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| 00:34.58 | Crashbit | Hiz! i don't speak english, i'm spanish, but my neo1973 sound fail, the rootfs and kernel is january 2008 |
| 00:35.25 | Crashbit | with old kernels sound works but gsmd doesn't work. |
| 00:36.36 | Crashbit | how i can repair the sound, the file modules is needed with the latests kernels or it's opcional ? |
| 00:37.46 | mjr | yes you probably need the modules from that package to better match your kernel |
| 00:38.23 | Crashbit | i don't know to install modules package |
| 00:39.27 | Crashbit | How install the modules files ? |
| 00:39.44 | Crashbit | uf! bad construction ;) |
| 00:40.49 | Crashbit | i used dfu-utils to install the kernel and rootfs, modules too ? |
| 00:42.23 | mjr | untar the modules package, find the audio modules within, copy to the appropriate directory on the neo root, maybe run depmod -a (dunno if necessary) |
| 00:43.08 | Crashbit | ok, dunno whats it? |
| 00:43.52 | mjr | ask google |
| 00:44.07 | Crashbit | ok, thanks |
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| 00:46.35 | isforinsects | How well does openmoko implement the bluetooth stack? |
| 00:46.49 | isforinsects | I'm wondering the best solution to including it on my XO |
| 00:47.15 | SpeedEvil | It doesn't |
| 00:47.18 | SpeedEvil | it uses bluez |
| 00:47.21 | mjr | hmh? it's the usual linux bluez thingy |
| 00:47.32 | mjr | not much high-level support currently |
| 00:47.45 | SpeedEvil | there is a 'turn on/off bluetooth' |
| 00:47.46 | SpeedEvil | icon |
| 00:47.50 | SpeedEvil | I don't know if it works |
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| 00:54.46 | thseiler | i need a bit help with openembedded |
| 00:55.59 | thseiler | I have made a few changes to matchbox-keyboard to make it bit more usable with plain fingers... Now i would like to build an ipkg of this, so that i can share it easily with others. |
| 00:56.21 | thseiler | however, all the ipkg that i'm able to generate won't install on the neo |
| 00:56.45 | thseiler | it always fails with an error about some MD5 and suggests to run 'ipkg update'. |
| 00:57.15 | thseiler | Has anyone an idea what i do wrong ? there aren't many tutorials on ipkg in the web, i've already searched |
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| 01:59.10 | josch | thseiler, still there? |
| 01:59.16 | thseiler | yepp |
| 01:59.33 | josch | great - how do you build your new ipkg? |
| 01:59.48 | josch | do you just change the source in openembeddded? |
| 01:59.54 | josch | do you use the makefile? |
| 01:59.54 | thseiler | hehe, i was just building the wrong package |
| 02:00.06 | josch | so its fixed now? |
| 02:00.28 | thseiler | i used matchbox-keyboard instead of matchbox-keyboard-inputmethod |
| 02:00.48 | josch | what did you change? |
| 02:01.24 | thseiler | i think the problem a conflict between those two packages: they are providing the same files. |
| 02:01.46 | thseiler | I've got matchbox-keyboard-inputmethod installed (by default) and tried to add matchbox-keyboard |
| 02:02.03 | thseiler | I now have moved my patches to the other package and it works somehow... |
| 02:02.36 | josch | thseiler, consider using a local overlay for your apps in openembedded |
| 02:02.47 | thseiler | ok, how do I do that ? |
| 02:03.50 | thseiler | google revealed something on the wiki... reading it now |
| 02:04.07 | josch | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Application_Development_Crash_Course |
| 02:04.28 | josch | the " What's the goal?" section links to all important pages |
| 02:05.18 | thseiler | thank you very much. |
| 02:05.22 | thseiler | this really helps. |
| 02:06.58 | *** join/#openmoko Aria (n=aredride@acrux.theinternetco.net) |
| 02:08.42 | josch | thseiler, you're welcome! :-) |
| 02:09.09 | thseiler | josch: btw: do you know if there is a repository with a working gdb (i.e. to run it on the neo) |
| 02:10.03 | thseiler | my stuff still segfaults... :( |
| 02:10.56 | josch | thseiler, never used gdb on the neo sry - I only coded python and used strace |
| 02:15.23 | *** join/#openmoko daMaestro (n=jon@fedora/damaestro) |
| 02:16.35 | ljp | try using gdbserver. it will use less memory |
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| 02:21.32 | thseiler | thanks for the tip... |
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| 02:32.42 | thseiler | so enough for tonight, isn't looking so bad: http://www.seili.net/openmoko/matchbox-keyboard-screenshot.png |
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| 05:21.29 | free1 | db with a db |
| 05:21.52 | free1 | yeah, it took more than 24 hours but, you know, ... |
| 05:21.55 | free1 | game is game |
| 05:22.36 | free1 | without subsidy- another way of saying without a multi-year contract from a cell company... |
| 05:22.56 | free1 | the juke by samsung is $99.99 |
| 05:23.41 | free1 | MotoRazr v9m : $249 |
| 05:23.54 | *** part/#openmoko isforinsects (n=chatzill@host-69-59-76-78.nctv.com) |
| 05:23.58 | free1 | smartphones you say? |
| 05:24.21 | free1 | palm centro - --- $99 |
| 05:24.23 | free1 | holla |
| 05:24.54 | free1 | these cats ahead, you all stay the snail |
| 05:25.13 | mwester | fish is fish |
| 05:25.16 | mwester | dog with a cat |
| 05:25.20 | mwester | fun is fun |
| 05:25.33 | mwester | a pound of potatoes --- $1.99 |
| 05:25.35 | free1 | I move and all you see is the back of my nikes |
| 05:25.38 | summatusmentis | free1: $99 is not unsubsidized |
| 05:25.44 | mwester | a loaf of bread -- $2.39 |
| 05:25.57 | mwester | I type and electrons flow... |
| 05:25.59 | free1 | and at the end of tunnel I'M the light |
| 05:26.12 | mwester | I speak english. |
| 05:27.54 | free1 | my mind smells of excellence, yours reeks of estrogen |
| 05:29.23 | summatusmentis | you have yet to cite any phone that compares specs-wise to the neo, that is unsubsidized |
| 05:29.41 | *** part/#openmoko Crashbit (n=Crashbit@unaffiliated/crashbit) |
| 05:29.54 | free1 | check it out you keep speaking of comparing... and mention phones that don't have the GPS |
| 05:30.12 | free1 | but the Neo I saw didn't have a camera in it, ya dig? |
| 05:31.12 | summatusmentis | of the phones you listed, not one, save for the centro is a touchscreen, none(maybe the centro) have wifi |
| 05:31.20 | summatusmentis | and the centro price you listed is subsidized |
| 05:32.20 | free1 | hmm, surf the internet, check email, etc for two hundred some... or , pay 450 to have a touch screen |
| 05:32.26 | free1 | not difficult at all |
| 05:32.28 | free1 | holla |
| 05:34.07 | summatusmentis | you're ignoring the original challenge, which was comparable specifications |
| 05:34.14 | summatusmentis | the only that comes close is the centro |
| 05:36.49 | free1 | no I am not ignoring the original challenge |
| 05:37.22 | free1 | I said that cell phones are now 250 and under w/o a plan/contract |
| 05:37.27 | free1 | this was challenged |
| 05:37.46 | summatusmentis | where are you finding these phones for these prices? |
| 05:38.03 | free1 | for example, http://www.store.motorola.com/mot/en/US/adirect/motorola |
| 05:38.18 | free1 | laptopmag.com |
| 05:38.23 | free1 | plain and simple |
| 05:38.28 | free1 | black and white |
| 05:39.05 | free1 | furthermore, I was told that the price of the neo had to do with cdma and gsm |
| 05:39.21 | free1 | for some reason I thought the neo would only be gsm.... |
| 05:39.32 | summatusmentis | that's correct, the neo can only be gsm |
| 05:39.36 | free1 | so I'm not sure how relevant that point was |
| 05:39.41 | free1 | ok. there you go. |
| 05:39.41 | summatusmentis | I'm asking for a specific link |
| 05:39.49 | free1 | I just gave you two |
| 05:40.03 | free1 | what's really good with you, playa? |
| 05:40.20 | summatusmentis | neither of those sites link to a place where I can buy a centro, unsubsidized, for $99 |
| 05:41.54 | free1 | what exactly is that the centro can do that these other phones cannot? |
| 05:42.04 | free1 | in terms of the casual user |
| 05:42.16 | free1 | as opposed to the power user |
| 05:42.21 | free1 | ? |
| 05:42.34 | summatusmentis | http://www.store.motorola.com/mot/en/US/adirect/motorola?cmd=catProductDetail there's the v9m |
| 05:42.41 | summatusmentis | notice how it says "with plan" |
| 05:43.17 | summatusmentis | the centro is the closest in specifications to the original challenge |
| 05:43.18 | free1 | I get an error message when I click that link |
| 05:43.39 | free1 | the link that I provieded clearly says 'with no plan' |
| 05:43.55 | summatusmentis | not for $249 |
| 05:44.05 | free1 | yezzir |
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| 05:44.45 | summatusmentis | no, the link you provided was the generic front page of the motorola store. I had to search for the v9m |
| 05:44.55 | free1 | look where it says "Feature phones only (no plan)" |
| 05:45.16 | free1 | click on the 'moto store' graphic |
| 05:45.21 | free1 | holla |
| 05:46.20 | summatusmentis | none of the 3 phones listed there are the v9m |
| 05:47.03 | free1 | but you can store mp3s, check email, and surf |
| 05:47.11 | free1 | it doesn't need to say v9 |
| 05:47.33 | summatusmentis | you specifically cited the v9m |
| 05:47.49 | free1 | cmon yo, defcon only cost 100 |
| 05:48.07 | free1 | the neo should cost about the same |
| 05:48.13 | free1 | as a symblic gesture |
| 05:48.16 | free1 | keep it real |
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| 05:49.14 | free1 | yeah I know a lot of people that use linux and open source |
| 05:49.35 | free1 | but I know of only one old dude that buys those $20 linux magazines. |
| 05:50.05 | free1 | coming out with $450 'open-source' phone... is not the move. |
| 05:50.11 | free1 | no ones going for it. |
| 05:50.20 | summatusmentis | probably because it's not done yet |
| 05:50.35 | free1 | I guess you told me then. |
| 05:50.37 | free1 | unno |
| 05:50.58 | RayDar | Hey, I just got my phone. I need to flash it and I have some questions. I am hoping you can be gentle. |
| 05:51.34 | summatusmentis | free1: as wonderful as it's been discussing phones that don't compare to the Neo, I have to sleep |
| 05:51.57 | summatusmentis | RayDar: stick around, I'm not sure how many people are up, or awake at this point |
| 05:51.58 | free1 | makes sense, safe travels |
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| 05:53.39 | mwester | ~ask |
| 05:53.39 | apt | Questions in the channel should be specific, informative, complete, concise, and on-topic. Don't ask if you can ask a question first. Don't ask if a person is there, just ask what you intended to ask them. Better questions more frequently yield better answers. We are all here voluntarily or against our will. |
| 05:53.43 | RayDar | summatusmentis: Thanks. The wiki instructions say to issue a "cu -l /dev/ttyACM0" command, but /dev/ttyACM0 doesn't show up on my system. |
| 05:54.42 | RayDar | Do I need to enable some kernel driver to get /dev/ttyACM0 to show up? Might it be called something else on my Gentoo system? |
| 05:54.43 | mwester | RayDar: Did anything show up when you plugged the phone USB cable in, and powered up the phone? |
| 05:55.00 | mwester | (check dmesg if necessary) |
| 05:56.20 | RayDar | mwester: I checked dmesg, which states that it saw a new device on the USB bus and that it chose configuration #1 of two choices, but it doesn't say anything about assigning a /dev device. |
| 05:57.02 | *** join/#openmoko raydar (n=raydar@c-24-19-33-24.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) |
| 05:57.02 | mwester | He vanished... |
| 05:57.12 | mwester | He's back... |
| 05:57.24 | RayDar | Doh! Just installed this IRC client. I haven't been on the IRC in years. |
| 05:57.29 | mwester | What's the state of the neo -- do you have the u-boot menu up? |
| 05:57.42 | RayDar | mwester: Yes. |
| 05:57.57 | mmontour | RayDar: the kernel module is called cdc_acm |
| 05:58.25 | RayDar | mmontour: OK. I will search around for it. |
| 05:59.30 | RayDar | Probably in Device Drivers somewhere. |
| 06:01.24 | RayDar | Oh, looks like an "emerge kmobiletools" is what I need |
| 06:02.02 | RayDar | or not... |
| 06:03.19 | RayDar | Device Drivers -> USB Support -> USB Modem (CDC ACM) Support |
| 06:04.08 | RayDar | Yeah! I have a /dev/ttyACM0 |
| 06:04.23 | RayDar | The wiki should probably mention that kernel driver as needed. |
| 06:13.23 | RayDar | not a lot of chat here |
| 06:13.31 | RayDar | quite a few folks though |
| 06:19.34 | RayDar | Anyone alive? |
| 06:21.36 | free1 | still breathing |
| 06:21.53 | free1 | seriously laconic |
| 06:22.41 | *** join/#openmoko tholin (n=tholin@85.8.6.155.static.se.wasadata.net) |
| 06:23.09 | RayDar | I'm just glad you are free. |
| 06:28.14 | RayDar | booting...... |
| 06:29.16 | RayDar | Please wait... |
| 06:31.29 | RayDar | Hmmmm seems to be a phone. |
| 06:31.34 | RayDar | (mostly) |
| 06:32.03 | RayDar | surprisingly slow to change apps. |
| 06:32.39 | rwhitby | depends on your frame of reference :-) it's faster than what it was 12 months ago ... |
| 06:32.46 | RayDar | hehe |
| 06:32.59 | rwhitby | and for some people it's faster than the emulator |
| 06:33.07 | RayDar | just got mine (xmas present) |
| 06:34.36 | RayDar | lotsa games |
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| 06:45.40 | CM | Good morning |
| 06:51.15 | RayDar | Heh, it's 22:51 here. |
| 06:51.46 | *** join/#openmoko libervisco (n=libervis@tuxhacker/libervisco) |
| 06:51.55 | CM | That's one reason it's so quiet now. A lot of europeans in here, and we like to sleep in the mornings.. ;) |
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| 06:52.30 | RayDar | Sure is quiet. |
| 07:01.33 | RayDar | what do I use as a terminal-based text editor? nano doesn't seem to be present |
| 07:03.03 | CM | RayDar: vi is |
| 07:03.16 | CM | Or, I think you can install joe |
| 07:03.28 | CM | Or any other editor that's in the feeds :) |
| 07:03.40 | CM | Have you gotten usb networking or so up? |
| 07:05.15 | RayDar | CM: Nope. I am working on that. The wiki says to edit /etc/network/interfaces |
| 07:05.25 | CM | Hmm.. |
| 07:05.37 | CM | I think you don't have to do much on the neo |
| 07:05.46 | CM | At least it's worked out of the box for me |
| 07:05.54 | CM | Once I had everything configured on my comp |
| 07:06.46 | RayDar | yeah, I see it's already there |
| 07:06.52 | CM | :) |
| 07:07.07 | RayDar | I see a wlan entry. I thought these didn't do 80211 |
| 07:07.11 | *** join/#openmoko Dodji (n=dodji@torimasen.com) |
| 07:07.16 | CM | No, not the GTA01 |
| 07:07.26 | CM | But the GTA02 will run the same software |
| 07:07.35 | CM | So there are some extra stuff in there |
