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| 00:13.55 | Psi | any recommendation for the best image for using gta01 as your everyday phone |
| 00:15.19 | abraxa_ | Psi: Might wanna try http://downloads.openmoko.org/asu/ |
| 00:15.34 | Psi | thanks |
| 00:17.23 | abraxa_ | http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/community/2008-May/017504.html is the accompanying review |
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| 00:33.14 | woglinde | hi raster |
| 00:33.52 | raster | moo |
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| 00:38.33 | daMaestro | abraxa_, holy. moly. |
| 00:39.24 | abraxa_ | daMaestro: Hmm? |
| 00:39.38 | daMaestro | things are looking good |
| 00:40.09 | abraxa_ | Did you test the image? |
| 00:40.16 | daMaestro | the flash, too |
| 00:40.45 | abraxa_ | I'm not sure it runs on GTA01, so I'd be grateful for some feedback on this |
| 00:40.48 | daMaestro | it's come a long ways since the first build |
| 00:40.55 | daMaestro | sure, i'll flash my device tonight |
| 00:41.11 | daMaestro | glad to see my ~$300 was well spent on developing the freerunner |
| 00:41.19 | daMaestro | yay for non-vaporware! |
| 00:41.56 | abraxa_ | Yeah... personally I'm not too happy with Qtopia but it's the best we have, so whatever |
| 00:42.09 | abraxa_ | Buys us time to do Openmoko the right way :) |
| 00:42.13 | daMaestro | is qtopia *final* |
| 00:42.15 | daMaestro | ah, right |
| 00:42.39 | abraxa_ | No idea honestly |
| 00:42.56 | abraxa_ | I assume it'll be replaced eventually |
| 00:43.01 | daMaestro | it's not like the device can't be flashed with anything |
| 00:43.04 | daMaestro | exactly |
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| 00:43.29 | daMaestro | well.. except andriod.. unless google spend the time to backport to armv4 |
| 00:45.37 | raster | android also brings in a wonderful new proprietary display system and api's |
| 00:46.15 | kdean06 | abraxa_, What is it about what will ship on Openmoko that you dislike? I defended Qtopia on one of the lists (and I meant it) but I'm wondering why people dislike it. :) |
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| 00:47.51 | abraxa_ | kdean06: Simply cause it's Trolltech's work and I don't want Openmoko to look like they're just making money with other people's stuff - call it pride, if you want |
| 00:48.16 | kdean06 | Fair enough. |
| 00:48.50 | ljp | qtopia is open source, so they can make it "their stuff" |
| 00:49.24 | kdean06 | That's a good point, actually. Openmoko should release a press release and spin it as a strategic cooperation rather than copying. And to be fair, it's been sexified. :) |
| 00:50.34 | kdean06 | I'll say that original or not, the mockups and design goals and stuff make me want to spend money on it... Nothing trolltech offered got that kind of response. |
| 00:50.59 | kdean06 | But yeah, there's something to be said for originality. :D |
| 00:51.06 | Psi | abraxa_, doesnt seem to boot at all |
| 00:51.09 | abraxa_ | ljp: Yeah, and I acknowledge all the hard work Trolltech put into the platform. I am wondering however: as the Greenphone is pretty much dead (if not entirely), is Trolltech happy that it finds good use with Openmoko's phones? |
| 00:51.11 | unknown_lamer | just wait for a purely lisp based software stack ;-) |
| 00:51.47 | unknown_lamer | abraxa_: trolltech killed the greenphone and recommends using the neo now iirc |
| 00:51.48 | abraxa_ | Psi: That's too bad... I wonder why that is. In that case, using the latest builds on ScaredyCat's server might be a good idea |
| 00:51.53 | raster | kdean06: i do not like qt or qtopi because libqt/libqBLAH is... GPL. |
| 00:52.25 | Psi | abraxa_, doesnt even start to boot, looks like a uboot issue |
| 00:52.29 | kdean06 | raster, Yeah. That's one of my complaints. :( I'm not super fond of the GPL myself. |
| 00:52.37 | raster | i dont mind GPL |
| 00:52.38 | raster | but |
| 00:52.48 | ljp | gpl ensures things remain open source |
| 00:52.50 | raster | it means i only have 2 choices if i am a 3rd party developer |
| 00:52.56 | kdean06 | Right. |
| 00:52.57 | raster | 1. make my apps gpl if i use libqt |
| 00:52.58 | raster | OR |
| 00:53.04 | raster | pay trolltech |
| 00:53.08 | raster | i cant use mit-xx |
| 00:53.10 | raster | or bsd |
| 00:53.22 | raster | or make a closed 3rd party app because that is how i wish to doit |
| 00:53.37 | raster | writing an app for the platform means i now longer have freedom |
| 00:53.43 | raster | well not without a price-tag |
| 00:53.48 | kdean06 | GPL removes choice, and that's what Free Software is about. Sure, most people are willing to comply with the GPL, but I'm not keen on making that decision for others. |
| 00:54.20 | kdean06 | It's also just overly wordy. :) BSD/ISC is just easier to deal with. |
| 00:54.22 | SpeedEvil | Unless nobody cares. |
| 00:54.28 | unknown_lamer | kdean06: actually no; part of the goal of Free Software is to eliminate proprietary software |
| 00:54.32 | abraxa_ | kdean06: Dunno. I personally would never write code for free that companies can sell without paying me a dime |
| 00:54.35 | SpeedEvil | points at the various vendors continuing to violate the GPL. |
| 00:54.42 | ljp | unknown_lamer: exactly |
| 00:54.43 | unknown_lamer | kdean06: forcing users of a library to use the GPL helps forward that goal wonderfully |
| 00:55.38 | unknown_lamer | ljp: who knew that reading most of what RMS wrote would come in handy one day :-) |
| 00:55.47 | kdean06 | unknown_lamer, Richard Stallman's goal is to eliminate non-free software. That isn't the goal of "free software". I support free software and I support your right to choose not to use it. They're not in conflict, however much the FSF tries to spin it. |
| 00:56.12 | unknown_lamer | I think the FSF is allowed to define the goals of the free software movement since it is their movement |
| 00:56.14 | ljp | how could proprietary software be 'Free Software'? |
| 00:56.41 | raster | abraxa_: never write anything that is open source then :) |
| 00:56.56 | unknown_lamer | You have to remember that Stallman witnessed firsthand what happens when greedy people have accessed to bsd/mitish licensed code (Symbolics) |
| 00:57.03 | unknown_lamer | and then how that code is lost *forever* |
| 00:57.18 | kdean06 | unknown_lamer, I'll respectfully disagree with you. The Free Software Foundation lost the right to speak for user choice the moment Richard Stallman began spouting off about using the force of law to eliminate user choice. |
| 00:57.42 | unknown_lamer | kdean06: proprietary software by its very nature eliminates user choice |
| 00:57.48 | ljp | the 'user' has less rights under bsd/lgpl |
| 00:57.51 | unknown_lamer | kdean06: how does the GPL eliminate user choice? |
| 00:58.26 | SpeedEvil | GPLV3 I think he means. |
| 00:58.43 | rtm | It eliminates the user's choice to grab the source code, make it proprietary, and charge you for it. |
| 00:58.53 | unknown_lamer | you mean the right to opress others |
| 00:59.02 | unknown_lamer | which is not a right ... |
| 00:59.14 | rtm | Well, it's a choice... |
| 00:59.18 | kdean06 | unknown_lamer, Points of clarification. I said the GPL was overly wordy, and locks in VENDORS. I don't think the GPL is end-user restrictive. My complaint specifically was with Richards' "Proprietary software should be illegal" stance. Free Software by force is no better than non-free by choice. |
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| 01:00.17 | kdean06 | unknown_lamer, And secondly, I'm not anti-capitalist. I see nothing wrong with charging for a product or service. If you don't want someone doing it, don't license to allow it. I'm simply saying why I dislike it. |
| 01:00.18 | unknown_lamer | kdean06: you said users not vendors / he said proprietary software *developed by government using public funds* should not be proprietary / pointless given the qualification of publically funded software |
| 01:01.12 | raster | imgo the fact that gpl is viral THROUGH a public published interface |
| 01:01.15 | raster | ie qt's api |
| 01:01.18 | raster | or any library's api |
| 01:01.22 | raster | is just wrong |
| 01:01.27 | raster | if qt was lglp - great |
| 01:01.43 | raster | there is a "system library" exception clause |
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| 01:01.51 | raster | ie libs youwould normally find on an os |
| 01:01.58 | raster | BUT that is very hazy |
| 01:02.03 | raster | is qt one of those? |
| 01:02.05 | raster | gtk? |
| 01:02.08 | raster | libjpeg? |
| 01:02.14 | raster | any lib you like? |
| 01:02.36 | raster | its a world of license-pain and hell |
| 01:02.39 | unknown_lamer | I think the intent is for that to be limited to the basic interface to kernel / core OS services |
| 01:02.40 | SpeedEvil | cru: maybe - but you'd need to add a capacitor too |
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| 01:02.44 | SpeedEvil | oops |
| 01:02.50 | raster | and frankly imho the gpl should not extend beyond a public publishe api |
| 01:02.59 | raster | be it linked into your own address space via syumbol tables |
| 01:03.24 | raster | or via an ipc pipe (eg dbus, or x protocol or xmlrpc, etc. etc.) |
| 01:03.29 | mwester | SpeedEvil: you could add a capacitor to the licensing discussion, few would notice. |
| 01:03.31 | ljp | even RMS says dont use lgpl. |
| 01:03.37 | raster | unknown_lamer: that intent is unclear |
| 01:03.40 | raster | that is a problem |
| 01:03.48 | raster | in my opinion a gui lib *IS* a basic os service |
| 01:04.04 | raster | without such i am heavily limited in how i can display anything |
| 01:04.21 | raster | personally i dont give a hoot what rms says |
| 01:04.36 | raster | i am a software developer and i want to write code. |
| 01:05.01 | unknown_lamer | raster: the exception only applies to a GPLed program using a proprietary implementation of the system library |
| 01:05.06 | raster | and i dont want to be beholden to someoen elses philosophies just because i write software for a platform and use the api's it happens to ship with |
| 01:05.10 | ljp | if qt were lgpl, we couldn't release as much of it as we do |
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| 01:06.30 | raster | ljp: oh - i know! |
| 01:06.41 | raster | ljp: for tt it's a specific business becision |
| 01:06.50 | raster | and i respect tt's right to license as they see fit |
| 01:06.54 | raster | absolutely |
| 01:07.15 | raster | at the same time i prefer to have the right to license my application or lib as i see fit |
| 01:07.27 | raster | if there is a system api to display widgets or draw that ison the platform |
| 01:07.30 | ljp | so in the end, lgpl does not propegate free software like the gpl |
| 01:07.35 | raster | i would expect to be able to use it and still have my freedom |
| 01:07.45 | raster | as it is "supplied" as a core part of the platform |
| 01:07.51 | raster | but - that is not the case with a gpl lib |
| 01:08.05 | raster | yes |
| 01:08.09 | raster | lgpl is not viral |
| 01:08.10 | raster | :) |
| 01:08.14 | raster | (as i like to call it) |
| 01:08.28 | raster | but imho true freedom *IS* the freedom of choice |
| 01:08.32 | ljp | yes, the lgpl is about proprietary software |
| 01:08.37 | raster | not just for the user, but for the developer too |
| 01:08.59 | raster | and true freedom give me the freedom to write closed software - if i so want |
| 01:09.24 | raster | if my users (market) will shun my app as a result |
| 01:09.26 | raster | that is my problem |
| 01:09.31 | ljp | but that takes away freedom from the users |
| 01:09.37 | raster | and a matter of appeasing my market as it desires |
| 01:09.41 | raster | no |
| 01:09.51 | raster | the users have the freedom not to purchase/download/use that app |
| 01:09.53 | raster | but use another |
| 01:09.59 | ljp | yes, because then they no longer have the same freedoms as you |
| 01:10.02 | raster | note i qm talking about 3rd party software |
| 01:10.19 | raster | not what the user buys as a piece of bundled software with the device |
| 01:10.34 | raster | correct |
| 01:10.42 | raster | i chose not to give my users the fgreedom to poke around my code |
| 01:10.48 | raster | that is a choice of mine |
| 01:10.51 | ljp | thats not free software |
| 01:10.55 | raster | i know |
| 01:11.07 | raster | so as such if a platform REQUIRES i use a gpl lib |
| 01:11.07 | ljp | its business as usual |
| 01:11.20 | raster | then u have removed my freedoms |
| 01:11.30 | raster | so i have a choice here |
| 01:11.36 | raster | 1. make my app gpl |
| 01:11.39 | ljp | but your users dont |
| 01:11.48 | raster | or 2. simply ignore your platfrom and develop for another that doesnt require that |
| 01:11.51 | SpeedEvil | The users have the choice not to use an app |
| 01:11.55 | raster | yes |
| 01:11.56 | ljp | so using lgpl is very selfish |
| 01:11.57 | raster | thats is my point |
| 01:12.03 | SpeedEvil | For example. |
| 01:12.06 | raster | it is NOT an app they cantt' choose |
| 01:12.09 | SpeedEvil | Consider a deent mapping program. |
| 01:12.10 | raster | it is a 3rd party choice |
| 01:12.12 | raster | a download |
| 01:12.13 | SpeedEvil | Decent |
| 01:12.24 | raster | a "this is a closed app - download and accept that limitation" |
| 01:12.32 | raster | they agreed to the choice on download |
| 01:12.35 | SpeedEvil | with good maps of a country, and routing that works well. |
| 01:12.42 | SpeedEvil | I'd be quite happy to pay for that. |
| 01:12.53 | raster | good example |
| 01:12.59 | raster | and maps themselevs cost money |
| 01:13.05 | raster | like it or not - good maps are not cheap |
