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| 04:31.25 | summatusmentis | hi Sup3rkiddo |
| 04:32.07 | Sup3rkiddo | summatusmentis, re |
| 04:32.20 | summatusmentis | how goes it? |
| 04:32.21 | Sup3rkiddo | summatusmentis, any change in your apps? :P |
| 04:32.28 | Sup3rkiddo | summatusmentis, it goes fine |
| 04:32.28 | summatusmentis | not really |
| 04:32.47 | summatusmentis | what about you? heard anything? |
| 04:33.01 | Sup3rkiddo | summatusmentis, nada, zilch... |
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| 04:33.37 | summatusmentis | yeah, I'm probably gonna go w/ the other org I applied to, they told me they'd give me a position |
| 04:33.51 | summatusmentis | I haven't heard anything from OM yet, and this other org is wanting an answer |
| 04:34.55 | Sup3rkiddo | summatusmentis, wow, nice..i guess we will prolly wait,,,OM guys are busy afterall |
| 04:35.32 | summatusmentis | yeah, they are, I know. I just didn't want to risk not getting any position |
| 04:36.03 | Sup3rkiddo | summatusmentis, sounds fair |
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| 04:36.19 | Sup3rkiddo | summatusmentis, the other one was for OpenAFS? |
| 04:36.26 | summatusmentis | Sup3rkiddo: that's my theory. Yeah, it was |
| 04:37.04 | summatusmentis | might be through GSoC, or it might be that they hire some students outside of GSoC for the summer |
| 04:38.09 | Sup3rkiddo | ah ok |
| 04:38.24 | Sup3rkiddo | what about ophoned... |
| 04:38.36 | summatusmentis | what do you mean? |
| 04:39.19 | Sup3rkiddo | summatusmentis, applied for ophoned? |
| 04:39.31 | summatusmentis | I did, that's true |
| 04:39.40 | Sup3rkiddo | cool..:D |
| 04:39.50 | summatusmentis | oh wait, no, I applied for odeviced |
| 04:39.52 | Sup3rkiddo | the more the apps, the more the slots |
| 04:39.52 | summatusmentis | sorry |
| 04:39.55 | Sup3rkiddo | bleh |
| 04:40.21 | summatusmentis | OM got 62 apps, afaik, and ~10 slots? |
| 04:40.28 | summatusmentis | at least, preliminarily |
| 04:40.35 | Sup3rkiddo | woohoo..10 slots is big |
| 04:40.39 | Sup3rkiddo | brb..gotts bath |
| 04:41.07 | summatusmentis | I may be mistaken about slots #, but that's what I heard |
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| 06:13.16 | daMaestro | holy moly qtopia is polished |
| 06:16.33 | josch | would wish it to be germanished instead :-D |
| 06:20.24 | daMaestro | lol |
| 06:20.32 | daMaestro | though, the sound quality is still poor |
| 06:20.52 | daMaestro | might just be the gta01v4 hardware |
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| 07:42.59 | Hopscotch | good morning |
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| 08:00.53 | m4r3k | Hi! Stupid question :-) when will be able buy new Neo FreeRunner? Any timeline? |
| 08:01.30 | SpeedEvil | No. |
| 08:01.31 | doc|home | m4r3k: no time just yet. Phones are in production testing stage, so they can optimise yield |
| 08:01.52 | doc|home | SpeedEvil: shit man, terse aren't you? :) |
| 08:02.16 | SpeedEvil | No. |
| 08:02.23 | doc|home | ok. |
| 08:02.29 | rtm | He's efficient. |
| 08:02.42 | doc|home | so is a kick in the crotch |
| 08:02.56 | rtm | Both have there place. |
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| 08:03.16 | rtm | Ooops - "their place" |
| 08:03.29 | doc|home | tuts disapprovingly at rtm's grammar |
| 08:03.31 | doc|home | ;) |
| 08:04.15 | rtm | If I were as pithy as SpeedEvil, I'd make fewer mistakes. |
| 08:04.42 | SpeedEvil | It's 9AM. And I'm low on coffee. |
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| 08:10.42 | m4r3k | :'-( |
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| 08:19.39 | holycow | <rtm> Both have there place. <--- rofl ... *zing* |
| 08:22.06 | m4r3k | BTW i can translate UI to czech language... where i can get po files? Are translation welcome at this time? |
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| 08:42.50 | emdete | is some i/opkg guru around? i assume `grep Package: /usr/lib/ipkg/status | uniq -cd` should give no output (packages should be uniq in there) but i often see that packages are dublicated in the file... |
