| 00:00.13 | mmu_man | drivers themselves are just loaded on the fly by devfs which just follows symlinks when somone opens /dev/foo/bar |
| 00:00.30 | *** part/#openmoko tunys (n=tuna@unaffiliated/t00na) |
| 00:00.59 | mmu_man | linux finally got a hierarchical tree for modules, but it still uses insmod... |
| 00:01.48 | mmu_man | and linkage is done as in userland, so there is no clean API between modules |
| 00:02.03 | CVirus | is the link on openmoko.com clickable ? |
| 00:02.09 | CVirus | i mean does it direct to another page ? |
| 00:02.10 | dcordes_ | mmu_man: there's udev which automates modprobe/insmod |
| 00:02.46 | mmu_man | BeOS enforces accessing moduels through function pointers organized in structures with an inheritance like way |
| 00:03.01 | mmu_man | udev ? that's just hiding it :p |
| 00:03.04 | mmu_man | anyway |
| 00:03.21 | mmu_man | just try to find a stable driver API in linux... |
| 00:03.44 | dcordes_ | I like it more than windows |
| 00:04.58 | *** join/#openmoko felipe_ (n=felipe@my.nada.kth.se) |
| 00:05.10 | dcordes_ | linux that is :) |
| 00:07.18 | mmu_man | of course, but it's nothing but stable |
| 00:07.52 | mmu_man | anyway |
| 00:08.08 | mmu_man | the cpu does have an mmu, right ? |
| 00:08.20 | dcordes_ | a memory management unit? |
| 00:08.28 | SpeedEvil | yes. |
| 00:08.34 | SpeedEvil | s3c2410 |
| 00:08.56 | SpeedEvil | 2440 for freerunner |
| 00:08.58 | mmu_man | ah yes, ARM920T |
| 00:09.01 | dcordes_ | mmu_man: ohh you need to setup the virtual mapping entirely new eh? |
| 00:09.20 | mmu_man | it's the 940T that doesn't... |
| 00:09.36 | mmu_man | GP2X has both (why couldn't they just have twice the same and do SMP, dammit ?) |
| 00:10.17 | mmu_man | dcordes_: well it's an OS, not just a shell on top of linux :p |
| 00:10.25 | mmu_man | and yes, I've yet to port to ARM |
| 00:10.35 | mmu_man | but I have m68k to finish first :) |
| 00:10.47 | dcordes_ | there is _no_ ARM work for Be present? |
| 00:11.18 | mmu_man | Haiku |
| 00:11.27 | mmu_man | BeOs is proprietary and not developped anymore |
| 00:11.39 | mmu_man | (but yes there was a port, they used it for BeIA) |
| 00:11.51 | mmu_man | (for kitchen appliances after the focus shift that killed them) |
| 00:12.16 | *** join/#openmoko zncbtrn (n=zencubot@modemcable060.30-81-70.mc.videotron.ca) |
| 00:12.36 | dcordes_ | mmu_man: kitchen? |
| 00:12.39 | mmu_man | hmm ohh I2C... if the I2C bus available handy from outside ? |
| 00:12.48 | dcordes_ | they used BeIA in coffee machines? |
| 00:12.52 | dcordes_ | :P |
| 00:13.05 | mmu_man | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BeIA |
| 00:13.25 | mmu_man | eVilla, and another cancelled one that later got released with winCE |
| 00:13.31 | mmu_man | IA-1 |
| 00:13.38 | dcordes_ | I see but it doesn't help you because it's proprietary, that BeIA? |
| 00:14.32 | mmu_man | yes |
| 00:14.56 | mmu_man | I could dig the code somewhere but it's not worth it, would polute Haiku, and is probably for older ARMs anyway |
| 00:15.00 | mmu_man | http://www.iapplianceweb.com/images/appweb/appliance_directory/internet_terminals/internet_terminal_compaq_ipaq_ia1_m.jpg |
| 00:15.06 | dcordes_ | sounds like a time consuming nontrivial project |
| 00:15.34 | mmu_man | sounds a bit like OpenMoko, doesn't it ? :) |
| 00:15.46 | mmu_man | wow, I never came across this one http://x00xie.org/c22/case_studies/ui/12_beia.html |
| 00:15.55 | dcordes_ | well people here don't poke around with registers and io devices |
| 00:16.11 | dcordes_ | anymore |
| 00:16.19 | dcordes_ | at least not for the current hardware |
| 00:17.44 | dcordes_ | mmu_man: can I try Haiku on my x86 desktop? |
| 00:17.57 | mmu_man | well I can probably cope with some ported GPL drivers from linux :) |
| 00:18.04 | mmu_man | we do have some GPL addons around alerady anyway |
| 00:18.15 | mmu_man | dcordes_: sure there are QEMU and vmware images |
| 00:18.18 | dcordes_ | every part of neo/freerunner hardware is welldocumented |
| 00:18.27 | dcordes_ | oh I'd like the qemu image |
| 00:18.35 | *** join/#openmoko greentux_ (n=lemke@Z5f09.z.pppool.de) |
| 00:18.36 | SpeedEvil | points at the glamo. |
| 00:18.48 | mmu_man | dcordes_: hmm except the video chip I see (NDA), but I can live with framebuffer |
| 00:19.00 | dcordes_ | mmu_man: glamo=video chip |
| 00:19.09 | dcordes_ | I didn't know about nda there |
| 00:19.10 | mmu_man | http://www.haiku-os.org/downloads get the raw image |
| 00:19.33 | mmu_man | the GTA02 specs on the wiki says it's under NDA (from IRC logs) |
| 00:20.02 | dcordes_ | mmu_man: I will pick the most bleeding http://haiku-files.org/raw/haiku.image.r26003.bz2 |
| 00:20.07 | mmu_man | http://revolf.free.fr/beos/shots/shot_haiku_m68k_loader_010.png work in progress atari Falcon port :) |
| 00:20.35 | dcordes_ | mmu_man: I mean I didn't know about it as in I wasn't aware of it |
| 00:20.47 | dcordes_ | I don't know too much about the moko hardware |
| 00:23.02 | mmu_man | just read a few times about it |
| 00:23.26 | mmu_man | there is a news about imminent *grin* shipping on http://linuxfr.org/ |
| 00:24.07 | mmu_man | so, anyone knows if the I2C bus is accessible from outside ? |
| 00:24.34 | mmu_man | might be interesting to be able to add like temperature or pressure sensors, there are many funny I2C chips around |
| 00:24.51 | SpeedEvil | Not trivially |
| 00:24.58 | mmu_man | could be interesting for school tech classes also |
| 00:25.07 | SpeedEvil | you can however attach a stubby PCB to the debug port, or solde. |
| 00:25.38 | mmu_man | it's on the debug port ? I guess that's fine |
| 00:25.42 | *** join/#openmoko swc|666 (n=swc|666@unaffiliated/swc666/x-4934821) |
| 00:26.12 | SpeedEvil | Or more practically, USB. |
| 00:26.53 | mmu_man | yes but that'd need a bridge chip, even if it's a PIC |
| 00:27.23 | mmu_man | ah the debug port pinout... |
| 00:27.26 | mmu_man | hmm spi :) |
| 00:29.19 | swc|666 | here's a question... i see that the freerunner will (hopefully) be out soon... has there already been presales for it? |
| 00:29.54 | SpeedEvil | No. |
| 00:30.22 | swc|666 | so first come/first server then? |
| 00:30.37 | SpeedEvil | The hope is that there will be enough for everyone. |
| 00:30.43 | SpeedEvil | The first batch is 8 billion. |
| 00:30.49 | mmu_man | oh there is SDIO support |
| 00:31.01 | dcordes_ | mmu_man: don't you wanna port your operating system to sepak ARM first? |
| 00:31.09 | mmu_man | sepak ? |
| 00:31.30 | dcordes_ | I mean if I got your right, there is no work for ARM you can base on |
| 00:31.31 | mmu_man | I suppose I'll first target whatever qemu-system-arm supports |
| 00:32.22 | balrog-k1n | qemu-system-arm speaks ARM :) |
| 00:32.23 | mmu_man | there is an arm port of NewOS AFAIK; not sure how done it is. NewOS is the kernel we forked off for Haiku |
| 00:32.48 | mmu_man | balrog-k1n: yes but there is more than the cpu, besides there are many dialects of ARM |
| 00:33.25 | mmu_man | ARM9 ARM10 ARM11, thumb, with or without mmx-like opcodes, ... |
| 00:33.36 | *** join/#openmoko Demitar (n=demitar@h-79-136-2-44.NA.cust.bahnhof.se) |
| 00:33.44 | balrog-k1n | yeah |
| 00:34.40 | balrog-k1n | S3C24xx forces you to use the most limited set of arm capabilities so that you can be sure your os runs on any other ARM too :) |
| 00:35.04 | balrog-k1n | well, except the hw drivers |
| 00:35.16 | mmu_man | great |
| 00:35.24 | mmu_man | now I just need to find EUR330 :) |
| 00:35.59 | mmu_man | (and I'll have to cash about this for RMLL in july anyway) |
| 00:36.02 | SpeedEvil | balrog-k1n: there are smaller ARMs - but meh. |
| 00:36.14 | SpeedEvil | has one with a whole 20K of RAM. |
| 00:36.19 | SpeedEvil | 32 bit though. |
| 00:36.21 | mmu_man | yeah, like in 10yo HP Jornada :) |
| 00:36.57 | mmu_man | I recall testing one at school, winCE was sooo buggy |
| 00:37.06 | balrog-k1n | SpeedEvil: but their instruction set is not smaller than that of arm920 |
| 00:37.22 | balrog-k1n | arm920 is at the edge of being able to run linux, with its mmu :) |
| 00:38.14 | mmu_man | well lower can run uCLinux |
| 00:38.16 | *** join/#openmoko milos_ (n=milos@92.36.149.20) |
| 00:39.09 | balrog-k1n | you can't advertise a phone based on uCLinux as a linux phone i think |
| 00:39.24 | SpeedEvil | balrog-k1n: yeah - the 20K chip I mentioned if it had a MMU could actually run linux (with software RAM drivers). |
| 00:39.30 | SpeedEvil | It'd be silly, but you could. |
| 00:39.32 | balrog-k1n | and porting beos to it would be even more work |
| 00:40.58 | mmu_man | Haiku :) |
| 00:41.36 | mmu_man | well, some early Sun stations had a 68000 with a custom mmu... |
| 00:41.43 | mmu_man | but that I won't try to support :) |
| 00:41.51 | balrog-k1n | err.. right :) |
| 00:42.03 | mmu_man | 030 wil be enough |
| 00:42.39 | balrog-k1n | what's 030? |
| 00:43.03 | SpeedEvil | 68030 |
| 00:43.25 | balrog-k1n | oh |
| 00:43.30 | mmu_man | that's what is in Atari Falcon, Amiga 4000 (but without mmu I think) |
| 00:43.30 | balrog-k1n | Apple Macintosh II |
| 00:43.33 | mmu_man | and Mac LC III |
| 00:43.56 | mmu_man | I have an LC III around :) |
| 00:46.58 | balrog-k1n | there's a wiki page about the porting of netbsd / openbsd to neo1973 |
| 00:47.13 | balrog-k1n | might give you some idea about the struggles of porting new OSes to neo1973 |
| 00:48.20 | balrog-k1n | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/NetBSD <-- i think there was a more "report" like one somewhere |
| 00:48.30 | *** join/#openmoko zefanja_ (n=zefanja@drsd-4db29daf.pool.einsundeins.de) |
| 00:49.56 | mmu_man | oh great |
| 00:50.22 | mmu_man | NetBSD runs really everywhere :) |
| 00:50.34 | mmu_man | (including the BeBox, Falcon and Amiga :) |
| 00:51.13 | mmu_man | oh and there is a qemu mod around. Yeah I recall seeing that once |
| 00:52.24 | balrog-k1n | there are even screenshots :) |
| 00:52.37 | *** join/#openmoko ruoso (n=ruoso@201009064084.user.veloxzone.com.br) |
| 00:53.40 | balrog-k1n | i wonder how much of the openmoko userspace can be compiled for NetBSD |
| 00:53.56 | dcordes_ | didn't somebody apply for *bsd on moko hardware as gsoc project? |
| 00:55.03 | balrog-k1n | oh, someone applied for Plan 9 port |
| 00:55.10 | balrog-k1n | but was rejected accroding to the wiki |
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| 01:00.52 | mmu_man | plan9... UTF-8 \o/ |
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| 01:47.04 | mmu_man | btw what's the DAS of the Runner ? |
| 01:47.21 | mmu_man | hmm what's the english name... ah yeah SAR |
| 01:47.42 | mmu_man | Specific Absorbsion Rate (sp?) |
| 01:48.24 | mmu_man | s/bs/bt/ |
| 01:48.47 | mmu_man | not exactly |
| 01:48.52 | mmu_man | s/bsi/bti/ |
| 01:48.59 | mmu_man | :D |
| 01:49.40 | mmu_man | nothing at all on the wiki :-( |
| 01:51.26 | *** join/#openmoko kdean06 (n=Kevin@fsf/member/kdean06) |
| 01:51.38 | mmu_man | so, noone knows about the SAR ? |
| 01:55.08 | *** join/#openmoko zeno_ (n=andrew@c-75-70-202-80.hsd1.co.comcast.net) |
| 01:55.33 | mmu_man | ping |
| 01:59.24 | *** join/#openmoko zeno_ (n=andrew@c-75-70-202-80.hsd1.co.comcast.net) |
| 02:03.39 | mmu_man | ah I think I found it |
| 02:04.20 | *** join/#openmoko behdad (n=behdad@CPE001217b19226-CM0012c9c84bc4.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 02:05.35 | mmu_man | http://people.openmoko.org/tony_tu/GTA02/certificate/EUNGTA02_850_1800_1900/FA7O1101_R01_FCC%20SAR_FIC_GTA02_for%20GSM.pdf :) |
| 02:07.15 | mmu_man | it seems to be around 0.44, which isn't too bad |
| 02:07.45 | mmu_man | hmm oh there is a 1.2 here... |
| 02:08.12 | mmu_man | hmm ok it depends on the freq |
| 02:09.01 | mmu_man | ok page 35, SAR Test Results... |
| 02:09.44 | mmu_man | ok seems to all be under 0.5 W/Kg |
| 02:09.59 | mmu_man | 0.8 at most |
| 02:10.27 | mmu_man | much better than some other phones I know :) |
| 02:11.42 | mmu_man | oh the page is on the othe pdf... |
| 02:11.44 | mmu_man | older one |
| 02:11.46 | CIA-45 | openmoko: 03zecke 07softmenu-rework * r03d70badb46f 10/src/ (8 files in 4 dirs): [softmenu] Start using X Properties for the Soft Menu to avoid race conditions |
| 02:13.00 | mmu_man | seems the runner figures are a bit higher than the previous model |
| 02:13.25 | *** join/#openmoko HellDragon (i=jd@unaffiliated/helldragon) |
| 02:14.11 | mmu_man | aw, the limit is 1.6 now ? |
| 02:14.22 | mmu_man | odd, it seems to still be 2 in France |
| 02:21.01 | *** join/#openmoko xzcvczx_ (n=simon@ip-58-28-152-201.static-xdsl.xnet.co.nz) |
