| 00:00.17 | Ghiottone | I see |
| 00:04.51 | kristian-m | Ghiottone okay fixed. - this setup.py stuff is a bit tricky |
| 00:06.09 | Ghiottone | great |
| 00:06.27 | Ghiottone | let me know when you have uploaded the sources |
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| 00:07.28 | kristian-m | Ghiottone http://mput.de/~kristian/.openmoko/SMSTool-0.3c.tar.bz2 |
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| 00:10.22 | Ghiottone | did you also think of icons for these new programs? |
| 00:10.55 | kristian-m | Ghiottone there is one with a pen in openmoko, wait... |
| 00:14.29 | kristian-m | Ghiottone hmm no there's not. okay let's just take the gtk-directory for now |
| 00:16.28 | Ghiottone | for smstool I chose one |
| 00:16.54 | kristian-m | Ghiottone yea thats a good one |
| 00:17.05 | Ghiottone | but it's not there anymore mmm |
| 00:17.19 | kristian-m | Ghiottone it's still working here |
| 00:17.48 | Ghiottone | version? |
| 00:17.57 | Ghiottone | oh probably X restart is needed |
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| 00:19.13 | kristian-m | Ghiottone it's a build from oct 3rd |
| 00:21.12 | Ghiottone | yeah but I messed things a bit here in testing new version |
| 00:21.45 | Ghiottone | still not ther |
| 00:21.47 | Ghiottone | e |
| 00:28.01 | kristian-m | Ghiottone they should be in /usr/share/icons/openmoko-standard/48x48/stock/mail-message-new.png |
| 00:28.13 | kristian-m | ... and 36 |
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| 00:31.21 | Ghiottone | oh yes I still have the sources. in fact I reenabled it for 0.3 and I'm testing |
| 00:31.27 | Ghiottone | what about the other? |
| 00:31.30 | Ghiottone | gtk-directory= |
| 00:31.31 | Ghiottone | ? |
| 00:32.53 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[SMSTool]] |
| 00:33.03 | CoreDump|home | http://xkcd.com/ <-=D |
| 00:33.09 | kristian-m | Ghiottone yes, for now. - i'll add next and prev. note as well as a color chooser next - so it can be used as a notebook |
| 00:34.15 | kristian-m | CoreDump|home :-) |
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| 04:15.33 | BryceLeo | hello all |
| 04:15.37 | BryceLeo | torpor: you around? |
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| 04:32.53 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Gsmd/document]] |
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| 06:03.04 | mbuf | has anyone's recent builds failed with gnokiigsm/virtmodem.c ? |
| 06:04.12 | blindcoder | moin |
| 06:11.42 | *** part/#openmoko baird (n=cbaird@brushtail.apana.org.au) |
| 06:15.11 | mbuf | CM, RalphEichelberge, build completed :) October 5, 2007 |
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| 06:26.01 | cdbot2 | * * OM Bug 912 has been created by gnomecn(AT)gmail.com |
| 06:26.02 | cdbot2 | * * uboot-openmoko build error for x86 arch |
| 06:26.03 | cdbot2 | * * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=912 |
| 06:30.00 | cdbot2 | * * OM Bug 913 has been created by gnomecn(AT)gmail.com |
| 06:30.02 | cdbot2 | * * template error? |
| 06:30.03 | cdbot2 | * * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=913 |
| 06:32.14 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Gsmd/document]] |
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| 07:19.42 | Penguin | hi room |
| 07:20.39 | Penguin | how can i skip the build of uboot-openmoko, it failed while I'm building a openmoko-devel-image for x86? |
| 07:20.39 | aloril | Penguin: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1, SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) (Hopefully these links answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) |
| 07:22.14 | Henryk | hihi |
| 07:22.29 | mbuf | Penguin, i just ignored it and using just openmoko-devel-image |
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| 07:22.52 | mbuf | Penguin, did it fail at gnokiigsm/virtmodem.c ? |
| 07:22.56 | Penguin | mbuf: but there is no rootfs image in the build/tmp |
| 07:23.19 | Penguin | http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=912 |
| 07:23.47 | Henryk | Penguin: just saw that. It shouldn't use -march=armv4 on x86 ... |
| 07:23.47 | mbuf | Penguin, i did a build yesterday, and it it built fine for target; check images/openmoko |
| 07:23.57 | mbuf | *and it built |
| 07:25.27 | Henryk | (though of course building uboot at all on x86 is also pretty useless) |
| 07:25.58 | Penguin | Henryk: yes, I have run 'make qemu' in the same directory but faild, then I try to build for x86... |
| 07:28.04 | Penguin | Should I remove build/tmp and start a new build? |
| 07:29.02 | Henryk | Penguin: a quick fix for the moment: find the proper stamps directory (in build/tmp/stamps/*) where it keeps the stamps (I don't know which one, I never did a x86 build) for uboot-openmoko-... and touch the do_build stamp |
| 07:29.06 | mbuf | Henryk, isn't it not possible to use a local repository, build your code against the repository, make sure it builds fine, and then check-in the code? |
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| 07:33.54 | Penguin | I got the same error.:( |
| 07:34.34 | mbuf | Penguin, and you are only testing with qemu? |
| 07:35.42 | Penguin | no, I just want to build a rootfs for x86, and then I can run it on my PC. |
| 07:35.50 | mbuf | i think it is best to have a local code-base, build the package to see if it is ok; then integrate it with the local repository, built to make sure target and qemu is fine, and then code should be checked into server repository |
| 07:36.10 | mbuf | *build to make sure target and qemu are fine |
| 07:36.55 | Hopscotch | good morning |
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| 07:37.40 | Penguin | How do you guys to test application? on neo1973 or qemu or x86? |
| 07:37.48 | Henryk | mbuf: yes, that's usual procedure. however, there are quite some different system configurations out there so that it's always possible that something doesnt build on one or the other |
| 07:38.13 | Henryk | Penguin: qemu. i believe x86 didn't get much more testing since qemu works |
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| 07:39.58 | Penguin | Ok, I'll try to build for qemu again, I'v cost more than 3 days to build openmoko, first for qemu, then fallback to x86, and now, I'd like to go back to qemu again:) |
| 07:40.40 | Penguin | Shall I clean the build/tmp and then make qenu? |
| 07:41.59 | Henryk | yes, do a make clean |
| 07:42.40 | Penguin | No such rule. |
| 07:43.17 | Henryk | make update-makefile |
| 07:46.06 | Penguin | I nearly got the last stage for x86...:( |
| 07:49.38 | Penguin | Can I flash new rootfs into new1973 by the USB cable? |
| 07:49.49 | Henryk | yes |
| 07:50.08 | Penguin | Can I upgrade a package in the neo1973 with a new ipkg? |
| 07:50.58 | Penguin | make clean deleted 8G data:) |
| 07:52.03 | Henryk | yes (both :) |
| 07:54.13 | Penguin | thx:) I've never tried that, because I've never get qemu runing for neo1973:) |
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| 08:05.44 | zefanja | hello...can I rebuild the kernel with the mokomakefile? |
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| 08:55.39 | Esben | is there an easy way to build an image with console messages on usb? |
| 08:58.49 | mbuf | Esben, you mean build messages to be redirected to USB? |
| 09:01.29 | Esben | kernel messages redirected to USB without using the serial-usb converter on the debug board |
| 09:01.51 | Esben | of-course, usb in kernel have to be up and running first. |