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| 11:24.45 | CIA-41 | freesmartphone.org: 03emdete * r191 10/trunk/specifications/otapi/org.freesmartphone.GSM.MUX: |
| 11:24.45 | CIA-41 | freesmartphone.org: added GetPower |
| 11:24.45 | CIA-41 | freesmartphone.org: fixed names to conform dbus-conventions |
| 11:24.45 | CIA-41 | freesmartphone.org: added annotation for c interface generation with c-name-conventions |
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| 11:41.40 | CIA-41 | freesmartphone.org: 03emdete * r192 10/trunk/specifications/otapi/org.freesmartphone.GSM.MUX: fixed typo |
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| 11:54.20 | CIA-41 | freesmartphone.org: 03emdete * r193 10/trunk/software/gsm0710muxd/ (6 files in 2 dirs): new names conforming org.freesmartphone.GSM.MUX |
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| 12:25.50 | cb22_ | ooh, someone put up a screenshot of one of my encoded videos playing |
| 12:29.44 | SpeedEvil | Fame! |
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| 12:35.09 | J-23 | Hello! Will be FreeRunner available officially in Poland? |
| 12:41.23 | CM | J-23: You will be able to order it anywhere |
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| 15:48.54 | mwester | good morning |
| 15:49.05 | CVirus | good morning |
| 15:49.13 | CVirus | released at some time ? |
| 15:49.13 | CVirus | LOL |
| 15:59.30 | elation | CVirus: More like 1 year long april fools joke. |
| 16:01.05 | Basheri | holds his breath till Freerunner gets released |
| 16:01.13 | CVirus | same |
| 16:01.45 | elation | Same here, post boned, my mp3 mplayer and phone upgrade for a while now... |
| 16:01.47 | Kero | you can hold your breath for, like, months? |
| 16:02.33 | elation | Kero: It's and old saying, don't be a jerk about it. |
| 16:02.45 | CVirus | lol |
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| 16:04.42 | *** join/#openmoko Dunedan (n=dunedan@phoenitydawn.de) |
| 16:09.48 | pyknite | maybe we will not wait months |
| 16:10.39 | pyknite | i found that on the community list: Usually this means just weeks and no longer months until sales can start. (from Nikolaus Schaller on 8 april) |
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| 16:23.15 | elation | pyknite: Lets hope so, but I doubt. |
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| 16:25.23 | Basheri | I'm cautiously optimistic |
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| 16:37.54 | webjames | hello |
| 16:38.04 | webjames | is anyone doing a 10pack in the UK? |
| 16:40.00 | gambler | im drinking a 6pack right now |
| 16:40.21 | webjames | that reminds me i have a beer in the freezer.. |
| 16:40.39 | webjames | also do we know the uk /euro pricing yet? |
| 16:41.05 | gambler | vapour has no price |
| 16:41.31 | gambler | puts on some 2pac |
| 16:41.59 | webjames | okay.. |
| 16:42.28 | Sup3rkiddo | just wondering, have there been any hacks on making neo work with the gnome-phone-manager and friends? |
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| 16:50.33 | zedstar | webjames there are quite a few Neo owners in the UK so i bet quite a few orders for the Freerunner....so should be possible |
| 16:51.03 | webjames | awesome |
| 16:51.28 | zedstar | webjames worth sticking your name down on the wiki in local groups anyway to see who is about where etc |
| 16:51.54 | webjames | okay, i'll do that, thanks |
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| 17:03.02 | webjames | sounds good, i'm lookingforward to this, my mate just got some LG phone and it's crap so... |
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| 17:16.27 | cb22 | wants freerunner |
| 17:16.35 | cb22 | * freerunner wants cb22 |
| 17:18.21 | mjr | but only in Soviet Russia |
| 17:20.42 | cb22 | Heh, 'In Soviet Russia, FreeRunner buy you!' |
| 17:20.54 | CVirus | lol |
| 17:21.16 | cb22 | In Southern Africa, Internet disconnect you! |
| 17:23.18 | Sup3rkiddo | In India, there is no Internet |
