| 00:00.23 | rwhitby | cworth: I disagree. I want to move to something more "mainline" than monotone. |
| 00:00.47 | cworth | rwhitby: And yeah, the "core team" of openmoko does the right thing by adopting something that exists. It's for casual-time hobbyists to do experiments that reinvent everything. |
| 00:00.53 | cesarb | rwhitby: people are talking here about SCM because someone mentioned the "mtn" word |
| 00:00.58 | cworth | rwhitby: Oh, definitely. |
| 00:01.07 | cesarb | rwhitby: it's one of those "trigger" words for this group of people |
| 00:01.08 | Ghiottone | kristian-m, well it prints just atz. and when terminal is back again, it overwrites even the atz |
| 00:01.10 | kristian-m | Ghiottone btw "excecutes subprocess" does not show the system-calles comandline? |
| 00:01.17 | Ghiottone | kristian-m, no |
| 00:01.20 | cworth | rwhitby: I _will_ be working on convincing people to change eventually. Just that it's the "get something working" stage right now. |
| 00:02.03 | kristian-m | Ghiottone but you have got /etc/ppp/peers/latest_... ? |
| 00:02.17 | cworth | cesarb: I'm talking about SCM here at least until my "mtn update" completes, (since otherwise I'm just waiting for it). About 33% done now(!). |
| 00:02.24 | rwhitby | cworth: excellent - that's the right (and "Linux") way to do it. "show me the working code" ;-) |
| 00:02.26 | Ghiottone | kristian-m, yes |
| 00:03.02 | *** join/#openmoko ccube_ (n=ccube@87.230.22.107) |
| 00:03.03 | rwhitby | I pledge that MokoMakefile will be modified to work with any viable alternative, as part of showing the viability of that alternative. |
| 00:03.07 | Ghiottone | kristian-m, http://pastebin.com/d40a4e7e4 |
| 00:03.16 | kristian-m | Ghiottone i whish i could reconstruct it here... I'll try a clean install |
| 00:03.49 | cworth | rwhitby: Awesome. So nobody else I need to convince for now. ;-) |
| 00:04.25 | Ghiottone | kristian-m, this is with contents http://pastebin.com/d6b27469f |
| 00:04.28 | rwhitby | cworth: I need an excuse to use git, cause I eventually want to replace svn on two continents at work with git. |
| 00:04.53 | kristian-m | Ghiottone can you also pastebin a cat /etc/ppp/peers/* please? |
| 00:05.00 | cworth | But yeah, if we _really_ want to throw away the entire approach that openembedded currently uses, (patches inside of version control), then something like a tailor conversion might not be what we want anyway. |
| 00:05.32 | Ghiottone | kristian-m, did it. do you want the full dir or is that enough? |
| 00:05.33 | hozer | cworth: I'm going to suggest you start by pulling down the GCC mercurial repo |
| 00:05.46 | rwhitby | cworth: that's a whole different ball game. I think people should wait to see what OM comes up with for the "binary SDK and toolchain" that mickey|sports has been talking about. |
| 00:05.54 | cworth | Might be better to take the whole source tree that results currently, shove that all into git, and then just go forward by applying new openembedded patches from there. |
| 00:05.55 | hozer | and then check the patches that OE/Openmoko/mokomakefile end up applying in |
| 00:06.01 | kristian-m | Ghiottone ahkay, thanks |
| 00:06.16 | cesarb | cworth: the openembedded approach is a proven approach used by every single linux distribution |
| 00:06.25 | cworth | hozer: Yeah. And that might be a faster way to get me to where I want to be. |
| 00:06.31 | *** part/#openmoko cindy (n=cindy@c-24-218-180-68.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 00:06.33 | cesarb | cworth: all linux distributions I've seen use a "upstream source + patches + control file" model |
| 00:06.47 | rwhitby | cesarb: which is exactly what OE is |
| 00:06.51 | cworth | cesarb: I _work_ for a large distribution, and I've been pushing internally to totally revamp this similarly. |
| 00:07.10 | cworth | cesarb: "Always been done that way" doesn't mean it's right at all. |
| 00:07.49 | cesarb | cworth: good luck, one of the better things of linux is that people can do try different things, and if they succeed (sp?), everyone else can eventually switch |
| 00:07.55 | cworth | cesarb: Things like "git bisect" are really powerful, and I'd _love_ to be able to apply them at the distribution level. |
| 00:08.46 | cworth | cesarb: Yeah. This seems like something that OpenMoko really "gets", (and Nokia's maemo work, for example, totally misses out on by not being 100% free). |
| 00:09.06 | kristian-m | Ghiottone the only thing i see is that you have no number (atdt) there - there should only be one '#' thats a bug - but it should show the at commands before that, i think - try entering *123# or something as number if your provider doen not need one... - hmm still no idea |
| 00:09.26 | cworth | hozer: Since where I want to be is "able to write some neo-targeted games while on a long plane ride tomorrow". |
| 00:09.39 | hozer | heeh yep |
| 00:10.23 | Ghiottone | kristian-m, ok I'm trying |
| 00:11.30 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Talk:IPhone]] [[User:Historybuff/notes]] |
| 00:12.34 | Ghiottone | kristian-m, no difference. http://pastebin.com/d2dfadbb5 |
| 00:14.16 | kristian-m | Ghiottone I guess *99***1# is still the best choice - try: "mv /etc/ppp /etc/ppp_" and restart settingsgui |
| 00:15.10 | kristian-m | Ghiottone you've got 4 other peers there, maybe its best to create a new one from the default scripts within settingsgui |
| 00:15.19 | Ghiottone | kristian-m, ok what exactly should I do? fill in data and click connect? do I have to save anything? which data are mandatory? |
| 00:16.12 | kristian-m | Ghiottone you should fill in the apn and the user - maybe the password - i guess *99***1# is mostly okay |
| 00:16.46 | kristian-m | Ghiottone you dont have to save - this is why i generate the latest_* scripts - so the original configuration does not have to be changed |
| 00:17.40 | Ghiottone | kristian-m, same results |
| 00:18.06 | Ghiottone | http://pastebin.com/d5d1c9744 |
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| 00:19.15 | kristian-m | Ghiottone hmm, mom |
| 00:19.38 | Ghiottone | kristian-m, lol |
| 00:19.56 | kristian-m | Ghiottone got it |
| 00:19.57 | Ghiottone | kristian-m, what should I do to try it manually? what is the command to send AT codes? |
| 00:20.20 | kristian-m | Ghiottone are you sure the .py files are the new once? |
| 00:20.46 | kristian-m | Ghiottone it seems as if you still have an old ProcessInterface.py |
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| 00:21.14 | Ghiottone | kristian-m, mmmm the package has been upgraded |
| 00:21.26 | Ghiottone | kristian-m, I'll try a remove/install |
| 00:21.29 | kristian-m | Ghiottone it should print the subprocess commandline... hmmm |
| 00:22.45 | kristian-m | Ghiottone have you had the mute option in the audio panel? |
| 00:23.32 | Ghiottone | kristian-m, no mute option |
| 00:23.45 | Ghiottone | kristian-m, mmmmmm |
| 00:23.50 | Ghiottone | kristian-m, that should be 0.6 |
| 00:24.09 | kristian-m | Ghiottone that you are still using the files from 0.5 - maybe there are in your current directory |
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| 00:25.37 | kristian-m | Ghiottone 0.5 had a hardcoded start of libgsmd-tool in the ProcessInterface - this is why it ignores its parameters - still strange that you've had no ther issues |
| 00:25.59 | Ghiottone | kristian-m, there were some old files in /usr/lib/python ! |
| 00:26.07 | Ghiottone | kristian-m, I'm checking again |
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| 00:28.23 | Ghiottone | kristian-m, same results :( |
| 00:29.01 | kristian-m | Ghiottone but the output should be different now anyway |
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| 00:30.02 | Ghiottone | same as before |
| 00:30.10 | Ghiottone | should I check manually what is in that file? |
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| 00:31.44 | kristian-m | Ghiottone you can activate the test at the buttom of the file (comment the last 2 lines in) - then you should at least see if it's used |
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| 00:33.08 | Ghiottone | test = test() ? |
| 00:33.30 | kristian-m | right |
| 00:34.55 | kristian-m | Ghiottone and the next one behind - that sould activate a test as soon as the file is included into any other python script |
| 00:35.16 | Ghiottone | no change :( |
| 00:35.43 | Ghiottone | I'm doing a find / |
| 00:35.59 | *** part/#openmoko jseghers_ (n=jseghers@70.90.187.217) |
| 00:36.54 | Ghiottone | there is the .pyo |
| 00:37.00 | Ghiottone | should I remove it? |
| 00:37.26 | kristian-m | Ghiottone oh, yes - that could be it. |
| 00:37.56 | kristian-m | Ghiottone btw, you could do a release with only th .pyo files - should start up faster |
| 00:38.04 | kristian-m | i think |
| 00:38.13 | Ghiottone | kristian-m, that changed |
| 00:38.29 | Ghiottone | kristian-m, but now the interface does not show up... |
| 00:40.25 | kristian-m | Ghiottone the test is still active |
| 00:40.50 | Ghiottone | Test interface |
| 00:40.56 | Ghiottone | Executes subprocess [/bin/sh] |
| 00:41.02 | Ghiottone | is the test blocking? |
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| 00:41.21 | Ghiottone | I think I'll restore the # and clean all the pyo |
| 00:41.24 | Ghiottone | brb |
| 00:41.44 | kristian-m | Ghiottone actually it should not, but who knows what else is happening there... ;-) - cu |
| 00:44.18 | Ghiottone | kristian-m, argh. I have to use my sim. bbl |
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| 00:45.11 | Ghiottone | ah kristian-m , is the right icon the -48 one? |
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| 00:47.12 | kristian-m | Ghiottone i think so - btw. the testinterface hangs you're rigth - haven't used it for a while |
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| 01:02.38 | Guest798 | DOES ANYONE KNOW WHY MY SAMSUNG CANT RECOGNISE MY 2GB STORAGE CARD? |
| 01:02.38 | aloril | Guest798: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1, SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) (Hopefully these links answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) |
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| 01:03.23 | roh | <PROTECTED> |
| 01:03.45 | cesarb | Wow, that was incredibly rude. Asking on a unrelated channel, and yelling... |
| 01:03.53 | cesarb | Not to mention the "guest" nick |
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| 01:09.03 | cesarb | webkit-gtk-0.0+svnr25426-r25427 |
| 01:09.21 | cesarb | someone seems to have commited something _in the middle of my do_fetch_ |
| 01:10.43 | cesarb | I also wonder why do we have a feedreader when we can't even call out-of-the-box yet, but that's another issue |
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| 01:12.25 | roh | cesarb because its a totally different field of working. |
| 01:12.55 | roh | the webkit stuff/feedreader is done by zecke, who got a google summer of code for it. |
| 01:13.22 | cesarb | roh: the problem is that webkit is slow to compile, and wants to compile _every single time_ I do a build |
| 01:13.35 | cesarb | roh: when I'm eager to try out my patch for the gsmd issues |
| 01:14.13 | roh | why don't you build gsmd instead and just install the ipkg? |
| 01:14.24 | mwester | Oh, btw, when Guest-whatever comes back, tell him that we all know why his samsung won't work, but we refuse to tell him. |
| 01:14.50 | mwester | ... and then what? |
| 01:14.54 | cesarb | mwester: yeah, but last time I used my local overlay to change the contents of the rootfs, the way the image was done changed, and I ended breaking my build and having to recompile everything |
| 01:15.24 | cesarb | roh: because I don't have a working rootfs and its matching build environment |
| 01:15.33 | mwester | I didn't do that in an overlay. I edited the file in openembedded/packages; it won't get overwritten. |
| 01:15.41 | roh | hm.. i rebuilt clean yesterday and that was through in about 300min. |
| 01:16.02 | cesarb | roh: your computer is probably faster than mine |
| 01:16.55 | roh | mwester nope.. c2d t7600 at 2.3ghz with 2g ram.. thats enough if you fetched the sources before |
| 01:17.54 | mwester | Hmm. interesting. Takes me 340 minutes to build, with all sources in the download directory, on a dual-core 2.4GHz system, also 2GB RAM |
| 01:18.02 | roh | but i mostly recompile from scratch every few days to find hidden bugs with the buildsys or to replicate reports i get |
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| 01:18.16 | roh | with rm_work it also doesnt take too much space |
| 01:18.20 | cesarb | mwester: I upgraded like the end of last year (from a "slot A" Ahtlon 750 with 256M RAM) |
| 01:18.25 | cesarb | mwester: it's way too soon to upgrade again |
| 01:18.26 | mwester | hehe - I *attempt* to recompile every other day - usually it suceeds about once a week. |
| 01:19.16 | roh | mwester try checking out after europe went to sleep and before taiwan awakes ;) |
| 01:19.36 | roh | about 2-4am CEST |
| 01:20.20 | Ghiottone | back |
| 01:20.25 | Ghiottone | kristian-m, much better now :) |
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| 01:21.43 | Ghiottone | kristian-m, where do you add rss feed to the rss reader? |
| 01:23.14 | roh | mwester ah.. and something which i used to make the compile always compareable long.. the bb cache is already built.. (the thing that counts up tasks at start) |
| 01:23.52 | roh | i used bitbake -g openmoko-devel-image for that... because i need the .dot files anyways from time to time |
| 01:24.20 | mwester | Yeah, that's gotten especialliy bad, as it now connects to SVN and CVS repos as it processes the bb files!!! |
| 01:25.08 | *** part/#openmoko bedboi (i=bedboi@129.24.27.25) |
| 01:25.19 | mwester | (as I discovered the other evening when I tried to build a much smaller OE project from a hotel, on their crappy internet connection) |
