| 00:01.46 | *** join/#openmoko uhsf (n=uhsf@modemcable009.150-57-74.mc.videotron.ca) |
| 00:01.46 | *** join/#openmoko georgy_28 (n=georgy@217-117-42-7.teledisnet.be) |
| 00:06.33 | *** join/#openmoko dougt (n=dougt@c-67-180-69-46.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 00:26.25 | sirkha_top | note: if you want your freerunner to charge correctly, it is pertinant to plug it into a charger that is also connected to the wall |
| 00:28.35 | *** part/#openmoko alphabeat (n=nick@123-243-190-207.static.tpgi.com.au) |
| 00:29.05 | *** join/#openmoko thantalos (n=thantalo@p57AE4C65.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 00:31.54 | *** join/#openmoko georgy_28 (n=georgy@217-117-42-7.teledisnet.be) |
| 00:42.00 | thantalos | hey - I'm trying to compile stumpWM (-> http://www.nongnu.org/stumpwm/) for my FreeRunner - it compiles but seems like it doesn't cross compile. I think the problem is, that it's a LISP application but I'm not sure about that. |
| 00:42.00 | thantalos | Does anyone here know how to cross compile a lisp application? |
| 00:42.59 | *** join/#openmoko rooly (n=rooly@host-125-92.lalacap.clients.pavlovmedia.com) |
| 00:45.59 | *** join/#openmoko Cthobs (n=cerebus@fl-71-3-161-53.dyn.embarqhsd.net) |
| 00:46.24 | *** join/#openmoko alphabeat (n=nick@60-241-37-3.static.tpgi.com.au) |
| 00:47.39 | *** part/#openmoko bamccaig (n=bamccaig@dsl-66-186-95-161.vianet.ca) |
| 00:48.34 | *** join/#openmoko recursor (n=chatzill@c-69-254-104-107.hsd1.tn.comcast.net) |
| 00:48.55 | *** part/#openmoko recursor (n=chatzill@c-69-254-104-107.hsd1.tn.comcast.net) |
| 00:58.01 | *** part/#openmoko thantalos (n=thantalo@p57AE4C65.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 01:00.17 | *** join/#openmoko romulo (n=romulo@20158203017.user.veloxzone.com.br) |
| 01:00.23 | romulo | hi there |
| 01:01.40 | georgy_28 | hi here |
| 01:02.33 | romulo | im trying to run openmoko on qemu using the mokomakefile |
| 01:02.52 | romulo | it loaded the qemu screen and made the boot proccess, now im stuck on initial screen |
| 01:02.57 | romulo | any button i click does nothing but highlight |
| 01:05.51 | *** join/#openmoko euud (n=chatzill@60-249-99-148.HINET-IP.hinet.net) |
| 01:06.39 | romulo | can anyone help me to setup this? i just ordered my freerunner today and i would like to giv the interface a welcome :P |
| 01:10.06 | *** join/#openmoko swc|666 (n=swc|666@unaffiliated/swc666/x-4934821) |
| 01:19.54 | *** join/#openmoko pea (n=pea@adsl-75-58-4-163.dsl.dytnoh.sbcglobal.net) |
| 01:21.21 | CIA-22 | openmoko: 03zecke 07org.openmoko.dev * r6789bff83933 10/packages/tasks/ (task-openmoko-asu.bb task-openmoko-basic.bb): [tasks] connman plugin packages got renamed, catch up |
| 01:21.22 | CIA-22 | openmoko: 03zecke 07org.openmoko.dev * re21125fe5948 10/ (2 files in 2 dirs): [misc] Use ln -sf to overwrite an existing link |
| 01:21.59 | *** join/#openmoko weiles (n=quassel@HSI-KBW-085-216-094-061.hsi.kabelbw.de) |
| 01:22.54 | MnemonicPunk | Good night. =) |
| 01:23.48 | *** join/#openmoko HellDragon (n=jd@modemcable100.136-203-24.mc.videotron.ca) |
| 01:40.01 | *** join/#openmoko mickey|tw|zzZZzz (n=mickey@118-166-64-239.dynamic.hinet.net) |
| 01:44.14 | *** join/#openmoko ChandleWEi (n=chandle@210.13.121.62) |
| 01:44.19 | *** part/#openmoko ChandleWEi (n=chandle@210.13.121.62) |
| 02:00.46 | *** join/#openmoko Torikun (n=rusher@astound-69-42-18-131.ca.astound.net) |
| 02:02.41 | *** join/#openmoko rddDavid51 (n=roudoudo@gar31-1-82-224-8-235.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 02:03.15 | *** join/#openmoko dougt (n=dougt@c-67-180-69-46.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 02:07.31 | *** join/#openmoko uhsf (n=uhsf@modemcable009.150-57-74.mc.videotron.ca) |
| 02:15.29 | *** join/#openmoko daMaestro (n=jon@fedora/damaestro) |
| 02:23.06 | *** join/#openmoko malik1972 (n=malik197@e182059107.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 02:27.01 | *** join/#openmoko j_ack_ (n=rudi@dsbg-4db5f9a9.pool.einsundeins.de) |
| 02:29.15 | *** join/#openmoko daMaestro (n=jon@fedora/damaestro) |
| 02:29.49 | *** join/#openmoko mgregson (n=mgregson@129-97-136-247.uwaterloo.ca) |
| 02:38.32 | *** join/#openmoko charlie137 (n=charlie@firewall.tw.openmoko.org) |
| 02:45.39 | *** join/#openmoko neldoreth (n=ascot@unixboard/users/neldoreth) |
| 02:51.27 | *** part/#openmoko alphabeat (n=nick@60-241-37-3.static.tpgi.com.au) |
| 02:51.58 | *** join/#openmoko bengo (n=bengo@118.130.253.251) |
| 02:52.23 | *** part/#openmoko bengo (n=bengo@118.130.253.251) |
| 03:00.25 | *** join/#openmoko Sargun (n=Sargun@atarack/staff/sargun) |
| 03:12.14 | *** join/#openmoko behdad (n=behdad@CPE001217b19226-CM0012c9c84bc4.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 03:13.03 | *** join/#openmoko mickey|tw (n=mickey@firewall.tw.openmoko.org) |
| 03:15.44 | *** join/#openmoko swc|666 (n=swc|666@unaffiliated/swc666/x-4934821) |
| 03:21.47 | *** join/#openmoko prjktdtnt (n=trash@67-93-61-132.lcc.clearwire-dns.net) |
| 03:21.59 | *** join/#openmoko dTx (n=user@adsl-69-148-205-169.dsl.okcyok.swbell.net) |
| 03:23.06 | *** part/#openmoko dTx (n=user@adsl-69-148-205-169.dsl.okcyok.swbell.net) |
| 03:30.24 | *** join/#openmoko alphabeat (n=nick@123-243-190-207.static.tpgi.com.au) |
| 03:37.41 | *** join/#openmoko jitu3485 (n=jitender@61.16.248.242) |
| 03:53.48 | *** join/#openmoko aggtrfrad (n=unkbnoj@CPE001cf0eb9434-CM0018c0d9db72.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 03:54.24 | *** join/#openmoko icman (n=icman@123-240-172-254.cctv.dynamic.lsc.net.tw) |
| 03:57.59 | *** join/#openmoko datenmaulwurf (n=datenmau@e178148136.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 03:58.34 | *** join/#openmoko christooss (n=matic@BSN-95-237-32.dial-up.dsl.siol.net) |
| 04:02.40 | *** join/#openmoko BlackBsd (n=brian@72.168.193.117) |
| 04:14.39 | *** join/#openmoko u_l-lap (n=clinton@cpe-024-211-230-216.nc.res.rr.com) |
| 04:16.57 | L84supper | I still can't find a link to the schematic capture or pcb layout files, is this available anywhere? |
| 04:22.34 | *** join/#openmoko lawnjart (n=scsh@pool-72-87-42-8.ptldor.fios.verizon.net) |
| 04:23.17 | fredrin | What's the most dangerous that could happen if the GSM firmware was reversenginered? |
| 04:26.02 | rooly | hmm...possibly hack a tower, maybe the network if you're good |
| 04:26.14 | SpeedEvil | hack - no |
| 04:26.37 | SpeedEvil | freelock: if you make handset-handset link using one channel, you wipe out 16 users of that channel that are talking to the tower. |
| 04:26.50 | SpeedEvil | fredrin: some of which may be on emergency calls |
| 04:27.31 | SpeedEvil | That's even without 'hacking' - just unauthorised use. |
| 04:27.41 | rooly | hence the illegal part... |
| 04:27.57 | rooly | also why networks are encrypted |
| 04:28.13 | SpeedEvil | Encryption is not really the problem. |
| 04:28.25 | SpeedEvil | Wireless comms is essentially broadcast. |
| 04:28.30 | SpeedEvil | Everyone recieves it. |
| 04:28.50 | SpeedEvil | Cellphones work so well because they coordinate so that only one is transmitting at once on any channel. |
| 04:29.06 | SpeedEvil | (in a given range) |
| 04:30.21 | *** join/#openmoko DocScrutinizer (n=jr@p5493CC84.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 04:31.07 | jitu3485 | can I add a custom library in moko build ? if yes how? |
| 04:32.18 | lindi- | jitu3485: maybe you need to write bitbake recipe for it? |
| 04:33.42 | DocScrutinizer | L84supper: http://www.openmoko.com/download-schematics.html |
| 04:34.22 | L84supper | those are only pdf's |
| 04:35.15 | jitu3485 | lindi-, then make build-package-<my_package> ? |
| 04:35.23 | DocScrutinizer | L84supper: that's all you may get |
| 04:35.29 | ieatlint | L84supper, try look on that link on the left side of the screen |
| 04:35.37 | ieatlint | ahemcadahem |
| 04:36.16 | L84supper | DocScrutinizer: is there a hidden link to the CAD files for schematic and PCB? any gebrber output or tool fil |
| 04:36.27 | L84supper | tool files, excellon? |
| 04:36.42 | DocScrutinizer | nope, we won't publish gerber |
| 04:37.12 | L84supper | so I'd have to generate my own and then create an openermoko site |
| 04:38.03 | DocScrutinizer | go ahead. I don't see why you would need them anyway, except to build your own FR, and then sell it 5$ less than OM |
| 04:38.13 | L84supper | VIA is the same way with their open notebook design, mechanical cad for enclosure, no schematic capture or pcb files in the wild |
| 04:38.36 | DocScrutinizer | FTW is a schematic caprure? |
| 04:38.48 | SpeedEvil | schematic in a usable form |
| 04:39.07 | DocScrutinizer | use for WHAT? |
| 04:39.08 | SpeedEvil | with the PDF, you have to enter it into a package to say which pin is connected to which before you can make a board. |
| 04:39.27 | L84supper | well, its to do mods of the freerunner a couple weeks faster |
| 04:39.32 | SpeedEvil | with a schematic loaded in a schematic editor, you can easily change the circuit. |
| 04:39.39 | DocScrutinizer | exactly. We sell the boards, you don't need to make them yourself ;-) |
| 04:39.49 | SpeedEvil | L84supper: I would not assume that the FR boards are copyright free. |
| 04:39.55 | SpeedEvil | FR design |
| 04:40.45 | *** join/#openmoko chomwitt (n=chomwitt@adsl64-90.ath.forthnet.gr) |
| 04:40.51 | L84supper | hmm almost-openmoko (runs to trademark office) |
| 04:41.19 | DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvil: exactly. FR is IP of OM. Publishing schem doesn't mean we want to see some chinese carbon copy of FR |
| 04:41.27 | rooly | anyone know of very light screen-draw capable applications? |
| 04:41.35 | rooly | or will i have to make my own |
| 04:44.47 | DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvil: you can change the schematics, not the actual circuit. A small difference, but the reason we don't plan to publish project files. You don't need them if you use FR the way we like it |
| 04:45.13 | L84supper | some of the coreboot devs were talking up this project, didn't realize it's turning into what happened with the XO/olpc |
| 04:47.02 | *** join/#openmoko froksen (n=froksen@87.54.254.190) |
| 04:48.16 | *** join/#openmoko slaxxin (n=brian@ip70-178-27-23.ks.ks.cox.net) |
| 04:48.19 | slaxxin | Nokia last week told delegates at a technology conference the next version of its Linux maemo software will give devices access to 3G networks, while it also upgraded its membership in the Linux Foundation to gold level |
| 04:48.29 | *** join/#openmoko dwb (n=david@pdpc/supporter/active/dwb) |
| 04:49.36 | *** join/#openmoko soman (n=somnath@61.16.248.242) |
| 04:49.56 | *** join/#openmoko tholin (n=tholin@c-a264e455.04-302-6c6b701.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se) |
| 04:50.10 | slaxxin | symbian owns 1/2 of the cell market an nohia is fixing to open source it Y A Y |
| 04:50.46 | DocScrutinizer | slaxxin: I think there should be some *HW* to enable 3G-access for N8x0 tablets. SW enable 3G access just sounds like a simple 2 AT commands via BT to the coupled phone |
| 04:53.47 | *** join/#openmoko unknown_lamer (n=clinton@cpe-024-211-230-216.nc.res.rr.com) |
| 04:53.55 | DocScrutinizer | slaxxin: btw, I got me a N810 this week, to compare some of the HW details, and get some inspiration for next OM products. Really, a smart pile of chips! Lovely :-) |
| 04:57.02 | DocScrutinizer | Anyway TTFF for GPS is ~15..40min. Same issue as with FR: need to download efem/alm first ;-) |
| 05:02.00 | *** join/#openmoko ArteK_Work (n=Miranda@80.50.33.246) |
| 05:03.08 | *** join/#openmoko chomwitt_ (n=chomwitt@adsl95-147.ath.forthnet.gr) |
| 05:10.21 | *** join/#openmoko GiggleLoop (n=loop@dogbert.linux-frickler.de) |
| 05:10.56 | GiggleLoop | g'morning |
| 05:14.21 | *** join/#openmoko arquebus (n=shintaro@201.148.56.4) |
| 05:15.01 | *** join/#openmoko arzej (n=user@avr170.internetdsl.tpnet.pl) |
| 05:16.50 | *** join/#openmoko FxChiP (n=FxChiP@75.32.72.27) |
| 05:21.22 | *** join/#openmoko tedo (n=cta@HSI-KBW-091-089-240-002.hsi2.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de) |
| 05:28.05 | *** join/#openmoko peter-b (n=peter_b@p54978754.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 05:32.30 | CIA-22 | openmoko: 03olv 07org.openmoko.dev * ra57d265ce1d3 10/ (4 files in 3 dirs): [diversity-daemon] Bump up the revision to 571. |
| 05:34.18 | *** part/#openmoko tedo (n=cta@HSI-KBW-091-089-240-002.hsi2.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de) |
| 05:42.50 | *** join/#openmoko maddy (n=qvantel@61.16.248.242) |
| 05:44.36 | CIA-22 | openmoko: 03olv 07org.openmoko.dev * raf367cd54691 10/conf/distro/include/sane-srcrevs.inc: [om-locations] Bump up to 5e6efbac816c3a7ab7846e06b27f176325e1562f. |
| 05:44.56 | *** join/#openmoko Toriku1 (n=rusher@astound-69-42-18-131.ca.astound.net) |
| 05:54.32 | *** join/#openmoko icman (n=icman@123-240-172-254.cctv.dynamic.lsc.net.tw) |
| 05:56.34 | *** join/#openmoko rob_w (n=bob@Mbf8d.m.pppool.de) |
| 06:05.20 | *** join/#openmoko ljp_ (n=lpotter@218.185.108.156) |
| 06:06.14 | *** join/#openmoko MnemonicPunk (n=atlantis@dslb-084-060-035-185.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 06:07.09 | MnemonicPunk | Good morning. =) I just installed Openmoko 2008.8 on my phone. Is it normal for the first boot to take a while? |
| 06:08.43 | raster | all boots take a while |
| 06:09.34 | MnemonicPunk | I think it crashed. =( After the "Booting..." went to 100%, the screen with what looks like a cursor in the upper left corner but nothing is happening. |
| 06:10.30 | ljp_ | first boot after a flash takes longer than other boots, as it configures things like dropbear keys |
| 06:10.51 | raster | those damn dropbears |
| 06:10.59 | raster | poor tourists dont have a chance |
| 06:11.19 | MnemonicPunk | But it does that configuring with an empty, black screen? o.o |
| 06:11.21 | FxChiP | What the heck's a dropbear? |
| 06:12.01 | MnemonicPunk | (I didn't flash it but installed it to SD o.o) |
| 06:12.06 | *** join/#openmoko geaaru (n=geaaru@host108-34-dynamic.40-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 06:12.21 | *** join/#openmoko pleemans (n=toi@212-123-1-140.iFiber.telenet-ops.be) |
| 06:14.07 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: 03jluebbe 07framework * r23fbc817c8c7 10/ (conf/example/frameworkd.conf framework/persist.py): frameworkd: add simple persistance module |
| 06:14.53 | *** join/#openmoko Rakshasa (n=rakshasa@a88-115-100-238.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 06:15.14 | MnemonicPunk | I'm not using a freerunner. Maybe that's the reason? =( Older image from 2007.12 worked well. |
| 06:16.30 | *** part/#openmoko arquebus (n=shintaro@201.148.56.4) |
| 06:16.31 | *** join/#openmoko gatestone (n=app@wlan.telis.fi) |
| 06:17.11 | *** join/#openmoko nite613 (n=chris@i216-58-80-207.cybersurf.com) |
| 06:17.24 | *** join/#openmoko yabo (i=d9c73682@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-98b14b12b310d49f) |
| 06:17.39 | *** join/#openmoko BDo (n=bdonnett@linagoraberri.pck.nerim.net) |
| 06:18.08 | *** join/#openmoko |FiLiP| (n=filip@d5152E303.access.telenet.be) |
| 06:19.07 | *** join/#openmoko KenSentMe (n=jeroen@213-132-206-101.adsl.nlhosting.nl) |
| 06:19.28 | FxChiP | raster, why'd you leave teh OpenMoko? :( |
| 06:20.17 | raster | mainly professional company-structure/agreement related |
| 06:24.06 | *** join/#openmoko HauDyr (n=kim@wnn73219.wireless.dtu.dk) |
| 06:26.41 | lindi- | jitu3485: i don't remember those by heart sorry |
| 06:26.54 | jitu3485 | ok |
| 06:28.24 | *** join/#openmoko woxz (i=d2ca1087@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-65b14b0de2f4857b) |
| 06:28.43 | MnemonicPunk | Giving the FSO Milestone 3 a try now. =) |
| 06:32.02 | *** join/#openmoko Infinyte (n=Infinyte@66-146-252-212.gtmc.net) |
| 06:32.05 | *** part/#openmoko Infinyte (n=Infinyte@66-146-252-212.gtmc.net) |
| 06:34.13 | *** join/#openmoko dneary_ (n=dneary@mne69-9-88-163-116-163.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 06:35.01 | GiggleLoop | mmh... can I somehow put FSO M3 to sleep (suspend)? |
