| 00:05.30 | *** join/#openmoko heikkit (n=chatzill@c-67-188-122-139.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 00:11.01 | balrog-kun | "acquired a device that inludes software licensed by Openmoko" is quite liberal and can be interpreted to perhaps mean any device and apply to anybody |
| 00:11.28 | emdete | quicksand: -np switches off the names pipe... that's why i added it to the wiki. names pipes tend to fill up. i prefere udp |
| 00:13.18 | emdete | quicksand: and it's consistent, - switches off, + switches on. default for the options are different... |
| 00:15.00 | quicksand | emdete: this is quoted directly from the gllin.real -h output: |
| 00:15.08 | quicksand | +pty | -pty Enable or disable NMEA output to pty "/tmp/nmeaPTY" |
| 00:15.08 | quicksand | <PROTECTED> |
| 00:15.18 | quicksand | +np | -np Enable or disable NMEA output to named pipe "/tmp/nmeaNP" |
| 00:15.18 | quicksand | <PROTECTED> |
| 00:15.23 | *** join/#openmoko jeffdame1h (n=jeff@dyndsl-091-096-040-014.ewe-ip-backbone.de) |
| 00:16.36 | quicksand | So it's either inconsistent or wrong I figure. But in the big picture, I agree -- just get it from UDP, and turn everything else OFF. |
| 00:16.40 | balrog-kun | "openmoko specifically disclaims [...] warranties of [...] quiet enjoyment" |
| 00:17.02 | quicksand | But the current start script doesn't do that. It runs the pipe at /tmp/nmeaNP and fills up logfiles. |
| 00:19.10 | quicksand | Yes, the "warranty of quiet enjoyment" is a legal term of art. Basically, OM can't warranty that you can use your Neo or the software without third-party interference. |
| 00:20.40 | balrog-kun | quicksand: i see, thank. nice wording, i hadn't heard the phrase before |
| 00:20.49 | balrog-kun | but i don't read a whole lot of EULAs |
| 00:21.07 | *** join/#openmoko alphaone (n=daniel@2001:638:602:af01:20c:76ff:fe8d:9703) |
| 00:22.55 | quicksand | I'm an attorney, so I see this stuff a lot. :-) |
| 00:23.20 | *** join/#openmoko merriam (n=merriam@85-211-68-26.dyn.gotadsl.co.uk) |
| 00:24.46 | cesarb | meh, I completely failed. The maximum I got was three sats - I got four sats _once_. |
| 00:25.19 | *** join/#openmoko fatal- (i=fatal@ugly.blerp.org) |
| 00:25.33 | cesarb | how much of the sky do one need to get four sats for long enough? |
| 00:25.54 | SpeedEvil | where are you in the world - nearest city |
| 00:27.07 | cesarb | SpeedEvil: Rio de Janeiro is close enough |
| 00:28.47 | SpeedEvil | As I see it about 10 sats are up |
| 00:29.11 | balrog-kun | it seems some Neo GPSes work quite well and some work quite not at all |
| 00:29.20 | balrog-kun | i hope mine is in the former category |
| 00:30.18 | SpeedEvil | most of the sats happen to be in the northeastern hemisphere of the sky |
| 00:31.02 | Mononoke | hmm there are 27 satelites known for gps [old news] |
| 00:31.06 | Mononoke | are there more ? |
| 00:31.31 | Mononoke | if not it's possible that most of them could be centralised over one half of the earth :S |
| 00:31.34 | SpeedEvil | Mononoke: 30 I think |
| 00:32.10 | SpeedEvil | Mononoke: no - it's just that at any time more or less may be visible at a location |
| 00:32.15 | emdete | balrog-kun: where do you know that some work, some dont? |
| 00:32.39 | balrog-kun | emdete: from people's comments only so far |
| 00:32.43 | Mononoke | SpeedEvil: is there any source telling you where those satelites could be atm ? |
| 00:32.48 | SpeedEvil | Mononoke: I've got two-line elements for 30 |
| 00:32.54 | SpeedEvil | unless I'm mis-counting |
| 00:33.19 | emdete | balrog-kun: mine seems not to work well... |
| 00:33.22 | SpeedEvil | yeah - 30 sounds about right. |
| 00:33.44 | emdete | perhaps we should start a wiki to collect people, locations and expiriences... |
| 00:35.07 | emdete | i also wonder if the gsm has some influence on gps... |
| 00:35.24 | SpeedEvil | the interesting parts are the GPGSV lines in the output of the NMEA |
| 00:35.26 | Mononoke | http://www.calsky.com/?GPS= & http://www.nstb.tc.faa.gov/Full_WaasSatelliteStatus.htm |
| 00:35.38 | SpeedEvil | $GPGSV,3,1,11,10,73,232,27,08,70,132,24,21,15,326,34,25,36,060,13*70 |
| 00:35.40 | SpeedEvil | for example |
| 00:35.49 | SpeedEvil | has a report of 3 satellites |
| 00:36.09 | cesarb | no matter what I try, I can only see sats 2, 4, and 8 |
| 00:37.35 | SpeedEvil | you can see a narrow slice of sky to the northwest? |
| 00:37.55 | Mononoke | cesarb: the first link should tell you satelites around you |
| 00:37.58 | SpeedEvil | northeast even |
| 00:38.41 | cesarb | SpeedEvil: I can get northwest too in the other side (I'm in a corner of the building, so I can chose northeast and northwest |
| 00:38.56 | _diego__ | anybody know how to avoid this error: |
| 00:38.59 | Mononoke | those links doesn't work for me at all ^.^ as I have fedora an they had some mad security fix breaking FF |
| 00:39.02 | _diego__ | (openmoko-dates:1406): libecal-WARNING **: Cannot activate ECal: Failed to execute dbus-launch to autolaunch D-Bus session |
| 00:39.07 | SpeedEvil | nw looks like it might have more |
| 00:39.26 | SpeedEvil | though with 3, I'd have thought you'd get a 2d fix |
| 00:39.47 | balrog-kun | mickeyl: ping |
| 00:39.55 | Mononoke | but still haven't found more than 27 satelites |
| 00:40.03 | Mononoke | anyone please link me to more :) |
| 00:40.08 | mickeyl | balrog-kun: pong |
| 00:40.31 | Mononoke | hey mickeyl you should respond to ping in about 8 years :S |
| 00:40.57 | balrog-kun | mickeyl: regarding the patches in ombug 1034, i just made a fresh checkout of current svn and they applied (in order) seemingly seamlessly |
| 00:41.13 | balrog-kun | mickeyl: thanks for checking them out though :) |
| 00:41.14 | mickeyl | hmm |
| 00:41.30 | mickeyl | my oe says the 2nd one doesn't apply |
| 00:41.37 | mickeyl | let me try manually |
| 00:41.51 | balrog-kun | does oe apply patches of its own before? |
| 00:42.00 | mickeyl | no, not to libgsmd_svn |
| 00:42.08 | mickeyl | only to libgsmd-devel |
| 00:42.16 | balrog-kun | i see -_- |
| 00:42.21 | cesarb | SpeedEvil: I can only see sats 2 and 5 that side |
| 00:42.30 | RoboPhred | urg, anyone here know how the gtk+ code is set up? |
| 00:42.48 | SpeedEvil | you do know that the antenna is opposite to the hole? |
| 00:43.09 | SpeedEvil | reflections can happen |
| 00:43.10 | cesarb | SpeedEvil: yes, the hole is the gsm one, the gps one is on the other end, and the bluetooth one is somewhere in the middle |
| 00:43.14 | mickeyl | balrog-kun: Hunk #4 FAILED at 243. |
| 00:43.14 | mickeyl | Hunk #5 FAILED at 257. |
| 00:43.20 | mickeyl | patch 2/3 |
| 00:43.24 | Mononoke | As of September 2007, there are 31 actively broadcasting satellites in the GPS constellation. \o/ |
| 00:43.38 | mickeyl | and the other hunks have an offset of -23 lines |
| 00:44.21 | balrog-kun | mickeyl: are you using the standard "patch" utility? i'll try with this as i was using cg-patch now |
| 00:44.32 | mickeyl | yes, standard patch |
| 00:45.10 | cesarb | SpeedEvil: as to the 2d fix, doesn't it need a correct time? my neo's clock is completely off whack (I'm hoping someone soon will make gpds or something set the clock from the gps) |
| 00:45.20 | SpeedEvil | the GPS clock is seperate |
| 00:45.48 | SpeedEvil | #!/bin/ash |
| 00:45.49 | cesarb | SpeedEvil: doesn't it get turned off when you take the batteries off? |
| 00:45.49 | SpeedEvil | date `ssh 192.168.0.200 date "+%m%d%H%M%Y.%S"` |
| 00:45.55 | SpeedEvil | yes |
| 00:46.18 | SpeedEvil | however, I've got some logfiles from the GPS when it has had the clock misset by being off |
| 00:46.21 | SpeedEvil | which works fine |
| 00:46.27 | balrog-kun | mickeyl: also applied ok, i'll check if i uploaded the correct file :) |
| 00:47.33 | balrog-kun | yes, even in the right order |
| 00:48.00 | mickeyl | hmm strange |
| 00:48.10 | mickeyl | ok, once again to be sure |
| 00:48.36 | cesarb | SpeedEvil: it probably works fine... with 4 or more sats |
| 00:48.46 | balrog-kun | svn log shows r3519 on top |
| 00:48.54 | cesarb | SpeedEvil: at least the wiki says it needs 4 sats to get the clock |
| 00:49.26 | mickeyl | balrog-kun: that's wrong |
| 00:49.28 | mickeyl | mickey@andromeda:/local/pkg/openmoko/src/target/gsm$ sup |
| 00:49.28 | mickeyl | Revision 3543. |
| 00:50.18 | balrog-kun | [balrog@borg gsm]$ svn up |
| 00:50.18 | balrog-kun | At revision 3543. |
| 00:50.20 | mickeyl | ah nevermind |
| 00:50.25 | mickeyl | svn log shows 3519 as well |
| 00:50.38 | mickeyl | sometimes svn is strange |
| 00:52.13 | balrog-kun | i keep svn trees inside git trees just to be sure i know what's going on :P |
| 00:52.16 | mickeyl | hmm *shrug* now it works |
| 00:52.59 | quicksand | cesarb: I think you need three sats for a 2D fix and clock, four sats for a 3D fix |
| 00:53.08 | quicksand | Maybe even fewer for the clock, I don't recall. |
| 00:53.21 | *** join/#openmoko EuroTrash (i=unices@ip5652ade4.speed.planet.nl) |
| 00:56.39 | *** join/#openmoko mba (n=kvirc@bgl93-4-82-235-218-191.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 00:56.50 | balrog-kun | my dad had a gps self-synchronising wall clock that hung inside the flat somewhere and usually worked |
| 00:57.01 | balrog-kun | it was especially cool because it was in like 99 |
| 00:57.13 | mickeyl | g'night |
| 00:57.27 | balrog-kun | night mickey|zzZZzz |
| 00:58.34 | DukeOfURL | qemu-native-0.9.0+cvs20070613-r5 doesn't compile <sigh> |
| 00:58.56 | cesarb | quicksand: perhaps I didn't wait enough... how long would it take? |
| 00:59.18 | *** join/#openmoko daMaestro (n=jon@fedora/damaestro) |
| 00:59.28 | *** join/#openmoko mindCrime (n=chatzill@cpe-065-190-188-124.nc.res.rr.com) |
| 00:59.58 | DukeOfURL | where is the button to eliminate qemu from the buid process? |
| 01:01.13 | DukeOfURL | build |
| 01:01.18 | quicksand | cesarb: It took me about 11 minutes from a cold start to my first fix, with my Neo sitting on a windowsill. |
| 01:01.29 | balrog-kun | why is gllin.real executed twice by the script? |
| 01:01.50 | cesarb | quicksand: I didn't wait nearly as much, and with only three sats, it's no wonder I'm not getting a fix |
| 01:06.21 | balrog-kun | has anyone figured out what architecture is the code in the NVRAM?.DAT files? |
| 01:06.25 | quicksand | balrog-kun: the first time it does some rapid power-cycling and self-check operations (all those things that scroll by). The second sets it to generate NMEA output once per second. |
| 01:06.51 | quicksand | I could tell you but apt would have to kill you. |
| 01:07.22 | balrog-kun | :) |
| 01:07.30 | balrog-kun | i will find out |
| 01:08.12 | *** join/#openmoko rd_ (n=dr@vnsecurity.net) |
| 01:08.23 | cesarb | balrog-kun: I'd expect these files to be data, not code... |
| 01:08.41 | cesarb | balrog-kun: what would be found in the NVRAM/EEPROM on a smarter gps chip |
| 01:09.00 | cesarb | balrog-kun: things like the most recent almanac, the last seen fix, and so on |
| 01:11.39 | balrog-kun | cesarb: yes, possible |
| 01:13.25 | *** join/#openmoko bluelightning (n=blueligh@122-57-164-172.jetstream.xtra.co.nz) |
| 01:14.25 | *** join/#openmoko AlexJTanner (n=alex@68-187-80-127.dhcp.eucl.wi.charter.com) |
| 01:16.11 | cesarb | balrog-kun: in fact, I'd expect these two files to be recreated if not present |
| 01:16.36 | cesarb | balrog-kun: unless they have some important data like calibration tables |
| 01:16.52 | mmontour | cesarb: yes, you can delete the NVRAMs and they'll be re-created |
| 01:20.05 | *** part/#openmoko quicksand (i=cwixon@gateway/tor/x-f3160e0272f3d508) |
| 01:21.24 | *** join/#openmoko hiS_oWn_ (n=chatzill@adsl-75-26-140-138.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net) |
| 01:22.56 | *** join/#openmoko hiS_oWn__ (n=chatzill@adsl-75-26-140-138.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net) |
| 01:26.48 | *** join/#openmoko Kero (n=kero@dhcp-077-251-029-148.chello.nl) |
| 01:29.38 | *** join/#openmoko tick (n=tick@122-124-71-107.dynamic.hinet.net) |
| 01:30.17 | *** part/#openmoko stefan_schmidt (n=stefan@datenfreihafen.org) |
| 01:33.33 | *** join/#openmoko shenki (n=joel@202.174.42.5) |
| 01:35.02 | *** join/#openmoko greentux_ (n=lemke@Z705c.z.pppool.de) |
| 01:55.55 | CIA-14 | 03tick * r3545 10/trunk/src/target/gsm/ (8 files in 5 dirs): gsmd: Submitting a PIN for authentication needs to respond with status too.(Andrzej Zaborowski) |
| 01:57.22 | CIA-14 | 03tick * r3546 10/trunk/src/target/gsm/ (9 files in 5 dirs): gsmd: Severe clean-up (Andrzej Zaborowski) |
