Jeti`	`Why?`
`21:25.31`	`*** join/#openmoko ScarEye (n=scareye@12.27.87.66)`
`21:25.42`	`Kensan`	`Jeti: just being curious :)`
`21:26.05`	`Kensan`	`Jeti: ah ok, I remember your other nickname.`
`21:26.28`	`Jeti`	`Is that a good thing or a bad one :p`
`21:28.04`	`Kensan`	`Jeti: in my eyes I was just stating a fact, so I'd say is neither good nor bad.`
`21:28.26`	`Jeti`	`you're avoiding the question :p`
`21:28.38`	`Jeti`	`no, I actually don't want to know`
`21:28.39`	`Kensan`	`Jeti: good post btw, mwester will be happy :)`
`21:28.50`	`Jeti`	`just fooling you`
`21:29.09`	`Jeti`	`It's the truth`
`21:29.25`	`Jeti`	`hopefully openmoko will learn from it`
`21:29.28`	`Kensan`	`Jeti: sadly it seems like it...`
`21:30.37`	`Jeti`	`Sadly the openmoko developers are all indulged in the work and the community protesting will give them more stress`
`21:30.54`	`Jeti`	`So hopefully they can reorganize their priorities`
`21:31.30`	`Tig\|`	`why doesn't my freerunner fly yet?`
`21:31.48`	`Kensan`	`Jeti: after reading the weekly engineering news 41 I thought that's what they had done. Maybe they need some more time... eventhough a lot of time has past since the Freerunners started shipping...`
`21:32.31`	`Jeti`	`true, almost everyone has hoped they would have done that after reading the WE 41`
`21:32.39`	`Jeti`	`including me`
`21:32.50`	`Jeti`	`I was really positive about the future of om`
`21:33.26`	`cjb_ie`	`am i the only person who can't helping thinking 'nom nom' whenever someone references om ?`
`21:33.38`	`Kensan`	`It's sad to see that on one side there's so much friction and issues while FSO is clearly coming along...`
`21:34.07`	`Jeti`	`I like FSO and it's a really good direction`
`21:34.16`	`Jeti`	`but they have to fix the lowlevel things first`
`21:34.26`	`Jeti`	`because else the fso will also have lowlevel problems`
`21:34.38`	`Kensan`	`but without the kernel/low-level issues fixed fso can't provide reliable/stable operation...`
`21:34.49`	`Kensan`	`yeah, like you said.`
`21:34.51`	`Tig\|`	`FSO is a wonderful base, the otherday I wanted to put a shopping list, just a basic todo on my phone and failed`
`21:35.33`	`Kensan`	`Tig\|: use post-its and stick them to the back of your FR ;)`
`21:35.34`	`Tig\|`	`yet this was something I had with 2007`
`21:36.08`	`mattl`	`cjb_ie: are you in ireland, or using IE?`
`21:36.10`	`Tig\|`	`Kensan: is it cash flow that is stopping them hiring openhand again?`
`21:36.11`	`gurugentoo`	`Tig\|: 2 words: Debian, Abiword`
`21:36.15`	`cjb_ie`	`mattl: the former`
`21:36.28`	`rhkfin`	`Jeti: you're writing great stuff in your blog, /me likes it!`
`21:36.30`	`Kensan`	`Tig\|: openhand got bought by intel`
`21:36.32`	`mattl`	`why are you there?`
`21:36.40`	`Kensan`	`Tig\|: they work on moblin now.`
`21:36.53`	`rhkfin`	`But Yes, I hope that OM will focus - focus - focus..`
`21:37.04`	`cjb_ie`	`mattl: family. oh. are you mixing me up with cjb?`
`21:37.08`	`Jeti`	`rhkfin: thanks. It's really great if someone appreciate your work ;)`
`21:37.20`	`Kensan`	`Jeti: yeah, keep it up.`
`21:37.25`	`mattl`	`cjb_ie: yes.`
`21:37.27`	`Tig\|`	`Kensan: yes and, openhand were dropped by om ages ago back in the tail end of 07 with the pust for qtopia`
`21:37.39`	`rhkfin`	`I wish they (you, if someone from OM is around) listens the community and feels the disappointement and encouragement of the community`
`21:38.06`	`cjb_ie`	`mattl: apologies for confusion. i have this nick in too many channels to start changing it though.`
`21:38.16`	`opentrinity`	`hola Tig\| ....`
`21:38.20`	`rhkfin`	`stuff like weekly engineering news, community news and some blogs are very important to help the community..`
`21:38.25`	`Tig\|`	`eek`
`21:38.28`	`Jeti`	`Kensan: That's what I intend to do so. But I have to little time. (I remember meself, I still have to write about the new release of FDOM)`
`21:38.28`	`Kensan`	`Tig\|: I didn't understand that decision at the time and now one can say it was a waste of time&effort. that's when they should have realized (for the 2nd time) that they should focus on the basics.`
`21:39.00`	`rhkfin`	`Jeti: I'm planning to do the same.. Let's see if I got the time on weekend to give it a try..`
`21:39.03`	`Tig\|`	`Kensan : OM should have focused on the backend and left the front end to OH`
`21:39.11`	`rhkfin`	`Tig\|: agree..`
`21:39.32`	`Jeti`	`rhkfin: The mine is already up and running and I'm planning to write about it tomorrow afternoon. ;)`
`21:39.36`	`Kensan`	`Jeti: are you doing fdom?`
`21:39.50`	`Tig\|`	`hola opentrinity`
`21:39.51`	`rhkfin`	`Jeti: you'll be first ;)`
`21:39.57`	`*** part/#openmoko Torikun (n=rusher@gateway.penguincomputing.com)`
`21:39.58`	`Jeti`	`I will`
`21:40.03`	`rhkfin`	`Maybe I'll try to focus on apps more..`
`21:40.11`	`Jeti`	`I will start on doing FDom`
`21:40.12`	`rhkfin`	`apps available at opkg`
`21:41.09`	`opentrinity`	`Tig\|, df_aldur helps me to solve my problem do u remember..i ping but i can't opkg upload...was a mtu problem...now works :-)`
`21:41.32`	`Jeti`	`rhkfin: Good idea, because I only target apps that I already have changed or adapted to work better on the freerunner`
`21:42.00`	`Tig\|`	`opentrinity: glad to hear you are back on the net :)`
`21:42.01`	`rhkfin`	`Jeti: right..`
`21:42.09`	`opentrinity`	`:-)`
`21:42.36`	`opentrinity`	`now i'm glad to solve wifi and gps problems ;-)`
`21:42.48`	`Jeti`	`rhkfin: Else there is to much to blog about for one person ;)`
`21:43.06`	`rhkfin`	`Jeti: true :) I'd have a lot to blog about if I only had the time.`
`21:43.45`	`Jeti`	`Openmoko has to hire us to fulltime blog :p`
`21:43.55`	`Tig\|`	`ye gods no`
`21:44.15`	`Jeti`	`I think I would be bored after a week`
`21:44.15`	`rhkfin`	`Jeti: I'm writing http://risto.kurppa.fi/blog (unless you already noticed :) (hmm.. though it's again reaaaaally slow:(`
`21:44.24`	`Sargun`	`How do you set the default boot device to sd card?`
`21:44.28`	`Jeti`	`Is it in the planet?`
`21:44.37`	`rhkfin`	`Don't know: blogging means a lot to learn :)`
`21:45.02`	`rhkfin`	`Jeti: yes it is`