| 06:35.22 | *** join/#openmoko max_posedon (n=max_pose@212.98.171.13) |
| 06:39.00 | lindi- | GiggleLoop: do you know python? |
| 06:40.59 | *** join/#openmoko doc|home (n=doc@gentoo/contributor/doc-007) |
| 06:42.12 | *** join/#openmoko trickie (n=trickie@a5061.upc-a.chello.nl) |
| 06:43.33 | *** join/#openmoko dneary (n=dneary@mne69-9-88-163-116-163.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 06:52.00 | *** join/#openmoko zipo (n=zipo@chello089076197077.chello.pl) |
| 06:52.06 | *** join/#openmoko nataraj (n=nataraj@121.246.244.166) |
| 06:52.11 | nataraj | hi |
| 06:52.29 | nataraj | Any body from India whos using FreeRunner? |
| 06:52.41 | *** join/#openmoko bentob0x (n=laurent@ip-213-49-80-173.dsl.scarlet.be) |
| 06:53.17 | nataraj | does FreeRunner have normal Ethernet? |
| 06:54.08 | nataraj | how do i see the logs? |
| 06:54.58 | max_posedon | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Getting_Started_with_your_Neo_FreeRunner |
| 06:58.11 | *** join/#openmoko dracozna (i=thomas@cc408686-b.leek1.gr.home.nl) |
| 07:03.06 | *** part/#openmoko OdyX (n=OdyX@23-195.5-85.cust.bluewin.ch) |
| 07:03.09 | *** join/#openmoko OdyX (n=OdyX@23-195.5-85.cust.bluewin.ch) |
| 07:03.47 | *** join/#openmoko DPThought (n=tilli@mail.collax.com) |
| 07:14.51 | GiggleLoop | lindi-: sure. at least a bit... :) |
| 07:15.11 | nataraj | $399 price is a killer |
| 07:15.57 | nataraj | any way to get it under $200? |
| 07:16.06 | jitu3485 | hi I am building helloworld example (ref:http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Customizing_the_Openmoko_Distribution) on my latest asu build . it is throwing error, Error log: URL: http://rafb.net/p/tuvIEf74.html |
| 07:16.23 | GiggleLoop | lindi-: did a jabber-bot in python a while back... |
| 07:17.53 | *** join/#openmoko mbuf (n=user@61.16.248.242) |
| 07:20.23 | *** join/#openmoko vaiursch (n=erwin@vpn-global-dhcp3-173.ethz.ch) |
| 07:21.24 | *** join/#openmoko jitu3485 (n=jitender@61.16.248.242) |
| 07:21.46 | *** join/#openmoko caratorn (n=aratorn@tui75-3-88-168-237-15.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 07:23.45 | *** join/#openmoko cheng (n=cheng@141.76.49.20) |
| 07:23.53 | *** join/#openmoko rufus_ (n=rufus@c-98-226-41-174.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 07:24.35 | *** join/#openmoko Toutoug (n=ludovic_@tsf-wpa-1-117.epfl.ch) |
| 07:25.00 | *** join/#openmoko RedFlash (n=sog@217.221.131.126) |
| 07:25.10 | *** join/#openmoko ruxpin (n=pkunk@host-91-145-85-133.kpylaajakaista.net) |
| 07:32.00 | *** join/#openmoko pazante (n=patrik@user113.77-105-224.netatonce.net) |
| 07:35.34 | *** join/#openmoko El_Senator (n=El_Senat@wartburg.auh.dk) |
| 07:36.33 | *** join/#openmoko MrTuttle (n=hklein@66.187.227.198) |
| 07:38.12 | *** join/#openmoko jorutila (n=jorutila@vipunen.hut.fi) |
| 07:38.49 | Hopscotch | good morning |
| 07:39.43 | caratorn | hello, |
| 07:43.10 | *** join/#openmoko ken_ (n=user@84.92.70.37) |
| 07:44.35 | *** join/#openmoko erwin__ (n=erwin@guest-docking-nat-1-181.ethz.ch) |
| 07:48.07 | *** join/#openmoko khorben (n=khorben@nat/af83/x-97b140ff0d9e9f05) |
| 08:01.47 | *** join/#openmoko Kame2 (n=manuel@port-92-196-103-15.dynamic.qsc.de) |
| 08:02.27 | *** join/#openmoko Jamiro007 (n=javier_g@dslb-084-059-110-233.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 08:04.08 | *** join/#openmoko ruxpin_ (n=pkunk@195.148.225.17) |
| 08:05.39 | *** join/#openmoko max_posedon (n=max_pose@leased-line-250-127.telecom.by) |
| 08:05.43 | *** join/#openmoko jOERG_rw (n=jr@p5493CC84.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 08:06.07 | *** join/#openmoko Bubbi (n=Miranda@firewall.dwarf.dk) |
| 08:06.10 | *** join/#openmoko quickdev (n=quickdev@p5B057463.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 08:08.37 | *** join/#openmoko evolux (n=evolux@win4077.informatik.uni-wuerzburg.de) |
| 08:18.37 | *** join/#openmoko anno^da_ (n=anno^da@p5B07DDF1.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 08:23.11 | *** join/#openmoko yabo (i=d9c73682@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-87dd30f948e91070) |
| 08:23.20 | yabo | Hello |
| 08:24.13 | yabo | Python modules are all .py right, so if i copied the files from /Lib to /lib on my freerunner, some of them would work right? But how would that work with the extended modules (the c-wrappers)? |
| 08:24.14 | raster | muahahhaha! |
| 08:24.19 | raster | at last! |
| 08:24.28 | raster | <PROTECTED> |
| 08:24.30 | yabo | Oh and is there a package with the most common python-modules for the freerunner? |
| 08:24.48 | raster | ok |
| 08:24.53 | raster | time to lean this down and remove crap |
| 08:29.37 | *** join/#openmoko holycow (n=new@mail.wjsgroup.com) |
| 08:35.18 | *** join/#openmoko Gnutoo (n=gnutoo@host78-55-dynamic.24-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 08:38.05 | *** join/#openmoko t_s_o (n=tso@135.84-49-129.nextgentel.com) |
| 08:38.43 | *** join/#openmoko haakeyar (n=haakeyar@cB83A4BC1.dhcp.bluecom.no) |
| 08:41.37 | *** join/#openmoko balrog-kun (n=balrog@cky54.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl) |
| 08:44.02 | *** join/#openmoko unlotto (n=unlotto@ip114.rev112.brygge.net) |
| 08:47.07 | *** join/#openmoko maddy (n=qvantel@61.16.248.242) |
| 08:48.12 | caratorn | Does anyone know if it is possible to adjust the pressure to get a button press event on the freerunner? |
| 08:49.59 | *** join/#openmoko maddy (n=qvantel@61.16.248.242) |
| 08:50.13 | *** join/#openmoko Free_maN (n=Free_maN@83-157-172-231.rev.libertysurf.net) |
| 08:51.08 | *** join/#openmoko pooze (n=imo@62.70.2.252) |
| 08:51.30 | *** join/#openmoko ken_ (n=user@84.92.70.37) |
| 09:00.08 | *** join/#openmoko valos[fr] (n=valos@APuteaux-153-1-66-64.w81-249.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 09:03.11 | pooze | I have flashed my freerunner with 2008.8 a good while back, and lately I have seen no updates using opkg update && opkg upgrade |
| 09:03.39 | pooze | I assume this is because of the 2008.9 release, and that I'm probably using the wrong repositories to get these latest updates |
| 09:04.04 | pooze | can I just change the repositories, or do I need to reflash the phone? |
| 09:06.44 | *** join/#openmoko Tig|_ (n=tigger@82.153.215.237) |
| 09:07.02 | raster | caratorn: the touchscreen? |
| 09:07.37 | *** join/#openmoko swc|666 (n=swc|666@unaffiliated/swc666/x-4934821) |
| 09:08.05 | caratorn | raster: yes, is there a way for it not to generate button press all the time? |
| 09:08.25 | Gnutoo | hello, is dfu-util an official tool? |
| 09:08.52 | Tig|_ | Gnutoo: as far as I know yes |
| 09:08.53 | SpeedEvil | yes |
| 09:09.22 | raster | caratorn: no idea. i wish i knew how to make it more sensitve (needs less pressure to get/keep a press) |
| 09:09.23 | Gnutoo | so if i bugreport to the openmoko bugreporting system it will be ok |
| 09:09.26 | Gnutoo | thanks |
| 09:10.27 | *** join/#openmoko PBeck (n=PBeck@HSI-KBW-091-089-092-154.hsi2.kabelbw.de) |
| 09:10.45 | PBeck | ahoi |
| 09:10.47 | pooze | can I from 2008.8 just use 2008.9 repositories to get the lastest updates? |
| 09:11.19 | caratorn | raster: Using the Xlib when dragging the finger around it generates lots of button press/release for me |
| 09:14.00 | raster | same |
| 09:14.07 | raster | and tis damn annoying |
| 09:14.17 | raster | it makes usoing the ts reliably for dragging stuff very hard |
| 09:14.33 | *** part/#openmoko alphabeat (n=nick@123-243-190-207.static.tpgi.com.au) |
| 09:15.00 | caratorn | is it soft or hardware related? |
| 09:17.55 | *** join/#openmoko dwb (n=david@pdpc/supporter/active/dwb) |
| 09:18.23 | raster | i think hardware |
| 09:18.48 | raster | itds a pressure ts. so u need a certain amount of pressure on a point to get it to regitser current "ie a touch" |
| 09:19.02 | raster | if its a stylus its easy - all mass is concentrated on a small point |
| 09:19.06 | raster | if its the flat of yoru finger |
| 09:19.12 | raster | all pressure is spread acorss your finger |
| 09:19.22 | raster | and your finger is also soft and so absorbs the pressure too |
| 09:19.58 | caratorn | yes, there is no problem with a stylus |
| 09:20.07 | raster | yup |
| 09:20.23 | SpeedEvil | Anyway - there is an easy fix. |
| 09:20.39 | SpeedEvil | passes caratorn a pencil sharpener. |
| 09:20.47 | raster | sharp fingers! |
| 09:20.56 | raster | i tend to use my fingernail |
| 09:21.03 | SpeedEvil | Me too. |
| 09:21.07 | raster | though i do test the keyboard with both fingernail and flat of giner |
| 09:21.12 | raster | its working nicely these days... |
| 09:21.21 | raster | i now have my own images |
| 09:21.23 | raster | MUHAHAHAHHA |
| 09:21.27 | caratorn | SpeedEvil: I'd rather pass on that! |
| 09:21.44 | raster | <PROTECTED> |
| 09:21.54 | raster | cackles |
| 09:21.57 | mjr | hmh, I don't find at least the screensaver drag from 2007.2 difficult to do with a finger, but ymmv... |
| 09:22.20 | caratorn | btw, is there a way to make an input window size not to take all the screen width? |
| 09:22.45 | raster | caratorn: no - thats just display policy |
| 09:22.51 | raster | all windwos are forced to screen width |
| 09:23.00 | caratorn | aargh |
| 09:23.12 | caratorn | why is that? |
| 09:25.15 | raster | just decided to make it so |
| 09:26.08 | caratorn | and we can't center it or move it to the right corner? |
| 09:26.23 | raster | could |
| 09:26.32 | raster | but that just isnt what the code does |
| 09:26.36 | raster | :) |
| 09:26.57 | caratorn | is illume reponsible for that? |
| 09:26.58 | raster | dialgo windows get a titlebar and their hight can be limited by minimum height of window |
| 09:27.02 | *** join/#openmoko max_posedon (n=max_pose@leased-line-250-127.telecom.by) |
| 09:27.06 | raster | width is always maximum width (screen) |
| 09:27.07 | raster | yes |
| 09:27.15 | raster | its just what the layout manager code policy does |
| 09:27.41 | *** join/#openmoko Proton23 (n=proton@p57BA774C.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 09:27.41 | OdyX | ? |
| 09:27.41 | raster | illume is just a module for e that hooks into the layout border hooks and enforces a policy |
| 09:27.51 | raster | that policy just happens to have no config options |
| 09:29.31 | caratorn | but it'd be feasable |
| 09:29.50 | *** join/#openmoko Microtechno (n=ubergeek@219-90-248-29.ip.adam.com.au) |
| 09:30.08 | raster | yes - easily |
| 09:30.29 | raster | but right now i need to get e's existing config options (that make sense) usable in their existing dialogs |
| 09:30.36 | raster | then i can worry about adding more and more |
| 09:30.46 | raster | i'm all for more config options when they are wanted/needed |
| 09:30.50 | raster | (it makes sense) |
| 09:31.04 | raster | ie "force dialogs to be maximised" could be one |
| 09:31.12 | caratorn | good to know |
| 09:31.12 | raster | another to "maximise only horizontally" |
| 09:31.22 | raster | or "provide dialog border for dialogs" |
| 09:31.23 | raster | etc. etc. |
| 09:31.28 | raster | all of these could be options |
| 09:31.33 | raster | not hard at all |
| 09:31.44 | raster | the TOUGH part is how to show these options to users |
| 09:31.53 | raster | i have lots of config dialogs in e and illume |
| 09:31.56 | raster | 50+ dialogs |
| 09:32.01 | raster | but most dont fit on the screen |
| 09:32.02 | raster | too big |
| 09:32.08 | raster | due to high dpi and small size |
| 09:32.12 | raster | so i need a way to make them fit |
| 09:32.19 | raster | and not have to always go re-design/re-code the dialogs |
| 09:32.22 | raster | have it "automatic" |
| 09:32.29 | raster | so the dialogs auto-re-arrange themselves |
| 09:32.37 | raster | ... maybe thats just too much of a dream? |
| 09:32.46 | ieatlint | beer is alcoholic |
| 09:32.50 | *** join/#openmoko tschaka (n=tschaka@p5B0EA4EE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 09:36.25 | caratorn | raster: thank you, see you later |
| 09:36.54 | raster | oh this is so much nicer |
| 09:36.56 | lindi- | GiggleLoop: if you grep SUSPEND from the zhone source you can find the place were it handles suspend |
| 09:36.57 | raster | with a custom image |
| 09:37.06 | raster | so much less "cruft" on it |
| 09:38.32 | ieatlint | "cruft"? |
| 09:38.39 | ieatlint | that weird aussie slang? |
| 09:38.46 | raster | "crap" |
| 09:38.47 | raster | "shit" |
| 09:38.56 | raster | "old musty shit in the attic" |
| 09:39.00 | raster | == cruft |
| 09:39.01 | ieatlint | ack, my virgin eyes |
| 09:39.18 | pooze | I have flashed my phone with 2008.8, can I just change repositories to get the 2008.9 updates? |
| 09:39.24 | raster | man actually.. e/illume is much faster on this build... |
| 09:40.10 | ieatlint | i learnt that edje_editor is vaguely nice, except that it lacks a lot of edje features, and produces edj files 10x the size of edc files |
| 09:42.45 | raster | yea |
| 09:42.49 | raster | far from perfect |
| 09:43.16 | raster | but can get u started |
| 09:43.16 | ieatlint | either way, even though i keep harassing you, i am still impressed with e :) |
| 09:43.27 | raster | edje in svn also has python scripts that conver gimp .xcf's |
| 09:43.37 | raster | and inkscape .svg's to .edc |
| 09:43.57 | ieatlint | interesting... i'm on gentoo using the edje svn, but i haven't touched any of that |
| 09:49.34 | *** join/#openmoko atul (n=Atul@61.16.248.242) |
| 09:55.21 | *** join/#openmoko bricode (n=bricode@200.122.185.24) |
| 09:56.21 | *** join/#openmoko hipitihop (n=denis@97.91.221.203.static.comindico.com.au) |
| 09:56.42 | hipitihop | waves to the residents |
| 09:58.34 | hipitihop | I no longer seem to be able to boot from SD. I had prepared 2008.9 and it fails to boot, simply returns to u-boot and any subsequent option off the menu causes error, even "power off" I have even tried this with another SD card which previously booted fine. Can someone suggest what may be wrong ? |
| 10:01.50 | *** join/#openmoko bricode_ (n=bricode@200.122.185.24) |
| 10:01.54 | *** join/#openmoko MarcOChapeau (n=mbarre@bgn92-4-82-238-213-101.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 10:01.59 | raster | ieatlint: check them out. went in recently |
| 10:05.32 | ieatlint | will do ... tomorrow, when i actually sober up |
| 10:05.45 | ieatlint | i'm presently beyond the ballmer peak |
| 10:06.31 | Gnutoo | hello, how do i download a pdf with midori...and view it offline with evince? |
| 10:06.53 | *** join/#openmoko mbuf (n=user@61.16.248.242) |
| 10:11.33 | *** join/#openmoko andrenarchy (n=andrenar@dslb-088-065-092-013.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 10:13.23 | pooze | do I need to reflash the phone from 2008.8 to 2008.9 to get the updates, or is it enough to update the repositories in /etc/opkg ? |
| 10:14.45 | *** join/#openmoko igor321 (n=igor@134-79.dsl.iskon.hr) |
| 10:15.31 | *** join/#openmoko Varox (n=Varox@p4FD45BCD.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 10:18.37 | pooze | where would the people suggest I look for the answer to my previous question? I can't seem to find it on the wiki. |
| 10:19.51 | *** join/#openmoko cheesy (n=cheesy30@mnch-5d87b0da.pool.einsundeins.de) |
| 10:24.09 | *** join/#openmoko ritz (n=ritesh@123.236.160.233) |
| 10:25.16 | *** join/#openmoko Stroller (n=Stroller@213-152-39-89.dsl.eclipse.net.uk) |
| 10:29.07 | *** join/#openmoko cgerum1 (i=christop@vpn2775.extern.uni-tuebingen.de) |
| 10:30.10 | *** join/#openmoko mickey|tw (n=mickey@firewall.tw.openmoko.org) |
| 10:30.31 | *** join/#openmoko Ghiottone (n=ale@213.158.72.21) |
| 10:33.47 | Gnutoo | pooze, i don't know the ansewr but mabe look at the mailing lists...i've tried to upgrade it but it ran out of space... |
| 10:33.55 | Gnutoo | so at the end i flashed |
| 10:34.33 | *** join/#openmoko dwb (n=david@pdpc/supporter/active/dwb) |
| 10:36.16 | *** join/#openmoko ritz (n=ritesh@123.236.160.233) |
| 10:37.21 | *** part/#openmoko cgerum1 (i=christop@vpn2775.extern.uni-tuebingen.de) |
| 10:37.33 | pooze | thanks for the answer Gnutoo. |
| 10:38.05 | *** join/#openmoko polz (n=polz@ecg.fri.uni-lj.si) |
| 10:38.32 | ieatlint | plus whiskey is good |