| 02:21.15 | mmu_man | n8 |
| 02:22.08 | xzcvczx_ | :S someone forgot ipkg out of latest daily build |
| 02:26.24 | CIA-45 | openmoko: 03werner * r4490 10/developers/werner/bin/mdflt: |
| 02:26.24 | CIA-45 | openmoko: mdflt: a simple Maildir (re)classifier that keeps me from completely drowning |
| 02:26.24 | CIA-45 | openmoko: in mails ... |
| 02:30.03 | xzcvczx_ | learns how to read and shuts up :S |
| 02:30.15 | kdean06 | http://www.wired.com/culture/lifestyle/commentary/alttext/2008/06/alttext_0618 |
| 02:30.52 | kdean06 | xzcvczx_, opkg has replaced ipkg. :) |
| 02:31.03 | kdean06 | learns how to read and shuts up. |
| 02:34.07 | xzcvczx_ | hmm getting 404's on all the daily-feed sigs :S |
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| 04:56.36 | wukong | hi everyone, I installed embedded.dev development environment, the error occurred, please guide: |
| 04:56.37 | wukong | ben@ben-desktop:~/oe/stuff$ mtn --version |
| 04:56.37 | wukong | monotone 0.37 (base revision: c21eefc002b8f9c430e9f4cc16c4af7b852f54ec) |
| 04:57.13 | wukong | ben@ben-desktop:~/oe/stuff$ mtn --db=/home/ben/oe/stuff/OE.mtn pull monotone.openembedded.org org.openembedded.dev |
| 04:57.14 | wukong | mtn: doing anonymous pull; use -kKEYNAME if you need authentication |
| 04:57.14 | wukong | mtn: connecting to monotone.openembedded.org |
| 04:57.14 | wukong | mtn: network error: failed to connect: tiem out |
| 04:57.28 | josch | ~pastebin |
| 04:57.29 | apt | [~pastebin] A "pastebin" is a web-based service where you can paste anything over 3 lines without flooding the channel. Here are links to a few : http://www.pastebin.com , http://pastebin.ca , http://channels.debian.net/paste , http://paste.lisp.org , http://www.rafb.net/paste |
| 04:57.55 | josch | wukong, maybe the server is currently offline? |
| 04:58.01 | josch | i would try again in a few hours |
| 04:59.46 | wukong | I have repeatedly linking the case, you have such a mistake? |
| 05:02.40 | *** join/#openmoko mbuf (n=shakthim@61.16.248.242) |
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| 05:09.27 | mwester | wukong: the development environment no longer uses monotone |
| 05:10.08 | hfsplus | ooh 4th of july |
| 05:10.10 | mwester | I think the instructions you are following are out of date. |
| 05:10.15 | hfsplus | before iphone even if that is on time... |
| 05:10.32 | hfsplus | saves money for a phone. |
| 05:11.07 | *** join/#openmoko Crfrod (n=Crfrod@88.214.193.26) |
| 05:11.53 | wukong | it seems git? |
| 05:12.36 | *** join/#openmoko Q_Continuum (i=kcbnac@flirtini.mintygreen.net) |
| 05:12.56 | wukong | mwester: it seems git? |
| 05:13.25 | Q_Continuum | Huzzah. Saw the latest Update. Just in time for me to stop getting paychecks, and start getting unemployment! Perfect time to buy an openmoko :P |
| 05:13.39 | mwester | wukong: yes, it is now git. |
| 05:15.08 | wukong | mwester:You have to update the document, I can not find how |
| 05:16.18 | mwester | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Mokomakefile |
| 05:17.25 | wukong | tks |
| 05:19.10 | opendeep | What is the difference between monotone and git? |
| 05:19.18 | *** join/#openmoko jeddy3 (n=mattiast@81-237-230-160-no83.tbcn.telia.com) |
| 05:19.27 | mbuf | opendeep, google around |
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| 05:29.01 | wukong | git be used kernel |
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| 05:32.13 | Pulpie | is openmoki going to be ported to bsd? |
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| 05:44.32 | wukong | hi ,new Mokomakefile error:( [ -e stamps/bitbake ] && \ |
| 05:44.33 | wukong | <PROTECTED> |
| 05:44.33 | wukong | <PROTECTED> |
| 05:44.33 | wukong | Initialized empty Git repository in /home/embed/openmoko/bitbake/.git/ |
| 05:44.33 | wukong | fatal: unable to connect a socket (Connection timed out) |
| 05:44.33 | wukong | fetch-pack from 'git://git.openmoko.org/git/bitbake.git' failed. |
| 05:44.35 | wukong | make: *** [setup-bitbake] Error 1 |
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| 06:24.50 | mbuf | build failed at linux-openmoko_2.6.24 |
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| 06:33.27 | methril | morning |
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| 06:36.37 | methril | mbuf mines break yesterday at that point (create a directory) at: {OM_DIR}/build/tmp/work/om-gta01-angstrom-linux-gnueabi/linux-openmoko-1_2.6.24+git20080618-ro/install |
| 06:37.30 | methril | but now, some prefered glibc version is missing |
| 06:38.33 | mbuf | methril, why only the 618, and not the 619? |
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| 06:38.50 | methril | it could be the 619 |
| 06:39.06 | methril | mine was the 618 because was yesterday |
| 06:39.07 | methril | :D |
| 06:40.12 | methril | it's still not working |
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| 07:02.42 | mbuf | methril, if it didn't build for us, how come they have a build image here for June 17, 18? http://buildhost.openmoko.org/daily/neo1973/deploy/glibc/images/neo1973/ |
| 07:02.56 | Hopscotch | good morning |
| 07:03.26 | methril | some missing things |
| 07:03.26 | mbuf | Hopscotch, morning |
| 07:03.28 | methril | := |
| 07:03.30 | methril | :) |
| 07:03.37 | methril | it's compiling right now |
| 07:03.41 | methril | i was out of space |
| 07:03.46 | starox | methril: for glibc, is it an mmap error ? I built successfully the asu.dev branch 2 days ago |
| 07:04.46 | mbuf | or, is it possible in OM or OE images for a specific date? |
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| 07:06.08 | methril | mbuf this is in development, |
| 07:06.17 | mbuf | methril, ok |
| 07:06.23 | methril | i think that it's normal that has errors |
| 07:07.01 | methril | they are temporal, but it takes so long then... until the error doesn't happens, you can not fix it |
| 07:07.10 | methril | :) |
| 07:07.11 | mbuf | methril, if we had an index of packages, and their version used on a particular build, we could just use that list to repeat builds |
| 07:07.39 | methril | maybe they have to make some "stable" images |
| 07:08.34 | hfsplus | will the Freerunner come with a preloaded OS or will we be required to build that ourselves? Is this in some FAQ I ought to be reading and not asking on here? |
| 07:08.38 | methril | if we make openmoko-devel-image, it's a WIP |
| 07:09.03 | methril | hfsplus, it comes with a preloaded OS |
| 07:09.26 | hfsplus | methril: okay cool. I am planning to purchase it as opposed to an iphone. |
| 07:09.32 | hfsplus | not that anyone cares, but hey :) |
| 07:11.07 | methril | but the OS maybe it's not really stable |
| 07:11.12 | methril | maybe |
| 07:11.13 | methril | :) |
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| 07:14.00 | hfsplus | I'm used to that,. lol |
| 07:17.34 | CIA-45 | openmoko: 03zecke * ra400c8c0b27f 10/src/ (8 files in 4 dirs): [softmenu] Start using X Properties for the Soft Menu to avoid race conditions |
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| 07:17.35 | CIA-45 | openmoko: 03zecke * r8cf4803382bb 10/src/ (8 files in 4 dirs): Merge branch 'softmenu-rework' |
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| 07:27.41 | tessier | When the freerunner arrives in July will it be usable as an actual daily use phone? Reasonably reliable? |
| 07:28.02 | hfsplus | I hope so, or I will feel silly :D |
| 07:28.47 | raster | prepares the clown shoes for hfsplus |
| 07:29.08 | hfsplus | woot! |
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| 07:30.30 | hfsplus | I have to change cell providers |
| 07:30.33 | hfsplus | GSM... bah |
| 07:31.10 | diego_at_work | good old gsm |
| 07:31.28 | hfsplus | my current provider is CDMA. |
| 07:31.30 | raster | hooray. phones that work all over the wold |
| 07:31.52 | diego_at_work | where are u from? |
| 07:32.16 | hfsplus | Canada here. |
| 07:33.23 | diego_at_work | Here in Italy don't sell cdma phone since 10 years ago |
| 07:33.58 | hfsplus | yeah, well... there's only 1 gsm provider here really |
| 07:34.07 | hfsplus | there were two, but Rogers bought Fido. |
| 07:34.09 | diego_at_work | or cdma = 3g ? |
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| 07:35.56 | raster | gsm (and gsm related - utms/hsdpa etc.) are by far the most common/ubiquitous phone technologies around the world |
| 07:36.12 | hfsplus | yep |
| 07:36.29 | hfsplus | I know, we got got crap CDMA cause we're next to the US and some idiots decided to use what they had |
| 07:36.31 | hfsplus | sucks. |
| 07:36.52 | hfsplus | So I shall change to gsm once the freerunner is order-able |
| 07:41.21 | raster | hopefully that isnt far away |
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| 07:44.13 | ScaredyCat | !logs |
| 07:44.14 | cdbot2 | Channel logs for #openmoko are archived at: |
| 07:44.15 | cdbot2 | http://hentges.net/tmp/logs/irc/%23openmoko |
| 07:44.15 | cdbot2 | Live-logs are available at |
| 07:44.17 | cdbot2 | http://hentges.net/tmp/logs/irc/livelogs/%23openmoko.livelog |
| 07:44.20 | cdbot2 | See ?? help-logs for usage instructions |
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| 07:52.37 | *** join/#openmoko kvk (n=vinu@61.16.248.242) |
| 07:53.31 | kvk | Hi, can i run gdb on OM2007.02,or any other debugger available? |
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| 08:15.21 | diego_at_work | kvk, yes |
| 08:15.36 | diego_at_work | just install it |
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| 08:42.35 | kvk | diego_at_work: ok, thanx |
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| 09:01.39 | CIA-45 | freesmartphone.org: 03heikki.paajanen * r4cab3a9fd22b 10/ (4 files in 2 dirs): |
| 09:01.39 | CIA-45 | freesmartphone.org: Clean device get info for consistency |
| 09:01.39 | CIA-45 | freesmartphone.org: Make tests run a little faster |
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| 09:10.27 | mbuf | methril, build completed |
| 09:11.24 | methril | nice!! i'll give a complete one yesterday, but now i had to restart it again |
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| 09:35.27 | CIA-45 | openmoko: 03zecke 07org.openmoko.asu.dev * r17b9cdadf37f 10/conf/distro/include/sane-srcrevs.inc: [srcrev] Upgrade Qtopia to get the softmenu rework. Some bugs should be fixed |
| 09:35.39 | CIA-45 | openmoko: 03zecke 07org.openmoko.asu.stable * r776d95cd9a2c 10/conf/distro/include/sane-srcrevs.inc: [srcrev] Upgrade Qtopia to get the softmenu rework. Some bugs should be fixed |
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| 09:48.39 | zlfita | does anyone know howto "wake up" emulated neo1973 on qemu |
| 09:49.05 | zlfita | it shut down processor due to being idle |
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| 10:43.16 | mmu_man | hmm it only lacks a camera :^) |
| 10:43.46 | mmu_man | the SD port should theorically be usable with SDIO to put an (overpriced) cam on, but it's under the battery :-( |
| 10:48.43 | *** join/#openmoko swc|666 (n=swc|666@unaffiliated/swc666/x-4934821) |
| 10:52.24 | mudyc | mmu_man: how about a bluetooth camera? |
| 10:52.36 | mmu_man | does that exist ? |
| 10:52.45 | mmu_man | oh BT-enabled regular camera |
| 10:52.48 | mmu_man | yeah |
| 10:52.56 | mmu_man | but I mean for EUR330... :) |
| 10:53.05 | mudyc | has much better optics too |
| 10:53.18 | mmu_man | right |
| 10:53.19 | mudyc | actually such a device does not exist |
| 10:53.35 | mudyc | according to my memory... |
| 10:54.01 | mudyc | year ago there were two bt enabled cameras |
| 10:54.17 | *** join/#openmoko Dominus (n=SuN@82-170-225-106.ip.telfort.nl) |
| 10:54.23 | ebbe | How about a usb-camera |
| 10:54.43 | mudyc | as long as bt speed is too slow for transfering images there won't exist more |
| 10:55.17 | mmu_man | right, for a single shot photo it might work but not video conferencing |
| 10:55.41 | mjr | personally I'd find bt support in cameras useful |
| 10:55.45 | mmu_man | it's just a shame the SD port isn't outside, as there are SDIO cameras, expensive though |
| 10:55.47 | mjr | but noo... |
| 10:55.49 | XorA | why not a wifi camera |
| 10:56.08 | mjr | yeah with the fr that's of course an option |
| 10:56.13 | mjr | those are crazy expensive :) |
| 10:56.42 | ebbe | Just use a normal usb-webcam, or have I missed some of this discussion? |
| 10:57.03 | mudyc | wifi is actually more used than bt in cameras |
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| 10:58.37 | mjr | mudyc, yeah, it is. Pretty high-end stuff though. |
