| 00:02.05 | PITABoy | so whats up |
| 00:02.35 | zash | yeah, realy, what is up? |
| 00:03.08 | PITABoy | does anyone know if openmoko has any support for cdma or 3rd party support for cdma or an even beter question does anyone know if any linux distro can make a call on cdma? |
| 00:03.51 | zash | cdma is not gsm |
| 00:03.56 | PITABoy | i know |
| 00:03.58 | zash | the neo is a gsm-phone |
| 00:04.13 | PITABoy | i know but openmoko is software not hardware |
| 00:04.18 | PITABoy | the neo is hardware |
| 00:04.36 | PITABoy | openmoko runs on quite a few devices about 7 or 8 |
| 00:04.51 | zash | if you get om on a cdma-phone, and cdma-modem works similary to gsm-modem then maby |
| 00:05.23 | PITABoy | cool and you can make voice calls with gsm-modem |
| 00:06.03 | zash | gsm vs cdma? |
| 00:07.39 | mjr | basically any possible cdma support in openmoko is accidental and a product of some cdma chip offering a similar AT interface as the GSM chips... |
| 00:07.49 | mjr | if such things exist |
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| 00:11.59 | zash | is there even cdma outside of the us? |
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| 00:13.42 | mjr | Japan and some random countries. Though compatibility isn't given. |
| 00:17.39 | zash | do they have gsm in japan, or only cdma? |
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| 00:18.16 | mjr | No gsm. They do apparently have some umts nowadays. |
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| 00:27.20 | zash | hm, having the modem on a separate plug-in-ish chip.. |
| 00:27.38 | mjr | zash, no |
| 00:28.04 | mjr | well, yes of course but you get a nice boost in size and all |
| 00:28.39 | mjr | might as well make a PDA with a cardbus slot for mobile access ;) |
| 00:28.52 | SpeedEvil | PCI is more flexible. |
| 00:29.20 | roh | mjr japan is phs/cdma/3g only. no 2g-gsm coverage at all |
| 00:29.37 | mjr | yes that's why I said "no gsm" :) |
| 00:30.15 | mjr | sleep now, anyway |
| 00:30.31 | roh | the problem with cdma in general is that r-uim seem only to exist as single occurances, and not generic. so getting a cdma-phone working needs support from the carrier |
| 00:31.24 | roh | the provisioning is done directly onto the phone, no chipcard usually. the chipcard case (r-uim) is so seldom that most cdma devices do not even have a slot for it |
| 00:31.39 | zash | gnome-power-manager says "Laptop battery 25 minutes remaining (21%)" |
| 00:37.29 | zash | now sleep |
| 00:37.53 | CM | Good plan ;) |
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| 00:55.10 | DukeOfURL | I dropped my Neo :-( and the AUX button no longer works. |
| 00:55.23 | flexd | yay payday today (i can now officially afford a neo!) |
| 00:55.30 | PITABoy | lol |
| 00:55.42 | flexd | okay so i lie, i can afford several :( |
| 00:55.48 | flexd | but it feels better to spend money right as they come in |
| 00:55.54 | PITABoy | yay payday on the 15 and I already spent it! |
| 00:55.55 | DukeOfURL | looking in the plastic button piece, there is a slot on the inside. was there a magnet in the slot? |
| 00:55.57 | flexd | that way i wont notice having less money |
| 00:57.00 | flexd | because techically i'l have more money, and i get a new shiny thing to play with! |
| 00:57.43 | balrog-kun | clever! |
| 00:58.03 | abraxa_ | DukeOfURL: Nope, no magnet |
| 00:58.13 | abraxa_ | DukeOfURL: Maybe it's just misaligned |
| 00:58.24 | balrog-kun | flexd: i think the federal economy of a couple of countries works this way too |
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| 01:07.32 | flexd | balrog-kun: im sure they are successful countries.. |
| 01:07.46 | flexd | anyway, tired, so bbl sleeps and such \o |
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| 01:12.24 | balrog-kun | i'm not so sure |
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| 01:19.05 | Qwell | hey, does anybody know off the top of their head how the AMR transcoding is handled? Is that on the GSM chip? |
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| 01:23.18 | PITABoy | transcoding as in voice transcoding when it is sent to the cell towers??? |
| 01:23.43 | Qwell | well, before it's sent, and after it's received. It would have to go to wav before hitting the speakers. |
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| 01:23.53 | PITABoy | if so it depends on the phone |
| 01:24.08 | PITABoy | it needs a processor to transcode |
| 01:25.00 | SpeedEvil | the GSM module does all of that |
| 01:25.08 | PITABoy | my phone has a seperate processor for transcoding/and other communication tasks and one for the os |
| 01:25.12 | SpeedEvil | the GSM module takes a microphone and a speaker signal |
| 01:25.18 | SpeedEvil | (in the neo1973) |
| 01:25.22 | SpeedEvil | analog |
| 01:25.23 | PITABoy | the gsm module is a processor |
| 01:25.24 | SpeedEvil | and that's it. |
| 01:25.32 | Qwell | Is that ability accessible from userspace? |
| 01:25.34 | SpeedEvil | No, but it contains one. |
| 01:25.37 | Qwell | ie; can I give it wav, and get back amr? |
| 01:25.39 | SpeedEvil | Qwell: what? |
| 01:25.51 | PITABoy | i thought that the gsm module would just interface between the mic/speaker and the processor |
| 01:25.54 | Qwell | or is it more like "here's audio - make a call"? |
| 01:25.55 | SpeedEvil | Qwell: you can only give it analog audio |
| 01:25.56 | balrog-kun | Qwell: i'm afraid you can't |
| 01:26.00 | SpeedEvil | and get back analog audio |
| 01:26.03 | Qwell | shame |
| 01:26.10 | SpeedEvil | you cannot get at the encoded data |
| 01:26.21 | Qwell | okay, thanks |
| 01:26.26 | balrog-kun | at least not easily |
| 01:26.30 | Qwell | I'm pondering UMA :) |
| 01:26.38 | SpeedEvil | You can't do UMA |
| 01:26.43 | balrog-kun | it might be done in software, but it woudl be software that runs on the GSM chip |
| 01:26.44 | Qwell | not currently |
| 01:26.48 | SpeedEvil | without at least unrevealed support from TI |
| 01:26.59 | Qwell | hence the pondering :) |
| 01:27.38 | Qwell | I'm actually very seriously considering writing an LGPL UMA library. |
| 01:27.58 | Qwell | I spent half the day today reading the 3GPP spec (44.318) |
| 01:28.44 | Qwell | the only real problem I'm facing so far is a way to (legally) transcode AMR on devices. |
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| 01:29.35 | Qwell | well, and the whole SIM authentication stuff |
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| 01:30.17 | sladen | Qwell: ffmpeg and being outside the US should get you AMR |
| 01:30.24 | Qwell | sladen: yes, I know |
| 01:30.35 | Qwell | the AMR codec itself won't be difficult. |
| 01:30.48 | Qwell | it's just the patent crap |
| 01:31.16 | sladen | Qwell: and the SIM auth stuff is nothing more than bitbanging an ISO smart-card |
| 01:31.31 | Qwell | sladen: explain? |
| 01:31.51 | Qwell | surely you can't do the auth properly just by having read access? I assume there is some sort of exec required |
| 01:32.05 | sladen | Qwell: which, the living in Europe where software patents are technically not allowed |
| 01:32.25 | sladen | Qwell: or how to interface to a standard ISO smart-card with the corners cut off? |
| 01:32.41 | Qwell | sladen: huh? |
| 01:32.46 | Qwell | oh, the sim part |
| 01:32.50 | sladen | I'm confused too |
| 01:33.50 | Qwell | if you could explain the sim auth stuff, that would be awesome. that's been a big thing in the back of my mind while reading these specs |
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| 01:34.56 | sladen | in the case of the Neo, the modem completely hides the SIM, there's no direct access to the serial lines running to it |
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| 01:35.32 | Qwell | sladen: you mentioned a smart-card with the corners cut off.. I assume you mean you can still auth with a normal card reader? |
| 01:36.11 | sladen | when you go to the shop and by "a SIM card", you recieve a credit-card sized ISO smart-card |
| 01:36.38 | sladen | if you pick up older 10year old GSM phones you will find that this is the size of slot they contain |
| 01:36.57 | Aria | Huh! |
| 01:37.17 | Qwell | so, there is no "execute this and give me an auth code to send to the provider" built-in to a SIM? |
| 01:37.22 | sladen | so previously the size of a phone was limited by the spec for an ISO smart card. |
| 01:37.52 | sladen | the genius idea was to cut the corners off and have just the package containing the contains---thus we now have smaller phones |
| 01:38.09 | sladen | hence, there's nothing special about talking to "a SIM card" |
| 01:38.12 | Qwell | so - here's the problem I'm facing. In order to do UMA/GAN, you need to setup an IPsec tunnel with the provider. While doing the setup, you have to do "SIM authentication" |
| 01:38.32 | sladen | EAP/SIM ? |
| 01:38.36 | Qwell | that would simply be reading some bits from the SIM, and doing some voodoo to them? |
| 01:38.41 | Qwell | umm, I believe so |
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| 01:39.16 | SpeedEvil | Qwell: the current TI firmware will not do UMA' |
| 01:39.24 | Qwell | SpeedEvil: yes, I understand |
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| 01:39.38 | Qwell | this would be a standalone library |
| 01:40.28 | Qwell | (by TI, I assume you mean the GSM chip) |
| 01:42.16 | SpeedEvil | itr's a TI calypsi chipset |
| 01:42.19 | sladen | Qwell: your bankcard/simcard/etc have methods (several) for sending sending a number to the smart-card and having the smart-card perform a secret hash on the number and return you can other number |
| 01:42.44 | sladen | Calypso |
| 01:42.55 | Qwell | sladen: So, I guess the question I'm asking, is whether a standard smart-card reader/writer would be able to do this |
| 01:43.09 | sladen | Qwell: yes. |
| 01:43.34 | Qwell | so it's basically just write some magic bits, and then read some magic bits back? |
| 01:43.59 | Qwell | that's perfect |
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| 01:44.44 | sladen | it's a serial port. You speak a language down it, and then query for replies back. The functions/actions are encoded using a binary-based protocol |
| 01:45.01 | Qwell | ahh, I figured it was just a storage device. that makes more sense |
| 01:45.21 | Qwell | or, rather, the interface being just a storage device (like CF) |
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| 01:45.57 | Qwell | though I guess even in the case of CF, it's not a "storage device" either.. okay, I get it |
| 01:46.57 | sladen | no, but there are functions to access, list, and store to the files contained on the smart card |