| 01:13.14 | raster | someone SPENDS a lot of money aquiring al the data |
| 01:13.17 | SpeedEvil | Modulo stuff like OSM |
| 01:13.25 | SpeedEvil | Which may eventually come up with good maps |
| 01:13.32 | raster | other spend lots of time developign code to route and work around all the map bugs and inaccuracies |
| 01:13.33 | SpeedEvil | but not for several years at best. |
| 01:13.37 | SpeedEvil | (in most palces) |
| 01:13.39 | raster | yup |
| 01:13.53 | raster | but if the map app was fast, efficient, did a good job and was a reasonable price |
| 01:13.58 | raster | why not sell a closed one |
| 01:14.07 | raster | get reward for your time and effort to creat it |
| 01:14.14 | *** join/#openmoko d3vice (n=d3vice@a213-22-124-16.cpe.netcabo.pt) |
| 01:14.30 | SpeedEvil | Especially as the map data vendors will not let you sell an open-source one. |
| 01:14.35 | *** join/#openmoko Q_Continuum (i=kcbnac@flirtini.mintygreen.net) |
| 01:14.42 | raster | but |
| 01:14.50 | raster | toi do this i also need to pay a royalty to trolltech |
| 01:14.57 | raster | its like a tax |
| 01:15.10 | raster | to do that for wince/winmob i don't |
| 01:15.17 | raster | i dont need to do it for the iphone |
| 01:15.24 | ljp | and having to buy closed maps isnt a tax? |
| 01:15.29 | raster | not to mention the customerbase fo those is SOOOOO much larger |
| 01:15.40 | SpeedEvil | ljp: choosing to buy closed maps vs not having any maps |
| 01:15.45 | raster | why would i then bother making an app for the freerunner? |
| 01:15.48 | ljp | is not a choice |
| 01:16.10 | Q_Continuum | Hmmm. I think I might *need* a Freerunner. I think I just broke my Treo650/sim card :-( |
| 01:16.16 | Q_Continuum | I was hoping they were available. lol |
| 01:16.27 | Q_Continuum | Oh well |
| 01:16.45 | SpeedEvil | ljp: you cannot - the data vendors will not let you - sell a GPLd map program. |
| 01:17.08 | Q_Continuum | How good are Google's maps? |
| 01:17.10 | SpeedEvil | (without at least some closed source part that protects the data) |
| 01:17.15 | abraxa__ | Q_Continuum: The first mass-produced batches supposedly hit the distributors around June 1st |
| 01:17.22 | Q_Continuum | sweet. |
| 01:17.40 | Q_Continuum | because I can't use my phone :-( it says check the sim card. |
| 01:17.41 | Q_Continuum | lol |
| 01:18.03 | SpeedEvil | Q_Continuum: mostly fine - they are very licence restricted though. All you can basically do is look at them online. You cannot cache them. |
| 01:18.04 | Q_Continuum | Looks like I'll be buying a rechargable for now, and hoping it works... |
| 01:18.32 | Q_Continuum | SpeedEvil: I'll bet if you worked with Google, they'd be willing to do something for the OpenMoko - as its also something they could use for Android. |
| 01:18.49 | Q_Continuum | Or they might have something already in the works for Android, that could be pulled over. |
| 01:19.02 | SpeedEvil | Q_Continuum: the problem is not google. |
| 01:19.19 | SpeedEvil | Q_Continuum: the problem is t hat google license data from the map vendors. |
| 01:19.25 | Q_Continuum | I understand the licensing issue - doesn't google have its own maps? |
| 01:19.42 | SpeedEvil | Q_Continuum: the map vendors want a _much_ larger slice of the pie for maps that the user downloads to their device. |
| 01:19.57 | Q_Continuum | I'm thinking more along the lines of a GPL'd front-end that ties into maps.google.com - or are we talking off-line data? |
| 01:20.03 | SpeedEvil | off-line |
| 01:20.07 | Q_Continuum | might've missed crucial convo |
| 01:20.08 | Q_Continuum | Dang. |
| 01:20.19 | SpeedEvil | You can't (legally) do anything beyond show tiles online. |
| 01:20.31 | SpeedEvil | You can't cache areas of the map for later use for example. |
| 01:20.32 | raster | SpeedEvil: i think u can cache |
| 01:20.41 | raster | SpeedEvil: but only to the same extent a browser would dumbly cache |
| 01:20.44 | SpeedEvil | yes |
| 01:20.57 | raster | u cant go an "download all the maps for my city and keep them permanently cached" |
| 01:20.59 | raster | for example |
| 01:21.05 | SpeedEvil | yeah. |
| 01:21.13 | raster | i guess the caching is more to the intent of it |
| 01:21.24 | _charly_ | hi :) |
| 01:21.28 | raster | if the intent is just simply to avoid mroe data xfer in a generic way - good |
| 01:21.46 | raster | if it is intended to attempt to keep maps for a large region even if u never used the maps - then you are dicing with death |
| 01:22.14 | SpeedEvil | Yeah. The map ninjas will come for you in the night with their weighty theodolites. |
| 01:23.16 | Psi | how come the numeric keypad is still in terminal? i would have though that would be fixed by now? |
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| 01:24.34 | SpeedEvil | The numeric keypad could work quite well - if it had A-F too. |
| 01:24.48 | Psi | and all the symbols |
| 01:25.18 | Psi | its totally useless in terminal as it is, so i wonder why its still there |
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| 01:25.40 | SpeedEvil | It's not totally useless - merely clunky |
| 01:26.24 | Psi | it doesnt even have a / |
| 01:26.38 | SpeedEvil | I found one somewhere IIRC |
| 01:27.12 | Psi | or a tab for autocomplete |
| 01:39.02 | raster | u'll love the new qtopia+x11 image then |
| 01:39.06 | raster | doesnt even have a terminal |
| 01:39.07 | raster | "_ |
| 01:39.09 | raster | :) |
| 01:41.54 | mmontour | stabs Bluez (headset audio in particular) with a rusty spork |
| 01:43.00 | Qwell | sco? bleh |
| 01:43.14 | mmontour | Does anyone have any hints on the significance of "hcid[13049]: Unable to lock headset" when trying to play a wav with 'aplay'? |
| 01:46.39 | SpeedEvil | Your headset does not have the stainless steel explosively-actuated flesh locks enabled. There should be a pink button somehere on the headset. |
| 01:48.51 | mwester | raster: that's a subject that'll get the qtopia folks REALLY riled! ;) :D |
| 01:49.18 | raster | mwester: no terminal? |
| 01:49.19 | raster | :) |
| 01:50.11 | mwester | :D Why a terminal on a phone would be a good thing -- they'll get all defensive, and argue that it's open-source, and if you want a terminal, write one yourself. :D |
| 01:50.42 | mwester | And then if you point out that there's already several for X-11, and none for Qt, they get REALLY angry! |
| 01:51.18 | raster | and if we dont ship their favorite temrinal we will suck |
| 01:51.43 | mwester | Nah. The lack of a useful on-screen keyboard will distract everyone. |
| 01:51.53 | raster | hhehehheheh |
| 01:52.04 | raster | well i did install gpe-terminal |
| 01:52.09 | raster | as i literally have no terminal |
| 01:52.16 | raster | (and that just puts a .desktop file in for rxvt) |
| 01:52.34 | raster | which of course doesnt accept inptu thanks to the new "no manual way to pop kbd up/down" |
| 01:52.42 | raster | so i gave up and dont use a terminal on my phone |
| 01:52.46 | raster | as frankly its too much effort |
| 01:54.04 | sagacis | I just mostly gave up on the phone. Without complete apps, we used the terminal for a lot of start/stop scripts. Without a useful suspend/resume, the six phones we bought at work just collect dust. |
| 01:54.06 | mwester | It'll get fixed one way or another, I expect. It's rather too bad, though. The display is a bit smaller than the N800, but it seems to me that the GTA0x should reasonably be expected to work as well. |
| 01:54.26 | mwester | sagacis: suspend/resume is almost completely working now. |
| 01:54.45 | sagacis | mwester: except when I want to get/make a phone call after suspending..... :( |
| 01:55.06 | sagacis | I haven't tried it since Thursday, tho. I'm trying to update the build. |
| 01:55.17 | sagacis | I've been using Scaredycat's images. |
| 01:55.22 | mwester | Just a bit of time still required to get the last little bits in place. In the meantime, you can try a kernel that'll work with recent images that has early patches that should fix the GSM after suspend. |
| 01:55.29 | mwester | http://moko.mwester.net |
| 01:55.35 | sagacis | I'll give it a shot. |
| 01:55.53 | sagacis | I was happy to see with suspend I could carry the phone all day.... |
| 01:56.23 | rtm | Is the lack of suspend/resume what caused Openmoko to give up on their applications and adopt qt apps? |
| 01:56.36 | mwester | One report indicates that if you removed "console=ttySAC0" from the boot args in u-boot, you may have to put that back to get it to work; I've not investigated that any further yet. |
| 01:56.42 | mwester | rtm: no. |
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| 01:56.53 | rtm | mwester: What was? |
| 01:56.58 | sagacis | I'd work on it myself, but since upgrading to Hardy, I haven't been able to build all the way through.... |
| 01:57.05 | sagacis | I don't seem to have as much time as I used to. |
| 01:57.12 | mwester | I don't know for sure, rtm -- I expect general progress was the biggest issue. |
| 01:57.16 | sagacis | mwester: I tried it both ways. |
| 01:57.39 | rtm | mwester: They didn't seem *that* bad. |
| 01:58.00 | sagacis | I liked them.... I'm not such a big fan of Qt, personally... I like the gtk toolkit better |
| 02:00.16 | mwester | rtm: :) I guess it depends on expectations. Qtopia is a pretty complete phone software stack. I think OM will be the more versatile in the long run, if folks work on it (kinda like the maemo stuff) |
| 02:00.44 | rtm | Will it be difficult to launch gtk-based apps using the new Qtopia stack? |
| 02:00.44 | mwester | I'm not a fan of the Qt stuff at all, but the phone apps looked very good indeed. |
| 02:00.56 | sagacis | Very shiny. |
| 02:01.03 | mwester | I haven't tried the new stuff; I can't get it to build for the gta01 |
| 02:02.06 | abraxa__ | mwester: It doesn't seem to run on GTA01 anyway |
| 02:02.24 | mwester | Ah. Well, that would be a rather more serious problem, then! |
| 02:02.35 | sagacis | that's a bummer.... I'm already in the dust.... |
| 02:02.36 | mwester | I presume that's something we can fix? |
| 02:02.39 | sagacis | It hasn't even been a year. |
| 02:03.17 | abraxa__ | mwester: No idea. Kernel doesn't boot and with a different 2.4.24 it gets stuck in a loop spitting out jffs2 error messages |
| 02:03.23 | abraxa__ | 2.6.24* |
| 02:03.40 | mwester | Different kernel? Ick. |
| 02:04.24 | rtm | We just need to get a VM running on the gta01, then. |
| 02:04.29 | abraxa__ | mwester: I mean... the kernel on http://downloads.openmoko.org/asu/ doesn't boot on GTA01 and a kernel that does boot can't handle the jffs2 rootfs. |
| 02:04.41 | mwester | So much to do. And with the OM/OE build system, so little disk space left! :D |
| 02:04.51 | sagacis | heh |
| 02:05.15 | sagacis | mwester: so I need both the kernel and the neod patch, right? |
| 02:05.50 | *** join/#openmoko alan (n=alan@61.6.64.6) |
| 02:06.12 | mwester | The kernel, yes -- the neod patch is actually optional. Without the neod change, you'll just find that it won't stay suspended for long because any change in signal strength will have the GSM waking the GTA01 to tell it about it. |
| 02:06.47 | mwester | So I'd try the kernel only at first, and make sure that it suspends and resumes ok. Then you can start messing with the neod and apmd configs. |
| 02:06.59 | sagacis | ok |
| 02:07.33 | sagacis | Hmm... I dont' like Firefox3's download window. |
| 02:08.47 | alan | Greetings :) |
| 02:08.52 | abraxa__ | sagacis: You might like its privacy policy even less. |
| 02:09.02 | alan | anyone added gtk-directfb before? |
| 02:09.16 | sagacis | Uh-oh. Better read it. |
| 02:09.23 | *** part/#openmoko aboyer (n=aboyer@bas1-ottawa23-1096708796.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 02:10.14 | *** join/#openmoko j_ack (n=rudi@dsbg-4db7c265.pool.einsundeins.de) |
| 02:11.50 | abraxa__ | sagacis: http://john.jubjubs.net/2008/05/13/mozilla-firefox-data/ |
| 02:14.13 | SpeedEvil | As long as it's turnoffable-onnable - I don't see an issue. |
| 02:15.24 | abraxa__ | Fact is: it's currently being done already through their automatic updates and you can't turn that off |
| 02:16.43 | SpeedEvil | As I read that - what tehy are saying is simply that FF occasionally asks if there is a new version. |
| 02:16.58 | SpeedEvil | And that's what they're logging. |
| 02:17.26 | SpeedEvil | It's FF version only |
| 02:19.03 | abraxa__ | Yes, but a lot of programs ask the user if he's okay with submitting data (even anonymous) to the creator |
| 02:19.09 | sagacis | How long does the suspend take to go to full suspend by default? |
| 02:19.20 | abraxa__ | They don't even do that now, so I don't see why they would do it with more private data then |
| 02:20.06 | SpeedEvil | I assumed it was doing this the first time I got a 'there is a new version of FF' dialog. |
| 02:20.09 | SpeedEvil | It's obvious. |
| 02:20.12 | SpeedEvil | (to me) |
| 02:20.21 | sagacis | Maybe it was just guessing? |
| 02:21.01 | alan | gtk-directfb issue.. anyone can help? |
| 02:21.12 | *** part/#openmoko Q_Continuum (i=kcbnac@flirtini.mintygreen.net) |
| 02:21.32 | sagacis | alan: I haven't done it before. |
| 02:23.32 | abraxa__ | SpeedEvil: On http://john.jubjubs.net/2007/11/27/mozilla-firefox-market-share/ it's said that it does transmit "anonymous" data with every ping to the update server - from what I know, no one ever asked me if that's okay |
| 02:23.42 | alan | hmm.. alright.. anyone else that can help me? |
| 02:26.48 | SpeedEvil | abraxa__: where that data is your FF version as I understand it. |
| 02:28.41 | SpeedEvil | abraxa__: And I aslo vaguely recall something saying this on the first time it did it on FF1.5 |
| 02:29.04 | abraxa__ | SpeedEvil: Hmm okay, I don't have any proof cause I don't remember :) |
