| 00:01.08 | *** join/#openmoko Demitar (n=demitar@h-79-136-2-44.NA.cust.bahnhof.se) |
| 00:05.08 | *** join/#openmoko icman (n=icman@60-249-22-235.HINET-IP.hinet.net) |
| 00:09.06 | *** join/#openmoko Sonicadvance1 (n=Sonic@69.92.97.122) |
| 00:10.40 | Sonicadvance1 | wait...may 16th...That's tomorrow... |
| 00:10.52 | SpeedEvil | Today |
| 00:10.58 | SpeedEvil | For an hour. |
| 00:11.01 | SpeedEvil | (here) |
| 00:11.05 | SpeedEvil | (uk) |
| 00:11.20 | Sonicadvance1 | oh no! |
| 00:13.24 | Sonicadvance1 | dies |
| 00:14.27 | *** join/#openmoko raster (n=raster@124-170-236-47.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 00:14.33 | SpeedEvil | lights a ultrabright red LED in Sonicadvances memory. |
| 00:15.55 | Sonicadvance | implodes |
| 00:16.11 | Sonicadvance | and thus the desktop die |
| 00:18.36 | *** join/#openmoko Sonicadvance1 (n=Sonic@69.92.97.122) |
| 00:28.34 | unknown_lamer | oh yay someone who knows ARM architecture offered to fix ffcall and libsigsegv |
| 00:28.46 | unknown_lamer | mmm clisp with FFI and generational GC |
| 00:29.33 | Sonicadvance | :D |
| 00:29.36 | SpeedEvil | "ground cover" 5cm |
| 00:29.38 | SpeedEvil | oops |
| 00:30.30 | Sonicadvance | foggy out :P |
| 00:33.36 | *** join/#openmoko idarwin (n=ian@207.81.133.5) |
| 00:37.50 | *** join/#openmoko Sonicadvance1 (n=Sonic@69.92.97.122) |
| 00:43.09 | *** join/#openmoko Sonicadvance1 (n=Sonic@69.92.97.122) |
| 00:48.38 | *** join/#openmoko mindCrime (n=chatzill@cpe-075-177-141-190.nc.res.rr.com) |
| 00:54.13 | *** join/#openmoko gnosy (n=IceChat7@211.141.40.70) |
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| 00:56.39 | *** join/#openmoko jaebird (n=jaebird@unaffiliated/jaebird) |
| 01:05.18 | *** join/#openmoko kdean06 (n=Kevin@fsf/member/kdean06) |
| 01:07.26 | *** join/#openmoko Sonicadvance1 (n=Sonic@69.92.97.122) |
| 01:10.48 | CIA-44 | freesmartphone.org: 03mickey * ra39442d8db86 10/ophoned/ (gsm/channel.py gsm/mediator.py objects.py ophoned): python-ophoned: add test commands and fix decoding for phonebook entries != ASCII |
| 01:10.48 | CIA-44 | freesmartphone.org: 03mickey * r4309b910b9ed 10/ophoned/ (5 files in 2 dirs): |
| 01:10.48 | CIA-44 | freesmartphone.org: python-ophoned: more goodies |
| 01:10.48 | CIA-44 | freesmartphone.org: * use seconds as timeout metric |
| 01:10.50 | CIA-44 | freesmartphone.org: * start using regular expressions for parsing |
| 01:10.52 | CIA-44 | freesmartphone.org: * add more of org.freesmartphone.GSM.Network |
| 01:11.42 | *** join/#openmoko Sonicadvance1 (n=Sonic@69.92.97.122) |
| 01:14.40 | summatusmentis | so... with mickeyl's most recent blog post, do we know anything about when a usable software set might be ready? |
| 01:15.28 | Sonicadvance | 5 hours? :D |
| 01:15.29 | *** join/#openmoko JonCruz (n=joncruz@adsl-75-51-184-128.dsl.lsan03.sbcglobal.net) |
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| 01:15.36 | SpeedEvil | <PROTECTED> |
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| 02:40.54 | *** part/#openmoko baird (n=cbaird@brushtail.apana.org.au) |
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| 04:07.22 | linuxxr | any idea the total people in the "groups" buying plan? |
| 04:07.56 | holycow | hello moko! |
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| 04:43.10 | ewon | int |
| 04:43.11 | ewon | shit |
| 04:43.31 | Sonicadvance1 | long |
| 04:44.10 | holycow | hehehe |
| 04:44.45 | *** join/#openmoko rwhitby` (n=rwhitby@ppp240-74.static.internode.on.net) |
| 04:46.25 | mwester | wonders if ewon needs to select better names for his integer variables... |
| 04:46.30 | *** join/#openmoko rwhitby` (n=rwhitby@ppp240-74.static.internode.on.net) |
| 04:49.56 | Daemonax | Well what's the state on production? Started? |
| 05:00.10 | *** join/#openmoko doron (n=Ofek@87.68.144.6) |
| 05:15.07 | *** join/#openmoko Tuju (n=tuju@50.157.190.90.sta.estpak.ee) |
| 05:18.26 | Sonicadvance | No one knows |
| 05:30.59 | *** join/#openmoko mibo-cz (n=mibo-cz@ip-89-102-134-143.karneval.cz) |
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| 06:05.48 | *** part/#openmoko baird (n=cbaird@brushtail.apana.org.au) |
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| 06:11.37 | *** join/#openmoko geogriffin (n=geogriff@s98-99.resnet.ucla.edu) |
| 06:14.10 | geogriffin | hey, can someone help me get openmoko compiled on fedora? |
| 06:16.40 | geogriffin | it would make me consider buying the phone :) |
| 06:18.48 | *** join/#openmoko geogriffin (n=geogriff@s98-99.resnet.ucla.edu) |
| 06:19.38 | *** join/#openmoko yangh (i=7c108a34@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-ed96ed22e1bd1447) |
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| 06:34.40 | geogriffin | i am having a problem building gmp-native |
| 06:35.26 | *** join/#openmoko CVirus (n=GoD@196.205.193.11) |
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| 07:00.57 | methril | morning |
| 07:02.15 | *** join/#openmoko christooss (n=matic@89-212-127-244.dynamic.dsl.t-2.net) |
| 07:10.21 | CIA-43 | freesmartphone.org: 03vesa.pikki * r6b8841e37800 10/ (14 files in 3 dirs): |
| 07:10.21 | CIA-43 | freesmartphone.org: Fixed release methods parameter's in ui.py |
| 07:10.21 | CIA-43 | freesmartphone.org: Fixed a bug related to activating a call with incorrect id. |
| 07:10.21 | CIA-43 | freesmartphone.org: Initial version of wavecom's vendor plugin |
| 07:10.22 | CIA-43 | freesmartphone.org: 03vesa.pikki * r9ad6c5886532 10/src/network.c: Merge branch 'master' of git@git.freesmartphone.org:gsmd2 |
| 07:10.35 | Hopscotch | good morning |
| 07:12.31 | *** join/#openmoko milo__ (n=nilsense@dslb-088-076-233-013.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 07:18.20 | *** join/#openmoko Tuju (n=tuju@50.157.190.90.sta.estpak.ee) |
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| 07:40.50 | *** part/#openmoko baird (n=cbaird@brushtail.apana.org.au) |
| 07:42.33 | *** join/#openmoko t_s_o (n=tso@129.84-49-131.nextgentel.com) |
| 07:43.34 | *** join/#openmoko Werty (n=radek@gw.mkinet.cz) |
| 07:52.45 | *** join/#openmoko jzoef (i=jzoef@gateway/tor/x-18dd511e5b7b6fc1) |
| 08:01.06 | CIA-43 | openmoko: 03zecke * r4e4df81592f9 10/src/server/phone/ (smsstatusdbusexporter.cpp smsstatusdbusexporter.h): [sms] Add removing of messages for Chia-I Wu (olv) |
| 08:01.07 | CIA-43 | openmoko: 03zecke * rcc34f70a6226 10/src/libraries/qtopia/qtopiaapplication.cpp: [im] Implement the matchbox command to show and hide the keyboard |
| 08:03.04 | *** join/#openmoko aloril (n=aloril@h15794.gprs.dnafinland.fi) |
| 08:03.44 | *** join/#openmoko apol|work (n=pol@xwing4.upc.es) |
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| 08:16.52 | *** join/#openmoko polz (n=polz@lbcsi.fri.uni-lj.si) |
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| 08:34.18 | *** join/#openmoko wibbit (n=douglasf@SAGW-PRIMARY.ARC.COM) |
| 08:35.40 | *** part/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@161.121.142.82.ip.b26.cz) |
| 08:37.32 | *** join/#openmoko SorenHK (n=SorenHK@0x50a13df3.abnxx6.adsl-dhcp.tele.dk) |
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| 08:46.59 | *** join/#openmoko vaiursch (n=erwin@80-219-241-205.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 08:49.22 | *** join/#openmoko danilos (n=danilo@canonical/launchpad/danilos) |
| 08:53.13 | ScaredyCat | mmmmm |
| 08:53.16 | *** join/#openmoko ruoso (n=ruoso@195.23.92.2) |
| 08:54.32 | CIA-43 | openmoko: 03rwhitby * r19 10mokomakefile/trunk/Makefile: Allow selection of the monotone branch to build (e.g. org.openmoko.april-update) |
| 08:54.46 | *** join/#openmoko mzb_d800 (n=mzb@ppp108-88.static.internode.on.net) |
| 08:55.32 | CVirus | mass production started .. right ? |
| 08:58.07 | ScaredyCat | dunno |
| 08:58.23 | ScaredyCat | wonders why there's no audio |
| 09:00.03 | CVirus | wonders why there's no community update |
| 09:05.18 | *** join/#openmoko apol|work (n=pol@xwing4.upc.es) |
| 09:05.18 | ScaredyCat | how does gstreamer get started ? |
| 09:06.00 | polz | wonders whether the bugs in the communication between the UART and GSM have been pinpointed |
| 09:06.09 | *** join/#openmoko tick36 (n=tick@firewall.tw.openmoko.org) |
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| 09:18.27 | *** join/#openmoko ChanServ (ChanServ@services.) |
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| 09:18.28 | *** join/#openmoko mickey|zzZZzz (i=mickey@openmoko/coreteam/mickey) |
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| 09:18.29 | *** join/#openmoko flaushy (n=flaushy@vs240161.vserver.de) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.29 | *** join/#openmoko Placid (n=placid@unaffiliated/placid) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.29 | *** join/#openmoko Karrde (i=sehaton@shodan.irccrew.org) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.29 | *** join/#openmoko Kensan (n=ken@gw.ptr-80-238-205-18.customer.ch.netstream.com) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 09:18.29 | *** mode/#openmoko [+o ChanServ] by irc.freenode.net |
| 09:19.45 | *** join/#openmoko ChanServ (ChanServ@services.) |
| 09:19.45 | *** mode/#openmoko [+o ChanServ] by irc.freenode.net |
| 09:23.38 | *** join/#openmoko summatusmentis (n=summatus@c-24-118-78-158.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) |
| 09:24.54 | *** join/#openmoko florian (n=fuchs@217.146.132.69) |
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| 09:26.51 | *** join/#openmoko mire (n=mirezwer@210-174-222-85.adsl.verat.net) |
| 09:30.14 | wibbit | wiiieeeeeeeee mass production |
| 09:30.16 | wibbit | woot woot |
| 09:41.18 | CVirus | wibbit: how did you know ? |
| 09:41.34 | CVirus | no announcements yet |
| 09:41.36 | *** join/#openmoko kwek (n=martijn@188.Red-213-97-48.staticIP.rima-tde.net) |
| 09:43.36 | wibbit | Call me positive :) |
| 09:43.48 | nepumuck | mass production of the phone? |
| 09:48.05 | CVirus | yes |
| 09:48.14 | *** join/#openmoko exc1 (n=exco@e181067045.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 09:48.36 | CVirus | I can't wait for steve's announcement |
| 09:50.35 | geogriffin | hey, can anyone help me build openmoko with the mokomakefile? it is failing at gmp-native |
| 09:52.25 | XorA | fedora core 9? |
| 09:52.30 | geogriffin | yes yes |
| 09:52.34 | geogriffin | heh |
| 09:52.36 | XorA | dont use fedora core 9 |
| 09:52.42 | geogriffin | thats a good answer |
| 09:52.51 | *** join/#openmoko lrg (n=liam@79-68-66-4.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com) |
| 09:52.58 | XorA | gcc 4.3.0 doesnt like gmp sources |
| 09:53.09 | XorA | you'll have to figure out a patch |
| 09:53.17 | XorA | OM people tend not to use fedore core |
| 09:53.26 | ScaredyCat | XorA: ! |
| 09:53.28 | ScaredyCat | biathc |
| 09:53.30 | ScaredyCat | dsf |
| 09:53.38 | ScaredyCat | can you ssh into your phine |
| 09:53.40 | ScaredyCat | phone |
| 09:53.45 | XorA | yes |
| 09:53.55 | geogriffin | should i just run debian or something in xen |
| 09:54.17 | ScaredyCat | then do /etc/init.d/avahi-daemon restart |
| 09:54.20 | *** join/#openmoko sirclown82 (n=sirclown@adsl-76-231-227-182.dsl.rcsntx.sbcglobal.net) |
| 09:54.25 | geogriffin | what distro would you recommend? |
| 09:54.30 | ScaredyCat | suse 10.3 |
| 09:54.30 | XorA | debian lenny or ubuntu are the best at the moment |
| 09:54.35 | ScaredyCat | pft |
| 09:54.43 | geogriffin | latest releases? |
| 09:55.02 | *** join/#openmoko bricode (n=bricode@206-248-137-228.dsl.teksavvy.com) |
| 09:55.46 | XorA | I use debian lenny |
| 09:55.51 | geogriffin | ok |
| 09:55.54 | XorA | ubuntu gutsy or hardy are said to work as well |
| 09:55.55 | geogriffin | thanks man |
| 09:56.47 | geogriffin | i am considering buying the phone when it is released, but i want to test out some stuff first |
| 09:57.10 | geogriffin | how stable will the software be on release? |
| 09:57.10 | ScaredyCat | stabs wildly with a sharp knife after seeing raster's message |
| 09:57.19 | ScaredyCat | not geogriffin |
| 09:57.29 | ScaredyCat | well, actually... |
| 09:57.32 | ScaredyCat | that depends... |
| 09:57.44 | ScaredyCat | if the hardware is out in 2008 or not ;) |
| 09:57.56 | geogriffin | heh |
| 09:58.20 | *** join/#openmoko MetaMorfoziS (n=avr@3e44b94c.adsl.enternet.hu) |
| 09:58.37 | geogriffin | well i mean i have another phone i could use if this isn't stable at first, but i get the impression it will get a lot better over time |
| 10:02.33 | ScaredyCat | it's useable now. |
| 10:02.46 | ScaredyCat | just that battery life (pwoermanagement) needs work... |
| 10:03.33 | BDo | If I can get a hand on it, I'm willing to contribute ! :-) |
| 10:04.01 | geogriffin | ok. and the jack is a 2.5mm? guess i will have to carry an adapter :/ |
| 10:04.06 | nigel_c | wants to make it hibernate :) |
| 10:04.47 | XorA | it goes into suspend fine :-D |
| 10:04.54 | nigel_c | Of course that doesn't help if you actually want to use it though :) |
| 10:05.34 | nigel_c | Yeah, but I mean hibernate for faster startup and state persistance. |
| 10:05.57 | ScaredyCat | XorA: did you try that command for me ? |
| 10:06.33 | XorA | <PROTECTED> |
| 10:06.33 | XorA | [ ok ] |
| 10:07.52 | ScaredyCat | grrs |
| 10:08.08 | ScaredyCat | # /etc/init.d/avahi-daemon restart |
| 10:08.08 | ScaredyCat | <PROTECTED> |
| 10:08.08 | ScaredyCat | /usr/sbin/avahi-daemon: error while loading shared libraries: libssp.so.0: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory |
| 10:08.12 | ScaredyCat | <PROTECTED> |
| 10:08.18 | ScaredyCat | see... libssfuckingp |
| 10:08.47 | XorA | for some reason your gcc built libssp even though --disable-libssp is passed to it |
| 10:09.10 | ScaredyCat | this is from a clean build... |
| 10:09.15 | XorA | check the log.do_configure for gcc-cross to make sure disable-libssp actually got sent to configure |
| 10:09.18 | ScaredyCat | with sane-srcrecs |
| 10:09.20 | ScaredyCat | revs |
| 10:09.45 | *** join/#openmoko rd_ (n=dr@vnsecurity.net) |
| 10:10.59 | ScaredyCat | its on the configure line |
| 10:11.28 | XorA | I wonder why gcc ignores this and builds it anyway |
| 10:11.53 | XorA | ScaredyCat: time for you to get down and dirty withy autoconf I think |
| 10:12.17 | ScaredyCat | I'd rather know why it works on yours and not mine... |
