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| 00:20.39 | tonyg | ok goodnight folks. |
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| 00:33.48 | cesarb | Does anyone know which pin can I look at to know if there's power on the USB power line? |
| 00:34.18 | SpeedEvil | cesarb: measure between the outer ones |
| 00:34.19 | stefan_schmidt | cesarb: Test? I mean there are just 5 :) |
| 00:34.28 | aevin | cesarb: it's one of those on the side. |
| 00:34.33 | SpeedEvil | cesarb: the neo one? |
| 00:34.37 | cesarb | SpeedEvil: I mean from within the SoC... |
| 00:34.49 | SpeedEvil | cesarb: ah - don't think it's hooked up |
| 00:34.55 | SpeedEvil | cesarb: only through the PMU |
| 00:34.57 | cesarb | I want to somehow make the driver know it's got Vusb *before* it enables the USB core |
| 00:35.12 | cesarb | and make the cpufreq dance stop as long as it's plugged into something |
| 00:35.35 | SpeedEvil | The minor problem is of course, it's quite possible to be connected to a UsB host not supplying any power. |
| 00:35.43 | SpeedEvil | but that's probably not the usual case |
| 00:36.28 | SpeedEvil | I just found a benchmarks page. |
| 00:36.57 | SpeedEvil | Current processors are at about a million times the speed of a pdp/11-03 |
| 00:37.21 | SpeedEvil | The neo is probably on the order of a hundred thousand times faster. |
| 00:38.47 | cesarb | SpeedEvil: connecting to a powerless host is not a problem... lots of devices fail in that situation too (it seems it's quite common to use Vusb as a signal to actually turn on the pull-up/down in the data line which signals the host it's on) |
| 00:39.08 | cesarb | SpeedEvil: unless you really want to use it OTG style |
| 00:39.45 | SpeedEvil | cesarb: I know - I was just commenting as I've used it in the 'cut red wire' case - for battery current testing |
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| 01:50.44 | KrisAbsinthe | YAY got the Test GTA01 today, GSM 850 works |
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| 02:15.20 | raster | KrisAbsinthe: it does? |
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| 03:06.46 | torrentzasd | i call the police on you |
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| 03:38.57 | Kero | there, incoming text messaging event, and I can even read it. libgsmd-tool level. |
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| 04:24.08 | CIA-15 | openmoko: 03werner * r3969 10/trunk/src/target/u-boot/patches/gta02-nor.patch: (log message trimmed) |
| 04:24.08 | CIA-15 | openmoko: This patch adds the minimum infrastructure necessary for having a correct |
| 04:24.08 | CIA-15 | openmoko: "mtdparts" variable that contains the NOR partition, and still making sure that |
| 04:24.08 | CIA-15 | openmoko: u-boot understands the partition layout. |
| 04:24.08 | CIA-15 | openmoko: CFG_MTDPARTS_PREFIX is admittedly a bit of a hack. Should probably extend the |
| 04:24.12 | CIA-15 | openmoko: dynparts logic to handle multiple devices. |
| 04:24.14 | CIA-15 | openmoko: Note that this patch isn't in "series" yet. There's more to come. |
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| 05:07.07 | Kero | yay, second step succeeded, called a method in libgsmd and saw what gsmd tries to do in my testing framework |
| 05:08.20 | Kero | next step: produce a response and see it arrive back via libgsmd |
| 05:20.31 | Kero | which immediately brings up the question, wtf are libgsmd methods returning in this int? and where does the string from gsmd go... |
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| 06:00.44 | KrisAbsinthe | raster: only on the modified phone I have |
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| 06:12.14 | _Krieger_ | i have a fail on 'make all' with MokoMakefile on building cacao. What does my sytem lack? Java environment? http://www.pastebin.ca/876962 |
| 06:13.38 | CM | What version of the java sdk do you have? |
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| 07:15.08 | duffyd | hi ever since I updated to the image from 23/01 my OM segfault/freezes when I try to do any operations that are IO intensive, e.g. ipkg update, scp, etc |
| 07:15.12 | duffyd | any ideas on how to fix it? |
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| 07:59.51 | Hopscotch | good morning |
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| 08:22.42 | TRIsoft | morning |
| 08:23.41 | Sonicadvance | morning |
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| 08:41.55 | CIA-15 | openmoko: 03werner * r3970 10/branches/src/target/kernel/2.6.24.x/patches/gta02-acc.patch: |
| 08:41.55 | CIA-15 | openmoko: sensors-inactive-unless-event-open.patch |
| 08:41.55 | CIA-15 | openmoko: From: warmcat <andy@openmoko.com> |
| 08:41.55 | CIA-15 | openmoko: Stop the global slowdown action of the current motion sensor patch: |
| 08:41.55 | CIA-15 | openmoko: only accept interrupts if the event interface is opened by something |
| 08:41.56 | CIA-15 | openmoko: Signed-off-by: Andy Green <andy@openmoko.com> |
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| 08:44.57 | hrw | morning |
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| 09:09.34 | CIA-15 | openmoko: 03werner * r3971 10/branches/src/target/kernel/2.6.24.x/patches/gta02-acc.patch: (log message trimmed) |
| 09:09.34 | CIA-15 | openmoko: motion-sensors-irq-spi.patch |
| 09:09.34 | CIA-15 | openmoko: From: Andy Green <andy@openmoko.com> |
| 09:09.34 | CIA-15 | openmoko: This patch removes the workqueue method originally implemented for |
| 09:09.34 | CIA-15 | openmoko: motion sensor service and replaces with with a platform-defined |
| 09:09.36 | CIA-15 | openmoko: callback which is used in the ISR. |
| 09:09.40 | CIA-15 | openmoko: An implementation for the callback is also provided which performs |
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| 09:38.20 | gambler | how lonk does it take to make openmoko-devel-image |
| 09:40.25 | roh | gambler 5-7h on a fast recent machine with fast internet. |
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| 09:48.56 | gambler | roh what does that leave me with? will i be able to bring up an emulator when its finished |
| 09:52.02 | `pwgen` | gambler: you can build your emulator in maybe 20 min http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/OpenMoko_under_QEMU |
| 09:55.16 | roh | gambler the emulator is seperate. that just takes minutes to build. |
| 09:55.51 | roh | openmoko-devel-image builds a complete toolchain (crossgcc, binutils, etc) and a 'world' means linux kernel, filesystem full of system and applications |
| 09:57.43 | cesarb | roh: including things like strace |
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| 09:58.41 | roh | cesarb dunno. need to find out |
| 09:58.54 | roh | but you can surely build that if you need it |
| 09:59.04 | roh | balrog-kun youre there? |
| 10:00.54 | cesarb | roh: I just used strace on the emulated device yesterday |
| 10:01.08 | cesarb | roh: I found it so unexpected it was already there I had to mention it ;-) |
| 10:02.36 | XorA | cesarb: thats why its called devel-image |
| 10:03.09 | roh | ;) |
| 10:03.23 | roh | <- just adding balrog to planet |
| 10:04.17 | roh | did we miss somebody else? |
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| 10:16.23 | xcasex | roh *couhg cough* |
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| 10:27.22 | XorA | still no mokopr0n out there |
| 10:27.31 | XorA | there is gp2x pr0n, why no moko pr0n |
| 10:28.35 | ScaredyCat | o rly |
| 10:29.09 | cesarb | On qemu, it looks like all blocks except spi (wtf?) are enabled... I wonder if it's the same on the real device |
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| 10:30.23 | ScaredyCat | I was.... :P |
| 10:30.31 | ScaredyCat | k |
| 10:30.45 | ScaredyCat | but i didn;t write it... |
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| 10:31.39 | xcasex | ScaredyCat: tss only pics on my blahwg are of my two bonus sons |
| 10:32.02 | ScaredyCat | did you win them ? |
| 10:32.10 | ScaredyCat | bonus ? |
| 10:32.13 | ScaredyCat | eh? |
| 10:32.15 | xcasex | nah |
| 10:32.22 | gambler | how to resolve this error |
| 10:32.22 | XorA | cesarb: I toyed with powering up/down audio on demand, but need support from gsmd for that |