| 02:29.13 | abraxa__ | I'm just wary of these efforts, that's all |
| 02:30.24 | SpeedEvil | It's also turnoffable from prefs->advanced->updates. |
| 02:30.39 | *** join/#openmoko fenfir (n=fenfir@adsl-64-219-109-77.dsl.lgvwtx.swbell.net) |
| 02:30.50 | SpeedEvil | There is also a note on that blog post that many distributions turn off that switch, and manage the updates themselves |
| 02:31.30 | abraxa__ | Thanks for the hint |
| 02:33.03 | *** join/#openmoko bmk789_ (n=bmk789@c-98-223-16-230.hsd1.in.comcast.net) |
| 02:34.10 | sagacis | mwester: I imaged to your kernel, but get the same thing. It wakes for the first incoming phone call. I answer, then hang up from the phone.... |
| 02:34.33 | sagacis | wait for the device to fully suspend again (about 5 minutes, hear a click from the speakers), and I can't answer it any more. |
| 02:37.16 | mwester | :( Debug time... The readme describes the "nspy" mechanism to dump the driver<->GSM communications. You might like to enable that, duplicate the failure, and dump the buffer (use the little script in the readme to make sure the buffer is completely empty; there's a limit on how much data can be read in one go from sysfs). |
| 02:37.31 | *** join/#openmoko danilos (n=danilo@canonical/launchpad/danilos) |
| 02:39.21 | *** join/#openmoko holycow (n=biteme@S01060016b6b53675.vf.shawcable.net) |
| 02:40.36 | sagacis | OK.... Sounds like it'll take a few minutes. |
| 02:41.03 | mmontour | OK, I got that downloads.openmoko.org/asu/ image to boot on GTA01 (mounted it with mtdram then did a new mkfs.jffs2) but it's not happy. Complains about a critical battery, and didn't respond to the 'answer' button when I called it. |
| 02:47.32 | *** join/#openmoko milos_ (n=milos@92.36.184.240) |
| 02:55.41 | jaebird | wonders how foreign gtk apps will look inside qtopia |
| 02:57.35 | *** join/#openmoko gopi (n=gopi@ppp-71-139-48-90.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net) |
| 03:00.06 | sagacis | mwester: I like your nspy. Works well. Now to suspend. |
| 03:03.43 | *** join/#openmoko daMaestro (n=jon@fedora/damaestro) |
| 03:08.05 | sagacis | mwester: When I have the usb cable plugged in and the phone suspends, I get the white screen of death. |
| 03:08.32 | *** join/#openmoko SP-8472 (i=8472@dslb-084-056-227-006.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 03:08.45 | mmontour | I added my GTA02-to-GTA01 jffs conversion instructions to http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Userspace_root_image |
| 03:15.39 | *** join/#openmoko behdad (n=behdad@CPE001217b19226-CM0012c9c84bc4.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 03:18.01 | daMaestro | mmontour, testing them now |
| 03:18.24 | *** join/#openmoko phobie (i=phobof@87.106.166.126) |
| 03:18.33 | *** join/#openmoko batti (n=batti@blfd-4db5a191.pool.einsundeins.de) |
| 03:22.29 | *** join/#openmoko milos_ (n=milos@92.36.131.182) |
| 03:22.45 | mwester | mmontour: Thanks! that's really good info. |
| 03:33.22 | daMaestro | mmontour, still need to test the results, you might add some information on how to undo what we've done (mainly unmount and clearing /dev/mtdblock0 /dev/mtd0) |
| 03:33.23 | *** join/#openmoko aesci7E (n=aesci99@124.205.32.2) |
| 03:37.02 | mmontour | daMaestro: I added the cleanup steps (although I think people would've figured it out). |
| 03:37.55 | daMaestro | mmontour, yes; but we want the lowest barrier to entry as possible ;-) |
| 03:38.14 | daMaestro | gah.. now i have to wait for the device to charge enough to boot |
| 03:38.57 | *** join/#openmoko loufoque (n=loufoque@tob.residence.ens-lyon.fr) |
| 03:39.21 | loufoque | wonders if the freerunner will be out by christmas, and if the price will drop |
| 03:39.32 | SpeedEvil | To that girl you missed. |
| 03:39.34 | SpeedEvil | oops |
| 03:40.08 | daMaestro | rootPassword |
| 03:42.56 | *** join/#openmoko playya (n=playya@p57B2BFD5.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 03:45.45 | *** join/#openmoko playya_ (n=playya@p57B2BE0E.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 03:53.04 | *** part/#openmoko fenfir (n=fenfir@adsl-64-219-109-77.dsl.lgvwtx.swbell.net) |
| 03:53.13 | *** join/#openmoko fenfir (n=fenfir@adsl-64-219-109-77.dsl.lgvwtx.swbell.net) |
| 04:05.13 | *** join/#openmoko playya (n=playya@p57B2BB0C.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 04:07.11 | *** join/#openmoko Yanroy (n=rmeador@71-88-110-253.dhcp.oxfr.ma.charter.com) |
| 04:07.18 | Yanroy | hi all |
| 04:07.48 | geogriffin | hey |
| 04:07.54 | Yanroy | I'm so psyched about the (hopefully) impending release of the freerunner that I decided to install qemu and try it out with the neo1973 setup |
| 04:08.03 | Yanroy | it looks pretty sweet |
| 04:08.23 | geogriffin | i have been building that for a few days haha |
| 04:08.27 | SpeedEvil | quemu is slwoer than the hardware. |
| 04:08.34 | Yanroy | but my understanding is that the newer stuff changes a lot... what with all the discussion on the mailing list about GTK and qtopia |
| 04:08.55 | Yanroy | yeah, qemu had better be slower than the hardware... it took about 15 mins to boot up, over 1 min to go into the calendar app |
| 04:09.27 | Yanroy | so how "real" is the qemu experience? |
| 04:09.37 | Yanroy | both looks/software and speed |
| 04:09.45 | SpeedEvil | looks/software are identical |
| 04:09.56 | SpeedEvil | speed - maybe 1/10th - it depends on your hardware |
| 04:10.15 | Yanroy | I have an athlon 3000+ w/ 1gb ram |
| 04:10.20 | geogriffin | is there some way to check what equivalent speed qemu is running at? |
| 04:10.23 | Yanroy | it's about 3 years old... |
| 04:10.36 | *** join/#openmoko soundar (n=openmoko@59.97.56.189) |
| 04:10.58 | Yanroy | so is the only way to get to the home screen from inside an app to click on the top right and select it off the list? |
| 04:11.04 | Yanroy | and do other things than just home ever show up on that list? |
| 04:11.05 | *** part/#openmoko soundar (n=openmoko@59.97.56.189) |
| 04:11.35 | SpeedEvil | that lists active applications |
| 04:12.33 | Yanroy | so I take it that by switching back to home, I am closing the application I was in? I would have expected it to keep it running so it would switch faster next time rather than restarting it |
| 04:13.01 | SpeedEvil | no - you're not |
| 04:14.02 | Yanroy | hmm... well, the dialer stayed on the menu, but the calendar thing didn't |
| 04:14.30 | d3vice | omg, i'm booting om for the first time in qemu |
| 04:15.13 | d3vice | i thought it would take ages to compile |
| 04:15.17 | d3vice | 10 mins |
| 04:16.07 | Yanroy | heh... mine took like half an hour |
| 04:16.51 | Yanroy | are there any plans to add tooltips? |
| 04:17.01 | Yanroy | or some kind of help? I'm having trouble navigating this thing, not having seen it before... |
| 04:17.28 | Yanroy | I suppose it would need to be a tooltip that popped up when you held the stylus down for a second or so, since there's no cursor for a mouseover... |
| 04:19.19 | d3vice | :) i think its taking more time for first boot under qemu than to build the image |
| 04:19.26 | d3vice | there, ready |
| 04:19.41 | d3vice | you guys rock |
| 04:20.10 | Yanroy | it doesn't look quite like the mockups on the wiki, but it's really great |
| 04:20.19 | d3vice | its not great |
| 04:20.21 | Yanroy | I'll buy one the instant they're available |
| 04:20.23 | d3vice | its awesome |
| 04:24.12 | *** join/#openmoko winux (n=winux@218.7.43.195) |
| 04:24.53 | winux | who has succeed in distributed cross compile openmoko ? |
| 04:24.57 | Yanroy | it's somewhat unfortunate that the font size for numbers in the dialer has to resize in order to fit a standard US phone number (which has fewer digits than european, IIRC...) |
| 04:25.28 | *** join/#openmoko playya (n=playya@p57B2BA66.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 04:27.06 | zash | Yanroy: standard? |
| 04:27.26 | Yanroy | ? |
| 04:29.03 | zash | "standard US phone number" ? |
| 04:29.11 | Yanroy | 10 digits |
| 04:31.17 | zash | including all regional codes and such? |
| 04:31.24 | Yanroy | yeah |
| 04:31.51 | zash | hm |
| 04:31.58 | Yanroy | sometimes ppl put a 1 in front, making it 11 digits, but that's not required by any cell service I've ever had |
| 04:32.36 | Yanroy | and if your number is from a place with a really small population so they only need one area code, they might permit you to drop the first 3 digits, leaving only 7 (unless dialing long distance) |
| 04:33.33 | *** join/#openmoko tholin (n=tholin@h-79-136-60-229.NA.cust.bahnhof.se) |
| 04:33.38 | zash | in .se it is like (+46|0)(\d{1,3})\d{5,6} |
| 04:33.41 | zash | or something |
| 04:34.50 | *** join/#openmoko tholin (n=tholin@h-79-136-60-229.NA.cust.bahnhof.se) |
| 04:34.58 | Yanroy | hmm... |
| 04:35.09 | Yanroy | that's quite a range |
| 04:35.43 | zash | regional codes is 1-3 digits |
| 04:36.02 | Yanroy | how would you tell the difference between a number with 2 digits in the middle piece and 5 in the end or 1 in the middle and 6 in the end? |
| 04:36.14 | zash | you don't |
| 04:36.18 | Yanroy | oh |
| 04:36.19 | Yanroy | lol |
| 04:36.53 | zash | i read som specs on swedish phone numbers, it was a mess |
| 04:37.10 | d3vice | wow |
| 04:37.43 | Yanroy | so how do I pull up a shell in qemu? |
| 04:37.53 | Yanroy | it's not on the utilities menu, which is where I'd expect it... |
| 04:38.20 | zash | hm, 5-8 digits in the local part |
| 04:39.10 | zash | lol |
| 04:39.29 | d3vice | errr |
| 04:39.37 | d3vice | how do i exit kobo? |
| 04:40.12 | Yanroy | ah, I found Terminal on the list of all programs |
| 04:40.21 | d3vice | got it |
| 04:40.24 | zash | d3vice: kobo? |
| 04:40.36 | d3vice | kobodeluxe, fast pace 2d space shooter |
| 04:40.40 | Yanroy | ooh... I'm running as root... naughty naughty |
| 04:40.43 | d3vice | works great even under qemu |
| 04:40.48 | Yanroy | does OM always make the user run as root? |
| 04:40.55 | d3vice | Yanroy: theres only root |
| 04:41.02 | Yanroy | hmm |
| 04:41.04 | zash | Yanroy: yepp :( |
| 04:41.07 | Yanroy | what about security? |
| 04:41.07 | d3vice | no users concept |
| 04:41.12 | Yanroy | ... it's linux |
| 04:41.17 | Yanroy | it's fundamentally a multiuser OS |
| 04:41.21 | d3vice | what about memory footprint, resources? |
| 04:41.32 | Yanroy | can it run sshd? |
| 04:41.35 | d3vice | sure |
| 04:41.45 | Yanroy | then it needs a concept of users, right? |
| 04:41.47 | d3vice | its linux... |
| 04:43.02 | *** join/#openmoko dvarnes (n=davidv@unaffiliated/dvarnes) |
| 04:44.28 | d3vice | whereis scummvm ? :) |
| 04:44.46 | Yanroy | how do I get a qwerty keyboard? the wiki docs on the input method just mention it exists, not how to make it come up... |
| 04:45.14 | *** join/#openmoko playya (n=playya@p57B2B838.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 04:45.36 | zash | Yanroy: enter a textfield |
| 04:45.52 | zash | s/enter/give focus to/ |
| 04:45.54 | Yanroy | I'm in the terminal, but it's giving me a dialing type pad |
| 04:46.07 | zash | lol wut? |
| 04:46.11 | Yanroy | same as it did when I tried to make a text message |
| 04:46.21 | Yanroy | I can type letters by clicking the buttons multiple times... |
| 04:47.00 | Yanroy | come to think of it, shell commands do look a lot like text message abbreviations... it might not be that bad |
| 04:47.02 | zash | ah, that one |
| 04:47.33 | *** join/#openmoko tedo (n=cta@HSI-KBW-091-089-005-184.hsi2.kabelbw.de) |
| 04:48.35 | *** join/#openmoko winux_ (n=winux@218.7.43.195) |
| 04:49.00 | d3vice | great work people |
| 04:49.10 | Yanroy | oh well, I can't figure it out... this thing is still probably the coolest thing I've seen in years |
| 04:49.12 | *** join/#openmoko playya_ (n=playya@p57B2B866.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 04:49.37 | Yanroy | keep up the good work :) once I get my hands on one, I'll try to do a little dev work myself |
| 04:49.41 | zash | reads /. feed |
| 04:49.52 | zash | sees |
| 04:49.52 | zash | sees Total Phone and Email Database Proposed In UK |
| 04:50.02 | *** join/#openmoko juri_ (n=juri@ip70-178-3-140.ks.ks.cox.net) |
| 04:50.02 | Yanroy | not surprised |
| 04:50.09 | d3vice | ouch! |
| 04:50.12 | Yanroy | the UK is living in the police state of 1984 |
| 04:50.24 | Yanroy | and the US is only about 3-5 years behind... |
| 04:50.41 | d3vice | yeah, but the chinese beat everyone else in cctv |
| 04:50.48 | Yanroy | wonders if he can get service for his openmoko on an island in the middle of the ocean |
| 04:51.00 | d3vice | and dont forget the great (fire)wall of china |
| 04:51.03 | juri_ | heres something for you. to interview for a job at the FSF, i have to dial into a conference call. my openmoko dosent dial numbers while i'm talking. therefore, i'm going to have to use a non-free phone to interview for a job at the FSF. |
| 04:51.06 | Yanroy | small, deserted island |
| 04:51.18 | Yanroy | huh? |
| 04:51.30 | Yanroy | what do you mean it doesn't dial while talking? |
| 04:51.30 | juri_ | i'm not even sure where to file that. "irony" dosent even begin to describe it. |
| 04:51.31 | d3vice | juri_: file a bug!!! |
| 04:51.39 | zash | hm, wheres my list of countries that dont suck |
| 04:51.57 | juri_ | maybe after my interview. :P |
| 04:52.01 | zash | -rw-r----- 1 zash zash 0 2008-05-20 06:51 countries_that_dont_suck |
| 04:52.04 | zash | oh :( |
| 04:52.07 | Yanroy | rofl |
| 04:52.25 | juri_ | i mean, wow. |
| 04:52.41 | juri_ | i'm sure somewhere, god is playing a cruel joke on me. :) |
| 04:52.45 | d3vice | juri_: that's a great RFE ! |
| 04:52.49 | Yanroy | there are always countries that just don't care... like if you live in the middle of a desert or jungle in an impoverished country undergoing a revolution |