| 01:47.08 | Qwell | gotcha |
| 01:47.39 | Qwell | so that gets rid of the only technical hurdle - the only hurdle (in the US..) is the licensing one |
| 01:47.54 | Qwell | (which at this point, as far as I'm concerned, isn't an issue) |
| 01:49.58 | sladen | uh huh. |
| 01:50.00 | Qwell | So, does the GSM chip also do SIM access? |
| 01:50.04 | Qwell | (on the Neo) |
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| 01:51.03 | mwester | The only connections the SIM has on the Neo is to the GSM modem. |
| 01:51.10 | Qwell | k |
| 01:51.34 | Qwell | that still doesn't make UMA impossible |
| 01:51.35 | sladen | if you go on ebay, you'll find tonnes of USB smartcard/"sim card" readers |
| 01:51.39 | Qwell | just a little more...difficult |
| 01:51.47 | Qwell | the Neo has a USB port, right? :) |
| 01:52.03 | matthew__ | does the neo have a place for an SD card? |
| 01:52.20 | Qwell | pull the SIM from the built-in reader, put it into a USB reader, and do your UMA stuff |
| 01:52.53 | mwester | matthew__: micro sd is behind the sim card. |
| 01:53.06 | matthew__ | mwester: good, that's the answer i was hoping for |
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| 01:53.42 | mwester | Qwell: USB is provided. If you need "closer" to the device, there are solder pads for the i2c and/or SPI bus (one or both of those, I forget the details). |
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| 01:57.17 | sladen | Qwell: to make GAN work, *you* (either yourself, or the operator) has to control both ends of the connection, so that the rerouteing can take place |
| 01:57.45 | Qwell | eh? |
| 01:58.15 | sladen | Qwell: if you control both ends, it's possible to do roaming now using a call that gets switched between being carried over VoIP over IP, or over circuit switched GSM |
| 01:58.35 | Qwell | oh, sure. At this point, I'm not going to be implementing handover |
| 01:58.52 | Qwell | You can simply say "I don't see any towers - can't help you" |
| 02:00.21 | Qwell | normally, you'd get a packet that says "scan for GSM towers, and tell me what you see". The phone does so, and sends it what it finds. In my case, I'll just say "sure, I scanned, but there is nothing in range" |
| 02:00.57 | sladen | in the future, your phone will have a 2.75G radio and then a tonne of high-speed radios (bluetooth, 802.11, wifimax, WCDMA) suitable for starting high-speed IP packet connections over |
| 02:01.13 | sladen | the GSM radio will just be there for fallback |
| 02:01.20 | Qwell | yeah |
| 02:02.07 | *** part/#openmoko Aria (n=aredride@acrux.theinternetco.net) |
| 02:03.50 | DukeOfURL | abraxa_: I see the pad where the switch was mounted, but no switch. No switch in the case, on the desk, or on the floor. Mystery. |
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| 02:06.11 | bmk789 | i made a little diagram thing of some features i think would be good for openmoko http://bmk789.dyndns.org/bmk/openmoko.jpeg , im going to type it all out but where should i send it? |
| 02:06.33 | Qwell | bmk789: there is a wishlist on the wiki |
| 02:06.47 | Qwell | maybe something off of that? |
| 02:07.01 | bmk789 | Qwell: thanks ill check it out |
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| 02:07.15 | sladen | bmk789: wiki |
| 02:07.16 | matthew__ | bmk789: bro, get Dia quickly |
| 02:07.34 | bmk789 | what? |
| 02:07.35 | sladen | probably better it was done on paper first |
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| 02:07.48 | matthew__ | Dia Diagram editor |
| 02:08.00 | bmk789 | ah |
| 02:08.21 | sladen | or inkscae |
| 02:08.24 | sladen | inkscape |
| 02:08.36 | sladen | or umbrello |
| 02:09.06 | matthew__ | didn't know inkscape did diagrams |
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| 02:10.28 | bmk789 | thanks |
| 02:10.39 | Qwell | sladen: thanks again for the help - you shed a lot of light on things :) |
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| 03:43.41 | niklauz | hi all |
| 03:44.07 | niklauz | any predictions of openmoko's response to android? |
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| 03:56.11 | niklauz | where is everybody? |
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| 03:59.36 | zmedico | everybody moves to the secret channel whenever android trolls come along |
| 04:00.12 | niklauz | i'm really not trolling, just curious. it's a essential conversation to have don't you think? |
| 04:02.06 | niklauz | this is the quietest i've seen the channel in months though |
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| 04:04.48 | zmedico | the usual response is that it's difficult speculate until after the android sdk is actually released |
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| 04:11.40 | niklauz | thats reasonable, the early preview is on monday though i think |
| 04:12.27 | niklauz | i was trying to find more information about the licensing but only saw mentions of different stuff |
| 04:13.25 | niklauz | about the apache public lisence |
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| 04:14.20 | niklauz | i guess i'm just thinking out loud at this point, but shouldn't the apache public license and the gpl be compatible? |
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| 04:16.21 | niklauz | i guess i'll read up on it, it could be a huge benefit to openmoko though |
| 04:16.29 | niklauz | anywho.. |
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| 04:36.32 | balrog-kun | yes, openmoko already benefits from tons of free software and it can also benefit from android |
| 04:36.52 | balrog-kun | android also benefits from tons of free software and may benefit from openmoko |
| 04:37.11 | balrog-kun | the faq mentions that i think |
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| 04:41.40 | xzcvczxx | balrog-kun: are you the one who put all the AT%EM stuff on the wiki? |
| 04:45.15 | balrog-kun | xzcvczxx: yup |
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| 05:01.47 | rwhitby | morning |
| 05:07.35 | ljp | hi |
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| 05:13.16 | rwhitby | ljp: seen http://lists.arm.linux.org.uk/pipermail/linux-arm-kernel/2007-November/043241.html: "the vast majority of the devices in the 88-D0 space are peripherals specific to the MSM7K SOC and not likely to be useful elsewhere, excepting only the GPU (which ends up being a userspace library anyway, due to unfortunate license issues)." ? |
| 05:14.05 | rwhitby | that says binary graphics drivers for android to me ... |
| 05:19.15 | ljp | :) probably so. and alot of other closed source associated with it |
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| 06:27.12 | rwhitby | Hmm - only one person wanting to sell their phone on http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/US_850_band_users_wanting_to_sell_Neo |
| 06:27.35 | rwhitby | If I was OpenMoko, I wouldn't consider 1 out of a couple of thousand devices to be a real problem then ;-) |
| 06:29.59 | nelson | josch: hi. |
| 06:30.23 | nelson | josch: I've verified that my bluetooth HID keyboard works with the GTA01 |
| 06:30.40 | nelson | josch: I had to use the GUI to turn on the bluetooth radio power. |
| 06:31.06 | nelson | josch: and I just ran "hidd --search" and the blinking blue light went out and my keyboard started working. |
| 06:31.37 | nelson | rwhitby: I'll sell mine after I get gnash working on it. |
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| 07:40.38 | josch | nelson, hi! thanks for your help!! me and pbeck tried for hours to get it working - good to know that there is the possibility that it could be so simple :-) |
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| 07:54.32 | josch | nelson, maybe you can help by adding your keyboard model to the list here http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Manually_using_Bluetooth#HID_.28Human_Input_Device.29 |
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| 07:58.43 | Henryk | hmm, I always thought of lists of working bluetooth devices as completely useless (at least as long as there's no windows in the equation). If anything you should have a list of non-working devices. (Which for such classes as HID should be empty) |
| 08:00.47 | josch | Henryk, put my keyboard as the first on this list :-/ |
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| 08:10.07 | Henryk | josch: what make and model is it? and you *did* enable pairing mode on the keyboard before trying, didn't you? (most devices will leave this mode after 60s to 3mins, hcitool scan might not work on the first try and also return cached information for some time after that) |
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| 08:13.16 | josch | Henryk, its a hama keyboard (think they just relabeled another one - looks the same). |
| 08:13.34 | josch | Henryk, the only button is the on/off button |
| 08:13.43 | Henryk | then RTFM :) |
| 08:14.27 | josch | Henryk, the manual sais, that the connection eith windows ce, palm and symbian is nothing more than switching on and connecting |
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| 08:15.27 | josch | http://www.rabenfrost.net/openmoko/btkeyboard.tar.bz2 |
| 08:15.43 | josch | this is the complete cd that came with it (3,5MB) |
| 08:16.12 | josch | it's my first bluetooth device but everywhere I only see something like scanning and connecting - finish |
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| 08:16.58 | josch | me and pbeck tried thousands of methods last night and I would be really glad if someone could give us some tips |
| 08:17.44 | Henryk | josch: the file is damaged |
| 08:19.43 | josch | Henryk, fixed |
| 08:19.58 | Henryk | ah, better |
| 08:25.16 | Henryk | josch: ok, switch the keyboard on. does the LED alternately light up orange and green? |
| 08:25.57 | josch | Henryk, as the manual sais it first lights orange for 2secs and then blinks green every sec |
| 08:26.37 | Henryk | good, then it should be visible in hcitool scan. (maybe try several times, wait 15secs between each try) |
| 08:26.59 | josch | it is always vidoble by hcitool scan |
| 08:27.05 | josch | visble |
| 08:29.14 | Henryk | ah, you didn't say that before :) |
| 08:29.43 | Henryk | look up its address and do an sdptool browse ADDRESS (replace ADDRESS with the address) |
| 08:30.03 | josch | sry - the problem is, when i do hidd --connect xx:xx:xx:xx:xx:xx or hidd --search I get a "Can't connect: Connection refused (111)" |
| 08:30.25 | josch | yesterday we also tried sdptool browse |
| 08:30.46 | Henryk | do you have the output in pastebin? |
| 08:30.55 | josch | ther is no output ecept |