| 10:59.19 | mjr | I mean, bt would be cheap to tack on to some pocket cam... |
| 11:04.16 | mmu_man | ebbe hmm usb webcam might be useful btu not really handy on the go |
| 11:04.28 | mmu_man | besides you need the driver for the exact model and there are so many |
| 11:04.51 | swc|666 | is there any inclination of how many frerunners will be available for sale? |
| 11:06.04 | *** join/#openmoko jonwil (n=jonwil@121.221.230.164) |
| 11:06.20 | jonwil | hi |
| 11:06.20 | mmu_man | dunno |
| 11:07.22 | jonwil | Is there information out there on the next phone after the Freerunner (GTA02)? |
| 11:07.35 | jonwil | I see bits and pieces in various mailing list posting talking about camera for example |
| 11:07.37 | jonwil | but no actual info |
| 11:08.06 | swc|666 | what is the best way to asure that one can get a freeruner... the mailing list? |
| 11:09.10 | ebbe | swc|666: Sign up with on the group-order page on the wiki |
| 11:09.30 | ebbe | speaks lousy english :) |
| 11:09.55 | mjr | jonwil, gta03 will be a less than revolutionary update, by current info will have a new case, a bit faster edge data, a camera and no gpu |
| 11:09.59 | swc|666 | ebbe: group-order! thank you ... i did not see tat before |
| 11:11.09 | *** join/#openmoko Dominus (n=SuN@82-170-225-106.ip.telfort.nl) |
| 11:11.59 | jonwil | #1 wish for openmoko seems to be quad band (or at the very least, tri-band with a way to switch bands) |
| 11:12.20 | *** part/#openmoko willie_chen (n=willie@firewall.tw.openmoko.org) |
| 11:12.40 | mjr | yeah that thing, one hopes the 03 will be quad band, this time really |
| 11:13.02 | mmu_man | 3G would be nice I suppose |
| 11:13.04 | mjr | (I don't need it but) |
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| 11:13.23 | mjr | mmu_man, yes, but it's not in the cards at least until 04 |
| 11:13.25 | jonwil | Good luck finding a vendor who will sell you a 3G chipset thats open enough for OpenMoko |
| 11:13.44 | mmu_man | the openmoko site still lists job offers, are they still on ? :) |
| 11:13.53 | jonwil | What happened with the GPU on openmoko anyway? |
| 11:13.58 | mmu_man | though I think taiwan is a bit far for me for now |
| 11:14.10 | mjr | jonwil, turned out it's not that great. Sure, it has some good sides, but limitations as well |
| 11:14.34 | mmu_man | doesn't it have doc under NDA ? |
| 11:14.43 | mjr | Yes, it has. |
| 11:14.50 | *** join/#openmoko Savago (n=adenilso@192.100.104.170) |
| 11:15.25 | jonwil | I think from what I read basically the issue there is that OpenMoko people dont have the time or whatever to write proper drivers and because of NDA no-one else can see the docs to do it |
| 11:15.36 | jonwil | so thats why GPU is just a glorified framebuffer right now |
| 11:15.51 | mjr | well, it's not quite that bad |
| 11:15.55 | mmu_man | yeah that's a shame still |
| 11:16.06 | mmu_man | but I suppose gamers will get a GP2X instead anyway :D |
| 11:16.30 | jonwil | yeah, OpenMoko is not for games, its a phone |
| 11:17.19 | mmu_man | still, for its price it'd be nice, and the frontier is blurring between devices nowadays |
| 11:17.19 | mjr | balrog-kun has been doing eg. support for the gpu mpeg4 decoding, apparently om's libglamo was enough information to get started (correct me if I'm wrong) |
| 11:17.43 | mmu_man | is ffmpeg (libavcodec) used yet ? |
| 11:17.47 | mmu_man | there is an arm port |
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| 11:18.07 | jonwil | me, I would definatly be interested in an OpenMoko phone if the form factor was different (i.e. phone style form factor with keypad not touchscreen like GTA02) |
| 11:18.08 | mmu_man | well it probably is if you use gstreamer |
| 11:18.30 | balrog-kun | mjr: libglamo and the wince driver |
| 11:18.37 | mmu_man | as for me I just don't like the roundy look but that's just taste |
| 11:18.42 | balrog-kun | mmu_man: ffmpeg/libavcodec are part of mplayer |
| 11:18.50 | mjr | the glamo output driver is in mplayer, which does use ffmpeg. ffmpeg isn't that interesting though since you can bog down the gpu bus if you decompress on the cpu |
| 11:18.50 | mmu_man | no |
| 11:18.52 | balrog-kun | mmu_man: it worked out of the box when i compiled mplayer |
| 11:19.00 | mjr | balrog-kun, 'kay |
| 11:19.01 | mmu_man | it is used by mplayer (and hosted on the same svn) |
| 11:19.15 | balrog-kun | mmu_man: but the point of using the gpu is to avoid usinf ffmpeg (softwarE) |
| 11:19.21 | *** join/#openmoko t_s_o (n=tso@117.84-49-132.nextgentel.com) |
| 11:19.22 | mmu_man | but it's also used by all and every linux player, (xine, vlc) and many others |
| 11:19.41 | mmu_man | I even wrote an FFDecoder add-ons for BeOS that provides native apps with lavc codecs |
| 11:19.57 | balrog-kun | just saying that you don't need a special port for arm, it "just works" |
| 11:20.20 | mmu_man | balrog-kun yes of course. though I think there is plan to support an acceleration API from ffmpeg itself |
| 11:20.56 | mmu_man | (having arm optimzed asm really help speedwise you know:D) |
| 11:21.07 | mmu_man | http://freedesktop.org/wiki/Software/vaapi |
| 11:21.11 | balrog-kun | mmu_man: hmm may be a good idea |
| 11:21.24 | jonwil | The camera planned for GTA03, is that video or just picture? |
| 11:21.29 | jonwil | Or has the camera not been decided yet? |
| 11:21.40 | balrog-kun | on the other hand ffmpeg does only decoding, while accelerators usually accelerate decoding *and* showing on the screen |
| 11:21.46 | balrog-kun | rather than decoding only |
| 11:22.02 | *** join/#openmoko Sup3rkiddo (n=sudharsh@unaffiliated/sudharsh) |
| 11:22.14 | mmu_man | right |
| 11:22.48 | mmu_man | on BeOS they would just show up as dormant media nodes accepting encoded viceo |
| 11:23.01 | *** join/#openmoko jonwil (n=jonwil@121.221.230.164) |
| 11:23.07 | mmu_man | and the media player would just check if they support the format before instanciating a decoder node |
| 11:23.20 | mmu_man | s/BeOS/BeOS and Haiku/ |
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| 11:24.38 | balrog-kun | media nodes are something beos/haiku specific, i.e. non-unix? |
| 11:25.14 | balrog-kun | needs to play with it one day |
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| 11:31.17 | mmu_man | balrog-kun yes, though I think gstreamer has a similar concept |
| 11:31.26 | mmu_man | windows as well with directshow |
| 11:31.32 | mmu_man | but BeOS had that 10 years ago :) |
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| 11:46.23 | mickeyl | morning folks |
| 11:46.48 | jonwil | morning |
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| 11:48.52 | `pwgen` | good morning mickey |
| 11:48.59 | mickeyl | hey pwgen! |
| 11:50.08 | `pwgen` | i did a fso-image build yesterday.. please readd mickeyterm or remove mickeyterm from the fso-image.bb |
| 11:51.50 | mickeyl | hmm, readd or remove? |
| 11:51.55 | mickeyl | what's wrong? :) |
| 11:51.56 | `pwgen` | and zhone will not start the gui without gsm card (:-)) |
| 11:52.06 | mickeyl | oh it will start, just press X |
| 11:52.27 | mickeyl | at least it _should_ start |
| 11:52.34 | mickeyl | (note that you need to reboot first time after installation) |
| 11:53.06 | mickeyl | as for building fso-image, you need to |
| 11:53.10 | mickeyl | require moko-autorev.inc |
| 11:53.13 | mickeyl | require fso-autorev.inc |
| 11:53.19 | mickeyl | in your local.conf to get the latest versions |
| 11:53.29 | mickeyl | that might be the reason mickeyterm (and other stuff) is failing |
| 11:53.31 | `pwgen` | some days ago i could git the mickeyterm from freesmatphone .. now its not there and the fso image had build-dependency |
| 11:53.35 | mickeyl | sorry i did not mention that yesterday |
| 11:54.20 | `pwgen` | i removed mickeyterm it by myself from fso-image.bb so build didnt fail .. |
| 11:55.56 | mickeyl | right, i guess this is because it's missing a well-known source rev in conf/distro/include/sane-srcrevs.inc |
| 11:56.01 | mickeyl | will add that |
| 11:56.13 | mickeyl | and also bump the sourcerevs so that the default points to milestone1 versions |
| 11:56.26 | mickeyl | since we're going to break it a little bit until milestone2 |
| 11:56.29 | mickeyl | :) |
| 11:56.41 | *** join/#openmoko edistar_ (n=edistar@ip503ddd09.speed.planet.nl) |
| 11:57.50 | `pwgen` | how do i get rid of the GSM PIN |
| 11:58.01 | mickeyl | close the window |
| 11:58.04 | mickeyl | [X] |
| 11:58.11 | mickeyl | bottom right |
| 11:58.58 | mickeyl | it doesn't differenciate between SIM.NotPresent and SIM.NotAllowed yet |
| 11:59.13 | mickeyl | that's why it thinks you have to add a PIN if +CFUN=1 fails |
| 11:59.14 | mickeyl | :) |
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| 12:00.21 | `pwgen` | i think there is an howto to unpin a gsmcard |
| 12:00.42 | `pwgen` | <PROTECTED> |
| 12:00.51 | `pwgen` | s/alt/at/ |
| 12:01.21 | mickeyl | ah, you mean you don't want to be asked your PIN ? |
| 12:01.25 | mickeyl | that's easy |
| 12:02.16 | mickeyl | let me lookup the command |
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| 12:02.38 | `pwgen` | YES ,,, how do i get rid off this ( and then ,i hope no one will steal my gsm card ) |
| 12:03.10 | mickeyl | AT+CLCK,"SC",0 |
| 12:03.20 | mickeyl | iirc |
| 12:04.38 | *** join/#openmoko surf2me (n=surfer@unixboard/users/surf2me) |
| 12:04.38 | hepaajan | try at+clck="SC",0,"<yourpin>" |
| 12:04.57 | mickeyl | right, this command needs the PIN |
| 12:06.35 | hepaajan | has anyone got a problem with svn.berlios.de? (svn: Can't connect to host 'svn.berlios.de': Connection refused) |
| 12:07.14 | mickeyl | berlios has problems, yea |
| 12:07.43 | woglinde | hepaajan yes happens often |
| 12:07.55 | woglinde | maybee berlios didnt pay networktraffic again |
| 12:07.57 | woglinde | *g* |
| 12:08.01 | mickeyl | berlios becomes the new sourceforge, in terms of reliability |
| 12:09.09 | hepaajan | mickeyl: is moko-autorev.inc needed for building fso-image? |
| 12:09.22 | mickeyl | let me say i didn't try without |
| 12:09.25 | mickeyl | so yes, I'd recommend it |
| 12:09.33 | mickeyl | and |
| 12:09.38 | mickeyl | fso-autorev.inc |
| 12:09.49 | mickeyl | although we hardly use any om2007.2 packages |
| 12:10.34 | hepaajan | Well I guess I'll just have to test without moko-autorev since berlios svn is down :) |
| 12:10.40 | mickeyl | ah |
| 12:10.42 | mickeyl | just remove two entries |
| 12:10.45 | mickeyl | openocd |
| 12:10.47 | mickeyl | openocd-native |
| 12:10.49 | mickeyl | from moko-autorev |
| 12:10.52 | mickeyl | that should do t |
| 12:11.00 | mickeyl | we don't grab anything else from berlios |
| 12:11.17 | mickeyl | goes to finish multiparty call handling |
| 12:11.30 | woglinde | hehe |
| 12:11.32 | hepaajan | mickeyl: ok. thanks |
| 12:11.46 | woglinde | mickeyl only wrapping some AT commands? |
| 12:11.46 | mickeyl | now that i discovered local hold and remote hold are two different things *cough* ;) |
| 12:11.56 | dcordes | mickeyl: I need that fso video :) |
| 12:12.00 | mickeyl | well, bumping that state machine |
| 12:12.06 | mickeyl | dcordes: oooh, right |
| 12:12.11 | mickeyl | i should do that first |
| 12:12.16 | woglinde | mickeyl AH your blog entry |
| 12:12.17 | dcordes | would be great! |
| 12:12.37 | mickeyl | woglinde: yep :) |
| 12:13.28 | mmu_man | hepaajan no it's not |
| 12:13.35 | mmu_man | they just switched again to https |
| 12:13.39 | mmu_man | (and http) |
| 12:13.51 | mmu_man | is you used svn+ssh:// you can do: |
| 12:13.59 | mmu_man | svn switch --relocate svn+ssh:// https:// |
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| 12:14.14 | mmu_man | for anon svn the url is different IIRC |
| 12:14.49 | dcordes | mmu_man: hai finished haiku port yet :D |
| 12:15.01 | mmu_man | not yet started :D |
| 12:15.08 | mmu_man | want to help ? |
| 12:16.42 | dcordes | no my kernel porting capacities are already filled. Also I won't be much of help for you |
| 12:16.44 | hepaajan | mmu_man: oh well, then openocd recipes just need some tweaking |
| 12:17.15 | mmu_man | hmm the SAR figures aren't very clear on http://people.openmoko.org/tony_tu/GTA02/certificate/NCC/TA7O1104_R01_CNS14959_FIC_GTA02_2008.01.02.pdf |
| 12:17.33 | mmu_man | there is a summary but no single number as usual on brochures |
| 12:17.48 | mmu_man | which is the one that corresponds to the usual number ? |
| 12:17.53 | mmu_man | (page33) |
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| 12:19.28 | dcordes | mmu_man: what's so important about that? |