| 10:40.57 | *** join/#openmoko dario_ (n=dario@81-208-91-225.ip.fastwebnet.it) |
| 10:43.22 | *** join/#openmoko mrmoku (n=mok@ppp-93-104-114-147.dynamic.mnet-online.de) |
| 10:48.15 | *** join/#openmoko haakeyar (n=haakeyar@cB83A4BC1.dhcp.bluecom.no) |
| 10:51.11 | *** join/#openmoko Varox (n=Varox@p4FD45BCD.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 10:52.06 | *** join/#openmoko guerby (n=guerby@227.174.71-86.rev.gaoland.net) |
| 10:53.56 | *** join/#openmoko dns53 (n=dns@ppp246-215.static.internode.on.net) |
| 11:08.22 | *** join/#openmoko MnemonicPunk (n=atlantis@dslb-084-060-035-185.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 11:09.06 | GiggleLoop | lindi-: thanks. I will have a look. |
| 11:09.54 | MnemonicPunk | I heard something about Debian images for mobile phones. Could someone link me to those? =) |
| 11:10.16 | lindi- | MnemonicPunk: use the installer, i don't fancy the whole concept of images :) |
| 11:10.46 | MnemonicPunk | Problem is I don't have a native linux phone. ^^ So I don't think I can use the installer. |
| 11:11.04 | MnemonicPunk | (WinCE Q_Q But got my oen kernel compiled and running) |
| 11:11.52 | lindi- | MnemonicPunk: just debootstrap your debian on another machine? |
| 11:11.52 | MnemonicPunk | Sorry in case you only want freerunner users asking here. o.o |
| 11:12.27 | MnemonicPunk | lindi-: Is there some tutorial I could follow for that? |
| 11:13.31 | lindi- | MnemonicPunk: the manual page even has examples |
| 11:13.53 | lindi- | MnemonicPunk: just ask if you hit problems |
| 11:14.28 | MnemonicPunk | Okay, thanks, I'll try that. =) |
| 11:16.22 | MnemonicPunk | I can just boot to ubuntu and tell it to debootstrap an armel Ubuntu? o.o That rocks. |
| 11:16.29 | *** join/#openmoko bumbl (n=bumbl@91-113-122-94.adsl.highway.telekom.at) |
| 11:17.22 | *** join/#openmoko vaiursch (n=erwin@vpn-global-012-dhcp.ethz.ch) |
| 11:18.24 | *** join/#openmoko lynx (n=u@31-123-204-62-pool.dsl.fcom.ch) |
| 11:21.12 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: 03charlie 07framework * ra021eb82e985 10/ (3 files in 3 dirs): (log message trimmed) |
| 11:21.12 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: tasklet: Modifications to the tasklet module |
| 11:21.12 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: * added the tasklet decorator |
| 11:21.12 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: * generator function need to be explicitely specified as a keyword argument in Tasklet.__init__ |
| 11:21.13 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: * added Tasklet.start_dbus method, that connect to dbus compliant callback methods |
| 11:21.17 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: * added the WaitFunc tasklet (useful to connect a tasklet to a function that take callback arguments) |
| 11:21.20 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: * added the Sleep tasklet (useful for testing) |
| 11:21.22 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: 03charlie 07framework * r44c22c845d6c 10/framework/ (3 files in 3 dirs): ousaged: Enable and Disable are now asynchronous, using tasklet module to make things simpler. |
| 11:21.25 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: 03charlie 07framework * rb5c541af8694 10/tests/ousaged.py: tests: updated ousaged test suite |
| 11:23.16 | *** join/#openmoko MnemonicPunk (n=atlantis@dslb-084-060-035-185.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 11:28.44 | *** join/#openmoko bernt (n=bernt@dslb-084-061-208-189.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 11:30.24 | MnemonicPunk | Can I just use an older Openmoko to boot my phone and finish the second part of the installation? |
| 11:33.39 | *** join/#openmoko HauDyr (n=kim@wnn73219.wireless.dtu.dk) |
| 11:33.50 | *** join/#openmoko xMDKx (n=mdkcore@nat/mandriva/x-9215964950689e9c) |
| 11:34.08 | lindi- | MnemonicPunk: hmm? you can do --second-stage under qemu |
| 11:35.04 | MnemonicPunk | Okay, that appears to be easier. =) |
| 11:35.05 | *** join/#openmoko pwerken (n=pwerken@a-eskwadraat.nl) |
| 11:39.48 | *** join/#openmoko fredrin (n=workingn@190.19.153.33) |
| 11:40.10 | *** join/#openmoko emonkey (n=emonkey@edu-34.92.zhaw.ch) |
| 11:46.05 | *** join/#openmoko edistar_ (n=edistar@ip503ddd09.speed.planet.nl) |
| 11:51.08 | *** join/#openmoko bumbl_ (n=bumbl@91-113-63-218.adsl.highway.telekom.at) |
| 11:52.21 | *** join/#openmoko Shlee (n=MrShlee@114-30-98-165.ip.adam.com.au) |
| 11:56.29 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: 03jluebbe 07framework * r2c4c01d5de49 10/framework/subsystems/ogsmd/modems/sierra/channel.py: ogsmd.sierra: switch to PDU mode for SMS |
| 11:56.39 | *** join/#openmoko mazzen (n=mortel@vpn-ce242144.extern.uni-duisburg-essen.de) |
| 11:59.48 | *** join/#openmoko gregdude (n=imreh@alxp91.physics.ox.ac.uk) |
| 12:00.23 | *** join/#openmoko kth5 (n=kth5@edge.smeet.de) |
| 12:02.42 | *** join/#openmoko nite613 (n=chris@i216-58-80-207.cybersurf.com) |
| 12:03.58 | *** join/#openmoko dolf1074 (n=chatzill@78-20-186-137.access.telenet.be) |
| 15:08.32 | *** join/#openmoko apt (i=ibot@pdpc/supporter/active/TimRiker/bot/apt) |
| 15:08.32 | *** topic/#openmoko is Developers, please join #openmoko-cdevel | Freerunner is in stock in some resellers. | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Quickstart | See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/GPS_Problems | Keyboard numbers for 2008.8 : slide finger up on the keyboard |
| 15:09.30 | lindi- | MnemonicPunk: hmm |
| 15:09.42 | lindi- | MnemonicPunk: what does lspci inside qemu say? |
| 15:09.52 | MnemonicPunk | "command not found" |
| 15:09.58 | lindi- | MnemonicPunk: well, install it :) |
| 15:10.08 | MnemonicPunk | *sigh* How? Q_Q |
| 15:10.14 | *** join/#openmoko rufus_ (n=rufus@c-98-226-41-174.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 15:10.52 | MnemonicPunk | Manual download with x86 and then put it in the image? |
| 15:11.19 | lindi- | MnemonicPunk: for example, or experiment first with some livecd |
| 15:12.38 | MnemonicPunk | Hm. |
| 15:12.43 | uhsf | you ain't no punk, you punk |
| 15:13.05 | MnemonicPunk | There's no interface tap0 on the x86. Guess I missed something there. |
| 15:14.55 | *** join/#openmoko aloril (n=aloril@dsl-tkubrasgw1-fe25fa00-28.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 15:17.51 | MnemonicPunk | Alright, got internet working in qemu. =) |
| 15:19.19 | *** join/#openmoko apol (n=apol@xsftbnupc02.upc.es) |
| 15:19.30 | MnemonicPunk | At least I thought I did. |
| 15:21.07 | MnemonicPunk | I can hot-plug eth0 now, though. And ping the gateway address from there. =) |
| 15:21.28 | MnemonicPunk | The gateway IP has to be the x86 IP? |
| 15:22.06 | *** join/#openmoko IXian-probe (n=Anonymou@179.80-203-95.nextgentel.com) |
| 15:22.48 | max_posedon | hm, no |
| 15:23.05 | max_posedon | if you bridget, it might be your regular default gw |
| 15:24.43 | *** join/#openmoko lesouvage (n=lesouvag@cc341200-a.assen1.dr.home.nl) |
| 15:24.52 | *** join/#openmoko Wiedi (n=wiedi@newton-air.w.fruky.net) |
| 15:26.01 | *** join/#openmoko tedo (n=cta@HSI-KBW-091-089-003-002.hsi2.kabelbw.de) |
| 15:27.35 | lesouvage | I have a wlan connection (at least the icon is there) but when "updating all" i got e message " error cannot access repository, Please check your network" what should I check on the network? |
| 15:28.13 | max_posedon | You should begin from checking dns, and ping google.com from terminal. |
| 15:30.04 | lesouvage | btw: gps seem to be working. A red spot was covering the whole netherlands to show that that was my location ;-) |
| 15:30.56 | *** join/#openmoko khorben (n=dont@port-83-236-217-161.static.qsc.de) |
| 15:31.30 | *** join/#openmoko xzcvczx (n=simon@gentoo/user/xzcvczx) |
| 15:32.08 | xzcvczx | is wiki.om working or anyone? |
| 15:32.31 | *** join/#openmoko IXian-pr1be (n=Anonymou@179.80-203-95.nextgentel.com) |
| 15:32.53 | *** part/#openmoko Torikun (n=rusher@67.112.215.16) |
| 15:34.21 | xzcvczx | s/or/for/ |
| 15:34.23 | *** join/#openmoko anno^da_ (n=anno^da@p5B07DDF1.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 15:34.41 | xzcvczx | apt: shutup you useless bot |
| 15:38.50 | *** part/#openmoko Toutoug (n=ludovic_@tsf-wpa-1-117.epfl.ch) |
| 15:39.02 | izzyb | looks like its down for me too :( |
| 15:39.26 | *** join/#openmoko Toutoug (n=ludovic_@tsf-wpa-1-117.epfl.ch) |
| 15:39.42 | xzcvczx | izzyb: ah ok, thanks. |
| 15:40.12 | izzyb | hopes it's back up soon |
| 15:40.24 | xzcvczx | agrees |
| 15:43.04 | *** join/#openmoko hama (n=hama@p5084F7C1.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 15:44.06 | *** join/#openmoko mickey|tw (n=mickey@118-166-64-239.dynamic.hinet.net) |
| 15:45.42 | *** join/#openmoko rjack (n=ritucci@adsl-ull-239-182.51-151.net24.it) |
| 15:46.52 | *** join/#openmoko rmoravcik (n=rmoravci@ip-89-102-255-171.karneval.cz) |
| 15:48.43 | *** part/#openmoko pooze (n=imo@62.70.2.252) |
| 15:52.06 | *** join/#openmoko lesouvage_ (n=lesouvag@cc341200-a.assen1.dr.home.nl) |
| 15:52.08 | *** join/#openmoko MnemonicPunk (n=atlantis@dslb-084-060-035-185.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 15:52.35 | *** join/#openmoko Blastur (n=kebab@kr-lun-168-149-233-83.3.cust.bredband2.com) |
| 15:53.17 | *** join/#openmoko Batchy (n=batchy@AVelizy-155-1-52-193.w86-217.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 15:53.37 | *** join/#openmoko Guest47168 (n=root@host78-55-dynamic.24-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 15:54.48 | *** join/#openmoko Sargun (n=Sargun@atarack/staff/sargun) |
| 15:56.38 | *** join/#openmoko leinir (n=leinir@amarok/usability/leinir) |
| 16:00.50 | MnemonicPunk | I am still here? o.o |
| 16:00.54 | *** join/#openmoko izzyb (n=izzyb@S010600b0d0436543.ed.shawcable.net) |
| 16:00.57 | MnemonicPunk | Thought my internet crashed. |
| 16:01.35 | MnemonicPunk | lindi-? Mind helping me again? |
| 16:03.03 | *** join/#openmoko niki (n=niki@0x5553169c.adsl.cybercity.dk) |
| 16:08.00 | lesouvage_ | After a reboot my /etc/resolv.conf is empty again. What should I do to keep the lines in /etc/resolv.conf |
| 16:11.12 | *** join/#openmoko pleemans (n=toi@d54C2AAB7.access.telenet.be) |
| 16:14.13 | *** join/#openmoko behdad (n=behdad@199.243.246.90) |
| 16:14.22 | fletch | add up echo nameserver 192.168.0.1 >/etc/resolv.conf to /etc/network/interfaces |
| 16:14.46 | fletch | add "up echo nameserver 192.168.0.1 >/etc/resolv.conf" ;) |
| 16:21.51 | *** join/#openmoko baze (n=baze@g226196218.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 16:31.34 | *** join/#openmoko ruoso (n=ruoso@201.45.49.162) |
| 16:33.03 | MnemonicPunk | Is it just me or is openmoko.org unreachable atm? |
| 16:33.31 | *** join/#openmoko holycow (n=new@mail.wjsgroup.com) |
| 16:34.22 | Weiss | http://downforeveryoneorjustme.com/openmoko.org |
| 16:34.59 | *** join/#openmoko norro (n=norro@e181123245.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 16:36.26 | MnemonicPunk | Oh, right, forgot about that site. ^^ |
| 16:37.08 | *** join/#openmoko RedFlash (n=RedFlash@host201-107-dynamic.2-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 16:37.10 | Weiss | looks like there's some problems |
| 16:37.38 | MnemonicPunk | Alright. |
| 16:38.01 | MnemonicPunk | Just had a little fight with my /etc/network/interfaces so I wasn't sure if it was my fault. |
| 16:39.04 | mwester | somebody forgot to pay the hosting bill? |
| 16:39.29 | *** join/#openmoko mboldisc (n=mike@c-75-73-28-183.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) |
| 16:39.33 | alphaone | It works from my server in germany |
| 16:39.48 | mwester | the name doesn't resolve from the US |
| 16:39.52 | alphaone | From .tw it's quite unstable at the moment |
| 16:40.20 | *** join/#openmoko pb_ (n=pb@79-71-201-221.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com) |
| 16:40.54 | MnemonicPunk | alphaone: What's your provider? |
| 16:41.04 | alphaone | hinet |
| 16:41.05 | *** join/#openmoko Dave (n=dave@pool-141-150-36-199.mad.east.verizon.net) |
| 16:41.18 | MnemonicPunk | Doesn't ring a bell. Arcor here. |
| 16:41.27 | Dave | How are you gentlemen? |
| 16:41.49 | alphaone | MnemonicPunk: But I just tried to browse from germany (DFN / GWiN) and it seems to time out somewhere |
| 16:43.22 | MnemonicPunk | Trace ends at bhavani.openmoko.org o.O |
| 16:43.24 | Dave | Hey alphaone |
| 16:43.36 | alphaone | wiki.openmoko.org seems down |
| 16:43.37 | *** join/#openmoko drscream (n=drscream@gw.doc.fruky.net) |
| 16:43.44 | Dave | oh snap? |
| 16:43.51 | alphaone | http://pastebin.com/m5bd5ee9b |
| 16:43.56 | alphaone | Dave: Hi |
| 16:44.07 | Dave | yeah, it got exploded. |
| 16:44.21 | MnemonicPunk | Not that evil. Just use google cache to view openmoko Wiki pages. |
| 16:44.22 | Dave | What's new, Alpha? |
| 16:45.37 | *** join/#openmoko vivijim (n=vivijim@unaffiliated/vivijim) |
| 16:46.25 | bricode_ | Dave: Dave-o! |
| 16:46.35 | alphaone | Dave: Oh, we have UCS2 support now for SMS and Phonebook entries in the framework |
| 16:46.52 | *** join/#openmoko spydon (n=spydon@90-227-33-55-no42.tbcn.telia.com) |
| 16:47.01 | *** join/#openmoko Heinervdm (n=thomas@pD9E164B6.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 16:47.13 | alphaone | And a lot of talk about what to do next, how to do it. Being in Taipei once again is really productive |
| 16:47.50 | lindi- | mmontour: sure |
| 16:47.56 | lindi- | MnemonicPunk: sure |
| 16:48.00 | lindi- | mmontour: sorry about that |
| 16:48.35 | MnemonicPunk | lindi-: I think I got the hang of creating network bridges now. =) |
| 16:49.18 | Dave | bricode o/ |
| 16:49.20 | *** part/#openmoko Toutoug (n=ludovic_@tsf-wpa-1-117.epfl.ch) |
| 16:49.45 | Dave | alphaone, hooray! |
| 16:49.58 | Dave | So, whast though, does that mean we can make use of it, in a few months? |
| 16:50.13 | Dave | lindi, how many bugs have you squashed? |
| 16:50.24 | alphaone | Dave: Define "make use of it". |
| 16:50.35 | alphaone | You can use it right now for certain stuff |
| 16:50.36 | Dave | heh |
| 16:50.57 | Dave | but there isn't any one application which reaps the benefits of it yet? |
| 16:52.48 | mwester | thinks that Om should just cancel the 2008.9 series, and put all resources behind the FSO stuff to speed FSO to market. Wouldn't even come at any loss to 2008.9, since that firmware doesn't really work yet anyway. |
| 16:52.54 | *** join/#openmoko mac2k (n=mac2k@ip-88-152-143-217.unitymediagroup.de) |
| 16:53.20 | Dave | I second the motion! |
| 16:53.39 | alphaone | Dave: zhone can display Chinese SMS and Contacts |
| 16:53.47 | Dave | funny, because, doesn't 2008.X have decent ui but shitty framework, and fso seems to now have the reverse? :P |
| 16:53.54 | Dave | terrible UI, but great framework :P |
| 16:54.01 | alphaone | mwester: In that case you would not have a usable UI |
| 16:54.09 | Dave | Alphaone, yes, clearly illustrated by some recent scap posts |
| 16:54.30 | Dave | Why don't we just make a fucking SSHR!? |
| 16:54.35 | mwester | alphaone: I realize this is opinion, but the 2008 firmwares do not have a usable UI to begin with. It's tantalizingly close, but not usable. |
| 16:54.38 | alphaone | Dave: Yeah, I was so happy I just had to upload that |
| 16:54.43 | Dave | WHY DON'T ALL THE DISTROS COMBINE TO FORM VOLTRON ALREADY!?! |
| 16:54.54 | *** join/#openmoko milo_ (n=nilsense@dslb-088-078-235-238.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 16:54.54 | Dave | and be done with it :P |
| 16:55.11 | Dave | alphaone, oh that was you? cool. thanks for the picture :) |
| 16:55.15 | MnemonicPunk | Voltron? |
| 16:55.16 | mwester | alphaone: Zhone is IMO just as usable as 2008.x, and has more potential. |
| 16:55.19 | *** join/#openmoko leachim_dot_eu_ (n=Leachim@91.89.129.70) |
| 16:55.20 | Dave | YES |
| 16:55.27 | MnemonicPunk | wtf is Voltron? o.o |
| 16:55.32 | Dave | LOOK IT UP |
| 16:55.36 | MnemonicPunk | Sounds like one of the transformers. |
| 16:55.37 | MnemonicPunk | o.o |
| 16:55.41 | GNUtoo | hello, is there a way to activate right click with the styllus such as clicking for a long time? it would be great for midori... |
