| 00:00.21 | Kensan | raster: would you have an image somewhere, which I could/should use for further boottime "improvement" stuff? |
| 00:01.06 | raster | ummm |
| 00:01.13 | raster | if u are happy that it violates gpl... |
| 00:01.19 | slaxxin | working on it right now |
| 00:02.15 | raster | jadams: btw - tell us about the g1... |
| 00:02.27 | Kensan | raster: what do you mean, I don't follow... |
| 00:02.34 | raster | Kensan: i can give u an image |
| 00:02.48 | raster | but fucked if i will supply you with a written offer to suply all sources |
| 00:02.54 | raster | or send you all sources of all gpl stuffon the image |
| 00:03.38 | johngay | Don't listen to every troll, raster. |
| 00:03.40 | Kensan | raster: *heh* I see. Well I would simply install bootchart and try tweaking the kernel+init stuff. |
| 00:03.47 | raster | (if u can accept that i built it from OE and asll my gpl source is upstream as per OE builds and you can get it oyurself and that i havent patched any gpl/lgpl stuff and taken it verbatim as OE gives it to me) |
| 00:04.11 | raster | i hbasically am no0t going to upload 400mhb of sources every time i do a new image |
| 00:04.14 | raster | 400mb |
| 00:04.32 | Kensan | raster: well pragmatism wins in this case I believe. |
| 00:04.32 | raster | i have bandwidth caps in .au |
| 00:04.36 | raster | max fer per month |
| 00:04.39 | johngay | You don't need to, unless you've patches 400mb of stuff. |
| 00:04.43 | raster | max xfer |
| 00:04.56 | raster | johngay: rwhitby is right. |
| 00:04.59 | raster | you DO technically need to |
| 00:05.05 | raster | gpl requires it |
| 00:05.07 | raster | patches or not |
| 00:05.15 | raster | its a STUPID bit of the gpl |
| 00:05.19 | raster | for hobbyists like us |
| 00:05.30 | raster | who just build form upstream using a "Well known build system" |
| 00:05.38 | raster | and we all have access and use the same upstream source |
| 00:05.44 | johngay | Only if you've modified it. |
| 00:05.44 | raster | but gpl does not account for that |
| 00:05.48 | raster | no |
| 00:05.52 | raster | it doesnt say that |
| 00:05.52 | Kensan | raster: I thought you were in Japan. Cheap bandwidth there, at least in the cities. |
| 00:05.59 | raster | Kensan: nah - back in .au |
| 00:06.18 | raster | johngay: gpl has no exception for "if u didnt modify it" |
| 00:06.37 | jadams | raster, I won't have the G1 until October 22. |
| 00:06.39 | raster | u either must provide a written offer to provide the source "at cost of distributing it" |
| 00:06.47 | raster | or offer the exact soruces u used to build |
| 00:06.49 | jadams | raster, but I will certainly update anyone who wishes me too when it comes in |
| 00:06.50 | raster | patched or not |
| 00:07.00 | raster | jadams: aaah |
| 00:07.19 | raster | Kensan: but i can get u an image. i'm just fixing up my exquisite theme right now |
| 00:07.23 | raster | to be a bit prettier |
| 00:07.27 | jadams | raster, and I live in Birmingham, AL USA. There's no 3G here until later this year, so I'll be on edge at first |
| 00:07.32 | raster | and i want to get rid of the orange openmoko splash image x uses |
| 00:07.45 | Kensan | raster: oh cool! I don't need pretty, I just need ssh... |
| 00:07.48 | Kensan | ;) |
| 00:08.04 | raster | jadams: was hoping u'd have found out if u can ssh in yet and fuck around with the base os, get a new kernel on etc. |
| 00:08.20 | jadams | raster, yeah, can guarantee that'll be one of the first things I do |
| 00:08.25 | raster | Kensan: let me make it pretty... in fact it matters as these are things that load data files |
| 00:08.27 | raster | thus impact io |
| 00:08.36 | raster | so having them in a different confi affects bootchart stuff |
| 00:08.53 | johngay | the FSF has a basic tutorial for GPL. Check it out. |
| 00:08.57 | raster | jadams: if the g1 is hackable to the point oif getting all its (major) hardware working |
| 00:08.59 | Kensan | raster: just read about the Swisscom thing on laforges blog. Can you disclose any info on what kind of project they are doing? |
| 00:09.05 | raster | it may be a good platform |
| 00:09.08 | *** part/#openmoko A__A (n=irc@62-249-253-85.dial.entanet.co.uk) |
| 00:09.34 | raster | Kensan: cat's out of the bag now. yes. |
| 00:09.36 | jadams | raster, assuming it were, does that mean one could easily run openmoko with 3G data / wifi? |
| 00:09.43 | raster | Kensan: simple efl based tooklit for mobile stuff |
| 00:09.45 | *** join/#openmoko vivijim (n=vivijim@unaffiliated/vivijim) |
| 00:10.10 | raster | Kensan: in fact the image i build has the demo app i wrote (the alarm one). also has the widget set test/demo app too |
| 00:10.22 | raster | jadams: i guess you could |
| 00:10.27 | raster | jadams: "Assuming" |
| 00:11.12 | Kensan | raster: nice. I am psyched about the news, since I saw the Swisscom guys at Openexpo (here in Switzerland) last week and I was quite surprised to see mokos at their "booth". |
| 00:11.30 | Kensan | raster: Swisscom is big here in switzerland. |
| 00:11.42 | jadams | raster, have you uploaded any screens of the alarm app to scap? |
| 00:11.47 | *** join/#openmoko vk5foss (n=kgoetz@gnewsense/friend/pdpc.active.kgoetz) |
| 00:12.19 | raster | Kensan: aaah. you're in .ch too |
| 00:12.38 | Kensan | raster: yes, that's why I am asking about the nitty gritty details ;) |
| 00:12.43 | raster | jadams: http://www.rasterman.com/files/illume-01.ogg |
| 00:12.47 | raster | jadams: http://www.rasterman.com/files/illume-02.ogg |
| 00:12.49 | raster | jadams: http://www.rasterman.com/files/illume-03.ogg |
| 00:12.51 | raster | jadams: http://www.rasterman.com/files/illume-04.ogg |
| 00:12.57 | jadams | raster: awesome |
| 00:13.18 | raster | (note running on my desktop, not on om - buyt pretending to have the dpi of the fr in 01 - 02, 03, 04 are differetn screen res/dpi's) |
| 00:13.23 | raster | the alarm app is white |
| 00:13.27 | raster | not the brown/round clock test app |
| 00:13.52 | raster | its simple |
| 00:13.54 | raster | but works |
| 00:13.59 | raster | its mroe a demo of the widget set |
| 00:14.03 | raster | its a very small app |
| 00:14.09 | Kensan | raster: Would you know anything about the "crypto and security related bits" that Harald mentioned in his blog? |
| 00:14.22 | raster | the vast majority off it si simple "Create widget, set its parameters, pack it into a parent" |
| 00:14.24 | jadams | raster, wow, keyboard-zoom never went so fast on fso |
| 00:14.28 | jadams | oh, nm |
| 00:14.29 | jadams | :) |
| 00:14.31 | raster | Kensan: no idea about them :( |
| 00:14.45 | raster | jadams: oh trust me.. it actually is pretty good on my illume umage on my fr |
| 00:15.03 | Kensan | raster: ok, I will see if "my other contacts" know something :) |
| 00:15.08 | raster | not as good as there |
| 00:15.11 | raster | but very usably nice |
| 00:15.15 | raster | also note |
| 00:15.17 | raster | fdo has problems |
| 00:15.36 | raster | if u move/drag your figner 50% of your cpu is being eaten by frameworkd just "listening" to touchscreen events |
| 00:15.41 | raster | kill frameworkd and it'll be faster |
| 00:15.42 | raster | :) |
| 00:16.04 | raster | the alarm app is the one with the "flipping" numbers |
| 00:16.14 | Kensan | raster: wow, 50%? that's heavy. |
| 00:16.29 | raster | Kensan: if u can wait a little - i alreayd did the artwork for new boot stuff. let me just get it into a theme and slap it on and built an image |
| 00:16.38 | raster | kenb if u absolutely can't wait.. i'll upload |
| 00:16.47 | raster | Kensan: and yes. 50%... it's python. not surprising |
| 00:16.49 | *** join/#openmoko sibbe (i=jvtm@omni.byte.fi) |
| 00:17.04 | Kensan | raster: well it's quite late here. How long is "a little" ? ;) |
| 00:17.21 | raster | lastr time i benchmarked python vs c, python was about 280 times slower. |
| 00:17.28 | raster | Kensan: maybe 30 mins... |
| 00:17.38 | raster | actually no |
| 00:17.43 | raster | i'd need to buil,d flash, test first |
| 00:18.09 | Kensan | raster: "torvalds-tested" (tm) aka. compile-tested ;) |
| 00:18.51 | Kensan | raster: either way, I think I should catch some sleep. |
| 00:19.50 | raster | hahaha |
| 00:19.52 | raster | wait |
| 00:19.54 | raster | uploading |
| 00:20.16 | raster | 30 mins |
| 00:20.19 | raster | err |
| 00:20.22 | raster | 4mins |
| 00:20.23 | raster | i mean |
| 00:20.55 | Kensan | raster: how did you speed that up? :) |
| 00:20.55 | sicu | raster: is your new splash in one of the oggs ? |
| 00:21.02 | raster | Kensan: i just didnt fix it |
| 00:21.04 | raster | u get it "as is" |
| 00:21.09 | raster | as i built last night and tested |
| 00:21.09 | Kensan | raster: ah ok :) |
| 00:21.15 | raster | sicu: no. |
| 00:21.46 | Kensan | raster: well there's no need to hurry, since I won't be doing any bootcharting tonight :) |
| 00:22.18 | niklauz | hi, anyone know if there is work or effort toward making images selectable on boot? |
| 00:22.33 | sicu | raster: ok ... btw, i love what you've done with layout and graphics in the ogg files =] |
| 00:22.50 | *** join/#openmoko Kensan (n=ken@gw.ptr-80-238-227-82.customer.ch.netstream.com) |
| 00:23.19 | jadams | raster, that phone interface is orders of magnitude nicer than what ships in om |
| 00:23.25 | jadams | raster, very, very well done |
| 00:24.04 | *** join/#openmoko Kamping_Kaiser (n=kgoetz@gnewsense/friend/pdpc.active.kgoetz) |
| 00:24.26 | raster | kennyz[dnd]: aaah ok |
| 00:24.29 | niklauz | pics? |
| 00:24.53 | raster | niklauz: how do u propose to store multiple ones - other than on sd |
| 00:24.54 | raster | ? |
| 00:25.03 | niklauz | only on sd |
| 00:25.06 | raster | whihc (imho) is not the ultimate goal of an image |
| 00:25.10 | raster | (its goal is to live on flash) |
| 00:25.31 | raster | sicu: thats just illume+e.. just with a theme that is nice |
| 00:25.32 | raster | :) |
| 00:25.48 | raster | http://download.enlightenment.org/misc/Illume/ |
| 00:25.49 | raster | there |
| 00:25.56 | raster | kernel + rootfs |
| 00:26.02 | raster | NOT FULLY BAKED |
| 00:26.05 | raster | but boots |
| 00:26.06 | raster | and runs |
| 00:26.15 | raster | has a terminal, screenshot and alarm app |
| 00:26.16 | raster | thats it |
| 00:26.20 | Kensan | raster: Do you think there's still potential to speed up the Flash access on FR? |
| 00:26.30 | niklauz | raster: multi-boot option is a bad idea? |
| 00:26.35 | raster | botosplash is not final - botsplahs si simply the raw default exquisite ships with |
| 00:26.52 | raster | Kensan: i think so - yes. it should be maybe 2x as fast |
| 00:27.01 | raster | niklauz: for a phone.. yes |
| 00:27.05 | raster | as u dont want to be "booting" |
| 00:27.09 | raster | u want to just boot and stay on |
| 00:27.09 | niklauz | hehe |
| 00:27.13 | raster | and nevrr shut down |
| 00:27.20 | niklauz | raster: you make good points |
| 00:27.28 | raster | always suspend/resume |
| 00:27.34 | raster | or go into zero clock and save power |
| 00:27.37 | raster | but stay the hell up |
| 00:28.04 | Kensan | raster: hm ic. So that means that the driver could be improved (somehow)? |
| 00:28.09 | raster | at worst u reboot when an upgrade requires restarting base system servicews (u can restart them on the fly too - but often its just simpler to do it windows-style..) |
| 00:28.16 | raster | Kensan: i thnk so |
| 00:28.20 | niklauz | still as a 'device' it is fun and encourages experimentation, for example switch from phone to router on demand |
| 00:28.36 | Kensan | raster: ok, thanks for the info. There's still hope... :) |
| 00:28.36 | raster | Kensan: for example it's doing ecc in software, not hardware |
| 00:28.41 | niklauz | or to try out an images new features |
| 00:28.41 | ceda | raster: I though you lived in Germany? |
| 00:28.49 | raster | ceda: why did u think that? :) |
| 00:29.13 | raster | i havent lived in germany for... almost 29 years |
| 00:29.15 | Kensan | raster: eventhough it could do it in hardware? |
| 00:29.23 | ceda | well, I guess I've mixed you up with some other guy :) |
| 00:29.31 | raster | Kensan: yes. and possibly other flash io mode improvements too |
| 00:29.42 | ceda | time to sleep anyway |
| 00:29.46 | raster | maybe check to see if you do zero-copy |
| 00:29.49 | Kensan | raster: well for how long have you not been living in Japan then? Just so I know how far off *I* was :) |
| 00:30.05 | raster | ie when u uncompress a jffs2 block - do u uncompres sdirectly into the userspace page |
| 00:30.09 | raster | or is there an extra copy |
| 00:30.25 | raster | also some files (.edj. jpg, png) files could be fixed |
| 00:30.33 | raster | jffs2 will not manage any useful comrpession on them |
| 00:30.36 | raster | ever |
| 00:30.36 | Kensan | raster: oh so there's still some things that should be looked into. |
| 00:30.39 | raster | its a waste of cycles |
| 00:31.01 | raster | so jffs2 needs a way to flag files (bigen maybe a glob pattter?) to "dont bother compressing these ones" |
| 00:31.12 | raster | ceda: :) |
| 00:31.14 | Kensan | raster: hm... ic. Do you know if anybody at OM is looking into that? |
| 00:31.37 | *** join/#openmoko iscape (n=Marcus@193.253.141.89) |
| 00:31.37 | raster | niklauz: sure - but why not just have your 1 os do all those tasks? |
| 00:31.43 | raster | just have different daemons running.. |
| 00:31.55 | raster | its got enough ram and even cpu to do most of these |
| 00:32.01 | raster | most cpu is eaten up in wait cycles for the glamo |
| 00:32.14 | raster | and well efl likes ot munch cpu cycles for gfx rendering... |
| 00:32.15 | raster | :) |
| 00:32.24 | raster | Kensan: as best i know - they arent |
| 00:32.24 | Kensan | raster: hehe |
| 00:32.30 | raster | but i dont work @ om... anymore :) |
| 00:32.39 | raster | but i do know htings that could help |
| 00:32.48 | raster | other than that - removing all sorts of stupid stuff from boot |
| 00:32.53 | Kensan | raster: ugh :( Yeah, I read that on your site. |
| 00:32.53 | raster | ie in general from OE |
| 00:32.58 | raster | and OE's linux setup |
| 00:32.59 | raster | technically |
| 00:33.05 | raster | when exquisite's boot splash is up |
| 00:33.07 | niklauz | i suppose, i like the idea of trying out new efforts for comparison, to do this 'on-the-fly' would be incredibly awesome to me |
| 00:33.10 | raster | that is when x COULD be up |
| 00:33.13 | niklauz | u don't think so? |
| 00:33.14 | Kensan | raster: (ugh for the "nobody at om looking into glamo") ;) |
| 00:33.16 | raster | it doesnt need to be delayed so long |
| 00:33.27 | raster | Kensan: frankly - glamo isnt worht it |
| 00:33.29 | raster | its an EOL chip |
| 00:33.32 | raster | it has no future :( |
| 00:33.39 | Kensan | raster: great :( |
| 00:33.54 | niklauz | similar to the enjoyment between bouncing between fedora, ubuntu, etc |
| 00:34.00 | CIA-22 | openmoko: 03werner * r4679 10/developers/werner/ahrt/host/tmc/ (demo/eye.py lib/phosphor.py lib/trigger.py lib/wave.py): (log message trimmed) |
| 00:34.00 | CIA-22 | openmoko: Highlights: |
| 00:34.00 | CIA-22 | openmoko: - new module phosphor.py to view how often patterns repeat |
| 00:34.00 | CIA-22 | openmoko: - example eye.py to plot an eye diagram with phosphor.py |
| 00:34.00 | CIA-22 | openmoko: Details: |
| 00:34.03 | raster | niklauz: just back-up your excisting flash |
| 00:34.04 | CIA-22 | openmoko: - lib/wave.py (analog, digital): moved binary search by time from "get_one" |
| 00:34.05 | Kensan | raster: I guess the same goes for the TI Calypso... |
| 00:34.06 | CIA-22 | openmoko: into new method "index" |
| 00:34.06 | raster | flash new image |
| 00:34.13 | raster | try - dont like, restore old flash |
| 00:34.14 | raster | :) |
| 00:34.21 | raster | Kensan: correct. |
| 00:34.33 | niklauz | raster: i know :) i'm just daydreaming about showing it to geek friends lol |
| 00:34.35 | raster | Kensan: as such glamos' acceleration is abut at the level of most desktop xservers |
| 00:34.41 | raster | ie blit, fill, xvideo. |
| 00:34.47 | raster | it has some bugs in sv for sure |
| 00:35.00 | raster | but mostly its biggest bottleneck is bus bandwidth |
| 00:35.04 | raster | it can accelerate a bit more |
| 00:35.10 | raster | but not enough to be "worth it" |
| 00:35.17 | raster | opengles is the only other thing |
| 00:35.20 | raster | and that coems with caveats |
| 00:35.28 | Kensan | raster: that's what I figured... it's really a pitty since IO is so crucial to overal performance. |
| 00:35.42 | *** join/#openmoko GLHMarmot (n=scott@S0106001217d138ed.vs.shawcable.net) |
| 00:35.46 | raster | (256x256 texture size max, no render-to-texture, qvga output - which is broken in xglamo anyway) etc. |
| 00:35.54 | raster | by the time all the basics are fixed |
| 00:36.11 | raster | (rotation and qvga mode with touchsrceen, other basic xvideo bugs and slowdowns) |
| 00:36.21 | raster | freerunenr is an obsolete piece of hardwre and glamo will never be seen again |
| 00:36.39 | raster | so all the effort u did isnt goign to live beyond a product that now is not manufacturered anymore :( |
| 00:36.49 | raster | that is the problem - its a matter of weighing up effort vs gain |
| 00:37.07 | Kensan | raster: ok so my motivation to look at the glamo driver is close to 0 now. |
| 00:37.16 | raster | i know that i'd focus on work that will live many years into the future |
| 00:37.25 | raster | so eg hardware i know will have compatible successors |
| 00:37.33 | raster | or stuff that isnt dependant on specific hardware |
| 00:37.46 | Kensan | raster: yes, that sounds reasonable. |
| 00:37.55 | raster | i know i was exciteed about the lgamo.. until i read all of its specs |
| 00:38.03 | raster | and i know the community is still "Excitied" |
| 00:38.10 | raster | all the people "Excited" havent read the details |
| 00:38.12 | raster | ask dodji |
| 00:38.14 | raster | or me |
| 00:38.30 | raster | excitement dropped to "non existant" after actually getting all the details |
| 00:38.34 | Kensan | raster: they have not read your various mails on the mailinglists :) |
| 00:38.51 | raster | *IF* this was like the ps2 |
| 00:38.53 | raster | or ps1 |
| 00:38.54 | raster | or psp |
| 00:38.57 | raster | or amiga |
| 00:38.58 | raster | etc. |
| 00:39.05 | raster | this hardware would live for the next 5 or 10 years |
| 00:39.07 | raster | and be produced |
| 00:39.15 | raster | and thus it is worth squeezing every last cycle out of it |
| 00:39.25 | iscape | who did then made the decision to get the glamo in? |
| 00:39.26 | raster | and on these platforms it takes years of hard-core hackers |
| 00:39.40 | raster | game engine coders - who know their shit when it comes to twisted and bizarre hardware |
| 00:39.52 | raster | to imaginatively code SPECIFICALLY for that hardware and max out its potential |
| 00:39.53 | Kensan | raster: hm ok, so if I may be so frank to ask: what would you consider worthwhile to try and fix which would have a fair amount of impact on the devices performance? |
| 00:40.08 | raster | if u designed guis specifically to do only what glamo could do |
| 00:40.10 | raster | it'd be better |