| 10:12.28 | ScaredyCat | they should both do the same thing |
| 10:12.51 | ScaredyCat | I don;t know of anyone else that's done a full rebuild recently |
| 10:18.55 | *** join/#openmoko janneg (n=janne@tichy.grunau.be) |
| 10:19.59 | *** join/#openmoko balrog-k1n (n=balrog@ckx55.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl) |
| 10:24.56 | spyre | mickeyl: Hi, did you have a chance to look at my fso.sms email? |
| 10:27.51 | mickeyl | spyre: yes, sorry for not getting back yet. i'm just finishing implementing the SMS part of org.freesmartphone.GSM.SIM, then I have the necessary experience to comment on your message |
| 10:28.12 | mickeyl | so i guess i can answer tomorrow or sunday |
| 10:28.16 | mickeyl | time flies *sigh* |
| 10:29.24 | spyre | mickeyl: np, now I have the chance to send a followup email ;) |
| 10:29.36 | spyre | it sure does, not enough hours in a day |
| 10:29.44 | mickeyl | right |
| 10:35.14 | ScaredyCat | mickeyl: any idea why gcc would use libssp even with --disable-libssp ? |
| 10:35.18 | *** join/#openmoko Heinervdm (n=thomas@pD9E1461C.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 10:38.28 | mickeyl | no idea offhand |
| 10:38.41 | mickeyl | need to ask the toolchain experts over at #oe |
| 10:39.36 | ScaredyCat | anyone in particular I should look for ? |
| 10:39.56 | mickeyl | hmm, hard to say. RP, Stelios, zecke, koen. Best write an email to oe-devel |
| 10:46.03 | SpeedEvil | ScaredyCat: familiar with build problems with gdb? |
| 10:46.25 | ScaredyCat | not seen any... |
| 10:46.31 | ScaredyCat | you have some? |
| 10:47.05 | SpeedEvil | I do... |
| 10:47.22 | SpeedEvil | extracts log. |
| 10:49.01 | *** join/#openmoko Virtuall (n=virtuall@83.241.45.109) |
| 10:49.34 | spyre | mickeyl: btw you said SIM, isn't fso.SMS still goingto be used (even though if received messages would be stored elsewhere)? |
| 10:49.42 | SpeedEvil | sca http://pastebin.com/m38467b2d |
| 10:50.45 | CIA-43 | freesmartphone.org: 03mickey * rd14b626fccb9 10/ophoned/ (gsm/const.py gsm/mediator.py objects.py): python-ophoned: org.freesmartphone.GSM.SIM.{Get,Set}ServiceCenterNumber() done. |
| 10:51.31 | SpeedEvil | tries make update |
| 10:51.54 | mickeyl | Well, SIM is going to contain functions to read and store an SMS on/from the SIM |
| 10:52.14 | mickeyl | SMS is the 'real thing' |
| 10:52.42 | spyre | mickeyl: ok, just making sure :) |
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| 11:01.15 | winux | i install bitbake by runing "./setup.py install" ,but how can i remove it ? |
| 11:05.25 | *** join/#openmoko SP8472 (i=8472@dslb-084-056-222-093.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 11:07.23 | *** join/#openmoko grummel (n=christia@2a01:198:21d:0:211:2fff:fe89:f4c2) |
| 11:07.52 | apollo13 | winux: you can't; just remove the installed files |
| 11:08.39 | winux | apollo13,where can i find the files i installed? |
| 11:09.15 | apollo13 | winux: most likely under /usr/lib/python2.x/site-packages/.... |
| 11:09.23 | apollo13 | or just use find ;) |
| 11:09.43 | winux | thank you |
| 11:10.03 | SorenHK | Hmm I'm trying to build the openmoko-sample2 as described on: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Toolchain but I'm getting an error (configure: error: C compiler cannot create executables) when running the command: om-conf openmoko-sample2 . I've pasted the error message from the console and some of the stuff from config.log here: http://pastebin.com/m4d6d3fb . I've installed all the prerequisites as described on the wiki.. I'm running |
| 11:10.03 | SorenHK | <PROTECTED> |
| 11:14.26 | *** join/#openmoko mbuf (n=shakthim@61.16.248.242) |
| 11:16.56 | wibbit | ScaredyCat: which message from raster? |
| 11:17.01 | *** join/#openmoko KenSentMe (n=jeroen@kensentme.xs4all.nl) |
| 11:17.14 | ScaredyCat | re: the keybard |
| 11:17.18 | ScaredyCat | keyboard |
| 11:17.25 | ScaredyCat | on dev list |
| 11:19.19 | wibbit | openmoko or opkg? |
| 11:20.05 | wibbit | no manual control of the keyboard popup?!? |
| 11:20.48 | *** join/#openmoko Outlander (n=outlande@unaffiliated/outlander) |
| 11:21.33 | wibbit | ScaredyCat: You bring the rail way line, I'll bring the rope |
| 11:21.36 | *** join/#openmoko Sup3rkiddo (n=sudharsh@unaffiliated/sudharsh) |
| 11:23.39 | raster | ScaredyCat: dont stab me. i didnt make the decision.. i was told to remove it by the almighty powers that are our ui design department |
| 11:23.48 | SpeedEvil | ... |
| 11:23.52 | raster | and i was wuoted some ui dsign book as to why |
| 11:23.55 | ScaredyCat | I wasn't stabbing you |
| 11:23.57 | ScaredyCat | ... |
| 11:24.19 | raster | u have no idea the shit i stirred arguing against the removal |
| 11:24.23 | raster | i give up |
| 11:24.43 | raster | i just dont fight anymore. |
| 11:24.49 | wibbit | ScaredyCat: I suppose, you have the option of setting it up so that if a keyboard is attached (surely the system will know) then the onscreen keyboard can be hidden. |
| 11:25.03 | ScaredyCat | who are these gui design numptys ? |
| 11:25.11 | SpeedEvil | passes raster gifts for the people that decided that. Eighteen puppies full of coffee. |
| 11:25.15 | ScaredyCat | wibbit: you'd think so.. |
| 11:25.19 | wibbit | raster: never give up raging against the machine :) |
| 11:25.45 | trickie_ | wibbit: right on! |
| 11:26.04 | wibbit | Especially when the machines are numpty's |
| 11:26.07 | raster | wibbit: i do. |
| 11:26.23 | ScaredyCat | did you just marry wibbit? |
| 11:26.36 | wibbit | blushes |
| 11:27.00 | raster | hahahaha |
| 11:27.17 | wibbit | wonders how he'd look in a dress |
| 11:28.09 | ScaredyCat | *shudder* |
| 11:28.09 | raster | i thought one reaosn i'm here is |
| 11:28.33 | raster | 1. i have been doing software - gui software, for a loooong time. i have dealt directly with users for over a decade. i KNOW what they will say |
| 11:28.39 | raster | i can predict your reactions almost to a tea |
| 11:28.40 | raster | i do X |
| 11:28.43 | raster | you will say Y |
| 11:28.48 | raster | its nice and predictable |
| 11:28.57 | raster | (once u've done it for long enough) |
| 11:29.08 | SpeedEvil | raster: ah - but we are not the users they're interested in (they hope) |
| 11:29.16 | raster | so i can shortcut doing anything by saying "lets not do that - users will complain about X, Y, Z" |
| 11:29.20 | raster | and save the effort |
| 11:29.20 | SpeedEvil | raster: the users they hope for are utter newbs. |
| 11:29.30 | raster | but apparently that is now why i am here |
| 11:29.39 | raster | and such advice is not sught nor heeded. |
| 11:29.42 | raster | sought |
| 11:30.01 | raster | utter newbs will be so royally FUCKED using the freerunner |
| 11:30.08 | raster | i feel sorry for them |
| 11:30.08 | SpeedEvil | Yes. |
| 11:30.10 | raster | already |
| 11:30.25 | wibbit | wonders if the phone would sell well to udder newbs. |
| 11:32.00 | *** join/#openmoko Sup3rkiddo (n=sudharsh@unaffiliated/sudharsh) |
| 11:37.02 | wibbit | Always nice to have faith in one's products :( |
| 11:41.18 | SpeedEvil | Well - worst case, it's open hardware which can be forked. |
| 11:41.45 | SpeedEvil | If I win the lottery... :) |
| 11:42.16 | tc | raster: Do you mean that newbs will be "fucked" with the initial offering, and then the software will be improved for them, or is the hardware platform the problem? |
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| 11:49.38 | TAsn | hehe today is may 16. |
| 11:49.45 | TAsn | nothing happend though :\ |
| 11:50.00 | TAsn | i had this flashing memo, buy moko :) |
| 11:50.36 | rwhitby | OK, anyone have opinions on how MokoMakefile should handle the new openmoko git repo checkout? |
| 11:50.48 | rwhitby | Should I assume that people make local changes, and rebase them on every update? |
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| 11:52.25 | wibbit | TAsn: 16th's not over yet :) |
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| 11:52.37 | TAsn | hehe :) |
| 11:53.42 | CIA-43 | freesmartphone.org: 03mdt * r62d4aec55b21 10/pyneod/setup.py: add lost installer script |
| 11:55.49 | nigel_c | rwhitby: Make local changes, keep a master branch which gets pulled to then merged with local changes branch |
| 11:56.34 | nigel_c | then diff against current master = git diff master..local-branch |
| 11:56.43 | nigel_c | rebasing is ugly |
| 11:56.45 | *** join/#openmoko broedge (n=l@92.117.68.223) |
| 11:56.50 | rwhitby | nigel_c: the master will be origin/foo, checked out to local foo branch |
| 11:57.32 | nigel_c | Yeah, so then I make a local nigel branch. When I want to pull the latest from origin/foo, |
| 11:57.39 | rwhitby | nigel_c: if you're going to submit your local changes back as patches, then rebasing is necessary isn't it? |
| 11:57.50 | nigel_c | I pull it into local foo, then checkout local and git merge foo. |
| 11:57.56 | nigel_c | No, it's not. |
| 11:57.56 | rwhitby | (assuming here that openmoko won't be pulling from mokomakefile user's git repos) |
| 11:58.06 | nigel_c | After merging, you just do the git diff I mentioned above. |
| 11:58.06 | *** join/#openmoko rtm (n=rtm@pool-151-199-27-126.bos.east.verizon.net) |
| 11:58.24 | rwhitby | but then you can't use git-format-patch, can you? |
| 11:58.31 | nigel_c | At least that's the way I prepare tuxonice patches against Linus' kernel. |
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| 11:58.45 | nigel_c | I don't use git-format-patch - I use git diff. |
| 11:58.47 | XorA | you need to rebase when patches collide |
| 11:58.57 | rwhitby | I prepare nslu2-linux kernel patches rebasing, cause that's what the arm kernel maintainer requires |
| 11:59.08 | nigel_c | XorA: git merge will tell you rejects and let you fix them. |
| 11:59.24 | nigel_c | It will probably work both ways :) |
| 11:59.32 | XorA | nigel_c: but then you end with your git history being a mess of tiny fixes |
| 11:59.43 | raster | tc: the software |
| 11:59.56 | raster | tc: its not wel featured . it has many rough bits |
| 11:59.56 | nigel_c | No, it's all the normal patches, just with occasional merge commits in the changelog. |
| 11:59.57 | rwhitby | rebase allows the receiver of the patch to see the exact commit you're patching against |
| 12:00.03 | raster | it has nerdy bits u will need to end up playing with |
| 12:00.11 | nigel_c | :) |
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| 12:00.14 | raster | it is not ready for mass-usage |
| 12:00.21 | nigel_c | I guess it depends how your patches are getting upstream. |
| 12:00.24 | raster | maybe in a year - or well over time it will improve |
| 12:00.28 | raster | but as it stands - no. |
| 12:00.32 | nigel_c | If they're git pulling from you, I don't think you want to rebase. |
| 12:00.43 | nigel_c | if you're emailing patches, maybe rebase is the way to go. |
| 12:01.12 | rwhitby | nigel_c: agreed - if you've got a public repo then rebase is bad |
| 12:01.15 | *** join/#openmoko bricod1 (n=bricode@206-248-137-228.dsl.teksavvy.com) |
| 12:01.20 | rwhitby | if you're mailing patches, then rebase is good |
| 12:01.43 | nigel_c | k. I don't mail patches, so I'll be quiet now :) |
| 12:01.44 | rwhitby | (at least that's my naive view of the git world) |
| 12:02.10 | nigel_c | I just commit, pull, merge and push |
| 12:02.36 | nigel_c | I'm not sure anyone but Linus and maybe a couple of others understand git fully :) |
| 12:03.19 | rwhitby | nigel_c: so the person pulling tuxonice patches from you doesn't mind all the extra merges? |
| 12:03.40 | rwhitby | (cause RMK and Linus really hate them apparently) |
| 12:04.09 | nigel_c | The extra merges don't matter to them, because they're just commits they already have. |
| 12:04.42 | nigel_c | If someone pulls 2.6.25.4, say, and then makes a branch for tuxonice-for-2.6.25 and pulls from my kernel.org |
| 12:04.50 | nigel_c | tree, they'll only pull the tuxonice changes. |
| 12:05.10 | rwhitby | fair enough |
| 12:05.38 | nigel_c | My understanding is that rebasing causes more trouble to people who want to keep pulling from you, |
| 12:05.58 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@208.84-48-176.nextgentel.com) |
| 12:06.04 | nigel_c | but my understanding might be wrong :) |
| 12:06.24 | rwhitby | nigel_c: fully agree - if someone is pulling from you more than once then rebasing is completely outlawed |
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| 12:16.50 | cekay | hey guys. does anyone know if i can create an APM event, so that the gta02 hardware resumes from suspend on an incoming call? |
| 12:17.20 | SpeedEvil | cekay: in principle yes |
| 12:17.21 | XorA | cekay: it should do |
| 12:17.32 | SpeedEvil | APM isn't it though |
| 12:17.45 | *** join/#openmoko TAsn-ghost (n=TAsn@89.1.34.12.dynamic.barak-online.net) |
| 12:17.56 | *** join/#openmoko k-s (n=gustavo@enlightenment/developer/k-s) |
| 12:18.43 | cekay | XorA: i'm trying it on qtopia and it doesn't resume :) |
| 12:18.53 | CVirus | so .. production has started .. right ? |
| 12:19.09 | XorA | cekay: yeah it should do :-) |
| 12:19.16 | XorA | cekay: does it resume at all? |
| 12:19.17 | cekay | heh :) |
| 12:19.26 | cekay | yea, it resumes |
| 12:19.37 | XorA | cekay: there are currently some kernel issues see kernel mailing list |
| 12:19.59 | cekay | ok. thanks for your help :) |
| 12:20.35 | cekay | XorA: lkml or is there an openmoko kernel-ml? |
| 12:20.45 | *** join/#openmoko milos_ (n=milos@92.36.152.242) |
| 12:20.52 | XorA | cekay: there is an openmoko-kernel |
| 12:20.57 | XorA | cedric: see lists.openmoko.org |
| 12:20.57 | cekay | ok |
| 12:21.07 | cekay | :-) |
| 12:21.08 | XorA | cekay: see lists.openmoko.org |
| 12:21.08 | rwhitby | XorA: is the openmoko svn area also moving to git? if so, isn't the openmoko.git name already taken by the openembedded repo? |
| 12:21.26 | XorA | rwhitby: svn is staying svn AFAIK |
| 12:21.55 | CIA-43 | openmoko: 03thomas * r4440 10/trunk/src/target/opkg/libopkg/ (args.c args.h opkg_conf.c opkg_conf.h): opkg: remove verbose_wget option |
| 12:23.33 | *** join/#openmoko miip (n=miip@p54A557D8.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 12:24.13 | tc | raster: Thanks for clearing that up, I just wanted to ensure your comment wasn't taken out of context |