| 12:19.38 | mmu_man | health! |
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| 12:20.09 | mmu_man | there are growing suspitions about the effect of microwaves on brain cells... |
| 12:20.16 | mmu_man | so the lower the healthier |
| 12:20.35 | mmu_man | it's just precaution |
| 12:21.00 | dcordes | mmu_man: german governmental organisation just released the result of a study which states there's no harm to the human body from using cell phones |
| 12:21.12 | dcordes | maybe it was vodafone funded ^^ |
| 12:21.19 | mmu_man | s/maybe/certainly/ |
| 12:21.29 | dcordes | it had a very high impact on the media |
| 12:21.29 | mmu_man | :) |
| 12:21.36 | dns53 | there have not been any large enough studies to prove anything |
| 12:21.45 | mmu_man | yes, french health services did as well... |
| 12:21.58 | mmu_man | but some other studies show that might be different |
| 12:22.07 | dcordes | well they say they can't tell about kids but for adults they say, they'd be quite sure |
| 12:22.18 | mmu_man | it's just like GMO... big market = big company = big lobbies |
| 12:22.23 | dcordes | big FUD |
| 12:22.46 | dcordes | actually nothing useful is spit out of that large system of contrasting studies |
| 12:22.50 | mmu_man | anyway, not a reason to not limit power |
| 12:22.58 | mmu_man | it also increases battery life :) |
| 12:23.30 | dcordes | yea right the way we tick is electric so we shouldn't surround us with too much electromagnetic stuffs |
| 12:23.36 | dcordes | easy calculation ^^ |
| 12:24.03 | mmu_man | plus all energy we absorbe doesn't go to the relay, so... |
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| 12:25.13 | mmu_man | re :) |
| 12:25.38 | SpeedEvil | relay? |
| 12:26.01 | dcordes_ | mmu_man: you mean it deoesn't disappear in black holes? |
| 12:26.16 | SpeedEvil | Anyway - if you care - you don't want to be looking at the SAR number. |
| 12:26.32 | dcordes_ | haha |
| 12:26.34 | mmu_man | the hotspot I mean |
| 12:26.35 | SpeedEvil | You want to be using a bluetooth headset, and have the phone well away from your head. |
| 12:26.42 | mmu_man | eh, I do want :) |
| 12:26.48 | mmu_man | yes that seems the sanest solution |
| 12:27.04 | SpeedEvil | Bluetooth has a order of magnitude or two lower SAR than any phone. |
| 12:27.05 | ebbe | Just don't keep it in your pocket either .. |
| 12:27.21 | mmu_man | some studies showed that headset with coords actually don't protect much, as the wires act as antenna |
| 12:27.30 | SpeedEvil | Yeah - hence BT. |
| 12:27.48 | mmu_man | ebbe yeah, family jewels... |
| 12:27.55 | mmu_man | but then where can one put it ? |
| 12:27.59 | ebbe | Exactly |
| 12:28.25 | mmu_man | maybe we'll end up selling pants with phone pockets at the bottom |
| 12:28.31 | mmu_man | or on the shoes :) |
| 12:28.34 | ebbe | Keep in a trolly a few meters behind you.. |
| 12:28.42 | mmu_man | hmm oh! |
| 12:28.53 | mmu_man | or with a balloon of helium |
| 12:29.01 | mmu_man | 4 meters up |
| 12:29.05 | ebbe | Good idea :) |
| 12:29.32 | SpeedEvil | There are valid alternatives. |
| 12:29.36 | SpeedEvil | http://collectingtokens.files.wordpress.com/2007/06/teletubbies_dipsy.jpg |
| 12:29.47 | SpeedEvil | An antenna on your hat. |
| 12:30.10 | SpeedEvil | It could even have a steerable wifi dish. |
| 12:30.12 | ebbe | And a green protection suit |
| 12:30.13 | mmu_man | :) |
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| 12:32.24 | SpeedEvil | With an external screen of course. |
| 12:36.25 | `pwgen` | cool dbus support for the realtimeclock . |
| 12:36.32 | mickey|fsoVideo | :D |
| 12:36.49 | mickey|fsoVideo | i've not been lazy in the last couple of months |
| 12:37.29 | `pwgen` | i see i see .. |
| 12:40.39 | `pwgen` | what is the intention for the usage-daemon ? |
| 12:42.25 | mickey|fsoVideo | reference counting for subsystem usage |
| 12:42.27 | mickey|fsoVideo | i.e. |
| 12:42.30 | mickey|fsoVideo | application A wants gps |
| 12:42.32 | mickey|fsoVideo | requests it |
| 12:42.39 | mickey|fsoVideo | if its the first, gps is going to get switched on |
| 12:42.42 | mickey|fsoVideo | app B... |
| 12:42.44 | mickey|fsoVideo | app C... |
| 12:42.53 | `pwgen` | ahh |
| 12:42.53 | mickey|fsoVideo | if the last app quits, gps will be switched off |
| 12:42.55 | mickey|fsoVideo | :D |
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| 12:43.11 | mmu_man | aw, doesnt the driver handle this on the last close() ? |
| 12:43.34 | mmu_man | oh it's handled on a regular tty line... |
| 12:44.03 | zedstar | slightly OT....trying to build a package with bitbake it failed to fetch a tarball as it didnt locate it....anyone know what files i can edit so that i can manually get the tarball and for the build to proceed |
| 12:44.26 | mmu_man | no idea, Haiku uses Jam :) |
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| 12:56.04 | `pwgen` | mickeyl: http://pastebin.com/m223a772d ophoned missing python dependency |
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| 13:01.09 | mickey|fsoVideo | sounds like you did not have fso-autorev included |
| 13:01.14 | mickey|fsoVideo | this was a problem in earlier revisions |
| 13:02.00 | `pwgen` | that may be true (;-(( but my buildsystem at home is off |
| 13:02.50 | `pwgen` | how do I include fso-autorev ( in local.conf ? ) |
| 13:04.04 | mickey|fsoVideo | echo "require conf/distro/include/fso-autorev" >>local.conf |
| 13:04.31 | mickey|fsoVideo | err |
| 13:04.34 | mickey|fsoVideo | echo "require conf/distro/include/fso-autorev.inc" >>local.conf |
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| 13:11.25 | `pwgen` | i will try it when i am back at home .. |
| 13:12.47 | *** part/#openmoko LetoTo (n=paul@bofh.xelerance.com) |
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| 13:26.11 | emdete | mickey|fsoVideo: why dont the deamons do that by their own? why invent a new one? |
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| 13:39.40 | SpeedEvil | emdete: because the individual programs can't know stuff |
| 13:39.56 | SpeedEvil | Or rather - probably shouldn't know stuff. |
| 13:41.09 | SpeedEvil | For example, should every application that wants the internet know that it may have to terminate a call? |
| 13:42.14 | wibbit | SpeedEvil: yup |
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| 13:43.05 | SpeedEvil | wibbit: you're going to teach ping how to pop up a dialog and ask the user? |
| 13:43.11 | SpeedEvil | (as a degenerate example) |
| 13:43.18 | wibbit | Yup |
| 13:46.09 | wibbit | :) |
| 13:46.10 | woglinde | lol |
| 13:49.41 | *** join/#openmoko J_P (n=jpillati@189.2.146.45) |
| 13:49.44 | J_P | hi all |
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| 13:55.59 | CIA-45 | freesmartphone.org: 03sudharsh * rd47801bdcf5d 10/odeviced/src/plugins/backlight/ (backlight.c backlight.h backlight.vala): Added Set and Get Backlight |
| 13:56.32 | emdete | SpeedEvil: thats a different case i think, that's a ruleset not reference counting... |
| 13:57.48 | summatusmentis | so is it bad that I dreamed last night that my current cell carrier got bought out by a gsm provider, which then turned off all the cdma towers, forced us onto gsm, and handed out FreeRunners to all the previous customers of cdma? |
| 13:58.13 | summatusmentis | I think they call that obsession |
| 13:58.15 | jonwil | Its only bad because it was a dream and not real |
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| 13:58.31 | summatusmentis | jonwil: :-D |
| 13:59.03 | wibbit | I would hate to be manning openmoko's helpdesk on the day/week/month that happened |
| 13:59.16 | jonwil | Thankfully Australia has no more CDMA, only GSM and UMTS now |
| 13:59.35 | *** join/#openmoko zerghase (n=zerghase@dslb-088-065-138-199.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 13:59.36 | summatusmentis | The US is still as backwards as ever about networks |
| 14:00.03 | woglinde | hm |
| 14:00.11 | woglinde | didnt was cdma more robust then gms |
| 14:00.18 | woglinde | gsm |
| 14:00.28 | jonwil | CDMA is aparently better because it has longer range than GSM |
| 14:00.31 | *** join/#openmoko dcordes (n=dcordes@unaffiliated/dcordes) |
| 14:00.43 | summatusmentis | right, and so is easier to cover rural areas |
| 14:00.50 | summatusmentis | happens to live in rural areas |
| 14:00.58 | woglinde | then why austrial switched too gsm? |
| 14:01.15 | jonwil | no, Australia switched from CDMA to UMTS |
| 14:01.20 | woglinde | ??? |
| 14:01.38 | woglinde | umts is worser in range than gsm |
| 14:01.49 | summatusmentis | most of the US is going either LTE or wi-max for it's 4g network |
| 14:02.35 | jonwil | Telstra used to run AMPS at 850MHz way back when. Then they replaced that with CDMA running at 850MHz |
| 14:02.45 | jonwil | and now they replaced the CDMA with UMTS at 850MHz |
| 14:03.14 | *** join/#openmoko retracile (n=eli@66.205.179.175) |
| 14:03.21 | jonwil | Soemthing to do with the 850MHz is why they can get range out of it |
| 14:03.37 | woglinde | jonwill ah okay yes that made sense |
| 14:04.12 | *** join/#openmoko Dominus (i=unices@ip5652ade4.speed.planet.nl) |
| 14:05.42 | jonwil | The good thing is that you can use any UMTS850 phone on the network |
| 14:05.51 | jonwil | although some phones work better in the bush than others |
| 14:06.04 | *** join/#openmoko xcasex (n=rrg@ua-83-227-156-234.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se) |
| 14:06.29 | jonwil | I wonder if Verizon Wireless will ever move to something that lets you use a phone they didnt sell you (and lock down)... :P |
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| 14:08.00 | mickey|fsoVideo | emdete: (usaged) because there's an interesting chance to start monitoring/statistics et. al. if you let the usaged do this |
| 14:08.21 | *** join/#openmoko edistar (n=edistar@ip503ddd09.speed.planet.nl) |
| 14:08.24 | mickey|fsoVideo | a centralized place of resource management may also tie into cpufreq handling |
| 14:08.30 | mickey|fsoVideo | and suspend/resume handling |
| 14:09.08 | jonwil | Personally, I see no great benifit in 3G, the big move IMO will be towards networks like Wi-Max where everything is just an IP packet (including voice calls and SMS) |
| 14:10.00 | woglinde | jonwill yes this will come |
| 14:10.27 | woglinde | but then security is a hot topic |
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| 14:10.57 | Robot101 | ....? the benefit of 3G is it's already deployed and easily upgradable to huge speeds with HSDPA |
| 14:11.05 | Robot101 | nobody in europe is rushing to do any wimax stuff |
| 14:11.08 | jonwil | in europe yes |
| 14:11.11 | jonwil | but in USA no |
| 14:11.17 | jonwil | in USA very little 3G |
| 14:12.05 | ebbe_ | And in Denmark, no one is really using 3g. Too expensive |
| 14:12.11 | jonwil | but then again, USA mobile networks are screwed up in other ways compared to rest of world |
| 14:12.12 | balrog-kun | netherlands relled out wimax converage recently i hear |
| 14:12.17 | balrog-kun | rolled |
| 14:12.23 | jonwil | Like that thing where people have to pay for incoming calls |
| 14:12.40 | jonwil | here in australia, if I ring someone mobile phone, I am the one that pay, not them |
| 14:12.58 | *** part/#openmoko arbue (n=arbue@212.192.251.106) |
| 14:13.16 | woglinde | thats crazy |
| 14:13.41 | balrog-kun | in USA it's the other way? |
| 14:13.54 | methril | yes, but in europe it's going to happen |
| 14:14.02 | methril | sadly |
| 14:14.11 | methril | are the news talking about |
| 14:14.21 | balrog-kun | whoah |
| 14:14.41 | jonwil | I think it should be always that the person who makes the phone calls pays for the phone call, never the person recieving the calls (reverse charge calls being the exception) |
| 14:14.45 | tomjoad | in the USA both ends usually pay |
| 14:15.04 | jonwil | even more stupid |
| 14:15.09 | tomjoad | if both are mobile phones |
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| 14:18.03 | Q_Continuum | So I have to ask - I wasn't able to find it on the website (probably just looking in the wrong places) but I know there used to be a page with the current capabilities of the software, and what was in the next stages, etc. |
| 14:18.41 | CIA-45 | freesmartphone.org: 03jluebbe * r900105c27bd1 10/ (5 files in 2 dirs): Add simple screen lock |
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| 14:50.28 | |cody| | So I uninstalled the keyboard on my openmoko in hopes of getting a keyboard instead of the 1-9 texting keyboard, but now I can't find where to download the software keyboard. Does anyone know where I can get this? |