| 17:23.34 | Sup3rkiddo | that was lame |
| 17:24.57 | elation | Computers are so cheap, the are bound to have internet axx and computer everywhere soon. |
| 17:25.22 | Sup3rkiddo | is poor :S |
| 17:26.51 | elation | So no electricity ? :) |
| 17:27.09 | Sup3rkiddo | no wheels |
| 17:27.11 | Sup3rkiddo | bleh |
| 17:27.16 | Sup3rkiddo | i am a student |
| 17:27.31 | *** join/#openmoko Mathiasdm (n=Mathias@vpne229.ugent.be) |
| 17:27.38 | Sup3rkiddo | ...and all students are poor |
| 17:28.15 | elation | student usually got free electricity, you bastard. |
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| 17:29.19 | moo^ | and students can party in the middle of a week :) |
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| 17:32.54 | pyknite | yeah.. party :D |
| 17:33.06 | pyknite | depend on what study you're making |
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| 17:42.32 | Sup3rkiddo | ~trout elation for just the heck of it |
| 17:42.32 | apt | ACTION slaps elation for just the heck of it around a bit with a large trout! |
| 17:44.23 | elation | now now guys, no cybersex in here :) |
| 17:44.53 | nezza-_- | looks away |
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| 18:32.46 | pyknite | is lokking for a free mail, unlike gmail |
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| 18:36.09 | Sup3rkiddo | pyknite, hotmail! |
| 18:36.21 | pyknite | mouhahahaha |
| 18:37.15 | webjames | is it true hotmail doesn't work in linux? |
| 18:37.41 | PiXeLStick | no, you can use firefox to access it |
| 18:37.55 | Aria | Works fine. |
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| 18:40.10 | bmk789_ | just ported nano to openmoko |
| 18:40.40 | Blastur | hurray! |
| 18:40.57 | pyknite | ehh great |
| 18:42.25 | Sup3rkiddo | please port nethack |
| 18:42.38 | pyknite | and vim :P |
| 18:43.22 | SpeedEvil | And DOOM II! |
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| 18:43.29 | Sup3rkiddo | Counter Strike |
| 18:44.22 | pyknite | and windows :D |
| 18:44.31 | pyknite | ok, i'm just leaving :D |
| 18:44.39 | nano- | bmk789_: thanks! |
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| 18:44.47 | PiXeLStick | and Crysis! |
| 18:45.20 | Sup3rkiddo | bmk789_, ipks, recipes somewhere? |
| 18:46.55 | abraxa_ | Why do nano if it's already in OE? *wonders* |
| 18:47.31 | SpeedEvil | To integrate the dial command. |
| 18:47.55 | FnuggleMaster | loves how delays since "August maybe" have led to "April" being changed to "some time" |
| 18:49.04 | abraxa_ | FnuggleMaster: Easy... people will complain about delays one way or another, so not announcing a date is the most sane way imo |
| 18:49.25 | SpeedEvil | _combined_with_information_about_what's_happening! |
| 18:49.27 | FnuggleMaster | abraxa_: I've been saying that since before August :) |
| 18:49.42 | abraxa_ | hehe |
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| 19:08.59 | SpeedEvil | When was the glamo chip picked? Last Feb? |
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| 19:16.35 | doc|home | hmmm, no stylus with the phone? that's not very good |
| 19:16.45 | SpeedEvil | They are $4 on ebay |
| 19:17.06 | doc|home | if you have a paypal account, which I don't, and if you would even be prepared to use ebay, which i'm not :) |
| 19:17.23 | LetoTo | the delays are going to cost them market and momentum. |
| 19:17.25 | SpeedEvil | Pick a seller with a good reputation, send cash in an envelope. |
| 19:17.39 | LetoTo | I've waited for 1.5 years. Not going to wait again beyond the summer |
| 19:19.43 | abraxa_ | LetoTo: Hurhur. |
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| 19:36.10 | doc|home | LetoTo: not much they can do really, would you rather a device that works or a device that's released? And without wanting to sound like a prick, by all means, find an alternative which is anything close :/ |
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| 19:44.46 | abraxa_ | doc|home: Adding to that, no device is good without a working (and usable) software stack... which is problematic at this point |