| 01:59.52 | *** join/#openmoko jserv-- (n=jserv@218.4.143.118) |
| 02:00.30 | RoboPhred | this isnt making sense... somehow the gtk menu is always making the last selected item show up at the top due to the offset, yet the code doesnt seem to have anything to do with it |
| 02:01.17 | RoboPhred | this should be simple... |
| 02:02.40 | *** join/#openmoko dkirker (n=dkirker@adsl-70-135-165-13.dsl.snlo01.sbcglobal.net) |
| 02:03.40 | balrog-kun | yay! thanks tick |
| 02:03.59 | tick | balrog-kun, ^^ |
| 02:04.38 | *** join/#openmoko holycow (n=new@mail.wjsgroup.com) |
| 02:06.49 | jserv-- | tick, hi |
| 02:07.00 | tick | jserv--, hi |
| 02:08.12 | *** join/#openmoko chris^ (n=kraetzi@p548AED6F.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 02:09.16 | jserv-- | tick, can you clarify the usage of sleep in src/gsmd/gsmd.c (main)? |
| 02:09.20 | jserv-- | -- |
| 02:09.30 | jserv-- | <PROTECTED> |
| 02:09.31 | jserv-- | <PROTECTED> |
| 02:09.31 | jserv-- | <PROTECTED> |
| 02:09.31 | jserv-- | -- |
| 02:09.37 | jserv-- | tick, I meant the part. |
| 02:11.15 | tick | jserv--, I think it's waiting for GSM modem's response |
| 02:12.10 | balrog-kun | i think this piece was added by alphaone |
| 02:12.11 | tick | atcmd_drain is trying to drain all msg from uart |
| 02:12.52 | balrog-kun | a vague explanation is at http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/commitlog/2007-August/002327.html |
| 02:13.04 | tick | balrog-kun, cool |
| 02:13.25 | balrog-kun | :) |
| 02:13.51 | jserv-- | tick, yes, I see, but I am thinking of being lazy initializing GSM modem after startup. |
| 02:14.10 | alphaone | jserv--: That was an attempt to circumvent some intermittent failure of gsmd. |
| 02:15.02 | alphaone | jserv--: And I don't think it was ever particularly useful |
| 02:17.35 | alphaone | Anyway, good night |
| 02:17.57 | balrog-kun | night alphaone |
| 02:17.59 | tick | alphaone, good night |
| 02:18.57 | ewon | o/ |
| 02:19.29 | tick | jserv--, I think we may not need to do that sleep now. (need to try) |
| 02:20.11 | jserv-- | tick, good. :-) |
| 02:20.23 | *** join/#openmoko summatusmentis (n=summatus@umm-yrless170.morris.umn.edu) |
| 02:20.46 | tick | jserv--, verifying |
| 02:22.39 | *** join/#openmoko fgau__ (n=fgau@pD9538023.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 02:24.19 | *** join/#openmoko eonj (n=ENJ@c-68-35-225-183.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) |
| 02:24.26 | tick | jserv--, I removed write '\r' and sleep. It's work for me, for the first trial. |
| 02:25.07 | jserv-- | tick, you shall try the case when gsm modem is about to sleep. |
| 02:25.46 | tick | jserv--, you mean? |
| 02:26.53 | jserv-- | tick, we need to consider the timing issues while power management is introduced. |
| 02:27.25 | tick | jserv--, oh I see |
| 02:27.33 | RoboPhred | anyone mind helping me figure out whats up with the gtkmenu code? |
| 02:28.07 | balrog-kun | the '\r' might potentially be useful, for example if you opened "cu /dev/ttyblahblah" and wrote half of a command with no newline at the end, and afterwards ran gsmd, the first command (ATZ) would be received by modem with some characters in front of it |
| 02:30.56 | tick | balrog-kun, ya, I had noticed that. but I am wondering is it work if I remove the '\r'. just curious. |
| 02:31.25 | balrog-kun | oh okies |
| 02:37.21 | *** join/#openmoko johncylee (n=john@219-84-30-182-adsl-tpe.STATIC.so-net.net.tw) |
| 02:43.23 | tick | balrog-kun, ya '\r' does affect |
| 02:56.19 | *** join/#openmoko summatusmentis (n=summatus@umm-yrless170.morris.umn.edu) |
| 02:59.11 | *** join/#openmoko Aria (n=aredride@acrux.theinternetco.net) |
| 03:02.01 | tick | jserv--, After testing for 15 times, I think removing the sleep(1) is ok. |
| 03:05.49 | CIA-14 | 03tick * r3547 10/trunk/src/target/gsm/src/gsmd/gsmd.c: gsmd: remove a dummy sleep(1) (Tick) |
| 03:07.22 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@qiqinebs.chi.il.us) |
| 03:11.30 | *** join/#openmoko oppiz (n=zippo@pool-96-228-29-134.rcmdva.fios.verizon.net) |
| 03:16.11 | jserv-- | tick, thanks |
| 03:16.21 | tick | jserv--, welcome |
| 03:26.18 | *** join/#openmoko D620Adam (n=D620Adam@ppp-70-243-80-55.dsl.austtx.swbell.net) |
| 03:26.19 | *** join/#openmoko amarsh04 (n=amarsh04@CPE-124-182-113-3.sa.bigpond.net.au) |
| 03:26.31 | *** join/#openmoko xamindar (n=xamindar@c-67-174-253-189.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 03:27.10 | *** join/#openmoko buckrey (n=buckrey@218.111.232.41) |
| 03:30.34 | jserv-- | tick, BTW, how about splitting phonebook from usock.c? |
| 03:31.50 | tick | jserv--, L. Sean is working on phonebook stuff and I will ask him about this |
| 03:32.01 | jserv-- | tick, cool |
| 03:32.06 | *** part/#openmoko Aria (n=aredride@acrux.theinternetco.net) |
| 03:37.19 | *** join/#openmoko mmontour (n=mmontour@S01060016b606e65a.vc.shawcable.net) |
| 03:43.10 | *** join/#openmoko orospakr (n=orospakr@CPE001a70d1de84-CM0019474a8676.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 03:46.00 | *** join/#openmoko MBitter_ (n=malbi@p3EE25027.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 03:59.58 | *** join/#openmoko dkirker (n=dkirker@adsl-70-135-165-13.dsl.snlo01.sbcglobal.net) |
| 04:02.59 | *** join/#openmoko Zoolooc (n=fredsiba@p54950CB9.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 04:03.56 | *** join/#openmoko SP-8472 (i=8472@dslb-084-056-225-254.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 04:15.47 | *** join/#openmoko Kasheye (n=alex@68-187-80-127.dhcp.eucl.wi.charter.com) |
| 04:16.39 | *** join/#openmoko chris^^ (n=kraetzi@p548AF0D7.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 04:20.53 | *** join/#openmoko doughnut42 (n=goden@cpe-72-177-112-195.austin.res.rr.com) |
| 04:22.23 | *** join/#openmoko icman (n=Administ@60-249-22-235.HINET-IP.hinet.net) |
| 04:23.20 | *** join/#openmoko mib_force (i=mib_forc@2001:1638:17a5:0:0:0:0:20) |
| 04:32.44 | *** join/#openmoko niklauz (i=d863b241@gateway/web/cgi-irc/ircatwork.com/x-a6f46c1b38b25aad) |
| 04:35.39 | niklauz | i all, hows it going? |
| 04:35.52 | niklauz | *hi |
| 04:44.49 | *** join/#openmoko dkj10738 (n=dkj10738@c-71-57-52-206.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 04:44.53 | *** join/#openmoko JOSF (i=JOSF@53d82a8a.adsl.enternet.hu) |
| 04:52.21 | *** join/#openmoko niklauz (i=d863b241@gateway/web/cgi-irc/ircatwork.com/x-bca24d0c1557b0d1) |
| 04:53.42 | *** join/#openmoko jkilb_ (n=jkilb@p5B2097FA.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 05:04.22 | *** join/#openmoko unmadindu (n=sayamind@gnu-india/admin/unmadindu) |
| 05:09.52 | *** join/#openmoko chode (n=chode@pD9E8A42B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 05:12.49 | *** join/#openmoko linuxxr (n=brian@ip70-178-27-23.ks.ks.cox.net) |
| 05:13.09 | linuxxr | and the word is? |
| 05:13.33 | HistoryOnTheRoad | up |
| 05:19.44 | xzcvczx | down |
| 05:19.57 | *** join/#openmoko heikkit (n=chatzill@c-67-188-122-139.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 05:21.31 | *** join/#openmoko tonyg_ (n=tonyg@91.84.108.56) |
| 05:22.51 | tonyg_ | I'm really having bad luck with builds over the past few days. |
| 05:23.11 | tonyg_ | Now I'm seeing mtn: network error: failed to connect: Connection refused |
| 05:23.19 | tonyg_ | in reference to monotone.openmoko.org |
| 05:27.47 | *** join/#openmoko bluelightning (n=blueligh@122-57-166-74.jetstream.xtra.co.nz) |
| 05:38.21 | *** join/#openmoko xzcvczx (n=swel024@ip-118-90-10-53.xdsl.xnet.co.nz) |
| 05:41.59 | CIA-14 | 03rwhitby * r168 10mokomakefile/trunk/Makefile: Added update-stable and update-bleeding-edge convenience targets |
| 05:42.36 | rwhitby | make update-bleeding-edge goes to monotone.openembedded.org |
| 05:46.54 | tonyg_ | rwhitby, that seems to be the default I have in my OE.mtn, too |
| 05:47.03 | tonyg_ | perhaps that's the source of my woes |
| 05:49.12 | *** part/#openmoko AlexJTanner (n=alex@68-187-80-127.dhcp.eucl.wi.charter.com) |
| 05:49.45 | *** join/#openmoko AlexJTanner (n=alex@68-187-80-127.dhcp.eucl.wi.charter.com) |
| 05:50.02 | *** join/#openmoko AlexJTanner (n=alex@68-187-80-127.dhcp.eucl.wi.charter.com) |
| 05:50.20 | *** join/#openmoko summatusmentis (n=summatus@umm-yrless170.morris.umn.edu) |
| 05:52.22 | *** join/#openmoko Dwight2 (n=chatzill@vc-196-207-32-223.3g.vodacom.co.za) |
| 05:54.23 | mjr | one wonders, though |
| 05:54.33 | Dwight2 | about? |
| 05:54.37 | mjr | is iptables available in some package? couldn't find it |
| 05:54.57 | mjr | would like to nat my laptop |
| 05:57.34 | HistoryOnTheRoad | hmmmm. |
| 05:58.01 | HistoryOnTheRoad | If I munged my rootfs, do I have to NAND erase it to reflash a known good rootfs? |
| 05:58.23 | mjr | if you don't have a sufficiently new uboot (newer than factory) |
| 05:58.41 | HistoryOnTheRoad | ah |
| 05:58.55 | mjr | don't recall the exact versions |
| 06:00.31 | SpeedEvil | nand erase rootfs works |
| 06:00.57 | mjr | it does |
| 06:00.58 | SpeedEvil | as does dd if=/dev/zero of=/whateverthepartition |
| 06:01.34 | SpeedEvil | however, that will crash the nand access, and you'll need to reboot |
| 06:01.36 | SpeedEvil | but... |
| 06:02.26 | SpeedEvil | mjr: if you're lazy - ssh works as a socks repearer |
| 06:02.39 | mjr | oh yeah, I forgot about that |
| 06:02.41 | mjr | thanks |
| 06:02.46 | mjr | (I am) |
| 06:02.48 | SpeedEvil | remember to use it for nameservice too |
| 06:03.20 | *** join/#openmoko eonj (n=ENJ@c-68-35-225-183.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) |
| 06:04.18 | HistoryOnTheRoad | Now if I could only figure out where Debian hides the damned serial term program |
| 06:05.01 | *** join/#openmoko tholin (n=tholin@85.8.6.155.static.se.wasadata.net) |
| 06:05.22 | tonyg_ | wah, monotone.openmoko.org connection refused still ;-( |
| 06:09.43 | HistoryOnTheRoad | Look at that. Apt works much better with a working sources.list |
| 06:15.04 | HistoryOnTheRoad | SpeedEvil: Thanks for the tip, once I get serial term working I'll try that. |
| 06:16.39 | *** join/#openmoko moko-bunny (n=reik@CPE-76-178-148-218.natnow.res.rr.com) |
| 06:17.33 | *** part/#openmoko sikahakki (i=hakki@wanha.org) |
| 06:21.27 | SpeedEvil | just remember - nand erase = brick |
| 06:21.33 | SpeedEvil | nand erase rootfs = ok |
| 06:21.51 | HistoryOnTheRoad | heh heh |
| 06:22.06 | HistoryOnTheRoad | I'm in Canada, it would be a puck |
| 06:22.39 | HistoryOnTheRoad | I followed the wiki page |
| 06:22.42 | HistoryOnTheRoad | nand erase clean rootfs |
| 06:22.57 | HistoryOnTheRoad | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Nand_erase |
| 06:24.34 | HistoryOnTheRoad | Well, busting my neo's filesystem got me to unbust my Debian here to get the neo going again. It would be nice if just once everything worked in harmony |
| 06:25.32 | HistoryOnTheRoad | So, as long as the wiki is right, I'm ok |
| 06:25.55 | HistoryOnTheRoad | the dfu download seems to be going though |
| 06:33.23 | *** join/#openmoko netx (n=rlange@osiris.darkempire.org) |
| 06:33.46 | *** join/#openmoko peter__b (n=biertrin@p5B0C16D2.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 06:34.02 | *** join/#openmoko lalo (n=lalo@sourcemage/mage/lalo) |
| 06:37.18 | *** join/#openmoko weez (n=weez@simulakrum.com) |
| 06:38.44 | HistoryOnTheRoad | SpeedEvil: WOW, am I impressed :D |
| 06:40.02 | HistoryOnTheRoad | ok, n/m, it looks impressive because the clock and date seemed right :P |
| 06:46.55 | *** join/#openmoko niklauz (i=d863b241@gateway/web/cgi-irc/ircatwork.com/x-2e0f645192bac104) |
| 06:50.50 | *** join/#openmoko Dwight2 (n=chatzill@vc-196-207-32-226.3g.vodacom.co.za) |
| 06:57.34 | *** join/#openmoko baird (n=cbaird@brushtail.apana.org.au) |
| 07:01.08 | *** join/#openmoko rd_ (n=dr@s15244973.onlinehome-server.info) |
| 07:05.33 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@81.80-202-132.nextgentel.com) |
| 07:08.09 | *** join/#openmoko weez (n=weez@simulakrum.com) |
| 07:28.57 | *** join/#openmoko thomasg_ (n=thomasg@p57AFCFAA.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 07:29.32 | *** join/#openmoko mi|house (n=milhouse@bas2-montreal28-1242550363.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 07:32.40 | *** join/#openmoko Sup3rkiddo (n=sudharsh@unaffiliated/sudharsh) |
| 07:47.10 | torpor | wtf? |
| 07:47.10 | torpor | mtn: connecting to monotone.openmoko.org |