| 00:40.12 | iscape | openmoko is very often quite opaque in its decisions... |
| 00:40.16 | raster | but u'd be designing for.. a dead platform |
| 00:40.24 | raster | it'd take years to really squeeze the best out of it |
| 00:40.35 | raster | and everythign u did would be irrelevant for any future platforms |
| 00:40.36 | raster | :( |
| 00:40.56 | raster | Kensan: fix. i'd look at leaning down the boot |
| 00:41.10 | Kensan | raster: if I am not mistaken, that's what's beggining to happen with the PS3: dev teams starting to code "for" the PS3 and actually using it's specifics. |
| 00:41.14 | raster | Kensan: get x up as early as possible and start up any other services in the backgroudn later with a delay |
| 00:41.19 | raster | eg dropbear |
| 00:41.25 | raster | that could easily be delayed by 60 seconds |
| 00:41.30 | raster | and started long after gui is up |
| 00:41.31 | iscape | well, there are a couple of companies working on a linux samrtphone... |
| 00:41.32 | iscape | smartphone |
| 00:41.36 | Kensan | raster: well that's what I figured since I am not really the UI guy... |
| 00:41.39 | raster | (a debug mode to start it early if u like) |
| 00:41.53 | raster | i'd look at removing as much shell script logic and file io stuff form scripts |
| 00:41.59 | raster | eg using files to do things |
| 00:41.59 | raster | eg |
| 00:42.08 | raster | if [ -f /path/to/file ] then |
| 00:42.09 | raster | ... |
| 00:42.19 | raster | all the sourcing of function headers |
| 00:42.22 | raster | running unix commands |
| 00:42.31 | raster | (find, cat, sed, grep, etc.) during boot |
| 00:42.43 | Kensan | raster: well a lot of stuff that's done dynamically (e.g. udev) could be done statically |
| 00:42.48 | raster | nuke the boot down to only bare bones needed to get the ui up |
| 00:42.51 | raster | ie device nodes |
| 00:42.52 | raster | dbus |
| 00:42.54 | Kensan | raster: dynamically at boot time. |
| 00:42.54 | raster | x |
| 00:42.56 | raster | thats it |
| 00:42.57 | *** join/#openmoko ozzloy (n=ozzloy@unaffiliated/ozzloy) |
| 00:43.05 | raster | then get ui up asap |
| 00:43.10 | raster | (Thats what users notice the most) |
| 00:43.26 | raster | all of this work will be applicable to all hardware platforms |
| 00:43.28 | raster | and help everything |
| 00:43.33 | Kensan | raster: true. |
| 00:43.36 | raster | its a "non-wasted effort" |
| 00:44.13 | *** join/#openmoko rooly|away (n=chris@host-125-92.lalacap.clients.pavlovmedia.com) |
| 00:44.13 | raster | wil applye to gta01, gta02, gta03/4, to anytning else oe/om runs on |
| 00:44.21 | Kensan | raster: well thanks a bunch for the, dare I say, enlightening conversation *heh* |
| 00:44.26 | Kensan | raster: gotta catch some sleep. |
| 00:44.32 | raster | (eg that jffs2 image i built - try it. its boot isnt that slow) i also build for my zaurus |
| 00:44.44 | raster | and i will build it for my treo650 when it arrives. |
| 00:44.45 | raster | :) |
| 00:45.02 | Kensan | raster: you mean the one from download.enlightenment.org, right? |
| 00:45.08 | raster | yes |
| 00:45.16 | raster | i have it flashed on my z too |
| 00:45.25 | raster | i was going to build one for my n800 too |
| 00:45.31 | raster | but seems i need to fix xomap... |
| 00:45.32 | Kensan | raster: ok will do. |
| 00:45.59 | Kensan | raster: once I get some time that is :( |
| 00:46.18 | raster | :( |
| 00:46.21 | raster | thats always the problem |
| 00:46.22 | raster | time... |
| 00:46.36 | Kensan | raster: well I imagine it's worse for you so I shouldn't complain. |
| 00:46.42 | raster | i'm doing this image so i have a clean pristine image to run things on for swisscom |
| 00:46.56 | raster | so i guess i have some time |
| 00:47.10 | raster | i'm a bit of a perfectionist - so if i have an image.. ithas to at least look right |
| 00:47.11 | raster | :) |
| 00:47.18 | Kensan | raster: I will try to figure out some details about this secret Swisscom project :) |
| 00:47.18 | raster | but if u want to dig into boot stuff |
| 00:47.23 | raster | definitely fixing up all the boot scripts |
| 00:47.27 | raster | takew this as a goal |
| 00:47.31 | raster | this is not a freerunner |
| 00:47.33 | raster | it was a laptop |
| 00:47.40 | raster | 1.5ghz celeron |
| 00:47.41 | ljp | telepathy not included in package feeds? |
| 00:48.10 | Kensan | raster: what do you mean by" it was a laptop"? |
| 00:48.10 | raster | got linux to boot from lilo to x11, with opengl gui in 1.6 seconds |
| 00:48.19 | raster | well its not a "slow arm" |
| 00:48.20 | Kensan | raster: ah ok ic. |
| 00:48.24 | raster | its booting off a hdd |
| 00:48.40 | raster | but 1.6 seconds from bios -> x + gui |
| 00:48.58 | Kensan | raster: aha, so you are setting the mark whilst making me look ridiculous in the future. |
| 00:48.59 | raster | a handicap of having a hdd, but a faster cpu (and memory bus) |
| 00:49.12 | raster | hehee |
| 00:49.13 | raster | nah |
| 00:49.17 | raster | u wont manage that |
| 00:49.17 | raster | i know |
| 00:49.40 | raster | but i believe (imho) 10-15 sec boot all the way to full usabel gui is possible |
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| 00:50.42 | raster | maybe 20sec on the outside |
| 00:50.48 | Kensan | raster: heh well speeding up boot time was one of my small projects and with all the additional arguments you provided I really believe it is a worthwile goal. |
| 00:51.03 | raster | it is definitely worthwhile |
| 00:51.12 | raster | i think some general jffs2 work |
| 00:51.26 | raster | like being able to have specific files not compressed wil lhelp |
| 00:51.28 | Kensan | raster: many people disagree ("You only boot once, then you use suspend/resume"). |
| 00:51.33 | raster | other stuff like improved jffs2 mount time |
| 00:51.42 | johngay | What about RIP code? |
| 00:51.49 | raster | Kensan: sure. its a "firts impression" though |
| 00:52.00 | Kensan | raster: indeed. |
| 00:52.01 | raster | first impressions matter. |
| 00:52.06 | Kensan | raster: exactly |
| 00:52.14 | raster | and thats why i'd focus on things that also benefit general runtime too |
| 00:52.23 | raster | boto itself is just stupidlyt heavy/slow |
| 00:52.28 | raster | its simple to lean it down |
| 00:52.34 | Kensan | raster: were other FS considered at the time? |
| 00:52.37 | raster | u could probably halve the time |
| 00:52.47 | raster | hmm really not many other options |
| 00:52.52 | raster | yaffs i guess |
| 00:53.09 | raster | kernel could also move much more into modules |
| 00:53.23 | raster | anything it doesnt absolutely need for boot |
| 00:53.27 | Kensan | raster: well while fiddling around with FSO MS3 I got -20 secs or so but the overall boot time was still > 2:20 so it was still no use... |
| 00:53.33 | raster | (audio, wifi, etc.) |
| 00:53.40 | raster | (sd card io etc.) |
| 00:53.55 | Kensan | raster: I believe, that's what andy is doing if I read the kernel ML right... |
| 00:54.24 | raster | aaah at last |
| 00:54.24 | Kensan | raster: well there's some new Flash FS around the block in the kernel so it might be worth to reconsider... |
| 00:54.34 | raster | i rememebr suggesting it ages ago and getting resistance |
| 00:54.41 | raster | yeah |
| 00:54.47 | raster | some new flash fs might be worth a look |
| 00:54.52 | raster | though io is just generally abysmal |
| 00:54.59 | raster | i clock about 2mb/sec from flash |
| 00:55.02 | raster | (reads) |
| 00:55.07 | raster | whihc is.. pretty atrocious |
| 00:55.35 | raster | from "built in on-chip flash) i would have "expected" at least 5-10m/sec |
| 00:56.27 | Kensan | raster: yeah. If I am not mistaken, the microSD shares the same bandwidth issues, since it is run by the glamo, right? |
| 00:56.48 | raster | flash isnt run by glamo |
| 00:56.50 | raster | so its different |
| 00:57.10 | Kensan | raster: ah really? so it's actually the flash that is slow? |
| 00:57.18 | raster | flash and driver |
| 00:57.29 | raster | u cant blame glamo for flash io speed here |
| 00:57.39 | raster | glamo is getting a free pass on this one |
| 00:57.41 | raster | :) |
| 00:57.48 | Kensan | raster: well that's what I used to, but this keeps getting better... |
| 00:58.09 | raster | the 2442 does flash |
| 00:58.13 | raster | it has hardware-ecc |
| 00:58.35 | raster | but its ecc algorithm disagrees with uboot's so when flashing it'll fail |
| 00:58.51 | Kensan | raster: that's what you get for not RTFM... Luckily everybody is very nice tonight... |
| 00:59.12 | Kensan | raster: ah I read something about that on the om-kernel ML |
| 00:59.21 | raster | as such uboot is not aware of hw ecc |
| 00:59.29 | raster | if u used hw ecc when writing (flashing) from uboot |
| 00:59.31 | Kensan | raster: I guess I need to reread, didn't pay much attention at the time, |
| 00:59.35 | raster | it'd probably work |
| 00:59.50 | raster | werner guesses a 2x speedup is possible |
| 01:00.05 | Kensan | raster: so uboot would need support for 2442's hw ecc |
| 01:00.22 | raster | combine that with a better jffs2 mount process and runtime not compressing files that are not worth compressing |
| 01:00.25 | raster | :) |
| 01:00.32 | raster | yeah |
| 01:00.35 | Kensan | raster: 0_o |
| 01:00.38 | raster | there is support in the kernel driver |
| 01:00.40 | raster | but disabled |
| 01:00.57 | Kensan | raster: hm kay. |
| 01:01.19 | raster | sometimes i think i know way too many details about stuff i dont work on... |
| 01:01.49 | Kensan | raster: hahaha |
| 01:02.04 | Kensan | raster: many people wish for the opposite |
| 01:02.36 | Kensan | raster: actually it's the majority I guess. |
| 01:02.53 | Kensan | raster: I know nothing about the stuff I work on. :) |
| 01:03.31 | Kensan | raster: so I should not keep you from working and I should not keep myself from sleeping... |
| 01:03.37 | slaxxin | why is lilo not used in place of uboot? |
| 01:04.00 | raster | Kensan: hahahahahah |
| 01:04.05 | raster | Kensan: go sleep! |
| 01:04.17 | raster | i need to make this exquisite boot splash purierr |
| 01:04.20 | raster | purtier |
| 01:04.20 | Kensan | raster: thanks for all the info. I will try to hit you back if you are interested and if I make some progress but I fear it's going to take some time. |
| 01:04.31 | raster | no problems |
| 01:04.42 | raster | do u have a working setup of oe's build going? |
| 01:04.49 | Kensan | raster: yes I do |
| 01:04.51 | raster | if so - it might be good to get that working |
| 01:04.54 | raster | cool |
| 01:05.07 | raster | openemebdded's git tree? |
| 01:05.14 | raster | org.openembedded.dev ? |
| 01:05.29 | Kensan | raster: I actually used OE/Openmoko/building images to buy me a shiny new quad-core system :) It's so worht to lie to yourself when it comes to gadgets and stuff :) |
| 01:05.40 | raster | HAHAHAHAHHAA |
| 01:05.49 | raster | slaxxin: lilo is x86 only |
| 01:05.59 | Kensan | raster: I used the mokomakefile thingy. |
| 01:06.03 | raster | (utterly useless beyond x86) |
| 01:06.16 | raster | Kensan: oooh. ok. i set imine up pristine from oe |
| 01:06.18 | Kensan | raster: but I thought I should move to "upstream" |
| 01:06.27 | raster | but i have my own "install.sh" that does what mokomakefile does |
| 01:06.29 | raster | (setup) |
| 01:06.35 | Kensan | raster: nice! |
| 01:07.07 | raster | so i use bitbake directly these days |
| 01:07.24 | Kensan | raster: ok, since FR is more of a devel toy for me I don't actually need the phone apps etc. So actually I could flush the build I got now and do a pristine OE I guess. |
| 01:07.27 | raster | i also have mine set up to build multiple target devices fromt he same source/package tree |
| 01:07.35 | raster | whihc was what i specirfically wanted |
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| 01:08.04 | raster | needs more devel toys |
| 01:08.16 | Kensan | raster: I actually wanted that too (GTA01/02) but I went the cheap way and used mokomakefile. |
| 01:08.24 | raster | hehee |
| 01:08.29 | raster | well u could use my install.sh |
| 01:08.39 | raster | it just automates the initial setup |
| 01:08.52 | raster | tho i need to really split it out of my tree... |
| 01:09.57 | Kensan | raster: well... how can I put that. *IF* you would provide your script I would be willing to beta-test *heh* |
| 01:11.21 | raster | ummm |
| 01:11.27 | raster | need to fix it up a bit ... |
| 01:13.01 | Kensan | raster: haha, don't bother. I don't want to be the reason for you spending to clean up shell-scripts instead of doing illume/e/enlightenment or any of the zillions of other awesome projects you do. |
| 01:14.06 | raster | i'll get to it eventually |
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| 01:15.03 | Kensan | raster: ok, but seriously, don't put in too much effort. You should tell me to RTFM instead ;) |
| 01:15.54 | raster | http://www.rasterman.com/files/install.sh |
| 01:15.58 | raster | read it |
| 01:16.07 | raster | ie mkdir ~/oe |
| 01:16.08 | raster | or whatever |
| 01:16.12 | raster | put install.sh in there |
| 01:16.13 | raster | run it |
| 01:16.25 | raster | not cleaned up |
| 01:16.36 | raster | it wont set up multi-build-target stuff |
| 01:16.38 | raster | only 1 |
| 01:16.49 | raster | ooh |
| 01:16.50 | raster | wait |
| 01:16.52 | raster | u need... |
| 01:17.57 | raster | u'll also need |
| 01:18.07 | raster | http://www.rasterman.com/files/local.conf |
| 01:18.13 | raster | before u run it |
| 01:18.14 | raster | :) |
| 01:18.55 | Kensan | raster: AWESOME! |
| 01:19.53 | Kensan | raster: why can't they put your script up on the OE page as a howto? 20 lines and I actually understand how it works. |
| 01:19.56 | Kensan | :) |
| 01:22.20 | raster | i just wrote it end of last week? |
| 01:22.46 | raster | i'm a compulsive scripter |
| 01:22.50 | Kensan | raster: domo arigato-u. Well it's been very interesting and instructive but I really need to catch some sleep. |
| 01:22.55 | raster | if i have something that has a "manual setup" |
| 01:23.04 | raster | i instantly go write all the setup commands in a script |
| 01:23.12 | raster | so if i have to do it again |
| 01:23.23 | Kensan | raster: :) |
| 01:23.26 | raster | 1. i have documented all the steps in a runnable script |
| 01:23.32 | raster | 2. i can repeat with little effort |
| 01:23.42 | raster | the problewm is my scritps tend to be "works for me (tm)" |
| 01:23.49 | raster | i dont ntend to make much effort to make them generic |
| 01:23.54 | raster | for all people in the world |
| 01:24.04 | raster | its great if your environment/setup is like mine tho... |
| 01:24.06 | raster | :) |
| 01:24.15 | raster | i just think the world should use zsh |
| 01:24.20 | raster | and use my .zshrc |
| 01:24.20 | Kensan | raster: well dog food is ok. I can live with that since I can make other peoples stuff work for me somehow... sometimes. |
| 01:24.25 | raster | and my sudoers |
| 01:24.27 | raster | ... |
| 01:24.37 | Kensan | raster: hehe sudoers |
| 01:24.47 | raster | well i have full root sudo access |
| 01:24.57 | raster | no password |
| 01:25.01 | Kensan | raster: tell me your root password and I will set the same on my workstation ;) |
| 01:25.08 | raster | so anything i need root for i just throw sudo infront of |
| 01:25.10 | raster | not secure |
| 01:25.12 | raster | but convenient |
| 01:25.13 | raster | :) |
| 01:25.24 | raster | bah |
| 01:25.27 | raster | u dont need root pw |
| 01:25.32 | raster | u just need mine! |
| 01:25.33 | raster | :) |
| 01:25.43 | Kensan | raster: exactly :) |
| 01:26.25 | Kensan | with that I shall go to sleep and my irc alter ego shall idle here :) |
| 01:27.08 | Kensan | raster: once again, thanks for the images/scripts and whatnot I hope I can come up with something in the not too distant future. |
| 01:27.11 | Kensan | good night |
| 01:29.36 | raster | ok |
| 01:29.37 | raster | nite! |
| 01:29.38 | raster | :) |
| 01:30.19 | rwhitby | morning |
| 01:30.47 | raster | da whit! |
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| 01:34.28 | ljp | does anyone build telepathy for the neo? |
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| 01:38.01 | ljp | cant seem to find it anywhere... oh well. |
| 01:58.35 | kelvie | anyone run the 2.6.26-stable branch of the OM kernel? |
| 02:08.24 | slaxxin | i check |
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| 02:09.07 | slaxxin | nope |
| 02:09.29 | kelvie | hmm.. anyone know if the suspend / sd-card partition table corruption bug is fixed for 2008.9? |
| 02:09.37 | slaxxin | is it somewhere to dl? |
| 02:09.58 | kelvie | slaxxin: you have to compile it yourself |
| 02:10.04 | slaxxin | mine hasnt corrupted yet\ |
| 02:10.11 | slaxxin | no i dl |
| 02:10.19 | slaxxin | ok |
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| 02:26.04 | Dave | Howdy ya'll |
| 02:27.20 | Dave | any jvm users here? |
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| 02:50.25 | kelvie | hmm.. I hear a faint buzz every time I touch the touchscreen on the neo |
| 02:50.29 | kelvie | .. what could cause that? |
| 02:50.33 | kelvie | and what can O di about that? |
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| 02:51.07 | kelvie | s/O di/I do/ |
| 02:54.37 | kelvie | it also makes a whining sound when I rotate the screen |
| 02:57.59 | kelvie | it seems to get louder the closer I get to the speaker |
| 03:01.26 | rooly|away | ... |
| 03:01.29 | rooly|away | you sure, kelvie? |
| 03:01.46 | rooly|away | seems odd that sound would get louder as you get closer to it's source |
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| 03:13.15 | slaxxin | can someone tell me howto close kobodelux? |
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| 03:16.33 | slaxxin | ok i got it |
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| 04:20.13 | kelvie | has the sim reading code changed for 2008.8 and 2008.9? |
| 04:20.18 | kelvie | my sim card is no longer read in 2008.9 |
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| 04:20.39 | kelvie | and is that handled by the kernel? |
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| 05:09.17 | slaxxin | cant seem to copy any music to the sdcard |
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| 06:07.42 | CIA-22 | openmoko: 03werner * r4680 10/developers/werner/neodog/ (. Makefile event.c neodog.c neodog.h pmu.c): Tough watchdog daemon. |
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| 06:20.16 | methril | morning all |
| 06:24.53 | slaxxin | nite all |
| 06:24.59 | slaxxin | lol |
| 06:25.14 | slaxxin | u must be in europe |
| 06:28.28 | raster | ma uero-homies |
| 06:28.34 | raster | euro |
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| 06:38.56 | methril | i'm in europe |
| 06:39.02 | methril | Spain |
| 06:39.38 | viq | Contrary to popular belief not all of the world lives in US :P |
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| 06:41.01 | lpotter | what?! |
| 06:41.06 | raster | word to my spanish homies! |
| 06:41.19 | raster | ola! |
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| 06:42.41 | slaxxin | 700 billion devided by 300 million = ? |