| 12:24.16 | tc | :) |
| 12:24.44 | raster | tx sometimes i am a bit extreme :) |
| 12:24.52 | raster | but its me being very conservative on the software front |
| 12:25.03 | raster | i dont want people to have hopes that are misplaced |
| 12:25.07 | *** join/#openmoko bricode (n=bricode@206-248-137-228.dsl.teksavvy.com) |
| 12:27.42 | tc | raster: Makes sense. I think delaying the hardware release for user-ready software would be a big mistake |
| 12:29.01 | raster | i would agree |
| 12:29.01 | tc | and I have little motivation to hack on the software without a freerunner to run it on, PC's are just not the same |
| 12:29.16 | *** join/#openmoko winux_ (n=winux@218.7.43.195) |
| 12:32.58 | ScaredyCat | sells tc an 01 with an 02 sticker on it |
| 12:33.25 | cekay | sell me some stickers :) |
| 12:34.26 | ScaredyCat | :) |
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| 12:34.50 | ScaredyCat | kicks off another clean build :( |
| 12:35.36 | *** join/#openmoko kwek (n=martijn@188.Red-213-97-48.staticIP.rima-tde.net) |
| 12:35.40 | cekay | good luck |
| 12:35.57 | ScaredyCat | it wont work, I know that, I just need to prove it |
| 12:36.02 | *** join/#openmoko emonkey (n=emonkey@edu-38.148.zhaw.ch) |
| 12:36.17 | cekay | :-( |
| 12:37.16 | mjr | Well. At least it's an easier job than proving it _does_ work. |
| 12:37.25 | SpeedEvil | where's yours sticking Sc? |
| 12:37.46 | ScaredyCat | my avahi / libssp stuff |
| 12:38.09 | ScaredyCat | I can get round it, I just don't want to work around it I want to find the cause |
| 12:38.19 | SpeedEvil | hmm. gdb here |
| 12:38.40 | ScaredyCat | are you useing san srcrevs ? |
| 12:39.10 | ScaredyCat | sane |
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| 12:43.01 | SpeedEvil | I haven't touched anything other than the binary locales thing |
| 12:43.37 | *** join/#openmoko larry_jr (n=Larry@200.184.118.132) |
| 12:44.43 | *** join/#openmoko bricode (n=bricode@206-248-137-228.dsl.teksavvy.com) |
| 12:44.46 | *** join/#openmoko gromez (n=gromez@unaffiliated/gromez) |
| 12:46.52 | *** join/#openmoko idarwin (n=ian@67.70.212.228) |
| 12:51.01 | ScaredyCat | hrmml... |
| 12:51.57 | ScaredyCat | can someone paste in their EXTRA_OECONF line from ./openembedded/packages/avahi/avahi.inc for me |
| 12:52.51 | CIA-43 | freesmartphone.org: 03mickey * r473cd54120c4 10/ophoned/ (gsm/const.py gsm/mediator.py objects.py): python-ophoned: org.freesmartphone.GSM.SIM.RetrieveMessagebook done. |
| 12:53.24 | *** join/#openmoko wipf (n=wipf@dslb-084-057-235-201.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 12:53.52 | mickeyl | EXTRA_OECONF = "--with-distro=debian --disable-nls --disable-gdbm ${AVAHI_GTK} --disable-mono --disable-monodoc --disable-qt3 --disable-qt4 ${AVAHI_PYTHON}" |
| 12:54.32 | ScaredyCat | thanks |
| 12:59.44 | *** join/#openmoko cesarb (n=cesarb@grumari.nitnet.com.br) |
| 13:00.05 | *** join/#openmoko slomo (n=slomo@ubuntu/member/slomo) |
| 13:05.27 | rwhitby | With the git repo, a null "make update" now takes only 23 seconds. |
| 13:06.04 | rwhitby | (and most of that is the svn updates for trunk and developers) |
| 13:08.55 | *** join/#openmoko SirBob1701 (n=mcginley@pool-70-110-179-229.phil.east.verizon.net) |
| 13:10.07 | *** join/#openmoko Tob1 (n=tobi@pD9E87CD3.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 13:12.03 | *** join/#openmoko k-s (n=gustavo@enlightenment/developer/k-s) |
| 13:18.12 | *** join/#openmoko AzalynHD (n=junon@mcbain.semsolutions.com) |
| 13:20.31 | *** join/#openmoko andrunko (n=andrunko@200.184.118.132) |
| 13:27.21 | CIA-43 | freesmartphone.org: 03jluebbe * r548a75edec2f 10/setup.py: Correctly declare the encoding |
| 13:27.21 | *** join/#openmoko AzalynHD (n=junon@mcbain.semsolutions.com) |
| 13:29.34 | CIA-43 | freesmartphone.org: 03jluebbe * rc7a6cdcc72ed 10/ousaged/ (ousaged ouseaged): Fix incorretly named script |
| 13:30.31 | *** join/#openmoko polz_ (n=polz@88.200.89.142) |
| 13:31.42 | AzalynHD | before may 16th ! :D |
| 13:31.52 | AzalynHD | what a coincidence that it is may 16th today! :D |
| 13:32.17 | XorA | what happens on may 16th |
| 13:32.27 | CVirus | MASS PRODUCTIONS BEGINSSSS |
| 13:32.28 | CVirus | WOHOOO |
| 13:32.35 | XorA | you mean I can finally guy one? |
| 13:32.36 | CVirus | any updates from steve ? |
| 13:32.38 | CVirus | no |
| 13:32.52 | AzalynHD | no, it means they're finally being made. |
| 13:32.53 | XorA | :-( Ive been waiting years to buy one |
| 13:33.02 | AzalynHD | i imagine it should only be a month or two at the most. |
| 13:33.06 | XorA | :-( |
| 13:33.10 | AzalynHD | there will be a test period. |
| 13:33.14 | CVirus | I can't wait any longer |
| 13:33.19 | CVirus | tests ? again ? |
| 13:33.30 | AzalynHD | CVirus: well, final production tests. |
| 13:33.35 | AzalynHD | i'm just guessing. |
| 13:33.45 | AzalynHD | keep in mind this is hardware, not software. |
| 13:33.52 | SpeedEvil | <PROTECTED> |
| 13:34.05 | AzalynHD | there's no such thing as 'releasing a patch to fix a hardware problem' |
| 13:34.12 | SpeedEvil | Sure there is. |
| 13:34.15 | CVirus | those tests are done already |
| 13:34.17 | SpeedEvil | It's just bloody expensive. |
| 13:34.20 | AzalynHD | so they have to make absolutely certain. |
| 13:34.49 | janneg | CVirus: tests for not delivering broken devices |
| 13:34.50 | AzalynHD | SpeedEvil: modding your own phone to fix the problem doesn't count. :| |
| 13:34.59 | ScaredyCat | shop is open |
| 13:35.02 | SpeedEvil | I mean it involves couriers, and moddings. |
| 13:35.02 | CVirus | janneg: ah |
| 13:35.03 | ScaredyCat | errm... |
| 13:35.06 | ScaredyCat | not |
| 13:35.07 | CVirus | huh ??? |
| 13:35.08 | CVirus | damn |
| 13:35.12 | SpeedEvil | stabs ScaredyCat. |
| 13:35.22 | SpeedEvil | unstabs ScaredyCat, as he's occasionally handy. |
| 13:35.30 | ScaredyCat | giggles and dances around SpeedEvil |
| 13:35.49 | AzalynHD | i might wait for the second batch of phones before buying one. |
| 13:36.00 | ScaredyCat | I just know they're going to take orders on the day I'm away |
| 13:36.04 | AzalynHD | i want to see what interesting apps people will come up with and so on. |
| 13:36.12 | AzalynHD | and for now i'm a bit short on cash. |
| 13:36.14 | SpeedEvil | ScaredyCat: give me your CC details, and I'll order for you. |
| 13:36.20 | AzalynHD | i'd like to sell my old phone before i get a new one |
| 13:36.31 | ScaredyCat | hands SpeedEvil XorA's cc |
| 13:36.33 | rwhitby | Yeah, best to wait for GTA02.1 rather than buying GTA02.0 |
| 13:36.38 | rwhitby | ;-) |
| 13:36.42 | SpeedEvil | GTA04! |
| 13:36.54 | CVirus | whats GTA ? |
| 13:36.58 | CVirus | Grand Theft Auto ? |
| 13:36.59 | CVirus | :-p |
| 13:37.09 | rwhitby | GNU Telephony Appliance |
| 13:37.10 | ScaredyCat | they're just trying to keep up with the game version numbers |
| 13:37.11 | SpeedEvil | I don't think that's ever been revealed. |
| 13:37.25 | rwhitby | oops |
| 13:37.36 | AzalynHD | it's not a gnu project though :| |
| 13:37.45 | ScaredyCat | Gybrush's Tiny Appendage |
| 13:37.48 | CVirus | LOL @ ScaredyCat |
| 13:38.22 | *** join/#openmoko aloril (n=aloril@h14414.gprs.dnafinland.fi) |
| 13:38.35 | rwhitby | Greedy Towards Amperage |
| 13:38.42 | AzalynHD | i think this is one of the most important hardware launches this year. |
| 13:38.45 | AzalynHD | so they have to get it right. |
| 13:39.27 | SpeedEvil | I think the hardware is unimportant. |
| 13:39.43 | SpeedEvil | It has absolutely nothing over GTA01 in terms of vital end-user hardware. |
| 13:40.04 | ScaredyCat | true, but the software needs something to run on |
| 13:40.05 | AzalynHD | i find the more powerful cpu vital. |
| 13:40.14 | AzalynHD | i like the extras that they added. |
| 13:40.17 | SpeedEvil | Azalyn: but it's hamstrung by other issues. |
| 13:40.20 | AzalynHD | i think it makes it more valuable as a phone. |
| 13:40.28 | ScaredyCat | crippled... |
| 13:40.40 | SpeedEvil | Azalyn: the graphics chip shares a horribly slow bus with the SD |
| 13:40.41 | ScaredyCat | like a badger with one stripe |
| 13:40.49 | SpeedEvil | It's about 16 bit ISA speed. |
| 13:41.08 | *** join/#openmoko AlecTBM (n=alectbm@c06C245C1.dhcp.bluecom.no) |
| 13:41.09 | AzalynHD | well, what if you're not using the sd card.. |
| 13:41.29 | SpeedEvil | Where else are you going to get video? |
| 13:41.47 | *** part/#openmoko AlecTBM (n=alectbm@c06C245C1.dhcp.bluecom.no) |
| 13:41.47 | SpeedEvil | other than BT/wifi/USB |
| 13:41.48 | AzalynHD | i didn't specifically mention video.. |
| 13:41.49 | ScaredyCat | points "somewhere" |
| 13:42.15 | AzalynHD | even so there's probably a way in software to work around that |
| 13:42.22 | SpeedEvil | There isn't. |
| 13:42.26 | mwester | XorA: How do I build Qtopia? Or do I need a different branch checked out for that? (Or is it not quite integrated into the OM OE repo, and I should be patient for a while?) |
| 13:42.27 | ScaredyCat | the gta02 isn't for pron? |
| 13:42.29 | SpeedEvil | The hardware bus is 8M/second |
| 13:42.32 | SpeedEvil | 7M |
| 13:42.49 | AzalynHD | and that's not good enough? |
| 13:42.50 | SpeedEvil | It's shared between the graphics chip and the SD card, which is hung off the graphics chip |
| 13:43.54 | CVirus | we'll never get any video on the freerunner ? |
| 13:44.09 | ScaredyCat | not no |
| 13:44.17 | AzalynHD | i'm sure it'll work somehow.. |
| 13:44.32 | ScaredyCat | isn't cb22 working on that? |
| 13:44.36 | CVirus | not now ? |
| 13:44.38 | CVirus | not no ? |
| 13:44.40 | SpeedEvil | ScaredyCat: no |
| 13:44.41 | ScaredyCat | not no... |
| 13:44.43 | ScaredyCat | yes |
| 13:44.46 | ScaredyCat | :) |
| 13:44.48 | SpeedEvil | ScaredyCat: he's working on low bitrate video |
| 13:44.58 | ScaredyCat | right |
| 13:45.01 | *** join/#openmoko mbuf (n=shakthim@61.16.248.242) |
| 13:45.17 | SpeedEvil | ScaredyCat: which is a seperate problem. Scaling small video can work. |
| 13:45.23 | CVirus | can i has video on me freirunnar ? |
| 13:45.32 | CIA-43 | freesmartphone.org: 03jluebbe * r3e0c1367400e 10/setup.py: Install the modules directory |
| 13:45.40 | SpeedEvil | Some sort of video, yes. |
| 13:45.47 | MetaMorfoziS | :DD |
| 13:45.54 | madwoota | video, one jpg at a time :P |
| 13:45.58 | CVirus | haha |
| 13:45.59 | SpeedEvil | The same speed of video as you might with a 400MHz GTA01 - no |
| 13:46.00 | ScaredyCat | who cares anyway, so long as we ge tthe lightsaber app |
| 13:46.10 | madwoota | whoosh! |
| 13:46.19 | AzalynHD | madwoota: that is a format you know... :| |
| 13:46.20 | AzalynHD | mjpeg |
| 13:46.29 | AzalynHD | it's the one used a lot on digital cameras |
| 13:46.34 | *** join/#openmoko lunartear (n=cayres@ip68-103-160-30.ks.ok.cox.net) |
| 13:46.34 | AzalynHD | my nikon uses it |
| 13:46.36 | *** join/#openmoko Ryback_ (n=ulisses@enlightenment/developer/ryback) |
| 13:46.48 | AzalynHD | it's high quality and the file-size is *massive* |
| 13:47.19 | madwoota | sorry, i retract my incorrect attempt at humour for not considering rare digressions of technicality |
| 13:47.30 | CVirus | rofl |
| 13:47.31 | AzalynHD | Yeah you better! |
| 13:47.47 | AzalynHD | I showed him. |
| 13:47.52 | AzalynHD | :P |
| 13:47.52 | madwoota | <-- pwned |
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| 13:48.43 | madwoota | video, one non-specific-static-image-format-usually-using-a-bitmap-style-rather-than-a-vector at a time |
| 13:48.46 | AzalynHD | what about lowering the quality of an hq video? |
| 13:48.50 | madwoota | just doesnt quite have the same ring |
| 13:48.52 | rwhitby | mwester: mokomakefile can build qtopia-x11 image, and you can now tell it to use the april-update branch ... |
| 13:49.12 | SpeedEvil | Azalyn: recoding will make it work, yes, at low res. |
| 13:49.37 | madwoota | oh wait, ringd is broken, must wait for gta03 :) |
| 13:49.42 | AzalynHD | I recall i got mp3's to play on my 486 with win98 and 8MB ram. the mp3 player essentially lowered the bitrate of the mp3. so it could play without any skipping. |
| 13:50.01 | AzalynHD | but the mp3 itself had high bitrate. |
| 13:50.02 | SpeedEvil | 486/75 cannot play mp3 |
| 13:50.11 | AzalynHD | it so can. |
| 13:50.13 | AzalynHD | i did it. |
| 13:50.14 | SpeedEvil | Err |
| 13:50.14 | mwester | rwhitby: qtopia-x11-image failed badly a couple days ago on HEAD, so I'll go try the april-update branch instead. (I was hoping I didn't have to do a complete rebuild, but that's probably not a bad idea in the grand scheme of things anyway). |
| 13:50.29 | madwoota | remembers doing mp3's on his 486 dx2/66 |
| 13:50.32 | SpeedEvil | Not at least when I tried it. |
| 13:50.35 | rwhitby | mwester: oh, qtopia-x11-image only works for gta02 as far as I know |
| 13:50.35 | AzalynHD | it was a 486 laptop |
| 13:50.35 | SpeedEvil | oh well. |
| 13:50.47 | mwester | rwhitby: Aaagh! :( |
| 13:50.49 | SpeedEvil | My 486 laptop would get about 75% throughput |
| 13:51.17 | madwoota | i remember overnight encodes for an album |
| 13:51.18 | SpeedEvil | of a 128K mp3 |
| 13:51.20 | madwoota | heh |
| 13:51.57 | AzalynHD | well anyways, my point was maybe the video could be lowered in quality on the fly. basically taking a high quality video, but rendering it in low quality. |
| 13:52.12 | AzalynHD | that way we wouldn't have to re-encode. |
| 13:52.20 | madwoota | you assume transcoding requires less cpu time than decoding? |
| 13:52.29 | mwester | Anyone have a qtopia image that works on the GTA01? |
| 13:52.51 | *** join/#openmoko Ryushin (i=proxy@windwalker.openinnovations.com) |
| 13:53.03 | AzalynHD | well, i don't think it's the cpu we're worried about.. it's that the video/gpu/whatever is shared with the sd card. |
| 13:53.16 | *** join/#openmoko ecraven (n=nex@plc31-103.linzag.net) |
| 13:53.20 | AzalynHD | the cpu itself is good. |
| 13:53.23 | ScaredyCat | ls |
| 13:53.34 | *** join/#openmoko abraxa__ (n=abraxa@pD95FD507.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 13:54.12 | SpeedEvil | madwoota: no - I mean transcode before |
| 13:54.46 | SpeedEvil | Azalyn: playing back at half resolution helps lots - but doesn't helo that much with decoding time |
| 13:55.11 | AzalynHD | SpeedEvil: but the cpu isn't shared is it? |
| 13:55.25 | zash | is it possible to make the gfx-thingy read directly from sd? |