| 07:47.11 | torpor | mtn: network error: failed to connect: Connection refused |
| 07:47.13 | *** join/#openmoko sparq_ (n=russell@ich.thy.om.orpho.us) |
| 07:48.40 | torpor | mjr: how'd you get gprs working? |
| 07:49.44 | mjr | as per wiki instructions (well, I also disabled lcp echoes, but am not sure it's essential) |
| 07:50.07 | *** join/#openmoko borg_ (n=olaf@80.149.17.21) |
| 07:50.40 | torpor | well it sure is nice to hear you got it working .. i'd also like to be using my neo as a gprs gateway for my laptop .. |
| 07:50.44 | torpor | hell, put squid on there too .. ;) |
| 07:51.27 | mjr | it would be nice if it could receive phonecalls while doing this, but not so important ;] |
| 07:52.29 | HistoryOnTheRoad | Does anyone know if mounting/detecting the SD card is busted in the latest scaredycat image? |
| 07:54.16 | HistoryOnTheRoad | It doesn't seem devfs is making a node for the SD card. root issue, or maybe a module mismatch? :S |
| 07:56.53 | *** join/#openmoko Linux_Galore (n=richard@60-242-20-212.static.tpgi.com.au) |
| 08:00.26 | *** join/#openmoko behdad (n=behdad@CPE001217b19226-CM0012c9c84bc4.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 08:05.53 | *** join/#openmoko pvanhoof (n=pvanhoof@d54C0EE14.access.telenet.be) |
| 08:06.50 | *** join/#openmoko chode (n=chode@pD9E8A42B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 08:07.22 | *** join/#openmoko tonyg (n=tonyg@91.84.108.56) |
| 08:09.48 | tonyg | how do I force a .bb file to use a particular automake version? |
| 08:09.56 | tonyg | i have some code that needs 1.9.6 |
| 08:10.01 | tonyg | but oe defaults to 1.9.3 |
| 08:11.02 | DukeOfURL | `does anyone know why monotone.openmoko.org is refusing connections? |
| 08:12.32 | tonyg | DukeOfURL, no, but you're the third to report the problem in the last couple of hours |
| 08:12.34 | tonyg | I get it too |
| 08:13.19 | *** join/#openmoko icma1 (n=Administ@60-249-22-235.HINET-IP.hinet.net) |
| 08:16.09 | *** join/#openmoko whm (i=terooj@jymy.kase.fi) |
| 08:33.42 | *** join/#openmoko zilux` (n=user@bdy93-1-82-67-223-79.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 08:38.08 | *** join/#openmoko ifeel (n=ifeel@151.70.141.16) |
| 08:42.40 | *** join/#openmoko rmoravcik (n=rmoravci@ip-89-102-255-171.karneval.cz) |
| 08:43.26 | *** join/#openmoko leila (n=leila@s55915244.adsl.wanadoo.nl) |
| 08:48.11 | *** join/#openmoko buz (n=buz@84-73-66-71.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 08:49.02 | *** join/#openmoko marsan (n=marsan@ti500720a080-12026.bb.online.no) |
| 08:53.53 | *** join/#openmoko AlexJTanner (n=alex@68-187-80-127.dhcp.eucl.wi.charter.com) |
| 08:56.04 | rwhitby | use make update-bleeding-edge if you want to use the bleeding edge OE server instead. |
| 08:56.05 | *** part/#openmoko johncylee (n=john@219-84-30-182-adsl-tpe.STATIC.so-net.net.tw) |
| 09:06.23 | Sup3rkiddo | is the uboot-mkimage not found error while building linux-openmoko a known thing? |
| 09:07.14 | Sup3rkiddo | ..and is monotone.openmoko.org down or something? |
| 09:08.10 | *** join/#openmoko thomasgruebler (n=thomasgr@85-124-167-249.work.xdsl-line.inode.at) |
| 09:10.18 | rwhitby | Sup3rkiddo: Looks like OM needs some experience in running a monotone server :-) |
| 09:11.46 | rwhitby | (i.e. I bet they don't have a cron job which checks every minute to make sure the monotone server is still running, like nslu2-linux does) |
| 09:12.09 | mjr | ... |
| 09:12.10 | mjr | right |
| 09:12.19 | Sup3rkiddo | so i guess i will check bugzilla for it, but the uboot-mkimage stuff? |
| 09:13.16 | *** join/#openmoko Maledictus (n=Malebob@f048042084.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 09:17.24 | torpor | i wanna make an openmoko t-shirt. |
| 09:17.29 | torpor | it basically says this: " Running task 1012 of 5065 " |
| 09:21.28 | Sup3rkiddo | 1076 here |
| 09:21.32 | Sup3rkiddo | i have the lead |
| 09:28.45 | torpor | too bad we can't share cycles. |
| 09:29.53 | Sup3rkiddo | too bad i hit the wall while building linux-openmoko :/ |
| 09:33.30 | josch | my openmoko shirt would say: NOTE: build 200712011033: completed :-D |
| 09:35.00 | Sup3rkiddo | josch: bah |
| 09:36.40 | Sup3rkiddo | josch: I dare you to make update-bleeding-edge and then talk |
| 09:37.00 | rwhitby | Mine would say: "mtn: 1.3 k | 1.5 k | 4/1034 | 2/1245" |
| 09:37.08 | josch | Sup3rkiddo, I know.... monotone server is down :-( |
| 09:37.44 | Sup3rkiddo | josch: thats the openmoko server, openembedded is up and i have payed the price for it |
| 09:38.15 | rwhitby | someone who has downloaded last from openmoko just needs to open up a port and let everyone else sync from them. In monotone, there is no central server. |
| 09:41.09 | *** join/#openmoko MetaMorfoziS (n=khmhm@3e70d05a.adsl.enternet.hu) |
| 09:41.47 | *** part/#openmoko doughnut42 (n=goden@cpe-72-177-112-195.austin.res.rr.com) |
| 09:48.21 | *** join/#openmoko jpozlovsky (n=jindra@rb5cc115.net.upc.cz) |
| 09:49.08 | *** join/#openmoko joern__ (n=joern@e177147124.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 09:50.29 | *** join/#openmoko Dvalin (i=hawkeye@195.0.160.130) |
| 09:50.55 | Dvalin | does anyone know if openmoko may run on A1200 too, not only A1200E? and about any howtos for it? :) |
| 09:50.59 | torpor | how does one get e17 started on the neo? is there some deep hackery involved? |
| 09:52.09 | *** join/#openmoko slomo (n=slomo@ubuntu/member/slomo) |
| 09:52.17 | *** join/#openmoko buz (n=buz@84-73-66-71.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 09:53.48 | *** join/#openmoko miip (n=miip@p54A54373.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 09:55.46 | *** part/#openmoko icma1 (n=Administ@60-249-22-235.HINET-IP.hinet.net) |
| 09:57.15 | *** join/#openmoko mkmks (n=viv@nfrolov.dialup.corbina.ru) |
| 09:59.38 | *** join/#openmoko morricone (n=foobar@dslb-084-057-156-208.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 09:59.58 | *** join/#openmoko pwerken (n=pwerken@83.119.198.36) |
| 10:06.58 | *** join/#openmoko Magon (n=Magon@archangel.kolej.mff.cuni.cz) |
| 10:10.32 | *** join/#openmoko Marcel_M (n=Marcel_M@86.59.65.236) |
| 10:13.26 | *** join/#openmoko Tob1 (n=tobi@p5B00733E.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 10:13.43 | *** join/#openmoko gnu{- (n=gnu@quiet.toad.com) |
| 10:14.09 | *** join/#openmoko Ophelia (n=Ophelia@pD9EAA5D7.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 10:18.28 | *** join/#openmoko mmp (n=mmp@adsl-d145.84-47-55.t-com.sk) |
| 10:18.33 | josch | torpor, it's very very very easy |
| 10:18.44 | josch | torpor, make build-package-e-wm |
| 10:18.53 | josch | torpor, then ipkg install e-wm |
| 10:18.57 | josch | reboot |
| 10:18.58 | josch | done |
| 10:19.20 | leila | not exactly deep hackery :) |
| 10:19.53 | josch | I didn't believe it when someone told me the same but I tried and it's true ^^ |
| 10:20.16 | torpor | but then this replaces the standard gui right? |
| 10:20.27 | torpor | how do we go back and forth? |
| 10:20.41 | josch | torpor, it's just some linking |
| 10:20.45 | torpor | i'd like to try e out for sure, but i don't want to impede my ability to work on a standard app. |
| 10:20.51 | josch | torpor, ipkg informs you about what it links |
| 10:20.54 | torpor | (since i don't think e is gonna be standard any time soon) |
| 10:23.23 | *** join/#openmoko ckuethe (n=ckuethe@S0106000024c38a18.ed.shawcable.net) |
| 10:35.58 | *** join/#openmoko wucheng (n=jacky@218.7.43.204) |
| 10:36.38 | wucheng | hi,how could i start a console in my qemu neo1973? |
| 10:38.05 | *** join/#openmoko nirz (n=nir@bzq-79-180-65-6.red.bezeqint.net) |
| 10:40.27 | *** join/#openmoko thomasgruebler (n=thomasgr@85-124-167-249.work.xdsl-line.inode.at) |
| 10:43.13 | rwhitby | hopefully e uses update-alternatives, which would mean that our old wm returns after you uninstall e-wm |
| 10:44.41 | *** join/#openmoko Tyrael (n=tyrael@213-140-6-114.ip.fastwebnet.it) |
| 10:45.07 | *** join/#openmoko ifeel (n=ifeel@151.70.141.16) |
| 10:45.15 | Tyrael | Hi, is http://monotone.openmoko.org/ down? |
| 10:45.20 | torpor | yes |
| 10:45.22 | josch | wucheng, under applications |
| 10:45.24 | *** join/#openmoko Any_Key (n=Any_Key@IGLD-80-230-88-182.inter.net.il) |
| 10:45.44 | *** join/#openmoko asdas (n=Hasop@85.101.97.160) |
| 10:45.53 | *** part/#openmoko asdas (n=Hasop@85.101.97.160) |
| 10:49.17 | *** join/#openmoko t_s_o (n=tso@33.84-49-135.nextgentel.com) |
| 10:50.02 | bluelightning | wow... http://blog.automated.it/2007/11/30/openmoko-gllin-eula/ |
| 10:50.03 | bluelightning | lovely |
| 10:50.43 | *** join/#openmoko matsch (n=matsch@host-091-097-018-131.ewe-ip-backbone.de) |
| 10:51.19 | *** join/#openmoko Sup3rkiddo (n=sudharsh@unaffiliated/sudharsh) |
| 10:51.50 | _diego__ | how can i extract a .jffs2 file? |
| 10:52.07 | ruxpin | _diego__: it's in the wiki |
| 10:52.31 | ruxpin | _diego__: not a one-step process |
| 10:53.38 | _diego__ | can u give me a pointer? Till now i just get instruction about creating jffs2 image ^^ |
| 10:53.48 | *** join/#openmoko Eludias (n=eludias@wingding.demon.nl) |
| 10:54.26 | *** join/#openmoko icman (n=icman@123-240-172-21.cctv.dynamic.lsc.net.tw) |
| 10:56.28 | *** join/#openmoko lrg (n=liam@lrg2.demon.co.uk) |
| 11:02.58 | *** join/#openmoko thomasgruebler (n=thomasgr@85-124-167-249.work.xdsl-line.inode.at) |
| 11:07.12 | *** join/#openmoko behdad (n=behdad@CPE001217b19226-CM0012c9c84bc4.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 11:07.22 | *** join/#openmoko edistar (n=edistar@ip503ddd09.speed.planet.nl) |
| 11:12.43 | *** join/#openmoko bentob0x (n=laurent@ip-213-49-79-14.dsl.scarlet.be) |
| 11:14.37 | *** join/#openmoko bentob0x (n=laurent@ip-213-49-79-14.dsl.scarlet.be) |
| 11:19.35 | *** join/#openmoko zipola (n=zipola@cable-vrk-fe5cdd00-177.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 11:21.42 | *** join/#openmoko miip (n=miip@p54A54373.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 11:22.12 | zilux` | _diego__: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Userspace_root_image#Mounting_the_JFFS2_image_on_a_loop_back_.28MTD_RAM.29_device |
| 11:29.04 | *** join/#openmoko nirz_ (n=nir@bzq-79-180-65-6.red.bezeqint.net) |
| 11:29.17 | *** join/#openmoko _rob (n=rob@85.233.59.8.static.cablesurf.de) |
| 11:31.01 | *** join/#openmoko ossman (n=drzeus@gateway.drzeus.cx) |
| 11:33.57 | _diego__ | thx |
| 11:34.21 | *** join/#openmoko yoyo_ (n=yoyo@nat.zegrze.maverick.com.pl) |
| 11:34.26 | yoyo_ | hellow |
| 11:36.23 | *** join/#openmoko amir (n=Miranda@gentoo/developer/amir) |
| 11:36.44 | *** join/#openmoko stefan_schmidt (n=stefan@datenfreihafen.org) |
| 11:43.25 | *** join/#openmoko krau (n=cktakaha@189.70.66.189) |
| 11:48.32 | tonyg | Sup3rkiddo, I got up to uboot-mkimage problems with the kernel, too :( |
| 11:49.45 | tonyg | "linux-openmoko-2.6.22.5-moko11+svnr3238-r10/temp/run.do_compile.29665: line 732: uboot-mkimage: command not found" |
| 11:49.56 | *** join/#openmoko demaledetti (n=ste@151.82.10.139) |
| 11:53.27 | *** join/#openmoko Marex-notebook (n=marex@gwfm10-3-250.802.cz) |
| 11:55.06 | *** join/#openmoko gambler (n=orion@124-171-176-236.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 11:59.31 | *** join/#openmoko ericthefish (n=ivan@82-71-36-214.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk) |
| 12:00.45 | yoyo_ | ohh no my mtn can't pull :/ from monotone |
| 12:00.51 | *** part/#openmoko stefan_schmidt (n=stefan@datenfreihafen.org) |
| 12:01.19 | tonyg | Sup3rkiddo, there's a simple fix: (cd build; . ../setup-env; bitbake uboot-openmoko) - then a make openmoko-devel-image will proceed past the uboot-mkimage problem |
| 12:01.22 | tonyg | yay |
| 12:01.36 | tonyg | yoyo_, yes, the server is down :-( |
| 12:01.53 | yoyo_ | tonyg: for how long ? |
| 12:01.55 | tonyg | if you want updates you'll have to use monotone.openembedded.org, which is bleeding-edge |
| 12:01.59 | tonyg | I have no idea, sorry |
| 12:02.14 | tonyg | but it's been that way for at least 6 hours |
| 12:04.55 | tonyg | 1221 of 3649... |
| 12:04.56 | tonyg | sigh |
| 12:05.12 | tonyg | us humans have really got to start making progress on the strong AI front |
| 12:05.28 | tonyg | so we don't have to spend our lives gently encouraging things like openembedded builds along |
| 12:05.40 | *** join/#openmoko Ebbe (n=ebbe@users.kollegienet.dk) |
| 12:05.46 | Sup3rkiddo | tonyg: thanks, will take a look] |
