| 00:01.14 | *** join/#openmoko affen (n=kala@194.126.113.157) |
| 00:05.07 | *** join/#openmoko CVirus (n=GoD@82.201.178.6) |
| 00:07.12 | *** join/#openmoko bmk789 (n=bmk789@c-98-222-247-219.hsd1.in.comcast.net) |
| 00:08.23 | darmou | Hi I am running openmoko programs on my Zaursus, for some reason the icons are not showing, what package do I need to install to get them to appear for openmoko-browser2? |
| 00:10.47 | *** join/#openmoko ahbritto (n=guest@adsl-68-125-197-181.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net) |
| 00:19.10 | *** join/#openmoko Aria (n=aredride@acrux.theinternetco.net) |
| 00:23.06 | *** join/#openmoko Selveste1_ (n=Selveste@0x5735ead7.hknxx3.adsl-dhcp.tele.dk) |
| 00:37.54 | *** join/#openmoko djk (n=djk@mf80f36d0.tmodns.net) |
| 00:38.00 | *** join/#openmoko ajbrun (n=ajbrun@host86-151-145-24.range86-151.btcentralplus.com) |
| 00:41.01 | *** join/#openmoko fredtheca1 (n=martin@82-42-255-216.cable.ubr12.brad.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 00:43.16 | *** join/#openmoko freelock (n=john@logan.freelock.com) |
| 00:44.36 | *** join/#openmoko ajbrun (n=ajbrun@host86-151-145-24.range86-151.btcentralplus.com) |
| 00:54.04 | *** join/#openmoko icman (n=icman@60-249-22-235.HINET-IP.hinet.net) |
| 00:58.55 | *** join/#openmoko linuxxr (n=brian@ip70-178-27-23.ks.ks.cox.net) |
| 01:07.38 | *** join/#openmoko morricone (n=foobar@dslb-084-057-175-242.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 01:12.42 | *** join/#openmoko Synchronicity (n=Stick@unaffiliated/relate) |
| 01:26.07 | *** join/#openmoko darmou (n=darmou@ppp121-44-180-46.lns5.mel6.internode.on.net) |
| 01:31.00 | *** join/#openmoko darmou (n=darmou@ppp121-44-180-46.lns5.mel6.internode.on.net) |
| 01:34.47 | *** join/#openmoko ajbrun (n=ajbrun@host86-151-145-24.range86-151.btcentralplus.com) |
| 01:39.08 | *** join/#openmoko greentux_ (n=lemke@Z4047.z.pppool.de) |
| 01:40.49 | *** join/#openmoko CVirus (n=GoD@82.201.178.6) |
| 01:49.02 | *** join/#openmoko ajbrun (n=ajbrun@host86-151-145-24.range86-151.btcentralplus.com) |
| 03:06.04 | *** join/#openmoko apt (i=ibot@pdpc/supporter/active/TimRiker/bot/apt) |
| 03:06.04 | *** topic/#openmoko is Welcome to the OpenMoko support and discussion channel! | http://openmoko.org/ | New version is the FreeRunner (with WiFi and pre-alpha software) maybe due April | Official status: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Community_Updates |
| 03:13.51 | *** join/#openmoko christoos1 (n=matic@BSN-77-106-146.dial-up.dsl.siol.net) |
| 03:14.12 | *** join/#openmoko gopi (n=gopi@ppp-71-139-48-90.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net) |
| 03:17.12 | *** join/#openmoko christoos2 (n=matic@BSN-77-106-146.dial-up.dsl.siol.net) |
| 03:22.35 | *** join/#openmoko t_s_o (n=tso@61.84-49-136.nextgentel.com) |
| 03:23.35 | *** join/#openmoko ajbrun (n=ajbrun@host86-151-145-24.range86-151.btcentralplus.com) |
| 03:31.33 | *** join/#openmoko darmou_ (n=darmou@ppp59-167-71-87.lns1.mel6.internode.on.net) |
| 03:32.14 | *** join/#openmoko ajbrun (n=ajbrun@host86-151-145-24.range86-151.btcentralplus.com) |
| 03:36.07 | linuxxr | http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS3842376400.html |
| 03:40.20 | *** join/#openmoko Zoolooc_ (n=fredsiba@nrbg-4dbfaaab.pool.einsundeins.de) |
| 03:41.09 | *** join/#openmoko darmou__ (n=darmou@ppp121-44-180-46.lns5.mel6.internode.on.net) |
| 03:55.05 | *** join/#openmoko Trevi (n=Trevi@host154-124-dynamic.12-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 04:02.49 | *** join/#openmoko SP-8472 (i=8472@dslb-084-056-251-212.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 04:08.20 | *** join/#openmoko slchen (n=slchen@61-228-27-124.dynamic.hinet.net) |
| 04:09.55 | *** join/#openmoko poffy (n=poffy@c-98-199-135-173.hsd1.tx.comcast.net) |
| 04:10.07 | *** part/#openmoko poffy (n=poffy@c-98-199-135-173.hsd1.tx.comcast.net) |
| 04:11.28 | *** join/#openmoko Big-Pat (n=chatzill@c-24-118-41-205.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) |
| 04:14.22 | *** join/#openmoko darmou (n=darmou@ppp121-44-172-230.lns5.mel4.internode.on.net) |
| 04:18.32 | *** join/#openmoko darmou_ (n=darmou@ppp59-167-154-178.lns4.mel6.internode.on.net) |
| 04:18.37 | *** join/#openmoko djk (n=djk@c-69-181-64-193.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 04:42.38 | *** join/#openmoko sunny (n=sunny@59.163.121.1) |
| 04:42.48 | *** join/#openmoko lysanderslair (n=jeff@CPE0014bf4ad3e5-CM001a66825f60.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 04:52.35 | *** join/#openmoko j_ack (n=j_ack@dsbg-4db7c2a3.pool.einsundeins.de) |
| 04:53.01 | *** join/#openmoko _3v1n0_ (n=Trevi@host154-124-dynamic.12-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 05:00.53 | *** join/#openmoko uriahheep (n=alexis@bas1-montreal45-1177792154.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 05:07.37 | *** join/#openmoko darmou (n=darmou@ppp121-44-180-46.lns5.mel6.internode.on.net) |
| 05:08.11 | *** join/#openmoko summatusmentis (n=summatus@umm-yrless170.morris.umn.edu) |
| 05:10.09 | *** join/#openmoko jkilb_ (n=jkilb@p5B20989A.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 05:15.22 | *** join/#openmoko summatusmentis (n=summatus@umm-yrless170.morris.umn.edu) |
| 05:18.13 | *** join/#openmoko summatusmentis (n=summatus@rn083002.morris.umn.edu) |
| 05:28.41 | *** join/#openmoko holycow (n=biteme@S01060016b6b53675.vf.shawcable.net) |
| 05:28.56 | *** join/#openmoko fobos (n=fobos@78.90.88.244) |
| 05:40.05 | *** join/#openmoko johncylee (n=john@firewall.tw.openmoko.org) |
| 05:59.00 | *** join/#openmoko HellDragon (i=jd@unaffiliated/helldragon) |
| 06:08.00 | *** join/#openmoko darmou (n=darmou@ppp121-44-180-46.lns5.mel6.internode.on.net) |
| 06:24.08 | *** join/#openmoko johncylee (n=john@firewall.tw.openmoko.org) |
| 06:27.28 | *** join/#openmoko maroi_ (n=mario@213.33.89.38) |
| 06:30.41 | *** join/#openmoko bmk789 (n=bmk789@c-98-222-247-219.hsd1.in.comcast.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 06:31.09 | *** join/#openmoko chouse (n=chadh@ws.stunned.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 06:31.13 | *** join/#openmoko KentControl (n=afo0l@portia.unixfreunde.de) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 06:31.16 | *** join/#openmoko Basheri (i=basher@hehz.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 06:31.25 | *** join/#openmoko ynezz (i=ynezz@ibawizard.net) |
| 06:31.35 | *** join/#openmoko flaushy (n=flaushy@vs240161.vserver.de) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 06:31.37 | *** join/#openmoko HdR (i=hdr@ns.km31715.keymachine.de) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 06:31.38 | *** join/#openmoko johncylee (n=john@firewall.tw.openmoko.org) |
| 06:31.53 | *** join/#openmoko party- (i=party@stetson.frozenhat.fi) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 06:32.16 | *** join/#openmoko andred (n=aduffeck@nat/suse/x-cedea6b05e5e0467) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 06:32.19 | *** join/#openmoko freelock (n=john@logan.freelock.com) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 06:33.04 | *** join/#openmoko polz (n=polz@cpe-213-157-235-31.dynamic.amis.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 06:36.11 | *** join/#openmoko gopi (n=gopi@ppp-71-139-48-90.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net) |
| 06:39.55 | *** join/#openmoko death-row (n=pierre@217.20.125.101) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 06:41.20 | *** join/#openmoko fulgas560 (n=fn@85.138.15.232) |
| 06:41.20 | *** join/#openmoko greentux_ (n=lemke@Z4047.z.pppool.de) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 06:41.20 | *** join/#openmoko jeffdameth (n=jeff@dyndsl-091-096-034-061.ewe-ip-backbone.de) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 06:41.20 | *** join/#openmoko FuL|OUT (n=fn@85.138.15.232) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 06:41.20 | *** join/#openmoko simon_ (n=simon@w208.wist.uni-linz.ac.at) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 06:41.20 | *** join/#openmoko vallor (i=scott@pdpc/supporter/monthlygold/vallor) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 06:41.20 | *** join/#openmoko lifeeth (n=praneeth@202.3.77.38) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 06:41.20 | *** join/#openmoko hippieindamakin8 (n=hippiein@203.200.95.130) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 06:41.20 | *** join/#openmoko niclone (n=nicolas@d77-218-95-154.cust.tele2.fr) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 06:41.20 | *** join/#openmoko maroi (n=mario@213.33.89.38) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 06:41.20 | *** join/#openmoko SpeedEvil (n=mauve@tor/regular/SpeedEvil) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 06:41.20 | *** join/#openmoko cheetah100 (n=peter@203-109-246-29.static.bliink.ihug.co.nz) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 06:41.20 | *** join/#openmoko bmidgley (n=bmidgley@c-24-2-92-215.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 06:41.20 | *** join/#openmoko lSpeedEvi (n=mauve@212.159.7.170) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 06:41.20 | *** join/#openmoko ikim (n=ikim@dsl081-165-168.sea1.dsl.speakeasy.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 06:41.20 | *** join/#openmoko HdR (i=hdr@87.118.118.174) |
| 06:41.20 | *** join/#openmoko XorA (n=XorA@www.xora.org.uk) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 06:41.20 | *** join/#openmoko smlsfb (n=koenig10@shell.newpaltz.edu) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 06:41.20 | *** join/#openmoko chihchun (n=chihchun@flat.iis.sinica.edu.tw) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 06:41.26 | *** join/#openmoko HdR_ (i=hdr@ns.km31715.keymachine.de) |
| 06:42.26 | *** join/#openmoko vallor_ (i=scott@69.12.218.212) |
| 06:45.51 | *** join/#openmoko cheetah100 (n=peter@203-109-246-29.static.bliink.ihug.co.nz) |
| 06:46.48 | *** join/#openmoko greentux_ (n=lemke@Z4047.z.pppool.de) |
| 06:51.19 | *** join/#openmoko astro76_ (n=jtaji@unaffiliated/astro76) |
| 06:57.05 | *** join/#openmoko icman (n=icman@60-249-22-235.HINET-IP.hinet.net) |
| 06:57.16 | *** join/#openmoko DethKing (n=lawrence@221.120.97.12) |
| 06:57.31 | *** part/#openmoko DethKing (n=lawrence@221.120.97.12) |
| 07:04.13 | *** join/#openmoko darmou_ (n=darmou@ppp59-167-154-15.lns4.mel6.internode.on.net) |
| 07:04.28 | Hopscotch | good morning |
| 07:05.26 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@208.84-48-176.nextgentel.com) |
| 07:05.43 | *** join/#openmoko tholin (n=tholin@85.8.6.155.static.se.wasadata.net) |
| 07:06.09 | *** join/#openmoko icman (n=icman@60-249-22-235.HINET-IP.hinet.net) |
| 07:14.04 | *** join/#openmoko J-23 (n=aldwulf@a105.net128.okay.pl) |
| 07:15.41 | *** join/#openmoko drath_ (i=vmaster@p5B07DCE5.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 07:17.30 | *** join/#openmoko Blastur (i=Blastur@kr-lun-168-149-233-83.3.cust.bredband2.com) |
| 07:19.37 | *** join/#openmoko mbuf (n=mbuf@61.16.248.242) |
| 07:20.36 | *** join/#openmoko thomasg (n=thomasg@p57AFD7FC.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 07:22.24 | *** join/#openmoko darmou__ (n=darmou@ppp121-44-180-46.lns5.mel6.internode.on.net) |
| 07:30.39 | *** join/#openmoko HellDragon (i=jd@unaffiliated/helldragon) |
| 07:39.47 | *** join/#openmoko icman (n=icman@60-249-22-235.HINET-IP.hinet.net) |
| 07:40.09 | *** join/#openmoko mbuf (n=mbuf@61.16.248.242) |
| 07:43.53 | *** join/#openmoko ThePizzaKing (n=jeff@c122-108-33-134.eburwd9.vic.optusnet.com.au) |
| 07:53.38 | *** join/#openmoko ccfly (n=ccfly@89.212.76.77) |
| 07:53.54 | *** part/#openmoko ccfly (n=ccfly@89.212.76.77) |
| 07:54.17 | *** join/#openmoko ccfly (n=ccfly@89.212.76.77) |
| 07:54.22 | ccfly | good morning :) |
| 07:59.15 | CIA-17 | openmoko: 03rwhitby * r11 10mokomakefile/trunk/patches/ (6 files in 2 dirs): Removed old patches |
| 07:59.37 | *** join/#openmoko simon__ (n=simon@h98n2fls301o1032.telia.com) |
| 08:00.30 | *** join/#openmoko johncyle1 (n=john@firewall.tw.openmoko.org) |
| 08:02.44 | *** join/#openmoko johncyle1 (n=john@firewall.tw.openmoko.org) |
| 08:10.01 | CIA-17 | openmoko: 03rwhitby * r12 10mokomakefile/trunk/ (Makefile patches/bitbake-HEAD/ patches/openembedded-HEAD/): Updated Makefile on projects.openmoko.org to new repo |
| 08:11.28 | CIA-17 | openmoko: 03rwhitby * r13 10mokomakefile/trunk/Makefile: Updated check-generation to check bitbake tag |
| 08:11.39 | *** join/#openmoko methril (n=Methril@213.27.233.98) |
| 08:11.42 | methril | morning |
| 08:15.34 | *** join/#openmoko grummel (n=grummel@p5B16C91B.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 08:16.12 | rwhitby | are there any mokomakefile users here who wish to be a guinea pig? |
| 08:16.39 | josch | hops up and down |
| 08:16.44 | josch | *me* *me* |
| 08:17.24 | CM | Me too, if I could get past the shitty pth build failure |
| 08:17.39 | CM | I'll be happy to try a clean restart if needed :) |
| 08:19.07 | *** join/#openmoko danilos (n=danilo@canonical/launchpad/danilos) |
| 08:20.38 | *** join/#openmoko darmou (n=darmou@ppp59-167-90-189.lns2.mel6.internode.on.net) |
| 08:25.07 | Blastur | what are the changes of freerunner getting 3g in the future? |
| 08:25.37 | *** join/#openmoko wolog_ (n=wolog@AOrleans-152-1-50-32.w90-21.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 08:28.02 | *** join/#openmoko Dodji (n=Dodji@torimasen.com) |
| 08:28.09 | rwhitby | josch, CM: wget http://svn.projects.openmoko.org/svnroot/mokomakefile/trunk/Makefile to overwrite your current Makefile |
| 08:28.42 | rwhitby | then make update and follow the instructions to replace your patches and openembedded directories. No need to remove build/tmp. |
| 08:29.24 | CM | Ok |
| 08:29.24 | rwhitby | As soon as I get two successes, I'll redirect the old location to the new location. |
| 08:29.43 | rwhitby | (the location I've given you is the new official location after this is rolled out) |
| 08:29.55 | CM | rwhitby: It's just that I've been having some issue with pth that I just can't get around.. Might as well remove my whole temp :( |
| 08:30.12 | rwhitby | CM: your choice. |
| 08:30.25 | rwhitby | try this before you remove build/tmp |
| 08:30.59 | CM | I had to do the make setup-patches first |
| 08:31.30 | *** join/#openmoko Aniruddha_NL (n=Aniruddh@s5590cf7b.adsl.wanadoo.nl) |
| 08:32.39 | rwhitby | yep, it asked you to do that correctly? |
| 08:33.10 | CM | Yes |
| 08:33.39 | josch | aye |
| 08:35.08 | josch | i rm'd everything it asked me to and now mtn does its stuff |
| 08:37.53 | rwhitby | josch: let me know when it starts to bitbake ... |
| 08:37.56 | rwhitby | CM: you too |
| 08:38.20 | josch | can take some time on my machine ^^ |
| 08:38.46 | ccfly | rm -rf * alone takes ages :) |
| 08:41.41 | *** join/#openmoko abraxa__ (n=abraxa@pD95FDF0D.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 08:44.12 | cb22 | wishes he could take part in the SoC :( |
| 08:45.07 | josch | wishes he had the skillz to do so ^^ |
| 08:45.25 | *** join/#openmoko zefanja_ (n=zefanja@p54BA6030.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 08:45.35 | *** part/#openmoko zefanja_ (n=zefanja@p54BA6030.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 08:45.49 | cb22 | you see the email from sean on the mailing list? |
| 08:45.56 | CM | rwhitby: I get a lot of missing providers, and then it fails on pth like it has for almost a month |
| 08:46.01 | *** join/#openmoko rob_w (n=bob@Mb5a8.m.pppool.de) |
| 08:46.17 | *** join/#openmoko amarsh04_ (n=amarsh04@121.220.163.49) |
| 08:46.29 | cb22 | the accepted participants will get a freerunner (engineering samples) |
| 08:47.43 | rwhitby | CM: I get the following errors at the start: http://www.pastebin.ca/955024 |
| 08:47.52 | rwhitby | (but that's not MokoMakefile's problem) |
| 08:48.10 | CM | I'll clean my tmp and try again from scratch |
| 08:48.24 | rwhitby | I doubt it will fix those errors. |
| 08:48.34 | CM | *nod* |
| 08:48.39 | CM | I get the exact same error |
| 08:48.50 | *** join/#openmoko peepsalot (n=peeps@cpe-67-9-161-48.austin.res.rr.com) |
| 08:48.54 | josch | *still working* (tm) |
| 08:48.55 | cb22 | josch: btw, you solve your x problem? |
| 08:49.13 | CM | I really wonder why glibc isn't found |
| 08:49.24 | josch | sadly no but I think I completed the wiki page on how to get to my error :P |
| 08:49.26 | CM | That sounds quite bad, and it's the reason pth fails for me |
| 08:49.34 | *** join/#openmoko buz (n=buz@84-74-162-208.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 08:50.12 | josch | when using vesa i even get: |
| 08:50.14 | josch | xf86PciVideoInfo is not set |
| 08:50.14 | josch | Could not get primary PCI info |