| 10:32.24 | gambler | http://pastebin.ca/877451 |
| 10:32.26 | xcasex | its my gfs sons from a previous relationship, and well |
| 10:32.31 | ScaredyCat | ahh |
| 10:32.33 | xcasex | you get the idea |
| 10:32.38 | gambler | roh any ideas? |
| 10:32.39 | XorA | cesarb: its actually only a few lines of code in audio driver |
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| 10:37.12 | cesarb | XorA: actually, audio is almost completely a separate pair of chips |
| 10:37.23 | cesarb | XorA: I'm talking about blocks within the SoC chip |
| 10:37.42 | XorA | cesarb: take a step back, think and look at audio driver author :-) |
| 10:37.52 | cesarb | XorA: things like rtc (which we don't use - we use the PMU RTC - but still seems to have been left enabled) |
| 10:37.56 | XorA | cesarb: and the I2S unit is inside s3c24xx |
| 10:38.43 | cesarb | Also, UART2. There's nothing using UART2 (in fact, it shares lines with RTS/CTS of UART1, so it's useless). Why is it (at least on qemu) enabled? |
| 10:39.41 | XorA | cesarb: please file a bug with this |
| 10:39.55 | XorA | cesarb: that way the kernel guys can answer or go DOH!!! |
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| 10:41.29 | roh | gambler sorry.. no clue. do you have the rest of the error? |
| 10:41.40 | cesarb | XorA: I have to check with the real device later tonight |
| 10:41.49 | cesarb | XorA: since qemu can sometimes be a bit wonky |
| 10:42.10 | XorA | cesarb: for some strange reason s3c24xx boots with everything enabled, you have to remever to turn off devices in driver init |
| 10:42.19 | XorA | cesarb: that one drove me mad for a bit |
| 10:43.01 | *** join/#openmoko Sufflope (n=Sufflope@crj95-3-82-237-151-219.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 10:43.03 | rtp | XorA: for kernel stuff, one should use om-kernel imho. Otherwise, it has high chances to be missed |
| 10:44.47 | xcasex | roh blog.asystemapart.com :p |
| 10:46.49 | XorA | rtp: doesnt filing a bug against kernel assign it to openmoko-kernel anyway? |
| 10:48.34 | gambler | roh, the full output: http://pastebin.ca/877524 |
| 10:49.31 | roh | XorA i think its best to file a bug, but without a mail to the system-ml (openmoko-kernel) it could go unnoticed |
| 10:49.38 | rtp | XorA: I doubt. In a recent thread on om-kernel, it was said that the kernel guys were not really looking at the bugzilla |
| 10:49.55 | roh | rtp they are looking if somebody hands them a link ;) |
| 10:49.55 | rtp | XorA: http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-kernel/2008-January/000639.html |
| 10:50.48 | roh | gambler some problem with locale generation via local qemu invocation |
| 10:51.04 | roh | gambler but why it crashed i dunno. |
| 10:51.56 | rtp | roh: which doesn't seem to happen. Also, other people might want to look at the patches. They likely won't get this link |
| 10:53.31 | roh | rtp yes. thats why i meant, post it to bugzilla with as much info as possible and then send a mail to openmoko-kernel with a link to the bugzilla entry. |
| 10:54.37 | roh | gambler you seem not to have psycho installed (python jit compiler) which would speed things up massively.. youre on x86? |
| 10:54.54 | roh | gambler also it cries about not having qemu.. the question for me is: why didnt it get built by OE? |
| 10:55.10 | roh | XorA any idea? ERROR: Nothing PROVIDES 'uboot-openmoko' (but '[]' DEPENDS on or otherwise requires it) |
| 10:55.17 | *** join/#openmoko TAsn (n=TAsn@82.166.221.69) |
| 10:55.25 | XorA | roh: update MokoMakefile |
| 10:55.44 | rtp | roh: ok. You make a point. But this won't work for reviewing patches. |
| 10:55.46 | roh | gambler there you have it ;) |
| 10:56.22 | roh | rtp as soon as somebody is really working on a ticket it should be assigned to the respecting devel, means he also gets mail on adding new patches. |
| 10:56.43 | XorA | rtp: internally we are only allowed to work on unscheduled work if it is assigned a bug |
| 10:58.25 | XorA | gambler: building on fedore core? |
| 10:58.46 | ScaredyCat | you know, I always thought gkt programming would be hard... the programming isn't the hard bit... it that stupid layout crap.... |
| 10:58.50 | ScaredyCat | gtk |
| 10:59.07 | rtp | XorA: oh... I didn't know that |
| 10:59.28 | ScaredyCat | anyone know of a simple ui design tool that works properly with gtk ? |
| 11:00.22 | XorA | ScaredyCat: glade? |
| 11:00.29 | ScaredyCat | glade sucks |
| 11:00.46 | ScaredyCat | I don;t want another lib for a start... plus it lies.. |
| 11:00.50 | XorA | ScaredyCat: you should have said a non sucky simple :-) |
| 11:03.05 | ScaredyCat | well, glade seems to support what is effectively 'colspan' but it seems to be totally ignored when I use the C code |
| 11:04.25 | *** join/#openmoko Weteor (n=Weteor@i59F6367D.versanet.de) |
| 11:04.28 | XorA | ScaredyCat: to be honest I havent tried glade since gtk 1 |
| 11:04.41 | ScaredyCat | what do you use? |
| 11:04.43 | ScaredyCat | paper? |
| 11:05.25 | *** join/#openmoko t_s_o (n=tso@63.84-49-135.nextgentel.com) |
| 11:06.20 | XorA | ScaredyCat: I dont do UI work, its easier that way |
| 11:06.36 | ScaredyCat | lol |
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| 11:25.51 | gambler | roh, XorA, hey yep building on fedora Core...yep |
| 11:25.54 | gambler | updaing MokoMakefile |
| 11:28.23 | XorA | gambler: qemu arm doesnt play well with fedora core, you need to replace your kernel |
| 11:29.18 | gambler | argh...ok |
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| 11:36.33 | *** join/#openmoko Mathiasdm (n=Mathias@d54C597B6.access.telenet.be) |
| 11:38.39 | balrog-kun | roh: awesome |
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| 11:43.16 | roh | balrog-kun :) |
| 11:43.30 | ScaredyCat | lol, looks funny in that order... |
| 11:43.47 | ScaredyCat | CM saying you aren't there... then you being there, below him |
| 11:43.57 | roh | balrog-kun if somebody should be in there just mail gismo or me in the future ;) |
| 11:45.07 | balrog-kun | roh: okays, thanks :) |
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| 11:57.07 | CIA-15 | openmoko: 03thomas * r3972 10/trunk/src/target/opkg/opkg_download.c: opkg: protect against total being zero when calculation percentage |
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| 12:25.33 | tonyg | ScaredyCat, glade-3 is what I used for the (extremely ugly, mind) UI for my erlang userland |
| 12:25.39 | tonyg | It seemed entirely adequate. |
| 12:26.12 | tonyg | For traditional, desktop-oriented gui toolkits, that is :-) |
| 12:27.46 | tonyg | btw, re: yesterday's discussion of at@poff: I can confirm that the battery survived nicely overnight after I made the system at@poff before shelling out to "poweroff". |
| 12:28.13 | tonyg | some few percentage points of drop, but nothing to worry about (esp considering the power draw when it's switched on :-) ) |
| 12:28.16 | SpeedEvil | the battery use is about 100uA when off - amp and GSM |
| 12:28.32 | SpeedEvil | This is a battery life of aroung a year |
| 12:31.52 | *** join/#openmoko florian (n=fuchs@217.146.132.69) |
| 12:36.24 | CIA-15 | openmoko: 03werner * r3973 10/trunk/src/target/u-boot/patches/nor-default-env.patch: (log message trimmed) |
| 12:36.24 | CIA-15 | openmoko: This patch makes u-boot use the default environment is booting from NOR. That |
| 12:36.24 | CIA-15 | openmoko: way, we can be sure no contamination occurs from a possibly severely upset |
| 12:36.24 | CIA-15 | openmoko: NAND. |
| 12:36.24 | CIA-15 | openmoko: nor-default-env.patch: |
| 12:36.26 | CIA-15 | openmoko: - cpu/arm920t/start.S, common/env_common.c (env_relocate): new configuration |
| 12:36.30 | CIA-15 | openmoko: option CFG_DEFAULT_ENV_IF_NOR to use the default environment (and not try to |
| 12:37.53 | CIA-15 | openmoko: 03chris * r3974 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/libraries/libmokoui2/ (6 files in 2 dirs): |
| 12:37.53 | CIA-15 | openmoko: * bindings/python/Makefile.am: |
| 12:37.54 | CIA-15 | openmoko: * bindings/python/moko.override: |
| 12:37.54 | CIA-15 | openmoko: * bindings/python/mokomodule.c: |
| 12:37.54 | CIA-15 | openmoko: Rename 'moko' to 'mokoui' in python bindings |
| 12:39.07 | florian | r |
| 12:39.08 | florian | e |