| 13:55.26 | *** join/#openmoko mindCrime (n=chatzill@216.27.62.2) |
| 13:55.32 | SpeedEvil | zash: no |
| 13:55.44 | XorA | mwester: did you just ask me a question, I lost it usb on my machine seems to have just lost its magic smoke |
| 13:55.44 | zash | :( |
| 13:55.44 | SpeedEvil | zash: It isn't programmable that way. |
| 13:56.07 | AzalynHD | i know that it still means that when it pulls the data from the sd card.. it will use more of the bus than if it was transcoded.. (filesize will be bigger.. |
| 13:56.08 | AzalynHD | ) |
| 13:56.11 | AzalynHD | but yeah.. |
| 13:56.19 | AzalynHD | it's just one of many options i guess. |
| 13:56.41 | mwester | XorA: I was looking to build a qtopia image for the GTA01, and wondered if there is a way that is more correct than others. |
| 13:56.46 | CIA-43 | freesmartphone.org: 03jluebbe * rc7f83c3f696b 10/ousaged/ousaged: Import the correct controller |
| 13:57.14 | AzalynHD | zash: the gpu would have to support gpgpu capabilities i think.. which i seriously doubt it does... :| |
| 13:57.38 | AzalynHD | although it would be so awesome it if did. |
| 13:57.46 | mwester | rwhitby pointed me to the april branch, so I think that might resolve my build troubles for the qtopia X11 image. |
| 13:59.22 | ScaredyCat | where is this april branch of which you speak |
| 13:59.48 | mwester | Don't know. Step one is to find it. |
| 14:00.08 | ScaredyCat | can't see it in the mf |
| 14:00.11 | mwester | But there are only a limited number of places that branches can hide, so that shouldn't be too hard. |
| 14:01.53 | ScaredyCat | ... is it public yet? |
| 14:01.58 | rwhitby | starts a complete build from scratch using the new git repo |
| 14:02.05 | ScaredyCat | i thought XorA had some work to do |
| 14:02.12 | CIA-43 | freesmartphone.org: 03jluebbe * r2f02576532b5 10/odeviced/modules/ (helpers.py kernel26.py): Clean up sysfs filenames before using them as D-Bus paths |
| 14:02.18 | rwhitby | org.openmoko.april-update |
| 14:03.06 | rwhitby | I added a makefile var for it earlier today |
| 14:04.35 | *** join/#openmoko MarcOChapeau (n=mbarre@bgn92-4-82-238-213-101.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 14:05.22 | mwester | should remember to do "make update-makefile" *before* doing things the hard way. |
| 14:05.33 | ScaredyCat | really rwhitby? |
| 14:05.38 | ScaredyCat | I just updated the mf |
| 14:05.41 | ScaredyCat | can;t see it |
| 14:06.22 | *** join/#openmoko ccube (n=ccube@ssh.ccube.de) |
| 14:06.29 | *** join/#openmoko Blastur (i=Blastur@kr-lun-168-149-233-83.3.cust.bredband2.com) |
| 14:07.08 | rwhitby | OM_BRANCH |
| 14:07.15 | ScaredyCat | oh.. right |
| 14:07.29 | ScaredyCat | not specifically april update... |
| 14:07.33 | ScaredyCat | got you |
| 14:14.36 | ScaredyCat | XorA: is the april update going to become the new 'live' ? |
| 14:15.08 | XorA | april software update will become the god of software |
| 14:15.33 | ScaredyCat | it wont exist? |
| 14:15.47 | rwhitby | it will only exist if you have faith .... |
| 14:15.52 | stefan_schmidt | XorA: Especially as we already have may for some time now. ;) |
| 14:16.04 | stefan_schmidt | Debian release scheme |
| 14:16.18 | stefan_schmidt | We give you a month, but not the year. :) |
| 14:16.49 | XorA | Aprial isnt for 11 months |
| 14:17.05 | ScaredyCat | is that a new month? |
| 14:17.47 | rwhitby | yeah, comes after maarch |
| 14:17.56 | ScaredyCat | so is this just a snapshot then... |
| 14:18.03 | ScaredyCat | so build it once, move on |
| 14:20.11 | CIA-43 | freesmartphone.org: 03jluebbe * r8bb89a912163 10/setup.py: Adapt setup.py from odeviced |
| 14:20.11 | *** join/#openmoko Kt_ (n=Kirsat@96.243.196.167) |
| 14:21.25 | *** join/#openmoko rwhitby (n=rwhitby@nslu2-linux/rwhitby) |
| 14:25.52 | idarwin |  CVirus: whats GTA ? The G is probably for GSM, FIC makes other phones, the CDMA ones start with a C, ... |
| 14:26.14 | ScaredyCat | XorA: |
| 14:27.04 | CVirus | idarwin: i see |
| 14:27.48 | *** join/#openmoko polz_ (n=polz@cpe-213-157-253-90.dynamic.amis.net) |
| 14:29.41 | *** join/#openmoko woglinde (i=woglinde@e178075163.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 14:31.27 | broedge | it is strange, i have reproducable "no desktops" when i try to ipkg like some gtk apps upon the minimalist OM image of Angstroma780 |
| 14:31.27 | broedge | just the "wireless" icons appear |
| 14:31.29 | broedge | and in the terminal there is an error .. the syslog moment |
| 14:32.20 | *** join/#openmoko pyknite (n=pyknite@pub1.heig-vd.ch) |
| 14:33.38 | broedge | ok... kinda solved |
| 14:36.58 | broedge | finally.. seems there is a problem with the task-openmoko-ui on my clamshell. but this , second, time , a reinstall just brought it back with ther nice clock and everything |
| 14:37.10 | *** join/#openmoko cktakahasi (n=cktakaha@200.184.118.132) |
| 14:37.48 | broedge | the |
| 14:37.48 | broedge | may also be the reinstall of gtk+ and openmoko-today2 |
| 14:37.58 | *** join/#openmoko fsteinel (n=fsteinel@pD9FBBE96.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 14:41.50 | CIA-43 | openmoko: 03thomas * r4441 10/trunk/src/target/opkg/libopkg/libopkg.c: opkg: set callbacks before opkg_conf_init |
| 14:43.23 | *** join/#openmoko spydon (n=spydon@90-227-33-55-no42.tbcn.telia.com) |
| 14:43.42 | spydon | Anyone knows if the production has started? :) |
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| 14:50.14 | Kt_ | ohh productionnnn |
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| 15:17.17 | *** join/#openmoko fobos (n=fobos@78.90.88.244) |
| 15:19.39 | mjr | Incidentally, a guy here is fretting over not having enough gpu bandwidth on the freerunner to run scummvm properly. I think he's out of it and scumm should be ok - it's not like it's full screen video. How goes? Anyone tried? |
| 15:20.12 | dcordes_ | on the freerunner lol |
| 15:20.39 | dcordes_ | I guess you can run multiple scummvm instances on it at the same time |
| 15:20.42 | SpeedEvil | There is 8M/s bandwidth to the video card |
| 15:21.41 | *** join/#openmoko fenfir (n=fenfir@206.255.217.100) |
| 15:22.06 | Kamping_Kaiser | SpeedEvil, does that mean quake is an option or not? ;) |
| 15:22.21 | SpeedEvil | Kamping_Kaiser: not at 640*480 - 320*240 zoomed should be fine |
| 15:22.34 | abraxa__ | mjr: I'd think even the limited GPU bandwidth should be fine for ScummVM |
| 15:22.39 | Kamping_Kaiser | SpeedEvil, \o/ so going to try |
| 15:22.46 | Kamping_Kaiser | goes to sleep happy |
| 15:22.55 | SpeedEvil | 320*240*16 at 50% utilisation is 25fps |
| 15:25.07 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@194.213.48.99) |
| 15:25.33 | mjr | and ScaredyCat, if you want help tying someone to a railway if they make it hard to disable the on-screen keyboard when using an external one, I'm there |
| 15:28.55 | SpeedEvil | Me too! |
| 15:29.03 | woglinde | hehe |
| 15:29.07 | woglinde | pure raster |
| 15:29.21 | SpeedEvil | I'll bring some nice steak for a party. |
| 15:31.19 | SpeedEvil | I hate with a passion 'blue sky' UI types. |
| 15:31.46 | mjr | (I btw assume that scumm doesn't redraw the entire buffer all the time? :] ) |
| 15:32.02 | *** join/#openmoko Deubeuliou (n=david@AFontenayssB-151-1-5-217.w82-121.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 15:33.17 | raster | i'd hope it doesnt |
| 15:33.18 | raster | :) |
| 15:33.21 | mjr | needs to buy some rechargeable AAAs for the bt pad btw |
| 15:33.38 | *** join/#openmoko mortenlysgaard (n=mortenly@85.221.51.42) |
| 15:33.49 | SpeedEvil | mjr: you probably want eneloop/hybrio ones - that don't lose their charge rapidly |
| 15:34.51 | raster | SpeedEvil: rememebr than bandiwdht is not the only problem |
| 15:34.54 | ScaredyCat | wookie wookie |
| 15:34.59 | SpeedEvil | raster: I know |
| 15:35.02 | SpeedEvil | raster: also CPU |
| 15:35.02 | raster | at 50% utilisation u also lost 50% of your cpu |
| 15:35.04 | raster | :) |
| 15:35.12 | SpeedEvil | raster: at one point you expressed hopes that you could do DMA |
| 15:35.14 | raster | so its a bit nastier :( |
| 15:35.17 | SpeedEvil | raster: have these been dashed? |
| 15:35.18 | raster | yeah |
| 15:35.22 | raster | that was an abysmal failure |
| 15:35.25 | raster | yeah |
| 15:35.30 | SpeedEvil | raster: :/ |
| 15:35.52 | raster | 1. it was hopless for small regions (i expected as much that we'd need to put in a "if # of bytes to dma is < that X, then memcpy< otheriwse dma) |
| 15:36.03 | raster | that i expected as dma had setup costs |
| 15:36.08 | raster | BUT |
| 15:36.22 | raster | with large regions dma ended up 1/2 the speed of a memcpy |
| 15:36.28 | raster | AND it locked up the memory bus anyway |
| 15:36.33 | SpeedEvil | Ick. |
| 15:36.41 | raster | whihc was what we were trying to avoid |
| 15:36.51 | SpeedEvil | How is the DMA done - what port is it coming from. |
| 15:37.07 | SpeedEvil | I had a brief look and diddn't see a way to do DMA from GPIO |
| 15:37.14 | SpeedEvil | I guess I must have missed something |
| 15:37.46 | raster | its a memory -> memory dma on the soc |
| 15:37.50 | raster | as the glamo is memory mapped |
| 15:37.59 | SpeedEvil | Ah |
| 15:38.05 | SpeedEvil | It appears on the memory controller then? |
| 15:38.11 | raster | yes |
| 15:38.17 | SpeedEvil | That makes sense. |
| 15:38.21 | raster | i had hopes |
| 15:38.23 | raster | hopes dashed |
| 15:38.27 | raster | unhappy raster |
| 15:38.28 | raster | :( |
| 15:38.37 | *** join/#openmoko kdean06 (n=kdean06@fsf/member/kdean06) |
| 15:38.37 | raster | i would have been much less unhappy then |
| 15:38.55 | raster | withg the bandwidht limit - it'd just set an upper limit on image xfewrs up to vidoe ram |
| 15:39.10 | raster | but it wouldnt kill out cpu while we hammered pixels up as fast as possible |
| 15:39.19 | SpeedEvil | Does that impact reading from SD too? |
| 15:39.23 | raster | yes |
| 15:39.26 | SpeedEvil | Nasty. |
| 15:39.29 | raster | as SD is on the lgamo |
| 15:39.36 | raster | data to/from sd goes down the same bus as gfx |
| 15:39.51 | raster | something i actually utterly ignored until recently when the whole video playing thread came up |
| 15:39.57 | raster | it just made life worse |
| 15:40.09 | raster | but i was already thinking they were pretyt damn bad |
| 15:40.32 | raster | so i wasnt that shocked |
| 15:41.07 | mjr | "should've put the wifi behind glamo" |
| 15:41.09 | raster | i was not happy wiht vidoe memory separate form system ram on small system already |
| 15:41.21 | raster | as it basically means unless your gfx chip is so full featured it can do everyuthing itself |
| 15:41.27 | SpeedEvil | How hard is getting the video decoder working - if 'working' is to the extent of something as nasty as change to another VT and take over the whole screen while writing to a pipe to the glamo? |
| 15:41.42 | raster | you end up sooner or later doing software gfx |
| 15:41.46 | raster | to a greater or lesser extent |
| 15:41.53 | raster | and a vidoe bus always presents a limit |
| 15:41.58 | raster | hopefulyl not too bad of one |
| 15:42.08 | raster | on high-end hardware where the gpu can do pretty mnuch everything |
| 15:42.10 | mjr | cheers for SpeedEvil's question |
| 15:42.13 | raster | then the vidoe bus is almost moot |
| 15:42.18 | SpeedEvil | Roll on 6400. |
| 15:42.33 | raster | i'm all for gpus' that can do everything |
| 15:42.37 | raster | give me one and i'm happy |
| 15:42.38 | raster | :) |
| 15:42.46 | raster | but if u cant |
| 15:42.52 | raster | give me a uma system |
| 15:42.54 | raster | fb is in system ram |
| 15:43.04 | raster | write/read is ad memory bandwidth for the cpu |
| 15:43.08 | raster | nbh |
| 15:43.14 | raster | the 6400 has no advanced gfx |
| 15:43.17 | raster | simple 2d |
| 15:43.25 | raster | a bit better than glamo in 2d actually |
| 15:43.27 | raster | but still simple |
| 15:43.34 | SpeedEvil | But the 6410 is a simple upgrade |
| 15:43.36 | SpeedEvil | in principle |
| 15:43.45 | raster | it has limits od drawable sizes of 2048x2048 in hw |
| 15:43.45 | abraxa__ | raster: Will you be happy with the GTA04 CPU? |
| 15:43.53 | raster | so u need ot tile thigns in 204x wide/high units |
| 15:44.04 | SpeedEvil | Annoyingly I have to amke up a corporate fake website, so I can get docs from samsung. |
| 15:44.05 | raster | ot fall back to software for any destination drawable > 2048 in a dimension |
| 15:44.12 | SpeedEvil | for the sc64100 |
| 15:44.16 | SpeedEvil | for the sc6400 |
| 15:44.23 | raster | SpeedEvil: aah. 6410 - not that is another matter |
| 15:44.29 | mjr | 2048 pixels not really that limiting for a phone... |
| 15:44.30 | raster | the 3d gpu looks a lot better |
| 15:44.40 | raster | mjr: thats my point :) |
| 15:44.41 | AzalynHD | if the gta02 is a huge success, will the development of gta04 come about a little faster? |
| 15:44.41 | *** join/#openmoko MHazem (n=GoD@196.205.193.11) |
| 15:44.48 | raster | mjr: for a DESTINATION - definitely |
| 15:44.54 | *** join/#openmoko mibo-cz (n=mibo-cz@ip-89-102-134-143.karneval.cz) |
| 15:44.56 | SpeedEvil | Azalyn: I'd be surprised at under a year. |
| 15:44.58 | AzalynHD | because from gta01->gta02 it's taken a long time |
| 15:45.02 | raster | right now gta04 has gone back on hold |
| 15:45.06 | raster | and gta03 will be coming |
| 15:45.12 | raster | gta03 is gta02 minus glamo |
| 15:45.17 | SpeedEvil | raster: Ah. |
| 15:45.18 | raster | in a new case |
| 15:45.23 | AzalynHD | i thought gta03 would be a dev unit |
| 15:45.26 | AzalynHD | like the gta01 was |
| 15:45.32 | AzalynHD | like the linux kernel versioning model |
| 15:45.39 | raster | and a newer 2g+edge gsm module |
| 15:45.43 | SpeedEvil | Using the 2440? |
| 15:45.48 | raster | 2442 |
| 15:45.49 | raster | yes |
| 15:45.54 | mjr | edge, pfft |
| 15:45.58 | SpeedEvil | Exposing the camera bus might be an idea. |
| 15:45.59 | AzalynHD | what's 'glamo' ? |
| 15:46.05 | SpeedEvil | Azalyn: the accel chip |
| 15:46.06 | AzalynHD | the sd/gpu shared bus thing? |
| 15:46.07 | raster | so basically gta02 minus glamo basically |
| 15:46.12 | raster | plus camera |
| 15:46.13 | raster | sorry |
| 15:46.20 | CVirus | when steve shows up .. he has got alot to explain |
| 15:46.28 | SpeedEvil | raster: Interesting, thanks. |