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| 08:30.57 | josch | Browsing 00:0A:3A:05:C8:12 ... |
| 08:31.05 | josch | then it returns |
| 08:31.52 | josch | with my phone I get a long output but with this keyboard - nothing |
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| 08:33.59 | Henryk | ok, no SDP, that's kind of stupid on the side of the manufacturer |
| 08:37.44 | Henryk | josch: get http://www.betaversion.net/btdsd/download/bt_audit-0.1.tar.gz and try psm_scan on the keyboard |
| 08:38.14 | josch | Henryk, thx! will try that! |
| 08:38.55 | Henryk | (a psm is similar in concept to a port in tcp/ip, so that tool is basically a port scanner) |
| 08:39.07 | josch | btw: there seem to be many keyboards of this type |
| 08:39.12 | josch | for example this http://www.tangshop.com/dell-axim-x30-accessories-universal-bluetooth-pda-keyboard-smartphone-keyboard.html |
| 08:39.23 | josch | looks EXACTLY in EVERY WAY like mine |
| 08:42.03 | Henryk | hmm, http://www.heise.de/mobil/bluetooth/db/?a=detail&suche_alt=YTozOntzOjEwOiJoZXJzdGVsbGVyIjtzOjQ6IkhhbWEiO3M6MTM6ImdlcmFldGVrbGFzc2UiO3M6MzoiYWxsIjtzOjY6InByb2ZpbCI7czozOiJhbGwiO30=&detail=634 claims it's HID |
| 08:42.19 | josch | jepp - already saw this |
| 08:42.30 | josch | didn't know your are german |
| 08:43.20 | roh | well.. i think we have more german speaking people around than it seems ;) |
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| 08:43.59 | josch | roh, already figured it :-) |
| 08:45.55 | josch | status: L2CAP_CS_NO_INFO result: L2CAP_CR_BAD_PSM |
| 08:46.19 | Henryk | which psm? |
| 08:46.22 | josch | Henryk, this is the output of psm_scan |
| 08:46.44 | josch | how do I use it? i did only sudo ./psm_scan 00:0A:3A:05:C8:12 |
| 08:47.01 | Henryk | ah, maybe add an -o |
| 08:47.01 | josch | shall it run thorugh all psms? |
| 08:47.07 | josch | ah now I understand |
| 08:47.17 | josch | i was worried that the output stays the same |
| 08:47.37 | josch | what output do you need |
| 08:47.38 | josch | ? |
| 08:47.43 | Henryk | (my bad, I got it from http://www.mulliner.org/bluetooth/hidattack.php and forgot to mention the -o option) |
| 08:47.55 | Henryk | josch: with -o? all of it. pastebin.ca |
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| 08:48.19 | josch | so I do sudo ./psm_scan 00:0A:3A:05:C8:12 -o and paste everything on pastebin |
| 08:48.36 | Henryk | right |
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| 08:57.57 | josch | Henryk, http://pastebin.ca/768097 |
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| 09:01.18 | josch | Henryk, did l2ping afterwards to make sure the device was online |
| 09:03.51 | Henryk | josch: hmm, interesting. switch the keyboard off and on again to make sure it's reset, then try hidd --nosdp --connect 00:0A:3A:05:C8:12 |
| 09:04.37 | josch | did it with sudo to be sure |
| 09:04.38 | josch | Can't open input device: No such file or directory (2) |
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| 09:06.54 | Henryk | d'oh |
| 09:06.57 | Henryk | modprobe uinput |
| 09:07.41 | josch | Connected to 00:0A:3A:05:C8:12 on channel 1 |
| 09:07.43 | josch | wtf??? |
| 09:07.48 | josch | it works!!!! |
| 09:07.53 | josch | YOU ARE MY HERO!!!!!!!!!!!! |
| 09:08.08 | roh | :) |
| 09:08.24 | josch | uinput... argh! |
| 09:08.31 | josch | why didn't I read about this? |
| 09:08.32 | Henryk | Notice for the next time: Read error message. Carefully. |
| 09:08.46 | josch | Henryk, can you point me to it? |
| 09:10.08 | roh | now please document that in the wiki ;) |
| 09:10.08 | josch | isdvshjjjjjuuuuiiiioooppp |
| 09:10.08 | josch | ack sry |
| 09:10.08 | josch | roh, will do that for sure! |
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| 09:10.08 | roh | thanks |
| 09:10.29 | Henryk | josch: point to what? |
| 09:10.47 | josch | how I could find out about uinput myself |
| 09:11.20 | josch | you said, that I didn't read the error messages carefully enough |
| 09:11.34 | josch | so can you please tell me where my error was? :-) |
| 09:11.45 | Henryk | no that was me who didn't read it right right away |
| 09:12.21 | josch | whet secifically? |
| 09:12.29 | josch | s/whet/what/ |
| 09:12.45 | Henryk | "No such file or directory" is not "Connection refused" and would be a rather strange error code. I then googled up the source (e.g. https://stage.maemo.org/svn/maemo/projects/connectivity/bluez-utils/tags/bluez-utils-3.10-0osso1/input/device.c) where it's obvious that "Can't open input device" can only be a missing uinput module |
| 09:13.02 | josch | wow |
| 09:13.06 | josch | thx!! |
| 09:13.18 | josch | will document it after I'm fined testing |
| 09:13.30 | josch | there seems to be a strange problem with some keycodes but |
| 09:13.34 | josch | I can fix it |
| 09:14.07 | josch | I also found out which model my keyboard really is - its from freedominput.com and seems to be rebranded 1000 times |
| 09:14.22 | Henryk | josch: yes, I found that too |
| 09:15.30 | roh | too bad pavarotti is dead... i just got that i would need him to sing me a 'FNORD' to make a soundset from it. |
| 09:15.42 | josch | ^^ |
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| 09:24.37 | josch | okay... it seems that the keys ENTER, Ö, K, N, M and , just do not give any keycodes back |
| 09:25.15 | josch | :-/ |
| 09:25.17 | Henryk | use hcidump to see whether there's BT traffic associated with pressing the keys |
| 09:25.34 | Henryk | anyway, need sleep. 'night |
| 09:25.35 | josch | Henryk, thx - will try that |
| 09:25.43 | josch | Henryk, thx and night! |
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| 09:28.56 | josch | okay they not even send something |
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| 09:36.30 | wibbit | Good morning all |
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| 10:19.41 | PBeck | hi |
| 10:20.58 | Sup3rkiddo | hi |
| 10:21.16 | doc|home | hi |
| 10:26.27 | torpor | yo |
| 10:26.34 | torpor | sup? |
| 10:26.53 | Sup3rkiddo | ceiling |
| 10:28.30 | josch | ceiling mickeyl is watching you |
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| 10:29.06 | torpor | anything new going on? |
| 10:29.32 | Sup3rkiddo | i am worried about my safety |
| 10:29.54 | CM | Sup3rkiddo: Have you kidnapped an android? |
| 10:30.18 | Sup3rkiddo | hehe |
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| 10:33.47 | torpor | godamnit can we please autokick anyone who mentions android in this channel? |
| 10:35.31 | fgau | ANDROID |
| 10:35.58 | CM | torpor: How's it going with that audio project you're working on? |
| 10:36.17 | torpor | CM: okay, i've been hacking mostly around with pulseaudio this week, getting familiar with it. |
| 10:36.30 | torpor | i've got a little drumbox toy working, but it sorta sucks and i want to re-do the interface for it. |
| 10:36.48 | torpor | i really wish the neo had multi-touch! |
| 10:36.54 | CM | *nod* |
| 10:37.04 | CM | Could do so much cool stuff if it had |
| 10:37.22 | torpor | i also wanna finish the bluetooth panel that i started last week .. maybe i'll do that today. |
| 10:39.26 | guaqua | what does multitouch really mean? |
| 10:39.45 | torpor | you can hold down more than one button on screen at the time. |
| 10:39.54 | torpor | for music its necessary |
| 10:40.02 | guaqua | and how does the current screen tell where the pressure is? |
| 10:40.25 | torpor | just a single point |
| 10:40.30 | guaqua | just that it's pressed and the location? |
| 10:40.32 | guaqua | okay |
| 10:41.11 | guaqua | does it change once it's pressed? |
| 10:41.20 | guaqua | and how easily does it change? |
| 10:42.11 | guaqua | damn libusb-native |
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| 10:42.26 | guaqua | that's where my openmokobuild fails |
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| 12:33.13 | hhf423 | moin |
| 12:33.59 | *** join/#openmoko danilos (n=danilo@pool-71-124-234-44.bstnma.east.verizon.net) |
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| 12:41.03 | hhf423 | does anyone know where this is? http://scap.linuxtogo.org/files/7b2ce1ab51fd39bd3e0f9e99c5fd7830.png |
| 12:41.36 | torpor | hhf423: its in ScaredyCat's repo |
| 12:41.53 | hhf423 | ah, whats it called? |
| 12:42.20 | torpor | openmoko-agpsui2_0.1.0+svnr3372-r0_armv4t.ipk |
| 12:42.32 | torpor | but you'll need to get gpsd working yourself .. i tried yesterday but got nowhere. |
| 12:43.08 | hhf423 | ah, doh :-) |
| 12:44.08 | hhf423 | oh, error during download? |
| 12:45.51 | hhf423 | hmm, thats funny |
| 12:46.08 | *** join/#openmoko k-s (n=gustavo@189.70.192.54) |
| 12:46.24 | hhf423 | I flash a large image and close to the end the neo start scrolling text over the display and dfu-util stops with error -84 |
| 12:47.11 | CM | You said it's 82 megs? |
| 12:47.16 | hhf423 | yes |
| 12:47.29 | CM | The neo only have 64 mb flash |
| 12:47.44 | CM | Or are you copying to the sd card? |
| 12:47.54 | hhf423 | ah, I forgot that, I had 128 in my mind |
| 12:47.59 | CM | :) |
| 12:48.12 | CM | The 256mb in GTA02 will be nice |
| 12:48.17 | hhf423 | so if I want that thing, it needs to go to the sd card |
| 12:48.17 | CM | 128 is the ram |
| 12:48.21 | CM | Yes |
| 12:48.24 | hhf423 | k |
| 12:48.27 | torpor | i'm sure we'll fill it. |
| 12:48.42 | CM | But I don't know how or even if you can boot from the sd card like that |
| 12:48.45 | hhf423 | yeah, 256 is not that much :-) |
| 12:49.09 | hhf423 | well, the 82mb is rootfs, not kernel |
| 12:49.21 | hhf423 | maybe a change in uboot parameters |
| 12:49.27 | hhf423 | required |
| 12:49.45 | CM | Probably, and I'm sure someone has done some work on that |
| 12:49.54 | CM | Sunny and nice here, time to go out |
| 12:50.52 | *** join/#openmoko Ghiottone (n=ale@151.72.108.83) |
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| 13:01.18 | SpeedEvil | From Embeddedlinux |
| 13:01.18 | SpeedEvil | Jump to: navigation, search |
| 13:01.18 | SpeedEvil | [edit] |
| 13:05.04 | *** join/#openmoko icman (n=icman@123-240-172-21.cctv.dynamic.lsc.net.tw) |
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| 13:07.48 | hhf423 | ?? |
| 13:13.52 | hhf423 | hmm, the latest qtopia looks good. I wonder what the battery life is? |
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| 13:15.41 | hhf423 | seem that we're getting to the part where the neo can be used as a phone |
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| 13:21.52 | guerby | hi, is there a particular firmware supporting voice call/receive and GPRS (GTA01)? |
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| 13:28.42 | hhf423 | guerby: I do not get the question |