| 09:02.19 | Esben | I just built my first image during the night. Worked nicely with MokoMakefile :-) |
| 09:02.29 | Esben | But it does not boot.... |
| 09:04.00 | Esben | usb-net is not up and running, so most likely usb did not initialize correctly. |
| 09:04.57 | Esben | the small golden connector on the top right, is that for rf? |
| 09:05.52 | Esben | now, how do I open this thing so I can connect the debug board.... |
| 09:06.41 | mbuf | Esben, yes, that is for GSM; check the wiki, http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Connecting_GTA01Bv2_with_Debug_Board |
| 09:07.17 | mbuf | Esben, http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973_Debug_Board_v2 |
| 09:07.22 | mbuf | Esben, http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Connecting_Neo1973_with_Debug_Board_v2 |
| 09:07.55 | Esben | mbuf: thanks, I have seen that one. just wondering how to dismantle the phone without ruining it to much... |
| 09:08.14 | SpeedEvil | See the dissasembly guide |
| 09:08.24 | Esben | url? |
| 09:08.24 | mbuf | Esben, http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Disassembling_Neo1973 |
| 09:08.28 | Esben | thanks! |
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| 09:42.13 | CIA-23 | openmoko: 03shoragan * r3092 10/branches/src/target/kernel/2.6.23.x/patches/ (fix-change_console-race.patch series): Drop fix-change_console-race because it was merged in 2.6.23-rc9. |
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| 10:15.45 | mbuf | has anyone tested a recent image on the Neo1973? i get no text/icon display, instead I get a square with x inside it for all entries/items? are they trying to play Hollywood Squares? |
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| 11:08.32 | ScaredyCat | 21gb |
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| 11:34.07 | DukeOfURL | good morning everyone |
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| 11:36.50 | abraxa_ | Good afternoon, Duke |
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| 11:40.22 | DukeOfURL | http://www.skyhookwireless.com/howitworks |
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| 11:42.24 | CM | DukeOfURL: Cool |
| 11:43.02 | DukeOfURL | the database of WiFi points is the value |
| 11:43.03 | CM | DukeOfURL: I've built a small project like that at the university, but only for one building. Worked pretty good |
| 11:43.17 | CM | Yes, was a pain to record all the points |
| 11:43.32 | CM | We had a map of each floor, and walked around measuring |
| 11:43.44 | CM | Used the signal strength too to increase accuracy |
| 11:44.02 | CM | But that was a bit tricky since humans block signal strength a lot.. |
| 11:44.23 | MetaMorfoziS | just do that at night:) |
| 11:44.29 | DukeOfURL | we need software to collect data for the Open Street Map project that will also collect WiFi AP locations |
| 11:44.59 | viq | ooh. OpenWarDriving :D |
| 11:45.18 | DukeOfURL | would be a good project for teens during summer vacation |
| 11:45.23 | viq | hehe |
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| 11:45.52 | DukeOfURL | viq: I like that: OpenWarDriving |
| 11:45.59 | CM | Hehe |
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| 11:46.52 | LionKMP | what's the accuracy of opensteetmap? Will two streets connect? (I heard about that project only a few days ago.) |
| 11:47.17 | DukeOfURL | CM: Is it basically the overlapping ellipses? |
| 11:47.34 | Henryk | DukeOfURL: hmm, there's some resistance in the openstreetmap project against adding such types of information. which i can understand. |
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| 11:47.46 | DukeOfURL | why? |
| 11:48.03 | DukeOfURL | why resistance? |
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| 11:49.23 | DukeOfURL | I didn't say incorporate the data into openstreetmap, just collect street data and WiFi AP data at the same time |
| 11:49.42 | viq | DukeOfURL: my guessing, but now openstreetmap is completely legal and useful and nice. with that it can be seen as a "project for bad hackers and needs to be abolished" |
| 11:50.04 | Henryk | DukeOfURL: some feel that openstreetmap should only include information on how to find your way around, and not every single shop there is and surely not every AP. these should be separate projects for map overlays (e.g. something like openyellowpages) |
| 11:50.06 | Henryk | DukeOfURL: ah, ok |
| 11:50.44 | viq | can multiple apps have concurrent access to GPS? Say, gathering info for openstreetmap and running kismet? ;) |
| 11:50.45 | DukeOfURL | ah, yellow pages, another dying industry |
| 11:51.03 | ckuethe | viq: gpsd.... |
| 11:51.42 | viq | OK, I guess that's a 'yes' |
| 11:51.44 | Henryk | viq: no, but you'll have to use gpsd or similar anyway. and then just log the info to a file where everyone can read. or dbus ... |
| 11:51.55 | DukeOfURL | CM: Is it just overlapping ellipses, or is there higher math involved in determining position? |
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| 11:54.00 | DukeOfURL | CM: did you use the AP's MAC address or it's SSID? |
| 11:54.31 | CM | DukeOfURL: Sorry, making lunch |
| 11:55.27 | CM | We made it simpler than that. Since it was a lot of acess points in the house, we recorded the 5 strongest with signalstrengh per SSID |
| 11:55.37 | CM | For each point |
| 11:55.59 | DukeOfURL | ok |
| 11:56.13 | CM | We had a map on a tablet pc, walked around and clicked on where we were right now to record the position |
| 11:56.27 | CM | Was more of a proff of concept, and it was 5 years ago |
| 11:56.37 | CM | Worked nicely later though when we demo:ed it |
| 11:56.38 | DukeOfURL | did you then infer the coordinates of the AP? |
| 11:56.47 | DukeOfURL | of each AP? |
| 11:56.53 | CM | No, we never cared about the positions of the AP's |
| 11:57.05 | CM | Only the places where we recorded signal strengths |
| 11:57.09 | DukeOfURL | so just the intersecting signals? |
| 11:57.12 | CM | Yes |
| 11:57.51 | DukeOfURL | we NEED this data in the public domain, along with cell tower locations... |
| 11:57.53 | CM | We had server also where you could sign in so that everyone could see logged in people on a homepage, where they were in the building |
| 12:02.01 | DukeOfURL | is there a way to determine whether a WiFi signal is statonary or mobile? Something in the protocol that indicates it's an AP? |
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| 12:04.02 | hrw | DukeOfURL: infrastructure/managed <> ad-hoc thing? |
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| 12:04.37 | DukeOfURL | yes |
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| 12:06.13 | ScaredyCat | errm.. |
| 12:06.42 | hhf423 | moin |
| 12:07.32 | LionKMP | actually the signal measuring may be better than AP locations, because CM's method includes all the enviromental affects on the signal. E.g. same distance from the same AP may be strong or weak in different directions. (But I don't know, never tried :-) ) |
| 12:08.47 | DukeOfURL | CM had the luxury of walking each floor of the building. I thinking how we could build such a database by driving the streets. |
| 12:09.17 | DukeOfURL | knowing the signal strength is affected by many factors |
| 12:09.49 | CM | By far, a human standing next to the wifi-card was the most affecting thing |
| 12:09.50 | LionKMP | actually, what's the use of this? |
| 12:09.51 | mbuf | has anyone's recent build doesn't produce any icons/text on the Neo1973? I get a square box instead with a red cross in it |
| 12:09.57 | CM | Water absorbs the signal.. |