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| 19:45.28 | abraxa_ | So I think that it would cost them even more market shares if they'd release a consumer product with a software stack that's in a disastrous state |
| 19:47.31 | doc|home | abraxa_: well, they're kinda doing that :/ it's a very basic phone still, calls, sms, gps, the rest's not in a very great position. Web browser for example. :/ |
| 19:47.42 | doc|home | that will change quickly imo, but still |
| 19:49.29 | abraxa_ | Can't really comment on that... |
| 19:49.41 | SpeedEvil | The freerunner at release will _NOT_ be a consumer device. |
| 19:49.46 | SpeedEvil | That's _many_ months ago. |
| 19:49.48 | SpeedEvil | err |
| 19:49.51 | SpeedEvil | That's _many_ months ahead. |
| 19:50.30 | mboldisc | It will function as a phone, correct? |
| 19:50.48 | summatusmentis | there are people using their 1973s as phones |
| 19:50.55 | mboldisc | excellent |
| 19:51.30 | summatusmentis | very limited phone functionality though, afaik |
| 19:52.07 | abraxa_ | SpeedEvil: The freerunner *as such* is a consumer device like any other - the software part of it may be consumer-ready or not, depending on the stack used |
| 19:52.37 | SpeedEvil | points to his exact wording. |
| 19:52.57 | abraxa_ | Why do you speak in such absolute terms? |
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| 19:53.45 | SpeedEvil | emulates the great philosopher. |
| 19:53.56 | SpeedEvil | '`When I use a word,' Humpty Dumpty said, in rather a scornful tone, `it means just what I choose it to mean -- neither more nor less.' |
| 19:54.03 | abraxa_ | heh :) |
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| 19:59.59 | MichaelShiloh | SpeedEvil: i love that you quote that line. one of my favorite. |
| 20:02.29 | MichaelShiloh | abraxa_: the reason is this: we know that our software needs more polish. we don't want to delay getting the hardware into the hands of developers who are comfortable with beta software, knowing they can upgrade it. however, we need to be very careful to make sure that non-technical consumers don't jump on the Neo Freerunner when it first comes out and expect it to be consumer ready. That's... |
| 20:02.30 | MichaelShiloh | ...why we are so careful with our words. |
| 20:05.29 | abraxa_ | MichaelShiloh: Yeah, I understand. However, the direction OM, Inc. wants to go is unclear to everyone in this community and we'd really wish to hear where things are headed - if that's even clear to OM, Inc. itself :) |
| 20:09.11 | abraxa_ | Point is: we have *tons* of untapped potential in this channel. If you'd come clear and say "we have 4 months and need this, this and this done" then everyone who's willing and able to help can do so. As of now, developers have been burned and confused more than anything else, so OM, Inc. has to lift the heavy work all by itself... sadly. |
| 20:09.47 | MichaelShiloh | Well, I'm in California (although right now I'm in Israel - even further removed) and there is necessarily a delay in getting the true situation in Taiwan to me. As I see it, we had to make a choice: with our limited resources, should we focus on hardware, software, or both? What we decided to do was to focus on hardware, but with as much effort on improving the software as possible, without... |
| 20:09.48 | MichaelShiloh | ...delaying the hardware further. The result is that the hardware is very nearly ready for mass production, as you've seen from Steve's updates. The software, on the other hand, is further behind, but that's because we've asked those people to help get the hardware as solid as possible first. |
| 20:10.40 | MichaelShiloh | Does this answer your question or have I missed your point? |
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| 20:12.31 | abraxa_ | It does answer it and it does make sense... though at the same time I wish the community had been involved more - as I said, people here *want* to help but got burned by OM, Inc's actions. Thus, fixing that asap would be *my* personal priority if I had a say. |