| 12:06.03 | *** join/#openmoko Elessar_81 (n=Andreas@p5B059257.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 12:06.13 | *** part/#openmoko Elessar_81 (n=Andreas@p5B059257.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 12:09.51 | torpor | tonyg: we don't need AI. we need to trust each other enough to share a single build system. |
| 12:10.09 | tonyg | :) |
| 12:10.26 | *** join/#openmoko stefan_schmidt (n=stefan@datenfreihafen.org) |
| 12:10.30 | Sup3rkiddo | Artificial intelligence = Human Stupidity |
| 12:10.35 | Sup3rkiddo | right, apt? |
| 12:13.30 | josch | ~fish apt |
| 12:13.30 | apt | ACTION slaps apt around with a large trout |
| 12:13.48 | josch | yeah, right |
| 12:14.55 | *** join/#openmoko edistar_ (n=edistar@ip503ddd09.speed.planet.nl) |
| 12:15.26 | *** join/#openmoko jeffdameth (n=jeff@dyndsl-080-228-177-059.ewe-ip-backbone.de) |
| 12:16.51 | *** join/#openmoko CVirus (n=GoD@196.205.192.131) |
| 12:17.06 | *** join/#openmoko p3t3r (n=peter@dslb-088-070-182-053.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 12:18.43 | edistar_ | btw, has anyone thought of porting prelink to OM? |
| 12:19.37 | Mononoke | what about having apt by default packed in openmoko ? :P |
| 12:20.02 | *** join/#openmoko nirz (n=nir@bzq-79-183-127-209.red.bezeqint.net) |
| 12:20.11 | Mononoke | openmoko could become real HAL9000 |
| 12:20.32 | Sup3rkiddo | Mononoke: reminds me of "Clippy" |
| 12:22.11 | *** join/#openmoko DPThought (n=tilli@62.206.217.68) |
| 12:22.22 | Mononoke | oh does M$ Office still use Clippy? |
| 12:26.08 | *** join/#openmoko zedstar (n=john@82-44-200-69.cable.ubr08.haye.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 12:26.36 | *** join/#openmoko zell1983 (n=zell1983@87.14.122.214) |
| 12:28.58 | *** part/#openmoko stefan_schmidt (n=stefan@datenfreihafen.org) |
| 12:29.14 | *** join/#openmoko pipomolo42 (n=pipomolo@ALille-152-1-78-38.w90-1.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 12:30.07 | *** join/#openmoko lar5 (n=laprican@hsiproxy.astra-net.com) |
| 12:36.42 | *** join/#openmoko nirz_ (n=nir@bzq-79-180-93-41.red.bezeqint.net) |
| 12:41.28 | *** join/#openmoko PBeck (n=PBeck@78.42.60.129) |
| 12:41.33 | PBeck | hi |
| 12:43.55 | Sup3rkiddo | hi |
| 12:51.55 | *** join/#openmoko ifeel (n=ifeel@151.70.141.16) |
| 13:03.23 | *** join/#openmoko miip (n=miip@p54A54373.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 13:06.04 | *** join/#openmoko OJW (n=owhite@87-194-198-122.bethere.co.uk) |
| 13:13.40 | *** join/#openmoko Vndmtrx (n=0x0fff@unaffiliated/vndmtrx) |
| 13:15.57 | tonyg | 1547 of 3649... |
| 13:16.28 | *** join/#openmoko pleemans (n=peter@d51A5E76A.access.telenet.be) |
| 13:16.57 | *** join/#openmoko yerga (n=yerga@87.223.212.95) |
| 13:19.42 | Sup3rkiddo | on webkit |
| 13:20.01 | cdbot2 | * * OM Bug 1062 has been created by mickey(AT)vanille-media.de |
| 13:20.01 | cdbot2 | * * While ringing, dialer does not recognize when peer hangs up |
| 13:20.02 | cdbot2 | * * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=1062 |
| 13:21.00 | cdbot2 | * * OM Bug 1063 has been created by mickey(AT)vanille-media.de |
| 13:21.01 | cdbot2 | * * Today crashes when clicking on "missed call" |
| 13:21.02 | cdbot2 | * * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=1063 |
| 13:23.13 | *** join/#openmoko chris^ (n=kraetzi@p548AF0D7.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 13:23.39 | *** join/#openmoko ossman (n=drzeus@gateway.drzeus.cx) |
| 13:28.04 | *** join/#openmoko danilos (n=danilo@161.53.174.101) |
| 13:30.58 | *** join/#openmoko p3t3r (n=peter@dslb-088-070-182-053.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 13:34.45 | *** join/#openmoko edistar (n=edistar@ip503ddd09.speed.planet.nl) |
| 13:36.34 | tonyg | w00t. got erlang's gtknode to compile and package. now to try running the hello-world example, in erlang, on my cellphone... |
| 13:36.42 | *** join/#openmoko Elessar_81 (n=Andreas@p5B059257.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 13:36.49 | *** part/#openmoko Elessar_81 (n=Andreas@p5B059257.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 13:37.02 | josch | | configure: error: could not find Python headers <= in which package can I find these headers?? |
| 13:37.04 | *** join/#openmoko pH5 (n=ph5@R5734.r.pppool.de) |
| 13:37.35 | *** join/#openmoko dneary (n=dneary@mne69-9-88-163-116-163.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 13:44.23 | *** join/#openmoko aloril (n=aloril@kaar72.airix.fi) |
| 13:45.32 | *** join/#openmoko edistar_ (n=edistar@ip503ddd09.speed.planet.nl) |
| 13:45.33 | zedstar | tonyg did u try scheme on your phone? |
| 13:46.08 | tonyg | zedstar, not yet. i'm unsure which variant would be best at POSIXy things (like serial port access, process control, raw file I/O etc) |
| 13:46.15 | tonyg | or even UI |
| 13:46.46 | zedstar | tongy i packaged chicken which is pretty good at most things |
| 13:46.52 | tonyg | ah, chicken. |
| 13:46.54 | tonyg | yeah, it's ok. |
| 13:47.29 | tonyg | the C ffi is pretty good. |
| 13:47.40 | tonyg | that's probably a good choice for an embedded system. |
| 13:47.42 | zedstar | tonyg yeh i just write my own bindings for gtk |
| 13:47.53 | tonyg | good fun :-) |
| 13:48.07 | zedstar | be nice if there was a decent gtk egg |
| 13:48.09 | tonyg | did you see my old gtk2 bindings for chicken? |
| 13:48.21 | zedstar | is it an egg/ |
| 13:48.22 | zedstar | ? |
| 13:48.30 | tonyg | the one problem I've found with chicken is that it's still very fast-moving, so things break all the time |
| 13:48.39 | tonyg | or at least, that was my impression a couple of years ago |
| 13:48.43 | tonyg | yes, it was an egg |
| 13:48.50 | tonyg | it will need some care and attention to get running again |
| 13:49.04 | tonyg | because the macro system, ffi etc have changed since I last worked on it |
| 13:49.10 | zedstar | ah ok yeh... i dont use that many features of gtk so i think easier to glue myself |
| 13:49.16 | tonyg | probably |
| 13:49.26 | tonyg | well, up to a point |
| 13:50.05 | zedstar | the ffi is really nice i think ..easy to use but yeh some confusing changes |
| 13:52.25 | tonyg | hmm. looks like tony sidaway has taken my old code and done some work on it. cool! perhaps you should check it out - it's at http://trac.callcc.org/browser/gtk2/trunk , but I've not tried it myself |
| 13:53.18 | zedstar | yeh i remember somebody working on it but went quiet will have to take a look again |
| 13:56.34 | *** join/#openmoko baze (n=baze@xdsl-213-196-212-24.netcologne.de) |
| 14:09.13 | *** join/#openmoko C7 (n=C7@172-122.0-85.cust.bluewin.ch) |
| 14:10.13 | *** join/#openmoko parag0n (n=parag0n@87.194.100.170) |
| 14:13.11 | *** join/#openmoko smartbhai (n=smartbha@116.68.97.145) |
| 14:20.31 | *** join/#openmoko rd_ (n=dr@vnsecurity.net) |
| 14:30.09 | *** join/#openmoko lrg (n=liam@lrg2.demon.co.uk) |
| 14:33.51 | *** join/#openmoko flexd_ (n=flexd@237.84-48-84.nextgentel.com) |
| 14:34.15 | *** join/#openmoko ossman (n=drzeus@gateway.drzeus.cx) |
| 14:36.39 | *** join/#openmoko JOSF (i=JOSF@3e70c96d.adsl.enternet.hu) |
| 15:00.27 | *** join/#openmoko pH5 (n=ph5@89.54.87.52) |
| 15:07.45 | *** join/#openmoko lrg (n=liam@lrg2.demon.co.uk) |
| 15:08.49 | *** join/#openmoko SpeedEvil (n=irc@mauve.plus.com) |
| 15:08.52 | *** join/#openmoko Marex-notebook (n=marex@gwfm10-3-250.802.cz) |
| 15:09.46 | *** join/#openmoko smartbhai (n=smartbha@116.68.97.145) |
| 15:14.04 | *** join/#openmoko Any_Key (n=Any_Key@bzq-84-108-121-143.cablep.bezeqint.net) |
| 15:16.35 | cesarb | How can i switch to a running application in the home screen? I used to do it by clicking on the application on the list, but that isn't doing anything right now |
| 15:17.42 | cesarb | nm, the AUX key did the trick |
| 15:18.52 | *** join/#openmoko lysanderslair_ (n=jeff@CPE0014bf4ad3e5-CM000a7363f3b6.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 15:19.17 | *** join/#openmoko Crofton|home (n=balister@66-207-66-26.black.dmt.ntelos.net) |
| 15:20.50 | cesarb | ...and it crashed because I decided to unplug the USB while locked via the power menu. lovely. |
| 15:27.50 | *** join/#openmoko j_ack (n=j_ack@p508D82B7.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 15:27.58 | *** join/#openmoko jkilb (n=jkilb@p5B2097FA.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 15:28.21 | *** join/#openmoko AGazzaz (n=ahmadelg@217.54.155.99) |
| 15:29.32 | *** join/#openmoko jkilb (n=jkilb@p5B2097FA.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 15:35.49 | *** join/#openmoko miip (n=miip@p54A54373.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 15:35.50 | *** join/#openmoko Magon (n=Magon@archangel.kolej.mff.cuni.cz) |
| 15:38.40 | *** part/#openmoko AGazzaz (n=ahmadelg@217.54.155.99) |
| 15:38.53 | *** join/#openmoko smartbhai (n=smartbha@116.68.97.145) |
| 15:45.41 | *** join/#openmoko alphaone_ (n=daniel@c120.apm.etc.tu-bs.de) |
| 15:48.00 | *** join/#openmoko freezesucker (n=fz@ppp-62-216-215-96.dynamic.mnet-online.de) |
| 15:49.18 | *** join/#openmoko no_mind (n=vivek@59.176.111.177) |
| 15:57.46 | *** join/#openmoko smartbhai (n=smartbha@116.68.97.145) |
| 16:01.42 | cesarb | Great, I got a 3D fix by going to a nearby park, and now it got a fix even by just being near a window... Unfortunately, it just turned off by itself and won't turn on again. |
| 16:03.21 | *** join/#openmoko _rob (n=rob@85.233.59.8.static.cablesurf.de) |
| 16:07.08 | *** join/#openmoko tonyg (n=tonyg@91.84.108.56) |
| 16:17.06 | cesarb | Great, and my multimeter is returning bogus values, so I cannot even check the voltage |
| 16:18.13 | *** join/#openmoko smartbhai (n=smartbha@116.68.97.145) |
| 16:24.54 | *** join/#openmoko chris^ (n=kraetzi@p548AF0D7.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 16:26.19 | *** join/#openmoko Ebbe (n=ebbe@users.kollegienet.dk) |
| 16:27.49 | _diego__ | what's wrong with 3.91v? |
| 16:28.49 | *** join/#openmoko loufoque (n=loufoque@140.77.128.140) |
| 16:33.14 | *** join/#openmoko fgau (n=Administ@p548C3025.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 16:35.31 | cesarb | _diego__: that's without load. the voltage with load is what matters. |
| 16:35.35 | *** part/#openmoko fgau (n=Administ@p548C3025.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 16:36.06 | cesarb | _diego__: but perhaps someone else in this channel knows the voltage without load of a "dead" battery and of a fully charged one |
| 16:41.21 | *** join/#openmoko fgau (n=fgau@p548C30A8.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 16:42.09 | Sup3rkiddo | anyone know if zecke had his flu patched |
| 16:43.08 | *** join/#openmoko BlackBsd (n=brian@72.168.193.117) |
| 16:43.50 | *** join/#openmoko smartbhai (n=smartbha@116.68.97.145) |
| 16:44.10 | *** join/#openmoko C7 (n=C7@120-11.77-83.cust.bluewin.ch) |
| 16:44.42 | mmontour | cesarb: low-battery voltage is around 2.8V. You should be fine at 3.91V |
| 16:45.23 | cesarb | mmontour: but without load? (voltages are higher without load, and the "nominal" is 3.7, which is probably a "with load" value) |
| 16:46.18 | _diego__ | 3.9 looks like a tipical full charged battery |
| 16:49.05 | cesarb | _diego__: fully charged it isn't, I was outside for several minutes with GPS/GSM enabled to try to get a fix, and the battery hadn't been fully recharged from when I went around the apartment yesterday trying to do the same |
| 16:49.30 | mmontour | cesarb: the load current will be very small when the phone is off. Have you tried replacing the battery, connecting the usb power, then turning it on? |
| 16:49.39 | *** join/#openmoko PBeck (n=PBeck@78.42.60.129) |
| 16:50.51 | cesarb | yes, and it didn't turn on even with usb plugged. right now I'm leaving it for an hour after the unplug/remove battery/insert battery/plug dance |
| 16:50.52 | Ebbe | cesarb: Which horror stories? |
| 16:51.14 | cesarb | Ebbe: things like letting it charge for a week and then it won't turn on anymore |
| 16:51.17 | _diego__ | several minute should not be a problem, except for minutes something like 200 ^^ |
| 16:51.37 | Ebbe | cesarb: Creepy.. |
| 16:51.39 | *** join/#openmoko Q_Continuum (n=Q@75-168-112-193.mpls.qwest.net) |
| 16:51.52 | cesarb | _diego__: summing yesterday and today, it probably was something like 2 hours off the wire |
| 16:52.21 | cesarb | _diego__: not counting the times the battery was outside the case |