| 12:10.19 | CM | mbuf: I have a two days old build, and that one works. Must have been something more recent |
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| 12:10.41 | Henryk | mbuf: did you nand erase rootfs before flashing? |
| 12:11.01 | DukeOfURL | LionKMP: to augment positioning from the GPS receiver, especially when inside a building. |
| 12:11.03 | mbuf | Henryk, no |
| 12:11.07 | abraxa_ | mbuf: You might wanna check if the icons in /usr/share/themes/openmoko-standard-2/ are there |
| 12:11.25 | Henryk | mbuf: try that and flash again |
| 12:11.27 | mbuf | Henryk, but nand erase rootfs is only if the image size is smaller than the previous right? |
| 12:11.45 | Henryk | mbuf: in theory, yes |
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| 12:12.21 | LionKMP | I see. |
| 12:13.37 | LionKMP | when I saw openstreetmap faq about accuracy, it talked about street names, and not meters. What's the accuracy in meters? Only about 30 steets of my 2M ppl city is mapped there :-( |
| 12:13.38 | mbuf | Henryk, from where should i do cu -l /dev/ttyACM0, #nand erase rootfs |
| 12:13.40 | DukeOfURL | LionKMP: multipath errors from GPS in a dense urban setting |
| 12:14.33 | Henryk | LionKMP: the accuracy is as good as the data that has been put in. naturally this varies. it's pretty ok for cities that are on yahoo satellite images, though |
| 12:14.40 | mbuf | abraxa_, /usr/share/themes/openmoko-standard-2 exists with gtk+-2.0 and matchbox directory, and index.theme file |
| 12:15.02 | Henryk | mbuf: pardon? |
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| 12:15.36 | mbuf | Henryk, i boot into u-boot, and from host PC I should do cu -l /dev/ttyACM0 ? |
| 12:15.44 | abraxa_ | mbuf: Actually, my bad, I meant /usr/share/icons/openmoko-standard/ |
| 12:15.53 | LionKMP | Henryk: :-) ok, I am asking about the accuracy of the devices used in general. What if two connected streets are mapped by different ppl different device? |
| 12:16.19 | LionKMP | 3m? 10m? 30m? |
| 12:16.20 | mbuf | abraxa_, yes, there are directories, 128x128, 22x22, 32x32 etc. |
| 12:16.51 | abraxa_ | mbuf: Ah, good. I wonder what's the cause then. |
| 12:17.17 | Henryk | LionKMP: the GPS, if used at all, is only the first step. the actual data is entered in terms of nodes, edges and paths, e.g. it's topological information. so generally it's correct with respect to connectedness |
| 12:17.33 | abraxa_ | Henryk: Nice way of putting it :) |
| 12:18.43 | LionKMP | Henryk: ok I see, thanks. Maybe I should register and see how it is edited. |
| 12:18.49 | mbuf | what needs to be installed for cu ? |
| 12:19.05 | hhf423 | is there any news on GPS btw? driver? code? anything? |
| 12:19.10 | Henryk | LionKMP: but careful. it's addictive :) http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/index.php/Beginners%27_Guide |
| 12:20.00 | Henryk | mbuf: you need to have some terminal program on your host machine. for some reason some people prefer cu (which needs to be installed). i actually prefer screen /dev/ttyACM0 115200 |
| 12:20.03 | LionKMP | :-) yes, I miss my appartment's street so much :-p |
| 12:20.35 | Henryk | LionKMP: hehe, I did too. :) |
| 12:20.41 | LionKMP | :-D |
| 12:20.50 | mbuf | Henryk, ok, it is just cu package |
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| 12:22.09 | Henryk | LionKMP: if your area is captured by the yahoo satellite/aerial images you can actually edit without owning a gps. the online flash editor integrates those images |
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| 12:34.47 | hhf423 | no top menu, crap |
| 12:35.25 | mbuf | hhf423, no icons/text on the Neo1973? get a square box instead with a red cross in it? |
| 12:35.55 | ScaredyCat | DukeOfURL: lookes at the output of iwlist ? |
| 12:36.22 | hhf423 | no I get all that. I even get asked for the PIN, just I can not see if it registeres with the network as the top menu with all the status icons is not there |
| 12:36.31 | mbuf | hhf423, ok |
| 12:36.50 | hhf423 | mbuf: did you already flash the august 19 uboot? |
| 12:37.00 | ScaredyCat | there's a new image for that too hhf423 :) |
| 12:37.06 | mbuf | hhf423, not uboot |
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| 12:37.29 | hhf423 | ScaredyCat: yes, I am flashing your latest qtopia image, thanks. |
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| 12:37.45 | mbuf | hhf423, using OpenMoko-openmoko-devel-image-glibc-P1-August-Snapshot-20070819-fic-gta01.rootfs.jffs2 |
| 12:37.56 | hhf423 | mbuf: you should do that. with that ubott, nand erase stuff is no longer required |
| 12:38.24 | mbuf | hhf423, you mean i should update u-boot? |
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| 12:38.42 | hhf423 | mbuf: yes, I think you should use this one: http://buildhost.openmoko.org/snapshots/2007.08/images/ |
| 12:38.58 | mbuf | hhf423, i flash the images that i build |
| 12:39.00 | hhf423 | mbuf: since that ubott I did not have any uboot related issues whatsoever |
| 12:39.27 | hhf423 | mbuf: your choice :-) do you have a debug board? |
| 12:39.41 | mbuf | hhf423, yes, haven't had time to work with it, yet |
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| 12:40.35 | hhf423 | mbuf: I do not have a debug board and I do not build images myself. I used to rely on openmoko buildhost (now out of service) and ScaredyCat :-) |
| 12:41.24 | mbuf | Henryk, thanks, nand erase rootfs, and reflashing rootfs, now produces sound and the GUI with icons |
| 12:42.18 | hhf423 | mbuf: then you should go to a never uboot version (august 19 or later), because that fixes the bug which requires the nand erase |
| 12:43.06 | mbuf | hhf423, ok |
| 12:43.17 | Henryk | hhf423: that the try area is not seen seems to happen sometimes. just reboot and try again. seems to be a timing issue |
| 12:43.39 | mbuf | ERROR: Cannot satisfy the following dependencies for helloworld: libmokoui2-0 (>= 0.1.0+svnr3064) libgsmd0 (>= 0.1+svnr3074) |
| 12:44.17 | ScaredyCat | DukeOfURL: |
| 12:44.35 | ScaredyCat | DukeOfURL: http://www-robotics.usc.edu/~ahoward/pubs/howard_fsr03a.pdf could be an interesting paper for you |
| 12:46.09 | hhf423 | great and qtopia has no sound. that has worked before |
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| 12:47.58 | hhf423 | there has been some talk that gsmd is more stable now, but I can not see any commits in the commitlog, does anyone know why? do the openhand people use an other commit log? |
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| 12:49.02 | abraxa_ | hhf423: gsmd is under OM SVN, so any commits for it would appear on commitlog, too |
| 12:49.34 | hhf423 | hahaha |
| 12:49.36 | hhf423 | http://cgi.ebay.de/18x-Schutzfolie-Computer-Neo-1973-Tuch_W0QQitemZ290145736835QQihZ019QQcategoryZ38950QQrdZ1QQssPageNameZWD1VQQcmdZViewItem |
| 12:49.49 | hhf423 | abraxa_: do you have a link for that? |
| 12:51.39 | abraxa_ | hhf423: http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/commitlog/ - the only change regarding gsm would be commit 3074, though it's not gsmd |
| 12:52.42 | abraxa_ | hhf423: I wonder why they sell 18 of them at once... |
| 12:53.17 | hhf423 | yes, hehe |
| 12:53.42 | hhf423 | gsmd more stable must be bullshit or magic then, if it was not changed |
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| 12:55.42 | DukeOfURL | ScaredyCat: thank you |
| 12:55.50 | abraxa_ | hhf423: Magic ;) |
| 12:56.14 | hhf423 | abraxa_: one would hope that. but probably just placebo |
| 12:57.28 | abraxa_ | hhf423: http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/community/2007-September/009997.html might be an interesting read |