`21:45.14`	`Jeti`	`That's true, When I'm blogging: I'm learning so many things`
`21:45.38`	`rhkfin`	`Writing a good blog post includes a lot of background checks that make you learn new stuff.. But it takes time!`
`21:45.50`	`Jeti`	`rhkfin: Than I read them all ;)`
`21:46.03`	`rhkfin`	`It took me around 9 hours or so to write the openmoko community discussion posts.. But I hope it was worth it..`
`21:46.23`	`rhkfin`	`write.. or copy paste.. But still 9 hours :)`
`21:46.47`	`Jeti`	`yes, I can believe there's so much work on that post`
`21:47.27`	`Jeti`	`you first have to find a story about all things, then find the right things to copy (things that represent the person), then you will have to click it togheter`
`21:48.23`	`Tig\|`	`in other news, your phone still does not work but now people are thinking about fixing it...`
`21:52.48`	`rhkfin`	`Anyway, I hope that the community can benefit from the blog posts.. test applications, test distros, tell what's happening with the development and so on.. I'm not much of a coder so I concider this as my way to support the community..`
`21:53.16`	`Kensan`	`rhkfin: it's a good way of contributing.`
`21:53.49`	`rhkfin`	`Kensan: thanks :)`
`21:56.42`	`*** join/#openmoko dskippy (n=mmacHenr@gatekeeper.athenahealth.com)`
`21:57.31`	`dskippy`	`I apologize if this seems like a really silly question but has anyone played the Numpty Physics game that comes with FDOM? Anyone know how to restart a level if you fail?`
`21:57.44`	`dskippy`	`I can't even exit the game without getting an error message.`
`21:58.05`	`mattl`	`dskippy: i play it all the time, but no i think yu have to quit to restart`
`21:58.11`	`rhkfin`	`dskippy: r from the keyboard`
`21:58.29`	`rhkfin`	`launch the keyboard: r to reset, n for next level, p for previous.`
`21:58.37`	`Kensan`	`dskippy: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Numptyphysics`
`21:58.38`	`rhkfin`	`And there'll be a new release soon AFAIK..`
`21:58.46`	`*** join/#openmoko jserv--- (n=jserv@118-169-100-219.dynamic.hinet.net)`
`21:58.49`	`rhkfin`	`With a new version of the engine`
`21:58.56`	`rhkfin`	`And some other improvements`
`21:59.14`	`dskippy`	`rhkfin: Thanks a bunch! Hadn't even thought of that.`
`21:59.33`	`dskippy`	`People are just gushing over my phone now that I downloaded this thing by the way.`
`21:59.38`	`dskippy`	`It's really really cool.`
`22:00.00`	`rhkfin`	`dskippy: :)`
`22:00.07`	`dskippy`	`My friends at work and I play with Phun all the time. (similar program, not a goal-orient game though)`
`22:00.16`	`rhkfin`	`There might eventually be a landscape version -> bigger screen.`
`22:00.23`	`dskippy`	`That and Duke Nukem 3D`
`22:00.27`	`rhkfin`	`Phun is closed source :/`
`22:00.46`	`dskippy`	`Are there any similar keys to reduce the volume in Duke Nukem 3D actually?`
`22:00.52`	`dskippy`	`It's super loud.`
`22:00.53`	`rhkfin`	`would like to try the new FDOM to see the duke3d with transparent buttons..`
`22:01.02`	`Jeti`	`It seems nice`
`22:01.07`	`rhkfin`	`dskippy: I guess not.. I've disabled the sound..`
`22:01.08`	`Jeti`	`only exit doesn't work anymore`
`22:01.17`	`rhkfin`	`Jeti: good & too bad`
`22:01.17`	`dskippy`	`rhkfin: New FDOM is nice. Duke is really cool.`
`22:01.31`	`rhkfin`	`wants to upgrade but has to sleep..`
`22:01.34`	`dskippy`	`If you hit the center of the screen that's exit though. I wish that were not true.`
`22:01.48`	`dskippy`	`I am always accidentally hitting exit when I am trying to shoot.`
`22:02.45`	`rhkfin`	`<PROTECTED>`
`22:02.55`	`Jeti`	`dskippy: So it's not the right upper button anymore?`
`22:03.06`	`*** join/#openmoko kristian_paul (n=paul@190.69.83.58)`
`22:05.15`	`*** join/#openmoko Staticwave_Ace (n=Ace@d57-135-60.home.cgocable.net)`
`22:05.25`	`dskippy`	`Jeti: You mean shoot? No I don't think so. I have to hit the bottom 10% of the screen to shoot.`
`22:05.39`	`Jeti`	`No, exit`
`22:05.49`	`Jeti`	`Normally it was the upper right button`
`22:05.52`	`dskippy`	`Jeti: Well hitting the screen for sure exits.`
`22:06.00`	`Jeti`	`ok`
`22:06.02`	`dskippy`	`Haven't tried hitting the hardware button yet.`
`22:06.12`	`Jeti`	`Me neither`
`22:06.16`	`dskippy`	`Maybe it's an un-caught exception and it's just a bug.`
`22:06.22`	`Jeti`	`can be`
`22:06.23`	`dskippy`	`Seems like a really crazy feature.`
`22:06.33`	`df_aldur`	`gets jealous of all these games and installs fdom`
`22:06.35`	`*** join/#openmoko HauDyr_ (n=kim@knet-gip124.prod.bolignet.dk)`
`22:07.36`	`Jeti`	`bye, me also going zzzzz`
`22:07.42`	`dskippy`	`df_aldur: What distro are you running? You should be jealous. FDOM is really cool.`
`22:07.51`	`dskippy`	`Night Jeti.`
`22:07.57`	`kristian_paul`	`openmoko 3gb?`
`22:08.02`	`kristian_paul`	`3 G?`
`22:08.15`	`*** join/#openmoko Pyrasi (n=dan@74-140-180-181.dhcp.insightbb.com)`
`22:08.17`	`df_aldur`	`I'm dual booting qtopia and debian, but I'm bored of qtopia`
`22:08.55`	`viq`	`kristian_paul: maybe gta04`
`22:09.05`	`dskippy`	`df_aldur: Qtopia's okay. It's the nicest as far as just being a phone. Though I find that none of the distros are able to equal the reliablility of my old phone yet... so it's still just a toy for me right now.`
`22:09.15`	`dskippy`	`Thus FDOM is really cool. :)`
`22:09.18`	`kristian_paul`	`viq: but is avaliable?`
`22:09.20`	`df_aldur`	`same here, I've taken my sim card out of it for now`
`22:09.28`	`kristian_paul`	`viq: for buy`
`22:09.34`	`viq`	`kristian_paul: current is gta02`
`22:09.35`	`df_aldur`	`though I might get a payg sim just to allow me to experiment with the phone stuff`
`22:09.56`	`viq`	`kristian_paul: no, there are not even details about exact hardware available, nor specific plans.`
`22:10.02`	`dskippy`	`I want to get some time to work on it. Other than speed of loading basic operations being a little annoying there are just a few things I need for it to be my phone.`
`22:10.08`	`kristian_paul`	`viq: gta02 is EDGE?`
`22:10.18`	`viq`	`No, GPRS.`
`22:10.25`	`kristian_paul`	`viq: :-(`
`22:10.27`	`df_aldur`	`mmm, time would be nice`