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| 12:43.05 | CIA-15 | openmoko: 03chris * r3975 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/libraries/libmokoui2/bindings/python/Makefile.am: Unbreak python bindings makefile |
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| 12:46.26 | *** join/#openmoko pauliusz (n=paulius@82-135-208-232.ip.zebra.lt) |
| 12:51.16 | pauliusz | Is it posible to post to gsmd mailing list through gmane without subscription? |
| 12:52.51 | Vegar | does it have to go through gmane? |
| 12:53.22 | *** join/#openmoko rmoravcik (n=rmoravci@gtsgw.ttc.cz) |
| 12:53.36 | CIA-15 | openmoko: 03chris * r3976 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/libraries/libmokoui2/bindings/python/ (mokoui.override mokouimodule.c): *Really* unbreak python bindings |
| 12:55.07 | *** join/#openmoko faern (n=faern@faern.olf.sgsnet.se) |
| 12:55.56 | pauliusz | I prefer to read it through gmane... but when I try to post to gmane.comp.handhelds.openmoko.gsmd it doesn't return any "error" e-mail neither my post appears in the mailing list... |
| 12:58.30 | roh | pauliusz thats ok. i mean. the list is gsmd-devel@lists.openmoko.org its not hosted at gmane. |
| 13:00.25 | *** part/#openmoko baird (n=cbaird@brushtail.apana.org.au) |
| 13:00.56 | Vegar | are the MLs broken again? |
| 13:01.31 | roh | Vegar nope. not that i know of. and the admin sits across to me and i can login onto the admin if just now |
| 13:01.53 | Vegar | I haven't received any mails today |
| 13:02.40 | roh | and youre sure its not your mta? |
| 13:03.14 | Vegar | might be, but I'm assuming that gmail is pretty stable |
| 13:03.32 | roh | whats your address and which lists? |
| 13:04.01 | pauliusz | but the gmane is just gateway... It means that if I post to gmane.comp.handhelds.openmoko.gsmd it should just resend my post to the gsmd-devel@lists.openmoko.org |
| 13:04.27 | Vegar | roh: would you mind if I sent the address in msg? |
| 13:04.53 | pauliusz | maybe there is some blacklist for gmane in this mailing list? |
| 13:04.57 | Vegar | lists -svn, -distro-devel, -kernel, -community, -device-owners |
| 13:07.27 | *** join/#openmoko VladoK (n=vlado@92.60.48.2) |
| 13:07.37 | roh | Vegar n.p. just /msg me. |
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| 14:00.50 | CIA-15 | openmoko: 03werner * r3977 10/trunk/src/target/u-boot/patches/usb-vendor.patch: (log message trimmed) |
| 14:00.50 | CIA-15 | openmoko: OpenMoko, Inc. now has its own USB vendor ID. Changing the ID creates a |
| 14:00.50 | CIA-15 | openmoko: compatibility barrier for DFU, so we only do this for GTA02. |
| 14:00.50 | CIA-15 | openmoko: To make it easier to locally back out this change, it gets its own patch |
| 14:00.50 | CIA-15 | openmoko: for a while. To be merged into uboot-gta02.patch later. |
| 14:00.54 | CIA-15 | openmoko: usb-vendor.patch: |
| 14:00.56 | CIA-15 | openmoko: - include/configs/neo1973_gta02.h (CONFIG_USBD_VENDORID), |
| 14:03.39 | *** join/#openmoko riot (n=wntrmut@krombacher-pils.oph.RWTH-Aachen.DE) |
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| 14:31.42 | CIA-15 | freesmartphone.org: 03emdete * r64 10/trunk/software/py-proto/pygsmd.py: fault tolerant restart with muxer implementation started |
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| 15:02.09 | pauliusz | looks like mailing list is down? |
| 15:03.36 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@209.195.169.219) |
| 15:04.34 | pauliusz | or I must subscibe to be able to post to it? |
| 15:06.22 | SpeedEvil | look on archives |
| 15:06.30 | SpeedEvil | is it updating? |
| 15:06.36 | SpeedEvil | if not, it may be down |
| 15:06.38 | *** join/#openmoko grummel (n=grummel@p5B16DF17.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 15:06.53 | *** part/#openmoko dorje78 (n=astanese@81-174-61-89.staticnet.ngi.it) |
| 15:06.55 | ynezz | or it's moderated for those who aren't subsribed |
| 15:06.56 | *** join/#openmoko t_s_o (n=tso@63.84-49-135.nextgentel.com) |
| 15:07.11 | ynezz | s/subsribed/subscribed/ |
| 15:08.36 | SpeedEvil | Don't actually know |
| 15:08.41 | *** join/#openmoko zipola (n=zipola@zip.kortex.jyu.fi) |
| 15:09.11 | SpeedEvil | I vaguely recall it bounciing mail back to me saying it's waiting for admin if I got the sending name wrong |
| 15:09.19 | ScaredyCat | kyes it is |
| 15:09.57 | ScaredyCat | not subbed == admin approval (afaik doesn't happen) |
| 15:10.02 | *** join/#openmoko peepsalot (n=peepsalo@bwext.kpimdp.com) |
| 15:10.07 | ScaredyCat | ie message never delivered |
| 15:12.09 | pauliusz | ScaredyCat: thanks for info. |
| 15:12.35 | ScaredyCat | np |
| 15:12.38 | tonyg | abc |
| 15:12.44 | tonyg | s/a\(.\)/a\1\1/ |
| 15:12.45 | ScaredyCat | 123 |
| 15:12.49 | tonyg | bah |
| 15:13.42 | pauliusz | someone should set proper settings for gmane that posting without subsciptio is not allowed... |
| 15:14.21 | *** join/#openmoko Ebbe (n=ebbe@users.kollegienet.dk) |
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| 15:25.45 | wurp2|in_and_out | I finished that little program to detect low charge rate and ask if you want to crank it up |
| 15:26.07 | wurp2|in_and_out | I'll test it out for a couple of days and then post it to the wiki and/or make an ipkg |
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| 15:35.09 | josch | lol bug? |
| 15:35.10 | josch | root@fic-gta01:~$ ls /var/volatile/tmp/x.log -lha |
| 15:35.10 | josch | -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 61.5M Jan 29 09:10 /var/volatile/tmp/x.log |
| 15:35.27 | josch | why is x.log 61.5MB ???? |
| 15:35.56 | josch | it eats up my whole /var/volatile |
| 15:37.20 | josch | okay my x.log is filled up with only this message: |
| 15:37.21 | josch | ** (phone-kit:1079): WARNING **: Unhandled IO condition |
| 15:38.37 | Sup3rkiddo | josch, re |
| 15:38.56 | *** join/#openmoko kdean06 (n=kdean06@fsf/member/kdean06) |
| 15:39.03 | josch | hi Sup3rkiddo |
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| 15:45.53 | wurp2|in_and_out | Is there a better way to programatically unlock the phone than 'killall neod'? |
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| 15:52.12 | CIA-15 | openmoko: 03werner * r3978 10/trunk/src/target/u-boot/patches/ (6 files): (log message trimmed) |
| 15:52.12 | CIA-15 | openmoko: Implement new partition layout and enable patches that |
| 15:52.12 | CIA-15 | openmoko: - change the vendor ID, |
| 15:52.12 | CIA-15 | openmoko: - make "mtdparts" work smoothly, and |
| 15:52.12 | CIA-15 | openmoko: - that make NOR boot use the default environment |
| 15:52.12 | CIA-15 | openmoko: Details: |
| 15:52.14 | CIA-15 | openmoko: uboot-gta02.patch: |
| 15:54.08 | Kero | logging is soooo much fun. should say "message repeated 103,258 times in the last minute" |
| 15:54.17 | *** join/#openmoko amarsh04 (n=amarsh04@CPE-139-168-223-49.sa.bigpond.net.au) |
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| 15:55.13 | Kero | wurp2|in_and_out: not that I know of. But I do not recell that behaviour for the last dozen times I tried (seen it gobble up 100% CPU before, tho...) |
| 15:56.53 | wurp2|in_and_out | Kero: Do not recall what behavior? |
| 15:57.09 | wurp2|in_and_out | Oh, it's not "locking up" |
| 15:57.17 | Ebbe | wurp2|in_and_out: I you can't do it, maybe someone should work on a/the d-bus interface to neod. |
| 15:57.37 | wurp2|in_and_out | I mean get rid of the cool matrix-y image that blocks the screen |
| 15:57.57 | wurp2|in_and_out | Ebbe: I just don't know how to do it, and the fastest way to find out seemed to be to ask here |
| 15:58.26 | wurp2|in_and_out | I wrote a little program to monitor if you're doing slow charge, and throw up a GUI to ask if you want to fast charge |
| 15:58.27 | Ebbe | wurp2|in_and_out: I also meant the main developers should look at it :) |
| 15:58.46 | wurp2|in_and_out | but I want it to unlock the phone and turn on the lcd when it shows the gui |
| 15:59.02 | Kero | ah |
| 15:59.32 | wurp2|in_and_out | turning on the lcd I can figure out; just find the right proc file and send the right string to it |
| 15:59.39 | tonyg | wurp2|in_and_out, it should probably just turn on the lcd and give up on the user after a few seconds and turn it off again... they might not be looking |