| 12:57.52 | abraxa_ | (in case you haven't seen it yet) |
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| 12:58.26 | hhf423 | abraxa_: I have read that. the due date of all that is already past. |
| 12:59.28 | abraxa_ | If Harald's previous blog posts are any indicator of how incompetent certain people in Taiwan are then... yeah |
| 12:59.48 | abraxa_ | I'm not gonna ask for the impossible ;) |
| 12:59.59 | hhf423 | well, harald has been even more silent than he used to be |
| 13:00.48 | Elrond | mickey|portugal - You there? |
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| 13:02.13 | hhf423 | I have now rebooted three times and have no try/top menu. |
| 13:02.39 | hhf423 | ok, I'll shelve the rubbish for an other week and see where we are then. talk to you later |
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| 13:09.56 | Black-Dog | Hi all guys... |
| 13:10.02 | Black-Dog | i'm new here |
| 13:10.48 | Black-Dog | is there anyone that can tell me how much time does it take to have a neo 1973 now? |
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| 13:18.27 | DukeOfURL | In /usr/share/openmoko-panel-gsm are the gsm icon files. Is there anything that indicates whether the Neo is currently registered? |
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| 13:44.33 | Black-Dog_ | I would really love to buy a neo 1973 do u know how long does it takes to get it? |
| 13:45.44 | viq | Black-Dog_: the developer/testing version, or the production/consumer-ready version? |
| 13:45.55 | Black-Dog_ | developer tsting |
| 13:46.06 | Black-Dog_ | i know that i don't have to ask for the gta2 |
| 13:46.16 | Mek | in my case it was two weeks from ordering->delivered, but I don't know if the last batch has ran out yet... |
| 13:46.17 | thomasg | why? |
| 13:46.31 | Black-Dog_ | i'd like to buy the gta1 |
| 13:46.37 | thomasg | gta02 will only take a few months to be ready for shipping |
| 13:46.56 | Black-Dog_ | On the main screen of the room says: "do not ask about tha gta2" |
| 13:46.58 | thomasg | it's planned for the late november |
| 13:47.13 | Black-Dog_ | So the gta1 will be faster? |
| 13:47.14 | thomasg | so imho you should wait |
| 13:47.16 | Mek | thomasg: last I heard it was planned for december at the earliest... |
| 13:47.30 | thomasg | Mek: michael shiloh wrote some messages on the list |
| 13:47.35 | Black-Dog_ | yes but when gta2 will come out will be for consumers? |
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| 13:48.02 | thomasg | the developer version will be shipped (if nothing goes wrong) in the late november, the consumer release is planned for december |
| 13:48.13 | Black-Dog_ | ahhh ok |
| 13:48.33 | Black-Dog_ | so if i'd like the neo 1973 gta1 i can buy it know in developer preview |
| 13:48.35 | Mek | although I doubt consumer ready software will be available in december... |
| 13:48.48 | thomasg | I doubt that, too |
| 13:48.50 | Black-Dog_ | i don't care for consumer version |
| 13:48.59 | thomasg | but I think that the hardware will be ready in november |
| 13:49.13 | Black-Dog_ | it will have wifi right? |
| 13:49.16 | thomasg | yes |
| 13:49.20 | Black-Dog_ | wowo |
| 13:49.40 | Black-Dog_ | i've read somewhere that gta1 owners will be able to add wifi module |
| 13:49.43 | viq | Black-Dog_: the consumer version will have wifi, not developer |
| 13:49.52 | mjr | Black-Dog_, you've read clueless stuff |
| 13:49.53 | SpeedEvil | Black-Dog: not without hardware mods. |
| 13:50.02 | Black-Dog_ | yeah i know |
| 13:50.05 | *** join/#openmoko der_io (n=der@p54A0FCFD.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 13:50.23 | mjr | or, yes, "able to" the same way you are able to get a porsche engine in a lada |
| 13:50.35 | Black-Dog_ | i know that to have wifi i have to make some mods |
| 13:50.50 | Black-Dog_ | but anyway how is the device??? do you love it? |
| 13:51.00 | Black-Dog_ | i'm so impressed |
| 13:51.24 | mjr | can't really love it with the software being this unfinished yet |
| 13:52.08 | Black-Dog_ | yeah i understand but it's able to makes some calls and some early things... right? |
| 13:52.54 | *** join/#openmoko tomjoad4500 (n=tomjoad4@adsl-70-130-137-193.dsl.stlsmo.swbell.net) |
| 13:53.21 | *** join/#openmoko Demitar (n=demitar@c-212-031-182-147.cust.broadway.se) |
| 13:54.43 | abraxa_ | Elrond: I assume Mickey returns tomorrow - he said he'll be gone for two weeks and left on a sunday morning |
| 14:01.43 | CM | abraxa_: And hopefully he's really eager to get back working on OpenMoko :D |
| 14:02.39 | abraxa_ | CM: I'm sure he will be :) |
| 14:05.48 | *** join/#openmoko MetaMorfoziS (n=khmhm@dsl54007EE5.pool.t-online.hu) |
| 14:06.04 | *** join/#openmoko arw1 (i=familia@201.244.108.215) |
| 14:14.40 | goxboxlive | I guess some of you might think this is interesting: http://84.18.144.44/tsdogs/screenshots/qtopia_roadmap2.mpg |
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| 14:50.10 | Elrond | abraxa_ - Ahh, cool. :-) |
| 14:51.44 | *** join/#openmoko Gopi (n=root|iPh@64.213.69.83) |
| 14:52.21 | Gopi | Good morning. |
| 14:52.43 | *** join/#openmoko rd_ (n=dr@toi.yeu.phu.nu) |
| 14:53.13 | orzo | riot, lasrtiq |
| 14:53.24 | *** join/#openmoko Marex-notebook (n=marex@gwfm4-3-206.802.cz) |
| 14:53.52 | orzo | my music player client doesnt build againt 2007.2 but can probably be finangled and made to build |
| 14:53.54 | abraxa_ | Good afternoon, Gopi |
| 14:54.17 | orzo | it just needs to link and such |
| 14:54.21 | orzo | it compiles of course |
| 14:54.36 | orzo | but apparently, its a great effort to get me to do anything at all with it |
| 14:55.02 | orzo | so riot, if i just upload the source file and give you svn access, would you make it build for us? |
| 14:55.07 | orzo | heh |
| 14:56.06 | viq | Do you think it will be feasible to have something like OpenVPN or other IPSec running on OpenMoko/Neo1973? |
| 14:57.04 | Henryk | sure |
| 14:57.16 | mwester | viq: Yes. I currently run OpenVPN on a smaller ARM device. |
| 14:57.22 | viq | ah, cool |
| 14:57.32 | Gopi | So if I want a phone with a decent address book, power management but nothing else...ETA? |
| 14:57.41 | Henryk | I had OpenVpn on a Netgear WGT634U once, 200 MHz processor, did about 1.8 MBit/s |
| 14:57.56 | mwester | viq: is that something you wish to test? Perhaps we should add OpenVPN to the feeds... |
| 14:58.23 | CIA-23 | openmoko: 03werner * r3093 10/trunk/src/host/usbpath/ (8 files): |
| 14:58.23 | CIA-23 | openmoko: Library and utility to convert between USB device numbers and physical paths |
| 14:58.23 | CIA-23 | openmoko: to devices. |
| 14:58.55 | viq | Yes, I would be using it I believe. My wireless at home is protected by firewall and VPN instead of WEP/WPA/WhatevER |
| 14:59.27 | abraxa_ | Holy crap, Werner committed something! *drops jaw in awe* |
| 14:59.40 | *** join/#openmoko pH5 (n=ph5@dsl-62-220-14-162.berlikomm.net) |
| 14:59.41 | Henryk | viq: i had that too, when my laptop couldn't do wpa. (i had something like PPPoE over OpenVPN over Wifi) |
| 14:59.54 | viq | lol |
| 15:00.12 | viq | Yeah, my OS of choice is OpenBSD, which doesn't do WPA just yet |
| 15:00.18 | mwester | :) |
| 15:00.22 | Henryk | (oh, and in the PPPoE there was another OpenVPN to the university) |
| 15:00.35 | *** join/#openmoko jaebird (n=jaebird@unaffiliated/jaebird) |
| 15:00.44 | viq | argh, what MTU did you have with so many layers? |
| 15:01.14 | Henryk | hmm, didn't care, let openvpn do the fragmentation stuff |
