| 00:03.10 | *** join/#openmoko orospakr (n=orospakr@CPE001c1019cfc4-CM0011ae034e04.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 00:03.28 | MetaMorfoziS | gn |
| 00:08.50 | *** join/#openmoko demaledetti (n=ste@151.16.90.111) |
| 00:10.34 | Keizer | Hey guys |
| 00:11.07 | Keizer | I keep getting the error cannot find -lftd2xx |
| 00:18.42 | inwoo | is there a way to make sure that openmoko compiles using all my cpus? i've edited the parallel_make and the bb_number_threads but it still is single threaded building. |
| 00:19.10 | tsuramoto | -jX? |
| 00:19.41 | inwoo | i put "-j 4" into local.conf |
| 00:19.47 | inwoo | but the builds still build single threaded |
| 00:19.50 | *** join/#openmoko CVirus (n=GoD@82.201.178.186) |
| 00:20.13 | CoreDump | inwoo: parallel_make != PARALLEL_MAKE in OE |
| 00:20.19 | tsuramoto | no space |
| 00:20.21 | tsuramoto | -j4 |
| 00:20.29 | CoreDump | capital letters |
| 00:20.37 | inwoo | CoreDump: , it's like this in my config |
| 00:20.39 | inwoo | PARALLEL_MAKE = "-j 4" |
| 00:20.40 | inwoo | BB_NUMBER_THREADS = "4" |
| 00:20.48 | inwoo | no space then? |
| 00:20.50 | tsuramoto | no space |
| 00:21.26 | inwoo | i'll give that a try thanks tsuramoto |
| 00:21.31 | inwoo | and CoreDump |
| 00:21.51 | CoreDump | BB_NUMBER_THREADS = "16" |
| 00:21.51 | CoreDump | PARALLEL_MAKE = "-j 6" |
| 00:21.57 | CoreDump | the above work for me |
| 00:22.05 | inwoo | alright... i'll try that too |
| 00:22.32 | inwoo | do i need to reload the conf file or anything? |
| 00:22.50 | CVirus | What's the status of the wifi driver ? |
| 00:22.53 | CoreDump | no, touching local.conf will make OE reparse automatically |
| 00:23.08 | Keizer | Anyone here using Gentoo? |
| 00:23.15 | tsuramoto | yes |
| 00:23.20 | CVirus | me |
| 00:23.25 | Keizer | tsuramoto: I'm trying to install openocd |
| 00:23.50 | Keizer | I keep getting this error: |
| 00:23.51 | Keizer | /usr/lib/gcc/x86_64-pc-linux-gnu/4.2.2/../../../../x86_64-pc-linux-gnu/bin/ld: skipping incompatible /usr/lib/libftd2xx.so when searching for -lftd2xx |
| 00:24.00 | inwoo | CoreDump: thanks |
| 00:24.15 | Keizer | Any help would be awesome |
| 00:24.28 | CoreDump | you're welcome ;) |
| 00:24.47 | inwoo | Keizer: i think i ran into that issue with a 64bit version of linux, let me dig up a link for you |
| 00:24.59 | Keizer | inwoo: Thank you |
| 00:25.14 | inwoo | Keizer: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Talk:MokoMakefile#The_lib64_issue |
| 00:25.34 | CVirus | I guess this should solve your problem |
| 00:26.24 | Keizer | inwoo: Good read |
| 00:28.46 | *** join/#openmoko PMT (n=rich@c-68-39-249-165.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) |
| 00:28.49 | Keizer | Doesn't say how to get around it with Gentoo |
| 00:29.06 | Keizer | What sucks is I try everything possible to prevent from chroot environment |
| 00:29.31 | inwoo | Yeah, i gave up on building it in a 64bit env, ... just chrooted |
| 00:30.22 | Keizer | Damn |
| 00:30.33 | Keizer | inwoo: Is it a pain to do the 32bit chroot? |
| 00:30.46 | Keizer | I know people run firefox 32bit chroot for flash plugin |
| 00:31.11 | inwoo | no it's not too hard, i'm sure there's a HOWTO to get a chroot env setup for gentoo somewhere... i don't run that disto |
| 00:32.34 | Keizer | http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/base/amd64/howtos/index.xml?part=1&chap=2 |
| 00:32.44 | *** join/#openmoko orion_ (n=orion@124-171-187-172.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 00:32.52 | inwoo | there ya go.. |
| 00:34.23 | *** join/#openmoko orion__ (n=orion@124-171-182-204.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 00:38.10 | duffyd | hi, anyone know what happened to this url: http://downloads.openmoko.org/OM2007.2/tmp/deploy/glibc/ipk/all ? |
| 00:38.32 | duffyd | in fact anything under http://downloads.openmoko.org/OM2007.2 |
| 00:39.02 | *** join/#openmoko mboldisc (n=mike@c-66-41-225-167.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) |
| 00:40.06 | *** join/#openmoko uriahheep (n=alexis@bas1-montreal45-1177792407.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 00:40.08 | uriahheep | ello |
| 00:40.13 | mmontour | duffyd: try buildhost.openmoko.org |
| 00:40.32 | uriahheep | ...how many generations of the neo phone are planned so far? |
| 00:41.36 | *** join/#openmoko PMT (n=rich@c-68-39-249-165.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) |
| 00:41.55 | tsuramoto | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Main_Page |
| 00:42.04 | tsuramoto | Neo1973 DEVELOPMENT STATUS Neo1973 GTA02 is still under development. We are on the fourth revision of |
| 00:42.06 | duffyd | mmontour: ok, thanks |
| 00:42.22 | SpeedEvil | uriahheep: one more basically |
| 00:42.48 | SpeedEvil | uriahheep: there are of course hopes for more devices, which will be developed in due course. |
| 00:43.17 | *** join/#openmoko peepsalot (n=peepsalo@cpe-67-9-161-48.austin.res.rr.com) |
| 00:45.12 | duffyd | mmontour: that's working :) |
| 00:45.14 | duffyd | thanks |
| 00:46.27 | mgregson | Any news on how long until the a02 is released? |
| 00:48.11 | *** join/#openmoko ^leo^ (n=user@r190-64-6-252.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy) |
| 00:48.17 | uriahheep | SpeedEvil: hmm, ok :P |
| 00:53.23 | SpeedEvil | mgregson: it is practically impossible that it'll happen in the next 60 days. |
| 00:53.49 | SpeedEvil | mgregson: I'd say march, april, may might be possible. |
| 00:54.06 | *** join/#openmoko CVirus (n=GoD@82.201.178.186) |
| 00:54.59 | *** join/#openmoko miip__ (n=miip@p54A55534.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 00:57.39 | *** join/#openmoko Linux_Galore (n=richard@60-242-20-212.static.tpgi.com.au) |
| 00:58.19 | Linux_Galore | another Linux phones is released at CES http://www.engadget.com/2008/01/07/hands-on-with-wistron-newebs-gw4-linux-phon |
| 00:58.25 | Linux_Galore | phone* |
| 00:58.46 | Linux_Galore | grr |
| 00:58.50 | Linux_Galore | http://www.engadget.com/2008/01/07/hands-on-with-wistron-newebs-gw4-linux-phone/ |
| 01:00.42 | SunX2 | Hardware looks interesting |
| 01:00.59 | Linux_Galore | yeah, thats what I wish the NEO looked like |
| 01:01.22 | Linux_Galore | even has a camera |
| 01:01.36 | Linux_Galore | http://www.blogsmithmedia.com/www.engadget.com/media/2008/01/wistron-neweb-gw4-hands-on-ces-2008-02.jpg |
| 01:01.47 | mgregson | I dunno why everyone likes these cameras on cell phones... |
| 01:01.55 | mgregson | but they keyboard is kinda nice. |
| 01:02.14 | mgregson | Any details on screen size? |
| 01:02.53 | Linux_Galore | looks like 2.8" to me |
| 01:02.58 | SunX2 | They're very handy to catch certain moments... but as a serious camera they're pretty useless. |
| 01:03.32 | Linux_Galore | SunX2: depends on your social life, my phone is full of pictures |
| 01:04.34 | SunX2 | Crappy ones, no doubt :D |
| 01:04.55 | *** join/#openmoko dkirker (n=dkirker@69.229.198.200) |
| 01:05.43 | Linux_Galore | hmm Wistron will be releasing a 3G version last 1/4 2008 |
| 01:05.48 | mgregson | So this thing has the same size screen, but adds a keyboard... |
| 01:05.56 | duffyd | hi, anyone know what the SMS app in OM is called? |
| 01:06.05 | tsuramoto | bluetooth virtual laser keyboard ftw |
| 01:06.13 | SpeedEvil | Sucky |
| 01:06.17 | SpeedEvil | no feel,. |
| 01:06.35 | mgregson | but a moko with a bluetooth keyboard would do the trick |
| 01:06.40 | SpeedEvil | yeah. |
| 01:07.04 | mgregson | not sure how i feel about pulling out a keyboard to send an sms though |
| 01:07.15 | Linux_Galore | SunX2: is that the negativity of resentment I hear |
| 01:07.43 | mgregson | SunX2: Yeah, cell phone cameras will need to improve a LOT before they become a 'feature'... |
| 01:08.00 | SpeedEvil | IMO, utterly not mgregson. |
| 01:08.13 | SpeedEvil | Cameras are not only for taking pictures to print out. |
| 01:08.14 | tsuramoto | what is besides resolution and FPS with cameras? |
| 01:08.14 | SunX2 | Linux_Galore: it's not about your social life, it's about the awful image quality. |
| 01:08.19 | Linux_Galore | mgregson: Samsun G800 has 3 x "optical" zoom and 5MP camera now |
| 01:08.40 | SpeedEvil | A 640*480 camera is quite adequate for _many_ tasks. |
| 01:08.44 | Linux_Galore | SunX2: the images on my N95 are very clear |
| 01:09.03 | *** part/#openmoko wasabi (n=wasabi@207.55.182.70) |
| 01:09.05 | SunX2 | SpeedEvil: sure. But not with the colors and distortion present on most cellphone camera. |
| 01:09.07 | SunX2 | s |
| 01:09.30 | SpeedEvil | SunX2: for taking pictures of buisness cards, or price labels, or ... it's quite fine. |
| 01:09.46 | SunX2 | Linux_Galore: under the right circumstances, I'm sure. But they look awful compared to average compact cameras still. |
| 01:09.50 | SpeedEvil | SunX2: I also note that 2MP cameras are available in 5mm*5mm*3mm packages |
| 01:09.52 | Linux_Galore | SunX2: depends on the phone Nokia have very god camera but HTC cameras seriously suck |
| 01:09.59 | Linux_Galore | good* |
| 01:10.13 | SpeedEvil | There is no alternative for large glass size when it comes to performance in the dark though. |
| 01:10.14 | SunX2 | SpeedEvil: sure, but that's a very limited application and not quite suited for the "social" trends. |
| 01:10.25 | Linux_Galore | SunX2: I have a compact Sony camera, exactly the same |
| 01:10.29 | SunX2 | OCR is going to be off a lot on 640x480 though. |
| 01:10.54 | SunX2 | Was it built before the year 2000? :D |
| 01:11.17 | Linux_Galore | SunX2: no it s 7.1MP camera with 4 x zoom |
| 01:11.18 | SpeedEvil | I actually have recently been looking for 100*100 camera chips or so. |
| 01:11.32 | Linux_Galore | SunX2: be less than a year old |
| 01:11.44 | *** join/#openmoko eikonos (n=eikonos@S0106001c104ae594.gv.shawcable.net) |
| 01:11.57 | SunX2 | Linux_Galore: forgive me for not believing that :D |
| 01:11.58 | duffyd | hi, anyone know what the SMS app in OM is called? (2nd posting plz :) |
| 01:11.58 | *** join/#openmoko pixelstick (n=pixel@d-74-214-40-54.metrocast.net) |
| 01:11.59 | SpeedEvil | (to make a 360*360 low-res pano-cam for situational awareness on a UAV.) |
| 01:12.12 | SpeedEvil | duffyd: messages |
| 01:12.20 | duffyd | SpeedEvil: thanks! |
| 01:12.54 | SunX2 | SpeedEvil: well.. yeah... I'm sure low-res cams have their applications, but not cellphones, IMO. |
| 01:12.55 | SunX2 | I don't care for much more than say, 1.3MP... but the opticals are much more important. |
| 01:12.56 | Linux_Galore | SunX2: as I said, Nokia do allot of R&D on their cameras before they fit them into any of their products, the difference between manufacturers on cameras in phones is huge |
| 01:13.18 | SpeedEvil | SunX2: actually - if cheap - they'd be great for gesture recognition. |
| 01:13.40 | SpeedEvil | A noise-free camera is 'easy' to make. |
| 01:13.44 | duffyd | SpeedEvil: Collected errors: |
| 01:13.45 | duffyd | Cannot find package messages. |
| 01:13.45 | duffyd | Check the spelling or perhaps run 'ipkg update' |
| 01:14.07 | SpeedEvil | you simply need to spec a high enough grade imager of a large enough size, and fit a fast enough lens. |
| 01:14.29 | SpeedEvil | duffyd: it's built in |
| 01:14.47 | Linux_Galore | SunX2: I have had the opertunity to compare the 2MP camera in a Nokia E90 to that of a HTC Tytn II (touch) and its chalk and cheese, HTC seem to have done bugger all R&D on their camera |
| 01:15.01 | duffyd | SpeedEvil: oh really. I just did an ipkg update && ipkg upgrade, so should sms now work (mostly)? |
| 01:15.03 | SpeedEvil | It's not a case of R&D - it's a case of budget. |
| 01:15.15 | SpeedEvil | duffyd: I don't know if it actually works. |
| 01:15.26 | duffyd | SpeedEvil: ok, thanks |
| 01:15.29 | Linux_Galore | SpeedEvil: both products are about the same price RRP |
| 01:15.59 | SpeedEvil | Linux_Galore: price does not reflect on the amount they paid for the camera, or the volume of the case they paid for it. |
| 01:16.06 | Linux_Galore | SpeedEvil: the E90 has a bigger screen so you would think the camera would be crapier, nope |
| 01:16.34 | SpeedEvil | Linux_Galore: end-user price that is |
| 01:17.09 | SunX2 | Linux_Galore: well, I've seen N93 pictures and they're awful compared to my Ixus. |
| 01:17.09 | SunX2 | The N95 is probably better, but I'd still trust my Ixus more than the N95. |