| 07:07.41 | RayDar | I will want to trade up. |
| 07:07.48 | CM | Me too |
| 07:09.13 | RayDar | Isn't there some sort of discount for those who bought the current model? |
| 07:09.28 | CM | No, instead the price of the current model was lowered |
| 07:09.45 | *** join/#openmoko buz (n=buz@84-74-88-75.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
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| 07:13.21 | RayDar | fascinating. Can they make a call yet? |
| 07:13.45 | CM | Sure, I used up my prepaid card on my neo |
| 07:13.56 | CM | But the battery time is not so good |
| 07:14.18 | CM | Also, you should install gllin to get the gps stuff working :) |
| 07:14.46 | RayDar | CM: Noted. First I am going to try to get this USB networking thing going. |
| 07:14.46 | *** join/#openmoko peter__b (n=biertrin@p5497A89F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 07:15.11 | RayDar | CM: Is there a screen brightness control? |
| 07:15.24 | CM | Hmm.. I think so |
| 07:15.40 | CM | Or just echo into some sys/bla bla/brightness :) |
| 07:18.15 | CM | RayDar: Btw, better search then in the wiki: http://www.google.com/coop/cse?cx=018430699993342716089%3Aszsaurhronw&hl=en |
| 07:21.54 | RayDar | Device Drivers->Network device support->USB Network Adapters->Multipurpose USB Networking Framework |
| 07:21.57 | RayDar | (I think) |
| 07:23.11 | CM | Can't remember, such long time since I did it but it sounds likely :) |
| 07:23.29 | RayDar | Whew, I need to clean my screen already..... and put a protector on it. |
| 07:25.04 | CM | I have no protector on it and I've had mine since august |
| 07:25.08 | CM | It's pretty durable |
| 07:25.18 | RayDar | Hmmmm. I have a usbnet module now but it doesn't make a usb0 device...... hmmmmmm |
| 07:25.23 | CM | Even managed to accidently use the ink pen tip instead fo the stylus, but no marks |
| 07:25.35 | CM | What distro are you on? |
| 07:25.38 | RayDar | Gentoo |
| 07:25.45 | CM | Ah, same as me then |
| 07:25.57 | CM | I've just moved, so I haven't had time to unpack my comp yet |
| 07:26.13 | RayDar | Wow, you get IRC on your eyelids?!? Convenient! |
| 07:26.21 | CM | :P |
| 07:26.25 | CM | I'm at work |
| 07:26.36 | CM | New work started this monday.. |
| 07:26.59 | CM | Anyway, create the usb0.net softlink in /etc/init.d/ |
| 07:27.20 | CM | And update the script according to the wiki |
| 07:27.55 | *** join/#openmoko rmoravcik (n=moravcik@gtsgw.ttc.cz) |
| 07:28.27 | mmontour | RayDar: you need the cdc_ether module as well as usbnet |
| 07:28.33 | RayDar | Ahhhhh |
| 07:28.43 | RayDar | mmontour: Thanks.... compiling |
| 07:29.19 | mmontour | good luck - time for me to sleep. |
| 07:29.34 | RayDar | mmontour: Thanks again. Homer sleep now. |
| 07:30.47 | RayDar | Yeah, I have a usb0 network interface! |
| 07:31.44 | CM | :) |
| 07:33.12 | RayDar | Yeah, I can ping the phone. |
| 07:33.30 | CM | Nice, just some iptables rules left then |
| 07:34.32 | CM | I use dnsmasq for dns btw, not sure if that's in the wiki |
| 07:34.51 | *** join/#openmoko Longfield (n=valentin@138.131.217.87) |
| 07:34.58 | RayDar | W00t! I have ssh'd to the phone! |
| 07:35.21 | CM | Nice, now things get a lot easier :) |
| 07:36.13 | *** join/#openmoko wolog (n=wolog@s15209028.onlinehome-server.info) |
| 07:37.32 | RayDar | Indeed |
| 07:37.59 | RayDar | Oh geez, looks like I need to emerge iptables. |
| 07:39.11 | ewon | here's a dime son, go get yourself a proper distro. |
| 07:39.36 | CM | Hehe |
| 07:41.29 | rwhitby | ewon: at least RayDar will be used to waiting for long periods for things to compile, so building an openmoko image should feel right at home ... |
| 07:42.29 | CM | And getting things just the way he wants and not all extra cruft ;) |
| 07:45.08 | *** join/#openmoko nadio (i=weechat@gateway/tor/x-af42a67669122b83) |
| 07:48.03 | RayDar | Oh no, not a distro war! |
| 07:48.14 | nadio | how long does the openmoko bettery work? say for listening on internet radio? |
| 07:48.54 | CM | Don't know about gta02, but gta01 is probably not that long |
| 07:49.20 | CM | RayDar: They're just teasing, it's not much flaming in here :) |
| 07:49.24 | RayDar | I hope all this extra stuff (debug board etc.) will work with the GTA02 |
| 07:49.30 | RayDar | ~gta |
| 07:49.31 | apt | well, gta is <jcm> would having a woman as the main character change anything? <jcm> it would still be GTA <gwizz> yeah <gwizz> grand theft alimony |
| 07:50.10 | CM | RayDar: The debugboard should work with any jtag |
| 07:51.16 | RayDar | I am somewhat of a newbie when it comes to jtag. |
| 07:51.24 | RayDar | I just figured out ICSP. |
| 07:51.47 | nadio | is there any extra board that can add 3g support? |
| 07:51.49 | CM | Me too, just borrowed a debugboard before christmas and managed to get my Neo working before I moved |
| 07:51.59 | CM | nadio: No |
| 07:52.50 | nadio | CM: not even true USB? |
| 07:53.15 | RayDar | ~true usb |
| 07:53.19 | CM | Well, the neo is an usb host, so if you get some power injection it should work |
| 07:53.24 | CM | RayDar: :P |
| 07:54.01 | RayDar | power injection? |
| 07:54.27 | CM | The usb host on the neo gta01 is not powered |
| 07:54.38 | nadio | through, sorry about the typo |
| 07:54.56 | CM | So you can't use a 3G usb dongle without supplying 5v or so through some external power source |
| 07:55.08 | nadio | I am thinking of gta02 |
| 07:55.12 | RayDar | Ahhhh. |
| 07:55.38 | RayDar | I was gunna wait for the gta02 but I got this one as an xmas present. So, whaddya gonna do? |
| 07:55.47 | CM | Don't know enough about gta02.. Been away a bit from things the last 3 weeks, moving, holidays and no computer at home.. |
| 07:56.03 | CM | RayDar: Use it as a cool toy. ;) |
| 07:57.18 | RayDar | CM: Yeah. I am afraid it might distract me from other projects though. |
| 07:57.44 | CM | Heh, move the other projects to the Neo ;) |
| 07:58.01 | cdbot2 | * * OM Bug 1178 has been created by dodji(AT)openedhand.com |
| 07:58.01 | cdbot2 | * * iron out XVideo support in Xglamo |
| 07:58.02 | cdbot2 | * * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=1178 |
| 07:58.20 | *** join/#openmoko thomasg (n=thomasg@p57AFF833.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 07:58.43 | RayDar | this thing has xv support? |
| 07:58.55 | CM | GTA01 runs full X |
| 07:59.16 | RayDar | What kinda graphics system does it have? Nvidia? |
| 07:59.17 | CM | But GTA02 has a accelerated graphics card.. |
| 07:59.56 | Dodji | RayDar, it has an smedia chip named glamo. |
| 08:00.02 | CM | RayDar: http://www.smediatech.com/product3362.htm |
| 08:00.26 | RayDar | Is that the same brand that the new one will have? |
| 08:00.40 | raster | yes |
| 08:00.42 | raster | same chip |
| 08:01.01 | raster | unfortunately - i wouldnt get all worked up over it if i were you |
| 08:01.06 | raster | i've been doing benchmarks |
| 08:01.10 | RayDar | hehe |
| 08:01.20 | raster | even with a faster cpu - graphcis is about the same speed |
| 08:01.21 | RayDar | Probably can't play Portal on it. |
| 08:01.22 | CM | raster: We're not surprised that you have... ;) |
| 08:01.32 | raster | what we make up on the swings - we lost on the roundabouts |
| 08:02.01 | raster | the pitiful bus TO the smedia is a big cause of problems |
| 08:02.02 | *** part/#openmoko Aria (n=aredride@acrux.theinternetco.net) |
| 08:02.16 | raster | the fact that the smedia can only partly accelerate x is part of that too |
| 08:03.26 | RayDar | Yeah, it doesn't seem like a speed demon. |
| 08:05.24 | *** join/#openmoko jpozlovsky (n=jindra@rb5cc115.net.upc.cz) |
| 08:07.06 | *** join/#openmoko fgau (n=fgau@62.8.133.125) |
| 08:07.28 | RayDar | But, if this thing had wifi, it could potentially take over all the functionality of my phone and my Palm T|X |
| 08:07.34 | nadio | is it possible to add extra usb ports? |
| 08:08.06 | hrw | morning |
| 08:08.17 | hrw | nadio: thats what for usb hubs are |
| 08:09.02 | RayDar | thanks for your help CM |
| 08:11.51 | CM | RayDar: You're welcome :) |
| 08:12.16 | *** join/#openmoko josch (n=josch@host132.natpool.mwn.de) |
| 08:15.44 | *** join/#openmoko slomo (n=slomo@ubuntu/member/slomo) |
| 08:19.31 | *** join/#openmoko grummel (n=grummel@p5B16D814.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 08:22.26 | Hopscotch | good morning |
| 08:24.04 | *** join/#openmoko Magon (n=Magon@archangel.kolej.mff.cuni.cz) |
| 08:24.15 | *** join/#openmoko Mathiasdm (n=Mathias@vpnf152.ugent.be) |
| 08:25.32 | *** join/#openmoko Ghiottone (n=ale@213.158.72.22) |
| 08:25.42 | Ghiottone | morning all |
| 08:25.46 | CM | ;) |
| 08:29.20 | *** join/#openmoko rob_w (n=bob@M8848.m.pppool.de) |
| 08:29.31 | *** part/#openmoko moo (n=sexycows@80.75.108.6) |
| 08:34.21 | *** join/#openmoko [PI]Sami (n=sami@a9b.pirttimaki.jyu.fi) |
| 08:36.24 | CM | Unable to sleep? |
| 08:36.48 | RayDar | I was mostly "or something". |
| 08:37.12 | RayDar | Never go to bed in the middle of your hobby. |
| 08:37.18 | CM | Hehe |
| 08:38.16 | RayDar | Lessee, wherewuzeye |
| 08:38.27 | RayDar | ah yes, iptables |
| 08:41.18 | RayDar | Hmmm, looks like it is a package and some kernel stuff |
| 08:41.37 | CM | Yes |
| 08:49.00 | RayDar | Wow, that re-compiled a lot of kernel stuff |
| 08:49.21 | NineX | damn www.agngstrom-distribution.org is down :S |
| 08:49.49 | *** join/#openmoko N-Mi (n=nicolas@calvix/staff/N-Mi) |
| 08:49.53 | RayDar | damn, these pixels on the screen are small |
| 08:50.06 | CM | Hehe, 283 dpi.. |
| 08:50.15 | *** join/#openmoko njpatel (n=njp@5ac04736.bb.sky.com) |
| 08:52.47 | RayDar | ~time |
| 08:52.47 | apt | You cannot understand nature's perfect time cube! (2008.01.11 8:52:47 GMT) |
| 08:53.06 | RayDar | I suppose it's morning for the limeys |
| 08:54.04 | RayDar | I need to reboot to take advantage of my new iptables |
| 08:54.07 | RayDar | BRB |
| 08:57.58 | *** join/#openmoko abraxa__ (n=abraxa@pD95FF91E.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 08:58.10 | CM | abraxa__: Good morning :) |
| 08:58.57 | abraxa__ | Ahoy CM |
| 08:59.00 | abraxa__ | Long time no talk |
| 08:59.11 | CM | Yeah, long time no computer for me.. |
| 08:59.38 | abraxa__ | Likewise - Christmas and New Year's was computer-free time :) |
| 09:00.12 | *** join/#openmoko RayDar (n=raydar@c-24-19-33-24.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) |
| 09:00.13 | CM | Yeah, and I finally moved in here in Stockholm. At my new job now |
| 09:00.17 | *** join/#openmoko nurgle_ (n=nurgle@62.8.195.163) |
| 09:00.35 | abraxa__ | Ohh, congrats! |
| 09:00.40 | cjb_ie | CM: yay! settling in to "married life" too? ;) |
| 09:00.59 | abraxa__ | I would bet that his g/f is checking her options ;) |
| 09:01.00 | CM | cjb_ie: Well, not really married yet, but engaged, and living on 38 sqm... |
| 09:01.15 | RayDar | CM: What's the new jobby then? |
| 09:01.16 | CM | I'm having trouble getting my stuff unpacked |
| 09:01.27 | CM | RayDar: Consultant, programming.. |
| 09:01.35 | cjb_ie | CM: see, that's why i put in the quotes :) |
| 09:01.37 | CM | Not sure what assignment yet though |
| 09:01.43 | CM | Hehe |
| 09:01.55 | Xx13 | <PROTECTED> |
| 09:02.01 | *** join/#openmoko NineX|Moko (n=gta01@host-ip26-159.crowley.pl) |
| 09:02.02 | abraxa__ | But you're already earning money? Good deal |
| 09:02.07 | CM | No, and it's very central |
| 09:02.14 | CM | abraxa__: Yes, full salary :D |
| 09:02.28 | abraxa__ | Niiiice |
| 09:02.45 | CM | Already spent 1000EUR on a bigger bed though.. ;) |
| 09:03.01 | CM | 120cm is ok for a while, but not good for your back.. |
| 09:03.30 | *** join/#openmoko toggles_1 (n=tommy@70.17.185.168) |
| 09:03.39 | Xx13 | hehe, did you pay 1K e for 120cm bed? |
| 09:03.50 | cjb_ie | 8eur per cm! |
| 09:03.59 | CM | Xx13: No, I had one like that, but now we have a 160cm |
| 09:04.07 | CM | Very nice one :) |
| 09:04.07 | Xx13 | right |
| 09:04.39 | Xx13 | we went for 180, and now the bed takes up most of the bedroom ;] |
| 09:05.01 | CM | Xx13: Well that would be bad for my 38 sqm |
| 09:05.20 | Xx13 | nah, we have 49 |
| 09:05.31 | Xx13 | and a newborn ;] |
| 09:05.43 | CM | Ouch.. |
| 09:05.58 | CM | I'll move before the family grows any bigger |
| 09:07.07 | Xx13 | the plan was for my wife to get a nice postdoc position in a nice and warm country, but if we move to a more comfortable accomodation, we might not be able to leave ever.. |
| 09:07.32 | CM | Ah, I see |
| 09:08.00 | cjb_ie | wow, i'm in 42 sq m on my own and running out of space! |
| 09:08.13 | Xx13 | although i'm starting to doubt this logic |
| 09:13.31 | RayDar | (Darn backwards US) |
| 09:14.07 | *** join/#openmoko Marex-notebook (n=marex@vasut.kolej.mff.cuni.cz) |
| 09:14.39 | *** join/#openmoko dneary (n=dneary@mne69-9-88-163-116-163.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 09:14.54 | *** join/#openmoko buz (n=buz@84-74-88-75.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 09:15.57 | RayDar | wow, 38 sqm is small! |
| 09:16.21 | cjb_ie | at one point i was sharing my place with a gf, and i was subletting my spare room to another couple |
| 09:16.28 | RayDar | I thought my 60 sq m place was small. |
| 09:16.45 | cjb_ie | _that_ was getting quite cramped |
| 09:17.43 | *** join/#openmoko jas4711 (n=jas@p69.kthopen.kth.se) |
| 09:18.19 | Xx13 | i was under impression that average homes in the US are bigger then in Europe |
| 09:18.40 | *** join/#openmoko zween (n=zween@78-86-213-209.zone2.bethere.co.uk) |
| 09:18.40 | cjb_ie | Xx13: everything is bigger in texas! |
| 09:19.15 | Xx13 | and houses are cheaper to build |
| 09:19.31 | RayDar | Even the presidential treachery is bigger when it's from Texas. |
| 09:20.29 | *** join/#openmoko Maledictus (n=Malebob@92.227.192.128) |
| 09:21.07 | *** join/#openmoko suuuper (n=suuuper@81-208-88-100.ip.fastwebnet.it) |
| 09:22.34 | RayDar | ~top |
| 09:22.35 | apt | hmm... top is acting funky - keeps segfaulting - that's an old problem I know |
| 09:26.50 | RayDar | Is there actually a web browser? Or is that just there to taunt me? |
| 09:31.23 | CM | Xx13: The houses there are cheap because they're build like crap |
| 09:31.25 | CM | ;) |
| 09:32.57 | RayDar | nifty, the magic commands seem to have given my phone DNS lookup. |
| 09:35.00 | RayDar | seems like the "Web Browser - Conquer the net" item isn't real. |
| 09:35.53 | CM | Hmm.., maybe the link is wrong |
| 09:36.04 | CM | Try openmoko-browaser2 from the terminal |
| 09:39.45 | *** join/#openmoko toxx_ (n=toxx_@103-247-dsl.kielnet.net) |
| 09:40.47 | RayDar | Wow, it has a web browser. I guess the link is wrong. I wonder how I can fix that. |
| 09:40.58 | RayDar | Can the screen rotate? |
| 09:41.09 | fgau | jep |