| 08:50.22 | josch | but the neo has no pci hasnt it? |
| 08:50.46 | josch | i tried vesa and fbdev as driver and ran it with and without kernel fb support |
| 08:50.57 | josch | slowly I'm out of ideas what to do next |
| 08:52.14 | josch | I'm just uploading a clean debianchroot so people without debian'ish OS's can try verything out to |
| 08:54.43 | *** join/#openmoko TAsn-ghost (n=TAsn@89.1.19.222.dynamic.barak-online.net) |
| 08:59.13 | *** join/#openmoko Heinervdm (n=thomas@pD9E1710D.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 09:00.59 | *** join/#openmoko greentux_ (n=lemke@Z4047.z.pppool.de) |
| 09:02.36 | josch | hrm... it *may* be unwise to run a 34h mencoder job while mokomakefile'ing ^^ |
| 09:03.22 | *** join/#openmoko Varox_NB (n=doug@p4FD47756.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 09:03.32 | cb22 | josch: get a quad core :) |
| 09:03.33 | *** join/#openmoko lrg (n=liam@lrg2.demon.co.uk) |
| 09:03.36 | cb22 | and some raid |
| 09:04.47 | josch | could it be that the internal clock is reset everytime I remove the battery?? |
| 09:06.40 | *** join/#openmoko mmp (n=mmp@adsl-dyn43.78-99-66.t-com.sk) |
| 09:07.12 | *** join/#openmoko gopi (n=gopi@63.83.135.35) |
| 09:13.26 | *** join/#openmoko djk (n=djk@c-69-181-64-193.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 09:13.52 | *** join/#openmoko peepsalot (n=peeps@cpe-67-9-161-48.austin.res.rr.com) |
| 09:20.16 | CIA-17 | openmoko: 03rwhitby * r178 10mokomakefile/trunk/Makefile: Updated to point to new org.openmoko.dev branch, and to move mokomakefile back to projects.openmoko.org |
| 09:22.16 | ScaredyCat | new dev branch? |
| 09:22.52 | rwhitby | ScaredyCat: XorA is sending the email now |
| 09:24.43 | josch | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Debian <= have fun trying debian out :-D |
| 09:25.27 | *** join/#openmoko patryk_ (n=patryk@static-ip-194-106-214-184.promax.media.pl) |
| 09:27.22 | XorA | Mail is off |
| 09:30.15 | rwhitby | like a bucket of prawns in the sun? |
| 09:30.40 | ScaredyCat | slaps XorA |
| 09:32.38 | XorA | kicks ScaredyCat in the stones |
| 09:34.18 | CIA-17 | openmoko: 03rwhitby * r14 10mokomakefile/trunk/Makefile: Removed the update-stable and update-bleeding-edge targets, as they no longer make any sense. |
| 09:34.55 | ScaredyCat | XorA: where is the om server holding the new branch ? |
| 09:35.11 | XorA | ScaredyCat: same server |
| 09:35.24 | ScaredyCat | oh... |
| 09:35.32 | ScaredyCat | fairy muff |
| 09:35.51 | XorA | it servers something like 8 branches |
| 09:36.20 | ScaredyCat | ok, so have you built from the new branch yet? |
| 09:36.25 | ScaredyCat | (a clean build) |
| 09:37.01 | rwhitby | XorA: so what is the work-flow for someone in the community to fix a problem in the org.openmoko.dev branch? We used to be able to fix in org.openembedded.dev and it would appear on the OM server a week or less later. What do we do now? |
| 09:37.43 | *** join/#openmoko thomasgruebler (n=thomasgr@85-124-167-249.work.xdsl-line.inode.at) |
| 09:38.46 | ScaredyCat | he's hiding.. or he's eaten some of those prawns |
| 09:39.20 | XorA | rwhitby: the same |
| 09:39.46 | XorA | rwhitby: I will propogate from org.openembedded.dev at least once a week |
| 09:40.17 | rwhitby | XorA: do you build using sane-srcrevs.inc or moko-autorev.inc ? |
| 09:40.28 | rwhitby | (for testing your propagation result) |
| 09:40.31 | XorA | rwhitby: buildhost builds using moko-autorev.inc |
| 09:40.39 | XorA | rwhitby: I normally use both |
| 09:40.55 | rwhitby | yes, but what do you test your propagation with as the gate for promoting it to org.openmoko.dev? |
| 09:41.33 | XorA | rwhitby: I do the merge, then check that it works |
| 09:41.36 | ScaredyCat | test? test! |
| 09:41.37 | ScaredyCat | hhahahahaa |
| 09:41.41 | XorA | rwhitby: so I test the destination, not the source |
| 09:41.59 | ScaredyCat | pokes XorA with a teasing stick |
| 09:42.00 | XorA | rwhitby: but I only have bandwidth to test in OM and Angstrom |
| 09:42.12 | rwhitby | XorA: yes, but do you guarantee that you test it with sane-srcrevs.inc, or do you just test moko-autorev.inc? |
| 09:42.33 | XorA | rwhitby: I always test with sane-srcrevs.inc unless I fuck up |
| 09:42.45 | rwhitby | XorA: cool, thanks. |
| 09:42.47 | XorA | rwhitby: in fact my latest bug onlu happened with AUTOREV :-) |
| 09:43.39 | ScaredyCat | so, you're going to port every change in oe dev ? |
| 09:43.42 | ScaredyCat | on your own? |
| 09:49.24 | XorA | ScaredyCat: mtn propogate is easy |
| 09:49.59 | rwhitby | josch, CM: did the makefile ask you to remove the openembedded directory before or after it checked out the new patches directory? |
| 09:50.04 | ScaredyCat | but wont you face the same problems you faced prior to the change... |
| 09:51.11 | CM | rwhitby: Before it said make setup-patches |
| 09:51.45 | XorA | ScaredyCat: the main problem is org.openembedded.dev on openmoko server wasnt the same as org.openembedded.dev of OE server, and so if someone pushed from OM -> OE you get a lot of crap that really shouldnt be in OE.dev |
| 09:51.55 | XorA | ScaredyCat: and a lot of false history |
| 09:52.19 | XorA | ScaredyCat: I have come within milliseconds of doing that a few times |
| 09:52.19 | rwhitby | huh? it should have said remove patches, then make setup-patches. my question is when you ran make setup-patches, did it immediately ask you to remove openembedded, or did it checkout the new patches and then ask you to remove openembedded? |
| 09:52.29 | CM | Ah, ok |
| 09:53.04 | ScaredyCat | XorA: oh, not good then |
| 09:53.47 | CM | After I did the make setup_patches, then did a make setup and it said "You will need to run 'rm -rf openembedded stamps/openembedded' after..." |
| 09:53.52 | ScaredyCat | I din't realise you weren't working on oe dev real, rather than oe dev moko |
| 09:54.39 | CIA-17 | openmoko: 03erin_yueh * r4242 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/applications/openmoko-messages2/ (ChangeLog src/sms-compose.c src/sms-compose.h src/sms-dbus.c): openmoko-messages2: display recipient number from call log |
| 09:54.40 | XorA | ScaredyCat: Im an OE developer 1st priority and an OM/OE developer second |
| 09:55.23 | ScaredyCat | yeah, I meant that as "in your om/oe capacity" |
| 09:55.31 | *** join/#openmoko pwerken (n=pwerken@83.119.198.36) |
| 09:55.56 | XorA | ScaredyCat: I always try and put stuff in OE.dev first, but the guys inside OM use OM.dev |
| 09:55.56 | ScaredyCat | I assumes that oe.dev == oe.dev-moko |
| 09:56.06 | ScaredyCat | right |
| 09:56.09 | ScaredyCat | k |
| 09:56.11 | XorA | ScaredyCat: then I or John do a two way merge |
| 09:56.12 | ScaredyCat | clear now |
| 09:56.28 | XorA | which isnt so clear when they are the same branch names |
| 09:56.35 | ScaredyCat | no |
| 09:57.01 | XorA | and I see a time in the future when there is org.openmoko.stable |
| 09:58.23 | ScaredyCat | so there is no 'bleeding' edge now, because om's branch may differ wildly from oe.dev .. |
| 10:01.30 | *** join/#openmoko kies (n=kies@adsl-76-199-13-102.dsl.chmpil.sbcglobal.net) |
| 10:01.43 | XorA | ScaredyCat: no different than what there was before |
| 10:03.33 | ScaredyCat | ? |
| 10:05.15 | rwhitby | XorA: are these errors expected?: http://www.pastebin.ca/955064 |
| 10:07.17 | *** join/#openmoko _diego_ (n=diego@host-84-222-14-60.cust-adsl.tiscali.it) |
| 10:10.19 | josch | IT WORKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
| 10:10.22 | josch | I GOT X!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
| 10:10.24 | josch | wohooo! |
| 10:11.26 | XorA | rwhitby: yes, means someone is ahead of me updating software |
| 10:11.47 | XorA | rwhitby: and some bad person is deleting old versions without checking a DISTRO is using them |
| 10:13.14 | CM | XorA: Can I get glib-2.5 to be found somehow? It's built, but seems to be missing for that virtual/arm-angstrom-linux-gnueabi-libc-for-gcc thing |
| 10:13.19 | *** join/#openmoko miip (n=miip@p54A57348.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 10:13.44 | XorA | CM: thats a normal message and is not an error |
| 10:14.42 | *** join/#openmoko simon___1 (n=simon@h98n2fls301o1032.telia.com) |
| 10:15.28 | CM | Ok, but because of that I can't get past building pth |
| 10:15.36 | CM | I've really tried |
| 10:17.27 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@dsl093-060-111.pit1.dsl.speakeasy.net) |
| 10:17.54 | *** join/#openmoko ruoso (n=ruoso@195.23.92.2) |
| 10:21.46 | XorA | CM: I used to have that pth bug years ago, it was something to do with a value missing from an include file in arm glibc |
| 10:22.02 | CM | Ah, ok |
| 10:22.24 | CM | I've just cleaned out my tmp again and trying a rebuild from scratch |
| 10:22.30 | XorA | CM: if you look through the complex #if #else crap, I think its the stack offsets in setjmp.h |
| 10:22.33 | *** join/#openmoko jeffdamet1 (n=jeff@host-091-096-148-238.ewe-ip-backbone.de) |
| 10:22.35 | XorA | CM: from memory |
| 10:23.47 | *** join/#openmoko gopi (n=gopi@63.83.135.35) |
| 10:24.26 | CM | Ok, I'll try to figure it out |
| 10:24.31 | CM | Thanks for the hints :) |
| 10:26.59 | *** join/#openmoko fredtheca1 (n=martin@82-42-255-216.cable.ubr12.brad.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 10:28.23 | *** join/#openmoko johncylee (n=john@firewall.tw.openmoko.org) |
| 10:33.57 | josch | has somebody an idea which touchscreen driver to use for the neo1973 display? |
| 10:34.19 | XorA | tslib |
| 10:34.49 | *** join/#openmoko simon__ (n=simon@h98n2fls301o1032.telia.com) |
| 10:39.27 | *** join/#openmoko vaiursch (n=erwin@84-72-190-146.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 10:46.20 | josch | XorA, thanks! |
| 10:46.36 | josch | unfortunately there is no xserver-xorg-input-tslib package in the debian armel repo :-( |
| 10:47.01 | *** join/#openmoko KenSentMe (n=jeroen@kensentme.xs4all.nl) |
| 10:47.40 | *** join/#openmoko Tanuva (n=tanuva@e177233161.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 10:51.27 | XorA | josch: no, there are patches for Xorg kicking around somewhere |
| 10:52.13 | josch | XorA, meaning what? |
| 10:53.29 | XorA | josch: somewrote a driver for Xorg but never merged it |
| 10:54.40 | josch | so I do *not* need xserver-xorg-input-tslib ? |
| 10:56.02 | *** join/#openmoko rd_ (n=dr@vnsecurity.net) |
| 10:56.06 | XorA | well you do, but it doesnt exist |
| 10:57.28 | josch | http://packages.debian.org/sid/xserver-xorg-input-tslib <= this does not exist? |
| 10:57.35 | josch | doesnt understand :-( |
| 10:58.55 | XorA | josch: oh wow, things changed since I last looked |
| 10:59.30 | josch | XorA, neither the less i was told that this is a very new package |
| 10:59.53 | josch | i just arranged thi package to be build for armel too ;-) |
| 11:00.03 | josch | thanks to the guys at #debian-arm |
| 11:00.08 | XorA | excellent |
| 11:00.35 | *** join/#openmoko krau (n=cktakaha@200.184.118.132) |
| 11:06.08 | *** join/#openmoko patryk_ (n=patryk@static-ip-194-106-214-184.promax.media.pl) |
| 11:06.22 | *** join/#openmoko madwoota (i=mad@woota.net) |
| 11:07.00 | *** join/#openmoko Xilent (n=supersti@unaffiliated/xilent) |
| 11:18.39 | *** join/#openmoko poffy (n=poffy@c-98-199-135-173.hsd1.tx.comcast.net) |
| 11:19.22 | *** join/#openmoko n0t (n=kvirc@81-208-83-236.fastres.net) |
| 11:23.29 | *** join/#openmoko _rob_ (n=rob@85.233.59.8.static.cablesurf.de) |
| 11:25.44 | *** join/#openmoko antony (n=antony@59.97.56.145) |
| 11:25.52 | antony | hello people |
| 11:26.17 | antony | can anyone help me in looking at the fonts available to use in openmoko like the command xlsfonts in linux?? |
| 11:27.11 | *** join/#openmoko openwill (n=will@firewall.tw.openmoko.org) |
| 11:29.57 | antony | ?? |
| 11:30.08 | *** join/#openmoko zedstar (n=john@82-44-200-69.cable.ubr08.haye.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 11:31.34 | *** join/#openmoko BlueR|Home (n=andreas@p4FCACC9E.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 11:34.18 | XorA | ls /usr/share/truetype |
| 11:34.58 | antony | thanks for that but |
| 11:35.05 | antony | those are the font names.. |
| 11:35.15 | antony | while i need to use that font in gdk, |
| 11:35.43 | antony | i need fully qualified font name to load the font. something like this is required. "-misc-fixed-medium-r-semicondensed--13-120-75-75-c-60-iso8859-1" |
| 11:36.26 | antony | on giving xlsfonts in linux gives all these possible combinations and returns me the font names while i want to know whether there is any such command or downloadable utility for openmoko |
| 11:38.25 | XorA | fc-list or something like that |
| 11:38.29 | XorA | anyway I have to go |
| 11:38.53 | *** join/#openmoko Mathiasdm (n=Mathias@d54C597B6.access.telenet.be) |
| 11:39.51 | antony | fc-list just gives me the font name and textual description of that font but i need the fully qualified name |
| 11:40.00 | antony | anyway, thanks for your help XorA |
| 11:40.21 | *** join/#openmoko johncylee (n=john@firewall.tw.openmoko.org) |
| 11:40.22 | *** join/#openmoko Quadduc (n=stian@193.216.73.219) |
| 11:41.13 | *** join/#openmoko holycow (n=biteme@S01060016b6b53675.vf.shawcable.net) |
| 11:41.15 | *** join/#openmoko pjb_ (n=pjb@host81-156-90-104.range81-156.btcentralplus.com) |
| 11:42.42 | pjb_ | Just wondering if anyone has considered linking the full screen keyboard app to the accelerometers so when you are in a text field and rotate the device it then brings up the thumb board. |
| 11:44.25 | abraxa__ | pjb_: Sounds good in theory but I doubt it'll be very usable as that won't work when the Neo lies flat on a table, as far as I am aware |
| 11:45.31 | pjb_ | what if it was set as a default but could be configured. i can't see myself trying to type on the neo when it is on a tabletop unless i have an external keyboard |
| 11:46.17 | abraxa__ | Good point |
| 11:46.22 | *** join/#openmoko homyx (n=homyx@ppp-88-217-47-88.dynamic.mnet-online.de) |
| 11:48.53 | *** join/#openmoko homyx (n=homyx@ppp-88-217-47-88.dynamic.mnet-online.de) |
| 11:51.17 | *** join/#openmoko mohanl (n=mohan@202.71.146.210) |
| 11:55.09 | mohanl | #openmoko |
| 11:55.31 | madwoota | yes, yes it is |
| 11:56.22 | mohanl | how to install qemu on ubuntu 7.10 |
| 11:56.24 | pjb_ | Can anyone offer advice in setting up GPRS on the Neo. I live in the UK and use t-mobile |
| 11:56.30 | mohanl | i am new to openmoko |
| 11:58.31 | josch | mohanl, only qemu or whole openmoko to run in qemu? there are wiki pages about this |
| 12:00.46 | mohanl | i tryed usig this wiki but i got error |
| 12:01.07 | mohanl | i posted my error on community mailing list now only |
| 12:01.07 | *** join/#openmoko larry (n=larry@200.184.118.132) |
| 12:01.22 | pjb_ | mohani, at what stage did you get the error and what was the error. |
| 12:02.18 | mohanl | i posted full details abot my error on community mailing list |
| 12:03.01 | *** join/#openmoko mlcy (n=mlcy@c-d327e353.1434-1-64736c10.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se) |
| 12:06.00 | antony | can anyone help me on the fonts guys?? |
| 12:06.06 | *** join/#openmoko edistar_ (n=edistar@ip503ddd09.speed.planet.nl) |
| 12:08.21 | mohanl | <PROTECTED> |
| 12:08.23 | mohanl | when i run $openmoko/flash.sh i got the following error openmoko/flash.sh: line 91: 13634 Aborted (core dumped) $qemu -mtdblock "$script_dir/$flash_base" -kernel "$script_dir/$1" -serial stdio -nographic -usb -monitor null 0<&0 |
| 12:08.23 | mohanl | U-boot failed to finish writing in 300 seconds, giving up. |
| 12:08.57 | *** join/#openmoko Sup3rkiddo (n=sudharsh@unaffiliated/sudharsh) |
| 12:09.01 | pjb_ | zedstar, i was advised to speak to you in regards to gprs configuration. i didn't fully understand the message but something to do with thumbtribes over gprs. Can you help? |
| 12:10.10 | mohanl | #please |
| 12:11.46 | antony | can anyone help me in knowing the font strings available to load in gtk programming?? |
| 12:12.30 | abraxa__ | antony: Why do you need those strings to begin with? |
| 12:12.53 | antony | abraxa_ i am doing an application like contacts... |
| 12:13.07 | antony | abraxa_, i need to display larger fonts to display those names... |
| 12:13.45 | abraxa__ | antony: Using a GtkLabel? |
| 12:13.57 | abraxa__ | Or what widget do you use? |
| 12:14.29 | antony | abraxa_, so to load them i need font strings like "-misc-fixed-medium-r-semicondensed--13-120-75-75-c-60-iso8859-1" |
| 12:14.43 | antony | abraxa_, no. i am not using GtkLabel |
| 12:14.50 | *** join/#openmoko webjames (n=james@82-45-33-169.cable.ubr01.nail.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 12:15.06 | antony | abraxa_: i am just painting on the screen directly. |
| 12:15.17 | abraxa__ | uh... I see |