| 14:52.11 | |cody| | I would like the keyboard that you can get in the "Dock Keyboard Mode" |
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| 14:55.39 | |cody| | keyboard |
| 14:55.58 | *** join/#openmoko Daemonax (i=daemonax@59.56.35.171) |
| 14:56.12 | Daemonax | Shit..... It's still not out? :-\ |
| 15:02.58 | CIA-45 | freesmartphone.org: 03mickey * rfcf6f975b18d 10/odeviced/modules/idlenotifier.py: python-ophoned: fix time between IDLE_PRELOCK and LOCK |
| 15:04.19 | |cody| | So these are the instructions that I followed to change my keyboard: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Switching_Keyboards but I can't download the matchbox keyboard. When I run the second command there it gives me an error and tells me to run opkg update. |
| 15:04.37 | *** join/#openmoko xcasex (n=rrg@ua-83-227-156-234.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se) |
| 15:04.49 | ebbe | |cody|: The old keyboard isn't in opkg repository |
| 15:06.19 | |cody| | ebbe: So is it necessary to download ipkg? |
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| 15:07.38 | ebbe | |cody|: That wont help, but maybe some of these have it: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Repositories |
| 15:12.12 | dcordes | mickeyl: got the vid? |
| 15:12.23 | mickeyl | ~lart youtube |
| 15:12.23 | apt | takes a large goose feather pillow and swings it wildly in youtube's direction, hitting youtube and sending youtube flying into the closet |
| 15:12.24 | CIA-45 | openmoko: 03julian_chu 07org.openmoko.asu.dev * r30e9106df872 10/packages/openmoko-projects/ (2 files in 2 dirs): [diversity] Diversity team create a branch for splinter. |
| 15:12.34 | mickeyl | i tried uploading it but it always times out |
| 15:12.47 | mickeyl | i'm now converting it to something smaller |
| 15:12.56 | mickeyl | seems 45 MB are too huge for youtube |
| 15:14.55 | dcordes | mickeyl: put it in my ~ |
| 15:15.43 | dcordes | or somewhere else on ltg |
| 15:21.33 | Sup3rkiddo | mickeyl, :O, you do music videos? |
| 15:21.53 | dcordes | mickeyl: the full quality would be nice |
| 15:22.08 | mickeyl | not really |
| 15:22.08 | mickeyl | dcordes: nah, you don't want the full quality |
| 15:22.20 | dcordes | oks |
| 15:25.58 | mickeyl | DV is over 100 MB or what |
| 15:25.58 | mickeyl | i do slight compression, which should be ok |
| 15:25.58 | mickeyl | uploading... |
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| 15:26.50 | woglinde | hm when will mickeyl buy a hdtv cam |
| 15:28.29 | mickeyl | never |
| 15:28.39 | mickeyl | i hardly used my dv cam in 8 years now |
| 15:28.50 | mickeyl | my wife will never allow me to buy another one until I'm using this one frequently |
| 15:29.57 | balrog-kun | spill some coffee in it and say it was an accident |
| 15:31.18 | mickeyl | http://downloads.openmoko.org/framework/milestone1/FrameworkMilestone1.m4v |
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| 15:32.28 | dcordes | mickeyl: I'm so confused on the current situation with asu, zhone, fso, gtk qtopia |
| 15:32.34 | dcordes | is milestone1=zhone? |
| 15:32.46 | dcordes | is downloading |
| 15:32.50 | mickeyl | zhone is the phone UI we're using to test our framework |
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| 15:34.15 | mickeyl | i'll try to find time to respond to Kevin's mail on device-owners |
| 15:34.20 | mickeyl | clearing up the situation |
| 15:34.24 | mickeyl | hopefully tomorro |
| 15:34.25 | mickeyl | w |
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| 15:35.12 | josch | lol re |
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| 15:36.35 | dcordes | mickeyl: marvellous thanks a lot |
| 15:36.40 | mickeyl | np |
| 15:36.45 | ebbe | mickeyl: Like your conversation with the Neo on the video :) |
| 15:36.48 | mickeyl | quality will be even better for milestone2 ;) |
| 15:36.50 | mickeyl | ebbe: :) |
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| 15:37.42 | dcordes | haha the call is great |
| 15:38.21 | mickeyl | next milestone will feature multiparty handling... _that_'ll be fun to demo ;)) |
| 15:38.26 | mickeyl | i need some assistants by then |
| 15:38.33 | dcordes | ringtone rocks |
| 15:38.44 | dcordes | I'll call you from kaiser |
| 15:39.16 | dcordes | it's pretty koom |
| 15:39.59 | ebbe | When I tried calling on my gta01 there's still a small echo, is this hardware? Because it's been there for a long time now |
| 15:41.03 | mickeyl | hahaha |
| 15:41.35 | mickeyl | ebbe: yeah, pretty likely hardware not being shielded enough. we may do some more finetuning with the alsa controls, but i don't really count on it |
| 15:41.36 | xzcvczx_ | is happy.... his 01 fixed itself |
| 15:41.59 | ebbe | mickeyl: It's better on gta02? |
| 15:42.07 | mickeyl | unfortunately not |
| 15:42.45 | ebbe | Oh well, it's not that bad |
| 15:43.19 | SpeedEvil | microlith: any update on GTA01 GSM firmware updaters? |
| 15:43.22 | SpeedEvil | mick: |
| 15:43.43 | mickeyl | no idea, tbh |
| 15:43.54 | mickeyl | i've updated people to moko9-beta1 on LinuxTag |
| 15:43.59 | mickeyl | well, shoragan did :) |
| 15:44.23 | mickeyl | i'll ask whether there's any status chance next time |
| 15:44.27 | mickeyl | change, even |
| 15:44.32 | SpeedEvil | Thanks. |
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| 15:54.59 | `pwgen` | mikeyl: how do you get python-config in your fso-image ? |
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| 16:10.02 | J_P | Is possible install openmoko in another cellphone? N95 8gb for example ? |
| 16:12.02 | dcordes | J_P: depends on whether or not the linux kernel runs on that device I guess |
| 16:12.24 | dcordes | J_P: n95 is symbian? |
| 16:12.59 | `pwgen` | mickeyl: how do you get python-config in your fso-image ? installing by hand ? |
| 16:13.15 | mickeyl | which python-config? |
| 16:13.31 | mickeyl | the error you have seen is because you need a newer set of daemons |
| 16:13.37 | mickeyl | it was a bug that has been fixed since |
| 16:13.50 | mickeyl | include fso-autorev.inc and rebuild |
| 16:13.55 | `pwgen` | http://pastebin.com/m768bdff3 |
| 16:14.22 | mickeyl | yes |
| 16:14.37 | mickeyl | this is not just a missing python module |
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| 16:27.00 | J_P | dcordes: yes. wymbiam, why ? |
| 16:27.23 | J_P | dcordes: are there a lista the cellphones where is possible install openmoko ? |
| 16:27.25 | *** join/#openmoko sindre (n=sindre@062016243239.customer.alfanett.no) |
| 16:27.27 | dcordes | J_P: if it had windows mobile you could poke around with haret a bit |
| 16:27.45 | dcordes | J_P: did you google a bit on linux port to n95? |
| 16:28.50 | J_P | dcordes: no .. I will do that :-) |
| 16:29.11 | dcordes | I'm not aware of such a list |
| 16:29.55 | J_P | ok.. |
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| 16:31.06 | dcordes | but it wouldn't be too long I guess. you got the two moko phones, the motorola ezx phones..., ..? |
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| 16:31.50 | dcordes | I tried to make up a usable image for htc blueangel once but the UI didn't quite work with the qvgadisplay |
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| 17:14.19 | doc|work | so, I just checked planet.om.o and am wondering why the top post is there? Not wanting to silence opinions or anything but seems to just not really be relevant |
| 17:15.11 | doc|work | (also, relating to his opinion, seems a bit unjustified given the phone hasn't been finished but *shrug*) |
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| 17:21.31 | summatusmentis | doc|work: it's a planet, it just pulls posts from people's blogs. Presumably the people tag the post or something |
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| 17:25.37 | balrog-kun | yeah, it's just a blog |
| 17:26.38 | balrog-kun | a diary, with anything that mentions openmoko |
| 17:30.11 | doc|work | balrog-kun: yeah, but does it pull it from every random blog or people who are in some way related to openmoko? |
| 17:30.27 | wurp2 | They have a list of the blogs they pull from on the left |
| 17:30.40 | wurp2 | doc|work: I agree with you; that guy's blog didn't seem like it should be there |
| 17:30.58 | doc|work | wurp2: bingo :/ |
| 17:31.04 | balrog-kun | he's an OE hacker |
| 17:31.08 | wurp2 | If he had specific complaints, that's good stuff to hear |
| 17:31.38 | wurp2 | but he just seemed to be saying: it sucks, there are multiple branches, it's not finished |
| 17:31.38 | doc|work | he didn't really though, he was complaining about ... well, I'm not sure |
| 17:31.51 | wurp2 | none of which seem like constructive complaints |
| 17:32.24 | balrog-kun | that's not a bug report, it doesn't have to be constructive imho |
| 17:32.28 | balrog-kun | just a flow of thought |
| 17:32.38 | doc|work | it's more like he was put out by the change from gtk, even though gtk will still be there... |
| 17:32.41 | balrog-kun | a totally personal blog |
| 17:32.43 | doc|work | sure |
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| 17:38.14 | summatusmentis | he was one of the initial people to get a neo though |
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| 17:38.52 | balrog-kun | if you look at planet.gnome.org it's also not a source of information about gnome (at least not an official one) |
| 17:39.38 | balrog-kun | it's more like for staying up to date with what interesting is up in the lives of the other developers |
| 17:39.59 | balrog-kun | although this one isn't very interesting :) |
| 17:40.07 | doc|work | heh |
| 17:40.39 | doc|work | well, gentoo split that, planet.gentoo.org was gentoo related stuff, planet.gentoo.org/universe was gentoo + developer random stuff |
| 17:41.25 | balrog-kun | that seems a good idea |
| 17:41.54 | doc|work | yep |
| 17:42.01 | abraxa_ | Except that hrw isn't really an OM dev |
| 17:42.33 | doc|work | so what about splitting it into planet.om.o and planet.om.o/randomotherpeople or somesuch? |
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| 17:54.37 | CIA-45 | freesmartphone.org: 03sudharsh * r335befe2cbf4 10/odeviced/src/ (5 files in 3 dirs): catch some unhandled exceptions |
| 17:55.36 | d3vice | is planet.om.org really going to change because someone wrote a post that some other people didn't like? |
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| 17:57.51 | CIA-45 | freesmartphone.org: 03sudharsh * r6fe40f507df2 10/odeviced/src/plugins/backlight/backlight.plugin: fix typo in .plugin |
| 17:59.10 | doc|work | d3vice: it's not about not liking it (I even said that), it's just that his posts don't really seem relevant. I read planet.om.o to get dev updates |
| 18:01.04 | d3vice | me too, all i'm saying is that talking and thinking about subjects (good or bad) is some of the ways to make projects go forward |
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| 18:01.37 | aspire | hello |
| 18:01.37 | doc|work | sure, but he hasn't really said anyway what he's not happy about. |
| 18:01.46 | doc|work | hello aspire |
| 18:02.18 | aspire | doc|work I dont want to start bombing you with questions but have some to ask |
| 18:02.41 | aspire | would like to know what language the linux phone its OS is develoepd in |
| 18:03.08 | wurp2 | Mostly C |
| 18:03.12 | doc|work | aspire: I'm not the best person to ask this but I'll try and someoen else can correct me if I'm wrong |
| 18:03.26 | doc|work | aspire: linux = C, qtopia = c++ |
| 18:03.33 | doc|work | but you can use pretty much anything |
| 18:03.38 | wurp2 | Other stuff = python |
| 18:04.01 | aspire | OK c is fine, so is the linux OS ready? |
| 18:04.27 | XorA | reads back and is astonished by the whining |
| 18:04.36 | doc|work | I hope so, given they're going to start selling phones soon :) |
| 18:04.37 | aspire | meaning is it functional? |
| 18:04.39 | doc|work | XorA: whining? |
| 18:04.55 | XorA | doc|home: about hrw's blog, its his blog FFS, he can post what he likes |
| 18:05.08 | doc|work | XorA: except it's not his blog, it's planet.om.o .... |
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| 18:05.30 | XorA | doc|work: planet just republishes anything its told to |
| 18:05.37 | XorA | doc|work: hrw doesnt get much choice |
| 18:05.49 | CVirus | why do harald welte's posts go to planet.om ? |
| 18:05.54 | doc|work | XorA: right, and I was wondering why he was even added to it.... I've explained this... |