| 01:25.43 | cesarb | mwester: it did that also on 2007.1, so it's not that new |
| 01:26.28 | mwester | Ok, then perhaps I've been lucky for two years building with OE... ? |
| 01:26.39 | kristian-m | Ghiottone ./openmoko-feedreader2/src/feed-configuration.c |
| 01:27.02 | kristian-m | Ghiottone nice to hear :-) - are you online with gprs now? |
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| 01:27.21 | cesarb | mwester: on 2007.1 it was even more interesting... it _printed_ the svn/etc revisions while it was parsing the files |
| 01:27.26 | Ghiottone | kristian-m, not yete |
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| 01:28.03 | Ghiottone | http://pastebin.com/d60bdcff |
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| 01:28.33 | Ghiottone | thre tries gradually removing the telefone numbere. program seems to ignore that value |
| 01:29.39 | kristian-m | Ghiottone maybe you'll have to reconnect to the gsm network |
| 01:30.48 | Ghiottone | Ghiottone, with my old phone (a P800) I used to send at+cgdcont=1 |
| 01:31.00 | Ghiottone | s/=1/=5/ |
| 01:31.58 | Ghiottone | I am really too tired now |
| 01:32.06 | Ghiottone | thanks for the help kristian-m |
| 01:32.19 | Ghiottone | I'll keep trying tomorro |
| 01:32.26 | Ghiottone | tomorrow |
| 01:32.30 | Ghiottone | nite all |
| 01:32.50 | kristian-m | Ghiottone 'night i thank you. |
| 01:33.19 | Ghiottone | kristian-m, I think I'll do new package tomorrow, as now I'm too tired and I would probably mistake something |
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| 01:33.40 | kristian-m | i know what you mean ;-) |
| 01:33.58 | Ghiottone | nite alle |
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| 02:39.32 | bedboi | hi there. |
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| 02:47.34 | dotmef | cesarb - how that scratch rebuild go? |
| 02:47.48 | dotmef | s/how/how'd/ |
| 02:47.56 | cesarb | still 2556 of 3331 |
| 02:48.39 | dotmef | cesarb - fingers crossed |
| 02:48.54 | cesarb | dotmef: I don't see why it would not work |
| 02:49.17 | cesarb | dotmef: other than a different build breakage |
| 02:49.37 | dotmef | cesarb - yup |
| 02:50.30 | dotmef | cesarb - did you do an "rm -rf build/tmp" as before? |
| 02:50.51 | cesarb | dotmef: yeah, that's the quickest way to clean the build |
| 02:51.02 | cesarb | dotmef: "make clobber" clobbers too much |
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| 03:01.17 | cesarb | I increased the ccache maximum size, so next time I hope it will build much faster |
| 03:04.03 | roh | compiling is fast and easy... parsing bb files, doing cvs, svn, mtn updates and especially running autoconf/automake generated configures takes ages |
| 03:04.44 | roh | for faster builds, add ram and fast hdd.. fast cpu is only partially helpful |
| 03:05.38 | cesarb | roh: and noatime. Cuts build times in half. |
| 03:11.40 | cesarb | mwester: well, my full build time used to be about two days... I started this one today, and it's already near the end! |
| 03:11.46 | cesarb | mwester: it about halves the time |
| 03:12.04 | cesarb | mwester: and I didn't noatime the other partitions (/ and /home where ccache is) yet |
| 03:12.11 | mwester | That's impressive. I think I'll try that as soon as this one is done, and see what the impact is. |
| 03:12.25 | cesarb | mwester: IIRC, Linus has recently called atime the worst design decision of Unix |
| 03:12.44 | cesarb | mwester: you can set atime _while it is running_... just do a remount |
| 03:12.52 | cesarb | s/atime/noatime/ |
| 03:13.03 | mwester | Yep, but if I remount I won't have a good baseline to compare. |
| 03:13.20 | mwester | Its late here, I'll let it finish and try noatime in the morning. |
| 03:13.23 | cesarb | mwester: who cares about baselines? It's long, and that's all which matters |
| 03:13.39 | mwester | curiosity |
| 03:14.49 | mwester | OE has filled up my root filesystem enough that I actually have a separate partition for nothing but OE... that makes noatime even easier. |
| 03:16.29 | cesarb | mwester: I already had a separate "scratch" partition for things like huge source trees, things copied from my data CDs/DVDs (or which will end up on them), and so on |
| 03:16.52 | cesarb | mwester: it was quite easy to free space on it (just write a couple of data DVDs) and use it |
| 03:18.48 | mwester | I had a big NFS file server that had all the disk space -- but too slow to build with. And my desktop system just had a small 40GB hard drive, with /home (and everything else) on a single root partiion. Hardly ideal, as it turned out. |
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| 03:35.52 | dotmef | cesarb - I've just remounted my build partition as noatime (been meaning to do this) |
| 03:36.14 | dotmef | cesarb - and run a "time make update setup openmoko-devel-image" |
| 03:37.03 | dotmef | cesarb - will see what the improvement is. full builds are usually 10h+, I think |
| 03:37.41 | cesarb | dotmef: you run setup after update? |
| 03:37.57 | cesarb | dotmef: isn't setup meant to be run only once (the first time you use mokomakefile)? |
| 03:38.30 | dotmef | cesarb - dunno - just going by the moko-makefile doco |
| 03:39.21 | dotmef | cesarb - it made sense to me that if I'm running an update that a "setup" might have to be done afterwards |
| 03:39.30 | rwhitby | should be only once, or after a major structural change |
| 03:39.49 | rwhitby | usually, just "make update image" will do |
| 03:40.24 | dotmef | rwhitby, cesarb: ah ok. thx |
| 03:40.36 | cesarb | yay finished |
| 03:41.38 | rwhitby | cesarb: only update-makefile and setup are the ones that need to be separate. update, tools, image, build-qemu can all be in the one make command |
| 03:42.25 | cesarb | rwhitby: I like seeing the output of the openembedded output (to see if there's some change which could make my local overlay break), which is why I always separate it |
| 03:42.35 | rwhitby | nod |
| 03:42.43 | dotmef | rwhitby: what do the moko-devel-tools give one? |
| 03:43.20 | rwhitby | enough for running devirginator |
| 03:43.26 | rwhitby | dfu and openocd |
| 03:43.49 | dotmef | rwhitby: so pointless if you don't have a debug board? |
| 03:44.33 | rwhitby | flash-neo-local uses the dfu-utils-native it builds |
| 03:44.39 | cesarb | dotmef: it gives you dfu-util, which you need to flash |
| 03:45.01 | dotmef | cesarb - I thought I got that anyway with openmoko-devel-image |
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| 03:47.10 | cesarb | dotmef: no, openmoko-devel-image only gets you the rootfs (and as a side effect the kernel) |
| 03:48.15 | cesarb | dotmef: ok, now I got init ;-) |
| 03:48.32 | dotmef | cesarb: w000000000t! :D |
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| 03:59.14 | rwhitby | yeah, image doesn't even get you uboot at the moment |
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| 04:05.37 | cworth | Ouch. And after all of that waiting: |
| 04:05.50 | cworth | mtn: bytes in | bytes out | certs in | revs in |
| 04:05.50 | cworth | mtn: 19.7 M | 2.2 M | 19,324/20,768 | 4,779/5,135 |
| 04:05.50 | cworth | terminate called after throwing an instance of 'informative_failure' |
| 04:05.50 | cworth | <PROTECTED> |
| 04:05.50 | cworth | mtn: fatal signal: Aborted |
| 04:05.50 | cworth | this is almost certainly a bug in monotone. |
| 04:06.34 | roh | smells like it |
| 04:06.44 | roh | what have you done to get so many revisions on a bunch? |
| 04:07.47 | cworth | Just trying to update with MokoMakefile after being away for a while. |
| 04:08.29 | rwhitby | if you don't have local changes, and have a supported version of monotone, it's often better to blow away OE.mtn and download the latest snapshot |
| 04:11.10 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Wish_List_-_OpenMoko_Ringtones_and_Sounds]] |
| 04:15.00 | cesarb | how do I make openembedded rebuild the Packages.gz files after building a package? |
| 04:16.34 | rwhitby | bitbake package-index |
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| 04:17.16 | cesarb | rwhitby: thx (is that useful enough for a new mokomakefile target?) |
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| 04:18.54 | cesarb | rwhitby: hm, no need to, I can see "make build-package-package-index" does that quite nicely |
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| 04:20.21 | cesarb | urgh, predictably it tried to restart gsmd, thus killing the phone |
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| 04:31.23 | cesarb | yeah, my patch changes things alright... |
| 04:31.39 | cesarb | It made the icons bar at the top disappear |
| 04:31.53 | cesarb | And it does seem to avoid the back-to-back issue at ombug 766 |
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| 05:06.36 | bedboi | anyone of you knows a somewhat portable way of getting the mac address of a device? |
| 05:07.19 | bedboi | right now i'm using libnet_get_hwaddr but i want to get rid of libnet |
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| 05:29.45 | roh | bedboi /sys/class/net/<device>/address and addr_len |
| 05:33.08 | bedboi | roh: that's not the most portable way to do |
| 05:38.12 | roh | so what? portable is not always the best idea |
| 05:39.16 | roh | or do you also write your makefiles in bsdmake compliant? |
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| 05:42.25 | roh | no.. really.. what are you trying to do? |
| 05:47.00 | bedboi | dirty stuff with packet forging |
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| 05:54.32 | cesarb | I think I found an interesting thing on gsmd's code |
| 05:54.59 | cesarb | Looks like it will _always_ pipeline the commands, unless the modem's buffer gets full |
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| 05:55.10 | cesarb | See ombug 766 for the details |
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| 06:11.30 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[MokoMakefile]] |
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| 06:32.09 | anticw | cesarb: ok, w/ your patch it works even less now :-/ |
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| 06:38.33 | anticw | cesarb: (actually, i have local changes, i should isolate those first) |
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| 06:54.47 | ixs | rwhitby: did you recently do a build with your mokomakefile? I'm not getting uboot images anymore. |
| 06:54.53 | ixs | ever seen that? |
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| 07:14.41 | rwhitby | ixs: uboot is not build as part of openmoko-devel-image |
| 07:18.13 | ixs | rwhitby: but it was before IIRC. |
| 07:19.43 | rwhitby | yes, it was. |
| 07:20.19 | rwhitby | but then everyone complained about having to build uboot just to make a kernel image, so someone in OM worked out how to make a kernel image without building all of uboot |
| 07:20.47 | rwhitby | some people complain the build takes to long, others complain that things are not built ;-) |
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| 07:25.41 | ixs | rwhitby: :-) okay. |
| 07:25.53 | ixs | rwhitby: do you know what I have to type then to have uboot built? |
| 07:26.05 | rwhitby | make package-build-uboot-openmoko |
| 07:26.11 | ixs | thx |
| 07:33.59 | Sup3rkiddo | isnt it uboot-gta01? |
| 07:34.34 | Obri | i think it is make build-package-uboot-openmoko |
| 07:34.56 | rwhitby | yeah, that's it |
| 07:35.18 | rwhitby | let's see if it builds ... |
| 07:35.23 | rwhitby | nope |
| 07:36.06 | Sup3rkiddo | oh, my bad then |
| 07:36.08 | Sup3rkiddo | sorry |
| 07:36.21 | rwhitby | Sup3rkiddo: it used to be that |
| 07:37.33 | Sup3rkiddo | rwhitby, ah ok....been outta action for a while... |
| 07:38.19 | Basheri | suihq ja sit cs |
| 07:38.27 | Basheri | vattu |
| 07:38.30 | Basheri | sorry |
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| 08:04.51 | Hopscotch | good morning |
| 08:05.31 | blindcoder | moin |
| 08:05.54 | tuukkah | Basheri ;-) |
| 08:06.10 | tuukkah | moinmoin :-) |
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| 08:11.10 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Main_Page/es]] [[NAND_bad_blocks]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Oslo]] |
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| 08:18.45 | torpor | hiya |
| 08:18.55 | torpor | sup folks? |
| 08:20.17 | keesj | cd |
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| 08:52.31 | jeddy3 | morning |
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| 08:55.00 | jeddy3 | hmm why isn't bitbake building dependencies as ipks? isn't it supposed to? |
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| 08:57.02 | mbuf | jeddy3, because it feels its baked enough for a day, and it is tired? (just kidding) |
| 08:58.05 | torpor | great my build is done .. |
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| 09:01.28 | matsimoto | hi |
| 09:01.57 | polz | hello. |
| 09:03.04 | *** join/#openmoko hp__ (i=hp@ladderzat.student.utwente.nl) |
| 09:03.30 | matsimoto | my mokomakefile crashes with: /home/moko/build/tmp/staging/arm-angstrom-linux-gnueabi/lib/libicui18n.so: undefined reference to `operator delete(void*)@GLIBCXX_3.4' any hints ? |
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| 09:06.47 | torpor | matsimoto: rebuild glibc |
| 09:06.55 | rwhitby | jeddy3: it only builds dependencies as ipks for meta packages. See meta/openmoko-feed.bb for how we do it for the openmoko-feed package |
| 09:07.41 | matsimoto | torpor: I am fairly new to this, could you tll me how -- make clean-package-glibc ? |
| 09:07.46 | jeddy3 | rwhitby: ah, thanks |
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| 09:10.43 | jeddy3 | rwhitby: basically, if i inherit meta in a package it will work as i wanted? |
| 09:12.21 | rwhitby | I expect so |
| 09:12.40 | rwhitby | best to do a task, then a meta package which depends on the task |
| 09:12.50 | jeddy3 | nice thanks |
| 09:12.51 | jeddy3 | nod |
| 09:12.52 | rwhitby | make the task something useful for not only openmoko |