| 15:01.29 | viq | Which reminds me that "one of those days" I should have a look why the IPSec stopped being happy with my setup. |
| 15:02.44 | *** part/#openmoko semka (n=babushka@homeuser77.43.148.116.ccl.perm.ru) |
| 15:04.00 | Gopi | We're getting a voice T1 at work, with Asterisk, and the Neo1973 could do some interesting least cost routing tricks. |
| 15:04.12 | viq | And yes, OpenVPN in default packages would be nice ;) |
| 15:04.52 | viq | Gopi: sounds like an interesting thing :) |
| 15:05.11 | viq | speaking of, there still isn't any IM client done yet? |
| 15:05.21 | *** join/#openmoko poseidon (n=poseidon@X6de5.x.pppool.de) |
| 15:05.32 | Henryk | hmm, there's openvpn in oe and builds fine |
| 15:05.48 | Gopi | I'm buying a compact PC with an fxo pci card, and putting in a gsm module as well |
| 15:06.50 | Gopi | Foreigm country: 2x local sim, net at the hotel --> cellphone to voip |
| 15:07.38 | *** join/#openmoko derFrank_ (n=Frank@Pb230.p.pppool.de) |
| 15:07.54 | Gopi | Want the phone to dial the voip box and do in band dtmf signalling for the actual outgoing number |
| 15:08.32 | *** join/#openmoko fobos (n=fobos@78.90.88.72) |
| 15:08.34 | viq | Wow. And I didn't get around to setting up my own asterisk yet... ;) |
| 15:08.35 | mwester | Henryk: Yep, that's the OpenVPN I've been using for some time. It should work fine. |
| 15:09.03 | Gopi | Incoming, immediate answer, dtmf decode of actual caller id, present ring to the user |
| 15:09.39 | viq | anyway, back in a while, time to take care of rest of my dinner ;) |
| 15:09.43 | Gopi | viq: this will be my first non virtual asterisk config. |
| 15:10.20 | Gopi | We just got aastra etheenet phones. They can do xml browsing |
| 15:12.16 | Gopi | So...when can I add openmoko to this package...? |
| 15:13.57 | *** join/#openmoko bentob0x (n=laurent@ip-213-49-73-152.dsl.scarlet.be) |
| 15:14.04 | abraxa_ | Gopi: You mean "when will OpenMoko be able to do VoIP calls"? |
| 15:16.14 | *** join/#openmoko white_gecko (n=natanael@1Cust162.tnt5.ber2.deu.da.uu.net) |
| 15:16.42 | abraxa_ | ~lart GTK's theming abilities |
| 15:16.42 | apt | readies the nuke launcher and fires some rounds at GTK's theming abilities |
| 15:17.39 | Henryk | I think voip should in principle work already. I think i used one of the command line sip clients. could get it to do simultaneous recording and playback though |
| 15:17.41 | *** part/#openmoko white_gecko (n=natanael@1Cust162.tnt5.ber2.deu.da.uu.net) |
| 15:18.34 | mjr | yeah it's all about integration |
| 15:22.45 | *** join/#openmoko PBeck (n=PBeck@HSI-KBW-091-089-102-236.hsi2.kabelbw.de) |
| 15:22.55 | PBeck | hi |
| 15:25.18 | *** join/#openmoko _andred (i=bnc@duffeck.de) |
| 15:33.56 | Gopi | Direct phone voip isn't interesting to me before wifi is there. Good power managment and a robust calling and address book system is what I need |
| 15:34.50 | *** join/#openmoko dcorking (n=dcorking@82.153.78.153) |
| 15:35.12 | Gopi | Last I looked, the wiki indicated that the neo1973 didn't have that. |
| 15:35.56 | mjr | correct, not any of those |
| 15:37.11 | Gopi | Any guesses as to when those will be there? |
| 15:37.44 | abraxa_ | I would guess 3 months tops |
| 15:39.22 | Gopi | '02 == Wi-Fi enabled hardware? |
| 15:39.26 | cb22 | yeo |
| 15:39.28 | cb22 | yep* |
| 15:39.39 | XorA | cb22: nah, we will all be playing with the shineys too much to code stuff |
| 15:39.47 | cb22 | hehe |
| 15:40.01 | Gopi | Will ebay be flooded with cheap 01s? |
| 15:40.05 | cb22 | ooh, i wonder if i can make it when i wave the phone around in a specific patern it will unlock |
| 15:40.39 | XorA | in morse |
| 15:40.57 | Gopi | I want morse ring tones |
| 15:41.05 | XorA | like Nokia |
| 15:41.15 | cb22 | XorA, now make it :) |
| 15:41.48 | XorA | there used to be linux support for error message by morse on caps LED, wonder if we can re-use that |
| 15:42.03 | Gopi | If there are good apis, it isn't hard to do this |
| 15:42.29 | viq | Gopi: what do you mean by "virtual asterisk config"? |
| 15:42.32 | Henryk | XorA: if it uses the led device class for morsing than it should work with the vibrator! |
| 15:43.07 | XorA | Henryk: but that would cause feedback problem with accelleraometer |
| 15:43.14 | Gopi | There are so many nifty things I want to do with my phone that are easy with OSS / impossible without |
| 15:43.43 | Gopi | viq: remote SIP to PSTN gateways only |
| 15:43.57 | *** join/#openmoko tr2x (n=alvar@80-218-164-205.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 15:44.32 | Gopi | viq: used asterisk to man in the middle phone calls in user studies |
| 15:45.26 | viq | ah, ok |
| 15:45.39 | Gopi | It clearly has to be interactive pr0n |
| 15:45.56 | viq | Asterisk is on my list of things I would like to play with, set up on my box to have a way to have voice conversations with people |
| 15:46.03 | viq | lol |
| 15:46.16 | viq | "shake it, baby!!" |
| 15:47.15 | *** join/#openmoko danilos (n=danilo@adsl-236-193.eunet.yu) |
| 15:47.40 | Gopi | viq: asterisk is a bit annoying. You configure it like a pbx. Confusing if you don't want to use it that way. |
| 15:48.16 | viq | PBX? |
| 15:48.58 | *** part/#openmoko orzo (n=joe@adsl-074-236-102-092.sip.bct.bellsouth.net) |
| 15:49.02 | mwester | XorA: I seem to recall that someone extended the LEDs mechanism in the kernel to do Morse not too long ago... |
| 15:53.47 | *** join/#openmoko gopi_ (n=gopi@64.213.69.83) |
| 15:54.46 | gopi_ | PBX == Private Branch Exchange. |
| 15:58.14 | viq | ah, ~= "internal phone network" |
| 15:58.55 | mwester | What most folks refer to as the "phone switch" instead of the handset. |
| 15:59.32 | gopi_ | Yes, but a private phone switch. One that you can screw around with yourself. |
| 15:59.39 | mwester | The neo is interesting because it can do both handset and pbx... that's cool. |
| 15:59.48 | *** join/#openmoko pleemans (n=peter@d51A5E76A.access.telenet.be) |
| 16:00.08 | *** join/#openmoko lostgeek (n=aschenba@xdsl-87-78-247-148.netcologne.de) |
| 16:00.22 | *** join/#openmoko Ophelia (n=Ophelia@pD9EABADE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 16:00.28 | *** join/#openmoko mypapit (n=mypapit@161.45.49.60.kmr01-home.tm.net.my) |
| 16:01.15 | viq | hehe, yeah. "hey, why was your server not reachable in the morning?" "sorry, I was in a subway..." ;) |
| 16:02.02 | gopi_ | You can't do simultaneous voice and data either :( |
| 16:04.51 | gopi_ | I was thinking that a phone with GPRS and CDMA EVDO radios would be nifty. |
| 16:05.20 | gopi_ | Fast data in most parts of the US, + world data everywhere. |
| 16:06.52 | *** join/#openmoko j_ack (n=j_ack@p508D9EEA.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 16:07.01 | Henryk | viq: *lol* |
| 16:07.12 | *** join/#openmoko tr2x_ (n=alvar@80-218-164-205.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 16:07.30 | abraxa_ | Anyone with GTK theming experience around? |
| 16:08.57 | *** join/#openmoko moo (n=sexycows@oul110-gw4.netplaza.fi) |
| 16:11.21 | *** part/#openmoko tomjoad4500 (n=tomjoad4@adsl-70-130-137-193.dsl.stlsmo.swbell.net) |
| 16:12.16 | CIA-23 | openmoko: 03werner * r3094 10/trunk/src/host/usbpath/ (Makefile libusbpath.pc.in): - added provision of libusbpath.pc |
| 16:14.53 | ar0x | ~seen roh |
| 16:14.56 | apt | roh is currently on #oe #openmoko. Has said a total of 44 messages. Is idling for 2d 4h 12m 49s, last said: 'nibbo_ stinks like gcc3 vs gcc4 .. which gcc are you using?'. |
| 16:17.07 | *** join/#openmoko fobos (n=fobos@78.90.88.72) |
| 16:23.17 | *** join/#openmoko rd_ (n=dr@toi.yeu.phu.nu) |