| 09:41.26 | fgau | try the aux-button |
| 09:41.34 | Ghiottone | keep it pressed |
| 09:42.45 | RayDar | Hmmm, a menu comes up but none of the choices seem to do anything. |
| 09:43.10 | RayDar | oh wait, screenshot works. |
| 09:44.10 | RayDar | how do I bring up a keyboard to enter things into fields on web pages? |
| 09:44.46 | CM | It should pop up automaticly |
| 09:44.59 | CM | If not, there should be a keyboard icon on the top menu bar |
| 09:45.19 | CM | Not sure what build of the rootfs you're running |
| 09:46.08 | *** join/#openmoko jeddy3 (n=mattiast@gw.sbg.se) |
| 09:46.21 | *** join/#openmoko buz (n=buz@84-74-88-75.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 09:46.36 | RayDar | 2007-11-21 |
| 09:46.51 | CM | Oh, ok. That's fairly old, but should work |
| 09:47.33 | CM | RayDar: Try some of ScaredyCat's builds if you want newer stuff: http://buildhost.automated.it/OM2007.2/ |
| 09:48.07 | CM | Just don't take the 85.3 mb files unless you boot from SD |
| 09:49.14 | RayDar | no keyboard icon, no automatic popup, aux button menus don't work either. |
| 09:49.35 | RayDar | I don't know how to boot from SD. Why wouldn't I want to take them unless I did so? |
| 09:49.53 | CM | Because the build in flash on gta01 is only 64mb |
| 09:50.36 | RayDar | Oh, it won't fit. |
| 09:50.45 | CM | Correct :) |
| 09:50.55 | CM | The gta02 will have 256 mb |
| 09:50.59 | mjr | well, those larger files are just tar files. Presumably they would fit were you to untar on the internal flash :] |
| 09:51.19 | mjr | but flashing the jffs2 image is rather a lot easier... |
| 09:51.27 | RayDar | maybe I should try an ipkg update or ipkg upgrade |
| 09:52.08 | CM | RayDar: I think reflashing would probably be faster, but who knows :) |
| 09:52.57 | RayDar | I tried the ipkg update. It's doing something. |
| 09:53.11 | RayDar | doh, just stopped |
| 09:53.22 | CM | It might fill the flash |
| 09:53.59 | *** join/#openmoko rd_ (n=dr@vnsecurity.net) |
| 09:54.44 | RayDar | something about wget passive ftp not working. |
| 09:55.20 | NineX | RayDar: yes |
| 09:55.26 | NineX | RayDar: one error on ipkg update |
| 09:55.27 | Xx13 | CM: also they need a lot less thermal insulation |
| 09:55.46 | CM | Xx13: Yes, especially compared to the nordic countries.. ;) |
| 09:56.13 | NineX | ipkg_download: ERROR: Command failed with return value 1: `wget --passive-ftp -q -P /tmp/ipkg-9MRNxd http://buildhost.openmoko.org/snapshots/2007.08/ipk/neo1973/Packages.gz |
| 09:56.29 | CM | Gett a better repo |
| 09:56.31 | CM | get |
| 09:56.35 | CM | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Repositories |
| 09:56.56 | NineX | CM: http://buildhost.openmoko.org/snapshots/2007.08/ipk/ <- neo1973 are missing |
| 09:57.10 | NineX | CM: i'm use my own repo ;P |
| 09:57.14 | CM | Hehe |
| 09:57.18 | NineX | s/i'm/i/ |
| 09:57.32 | CM | RayDar: Use ScaredyCat's, just follow the instructions on that wiki page |
| 09:58.16 | *** join/#openmoko Audiomind (n=Audiomin@62.79.42.233.adsl.kj.tiscali.dk) |
| 09:59.22 | NineX | CM: sholud i remove /etc/ipkg/*.conf , and add only my (it is safe?) |
| 09:59.46 | CM | NineX: I did that before and it worked fine |
| 10:00.00 | CM | But I just moved all other conf files to my /home/root/bak |
| 10:00.09 | CM | Also, you save space doing that |
| 10:00.38 | CM | When you have many configs, you get more disk space used for that update datbase for each file |
| 10:00.48 | CM | Can't remember where they were put though.. |
| 10:01.07 | NineX | CM: cause snapshot-neo1973-feed.conf are fuckedup ;P |
| 10:01.15 | *** join/#openmoko Field (n=Field@ip-185.emscb.ruhr-uni-bochum.de) |
| 10:01.15 | CM | Hehe |
| 10:01.38 | RayDar | CM: on the flashing page? |
| 10:01.58 | CM | RayDar: No, the Repositories one I linked to above :) |
| 10:04.11 | *** join/#openmoko lrg (n=liam@lrg2.demon.co.uk) |
| 10:07.16 | *** join/#openmoko thomasgruebler (n=thomasgr@85-124-167-249.work.xdsl-line.inode.at) |
| 10:07.34 | RayDar | Can't I just download the latest jffs2 and .bin files and then use dfu-util to upgrade? |
| 10:07.42 | CM | RayDar: Of course |
| 10:07.46 | CM | That's what I usually do |
| 10:07.57 | RayDar | OK, I think I will give it a try. |
| 10:07.58 | CM | (Except building them myself) |
| 10:08.08 | CM | Just don't update uboot unless you really really have to |
| 10:08.17 | RayDar | Yeah, that is what I have read. |
| 10:08.21 | RayDar | I won't. |
| 10:08.24 | CM | :) |
| 10:08.46 | CM | It's still good to have the feeds in your etc/ipkg/ though |
| 10:09.07 | CM | Makes it easy to install additional apps that are not in the default image |
| 10:13.41 | linux_ | 18:08 < CM> Just don't update uboot unless you really really have to |
| 10:14.48 | *** join/#openmoko _rob (n=rob@85.233.59.8.static.cablesurf.de) |
| 10:15.10 | RayDar | weird, it timed out several times. |
| 10:16.23 | RayDar | sending new rootfs |
| 10:17.00 | NineX | CM: /var/lib/ipkg |
| 10:18.04 | *** join/#openmoko toggles_w (n=tommy@pool-141-151-173-117.pitt.east.verizon.net) |
| 10:18.57 | xcasex | CM: you suck at the whole getting in touch thing :p |
| 10:19.13 | *** join/#openmoko Kero (n=kero@dhcp-077-251-029-148.chello.nl) |
| 10:20.10 | *** join/#openmoko pvanhoof (n=pvanhoof@d54C0EE14.access.telenet.be) |
| 10:21.10 | RedDog | morning! ;-) |
| 10:21.22 | *** join/#openmoko grummel (n=grummel@p5B16D814.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 10:23.44 | RayDar | neat, there are some accelerometers in this baby. But it seems they don't work yet. |
| 10:25.14 | *** join/#openmoko t_s_o (n=tso@179.84-49-131.nextgentel.com) |
| 10:27.22 | CM | xcasex: Yeah, sorry :( |
| 10:28.00 | RayDar | now now boys |
| 10:28.08 | xcasex | CM: :p |
| 10:29.01 | CM | RayDar: He lives in my hometown and we were supposed to meet up when I was home for christmas, but I sick for a few days, then my family kept me busy |
| 10:29.16 | CM | s/I si/I was si/ |
| 10:29.20 | Vegar | updating uboot might be a good idea if you have a really really old version |
| 10:29.41 | Vegar | there was a bug that caused the slow charging to be even slower |
| 10:29.47 | Vegar | (50mA vs. 100mA) |
| 10:30.08 | CM | Yes, and you had to manually do nand erase rootfs if you changed to a smaller rootfs image |
| 10:30.30 | RayDar | I just got the phone today. Not sure if I want to risk it. |
| 10:31.02 | CM | RayDar: But you have the advanced kit with the debugboard and all? |
| 10:31.19 | RayDar | CM: Yuppers |
| 10:31.25 | Vegar | no worries then |
| 10:32.05 | RayDar | The "scaredy cat" version has a picture of someone's eyes and nose as a background image. |
| 10:32.13 | *** join/#openmoko toggles_2 (n=tommy@pool-141-151-191-58.pitt.east.verizon.net) |
| 10:33.46 | RayDar | oh my, quite a few new enhancements in this version. |
| 10:34.54 | *** join/#openmoko Gybrush_ (n=Gybrush@f053153216.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 10:35.07 | Xx13 | how dangerous is updating uboot in absence of dev board? |
| 10:35.09 | CM | Yeah, a lot happened in the first weeks of december |
| 10:35.17 | CM | Xx13: I did it 4-5 times |
| 10:35.37 | CM | It's fairly safe, until you flash a broken uboot version.. |
| 10:35.53 | CM | Maybe not "safe" but it works if the uboot version is good |
| 10:36.14 | Xx13 | ok, and which ones are good? |
| 10:36.30 | CM | Not many... |
| 10:36.46 | CM | Can't remember wich one I'm using now |
| 10:37.09 | Xx13 | would be a good idea to clean out the non working images from the repos |
| 10:37.12 | CM | Booting from sd was broken after august 13th I think |
| 10:37.24 | CM | And I still don't think that's fixed |
| 10:37.24 | torpor | yo |
| 10:37.30 | CM | torpor: Hello :) |
| 10:37.30 | torpor | whats news crew? |
| 10:37.33 | torpor | hi CM! |
| 10:37.42 | CM | I just got back in here too |
| 10:37.56 | torpor | i've been a bit quiet the last few weeks - christmas and all that - and i just recently started working again (for THALES, doing driver development, woot!) but i'm hoping i can get a bit more active.. |
| 10:38.13 | CM | :) |
| 10:38.42 | torpor | anyone know whats up with svn.berlios.de? should i switch to some other server? |
| 10:39.10 | CM | I guess berlios is just having troubles as usually.. |
| 10:40.04 | RayDar | Wow, the browser really needs an activity indicator. |
| 10:40.23 | CM | It needs a lot of stuff |
| 10:40.36 | CM | Last I tried wikipedia.org crashed it |
| 10:41.18 | RayDar | hehe. It is doing amazingly well at my fancy site. |
| 10:41.57 | RayDar | It would be nice if full screen works. Rotate does. |
| 10:45.08 | RayDar | The browser is far superior to that on my Palm TX |
| 10:45.24 | *** join/#openmoko Ebbe (n=ebbe@users.kollegienet.dk) |
| 10:45.35 | CM | Well, it is webkit based :) |
| 10:45.55 | RayDar | I dunno what that is. |
| 10:46.11 | CM | Same as Safari is using |
| 10:46.21 | CM | And many other browsers now too |
| 10:46.40 | RayDar | I see.... just went to their homepage. |
| 10:46.45 | CM | :) |
| 10:47.48 | torpor | hmm.. |
| 10:47.49 | torpor | ERROR: Cannot satisfy the following dependencies for libepsilon0: |
| 10:47.49 | torpor | <PROTECTED> |
| 10:48.01 | CM | ~blame mickey_away |
| 10:48.02 | apt | ACTION blames mickey_away (and Canada) for all the evil in the world |
| 10:48.06 | torpor | wtf is that all about? |
| 10:48.14 | torpor | should i do some changes to my repo? |
| 10:48.14 | raster | oh god |
| 10:48.17 | RayDar | hmmmm, no camera on the phone. |
| 10:48.22 | raster | not using the openembedded EFL .bb';s |
| 10:48.28 | raster | they are in serious need of loving |
| 10:48.47 | raster | i have a bunch of much better/fixed ones, but i built them to build off my local cvs dev tree |
| 10:49.04 | raster | as i then can build a package instantly direct from my current dev srcs |
| 10:49.07 | torpor | raster: repo? |
| 10:49.14 | raster | no repo |
| 10:49.24 | torpor | is there a fix? |
| 10:49.33 | raster | but i can upload the ipk's i built yesterday |
| 10:49.44 | torpor | i'm just trying to keep my neo current is all .. not even sure why i got this problem now to be honest.. |
| 10:49.51 | raster | thre .bb's i have should be fine exccept the SRC needs to be changed to use anoncvs instead of a local dir |
| 10:50.15 | raster | hmmm |
| 10:50.20 | raster | wonder what u need epsilon for |
| 10:50.23 | raster | entrance? |
| 10:50.33 | raster | entrance isn't much use on a neo really |
| 10:50.37 | torpor | got no idea. |
| 10:50.49 | torpor | all i did was ipkg update && ipkg upgrade |
| 10:50.55 | torpor | so want me to show you the log? |
| 10:51.08 | raster | oooh nooo |
| 10:51.09 | raster | no no |
| 10:51.15 | raster | i have 1.5 months of email to catch up on |
| 10:51.18 | CM | hehe |
| 10:51.24 | raster | got enough rheems of text to deal with |
| 10:51.28 | torpor | sure? |
| 10:51.33 | torpor | coz i think you just should. |
| 10:51.35 | raster | damn ISP had my internude down for 1.5 months |
| 10:51.36 | CM | raster: Finally gotten internet working in australia? :D |
| 10:51.44 | cjb_ie | internude - i like it :) |
| 10:51.44 | raster | incompetent fools |
| 10:52.05 | raster | cjb_ie: just accepting honestly what its used for |
| 10:52.05 | raster | :) |
| 10:52.27 | *** join/#openmoko _Damien_ (n=dschulz@sonne.gits-ag.de) |
| 10:52.43 | *** join/#openmoko zedstar (n=john@dev.zedstar.com) |
| 10:52.46 | torpor | for future reference regarding libepsilon0 problems: http://rafb.net/p/drJ2KO72.html |
| 10:52.52 | torpor | <-- going away now |
| 10:54.01 | _Damien_ | hi there.. I'm trying to get the touchscreen to work with tslib+QT4.. but it doesn't work |
| 10:54.16 | _Damien_ | tslib tells me that the touchscreen is unknown |
| 10:54.25 | _Damien_ | do I have to apply any patches? |
| 10:55.51 | _Damien_ | I also tried the linuxtp driver of QT4 but the cursor remains in the top-left corner |
| 10:56.02 | _Damien_ | any ideas? |
| 10:56.33 | *** join/#openmoko Marex-notebook (n=marex@vasut.kolej.mff.cuni.cz) |
| 11:09.13 | bembel | exit |
| 11:09.19 | bembel | ups |
| 11:12.06 | hrw | does someone have nokia communicator phone? |
| 11:17.54 | *** join/#openmoko RedDog (n=reddog@mastersword.de) |
| 11:20.08 | emdete | does someone have a fortran compiler or an idea what i can do without? my mokomakefile requires one since yesterday |
| 11:25.46 | *** join/#openmoko RedDog (n=reddog@mastersword.de) |
| 11:26.52 | *** join/#openmoko RedDog (n=reddog@mastersword.de) |
| 11:29.04 | hrw | http://blog.haerwu.biz/2008/01/11/keyboard-in-palmtops/ |
| 11:29.20 | *** join/#openmoko TRIsoft (n=mac@p57A2DC54.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 11:30.09 | *** join/#openmoko Zenton (n=Vicente@212.166.192.129) |
| 11:30.15 | TRIsoft | morning |
| 11:30.35 | CM | emdete: Install gcc with fortran support? |
| 11:32.29 | hrw | hi Mac |
| 11:32.45 | hrw | emdete: touch build/conf/sanity.conf |
| 11:33.14 | hrw | emdete: then it will ignore all sanity checking - but this is insane setting for non-OE devs |
| 11:33.53 | *** join/#openmoko Robwoerle (n=bob@X069d.x.pppool.de) |
| 11:34.57 | emdete | CM: tried that. does not work... |
| 11:35.27 | CM | Hmm.. Asked around in #oe any? |
| 11:36.06 | emdete | CM: good idea. hrw what do you mean with "but this is insane setting for non-OE devs" - what is non-OE? |
| 11:36.26 | CM | I guess he means non oe developers |
| 11:36.31 | CM | Users like you and me :) |
| 11:40.32 | _Damien_ | could anyone help me to get the touchscreen of my neo1973 to work under arm-linux |
| 11:40.39 | _Damien_ | ? |
| 11:41.39 | CM | What is the problem? |
| 11:41.48 | CM | Using openmoko? |
| 11:44.04 | _Damien_ | no, I'm using a unpatched linux |
| 11:44.06 | _Damien_ | tslib tells me that the touchscreen is unknown |
| 11:44.17 | _Damien_ | do I have to apply any patches to tslib? |
| 11:45.40 | hrw | danilos: what you mean by 'unpatched linux'? |
| 11:46.07 | danilos | hrw: I mean compiled directly from sources from kernel.org |
| 11:46.08 | *** join/#openmoko florian (n=fuchs@217.146.132.69) |
| 11:46.12 | danilos | ;) |
| 11:46.13 | _Damien_ | hm, I'm using 'Wombat' that is a linux on top of OKL4 |
| 11:46.27 | _Damien_ | without any openmoko specific patches |
| 11:46.31 | hrw | ops - I mean _Damien_ ;D |
| 11:46.55 | hrw | _Damien_: so you lack support for some neo1973 components |
| 11:47.42 | _Damien_ | yes |
| 11:47.56 | hrw | so you know why you lack touchscreen? |
| 11:48.05 | _Damien_ | but I can access the touchscreen |
| 11:48.23 | _Damien_ | the driver makes it directly accessible |
| 11:48.35 | _Damien_ | under /dev/touchscreen/0 |
| 11:48.40 | _Damien_ | and under /dev/touchscreen/0raw |
| 11:48.53 | hrw | it should be /dev/input/touchscreen0 rather but ok |