`22:10.34`	`dskippy`	`Like reverse phone number look up to my address book when displaying who sent an SMS`
`22:11.00`	`df_aldur`	`so is the phone interface in fdom the same as in om 2008?`
`22:11.19`	`dskippy`	`df_aldur: Yeah it's take from qtopia just like 2008`
`22:11.25`	`dskippy`	`df_aldur: Ever tried FSO?`
`22:11.38`	`*** join/#openmoko Zoup_ (n=Zoup@91.98.73.252)`
`22:11.40`	`df_aldur`	`yes, in the sense that the debian distro includes it`
`22:11.56`	`Zoup_`	`how can i replace NAND with NOR uboot ? how can i fully recover NAND from NOR ?`
`22:12.05`	`dskippy`	`zhone is my favorite phone app so far. Still missing some of the necessities that I mentioned earlier but it's simple and also nice and fast.`
`22:12.11`	`df_aldur`	`my early attempts at hacking some software together have been on fso since that seems to be the future`
`22:12.12`	`dskippy`	`Responsiveness is really important.`
`22:12.26`	`df_aldur`	`agreed`
`22:12.34`	`df_aldur`	`I prefer a responsive interface to a flashy one`
`22:12.34`	`*** part/#openmoko FilipLinux4BE (n=Filip@77.109.123.60)`
`22:13.08`	`dskippy`	`Yeah seems like FSO is the future. Which is nice. I think if I am going to put some time in to the openmoko finally soon, it'll be into basic phone niceness for zhone.`
`22:13.28`	`df_aldur`	`do I need to flash the om 2008 kernel for fdom?`
`22:14.36`	`dskippy`	`df_aldur: Yes.`
`22:14.52`	`dskippy`	`I had to come here and ask that a week ago myself :)`
`22:15.02`	`df_aldur`	`:)`
`22:15.39`	`df_aldur`	`it's not very easy for newbies, took me ages to get my head around the different distros`
`22:16.00`	`df_aldur`	`although I noticed someone's improved the distro page on the wiki, it's a lot more comprehensible now`
`22:17.53`	`*** part/#openmoko kristian_paul (n=paul@190.69.83.58)`
`22:18.06`	`dskippy`	`Yeah it is a little difficult to figure out. It's really straight forward and simple now that I understand it, of course.`
`22:18.22`	`dskippy`	`And yeah the wiki is a little more understandable.`
`22:19.22`	`df_aldur`	`I guess it was a matter of realising that the phone ships with a distro which is basically obsolete, and then having enough information to know what to install next`
`22:19.50`	`dskippy`	`Yeah.`
`22:20.41`	`mjr`	`and then noticing that it actually works better as a phone than the newer stuff...`
`22:20.52`	`vinicius`	`mmm koolu should sell debug boards. :/`
`22:21.02`	`df_aldur`	`heh`
`22:21.34`	`df_aldur`	`2007 didn't work brilliantly for me as a phone`
`22:21.49`	`*** join/#openmoko DieMumiee (n=DieMumie@W3fd6.w.pppool.de)`
`22:21.53`	`df_aldur`	`I liked the keyboard better than the 2008 one though`
`22:22.11`	`dskippy`	`df_aldur: 2008 keyboard really kind of annoys me.`
`22:22.38`	`dskippy`	`It's annoying to, for example, just hit 'r' in the physics game.`
`22:22.58`	`dskippy`	`I have to hit 'r' then I have to pick the 'r' from the possible results.`
`22:23.30`	`df_aldur`	`it's bloody impossible to use with a terminal`
`22:23.41`	`df_aldur`	`ah - does fdom have the same one then?`
`22:23.45`	`df_aldur`	`or do you get a choice?`
`22:24.13`	`dskippy`	`It'd be nice to have a mode that's just going to send the keys as I type them.`
`22:24.55`	`dskippy`	`I want the keyboard to take up 90% of the screen and be horizontal when I'm typing text messages.`
`22:25.06`	`dskippy`	`Then it could be a heck of a lot bigger.`
`22:25.24`	`dskippy`	`You might need to wait for auto tipping the screen to the side for that functionality to come out.`
`22:25.58`	`df_aldur`	`yes, I want landscape mode for my freerunner`
`22:26.25`	`df_aldur`	`X doesn't seem to support it yet though - or at least, xrandr cowardly refuses to switch it`
`22:26.49`	`df_aldur`	`doesn't necessarily need to be automatic, that'd just be an added bonus`
`22:26.55`	`Kensan`	`any udev-gurus around?`
`22:27.08`	`gurugentoo`	`you have to add a line, it works fine in debian, except it screws up the dpi of fonts`
`22:27.20`	`df_aldur`	`ah, cool, got a link?`
`22:27.21`	`gurugentoo`	`add a line in xorg.conf*`
`22:27.25`	`bricode`	`vinicius: Yes we should.`
`22:27.45`	`df_aldur`	`hmm, just realised I started flashing this image before it finished downloading`
`22:27.52`	`df_aldur`	`races dfu against teh internets`
`22:28.05`	`dskippy`	`Has anyone tried qt-embedded 4.4.1? The new qtopia?`
`22:28.12`	`vinicius`	`bricode: :D do it, I want to buy it together with pounch and phones.`
`22:28.20`	`df_aldur`	`dskippy: is it available?`
`22:28.27`	`df_aldur`	`I was looking for it earlier and couldn't find it`
`22:28.33`	`dskippy`	`I thought it was announced.`
`22:28.41`	`df_aldur`	`then I heard people raving about fdom and decided to install that instead`
`22:28.45`	`df_aldur`	`it was announced, yes`
`22:28.50`	`bricode`	`vinicius: For the most part you don't need it unless you're updating the NOR flash, or are doing intense kernel stuff.`
`22:29.09`	`*** join/#openmoko Varox (n=Varox@p4FD4797A.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`22:29.12`	`vinicius`	`I want to try the latter.`
`22:29.20`	`dskippy`	`df_aldur: Yeah I think FDOM is worth spending time on.`
`22:29.27`	`dskippy`	`But I do want to try qt-embedded.`
`22:29.35`	`df_aldur`	`is it fso based though?`
`22:29.40`	`dskippy`	`Qt-extended actually.`
`22:29.46`	`dskippy`	`QT? No.`
`22:29.51`	`df_aldur`	`fdom`
`22:29.52`	`dskippy`	`Neither is FDOM.`
`22:30.16`	`dskippy`	`df_aldur: Yeah I can't find 4.4.1`
`22:30.18`	`df_aldur`	`so isn't it a bit of a dead end too? (albeit one with lotsa cool stuff)`
`22:30.38`	`dskippy`	`The "4.4.1 is released!" link takes me to a download for 4.3.2`
`22:30.43`	`dskippy`	`What a cruel joke :)`
`22:30.52`	`df_aldur`	`I think nokia have EATEN it`
`22:31.17`	`dskippy`	`:_`
`22:31.18`	`dskippy`	`:)`
`22:31.26`	`df_aldur`	`yep, I couldn't even find 4.3.3, which my phone is running`
`22:31.29`	`df_aldur`	`er, was running`
`22:31.32`	`*** join/#openmoko gnu{- (n=gnu@quiet.toad.com)`
`22:31.48`	`df_aldur`	`mabye I should have backed it up, given taht it seems to have become a collector's item`