| 16:56.10 | alphaone | wiki.openmoko.org works again btw |
| 16:56.13 | Dave | Mwester, and what, if anything, do you think of the debian distribution, or in your mind, is that just something completely on its own? |
| 16:56.19 | MnemonicPunk | Great. =) |
| 16:56.23 | Dave | Hooray! |
| 16:56.41 | MnemonicPunk | Gonna need the wiki a lot in the next few days. *g* |
| 16:57.16 | lindi- | MnemonicPunk: cool |
| 16:57.25 | MnemonicPunk | I'm no neo-freerunner-bla-user but the Openmoko sites are great for any mobile linux distro to learn from, I noticed. |
| 16:57.26 | lindi- | Dave: in total? no idea |
| 16:57.38 | Dave | heh |
| 16:57.43 | Dave | Lindi, how many since yesterday? ;) |
| 16:57.51 | lindi- | haven't counted |
| 16:57.52 | alphaone | MnemonicPunk: Cool |
| 16:57.54 | lindi- | at least two |
| 16:57.59 | *** join/#openmoko daMaestro (n=jon@fedora/damaestro) |
| 16:58.01 | Dave | woo |
| 16:58.04 | Dave | Go lindi! |
| 16:58.07 | *** join/#openmoko alfatangoxt (n=michele@host10-204-dynamic.16-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 16:58.12 | Dave | Lindi, I wonder if there are any I can tackle :p |
| 16:58.20 | MnemonicPunk | But in case I can't get it bootstrapped, does anyone have a debain ARM image thats <2 Gig? |
| 16:58.22 | lindi- | Dave: i'm sure there are |
| 16:58.38 | mwester | Dave: Debian is a desktop distro -- perfect for people who want a small desktop that just happens to have a (really shitty) GSM modem attached to it. Qtopia is perfect for people who want a phone that just happens to run Linux. What we are missing is something that fits in between -- the best model IMO is the Nokia Internet Tablet. |
| 16:58.40 | Dave | Oh, and to whomever thought of it the other day... qtopia on SD, is not as amazing as they made it sound. |
| 16:58.48 | GNUtoo | mwester: the problem with FSO is that you don't have missed-calls and operators messages(such as the credit left at the end of each calls)(or am i wrong) |
| 16:58.52 | *** join/#openmoko HauDyr (n=kim@knet-gip124.prod.bolignet.dk) |
| 16:59.08 | MnemonicPunk | is one of those who want a small desktop. =) |
| 16:59.09 | Dave | Nokia internet tablet? |
| 16:59.14 | Dave | which model is that? |
| 16:59.25 | Dave | MnemonicPunk, perhaps you should install debian then? :D |
| 16:59.27 | nyu | mwester: debian's not a desktop distro! |
| 16:59.29 | mwester | GNUtoo: Yep. But since 2008.9 doesn't work correctly most of the time, that's irrellevant. |
| 16:59.42 | nyu | it runs on servers and embedded too |
| 16:59.43 | MnemonicPunk | Dave: Guess what I'm doing right now? ^^ |
| 16:59.46 | mwester | Dave: N800 and N810 -- Maemo. |
| 16:59.52 | Dave | ah, yeah |
| 17:00.04 | Dave | What is it that runs on the RX-44 then? |
| 17:00.08 | MnemonicPunk | I mean... Microsoft tried to create a small desktop with WinCE. Epic fail. xD |
| 17:00.12 | Dave | I see all those pretty pictures on scap all the time. |
| 17:00.20 | Dave | looks like some KDE ripoff |
| 17:00.40 | MnemonicPunk | Opie maybe? |
| 17:00.56 | mwester | nyu: you're right -- it's also a fabulous server distro, probably better than Fedora at that. |
| 17:01.10 | Dave | true that |
| 17:01.11 | nyu | :-) |
| 17:01.12 | Tig|_ | MnemonicPunk: I remember that on my Collie :) |
| 17:01.30 | MnemonicPunk | But Ubuntu one-ups Debian on the normal, not too low-end Desktop PC. |
| 17:01.35 | nyu | mwester: I hope it becomes a good phone distro too. in the meantime I use qtopia ;-) |
| 17:01.52 | Tig|_ | Dave! |
| 17:02.11 | GNUtoo | mwester: yes...but for now i use my old phone...because i do not have missed-calls on FSO or no echo on qtopia...after if theses bugs are fixed...mabe i'll consider using it as a phone(not shure because i will have to pay attention to the battery life and not play with wifi or gps...) |
| 17:02.18 | nyu | or qtopia/openmoko to be more accurate |
| 17:02.20 | MnemonicPunk | My favorite Desktop distro atm is Arch Linux though. |
| 17:02.28 | Dave | Tig! |
| 17:02.40 | nyu | since there could also be qtopia/debian, etc |
| 17:03.03 | mwester | nyu: I too have switched to qtopia -- I'm not blind to qtopia's faults and I'm still critical of it, but it's the best we have, and the only stable environment we can use to flush out and solve the remaining troublesome kernel, battery life, and GSM problems. |
| 17:03.10 | MnemonicPunk | Does anyone consider xfce/debian + cellphone widgets? |
| 17:03.14 | Dave | haha, the Missed Calls functionality works -too- well on 2007 |
| 17:03.18 | Dave | to the point where it annoys me |
| 17:03.43 | Dave | Mwester, here here! |
| 17:03.44 | Dave | :D |
| 17:03.53 | lindi- | GNUtoo: simple call log should be easy |
| 17:04.09 | lindi- | MnemonicPunk: cellphone widgets? |
| 17:04.21 | Dave | sounds hot |
| 17:04.26 | Dave | more like iphone style |
| 17:05.02 | GNUtoo | lindi-: ok...but i think to implement it well you must access the sim(via the TI calypso chip of course) because if i remember well they are stored on the sim |
| 17:05.40 | MnemonicPunk | lindi-: Yeh. May be a personal opinion but I'd like a minimalist but REAL desktop, not a background picture with icons it and then some widgets that show missed calls, network, battery life, maybe the latest SMS in the style of an RSS feed. |
| 17:05.40 | Dave | Mwester, so what does the rx44 run? I still haven't figured it out - though I never bothered to actually look into it :) |
| 17:05.40 | lindi- | GNUtoo: are they? |
| 17:05.40 | mwester | Dave: dunno. |
| 17:05.41 | mwester | I've never looked either. |
| 17:05.42 | lindi- | MnemonicPunk: hmm |
| 17:05.42 | Dave | You have seen all those screenshots though, right? |
| 17:05.54 | lindi- | MnemonicPunk: maybe i am biased since i don't use desktop on my real computer either |
| 17:05.55 | Dave | It's running all these blatantly KDE like apps. |
| 17:06.05 | Dave | it does look very pretty and polished though |
| 17:06.10 | MnemonicPunk | lindi-: What do you use then? o.o |
| 17:06.21 | lindi- | MnemonicPunk: just a window manager, no desktop environment |
| 17:06.25 | MnemonicPunk | Ah. |
| 17:06.26 | GNUtoo | lindi-: i think so because otherwise from what mean the phone could tell me the missed calls ...missed from another phone...but i'll doubble check |
| 17:06.41 | MnemonicPunk | No I don't mean a desktop environment. Not necessarily. |
| 17:06.44 | Dave | Oh and alphaone, thanks for the screenshots of the sms :) |
| 17:06.48 | lindi- | MnemonicPunk: so i have workspaces, can move/resize windows and start new programs |
| 17:06.48 | Dave | We don't need anymore though :P |
| 17:06.53 | lindi- | MnemonicPunk: but that's about it |
| 17:07.10 | *** join/#openmoko two3four (n=erik@c83-251-40-108.bredband.comhem.se) |
| 17:07.12 | lindi- | GNUtoo: ok but would you be happy with simple call log |
| 17:07.15 | MnemonicPunk | Sounds okay to me. ^^ |
| 17:07.15 | *** join/#openmoko pogan0 (n=ccvx@abvf64.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl) |
| 17:07.17 | Dave | man, all these beagle whores |
| 17:07.23 | pogan0 | hi ppl |
| 17:07.23 | Dave | trying to one-up our mokos |
| 17:08.02 | GNUtoo | lindi-: mabe...how do i implement it?(and is there a lot of apps compiled for FSO?) |
| 17:08.25 | alphaone | Dave: Heh :-) |
| 17:08.42 | lindi- | GNUtoo: if you just run dbus-monitor you will see the calls |
| 17:08.46 | Dave | ;) |
| 17:08.55 | FxChiP | ? |
| 17:09.06 | Dave | Which scap had filtering, good thing I started to spinoff my own :) |
| 17:09.17 | lindi- | GNUtoo: so the el'cheapo solution is to run sudo su bin -c "dbus-monitor --system" > calls.log |
| 17:09.35 | MnemonicPunk | Hm. |
| 17:09.47 | MnemonicPunk | << NoMoko xD |
| 17:09.58 | GNUtoo | lindi-: ok...couldn't i do a more elegant system with python? |
| 17:10.16 | *** join/#openmoko Shlee (n=MrShlee@114-30-98-165.ip.adam.com.au) |
| 17:10.22 | *** join/#openmoko surf2me (n=surfer@unixboard/users/surf2me) |
| 17:11.15 | Dave | :D |
| 17:11.22 | Dave | moko moko moko |
| 17:11.33 | *** join/#openmoko malik1972 (n=malik197@e182058053.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 17:11.49 | GNUtoo | such as a a file that have date;person |
| 17:11.57 | GNUtoo | and make a treeview of it |
| 17:12.12 | pogan0 | what cpu has moko ? |
| 17:12.22 | lindi- | GNUtoo: yeah should be quite easy |
| 17:12.26 | romulo | 400mhz on freerunner |
| 17:12.27 | GNUtoo | ok |
| 17:12.32 | MnemonicPunk | 400 only? |
| 17:12.33 | unknown_lamer | pogan0: 400MHz ARMv4t |
| 17:12.33 | MnemonicPunk | o.o |
| 17:12.39 | MnemonicPunk | But a 3D chip eh? |
| 17:12.40 | *** join/#openmoko bipak (n=bip@p57B84492.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 17:12.42 | GNUtoo | i'll install FSO on my s512MB sd-card |
| 17:12.44 | romulo | only? why only? |
| 17:12.49 | MnemonicPunk | Well... |
| 17:12.57 | MnemonicPunk | My Magician is 4 years old. |
| 17:13.01 | unknown_lamer | MnemonicPunk: a very slow 3d chip that can't do 3d ... no drivers |
| 17:13.14 | MnemonicPunk | And it has 421mhz |
| 17:13.14 | pogan0 | can i run this os on smatphone ? |
| 17:13.22 | unknown_lamer | hey I did common lisp development on a 166MHz pentium with 16M of RAM |
| 17:13.23 | MnemonicPunk | And can be safely overclocked to ~600mhz |
| 17:13.46 | unknown_lamer | the processor is actually underclocked :-\ |
| 17:13.52 | unknown_lamer | (it can do 500MHz) |
| 17:13.59 | MnemonicPunk | The Moko one? |
| 17:14.05 | unknown_lamer | but there was something involving RAM and some bus multipliers |
| 17:14.18 | unknown_lamer | yeah |
| 17:14.38 | MnemonicPunk | If the next Moko phone has Wifi and some decent 3D power, I'm so gonna buy. xD |
| 17:14.39 | GNUtoo | lindi-: confirmed...i have outgoing calls even if i didn't made calls with the freshly flashed 2008.9 |
| 17:14.56 | FxChiP | er |
| 17:15.03 | FxChiP | the CURRENT Moko phone has wifi |
| 17:15.07 | romulo | yeah |
| 17:15.10 | romulo | i bought mine yesterday |
| 17:15.14 | romulo | too bad it will take 3 months to arrive |
| 17:15.15 | romulo | :P |
| 17:15.15 | unknown_lamer | MnemonicPunk: the next moko takes the gfx chip out |
| 17:15.34 | MnemonicPunk | I just meant that Wifi is a must for me, if I get a new phone. ^^ |
| 17:15.38 | Dave | fxchip :o |
| 17:15.45 | unknown_lamer | MnemonicPunk: but ups the memory and processor speed (100MHz -> 133MHz [IIRC] / 400 -> 500) |
| 17:16.01 | Dave | that would be nice |
| 17:16.09 | lindi- | GNUtoo: ok they are on sim then. can you figure out how to retrieve them? |
| 17:16.09 | Dave | that way the fb can catch up o.O |
| 17:16.11 | *** join/#openmoko froksen (n=froksen@87.54.254.190) |
| 17:16.15 | *** join/#openmoko thegh (n=thegh@88-206-219-253.highlandnet.se) |
| 17:16.23 | unknown_lamer | and the one after that *might* use the sc6410 and summarily kill the iPhone |
| 17:16.29 | unknown_lamer | just by existing |
| 17:16.42 | MnemonicPunk | The next big hardware battle in mobile phones will be graphics and effects anyway. Saw the new Apple commercials? or the new Symbian ones? |
| 17:16.48 | unknown_lamer | my favorite part about the iPhone is the continual "OH EM GEE THE NDA IS SO TERRIBLE" |
| 17:16.52 | GNUtoo | lindi-: yes with AT commands... |
| 17:16.57 | unknown_lamer | but ... "apple has me by the balls but I'm still writing code for it!" |
| 17:17.00 | Dave | haha |
| 17:17.01 | lindi- | GNUtoo: can you please capture what is sent/received on your phone? |
| 17:17.15 | Dave | unknown_lamer, so I take it you're not one of those? :P |
| 17:17.28 | FxChiP | eh? |
| 17:17.40 | MnemonicPunk | unknown_lamer: Yes, that's my main reasion for never buying apple. Even M$ is more open with their platform. And that means something. |
| 17:17.40 | GNUtoo | lindi-: i'm on 2008.9 now...must install FSO first |
| 17:17.50 | Dave | really? |
| 17:17.54 | romulo | apple sucks |
| 17:17.56 | Dave | hahaha |
| 17:18.05 | FxChiP | They're removing the graphics chip? |
| 17:18.11 | Dave | glamo go byebye |
| 17:18.13 | FxChiP | No 3D in the next GTA? |
| 17:18.14 | MnemonicPunk | lol |
| 17:18.18 | nyu | "think different" |
| 17:18.23 | FxChiP | psh |
| 17:18.26 | FxChiP | I have an iPhone |
| 17:18.26 | Dave | "think non-shitty" |
| 17:18.30 | MnemonicPunk | Can someone provide me with a Debian image? Q_Q |
| 17:18.30 | FxChiP | I do want a Moko, however |
| 17:18.37 | unknown_lamer | Dave: the last mac I owned was a user powermac 7100/66 |
| 17:18.42 | Dave | So, has anybody installed Openmoko on their iPhone yet? |
| 17:18.48 | Dave | unknown_lamer: sweet :D |
| 17:18.56 | FxChiP | Dave, there are... hurdles. |
| 17:19.04 | Dave | hurdles? |
| 17:19.04 | FxChiP | www.iphonelinux.org |
| 17:19.05 | unknown_lamer | s/user/used/ |
| 17:19.06 | Dave | :o |
| 17:19.09 | Dave | oh snap |
| 17:19.09 | MnemonicPunk | Oh wait, there is Zubuntu. *remembers* |
| 17:19.13 | Dave | there's already a cult gathering? |
| 17:19.16 | *** join/#openmoko alvarezp (n=alvarezp@201.139.193.235) |
| 17:19.21 | nyu | Dave: is that even legal? |
| 17:19.24 | FxChiP | Sort of. There's one guy who's presently writing all the low-level shit and needs help. |
| 17:19.25 | MnemonicPunk | Anyone installed Android on their iPhone yet? *g* |
| 17:19.30 | Dave | unknown_lamer, I have two Apple ][e's :) |
| 17:19.36 | Dave | that's it though |
| 17:19.38 | unknown_lamer | OM and AMD are the only two companies ethical enough for me to buy anything from nowadays |
| 17:19.41 | Dave | as far as apple products go |
| 17:19.47 | unknown_lamer | (in the hardware realm) |
| 17:19.47 | FxChiP | unknown_lamer, what? |
| 17:19.49 | FxChiP | Intel's not ethical? |
| 17:19.52 | *** join/#openmoko tsdogs (n=tsdogs@net70-17.metalit.net) |
| 17:19.54 | CIA-22 | freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07framework * rd7f56ccf51bf 10/framework/resource.py: resource.py: be prepared that OUsaged can be disabled |
| 17:20.00 | nyu | unknown_lamer: AMD is a member of the Treacherous Computer Consortium |
| 17:20.10 | Dave | the TCC? |
| 17:20.15 | nyu | unknown_lamer: though, Intel is too so they're even on that |
| 17:20.15 | Dave | :D |
| 17:20.18 | unknown_lamer | FxChiP: I guess they are but ... their chips are all integrated and I have an athlonmp |
| 17:20.20 | *** join/#openmoko alfatangoxt (n=michele@host157-165-dynamic.49-82-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 17:20.22 | FxChiP | Dave, the BIGGEST hurdle is the fact that the iPhone sig-checks everything in-hardware |
| 17:20.32 | Dave | zomg! |
| 17:20.36 | unknown_lamer | nyu: TCC isn't very threatening until everyone is running EFI |
| 17:20.48 | unknown_lamer | until then yay handy little on board rng and crypto chip? |
| 17:20.49 | FxChiP | no |
| 17:20.52 | nyu | unknown_lamer: true. Intel is much, much worse |
| 17:21.06 | nyu | also, AMD supports coreboot |
| 17:21.11 | Dave | checks EVERYTHING in hardware? |
| 17:21.14 | FxChiP | Once again: Intel's not ethical? |
| 17:21.15 | nyu | just wanted to point out they're not precisely saints |
| 17:21.16 | Dave | What the fuck? |
| 17:21.24 | FxChiP | Dave, here's what happens: |
| 17:21.27 | FxChiP | You turn on your iPhone |
| 17:21.42 | unknown_lamer | oh right apple's ARM has the /security/ extensions right? |
| 17:21.43 | FxChiP | The first chip, which is read-only, *signature-checks* (NOT HASH VERIFIES) the iBoot firmware. |
| 17:21.51 | nyu | FxChiP: you have to sign an NDA to turn it on? |
| 17:21.54 | FxChiP | no |
| 17:22.00 | Dave | ugggh iBoot? |
| 17:22.01 | *** join/#openmoko chomwitt_ (n=chomwitt@athedsl-340289.home.otenet.gr) |
| 17:22.06 | FxChiP | And then iBoot comes up |
| 17:22.09 | Dave | nyu :) |
| 17:22.11 | FxChiP | Sorry |
| 17:22.21 | FxChiP | The read-only chip doesn't boot iBoot |
| 17:22.23 | FxChiP | It boots LLB |
| 17:22.25 | FxChiP | Which does other stuff |
| 17:22.26 | nyu | FxChiP: sounds like a complete Treacherous Computing stack |
| 17:22.30 | FxChiP | Then sig-checks iBoot |
| 17:22.34 | FxChiP | If iBoot's okay, boots iBoot |
| 17:22.37 | FxChiP | Then iBoot comes up |
| 17:22.37 | Dave | deep magic? |