| 11:49.06 | hrw | _Damien_: did you told tslib where touchscreen is? |
| 11:49.31 | *** join/#openmoko ecraven (i=nex@eutyche.swe.uni-linz.ac.at) |
| 11:50.52 | _Damien_ | yes |
| 11:50.52 | _Damien_ | export TSLIB_CALIBFILE=/etc/pointercal |
| 11:50.52 | _Damien_ | export TSLIB_CONFFILE=/etc/ts.conf |
| 11:50.52 | _Damien_ | export TSLIB_PLUGINDIR=/lib/ts |
| 11:50.54 | emdete | _Damien_: do you have entries in /dev/input? |
| 11:50.54 | _Damien_ | export TSLIB_TSDEVICE=/dev/touchscreen/0 |
| 11:50.56 | _Damien_ | export TSLIB_CONSOLEDEVICE=/dev/console |
| 11:50.58 | _Damien_ | export LD_LIBRARY_PATH=/usr/lib/ts:/usr/lib:$LD_LIBRARY_PATH |
| 11:51.00 | _Damien_ | export TSLIB_FBDEVICE=/dev/fb0 |
| 11:51.02 | _Damien_ | export QWS_MOUSE_PROTO=tslib |
| 11:51.23 | _Damien_ | yes, /dev/input/event0 , event1 |
| 11:51.38 | _Damien_ | I also tried those |
| 11:51.50 | *** join/#openmoko raster_ (n=raster@124-170-70-202.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 11:52.18 | RedDog | if cat /sys/bus/i2c/drivers/pcf50606/0-0008/chgcur tells me my battery is charges with "880" ... what is this? |
| 11:52.24 | RedDog | 880mA over USB? |
| 11:52.46 | emdete | RedDog: sometimes it even tell 17000... it is just buggy |
| 11:52.55 | RedDog | my currentmeter tells me my battery gets 33mA ... |
| 11:53.13 | RedDog | fast charge is enabled... |
| 11:53.17 | RedDog | what's wrong? |
| 11:53.19 | *** join/#openmoko andrunko (n=andrunko@200.184.118.132) |
| 11:54.55 | _Damien_ | I also tried the linuxtp driver of QT4 but the cursor remains in the top-left corner |
| 11:55.10 | _Damien_ | and I don't get any click event |
| 11:55.32 | _Damien_ | so I'm not able to recalibrate the TS |
| 11:58.20 | _Damien_ | btw. this is the message QT4/tslib shows: selected device is not a touchscreen I understand |
| 11:58.49 | thseiler | RedDog: just a theory: something else uses up 467ma |
| 12:00.11 | RedDog | thseiler: hmm ... will shutdown ;-) |
| 12:03.06 | *** join/#openmoko miip (n=miip@p54A54455.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 12:04.29 | _Damien_ | is wether tslib or the kernel itself of openmoko is patched in order to use it with the neo1973 phone? |
| 12:06.01 | *** join/#openmoko cb23 (n=cb25@dsl-245-181-180.telkomadsl.co.za) |
| 12:06.06 | *** join/#openmoko simon_ (n=simon@w208.wist.uni-linz.ac.at) |
| 12:06.27 | CM | _Damien_: Maybe poke mickey_away about that when he gets back |
| 12:07.02 | _Damien_ | CM: ok, thanx |
| 12:07.21 | RedDog | could my currentmeter reduce the charge current? |
| 12:07.37 | CM | _Damien_: balrog-kun might know some too, he's the qemu guy (and more) :) |
| 12:08.02 | thseiler | RedDog: don't know... hm, there is an option you can set on the uboot shell: neo1973 charger autofast |
| 12:08.31 | CM | There's a lot of power related things in the wiki |
| 12:08.50 | thseiler | RedDog: this will enable fast charching, while all the other periferialls are still switched off, even whith a dump charger that does not speak usb |
| 12:09.10 | SpeedEvil | RedDog: it's not milliamps |
| 12:09.12 | *** join/#openmoko jas4711 (n=jas@c80-216-80-66.bredband.comhem.se) |
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| 13:24.24 | RedDog | SpeedEvil, roh: any news about d3reg? |
| 13:25.01 | SpeedEvil | RedDog: it's practically unimportant |
| 13:25.32 | RedDog | :-( |
| 13:25.40 | SpeedEvil | RedDog: from some reading I did yesterday - going through the datasheet - it's not possible to use the GTA01 at 266MHz as it is, and remain within spec. |
| 13:25.58 | SpeedEvil | Within the recommended conditions on the datasheet that is |
| 13:26.02 | SpeedEvil | However. |
| 13:26.06 | *** join/#openmoko chris^ (n=kraetzi@p548AD52A.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 13:26.31 | *** join/#openmoko Atul_ (n=qvantel@61.16.248.242) |
| 13:26.34 | SpeedEvil | It's certain not to cause damage, and as I read the rest of the datasheet, and general knowledge, unlikely not to actually work |
| 13:27.28 | Atul_ | I want to update gsm pathces on to neo |
| 13:27.29 | cb23 | SpeedEvil, double negatives? |
| 13:27.39 | SpeedEvil | The only real 'fix' that should be done at some point in the future is that it should clock down to 200MHz and reduce the voltage before switching off. |
| 13:28.15 | SpeedEvil | This saves some 200uW of power |
| 13:28.37 | SpeedEvil | Which is about half of the suspend-RAM current |
| 13:28.40 | Atul_ | Hi all, I want to update gsm pathces on to neo1973 any Idia ? |
| 13:28.50 | SpeedEvil | (which the neo doesn't properly do yet) |
| 13:29.02 | cb23 | SpeedEvil, uW? |
| 13:29.07 | SpeedEvil | yes |
| 13:29.38 | RedDog | ok ok ... |
| 13:29.42 | SpeedEvil | It's somewhat down the list of powersaving measures. |
| 13:29.51 | *** join/#openmoko borg_ (n=olaf@80.149.17.21) |
| 13:29.59 | RedDog | what are the problems on suspend to ram? |
| 13:30.03 | cb23 | i cant imagine why :) |
| 13:31.07 | SpeedEvil | RedDog: I don't know - it uses - last I measured it - a few orders of magnitude more power than it should |
| 13:31.16 | *** join/#openmoko summatusmentis (n=summatus@72.168.202.219) |
| 13:31.18 | cb23 | SpeedEvil, so the neo in suspend-ram should use 400uw? |
| 13:31.41 | SpeedEvil | cb23: on the order of a milliwatt or so, with suspend-RAM, and the RAM self-refreshing. |
| 13:32.06 | SpeedEvil | However. This is with the CPU totally shut down. And it essentially needs to be rebooted. |
| 13:32.46 | SpeedEvil | From (very limited) research I've done, I think it just turns off the clock to the CPU at the moment, which only cuts the power to some half of what it is normally |
| 13:33.48 | cb23 | right, so it would be more of a replace to off, then a replacement to suspend? |
| 13:34.19 | SpeedEvil | The CPU doesn't have an extremely low power mode where it maintains all the registers. |
| 13:34.27 | RedDog | SpeedEvil: but the power cunsumption is different from time to time, isn't it? |
| 13:34.38 | SpeedEvil | time to time? |
| 13:34.41 | RedDog | one time i had only 20mA in suspend to ram ... |
| 13:34.48 | SpeedEvil | RedDog: how measured? |
| 13:34.51 | RedDog | another time it takes 80mA |
| 13:35.01 | RedDog | betwen battery+ and neo ;-) |
| 13:35.13 | RedDog | currentmeter ... |
| 13:35.19 | SpeedEvil | RedDog: Turn off amp power, ensure bluetooth and GPS is off. |
| 13:35.21 | SpeedEvil | and GSM |
| 13:35.56 | RedDog | bluetooth and gps were off all the time... |
| 13:35.59 | NineX | can someone remember me who has created bb file for wesnoth ? |
| 13:36.00 | SpeedEvil | I plan on getting nasty with JTAG and current measurements on a running system when my debug board arrive |
| 13:36.25 | RedDog | how do i controll the amp power? |
| 13:36.36 | RedDog | how can i be shure gsm is off? |
| 13:36.36 | SpeedEvil | RedDog: alsamixer - it's amp-mode I think |
| 13:36.40 | SpeedEvil | one of them is 'off' |
| 13:36.45 | NineX | | CROSS COMPILE Badness: /usr/include in INCLUDEPATH: /usr/include |
| 13:36.49 | NineX | :S |
| 13:37.20 | *** join/#openmoko CVirus (n=GoD@82.201.174.11) |
| 13:37.47 | SpeedEvil | Offtopic - has anyone done any CSR bluetooth chip programnming? |
| 13:39.13 | Atul_ | CM, I want to update gsm pathces on to neo1973 any Idia ? |
| 13:39.51 | SpeedEvil | What do you mean At? |
| 13:42.40 | RedDog | SpeedEvil: 32mA |
| 13:46.43 | SpeedEvil | RedDog: that's from memory about what I measured. You're sure you've turned GSM off? Sent at@poff? |
| 13:47.39 | RedDog | i used libgsmtool -m shell and press o and m... after another o gsmd stopt running |
| 13:49.24 | *** join/#openmoko grummel_ (n=grummel@p5B16D814.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 13:49.42 | Atul_ | SpeedEvil, I just want to updat gsmd patches on to my device. |
| 13:49.43 | CIA-1 | openmoko: 03chris * r3814 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/applications/openmoko-dialer2/ (3 files in 2 dirs): |
| 13:49.43 | CIA-1 | openmoko: * src/dialer/moko-alsa-volume-button.[ch]: |
| 13:49.43 | CIA-1 | openmoko: Add an alsa volume control widget (requires refactoring) |
| 13:49.50 | Atul_ | Did you have any Idea |
| 13:53.00 | *** join/#openmoko DukeOfURL (n=chatzill@introspect.com) |
| 13:53.24 | *** join/#openmoko suuuper (n=suuuper@81-208-88-100.ip.fastwebnet.it) |
| 13:54.25 | *** join/#openmoko kdean06 (n=Kevin@fsf/member/kdean06) |
| 13:55.44 | RedDog | SpeedEvil: now it drops 64mA?!? GSM is off!! |
| 13:55.53 | LarstiQ | Atul_: if you ask about getting a more current gsmd, try 'ipkg update && ipkg upgrade' |
| 13:56.00 | SpeedEvil | Atul_: what do you mean? the GSM module firmware update is not yet available |
| 13:56.46 | *** join/#openmoko renatofilho^_ (n=renato@200.184.118.132) |
| 13:57.33 | Atul_ | LarstiQ, SpeedEvil, I have update moko build environment on my system latest one I want only gsmd .ipkg packages install on to neo1973. So my question is where to install these packages |
| 14:01.24 | CM | Atul_: If you have your feed configured, just update and upgrade :) |
| 14:01.48 | Atul_ | CM, yes I have but it fails after 7-8 download |
| 14:02.10 | *** join/#openmoko MetaMorfoziS (n=khmhm@3e44b1b2.adsl.enternet.hu) |
| 14:02.33 | Atul_ | CM, These error I got "ipkg_download: ERROR: Command failed with return value 1: `wget --passive-ftp -q -P /tmp/ipkg-lcBsHv http://buildhost.openmoko.org/snapshots/2007.08/ipk/fic-gta01/gdk-pixbuf-loader-gif_2.10.14-r5_fic-gta01.ipk' |
| 14:02.33 | Atul_ | " |
| 14:05.39 | LarstiQ | Atul_: that's not the actual error |
| 14:06.06 | Atul_ | LasrtiQ, Then where is the problem |
| 14:12.06 | *** join/#openmoko t_s_o (n=tso@179.84-49-131.nextgentel.com) |
| 14:12.12 | zedstar | anybody happen to know any working gpsd's on the net i can connect for testing? the ones on gpsd page are down |
| 14:12.34 | SpeedEvil | what for? |
| 14:12.46 | zedstar | just test some client queries |
| 14:12.55 | SpeedEvil | why not run your own? |
| 14:13.13 | zedstar | dont get position here |
| 14:13.34 | SpeedEvil | there is a 'fake' backend |
| 14:13.38 | SpeedEvil | which does random walk |
| 14:13.39 | SpeedEvil | IIRC |
| 14:14.11 | LarstiQ | Atul_: earlier on, so check all of the output |
| 14:14.31 | *** join/#openmoko j_ack (n=j_ack@dsbg-4db7bbfa.pool.einsundeins.de) |
| 14:14.46 | Atul_ | LarstQ, Am not getting you. |
| 14:14.48 | SpeedEvil | http://gpsd.berlios.de/gpsfake.html |
| 14:14.56 | *** part/#openmoko thresh (n=popa3d@unaffiliated/thresh) |
| 14:15.08 | zedstar | not tried that i was just being lazy as the ones on net usually work |
| 14:15.30 | LarstiQ | Atul_: use http://rafb.net/paste/ and paste the entire output following ipkg upgrade there |
| 14:15.39 | LarstiQ | (don't paste on irc) |
| 14:15.57 | Atul_ | LarstiQ, Ya I konw ok I will do it. |
| 14:16.12 | *** join/#openmoko k-s (n=gustavo@200.184.118.132) |
| 14:17.12 | zedstar | so i guess could pipe the contents of cating the gllin pipe into that or something along those lines |
| 14:17.22 | SpeedEvil | yeah |
| 14:17.39 | zedstar | actually that doesnt make sense |
| 14:18.01 | zedstar | i need get a real log first for that |
| 14:18.18 | zedstar | with position data |
| 14:18.19 | SpeedEvil | dcc ok? |
| 14:18.22 | zedstar | sure |
| 14:20.51 | SpeedEvil | Not a neo one. |
| 14:21.19 | zedstar | hmm what did xchat do ! lol |
| 14:21.22 | *** join/#openmoko Longfield (n=valentin@138.131.217.87) |
| 14:21.47 | SpeedEvil | looks like it's not wanting DCC |
| 14:22.23 | RedDog | SpeedEvil: booted, entered pin and so on (gsm definatly on)... apm -s -> ~50-60mA |
| 14:22.28 | SpeedEvil | http://www.mauvedotplus.com/log_2007-12-08_10-51-40.bin.bz2 |
| 14:22.30 | *** join/#openmoko buz (n=buz@dhcp-206-98-vpn.unizh.ch) |
| 14:22.39 | SpeedEvil | (with a literal dot) |
| 14:23.17 | zedstar | great thanx speedevil |
| 14:23.24 | SpeedEvil | 6000s or so |
| 14:24.43 | zedstar | btw if u have some time soon have an app i would love u to try as i know u have gps and gprs working! ill buy u a pint if u visit london :) |
| 14:25.11 | CIA-1 | openmoko: 03chris * r3815 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/applications/openmoko-dialer2/ (5 files in 2 dirs): |
| 14:25.11 | CIA-1 | openmoko: * src/dialer/moko-alsa-volume-button.[ch]: |
| 14:25.11 | CIA-1 | openmoko: * src/dialer/moko-alsa-volume-control.[ch]: |
| 14:25.11 | CIA-1 | openmoko: Refactor into separate control a widget objects for flexibility |
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| 14:38.08 | *** part/#openmoko ruimoreira (n=ruimorei@195-23-27-237.net.novis.pt) |
| 14:43.51 | zedstar | bbiab |
| 14:44.09 | *** join/#openmoko Marex-notebook (n=marex@vasut.kolej.mff.cuni.cz) |
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| 14:55.12 | DukeOfURL | speedevil: I'm unable to solder the AUX switch back onto the main board. I think it's a BGA part because it doesn't have pins, just four pads. Suggestions? |
| 14:56.25 | DukeOfURL | And it's real close to the display--hard to get a soldering iron in there |
| 15:01.12 | NineX | ha someone fixed alsa states and caller don't listen echo when calling to may openmoko phone :> |
| 15:02.01 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@209.195.169.219) |
| 15:02.08 | LarstiQ | nnpiggy: ooh |
| 15:02.17 | LarstiQ | NineX: and that's actually in svn now? |
| 15:02.44 | LarstiQ | NineX: or was that a question? |
| 15:04.28 | NineX | LarstiQ: alsa-state_0.1.0-r9 has no echo issue :> |
| 15:06.43 | LarstiQ | NineX: good |
| 15:07.59 | SpeedEvil | Boot over GSM! |
| 15:08.00 | SpeedEvil | :) |
| 15:08.13 | SpeedEvil | Well - nbd+ppp+GPRS |
| 15:08.20 | NineX | hehehe |
| 15:08.37 | borg_ | NineX: where can i get this alsa state? |
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| 15:09.45 | NineX | borg_: make update-bleeding-edge && make openmoko-devel-image |
| 15:09.47 | NineX | ;P |
| 15:09.58 | borg_ | ah, it is in the svn? ok thx :) |
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| 15:14.35 | RedDog | can anybody interpret this: http://mastersword.de/~reddog/panic.jpg ? |
| 15:15.34 | XorA | ran out of memory while suspending is my guess |
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| 15:17.47 | RedDog | out of memory? |
| 15:18.16 | RedDog | i killed all not needed apps before! :D |
| 15:18.26 | RedDog | rmmod unneeded modules... |
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| 15:20.14 | borg_ | RedDog: do you have a list of modules you rmmod'ed? |
| 15:20.23 | borg_ | i guess one of it was needed :) |
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| 15:20.52 | sbeh | suspend_device from device_suspend <3 |
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| 15:32.49 | andylockran | hey guys |