| 12:15.50 | webjames | balrog-kun, just so you know that u-boot fix re: qemu hasn't gone live yet, i'm having to use an old u-boot image at the moment |
| 12:17.36 | antony | abraxa_: the equivalent command in linux is xlsfonts |
| 12:18.30 | *** join/#openmoko adamblokus (n=adam@chello087206115169.chello.pl) |
| 12:19.13 | *** join/#openmoko ajbrun (n=ajbrun@host86-155-35-175.range86-155.btcentralplus.com) |
| 12:21.45 | abraxa__ | antony: There's xlsfonts in OE, so why not just try a "ipkg install xlsfonts"? |
| 12:23.36 | antony | abraxa_: thanks a lot for that suggestion but i dont have the package in phone or internet in Openmoko.. |
| 12:23.42 | *** join/#openmoko fredthecat (n=martin@82-42-255-216.cable.ubr12.brad.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 12:23.54 | antony | abraxa_:so, i how do i proceed about? any idea? |
| 12:26.54 | abraxa__ | antony: I'm sure people like ScaredyCat will gladly build it for you - I'm building it as we speak but it might be a little bit |
| 12:28.06 | *** join/#openmoko jserv-- (n=jserv@220-137-160-179.dynamic.hinet.net) |
| 12:28.31 | *** part/#openmoko J-23 (n=aldwulf@a105.net128.okay.pl) |
| 12:29.13 | *** join/#openmoko J-23 (n=aldwulf@a105.net128.okay.pl) |
| 12:29.45 | *** join/#openmoko greentux__ (n=lemke@Z769a.z.pppool.de) |
| 12:30.17 | antony | abraxa_: oh!! thank you |
| 12:31.12 | *** part/#openmoko J-23 (n=aldwulf@a105.net128.okay.pl) |
| 12:31.23 | *** join/#openmoko tombhadAC (n=tombhad@pD95DECCF.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 12:31.24 | abraxa__ | You're welcome (don't thank just yet, the package hasn't finished building yet ;) |
| 12:31.45 | *** join/#openmoko playya (n=playya@pD9E0ADCF.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 12:32.34 | antony | abraxa_: i am happy and thankful that, you people did this help.. :-D |
| 12:33.10 | ScaredyCat | xlsfonts built, uploading |
| 12:33.44 | abraxa__ | lol |
| 12:33.47 | abraxa__ | Sneaky! |
| 12:33.55 | antony | thank GOD!!! |
| 12:34.39 | ScaredyCat | :) |
| 12:35.19 | *** join/#openmoko morricone (n=foobar@dslb-084-057-186-233.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 12:35.29 | ccfly | go Cats ! :> |
| 12:35.44 | ccfly | nice splashscreen by the way |
| 12:36.03 | antony | just a minute guys, i found a tar file for xlsfonts and i have transferred that to openmoko.. |
| 12:36.14 | antony | now to which location should i extract it?? |
| 12:37.08 | *** join/#openmoko t0h (n=tommi@dsl-kvlbrasgw2-fe0cdf00-1.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 12:37.11 | *** join/#openmoko J-23 (n=aldwulf@a105.net128.okay.pl) |
| 12:38.44 | ScaredyCat | ccfly: the one with or without nostrils |
| 12:38.45 | ScaredyCat | ? |
| 12:39.30 | ccfly | I've seen only one :> |
| 12:40.27 | ScaredyCat | ok, well I updated it because people didn;t seem to like staring up my nose... |
| 12:40.40 | *** join/#openmoko ajbrun (n=ajbrun@host86-155-35-175.range86-155.btcentralplus.com) |
| 12:40.57 | ScaredyCat | so if there's no face, it's the new one :) |
| 12:42.13 | *** join/#openmoko Demitar (n=demitar@83.209.99.159) |
| 12:42.30 | abraxa__ | antony: Are you sure the tar contains an ARM binary? |
| 12:42.31 | ScaredyCat | ccfly: did it have a build string down the left? |
| 12:42.37 | ccfly | yup |
| 12:43.55 | antony | abraxa_: i dont know... i tried to extract the tar.bz2 file using the command tar -xjvf <filename> |
| 12:44.18 | antony | abraxa_: but it shows the error, "Invalid tar magic" |
| 12:44.56 | abraxa__ | antony: Hm, interesting but you can save yourself time and effort: |
| 12:44.58 | *** join/#openmoko ajbrun (n=ajbrun@host86-155-35-175.range86-155.btcentralplus.com) |
| 12:45.29 | abraxa__ | cd /etc/ipkg; wget http://buildhost.automated.it/OM2007.2/packages/scaredycat.conf && ipkg update && ipkg install xlsfonts |
| 12:45.37 | *** join/#openmoko cmarcelo (n=cmarcelo@enlightenment/developer/cmarcelo) |
| 12:45.47 | *** join/#openmoko Openfree (n=df@218.79.154.204) |
| 12:45.56 | ScaredyCat | isn't it opkg now? |
| 12:46.05 | ScaredyCat | depends on the version you have I guess |
| 12:46.16 | abraxa__ | Ah, righty |
| 12:46.31 | abraxa__ | Didn't know the switch already took place |
| 12:46.43 | *** join/#openmoko ajbrun (n=ajbrun@host86-155-35-175.range86-155.btcentralplus.com) |
| 12:46.53 | *** join/#openmoko rharha (n=rharhacu@58.147.191.242) |
| 12:47.04 | antony | abraxa_: but the problem of using the internet comes up again... |
| 12:47.24 | abraxa__ | antony: What problem do you have with it? |
| 12:47.38 | antony | abraxa_: i cant access itnernet from my openmoko.. i can just transfer contents to my openmoko thru data cable |
| 12:48.08 | *** join/#openmoko Marex (n=marex@gwfm10-3-250.802.cz) |
| 12:48.18 | ScaredyCat | rwhitby: the instructions in your new makefile are incorrect |
| 12:48.26 | abraxa__ | antony: Your host system is linux, I assume? |
| 12:48.41 | antony | abraxa_: yes.. |
| 12:49.09 | rwhitby | ScaredyCat: in what way? |
| 12:49.29 | abraxa__ | antony: Are you interested in fixing network access? If not then it's easier to just download the xlsfonts package on your host, transfer it to the Neo and install it there |
| 12:49.48 | ScaredyCat | "You will need to run 'rm -rf openembedded stamps/openembedded' after |
| 12:49.48 | ScaredyCat | making sure you have no local changes in that tree. |
| 12:49.48 | ScaredyCat | Then run 'make update-mtn setup-openembedded' to get the new branch." |
| 12:50.26 | antony | abraxa_: actually, my first preference is the fonts but still i do need to know about network access to... |
| 12:50.59 | rwhitby | waits for ScaredyCat to actually answer the question |
| 12:51.08 | antony | abraxa_: do you know of any location to download some package like rpm of xlsfonts for OE? |
| 12:51.09 | abraxa__ | ScaredyCat: Where did you upload the package to? I can't find it on bh.automated.it |
| 12:51.16 | ScaredyCat | hold on.. rwhitby |
| 12:51.23 | ScaredyCat | had to start ff |
| 12:51.37 | *** join/#openmoko Niluge_KiWi (n=niluge_k@mut38-2-89-84-251-188.dsl.club-internet.fr) |
| 12:51.51 | ScaredyCat | 1 sec abraxa__ |
| 12:52.02 | antony | abraxa_: i have the xlsfonts.tar.bz2 file for OE downloaded from openmoko.org |
| 12:52.21 | abraxa__ | antony: Can I see the URL? |
| 12:52.33 | ScaredyCat | pastebin.ca suck with slowness |
| 12:53.09 | antony | abraxa_: http://downloads.openmoko.org/sources/xlsfonts-X11R7.0-1.0.1.tar.bz2 |
| 12:53.35 | abraxa__ | antony: Ah, the sources won't help I'm afraid as they don't contain a binary |
| 12:53.47 | antony | abraxa_: oh ok... |
| 12:54.07 | abraxa__ | antony: Let's wait until that little evil kitten here has finished his duties and helps us out ;) |
| 12:54.07 | antony | abraxa_: then i think i will have to search for binaries to directly install and use it.. |
| 12:54.17 | antony | abraxa_: sure.. i can wait... |
| 12:54.35 | antony | abraxa_: meanwhile can you help you out with the network access??, if you wish to |
| 12:54.52 | abraxa__ | antony: Yeah, sure thing. What did you configure so far? |
| 12:55.24 | antony | abraxa_: i have configured nothing in the network side yet in OE. |
| 12:57.08 | abraxa_ | antony: What's your network setup? Neo -> PC -> router -> internet? |
| 12:57.41 | antony | abraxa_: Neo ->Router->internet. |
| 12:57.53 | antony | abraxa_: i have a Wi-Fi network and a wireless router.. |
| 12:58.12 | abraxa_ | antony: You have a GTA02? :) |
| 12:58.17 | *** part/#openmoko cmarcelo (n=cmarcelo@enlightenment/developer/cmarcelo) |
| 12:58.29 | abraxa_ | Cause GTA01 has no WiFi so just wondering |
| 12:59.17 | antony | abraxa_: i do have a GTA02 but the OS installed by the Openmoko developers while giving us is the OS of GTA01 |
| 12:59.30 | abraxa_ | Ohh nice! |
| 12:59.33 | abraxa_ | Lucky you |
| 13:00.03 | abraxa_ | In that case... were you able to associate with the router already? |
| 13:00.10 | antony | \a |
| 13:00.12 | antony | \ |
| 13:00.37 | rwhitby | examines ScaredyCat's pastebin, and refutes any error |
| 13:00.49 | ScaredyCat | pfft... |
| 13:01.02 | ScaredyCat | stuffs rwhitby into pastebin |
| 13:01.08 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@209.195.169.219) |
| 13:02.36 | XorA | morning |
| 13:02.57 | abraxa_ | Ahoy XorA |
| 13:03.10 | antony | abraxa_: unfortunately, the OS installed in my GTA0 is the OS supporting GTA01 |
| 13:03.32 | antony | abraxa_: so the wi-fi menu itself is not popping up... |
| 13:03.43 | antony | abraxa_: thats very bad. i will not be able to configure |
| 13:03.48 | antony | \type |
| 13:04.27 | antony | frowns for not being lucky on network access in OE |
| 13:04.29 | abraxa_ | antony: Unfortunately I'm not familiar with the wifi setup of GTA02 myself so unless you find someone who knows how to configure it you'll have to use USB networking |
| 13:04.47 | abraxa_ | hehe, and btw... OE = OpenEmbedded |
| 13:05.08 | antony | abraxa_: oh fine... i thought OE = Openmoko Environment |
| 13:05.33 | antony | abraxa_: is there a way, i can access internet thru USB networking?? |
| 13:05.38 | abraxa_ | Yeah |
| 13:06.46 | abraxa_ | antony: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/USB_Networking |
| 13:07.02 | antony | abraxa_: thank you so much |
| 13:07.18 | abraxa_ | No prob |
| 13:07.41 | antony | has heard that "Ahoy" word in some famous game... |
| 13:10.44 | *** join/#openmoko darmou (n=darmou@ppp59-167-90-189.lns2.mel6.internode.on.net) |
| 13:10.54 | abraxa_ | antony: shoragan said wifi configuration works as on a desktop (iwconfig) and no special kernel/driver is necessary - so you might wanna try if it works for you |
| 13:11.13 | *** join/#openmoko MetaMorfoziS (n=avr@3e70d272.adsl.enternet.hu) |
| 13:11.51 | shoragan | and wpa_supplicant should work, too |
| 13:12.26 | abraxa_ | antony: ifconfig eth0 up; iwconfig eth0 essid <foo> |
| 13:13.04 | shoragan | iwlist scan worked |
| 13:13.17 | XorA | cant get GTA02 wifi working |
| 13:13.45 | shoragan | did you see the driver's output while loading? |
| 13:13.48 | ScaredyCat | what was your problem abraxa_?? |
| 13:14.31 | XorA | shoragan: I have same problem as mickeyl just wont associate |
| 13:14.46 | antony | shoragan: the iwconfig command in moko gives me two interfaces lo and usb0 and says, no wireless connection. |
| 13:14.48 | XorA | shoragan: we are trying to debug it in .tw now |
| 13:14.51 | shoragan | did you try ad-hoc? |
| 13:15.02 | mickeyl | XorA: please comment to #1250 with your access point data |
| 13:15.08 | *** join/#openmoko ajbrun (n=ajbrun@host86-155-35-175.range86-155.btcentralplus.com) |
| 13:15.52 | abraxa_ | ScaredyCat: I couldn't find the xlsfonts ipk on bg.automated.it - mind giving a hint? :) |
| 13:16.05 | shoragan | mickey, didn't your's work when we tried it in the train from fosdem? |
| 13:16.18 | *** join/#openmoko lsobral (n=sobral@200.184.118.132) |
| 13:16.32 | XorA | mickeyl: wrt54g, we tried to get one setup in office today to debug, but it was busted beyond repair |
| 13:16.35 | antony | abraxa_: i think since i have a GTA01 OS, the command iwconfig too doesnt work. :-( |
| 13:16.53 | XorA | mickeyl: the guys are supposed to scour the shops for another wrt54g |
| 13:17.13 | XorA | mickeyl: the GSM oscillation we make good progress on though |
| 13:17.31 | ScaredyCat | did you update? |
| 13:17.43 | XorA | mickeyl: and the sound problem we see tomorrow if we fixed |
| 13:18.42 | abraxa_ | ScaredyCat: Was gonna give antony the URL to the ipkg so he can download it to his host as his neo doesn't have internet access yet |
| 13:18.57 | *** join/#openmoko ajbrun (n=ajbrun@host86-155-35-175.range86-155.btcentralplus.com) |
| 13:19.01 | ScaredyCat | ahh ok 1 sec |
| 13:19.56 | ScaredyCat | http://buildhost.automated.it/OM2007.2/packages/armv4t/xlsfonts_1.0.2-r0_armv4t.ipk |
| 13:20.46 | antony | thank you so much guys for the valuable help |
| 13:20.47 | antony | :-D |
| 13:20.54 | abraxa_ | antony: That URL is for you ;) - put it on the neo and then install it with "ipkg install xlsfonts_1.0.2-r0_armv4t.ipk" (or opkg, dunno if it changed) |
| 13:21.34 | antony | abraxa_: thanks a lot for you too for your help.. i finished downloading and i am in the processof uploading it in moko. |
| 13:22.19 | *** join/#openmoko andrunko (n=andrunko@200.184.118.132) |
| 13:22.23 | ScaredyCat | now in exchange antony ... we want your gta02 :) |
| 13:22.50 | XorA | all your gta02 are belong to me |
| 13:23.20 | mickeyl | shoragan: see bug 1250. it has problems with _some_ APs |
| 13:23.27 | shoragan | ahrg |
| 13:23.46 | shoragan | is it a problem with our driver? |
| 13:23.52 | buz | and that's exactly mine listed there :( |
| 13:23.58 | mickeyl | XorA: ok, glad to hear (gsm osc and sound) |
| 13:24.07 | mickeyl | i have a strange problem |
| 13:24.09 | mickeyl | where i might need your help |
| 13:24.12 | *** part/#openmoko antony (n=antony@59.97.56.145) |
| 13:24.19 | XorA | mickeyl: nothing personal now :-) |
| 13:24.26 | abraxa_ | lol |
| 13:25.07 | ScaredyCat | rates the channel at 21+ |
| 13:26.00 | ScaredyCat | mickeyl: I put those applet icons and the theme on bugzilla. |
| 13:26.13 | mickeyl | ScaredyCat: cool, thanks! |
| 13:26.26 | ScaredyCat | although that was a job in itself, is there any reason that you can't add a file at the time you create the bug? |
| 13:26.39 | mickeyl | heh |
| 13:26.41 | mickeyl | bugzilla... |
| 13:26.47 | ScaredyCat | I had to create i, then go back and add the file... mad. |
| 13:28.14 | ScaredyCat | there is one fix needed on the theme... but that's in the bug - just to make thos happy |
| 13:28.26 | ScaredyCat | 1291 and 1293 iirc |
| 13:28.34 | ScaredyCat | !ombug 1291 |
| 13:28.36 | Niluge_KiWi | I'd like to apply for GSoC, and I don't know if I should submit my application on the openmoko mailing list, or somewhere else. |
| 13:28.36 | cdbot2 | * * Bug 1291, Status: NEW, Created: Unknown |
| 13:28.37 | cdbot2 | * * scaredycat(AT)automated.it: ScaredyCat's applet icons |
| 13:28.38 | cdbot2 | * * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=1291 |
| 13:28.41 | *** join/#openmoko greentux_ (n=lemke@Z4a49.z.pppool.de) |
| 13:28.43 | ScaredyCat | !ombug 1293 |
| 13:28.44 | cdbot2 | * * Bug 1293, Status: NEW, Created: Unknown |
| 13:28.45 | cdbot2 | * * scaredycat(AT)automated.it: ScaredyCat's alternate theme |
| 13:28.46 | cdbot2 | * * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=1293 |
| 13:29.23 | rwhitby | wonders if knowing where to submit the GSoC application is the first test ... |
| 13:29.45 | XorA | oh mickeyl neither I or koen can compile any E stuff, edje_cc eats up all the memory and then segfaults |
| 13:29.52 | mickeyl | good |
| 13:29.55 | ScaredyCat | lol |
| 13:29.58 | mickeyl | <mickeyl> i have a strange problem |
| 13:29.58 | mickeyl | <mickeyl> where i might need your help |
| 13:29.59 | XorA | mickeyl: 3G of memory eaten on my machine at OM |
| 13:30.13 | mickeyl | currently i'm trying to go back in time |
| 13:30.19 | mickeyl | to find out where the problem comes from |
| 13:30.20 | ScaredyCat | that happened to me with emotion(?) |
| 13:30.28 | mickeyl | something really strange is happening here |
| 13:30.29 | mickeyl | please see |
| 13:30.33 | mickeyl | http://pastebin.ca/955166 |
| 13:30.42 | mickeyl | complete stack overflow |
| 13:30.44 | Niluge_KiWi | rwhitby: Yes probably :), in fact I saw some applications on the mailing list, so I wondered if it was the right place. |
| 13:31.23 | XorA | mickeyl: erk, file a bug, tick doesnt see it at all |
| 13:31.32 | XorA | mickeyl: on either of the 3 machines he builds on |
| 13:31.38 | mickeyl | really? |
| 13:31.40 | mickeyl | now taht sucks |
| 13:31.45 | mickeyl | i see it on all my machines |
| 13:32.05 | XorA | my build machine is turned off, but I see it on OM machine |
| 13:32.10 | mickeyl | i went back one week |
| 13:32.11 | mickeyl | still broken |
| 13:32.16 | mickeyl | going to go back aonther week |
| 13:32.30 | XorA | my build machine is turned off, but I see it on OM machine/ |
| 13:32.39 | mickeyl | yes, got it already :) |
| 13:32.47 | XorA | OM is using a march date though? the one you rolled back |
| 13:33.21 | XorA | someone put the shift key n eeePC too close to up arrow |
| 13:33.44 | *** join/#openmoko slchen (n=slchen@61-228-27-124.dynamic.hinet.net) |
| 13:33.57 | ScaredyCat | XorA: is your build machine off? do you see it on OM machine? |
| 13:33.58 | ScaredyCat | :P |
| 13:34.01 | *** join/#openmoko djk_ (n=djk@h-67-103-121-195.snfccasy.covad.net) |
| 13:34.19 | XorA | ScaredyCat: no and yes :-) |
| 13:34.33 | mickeyl | XorA: it does not look to be a problem in EFL |
| 13:34.37 | ScaredyCat | heheh wow, how did I get that :) |
| 13:34.58 | mickeyl | XorA: i'm going back w/ mtn |
| 13:35.00 | ScaredyCat | gest a segfault with the theme |
| 13:35.08 | ScaredyCat | e.edj theme |