| 15:46.31 | AzalynHD | wait.. so gta03 won't have the gpu? |
| 15:46.37 | raster | but this is all overe the shop now |
| 15:46.44 | mjr | AzalynHD, apparently it's more trouble than worth |
| 15:46.50 | raster | gta04 is being pushed futher back now into the "not the next thing" |
| 15:47.11 | broedge | NEO wont rise or fall with the crappy DVBT or skype ; hugh |
| 15:47.11 | broedge | buit i want a flipper game |
| 15:47.11 | broedge | but |
| 15:47.53 | raster | i was thinkign that gta04 was going well |
| 15:47.53 | rwhitby | I thought http://walkingice.twbbs.org/blog/wp-content/uploads/2008/04/gta03.JPG was gta03 |
| 15:48.01 | raster | but hey |
| 15:48.27 | raster | hahahahaah |
| 15:48.43 | mjr | would think it a bad idea to do a little incremental change in hardware at this point (gta03) :/ |
| 15:49.04 | raster | you will need to argue that with sean |
| 15:49.12 | raster | he 100% disagrees |
| 15:49.14 | *** join/#openmoko summatusmentis (n=summatus@71-215-232-75.mpls.qwest.net) |
| 15:49.17 | raster | dont look at me |
| 15:49.18 | rwhitby | <PROTECTED> |
| 15:49.23 | raster | i'm all for gta04 |
| 15:49.23 | *** join/#openmoko dbmoodb (n=david@unaffiliated/dbmoodb) |
| 15:49.24 | SpeedEvil | looks at raster. |
| 15:49.31 | dbmoodb | well today is the 17th |
| 15:49.34 | raster | our gta02 is built on ancient board and hw and chips |
| 15:49.34 | AzalynHD | isn't there an alternative gpu that would be better suited? |
| 15:49.37 | dbmoodb | has it gone out yet |
| 15:49.39 | raster | it need a radical revamp |
| 15:49.44 | raster | to something modern |
| 15:49.53 | SpeedEvil | Azalyn: not really |
| 15:49.54 | raster | AzalynHD: none |
| 15:49.54 | AzalynHD | to replace the glamo, instead of just tossing out the idea altogether? |
| 15:49.59 | rwhitby | dbmoodb: yeah, we've all got one already |
| 15:50.04 | AzalynHD | hm |
| 15:50.09 | raster | AzalynHD: any gpu that is vaguely nice is combined on an soc |
| 15:50.10 | dbmoodb | usb graphics card ? |
| 15:50.14 | *** join/#openmoko imcsk8 (n=ichavero@148.229.1.11) |
| 15:50.15 | raster | so you choose soc, not gpu |
| 15:50.17 | SpeedEvil | Azalyn: the idea is nice - if there was a suitable open, low-power small chip |
| 15:50.22 | SpeedEvil | Azalyn: there isn't really |
| 15:50.29 | raster | yeah |
| 15:50.37 | raster | ny that are there are also pretty weak |
| 15:50.40 | dbmoodb | ... SpeedEvil --> do the gpu stuff off site |
| 15:50.46 | AzalynHD | so the sd controller is on the same system on chip as the gpu? |
| 15:50.51 | dbmoodb | render farm / render from your home computer |
| 15:51.02 | SpeedEvil | Azalyn: no - not this one |
| 15:51.07 | SpeedEvil | Azalyn: it's off-chip |
| 15:51.12 | mjr | Yes, gta02 shows its age in several things. That's why I'd think you'd want your next phone not to show its age already when in planning... |
| 15:51.17 | *** join/#openmoko apol (n=apol@84.78.178.63) |
| 15:51.19 | AzalynHD | so then why is the sd bus shared? |
| 15:51.24 | SpeedEvil | Azalyn: and it connects the SoC to the SD as well as being the GPU |
| 15:51.25 | AzalynHD | with the gpu? |
| 15:51.40 | SpeedEvil | Azalyn: because the wifi is connected where GTA01 had the SD |
| 15:51.51 | dbmoodb | they didn't think it through --- |
| 15:51.59 | SpeedEvil | Anyone got a broken GTA01? |
| 15:52.03 | AzalynHD | hm.. |
| 15:52.09 | dbmoodb | SpeedEvil: if i turn off that wifi and use my own is that ok then ? |
| 15:52.10 | SpeedEvil | I want to try putting wifi in. |
| 15:52.19 | SpeedEvil | cmb: no - the wires are not tehre |
| 15:52.43 | AzalynHD | so can't gta03 just 'fix' the issues with the sd being shared, instead of just tossing out the gpu altogether.. |
| 15:53.06 | SpeedEvil | Azalyn: the GPU is in many ways a negative |
| 15:53.11 | AzalynHD | why? |
| 15:53.18 | SpeedEvil | Azalyn: at least as it is currently configured. |
| 15:53.27 | CVirus | SpeedEvil: where did you get the wireless module from ? |
| 15:53.30 | SpeedEvil | Azalyn: because it's so limited and hard to work with. |
| 15:53.37 | SpeedEvil | CVirus: dealextrem.com |
| 15:53.41 | AzalynHD | well, that's what i'm saying, why don't they 'fix' it in gta03 instead of just throwing it out |
| 15:53.48 | SpeedEvil | s/em./eme./ |
| 15:54.04 | CVirus | thanks |
| 15:54.09 | SpeedEvil | Azalyn: the fixes cannot be made as they are fundamental to the chip |
| 15:54.17 | SpeedEvil | CVirus: it's just a shaved-down USB key though |
| 15:54.25 | SpeedEvil | Azalyn: the GPU chip |
| 15:54.36 | *** join/#openmoko pyknite (n=pyknite@pub1.heig-vd.ch) |
| 15:54.44 | AzalynHD | could a faster cpu do it better with software rendering, than this gpu can do? |
| 15:55.18 | broedge | does wifi run on the neo, when you plug a external prism2 stick in client /host usb mode? |
| 15:55.23 | AzalynHD | even a limited gpu can be useful.. unless it's so bad that even software rendering would be better.. :\ |
| 15:55.43 | *** join/#openmoko janneg (n=janne@tichy.grunau.be) |
| 15:55.46 | broedge | ah k |
| 15:55.47 | raster | one problem is the vga screen |
| 15:55.51 | dbmoodb | broedge: it has no reason not to |
| 15:55.56 | dbmoodb | i plan on doing so |
| 15:55.59 | raster | filling a vga screen full of pixels is 4x the daya most phones deal with |
| 15:56.09 | rwhitby | SpeedEvil: I have two broken GTA01's, but OpenMoko wants them back |
| 15:56.10 | raster | err data |
| 15:56.26 | broedge | yes but DID someone test it? any chipset lists? |
| 15:56.28 | raster | so imagine u went from 400mhz to 100mhz |
| 15:56.29 | SpeedEvil | Azalyn: in many senses, no GPU would be better |
| 15:56.30 | *** join/#openmoko DerCorny (n=corny@toronto233.server4you.de) |
| 15:56.32 | raster | for software rendering |
| 15:56.45 | raster | no gpu simplifies things a lot |
| 15:56.49 | raster | leaves it to software |
| 15:57.07 | raster | removes a complicted driver for what is not a veryt powerful chip |
| 15:57.34 | raster | the glamo would hve been good |
| 15:57.36 | AzalynHD | well... using 300MHz for software rendering isn't a big deal.. unless you're multitasking. |
| 15:57.41 | raster | 5 years ago |
| 15:57.52 | raster | azx 100mhz |
| 15:57.55 | raster | not losing 100mhz |
| 15:57.56 | broedge | !glamo |
| 15:57.57 | raster | down to 100mhz |
| 15:58.06 | AzalynHD | that's what i said |
| 15:58.18 | raster | no |
| 15:58.21 | AzalynHD | yeah. |
| 15:58.24 | raster | thats spending 100% of your cpu doing rendering |
| 15:58.33 | raster | it has 4x the output data to generate |
| 15:58.49 | raster | compared to your average qvga phone or pda |
| 15:59.03 | AzalynHD | you said it goes down to 100... how is that 100% ? |
| 15:59.19 | *** join/#openmoko mortenlysgaard (n=mortenly@85.221.51.42) |
| 16:00.08 | raster | pause |
| 16:00.18 | *** join/#openmoko bobesponja (n=bobespon@190.42.15.27) |
| 16:00.19 | raster | when doing software rendering you use the cpu to do it |
| 16:00.29 | AzalynHD | yes i know.. |
| 16:00.35 | raster | that means all display related stuff for output is consuming cpu cycles |
| 16:00.52 | dbmoodb | dude just outsource the rendering |
| 16:00.59 | unknown_lamer | raster: so if dma stalls the memory controller ... does the cpu at least not spin at full power during that time? |
| 16:01.00 | SpeedEvil | dmb: to what? |
| 16:01.02 | dbmoodb | -- i dont' see the issue just add a usb graphics card |
| 16:01.05 | raster | that means to do something like redraw a window contents will consume all cpu |
| 16:01.06 | dbmoodb | -- have an addon |
| 16:01.07 | SpeedEvil | dbmoodb: hahahahahah |
| 16:01.12 | raster | (except for timeslices dished out ot other processes) |
| 16:01.13 | SpeedEvil | dmb: you can't do that |
| 16:01.16 | dbmoodb | in a few years / now soon we can do it |
| 16:01.20 | dbmoodb | /dev/usbgraphics |
| 16:01.24 | SpeedEvil | dbmoodb: they don' support |
| 16:01.25 | AzalynHD | the usb is 1.1 |
| 16:01.28 | raster | if you have to product 4x the output in pixels you have 4 time the work |
| 16:01.28 | AzalynHD | :| |
| 16:01.32 | SpeedEvil | dbmoodb: LCDs for one |
| 16:01.35 | dbmoodb | what ? |
| 16:01.36 | dbmoodb | 1.1 |
| 16:01.41 | *** join/#openmoko holycow (n=new@mail.wjsgroup.com) |
| 16:01.42 | raster | (ok i lie - not quite - we can debate that though. its a pretty good rule of thumb) |
| 16:01.42 | AzalynHD | i think so |
| 16:01.43 | dbmoodb | WTF |
| 16:01.45 | dbmoodb | no |
| 16:01.46 | AzalynHD | isn't it? |
| 16:01.51 | dbmoodb | i hope not |
| 16:01.52 | raster | that means your average phone whihc these days is qvga |
| 16:01.53 | SpeedEvil | It is USB 1.1 |
| 16:01.53 | AzalynHD | i believe that's what i saw |
| 16:01.55 | raster | or 1/4 the pixels |
| 16:01.56 | dbmoodb | or i will backout of my group |
| 16:01.59 | AzalynHD | on their site |
| 16:02.03 | raster | can get 4x the framerate |
| 16:02.04 | dbmoodb | ok cya |
| 16:02.06 | AzalynHD | what group? |
| 16:02.11 | dbmoodb | local group |
| 16:02.13 | raster | or with the same, use 1.4 of its resource if it was the same cpu |
| 16:02.14 | dbmoodb | buying |
| 16:02.20 | dbmoodb | i'm not buying if it is usb 1.1 |
| 16:02.23 | raster | unknown_lamer: there is no dma |
| 16:02.31 | AzalynHD | it's not a big deal. |
| 16:02.40 | dbmoodb | how the hell can i get data onto the thing then ? |
| 16:02.48 | abraxa__ | dbmoodb: WiFi/BT |
| 16:02.52 | dbmoodb | no |
| 16:03.02 | AzalynHD | why not? |
| 16:03.02 | dbmoodb | that is not an answer that is an excuse |
| 16:03.07 | AzalynHD | wireless is better |
| 16:03.14 | dbmoodb | than usb 2 ? |
| 16:03.16 | dbmoodb | oh ffs |
| 16:03.17 | CIA-43 | freesmartphone.org: 03jluebbe * rc1b73d7b4bc3 10/src/zhone: Allow enabling and disabling fullscreen using options |
| 16:03.19 | raster | dmdata still goes on |
| 16:03.22 | raster | just not that fast |
| 16:03.28 | SpeedEvil | dbmoodb: everything is a compromise. |
| 16:03.29 | raster | usb1.1 isnt a bottleneck tho |
| 16:03.37 | raster | i can only scp onto it at about 300-400kb/sec |
| 16:03.44 | raster | half the usb bbandwidth |
| 16:04.00 | raster | fs io and cpu for ssh and other stuff limit it anyway |
| 16:04.04 | SpeedEvil | raster: that's quite irreelevant - the valid test is curl/... |
| 16:04.04 | rwhitby | wonders what the throughput of manual sd card swapping is ... |
| 16:04.06 | dbmoodb | where does it say usb 1.1 |
| 16:04.22 | mjr | dbmoodb, doesn't matter where it says. It is. |
| 16:04.22 | SpeedEvil | raster: as scp does compression |
| 16:04.28 | mjr | if that's a dealbreaker for you, too bad |
| 16:04.49 | rwhitby | no, we should halt productin cause it's a dealbreaker for dbmoodb! |
| 16:04.52 | dbmoodb | well can i get rsync |
| 16:04.55 | dbmoodb | no rwhitby |
| 16:05.03 | AzalynHD | WiFI is 54 Mbit/s |
| 16:05.08 | AzalynHD | that's not fast enough for you? |
| 16:05.08 | dbmoodb | mmm rsync on a phone who would have thaught it |
| 16:05.11 | unknown_lamer | raster: I thought you tried using dma but discovered that it stalled the memory controller? |
| 16:05.40 | AzalynHD | dbmoodb: personally i'm planning not just to use rsync |
| 16:05.43 | AzalynHD | but ssh |
| 16:05.56 | AzalynHD | and many other typical desktop/workstation stuff |
| 16:06.00 | AzalynHD | :) |
| 16:06.10 | dbmoodb | ssh ? |
| 16:06.13 | dbmoodb | nar too slow |
| 16:06.16 | AzalynHD | the freerunner is the begining of "phone as a portable computer" |
| 16:06.16 | dbmoodb | duplicity |
| 16:06.20 | AzalynHD | what? |
| 16:06.27 | dbmoodb | -- gpg it and then open it later |
| 16:06.27 | AzalynHD | ssh would run fine on it |
| 16:06.35 | AzalynHD | ... |
| 16:06.38 | dbmoodb | well i would rather be at full speed |
| 16:06.49 | abraxa__ | We all would :) |
| 16:07.03 | SpeedEvil | dbmoodb: We all would like it to have the latest shiny hardware in. |
| 16:07.06 | raster | SpeedEvil: i know. :) |
| 16:07.20 | rwhitby | I want dull hardware and shiny software ... |
| 16:07.20 | SpeedEvil | dbmoodb: for various reasons, we can't have this - cost, availability, openness, ... |
| 16:07.22 | raster | dbmoodb: it is definitely usb1.1 |
| 16:07.24 | dbmoodb | k |
| 16:07.25 | AzalynHD | with usb2.0 though.. you could do a usb gpu :) |
| 16:07.32 | AzalynHD | with an external monitor |
| 16:07.39 | dbmoodb | which is what i was saying |
| 16:07.40 | AzalynHD | the phone could be docked and 'become' a pc |
| 16:07.46 | dbmoodb | !docked |
| 16:07.48 | dbmoodb | no no n on on o no no |
| 16:07.54 | dbmoodb | we don't need to dock |
| 16:07.56 | raster | AzalynHD: in theory 54mbit - in practice u likely will see 10mbit... is usb1.1 speeds anyway |
| 16:08.01 | dbmoodb | just walk into the room |
| 16:08.21 | raster | unknown_lamer: did try. also it was slower than memcpy() |
| 16:08.24 | dbmoodb | Azalyn try getting any better over usb 2 to a phone |
| 16:08.53 | AzalynHD | honestly, i won't mind if you guys ditch the gpu for GTA03... |
| 16:09.04 | AzalynHD | but, it would be nice to have a keyboard :) |
| 16:09.14 | AzalynHD | since you mentioned the casing will be new. |
| 16:09.17 | unknown_lamer | Azalyn: gta04 has no gpu ... except the SoC has awesome graphics stuff builtin |
| 16:09.30 | dbmoodb | ... Azalyn foldable usb ones are $!2 |
| 16:09.32 | dbmoodb | 12* |
| 16:09.41 | dbmoodb | why do you want a keyboard on it |
| 16:09.53 | AzalynHD | yes but having it built-in makes it more usable and portable |
| 16:10.02 | AzalynHD | a hidden keyboard would be nice. |
| 16:10.06 | AzalynHD | like a sliding one |
| 16:10.06 | dbmoodb | ........... no |
| 16:10.13 | dbmoodb | dude plug and play |
| 16:10.14 | AzalynHD | ................... yes |
| 16:10.27 | AzalynHD | that doesn't matter |
| 16:10.31 | dbmoodb | ... |
| 16:10.33 | *** join/#openmoko zipola (n=zipola@zip.kortex.jyu.fi) |
| 16:10.34 | AzalynHD | carrying around additional accessories sucks |
| 16:10.38 | AzalynHD | especially a keyboard |
| 16:10.42 | dbmoodb | ... the future is touch |
| 16:10.44 | raster | AzalynHD: kbd is not happening. not for gta03 |
| 16:10.57 | AzalynHD | i'd rather carry a usb camera than a usb keyboard around. |
| 16:11.09 | SpeedEvil | Camera is _trivial_ to integrate |
| 16:11.14 | broedge | AzalynHD yea or the BT ones? i prefer strokes |
| 16:11.14 | raster | unknown_lamer: the 6400 has good gfx. not awesome. the 6410 tho - on paper, looks much more awesome. |
