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| 00:20.28 | xzcvczx | hmmm gps doesnt seem to work too well in a concrete building |
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| 01:07.15 | Mek | hey... nice... I upgraded the software on my neo, and now all of a sudden media player actually more or less works! yay :) |
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| 01:34.35 | CVirus | Can the GTA01 make calls with OpenMoko now ? |
| 01:34.40 | CVirus | using* |
| 01:38.47 | alphaone | I have been doing that, yes |
| 01:39.40 | Mek | with the Dialer gui, or with some command-line stuff? |
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| 01:46.15 | alphaone | Dialer |
| 01:47.58 | Mek | hmm.. I don't even seem to be able to get it to recognize my sim card... |
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| 02:14.10 | Mek | btw, already seen http://www.wired.com/gadgets/wireless/news/2007/10/openmoko_firstlook ? |
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| 02:33.25 | kW | nice :-) |
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| 02:57.31 | jadams_ | hey hey |
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| 03:07.31 | LetoTo | haha |
| 03:07.34 | LetoTo | the greenphone died. |
| 03:07.41 | jadams_ | retired |
| 03:07.47 | LetoTo | if they hadnt screwed up their orders twice, i would have had one :) |
| 03:14.41 | doc|home | LetoTo: it was always going to be a test device, never meant for the mass market |
| 03:15.16 | swel024 | and i dont think nice things like the greenphone and 1973 would be yay if they died |
| 03:15.31 | jadams_ | exactly what I was thinking |
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| 03:20.39 | russellb | that's ... odd |
| 03:21.50 | swel024 | lol |
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| 03:26.42 | swel024 | russellb: will probably change when the phone is usable as a phone |
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| 03:34.01 | doc|home | I'm kindof the same, I want an internet device with wifi, the phone can wait until later :) |
| 03:36.30 | swel024 | i like the gps :P |
| 03:36.37 | *** join/#openmoko mickey-tw (n=mickeyl@rd.tw.openmoko.org) |
| 03:42.52 | xaid | how does the gps chipset in GTA02 compare to the one in GTA01? |
| 03:43.40 | xaid | capability-wise I mean, I know of the driver issue with the gps chipset in GTA01 (which should go away soon). |
| 03:44.53 | ckuethe | xaid - you don't get quite as "raw" data |
| 03:45.02 | ckuethe | but you could probably still post-process it |
| 03:45.10 | ckuethe | i rather like ublox chipsets |
| 03:46.39 | xaid | ckuethe: i read the spec paper and it looks pretty interesting. is there a big different as far as accuracy? |
| 03:47.35 | ckuethe | in "road tests" i find my ublox and itrax receivers do better than sirf, trimble or garmin |
| 03:47.54 | ckuethe | at least for non-optimal, gps-in-my-pocket applications |
| 03:48.11 | mickey-tw | executive summary: our RF engineers say it´s better |
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| 03:48.15 | ckuethe | my high-sensitivity antaris4 receiver gets fixes inside my concrete office building |
| 03:49.05 | xaid | ckuethe: mickey-tw : thanks, that pretty much answers my question :) |
| 03:49.12 | mickey-tw | :) |
| 03:50.25 | jadams_ | installing the qtopia image for the first time right now |
| 03:50.29 | jadams_ | s/installing/flashing |
| 03:51.36 | swel024 | welcome back mickey-tw |
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| 04:36.33 | swel024 | mickey-tw: are you still around? |
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| 05:05.54 | KzN_ | hi, I know it should be obvious but I downloaded the win32 qemu build and I can't find an updated openmoko-flash image |
| 05:06.00 | KzN_ | where are they located? |
| 05:07.18 | ljp | jadams_: let me know how it goes |
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| 05:22.02 | jadams_ | ljp: qtopia is much better for me than openmoko was, in terms of usability |
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| 06:08.02 | mickey-tw | swel024: yep, i´m here |
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| 06:12.20 | swel024 | mickey-tw: is there any reason the open-source gps components that have been made by om havent been released yet? it would mean that at least people who are planning on integrating gps into an app can look at the way to go |
| 06:12.29 | mickey-tw | one word |
| 06:12.30 | mickey-tw | EULA |
| 06:12.39 | mickey-tw | two more |
| 06:12.40 | mickey-tw | yet missing |
| 06:12.56 | swel024 | mickey-tw: why does it need to be EULA'd? |
| 06:13.09 | mickey-tw | because it´s closed source |
| 06:13.10 | swel024 | isnt it only the binary that needs the EULA |
| 06:13.17 | mickey-tw | yes, that it |
| 06:13.23 | mickey-tw | there are no open source componentes by OM |
| 06:13.26 | mickey-tw | yet |
| 06:13.30 | mickey-tw | (gps open source) |
| 06:13.36 | swel024 | mickey-tw: what about the one i saw on youtube |
| 06:13.48 | mickey-tw | ? |
| 06:13.48 | linux_galore | I noticed the new N810 has GPS |
| 06:13.58 | mbuf | mickey-tw, the gsm driver is closed-source, but not part of OM? |
| 06:14.10 | *** join/#openmoko rob_w (n=bob@X048a.x.pppool.de) |
| 06:14.10 | mickey-tw | there is no gsm driver |
| 06:14.22 | mickey-tw | there is a gsm module |
| 06:14.25 | mickey-tw | and it talks serial commands |
| 06:14.30 | mbuf | mickey-tw, i see |
| 06:14.56 | swel024 | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5D6i6vLlhGA |
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| 06:15.10 | linux_galore | mickey-tw: sounds like a pain |
| 06:15.21 | swel024 | well i assume it will be open source as it logically would just talk to the binary not be part of it |
| 06:16.24 | mickey-tw | if we were to write stuff on top of gps NMEA it would of course be open |
| 06:16.31 | *** join/#openmoko geaaru (n=geaaru@host2-172-dynamic.14-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 06:16.35 | mickey-tw | but remember this situation affects gta01 only anyways... |
| 06:17.36 | swel024 | mickey-tw: its all i have at the moment :S |
| 06:17.38 | mickey-tw | swel024: ah i see what you mean. this code has come from the same source as gllin as it´s just a testing app from GL. |
| 06:17.48 | mickey-tw | hence it goes under the same EULA |
| 06:17.50 | yang | no neo phones @ ebay ? |
| 06:17.52 | swel024 | dangit |
| 06:18.08 | mickey-tw | well, the ball is hanging on our side atm. |
| 06:18.12 | mickey-tw | FIC legal has to write this EULA |
| 06:18.19 | mickey-tw | and legal departments are sllooooooooooooooowwwwwwwww |
| 06:19.13 | linux_galore | mickey-tw: yeah, our SIP phone is was held up for ages by legal on getting all the codec stuff sorted |
| 06:19.20 | swel024 | "By using the GPS chip in this equipment you agree not to reverse engineer anything you do not get source code access to and will not use it in a missile made to hit the white house" |
| 06:19.26 | swel024 | there we go all done |
| 06:19.37 | *** join/#openmoko geaaru (n=geaaru@host2-172-dynamic.14-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 06:19.42 | mickey-tw | heh |
| 06:19.45 | zash | swel024: jäh! |
| 06:20.33 | swel024 | zash: ??? |
| 06:20.53 | linux_galore | swel024: you cant redefine legislated consumer rights in a EULA, in fact you can get fined for even trying in some countries |
| 06:21.21 | swel024 | so its a consumers right to hit the whitehouse with a missile? |
| 06:22.55 | linux_galore | swel024: its legal misrepresentation, bit like writing a contract that says, if you use this device you can kill anyone legally |
| 06:23.55 | zash | swel024: as in 'yeah!' |
| 06:24.11 | swel024 | lol ok |
| 06:24.21 | linux_galore | also you cant deny all liability in a contract or license either because that is legislated |
| 06:24.55 | linux_galore | you can try but as soon as it hits the court room its thrown out |
| 06:25.03 | swel024 | yeah |
| 06:26.11 | swel024 | its also like how all the companies here try to say if your warranty is 3 years long and after 3 years and 1 week your 100k tv stops working they try to claim too bad but gotta love the consumer guarantees act |
| 06:27.29 | linux_galore | same here in Australia, we also have warranty extensions for support so even if the product is out of warranty you cant deny support for usually around 7-8 years after the product is made |
| 06:27.58 | swel024 | what part of aussie? |
| 06:28.05 | linux_galore | Sydney |
| 06:28.09 | swel024 | ah ok |
| 06:28.21 | swel024 | havent been there in a while |
| 06:29.12 | linux_galore | Australia is how most Americans think the USA should be |
| 06:29.53 | linux_galore | we are pro capitalist but have a egalitarian tilt |
| 06:30.47 | swel024 | lol yeah im thinking about coming over there in a couple of years to work there for a while..... much more money to be had there than here |
| 06:31.24 | linux_galore | swel024: depends were here is and some parts of Australia are not so good |
| 06:31.30 | linux_galore | wage wise |
| 06:31.51 | swel024 | lol most places are better than nz |
| 06:31.59 | linux_galore | lots of money in Western Australia thanks to the mining boom |
| 06:32.40 | mudyc | it seems that trolltech is abandoning greenphone and moves to FIC's hw (according to /.) |
| 06:32.41 | linux_galore | swel024: aah NZ, nice green mountain one day, still camping at the base because Im broke the next |
| 06:33.08 | linux_galore | mountains* |
| 06:33.39 | linux_galore | swel024: hear foreigners are pushing property prices through the roof in NZ |
| 06:33.43 | swel024 | mudyc: lol days old |
| 06:33.54 | swel024 | linux_galore: luckily i am already in the property market |
| 06:34.24 | mudyc | swel024: that happens ;) |
| 06:34.31 | linux_galore | swel024: yeah, rich fat white people wanting a bit of middle earth heh |
| 06:34.44 | swel024 | lol im not rich or fat |
| 06:34.56 | swel024 | and actually a majority of out imports are asian |
| 06:35.02 | swel024 | immigrants rather |
| 06:35.14 | linux_galore | swel024: same here |
| 06:36.07 | linux_galore | I think tourists are surprised how big a chunk of the Australian population is Asian now |
| 06:37.44 | swel024 | aucklands the same |
| 06:38.06 | zash | linux_galore: noo! but i wants to move to nz! |
| 06:38.09 | zash | some day .. |
| 06:38.10 | linux_galore | I have been catch the train to school in the morning now for about 12 years and there is a stop were the students from a girls private high school all get off. Well a few weeks back I looked up and it hit me about 90% of the students were asian |
| 06:38.23 | linux_galore | catching* |
| 06:38.44 | linux_galore | sorry let me post that again |
| 06:40.00 | linux_galore | I have been catching the train to work in the morning now for about 12 years and there is a stop were the students for a girls private high school. Well a few weeks back I looked up and it hit me about 90% of the students were asian but 12 years ago they were mostly European. |
| 06:41.04 | linux_galore | White Australia is well and trully dead and gone now |
| 06:41.47 | linux_galore | I like it though because there is allot more variety of food to choose from |
| 06:42.25 | linux_galore | life isnt so boring with a cultural collage |
| 06:44.07 | linux_galore | I think the USA from what i can see is going the same direction |
| 06:45.09 | linux_galore | its getting to the stage were you don't visit india to see the culture you just cross town to were all the Indian people congregate heh |
| 06:46.07 | linux_galore | anyway back to the OM |
| 06:46.36 | linux_galore | Anyone tried the QTopia image on the OM yet |
| 06:47.06 | swel024 | someone just commented a few mins ago on it being more usable |
| 06:48.17 | linux_galore | swel024: yeah, looks very nice to me too from the video, I cant help but feel the Apple iPhone crew ripped of some of the QTopia design process |
| 06:48.46 | *** join/#openmoko atul (n=Atul@202.63.103.2) |
| 06:49.31 | swel024 | lol you cant say qtopia is entirely original either |
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| 06:51.26 | linux_galore | yeah, is seems like Apple and QTopia have this copy each other thing going, Im laughing at some of the features in OSX 10.5 ie icon preview, been in KDE now for what 5 years |
| 06:51.57 | XorA | its the world of software, everything is a rip off of something else |
| 06:52.13 | XorA | its the little spark of newness that is the gem |
| 06:52.21 | *** part/#openmoko Zakamiro (n=fox@adsl-75-44-16-203.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net) |
| 06:52.26 | swel024 | XorA: lol but that newness is stolen 5 mins later |
| 06:52.36 | XorA | swel024: of course |
| 06:52.56 | XorA | swel024: but for the rest of time you can walk into shops and see devices you designed :-) |
| 06:53.00 | linux_galore | OSX 10.5 dock is a serious copy of the 2003 looking glass one |
| 06:53.26 | swel024 | linux_galore: at least looking glass was opensource though |