| 13:35.18 | ScaredyCat | -e. |
| 13:35.25 | mickeyl | could be dlopen |
| 13:35.27 | XorA | its rasters anti OE code :-) |
| 13:35.33 | mickeyl | right |
| 13:35.36 | mickeyl | that could be |
| 13:35.43 | XorA | koen sees same problem as well |
| 13:36.02 | mickeyl | downgrades another week |
| 13:36.29 | mickeyl | do you know offhand when the new staging came in? |
| 13:36.52 | XorA | no |
| 13:36.57 | XorA | but OM doesnt use it |
| 13:37.14 | ScaredyCat | 2008-03-04 |
| 13:37.20 | mickeyl | thanks |
| 13:37.22 | XorA | oh sorry you mean sysroot |
| 13:37.24 | mickeyl | yes |
| 13:37.26 | mickeyl | sysroot |
| 13:37.46 | mickeyl | although it's actually a problem in *-native |
| 13:37.59 | mickeyl | which is iirc not affected by sysroot |
| 13:38.00 | XorA | oh mickeyl tell raster to not use e.h as the main E header thats just studpid |
| 13:41.05 | *** join/#openmoko renatofilho^_ (n=renato@200.184.118.132) |
| 13:41.17 | *** join/#openmoko peepsalot (n=peeps@cpe-67-9-161-48.austin.res.rr.com) |
| 13:41.48 | *** join/#openmoko k-s (n=gustavo@200.184.118.132) |
| 13:44.33 | *** join/#openmoko peepsalot (n=peeps@cpe-67-9-161-48.austin.res.rr.com) |
| 13:44.42 | mohanl | I am unable to run flash.sh for my qemu-1973 checkout ... I am trying to follow http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/OpenMoko_under_QEMU |
| 13:44.56 | mohanl | The error is http://rafb.net/p/0BwAuS84.html |
| 13:46.22 | *** join/#openmoko Robwoerle (n=bob@M8f2b.m.pppool.de) |
| 13:46.40 | mohanl | XorA: mickeyl ^^^ |
| 13:47.35 | XorA | fedora core? |
| 13:47.37 | mickeyl | isn't that was what been talking about on the list? |
| 13:47.44 | Niluge_KiWi | mohanl: it's an issue with the u-boot...bin file, try with this one instead : http://buildhost.openmoko.org/daily/neo1973/deploy/glibc/images/neo1973/u-boot-gta01bv4-1.3.1+git0+b29661fc1151077776454288051bc9a488351ce8+svn4230-r3.bin |
| 13:48.01 | mohanl | XorA: its ubuntu gutsy |
| 13:48.13 | XorA | listen to the others then |
| 13:49.07 | mohanl | Niluge_KiWi: where do I keep that file ? ( I am new) |
| 13:50.45 | Niluge_KiWi | mohanl: here : images/openmoko |
| 13:51.53 | Niluge_KiWi | mohanl: and I think you should remove the other u-boot file too |
| 13:52.37 | *** join/#openmoko Marex (n=marex@gwfm10-3-250.802.cz) |
| 13:54.30 | mickeyl | ok, found a version where edje_cc still works |
| 13:54.33 | mickeyl | 9b067b2f0dd220246d5a920b6ef71cc10a6404c3 (2008-02-22 13:27) |
| 13:54.45 | mickeyl | advancing one more week now |
| 13:56.53 | shoragan | mickeyl, do you have scripts for automatic bisection? |
| 13:56.58 | mickeyl | no :/ |
| 13:57.04 | mickeyl | i am the manual bisector |
| 13:57.12 | mohanl | Niluge_KiWi: There is no images folder in qemu-1973 |
| 13:57.45 | mickeyl | once we're using git i know there are some scripts for that |
| 13:57.53 | XorA | its not bisection if yiu hunt backwards only |
| 13:58.28 | mickeyl | sure |
| 13:58.33 | mickeyl | i'm in advancing mode now |
| 13:59.05 | *** join/#openmoko giantbicycle (n=giant@140.116.226.216) |
| 13:59.25 | mickeyl | trying 2008-03-03 now |
| 13:59.29 | *** join/#openmoko greentux__ (n=lemke@Z5b71.z.pppool.de) |
| 13:59.34 | mickeyl | thankfully for now i only need edje-native |
| 13:59.42 | mickeyl | so no toolchain etc. |
| 14:00.36 | XorA | what is changing, the edje recipe or cvs sourcedate? |
| 14:00.50 | mickeyl | mtn revision |
| 14:01.02 | mickeyl | like i said, i don't believe it's EFL |
| 14:02.48 | *** join/#openmoko peepsalot (n=peeps@cpe-67-9-161-48.austin.res.rr.com) |
| 14:03.03 | mickeyl | but since i don't have any idea, i first try to find the mtn revision |
| 14:03.30 | mickeyl | since putting back EFL SRCDATE did have no effect |
| 14:03.35 | mickeyl | even to a january version which i _know_ was good |
| 14:04.48 | mickeyl | that's got to be the dumbest job i ever did |
| 14:04.49 | mickeyl | *sigh* |
| 14:05.20 | mickeyl | well it's not... i did some more dumb things ;) |
| 14:05.28 | abraxa_ | Care to share? ;) |
| 14:05.46 | mickeyl | NO WAY! :D |
| 14:05.48 | *** join/#openmoko peepsalot (n=peeps@cpe-67-9-161-48.austin.res.rr.com) |
| 14:06.08 | mickeyl | k-s: Gustavo, any reason why python-etk is not yet in cvs? |
| 14:06.08 | abraxa_ | Awww =( |
| 14:06.31 | *** join/#openmoko larry (n=larry@200.184.118.132) |
| 14:07.51 | mickeyl | ok, so 2008-03-03 still works |
| 14:07.58 | mickeyl | trying 2008-03-05 now (after sysroot) |
| 14:13.58 | torpor | hey guys anyone know whats up with gettext-native? |
| 14:14.27 | Niluge_KiWi | mohanl: not in qemu-1973, the path I gave you is from the root where you downloaded the Makefile |
| 14:15.14 | mohanl | <PROTECTED> |
| 14:16.26 | torpor | ah, is ee the problem: sh: oe_sha256sum: command not found |
| 14:16.31 | torpor | anyone know wtf that is all about? |
| 14:18.02 | *** join/#openmoko Marex (n=marex@gwfm10-3-250.802.cz) |
| 14:18.09 | mickeyl | try bitbake shasum-native |
| 14:18.12 | mickeyl | should have been built though |
| 14:18.22 | torpor | it was but it wasn't in my path .. |
| 14:18.38 | torpor | i just copied it to my local ~/bin and will see if that fixes it .. |
| 14:18.39 | torpor | nope. |
| 14:18.57 | torpor | /home/j/hak/openmoko/build/tmp/work/i686-linux/shasum-native-1.0-r1/oe_sha256sum |
| 14:19.05 | torpor | /home/j/hak/openmoko/build/tmp/work/i686-linux/shasum-native-1.0-r1/oe_sha256sum |
| 14:19.12 | torpor | oops sorry |
| 14:19.24 | mickeyl | it should live in tmp/staging/<buildarch>/usr/bin/ |
| 14:19.42 | torpor | i don't know wtf is going on here. |
| 14:19.46 | torpor | | install: cannot stat `/home/j/hak/openmoko/tmp/staging/i686-linux/usr/share/aclocal/libtool.m4': No such file or directory |
| 14:19.49 | torpor | ? |
| 14:19.50 | torpor | eh? |
| 14:21.03 | *** part/#openmoko BlueR|Home (n=andreas@p4FCACC9E.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 14:22.07 | torpor | can you look at this mickeyl ? http://rafb.net/p/2VqKHK36.html |
| 14:22.26 | torpor | maybe let me know if you see any quick fix so i can get an image built today? |
| 14:22.26 | *** join/#openmoko peepsalot (n=peeps@cpe-67-9-161-48.austin.res.rr.com) |
| 14:22.41 | mickeyl | remove all the offending .la files |
| 14:22.49 | mickeyl | oder disable insanity.bbclass |
| 14:22.56 | mohanl | Niluge_KiWi: i dowloaded makefile under my home directory( /home/mohan/openmoko ).it is not correct please tell me where i have to download |
| 14:23.29 | mohanl | any other document link is there |
| 14:24.02 | *** join/#openmoko retracile (n=eli@76-204-213-211.lightspeed.allntx.sbcglobal.net) |
| 14:24.38 | torpor | mickeyl: i don't get it though, isn't this makefile supposed to be 'clean' so we don't have weird situations like this to deal with? |
| 14:25.44 | mickeyl | i have no idea about mokomakefile tbh. |
| 14:25.49 | torpor | ok |
| 14:26.01 | mickeyl | being an OE founder, i can't convince myself to use it |
| 14:26.02 | torpor | well i tried removing module.la and i still get the same errors. |
| 14:26.09 | torpor | yeah i can imagine that. |
| 14:26.10 | mickeyl | all *.la files? |
| 14:26.20 | torpor | i'm not sure why i bother with it either to be honest, but maybe its because OE scares me.. |
| 14:26.26 | torpor | no just the offending ones .. |
| 14:26.45 | *** join/#openmoko Ryback_ (n=ulisses@enlightenment/developer/ryback) |
| 14:27.15 | mickeyl | urghs |
| 14:27.18 | mickeyl | hmm |
| 14:27.21 | torpor | you still in brazil mickeyl? |
| 14:27.24 | mickeyl | 2003-08-05 works |
| 14:27.28 | torpor | well i'll just blow it off for now. |
| 14:27.31 | mickeyl | there goes my sysroot-is-to-blame theory |
| 14:27.39 | mickeyl | torpor: no, came back yesterday |
| 14:27.40 | torpor | step back from Openmoko for a few days until it sorts out. |
| 14:27.51 | *** join/#openmoko p3t3r__ (n=p3t3r__@wlan.net-you.de) |
| 14:27.54 | *** part/#openmoko p3t3r__ (n=p3t3r__@wlan.net-you.de) |
| 14:28.15 | XorA | feel lucky you can even build E stuff :-) |
| 14:28.23 | XorA | none of the rest of us can |
| 14:28.34 | torpor | meh |
| 14:28.34 | mickeyl | ok, 2003-03-10 now |
| 14:28.43 | torpor | sometimes i really don't get whats going on with all these forks and branches .. |
| 14:29.01 | torpor | i wish i could get to the bottom of it but i just don't get why there are so many different flavours .. |
| 14:29.55 | XorA | there are two branches and no flavours |
| 14:30.30 | Qwell | You can have any color you want, as long as it's red. |
| 14:30.42 | XorA | Qwell: orange for moko |
| 14:30.48 | Qwell | isn't it black now? |
| 14:30.52 | mickeyl | Mokorange is fading out |
| 14:30.55 | Qwell | because I *want* an orange freerunner |
| 14:30.57 | XorA | gtk theme is still orange |
| 14:31.06 | Qwell | mickeyl: can you make that happen? :D |
| 14:31.33 | mickeyl | Qwell: well, i have some orange parts spare |
| 14:31.39 | *** join/#openmoko Mathiasdm2 (n=Mathias@d54C597B6.access.telenet.be) |
| 14:31.40 | mickeyl | but there won't be an official one |
| 14:31.56 | Qwell | I wonder if there will be any third-party case companies |
| 14:32.01 | mickeyl | i hope so |
| 14:32.03 | XorA | visit OM office there are numerous colours hanging from ceiling :-) |
| 14:32.04 | Qwell | I would pay for orange, if somebody were to make it |
| 14:32.08 | pjz | thinks a hardwood case would be neat |
| 14:32.09 | mickeyl | that's the reason why we distributed the CAD files |
| 14:32.12 | torpor | well i'm trying to get the machines at the metalab to be used to build cases .. |
| 14:32.17 | Qwell | mickeyl: yeah.. |
| 14:33.01 | torpor | mickeyl: what are indt doing for openmoko? building new phones? |
| 14:33.15 | mickeyl | indt is not doing anything for OM |
| 14:33.18 | torpor | oh |
| 14:33.23 | mickeyl | indt just happens to work on things we also are interested |
| 14:33.24 | mickeyl | in |
| 14:33.29 | torpor | thought you were there for some strategic reason - just reading the blogs. |
| 14:33.30 | mickeyl | i happen to visited indt because of OE |
| 14:33.49 | *** join/#openmoko greentux_ (n=lemke@Z7010.z.pppool.de) |
| 14:33.50 | mickeyl | yes, strategic as in "they doing stuff we are doing. lets work together" |
| 14:34.18 | mickeyl | i had my OE hat on merging lots of stuff and giving them upstream access so we have less divergence |
| 14:35.26 | torpor | i see. |
| 14:35.33 | torpor | they've got their own fork of OE? |
| 14:35.38 | mickeyl | yep. for mamona |
| 14:35.48 | mickeyl | their E-based distro |
| 14:35.56 | torpor | ah right |
| 14:36.04 | torpor | don't know much about that yet |
| 14:36.08 | mickeyl | and i want to see mamona in OE mainland |
| 14:36.13 | mickeyl | could be very useful for zaurus |
| 14:36.20 | *** join/#openmoko greentux (n=lemke@Z7095.z.pppool.de) |
| 14:36.21 | mickeyl | and possible other models |
| 14:36.23 | torpor | low mem? |
| 14:36.56 | mickeyl | dunno the numbers |
| 14:37.26 | Qwell | mickeyl: you mentioned you were a founder of OE - how long has that been around now? |
| 14:37.37 | rwhitby | torpor: the mokomakefile has very little to no impact on whether your OE metadata will build cleanly. |
| 14:37.51 | mickeyl | Qwell: we're now in the 5th year. |
| 14:37.53 | mickeyl | We started 2003 |
| 14:37.59 | mickeyl | when we phased out OpenZaurus |
| 14:38.15 | mickeyl | because it did not scale with more target systems |
| 14:38.18 | rwhitby | once it sets up a couple of conf files, all it does it call bitbake in exactly the same way that any other OE developer calls bitbake manually |
| 14:38.35 | torpor | rwhitby: but i don't get why i'm running into this issue .. i thought the mokomakefile was supposed to shield us from this, somewhat? |
| 14:38.39 | *** join/#openmoko patryk_ (n=patryk@static-ip-194-106-214-184.promax.media.pl) |
| 14:38.40 | mickeyl | actually the 6th year |
| 14:38.49 | rwhitby | torpor: no, what made you think that? |
| 14:38.52 | torpor | so everyone is having this issue with OE too? |
| 14:39.12 | rwhitby | all the mokomakefile shields you from is the initial effort to set up an OE build environment correctly. |
| 14:39.20 | torpor | what made me think that: i dunno, just some dumb assumption that the mokomakefile was for those who didn't want to hack too much on OE, but did want to have the tools to build apps for the environment. |
| 14:39.32 | rwhitby | no, that's the SDK you want. |
| 14:39.36 | torpor | ok |
| 14:39.41 | *** join/#openmoko LetoTo (n=paul@193.110.157.17) |
| 14:39.50 | rwhitby | ask mickeyl about the SDK |
| 14:39.59 | mickeyl | SDK! |
| 14:40.07 | mickeyl | 9 out of 10 users don't want OE |
| 14:40.11 | torpor | well don't worry about it i'll just let this sit and stew for a few days anyway .. i can still compile/build my app, its just that todays 'make update openmoko-devel-image' failed, and i'm usually a bit grumpy about it not being clean like that .. |
| 14:40.11 | mickeyl | they want to build software |
| 14:40.17 | Niluge_KiWi | mohanl: it's better to have the makefile in a sub folder, because it create files where it is. |
| 14:40.28 | rwhitby | torpor: please stop using OE and use the SDK instead. |
| 14:41.11 | torpor | mickeyl: thats what i'm doing with my openmoko tree, anyway - using it to build apps for OM/neo1973, and i know its a *faaaaat* way to do it, but its often great to see the changes in the base distro, and as well have reference to all the existing projects .. |
| 14:41.14 | rwhitby | it seems that it will suit your needs much better, and hopefully you'll get far less frustration from it |
| 14:41.16 | *** part/#openmoko LetoTo (n=paul@193.110.157.17) |
| 14:41.28 | mickeyl | torpor: no doubt, ya |
| 14:41.41 | mickeyl | torpor: it's pretty unique you can really rebuild a whole distro |
| 14:41.44 | torpor | i'll just let it stew for a day or two and come back to it in the meantime. |
| 14:42.02 | mickeyl | i don't know any commercial vendor who gives that opportunity to anyone but their bussiness partners... often not even to them |
| 14:42.09 | torpor | sure, its good to have the whole distro tool on board .. for my needs, its important to know how things are set up like thi. |
| 14:42.38 | torpor | mickeyl: i'm working for thales these days, in the rail group, building the base platform. we give our vendors all they need to build the whole system. |
| 14:42.44 | mickeyl | ooh |
| 14:42.45 | mickeyl | thales |
| 14:42.48 | mickeyl | fun |
| 14:42.54 | torpor | sarcasm |
| 14:42.56 | mickeyl | no |
| 14:43.18 | torpor | well it is sorta fun .. not as fun as embedded ARM, but i can't complain about having my own Intel tolapai board to work on these days .. |
| 14:43.26 | mickeyl | thales is interesting work. Dirk Opfer (tosa maintainer and oe contributor) worked many years for them |
| 14:43.54 | torpor | i've een there for 2 months now, its sorta sinking in to me that its fun. |
| 14:44.01 | torpor | nice to work with professor mcguire too .. |
| 14:44.46 | torpor | but i still have a lot of inspiration to write some kickass OM killer app and then use the fame and celebrity from that to start my own company/join up with someone else who wants to do handheld apps development .. |
| 14:46.07 | mickeyl | good plan |
| 14:46.08 | mickeyl | same here ;) |
| 14:46.09 | torpor | game screenshot: http://w1xer.de/ass/invscreen.jpg |
| 14:46.31 | mickeyl | cool |
| 14:46.39 | torpor | card-carrying membership: http://w1xer.de/ass/mokopic.jpg |
| 14:46.40 | torpor | ;) |
| 14:47.21 | XorA | mickeyl: how is your progress koen says chack around 2008-03-19T12:32:22 |
| 14:47.31 | *** part/#openmoko mohanl (n=mohan@202.71.146.210) |
| 14:47.51 | mickeyl | 5f47d416eff2a5b153b47ab40febb9ab6e523b06 works |
| 14:47.57 | torpor | mickeyl: seems like you've got a good run of it so far though, eh? flying all around the world/ |
| 14:47.59 | mickeyl | trying 0b604857bbf871639fdb43ee8380222e8ef64bb7 now |
| 14:48.01 | XorA | f52d7d3a273a02c7b40d7541a780ac5e72a1236c |
| 14:48.22 | mickeyl | torpor: indeed. i'm in "making yourself know by working on a revolutionary project" mode ;) |
| 14:48.28 | torpor | heh |
| 14:48.36 | mickeyl | torpor: next step. found your own thinktank with the best of the breed |
| 14:48.36 | *** join/#openmoko christooss (n=matic@BSN-77-106-146.dial-up.dsl.siol.net) |
| 14:48.40 | torpor | having fun watching you. |
| 14:48.45 | mickeyl | in 1 or 2 years |
| 14:48.47 | mickeyl | :)) |
| 14:48.56 | torpor | i gotta finish my apps .. then i'll be happy. |
| 14:49.11 | torpor | from there, if there's a chance to work with a handheld apps developer using linux, i'll go for it .. |
| 14:49.15 | torpor | until then, thales it is .. |
| 14:49.28 | mickeyl | righto |
| 14:49.43 | Sup3rkiddo | hi all, may i know who are the potential mentors for GSoC this year? mickey? |
| 14:49.45 | mickeyl | there should be plenty of opportunities for guys like us |