`22:31.51`	`dskippy`	`Oh right, 4.3.3 was the latest.`
`22:31.56`	`dskippy`	`What's with their site?`
`22:32.06`	`dskippy`	`df_aldur: I have it.`
`22:32.17`	`df_aldur`	`ah good`
`22:32.19`	`dskippy`	`At home.`
`22:32.26`	`df_aldur`	`not that I want it back particularly`
`22:32.27`	`dskippy`	`I'd be happy to send it to you though.`
`22:32.36`	`df_aldur`	`but it's good to know that it's not gone forever`
`22:32.38`	`*** join/#openmoko unlotto (n=unlotto@ip114.rev112.brygge.net)`
`22:32.38`	`dskippy`	`Well dskippy@ccs.neu.edu if you ever do.`
`22:32.43`	`df_aldur`	`cheers`
`22:33.27`	`df_aldur`	`dfu is pretty awesome, wish it was a bit faster though`
`22:33.38`	`dskippy`	`df_aldur: You can get the 4.4.1 jffs file from the wiki`
`22:33.52`	`df_aldur`	`ah right`
`22:33.58`	`dskippy`	`Not sure about the kernel. Maybe it takes the same kernel at 4.3.2 or 4.3.3?`
`22:34.06`	`df_aldur`	`well, I'm going for fdom now anyway`
`22:34.13`	`df_aldur`	`I'll play with that for a while and see how it goes`
`22:34.29`	`dskippy`	`Yeah good call. If only to show off physics and duke nukem to your friends.`
`22:34.57`	`dskippy`	`Hey look at me, I'm titling my phone back and forth and shooting!`
`22:35.02`	`df_aldur`	`I use the debian install for serious hacking (when I get the chance), so the one in flash is mostly just for fun`
`22:35.12`	`df_aldur`	`and for showing off to friends, of course`
`22:35.20`	`dskippy`	`What hacking are you doing?`
`22:35.25`	`dskippy`	`zhone stuff?`
`22:35.33`	`df_aldur`	`no, an indepedent ui`
`22:35.37`	`dskippy`	`Ah.`
`22:35.42`	`df_aldur`	`but using fso`
`22:35.48`	`dskippy`	`Anything interesting?`
`22:35.49`	`df_aldur`	`and gtk`
`22:35.50`	`Dave`	`Aldur, still having problems?`
`22:35.56`	`df_aldur`	`not really, tbh`
`22:36.03`	`sicu`	`DAVE!`
`22:36.14`	`Dave`	`SICU`
`22:36.17`	`df_aldur`	`I just want a lightweight, fast, functional interface`
`22:36.25`	`dskippy`	`I think I might try qt-e next time I get a chance to flash and then go back to FDOM again.`
`22:36.28`	`df_aldur`	`I'm no artist, so I doubt it will look any good`
`22:36.31`	`Kensan`	`Dave: why so quiet?`
`22:36.40`	`df_aldur`	`Dave: problems?`
`22:36.46`	`Kensan`	`Dave: thought you weren't here.`
`22:36.52`	`Kensan`	`heh`
`22:36.58`	`Dave`	`Hahaha Kensan`
`22:37.00`	`dskippy`	`I just want to keep an eye on where qt-e is cause it seems like it might be the first to fix all the little feature lacks that are in all the other phone applications.`
`22:37.01`	`Dave`	`It was an illusion!`
`22:37.04`	`sicu`	`i'm guessing Dave's ganghis gang is rioting`
`22:37.12`	`dskippy`	`Then I can just dual boot if it becomes usable.`
`22:37.17`	`sicu`	`wow ... keyboard mixup`
`22:37.18`	`Kensan`	`runs for cover`
`22:37.23`	`dskippy`	`Anyway I should run. Nice talking to you guys.`
`22:37.24`	`df_aldur`	`what sort of feature lacks? high-level stuff?`
`22:37.27`	`Dave`	`installs orrery on Kensan`
`22:37.35`	`dskippy`	`df_aldur: Yeah, a bunch of little things.`
`22:37.37`	`df_aldur`	`ah ok, see you later`
`22:37.49`	`dskippy`	`Most of them have no volume control on the screen when I'm on the phone.`
`22:37.54`	`Kensan`	`summons Dave's parole officer`
`22:38.10`	`df_aldur`	`aye, that sucks`
`22:38.13`	`dskippy`	`It tells me my SMS are from 6178883270 and not "Sarah"`
`22:38.15`	`df_aldur`	`istr 2007 did, though`
`22:38.23`	`dskippy`	`Though the call log gives the names properly.`
`22:38.28`	`sicu`	`2007 =D`
`22:38.29`	`dskippy`	`Lots of little stuff like that.`
`22:38.32`	`Dave`	`incarcerates kensan`
`22:38.40`	`df_aldur`	`are the basics ok for you then?`
`22:38.44`	`dskippy`	`And the keyboard leaves a lot to be desired but I can deal with that I suppose.`
`22:38.47`	`Dave`	`\o\ Openmoko \o/ 2007 /o/`
`22:38.50`	`Kensan`	`hm this summoning does not work for me. Need to ask raster again how to do it properly.`
`22:38.58`	`df_aldur`	`audio quality, staying registered with the cell etc?`
`22:39.01`	`dskippy`	`df_aldur: to the extent that though aren't the basics, yeah I guess.`
`22:39.11`	`dskippy`	`Oh yes. Those basics are pretty good.`
`22:39.17`	`Dave`	`apt summon mwester`
`22:39.18`	`apt`	`apt takes out 20 clean, identical-looking phones, some extra hands, and pretends to be a telemarketer for a large corporation, so he gets delivered a phonelist containing mwester's coordinates`
`22:39.23`	`df_aldur`	`well, ui stuff is 'trivial' in a way`
`22:39.25`	`hipitihop`	`dskippy, is the 4.4.1 image not available here ? http://qtextended.org/modules/mydownloads/`
`22:39.26`	`Kensan`	`ah nice!`
`22:39.32`	`df_aldur`	`although admittedly it's tricky to get it all right in one ui`
`22:39.50`	`Kensan`	`just killed 10 secs off boottime`
`22:39.51`	`mwester`	`places his nick on the national "Do Not Call" list.`
`22:39.57`	`Dave`	`:D`
`22:40.12`	`sicu`	`haha, apt takes out 20 clean, freerunners and fails miserably at his summoning task`
`22:40.22`	`Dave`	`:D`
`22:40.25`	`Kensan`	`Dave: bee wewy wewy quiet, mwester's in a meeting`
`22:40.26`	`dskippy`	`hipitihop: That looks pretty good actually. Not sure if it's the new version.`
`22:40.27`	`vinicius`	`bricode: btw, do you happen to know how to track XPressPost shipments? =P`
`22:40.28`	`dskippy`	`Hard to tell.`
`22:40.37`	`Dave`	`Home many developers does it take to make a call on a freerunner?`
`22:40.43`	`df_aldur`	`crap`
`22:40.44`	`*** join/#openmoko emacsen (n=serge@pool-141-156-49-33.washdc.btas.verizon.net)`
`22:40.46`	`sicu`	`Kensan: congrats =D`
`22:40.46`	`Dave`	`How many`
`22:40.55`	`df_aldur`	`dfu beat teh internets`
`22:41.02`	`df_aldur`	`that's 3G for you`
`22:41.08`	`mwester`	`Nah, meeting is over. I'm looking at graphics cards now.`
`22:41.29`	`Dave`	`Surely the Radeon 98billion is the best one out there...`
`22:41.34`	`hipitihop`	`dskippy, not sure what you mean or what you'r elooking for but afaik it is the latest they released this month`
`22:41.36`	`sicu`	`Kensean: does that mean you figured out where those mysterious 10 seconds dissapeared to ?`
`22:41.38`	`Dave`	`rolls his eyes`