| 20:13.40 | abraxa_ | I fully understand that it's hard for you to do much at this point (and I do know that you're trying), just saying how things are perceived by me |
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| 20:14.52 | rtm | abraxa: I don't mean this in an accusatory way; I'm just ignorant: How were people here burned by OM? |
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| 20:17.16 | abraxa_ | rtm: Sample quote: "mwester mutters to himself that even those who commit fixes and updates find their changes languishing and bit-rotting in ignored bugzilla entries." |
| 20:18.26 | abraxa_ | Aside from that, developers were first made believe that the GTK+ stack would be the way to go and then were presented EFL-based projects (illume, diversity, enlazar, etc) while also wondering about Qtopia |
| 20:18.47 | rtm | OK, I had not heard that. I myself have submitted but never submitted a fix. |
| 20:20.11 | abraxa_ | Also, there was never a clear API that could be relied upon... if you want to develop now, what do you use? GTK? EFL? How do you talk to the hardware? etc... so people are waiting until these issues get resolved before they waste their time |
| 20:20.49 | abraxa_ | And as much as I don't like saying it, Openmoko does have to take the blame on those issues :( |
| 20:21.04 | mwester | observes that since the quoted comment was made, the situation as it relates to kernel patches and fixes has been much improved. |
| 20:21.33 | abraxa_ | mwester: I am glad then |
| 20:21.35 | mwester | cannot comment on user-space, but is still rather concerned about that entire area. |
| 20:22.02 | rtm | But there have been some excellent (IMO) applications generated, such as tangogps. Do you feel that the API is so ill defined that the effort that went into that project is apt to have been wasted? |
| 20:23.22 | mwester | I agree with your general point, abraxa_ --- there has been much untapped potential that could have (and still could be) used if a project plan and clear direction on the items you mentioned were to be posted, and the community organized around it. |
| 20:23.24 | abraxa_ | rtm: I can't say as I don't know which APIs tangogps makes use of |
| 20:24.13 | rtm | tangogps looks pretty much like straight GTK. |
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| 20:26.01 | abraxa_ | rtm: It *might* be a waste then if Openmoko scratches the GTK stack - which to me, appears to be the long-term goal |
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| 20:32.57 | summatusmentis | isn't part of having community involvement seeing where the community goes with things? I don't know enough about the hierarchy, but what if the community just decided to do things one way |
| 20:33.07 | SpeedEvil | I don't think anyone has a problem with OM concentrating on hardware. |
| 20:33.10 | summatusmentis | wouldn't that leave OM in a position where they have to listen to the community? |
| 20:33.43 | SpeedEvil | I think there is a problem that OM hasn't said 'we are not working on x,y,z' - when in the past, h,j,k have turned up with no notice to the community. |
| 20:34.05 | SpeedEvil | So people are unwilling to work on x,y,z when their work may be redundant. |
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| 20:47.18 | zedstar | speedevil you are right....i noticed this with the location project they seem to be working on |
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| 21:48.22 | *** part/#openmoko christooss (n=matic@84-255-246-158.static.t-2.net) |
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| 22:35.40 | ljp | i think they plan on using ultiple toolkits |
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| 23:34.35 | bmk789_ | what is the difference with ipkg and opkg? |
| 23:39.15 | xaid | bmk789_: ipkg is no longer maintained afaik. |
| 23:39.39 | xaid | bmk789_: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Opkg |
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