| 01:17.17 | Linux_Galore | also the e90 has two screen and two keyboards |
| 01:18.31 | Linux_Galore | HTC Tytn II has one of each |
| 01:18.33 | SpeedEvil | It'd be so nice if it was mandated that they must publish standardised test photos first. |
| 01:19.43 | Linux_Galore | SpeedEvil: yeah, use a text sheet (like a TV test image) |
| 01:19.51 | Linux_Galore | test* |
| 01:20.08 | cb23 | phone cameras all tend to generally be crap |
| 01:20.29 | cb23 | (generally == in my experience) |
| 01:20.33 | Linux_Galore | cb23: true, but Samsun and Nokia seem to do a reasonably good job |
| 01:20.36 | SunX2 | That's what I was saying :D |
| 01:20.43 | Linux_Galore | Samsung* |
| 01:21.05 | cb23 | i normally find the bigger the phone, the better the camera, when staying with the same brand |
| 01:21.26 | cb23 | its still irritating when people just use MP as a measure of quality :/ |
| 01:21.43 | SpeedEvil | Generally the design problem on the camera gets _much_ easier as you increase the sensor size. |
| 01:21.58 | Linux_Galore | I dont like the compact cameras either, the best digital camera I have right now is a full sized 5MP digital camera unit with a large lense, the pictures are super clear |
| 01:22.00 | SpeedEvil | And a larger sensor size means that you can increase the lens size. |
| 01:22.20 | SpeedEvil | and a larger phone can incorporate larger lenses |
| 01:22.38 | cb23 | friend - ZOMGLOLROFLCOPTER! my new phone is 120MP. me - so what? my 7mp camera with this thing called a lens cuts it into pieces |
| 01:22.41 | Linux_Galore | SpeedEvil: the Samsun G800 is very big |
| 01:22.45 | Linux_Galore | Samsung* |
| 01:22.49 | cb23 | SpeedEvil, indeed |
| 01:22.54 | cb23 | Linux_Galore, bad g key :)? |
| 01:23.07 | Linux_Galore | no I keep missing it, new keyboard |
| 01:23.39 | SpeedEvil | cbrake_away: I saw a datasheet on a 81MP imager the other day. |
| 01:23.42 | SpeedEvil | cb23: |
| 01:23.52 | cb23 | SpeedEvil, you still do that! |
| 01:23.56 | SpeedEvil | cb23: made from one entire 5" imager |
| 01:24.00 | SpeedEvil | cb23: made from one entire 5" wafer |
| 01:24.09 | cb23 | i havent been in this channel for 2 months or so, and you still prematurly tab :p |
| 01:24.30 | SpeedEvil | the problem is that I don't tab, I do cb: |
| 01:24.39 | Linux_Galore | cb23: yeah, cant beat a decent sized camera with a decent lense with a 12MP compact camera (Kodak have one Im not kidding) |
| 01:25.01 | SpeedEvil | It's problematic. |
| 01:25.12 | cb23 | SpeedEvil, no fair, why do you get a UAV? |
| 01:25.42 | cb23 | Linux_Galore, indeed, especially in crappy light |
| 01:25.48 | SpeedEvil | cb23: because I order the bits off the internet for $450 or so total, and write the kalman filter and thrust vector code myself. |
| 01:26.09 | Linux_Galore | SpeedEvil: talk to some security camera geeks, they know the best lense etc combo's |
| 01:26.12 | SpeedEvil | cb23: http://www.mauve.plus.com/test.pgm |
| 01:26.17 | cb23 | phone cameras in normal light are bad enough, in a semi-dark room everything sucks to hell |
| 01:26.29 | cb23 | SpeedEvil, wow O-o |
| 01:26.33 | SpeedEvil | Linux_Galore: I'm in a different space - I care about weight - my all-up weight is 1Kg |
| 01:26.37 | cb23 | btw, bad link |
| 01:26.49 | SpeedEvil | cb23: http://www.mauve.plus.com/test.png ? |
| 01:27.10 | Linux_Galore | SpeedEvil: security people have space constraints too, try fitting a camera in a lift that cant be seen |
| 01:27.39 | SpeedEvil | Linux_Galore: however, I want 5MP+, in under 150g |
| 01:27.40 | duffyd | I've got python on my OM! |
| 01:27.50 | duffyd | go ahead call me a n00b :) |
| 01:27.53 | SpeedEvil | Linux_Galore: which is probably not a common requirement for security. |
| 01:28.01 | cb23 | duffyd, ok, now run python and type import antigravity ;) |
| 01:28.12 | duffyd | cb23: :) |
| 01:28.23 | Linux_Galore | SpeedEvil: buy a broken N95 on ebay heh |
| 01:28.42 | cb23 | or from __future__ import braces |
| 01:28.57 | SpeedEvil | Linux_Galore: I've already got an ARM processor in there ( tincantools.com ) and may do USB ptp camera. |
| 01:28.59 | duffyd | cb23: I just wanna run a db app :) |
| 01:28.59 | cb23 | Linux_Galore, could you actually reuse a camera from a phone without a significant amount of work? |
| 01:29.01 | duffyd | gotta find one now |
| 01:29.07 | SpeedEvil | cb23: no |
| 01:29.52 | Linux_Galore | cb23: yes, most manufacturers actualy use a pretty stock USB insterface module |
| 01:30.33 | SpeedEvil | Linux_Galore: no they don't |
| 01:30.43 | SpeedEvil | Linux_Galore: they use sccb or similar parallel camera busses. |
| 01:30.57 | SpeedEvil | Linux_Galore: usb2 in phone type SOC's are _rare_. |
| 01:31.08 | SpeedEvil | and there are no USB2 integrated imagers. |
| 01:31.09 | duffyd | anyways, I'm off. Thanks all |
| 01:31.11 | *** part/#openmoko duffyd (n=tim@203-211-67-136.ue.woosh.co.nz) |
| 01:31.16 | Linux_Galore | SpeedEvil: well the ones Ive looked at just use a standard 4 wire serial setup as the interface |
| 01:31.32 | SpeedEvil | Linux_Galore: that's for the control - not the data |
| 01:31.44 | cb23 | how does the data flow? |
| 01:32.08 | SpeedEvil | cb23: it's basically an 8 bit parallel bus, with some frame/clock/line sync signals |
| 01:32.08 | cb23 | like my ipaqs camera didnt really have many wires linking it up |
| 01:32.20 | Linux_Galore | SpeedEvil: Im not talking getting the data direct from the camera module but after the interface |
| 01:32.24 | SpeedEvil | then a seperate 2 -4 wire serial bus to set the registers. |
| 01:32.53 | cb23 | so you cant just wire the damn thing up to a parallel port? boo |
| 01:32.59 | SpeedEvil | Linux_Galore: the interface is typically connected directly to a dedicated port on an image processing or direct to the CPU. |
| 01:33.24 | SpeedEvil | cb23: it's typically 20-90Mhz readout, so no. |
| 01:33.43 | cb23 | hmm, i actually remember seeing a serial camera once |
| 01:33.52 | cb23 | (serial port) |
| 01:33.57 | cb23 | SpeedEvil, yes, yes you have |
| 01:34.05 | cb23 | but its educational for me, so i dont mind :) |
| 01:34.20 | SpeedEvil | (trying to pick the remaining stuff for the UAV) |
| 01:34.49 | Linux_Galore | SpeedEvil: sp now they have removed the serial interface and feed it direct into the video processor ? |
| 01:35.46 | SpeedEvil | Linux_Galore: no - the serial interface never had the video. It's been pretty much 'standard' - from when CMOS imagers were 120*160 - to have one serial bus for control, and one parallel bus that the data comes out on. |
| 01:36.14 | SpeedEvil | Linux_Galore: of course, video format output cameras are different - they only have power and composite out. Maybe sync too |
| 01:36.53 | SpeedEvil | Of course, the chips have enough incompatabilities that it's hard to simply swap. |
| 01:37.46 | SpeedEvil | And there are exceptions like single-chip USB cameras - but these are typically bottom feeders in terms of quality. |
| 01:38.15 | *** join/#openmoko freelock_ (n=john@foraker.freelock.com) |
| 01:40.32 | Linux_Galore | this year should be the year of "Linux on hand helds" |
| 01:40.36 | Linux_Galore | fsk the desktop |
| 01:43.12 | Linux_Galore | SpeedEvil: you can get decent 8MP PC video camera now I noticed |
| 01:43.36 | Linux_Galore | not too expensive either |
| 01:43.36 | SpeedEvil | Linux_Galore: no you can't. |
| 01:43.49 | SpeedEvil | Linux_Galore: the maximum native resolution is 2MP |
| 01:44.01 | SpeedEvil | at least for common video cameras. |
| 01:44.22 | SpeedEvil | the logitech Optia AF is about the leader of the pack. 2MP 10Hz under linux. |
| 01:44.36 | SpeedEvil | If you look carefully you may find '8MP still image capture' |
| 01:44.44 | SpeedEvil | which is basically just the driver blowing the image up |
| 01:45.15 | ewon | oh for a cheap 300fps usb camera |
| 01:45.16 | *** join/#openmoko miip_ (n=miip@p54A55534.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 01:45.38 | Linux_Galore | s/video// |
| 01:46.19 | SpeedEvil | Linux_Galore: they don't really take 8MP stills - it's simply blowing up a 1.3MP image to 8MP forex |
| 01:47.29 | Linux_Galore | SpeedEvil: if you think about it any video above 720p is a wast of time anyway |
| 01:47.40 | SpeedEvil | No it's not. |
| 01:48.02 | SpeedEvil | You can do image processing on it usefully |
| 01:48.07 | *** join/#openmoko orion_ (n=orion@124-171-212-151.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 01:48.12 | Linux_Galore | unless your a spy satellite heh |
| 01:48.40 | peepsalot | http://gizmodo.com/341634/casios-exilim-pro-ex+f1-hands+on-1200-fps-demo-video-and-sample-60+shots+per+second-gallery |
| 01:48.43 | Linux_Galore | SpeedEvil: Im talking on the consumer side |
| 01:50.01 | Linux_Galore | Im not talking about making the next Star Wars block buster |
| 01:50.27 | SpeedEvil | I somewhat disagree - if you've got a good enough video camera, which can take 10MP video, forex, you can later go back and do digital zoom on sections of the image. |
| 01:50.46 | SpeedEvil | In principle. |
| 01:51.41 | cb23 | isnt principle a nice thing :) |
| 01:51.58 | cb23 | too bad its arch enemy practice comes around so often and ruins the day |
| 01:52.03 | SpeedEvil | True. |
| 01:52.35 | Linux_Galore | SpeedEvil: yeah, reminds me of blade runner and the zooming |
| 01:52.39 | SpeedEvil | In principle, 100MP video for 'snap' cams would be nice. |
| 01:53.26 | SpeedEvil | It simply notes when you pressed the button and takes a nominal picture, which is really a bookmark. |
| 01:53.29 | Linux_Galore | SpeedEvil: Military already have satellites with 150mp+ cameras |
| 01:53.57 | Linux_Galore | cost over $200k each |
| 01:53.59 | SpeedEvil | you can reframe by digital zooming, or seek backwards or forwards a bit. |
| 01:54.26 | SpeedEvil | Linux_Galore: oh yeah - it's going to be some while. |
| 01:55.07 | Linux_Galore | you can purchase 32MP cameras now ($30k) |
| 01:55.29 | peepsalot | you guys see that link I posted, that cam can do up to 1200FPS |
| 01:55.29 | *** part/#openmoko stefan_schmidt (n=stefan@datenfreihafen.org) |
| 01:55.50 | Linux_Galore | peepsalot: yeah, but it degrades the resolution to do it |
| 01:55.54 | peepsalot | yeah |
| 01:56.10 | Linux_Galore | peepsalot: camera needs more grunt |
| 01:56.21 | Linux_Galore | or a faster IO |
| 01:56.26 | *** join/#openmoko behdad (n=behdad@32.60.107.139) |
| 01:56.27 | peepsalot | it' still pretty impressive |
| 01:56.30 | *** join/#openmoko pixelstick (n=pixel@d-74-214-40-54.metrocast.net) |
| 01:56.43 | peepsalot | fastest one so far(in consumer space) that I know of |
| 01:56.53 | Linux_Galore | peepsalot: yeah, I can see cameras and video merging more and more |
| 01:57.05 | Linux_Galore | still cameras* |
| 01:57.43 | peepsalot | yeah, that thing is built like a still cam, but can record HD vid |
| 01:57.44 | Linux_Galore | peepsalot: Canon's more expensive HD camera also can do still shots |
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| 01:59.52 | Linux_Galore | sounds like a fun year, HTC have a Linux mobile phone on the drawing boards, few no name brands showing phones at CES, and OM release one (maybe two) models this year |
| 02:00.17 | Linux_Galore | then we have Android from Mr Money (Google) Bags |
| 02:01.09 | Linux_Galore | SpeedEvil: all companies are evil or they will get sued |
| 02:01.21 | SpeedEvil | publically held |
| 02:01.30 | SpeedEvil | privately held ones can be nice in principle. |
| 02:01.45 | Linux_Galore | SpeedEvil: its funny, companies have to be evil ie make as much money as possible for share holder or they can get sued |
| 02:02.00 | SpeedEvil | Linux_Galore: some companies have no shareholders. |
| 02:02.19 | Linux_Galore | SpeedEvil: and have no share holders |
| 02:02.39 | Linux_Galore | as soon as you have share holders the rules change allot |
| 02:03.02 | Linux_Galore | your legally bound to make as much money as possible for your share holders |
| 02:03.03 | mwester | Companies can be neither evil nor good; the people running them can be, and perhaps they can behave in ways that might be morally objectionable, but to say that a company is evil has about as much meaning as saying a rock is evil. |
| 02:03.49 | roh | mwester: youre american, right? |
| 02:03.52 | roh | *ducks* |
| 02:04.40 | Linux_Galore | mwester the legal system specifies that a company has to return as much money as viable for its holders even if bending the law is part of that, and yes that has gone to court |