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| 06:42.57 | methril | hola |
| 06:43.31 | methril | what billion? american one or european one? |
| 06:43.37 | slaxxin | usa |
| 06:43.51 | doc|home | slaxxin: 5k per person |
| 06:44.04 | slaxxin | is that all? |
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| 06:44.42 | raster | not too bad |
| 06:44.52 | raster | i vote that us taxpayers fund said bailout |
| 06:44.53 | raster | :) |
| 06:45.41 | doc|home | slaxxin: all? probably not |
| 06:45.53 | doc|home | given estimates are about 2 trillion in reality |
| 06:46.12 | doc|home | and then you have the devaluation of the dollar on top of it, what with the US debt growing by a further 2 trillion |
| 06:46.37 | doc|home | these are the same asshats who said the Iraq invasion would cost 50 billion, it's now much closer to a trillion |
| 06:47.31 | slaxxin | rapage in america |
| 06:48.23 | ieatlint | you're math is off, it's far less than $5k |
| 06:48.34 | ieatlint | 700b / 300m is $2.333... k |
| 06:49.16 | raster | doc|home: at least those asshats arent using my $ for the bailout :) |
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| 06:49.49 | ieatlint | the issue is that the average american is also the asshat, hehe |
| 06:49.58 | doc|home | raster: well, they kinda are, it's going to devalue the dollar and the dollar is the reserve currency of the world, the dollars your country's central banks hold will be worth less, which means inflation in your country will rise |
| 06:50.17 | doc|home | the price of oil will rise, anything else priced in dollars too |
| 06:50.39 | raster | doc|home: i already stashed my $ in euros and various other currencies. i have my bets hedged outside the $USà ¤ˆ) |
| 06:50.40 | ieatlint | asshole companies set themselves up to fail by convincing ignorant americans to buy houses they couldn't afford, and/or take out equity lines on their house to use as a shopping spree |
| 06:50.42 | raster | :) |
| 06:51.04 | doc|home | raster: makes no difference, they ECB is doing currency swaps constantly to stop the euro from increasing in value too much |
| 06:51.06 | raster | and also i have my money sunk into oil companies |
| 06:51.11 | raster | if u can't beat them |
| 06:51.13 | raster | join them! |
| 06:51.14 | raster | :) |
| 06:51.14 | doc|home | all currencies are being devalued |
| 06:51.22 | ieatlint | hehe, oil is a safe investment |
| 06:51.27 | raster | a currency only devalues RELATIVE to another |
| 06:51.31 | doc|home | ieatlint: it is, and silver, gold |
| 06:51.35 | raster | otherwise ua re only discussing inflation |
| 06:51.40 | doc|home | raster: not true, its buying power can be lost |
| 06:51.41 | ieatlint | nah, silver and gold are not |
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| 06:51.49 | raster | yup |
| 06:51.50 | raster | inflation |
| 06:51.50 | ieatlint | they are high now -- and expected to go even higher |
| 06:51.51 | doc|home | raster: inflation is the increase in money supply |
| 06:51.51 | raster | :) |
| 06:52.00 | ieatlint | but they are known for rapid fluxuations |
| 06:52.13 | raster | i'm not worried |
| 06:52.14 | doc|home | raster: nope, you can have inflation in all prices in all currencies at the same time |
| 06:52.19 | raster | my money is in resources and mining |
| 06:52.22 | raster | ie resources |
| 06:52.24 | doc|home | raster: smart |
| 06:52.26 | raster | the stuff that goes up in price |
| 06:52.31 | doc|home | ieatlint: they are low now |
| 06:52.33 | ieatlint | just invest in the yuan :P |
| 06:52.38 | raster | thus.. "i dont care" |
| 06:52.47 | doc|home | $13 an ounce silver is cheaper |
| 06:52.51 | raster | i'm still sitting on a small mountain of proft |
| 06:52.51 | ieatlint | doc|home, compared to a decade ago, they're high |
| 06:52.52 | doc|home | raster: your euros? |
| 06:52.55 | raster | even after the past 12 months |
| 06:52.59 | doc|home | ieatlint: eh, not really |
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| 06:53.12 | ieatlint | a decade ago they were record lows if i recall right |
| 06:53.17 | raster | i have euros, soon to grow a small family of CHF, and $AU, |
| 06:53.25 | doc|home | ieatlint: sure, their value in dollars is lower :) |
| 06:53.33 | raster | i have some also stashed in yen and $TWD and $HKD |
| 06:53.59 | FilipLinux4 | lpotter: just received yet another Nokia/Trolltech announcement this time Qt4.4.3, any hint on when we can expect a Qtopia update ? |
| 06:54.23 | doc|home | fletch: <standard answer>when it's ready :) |
| 06:54.29 | doc|home | wants it too :/ |
| 06:55.34 | raster | crup |
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| 07:08.20 | Daramara` | <PROTECTED> |
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| 07:39.48 | l403 | hey guys. does anyone have the motorola a780. I'm looking for a way to install CoPilot maps from a linux mashine |
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| 08:18.54 | Hopscotch | good morning |
| 08:24.10 | [df] | morning! |
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| 08:48.42 | raster | muhahahahhahaha! |
| 08:48.46 | raster | laughs evilly |
| 08:48.55 | raster | my creation is almost complete! |
| 08:49.13 | _Bill_ | rasterstein? |
| 08:49.31 | raster | MUHHAHAHHA |
| 08:49.53 | *** join/#openmoko kuzgun (n=deniz@unaffiliated/kuzgun) |
| 08:50.06 | xt | raster: do elaborate (: |
| 08:50.10 | raster | waits for the thunder and lightning to punctuate his maniacal laughter |
| 08:50.21 | raster | "fixing" openembedded... |
| 08:50.25 | raster | man its got some ugly hacks... |
| 08:50.37 | _Bill_ | lol.. you also have to harvest the lightning to put life into your creation... |
| 08:51.07 | _Bill_ | but do share your genius with the world... |
| 08:51.28 | raster | ... |
| 08:51.58 | Tig| | please say it is a phone app for FSO :) |
| 08:53.08 | lpotter | is not hearing and thunder or seeing any lightning... |
| 08:53.45 | lpotter | FilipLinux4: soon! ;) |
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| 08:54.13 | mickey|tw | :D |
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| 08:56.51 | FxChiP | going down hard soon due to CPU temp probably |
| 08:58.00 | raster | xt: building my own ditro/image |
| 08:58.03 | raster | distro |
| 08:58.11 | xt | based on fso? |
| 08:58.14 | raster | i need to split out splashscreen for x from the xserver-kdrive-common stuff |
| 08:58.19 | raster | it really should be a package on its own |
| 08:58.32 | *** part/#openmoko alphabeat (n=nick@60-241-37-3.static.tpgi.com.au) |
| 08:58.51 | raster | xt: well.. i started with fso. but i've removed pretty much "fso" for performance for now |
| 08:58.57 | raster | it also makes the image much smaller |
| 08:58.58 | raster | :) |
| 08:59.17 | xt | yeh, but you plan on using the dbus-stuff in fso ? |
| 08:59.24 | raster | i have fixed up a seksie exquisite bootsplash theme |
| 08:59.34 | raster | and e/eillume theme is not done - but sexier... |
| 08:59.41 | raster | one last plash image to do... |
| 08:59.56 | xt | sounds like fun (: |
| 09:00.01 | raster | xt: yes. when frameworkd stops eating up 50% of my cpu if i drag my dinger around.. it'll go back on |
| 09:00.02 | raster | :) |
| 09:00.02 | FxChiP | whatever schmuck designed this laptop was a schmuck |
| 09:00.25 | FxChiP | as it can't seem to sustain its full 1.6 GHz without overheating unless it's hooked up to an external fan :( |
| 09:00.27 | lpotter | probably a team of them |
| 09:00.32 | *** join/#openmoko BDo (n=bdonnett@linagoraberri.pck.nerim.net) |
| 09:02.30 | FilipLinux4 | lpotter: is qtopia release waiting to get re-branded as well ? |
| 09:05.01 | Shlee | I'm going back to qtopia 4.3 |
| 09:05.14 | Shlee | Hopefully 4.4 will be out in the near future |
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| 09:06.37 | _Bill_ | raster: i got the same impression of fso last time i tried it.. slow as hell.. |
| 09:06.52 | raster | _Bill_: it will all get fixed |
| 09:06.58 | raster | right now though.. my image is fast |
| 09:07.00 | raster | boots fast |
| 09:07.01 | ceda | _Bill_: slow startup but I think it works just ok when it's up |
| 09:07.01 | raster | runs fast |
| 09:07.05 | raster | smells fast |
| 09:07.07 | raster | loosk fast |
| 09:07.09 | raster | tastest fast |
| 09:07.12 | _Bill_ | ceda: not really.. |
| 09:07.17 | _Bill_ | raster: gimmegimmegimme |
| 09:07.24 | raster | gtive me a few mins |
| 09:07.25 | Daramara` | raster: boots how fast? |
| 09:07.33 | raster | umm.,, |
| 09:08.07 | ieatlint | raster, but does it have any support for the gsm modem? |
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| 09:08.26 | raster | let me time it |
| 09:08.31 | raster | ia zero |
| 09:08.35 | raster | ieatlint: zero |
| 09:08.39 | *** part/#openmoko kPb_ (n=chatzill@123.252.210.62) |
| 09:08.41 | raster | no phone apps or infra on it at all |
| 09:08.50 | raster | its a really basic "boot to a gui" image |
| 09:08.52 | raster | with 3 apps |
| 09:08.55 | ieatlint | :) |
| 09:09.01 | _Bill_ | raster: lol... |
| 09:09.01 | raster | terminal, screenshot and alarm test app |
| 09:09.03 | ceda | logout, shutdown, suspend? |
| 09:09.26 | ieatlint | how about minicom and a tty for the modem? :P |
| 09:09.31 | raster | doesnt ven have that stuff |
| 09:09.39 | ieatlint | "come one, there's minicom and terminal app, it's functional" |
| 09:09.47 | ieatlint | err, come on ... :P |
| 09:09.54 | raster | boot time till dull orkign gui: 1:20 |
| 09:09.56 | raster | we |
| 09:09.57 | raster | full orking |
| 09:10.00 | raster | working |
| 09:10.15 | raster | this isnt itended tobe a phone imae.. yet |
| 09:10.22 | raster | just me gettign my house in order |
| 09:10.28 | xt | raster: So, booting into nothing is pretty fast? That's great news. lol |
| 09:10.29 | raster | eveything cleaned up and fixed int he basic desktop |
| 09:10.43 | raster | xt: doesnt matter how many apps would be istalled - t' boot the same |
| 09:10.48 | raster | its all about how much u RN on boot |
| 09:11.00 | raster | as such frameworkd is pretty slow right now |
| 09:11.04 | raster | grea proof of cncep |
| 09:11.06 | xt | well, stuff like gsmd/gpsd/dropbear etc all takes time to start |
| 09:11.07 | raster | concept |
| 09:11.18 | raster | great |
| 09:11.28 | raster | still have ropa |
| 09:11.41 | raster | damn freeruners fucking up my kbbbbbbbbbb |
| 09:11.54 | *** join/#openmoko zedstar (n=john@net26-100.tvu.ac.uk) |
| 09:12.15 | raster | ot dropbear tillneed mvoe hatto "post boot' sttup |
| 09:12.15 | ieatlint | gpsd isn't started on boot |
| 09:12.25 | raster | gah! |
| 09:12.40 | raster | fucking RF intrfence |
| 09:12.45 | ieatlint | and yeah, dropbear is not needed mostly... |
| 09:12.52 | ieatlint | hehe, is someone enjoying the gsm interference? |
| 09:12.55 | raster | ieatlint: not neeed? |
| 09:13.01 | raster | ieatlint: no. i think its wifi |
| 09:13.06 | raster | my kbd is wireless |
| 09:13.16 | raster | andany freerunner near my kbd screws up my yping |
| 09:13.30 | ieatlint | raster, what i mean is that you only use it under very specific circumstances (ie, plugged into a computer) |
| 09:13.50 | raster | ieatlint: oh sure |
| 09:13.52 | ieatlint | somehow, to me, it doesn't seem insane to not run it until you actually want/need to ssh into the damned thing |
| 09:13.59 | raster | its a farily stripped down base shell for me to put stuffinto |
| 09:14.08 | raster | its enough to do work/debugging and build on top of |
| 09:14.25 | raster | i need to work on cleaning up the boot a bit more |
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| 09:16.31 | raster | muhahaha! |
| 09:16.33 | raster | it works |
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| 09:22.14 | raster | http://download.enlightenment.org/misc/Illume/ |
| 09:22.19 | raster | happy flashing! |
| 09:22.38 | raster | new OS images... fresh from the oven |
| 09:22.44 | xt | 35 M |
| 09:22.45 | xt | (: |
| 09:26.06 | ieatlint | hey raster, you mind if i ask you another edje question, or do i just come off as annoying? :) |
| 09:26.29 | FilipLinux4 | raster: would this be a suitable candidate to put qtopia on top of it ? |
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| 09:27.34 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: 03daniel 07framework * r2a92992ece19 10/framework/subsystems/ogsmd/modems/abstract/mediator.py: ogsmd: Assign the features correctly |
| 09:27.35 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: 03daniel 07framework * r48f1174179c6 10/framework/subsystems/ogsmd/gsm/const.py: |
| 09:27.35 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: ogsmd: Change regex for SMS PDU header |
| 09:27.35 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: This fixes a bug where RetrieveMessage would not be able to return the |
| 09:27.37 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: SMS if the destination address or origination address is not stored as a |
| 09:27.39 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: contact on the SIM card. |
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| 09:56.37 | raster | fli qtopia on top? no. it's x11 based. |
| 09:56.41 | raster | ieatlint: ok |
| 09:56.49 | raster | xt: yeah. nice and small. "no frills" |
| 09:56.51 | raster | :) |
| 09:57.18 | xt | hm, it sucks that i cant use dfu-util to backup my image |
| 09:57.29 | xt | I want to try yours, but that means wiping my existing stuff :/ |
| 09:57.56 | xt | or can I get it to boot from SD with vfat + ext2 |
| 09:58.51 | ieatlint | ok, what is the best way to create a progress bar in an edje? ... because the only method i can manage seems to be making a rectangle, using edje_object_part_get and then resizing it in evas ... which seems to be discouraged, hehe |
| 10:00.01 | ceda | raster: is there a visual way to see if an alarm is set? |
| 10:00.21 | ceda | it'd be good to have |
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| 10:02.01 | raster | ieatlint: ummm. u can us a dargable - ans set the dragable position. |
| 10:02.16 | raster | u can als use embryo script to accept messages |
| 10:02.23 | raster | tghen interpret them and either change a dragable from script |
| 10:02.29 | raster | or modify a part with custom states |
| 10:02.42 | raster | ceda: no. |
| 10:02.52 | raster | alarm has no idea of the environment its in |
| 10:02.55 | raster | eventually - yes |
| 10:03.06 | ieatlint | can a dragable be moved by a function if it's not supposed to move on either axis? |
| 10:03.06 | raster | but that will mean i need to get done with the revamp of the desktop |
| 10:03.20 | ieatlint | because the user accidently moving it could be an issue, hehe |
| 10:03.25 | raster | ia hmm if it cant move - no |
| 10:03.29 | raster | so make it mxable in 1 axis |
| 10:03.41 | raster | oooh |
| 10:03.51 | raster | just make the dragable not accept mouse events |
| 10:03.52 | raster | :) |
| 10:04.02 | raster | see exquisite |
| 10:04.03 | ieatlint | ah.... good idea, hehe, ok, thanks |
| 10:04.08 | raster | its default theme uses a dragable |
| 10:04.10 | raster | :) |
| 10:07.14 | ceda | raster: i was thinking about the clock applet, but desktop is better |
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| 10:10.49 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07framework * r9c20a5126339 10/framework/patterns/decorator.py: readd Michele Simionato's amazing decorator module |
| 10:10.49 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07framework * r268816d759d2 10/framework/resource.py: add special decorator checking for resource availability |
| 10:10.50 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07framework * rf8f547066402 10/framework/subsystems/ogsmd/objects.py: ogsmd: add resource.checkedmethod for every exported dbus method on /org/freesmartphone/GSM/Device |
| 10:11.25 | *** join/#openmoko jserv-- (n=jserv@118-169-96-65.dynamic.hinet.net) |
| 10:12.44 | *** join/#openmoko erwin__ (n=erwin@134.89.94-79.rev.gaoland.net) |
| 10:20.14 | erwin__ | hi |
| 10:21.03 | erwin__ | I'm playing with toolchain and launching "om-conf openmoko-sample2/" i get "No package 'libmokoui2' found" |
| 10:21.36 | *** join/#openmoko playya (n=playya@p579B889B.dip.t-dialin.net) |
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| 10:22.43 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: 03daniel 07framework * r914a7e12d1c2 10/framework/subsystems/ogsmd/gsm/sms.py: (log message trimmed) |
| 10:22.43 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: ogsmd: Split the info for concatenated short messages in multiple keys |
| 10:22.43 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: There's now csm_id, csm_num and csm_seq for the id of the csm, the |
| 10:22.43 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: total number of messages for that csm and the sequence of this message. |
| 10:22.44 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: The features will only have simple types as values (no lists or maps) |
| 10:22.46 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: to make life easier especially for the C guys. |
| 10:22.48 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: WARNING: The final names for the features are not decided upon yet and |
| 10:23.48 | *** join/#openmoko Kame2 (n=manuel@port-92-196-116-4.dynamic.qsc.de) |
| 10:25.12 | ceda | allt these FSO commits are really encouraging, makes one (= me) happy |
| 10:26.16 | *** join/#openmoko alphabeat (n=nick@123-243-190-207.static.tpgi.com.au) |
| 10:26.17 | Shlee | ceda: Me too, but fully functioning FSO is afew milestones away... Impressive project |
| 10:29.12 | *** join/#openmoko giantHogweed (n=Frank@P86ee.p.pppool.de) |
| 10:29.24 | ceda | Shlee: well, it's kind of useful. I can read RSS news using GPRS on my way to work. |
| 10:29.33 | *** join/#openmoko unlotto_ (n=unlotto@ip114.rev112.brygge.net) |
| 10:29.59 | ceda | as long as minimo plays nice that works quite reliable |
| 10:30.17 | lindi- | minimo? and not midori? |
| 10:31.53 | ceda | lindi-: where do you get midori from? |
| 10:32.06 | lindi- | ceda: debian unstable |
| 10:32.30 | lindi- | minimo on the other hand does not seem to be in debian |
| 10:33.34 | *** join/#openmoko rddDavid51 (n=roudoudo@gar31-1-82-224-8-235.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 10:34.03 | *** join/#openmoko CM_work (i=893deae1@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-6f3be2631fe65a70) |
| 10:34.04 | ceda | ok |
| 10:35.04 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07framework * r97d26ee32f37 10/framework/resource.py: add specialized checked method decorator for sync dbus methods |
| 10:35.28 | *** join/#openmoko anno^da_ (n=anno^da@p5B07DF77.dip.t-dialin.net) |
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| 10:41.07 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: 03daniel 07framework * r11ec61cb763f 10/framework/subsystems/ogpsd/gpsdevice.py: |
| 10:41.07 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: ogpsd: Only run through the dbus methods if the resource is enabled |