| 18:06.03 | aspire | doc|work if I wanted to make an application that would run on a linux phone, is that possible? |
| 18:06.29 | d3vice | sure |
| 18:06.30 | doc|work | aspire: yes, it's basically a computer with a gsm connection |
| 18:06.34 | CVirus | which post is doing the fud ? |
| 18:06.52 | doc|work | CVirus: the top one, and not so much fud, just not really clear why it's there |
| 18:07.27 | doc|work | I mean, I get how it's there, but not why his posts seem relevant |
| 18:07.37 | aspire | in that case would you advice me to use C++? |
| 18:07.51 | CVirus | By Marcin "hrw" Juszkiewicz |
| 18:07.54 | CVirus | that is ? |
| 18:08.03 | doc|work | CVirus: yep |
| 18:08.07 | zash | wut |
| 18:08.07 | doc|work | someone said he's OE |
| 18:08.10 | CVirus | that is harald welte ? |
| 18:08.15 | woglinde | ??? |
| 18:08.30 | doc|work | CVirus: nope |
| 18:08.40 | CVirus | ok |
| 18:08.54 | aspire | What kind of libs would I need to get my mobile application to interact with a websphere server? |
| 18:09.12 | aspire | or any otehr kind of server? |
| 18:09.14 | woglinde | apsire a http lib? |
| 18:10.05 | aspire | Is it possible to install applications on the linux phone? |
| 18:10.31 | doc|work | yes |
| 18:10.40 | d3vice | aspire, its a computer with gsm |
| 18:10.49 | aspire | does that require any form of premissions? |
| 18:10.59 | doc|work | aspire: might be an idea to read the wiki :) |
| 18:11.15 | aspire | do you mean the one of OPEN MOKO? |
| 18:11.23 | doc|work | yep |
| 18:11.27 | aspire | OK |
| 18:12.25 | aspire | is there any one here who has the NEO phone and is able to make phone calls with it? |
| 18:12.47 | woglinde | *g* |
| 18:12.56 | aspire | woglinde? |
| 18:12.59 | hari | me |
| 18:13.02 | tobii_ | me too |
| 18:13.04 | tobii_ | ;D |
| 18:13.06 | hari | put a prepaid sim in it, works fine |
| 18:13.31 | aspire | is it buggy? does it crash? |
| 18:13.41 | hari | never crashed on me |
| 18:13.47 | hari | but i did not use it much yet |
| 18:13.53 | aspire | OK, thanks that is all for now |
| 18:14.04 | hari | regarding on of our lmce devs it's a bit buggy with sms |
| 18:14.46 | hari | does anybody run j2me apps on the openmoko? |
| 18:14.50 | d3vice | aspire, if you know qemu, you can build a qemu image of openmoko and see for your self |
| 18:15.14 | d3vice | lmce guys joined OM? GREAT! |
| 18:15.29 | d3vice | aspire: in 10 minutes |
| 18:15.38 | aspire | d3viceb have use qemu, but it provides limited capability and does not allow any of the GSM features |
| 18:15.53 | hari | d3vice, we won a neo on the LinuxTag |
| 18:15.55 | d3vice | sure, but you can see the rest |
| 18:16.04 | hari | d3vice, just finishing http://wiki.linuxmce.org/index.php/Java_Mobile_Orbiter |
| 18:16.06 | d3vice | hari, thats awesome! congrats |
| 18:16.12 | d3vice | yeah!!!! |
| 18:16.25 | hari | d3vice, and wondering if i should try to run it in a java vm or do a native port |
| 18:16.34 | CVirus | d3vice: imce ? |
| 18:16.47 | d3vice | linux media center edition |
| 18:16.47 | *** join/#openmoko ruoso (n=ruoso@201.45.49.162) |
| 18:16.50 | hari | d3vice, I'm not the lucky winner but I can have the phone for the next months to do the orbiter port |
| 18:16.50 | aspire | does open moko have any initiatives to start a voip project? |
| 18:16.59 | *** join/#openmoko smancke (n=smancke@ip-62-143-122-209.hsi.ish.de) |
| 18:17.25 | hari | d3vice, and as I found out that #openmoko is also on freenode I've decided to lurk around a bit.. |
| 18:17.32 | d3vice | hari, good news! |
| 18:17.35 | *** join/#openmoko wirrwarr (n=tim@ppp-88-217-70-120.dynamic.mnet-online.de) |
| 18:17.47 | CVirus | I think ASU looks ugly |
| 18:17.50 | d3vice | but, will freerunner run java apps? |
| 18:17.58 | CVirus | d3vice: yup |
| 18:18.07 | d3vice | great! |
| 18:18.21 | hari | for a first throw with the JavaMO i'd need j2me MIDP2.0 with CLDC1.1 and JSR082 |
| 18:18.42 | hari | somehow I think I will get troubles with at least JSR082 |
| 18:18.58 | hari | wondered if the Avetana jsr082 stack would compile for the moko |
| 18:19.19 | d3vice | aspire: i think a sip client is in the works |
| 18:19.47 | d3vice | CVirus: i think uglyness can be solved with themes |
| 18:20.03 | hari | maybe I should just use c++, sdl and libbluetooth and rewrite the code for the moko |
| 18:20.24 | d3vice | hari, a while back i used to follow lmce's forum, great stuff! |
| 18:20.34 | hari | d3vice, we are making progress every day :-) |
| 18:20.36 | *** join/#openmoko ajbrun (n=ajbrun@host86-151-145-13.range86-151.btcentralplus.com) |
| 18:20.43 | CVirus | d3vice: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Java |
| 18:20.47 | hari | d3vice, and we had many jaws hitting the floor on the linux tag booth |
| 18:20.58 | hari | d3vice, people are not used to media, lightning and whatever follow them through the rooms |
| 18:21.18 | hari | d3vice, and stumbling through dvd covers on the mobile phone :=) |
| 18:21.22 | d3vice | hari: you guys are responsible for me buying a tv card, nvidia card and the works! :) |
| 18:21.34 | d3vice | yeah, thats what i'm talking about!!! :) |
| 18:21.39 | aspire | are there any complications in the development of a mobile app for accessing the internet for example access levels and certain protocols that have to be accomplished, is there any doc which I can look at that demonstrates how this would work |
| 18:21.41 | aspire | ? |
| 18:22.00 | hari | aspire, ? |
| 18:22.21 | hari | aspire, which layer are we talking about? |
| 18:22.42 | aspire | not sure myslef yet, trying to find out |
| 18:22.46 | doc|work | aspire: it's a computer, it'll work the same way as a desktop would |
| 18:23.07 | *** join/#openmoko solar_george (n=solargeo@80-41-147-75.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com) |
| 18:23.49 | aspire | yes but my computer uses DSL, a simple modem that is prepaid, a mobile phone uses a different protocol to gain access to the internet |
| 18:24.00 | aspire | different access levels |
| 18:24.06 | zash | aspire: that is would be handled by the system |
| 18:24.23 | d3vice | that protocol is "transparent" to you and your app |
| 18:24.55 | zash | like a normal linux computer with a modem |
| 18:24.58 | aspire | so once the OS is configured then the application is free to connect to the internet and do whatever is required |
| 18:25.00 | d3vice | although it's not there anymore, think that NetworkManager solves those questions... |
| 18:25.10 | d3vice | aspire: yep |
| 18:25.17 | aspire | OK |
| 18:25.48 | aspire | any specific libs I would have to use, httplib was already mentioned, |
| 18:25.51 | d3vice | which brings me too, why remove NetworkManager? |
| 18:26.32 | d3vice | aspire: e17 libs maybe, if your apps has a gui, i'm just guessing here |
| 18:27.07 | d3vice | or even gtk libs |
| 18:27.55 | aspire | are those standard and available from openmoko.org |
| 18:28.44 | *** join/#openmoko tedo (n=cta@HSI-KBW-091-089-005-067.hsi2.kabelbw.de) |
| 18:28.46 | d3vice | i think so but i can be mistaken |
| 18:29.04 | aspire | another thing why develop in C or C++ if JAVA is almost the only type of application functional on most hand-held devices |
| 18:29.24 | d3vice | aspire: you're thinking traditional handheld devices |
| 18:29.25 | XorA | what do you think java is written in? |
| 18:29.31 | d3vice | think big, future! |
| 18:29.40 | CVirus | fuck java |
| 18:29.45 | Gottox | CVirus: ack! |
| 18:29.51 | CVirus | haha |
| 18:30.17 | aspire | CVirus I understand what you are getting at but it is not nice of you to cut JAVA out |
| 18:30.22 | aspire | THanks any way |
| 18:30.32 | Gottox | java is in many ways C++,--,--. |
| 18:30.52 | aspire | why not use C# |
| 18:31.02 | d3vice | aspire: the most important thing is that you're free to use your favorite language |
| 18:31.07 | aspire | evolution and revolution |
| 18:31.13 | CVirus | C# ? |
| 18:31.26 | zedstar_ | too many bad universities brainwashing kids with JAVA |
| 18:31.27 | aspire | that is # for sharp |
| 18:31.34 | CVirus | zedstar_: mine is one of them |
| 18:31.43 | aspire | zedstar I could agree with you |
| 18:31.43 | d3vice | zedstar_: +1 (dave jones in here? ;) |
| 18:31.47 | *** join/#openmoko alexxy (n=alexxy@79.173.81.171) |
| 18:31.59 | tedo | you need a vm for this stuff -> overhead |
| 18:32.00 | mwester | zedstar: right on. |
| 18:32.12 | tedo | c and c++ are fine for me :) |
| 18:32.22 | CVirus | aspire: I know what that is ... but what's the point of using C# .. there are better languages around |
| 18:32.33 | XorA | java is better as a coffee than a language :-D |
| 18:32.40 | d3vice | lol |
| 18:32.56 | wurp2 | Java is on OM |
| 18:33.03 | wurp2 | Jalimo is the project name, I think |
| 18:33.15 | wurp2 | Java is a fine language for many purposes |
| 18:33.20 | aspire | look this is the developer section of OPEN MOKO |
| 18:33.21 | aspire | http://docs.openmoko.org/trac/wiki/DevelopmentGuides |
| 18:33.30 | cyrilRomain | heards Java is free, but prefers being free from Java |
| 18:34.50 | zash | 's gf wants him to learn java. :( |
| 18:35.01 | doc|work | could be worse |
| 18:35.08 | doc|work | she could want you to wash the dishes |
| 18:35.16 | wurp2 | If you want to write one app to run in browser, on Mac, Linux, Windows, Java is great |
| 18:35.27 | wurp2 | Java is far better than C or C++ for biz type apps |
| 18:35.38 | zash | wurp2: thats what php is for |
| 18:35.43 | woglinde | lol |
| 18:35.46 | mwester | perl |
| 18:35.48 | woglinde | php is |
| 18:35.54 | wurp2 | zash: You run php for a windows app? |
| 18:36.01 | woglinde | crap |
| 18:36.18 | zash | wurp2: if its going to run i a browser .. |
| 18:36.19 | wurp2 | And php is not dynamic client-side... it's a totally different target |
| 18:36.38 | wurp2 | Yeah, then I said on Mac, on Linux - those were meant to be distinct |
| 18:36.40 | hari | wurp2, both c++ and java have their place |
| 18:36.41 | zash | wurp2: anyways, $RANDOM_SERVERSIDE_LANGUAGE is the shit |
| 18:36.46 | zash | except ASP |
| 18:36.52 | wurp2 | One app can run in the browser, or as an app on Linux, app on Windows, etc. |
| 18:36.58 | wurp2 | hari: Sure |
| 18:37.16 | wurp2 | C is great for device drivers, and places where profiling shows performance is critical |
| 18:37.42 | wurp2 | Or for code that's gonna be stable for years, so you can thoroughly debug it |
| 18:37.43 | zash | PHP is great for ugly serverside hacks |
| 18:37.56 | cyrilRomain | gives zash an erlang book to change his mind |
| 18:38.02 | wurp2 | zash: True, but I prefer turbogears for that |
| 18:38.19 | wurp2 | erlang sounds like it could be a big deal in the future |
| 18:38.28 | wurp2 | as parallel processing becomes more & more widely used |
| 18:38.40 | woglinde | wurp2 in 20 years maybee |
| 18:38.50 | CIA-45 | freesmartphone.org: 03sudharsh * r2d74f1e28dcd 10/odeviced/src/daemon/ (plugin.vala service.vala): Create a new PluginError error domain and use it in the errordomain and use it |
| 18:38.55 | zash | I'm already running erlang stuff |
| 18:39.05 | aspire | wurp2 it is a big deal, however not much used since ericson left it go |
| 18:39.09 | zash | ejabberd ftw! |
| 18:39.41 | zedstar_ | C isnt too painful if u abstract it a bit with higher level libraries like glib and apr....raw C can be hard work |
| 18:39.58 | zash | Ruby is a nice language |
| 18:40.14 | CVirus | Python > * |
| 18:40.22 | ljp | actually, Qt is all you need |
| 18:40.27 | woglinde | ljp lol |
| 18:40.34 | zash | wxruby! |
| 18:40.59 | zedstar_ | still think everyone should use Scheme though |
| 18:41.21 | ljp | cobalt! cobalt! |
| 18:41.28 | zash | ASSEMBLER |
| 18:41.36 | zash | for everything |
| 18:42.32 | ewon | heh, scheme |
| 18:42.42 | ewon | my 1st year comp sci lecturer called, he wants his language back |
| 18:43.15 | zash | lol, lisp? |
| 18:43.51 | aspire | any one still use fortrand? |
| 18:44.00 | aspire | fortrant |
| 18:44.23 | *** join/#openmoko ericthefish (n=ivan@82-71-36-214.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk) |
| 18:44.29 | ljp | no, really... "Qt Everywhere" |
| 18:44.35 | ljp | and we mean it |
| 18:44.43 | zedstar_ | bend over then ;) |
| 18:44.54 | ljp | we are coming out with a Qt kernel in afew months |
| 18:45.04 | zash | hahah |
| 18:45.16 | ljp | we ported linux kernel to Qt |
| 18:45.25 | ljp | only took a week |
| 18:46.01 | zash | think webapps should be written in assembler and include their own kernel and webbserver |
| 18:47.07 | CVirus | LOL |