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| 02:05.52 | mwester | Linux_Galore: The law has little to do with good or evil. Regrettably. |
| 02:06.52 | Linux_Galore | you as a director of a publically woned company cant sit there (unless its in the charter) and say, no Im not going to make lots of money for my share holders because those actions may be morally questionable, you can get sued for that |
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| 02:08.18 | Linux_Galore | mwester true |
| 02:08.21 | mwester | Perhaps, but that doesn't make the company evil. It might make the share holders evil. It might make the people who created and uphold that law evil. But not a company. To perpetuate the myth that companies are evil is just to permit those who are *really* responsible to hide behind the facade of a company. |
| 02:09.42 | mwester | For example, we have lots of people here in Chicago who are busy saying that they are not responsible for polluting Lake Michigan -- it was the company who dumped PCB's into the harbor. :( |
| 02:09.47 | Linux_Galore | mwester what Im saying is its impossible more a publically owned company to be 100% "not evil" or morally acceptable and still be legally within the bounds of making money for its share holders |
| 02:09.58 | Linux_Galore | s/more/for/ |
| 02:11.05 | SpeedEvil | Assuming that the shareholders care |
| 02:11.21 | SpeedEvil | you can not make the shareholders as much money if they agree. |
| 02:11.36 | mwester | I see what you're getting at. I happen to disagree -- I think that it is possible, and legal, but I agree that it is impractical, and that many lawyers will sue -- but the fact that the company got sued, and perhaps a judgement against them was rendered, does not impune the company's morals. |
| 02:12.10 | mwester | Rather it impunes the morality of the lawyers and shareholders who sued a company for "doing the right thing". |
| 02:12.40 | Linux_Galore | SpeedEvil: well large parts of public companies are usually held by investment funds and all they care about is the returns for the members, and the members only care about the **% number they see on the bit if paper they get from the fund every 6 months they dont give a stuff about the companies principles |
| 02:12.48 | SpeedEvil | pk: indeed. |
| 02:12.50 | SpeedEvil | lin: |
| 02:14.38 | mwester | Anyway, interesting digression :) (and roh: :P ) |
| 02:14.49 | Linux_Galore | mwester you dont understand how the law stands at the moment in the USA for public companies, they have no choice but to maximise returns for the share holders, doing do "is illegal" |
| 02:15.42 | Linux_Galore | s/do/so/ |
| 02:15.47 | Linux_Galore | ack |
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| 02:17.56 | Linux_Galore | Michael Moore did a documentary piece just on that part of corporate law, amazing if a company is good and has low returns when they can be evil and break the law to do so with igh returns the directors can nad have found themselves on the losing side of a court case |
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| 02:38.55 | CVirus | ROFL |
| 02:42.38 | ewon | nice |
| 02:45.54 | CVirus | ewon: into metal ? |
| 02:47.29 | ewon | into metal? |
| 02:48.54 | CVirus | you're into metal I mean ? |
| 02:49.03 | ewon | no |
| 02:49.08 | CVirus | ah okay |
| 02:50.39 | Keizer | Do I hve to use jtagkey when trying to connect to the debug board? |
| 02:51.01 | ewon | the name just amused me, that's all |
| 02:56.51 | Keizer | Anyone here familiar with debug board? |
| 02:57.12 | mmontour | Keizer: yes |
| 02:57.48 | mmontour | The "Neo1973 Debug Board v2" page on the Wiki (and the ones it links to) should have most of the information that you will need. |
| 02:58.45 | Keizer | mmontour: I need to run openocd |
| 02:58.46 | *** join/#openmoko HellDragon (i=jd@unaffiliated/helldragon) |
| 02:58.51 | Keizer | But it's not documented well enough |
| 02:58.58 | Keizer | I tried the config file listed for openocd |
| 02:59.00 | Keizer | And I get errors |
| 03:00.11 | mmontour | Make sure you're running it as root or that you've set up a udev rule to adjust the device permissions |
| 03:00.48 | Keizer | Error: jtag.c:1251 jtag_examine_chain(): JTAG communication failure, check connection, JTAG interface, target power etc. |
| 03:01.29 | mmontour | That one can happen if the Neo1973 isn't powered on. You also sometimes need to unplug and re-plug the debug board's USB cable before running openocd. |
| 03:02.22 | Keizer | mmontour: Do I need to power on the moko? |
| 03:03.20 | Keizer | mmontour: I'm trying to debrick the moko |
| 03:03.24 | mmontour | Yes, you need to power it on. If it's bricked you may not see anything on the screen when you press the power button, but it will still start the CPU |
| 03:03.42 | Keizer | When will I know it's started? |
| 03:05.42 | mmontour | Just hold the power button for about 5 seconds then try to connect with the debug board. Please see the "Hardware Connection" section on that wiki page I mentioned |
| 03:06.15 | Keizer | Does the battery need to be in it? |
| 03:06.46 | mmontour | Yes, the battery needs to be in it and needs to be at least partially charged. |
| 03:06.57 | Keizer | usb 2-4: device descriptor read/64, error -62 |
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| 03:09.02 | mmontour | Some usb errors are normal with a bricked Neo. |
| 03:09.18 | Keizer | Is it still possible to install uboot? |
| 03:10.04 | Keizer | Having a tough time with this |
| 03:10.20 | Keizer | usb 2-4: device not accepting address 20, error -62 |
| 03:13.37 | Keizer | http://pastebin.com/m391b936a |
| 03:13.45 | Keizer | mmontour: There's a pastebin of the error message |
| 03:17.27 | mmontour | Do you still get that if you follow the "Hardware Connection" sequence precisely, before running openocd? |
| 03:18.42 | mmontour | You should also double-check the FPC cable between the Neo and the debug board to make sure it's seated properly in both of the connectors |
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| 03:42.31 | Keizer | Anyone know the settings to set in minicom for connecting to debug board V3? |
| 03:46.07 | mmontour | I don't know about debug board V3. For V2, device = /dev/ttyUSB1 baud = 115200, no flow control (I think), and clear the modem init/hangup/reset strings |
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| 04:08.52 | Keizer | mmontour: Still there? |
| 04:09.50 | Keizer | Error: jtag.c:1344 jtag_validate_chain(): Error validating JTAG scan chain, IR mismatch, scan returned 0x00 |
| 04:11.50 | mmontour | That's the error you get if the Neo isn't powered on. Also try stopping openocd, unplugging and re-plugging the USB cable to the debug board, then re-running openocd. If those don't work I probably can't help you. |
| 04:12.25 | Keizer | mmontour: I'm trying to use SEC JTAG FLASH(SJF) |
| 04:12.33 | Keizer | That's the only option I have I think |
| 04:12.56 | Keizer | But it gives me the error unable to find parallel port |
| 04:15.02 | mmontour | I've only worked with openocd, not SJF. |
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| 05:00.32 | free1 | spring? as in april or like late June? |
| 05:00.42 | *** join/#openmoko Q_Continuum (n=Q@75-168-104-34.mpls.qwest.net) |
| 05:06.37 | SpeedEvil | Or as in slinky. |
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| 05:09.54 | free1 | "If I'm wrong there is no right. If I'm wrong there is snow white." |
| 05:10.57 | SpeedEvil | More seriously. |
| 05:11.20 | SpeedEvil | It's basically a guess, the absolute earliest time it might be is around 2 months. |
| 05:11.24 | *** join/#openmoko t_s_o (n=tso@179.84-49-131.nextgentel.com) |
| 05:11.36 | SpeedEvil | but it's more likely to be longer than that. |
| 05:11.39 | free1 | March. Yay(o) |
| 05:11.48 | SpeedEvil | and if things don't go right, rather a lot longer. |
| 05:12.11 | free1 | It's not going to cost a couple bucks short of an iphone? |
| 05:12.17 | free1 | is it? |
| 05:12.24 | SpeedEvil | that price was released a _long_ time ago. |
| 05:12.30 | SpeedEvil | I would not be surprised to see it alter. |
| 05:12.49 | SpeedEvil | (I'm not one that'd be involved in setting the price thjough) |
| 05:12.51 | mgregson | any word on the 850mhz mod? |
| 05:12.55 | free1 | the release date was released a l o n g time ago |
| 05:12.58 | free1 | but that changed |
| 05:13.02 | free1 | dramatically |
| 05:13.18 | SpeedEvil | I think the $450 was stated around august |
| 05:13.35 | SpeedEvil | mgregson: GTA02 will have two variants apparently. |
| 05:13.43 | SpeedEvil | +-850 |
| 05:13.48 | free1 | what the blood clot ?!? |
| 05:13.48 | mgregson | SpeedEvil: for sure? |
| 05:13.57 | SpeedEvil | mgregson: it's not going to be quadband |
| 05:14.11 | SpeedEvil | 03 - who knows. |
| 05:14.34 | free1 | How's about for developers. what is the price? |
| 05:14.36 | mgregson | quad would have been nice, but really the 850 band is what's important for me... |
| 05:14.51 | SpeedEvil | freelock_: same |
| 05:14.52 | free1 | all that wait so I can pay I-phone price |
| 05:14.53 | SpeedEvil | free1: |
| 05:14.56 | free1 | yo |
| 05:15.00 | free1 | holla at me |
| 05:15.29 | mgregson | IIRC, the iPhone is locked and running shady Apple software... |
| 05:15.43 | SpeedEvil | freelock_: unless you can show that you have skills that would mean you would be able to do actual development of the hardware. |
| 05:15.47 | free1 | the Ipone, she's not locked |
| 05:15.48 | SpeedEvil | free1: rather |
| 05:16.59 | free1 | no apple is not shady |
| 05:17.16 | free1 | they have been having a steady policy of high priced-ness |
| 05:17.21 | free1 | for a while no |
| 05:17.26 | free1 | now, rather |
| 05:17.27 | free1 | . |
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| 05:17.43 | mgregson | SpeedEvil: Have you used a moko? |
| 05:17.47 | free1 | but for a 'free' phone to charge the same thing |
| 05:18.00 | free1 | after waiting so long for it |
| 05:18.05 | SpeedEvil | mgregson: yes |
| 05:18.11 | free1 | is straight whack move |
| 05:18.14 | SpeedEvil | mgregson: it's several metrers from me |
| 05:18.17 | mgregson | mgregson: How is typing on it? |
| 05:18.27 | mgregson | SpeedEvil: How is typing on it? |
| 05:18.29 | free1 | I think I'd rather go ahead and buy an Iphone |
| 05:18.36 | free1 | 450? |
| 05:18.38 | mgregson | (I seem to fail at typing on a laptop...) |
| 05:18.49 | free1 | pesos, maybe |
| 05:18.52 | free1 | or rubles |
| 05:18.55 | SpeedEvil | freelock_: if you don't understand why you should get the neo, you want an iphone. |
| 05:19.33 | free1 | Speedy: I am down with the free software, gpl, stallman, all that |
| 05:19.54 | free1 | but if in the end, you pull some |
| 05:20.00 | free1 | nonsense |
| 05:20.09 | free1 | in 2008, I'm staying sucker free |
| 05:20.11 | free1 | holla |
| 05:20.15 | SpeedEvil | define nonsense? |
| 05:20.40 | mgregson | free1: Unfortunately, it's rather difficult to produce no-cost hardware... |
| 05:20.55 | free1 | nonsense-- piggybacking on the linux philosophy/movement for profit |
| 05:21.03 | summatusmentis | is there a keyboard? or is it still the 1-9 dailing typing? |
| 05:21.09 | free1 | are you kidding me?!? |
| 05:21.15 | free1 | mgregson? |
| 05:21.29 | free1 | ole boy, I forgot his name... |
| 05:21.56 | ahven | free software is one thing, but free hardware is another thing |
| 05:21.57 | SpeedEvil | freelock_: each hardware revision probably costs $15K at least. |
| 05:22.01 | SpeedEvil | free1: |
| 05:22.13 | free1 | one of the co-founders, was hanging out in the HK |
| 05:22.19 | free1 | you know Hong Kong |
| 05:22.28 | SpeedEvil | free1: and there is significantly more than that involved in the project. |
| 05:22.33 | free1 | all he had to do was cross-over to the mainland |
| 05:22.41 | free1 | and get things mad cheap |
| 05:22.44 | free1 | ask nike? |
| 05:22.48 | SpeedEvil | Err - no. |
| 05:22.54 | free1 | and I'm not referring to the lil wayne remix |
| 05:22.54 | SpeedEvil | FIC has factories in china. |
| 05:23.00 | SpeedEvil | It's not that simple. |
| 05:23.23 | SpeedEvil | $15K is design + one-time costs in getting 10 or so custom phones made. |
| 05:23.28 | free1 | but the funny thing is.... it is that simple |