| 10:41.07 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: This is achieved through the resource.checkedmethod decorator |
| 10:43.56 | *** join/#openmoko zedstar (n=john@net26-100.tvu.ac.uk) |
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| 11:10.55 | CIA-22 | openmoko: 03marek * r4681 10/trunk/src/host/pye17/ (6 files in 4 dirs): edje support added |
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| 11:31.41 | ceda | raster: a backspace in the normal keyboard would be useful |
| 11:32.04 | ceda | or "start over" |
| 11:32.24 | lindi- | ceda: isn't the layout just a text file? |
| 11:32.35 | ceda | because you'll never recover from typing "interface" as "irerffe" |
| 11:33.46 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: 03jluebbe 07zhone * r6bce8605cb05 10/src/zhone: remove display handling from zhone |
| 11:33.47 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: 03jluebbe 07zhone * raf1d215333c0 10/data/themes/ (zhone.edc zhone_dial.edc): switch the number label to a textblock |
| 11:34.05 | ceda | lindi-: sure, but spending too much time without knowing if it even might get concidered for inclusion ... |
| 11:36.25 | lindi- | ceda: but if you need it for yourself it should be enough? |
| 11:36.43 | ceda | yes, of course |
| 11:38.44 | *** join/#openmoko Gnutoo (n=gnutoo@host78-55-dynamic.24-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 11:40.16 | raster | ceda: slide left |
| 11:40.17 | raster | :) |
| 11:40.25 | *** join/#openmoko Gnutoo (n=gnutoo@host78-55-dynamic.24-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 11:42.42 | Shlee | Id love to see the default theme sidewards.. easily fit the full/enhanced keyboard |
| 11:43.25 | lindi- | sidewards? |
| 11:43.45 | raster | sure |
| 11:43.46 | raster | its wider |
| 11:43.53 | raster | but then u edn up with less of the screen for the app |
| 11:43.54 | raster | :) |
| 11:44.13 | Shlee | how much room does SMS need... |
| 11:44.21 | raster | its actually quite usable in portrait mode if entering "english text" |
| 11:44.31 | ieatlint | but if you can pull a level of transparency, then you don't end up with less area |
| 11:44.36 | *** join/#openmoko christooss (n=matic@BSN-95-239-87.dial-up.dsl.siol.net) |
| 11:44.41 | raster | the dictionary lookup does a good job once you've trained it a bit (used it and you have frequency info in the dict) |
| 11:45.35 | raster | ieatlint: same in portrait |
| 11:46.15 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: 03daniel 07framework * r3004eed4678d 10/framework/subsystems/ogpsd/ubx.py: ogpsd.ubx: Sanitize handling of non UBX data |
| 11:46.16 | ieatlint | yeah, but in landscape mode you could quite easily type without a stylus |
| 11:46.38 | *** join/#openmoko edistar_ (n=edistar@ip503ddd09.speed.planet.nl) |
| 11:46.40 | raster | in portrait u can do it too |
| 11:46.48 | raster | i have been doing just so myself |
| 11:46.56 | raster | walking down the street typing up whole paragraphs |
| 11:47.00 | ieatlint | make the keyboard transparent and not resize the normal screen? |
| 11:47.00 | raster | in portrait mode |
| 11:47.03 | raster | with illume keyboard |
| 11:47.11 | xt | raster: do you devel on qemu, or straight on the phone? |
| 11:47.19 | raster | xt: on x86 |
| 11:47.24 | xt | ah |
| 11:47.29 | xt | cheat |
| 11:47.37 | raster | xt: no need/point to use qemu or dev on phone |
| 11:47.44 | raster | that is onyl a final build target for oe |
| 11:47.45 | lindi- | transparent keyboard would be useful indeed |
| 11:47.49 | *** join/#openmoko behdad (n=behdad@CPE001217b19226-CM0012c9c84bc4.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 11:47.50 | raster | all dev is done natively on x86 |
| 11:48.27 | raster | developing on the phone or within qemu is just plain madness |
| 11:51.21 | raster | ieatlint: compositing not sane on FR. need better hw platform |
| 11:51.41 | lindi- | it might not need to be true transparency |
| 11:51.48 | raster | it does |
| 11:52.02 | raster | as its pointless to overlay unless u can see the updates happening underneath |
| 11:52.10 | raster | other than that - it just pollutes code with ugly hacks |
| 11:52.15 | raster | trust me |
| 11:52.19 | ieatlint | damn |
| 11:52.28 | raster | i was doing fake transparency long ebfore you guys even knew what it was |
| 11:52.41 | raster | i mostly wrote the book on it when it comes to it and x |
| 11:53.55 | lindi- | maybe it'd just help if the browser window was not resized when i popup a virtual keyboard. i could then move the keyboard so that it'd cover either the upper or lower part of the screen |
| 11:54.27 | raster | yes |
| 11:54.31 | raster | i added thgat to my todo list |
| 11:54.37 | raster | make an option for that |
| 11:57.09 | *** join/#openmoko koenigjm (n=koenigjm@206.83.89.3.ptr.us.xo.net) |
| 11:57.13 | *** join/#openmoko MnemonicPunk (n=atlantis@dslb-084-060-000-138.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 11:57.13 | ieatlint | it's depressing how many things the freerunner seems to come within grasp of doing, before beaten back by hardware deficiences :( |
| 11:57.32 | MnemonicPunk | o.o |
| 11:57.47 | raster | glamo os a 4+ year old gfx chip |
| 11:57.55 | raster | the 2442 is like 2+ years old |
| 11:58.02 | ieatlint | yeah, i know, i know |
| 11:58.06 | raster | the vga screen is possibly by far the most advanced bit of the fr |
| 11:58.13 | ieatlint | 2005 i heard for the 2442 |
| 11:58.14 | MnemonicPunk | I don't know the freerunner too well but I thought it had some nice specs, o.o |
| 11:58.23 | raster | and its definitely underpowered for driving it attempting to do "modern ui's of "today" |
| 11:58.30 | raster | sure |
| 11:58.35 | raster | ui's of 4 years ago are ok |
| 11:58.43 | koenigjm | Anyone know if there is a way to increase call volume in the qtopia dialer? |
| 11:58.55 | ieatlint | the graphics is the real issue i see |
| 11:59.09 | ieatlint | 4 year old UIs are fine on a computer |
| 11:59.36 | ieatlint | but it hurts a bit more on a mobile device, where things like such a keyboard wold be a fantastic feature |
| 12:00.03 | MnemonicPunk | Do you know PointUI for Windows Mobile? It doesn't use too mich hardware but looks nice. o.o |
| 12:01.26 | ieatlint | i happily know nothing of windows mobile |
| 12:01.37 | *** join/#openmoko kraemate (n=chatzill@125.18.17.16) |
| 12:01.50 | MnemonicPunk | Problem is that it's for Windows but it shows that even devices with not too much power can have some great UIs. |
| 12:03.15 | raster | never seen i8t |
| 12:03.16 | raster | and it all depends what your "bar" is |
| 12:03.16 | raster | my bar is apple and beyond |
| 12:03.58 | MnemonicPunk | Yes, that's why I mentioned it. ^^ It's a lot like the iPhone interface. |
| 12:04.04 | *** join/#openmoko t_s_o (n=tso@135.84-49-129.nextgentel.com) |
| 12:04.22 | MnemonicPunk | And runs pretty well even on my old Magician. |
| 12:04.23 | raster | ok |
| 12:04.25 | kraemate | have some benchmarks been run on the openmoko hardware? |
| 12:04.27 | raster | that stuff can already be done |
| 12:04.31 | raster | thats why efl exists |
| 12:04.37 | raster | thats just the kind of thing it does |
| 12:04.38 | raster | BUT |
| 12:04.45 | MnemonicPunk | efl? |
| 12:04.57 | raster | the problem is the freerunner and glamo and acceleration/abilities and limitations |
| 12:05.05 | raster | enlightenment foundation libraries |
| 12:05.09 | MnemonicPunk | Ah. |
| 12:05.27 | raster | http://www.rasterman.com/files/illume-01.ogg |
| 12:05.29 | raster | http://www.rasterman.com/files/illume-02.ogg |
| 12:05.30 | raster | http://www.rasterman.com/files/illume-03.ogg |
| 12:05.32 | raster | http://www.rasterman.com/files/illume-04.ogg |
| 12:05.54 | raster | http://www.rasterman.com/files/eem-live.avi |
| 12:05.59 | raster | i did that one years and years ago |
| 12:06.06 | raster | like 4 years ago |
| 12:06.16 | raster | http://www.rasterman.com/files/eem.avi |
| 12:06.19 | MnemonicPunk | That does look very nice, o.o |
| 12:06.23 | *** join/#openmoko evolux (n=evolux@win4077.informatik.uni-wuerzburg.de) |
| 12:07.05 | raster | http://www.rasterman.com/files/rage.avi |
| 12:07.16 | *** join/#openmoko zedstar (n=john@net26-101.tvu.ac.uk) |
| 12:07.19 | raster | http://www.rasterman.com/files/rage2.avi |
| 12:08.07 | raster | http://www.rasterman.com/files/r2.avi |
| 12:08.39 | raster | http://www.rasterman.com/files/e17_movie-00.avi |
| 12:08.42 | raster | http://www.rasterman.com/files/e17_movie-01.avi |
| 12:08.49 | raster | http://www.rasterman.com/files/e17_movie-03.avi |
| 12:08.52 | raster | http://www.rasterman.com/files/e17_movie-02.avi |
| 12:08.57 | raster | http://www.rasterman.com/files/e17_movie-04.avi |
| 12:09.05 | raster | http://www.rasterman.com/files/e17_movie-05.avi |
| 12:09.06 | raster | etc. |
| 12:09.22 | raster | already being used on the freerunner |
| 12:09.23 | raster | BUT |
| 12:09.28 | raster | the speed and effects are limited |
| 12:09.38 | raster | the vga resolution means u have to calculate 4x the # of pixels |
| 12:09.41 | raster | comapred to qvga |
| 12:09.53 | Tanuva | so we REALLY need drivers for the glamo |
| 12:10.07 | raster | the eem-live was on an ipaq 3660 (64m ram, 16m flash and 206mhz arm, qvga) |
| 12:10.10 | quickdev | do drivers solve the issue? |
| 12:10.17 | raster | tau no point. u wont get much out of it |
| 12:10.19 | raster | thats the problem |
| 12:10.22 | raster | no |
| 12:10.29 | Tanuva | damn.. |
| 12:10.32 | raster | glamo itself is missing operations to be able to do that stuff properly |
| 12:10.33 | Ainulindale | Problem is with the bus IIRC ? |
| 12:10.41 | raster | its missing ARGB destination for rendeirng |
| 12:10.48 | raster | it can onyl render TO rgb565 solid dests |
| 12:10.56 | raster | that means no itnermediate buffers cna be done with acceleration |
| 12:11.03 | MnemonicPunk | If it runs that well on such slow hardware, why can't you do more on current hardware? o.o |
| 12:11.15 | raster | the 3d is basicall ylimited to qvga and texture max size is 256x256 |
| 12:11.20 | raster | and no render to texture |
| 12:11.36 | Shlee | That's sad. |
| 12:11.40 | raster | MnemonicPunk: because per pixel the ipaq had 2xc the processing power of freerunenr |
| 12:11.42 | raster | (at least) |
| 12:11.53 | raster | and framebuffer access was immensely faster |
| 12:11.56 | quickdev | what about switching the resolution to 240 * 340? |
| 12:11.58 | raster | as it wasnt on a "gfx chip" |
| 12:12.06 | raster | quickdev: would help |
| 12:12.12 | raster | but then u just wasted the cost of the vga lcd |
| 12:12.20 | raster | also right now qvga is broken |
| 12:12.21 | raster | try it |
| 12:12.29 | raster | and u still have a slow video bus |
| 12:12.38 | raster | (compared to my ancient ipaq from 2001) |
| 12:12.57 | raster | its not worth the software effort to try work around it all |
| 12:13.01 | raster | simply wait for better hardware |
| 12:13.49 | Shlee | Looking at the wiki doesn't show too much... |
| 12:13.57 | MnemonicPunk | I have a Magician, that's like a real powerhorse for its time but today it is terribly slow. Still runs a full xfce desktop though. |
| 12:14.11 | Shlee | Has the freerunner been successful enough to work on the freerunner 2? |
| 12:14.24 | Shlee | Are they? |
| 12:14.33 | quickdev | raster, gta03 won't fix it, right? so let's wait for gta04 :) |
| 12:14.44 | ieatlint | the gta03 is in planning stages |
| 12:15.04 | ieatlint | and no one can tell if it'll fix it, although they seem to have decided to get rid of glamo |
| 12:15.08 | Shlee | I'm buying a OpenPandora tomorrow.. |
| 12:15.26 | Shlee | so I'll use the moko as a phone.. |
| 12:15.46 | ieatlint | they are switching the SoC |
| 12:15.50 | raster | Shlee: if its actually made available. |
| 12:16.07 | ieatlint | but they haven't decided which one to my knowledge |
| 12:16.08 | raster | Shlee: been waiting for a while |
| 12:16.26 | Shlee | raster: They are pre-ordering tomorrow. Date set for NOV |
| 12:16.29 | raster | i hope to get a pandora too |
| 12:16.31 | MnemonicPunk | SoC? |
| 12:16.31 | Shlee | It looks ontrack finally |
| 12:16.34 | raster | just as a dev platform with decent grunt |
| 12:16.47 | raster | Shlee: thars what they say. let's see :) |
| 12:17.00 | Shlee | Yeah, they'll get my money atleast |
| 12:17.06 | Shlee | so they get the numbers for the first 3000. |
| 12:17.15 | raster | good |
| 12:17.15 | Shlee | http://openpandora.org/ It's the DS 2.0 |
| 12:17.22 | ieatlint | MnemonicPunk, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/System-on-a-chip |
| 12:17.34 | raster | i hope oe gets a build for it asap |
| 12:17.36 | raster | it should |
| 12:17.53 | Shlee | No reason why not. |
| 12:17.54 | raster | as there is one for beagleboard already |
| 12:18.25 | Shlee | Yeah, it has the next revision TI cpu, but everything on beagle will run smoothly |
| 12:18.30 | MnemonicPunk | Thanks, ieatlint. =) |
| 12:18.47 | Shlee | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QDbLQI91510&eurl=http://openpandora.org/blog.php |
| 12:18.52 | Shlee | That makes me happy. |
| 12:19.30 | ieatlint | those are some crazy specs |
| 12:19.58 | ieatlint | it's like a smaller eeepc, but on arm and with better graphics |
| 12:20.00 | Shlee | It's effectively a net-top |
| 12:20.44 | *** join/#openmoko alephnull (n=alok@122.167.67.128) |
| 12:21.27 | MnemonicPunk | Sonic the hedgehog! <3 |
| 12:21.36 | raster | i want it for the ability to play with real opengles2.0 hw |
| 12:21.36 | raster | with real gles libs |
| 12:21.36 | raster | from what i have read it probably will run software rendering smothly enough anyway |
| 12:21.36 | raster | so that might be enough toy for now |
| 12:21.37 | raster | i've got a treo650 on tis way too |
| 12:22.37 | MnemonicPunk | How do you get the money for all that? ;p |
| 12:23.05 | raster | money for what? |
| 12:23.20 | MnemonicPunk | For like... 10 different phones. o.o |
| 12:23.44 | raster | well treo650 is only $150 or so |
| 12:23.52 | MnemonicPunk | I'm stuck with my device but I'll make the most of it. (I have a DS and a PSP for mobile gaming anyway) |
| 12:23.54 | raster | otherwise buy them |
| 12:24.01 | ieatlint | i preordered the tmobile g1, so i've no spending cash to blow for now... |
| 12:24.03 | raster | you buy them with money you earn - you work. |
| 12:24.10 | MnemonicPunk | 150$ is a lot for me. =( |
| 12:24.38 | raster | MnemonicPunk: student? |
| 12:24.43 | MnemonicPunk | That's about 110€ or something, right? |
| 12:24.49 | raster | btw |
| 12:24.51 | raster | http://download.enlightenment.org/misc/Illume/ |
| 12:25.06 | raster | if u want to ply with the illume image that has the ui those videos showed |
| 12:25.09 | MnemonicPunk | raster: Sort of. ^^ |
| 12:25.21 | raster | well once u have been workign for a decade... |
| 12:25.26 | raster | you will save money |
| 12:25.28 | raster | invest it |
| 12:25.35 | raster | make money from investments |
| 12:25.37 | Shlee | unless you live in America. |
| 12:25.38 | raster | make money from work |
| 12:25.59 | raster | money doesnt drop into yoru lap... you do something to get it |
| 12:26.00 | raster | :) |
| 12:26.10 | raster | it kind of is a self-feeding loop |
| 12:26.16 | MnemonicPunk | Can I run that image on my phone, too? |
| 12:26.26 | raster | as u earn money - u spend it on toys to port stuff to |
| 12:26.27 | raster | develop fore |
| 12:26.37 | raster | and then people pay your more money to develop for their hardware toys |
| 12:26.43 | Shlee | wishes the OM didn't have those 4 transparent buttons at the bottom. |
| 12:26.43 | raster | or their procjects as a result of you porting... |
| 12:26.44 | MnemonicPunk | Hehe. ^^ |
| 12:26.49 | raster | men if its a freerunner... |
| 12:26.56 | raster | MnemonicPunk: if it's a freerunner... |
| 12:27.01 | MnemonicPunk | And then the next step: World domination. Right? |
| 12:27.11 | *** join/#openmoko DrRabbit_ (n=tuna@ip70-176-117-108.ph.ph.cox.net) |
| 12:27.24 | MnemonicPunk | raster: No it isn't. ^^ HTC Magician. But I could run some of the earlier Openmoko images as well. |
| 12:27.40 | raster | i build it with OE |
| 12:27.46 | raster | so i guess u could build an image for yourself |
| 12:27.51 | MnemonicPunk | Hm. |
| 12:27.54 | *** join/#openmoko vaiursch (n=erwin@vpn-global-dhcp3-150.ethz.ch) |
| 12:27.55 | MnemonicPunk | Sounds reasonable. |
| 12:28.00 | ieatlint | lol |
| 12:28.03 | ieatlint | OE ... reasonable |
| 12:28.05 | ieatlint | :) |
| 12:28.06 | raster | u'd better be a pretty good hand with OE though |
| 12:28.07 | raster | :) |
| 12:28.24 | MnemonicPunk | I tried getting OE to run yesterday and failed. =( Dunno why. |
| 12:28.45 | *** join/#openmoko tjikkun (n=tjikkun@195-240-122-237.ip.telfort.nl) |
| 12:28.53 | Shlee | Anyone aware of a serious timeframe for qtopia 4.4? |
| 12:29.06 | ieatlint | funnily enough i'm unemployed |
| 12:29.11 | Shlee | so when its done. soonish? |
| 12:29.12 | MnemonicPunk | Folowed the tutorial step by step, installed the stuff but then it complained about CAHCE not being set and I had no idea what I should set it to. >_> |
| 12:29.27 | MnemonicPunk | *CACHE |
| 12:29.43 | ieatlint | a directory, if i recall right |
| 12:30.00 | MnemonicPunk | Any directory I have write access to? |
| 12:30.52 | LittleIdiot | ls |
| 12:30.58 | ieatlint | in a tmp dir might be best |
| 12:31.00 | LittleIdiot | EWRONGWINDOW, sorry ;) |
| 12:31.13 | MnemonicPunk | lol |
| 12:31.50 | *** join/#openmoko playya (n=playya@p579B889B.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 12:31.52 | MnemonicPunk | You throw exceptions when talking in the wrong window? |
| 12:32.16 | raster | ieatlint: join the club! |
| 12:33.07 | ieatlint | raster, i did, i tend to have 3 geek groups i attend each week, between programming, linux and an openmoko group |
| 12:33.23 | raster | MnemonicPunk: ... |
| 12:33.26 | raster | rm -rf ~/oe |
| 12:33.29 | *** join/#openmoko skorzen (n=skorzen@89-180-153-240.net.novis.pt) |
| 12:33.30 | raster | mkdir ~/oe |
| 12:33.33 | raster | cd ~/oe |
| 12:33.34 | ieatlint | and then developing software to put on my resume to explain a 3 year gap |
| 12:33.38 | raster | wget http://www.rasterman.com/files/install.sh |
| 12:33.45 | raster | wget http://www.rasterman.com/files/local.conf |
| 12:33.53 | raster | sh ./install.sh |
| 12:34.03 | raster | --- |
| 12:34.05 | raster | done |
| 12:34.16 | MnemonicPunk | raster: Heh. Okay, I'll do that. =) |
| 12:34.28 | raster | ieatlint: if u are unemployed.. u must be so productive |
| 12:34.32 | raster | have so much time to do useful shit |
| 12:34.52 | ieatlint | well, i do have beer |
| 12:35.50 | ieatlint | anyway, for related reasons to a 3 year gap on my resume i'm surviving |
| 12:36.44 | *** join/#openmoko surf2me (n=surfer@unixboard/users/surf2me) |
| 12:37.15 | *** join/#openmoko apol (n=apol@xsftbnupc02.upc.es) |
| 12:37.16 | MnemonicPunk | Mind the gap or something? |
| 12:38.41 | MnemonicPunk | Being unemployed in Germany isn't that bad though, I noticed. Not really comfortable but you can make do without problems. |