| 16:24.05 | *** join/#openmoko lostgeek_ (n=aschenba@xdsl-87-78-247-148.netcologne.de) |
| 16:25.49 | Henryk | anybody with om commit rights here? http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=902 has a patch. i was just about to fix the same problem but then noticed that somebody else already posted a patch |
| 16:26.57 | zecke | Henryk: I can do that... |
| 16:27.04 | Henryk | thanks |
| 16:33.58 | |R | is it an upstart like system ? |
| 16:34.31 | XorA | nope |
| 16:35.01 | *** join/#openmoko zblach (n=zblach@bas2-windsor12-1177686365.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 16:36.40 | hrw | I know how to make it boot a 'bit faster' from user point of view ;D\ |
| 16:41.32 | *** join/#openmoko kuyky (n=kuyky@81.84.150.241) |
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| 16:54.53 | *** join/#openmoko Fradeve (n=fradeve@87.13.133.78) |
| 16:56.24 | Fradeve | quick dirty question: which is actually the maximum time for the battery? There are news inspite of that written in Wiki/FAQ? |
| 16:56.45 | abraxa_ | Maximum time? |
| 16:59.50 | Fradeve | abraxa_: the during of the battery, some notices are written in WIki/"Approximate power draw of various subsystems" but I want to know if there are news on this topic by users themselves |
| 17:00.26 | *** join/#openmoko Gopi (n=root|iPh@64.213.69.83) |
| 17:00.37 | abraxa_ | Do you mean the estimated maximum running time with all power management features in place? |
| 17:00.52 | abraxa_ | Cause currently there are pretty much... none |
| 17:00.52 | *** join/#openmoko sagacis|livingro (n=sagacis@cpe-76-185-118-188.tx.res.rr.com) |
| 17:00.56 | Fradeve | yeah |
| 17:01.09 | abraxa_ | Well, that can't be guessed really |
| 17:01.27 | Fradeve | abraxa_: for this reason I'm searching for news :) |
| 17:02.45 | abraxa_ | Unfortunately that won't be very successful as any guess at this point would be a wild speculation |
| 17:02.46 | Writchie | Fradeve: best guess at moment is about 30 hours standby (GSM ready for incoming call or SMS) |
| 17:03.06 | Writchie | abraxa_: standby is not wild speculation. |
| 17:03.16 | Writchie | i.e. suspend to RAM |
| 17:03.50 | Fradeve | Writchie: and with an active using? I mean calling, sending/receiving sms, webworking, reading rss etc? |
| 17:04.12 | XorA | Fradeve: about 2 hours |
| 17:04.13 | Writchie | talk time depends on what you're doing and how far from the tower |
| 17:04.26 | Writchie | 2 to 3 hours is best guess at moment for GTA01 |
| 17:04.45 | Fradeve | XorA: is exactly the kind of information I'm searching for ;) |
| 17:04.51 | Fradeve | Writchie: ook |
| 17:05.09 | abraxa_ | Writchie: I stand corrected then |
| 17:05.25 | Sup3rkiddo | hmm...webkit-gtk is taking unusually long to compile |
| 17:05.33 | XorA | Fradeve: I havent measured it but from memory when I forget to plug in power its about 2 hours when you are using machine to the dgree it cant sleep[ |
| 17:06.15 | Fradeve | XorA: mmm interesting |
| 17:06.29 | Fradeve | ok thanks for "news" and good work to all ;) |
| 17:06.29 | Henryk | XorA: I think I have about the same |
| 17:06.41 | XorA | of course when talking we will shut down a lot of stuff like screen |
| 17:09.12 | AntonTakk | XorA: so you can't put it on speaker and check your calendar while talking? ;) |
| 17:09.33 | XorA | AntonTakk: when you touch screen it will turn back on |
| 17:09.41 | AntonTakk | ah |
| 17:09.43 | AntonTakk | ok |
| 17:09.54 | AntonTakk | i misunderstood your meaning then |
| 17:09.55 | Writchie | XorA: and if handled right the touch will not do anything |
| 17:10.08 | Writchie | other than wake up display |
| 17:10.18 | viq | What about your cheek/ear then when talking? |
| 17:10.38 | XorA | viq: what happens on other phones? |
| 17:10.52 | Writchie | viq: u learn not to operate phone with your ear |
| 17:10.55 | cjb_ie | screen, backlight and touch screen stay on on my p910i when on the phone... sometimes bad things happen when my face touches the screen |
| 17:11.02 | viq | Other phones don't have most of their surface covered by touch-sensitive screen ;) |
| 17:11.32 | XorA | viq: hmmm, mine does |
| 17:11.34 | Writchie | p800 has about the same % screen and i've never found it to be a problem |
| 17:11.46 | viq | Writchie: or maybe you actually learn to operate phone with your ear ;) |
| 17:12.03 | Writchie | viq: ;) which i could |
| 17:12.04 | cjb_ie | Writchie: but if you start call with the flip down...? |
| 17:12.20 | Writchie | i haven't had a real flip installed for 4 years |
| 17:12.39 | cjb_ie | ah, you use the pretend flip |
| 17:12.46 | Writchie | yes |
| 17:12.55 | cjb_ie | on the p910i the flip is hardwired in as it has a keypad on both sides |
| 17:12.58 | viq | Eh, my current phone is SE k700i. Which I am looking to replace now. |
| 17:13.02 | Writchie | and i must say neo touch screen works far better |
| 17:13.13 | *** join/#openmoko borg_ (n=olaf@80.149.17.21) |
| 17:13.15 | cjb_ie | Writchie: i did like the poke-through on my p800 flip though |
| 17:13.40 | Writchie | it's cute but the phone itself is a bit big |
| 17:13.40 | *** join/#openmoko X1000v1 (i=X1000v3@gateway/tor/x-cd6f259cd73a9e53) |
| 17:13.51 | *** join/#openmoko xamindar (n=xamindar@adsl-69-239-79-217.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net) |
| 17:14.27 | cjb_ie | my p910i is slowly dying... wonder how long till gta02 will be usable enough to put my sim in |
| 17:14.52 | *** join/#openmoko El_Salvador[Away (n=Brescia@adsl-155-180.38-151.net24.it) |
| 17:15.05 | Writchie | GTA01 is getting close - maybe just a week or two more at least for qtopia load |
| 17:15.07 | cjb_ie | (the latest joy on the p910i is some sort of failure mode where it crashes in high current consumption mode, and flattens the battery from full in a couple of hours) |
| 17:15.26 | Writchie | cjb_ie: p800's do the same |
| 17:15.37 | Writchie | one or twice a week |
| 17:15.38 | cjb_ie | Writchie: don't remember it ever happening on my p800 |
| 17:15.57 | cjb_ie | and i had it for a couple of years, till the battery was worn out |
| 17:16.02 | Writchie | may be network dependant |
| 17:16.13 | cjb_ie | i've had the p910i nearly three years now |
| 17:16.15 | Writchie | just by new batteries |
| 17:16.37 | cjb_ie | it's tempting, but i wanted the flashiness of the 910 anyway :) |
| 17:16.47 | cjb_ie | though in hindsight, i preferred the ui on the p800 |
| 17:17.06 | Writchie | p800 was the pinnacle and will be replaced by the neo |
| 17:17.28 | Writchie | but probably not until GT03 when BT is straightened out |
| 17:17.42 | viq | What's wrong with BT now? |
| 17:17.45 | *** join/#openmoko bedboi (n=bedboi@70.158.103.10) |
| 17:17.56 | Writchie | can't be woken up from headset |
| 17:18.05 | cjb_ie | ah, yes, dammit, bt. i've recently actually started using bt for handsfree in the car |
| 17:18.19 | Writchie | which means you can't press the button and use the phone - you have to physicall handle the phone |
| 17:18.30 | Writchie | JPFS |
| 17:18.38 | viq | Ah, thank you, I was about to ask. |
| 17:19.31 | Writchie | just plain f*%^^& stupid |
| 17:21.45 | *** join/#openmoko der__io (n=der@p54A0FCFD.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 17:22.12 | *** join/#openmoko chris^ (n=kraetzi@ACB6CC29.ipt.aol.com) |
| 17:27.06 | gopi_ | I've had two P800s start burning out their LCDs. |
| 17:27.11 | gopi_ | Bottom part of the display turns black. |
| 17:28.06 | *** join/#openmoko peepsalot (n=peeps@cpe-70-112-23-104.austin.res.rr.com) |
| 17:31.15 | Writchie | gopi_: something growing over the backlight? |