| 05:23.55 | SpeedEvil | free1: have you ever designed complex multi-layer PCBs for surface mount electronics? |
| 05:24.30 | free1 | speedevil: have you taken notice of --the 20th century-- and businesses which bnefit from economies of scale |
| 05:24.32 | SpeedEvil | free1: because I have - and it is in fact not simple. Stuff gets cheap only at runs of several thousand, or in really simple assemblies. |
| 05:24.38 | free1 | like the telecom industry?? |
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| 05:24.53 | SpeedEvil | free1: this is initial test runs. 1s and 10s. |
| 05:25.24 | SpeedEvil | free1: and you need maybe 5-6 revisions before you get to a stage you can commit to a thousand. |
| 05:25.25 | free1 | there is no way I'm paying more than $105. |
| 05:25.37 | free1 | for the final product. |
| 05:25.41 | SpeedEvil | As if you screw up on that thousand, you need to eat the cost. |
| 05:25.42 | Stephmw | then you're far too early to the party |
| 05:25.49 | mgregson | free1: You can get an iPhone for $105? |
| 05:25.51 | free1 | step up your business model game, yo |
| 05:25.56 | SpeedEvil | freelock_: come back 2010. |
| 05:25.59 | SpeedEvil | free1: |
| 05:26.16 | free1 | no, Iphones are run buy apple which are known to charge ridiculous amounts |
| 05:26.21 | SpeedEvil | free1: $105 is not achievable without subsidy. Networks will not be subsidising this phone. |
| 05:27.07 | SpeedEvil | free1: $100 is probably a little less than the total cost of the parts in the phone - it can't sell for that. |
| 05:27.09 | mgregson | free1: This is an Apple thing? I don't think I've ever seen a smartphone at that kind of price... |
| 05:27.09 | free1 | 2007- the year of lil wayne, 2008- sucker free, 2010- openmoko a footnote in linux history |
| 05:27.37 | free1 | than go to china and get some cheaper parts, yo |
| 05:27.44 | mgregson | free1: Uh, they did. |
| 05:27.45 | free1 | you can't ignore the truth |
| 05:27.56 | free1 | you don't the future can cross a bridge |
| 05:28.03 | free1 | the mainland is right there |
| 05:28.17 | free1 | a mr. ignore, what have you done? |
| 05:28.22 | free1 | nothing. |
| 05:29.21 | free1 | here's a little reality. If you think, you are going to charge the same amount as an Iphone, and think this is a viable long-term strategy... you cats will be non-existent |
| 05:29.47 | free1 | so ignoring people who are not checking for you... best of luck with that |
| 05:32.44 | free1 | paisano, una cazata! |
| 05:33.03 | mgregson | SpeedEvil: How is typing on the neo (sending sms)? |
| 05:33.24 | daMaestro | you have a qwerty keyboard on screen mgregson |
| 05:33.38 | SpeedEvil | Ok - with the stylus. |
| 05:33.48 | SpeedEvil | it needs other input methods though |
| 05:33.50 | mgregson | daMaestro: Seen the pictures, interested in ease of use. Looked kinda small. |
| 05:33.55 | mgregson | SpeedEvil: Ah... |
| 05:34.10 | mgregson | SpeedEvil: So not really practical for sms |
| 05:34.23 | SpeedEvil | for SMS with stylus - yes. |
| 05:34.43 | mgregson | SpeedEvil: But, unlike other stylus-dependent devices, it doesn't have a slot to store the stylus... |
| 05:34.48 | SpeedEvil | indeed |
| 05:36.13 | free1 | indeed |
| 05:36.16 | free1 | hahaha |
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| 05:36.55 | Stephmw | good riddance to bad rubbish |
| 05:37.04 | mgregson | lol |
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| 05:47.32 | Linux_Galore_ | ah free1 another US creation of "cheaper is better" philosophy, yep just look at the US economy as we speak, cheap loans did allot of good huh |
| 05:48.15 | free1 | Linux_Galore: congrats! the most facile analogy of the year |
| 05:48.44 | Linux_Galore | free1: Im in marketing, do you know the expression, "race to the bottom" |
| 05:49.29 | free1 | Linux_G: I'm in the real world, do you know the phrase "never heard of 'em" |
| 05:49.31 | free1 | ? |
| 05:49.59 | free1 | steve jobs, and the rest of the planet, not checking for you openmoko boys |
| 05:50.02 | free1 | truth |
| 05:50.11 | Linux_Galore | free1: you just expressed "race to the bottom" without actually understanding what it actually means |
| 05:50.31 | free1 | how very Platonic of me, indeed. |
| 05:50.48 | Linux_Galore | free1: ah a boincing icons and "Hey I will bend over and take it in the arse for some pretty consumer crap" teenager |
| 05:51.01 | free1 | you know I went to the open-source convention in Oregon in July of 2007 |
| 05:51.26 | Linux_Galore | free1: heh, just because you went to a wedding doesnt mean your married |
| 05:51.28 | free1 | L_Galore: taking it up the arse/ass |
| 05:51.36 | free1 | would be to pay 450 for a free phone |
| 05:52.03 | free1 | LInux _Galore: a bird in the hand... |
| 05:52.05 | free1 | etc etc |
| 05:52.11 | Linux_Galore | free1: the Om isnt about "price" it asks the question, how much would you pay to be truly free |
| 05:52.43 | free1 | you cannot pay someone else to make yourself free |
| 05:52.49 | Linux_Galore | free1: so, do you want to be just another consumer slave or yourself and free |
| 05:52.52 | mjr | ah, it's idiot season |
| 05:53.21 | free1 | I am not free at 450 a phone |
| 05:53.21 | moko-bunny | would you like to shoot him now, or wait till you get home? :) |
| 05:53.24 | free1 | I can tell you that |
| 05:53.48 | SpeedEvil | freelock_: most phones of similar hardware feature set are around the same price without subsidy. |
| 05:53.50 | Linux_Galore | free1: your mixing terms to escape the question |
| 05:53.51 | SpeedEvil | free1; |
| 05:53.52 | free1 | bunny: were you at the open-source convention in Oregon? |
| 05:53.53 | mjr | moko-bunny, I am at home. Teh win. |
| 05:53.56 | free1 | were any of you? |
| 05:54.12 | free1 | the open-moko people didn't even show! |
| 05:54.22 | moko-bunny | I went to Siggraph...that's enough convention for one year for me :) |
| 05:54.24 | free1 | some Linux-Tv host |
| 05:54.30 | free1 | showed up to return |
| 05:54.34 | Linux_Galore | free1: in your whole rant you avoided the single thing the OM really stands for, are you ready to be free and how much will you pay |
| 05:54.37 | free1 | his non-working moko phone |
| 05:54.51 | free1 | you can't sell freedom |
| 05:55.08 | free1 | I think that Ohm you pushing, is a fugazi |
| 05:55.38 | free1 | anyways, so we're all waiting for close to an hour for the presenter to show up |
| 05:55.43 | Linux_Galore | free1: freedom is never free, only fools and the naive think like that, just ask those who gave their lives by fighting tyranny if their lives are truly worth freedom |
| 05:55.43 | free1 | he doesn't |
| 05:56.13 | moko-bunny | freedom's just another word for nothing left to lose. |
| 05:56.19 | free1 | Linux_Galore: I'm willing to bet you haven't even been in the same city as anyone who fought tyranny |
| 05:56.45 | moko-bunny | I fought the law and the law won. |
| 05:56.46 | free1 | then this cable-access tv show host shows up. good dude |
| 05:56.55 | free1 | but a major disappointment. |
| 05:57.10 | free1 | I was clear, these open moko boys ain't serious. |
| 05:57.14 | *** part/#openmoko mboldisc (n=mike@c-66-41-225-167.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) |
| 05:57.15 | free1 | all these delays |
| 05:57.23 | Linux_Galore | free1: when you childishly complain about $450 for freedom, though small "F" are you also saying people should have not given their lives for your right to be free because yours is worth less than thiers |
| 05:57.29 | free1 | and now this outrageous price |
| 05:57.48 | Linux_Galore | s/have not/have/ |
| 05:58.19 | Linux_Galore | is was correct the other way heh |
| 05:58.24 | free1 | Linux_Galore: son, you have no idea about lives, freedom, and tyranny. you haven't been remotely involved- nor has your family- in any revolution |
| 05:58.31 | SpeedEvil | freelock_: most phones of similar hardware feature set are around the same price without subsidy. |
| 05:58.41 | SpeedEvil | free1: most phones of similar hardware feature set are around the same price without subsidy. |
| 05:58.46 | Linux_Galore | free1: ha, try again |
| 05:59.13 | free1 | ha, no I won't |
| 05:59.23 | summatusmentis | SpeedEvil: the new moto rokr e6(iirc, the slider) is $500 w/out subsidy |
| 05:59.23 | Linux_Galore | free1: you have just admitted you are happy to sell your freedom for a few gold coins |
| 05:59.38 | free1 | $500. |
| 05:59.42 | free1 | ?!?! |
| 05:59.53 | summatusmentis | yes |
| 06:00.26 | summatusmentis | let me double check that, but I'm pretty sure |
| 06:00.26 | SpeedEvil | The US has a _very_ distorted phone market. Phones are _not_ as cheap as their 'sticker' price. |
| 06:00.27 | free1 | oh ok. w/o coverage plan subsidy |
| 06:00.37 | Linux_Galore | free1: the reason phones are cheaper are because they are locking in or should I say "taking away your freedom" to define how you use the hardware you havent actually paid for yet |
| 06:01.33 | free1 | Linux_Galore: stick to the sophistries, cuz a revolutionary you are not, nor ever will be. |
| 06:01.40 | summatusmentis | free1: oh, sorry, I was confused |
| 06:01.50 | summatusmentis | the rokr is $360 w/out subsidy |
| 06:01.59 | mgregson | free1: Were you under the impression that moko would come with a coverage plan subsidy? |
| 06:02.02 | Linux_Galore | free1: hah, and a fool to reality you shall always be |
| 06:02.03 | free1 | makes more sense |
| 06:02.23 | free1 | cuz in Europe, the highest you will see them go is 250 euro |
| 06:02.51 | free1 | Linuz_Galore: congrats on that revolutionary zinger, son. |
| 06:03.06 | Linux_Galore | free1: the price you mention isnt to buy the phone, your not buying the phoen you putting a "down payment on it", the network fees over the period of the contract are the full price of the phone |
| 06:03.09 | free1 | 250 w/o subsidy |
| 06:03.40 | summatusmentis | maybe for the rokr, dollar sucks against the euro |
| 06:03.45 | summatusmentis | but not for a smartphone |
| 06:03.55 | free1 | right, that's true |
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| 06:04.10 | Linux_Galore | free1: $250 for a phone you cant do anything with other than what it can do, ie you cant expand it doesnt compare |
| 06:04.31 | free1 | yes it does compare, |
| 06:04.39 | free1 | I'm not looking to install Java |
| 06:04.48 | free1 | I'm not looking to uninstall Java |
| 06:04.59 | Linux_Galore | free1: java would be one of many things you can install on the OM |
| 06:05.12 | free1 | I know... |
| 06:05.36 | free1 | but what I want is to control my phone, via open-source |
| 06:05.50 | Linux_Galore | free1: also the hardware specifications (90%) are open so you can change anything as you wish |
| 06:06.02 | free1 | to do things that don't have to be uber super-user esque |
| 06:06.10 | summatusmentis | which you can, with a phone that is on par with most other smartphones |
| 06:06.33 | Linux_Galore | free1: to do what "you truly want" with your mobile isnt cheap, thats the problem |
| 06:06.44 | free1 | right, a lot of the phones in Europe, or the ones coming out of Korea or Japan are phones |
| 06:06.54 | free1 | with smartphone capabilities and more |
| 06:07.07 | Linux_Galore | free1: yes but they are locked in on the hardware |
| 06:07.30 | free1 | what I want, what a lot of people want, is to do what they need to do day to day |
| 06:07.37 | free1 | big buck with no whammies |
| 06:07.40 | free1 | ya dig |
| 06:07.54 | free1 | without the b.s of the evil empire- microsoft |
| 06:08.07 | Linux_Galore | free1: go change your so called smart phone so it runs lets say QTopia's software stack, ooh sorry you cant do that its locked down |
| 06:08.09 | free1 | that's why a lot of people switched to linux/sopen source |
| 06:08.31 | free1 | not to pay 450 |
| 06:08.45 | Linux_Galore | free1: as I said, freedom isnt cheap |
| 06:08.47 | free1 | I paid 350 for a brand new toshiba satellite this past july |
| 06:08.57 | free1 | and put linux on it |
| 06:09.00 | Linux_Galore | free1: you keep mentioning none free phones |
| 06:09.16 | free1 | there's on way I'm paying more for a mobile phone |
| 06:09.27 | mgregson | free1: Seriously... please find me a smartphone I can buy unlocked w/o subsidy or plan for <$400 |
| 06:09.37 | mgregson | (new) |
| 06:09.47 | free1 | (new) |
| 06:09.49 | free1 | I like that |