| 17:22.39 | GNUtoo | hello, is there a lot of packages on FSO or just the image? |
| 17:22.39 | nyu | now you have to find the DRM at the other end |
| 17:22.41 | FxChiP | Signature-checks the kernel |
| 17:22.48 | FxChiP | IF the kernel's okay, boots the kernel |
| 17:22.57 | Dave | UGGH |
| 17:23.00 | FxChiP | And the kernel proceeds to signature-check everything runnable on the phone all the way down |
| 17:23.07 | *** join/#openmoko behdad (n=behdad@CPE001217b19226-CM0012c9c84bc4.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 17:23.13 | Dave | EVERYTHING!? |
| 17:23.16 | nyu | and when TC and DRM meet, since they love each other very much, they have beautiful children handcuffs |
| 17:23.17 | FxChiP | Yes. |
| 17:23.20 | FxChiP | All the app store apps |
| 17:23.24 | FxChiP | even |
| 17:23.25 | *** join/#openmoko |FiLiP| (n=Filip@77.109.122.106) |
| 17:23.26 | FxChiP | And on top of it all |
| 17:23.28 | FxChiP | App Store apps? |
| 17:23.29 | Dave | So, CLEARLY, they did ALL this so that users couldn't "use" the phone. |
| 17:23.31 | FxChiP | Are sandboxed. |
| 17:23.35 | nyu | Dave: never read about tracherous computing before? |
| 17:23.46 | Dave | you mean tentacle rape? |
| 17:23.47 | *** join/#openmoko gnutoo_ (n=gnutoo@host78-55-dynamic.24-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 17:23.58 | MnemonicPunk | Hang on. I'll show you first concept art of the Apple product I designed a while ago. |
| 17:24.08 | FxChiP | The iPhone Dev Team actually found a way around this |
| 17:24.09 | Dave | hahaha |
| 17:24.15 | Dave | fxchip, rofl |
| 17:24.18 | Dave | TELL US MORE |
| 17:24.20 | FxChiP | There was actually a bug in the read-only chip |
| 17:24.21 | nyu | they call it "trusted computing" and try to sell it as a security feature as well. which makes sense to some extent, except you can't get the security without the treacherous bits in |
| 17:24.21 | Dave | >:) |
| 17:24.27 | FxChiP | In that code |
| 17:24.31 | FxChiP | Which Apple *CANNOT* fix |
| 17:24.39 | FxChiP | (Except they have in the latest iPod Touch revision) |
| 17:24.41 | Dave | Hi-larious. |
| 17:24.46 | FxChiP | Because it's a hardware exploit |
| 17:24.48 | Dave | iPod? |
| 17:24.52 | Dave | hardware exploit? |
| 17:24.55 | FxChiP | iPod Touch and iPhone are VERY CLOSELY RELATED |
| 17:25.02 | unknown_lamer | the iPod touch is ... ha |
| 17:25.02 | Dave | what you, plug it into a toaster and it shorts the security circuits? |
| 17:25.06 | FxChiP | no |
| 17:25.09 | nyu | theyre almost the same thing right? |
| 17:25.09 | unknown_lamer | my friend traded her old iPod for a touch and hates it |
| 17:25.14 | FxChiP | Yeah |
| 17:25.16 | Dave | ahaha, oh yeah I heard they're one in the same, just one doesn't have a phone |
| 17:25.21 | unknown_lamer | because she can't use it at all without looking at it (yay lack of tactile feedback) |
| 17:25.22 | FxChiP | iPod Touch is iPhone without speakers, camera, microphone, etc. |
| 17:25.41 | Dave | basically, stripped down? |
| 17:25.42 | unknown_lamer | actually all of my friends with iPods in general *continually* bitch about how iTunes decides that oops I should delete your music now... |
| 17:25.45 | FxChiP | yeah |
| 17:25.49 | unknown_lamer | it's like wow |
| 17:25.51 | Dave | yeah :D |
| 17:25.55 | unknown_lamer | why do you guys ... keep buying this stuff |
| 17:25.57 | FxChiP | So the hardware is related |
| 17:25.58 | nyu | the wow starts now |
| 17:25.59 | unknown_lamer | if it doesn't do what you want |
| 17:26.05 | Dave | itunes has always been fail with respect to its music library synching |
| 17:26.17 | unknown_lamer | my fucking neuros was better |
| 17:26.22 | FxChiP | So the current (2nd-gen) iPod Touch has actually yielded what Apple plans to do next with the iPhone |
| 17:26.26 | FxChiP | One of which was to fix the pwnage bug |
| 17:26.33 | Dave | pwnage? |
| 17:26.36 | unknown_lamer | I really wish that I hadn't broken the pins on the CF connector accidentally... |
| 17:26.41 | Dave | is this that hardware bug you alluded to before? |
| 17:26.43 | FxChiP | yep |
| 17:26.51 | Dave | what does it allow you to do? |
| 17:27.02 | unknown_lamer | <PROTECTED> |
| 17:27.08 | FxChiP | It essentially amounts to a specially-crafted certificate or some dealie that basically breaks/buffer-overflows the read-only chip's code into running unsigned cod |
| 17:27.11 | FxChiP | code* |
| 17:27.21 | Dave | install linux on your iPod? |
| 17:27.25 | FxChiP | Basically, it gets you REALLY LOW LEVEL |
| 17:27.27 | FxChiP | To the hardware |
| 17:27.30 | Dave | yeah |
| 17:27.33 | FxChiP | Which allows you to pre-empt everything else |
| 17:27.37 | FxChiP | And obliterate Apple's chain of trust |
| 17:27.38 | Dave | so you can do those naughty things you wanted to do? ;) |
| 17:27.53 | pogan0 | ql |
| 17:27.54 | Dave | so basically you just now need to buy and iphone and play circuit surgery? :D |
| 17:27.55 | *** join/#openmoko andrenarchy (n=andrenar@dslb-088-065-092-013.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 17:28.02 | FxChiP | Nothing to do with circuit surgery |
| 17:28.05 | MnemonicPunk | Here, that's the Apple product I designed a few weeks ago: http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y125/atlantis_base/iSuck.png |
| 17:28.11 | FxChiP | Like I said, it's the CODE on the READ-ONLY CIHP |
| 17:28.13 | FxChiP | CHIP* |
| 17:28.16 | Dave | ah |
| 17:28.23 | Dave | make new code |
| 17:28.31 | MnemonicPunk | (Effects slightly wrong because it is a photoshop image but I PNGed it with GIMP. ^^) |
| 17:28.40 | nyu | FxChiP: does read-only mean it's a ROM, or that it's digitally signed? |
| 17:28.44 | FxChiP | ROM |
| 17:28.56 | nyu | MnemonicPunk: heh |
| 17:28.57 | FxChiP | It's ROM on a chip and it apparently can't be written to or Apple would have done it by now |
| 17:29.01 | Dave | :D |
| 17:29.11 | FxChiP | Therefore, they effectively have a *hardware exploit* |
| 17:29.22 | Dave | fxchip, my point was just take it out of the iPod touch and replace the one in the iPhone? |
| 17:29.30 | Dave | conceptually, it sounds fun :) |
| 17:29.33 | FxChiP | Which will be fixed next hardware revision for sure, but until then Apple's playing the dirty trick of "iTunes will refuse to recognize a pwned iPhone" |
| 17:29.42 | *** join/#openmoko chomwitt1 (n=chomwitt@athedsl-07306.home.otenet.gr) |
| 17:29.43 | FxChiP | Take what out? |
| 17:29.48 | Dave | THE FUCKING ROM CHIP |
| 17:29.52 | FxChiP | yarg |
| 17:29.53 | FxChiP | bad idea |
| 17:29.54 | FxChiP | haha |
| 17:29.56 | Dave | duh :P |
| 17:30.00 | nyu | FxChiP: pwned iphone? how can you even proceed with the normal boot sequence? |
| 17:30.05 | Dave | it'll likely end in megafail, but fun to think about :) |
| 17:30.14 | MnemonicPunk | You know what I don't really understand? Exactly WHY are Apple trying to lock down the iPhone? o.o |
| 17:30.14 | Dave | Fxchip, so is apple going to change that? |
| 17:30.20 | Dave | so they can fucking at least fix their own shit |
| 17:30.24 | FxChiP | Change what? |
| 17:30.25 | Dave | or be ignorant? |
| 17:30.25 | nyu | MnemonicPunk: I know why |
| 17:30.30 | FxChiP | The hardware bug? |
| 17:30.31 | Dave | the fucking shitty rom chip |
| 17:30.32 | Dave | yes |
| 17:30.35 | FxChiP | Yeah, they've changed it in iPod Touch 2G |
| 17:30.37 | nyu | MnemonicPunk: they live in a dream world, totally disconnected from reality |
| 17:30.41 | Dave | what about the iphone? |
| 17:30.42 | FxChiP | And they will change it in the next rev. of iPhone 3G |
| 17:30.46 | MnemonicPunk | They could just open the iPhone up to developers and kill WinCE and Google Android in one blow. o.o |
| 17:30.46 | Dave | oh i doesn't have it, right |
| 17:30.50 | FxChiP | If the results from the 2G are to be believed |
| 17:30.51 | Dave | Ah, I see |
| 17:30.55 | Dave | right :P |
| 17:31.00 | Dave | iFail |
| 17:31.01 | nyu | MnemonicPunk: things that don't make any fucking sense here are perfectly fine for them |
| 17:31.02 | FxChiP | Honestly |
| 17:31.13 | FxChiP | The reason they're locking down the iPhone so hard is job security, apparently |
| 17:31.20 | MnemonicPunk | Oh yes, right, it's Apple. xD |
| 17:31.24 | nyu | FxChiP: itunes |
| 17:31.24 | FxChiP | Because the more open they get the phone, the closer people are to the unlock that violates their contract with AT&T |
| 17:31.31 | nyu | yeah, that too |
| 17:31.37 | nyu | but itunes mostly |
| 17:31.37 | MnemonicPunk | Job security? Jobs security? Jobs' job security? |
| 17:31.41 | unknown_lamer | FxChiP: and then we'd just get GNUStep working well on the openmoko platform :-) |
| 17:31.46 | *** join/#openmoko zipo (n=zipo@chello089076197077.chello.pl) |
| 17:31.58 | nyu | the DRM in itunes needs to be highly secure for RIAA/MPAA to buy it |
| 17:32.08 | FxChiP | That too |
| 17:32.11 | unknown_lamer | the iPhone isn't so different from say ... every Nokia phone |
| 17:32.17 | FxChiP | Speaking of, they updated their hash algorithm in iPod Touch 2.0 |
| 17:32.19 | unknown_lamer | I at least cannot flash my 7610 without sending it to Nokia |
| 17:32.21 | FxChiP | Firmware |
| 17:32.41 | unknown_lamer | except I can run unsigned apps thanks to only have s60v2 instead of v3 |
| 17:32.44 | FxChiP | Rendering libgpod useless (libgpod will clobber your playlist if you try, and then iTunes has to "restore" it) |
| 17:32.52 | MnemonicPunk | unknown_lamer: Why not? Locked down so tight? |
| 17:33.04 | unknown_lamer | MnemonicPunk: sort of -- you need custom hardware to do it |
| 17:33.09 | unknown_lamer | and then a way to get the firmware image |
| 17:33.15 | MnemonicPunk | Hm. |
| 17:33.28 | MnemonicPunk | Dunno, I never had a mobile where I was unable to flash. o.o |
| 17:33.36 | unknown_lamer | which sucks for me because I'm running an early rev of the software with a wonderful t9 bug that *reboots the phone* sometimes |
| 17:34.04 | unknown_lamer | "hey kristen can I get your number ... thanks [girl walks away] ... fuck my phone restarted trying to type her name in lkjds;f" |
| 17:34.33 | pogan0 | ; ) |
| 17:34.37 | unknown_lamer | this has happened |
| 17:34.40 | MnemonicPunk | unknown_lamer: When you want to type "raleigh"? |
| 17:34.51 | unknown_lamer | MnemonicPunk: raleigh and kristen are two triggers |
| 17:35.01 | MnemonicPunk | That sucks. |
| 17:35.10 | unknown_lamer | it seems to be at random |
| 17:35.21 | unknown_lamer | luckily another bug of the t9 dictionary is that it resets all user added entries at reboot |
| 17:35.42 | MnemonicPunk | My Siemens M55 had some weird reboot bugs as well but I could easily ignore them as they would only occur every 2-3 weeks. |
| 17:36.50 | MnemonicPunk | Well... I don't think I have to comment on reboot bugs with my WinCE phone, right? |
| 17:36.51 | Dave | :D |
| 17:37.17 | GNUtoo | lindi-, hello, how do i stop the framework? |
| 17:37.19 | *** join/#openmoko kishore (n=quassel@122.171.19.86) |
| 17:37.29 | GNUtoo | so my AT command would work... |
| 17:38.11 | Dave | heh, job security :p |
| 17:38.11 | MnemonicPunk | ps ax | grep framework | xargs -I '{}' killall {} |
| 17:38.11 | MnemonicPunk | ;P |
| 17:38.34 | GNUtoo | i've done /etc/init.d/frameworkd stop but i still have errors |
| 17:38.35 | tobyS | n'amt |
| 17:38.37 | MnemonicPunk | (dunno if that works. xD) |
| 17:38.51 | Dave | fxchip: fucking apple. |
| 17:39.09 | *** join/#openmoko chomwitt2 (n=chomwitt@athedsl-4362785.home.otenet.gr) |
| 17:39.28 | *** join/#openmoko kW (n=kW@unaffiliated/kw) |
| 17:39.33 | *** join/#openmoko Stroller (n=Stroller@213.152.39.89) |
| 17:40.30 | lindi- | GNUtoo: run "cli-framework" and use gsm.DebugCommand("AT\r\n") |
| 17:40.34 | lindi- | GNUtoo: no need to stop framework |
| 17:40.41 | *** join/#openmoko fobos (n=fobos@78.90.88.244) |
| 17:41.09 | GNUtoo | lindi-, ok thanks |
| 17:42.03 | zash | MnemonicPunk: i think "pkill framework" would do the same as that |
| 17:42.30 | Dave | killall -1 zash |
| 17:42.30 | zash | if there is pkill |
| 17:42.35 | Dave | haha, right :P |
| 17:42.43 | zash | pkill -u dave |
| 17:42.45 | Dave | :D |
| 17:43.18 | Dave | touch leinir |
| 17:43.29 | *** join/#openmoko RedFlash (n=RedFlash@host28-43-dynamic.56-82-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 17:43.32 | GNUtoo | i'll do it after eating... |
| 17:44.00 | FxChiP | Dave, no, fucking T-Mobile, fucking Android, and the fucking G1. |
| 17:44.08 | FxChiP | On top of your "fucking Apple." |
| 17:44.13 | Dave | hahahaha |
| 17:44.18 | Dave | THRICED |
| 17:44.19 | *** join/#openmoko chomwitt (n=chomwitt@athedsl-4398462.home.otenet.gr) |
| 17:44.21 | FxChiP | Because |
| 17:44.21 | FxChiP | See |
| 17:44.25 | Dave | Elaborate. |
| 17:44.26 | FxChiP | Android is supposed to be this |
| 17:44.30 | FxChiP | Big, open platform |
| 17:44.31 | leinir | *murrs* ;) |
| 17:44.35 | Dave | :D |
| 17:44.39 | FxChiP | And yet |
| 17:44.39 | Dave | pets leinir |
| 17:44.39 | zash | "open" |
| 17:44.46 | Dave | fxchip, and yet it's all closed, afterall |
| 17:44.47 | FxChiP | zash, getting to that |
| 17:44.52 | leinir | enjoys the pettings :) |
| 17:44.53 | Dave | yeah let fxchip continue :D |
| 17:44.58 | FxChiP | Yet the developers are forced to write in a Java/"Java-like" code |
| 17:44.59 | Dave | leinir, don't we always ;) |
| 17:45.03 | zash | FxChiP: :D |
| 17:45.04 | FxChiP | That doesn't allow anyone to touch the bare metal of the code |
| 17:45.07 | leinir | *giggles* Absolutely :) |
| 17:45.10 | unknown_lamer | is android really anything other than a new j2me but apache licensed? |
| 17:45.13 | Dave | :D |
| 17:45.13 | *** join/#openmoko cheng (n=cheng@xGagB214.WH1.TU-Dresden.De) |
| 17:45.13 | FxChiP | Or of the phone |
| 17:45.18 | unknown_lamer | it seems *less* free than j2me now |
| 17:45.28 | Dave | fxchip, continue :) |
| 17:45.37 | MnemonicPunk | unknown_lamer: Android is more or less a distro. |
| 17:45.45 | FxChiP | It's supposed to be like all Apache-licensed, but they're really not quite as open as they'd like you to believe. Hell, there's probably not even a way to replace their kernel or anything of the sort -- the platform doesn't even support native code. |
| 17:45.59 | FxChiP | Android is not a distro, Android is an abomination that happens to use Linux as a kernel |
| 17:46.09 | unknown_lamer | but all of the fanboys love it |
| 17:46.11 | Dave | sounds like qtopia almost in that respect ;) |
| 17:46.13 | MnemonicPunk | But the media doesn't see it as "linux distro" but as "the new mobile phone revolution from Google that will fight against Apple!" |
| 17:46.14 | unknown_lamer | GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOGLE |
| 17:46.14 | Dave | haha |
| 17:46.20 | Dave | fucking fans |
| 17:46.23 | FxChiP | I'm also really bitter at them because I JUST got off T-Mobile |
| 17:46.26 | *** join/#openmoko ajbrun (n=ajbrun@host86-155-34-181.range86-155.btcentralplus.com) |
| 17:46.29 | FxChiP | And I'm chained to AT&T via iPHone |
| 17:46.33 | leinir | Dave: What, it's all GPL? ;) |
| 17:46.34 | Dave | MnemonicPunk -_- |
| 17:46.37 | FxChiP | And T-Mobile is going to end up being the better service now |
| 17:46.46 | FxChiP | (The G1's specs kick the iPhone's all over the place) |
| 17:46.52 | unknown_lamer | t-mobile always was the better service |
| 17:46.55 | Dave | touches leinir some more |
| 17:47.04 | leinir | murrs some more :) |
| 17:47.05 | Dave | fxchip, hahaaha |
| 17:47.06 | unknown_lamer | excepting 3G |
| 17:47.08 | FxChiP | Yeah, but they're using odd frequencies |
| 17:47.19 | Dave | fxchip, could it possibly get any worse? |
| 17:47.19 | unknown_lamer | not for old fashioned GSM/EDGE |
| 17:47.21 | MnemonicPunk | Huh? Odd frequencies? |
| 17:47.28 | FxChiP | Which means that GTA04, if it's supposed to work with the 3G of all carriers, will have to be able to use a whole shitload of frequencies just for 3G |
| 17:47.33 | MnemonicPunk | The G1 specifically? Or T-Mobile? |
| 17:47.39 | FxChiP | T-Mobile |
| 17:47.47 | FxChiP | They use a different frequency for 3G than AT&T |
| 17:47.47 | leinir | blah |
| 17:47.49 | FxChiP | And Sprint |
| 17:47.50 | leinir | 3G-- |
| 17:47.55 | leinir | Just go directly to 4G ;) |