| 14:50.10 | torpor | indeed, hope to see those some day come to fruition.. |
| 14:50.11 | mickeyl | Sup3rkiddo: Daniel Willmann, Stefan Schmidt, Rob Tyler, Rob McQueen, me, hopefull some more |
| 14:50.25 | torpor | how does the mentoring for gsoc work? |
| 14:50.48 | mickeyl | you pick a project and try to help the student finishing it |
| 14:50.55 | mickeyl | (simplified) |
| 14:51.03 | *** join/#openmoko CVirus (n=GoD@82.201.178.6) |
| 14:51.20 | *** join/#openmoko Openfree (n=df@218.79.154.204) |
| 14:51.42 | Sup3rkiddo | mickeyl, i am not sure if you remember but I was pestering you guys on working on improving a gsmd implementation for fsm.org :D |
| 14:51.50 | Sup3rkiddo | on the lists that is... |
| 14:52.02 | mickeyl | i do remember |
| 14:52.05 | mickeyl | it's insane |
| 14:52.07 | mickeyl | we have 4 options |
| 14:52.13 | mickeyl | :/ |
| 14:52.13 | *** join/#openmoko _rob_ (n=rob@85.233.59.8.static.cablesurf.de) |
| 14:52.33 | Sup3rkiddo | mickeyl, i really feel some work on that would be really useful for us |
| 14:52.39 | Sup3rkiddo | us as in Openmoko |
| 14:52.45 | mickeyl | true |
| 14:53.17 | mickeyl | XorA: building Wed Mar 19 23:25:13 CET 2008 now |
| 14:53.30 | mickeyl | XorA: before you updating SRCDATE |
| 14:54.16 | mickeyl | bbiab, hungry |
| 14:54.54 | torpor | me too |
| 15:00.20 | *** join/#openmoko ce_geek (n=ce_geek@roger-blanchette-4.umelst.maine.edu) |
| 15:03.54 | mathroc | hi |
| 15:04.54 | mathroc | I'm trying to build openmoko to run it via qemu, I typed make run-qemu, but it fails because 'mtn' was not found, |
| 15:05.20 | mathroc | but I don't know waht mtn is, which package should I install to get it? |
| 15:06.29 | XorA | mtn is monotone |
| 15:07.20 | *** join/#openmoko j_ack (n=j_ack@dsbg-4db7ba21.pool.einsundeins.de) |
| 15:07.34 | mathroc | thx :) |
| 15:08.29 | *** join/#openmoko ajbrun` (n=ajbrun@host86-155-35-175.range86-155.btcentralplus.com) |
| 15:08.49 | *** join/#openmoko greentux (n=lemke@Z72e5.z.pppool.de) |
| 15:15.10 | *** join/#openmoko eugeneoden (n=goden@rrcs-67-79-195-201.sw.biz.rr.com) |
| 15:17.07 | *** join/#openmoko amir (n=Miranda@unaffiliated/amir) |
| 15:18.21 | *** join/#openmoko peepsalot (n=peeps@cpe-67-9-161-48.austin.res.rr.com) |
| 15:29.01 | *** join/#openmoko noriX (i=noriX@csbnc0001.207.clanserver4u.de) |
| 15:31.51 | *** join/#openmoko ericthefish (n=ivan@82-71-36-214.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk) |
| 15:33.02 | ScaredyCat | XorA: can you grab me a green case :) |
| 15:39.48 | *** join/#openmoko lrg (n=liam@lrg2.demon.co.uk) |
| 15:40.47 | *** part/#openmoko fredthecat (n=martin@82-42-255-216.cable.ubr12.brad.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 15:42.35 | *** join/#openmoko dvarnes (n=davidv@unaffiliated/dvarnes) |
| 15:44.03 | *** join/#openmoko summatusmentis (n=jts@velcro.morris.umn.edu) |
| 15:46.48 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@208.84-48-176.nextgentel.com) |
| 15:49.59 | *** join/#openmoko Tanu (n=tanuva@92.224.105.89) |
| 15:55.38 | *** join/#openmoko hatty (n=Hatty@203.193.154.146) |
| 15:58.25 | *** join/#openmoko mehrshad (n=mehrshad@c-71-202-47-12.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 16:00.23 | *** join/#openmoko slchen (n=slchen@61-228-27-124.dynamic.hinet.net) |
| 16:06.10 | *** join/#openmoko behdad (n=behdad@91.184.74.49) |
| 16:09.23 | *** join/#openmoko Tro1 (n=Troy@220.225.146.98) |
| 16:09.35 | Tro1 | krau:hello |
| 16:11.34 | *** join/#openmoko elation (i=elation@gateway/tor/x-2dada2be2b88f081) |
| 16:12.32 | *** join/#openmoko Aria (n=aredride@acrux.theinternetco.net) |
| 16:15.47 | *** join/#openmoko LetoTo (n=paul@193.110.157.17) |
| 16:19.25 | *** join/#openmoko grummel (n=grummel@p5B16C91B.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 16:20.20 | *** join/#openmoko kdean06 (n=kdean06@fsf/member/kdean06) |
| 16:20.59 | *** join/#openmoko C7|home (n=C7@51-5.76-83.cust.bluewin.ch) |
| 16:24.48 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive_ (n=goxboxli@208.84-48-176.nextgentel.com) |
| 16:26.27 | *** join/#openmoko Gybrush (n=Gybrush@f053155238.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 16:27.10 | *** part/#openmoko mathroc (n=mathieu@79.86.100.241) |
| 16:32.21 | *** join/#openmoko rcxdude (n=rcxdude@host86-147-87-6.range86-147.btcentralplus.com) |
| 16:33.10 | *** part/#openmoko Tro1 (n=Troy@220.225.146.98) |
| 16:34.15 | *** join/#openmoko [VR]Ghost (n=ilja@balticom-134-181.balticom.lv) |
| 16:39.09 | *** join/#openmoko willis_ (n=willis@ip23-247.jmu.edu) |
| 16:39.59 | *** join/#openmoko jamewill (n=jamewill@79-75-170-55.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com) |
| 16:44.52 | *** join/#openmoko summatusmentis (n=summatus@umm-yrless170.morris.umn.edu) |
| 16:47.06 | *** join/#openmoko sandman__ (n=willis@ip23-247.jmu.edu) |
| 16:48.01 | cdbot2 | * * OM Bug 1295 has been created by singu(AT)wivada.de |
| 16:48.01 | cdbot2 | * * timezone is ignored |
| 16:48.02 | cdbot2 | * * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=1295 |
| 16:49.08 | *** join/#openmoko Tanuva (n=tanuva@92.224.105.89) |
| 16:49.37 | *** join/#openmoko haakeyar (n=haakeyar@c9C364BC1.dhcp.bluecom.no) |
| 16:50.29 | sandman__ | rumor had it mickeyl was the contact point for GSOC questions, is that still true? |
| 16:51.55 | Sup3rkiddo | sandman__, yeah, along with Stefab |
| 16:51.57 | Sup3rkiddo | *Stefan |
| 16:53.14 | *** join/#openmoko PBeck (n=PBeck@HSI-KBW-091-089-099-121.hsi2.kabelbw.de) |
| 16:53.28 | *** join/#openmoko greentux_ (n=lemke@Z73a5.z.pppool.de) |
| 16:53.29 | PBeck | hi |
| 16:53.38 | sandman__ | whats their email address or where can I find it (I only found mickeyl business email on the interwebs) |
| 16:54.21 | Sup3rkiddo | sandman__, the list archives at lists.openmoko.org |
| 16:54.22 | sandman__ | *are their addresses |
| 16:54.34 | sandman__ | ok |
| 16:54.37 | sandman__ | thanks |
| 16:58.55 | cb22 | wonders if it would be a good idea to put a deprecated box in everything to do with 2007.1 |
| 17:00.19 | *** join/#openmoko amarsh04_ (n=amarsh04@CPE-124-177-185-90.sa.bigpond.net.au) |
| 17:00.58 | Basheri | Yeah, its probably a good idea |
| 17:02.16 | *** join/#openmoko j_ack (n=j_ack@dsbg-4db7c7df.pool.einsundeins.de) |
| 17:03.05 | *** join/#openmoko tombhadAC (n=tombhad@pD95DECCF.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 17:10.27 | *** join/#openmoko playya_ (n=playya@pD9E08C03.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 17:13.31 | *** join/#openmoko christooss (n=matic@BSN-77-106-146.dial-up.dsl.siol.net) |
| 17:15.09 | *** join/#openmoko Fradeve (n=fradeve@87.13.133.148) |
| 17:18.41 | *** join/#openmoko eray (n=eray@pc-149.raksoy.yurtlar.metu.edu.tr) |
| 17:19.44 | eray | Hi, I am eray, and I want to be a SoC student of openmoko, can you help me for my some quetions :) |
| 17:20.11 | *** join/#openmoko Virtuall (n=virtuall@83.241.45.109) |
| 17:20.18 | jamewill | eray, yes did you see the wiki entry on this yet? |
| 17:20.44 | eray | no I didn't |
| 17:20.59 | jamewill | the advice others have had is... |
| 17:21.05 | jamewill | 1) check the wiki for suggested topics |
| 17:21.06 | *** join/#openmoko suuuper (n=suuuper@151.60.83.69) |
| 17:21.21 | eray | ok I have read the topics |
| 17:21.33 | eray | and I like the speech recognition |
| 17:21.35 | jamewill | 2) write to the community@lists.openmoko.org with your proposal |
| 17:21.42 | eray | ok |
| 17:21.50 | jamewill | 3) there are 5 or so mentors but not official yet... |
| 17:22.19 | SpeedEvil | Speech recognition is a vastly underdone topic. |
| 17:22.24 | jamewill | 4) feel free to come up with your own brilliant topic... :-) |
| 17:22.24 | SpeedEvil | At least aimed at users. |
| 17:22.41 | SpeedEvil | I'd pay some money for a solution that worked well under linux. |
| 17:23.54 | SpeedEvil | 10-20 quid for a speaker dependant thing that needed a fair bit of training, more the less training it needs. Something that could transcribe all my phone calls as they came in and enable full text searching would be _so_ cool |
| 17:24.27 | *** join/#openmoko slchen (n=slchen@61-228-27-124.dynamic.hinet.net) |
| 17:24.36 | anrp | i wonder, would transcribing count as recording a call |
| 17:25.04 | SpeedEvil | I was assuming audio recording too - the transcribing solely for search and review |
| 17:25.40 | eray | so, my question is I have no idea to achieve this goal, but I like this topic and also I want to grow myself on mobile programming |
| 17:26.11 | eray | do you think I can achieve this goal, I am a skillful programmer and a very good student, however :) |
| 17:26.54 | eray | but I lack of knowledge of how to recognize and how to code for openmoko |
| 17:27.02 | *** join/#openmoko smlsfb (n=koenig10@shell.newpaltz.edu) |
| 17:27.40 | eray | but if it is a thing that I can learn, I try to achieve this and I try to do my best |
| 17:27.44 | jamewill | eray, write your proposal and give some background on your skills... i am sure one of the mentors will be in touch in due course |
| 17:27.45 | SpeedEvil | Speech recognition is man-centuries of work to get it working well |
| 17:27.46 | eray | what do you think about that :) |
| 17:27.55 | eray | ok |
| 17:28.18 | SpeedEvil | Exactly how much can be achieved in limited recognition is a different matter. |
| 17:28.33 | SpeedEvil | Something able to dial numbers, for example may be substantially simpler. |
| 17:28.41 | *** join/#openmoko Xilent (n=supersti@unaffiliated/xilent) |
| 17:29.41 | *** join/#openmoko icman (n=icman@123-240-172-21.cctv.dynamic.lsc.net.tw) |
| 17:29.43 | k-s | mickeyl: ask cmarcelo, as he is the owner, but I don't think there is a problem other than "cvs" itself :-) |
| 17:30.38 | eray | i think it'd better to write to mail-list with my proposal |
| 17:30.44 | *** join/#openmoko greentux__ (n=lemke@Z459d.z.pppool.de) |
| 17:31.13 | eray | I think this place is not suitable for these purposes, I am sorry :( |
| 17:36.51 | *** part/#openmoko eray (n=eray@pc-149.raksoy.yurtlar.metu.edu.tr) |
| 17:37.29 | *** part/#openmoko patryk_ (n=patryk@static-ip-194-106-214-184.promax.media.pl) |
| 17:38.16 | *** join/#openmoko djk (n=djk@h-67-103-121-195.snfccasy.covad.net) |
| 17:38.51 | *** join/#openmoko grummel_ (n=grummel@p5B16FE7A.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 17:40.35 | *** join/#openmoko gopi (n=gopi@63.83.135.35) |
| 17:43.42 | *** join/#openmoko zedstar (n=john@82-44-200-69.cable.ubr08.haye.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 17:48.24 | *** join/#openmoko emre (n=emre@85.104.68.149) |
| 17:48.46 | emre | Hi folks, is there anybody experienced with the PCF50606? |
| 17:52.05 | *** join/#openmoko greentux_ (n=lemke@Z5418.z.pppool.de) |
| 17:57.27 | *** join/#openmoko Trevi (n=Trevi@79.12.124.154) |
| 17:59.02 | *** join/#openmoko fader6818 (n=kdean06@pool-70-17-99-225.res.east.verizon.net) |
| 18:00.00 | *** join/#openmoko Heinervdm (n=thomas@pD9E1710D.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 18:10.09 | *** join/#openmoko prpplague (n=dave@mail.americanmicrosystems.com) |
| 18:10.29 | *** join/#openmoko krau (n=cktakaha@200.184.118.132) |
| 18:13.09 | *** join/#openmoko zipola (n=zipola@zip.kortex.jyu.fi) |
| 18:15.12 | *** join/#openmoko greentux__ (n=lemke@Z6799.z.pppool.de) |
| 18:19.44 | *** join/#openmoko denis` (n=anno@p5B07FF70.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 18:20.24 | *** join/#openmoko raster (n=raster@200.184.118.136) |
| 18:21.40 | abraxa_ | Aloha raster |
| 18:24.09 | SpeedEvil | !seen vector |
| 18:24.11 | cdbot2 | SpeedEvil, I don't remember seeing vector. |
| 18:24.52 | abraxa_ | raster's evil twin? Or archnemesis? |
| 18:26.02 | *** join/#openmoko holycow (n=new@mail.wjsgroup.com) |
| 18:26.03 | raster | moo |
| 18:27.15 | *** join/#openmoko fehmicans (n=canavar@88.227.103.19) |
| 18:32.18 | *** join/#openmoko djk_ (n=djk@h-67-103-121-195.snfccasy.covad.net) |
| 18:34.08 | *** join/#openmoko BenO (n=BenO@82-69-120-120.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk) |
| 18:35.04 | *** part/#openmoko BenO (n=BenO@82-69-120-120.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk) |
| 18:35.17 | *** join/#openmoko alex-weej (n=alex@cpc1-acto9-0-0-cust931.brnt.cable.ntl.com) |
| 18:39.24 | *** join/#openmoko Zword (n=Zword@bos94-3-82-226-234-106.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 18:40.16 | *** join/#openmoko mrcucumber (n=voorhees@c-24-22-105-96.hsd1.or.comcast.net) |
| 18:46.18 | emre | how can i see the whole kernel source, including the patches? |
| 18:47.48 | *** join/#openmoko Varox_NB (n=doug@p4FD47756.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 18:49.10 | *** join/#openmoko slchen (n=slchen@61-228-27-124.dynamic.hinet.net) |
| 18:50.01 | *** join/#openmoko biertrinken (n=biertrin@p5497BAF0.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 18:50.46 | ccfly | <abraxa_> raster's evil twin? Or archnemesis? <--- Less visible sidekick used for comic releif |
| 18:51.25 | ccfly | glamo is the archnemesis |
| 18:51.37 | ccfly | him and his low thoughput schemes |
| 18:51.54 | abraxa_ | I cannot dispute that claim. |
| 18:52.26 | *** join/#openmoko greentux__ (n=lemke@Z7421.z.pppool.de) |
| 18:53.02 | *** join/#openmoko bentob0x (n=laurent@ip-213-49-79-40.dsl.scarlet.be) |
| 18:57.20 | *** join/#openmoko hippieindamakin8 (n=hippiein@203.200.95.130) |
| 18:57.49 | *** join/#openmoko Tjikkun (n=tjikkun@h89220243036.dsl.mijnabel.nl) |
| 18:59.19 | raster | ccfly: glamo is indeed my arch nemesis (for the moment) |
| 18:59.46 | prpplague | hehe, i was wondering how well the glamo was being integrated into the system |
| 19:00.56 | raster | be more specific? |
| 19:01.32 | ScaredyCat | !seen XorA|gone.do.any.work.lately |
| 19:01.44 | *** join/#openmoko josch (n=josch@p57AD5452.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 19:03.18 | SpeedEvil | prpplague: basic problems are hideously slow bus - 7M/second or so to the glamo chip. |
| 19:03.38 | prpplague | SpeedEvil: ahh |
| 19:03.53 | SpeedEvil | prpplague: which really limits things with a 640*480*16 buffer |
| 19:04.10 | SpeedEvil | And the fact that the glamo wasn't really meant to be used at 640*480 |
| 19:04.17 | prpplague | raster: no, i was just curious how much trouble it was going to be to use an external i/o device like the glamo for lcd and such |
| 19:04.18 | SpeedEvil | It's in spec - but not really optimal |
| 19:05.53 | SpeedEvil | stuff like - for example - the 3d accel part being only able to do 512*512 |
| 19:07.14 | *** join/#openmoko grummel (n=Grummel@p5B16FE7A.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 19:08.18 | prpplague | SpeedEvil: interesting |
| 19:09.18 | SpeedEvil | Unfortunately not in a good way. Broadly it looks like performance in many cases will be a wash on much stuff with the existing hardware. Except for avi/mpg playing. |
| 19:09.38 | SpeedEvil | Some will be better - some a lot better, and some worse. |
| 19:10.57 | summatusmentis | is mickeyl still in brazil? |
| 19:11.04 | ScaredyCat | no |
| 19:11.11 | prpplague | SpeedEvil: ahh, well we don't plan on using anything about 320x240 at 16bpp |
| 19:11.24 | prpplague | SpeedEvil: using the 2440's lcd controller |
| 19:11.31 | raster | prpplague: well the glamo does drive the lcd |
| 19:11.32 | raster | it does work |
| 19:11.37 | raster | it displays @ 480x640 |
| 19:11.40 | raster | @ 16bpp |
| 19:11.42 | prpplague | raster: right |
| 19:12.09 | cb22 | still wants bzflag on the freerunner :p |
| 19:12.42 | prpplague | raster: we considered using several chips including the glamo, but eventually decided to just use whats on the 2440 |
| 19:13.29 | raster | well it wouldnt be a product without doing that |
| 19:13.43 | raster | the glamo comes with lots of gives and takes |
| 19:13.53 | raster | so far i have only run into its "takes" |
| 19:13.53 | raster | :) |
| 19:15.37 | prpplague | raster: yea we just couldn't justify the costs since we could do everything we needed with the 2440, not exactly like people use our handhelds for mpegs and mp3's, hehe |
| 19:16.36 | *** join/#openmoko greentux_ (n=lemke@Z46b8.z.pppool.de) |
| 19:16.59 | raster | whares screen |
| 19:17.19 | *** join/#openmoko smlsfb_ (n=koenig10@shell.newpaltz.edu) |
| 19:18.22 | *** join/#openmoko Demitar (n=demitar@h-6-53.A146.cust.bahnhof.se) |
| 19:18.23 | raster | ummm |
| 19:18.31 | raster | prpplague: what res lcd? |
| 19:18.39 | prpplague | raster: 320x240x16bpp |
| 19:18.53 | raster | aaah |
| 19:19.04 | raster | u lose much less memory bandwidth tot he lcd refresh |
| 19:19.09 | prpplague | raster: we are evaluating a 320x320x16bpp but i doubt we will use it |
| 19:19.11 | raster | also a lot fewer pixels to drive in software |