| 04:52.50 | *** join/#openmoko BDo (n=bdonnett@linagoraberri.pck.nerim.net) |
| 04:53.13 | juri_ | request for employment? :P |
| 04:53.19 | zash | so far, new zealand seems to be the best |
| 04:53.33 | Yanroy | juri_: if it can't dial while talking (by which I assume you mean on a call), then how can anyone ever dial into their voicemail, or a phone menu system like any company has? |
| 04:53.34 | d3vice | :) request for enhancement (when filling a bug) |
| 04:53.56 | juri_ | yanroy: i don't know. |
| 04:54.08 | Yanroy | knows it can access voicemail cuz ppl talk about it on the mailing list |
| 04:54.15 | juri_ | i've been having to re-arange how i use a phone to avoid voice menus, and cannot check my voicemail. |
| 04:54.27 | d3vice | ouch |
| 04:54.42 | Yanroy | that's messed up... are you sure one of the buttons on the call screen doesn't go back to the dialer w/o hanging up? |
| 04:54.56 | Yanroy | wait, not every country uses DTMF, right? |
| 04:54.57 | juri_ | oh, you can go to the dialer. and press numbers. nothing *happens*. |
| 04:55.01 | geogriffin | i thought i saw something about DTMF |
| 04:55.08 | Yanroy | so it might need to generate different tones for different regions... |
| 04:55.09 | geogriffin | while reading the wiki |
| 04:55.20 | zash | juri_: use the cli ;) |
| 04:55.26 | d3vice | Yanroy: i thought there was only one DTMF |
| 04:55.32 | zash | or like, whisstle |
| 04:55.49 | Yanroy | zash: you'll need 2 ppl to whistle to make ti work ;) |
| 04:55.54 | juri_ | i just thought i'd share that gemstone. ;P |
| 04:56.04 | d3vice | juri_: indeed, a gemstone |
| 04:56.07 | Yanroy | juri_: I'll fix that myself if it isn't fixed by the time I get my freerunner |
| 04:56.27 | geogriffin | haha yeah just learn how to whistle the DTMF tones with your friend |
| 04:56.31 | *** join/#openmoko trivex (n=trivex@CPE00112f8785ab-CM000f9f50281e.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 04:56.34 | juri_ | here i am, interviewing for the FSF... and to do it, i need to whip out my proprietary phone. |
| 04:56.56 | juri_ | its like taking your brain to a cheesegrater. |
| 04:57.09 | Yanroy | good night all... time for me to hit the hay |
| 04:57.16 | d3vice | later Yanroy |
| 04:57.43 | *** join/#openmoko winux__ (n=winux@218.7.43.195) |
| 05:00.34 | mmontour | juri_: sending DTMF tones during a call works for me. |
| 05:01.21 | geogriffin | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/GSM02.07#1.15_Dual_Tone_Multi_Frequency_function_.28DTMF.29 |
| 05:01.41 | geogriffin | apparently DTMF functionality is required.. so that should be checked |
| 05:01.56 | *** join/#openmoko TeringTu1y (n=maarten@195-241-125-243.ip.telfort.nl) |
| 05:01.58 | juri_ | mmontour: how are you accomplishing that? |
| 05:02.21 | juri_ | uhm, thats a gsm02 page. i've got a neo1973. |
| 05:02.34 | d3vice | uh? |
| 05:02.59 | geogriffin | oh yeah i didnt think about that |
| 05:03.17 | juri_ | i'm looking at it anyways. i'll try it out here in a sec. |
| 05:03.49 | mmontour | Dial the call, press the tab at the bottom to get back to the numeric keypad, then just type the numbers. (p.s. "02.07" is the number of one of the GSM standards, not a phone model) |
| 05:04.47 | juri_ | xyea, i got that. its not *working*. |
| 05:05.00 | juri_ | thats what i've been trying. |
| 05:05.45 | geogriffin | yeah it is for GTA01 i guess |
| 05:07.20 | mmontour | juri_: sorry, I can't provide much help beyond "works for me". |
| 05:07.34 | *** join/#openmoko playya_ (n=playya@p57B2B527.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 05:07.47 | juri_ | hmm. the voice menus seem to be working.. but its not making any noise on my end. |
| 05:08.01 | juri_ | i'll try to dial into the conference call tomorow. |
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| 05:09.57 | mmontour | You don't hear the tones from the Neo; only the other end hears them. |
| 05:10.21 | liwei | hi please help me , i want to flash kernel to my neo1973 use dfu-util -a kernel -R -D ./uImage.bin , but it always download to ram |
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| 05:13.55 | ljp | maybe try using -a 3 |
| 05:14.42 | juri_ | files that under "non-intuitive". :P |
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| 05:17.02 | liwei | very surprise, i use vmware it always download to ram, but when i use a real machine it work ok |
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| 05:27.31 | daMaestro | http://www.spoofapp.com/ |
| 05:27.32 | daMaestro | lol |
| 05:27.41 | daMaestro | *that* is funny |
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| 05:32.46 | Level1Tech | moko you |
| 05:32.55 | Level1Tech | hey mokofucker.. |
| 05:33.04 | Level1Tech | Man thats one bad moko |
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| 05:34.11 | doc|home | moron |
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| 05:56.10 | daMaestro | http://downloads.openmoko.org/asu/ seems to not be owkring on the gta01 hardware |
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| 05:58.38 | daMaestro | and yes, i used http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Userspace_root_image to convert the image |
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| 06:09.13 | geogriffin | NOTE: package openmoko-devel-image-1.0: completed |
| 06:09.27 | geogriffin | oh man |
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| 06:22.57 | dbmoodb | is it in production yet ? |
| 06:23.06 | dbmoodb | tis the 20th |
| 06:23.23 | dbmoodb | and mass was said to start by the 16th latest |
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| 06:28.51 | zash | dbmoodb: you should filter all dates that fic/om says trough a increase-all-dates-with-at-least-one-week-filter |
| 06:29.04 | dbmoodb | ... |
| 06:29.06 | dbmoodb | why |
| 06:29.16 | dbmoodb | what would it show me -- yes or no ? |
| 06:29.36 | geogriffin | http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/community/2008-May/017520.html |
| 06:30.21 | dbmoodb | so when is the new date ? |
| 06:30.47 | zash | http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/community/2008-May/017531.html |
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| 06:32.01 | izico | it's a hot channel |
| 06:32.03 | zash | i still don't see any "we're currently building shitloads of phones" |
| 06:32.03 | dbmoodb | woooo wait ... first for mass production start then 2/3 weeks wait |
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| 06:43.37 | brian_ | I'm a Dope. |
| 06:43.43 | brian_ | too |
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| 06:44.49 | zash | coffeedope |
| 06:44.52 | zash | .com |
| 06:45.07 | brian_ | so save the cost an camel jockie em |
| 06:45.45 | Kamping_Kaiser | wonders if the Free Software Song is available as a ringtone - *mwhwhahahah* |
| 06:46.15 | brian_ | no fireworks this year |
| 06:46.22 | zash | firewhat? |
| 06:46.36 | zash | ;) |
| 06:46.37 | zash | .. |
| 06:46.38 | zash | :( |
| 06:46.48 | brian_ | no sence in air freight those phones |
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| 06:47.26 | brian_ | since# |
| 06:47.35 | brian_ | idk |
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| 06:54.53 | liwei | why i cann't see sd card in my neo1973? |
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| 06:55.13 | liwei | please give me some suggestion? |
| 06:55.46 | liwei | i can't find anythine with ls /dev/ | grep mmc |
| 06:57.52 | FuzzyCat | df -h |
| 06:59.34 | rtm | lewei: The SD card should show up under /media/card. |
| 07:03.46 | Hopscotch | good morning |
| 07:04.54 | d3vice | g'morning Hopscotch |
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| 07:11.45 | methril | morning |
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| 07:13.36 | CIA-43 | freesmartphone.org: 03vesa.pikki * r990bbce53289 10/ (7 files in 2 dirs): |
| 07:13.36 | CIA-43 | freesmartphone.org: Fixed wavecom's call handling |
| 07:13.36 | CIA-43 | freesmartphone.org: Hangup now works when calling |
| 07:13.37 | CIA-43 | freesmartphone.org: 03vesa.pikki * r290cf97fad38 10/ (12 files in 3 dirs): Merge branch 'master' of git@git.freesmartphone.org:gsmd2 |
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| 08:50.02 | doron | g-morning |
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| 09:00.59 | geogriffin | i am pretty sure qemu is messing up my network |
| 09:02.09 | geogriffin | i keep having to bring my comp's network down then up |
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| 09:38.19 | tc | Can anyone tell me what ASU stands for, as in "Openmoko ASU software"? |
| 09:38.31 | XorA | April Software Update |
| 09:39.16 | Gottox | "Abgas Sonder Untersuchung". :) |
| 09:39.27 | cekay | *g |
| 09:39.31 | raster | arse suckage units |
| 09:39.33 | tc | ahhhh :) |
| 09:39.38 | tc | raster: haha |
| 09:39.53 | V0lle | Gottox: *lol* |
| 09:40.14 | Gottox | Yea, The Neo is a versatile device :P |
| 09:40.43 | zash | Abacus Software Update |
| 09:41.28 | V0lle | lol damn, first had to lookup the word "versatile"... Now I'm feeling ashamed a bit |
| 09:41.30 | V0lle | ^^ |
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| 09:48.12 | zedstar_ | All Swingers Unite |
| 09:50.17 | XorA | zedstar: not in this channel please, takes too long to clean up |
| 09:51.17 | zedstar_ | lol put your keys in the bowl |
| 09:51.53 | mjr | I hope you mean public keys |
| 09:52.45 | XorA | privates in a bowl is a whole different party |
| 09:53.11 | mjr | sounds like a german party in particular |
| 09:53.36 | zedstar_ | considering how male dominated this channel is im thinking swinging was probably not a good idea |
| 09:54.07 | buz | sees the southpark man pile in his mind |
| 09:54.17 | buz | thanks for making me recall that, really |
| 09:54.40 | XorA | chuckles evilly |
| 09:55.24 | zedstar_ | soggey biscuit? |
| 09:55.48 | madwoota | surely most of them are submissives though? :P |
| 09:56.01 | zedstar_ | lol |
| 09:56.39 | *** join/#openmoko bedboi (n=bedboi@c3lab.poliba.it) |
| 09:56.48 | bedboi | hi there. |
| 09:57.26 | bedboi | i've just read the post "Openmoko software update". Are the images working also for the old neo? |
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| 10:30.36 | CIA-43 | freesmartphone.org: 03vesa.pikki * rd95408e4633e 10/src/call.c: Temporary commit to get a single simultaneous call working. |
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| 10:57.12 | ebbe | bedboi: The images are working just fine on Neo1973 |
| 10:57.21 | bedboi | ebbe: thanks |
| 10:57.28 | bedboi | i'll try it right now |
| 10:59.17 | ebbe | bedboi: Oh wait.. dont know .. |
| 10:59.27 | bedboi | what? |
| 10:59.39 | ebbe | I misunderstod. I haven't tried them |
| 10:59.58 | ebbe | Looks like they are made for GTA02 |
| 11:00.30 | ebbe | But feel free to try them, just don't flash the uboot |
| 11:03.01 | bedboi | yep of course |
| 11:03.04 | bedboi | i have a GTA02 |
| 11:03.52 | ebbe | bedboi: Lucky bastard :) |
| 11:04.31 | bedboi | gta02 is not freerunner |
| 11:04.58 | ebbe | But it's got a faster cpu, right? |
| 11:04.58 | bedboi | wait |
| 11:05.11 | bedboi | i don't even know what I own :) |
| 11:05.26 | diego_at_work | maybe gta01b4? ^^ |
| 11:05.44 | bedboi | I own too many devices (n770, n810, n800, ipaq5455, neo1973, asus eee) |
| 11:06.02 | bedboi | diego71_: yep, that's the case :) |
| 11:06.06 | bedboi | gta01b4 |
| 11:06.52 | bedboi | diego_at_work: so i guess it won't work |
| 11:07.29 | diego_at_work | except for the kernel (maybe), it should work... |
| 11:07.47 | diego_at_work | maybe i'll try it on the SD |
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| 11:13.56 | rwhitby | ok, who is ready to try out a new MokoMakefile which no longer requires monotone? |
| 11:14.23 | diego_at_work | not now, sorry |
| 11:14.24 | FuzzyCat | ! |
| 11:14.30 | FuzzyCat | !! |
| 11:14.34 | FuzzyCat | <---- !!! |
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| 11:15.17 | ScaredyCat | :) |
| 11:15.45 | ScaredyCat | have they switched to git rwhitby? |
| 11:16.01 | XorA | wonders why OM bothers with public mailing lists |
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| 11:17.39 | rwhitby | ScaredyCat: I just saw an announcement on distro-devel ... |
| 11:18.36 | XorA | yes we did, and in a first for OM we switched one day early :-) |
| 11:18.51 | rwhitby | XorA: depends which timezone you're in ;-) |
| 11:19.11 | XorA | rwhitby: you werent in Weds when email was sent |
| 11:19.27 | rwhitby | XorA: I thought the plan was Monday ... |
| 11:19.41 | XorA | rwhitby: Wedsday for external people to see change |
| 11:20.42 | XorA | rwhitby: monday, to stop updating MTN, wedsday to announce switch to git, just to give some breathing space was my original timescale email |
| 11:22.08 | rwhitby | ah,cool. |
| 11:23.02 | rwhitby | ScaredyCat: /msg'd you the new Makefile |
| 11:23.07 | methril | me |
| 11:23.21 | rwhitby | when I have three success stories, I'll push it publicly |
| 11:23.29 | XorA | time to each lunch and watch bleach |
| 11:23.57 | methril | rwhitby i want to check mokomakefile |
| 11:24.09 | rwhitby | methril: I /msg'd you the URL |
| 11:24.53 | rwhitby | that URL will only be valid until I get three success stories |
| 11:25.10 | methril | i see |
| 11:25.21 | methril | i'm going on |
| 11:25.22 | rwhitby | (it's not being pasted here publicly, so it doesn't appear in the logs and get picked up by Google) |
| 11:25.49 | diego_at_work | encode it ... ^^ |
| 11:25.49 | rwhitby | waits to see if linux-openmoko recipe git fails again |
| 11:26.06 | ScaredyCat | ta |
| 11:26.08 | rwhitby | I haven't been able to fully test the new Makefile, cause my build doesn't get past linux-openmoko ... |