| 09:13.05 | torpor | matsimoto: bitbake -c mrproper glibc |
| 09:13.18 | rwhitby | (i.e. something like task-samba-server or something like that) |
| 09:13.20 | matsimoto | torpor: tanks |
| 09:14.39 | jeddy3 | rwhitby: yes, now it's building ipks like no tomorrow :) |
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| 09:35.57 | PBeck | hallo |
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| 09:42.02 | tuukkah | is it normal for the jffs2 kernel module to give a lot of warnings when mounting an image on a desktop computer? |
| 09:43.00 | tuukkah | "jffs2_scan_eraseblock(): Magic bitmask 0x1985 not found at" and "JFFS2 notice: (31336) read_dnode: node CRC failed on dnode at" |
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| 09:47.34 | shiversc | please help me http://www.pennergame.de/ref.php?refid=9290332 |
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| 09:49.07 | tuukkah | shiversc, wtf is that? |
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| 09:49.57 | tuukkah | spam... |
| 09:49.59 | rwhitby | that'd be hit and run spam |
| 09:50.38 | rwhitby | no person who immediately joins the channel is smart enough to give a pastebin in the first message :-) |
| 09:50.47 | tuukkah | heh |
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| 10:06.51 | CIA-23 | openmoko: 03laforge * r2943 10/trunk/src/target/u-boot/patches/uboot-s3c24xx_multi_serial.patch: sync up with recent u-boot which already initializes multi-serial from lib_arm/board.c |
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| 10:12.10 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Current_events]] |
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| 10:30.14 | SpeedEvil | http://www.secondlifeherald.com/slh/2007/09/afternoon-delig.html ... |
| 10:30.17 | SpeedEvil | oops |
| 10:30.44 | SpeedEvil | Sigh. Hate it when I do that. /me is tired. |
| 10:31.46 | Psi | i found alsamixer today while playing with the neo |
| 10:31.51 | Psi | so nice to have a working volume control |
| 10:32.13 | *** join/#openmoko _rob (n=rob@85.233.59.8.static.cablesurf.de) |
| 10:32.15 | SpeedEvil | And so many of them. |
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| 10:46.54 | Ghiottone | zzz mornin' all |
| 10:47.10 | zash_se | mornin' |
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| 10:51.38 | rwhitby | Ghiottone: how can we get your new packages into OE ? |
| 10:52.14 | rwhitby | (so that we can then add them to task/openmoko-feed.bb and they automatically appear in the standard feeds whenever mickeyl runs the builder) |
| 10:54.01 | Ghiottone | rwhitby, glad to hear that. Which packages do you want in? |
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| 11:00.59 | rwhitby | Ghiottone: why not all of them? |
| 11:02.01 | rwhitby | (note that I haven't run any of them yet, cause the latest ipkg upgrade from buildhost hosed my two neos) |
| 11:02.40 | Ghiottone | rwhitby, hosed? why? |
| 11:03.12 | rwhitby | hangs at "starting the UI". It's too late here to debug it, so they're staying that way until tomorrow. |
| 11:03.40 | Ghiottone | rwhitby, I have built ipkg-link and synergy from OE |
| 11:04.00 | Ghiottone | rwhitby, so for those it would be enough to add their name to the feed |
| 11:04.25 | Ghiottone | rwhitby, note that synergy is not yet usable, until I find a way to display the cursor on the Neo, at least |
| 11:04.58 | tuukkah | rwhitby, i saw someone report a freeze on /etc/init.d/gsmd stop http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Phase_1_Software_Testing#GSM_9 |
| 11:05.21 | Ghiottone | rwhitby, the free42 package comes for the bb recipe that quicksand already submitted in OE bugs |
| 11:05.31 | Ghiottone | rwhitby, reassembled into a bb file |
| 11:06.15 | Ghiottone | rwhitby, for SettingsGUI, I am fixing a new recipe (completely made by me) to include new icon and get rid of a .pyo bug |
| 11:06.56 | Ghiottone | rwhitby, and last for ipkgorphan, I have to submit both source code and recipe |
| 11:07.04 | Ghiottone | rwhitby, what should I do? |
| 11:11.47 | Ghiottone | rwhitby, as for the bug, tuukkah is probably right, if you added a /etc/init.d/gsmd restart at the start of the X session as was suggested some days ago |
| 11:12.46 | *** join/#openmoko miip (n=miip@p54A57944.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 11:12.46 | tuukkah | there's a suggested workaround by LaF0rge in the bug report, let me see if it makes a difference here |
| 11:13.36 | Ghiottone | lunch time, bbl |
| 11:14.04 | Ghiottone | rwhitby, if you have to go, drop me an email. My username on the wiki is Alessandro |
| 11:23.30 | rwhitby | Ghiottone: when the bb recipes are ready, attach them to the OE bugtracker, and let me know which bug Id's they are. |
| 11:23.46 | rwhitby | on the second neo, I removed the gsmd restart. it still froze |
| 11:23.49 | *** join/#openmoko squalyl (n=squalyl@fbx.unsads.com) |
| 11:23.54 | squalyl | Hi all |
| 11:24.50 | rwhitby | Ghiottone: for ipkg-orphan, we can put the source somewhere (perhaps even in OE if it is small) and add the recipe. |
| 11:25.07 | rwhitby | I have added ipkg-link, and am adding synergy now. |
| 11:25.28 | rwhitby | I used free42 on the Nokia N800, so I will be interested in getting that in OE. |
| 11:25.46 | rwhitby | bbinab (be back in next ad break) |
| 11:26.09 | squalyl | I'm currently having build issues with glibc. Do you have too? |
| 11:26.52 | *** join/#openmoko cga (n=cga@213-140-6-101.ip.fastwebnet.it) |
| 11:28.53 | squalyl | here is the bug: http://pastebin.org/1972 |
| 11:28.59 | *** join/#openmoko rd_ (n=rd@88.198.85.37) |
| 11:31.29 | Ghiottone | back |
| 11:31.43 | Ghiottone | rwhitby, the OE bug for free42 is http://bugs.openembedded.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2920 |
| 11:32.29 | *** join/#openmoko hp__ (n=hp@rhuidean.student.utwente.nl) |
| 11:34.23 | Ghiottone | rwhitby, for ipkg-orphan and SettingsGUI I'll fix a few issues and open a bug in OE. the source of ipkgorphan is one .c file |
| 11:35.49 | Ghiottone | rwhitby, for synergy, I would like to tweak it to get it usable, but I still don't know if there is a way to show the cursor on moko'screen. do you know of any? |
| 11:38.58 | Marcel_M | Ghiottone: you can try setting it in /etc/matchbox/session |
| 11:40.35 | Ghiottone | Marcel_M, that -use_cursor no ? |
| 11:41.18 | tuukkah | i changed that to yes but nothing seems to have changed |
| 11:41.30 | Ghiottone | Marcel_M, thanks. I'll give it a try. But I guess I will need something more dynamic to let both use with synergy and normal finger mode |
| 11:41.43 | rwhitby | Ghiottone: thx |
| 11:42.45 | Marcel_M | i think so i´m trying it right now |
| 11:43.09 | *** join/#openmoko Vegar (i=vegar@51-142-151-213.mtulink.net) |
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| 11:44.44 | Ghiottone | I guess it is -hide-cursor agrument in /etc/X11/Xserver |
| 11:46.20 | Ghiottone | mmm no change |
| 11:46.25 | Marcel_M | i can see the mouse-pointer with setting to SHOWCURSOR="yes" in /etc/matchbox/session |
| 11:48.45 | Ghiottone | w00t! |
| 11:48.51 | Ghiottone | Marcel_M, works! |
| 11:49.02 | Marcel_M | great |
| 11:49.14 | tuukkah | i needed to make both changes |
| 11:49.34 | Ghiottone | It is fun to move the cursor on the neo with my laptop touchpad! :) |
| 11:49.41 | Ghiottone | I made both changes as well |
| 11:49.48 | Marcel_M | :-) |
| 11:49.52 | tuukkah | yeah synergy is very cool |
| 11:50.05 | Ghiottone | I wonder if there is a way to enable both without restarting X |
| 11:50.29 | tuukkah | Ghiottone, or even one of them, we could perhaps make the other change static |
| 11:50.59 | Ghiottone | if you want to play with it you can build synergy from OE or get it from my repo (until it is included in OM buildhost) |
| 11:51.29 | *** join/#openmoko C7 (n=C7@77-56-188-232.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 11:51.31 | Ghiottone | tuukkah, I wonder if maybe both changes are needed or they would not have been there |
| 11:53.27 | tuukkah | it can also be unintended |
| 11:55.16 | tuukkah | "libmokogsmd: Unable to connect to gsmd, trying to start it |
| 11:55.16 | tuukkah | Stopping GSM daemon: " - this causes crashes even if i don't have the restart line |
| 11:55.26 | Marcel_M | s/just/only |
| 11:55.48 | *** join/#openmoko denis^da (n=anno@p5B07D031.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 11:55.55 | Psi | hm.. has there been any 2007.2 build with a working dialer? (For when i show the neo to people) |
| 11:56.42 | Ghiottone | I'll try to put -hide-cursor in again |
| 11:56.44 | tuukkah | if i only change xserver, i can see the cursor until matchbox starts, naturally |
| 11:57.11 | *** join/#openmoko nobody96 (n=nobody99@p5B2204A7.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 11:57.11 | Marcel_M | Psi: http://buildhost.automated.it/OM2007.2/OpenMoko-scaredycat-openmoko-devel-image-glibc-ipk-P1-August-Snapshot-20070903-fic-gta01.rootfs.jffs2 should work |
| 11:57.28 | Psi | thanks, ill give it a go |
| 11:58.54 | tuukkah | i hate vi :-( how did i join lines again? |
| 11:59.33 | *** join/#openmoko zell1983 (n=zell1983@79.0.122.77) |
| 12:00.37 | Ghiottone | J |
| 12:00.51 | Ghiottone | tuukkah, Shift + j |
| 12:01.21 | Ghiottone | it works with -hide-cursor present |
| 12:01.25 | Marcel_M | Psi: maybe you neet to modify /etc/matchbox/session like sacacis said |
| 12:01.26 | tuukkah | heh, thanks :-) |
| 12:01.26 | nobody96 | moin |
| 12:01.41 | *** join/#openmoko mewt (n=mewt@88.203.7.161) |
| 12:02.07 | Ghiottone | so I guess it is enough to set show cursor to yes in the session file |
| 12:02.27 | Ghiottone | and that for a dynamic change I should look at the matchbox website |
| 12:05.30 | Ghiottone | the Neo is on the first page of matchbox project :) |
| 12:05.32 | Psi | Marcel_M, where did he say that? |
| 12:06.19 | *** join/#openmoko MuffY (n=chatzill@s55928932.adsl.wanadoo.nl) |
| 12:06.45 | Marcel_M | i think some weeks ago |
| 12:06.55 | *** join/#openmoko kuyky (n=kuyky@a81-84-127-196.cpe.netcabo.pt) |
| 12:09.25 | tuukkah | Ghiottone, ok now i can see the cursor with -hide-cursor present too. but not straight away, i need to start some app first or something |
| 12:10.24 | Marcel_M | you need to add /etc/init.d/gsmd stop; /etc/init.d/gsmd start between openmoko-today and /etc/init.d/gsmd stop; /etc/init.d/gsmd start |
| 12:10.43 | Ghiottone | tuukkah, so maybe X server did not show it at first but after that matchbox got some work to do it told X to display it... |
| 12:11.37 | Marcel_M | so it works most of the time |
| 12:11.37 | tuukkah | Marcel_M, then again those lines make the kernel crash |
| 12:11.42 | Psi | Marcel_M, ok, thanks |
| 12:11.45 | Marcel_M | ahhh |
| 12:11.54 | *** join/#openmoko aloril_ (n=aloril@kaar72.airix.fi) |
| 12:11.57 | Marcel_M | didt try it with the newer images |
| 12:12.23 | Marcel_M | it works with scaredy cat images from 3.9.2007 |
| 12:12.27 | tuukkah | i'm testing atm but it would seem that the suggestion to remove "console=ttySAC0,115200" stops the crashes |
| 12:12.31 | *** join/#openmoko pwerken (n=pwerken@ip5457b8f8.direct-adsl.nl) |
| 12:13.16 | tuukkah | i'm using uImage-2.6.22.5-moko11-r2-fic-gta01.bin |
| 12:14.41 | *** join/#openmoko hp__ (i=hp@ladderzat.student.utwente.nl) |
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| 12:17.02 | Maledictus | tuukkah: where can one get that image? |
| 12:17.30 | Marcel_M | Psi: if you do an ipkg upgrade you should comment-out the gsmd start stop lines before you reboot |
| 12:17.54 | Psi | ok |
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| 12:18.40 | *** join/#openmoko buz (n=buz@84-73-66-71.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 12:18.42 | tuukkah | Maledictus, http://buildhost.openmoko.org/OM2007.2/tmp/deploy/glibc/images/fic-gta01/ |
| 12:20.36 | Maledictus | ah, thanks! |
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| 12:23.51 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Community_nominees_for_GTA02_P0]] [[Wish_List_-_OpenMoko_Ringtones_and_Sounds]] [[Wishlist_-_Hardware:_Digital_compass]] |
| 12:36.13 | *** join/#openmoko juco2 (n=vickeryj@cpe-076-182-044-240.nc.res.rr.com) |
| 12:45.30 | thomasg | hm, who fixed the "Answer All"-problems of gmail in the mailing list - was it gmail or was it fixed on list-side? |
| 12:45.41 | *** join/#openmoko _diego__ (n=diego@host-84-223-79-23.cust-adsl.tiscali.it) |
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| 12:49.53 | Ghiottone | yay!!! finally the do_rm_work of webkit-gkt!! |
| 12:50.25 | tuukkah | Ghiottone, do_rm_work? |
| 12:50.55 | Ghiottone | yep! from 150MB of free space to 4GB in a few minutes! |
| 12:51.24 | Ghiottone | and counting... |
| 12:51.41 | Ghiottone | it seems that I finally managed to build all the base packages |
| 12:52.28 | Ghiottone | tuukkah, rm_work is a configuration parameter of local.conf that removes the content of the work dir after it is no longer needed during make openmoko-devel-image |
| 12:52.49 | tuukkah | oh, i see |
| 12:53.16 | Ghiottone | very useful as my OM tree has grown up to more than 12GB |
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| 13:01.36 | mewt | dunno if it's the place to ask, but is tehre something wrong with the device owners list ? |
| 13:01.44 | mewt | cos i havent received a single email in days now |
| 13:02.34 | tuukkah | mewt, you can see the archives here: http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/device-owners/2007-September/date.html |
| 13:03.47 | mewt | ok so i definately havent been recieving emails |
| 13:04.35 | mewt | should i do anything to fix it ? |
| 13:05.11 | Ghiottone | you could try to get to your membership page |
| 13:05.41 | Ghiottone | to see if your account is still valid on that list |
| 13:06.09 | *** join/#openmoko Administrator (n=Administ@dsl-245-145-221.telkomadsl.co.za) |
| 13:06.44 | mewt | aye aye sir! |