`22:41.53`	`mwester`	`Yeah, but the machine in question already has the nvidia drivers.`
`22:41.58`	`Kensan`	`sicu: yes, udevd was waiting for usb to settle heh`
`22:42.03`	`Dave`	`oops?`
`22:42.12`	`Dave`	`Kensan... grr... fucking udev`
`22:42.37`	`sicu`	`Dave: go easy on the udev ;p`
`22:42.39`	`df_aldur`	`ah, 4.4.1`
`22:42.40`	`Kensan`	`who has stuff plugged into his Freerunner on boot?`
`22:42.43`	`Dave`	`NO`
`22:42.46`	`df_aldur`	`they don't make it obvious`
`22:42.48`	`mwester`	`Me`
`22:42.56`	`Dave`	`I do`
`22:42.59`	`Kensan`	`raise hands please`
`22:43.06`	`mwester`	`raises his hand.`
`22:43.17`	`Dave`	`raises five hands`
`22:43.17`	`Kensan`	`ignores mwester`
`22:43.27`	`mwester`	`notes that he has multiple Om devices plugged in, and raises the other hand.`
`22:43.30`	`df_aldur`	`I have a 3G freerunner, with the help of a usb dongle`
`22:43.42`	`Dave`	`I have one hand up for each device plugged into my freerunner`
`22:43.48`	`Dave`	`what now bitch? :p`
`22:43.48`	`*** part/#openmoko dskippy (n=mmacHenr@gatekeeper.athenahealth.com)`
`22:43.55`	`Kensan`	`seriously though, I don't believe the average user needs that during init.`
`22:43.57`	`mwester`	`df_aldur: which device?`
`22:43.59`	`df_aldur`	`what if you have two freerunners plugged into each other?`
`22:44.12`	`df_aldur`	`mwester: the dongle? huwaei wossname`
`22:44.19`	`sicu`	`now he screws you over by ignoring all hands and continues to take off the 10 secs from boot-time`
`22:44.26`	`Kensan`	`Dave: I see you have a usb-fixation... maybe you need some therapy.`
`22:44.27`	`df_aldur`	`huawei`
`22:44.28`	`mwester`	`Kensan: agree - as long as it works the other way (the host detects the neo)`
`22:44.38`	`Dave`	`plugs Kensan into his freerunner`
`22:44.39`	`df_aldur`	`the one t-mobile sell in the uk`
`22:44.42`	`Kensan`	`mwester: yeah sure`
`22:44.47`	`mwester`	`Cool. Multiple GSMs on one device. :)`
`22:44.54`	`df_aldur`	`heh`
`22:45.06`	`Dave`	`FORM VOLTRON!`
`22:45.15`	`Kensan`	`mwester: I only tell udevd to ignore udev events from usb during init.`
`22:45.28`	`Kensan`	`mwester: ignore-> not wait for`
`22:45.37`	`Dave`	`Kensan, why do you treat your freerunner this way?`
`22:45.38`	`mwester`	`Ah - got it.`
`22:45.39`	`Dave`	`OH SNAP`
`22:45.45`	`Dave`	`I should go as a Neo Freerunner for halloween!`
`22:45.57`	`Dave`	`It's so utterly horrific!`
`22:46.01`	`*** join/#openmoko neldoreth (n=ascot@unixboard/users/neldoreth)`
`22:46.02`	`Dave`	`to modern cellular consumers`
`22:46.03`	`mwester`	`So they'll still appear, just that (for example) an external USB disk may not be ready until post-boot.`
`22:46.03`	`sicu`	`Dave: that would be cruel`
`22:46.06`	`Dave`	`:D`
`22:46.12`	`Dave`	`I'd just make people cry`
`22:46.13`	`Kensan`	`Dave: because it's not booting fast enough`
`22:46.18`	`Dave`	`Dude`
`22:46.22`	`Kensan`	`Dave: that's spankworthy`
`22:46.26`	`Dave`	`my record high`
`22:46.30`	`Dave`	`seven minute boot time`
`22:46.34`	`Kensan`	`Dave: raster would concurr`
`22:46.46`	`Dave`	`Excellent.`
`22:46.48`	`mwester`	`he's asleep :p`
`22:46.52`	`Dave`	`We should team up`
`22:46.52`	`Kensan`	`Dave: did you have to find a plug first?`
`22:47.01`	`Dave`	`rolls his eyes at Kensan`
`22:47.04`	`*** join/#openmoko opapo (n=daniel@205.118.116.89)`
`22:47.22`	`Kensan`	`mwester: yeah, he's acting all busy but actually... he's out surfing!`
`22:47.24`	`Dave`	`Kensan, I'm going to strangle you with a usb cable`
`22:47.27`	`opapo`	`is the freerunner "grandma ready"?`
`22:47.33`	`Dave`	`hahaha`
`22:47.36`	`Dave`	`The ultimate test!`
`22:47.58`	`Kensan`	`btw`
`22:48.09`	`vinicius`	`opapo: is that the next windows version?`
`22:48.09`	`mwester`	`There's a company in the US that's marketing phones specailly designed for grandma.`
`22:48.14`	`Kensan`	`IO does not seem to be issue, it's the cpu`
`22:48.19`	`Dave`	`Of course`
`22:48.23`	`Kensan`	`:(`
`22:48.26`	`Dave`	`IO is definitely an issue`
`22:48.30`	`Dave`	`in more ways than one`
`22:48.45`	`df_aldur`	`grandma doesn't want a mobile phone, so the freerunner is fine`
`22:48.49`	`Dave`	`hah`
`22:48.55`	`Kensan`	`sicu: why did you wake up Dave? sigh`
`22:48.57`	`Dave`	`grandma's probably running debian already ;p`
`22:48.59`	`opapo`	`:)`
`22:49.05`	`Kensan`	`It was so nice and peacefull and quiet.`
`22:49.12`	`opapo`	`I am an ubuntu user and like things to just work`
`22:49.15`	`df_aldur`	`no, grandma's old school and runs slackware`
`22:49.27`	`Dave`	`man, if grandma said fuck that to gentoo, I'd give her a high-five.`
`22:49.39`	`df_aldur`	`I need a better grandma`
`22:49.44`	`*** join/#openmoko jas4711 (n=jas@c80-216-18-41.bredband.comhem.se)`
`22:49.47`	`Dave`	`her comment would of course be, I'm not getting any younger now.`
`22:49.48`	`Dave`	`:p`
`22:49.53`	`opapo`	`If I spend the $400 on the freerunner with Qtopia will things just work?`
`22:49.58`	`Dave`	`df_aldur: eBay?`
`22:50.09`	`hipitihop`	`rustles off to get some work done while the residents discuss the new geriatric market potentials`
`22:50.09`	`df_aldur`	`opapo: short answer: no`
`22:50.09`	`Dave`	`craigslist`
`22:50.14`	`df_aldur`	`browses`
`22:50.25`	`Dave`	`:D`
`22:50.29`	`sicu`	`claims self 'not-guilty' in the awakening of the beast that is Dave`
`22:50.38`	`df_aldur`	`wait, can't I just re-flash my current one?`
`22:50.44`	`df_aldur`	`I think the hardware's basically sound`
`22:50.45`	`Dave`	`Bow before me my loyal minions.`
`22:50.55`	`Dave`	`aldur, sure.`
`22:51.59`	`Kensan`	`mwester: question about logging: do I need to install a proper syslog to catch all the debug output and error messages from init? It seems that error messages from udev are not picked up by busybox/logread et al.`
`22:52.14`	`opapo`	`how much configuration will I need to do to get the phone to make/receive calls with Qtopia?`
`22:52.31`	`vinicius`	`opapo: think exherbo`
`22:52.45`	`opapo`	`exherbo?`
`22:52.54`	`sicu`	`Dave: http://www.jeffiscool.com/pictures/Foxtrot/foxtrot_bluescreenofdeath.JPG`
`22:53.34`	`Kensan`	`ok boottime is now at 50 secs`