| 15:32.54 | andylockran | been a long time since I was in here |
| 15:33.12 | andylockran | my neo's been with a friend the last couple of months. |
| 15:33.29 | nnpiggy | LarstiQ, hello. what's up? |
| 15:34.48 | LarstiQ | nnpiggy: I seem to be having a cold and headache. Do we know eacht other? |
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| 15:41.08 | RedDog | borg_: all bluetooth, snd ... at the end there were only "ohci_hcd nls_iso8859_1 nls_cp437 vfat fat nls_base" |
| 15:43.34 | mmontour | NineX: If you want a recent u-boot that can boot from SD, you can add the patch that's attached to bug #799 to the uboot-openmoko_svn.bb u-boot. Or get a slightly older prebuilt one from http://members.shaw.ca/mmontour/u-boot/ |
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| 16:18.30 | thseiler | quick question: how does one build a debug binary (with symbols) using openembedded ? Is there a trick to do that ? |
| 16:19.17 | Sup3rkiddo | thseiler, normally, you have foo-dbg ipk created |
| 16:19.49 | thseiler | so i instal the foo-dbg packet instead ? |
| 16:20.21 | Sup3rkiddo | thseiler, yup |
| 16:20.40 | thseiler | great, thanks! |
| 16:20.54 | Sup3rkiddo | np..happy hacking |
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| 16:32.24 | RayDar | does the "auto register with network" thing work? |
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| 16:47.11 | Field | question: is the port where I connect my debug-board a normal serial-port? Does my neo has a normal serial port so I can use it as serial console (and not something with usb?) |
| 16:47.34 | SpeedEvil | AS I understand it, yes. |
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| 16:47.41 | SpeedEvil | But you can't use the GSM modem at the same time |
| 16:47.45 | SpeedEvil | it's one or the other |
| 16:48.18 | thseiler | Field: Yes, and its not the same voltage as a RS232 port, so don't connect it directly !!! |
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| 16:49.09 | *** join/#openmoko libervisco (n=libervis@tuxhacker/libervisco) |
| 16:49.28 | Field | oh GSM would be fare away in the future for me.. next question .. I can connect to openOCD (as I understand - this conencts me to the debug-board) .. but how can I get access this port as normal serial-console? |
| 16:49.43 | Field | is there anything describben somewhere in our wiki? |
| 16:50.27 | mmontour | Field: start with the "Neo1973 Debug Board v2" wiki page. Short answer - the serial port shows up as /dev/ttyUSB1 |
| 16:52.45 | *** part/#openmoko stefan_schmidt (n=stefan@datenfreihafen.org) |
| 16:53.30 | Field | mmontour: well - i've already read this page, but /dev/ttyUSB1 is shown up in the normal openmoko-kernel .. not in my case .. I am almost sure my kernel (okl4) puts his output inside the "normal" ttyS0 or somehing like that. .. So what I would like to do is to watch what comes out at the other side.. |
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| 16:54.54 | Field | maybe I'll describe my question a bit more .. "how do I use the debug board - to get the serial output of my own-moko-kerel inside my host-gentoo-system" |
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| 16:55.57 | mmontour | On the host system, the debug board should provide you with /dev/ttyUSB1. You need the ftdi_sio module loaded with the correct parameters as shown on the wiki |
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| 16:56.12 | Field | what brings me to that question is - that if I start the same kernel insede qemu with the parameter "-serial blabla" .. and connect via terminal-programm with the given port .. i'll see my console |
| 16:56.48 | mmontour | The chip on the debug board is connected over the FPC to the serial port on the Neo. When you boot the Neo kernel, you can give it a "console=/dev/ttySAC0,115200" parameter (or something like that) to tell it to put its console onto that serial port |
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| 16:57.09 | Field | exactly |
| 16:57.47 | Field | ok - so it looks like the fault would be found there ... i've put ftdi_sio not as module .. so i could not give any parameters |
| 16:58.06 | mmontour | That's probably the issue. It needs to know the vendor and product IDs |
| 16:58.49 | Field | kk .. thank you - I'll check this.. |
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| 17:13.37 | andylockran | A quick thought - is it possible to GPLv3 hardware? |
| 17:14.35 | SpeedEvil | It's not especially applicable. |
| 17:14.35 | andylockran | i.e. all components of GPLv3 need to be GPL'd - can you create a license for hardware which specifies that all software needs to be open sourced - so that the hardware manufacturer can be sure it wasn't a badly-coded program that made the hardware fail :) |
| 17:15.09 | SpeedEvil | You're claiming no open-sourced programs have bugs? |
| 17:15.22 | andylockran | no, i'm claiming every program has bugs |
| 17:15.38 | andylockran | but at least in the open source model _everyone_ has the capability of viewing them |
| 17:15.53 | SpeedEvil | In theory - spending man-years of effort per bug. |
| 17:16.00 | andylockran | true. |
| 17:16.19 | SpeedEvil | Some bugs are trivial on a reading of the code. |
| 17:16.26 | SpeedEvil | Others are more involved. |
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| 17:17.01 | andylockran | imagine if some closed-source vendor created a killer-app for the moko.. then no man-in-the-street had access - as the program was only made available to people on a certain vendors' contract |
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| 17:17.34 | SpeedEvil | I see no problem with that. |
| 17:17.39 | SpeedEvil | And think it's a good thing. |
| 17:17.54 | SpeedEvil | If someone wants to make an open-source clone, go for it. |
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| 17:18.23 | andylockran | fair enough. I personally think it'd annoy the hell out of consumers on other contracts |
| 17:18.44 | SpeedEvil | I have no problem at all with it - as long as it's clearly explained to the user at purchase time. |
| 17:19.09 | SpeedEvil | andred_: being annoyed is not a reason why you should be able to use someones work without their permission. |
| 17:20.04 | andylockran | I'm not saying that.. what I'm saying is that given the developers have spent so long on developing the hardware and the OS for the moko - shouldn't the application developers pay them back by sharing their software with them too |
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| 17:20.13 | SpeedEvil | No. |
| 17:20.19 | SpeedEvil | Absolutely not. |
| 17:20.46 | SpeedEvil | Users must have the choice of installing open-source or non-open-source. |
| 17:21.16 | *** part/#openmoko thseiler (n=Thomas@195.176.215.22) |
| 17:21.36 | andylockran | I take your point, though I don't personally agree with it. |
| 17:21.39 | SpeedEvil | However, if there are compelling apps, which took many man-years of development to develop, and won't ever appear open-source, should you ban users from using them? |
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| 17:23.07 | SpeedEvil | Say - for example - a really good speaker independant voice recogniser that transcribed all your incoming calls, for example. |
| 17:23.15 | andylockran | no, I don't think you should ban them. what I was saying is you should pre-empt that "man-years of development" by specifying the license before the hardware is released. My thoughts don't relate to the neo itself - I was using it as a hypothetical object.. but your point remains valid |
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| 17:23.49 | SpeedEvil | Hardware on which I cannot run commercial apps reduces my freedom as to what I can do with it. |
| 17:24.31 | SpeedEvil | Just as much as hardware that can only run closed-source apps. |
| 17:25.22 | mjr | incorrect |
| 17:25.31 | kdean06 | Free Software gives users freedom - it also gives them freedom to run non-free apps, and it would stop being Free Software is that was prevented. |
| 17:25.36 | SpeedEvil | Well - not just as much. |
| 17:25.41 | mjr | indeed |
| 17:25.56 | SpeedEvil | But in practice, I have no freedom to write certain apps. |
| 17:26.16 | SpeedEvil | For example, a speaker independant voice recognition library, as I don't have 20 years spare. |
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| 17:31.59 | balrog-kun | GPL already reduces your freedom a bit as to what you can link the code with, so i can see a valid argument in reducing the freedom further to disallow proprietary apps on top of linux |
| 17:32.54 | balrog-kun | bsd has no such restriction, GPL attempts to find some optimal place between the two extremes |
| 17:33.21 | balrog-kun | that's why linus doesn't want to go with GPL v3, he thinks the restrictions go too far alreayd in it |
| 17:35.33 | CVirus | the mailing lists are so active today |
| 17:35.35 | SpeedEvil | Personally, I want to have the freedom to buy OpenMoko on a device locked to one provider, and maybe even with a phone vendors approved software only on it (which list I can view first). If they are willing to subsidise it significantly. |
| 17:35.56 | SpeedEvil | Also the freedom to buy an unsubsidised one, and only run open source. |
| 17:40.39 | kdean06 | balrog-kun, Without attempting to start a flamewar on the subject, there are a proverbial buttload of people who consider the GPL's restrictions as unacceptable in Free Software. |
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| 17:43.57 | CVirus | stupid debates on the list |
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| 18:09.21 | balrog-kun | kdean06: exactly |
| 18:09.37 | balrog-kun | most notably thow who grew up with bsd or other software |
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| 18:10.01 | kdean06 | I grew up with Windows and Mac. :) I still prefer ISC/BSD. :) |
| 18:10.23 | balrog-kun | similarly the restriction of running closed-source on OpenMoko seems unacceptable for many people who use Linux, e.g. SpeedEvil |
| 18:10.41 | balrog-kun | but if GPL had the restriction from the beginning it would probably be ok with us |
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| 18:13.52 | wurp2 | kdean06: terminology quibble: Free Software is a term invented by Stallman explicitly for GPLed software, and other software that ensures that the end user has access to source for any software he gets |
| 18:14.15 | wurp2 | So I would replace Free Software with Open Source and then agree with what you said about acceptability of GPL :-) |
| 18:14.16 | teprrr | balrog-kun, gpl doesn't reduce your freedom to link, it just limits how you can redistribute it |
| 18:15.00 | mjr | wurp2, actually no, that term would be "copyleft" |
| 18:15.15 | teprrr | free software consists from much more than just GPLd software, yes |
| 18:15.29 | wurp2 | mjr: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_software |
| 18:16.37 | kdean06 | wurp2, I see your point, but disagree with using Open Source since it's (historically) Free Software (according to Bruce) and also because there's an established connotation to it as well. I use the term "Libre" and when I say "Free Software" I mean software that meets Stallman's criterion. :) But I am sure you know that. |
| 18:17.29 | wurp2 | kdean06: when you say Free Software you mean software that meets Stallman's criterion? |
| 18:17.31 | *** join/#openmoko ajbrun (n=ajbrun@86.157.22.208) |
| 18:17.54 | wurp2 | because e.g. BSD doesn't meet the criterion I'm referring to |
| 18:18.13 | balrog-kun | fsf has a list of approved opensource licenses |
| 18:18.18 | wurp2 | nor does public domain software |
| 18:18.18 | balrog-kun | i think BSD is one of them? |
| 18:18.28 | balrog-kun | public domain obviously doesn't |
| 18:18.45 | wurp2 | there is a list of Free Software compatible license |
| 18:18.46 | wurp2 | s |
| 18:19.02 | wurp2 | and I can see how BSD should be on that list |
| 18:19.14 | wurp2 | but I wouldn't think it would be listed as Free Software as the FSF defines it |
| 18:19.29 | wurp2 | because you can add to it, close the source & distribute the binary |
| 18:19.30 | so_solid_moo | FSF lists both original and the modified BSD licenses as free |
| 18:19.31 | JanC | Free Software compatible != Free Software |
| 18:19.37 | kdean06 | wurp2, Richard does consider BSD and public domain to be Free Software - he just considers them "less than ideal" because they're not copyleft. The criteria I am referring to are freedoms 0-3 |
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| 18:20.38 | wurp2 | kdean06: reading up on it; stupid fsf web server is slow... |
| 18:21.26 | wurp2 | hmm, I think I see your point |
| 18:21.47 | wurp2 | BSD satisfies 3 because as long as the SW you get is under BSD, you can do what freedom 3 sayd |
| 18:21.51 | kdean06 | wurp2, "Free Software definition" from GNU.org -> http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/free-sw.html and FSF's list of Free Software licenses. :) http://www.fsf.org/licensing/licenses/ |
| 18:21.52 | wurp2 | s/sayd/says/ |
| 18:22.04 | wurp2 | kdean06: that's where I am |
| 18:22.42 | wurp2 | I agree kdean06, mjr. Thanks for correcting my understanding of it. |
| 18:22.50 | PBeck | hi |
| 18:23.00 | wurp2 | I thunk that Free Software required that it 'stayed free' |
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| 18:24.03 | CIA-1 | openmoko: 03sameo * r3816 10/developers/sameo/patches/ar6k-atheros-2.0/ (atheros_2_0_function.patch atheros_2_0_hcd.patch): |
| 18:24.03 | CIA-1 | openmoko: ar6k-atheros-2.0: Disable scan filtering. |
| 18:24.03 | CIA-1 | openmoko: We can now get the scan results without calling funky ioctls. |
| 18:24.13 | kdean06 | Well, it sort of does... But it sort of doesn't. Copyright law says you can't change the license of a work unless you own it so even a BSD library used in Windows is still Free Software - but the derivative work is not. The BSD library is still Free and always will be. |
| 18:24.26 | wurp2 | in which case, though, public domain is also Free Software, assuming that you can get access to the source |
| 18:24.34 | kdean06 | It is. :) |
| 18:24.48 | kdean06 | Or... |
| 18:25.13 | kdean06 | The FSF officially says it's not Free or non-free since it's totally unlicensed. It is functionally free. |
| 18:25.19 | kdean06 | (and GPL compatible. :) ) |
| 18:25.24 | wurp2 | kdean06: Are you saying that I can't provide a way for licensees to re-license my software in its license? |
| 18:25.32 | wurp2 | 'cause that sounds wrong to me |
| 18:25.35 | kdean06 | wurp2, You can, since you own it. :) |
| 18:25.52 | wurp2 | I thought essentially that BSD did just that |