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| 13:09.15 | sagacis | Anybody else having problems with recent images? I've used the Scaredycat images and the nslu2 image. They all are missing panel icons and half the time crash on boot (during the startup sound). |
| 13:09.47 | Obri | sagacis: try http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=788 |
| 13:09.52 | Psi | did you erase rootfs/uimage first? |
| 13:10.10 | tuukkah | #788 can be the crash part |
| 13:10.57 | tuukkah | now that there's a solution for that, what next? |
| 13:12.36 | Elrond | stefan_schmidt - BTW: Has laforge found someone to maintain gsmd? |
| 13:12.41 | sagacis | I erased rootfs and uimage first |
| 13:13.20 | CM | sagacis: There's lots of issues with the latest images for me too |
| 13:13.44 | CM | Last one somewhat reliable for me was scaredycat-0903 |
| 13:13.54 | CM | :( |
| 13:14.19 | Elrond | CM - So the image on buildhost is not very useable? |
| 13:14.42 | tuukkah | CM, what kind of issues? |
| 13:14.50 | *** join/#openmoko Demitar (n=demitar@c-212-031-190-120.cust.broadway.se) |
| 13:19.14 | sagacis | I've also been unable to build for over a week. |
| 13:19.26 | sagacis | unreliable download connections, wierd localization issues |
| 13:21.40 | *** join/#openmoko no_mind (n=matrix@59.161.79.10) |
| 13:22.30 | CM | Elrond: I haven't tried the ones on the build host, but I've build the standard images myself |
| 13:22.46 | no_mind | anyone working on reducing the boting time of openmoko ? |
| 13:22.47 | no_mind | booting* |
| 13:23.01 | *** join/#openmoko serenity (n=serenity@p54859AD7.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 13:23.06 | CM | tuukkah: No sound, menu crashing because of missing icons, unable to use gsmd, unable to power off |
| 13:23.11 | serenity | hi |
| 13:23.20 | serenity | i found these timeline http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/GTA02#.22Phase_2.22_.28GTA02.2C_.22Mass_Market.22.29 is it official? |
| 13:23.45 | Elrond | CM - And they're not that useable? |
| 13:23.48 | CM | no_mind: Not yet, but I think some people were looking at upstart and such |
| 13:23.56 | no_mind | Aha i got the slogan for openmoko |
| 13:24.02 | tuukkah | CM, haven't seen the first two with the images myself |
| 13:24.16 | no_mind | openmoko! nothing official about it!! |
| 13:24.24 | CM | Elrond: No, my images work bad. Last good one was scaredycats from last weekend, linked here recently |
| 13:24.24 | serenity | ;) |
| 13:24.34 | CM | no_mind: Hehe |
| 13:25.08 | Elrond | CM - What exactly is "bad"? |
| 13:25.40 | CM | gsmd hangs hard |
| 13:26.04 | CM | I can't call, so I tried to do a /etc/init.d/gsmd restart and it locked everything up |
| 13:26.10 | tuukkah | well that's #788 |
| 13:26.30 | CM | Ok. Then when I started the dialer, the menu disappered |
| 13:26.38 | CM | And when I closed it X crashed |
| 13:26.56 | Elrond | CM - Yuck. :-| |
| 13:27.11 | Elrond | Okay, I'll keep 2007.1 for another week or so. |
| 13:27.15 | CM | ssh'd in and managed to restart it, but it sure doesn't feel like it's working |
| 13:27.30 | CM | The images were better off a week ago |
| 13:28.04 | Elrond | Ahh. |
| 13:28.07 | *** join/#openmoko tnt_ (n=tnt@54.20-65-87.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be) |
| 13:28.24 | tuukkah | hmm, i see that i can use the panel to switch from other apps to Today but not from Today to other apps |
| 13:29.12 | tuukkah | instead, i need to go to the list of running apps and press the left-most tool icon |
| 13:30.32 | *** join/#openmoko alexzhang (n=alex@218.18.43.78) |
| 13:30.33 | Elrond | CM - I still delay the .1 -> .2 every week. ;o) |
| 13:31.20 | *** part/#openmoko serenity (n=serenity@p54859AD7.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 13:32.10 | CM | Elrond: Hehe, well, guess it's time for you to bite the bullet soon ;) |
| 13:32.25 | *** join/#openmoko hp__ (n=hp@rhuidean.student.utwente.nl) |
| 13:32.31 | Elrond | CM - Not really. My main tools run on python. :-) |
| 13:32.47 | Elrond | CM - I just want to play a little with .2 sometime. |
| 13:32.56 | *** join/#openmoko zwerg (n=zwerg@p57BA41D9.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 13:32.57 | CM | Ok |
| 13:33.08 | zwerg | Hi there. |
| 13:33.17 | Elrond | And it's stupid, that gllin is oabi only. |
| 13:33.34 | *** join/#openmoko infernix (n=nix@unaffiliated/infernix) |
| 13:33.35 | no_mind | Elrond: which tools ? |
| 13:33.52 | CM | Elrond: Yes, that's really anoying. Why can't they just get out an eabi version. Sloooooooowwww.... |
| 13:34.01 | Elrond | no_mind - I have some tools to talk to the HH. I really need to merge them into sphyrna soon. |
| 13:34.36 | Elrond | CM - Right. Is there any way to convert oabi binaries to eabi? |
| 13:34.56 | Elrond | (In the old days, I converted aout statically linked binaries to elf...) |
| 13:35.08 | no_mind | Elrond: whats HH ? |
| 13:35.17 | Elrond | no_mind - HammerHead. The gps on the gta01 |
| 13:38.58 | no_mind | Elrond: cool |
| 13:38.58 | no_mind | Elrond: so you using superkiddo's gps libary ? |
| 13:38.58 | no_mind | library* |
| 13:38.58 | no_mind | pygsmd? |
| 13:39.06 | zwerg | I'm just playing with the qemu version of openmoko and I wondered how to submit a new contact after editing? |
| 13:39.06 | aloril | zwerg: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1, SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) (Hopefully these links answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) |
| 13:39.52 | tuukkah | zwerg, you just change back to the main view |
| 13:40.15 | Elrond | no_mind - GPS != GSM |
| 13:40.37 | no_mind | Elrond: err yes |
| 13:40.53 | no_mind | and whats sphyrna ? |
| 13:41.09 | Elrond | no_mind - Reverse Engeneering project fot the GPS chip. |
| 13:41.14 | tuukkah | zwerg, i can see a bug there: the contact list area only updates when you click on it |
| 13:41.24 | mwester | Wasn't that what Henry the 8th died from? |
| 13:41.25 | no_mind | Elrond: cool |
| 13:41.51 | no_mind | mwester: eeekkks! openmoko will suffer from the same |
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| 13:42.03 | zwerg | tuukkah: Hmm, I see. Most of the time it just brings me back to the overview panel. |
| 13:42.26 | zwerg | When klicking on the contact list button. |
| 13:42.42 | Elrond | mwester - Huh, what? |
| 13:42.56 | tuukkah | zwerg, yeah. then you click the list and it updates to show the new contact too :-) |
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| 13:43.53 | zwerg | With "overview" I meant "0 missed calls" and so on... |
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| 13:44.44 | tuukkah | zwerg, oh, Today. that might mean the contact app dies |
| 13:44.50 | *** join/#openmoko SpeedEvil (n=fkdkdfji@mauve.plus.com) |
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| 13:45.03 | tuukkah | esp if you can't see it in the list of running apps anymore |
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| 13:45.43 | Elrond | pH5 - BTW: Who is mmontour? |
| 13:46.30 | tuukkah | zwerg, now i had it die too, simply by clicking "add new contact" icon :-( |
| 13:46.45 | tuukkah | and Today went with it |
| 13:46.47 | zwerg | Alright then :-) |
| 13:47.08 | tuukkah | zwerg, wanna file a bug? |
| 13:47.19 | zwerg | I could do, yes. |
| 13:47.51 | tuukkah | cool |
| 13:49.32 | pH5 | hi Elrond, see http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/User:Mmontour and HHNotes. iirc he also wrote a mail to the list. |
| 13:50.02 | *** join/#openmoko eesu (n=eesu@a88-115-124-27.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 13:50.25 | zwerg | I'm using a rootfs snapshot from august 20070819. |
| 13:50.48 | zwerg | Would that be 2007.2? |
| 13:50.54 | tuukkah | why not a newer one? |
| 13:51.17 | tuukkah | 2007.2 says it's 2007.2 when it boots |
| 13:51.22 | zwerg | It's what the download.sh script pulled for me. |
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| 13:52.10 | Elrond | pH5 - Is he on irc? |
| 13:53.16 | tuukkah | (at the bottom of the boot progress meter and X splash screen) |
| 13:53.45 | zwerg | Well I know that it is 2007.2 and not the older one. |
| 13:54.08 | tuukkah | right |
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| 13:55.27 | zwerg | But I don't think it's svn head because the snapshot is from august. |
| 13:56.06 | tuukkah | yeah there are newer snapshots for example here: http://buildhost.openmoko.org/OM2007.2/tmp/deploy/glibc/images/fic-gta01/ |
| 13:56.23 | pH5 | Elrond: I can't remember having seen him here. |
| 13:56.44 | Elrond | pH5 - Ahh. We should invite him. :-) |
| 13:56.50 | aloril | (script) openmoko-devel: "Michael 'Mickey' Lauer" <mickey at openmoko.org> Re: themes and skins |
| 13:57.00 | pH5 | yes :) |
| 13:57.16 | tuukkah | (which just went down?) |
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| 13:58.18 | hhf423 | moin |
| 13:59.19 | DukeOfURL | good morning |
| 13:59.42 | hhf423 | hi DukeOfURL |
| 13:59.52 | hhf423 | anything new? |
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| 14:00.28 | DukeOfURL | I'll be in Fremont, CA Monday. Wondering if I should stop by the FIC office... |
| 14:01.13 | hhf423 | why not? ask for a fixed gsmd and gps support, please |
| 14:01.47 | DukeOfURL | question... |
| 14:01.52 | mickeyl | i have new EABI binaries for gps. If all goes well, I can release something next week |
| 14:02.08 | DukeOfURL | when I make openmoko-devel-image, is everything included? |
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| 14:02.16 | *** join/#openmoko mewt (n=mewt@88.203.7.161) |
| 14:02.24 | hhf423 | mickeyl: cool |
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| 14:02.39 | mickeyl | DukeOfURL: "everything"? |
| 14:02.40 | DukeOfURL | what is available at buildhost.openmoko.org for ipkg that I don't already have? |
| 14:02.59 | mickeyl | no. everything doesn't fit in 60M |
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| 14:03.07 | CM | mickeyl: Great news indeed :) |
| 14:03.13 | mickeyl | bitbake task-openmoko-feed should give you a lot more packages |
| 14:04.10 | Ghiottone | mickeyl, great news! and hi all |
| 14:04.49 | hhf423 | hi Ghiottone |
| 14:04.53 | fgau | mickeyl, very cool |
| 14:05.00 | ixs | yay. |
| 14:05.14 | ixs | now I have the nice gsmd stop -> device dead bug as well... |
| 14:05.16 | ixs | *sigh* |
| 14:05.38 | hhf423 | ixs: welcome to the club |
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| 14:06.02 | tuukkah | have you all changed the kernel command line already ?-) |
| 14:06.13 | ixs | hhf423: thanks. I'm feeling so very special. |
| 14:06.19 | Ghiottone | lol |
| 14:06.49 | ixs | hhf423: now I'm a member of the serial problem club as well and also of the gsm does not work at all club. Fitting of course that I'd join the gsmd kills the device club... |
| 14:06.56 | tuukkah | no need to reflash, just change bootloader settings |
| 14:07.12 | hhf423 | ixs: maybe we should design a badge for the club? |
| 14:07.34 | hhf423 | tuukkah: bootloader settings? how? |
| 14:08.17 | hhf423 | ixs: and invent a special greeting and handshake ! |
| 14:08.25 | tuukkah | hhf423, hold the aux button when you boot the phone connected via usb to your computer. then on the computer run cu -l /dev/ttyACM0 to access the boot loader prompt |
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| 14:09.08 | hhf423 | tuukkah: there is the problem ; i see my computer on sunday... |
| 14:09.44 | tuukkah | damn ;-) |
| 14:10.27 | hhf423 | tuukkah: exactly what i said ;-) |
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| 14:18.24 | tuukkah | hhf423, what about booting from the sd card with a fresh image ?-) |
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| 14:24.24 | Ghiottone | is buildhost down? |
| 14:25.03 | tuukkah | answers to ping but not to http for a while now |
| 14:25.10 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Community_nominees_for_GTA02_P0]] [[Wish_List_-_Hardware]] [[Hardware:NearlyTouchScreen]] [[Phase_1_Software_Testing]] [[Main_Page/it]] [[Talk:IPhone]] |
| 14:26.53 | hhf423 | tuukkah: i would need a way to write the image to the card |
| 14:27.13 | Ghiottone | hhf423, some voodoo? |
| 14:27.38 | tuukkah | hhf423, well i assume even if you don't have your computer you have some access to the net etc =) |
| 14:27.53 | *** join/#openmoko no_mind__ (n=matrix@59.161.79.10) |
| 14:27.53 | hhf423 | i have a n770 and a se k610i |
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| 14:28.23 | tuukkah | see, can't the 770 write to the sd? |
| 14:28.38 | hhf423 | hmm |
| 14:28.48 | hhf423 | brb |
| 14:28.50 | tuukkah | at least n800 can |
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| 14:32.35 | hhf423 | tuukkah: maybe with an adapter that i do not have ;-/ |
| 14:33.01 | tuukkah | oh right |
| 14:34.10 | hhf423 | how would i put an image on the sd? |
| 14:34.27 | hhf423 | just put the files there? |
| 14:35.27 | tuukkah | i haven't tested yet but it would seem you extract rootfs.tar to the card and add boot/uImage |
| 14:35.43 | tuukkah | actually that's one of the things i want to do right now :-) |
| 14:36.01 | hhf423 | ;-) |
| 14:36.13 | tuukkah | there's so much :-) |
| 14:37.29 | Ghiottone | libmokogsmd: Unable to connect to gsmd, trying to start it --> hang. damn! |
| 14:37.57 | tuukkah | Ghiottone, you also haven't changed kernel boot params? |
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| 14:38.31 | Ghiottone | mmm no. what parameter? and does it fix the gsm restart bug? |
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| 14:39.18 | tuukkah | you remove "console=ttySAC0,115200" from where it is |
| 14:39.32 | tuukkah | and no crashes anymore |
| 14:39.41 | Ghiottone | nice! |
| 14:39.45 | Ghiottone | how do I do that? |
| 14:40.01 | tuukkah | do you know how to get to the bootloader prompt? |
| 14:40.11 | Ghiottone | aux and power on? |
| 14:40.26 | tuukkah | yeah, then on the computer cu -l /dev/ttyACM0 |
| 14:41.14 | Ghiottone | trying |