| 17:48.04 | Dave | I bet we'll have 3 modems in the gta4 :P |
| 17:48.05 | Dave | haha |
| 17:48.08 | Dave | leinir, huhu |
| 17:48.08 | FxChiP | 4G isn't possible yet I don't think. If it is, we don't have it out here |
| 17:48.10 | Dave | you got it! |
| 17:48.18 | Dave | wiiiiiiiimaaaaaaaaaaax |
| 17:48.25 | Dave | it's starting here |
| 17:48.35 | MnemonicPunk | lol |
| 17:48.38 | Dave | vewy vewy shawtly |
| 17:48.45 | FxChiP | hmm |
| 17:48.52 | MnemonicPunk | And the GTA5 will have a built-in Wii? ;p |
| 17:49.02 | Dave | fuck that |
| 17:49.06 | *** join/#openmoko emacsian1 (n=ram@122.167.113.36) |
| 17:49.13 | Dave | hopefully the Gta05 will have a working phone! |
| 17:49.13 | FxChiP | Heh -- the GTA05 will be usable as a Wii remote :) |
| 17:49.18 | *** join/#openmoko Bish (n=arne@p4FC4FF85.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 17:49.23 | Bish | hey gais |
| 17:49.27 | FxChiP | er |
| 17:49.27 | fredrin | GTA5 will come with guns and hookers |
| 17:49.36 | FxChiP | last I heard, FreeRunner is a working phone a lot of the time |
| 17:49.41 | Bish | fredrin: fuck yeah , |
| 17:49.43 | FxChiP | Especially if Qtopia is used |
| 17:49.56 | FxChiP | or am I wrong there? |
| 17:49.58 | Dave | it still sucks, apparently |
| 17:50.01 | Dave | and is riddled with bugs |
| 17:50.05 | *** join/#openmoko froksen (n=froksen@87.54.254.190) |
| 17:50.06 | Dave | affecting all aspects of the device |
| 17:50.11 | Dave | except gps now :P |
| 17:50.12 | FxChiP | hardware or software? |
| 17:50.16 | Bish | FxChiP: no .. qtopia is quite usable, but.. its shit :P |
| 17:50.35 | Dave | most hardware problems were either all acknowledged and redesigned, or worked around on the currently models |
| 17:50.46 | Dave | one or two items I believe still elude us, but it's good. |
| 17:50.50 | Dave | so mostly all kernel crap |
| 17:50.52 | unknown_lamer | I think just the gsm buzz? |
| 17:50.53 | leinir | Bish: Define "shit" :) |
| 17:51.00 | Dave | or lack of the appropriate support |
| 17:51.07 | Dave | pokes leinir |
| 17:51.08 | Bish | leinir: ... i just dont like C++, qt(opia) |
| 17:51.11 | unknown_lamer | which on -devel seemed to be fixed by biasing the micbias from another source elsewhere on the board |
| 17:51.17 | Dave | Bish :D |
| 17:51.21 | unknown_lamer | I think that was fixable ... via a small piece of wire |
| 17:51.29 | leinir | Bish: Fair enough, that's up to you :) |
| 17:51.29 | Bish | Dave: whats so funny bout that :D? |
| 17:51.37 | Dave | I agree :p |
| 17:51.45 | Dave | to an extent |
| 17:51.49 | Bish | Dave: ...nonono :) u have to agree |
| 17:51.54 | unknown_lamer | Bish: smoke! |
| 17:52.03 | Bish | unknown_lamer: smoke? |
| 17:52.05 | unknown_lamer | automagic bindings for kde/qt for any language |
| 17:52.09 | unknown_lamer | thanks to the Qt MOP |
| 17:52.24 | unknown_lamer | I doubt it would tkae much work to make it run over the Qtopia headers instead of normal Qt |
| 17:52.26 | Dave | installs his software on leinir's phone |
| 17:52.43 | Bish | yeah |
| 17:52.47 | Bish | qt C bindings xD |
| 17:52.48 | Bish | uck yeah |
| 17:53.07 | Dave | :P |
| 17:53.09 | Dave | icky |
| 17:53.31 | MnemonicPunk | Does anyone know if the Zaurus has a built-in keyboard? |
| 17:53.44 | Dave | built-in? physical keyboard? |
| 17:53.46 | Tig|_ | Zaurus, yes |
| 17:53.48 | Dave | (tactile) |
| 17:53.50 | MnemonicPunk | Damn. xD |
| 17:53.55 | Tig|_ | all of them iirc |
| 17:53.55 | Dave | that's a good thing |
| 17:54.02 | Dave | better than the shitmoko |
| 17:54.06 | Dave | or failapple |
| 17:54.13 | Bish | Someone has exp in C & edje? |
| 17:54.18 | Dave | hides |
| 17:54.18 | Bish | or a good site to start? |
| 17:54.23 | Tig|_ | MnemonicPunk: keyboard or thumbboard |
| 17:54.45 | MnemonicPunk | It IS good, yes. xD But I'm downloading a Zaurus image and... if it has a keyboard, I still have to activate some onscreen keyboard. xD |
| 17:54.56 | Dave | ROFL |
| 17:54.59 | Dave | wouldn't that be great? |
| 17:55.09 | MnemonicPunk | Hm? |
| 17:55.12 | Dave | You have to CALL apple to "activate your keyboard" after purchasing it. |
| 17:55.16 | MnemonicPunk | lol |
| 17:55.22 | Dave | I could see that :P |
| 17:55.22 | MnemonicPunk | Nooo. |
| 17:55.25 | Dave | haha |
| 17:55.26 | FxChiP | ... |
| 17:55.32 | Dave | fxchip :) |
| 17:55.45 | Dave | Wouldn't it be funny if the keyboard didn't pass it's security check or something? |
| 17:55.50 | Tig|_ | Dave: nah you would have to take it to a "genius" in mac church |
| 17:55.50 | Dave | man, good stuff, that apple... |
| 17:55.54 | MnemonicPunk | I mean I have to activate it so I can type at all. Because my phone has no physical keyboard. |
| 17:55.57 | Dave | uggh |
| 17:56.05 | Dave | MnemonicPunk, yes, we gathered that :) |
| 17:56.10 | MnemonicPunk | Okay. =) |
| 17:56.35 | Dave | We're too preoccupied at the moment with hating several different corporations and providers :) |
| 17:56.41 | MnemonicPunk | Okay. |
| 17:56.42 | Dave | Speaking of which... |
| 17:56.46 | Dave | Fxchip, tell me more :) |
| 17:56.52 | FxChiP | About? |
| 17:56.54 | Dave | I wish to subscribe to your newsletter. |
| 17:57.01 | Dave | :) |
| 17:57.02 | FxChiP | lulz |
| 17:57.08 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@139.84-48-212.nextgentel.com) |
| 17:57.12 | Dave | Though seriously, I'd like to hear more :P |
| 17:57.33 | *** join/#openmoko dkirker (n=dkirker@adsl-99-2-134-30.dsl.snlo01.sbcglobal.net) |
| 17:57.42 | Dave | your dislike and loathing of the aforementioned companies, and their products. |
| 17:57.55 | Dave | Let the hate flow THROUGH you... |
| 17:57.58 | FxChiP | I don't dislike or loathe T-Mobile. I looove T-Mobile. |
| 17:57.58 | Dave | >:) |
| 17:58.02 | Dave | You do? |
| 17:58.06 | FxChiP | I just wish I could have stayed with them. |
| 17:58.07 | FxChiP | Hehe |
| 17:58.13 | Dave | Where do you live? The mid-west? |
| 17:58.16 | FxChiP | I was dumb enough to want the iPhone |
| 17:58.18 | *** join/#openmoko evolux (n=evolux@p5B089DBE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 17:58.22 | Dave | haha, aww |
| 17:58.24 | FxChiP | Back when I HAD T-Mobile, I lived in Pennsylvania |
| 17:58.30 | Dave | so now apple has YOU by the balls? :\ |
| 17:58.36 | FxChiP | Unfortunately |
| 17:58.37 | Dave | fucking shitty. |
| 17:58.40 | FxChiP | Yeah |
| 17:58.45 | Dave | fucking AT&T |
| 17:59.05 | Dave | goddamn teaming up with apple for the gangrape |
| 17:59.21 | Dave | anyhoo, evdo ftw |
| 17:59.28 | *** part/#openmoko emacsian1 (n=ram@122.167.113.36) |
| 17:59.39 | FxChiP | It is an extreme irritation that Apple footbulleted themselves that way |
| 17:59.48 | Dave | heh |
| 18:00.10 | FxChiP | "Hey, let's take our phone worth a SHITLOAD of money to consumers, and let's LOCK OURSELVES DOWN TO ONE COMPANY" |
| 18:00.11 | Dave | sellouts |
| 18:00.22 | Dave | yeah |
| 18:00.34 | Dave | you'd think they'd make multitudes MORE revenue, if they opened it up a bit |
| 18:00.41 | FxChiP | I maintain that had Apple not pursued exclusivity they'd have made a lot more money than AT&T was paying htem |
| 18:00.42 | FxChiP | them* |
| 18:00.51 | FxChiP | (And AT&T HAD to have been paying them a LOT for exclusivity!) |
| 18:00.56 | Dave | though you can still unlock the iphone... |
| 18:00.58 | Dave | right? |
| 18:01.06 | FxChiP | Earlier models capable only of EDGE, yes. |
| 18:01.12 | Dave | hrm |
| 18:01.16 | FxChiP | iPhone 3G, no. You have to buy it from a foreign country |
| 18:01.21 | Dave | rigt |
| 18:01.29 | *** join/#openmoko rcxdude (n=rcxdude@host86-144-204-236.range86-144.btcentralplus.com) |
| 18:01.34 | Dave | a few of my friends that were visiting from japan were showing me their cdma iphones :P |
| 18:02.08 | Dave | anyhoo, yeah, apple. |
| 18:02.09 | Dave | Man |
| 18:02.19 | Dave | and to think they had themselves a smart business plan. |
| 18:02.22 | FxChiP | Indeed. |
| 18:02.22 | Dave | hehe |
| 18:02.41 | Dave | I wish they'd fail, in a way |
| 18:02.50 | Dave | then they'd have to rethink things, and possibly redesign |
| 18:03.06 | FxChiP | psh |
| 18:03.11 | FxChiP | I wish someone would crack their RSA private key |
| 18:03.16 | Dave | Totally ignoring the fact that if they ever got it in their heads to fucking hire some real materials engineers, their products might not be garbage. |
| 18:03.19 | Dave | haha |
| 18:03.25 | FxChiP | Because that would be the ultimate |
| 18:03.37 | Dave | it'd only take, what, a hundred years? |
| 18:03.47 | FxChiP | probably |
| 18:03.52 | Dave | :) |
| 18:04.01 | Dave | and then they'd just change it |
| 18:04.01 | FxChiP | I wish there were a mathematical way of doing it, but |
| 18:04.07 | FxChiP | well |
| 18:04.08 | FxChiP | see |
| 18:04.13 | FxChiP | that's where things get complicated |
| 18:04.23 | FxChiP | Due to the nature of Apple's Chain o' Trust... |
| 18:04.31 | FxChiP | ... the public key is hardwired into the phone. |
| 18:04.32 | Dave | sounds like more of distrust, to me |
| 18:04.41 | Dave | ~_~ |
| 18:04.42 | apt | STOP DOING THAT! |
| 18:05.09 | FxChiP | So if someone cracks Apple's current private key, every device that uses the corresponding public key is open |
| 18:05.17 | Dave | yep |
| 18:05.30 | Dave | it'd be deliciously grand to be able to deal a crippling blow to them, eh? ;) |
| 18:06.15 | Dave | anyoo |
| 18:06.23 | Dave | someone install openmoko on their ipod already |
| 18:06.57 | Dave | oh man, but security circuits? ... I'm still laughing from that :) |
| 18:07.05 | Dave | Thanks for the bit of enlightenment, fxchip ;) |
| 18:07.57 | FxChiP | yeah |
| 18:08.30 | Dave | It's always vindicating to know I've been on the "right" side. :) |
| 18:09.27 | Dave | Meanwhile, I have to hit up some old games, and see if I can't leverage the people who made them for the source code. |
| 18:09.42 | Dave | timing algorithms are near-impossible to infer |
| 18:10.50 | wurp2|working | FxChiP: I think it's vastly more likely that the private key would leak than be cracked. Accepted pub/priv key cryptography methods are extremely secure. |
| 18:11.27 | Dave | WURP |
| 18:11.57 | Dave | Come, join our hate fest :) |
| 18:13.48 | robtaylor | wurp2|working: unless you happen to work at GCHQ or similar ;) |
| 18:13.53 | wurp2|working | What are we hating today? |
| 18:14.27 | *** join/#openmoko Ghiottone (n=ale@213.158.72.21) |
| 18:14.40 | wurp2|working | robtaylor: You think so? Unless they have some 2048 bit quantum computer or something I'd think it's still safe |
| 18:15.08 | wurp2|working | I thought the time-to-crack on those things were measured in centuries or millenia of all currenct computing power on earth churning on it |
| 18:16.06 | MnemonicPunk | Does anyone know this? When I dont want a script from rc.d to run, can I just delete it? Or will that cause file-not-found errors? |
| 18:16.16 | *** join/#openmoko tdobson (n=a_lead_f@dobsad.plus.com) |
| 18:16.37 | wurp2|working | MnemonicPunk: rc.d.<some number>? |
| 18:16.48 | *** join/#openmoko max_posedon (n=max_pose@212.98.171.13) |
| 18:16.55 | wurp2|working | MnemonicPunk: Those are usually links to an /etc/init.d file, and you can just delete them |
| 18:17.18 | MnemonicPunk | Okay. =) |
| 18:17.51 | *** join/#openmoko Zorkman (i=Zorkman@dD5771B7B.access.telenet.be) |
| 18:18.24 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@139.84-48-212.nextgentel.com) |
| 18:19.12 | *** join/#openmoko mr_nice (n=nice@91-65-152-238-dynip.superkabel.de) |
| 18:21.58 | *** join/#openmoko macdonalder (n=macdonal@mango.fourthandvine.com) |
| 18:22.13 | *** part/#openmoko macdonalder (n=macdonal@mango.fourthandvine.com) |
| 18:22.27 | *** join/#openmoko brundlefliege (n=brundlef@h081217092231.dyn.cm.kabsi.at) |
| 18:22.57 | Dave | wurp2|helping |
| 18:23.00 | *** join/#openmoko harnir (n=harnir@dhcp046-205.ds.amg.gda.pl) |
| 18:23.05 | harnir | hello |
| 18:23.08 | Dave | Greetings |
| 18:23.13 | Tig|_ | 'nings |
| 18:23.21 | harnir | Good morning, Dave. |
| 18:24.52 | *** join/#openmoko RedFlash (n=RedFlash@host9-44-dynamic.52-82-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 18:25.26 | *** join/#openmoko aaronw (n=aaronw@thurgood-marshall.sflc.info) |
| 18:30.37 | *** join/#openmoko apol (n=apol@81.184.56.180.dyn.user.ono.com) |
| 18:31.40 | aaronw | has anyone followed the GPRS howto at http://freeyourphone.de/portal_v1/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=295? |
| 18:46.30 | lindi- | aaronw: it uses frameworkd but seems to do a lot of unnecesary things |
| 18:47.05 | aaronw | lindi-: are there better instructions out there? |
| 18:47.43 | lindi- | aaronw: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/GPRS_FSO |
| 18:48.01 | lindi- | aaronw: look to the bottom of the page for "gprs-on.sh" |
| 18:48.14 | *** join/#openmoko rddDavid51 (n=roudoudo@gar31-1-82-224-8-235.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 18:48.42 | aaronw | lindi-: ah, ok, thanks. so you just use a terminal to turn gprs on? |
| 18:48.53 | lindi- | aaronw: i do at the moment yes |
| 18:49.05 | lindi- | aaronw: but i use terminal for almost everything at the moment |
| 18:49.17 | aaronw | lindi-: heh, yeah. hopefully not dialing? |
| 18:49.20 | lindi- | i prefer to get things work before starting to think about UIs :) |
| 18:49.33 | lindi- | aaronw: well, zhone is graphical ui for dialing |
| 18:50.07 | aaronw | lindi-: yes, i think openmoko could have benefited from some of that thinking from the beginning. |
| 18:50.40 | aaronw | thanks for the tip -- bbl |
| 18:51.10 | *** join/#openmoko almien (n=OJW@87-194-198-122.bethere.co.uk) |
| 18:51.47 | *** join/#openmoko lol_h (n=laurent@ip-213-49-80-173.dsl.scarlet.be) |
| 18:52.37 | *** join/#openmoko Zilla_ (n=Zilla@cc479555-b.hnglo1.ov.home.nl) |
| 18:56.19 | lindi- | aaronw: maybe |
| 18:58.15 | Bish | feels alone |
| 18:58.35 | Dave | Zilla! |
| 18:58.39 | Dave | consoles Bish |
| 18:58.44 | Zilla | Hi Dave \ |
| 18:58.48 | Bish | :/ |
| 18:58.58 | Bish | even edje_editor doesnt wat to talk with me |
| 18:59.08 | Bish | HEY FUCK IT WORX |
| 18:59.08 | Bish | brb |
| 18:59.33 | Zorkman | something new? |
| 18:59.50 | MnemonicPunk | What works? o.o |
| 19:00.06 | Zilla | Eey Zorkman |
| 19:00.30 | Zorkman | lloµ |
| 19:00.59 | Zorkman | has only 234 new mails, all hail the mailinglist :) |
| 19:01.55 | Dave | :D |
| 19:01.59 | Dave | \o/ |
| 19:02.12 | Zilla | you should make a mailadress dedicated too the mailinglist ;) |
| 19:02.18 | Dave | YES |
| 19:02.19 | Zorkman | i did :p |
| 19:02.21 | Dave | I have one :P |
| 19:02.22 | Dave | hahaha |
| 19:02.23 | Dave | :D |
| 19:02.27 | Dave | smart zilla |
| 19:03.15 | *** part/#openmoko tedo (n=cta@HSI-KBW-091-089-003-002.hsi2.kabelbw.de) |
| 19:03.48 | Bish | MnemonicPunk: edje_editor |
| 19:04.11 | MnemonicPunk | What's that? |
| 19:07.36 | Dave | It sounds horrible, from the way Bish is describing his struggles with it :D |
| 19:08.02 | Bish | MnemonicPunk: an editor of edje files |
| 19:08.09 | Bish | s/of/for |
| 19:08.25 | Bish | still feels alone |
| 19:08.32 | Dave | :[ |
| 19:09.50 | ieatlint | unfortunately edje_editor has bugs, lacks full support for all of the edje features, and produces edj files 10x the size of identical layouts written manually |
| 19:10.40 | Dave | LINT |
| 19:10.51 | ieatlint | hey dave |
| 19:10.57 | Dave | ieatlint, that sounds totally scary. |
| 19:10.58 | Zorkman | lintworm :) |
| 19:11.08 | Dave | it's like windows on doxygen, written in java |
| 19:11.12 | Dave | hahaha, wow. |
| 19:12.28 | ieatlint | hey Zorkman |
| 19:12.46 | ieatlint | ok, and i just got an important call from my lawyer, so i'm off |
| 19:12.55 | Zorkman | how is the buss-time-)table program comming along? |
| 19:13.36 | *** join/#openmoko mluser-work (n=mluser-w@208.178.12.226) |
| 19:13.54 | ieatlint | uh, it's in a working state |
| 19:14.17 | ieatlint | but there is no working UI for the phone (the computer's UI has issues on the phone) |
| 19:14.46 | FilipLinux4BE | wonders if ieatlint is going straight to jail ;-) |
| 19:14.53 | ieatlint | i spent about 2 hours yesterday writing one in edje, and am about 90% done with the UI, then i just need to create it |