| 13:29.04 | hhf423 | you can do voice calls and gprs with the latest openmoko images |
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| 13:29.28 | hhf423 | you might want to add "SettingsGUI" to have GUI support for GPRS |
| 13:29.49 | hhf423 | but other than that you can already call and surf with the phone |
| 13:30.33 | hhf423 | of course, there is no 100% stability yet, gsmd seems to be better than a few weeks ago, but not fully reliable yet |
| 13:32.06 | guerby | hhf423, thx, do you have an URL for the latest images? |
| 13:33.35 | hhf423 | guerby: all the repositories are here: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Repositories |
| 13:34.22 | hhf423 | I would go here: http://buildhost.openmoko.org/OM2007.2/tmp/deploy/glibc/images/neo1973/?C=M;O=D for the latest kernel and rootfs or |
| 13:34.39 | hhf423 | here: http://celtune.morb-design.com/images/fic-gta01/?C=M;O=D |
| 13:34.56 | hhf423 | celtune has the most up to date stuff as far as I can see |
| 13:35.27 | hhf423 | ok, gotta go now, see you all later |
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| 13:39.31 | guerby | hhf423, thx again and good weekend |
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| 14:23.41 | torpor | so how are we supposed to use the celtune monster image? is that for booting off disk or something? (SD) |
| 14:23.58 | *** join/#openmoko stefan_schmidt (n=stefan@datenfreihafen.org) |
| 14:27.04 | fgau | torpor: only on sdcard http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Booting_from_SD#Installing_without_removing_your_SD_card |
| 14:27.31 | *** join/#openmoko cyt (n=cyt@linux.cs.ccu.edu.tw) |
| 14:28.27 | torpor | so is this a pretty good dist then or whats the main benefit to the celtune image? anyone know? |
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| 14:34.43 | abraxa__ | torpor: No idea |
| 14:35.05 | guerby | hmmm I get "Dialer: Error setting antenna power" box at boot |
| 14:36.09 | guerby | with 20071105-fic-gta01, any idea? |
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| 14:55.47 | torpor | anyone know why all the app menu categories got changed and there's hardly anything else in the app list in recent builds? |
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| 15:16.47 | abraxa_ | torpor: http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=985 |
| 15:17.09 | abraxa_ | Seems related to that |
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| 15:24.51 | torpor | abraxa_: right, thanks. will wait for the fix to trickle through. |
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| 15:47.55 | eonj | svn: REPORT request failed on '/repos/matchbox/!svn/vcc/default' |
| 15:47.56 | eonj | svn: Cannot replace a directory from within |
| 15:47.56 | eonj | make: *** [update-openmoko] Error 1 |
| 15:47.59 | eonj | whats that supposed to mean? |
| 15:48.33 | mickeyl | means someone broke svn layout |
| 15:48.42 | mickeyl | usually, just remove the svn directory and let it recheckout |
| 15:48.45 | mickeyl | fixes it |
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| 15:51.45 | LetoTo | so what's the status on the phones these days? |
| 15:52.04 | LetoTo | "almost ready to ship"? |
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| 16:00.13 | eonj | do i also need to update my makefile often? |
| 16:02.21 | Motiv | I have a brand new makefile environment. dfu-util in the build path is giving me an error: No such Alternate Setting: "rootfs" Has there been a change? |
| 16:03.21 | XorA|gone | Motiv: no, but you get that at random if USB is having a bad day, or you use a hub |
| 16:03.45 | torpor | eonj: i make update-makefile at least once a day .. |
| 16:04.10 | eonj | torpor: i see, that means i'll have to remove uboot each time too >< since i'm emulating on x86 |
| 16:04.37 | Motiv | XorA|gone: Thanks, I'll try a couple things then |
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| 16:08.02 | abraxa_ | eonj: The makefile doesn't change *that* often, though |
| 16:08.48 | abraxa_ | Read: I update mine rougly every two weeks and never had a problem |
| 16:09.25 | *** join/#openmoko vciaglia (n=vciaglia@87.18.18.58) |
| 16:10.01 | eonj | ugh i deleted my /home/moko/openmoko directory and make-update doesn't work lol |
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| 16:12.43 | abraxa_ | make-update? |
| 16:12.47 | mwester | eonj: hopefully you still have your "downloads" directory, that's painful to re-fetch. |
| 16:12.59 | eonj | i did make setup-openmoko-developer and its re-checking out the svn for openmoko |
| 16:13.05 | eonj | when its done ill try make update |
| 16:15.25 | eonj | thing is, i'm on a VM, and would rather build as little as possible |
| 16:15.45 | CM | That doesn't rebuild anything that's not updated |
| 16:15.51 | eonj | ah |
| 16:16.11 | eonj | but, uboot throws an error when i try to build for x86 |
| 16:16.16 | CM | mwester: Hehe, qemu failed to build this morning but I'm giving it another try now |
| 16:16.27 | eonj | which is how i run OM right now |
| 16:16.31 | nelson | josch: are you SURE there isn't a "set me into pair mode" key combination? |
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| 16:19.14 | LetoTo | ahh dec 7 is the target date now |
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| 16:24.20 | nelson | josch: ahhhh, reading more I see that you got it working. Excellent. |
| 16:25.39 | torpor | eonj: i'm on a VM as well and as long as you keep up to date you should be fine .. |
| 16:26.23 | eonj | torpor cool, it seems i am :) |
| 16:27.32 | abraxa_ | nelson: Are you THE Russ Nelson? ;) |
| 16:27.46 | eonj | how do i see which libraries are included by default in openmoko? |
| 16:28.01 | nelson | abraxa_: I would be, except for all the imposters. |
| 16:28.24 | abraxa_ | nelson: Oooh, sneaky answer. Me like. |
| 16:28.47 | abraxa_ | eonj: You mean of all applications? For the entire distribution? Or what? |
| 16:29.08 | nelson | abraxa_: I was the first Russ Nelson on the Internet, if that helps. |
| 16:29.43 | nelson | abraxa_: you'd think I'd have some kind of ownership of the name or something, but honestly, they'll let ANYBODY on the 'net these days. |
| 16:29.47 | *** join/#openmoko kloeri (i=kloeri@freenode/staff/kloeri) |
| 16:29.56 | abraxa_ | nelson: Yes, that does make it clear ;) |
| 16:30.07 | eonj | abraxa_: i mean like, i assume cairo is, and pango, but id like to make sure |
| 16:30.18 | abraxa_ | eonj: Yes, both are |
| 16:30.20 | eonj | i'm new to the whole c/c++ dev environment |
| 16:31.06 | abraxa_ | nelson: Do you have particular interest in OpenMoko or are you just in here for leisure? |
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| 16:34.29 | torpor | abraxa_: get the jfss file, mount it, and look in /lib and /usr/lib for all the details. |
| 16:36.38 | abraxa_ | Actually, looking at http://buildhost.openmoko.org/OM2007.2/tmp/rootfs/usr/lib/ would be the same with less effort :) |
| 16:39.23 | torpor | i/clear |
| 16:39.26 | nelson | abraxa_: yes, I want to run Google Maps on my cellphone with a GPS receiver. I also want my cellphone to confess to my wife where I've been. |
| 16:39.34 | eonj | or i could look in my /rootfs/usr/lib i guess right? |
| 16:39.44 | abraxa_ | eonj: 'course |
| 16:39.45 | nelson | abraxa_: that way, when I'm out in the woods chainsawing, and I don't come back, she can find my corpse more easily. |
| 16:40.06 | mwester | nelson: here in the US the tollway operators will be happy to do that. |
| 16:40.17 | CM | nelson: Hehe, what a way to put it ;) |
| 16:40.20 | mwester | (confess to one's wife, that is) |
| 16:40.23 | abraxa_ | nelson: I'm sure that lets her sleep well at night :) |
| 16:40.54 | nelson | well .... chainsaws have been known to leap up and cut off vital parts of one's body. |
| 16:41.12 | LetoTo | nelson: there is a cool discovery protocol using gps and a double blind system |
| 16:41.13 | nelson | That's why they have a handle brake and a tip guard. |
| 16:41.14 | Kensan | exit |
| 16:41.35 | nelson | Kensan: Ha! It will take more than THAT to leave IRC, bwahahahahaha! |
| 16:41.36 | LetoTo | nelson: you can ask another phone if they are "near". and only when your are near enough, will you reveal each others location |
| 16:41.55 | torpor | why would you need that, when you've got DHS and NSA looking after you .. |
| 16:42.23 | LetoTo | it's for your friends :P |
| 16:42.43 | LetoTo | you want to "grab a drink" with your friends if nearby, but you dont want to tell all your friends all the time exactly where you are |
| 16:42.52 | abraxa_ | LetoTo: You mean give one to your wife and have one yourself so you can be warned when your wife approaches your position? ;) |
| 16:43.06 | LetoTo | abraxa: that would be another usage :) |
| 16:43.34 | LetoTo | however, the protocol allows you to "lie" too, so your wife could let her phone say "i am far far away, you dont know where" |
| 16:43.42 | mwester | I just send an email to anyone at random, that contains selected keywords. This ensures that the DHS will be closely watching over me on my journey. :) |
| 16:43.45 | LetoTo | while watching your bedroom to catch you and your mistress :) |
| 16:44.01 | eonj | if im making my own application with a local overlay, do i want to make my own image too? |
| 16:44.22 | CM | eonj: Just installing it as an ipkg should be easier :) |
| 16:44.27 | abraxa_ | LetoTo: That would be an interesting debate to determine who's the "cheater" in that scenario. |
| 16:44.30 | eonj | CM thanks |
| 16:44.46 | LetoTo | abraxa: just have an open relationship with your wife instead :P |
| 16:44.59 | eonj | CM I still want to go with local overlay though right? or does that make it irrelevant |
| 16:45.03 | eonj | is there a good ipkg tutorial |
| 16:45.08 | *** join/#openmoko infernix (i=nix@unaffiliated/infernix) |
| 16:45.14 | abraxa_ | LetoTo: Ahh, I'd rather not :) |
| 16:45.44 | LetoTo | abraxa: ahh a hypocrite :) he wants to screw other people but not allow the same for his wife. that's your real problem :) |
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| 16:46.02 | abraxa_ | LetoTo: lol, didn't say I would. Just saying. |
| 16:46.06 | LetoTo | eonj: I have an ipkg creator in openswan. It's a fairly simple makefile |
| 16:46.38 | torpor | maybe you need to open source your wife? |
| 16:46.39 | LetoTo | eonj: just untar an existing ipk should give you all you need to know really |
| 16:47.14 | eonj | LetoTo: thanks. where can i see the openswan ipkg creator? |
| 16:47.36 | LetoTo | sec. I'll put up a temp copy |
| 16:47.41 | eonj | thanks |