| 15:59.56 | CIA-15 | openmoko: 03werner * r3979 10/trunk/src/target/u-boot/scripts/build: build: upgraded to SVN_REV 3978 |
| 16:00.05 | wurp2|in_and_out | tonyg: I didn't plan to keep it on; just let it time out the same way it normally does |
| 16:00.27 | wurp2|in_and_out | tonyg: Good point - it would suck to have the program for helping you charge your battery kill your battery faster |
| 16:09.09 | jmichel | Is there someone that is familiar with usb drivers for the openmoko. I'm running my usb port in host mode and it works with a keyboard. Then i build a driver for a usb radio receiver, the module load correctly on openmoko but when I connect the radio there are some errors |
| 16:09.39 | jmichel | The same driver works fine on my laptop |
| 16:10.09 | *** join/#openmoko baird (n=cbaird@brushtail.apana.org.au) |
| 16:10.17 | SpeedEvil | what sort of radio? |
| 16:11.08 | jmichel | It is a DAB receiver |
| 16:11.22 | SpeedEvil | what are the errors? |
| 16:11.38 | SpeedEvil | I assume it doesn't require USB2? |
| 16:12.14 | jmichel | When I first connect the device, it should load a firmware then reset the device |
| 16:12.51 | jmichel | but it doesn't do it... the vender:device ids stays to the value of the "no firmware" device |
| 16:12.54 | *** join/#openmoko netx (n=rlange@osiris.darkempire.org) |
| 16:13.17 | jmichel | This device existed before USB2.0 so it is not the problem :) |
| 16:13.53 | SpeedEvil | do you get errors from the firmware loader step? |
| 16:14.01 | XorA | jmichel: is the firmware file in the moko? |
| 16:14.44 | jmichel | XorA: the firmware is built inside the .ko file |
| 16:14.46 | CIA-15 | openmoko: 03werner * r3980 10/trunk/src/target/u-boot/patches/gta02-splash.patch: |
| 16:14.46 | CIA-15 | openmoko: Reference to CONFIG_GTA01_REVISION broke GTA01 builds of u-boot. |
| 16:14.46 | CIA-15 | openmoko: gta02-splash.patch: |
| 16:14.46 | CIA-15 | openmoko: - board/neo1973/common/jbt6k74.c (top-level, jbt6k74_init): unfortunately, |
| 16:14.46 | CIA-15 | openmoko: there is no CONFIG_GTA01_REVISION. Use CONFIG_GTA02_REVISION instead. |
| 16:15.21 | *** join/#openmoko bipolar (i=bflong@216-164-162-138.pa.subnet.cable.rcn.com) |
| 16:15.36 | XorA | jmichel: any reports of that driver working on arm? |
| 16:15.47 | jmichel | SpeedEvil: It seems the firmware is loaded... there is no error at this step. Then the code sends a signal to the device to reset then nothing happens |
| 16:16.26 | SpeedEvil | Ah |
| 16:16.29 | SpeedEvil | Hmm |
| 16:16.33 | jmichel | XorA: No but I'm rebuilding the driver for the arm so I thought it would work |
| 16:16.56 | XorA | jmichel: someone might have fucked up the packing/alignment for the firmware and the driver is sending garbage |
| 16:16.59 | SpeedEvil | Actually no - my first thought would be tha thte bus reset would be usually done by turning off hte power, which won't work. |
| 16:17.06 | SpeedEvil | But of course that's not hte case |
| 16:17.08 | XorA | jmichel: that sort of error is still far too common in linux |
| 16:17.34 | jmichel | XorA: well the same driver works on my laptop with OpenSuse |
| 16:17.47 | XorA | if the device is self powered unplugging it should do a reset :-) |
| 16:17.53 | XorA | from usb that is |
| 16:18.14 | XorA | jmichel: most driver do work on x86, but there are quiet a few dont work right on arm due to shoddy coding |
| 16:18.40 | *** part/#openmoko pauliusz (n=paulius@82-135-208-232.ip.zebra.lt) |
| 16:19.19 | jmichel | XorA: I tried to unplug/replug only the USB but it still see the device with the vendor:device ids as if the firmware was not loaded |
| 16:19.33 | *** join/#openmoko polz (n=polz@cpe-213-157-235-31.dynamic.amis.net) |
| 16:19.34 | XorA | jmichel: that kind of indicates firmware isnt being squirted right |
| 16:20.29 | jmichel | XorA: What do you mean exactly? The firware is not read correctly on the arm ? |
| 16:20.59 | XorA | jmichel: the driver for any number of reasons does not correctly send firmware to device |
| 16:21.12 | jmichel | Could it be an issue of integer size on the arm vs x86 ? |
| 16:21.24 | XorA | jmichel: you'll probably have to stick in some debugging and see what happens |
| 16:24.11 | *** join/#openmoko white_gecko (n=natanael@1Cust76.tnt2.ber2.deu.da.uu.net) |
| 16:25.12 | jmichel | XorA: I'll try to read the code of the driver again and add some debugging info to find the exact location of the problem |
| 16:25.55 | XorA | jmichel: when you get it working you can claim credit for a better than FM receiver integrated with Neo :-) |
| 16:26.08 | SpeedEvil | DAB is only sometimes better than FM |
| 16:26.18 | *** join/#openmoko Quadduc (n=stian@149-13-7.oke2-bras2.adsl.tele2.no) |
| 16:26.31 | SpeedEvil | 96K MP2 is _not_ better than an even semi-decent FM signal |
| 16:28.08 | jmichel | SpeedEvil: This receiver would also be good for DMB video... which could be nice... if OpenMoko can decode it. |
| 16:28.21 | SpeedEvil | Well... |
| 16:28.35 | SpeedEvil | It can do VCD class video - just about |
| 16:28.49 | *** join/#openmoko leastsuper (n=leastsup@212.23.103.90) |
| 16:30.17 | *** join/#openmoko br3n (n=bren@79-67-146-2.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com) |
| 16:31.45 | SpeedEvil | (The UK regulator recently removed the 128K constraint on broadcasters on DAB - they are now free to reduce it as much as they like |
| 16:32.00 | SpeedEvil | And under 128K MP2 isn't pretty |
| 16:32.51 | *** join/#openmoko MetaMorfoziS (n=khmhm@53d8392d.adsl.enternet.hu) |
| 16:32.56 | buz | under 128k no audio codec is pretty |
| 16:33.11 | SpeedEvil | There are less bad ones. |
| 16:33.13 | jmichel | I guess that is a good thing no other countries adopted DAB before last year. Now they can go with DAB+ which should be better... it uses the AAC+ codec |
| 16:33.17 | buz | thats true |
| 16:33.26 | buz | but even 128k is bad with most |
| 16:33.44 | ScaredyCat | yeah, because they think that quantity is better than quality |
| 16:33.44 | *** part/#openmoko white_gecko (n=natanael@1Cust76.tnt2.ber2.deu.da.uu.net) |
| 16:33.46 | mjr | vorbis is pretty okay for my ears with default -q 3, which is a bit less |
| 16:33.49 | SpeedEvil | DAB _sucks_ in terms of spectral efficiency and bits/J/Hz |
| 16:33.51 | SpeedEvil | though |
| 16:34.20 | jmichel | AAC+ at 128k is pretty good... it's the defautl Itune encoding quality |
| 16:34.34 | buz | which is a rather sorry proposition if you ask me |
| 16:34.42 | SpeedEvil | (which means that a similar sized transmitter goes much less far) |
| 16:35.11 | ScaredyCat | mmmm... |
| 16:35.29 | SpeedEvil | ScaredyCat: you weren't told? |
| 16:35.50 | *** join/#openmoko Sonicadvance1 (n=Sonic@67.61.15.39) |
| 16:35.55 | ScaredyCat | noone notified me :P |
| 16:36.01 | buz | then again considering what radio generally airs, they could use 56k wma for all i care |
| 16:36.22 | buz | or god forbid realaudio |
| 16:36.31 | Sonicadvance1 | ew |
| 16:36.53 | buz | or flac and i still wouldt listen to it |
| 16:37.34 | SpeedEvil | (UK) |
| 16:38.00 | SpeedEvil | Though much of the time I'm listening to Radio 4 - speech based network. |
| 16:38.14 | buz | speech is precisely the reason i never listen to radio |
| 16:38.27 | SpeedEvil | It's not that sort of speech radio network. |
| 16:39.22 | SpeedEvil | For example - http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/science/thematerialworld.shtml |
| 16:39.43 | zash_ | why does radio and tv still exist when there is the intetubes! |
| 16:40.08 | zash_ | s/inte/inter |
| 16:40.17 | buz | because supposedly downloading stuff aint quite legal |
| 16:40.32 | buz | and IP is horribly flawed way of broadcasting stuff |
| 16:40.51 | SpeedEvil | IMO _good_ channels have a future. |
| 16:41.01 | SpeedEvil | But primarily as a content aggregation service |
| 16:41.17 | SpeedEvil | With the programs being available elsewhere. |
| 16:41.38 | *** join/#openmoko rob_w (n=bob@Mbd1a.m.pppool.de) |
| 16:41.43 | jmichel | And Internet streaming for mobile devices like phones is still not a solution |
| 16:42.21 | jmichel | so radio still has this market |
| 16:43.22 | SpeedEvil | Internet streaming over wireless is certainly not a solution for thousands of listeners in a relatively small space |