| 17:32.11 | abraxa_ | Writchie: Growing as in... fungus? |
| 17:32.13 | gopi_ | Writchie: No, not backlight. something 3/4 the width of the screen at the bottom, nearly 1cm at the middle. |
| 17:32.31 | gopi_ | Totally black. |
| 17:32.32 | Writchie | abraxa_ or mold? |
| 17:32.52 | Writchie | gopi: sounds like the lcd driver chip |
| 17:33.09 | gopi_ | It's there when the LCD is off. |
| 17:33.17 | gopi_ | And it's not pixel shaped. |
| 17:33.29 | gopi_ | Perhaps there's a serious DC bias in there. |
| 17:33.44 | Writchie | is it exactly the same on both? |
| 17:33.51 | gopi_ | It grows. |
| 17:34.05 | gopi_ | But it is _extremely_ similar. |
| 17:34.23 | gopi_ | One of them was like that when it was loaned to me. |
| 17:34.32 | gopi_ | Mine started to do that afterwards. |
| 17:34.46 | Writchie | maybe its infectious ;) |
| 17:35.10 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@139.80-202-160.nextgentel.com) |
| 17:35.34 | Writchie | p800 is so old now its hard to compain about much |
| 17:35.54 | gopi_ | It's not caused by a single defective charger, or by some unique mistreatment from me :) |
| 17:35.56 | orospakr | hm, my Neo finally got a GPS fix. you just have to wait a while. a while being, like, half an hour. |
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| 17:36.07 | gopi_ | Writchie: Mmm. But. I've just *never* seen this from an LCD. |
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| 17:36.36 | Writchie | me neither, and i've seen lots of partially broken ones |
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| 17:37.44 | Writchie | if its across in even lines then some kind of bias anomoly may be spreading from one end to the other |
| 17:38.50 | gopi_ | It's an arc. |
| 17:39.04 | Writchie | from one corner? |
| 17:39.24 | gopi_ | LIke there's this massive ~8cm circle taht just started to cast a shadow... |
| 17:39.31 | gopi_ | All four corners are perfect. |
| 17:39.40 | gopi_ | the shadow's thickest point is precisely in the middle. |
| 17:39.48 | gopi_ | at the bottom. |
| 17:39.54 | CIA-23 | openmoko: 03zecke * r3095 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/applications/openmoko-dialer2/ (ChangeLog src/moko-keypad.c): |
| 17:39.54 | CIA-23 | openmoko: 2007-10-06 Holger Hans Peter Freyther <zecke@selfish.org> |
| 17:39.54 | CIA-23 | openmoko: openmoko-dialer display isn't cleared after pin is sent |
| 17:39.54 | CIA-23 | openmoko: -http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=902 |
| 17:39.55 | CIA-23 | openmoko: * src/moko-keypad.c: |
| 17:39.56 | Writchie | gopi_ : that is characteristic of physical damange at one point. |
| 17:39.57 | CIA-23 | openmoko: (on_dial_clicked): |
| 17:39.59 | CIA-23 | openmoko: (on_panel_user_input): |
| 17:40.00 | gopi_ | So at first you would get a tiny sliver of black in the middle. |
| 17:40.13 | Writchie | do you ever put in back pocket? |
| 17:40.31 | Writchie | or carry keys in same pocket and bump against something |
| 17:40.46 | gopi_ | Writchie: Back pocket, only with cargo pants and without sitting down. |
| 17:41.08 | gopi_ | Writchie: The odd thing is that my boss's P800 did the same thing. |
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| 17:41.21 | Writchie | gopi_: it doesn't take all that much |
| 17:41.42 | Writchie | the p800 plastic touchscreen is very hard |
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| 17:41.55 | gopi_ | I haven't heavly abused it, but I can't say I treated it like a piece of artwork. |
| 17:42.34 | Writchie | i have large lcd's with similar effect - black bullet hole. |
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| 17:42.55 | gopi_ | Interesting. So what causes it? Pressure point? |
| 17:43.08 | Writchie | yes - usually a sharp blow |
| 17:43.28 | gopi_ | My 770's LCD is scary; the touch screen is very flexible. |
| 17:43.41 | Writchie | i know |
| 17:43.53 | Writchie | iPhone is probably best. |
| 17:44.00 | Writchie | neo is not too bad so far |
| 17:44.10 | gopi_ | The flip on the P800 is an interesting pressure point. |
| 17:44.30 | Writchie | gopi_ there's a gap in the p800 |
| 17:44.56 | Writchie | causes some parallax |
| 17:45.37 | gopi_ | The iPhone's parallax is epsilon. |
| 17:45.39 | gopi_ | They cheated. :) |
| 17:45.52 | gopi_ | Your finger is so massive compared to parallax that it doesn't matter. |
| 17:46.09 | Writchie | gopi_: is the anomoly related to one of the keypad points from the flip: |
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| 17:46.35 | Writchie | gopi_: yes - the touch resolution is barely usable on p800 but excellent on neo |
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| 17:47.18 | gopi_ | I don't have my P800s with reach ATM. |
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| 18:07.42 | emre_ | Is gtkmm & libglademm supported ? |
| 18:08.14 | zecke | emre_: supported in which way? |
| 18:08.17 | hrw | emre_: they are available |
| 18:09.09 | emre_ | When I try to compile pulse audio volume control program, at configure it gives the error | No package 'gtkmm-2.4' found |
| 18:09.09 | emre_ | | No package 'libglademm-2.4' found |
| 18:09.09 | emre_ | | No package 'sigc++-2.0' found |
| 18:09.14 | emre_ | with mokomakefile. |
| 18:10.03 | emre_ | I guess somehow I need to compile and install them into staging, right? |
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| 18:37.26 | loufoque | emre_: why do you want to use gtkmm-2.4? The latest version doesn't please you? |
| 18:38.01 | emre_ | I'm trying to compile a pulseaudio volume control application, and it requires it. |
| 18:39.00 | loufoque | emre_: why do you want to use gtkmm-2.4? The latest version doesn't please you? |
| 18:39.26 | emre_ | loufoque: I'm trying to compile a pulseaudio volume control application, and it requires it. |
| 18:41.41 | loufoque | ok |
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| 18:51.34 | PBeck | re |
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| 18:56.54 | hrw | loufoque: it is rather gtkmm 2.4 OR newer |
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| 19:07.29 | emre_ | for some reason the pulseaudio volume control program does not work. |
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| 19:21.33 | ScaredyCat | w00t! |
| 19:22.53 | ljp | ? |
| 19:23.01 | zecke | ljp: hi |
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| 19:23.20 | ljp | hi zecke |
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| 19:25.52 | ScaredyCat | ljp: you got the handwritting working |
| 19:25.55 | ScaredyCat | :) |
| 19:26.06 | ljp | :) |
| 19:26.13 | ScaredyCat | v good! |
| 19:26.19 | ScaredyCat | once you get the hang of it :D |
| 19:26.33 | ljp | just a theme thing |
| 19:26.37 | ScaredyCat | ahh.. |
| 19:26.43 | ljp | dont know why they named it "PhoneKeys" |
| 19:27.04 | ScaredyCat | the screen lock is a bit iffy... (from the home screen padlock) |
| 19:27.10 | ScaredyCat | leaves a key trail |
| 19:27.40 | ljp | ya. someone made changes to exportedbackgrounds, I heard. havent looked into it, as the UI guys took a holiday |
| 19:27.49 | ljp | but we get 4 more neos on Monday |
| 19:27.54 | ScaredyCat | cool |
| 19:27.56 | ljp | one is headed for the UI group |
| 19:28.07 | ScaredyCat | it's working quite well ... |
| 19:28.23 | ScaredyCat | glad that the timezone selection map is bigger too :D |
| 19:28.27 | ljp | I have seen some instability creep in.. random crashing |
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| 19:29.00 | ScaredyCat | not had any yet, will keep testing though |