| 11:26.22 | ScaredyCat | what's the initial setup ? |
| 11:26.25 | rwhitby | and it fails again ... |
| 11:26.28 | *** join/#openmoko tubastian (n=tubastia@131.234.197.252) |
| 11:26.57 | rwhitby | ScaredyCat: "make clobber ; make" |
| 11:27.12 | rwhitby | be aware that clobber does what it says |
| 11:27.33 | ScaredyCat | does a "make backup first" |
| 11:28.28 | rwhitby | Good Plan TM |
| 11:29.17 | *** join/#openmoko arndot (n=arndt@port-92-196-69-210.dynamic.qsc.de) |
| 11:29.22 | rwhitby | does a "while true ; make ; done" to see if he can get the linux-openmoko git thing to work |
| 11:29.59 | ScaredyCat | while !git work |
| 11:32.24 | ScaredyCat | it never works |
| 11:32.45 | ScaredyCat | well, not unless you send me lots of freerunners |
| 11:33.13 | rwhitby | make setup-machine-neo or something |
| 11:34.15 | rwhitby | sets the default back to gta01 |
| 11:36.14 | methril | why it downloads the bitbake branch? |
| 11:37.17 | rwhitby | methril: have you read the announcement on distro-devel? |
| 11:37.35 | rwhitby | "[Announcement] Switch to git for the OpenEmbedded metadata andBitbake" |
| 11:37.41 | methril | i'm going to :$ |
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| 11:43.07 | steko | hi |
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| 11:46.09 | rwhitby | Is anyone else getting "fatal: failed to unpack tree object 927c22fef4b386a419b0ac684815881a7d489775" when building linux-openmoko ? |
| 11:47.05 | XorA | rwhitby: yeah, my fault |
| 11:47.15 | XorA | rwhitby: used the wrong git hash |
| 11:48.05 | XorA | rwhitby: if you set AUTOREV for linux-openmoko just until I merge the fixes in |
| 11:48.41 | rwhitby | XorA: will you be doing that in the next 30 minutes? |
| 11:49.06 | XorA | rwhitby: depends how quickly I learn git |
| 11:49.10 | ScaredyCat | is still rm -rf ing tmp :( |
| 11:49.29 | rwhitby | ScaredyCat: here's a tip: "mv tmp tmp.old ; rm -rf tmp.old &" |
| 11:49.30 | XorA | mv tmp tmp.old; nice -n19 rm -rm tmp.old & |
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| 11:50.05 | ScaredyCat | I have a tmp.old already :) |
| 11:50.26 | diego_at_work | have you tried tmp.old.old? ^^ |
| 11:50.51 | ScaredyCat | heheh |
| 11:50.55 | XorA | just made a script called backrm |
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| 11:51.10 | ScaredyCat | spies XorA's deliberate typo |
| 11:51.27 | XorA | in spirit of uks pub culture I should releaser the script as backroom |
| 11:51.33 | rwhitby | GNU rm should have an option for this ... |
| 11:51.55 | winux | the wiki of icecc say that we could tell icecc not distribute compiles jobs for native packages, anyone can tell me what's the native packages meanãï¼ |
| 11:52.24 | XorA | winux: stuff that OE needs like git-native that we cant rely on OS to provide a good version |
| 11:52.44 | rwhitby | native => target OS is same as build host OS |
| 11:52.46 | diego_at_work | native means they are compiled for host target |
| 11:54.02 | winux | so i should set ICECC_USER_CLASS_BL = " native" |
| 11:54.03 | winux | <PROTECTED> |
| 11:55.33 | XorA | RP: ahah, bitbake update fixed that problem thanks |
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| 11:58.38 | ScaredyCat | stares into space |
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| 12:09.02 | CIA-43 | freesmartphone.org: 03heikki.paajanen * r761ed76f122f 10/ (src/modem.c src/serial.c vendor/ti-calypso-neo1973.c): Call progress indication work for Neo 1973 |
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| 12:16.59 | RP | XorA: great :) |
| 12:19.12 | rwhitby | methril|lunch, XorA: hang on before trying that new MokoMakefile |
| 12:19.26 | rwhitby | zecke fixed the repo, which means I can take a couple of hacks out. |
| 12:19.59 | methril|lunch | k |
| 12:20.34 | XorA | is still trying to merge |
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| 12:21.40 | XorA | time to crash course on git :-) |
| 12:23.52 | rwhitby | methril|lunch, XorA, ScaredyCat: URL updated |
| 12:24.02 | ScaredyCat | yay |
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| 12:26.53 | ScaredyCat | wonders is XorA will merge before I get to that part |
| 12:34.35 | CIA-43 | freesmartphone.org: 03heikki.paajanen * r6a4eb22a3572 10/ (src/modem.c vendor/ti-calypso-neo1973.c): |
| 12:34.35 | CIA-43 | freesmartphone.org: Start up fix |
| 12:34.35 | CIA-43 | freesmartphone.org: Neo wakeup timeout fix |
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| 12:41.45 | CIA-43 | freesmartphone.org: 03jluebbe * r1205ff3d78ea 10/data/themes/ (4 files): Replace all tabs with spaces to get a consistent indention |
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| 13:12.46 | jmichel | Could someone explain what this post means exactly: http://gettingstartedopenmoko.wordpress.com/2008/05/19/openmoko-software-update/ |
| 13:13.14 | jmichel | The OpenMoko development will continue but the FreeRunner will be shipped with a QTopia based platform ? |
| 13:13.50 | woglinde | what's the probem? |
| 13:14.40 | jmichel | I'm just a little confused about the future direction of the project |
| 13:14.45 | zedstar_ | jmichel the community mailing list has discussion about this |
| 13:15.26 | RedDog | 2007.1 -> 2007.2 -> Qtopia ... hmpf ... |
| 13:15.46 | jmichel | zedstar_: I'm not receiving these mails so I will register asap |
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| 13:17.15 | RedDog | is the mokomakefile allready updated? |
| 13:18.01 | zedstar_ | jmichel: but from what i understand there is not too much to worry about...if u wanna continue with gtk those libraries will ship etc etc |
| 13:18.37 | patoh | is there a reason for the move to qtopia? |
| 13:18.50 | k-s | patoh: because it's mostly ready? |
| 13:19.11 | k-s | and it is free software |
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| 13:20.29 | diego_at_work | i've tried it on neo some month ago, but i'm not very impressed |
| 13:20.41 | patoh | k-s: fair enough, I wasn't aware of the state of the current platform |
| 13:21.22 | k-s | patoh: problem with qtopia was that it was not ported to X, it required its own framebuffer |
| 13:21.39 | patoh | so it has been ported to kdrive now? |
| 13:22.00 | patoh | so the openmoko platform will still be used, qtopia will just be used for the high level ui correct? |
| 13:22.01 | k-s | to x11, which kdrive is a server impl |
| 13:22.29 | k-s | e17 is the window manager, takes care of that windows and like |
| 13:22.36 | k-s | (obviously) |
| 13:22.54 | k-s | and qtopia does the basic phone apps: contacts, dialer |
| 13:23.38 | patoh | mmm, would be interesting to see how this turns out |
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| 13:23.51 | zedstar_ | i can see the arguement for QT etc.....it looks likely nokia will adopt it for symbian also so bigger window for your apps |
| 13:24.40 | k-s | zedstar_: i still don't see good apps running unmodified in lots of environment |
| 13:25.08 | patoh | will be interesting to see how the look and feel are |
| 13:25.09 | k-s | but yes, it wll require less than rewrite the app again... maybe just some minor ui changes |
| 13:25.19 | zedstar_ | k-s well trolltech use the examples of apps like Skype |
| 13:25.20 | patoh | any contacts/dialer application is a upgrade on the current ones I guess |
| 13:25.31 | k-s | patoh: i saw raster running it sometime ago, was really fine |
| 13:25.53 | k-s | zedstar_: but you still need minor ui changes, otherwise it's an alien |
| 13:26.10 | patoh | i really was a fan of the old ui but |
| 13:26.14 | patoh | I guess I just love gtk :) |
| 13:26.42 | zedstar_ | k-s yeh i dunno ive never used it personally |
| 13:26.55 | zedstar_ | gtk still being used in new plaforms like ALP |
| 13:27.03 | zedstar_ | bring on the toolkit wars :) |
| 13:27.04 | k-s | alp? |
| 13:27.23 | zedstar_ | access linux platform |
| 13:27.41 | zedstar_ | allegedly first phone out this summer |
| 13:27.43 | k-s | ah, former palm :-P |
| 13:27.46 | zedstar_ | yeh |
| 13:28.26 | zedstar_ | they spent (or wasted) a lot of money buying that |
| 13:29.55 | zedstar_ | i guess what is kinda cool about not pushing one toolkit is that it will be survival of the fittest determined by end user apps |
| 13:30.29 | k-s | ehehe... |
| 13:30.47 | k-s | just remember some maemo and canola |
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| 13:49.18 | steko | hi |
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| 13:49.50 | steko | http://sharesource.org/pipermail/totalopenstation-dev/2008-May/000000.html |
| 13:50.01 | steko | does someone have suggestions about the above error? |
| 13:52.31 | diego_at_work | I think that python is no compiled with tk support |
| 13:52.38 | diego_at_work | s/no/not/ |
| 13:53.17 | steko | ok, but.. |
| 13:53.18 | mickey|zzZZzz | if you're using Python from OE, then it rather means, you did not install python-tkinter |
| 13:53.21 | diego_at_work | or tk library are not installed |
| 13:53.47 | steko | it sounds more like tk missing |
| 13:53.52 | mickey|zzZZzz | perhaps there are some missing dependencies |
| 13:53.55 | mickey|zzZZzz | please keep me posted |
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| 13:54.04 | steko | because the exception is raised in tkinter |
| 13:54.07 | mickey|zzZZzz | right |
| 13:54.25 | diego_at_work | look in /usr/lib/ |
| 13:54.49 | mickey|zzZZzz | usually _tkinter links against libtk.8.4.so, which means the automatic shared library dependencies should catch it |
| 13:54.59 | steko | ok diego_at_work I'll tell my friend to check.. he's the one who owns the GTA02 |
| 13:55.33 | steko | as a general advice, it would be better to write GUIs using pygtk, right ? |
| 13:55.47 | steko | (I mean for OpenMoko) |
| 13:56.02 | diego_at_work | i write some apps with python + gtk + glade |
| 13:56.48 | steko | I've written some, too. But only for pc/notebook use |
| 13:57.03 | steko | this would be my first app for OM.. :) |
| 13:57.04 | diego_at_work | it's quite the same |
| 13:57.29 | diego_at_work | i wrote them on my pc, and they worked fine on the neo1973 |
| 13:59.35 | diego_at_work | just keep the gui simple ^^ |
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| 14:00.02 | steko | :-) this is not a problem because I would'nt be able to write a complex GUI anyway... |
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| 14:27.15 | stefan_schmidt | hmm, is this one a bad joke? |
| 14:27.17 | stefan_schmidt | Qwell: What sort of warranty does the Freerunner come with? |
| 14:27.17 | stefan_schmidt | apt: Phones with hardware flaws will be repaired or replaced (at our discretion) if the flaw is reported with 14 days for individual phones, and 28 day sfor phones shipped in â10 packsâ. |
| 14:27.18 | apt | that's too long, stefan_schmidt |
| 14:27.26 | stefan_schmidt | thanks apt |
| 14:27.45 | stefan_schmidt | http://rafb.net/p/vF9BO031.html |
| 14:28.47 | stefan_schmidt | It's a quote from here: http://gettingstartedopenmoko.wordpress.com/2007/12/31/faq-frequently-asked-questions/ |
| 14:29.56 | SpeedEvil | sterna: yes, that's not legal for the european distributor to do |
| 14:30.02 | SpeedEvil | dtef: |
| 14:30.14 | SpeedEvil | you. |
| 14:31.08 | *** part/#openmoko BDo (n=bdonnett@linagoraberri.pck.nerim.net) |
| 14:31.43 | rwhitby | RedDog: mokomakefile is not updated yet, but you can test it if you like |
| 14:32.17 | *** join/#openmoko exco (n=excogita@scenicl-69.itm.mw.tum.de) |
| 14:32.36 | stefan_schmidt | SpeedEvil: Well, that for sure. Besides that I find it not funny to have a broken phone after 15 days and have no more warranty. |
| 14:34.58 | bedboi | is the new software (qtopia based) available for GTA01? |
| 14:35.59 | RedDog | rwhitby: why not? |
| 14:36.10 | XorA | bedboi: not officially, but I shortly will do a commit so it at least builds |
| 14:36.11 | methril | takes a lot |
| 14:36.15 | methril | rwhitby |
| 14:36.17 | methril | :D |
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| 14:36.21 | RedDog | rwhitby: where can i find it? |
| 14:36.45 | rwhitby | RedDog: it's not publicly updated yet, cause I haven't had three success stories from the alpha testing. |
| 14:36.49 | bedboi | XorA: i don't need "officially" :) |
| 14:36.59 | bedboi | i just want to give it a try |
| 14:37.11 | rwhitby | RedDog: if you want to alpha test it, I can give you a URL. |
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| 14:41.44 | RedDog | rwhitby: i will test it |
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| 14:48.32 | mokel | is there a chance to get the asu image running with qemu? |
| 14:49.35 | methril | i've to go |
| 14:49.44 | methril | rwhitby report tomorrow |
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| 14:53.10 | jmichel | Maybe a stupid question but what is "ASU" ? |
| 14:53.51 | mokel | http://gettingstartedopenmoko.wordpress.com/2008/05/19/openmoko-software-update/ |
| 14:53.58 | mokel | or planet.openmoko.org |
| 14:54.04 | mokel | there is a link to the image |
| 14:54.17 | mokel | http://downloads.openmoko.org/asu/ |
| 14:54.24 | jmichel | Sorry I know about the new software update but what does "ASU" mean? |
| 14:54.43 | mokel | what it means, no idea |
| 14:55.03 | mokel | i always get "s3c_nand_read: Bad register 0x20" while flashing |
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| 14:55.34 | jmichel | I've seen this wording on the forum everywhere but I can't find what it means |
| 14:55.44 | mokel | :) |
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| 14:56.03 | diego_at_work | April Software Update |
| 14:56.07 | mokel | ah |
| 14:56.20 | jmichel | finally I know :) |
| 14:56.40 | ohin | deja vu |