| 06:10.06 | Linux_Galore | free1: ok go to Toshiba and get them to give you the hardware specs lets say for the GSM chip, they will go and say "sorry cant do that we have a NDA with the chipset maker and we paid big $$$$ for that" |
| 06:10.16 | free1 | like I said, there are phones in europe for 250 with smartphone features |
| 06:10.37 | mgregson | free1: 250 euros? |
| 06:10.43 | free1 | gsm chip on a laptop?!? |
| 06:10.48 | free1 | euros |
| 06:11.09 | Linux_Galore | free1: and as I keep telling you those 250 euro phones are all locked down |
| 06:11.15 | free1 | don't blame be for the W's policies which devalued the dollar |
| 06:11.30 | free1 | in 2003 the $ was still ahead of the euro |
| 06:11.33 | mgregson | free1: Didn't affect me. I'm not in the US. |
| 06:11.33 | Linux_Galore | free1: the reason they are cheap is because they are locked down, thats the scam and your not even seeing it |
| 06:12.16 | free1 | Linux_Galore: locked down via propriatery software, right? |
| 06:12.40 | mgregson | free1: Raise the bar. I want wifi, bluetooth, and gps. Still 250 euros? |
| 06:12.45 | Linux_Galore | free1: no hardware and software |
| 06:12.52 | free1 | yes |
| 06:13.00 | mgregson | free1: Send me the link? |
| 06:13.11 | free1 | ok... |
| 06:13.48 | Linux_Galore | free1: do you thing locking is just a software thing ie @ Microsoft, sorry but the hardware market is just as cut throat, companies like Toshiba and Sony sign agreements with chip makers "locking agreements" to get cheaper prices |
| 06:13.54 | free1 | how's this one http://www.mobiletracker.net/archives/2005/05/02/voip-wifi-cell-phone |
| 06:14.22 | Linux_Galore | free1: wifi is an open standard |
| 06:14.42 | Linux_Galore | free1: gsm and cdma are all licences locked in technologies |
| 06:14.52 | free1 | Linux_Galore: yes, wifi is an open standard |
| 06:14.58 | mgregson | free1: I don't understand. That isn't a cell phone, it's an add for a wifi handset. |
| 06:15.31 | mgregson | free1: Sorry, it is a cell phone, and has wifi. |
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| 06:15.39 | free1 | exactly |
| 06:15.43 | free1 | voila |
| 06:16.00 | mgregson | free1: No mention of unit price, no GPS, and what suggests it supports bluetooth? |
| 06:16.07 | Linux_Galore | free1: there are lots of Linux wifi/VoIP phones around, not hard to do the hardware is very open in many cases, not so easy with mobiles because of all the agreements and patents and cross licensing that forces makers to lock down the hardware |
| 06:18.25 | mgregson | free1: That page didn't actually answer the question I asked you. |
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| 06:20.01 | free1 | so you want a link from a store I saw which was selling a phone for 250 with smart-phone capabilities? or wifi-enabled? kindly remind me |
| 06:20.25 | summatusmentis | he said, phone, wifi, bluetooth, gps, for 250 euros |
| 06:21.02 | free1 | gotcha |
| 06:21.27 | mgregson | free1: also, unlocked. No plan or contract. No subsidy. |
| 06:22.04 | Linux_Galore | free1: with a complete hardware list and specifications and open source drivers |
| 06:22.23 | free1 | I'm going back to that bricks and mortar shop. and get the leaflet or something, scan it on a paste-bin and paste it... for a no contract wifi bluetooth phone |
| 06:22.28 | free1 | forget gps |
| 06:22.32 | free1 | I never spoke about that |
| 06:22.51 | free1 | also, there is not point in getting a complete list of drivers |
| 06:23.07 | free1 | cuz the comparison is with the evil empire folks |
| 06:23.15 | mgregson | free1: moko has gps |
| 06:23.24 | mgregson | free1: What evil empire folks? |
| 06:23.41 | free1 | so, you're not trying to tell me that gps is the trump card, no? |
| 06:23.45 | free1 | anyways, |
| 06:23.51 | Linux_Galore | free1: you do know there are no opensource CDMA and GSM drivers for any chipset dont you, thats been one of the big headaches with the OM, part of getting the chipsets free is als accepting whatever locked in closed drivers they give you, and often the drivers are very buggy just look at the Windows Mobile platform and how buggy the closed drivers are |
| 06:24.10 | mgregson | free1: No, I'm not. I'm saying you pay for hardware features. |
| 06:24.34 | free1 | It's past midnight, and I have to wait some for the store to open. is 24 hours ok? |
| 06:25.20 | free1 | ay, just as long as that's all you're pulling |
| 06:25.24 | free1 | holla |
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| 06:26.01 | summatusmentis | can we ban him? |
| 06:26.13 | tsuramoto | operator I need an exit |
| 06:26.23 | *** part/#openmoko rmoravcik (n=rmoravci@adsl-dyn53.91-127-139.t-com.sk) |
| 06:26.40 | Linux_Galore | summatusmentis: if we ban him he wins |
| 06:27.29 | summatusmentis | so we give some loser the satisfaction of thinking that he won, and we win because we don't have to listen to him anymore? |
| 06:27.37 | summatusmentis | he's not gonna change his mind |
| 06:27.44 | Linux_Galore | summatusmentis: no, we try to logically talk to them |
| 06:28.04 | summatusmentis | and they don't change their mind |
| 06:28.11 | Linux_Galore | summatusmentis: part of dealing with people is understanding their needs |
| 06:28.37 | Linux_Galore | summatusmentis: changing peoples minds takes time |
| 06:28.38 | summatusmentis | I agree |
| 06:29.06 | Linux_Galore | summatusmentis: he is complaining about the price of freedom, the answer is simple, freedom is expensive |
| 06:29.28 | summatusmentis | he's trolling, wanting to rile people up |
| 06:29.37 | Linux_Galore | summatusmentis: then dont get riled |
| 06:29.57 | Linux_Galore | summatusmentis: he losed face when you dont wander of the path |
| 06:30.02 | Linux_Galore | loses* |
| 06:30.37 | Linux_Galore | summatusmentis: imagine it a star wars jedi thing |
| 06:30.59 | mgregson | lol |
| 06:31.36 | summatusmentis | I guess I don't understand the point of humoring someone who is trying to get reactions, as compared to just not paying them any regard |
| 06:31.58 | Linux_Galore | summatusmentis: all products are challenged, I work in marketing and get challenged every 5 minutes, what I never do is wander of the path |
| 06:32.38 | Linux_Galore | summatusmentis: welcome to the consumer world |
| 06:32.46 | summatusmentis | Linux_Galore: I hate consumerism :-) |
| 06:32.51 | Linux_Galore | cheaper faster crappier |
| 06:33.14 | summatusmentis | also, most smartphones cost about the same, with no openness |
| 06:33.24 | Linux_Galore | licky for me I work for a company that ignores the motto of "cheaper faster crappier" |
| 06:33.25 | summatusmentis | so, this freedom you speak of is close to being free |
| 06:33.28 | Linux_Galore | lucky* |
| 06:33.53 | Linux_Galore | summatusmentis: freedom is expensive, thats all you need to remember |
| 06:34.12 | summatusmentis | maybe $50 :-) |
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| 06:35.24 | summatusmentis | I don't wanna graduate and have to go out into the real world |
| 06:35.37 | Linux_Galore | heh, the biggest problem OM has right now is the plethora of allmost free Linux mobiles heading our way in 2008 |
| 06:36.32 | summatusmentis | is palm still working on a linux based OS? |
| 06:36.40 | mbuf | Linux_Galore, that is very true |
| 06:37.04 | Linux_Galore | summatusmentis: not sure to be honest, Palm seem to have gone down the path of cheap and crappy |
| 06:37.25 | summatusmentis | my uncle just bought a centro |
| 06:37.29 | summatusmentis | so people still want them |
| 06:37.43 | Linux_Galore | mbuf: dont know, might whip the OM crew to hussle |
| 06:38.26 | Linux_Galore | summatusmentis: centro I would say has saved Palm from the fire but it wont last long |
| 06:38.26 | mbuf | Linux_Galore, it would depend on who is backing which project :) |
| 06:39.13 | summatusmentis | Linux_Galore: yes, and no |
| 06:39.36 | Linux_Galore | summatusmentis: Palm have a Pink Centro being released soon, when a company starts releasing "Pink" colours you know they are running out of winners |
| 06:39.37 | summatusmentis | it means that people still want to use palm OS, which means palm needs to get their horses into gear, and fix it |
| 06:40.15 | Linux_Galore | summatusmentis: I havent seen anyone using a Palm Treo for ages here in Sydney |
| 06:41.06 | ewon | cute asian girl sitting beside me on the plane had a pink treo |
| 06:41.09 | summatusmentis | I still see a fair amount of people using them in the US |
| 06:41.58 | summatusmentis | I'm thinking about taking my uncles treo, and hacking it to my provider |
| 06:42.46 | Linux_Galore | summatusmentis: all the business typed I see now use blueberry phones |
| 06:42.53 | Linux_Galore | types* |
| 06:43.22 | Linux_Galore | in the last year I cant remember a business person being seen with a treo |
| 06:43.50 | summatusmentis | well, I assume it's because palm hasn't stepped up |
| 06:44.15 | Linux_Galore | summatusmentis: true, Palm got caught sitting on their hands |
| 06:44.33 | Linux_Galore | Blueberry are now kicking their asses |
| 06:45.08 | summatusmentis | I think if palm could re-release an OS, a number of people would switch back |
| 06:45.13 | Linux_Galore | Palm need a new OS and a new method |
| 06:45.42 | Linux_Galore | summatusmentis: yeah but now Samsung also make Treo like phones |
| 06:45.54 | mbuf | anyone using qemu on host PC from a recent build? my build fails with audio/audio.d no such file |
| 06:46.13 | Linux_Galore | so do LG and Toshiba and HTC, Apple seem to be the only company bringing out a new concept |
| 06:46.19 | summatusmentis | mmm |
| 06:46.31 | summatusmentis | i need to sleep, I'll be around tomorrow |
| 06:46.39 | Linux_Galore | night summatusmentis |
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| 06:46.52 | summatusmentis | goodnight Linux_Galore, all |
| 06:47.29 | Linux_Galore | to be honest all the big makers in the mobile market seem very stagnant right now |
| 06:47.59 | Linux_Galore | Apple couldnt have picked a better time to bring out its bouncing beach ball phone |
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| 06:49.25 | Linux_Galore | some pic's of Windows Mobile 8 are doing the rounds, bet Steve is laughing his ass off, oooh look they have added lots more cute icons |
| 06:50.15 | Linux_Galore | if Microsoft got off their lame asses and made mobiles we would be all in trouble |
| 06:50.27 | Linux_Galore | then again maybe not |
| 06:54.37 | bmidgley | hmm can't use the angstrom instructions now |
| 06:54.40 | bmidgley | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Angstrom_on_Neo1973 |
| 06:54.43 | bmidgley | images aren't there |
| 06:55.03 | bmidgley | I just wanted to test something from the latest oe |
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| 07:02.03 | mgregson | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Samsung_S3C2442B |
| 07:02.12 | mgregson | claims that the cpu clocks up to 500mhz |
| 07:02.26 | mgregson | but the datasheet says it's internal clock wont move above 400 |
| 07:02.31 | CIA-15 | openmoko: 03erin_yueh * r3784 10/trunk/src/target/gsm/src/gsmd/usock.c: gsmd: fix segfault for list operator names (Sean Chiang) |
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| 08:25.28 | Hopscotch | good morning |
| 08:25.45 | tsuramoto | we lost contact with gamma 12 |
| 08:26.53 | mudyc | mickeyl: could you add the fso to my project page in projects.ltg? |
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| 09:43.19 | josch | is there a list anywhere of the values of all the standard uboot entries? I currently only have boot and factory defaults but also want things like shutdown - whats possible? |
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| 10:33.52 | hrw | morning |
| 10:34.39 | Stephmw | heya |
| 10:38.38 | hrw | http://blog.haerwu.biz/2008/01/07/how-to-replace-zaurus-pda/ |
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| 11:24.18 | iw3hj | hi! |
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| 12:15.19 | florian | good morning |
| 12:16.19 | Stephmw | howdy |
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| 12:25.03 | mickeyl | morning |
| 12:25.07 | mickeyl | mudyc: you should now have access |
| 12:25.10 | SpeedEvil | Morning! |
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| 12:25.34 | SpeedEvil | Something to do with your freerunner on a 787. |