| 06:53.44 | linux_galore | right down to the 3D effects, and cover flow is also in Looking Glass (a Sun Java project) |
| 06:54.02 | swel024 | ho hum buildhost is back up but empty again :( |
| 06:54.26 | *** join/#openmoko kW (n=kwkw@203.35.205.2) |
| 06:55.02 | linux_galore | I prefere the cover flow effect in Looking Glass to be honest OSX 10.5 seems to miss the point a bit |
| 06:55.47 | linux_galore | I noticed someone has done a compiz-fussion cover flow plugin too |
| 06:56.18 | linux_galore | accept in Linux the video files "keep playing" |
| 06:57.07 | swel024 | and you know that the stores got to be good when links to preorder the software doesnt work and it hasnt changed to buy now after the timer ran out 2 hrs ago for it |
| 06:57.38 | linux_galore | lol |
| 06:57.49 | linux_galore | yeah, crappy website code |
| 06:58.03 | linux_galore | Im off anyway |
| 06:59.24 | swel024 | mickey-tw: any idea when buildhost will be back properly? |
| 06:59.33 | mickey-tw | is it not? |
| 06:59.43 | swel024 | everythings missing from it |
| 06:59.54 | mickey-tw | mmh |
| 07:00.28 | swel024 | except the root folders and /snapshots/ |
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| 07:02.03 | ljp | linux_galore: what do you think qtopia copied from iPhone? |
| 07:02.40 | swel024 | ljp: i was more referring to stuff that was "ripped" off other phones |
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| 07:07.16 | Hopscotch | good morning |
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| 07:11.52 | mbuf | Hopscotch, good morning |
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| 07:15.13 | chong | i |
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| 07:28.56 | swel024 | in a init script whats the proper way to start a shell script? |
| 07:29.10 | swel024 | thats going to keep going |
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| 07:32.58 | chacha_chaudhry | hi all |
| 07:33.53 | mbuf | swel024, yes |
| 07:34.17 | swel024 | mbuf: i am not too sure if it was a yes no question :S |
| 07:34.23 | swel024 | do you jsut do sh /blah & |
| 07:34.29 | chacha_chaudhry | I was updating packages but found that http://buildhost.openmoko.org/OM2007.2/ is empty. I used the paths given in here http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Package_management But they seemed to moved some other place :( |
| 07:34.42 | swel024 | chacha_chaudhry: they will be back |
| 07:34.44 | mbuf | swel024, if i want to start services on boot-up, yes |
| 07:34.46 | XorA | chacha_chaudhry: we are waiting on sysadmin to fix that |
| 07:34.49 | swel024 | patience is a virtue |
| 07:34.59 | chacha_chaudhry | swel024: okay Thanks :) |
| 07:35.02 | swel024 | mbuf: thanks |
| 07:35.10 | chacha_chaudhry | ^^^ + XorA |
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| 07:56.11 | *** join/#openmoko Richlv (n=rich@81.94.235.186) |
| 07:56.29 | Richlv | neo buzz on slashdot again :) |
| 07:56.34 | Richlv | from one of the comments : "Here's something I read today from the OpenMoko mail list: "The Neo is, was, and will be, a product for geeks and therefore never was intended to be a mass market product. Geeks do not look at fancy glamour but for useful attributes."" |
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| 07:57.17 | Richlv | i hope that's not an official stance or something ? i would really love to see neo/openmoko to reach a state where i can use it and it is geeky-powerful, but i would also like to be able to suggest it to everybody else |
| 07:57.24 | Richlv | even to the most non-geek persons |
| 07:57.32 | mickey-tw | well |
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| 07:57.52 | mickey-tw | has this guy an openmoko.org or openmoko.com address? |
| 07:57.54 | mickey-tw | if not, ignore |
| 07:58.19 | mickey-tw | if so, i'll have to kick him |
| 07:58.22 | mickey-tw | :D |
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| 08:01.09 | ScaredyCat | lazy mofo |
| 08:01.11 | Richlv | mickey-tw, the comment did not specify the origin :) |
| 08:01.29 | CM | Richlv: Sounds like FUD then |
| 08:01.36 | mickey-tw | aah, bogglers |
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| 08:02.10 | Pengu1n | hi there. |
| 08:02.20 | Pengu1n | my openmoko-today cann't startup. |
| 08:02.32 | Pengu1n | It cann't find the libjana-gtk |
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| 08:02.36 | Richlv | CM, i really hope so, yes |
| 08:03.11 | Pengu1n | I'll show my neo to my friends...but.... |
| 08:03.15 | ScaredyCat | iirc wasn't that Harald - ^^ the comment ? |
| 08:03.29 | CM | Richlv: I guess the missconception can be that the GTA01 was never intended for mass market, GTA02 is |
| 08:03.33 | ScaredyCat | but it was't on the community list, iirc dev list |
| 08:07.17 | Richlv | CM, that would be a very weird one, as even i know that :) |
| 08:07.29 | Richlv | what's the current situation, btw ? |
| 08:07.31 | ScaredyCat | or was it the lipstick on a fetus thread ? |
| 08:07.40 | Richlv | is there some progress overview page or something ? |
| 08:07.51 | Richlv | i saw "in progress" category in wiki, but that's too spread out |
| 08:07.54 | CM | The current situation is that we're waiting and waiting... ;) |
| 08:08.48 | CM | A lot of work is getting done now, but I'm waiting for two things mostly, the FIC legal department do get done with the silly EULA for the GPS blob, and for the GTA02 hardware to come out :) |
| 08:10.21 | Richlv | any guesses when the 'ready for mass market' phase might be achieved (in software) ? |
| 08:10.36 | Richlv | that is, when most basic things work without problems from the gui :) |
| 08:10.57 | swel024 | dev mailing list* |
| 08:11.12 | CM | Richlv: Hmm.. Not in the next 3 months I think, but that's just my guess |
| 08:11.59 | swel024 | cm has no life |
| 08:12.15 | CM | swel024: :P |
| 08:12.50 | CM | What I do have is a boring job withotu challanges, and I'll start another one in 2 months. Just have to wait... |
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| 08:18.13 | Richlv | CM, ok, will take a look now and then :) |
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| 08:21.12 | wibbit | Hi All |
| 08:21.27 | wibbit | I've been looking at some of the screen shots that have been appearing of late, and some thing kinda stuck out. |
| 08:21.34 | mbuf | everytime we update .bb file, we should increment x.y.z in PV by one, and also PR by one? |
| 08:22.29 | wibbit | The bit that says "No new messages", is it configurable to have that displayed? the reason I ask, for me it seems to be a waste of realestate on the screen and clutter, I would rather see it omitted and the fact that there are no new messages is implied. |
| 08:26.43 | swel024 | who was telling me about sqlite earlier? |
| 08:27.29 | zash | wibbit: smart! |
| 08:29.31 | wibbit | Where would be the best place to comment on that? Or is IRC the best? |
| 08:29.49 | CM | wibbit: Maybe set is as a bug against the today app? |
| 08:30.54 | swel024 | wibbit: i think at this stage its there as they have no reason to save real estate on that screen as there isnt much to put there |
| 08:31.02 | wibbit | CM: Am I the only person that feels this way? |
| 08:31.03 | *** join/#openmoko lrg_ (n=liam@lrg2.demon.co.uk) |
| 08:31.29 | CM | wibbit: Nope, I agree |
| 08:31.32 | Pengu1n | who's the maintainer of libjana? |
| 08:31.41 | Pengu1n | my openmoko-today cann't start |
| 08:31.49 | wibbit | swel024: I can believe that, and it's good to kinda "demo the abilities" but at the same time, wouldn't want it to become the defacto default ;) |
| 08:31.50 | CM | Pengu1n: Cwiiis I think |
| 08:31.57 | CM | Pengu1n: Chris Lord |
| 08:32.03 | wibbit | Pengu1n: http://chrislord.net/ |
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| 08:32.17 | wibbit | CM: Got a link the bug db? |
| 08:32.43 | CM | wibbit: http://bugzilla.openmoko.org :) |
| 08:32.47 | Pengu1n | CM: thx |
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| 08:33.40 | swel024 | and for the obsessive people who think they are cool' |
| 08:35.09 | wibbit | There are *NO* open bugs against the today app? |
| 08:38.00 | Pengu1n | I got a broken libjana0 and libjana-gtk0, then openmoko-today cann't startup |
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| 08:39.42 | XorA | Pengu1n: we saw this yesterday on .dev channel, the packages are fine, ipkg is broken :-( |
| 08:40.04 | XorA | Pengu1n: if you ipkg remove -force-depends libjana-gtk0 ; ipkg install libjana-gtk0 it should fix it |
| 08:40.18 | XorA | Pengu1n: repeat for libjana as well if need be |
| 08:40.30 | *** join/#openmoko gordonsyme (n=gordon@62.231.57.138) |
| 08:40.54 | torpor | sup guys? |
| 08:41.01 | torpor | what .dev channel? |
| 08:41.40 | torpor | swel024: tinysql/sqlite .. |
| 08:41.57 | XorA | torpor: not for openmoko dev |
| 08:42.56 | XorA | torpor: BTW does anyone ever speak during .eu time on open2x? |
| 08:43.01 | wibbit | CM: Bug submitted |
| 08:43.33 | wibbit | Does any one have a nice list of blogs to read to keep updated on OpenMoko/ Neo development. |
| 08:43.44 | CM | wibbit: planet.openmoko.org |
| 08:43.49 | CM | :) |
| 08:43.52 | XorA | planet.openmoko.org planet.openembedded.org |
| 08:43.53 | Pengu1n | XorA: Thank you very much. I alsa repeat it for libjana-ecal0. then I can show my neo for my friend now:) |
| 08:44.01 | cdbot2 | * * OM Bug 959 has been created by douglas.furlong(AT)gmail.com |
| 08:44.02 | cdbot2 | * * Superflous information in Today Display |
| 08:44.03 | cdbot2 | * * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=959 |
| 08:44.08 | XorA | mickey-tw: we need a new package manager :-( |
| 08:44.17 | XorA | mickey-tw: or hire a guy to fix ipkg |
| 08:44.18 | wibbit | I had assumed that planet.openmoko.org would be a good agrigate to use, however for example http://chrislord.net/ isn't linked there, and after looking at his blog, it looks like it would be good. Wondering if I'm missing out on any more |
| 08:44.20 | Pengu1n | The digital clock is too large... |
| 08:45.21 | torpor | XorA: me. i'm in vienna. |
| 08:46.03 | XorA | planet.closedfist.co.uk is I think for o-hand people |
| 08:46.13 | swel024 | torpor: do you know what package i need to install on the moko to use sqlite in my program? |
| 08:46.30 | torpor | wibbit: planet.openmoko.org |
| 08:46.37 | XorA | torpor: its time for me to look into open2x, but there been no news for 3 months and webpages are down |
| 08:46.51 | torpor | if anyone is hiring, i'm available! and i'd love to work on openmoko full time doing package maintenance |
| 08:46.54 | ScaredyCat | :o |
| 08:47.01 | torpor | XorA: there is lots of activity .. |
| 08:48.42 | XorA | torpor: not package maintenence, someone needs to destroy and rebuild ipkg so it actually does something useful most of the time |
| 08:49.08 | torpor | the thing with open2x is that there is a lot of major progress done already: compiler optimized for gp2x, SDL optimized for the gp2x video hardware, custom libs for the onboard stuff (2nd CPU, etc) .. but there is no real 'public' release of it all yet .. we still have to solve a couple issues before we can bundle a 100% replacement for the GPH-provided firmware.. such as mplayer, which as of a few days ago looks like its totally solved: is being built by the |
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| 08:51.22 | CIA-13 | openmoko: 03werner * r3279 10/trunk/src/host/devirginator/envedit.pl: envedit.pl (readenv): added option -c to only warn about CRC errors, don't fail |
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| 08:57.44 | wibbit | XorA: Thanks for that, I'll have a look |
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| 08:57.59 | XorA | wibbit: you suffering the bug as well? |
| 08:58.20 | wibbit | Who would one contact to request additional feeds on planet.openmoko.org? |
| 08:58.41 | wibbit | XorA: If buy bug you mean, withdrawl symptoms from lack of updates on openmoko, then yes :o) |
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| 09:01.26 | gordonsyme | rwhitby: MokoMakefile needs a patch for flash-qemu-local since the images are now kept in a different directory http://pastebin.ca/750169 |
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| 09:03.19 | gordonsyme | build/qemu/openmoko/env also needs a patch since the kernel naming scheme has changed but I'm not sure whom that should go to. http://pastebin.ca/750171 |
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| 09:08.40 | PBeck | hi |
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| 09:18.18 | torpor | tar: /home/j/hak/openmoko/sources/gsm_svn.openmoko.org_.trunk.src.target_3074_.tar.gz: Cannot open: No such file or directory |
| 09:21.13 | *** join/#openmoko Sup3rkiddo (n=sudharsh@unaffiliated/sudharsh) |
| 09:21.33 | gi-el | this is of course old news for you guys, but still: "Trolltech CTO, Benoit Schilling, stated that they are not really a hardware company and so will focus it's efforts on FIC's Neo 1973" |