| 18:25.53 | kdean06 | But you can't relicense someone elses work unless they specifically license you that right. |
| 18:25.59 | wurp2 | surely |
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| 18:26.51 | wurp2 | lemme go read the BSD license :-) |
| 18:26.51 | kdean06 | BSD license does not allow relicensing since you must ALWAYS attribute the author's contribution - but the license does NOT prohibit your from using the application without providing your modified sources. |
| 18:28.01 | *** part/#openmoko behdad (n=behdad@32.60.107.139) |
| 18:29.01 | kdean06 | The GPL "simplifies" things by making "all this software one license", the GPL. BSD works can be used in a proprietary application in which case the application is both (say) EULA + BSD since the BSD does not prohibit distribution without sources. :P The shortest answer is "BSD lets you use it how you want" as long as you always recognize that it's not "your" work. |
| 18:30.09 | kdean06 | But I suppose this discussion is probably off-topic here. :P |
| 18:34.43 | *** join/#openmoko mbuf (n=mbuf@59.92.32.189) |
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| 18:50.28 | *** join/#openmoko idioterna (n=jype@dialup-42.kiss.uni-lj.si) |
| 18:50.31 | idioterna | re |
| 18:53.15 | RayDar | re |
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| 18:58.46 | idioterna | i've just received my neo and i'm setting up to flash it with the december 01 stuff on the wiki |
| 18:58.54 | *** join/#openmoko loufoque (n=loufoque@140.77.129.15) |
| 18:58.56 | idioterna | apparently, my bootloader is r8 and these are r9 |
| 18:59.24 | idioterna | this probably means i have to flash i-boot as well? |
| 18:59.28 | idioterna | er, u-boot |
| 19:02.01 | RayDar | idioterna: I also just got my phone. How did you figure out the u-boot version? |
| 19:02.28 | idioterna | hold the AUX button and power it on by holding the power button |
| 19:02.41 | idioterna | and it powers up into the boot menu |
| 19:02.55 | idioterna | it displays the u-boot version at the top |
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| 19:03.29 | idioterna | according to the wiki at http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Flashing_openmoko it's wrong to flash a mismatching version |
| 19:04.04 | RayDar | do |
| 19:04.06 | RayDar | doh |
| 19:04.25 | wurp2 | idioterna: True, but the uboot version you get with the phone is almost certainly compatible with any recent rootfs and kernel |
| 19:04.37 | wurp2 | and it's dangerous to flash your uboot if you don't have a debug board |
| 19:05.00 | idioterna | yeah, that's what i wanted to ask |
| 19:05.10 | wurp2 | I got my phone 2 weeks ago, and I just flashed the latest kernel & rootfs I could find, and it works fine |
| 19:05.19 | idioterna | if i flash this recent root and kernel i can still flash a different version |
| 19:05.24 | wurp2 | Worst case, you flash the kernel & rootfs on there and it doesn't work |
| 19:05.38 | idioterna | and if i bugger up i-boot, i'll need to find somebody with a debug board? |
| 19:05.54 | balrog-kun | idioterna: right |
| 19:06.00 | wurp2 | so you 'nand clean rootfs' (never nand clean w/o an argument) and install another kernel & rootfs |
| 19:06.02 | idioterna | yeah, makes sense, just wanted to confirm that |
| 19:06.08 | *** join/#openmoko k-s[WORK] (n=gustavo@200.184.118.132) |
| 19:06.16 | balrog-kun | idioterna: u-boot tends to not change much, the interfaces are standard so an old u-boot should be still usable with new kernel/rootfs |
| 19:06.48 | KrisAbsinthe | newer U-boot(after a certain version) contain the GSM terminal though |
| 19:07.13 | balrog-kun | newer versions for sure have many things fixed, but they are not things you can't live without |
| 19:08.05 | idioterna | where should i look for a recent build? |
| 19:08.27 | idioterna | wiki references http://downloads.openmoko.org/snapshots/2007.11/images/neo1973/ |
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| 19:09.30 | balrog-kun | official daily snapshots are not beign built for u-boot, there are unofficial ones at buildhost.automated.it |
| 19:10.56 | RayDar | idioterna: Wow, I cannot match the U-Boot numbers shown on my boot screen to anything at http://buildhost.automated.it/OM2007.2/?M=D |
| 19:11.32 | idioterna | apparently you don't really have to |
| 19:13.22 | mmontour | The warnings about a "matched" u-boot probably refer to the machine type, e.g. making sure you use one that says "gta01bv4" if that's the model of phone that you have |
| 19:13.48 | balrog-kun | KrisAbsinthe: which is actually unusable |
| 19:13.53 | RayDar | idioterna: But I am wondering if I should update the u-boot. Since I cannot match up the numbers, I cannot tell whether it is newer or not. |
| 19:14.13 | idioterna | you shouldn't and don't really need to |
| 19:14.29 | balrog-kun | RayDar: part of the version string should be the date |
| 19:14.32 | idioterna | if you mess up flashin kernel or rootfs, you can always recover by clearing nand kernel and nand root-fs |
| 19:14.55 | idioterna | but if you mess up u-boot, you're going to need the debug board to recover |
| 19:15.20 | RayDar | I have debug board. I am sure it will be fun figuring out how to use it. |
| 19:15.27 | idioterna | oh :) |
| 19:15.41 | mmontour | I have an unofficial build at http://members.shaw.ca/mmontour/u-boot/ that I recommend for anyone with a debug board (as insurance - I don't expect people to have problems) |
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| 19:17.00 | balrog-kun | which was only potentially useful because it always did run |
| 19:17.06 | RayDar | I wonder which bv I have |
| 19:17.07 | idioterna | when you flash u-boot, do you also have to clear nand u-boot first? |
| 19:17.21 | balrog-kun | idioterna: with dfu-util nope |
| 19:17.37 | idioterna | ok |
| 19:18.49 | RayDar | idioterna: The date on my u-boot (just got the phone) is 19-May-2007. Seems kinda old. That's probably why the dialer doesn't work. |
| 19:19.19 | idioterna | yep, mine's the same |
| 19:19.37 | balrog-kun | no, u-boot doesn't touch the modem, dialer not working can't be related to u-boot |
| 19:20.05 | RayDar | oh |
| 19:20.31 | RayDar | well then. |
| 19:20.58 | *** part/#openmoko mbuf (n=mbuf@59.92.32.189) |
| 19:21.21 | RayDar | I thought I read somewhere that newer u-boots could make phone calls and older ones couldn't |
| 19:22.21 | balrog-kun | RayDar: i think newer rootfs or newer dialer/gsmd? |
| 19:22.37 | balrog-kun | really the connection between dialer and u-boot if there is any is not a traightforward one |
| 19:23.03 | kdean06 | I was just thinking... Is there a "debug board" locater? :) I didn't get the debug board because I didn't realize that I couldn't recover from failed u-boot flashes without it, so I was wondering where the 'nearest' one was in the event of rare emergencies. |
| 19:23.49 | balrog-kun | you can try at http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/OpenMoko_Local_Groups :) |
| 19:24.19 | kdean06 | Oh, awesome. Duh. |
| 19:24.20 | kdean06 | Thanks. |
| 19:24.57 | mmontour | At one point there was a change to the u-boot environment that helped GSM - removing the "console=ttyACM0,115200" statement from the kernel boot parameters. I don't know if that's still required. |
| 19:26.06 | wurp2 | idioterna, RayDar: a few days ago someone was having dialer problems in this chat room |
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| 19:26.23 | wurp2 | You might look in the history and see if you can find the rootfs they switched to that fixed it for them |
| 19:26.28 | balrog-kun | mmontour: yeah, but if you update only u-boot the environment stays |
| 19:26.31 | wurp2 | I'm pretty sure they said which one worked |
| 19:26.52 | idioterna | i'm about to flash the latest scaredycat images |
| 19:27.20 | wurp2 | Yeah, it's quick enough that there's not much reason to avoid just trying them |
| 19:27.29 | RayDar | idioterna: I flashed the latest scaredycat images yesterday. They are much more feature filled than the ones that came with it. |
| 19:27.31 | mmontour | Yes, but that's the only u-boot/dialer connection I can think of. |
| 19:27.39 | RayDar | idioterna: But, the dialer doesn't seem to work. |
| 19:28.18 | mmontour | The other thing is that if you have a really old u-boot and forget the "nand erase rootfs" before flashing a new image, stuff can break in strange ways |
| 19:28.31 | RayDar | wurp2: Thanks for the suggestion. I haven't been on here a few days. |
| 19:29.10 | idioterna | RayDar: with scaredycat images? |
| 19:29.39 | wurp2 | mmontour: Are you saying that some newer uboot eliminated the need to nand erase rootfs ? |
| 19:29.51 | idioterna | wurp2: the wiki says so, too |
| 19:29.59 | wurp2 | cool! |
| 19:30.00 | idioterna | regarding erasing nand |
| 19:30.18 | RayDar | idioterna: Yeah, I installed the 06-Jan Scaredycat stuff and my dialer doesn't work. |
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| 19:31.05 | mmontour | Yes, newer u-boots do not require the "nand erase rootfs" command. |
| 19:31.19 | idioterna | where do i get a recent but well tested u-boot? |
| 19:31.23 | RayDar | Grrrr, I cannot try manual dialing because neither cu nor socat is installed. |
| 19:31.36 | balrog-kun | RayDar: the aren't more feature filled than current official images, but are more feature filled than any 8 months old images |
| 19:32.21 | idioterna | where are current official images? |
| 19:32.34 | idioterna | at downloads.openmoko.org? |
| 19:32.53 | balrog-kun | buildhost.o.o/daily/ or similar |
| 19:33.18 | idioterna | k, thanx, let me try those |
| 19:33.58 | RayDar | the wiki directed me to http://buildhost.openmoko.org/OM2007.2/tmp/deploy/glibc/images/neo1973/?C=M;O=D (11-November images) but the scaredycat images I installed had more features. |
| 19:34.09 | RayDar | but of course, I have yet to see it make a call |
| 19:34.36 | idioterna | hmm, there's a gta02 image as well |
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| 19:35.23 | idioterna | i suppose none of you like questions about it, but... is it likely gta02 will support 3G or edge? |
| 19:35.33 | mmontour | RayDar: make sure you aren't in an area with only 850-MHz coverage, and check that you have a supported SIM (see bug #666) |
| 19:35.39 | mjr | idioterna, it is sure not to |
| 19:35.50 | idioterna | oh |
| 19:36.07 | idioterna | well, i guess the wifi will do as well |
| 19:37.33 | idioterna | what is the difference between OpenMoko-openmoko-devel-image-glibc-ipk-P1-Snapshot-20080111-fic-gta01.rootfs.jffs2 and openmoko-devel-image-fic-gta01.jffs2 ? |
| 19:37.39 | wurp2 | RayDar: can't you use lib-gsmdtool? |
| 19:39.39 | RayDar | idioterna: Good question |
| 19:40.07 | RayDar | idioterna: I too would like to know. The last one I flashed didn't have the glibc stuff in it. |
| 19:40.21 | idioterna | well the one with "glibc" in the filename is bound to have it :) |
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| 19:42.17 | mickeyl | one is a symlink |
| 19:42.19 | RayDar | idioterna: What I meant was that last time, (when I flashed scaredycat), I used a filename that didn't include glibc. I don't know what the differences is between the two images or which I should use. |
| 19:42.39 | mickeyl | no difference. openmoko-devel-image-fic-gta01.jffs2 just links to the latest |
| 19:43.01 | idioterna | aha, thanks |
| 19:43.17 | idioterna | this explains exactly the same bytesize |
| 19:45.06 | wurp2 | RayDar: for manual dailing, try libgsmd-tool |
| 19:45.40 | wurp2 | Oh, and if you just got a neo, read http://openmoko.togaware.com/survivor/openmoko.html |
| 19:45.58 | wurp2 | Some of it is out of date, but it's the only user manual type thing I've seen |
| 19:46.41 | RayDar | wurp2: Thanks. I did just get it. libgsmd-tool just hangs after saying that the program is free. |
| 19:48.35 | RayDar | I'll try flashing the two latest files from http://buildhost.openmoko.org/daily/neo1973/deploy/glibc/images/neo1973/ |
| 19:48.40 | RayDar | maybe that will do the trick. |
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| 19:51.58 | RayDar | who knows |
| 19:52.20 | RayDar | It would be nice to verify that the GSM on this new phone works. |
| 19:52.55 | idioterna | btw, what do i do with modules? |
| 19:53.05 | idioterna | i flashed the kernel, where do i put modules? |
| 19:53.22 | RayDar | idioterna: I think I read somewhere that you don't need to do anything with them.... but I am SuperNewbie |
| 19:53.25 | mmontour | The rootfs image should have all of the required modules already. |
| 19:53.45 | idioterna | makes sense |
| 19:53.52 | idioterna | why the separate tarball? |
| 19:54.31 | mmontour | Probably historical reasons. |
| 19:55.54 | wurp2 | RayDar: libgsmd-tool is an interactive tool |
| 19:56.01 | wurp2 | It will hang waiting for user input |
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| 19:57.28 | RayDar | wurp2: Oh. There was no prompt. I guess I should type a question mark. I will try that after this flash. |
| 19:57.42 | wurp2 | RayDar: see http://openmoko.togaware.com/survivor/Command_Line0.html |
| 19:57.54 | wurp2 | yeah, it's misleading |
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| 20:00.08 | RayDar | wurp2: Also, the instructions say to turn off the gsmd however if it is off, libgsmd-tool errors saying that it cannot connect to the gsmd |
| 20:01.07 | idioterna | where do i get a recent official u-boot? |
| 20:01.17 | RayDar | idioterna: Good question. |
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| 20:02.24 | RayDar | mmontour mentioned his unofficial uboot |
| 20:02.32 | mmontour | idioterna: no such thing as far as I know. I think there was one as part of the November snapshot (2007.11) but it has bugs |
| 20:03.08 | idioterna | i'm now flashing latest official stuff over the may 19 2007 u-boot |
| 20:03.40 | RayDar | idioterna: U and I are in the same boat. |
| 20:03.54 | idioterna | except for the debug board :) |
| 20:03.54 | mickeyl | fwiw, i think we can soon release a new stable u-boot |
| 20:04.27 | idioterna | mickeyl: is a recent build of that code available? |
| 20:04.43 | mickeyl | i can do one for you |
| 20:04.46 | mickeyl | but it'll be untested |
| 20:04.50 | RayDar | neat, someone from the coreteam! |
| 20:04.50 | mickeyl | i have no time to reflash uboot atm. |
| 20:05.18 | idioterna | yeah, i don't have the debug board so |
| 20:05.23 | idioterna | i'll ask RayDar to test it for me :) |
| 20:05.30 | RayDar | OK, newest kernel and rootfs... same old 19-May uboot..... let's see what happens |
| 20:05.53 | idioterna | mickeyl: if it won't take too much time, i'd appreciate it |