| 19:15.03 | ieatlint | heh |
| 19:15.06 | ieatlint | probate court |
| 19:15.09 | ieatlint | anyway, i'm off |
| 19:15.13 | Dave | :D |
| 19:15.45 | Dave | what a badass ;) |
| 19:16.50 | Tig|_ | reads up |
| 19:17.15 | Tig|_ | has ieatlint made a decent UI for FSO or have I misread things? |
| 19:19.12 | Zorkman | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:19.18 | Dave | you have misread |
| 19:21.40 | Tig|_ | ah what has he done then? |
| 19:22.10 | *** join/#openmoko chomwitt (n=chomwitt@athedsl-389990.home.otenet.gr) |
| 19:23.39 | Zorkman | anyone know how to solve this? |
| 19:23.40 | Dave | It is beyond your comprehension. |
| 19:23.59 | Dave | Zorkman, that's a bug? I thought you were just complimenting/praising your latest accomplishment :) |
| 19:24.06 | *** join/#openmoko skorzen (n=skorzen@89-180-3-11.net.novis.pt) |
| 19:25.35 | *** join/#openmoko Torikun (n=rusher@67.112.215.16) |
| 19:26.56 | Zorkman | :D |
| 19:27.36 | *** join/#openmoko ptitjes (n=didier@93.2.7.240) |
| 19:30.31 | *** part/#openmoko Torikun (n=rusher@67.112.215.16) |
| 19:30.50 | *** join/#openmoko kuzgun (n=deniz@unaffiliated/kuzgun) |
| 19:30.52 | Dave | ;) |
| 19:32.14 | *** join/#openmoko swc|666 (n=swc|666@unaffiliated/swc666/x-4934821) |
| 19:32.30 | *** join/#openmoko apol (n=apol@81.184.56.180.dyn.user.ono.com) |
| 19:32.52 | Tig|_ | Dave: there are no such things as bugs, there are only opportunities for bug reports for one lucky user :) |
| 19:32.59 | *** join/#openmoko igor321 (n=igor@134-79.dsl.iskon.hr) |
| 19:33.48 | lindi- | yep |
| 19:33.49 | pogan0 | my toshiba smartphone is not suported yet by handhelds |
| 19:33.53 | pogan0 | linux |
| 19:33.57 | pogan0 | ; / |
| 19:34.14 | Dave | uh huh |
| 19:34.31 | Dave | it clearly must not be that smart then :P |
| 19:35.11 | pogan0 | bun im not gona like it than |
| 19:35.21 | pogan0 | ;( |
| 19:35.47 | Bish | the options of the edje_editor are quite limited , uh? |
| 19:36.13 | *** join/#openmoko ritz (n=ritesh@123.236.160.233) |
| 19:36.13 | *** join/#openmoko Sargun (n=Sargun@atarack/staff/sargun) |
| 19:38.18 | Dave | Howdy Sargun |
| 19:38.42 | Sargun | Dave. |
| 19:39.24 | Dave | Affirmative. |
| 19:41.14 | *** join/#openmoko ScarEye (n=scareye@12.27.87.66) |
| 19:48.50 | *** join/#openmoko El_Senator (n=El_Senat@0x4dd4371c.adsl.cybercity.dk) |
| 19:53.17 | *** join/#openmoko geaaru (n=geaaru@host108-34-dynamic.40-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 19:57.17 | *** join/#openmoko LetoTo (n=paul@207.34.230.180) |
| 19:57.53 | *** join/#openmoko Zorkman (n=Zorkman@dD5771B7B.access.telenet.be) |
| 19:59.17 | Zorkman | anybody using FSO ms3 as stable phone? |
| 19:59.28 | Dave | ERROR ERROR |
| 19:59.32 | Dave | THAT DOES NOT COMPUTE |
| 19:59.35 | Zorkman | :) |
| 19:59.44 | Zorkman | *quasi-usable daily phone |
| 20:00.32 | jakob_ | Zorkman: fso is not supposed to be a gui or a fully functional distribution to be used on its own |
| 20:00.49 | *** join/#openmoko Pjj (n=pjj@fsf/member/pjj) |
| 20:01.08 | Zilla | the gta04 will probably have 3g :( just a pitty that gta03 wont support 3g networks :( |
| 20:01.37 | Zilla | for just calling you dont need 3g but internet is al lot faster with it ;) |
| 20:01.51 | Dave | rawr |
| 20:01.56 | *** join/#openmoko qhartman (n=qhartman@74.93.188.113) |
| 20:02.08 | Dave | I suppose |
| 20:02.09 | Dave | yes |
| 20:02.23 | Tm_T | it is if it works where you live (;) |
| 20:02.31 | *** join/#openmoko dougt__ (n=dougt@c-67-180-69-46.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 20:02.49 | Dave | :P |
| 20:02.54 | Dave | touché |
| 20:02.59 | Zilla | so i can wait till OM supports 3g (hardware wise) or buy an OM now if i want to play with it :) |
| 20:03.19 | Tm_T | Openmoko is not hardware, is it? |
| 20:03.28 | Dave | or somehow get usb drivers working and use an aircard |
| 20:03.35 | Dave | Tm_T, no |
| 20:03.47 | Tm_T | I thought so |
| 20:03.55 | Zilla | gta02 is OM hardware ;) |
| 20:04.11 | Zilla | you can use that aircard in a laptop too :) |
| 20:04.11 | Tm_T | is it? |
| 20:04.46 | Dave | yep |
| 20:04.50 | Zilla | but if you buy an aircard.... (usb one) you have to say that you cant put the sim card in a phone./.... but what if the phone suports usb-modems ? |
| 20:04.57 | Wonka | I have used the GPRS of my other cellphone via bluetooth... |
| 20:05.09 | Wonka | (3G SIM problem..) |
| 20:05.22 | Zilla | yeah.... how about the 3g-sim compatibility |
| 20:05.23 | Zilla | ? |
| 20:05.40 | Zilla | looking up train information works great on gprs (non 3g) too :D |
| 20:05.47 | harnir | anybody knows what font is used in the NEO logo on the phone? |
| 20:05.48 | Dave | heh |
| 20:06.04 | Zilla | and ssh login for my server :D |
| 20:06.05 | Dave | steal it from their website! |
| 20:06.28 | Zilla | defenately no tohomaMS font :) |
| 20:07.14 | *** join/#openmoko swc|666 (n=swc|666@unaffiliated/swc666/x-4934821) |
| 20:09.48 | lesouvage_ | I can login in to my freerunner, I changed /etc/resolv.conf can ping to the outside internet via the wlan connection but if I run the installer and do "update" nothing seems to happen. What should be my next step? |
| 20:09.55 | Zorkman | lesouvage_: you need to do an upgrade after your update |
| 20:10.07 | *** join/#openmoko malik1972 (n=malik197@e182058053.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 20:10.15 | lesouvage_ | Zorkman: over ssh via usb? |
| 20:10.19 | Zorkman | yes |
| 20:10.24 | lesouvage_ | OK |
| 20:10.31 | Zorkman | opkg update && opkg upgrade |
| 20:12.26 | lesouvage_ | I see "collected errors: * could not obtain administrive lock |
| 20:14.12 | Dave | lesouvage_: killall packagekitd |
| 20:15.12 | Bish | lesouvage_: youve been assasinated |
| 20:15.42 | Tig|_ | Dave: I think I need to set a bot up ;) |
| 20:16.16 | *** part/#openmoko islandescape (n=m@car06-3-82-240-156-91.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 20:17.15 | lesouvage_ | I'm afraid that with the launching of the device to a larger user group a lot of this "newbie" questions will be asked. With a bot you just have to answer them once. |
| 20:18.55 | harnir | vectorized FR, what do you think? http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/9612/rect4774jg6.png |
| 20:21.01 | Bish | harnir: nice hit |
| 20:21.09 | Bish | s/hit/shot |
| 20:21.43 | Zorkman | doesn't "apm" work on FSO? |
| 20:21.55 | Zorkman | what is the equivalent to check battery? |
| 20:22.00 | *** part/#openmoko swc|666 (n=swc|666@unaffiliated/swc666/x-4934821) |
| 20:24.45 | izzyb | Is there a way to troubleshoot the phone portion of the freerunner? |
| 20:25.19 | izzyb | I'm unable to receive calls, and sending calls results in an immediate disconnection. I don't think it even tried dialing. |
| 20:26.03 | izzyb | I'm currently using qtopia, but have similar results in om2008.8, om2008.9, and fdom |
| 20:26.51 | *** join/#openmoko romulo (n=romulo@189.12.32.27) |
| 20:29.48 | Dave | moo |
| 20:29.59 | *** join/#openmoko bluelightning (n=blueligh@pdpc/supporter/active/bluelightning) |
| 20:31.31 | lesouvage_ | I seem to ahve my installer (finally) running. How log does it normally take to install the openmoko browser? |
| 20:31.42 | lesouvage_ | log=long |
| 20:34.48 | lesouvage_ | the installer is now running for about 5 minutes and packagekitd is using 58% cpu |
| 20:35.17 | *** join/#openmoko swc|666 (n=swc|666@c66-235-51-71.sea2.cablespeed.com) |
| 20:38.03 | lesouvage_ | done! no i can browse! (i hope) |
| 20:39.11 | *** join/#openmoko Torikun (n=rusher@67.112.215.16) |
| 20:39.13 | *** join/#openmoko christooss (n=matic@BSN-30-72-201.dial-up.dsl.siol.net) |
| 20:39.30 | *** part/#openmoko Torikun (n=rusher@67.112.215.16) |
| 20:42.30 | *** part/#openmoko Proton23 (n=proton@p57BA774C.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 20:45.03 | *** join/#openmoko Proton23 (n=proton@p57BA774C.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 20:47.18 | *** join/#openmoko t_s_o (n=tso@135.84-49-129.nextgentel.com) |
| 20:49.24 | *** part/#openmoko swc|666 (n=swc|666@unaffiliated/swc666/x-4934821) |
| 20:52.20 | *** join/#openmoko romulo (n=romulo@201.78.21.249) |
| 20:53.22 | izzyb | According to this --> http://bieberphoto.com/canadia/index.php/2008/07/openmoko-neo-freerunner-review/ |
| 20:53.34 | lesouvage_ | Every time my screen turns black and it seems like the device turns of.When I press the power button most of the times the screen comes back within a second but sometimes it stays back until it reboots. |
| 20:53.35 | izzyb | there is a known issue with some sim cards not working properly |
| 20:53.59 | izzyb | the link provided in the article didn't have details anyone know what he is talking about? |
| 20:54.11 | izzyb | or how to tell which sim cards have problems? |
| 20:54.12 | *** join/#openmoko baze (n=baze@g226196218.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 20:54.21 | wurp2|working | lesouvage_: It sounds as if your device is suspending. Suspend/resume have been problematic. |
| 20:57.12 | lesouvage_ | wurp2: I hope it will be solved in the near futere |
| 20:57.15 | *** join/#openmoko vaiursch (n=erwin@80-218-125-202.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 20:58.11 | *** join/#openmoko sandwitch (n=mark@247-50-223.ftth.xms.internl.net) |
| 20:58.28 | zipo | hello how font ins use to neo |
| 20:59.18 | Zorkman | anybody: ui'm using fso ms3 and I've 'lost" the drop-down bar (the bar which displays the time and that you can press to close a window) |
| 20:59.28 | Zorkman | is there a way to get it back? |
| 20:59.49 | *** join/#openmoko mazzen (n=mortel@u30-237.dsl.vianetworks.de) |
| 21:00.44 | *** join/#openmoko mattbnz (n=mattbrow@87-198-135-238.ptr.magnet.ie) |
| 21:01.17 | *** join/#openmoko evolux (n=evolux@p5B089DBE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 21:03.38 | *** join/#openmoko mickey (n=mickey@118-166-64-117.dynamic.hinet.net) |
| 21:08.03 | *** join/#openmoko mazzen (n=mortel@u30-237.dsl.vianetworks.de) |
| 21:12.07 | *** join/#openmoko kasjo (n=kasjo@ahd82.internetdsl.tpnet.pl) |
| 21:12.24 | evolux | I don't see all applications in the "menu" on 2008.09. Does that perhaps have something to do with the categories? What is the "menu" application by the way? |
| 21:12.29 | *** join/#openmoko aggtrfrad (n=unkbnoj@CPE001cf0eb9434-CM0018c0d9db72.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 21:12.45 | Zorkman | evolux: yes it has to do with the categories |
| 21:12.49 | Zorkman | or with the icons |
| 21:14.53 | lesouvage_ | the keyboard is kind of crazy, it is actually unusable for normal input. |
| 21:15.52 | *** join/#openmoko tomboy64 (n=tomboy64@e178024255.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 21:15.56 | *** join/#openmoko dolf1074 (n=chatzill@78-20-186-137.access.telenet.be) |
| 21:15.56 | evolux | Zorkman: how can i tell this application to show all categories? |
| 21:17.17 | Zorkman | evolux: I don't know |
| 21:18.22 | *** join/#openmoko Ghiottone (n=ale@host-84-221-209-140.cust-adsl.tiscali.it) |
| 21:18.24 | *** join/#openmoko ||Leto|| (n=tomboy64@e178058103.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 21:19.31 | *** join/#openmoko tuXXX (n=damien@pat35-3-82-245-141-101.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 21:22.04 | evolux | do i configure it in /etc/xdg/menus/applications.menu? |
| 21:23.46 | *** join/#openmoko danwink (n=daniel@adsl-71-145-144-105.dsl.austtx.sbcglobal.net) |
| 21:24.50 | *** join/#openmoko swc|666 (n=swc|666@unaffiliated/swc666/x-4934821) |
| 21:27.16 | Dave | u |
| 21:27.46 | *** join/#openmoko Proton23 (n=proton@p57BA774C.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 21:32.05 | *** join/#openmoko Amorphous (i=jan@unaffiliated/amorphous) |
| 21:34.20 | *** join/#openmoko vk5foss (n=kgoetz@gnewsense/friend/pdpc.active.kgoetz) |
| 21:35.08 | izzyb | FYI, for anyone having problems making or receiving calls, there are issues reported with some SIM cards: -->http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FreeRunner_Hardware_Issues#Some_SIMs_Don.27t_Work |
| 21:35.26 | izzyb | I'm surprised nobody mentioned that in all the posts I've made here |
| 21:36.06 | izzyb | As it turns out, both sim cards I have here are the 3040 serious known to have problems... |
| 21:36.40 | danwink | im trying to opkg install mofi_0.02_armv4t.ipk and its saying cannot obtain administrative lock |
| 21:36.58 | dolf1074 | danwik: pkill packagekit |
| 21:38.05 | danwink | worked. Thanks dolf1074! |
| 21:38.24 | ceda | izzyb: since your surprised, I wouldn't be surprised if you're from the US and expects everyone to be awake when you are |
| 21:38.45 | ceda | has had a bad week, time to sleep |
| 21:38.50 | *** join/#openmoko TeringTuby (n=maarten@195-241-125-243.ip.telfort.nl) |
| 21:40.14 | *** join/#openmoko Arhuaco (n=nc@190.157.196.38) |
| 21:42.51 | *** part/#openmoko gargoyle-grin (n=randerso@gentoo/contributor/gargoyle-grin) |
| 21:46.49 | *** join/#openmoko mazzen (n=mortel@u30-237.dsl.vianetworks.de) |
| 21:47.01 | *** join/#openmoko Kamping_Kaiser (n=kgoetz@gnewsense/friend/pdpc.active.kgoetz) |
| 21:47.03 | *** join/#openmoko ndrs__ (n=andres@89.100.134.85) |
| 21:47.41 | *** join/#openmoko zedstar (n=john@82-44-200-69.cable.ubr08.haye.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 21:47.43 | *** join/#openmoko evolux (n=evolux@p5B089DBE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 21:49.33 | *** join/#openmoko max_posedon (n=max_pose@212.98.171.14) |
| 21:50.33 | izzyb | ceda, sorry to disappoint you, but I'm a polite Canadian! Just goes to show that you shouldn't assume. I was just trying to make sure more people were aware of the issue so others may be pointed in the right direction. :) |
| 21:52.24 | *** join/#openmoko haakeyar (n=haakeyar@cB83A4BC1.dhcp.bluecom.no) |
| 21:56.49 | Zilla | bye all |
| 21:59.37 | *** join/#openmoko Linux_Galore (n=richard@60-242-20-212.static.tpgi.com.au) |
| 22:00.29 | *** join/#openmoko bove (n=opera@cm-84.208.114.37.getinternet.no) |
| 22:01.15 | *** join/#openmoko mazzen (n=mortel@u30-237.dsl.vianetworks.de) |
| 22:13.47 | *** join/#openmoko nigel_c (n=nigel_c@mail.crca.org.au) |
| 22:14.29 | *** join/#openmoko freelock (n=john@c-76-105-93-212.hsd1.ga.comcast.net) |
| 22:17.45 | *** join/#openmoko jOERG_rw (n=jr@p5493C9B2.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 22:19.14 | *** join/#openmoko Tanuva (n=tanuva@e177236166.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 22:22.11 | Zorkman | where can i find illume-config-illume? |
| 22:22.15 | Zorkman | i want the spanner back |
| 22:22.28 | Zorkman | it can't find it in testing or in unstable |
| 22:25.32 | danwink | anyone here use mofi? |
| 22:26.05 | Zorkman | i used it a long time ago |
| 22:26.21 | Zorkman | worked fine for free AP's and WPA AP's didn't test it for other encryptions |
| 22:26.27 | MnemonicPunk | is building a small but versatile Ubuntu image. =) |
| 22:29.46 | *** join/#openmoko gnu{- (n=gnu@quiet.toad.com) |
| 22:31.58 | *** join/#openmoko neldoreth (n=ascot@unixboard/users/neldoreth) |
| 22:32.42 | *** join/#openmoko aggtrfrad (n=unkbnoj@CPE001cf0eb9434-CM0018c0d9db72.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 22:34.02 | *** join/#openmoko uhsf (n=uhsf@modemcable009.150-57-74.mc.videotron.ca) |
| 22:36.34 | danwink | for some reason mofi is crashing every time i click connect |
| 22:36.42 | danwink | im rebooting right now |
| 22:38.36 | MnemonicPunk | Does anyone know if Ubuntu has the typical mobile phone apps? |
| 22:38.46 | MnemonicPunk | If it does... |
| 22:38.49 | MnemonicPunk | where? xD |
| 22:38.56 | Zorkman | anybody else having problems with tangogps and Om2008.9? |
| 22:43.00 | *** join/#openmoko DaveLab (n=dave@pool-141-150-36-199.mad.east.verizon.net) |
| 22:43.06 | DaveLab | Howdy ya'll |
| 22:43.06 | Zorkman | and I can't get the spanner/wrench back on Om2008.9 (I can't find illume-config-illume in testing or in unstable) can somebody point me in the right direction? |
| 22:43.44 | Zorkman | llo Dr Davenstein |