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| 14:45.02 | hhf423 | tuukkah: and then what? |
| 14:45.09 | tuukkah | printenv |
| 14:45.14 | tuukkah | that shows you the current settings |
| 14:46.15 | tuukkah | the name of the variable is something like bootargs_base |
| 14:46.16 | Ghiottone | ok |
| 14:46.22 | Ghiottone | yes |
| 14:46.29 | Ghiottone | how do I change it? |
| 14:46.40 | tuukkah | setenv bootargs_base ... |
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| 14:47.08 | tuukkah | ... being what was there already but without the "console=ttySAC0,115200" part |
| 14:47.38 | Ghiottone | with = or space? |
| 14:47.54 | tuukkah | space |
| 14:49.22 | Ghiottone | then ? |
| 14:49.26 | tuukkah | boot |
| 14:49.52 | Ghiottone | ok gone |
| 14:49.54 | Ghiottone | thanks |
| 14:49.58 | Ghiottone | but is this fix permanent? |
| 14:49.58 | tuukkah | the change isn't permanent though |
| 14:50.02 | Ghiottone | ah ok |
| 14:50.02 | tuukkah | =) |
| 14:50.16 | Ghiottone | but if I save this settings am I able to revert it? |
| 14:50.19 | tuukkah | you need to run saveenv to make it last between reboots |
| 14:51.06 | tuukkah | i don't see why you couldn't revert as it affects the kernel and you can make the change in the boot loader before the setting is used for anything |
| 14:51.14 | Ghiottone | ok great! |
| 14:51.20 | Ghiottone | thanks a lot! |
| 14:51.45 | tuukkah | thanks for testing, we have yet to see whether it works for you too :-) |
| 14:51.59 | hhf423 | and that fixes what exacrly? |
| 14:52.14 | tuukkah | http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=788 |
| 14:52.18 | technil | http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=788 |
| 14:52.23 | technil | oops |
| 14:52.41 | tuukkah | "this looks to me as if for whatever reason the kernel still wants to use ttySAC0 |
| 14:52.41 | tuukkah | as serial console, rather than as non-console port for the GSM modem." |
| 14:52.45 | Ghiottone | the gui showed up without problem |
| 14:53.02 | Ghiottone | before the fix I had tried to boot it a few times without success |
| 14:53.11 | Elrond | mickeyl - *ping* |
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| 14:54.54 | mickeyl | Elrond: pöng |
| 14:55.36 | Elrond | mickeyl - Ahh. :) Has laforge found someone for gsmd? |
| 14:56.29 | mickeyl | Elrond: there's someone in .tw who may come up with more patches. why do you ask? |
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| 14:57.28 | Elrond | mickeyl - I might have some patches to talloc.[ch] and just wonder, if they'll take as long as my one-line u-boot patch to get applied. ;o) |
| 14:58.08 | mickeyl | hard to forecast, but gsmd patches have made it relatively fast in the past |
| 14:58.35 | *** part/#openmoko hhf423 (n=user@tmo-096-11.customers.d1-online.com) |
| 14:58.47 | Elrond | Ahh. :) Is "by mail" or "by bugzilla" preferrable? |
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| 15:00.47 | mickeyl | bugzilla please |
| 15:01.01 | Elrond | Ahh, I like bugzilla for this sort of things. :) |
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| 15:04.44 | Elrond | mickeyl - Thanks. :) |
| 15:04.53 | mickeyl | :) |
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| 15:11.33 | Ghiottone | why does my postrm method don't work? |
| 15:11.57 | Ghiottone | isn't the right name do_postrm() ? |
| 15:12.18 | Ghiottone | is the ${D} variable set? |
| 15:14.01 | mickeyl | ${D} is only set in offline mode, i.e. at build time |
| 15:14.17 | mickeyl | (that is, unless someone defines D in his profile ;)) |
| 15:15.03 | Ghiottone | uh? I thought that D is used when you install to some location other than / (i.e. ipkg install -d card package) |
| 15:16.15 | mickeyl | no |
| 15:16.53 | mickeyl | this is handled internally by ipkg |
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| 15:17.34 | Ghiottone | I read the role of D here http://www.openembedded.info/user-manual/recipes_directories.html#id341093 |
| 15:18.22 | mickeyl | yes. this is the destination directory of the build process |
| 15:18.28 | mickeyl | ipkg knows nothing about D |
| 15:18.51 | Ghiottone | if D is only used at build time, how do I remove garbage files from the postrm function? |
| 15:19.07 | mickeyl | garbage files? |
| 15:19.11 | mickeyl | what do you want to actually do? |
| 15:19.14 | Ghiottone | yeah |
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| 15:19.16 | mickeyl | show me an example |
| 15:19.20 | Ghiottone | I'm packaging SettingsGUI |
| 15:19.28 | Ghiottone | which is a python app |
| 15:19.33 | mickeyl | right |
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| 15:21.31 | Ghiottone | back |
| 15:21.46 | Ghiottone | been kicked out someway |
| 15:22.17 | Ghiottone | mickeyl, what were you saying? |
| 15:23.15 | El_Salvador[Away | [08/09/2007][17:19:31] <mickeyl> right |
| 15:23.15 | El_Salvador[Away | [08/09/2007][17:20:58] * ale__ (n=ale@151.72.70.44) has joined #openmoko |
| 15:23.15 | El_Salvador[Away | [08/09/2007][17:21:10] * Ghiottone (n=ale@151.72.79.180) Quit (Nick collision from services.) |
| 15:23.42 | mickeyl | still waiting for what you want to remove |
| 15:23.53 | Ghiottone | ok thanks |
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| 15:24.02 | Ghiottone | after I remove the package it leaves .pyo files |
| 15:24.17 | Ghiottone | and that causes some problems |
| 15:24.28 | mickeyl | hmm. you should ship the pyo's with the package |
| 15:24.33 | mickeyl | it's what i do with all other python packages |
| 15:24.44 | mickeyl | that way it also starts faster |
| 15:24.50 | Ghiottone | only the pyo? |
| 15:25.00 | Ghiottone | and not any .py file? |
| 15:25.06 | mickeyl | no, both |
| 15:25.12 | mickeyl | eventually we may just ship .pyo |
| 15:25.14 | mickeyl | to save space |
| 15:25.18 | cb22 | AFAIK pyo files are obsolete though? |
| 15:25.27 | mickeyl | erm? |
| 15:25.30 | cb22 | they've been replaced by the pycs? |
| 15:25.37 | zecke | ~lart intltool |
| 15:25.37 | apt | raises middle finger to intltool |
| 15:25.41 | mickeyl | uhm, no. pyc is bytecode, pyo is optimized bytecode |
| 15:25.47 | Ghiottone | El_Salvador[Away, by the way, thanks :) |
| 15:26.09 | cb22 | guess not |
| 15:26.29 | Ghiottone | how do I ship them into the package? are they generated at compile time? |
| 15:26.52 | mickeyl | Ghiottone: right. every package that uses distutils or setuptools runs a bytecode compile step |
| 15:27.10 | cb22 | mickeyl, my bad |
| 15:27.23 | cb22 | i couldv'e sworn i read they were obsolete somewhere :) |
| 15:27.31 | cb22 | s/v'e/'ve/ |
| 15:27.39 | Ghiottone | mickeyl, how do I do it from the recipe? should I inherit some .class? |
| 15:27.58 | mickeyl | Ghiottone: step 1) make the package use distutils. step2) inherit distutils |
| 15:29.02 | Ghiottone | mickeyl, any source on where to learn enough to do step 1? |
| 15:29.14 | mickeyl | Ghiottone: yes, the distutils documentation on the python homepage |
| 15:29.15 | El_Salvador[Away | <Ghiottone> El_Salvador[Away, by the way, thanks :) |
| 15:29.17 | El_Salvador[Away | :) |
| 15:29.48 | mickeyl | Ghiottone: it's straightforward. add a setup.py file and some extra information. but involves more than i'd like to write here :) |
| 15:30.40 | mickeyl | and for the records (you might want to use the remove task for something other eventually), the respective task is called pkg_postrm, not do_postrm |
| 15:30.50 | mickeyl | bb tomorrow, having guests tonite |
| 15:30.51 | mickeyl | cu |
| 15:31.07 | Ghiottone | mickeyl, ok thanks |
| 15:31.47 | cb22 | hmm |
| 15:31.54 | cb22 | looks like pyo files are old |
| 15:31.57 | cb22 | and pyc == pyo |
| 15:32.10 | cb22 | MD5 (test2.pyc) = 5e69525b60353611b4c35e4931dfd1af |
| 15:32.14 | cb22 | MD5 (test2.pyo) = 5e69525b60353611b4c35e4931dfd1af |
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| 15:33.08 | daxxar | pyo is optimized pyc, isn't it? |
| 15:33.23 | daxxar | But python doesn't have many optimizations ;-) |
| 15:33.43 | borg_ | there are no optimizations for arm, probably |
| 15:34.11 | daxxar | I read somewhere that -O removed assert statements, and that -OO also removed __doc__strings ;P |
| 15:34.14 | cb22 | daxxar, it looks as if pyc's are already optimized |
| 15:34.18 | borg_ | :P |
| 15:34.23 | cb22 | daxxar, that somewhere would be the man page :) |
| 15:34.29 | daxxar | cb22: Aha. :-P |
| 15:35.14 | cworth | Hmm... gettext-native linking is failing with undefined symbols, (program_name, set_program_name, xasprintf, etc.). Any ideas? |
| 15:37.01 | *** join/#openmoko bedboi (n=bedboi@c-68-35-124-143.hsd1.nm.comcast.net) |
| 15:37.09 | bedboi | hi there. |
| 15:37.58 | dcordes | is it normal that there is no iwconfig in openmoko-devel-image? |
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| 15:38.34 | mwester | dcordes: no wireless yet |
| 15:38.37 | daxxar | Assuming it's not for gta02, yes |
| 15:38.52 | dcordes | it was built for machine type akita |
| 15:39.03 | dcordes | it's loading prism2 modules but there's no iwconfig |
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| 15:42.40 | technil | has anyone been dropping into a shell during boot on 2.6.22.5-moko11-r2... |
| 15:43.00 | technil | can't access tty; job control turned off |
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| 15:52.30 | cesarb | technil: if you were having build trouble before, you probably got an image without init |
| 15:52.41 | cesarb | technil: nuke the whole build and start from scratch |
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| 16:08.03 | tuukkah | dcordes, perhaps you can add iwconfig to the build then |
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| 16:16.35 | joao | Anyone managed to make a build last night? |
| 16:16.45 | mwester | yep |
| 16:17.27 | joao | mwester: Standard wiki instructions or some special local flavor of yours? |
| 16:18.39 | mwester | Mastermakefile. I don't build the rssreader, since I'm of the opinion that we should be able to dial calls, and send SMS msgs, before we need to struggle with building web browsers. |
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| 16:19.59 | joao | mwester: Mastermakefile? (Sorry quite new) |
| 16:20.35 | mwester | Check the wiki for instructions on building with the makefile |
| 16:22.03 | mwester | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/MokoMakefile |
| 16:23.20 | CIA-23 | openmoko: 03zecke * r2944 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/applications/openmoko-feedreader2/ (ChangeLog po/LINGUAS po/de.po): |
| 16:23.20 | CIA-23 | openmoko: 2007-09-08 Holger Hans Peter Freyther <zecke@selfish.org> |
| 16:23.20 | CIA-23 | openmoko: Check if translation works by setting up a dummy language |
| 16:23.24 | CIA-23 | openmoko: * po/LINGUAS: |
| 16:23.26 | CIA-23 | openmoko: * po/de.po: Added. |
| 16:23.49 | joao | mwester: Ok. That's what I'm doing. But I'm probably not building the right image. I "always" buil openmoko-devel-image and that's been crashing on me lately |
| 16:24.06 | mwester | It does that. |
| 16:24.12 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Talk:Neo1973]] [[Community_nominees_for_GTA02_P0]] [[User_talk:Hhf423]] [[Getting_Started_with_your_Neo1973]] [[Wish_List_-_Hardware]] |
| 16:24.42 | mwester | It builds the tip of the development branch(s) -- so instability is part of its nature. |
| 16:24.53 | *** join/#openmoko readon (n=readon@222.209.94.57) |
| 16:25.44 | joao | mwester: Ok and if I wanted something where I can eventually get to play with gsmd... What should I build? (Actually I thought that only "woring" things were checked in) |
| 16:25.57 | readon | any one using glade3 & libglade in embedded device? |
| 16:25.58 | aloril | readon: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1, SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) (Hopefully these links answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) |
| 16:26.21 | mwester | joao: openmoko-devel-image |
| 16:26.26 | tuukkah | joao, for a solution to crashes see http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=788 |
| 16:27.59 | joao | tuukkah: gosh, and I was so happy thinking that rwhitby's fixes to the startup and state machine had completely fixed gsmd |
| 16:28.31 | tuukkah | joao, #788 is a bug in kernel as far as i can tell |
| 16:33.12 | joao | tuukkah: Yeah, seems to have a workaround though : Indeed, booting without "console=ttySAC0,115200", I can't reproduce the crashes |
| 16:33.15 | joao | anymore. I'm testing on uImage-2.6.22.5-moko11-r2-fic-gta01.bin and |
| 16:33.17 | joao | OpenMoko-openmoko-devel-image-glibc-ipk-P1-September-Snapshot-20070906-fic-gta01.rootfs.jffs2 |
| 16:33.53 | tuukkah | right :-) s/solution/workaround/ |
| 16:35.11 | joao | tuukkah: Don't be too hard on me just because of a few NLs :-) by the way, task 2668 of 3310 and still no crash... I am starting to hope |
| 16:35.47 | tuukkah | "NLs"? |
| 16:35.56 | *** join/#openmoko buz (n=buz@84-73-66-71.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 16:40.52 | joao | New Lines never mind, I think I am a bit off today |
| 16:41.35 | tuukkah | and, "task"? |
| 16:41.42 | readon | anyone is using glade3? |
| 16:42.06 | *** join/#openmoko dcordes (n=tsingtao@e179111001.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 16:43.14 | *** join/#openmoko l4rs (n=laprican@hsiproxy.astra-net.com) |
| 16:48.43 | *** join/#openmoko ecraven (i=nex@eutyche.swe.uni-linz.ac.at) |
| 16:54.22 | *** join/#openmoko MetaMorfoziS (n=khmhm@dsl54009E76.pool.t-online.hu) |
| 16:56.25 | *** join/#openmoko emre (n=emre@85.98.14.7) |
| 16:57.58 | *** join/#openmoko HellDragon (n=Nocebo@unaffiliated/helldragon) |
| 16:58.32 | *** join/#openmoko evanpro_ (n=evan@142.137.210.213) |
| 16:58.49 | Ghiottone | rwhitby, I have created the bug for ipkg-orphan, it's #2954 |
| 17:00.50 | *** part/#openmoko J-23 (n=Moarc_zi@a105.net128.okay.pl) |
| 17:02.22 | Ghiottone | where are the channel logs? |
| 17:04.20 | SpeedEvil | !logs |