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| 16:49.20 | LetoTo | ohh |
| 16:51.03 | *** join/#openmoko mockenh (n=joe@p57B8FF13.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 16:53.07 | LetoTo | ohh |
| 16:53.14 | LetoTo | eonj: you didnt get my priv msg did you? |
| 16:53.17 | LetoTo | fucking freenode :P |
| 16:55.53 | eonj | LetoTo: i did, thanks! sorry im slow |
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| 16:59.58 | eonj | so i can build my app with bitbake according to the tutorials, then package it into an ipkg |
| 17:00.57 | abraxa_ | eonj: Correct |
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| 17:08.20 | eonj | how come everything builds fine, but i just type bitbake in my OMDIR/build it says command not found? |
| 17:10.56 | abraxa_ | eonj: Cause the makefile sources OMDIR/setup-env which sets up the path to bitbake (among other things) |
| 17:11.28 | eonj | oh i see, i think following the app dev tut itll work because it uses the mokomakefile to build my package |
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| 17:12.12 | abraxa_ | Yup |
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| 17:22.57 | flexd | One thing i've been thinking about |
| 17:23.26 | flexd | The commands to send sms manually are there right? |
| 17:23.40 | flexd | But there's no sms program? |
| 17:25.34 | Ebbe | flexd: There exists a python program to send sms. |
| 17:25.41 | flexd | ah |
| 17:25.56 | flexd | I was thinking of trying to create one when i get my neo |
| 17:26.12 | Ebbe | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/SMSTool |
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| 17:28.18 | Ebbe | flexd: Maybe you could make a program to read sms messages :) |
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| 17:33.34 | dashavoo | can anybody help me with running openmoko in qemu? Im having problems getting it to work |
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| 17:35.25 | balrog-kun | dashavoo: describe the problem or no one will know whether they can help you or not |
| 17:35.36 | dashavoo | balrog-kun, just typing it |
| 17:35.44 | balrog-kun | cool |
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| 17:41.47 | dashavoo | I run "make setup && make qemu", it does stuff, hangs for a while on "GTA01Bv4 # setenv bootcmd '" and then quits with the error message "U-boot failed to finish writing in 300 seconds, giving up. make: *** [flash-qemu-official] Error 255" |
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| 17:45.36 | balrog-kun | dashavoo: there's some info on this here: http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=937 |
| 17:45.43 | balrog-kun | unfortunately not very helpful |
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| 17:46.18 | univac | balrog-kun: :) |
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| 17:48.27 | dashavoo | balrog-kun, yeah, I read that already. I hoped somebody in here would have a better answer than the bugzilla =( |
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| 17:51.35 | balrog-kun | dashavoo: i would like to find the reason this happens but i can never reproduce it, the process just works everywhere i've tried it |
| 17:51.43 | thomasgruebler | hi |
| 17:51.45 | thomasgruebler | weis jemand wie ich multidesktop schaffe? |
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| 17:51.54 | thomasgruebler | weil ich hab das tutorial aus thinkwiki für mein thinkpad genommen |
| 17:52.01 | eonj | so weird, i made my package, installed it with ipkg, and now it gives me "permission denied" when i try to run it |
| 17:52.15 | thomasgruebler | doch danach brauchte es ne zeit bis es iwder funktionierte |
| 17:52.46 | thomasgruebler | musste im init 1 starten wiel init3 zufälligerweise xorg so weit startete das nix mehr ging |
| 17:52.49 | guaqua | thomasgruebler: this is not a general linux helpdesk |
| 17:53.03 | thomasgruebler | sry |
| 17:53.07 | thomasgruebler | wrong channel |
| 17:53.08 | thomasgruebler | :D |
| 17:53.10 | guaqua | :) |
| 17:53.11 | thomasgruebler | sry |
| 17:53.14 | guaqua | okay :) |
| 17:55.19 | eonj | <PROTECTED> |
| 17:55.19 | eonj | Installing myhelloworld (0.1-r0) to root... |
| 17:55.37 | eonj | why is it installing to root? it wont let me use it with permission denied after ipkg installs.. |
| 17:56.34 | abraxa_ | eonj: i486? Building for x86? |
| 17:56.47 | eonj | yeah... i dont know why, when i bitbake it didnt make an x86 |
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| 17:57.20 | abraxa_ | eonj: Are you chrooting into the rootfs and then use ipkg? |
| 17:57.24 | eonj | abraxa_: yes |
| 17:57.51 | eonj | abraxa_: my rootfs is built for x86 tho, so im probably doing something wrong |
| 17:58.07 | eonj | do i need to change my site.conf to target x86 in my package? |
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| 17:58.43 | guaqua | if you want to run stuff on x86 |
| 17:59.12 | eonj | but how do i do that? |
| 17:59.23 | guaqua | just change it in site.conf |
| 17:59.27 | eonj | add MACHINE="x86" and BUILD_ARCH="i686" to the site.conf? |
| 18:00.30 | CM | Have anyone else been able to build qemu today? |
| 18:01.01 | balrog-kun | CM: can you pastebin the error? |
| 18:01.27 | CM | balrog-kun: http://rafb.net/p/105aGS49.html |
| 18:01.39 | CM | This looks suspicious: http://article.gmane.org/gmane.comp.emulators.qemu/20891 |
| 18:01.47 | eonj | guaqua: when i changed it, doing . setup-env ; bitbake -b local/packages/myhelloworld/myhelloworld.bb breaks on do_compile |
| 18:01.57 | balrog-kun | ouch |
| 18:02.01 | CM | I did make clobber-qemu and tried to rebuild |
| 18:03.51 | balrog-kun | CM: should be okay now |
| 18:04.59 | CM | Ok, I'll retry from scrat :) |
| 18:05.29 | CM | +ch |
| 18:05.41 | balrog-kun | hopefully no need to start from scratch |
| 18:05.54 | CM | Ok, even better :) |
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| 18:25.36 | CM | balrog-kun: Thanks, compiled now at least. :) |
| 18:25.45 | CM | Can't get it to flash though, but that's ok |
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| 18:27.10 | balrog-kun | :/ |
| 18:28.49 | CM | balrog-kun: http://rafb.net/p/g5GSJQ12.html |
| 18:29.19 | eonj | i'm really confused by bitbake and site.conf when i do: |
| 18:29.21 | eonj | export BBPATH=$OMDIR/local:$OMDIR/build:$OMDIR/openmoko/trunk/oe:$OMDIR/openembeded |
| 18:29.43 | eonj | bitbake gives me an error like: ERROR: Unable to open conf/bitbake.conf |
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| 18:30.42 | CM | balrog-kun: I only have a OpenMoko-openmoko-devel-image-*.rootfs.jffs2 |
| 18:30.48 | balrog-kun | CM: http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=954 has the solution |
| 18:30.57 | balrog-kun | it's some old mokomakefile bug |
| 18:31.02 | abraxa_ | eonj: What directory are you in when issuing bitbake? |
| 18:31.10 | CM | balrog-kun: Ah, danke |
| 18:31.16 | eonj | $OMDIR/build |
| 18:31.26 | balrog-kun | bitte :) |
| 18:31.34 | abraxa_ | Ew, Germans ;p |
| 18:31.35 | eonj | abraxa_: i do it from $OMDIR or $OMDIR/build and get same error |
| 18:31.55 | CM | abraxa_: Nein.. :P |
| 18:32.00 | ScaredyCat | ten |
| 18:32.08 | eonj | abraxa_: but if i don't export that (so its missing the $OMDIR/local part) then bitbake runs but it ignores seemingly all my site.confs that say machine=x86 |
| 18:32.20 | balrog-kun | abraxa_: where! |
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| 18:34.07 | abraxa_ | eonj: What files do you have in build/conf? |
| 18:34.20 | jeddy3 | maybe wrong place (but since im playing on neo)...anyone knows how to adress audio sync issues in mpegs? some switch to either mencoder when encoding, or mplayer when playing...? |
| 18:34.54 | josch | würden bitte alle deutschen wieder englisch sprechen? ich verstehe sonst nicht was ihr schreibt. danke. |
| 18:34.55 | abraxa_ | jeddy3: What's your command line when playing the mpegs? |
| 18:34.57 | balrog-kun | jeddy3: maybe -idx |
| 18:35.07 | eonj | abraxa_: local.conf and site.conf |
| 18:35.10 | abraxa_ | josch ;p |
| 18:35.30 | CM | josch: Genau! |
| 18:35.49 | jeddy3 | abraxa_, just mplayer <file> :) |
| 18:35.50 | balrog-kun | josch: volkswagen |
| 18:35.52 | balrog-kun | err.. |
| 18:35.53 | abraxa_ | eonj: site.conf is a symlink to a file in the OM SVN repo so editing might not be a good idea |
| 18:36.04 | josch | balrog-kun, :-D |
| 18:36.13 | abraxa_ | jeddy3: Try adding -framedrop |
| 18:36.14 | eonj | abraxa_: well i havn't touched it... |
| 18:36.24 | eonj | abraxa_: i was messing with local/conf/site.conf |
| 18:36.50 | abraxa_ | eonj: You have an overlay? |
| 18:37.07 | eonj | abraxa_: yeah, i followed the tutorial |
| 18:37.34 | jeddy3 | abraxa_, balrog-kun: thanks, i'll try as soon as neo manages to get some charge :) |
| 18:38.38 | abraxa_ | jeddy3: Using QVGA? |
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| 18:38.48 | jeddy3 | abraxa_, yes |
| 18:39.05 | abraxa_ | jeddy3: "-really-quiet -framedrop -noslices -lavdopts fast -pp 0 -sws 0 -vo fbdev -zoom -vf scale=320:-3,rotate=2" is what I use for the media player currently |
| 18:39.45 | josch | abraxa_, seem reasonable |
| 18:39.47 | abraxa_ | eonj: Hmm, I'm not sure which conf has priority in that case... could be it's looking at the one in build/conf/local.conf |
| 18:40.27 | eonj | abraxa_: if it is, its strange because that conf has MACHINE="x86" and BUILD_ARCH="i686" but its trying to compile with i486 gcc... |
| 18:41.00 | abraxa_ | eonj: Do the confs in your overlay say anything different? |
| 18:41.00 | jeddy3 | abraxa_, ouch! thanks :D |
| 18:41.24 | eonj | abraxa_: i only have a site.conf in the overlay, and it says some more BB related stuff |
| 18:41.28 | eonj | should i copy local.conf too/ |
| 18:42.47 | abraxa_ | eonj: I honestly have no idea as I've never used OE overlays before :( |
| 18:42.59 | jeddy3 | abraxa_, you know how to show current fps/"load" or something when playing? |
| 18:43.00 | eonj | abraxa_: thanks for tryin tho :) |
| 18:44.58 | abraxa_ | jeddy3: I didn't look into that yet, I have to admi |
| 18:44.59 | abraxa_ | t |
| 18:45.11 | jeddy3 | :) |
| 18:46.35 | flexd | argh, python.org down for any of you guys? |
| 18:48.16 | LarstiQ | flexd: nope |
| 18:48.22 | flexd | err yeah |
| 18:48.23 | flexd | nevermind |
| 18:48.27 | flexd | just me not being able to type today |
| 18:48.31 | flexd | i was writing pythong.org |
| 18:48.34 | flexd | like tons of times |
| 18:48.36 | flexd | :( |
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| 18:51.54 | abraxa_ | thong, hm? |
| 18:52.00 | eonj | whats the openembed channel? |