| 16:53.09 | mmontour | If the phone is not shut down properly, the GSM modem and the audio amplifier can continue to draw current directly from the battery |
| 16:53.38 | mmontour | Also, there was a uboot bug where the PMU was configured to only charge at 50 mA rather than 100 mA in the "pre-charge mode" |
| 16:54.04 | mmontour | This could lead to a scenario where the phone was plugged in, but with a net charging current of almost 0 |
| 16:57.03 | zilux` | 17640*.544 |
| 16:57.14 | zilux` | sorry |
| 16:57.39 | *** join/#openmoko demaledetti (n=ste@151.82.14.200) |
| 16:59.07 | *** join/#openmoko PBeck (n=PBeck@78.42.60.129) |
| 16:59.31 | _diego__ | ok, in my experience, often is possible to recover the phone in a couple of hour |
| 16:59.50 | *** join/#openmoko lysanderslair (n=jeff@CPE0014bf4ad3e5-CM000a7363f3b6.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 17:00.02 | _diego__ | and i've still the same uboot of august |
| 17:00.30 | cesarb | _diego__: me too, I'm still on the "august snapshot" uboot |
| 17:01.23 | cesarb | but this is the first time I actually took the neo outside... so most of the time the battery is nearly full (and plugged in), and I never had it power off on me like that |
| 17:01.56 | *** join/#openmoko buz (n=buz@84-73-66-71.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 17:02.34 | _diego__ | dont worry, is happened a lot of time to me |
| 17:03.10 | _diego__ | usually, i remove the battery, press button power for a couple of second |
| 17:03.33 | _diego__ | put the battery back, and i tried again |
| 17:04.16 | _diego__ | if the battery is charged enough it should boot ^^ |
| 17:05.03 | cesarb | yay, worked again |
| 17:05.14 | cesarb | less than the "1 hour" of charge the wiki said |
| 17:07.31 | *** join/#openmoko dneary (n=dneary@mne69-9-88-163-116-163.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 17:07.49 | cesarb | cat /sys/devices/platform/s3c2410-i2c/i2c-adapter/i2c-0/0-0008/battvolt |
| 17:07.50 | cesarb | 3662 |
| 17:08.23 | cesarb | cat /sys/devices/platform/s3c2410-i2c/i2c-adapter/i2c-0/0-0008/battemp |
| 17:08.24 | cesarb | -5 |
| 17:08.46 | *** join/#openmoko smartbhai (n=smartbha@116.68.97.145) |
| 17:15.24 | borg_ | is there a reason that the /etc/resolv.conf on my gets overwritten on each restart? |
| 17:15.37 | borg_ | s/on my/on my neo/ |
| 17:17.07 | Magon | borg_: yes..resolvconf ? isnt it just symlink? |
| 17:17.32 | borg_ | yes, it is a symlink to /var/run/resolv.conf |
| 17:17.39 | borg_ | but this gets overwritten too |
| 17:17.55 | Magon | it is in /var/run..so it is supposed to |
| 17:18.02 | Magon | try /etc/resolvconf/* |
| 17:18.27 | borg_ | there is nothing like that |
| 17:18.44 | borg_ | i know that it is probably supposed |
| 17:18.46 | borg_ | but why? |
| 17:19.01 | Magon | there is probably resolvconf program |
| 17:19.13 | borg_ | i cant find anything |
| 17:19.15 | borg_ | mhmh |
| 17:19.36 | Marcel_M | borg_: /etc/network/interfaces |
| 17:19.46 | Magon | ok..it has no binary, but it is definetly that :-) |
| 17:20.07 | Magon | i have it on my box too, but dont know how it works exactly |
| 17:20.38 | borg_ | Marcel_M: i can configure my nameserver and "search lan" thingy in the interfaces config? |
| 17:20.40 | cesarb | Yay, Google Maps shows me precisely where I got my first 3D fix :D |
| 17:21.23 | Marcel_M | jo take a look |
| 17:21.41 | *** join/#openmoko zipola (n=zipola@cable-vrk-fe5cdd00-177.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 17:21.42 | *** join/#openmoko eonj (n=ENJ@fl-65-40-12-114.sta.embarqhsd.net) |
| 17:22.47 | Marcel_M | borg_: http://celpaste.morb-design.com/pastebin.php?show=m391031d2 |
| 17:24.59 | borg_ | ah ok, but thats kind of a hack ;) |
| 17:24.59 | borg_ | thx |
| 17:25.41 | Marcel_M | it works |
| 17:25.44 | Marcel_M | ;) |
| 17:31.57 | *** join/#openmoko alex-weej (n=alex@cpc1-acto9-0-0-cust931.brnt.cable.ntl.com) |
| 17:35.06 | *** join/#openmoko j_ack (n=j_ack@p508D82B7.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 17:35.46 | *** join/#openmoko ossman (n=drzeus@gateway.drzeus.cx) |
| 17:37.03 | *** join/#openmoko Q_Continuum (n=Q@75-168-112-193.mpls.qwest.net) |
| 17:45.42 | *** join/#openmoko bmk789__ (n=bmk789@74-140-26-120.dhcp.insightbb.com) |
| 17:46.28 | *** join/#openmoko x1jmp (n=x1jmp@p57B0B422.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 17:56.10 | *** join/#openmoko lrg (n=liam@lrg2.demon.co.uk) |
| 18:00.14 | *** join/#openmoko ecraven (i=nex@eutyche.swe.uni-linz.ac.at) |
| 18:02.08 | *** join/#openmoko fsteinel (n=fsteinel@pD9FBBEEB.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 18:03.00 | *** join/#openmoko orospakr (n=orospakr@bas4-ottawa23-1096745455.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 18:04.52 | *** join/#openmoko esben_ (n=esben@0x55532124.adsl.cybercity.dk) |
| 18:08.15 | *** join/#openmoko no_mind (n=vivek@59.176.111.177) |
| 18:10.51 | *** join/#openmoko no_mind_ (n=vivek@59.176.111.177) |
| 18:12.03 | *** join/#openmoko behdad (n=behdad@CPE001217b19226-CM0012c9c84bc4.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 18:20.02 | *** join/#openmoko Aria (n=aredride@224x165.ouraynet.com) |
| 18:20.48 | *** join/#openmoko mmp (n=mmp@158.195.96.206) |
| 18:24.16 | NineX | can someone tell me why newest versions of u-boot dosn't support boot from SD? |
| 18:25.29 | balrog-kun | u-boot doesn't interact with SD in any way afaik |
| 18:25.35 | balrog-kun | the booting is done by the kernel |
| 18:25.58 | *** join/#openmoko C7 (n=C7@248-34.76-83.cust.bluewin.ch) |
| 18:27.06 | *** join/#openmoko polz (n=polz@cpe-213-157-235-31.dynamic.amis.net) |
| 18:27.11 | mmontour | balrog-kun: u-boot crashes when it tries to load the kernel from SD |
| 18:27.49 | polz | can anyone here tell me where to download gllin ? |
| 18:27.53 | balrog-kun | oh, kkernel from SD |
| 18:28.08 | polz | the site mentioned on the mailing list doesn't seem to work anymore |
| 18:28.11 | xzcvczx | polz: planet.openmoko.org |
| 18:28.13 | NineX | there are versions of u-boot that can load kernel from sd |
| 18:28.15 | xzcvczx | polz: says there |
| 18:30.05 | polz | xzcvczx: I tried thirdparty.openmoko.org or something... |
| 18:30.18 | polz | and it just keeps serving me the EULA |
| 18:31.34 | roh | disable adblocker/referrer-blocking plugins |
| 18:31.56 | roh | sometimes also ff seems to drop all referrers.. quit and restart it and it works again |
| 18:32.10 | polz | roh: I'm using konqueror |
| 18:32.15 | *** join/#openmoko no_mind_ (n=vivek@59.176.111.177) |
| 18:32.36 | polz | and I get as far as the downloads directory... |
| 18:32.43 | polz | I can even click on the file |
| 18:33.08 | polz | but the server just serves the EULA, packaged neatly in a .ipk file |
| 18:33.14 | NineX | somethink is gucked up |
| 18:33.18 | balrog-kun | firefox didn't work for me but elinks worked perfectly |
| 18:33.25 | polz | btw, is anyone here using openmoko as their daily phone yet ? |
| 18:33.36 | polz | balrog-kun: 10x, I'll try that |
| 18:33.44 | xzcvczx | polz: i might be but my ts dont work |
| 18:33.56 | *** join/#openmoko _rob (n=rob@85.233.59.8.static.cablesurf.de) |
| 18:34.07 | NineX | http://3rdparty.downloads.openmoko.org/?Decline=Decline |
| 18:34.49 | NineX | if you Decline EULA download works ;) |
| 18:34.53 | NineX | funy error |
| 18:34.56 | polz | NineX: huh ? We're supposed to _decline_ the EULA ? :) |
| 18:35.07 | NineX | polz: try |
| 18:35.13 | polz | it didn't work before, but 10x for the idea :) |
| 18:35.48 | mwester | Darn! I didn't think to try to decline it. Then I'd have the software, and I wouldn't be bound by the silly EULA. ("comfort" is not guaranteed, apparently... anyone read that thing?) |
| 18:36.29 | xzcvczx | mwester: i dont know anyone who reads EULA's |
| 18:37.07 | *** join/#openmoko moko-bunny (n=reik@CPE-76-178-148-218.natnow.res.rr.com) |
| 18:37.12 | mwester | After all the fuss, I just wanted to know what on earth could have taken the bleeding lawyers so many MONTHS to do. |
| 18:37.15 | balrog-kun | quiet enjoyment is also not included :( |
| 18:37.28 | xzcvczx | mwester: the longer they take the more they can charge |
| 18:37.34 | mwester | Exactly. |
| 18:37.37 | polz | mwester: apparently, if you create an alternative driver, you're just not allowed to use gllin anymore |
| 18:37.56 | xzcvczx | lol |
| 18:38.34 | polz | at least that's what I think it says |
| 18:38.42 | mwester | I think the "quiet enjoyment" part is just saying that you agree to permit Broadcom to harass/sue/litigate you personally, even though you didn't get the software from Broadcom. |
| 18:39.19 | roh | btw.. the accept/decline variables say nothing. |
| 18:40.08 | *** join/#openmoko no_mind__ (n=vivek@59.176.111.177) |
| 18:40.34 | polz | it still doesn't work for me, even if I decline |
| 18:40.55 | roh | polz which browser, and do you use a proxy? |
| 18:41.47 | polz | OK, elinks seems to work |
| 18:41.58 | polz | at least it's downloading something |
| 18:42.17 | polz | before elinks, I tried konqueror, firefox and dillo |
| 18:42.24 | polz | none of which worked |
| 18:42.24 | xzcvczx | polz: if its over a few kb it'll be the real thing |
| 18:42.32 | *** join/#openmoko j_ack_ (n=j_ack@p508D8787.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 18:42.48 | polz | xzcvczx: yeah, the progress bar says it's going to be around 1.9M |
| 18:43.00 | polz | so this should be it |
| 18:43.02 | polz | wheee |
| 18:43.03 | *** join/#openmoko playya_ (n=playya@p508B2F5A.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 18:43.20 | polz | anyway, is anyone using openmoko as their everyday phone ? |
| 18:43.39 | roh | polz your konqueror does not send referrers. |
| 18:44.04 | *** join/#openmoko t_s_o (n=tso@33.84-49-135.nextgentel.com) |
| 18:44.42 | *** part/#openmoko pwerken (n=pwerken@83.119.198.36) |
| 18:46.24 | roh | polz ah.. it does.. and from here it looks like a successful download with konq. |
| 18:46.44 | polz | I don't know what exactly is broken... |
| 18:47.02 | polz | but as long as I get the binary, I don't care anymore |
| 18:47.29 | polz | I'm tired of explaining to everyone how the neo contains a GPS receiver but you can't use it. |
| 18:48.20 | polz | btw, what happened to monotone.openmoko.org this night ? |
| 18:49.50 | roh | happened? |
| 18:54.39 | CVirus | Can the GTA02 wireless chipset go into Monitor mode ? |
| 18:55.42 | *** join/#openmoko _ts (n=pinhead@stdin.stderror.at) |
| 18:56.15 | polz | roh: it seems to be working now, but last night it just kept refusing connections |
| 18:58.30 | roh | interresting. i can see no problem from here |
| 19:00.22 | polz | roh: hehe, the more time I spend trying to fiddle with my neo, the more it feels like I'm a PEBKAC :) |
| 19:00.44 | roh | well.. if you'd ask me, i would have put it just onto the httpd.. but sinc ethe eula can and will ne interpreted differently in the us, europe and asia we decided to play it save |
| 19:01.05 | *** join/#openmoko Aria_ (n=aredride@224x165.ouraynet.com) |
| 19:01.45 | *** join/#openmoko heikkit (n=chatzill@c-67-188-122-139.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 19:01.52 | *** join/#openmoko Christoph (n=christop@p508CE6C4.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 19:02.16 | roh | which means, first you have to read and accept the eula, then you can download/get it. by downloading you accept the eula, but since this is kinda implicit some could argue they have not seen the eula first. thats why we enforce reading the eula first. sorry about that |
| 19:02.22 | polz | I hope someone with more gray matter than myself will find the time to restart the sphyrna project, now that the gllin has become widely available |
| 19:02.52 | roh | polz: yeah ;) i would love to see that working.. i just do not believe its so simple as some think. |
| 19:02.58 | *** join/#openmoko Ophelia (n=Ophelia@pD9EAA5D7.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 19:03.36 | roh | polz also its proably better someone outside the us hacks on that, but thats just a guess.. i am no lawyer |
| 19:05.28 | mmontour | polz: the main reason for that project stalling was that the chipset was changed for GTA02 - less motivation to spend a lot of time on it if it's only relevant to GTA01 owners |
| 19:07.50 | polz | mmontour: that and the fact that only a few people have access to a Neo with a working GPS. |
| 19:09.15 | polz | roh: that's why I hope some genius finds enough free time to build a free driver anyway |