| 12:39.00 | *** join/#openmoko dns53 (n=dns@ppp246-215.static.internode.on.net) |
| 12:39.13 | ieatlint | so i hear... |
| 12:40.03 | *** join/#openmoko tomboy64 (n=tomboy64@e178045151.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 12:40.24 | raster | i like being unemployed |
| 12:41.00 | ieatlint | well, i'm too young to retire and my money won't last forever |
| 12:41.44 | *** join/#openmoko unlotto (n=unlotto@ip114.rev112.brygge.net) |
| 12:41.46 | quickdev | ieatlint, how old are you? :) |
| 12:41.47 | MnemonicPunk | I'm not yet unemployed (okay, I was, for about 2 years but that's a different story) but considering the job situation here I will be as soon as I finish school. (Well. kind of a school. xD) |
| 12:42.29 | ieatlint | 15 |
| 12:42.46 | MnemonicPunk | 15? o.O You serious? |
| 12:43.03 | ieatlint | no, but i was curious if someone was going to bring up the beer |
| 12:43.11 | quickdev | ieatlint, just wanted to quote you :) |
| 12:43.24 | ieatlint | i'm 24 |
| 12:43.32 | MnemonicPunk | Heh, older than I am. ;p |
| 12:46.34 | *** join/#openmoko Flyser (n=flyser@dialin-212-144-072-099.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 12:46.37 | raster | you whipper snappers |
| 12:46.41 | raster | youn'uns |
| 12:47.08 | *** join/#openmoko christooss1 (n=matic@BSN-95-239-87.dial-up.dsl.siol.net) |
| 12:47.37 | kraemate | _phones_ back in my day we didnt have phones |
| 12:47.40 | *** join/#openmoko surf2me (n=surfer@unixboard/users/surf2me) |
| 12:48.35 | ieatlint | heh, i'm old enough to have gone through school without mobile phones, and remember when pagers were all the rage |
| 12:48.41 | MnemonicPunk | lol |
| 12:48.45 | MnemonicPunk | Yeh. |
| 12:48.53 | MnemonicPunk | Although. |
| 12:48.57 | ieatlint | and days before the internet :P |
| 12:49.04 | raster | back in my day we'd communicate by throwing dinosaur bones at eachother and depending what part of the body you broke indicated the message. |
| 12:49.19 | MnemonicPunk | Not quite, phones were kinda "in" in the later grades. |
| 12:49.20 | MnemonicPunk | o.o |
| 12:49.25 | MnemonicPunk | In mine, that is. |
| 12:49.32 | ieatlint | damn, that must've been a real trick... were there even dinosaurs in aussieland? |
| 12:49.39 | raster | not a single person at my school had a hpone |
| 12:49.40 | raster | or pager |
| 12:49.44 | MnemonicPunk | I'm 22 and still wondering about ieatlints real age. xD |
| 12:49.49 | raster | hell no one at university had one |
| 12:50.04 | raster | didnt get a mobile phone until i was well into being a working slave |
| 12:50.05 | ieatlint | MnemonicPunk, i'm 24... |
| 12:50.10 | raster | and that was... analogue! |
| 12:50.13 | ieatlint | how old do you think i am? |
| 12:50.21 | raster | 7 |
| 12:50.22 | MnemonicPunk | ieatlint: Alright, maybe then it was just different where you live. |
| 12:50.39 | ieatlint | MnemonicPunk, where are you? |
| 12:50.45 | MnemonicPunk | I know we had that "tech hipster" in class. Always had the newest stuff with him. |
| 12:51.06 | MnemonicPunk | I don't have to mention he bought a Mac later on, do I? ;) |
| 12:51.11 | MnemonicPunk | Germany. |
| 12:51.12 | MnemonicPunk | NRW |
| 12:51.22 | ieatlint | which part? |
| 12:51.24 | kraemate | i need some advice: is the freerunner a good buy if i want it mainly as a 'ultra-mobilei' linux box? |
| 12:51.26 | ieatlint | of nrw |
| 12:51.27 | dns53 | we have some of the oldest dinosaur fossils in australia |
| 12:51.32 | raster | young whipper snappers. |
| 12:51.46 | MnemonicPunk | Bochum, between Dusseldorf and Dortmund. ^^ |
| 12:52.02 | raster | goes back to throwing dinosaur bones at his freerunner to see if it answers |
| 12:52.05 | kraemate | back in my day we didnt have the term whipper snappers |
| 12:52.07 | ieatlint | anyway, i finished high school in 2000, and mobile phones were around, but not in the hands of students |
| 12:52.37 | ieatlint | raster might be old enough to be one of those original prisoners shipped over by them pommies |
| 12:52.42 | MnemonicPunk | raster: "IO Error: Unexpected bone format" |
| 12:52.57 | ieatlint | MnemonicPunk, altbier or kölsch? :) |
| 12:53.01 | raster | ieatlint: actually no. my heritage is german/finnish |
| 12:53.11 | raster | my ancestors actually were robber knights thoughy |
| 12:53.26 | kraemate | rofl |
| 12:53.28 | MnemonicPunk | ieatlint: If I have to drink any of those two, it's alt. ^^ Prefer pils though. |
| 12:53.41 | Kensan | Good afternoon |
| 12:53.44 | ieatlint | nice... i'm of irish descent, so i presume my ancestors to be drunks |
| 12:53.49 | raster | in süd tirol |
| 12:54.00 | raster | which technically is italy these days... |
| 12:54.03 | ieatlint | MnemonicPunk, alt... good choice ;) |
| 12:54.13 | torpor | yo |
| 12:54.29 | MnemonicPunk | ieatlint: Where are you from? |
| 12:54.42 | ieatlint | california |
| 12:54.49 | ieatlint | near san francisco originally, currently in sf |
| 12:54.55 | MnemonicPunk | How do you type ö then? o.o |
| 12:55.10 | Kensan | MnemonicPunk: he knows how to copy+paste ;) |
| 12:55.10 | MnemonicPunk | Know the ASCII by heart or something? xD |
| 12:55.27 | ieatlint | ich habe ein bisschen deutsch gelernt... |
| 12:55.37 | MnemonicPunk | I see. ^^ |
| 12:55.42 | ieatlint | and in traveling to germany, i was introduced to the german keyboard layout |
| 12:55.56 | ieatlint | and somehow i prefer its layout for non-letter chars |
| 12:56.05 | ieatlint | so i use a german keyboard layout |
| 12:56.10 | MnemonicPunk | lol |
| 12:56.16 | torpor | so whats the best thing to run on my freerunner today? |
| 12:56.33 | ieatlint | it also lets me type spanish chars for the local stuff... el niño... i'm so cool |
| 12:56.34 | Kensan | raster: I flashed your image, it looks great! And it actually boots faster than all others without doing any optimisations. |
| 12:56.58 | raster | Kensan: welcome to super-raster-happy-fun-times :) |
| 12:57.09 | ieatlint | plus it does help when i try to type in german, hehe |
| 12:57.11 | raster | and i havent even tried to make it faster.... yet |
| 12:57.12 | raster | :) |
| 12:57.21 | MnemonicPunk | raster, you may officially call me stupid. xD I installed oe with your script but have no idea how to go on from there. |
| 12:57.27 | Kensan | raster: hehe, makes me wonder... |
| 12:57.50 | raster | men did u see the bit where it prints out what to do? |
| 12:57.56 | raster | at the end |
| 12:57.57 | *** join/#openmoko cekay (n=christia@gate.tarent.de) |
| 12:57.59 | raster | like lots of echo's |
| 12:58.01 | MnemonicPunk | Yes. |
| 12:58.07 | dns53 | raster how different is your image to 2008.9? |
| 12:58.17 | raster | did u follow any of the hints? |
| 12:58.21 | raster | dns53: totally |
| 12:58.29 | raster | dns53: for one. it has no phone apps :) |
| 12:58.41 | ieatlint | and i have friends in ratingen, so i've been well introduced to the alt vs kölsch fight (theformer being my preference) |
| 12:58.43 | MnemonicPunk | It starts with the "source ./setup-env" part. o.o |
| 12:59.14 | MnemonicPunk | ieatlint: Kölsch is like water anyway (and I can say that without being biased since I don't live in either city) |
| 12:59.15 | Gnutoo | i've a quick question: does SHR implement : calls,sms,missed-cals? |
| 12:59.29 | torpor | hey, raster released an image? anyon wanna share the url with me? i wanna try it too .. |
| 12:59.39 | raster | hehehe |
| 12:59.41 | ieatlint | both are very hard to find here... alt is essentially impossible... :( |
| 12:59.47 | raster | waits for the rumor mill to do its job |
| 12:59.55 | ieatlint | kölsch can be found in a handful of places (local brew), but meh |
| 12:59.56 | raster | Kensan: btw - i released an update... with a nicer bootsplash |
| 12:59.56 | Kensan | raster: I dug out a ticket in the olpc bugzilla about speeding up boot. Has one or two ideas we could borrow. |
| 13:00.03 | raster | :) |
| 13:00.05 | torpor | what rumour mill raster? |
| 13:00.06 | torpor | tries to play catchup |
| 13:00.19 | MnemonicPunk | In Köln they have a little shop called "Beer Museum", it's actually no real museum but they have shitloads of beer from all over the world. |
| 13:00.20 | torpor | booting linux in 5 secondds: http://lwn.net/SubscriberLink/299483/fa0208e48cf3eeac/ |
| 13:00.27 | raster | Kensan: i've been in the "make booting fast" boat before. ;. as i said. 1.6 seconds. did that for toshiba on a contract. |
| 13:00.39 | Kensan | hints at the presence of the raster-uber-image somewhere in the depths of the intarwebz |
| 13:00.43 | raster | torpor: lame. 1.6. |
| 13:00.43 | Kensan | ;) |
| 13:00.49 | raster | beat that |
| 13:00.52 | raster | and i'll listen |
| 13:00.55 | ieatlint | MnemonicPunk, if they have a tap that says budweiser but just pours water, i'll change my entire vew of köln |
| 13:01.01 | torpor | ok |
| 13:01.11 | torpor | damnit i just want something cool to run on my freerunner. |
| 13:01.13 | torpor | please share. |
| 13:01.25 | [df] | suggests debian |
| 13:01.33 | MnemonicPunk | ieatlint: Budweiser is the american equivalent to Kölsch, isn't it? xD |
| 13:01.36 | [df] | then run whatever you like |
| 13:01.37 | ieatlint | until such a day, my views are formed by my biased friends ;) |
| 13:01.42 | raster | http://download.enlightenment.org/misc/Illume/ |
| 13:01.49 | Kensan | raster: yes, and I am still convinced, as I was this morning, that you simply made that statement at that specific point in time to make me look like a goof-ball in the future ;) |
| 13:01.49 | ieatlint | no, kölsch is far better |
| 13:02.05 | raster | Kensan: hahahahah! |
| 13:02.13 | MnemonicPunk | Far... better...? o.o Poor americans. |
| 13:02.28 | ieatlint | hardly, i don't drink either |
| 13:02.43 | ieatlint | california has a very healthy selection of awesome local breweries |
| 13:02.46 | torpor | mm.. whats with the .summary file extentions? can i just burn this like a normal .jffs2 or something |
| 13:03.00 | raster | torpor: jffs2 WITH summary info for faster mount by kernel |
| 13:03.06 | Kensan | raster: when did you upload the new image? I downloaded and flashed the image about 3 hours ago... |
| 13:03.13 | MnemonicPunk | ieatlint: Ever tried Fiege? |
| 13:03.15 | raster | Kensan: an hour or 2 ago |
| 13:03.21 | ieatlint | nope |
| 13:03.29 | MnemonicPunk | It's TEH BEER. xD |
| 13:03.30 | torpor | so i can just burn this and roll then, eh? |
| 13:03.31 | Kensan | fires up dfu-util |
| 13:03.34 | torpor | goes off to do it |
| 13:03.53 | raster | actually |
| 13:03.55 | raster | longer |
| 13:03.59 | ieatlint | i'm generally not a pilsener fan |
| 13:04.03 | MnemonicPunk | Okay, actually it's probably not THAT good. But they make it right here and it simply is my favourite. |
| 13:04.06 | raster | 3.5hrs ago |
| 13:04.15 | ieatlint | ales and darker lagers are my thing |
| 13:04.41 | torpor | mmm .. openpandora goes on sale today! w00t for new toys! |
| 13:04.49 | MnemonicPunk | Irish ancestors shining through there? ;P |
| 13:04.51 | Kensan | raster: is there a changelog of your "official" image? |
| 13:04.58 | Kensan | tries to spread rumours about Rasters image... |
| 13:05.07 | raster | Kensan: nup. |
| 13:05.11 | ieatlint | personal preferences :) |
| 13:05.13 | raster | i'm lazy |
| 13:05.24 | raster | but i am maintaining a git patchset against upsteram OE git |
| 13:05.29 | raster | i havent published it |
| 13:05.32 | raster | but i can... |
| 13:05.36 | Kensan | raster: heh, I would dispute that. |
| 13:05.50 | Kensan | raster: no worries. I was just wondering what I was potentially missing ;) |
| 13:05.58 | raster | dunnop |
| 13:06.02 | raster | is the bootsplash black? |
| 13:06.04 | raster | or white bg? |
| 13:06.12 | Kensan | raster: yes, the E-splash so to speak |
| 13:06.24 | raster | well there are 2 splashes |
| 13:06.29 | *** join/#openmoko alphabeat (n=nick@123-243-190-207.static.tpgi.com.au) |
| 13:06.35 | raster | 1. expedite (bootsplash) |
| 13:06.42 | raster | 2. e's init splash (thats once x is up) |
| 13:07.41 | Kensan | raster: expedite is the E logo b&w with the white progress bar and "glossy surface" reflections. |
| 13:08.21 | Kensan | raster: and e's init splash is the b&w lamp. |
| 13:08.24 | Kensan | raster: correct? |
| 13:08.55 | raster | correct |
| 13:09.00 | raster | then u have my updated image |
| 13:09.29 | toggles_w | raster: where is it located? |
| 13:09.38 | Kensan | raster: ok cool. |
| 13:09.43 | raster | http://download.enlightenment.org/misc/Illume/ |
| 13:09.48 | Kensan | toggles_w: 15:01 < raster> http://download.enlightenment.org/misc/Illume/ |
| 13:09.56 | toggles_w | <PROTECTED> |
| 13:10.04 | toggles_w | Kensan: same goes ;-) |
| 13:10.22 | raster | Kensan: i am pretty sure it can be definitely improved boot-speed-wise |
| 13:10.31 | Kensan | toggles_w: I am just quoting, no work here. |
| 13:10.55 | raster | X could move to S22 |
| 13:11.02 | Kensan | raster: I have to put bootsplash on it first and see what's holding things up. |
| 13:11.12 | raster | dropbear to S60 |
| 13:11.15 | raster | just for starters |
| 13:11.17 | raster | simple changes |
| 13:11.49 | *** join/#openmoko playya (n=playya@p579B889B.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 13:12.06 | Kensan | raster: I wonder how much one could get from disabling the printks/console output... Not much I guess but probably more than expected. |
| 13:12.26 | raster | Kensan: i already tell uboot to put my console to serial, not screen |
| 13:12.32 | raster | so i get almost no kernel printk's |
| 13:12.35 | raster | in fact none |
| 13:12.47 | raster | i get a little bit of text between exqusitie and x |
| 13:12.54 | raster | like with anstrom banner |
| 13:12.56 | Kensan | raster: ah k. Yeah saw that. |
| 13:13.03 | raster | i should hunt donw that crap and remove it |
| 13:13.10 | raster | but for now - that doesnt bother me |
| 13:14.37 | Kensan | raster: it would be cool to have the expedite screeny as u-boots "bootsplash". |
| 13:15.04 | Kensan | raster: there's some error messages printed out before e's init splash |
| 13:15.07 | *** join/#openmoko lsobral (n=sobral@200.184.118.132) |
| 13:16.14 | raster | Kensan: yeah. technically tho... if we really wanted to - we COULD get x up before even dbus |
| 13:16.18 | *** join/#openmoko krau (n=cktakaha@189.70.4.78) |
| 13:16.40 | raster | launch pretty much everything in the bg |
| 13:16.45 | raster | exquisite also runs in x |
| 13:16.46 | raster | :) |
| 13:16.54 | raster | then u wont get the changeover |
| 13:17.08 | raster | exquisite could run and e could seamlessly take over |
| 13:17.09 | MnemonicPunk | raster, there is no setup-env in there. o.o What am I doiing wrong? =( |
| 13:17.10 | Kensan | raster: hm ok... thinking a bit radically: X first and the rest is loaded in bg according to "priority". |
| 13:17.40 | Kensan | raster: ok, same line of thought here :) |
| 13:17.51 | raster | MnemonicPunk: ooh. u need my setup-env too |
| 13:17.58 | Kensan | raster: what do you need for X to come up? |
| 13:18.00 | MnemonicPunk | Heh. ^^ |
| 13:18.08 | Kensan | raster: as a minimum that is. |
| 13:18.20 | raster | MnemonicPunk: http://www.rasterman.com/files/setup-env |
| 13:18.44 | raster | Kensan: i think just device nodes |
| 13:18.45 | raster | thats it |
| 13:18.58 | Kensan | raster: ok, and they could be done statically |
| 13:19.02 | Kensan | raster: so no udev etc. |
| 13:19.10 | raster | mdev can do udev's job |
| 13:19.12 | raster | but much faster |
| 13:19.17 | raster | should look at mdev |
| 13:19.31 | raster | x could move to S01 |
| 13:19.42 | raster | the problem is E requires dbus to be up first |
| 13:19.43 | Kensan | raster: the olpc guys had the idea to simply gzip up the dev nodes and simply unpack them on boot |
| 13:19.45 | raster | BUT |
| 13:20.10 | raster | u will neecx a way to start X separately to the x session |
| 13:20.23 | raster | Kensan: look at mdev |
| 13:20.34 | Kensan | raster: ok will check it out. |
| 13:20.51 | raster | but there is a lot of time spent before S10.. etc init scritps run |
| 13:20.55 | raster | in rc/rcS |
| 13:21.38 | *** join/#openmoko larry_jr (n=Larry@200.184.118.132) |
| 13:22.00 | *** join/#openmoko evolux (n=evolux@win4077.informatik.uni-wuerzburg.de) |
| 13:22.40 | *** join/#openmoko jones (i=jones@svalbard.freeshell.org) |
| 13:22.52 | Kensan | raster: mdev still create device nodes dynamically on boot which could be avoided. Though I do not know if doing it the other way would actually be leaner. |
| 13:23.04 | jones | bye bye student loan :( |
| 13:23.09 | jones | hello openmoko :D |
| 13:26.01 | MnemonicPunk | Alright... now it says "/proc/sys/vm/mmap_min_addr is not 0. This will cause problems with qemu so please fix the value (as root)." What can I do against that? |
| 13:26.14 | Kensan | MnemonicPunk: read the wiki |
| 13:26.36 | MnemonicPunk | Mkay. ^^ |
| 13:26.58 | Kensan | MnemonicPunk: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/MokoMakefile#Build_issues |
| 13:27.19 | MnemonicPunk | Thanks a lot. =) |
| 13:28.09 | MnemonicPunk | It seems to work! Booya! ^-^ |
| 13:28.54 | raster | Kensan: xora has tried mdev and it saves about 10 seconds of boot |
| 13:30.15 | Kensan | raster: ah ic. I like the sound of that. How about a "linuxrc" kind of approach: replacing init with a custom binary which sets up the device nodes and starts x. The rest is done/loaded as-needed by some other daemon/app |
| 13:30.38 | raster | Kensan: good for a system u never want to install anything on or ever change the boot of |
| 13:31.06 | Kensan | raster: hm yeah. That would be a dead end... |
| 13:31.21 | Kensan | raster: specific per device or "distro" even... |
| 13:31.22 | raster | can work for custom products |
| 13:31.24 | Kensan | no fun. |
| 13:31.26 | raster | eg an mp3 player |
| 13:31.28 | raster | never will change |
| 13:31.31 | raster | or a set top obx |
| 13:31.40 | raster | does only what it was built to |
| 13:31.46 | raster | is not extendible etc. |
| 13:32.02 | MnemonicPunk | If I issue "bitbake gpe-image", will it make a gpe image for my Magician? o.o |
| 13:32.12 | raster | yes |
| 13:32.17 | MnemonicPunk | That rocks. o.o |
| 13:32.23 | raster | if u set up local.conf to have the right machine |
| 13:32.29 | MnemonicPunk | I did. =) |
| 13:33.42 | MnemonicPunk | I told it to build nano to see if it works and so far it does it's stuff without errors. |
| 13:34.01 | MnemonicPunk | Should I get the psyco jit as well? |
| 13:35.41 | raster | shivers |
| 13:35.46 | raster | ewww... java |
| 13:36.59 | MnemonicPunk | I'll take that as a no. o.O |
| 13:39.27 | MnemonicPunk | Ew. The german translation of that Wiki page sucks. o.o |
| 13:40.32 | *** join/#openmoko vivijim (n=vivijim@unaffiliated/vivijim) |
| 13:41.22 | Wonka | not unusual |
| 13:42.59 | raster | sucks |
| 13:43.09 | raster | but in the end... you end up having to read the english ones |
| 13:43.10 | raster | :( |
| 13:43.55 | MnemonicPunk | I actually prefer the english version in this case. xD |
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| 13:46.25 | Dave | raster! |