| 19:29.31 | hrw | ljp: keyboard lack backspace |
| 19:29.42 | ljp | which one? |
| 19:29.46 | hrw | qtopia one |
| 19:29.49 | kristian-m | wiki-problem: The upload directory (/space/www/wiki/images) is not writable by the webserver. |
| 19:30.18 | *** join/#openmoko drath_ (i=vmaster@p5B07EA81.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 19:30.23 | hrw | ljp: I played a bit with qtopia image on one phone here |
| 19:30.29 | abraxa_ | kristian-m: Mind filing a bug report with some nice severity? |
| 19:30.49 | abraxa_ | hrw: I thought backspace is achieved by a stroke to the left |
| 19:30.51 | ljp | I talked about the predictivekeyboard one backspace/backword thing. |
| 19:31.04 | ScaredyCat | hrw: it does... it's tiny though |
| 19:31.06 | ljp | to the inutmethod guy. he was open to changin it |
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| 19:31.12 | ScaredyCat | top right of the keyboard |
| 19:31.25 | ScaredyCat | next to = |
| 19:32.18 | zecke | alphaone: have you read the above? |
| 19:32.41 | alphaone | zecke: no, one moment |
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| 19:35.43 | kristian-m | abraxa_ done |
| 19:36.01 | cdbot2 | * * OM Bug 914 has been created by kristian(AT)mput.de |
| 19:36.02 | cdbot2 | * * File upload to wiki not working |
| 19:36.03 | cdbot2 | * * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=914 |
| 19:36.07 | abraxa_ | kristian-m: Thanks :) |
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| 20:09.42 | nbd | ossman: ping |
| 20:10.34 | mboldisc | Does anyone have a list of US wireless companies that the Neo 1973 will run on? |
| 20:11.30 | viq | mboldisc: any that offer GSM services |
| 20:11.33 | ljp | i believe cingualr and t-mobile both have pre paid sim cards |
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| 20:14.20 | mboldisc | I'm really excited about the GPS capability of GTA02, any hints on what mapping software will be running? |
| 20:14.43 | guaqua | whatever people write on it |
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| 20:16.51 | mboldisc | i.e. it has not been worked on? |
| 20:17.03 | guaqua | i doubt |
| 20:17.08 | mboldisc | doh |
| 20:17.10 | guaqua | you should see openstreetmap |
| 20:17.28 | guaqua | there are clients that might be somewhat easily portable to neo |
| 20:17.30 | SpeedEvil | Mapping software is not maps. |
| 20:17.51 | guaqua | SpeedEvil: openstreetmap + client software for it - happier? |
| 20:18.23 | SpeedEvil | client software for OSM - yes. |
| 20:18.29 | SpeedEvil | I don't think JOSM will cut it :) |
| 20:18.45 | guaqua | yeah, there are no good options as it is |
| 20:19.08 | SpeedEvil | Well - there is GPS logging then JOSM on desktop |
| 20:19.14 | guaqua | but that was just one place to start looking for options and maybe pointers on how to do it |
| 20:19.21 | SpeedEvil | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Openstreetmap |
| 20:19.21 | mboldisc | I see, so the software isn't the problem, it's the map data? |
| 20:19.42 | guaqua | maps are mostly closed |
| 20:19.48 | SpeedEvil | Openstreetmap supplies rudimentary data for most of the planet, and pretty compleete for US and NL |
| 20:19.48 | mboldisc | argh |
| 20:20.00 | guaqua | morelike only closed and they cost money |
| 20:20.08 | SpeedEvil | Tiger and AND data have been donated by various bodies. |
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| 20:20.51 | guaqua | i hope governments start to offer some geospatial data for free |
| 20:21.17 | SpeedEvil | Unlikely in many countries. |
| 20:21.22 | guaqua | true |
| 20:21.39 | guaqua | unlikely in finland... |
| 20:21.46 | SpeedEvil | The tendancy in the past hundred years has been to spin-out the mapping arm of government into the private sector |
| 20:22.00 | guaqua | even though it can easily be seen that not much money is made from taking the highest possible price from it |
| 20:22.13 | guaqua | same with weather data |
| 20:22.15 | SpeedEvil | for example, in the US, it went fairly recently - and is now a largely commercial orientation. |
| 20:22.25 | SpeedEvil | Supported by data sales. |
| 20:22.48 | guaqua | in the US there's volume to actually get the process going. here in finland i doubt... |
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| 20:48.41 | gopi_ | Good rendering of maps is often a problem, but if the data were there I think many more apps would come. |
| 20:48.59 | gopi_ | IMHO, one of the serious issues is that map licensing and FOSS are really, really incompatible. |
| 20:49.34 | gopi_ | like FOSS and DRM. |
| 20:50.05 | viq | Hmm, DRM for FOSS, so noone can remove the licence ;) |
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| 20:57.50 | SpeedEvil | NL and US have pretty good maps in openstreetmap - at least in a few weeks when the tiger import completes |
| 20:58.02 | SpeedEvil | (it's currently stalled due to disk space problems) |
| 20:58.20 | gopi_ | Ooh. New Tiger data? I haven't been paying attention for awhle. |
| 20:58.31 | SpeedEvil | 1/3(?) of the US has been imported. |
| 20:58.49 | viq | What is Tiger? |
| 20:59.01 | gopi_ | US Census Bureau, Tiger Line Data. |
| 20:59.07 | viq | oh, ok |
| 20:59.18 | gopi_ | Every block of every street, start and end lat/lon, left/right street numbers. |
| 20:59.27 | gopi_ | totally free. |
| 21:00.35 | viq | nice |
| 21:01.18 | gopi_ | AIUI, it's the starting point for more proprietary data sets too. |
| 21:02.52 | *** join/#openmoko daMaestro (n=jon@fedora/damaestro) |
| 21:06.54 | emre_ | openmoko-mediaplayer is too damn slow. |
| 21:07.42 | moko-bunny | it works for you? it gives me an error everytime I try to launch it |
| 21:08.06 | emre_ | I just find out why. |
| 21:08.17 | emre_ | you need to install pulseaudio plugins for gstreamer |
| 21:08.32 | rwhitby | morning |
| 21:08.32 | emre_ | ipkg install gst-plugin-pulse |
| 21:08.40 | moko-bunny | ahhh...okay :) |
| 21:08.58 | moko-bunny | mornin |
| 21:09.09 | emre_ | but the quality is too bad. |
| 21:09.19 | emre_ | there is no continuous sound. |
| 21:09.35 | mwester | abraxa_ knows about this, I think. |
| 21:09.37 | SpeedEvil | what sort of file? |
| 21:09.44 | emre_ | ogg |
| 21:09.52 | SpeedEvil | mp3 may use less CPU |
| 21:10.01 | emre_ | ok, let me try. |
| 21:14.12 | emre_ | no mp3 does not work either. |
| 21:14.58 | moko-bunny | madplay used to work decent with mp3's |
| 21:15.03 | emre_ | but the problem is either with the mediaplayer. because none of the console players has a performance problem. |
| 21:15.11 | *** join/#openmoko Gopi (n=root|iPh@64.213.69.83) |
| 21:15.18 | emre_ | i tried all madplay, ogg123, paplay. |
| 21:15.44 | emre_ | the problem with madplay & ogg123 is that they are not aware of pulseaudio, so they don't work always. |
| 21:15.49 | emre_ | and paplay only plays wavs |
| 21:16.03 | rwhitby | hmm - midori seems to be failing to build ... |
| 21:16.06 | moko-bunny | ahhh...that's why madplay quite working for me |
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| 21:23.31 | rwhitby | so what's the latest on gsmd - can I remove the restart in xsession yet? |
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| 21:35.02 | cindy | rwhitby: FWIW I just flashed the latest (just finished building) and it sends and receives calls without restart in xsession |
| 21:35.45 | rwhitby | cindy: thx |
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| 23:38.18 | dcordes | NOTE: package fontconfig-2.4.1-r1: task do_fetch: failed |
| 23:38.21 | dcordes | :( |
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