| 20:05.59 | idioterna | of your time, i mean |
| 20:06.31 | mickeyl | no worries, should not take longer than 5 min |
| 20:06.39 | mmontour | mickeyl: the current u-boot-openmoko_svn.bb is good except for #799, the boot-from-SD crash. |
| 20:07.28 | *** join/#openmoko StarKnight (n=StarKnig@pdpc/supporter/active/StarKnight) |
| 20:07.33 | mmontour | The patch I attached to that bug gives me 100% reliable boots from SD, but I am reluctant to call it a "fix" since I never found what was wrong with the original code. |
| 20:07.59 | mickeyl | oh |
| 20:08.02 | mickeyl | !ombug 799 |
| 20:08.03 | cdbot2 | * * Bug 799, Status: NEW, Created: Unknown |
| 20:08.04 | cdbot2 | * * obri(AT)chaostreff.ch: data abort while reading from SD Cards |
| 20:08.06 | cdbot2 | * * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=799 |
| 20:08.36 | mickeyl | fun patch |
| 20:08.48 | idioterna | do i need to reflash kernel and fs if i flash u-boot ? |
| 20:08.57 | mickeyl | not necessary |
| 20:09.09 | RayDar | different partition |
| 20:11.09 | mickeyl | i guess i should apply this patch |
| 20:11.13 | mickeyl | Obri: ping |
| 20:11.18 | mickeyl | Obri: does it fix it for you as well? |
| 20:11.26 | *** join/#openmoko orion_ (n=orion@124-171-229-224.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 20:12.05 | NineX | mmontour: thx |
| 20:12.57 | *** join/#openmoko dkirker (n=dkirker@pcp022158pcs.dhcp.calpoly.edu) |
| 20:13.22 | RayDar | Hmmmm, libgsmd-tool reports "Netreg registration denied" after a AT+COPS command |
| 20:13.45 | *** join/#openmoko peje (n=peje@13-2.76-83.cust.bluewin.ch) |
| 20:15.36 | mmontour | BTW, there is a minor cosmetic issue with the newest u-boots - the splash screen is somewhat distorted because a byte-swap video setting was changed. This can be resolved by flashing a new splashscreen and updating the u-boot environment. |
| 20:15.42 | *** join/#openmoko j_ack (n=j_ack@dsbg-4db7bbfa.pool.einsundeins.de) |
| 20:15.47 | mickeyl | yea |
| 20:15.54 | mickeyl | we swapped native byte order |
| 20:16.15 | mickeyl | updateing the enviroment? |
| 20:17.20 | mmontour | From the post I saw on the u-boot list, the new image doesn't compress as well and overflowed the size specified in the "nand read" command (although it still fits easily into the splash partition) |
| 20:17.31 | *** join/#openmoko andlo (n=andlo@87.60.126.34) |
| 20:17.39 | mickeyl | oh, really? |
| 20:17.41 | mickeyl | that's nasty |
| 20:18.01 | mickeyl | unfortunately we can't distribute environments |
| 20:18.32 | mickeyl | neither can we access them safely from within linux |
| 20:18.51 | mmontour | Quoting: "Since the new image now compresses slightly worse, we also need to increase the read size in the "splashimage" command (from 0x5000 to 0x5100)" |
| 20:19.50 | mickeyl | oops, so much for my attention when reading werner's mails |
| 20:19.52 | mickeyl | *g* |
| 20:20.57 | mickeyl | http://buildhost.vanille.de/fic-gta01/tmp/deploy/glibc/images/neo1973/u-boot-gta01bv4-1.3.1%2bgit20080111%2bsvnr3798-r0.bin |
| 20:21.06 | mickeyl | bleeding edge |
| 20:21.08 | mickeyl | handle with care |
| 20:21.17 | idioterna | thanks |
| 20:21.20 | mickeyl | np |
| 20:22.13 | idioterna | i'll wait for someone with a debug board to confirm it works |
| 20:22.26 | idioterna | RayDar: please? :) |
| 20:22.29 | *** join/#openmoko zdanek (n=zdanek@ams122.internetdsl.tpnet.pl) |
| 20:22.37 | zdanek | greetings all |
| 20:23.04 | *** join/#openmoko miip (n=miip@p54A5561C.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 20:23.06 | mmontour | It doesn't look that bad with the old splashimage. You could probably distribute the new u-boot version with manual instructions for those who want to fix their own devices (in keeping with the "developer preview" theme of GTA01) |
| 20:23.15 | RayDar | idioterna: I will try it after I confirm that my GSM works. I keep getting "Netreg registration denied" |
| 20:23.44 | idioterna | i confirm that the dialer doesn't work for me with the latest official daily build with the may 19 2007 u-boot |
| 20:23.44 | idioterna | aha |
| 20:23.44 | idioterna | well mine registered alright but outgoing call doesn't get through |
| 20:23.44 | idioterna | i'll try calling in |
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| 20:24.42 | mickeyl | netreg denied sounds dialer has still problems with PIN request? |
| 20:24.49 | mickeyl | +like |
| 20:26.11 | RayDar | mickeyl: I am using libgsmd-tool |
| 20:26.23 | idioterna | dialin worked halfway |
| 20:26.52 | idioterna | the phone rang but after i answered it just waited and the calling phone kept playing the ringing tone |
| 20:29.25 | mickeyl | RayDar: oh |
| 20:29.32 | mickeyl | RayDar: did it ask you for a PIN? |
| 20:29.46 | RayDar | mickeyl: Nope |
| 20:29.56 | RayDar | mickeyl: AFAIK, there is no pin on the SIM. |
| 20:31.09 | mickeyl | oh |
| 20:31.18 | mickeyl | registration denied even without a PIN |
| 20:31.20 | mickeyl | that's odd |
| 20:31.33 | mjr | can there be no pin? (ah well, I dunno) |
| 20:31.41 | mickeyl | well |
| 20:31.52 | mickeyl | to be safe, try it manually |
| 20:31.55 | idioterna | yes |
| 20:31.57 | mickeyl | kill gsmd |
| 20:32.04 | mickeyl | power on modem |
| 20:32.06 | mickeyl | and speak AT |
| 20:32.09 | idioterna | the sim card can be configured not to require a pin |
| 20:32.18 | *** join/#openmoko andrunko (n=andrunko@200.184.118.132) |
| 20:32.53 | idioterna | is it possible the dialer would work with a newer u-boot? probably not, right? |
| 20:33.12 | mickeyl | u-boot should have no effect whatsoever on the modem |
| 20:33.16 | *** join/#openmoko zell1983 (n=zell1983@host176-125-dynamic.24-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 20:33.20 | idioterna | yeah |
| 20:34.02 | NineX | how to build u-boot-openmoko_svn using MokoMakefile ? :S |
| 20:35.17 | RayDar | I have been speaking AT via libgsmd-tool |
| 20:35.43 | *** join/#openmoko doc|home (n=doc@gentoo/contributor/doc-007) |
| 20:35.55 | roh | NineX cd build |
| 20:36.08 | roh | <PROTECTED> |
| 20:36.34 | roh | bitbake -b u-boot-openmoko_svn |
| 20:36.41 | NineX | done |
| 20:36.44 | NineX | what next? |
| 20:37.12 | NineX | danm lags |
| 20:37.27 | roh | well.. your new uboot is where it always is.. build/tmp/deploy/glibc/images/ |
| 20:37.38 | roh | eh neo1973 at the end |
| 20:37.50 | NineX | roh: thx |
| 20:38.10 | NineX | me will test new uboot wit mmontour patch with workaround |
| 20:38.22 | roh | you have a debugboard? |
| 20:38.57 | RayDar | OMG this is frustrating |
| 20:39.04 | NineX | roh: sure |
| 20:39.24 | roh | NineX :) |
| 20:39.55 | NineX | roh: and some expirience with unbricking my neo so don't worry |
| 20:40.16 | roh | RayDar what is? |
| 20:40.56 | RayDar | roh: I am trying to dial (currently using libgsmd-tool) |
| 20:46.38 | NineX | fuck |
| 20:46.49 | NineX | mmontour: can you create corect patch? |
| 20:48.14 | mmontour | NineX: what's the problem? |
| 20:48.39 | RayDar | It was that I didn't have my SIM locked in. |
| 20:49.44 | idioterna | er. |
| 20:50.00 | idioterna | there are right-left arrows under my signal strength icon |
| 20:50.08 | idioterna | doesn't that mean i'm connected to GPRS? |
| 20:50.46 | *** join/#openmoko marsan (n=marsan@ti500720a080-2584.bb.online.no) |
| 20:51.47 | RayDar | Yipee! I just made a call! |
| 20:51.53 | RayDar | my first call! |
| 20:52.06 | idioterna | did it work? |
| 20:52.19 | idioterna | mine doesn't seem to work |
| 20:52.38 | rwhitby | roh: have you guys considered an overlay read-write filesystem over a read-only boot filesystem to improve the boot times (re the discussion on openmoko-kernel to get the boot to 20s) ? |
| 20:52.48 | RayDar | idioterna: Yes. I talked with the person at the other end. There was a slight echo, but that might not be the phone. |
| 20:53.17 | idioterna | i've now sent me an sms |
| 20:53.37 | idioterna | but the phone just popped up "connected to network yaddayadda" |
| 20:53.55 | rwhitby | OpenWrt does it, and it works really well - they boot from read-only squashfs, and have a tmpfs overlay during boot. Then after the jffs2 has finally mounted in the background, it is swapped with the tmpfs. |
| 20:53.59 | mjr | RayDar, if you mean echo for the other person, it is the Neo, possibly some mixer tweak needed |
| 20:54.34 | idioterna | RayDar: are you willing to test the mickey's u-boot image? |
| 20:54.49 | rwhitby | LaF0rge, mickey|bbl: has an overlay filesystem been considered and already discounted for increasing boot times? |
| 20:55.01 | roh | rwhitby i just explained what other embedded distros do. |
| 20:55.10 | mjr | I'm not sure why we want to increase boot time |
| 20:55.15 | borg_ | RayDar: if you install a bleeding edge rootfs there is no echo anymore |
| 20:55.19 | mmontour | NineX: the patch at http://members.shaw.ca/mmontour/u-boot/om799-workaround.patch should work if added to the SRC_URI as "file://om799-workaround.patch;patch=1 \" |
| 20:55.25 | borg_ | there is a new alsa state that fixes it |
| 20:55.25 | roh | ive seen jffs2 /squashfs with overlay at openwrt and seperate with onloy /var writeable at some stb |
| 20:55.39 | borg_ | i just tested it some minutes ago |
| 20:55.41 | rwhitby | s/increasing/decreasing/ |
| 20:56.08 | mjr | borg_, ooh, no? have to upgrade the state file for test... |
| 20:56.37 | rwhitby | roh: ok, as long as the idea is in the ring already then I'm happy. |
| 20:57.00 | rwhitby | (I haven't read all the overnight email yet, and wanted to throw this in before I forgot) |
| 20:57.49 | borg_ | mjr: alsa-state_0.1.0-r9 |
| 20:57.57 | mjr | ack |
| 20:58.05 | *** join/#openmoko fobos (n=fobos@78.90.88.244) |
| 20:59.39 | roh | rwhitby logfs ubifs and yaffs2 are also still in the ring i think (till they fall due to results of discussions, docs or evaluation) |
| 20:59.53 | rwhitby | roh: excellent |
| 21:00.14 | roh | ubifs looks quite nice from the outside.. like jffs2 done right.. do oyu know some platform which uses it already? |
| 21:02.08 | rwhitby | no, I only know of squashfs/mini_fo overlay |
| 21:04.00 | RayDar | I think I blew up the contacts app |
| 21:04.24 | *** join/#openmoko _rob (n=rob@85.233.59.8.static.cablesurf.de) |
| 21:04.42 | zdanek | guys, I made fresh flash with lastest OM build but I have no sound |
| 21:04.45 | RayDar | mjr: We both heard an echo. I am not sure which phone was responsible (if any). |
| 21:04.58 | zdanek | root@fic-gta01:/media/card$ alsactl -f /etc/stereoout.state restore |
| 21:04.58 | zdanek | alsactl: load_state:1327: No soundcards found... |
| 21:05.09 | zdanek | what's going on? any ideas? |
| 21:06.22 | RayDar | idioterna: I will eventually get to it. |
| 21:07.42 | *** join/#openmoko TimRiker (n=timr@70-7-107-118.area7.spcsdns.net) |
| 21:10.49 | idioterna | RayDar: thanks, just drop a note here so i know it's safe to flash |
| 21:10.57 | RayDar | zedstar: Great job! |
| 21:11.25 | RayDar | I can't figure out how to read incoming SMSs |
| 21:11.43 | zedstar | not tried sms yet :) |
| 21:12.00 | *** join/#openmoko buz (n=buz@84-74-88-75.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 21:12.02 | mmontour | zdanek: what does "lsmod" show? Does your kernel version match your rootfs modules? |
| 21:15.31 | zdanek | mmontour: i got plenty of snd* modules downloaded |
| 21:15.54 | zdanek | I installed rootfs and kernel from the same source and date |
| 21:16.00 | zdanek | it should match |
| 21:18.59 | *** join/#openmoko zween (n=zween@78-86-213-209.zone2.bethere.co.uk) |
| 21:19.13 | RayDar | Looks like outgoing SMS's work but darned if I can figure out how to read incoming messages. |
| 21:23.19 | zdanek | so, no ideas |
| 21:23.29 | zdanek | ok, I'll try other ver |
| 21:23.48 | *** part/#openmoko zdanek (n=zdanek@ams122.internetdsl.tpnet.pl) |
| 21:30.58 | mmontour | ideoterna: I just tested mickeyl's u-boot build. It worked for me booting from NAND flash (but not from the SD card). |
| 21:33.25 | *** join/#openmoko thseiler (n=Thomas@zux221-153-000.adsl.green.ch) |
| 21:33.27 | idioterna | aha |
| 21:37.25 | roh | mmontour sdcard booting is broken afaik |
| 21:37.38 | roh | clearly a regression |
| 21:37.52 | mmontour | roh: Not in my builds :-) |
| 21:38.33 | roh | mmontour oh.. you got a patch for that? |
| 21:38.35 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive_ (n=goxboxli@81.80-202-132.nextgentel.com) |
| 21:38.38 | *** join/#openmoko playya (n=playya@p508B034B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 21:40.02 | mmontour | See the attachment to ombug #799 |
| 21:40.23 | idioterna | dialing works for me, though i do get the echo somebody spoke of earlier |
| 21:40.42 | idioterna | but messages just seem to get lost |
| 21:40.48 | mmontour | That patch may not apply directly due to path issues, but it's just a 1-line change. |
| 21:41.40 | idioterna | btw, how do i change the time? |
| 21:42.16 | idioterna | ah, ipkg install ntpdate seems to just work |
| 21:42.37 | *** join/#openmoko Ryback_ (n=ulisses@200.184.118.132) |
| 21:42.49 | roh | mmontour thats all? the string gets too long? |
| 21:42.55 | roh | doh |
| 21:44.08 | mmontour | roh: I don't know what's wrong with the original code. It looks like it should work, but somehow the stack ends up corrupted. Using the fixed-size buffer works for me, so I think it should be included as a temporary workaround unless/until the real problem is found. |
| 21:44.46 | roh | i see |
| 21:44.59 | *** join/#openmoko norro (n=norro@port-87-234-155-81.dynamic.qsc.de) |
| 21:48.46 | CIA-1 | openmoko: 03laforge * r3817 10/branches/src/target/kernel/2.6.24.x/patches/gta02-sound.patch: Apply obvious copy+paste fix to gta02 sound driver (Graeme Gregory) |
| 21:49.08 | RayDar | idioterna: If you get usb networking going and you ssh into the phone, you can use date "2008-01-11 13:48:58" to set the date |
| 21:53.06 | CVirus | roh: How much fun are you having setting up the web store :-D ? |
| 21:53.23 | NineX | mmontour: works for me! :> |
| 21:54.02 | *** join/#openmoko summatusmentis (n=summatus@72.168.202.219) |
| 21:54.19 | RayDar | how do I figure out what bv number I have? |
| 21:54.28 | mmontour | NineX: good news - thanks for testing. |
| 21:55.15 | roh | mmontour i pushed werner.. its on his list now ;) |
| 21:56.04 | roh | CVirus loads.. this planet is sooo fucked up when it comes to easy stuff like 'pay a bill' or 'ship a package' when it involves more than just 2 points within a zone like eu or us |
| 21:56.14 | NineX | mmontour: n/p but you sholud fix patch on bugzilla in bugzilla path is fs/ext2/ext2fs.c , sholud be like in this link that you send me |
| 21:57.02 | CVirus | roh: I get it ... Good luck :-D |