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| 13:46.36 | raster | boop! |
| 13:47.01 | MnemonicPunk | Do later builds take less time than the initial one? |
| 13:47.15 | Dave | :) |
| 13:47.24 | Dave | heh |
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| 13:48.50 | raster | MnemonicPunk: yes |
| 13:49.15 | MnemonicPunk | Meh... got a dentist appointment in 15 minutes. >_< But maybe it will be done when I'm back. xD |
| 13:50.25 | Shlee | ok I give up - Anyone feel like making a tool to tweak the .state's.. I tried and failed |
| 13:50.30 | *** join/#openmoko skorzen (n=skorzen@89-180-10-18.net.novis.pt) |
| 13:51.53 | Kensan | raster: Is there a sane way to change/remove/add kernel params in uboot? Always adding/removing menu_? lines is a bit tedious |
| 13:52.23 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: 03jluebbe 07framework * r703cb77ce191 10/framework/subsystems/ogsmd/modems/abstract/modem.py: ogsmd: allow ogsmd to be reenabled |
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| 13:56.11 | Dave | Hmm |
| 13:56.17 | Dave | Oh, any jvm users here? |
| 13:56.57 | Dave | Furthermore does SSL work in java? |
| 13:57.17 | xt | Does generic questions shit in the woods? |
| 13:58.02 | Dave | -_- |
| 13:58.05 | MnemonicPunk | Alright, gotta go. =) Read ya later- |
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| 13:58.26 | Dave | Bye MnemonicPunk, thanks for coming! |
| 13:58.35 | raster | Kensan: hmm not really. |
| 13:58.48 | raster | Kensan: uboot really is n ot intended to be a good interactive tool |
| 13:59.01 | raster | inf act the fact it has any kind of "ui" is far eboynd what it should be |
| 13:59.14 | *** join/#openmoko Torikun (n=rusher@gateway.penguincomputing.com) |
| 13:59.15 | xt | should have grub :/ |
| 13:59.25 | Dave | Torikun! |
| 13:59.26 | raster | at worst is should be an emergency reflash mechanism and way to intercept normal boot and play with kernel params over a serial line |
| 13:59.28 | raster | nothng else |
| 13:59.56 | Dave | what, bootloader? |
| 14:02.09 | Torikun | Dave! |
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| 14:11.12 | toggles_w | Kensan: can you make a call on the new raster image? it's pretty but no phone? |
| 14:11.27 | Kensan | toggles_w: as raster said: it is completely missing any phone apps |
| 14:11.41 | Kensan | toggles_w: it's just a devel image he made for himself. |
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| 14:14.08 | toggles_w | Kensan: damn, thanks, i missed that |
| 14:14.34 | toggles_w | it's bloody gorgeous, i just wish zhone was available, evenif through opkg |
| 14:14.41 | toggles_w | Kensan: thanks |
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| 14:18.05 | Kensan | toggles_w: well it's based on OE so you can install all the other apps |
| 14:18.13 | Kensan | toggles_w: but you would need to install all the FSO daemons etc |
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| 14:47.27 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: 03jluebbe 07framework * rd56757001bfe 10/framework/subsystems/ousaged/generic.py: ousaged: be explicit about resource availability |
| 14:47.40 | *** join/#openmoko TimRiker (n=timr@72-62-19-159.area2.spcsdns.net) |
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| 14:57.15 | CIA-22 | openmoko: 03tick 07org.openmoko.dev * r7713c9e3c3cc 10/packages/packagekit/ (6 files in 2 dirs): [packagekit] modify summary field to support alias Tags. |
| 14:57.16 | CIA-22 | openmoko: 03tick 07org.openmoko.dev * rb36265cb0a71 10/conf/distro/include/sane-srcrevs.inc: [assassin] Bump up assassin to version 257. |
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| 15:01.01 | tsuchan | hi guys, anyone experienced this after flashing? jffs2_scan_eraseblock(): Magic bitmask 0x1985 not found at 0x0.... |
| 15:01.31 | *** join/#openmoko chomwitt (n=chomwitt@adsl62-80.ath.forthnet.gr) |
| 15:01.37 | tsuchan | i've tried to flash FDOM and it shows up during boot |
| 15:01.52 | *** join/#openmoko Sup3rkiddo (n=sudharsh@unaffiliated/sudharsh) |
| 15:01.55 | Dave | hmm |
| 15:01.56 | *** join/#openmoko max_posedon (n=max_pose@212.98.171.13) |
| 15:01.58 | *** join/#openmoko tombhadAC (n=tombhad@pD95DF439.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 15:02.03 | Dave | Oh great, I have to backup again |
| 15:02.59 | tsuchan | the worst thing is it happens after flashing asu again... |
| 15:03.14 | Dave | eyes OH |
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| 15:06.59 | Shlee | tsuchan: check MD5 |
| 15:07.16 | Shlee | if your on windows, search for tabhash |
| 15:07.19 | Shlee | it's awesome |
| 15:07.32 | Dave | things on windows are awesome? |
| 15:07.44 | *** join/#openmoko ccube_ (n=ccube@ssh.ccube.de) |
| 15:07.45 | Dave | when did this start? :P |
| 15:07.47 | tsuchan | Shlee: i've already done that, it's ok... |
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| 15:12.03 | tsuchan | ok, i think i've done something stupid |
| 15:12.26 | tsuchan | flashed neo without uncompressing images :-P |
| 15:13.53 | hama | :) |
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| 15:16.10 | *** part/#openmoko Torikun (n=rusher@gateway.penguincomputing.com) |
| 15:16.10 | *** join/#openmoko dolf1074 (n=chatzill@78-20-186-137.access.telenet.be) |
| 15:17.33 | MnemonicPunk | And back. >_> |
| 15:17.39 | *** join/#openmoko retracile (n=eli@76-204-213-211.lightspeed.allntx.sbcglobal.net) |
| 15:18.01 | Dave | heh |
| 15:18.03 | Dave | So soon? :P |
| 15:18.07 | Dave | retracile :) |
| 15:18.21 | retracile | Dave! |
| 15:18.42 | MnemonicPunk | Yeh, dentist is just around the corner for me. |
| 15:19.07 | Dave | that was quick :P |
| 15:19.25 | MnemonicPunk | Too bad, I was hoping I'd be gone for long enough for the initial build to finish. xD |
| 15:19.25 | *** join/#openmoko emacsian (n=ram@122.166.89.168) |
| 15:19.41 | *** join/#openmoko behdad (n=behdad@nat/redhat/x-1ce17c64a34a07c0) |
| 15:19.42 | Dave | :P |
| 15:19.52 | MnemonicPunk | Guess I'll just have to play Sonic Chronicles for a while then. =) |
| 15:19.58 | Dave | hah! |
| 15:20.08 | Dave | hmm... pandora... |
| 15:20.35 | MnemonicPunk | Anyone know how much of the build is completeted when it is at the "generating locales" stage? |
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| 15:21.38 | balrog-k1n | sounds like glibc which would be near the beginning, but i've never made a build myself |
| 15:22.09 | MnemonicPunk | The wiki page had an estimate of about 5 hours for my pc. |
| 15:22.12 | MnemonicPunk | >_> |
| 15:22.39 | Dave | zomg glibc |
| 15:22.48 | Dave | balrogkun, I've had nothing but trouble in that department :P |
| 15:23.44 | balrog-k1n | Dave: did you also play Sonic Chronicles in the meantime? |
| 15:23.49 | MnemonicPunk | lol |
| 15:24.04 | balrog-k1n | the wiki said something about it being incompatible with OE ;) |
| 15:24.08 | *** join/#openmoko cnwdup_ (n=harlekin@hnvr-4dbd7057.pool.einsundeins.de) |
| 15:24.50 | toggles_w | MnemonicPunk: what ar you building? |
| 15:25.06 | *** join/#openmoko tsdogs (n=tsdogs@net70-17.metalit.net) |
| 15:25.21 | MnemonicPunk | Actually I told it to build nano because most pages say that was a good way to test if it works. |
| 15:25.49 | Dave | balrogkun :P |
| 15:25.53 | MnemonicPunk | (In case that was a stupid idea, please tell me now. xD) |
| 15:26.00 | Dave | balrogkun, I've played mega collection :P |
| 15:26.08 | MnemonicPunk | On PSP? |
| 15:26.12 | Dave | Nope |
| 15:26.22 | balrog-k1n | nano probably doesn't require much more than glibc and curses.. |
| 15:26.33 | Dave | nano? |
| 15:26.46 | toggles_w | Dave: editor |
| 15:26.52 | Dave | ah :) |
| 15:26.56 | Dave | That nano :P |
| 15:27.04 | Dave | trying to get it working on the freerunner? :P |
| 15:27.16 | MnemonicPunk | But it can reuse the stuff it generated when building nano, right? o.o |
| 15:27.21 | toggles_w | i've been fighting with the fso make for 2 weeks now, i can't get an image with their makefile |
| 15:27.38 | toggles_w | MnemonicPunk: yeah |
| 15:28.11 | *** join/#openmoko weatherhead (n=danw_ups@cpc1-midd4-0-0-cust43.midd.cable.ntl.com) |
| 15:28.12 | balrog-k1n | Dave: what were you thinking about.. perv |
| 15:28.20 | Dave | What!? |
| 15:28.31 | Dave | haha |
| 15:28.33 | Dave | weak :P |
| 15:28.47 | Dave | slaps balrogkun around with a freerunner |
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| 15:28.58 | *** join/#openmoko Ghiottone (n=ale@213.158.72.21) |
| 15:29.33 | MnemonicPunk | I don't think the freerunner is massive enough to do serious damage. xD |
| 15:29.48 | *** join/#openmoko vallor (i=scott@pdpc/supporter/monthlygold/vallor) |
| 15:29.49 | Dave | oh yeah? |
| 15:29.53 | Dave | Check out the new CSI :P |
| 15:30.01 | Dave | oh man, wouldn't that be great? |
| 15:30.03 | MnemonicPunk | You can try to control your touchscreen by slapping it on his nose correctly, though. |
| 15:30.24 | Dave | Freerunner featured on CSI,... hooray for PR! but oh, wait, it was the murder weapon? |
| 15:30.43 | Dave | MnemonicPunk, let's just put it this way, I have a significant number of them to inflict serious injury :) |
| 15:30.49 | MnemonicPunk | It is done. o.o |
| 15:30.51 | Dave | Death by Freerunner stoning! |
| 15:31.03 | sicu | <PROTECTED> |
| 15:31.03 | MnemonicPunk | Dave: You got more than one? o.o |
| 15:31.19 | Dave | high-fives sicu |
| 15:31.21 | *** join/#openmoko christooss (n=matic@BSN-95-213-45.dial-up.dsl.siol.net) |
| 15:31.25 | Dave | sicu ME |
| 15:31.26 | Dave | :P |
| 15:31.35 | sicu | ^^ |
| 15:31.36 | MnemonicPunk | I mean... it's possible to brick a freerunner I guess but an actual brick would be way more effective. |
| 15:32.12 | Dave | :D |
| 15:32.22 | Dave | but would break more easily, methinks. |
| 15:32.59 | *** join/#openmoko retracile (n=eli@76-204-213-211.lightspeed.allntx.sbcglobal.net) |
| 15:33.03 | *** join/#openmoko fale_ (n=fale@89-96-108-175.ip12.fastwebnet.it) |
| 15:33.04 | MnemonicPunk | And you can't upload your "point of view slapping action" to youtube afterwards. |
| 15:33.35 | sicu | it's the green way of freerunner stoning by reusing just the one device ... greenpeace would be proud |
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| 15:37.54 | Dave | :D |
| 15:37.58 | Dave | Hooray! |
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| 15:55.47 | Dave | craps |
| 15:56.06 | Dave | I could use some input on the following. http://rafb.net/p/9kLvgs83.html |
| 15:56.09 | MnemonicPunk | In the middle of the channel? Don't! |
| 15:56.22 | Dave | :D |
| 15:56.41 | Dave | sics a two-tailed fox on mneumonicpunk |
| 15:56.53 | [df] | er, I guess /usr/lib/security/cacerts |
| 15:56.57 | [df] | ... doesn't exist |
| 15:57.00 | Dave | haha man, a rabid tails would be vicious! |
| 15:57.10 | Dave | df, I guess not :\ |
| 15:57.29 | Dave | df, right but where then would I obtain the package? |
| 15:57.40 | Dave | It doesn't seem to be in the repos unless it's part of another package :X |
| 15:57.50 | [df] | dunno, but there's something in debian called ca-certificates-java that looks like a fair bet? |
| 15:58.20 | [df] | ah, you're not running debian |
| 16:00.50 | [df] | perhaps they're installed somewhere else? |
| 16:01.09 | MnemonicPunk | Is that related to the free cacert service? |
| 16:01.37 | [df] | it's just a stash of certificate authority certs for java to use I believe |
| 16:03.01 | MnemonicPunk | Alright. |
| 16:03.15 | MnemonicPunk | Because cacert is down at the moment or at least unreliable. ^^ |
| 16:04.14 | *** join/#openmoko two34 (n=erik@c83-251-40-108.bredband.comhem.se) |
| 16:04.18 | [df] | I think they're part of the jre distribution so I'm guessing they might just be in the wrong place |
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| 16:05.30 | *** join/#openmoko vivijim (n=vivijim@unaffiliated/vivijim) |
| 16:09.34 | hama | what is task 'logger' doing? uses ~25% CPU on FDOM |
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| 16:19.57 | matteo_ | HI! |
| 16:20.39 | matteo_ | Sono il presidente del Lucca Lug (Lucca Linux User Group) sto cercando qualcuno che possa venire a parlare di open moko! |
| 16:20.58 | matteo_ | sorry if i don't speak english |
| 16:21.09 | Hire | io sono italiano |
| 16:21.14 | Hire | ma non sono di lucca :D |
| 16:21.14 | sicu | hehe .. sorry if we dont speak spanish :p |
| 16:21.21 | Hire | it is italian |
| 16:21.35 | sicu | ahh ... dont speak that either :p |
| 16:21.43 | *** join/#openmoko vivijim (n=vivijim@unaffiliated/vivijim) |
| 16:22.38 | [df] | je suis desole, ob Ich spreche kein Niederländisch |
| 16:22.53 | matteo_ | Hire i'm writing in private |
| 16:23.15 | *** join/#openmoko johanbr (n=j@JBrannlund2.MathStat.Dal.Ca) |
| 16:23.29 | matteo_ | my object was to take attection from italian people |
| 16:23.45 | *** join/#openmoko CVirus (n=cvirus@217.54.224.194) |
| 16:23.48 | matteo_ | i can't find any italian channel |
| 16:25.07 | Dave | Hi, my name is sicu. |
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| 16:32.05 | bumbl | hi Dave aka sicu |
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| 16:32.28 | Ghiottone | matteo_, hola. I'm from tuscany :) |
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| 16:37.12 | Dave | :D |
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| 16:38.40 | matteo_ | Ghiottone: nice |
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| 16:39.21 | Sargun_Screen | lindi-: I nuked a hdd with OM |
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| 16:41.52 | bipak | is there any fix of the "wlan can only connect one time" issue? |
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| 16:43.57 | baba_melone | Hi, How can I install glibc to my toolchain, I downloaded a binary toolchain, but now I cant compile anything as there is no glibc or libstdc++ |
| 16:44.37 | baba_melone | I just wanna install a few programs, small and self-coded, so I dont need lots of libraries |
| 16:44.38 | *** join/#openmoko Torikun (n=rusher@gateway.penguincomputing.com) |
| 16:44.51 | sicu | Dave: i dont speak english either |
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| 16:53.11 | Sargun_Screen | dave |
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| 16:53.57 | Sargun_Screen | Dave. |
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| 17:13.35 | bipak_ | remoko rules! :D |
| 17:14.23 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: 03jluebbe 07zhone * re60e7673f3d5 10/src/zhone: handle the new usage interface better |
| 17:16.20 | *** join/#openmoko TimRiker (n=timr@pdpc/supporter/bronze/TimRiker) |
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| 17:18.03 | MnemonicPunk | That ticker is a nice idea. o.o So you always see when your own problem was fixed. |
| 17:18.23 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: 03jluebbe 07framework * ra77ccca979d8 10/ChangeLog: changelog: comment about ousaged api change |
| 17:18.34 | Tig| | does anyone know if raster got his thunder and lightning earlier? |
| 17:19.23 | Dave | Sarguns |
| 17:19.37 | Dave | WHOS SUMMONS ME? |
| 17:19.47 | Tig| | not me, go away :P |
| 17:19.53 | Dave | QUIET YOU! |
| 17:19.58 | Tig| | 'nings Dave :) |
| 17:20.05 | Dave | ;p |
| 17:20.16 | Dave | go ning yourself, Deutschie :p |
| 17:20.39 | Tig| | eh? I am in Staffordshire :P |
| 17:20.52 | Dave | oh, well then |
| 17:20.55 | Dave | even worse! |
| 17:21.23 | *** join/#openmoko rmoravcik (n=rmoravci@ip-89-102-255-171.karneval.cz) |
| 17:21.32 | Dave | well, to better your spirits, your terriers surely look worse than you do. :p |
| 17:21.59 | Tig| | you saucy flirt :P |
| 17:22.27 | Dave | ;p |
| 17:22.35 | Tig| | Did raster release anything in the end today? |
| 17:22.50 | Dave | regarding? |
| 17:23.03 | Tig| | ah I will not steal his thunder then :) |
| 17:23.24 | Dave | You better not! |
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| 17:23.38 | Dave | We like Rasterman :) |
| 17:24.29 | Kensan | Tig|: it's not a release but keep the rumours spreading *heh* |
| 17:24.38 | Tig| | ah :) |
| 17:24.55 | Tig| | Kensan: thanks :) |
| 17:25.12 | Kensan | Tig|: he threw together an image which you can download but it's just his bare devel image WITHOUT any phone apps etc. |
| 17:25.20 | *** join/#openmoko tomboy64 (n=tomboy64@e178045151.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 17:25.40 | Kensan | Tig|: of course it looks very tasty :) |
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| 17:26.05 | Tig| | Kensan: ah that was what I was wondering about, was pondering if he had any phone apps up his sleeve :) |
| 17:26.33 | Tig| | Kensan: were there any links /screenshots? |
| 17:26.48 | Dave | :p |
| 17:26.59 | Kensan | Tig|: he's working on stuff, as you would expect. |
| 17:27.02 | Kensan | Tig|: http://download.enlightenment.org/misc/Illume/ |
| 17:27.04 | Kensan | the image |
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| 17:27.36 | Kensan | Tig|: http://www.rasterman.com/files/?M=D |
| 17:27.39 | Tig| | Kensan: many thanks :) I might flash it and try it out as at the moment I am not using it as a phone :( |
| 17:27.42 | Kensan | Tig|: there's some images and movies afaik. |
| 17:28.04 | Tig| | ta :) |
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| 17:31.10 | sandsmark | does the default openmoko firmware contain support for playing mp3's? |
| 17:35.22 | Tig| | sandsmark: I don't think so not as shipped |
| 17:36.11 | sandsmark | ok, because my freerunner is getting held up by german customs because someone says it is violating some mp3-related patents =/ |
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| 17:36.51 | Kensan | sandsmark: afaik there's no media player installed on the standard image. |
| 17:37.17 | Kensan | sandsmark: and I am pretty sure there are no codecs which would violate patents or any other such things. |
| 17:37.29 | wurp2|working | sandsmark: The media player on 2007.2 does support playing mp3s |
| 17:37.31 | sandsmark | ok |
| 17:37.43 | wurp2|working | Does the shipped image not include openmoko-mediaplayer2? |
| 17:38.03 | wurp2|working | The stanadard 2007.2 images do |
| 17:38.19 | mwester | How do we know what's on the now-shipping devices, now that 2007.2 is gone? |
| 17:38.20 | Tig| | wurp2|working: I don't think the shipped image did |
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| 17:38.29 | wurp2|working | Tig|: good deal |
| 17:38.38 | wurp2|working | mwester: :-( |
| 17:39.08 | Tig| | mwester: a very good point but I don't think I have mp3 support on my 2008 image |
| 17:39.18 | Kensan | mwester: I assumed they would not change the factory image since there's no "release" of any other firmware anyway... |
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| 17:41.40 | Dave | wurp :) |
| 17:42.16 | Dave | man, this regression in development is hilarious |
| 17:42.25 | Dave | yet counterproductive |
| 17:44.31 | bricode | mwester: I believe that they'll ship with 2007.2 until sometime later in October. |
| 17:45.11 | wurp2|working | Dave: This was happening even before FR was shipped :-( |