| 19:10.24 | mwester | Yeah, the GTA01 hardware has proven to be more "throw-away" than initially hoped, it seems. |
| 19:11.10 | moko-bunny | the free GPS driver would go well with my pulse-jet project :D (kidding...) |
| 19:12.27 | *** join/#openmoko baird (n=cbaird@brushtail.apana.org.au) |
| 19:13.02 | roh | mwester: not really. but it was clear from the beginning that its only the enabler to get real work done on the software-side. |
| 19:13.12 | mmontour | polz: You can do some things without a working Neo, by interpreting other people's 'strace' logs of the data to/from the GPS hardware |
| 19:13.32 | CVirus | Can the GTA02 wireless chipset go into Monitor mode ? |
| 19:13.57 | roh | i am quite fine with the hw in total, since we really worked hard to get all serious bugs out in the sold revision. we need to do the same for gta02. |
| 19:14.18 | roh | CVirus i do not know if the firmware from atheros supports that. |
| 19:14.21 | mmontour | For example, nobody has yet figured out how to extract the satellite navigation data (almanac, timestamp, etc) from the strace data, but it must be in there somewhere |
| 19:15.15 | *** join/#openmoko zdanek (n=zdanek@ams122.internetdsl.tpnet.pl) |
| 19:15.16 | *** join/#openmoko freelock_ (n=john@foraker.freelock.com) |
| 19:15.17 | CVirus | roh: how can we know ? |
| 19:15.22 | zdanek | greetings all |
| 19:15.57 | roh | CVirus when sameos driver is done |
| 19:15.58 | zdanek | anybody knows if included media player can play avi files? |
| 19:16.10 | zdanek | it asks me for proper plugin |
| 19:16.15 | CVirus | roh: sameos ? |
| 19:16.16 | zdanek | is any available? |
| 19:16.33 | *** join/#openmoko demaledetti (n=ste@83.224.147.200) |
| 19:16.41 | roh | CVirus he is working on the wifi driver. its not complete yet. |
| 19:16.51 | CVirus | I see |
| 19:17.02 | CVirus | roh: any status page ? |
| 19:17.17 | roh | first it needs to work. then we can do fancy stuff with it later |
| 19:17.34 | roh | CVirus not really.. you can read the svn log mails := |
| 19:17.41 | CVirus | gah .. okay .. thanks alot |
| 19:18.46 | roh | http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/commitlog/2007-November/003175.html |
| 19:19.03 | roh | http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/commitlog/2007-November/003172.html |
| 19:19.19 | zdanek | ping |
| 19:19.35 | *** join/#openmoko playya (n=playya@p508B2F5A.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 19:19.52 | *** join/#openmoko chode_ (n=chode@pD9E8BAC5.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 19:19.53 | Christoph | Hi, nice to see everybody talking about GPS, but has anybody got gllin runing according to Michael's post from friday? |
| 19:19.57 | CVirus | roh: aren't there linux drivers already for the AR6K ? |
| 19:19.57 | Christoph | Everything I get after executing ./gllin is a 'gllin: early exit(3) in halInit()/681' and an empty /tmp/nmeaNP :-( |
| 19:20.23 | borg_ | Christoph: works nice here |
| 19:20.31 | *** join/#openmoko TAsn-ghost (n=TAsn@82.166.201.246) |
| 19:20.31 | roh | CVirus we are using that. but we needed a working s3c2442 hci first which uses the same api |
| 19:20.32 | borg_ | and this early exit thingy is normal |
| 19:20.38 | zdanek | as far as I remember it did that way always |
| 19:20.49 | zdanek | but it should dump nmea |
| 19:20.52 | CVirus | roh: sorry but what's that ? |
| 19:21.02 | roh | the host controller interface |
| 19:21.06 | CVirus | hmm |
| 19:21.13 | *** join/#openmoko serious2007 (n=serious@84.123.30.84.dyn.user.ono.com) |
| 19:21.29 | roh | like the controller for the sdio interface |
| 19:21.41 | CVirus | I understand |
| 19:22.25 | Vegar | is the ar6k driver using the new 80211 subsystem? |
| 19:22.44 | *** join/#openmoko vivijim (n=vivijim@200-168-21-203.dsl.telesp.net.br) |
| 19:22.50 | roh | Vegar i dunno. but it would be nice if thats possible, yes |
| 19:23.29 | Vegar | it certainly would |
| 19:23.34 | roh | our focus is currently getting all drivers to work first, to check and validate the hardware design. |
| 19:24.02 | CVirus | roh: when do you excpet this to be done ? |
| 19:24.11 | roh | when thats done we need to polish them to a state where we can push the whole changeset chopped into handy functional blocks to go upstream. |
| 19:24.42 | roh | CVirus i do not know |
| 19:25.14 | CVirus | oh .. sorry :-D |
| 19:25.42 | *** join/#openmoko ifeel (n=ifeel@151.70.141.16) |
| 19:26.02 | serious2007 | guys ijust got my openmoko and I am fighting to get dfu-util on my debian to run. I got the sourcecode but my ./configure points out an error |
| 19:26.25 | serious2007 | ./configure: line 3331: `PKG_CHECK_MODULES(USB, libusb >= 0.1.4,,' |
| 19:26.33 | serious2007 | the libusb-dev is installed |
| 19:26.49 | roh | is pkg-config installed? |
| 19:26.52 | Christoph | strange, I've started gllin several times now but nmeaNP is always empty. Maybe I've to sleep a night over this (... with removed battery) :-) Thanx guys! |
| 19:28.08 | serious2007 | awsome man that worked out |
| 19:28.10 | serious2007 | thx |
| 19:29.03 | *** join/#openmoko Q_Continuum (n=Q@75-168-112-193.mpls.qwest.net) |
| 19:30.39 | *** join/#openmoko RoboPhred (i=95a97a39@gateway/web/cgi-irc/ircatwork.com/x-6c0f482acd668936) |
| 19:32.52 | zdanek | roh: maybe you know if media player is able to play avi files? |
| 19:33.13 | zdanek | it wants some plugin and is it somewhere available? |
| 19:33.37 | *** join/#openmoko caligari_spain (n=caligari@203.pool85-56-200.dynamic.orange.es) |
| 19:34.31 | *** join/#openmoko fgau (n=fgau@p548C0F5F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 19:35.42 | *** part/#openmoko serious2007 (n=serious@84.123.30.84.dyn.user.ono.com) |
| 19:35.46 | *** join/#openmoko miip_ (n=miip@p54A5514C.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 19:35.46 | *** join/#openmoko drath_ (i=vmaster@p5B07C9EB.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 19:39.08 | *** join/#openmoko lar5 (n=laprican@hsiproxy.astra-net.com) |
| 19:39.10 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@81.80-202-132.nextgentel.com) |
| 19:42.03 | *** part/#openmoko j_ack (n=j_ack@p508D8787.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 19:42.10 | *** join/#openmoko eonj (n=ENJ@fl-65-40-12-114.sta.embarqhsd.net) |
| 19:42.46 | *** join/#openmoko j_ack (n=j_ack@p508D8787.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 19:44.00 | cdbot2 | * * OM Bug 1064 has been created by robophred(AT)gmail.com |
| 19:44.01 | cdbot2 | * * Small combobox menus needlessly scrolling. |
| 19:44.02 | cdbot2 | * * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=1064 |
| 19:45.07 | roh | zdanek sorry.. no clue. |
| 19:45.23 | roh | zdanek abraxa is the one hacking on it |
| 19:46.11 | zdanek | roh: thx |
| 19:47.06 | borg_ | zdanek: it is able to play every file you can play on your desktop |
| 19:47.15 | RoboPhred | there we go, my first patch on om |
| 19:47.19 | borg_ | zdanek: you probably want to install gst-ffmpeg |
| 19:47.24 | borg_ | dont know the exact name of the package |
| 19:47.42 | zdanek | borg_: you mean on openmoko? |
| 19:47.46 | borg_ | zdanek: do "ipkg list | grep gst > file" |
| 19:47.53 | zdanek | okay |
| 19:47.55 | borg_ | and then search in the file for the right package |
| 19:47.56 | zdanek | I'll tryb |
| 19:47.59 | zdanek | okay |
| 19:48.10 | *** part/#openmoko caligari_spain (n=caligari@203.pool85-56-200.dynamic.orange.es) |
| 19:49.26 | RoboPhred | Thanks for your help yesterday borg, I finished the patch and submitted it |
| 19:50.05 | borg_ | RoboPhred: very nice :) |
| 19:50.06 | zdanek | borg_: with ffmpeg I found only gst-plugin-ffmpegcolorspace |
| 19:50.23 | borg_ | dont know exactly |
| 19:50.25 | borg_ | try it :) |
| 19:50.31 | zdanek | but there's gstreamer - 0.10.14-r0 - GStreamer is a multimedia framework for encoding and decoding video and sound. It supports a wide range of formats including mp |
| 19:50.53 | borg_ | gstreamer ist probably installed allready |
| 19:50.58 | zdanek | hmm |
| 19:51.07 | borg_ | but try it |
| 19:51.12 | zdanek | media player requires some kind of plugin |
| 19:51.14 | borg_ | i dont know exactly |
| 19:51.19 | zdanek | as it shouts in message box |
| 19:51.27 | zdanek | I will fight with it |
| 19:51.33 | borg_ | i am pretty sure it uses gstreamer |
| 19:51.41 | zdanek | should I use other reporitory than official? |
| 19:51.44 | borg_ | so you just need the right gst-plugin-* package |
| 19:51.55 | borg_ | there are no big difference |
| 19:53.27 | zdanek | yep, but none of packages looks like "avi decoder" |
| 19:54.02 | borg_ | "avi" is a containerformat |
| 19:54.07 | borg_ | it is now codec itself |
| 19:54.13 | borg_ | there can be any codec in it |
| 19:54.37 | borg_ | s/now/no |
| 19:54.44 | zdanek | maybe some of "gst-plugins-base - 0.10.14-r2 - Plugins for GStreamer |
| 19:54.56 | borg_ | zdanek: try it...... |
| 19:54.57 | zdanek | as we suppose media player is using gstreame |
| 19:55.00 | zdanek | ok |
| 19:55.05 | borg_ | install them all and it will work |
| 19:55.10 | zdanek | :) |
| 19:55.12 | borg_ | but look if you have enough space |
| 19:55.39 | zdanek | that's what is keeping me from not installing all of them |
| 19:56.08 | zdanek | with little space we should be like surgeons |
| 19:56.15 | zdanek | with precise cut&install ;) |
| 19:59.15 | xzcvczx | oh ffs office for mac cant print :S |
| 19:59.24 | RoboPhred | hardware has an sd card, doesnt i?t |
| 19:59.38 | RoboPhred | always has for me |
| 19:59.53 | RoboPhred | ^^->xzcvczx |
| 20:01.02 | xzcvczx | RoboPhred: in leopard? |
| 20:01.17 | RoboPhred | not sure, it is on the common computers around campus |
| 20:07.03 | *** join/#openmoko ossman (n=drzeus@gateway.drzeus.cx) |
| 20:09.14 | zdanek | borg_: I have a progress in the case, I added celtune repository and it exploded with about 30 new plugins! I installed avi plugin and media player didn't complain any more. I can play avi file and I have a sound, but still no video |
| 20:09.27 | zdanek | are we sure it can show video? |
| 20:09.36 | zdanek | maybe it's able to play sound |
| 20:09.38 | zdanek | only |
| 20:09.45 | borg_ | zdanek: it play video for me |
| 20:10.03 | zdanek | so I do need more plugins |
| 20:10.07 | borg_ | in the small preview window |
| 20:10.14 | borg_ | zdanek: is there gst-ffmpeg now? |
| 20:10.21 | zdanek | let's see |
| 20:10.58 | *** join/#openmoko goodwill (n=goodwill@netblock-66-245-212-230.dslextreme.com) |
| 20:11.08 | zdanek | damn it, only gst-plugin-ffmpegcolorspace |
| 20:11.15 | borg_ | then try this ;) |
| 20:11.29 | zdanek | i doesn't look like decoder |
| 20:11.36 | borg_ | mh |
| 20:13.43 | zdanek | nope |
| 20:13.48 | *** join/#openmoko eonj_ (n=ENJ@fl-65-40-12-114.sta.embarqhsd.net) |
| 20:13.52 | zdanek | it wasn't this plugin |
| 20:13.56 | borg_ | :D |
| 20:14.42 | borg_ | zdanek: can you open this avi with mplayer somewhere? |
| 20:14.51 | borg_ | i think it says what codec it uses on startup |
| 20:14.57 | borg_ | or vlc |
| 20:15.18 | *** join/#openmoko Astr0 (n=zeek@62.150.150.130) |
| 20:16.57 | *** part/#openmoko Christoph (n=christop@p508CE6C4.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 20:17.13 | *** join/#openmoko Lunpa (n=lunpa@rch85-2-88-163-221-31.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 20:18.10 | *** join/#openmoko MuffY (n=chatzill@s55928932.adsl.wanadoo.nl) |
| 20:19.06 | Astr0 | hello all |
| 20:19.46 | Astr0 | i just read about the project today, i have a question... can the neo be used as a proper phone right now with qtopia? |
| 20:21.14 | borg_ | Astr0: dont know, perhaps you should ask in #qtopia |
| 20:22.26 | Astr0 | will do |
| 20:23.40 | *** join/#openmoko AVee_ (n=AVee@edsger.d6.nl) |
| 20:23.48 | *** join/#openmoko Issac-S (n=Issac-S@208.113.24.205) |
| 20:24.56 | *** join/#openmoko eonj_ (n=ENJ@fl-65-40-12-114.sta.embarqhsd.net) |
| 20:34.20 | *** join/#openmoko twistx (n=no@64.30.190.171) |
| 20:37.58 | zdanek | borg_: my avi is coded with divx |
| 20:38.02 | zdanek | no such plugin |
| 20:38.26 | *** join/#openmoko _ts (n=pinhead@stdin.stderror.at) |
| 20:38.31 | borg_ | zdanek: thats ffmpeg |
| 20:38.33 | borg_ | mh |
| 20:38.51 | borg_ | on debian/ubuntu you need gstreamer0.10-ffmpeg for divx |
| 20:39.58 | zdanek | right |
| 20:40.13 | zdanek | i need it for openmoko |
| 20:43.29 | *** join/#openmoko MetaMorfoziS (n=khmhm@dsl54007FEF.pool.t-online.hu) |