`22:53.43`	`vinicius`	`just kidding btw, I wouldn't know because mine hasn't arrived yet.`
`22:53.45`	`Kensan`	`damnit`
`22:54.35`	`*** join/#openmoko raster (n=raster@124-170-59-47.dyn.iinet.net.au)`
`22:55.31`	`Dave`	`YES :D`
`22:55.34`	`Dave`	`sicu++`
`22:55.41`	`Dave`	`I remember that :]`
`22:55.47`	`*** join/#openmoko jancona (n=jancona@pool-70-22-136-131.bos.east.verizon.net)`
`22:55.50`	`Dave`	`Mwester - I should go as the WSoD!`
`22:55.50`	`sicu`	`Kensan: think your summoning worked ^^`
`22:55.52`	`Dave`	`:P`
`22:55.56`	`Dave`	`perhaps that would be unoriginal though`
`22:55.56`	`sicu`	`haha`
`22:56.06`	`df_aldur`	`exherbo looks... odd`
`22:56.07`	`Dave`	`fuck yeah, I'd make microsoft jealous`
`22:56.18`	`Dave`	`check it out yo, we made our own colorful screen of death`
`22:56.24`	`df_aldur`	`I don't think the world is lacking in linux distros that are non-user-friendly but fun for hackers`
`22:56.27`	`Dave`	`Bob, you around?`
`22:56.46`	`*** join/#openmoko kd8ikt (n=kd8ikt@we.trekbeyond.org)`
`22:57.15`	`*** join/#openmoko alphabeat (n=nick@60-241-37-3.static.tpgi.com.au)`
`22:58.03`	`Kensan`	`sicu: I can neither deny nor approve that I have anything to do with rasters appereance.`
`22:58.25`	`vinicius`	`the more the merrier`
`22:58.29`	`sicu`	`hehe`
`22:58.39`	`Kensan`	`raster: ping`
`22:59.00`	`raster`	`leaps out of a puff of smoke`
`22:59.02`	`raster`	`TADA!`
`22:59.19`	`Kensan`	`raster: figured out where the 10 secs went`
`22:59.30`	`Dave`	`SURPRISE!`
`22:59.33`	`opapo`	`thanks for your help everyone`
`22:59.42`	`Dave`	`Raster Surprise`
`22:59.51`	`Dave`	`Sounds like a meal grandma would make... cringe`
`23:00.19`	`sicu`	`haha, Exherbo got right what OM should've claimed:`
`23:00.20`	`sicu`	`OK, I Want to Try Exherbo`
`23:00.20`	`sicu`	`No you don't.`
`23:00.20`	`sicu`	`Yes I Do`
`23:00.20`	`sicu`	`OK, maybe you do, but we don't particularly want you to try it because we don't want to deal with you whining when you find that absolutely nothing works.`
`23:00.29`	`mwester`	`Kensan: You need a debug board to catch the udev output; stdout for things started by init go to the console, not to the kernel log (demsg) or to syslog.`
`23:00.29`	`henkie`	`gps still crappy :(`
`23:00.45`	`Dave`	`haha it sounds like OM`
`23:00.52`	`mwester`	`Kensan: The other possibility is something I experimented with on the NSLU2 -- start init with stdout redirected.`
`23:01.01`	`Dave`	`Yay nslu2!`
`23:01.06`	`Dave`	`praise rwhitby`
`23:01.12`	`Dave`	`:)`
`23:01.38`	`*** join/#openmoko jancon1 (n=jancona@pool-70-19-238-66.bos.east.verizon.net)`
`23:01.38`	`Kensan`	`mwester: right. Well I "need" a debugboard eventualy anyway since I am sure I'll brick my Neo at some point heh`
`23:01.46`	`raster`	`Kensan: where?`
`23:01.47`	`mwester`	`:D`
`23:01.48`	`Kensan`	`actually I should go order one right now`
`23:01.58`	`noaXess`	`hi all`
`23:02.02`	`Kensan`	`raster: udevd was waiting for usb-devices to settle haha`
`23:02.08`	`noaXess`	`where can i find all the keyboard conf files?`
`23:02.08`	`raster`	`ooooh PFFFT!`
`23:02.09`	`raster`	`wtf`
`23:02.15`	`raster`	`settle pettle`
`23:02.18`	`raster`	`my arse`
`23:02.19`	`df_aldur`	`I don't think OM would have sold many units with 'It's not that we hate you (unless we do). It's just that we have nothing to offer you, and you have nothing to offer us.'`
`23:02.41`	`sicu`	`opapo: you won't need to do any configuration to make/receive calls in qtopia`
`23:02.57`	`Dave`	`right`
`23:03.06`	`Dave`	`only to hear the other party, or for them to hear you...`
`23:03.09`	`Dave`	`rolls his eyes`
`23:03.15`	`Kensan`	`raster: since with the way udev is used (untar /dev/ & trigger udev events) now it was also waiting for usb stuff`
`23:03.36`	`Kensan`	`s/is used/I use/`
`23:03.39`	`mwester`	`Is the set of devices also minimal?`
`23:03.44`	`Kensan`	`ah crap`
`23:03.47`	`mwester`	`(so that the triggers are minimized?`
`23:04.00`	`Kensan`	`mwester: the tar gets created on first boot`
`23:04.02`	`mwester`	`) <-- oops`
`23:04.13`	`sicu`	`Dave: well, i said nothing about sound clarity or stability .... just that making/receiving calls works ;p`
`23:04.15`	`mwester`	`Hmm... ok.`
`23:04.20`	`Dave`	`:p`
`23:04.21`	`Dave`	`indeed`
`23:04.36`	`Kensan`	`raster: I can send you the latest bootchart if you want`
`23:04.38`	`mwester`	`probably minor returns, but if we defer the creation of certain devices we might also speed things up.`
`23:04.44`	`lpotter`	`doesnt have any problems making calls with qtextended`
`23:04.53`	`Dave`	`MWester, the calypso problem perpetually aggravates me.`
`23:05.01`	`raster`	`Kensan: sure.`
`23:05.11`	`mwester`	`Another thing to consider -- do we really need a getty running on a port that nobody can ever use?`
`23:05.17`	`raster`	`needs tyo get his git tree fixed`
`23:05.18`	`Dave`	`haha`
`23:05.27`	`raster`	`mwester: no`
`23:06.00`	`lpotter`	`calls a tree docter for raster`
`23:06.09`	`lpotter`	`doctor`
`23:06.28`	`mwester`	`suspects lpotter of being an english major.`
`23:06.30`	`Kensan`	`raster: yeah and I'll need to put all the changes in patch-form...`
`23:07.27`	`lpotter`	`mwester: no, just have wonky fingers`
`23:07.43`	`Sargun`	`Does Om2008.8 use gsmd + gsm mux stuff?`
`23:07.58`	`raster`	`Kensan: aye! u will!`
`23:08.05`	`raster`	`or at least allow me to try and do it`
`23:08.09`	`mwester`	`Sargun: no`
`23:08.13`	`Dave`	`:D`
`23:08.19`	`Kensan`	`mwester: instead of defering their creation we could simply defer the trigger`
`23:08.22`	`*** join/#openmoko ruoso (n=ruoso@201009034164.user.veloxzone.com.br)`
`23:08.31`	`Dave`	`Hello Sargun.`
`23:08.38`	`mwester`	`Kensan: er, oops. Yes, that would be better. :)`
`23:08.49`	`Dave`	`lpotter, so, how about that qtopia-extended stuff?`
`23:09.35`	`Sargun`	`mwester, What does OM2008.8 use?`
`23:09.54`	`sicu`	`is wondering if Dave is leaving 2007 for qtx ?`
`23:10.05`	`mwester`	`It manages that all internally in the qtopia/X application`
`23:10.11`	`mwester`	`(qte IIRC)`
`23:10.38`	`Dave`	`What?`
`23:10.40`	`Sargun`	`is there documentation for cli-framework?`