| 09:21.48 | gi-el | complete with the /. grammatical error ;) |
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| 09:25.09 | swel024 | ScaredyCat: why you having visitors from via |
| 09:25.16 | swel024 | and why would you let them in the door |
| 09:25.39 | torpor | oh god, please someone come up with a high power, low-consumption, x86 chip that can be used in the same places people are using arm. |
| 09:25.46 | torpor | it'd remove the cross-compile dilemna. |
| 09:27.45 | *** join/#openmoko morricone (n=foobar@dslb-084-057-158-119.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 09:27.47 | faern | torpor, that would be really nice |
| 09:28.40 | swel024 | would that ever |
| 09:28.59 | torpor | either that, or someone finally tackles the compiler-on-ARM issue and we do away with cross-compiling anything other than large system libs and stuff .. |
| 09:29.29 | torpor | lately i've been very enamoured with my current neo setup: neo+apple bt keyboard+python. it awesome. its like, computing is fun again. i can write code for the device, *on* the device. woot! |
| 09:30.16 | SpeedEvil | The cross compile dilemma wouldn't be an issue with a sane dev system. |
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| 09:34.53 | gamin | SpeedEvil: I like OE. Have you ever developed for maemo? |
| 09:35.08 | SpeedEvil | I did not say that OE was not sane. |
| 09:35.15 | gamin | ah :)) |
| 09:35.59 | SpeedEvil | But people complaining about it obviously think it's not. |
| 09:36.14 | gamin | Well, they never did any maemo. |
| 09:36.15 | torpor | its not sane in the sense that you can just take what you've learned and move rapidly into development. |
| 09:36.37 | torpor | you havde to learn new tools, which don't always make intuitive sense, because a lot of the design of these tools happened 'by the seat of the hackers pants' who developed them .. |
| 09:36.54 | torpor | unless you lurk forever on #oe and #openembedded, and #openmoko, you won't "get" why things are the way they are. the core team are very closed. |
| 09:38.02 | swel024 | i would prefer a way to jsut have a very easy way to compile something for a particular system and run it during the very first stages of testing though |
| 09:38.44 | torpor | swel024: i've got that for you. its called: a parallels/vmware image, refreshed daily, that anyone can download and use to get started already, without having to set their system up for it .. |
| 09:38.59 | swel024 | haha |
| 09:39.09 | gamin | swel024: apart from the fact the the first run of MokoMakefile takes hours, once it is done you just develop as you are used to |
| 09:39.39 | torpor | gamin: please add ".. and update it daily, be prepared for it to be broken daily, and fixed every 2 or 3 days or so..." |
| 09:39.50 | swel024 | exaxtly |
| 09:40.14 | swel024 | i have not had one start to finish of mokomakefile once |
| 09:41.54 | CIA-13 | openmoko: 03chris * r3280 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/applications/openmoko-today2/src/: |
| 09:41.54 | CIA-13 | openmoko: svn:externals on inotify code from matchbox-desktop2 (which is in turn copied |
| 09:41.54 | CIA-13 | openmoko: from GIO) |
| 09:42.34 | CIA-13 | openmoko: 03chris * r3281 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/applications/openmoko-today2/src/: Use http instead of https for externals |
| 09:45.59 | wibbit | XorA: You've mentioned a couple of times that you want ipkg fixed, is there a page for required/desired features for a ipkg replacement/rebuild? Or do you want it to be feature for feature replacement, that happens to actually work? :) |
| 09:47.04 | XorA | wibbit: unfortuneately ipkg is a hh.org project that seems to have been abandoned, all I know is it doesnt work very well. Angstrom is looking at just making use of apt and dpkg |
| 09:51.30 | swel024 | we should jsut switch to rpm's :P |
| 09:54.15 | wibbit | XorA: I know from my use of ipkg I really don't particularly like it, I was assuming that things like rpm/yum and apt/dpkg wasn't being used due to weight |
| 09:55.00 | *** part/#openmoko Richlv (n=rich@81.94.235.186) |
| 09:59.21 | torpor | swel024: i've had stable mokomakefile build systems every week, for about a day or two for months now . |
| 09:59.28 | torpor | but i've gotten used to things being broken for a few days |
| 10:02.26 | rwhitby | mickey-tw: http://pastebin.ca/750171 - qemu env file needs updating with new kernel name |
| 10:04.37 | CIA-13 | openmoko: 03thomas * r3282 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/applications/openmoko-dialer2/ (ChangeLog src/moko-talking.c): * src/moko-talking.c: (moko_talking_init): Don't use gtk_widget_set_no_show_all () |
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| 10:05.14 | PBeck | re |
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| 10:22.57 | torpor | anyone know why gsm is borked? |
| 10:24.18 | swel024 | because its wireless technology |
| 10:24.19 | Sup3rkiddo | torpor: it does crash occasionally...thats known, lot of things needs to be fixed, |
| 10:24.33 | Sup3rkiddo | oh..gsm..i thought you asked for gsmd |
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| 10:26.03 | swel024 | Sup3rkiddo: most likely one and the same |
| 10:27.31 | Sup3rkiddo | heh |
| 10:28.59 | torpor | no i'm talking about the build .. |
| 10:29.05 | torpor | NOTE: Unpacking /home/j/hak/openmoko/sources/gsm_svn.openmoko.org_.trunk.src.target_3074_.tar.gz to /home/j/hak/openmoko/build/tmp/work/fic-gta01-angstrom-linux-gnueabi/libgsmd-0.1+svnr3074-r32/ |
| 10:29.09 | torpor | tar: /home/j/hak/openmoko/sources/gsm_svn.openmoko.org_.trunk.src.target_3074_.tar.gz: Cannot open: No such file or directory |
| 10:29.16 | torpor | anyone got this file? |
| 10:29.16 | torpor | gsm_svn.openmoko.org_.trunk.src.target_3074_.tar.gz |
| 10:31.22 | Sup3rkiddo | torpor: lol..ok, works here for me though, and there is no tarball like hat..code should have been check out from the svn, not the tarball..but did you "make update" |
| 10:31.33 | torpor | yes i always do make update |
| 10:31.49 | torpor | /home/j/hak/openmoko/sources/gsm_svn.openmoko.org_.trunk.src.target_3074_.tar.gz.md5 |
| 10:31.54 | torpor | but no .gz file. |
| 10:32.07 | Sup3rkiddo | torpor: letme try that on my box |
| 10:32.25 | torpor | bitbake libgsmd-0.1+svnr3074 -c fetch |
| 10:32.28 | torpor | ^^ does not work |
| 10:34.04 | Sup3rkiddo | torpor: how about "make rebuild-package-libgsmd", works here |
| 10:34.19 | torpor | okay trying that now then .. |
| 10:34.26 | torpor | nope |
| 10:34.27 | torpor | fail |
| 10:34.30 | torpor | tar: /home/j/hak/openmoko/sources/gsm_svn.openmoko.org_.trunk.src.target_3074_.tar.gz: Cannot open: No such file or directory |
| 10:35.00 | torpor | Sup3rkiddo: do you have the .tar.gz? |
| 10:36.11 | Sup3rkiddo | torpor: no, it goes like this, the build system "does" look to download the file, but fails, then checkout code from svn and build..i think its the openmoko "feature" to look for tar.gz at openmoko.org...happens even in my code |
| 10:36.30 | torpor | well i don't get how i can fix this then .. |
| 10:41.17 | *** join/#openmoko florian (n=fuchs@217.146.132.69) |
| 10:44.14 | *** join/#openmoko bedboi (n=bedboi@dre84.lss.supelec.fr) |
| 10:45.55 | CIA-13 | openmoko: 03chris * r3283 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/applications/openmoko-today2/ (ChangeLog configure.ac src/Makefile.am src/today-launcher.c): |
| 10:45.55 | CIA-13 | openmoko: * configure.ac: |
| 10:45.56 | CIA-13 | openmoko: * src/Makefile.am: |
| 10:45.56 | CIA-13 | openmoko: * src/today-launcher.c: (monitor), (find_and_destroy), |
| 10:45.56 | CIA-13 | openmoko: (inotify_event), (load_data_dir), |
| 10:45.57 | CIA-13 | openmoko: (today_launcher_page_create): |
| 10:46.01 | CIA-13 | openmoko: Add inotify for .desktop files, copied from mb-desktop-2 |
| 10:47.15 | *** join/#openmoko mattzerah_ (n=matt@121.50.219.188) |
| 10:47.30 | ScaredyCat | torpor: you want me to copy them it to my buildhost like before? |
| 10:49.19 | torpor | ScaredyCat: it would be helpful because i'm trying to get a new image built as of today |
| 10:49.45 | torpor | i dunno why issues like this keep coming up .. its almost like people are committing things they're not testing through a full build first .. |
| 10:50.11 | ScaredyCat | copied... |
| 10:50.20 | ScaredyCat | http://buildhost.automated.it/ |
| 10:52.03 | torpor | thanks ScaredyCat .. i'll see if this works and can continue the build .. |
| 10:52.14 | ScaredyCat | :) |
| 10:52.30 | torpor | yeah looks like its progressing now .. thanks again.. |
| 10:52.55 | ScaredyCat | i'm going to create an om-missing dir and put them in there, so that I can do it with other missing stuff if I have it |
| 10:53.06 | torpor | yeah i think that'd be useful. |
| 10:53.26 | torpor | hopefully some of the other devs are reading their logs and seeing these problems we're having, and we can work out better solutions to this issue in the future. . |
| 10:53.35 | swel024 | buildhost.om is back up just in case people were wondering |
| 10:54.21 | *** part/#openmoko nexus10 (n=nichols7@213-152-52-108.dsl.eclipse.net.uk) |
| 10:55.15 | ScaredyCat | Yoink! |
| 10:55.17 | ScaredyCat | Bandwidth (this month) 55843.24 Megabytes |
| 10:55.32 | Shoragan | for what? |
| 10:55.41 | ScaredyCat | my buildhost |
| 10:56.09 | torpor | yikes. |
| 10:56.11 | ScaredyCat | (downloads) |
| 10:56.15 | Shoragan | Chain OUTPUT (policy ACCEPT 5437M packets, 38T bytes) |
| 10:56.26 | Shoragan | our debian mirror ;) |
| 10:56.47 | Shoragan | running about 3 months |
| 10:59.08 | Shoragan | so if you need a mirror for your stuff, just tell me |
| 11:00.11 | ScaredyCat | :D |
| 11:00.41 | ScaredyCat | it should be ok.. I think it's just because the om stuff has been b0rked for so long.. |
| 11:06.54 | *** join/#openmoko shingoki (n=shingoki@pdpc/supporter/active/shingoki) |
| 11:07.20 | *** part/#openmoko shingoki (n=shingoki@pdpc/supporter/active/shingoki) |
| 11:08.38 | *** join/#openmoko PBeck (n=PBeck@91.89.138.232) |
| 11:08.48 | PBeck | re |
| 11:11.12 | swel024 | how do you see what its going to do in a ipkg upgrade instead of actually having it do so |
| 11:13.09 | *** join/#openmoko MetaMorfoziS (n=khmhm@3e44a665.adsl.enternet.hu) |
| 11:13.35 | XorA | swel024: -noaction |
| 11:13.46 | swel024 | ah it is that |
| 11:24.59 | *** join/#openmoko nosyjoe (n=philipp@ppp-82-135-83-86.dynamic.mnet-online.de) |
| 11:26.03 | *** join/#openmoko robtaylor (n=robtaylo@208-78-103-131.slicehost.net) |
| 11:31.05 | *** join/#openmoko openfanss (n=df@218.79.140.212) |
| 11:35.36 | *** join/#openmoko Marex-notebook (n=marex@vasut.kolej.mff.cuni.cz) |
| 11:41.06 | CIA-13 | openmoko: 03thomas * r3284 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/applications/openmoko-today2/ (ChangeLog src/today-main.c): * src/today-main.c: (main): Do not hard code theme settings |
| 11:43.30 | *** join/#openmoko Linux_Galore (n=richard@60-242-20-212.static.tpgi.com.au) |
| 11:43.48 | Linux_Galore | quote of the day "Vista is Ballmer's way of throwing chairs at people he can't reach." |
| 11:45.24 | zash | OMG TERRORBOMING!!! |
| 11:45.58 | zash | of DOOM! |
| 11:46.57 | zash | DOOOOOM! |
| 11:47.41 | zash | (a leaking tube with acetylene in a car in umeå) |
| 11:48.44 | zash | sites of local newspapers is ddosed :D |
| 11:49.21 | gi-el | it's all part of OPERATION IMPENDING DOOM II |
| 11:49.57 | Henryk | hmm, why has openmoko-panel-clock been removed from the panel? |
| 11:51.06 | zash | Henryk: my guess: they have a clock in the today-app now |
| 11:51.39 | Henryk | bah, but that's not always visible. I love my clock. I need my clock. |
| 11:52.09 | zash | .. my .. precious .. |
| 11:52.51 | *** join/#openmoko wooKieface (n=benjamin@x1-6-00-03-2f-29-99-b9.k511.webspeed.dk) |
| 11:53.46 | Linux_Galore | Henryk: stop winding your clock |
| 11:53.58 | Linux_Galore | you will go blind |
| 11:54.06 | zash | wind-up-clocks ftw |
| 11:55.47 | abraxa_ | Henryk: Fancy writing a panel control applet to start/restart/customize them? |
| 11:56.14 | Linux_Galore | hmm another cheap Linux ultraportable laptop in the works this time from Mitec http://www.digitimes.com/news/a20071023PD217.html |
| 11:56.31 | Henryk | abraxa_: ENOTIME |
| 11:56.37 | abraxa_ | hehe :) |
| 11:56.43 | Linux_Galore | always have a virtual touch screen wind up clock |
| 11:57.52 | Linux_Galore | OM version of worry beads |
| 11:58.51 | Linux_Galore | EMOCLOCK |
| 11:59.11 | Linux_Galore | always shows 1 minute to midnight |
| 12:00.12 | *** join/#openmoko jpozlovsky (n=jindra@rb5cc115.net.upc.cz) |
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| 12:05.14 | *** join/#openmoko PBeck (n=PBeck@91.89.138.232) |
| 12:05.24 | PBeck | re :) |
| 12:06.38 | *** join/#openmoko agoode (n=agoode@2001:4830:1633:0:212:3fff:fe70:6222) |
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| 12:14.42 | *** join/#openmoko mbuf (n=mbuf@202.63.103.2) |
| 12:18.49 | ynezz | Holly cow! "OLPC Experiments With Cow-powered Laptops" |