| 19:19.27 | raster | all my previous work with evas on these devices has been mostly qvga |
| 19:19.36 | raster | which can be quite snappy in software |
| 19:19.45 | raster | when u go up to vga and above u hit real trouble |
| 19:19.53 | prpplague | raster: yea, we are actually considering dropping it down to 12bpp |
| 19:20.05 | raster | that wont change anything |
| 19:20.08 | roh | raster still.. qvga is so 1998 |
| 19:20.18 | raster | you will still pad all pixels out to 16bits |
| 19:20.19 | cb22 | 280dpi ftw too |
| 19:20.33 | raster | roh: glamo is also so 1997 |
| 19:20.34 | raster | :) |
| 19:20.42 | prpplague | raster: hmm, i thought the 2440 supported 12bpp config |
| 19:20.54 | cb22 | i remember hearing somewhere that to the human eye, anything above 300dpi is indistinguisable? |
| 19:20.55 | roh | raster no shit. anything thats buyable as silicium for 5 years is |
| 19:21.47 | raster | prpplague: it will use the lower 12bits of the 16bits |
| 19:21.56 | raster | the ipaq 3660 used to do that |
| 19:22.17 | raster | cb22: depends how close it is to your eye. dpi is a misnoma. |
| 19:22.27 | raster | cb22: as what ALSO matters is distance from your eye |
| 19:22.39 | raster | 10dpi @ 1km away is pretty high-res |
| 19:22.41 | raster | :) |
| 19:22.51 | *** join/#openmoko fehmicans (n=canavar@88.227.103.19) |
| 19:22.59 | raster | roh: yup |
| 19:23.18 | prpplague | raster: you sure of that? thats not how i read the specs for the 2440 |
| 19:23.38 | raster | prpplague: it'd be pretty nasty to deal with 13bpp packed. |
| 19:23.41 | raster | err 12bpp |
| 19:24.00 | raster | as 3 16bit words would map to 4 pixels |
| 19:24.12 | *** join/#openmoko n0on3 (n=n0on3@81-208-83-247.fastres.net) |
| 19:24.45 | raster | in fact the only nice boundary is 12 words (16pixels) |
| 19:25.12 | raster | doing anything that calculates pixels ro drsaws will be very painful as u are always doign read/modify/write for small ops |
| 19:25.32 | raster | and otherwise for larger ones u are pre-composing offscfreen and for sanity aligning that to 16 or 32bits etc. |
| 19:25.35 | raster | anyway |
| 19:25.42 | raster | so u basically lose any gains |
| 19:25.52 | raster | its basically a "stupid screen depth" |
| 19:26.02 | prpplague | ahh yea, gotcha, 12-15 and 28-31 end up being dummy bits |
| 19:26.07 | raster | it will do nothng but create hell, performance bottlenecks for anything interesting |
| 19:26.13 | raster | yup |
| 19:26.17 | prpplague | for some reason i was thinking it did packing for 12bpp |
| 19:26.19 | raster | so either u have dummy bits |
| 19:26.21 | raster | OR u pack |
| 19:26.35 | raster | and packing non-16bit aligned values... sucks |
| 19:26.38 | raster | or 8bit |
| 19:26.44 | raster | nup |
| 19:26.49 | raster | if it did packing - it'd bve unusual |
| 19:26.50 | raster | very |
| 19:26.59 | raster | and it'd make pixel-life hell on earth |
| 19:27.10 | raster | in the end u'd have software rendering doing thigns in 16/32bpp |
| 19:27.10 | *** join/#openmoko fehmicans (n=canavar@88.227.103.19) |
| 19:27.15 | raster | donw-convertingto 12bpp and blasting out |
| 19:27.19 | raster | u'd never make a gain |
| 19:27.30 | raster | only reason to do 12bpp is if your lcd literally cannot do better than 12bpp |
| 19:27.40 | raster | and u want to expose that to software so it can dither/display accurately |
| 19:27.50 | raster | and thus u just pad your pixels up to 16bits |
| 19:28.10 | raster | as i said - ipaq 3660 did this back in 2001/2 or so |
| 19:28.19 | raster | i have a special converter in evas just for it |
| 19:28.20 | raster | :) |
| 19:28.47 | raster | 12bpp is decent - if dithered. |
| 19:28.52 | raster | its nasty if not |
| 19:28.55 | prpplague | raster: ahh indeed, i just double checked it was another SoC that i was eval'n that has the 12bpp packed |
| 19:29.00 | raster | 16bpp is massively better |
| 19:29.19 | raster | prpplague: u'd be in pixel-hell with 12bpp packed |
| 19:29.20 | raster | :) |
| 19:29.48 | prpplague | yea, looks so |
| 19:30.20 | *** join/#openmoko fobos (n=fobos@78.90.88.244) |
| 19:30.56 | *** join/#openmoko d1 (n=dr@vnsecurity.net) |
| 19:31.10 | raster | but at 240x320 @ 266mhz u should be able to manage quite silky gfx |
| 19:31.21 | raster | i know evas runs better on the gta01 than the gta02 |
| 19:31.22 | raster | :) |
| 19:31.26 | raster | and that sat vga |
| 19:31.27 | prpplague | raster: we are using the 2440 at 400mhz |
| 19:31.28 | raster | :) |
| 19:31.34 | raster | u should be golden |
| 19:31.35 | raster | ... |
| 19:31.38 | *** join/#openmoko ewon (n=ewan@skynet.skynet.ie) |
| 19:31.39 | raster | if your gfx engine is good |
| 19:31.55 | prpplague | raster: standard x stuff, nothing out of the ordinary |
| 19:32.14 | prpplague | raster: we don't plan on doing any tweak on the userland stuff |
| 19:32.41 | raster | u may want to look at evas |
| 19:32.48 | raster | if u want to do anything interesting |
| 19:33.04 | raster | it should get u high almost-32bpp-like gfx |
| 19:33.09 | raster | with alpha blending and stuff |
| 19:33.16 | raster | at high speed |
| 19:33.27 | *** join/#openmoko d1 (n=dr@vnsecurity.net) |
| 19:33.28 | raster | with a dumb fb u dont have a slow video bus to worry about |
| 19:33.43 | raster | it will run under x or fb or whevere u want it |
| 19:33.56 | raster | but if u already have all your apps written - then its probably useless |
| 19:34.20 | cb22 | raster: so the 02 is _worse_ off then the 01? |
| 19:34.36 | raster | cb22: well illume runs better on my gta01 :) |
| 19:34.50 | raster | as such in benchmarks with expedite gta01 and 02 are neck and neck |
| 19:35.02 | prpplague | raster: yea, we only have a handfull of apps to use and we already have them all written |
| 19:35.08 | raster | for the more complex rendering the gta02 @ 400mhz wins a bit |
| 19:35.09 | cb22 | boo :( and the 02 even has a faster a processor |
| 19:35.09 | prpplague | raster: support low end stuff |
| 19:35.19 | raster | but for simpler stuff it loses thanks to the video bus |
| 19:35.19 | prpplague | s/support/supper |
| 19:35.24 | raster | the only hope is some xrender accel |
| 19:35.26 | *** join/#openmoko gopi (n=gopi@ppp-71-139-48-90.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net) |
| 19:35.35 | cb22 | no way towork around that? |
| 19:35.41 | raster | that can accel some of xrender - with some tweaking of the xrender engine it might be ok |
| 19:36.19 | raster | i was hoping dodji might get that done in parallel as he's more familiar with x internals |
| 19:36.26 | raster | but that may no longer be the case |
| 19:37.12 | cb22 | btw, what happens with sd card access, afaik it runs throught the glamo, i hope that doesnt go through the same 7mbps bus? |
| 19:37.20 | raster | it does |
| 19:37.29 | raster | so if u access sd at the same time as doing gfx |
| 19:37.30 | raster | ... |
| 19:37.33 | raster | welcome to hell |
| 19:37.34 | raster | :) |
| 19:37.34 | cb22 | ouch |
| 19:38.13 | anrp | 7mbps? |
| 19:38.17 | anrp | where'd that number come from |
| 19:38.26 | raster | my arse |
| 19:38.27 | raster | :) |
| 19:38.31 | morricone | I just hope that with GTA03 we won't have such issues. but i will buy GTA02 nevertheless |
| 19:38.36 | raster | it's 7.3 actually |
| 19:38.48 | raster | tot he nearest 0.1 mb/s |
| 19:39.01 | raster | morricone: dont expect a gta03 any time soon |
| 19:39.04 | raster | so stick with the 021 |
| 19:39.06 | raster | 02 |
| 19:39.11 | raster | its real and happening |
| 19:39.15 | raster | we'll do what we can |
| 19:39.25 | cb22 | so time dd if=/dev/mysdcardconnectedviaglamo of=/myranmdrive bs=1m count=7.3 should take 1s? |
| 19:39.57 | anrp | if dd accepted decimal counts, sure D: |
| 19:40.00 | raster | anrp: btw - numbers come from benchmarks. i am a benchmark person. i always benchmark stuff. it gives me a ballpark to knwo what i can expect to be able to do. |
| 19:40.21 | anrp | benchmark of doing what, i'm wondering... because that number is awfully low for a graphics bus |
| 19:40.26 | raster | cb22: assuming the sd card istelf can actually read at 7.3mb/sec on tbhe media layer |
| 19:40.26 | cb22 | heh, good point anrp |
| 19:40.27 | *** join/#openmoko tombhad-AC (n=tombhad@pD95DF9FA.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 19:40.42 | raster | cb22: tho i think reads are slower. i just cared about writes TO it |
| 19:40.59 | cb22 | what exactly is the glamo connected via? |
| 19:41.02 | raster | anrp: benchmarking copies of pixels to video ram |
| 19:41.16 | raster | anrp: benchmarkign exactly that which we care about - and yes. it is very low. |
| 19:41.27 | raster | cb22: some peripheral bus of some sort. |
| 19:41.54 | cb22 | didnt you try something with dma that didnt quite work too? |
| 19:41.57 | anrp | not even enough for 24fps vga yuv420p :/ |
| 19:42.03 | anrp | hopes in the hw decoding |
| 19:42.03 | raster | cb22: yes. failure. |
| 19:42.13 | raster | cb22: dma was < 50% of the speed of using the cpu to do writes |
| 19:42.16 | roh | anrp: decoding what? |
| 19:42.18 | anrp | oh, that was non-dma? |
| 19:42.18 | raster | cb22: whihc is quite amazing |
| 19:42.24 | anrp | anything, probably mpeg4 |
| 19:42.36 | raster | and dma also locks up the memory bus 100% while active |
| 19:42.38 | raster | so useless |
| 19:42.50 | anrp | not if it takes 1/10 of the time to transfer the data |
| 19:42.56 | roh | anrp there is no vga mpeg decoder in the glamo at all |
| 19:43.02 | raster | anrp: 7.3 is enough for 400x300 yuv 422 @ 30fps. |
| 19:43.02 | anrp | oh, well in that case.. |
| 19:43.07 | anrp | didn't know that |
| 19:43.10 | cb22 | hopes the 03 has some hypertransport lanes in it |
| 19:43.20 | roh | afaik its a option only for the qvga version. and its so crappy that its not nworth it |
| 19:43.24 | raster | but ALL u will be doing is xferring yuv data |
| 19:43.27 | anrp | well, gsm runs at 1.8ghz, clearly somethign in there is working fast! |
| 19:43.28 | raster | u wont have decode cycles |
| 19:43.30 | anrp | ;) |
| 19:43.36 | roh | cb22 i hope not. else you run out of battery in like 10secs |
| 19:43.40 | raster | as the cpu will be hung writign to the glamo |
| 19:44.10 | cb22 | roh: battery? pff, i want mine with a fuel cell |
| 19:44.11 | *** part/#openmoko LetoTo (n=paul@193.110.157.17) |
| 19:44.13 | abraxa_ | roh: So the glamo has no video playback abilities after all? |
| 19:44.22 | anrp | a V8 |
| 19:44.28 | raster | abraxa_: it does - very limited |
| 19:44.32 | anrp | buring toluene at 5 bar boost! |
| 19:44.41 | anrp | *burning |
| 19:44.49 | raster | i think u could make it with 160x120 video - naaaybe 320x240 (scaled up of course) |
| 19:44.49 | anrp | .. anyway, since i'm not being helpful >_> |
| 19:45.01 | cb22 | anrp: why settle for a v8? |
| 19:45.04 | cb22 | i want a v12 |
| 19:45.04 | raster | it does have video (yuv "overlay" with scaling) |
| 19:45.12 | anrp | true |
| 19:45.14 | *** join/#openmoko bmk789 (n=bmk789@c-98-222-247-219.hsd1.in.comcast.net) |
| 19:45.15 | anrp | or a w16? |
| 19:45.15 | abraxa_ | raster: Ugh. |
| 19:45.27 | raster | but u will spend a lot of cyclkes copying your yuv data up |
| 19:45.50 | anrp | er, not if you can dma it |
| 19:46.14 | raster | u can't |
| 19:46.16 | raster | thats the thing |
| 19:46.20 | anrp | at all? |
| 19:46.24 | raster | nup |
| 19:46.26 | anrp | ... |
| 19:46.29 | raster | dma is not possible |
| 19:46.32 | raster | we tried |
| 19:46.34 | raster | failed |
| 19:46.36 | roh | abraxa_ it has scaling and colorspace conversion afaik |
| 19:46.42 | raster | ewasted 3 weeks on the experiement |
| 19:46.49 | raster | my fault for the waste |
| 19:46.51 | cb22 | not even if you beat glamo with a dma stick? |
| 19:46.56 | anrp | surely the chip supports it |
| 19:46.56 | raster | i expected better out of the hw |
| 19:46.57 | raster | i was wrong |
| 19:47.03 | raster | glamo doesnt |
| 19:47.05 | raster | but samsung does |
| 19:47.14 | raster | samsung's dma |
| 19:47.19 | raster | 1. losk up memory bus while doing dma |
| 19:47.22 | raster | locks |
| 19:47.36 | raster | (that means u cant do any meory read/writes fromt he cpu while dma is active) |
| 19:47.47 | raster | 2. is 1/2 the actual throughput of copying with the cpu |
| 19:47.49 | raster | or less |
| 19:47.57 | raster | its less than 1/.2 if doing big transfers |
| 19:48.00 | anrp | 2 is strange, to say the least |
| 19:48.04 | raster | doing smalll transfers its much worse |
| 19:48.08 | raster | yes |
| 19:48.14 | raster | i would have expected it to match the speed |
| 19:48.24 | raster | and of course lose advantage as your xfer sizes go down |
| 19:48.33 | raster | so you'd code ina swithc point |
| 19:48.44 | raster | if xfer < X bytes, then memcpy() else dma(); |
| 19:48.53 | anrp | nod |
| 19:48.56 | raster | but the fact that it locks up the bus is just the killer |
| 19:49.03 | raster | it wont win us anything |
| 19:49.16 | anrp | well it would if dma was 2x as fast as pio |
| 19:49.19 | anrp | but since it isn't .. |
| 19:49.22 | roh | raster welcome to the reality in the embedded world |
| 19:49.24 | raster | the hope was to offload the copy and allow the cpu cycles to go back to actual computing stuff (computing new pixels of video.gfx/whatever) |
| 19:49.30 | roh | its like 10 years ago in pc technology |
| 19:49.32 | edistar_ | raster: will the gta02 be as fast/slow as the gta01 at least? |
| 19:49.35 | raster | roh: 8o(.... |
| 19:49.50 | raster | edistar_: doing what? |
| 19:49.53 | roh | but worse since some things just eat lots of power and were not designed properly for such from start |
| 19:50.17 | raster | roh: actually there is much better around.. but we just aren't using it - nor making decisions to use it :) |
| 19:50.26 | edistar_ | raster: drawing 2d.. e.g. using evas |
| 19:50.28 | *** join/#openmoko greentux__ (n=lemke@Z5acd.z.pppool.de) |
| 19:50.39 | raster | roh: sure - but i'd liver with 1/2 the battery life for a gfx system that didnt suck. |
| 19:50.51 | roh | and all the ugly stuff which vendors will not tell you about till you ate all their docs, are halfway through the design and start reverse--egineering the SDK |
| 19:51.06 | raster | (as frankly u arent drawing all the time and it can go idle for most of the battery life of a phone as its suspended) |
| 19:51.11 | roh | raster i dont. i do not care about graphics at all as long as its not Phoning reliable. |
| 19:51.43 | raster | edistar_: thats still an uncharted setof waters |
| 19:51.57 | raster | edistar_: evas with the software_x11 or software_16_x11 engine is piss-slow |
| 19:52.06 | raster | the n800 beats the gta02 hands-down |
| 19:52.13 | anrp | notes down a new adjective |
| 19:52.14 | raster | by many times |
| 19:52.30 | edistar_ | oh.. tha's bad news |
| 19:52.40 | edistar_ | s/tha/that |
| 19:52.44 | raster | and the n800 has a notoriously slow video bus |
| 19:52.53 | raster | BUT |
| 19:53.06 | raster | w2e maye yet be able to get some accel out of the 2d portion of the glamo |
| 19:53.08 | raster | for xrender |
| 19:53.21 | raster | and with some changes to evas's xrender engine - be able to use some of the accelerated paths |
| 19:53.31 | raster | that will mean a fair chunk of work in the driveer |
| 19:53.35 | raster | i took a look yesterday |
| 19:53.46 | roh | raster n800 also has no freedom im driverspace at all afaik (please correct me if i am wrong) |
| 19:53.57 | raster | roh: correct. |
| 19:54.14 | raster | roh: not concerned about freedom here. jsut something that is decent |
| 19:54.46 | morricone | i didn't thought graphics would be a problem that big. I always thought other embedded stuff would be a lot harder to manage |
| 19:54.57 | playya_ | is sth like the nobounds project planed for OM? |
| 19:54.57 | raster | gfx is hard |
| 19:55.04 | raster | its one of the most demanding things u can do |
| 19:55.28 | anrp | its a lot of bandwidth, at least |
| 19:55.40 | roh | i know. but you know that competing against companies like nokia is senseless without why people want a openmoko. |
| 19:55.47 | playya_ | using extern displays with the device? |
| 19:55.55 | morricone | yeah, but even the crappy nokias can do 3d and they don't even have a good use for it |
| 19:55.59 | roh | playya_ ? |
| 19:56.07 | anrp | single link DVI goes up to around 3.1 gigabits all by itself |
| 19:56.13 | roh | morricone they use nonfree drivers. |
| 19:56.37 | raster | roh: i'm not talking competing. i'm using a measuring stick - an existing linux device u can run the same stuff on. |
| 19:56.53 | roh | morricone which means as soon as you wanna update your kernel for some (security e.g.) reason and they do not give you a new binary you will have NO graphics driver at all. |