| 18:52.09 | abraxa_ | eonj: #oe |
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| 19:00.14 | eonj | does bitbake do the "handling bitbake files" every time i run it?? |
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| 19:07.26 | CM | Some people like IKEA, but some really love it: http://www.flickr.com/photos/zach_manchester/1875254180/ |
| 19:08.34 | jeddy3 | haha xD |
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| 19:12.51 | eonj | where is the openmoko-devel-image.bb located so i can copy it? |
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| 19:14.22 | CM | eonj: Mine seems to be in /home/moko/openmoko/trunk/oe/packages/images/openmoko-devel-image.bb |
| 19:14.31 | eonj | oh ok thanks! |
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| 19:23.31 | eonj | ugh it seems this overlay guide is out of date >< |
| 19:24.19 | CM | Nice, the dialler worked without any trouble at all in the snapshot from today :D |
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| 19:28.08 | torpor | CM: which snapshot are you using? |
| 19:28.56 | eonj | does anyone use local overlay to dev apps? |
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| 19:31.10 | CM | torpor: Just the standard openmoko-devel-image built today with the makefile |
| 19:31.13 | torpor | eonj: i haven't found it necessary |
| 19:31.23 | eonj | torpor: how do you do it then? |
| 19:31.27 | torpor | CM: your own local build, tho, right? |
| 19:31.32 | eonj | i'm just trying to get started and i can't get helloworld to work >< |
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| 19:31.58 | CM | torpor: Yes, every day.. :) |
| 19:32.21 | torpor | eonj: read this: http://w1xer.de/OpenMoko_DevNotesDRAFT.txt |
| 19:32.26 | torpor | i wrote it just for you. |
| 19:32.39 | eonj | appreciate it :P |
| 19:33.10 | torpor | CM: i build at least every day, but i test my apps on my local flashed image, as well as those from automated.it and whatever is announced on the release list .. |
| 19:33.20 | torpor | eonj: gimme questions |
| 19:33.37 | nelson | Android |
| 19:33.52 | CM | ~fish nelson |
| 19:33.53 | apt | ACTION slaps nelson around with a large trout |
| 19:34.10 | eonj | torpor: well im totally confused, after 2 hours of messing with local overlays and bitbake |
| 19:34.22 | nelson | eonj: yes, it has to read in all the bitbake files. Fortunately, it's doing it from a cache. |
| 19:34.24 | eonj | torpor i'll read this and try again |
| 19:34.50 | CM | eonj: Me too, it's definitely confusing. ScaredyCat knows a lot about it though.. ;) |
| 19:35.12 | eonj | :) |
| 19:36.59 | jeddy3 | abraxa_, hmmm...the mpeg itself seems to be completely out of sync, it is the same on my computer...and starts playback out of sync from the start |
| 19:37.18 | jeddy3 | abraxa_, do you have any special encoding tricks you use? |
| 19:37.41 | abraxa_ | jeddy3: Hmm nope... unfortunately not |
| 19:37.59 | jeddy3 | abraxa_, have you encoded anything? |
| 19:38.31 | abraxa_ | jeddy3: Back in the days, yeah - not recently |
| 19:38.44 | jeddy3 | abraxa_, ah, ok thanks anyway :) |
| 19:38.45 | nelson | ~fish Android |
| 19:38.45 | apt | ACTION slaps Android around with a large trout |
| 19:38.48 | anrp | back in the good old days eh |
| 19:38.58 | nelson | hehe. |
| 19:39.03 | abraxa_ | Yeah, the days of SVCDs... |
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| 19:45.26 | eonj | i think my main problem is that bitbake isn't compiling for i686 like i tell it to in local.conf |
| 19:47.25 | torpor | jeddy3: encoding? like media encoding, or some bitfield? |
| 19:47.47 | jeddy3 | torpor, encoding mpegs...with mencoder |
| 19:48.01 | josch | this netsplit totally f***ed up my irc history.... |
| 19:48.06 | torpor | eonj: my advice is not touch any conf files in moko until you completed your first build and tested the resulting image .. |
| 19:48.11 | dashavoo | I love embarassing my younger sister... all I have to do is wear my sarong when her friends come round and she goes bright red |
| 19:48.14 | torpor | jeddy3: i see. |
| 19:48.24 | torpor | oh man, netsplit. |
| 19:48.25 | eonj | torpor: ive done my first build, and i emulate it with Xephyr |
| 19:48.29 | torpor | cool. |
| 19:48.50 | eonj | torpor: that works fine, now im trying to build an app, but the only "success" ive had ended up with my helloworld being compiled for i486 |
| 19:48.55 | josch | eonj, you "emulate" it with xephyr?? |
| 19:49.09 | eonj | josch: ok, well i chroot and then look at it with xephyr |
| 19:49.24 | josch | ah... k - I got slightly confused :-) |
| 19:49.49 | matsimoto | Everybody who calls me has an annoying echo. Is it possible to supress this with the audio settings ? Or is this an electrical/mechanical problem ? |
| 19:50.06 | torpor | eonj: then read my guide and copy the bitbake recipe .. |
| 19:50.20 | eonj | but the problem is i can't get helloworld to work >< when bitbake ran successfuly and gave me an i486 build which when installed with ipkg from the chroot env, wont let me run myhelloworld (permission denied) |
| 19:50.24 | torpor | matsimoto: its an easy fix. |
| 19:50.44 | CM | dashavoo: About that sarong, I hope you've seen: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P842Tmi6lrc |
| 19:50.45 | josch | torpor, I would also be interested in a fix |
| 19:51.09 | torpor | eonj: if its an ARM 'emu' trying to run an x86 binary, you'll get a message other than "permission denied", which could mean any number of other things. |
| 19:51.17 | torpor | what does 'file myhellworld' report? |
| 19:51.35 | torpor | josch: its a pulseaudio thang. |
| 19:51.40 | matsimoto | torpor: sounds exciting ... |
| 19:51.52 | josch | torpor, is the fix wikified? |
| 19:51.53 | eonj | torpor, im not really emulating. i built openmoko for x86/i686 and just chroot into the (copied) rootfs |
| 19:51.58 | torpor | but i don't do calls with my neo, so i don't know it. but check the irc log.. |
| 19:52.03 | jpcass | torpor: for some reason, bitbake is not applying SRCREV overrides from sane-srcrevs.inc for package eds-dbus for me, so its always trying to build eds-dbus-1.4.0-svnr1-r6, when it should be r628 ... any idea why this could be being overlooked? |
| 19:52.21 | torpor | jpcass: known bug. check bugzilla. |
| 19:52.39 | jpcass | torpor: ah, ok, thanks I will check... |
| 19:52.53 | torpor | there is a bugzilla bot in here but i can't ever remember the keys .. |
| 19:52.57 | torpor | sorry. |
| 19:53.20 | torpor | my personal situation dev-wise is that my images are working, and i am ignoring all functionality of the neo that isn't related to the code i'm writing specifically for it. |
| 19:53.32 | torpor | i'm leaving a lot of the distro-wrinkles to people you like. ;) |
| 19:53.39 | eonj | so i want my bb to eventually put my ipkgs in $OMDIR/build/tmp/deploy/glibc/ipk/i686 |
| 19:53.40 | ScaredyCat | !ombug 555 |
| 19:53.41 | cdbot2 | * * Bug 555, Status: NEW, Created: Unknown |
| 19:53.42 | cdbot2 | * * philippedeswert(AT)scarlet.be: remove/disable portmap by default on official releases |
| 19:53.43 | cdbot2 | * * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=555 |
| 19:53.46 | torpor | but as a lurker, i've noticed these issues.. |
| 19:54.28 | torpor | eonj: post your recipe and maybe its an easy fix .. |
| 19:54.34 | torpor | thanks ScaredyCat |
| 19:54.40 | matsimoto | josch: I found this: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Phase_1_Software_Testing, but reducing the level makes it a bit hard to understand the caller |
| 19:54.50 | torpor | !ombug linux |
| 19:54.50 | cdbot2 | * * Bug linux, Status: Unknown Error () |
| 19:54.55 | torpor | !ombug help |
| 19:54.56 | cdbot2 | * * Bug help, Status: Unknown Error () |
| 19:55.08 | jpcass | !ombug SRCREV |
| 19:55.09 | cdbot2 | * * Bug srcrev, Status: Unknown Error () |
| 19:55.30 | eonj | http://pastebin.com/m44b528b9 |
| 19:55.39 | torpor | i wish regex on cdbot2 worked.. |
| 19:55.48 | torpor | ~lart cdbot2 |
| 19:55.48 | apt | offers cdbot2 some herring |
| 19:56.06 | torpor | ~kick cdbot2 for not knowing regex |
| 19:56.07 | apt | ACTION kicks cdbot2 for not knowing regex |
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| 19:57.02 | dashavoo | CM, not yet, but il view it later |
| 19:57.30 | eonj | torpor: http://pastebin.com/m44b528b9 |
| 19:57.39 | eonj | i basically got it all from: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Application_Development_Crash_Course#Setting_Up_the_OpenMoko_Environment |
| 19:58.04 | eonj | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Application_Development_Crash_Course#Your_First_Application |
| 19:58.06 | eonj | is what i meant |
| 19:58.12 | torpor | yeah |
| 19:58.20 | torpor | looks okay so far .. |
| 19:58.39 | torpor | how are you running this recipe? |
| 20:00.24 | eonj | from my $OMDIR: cd build ; . ../setup-env ; bitbake -b ../local/packages/myhelloworld/myhelloworld.bb |
| 20:00.29 | eonj | its actually building |
| 20:00.34 | eonj | but its only building i486 |
| 20:00.39 | eonj | let me pastebin my local.conf |
| 20:01.18 | eonj | http://pastebin.com/m1ee0f30a |
| 20:01.22 | jpcass | torpor: cant find anything on bugzilla - how are you working around this? |
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| 20:02.42 | torpor | jpcass: i don't make calls. ;) |
| 20:03.28 | torpor | eonj: take a look at my recipe and compare it to yours and tell me whats different. . . |
| 20:03.36 | torpor | i'll give you a hint: use autotools. |
| 20:03.49 | torpor | http://w1xer.de/OpenMoko_DevNotesDRAFT.txt |
| 20:04.07 | eonj | yeah, i have that open |
| 20:04.14 | eonj | i guess ill try it with autotools ^^ |
| 20:04.16 | jpcass | torpor: bien sur!, but this means ./bb openmoko-devel-image fails so I cant even build an updated image... ;-( |
| 20:04.16 | eonj | thanks |
| 20:05.15 | torpor | jpcass: make clean-eds-dbus && make all |
| 20:06.03 | torpor | eonj: refresh, i made some changes. |
| 20:06.10 | eonj | torpor: if im not mistaken following your example will still build for arm |
| 20:07.06 | torpor | you want to build the same app for x86 and test on your linux machine, you mean? |
| 20:07.18 | torpor | if so: use autotools |
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| 20:08.14 | eonj | yes, i don't have a neo and qemu is unbarably slow. so i'm trying to just use x86 env since im prototyping anyway |
| 20:08.18 | eonj | ok ill try with autotools |
| 20:10.05 | eonj | thanks for the guide |
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| 20:32.24 | eonj | torpor, maybe i should ask how you change autotools config to do a native build (not for arm4) |