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| 12:25.35 | SpeedEvil | Gunter added that although data can pass between the networks, |
| 12:25.35 | SpeedEvil | "there are protections in place" to ensure that the passenger Internet |
| 12:25.35 | SpeedEvil | service doesn't access the maintenance data or the navigation system "under |
| 12:25.36 | mudyc | mickeyl: thanks |
| 12:25.37 | SpeedEvil | any circumstance." |
| 12:26.11 | SpeedEvil | An aircraft without air-gaps between the user and important networks... |
| 12:26.18 | cb23 | SpeedEvil, protection? like a windows firewall? |
| 12:26.39 | SpeedEvil | It doesn't matter. It's protection, therefore it must work. |
| 12:26.44 | SpeedEvil | :/ |
| 12:26.49 | cb23 | very sad :/ |
| 12:26.59 | mudyc | mickeyl: are you going to send the RFC you were talking about? |
| 12:27.29 | cb23 | seriously thought, what are/were they thinking? |
| 12:27.39 | _buz | nothing? |
| 12:28.04 | cb23 | any competent 14 year old could tell you the most secure way to separate things is not to join them |
| 12:28.06 | SpeedEvil | cbrake_away: I suspect it was a neglected area of the design. |
| 12:28.11 | SpeedEvil | cb2: |
| 12:28.43 | cb23 | SpeedEvil, indeed, but its quite retarded when you look at how strictly other aspects have to be controlled |
| 12:29.16 | mickeyl | mudyc: i will, i just want to complete two or three more xml files before we dive into the discussion of changing/improving the interfaces. i hope i can finish that at the latest tomorrow |
| 12:29.25 | mickeyl | everything always takes longer as expected |
| 12:29.29 | mickeyl | i wonder whether this is a natural law or what |
| 12:29.30 | mickeyl | :D |
| 12:29.49 | mudyc | heh, things happens |
| 12:29.53 | cb23 | mickeyl, then give yourself a day to do a 3 day project ;) |
| 12:30.00 | cb23 | that way you'll finish on time! |
| 12:31.04 | *** join/#openmoko simon_ (n=simon@dyn167240.wlan.jku.at) |
| 12:32.57 | mbuf | trying to get USB-networking openmoko under qemu working; mount /dev/gadget returns "unknown filesystem "gadgetfs"; why? |
| 12:33.14 | mbuf | using Debian Etch |
| 12:34.13 | *** part/#openmoko mib_force (i=mib_forc@system-ready.org) |
| 12:35.22 | Sup3rkiddo | mbuf, there was some regression in the qemu that is causing this iirc....http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=1102 |
| 12:36.17 | mbuf | Sup3rkiddo, i see |
| 12:38.09 | mbuf | Sup3rkiddo, how do you disable dynticks? (bug #1103) |
| 12:39.53 | Sup3rkiddo | mbuf, i have no idea =(, i havent had much luck with qemu-neo1973 and networking |
| 12:40.46 | mbuf | Sup3rkiddo, i have been able to build code from svn; copied usb_gadget relevant headers; just need to mount this to stuff to use it |
| 12:41.01 | mbuf | Sup3rkiddo, follow manual setup, http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/OpenMoko_under_QEMU#Manual_setup |
| 12:41.10 | mbuf | brb |
| 12:42.13 | Sup3rkiddo | mbuf, i tried that...some one has been playing around with usb_gadgetfs.h, nneeded to find an old kernel which had that header in the proper place |
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| 12:50.56 | magellan | good morning all |
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| 12:53.51 | mbuf | Sup3rkiddo, how old? which kernel version? |
| 12:55.29 | Sup3rkiddo | mbuf, its not in the kernels 2.6.23, got it from 2.6.20 or something |
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| 12:55.36 | mbuf | Sup3rkiddo, ok |
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| 12:59.54 | magellan | is mickeyl around, or does someone want to help me with some build problems under moko makefile? |
| 13:00.45 | mickeyl | i'm around, but I'm afraid I can't help you with mokomakefile since I never used it |
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| 13:03.14 | magellan | mickeyl: you were able to give me some pointers and tell me why my comlies wasn't working about 4 days ago. |
| 13:03.27 | mickeyl | well |
| 13:03.29 | mickeyl | basically |
| 13:03.45 | mickeyl | monotone.openembedded.org synced with oe.org when oe.org was not building |
| 13:03.46 | magellan | you said that the developers had commited a revision to HEAD that didn't compitle |
| 13:03.50 | mickeyl | right |
| 13:03.54 | magellan | ya |
| 13:04.02 | mickeyl | and it seems there has been no sync since then |
| 13:04.08 | mickeyl | so the recommendation still the same |
| 13:04.13 | mickeyl | * wait |
| 13:04.17 | mickeyl | or |
| 13:04.17 | magellan | Ive tried to get around this but this is my first dive into work like this |
| 13:04.19 | mickeyl | * use org.oe.dev for the time being |
| 13:05.12 | magellan | Ive spend some time trying to figure out what you meant by that but I have been unable to figure it out |
| 13:05.57 | mickeyl | ah |
| 13:06.03 | mickeyl | well, apparantly there's some |
| 13:06.21 | mickeyl | target |
| 13:06.56 | mickeyl | to update from there |
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| 13:08.33 | mickeyl | make update-bleeding-edge or so |
| 13:08.45 | mickeyl | rwhitby would know for sure, it's his baby |
| 13:09.27 | rwhitby | yep, that's it |
| 13:09.48 | rwhitby | note that it's a one-way-street until the next OE->OM sync |
| 13:10.14 | magellan | meaning once I do this there is no turning back |
| 13:11.44 | rwhitby | not until OM catches up with that bleeding edge |
| 13:12.00 | magellan | so would I need to change OM_MONOTONE_SITE := monotone.openmoko.org to OM_MONOTONE_SITE := org.oe.dev |
| 13:12.50 | rwhitby | no, mickeyl gave you wrong information. you're using the org.openembedded.dev branch in both cases, but you'd be syncing with monotone.openembedded.org instead of the stable monotone.openmoko.org |
| 13:13.25 | rwhitby | (make update-bleeding-edge does this automatically for you) |
| 13:13.45 | rwhitby | update-bleeding-edge: |
| 13:13.45 | rwhitby | <PROTECTED> |
| 13:13.56 | hrw | mickeyl: cant openmoko create org.openembedded.openmoko branch on own server and propagate it from time to time? |
| 13:14.15 | rwhitby | hrw: there be dragons |
| 13:14.24 | hrw | mickeyl: it will make live easier as you will have total control over it and only one server with it |
| 13:14.44 | mickeyl | hrw: sure, they can do that. but I'd rather not have us do this. look at what dreambox became |
| 13:14.54 | mickeyl | this road is dangerous |
| 13:15.13 | hrw | mickeyl: the one which you go now is not safe too |
| 13:15.27 | mickeyl | why not? |
| 13:15.28 | rwhitby | hrw: it is if everyone obeys the road rules |
| 13:15.38 | mickeyl | this particular incident was an accidant |
| 13:15.39 | hrw | *if* everyone |
| 13:15.40 | mickeyl | i think |
| 13:16.03 | rwhitby | we need to call an ambulance to fix it :-) |
| 13:16.20 | mickeyl | pester JohnLee or XorA |
| 13:16.28 | mickeyl | they should have access to the server |
| 13:16.42 | XorA | whats happening? |
| 13:16.57 | mickeyl | someone apparantly sync'ed with org.oe.dev when it was not building |
| 13:17.06 | mickeyl | and it's not been resynced since then |
| 13:17.16 | mickeyl | so HEAD at monotone.openmoko.org is not building atm. |
| 13:17.21 | mickeyl | and it's been like that for days |
| 13:17.39 | hrw | mickeyl: you do not have daily autobuilder? |
| 13:17.52 | mickeyl | no idea |
| 13:18.11 | XorA | john told me it built as long as you dont use autorev |
| 13:18.25 | mickeyl | i don't think so |
| 13:18.27 | mickeyl | it's not just the terminal |
| 13:18.34 | mickeyl | if you fix that, then it complains about uboot |
| 13:18.39 | mickeyl | which received some renamings |
| 13:18.49 | magellan | so basically if I do make update-bleeding-edge followed by make openmoko-devel-image then I should be good to go? |
| 13:18.52 | mickeyl | so i guess the rev. was not tested that has been checked out |
| 13:19.07 | mickeyl | yeah, or make openmoko-image, which is faster |
| 13:19.13 | mickeyl | [if you don't need the devel tools] |
| 13:20.09 | mickeyl | hehe |
| 13:20.12 | XorA | hmm, this slowdown idea isnt going to work |
| 13:20.12 | mickeyl | mark that day |
| 13:20.24 | XorA | we need to advertise golden revs, not slow the tree I think |
| 13:20.40 | mickeyl | it worked fine until a couple of days ago |
| 13:20.53 | mickeyl | when it was updated without testing |
| 13:21.03 | mickeyl | then it can break, yeah |
| 13:21.09 | XorA | mickeyl: well check who synced those revs |
| 13:21.32 | XorA | I thought john was the only one with push access to mtn.om.org |
| 13:21.51 | mickeyl | i don't know whom he gave access now |
| 13:21.53 | mickeyl | who synced? |
| 13:22.57 | *** join/#openmoko dotmef (n=mef@mx1.bitwise.org) |
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| 13:37.04 | CIA-48 | openmoko: 03mickey * r3785 10/trunk/src/host/xoo/om-launch: xoo: add om-launch script |
| 13:43.05 | magellan | rwhitby: mickeyl: it still fails with openmoko-terminal2, it is unable to fetch due to 404 file not found, You said I needed to remove this from the build, where would I need to remove it from in order to have it not be built. |
| 13:43.24 | mickeyl | check where your sources are |
| 13:43.31 | mickeyl | then rm -rf openmoko-terminal2 |
| 13:43.34 | mickeyl | and let it redownload |
| 13:43.42 | mickeyl | e.g. |
| 13:44.26 | magellan | it is downloading for the first time and gets a 404:file not found error, openmoko-terminal2 isn't on the server |
| 13:44.44 | mickeyl | interesting |
| 13:44.49 | mickeyl | which revision is it trying to download? |
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| 13:47.00 | magellan | I believe head .trunk.src.target.OM-2007.2.applications_3542_.tar.gz' |
| 13:47.21 | mickeyl | 3542 is not head |
| 13:47.29 | mickeyl | but anyways |
| 13:47.40 | mickeyl | it's normal that a said rev is not on the mirror server |
| 13:47.47 | mickeyl | it just tries it first |
| 13:47.50 | mickeyl | then tries to download from svn |
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| 13:49.36 | magellan | rwhitby: any thoughts on this? |
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| 13:52.12 | CIA-48 | openmoko: 03werner * r3786 10/trunk/src/target/u-boot/patches/uboot-gta02.patch: |
| 13:52.12 | CIA-48 | openmoko: uboot-gta02.patch: |
| 13:52.12 | CIA-48 | openmoko: - board/neo1973/gta02/gta02.c (board_init): increase clock speed on GTA02 from |
| 13:52.12 | CIA-48 | openmoko: FCLK = 211 MHz, HCLK = 70 MHz, PCLK = 35 MHz |
| 13:52.12 | CIA-48 | openmoko: to |
| 13:52.12 | CIA-48 | openmoko: FCLK = 400 MHz, HCLK = 100 MHz, PCLK = 50 MHz |
| 13:56.23 | CIA-48 | openmoko: 03werner * r3787 10/trunk/src/target/u-boot/patches/uboot-gta02.patch: |
| 13:56.23 | CIA-48 | openmoko: uboot-gta02.patch: |
| 13:56.23 | CIA-48 | openmoko: - board/neo1973/gta02/gta02.c: remove obsolete comment about needing a voltage |
| 13:56.23 | CIA-48 | openmoko: increase |
| 13:56.42 | rtp | magellan: hi. Was it you who was trying to use the usb host patch ? |
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| 14:00.09 | magellan | rtp: indeed is was |
| 14:00.42 | magellan | and I had it working until I did an update and had everything stop compiling |
| 14:01.15 | rtp | magellan: ok |
| 14:01.18 | *** join/#openmoko doc|home (n=doc@gentoo/contributor/doc-007) |
| 14:01.25 | rtp | magellan: what kind of device you tested ? |
| 14:03.16 | magellan | rtp: a usb serial device |
| 14:04.01 | magellan | it wasn't nearly as hard as I expected |
| 14:05.37 | rtp | did you try a powered device like a usb hard driver with its own powersupply ? |
| 14:07.22 | magellan | I used a three headed cable |
| 14:08.17 | magellan | The device is powered but I don't know if it puts that power on the USB cable, I didn't think to plug it in without the power hooked up |
| 14:08.46 | magellan | I will have to try that once I get a working kernel again |
| 14:10.11 | magellan | the only other thing I had to do was to make sure the drivers were on the device, which they were, and then insmod usbserial.ko product=0xXXXX vendor=0xXXX from the correct directory. |
| 14:10.13 | SpeedEvil | rtyler: it may not work. Many self-powered devices will not wake up without USB power. |
| 14:10.15 | *** join/#openmoko jonkristian (n=admin@50.80-203-232.nextgentel.com) |
| 14:10.18 | SpeedEvil | rtp: |
| 14:10.24 | rtp | magellan: ok. I'll try it when my kernel tree will be up. Thanks for the answers |