| 19:56.56 | playya_ | using the the neo on extern displays like TV or other screens |
| 19:57.10 | roh | raster well. bad comparison. very bad. eggs and apples |
| 19:57.21 | raster | roh: perfectly fine comparison. |
| 19:57.26 | roh | playya_ whatfor? even less pixels? |
| 19:57.26 | morricone | roh, I know, that's the reason why i don't have any mobile, yet ;) |
| 19:57.27 | anrp | mmm apple omelette |
| 19:57.50 | raster | roh: similarly specced devices (128mb ram, 333 vs 400mhzx arm, QVGA vs VGA, samsung vs omap...) |
| 19:57.59 | raster | free schmee |
| 19:58.03 | playya_ | i know it works fine on the n800 in HD quality |
| 19:58.04 | anrp | ooh |
| 19:58.08 | anrp | cooks the popcorn |
| 19:58.10 | anrp | a clash of ideals! |
| 19:58.16 | raster | free shouldnt mean u are forced to travel across the country in a horse and cart |
| 19:58.24 | roh | playya_ sorry.. but ive never understood why people waste money and space/weight for things you never use in reality.. come on.. who connects his phone to a tv... ever? |
| 19:58.36 | anrp | i would, just for the wtf factor |
| 19:58.41 | anrp | but it would only happen once ;) |
| 19:58.49 | raster | the n800 USES free drivers for video |
| 19:58.58 | raster | they can't use the 3d accel of the imagination chip |
| 19:59.00 | cb22 | would rather have an 8800gt with closed nvidia drivers, then an i945 with open intel ones |
| 19:59.00 | playya_ | i would. if i get the source |
| 19:59.02 | raster | as that has been closed |
| 19:59.02 | roh | raster then you should also think about form factor (which changes battery size and thus power-conditionals) |
| 19:59.12 | *** join/#openmoko rmoravcik (n=rmoravci@ip-89-102-255-171.karneval.cz) |
| 19:59.28 | raster | roh: the n800 is similarly specced to the iphone - with a much higher res screen. |
| 19:59.32 | raster | roh: and a much slower cpu |
| 19:59.47 | raster | again - its a variyl close comparison |
| 19:59.47 | roh | cb22 well.. the intel one atleast works stable. and as long as you only watch movies and do desktop work you will never know the difference |
| 19:59.49 | raster | fairly |
| 19:59.50 | playya_ | raster, but afaik the driver doesn't use full power of the GPU |
| 19:59.56 | raster | playya_: yup |
| 20:00.02 | raster | playya_: they get basic 2d accel |
| 20:00.08 | raster | no xrender |
| 20:00.12 | raster | no compositing |
| 20:00.17 | raster | just 2d blits, fills |
| 20:00.17 | roh | raster bad comparison. battery size. also the 2g/3g modems do eat loads of power |
| 20:00.18 | playya_ | its the same GPU which is also in the n-gage phones |
| 20:00.28 | cb22 | roh: yup, and then you start up compiz-fusion with 16x anti-aliasing |
| 20:00.31 | anrp | n-gage...aieee |
| 20:00.38 | raster | roh: its an excellent comparison. |
| 20:00.48 | roh | ngage was a huge flop. shows why one cannot make money from a bad gaming console with a bad phone in it |
| 20:01.02 | cb22 | anrp: btw, you have some popcorn left? |
| 20:01.15 | roh | raster why? n800 has gsm at all-> power requirements totally different |
| 20:01.17 | anrp | i could make some more |
| 20:01.23 | CM | The GTA03 should be "Side talking" style.. ;) |
| 20:01.27 | raster | roh: did i ever comapre power requirements? |
| 20:01.34 | raster | i am comparing graphics perfromance |
| 20:01.38 | roh | cb22 i know people who USE compiz on eee-pcs. fluid. working. |
| 20:01.48 | raster | in the end the same gfx chip in the n800 is in the iphone |
| 20:01.51 | raster | and the itouch |
| 20:02.03 | raster | the power requirements are not an issue |
| 20:02.13 | raster | its not liek u need anextra special battery to power it |
| 20:02.34 | roh | raster: still bad comparison to compare things you cannot buy in combinations which we would need with products we cannot use for documentaion-reasons. |
| 20:02.40 | morricone | i actually never had the feeling that compiz was as fluid as a standard wm |
| 20:02.48 | roh | raster gives people senseless hope where there is none. |
| 20:03.06 | raster | roh: i never was talking of hope. |
| 20:03.15 | raster | i'm talking of simple performance |
| 20:03.25 | raster | of a similar device |
| 20:03.35 | raster | gfx is offboard across a bus |
| 20:03.40 | roh | raster the world is NOT simpleÃ. showing it as such lets space shuttles crash and people die. its harmful. |
| 20:03.41 | raster | not a uma system |
| 20:04.25 | raster | in which case - given your world view |
| 20:04.26 | roh | btw.. the iphone real world battery runtime seems to be quite bad. |
| 20:04.31 | raster | i shall never compare 2 things ever again |
| 20:04.34 | roh | just nobody who has one talks about it ;) |
| 20:04.37 | anrp | lol |
| 20:04.39 | anrp | the safe option |
| 20:04.42 | raster | nothign can ever be compared |
| 20:04.53 | raster | i shouldnt compare the pasts i had last night with lunch today |
| 20:05.02 | cb22 | roh: sssh, dont say apple too loud or the fanboys will come out |
| 20:05.02 | raster | as it is just too complexto compare whihc one tasted better |
| 20:05.08 | raster | its just too complex |
| 20:05.13 | raster | imagine all those divverent atoms |
| 20:05.21 | raster | like billions of them that are different |
| 20:05.25 | raster | and differing energy states. |
| 20:05.34 | playya_ | and the different plants which died for it |
| 20:05.38 | roh | raster please do, but only if they make sense to compare. so comparing the performance of things can only be artificial or theoretical, since in realworld there are thousands of other showstoppers who will stop the realisation |
| 20:06.24 | raster | i will say it one last time |
| 20:06.32 | raster | n800 and gta02 are fairly good comparisons |
| 20:06.35 | roh | for people who only want fast 3d. i would be so drastic om is the wrong place. they should buy a iphone and jailbreak it. tadaaa there is you egl surface.. just not any freedom. |
| 20:06.39 | raster | i have both |
| 20:06.46 | raster | i have developed for both |
| 20:07.08 | roh | raster well.. and one will bitrot very soon when nokia dumps kernelsupport like on the 770 |
| 20:08.08 | roh | i choose freedom. especially since i had a few endeveaurs with locked down embedded stuff recently with my dsl line *sigj* |
| 20:08.30 | raster | the n80 hyas a 1500mah @ 3.7v =- we have 1200. |
| 20:08.31 | roh | turns out some vendors are even too stupid to keep a pppoe connection stable |
| 20:08.33 | raster | didums. |
| 20:08.48 | raster | its within a reaosnable percentage |
| 20:08.55 | roh | raster n80? |
| 20:09.00 | raster | the n800 drives a much laretgr screen with more backlight power suckage |
| 20:09.02 | raster | n800 |
| 20:09.09 | roh | yes. |
| 20:09.25 | roh | so i would rather like to compare it to a similar sized screen. |
| 20:09.33 | raster | i dont give a crud about "freedom" when i am comparing hardeware platforms and their performance |
| 20:09.40 | raster | fre3edom is not the issue |
| 20:09.54 | Qwell | raster: so, this whole 7.3mbps for graphics + SD.. does that mean that video isn't going to be playable from the SD, or? |
| 20:10.06 | anrp | it means that video on sd is iffy |
| 20:10.09 | raster | free shouldnt mean i am forced to ride a horse and art instead of drive a car. |
| 20:10.32 | raster | the systems should be within spitting distance in performance in PRINCIPLE |
| 20:10.48 | raster | but as such choises along the way have meant they are not and won't ever be |
| 20:10.53 | raster | (video-bus wise) |
| 20:11.07 | raster | Qwell: quite possible |
| 20:12.27 | abraxa_ | Qwell: Actually, it might mean "does that mean that video isn't going to be playable" |
| 20:12.46 | Qwell | yeah... |
| 20:13.19 | *** join/#openmoko slchen (n=slchen@61-228-27-124.dynamic.hinet.net) |
| 20:17.08 | raster | basically there is a big qurestion of what may be possible |
| 20:17.13 | raster | but don't get your hopes up |
| 20:17.16 | raster | thats the main thing |
| 20:17.31 | raster | but - we'll be trying to squeeze what we can out of it |
| 20:19.41 | SpeedEvil | You can squeeze out more if you blend it. :) |
| 20:19.57 | anrp | hydraulic press |
| 20:20.04 | anrp | once the battery stops shooting flames of course |
| 20:25.04 | *** join/#openmoko homyx (n=homyx@ppp-88-217-47-136.dynamic.mnet-online.de) |
| 20:25.38 | raster | hahahaha |
| 20:25.51 | raster | well right now 2 things the glamo might be good at: |
| 20:26.07 | mwester | A new five-letter curse word? |
| 20:26.15 | raster | 1. some xrender accel. enough to make 2d performance not too awful for simple to medium things |
| 20:26.34 | raster | 2. opengl at qvga with very simple 3d "games" |
| 20:26.48 | raster | ie tex size of 25x6256 limits u to using textures as just textures |
| 20:26.51 | anrp | hit the monkey, win a free...runner! |
| 20:26.55 | raster | not as a 2d rendering replacement |
| 20:28.07 | playya_ | bomberman3d |
| 20:30.21 | mjr | accelerometer-driven tuxracer ftw |
| 20:31.51 | playya_ | using the freeruner as a wiimote |
| 20:32.53 | *** join/#openmoko a_thing (n=notroot@libervis/athing) |
| 20:33.49 | Babear | raster: so what's going on with the decision process if better chips weren't/aren't chosen? |
| 20:34.28 | raster | Babear: choice was before my time |
| 20:34.41 | raster | it ewas a bit of a hard place and a rock thing though |
| 20:34.49 | raster | to get wifi on - it needed extra sdio lines |
| 20:34.52 | raster | and glamo provided that |
| 20:34.57 | raster | but at a cost |
| 20:35.08 | *** join/#openmoko a__thing (n=notroot@c-98-193-50-46.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 20:35.20 | Babear | sounds like might've been a bit too big of a cost :) |
| 20:36.08 | *** join/#openmoko christooss (n=matic@84-255-246-158.static.t-2.net) |
| 20:36.33 | summatusmentis | raster: what're you trying to do? |
| 20:37.19 | raster | summatusmentis: trying to find a way to make the glamo behave decently |
| 20:37.20 | raster | :) |
| 20:37.35 | summatusmentis | glamo being the vid card? |
| 20:37.43 | SpeedEvil | suma: yes |
| 20:37.57 | summatusmentis | is it being naughty? |
| 20:38.04 | raster | norty |
| 20:38.07 | raster | very very norty |
| 20:38.16 | SpeedEvil | Or there were other possible hacks - for example a USB hub in between the SoC and the bluetooth/wifi |
| 20:38.30 | summatusmentis | urgh, this GSoC thing seems never ending |
| 20:38.31 | SpeedEvil | but that's got its own problems |
| 20:38.44 | SpeedEvil | (not GSoC - System on chip) |
| 20:39.08 | summatusmentis | lol, oh, well, Sumer of Code application process still seems never ending |
| 20:40.23 | *** join/#openmoko benkai (i=bkaindl@vic.ffii.org) |
| 20:40.23 | playya_ | the applying of the students will end this week? |
| 20:40.33 | *** join/#openmoko Cthobs (n=cerebus@fl-76-2-102-239.dhcp.embarqhsd.net) |
| 20:40.58 | summatusmentis | should be starting today, and ending in a week, yes |
| 20:41.35 | playya_ | the complexity of themes might be a bachelor thesis? |
| 20:41.43 | HOTR | peeks in |
| 20:41.57 | HOTR | playya_: Should be a Masters, I'd say. :P |
| 20:42.13 | anrp | sadly that doesn't say much anymore |
| 20:42.44 | playya_ | yes i know |
| 20:43.32 | playya_ | but for my thesis it ends a bit too early. |
| 20:45.12 | *** join/#openmoko ruoso (n=ruoso@a83-132-209-29.cpe.netcabo.pt) |
| 20:56.49 | *** join/#openmoko j_ack (n=j_ack@dsbg-4db7d6d7.pool.einsundeins.de) |
| 21:11.30 | *** join/#openmoko LoRez (i=lorez@freenode/staff/lorez) |
| 21:12.07 | *** join/#openmoko kloeri_ (i=kloeri@freenode/staff/kloeri) |
| 21:12.22 | *** join/#openmoko Ganneff (i=joerg@freenode/staff/debian.joerg) |
| 21:13.45 | *** join/#openmoko LoRez_ (i=lorez@freenode/staff/lorez) |
| 21:15.22 | *** join/#openmoko ecraven (n=nex@plc9-214.linzag.net) |
| 21:19.13 | *** join/#openmoko astro76 (n=jtaji@unaffiliated/astro76) |
| 21:20.32 | Babear | I wonder if someone at FIC would be open to a minimal-budget community-designed "backup plan" phone |
| 21:21.02 | Babear | where we would just provide a finished schema to FIC for a prototype run |
| 21:22.10 | Babear | and then it'd have better video bandwidth etc. and would be a possible choice for GTA03 |
| 21:23.00 | Babear | if (as it seems) they don't have anyone working on a next version in-house yet |
| 21:23.59 | *** part/#openmoko J-23 (n=aldwulf@a105.net128.okay.pl) |
| 21:24.12 | roh | Babear the problem is not wanting. its the pure realism problem that you have to choose from a) stuff thats available b) stuff that does work at all and c) stuff thats free enough to use it all all |
| 21:25.05 | roh | means you cannot decide by datasheet at all and lots of available hw falls out of the picture totally since its closed down or unusable due to 3rd party stuff |
| 21:25.06 | Babear | well from raster's musings I understood that there are better free alternatives for glamo available |
| 21:25.25 | *** join/#openmoko bentob0x (n=laurent@ip-213-49-79-40.dsl.scarlet.be) |
| 21:25.31 | roh | Bebear not really. |
| 21:26.20 | Babear | I wonder which chips raster had in mind |
| 21:28.57 | SpeedEvil | I think he was simply thinking of the dumb framebuffer alternative. |
| 21:28.57 | roh | Bebear: also we have to see how much time needs to pass from the decision to use something till you have a working prototype to mo |
| 21:29.17 | raster | dumb fb is the only other sane option we had |
| 21:29.35 | roh | SpeedEvil still wouldnt changed so much. means 32mbytes/sec load on ram also |
| 21:29.42 | SpeedEvil | roh: sure |
| 21:29.55 | *** join/#openmoko apaulsen (n=apaulsen@64.122.73.112) |
| 21:29.57 | SpeedEvil | roh: swings and roundabouts |
| 21:30.01 | roh | and no faster ramclock since we still would need some sdhc controller (means bus impedance stays the same) |
| 21:30.35 | SpeedEvil | Or some other attachment for wifi |
| 21:30.36 | roh | always a 'whats availabble' 'whats possible' 'whats the best guess now' game. |
| 21:30.45 | roh | SpeedEvil only slower ones avail. |
| 21:30.55 | anrp | also a "can i actually get 5 units" game to prototype.. |
| 21:31.00 | roh | do you want to see wifi on a shitty spi? i don't |
| 21:31.04 | SpeedEvil | Is usb1 a practical limitation though. |
| 21:31.05 | *** join/#openmoko j_ack_ (n=j_ack@dsbg-4db7d0a9.pool.einsundeins.de) |
| 21:31.28 | SpeedEvil | Assuming that's an option on some of the chipsets. |
| 21:31.29 | anrp | wifi on usb1 on a low powered device would seem fine to me |
| 21:31.43 | anrp | don't really see why you'd need to push more than a few megabits anyway, it would be hard to actually use |
| 21:31.45 | roh | no. also eats power like hell |
| 21:31.55 | *** part/#openmoko apaulsen (n=apaulsen@64.122.73.112) |
| 21:31.56 | anrp | ... |
| 21:31.56 | roh | usb inside a device is always last resort. |
| 21:32.01 | anrp | doesn't have to |
| 21:32.27 | roh | it is. usb cannot be used in sane sleep modes without nonstandard extensions |
| 21:32.59 | SpeedEvil | Is wake on wifi that interesting though? |
| 21:33.00 | roh | the only reason bt is connected to usb in gta devices is that the alternative would be spi and thats really slow compared to usb |
| 21:33.11 | anrp | spi definately doesn't have to be slow |
| 21:33.14 | roh | and bt is not always in in sane real world scenarios |
| 21:33.42 | SpeedEvil | Wake on wifi would have even more power impact than wake on bt typically. |
| 21:33.48 | roh | anrp its slower than usb1. |
| 21:33.54 | anrp | ... right |
| 21:33.59 | anrp | even a bus running at 50mhz |
| 21:34.02 | anrp | uh huh |
| 21:34.07 | roh | SpeedEvil also it needs support from the soc for wifi |
| 21:34.23 | roh | anrp well.. first i wanna see stuff that really can handle it ;) |
| 21:34.24 | SpeedEvil | roh: not really - it needs a wake line |
| 21:34.30 | Babear | wouldn't the n800 imagination chip be an alternative for the glamo? |
| 21:34.33 | ccfly | as far as GPU is concerned, does Smedia have a better GPU in their product protfolio you could use in GTA03 ? |
| 21:34.37 | roh | SpeedEvil yes. and it needs to stay powered. |
| 21:34.38 | anrp | i do 10mhz on a 20mhz avr, so i'm not really believing you |
| 21:34.44 | SpeedEvil | roh: or a microcontroller. |
| 21:34.44 | Babear | you don't get 3d with free drivers, but you don't get 3d with glamo either |
| 21:34.45 | anrp | :/ |
| 21:34.52 | ccfly | since they seem to be the only one willing to share technical documentation |
| 21:34.58 | roh | <Babear> wouldn't the n800 imagination chip be an alternative for the glamo? |
| 21:35.02 | roh | argh |
| 21:35.08 | *** join/#openmoko greentux_ (n=lemke@Z40e0.z.pppool.de) |
| 21:35.14 | roh | Babear imagination is closed afaik. |
| 21:35.41 | roh | SpeedEvil yes. which complicates stuff as soon as you need to connect the wifi or bt 'through' it :) |
| 21:36.05 | SpeedEvil | roh: I was meaning solely to handle the wake states and accelerometers and buttons and stuff |