| 20:32.50 | eonj | i'm also getting a weird error from autom4te that breaks do_configure in bb... |
| 20:35.27 | CM | I never got anywhere trying to build it native (x86-64) |
| 20:35.52 | CM | "it" = the openmoko dist for running programs in Xoo or so |
| 20:36.36 | eonj | i've gotten the dist to build, and it runs in xephyr or xoo |
| 20:36.42 | eonj | now i want to build apps for it ^^ |
| 20:37.03 | CM | :) |
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| 20:55.42 | summatusmentis | is there a list of hardware that is not fic's that openmoko currently runs on? |
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| 20:56.45 | summatusmentis | specifically HTC apache? |
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| 20:58.14 | eonj | torpor: would you mind looking at this: http://pastebin.com/m60ee4ab7 |
| 21:01.10 | ScaredyCat | hehehehhe http://www.dialaphone.co.uk/blog/?p=750 |
| 21:01.22 | eonj | ScaredyCat: i hear you know a lil about bitbake and such too ^^ |
| 21:01.48 | ScaredyCat | a little... |
| 21:02.29 | eonj | do you use autotools to dev apps? |
| 21:10.26 | abraxa_ | eonj: What problem are you encountering? |
| 21:10.49 | eonj | its in the pastebin, basically m4 is crapping out in my do_configure when i bitbake |
| 21:10.55 | abraxa_ | ah o |
| 21:10.56 | abraxa_ | k |
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| 21:12.32 | Askyron | http://www.pennergame.de/ref.php?refid=1041549 |
| 21:12.33 | Askyron | http://www.pennergame.de/ref.php?refid=1041549 |
| 21:12.44 | abraxa_ | eonj: I'd say that PKG_CHECK_MODULES(GETBIGGER, gtk+-2.0 >= 2.6.0) should read PKG_CHECK_MODULES(ENJHELLO, gtk+-2.0 >= 2.6.0) |
| 21:12.57 | abraxa_ | Otherwise AC_SUBST() has nothing to subst |
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| 21:14.10 | eonj | abraxa_: thanks for pointing that out. but if i change it i get same error |
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| 21:16.21 | abraxa_ | eonj: I'm not sure what the error could be then as you only get warnings anyway |
| 21:16.32 | eonj | yeh |
| 21:17.50 | abraxa_ | What I'd try: |
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| 21:18.24 | abraxa_ | #1: Use brackets for "gtk+-2.0 >= 2.6.0": PKG_CHECK_MODULES(GETBIGGER, [gtk+-2.0 >= 2.6.0]) |
| 21:18.40 | abraxa_ | #2: Comment stuff out until it starts working |
| 21:20.31 | torpor | eonj: you are requiring AC_PREREQ(2.61) but only providing 1.9 .. |
| 21:20.55 | eonj | hmm |
| 21:22.28 | torpor | yeah, GETBIGGER won't be useful to you .. |
| 21:22.37 | eonj | yeah, i changed that up |
| 21:22.46 | eonj | i was copying and replacing with my name |
| 21:22.48 | balrog-kun | 2.0 >= 2.6.0, while i know what it means, looks like always false :) |
| 21:22.52 | torpor | each autoconf comes with its own macro's .. |
| 21:23.15 | torpor | gtk+-2.0 is the package name, and its version must be >= 2.6.0 |
| 21:23.18 | eonj | yeah, i generated with autoscan |
| 21:23.27 | balrog-kun | torpor: yeah |
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| 21:23.46 | torpor | the macro's must match the tools. |
| 21:24.11 | torpor | change prereq to 1.9 and see if that solves the issue. |
| 21:24.18 | eonj | i did, it doesn't solve it :( |
| 21:24.23 | torpor | exit 1 is happening because of too many warnings .. |
| 21:24.26 | eonj | exact same message |
| 21:24.36 | torpor | put gettext on your system. |
| 21:24.40 | torpor | thats the only error i can see .. ;) |
| 21:25.09 | torpor | you are on redhat correct? |
| 21:25.14 | eonj | sudo apt-get install gettext says its already at latest version |
| 21:25.15 | eonj | ubuntu |
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| 21:26.05 | eonj | but what about making it build for x86 instead of i486, your guide says its easy but i dont see how to change that |
| 21:26.35 | torpor | in that case you simply run your local aclocal on the project config |
| 21:26.41 | torpor | i'm getting to that (DRAFT) |
| 21:26.46 | eonj | i se |
| 21:27.42 | torpor | you want to basically write apps for your machine, then run them (with the same API's/libs) on the neo at some point, right? |
| 21:27.45 | torpor | but you don't have a neo. |
| 21:28.01 | eonj | exactly |
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| 21:28.07 | torpor | so you get the autotools-based project rolling on your local machine first, and then worry about using openmoko to cross-compile. |
| 21:28.28 | torpor | seems you have not done step 1 |
| 21:28.31 | eonj | i see |
| 21:28.46 | eonj | so i need to follow an autotools tutorial then |
| 21:28.49 | torpor | and that is highly dependent on your local distro setup .. but you want to sync the two systems.. |
| 21:28.57 | torpor | i would advise a little autotools love first. |
| 21:29.02 | Tyrae1 | Hi all. (I know that I'm OT, but please it is urgent) Is there someone that know LISP? |
| 21:29.24 | torpor | there are good ones out there, such as: http://www-src.lip6.fr/homepages/Alexandre.Duret-Lutz/dl/autotools.pdf |
| 21:29.33 | torpor | Tyrae1: (no) |
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| 21:31.02 | eonj | thanks for the help torpor |
| 21:31.05 | eonj | ill read up |
| 21:31.06 | abraxa_ | Tyrae1: #lisp? ;) |
| 21:31.23 | torpor | eonj: you're welcome, and come back when you want someone to test your app on openmoko/neo1973 hardware! :) |
| 21:31.52 | eonj | awesome :) |
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| 21:33.43 | Tyrae1 | yep... I have a stupid question on function that return 2 or more values |
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| 21:48.17 | matsimoto | nothing found about echo cancellation in the wiki :( any hints where I can look for it ? |
| 21:59.54 | Ebbe | When I want to build to the neo with MokoMakefile, how should my ~/moko/build/conf file look like? |
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| 22:07.32 | *** part/#openmoko matsimoto (n=barmeier@dslb-088-072-000-246.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 22:07.40 | abraxa_ | Ebbe: Building for the Neo, QEmu or x86? |
| 22:07.49 | Ebbe | abraxa_: Neo |
| 22:08.13 | Ebbe | abraxa_: What do you have as BUILD_ARCH? |
| 22:08.56 | abraxa_ | Ebbe: http://pastebin.com/m31e1c8ba is mine - you may want to use rm_work, you may not. It's up to you |
| 22:09.45 | Ebbe | abraxa_: Okay. Thanks :) |
| 22:13.13 | abraxa_ | Sure thing :) |
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| 22:21.13 | josch | grrr... did someone msg me? my history got destroyed by netsplit again... |
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| 22:23.12 | mcscruff | lo all |
| 22:23.22 | abraxa_ | josch: matsimoto did |
| 22:23.25 | abraxa_ | <matsimoto> josch: I found this: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Phase_1_Software_Testing, but reducing the level makes it a bit hard to understand the caller |
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| 22:24.27 | mcscruff | im waiting for the consumer version and just checked in to see what kind of stuff this kick ass phone will run |
| 22:25.11 | abraxa_ | mcscruff: Thanks for your interest. Is there a certain application you have in mind? |
| 22:25.55 | mcscruff | abraxa_, will there be a terminal of any kind? |
| 22:26.07 | abraxa_ | Yes, there already is as a matter of fact |
| 22:26.16 | mcscruff | cool!! |
| 22:26.44 | abraxa_ | You might want to check out http://scaps.linuxtogo.org to see some of the things running on GTA01 and other such devices |
| 22:26.56 | mcscruff | and i should be able to compile apps for that much like you can when cross compiling? |
| 22:27.00 | mcscruff | i will do , ty |
| 22:27.06 | abraxa_ | My bad, http://scap.linuxtogo.org |
| 22:27.32 | abraxa_ | Yes, cross-compiling is what everyone does :) |
| 22:28.24 | torpor | abraxa_: i don't. |
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| 22:28.26 | torpor | i build local, test local, then cross-compile at milestone |
| 22:29.02 | abraxa_ | Okay, not everyone... you're Gargamel ;D |
| 22:29.32 | torpor | oh joy |
| 22:29.42 | mcscruff | i see in the topic you mention wifi, but i cant see that in the neo specs? |
| 22:29.51 | torpor | i get to watch the smurfs have a big gay orgy and then get pissed about it .. |
| 22:30.04 | torpor | mcscruff: gta02 has wlan, gta01 doesn't. |
| 22:30.11 | torpor | gta01 is a developer release |
| 22:30.17 | mcscruff | kk |
| 22:30.30 | torpor | for developers, it doesn't matter if wlan is used or bluetooth or usb-gadget-net |
| 22:30.43 | torpor | unless you're doing a wlan app, of course, but thats moot .. |
| 22:30.53 | torpor | i'm fine with bluetooth-pand for example .. |
| 22:31.14 | xzcvczx | grrr when are dvdr-dl's going to come down in price |
| 22:31.51 | mcscruff | i think wlan will be a large selling point, on the hardware side is there any other phone designs in the making as i have a touch screen phone at the moment but it is hard to text on the move |
| 22:32.17 | mcscruff | xzcvczx, under £1 each |
| 22:32.22 | xzcvczx | mcscruff: i doubt a phone with buttons will be released |
| 22:32.22 | mcscruff | thats not too bad |
| 22:32.48 | xzcvczx | mcscruff: singly they at least $7.99 and packs at least $4 each here |
| 22:33.33 | xzcvczx | and i dont know what your currency is meant to be as it came up as question mark |
| 22:33.37 | mcscruff | i usually get 10 for £8 , bout usd 17 |
| 22:33.55 | mcscruff | gbp |
| 22:34.01 | xzcvczx | ah |
| 22:34.03 | torpor | mcscruff: wlan+multitouch is going to be *standard* in 2008. anything other than that is going to be cheap and nasty |
| 22:35.24 | xzcvczx | mcscruff: i reckon if you put a 12 digit keypad on the neo for texting it would probably be just as quick as a normal phone |
| 22:36.01 | mcscruff | is there any rough dates for the consumer version? |
| 22:36.34 | mcscruff | or is it just "end of year" |
| 22:37.05 | xzcvczx | when its ready :P |
| 22:37.06 | mjr | it'll be a consumer version when the software is up to it |
| 22:37.39 | mcscruff | only downside is the lack of camera but beggers can't be choosers |
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| 22:38.34 | xzcvczx | mcscruff: i find cameras are very much a novelty and good for taking photos when you car clocks 100,000k and thats it |
| 22:38.41 | xzcvczx | well camera phones |
| 22:39.00 | mcscruff | i use mine on drunken nights out |
| 22:39.15 | xzcvczx | lol i just use my charm :P |
| 22:39.19 | torpor | xzcvczx: i can think of far more uses than that |
| 22:39.32 | xzcvczx | torpor: like? |