| 16:46.30 | *** join/#openmoko Sonicadvance1 (n=Sonic@67.61.15.39) |
| 16:48.49 | SpeedEvil | Some numbers I did back when I found what channel 5 (UK) paid for 'Joey' indicated 10p/episode - which I suspect many'd be willing to pay. |
| 16:50.32 | *** join/#openmoko andrunko (n=andrunko@200.184.118.132) |
| 16:50.55 | *** join/#openmoko j_ack (n=j_ack@dsbg-4db7c34d.pool.einsundeins.de) |
| 16:53.05 | *** join/#openmoko wirrwarr (n=fz@ppp-88-217-74-197.dynamic.mnet-online.de) |
| 16:53.35 | wirrwarr | tach |
| 16:54.43 | *** join/#openmoko grummel (n=grummel@p5B16DF17.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 17:03.45 | ScaredyCat | i was probably the only person that liked 'joey' |
| 17:08.04 | XorA | ScaredyCat: nope, there is 2 of us |
| 17:08.54 | *** join/#openmoko Sonicadvance (n=Sonic@67.61.15.39) |
| 17:11.56 | ScaredyCat | :) |
| 17:12.37 | Sup3rkiddo | who or what is joey |
| 17:12.51 | XorA | Sup3rkiddo: the talented one from friends in his own sitcom |
| 17:13.18 | Sup3rkiddo | ok...:/, |
| 17:13.47 | Sup3rkiddo | crazy american sitcoms :P |
| 17:17.08 | kdean06 | That show got cancelled halfway into the first season, I thought. |
| 17:17.20 | buz | for a reason |
| 17:17.33 | wurp2|in_and_out | I never knew it existed |
| 17:17.35 | buz | awful show |
| 17:17.50 | wurp2|in_and_out | I feel dimished somehow for knowing now |
| 17:18.22 | *** join/#openmoko holycow (n=new@mail.wjsgroup.com) |
| 17:18.39 | XorA | kdean06: it made it to halfway through second season :-) |
| 17:18.42 | *** join/#openmoko heikkit (n=chatzill@c-67-188-122-139.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 17:18.54 | *** join/#openmoko Sonicadvance1 (n=Sonic@67.61.15.39) |
| 17:19.10 | *** join/#openmoko TimRiker (n=timr@70.1.33.84) |
| 17:19.50 | wurp2 | Of course, I still play D&D, so good taste and I are two ships passing in the night |
| 17:20.01 | kdean06 | I'm not sure which concerns me more, that you know that or that the show lasted that long. :P |
| 17:21.19 | *** join/#openmoko spaceninja (n=mindshif@c83-255-163-227.bredband.comhem.se) |
| 17:22.08 | SpeedEvil | I was basically meaning as an example |
| 17:22.27 | SpeedEvil | It was a 'prime' show - maybe 5m viewers for the first few episodes in the UK |
| 17:22.37 | XorA | wurp2: nothing wrong with D&D |
| 17:22.58 | kdean06 | Oh, I'm only teasing, I tend not to care too much either way about TV. :) |
| 17:23.53 | wurp2 | I haven't seen anything about 4E that turns me on yet |
| 17:24.03 | wurp2 | But, really, we haven't seen anything substantive about 4E yet |
| 17:24.18 | spaceninja | it's too expensive |
| 17:24.21 | wurp2 | In a lot of ways I like 1st ed better than 3.5E |
| 17:24.32 | XorA | if they dont bottle out, the changes are IMO good, but then maybe thats because they make my style of character not cost insane amounts of XP |
| 17:24.40 | wurp2 | 'cept melee. They really did melee right in 3.5. And saving throws. |
| 17:25.23 | *** join/#openmoko abraxa__ (n=abraxa@pD95FEEA6.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 17:25.30 | *** part/#openmoko spaceninja (n=mindshif@c83-255-163-227.bredband.comhem.se) |
| 17:25.45 | *** join/#openmoko geaaru (n=geaaru@79.24.214.236) |
| 17:26.15 | XorA | wurp2: yeah melee ran well in 3.5 I hope they dont break it in 4E |
| 17:26.54 | XorA | must be time for someone to write MokoDungeonMaster |
| 17:27.58 | *** join/#openmoko white_gecko (n=natanael@1Cust29.tnt2.ber2.deu.da.uu.net) |
| 17:28.17 | *** join/#openmoko rwhitby` (n=rwhitby@ppp240-74.static.internode.on.net) |
| 17:28.30 | *** part/#openmoko white_gecko (n=natanael@1Cust29.tnt2.ber2.deu.da.uu.net) |
| 17:29.22 | bipak_ | is there something like a roadmap for the stages |
| 17:29.23 | *** join/#openmoko TheAndichrist (n=andy@CPE-24-160-241-218.wi.res.rr.com) |
| 17:32.11 | *** join/#openmoko pleemans (n=peter@d51A5E76A.access.telenet.be) |
| 17:32.14 | *** join/#openmoko ericthefish (n=ivan@82-71-36-214.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk) |
| 17:37.19 | *** join/#openmoko br3n_ (n=bren@79-67-177-91.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com) |
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| 17:38.43 | kdean06 | Media player works in the latest ScaredyCat images but I'm still not getting an audio ring on incoming calls. :( |
| 17:39.06 | Ebbe | kdean06: Have you an updated kernel? |
| 17:40.11 | kdean06 | Yes, the kernel image in the automated buildhost from the same date... The 27th's snapshot... I HAVE sound, but not on that specific event. |
| 17:40.20 | kdean06 | I can make calls and use the media player. |
| 17:41.13 | *** join/#openmoko denisko (n=denis@89.151.161.68) |
| 17:41.57 | kdean06 | ScaredyCat, Good job on this latest image. :) |
| 17:42.18 | wurp2 | kdean06: Why are you going w/ ScaredyCat vs main build? |
| 17:42.22 | kdean06 | Any hint where I might set an audio ringtone though? |
| 17:42.30 | *** join/#openmoko ericthefish__h (n=ivan@82-71-36-214.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk) |
| 17:42.34 | kdean06 | wurp2, Because as of the 24th, the main build didn't have working SMS. |
| 17:42.34 | wurp2 | I tried two ScaredyCat images recently and both had big sound problems |
| 17:42.39 | wurp2 | Of course, so did the main builds |
| 17:42.44 | wurp2 | orly |
| 17:42.57 | wurp2 | I thought ScaredyCat just had some extra packages |
| 17:43.19 | *** join/#openmoko pH5 (n=ph5@e178212083.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 17:43.21 | wurp2 | like ScummVM, which is nice |
| 17:43.43 | kdean06 | I've never had problems with the main builds, but there's less working features. ScaredyCat's build has working SMS but had audio issues on the 24th. Today I've got audio except for that specific thing, which is kinda big but isn't horrifical. |
| 17:44.04 | wurp2 | Yeah, I'm still working off a build from about the 24th |
| 17:44.05 | wurp2 | main build |
| 17:44.10 | wurp2 | I had to hack on it to get sound in |
| 17:44.33 | kdean06 | wurp2, I'd LOVE to know what ScaredyCat does differently. He said he used "the bleeding edge stuff" but I assumed that MokoMakefile did too. :( |
| 17:44.40 | wurp2 | Oh, I wrote that little app to monitor for slow charge and ask me if I want to kick it to fast |
| 17:45.12 | wurp2 | I'm going to test it for a day or 2 and add a couple of very minor features, then I'll ipkg it up or put it on the wiki |
| 17:45.18 | wurp2 | depending on how lazy I feel at the time |
| 17:45.54 | kdean06 | I've been flashing builds every day, but I've somehow not taken the time to sit down and figure out the build system. I've made openmoko-devel-images but that's basic and offers no control. |
| 17:46.24 | wurp2 | I thought the mainline build on the 26th was supposed to be quite good |
| 17:46.34 | wurp2 | including SMS, my sometimes faulty memory suggests |
| 17:46.39 | kdean06 | Hrm... |
| 17:47.28 | kdean06 | Any info on today's? |
| 17:47.36 | wurp2 | Not that I know of |
| 17:47.56 | wurp2 | We need to create a wiki page that lists builds, w/ a link to a little page for each where people can make notes |
| 17:47.58 | kdean06 | I'll try. |
| 17:48.35 | kdean06 | I thought there was one, but it was horribly out of date. |
| 17:48.45 | *** join/#openmoko zedstar_ (n=john@82-44-200-69.cable.ubr08.haye.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 17:48.49 | kdean06 | I hate wiki. :( |
| 17:48.54 | wurp2 | really? |
| 17:48.58 | wurp2 | I love it |
| 17:49.02 | kdean06 | At least OpenMoko's is decently organized. |
| 17:49.09 | wurp2 | Way better than the common alternative, which is nothing |
| 17:49.35 | wurp2 | From said wiki: |
| 17:49.38 | wurp2 | # Several (non openmoko) people report that the daily image from 27 Jan 08 is quite stable for use on GTA01 and that with it you can both SMS and make and receive voice calls with good stability although (understandably) tweaks to the UI are far from complete. However, SeanC reported that under pressure testing of the GSM daemon (ie cycling it through hundreds of commands) there are still failures so some way to go yet until the GSM side is sorted. |
| 17:49.50 | *** join/#openmoko Sonicadvance1 (n=Sonic@67.61.15.39) |