| 21:36.11 | roh | SpeedEvil but yes. we want a mpu. thinking about msp430 since its really cool low power |
| 21:36.24 | Babear | <raster> the n800 USES free drivers for video |
| 21:36.29 | *** join/#openmoko greentux (n=lemke@Z410e.z.pppool.de) |
| 21:36.45 | roh | Babear but not for graphics. video is only a small part |
| 21:37.18 | ccfly | MSP430 is not a bad idea at all |
| 21:37.19 | Babear | <raster> they can't use the 3d accel of the imagination chip |
| 21:37.33 | anrp | so, we'd almost be at the same place |
| 21:37.34 | Babear | from that I understood that they CAN use the 2d parts, with free drivers |
| 21:37.39 | ccfly | it would really simplify power management |
| 21:37.42 | *** part/#openmoko macaronyde (n=marco@83-149-68-11.ippool.wk-serv.net) |
| 21:37.57 | SpeedEvil | ccfly: actually - that's not what we really want. |
| 21:38.05 | *** join/#openmoko slchen (n=slchen@61-228-27-124.dynamic.hinet.net) |
| 21:38.12 | SpeedEvil | ccfly: in some ways license from TI to actually use the calypso would be it. |
| 21:38.17 | roh | ccfly yes. i havent used it myself, but it has free toolchain support, 16bits, really good low-power modes (better than avr) and its awail in small packages |
| 21:38.30 | SpeedEvil | ccfly: we already have 2 processors in there hot most of the time. |
| 21:38.38 | anrp | D:? |
| 21:38.57 | SpeedEvil | ccfly: and much of the programming info has leaked. |
| 21:39.02 | anrp | if you haven't looked at the atmegaX8 series, they added some power disable blocks |
| 21:39.08 | anrp | just saying, i've only used avr |
| 21:39.38 | roh | anrp still they use loads of what a msp430 can do. msp goes deeper down. for high-load i also like avr a lot. |
| 21:39.53 | SpeedEvil | There is then the temptation to think of all teh nice things you can do with a microcontroller that costs .25 more. |
| 21:40.16 | ccfly | and then anorher one with 0,25 ccents more which has more of this and that :> |
| 21:40.25 | roh | still. one has to see the pcbspace such a endeavour uses and what complex parts will be needed around it |
| 21:40.30 | anrp | a few dollars later you're wondering why you even bothered with the main processor |
| 21:40.33 | SpeedEvil | I don't think we generally care. Once you're below 1mA at 3.3V or so, you're at 2% battery/day |
| 21:40.34 | anrp | ;o |
| 21:40.53 | SpeedEvil | And 1mA is huge in 8 bit space standby. |
| 21:40.56 | anrp | and then you're back where you started! |
| 21:41.12 | ccfly | I'm not sure MSP430 uses even that much power ;) |
| 21:41.19 | anrp | 1ma is a lot |
| 21:41.25 | anrp | lots of devices run at under 1ma |
| 21:41.27 | SpeedEvil | Indeed - it's huge |
| 21:41.37 | *** join/#openmoko zell1983 (n=zell1983@host196-56-dynamic.14-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 21:41.48 | anrp | and if you can spare a switching converter, you can go even further by running at 1.8v |
| 21:42.10 | roh | heh.. when i first heard about intel selling its arm stuff to marvell i wondered if they now do x86 in <1 watt..still waiting ;) |
| 21:42.28 | anrp | doesn't amd do that now? |
| 21:42.35 | anrp | with the geode |
| 21:42.48 | roh | still multiple of what you can do with arm or even avr32 |
| 21:43.05 | ccfly | actually geode still falls into 5W envelope more or less |
| 21:43.05 | *** join/#openmoko CVirus (n=GoD@82.201.178.6) |
| 21:43.09 | ccfly | afaik |
| 21:43.14 | roh | intel doesnt count ram, and chipset to that watt |
| 21:43.36 | roh | well.. 5 watt is like 5-10times what a moko has as envelope |
| 21:43.42 | ccfly | indeed |
| 21:43.56 | *** join/#openmoko ljp (n=lpotter@203.94.178.46) |
| 21:44.09 | roh | the biggest eaters are the radios and the display. then the cpu and eventually gpu come to it. |
| 21:44.12 | SpeedEvil | On cool MSP stuff http://www.ti.com/corp/docs/landing/mcu/index.htm?DCMP=MSP430ez430RFTools&HQS=Tools+OT+ez430-rf |
| 21:44.14 | *** join/#openmoko astro76 (n=jtaji@unaffiliated/astro76) |
| 21:44.58 | ccfly | we have 2 of those kits at work |
| 21:45.06 | ccfly | got them in nurnberg last year |
| 21:45.10 | anrp | you could add another bullet to the feature list of the neo, mabe |
| 21:45.16 | anrp | "also functions as hand warmer" |
| 21:45.53 | roh | anrp heh... luckily batteries are too fat to make such hw buildable |
| 21:46.24 | SpeedEvil | roh: I have used my neo duct taped to a 12V 55Ah car battery. |
| 21:46.25 | playya_ | speciel pockets in your gloves for neo |
| 21:46.28 | anrp | unless the battery IS the hand warmer |
| 21:46.29 | anrp | hmm.. |
| 21:46.30 | anrp | idea! |
| 21:46.32 | playya_ | ask your grandma |
| 21:46.38 | *** join/#openmoko j_ack (n=j_ack@dsbg-4db7dc59.pool.einsundeins.de) |
| 21:46.55 | *** part/#openmoko rcxdude (n=rcxdude@host86-147-87-6.range86-147.btcentralplus.com) |
| 21:46.57 | ccfly | if battery is a handwarmer, your hands will soon fell warm for the rest of your life |
| 21:47.06 | SpeedEvil | roh: for GPS logging - it was handier than a powercord. |
| 21:47.06 | anrp | indeed |
| 21:47.12 | roh | SpeedEvil hrhrh |
| 21:47.19 | anrp | pah |
| 21:47.30 | anrp | my 500 amp load tester laughs at your 55ah battery :o |
| 21:47.31 | *** join/#openmoko Niluge_KiWi (n=niluge_k@mut38-2-89-84-251-188.dsl.club-internet.fr) |
| 21:48.04 | anrp | although even going full tilt, that battery should run for .. days? |
| 21:48.14 | anrp | weeks |
| 21:48.35 | SpeedEvil | Call it a watt - that's 2Ah/day - about 3 weeks |
| 21:48.52 | SpeedEvil | Or 6 weeks or so with the display off |
| 21:50.25 | roh | hmm.. load tester.. still searching for a eelectronic 3-phase load wich can sink 0-72V and 0-25A |
| 21:50.54 | anrp | spies a custom project |
| 21:51.59 | roh | to be fair, i want a steerable load for a electric motor to build a test and measurement device |
| 21:52.33 | anrp | i'm looking for something similar except its more like 0-50v, 0-150a :/ for an engine tester |
| 21:53.10 | anrp | all the amps is the killer |
| 21:54.14 | anrp | although what you're looking for is pseudo-hv |
| 21:56.31 | *** join/#openmoko fehmicans (n=canavar@88.227.103.19) |
| 21:58.19 | roh | anrp well.. i have to look up how other people do it, but atm i am still unclear where to sink 1-2kW ... some oil-radiator oven? |
| 21:58.53 | anrp | nichrome wire is your best bet |
| 21:59.08 | anrp | two strands of 18ga, maybe 30cm each, can sink 750w |
| 21:59.10 | anrp | easy |
| 21:59.20 | anrp | you can cool if if you want but you don't need to |
| 21:59.49 | anrp | just make sure it doesn't get more than a dullish red hot |
| 21:59.54 | roh | hm. so heating is the solution. *g* |
| 22:00.01 | anrp | when it gets to about orange, it'll melt |
| 22:00.03 | anrp | but its stable at red |
| 22:00.14 | raster | well |
| 22:00.18 | raster | missed all of that |
| 22:00.28 | roh | eventually i should play with cheap heaters with fans and reuse that |
| 22:01.28 | anrp | meh, my dummy load cost all of $5-$10.. fixed resistance, but two bits of nichrome and 3 bolts, and a board of wood are pretty cheap |
| 22:01.47 | anrp | wall-plug-in heaters are generally for mains voltage, so lots of thin wire |
| 22:02.03 | *** join/#openmoko Marex (n=marex@vasut.kolej.mff.cuni.cz) |
| 22:04.57 | *** join/#openmoko j_ack (n=j_ack@dsbg-4db7b847.pool.einsundeins.de) |
| 22:05.47 | anrp | also, with bits of exposed wire, you can use alligator clips to adjust the load |
| 22:05.57 | anrp | although that's treading into iffy areas |
| 22:06.08 | anrp | since it *is* red hot |
| 22:09.04 | *** join/#openmoko j_ack_ (n=j_ack@dsbg-4db7b859.pool.einsundeins.de) |
| 22:21.30 | *** join/#openmoko masquerade (i=masquera@c-71-200-21-140.hsd1.de.comcast.net) |
| 22:23.35 | *** join/#openmoko jeffdameth (n=jeff@dyndsl-085-016-237-137.ewe-ip-backbone.de) |
| 22:25.32 | ccfly | bye |
| 22:27.26 | *** join/#openmoko Quadduc (n=stian@193.216.73.219) |
| 22:28.07 | masquerade | Hi all. |
| 22:28.45 | masquerade | I'm interested and will probably apply as a student for OpenMoko for this year's summer of code |
| 22:29.14 | masquerade | there are a few specific projects I'd be interested in working on, but afaict there isn't actually a way to get my hands on an OpenMoko device if I were to work on the project. |
| 22:29.46 | masquerade | I know some organizations provide their students with the hardware and related items necessary for development. Does anyone know if this would be the case with OpenMoko or would I be expected to try to get my hands on some hardware on my own? |
| 22:31.04 | abraxa_ | Openmoko, Inc. doesn't do this, I'm afraid |
| 22:31.24 | abraxa_ | Well, at least as I'm aware |
| 22:31.40 | cb22 | wll... |
| 22:32.02 | cb22 | from sean: Don't worry. GSoC is extremely important to us. We will make sure all |
| 22:32.05 | cb22 | the people who participate have FreeRunners. |
| 22:32.25 | cb22 | source: community mailing list, topic: GSoC 2008 |
| 22:32.41 | Weiss | here: http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/community/2008-March/014349.html |
| 22:33.07 | playya_ | thats an additional incetive to participate |
| 22:33.16 | cb22 | indeed |
| 22:33.29 | cb22 | think of the bragging rights too ;) |
| 22:33.54 | playya_ | i thought of buying a HTC MAgician |
| 22:34.08 | masquerade | that's definitely an extra incentive to participate for sure. |
| 22:34.17 | playya_ | but there i might not do hardware dependent stuff |
| 22:34.48 | playya_ | i actually do not know if i have to work during summer |
| 22:35.02 | playya_ | that my problem. nokia is too slow |
| 22:35.31 | *** join/#openmoko grummel (n=Grummel@p5B16FE7A.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 22:36.40 | abraxa_ | cb22: Thanks for the notice |
| 22:37.00 | abraxa_ | And it's kinda blasphemic |
| 22:37.40 | abraxa_ | Sean says SoC is "extremely important" to Openmoko, Inc. - yet mickey is forced to organize it |
| 22:39.54 | *** join/#openmoko a_thing (n=notroot@libervis/athing) |
| 22:40.05 | SpeedEvil | that's one of the benefits of having minions. |
| 22:40.55 | cb22 | mwahahahha |
| 22:41.36 | cb22 | slaps the person who thought of lga775. |
| 22:41.47 | ScaredyCat | is too old for GSoc ... :( |
| 22:41.54 | SpeedEvil | also. |
| 22:41.55 | cb22 | is too young :( |
| 22:42.08 | SpeedEvil | ponders if average age would work. |
| 22:42.32 | *** join/#openmoko Hirvinen_ (i=patrik@hoas-fe3ddd00-123.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 22:43.22 | ScaredyCat | average age of a 1 day old badger and me, maybe that would work. |
| 22:43.45 | cb22 | 100 + 1 / 2 still == 50 |
| 22:43.48 | *** join/#openmoko cmarcelo (n=cmarcelo@enlightenment/developer/cmarcelo) |
| 22:43.56 | playya_ | muhaha |
| 22:44.23 | *** part/#openmoko cmarcelo (n=cmarcelo@enlightenment/developer/cmarcelo) |
| 22:45.02 | ScaredyCat | and cb22 is just a postcode |
| 22:45.25 | ScaredyCat | right time for old farts to get some sleep... night all |
| 22:45.38 | cb22 | night old cat |
| 22:51.27 | cb22 | yay! fixed some pins on an lga775 mobo |
| 22:52.36 | *** join/#openmoko suuuper (n=suuuper@151.60.83.69) |
| 22:53.43 | SpeedEvil | just threw out his first PCI card... |
| 22:55.01 | cb22 | thats rather ambiguious |
| 22:55.12 | cb22 | did you throw out the first PCI card you ever had |
| 22:55.12 | SpeedEvil | has been tidying. |
| 22:55.29 | cb22 | or did you throw out a PCI card for the first time? |
| 22:55.37 | SpeedEvil | is a packrat. |
| 22:55.43 | SpeedEvil | I'm trying to overcome it. |
| 22:56.01 | anrp | mmm |
| 22:56.15 | anrp | step one: accumulate a pile of useless stuff |
| 22:56.16 | *** join/#openmoko Synchronicity (n=Stick@unaffiliated/relate) |
| 22:56.24 | anrp | two: go "why did i accumulate a pile of stuff?" |
| 22:56.30 | SpeedEvil | step two: think 'I really should ebay some of this' |
| 22:56.32 | anrp | three: add some more stuff to it and throw it |
| 22:56.37 | SpeedEvil | Step three: procrastination. |
| 22:56.39 | anrp | ebaying is a lot of work |
| 22:56.41 | anrp | so :/ |
| 22:57.20 | cb22 | keeping stuff is good... once my mom forced me to through away stuff. so i did, then i bought a new hdd for my old laptop (i dropped the old one), and realized i through away the mini ide -> propritary sony ide convertor |
| 22:57.36 | anrp | if you have a lot of space, sure |
| 22:57.43 | anrp | but its far too easy to accumulate massive piles of stuff |
| 22:59.46 | SpeedEvil | hires a digger to dig out his garden to a depth of 5m, and roofs it. |
| 22:59.52 | SpeedEvil | Problem solved! |
| 23:00.18 | anrp | er |
| 23:00.24 | anrp | that solves the wrong problem D: |
| 23:01.11 | SpeedEvil | Yeah. I need a robot warehousing system with LRE algorithm. |
| 23:01.21 | SpeedEvil | Don't use an item in 3 years, and it autolists it on ebay. |
| 23:01.30 | cb22 | LRE? |
| 23:01.34 | anrp | lru.. |
| 23:01.38 | cb22 | ah |
| 23:03.36 | *** join/#openmoko slchen (n=slchen@61-228-27-124.dynamic.hinet.net) |
| 23:11.45 | cb22 | would the accelerometers in the freerunner be able to detect something like: http://cb22.za.net/can.png ? |
| 23:12.23 | SpeedEvil | easily |
| 23:12.32 | *** part/#openmoko keithp (n=keithp@home.keithp.com) |
| 23:12.40 | SpeedEvil | They are inaccurate for many things - but pickup 'down' quite accurately. |
| 23:12.53 | SpeedEvil | +- couple of degrees. |
| 23:13.01 | cb22 | sweet :) page turning would rock |
| 23:13.20 | SpeedEvil | Though of course turning fast round corners makes things ambiguous. |
| 23:14.00 | cb22 | what about if you had the neo flat, and you tilted the front down? |
| 23:14.54 | *** join/#openmoko djk (n=djk@m660f36d0.tmodns.net) |
| 23:14.54 | zash | it would be cool to answer a call by raising the phone to your ear |
| 23:15.02 | SpeedEvil | you can tell down easily in all cases. |
| 23:15.22 | anrp | what if you're in freefall D: |
| 23:15.23 | SpeedEvil | So think how down moves when you tilt the phone (WRT the phone) |
| 23:15.40 | SpeedEvil | places an anvil gently on anrps falling head. |
| 23:15.51 | anrp | or on the vomit comet! |
| 23:15.57 | anrp | which is mostly equiv |
| 23:16.06 | cb22 | gyros sound a lot cooler though |
| 23:16.57 | playya_ | gyros tastes good |
| 23:17.00 | SpeedEvil | Also lots more expensive. |
| 23:17.07 | SpeedEvil | accel chips are $2ish |
| 23:17.08 | cb22 | playya_: that too |
| 23:17.15 | SpeedEvil | Gyro chips are $20ish |
| 23:19.29 | abraxa_ | SpeedEvil: So am I understanding it right that the only thing we can't detect is motion parallel to gravity? e.g. rotating the phone as it's lying flat on a table |
| 23:20.10 | SpeedEvil | yes |
| 23:20.18 | abraxa_ | Thanks |
| 23:20.22 | SpeedEvil | or holding the phone vertically, and turning in place |
| 23:20.47 | playya_ | so no "spin-the-bottle" game for open moko :P |
| 23:21.04 | anrp | well strictly the only motion you can't detect is rotation around the axis between the two accelerometers |
| 23:21.09 | SpeedEvil | You can pick up _rapid_ translational accellerations - but these are pretty much fairly violent |
| 23:21.11 | anrp | however the small scale accelerations are hard to measure |
| 23:21.15 | cb22 | playya_: rig it :p |
| 23:21.17 | SpeedEvil | anrp: with ideal accellerometers. |
| 23:21.31 | SpeedEvil | anrp: these ones have 16cm/s^2 bits |
| 23:22.00 | *** join/#openmoko christooss (n=matic@84-255-246-158.static.t-2.net) |
| 23:22.05 | anrp | 6 bit? |
| 23:22.10 | anrp | ..per g |
| 23:22.20 | SpeedEvil | anrp: somewhere near that. |
| 23:22.23 | anrp | that's terrible |
| 23:22.31 | SpeedEvil | IIRC 8 bits and +-2G |
| 23:22.40 | anrp | i didn't know that :\ |
| 23:22.46 | anrp | i thought it would be closer to 10 |
| 23:22.53 | SpeedEvil | it's around an order of magnitude worse than the best. |
| 23:23.11 | anrp | ;( |
| 23:28.06 | *** join/#openmoko dnlcerqueira (n=dnlcerqu@a213-22-228-253.cpe.netcabo.pt) |
| 23:29.03 | playya_ | good night everybody |
| 23:38.37 | *** part/#openmoko dnlcerqueira (n=dnlcerqu@a213-22-228-253.cpe.netcabo.pt) |
| 23:38.39 | *** join/#openmoko rcxdude (n=rcxdude@host86-147-87-6.range86-147.btcentralplus.com) |
| 23:41.30 | *** join/#openmoko TobiX (i=tobias@zoidberg.org) |
| 23:44.16 | *** join/#openmoko gopi (n=gopi@ppp-71-139-48-90.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net) |
| 23:50.16 | *** join/#openmoko darmou (n=darmou@ppp121-44-177-119.lns5.mel6.internode.on.net) |
| 23:53.46 | josch | TOUCHSCREEN WORKS IN DEBIAN ON THE NEO!! |
| 23:53.51 | josch | used tslib xorg driver |
| 23:54.16 | josch | now i have to find a way to swap x/y axis as it seems to assume 640x480 screen |
| 23:54.55 | ewon | nice |
| 23:55.16 | zash | isnt openmoko based on openembedded, which is based on debian? |
| 23:59.07 | anrp | openembedded is (distantly) based on portage (gentoo) from what i remember |