| 16:11.17 | *** join/#openmoko noriX (i=noriX@csbnc0001.207.clanserver4u.de) |
| 16:11.17 | broedge | those thumbboards make freakish orthopedia, better learn to play the trombone |
| 16:11.17 | SpeedEvil | It's a 10m*10mm package at most |
| 16:11.22 | SpeedEvil | with a hole in the case |
| 16:11.23 | AzalynHD | raster: is gta03 just going to be removing stuff, or is anything actually being added... :| |
| 16:12.05 | dbmoodb | Azalyn they are putting windows back on it like with the olpc |
| 16:12.07 | AzalynHD | and the future is SO not touch. no touchscreen in the world will ever beat out a blackberry keyboard. |
| 16:12.10 | unknown_lamer | raster: aren't they pin compatible? |
| 16:12.21 | raster | AzalynHD: new case, add camera. remove glamo, replace gsm+gprs with gsm+edge |
| 16:12.21 | dbmoodb | you can never have enough of a good thing |
| 16:12.22 | dbmoodb | Azalyn want to make a bet |
| 16:12.23 | *** join/#openmoko buz (n=buz@84-72-53-89.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 16:12.26 | AzalynHD | if you want it to be portable, make it a slider keyboard.. |
| 16:12.32 | raster | unknown_lamer: they claim to be |
| 16:12.37 | dbmoodb | .... usb keyboard ... |
| 16:12.50 | unknown_lamer | raster: you should push to get rid of the useless mpswhatever and use a 6410 instead :-) |
| 16:12.51 | *** join/#openmoko larry_jr (n=Larry@200.184.118.132) |
| 16:12.52 | raster | unknown_lamer: but right now no specs on the 3d chip as to how to program it exactly and if we can even do open drivers |
| 16:13.01 | dbmoodb | Azalyn what is the diff you are loosing screen to a keyboard that could be external |
| 16:13.10 | raster | unknown_lamer: mps? |
| 16:13.11 | AzalynHD | usb keyboards are the fail. i'll use them for my gta02 when i get it since i won't have a choice. |
| 16:13.13 | summatusmentis | raster: I thought gta03 was not happening? |
| 16:13.18 | unknown_lamer | raster: the mpu |
| 16:13.20 | AzalynHD | no you're not losing screen |
| 16:13.21 | raster | summatusmentis: its back on now. |
| 16:13.22 | SpeedEvil | Azalyn: BT keyboard |
| 16:13.27 | mjr | bt keyboard > usb keyboard |
| 16:13.28 | AzalynHD | you don't understand what a slider is. |
| 16:13.37 | dbmoodb | i do |
| 16:13.39 | summatusmentis | raster: why? why was it ever off in the first place? |
| 16:13.43 | SpeedEvil | Azalyn: sliders have horrid packaging implications. |
| 16:13.48 | raster | unknown_lamer: oh that - thats been axed - or was, then gta04 went onto "deep freeze" mode and will now be positponed to make room for gta03 |
| 16:13.49 | *** join/#openmoko krau (n=cktakaha@200.184.118.132) |
| 16:13.53 | AzalynHD | http://www.cellphones.ca/news/upload/ultra_smart_f700_1.jpg |
| 16:13.56 | raster | (again) |
| 16:14.14 | raster | AzalynHD: no kbd happening for gta03. |
| 16:14.15 | AzalynHD | SpeedEvil: packaging? |
| 16:14.17 | mjr | wants gta04 :I |
| 16:14.19 | *** join/#openmoko andrunko (n=andrunko@200.184.118.132) |
| 16:14.20 | AzalynHD | raster: yeah i know. |
| 16:14.30 | AzalynHD | i'm just debating the value of it with dbmoodb. |
| 16:14.40 | raster | unknown_lamer: and actually i suggested putting in a 2nd 6400 instead of an mpu |
| 16:14.42 | unknown_lamer | raster: ah ... the gta04 looked nice except for that. Please tell me the 03 is going to have a 6400 or 6410 at least |
| 16:14.47 | summatusmentis | wants a Zaurus 3200 made smaller, and with CDMA :) |
| 16:14.48 | *** join/#openmoko lsobral (n=sobral@200.184.118.132) |
| 16:14.48 | raster | hell if we were put9otng in 2 cpus - make it 2 6400's |
| 16:14.50 | unknown_lamer | raster: ha I noticed the ridiculous diagram |
| 16:14.53 | dbmoodb | Azalyn the future is mind body interface |
| 16:15.09 | dbmoodb | -- eye patch hearing air bt head set etc. |
| 16:15.12 | raster | when in full-power mode devote 1 6400 to run a separate linux instance and be a dedicated "software gpu" |
| 16:15.12 | raster | :) |
| 16:15.13 | XorA | still advocates a raster in every device |
| 16:15.18 | unknown_lamer | raster: but oh no the 6400 uses a few mW in low power instead of a few uW |
| 16:15.26 | raster | and if u dont need the crazy software gpu |
| 16:15.27 | AzalynHD | dbmoodb: ok.. :| |
| 16:15.31 | raster | use the other linux os to run anything u like |
| 16:15.38 | dbmoodb | you know they can do this stuff today |
| 16:15.38 | raster | that 6400 has no perpipherals attached |
| 16:15.40 | raster | except lcd |
| 16:15.41 | dbmoodb | and you can buy it |
| 16:15.46 | AzalynHD | you laugh but i agree with that.. but i still don't think touch will beat the blackberry. :) |
| 16:15.50 | raster | and a interrupt line to the "main" 6400 |
| 16:16.00 | raster | so it can come up and down ultra-fast |
| 16:16.01 | AzalynHD | i like sliders because it's like the best of both worlds |
| 16:16.02 | dbmoodb | ................ if i think it does how that no the win ? |
| 16:16.05 | mwester | is rather intruiged by the dual-cpu idea.... |
| 16:16.10 | AzalynHD | or dual-flip phones like the samsung ones. |
| 16:16.18 | dbmoodb | snap |
| 16:16.20 | raster | it woudlnt be an smp system |
| 16:16.24 | dbmoodb | --- they crap |
| 16:16.25 | raster | as u dont have cache coherency |
| 16:16.25 | AzalynHD | with dual cpu's you could dedicate one to software rendering |
| 16:16.26 | dbmoodb | crack* |
| 16:16.28 | raster | but run 1 linux kernels |
| 16:16.32 | AzalynHD | would be neat |
| 16:16.37 | raster | and one just is brought up as a slave buy the main one |
| 16:16.39 | dbmoodb | next phone is really an eee |
| 16:16.41 | raster | could lead to interesting possibilities |
| 16:16.48 | raster | an soc chip is not that costly as such |
| 16:16.54 | raster | the problem is we'd need a 2nd pmu too |
| 16:17.00 | raster | and it's eat up board space |
| 16:17.06 | SpeedEvil | raster: and DRAM |
| 16:17.11 | raster | yeah |
| 16:17.18 | roh | and power. |
| 16:17.19 | raster | tho the first 16m of the 6400 is dual-ported |
| 16:17.25 | raster | as such... |
| 16:17.33 | raster | i was wonderign if we can hook another 6400 to the first 16m |
| 16:17.42 | raster | its an i9nterestign idea |
| 16:17.43 | mwester | ooh |
| 16:17.45 | roh | i'd rather want to have 200h standby than 3d ;) |
| 16:17.56 | raster | roh: just keep it suspended most of the time |
| 16:18.00 | dbmoodb | how much is a graphics card an old one ? |
| 16:18.03 | raster | it doesnt have to run @ full power |
| 16:18.08 | dbmoodb | we could hack some |
| 16:18.13 | raster | when asleep its asleep too |
| 16:18.19 | raster | so u wont suffer too badly |
| 16:18.41 | roh | raster thats only part of it. also the power-usage in regular 'is clocked, gets used' needs to get down. |
| 16:18.44 | raster | but the mpu ewas another 16bit soc anyway |
| 16:18.45 | raster | as such |
| 16:18.52 | *** part/#openmoko dbmoodb (n=david@unaffiliated/dbmoodb) |
| 16:19.05 | raster | roh: sure - but thats only when u have it on |
| 16:19.17 | roh | raster e.g. on my notebook that ati radeon eats more than 30% of the total power consumption alone. in idle (2d only, blitting a bit) |
| 16:19.19 | raster | but it does solve the open gpu problem |
| 16:19.55 | raster | it can dynclock itself probably too |
| 16:19.57 | roh | raster its on _lots_ of time. everytime you log a gps coord. every time you answer a jabber message. |
| 16:19.57 | raster | as much as it likes |
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| 16:20.36 | roh | raster but yeah.. lets wait and see what the soc vendors come up with next... could be hell freezes over and its not all crap in the next gen ;) |
| 16:20.47 | raster | who knows |
| 16:20.47 | raster | :) |
| 16:21.10 | raster | i woudl love something that doesnt suck |
| 16:21.12 | raster | anc is open |
| 16:21.18 | raster | doesn thave to be major top of the line |
| 16:21.24 | raster | but mid-to-high |
| 16:21.27 | SpeedEvil | Low power too. |
| 16:21.42 | XorA | raster: time to line all sales and marketing guys against the wall and shoot the lot of them |
| 16:21.45 | raster | the 6410 seems to fit the bill - on paper |
| 16:21.48 | roh | btw.. my x1600 in my t60p doesnt suck as hard anymore.. xorg-driver-ati (free driver which uses atombios) does work better and better every week i recompile the git tree of it and mesa/drm |
| 16:21.49 | raster | except its open status is unknown |
| 16:21.53 | XorA | once the dept whos job it is to invent crap is gone |
| 16:21.53 | AzalynHD | which are the vendors that are known to do open designs? |
| 16:22.00 | mwester | is in sales, and now fears for his life... |
| 16:22.20 | roh | so it took less than a year for getting more usable graphics drivers by only released documentation |
| 16:22.22 | rwhitby | ponders a salesman who also hacks kernel code ... |
| 16:22.36 | roh | more usable than fglrx or any other binary driver ive seen or used |
| 16:22.45 | unknown_lamer | roh: oh thank god for AMD I was geting worried there that I'd have to stockpile radeon 9100s |
| 16:22.51 | mwester | notes that there are technical folks in sales whos job it is to keep salespeople honest. |
| 16:23.15 | roh | unknown_lamer yeah.. now nvidia is in serious trouble |
| 16:23.34 | roh | the can't do that step that intel and now amd took. they still have too much sgi IP in there |
| 16:24.12 | XorA | a working ATI, I never thought Id ever hear about one of them |
| 16:24.14 | AzalynHD | well.. even opening all docs that isn't related to SGI IP would be fine. |
| 16:24.14 | unknown_lamer | roh: doubtful since they have the OMGGAMEZ crowd or something ... unless things have changed (which maybe ... I stopped caring when everything because closed / well then bzflag runs at 76fps @ 1920x1200 so I;m happy) |
| 16:24.31 | AzalynHD | besides, i honestly think nvidia is bullshitting, i doubt they ever even *asked* sgi. |
| 16:24.41 | AzalynHD | SGI has supported opensource projects before. |
| 16:24.45 | AzalynHD | and they use linux. |
| 16:25.15 | AzalynHD | of course... SGI hates nvidia for the many employees that left SGI to work for nvidia... at least from what i heard... :| |
| 16:25.25 | AzalynHD | there's supposedly this grudge between the two. |
| 16:26.05 | mjr | personally I'm not all too convinced nvidia will be in too much trouble for being the most closed contender around |
| 16:26.16 | mjr | I wish they were |
| 16:26.32 | *** join/#openmoko greentux (n=lemke@Z41a5.z.pppool.de) |
| 16:26.46 | AzalynHD | and given that SGI was on it's death throws last i heard, and is using ATI GPU's in their machines... the AMD/ATI open-sourcing is actually a GOOD thing for SGI, especially since any damage done to nvidia might help SGI a bundle. |
| 16:27.24 | mjr | hasn't sgi been dying for years on end though? |
| 16:27.34 | roh | well.. lets wait. but the gain in stability alone may get even more people to want free drivers. |
| 16:27.35 | mjr | *shrug* |
| 16:27.39 | AzalynHD | yeah, i think they emerged from chapter 11 recently though. |
| 16:27.45 | emilis_info | what is sgi selling today? |
| 16:27.46 | AzalynHD | which was some good news at least |
| 16:27.48 | AzalynHD | no more debt |
| 16:27.54 | roh | mjr them dying was the reason for nvidia being founded at all |
| 16:28.01 | AzalynHD | emilis_info: the same old crap unfortunately |
| 16:28.31 | AzalynHD | I don't understand why SGI didn't attack the mass market IT industry... |
| 16:28.48 | XorA | Azalyn: sales and marketing guys :-) |
| 16:28.49 | AzalynHD | given all the hoopla about 3D these days, SGI could have been bigger than IBM. |
| 16:29.06 | unknown_lamer | Symbolics too :-( They had fancier 3D a few years before SGI |
| 16:29.22 | *** join/#openmoko k-s[WORK] (n=gustavo@201.82.9.119) |
| 16:29.30 | AzalynHD | they were too attached to the specialization sector, they didn't realize that *everything* was going mass-market. |
| 16:29.38 | unknown_lamer | but SGI and Symbolics suffered similar fates -- turns out you can't make your own hardware (processors and all) when the commodity hardware hits a certain point |
| 16:29.52 | unknown_lamer | one day it was like oops intel has lots of money now CRUSH ALL OTHERS |
| 16:29.53 | AzalynHD | and that the age of the 30 thousand dollar computer was starting to fade. |
| 16:30.27 | AzalynHD | unknown_lamer: yeah but POWER/PowerPC and SPARC survived. |
| 16:30.32 | AzalynHD | so that wasn't the problem |
| 16:30.40 | AzalynHD | see how Sun reinvented SPARC with the T1 |
| 16:30.51 | AzalynHD | with the whole energy-efficiency thing for cost-savings. |
| 16:31.10 | unknown_lamer | Azalyn: IBM is the only reason power lived |
| 16:31.29 | unknown_lamer | Azalyn: and I bet sparc only lived by chance ... Sun held out the longest |
| 16:31.41 | unknown_lamer | damn capitalism we should all form worker coops and live happily ever after not caring about profit |
| 16:31.50 | AzalynHD | MIPS is one of the most powerful architectures out there even to this day, there's a lot of options for them to revamp it, but now no one has the money for that. |
| 16:31.56 | AzalynHD | So it's only going to stay in embeded. |
| 16:32.51 | AzalynHD | last i heard they couldn't make it faster because they had reached too high a transistor count, they'd have to make a new core microarchitecture. |
| 16:33.02 | unknown_lamer | hrm I need to figure out how to package clisp now |
| 16:33.16 | AzalynHD | It's a shame because I like SGI. |
| 16:33.19 | unknown_lamer | there is a terrible problem -- the last build stage requires that you run the compiled base lisp system |
| 16:33.32 | AzalynHD | And I think it's a shame that RISC lost out to those rich x86 hustlers. |
| 16:33.55 | AzalynHD | I would love to see a revival. heh |
| 16:33.57 | unknown_lamer | I can manually build packages but ... no automated buildhost unless there is a standard way to transfer stuff over to an emulator, run code there, and then suck it back over |
| 16:34.06 | AzalynHD | SGI could do well to learn from Apple. |
| 16:34.16 | roh | risc didnt loose |
| 16:34.32 | roh | but it was the same as wrong as cisc the truth is somewhere in the grey middle |
| 16:34.51 | AzalynHD | And I think the SGI brand name still carries enough weight to totally kill Apple in graphic design workstations if SGI would just go mass-market already and stop trying to rebuild the specialized sector. |