| 17:49.57 | wurp2 | It used to say the 26th build was the good one, but he (JW) updated it today to say the 27th |
| 17:50.16 | kdean06 | wurp2, Allow me to rephrase... I think Wiki is great for static info based on collective input. However, I think it's horrible for the kind of information generated by this project, since it changes SO rapidly. |
| 17:50.26 | kdean06 | Link? |
| 17:50.41 | wurp2 | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Community_Updates |
| 17:50.51 | wurp2 | I check http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Special:Recentchanges a couple of times a day |
| 17:51.20 | wurp2 | kdean06: Agreed, except that I still think the likely alternatives are even more out of date html pages and (ugh) forums |
| 17:51.38 | *** join/#openmoko faern (n=faern@faern.olf.sgsnet.se) |
| 17:51.45 | wurp2 | You are 100% right that wiki is WAY less useful for info that changes fast as it does on this project |
| 17:52.04 | wurp2 | Maybe we should write a wiki that colors the background of text based on how old it is |
| 17:52.05 | kdean06 | I've had the wiki vs forums debate before. But for me, Wiki is "documentation" and mailing lists are collaboration. |
| 17:52.35 | SpeedEvil | wurp2: or even an ordered table. |
| 17:52.43 | kdean06 | wurp2, THough, truth be told, the problem is less the format and more "not enough people writing their experiences down". |
| 17:52.45 | wurp2 | the problem is that the poor organization common in wikis is replaced with 0 organization for a mailing list/forum |
| 17:53.12 | wurp2 | SpeedEvil: except that often the info only makes sense in the context it was initially created |
| 17:53.15 | *** join/#openmoko PBeck (n=PBeck@78.42.60.129) |
| 17:53.32 | PBeck | hi |
| 17:53.49 | *** join/#openmoko paguilar_ (n=paguilar@217.194.179.73) |
| 17:53.49 | wurp2 | You would prolly want a 'refresh' button to tell people the info was still fresh w/o updates |
| 17:54.03 | wurp2 | or an everfresh option for info you know is stable |
| 17:54.28 | kdean06 | wurp2, Would it make sense to establish a certain list of tests that could be used to compare images? |
| 17:54.52 | *** join/#openmoko rmoravcik (n=rmoravci@ip-89-102-255-171.karneval.cz) |
| 17:54.52 | wurp2 | kdean06: That's a great idea |
| 17:55.18 | wurp2 | A grid on each "release notes" page with the results of basic activities |
| 17:55.42 | wurp2 | sms, make phone calls, recv same |
| 17:55.50 | wurp2 | etc |
| 17:56.49 | *** join/#openmoko daMaestro (n=jon@fedora/damaestro) |
| 17:57.49 | kdean06 | SpeedEvil, Would scripting the tests really make sense? I mean, for me, I look at this as moving towards a consumer device, so actually using the interface myself gives me a better feel. I'm sure we could automate things, to standardize how to "burn" out the battery, for instance to test bettery life. :P |
| 17:57.55 | wurp2 | kdean06: I was assuming you meant manual tests ppl would... yeah, that |
| 17:58.09 | wurp2 | I am a big fan of automated tests |
| 17:58.25 | *** join/#openmoko loufoque (n=loufoque@tobias.residence.ens-lyon.fr) |
| 17:58.26 | wurp2 | But for UI, they are much less useful |
| 17:58.37 | SpeedEvil | kdean06: yes - but hard |
| 17:58.40 | wurp2 | and it's very hard to automate tests for things like battery life, phone calls, etc. |
| 17:58.47 | kdean06 | No, I like automation, don't get me wrong. :) Consistancy is a great thing to have for benchmarks. :) |
| 17:59.04 | SpeedEvil | kdean06: or are you voulanteering to do it every night manually? |
| 17:59.24 | kdean06 | Sort of, yes. |
| 17:59.27 | kdean06 | :) |
| 17:59.28 | wurp2 | Wow |
| 17:59.39 | wurp2 | I thought you were just suggesting a list of tests we would put on the wiki |
| 17:59.49 | wurp2 | that ppl could update with their experinces for that build |
| 18:00.03 | kdean06 | SpeedEvil, I've been writing crappy articles that I hope might seed documentation at some point. |
| 18:00.18 | SpeedEvil | crappy beats none |
| 18:00.20 | kdean06 | http://www.monochromementality.com/index.php/blog/show/Anatomy-of-an-OpenMoko-Application.html |
| 18:01.02 | kdean06 | I plan to break down each application, take screenshots, provide "feedback" but at this point I have no real basis to judge since I only have my own use scenario. |
| 18:01.43 | wurp2 | SpeedEvil: There are some, although very out of date |
| 18:01.46 | wurp2 | at togaware |
| 18:02.07 | wurp2 | They were very helpful for me when I 1st got my phone |
| 18:02.20 | wurp2 | to answer questions like 'how do I exit an app', etc. |
| 18:02.47 | SpeedEvil | ssh in, kill $pid |
| 18:02.53 | kdean06 | lol |
| 18:03.38 | kdean06 | I love your finesse, SpeedEvil |
| 18:03.48 | ScaredyCat | moo! |
| 18:03.57 | kdean06 | You playing with apt again? |
| 18:04.14 | ScaredyCat | no, dbus |
| 18:05.16 | *** join/#openmoko Seb` (n=seb@bld.chezseb.net) |
| 18:05.20 | *** join/#openmoko grummel (n=Grummel@p5B16DF17.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 18:05.33 | *** part/#openmoko baird (n=cbaird@brushtail.apana.org.au) |
| 18:06.02 | kdean06 | dbus moos too? |
| 18:07.26 | *** join/#openmoko behdad (n=behdad@CPE001217b19226-CM0012c9c84bc4.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 18:08.03 | zedstar_ | anyone working on gps dbus integration? |
| 18:08.56 | ScaredyCat | dbus can moo.... if you make it |
| 18:15.01 | *** join/#openmoko mmp (n=mmp@158.195.96.206) |
| 18:15.07 | kdean06 | Hrm... Multi-tap input. :( |
| 18:15.18 | kdean06 | This is the one Chris hacked together, I think... |
| 18:16.18 | wurp2 | OK, stupid question |
| 18:16.24 | wurp2 | What linux distro is openmoko based upon? |
| 18:16.29 | kdean06 | Hrm. I wonder if that wasn't more to close bug 1121 |
| 18:16.34 | SpeedEvil | lfs? |
| 18:16.40 | XorA | wurp2: angstrom |
| 18:16.56 | wurp2 | XorA: Thanks, I didn't know angstrom was a distro :-) |
| 18:17.16 | XorA | wurp2: and angstrom/OE originate from open zaurus |
| 18:17.52 | *** join/#openmoko _Krieger_ (n=warsword@80.90.233.15) |
| 18:17.52 | *** join/#openmoko eikonos (n=eikonos@S0106001c104ae594.gv.shawcable.net) |
| 18:17.56 | Vegar | what's the relationship between ångström and OE? |
| 18:18.10 | Vegar | just that they both originate from open zaurus? |
| 18:18.18 | XorA | Angstrom distro is built from OE build system |
| 18:18.31 | XorA | same as OpenMoko distro is built from OE build system |
| 18:18.36 | wurp2 | Why wasn't OpenMoko started as a fork of QTopia? |
| 18:18.39 | mwester | OE can also build distros other than Angstrom. |
| 18:18.48 | _Krieger_ | do developers know about such error: "ERROR: Nothing PROVIDES 'uboot-openmoko' (but '[]' DEPENDS on or otherwise requires it)"? |
| 18:18.54 | mwester | wurp2: The two are vastly different in basics |
| 18:19.04 | XorA | wurp2: qtopia isnt a distro |
| 18:19.04 | wurp2 | _Krieger_: Don't worry about it |
| 18:19.06 | mjr | qtopia wasn't free at the time, plus it's more limited |
| 18:19.18 | wurp2 | for a while there was both uboot-openmoko and u-boot-openmoko |
| 18:19.20 | wurp2 | so it builds both |
| 18:19.31 | wurp2 | XorA: I actually knew that ;-) |
| 18:19.47 | wurp2 | mjr: I understand the 'not free' part, that shoots it down altogether |
| 18:19.56 | wurp2 | mjr: But in what way is it more limited? |
| 18:19.58 | XorA | NOTE: package qtopia-phone-4.3.0-r1: task do_compile: started |
| 18:20.09 | wurp2 | Not to start a flame war betwee peeps w/ three letter names |
| 18:20.57 | wurp2 | mwester: They are vastly different in basics, but why? What made the openmoko team decide to start something vastly different, rather than update an existing project? |
| 18:21.08 | wurp2 | (besides the non-free part, which we've already covered) |
| 18:21.44 | kdean06 | wurp2, That was the key reason Gnome was started against KDE... I think saying "other than that" is a big deal. :P |
| 18:21.47 | wurp2 | Clearly openmoko would be much closer to being consumer ready on neo1973 if it had started from QTopia |
| 18:21.54 | XorA | qtopia4 wasnt available, gtk2+ was at the time |
| 18:22.13 | kdean06 | That said, there are arguements for QT and against, and for GTK and against, and for EFL and against. |
| 18:22.51 | kdean06 | Though I know those aren't 1-to-1 comparisons. :) |