| 17:04.22 | cdbot2 | Channel logs for #openmoko are archived at: |
| 17:04.23 | cdbot2 | http://hentges.net/tmp/logs/irc/%23openmoko |
| 17:04.24 | cdbot2 | Live-logs are available at |
| 17:04.25 | cdbot2 | http://hentges.net/tmp/logs/irc/livelogs/%23openmoko.livelog |
| 17:04.27 | cdbot2 | See ?? help-logs for usage instructions |
| 17:05.25 | *** join/#openmoko peepsalot (n=peeps@cpe-70-112-16-13.austin.res.rr.com) |
| 17:06.56 | *** join/#openmoko J-23 (n=Moarc_zi@a105.net128.okay.pl) |
| 17:12.35 | Ghiottone | SpeedEvil, thanks! |
| 17:13.39 | *** join/#openmoko behdad (n=behdad@CPE001217b19226-CM0012c9c84bc4.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 17:14.46 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@139.80-202-160.nextgentel.com) |
| 17:16.02 | Ghiottone | it looks like logs ends to 2 in the morning |
| 17:20.37 | *** join/#openmoko blinx (n=blinx@unixboard/user/blinx) |
| 17:20.41 | blinx | hi |
| 17:21.01 | blinx | is there a date when the new version of openmoko is available? |
| 17:21.02 | aloril | blinx: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1, SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) (Hopefully these links answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) |
| 17:21.44 | *** join/#openmoko xamindar (n=xamindar@adsl-69-239-79-217.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net) |
| 17:21.52 | blinx | Fall 2007 |
| 17:21.55 | blinx | a bit more specific? |
| 17:22.44 | *** join/#openmoko MetaMorfoziS (n=khmhm@dsl51B664DC.pool.t-online.hu) |
| 17:24.12 | aloril | (script) planet: Koen Kooi: Angstrom running on an Motorola a780 http://dominion.kabel.utwente.nl/koen/cms/angstrom-running-on-an-motorola-a780 |
| 17:28.08 | *** join/#openmoko |pit (n=pit@modemcable216.170-56-74.mc.videotron.ca) |
| 17:29.15 | *** join/#openmoko j_ack (n=j_ack@p508DBAA8.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
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| 17:29.41 | *** part/#openmoko SiO2 (n=sarge@p54B3933C.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 17:32.16 | *** join/#openmoko edistar (n=edwinloc@ip503ddd09.speed.planet.nl) |
| 17:36.06 | *** part/#openmoko rmoravcik (n=rmoravci@ip-89-103-152-149.karneval.cz) |
| 17:41.29 | Ghiottone | !help-logs |
| 17:46.23 | *** join/#openmoko a_thing (n=notroot@c-98-193-50-46.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 17:47.51 | *** join/#openmoko rmoravcik (n=rmoravci@ip-89-103-152-149.karneval.cz) |
| 17:50.00 | joao | I am connected via ssh to the phone. My laptop range is in the 10.0.0.x and the neo on the 192.168.0.x. When I do an ipkg update, the phone doesn't find the hosts. I did a resolv with nameserver=laptop ip but it doesn't seem to help |
| 17:51.39 | *** join/#openmoko juco2 (n=vickeryj@cpe-076-182-044-240.nc.res.rr.com) |
| 17:51.41 | SpeedEvil | does ping an.external.ip work? |
| 17:52.04 | mjr | does your laptop actually serve dns? :] |
| 17:52.49 | J-23 | :( |
| 17:53.18 | joao | Pinging an external address is no good. No, I don't think I serve DNS but that's not the only reason. I somehow need to tell the neo to go to the 10.0.0. network using the mac. I did as indicated in the wiki |
| 17:53.52 | *** join/#openmoko u_l-lap (n=clinton@m1c0e36d0.tmodns.net) |
| 17:54.59 | joao | something like add route all via 192.168.0.200 and then pray that the packets find their way back :-) |
| 18:00.26 | *** join/#openmoko Magon (n=Magon@213.155.227.226) |
| 18:01.40 | *** part/#openmoko J-23 (n=Moarc_zi@a105.net128.okay.pl) |
| 18:05.10 | SpeedEvil | route add default gw 192.168.0.200 should work |
| 18:05.22 | SpeedEvil | but that relies on the host to forward. |
| 18:09.39 | Ghiottone | that route should already be present on the neo |
| 18:09.58 | Ghiottone | all you need to do is to setup masquerading on the host |
| 18:10.56 | *** join/#openmoko joao_ (n=joao@35-165.5-85.cust.bluewin.ch) |
| 18:11.14 | Ghiottone | ping ftp.funet.fi works for me |
| 18:11.20 | joao_ | masquerading like changing the ff.ff.ff.0 on the host? |
| 18:11.49 | Ghiottone | no |
| 18:11.56 | joao_ | if I do an ifconfig I get: inet 192.168.0.200 netmask 0xffffff00 broadcast 192.168.0.255 |
| 18:12.04 | *** join/#openmoko baird (n=cjb@zorilla.apana.org.au) |
| 18:12.27 | Ghiottone | masquerading with iptables |
| 18:12.35 | Ghiottone | iptables -A POSTROUTING -t nat -j MASQUERADE -s 192.168.0.0/24 |
| 18:12.42 | Ghiottone | echo 1 > /proc/sys/net/ipv4/ip_forward |
| 18:12.51 | Ghiottone | iptables -P FORWARD ACCEPT |
| 18:13.04 | Ghiottone | that should do the trick. (Sorry for the 3 lines spam) |
| 18:14.14 | Ghiottone | only you have to put in /etc/resolv.con a valid nameserver address. I use one public on the internet |
| 18:14.18 | Ghiottone | got to go now. |
| 18:14.19 | Ghiottone | bye all |
| 18:14.40 | *** join/#openmoko _rob (n=rob@85.233.59.8.static.cablesurf.de) |
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| 18:24.13 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Translation]] [[User:Javiroman]] [[User:ChrisLord]] |
| 18:25.43 | *** join/#openmoko mmp (n=mmp@158.195.103.104) |
| 18:29.16 | mwester | cesarb: With atime: 268 minutes to build --- with noatime: 263 minutes to build... |
| 18:32.46 | *** join/#openmoko rob_w (n=bob@X1e5b.x.pppool.de) |
| 18:34.52 | *** join/#openmoko possan (n=possan@dyn-fxd-spd-01-cust91.netit.se) |
| 18:36.01 | possan | how many locales are glibc supposed to generate during build, feels like it has been generating and generating for hours now |
| 18:36.54 | *** join/#openmoko jujun (n=JulienN@LPuteaux-151-42-19-56.w193-252.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
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| 18:39.28 | hhf423 | re |
| 18:45.31 | bedboi | anyone knows how to serialize/unserialize gobjects? |
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| 19:08.04 | hhf423 | cb22: you did not yet vote, only nominate on gta2 p0? |
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| 19:32.11 | *** part/#openmoko minnam (n=srikanth@dsl-olugw6-fe7afa00-207.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 19:32.42 | *** join/#openmoko poffy (n=poffy@c-76-30-222-129.hsd1.tx.comcast.net) |
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| 19:36.17 | *** join/#openmoko zell1983 (n=zell1983@host77-122-dynamic.0-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
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| 19:48.55 | blinx | does actually a screen lock exist? |
| 19:49.32 | *** join/#openmoko El_Salvador (n=Brescia@adsl-ull-174-181.42-151.net24.it) |
| 19:58.48 | *** join/#openmoko tnt__ (n=tnt@211.1-247-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be) |
| 20:02.11 | *** join/#openmoko dcordes|bro (n=TSD_Test@f048044238.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 20:02.21 | dcordes|bro | hi |
| 20:05.58 | hhf423 | hi dcordes |
| 20:13.31 | mjr | it's not wired to work without a battery, if that's what you're saying |
| 20:14.00 | ixs | DukeOfURL: if you're running the neo without battery, don't. from what I gathered you might fry your hardware that way. |
| 20:14.30 | *** join/#openmoko hp__ (i=hp@ladderzat.student.utwente.nl) |
| 20:16.14 | DukeOfURL | ixs: I never remove the battery without first removing the USB connection. |
| 20:16.23 | cesarb | Hey, he's probably not running without a battery... He didn't describe scary noises nor funny smells |
| 20:16.38 | ixs | cesarb: hrhrhr |
| 20:16.51 | DukeOfURL | With battery and USB connection, the boot process hangs on "starting GUI" message |
| 20:17.45 | DukeOfURL | Also, with Neo off, plugging into USB will start the boot process |
| 20:18.44 | DukeOfURL | Are there any diagnostics for the PM unit? |
| 20:19.13 | DukeOfURL | And what does the uboot "factory reset" really do? |
| 20:21.19 | hhf423 | i think factory reset copies a rootfs from a save place |
| 20:21.58 | cesarb | hm, cool, I never saw this small keyboard-looking widget on my neo's status bar |
| 20:22.32 | hhf423 | cesarb: i also wonder where this comes from |
| 20:22.45 | DukeOfURL | did anyone determine why the Neo won't power down? |
| 20:23.02 | cesarb | It probably came when I updated yesterday, and this is the first time the status bar _didn't_ crash ;-) |
| 20:23.31 | ixs | cesarb: does gsm work for you? |
| 20:23.46 | cesarb | ixs: only if I kill and restart gsmd |
| 20:24.01 | cesarb | ixs: I'm working on it right now, btw... Se my progress at bug 766</shameless plug> |
| 20:24.12 | ixs | killing gsmd does not kill your device? |
| 20:24.14 | ixs | !ombug 766 |
| 20:24.28 | cesarb | ixs: I'm using the trick harald revealed yesterday |
| 20:24.42 | cesarb | ixs: see bug 788 |
| 20:24.50 | ixs | cesarb: mhm. I haven't paid attention. thx for the pointer. looking now |
| 20:24.52 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Wish_List]] [[User:Possan]] |
| 20:25.18 | cesarb | ixs: I'm also removing all the modem-powering-off from gsmd, so it won't crash even without command line modifications |
| 20:26.48 | ixs | cesarb: ahhh. the "trick" with removing the serial line from the cmdline. |
| 20:26.57 | ixs | yeah, I noticed that some weeks ago already. |
| 20:27.02 | ixs | but back then, the problem was different |
| 20:28.57 | *** join/#openmoko der_io (n=der@p54A0FF9A.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 20:29.02 | SpeedEvil | DukeOfURL yes - it can be gotten into a state where it takes almost no power. |
| 20:29.06 | SpeedEvil | (when off) |
| 20:30.33 | hhf423 | yes, hehe, after removing battery for minutes, its almost totally off |
| 20:30.34 | ixs | cesarb: hmmm. nice. gonna try that tomorrow |
| 20:30.44 | cesarb | DukeOfURL: SpeedEvil and me found out it was the audio amp |
| 20:31.27 | cesarb | DukeOfURL: just turn it off on alsamixer ("Amp Mode" to "Off"), turn the GSM modem off, turn the main power management chip off, and it's all off. |
| 20:31.46 | DukeOfURL | ok |
| 20:32.21 | cb22 | hhf423, yes, why? |
| 20:32.59 | SpeedEvil | Off - to within 100uA anyway. |
| 20:33.10 | SpeedEvil | I diddn't have any easy way of measuring lower. |
| 20:33.23 | hhf423 | cb22, why no vote yet? just wondered |
| 20:34.37 | cb22 | hhf423, no reason :) i haven't been around here for very long |
| 20:34.50 | cb22 | but just by looking at the wiki i see SpeedEvil everywhere |
| 20:35.18 | DukeOfURL | ~praise SpeedEvil |
| 20:35.19 | apt | All hail SpeedEvil! |
| 20:37.05 | hhf423 | I want your clothes, your boots and your motorbike |
| 20:37.47 | DukeOfURL | while playing the splash music, my Neo will ofter hang, abd the "music" turns to a roar. Is this also an alsa problem? |
| 20:37.58 | DukeOfURL | s'ofter'often' |
| 20:37.58 | *** part/#openmoko davi (i=davi@57.Red-88-2-100.staticIP.rima-tde.net) |
| 20:38.09 | SpeedEvil | cb22: some of it is simply vandalism reversal. |
| 20:38.16 | SpeedEvil | There was a _lot_ of that for a while. |
| 20:38.48 | hhf423 | vandalism , really? what kind? |
| 20:39.06 | SpeedEvil | DukeOfURL: It crashes, and plays the noise continuously? |
| 20:39.08 | cb22 | hhf423, the enlarge your penis by 200 times i'd imagine :p |
| 20:39.10 | SpeedEvil | hhf423: porn spam |
| 20:39.22 | DukeOfURL | SpeedEvil: yes, until I pull the battery |
| 20:39.27 | SpeedEvil | pages of 100 links inserted after the first 0-1K of a real page |
| 20:40.41 | cb22 | SpeedEvil, so _you're_ the idiot that removed them. i could've enlarged my penis by 350 inches with all those offers. |
| 20:40.53 | cb22 | not to mention married 375 russian brides |
| 20:40.57 | cb22 | damn you. |
| 20:41.23 | *** join/#openmoko kuyky (n=kuyky@a81-84-127-196.cpe.netcabo.pt) |
| 20:44.27 | *** join/#openmoko El_Salvador (n=Brescia@adsl-ull-62-150.44-151.net24.it) |
| 20:46.50 | *** join/#openmoko summatusmentis (n=summatus@rn083002.morris.umn.edu) |
| 20:50.04 | DukeOfURL | what's the procedure to build uboot with the mokomakefile? |
| 20:54.54 | *** join/#openmoko hp__ (n=hp@rhuidean.student.utwente.nl) |
| 20:55.19 | roh | cb22/SpeedEvil: when you see some reocurring spammer, tell me. |
| 20:56.00 | ixs | DukeOfURL: make build-package-uboot-openmoko |
| 20:56.22 | DukeOfURL | thanks |
| 21:04.12 | *** join/#openmoko ecraven (i=nex@eutyche.swe.uni-linz.ac.at) |
| 21:05.52 | cesarb | WOAH |
| 21:06.01 | cesarb | a HUGE clock appeared on my neo's status bar this time |
| 21:06.30 | cb22 | cesarb, i was O-o, but then i re-read the sentance, this time a bit slower |
| 21:09.40 | *** join/#openmoko tri (n=tri@mnch-4db0251b.pool.einsundeins.de) |
| 21:10.18 | aloril | (script) planet: Holger "zecke" Freyther: WebKit, GSoC 2007 at an end prototyping http://zecke.blogspot.com/2007/09/webkit-gsoc-2007-at-end-prototyping.html |
| 21:10.52 | cesarb | wtf the neo rebooted by itself |
| 21:11.22 | cesarb | while I was staring at the gsmd log and wondering why my patch didn't do what it was supposed to do |
| 21:14.04 | *** join/#openmoko guest_ (n=guest@adsl-64-161-117-110.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net) |
| 21:14.41 | nbd | wildfire: 25 |
| 21:14.42 | nbd | oops |
| 21:14.44 | ixs | cesarb: yeah, happened to me as well. Sometimes, but not reproducable the text of the clock is gettign HUGE |
| 21:16.14 | cesarb | This thing still crashes/hangs in way too many weird ways |
| 21:20.52 | *** join/#openmoko weez (n=weez@rrcs-24-173-249-242.sw.biz.rr.com) |
| 21:23.29 | SpeedEvil | roh: this was ages ago. |
| 21:24.01 | SpeedEvil | roh: well - months. I haven't seen a spammer more recent than a couple of months. |
| 21:24.04 | *** join/#openmoko visor (n=kvirc@mrc45-2-82-240-74-63.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 21:24.30 | roh | ok. |
| 21:25.20 | *** join/#openmoko darksauvage (n=sauvage@41.224.0.132) |
| 21:27.22 | visor | On what mobile can i find openmoko? |
| 21:27.22 | aloril | visor: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1, SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) (Hopefully these links answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) |