| 22:04.30 | *** join/#openmoko baird (n=cbaird@brushtail.apana.org.au) |
| 22:06.54 | mmontour | NineX: I've updated the bugzilla patch |
| 22:10.14 | *** join/#openmoko erko (n=eolson@madden.mcs.anl.gov) |
| 22:16.13 | erko | zedstar, did you need to do anything not in the wiki to get your GPRS working? Did you need a recent openmoko version or anything? |
| 22:19.25 | SpeedEvil | erko: the 'manually using gprs' thing worked for me. |
| 22:19.33 | zedstar | erko...well i didnt use the wiki in the end... i found a script...documented just now here: http://zedstar.org/blog/2008/01/11/gprs-connection-with-openmoko/ |
| 22:19.37 | SpeedEvil | Though I last ysed it several months ago |
| 22:20.40 | zedstar | that was just 2 scripts with a couple of simple edits |
| 22:21.24 | SpeedEvil | yes |
| 22:21.53 | erko | SpeedEvil, k thanks. I haven't been able to connect to tmobile US's wap, yet (although I have got it working with my older ipaq) |
| 22:22.00 | erko | zedstar, thx for the link |
| 22:22.16 | SpeedEvil | you've got the right APN? |
| 22:22.17 | *** join/#openmoko quicksand (i=clarke@gateway/tor/x-65ca52f2d0334023) |
| 22:22.35 | zedstar | speedevil: me? |
| 22:22.37 | erko | SpeedEvil, yep, do I have to stop gsmd or anything else before running ppp? (I have tried both ways) |
| 22:23.57 | zedstar | tomorrow i hope to do my first gps micro blog from my local park! |
| 22:24.21 | SpeedEvil | I did |
| 22:24.27 | SpeedEvil | I don't know if it's needed |
| 22:24.41 | SpeedEvil | I'd post my script, but dfu-util ate it when I upgrded. |
| 22:24.42 | zedstar | i didnt need to |
| 22:25.14 | zedstar | it did fail a couple of times but didnt need to restart gsmd |
| 22:26.50 | erko | hmm, maybe I just need to retry a few times. |
| 22:27.20 | erko | zedstar, just to be safe, what version of openmoko are you currently using (when GPRS connected?) |
| 22:27.58 | zedstar | well it is one build from mokomakefile route and then ipkg update etc so recent |
| 22:28.11 | erko | ah ok, thanks |
| 22:33.04 | zedstar | brb |
| 22:35.34 | idioterna | well, mine works great, but i have no idea how to receive an SMS |
| 22:36.20 | *** join/#openmoko zedstar (n=john@82-44-200-69.cable.ubr08.haye.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 22:37.25 | *** join/#openmoko josch_ (n=josch@host132.natpool.mwn.de) |
| 22:40.00 | RayDar | idioterna: did you do the new uboot? |
| 22:40.22 | RayDar | idioterna: Mine seems to know about incoming SMS's but I cannot read them with the app. |
| 22:40.35 | *** join/#openmoko raboof (i=arnouten@vhe-520116.sshn.net) |
| 22:40.45 | *** join/#openmoko pH5 (n=ph5@p5485C154.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 22:41.32 | RayDar | idioterna: Everytime I boot it, it says there are more unread SMS messages. |
| 22:43.45 | RayDar | Fascinating: the tmobile chatscripts worked once but never again. |
| 22:43.51 | *** join/#openmoko cb23 (n=cb25@dsl-245-181-180.telkomadsl.co.za) |
| 22:45.04 | raboof | might be a faq but didn't see it anywhere: how far is the openmoko software from being a basic end-user phone? (e.g., send and receive calls through the gui, simple addressbook, missed calls and receive SMS)? |
| 22:45.17 | cb23 | rabble, this far '----------------------------------------' |
| 22:45.24 | raboof | cool, thanks! |
| 22:45.30 | cb23 | hehe :) quite far |
| 22:45.52 | cb23 | things work sometimes, but AFAIK the biggest issue is still suspend |
| 22:46.15 | raboof | right, so in practice the battery life will be sucky for now? |
| 22:46.27 | cb23 | _really_ sucky |
| 22:46.31 | raboof | ;) |
| 22:46.35 | cb23 | like blackhole sucky |
| 22:47.09 | RayDar | raboof: It has a long ways to go |
| 22:47.17 | SpeedEvil | There is actuve work ont he powersaving at the moment |
| 22:48.31 | zedstar | not had my neo disconnected from usb much so never noticed but will do now with gprs working....hopefully get a couple of hours |
| 22:48.32 | *** join/#openmoko Sirclown82 (n=Sirclown@adsl-76-231-227-192.dsl.rcsntx.sbcglobal.net) |
| 22:49.11 | raboof | there sure is a lot of good progress in the linux mobile space (trolltech, google, openmoko) - openmoko seems by far the most friendly ;0 |
| 22:49.37 | *** join/#openmoko orion_ (n=orion@124-171-229-224.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 22:50.48 | cb23 | raboof, indeed, unless you ask about GTA02... then you get kickbanned :) |
| 22:50.52 | idioterna | there's a python app for smsing but it requires quite a lot of space |
| 22:51.21 | idioterna | i asked about it earlier, and nobody bothered to get rid of me :) |
| 22:51.39 | idioterna | i guess i didn't ask the wrong questions |
| 22:51.51 | raboof | looking forward to jumping on the bandwagon once it's a little further on the way, i'm more of an application programmer, so all the hairy hardware and lowlevel driver stuff is better off in other people's hands :_) |
| 22:52.23 | idioterna | it's already amazing work |
| 22:52.34 | RayDar | raboof: Yeah, I am in the same boat as you. But then someone went and got me one as an xmas gift. |
| 22:52.38 | *** join/#openmoko C7_ (n=C7@12-39.77-83.cust.bluewin.ch) |
| 22:53.10 | zedstar | raydar wow they dont wanna speak to u on the phone that means ;) |
| 22:53.36 | idioterna | hehe |
| 22:53.49 | *** join/#openmoko wirrwarr (n=fz@ppp-62-216-207-209.dynamic.mnet-online.de) |
| 22:53.58 | RayDar | zedstar: Shows what you know. I already spoke to them on the new phone. |
| 22:54.18 | idioterna | which packages do you recommend i remove to gain enough space for python? |
| 22:56.49 | SpeedEvil | none |
| 22:56.53 | SpeedEvil | install it on the SD |
| 22:57.02 | SpeedEvil | search the wiki for ipkg-link |
| 22:57.12 | idioterna | ah |
| 22:57.57 | erko | RayDar, I increased the timeout in chatscripts/tmobile from 10 to something big like 200 (even 20 wasn't enough), and I finally got a GPRS connection. |
| 22:58.06 | erko | woo! |
| 22:58.37 | RayDar | erko: Good idea |
| 22:58.38 | zedstar | congrats erko |
| 22:59.02 | RayDar | erko: When I get a gprs connection, I haven't yet been able to do anything with it. |
| 22:59.07 | idioterna | huh? |
| 22:59.12 | SpeedEvil | route add default ppp0 |
| 22:59.37 | SpeedEvil | echo nameserver 1.2.3.4 >/etc/resolv.conf |
| 22:59.46 | RayDar | hehe just rebooted and here come the SMS's that keep piling up |
| 23:00.38 | RayDar | boy vi sux |
| 23:00.48 | idioterna | i typed poweroff in the shell and i got "angstrom" and an image of a geometric compass |
| 23:00.55 | idioterna | RayDar: watch your mouth :) |
| 23:01.15 | *** join/#openmoko freezesucker (n=fz@ppp-62-216-203-250.dynamic.mnet-online.de) |
| 23:01.21 | *** join/#openmoko edistar (n=edistar@ip503ddd09.speed.planet.nl) |
| 23:02.20 | RayDar | I would need a mirror to watch my mouth |
| 23:02.27 | mwester | idioterna: The truth is painful, often. emacs rules. |
| 23:02.58 | RayDar | meh, for small config file edits, I prefer nano |
| 23:03.13 | wurp2 | vi rules for small file edits |
| 23:03.31 | wurp2 | assuming you already know all the commands |
| 23:03.47 | RayDar | viblows |
| 23:03.54 | wurp2 | to get proficient with basic vi navigation, I recommend nethack or moria :-) |
| 23:03.56 | RayDar | so counterintuitive |
| 23:04.07 | wurp2 | Everything's on the home key |
| 23:04.24 | wurp2 | and intuition on anything more complicated than a pencil just means you've used it so much it's second nature |
| 23:04.38 | mwester | vi exists for the same reason bootloaders exist -- so that you can get the *real* stuff installed ;) |
| 23:04.40 | wurp2 | s/home key/home row/ |
| 23:04.50 | RayDar | mwester: Agreed |
| 23:04.58 | wurp2 | eh, emacs feels pretty damn heavy for file edits |
| 23:05.09 | wurp2 | I used to use it for my IDE |
| 23:05.10 | mwester | wurp2: hehe - especially for a phone. |
| 23:05.16 | wurp2 | :-) |
| 23:05.19 | RayDar | still, I think nano is a good non-real replacement for vi |
| 23:05.36 | wurp2 | honestly, I've never used nano |
| 23:05.41 | mwester | We really need a simple, basic notepad-like GUI editor for openmoko, just to make simple edits easier. |
| 23:05.49 | *** join/#openmoko twistx (n=no@64.30.190.108) |
| 23:05.52 | idioterna | vi rules for everything, but... |
| 23:06.23 | mwester | call it "mokopad"... |
| 23:06.36 | RayDar | vi was made in the days when computers didn't have a DEL key |
| 23:06.40 | wurp2 | but I dunno why I would want to learn nano when vi has sed built in, and I can type 4cw to edit the next four words, etc. |
| 23:07.05 | wurp2 | del key is not easy to reach with hands on home row |
| 23:08.06 | *** join/#openmoko HellDragon (i=jd@unaffiliated/helldragon) |
| 23:09.11 | idioterna | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pCiVCiku3cM |
| 23:09.18 | idioterna | just so you'll learn to respect vi |
| 23:10.18 | idioterna | beside the fact it's likely available on your washing machine's firmware |
| 23:10.26 | cb23 | ee <insert the thing on the left is better then> nano |
| 23:10.45 | cb23 | i've been on holiday for too long :/ |
| 23:11.11 | idioterna | i suggest reading http://www.viemu.com/a-why-vi-vim.html because it's insightful |
| 23:11.33 | RayDar | I am talking about simple config file edits here. Something that is user friendly (and doesn't ignore all those fancy keys on your keyboard) is probably the way to go. |
| 23:11.51 | idioterna | http://www.bemroses.net/images/curves.jpg |
| 23:12.03 | RayDar | Hmmmm. I wonder if I need to do the proxy server thing. |
| 23:12.09 | RayDar | I wonder if I can. |
| 23:12.17 | idioterna | yeah, i agree, nano would be nice for all the people who can't get the hang of vi |
| 23:12.51 | quicksand | Try the "leafpad" ecitor -- it's a very simple GTK+ text editor. About as capable as Notepad. |
| 23:12.59 | idioterna | either because they don't edit as much or they already have a favourite editor that does it for them |
| 23:13.03 | *** join/#openmoko edistar__ (n=edistar@ip503ddd09.speed.planet.nl) |
| 23:13.16 | *** join/#openmoko rmoravcik (n=rmoravci@ip-89-102-255-171.karneval.cz) |
| 23:13.21 | RayDar | I have made it this far without getting the hang of vi. No time to start now. |
| 23:13.34 | quicksand | leafpad is already in OE -- just build & go. |
| 23:14.27 | idioterna | i thought so too, for about 10 years, then i decided to learn and i've never looked back in 6 years |
| 23:14.40 | idioterna | it's worth every second of the time you invest, if you're a programmer |
| 23:14.55 | idioterna | if you're a unix programmer, doubly so. |
| 23:16.19 | RayDar | I suspect that I need a better t-mobile plan to actually use the gprs thing. |
| 23:16.25 | erko | RayDar, got web pages over gprs -- had to use proxy: 216.155.165.50 |
| 23:16.35 | RayDar | idioterna: Did you update your uboot? |
| 23:16.39 | *** join/#openmoko crunchywelch (n=welch@208.118.160.90) |
| 23:16.39 | erko | port :8080 for http, port :1080 for SOCKS |
| 23:16.46 | idioterna | not yet, but i'm setting up for it |
| 23:16.59 | RayDar | erko: Where did you put that proxy command? |
| 23:17.11 | RayDar | idioterna: Scary |
| 23:17.18 | erko | to test with wget: |
| 23:17.18 | erko | export http_proxy="http://216.155.165.50:8080" |
| 23:17.18 | erko | wget http://www.google.com |
| 23:18.48 | RayDar | erko: That worked. But here is my output: <html><title>COMVERSE</title><body>internal error You do not have access to the site in www.google.com/</body></html> |
| 23:18.48 | idioterna | why did my splash screens change from openmoko to angstrom? |
| 23:19.12 | *** join/#openmoko CVirus (n=GoD@82.201.222.69) |
| 23:19.13 | idioterna | because i did ipkg upgrade? |
| 23:19.19 | idioterna | i suppose so :) |
| 23:19.32 | Mononoke | google is stealiong your phone |
| 23:19.33 | RayDar | ipkg update never works for me |
| 23:19.37 | Mononoke | *stealing |
| 23:20.02 | *** join/#openmoko gopi (n=gopi@72.19.4.237) |
| 23:20.10 | RayDar | erko: I think my plan (pre-paid) doesn't want me to do any Internet. lame really. |
| 23:20.14 | idioterna | RayDar: can you ping/resolve hosts outside your home net? |
| 23:20.23 | idioterna | oh |
| 23:20.31 | idioterna | i'm accessing the net through usb |
| 23:20.53 | erko | RayDar, ah, ok, I thought maybe you had the wrong APN. I have the cheapest tmobile internet plan ($9/mo? with regular plan) and use wap.voicestream.com as the VPN |
| 23:20.59 | quicksand | RayDar: if you are in the US, you are correct -- T-Mo prepaid does not allow data. |
| 23:21.17 | erko | oops, s/VPN/APN |
| 23:22.01 | RayDar | erko: the DNS works but pings don't return |
| 23:22.29 | RayDar | quicksand: I have tried to find a US carrier that allows pre-paid Internet. I don't think there is one. |
| 23:22.37 | erko | RayDar, darn |
| 23:23.41 | erko | ok, i have to get back to real work, neo could probably replace my other phone soon now that internet works. |
| 23:23.42 | erko | bye all |
| 23:23.44 | *** part/#openmoko erko (n=eolson@madden.mcs.anl.gov) |
| 23:24.46 | *** part/#openmoko thseiler (n=Thomas@zux221-153-000.adsl.green.ch) |
| 23:26.45 | RayDar | I have hope that (thanks to Google stirring things up a bit) Verizon's new any-device policy will help things as far as cheap wireless data goes. |
| 23:29.29 | summatusmentis | I'm doubting it |
| 23:30.53 | quicksand | RayDar: me too -- I eventually went with T-Mo notwithstanding the lack of data, so at least I would have a working SIM to test stuff with. My regular phone is CDMA (Verizon). |
| 23:32.40 | quicksand | On the bright side, the area I'm in (SF Bay) seems to use the 1900 frequency quite a bit, so the lack of 850 isn't too big a deal (at least for my current purposes). If it were my everyday phone, then that would be another matter. |
| 23:32.43 | *** join/#openmoko zween (n=zween@78-86-213-209.zone2.bethere.co.uk) |
| 23:33.09 | *** join/#openmoko Anon2250 (n=Etienne@218-164.2-85.cust.bluewin.ch) |
| 23:36.06 | RayDar | It sure is a fancy-pants phone. One day it will be nice. |
| 23:36.12 | *** join/#openmoko thseiler (n=Thomas@zux221-153-000.adsl.green.ch) |
| 23:37.02 | *** join/#openmoko orion__ (n=orion@124-171-184-242.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 23:37.03 | *** join/#openmoko daMaestro (n=jon@fedora/damaestro) |
| 23:38.13 | idioterna | i'd sure like to see a model with 3G support, though |
| 23:38.47 | *** join/#openmoko ThePizzaKing (n=jeff@c211-28-162-92.eburwd2.vic.optusnet.com.au) |
| 23:38.51 | *** join/#openmoko ferric (n=aditya@user-0cdft28.cable.mindspring.com) |
| 23:43.09 | *** join/#openmoko edistar (n=edistar@ip503ddd09.speed.planet.nl) |
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| 23:59.01 | *** join/#openmoko toxx_ (n=toxx_@103-247-dsl.kielnet.net) |