| 18:23.05 | mwester | wurp2: qt is based on a single large entity that handles all gui interaction, and requires that apps be written to the qt API in C++. OM chose to use the standard X11 framework instead. There are rational arguments for both, and drawbacks for both, but in general they do not play nice together. :( |
| 18:23.31 | wurp2 | mwester: OK, I'll buy that |
| 18:23.46 | XorA | qtopia is officially coming to openmoko real soon now |
| 18:24.08 | mwester | but will it co-exist with the existing X apps? |
| 18:24.26 | mjr | prolly not |
| 18:24.46 | XorA | no, it will be a seperate choice |
| 18:24.53 | wurp2 | XorA: You mean, qtopia is officially coming to the neo? |
| 18:25.14 | wurp2 | 'cause I thought this whole conversation was about how openmoko and QTopia are incompatible |
| 18:25.19 | XorA | wurp2: its already on the neo, but OpenMoko distro should include it as an option |
| 18:25.52 | wurp2 | I knew it was already on the neo... I thought 'officially' meant that TrollTech would be distributing it |
| 18:26.18 | kdean06 | Nokia. ;P |
| 18:26.25 | XorA | everything is GPL or other FOSS license, either entity can make images for Neo |
| 18:26.26 | _Krieger_ | <PROTECTED> |
| 18:26.35 | wurp2 | But now I am more confused. I thought openmoko meant the non-QTopia software & OS stack that we install on the neo |
| 18:26.44 | wurp2 | kdean06: heh |
| 18:27.30 | XorA | hey mickeyl |
| 18:27.36 | mickeyl | hi XorA |
| 18:27.38 | mickeyl | how are things? |
| 18:27.52 | XorA | mickeyl: slow, C++ compiles take ages |
| 18:27.56 | mickeyl | true |
| 18:27.58 | *** join/#openmoko ericthefish__h (n=ivan@82-71-36-214.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk) |
| 18:28.13 | XorA | broke angstrom 2008.1 |
| 18:28.22 | XorA | locales dont compile in glibc 2.6.1 |
| 18:28.27 | kdean06 | wurp2, SMS works on today's snapshot. Audio works for making and recieving calls, Media player works (thought I'm in my office so I don't know if it skips). They buggy matchbox keyboard has been replaced with a multi-tap keyboard. |
| 18:28.41 | kdean06 | Audio alert on incoming call, startup sound. |
| 18:28.45 | wurp2 | kdean06: Great!! |
| 18:28.55 | wurp2 | I never had the matchbox kbd bug out on me |
| 18:29.06 | wurp2 | And I think I prefer it to multi-tap, usually |
| 18:29.23 | wurp2 | I know what I'm doing when I get home tonight |
| 18:29.51 | kdean06 | I'm using this rootfs -> http://buildhost.openmoko.org/daily/neo1973/deploy/glibc/images/neo1973/OpenMoko-openmoko-devel-image-glibc-ipk-P1-Snapshot-20080129-fic-gta01.rootfs.jffs2 and this kernel -> http://buildhost.automated.it/OM2007.2/uImage-2.6.22.5-moko11+svnr3874-r13-neo1973.bin |
| 18:29.57 | *** join/#openmoko Robwoerle (n=bob@M83e1.m.pppool.de) |
| 18:30.05 | ScaredyCat | mickeyl: that dbus call did work, much better after food. ... |
| 18:30.11 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@81.80-202-132.nextgentel.com) |
| 18:30.15 | mickeyl | ScaredyCat: glad to hear. |
| 18:31.06 | ScaredyCat | I was looking at the .xml files from your svn .... |
| 18:31.16 | *** join/#openmoko Seb` (n=seb@bld.chezseb.net) |
| 18:31.41 | ScaredyCat | I'm hoping that you'll add list cell-id's to the network one |
| 18:32.02 | ScaredyCat | so that you can get a lit of the cell id's and their signal strengths |
| 18:32.18 | ScaredyCat | s/lit/list/ |
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| 18:35.42 | SpeedEvil | http://www.mauve.plus.com/gsmlog is a trivial awk script to log the fields emitted by the modem about the local cell-sites repeatedly |
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| 18:37.02 | _Krieger_ | do developers know about such error: "ERROR: Nothing PROVIDES 'uboot-openmoko' (but '[]' DEPENDS on or otherwise requires it)"? |
| 18:37.12 | _Krieger_ | sorry, wrong msg |
| 18:37.15 | _Krieger_ | <PROTECTED> |
| 18:39.58 | wurp2 | Does anyone know a simple way to programatically unlock the phone? |
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| 18:40.26 | wurp2 | i.e. get rid of the screen that shows after a while when you choose 'dim, then lock' |
| 18:41.24 | SpeedEvil | a loock screen? |
| 18:41.40 | wurp2 | Yeah, the one that kind of looks like the screens from the Matrix |
| 18:41.56 | wurp2 | and shows up in the app drop-down as Neod |
| 18:42.08 | SpeedEvil | I recall talk of sliding something fom one side to the other |
| 18:42.25 | ahven | bottom to bot |
| 18:42.37 | XorA | SpeedEvil: he wants a friendlier script version of killall neod-locker-program |
| 18:42.44 | kdean06 | I think he wants to automate that so, for instance, it unlocks on incoming call. |
| 18:42.45 | ahven | aah :) |
| 18:42.58 | wurp2 | SpeedEvil: I said programatically |
| 18:43.33 | wurp2 | One presumes from the dripping sarcasm that you know all about it, and hence can answer my question ;-) |
| 18:43.55 | wurp2 | XorA: Yeah, but I want to do it before then :-) |
| 18:44.56 | ScaredyCat | XorA: surely neod should have a dbus interface |
| 18:45.36 | wurp2 | where might such a thing be documented |
| 18:45.51 | wurp2 | ? |
| 18:46.29 | ScaredyCat | did you just say documented? |
| 18:46.41 | wurp2 | I did indeed |
| 18:47.09 | ScaredyCat | well, the only programming docs seem to be embedded in the source code |
| 18:47.17 | wurp2 | Documentation is one of my favorite fictitious things |
| 18:47.30 | wurp2 | way cooler than Santa Clause or the Tooth Fairy |
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| 18:48.03 | wurp2 | or even DukeNukem Forever |
| 18:49.27 | wurp2 | *crickets chirp* |
| 18:49.30 | *** join/#openmoko ajbrun (n=ajbrun@86.156.79.41) |
| 18:49.54 | Mononoke | huh EU sw patent thingie is still around ? |
| 18:50.04 | *** join/#openmoko ajbrun (n=ajbrun@86.156.79.41) |
| 18:50.10 | mjr | well, it's unharmonized so far |
| 18:50.39 | mjr | so basically up to the country (even though, of course, a _honest_ reading of the european patent convention disallows them) |
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| 18:53.12 | ScaredyCat | wurp2: you could use xev |
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| 19:04.16 | wurp2 | ScaredyCat: Thanks, let me look up info on that :-) |
| 19:05.46 | ScaredyCat | would be a hack... I'm just reading up on the dbus stuff, since it seems to make much more sense to do it that way... then other apps can register callbacks when things like that happen |
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| 19:09.27 | wurp2 | ScaredyCat: Yeah, I see now. I hadn't used xev before. I will probably just 'ps' around and find the name of the gui part of the screen locker for now, and whack that |
| 19:09.36 | *** join/#openmoko edistar_ (n=edistar@ip503ddd09.speed.planet.nl) |
| 19:09.45 | wurp2 | I don't think I really want to emulate dragging the icon for this little app |
| 19:10.01 | wurp2 | And I can update it to use dbus when the interface is available. Thanks much for your input! |
| 19:10.19 | ScaredyCat | np.. good luck :) |
| 19:10.25 | bkruse | dbus=awesome |
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| 19:13.13 | wurp2 | dbus=opaque for now :-( |
| 19:14.08 | *** join/#openmoko pwerken (n=pwerken@83.119.198.36) |
| 19:14.39 | bkruse | :[ |
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| 19:41.59 | jmichel | XorA: Regarding my usb driver, it seems the formware is not loading correctly. It is defined as a serie of "unsigned short" values. Where could I find the info about the arm architecture nad the size of the basic types? |
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| 19:52.19 | bkruse | jmichel: if it is in C, type defining should not matter, as the compiler is what takes it from c -> arm asm |
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| 20:10.13 | Vegar | jmichel: is it a struct? |
| 20:11.48 | jmichel | yes |
| 20:12.33 | Vegar | do you get any warnings if you compile with -Wpadded? |
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| 20:14.44 | jmichel | Vegar: I don't have any new warnings with this option |
| 20:15.55 | Vegar | ok |
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| 20:43.52 | wurp2 | Anyone know offhand what phone-kit does, or a safe way to restart it? |
| 20:44.07 | wurp2 | It seems to be gobbling lots of cpu right now and I wanna listen to my music :-) |