| 16:35.02 | roh | and all cpus we use today in desktoÃops, servers or notebooks are ri cores with some 'microcode' anyways |
| 16:35.09 | AzalynHD | yes i know |
| 16:35.17 | roh | so its cisc only from the microcode-api outside up |
| 16:35.20 | AzalynHD | they do like a cisc->risc translation |
| 16:35.37 | AzalynHD | AMD opterons usually allow you to code to the risc core directly |
| 16:35.42 | roh | partial. some cisc commands are really there in hw (because its easy, and faszer that way) |
| 16:35.43 | AzalynHD | k8-risc it's called i think |
| 16:36.16 | AzalynHD | but with AMD64, didn't AMD deprecate some cisc crap? |
| 16:36.24 | AzalynHD | to make the 64bit side even more risc-like? |
| 16:36.59 | roh | a bit. but lots is convention, with optional downward compat. |
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| 16:37.16 | roh | you know.. this win32 world will still take some time to adapt ;) |
| 16:37.32 | roh | not everybody can just press the recompile-my-universe button that easy |
| 16:37.34 | emilis_info | hmm |
| 16:38.06 | AzalynHD | if they ever remove the 32bit support, we could finally have a more elegant arch. |
| 16:38.25 | roh | eeeh.. nope |
| 16:38.38 | roh | actually i run most stuff 32bit myself. with reason. its faster that way. |
| 16:38.40 | AzalynHD | any 32bit support could always be emulated.. i imagine emulating 32bit-x86 in software on top of 64bit-x86 can't be too hard at all. |
| 16:38.53 | roh | less registers to save on every context switch. less ram usage etc... |
| 16:39.02 | AzalynHD | roh: i mean once 64bit has taken over. |
| 16:39.19 | unknown_lamer | hrm I wonder ... has anyone used scratchbox to cross compile for the openmoko distro? |
| 16:39.28 | roh | 64bit only makes sense when you need that big registers for handling addresses that long, or managing ram >3-4gbyte in ONE app. |
| 16:39.44 | roh | unknown_lamer no. its not supported afaik |
| 16:40.33 | unknown_lamer | grr now I'm going to have to manually build clisp packages |
| 16:41.25 | unknown_lamer | now comes the fun of figuring out how to make bitbake play nicely with something that has been manually built all the way up to the "slurp into an ipk" stage |
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| 16:47.18 | unknown_lamer | yay I have received a patch for ffcall that might fix its problems! |
| 16:47.47 | unknown_lamer | turns out that arm assembly assumed an armv3 which did not have an instruction cache and so did not flush it when needed |
| 16:47.58 | unknown_lamer | which explains the random crap being executed when the code looked fine otherwise |
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| 17:07.35 | biertrinken | #lost.no |
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| 17:22.55 | kinneh | what's up with the daylies-images |
| 17:23.05 | *** join/#openmoko winux (n=winux@218.7.43.195) |
| 17:25.40 | kdean06 | kinneh, Julian tells me that everyone is busy working on the Qtopia side of things and that he's not had time to fix the buildhost. |
| 17:25.54 | kdean06 | So there hasn't been an official daily image since 09 May 2008 |
| 17:26.28 | *** join/#openmoko ArteK (i=root@82.177.19.205) |
| 17:28.31 | kinneh | ok thx |
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| 17:49.31 | CM | kinneh: Use ScaredyCat's images instead, from http://buildhost.automated.it/OM2007.2/ |
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| 17:55.35 | kinneh | CM: ah nice |
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| 18:08.24 | kdean06 | ScaredyCat, Qtopia images working yet? :P |
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| 18:13.52 | mmontour | kdean06: I can't speak for ScaredyCat, but my Qtopia image builds are failing at the moment (packagekit has a problem with libopkg versions, and qtopia-phone gets a do_configure() error) |
| 18:15.01 | kdean06 | mmontour, I bug him every day because I know they don't. :P |
| 18:15.17 | kdean06 | From what I gather, Qtopia is being changed quite a bit so it's failing pretty consistantly. |
| 18:16.00 | *** join/#openmoko zedstar_ (n=john@82-44-200-69.cable.ubr08.haye.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 18:16.20 | kdean06 | Though... I'd really like to know the latest usable Qtopia image someone has around. I've been using Qtopia a lot (It has fast forward on the Media Player!) but there are still glitches from the February image they released. |
| 18:17.58 | mmontour | I did get one to build maybe a week ago, but I have never been able to actually use a qtopia image. It would boot but sit there saying "please wait" for long periods of time, button presses sometimes wouldn't do anything, etc. |
| 18:19.15 | kdean06 | Hrm... |
| 18:20.08 | *** join/#openmoko t][s][o (n=tso@129.84-49-131.nextgentel.com) |
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| 18:42.35 | ScaredyCat | gneh! |
| 18:42.55 | ScaredyCat | well the qtopia x11 is only supposed to be working on 02 apparently |
| 18:43.04 | ScaredyCat | but ... well ... bollocks |
| 18:44.28 | mwester | doesn't exactly know the expression, but thinks he gets the general sentiment |
| 18:45.27 | *** join/#openmoko doron (n=Ofek@87.68.144.6) |
| 18:45.49 | abraxa__ | mwester: It's ok, ScaredyCat is a Brit, they use strange words :) |
| 18:47.16 | kdean06 | "supposed to be working" as in "only one getting attention right now" or "only one that's going to get attention"? |
| 18:50.28 | *** join/#openmoko daMaestro (n=jon@fedora/damaestro) |
| 18:50.31 | mwester | abraxa__: Yeah, so I've heard. They mix them up too, I understand they frequently refer to a storage area in an automobile as an article of footwear. |
| 18:51.10 | abraxa__ | rofl |
| 18:51.37 | *** join/#openmoko wipf_ (n=wipf@dslb-084-057-230-249.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 18:51.48 | ScaredyCat | fecking feckty feck feck... |
| 18:52.15 | ScaredyCat | at least we don;t have elephants in our automobiles |
| 18:52.22 | *** join/#openmoko pyknite (n=pyknite@pub1.heig-vd.ch) |
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| 18:53.24 | abraxa__ | Elephants? *blinks* |
| 18:54.01 | kdean06 | ScaredyCat, And ours don't need boots. :) |
| 18:54.12 | mwester | My daughter made an observation when she was very young -- she noted that it's a good thing it's an island -- otherwise there would be a terrible mess at the borders with all the automobiles trying to switch to the wrong side of the road. |
| 18:54.24 | *** join/#openmoko LetoTo (n=paul@76-10-144-1.dsl.teksavvy.com) |
| 18:55.28 | kdean06 | mwester, Actually, the term boot is used (of not frequently, enough that it's heard) in parts of the southeast US. |
| 18:55.53 | ScaredyCat | you're all English anyway |
| 18:58.11 | kdean06 | ScaredyCat, Are you a communist now? What is this "English" thing you claim "we" are? |
| 18:58.14 | kdean06 | ;) |
| 18:58.27 | kdean06 | "Nonsense!" said Alice, very loudly and decidedly, and the Queen was silent." |
| 19:01.17 | ScaredyCat | yeah, I'm a commie, I believe in free healthcare |
| 19:02.28 | kdean06 | O-o |
| 19:05.03 | *** join/#openmoko ArteK (i=root@82.177.19.205) |
| 19:11.41 | *** join/#openmoko SirBob1701 (n=mcginley@pool-72-81-40-248.phlapa.east.verizon.net) |
| 19:13.49 | kinneh | suff like: JFFS2 warning: (853) jffs2_do_read_inode_internal: Truncating ino #4518 to 122988 bytes failed because it only had 102400 bytes to start with! |
| 19:13.55 | kinneh | is not good right ? |
| 19:14.18 | kinneh | running latest ScaredyCat image and x wont still start |
| 19:14.47 | ScaredyCat | ! |
| 19:14.49 | ScaredyCat | wtf |
| 19:15.02 | mmontour | How old is your u-boot? |
| 19:15.15 | ScaredyCat | did you nand erase rootfs first? |
| 19:16.35 | balrog-k1n | who needs the stinking x anyway |
| 19:17.38 | kinneh | ScaredyCat: do I still need that, I'll try and report back |
| 19:18.02 | ScaredyCat | well, it sounds like somethigns screwy |
| 19:18.03 | abraxa__ | kinneh: It's only "still" if you didn't update your u-boot :) |
| 19:18.26 | ScaredyCat | yes, if you still have the old uboot you still have to do it |
| 19:18.41 | kinneh | will do that hen |
| 19:18.50 | kinneh | I have no debugboard :-/ |
| 19:19.04 | kinneh | so I have gta01-default uboot |
| 19:19.11 | ScaredyCat | then reflash the uImage and then the jffs2 |
| 19:19.29 | kinneh | ok |
| 19:21.05 | *** join/#openmoko vincent_ (n=vincent@207.96.176.71) |
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| 19:33.30 | pavelm | Hello, everyone |
| 19:34.38 | pavelm | ...I played a bit with checkfastcharge script, and it seems to be very useful... |
| 19:34.55 | pavelm | ...after getting rid of that "are you really really sure" annoyance. |
| 19:35.19 | *** join/#openmoko rcxdude (n=rcxdude@host86-138-62-77.range86-138.btcentralplus.com) |
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| 19:37.34 | vincent_ | hi |
| 19:41.29 | tuxi | hello |
| 19:45.01 | vincent_ | anyone have errors with 'make setup' and 'make openmoko-devel-image' directives today? |
| 19:46.26 | vincent_ | or who can tell me if it is necessary to be root in order to run the setup directive of the MokoMakefile? |
| 19:47.00 | *** join/#openmoko Ryushin (i=proxy@windwalker.openinnovations.com) |
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| 19:49.12 | abraxa__ | vincent_: No need to be root |
| 19:50.22 | mwester | vincent_: it would be very un-good to run make setup or make <anything> as root. |
| 19:54.32 | *** join/#openmoko aloril (n=aloril@h1588.gprs.dnafinland.fi) |
| 19:55.08 | vincent_ | indeed |
| 19:55.40 | *** join/#openmoko cyrilRomain (n=cyrilRom@AToulouse-157-1-7-233.w86-201.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 19:56.07 | *** join/#openmoko _rob (n=rob@85.233.59.8.static.cablesurf.de) |
| 19:56.24 | vincent_ | here's what I get from 'make setup' |
| 19:56.27 | vincent_ | A trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/artwork/sounds/ringtone_supertux.wav |
| 19:56.27 | vincent_ | svn: Ãchec de la requête REPORT sur '/!svn/vcc/default' |
| 19:56.27 | vincent_ | svn: REPORT de '/!svn/vcc/default': 200 OK (http://svn.openmoko.org) |
| 19:57.34 | vincent_ | well.. says that the REPORT request failed and then ERROR of the makefile procedure |
| 19:57.51 | cyrilRomain | vincent_: I suspect it is because of your firewall/proxy settings |
| 19:57.53 | vincent_ | i'm behind a proxy but it was working yesterday.. |
| 19:58.11 | vincent_ | Cyril c'est français ça... |
| 19:58.11 | cyrilRomain | vincent_: here 'svn ls http://svn.openmoko.org' works |
| 19:58.13 | vincent_ | well.. |
| 19:59.27 | vincent_ | it works for me too |
| 20:00.49 | vincent_ | .. third run of setup today : / |
| 20:09.12 | pavelm | I tried scaredycat's image from today, but it does not detect MMC card... and my flash is dead so I _need_ mmc card. |
| 20:14.25 | vincent_ | pavelm: excuse me what is mmc (:/) |
| 20:15.10 | kario | multimedia card |
| 20:17.57 | Sonicadvance1 | soooo....Topic still lying to us then? :D |
| 20:18.10 | vincent_ | still hehe |
| 20:18.56 | vincent_ | but i don't care much, I have my device ready to meet my desires already |
| 20:19.19 | vincent_ | even if it's not the 'new-wifi-awesome' FreeRunner |
| 20:19.52 | abraxa__ | vincent_: And without video bottleneck, lest not forget |
| 20:20.05 | vincent_ | lol my AP is still crappy at home since a lamer had covered all the WEP AP's and still ... |
| 20:20.09 | vincent_ | ho I forgot! |
| 20:20.31 | vincent_ | Those new 'without video bottleneck' features are just awesome, too |
| 20:20.37 | vincent_ | ;) |
| 20:21.12 | abraxa__ | ya :) |
| 20:22.07 | vincent_ | maybe if i'm doing 'awesome' work into the community I could have one for testing one day |
| 20:22.27 | vincent_ | hehe - I keep dreamin' |
| 20:22.29 | woglinde | wep |
| 20:22.32 | woglinde | hahaha |
| 20:22.39 | vincent_ | yep WEP |
| 20:22.42 | vincent_ | haha |
| 20:22.58 | woglinde | you could turn it off |
| 20:23.04 | woglinde | has the same effect |
| 20:23.10 | vincent_ | somebody in my neighborhood took about 6 months to acheive man-in-the-middle |
| 20:23.16 | vincent_ | agree |
| 20:23.24 | woglinde | 6 months |
| 20:23.25 | woglinde | lol |
| 20:23.26 | vincent_ | that is why i'm using WPA2 |
| 20:23.29 | woglinde | what a lamer |
| 20:23.55 | vincent_ | yeah, i't the date that my friend began to get disconnected more frequently from the AP |
| 20:24.04 | vincent_ | and now, using WPA2 I got |
| 20:24.12 | vincent_ | .. authentication then |
| 20:24.20 | woglinde | why you didnt use it from the beginning? |
| 20:24.22 | *** join/#openmoko aloril (n=aloril@h153150.gprs.dnafinland.fi) |
| 20:24.23 | vincent_ | .. association then |
| 20:24.32 | vincent_ | (i used it from the beginning and it worked) |
| 20:24.57 | *** part/#openmoko baird (n=cbaird@brushtail.apana.org.au) |
| 20:25.03 | vincent_ | then now I resetted the AP device and now after auth/assoc ... |
| 20:25.05 | *** join/#openmoko tsuramoto (n=tashiro@a82-92-30-111.adsl.xs4all.nl) |
| 20:25.14 | vincent_ | NO IP and NO ROUTE TO AP (even static) |
| 20:25.21 | vincent_ | wich means at my sense... |
| 20:25.39 | vincent_ | some lamer trying to hook my association with the AP |
| 20:26.31 | vincent_ | and further no connection for anyone .. resulting in DoS because i'm using some diffie-hellman stuff to exchange informations with my AP |
| 20:27.02 | *** topic/#openmoko by mmontour -> Welcome to the Openmoko support and discussion channel! The Freerunner phone (with wifi) should have started mass production before May 16. | Official status: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Community_Updates |
| 20:27.42 | vincent_ | ho forget it the wifi connection work A1 ... with no encryption at all |
| 20:27.51 | vincent_ | so as I think about it.. |
| 20:28.40 | vincent_ | I think I should start to build a level 1 attack against the ugly wifi-sniffer who acts in my neighborhood |
| 20:29.51 | vincent_ | still it's not easy to got undiscovered with a baseball bat and a laptop walking around to find AP's... |
| 20:29.54 | vincent_ | hum |
| 20:29.55 | Sonicadvance1 | ooo, an "ugly" wifi-sniffer? :D |