| 18:47.19 | *** join/#openmoko OJW (n=OJW@87-194-198-122.bethere.co.uk) |
| 18:47.38 | *** join/#openmoko t_s_o (n=tso@117.84-49-132.nextgentel.com) |
| 18:47.41 | zedstar_ | this is how to do web programming and hurt your brain in the process http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Continuation#Continuations_in_Web_development |
| 18:48.47 | zash | zedstar_: what |
| 18:49.33 | wurp2 | woglinde: Well, 8 core machines are fairly common on the desktop now. I think in *5* years you'll see ~20 cores commonly on machines, and somewhere around that number using a language that actually has support for parallelism becomes important, assuming you actually care about using the processing power available |
| 18:49.51 | woglinde | wurp2 right but the programmer arent there |
| 18:50.00 | zedstar_ | zash it is "goto" on steroids |
| 18:50.09 | woglinde | so it will need 20 years unitl parallel programming is the standard |
| 18:50.16 | zash | zedstar_: :( |
| 18:50.51 | zash | finds parallel programming to be easier in bash |
| 18:51.10 | aspire | how about duo core for a mobile device? |
| 18:51.37 | zedstar_ | duo battery more like ! |
| 18:51.38 | woglinde | aspire? |
| 18:51.39 | zash | aspire: my laptop is mobile-ish |
| 18:52.22 | aspire | yes it has a mobile chip |
| 18:52.34 | aspire | but that is not the same thing in the end of the day |
| 18:52.55 | ljp | wants a quadcore phone |
| 18:53.07 | zash | ljp: 4 phones + ducttape |
| 18:53.07 | XorA | FreeRunner has quad core |
| 18:53.16 | SpeedEvil | 7 core! |
| 18:53.21 | aspire | look where can I find documentation to develop an application for a linux phone |
| 18:53.31 | SpeedEvil | Teh intarnets! |
| 18:53.48 | aspire | any specific reference? |
| 18:53.50 | doc|work | aspire: wiki.openmoko.org |
| 18:54.03 | doc|work | aspire: it's just a computer, stop thinking of it as a phone |
| 18:54.06 | doc|work | :) |
| 18:54.19 | zedstar_ | dont make us do a goatse link |
| 18:54.30 | doc|work | no one ever makes you do that :o |
| 18:54.52 | XorA | he is the original and enjoys it :-) |
| 18:55.10 | doc|work | hah |
| 18:56.59 | aspire | OKOK |
| 18:57.49 | wurp2 | aspire: What's your preferred language? |
| 18:58.44 | wurp2 | woglinde: I'll bet once the cores are there, someone will pull an ID and write some app that uses them & blows people away (using erlang or another language with good parallel proc support), then everyone rushes to copy them |
| 18:59.20 | *** join/#openmoko suuuper (n=suuuper@ppp-152-181.32-151.iol.it) |
| 18:59.22 | doc|work | wurp2: like watch movies at full res? ;) |
| 18:59.49 | wurp2 | doc|work: heh |
| 19:18.26 | *** join/#openmoko neldoreth (n=ascot@81-223-127-237.stpeter.xdsl-line.inode.at) |
| 19:23.49 | *** join/#openmoko RayDar (n=raydar@c-67-171-26-100.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) |
| 19:24.52 | RayDar | I was just wondering if there was some way I can sync my KDE contacts with my Neo 1973 |
| 19:26.10 | SpeedEvil | cues the death star scene, with the voiceover 'Use the source luke!' |
| 19:26.18 | SpeedEvil | (not AFAIK yet) |
| 19:26.21 | zash | haha |
| 19:26.51 | zash | RayDar: any idea what format they are in |
| 19:29.10 | RayDar | zash: No idea what format they are in. But since there are so many syncing systems on Linux, (OpenSync, etc) -- and since the built-in system for adding/deleting/editing contacts is nearly unusable, I figured they might be relying on syncing with a desktop and therefore some sync system would merely be built in. |
| 19:29.42 | RayDar | But alas, perhaps I am wrong. |
| 19:30.30 | zash | RayDar: in the gtk-based stuff they use the same format as evolution does |
| 19:30.32 | d3vice | does OM support syncml or such= |
| 19:30.34 | d3vice | ? |
| 19:31.00 | *** join/#openmoko apol (n=apol@84.78.178.63) |
| 19:31.02 | zash | afaik no |
| 19:31.26 | RayDar | Wow, that really should be part of the system. |
| 19:31.41 | SpeedEvil | It's not basically functional yet. |
| 19:31.48 | SpeedEvil | It's _way_ off user-readiness. |
| 19:31.49 | SpeedEvil | :( |
| 19:31.52 | cyrilRomain | but opensync is available for OM, and opensync has a syncml plugin |
| 19:32.31 | d3vice | nice, so did anynone ever try to sync freerunner with a desktop? |
| 19:32.37 | cyrilRomain | dunno how good working it is though |
| 19:32.42 | SpeedEvil | rsync |
| 19:32.49 | d3vice | :) |
| 19:33.18 | zash | rsync is the shit |
| 19:33.52 | d3vice | does OM have a frontend to it? |
| 19:33.57 | RayDar | Heh, rsync won't convert my Palm or KDE contacts to GTK. |
| 19:34.00 | *** join/#openmoko mohamed (n=chatzill@41.196.72.67) |
| 19:35.50 | *** join/#openmoko tomboy64 (n=tomboy64@e179033097.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 19:36.05 | Qwell | RayDar: latest rsync does |
| 19:36.14 | bart__ | arg, delay on mailing list getting worse |
| 19:36.41 | bart__ | no message since 10h |
| 19:36.58 | aspire | hi is there a way to package applications for the linux phone? |
| 19:37.06 | bart__ | is it my mail server ? ^^ |
| 19:37.19 | d3vice | aspire: you gotta be kidding me |
| 19:37.32 | RayDar | Qwell: Really? I might have to look into this. |
| 19:37.37 | Qwell | RayDar: no.. |
| 19:37.38 | aspire | d3vice quite serious actually |
| 19:38.18 | *** join/#openmoko fulgas (n=fn@a81-84-101-131.cpe.netcabo.pt) |
| 19:38.26 | RayDar | hears "Never gonna give you up" in the background. |
| 19:38.40 | doc|work | lets RayDar down |
| 19:38.52 | aspire | d3vice does an application not need to be installed on your mobile?µ |
| 19:39.11 | doc|work | aspire: there is, and it's most likely documented on the wiki |
| 19:39.35 | aspire | thanks doc|work, hope to find it |
| 19:39.38 | bart__ | aspire: look at the wiki, quite a lot of link for devloppers : http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Main_Page ;) |
| 19:40.05 | RayDar | aspire: You need to install a "toolchain". |
| 19:40.07 | *** join/#openmoko hklein_ (n=hklein@i59F76E0B.versanet.de) |
| 19:40.49 | bart__ | aspire: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Toolchain and http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/OpenEmbedded should help you package your application |
| 19:41.44 | aspire | I found in a tutorial that it must be compiled in teh image that is used to flash your phone |
| 19:43.19 | *** join/#openmoko dneary (n=dneary@mne69-9-88-163-116-163.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 19:43.21 | aspire | http://www.openmoko.com/uploaded_images/41.png |
| 19:44.09 | RayDar | aspire: You can transfer files independently of the image. |
| 19:44.56 | bart__ | or make an ipkg package (quite like .deb) |
| 19:45.23 | bart__ | see "Packaging your application" in the Toolchain wiki page |
| 19:46.13 | *** join/#openmoko malik1972 (n=malik197@e182052147.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 19:47.10 | RayDar | what files might the contacts be in? |
| 19:49.01 | RayDar | oh: /home/root/.evolution/addressbook/local/system/addressbook.db |
| 19:50.32 | aspire | bart__thanks that is exactly what I am looking for |
| 19:51.26 | aspire | what does this stand for? |
| 19:51.27 | aspire | What is the best way to handle caching of application information? |
| 19:51.55 | aspire | what exactly does this mean, or what does this process involve? |
| 19:54.53 | aspire | bart__ does teh application manager actually work on the linux phone? |
| 19:57.13 | *** part/#openmoko malik1972 (n=malik197@e182052147.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 20:02.59 | *** join/#openmoko ahven (n=kala@194.126.113.140) |
| 20:03.52 | *** join/#openmoko MetaMorfoziS (n=avr@53d83cc0.adsl.enternet.hu) |
| 20:05.56 | bart__ | hum, i think opkg is functionnal |
| 20:06.00 | *** join/#openmoko malik1972 (n=malik197@e182052147.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 20:07.49 | *** join/#openmoko bluelightning (n=blueligh@pdpc/supporter/active/bluelightning) |
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| 20:10.21 | *** part/#openmoko sim51 (n=bsimard@crb44-2-89-86-30-236.dsl.club-internet.fr) |
| 20:11.00 | *** part/#openmoko J_P (n=jpillati@189.2.146.45) |
| 20:14.33 | aspire | bart__ it is because you cant upgrade your system and make a phone call at the same time |
| 20:17.47 | RayDar | Can I import .vcf files into my Neo1973? |
| 20:18.00 | *** join/#openmoko _rob (n=rob@85.233.59.8.static.cablesurf.de) |
| 20:20.38 | MetaMorfoziS | Hi all |
| 20:20.43 | MetaMorfoziS | Is there anybody from Austria? |
| 20:21.21 | CIA-45 | openmoko: 03zecke 07org.openmoko.dev * r1b7f2f3865ef 10/conf/distro/include/sane-srcrevs.inc: [srcrev] Upgrade Qtopia to get SMS account fixes |
| 20:21.21 | CIA-45 | openmoko: 03zecke 07org.openmoko.dev * r9f1787ac69d8 10/conf/distro/include/sane-srcrevs.inc: [srcrev] Upgrade Qtopia to get the softmenu rework. Some bugs should be fixed |
| 20:21.21 | CIA-45 | openmoko: 03graeme 07org.openmoko.dev * ra1effad4c7be 10/conf/distro/include/moko-autorev.inc: [autorev] berlios is down more than its up so dont autorev openocd |
| 20:23.58 | XorA|gone | openmoko-today looks really good in default gtk+ theme :-) |
| 20:24.54 | *** join/#openmoko nab (n=nab@64-172-115-11.ded.pacbell.net) |
| 20:27.45 | *** join/#openmoko baruch (n=baruch@bzq-79-182-122-101.red.bezeqint.net) |
| 20:31.04 | CIA-45 | freesmartphone.org: 03sudharsh * r2271353ae784 10/odeviced/src/daemon/helpers.vala: read_integer handles exceptions in a more sane manner |
| 20:31.04 | CIA-45 | freesmartphone.org: 03sudharsh * rcff51638b92b 10/odeviced/src/daemon/service.vala: simple change to order of the catch blocks |
| 20:31.16 | *** join/#openmoko fifafrazer (n=as@0x5738c891.rdnqu1.broadband.tele.dk) |
| 20:36.39 | Sup3rkiddo | what a fricking match |
| 20:37.19 | woglinde | yes |
| 20:37.21 | woglinde | we win |
| 20:38.31 | *** join/#openmoko hrw (n=hrw@ewi546.ewi.utwente.nl) |
| 20:38.33 | hrw | hi |
| 20:38.52 | hrw | doc|work: I saw that you had interesting opinion about my blog post |
| 20:39.33 | doc|work | hrw: not so much about the post, just wondering why it appeared on planet.openmoko.org as I said, and also as the person who told you should have said. |
| 20:40.28 | hrw | doc|work: it appeared there because my posts tagged 'openmoko' lands there |
| 20:40.58 | doc|work | which I didn't know when I asked... |
| 20:40.59 | doc|work | as I said |
| 20:42.01 | *** join/#openmoko suuuper (n=suuuper@ppp-152-181.32-151.iol.it) |
| 20:42.01 | hrw | and like I wrote -- I do not see usable linux phone on a market |
| 20:42.03 | doc|work | hrw: as an aside, regarding your post, it's not really all that clear why you're unhappy with om |
| 20:42.38 | doc|work | hrw: sure, but that's not what I was commenting on, and was one of the first things I said |
| 20:42.42 | hrw | doc|work: om has 1.5 year since first information about it was released. nothing usable as phone released |
| 20:43.07 | hrw | doc|work: feel free to add comment on blog - your point of view is interesting |
| 20:43.28 | XorA|gone | ~curse git fetcher |
| 20:43.29 | apt | May the fleas of a thousand camels infest your most sensitive regions, git fetcher ! |
| 20:43.42 | doc|work | hrw: sure, but it's about to be released... |
| 20:43.50 | hrw | doc|work: when I change phone I need something that is better then replaced one |
| 20:44.00 | hrw | doc|work: phones are going to be released - hardware |
| 20:44.00 | doc|work | hrw: it kind of seems, to me anyway, that you're dismissing it before you've even used it |
| 20:44.18 | XorA|gone | figures hrw has seen one or two GTA02 around |
| 20:44.33 | XorA|gone | he does know all the .eu openmoko developers closely |
| 20:44.46 | doc|work | that's great and all, but isn't explained in any way on the post |
| 20:44.49 | *** join/#openmoko MrSkittle (n=tuna@unaffiliated/t00na) |
| 20:45.08 | MrSkittle | Is there an OpenMoko facebook group? |
| 20:45.10 | doc|work | thinks XorA|gone is blowing this way out of proportion |
| 20:45.14 | doc|work | MrSkittle: yep |
| 20:45.29 | MrSkittle | blows doc|work way out of proportion |
| 20:45.35 | doc|work | rawr |
| 20:45.36 | XorA|gone | doc|work: it wasnt me that told hrw BTW, just in case you think Im tell tailing |
| 20:45.43 | hrw | doc|work: I used gta02v2, v3, v4 |
| 20:45.47 | MrSkittle | doc|work: I don't think I've ever seen doc|home say a thing |
| 20:46.01 | doc|work | MrSkittle: please don't troll :) |
| 20:46.26 | MrSkittle | I'm not trolling! |
| 20:46.36 | doc|work | hrw: with the software that will be what we can install when the phones arrive? |