| 20:45.06 | metzenas | Astr0, maybe you get some answers from there: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Qtopia_on_Neo_1973 |
| 20:46.54 | *** join/#openmoko AVee (n=AVee@edsger.d6.nl) |
| 20:47.44 | *** join/#openmoko MeTa (n=khmhm@dsl54007FEF.pool.t-online.hu) |
| 20:48.32 | *** join/#openmoko Aria (n=aredride@acrux.theinternetco.net) |
| 20:50.29 | *** join/#openmoko almien (n=Ojw@87-194-198-122.bethere.co.uk) |
| 20:51.01 | *** join/#openmoko SP-8472 (i=8472@dslb-084-056-218-067.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 20:53.36 | Astr0 | metzenas, so still not ready yet |
| 21:03.16 | OJW | pyroute modified to display map images original-size (no rescaling) |
| 21:04.00 | *** join/#openmoko zipola (n=zipola@cable-vrk-fe5cdd00-177.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 21:04.11 | *** join/#openmoko mboldisc (n=mike@c-66-41-225-167.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) |
| 21:04.33 | Vegar | OJW: have you solved the download-thread issue yet? |
| 21:05.27 | OJW | (not sure cairo actually draws them any faster though - but if it was too slow before you might check now) |
| 21:05.47 | OJW | Vegar: the killing of downloads-in-progress? |
| 21:05.57 | Vegar | yes |
| 21:06.29 | *** join/#openmoko AVee_ (n=AVee@edsger.d6.nl) |
| 21:06.37 | OJW | haven't looked at it. (though calling "sys.exit()" when the main window closes does seem to help ;) |
| 21:06.46 | Vegar | hehe |
| 21:08.40 | *** join/#openmoko ossman (n=drzeus@gateway.drzeus.cx) |
| 21:08.41 | OJW | eventually you'd want to download all the maps before leaving home (e.g. all tiles within 20km of your planned route) -- but how much storage space is available? |
| 21:10.26 | zdanek | OJW: does pyroute works with openmoko? |
| 21:10.28 | mjr | up to a few gigabytes... |
| 21:10.36 | mjr | if you have a large microsd |
| 21:10.57 | zdanek | is it available in ipk packages? |
| 21:11.15 | zdanek | or should it be only downloaded from homepage? |
| 21:11.30 | borg_ | OJW: i think if you store it on the sd card (/media/card) some 100mb should'nt be a problem |
| 21:11.38 | OJW | zdanek: look at recent archives of openmoko-dev mailing lists for its dependancies. the source code is only available on a SVN server, not as a package |
| 21:11.42 | borg_ | the standard sd card has 512 mb |
| 21:12.05 | OJW | SD cards do have a habit of getting cheaper I suppose |
| 21:12.08 | *** join/#openmoko simon_ (n=simon@w208.wist.uni-linz.ac.at) |
| 21:12.12 | borg_ | OJW: perhaps you can could look how much space is left, and fill it to a maximum of 50mb left? |
| 21:12.19 | OJW | borg_: good idea |
| 21:12.58 | borg_ | i thin in something like 100mb you can put lots of tiles, can't you? |
| 21:13.00 | OJW | would be good to be intelligent like that, avoid asking the user difficult questions. |
| 21:13.15 | zdanek | I have 2GB card for about $23 |
| 21:13.21 | zdanek | sorry |
| 21:13.24 | zdanek | $33 |
| 21:13.27 | borg_ | and there will be free space of more then 100mb in most cases |
| 21:13.32 | borg_ | i would guess |
| 21:13.54 | OJW | actually, a lot of it comes down to the filesystem you choose (i.e. how much space it wastes when storing lots of small files) |
| 21:14.17 | borg_ | thats right |
| 21:14.43 | borg_ | is it possible to .gz them and gunzip the parts that are needed on the fly? |
| 21:14.54 | borg_ | something like that |
| 21:15.01 | *** join/#openmoko chris^^ (n=kraetzi@p548AF0D7.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 21:15.38 | OJW | well we can play with stuff like that. See if the major problems (like rendering speed) have a solution first |
| 21:15.59 | borg_ | of course |
| 21:21.43 | *** join/#openmoko bmk789 (n=bmk789@74-140-26-120.dhcp.insightbb.com) |
| 21:32.13 | *** join/#openmoko AVee_ (n=AVee@edsger.d6.nl) |
| 21:44.13 | *** join/#openmoko cktakahasi (n=cktakaha@189.70.66.189) |
| 21:46.01 | zdanek | goodnight |
| 21:46.09 | *** join/#openmoko thierce (i=thierce@dslb-084-062-010-222.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 21:46.15 | thierce | hi |
| 21:46.22 | *** part/#openmoko zdanek (n=zdanek@ams122.internetdsl.tpnet.pl) |
| 21:46.58 | goodwill | hello |
| 21:49.20 | *** join/#openmoko erraen (n=user@mistaken-humer.volia.net) |
| 21:50.22 | *** join/#openmoko hhf423 (n=chatzill@A77b3.a.strato-dslnet.de) |
| 21:51.05 | hhf423 | moin |
| 21:51.51 | borg_ | nabend |
| 21:53.47 | *** join/#openmoko neutrino (n=chatzill@62.162.14.49) |
| 21:54.25 | hhf423 | gps gllin driver out, excellent |
| 21:54.33 | hhf423 | is that eabi or oabi? |
| 21:54.52 | borg_ | the one, which needs a wrapper |
| 21:55.06 | borg_ | it is the binary that was deliverd in the very first neos |
| 21:55.20 | hhf423 | ah, that |
| 21:55.28 | hhf423 | which is crashing sometimes... |
| 21:55.35 | borg_ | does it? |
| 21:55.41 | borg_ | it works very reliable here |
| 21:55.48 | borg_ | i tested it in my car today |
| 21:55.51 | hhf423 | what I heard |
| 21:55.55 | hhf423 | and? |
| 21:55.59 | borg_ | very good |
| 21:56.13 | hhf423 | how did you test it? |
| 21:56.27 | hhf423 | does the current image include it already? |
| 21:56.33 | borg_ | i looked at the coordinates.. ;) |
| 21:56.40 | borg_ | http://3rdparty.downloads.openmoko.org/ |
| 21:56.44 | borg_ | it will not get in the images |
| 21:56.52 | borg_ | because of the eula you have to accept |
| 21:57.10 | neutrino | http://celpaste.morb-design.com/pastebin.php?show=m23d1c861 |
| 21:57.12 | neutrino | Can someone help me with this error, raise when building openmoko-devel-image!? |
| 21:57.23 | hhf423 | ach |
| 21:57.24 | borg_ | mwester: where did you try it? |
| 21:57.46 | borg_ | after i got a gps fix outside it worked even in the car |
| 21:57.55 | mwester | Ottawa and Chicago - indoors and out. |
| 21:57.59 | hhf423 | anyways, the image from friday does not ask for a pin, still |
| 21:58.00 | borg_ | mh |
| 21:58.07 | borg_ | hhf423: ? |
| 21:58.18 | borg_ | i am getting asked for pin since 3 month or so |
| 21:58.35 | *** part/#openmoko thierce (i=thierce@dslb-084-062-010-222.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 21:58.37 | hhf423 | nah, I only when flashing qtopia |
| 21:58.45 | borg_ | strange |
| 21:58.59 | borg_ | mwester: how long did you wait? |
| 21:59.15 | borg_ | it takes something like ~8 minutes here for me |
| 21:59.16 | *** part/#openmoko Aria (n=aredride@acrux.theinternetco.net) |
| 21:59.21 | borg_ | to get a fix |
| 21:59.23 | mwester | 14 hours in Ottawa, 15:24 hours here. |
| 21:59.29 | borg_ | but then it works imo pretty nice |
| 21:59.34 | hhf423 | I can see that the gpsd does get the pin request, its in the logs. but dialer does not seem to pick it up |
| 21:59.55 | *** part/#openmoko MuffY (n=chatzill@s55928932.adsl.wanadoo.nl) |
| 22:00.48 | *** part/#openmoko neutrino (n=chatzill@62.162.14.49) |
| 22:04.06 | *** join/#openmoko morricone (n=foobar@dslb-084-057-156-208.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 22:04.26 | *** join/#openmoko jptmoore (n=john@82-44-200-69.cable.ubr08.haye.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 22:07.25 | *** join/#openmoko abraxa_ (n=abraxa@pD95FC9B5.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 22:08.32 | emdete | gpsd? pin? hm... ;) |
| 22:08.48 | hhf423 | yeah, well |
| 22:09.37 | hhf423 | all not very encouraging |
| 22:10.01 | *** join/#openmoko heikkit (n=chatzill@c-67-188-122-139.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 22:11.36 | *** join/#openmoko rbs-tito (n=tito@88-107-39-246.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com) |
| 22:11.52 | *** join/#openmoko dkirker (n=dkirker@adsl-70-135-165-13.dsl.snlo01.sbcglobal.net) |
| 22:12.08 | emdete | i always wonder why the openmoko people do not build their house from bottom up... |
| 22:12.45 | hhf423 | emdete |
| 22:12.47 | hhf423 | I know the answer to that |
| 22:13.03 | hhf423 | very easy answer |
| 22:13.16 | *** join/#openmoko yesi (n=yesi@bgl93-2-82-227-160-53.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 22:13.39 | hhf423 | they are still busy inventing open source concrete to create the foundation for the house |
| 22:14.17 | hhf423 | and its not even funny |
| 22:14.18 | emdete | hhf423: doesnt seem so - the have a roof but the basement is weak |
| 22:14.27 | OJW | emdete: you wonder why programmers don't do building work? still waiting for the punchline here |
| 22:14.30 | emdete | hhf423: why is there any gtk app right now? |
| 22:14.41 | mwester | a task made more difficult by their seeming insistence that none of the crowd gathered around asking to help be permitted to do so. |
| 22:14.48 | hhf423 | OJW because its a hardware problem... |
| 22:14.55 | polz | I'm guessing it's either because none of them have enough free time to make phonecalls.. |
| 22:15.10 | emdete | mwester: yes, i know that one - i offered a gsm07.10 daemon... :/ |
| 22:15.14 | polz | or because they're actually using some other manufacturer's phones |
| 22:15.45 | hhf423 | emdete: I get your point. But the lead architect was busy creating a webshop and then left the project |
| 22:16.00 | hhf423 | or something |
| 22:16.21 | emdete | hhf423: hm, bad situation - especially if there is only one capable of doing lead-arch |
| 22:16.58 | mwester | even worse when the truth is that there are many others who are capable, but they don't trust anyone in the community. |
| 22:17.18 | emdete | anyway a project should start with test cases for the requirements (as simple scripts for gsm, gps, sound, display, battery, whatever) and then the hardware drivers & daemon are implemented. |
| 22:17.20 | hhf423 | emdete: don't know about that. laforge left before gta02 was ready. we will see how much this will impact the timeline |
| 22:17.44 | emdete | laforge left? didnt know that... why? |
| 22:17.55 | buz | burn out maybe? |
| 22:17.58 | hhf423 | emdete: the interesting thing about what you are saying is: I think everyone knows that. And still it does not happen. |
| 22:18.09 | buz | or just pissed off by the obvious lack of proper management |
| 22:18.23 | emdete | i would immediatly drop all activity on all gui stuff. nobody is interested in that |
| 22:18.32 | polz | hhf423: maybe this whole project is just an experiment in extreme management... |
| 22:18.43 | buz | or absence of management |
| 22:18.56 | hhf423 | polz: you mean, in extreme absence of management... |
| 22:19.00 | polz | hhf423: first they tested how longe the hype could last by delaying GTA01 for almost half a year... |
| 22:19.16 | hhf423 | heh, yes |
| 22:19.20 | emdete | polz: don't think so - there was never a hype ;) |
| 22:19.24 | polz | hhf423: and now they're waiting to see if the community is actually capable of creating a software stack for free :> |
| 22:19.28 | buz | or they're trying to prove the old wisdom that if you leave engineers to manage a product launch you'll never launch anything |
| 22:19.47 | hhf423 | buz: I bet this is it |
| 22:20.01 | buz | hhf423: for all i can tell, there's noone with management skills there |
| 22:20.10 | buz | (in some way, that statement is tautological) |
| 22:20.17 | hhf423 | buz: that would also be my assessment |
| 22:20.34 | buz | if there was management skill around, things would be entirely different |
| 22:20.34 | polz | buz: judging by the sound quality when making a call and the problems with quad-band, delaying the launch might have made sense |
| 22:21.00 | emdete | polz: sound quality of gta02? |
| 22:21.04 | buz | anrp: optimism gradually gave way to pessimism over the past 12 months |
| 22:21.08 | polz | I don't care, really, as long as I have a working computer with a GSM modem in my hands, he he he |
| 22:21.12 | polz | emdete: gta01 |
| 22:21.28 | polz | emdete: I can hear the radio every time I make a call |
| 22:21.32 | emdete | polz: hm, sound quality was fine when i tested... |
| 22:21.50 | buz | then again, people with management skills would have sacrificed the project's ideals. for better or worse. |
| 22:21.58 | polz | emdete: and the people I call keep complaining about hearing themselves |
| 22:22.01 | emdete | but.. overall what does that all mean? stop neo, crack a iphone? |
| 22:22.05 | mmontour | polz: My GF's razr has about the same radio-buzz as my GTA01 |
| 22:22.05 | *** join/#openmoko miip (n=miip@p54A5514C.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 22:22.05 | hhf423 | buz: this is where I disagree |