| 14:56.44 | mokel | i would like to see it in action |
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| 14:59.13 | *** topic/#openmoko by XorA -> No, Freerunner is not out yet. Official updates at http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Community_Updates . | ASU means April Software Update and is coming soon |
| 14:59.35 | mokel | no one got qemu running with gta02? |
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| 15:00.58 | ohin | i thought it is may already :-) |
| 15:02.09 | XorA | April is 11 months away then |
| 15:02.40 | ohin | yeah, so ASU is announced 11 months earlier :-) |
| 15:02.59 | *** join/#openmoko CVirus (n=GoD@62.135.96.15) |
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| 15:06.51 | winux__ | hi, i wanna install my uImage and rootfs into sd card ,and boot from sd card ,how could i set the boot menu ? |
| 15:07.24 | *** join/#openmoko geaaru (n=geaaru@host21-218-dynamic.40-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 15:07.38 | diego_at_work | look on the wiki |
| 15:10.11 | d3vice | mokel: i did |
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| 15:10.36 | d3vice | mokel: it was easier than i thought, 10 mins and I had a qemu image running |
| 15:10.48 | mokel | d3vice: what did you do that it works? i always get "s3c_nand_read: Bad register 0x20" |
| 15:10.59 | d3vice | i just followed the wiki |
| 15:11.09 | d3vice | using fedora 9 |
| 15:11.20 | d3vice | let me get the wiki0s url |
| 15:12.35 | d3vice | mokel: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/OpenMoko_under_QEMU |
| 15:12.55 | d3vice | mokel: start with svn checkout ... |
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| 15:13.15 | mokel | qemu works |
| 15:13.27 | Bish | freerunner, möp möp |
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| 15:13.56 | mokel | i did it like in manual setup |
| 15:14.57 | mokel | then i replaced the .jffs, uboot and uimage |
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| 15:15.04 | d3vice | err... i just read your phrase with my glasses on, i'm refering to gta01 qemu image, although in that wiki page it says how to run gta02 but haven't tried it |
| 15:15.15 | mokel | ok |
| 15:16.40 | winux__ | diego_at_work,is this sentense "setenv menu_4 Boot from SD: setenv bootargs root=/dev/mmcblk0p1 rootdelay=5 console=ttySAC0,115200 console=tty0 \${mtdparts}\; mmcinit\; ext2load mmc 0 0x32000000 /boot/\${sd_image_name}\; bootm 0x32000000 |
| 15:16.40 | winux__ | " right to boot openmoko from sd card ,but i failed, |
| 15:17.44 | winux__ | my neo get reboot at the moment i select "boot from sd" entry |
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| 15:20.23 | diego_at_work | winux__ on my neo1973 works fine |
| 15:20.36 | diego_at_work | have you installed kernel and root image correctly? |
| 15:20.55 | winux__ | i think it's correct |
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| 15:21.16 | winux__ | is your sd card file system ext2 or ext3 ? |
| 15:21.44 | diego_at_work | ext2, if i remember well |
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| 15:24.06 | winux__ | my neo can not boot directly when press the power button,it stop at the splash all the time , the only way to boot my neo is press aux and power button at the same time and get into the boot menu ,and select the "boot" entry to boot |
| 15:24.37 | winux__ | what's the matter ? |
| 15:25.07 | diego_at_work | dunno. have you upgraded or modified uboot? |
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| 15:25.41 | diego_at_work | (going home) |
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| 15:26.58 | XorA | winux__: sounds like you have an old old uboot |
| 15:27.46 | winux__ | XorA,my uboot version is 1.3.0 rc11.2.0 |
| 15:27.59 | *** part/#openmoko mokel (n=hole@p5487E0D3.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 15:28.08 | XorA | winux__: sounds old |
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| 15:29.39 | winux__ | do you think the sentense "setenv menu_4 Boot from SD: setenv bootargs root=/dev/mmcblk0p1 rootdelay=5 console=ttySAC0,115200 console=tty0 \${mtdparts}\; mmcinit\; ext2load mmc 0 0x32000000 /boot/\${sd_image_name}\; bootm 0x32000000" right to boot from sd card ? |
| 15:30.19 | XorA | winux__: looks right from quick glance |
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| 15:44.47 | CIA-43 | openmoko: 03zecke * ra229e71c759d 10/pixmaps/ (42 files in 42 dirs): Revert "Make white transparent in the icons." |
| 15:44.48 | CIA-43 | openmoko: 03zecke * r42a0439d9bad 10/ (175 files in 45 dirs): Changing of icons. Provide two copies, classic Icons and Screenshots. Update the desktop files |
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| 15:53.03 | winux__ | XorA,i update my uboot ,and select "boot from sd ",but also failed |
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| 15:54.44 | mmontour | winux__: Do you have a debug board? |
| 15:54.55 | winux__ | no |
| 15:55.51 | mmontour | I have a u-boot package that works for boot-from-SD. You can try it if you want (1 other person has tested it successfully) but without a debug board there is a small chance of bricking your device. |
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| 15:57.01 | mmontour | Link is http://members.shaw.ca/mmontour/neo/u-boot-gta01bv4-1.3.3+svnr4297-r0.bin |
| 15:58.05 | mmontour | rwhitby: I'd like to test the new MokoMakefile |
| 15:58.56 | winux__ | mmontour,the error message is "bad magc number,unable to boot from sd" |
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| 16:04.30 | mmontour | winux__: you can try entering the commands one at a time from the u-boot console (e.g. "screen /dev/ttyACM0") to see which one is causing the problem. If it's an old u-boot the "mmcinit" will work but the "ext2load" will fail. |
| 16:06.09 | winux__ | what's the full ext2load command ? |
| 16:07.22 | winux__ | mmontour,what's job does mmcinit do ? |
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| 16:08.05 | mmontour | As shown in the menu entry you posted above, e.g. "ext2load mmc 0 0x32000000 /boot/uImage". You can also try "ext2ls mmc 0" |
| 16:08.33 | mmontour | mmcinit causes u-boot to detect the SD card |
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| 16:09.20 | Sup3rkiddo | NOTE: Handling BitBake files: | (3010/5404) [55 %]Error validating server certificate for 'https://svn.projects.openmoko.org:443':, anyone getting this lately? asking me to validate the certificate manually and barfs at etk-theme-ninja.bb..... |
| 16:09.57 | XorA | Sup3rkiddo: do an svn co outside of bitbake and accept the certificate permanently |
| 16:10.13 | Sup3rkiddo | okie dokie |
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| 16:12.39 | winux__ | it said "bad partition 1" when runing "ext2load mmc 0 0x32000000 /boot/uImage" |
| 16:12.44 | winux__ | mmontour |
| 16:13.16 | winux__ | mmontour,my neo reboot after run "ext2ls mmc 0" |
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| 16:14.17 | zeno | how amny freerunners will be shipped first run? |
| 16:14.36 | winux__ | the above is not corrent , it also said "bad partition -mmc 0:1" when runing "ext2ls mmc 0" |
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| 16:17.06 | mmontour | !ombug 799 |
| 16:17.07 | cdbot2 | * * Bug 799, Status: NEW, Created: Unknown |
| 16:17.08 | cdbot2 | * * obri(AT)chaostreff.ch: data abort while reading from SD Cards |
| 16:17.09 | cdbot2 | * * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=799 |
| 16:18.06 | mmontour | winux__: that's the bug that causes stack corruption, reboots, etc. after an ext2load or ext2ls command. |
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| 16:18.52 | winux__ | mmontour,so what can i do ? |
| 16:19.36 | mmontour | Try the u-boot version that I posted previously, or try to find the one that mickeyl released around the end of January this year (I no longer have a working link for that one) |
| 16:20.23 | *** join/#openmoko summatusmentis (n=summatus@198.36.194.3) |
| 16:21.29 | ebbe | winux__: Or find one here http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Snapshot_review |
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| 16:27.42 | winux__ | mmontour, could send me your u-boot? |
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| 16:32.39 | winux__ | mmontour,my email is shuiguomayi@gmail.com |
| 16:37.13 | DPThuugh1 | im getting slightly disturbed. Will the current UI be really replace by something completely new? |
| 16:37.21 | *** join/#openmoko tedo (n=cta@HSI-KBW-091-089-000-022.hsi2.kabelbw.de) |
| 16:37.36 | DPThuugh1 | I mean now. when it all started to work rather well... |
| 16:40.36 | ScaredyCat | hit will be replaced with cheese. |
| 16:40.43 | ScaredyCat | s/hit/it/ |
| 16:40.51 | *** part/#openmoko Tuju (n=tuju@50.157.190.90.sta.estpak.ee) |
| 16:40.51 | DPThuugh1 | jummy |
| 16:41.06 | DPThuugh1 | gtk cheese? *g* |
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| 17:34.52 | ScaredyCat | wonders what will happen to all the gta01's ... |
| 17:35.04 | ScaredyCat | does ASU work on an 01? |
| 17:35.15 | ScaredyCat | with e |
| 17:35.44 | *** join/#openmoko krau (n=cktakaha@200.184.118.132) |
| 17:37.12 | zash | no, only d |
| 17:37.21 | raboof | ScaredyCat: you build custom firmware images for the moko, right? |
| 17:37.28 | ScaredyCat | aye |
| 17:37.35 | ScaredyCat | ~lart zash |
| 17:37.35 | apt | throws a AN/M-8 smoke grenade at zash |
| 17:37.49 | raboof | are you posting patches upstream? |
| 17:38.10 | ScaredyCat | wel, no... |
| 17:38.20 | ScaredyCat | the stuff I add is in projects though |
| 17:39.01 | raboof | not because you don't want to or not because upstream isn't interested in contributions? |
| 17:39.34 | *** join/#openmoko _Fluffy (n=chatzill@82.96.63.58) |
| 17:39.35 | ScaredyCat | I guess right now they aren't so relavant.. |
| 17:39.57 | raboof | ok, good reason :) |
| 17:40.13 | raboof | just wondered how receptive OM is to contributions from outside the core devs |
| 17:40.24 | *** join/#openmoko nibbo_ (i=nibbo@gateway/shell/blinkenshell.org/x-38ceef57adfea1fb) |
| 17:40.32 | ScaredyCat | ... they are relavnat to me ... I only have an 01 ..:) |
| 17:40.42 | ScaredyCat | they'er pretty good... |
| 17:40.57 | ScaredyCat | you can post patches to the dev mailing list and bugzilla |
| 17:41.26 | ScaredyCat | you might have to whine and bitch a little... |
| 17:41.26 | abraxa__ | ScaredyCat: Is today the day of the dotdotdots? |
| 17:41.37 | ScaredyCat | ...possibly... |
| 17:41.39 | ScaredyCat | :P |
| 17:41.53 | abraxa__ | Apparently... |
| 17:42.04 | ScaredyCat | indeed it seems so.... |
| 17:42.13 | raboof | aye .: |
| 17:42.25 | ScaredyCat | has anyone posted a vid of the asu ? |
| 17:42.40 | abraxa__ | Not enough people with freerunners, it seems |
| 17:43.15 | ScaredyCat | lazy ass mofos |
| 17:43.24 | abraxa__ | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Userspace_root_image#Converting_a_GTA02_image_for_GTA01 |
| 17:43.28 | ScaredyCat | it seems like eveyone has one atm |
| 17:43.32 | Sup3rkiddo | anyone called me? |
| 17:43.42 | abraxa__ | I wonder if that works but I'm too lazy to build the modules needed |
| 17:43.46 | ScaredyCat | it was raster |
| 17:43.48 | ScaredyCat | :P |
| 17:44.36 | Sup3rkiddo | abraxa__, y0 |
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| 17:44.46 | abraxa__ | Ahoy Sup3rkiddo |
| 17:44.49 | ScaredyCat | why not put it on the sd card |
| 17:44.53 | Sup3rkiddo | ScaredyCat, y0 to yoo too |
| 17:44.55 | ScaredyCat | boot from that? |
| 17:45.05 | ScaredyCat | lo Sup3rkiddo |
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| 17:46.12 | *** part/#openmoko V0lle (n=volle@p5481CCC8.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 17:50.34 | mmontour | libtool-native seems to be broken - | configure: error: source directory already configured; run "make distclean" there first (in do_compile) |
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| 17:53.10 | ScaredyCat | built ok here... |
| 17:53.21 | raboof | many of you probably know it allready, but http://benno.id.au/blog/2007/11/21/android-neo1973 is a cool read |
| 17:53.42 | ScaredyCat | cd build && . ../setup-env && bitbake -c rebuild libtoo-native |
| 17:53.59 | ScaredyCat | he gave up though right? |
| 17:54.15 | raboof | afaik yeah |
| 17:54.32 | mmontour | hmm, OK I'll take a closer look at my local setup. I'm using autorev and the 'mtn' repository (not the newly-announced git one) |
| 17:55.51 | raboof | the main problem, afaics, is that some part of android is only distributed as an ARMv5 binary, because of which we can't compile it for the openmoko (ARMv4) hardware |
| 17:56.01 | ScaredyCat | yes... |
| 17:56.20 | ScaredyCat | basically Google don't know what opensource actually means |
| 17:56.24 | raboof | i wonder if android's really that closed or there are other issues |
| 17:56.33 | ScaredyCat | it is |
| 17:56.45 | ScaredyCat | I've biatched about it enough... |
| 17:56.50 | raboof | sucks. disqualifies android in my book now ;) |
| 17:56.59 | ScaredyCat | yes...mine too... |
| 17:57.29 | raboof | esp. because all the buzz is that it's all Apache License Open Source (i can live with non-'Free Software') |
| 17:57.34 | *** join/#openmoko geaaru (n=geaaru@host21-218-dynamic.40-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 17:57.43 | ScaredyCat | until they actually release the whole thing as oss they can go jump in a river |
| 17:57.51 | raboof | +1 |
| 17:57.55 | ccfly | .. of lava ! |
| 17:58.04 | ScaredyCat | and anchovies |
| 17:58.18 | raboof | now that's mean. |
| 17:58.38 | ccfly | now anchoview is over the line |
| 17:58.40 | ccfly | s |