| 20:46.46 | hrw | doc|work: I used gta02 with om2007.2 software and also with current e17/qtopia/x11 and also saw 'openmoko underground' images on real hardware |
| 20:47.02 | doc|work | hrw: so you're judging it on beta software |
| 20:47.03 | hrw | doc|work: I used qtopia on gta01, om2007.1 and om2007.2 |
| 20:47.11 | MrSkittle | hrw: how does e17 run on it? |
| 20:48.00 | hrw | MrSkittle: components are used |
| 20:48.01 | XorA|gone | e17 runs better on gta01 than gta02 :-( |
| 20:48.20 | hrw | doc|work: I judge on *current* state of software |
| 20:48.29 | doc|work | hrw: so then yes, on beta software |
| 20:48.35 | MrSkittle | go bai |
| 20:48.46 | doc|work | on a system that will be constantly upgrade and improved |
| 20:49.04 | woglinde | every one should calm down a little bit |
| 20:49.14 | hrw | doc|work: my closed k750i is contantly upgrade and improve by random hackers |
| 20:49.16 | woglinde | doc whats your problem? |
| 20:49.21 | doc|work | I'm perfectly calm, but if someone comes in here and jumps on me then I'm going to respond |
| 20:49.32 | woglinde | it took 2 years to make phone calls in a sane way |
| 20:49.35 | d3vice | hrw, i have a k800i, where do you get that stuff? |
| 20:49.41 | doc|work | huh? |
| 20:49.48 | balrog-kun | doc|work: that's hard to predict, it makes sense to judge by what's available imho |
| 20:50.04 | hrw | d3vice: search SE forums for 'elf' keyword and 'vkp patches' |
| 20:50.14 | d3vice | hrw: thankx! |
| 20:50.18 | doc|work | ok, so I say things are likely to get better and everyone jumps on me? if that's the case then why any of you here? |
| 20:50.32 | doc|work | boggles |
| 20:50.42 | woglinde | doc you jumps on your self |
| 20:50.44 | hari | hrw, the neo works fine for me |
| 20:50.47 | doc|work | woglinde: what? |
| 20:50.47 | hrw | doc|work: the things are going better since year ago |
| 20:50.52 | balrog-kun | doc|work: well, i trust it'll improve but i'm not buying a new phone at the moment :p |
| 20:51.02 | hrw | hari: then cool for you. |
| 20:51.04 | balrog-kun | i make alsmot no phonecalls these days |
| 20:51.19 | XorA|gone | loves his HSDPA |
| 20:51.22 | hrw | hari: I have two gta01 here and they gather dust rather then being used |
| 20:51.27 | hrw | XorA|gone: kaiser? |
| 20:51.30 | hari | hrw, for 1,5y I think they've done a pretty good job |
| 20:51.30 | XorA|gone | yeah |
| 20:51.48 | woglinde | hari yes they did |
| 20:51.49 | hari | hrw, compare that to your SE that has to be hacked after years in production to be usable :) |
| 20:51.50 | doc|work | woglinde: in case you didn't notice hrw joined the channel and immediately started giving me hassle for a comment that someone else passed to him which wasn't even related to the content of his post. Now you're all ganging up on me for it? |
| 20:52.11 | woglinde | *sigh* |
| 20:52.13 | *** join/#openmoko andrenarchy (n=andrenar@dslb-084-057-074-054.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 20:52.13 | XorA|gone | doc|work: welcome to the sharktank that is #openmoko |
| 20:52.16 | hrw | hari: yes, n-th framework |
| 20:52.16 | hari | doc|work, no :-) |
| 20:52.22 | woglinde | I said calm down |
| 20:52.37 | doc|work | I don't know why you think I'm not calm :) |
| 20:52.48 | woglinde | hrw saw the openmoko from the beginning |
| 20:52.56 | hrw | hari: my 750i was usable out-of-box. those hacks adds some nice tricks |
| 20:53.05 | hari | hrw, usable? ha, i have two of them |
| 20:53.21 | hari | hrw, the firmware releases of the first year were crap.. delays over 15 seconds and such.. |
| 20:53.31 | hari | hrw, network loss |
| 20:53.35 | XorA|gone | hrw: saw the moko when it was just some leaked logs of a kernel oops :-) |
| 20:53.36 | hari | hrw, and don't get me started on the joystick |
| 20:53.36 | hrw | woglinde: for pre-beginning - rememeber oedem 2006 when mickeyl told more then wanted? |
| 20:53.47 | XorA|gone | hes old skewl |
| 20:53.49 | hrw | hari: works for me |
| 20:53.55 | woglinde | hrw *g* |
| 20:54.06 | hari | hrw, the only cool thing about the 750i is the HID capability over bluetooth |
| 20:54.08 | woglinde | hrw I didnt want to pester mickeyl |
| 20:54.20 | hrw | XorA|gone: qt2410 times? |
| 20:54.26 | hari | hrw, but isn't that cool, everybody can decide which mobile to use :-p |
| 20:54.48 | hrw | hari: and thats the point - everyone can choose |
| 20:55.04 | hrw | I know people who use gta02 as each day phone |
| 20:55.19 | hrw | I also know people who use nokia 5110/3210 phones still |
| 20:55.34 | hari | looks for his 6150i |
| 20:55.53 | hrw | hari: 6150 has 'i' version? |
| 20:56.08 | hari | i stay corrected |
| 20:56.25 | hari | had too many nokias with an 'i'.. |
| 20:56.29 | hrw | ;) |
| 20:57.53 | XorA|gone | I still get my fold out qwerty nokia, that ruled |
| 20:57.57 | hrw | I had ericsson a2618s, alcatel a501, nokia 6310i, se k750i, gta01bv3, gta01bv4, few palmos powered pdas (lores, hires), all zaurus models, two nokia tablets etc |
| 20:58.12 | hrw | XorA|gone: 6820 iirc? |
| 20:58.22 | XorA|gone | 6822 I had, more advanced |
| 20:58.44 | hari | I love my N800, the best phone for my needs is the E60 |
| 20:58.47 | balrog-kun | what's the "i" for in 6310i? |
| 20:58.59 | hari | its the internet :-) |
| 20:59.05 | balrog-kun | uses a 6310i for phonecalls |
| 20:59.07 | hari | it's in the phone :=) |
| 20:59.14 | balrog-kun | oh i didn't even notice :p |
| 20:59.15 | hrw | balrog-kun: quadband, blue screen and few other difs |
| 20:59.42 | hrw | balrog-kun: ah.. 6310 lack bluetooth iirc |
| 20:59.45 | XorA|gone | wishes he had a whole internet in a phone |
| 21:00.05 | hari | get a UMTS flatrate.. |
| 21:00.08 | CVirus | yeah .. with all it's pr0n |
| 21:00.09 | CVirus | :-p |
| 21:00.12 | CVirus | its* |
| 21:00.20 | XorA|gone | hari: got one, but a whole internet just wont fit |
| 21:00.36 | SpeedEvil | ponders. |
| 21:01.25 | hrw | balrog-kun: if you want to use BT in 6310i check does it has 5.22 or higer firmware |
| 21:01.34 | hrw | -> sleep |
| 21:01.53 | balrog-kun | hrw: i only use it for phonecalls, nothing else :) |
| 21:01.55 | balrog-kun | see you |
| 21:02.09 | balrog-kun | downloads the internet and sells it to XorA|gone on a 3"1/2 diskette |
| 21:02.46 | *** part/#openmoko hrw (n=hrw@ewi546.ewi.utwente.nl) |
| 21:03.21 | *** part/#openmoko jfrousval (n=jfrousva@ARouen-152-1-15-21.w90-22.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 21:03.21 | SpeedEvil | You can probably get about a terabyte of flash into a phone if you stacked bare flash chips. |
| 21:03.31 | SpeedEvil | Probably a bit more. |
| 21:04.45 | zedstar_ | someone try it i want to see if it's true http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fet0SCt7uGg&eurl=http://www.za3tar.net/2007/09/29/typing-google-into-google/ |
| 21:06.02 | XorA|gone | zedstar: I didnt manage to break it |
| 21:06.05 | XorA|gone | I have met many many IT people like that though |
| 21:07.11 | zedstar_ | phew |
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| 21:19.12 | CIA-45 | openmoko: 03graeme 07org.openmoko.dev * r820bd00b9ad5 10/packages/tasks/task-openmoko-pim.bb: [openmoko-pim] appmanager2 no longer compiles with opkg |
| 21:20.35 | balrog-kun | is the buglog@... list deprecated? |
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| 21:30.31 | wurp2 | Hey, anything new on the accelerated mplayer front? |
| 21:30.38 | *** join/#openmoko dj_ (n=dj@88-109-104-254.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com) |
| 21:30.44 | wurp2 | (I dunno the answer to your Q) |
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| 21:37.47 | balrog-kun | wurp2: there won't be anything new from my side for the moment |
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| 21:38.36 | balrog-kun | the main goal of getting the sources public has been reached, and the side goal of making it usable also |
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| 21:57.19 | doc|work | off-topic but still cool |
| 21:57.22 | doc|work | http://www.osnews.com/story/19893 |
| 22:11.41 | wurp2 | balrog-kun: cool, thanks! |
| 22:12.27 | wurp2 | doc|work: Very nice! |
| 22:12.57 | wurp2 | It kind of surprises me... usually MS has the resources to get their way, and based on their dirty dealings on this one, they seemed pretty commited to it |
| 22:13.35 | *** join/#openmoko tunys (n=tuna@unaffiliated/t00na) |
| 22:13.40 | tunys | haz question |
| 22:13.46 | tunys | where did openmoko get its name? |
| 22:13.57 | tunys | what is a moko? |
| 22:14.24 | balrog-kun | tunys: it's "mobile communications" |
| 22:14.42 | wurp2 | it's from the spanish for booger |
| 22:14.48 | tunys | balrog-kun, what language? |
| 22:14.53 | tunys | wurp2, yeah i know :D |
| 22:14.56 | wurp2 | tunys: English |
| 22:15.03 | wurp2 | MObile COmmunications |
| 22:15.08 | tunys | oic |
| 22:15.12 | balrog-kun | that too :) and it similar to moto as in Hello MOTO |
| 22:15.18 | balrog-kun | 's |
| 22:15.26 | tunys | and it just made more since to use a K there? |
| 22:16.20 | *** join/#openmoko xcasex (n=rrg@ua-83-227-156-234.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se) |
| 22:16.53 | wurp2 | I have no idea why they used a K |
| 22:17.06 | wurp2 | I actually didn't know why they chose moko at all until balrog-kun just said :-) |
| 22:17.18 | tunys | probably to make it easer to remember |
| 22:17.52 | XorA|gone | maybe there is a secret drive to use KDE |
| 22:18.03 | XorA|gone | and all KDE apps replace C with K |
| 22:19.08 | zash | and Gnome-apps precede everything with G |
| 22:19.20 | balrog-kun | i wonder if they will consider rebranding for spanish markets |
| 22:19.44 | wurp2 | I dunno |
| 22:19.56 | wurp2 | Sometimes bad advertisement can be better than mediocre |
| 22:20.03 | wurp2 | Ew! Look at this phone name! |
| 22:20.08 | wurp2 | Hey, but look at this phone... |
| 22:20.50 | balrog-kun | hehe, may be |
| 22:20.53 | balrog-kun | makes it easier to remember |
| 22:21.00 | wurp2 | Like those idiotic car salesmen whose antics get put on youtube and spread far & wide |
| 22:21.28 | wurp2 | Now we just need the sw so someone will actually be inclined to buy the phone :-) |
| 22:21.43 | XorA|gone | hrmm, do moko people not know anyone with a zero in their phone number? |
| 22:21.43 | wurp2 | Has anyone tried milestone 1? |
| 22:22.53 | wurp2 | XorA|gone: but? |
| 22:22.58 | wurp2 | s/t/g/ |
| 22:23.47 | XorA|gone | wurp2: in some modes its impossible to type zero on the gtk+ keyboard thingy |
| 22:23.58 | wurp2 | XorA|gone: Oh, I never use multitap |
| 22:24.22 | wurp2 | I have a script that I run first thing after burning a new image that removes multitap and installs matchbox-keyboar |
| 22:24.25 | wurp2 | d |
| 22:24.34 | wurp2 | I know there's a bug w/ mb kbd somewhere, but I have yet to run into it |
| 22:24.44 | wurp2 | It's probably in the SMS app, since I rarely use that |
| 22:25.05 | XorA|gone | I never use multitap on my WinMobile |
| 22:25.07 | XorA|gone | stupid idea |
| 22:25.10 | wurp2 | Has anyone looked into a translucent full-screen overlay keyboard? |
| 22:25.17 | wurp2 | That seems ideal for SMS |
| 22:25.45 | wurp2 | and maybe for almost everything else - just put a little dot in one corner that hides it |
| 22:25.54 | wurp2 | XorA|gone: agreed |
| 22:26.20 | wurp2 | But I've never had a smartphone before my neo, so I can't really compare to alternatives |
| 22:26.52 | wurp2 | I hate contracts, and I wasn't about to pay $200+ for a phone that I had to pay to install my own software, or ringtones, on |
| 22:27.31 | *** join/#openmoko zlfita (i=atilla@turtle.stack.nl) |
| 22:31.23 | balrog-kun | is there some way to browse the old bugzilla? or is it really dead now? |
| 22:32.10 | XorA|gone | did something not make it to trac? |
| 22:32.37 | balrog-kun | XorA|gone: bug #914 |
| 22:33.02 | balrog-kun | i'm not sure what was there, it may have been closed |
| 22:33.43 | XorA|gone | hmm, Id send an email, I thought all bugs were being transfered |
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| 22:35.02 | balrog-kun | ok |
| 22:35.21 | balrog-kun | i don't see any other missing bugs |
| 22:36.08 | XorA|gone | #912 is missing |
| 22:36.19 | XorA|gone | I assume bugzilla allocated in order without gaps |
| 22:36.29 | XorA|gone | 913 I mean |
| 22:36.47 | balrog-kun | indeed |
| 22:37.13 | balrog-kun | i followed a link from the wiki to bug #914, so it should have been in bugzilla at one time |
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