| 22:39.47 | mcscruff | but as its all open source some ppl might decide to rip one of of another phone, solder it in and write a driver |
| 22:39.55 | torpor | taking someones contact info, then ocr'ing it |
| 22:44.31 | cb22 | torpor, i have a p990 that is supposed to do that... its a huge gimick |
| 22:45.05 | torpor | well it works fine for me in the places i've used it (gp2x+usb webcam) |
| 22:45.13 | mcscruff | i like my xda orbit, great phone but it runs windows crap |
| 22:45.21 | torpor | and pics are not just for myspace, is the point .. |
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| 23:04.31 | josch | abraxa_, thx |
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| 23:10.48 | *** join/#openmoko Joe_ (n=Joe@cpc3-leed14-0-0-cust462.leed.cable.ntl.com) |
| 23:11.37 | Joe_ | hey |
| 23:11.57 | abraxa_ | Aloha |
| 23:12.18 | Joe_ | Hey abraxa, whats your intrest in the neo1973? |
| 23:12.53 | abraxa_ | That's a simple one: everything |
| 23:13.25 | cb22 | yes, you see abraxa_ really is a neo1973 |
| 23:13.33 | cb22 | he is the new AI we plan to integrate |
| 23:13.58 | Joe_ | I'm a design student in the UK. i've beenr eading lots about Openmoko and Neo1973. I'm really pleased to see such a popular channel on it :-D |
| 23:14.26 | Joe_ | Do you have a handset? |
| 23:14.46 | Joe_ | I'm waiting egarly for the next release |
| 23:16.38 | abraxa_ | cb22: Sssh. That was supposed to be secret! |
| 23:16.53 | Joe_ | Does anyone hand or know of good blogs from people playing with the GTA01? |
| 23:17.05 | Joe_ | hand = have |
| 23:17.20 | balrog-kun | Joe_: yup, they even have an aggreagtor |
| 23:17.21 | abraxa_ | Joe_: I *am* a handset. If you want to find people blogging about playing with me and my friends you can check out http://planet.openmoko.org |
| 23:17.23 | Joe_ | I'm ega to read more on what people are doing |
| 23:17.25 | josch | abraxa_, i KNEW there was something suspicious about you! |
| 23:17.37 | balrog-kun | Joe_: http://planet.openmoko.org/ |
| 23:17.45 | Joe_ | cheers!! |
| 23:18.26 | balrog-kun | if you look at the older posts there will be more on-topic stuff |
| 23:18.52 | Joe_ | i'll havea good browse. thanks very much! |
| 23:19.17 | balrog-kun | (because currently everyone's nokia n800-frenzy) |
| 23:19.29 | balrog-kun | err, 810 |
| 23:19.31 | Joe_ | is openmoko running on the n800? |
| 23:19.35 | Joe_ | 810* |
| 23:20.37 | balrog-kun | i don't know |
| 23:20.46 | Tene | not that I've heard of. |
| 23:20.53 | balrog-kun | but were are some of the same people working on both |
| 23:21.28 | Joe_ | i see |
| 23:21.43 | *** join/#openmoko Ghiottone (n=ale@host145-56-dynamic.9-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 23:22.35 | cb22 | abraxa_, you know what comes up if you google your nick? |
| 23:24.01 | abraxa_ | cb22: Yes, and I'm not affiliated with it ;) |
| 23:25.08 | Ghiottone | eheheheh |
| 23:25.18 | Ghiottone | hello all :) |
| 23:25.18 | zash | hahahaha |
| 23:25.20 | guaqua | haha :> |
| 23:25.26 | Joe_ | hi |
| 23:26.10 | xzcvczx | hahahahahahahaha |
| 23:26.32 | xzcvczx | everyone point and laugh |
| 23:27.23 | cb22 | abraxa_, you still working on the MP widget? |
| 23:28.07 | abraxa_ | cb22: Widget? |
| 23:28.48 | CM | abraxa_: Lol! I didn't know you were the number one hit on google.. |
| 23:29.01 | abraxa_ | =*( |
| 23:29.19 | abraxa_ | That's not me, I'm not *that* mentally ill ;) |
| 23:29.20 | Ghiottone | hey cm |
| 23:29.23 | cb22 | wow, the lag here is killing me |
| 23:29.37 | *** join/#openmoko twistx_ (n=no@64.30.190.171) |
| 23:29.54 | zash | cb22: how bad is it? |
| 23:30.15 | CM | Ghiottone: Evening |
| 23:31.04 | *** join/#openmoko federico (n=federico@dsl-245-144-167.telkomadsl.co.za) |
| 23:31.12 | cb23 | hmm |
| 23:31.52 | cb23 | abraxa_: you get my question? |
| 23:31.52 | cb23 | about the media player widget? |
| 23:31.58 | abraxa_ | cb23: Yeah, and I asked "widget?" |
| 23:32.33 | cb23 | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/User_talk:Abraxa |
| 23:33.21 | abraxa_ | cb23: Ah - well, it's not a widget but rather an application, so that threw me off :) |
| 23:33.31 | Linux_Galore | Joe_: N810 has its own GTK based UI thats designed specifically for it, I cant see the logic of porting OM to it |
| 23:33.32 | abraxa_ | And yes, I actually am working on it as we speak |
| 23:33.47 | abraxa_ | mplayer integration is turning out to be a PITA |
| 23:34.06 | cb23 | hehe, i feel your pain |
| 23:34.08 | cb23 | i tried it once |
| 23:34.08 | CM | How have you planned to integrate that into the gui? |
| 23:34.12 | Linux_Galore | abraxa_: well mplayer is a 20lb gorilla |
| 23:34.23 | CM | A special "Play movie" tab or so? |
| 23:34.26 | cb23 | tcpmp anyone? |
| 23:35.18 | *** join/#openmoko hobitti (n=hobitti@pc-243-45.dsl.aina.net) |
| 23:35.19 | Joe_ | Linux-: im very much a newbie - it was jsut a question :) |
| 23:35.21 | cb23 | tcpmp is really fast, on a 300mhz xscale it can decode a full res, 350mb prison break episode |
| 23:35.27 | guaqua | we could run the n810 native ui on top of openmoko :) |
| 23:35.36 | cb23 | and scale it down to 240x240 |
| 23:35.37 | abraxa_ | CM: If a movie loads you can press the play button which will switch the Neo into QVGA mode, launch mplayer and control it through touchscreen input |
| 23:35.46 | CM | Nice |
| 23:35.50 | Linux_Galore | abraxa_: the nokia N770/800/810 has a open source third party media player. I would have thought porting that over would been smarter and less time consuming |
| 23:36.15 | CM | Hmm.. Like play/pause, exit, and volume up/down by "invisible" buttons? |
| 23:36.40 | CM | Like sliding up or down on the right side of the video sets the volume? |
| 23:36.47 | cb23 | abraxa_: is the qvga switching transparent? |
| 23:37.10 | abraxa_ | cb23: Transparent in what sense? |
| 23:37.13 | cb23 | oh, and speaking of that... not sure if any one has suggested it, but using the aux button as a lock button would be cool |
| 23:37.29 | cb23 | abraxa_: in the sense of the screen doesn't go black and flicker a few times like a PC |
| 23:37.46 | Linux_Galore | openhand have a new version of maemo in the works for the N series, images Ive seen look pretty nice, lots of 3D effects |
| 23:37.50 | *** join/#openmoko romu1us (n=romulus@S0106000625a403af.vc.shawcable.net) |
| 23:38.00 | abraxa_ | Linux_Galore: Quite frankly I didn't know that but even if I had I wouldn't have cared much - I don't want to just copy things for OM ;) |
| 23:38.09 | abraxa_ | cb23: Nope, doesn't |
| 23:38.10 | *** join/#openmoko Marex-notebook (n=marex@gwfm10-3-250.802.cz) |
| 23:38.38 | Linux_Galore | abraxa_: you can change the UI around, it is GTK but the underlying code is mplayer |
| 23:38.39 | cb23 | cool |
| 23:39.45 | abraxa_ | Linux_Galore: Unfortunately that's a no-go then, as gstreamer was desired |
| 23:39.50 | Linux_Galore | to be honest though I wouldnt use the OM for playing video files Im getting a COWON A3 for that |
| 23:40.28 | Linux_Galore | 2.8" screen is just too small |
| 23:40.38 | Linux_Galore | ok for pictures though |
| 23:41.11 | Linux_Galore | COWON A3 = 4" PMP that runs linux and plays just about anything, yep even mkv |
| 23:41.41 | Joe_ | whats mkv? |
| 23:41.56 | balrog-kun | Linux_Galore: the video is not anythign to do with Maemo afaik |
| 23:42.06 | cb23 | Joe_: a video container, like avi on steroids |
| 23:42.07 | Linux_Galore | Joe_: its a container for video files, very commonly used now with anime video files |
| 23:42.30 | Joe_ | Sounds cool :-) |
| 23:42.52 | cb23 | indeed, it has subtitle and multiple track support |
| 23:43.06 | CM | Linux_Galore: Is that Matroska? |
| 23:43.07 | Linux_Galore | Joe_: basically 170mb XVID file turns into a 140mb mkv with the same resolution |
| 23:43.09 | Joe_ | Is there a short way for xchat it to place 'linux_galore' or 'cb23:' ahead of my message? |
| 23:43.11 | *** join/#openmoko orospakr (n=orospakr@CPE001a70d1de84-CM0019474a8676.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 23:43.23 | CM | So you can put subtitles and all that stuff in the same file? |
| 23:43.24 | cb23 | Joe_: yep |
| 23:43.32 | Linux_Galore | CM: YES |
| 23:43.33 | cb23 | just type 'cb' or whatever and press tab |
| 23:43.38 | cb23 | CM: indeed |
| 23:43.49 | Joe_ | cb ... |
| 23:43.54 | CM | Thought so, nice indeed |
| 23:44.02 | CM | Joe_: What irc client are you using? |
| 23:44.06 | Joe_ | xchaty |
| 23:44.07 | cb23 | hmm? think of it like bash |
| 23:44.10 | Joe_ | xchat* |
| 23:44.15 | cb23 | ah |
| 23:44.17 | Joe_ | sorry im very mucha newbie here |
| 23:44.20 | cb23 | try cb2 and press tab |
| 23:44.29 | Joe_ | cb23, gotcha! |
| 23:44.50 | cb23 | xchat by default will only complete unique names on tab |
| 23:44.55 | *** join/#openmoko rd_ (n=dr@vnsecurity.net) |
| 23:45.27 | Joe_ | cb23, thanks |
| 23:45.33 | cb23 | to change, go settings -> preferences -> input box -> automatic nick completion |
| 23:45.42 | cb23 | then pressing tab will cycle through the nicks avalable |
| 23:45.44 | cb23 | CM: amen |
| 23:46.30 | Joe_ | cb23: cheers! |
| 23:46.47 | zash | irssi in screen on some dudes server with ups |
| 23:46.49 | zash | ftw |
| 23:47.52 | CM | zash: På ACC? ;) |
| 23:48.02 | CM | Rätt stabil uptime där |
| 23:48.36 | zash | CM: nope ;) |
| 23:49.20 | CM | zash: Just sucks when Ubuntu has a release since the images are on ACC's server, and irc laggs like mad for 2-3 days |
| 23:49.28 | *** join/#openmoko t0h (i=thelinev@nikita.tnnet.fi) |
| 23:49.38 | CM | zash: ftp.gnome.org = farfar.acc.umu.se också :) |
| 23:50.06 | zash | mm, hänger i en annan kanal med en del folk från acc |
| 23:50.33 | zash | och annat umefolk |
| 23:51.38 | CM | löst folk mao ;) |
| 23:51.46 | cjb_ie | jävla svenskar överallt :) |
| 23:51.51 | CM | Hehe |
| 23:52.08 | Joe_ | Linux_Galore: what app are you using to play your Matroska files? |
| 23:52.19 | CM | cjb_ie: Our fast connections gives us the chance to stick our noses everywhere.. ;) |
| 23:52.25 | *** join/#openmoko mwester-laptop (n=mwester@gw.mwester.net) |
| 23:52.34 | Linux_Galore | Joe_: kplayer |
| 23:52.35 | cjb_ie | that must be it |
| 23:52.40 | cjb_ie | you and your 40-gigabit grannies |
| 23:52.40 | CM | mwester-laptop: Evening :) |
| 23:52.51 | CM | Oh yes |
| 23:52.55 | mwester-laptop | 'allo! |
| 23:52.56 | Linux_Galore | sorry kmplayer |
| 23:53.10 | Joe_ | Linux_Galore: i'll check it out |
| 23:54.52 | xzcvczx | wow burning a double layer image takes forever |
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| 23:57.51 | mcscruff | 40 mins |
| 23:58.05 | mcscruff | wot u burning? |
| 23:58.20 | *** join/#openmoko raster (n=raster@60-240-29-193-nsw-pppoe.tpgi.com.au) |