| 18:03.02 | zedstar_ | unfortunately the unwashed masses believe whatever google says and dont like their fluffy image questioned ! |
| 18:03.16 | *** join/#openmoko dtony (n=tony@2a01:e35:2f07:1ea0:219:dbff:fe4a:23f9) |
| 18:03.34 | dtony | hello |
| 18:03.58 | zedstar_ | if they release a mobile which is a turd on a stick people gonna buy it |
| 18:04.27 | ScaredyCat | turd-stick-o-phone |
| 18:04.31 | zedstar_ | or if hardware vendors release it rather |
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| 18:05.30 | dtony | I would like to know one thing : would it be possible to make opengl application on freerunner? |
| 18:09.08 | ScaredyCat | no |
| 18:09.32 | ScaredyCat | well, probably techniclly possible.. |
| 18:09.40 | ScaredyCat | but the glamo is under NDA |
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| 18:10.08 | dtony | sad :( |
| 18:12.40 | raboof | the openmoko guys who are under NDA supposedly are allowed to write some docs though |
| 18:13.01 | raboof | not sure if that'd include the opengl capabilities of the thing though |
| 18:13.06 | mmontour | libtool-native works now. Turns out that it was because I had symlinked 'build/tmp/work' to another partition with more free space; with 'work' as a regular dir it builds OK. |
| 18:13.11 | raboof | and it's quite a step from docs to implementation of course :) |
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| 18:13.54 | raboof | http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/community/2007-September/010175.html |
| 18:19.33 | dtony | so it is possible that we have an opengl driver in the future |
| 18:20.52 | mmontour | dtony: You can expect an opengl driver to come bundled with the Duke Nukem Forever port :) |
| 18:21.08 | dtony | :D |
| 18:21.50 | dtony | what I'm dreaming is a port of neverball with the accelerometers :p |
| 18:23.38 | spydon | hehe that would be awesum ^^ |
| 18:24.00 | CIA-43 | openmoko: 03thomas * r4443 10/trunk/src/target/opkg/ (14 files in 2 dirs): opkg: (leak fixing, day 2) lots and lots of memory leaks fixed |
| 18:26.39 | SpeedEvil | raboof: it's been stated that that will not be happening - the rewriting of the docs |
| 18:26.54 | SpeedEvil | raboof: nor will 3D acceleration. |
| 18:28.16 | raboof | SpeedEvil: ow - http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/GTA02_Openness should be updated then |
| 18:30.18 | ebbe | So was there any reason then to have a chip that could handle 3d graphics? |
| 18:30.21 | *** join/#openmoko tubastian (n=tubastia@pD954485C.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 18:30.45 | SpeedEvil | Yes - at the time. |
| 18:30.52 | SpeedEvil | The limitations were not well understood. |
| 18:31.07 | ebbe | Makes sense then |
| 18:32.31 | *** join/#openmoko bmk789 (n=bmk789@c-98-223-16-230.hsd1.in.comcast.net) |
| 18:33.44 | raboof | SpeedEvil: happen to have a link saying the 3d accell docs won't be written? |
| 18:35.20 | SpeedEvil | No - however it'll be in the logs of this channel |
| 18:35.30 | Qwell | ~logs |
| 18:35.30 | apt | it has been said that logs is apt/ibot/infobot/jbot/purl all log daily to http://ibot.rikers.org/<channelname>/ where channelname is html encoded ie: %23debian | lines that start with a space are not shown | some channels have stats at http://ibot.rikers.org/stats/<channelname>.html.gz |
| 18:35.38 | SpeedEvil | Raster has said this several times. |
| 18:35.41 | raboof | thanks |
| 18:36.31 | SpeedEvil | (who is the one writing the 2d driver) |
| 18:36.46 | raboof | yeah, i'm somewhat up to speed, but thanks for mentioning |
| 18:37.25 | SpeedEvil | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/GTA02_Openness |
| 18:37.28 | SpeedEvil | updated somewhat |
| 18:37.42 | ScaredyCat | !logs |
| 18:37.43 | cdbot2 | Channel logs for #openmoko are archived at: |
| 18:37.44 | cdbot2 | http://hentges.net/tmp/logs/irc/%23openmoko |
| 18:37.45 | cdbot2 | Live-logs are available at |
| 18:37.47 | cdbot2 | http://hentges.net/tmp/logs/irc/livelogs/%23openmoko.livelog |
| 18:37.49 | cdbot2 | See ?? help-logs for usage instructions |
| 18:38.48 | raboof | SpeedEvil: nice, i'll try and dig up a reference to the chatlog |
| 18:38.59 | retracile | SpeedEvil: thanks for updating that. Is the 2D work GPL though? |
| 18:39.14 | SpeedEvil | search on raster.*rewrite |
| 18:39.26 | SpeedEvil | retracile: yes - it results in a GPL driver patch for the kenrel |
| 18:40.49 | retracile | SpeedEvil: glad to hear that. thakns |
| 18:41.21 | CM | qtopia-phone-x11-4.3.1-r13 fails to build for me... Anyone else having the same problem? |
| 18:41.26 | dtony | oe :p |
| 18:42.05 | *** join/#openmoko MoR4euZ (n=mor4euz@port-87-234-145-233.dynamic.qsc.de) |
| 18:43.50 | ScaredyCat | fears the kenrel |
| 18:44.54 | *** join/#openmoko woglinde (i=woglinde@e178078253.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 18:48.54 | *** join/#openmoko mjr (n=mjr@myntti.helsinki.fi) |
| 18:49.33 | *** join/#openmoko playya (n=playya@p57B29C4F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 18:49.51 | mjr | thhiis terminbl is horrible, by the way |
| 18:51.42 | mjr | vuut even more horrible is the multitap keyboard rules being aqlied to a bt pad |
| 18:52.53 | ScaredyCat | wok ewe taking a boat |
| 18:53.51 | *** join/#openmoko playya_ (n=playya@p57B29B6F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 18:54.44 | raboof | mjr: you're connected though openmoko? :) |
| 18:55.34 | mjr | however, bus ircig is still b limited success |
| 18:55.44 | *** join/#openmoko ericthefish (n=ivan@82-71-36-214.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk) |
| 18:56.16 | mjr | yes |
| 18:56.36 | mjr | I would be more legible otherwise ;) |
| 18:57.53 | mjr | the ccombination of the input crap and the terminal crap makes it hard to correct oneself |
| 18:58.12 | *** join/#openmoko geaaru_ (n=geaaru@host185-168-dynamic.11-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 18:58.22 | ScaredyCat | install pidgin |
| 18:58.23 | mjr | ad the pad is not perfect either |
| 18:58.48 | mjr | maybe |
| 18:59.10 | mjr | this seems to especially miss ns |
| 18:59.10 | *** join/#openmoko Ryback_ (n=ulisses@enlightenment/developer/ryback) |
| 18:59.40 | raboof | wow, had to read that one a couple of times ;) |
| 19:01.18 | Qwell | ScaredyCat: have you heard of anybody porting pidgin to openmoko yet? |
| 19:01.29 | ScaredyCat | porting? |
| 19:01.33 | Qwell | "porting" |
| 19:01.39 | ScaredyCat | it's in my repo... |
| 19:01.50 | Qwell | work pretty well? |
| 19:02.08 | ScaredyCat | works ok... screen is a little small / cluttered |
| 19:02.14 | Qwell | no comment. |
| 19:02.23 | SpeedEvil | I think it should work better rotated, with the tabs along the right |
| 19:02.30 | Qwell | actually, I will comment :p |
| 19:02.34 | SpeedEvil | Assuming BT keyboard |
| 19:02.46 | Qwell | It's not small/cluttered because it's running on a phone. It's because the design sucks :p |
| 19:02.49 | SpeedEvil | neglecting tap issues |
| 19:02.57 | ScaredyCat | yes, but then that fsdking multipap appears |
| 19:03.26 | ScaredyCat | Qwell: well, not really... there's bugger all screen real estate with the multicrap |
| 19:03.32 | ScaredyCat | on a pc it seems ok |
| 19:03.43 | ScaredyCat | although, i don;t actually use t |
| 19:03.53 | Qwell | I switched to funpidgin. |
| 19:04.02 | ScaredyCat | i just build stuff |
| 19:04.06 | *** join/#openmoko pidginevil (n=root@mauve.plus.com) |
| 19:04.10 | pidginevil | /win new |
| 19:04.13 | pidginevil | sigh |
| 19:04.14 | ScaredyCat | wtf is fun pifginh |
| 19:04.21 | ScaredyCat | slaps SpeedEvil |
| 19:04.29 | Qwell | ScaredyCat: pidgin with crappy design "features" reverted. |
| 19:04.34 | ScaredyCat | ahh |
| 19:04.39 | ScaredyCat | pre-pidgin |
| 19:04.44 | Qwell | post-pidgin |
| 19:05.05 | ScaredyCat | if it's post, how can they be reverted? |
| 19:05.17 | Qwell | it's a fork. certain commits have been reverted in the fork |
| 19:06.42 | Qwell | SpeedEvil: feel like making screenshots? :) |
| 19:06.43 | ScaredyCat | /cheese |
| 19:06.52 | SpeedEvil | few seconds |
| 19:06.56 | ScaredyCat | yeah, why are there non on the website |
| 19:06.58 | SpeedEvil | working out how to get it best sorted |
| 19:07.04 | Qwell | sweet |
| 19:07.10 | SpeedEvil | this is not on om |
| 19:07.14 | SpeedEvil | it's on my desktop |
| 19:07.21 | ScaredyCat | funpidgin shmunpidgin |
| 19:08.01 | *** join/#openmoko Tanu_ (n=tanuva@e177115218.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 19:08.20 | *** part/#openmoko pidginevil (n=root@mauve.plus.com) |
| 19:08.22 | *** join/#openmoko pidginevil (n=root@mauve.plus.com) |
| 19:08.35 | zedstar_ | eeeek the eurovision song contest is on |
| 19:08.40 | ScaredyCat | yay |
| 19:09.01 | ScaredyCat | are you sure? |
| 19:09.06 | tedo | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:09.12 | ScaredyCat | or do you mean a local one? |
| 19:09.26 | zedstar_ | well if it not then im having a bad trip |
| 19:09.30 | ScaredyCat | likes it. |
| 19:09.34 | zedstar_ | bbc 3 now |
| 19:09.42 | ScaredyCat | it;s usually on a saturday |
| 19:09.48 | zedstar_ | yeh it will |
| 19:09.53 | zedstar_ | this is the semi finals :) |
| 19:09.58 | ScaredyCat | ahh.. uk |
| 19:10.03 | ScaredyCat | the songs are shit |
| 19:10.08 | zedstar_ | yeh |
| 19:10.12 | ScaredyCat | they need to be bouncy bouncy |
| 19:10.26 | zedstar_ | yeh need to camp it up |
| 19:10.31 | ScaredyCat | yeah... |
| 19:10.52 | ScaredyCat | there were 2 really good ones last time |
| 19:10.57 | SpeedEvil | http://www.mauve.plus.com/pidgin.png |
| 19:10.57 | ScaredyCat | I liked the french one too |
| 19:11.11 | ScaredyCat | pidgin or funpidgin? |
| 19:11.12 | zedstar_ | some good outfits also! |
| 19:11.27 | SpeedEvil | This is stock pidgin - with the tabs on the right, and an alias set for #openmoko to reduce the width of the channelnamebar |
| 19:11.46 | SpeedEvil | pidgin 2.0.2 |
| 19:11.50 | ScaredyCat | pft |
| 19:11.55 | ScaredyCat | funpidgin |
| 19:12.20 | ScaredyCat | dl pdgin from my repo |
| 19:13.16 | ScaredyCat | what's an 'infinity edge' ? |
| 19:13.34 | SpeedEvil | notes ScaredyCat watches garden porn. |
| 19:13.58 | ScaredyCat | hehe |
| 19:14.03 | *** join/#openmoko playya_ (n=playya@p57B29993.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 19:14.08 | *** join/#openmoko Marex (n=marex@vasut.kolej.mff.cuni.cz) |
| 19:14.18 | SpeedEvil | I'mm going with http://www2.victoriassecret.com/collection/?cgname=OSBRPVERVIL&cgnbr=OSBRPVERVIL&rfnbr=1096 |
| 19:14.25 | SpeedEvil | As that was the first hit on google |
| 19:14.53 | zedstar_ | u cross dressing again? |
| 19:15.00 | ScaredyCat | and it's a tm too |
| 19:15.06 | SpeedEvil | The "infinity edge" is one of today's most coveted and visually fantastic pool features offered by California pool designers. Infinity edge pools are so named because one side of the pool is even with the water level in the pool. This feature is also called a "negative edge". Water is pumped back into the pool after it cascades over the edge and is held in a catch basin. You will be awestruck when you see that your pool appears to be "floating" a |
| 19:15.25 | SpeedEvil | Or not. |
| 19:16.27 | CIA-43 | freesmartphone.org: 03jluebbe * r6008dba3870a 10/oeventd/ (4 files in 2 dirs): Create basic classes |
| 19:16.50 | *** join/#openmoko playya__ (n=playya@p57B29AC5.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 19:17.27 | ScaredyCat | did XorA|gone get his merge done ? |
| 19:21.42 | *** join/#openmoko cekay (n=cekay@xdsl-87-79-218-21.netcologne.de) |
| 19:23.45 | *** part/#openmoko tedo (n=cta@HSI-KBW-091-089-000-022.hsi2.kabelbw.de) |
| 19:25.50 | *** join/#openmoko [sol] (n=jarek@asy168.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl) |
| 19:28.41 | *** join/#openmoko alexxy (n=alexxy@79.173.81.171) |
| 19:36.05 | *** join/#openmoko playya_ (n=playya@p57B299C3.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 19:39.58 | *** join/#openmoko cody (n=kvirc@63.78.162.2) |
| 19:42.34 | *** join/#openmoko LetoTo (n=paul@bofh.xelerance.com) |
| 19:43.51 | *** join/#openmoko hobitti (n=hobitti@a91-153-178-164.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 19:44.59 | pidginevil | waves. |
| 19:45.02 | *** part/#openmoko pidginevil (n=root@mauve.plus.com) |
| 19:45.45 | *** join/#openmoko dougt (n=dougt@c-67-180-89-151.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 19:54.28 | *** join/#openmoko summatusmentis_ (n=summatus@70.158.103.10) |
| 19:55.36 | *** join/#openmoko playya__ (n=playya@p57B28851.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 19:56.18 | *** join/#openmoko summatusmentis (n=summatus@70.158.103.10) |
| 19:59.54 | XorA|gone | ScaredyCat: nope, still working on cool features |
| 20:00.10 | ScaredyCat | huh? |
| 20:00.30 | ScaredyCat | you fixing the hash is what I meant.... |
| 20:00.55 | ScaredyCat | I presume you did since I've got the linux-openmoko git co |
| 20:00.56 | XorA|gone | ScaredyCat: yeah, but its stuck in the middle of work I am doing |
| 20:01.04 | *** join/#openmoko ericthefish (n=ivan@82-71-36-214.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk) |
| 20:01.30 | ScaredyCat | :/ |
| 20:01.53 | *** join/#openmoko peepsalot (n=peepsalo@bwext.kpimdp.com) |
| 20:01.56 | ScaredyCat | NOTE: package linux-openmoko-2_2.6.24+git0+e93ec75e2a9c85e5a92af9e1b754fa711bd864b6-r0: task do_compile: started |
| 20:02.27 | *** join/#openmoko Placid (n=placid@unaffiliated/placid) |
| 20:02.34 | XorA|gone | ScaredyCat: got autorev active? |
| 20:03.04 | ScaredyCat | no |
| 20:03.08 | ScaredyCat | sane |
| 20:05.15 | *** join/#openmoko LetoTo (n=paul@bofh.xelerance.com) |
| 20:05.28 | XorA|gone | maybe someone beat me |