| 12:19.05 | SpeedEvil | methane? |
| 12:19.35 | *** join/#openmoko Sup3rkiddo (n=sudharsh@unaffiliated/sudharsh) |
| 12:19.58 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@66.37.59.194.nauticom.net) |
| 12:19.58 | ynezz | http://dev.laptop.org/~arjs/cp1.JPG |
| 12:27.20 | *** join/#openmoko ruxpin_ (n=mikael@Catalyst-53.pspt.fi) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 12:27.20 | *** join/#openmoko massoud (n=massoud@86.69.158.104) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 12:27.20 | *** join/#openmoko Philippe (n=fille@a91-153-17-113.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 12:27.21 | *** join/#openmoko Mek (n=marijn@s55917044.adsl.wanadoo.nl) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 12:27.21 | *** join/#openmoko lampus (n=stotz@212-41-124-179.adsl.solnet.ch) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 12:27.21 | *** join/#openmoko torpor (n=torpor@zone79a.de) |
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| 12:27.21 | *** join/#openmoko Clint (n=Clint@thumb.scru.org) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
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| 12:27.21 | *** join/#openmoko Obri (i=daniel@sonne.alt-f4.ch) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
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| 12:27.21 | *** join/#openmoko folken (i=folken@sonne.alt-f4.ch) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
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| 12:27.21 | *** join/#openmoko avihavai (n=avihavai@myntti.helsinki.fi) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 12:27.21 | *** join/#openmoko ar0x (i=al@chocobo.soja.org) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 12:27.21 | *** join/#openmoko cbrake (n=cbrake@oh-69-34-21-229.sta.embarqhsd.net) |
| 12:27.21 | *** join/#openmoko gnu (n=gnu@quiet.toad.com) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 12:28.21 | CVirus | no official release date yet :-( ? |
| 12:29.24 | *** join/#openmoko sladen (i=paul@193.28.45.41) |
| 12:29.33 | nox-Hand | CVirus: Nope |
| 12:29.44 | nox-Hand | CVirus: In topic it states "December as of last update" |
| 12:29.55 | nox-Hand | Shame, I was hoping to buy it this month :( |
| 12:30.20 | CVirus | nox-Hand: this is not even official |
| 12:30.24 | nox-Hand | Oooh, Christmas... **adds to wish list as an "please be multiple people collaborating on making geek = happy"* thing |
| 12:30.27 | nox-Hand | I know |
| 12:30.28 | *** join/#openmoko ruxpin (n=mikael@Catalyst-53.pspt.fi) |
| 12:30.30 | nox-Hand | But that could be cool xD |
| 12:30.34 | *** join/#openmoko fo0bar (n=fo0bar@feh.colobox.com) |
| 12:31.00 | CVirus | Anybody around got the GTA02 ? |
| 12:31.29 | *** join/#openmoko guerby (n=guerby@gut75-4-82-235-162-148.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 12:31.41 | *** join/#openmoko Clint (n=Clint@thumb.scru.org) |
| 12:31.43 | nox-Hand | CVirus: Probably some testing geeks, very hush hush :P |
| 12:31.47 | *** join/#openmoko ar0x (i=al@chocobo.soja.org) |
| 12:31.52 | *** join/#openmoko avihavai (n=avihavai@myntti.helsinki.fi) |
| 12:32.00 | CVirus | the devs got their GTA02 I guess |
| 12:33.30 | CVirus | Can the GTA01 place calls using OpenMoko instead of Qtopia ? |
| 12:34.38 | hrw | gta01 can make calls |
| 12:35.21 | CVirus | hrw: using OpenMoko ? |
| 12:35.23 | *** join/#openmoko Sup3rkiddo (n=sudharsh@unaffiliated/sudharsh) |
| 12:35.33 | hrw | yes |
| 12:36.19 | SpeedEvil | CVirus: there are (as I understand it) less than a dozen GTA02 that work well enough to boot. |
| 12:36.44 | SpeedEvil | CVirus: these are being used at the moment solely by the core team to do driver development. |
| 12:37.52 | CVirus | SpeedEvil: how many developers are there ? |
| 12:38.18 | mwester-road | Sigh. If the core team could just kick some lawyer in the groin until he coughs up the legal paperwork for the GPS driver, that would get the GTA01 a bit closer to working. Right now, FIC has nothing that has a complete set of drivers. |
| 12:38.46 | torpor | if only there were some way we could complain about it loudly enough that someone actually does something about it .. |
| 12:39.05 | Henryk | CVirus: yes, OpenMoko can place calls in general. it's somewhat flaky. For my current image (built 2007-10-18) it seems to be mostly reliable if I restart x exactly once after booting |
| 12:39.12 | abraxa_ | Complaining is of no use. They're working on it already. |
| 12:39.17 | *** join/#openmoko Sup3rkiddo (n=sudharsh@unaffiliated/sudharsh) |
| 12:39.35 | Henryk | mwester-laptop: huh? the way I understood it everything is fine with the gps legal-wise, now |
| 12:39.41 | mwester-road | torpor: I did, and as informed by openmoko that A) I'm not a customer and B) the driver exists, so even though it's not available it's not a problem. |
| 12:39.59 | mwester-road | Henryk: Nope. Still need a lawer to write up a documnet. |
| 12:40.00 | Henryk | the current problem is that the driver doesn't like EABI too well |
| 12:40.17 | mwester-road | Henryk: I think they've given up on that, and will release the old driver. |
| 12:40.22 | SpeedEvil | Henryk: nobody cares. A version in a chroot would be fine for many. |
| 12:41.47 | atul | hi installtion of .ipk on neo1973 gives error message like |
| 12:41.49 | atul | root@fic-gta01:~$ ipkg install projectname_1.0-r0_armv4t.ipk |
| 12:41.49 | atul | ipkg: atmycommand_1.0-r0_armv4t.ipk: No such file or directory |
| 12:41.49 | atul | Nothing to be done |
| 12:41.49 | atul | An error occurred, return value: 4. |
| 12:41.49 | atul | Collected errors: |
| 12:41.50 | atul | Cannot find package atmycommand_1.0-r0_armv4t.ipk. |
| 12:41.52 | atul | Check the spelling or perhaps run 'ipkg update' |
| 12:43.48 | mbuf | atul, don't flood the channel with more than 4 lines of text |
| 12:43.58 | hrw | ~pastebin |
| 12:43.59 | apt | pastebin is, like, a place to paste your stuff without flooding the channel - try http://pastebin.ca, or http://channels.debian.net/paste, or http://rafb.net/paste/, or http://pastebin.com is usually painfully too slow and unresponsive to use, use one of the other pastebin sites, or dpaste.com is a very nice pastebin as well |
| 12:44.20 | mbuf | atul, check where you have copied the .ipk |
| 12:44.24 | atul | apt, ya i know i remeber from next time new to this |
| 12:44.35 | hrw | atul: let me guess - package is atmcommand and you renamed ipkg file? |
| 12:44.52 | atul | hrw, no |
| 12:45.16 | atul | mbuf, i copied on to device directly |
| 12:45.34 | mbuf | atul, to which directory? check that |
| 12:46.09 | atul | mbuf, am not copying on to any folder thats why it gives problem |
| 12:46.13 | hrw | atul: if you install stuff not from feeds then you need to give all packages to ipkg |
| 12:46.23 | hrw | ipkg install projectname_1.0-r0_armv4t.ipk atmycommand_1.0-r0_armv4t.ipk |
| 12:46.31 | mbuf | atul, how did you copy? |
| 12:47.14 | atul | mbuf, root@fic-gta01:~$ ipkg install projectname_1.0-r0_armv4t.ipk |
| 12:47.30 | CVirus | What City in Taiwan will the Neo1973 be shipping from ? |
| 12:47.45 | mbuf | atul, uninstall old version? ipkg remove projectname; for atmycommand, use -nodeps option |
| 12:48.01 | abraxa_ | CVirus: It will ship from California (Fresno?) |
| 12:48.53 | *** join/#openmoko CVirus (n=GoD@82.201.174.66) |
| 12:49.54 | CVirus | What City in Taiwan will the Neo1973 be shipping from ? |
| 12:50.09 | SpeedEvil | It won't be |
| 12:50.13 | SpeedEvil | it ships to california |
| 12:50.16 | SpeedEvil | then outwards |
| 12:50.41 | abraxa_ | stefan_schmidt: ping |
| 12:50.43 | CVirus | huh ? |
| 12:50.49 | CVirus | SpeedEvil: I live in Egypt .. how will I get my phone ? |
| 12:51.10 | SpeedEvil | CVirus: they send it to you from california. |
| 12:51.21 | CVirus | SpeedEvil: UPS ? |
| 12:51.27 | SpeedEvil | dunno |
| 12:51.30 | SpeedEvil | some carrier. |
| 12:51.55 | hrw | CVirus: ups or dhl |
| 12:52.03 | *** join/#openmoko fcarvalho (n=fcarvalh@200.184.118.132) |
| 12:52.05 | hrw | I got first one via dhl, second one via ups |
| 12:52.14 | CVirus | hrw: which costs less ? |
| 12:54.04 | *** join/#openmoko icman (n=icman@123-240-172-21.cctv.dynamic.lsc.net.tw) |
| 12:54.18 | *** join/#openmoko chris^ (n=kraetzi@p548AC584.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 12:54.34 | SpeedEvil | They ship it via the cheapest method as I understand it. |
| 12:54.35 | SpeedEvil | (now) |
| 12:54.52 | hrw | CVirus: hard to tell - both had other values |
| 12:54.57 | *** join/#openmoko Ryushin (i=proxy@windwalker.openinnovations.com) |
| 12:55.44 | yang | is the price 300 usd for neo negotiable or fixed? |
| 12:55.56 | CVirus | 450$ rather |
| 12:56.00 | CVirus | for the GTA02 |
| 12:56.01 | yang | ouch |
| 12:56.09 | SpeedEvil | fixed. |
| 12:56.21 | SpeedEvil | Negotiable probably if you order large multiples. |
| 12:56.25 | yang | i haven't seen any selling through other sites (ebay) |
| 12:56.43 | SpeedEvil | There have I think been a couple of auctions on ebay. |
| 12:57.21 | SpeedEvil | But just of individuals neos. |
| 12:57.49 | yang | does openmoko works well on motorola a780? |
| 12:58.33 | yang | i have seen some movie about openmoko boot |
| 12:58.36 | *** join/#openmoko Q_Continuum (n=Q@71-215-231-251.mpls.qwest.net) |
| 12:58.51 | SpeedEvil | yang: there is a link on the wiki frontpage to all phones that it's been found to work on |
| 12:58.59 | SpeedEvil | at the beginning |
| 12:59.11 | SpeedEvil | however, this is very much a user effort only. |
| 13:00.19 | yang | ok, its worth trying it out |
| 13:00.49 | *** join/#openmoko hardskinone (n=hardskin@81-208-31-222.ip.fastwebnet.it) |
| 13:02.19 | CVirus | it will cost me approximately 540$ to get the Neo1973 :-( |
| 13:02.39 | *** join/#openmoko dread_ (n=madmas@xdsl-87-78-207-199.netcologne.de) |
| 13:02.51 | *** join/#openmoko funktio (n=funktio@80-248-242-86.cust.suomicom.fi) |
| 13:04.28 | CVirus | approximately 3250 Egyptian Pounts :-( |
| 13:04.30 | ScaredyCat | pfft... think yourself lucky... mine cost more and had high delivery costs then I got hit for local taxes too :'( |
| 13:04.55 | CVirus | ScaredyCat: where do you live ? |
| 13:04.57 | swel024 | sux 2 b u ScaredyCat |
| 13:05.03 | CVirus | LOL |
| 13:05.25 | ScaredyCat | Netherlands CVirus |
| 13:05.37 | CVirus | I guess it's a better choice to ask someone from california to buy it for me and get it when he's coming to Egypt |
| 13:05.38 | ScaredyCat | swel024: yeah, and I get it 24x7 :/ |
| 13:05.48 | CVirus | ScaredyCat: how much did you pay for taxes ? |
| 13:06.08 | ScaredyCat | 86 Euro iirc |
| 13:06.21 | swel024 | CVirus: lol chances are i can get my sister from california to bring it over when she comes over next may |
| 13:06.28 | ScaredyCat | so about $100 ish |
| 13:06.32 | *** join/#openmoko Magon (n=Magon@archangel.kolej.mff.cuni.cz) |
| 13:06.33 | CVirus | swel024: lucky you |
| 13:06.34 | *** join/#openmoko berkus (n=berkus@87-119-191-142.tll.elisa.ee) |
| 13:06.41 | Xx13 | it was 60e in .fi |
| 13:06.56 | *** join/#openmoko ruxpin_ (n=mikael@Catalyst-53.pspt.fi) |
| 13:07.53 | swel024 | luckily i didnt get stung with taxes |
| 13:08.15 | *** join/#openmoko derFrank (n=Frank@P9302.p.pppool.de) |
| 13:08.46 | Xx13 | i think the whole package ended up around 300e |
| 13:09.48 | *** join/#openmoko Sup3rkid` (n=sudharsh@59.92.23.31) |
| 13:10.06 | CVirus | you lucky bastards |
| 13:10.24 | ScaredyCat | that's in euro not usd CVirus |
| 13:10.53 | swel024 | i payed about 400 for mine :S |
| 13:11.00 | CVirus | ScaredyCat: I understand |
| 13:11.00 | ScaredyCat | bear in ming the dollar has plumeted recently |
| 13:11.08 | ScaredyCat | s/ming/mind/ |
| 13:11.11 | Xx13 | still think it a pretty good deal ;) |
| 13:11.21 | ScaredyCat | it#s a better deal now :) |
| 13:11.25 | swel024 | i was lucky that i bought mine last time the dollar plumeted |
| 13:11.55 | *** join/#openmoko k-s[WORK] (n=gustavo@200.184.118.132) |
| 13:12.17 | Xx13 | ScaredyCat: not that much change in past couple of month |
| 13:12.20 | gi-el | BEER IN MIND! |
| 13:17.06 | *** join/#openmoko bahadunn (n=bahadunn@65.75.116.48) |
| 13:17.25 | bahadunn | any site for news on neo 1973? |
| 13:17.32 | bahadunn | when will it be available? |
| 13:18.04 | bedboi | check the topic |
| 13:18.08 | *** join/#openmoko Ryback_ (n=ulisses@200.184.118.132) |
| 13:19.15 | bahadunn | okay |
| 13:19.18 | *** part/#openmoko bahadunn (n=bahadunn@65.75.116.48) |
| 13:19.25 | *** join/#openmoko Sup3rkiddo (n=sudharsh@unaffiliated/sudharsh) |
| 13:21.42 | Clint | it's far too verbose |
| 13:22.03 | *** join/#openmoko crunchywelch (n=welch@208.118.160.90) |
| 13:22.46 | cjb_ie | it falls off the end of my terminal (200ish chars) |
| 13:24.23 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@139.80-202-160.nextgentel.com) |
| 13:26.24 | *** join/#openmoko xsdf (n=xsdf@82-39-185-200.cable.ubr01.benw.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 13:28.48 | zash | cjb_ie: 200x..? how small font/big screen do you have then? |