`23:10.44`	`Kensan`	`raster: you've got mail`
`23:10.51`	`Dave`	`Sicu, I already wiped my qtx freerunner.`
`23:10.54`	`Sargun`	`I need to register with the network so I can go do GPRS junk.`
`23:10.57`	`Dave`	`like two weeks ago.`
`23:11.10`	`Dave`	`It failed harder than 2008.`
`23:11.30`	`Kensan`	`raster: yeah, I think the next thing I'll do is put the changes I made so far into patches.`
`23:11.32`	`Dave`	`What's wrong with the gprs/pppd stuff?`
`23:11.33`	`sicu`	`Dave: hehe, i know ... you were just asking about qtipia-extended stuff is all ;p`
`23:11.46`	`Dave`	`Yeah well, it can't hurt to see what recent things have been done`
`23:11.48`	`Dave`	`if anything at all`
`23:12.29`	`Kensan`	`raster: btw, Harald seems to be looking into boottime too.`
`23:12.42`	`Sargun`	`how do I stop my FSO from suspending?`
`23:13.25`	`Dave`	`heehee`
`23:14.05`	`*** join/#openmoko Proton23 (n=proton@p57BA59E3.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`23:14.11`	`noaXess`	`hey people.. how to deactiate the automatically word processing for the keyboard, input methods?`
`23:14.39`	`raster`	`Kensan: i've seen the mails - fix for bootchart too :)`
`23:15.03`	`Kensan`	`raster: yeah I applied it and compiled and it looks the same...`
`23:15.21`	`Dave`	`That's rather disappointing.`
`23:15.36`	`noaXess`	`how to configure the input method's?`
`23:15.38`	`Kensan`	`need to recheck though`
`23:15.53`	`Dave`	`more numpty please`
`23:16.32`	`sicu`	`Dave: you have to be patient ... i.e waiting a few weeks would've gotten you WSoD on both wakeup from suspend and unblanking, as opposed to just on wakeup ;p`
`23:17.35`	`df_aldur`	`I have fdom :)`
`23:17.39`	`df_aldur`	`and damn it's slow to boot`
`23:17.44`	`Kensan`	`raster: hm should probably ask what he is up to.`
`23:17.58`	`Kensan`	`raster: otherwise it's duplication of work all over again`
`23:18.24`	`Kensan`	`raster: he replaced init with upstart I believe`
`23:18.43`	`Kensan`	`should respond to that mail`
`23:18.49`	`Sargun`	`What GSM daemons does OM2008.8 have?`
`23:19.37`	`bricode`	`vinicius: Um, try Canadapost.ca?`
`23:19.52`	`mwester`	`Sargun: it doesn't use a GSM daemon -- the GSM management is part of the same process that handles the dialer: qpe`
`23:20.27`	`Kensan`	`raster: disk utilization/throughput is not showing up in the chart so I guess there's more to it...`
`23:20.41`	`raster`	`Kensan: right now frameworkd is what worries me the most`
`23:20.45`	`raster`	`as unlike boot imrpvoements`
`23:20.47`	`mwester`	`Kensan: Someone looked into bootcharts a very long time ago, and came to the conclusion that in order to profile I/O activity from the JFFS2 filesystem it needs some hooks that are currently lacking,IIRC`
`23:20.48`	`raster`	`thats much mroe work`
`23:20.49`	`raster`	`:)`
`23:20.56`	`raster`	`and its much more pervasive`
`23:21.01`	`lpotter`	`wishes he could share some of the amazing things being done for 'qt extended'`
`23:21.06`	`raster`	`ie -it is always there eating up ram/resources`
`23:21.31`	`mwester`	`wishes he knew what lpotter was up to for the next qt extended release`
`23:21.46`	`Kensan`	`mwester: ah ok`
`23:22.34`	`sicu`	`wishes lpotter would stop saying A if he cannot say B ;p`
`23:22.50`	`sicu`	`it's cruel cries`
`23:23.05`	`mwester`	`it's good marketing ;) Build up demand...`
`23:23.44`	`lpotter`	`lets just say it blows doors off what we have now, and makes qtextended look like 1980's`
`23:23.48`	`noaXess`	`why can't i get an answer here for my questions.. or any response?`
`23:23.56`	`sicu`	`as long as the built up expectations aren't higher than the results =D`
`23:23.57`	`raster`	`wishes he could talk about some ultra cool things happening to EFL for new clients with major phone product lines`
`23:23.58`	`raster`	`:)`
`23:24.12`	`raster`	`Kensan: looks a lot better`
`23:24.13`	`Dave`	`yeah`
`23:24.23`	`Dave`	`I wish they'd hire you, raster`
`23:24.27`	`Dave`	`Change the future!`
`23:24.30`	`Kensan`	`raster: yeah, that's bad...`
`23:24.45`	`Kensan`	`raster: but it's still 50 secs :(`
`23:24.54`	`phobie`	`chat less code more ;)`
`23:25.00`	`Kensan`	`raster: well 20 are uboot and kernel which I haven't looked at at all`
`23:25.06`	`raster`	`Dave: they have requested my consulting and have several projects they want done.`
`23:25.19`	`raster`	`Kensan: oh uboot+kernel`
`23:25.28`	`raster`	`i noticed a huge difference in the speed of 2 uboots i have`
`23:25.39`	`Dave`	`Ah, excellent.`
`23:25.39`	`raster`	`1 loads and decomrpesses the kernel MUCH faster than the other`
`23:25.45`	`raster`	`its about 5 seconds+ difference`
`23:26.06`	`Dave`	`I need to do more consulting when I have time.`
`23:26.46`	`sicu`	`noaXess: if you provide info on distro and keyb. ... you might get answers ;]`
`23:28.04`	`noaXess`	`ok.. then i will giv it one more time.. qtextended 4.4.1, qtopia keyboard and fullscreen input.. i want disable the auto word completion`
`23:28.09`	`*** join/#openmoko behdad (n=behdad@CPE001217b19226-CM0012c9c84bc4.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)`
`23:28.57`	`phobie`	`isn't that more a question for trolltech?`
`23:29.32`	`noaXess`	`phobie: ok.. thats an answer.. thanks.`
`23:29.49`	`noaXess`	`but i can't find any information about taht on trolltech's web, forum,...`
`23:30.02`	`noaXess`	`thats why i ask here`
`23:30.03`	`emacsen`	`anyone else notice the developer guide on the wiki is ancient?`
`23:30.05`	`noaXess`	`try to ask`
`23:30.05`	`phobie`	`I would answer anyways, but I don't know...`
`23:30.11`	`emacsen`	`ancient and wrong`
`23:30.26`	`sicu`	`noaXess: sorry, i dont know either :/`
`23:30.56`	`phobie`	`noaXess if you install fso, we could help`
`23:31.09`	`noaXess`	`fso?`
`23:31.14`	`Kensan`	`raster: there's harald's nand-access patches for uboot`
`23:31.26`	`Kensan`	`raster: plus qi seems to be an order of magnitude faster.`
`23:31.32`	`raster`	`yeah`
`23:31.33`	`phobie`	`noaXess: http://downloads.freesmartphone.org/fso-testing/images/`
`23:31.36`	`raster`	`right now tho`