| 20:05.43 | ScaredyCat | seems to be happily compiling |
| 20:06.16 | XorA|gone | quit moaning then :-D |
| 20:07.21 | CIA-43 | freesmartphone.org: 03jluebbe * rfe9cc7c7645c 10/src/zhone: Work around invisible character bug |
| 20:08.15 | SpeedEvil | That damn invisible woman! |
| 20:08.16 | abraxa__ | balrog-kun: Are you around? |
| 20:08.22 | balrog-kun | abraxa__: yes |
| 20:08.47 | ScaredyCat | I wasn't moaning biatch |
| 20:10.29 | raboof | interesting: it seems to continue to participate in this android developer challenge, projects must endorse an NDA which seemingly prevents them from releaseing their code under a free license |
| 20:10.35 | raboof | that might make for a nice riot.. |
| 20:10.45 | abraxa__ | balrog-kun: Some guy would like to try GTA02 emulation in QEmu but can't quite figure out how to create a kernel with gta02fake support. Can you supply him with such a kernel by chance? |
| 20:12.51 | *** join/#openmoko playya_ (n=playya@p57B296D4.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 20:14.07 | balrog-kun | abraxa__: i can't find any ready to use zImage right now |
| 20:14.18 | balrog-kun | abraxa__: it's just a matter of taking the openmoko kernel and applying a tiny patch though |
| 20:14.54 | *** join/#openmoko baze_ (n=baze@e179057101.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 20:15.21 | balrog-kun | abraxa__: and the only actual difference for the userspace is that /proc/cpuinfo report Hardware: GTA02 instead of 01 |
| 20:15.28 | balrog-kun | reports |
| 20:15.39 | abraxa__ | balrog-kun: Ahh okay, thanks |
| 20:17.17 | abraxa__ | balrog-kun: He's a little confused about the locations of the partitions in flash as they seem to be different for GTA02. Is there anything he needs to change there or can he use the GTA01 values? |
| 20:18.44 | balrog-kun | abraxa__: well, he can use the GTA01 values as long as the rootfs fits in the rootfs partition |
| 20:18.54 | abraxa__ | Groovy, thanks |
| 20:19.29 | balrog-kun | (gta02fake actually adds virtual acceleromaters, gps and SDIO, but the rootfs can't take advantage of that, yet) |
| 20:19.39 | balrog-kun | or at least it couldn't last time i tried |
| 20:19.41 | abraxa__ | *nods* |
| 20:20.12 | abraxa__ | During flashing he gets " s3c_nand_read: Bad register 0x20", though I do wonder if that's even critical or not |
| 20:20.33 | balrog-kun | abraxa__: umm, lemme check |
| 20:23.59 | balrog-kun | abraxa__: i don't get this during flashing, only when booting |
| 20:24.14 | balrog-kun | but my u-boot is quite old |
| 20:29.14 | *** join/#openmoko smancke (n=smancke@ip-62-143-122-209.hsi.ish.de) |
| 20:34.44 | *** join/#openmoko Gybrush (n=Gybrush@f053155092.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 20:34.46 | abraxa__ | balrog-kun: Thanks for checking :) |
| 20:35.27 | abraxa__ | balrog-kun: And I forgot - can you boot despite that error? |
| 20:38.30 | SpeedEvil | We need a more widespread testerbase. http://youtube.com/watch?v=Rh8gfIcjQNY |
| 20:39.56 | balrog-kun | abraxa__: yes, i get some more errors too |
| 20:40.26 | balrog-kun | abraxa__: they're things that are theoretically illegal for the kernel to do but the real hardware ignores them so nobody cares to fix |
| 20:40.26 | *** join/#openmoko cyrilRomain (n=cyrilRom@AToulouse-157-1-130-144.w86-221.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 20:40.39 | *** join/#openmoko emonkey (n=emonkey@ubuntu/member/emonkey) |
| 20:41.47 | *** join/#openmoko malik1972 (n=malik197@e182056244.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 20:43.06 | abraxa__ | balrog-kun: Ah okay, thanks |
| 20:52.20 | *** part/#openmoko pvborza (n=paul@79.119.155.124) |
| 20:52.53 | summatusmentis | how big is the openmoko rootfs? |
| 20:53.59 | *** part/#openmoko malik1972 (n=malik197@e182056244.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 20:55.06 | *** join/#openmoko gopi (n=gopi@adsl-69-232-195-12.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net) |
| 20:57.20 | ScaredyCat | <-------------------this-big------------------------------> <---- not to scale |
| 20:58.10 | *** join/#openmoko ruoso (n=ruoso@a81-84-27-88.cpe.netcabo.pt) |
| 20:58.44 | summatusmentis | ScaredyCat: thanks :) |
| 20:59.03 | ccfly | is that in monospace or variable font ? |
| 20:59.16 | *** join/#openmoko roterguru (n=chatzill@p5B161CA0.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 20:59.56 | ScaredyCat | it's not to scale, it doesn;t matter |
| 21:00.33 | ccfly | i was hoping i could shirnk the rootfs, but it seems there's no hope |
| 21:00.50 | summatusmentis | but seriously, probably too large for a collie, for instance? |
| 21:00.55 | ccfly | but seriously how much crud are we looking at |
| 21:01.30 | ScaredyCat | <---this-much----> <---not to scale |
| 21:02.11 | *** join/#openmoko krau (n=cktakaha@200.184.118.132) |
| 21:05.39 | *** join/#openmoko ahven (n=kala@194.126.113.140) |
| 21:06.07 | *** join/#openmoko bmk789_ (n=bmk789@c-98-223-16-230.hsd1.in.comcast.net) |
| 21:06.27 | summatusmentis | ScaredyCat: you're always so helpful :) |
| 21:07.05 | ccfly | and exact :) |
| 21:07.19 | ccfly | well no matter have a good night of hacking |
| 21:07.29 | *** part/#openmoko ccfly (n=ccfly@89.212.76.77) |
| 21:07.46 | *** join/#openmoko daMaestro (n=jon@fedora/damaestro) |
| 21:08.09 | roterguru | hi |
| 21:10.27 | roterguru | will freerunner be sold in germany and will it work with German cards and networs? |
| 21:11.28 | *** join/#openmoko Marex (n=marex@vasut.kolej.mff.cuni.cz) |
| 21:11.43 | *** join/#openmoko ajbrun (n=ajbrun@host81-159-127-19.range81-159.btcentralplus.com) |
| 21:11.53 | josch | roterguru, y0 |
| 21:11.56 | *** part/#openmoko Tob1 (n=tobi@pD9E84F83.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 21:12.10 | josch | roterguru, http://trisoft.de/openmoko.htm |
| 21:12.22 | balrog-kun | roterguru: yes, it will |
| 21:12.22 | raboof | roterguru: apparently trisoft.de and pulstar.de will be distributors for Europe |
| 21:12.37 | raboof | at least, that's what http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ says |
| 21:12.38 | josch | roterguru, http://www.pulster.de/openmoko.htm |
| 21:12.49 | josch | y0 |
| 21:12.56 | roterguru | cool. great project *thumbs up* |
| 21:14.31 | rwhitby | ScaredyCat: did the new git-based MokoMakefile work for you? |
| 21:14.47 | ScaredyCat | still compiling, but seems to be ok |
| 21:15.40 | *** join/#openmoko TimRiker (n=timr@68-27-134-112.area1.spcsdns.net) |
| 21:19.19 | *** join/#openmoko peepsalot (n=peepsalo@bwext.kpimdp.com) |
| 21:21.09 | rwhitby | mickeyl: Is there a CIA project which I can get the RSS feed for git.openmoko.org commits? |
| 21:22.59 | ScaredyCat | ooooh.... |
| 21:23.10 | ScaredyCat | notes libsidplay getting compiled |
| 21:23.22 | mickeyl | rwhitby: openmoko |
| 21:24.16 | rwhitby | mickeyl: I see svn and monotone commits there, but no git commits |
| 21:24.27 | rwhitby | (and I know there were git commits overnight) |
| 21:24.58 | rwhitby | (I already have that CIA project in my rss feed browser) |
| 21:25.05 | mickeyl | <CIA-43> openmoko: zecke * ra229e71c759d /pixmaps/ (42 files in 42 dirs): Revert "Make white transparent in the icons." |
| 21:25.05 | mickeyl | <CIA-43> openmoko: zecke * r42a0439d9bad / (175 files in 45 dirs): Changing of icons. Provide two copies, classic Icons and Screenshots. Update the desktop files |
| 21:25.09 | mickeyl | they seem to land here |
| 21:25.28 | rwhitby | those were svn and monotone ones, not git commits |
| 21:25.42 | ferric | waves to rwhitby |
| 21:25.44 | mickeyl | oh |
| 21:25.45 | mickeyl | no idea then |
| 21:25.50 | mickeyl | git used to be reported |
| 21:25.56 | mickeyl | please check with roh or Gismo_C |
| 21:26.01 | rwhitby | mickeyl: thx |
| 21:26.04 | *** join/#openmoko MoR4euZ (n=mor4euz@port-87-234-145-233.dynamic.qsc.de) |
| 21:26.09 | rwhitby | waves back to ferric |
| 21:26.29 | rwhitby | Anyone else want to alpha test the new git-based MokoMakefile? |
| 21:26.41 | mmontour | rwhitby: me |
| 21:26.53 | rwhitby | I only have one success story from ScaredyCat so far - I need three to publish it. |
| 21:27.28 | rwhitby | mmontour: /msg'd you the URL |
| 21:27.33 | *** join/#openmoko fgau (n=fgau@pD95397F0.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 21:28.22 | *** join/#openmoko christooss (n=matic@89-212-127-244.dynamic.dsl.t-2.net) |
| 21:28.47 | mmontour | Thanks, got it - just checking to see how severe the "make clobber" is going to be. |
| 21:29.31 | kdean06 | rwhitby, I'll do it. :) |
| 21:29.52 | rwhitby | mmontour: clobber means clobber :-) |
| 21:29.53 | ScaredyCat | are the commits available as rss feeds then ? |
| 21:30.13 | rwhitby | ScaredyCat: yes, via cia.vc/project/openmoko |
| 21:30.31 | ScaredyCat | cool ta |
| 21:30.54 | rwhitby | http://cia.vc/stats/project/openmoko/ in particular |
| 21:31.15 | mjr | hmh, nokia is making noises about going into linux cells :/ |
| 21:31.16 | rwhitby | I expected to see git commits from XorA|gone there ... |
| 21:31.29 | rwhitby | kdean06: /msg'd you the url |
| 21:31.35 | XorA|gone | rwhitby: gimme a few mins :-) |
| 21:31.37 | kdean06 | Got it, thanks. |
| 21:31.48 | kdean06 | Hrm... I can't get on my server. :S |
| 21:34.11 | mmontour | OK, it's started (checking out SVN currently). I'll let you know how it turns out. |
| 21:35.17 | XorA|gone | starts to love git-reset |
| 21:45.00 | XorA|gone | rwhitby: some commits |
| 21:45.35 | rwhitby | XorA|gone: so cia is not reporting them here or at http://cia.vc/stats/project/openmoko/ |
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| 21:52.06 | XorA|gone | rwhitby: hmm, would be useful to get that fixed |
| 21:52.22 | XorA|gone | rwhitby: I guess the commit hook is just not attached yet as it works for the rest of the repos |
| 21:53.29 | rwhitby | XorA|gone: yeah my guess is the commit hook for git is missing |
| 21:53.59 | XorA|gone | rwhitby: Ill ask tomorrow |
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| 22:03.46 | mmontour | rwhitby: The Makefile is into the build phase now. I saw an odd error message: Parsing .bb files, please wait...done.sh: line 0: cd: /home/mmontour/moko/openembedded/packages/0xFFFF/0xffff_0.1.bb: Not a directory |
| 22:03.52 | mmontour | fatal: Not a git repository |
| 22:04.21 | raboof | mjr: 'linux cells' aren't interesting if they're not open, too |
| 22:04.34 | rwhitby | mmontour: yeah, that seems to be an openembedded metadata problem, unrelated to the changeover to git |
| 22:04.41 | raboof | motorola has some linux-based cells, but as the software is closed that isn't that interesting |
| 22:05.15 | raboof | imho, anyway :) |
| 22:07.51 | geogriffin | wow android is so dumb |
| 22:08.15 | geogriffin | it is only compiled for ARMv5 up compliant CPUs |
| 22:11.21 | rwhitby | geogriffin: I expect that is an OHA business tactic to ensure that android is only easily ported to new OHA member company handsets and not ported to legacy handsets |
| 22:12.46 | raboof | supposedly only after the first android-based phones are in production (and the OHA members have a nice head-start), will the stack become open-source |
| 22:13.08 | rwhitby | (previous to the handset releases by those companies, after which the source code will be available and anyone can port it to anything) |
| 22:13.17 | rwhitby | raboof: exactly |
| 22:13.27 | geogriffin | ARM is ridiculous anyway.. it has too many "features" |
| 22:13.32 | geogriffin | ha |
| 22:13.49 | rwhitby | I expect it's the "payback" for the huge dollars that OHA companies probably pay to be part of the alliance |
| 22:14.42 | geogriffin | just kidding, i know ARM architecture is probably important for maintaining code size/speed balance on small memory/slow devices |
| 22:15.02 | raboof | yeah, i guess it's understandable when you want to make friends with the commercial guys you'll have to make compromises |
| 22:15.49 | mjr | raboof, indeed not to me, which is why it's potentially quite bad for nokia to stick their hand in too. |
| 22:16.36 | raboof | if they do it right it might be interesting though - maemo looked reasonably open (though I though that about android, too, until i looked closer :) ) |
| 22:16.54 | geogriffin | i just dont get how android has an "open" image at all.. when it can only be compiled for one processor so far |
| 22:17.06 | woglinde | nite |
| 22:17.08 | raboof | the n810 is really interesting hardware, even if the software isn't tuned right and (quite importantly) it doesn't do GSM :) |
| 22:17.40 | raboof | geogriffin: good marketing and exciting promises, I guess |
| 22:18.23 | raboof | anyway |
| 22:18.28 | raboof | bedtime, later guys :) |
| 22:18.31 | geogriffin | cya |
| 22:20.03 | rwhitby | mickey|zzZZzz: any chance you can fix the bashism in python-edje_cvs.bb ? |
| 22:20.08 | rwhitby | XorA|gone: ^^ |
| 22:20.20 | rwhitby | that causes build failure on virgin ubuntu |
| 22:24.38 | rwhitby | If I had commit access I could fix it myself ... |
| 22:24.44 | geogriffin | ha |
| 22:26.39 | rwhitby | makes a local git commit, to see if "make update" will do the rebase correctly next time XorA|gone updates the git for openembedded |
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| 22:31.48 | mmontour | ERROR: Task 523 (/home/mmontour/moko/openembedded/packages/linux/linux-openmoko_2.6.24+git.bb, do_fetch) failed |
| 22:33.26 | rwhitby | mmontour: "make update" - XorA|gone was meant to have fixed that |
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| 23:56.02 | cdbot2 | * * OM Bug 1395 has been created by openmoko(AT)rcie.de |
| 23:56.03 | cdbot2 | * * SDHC-Support |
| 23:56.04 | cdbot2 | * * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=1395 |