| 17:45.40 | mwester | hehe! "Let's ship a release we killed off, because we have nothing that we can put on the phone that's any better" |
| 17:45.57 | MnemonicPunk | lol |
| 17:46.03 | mwester | is about to throw the GTA0x's into the basement and forget about it |
| 17:46.07 | wurp2|working | What are the downsides of debian + fso? |
| 17:46.13 | MnemonicPunk | mwester, may I solve? |
| 17:46.20 | MnemonicPunk | "What is Windows Mobile 6?" |
| 17:46.26 | Dave | \o/ |
| 17:46.34 | bricode | wurp2|working: FSO framework still isn't too stable, and is a little quirky, but getting better. |
| 17:46.45 | Dave | mwester, it's a pretty good deal as far as I'm concerned |
| 17:46.54 | Dave | because you can't really get 2007 anymore, and it was the best :p |
| 17:46.56 | Dave | overall |
| 17:47.00 | wurp2|working | bricode: the weird thing is that fso ms1 was very stable |
| 17:47.05 | bricode | wurp2|working: Debian is pretty sweet. |
| 17:47.09 | Dave | Mwester :) |
| 17:47.22 | Dave | fso ms3 is not :P |
| 17:47.30 | bricode | wurp2|working: Never ran it. Just have been using the zhone stuff and framework on Debian. |
| 17:47.35 | mwester | wurp2|working: doesn't suspend, still kills battery, wifi doesn't work reliably, -- and then the fact that zhone is still only a demo. |
| 17:47.35 | alphaone | wurp2|working: Well, that happens when you're working on stuff and have to keep track of all the features you add... |
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| 17:47.43 | Tig| | what om should do is focus on the FSO and re-hire openhand to bring up the 2007 apps to it |
| 17:47.49 | alphaone | The more code you write the more bugs you have |
| 17:48.00 | Dave | :D |
| 17:48.04 | alphaone | And MS3 really was a shitty release |
| 17:48.10 | Dave | :D |
| 17:48.16 | bricode | Tig|: Getting rid of Openhand was a bad idea IMHO. |
| 17:48.20 | mwester | What Om should do is contract with Nokia to get Qtopia running well, and throw all their developers on FSO. |
| 17:48.29 | alphaone | We didn't really have that much time to test them |
| 17:48.32 | Tig| | bricode: agreed |
| 17:48.36 | wurp2|working | alphaone: Yeah, that's why it all needs good automated tests, and easily repeatable tests for the non-automatable stuff (inherent in a phone :-( ) and at least one dedicated tester |
| 17:48.38 | Dave | Yes, literally, THROW the developers :) |
| 17:48.42 | bricode | *cough* Android *cough*. |
| 17:48.43 | mwester | :D |
| 17:48.48 | alphaone | wurp2|working: I agree |
| 17:48.55 | mwester | would even accept Android at this point. |
| 17:49.01 | Dave | stabs brian |
| 17:49.09 | alphaone | wurp2|working: But that will need time to stablize as well |
| 17:49.12 | Dave | Mwester, finally lost it? :P |
| 17:49.17 | bricode | Dave: Told you I was a dick :) |
| 17:49.20 | Dave | :D |
| 17:49.31 | alphaone | wurp2|working: But current testing builds are pretty stable in my book |
| 17:49.33 | wurp2|working | alphaone: Yeah |
| 17:49.37 | MnemonicPunk | You mean like try { boot(); } catch(e) { throw(developer); }? |
| 17:49.48 | *** join/#openmoko matteo_ (n=matteo@82.51.139.115) |
| 17:49.48 | Dave | :D |
| 17:49.56 | wurp2|working | alphaone: Very nice! Now we just need someone to step up & be Kevin for FSO + debian |
| 17:50.14 | alphaone | MnemonicPunk: You forgot public static void main |
| 17:50.15 | Dave | heh |
| 17:50.20 | Dave | fucking java |
| 17:50.47 | Dave | speaking of which, anyone know if and where the package that provides cacerts for moko lives? |
| 17:50.51 | mwester | Dave: Yep, I've lost it. I think to save my sanity I need to take a vacation from these useless Om devices for a while. |
| 17:50.55 | Dave | I was getting errors before because they weren't installed :( |
| 17:50.59 | MnemonicPunk | alphaone: Do I have to write complete pseudocode nowadays? =( |
| 17:51.01 | bricode | Dave: A whole whack of phones run Java. |
| 17:51.09 | Dave | mwester, I've started to :) |
| 17:51.09 | Tig| | really they have had all the ingredients, openhand for the apps, FSO for the backend and raster to make it pretty and add lots of usable shininess :) |
| 17:51.15 | *** join/#openmoko pea (n=pea@75.58.4.163) |
| 17:51.27 | Dave | brian: http://rafb.net/p/9kLvgs83.html |
| 17:51.31 | Dave | wah wah :( |
| 17:51.33 | wurp2|working | Tig|: and the OM mgmt to get the fuck out of the way :-( |
| 17:51.45 | Dave | wurp2 huhu |
| 17:51.54 | alphaone | Tig|: But raster is e and ohand is GTK, so that doesn't add up... |
| 17:51.54 | Dave | Let's start a mutiny! |
| 17:51.55 | mwester | I'm going to port SlugOS to the GTA01, using a USB ethernet dongle -- it'll make a pretty nice little ARM server. |
| 17:51.55 | Tig| | bricode: yes a lot of phones do run java but they actually require rebuilts for each fecking phone and then need signing off by each network |
| 17:52.02 | alphaone | Unless you want different UI |
| 17:52.13 | Dave | alphaone, pit them against one another to the death? |
| 17:52.14 | bricode | Dave: Isn't it beautiful? 32+ call levels deep... |
| 17:52.16 | Dave | :) |
| 17:52.27 | Dave | brian, no, it's not! >:( |
| 17:52.36 | Dave | It's sad and annoying! |
| 17:52.50 | Tig| | alphaone: yes the apps are gtk but illume is e and the idea was to be able to use more than one tool kit |
| 17:52.57 | bricode | Tig|: Yep. Doesn't really adhere to the "write once, run everywhere" thing. You can give Java apps their own little sandbox to play in though. |
| 17:53.27 | Dave | Anyway, where do I get the fucking CAcerts from, for this mofo? :P |
| 17:53.28 | alphaone | Tig|: Yes, that is true. |
| 17:53.50 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: 03jluebbe 07zhone * r6b1fa6bbc6f2 10/src/zhone: escape '<', '>' and '&' in edje textblocks |
| 17:54.34 | Dave | Why can't all the distros just combine together to form VOLTRON? |
| 17:55.08 | viq | One ring to rule them all? ;) |
| 17:55.09 | Dave | or some amalgamate thing :p |
| 17:55.16 | Dave | viq, pretty much :P |
| 17:55.18 | Tig| | bricode: it is mainly so that networks can charge access to their closed market, which is kind of what OM is supposed to be the opposite of |
| 17:55.20 | alphaone | I'm actually looking forward to SHR |
| 17:55.25 | Dave | Aren't we all! |
| 17:55.30 | Dave | note the S |
| 17:55.31 | Dave | :P |
| 17:55.44 | Tig| | fuck that gimme HR at the moment... |
| 17:55.45 | *** join/#openmoko alvarezp (n=alvarezp@201.139.193.235) |
| 17:55.53 | bricode | Tig|: It's also to provide security and stability for their networks. |
| 17:55.57 | Dave | haha |
| 17:55.59 | Dave | Agreed :p |
| 17:56.06 | Tm_T | kids... |
| 17:56.11 | Dave | TmT |
| 17:56.35 | Dave | We see you there, gawking at our discourse! |
| 17:56.36 | *** join/#openmoko alvarezp (n=alvarezp@201.139.193.235) |
| 17:56.51 | Tm_T | indeed |
| 17:57.05 | Tm_T | though, you failed with the nick thing, son |
| 17:57.42 | Tig| | bricode: yeah, odd it is a flat rate really considering that obviously they are checking each app for stability and security reasons as surely some apps would be more complicated to test than others :P |
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| 18:08.23 | cbrake | I'm having trouble getting my freerunner to connect to an P |
| 18:08.28 | cbrake | AP via wifi |
| 18:08.36 | cbrake | any know issues with 2008.9? |
| 18:12.02 | *** join/#openmoko phoenix7 (n=phoenix7@213.207.223.231) |
| 18:13.22 | cbrake | connection to an open AP is working fine from another OE based system |
| 18:13.57 | *** join/#openmoko emonkey (n=emonkey@static-pro-212-101-27-121.adsl.solnet.ch) |
| 18:15.23 | cbrake | finds wifi can only connect one issue ... |
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| 18:43.11 | Kensan | mwester: What's the easiest way to mess around with the OM-kernel? Doing it within openembedded seems too much overhead... |
| 18:43.37 | *** join/#openmoko phoenix7 (n=phoenix7@213.207.223.231) |
| 18:44.26 | mwester | Fetch it from the OM git repo; you'll need the toolchain as well. |
| 18:45.05 | Kensan | mwester: hm ok, I will give that a try. |
| 18:45.08 | Kensan | mwester: thanks! |
| 18:45.10 | mwester | Check the kernel mailing list archives; the procedure to get the correct branch is outlines. |
| 18:45.13 | mwester | er, outlined. |
| 18:45.34 | *** join/#openmoko FilipLinux4BE (n=Filip@77.109.122.106) |
| 18:53.15 | balrog-k1n | kernel is much more tolerant to toolchains so if you build one with any options it will most probably work |
| 18:54.35 | balrog-k1n | uses one toolchain for various machines (including armv5) |
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| 19:01.34 | LionKMP | why are there no logfiles in /var/log, I want log files. :-p |
| 19:01.39 | LionKMP | hi all anyway |
| 19:01.46 | bipak_ | good question |
| 19:01.47 | *** join/#openmoko baze (n=baze@p57A67699.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 19:01.54 | bipak_ | asked that myself too |
| 19:02.31 | bipak_ | but no one answered *g* |
| 19:02.45 | LionKMP | :-p |
| 19:03.15 | viq | Because writing to flash wears it out. |
| 19:03.32 | bipak_ | you could write to a ramdisk |
| 19:03.49 | LionKMP | yes, good idea (actually there is not enough ram! :) ) |
| 19:04.08 | bipak_ | logrotate ;) |
| 19:04.17 | LionKMP | :-) |
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| 19:19.03 | peter__b | hi |
| 19:19.16 | peter__b | any problems compiling fso-unstable atm ? |
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| 19:34.48 | SamuraiDio | hi |
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| 19:47.38 | lindi- | peter__b: with bitbake? |
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| 19:52.56 | xt | lindi-: do you happen to know about any broken packages in debian? Trying to install right now, but gstreamer0.10-good or something is complaining |
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| 19:57.12 | lindi- | xt: the arm buildd machine are bit slow |
| 19:57.47 | xt | is it a freerunner building? (: |
| 19:57.58 | lindi- | nope |
| 19:58.08 | lindi- | xt: agricola.debian.org is bit faster |
| 19:58.38 | xt | is there a .tar.gz I can download somewhere that's preinstalled? |
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| 20:02.38 | lindi- | xt: afaik not |
| 20:02.48 | bove | anyone here been trying usb memory sticks on the freerunner |
| 20:02.56 | lindi- | works |
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| 20:25.30 | bove | I can't seem to find the right device or the usb memory stick |
| 20:28.13 | bipak_ | bove: should be visible n dmesg |
| 20:28.22 | bipak_ | i guess sd[a-z] |
| 20:31.52 | bove | hmm... my mini usb to usb a doesn't seem to work very well |
| 20:34.39 | bove | even an external powered hdd wont show up in dmesg |
| 20:35.35 | *** part/#openmoko leachim_dot_eu_ (n=Leachim@HSI-KBW-078-042-217-226.hsi3.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de) |
| 20:38.18 | bipak_ | bove: did you remove the usb network driver? |
| 20:39.12 | bipak_ | oh wait.. there aren't modules |
| 20:39.13 | bipak_ | *g* |
| 20:39.28 | bipak_ | sorry.. i have no clue |
| 20:39.28 | bipak_ | :) |
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| 20:41.40 | MnemonicPunk | How would I go about creating an FSO image with OE? Is it as simple as saying "bitbake fso-image"? |
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| 20:46.12 | peter__b | lindi- : yes, ttf-liberation_0.2.bb fails |
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| 20:55.50 | bove | can anyone confirme I don't need to change manually from usb client mode to host mode in 2008.9? |
| 20:56.05 | lindi- | bove: how would it work then? |
| 20:56.31 | nicfer | one question, would be too hard to get a freerunner in Argentina? |
| 20:56.34 | bove | ? |
| 20:56.54 | bove | lindi-: what do you mean? |
| 20:56.59 | xt | lindi-: is there a more updated mirror somewhere, I cant install fso-frameworkd :( |
| 20:58.47 | FilipLinux4BE | bove: what does cat /sys/devices/platform/s3c2410-ohci/usb_mode give you ? |
| 20:58.57 | lindi- | bove: yeah, is there a way to detect it automatically? |
| 20:59.56 | FilipLinux4BE | and cat /sys/devices/platform/neo1973-pm-host.0/hostmode ? |
| 21:00.01 | bove | FilipLinux4BE: it says device. Should I change it to host? |
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| 21:00.18 | FilipLinux4BE | think so. echo host > /sys/devices/platform/s3c2410-ohci/usb_mode |
| 21:00.35 | FilipLinux4BE | and echo 1 > /sys/devices/platform/neo1973-pm-host.0/hostmode |
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| 21:01.15 | FilipLinux4BE | even if it is an externally powered usb hdd. I think the 'host' is still responsible for providing 5V on the usb bus |
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| 21:01.47 | lindi- | xt: better ask on #openmoko-debian, i'll reply when i have more time :) |
| 21:01.58 | xt | ok, thanks |
| 21:02.44 | lindi- | too many bugs to fix/report |
| 21:03.48 | *** join/#openmoko mgregson (n=mgregson@76-10-140-50.dsl.teksavvy.com) |
| 21:04.05 | OdyX | waits patiently for the "5 seconds boot" on the FreeRunner. |
| 21:06.25 | bove | FilipLinux4BE: Thanks. Got some sticks working now |
| 21:06.29 | johanbr | <PROTECTED> |
| 21:06.33 | johanbr | oops :) |
| 21:07.30 | nicfer | one question, will be too hard to get a freerunner in Argentina? |
| 21:07.40 | nicfer | the main trouble are really high taxes |
| 21:07.52 | *** join/#openmoko noother (n=noother@unaffiliated/noother) |
| 21:08.02 | nicfer | it costs like U$S300 more |
| 21:08.14 | mjr | getting one shipped to you should be no problem, for you to get it is between you and the local customs... |
| 21:08.15 | *** join/#openmoko e_s_p (n=evan@pdpc/supporter/silver/evanpro) |
| 21:09.46 | nicfer | I'm worried about the taxes, they're pretty high here, so the $400 freerunner would cost me $700 instead |
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| 21:11.17 | bove | strange... memory sticks seems to work fine, while a harddrive appears in dmesg but is not mapped to a device |
| 21:13.11 | FilipLinux4BE | hdd is powered ? |
| 21:13.56 | FilipLinux4BE | what does dmesg report ? |
| 21:15.01 | bove | [ 5964.855000] usb-storage: waiting for device to settle before scanning |
| 21:15.01 | bove | [ 5969.865000] usb-storage: device scan complete |
| 21:15.01 | bove | [ 5969.885000] PM: Removing info for No Bus:target3:0:0 |
| 21:15.01 | bove | [ 5969.890000] PM: Removing info for No Bus:target3:0:1 |
| 21:15.01 | bove | [ 5969.895000] PM: Removing info for No Bus:target3:0:2 |
| 21:15.01 | bove | [ 5969.900000] PM: Removing info for No Bus:target3:0:3 |
| 21:15.03 | bove | [ 5969.905000] PM: Removing info for No Bus:target3:0:4 |
| 21:15.05 | bove | [ 5969.910000] PM: Removing info for No Bus:target3:0:5 |
| 21:15.07 | bove | [ 5969.915000] PM: Removing info for No Bus:target3:0:6 |
| 21:15.09 | bove | [ 5969.920000] PM: Removing info for No Bus:target3:0:7 |
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| 21:16.34 | bove | another hdd actually worked fine. Only problem is missing file system support |
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| 21:16.41 | lindi- | spam |
| 21:19.13 | mwester | bove: install the kernel modules, I think most common filesystems are being built in the standard images. |
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| 21:20.54 | bove | where can I find these modules? I'm about to download ntfs-3g now |
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| 21:26.34 | *** part/#openmoko dwb (n=david@pdpc/supporter/active/dwb) |
| 21:26.56 | mwester | opkg install kernel-module-<desired-module> |
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| 21:34.05 | bove | where can I find a module list for 2008.9? I can only find some for 2007.11 |
| 21:40.40 | mwester | opkg list | grep kernel-module |
| 21:41.51 | bove | opkg list | grep -i ntfs |
| 21:41.52 | bove | returns nothing |
| 21:45.51 | *** join/#openmoko Stroller (n=Stroller@213-152-39-89.dsl.eclipse.net.uk) |
| 21:46.02 | bove | thanks for your help anyway. No hard feelings for me spamming the channel with rookie question, right? |
| 21:46.17 | bove | Good night everyone |
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| 22:41.19 | DaveLab | Hmm |
| 22:41.29 | DaveLab | mwester |
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| 22:44.52 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: 03daniel 07framework * r10562d9e99f9 10/framework/subsystems/ogpsd/gpsdevice.py: ogpsd: Send ConnectionStatusChanged signal |
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| 22:46.25 | MnemonicPunk | Alright, building ttf-liberation with OE fails not only for me, it seems. =( |
| 22:48.21 | DaveLab | Congratulations? It's a failparty! |
| 22:48.24 | DaveLab | :| |
| 22:48.31 | MnemonicPunk | lol |
| 22:49.33 | DaveLab | wurp |
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| 22:53.37 | mwester | watcha buildin' in the lab, Dave? Frankenstein? |
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| 22:54.18 | MnemonicPunk | Frankenmoko. |
| 22:54.29 | MnemonicPunk | The opensource living creature framework. |
| 22:54.32 | alphaone | MnemonicPunk: pull |
| 22:54.36 | alphaone | should work again |
| 22:54.51 | MnemonicPunk | Hm? |
| 22:55.21 | MnemonicPunk | What do you mean? |
| 22:55.27 | mwester | fetches a rope to help pull |
| 22:55.36 | mwester | MnemonicPunk: update your repo |
| 22:55.50 | MnemonicPunk | Okay. |
| 22:55.51 | mwester | make update if you are using the mokomakefile |
| 22:56.22 | DaveLab | Yeah |
| 22:56.28 | mwester | watches an 80GB disk format... on USB 1.1 |
| 22:56.31 | mwester | Sigh. |
| 22:56.35 | DaveLab | hahahaha |
| 22:56.50 | DaveLab | Mwester, I'm backing up just about that much! |
| 22:56.56 | DaveLab | pesky mokos |
| 22:57.18 | DaveLab | good thing the internal flash size is small :p |
| 22:57.27 | DaveLab | go go rsync! |
| 22:57.35 | mwester | I think I'll abort this and go put it on the laptop. |
| 22:57.54 | DaveLab | haha |
| 22:57.57 | DaveLab | pretty much :p |
| 22:58.14 | mwester | Backing up that much? Internal flash is rather smaller than that! |
| 22:58.35 | DaveLab | I'm backing up the SD's on all these freerunners simultaneously over usb1.1, but it's faster than me bothering to power down, reopen each, close up, get 8 card readers... yadda yadda |
| 22:58.39 | DaveLab | :p |
| 22:58.47 | DaveLab | plus I can do them all in parallel so, woo |
| 22:59.08 | mwester | You have 8 FRs? 8 x the pain... |
| 22:59.10 | DaveLab | mwester, 10 freerunners... 8GB SD cards... most of them 97% or so filled :p |
| 22:59.16 | mwester | Gack. |
| 22:59.18 | DaveLab | you do the math :D |
| 22:59.20 | mwester | But... |
| 22:59.31 | DaveLab | But but but but |
| 22:59.46 | mwester | Do you have any standard image or even the stock kernel on them? |
| 23:00.03 | mwester | As in, can you comment on if you see the WSOD on all, some, or none? |
| 23:00.20 | DaveLab | What does this have to do with my backing them up? |
| 23:00.25 | mwester | Nothing. |
| 23:00.36 | mwester | Opportunistic question. |