| 22:44.50 | DaveLab | >:) |
| 22:45.04 | DaveLab | Currently in the lab, contemplating the most complete and stable way to backup ten freerunners. |
| 22:45.10 | DaveLab | and I don't want to be here all night, either :P |
| 22:46.08 | ezekiel-v3 | dd? 10 rsync processes? |
| 22:46.28 | DaveLab | oy |
| 22:46.30 | ezekiel-v3 | tar over ssh? |
| 22:46.35 | viq | Take out SD cards, get new ones? ;) |
| 22:46.38 | DaveLab | haha |
| 22:46.45 | DaveLab | man, I have to backup the entire filesystem as well |
| 22:46.55 | DaveLab | oh shit, I better take out or exclude the sd from this sync D: |
| 22:47.02 | DaveLab | it's got the entire linux kernel tree on it |
| 22:47.06 | DaveLab | :D |
| 22:47.40 | ezekiel-v3 | tar -cvvf - / | ssh user@workstation "tar -C /some/backupdir -xf -" |
| 22:48.11 | ezekiel-v3 | run that on each freerunner, choose a different backupdir on your workstation for each |
| 22:48.17 | DaveLab | I already do :) |
| 22:48.46 | DaveLab | but won't that be WAY slower? |
| 22:49.27 | ezekiel-v3 | slower than what? I was just throwing out ideas under the impression that you needed a quick way to backup before you leave? |
| 22:49.39 | DaveLab | yeah |
| 22:49.43 | DaveLab | dd |
| 22:49.54 | zash | tar cf - / | nc ip randomport + nc -l randomport | tar xfv - |
| 22:50.01 | DaveLab | and your impression was correct :) |
| 22:50.13 | Zorkman | c'mon, somebody has to know where the illume-config and illume-config-illume files are; i need them |
| 22:50.17 | ezekiel-v3 | yeah, nc will be faster since you won't do any crypto |
| 22:50.21 | DaveLab | zorkman, ask raster |
| 22:50.28 | DaveLab | zash :) |
| 22:50.34 | zash | ezekiel-v3: or compression |
| 22:51.16 | DaveLab | exactly! |
| 22:52.50 | DaveLab | oh hot damn, it's going WAY faster :) |
| 22:52.53 | Zorkman | doc|home: why are there no illume-config or illume-config-illume files in testing or in unstable? i want your keyboard and acces to the wrench/spanner |
| 22:53.19 | Zorkman | doc|home: i would be very grateful if you knew a way to get them back |
| 22:53.28 | DaveLab | it's slow but a good compromise :) |
| 22:53.32 | DaveLab | zorkman? |
| 22:53.37 | DaveLab | what happened, you deleted them? :) |
| 22:53.39 | zash | if cpu is the weakest part, not using compression and/or encryption is .. good |
| 22:53.56 | Zorkman | DaveLab: no i re-flashed and they are no longer in the repositories |
| 22:54.10 | DaveLab | bah, tar errored out! |
| 22:54.18 | DaveLab | booo |
| 22:54.24 | ezekiel-v3 | it probably continued on after the error? |
| 22:54.32 | DaveLab | no, after ten or so it bailed |
| 22:54.33 | ezekiel-v3 | i mean, tar waits until the end to tell you about errors |
| 22:54.37 | ezekiel-v3 | ahh |
| 22:54.41 | DaveLab | tar: Error is not recoverable: exiting now |
| 22:54.45 | DaveLab | :( |
| 22:54.47 | ezekiel-v3 | ick |
| 22:55.00 | zash | DaveLab: did you start nc -l first |
| 22:55.01 | DaveLab | It only copied 22M too. |
| 22:55.05 | DaveLab | zash, YES |
| 22:55.10 | DaveLab | how else would my files have arrived? :D |
| 22:55.15 | zash | weird |
| 22:55.21 | zash | tcp shouldnt drop stuff |
| 22:55.37 | DaveLab | on the freerunner I got |
| 22:55.39 | DaveLab | tar: short read |
| 22:55.41 | DaveLab | blah |
| 22:55.53 | zash | weird |
| 22:56.00 | ezekiel-v3 | did you exclude /proc ? |
| 22:56.04 | DaveLab | No :D |
| 22:56.10 | ezekiel-v3 | or other directories where files might dissapear? |
| 22:56.15 | zash | tar -x perhaps |
| 22:56.16 | zash | no |
| 22:56.17 | zash | hm |
| 22:56.20 | DaveLab | no |
| 22:56.28 | zash | something like --one-filesystem |
| 22:56.35 | DaveLab | o.O |
| 22:56.36 | ezekiel-v3 | --exclude=PATTERN |
| 22:56.41 | DaveLab | guh |
| 22:56.44 | zash | --one-file-system |
| 22:56.56 | zash | would exclude /proc and stuff |
| 22:56.59 | zash | probably /dev too |
| 22:57.03 | *** part/#openmoko FilipLinux4BE (n=Filip@77.109.122.106) |
| 22:57.16 | DaveLab | I'd probably be better off just imaging the fucking moko, if it's less hassle. |
| 22:57.43 | ezekiel-v3 | --one-file-system oughtta do it for you, Dave |
| 22:57.43 | zash | you could dd /dev/sdwhatever over the network |
| 22:57.49 | lindi- | i rsync |
| 22:57.51 | DaveLab | right :P |
| 22:57.57 | DaveLab | rsync ftw |
| 22:58.26 | ezekiel-v3 | rsync plus hardlinks, ftw |
| 22:58.46 | lindi- | http://iki.fi/lindi/openmoko/backup-neo is really simple rsync+hardlinks |
| 22:58.49 | DaveLab | haha |
| 22:58.53 | DaveLab | lindi, does it work? |
| 22:58.56 | *** join/#openmoko georgy_28 (n=georgy@217-117-42-7.teledisnet.be) |
| 22:58.57 | lindi- | yes |
| 22:59.02 | DaveLab | even late? :P |
| 22:59.09 | zash | lindi-: hardlinking oldbackup to newbackup and then rsync -delete-before ? |
| 22:59.27 | lindi- | zash: did you read the script? |
| 22:59.46 | lindi- | DaveLab: late? |
| 23:00.04 | DaveLab | :P |
| 23:00.08 | zash | lindi-: no |
| 23:00.15 | DaveLab | let's find out! |
| 23:00.35 | lindi- | zash: i actually rsync first and hardlink then |
| 23:00.44 | lindi- | zash: but the idea is the same |
| 23:00.55 | DaveLab | eek |
| 23:01.30 | lindi- | zash: that way if rsync is interrupted i don't need to rm -fr or risk having an incomplete copy |
| 23:01.45 | DaveLab | uggh |
| 23:02.40 | lindi- | DaveLab: ? |
| 23:03.44 | DaveLab | nevermind |
| 23:03.50 | DaveLab | I modified your script; thank you. |
| 23:03.58 | DaveLab | It's chugging along across several freerunners :) |
| 23:04.31 | *** join/#openmoko bamccaig (n=bamccaig@dsl-66-186-95-161.vianet.ca) |
| 23:04.52 | lindi- | no warranty :P |
| 23:04.54 | DaveLab | I hope it backs up everything. |
| 23:04.55 | DaveLab | haha |
| 23:04.57 | DaveLab | I bet :p |
| 23:05.45 | DaveLab | well so far it's making a lot of broken links! |
| 23:05.45 | DaveLab | :D |
| 23:05.46 | DaveLab | but backing all the other data up :) |
| 23:06.15 | DaveLab | darn, I guess I'll have to backup the card data separately |
| 23:07.21 | lindi- | DaveLab: why? |
| 23:07.24 | DaveLab | Why what? |
| 23:08.56 | lindi- | DaveLab: why don't you backup the SD card at the same time? |
| 23:09.04 | DaveLab | oh I see! |
| 23:09.06 | DaveLab | It is |
| 23:09.12 | DaveLab | It's just a huge linky mess! |
| 23:09.15 | DaveLab | Link soup :p |
| 23:09.29 | DaveLab | spaghetti links |
| 23:09.35 | DaveLab | Mmm... now I have an urge to use lync |
| 23:09.36 | DaveLab | lynx |
| 23:09.44 | DaveLab | also troll the debian bug list :) |
| 23:09.46 | DaveLab | while waiting |
| 23:09.54 | DaveLab | point me in the right direction, lindi? |
| 23:10.04 | lindi- | hmm? |
| 23:11.42 | *** join/#openmoko bamccaig (n=bamccaig@dsl-66-186-95-161.vianet.ca) |
| 23:13.36 | DaveLab | I still have no idea where it's backing up the mmc data to. |
| 23:13.53 | *** join/#openmoko alephnull (n=alok@122.167.66.28) |
| 23:14.20 | *** join/#openmoko Kt_ (n=Kirsat@adsl-232-4-239.asm.bellsouth.net) |
| 23:15.02 | lindi- | DaveLab: probably nowhere |
| 23:15.11 | lindi- | DaveLab: "-x" means it won't cross filesystem boundaries |
| 23:15.33 | DaveLab | oh yeah, boohiss |
| 23:15.42 | DaveLab | crap |
| 23:15.47 | lindi- | DaveLab: instead of 192.168.0.202:/ you want 192.168.0.202:"/ /media/mmc" or something |
| 23:15.56 | DaveLab | yeah, I know |
| 23:16.07 | DaveLab | that's why I was saying I'd have to do it separately, before :P |
| 23:16.28 | DaveLab | Well, it's already copied 400M of something |
| 23:17.15 | DaveLab | Now it just seems like it's wasting my time :) |
| 23:18.07 | lindi- | you can always continue where it left off |
| 23:19.41 | *** join/#openmoko flavior (n=flavior@200.97.67.57) |
| 23:22.26 | *** join/#openmoko Tig|_ (n=tigger@82.153.215.237) |
| 23:22.52 | *** join/#openmoko stefreak__ (n=stefreak@frnk-5d812bf7.pool.einsundeins.de) |
| 23:23.24 | *** join/#openmoko niklauz (i=d863b241@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-b20de2ba208aa32a) |
| 23:23.59 | *** join/#openmoko MrTuttle (n=hklein@85-189-158-179.echo.managedbroadband.co.uk) |
| 23:29.42 | *** join/#openmoko lysanderslair (n=jeff@bas5-london14-1088883986.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 23:29.52 | *** join/#openmoko Torikun (n=rusher@67.112.215.16) |
| 23:30.11 | MnemonicPunk | Anyone tried Android yet? |
| 23:30.38 | mwester | If you can point me to a download location for a Treo 650, or a FR, I'll be happy to try it. |
| 23:30.54 | *** part/#openmoko Torikun (n=rusher@67.112.215.16) |
| 23:31.35 | MnemonicPunk | http://it029000.massey.ac.nz/vogue/android-new.zip |
| 23:31.35 | MnemonicPunk | It's in there, you just have to adjust the initrd for yourself =) |
| 23:31.56 | MnemonicPunk | (Android uses some strange initrd... -.-) |
| 23:35.10 | Zorkman | MnemonicPunk: it runs on the FR? |
| 23:35.54 | *** join/#openmoko bamccaig (n=bamccaig@dsl-66-186-95-161.vianet.ca) |
| 23:36.18 | MnemonicPunk | No idea. But if normal Linux does, it should run there as well. o.O |
| 23:36.32 | MnemonicPunk | Android is just a normal Linux with a funky filesystem. |
| 23:36.37 | mwester | MnemonicPunk: That's for an HTC -- doesn't run on a Treo, nor on a FR. |
| 23:36.43 | Zorkman | i'd think you would need to recompile it for amrv4 |
| 23:36.46 | Zorkman | *arm |
| 23:36.48 | MnemonicPunk | Ah. |
| 23:36.49 | mwester | At the very least |
| 23:36.51 | MnemonicPunk | FR is v4? |
| 23:37.00 | mwester | Then you'd need to deal with the display hardware |
| 23:37.07 | mwester | The serial port/GSM issues |
| 23:37.16 | mwester | battery, power, USB, wifi, etc. |
| 23:37.28 | MnemonicPunk | I can take most images from other distros and run them. |
| 23:37.29 | MnemonicPunk | o.o |
| 23:37.47 | MnemonicPunk | Touchscreen reacts strange sometimes though. |
| 23:37.55 | mwester | MnemonicPunk: on i386 hardware. |
| 23:38.01 | mwester | Not on anything else! |
| 23:38.16 | MnemonicPunk | No on my HTC xD |
| 23:38.33 | MnemonicPunk | It boots zubuntu, for example. |
| 23:38.34 | MnemonicPunk | o.ô |
| 23:38.46 | mwester | Really? You can run a FR kernel and rootfs on the HTC? |
| 23:38.53 | MnemonicPunk | Not the kernel. |
| 23:39.00 | MnemonicPunk | But initrd and rootfs yes. |
| 23:39.16 | MnemonicPunk | Doesn't have to work out of the box. |
| 23:39.17 | mwester | And what functionality does the initrd and rootfs provide, and where do you get those? |
| 23:39.41 | MnemonicPunk | initrd is an artificial rootfs that is mounted before the actual rootfs. |
| 23:40.13 | MnemonicPunk | For example if your device needs to load drivers before it can mount your actual root. |
| 23:40.19 | mwester | My point being that source code is portable, compiled source code is less so, and when you get to an application, even less so, and by the time you get to an entire suite of applications (like a phone), there's really no portability at the binary level at all. |
| 23:40.32 | mwester | MnemonicPunk: I know what initfs does. |
| 23:40.32 | MnemonicPunk | That's true, yeh. |
| 23:40.56 | MnemonicPunk | I'm not saying it will all run right on the spot. |
| 23:41.01 | MnemonicPunk | I know it doesn't. |
| 23:41.02 | mwester | What I'm asking you is does your rootfs and initfs provide phone applications that work on HTCs as well as other devices? Or is it just the bare minimum like busybox? |
| 23:41.21 | MnemonicPunk | Hm. |
| 23:41.26 | MnemonicPunk | How do I put that? |
| 23:41.35 | MnemonicPunk | Graphical environments boot. |
| 23:41.48 | MnemonicPunk | But the phone applications all use their specific API so they won't. |
| 23:41.57 | mwester | Building a bare base rootfs is relatively simple; getting Android to run on the FR would be a huge effort. |
| 23:42.36 | MnemonicPunk | And the touchscreen is touchy (haha -.-) in my case. |
| 23:43.18 | mwester | I think the community should undertake to do so, but nobody should think it is a trivial undertaking. I think asking Trolltech how much time it took to make Qtopia run as well as it does on the FR would be a good guage as to the effort to make Android boot and run in a basic way. |
| 23:43.42 | MnemonicPunk | I'm not sure. |
| 23:43.56 | MnemonicPunk | Android is *supposed* to be really portable. |
| 23:44.02 | mwester | Really? |
| 23:44.18 | MnemonicPunk | Yeh. o.o |
| 23:44.19 | Zorkman | is it? never read something that stated that... |
| 23:44.44 | mwester | Hmm... If its so portable how can we handle the parts of Android that are closed-source? |
| 23:45.03 | Zorkman | we use a crowbar? |
| 23:45.07 | MnemonicPunk | lol |
| 23:45.15 | MnemonicPunk | It's still Google. |
| 23:45.20 | Tig|_ | mwester: cash |
| 23:45.20 | MnemonicPunk | So you never know. |
| 23:45.21 | MnemonicPunk | =( |
| 23:46.11 | MnemonicPunk | What I'm thinking... |
| 23:46.24 | MnemonicPunk | If it is possible to take openmoko and run it on the HTC... |
| 23:46.37 | mwester | Nah, standard answer applies -- write HUGE abstraction layer over your device so that the binary blog from Google thinks it sees what it wants to see -- then when your device goes to market, you need to either suffer with poor performance compared to the native Google phone, or suffer with higher hardware costs to make your product on-par. :) Either way, google wins! |
| 23:46.44 | MnemonicPunk | Or take Angstrom and run it on the FR... (Dunno if that is possible yet xD) |
| 23:46.58 | MnemonicPunk | Then even Android should be able to run those. |
| 23:47.04 | mwester | Angstrom is what is running on the FR. |
| 23:47.39 | mwester | But there's nothing in Angstrom that abstracts the Calypso GSM -- so that part has to be written. |
| 23:47.47 | Tig|_ | mwester: saw a good talk by Chris De Bona from google at LRL and from what he was saying they like to make sure any technology that they use does not bite them in the ass, which is why they are iffy about where code comes from and the licences |
| 23:47.50 | MnemonicPunk | Yeh. |
| 23:48.06 | MnemonicPunk | lol |
| 23:48.23 | *** join/#openmoko pea (n=pea@adsl-75-58-4-163.dsl.dytnoh.sbcglobal.net) |
| 23:48.38 | MnemonicPunk | Why not opensource it all then? No assbiting to be done after that. xD |
| 23:48.40 | mwester | Chris sounds like he's either in Marketing, or he's studied what the Google Marketing department wants him to say. |
| 23:48.51 | mwester | Spiiiiiiiin! |
| 23:49.12 | Tig|_ | mwester: actually is he is a straight up guy |
| 23:50.27 | mwester | Never met him; I'll take your word for it, but even straight-up guys have to say what's best for their employer, lest they end up unemployed and unemployable. |
| 23:50.49 | viq | Any recommendations for a SIP client for debian-on-FR ? |
| 23:51.09 | Tig|_ | MnemonicPunk: prolly because they have licensed closed code but in a way it can't bite google |
| 23:52.14 | MnemonicPunk | For some reason I just don't really like Android. |
| 23:52.33 | Arhuaco | I thought it would be all open source. |
| 23:52.37 | MnemonicPunk | Did anyone try Vanilla Vogue Linux on FR yet? |
| 23:56.46 | mwester | Actually, I rather appreciate Android, and welcome it in the market -- I personally don't like the model, I don't trust Google, and I really think Java is a terrible language for embedded devices, but that's all technology stuff -- RIM failed, and without Android, Apple would be unthreatened in any way, and Apple is already showing signs of being more Microsoft than even Microsoft. |
| 23:57.08 | *** join/#openmoko MokoN00b (n=whatever@118-168-239-243.dynamic.hinet.net) |
| 23:57.22 | MnemonicPunk | True. |
| 23:58.06 | MnemonicPunk | I don't really care about Apple to be honest but I like the fact that android will bring good new stuff to other *nix users on mobile phones as well. |
| 23:58.28 | Tig|_ | mwester: apple have always been more more microsoft that microsoft have ever dared be they just lacked the market share to do it |
| 23:58.37 | MnemonicPunk | lol |
| 23:59.10 | mwester | I guess then I've been blind to it; it's taken the iPhone for me to realize just how closed and proprietary even things like the iPod are. |
| 23:59.13 | Tig|_ | MnemonicPunk: android will do fuck all for *nix stuff |
| 23:59.24 | Tig|_ | they are the same |
| 23:59.32 | MnemonicPunk | Why do you think that? o.o |