`23:31.42`	`raster`	`i'm in the "dont care about uboot" stage`
`23:32.00`	`raster`	`ie - replace with qi, problem solved, BUT qi means much harder reflash etc. pain`
`23:32.03`	`noaXess`	`phobie: are there some screenshots, more informations?`
`23:32.12`	`Kensan`	`raster: then kernel can be tweaked too I am sure. The only thing I did was avoid lpj calculation by providing it to the kernel via param.`
`23:32.23`	`raster`	`so i'd be doing the "qi for real production consumer device - problem solved. for those reflashing/hacking, live with the uboot pause"`
`23:32.31`	`phobie`	`noaXess: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FSO`
`23:32.39`	`Kensan`	`raster: well I guess NOR helps with that.`
`23:32.43`	`raster`	`it does`
`23:32.43`	`noaXess`	`phobie: thanks..`
`23:32.54`	`noaXess`	`why is there no irc channel for qtextended?`
`23:33.01`	`phobie`	`noaXess: be warned it is unfinished :)`
`23:33.07`	`emacsen`	`noaXess, there is, it's called #qtopia :)`
`23:33.29`	`noaXess`	`phobie: ok.. test is our live ;)`
`23:33.29`	`phobie`	`noaXess: you should read http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Distributions`
`23:33.33`	`noaXess`	`emacsen: thanks`
`23:33.37`	`Kensan`	`raster: I might roll an uboot with harald's patches over the weekend and see how much that helps`
`23:33.49`	`Kensan`	`raster: will start experimenting with qi etc when I get my debugboarg`
`23:34.07`	`phobie`	`noaXess: FSO works very good bug you will probably be unable to phone and sms.`
`23:34.13`	`Kensan`	`mwester: mtd devices do not write anything to /proc/diskstats`
`23:34.19`	`Kensan`	`it seems`
`23:34.26`	`phobie`	`s/bug/but/g`
`23:34.44`	`noaXess`	`phobie: hm.. why is that like this, why no phone and sms.. cause that is, i think, a main thing for the neo freerunner..`
`23:35.13`	`phobie`	`noaXess: currently the d-bus framework is the "main thing"`
`23:35.52`	`noaXess`	`phobie: ok..`
`23:36.07`	`emacsen`	`phobie, what do you mean d-bus is the main thing? Main thing for what?`
`23:36.09`	`noaXess`	`than.. now.. thansk for answers :) thats good..`
`23:36.18`	`noaXess`	`good information to work on`
`23:36.39`	`phobie`	`emacsen: more important than writing a dialer`
`23:36.55`	`phobie`	`for EFL`
`23:37.26`	`emacsen`	`phobie, yes, and no. A platform that does the basics attracts more people, but yeah dbus is kinda required now a days. It saves so much trouble`
`23:38.24`	`Dave`	`phobie :)`
`23:38.30`	`Dave`	`uh oh, hello emacsen :P`
`23:38.41`	`emacsen`	`Dave, what do you hean uh o?`
`23:38.42`	`phobie`	`emacsen: it was just an answer to noaXess question, why FSO is not usable as a phone`
`23:38.51`	`emacsen`	`ok`
`23:38.53`	`Dave`	`:p`
`23:39.01`	`Dave`	`various reasons`
`23:39.16`	`emacsen`	`Dave, oh you know me IRL? ;)`
`23:42.15`	`sicu`	`noaXess: i guess a dirty way of disabling autocompletion would be to empty the dictionary files:`
`23:42.15`	`sicu`	`noaXess: /opt/Trolltech/Qtopia/etc/dict/en_US/common.dawg`
`23:42.16`	`sicu`	`noaXess: /opt/Trolltech/Qtopia/etc/dict/en_US/words.dawg`
`23:42.16`	`sicu`	`noaXess: /home/root/Applications/Dictionary/local.dawg`
`23:42.16`	`sicu`	`noaXess: but be careful as i don't run qtopia and therefore don't know if this would work ;]`
`23:42.49`	`*** join/#openmoko israr (n=israr@119.152.2.221)`
`23:43.39`	`lpotter`	`you can always hold down the letter and get the bubble popup. that selects the letter`
`23:44.13`	`sicu`	`is there no terminal-keyb option in qtopia ?`
`23:44.21`	`*** join/#openmoko ayeuu (n=ayeuu@tss37-1-82-228-161-185.fbx.proxad.net)`
`23:44.58`	`noaXess`	`sicu: i will.. be asking in gtopia channel..`
`23:45.00`	`noaXess`	`thanks`
`23:45.16`	`sicu`	`k, np`
`23:47.15`	`*** join/#openmoko batti (n=batti@p5B14C3A3.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)`
`23:47.20`	`*** join/#openmoko israr[a] (n=israr@119.152.2.221)`
`23:49.20`	`lpotter`	`there is a qwerty keyboard`
`23:50.19`	`*** join/#openmoko Pander (n=chatzill@ip235-130-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl)`
`23:50.26`	`Pander`	`hi all`
`23:50.58`	`Pander`	`i will get my freerunner tomorrow but for now i am trying to setup a build and emulation environment on ubuntu hardy`
`23:51.21`	`Pander`	`what is the best approach for this? openmoko make file?`
`23:51.22`	`*** part/#openmoko vivijim (n=vivijim@unaffiliated/vivijim)`
`23:51.43`	`*** join/#openmoko d-b_ (n=alias@124-171-35-118.dyn.iinet.net.au)`
`23:52.07`	`Kensan`	`ok mail is out`
`23:52.09`	`Kensan`	`DAMNIT`
`23:52.10`	`*** join/#openmoko KenYoung (n=Ken@pool-151-203-48-250.bos.east.verizon.net)`
`23:52.16`	`Kensan`	`2 o'clock again`
`23:52.48`	`Pander`	`luckily i have a jetlag, for me its morning, but the local clock tries to convince me its also 0200`
`23:53.40`	`Kensan`	`raster: did you talk to mickey or any of the FSO guys about your concerns?`
`23:54.45`	`*** join/#openmoko israr (n=israr@203.99.179.216)`
`23:55.15`	`phobie`	`I have jetlag without flying around`
`23:55.34`	`raster`	`Kensan: yes.`
`23:55.51`	`raster`	`for now it seems that its unimportant to them`
`23:57.40`	`Kensan`	`raster: bummer`
`23:57.45`	`Pander`	`anyways, for getting started with building, openmokomake, make setup, make image, is this teh way to go?`
`23:57.57`	`raster`	`Kensan: they want to get it done/working`
`23:58.03`	`raster`	`worry about size/performance later`
`23:58.21`	`raster`	`it seems to me they dont share the size concerns as much`
`23:58.23`	`Kensan`	`Pander: Mokomakefile is a nice way to do it`
`23:58.30`	`raster`	`ie think its not that bad`
`23:58.40`	`raster`	`i know for a fact fso on my treo650 is unusable`
`23:58.48`	`Kensan`	`raster: mkay`
`23:58.51`	`raster`	`well adding fso made it unusable`
`23:59.07`	`Kensan`	`raster: adding fso adds at least 40 secs to boottime`
`23:59.20`	`Kensan`	`raster: which is inacceptable in itself`
`23:59.33`	`Kensan`	`raster: without the runtime cost etc...`
`23:59.43`	`raster`	`yeah`
`23:59.50`	`raster`	`i know it adds a hefty startup overhead`

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