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| 20:50.41 | _Krieger_ | guys, please, pay attention to my issue. did anybody have a fail on cacao compilation? |
| 20:51.12 | wurp2 | _Krieger_: sorry, no |
| 20:51.21 | wurp2 | I think mine fails well before that :-/ |
| 20:51.48 | _Krieger_ | can is somehow skip that package on make all with mokomakefile? |
| 20:52.04 | _Krieger_ | i suggest that is not critical package? |
| 20:52.25 | wurp2 | _Krieger_: If you want to bypass MokeMakefile, this may work for you: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Toolchain#Downloading_and_installing |
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| 21:10.36 | ploum | Hello |
| 21:10.48 | ploum | I have a few questions about Neo1973 hardware |
| 21:10.57 | ploum | I subscribed to the community mailing-list |
| 21:11.10 | ploum | but no answer. My mail is not sent |
| 21:11.21 | ploum | And I think the subscription does not work |
| 21:11.58 | wurp2 | subscription seems to work for me |
| 21:12.05 | wurp2 | How long ago did you send the email? |
| 21:17.16 | ploum | I don't receive any confirmation or anything |
| 21:17.21 | *** join/#openmoko fgau (n=fgau@pD953A65C.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 21:17.39 | SpeedEvil | There have been reports about broken email lists. |
| 21:17.48 | SpeedEvil | have you looked at the wiki hardware pges? |
| 21:17.54 | ploum | Yes |
| 21:18.23 | ploum | But I wanted to know is there's a way to plug a FM Tuner with RDS |
| 21:18.26 | *** join/#openmoko orion_ (n=orion@124-171-188-30.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 21:18.30 | ploum | (USB or anything else) |
| 21:18.37 | ploum | and if somebody did it |
| 21:18.41 | SpeedEvil | In theory |
| 21:18.52 | SpeedEvil | any USB device should work - with external power |
| 21:19.01 | SpeedEvil | If it supports usb1.1 |
| 21:19.01 | ploum | I also wanted to know if there is a DSP for sound processing |
| 21:19.06 | SpeedEvil | no |
| 21:19.22 | ploum | Ok |
| 21:19.37 | ploum | That's annoying because I intended to try some speech recognition stuffs |
| 21:20.11 | SpeedEvil | Well - basically - think of it as similar to a pentium 100 or P150 class device |
| 21:20.29 | SpeedEvil | maybe a bit faster in some cases, a bit less in others |
| 21:21.34 | ploum | mmm |
| 21:22.05 | ploum | so speech recognition must be possible with enough optimization |
| 21:22.12 | ploum | it will be hard |
| 21:22.53 | ploum | Mine was 33MHz ;-) |
| 21:24.28 | SpeedEvil | What do you mean by speaker recognition? |
| 21:24.42 | SpeedEvil | A) simple word matching with maybe 10 words |
| 21:24.54 | SpeedEvil | B) speaker dependant limited dictionary |
| 21:25.04 | SpeedEvil | C) speaker independant large dictionary? |
| 21:26.07 | ploum | I'm still not sure |
| 21:26.18 | ploum | it will probably be B |
| 21:26.29 | OJW | is there any software to do A? |
| 21:26.33 | SpeedEvil | How much work have you done in the past? |
| 21:27.38 | SpeedEvil | I mean on speech |
| 21:27.51 | ploum | SpeedEvil: I'm not the specialist |
| 21:27.54 | ploum | we are a team |
| 21:28.07 | ploum | we must choose an hardware platform |
| 21:28.13 | ploum | And I proposed the OpenMoko |
| 21:28.15 | SpeedEvil | Ah. Borg of speech recognition. |
| 21:28.40 | ploum | My work is more about user interaction ;-) |
| 21:28.52 | SpeedEvil | GTA02 - the next version - will go from 266-400MHz |
| 21:29.03 | SpeedEvil | but that may be months out. |
| 21:29.21 | SpeedEvil | But nothing directly related to speech. |
| 21:29.47 | ploum | But I can buy a GTA01 now and port it to 02 later, isn't it ? |
| 21:29.51 | SpeedEvil | What would be _lovely_ would be speaker independant voice recognition that could transcribe incoming calls. But that's not really likely I think. |
| 21:29.59 | SpeedEvil | Basically - the same exact code should run. |
| 21:30.59 | ploum | so if we buy the 01 now, we could get it next week (in Europe ? or more ?) and work on it before the 02 |
| 21:31.20 | ploum | at least, I'm trying to convince my boss that it's a good idea ;-) |
| 21:31.27 | SpeedEvil | Recent orders have been happening in that sort of timescale as I understand it. |
| 21:32.15 | ploum | So, I have my answer for the DSP/voice recognition, thanks :-) |
| 21:32.32 | SpeedEvil | It'd be nice. :) |
| 21:33.00 | ploum | Now, if you ever heard about someone who played with an FM tuner on OpenMoko, I'm highly interested |
| 21:33.17 | SpeedEvil | There was someone on earlier trying to get a DAB radio working. |
| 21:33.55 | SpeedEvil | having endian issues with the firmware upload it looked like. |
| 21:36.32 | wurp2 | I bought my neo about 4 or 5 weeks ago |
| 21:36.42 | wurp2 | It took right at a week to get it |
| 21:36.51 | wurp2 | But that was in the US... I think it's longer in EU |
| 21:37.32 | SpeedEvil | The carrier company was never the bottleneck. |
| 21:37.40 | ploum | Ah yes, DAB radio interests me a lot |
| 21:38.17 | ploum | All those discussion are on hardware list, community or mainly IRC ? |
| 21:38.48 | ploum | Because if I get one, you will get me more than a few minutes at the end of the day ;-) |
| 21:38.52 | SpeedEvil | IRC - I'm unsure if the mailing list is up. |
| 21:39.28 | *** part/#openmoko Tobi (n=tobi@pD9E852FE.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 21:40.28 | wurp2 | I have gotten emails within the last couple of days |
| 21:40.45 | wurp2 | from community & hardware at least |
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| 21:40.52 | wurp2 | Although I seem to get a lot of dupes |
| 21:47.35 | ploum | yep but no way to subscribe |
| 21:48.34 | wurp2 | You can't subscribe from the mailing list web site? |
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| 22:07.45 | ploum | good night |
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| 22:51.13 | zNaima | Hiz ! |
| 22:53.06 | zNaima | I have a problem. I've a neo1973 with kernel 2.6.22-5. |
| 22:54.16 | zNaima | The bluetooth is on and my other phone detects neo193 but the phone asks for a key |
| 22:54.47 | zNaima | i Not that key I have to put, I have tried with 1234 0000 |
| 22:55.37 | wurp2 | Have you read "Manually using Bluetooth" on the wiki? |
| 22:55.48 | zNaima | yes I read this manual |
| 22:56.33 | wurp2 | unfortunately I haven't looked into getting bluetooth going on my neo, so I don't have any useful advice :-( |
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| 22:57.51 | mjr | need a bluetooth pin helper for om in the long run, you probably could hack it to a constant somehow for now |
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| 23:02.38 | SpeedEvil | On mobile phones. |
| 23:02.57 | SpeedEvil | BT has revealed that 200 phone-boxes in scotland were not used in the past year |
| 23:04.50 | SpeedEvil | LiF might get you a 6V cell |
| 23:04.53 | SpeedEvil | oops |
| 23:05.18 | zilux | zNaima: there is a wiki page for this: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Manually_using_Bluetooth |
| 23:06.11 | zilux | (sorry wurp2 for the forked comment) |
| 23:06.50 | zNaima | zilux: yes I read this page but the phone asks for a key |
| 23:06.57 | zNaima | I don't have what a key |
| 23:07.24 | zNaima | I write 1234 0000 and I put in the neo passkey-agent 0000 |
| 23:07.34 | zNaima | but i don't conect the two phones |
| 23:09.38 | SpeedEvil | what do you want to connect the phones as? |
| 23:10.37 | zNaima | I want to synchronize the contacts |
| 23:10.57 | SpeedEvil | I think that's optimistic. |
| 23:11.03 | SpeedEvil | Unless you plan to write that first. |
| 23:12.42 | zNaima | I don't understand |
| 23:12.57 | zilux | :-) |
| 23:13.18 | zilux | sofwares in current development |
| 23:13.26 | zNaima | ah ... ok ok |
| 23:13.30 | zilux | or expected as is |
| 23:14.40 | zNaima | With qtopia could have synchronized all the contacts but with openmoko not |
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| 23:14.56 | zilux | here I simply type four digits using a bt keyboard |
| 23:20.05 | zilux | otherwise you may perhaps want to check if the connexion is encrypted, and change the conf file accordingly |
| 23:22.03 | zilux | gn |
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