| 13:29.34 | cjb_ie | screen 1280px wide, font 6px |
| 13:30.00 | cjb_ie | my phone has 320px and 4px :-) |
| 13:30.02 | CIA-13 | openmoko: 03chris * r3286 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/applications/openmoko-today2/src/today-launcher.c: Try saving files before committing |
| 13:31.04 | cjb_ie | i'd like one of those 1920x1200 laptop |
| 13:31.18 | ScaredyCat | Xx13: 2.05 usd == 1gbp |
| 13:31.18 | cjb_ie | in 15" |
| 13:31.23 | zash | cjb_ie: so, ~fullscreen-ish terminals then? |
| 13:31.28 | cjb_ie | zash: yup |
| 13:31.30 | CVirus | Drupal on an N810 http://foolab.org/node/1715 |
| 13:31.58 | cjb_ie | fluxbox and a bunch of desktops to switch between |
| 13:32.46 | xsdf | hello |
| 13:32.48 | CVirus | I'm moving to fluxbox if I don't buy more RAM |
| 13:32.54 | xsdf | what is the purpose of the openmoko/ |
| 13:33.08 | CVirus | troll ? |
| 13:33.11 | *** join/#openmoko ynezz (i=ynezz@ibawizard.net) |
| 13:33.13 | cjb_ie | that's an impressively open-ended question... |
| 13:33.21 | xzcvczx | xsdf: eventually missile operating system |
| 13:33.27 | CVirus | OpenMoko is a GNU / Linux based open software development platform. |
| 13:34.07 | zash | .. for mobile devices.. |
| 13:34.38 | zash | and NUCLEAR WARHEADS! |
| 13:34.40 | xsdf | i mean, what are you gentlemen using it for that cannot be done using an ordinary phone platform |
| 13:34.46 | xsdf | seriously, i am curious |
| 13:34.58 | mwester-road | Egads! And all this time I thought I was working on an improved cattle feeding device! :( |
| 13:35.18 | hrw | zash: nuclear warheads are also mobile ;) |
| 13:35.19 | sagacis | mwester, I used to work on embedded devices to milk cows |
| 13:35.19 | zash | xsdf: 'ordinary phone platforms' is not as open as this one |
| 13:35.21 | xzcvczx | xsdf: have you had a good look at www.openmoko.org or .com |
| 13:35.23 | sagacis | REALLY. |
| 13:35.43 | SpeedEvil | wiki.openmoko.org |
| 13:35.54 | berkus | xsdf: what is "ordinary phone platform"? |
| 13:35.58 | xsdf | yes i have just been reading the websites |
| 13:36.20 | xzcvczx | xsdf: read them again |
| 13:36.27 | xsdf | berkus, one where you can make applications for it but not fiddle with the low level details of the phone |
| 13:36.38 | berkus | openmoko IS an ordinary phone platform. open and linux based. |
| 13:37.19 | xsdf | i am just wondering by having this level of openness in a phone, how it benefits |
| 13:37.32 | berkus | well. tremendously |
| 13:37.45 | berkus | you're basically free to do anything with it |
| 13:38.03 | berkus | make your own looks. make your own feel. sell it. lend it. purchase it. |
| 13:38.08 | cjb_ie | xsdf: look at all the iphone users' complaints... |
| 13:38.12 | *** join/#openmoko Sup3rkiddo (n=sudharsh@unaffiliated/sudharsh) |
| 13:38.19 | xsdf | cjb_ie, not sure what you mean? |
| 13:38.35 | cjb_ie | and hacks |
| 13:38.39 | berkus | not 'users' rather than 'hackers' complaints |
| 13:38.46 | berkus | users are happy, but limited |
| 13:39.35 | xsdf | i mean, you have phone like the nokia n70, where you can write and use java applications on it - i am trying to understand the added benefit of having not just an open application API but an open source operating system |
| 13:39.36 | abraxa_ | berkus: With a completely open platform like OpenMoko you have the possibility to alter *anything* in *any* way you want so it fits *your* needs. |
| 13:40.15 | xsdf | what sort of examples of things that can be done with openmoko but not on other platforms? |
| 13:40.16 | *** join/#openmoko dneary (n=dneary@mne69-9-88-163-116-163.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 13:40.42 | xzcvczx | xsdf: adding hardware to the phone and being able to use it |
| 13:40.47 | berkus | abraxa_: thanks, like i didn't know :P |
| 13:41.30 | xsdf | xzcvczx, do you mean like, the openmoko phone has expansion slots to plug extra devices in to it?? |
| 13:41.52 | xsdf | that would be interesting |
| 13:42.03 | xzcvczx | xsdf: but it seems to me you dont have any brains so you jsut have to use what other people have made anyway so you may as well just not bother and go buy a nokia |
| 13:42.38 | xsdf | xzcvczx, no need to be like that. i am just looking for real world examples of how it is useful |
| 13:43.05 | berkus | it is. i can mess with gsmd trying to make it do f*cking SOMETHING for a couple of days. |
| 13:43.27 | abraxa_ | berkus: Sorry, I meant xsdf. |
| 13:43.29 | berkus | you know, you can't have such fun with nokia |
| 13:43.37 | *** join/#openmoko holycow (n=new@mail.wjsgroup.com) |
| 13:43.40 | wibbit | berkus: I got the impression gsmd was very proficient at not working, it shouldn't be too hard to get it to carry on doing that :) |
| 13:44.41 | xsdf | what sort of things are you guys personally going to have on your openmoko phones that is unavailable on any other phone? |
| 13:44.42 | xzcvczx | you can create a program that if some ****er steals your phone and puts a different simcard in you can make it text you the gps location every ten minutes you can then folllow said ****er and cut his nads off |
| 13:44.52 | abraxa_ | xsdf: Real world example is easy - imagine having BT PAN or WiFi at home. The Neo can be a VoIP phone when in range and a GSM phone otherwise. It also could automatically synchronise the phonebook/ToDo list/whatever when it sees you're at home |
| 13:45.19 | cjb_ie | xsdf: you can write a driver for a random bluetooth device without having to spend thousands just to sign an NDA and get the SDK |
| 13:45.47 | xsdf | thanks, those are interesting examples. i am beginning to understand now |
| 13:45.49 | hrw | abraxa_: n95 can handle voip too |
| 13:47.17 | wibbit | xsdf: For me personally, right now I don't think there is a particular thing that it will have out of the box that I can't get on another phone. I am not aware for example of any specific effort to get it to sync with Evolution (that is not to say it can't). |
| 13:47.17 | berkus | wibbit: true. i'm trying to convince it do otherwise tho :) |
| 13:47.59 | berkus | xsdf: example - using wiimote to dial numbers on your phone :) |
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| 13:48.14 | xzcvczx | berkus: haha nice |
| 13:48.20 | wibbit | xsdf: However, I currently have a Nokia E70, and there have been three "firmware" updates for this phone, however due to some effing about between Nokia and Vodafone, the update has not been made available to my phone, and I am stuk with the frankly sub standard service. |
| 13:48.36 | wibbit | xsdf: I am of the opinion things like this will not be happening with the OpenMoko |
| 13:48.41 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@66.37.59.194.nauticom.net) |
| 13:48.50 | wibbit | If a fix is made, it will be made available to me, at the same time as any one else. |
| 13:49.12 | xsdf | i see what you mean, there will be a better communication between the developers and the users |
| 13:49.23 | xsdf | due to the nature of the project |
| 13:49.33 | wibbit | xsdf: I never said that either ;) |
| 13:49.49 | xsdf | thought that's what you meant :) |
| 13:49.57 | wibbit | xsdf: I hope that, that will be the case, but it isn't always |
| 13:49.58 | abraxa_ | xsdf: That, and you can just change things you don't like. |
| 13:56.35 | ScaredyCat | don't be so unfriendly |
| 13:56.56 | ScaredyCat | oops.. sorry... scrollback-ism |
| 13:57.35 | torpor | xsdf: i've got a full deve environment on my phone now. i could easily just take this phone somewhere and work. it is almost a laptop replacement. |
| 13:57.39 | torpor | thats a big step for a phone. |
| 13:58.11 | ScaredyCat | what are you developing in torpor - basic ? |
| 13:58.41 | ScaredyCat | coding with a touchscreen keyboard != my idea of fun |
| 13:58.57 | torpor | ScaredyCat: python, c/c++ .. |
| 13:59.11 | torpor | and remember: i have bt keyboard action happening. its a lovely little setup to be honest. |
| 13:59.22 | ScaredyCat | which keyboard / |
| 13:59.23 | ScaredyCat | ? |
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| 14:00.18 | torpor | lear |
| 14:00.22 | torpor | apple bluetooth keyboard |
| 14:00.24 | torpor | wireless .. |
| 14:00.27 | torpor | beautiful thing |
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| 14:01.31 | *** part/#openmoko dtx (n=dtx@cdf-imaging.com) |
| 14:02.31 | CIA-13 | openmoko: 03chris * r3287 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/applications/openmoko-today2/ (ChangeLog src/today-task-manager.c): |
| 14:02.31 | CIA-13 | openmoko: * src/today-task-manager.c: (today_task_manager_raise_clicked_cb): |
| 14:02.31 | CIA-13 | openmoko: Remove debug comment that leaked in |
| 14:05.23 | *** join/#openmoko tnb (n=tnb@sdgsystems.net) |
| 14:13.09 | ScaredyCat | so not a foldy uppy one then torpor? |
| 14:16.42 | *** join/#openmoko homyx (n=homyx@ppp-88-217-28-41.dynamic.mnet-online.de) |
| 14:16.49 | torpor | no the apple one which is just as good for the job and quite solid too .. |
| 14:16.53 | torpor | its very portable. |
| 14:17.09 | ScaredyCat | no bt quirks with the neo then? |
| 14:18.42 | abraxa_ | SpeedEvil: ping |
| 14:20.08 | *** join/#openmoko amarsh04 (n=amarsh04@CPE-58-170-92-19.sa.bigpond.net.au) |
| 14:20.24 | torpor | ScaredyCat: nope it just plain works. |
| 14:20.52 | *** join/#openmoko StylusEater_Work (n=StylusEa@148.141.31.89) |
| 14:21.49 | *** join/#openmoko sebastian_ (n=sebastia@grads-53.phy.duke.edu) |
| 14:24.39 | sebastian_ | Hi folks, I'd like to know if the Neo would be capable of FUSE support. I know you'd like to use a 2.6. kernel... I heavily use SSHFS and find it very handy (secure, fast and easy). Has this been discussed? |
| 14:25.28 | *** part/#openmoko xsdf (n=xsdf@82-39-185-200.cable.ubr01.benw.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 14:25.34 | StylusEater_Work | I'd imagine you can, but I'm not sure the current build file has it enabled for the kernel. |
| 14:25.50 | *** join/#openmoko rd_ (n=dr@vnsecurity.net) |
| 14:26.10 | StylusEater_Work | sebastian: if you rebuild the kernel with that feature you probably can |
| 14:26.16 | ScaredyCat | yeah, you should be able to use it... |
| 14:26.25 | StylusEater_Work | sebastian: you'll have to check the recent .config for the 2.6 kernel build |
| 14:26.27 | sebastian_ | I see... that |
| 14:26.30 | sebastian_ | 's nice to hear |
| 14:26.32 | StylusEater_Work | it might be there... |
| 14:27.10 | sebastian_ | what about the performance? since it is encrypted, there will be some CPU load... |
| 14:27.44 | ScaredyCat | yes, there would be, but that's the price you pay for security |
| 14:28.00 | *** join/#openmoko orospakr (n=orospakr@132.213.238.4) |
| 14:28.03 | zash | but, nfs? |
| 14:28.25 | *** join/#openmoko j_ack (n=j_ack@p5B3BB0D6.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 14:28.27 | zash | nfs through vpn over gprs! |
| 14:28.58 | StylusEater_Work | but faster "arms" should lead to better performance over time... :-) |
| 14:30.26 | ScaredyCat | plus at least with sshfs you can be sure that noone is reading anyhting from that free wifi hotspot |
| 14:30.27 | sebastian_ | I really like mounting my server's music drive and streaming music (need's wifi, yes) and security would be necessary too (copyright...) |
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| 14:31.04 | *** part/#openmoko Elessar_81 (n=Andreas@p5B05B861.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 14:31.15 | sebastian_ | ScaredyCat: right |
| 14:31.25 | ScaredyCat | errm |
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| 14:33.04 | ScaredyCat | but you don't need sshfs for that... just tunnel it... |
| 14:33.06 | sebastian_ | pls explain. |
| 14:34.09 | ScaredyCat | slimserver will stream audio, uses a web interface. on the receiving side use mpg123 to receive the stream |
| 14:34.19 | ScaredyCat | tunel both through ssh |
| 14:34.22 | ScaredyCat | tunnel |
| 14:34.38 | ScaredyCat | eg ssh -D 5555 myserver.com |
| 14:35.20 | sebastian_ | sounds good, I didn |
| 14:35.25 | sebastian_ | 't think about that |
| 14:35.26 | ScaredyCat | use keys and there's no logging in, it can all be part of the basic startup script |
| 14:35.47 | ScaredyCat | and torpor could probably knock up a little python gui for it |
| 14:37.39 | *** join/#openmoko fobos (n=fobos@78.90.88.72) |
| 14:37.43 | sebastian_ | ah, good to hear... I guess other had the same thoughts before |
| 14:40.38 | sebastian_ | thanks and have a nice day! |
| 14:40.58 | ScaredyCat | and you :D |
| 14:40.58 | ScaredyCat | woo!! |
| 14:40.58 | abraxa_ | rofl |
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| 14:47.32 | abraxa_ | Did anyone here check out QVGA mode yet? It doesn't quite work for me, unfortunately. |
| 14:47.59 | xzcvczx | grrr one thing i hate about macs is there love of making random noises :S |
| 14:48.19 | summatusmentis | xzcvczx: you can turn off some of those in System Preferences |
| 14:48.50 | xzcvczx | problem is i dunno what each one means |