| 21:27.56 | CM | visor: So far, only the Neo1973 and somewhat on some EZX phones |
| 21:28.28 | *** part/#openmoko darksauvage (n=sauvage@41.224.0.132) |
| 21:29.16 | visor | 300$ it is expensive for me :/ |
| 21:29.58 | CM | Wait for the retail version then, but it will be 450$ |
| 21:30.17 | SpeedEvil | It's comparable to similar phones - at $300 |
| 21:30.31 | SpeedEvil | At $450 - it may be slightly more expensive. |
| 21:30.52 | SpeedEvil | The lack of subsidy is annoying. |
| 21:32.13 | cesarb | Great, it looks like my Palm's rusty old USB cable is starting to act up |
| 21:32.21 | cesarb | And Neo's USB cables are way too short |
| 21:32.33 | cesarb | (the Razr's cable is too short too) |
| 21:32.58 | *** join/#openmoko hp__ (n=hp@rhuidean.student.utwente.nl) |
| 21:33.41 | El_Salvador | but razr's cable works? |
| 21:34.02 | cesarb | El_Salvador: should work... never tested it (I've been using the Palm cable for years, even for the Razr) |
| 21:34.07 | El_Salvador | (i have a motorola razr v3xx) |
| 21:35.11 | mwester | El_Salvador: The V3 cables are just stock mini-b USB cables -- they'll work fine. |
| 21:35.35 | El_Salvador | good :) |
| 21:35.35 | cesarb | YES |
| 21:35.41 | *** join/#openmoko TimRiker (i=timr@nat/novell/x-1c452aad10dfc421) |
| 21:35.57 | cesarb | Patch 4 seems to work as intended! |
| 21:37.16 | DukeOfURL | SpeedEvil: New uboot, uImage, and rootfs from one hour ago. It still hangs on bootup during the splash "music" |
| 21:37.17 | hhf423 | cesarb: doing what? |
| 21:37.37 | DukeOfURL | SpeedEvil: beginning to wonder if there's a hardware problem... |
| 21:38.01 | ixs | unlikely |
| 21:38.39 | DukeOfURL | does anyone else have bootup problems? |
| 21:38.42 | Obri | DukeOfURL: disable the serial console in uboot |
| 21:39.16 | Obri | DukeOfURL: there is a problem with the serial console and gsmd |
| 21:41.24 | hhf423 | gsmd is a problem, period |
| 21:41.44 | Obri | hehe |
| 21:41.51 | DukeOfURL | ok, it's booting up to the "today" screen, but there is no panel |
| 21:41.53 | tuukkah | well gsmd alone doesn't crash the kernel =) |
| 21:42.31 | tuukkah | DukeOfURL, restart gsmd and you get a panel when you restart xserver |
| 21:42.43 | mwester | The problem is less gsmd as it is the lack of focus on gsmd -- I wonder why the core team have forgotten that this is a PHONE(!), after all.... |
| 21:42.51 | hhf423 | i would put nothing past gsmd |
| 21:43.29 | hhf423 | not even killing the kernel, when he is not looking |
| 21:43.33 | cesarb | hhf423: fixing bug 766, and potentially at least parts of bug 574 it depends on |
| 21:43.36 | tuukkah | gsmd used to work fairly well but then we need some power management features too |
| 21:43.43 | *** join/#openmoko _rob (n=rob@85.233.59.8.static.cablesurf.de) |
| 21:43.45 | cesarb | Just attached it to bug 766 |
| 21:43.55 | ixs | mwester: truer words were never spoken. :D |
| 21:44.38 | *** join/#openmoko El_Salvador[Away (n=Brescia@adsl-93-180.38-151.net24.it) |
| 21:46.03 | cesarb | OK, now let's try with a SIM... |
| 21:46.38 | hhf423 | yeah, i agree with mwester |
| 21:47.15 | cesarb | With my new patch on bug 766, I seem to have working GSM when turning on the phone (just have to test with a SIM now)... I think it's significant progress ;-) |
| 21:47.25 | tuukkah | what if #openmoko focused on gsmd? |
| 21:48.27 | *** join/#openmoko ufo76 (n=ufo76@host81-132-50-52.range81-132.btcentralplus.com) |
| 21:48.28 | cesarb | tuukkah: too narrow focus |
| 21:48.44 | cesarb | tuukkah: things like PM (looks sideways at SpeedEvil) are very important too |
| 21:48.44 | mwester | tuukkah: are you serious? Maybe the phone wouldn't crash with the power-management turned on; maybe gsmd would work on boot with needing to be restarted manually, maybe SMS would work, etc. etc. etc. |
| 21:48.50 | tuukkah | well, too narrow for the core team too |
| 21:48.56 | hhf423 | i can include gsmd in my prayers |
| 21:49.25 | cesarb | mwester: with my patch for bug 766, it works on boot without having to be restarted manually ;-) |
| 21:49.27 | cb22 | maybe if we all pray for gsmd it will sort itself out |
| 21:50.05 | borg_ | cesarb: sounds nice :) |
| 21:50.15 | mwester | I was hoping that you would attach it to the bug report |
| 21:50.17 | borg_ | cesarb: does gsmd work with the newest kernel with your patch? |
| 21:50.47 | cesarb | borg_: you have to comment out the powering off of the modem on /etc/init.d/gsmd or boot without serial console |
| 21:51.10 | cesarb | borg_: that to avoid the crash... if it doesn't crash (because you got lucky), it should work |
| 21:51.10 | borg_ | i thougt the dead-after-gsmd-restart-problem is with the kernel and not with gsmd |
| 21:51.43 | cesarb | borg_: the dead-device one is a kernel bug; the stuck-gsmd one is a gsmd bug |
| 21:51.51 | borg_ | ah ok |
| 21:51.57 | borg_ | i mixed them up then |
| 21:51.58 | borg_ | nice :) |
| 21:53.02 | cesarb | hm, didn't work with the SIM :( |
| 21:53.55 | CM | cesarb: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Community_nominees_for_GTA02_P0 :D |
| 21:53.58 | tuukkah | cesarb, doesn't it only restart if it wasn't running already? |
| 21:54.36 | cesarb | tuukkah: I think it's unconditional stop/start... will check as soon as I find where's that code |
| 21:55.33 | tuukkah | cesarb, if you stop gsmd and restart xserver-noxdm you can see the debug print it does |
| 21:55.58 | cesarb | hm, it's commented out |
| 21:56.55 | *** join/#openmoko tnt_ (n=tnt@40.95-244-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be) |
| 21:57.37 | CM | ScaredyCat: http://www.scratchprojects.com/2007/08/introduction_to_lua_programming_p01.php |
| 21:57.39 | cesarb | And the one in libmokogsmd is conditional |
| 21:58.33 | *** part/#openmoko hhf423 (n=user@tmo-106-1.customers.d1-online.com) |
| 21:59.15 | cesarb | Rebooting, it worked... Now it seems to work only half of the time, instead of reliably NOT working 100% of the time as before |
| 21:59.34 | mwester | That's sometimes even harder to track down... :( |
| 21:59.46 | cesarb | mwester: I think I only got part of the problem |
| 22:00.26 | cesarb | mwester: I'm guessing there's still a timing window where I don't get the "AT-Interpreter ready" message but it will not answer to ATZ |
| 22:00.58 | cesarb | mwester: if I get the "interpreter ready" thing just after the ATZ, it now (with my patch) correctly reissues the ATZ |
| 22:01.11 | cw666 | cesarb: after ATZ you should see OK |
| 22:01.12 | roh | mwester see bug 788 |
| 22:01.15 | cesarb | mwester: still, it's progress |
| 22:01.27 | cesarb | cw666: yeah, but I'm not seeing the OK |
| 22:01.32 | *** join/#openmoko El_Salvador (n=Brescia@adsl-137-177.38-151.net24.it) |
| 22:01.34 | cw666 | cesarb: are you saying you see "interp ready" sometimes? |
| 22:01.53 | cesarb | cw666: yeah, sometimes I see it just after the ATZ (and thus with my patch it reissues the ATZ) |
| 22:01.59 | mwester | roh: yep, that's why I'm wondering -- perhaps there are lost characters, lost interrupts, or other problems beyond what was noted by Harold in that comment on the bug. |
| 22:02.05 | cw666 | cesarb: oh, i dont think ive seen that |
| 22:02.09 | cesarb | cw666: but sometimes I don't... it sends ATZ and never gets any response |
| 22:02.28 | cw666 | cesarb: i know sometimes i dont get OK, so what i was doing was poking the power down/up the get the 'interpreter ready' message |
| 22:02.37 | cw666 | which in current kernels is busticated as you know |
| 22:02.54 | tuukkah | mwester, if you turn off the console then i'd expect there not to be switching anymore |
| 22:02.54 | roh | mwester its propably a bug in the serial driver, as hes written |
| 22:03.12 | cesarb | cw666: that evil "voodoo dance" in the gsmd script? I commented it out, else I would get insane rebooting it tens of times until I got lucky and it didn't crash |
| 22:03.23 | cesarb | cw666: or would have to every time turn off the serial console |
| 22:03.56 | tuukkah | cesarb, you should save the setting to turn off serial console |
| 22:03.57 | cw666 | cesarb: no, that was something i did |
| 22:04.01 | mwester | tuukkah: that's an interesting assumption -- I think it's worth testing that. If we can find a way to force the MUX to switch to the GSM modem independent of power, that might uncover some timing issues. |
| 22:04.12 | cw666 | gsmd and the script for poking at have been very unreliable for me |
| 22:04.30 | cw666 | cesarb: also, you know when you turn the modem 'off' like that it's still on right? |
| 22:04.34 | cw666 | you can even call the device |
| 22:05.22 | tuukkah | mwester, hmm, do we have information on where the mux is physically? |
| 22:05.37 | cesarb | cw666: yeah, that "power_on" thing is like the power button |
| 22:05.43 | cesarb | cw666: it will turn the phone on |
| 22:05.45 | mwester | Nope. I was going to dig into the kernel source, and see if we can just set it at initialization time. |
| 22:05.47 | cesarb | cw666: but not off |
| 22:06.01 | roh | tuukkah its a switch which is coupled with the gsm_on via software. |
| 22:06.07 | cw666 | cesarb: poke off/on though seems to cause it to deregister from the network though |
| 22:06.23 | cw666 | off leave it registers and on, tuning it back on leaves it on but registration to the network goes away |
| 22:06.31 | roh | its switched together via the same sysctl |
| 22:06.32 | cesarb | cw666: it probably sends a signal to the modem's CPU when toggled when it's on, like the main PMU's power button |
| 22:06.40 | tuukkah | roh, so how does the software see it? |
| 22:06.42 | cw666 | so maybe it should be treated more like a soft-reset |
| 22:07.19 | *** join/#openmoko holtmann (n=holtmann@nikita.holtmann.net) |
| 22:07.21 | *** part/#openmoko holtmann (n=holtmann@nikita.holtmann.net) |
| 22:08.09 | roh | see arch/arm/common/gta01_pm_gsm.c |
| 22:08.58 | roh | in openmoko/trunk/src/target/kernel/patches/gta01-power_control.patch |
| 22:09.22 | tuukkah | thanks! |
| 22:10.46 | cesarb | Well, finally I have a phone instead of an expensive toy |
| 22:11.01 | *** join/#openmoko El_Salvador[Away (n=Brescia@adsl-173-177.38-151.net24.it) |
| 22:11.08 | cesarb | With my patch, I managed to boot, and dial from the landline to the neo, answer, hear myself (both ways), and hangup from the phone |
| 22:11.18 | cesarb | _without_ having to plug USB or use the terminal |
| 22:11.35 | tuukkah | so we have s3c2410_gpio_setpin(gta01_gsm.gpio_ngsm_en, 0); to connect to the gsm chip and to disconnect s3c2410_gpio_setpin(gta01_gsm.gpio_ngsm_en, 1); |
| 22:11.57 | spikebike | cesarb excellent |
| 22:12.51 | cesarb | This deals with at least part of the first item of [[User:CesarB/Requirements]]... |
| 22:12.55 | cw666 | cesarb: im rebuilding with your latest patch now, ill update the bug with a "yeah it works here too" if it does |
| 22:13.19 | cesarb | cw666: are you using the debug patch too? |
| 22:13.44 | cesarb | cw666: it's pretty useful... shows what was actually sent to the modem (differently from the "submitted" stuff, which is just "enqueued") |
| 22:14.13 | cesarb | Urgh, dialing fails |
| 22:14.15 | cw666 | cesarb: ok, ill make sure it's there too |
| 22:14.16 | Vegar | cesarb: where is this patch of yours? |
| 22:14.24 | cw666 | !ombug 766 |
| 22:14.33 | cesarb | "Not connected to network. Current status = Home network registered" <- WTF? |
| 22:15.11 | cesarb | Vegar: bug 766 |
| 22:15.54 | tuukkah | gta01_gsm.gpio_ngsm_en is decided by gsm_probe based on system rev |
| 22:16.14 | Vegar | ok |
| 22:16.23 | cesarb | Hm, the gsm log says the dialer didn't even _try_ to dial :( |
| 22:16.27 | tuukkah | on GTA01B it's set to 0 by default |
| 22:16.35 | cw666 | cesarb: grrr, something unpatches/rm's the tree on rebuilds |
| 22:16.42 | cw666 | cesarb: what's is the 'right' incarnation to prevent that? |
| 22:17.08 | *** join/#openmoko drath_ (i=vmaster@p5B07F892.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 22:17.23 | tuukkah | or no, GTA01v3_GPIO_nGSM_EN is different from GTA01Bv2_GPIO_nGSM_EN... |
| 22:17.27 | cesarb | cw666: dunno, I use an overlay tree |
| 22:17.40 | cesarb | cw666: nothing touches the overlay tree ;-) |
| 22:18.21 | roh | tuukkah japp. but that should not concern anybody. all phones where we took money for are gta01bv4 |
| 22:18.55 | tuukkah | roh, yeah but the code is doing something weird, setting pin GTA01v3_GPIO_nGSM_EN on GTA01B devices |
| 22:19.15 | roh | there is no GTA01B |
| 22:19.52 | *** join/#openmoko Aria (n=aredride@acrux.theinternetco.net) |
| 22:20.01 | tuukkah | is it wrong to use that as an abbrv for case GTA01Bv2_SYSTEM_REV: case GTA01Bv3_SYSTEM_REV: case GTA01Bv4_SYSTEM_REV: |
| 22:20.37 | roh | i dunno. would have to look at the code then. |
| 22:20.42 | cesarb | roh: GTA01B* is the bluetooth ones |
| 22:20.55 | cesarb | roh: GTA01* (without the B) is the pre-bluetooth ones |
| 22:21.02 | cesarb | roh: (learned that on the wiki) |
| 22:21.27 | roh | japp. there was gta01vX, then with bt is gta01bvX |
| 22:22.10 | cesarb | BTW, my phone didn't ring when I tested, just vibrated. Is that normal? |
| 22:23.47 | *** join/#openmoko El_Salvador (n=Brescia@adsl-78-182.37-151.net24.it) |
| 22:24.16 | tuukkah | ok my point was i don't see where we set the initial value for the gta01b* mux pin, only for the gta01v* pin |
| 22:24.55 | roh | i'll take a look at it as soon as i can think straight again.. catched a flu |
| 22:25.05 | nibbler_de | oh, gute besserung. |
| 22:25.40 | roh | i think laforge will not have time too soon for fixing the kernelbug, so if any of you owns a debugboard and is faster than us.. feel free to debug and send patches. |
| 22:25.55 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Community_nominees_for_GTA02_P0]] [[Wish_List]] [[Talk:Hear_Me_FIC]] |
| 22:26.00 | *** join/#openmoko cb22 (n=cb22@dsl-245-145-221.telkomadsl.co.za) |
| 22:26.24 | *** join/#openmoko Aztlek (n=lbernal@190.156.58.45) |
| 22:27.12 | tuukkah | roh, wish i had one |