| 20:30.04 | vincent_ | yeah |
| 20:30.30 | Sonicadvance1 | hehe |
| 20:30.46 | vincent_ | if he is not ugly then I bet he won't be too clean after my passage... |
| 20:31.28 | Sonicadvance1 | oh no |
| 20:31.39 | vincent_ | hahaha I hate those who just not steal wifi connections (that I don't care) but who are causing DoS, trying mim-attacks against neighbors |
| 20:31.42 | vincent_ | ... |
| 20:31.48 | vincent_ | there is only one treatment |
| 20:32.24 | *** join/#openmoko Gybrush (n=Gybrush@f053152157.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 20:32.26 | Sonicadvance1 | High Powered sniper rifle? |
| 20:32.50 | vincent_ | clothes line burning !!!! |
| 20:32.54 | Sonicadvance1 | ooo |
| 20:32.55 | vincent_ | Arrrrr |
| 20:33.41 | vincent_ | I still have to find a way to catch him and to be damn sure |
| 20:34.15 | vincent_ | Maybe if there's a Cantenna beside in porch... |
| 20:34.21 | Sonicadvance1 | Protect your AP with an easy WEP password, let him connect, then screw with him? :D |
| 20:34.35 | vincent_ | not bad :) |
| 20:34.54 | vincent_ | medium complexity |
| 20:35.09 | Sonicadvance1 | He IS trying to hack the password though? |
| 20:35.19 | vincent_ | sure he will indeed |
| 20:35.26 | Sonicadvance1 | hehehe |
| 20:35.28 | zash | triangulation? |
| 20:35.32 | vincent_ | I can even generate traffic for him |
| 20:35.49 | Sonicadvance1 | hehehe xD |
| 20:35.55 | vincent_ | ya think with wich tool can we triangularize some AP's supplicant? |
| 20:36.53 | zash | that we need for openmoko! |
| 20:36.59 | vincent_ | because indeed that will be the best choice.. but if he is in passive mode and just sniffing... |
| 20:37.05 | zash | easy triangulation software |
| 20:37.14 | vincent_ | you're right |
| 20:37.37 | vincent_ | but I won't code for that guy it's getting too complex.. |
| 20:37.45 | vincent_ | still prefer Level 1 strike |
| 20:38.32 | vincent_ | that's a good question... if the guy is in monitor mode and that the only thing he is doing is collecting data |
| 20:38.47 | vincent_ | I won't be able to see him with any tool if he is passive |
| 20:39.02 | zash | sudo do-nuclear-strike $(get-my-position |
| 20:39.08 | zash | then get in the cellar |
| 20:39.15 | vincent_ | wait no !!!! |
| 20:39.19 | Sonicadvance1 | But why would he only want to monitor? He should be wanting to get on your network eventually to do something |
| 20:39.52 | vincent_ | you are getting 40 years back when FBI told million of people that a simple phone phreak could start a nuclear war L:D |
| 20:40.02 | vincent_ | .. with a payphone |
| 20:40.12 | zash | ASUM! |
| 20:40.20 | vincent_ | (wich was way far from payphone that time) |
| 20:41.41 | vincent_ | if the guy is brillant just a bit and that he as a minimum of real motivation (say profit) and that he already got free wireless access (there's an open AP) |
| 20:42.32 | zash | http://www.ex-parrot.com/~pete/upside-down-ternet.html |
| 20:42.52 | zash | do it! |
| 20:43.32 | vincent_ | let's assume that this guy for instance wants to charge my credit institution to get things around eBay... Of my Google mail account... Or all of my neighbors FB account... then he could get a piece of our identity without having to dig into our 'ever-more-secured-and-surely-updated' local networks |
| 20:43.35 | vincent_ | wzzthat? |
| 20:44.13 | vincent_ | your'e the man! |
| 20:44.15 | vincent_ | :) |
| 20:47.12 | *** join/#openmoko rcxdude (n=rcxdude@host86-138-62-77.range86-138.btcentralplus.com) |
| 20:47.49 | vincent_ | that is interesting |
| 20:48.14 | vincent_ | definitely something that looks like an honeynet gateway |
| 20:48.18 | vincent_ | and |
| 20:48.47 | vincent_ | I could indeed use that for my first fun-playing game of wireless pnwage |
| 20:48.54 | vincent_ | because |
| 20:49.19 | vincent_ | what I have here is a big - say énorme - personal itch |
| 20:50.03 | *** part/#openmoko tux1337 (n=tux1337@Mfa0d.m.pppool.de) |
| 20:50.30 | vincent_ | with I was even ready to solve with a ye 'olde physical-layer disruption and denial of service against the devices (if found) and the proprietary (if discovered) |
| 20:50.41 | *** join/#openmoko xcasex (n=rrg@ua-83-227-156-234.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se) |
| 20:51.34 | vincent_ | bit of thinking make me think that i'll just masquerade things up the .. hum .. right way I guess héhéhé |
| 20:52.04 | *** join/#openmoko libervisco (n=libervis@78-1-97-171.adsl.net.t-com.hr) |
| 20:56.10 | zash | goatse! |
| 20:56.41 | zash | gateway that replaces all images with goatse! |
| 20:56.58 | zash | and other "plesant" imagery |
| 20:56.59 | SpeedEvil | Too boring. |
| 20:58.20 | zash | hm, sed some word to something funny |
| 20:58.25 | emilis_info | there was an article somewhere about rotating all images upside down for wifi stealing neighbour |
| 20:58.35 | emilis_info | hmm |
| 20:58.38 | SpeedEvil | zash: sweedish chef filter. |
| 20:58.41 | zash | emilis_info: posted link above |
| 20:58.43 | emilis_info | clbuttic? |
| 20:58.52 | vincent_ | http://www.ex-parrot.com/~pete/upside-down-ternet.html |
| 20:58.58 | emilis_info | hehe |
| 20:59.04 | vincent_ | explained there |
| 20:59.09 | vincent_ | hey |
| 20:59.22 | emilis_info | :) |
| 20:59.22 | vincent_ | THAT should be part of the next OpenMoko release |
| 20:59.28 | SpeedEvil | It is. |
| 20:59.37 | SpeedEvil | Through the magic of turning the phone upside down. |
| 20:59.46 | zash | swedish chef audio filter |
| 20:59.51 | SpeedEvil | Ah |
| 20:59.51 | vincent_ | Neighbors' AP stealing GIF smashing utility... |
| 20:59.53 | SpeedEvil | That too. |
| 21:00.25 | vincent_ | sure, I got to have the new Freerunner then... SOLD! haha |
| 21:00.55 | zash | but triangulation software /me wants |
| 21:01.41 | vincent_ | yeah to be satellite-independant ? |
| 21:01.58 | vincent_ | you could triangulate with GSM tower d'you think? |
| 21:02.39 | zash | and/or other known wifi aps |
| 21:02.48 | *** join/#openmoko micrenda (n=michele@217.201.83.75) |
| 21:03.38 | vincent_ | hehe lets say with USB and bluethooth we could always have some success building external devices |
| 21:04.41 | vincent_ | like big-boosted antenna or just an external 802.11wathever chip stepping aside of the OpenMoko but commanded by it |
| 21:05.11 | vincent_ | everything is possible nowadays! |
| 21:06.23 | zash | a simple thing that draws a dot at your location on a map with alpha = signal strenght |
| 21:06.28 | zash | or color |
| 21:06.35 | vincent_ | still.. my setup directive is nearly finished processing |
| 21:06.45 | vincent_ | hum |
| 21:06.52 | vincent_ | yeah that exists |
| 21:07.00 | vincent_ | there's a demo on youtube |
| 21:07.11 | zash | easy portable to freerunner? |
| 21:07.40 | SpeedEvil | What's wrong with GPS? |
| 21:07.56 | *** join/#openmoko abraxa_ (n=abraxa@pD95FD507.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 21:07.57 | zash | huhu |
| 21:09.51 | vincent_ | dunno i'm looking for it |
| 21:10.10 | zash | why don't i have a freerunner so i can code an app like that |
| 21:10.44 | vincent_ | I got it |
| 21:10.55 | *** join/#openmoko jserv-- (n=jserv@61-230-51-213.dynamic.hinet.net) |
| 21:10.58 | SpeedEvil | passes zash qemu |
| 21:11.08 | vincent_ | TangoGPS on OpenMoko demo version |
| 21:11.13 | vincent_ | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ky-gbF1rgb4&feature=related |
| 21:11.25 | SpeedEvil | tangoGPS is handy |
| 21:11.27 | vincent_ | hum... |
| 21:11.37 | vincent_ | I think you dont have a freerunner beacause... |
| 21:11.38 | SpeedEvil | I was using it duct-taped to a GPS window-mount |
| 21:11.49 | vincent_ | The Freerunner phone (with wifi) should have started mass production before May 16. |
| 21:11.50 | SpeedEvil | For OSM use. |
| 21:11.52 | vincent_ | ... |
| 21:12.05 | vincent_ | hahaha |
| 21:12.09 | SpeedEvil | vincent_: 16th working day ends in china in a few hours |
| 21:12.15 | vincent_ | pretty cool |
| 21:12.28 | vincent_ | oh yeah that a news |
| 21:12.28 | SpeedEvil | IIRC |
| 21:13.03 | zash | SpeedEvil: i dont feel like downloading qemu + om over gprs |
| 21:13.09 | vincent_ | but I purchase an advanced Neo1973 just to be cool 3 months ago |
| 21:13.18 | vincent_ | hahaha |
| 21:13.29 | vincent_ | with monotone synchronisation :P |
| 21:13.31 | vincent_ | hehehe |
| 21:13.44 | zash | the 3g net crapped out |
| 21:14.22 | vincent_ | still what is needed next is a free GSM provider woldwide |
| 21:15.16 | emilis_info | free as in beer? |
| 21:15.34 | vincent_ | hum can you clone your beer? |
| 21:15.41 | vincent_ | if so I guess it's free then |
| 21:15.47 | vincent_ | ;) |
| 21:15.58 | *** join/#openmoko Deubeuliou (n=david@AFontenayssB-151-1-5-217.w82-121.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 21:16.17 | vincent_ | Deubeuliou?? |
| 21:16.20 | vincent_ | HAHAHA |
| 21:16.31 | Deubeuliou | ? |
| 21:16.42 | vincent_ | means W. in french right? |
| 21:16.43 | Deubeuliou | mmmh ? ^^ |
| 21:16.49 | Deubeuliou | right :) |
| 21:16.52 | vincent_ | like surname of Bush right? |
| 21:16.54 | vincent_ | HAHAHA |
| 21:16.58 | vincent_ | drôle :) |
| 21:17.02 | zash | city wide free (as in payed-with-taxes) would be nice |
| 21:17.03 | Deubeuliou | anéfé :p |
| 21:19.09 | vincent_ | Deubeuliou : http://shaowarrior.iquebec.com/avant/ capsule 17 :) |
| 21:19.37 | vincent_ | :( Still... |
| 21:19.51 | vincent_ | A developers/sameo/patches/ar6k-atheros-2.0/pnp_fixes_2.6.22.5.patch |
| 21:19.51 | vincent_ | A developers/sameo/patches/ar6k-atheros-2.0/atheros_2_0_sdio_stack.patch |
| 21:19.51 | vincent_ | svn: Ãchec de la requête REPORT sur '/!svn/vcc/default' |
| 21:19.51 | vincent_ | svn: REPORT de '/!svn/vcc/default': 200 OK (http://svn.openmoko.org) |
| 21:19.51 | vincent_ | make: *** [setup-openmoko] Erreur 1 |
| 21:19.52 | vincent_ | vincent@openmoko-dev:~/moko$ |
| 21:19.58 | vincent_ | gtg get my son |
| 21:20.02 | vincent_ | cya all! |
| 21:24.45 | CVirus | lol @ the topic |
| 21:25.39 | CVirus | no update from steve yet .. hmm |
| 21:27.28 | mmontour | CVirus: give it a few days and then flip the topic back to "...will be released at some time". |
| 21:27.29 | *** join/#openmoko fenfir (n=fenfir@adsl-64-219-109-77.dsl.lgvwtx.swbell.net) |
| 21:27.50 | CVirus | mmontour: I'm sure |
| 21:28.16 | CVirus | is frustrated |
| 21:29.20 | *** join/#openmoko Fradeve (n=fradeve@host219-7-dynamic.21-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 21:33.07 | *** join/#openmoko pavelm (n=pavel@gprs189-60.eurotel.cz) |
| 21:34.08 | *** join/#openmoko MarcOChapeau (n=mbarre@80.93.89.168) |
| 21:46.53 | cb22 | english tenses for the win :) |
| 21:48.15 | CVirus | haha |
| 21:49.25 | *** join/#openmoko k-s (n=gustavo@201.82.9.119) |
| 22:02.00 | *** join/#openmoko miip_ (n=miip@p54A557D8.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 22:07.31 | *** join/#openmoko rtm (n=rtm@pool-151-199-54-124.bos.east.verizon.net) |
| 22:10.53 | *** join/#openmoko Yanroy (n=rmeador@71-88-110-253.dhcp.oxfr.ma.charter.com) |
| 22:11.21 | Yanroy | hi all |
| 22:11.30 | Yanroy | I have a quick two-part question... |
| 22:11.48 | Yanroy | firstly, are the openmoko mailing lists the preferred way of keeping tabs on the project? |
| 22:11.59 | Yanroy | and secondly, are they archived anywhere online? |
| 22:12.11 | SpeedEvil | maybe, and yes |
| 22:12.13 | Yanroy | particularly, I'm interested in being able to get an RSS feed of the posts |
| 22:12.22 | SpeedEvil | lists..openmoko.org |
| 22:12.26 | Yanroy | like nabble has for all the lists it archives |
| 22:12.28 | SpeedEvil | lists.openmoko.org |
| 22:12.36 | SpeedEvil | I don't think it does RSS |
| 22:13.04 | Yanroy | I've visited that page before... where's the archive? |
| 22:13.11 | Yanroy | it seems to only let me sign up when I click a list name |
| 22:13.22 | Yanroy | nvm... |
| 22:13.27 | Yanroy | I'm just not very observant |
| 22:13.36 | Yanroy | still, it's not RSS |
| 22:13.48 | Yanroy | do you think anyone would object to me having it start archiving on nabble? |
| 22:14.07 | Yanroy | the only reason I ask is it seems to associate the person who requests the archive with someone connected to the list's management |
| 22:15.05 | mmontour | The lists are also available on gmane.org |
| 22:15.42 | *** join/#openmoko j_ack (n=rudi@dsbg-4db7dd86.pool.einsundeins.de) |
| 22:16.29 | mmontour | E.g. http://dir.gmane.org/gmane.comp.handhelds.openmoko.community (with RSS) |
| 22:17.51 | *** join/#openmoko doron (n=Ofek@87.68.144.6) |
| 22:18.11 | Yanroy | mmontour: thanks. that looks good. do you know the difference between "all messages" and "topics" feeds? |
| 22:20.38 | mmontour | I think "topics" would be 1 RSS entry for a message+all of its replies, vs. 1 RSS entry for each message, but I don't use RSS (I use the NNTP interface) |
| 22:22.46 | *** join/#openmoko Selveste1 (n=Selveste@85.235.243.199) |
| 22:23.15 | *** join/#openmoko mire (n=mirezwer@210-174-222-85.adsl.verat.net) |
| 22:25.47 | Yanroy | thank you very much |
| 22:26.04 | Yanroy | and I look forward to buying a freerunner as soon as they're available :) |
| 22:40.28 | *** join/#openmoko retracile (n=eli@76-204-213-211.lightspeed.allntx.sbcglobal.net) |
| 22:53.00 | *** join/#openmoko Varox_NB (n=doug@p4FD4449C.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 23:10.21 | Yanroy | exit |
| 23:10.23 | Yanroy | quit |
| 23:10.53 | CVirus | haha |
| 23:11.15 | *** join/#openmoko social_gentoo (n=sigterm@r4bd237.net.upc.cz) |
| 23:11.18 | josch | lol |
| 23:12.02 | *** join/#openmoko mire (n=mirezwer@210-174-222-85.adsl.verat.net) |
| 23:14.30 | *** join/#openmoko krau (n=cktakaha@189.70.254.148) |
| 23:19.22 | *** join/#openmoko Arg0naut (n=steveois@CPE001c10acab63-CM000a7369b290.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 23:20.39 | *** join/#openmoko Fluffy (n=chatzill@82.96.63.58) |
| 23:20.52 | Arg0naut | any updates if/when mass production has/will be started? |
| 23:22.14 | Fluffy | ./motd |
| 23:25.35 | *** join/#openmoko Demitar (n=demitar@h-79-136-2-44.NA.cust.bahnhof.se) |
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| 23:34.57 | *** part/#openmoko milobit (n=milobit@whiterabbit.rz.uni-mannheim.de) |
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