| 14:48.50 | *** join/#openmoko ^leo^ (n=user@r190-64-3-136.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy) |
| 14:50.27 | zash | xzcvczx: disable them all! |
| 14:51.22 | xzcvczx | lol |
| 14:52.00 | zash | notification-sounds from im-clients are from hell too |
| 14:52.40 | zash | stuff may only do sounds if one is not paying attension to them |
| 14:53.12 | xzcvczx | and then only if you want to speak to said person |
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| 14:57.00 | cjb_ie | SpeedEvil: did you see http://lea.hamradio.si/~s53mv/navsats/theory.html on #osm ? |
| 15:00.08 | SpeedEvil | no |
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| 15:01.40 | SpeedEvil | See the page linked off the Hammerhead/Protocol page on the wiki for more in depth info. |
| 15:01.57 | *** join/#openmoko wolog (n=wolog@lavalette.guerrier.info) |
| 15:02.30 | SpeedEvil | Building a GPS reciever is not hard, and hasn't been for some time. |
| 15:03.01 | SpeedEvil | Building a low-power, small, accurate one still is. (without using premade chips) |
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| 15:08.15 | xzcvczx | sweet....... |
| 15:09.19 | abraxa_ | torporAWAY: Was it you who asked for a cross-compile toolchain without the OE overhead? |
| 15:11.41 | StylusEater_Work | you can just rip the cross compilers out... |
| 15:11.47 | StylusEater_Work | and the libs |
| 15:11.51 | SpeedEvil | abraxa_: I think there have been many dozen at least making that implied comment. |
| 15:12.09 | StylusEater_Work | set CC... no? |
| 15:12.48 | *** join/#openmoko mindCrime (n=chatzill@66.83.208.218.nw.nuvox.net) |
| 15:12.52 | abraxa_ | SpeedEvil: Was wondering if those people saw http://buildhost.openmoko.org/OM2007.2/tmp/deploy/sdk/ and evaluated it |
| 15:13.06 | SpeedEvil | dunno |
| 15:13.08 | *** join/#openmoko Penguin (n=Pen9u1n@123.103.29.250) |
| 15:13.09 | abraxa_ | So if it comes up again you might wanna point them there |
| 15:13.18 | SpeedEvil | what is it? |
| 15:13.33 | Penguin | hi there:) |
| 15:15.57 | abraxa_ | SpeedEvil: I haven't looked at it myself but openmoko-P1-September-Snapshot-20070918-arm-toolchain.tar.bz2 sounds rather promising to me. |
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| 15:25.45 | xzcvczx | anyone know what package gives you file? |
| 15:26.30 | Vegar | the file package? |
| 15:26.44 | Vegar | (just a guess - that's what it's called in debian/ubuntu) |
| 15:27.28 | xzcvczx | nah tried that already |
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| 15:31.30 | *** join/#openmoko Moniker42 (n=sean@87-194-119-253.bethere.co.uk) |
| 15:31.38 | Moniker42 | GTA02 release is on december 20th? |
| 15:31.53 | xzcvczx | Moniker42: topic!!! |
| 15:32.48 | Moniker42 | does it have wifi? is there a camera? what kind of gps will it have? where can GTA01 sales on the web? :) |
| 15:33.15 | SpeedEvil | topic, topic, topic, topic |
| 15:33.25 | xzcvczx | wheres a knife |
| 15:33.51 | gamin | has anybody run festival speech synthesis? |
| 15:34.40 | SpeedEvil | gamin: a long time ago. (not on neo) |
| 15:34.47 | Moniker42 | xzcvczx, what i was actually coming in here to say was to comment on the release being five days before christmas |
| 15:34.54 | Moniker42 | won't there be a mad rush to get it before xmas? |
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| 15:36.09 | *** join/#openmoko rd_ (n=dr@vnsecurity.net) |
| 15:36.41 | abraxa_ | Moniker42: That "Christmas guess" is just that - a guess |
| 15:37.05 | Moniker42 | christmas guess? |
| 15:37.06 | abraxa_ | Personally I don't think it'll be available in 2007, though of course I would be happy to be proven wrong |
| 15:37.12 | gamin | SpeedEvil: okay, just started to build flite. Am curious to see if it works |
| 15:37.19 | Moniker42 | what i mean is... wouldn't it have been sensible to release it ~2weeks earlier or later? :) |
| 15:37.34 | abraxa_ | Moniker42: That's not an official statement, mind you |
| 15:37.52 | Moniker42 | abraxa_, ah so the 20th december isn't a set-in-stone date? |
| 15:38.13 | abraxa_ | Not at all, yeah |
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| 15:38.46 | Moniker42 | ah good |
| 15:38.47 | SpeedEvil | Moniker42: that timeline was solely a guess, based on semi-official information, and estimates based on previous timelines |
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| 15:39.06 | Moniker42 | i was just thinking "20th december? what a silly date..." i need to convince and wait for a friend of mine to buy his first |
| 15:39.06 | viq | AFAIK it's a guess someone made, and the devs decided it's as good as any and didn't deny it officialy ;) |
| 15:39.21 | StylusEater_Work | so has anyone here used the qtopia build on the neo yet? |
| 15:39.32 | Moniker42 | i want to make sure it's better than the iphone / isn't too heavy / what colour i want it in first :) |
| 15:39.55 | viq | Well, I know I don't want the orange one, so that doesn't leave many options ;) |
| 15:40.25 | viq | I had one in my hands and the impression is that it's a bit on the large side, but I don't think I would call it too large. |
| 15:40.33 | rcostine | anyone know if there's ever going to be a working OSS GPS driver for the GTA01? Failing that, Is there a way to purchase the "proprietary" gllin one from Global Locate? |
| 15:40.38 | StylusEater_Work | Moniker42: you're comparing apples to oranges when it comes to the iphone IMHO |
| 15:40.50 | *** join/#openmoko lampus (n=stotz@212-41-124-179.adsl.solnet.ch) |
| 15:40.53 | StylusEater_Work | Moniker42: and IMHO it already is better just by virtue of the community and open framework |
| 15:41.39 | SpeedEvil | rcostine: A) pay me and the team working on the OSS driver in some way (it's kind of stalled) B) hope for someone to send you. Do you have a GTA01? |
| 15:41.52 | xzcvczx | rcostine: its going through eula at the moment apparently |
| 15:42.05 | rcostine | yes. got it about a week ago. |
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| 15:42.26 | SpeedEvil | The OSS driver has pretty much stalled after the revelation that there will only be a few thousand of them, and it won't be the same chipset as in GTA02 |
| 15:43.35 | xzcvczx | SpeedEvil: how far through do you reckon the oss is? |
| 15:43.35 | rcostine | SpeedEvil: got ya |
| 15:44.47 | SpeedEvil | xzcvczx: well - some way off. |
| 15:45.22 | SpeedEvil | xzcvczx: we basically can (in principle, working code has not been released in a usable form) track satellite speeds. |
| 15:45.49 | *** join/#openmoko fo0bar (n=fo0bar@feh.colobox.com) |
| 15:45.58 | SpeedEvil | xzcvczx: roughly. We can't as of yet decode the navigation messages they are sending, or do timing of the incoming signal, that requires more analysis. |
| 15:45.58 | gamin | oh that's neat - flite works right out of the box! |
| 15:46.34 | SpeedEvil | xzcvczx: so we have a position to within 1000Km within 60 minutes or so. |
| 15:47.11 | SpeedEvil | xzcvczx: to do more we need to work out how the navigation messages are recieved by the chip, and how the synchronisation is done. |
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| 15:47.50 | xzcvczx | ah ok |
| 15:47.59 | Moniker42 | StylusEater_Work, haha.. apples and oranges ;) |
| 15:48.02 | SpeedEvil | xzcvczx: once we have this, there are a number of rough code projects out there that could be attached to this to give a rough position. More accurate positioning is then simply tweaking it. |
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| 15:48.15 | *** join/#openmoko ckuethe (n=ckuethe@S0106000024c38a18.ed.shawcable.net) |
| 15:49.13 | SpeedEvil | But again, perhaps several hundred hours of work to get from the current status to that. At best. And for maybe 200 people who might run it, ... |
| 15:49.55 | SpeedEvil | If it might have ended up as the driver on GTA02, then work would have continued with much more energy. |
| 15:50.34 | *** join/#openmoko matsimoto (n=barmeier@dslb-088-072-010-241.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 15:50.36 | *** join/#openmoko Mek (n=marijn@s55917044.adsl.wanadoo.nl) |
| 15:51.06 | xzcvczx | oh yup |
| 15:51.16 | *** join/#openmoko sladen (i=paul@starsky.19inch.net) |
| 15:51.21 | matsimoto | hi out there, does anybody know if mixer settings are stored in the flash ? |
| 15:51.40 | Moniker42 | any chance of 3g on the neo? |
| 15:52.04 | viq | Moniker42: not on this one |
| 15:52.12 | viq | most likely not on next one either. |
| 15:52.13 | SpeedEvil | matsimoto: no |
| 15:52.39 | Moniker42 | viq, oh well =( |
| 15:53.04 | rcostine | btw, i downloaded and built (in the "wrongly" style - cross-compiled on my FC6 machine) the Hammerhead satscan code, just to see if the GPS would find a working satellite. It would scan with questionmarks (?) in the _|_ , but no "*" showed up in any of the slots. |
| 15:53.14 | matsimoto | I have removed the battery over night but my mixer settigs are the same as yesterday ! do you know how this work ? |
| 15:55.05 | SpeedEvil | rcostine: I don't know - I haven't used it |
| 15:55.12 | xzcvczx | whats utc time at the moment |
| 15:55.22 | SpeedEvil | Fri Oct 26 16:55:20 BST 2007 |
| 15:55.25 | SpeedEvil | -1h |
| 15:55.47 | xzcvczx | hmmmm i am getting the time |
| 15:57.07 | abraxa_ | matsimoto: ALSA saves them |
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| 15:59.01 | matsimoto | abbraxa_: as file in the filesystem ? |
| 16:00.01 | SpeedEvil | yes |
| 16:00.04 | SpeedEvil | why? |
| 16:00.53 | rcostine | SpeedEvil: sorry, i misspoke. i downloaded and built hhtest.c - that seemed to give a x00 the first time i fired it up, then the same hex stream afterwards. the satscan is in an ipkg - binary only. I was trying to see of the gps device would give back something, to make sure it was working. |
| 16:01.32 | *** join/#openmoko heikkit (n=chatzill@c-67-188-122-139.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 16:01.46 | SpeedEvil | It probably needs the hardware initialised first, I'm unsure. |
| 16:01.56 | *** join/#openmoko rob_w (n=bob@X0984.x.pppool.de) |
| 16:02.18 | matsimoto | I have read, that write operations to a flash will "wash out the" the flash. logs, tmp alsa etc will write very often to the flash. Is there a risk of "washing out" the internal flash ? |
| 16:02.24 | SpeedEvil | no |
| 16:02.37 | SpeedEvil | The flash has 100kwrites/cell |
| 16:02.43 | SpeedEvil | It automatically wear levels. |
| 16:02.56 | SpeedEvil | This should not be a problem in practice, even if you swap to the flash. |
| 16:03.39 | matsimoto | ok, thanks. What doe you mean with "It automatically wear levels." ? |
| 16:04.15 | xzcvczx | matsimoto: shares writes over the cells to not kill some |
| 16:05.47 | SpeedEvil | It means that you can write to the main flash 13107200000 times (with 512 byte blocks) before the capacity decreases below the nominal 64M |
| 16:06.43 | rcostine | fwiw... some triumphs: jalimo, cacao work on my phone. I ran Java code that i wrote and compiled with the SUN JDK on my i386 laptop and scp-ed it to the /media/card. it invoked the maverick free ssh client lib, and worked identically as it did on the host. A good sign. |
| 16:07.46 | SpeedEvil | Expressed in another way - you can write 1.7 gigabytes to the 64M flash every day for 10 years |
| 16:08.13 | matsimoto | So, this is handled by the filesystem driver or the hardware ? |
| 16:08.41 | matsimoto | 1.7Gb for 10 years ... should be enough. |
| 16:09.01 | SpeedEvil | filesystem |
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| 16:11.51 | *** join/#openmoko abraxa__ (n=abraxa@pD95FFA29.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 16:12.56 | rcostine | and i was finally able to manually make a GSM call (cu -l /dev/ttySAC0... AT sequences... blah blah) in the US with my AT&T SIM - one that the current carrier docs indicate should work. echo "1" to the gsm device still wedges the unit tho. Even with the 10/22 devel rootfs and kernel. Have to hard boot it to get it to go again. |
| 16:13.03 | *** join/#openmoko ossman (n=drzeus@gateway.drzeus.cx) |
| 16:15.11 | rcostine | only the devel rootfs contained the cu command, so i had to reflash to get it. nothing in the current documentation indicates the difference between the devel and non-devel rootfs images. |
| 16:16.36 | rcostine | gsmd still fails with the dead modem message. |
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| 16:21.15 | *** join/#openmoko jujun (n=JulienN@LPuteaux-151-42-19-56.w193-252.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 16:21.50 | folken | any way to prevent puppet from dying if it cannot reach puppetmaster? |
| 16:22.13 | *** join/#openmoko aexin (n=brootvor@unaffiliated/aevin) |
| 16:22.32 | xzcvczx | no because puppet has no life without a master |
| 16:23.22 | folken | xzcvczx: argh to operate irssi over umts is a bit tricky. |
| 16:23.28 | folken | sorry wrong channel. |
| 16:23.35 | *** join/#openmoko CVirus (n=GoD@82.201.174.66) |