| 14:10.40 | SpeedEvil | magellan: they make USB devices too - I thought they just did beer. |
| 14:11.25 | magellan | SpeedEvil: I would expect you are right about the power, I may have to open it up and do some jumpering |
| 14:11.35 | rtp | SpeedEvil: my setup is working on my n800. Unfortunately, it doesn't mean it'll work on the neo :/ |
| 14:11.58 | magellan | the 800, how hackable is that decice |
| 14:12.15 | jonkristian | I want one, should i wait, are there any upcoming hardware upgrades worth waiting for? |
| 14:13.00 | magellan | jonkristian: one what? |
| 14:13.11 | rtp | magellan: I don't know, I don't use my n800 for hacking. I've a n770 for that :) |
| 14:13.33 | jonkristian | ah, sorry, neo1973 |
| 14:14.06 | *** join/#openmoko Atul_ (n=qvantel@202.63.103.2) |
| 14:14.23 | SpeedEvil | the curente version has no wifi |
| 14:14.39 | jonkristian | SpeedEvil: oh, still? hmm... |
| 14:14.55 | SpeedEvil | No. The version you can buy now has been on sale since july. |
| 14:15.10 | magellan | jonkristian: I would wait for the next version |
| 14:15.11 | SpeedEvil | Though it is now _much_ faster to ship. |
| 14:15.49 | jonkristian | sweet, any news on when we might be expecting the next version? that's gta03 right? |
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| 14:16.05 | SpeedEvil | nope. |
| 14:16.10 | SpeedEvil | 02 |
| 14:16.10 | zash | afaik there will be no gta03 |
| 14:16.31 | SpeedEvil | It'll be at least 2 months. |
| 14:16.42 | SpeedEvil | I would not be surprised at 5 |
| 14:16.52 | SpeedEvil | 2 requires _lots_ of things to go right. |
| 14:17.01 | zash | they say ~march for gta02 aka freerunner |
| 14:17.02 | SpeedEvil | and for there to be no delays |
| 14:17.12 | SpeedEvil | maybe. |
| 14:17.41 | jonkristian | ok, any place i can be sure to get the release info first? like, http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973 |
| 14:17.57 | zash | and then it most likly wont be ready for everyday phone-usage |
| 14:18.03 | SpeedEvil | yeah. |
| 14:18.05 | zash | jonkristian: mailinglists |
| 14:18.06 | jonkristian | so, gta02 contains wifi, i thought gta02 was out now, hehe |
| 14:18.26 | jonkristian | zash: good idea |
| 14:18.29 | SpeedEvil | jonkristian: there are maybe 10 sort-of-working prototypes, with severe bugs. |
| 14:18.55 | jonkristian | ah |
| 14:19.44 | SpeedEvil | they are being used for driver development to see if there are other hardware bugs in the hardware the drivers are being developed for, before committing to a new version |
| 14:22.38 | jonkristian | wifi is well worth waiting for:) |
| 14:24.02 | zash | anyone got any idea if om could be ported to neonode n2? |
| 14:24.24 | SpeedEvil | ram/rom/cpu? |
| 14:26.29 | zash | duno, runns wince off miniSD |
| 14:27.02 | SpeedEvil | probably in principle. |
| 14:28.52 | zash | nice ui thou |
| 14:30.01 | El_Salvador | gta03? |
| 14:31.43 | jonkristian | El_Salvador: my bad, i just thought i had seen that somewhere, but i think there was some missunderstandings about that on youtube or something |
| 14:32.00 | jonkristian | *just* |
| 14:33.59 | El_Salvador | maybe the game |
| 14:34.02 | El_Salvador | :) |
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| 15:52.48 | CIA-1 | openmoko: 03werner * r3788 10/trunk/src/target/kernel/patches/ (fbset-gta02-core.patch fbset-smedia-glamo.patch series): (log message trimmed) |
| 15:52.48 | CIA-1 | openmoko: ddition of xrandr support for GTA02: |
| 15:52.48 | CIA-1 | openmoko: http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=1145 |
| 15:52.49 | CIA-1 | openmoko: In particular, this is the kernel patch (changed GLAMO_LOG a little): |
| 15:52.50 | CIA-1 | openmoko: http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/attachment.cgi?id=459 |
| 15:52.52 | CIA-1 | openmoko: Note: this doesn't work yet but crashes the kernel at driver initialization |
| 15:52.54 | CIA-1 | openmoko: instead. Don't enable ! |
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| 16:01.27 | CIA-1 | openmoko: 03werner * r3789 10/trunk/src/target/ (kernel/scripts/build u-boot/scripts/build): |
| 16:01.27 | CIA-1 | openmoko: - u-boot/scripts/build, kernel/scripts/build: removed "don't use" header |
| 16:01.27 | CIA-1 | openmoko: - u-boot/scripts/build: fixed space typo, breaking git version selection |
| 16:01.27 | CIA-1 | openmoko: - kernel/scripts/build: also update defconfig's SVN revision |
| 16:04.50 | Twey | So what's all this FreeRunner talk about? |
| 16:05.00 | mjr | it's a market name for gta02 |
| 16:05.08 | Twey | Ah |
| 16:05.30 | Twey | Oh, yes, topic. Heh. |
| 16:05.54 | Twey | It won't be shipped with devel tools? |
| 16:05.56 | XorA | it can run up walls and jump off cranes with a 007 following it |
| 16:06.01 | Twey | Hahaha |
| 16:07.52 | Xx13 | but will it blend? |
| 16:08.52 | *** join/#openmoko orino (n=orino@84-74-193-114.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 16:22.04 | thomasg | Xx13: you're spending one for blending? :) |
| 16:22.14 | anrp | oh, the humanity |
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| 16:26.07 | Xx13 | i'm not even sure i'll go for gta02, hw feels somewhat dated already |
| 16:26.45 | drath | Xx13: compare it to the gta01, and that feeling will go away ;) |
| 16:27.37 | anrp | :/ |
| 16:30.06 | *** join/#openmoko j_ack (n=j_ack@dsbg-4db7c181.pool.einsundeins.de) |
| 16:30.41 | Xx13 | that's true, but it should rather be compared with other products on the market, shiny little nokias and htc that ppl run around with |
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| 17:10.50 | kdean06 | Xx13, I suppose it depends on why you're buying into the OpenMoko ecosystem. For me, it's the commitment to Free Software from the developers here and from FIC. Nokia's stuff doesn't compare in that regard. And for me, there's not enough incentive to buy a GTA02 over an 01 based on my usage. :) It's all relative. |
| 17:13.29 | *** join/#openmoko nano- (i=nano@exodus.xmms.se) |
| 17:15.43 | wurp2 | Xx13: Yeah, who cares how nice the hw is on a Nokia, when you can't do anything with it except what both the hw manufacturer and your network provider approve? |
| 17:16.01 | *** join/#openmoko wirrwarr (n=fz@ppp-62-216-213-71.dynamic.mnet-online.de) |
| 17:17.04 | mjr | Nokia is a dick anyway |
| 17:17.12 | mjr | (yeah, I'm productive today) |
| 17:19.29 | teprrr | but will freerunner have symbian? |
| 17:19.50 | morricone | teprrr, why sould it have symbian? |
| 17:19.55 | teprrr | if I'm gonna buy it I'll surely miss my sweeet little s60 :( |
| 17:20.28 | zash | teprrr: nokia could port it to neo |
| 17:20.36 | teprrr | because it's from nokia and gtk sucks ;) |
| 17:20.59 | teprrr | symbian sucks too though |
| 17:21.07 | zash | everything sucks |
| 17:21.20 | zash | what matters is what sucks less |
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| 17:39.54 | teprrr | yup |
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| 18:06.11 | fanny_ | I guy at digg said that freerunner will be released in the end of the next month, is this true? :) |
| 18:07.31 | kdean06 | fanny_, No, there is no information at this time about a release for Freerunner. Anything you hear is speculation at best. |
| 18:07.38 | kdean06 | A flat out lie at worst. |
| 18:08.24 | kdean06 | fanny_, We've got ceveral mailing lists you can join if you're watching in anticipation. :) |
| 18:08.34 | kdean06 | s/ceveral/several |
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| 18:12.35 | fanny_ | nice kdean06 |
| 18:12.43 | fanny_ | where can I join them? |
| 18:12.59 | fanny_ | nvm foun it |
| 18:13.04 | fanny_ | found* |
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| 18:29.45 | inwoo | anyone have this odd issue? pcf50606_irq: and pcf50606_work keep scrolling messages and X never starts |
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| 18:52.27 | *** join/#openmoko _Krieger_ (n=warsword@80.90.233.15) |
| 18:54.26 | _Krieger_ | question to all who had success in running openmoko in qemu: tell your distro and installed packages. i had gentoo and had freezing on booting of openmoko; now i have debian sid in vmware, likely followed instructions, but compilation fails. i don`t want to waste time on tuning debian, please, tell me straight way |
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| 18:57.31 | kdean06 | _Krieger_, Works fine for me on Sid. |
| 19:00.18 | _Krieger_ | kdean06, can you tell me the list of installed packages on your Sid, please? |
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| 19:01.56 | kdean06 | _Krieger_, Here you go. :P Long list -> http://www.pastebin.ca/847035 |
| 19:02.19 | _Krieger_ | thanks |
| 19:02.20 | kdean06 | Oh, wait, this machine is Sidux. :S |
| 19:02.27 | kdean06 | But I've built it on both, so. |
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| 19:04.41 | erko | _Krieger__, It worked for me on ubuntu feisty. I can't remember the packages and have upgraded to gutsy since then. |
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| 19:26.42 | SpekTrumBash | beer |
| 19:26.43 | SpekTrumBash | need |
| 19:26.44 | SpekTrumBash | beer |
| 19:26.46 | SpekTrumBash | neeed |
| 19:26.47 | SpekTrumBash | beeerr |
| 19:26.49 | SpekTrumBash | dont kik |
| 19:26.51 | SpekTrumBash | i smeelz it |
| 19:26.53 | SpekTrumBash | siff |
| 19:26.54 | SpekTrumBash | sniff |
| 19:26.58 | SpekTrumBash | ppooof |
| 19:27.00 | SpekTrumBash | \\ |
| 19:27.01 | SpekTrumBash | .// |
| 19:27.02 | SpekTrumBash | .\\ |
| 19:27.03 | SpekTrumBash | .// |
| 19:27.05 | SpekTrumBash | .\\ |
| 19:27.06 | SpekTrumBash | .//// |
| 19:27.08 | SpekTrumBash | .\\ |
| 19:27.14 | mmontour | ~beer SpekTrumBash |
| 19:27.15 | apt | ACTION pulls out a exquisite Piraat for SpekTrumBash |
| 19:27.33 | SpekTrumBash | glar P !! |
| 19:27.34 | orospakr | is there going to be a new official build, at some point? "2008.1"? |
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| 19:29.31 | SpekTrumBash | run |
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| 20:49.47 | ewon | heh |
| 20:49.50 | SpeedEvil | :) |
| 20:50.06 | ewon | so what's your opinion of the new hw? |
| 20:50.16 | PP|Spydon | Was there anything nice about Freerunner on CES? |
| 20:50.18 | SpeedEvil | this is gta02v4? |
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| 20:50.27 | SpeedEvil | ->bal |
| 20:52.15 | balrog-kun | ewon: the progress it made is quite impressive, really there's so many details that have been fixed since gta01bv4 |
| 20:52.23 | balrog-kun | SpeedEvil: A4 |
| 20:52.35 | ewon | what's gps performance like? |
| 20:52.48 | CIA-1 | openmoko: 03werner * r3790 10/trunk/src/target/kernel/patches/ (fbset-gta02-core.patch fbset-smedia-glamo.patch series): (log message trimmed) |
| 20:52.48 | CIA-1 | openmoko: Fixed the crash on initialization, which was a disagreement between allocated |
| 20:52.48 | CIA-1 | openmoko: and cleared memory. It's this patch, with trivial editing: |
| 20:52.48 | CIA-1 | openmoko: http://folks.o-hand.com/dodji/omoko/kernel/fix-glamo-fb-init-crash.patch.txt |
| 20:52.50 | CIA-1 | openmoko: fbset-gta02-core.patch: |
| 20:52.52 | CIA-1 | openmoko: - arch/arm/mach-s3c2440/mach-gta02.c (gta02_glamo_pdata): initialize |
| 20:52.53 | balrog-kun | if it continues this way gta03 will rock :P |
| 20:52.54 | CIA-1 | openmoko: fb_mem_size to 4MB (half of the SRAM available on the chip) |
| 20:53.04 | balrog-kun | ewon: haven't checked yet |
| 20:54.05 | ewon | I'm interested to see how it does against the Sirf-III in less than ideal conditions |
| 20:56.16 | ewon | hah :) |
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| 21:06.35 | wurp2 | balrog-kun: I have a little python script that reads gpsd and measures your distance from the time you started it up |
| 21:06.39 | wurp2 | in feet |
| 21:06.56 | wurp2 | It might or might not be handy in evaluating gps resolution |
| 21:07.28 | *** join/#openmoko Crashbit (n=Crashbit@unaffiliated/crashbit) |
| 21:07.35 | *** part/#openmoko Crashbit (n=Crashbit@unaffiliated/crashbit) |
| 21:08.17 | wurp2 | The script just hits gpsd every three seconds and tells you how far you are from the first location it acquired after starting up |
| 21:08.18 | *** join/#openmoko Crashbit (n=Crashbit@unaffiliated/crashbit) |