| 22:22.34 | hhf423 | emdete: I just asked a friend to get me a iphone from the states when he comes back |
| 22:22.38 | mmontour | There is (or was - I haven't checked lately) a bad echo when calling to the GTA01 |
| 22:22.46 | buz | hhf423: most people would have decided they want a phone now, figured if it takes a binary driver, so be it. got some momentum, then use that to get a completely open phone |
| 22:23.00 | polz | buz: I'm still an optimist - if they manage to release GTA02 without bugs in the hardware and core applications.... |
| 22:23.00 | hhf423 | buz: I believe that you can have management and not sacrifice ideals (much) :-) |
| 22:23.14 | buz | hhf423: yeah, but then you need tons of money |
| 22:23.17 | polz | buz: they're going to survive at least until GTA03 :) |
| 22:23.24 | emdete | polz: core application where not even the driver work? |
| 22:23.29 | hhf423 | buz: I agree on the binary thing |
| 22:23.53 | buz | a not completely open phone is a lot more useful for development than one that doesnt work |
| 22:24.02 | polz | emdete: well, IMHO GTA02 won't be released to the public before march, so there still is hope |
| 22:24.10 | hhf423 | MARCH? |
| 22:24.11 | polz | btw, that statement is based on 0 data. |
| 22:24.20 | buz | polz: that's exactly why the hope is diminishing |
| 22:24.25 | hhf423 | ah, define "the public" |
| 22:24.28 | buz | GTA02 should have been released in march 07 |
| 22:24.54 | polz | hhf423: ordinary people who are willing to buy a phone over the internet but expect it to actually work. |
| 22:25.05 | hhf423 | ah, ok, those suckers |
| 22:25.21 | buz | yeah why would anyone want a phone that actually makes calls? |
| 22:25.29 | polz | hhf423: the sort of people who would otherwise be deterred by a huge "developers only, might not work" sign |
| 22:25.33 | hhf423 | as long as I can have it earlier and it works to some extend :-) |
| 22:25.59 | hhf423 | in any case what there is now is not sufficient |
| 22:26.04 | emdete | hhf423: that's the question, what do you require when you say 'to some extend'? |
| 22:26.20 | buz | make calls |
| 22:26.23 | hhf423 | I need it to make and receive calls |
| 22:26.24 | OJW | because you can buy one of those for £15, polz? people are buying this thing as a handheld computer |
| 22:26.31 | buz | leave it without power for 2days |
| 22:26.31 | roh | same game as for gta01. we will not take money for hardware we do not see as fit for sale, which means no hw-bugs we know of |
| 22:26.32 | polz | buz: the hope is diminishing because we're nearing the first anniversary of the original "free software phone" announcement.. |
| 22:26.33 | hhf423 | and I want gps |
| 22:26.43 | buz | polz: no its because the market is accelerating |
| 22:26.46 | hhf423 | anything else is up to negotiation |
| 22:26.55 | emdete | hhf423: how - would do call over ssh be sufficient? |
| 22:27.08 | buz | polz: htc is pushing out nice hardware as ever but now they are actively marketing it |
| 22:27.28 | buz | and android is gearing up |
| 22:27.56 | hhf423 | emdete: no. I need to be able to make calls when I am in a place where I need a GSM phone, which is outside of my home |
| 22:28.13 | buz | hhf423: i agree. and battery needs to last at least 48h |
| 22:28.25 | polz | buz: are they also providing at least some sort of support to developers who want to boot their own software on it ? |
| 22:28.31 | hhf423 | yes, android will be really interesting once you can buy hw for that |
| 22:28.36 | buz | support? muahahahhaa |
| 22:28.45 | hhf423 | buz, I can live with charging every day |
| 22:28.56 | polz | buz: why would Android turn out much better than Java did ? |
| 22:29.04 | hhf423 | buz: my first mobile needed two battery packs to last the day :-) |
| 22:29.04 | emdete | hhf423: that's not what i need. i don't think the neo must be a all-day-mobile immendiatly. if you want to get support from open source developers just give them a working platform. every idiot can do a gui on that |
| 22:29.47 | buz | i occasionally take trips that take 30+h from point to point |
| 22:29.47 | buz | polz: have you looked at the demo? |
| 22:29.53 | polz | btw, is anyone working on the power management yet ? |
| 22:30.04 | polz | buz: I have to admit I haven't |
| 22:30.12 | buz | a phone that cant last at least 24h is totally worthless as phone |
| 22:30.16 | *** join/#openmoko xaid|isis (n=zaid@S0106001c101b4163.ed.shawcable.net) |
| 22:30.16 | buz | it may work as pda |
| 22:30.20 | buz | but so does an ipaq |
| 22:30.52 | polz | btw, if you put the phone into suspend - is receiving a phone supposed to wake it up yet ? |
| 22:31.03 | hhf423 | buz: we probably need to distinguish between stand by time and talk time. 4h talk time and/or 24h standby is my minimum |
| 22:31.22 | buz | yeah i agree |
| 22:31.33 | buz | i would say 48h standby is really what the phone should do |
| 22:31.37 | hhf423 | and then I can always have an extra battery for starters |
| 22:31.38 | buz | 24h is the absolute minimum |
| 22:32.09 | buz | symbian phones can have standby times of over a week |
| 22:32.21 | hhf423 | buz: yes, for 5 years now |
| 22:32.39 | josch | buz, can you play wesnoth on symbian? :-D |
| 22:32.47 | hhf423 | buz: my p800 did standy for a week if it did stay in one place. and that phone is now really old |
| 22:32.59 | buz | hhf423: my p900 originally did 10d |
| 22:33.03 | buz | now it does about 3 |
| 22:33.06 | buz | with 4 year old battery |
| 22:33.30 | buz | extra battery-> one more thing |
| 22:33.40 | buz | at some point i might as well get an n810 and a symbian smartphon |
| 22:33.40 | buz | e |
| 22:33.51 | emdete | hm, strange. i would like to have the neo as a nice dev. platform for own ideas. here all people would like the neo as a useable mobile... |
| 22:33.57 | hhf423 | I totally want some of the applications which are listed in the ideas section. linke location based todo and reminders and stuff |
| 22:34.16 | buz | yeah but most of them are useless without decent hardware |
| 22:34.52 | hhf423 | is there any location based todo/whatever apps out there for any phone? |
| 22:34.55 | emdete | buz: and working drivers and workings test for those. |
| 22:35.08 | OJW | is n810 touchscreen? |
| 22:35.18 | hhf423 | 810 is touchscreen, yes |
| 22:35.21 | emdete | i even would be fine if android would be ported to the neo but that won't work until the drivers work |
| 22:35.45 | josch | hhf423, shouldn't be a problem to write a python calendar app that interfaces gps |
| 22:36.29 | emdete | josch: if gps (and everything else) would work reliable... |
| 22:36.44 | hhf423 | josch: yeah, I know, one of those "can be done in half an hour problems" |
| 22:37.21 | polz | emdete: in it's current state, the battery will still be dead before you finish work |
| 22:37.25 | emdete | i really wonder why you all are looking at the roof while the cellar is not even visible... |
| 22:37.31 | polz | emdete: so the phone won't be able to remind you to pick up the groceries anyway |
| 22:37.50 | josch | right - problably the app could be hacked together in half an hour with a bit of glade magic but emdete is right - gps has to work reliable beforehand |
| 22:37.53 | emdete | polz: see, not the app is missing, the drivers below are |
| 22:38.08 | hhf423 | I should probably find myself a programmer in india, send him a openmoko and 100 euro a week and have him build my personal dream phone in a month or six |
| 22:38.25 | josch | emdete, agreed |
| 22:38.28 | emdete | josch: and everything. battery & charing, gsm, sms, mms & gprs |
| 22:38.45 | emdete | perhaps we write a petition to fic? :D |
| 22:39.03 | polz | hhf423: I doubt capable programers are that cheap, even in India |
| 22:39.05 | borg_ | emdete: thats all gsm |
| 22:39.24 | emdete | borg_: yes and no |
| 22:39.38 | hhf423 | polz: then you just also give 100 eur a week :-) |
| 22:39.50 | emdete | borg_: you have to decode sms. you have to request mms content & decode & render. and so on |
| 22:40.14 | emdete | borg_: and there is more - how about audio? |
| 22:40.18 | hhf423 | we should implement the street performer protocol to get those features |
| 22:40.30 | josch | I cannot imagine this GUI stuff being so difficult once gsmd works correctly... |
| 22:41.00 | josch | emdete, the new pulseaudio is beeing prepared by mickeyl and abraxa |
| 22:41.07 | emdete | josch: agree. exactly. point is: gsmd stuff is difficult. because gui looks nicer all programmers prefere to do that |
| 22:41.11 | hhf423 | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Street_Performer_Protocol |
| 22:42.23 | josch | hhf423, nice one ^^ |
| 22:42.30 | emdete | :D yes... |
| 22:42.52 | hhf423 | and its not a new idea, its like, 5 years old or more |
| 22:43.18 | hhf423 | oh, its like 8 years old |
| 22:43.23 | *** join/#openmoko jadams_ (n=jadams@rrcs-24-73-176-10.se.biz.rr.com) |
| 22:43.27 | hhf423 | Bruce Schneier 1999 |
| 22:43.42 | josch | whooo bruce schneier ftw |
| 22:43.53 | hhf423 | http://www.firstmonday.org/issues/issue4_6/kelsey/ |
| 22:44.02 | polz | hhf423: hey, I've already paid 260 EUR for the phone, that's money I still haven't made back :) |
| 22:44.40 | hhf423 | polz: I agree to some extend. but a call phone whith lots of features is more than 260 EUR |
| 22:45.18 | polz | hhf423: the other phones I've used so far were all free |
| 22:45.22 | hhf423 | polz: the neo1973 has the potential to deliver more value than 260 EUR to me and I would pay more if there was more. |
| 22:45.48 | polz | and by free, I mean I didn't even have to sign a contract - it's just that my friends got bored with them :P |
| 22:46.18 | hhf423 | polz: I have friends like you :-) |
| 22:46.58 | polz | hhf423: I'd rather buy a used laptop for 360 EUR than add the price of an Indian programer to that of the Neo |
| 22:47.07 | *** join/#openmoko MeTa (n=khmhm@dsl51B6AB0E.pool.t-online.hu) |
| 22:47.09 | polz | hhf423: thank you for supporting our kind :P |
| 22:47.47 | josch | polz, how did you get your neo for 260 € ?? |
| 22:48.34 | *** join/#openmoko Audiomind (n=Audiomin@62.79.42.233.adsl.kj.tiscali.dk) |
| 22:49.48 | polz | josch: a friend who works in the US ordered a pair and brought them over when he visited home |
| 22:52.53 | polz | and yeah, reading the prices of similar phones in the window of a shop I pass every day on my way to work still puts a smile on my face :) |
| 22:53.48 | *** join/#openmoko psal (n=ps@s3.flex.ch) |
| 22:54.01 | *** join/#openmoko eonj (n=ENJ@fl-65-40-12-114.sta.embarqhsd.net) |
| 22:57.09 | *** join/#openmoko MetaMorfoziS (n=khmhm@dsl51B6AB0E.pool.t-online.hu) |
| 22:57.39 | *** join/#openmoko ThePizzaKing (n=jeff@c220-239-221-132.brasd1.vic.optusnet.com.au) |
| 23:03.11 | NineX | hmm, new versions of u-boot does not support boot from SD? and this is a bug, or new versions wil not have this functionality? |
| 23:03.22 | NineX | s/wil/will |
| 23:06.08 | mmontour | !ombug 799 |
| 23:06.09 | cdbot2 | * * Bug 799, Status: NEW, Created: Unknown |
| 23:06.10 | cdbot2 | * * obri(AT)chaostreff.ch: data abort while reading from SD Cards |
| 23:06.11 | cdbot2 | * * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=799 |
| 23:07.09 | *** join/#openmoko bmk789_ (n=bmk789@74-140-26-120.dhcp.insightbb.com) |
| 23:08.26 | *** join/#openmoko wirrwarr (n=fz~@ppp-62-216-215-96.dynamic.mnet-online.de) |
| 23:10.34 | *** join/#openmoko daMaestro (n=jon@fedora/damaestro) |
| 23:12.10 | *** join/#openmoko nox-Hand (i=johnhand@unaffiliated/nox-hand) |
| 23:12.21 | *** join/#openmoko Taco (n=rtm@pool-151-199-42-6.bos.east.verizon.net) |
| 23:13.00 | *** join/#openmoko eonj_ (n=ENJ@fl-65-40-12-114.sta.embarqhsd.net) |
| 23:13.49 | *** join/#openmoko bluelightning (n=blueligh@122-57-161-46.jetstream.xtra.co.nz) |
| 23:14.35 | *** join/#openmoko goodwill_ (n=goodwill@netblock-66-245-212-130.dslextreme.com) |
| 23:18.16 | *** join/#openmoko mrcucumber (n=voorhees@reswlan251-246.wireless.stolaf.edu) |
| 23:18.55 | *** join/#openmoko k-s (n=gustavo@189.70.111.89) |
| 23:36.09 | *** join/#openmoko j_ack_ (n=j_ack@p508DADAD.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 23:38.29 | *** join/#openmoko rxr_ (n=rene@port-212-202-210-125.dynamic.qsc.de) |
| 23:49.00 | *** join/#openmoko Abraham (n=Abraham@175-178-112-217.dyn.adsl.belcenter.be) |
| 23:52.59 | *** join/#openmoko Q_Continuum (n=Q@75-168-121-58.mpls.qwest.net) |