| 16:24.06 | folken | xzcvczx: there always have to be two. ;) |
| 16:24.20 | xzcvczx | :P |
| 16:27.51 | rcostine | also, bridging the usb and eth interfaces together on the host works just fine, and after modding the interfaces file on the neo to use dhcp, it will dynamically get the address. |
| 16:29.41 | rcostine | one caveat, you have to keep trying to add the usb0 interface to the bridge on the host while the neo is powering up. if you wait too long the unit fails to get an address, too soon and usb is not there on the host yet. |
| 16:29.55 | *** join/#openmoko vivijim (n=vivijim@200.184.118.132) |
| 16:31.37 | berkus | rcostine: care to log that somewhere? |
| 16:31.47 | berkus | (the calling/gsmd part esp.) |
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| 16:34.51 | rcostine | berkus: the call that i made only lasted for about a minute before it dropped, tho. I followed the directions under "manually using GSM" in the wiki. |
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| 16:35.17 | roh | rcostine you could add the brctl add.. into the ifup handler on your distro |
| 16:35.18 | berkus | rcostine: ok. i'm going to mingle with gsm directly through u-boot |
| 16:35.52 | berkus | currently i'm not getting any RSTR back after the first reply :\ |
| 16:36.43 | abraxa_ | roh / Henryk: Did either one of you try out QVGA mode yet? |
| 16:36.54 | roh | abraxa_ nope |
| 16:37.08 | abraxa_ | Thanks roh |
| 16:37.16 | roh | abraxa_ i understood it could work now, but there is still no ocupling of lcm controller and framebuffer yet |
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| 16:37.48 | roh | abraxa_ when that is solved it should be one fbset call and everything is fine. |
| 16:38.06 | abraxa_ | roh: I tried it with the instructions in Stefan's mail but my Neo only shows a garbled display |
| 16:38.11 | abraxa_ | Hence my question :) |
| 16:38.31 | roh | abraxa_ ;) |
| 16:40.48 | rcostine | berkus: before it dropped, there was a load of noise in the headphones, then a NO CARRIER. It's a little inconvienient for me to test the calling stuff, since I have to pry the SIM out of my ancient working nokia, and put it into the neo. Meanwhile, if a call comes in, i'll miss it. |
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| 16:43.59 | *** part/#openmoko zedstar (n=john@sr-fw1.router.uk.clara.net) |
| 16:44.51 | *** join/#openmoko freelock (n=john@foraker.freelock.com) |
| 16:48.06 | berkus | rcostine: same here. i take my sim out of my regular phone. convenient tho - nobody can call in :) |
| 16:48.58 | Henryk | xzcvczx: or grow fingernails |
| 16:49.36 | xzcvczx | lol or get my fingers modified like that idiot for the iphone |
| 16:54.50 | CVirus | What software will be used to allow the device to vibrate on incoming calls ? |
| 16:56.24 | ScaredyCat | ? |
| 16:56.31 | ScaredyCat | it already vibrates |
| 16:57.19 | CVirus | how ? |
| 16:57.47 | ckuethe | a little vibrator motor inside. |
| 16:58.15 | CVirus | What driver handles this vibrator ? |
| 16:58.37 | abraxa_ | CVirus: Kernel driver via sysfs |
| 16:58.40 | ScaredyCat | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973_Hardware#Vibrator |
| 16:59.02 | *** join/#openmoko arw1 (i=familia@201.244.110.72) |
| 17:00.17 | cjb_ie | OSS competition for http://www.vibelet.com/ ? :-) |
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| 17:05.34 | *** part/#openmoko AcI1 (n=1@net12.mlyniec.gda.pl) |
| 17:06.32 | abraxa_ | cjb_ie: It could actually be a nice toy if you had various intensity levels instead of just on/off ;) |
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| 17:11.06 | xzcvczx | wow that was pretty accurate for the middle of the cbd with tall buildings |
| 17:11.09 | Henryk | open source teledildonics? |
| 17:11.55 | Henryk | abraxa_: bonus point: the neo1973 has no sharp edges == easier insertion |
| 17:12.32 | russellb | o.O |
| 17:12.35 | Henryk | (into its pouch of course! pervert) |
| 17:12.40 | xzcvczx | my gf was too tight for it |
| 17:12.55 | abraxa_ | lol |
| 17:12.56 | xzcvczx | money wise :P |
| 17:13.01 | russellb | lol |
| 17:13.14 | *** join/#openmoko Cap_J_L_Picard (n=ewanm89@134.219.165.21) |
| 17:13.31 | mjr | but I hear you can train that |
| 17:14.09 | abraxa_ | Ahh, I'd rather not ;) |
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| 17:15.08 | xzcvczx | trust one person to take it too far |
| 17:15.11 | xzcvczx | :S |
| 17:15.36 | mjr | what, who, where? |
| 17:17.01 | mmontour | rcostine - are you still online? |
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| 17:22.56 | CIA-13 | openmoko: 03andrew * r3288 10/trunk/src/host/qemu-neo1973/phonesim/ (74 files in 4 dirs): Import a phonesim version modified to be buildable out-of-qtopia-tree. |
| 17:23.04 | cjb_ie | abraxa_: how about pulse width modulation? |
| 17:23.26 | *** join/#openmoko behdad (n=behdad@net2.senecac.on.ca) |
| 17:23.49 | abraxa_ | cjb_ie: No idea how granular that would be - maybe the SoC has a PWM we can use... no idea :) |
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| 17:24.31 | *** part/#openmoko Testadiquarzo (n=opera@ppp128-165.adsl.forthnet.gr) |
| 17:29.26 | CVirus | How many OpenMoko core devs are funded by the FIC ? |
| 17:30.12 | abraxa_ | My personal guess would be ~10 people for the software |
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| 17:39.14 | goxboxlive | could anyone do: cat /sys/bus/i2c/devices/0-0008/battvolt for me on their ficphone phone? I need the output |
| 17:39.27 | SpeedEvil | It varies from 2800 to 4200 |
| 17:39.34 | SpeedEvil | nnnn\n |
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| 17:47.08 | goxboxlive | thx |
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| 17:57.40 | wirrwarr | !users |
| 17:57.48 | CVirus | lusers ? |
| 17:57.54 | CVirus | :-p |
| 17:58.14 | wirrwarr | aint work ;) |
| 17:58.19 | wirrwarr | hi there |
| 17:58.31 | CVirus | hello there stranger |
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| 18:21.46 | abraxa_ | Does openmoko-today now crash quite frequently for anyone else, too? |
| 18:25.30 | CIA-13 | openmoko: 03abraxa * r3289 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/artwork/themes/openmoko-standard-2/gtk-2.0/mokomediaplayer/background.png: Add background image that I forgot |
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| 18:42.05 | dread | hi |
| 18:42.33 | dread | what's the difference between the sacredy images and the others? :-) |
| 18:43.09 | abraxa_ | dread: See bottom note at http://buildhost.automated.it/OM2007.2/ |
| 18:44.12 | dread | ah, allright :) |
| 18:44.15 | dread | thanks |
| 18:47.16 | anrp | mm remote reinstall is slightly scary |
| 18:47.38 | anrp | reconfiguring the server to run out of ram so that the disks can be repartitioned... |
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| 19:00.03 | abraxa_ | stefan_schmidt: You there? |
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| 19:20.31 | CIA-13 | openmoko: 03andrew * r3290 10/trunk/src/host/qemu-neo1973/ (6 files in 4 dirs): |
| 19:20.31 | CIA-13 | openmoko: Sanitise AT+COPS output, implement AT+CSCB. |
| 19:20.31 | CIA-13 | openmoko: Hook up phonesim to qemu's configure & Makefile, add a usage note. |
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| 19:35.02 | Ghiottone | hi all |
| 19:42.22 | dread | hi |
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| 19:48.49 | torporAWAY | hi Ghiottone |
| 19:48.55 | torporAWAY | <-- still working on settingsUI hacks. |
| 19:49.13 | woglinde | hi torpor |
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| 19:52.32 | Ghiottone | hey torpor |
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| 19:52.42 | torpor | howdy |
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| 19:53.19 | torpor | bbl, movie time. |
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| 19:59.32 | SpeedEvil | IPoD http://xkcd.com/190/ |
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| 20:06.31 | Henryk | hmm, even if i was open to the idea of removing the clock in the tray in favor of a clock on the today application ... but then it would be kind of useful to actually include a clock in the today app |
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| 20:13.42 | abraxa_ | Henryk: Personally I'd say to remove the application title and add the clock again as well as increasing icon distance |
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| 20:14.03 | Henryk | abraxa_: application title is fine, imho |
| 20:14.37 | abraxa_ | Henryk: As you can only have one app in the foreground at a time and can recognize the app by its looks I don't see how the title would really be needed |
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| 20:47.40 | Ghiottone | is there any work going on for java on the Neo? |
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| 20:53.57 | Stephmw | OT, anybody have experience of modding lasers? |
| 20:54.58 | Henryk | Ghiottone: look at jalimo |
| 20:57.03 | Ghiottone | mmm java-like environment? what does it mean? |
| 20:57.20 | Stephmw | uncertified |
| 20:57.46 | Henryk | Ghiottone: they have packages (and even a ready to use feed for OpenMoko) for gnu classpath, cacao, etc. open source java, not the sun implementation |
| 20:58.44 | *** join/#openmoko microlith (n=no@c-76-105-18-51.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 21:01.22 | abraxa_ | Stephmw: Define "modding" |
| 21:03.48 | *** part/#openmoko StylusEater_Work (n=StylusEa@148.141.31.89) |
| 21:11.06 | Ghiottone | Henryk, nice! |
| 21:11.36 | *** join/#openmoko hhf423 (n=chatzill@A74a2.a.strato-dslnet.de) |
| 21:12.57 | hhf423 | moin! |
| 21:16.06 | Ghiottone | hola hhf423 |
| 21:16.22 | hhf423 | Hi Ghiottone |
| 21:16.26 | hhf423 | hows tricks? |
| 21:19.08 | Ghiottone | tomorrow is linux day in italy! |
| 21:19.19 | hhf423 | oh, really? |
| 21:19.41 | Ghiottone | yeah |
| 21:19.42 | hhf423 | what does everybody do? fight with the neighbour over vi vs emacs? |
| 21:19.46 | Stephmw | abraxa_: well, I've read a few forums with people pushing theirs and stuff, but I'm not too interested in that |
| 21:20.07 | Stephmw | abraxa_: I'd like to combine a green and red beam into a single pointer |
| 21:20.09 | *** join/#openmoko CVirus (n=GoD@82.201.174.66) |
| 21:20.13 | Ghiottone | hhf423, Italian linux society decides the day |
| 21:20.20 | Stephmw | abraxa_: so I was thinking prisms or fiberoptics |
| 21:20.29 | Ghiottone | hhf423, and then the Lugs in cities organize something |
| 21:20.55 | Ghiottone | like seminaries, hack meeting or just meeting to show linux pcs |
| 21:20.55 | hhf423 | so, for example vi vs emacs mud catching? :-) |
| 21:21.08 | Ghiottone | eheheh |
| 21:21.09 | abraxa_ | Stephmw: I've only read articles about that myself, don't have hand-on experience with mixing... I imagine it to be a littly tricky to adjust |
| 21:21.10 | hhf423 | that can be fun |
| 21:21.15 | Ghiottone | yeah it is |
| 21:21.23 | Ghiottone | you meet lot of people |
| 21:21.47 | Ghiottone | and sometimes you can listen to pretty interesting talks |
| 21:21.52 | hhf423 | and you can have a row with the people who use the wrong distribution |
| 21:21.54 | Ghiottone | tomorrow I'm going to the one in florence |
| 21:22.02 | Ghiottone | I hope to listen to a GPL3 talk |
| 21:22.19 | Ghiottone | and maybe I'll show the Neo just to be popular for a bit :) |
| 21:22.26 | Stephmw | abraxa_: aye - tbh, the beams don't need perfect divergence stats, I wouldn't be using this past 30m |
| 21:22.35 | Ghiottone | hhf423, yeah, religious wars just happen |
| 21:22.48 | Stephmw | abraxa_: maybe modding this in a bigger tube, http://www.thinkgeek.com/gadgets/lights/657a/ |
| 21:23.01 | hhf423 | Ghiottone: yes, always say: Linux on a PC how, boring. Use Linux on your phone! |
| 21:23.15 | Ghiottone | yeah |
| 21:23.23 | Ghiottone | I don't do it yet. |
| 21:23.33 | Stephmw | abraxa_: .. eep, ok, maybe a cheaper set of laser modules, but you get the idea |
| 21:23.36 | Ghiottone | because first reaction is of surprise |
| 21:23.44 | Stephmw | abraxa_: maybe using some cheap ones from dealextreme |
| 21:23.50 | hhf423 | hmm, in the latest image the top menu bar is still not stable |
| 21:23.52 | Ghiottone | then they ask if it can make calls, and I answer no |
| 21:23.59 | hhf423 | hahahaha |
| 21:24.07 | Ghiottone | then they ask about gps and I say it has but don't work yet |
| 21:24.10 | Ghiottone | and such... |
| 21:24.15 | hhf423 | right |
| 21:24.20 | Ghiottone | so I usually keep it in my pocket :( |
| 21:24.24 | hhf423 | but calls work with qtopia :-) |
| 21:24.48 | Ghiottone | did not try it yet |
| 21:24.56 | Ghiottone | I'm busy on the bb side |
| 21:25.14 | hhf423 | bb? |
| 21:25.19 | hhf423 | bitbaker |
| 21:26.46 | cjb_ie | Ghiottone: it's interesting that they ask if a phone can make calls. |
| 21:27.55 | Ghiottone | hhf423, yeah. I mainly work on recipes |
| 21:28.30 | Ghiottone | cjb_ie, yes. it always comes out as a subject. maybe because it is the first linux phone they see |