| 23:00.43 | DaveLab | Oh, are you asking if any of them use standard images, and if so, do I get the WSOD on any of them? |
| 23:00.45 | mwester | I had no idea anyone had more than one. |
| 23:00.46 | DaveLab | Ah >:) |
| 23:00.52 | DaveLab | Oh, hah |
| 23:01.17 | mwester | I'm trying to figure out if there is any truth to the suspicion that some devices exhibit this, and others (such as the one I have) are relatively immune. |
| 23:01.27 | sicu | what could possibly be the reason for having 10 of them ... :/ ? |
| 23:01.32 | DaveLab | Mwester, I've run a myriad of images, but out of all of them, I've only gotten the WSOD a few times (maybe three or four?), on older 2007/2008 images. |
| 23:01.40 | DaveLab | and it was only for a period of a week's images |
| 23:01.46 | mwester | sicu: Dave talks a lot, can't you tell? :p |
| 23:01.51 | DaveLab | before and beyond that development point I've never had problems |
| 23:02.05 | DaveLab | Mwester, I need one for each of my personalities? :) |
| 23:02.06 | bricode | DaveLab: You with 8 crazy mokos. You're cooking up something fancy aren't you? :) |
| 23:02.20 | mwester | Ok. Inconclusive then. My suspicion is that certain images trigger the problem, not the hardware... |
| 23:02.21 | DaveLab | Brian... you'll see... >:) |
| 23:02.31 | DaveLab | Mwester, I believe that's absolutely correct. |
| 23:02.32 | *** part/#openmoko nicfer (n=usuario@168.226.106.146) |
| 23:02.45 | *** join/#openmoko DrRabbit_ (n=tuna@ip70-176-117-108.ph.ph.cox.net) |
| 23:02.50 | DaveLab | From what I hear, the majority of users experiencing the WSoD are using 2008 or some variant. |
| 23:02.50 | MnemonicPunk | Build still fails. =( |
| 23:02.56 | bricode | WSOD during boot? |
| 23:03.05 | DaveLab | I have no conclusive evidence to support this other than my observations of complainers here :) |
| 23:03.08 | mwester | DaveLab: That is exactly the sense I have as well. |
| 23:03.30 | *** join/#openmoko Stroller (n=Stroller@213-152-39-89.dsl.eclipse.net.uk) |
| 23:03.48 | mwester | bricode: WSOD upon resuming the device after it suspends. |
| 23:03.53 | DaveLab | Mwester, honestly, the more frequent, yet similar issue I experienced with the late 2007 images (a few weeks before retirement), were where it'd boot but stay on the OM logo and never get past it :p |
| 23:04.03 | DaveLab | that was fixed after, but I just thought I'd state it :) |
| 23:04.29 | sicu | i've never had the WSOD ... but then i have never tried the 2008.* variants ... just all the other ones |
| 23:04.40 | DaveLab | Mwester, I hope the OM team doesn't just blame it on the glamo, and continue development, ignoring the issue :) |
| 23:04.46 | DaveLab | high-fives sicu |
| 23:04.46 | mwester | Yeah, that boot image annoyed me -- good to have the code there, but that shouldn't be turned on until the device is stable enough that we won't ever need to see where it got stuck in boot. |
| 23:05.13 | mwester | DaveLab: you are reading my mind on this issue. I am becoming worried that Om is doing exactly that. |
| 23:05.52 | bricode | mwester: It's easier to sweep things under the rug. |
| 23:06.22 | sicu | i think we would all be able to predict how Om deals with issues |
| 23:06.25 | bricode | One time during boot up from the SD card in Debian, my u-boot got blown away. |
| 23:06.42 | sicu | they must have one huge rug |
| 23:06.44 | DaveLab | Mwester, seems like, and on more than just this one issue :\ |
| 23:06.45 | *** join/#openmoko playya (n=playya@p579B889B.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 23:06.57 | DaveLab | sicu, exactly!!! |
| 23:07.04 | mwester | Ok, I'm going to set up a torture test for my FR with suspend/resume this week, and see if we can't get some statistics. |
| 23:07.07 | DaveLab | Makes me want to torch Sean's house :\ |
| 23:07.16 | sicu | is tempted to sweep his FR under the rug too |
| 23:07.16 | DaveLab | or just his goddamn rug :p |
| 23:07.21 | DaveLab | sicu yeah :[ |
| 23:07.24 | DaveLab | aren't we all, at times |
| 23:07.42 | sicu | sigh ... it's a shame though :/ |
| 23:07.42 | DaveLab | Mwester, I could probably donate ten or so phones to the fight, if you'd like. |
| 23:07.55 | DaveLab | Running the same, or different images on each, and seeing what happens. |
| 23:07.56 | mwester | things sweeping it wouldnt' be nearly as much fun as using it for what the case seems to be designed for: a hockey game. |
| 23:08.10 | DaveLab | haha |
| 23:08.14 | sicu | =] |
| 23:08.15 | DaveLab | Oh, you're one of the hockey puck people :) |
| 23:08.23 | DaveLab | I still think the shower radio was more fitting :P |
| 23:08.32 | mwester | THe orange Neo looked like a pool toy. |
| 23:08.37 | DaveLab | FYI, IT'S TOTALLY NOT WATERPROOF |
| 23:08.47 | MnemonicPunk | xD |
| 23:08.48 | DaveLab | and the invisible shield protectors DO NOT MAKE IT WATERPROOF. |
| 23:08.52 | mwester | wonders how Dave knows that. |
| 23:08.55 | DaveLab | I have tried... and uhhh... learned :P |
| 23:08.58 | MnemonicPunk | Dave probably found that out empiricially. |
| 23:09.00 | DaveLab | shit, I shouldn't have said that :D |
| 23:09.02 | MnemonicPunk | -i |
| 23:09.11 | mwester | So, once there were 11, huh? |
| 23:09.17 | DaveLab | sssssssh |
| 23:09.20 | MnemonicPunk | xD |
| 23:09.21 | DaveLab | :P |
| 23:09.26 | DaveLab | And then there were none... |
| 23:09.28 | MnemonicPunk | No, once there was a truckload + 8 |
| 23:09.34 | DaveLab | >:D |
| 23:09.36 | MnemonicPunk | Now there's no more pool. |
| 23:09.40 | mwester | Oh well, at least you have a spare battery, which you probably need frequently since nothing shuts the ****** thing down when the bat is low! |
| 23:09.51 | *** join/#openmoko raster (n=raster@124-170-117-193.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 23:09.54 | DaveLab | mwester, 2007 solved that a while ago |
| 23:10.00 | DaveLab | after much bitching (me included) :) |
| 23:10.01 | mwester | Shhhhh.. raster is here. |
| 23:10.04 | DaveLab | I was pleased with the result. |
| 23:10.07 | DaveLab | hoenoes |
| 23:10.08 | sicu | hmmm, does it float ?? |
| 23:10.11 | DaveLab | :D |
| 23:10.15 | raster | stabs mwester |
| 23:10.18 | DaveLab | wonder if Dave letterman would do it |
| 23:10.21 | raster | MUAHHAHAHAHAHA |
| 23:10.22 | MnemonicPunk | Ah, the rasterman is back. xD |
| 23:10.28 | DaveLab | Eeeeeeeeeeexcellent. |
| 23:10.33 | raster | runs |
| 23:10.34 | mwester | bleeds all over his FR, and magically it works better! |
| 23:10.37 | raster | has the runs |
| 23:10.39 | DaveLab | Time to flash these bitches. |
| 23:10.42 | MnemonicPunk | raster: Do you have any idea why ttf-liberation fails to build for me? |
| 23:10.48 | raster | mwester: yay! you solved it! |
| 23:10.49 | raster | :) |
| 23:10.49 | DaveLab | Mwester, oh no, now it's got a taste for blood! |
| 23:10.51 | mwester | MnemonicPunk: log file? |
| 23:10.56 | raster | MnemonicPunk: yes... it's missing my magic patch! |
| 23:10.57 | bricode | DaveLab: Have you worked out a decent mass flashing method? |
| 23:10.58 | raster | :) |
| 23:11.02 | sicu | DaveLab would bleed out before he could cover all his devices with blood :p |
| 23:11.06 | DaveLab | brian, it's a hack |
| 23:11.07 | raster | has a small army of patches... |
| 23:11.12 | DaveLab | but I'd really like to formalize it |
| 23:11.14 | raster | hmmm |
| 23:11.20 | DaveLab | I have to flash 60 phones on wednesday |
| 23:11.23 | bricode | DaveLab: Via USB or something else? |
| 23:11.26 | raster | i possibly should put this in svn... |
| 23:11.27 | DaveLab | or rather BEFORE |
| 23:11.28 | mwester | Say what? 60? |
| 23:12.12 | MnemonicPunk | Alright, request immediate raster backup, deploy now, rendezvous at 1150 |
| 23:12.12 | DaveLab | Roger roger |
| 23:12.12 | raster | in fact.. thats a fab idea |
| 23:12.12 | mwester | With what?!! I'm just imagining the tech support nightmare with 60 new users with any current image... |
| 23:12.12 | bricode | DaveLab: Wow. I hope you have a whack of self-installing SD card images... |
| 23:12.12 | DaveLab | Mwester, WELCOME TO MY WORLD. |
| 23:12.18 | MnemonicPunk | raster: Honestly, do I need a patch for that? |
| 23:12.23 | DaveLab | Why do you think my sanity has tanked so. :) |
| 23:12.38 | mwester | Did you volunteer for this mission? |
| 23:12.40 | bricode | DaveLab: Or a modified u-boot/filesystem to do an NFS mount followed by some exotic dd command. |
| 23:12.47 | DaveLab | In other news, any leads on finding a cacerts package for moko? |
| 23:12.54 | DaveLab | brian, yeah perhaps |
| 23:13.03 | DaveLab | right now, it's just a whopping usb hub |
| 23:13.11 | bricode | DaveLab: Ugly. |
| 23:13.12 | sicu | doubts DaveLabs sanity in the first place for buying 10 of them |
| 23:13.22 | bricode | DaveLab: Can you take a photo for me? |
| 23:13.25 | DaveLab | uhh |
| 23:13.38 | DaveLab | it's like looking at a white table covered in black spaghetti |
| 23:13.43 | DaveLab | :( |
| 23:13.55 | mwester | I doubt it; that much brokenness in one place would bend space and make photos blurry. |
| 23:14.01 | sicu | ooooh ... freerunner meatballs |
| 23:14.12 | DaveLab | the layout changes so frequently, and I have to frequently disconnect one so I can BEAT IT, until it does what I want |
| 23:14.17 | DaveLab | then reintegrate it INTO THE HIVE |
| 23:14.23 | DaveLab | Mwester :) |
| 23:14.47 | MnemonicPunk | DaveLab: Ever considered acoustic maintenance for that? |
| 23:14.56 | DaveLab | No :P |
| 23:15.23 | DaveLab | shit, I have to finish |
| 23:15.28 | MnemonicPunk | DaveLab: Just take some old USB-stick you find, drop it right next to your hub and smash it with a sledgehammer. Your devices will immediately obey. |
| 23:15.47 | DaveLab | >:) |
| 23:15.52 | DaveLab | Set an example. |
| 23:15.55 | DaveLab | haha |
| 23:15.59 | MnemonicPunk | Exactly. |
| 23:16.13 | MnemonicPunk | Good old BOFH teachings. xD |
| 23:16.18 | DaveLab | it was bad though, I like the fact I have written a distributed command interface, so I can control my massively growing freerunner army |
| 23:16.41 | DaveLab | except the other night when I wanted to run another group differential backup, but accidentally switched them all into runlevel 0 :( |
| 23:16.46 | DaveLab | hahaha |
| 23:17.04 | MnemonicPunk | o.O |
| 23:17.38 | MnemonicPunk | You got a distributed command interface for turning them on and off? Now that's lazy. o.o |
| 23:18.25 | MnemonicPunk | You should make that tells one of your freerunners to call the others. |
| 23:18.30 | MnemonicPunk | That'd be a nice concert. |
| 23:18.32 | raster | MnemonicPunk: yes - you do |
| 23:18.37 | raster | (need patch) |
| 23:18.45 | DaveLab | Raster |
| 23:18.53 | DaveLab | We've been touching your releases all afternoon! |
| 23:19.01 | raster | uh oh |
| 23:19.06 | MnemonicPunk | raster: Link plx =) |
| 23:19.08 | raster | i'm actually putting my oe build in svn |
| 23:19.13 | raster | with patches |
| 23:19.18 | MnemonicPunk | Do that. |
| 23:19.42 | MnemonicPunk | Buuut. |
| 23:19.46 | MnemonicPunk | Link me plx. xD |
| 23:19.47 | sicu | raster: i love your new image ... i have no noise or echo during calls anymore =] |
| 23:20.00 | MnemonicPunk | Because that's the only package missing for my image. >_> |
| 23:20.33 | raster | ic my image... doesnt do calls.. great. isn't it! :) |
| 23:20.47 | sicu | ;] ^^ |
| 23:20.54 | DaveLab | uggh |
| 23:21.00 | *** part/#openmoko LetoTo (n=paul@bofh.xelerance.com) |
| 23:21.01 | DaveLab | I have to back up the qtopia phones now... |
| 23:21.15 | DaveLab | And I am really compelled to just wipe all the data, and not save anything from them... :P |
| 23:21.21 | DaveLab | grumbles |
| 23:21.43 | sicu | just sweep everything under the rug |
| 23:22.01 | *** join/#openmoko DerHorst_ (n=Horst@e176108213.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 23:22.22 | DaveLab | Fuck you, Openmoko! |
| 23:22.36 | MnemonicPunk | fuck: command not found |
| 23:22.48 | DaveLab | on my system, it most certainly is! |
| 23:23.01 | DaveLab | well, my laptop, anyway |
| 23:23.13 | MnemonicPunk | You should symlink "fuck you" to "rm -rf /" xD |
| 23:23.23 | DaveLab | actually, funny you should mention that! |
| 23:23.37 | DaveLab | I was debating whether to rm -rf / all these freerunners or just reimage them :D |
| 23:23.41 | DaveLab | and be done with it tonight |
| 23:23.50 | DaveLab | I wasn't sure which would be more painful for them. |
| 23:23.52 | DaveLab | >:) |
| 23:23.59 | *** join/#openmoko batti (n=batti@p5B14C423.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 23:24.02 | raster | hmmm |
| 23:24.16 | raster | i wonder how i get patch to ski "reverse the patch" query... |
| 23:24.26 | DaveLab | sounds hot |
| 23:26.43 | raster | ok |
| 23:26.45 | raster | test-time |
| 23:26.53 | DaveLab | More enlightenment please! |
| 23:27.05 | *** join/#openmoko quickdev (n=quickdev@p5B057FC7.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 23:27.06 | quickdev | j #e.de |
| 23:27.10 | quickdev | argh :) |
| 23:27.15 | DaveLab | Die Deutschen! |
| 23:27.18 | balrog-k1n | turns on the light |
| 23:27.18 | DaveLab | :o |
| 23:27.41 | DaveLab | Balrogkun, I plug a usb light into my freerunner sometimes :P |
| 23:27.43 | MnemonicPunk | xD |
| 23:27.56 | DaveLab | the weight is nice and heavy, so it makes a good bed lamp |
| 23:28.03 | DaveLab | other than that, it doesn't do very much. |
| 23:28.08 | balrog-k1n | haha |
| 23:28.10 | DaveLab | :) |
| 23:28.19 | sicu | usb-light sounds like a good idea ... my battery always lasts way to long anyway |
| 23:28.25 | DaveLab | haha |
| 23:28.31 | balrog-k1n | you could turn the light on and off by inserting and removing the usb module in a script |
| 23:28.34 | MnemonicPunk | "Oh don't mind that, it's just my linux bedlamp." |
| 23:28.39 | DaveLab | :D |
| 23:28.41 | DaveLab | better yet |
| 23:28.43 | balrog-k1n | if you had more of them each attached to a freerunner |
| 23:28.56 | DaveLab | if I could somehow write a program to use the microphone and create a smart "Clapper" |
| 23:29.00 | DaveLab | :D |
| 23:29.05 | MnemonicPunk | lol |
| 23:29.11 | raster | awaits the testicles... |
| 23:29.24 | DaveLab | or better yet, change the Activation phrase to something else |
| 23:29.28 | DaveLab | preferably more profane :) |
| 23:29.35 | DaveLab | throws a qtopia freerunner at raster |
| 23:29.40 | mwester | DaveLab: do none of your devices suffer from the 1024 bug? |
| 23:30.01 | MnemonicPunk | raster: What exactly are you testing? |
| 23:30.05 | raster | oh crap this will wake a while |
| 23:30.14 | raster | Receiving objects: 1% (2384/172648), 459.99 KiB | 12 KiB/s |
| 23:30.51 | mwester | looks like raster is gitting git |
| 23:31.42 | raster | mnd i put my install.sh, patches, my osn custom package.bb's and everything u need to set up your own build treee in e's svn |
| 23:31.49 | *** join/#openmoko unlotto (n=unlotto@ip114.rev112.brygge.net) |
| 23:31.51 | raster | before i commit it - need to check it works |
| 23:31.52 | raster | :) |
| 23:32.03 | raster | as i just copied my own setup out of my current oe tree. |
| 23:32.15 | raster | i will probably migrate over to using this... |
| 23:32.20 | raster | but first to get it started |
| 23:32.31 | MnemonicPunk | Any chance you'd share that patch so I can see if my image works? ^^ |
| 23:32.44 | raster | what it do4es mean is u'll have an oe build tree set up "the oe way" (the way oe wants u to on their wiki) |
| 23:32.53 | raster | and works off oe's dev git tree |
| 23:32.57 | raster | yes |
| 23:33.00 | raster | the patch is in there |
| 23:33.06 | raster | along with a bunch of others |
| 23:33.13 | DaveLab | Whee, they're screaming in agony! |
| 23:33.28 | DaveLab | lpotter, take that, scanning documents! hahahah |
| 23:34.10 | MnemonicPunk | Dave you should connect your phones x servers and make them form one big widescreen. xD |
| 23:34.35 | raster | MnemonicPunk: when i know this works - i'll commit it |
| 23:34.40 | raster | u can use it then too |
| 23:34.42 | mwester | thinks that's an interesting idea; an audio interface to indicate cpu/load usage... screaming computers... |
| 23:34.43 | *** join/#openmoko Louis_XV (n=irc@dialup-01-192.abel.net.uk) |
| 23:34.43 | raster | i dont need to do a build |
| 23:34.49 | raster | i just need to know if the bit checkout works |
| 23:34.56 | raster | and the inital patch works |
| 23:35.17 | *** part/#openmoko Louis_XV (n=irc@dialup-01-192.abel.net.uk) |
| 23:37.09 | *** join/#openmoko alphabeat1 (n=nick@60-241-37-3.static.tpgi.com.au) |
| 23:37.20 | *** join/#openmoko mluser-work (n=mluser-w@208.178.12.226) |
| 23:37.52 | EvilDaveLab | Mwester :P |
| 23:38.11 | EvilDaveLab | I like how #openmoko is essentially raster's blog :) |
| 23:38.28 | raster | hahahahah |
| 23:38.38 | EvilDaveLab | Hey, no arguments from me :) |
| 23:38.48 | raster | 17% |
| 23:38.51 | raster | ... |
| 23:39.30 | EvilDaveLab | whoa whoa whoa, wtf |
| 23:39.49 | MnemonicPunk | More like Twitter. |
| 23:40.42 | EvilDaveLab | oh gawd |
| 23:41.04 | EvilDaveLab | Man, downloading the fucking OM wiki takes FOREVER |
| 23:41.09 | EvilDaveLab | they need to move out of china |
| 23:41.13 | EvilDaveLab | :P |
| 23:41.31 | raster | maybe you need to move TO china? |
| 23:41.32 | raster | :) |
| 23:41.40 | EvilDaveLab | har :P |
| 23:41.52 | EvilDaveLab | and maybe you need to eat more roo! |
| 23:42.04 | EvilDaveLab | damn... I'm hungry... I could totally go for some rooburgers right about now... |
| 23:42.21 | EvilDaveLab | salivates all over his desk narrowly avoiding several freerunners in the process. |
| 23:46.31 | *** join/#openmoko skorzen (n=skorzen@89-180-10-18.net.novis.pt) |
| 23:47.01 | *** join/#openmoko Kt_ (n=Kirsat@adsl-232-4-58.asm.bellsouth.net) |
| 23:50.51 | *** join/#openmoko rufus__ (n=rufus@c-98-226-41-174.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 23:52.26 | jOERG_rw | raster: moin! |
| 23:53.16 | raster | moo |
| 23:53.40 | jOERG_rw | raster: actually it's really bad our servers are located in TW |
| 23:53.58 | raster | bah! |
| 23:54.01 | raster | just move to .tw! |
| 23:54.02 | raster | :) |
| 23:54.12 | jOERG_rw | maybe TW needs a better FDDI cable |
| 23:54.38 | jOERG_rw | like 160 glas-fibre |
| 23:55.10 | jOERG_rw | directly to decix or wtf it's called |
| 23:55.43 | jOERG_rw | (.tw move) nope, too many hurricanes |
| 23:55.59 | raster | hehehe |
| 23:56.17 | jOERG_rw | recently the worst one this year - that's why TPE is so quiet today :-D |
| 23:57.07 | jOERG_rw | no work while windy outside |
| 23:57.07 | *** join/#openmoko aaronw (n=aaronw@ool-4570af17.dyn.optonline.net) |
| 23:57.47 | raster | HAHAHAHHA |
| 23:57.48 | raster | lame |
| 23:57.53 | raster | perfect time to work |
| 23:58.01 | raster | can't go anywhere. may as well work! |
| 23:58.06 | *** join/#openmoko grackleflint (n=gregk@ppp121-44-46-212.lns10.syd7.internode.on.net) |
| 23:58.42 | jOERG_rw | yup, but you know our coleagues have to go to work first ;-) |
| 23:59.11 | jOERG_rw | if they can't go anywhere - too bad |
| 23:59.46 | jOERG_rw | well on last one I did the same, stay at OM-appartment, but I still worked ;-) |