| 21:08.40 | wurp2 | of course, it requires pygps + all the basic python packages to be installed |
| 21:08.49 | Crashbit | Alguno de habla hispana que me pueda ayudar! |
| 21:09.29 | wurp2 | Mi espanol es pobre, pero puedo intenter a ayudar... |
| 21:10.31 | wurp2 | s/intenter/intentar/ |
| 21:11.29 | wurp2 | es possible que babelfish.altavista.com es mas provechoso que yo |
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| 21:12.09 | Crashbit | mm ok, thx, tengo un neo1973 y no consigo llamar por telefono, estaba buscando el kernel que le instale, pero no lo encuentro |
| 21:12.37 | ewon | hablas englais? |
| 21:12.53 | Crashbit | de hecho el neo1973 es nuevo, me ha llegado hoy, el modelo creo que es el GTA01B |
| 21:13.01 | wurp2 | cual kernel usa? |
| 21:13.33 | wurp2 | no creo que necesito nueva kernel |
| 21:13.38 | Crashbit | wait a moment i'm searching kernel version |
| 21:14.14 | Crashbit | 2.6.22.5 |
| 21:14.24 | wurp2 | creo que tu' (no se como se dice, 'version') de gsm modem software no es correcto |
| 21:14.54 | Crashbit | version=version :) |
| 21:15.07 | wurp2 | mira a http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Carriers/ATT |
| 21:15.13 | wurp2 | muy bien ;-) |
| 21:15.19 | wurp2 | donde vive? |
| 21:15.46 | Crashbit | en espaƱa |
| 21:15.57 | wurp2 | ah |
| 21:16.49 | *** join/#openmoko freelock_ (n=john@foraker.freelock.com) |
| 21:16.57 | wurp2 | y cual red de telefono usa? |
| 21:17.52 | wurp2 | la gsm modem software version que es en el neo1973 cuando enviado no funcione para muchas cajas de SIM |
| 21:17.55 | Crashbit | orange |
| 21:18.07 | wurp2 | disculpa me |
| 21:18.09 | balrog-kun | wurp2: cool |
| 21:18.12 | wurp2 | no se como se dice |
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| 21:18.23 | balrog-kun | i perhaps won't have time to play with the gps until the weekend though |
| 21:18.38 | wurp2 | como ATT, Teletopia, Vodafone, TMobile, etc. |
| 21:18.49 | wurp2 | cual uno |
| 21:19.05 | balrog-kun | also i'm from the gypsy camp and preferably would not install gpsd :P |
| 21:19.27 | wurp2 | balrog-kun: I don't think I understand |
| 21:19.40 | wurp2 | You don't want to use gps, or just have a problem with gpsd in particular? |
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| 21:20.11 | balrog-kun | wurp2: about gypsy? it's a different gps daemon |
| 21:20.15 | balrog-kun | afaik less braindead than gpsd |
| 21:20.28 | wurp2 | ah, cool! |
| 21:20.36 | wurp2 | Is there a python module or it? ;-) |
| 21:20.57 | wurp2 | s/ or / for / |
| 21:20.59 | balrog-kun | yes, it comes with a python example snippet |
| 21:21.19 | wurp2 | I'll have to look into the differences and maybe switch |
| 21:21.25 | wurp2 | I didn't know we had an alternative to gpsd |
| 21:21.51 | wurp2 | although it sounds to me as if the gps problems are lower level than gpsd - the output from nmeaNP has already been munged |
| 21:22.32 | zedstar | gypsy looks interesting i like its dbus integration |
| 21:22.33 | balrog-kun | it's built on d-bus and doesn't have all the quirks for all the different gps devices implemented because it's quite young yet |
| 21:22.40 | balrog-kun | wurp2: what gps problems? |
| 21:22.52 | wurp2 | really crappy resolution |
| 21:23.03 | wurp2 | not telling you any changes in position unless they're significant |
| 21:23.33 | wurp2 | gllin has to be 'cleaning' the data before they send it to us, since there's no noise when you're standing still |
| 21:24.20 | wurp2 | but it suddenly jumps by 20 or 50 feet (5 to 15 meters) when you move far enough |
| 21:24.31 | balrog-kun | wurp2: oh i see |
| 21:24.35 | balrog-kun | i didn't know |
| 21:24.35 | zedstar | be cool if somebody is working on getting gpsy running with freerunner |
| 21:24.45 | balrog-kun | wurp2: but i thought gllin was also used onthe TomTom earlier? |
| 21:24.52 | wurp2 | I didn't either until I started playing with my distance checking program |
| 21:24.54 | PP|Spydon | does anyone know anything about hardware numbers? |
| 21:25.15 | wurp2 | navit further cleans your position to force you to be in one of the possible places it thinks you can be |
| 21:25.16 | balrog-kun | and TomTom afaik is regarded as one of the high-end GPSes? |
| 21:25.22 | wurp2 | I dunno |
| 21:25.52 | wurp2 | I just know that the data I get from the gps shows no motion when you move less than 2 meters (or it jumps & shows 10 meters difference) |
| 21:26.07 | wurp2 | It's possible that I have the scale of the sudden jumps wrong from bug in my software |
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| 21:26.31 | wurp2 | but I don't see how I could fail to identify that the position is unchanging when you're still or most of the time when you move just a little |
| 21:27.19 | wurp2 | I will also double check to see that the problem is in the gllin output, not just gpsd |
| 21:27.36 | wurp2 | But I think it is in nmeaNP, not just gpsd |
| 21:27.43 | balrog-kun | from what i read about Hammerhead it provided much better measures than most gpses on the market (which was supposed ot be a good justification for the driver limitations and price and dunno what else) |
| 21:28.05 | balrog-kun | i have no firsthand experience though |
| 21:29.05 | wurp2 | It is possible too that the same algorithm that works wonders on the TomTom hardware is not so hot on the GTA01 hardware |
| 21:29.44 | wurp2 | I was just expecting something like 1.5 meter resolution on the GTA01, and unless I'm just totally off base in my code, it's more like 10 meters, at best |
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| 21:31.57 | balrog-kun | hmm i thought 1.5m was not even theoretically possible for a civil gps? (no gpsd etc) |
| 21:32.33 | balrog-kun | err, d-gps |
| 21:33.00 | balrog-kun | TomTom makes up for that by using good maps but i wouldn't expect 1.5m from it either |
| 21:34.09 | balrog-kun | the hardware in the gta01 and the TomTom Go is supposed to be the exact same chip |
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| 21:35.19 | wurp2 | Maybe I misread (or misremembered) the article I read |
| 21:35.55 | wurp2 | balrog-kun: But I would think that the antenna arrangement, interfernce from other components, etc. would make differences between TomTom and GTA01 results |
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| 21:38.20 | wurp2 | Crashbit: ?sabe que puede usar http://babelfish.altavista.com/ a tranducir la website a espanol? |
| 21:39.24 | wurp2 | (la website = http://wiki.openmoko.org) |
| 21:40.43 | JanC | I think with the motion censors, you can get to 1.5m *when moving* ? |
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| 21:43.59 | zedstar | http://www.engadget.com/2008/01/08/hands-on-with-fics-openmoko-powered-freerunner/ |
| 21:44.01 | zedstar | kewl |
| 21:47.51 | El_Salvador | :O |
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| 21:54.00 | El_Salvador | http://www.engadget.com/photos/hands-on-with-fics-openmoko-powered-freerunner/567695/ |
| 21:55.52 | Crashbit | wurp2: yes, thanks pero no me aclaro |
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| 22:03.29 | wurp2 | Crashbit: En su caja de SIM, es un numero que identifica la version |
| 22:03.55 | balrog-kun | Crashbit: tienes una rootfs mas o menos reciente? |
| 22:04.13 | Crashbit | balrog-kun: si |
| 22:04.18 | Crashbit | yes |
| 22:04.33 | balrog-kun | desde alrededor de principios de diciembre creo que las llamadas funcionan segun la gente |
| 22:04.46 | wurp2 | Crashbit: en las paginas con titulo "Carriers", tablas identifican cual SIM version es apoyado y cual no son apoyado |
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| 22:05.28 | balrog-kun | o sea antes tambien funcionaban pero no sin intervenciones del usuario |
| 22:05.49 | wurp2 | suena como yo identifico el probelemo incorrecto - y balrog-kun tiene mucho mejor espanol que yo |
| 22:06.28 | balrog-kun | :p no so much |
| 22:06.41 | balrog-kun | but i would more likely bet on gsmd problems than hw |
| 22:07.11 | wurp2 | Well, I was trying to tell him that his SIM card might not be supported w/o the gsm modem sw update |
| 22:07.19 | manulito | whats the status of batterylife, still around 5hours? |
| 22:07.52 | balrog-kun | well, that's worth checking too but i think the unsupported SIMs are rather rare |
| 22:07.57 | balrog-kun | i dunno though |
| 22:07.59 | wurp2 | weird |
| 22:08.01 | Crashbit | mm the numer of SIM card have 19 digits |
| 22:08.03 | wurp2 | That was my problem |
| 22:08.33 | balrog-kun | wurp2: and you updated your modem firmware? |
| 22:08.35 | wurp2 | Crashbit: el numero que es escrito en la caja? |
| 22:08.40 | wurp2 | (hardware, not software) |
| 22:08.56 | wurp2 | balrog-kun: Not yet; my neo is right now in transit to M Shiloh |
| 22:09.04 | balrog-kun | wurp2: oh, cool |
| 22:09.13 | wurp2 | but my card is identified on the Carriers/ATT page as an unsupported one |
| 22:09.18 | Crashbit | mm caja =? box or card |
| 22:09.24 | wurp2 | card |
| 22:09.31 | wurp2 | pardon :-) |
| 22:09.59 | balrog-kun | es decir la tarjeta sim |
| 22:10.03 | Crashbit | yes, the number have 19 digits, it's possible ? |
| 22:10.55 | Crashbit | gsmd corre, /etc/init.d/gsmd start no da errores |
| 22:11.48 | balrog-kun | en /tmp/gsm.log tienes una salida un poco mas detallada de gsmd |
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| 22:11.56 | wurp2 | ah, entonces su SIM es aproyado |
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| 22:12.19 | donomo | http://www.engadget.com/2008/01/08/hands-on-with-fics-openmoko-powered-freerunner/ |
| 22:12.25 | Crashbit | wurp2: como lo sabes ? |
| 22:12.29 | wurp2 | si, necesita mira /tmp/gsm.log para errores |
| 22:12.59 | univac | :)) |
| 22:13.40 | *** part/#openmoko donomo (n=donp@donk.personaltelco.net) |
| 22:13.54 | wurp2 | disculpa, no se que su SIM es aproyado |
| 22:14.02 | wurp2 | pero |
| 22:16.22 | wurp2 | (un momento, busco para un pagina que explica como a aprobar su SIM) |
| 22:17.12 | wurp2 | Does anyone know the URL of the GTA01 usage guide that guy put together? |
| 22:17.18 | wurp2 | Gregario, maybe? |
| 22:18.54 | wurp2 | He had a sequence of commands to play with libgsmd-tool, and it will tell Crashbit right away if his card is supported |
| 22:21.06 | wurp2 | Crashbit: intenta (en sh) 'libgsmd-tool -m shell' |
| 22:21.19 | wurp2 | (cuando gsmd es corre) |
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| 22:22.32 | bagpuss_thecat | br3n: you spamming whore |
| 22:22.48 | wurp2 | y entonces (en libgsmd-tool -m shell): AT+CFUN=1 |
| 22:22.51 | br3n | sorry brain not engaged ... no on purpose |
| 22:23.30 | bagpuss_thecat | think before you speak, it'll save you from some nasty people next time |
| 22:23.37 | balrog-kun | "O" in -m shell mode is "AT+CFUN=1" in -m atcmd mode |
| 22:23.41 | wurp2 | Can anyone kick these dueling bots? |
| 22:23.52 | wurp2 | O, oops |
| 22:24.02 | cjb_ie | bagpuss_thecat: what is it with #osm and #openmoko'ers cross-pollinating ;) |
| 22:24.15 | bagpuss_thecat | cjb_ie: oh ghod, not you as well :-) |
| 22:24.16 | Crashbit | ok, wurp2 voy a probar |
| 22:24.22 | cjb_ie | there's about a dozen of us |
| 22:24.49 | wurp2 | Crashbit: disculpa, usa 'libgsmd-tool -m atcmd', no usa 'libgsmd-tool -m shell' |
| 22:25.05 | Ganneff | Crashbit, wurp2: could you (please) use english? |
| 22:25.16 | wurp2 | Crashbit: balrug-kun me corrige |
| 22:25.35 | wurp2 | Gannef: Crashbit doesn't speak much English, I guess, because he asked for help in spanish |
| 22:25.50 | cjb_ie | bagpuss_thecat: (i may have been very, very sad and uniq'd the two /who lists sorted by hostname) |
| 22:25.52 | wurp2 | I don't speak much spanish, but I'm in there plugging away :-) |
| 22:26.07 | bagpuss_thecat | cjb_ie: you need to get out more :-) |
| 22:26.12 | Crashbit | yes Ganneff sorry i don't understand english and wurp2 help me in spanish |
| 22:26.29 | cjb_ie | bagpuss_thecat: and do some mapping you mean? i quite agree. |
| 22:26.37 | bagpuss_thecat | lol |
| 22:27.01 | cjb_ie | got me a spark plug socket this morning, hopefully i won't break anything when i use it... |
| 22:27.52 | Ganneff | Crashbit, wurp2: fine. just in case you need more time - you might want to take it to /msg, as this is mostly an english speaking channel... :) |
| 22:28.26 | Crashbit | ok Ganneff i understand it, sorry :) |
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