| 21:29.50 | Henryk | calls also do work with openmoko, at least for me most of the times |
| 21:31.00 | *** join/#openmoko fobos (n=fobos@78.90.88.72) |
| 21:31.15 | Ghiottone | really? maybe it's time to try it again. what are the tricks to use? or does it work for you out of the flash box? |
| 21:31.55 | CVirus | I'm thinking of writing an IAX softphone for OpenMoko |
| 21:31.59 | Henryk | Ghiottone: for the 2007-10-18 build i needed to restart X once after each boot, then it would work. even survived suspend/resume (i think) |
| 21:32.12 | hhf423 | hahahaha, coool! the mediapolayer works out of the box now |
| 21:32.18 | Ghiottone | good! |
| 21:32.19 | Henryk | yes it does |
| 21:33.08 | CVirus | any ideas any body ? |
| 21:33.19 | hhf423 | IAX softphone? |
| 21:33.22 | CVirus | yes |
| 21:33.34 | SpeedEvil | CVirus: sounds like fun. |
| 21:33.41 | SpeedEvil | CVirus: what do you mean any ideas? |
| 21:33.46 | hhf423 | is that VoIP or what? |
| 21:33.53 | CVirus | hhf423: yes |
| 21:34.27 | CVirus | SpeedEvil: guide me ... maybe ? |
| 21:34.35 | CVirus | SpeedEvil: I almost never wrote anything useful |
| 21:34.41 | CVirus | SpeedEvil: I know python .. that's all |
| 21:35.15 | abraxa_ | CVirus: You might be interested in http://sourceforge.net/projects/miax |
| 21:36.47 | CVirus | abraxa_: thanks |
| 21:36.52 | *** join/#openmoko Tsingi (n=tsingi@CPE000d8803ff13-CM00195eefbbb8.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 21:38.24 | abraxa_ | CVirus: http://sourceforge.net/projects/iaxclient might also be of interest as it offers a library as well |
| 21:38.34 | CVirus | abraxa_: thanks again |
| 21:38.47 | abraxa_ | yw ;3 |
| 21:39.00 | CVirus | there are no python iax modules though :-( |
| 21:39.38 | abraxa_ | Time to write bindings? |
| 21:40.27 | Robot101 | why not use Telepathy to do SIP or Jingle? |
| 21:40.43 | abraxa_ | Cause SIP is hell :( |
| 21:40.52 | abraxa_ | Whever invented is was on LSD |
| 21:40.55 | abraxa_ | it* |
| 21:41.41 | *** join/#openmoko rob_w (n=bob@X0984.x.pppool.de) |
| 21:41.50 | CVirus | abraxa_: I dunno C |
| 21:42.35 | abraxa_ | CVirus: Sup3rkiddo was looking for something to contribute a while ago, maybe he'd be interested |
| 21:43.16 | Tsingi | abraxa_: Tghis is slightly OT, but I have to write Python bindings for a c++ library I wrote, do you know if there is a tutorial or example page somewhere for that? |
| 21:43.38 | abraxa_ | Tsingi: Unfortunately not - I'd have to google myself : |
| 21:43.38 | abraxa_ | :); |
| 21:43.51 | *** join/#openmoko thomasg_ (n=thomasg@p57AFFD27.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 21:43.54 | Robot101 | abraxa_: maybe so, it was a student project, but it's not that bad. if you have a server which isn't behind NAT, it usually works |
| 21:44.02 | Tsingi | ok, thanks anyway, jost a random question. :) |
| 21:45.07 | abraxa_ | Robot101: And that is exactly my point. How braindead must one to be to design a protocol with major NAT problems when it was obvious that NAT would play a major role in the usage scenarios... |
| 21:45.13 | *** join/#openmoko daMaestro (n=jon@fedora/damaestro) |
| 21:45.32 | Robot101 | so how do you connect to an IAX server that's behind NAT? |
| 21:46.18 | abraxa_ | Simple port forwarding for a single port |
| 21:46.19 | Tene | abraxa_: how braindead would you have had to be at the time SIP was designed to believe that NAT would so cripple the internet by now? |
| 21:47.54 | Henryk | NAT must die. |
| 21:48.13 | Robot101 | eh whatever, Jingle does ICE and soon SIP will too |
| 21:48.17 | Robot101 | both supported by Telepathy |
| 21:48.20 | Henryk | And SIP is actually kind of neat, compared to H.323 |
| 21:48.31 | Tene | NAT's current use is a horrible abomination. |
| 21:48.32 | abraxa_ | Tene: Nice comback and yes, NAT is a plague. But still, it should have been taken into account in my opinon |
| 21:48.47 | Tene | abraxa_: hindsight is nice, isn't it? |
| 21:48.55 | CVirus | people shall start using IAX |
| 21:49.09 | Robot101 | write a telepathy IAX backend then :) |
| 21:49.18 | daMaestro | buildhost back up? |
| 21:49.20 | Robot101 | then people can use whatever protocol they feel lke |
| 21:49.26 | abraxa_ | Tene: Protocol extensibility and flexibility, too |
| 21:49.42 | roh | just don't think about nat. 2 years of stun hacks and then ipv4 is over.. |
| 21:50.05 | Tene | roh: people were saying that at least four years ago... |
| 21:50.19 | abraxa_ | daMaestro: Yes it is |
| 21:50.31 | daMaestro | thanks. |
| 21:50.58 | roh | Tene well.. ive seen plans from ripe suggesting that they are really out of fresh v4 ranges by then and also the routing equipment for carriers is now getting up to speed to do v6... finally |
| 21:51.24 | *** join/#openmoko kW (n=kwkw@203.35.205.2) |
| 21:51.35 | Tene | roh: interesting about ripe... |
| 21:51.36 | SpeedEvil | roh: and inbound bandwidth is suddenly free for all mobiles? |
| 21:54.22 | cb22 | i guess ipv4 has gotten rather... ripe |
| 21:54.32 | cb22 | pardon the lame joke :) |
| 21:54.34 | Ghiottone | hey roh |
| 21:55.15 | abraxa_ | lol cb22 |
| 21:55.16 | roh | ay |
| 21:55.21 | Ghiottone | where is the latest qtopia? |
| 21:55.41 | Henryk | I've had had native IPv6 at home for about 1.5 years (ok, it's a niche ISP) |
| 21:56.00 | Ghiottone | what is the best set of packages to impress other people? |
| 21:56.03 | XorA|gone | a lot of UK ISPs office ipv6 |
| 21:56.09 | XorA|gone | offer |
| 21:56.17 | Henryk | so i think even major ISP are finally getting IPv6. Hey, Apple even shipped 6to4 default active in its Wifi access points |
| 21:56.40 | Henryk | Ghiottone: minimally scummvm |
| 21:56.59 | roh | Henryk well.. when we got v6 over tunnels and friendly isps we were 5 yeas infront of the market .. again :) |
| 21:57.39 | mjr | my home isp is just getting to it |
| 22:00.41 | Ghiottone | Henryk, building started. what else? |
| 22:01.12 | daMaestro | wow.. i was actually able to make a phone call on a fresh boot |
| 22:01.31 | daMaestro | what's the needed tricks to get the handset working? (mixer, etc) |
| 22:01.58 | Ghiottone | alsactl restore -f /etc/some-file-containing-mixer-state IIRC |
| 22:02.26 | Henryk | gsmhandset.state |
| 22:02.36 | Tene | Huh, looks like my ISP is looking to start deploying IPv6 in Q1 2008. |
| 22:02.40 | CVirus | so who is gonna give me his mobile number to test my voipjet account :-D ? |
| 22:03.41 | CVirus | all you guys are dead now ? |
| 22:03.43 | CVirus | LOL |
| 22:05.14 | daMaestro | root@fic-gta01:~$ alsactl restore -f /etc/gsmhandset.state |
| 22:05.14 | daMaestro | alsactl: load_state:1329: No soundcards found... |
| 22:05.15 | daMaestro | hmm |
| 22:05.33 | daMaestro | alsamixer: function snd_ctl_open failed for default: No such device |
| 22:06.21 | daMaestro | http://nopaste.com/p/aGxuNf0N3 |
| 22:06.44 | Ghiottone | probably a kernel / modules version mismatch |
| 22:06.48 | CVirus | yeah |
| 22:07.05 | CVirus | recompile alsa against your new kernel maybe ? |
| 22:07.17 | daMaestro | so, the issue i've got is the base image i flashed with had issues? |
| 22:07.35 | Ghiottone | did you flash both the rootfs image and the kernel image? |
| 22:07.38 | *** join/#openmoko behdad (n=behdad@CPE001217b19226-CM0012c9c84bc4.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 22:07.47 | daMaestro | yes, i erased and then flashed both |
| 22:08.32 | Ghiottone | that's strange |
| 22:08.43 | daMaestro | http://buildhost.openmoko.org/OM2007.2/tmp/deploy/glibc/images/neo1973/ is what i should try flashing with? |
| 22:09.12 | Ghiottone | mm yeah I guess so |
| 22:09.30 | CVirus | so no one is giving me his mobile number to test my voipjet account ? |
| 22:10.40 | CVirus | I gess I'll go get some sleep then |
| 22:10.43 | CVirus | bbl |
| 22:11.00 | Ghiottone | bye |
| 22:11.08 | daMaestro | http://buildhost.openmoko.org/OM2007.2/tmp/deploy/glibc/images/neo1973/openmoko-image-fic-gta01.jffs2 and http://buildhost.openmoko.org/OM2007.2/tmp/deploy/glibc/images/neo1973/uImage-neo1973-latest.bin looks to be the new location /me looks on wiki if this is the case |
| 22:12.05 | abraxa_ | Yeah, daMaestro |
| 22:12.12 | abraxa_ | fic-gta01 got replaced by neo1973 |
| 22:21.22 | *** join/#openmoko jpozlovsky (n=jindra@rb5cc115.net.upc.cz) |
| 22:23.32 | Ghiottone | this is strange... I just flashed last qtopia rootfs and booted and Neo was starting openmoko again... |
| 22:24.02 | abraxa_ | Maybe DFU flashed a different device? |
| 22:24.11 | *** join/#openmoko mattzerah (n=matt@121.50.220.35) |
| 22:24.49 | Ghiottone | Neo was saying dfu download to partition rootfs |
| 22:24.53 | Ghiottone | so I gues the device was right |
| 22:24.56 | abraxa_ | Ah, yeah |
| 22:25.05 | abraxa_ | Odd indeed |
| 22:25.21 | Ghiottone | oh wait |
| 22:25.24 | Ghiottone | looking better |
| 22:25.43 | Ghiottone | I can see that dfu-util is now telling me that it is flashing to devnum=14 |
| 22:25.51 | Ghiottone | while before it said devnum=7 |
| 22:26.16 | *** join/#openmoko hardskinone (n=hardskin@host11-136-dynamic.56-82-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 22:26.25 | Ghiottone | strange |
| 22:26.32 | Ghiottone | is that relevant? |
| 22:27.04 | abraxa_ | No idea, sorry :) |
| 22:27.39 | Ghiottone | no effect again |
| 22:27.57 | Ghiottone | I'm using dfu-util from the dfu-util-native package. is that the right way? |
| 22:28.35 | abraxa_ | Yup |
| 22:28.38 | abraxa_ | I use that, too |
| 22:28.44 | abraxa_ | What's your cmdline? |
| 22:28.57 | Ghiottone | oh no it has just worked now. strange |
| 22:29.02 | Ghiottone | there is qtopia running |
| 22:29.05 | abraxa_ | heh :) |
| 22:29.07 | Henryk | Ghiottone: that's ok. whenever you're attaching an USB device it gets assigned a devicenum. Usually that's the last devicenum +1 |
| 22:29.07 | abraxa_ | Weird. |
| 22:30.31 | Ghiottone | maybe I just got confused by the splash screen |
| 22:30.45 | Ghiottone | which is the same as august openmoko |
| 22:31.36 | *** join/#openmoko Virtuall (n=virtuall@87.110.198.224) |
| 22:34.28 | *** join/#openmoko charkins (n=casey@pdpc/supporter/active/charkins) |
| 22:38.26 | *** join/#openmoko hardskinone (n=hardskin@host11-136-dynamic.56-82-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 22:39.18 | *** join/#openmoko daniel_bergamini (n=danieber@72-173-30-80.cust.wildblue.net) |
| 22:42.59 | *** join/#openmoko baird (n=cbaird@brushtail.apana.org.au) |
| 22:51.27 | *** join/#openmoko orospakr (n=orospakr@CPE001839ea7787-CM001a6670fc8c.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 22:52.43 | *** join/#openmoko wirrwarr (n=fz@ppp-62-216-207-236.dynamic.mnet-online.de) |
| 22:53.23 | *** join/#openmoko bluelightning (n=blueligh@219-89-45-30.dialup.xtra.co.nz) |
| 23:01.43 | dread | hm..is it normal that Xfbdev takes 60% cpu load on my NEO ? |
| 23:03.21 | *** join/#openmoko mindCrime (n=chatzill@cpe-065-190-188-124.nc.res.rr.com) |
| 23:03.24 | ljp | Ghiottone: openmoko is also the distro |
| 23:03.52 | SpeedEvil | dread: doing hwat? |
| 23:07.25 | Ghiottone | ljp, yeah I know. but thought qtopia was another distro |
| 23:08.15 | Ghiottone | damn I can't enter a numeric ip address in qtopia's internet preferences |
| 23:09.44 | daMaestro | "NOTE: Upload support is currently broken" http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Dfu-util#Flashing_the_rootfs and I'm getting -> Starting download: [dfu_download error -110 \n Error during download |
| 23:09.49 | abraxa_ | For some reason I feel quite stupid right now. No matter what I do, QVGA mode just does not want to work. |
| 23:15.21 | dread | SpeedEvil: just clicking around and figuring out if i've got a real adjustment problem with my screen |
| 23:16.04 | abraxa_ | dread: It's normal if a lot of redrawing (=framebuffer updating) is going on |
| 23:16.56 | dread | ah, okay...I've rebooted the phone in between, so it's back to normal now |
| 23:23.53 | *** join/#openmoko vivijim (n=vivijim@200.184.118.132) |
| 23:27.30 | *** join/#openmoko poffy (n=poffy@c-98-199-135-173.hsd1.tx.comcast.net) |
| 23:27.50 | *** join/#openmoko StealthCP (n=StealthC@user-544167cd.l6.c5.dsl.pol.co.uk) |
| 23:28.52 | SpeedEvil | Can anyone say where I've broken the landuse:urban defintion? |
| 23:28.56 | SpeedEvil | http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/index.php/Proposed_features#Proposed_Features_-_Landuse |
| 23:30.42 | SpeedEvil | oops |
| 23:30.43 | *** join/#openmoko thomasg (n=thomasg@p57AFFD27.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 23:30.51 | SpeedEvil | as you may have guessed, that was a mischan. |
| 23:33.47 | Ghiottone | Can I have a dual config qtopia/moko? |
| 23:34.02 | Ghiottone | without booting from sd that does not work with my uboot? |
| 23:35.46 | mmontour | Ghiottone: you can boot a kernel from NAND and a rootfs from SD. |
| 23:43.00 | *** join/#openmoko exastra (n=go@c-24-21-152-246.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) |
| 23:55.03 | SpeedEvil | Not very secret. |