| 22:27.18 | roh | i hope you can understand that completing gta02 hardware design and validation is more important right now than fixing sofware bugs on gta01. |
| 22:27.36 | tuukkah | sure |
| 22:27.51 | roh | hey nibbler_de ... thanks |
| 22:28.03 | tuukkah | i'm only talking here to tap on the power of the community :-) |
| 22:28.24 | cw666 | roh: once gta02 is out gta01 phones will be depricated? |
| 22:29.13 | mwester | I'll avoid the temptation to discuss the nature of successful startup companies, and just say with my experience, I must respectfully disagree with the core team's opinon on that point. |
| 22:29.31 | roh | cw666 no. we will still fully support the hardware and of course complete any missing components. were not like the rest of the fast-living industry |
| 22:29.53 | cw666 | roh: actually, the 'rest of us' generally support things in such a way too |
| 22:30.43 | tuukkah | cw666, so why did you even ask ;-) |
| 22:31.22 | cw666 | tuukkah: i see a lot of movement on gta02 and bugs on gta01 so wondered if there was much focus from the core team on gta01 at all |
| 22:31.27 | cw666 | and hence the question |
| 22:31.32 | mwester | (to clarify context, my last comment is in response to roh's comment regarding gta02 being more important that the product in customer's hands right now -- not in response to cw666's comment.) |
| 22:31.47 | buz | userland bugs will affect either of them |
| 22:31.49 | mwester | s/that/than/ |
| 22:31.57 | buz | only very specific kernel bugs are related to gta02 only |
| 22:32.00 | buz | uhm 01 |
| 22:32.06 | roh | mwester the only other possibility would have been to not open up development so early and complete the hard and software before going to the open. but thats not what we wanted. we do not want to build on the community fixing the bugs for us or develop everything like other companys tried before. that would be abuse of the community in my eyes. we wanted to be honest with you. thats important |
| 22:32.13 | cw666 | oh crap, ive been superdeaded again |
| 22:33.04 | tuukkah | cw666, i think it's just that hardware is more important than software |
| 22:33.20 | buz | outside of driver bugs, fixes for gta02 should benefit gta01 just as much |
| 22:33.41 | roh | mwester we will continue to work on all whats buggy and missing and fill in the missing bits. if the community wants to help, thats fine. that could eventually speed things up. but we also fully understand if you want to wait and build on 'working things' .. but i'm sorry.. we're not there yet. |
| 22:33.56 | cesarb | buz: and vice versa... |
| 22:34.10 | buz | boy i have some really bad lag |
| 22:34.26 | mwester | roh: Perhaps you misunderstand. I merely believe that working with your current customers and the product they have in hand is vital -- otherwise it is percieved that you are interested in future customers, and have abandoned the existing product. That is a reputation that is difficult to shed once established. |
| 22:35.19 | *** join/#openmoko hp__ (n=hp@rhuidean.student.utwente.nl) |
| 22:35.35 | roh | but the community made clear that they want to hack on this hard and software at the earlyiest possible moment. so i think we have to live with some of the citicism that were getting, since in my eyes weve been more honest to you than any other company ive seen before. (and i'm not saying that because i work for openmoko, but as a opensource enthusiast. |
| 22:36.14 | tuukkah | as far as i see, this is working well this far |
| 22:36.41 | roh | mwester i think you misunderstand. gta01 is not a product. gta01 does not have users. gta01 is for developers who usually get far less informations and source with a develboard like this. |
| 22:37.04 | tuukkah | of course gta01 customer == developer |
| 22:37.27 | folken | I just wished that the funtionality would be preserved. Currently it just seems like on every update something else breaks. |
| 22:37.29 | roh | and we sold them only because many asked us to, and not because we thought 'its done enough, deploy, deploy!' |
| 22:37.29 | SpeedEvil | Indeed - we do. The problem is not the information or software released, it's the lack of announcements of stuff that you have to have known well in advance. |
| 22:37.58 | cesarb | roh: I think the problem is that, while some of us are low-level people who can bash gsmd or even the kernel into shape when needed, others of us are left waiting for it to work enough |
| 22:37.59 | folken | But please don't get me wrong. I love digging around the code.. |
| 22:37.59 | SpeedEvil | For example, how many GTA01s are in process of production, and at what time might they hit the store, ... |
| 22:38.11 | SpeedEvil | Meh. |
| 22:38.12 | cesarb | roh: these high-level people are stuck on a waiting game |
| 22:38.15 | roh | SpeedEvil were working on than too. there will be much improved information flow from us. |
| 22:39.05 | SpeedEvil | Good. I know personally that the above has stopped me pushing the device to several devs I know that like to hack on hardware they own. Simply as I can't say 'order now, and you get one in a week'. |
| 22:39.15 | folken | If it where at least possible to dial and recieve calls. Everything else can be added easely. |
| 22:39.18 | mwester | I'm very happy to hack on the kernel to work on the UART/GSM poweron/off problem - I even have the debug board. But I will be very unhappy if I spend a week on that bug, to find that someone in the core team knows exactly what the problem is, and knows how to fix it, and will have a patch submitted about the time I figure it out a week hence. |
| 22:39.38 | tuukkah | folken, power management isn't necessarily easy |
| 22:39.50 | folken | tuukkah: agreed.. |
| 22:39.54 | roh | cesarb i can understand, and am shure that the publicity in direction of non-developers would be better when we waited. but that would not been openmoko |
| 22:39.58 | SpeedEvil | It's horribly hard. |
| 22:40.29 | tuukkah | SpeedEvil, still i've heard you've made progress :-) |
| 22:40.30 | roh | that would have been yet another linux device thats developed behind closed doors. |
| 22:40.52 | SpeedEvil | tuukkah: rather minimal - but at least it's off. |
| 22:41.24 | cesarb | urgh, WTF |
| 22:41.35 | tuukkah | SpeedEvil, i've wanted to ask, can i read about the results somewhere? |
| 22:41.36 | roh | mwester jap. i can understand that. but be shure these guys know how to use bugzilla. |
| 22:41.48 | cesarb | if (priv->registered != FOO || priv->registered != BAR) { /* don't let me dial */ } |
| 22:42.02 | cesarb | which means, of course, that it will never let me dial |
| 22:42.23 | roh | -h |
| 22:42.36 | tuukkah | cesarb, heh %-) |
| 22:42.52 | SpeedEvil | tuukkah: in what sense? |
| 22:43.23 | tuukkah | SpeedEvil, what did you do, what did you achieve, how can i reproduce that :-) |
| 22:43.38 | cesarb | svn blame points to thomas as the culprit... |
| 22:43.48 | SpeedEvil | tuukkah: turning all teh power stuff off, so the battery lasts most of a year in 'off' |
| 22:44.15 | SpeedEvil | tuukkah: send at@poff to modem, which makes it go to sleep. Set amp-mode in alsamixer to 'off' |
| 22:44.42 | SpeedEvil | then when you switch off, it uses under 100uA, rather than 30ma+ |
| 22:45.52 | tuukkah | that's all? wow |
| 22:46.07 | *** join/#openmoko cb22_ (n=cb22@dsl-245-145-221.telkomadsl.co.za) |
| 22:46.28 | cw666 | SpeedEvil: i never see 'amp-mode' in the mixer... where should i be looking? |
| 22:46.42 | cw666 | SpeedEvil: also, i wonder, why even have the amp on when there is no playback at all? |
| 22:46.48 | tuukkah | at least the amp-mode can be easily added to init scripts |
| 22:47.00 | SpeedEvil | I was most dissapointed to find out that the power supply chip has hideous granularity. It can only alter most rails in increments of 0.3V, which makes undervolting hard. |
| 22:47.16 | *** join/#openmoko Linux_Galore (n=richard@60-242-20-212.static.tpgi.com.au) |
| 22:47.22 | SpeedEvil | Especially as it _almost_ seems to work at 1.5V |
| 22:47.31 | SpeedEvil | And I'm sure another 20mv or so would make it go. |
| 22:47.34 | folken | is there something classy such as "wake up on modem ring" ? |
| 22:47.40 | SpeedEvil | In theory. |
| 22:47.46 | SpeedEvil | Not yet implemented |
| 22:48.09 | cw666 | SpeedEvil: actually, i wonder why it's not working... from the wiki the ring should be connected to EXTINT0 iirc |
| 22:48.14 | Linux_Galore | wonder if OM will make a UMPC like phone |
| 22:48.18 | roh | SpeedEvil heh.. were not too happy either. but its what we got and there are no reasonable alternatives i know of. |
| 22:48.19 | cw666 | SpeedEvil: that should suffice to wake the CPU just as the buttons do surely? |
| 22:48.42 | roh | Linux_Galore when umpc ever will archive reasonable power consumption.. who knows? ;) |
| 22:49.36 | tuukkah | SpeedEvil, in any vase, this is all we got? http://wiki.openmoko.org/wikiNeo1973_GTA01_Power_Management |
| 22:50.01 | Linux_Galore | roh: intel, samsung few others make low power 32 bit cpu's now |
| 22:50.02 | tuukkah | s/vase/case/ |
| 22:50.38 | roh | Linux_Galore currently there is no x86 cpu which comes into the range of whats exaptable... |
| 22:50.42 | SpeedEvil | tuukkah: pretty much |
| 22:51.07 | roh | Linux_Galore you know the sony umpc have fans and a big venting hole? |
| 22:51.34 | SpeedEvil | cw666: I don't know how you'd configure the modem to do that. |
| 22:51.49 | SpeedEvil | cw666: I should really have tried wake on ring in suspend mode. |
| 22:52.07 | Linux_Galore | roh: Ive seen the new Milo based intel UMPC and the new Touch UMPC phone and they haveno fans and run happily for 5 hours |
| 22:52.25 | Linux_Galore | Milo = distro of Linux |
| 22:52.36 | cw666 | SpeedEvil: yeah, im not sure either, no docs and it doesn't seem to work as-is |
| 22:52.41 | SpeedEvil | Is there a simple way to get bugzilla to tell me all bugs I have sumbitted? |
| 22:52.51 | cw666 | grrr, superdead battery is taking a LONG time to come up ... |
| 22:52.59 | cesarb | SpeedEvil: yes |
| 22:53.04 | cesarb | SpeedEvil: go to the advanced query page |
| 22:53.09 | Linux_Galore | sorry not touch HTC, wrong name |
| 22:53.24 | cesarb | SpeedEvil: "Any of" "Reporter" "is" |
| 22:53.33 | SpeedEvil | I've selected all the bug states, and reporter is me |
| 22:53.44 | cw666 | cesarb: http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/buglist.cgi?short_desc_type=allwordssubstr&short_desc=&long_desc_type=allwordssubstr&long_desc=&bug_file_loc_type=allwordssubstr&bug_file_loc=&bug_status=NEW&bug_status=ASSIGNED&bug_status=REOPENED&emailtype1=substring&email1=&emailreporter2=1&emailtype2=substring&email2=cesarb&bugidtype=include&bug_id=&votes=&changedin=&chfieldfrom=&chfieldto=Now&chfieldvalue=&cmdtype=doit&newquerynam |
| 22:53.50 | cesarb | SpeedEvil: don't select any bug stages, deselect them all |
| 22:53.52 | cw666 | oops :) that was longer than i expected |
| 22:54.27 | roh | Linux_Galore hm.. ive not yet seen specs.. have a url? |
| 22:54.31 | bedboi | are there any rumors about the next shipping date??? |
| 22:54.34 | SpeedEvil | Hmm. Looks like I diddn't submit the voltage bug |
| 22:54.36 | Linux_Galore | roh: Milo ? |
| 22:54.38 | cesarb | cw666: http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/buglist.cgi?short_desc_type=allwordssubstr&short_desc=&long_desc_type=allwordssubstr&long_desc=&bug_file_loc_type=allwordssubstr&bug_file_loc=&emailtype1=substring&email1=&emailreporter2=1&emailtype2=exact&email2=cesarb%40cesarb.net&bugidtype=include&bug_id=&votes=&changedin=&chfieldfrom=&chfieldto=Now&chfieldvalue=&cmdtype=doit&newqueryname=&order=Bug+Number&field0-0-0=noop&type0-0-0=noop&value0-0-0= |
| 22:54.55 | bedboi | the .com site is still fuzzy-saying "after 10 Sept" |
| 22:55.11 | roh | Linux_Galore a umpc based phone with 5hours battery which has much longer standby |
| 22:55.34 | Linux_Galore | roh: the HTC unit you can already purchase in the USA |
| 22:56.15 | Linux_Galore | the Intel Milo umpc unit is due to be released later this year |
| 22:56.18 | roh | eh.. i know of no x86 htc devices |
| 22:56.33 | cw666 | cesarb: btw, did you try that Willie's latest patch to power down the lm4857 |
| 22:56.41 | cesarb | cw666: nope |
| 22:57.02 | cesarb | cw666: wouldn't be useful since I don't have a current measurement rig |
| 22:57.05 | Linux_Galore | roh: what is this fixation with x86 |
| 22:57.13 | cesarb | cw666: SpeedEvil does |
| 22:57.29 | cw666 | cesarb: yeah, i need to find my meter(s) and make one myself |
| 22:57.33 | SpeedEvil | Can anyone with a recent kernel cat /sys/devices/platform/s3c2410-i2c/i2c-0/0-0008/voltage_dcud ? |
| 22:57.38 | Linux_Galore | roh: you dont need x86 for a UMPC |
| 22:57.40 | SpeedEvil | Err |
| 22:57.47 | SpeedEvil | Can anyone with a recent kernel cat /sys/devices/platform/s3c2410-i2c/i2c-0/0-0008/voltage_d3reg ? |
| 22:57.49 | SpeedEvil | I mean |
| 22:58.03 | SpeedEvil | Is it 2100? |
| 22:58.16 | *** join/#openmoko kuyky (n=kuyky@a81-84-127-196.cpe.netcabo.pt) |
| 22:59.12 | mwester | 2100 |
| 22:59.31 | SpeedEvil | Thanks. |
| 22:59.43 | folken | SpeedEvil: if it would boot i' could tell you. :) |
| 22:59.48 | mwester | on my kernel the path is actually cat /sys/devices/platform/s3c2410-i2c/i2c-adapter/i2c-0/0-0008/voltage_d3reg |
| 23:01.25 | roh | Linux_Galore UMPC meant embedded x86.. on a unified 'platform/chipset' |
| 23:01.26 | folken | i think i need to reflash. |
| 23:01.35 | *** join/#openmoko cindy (n=cindy@c-24-218-180-68.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 23:02.12 | SpeedEvil | Embedded x86 would be nice in a way. If it could be low power and cheap. |
| 23:02.52 | roh | SpeedEvil atm there are not even small enough ones.. so i think we can wait with that |
| 23:03.17 | cw666 | SpeedEvil: there are some options, but the power budget just isn't that low compared to arm/mips |
| 23:03.22 | SpeedEvil | Indeed. I want to get 386/20/4M in a SOIC8 or something. |
| 23:03.26 | SpeedEvil | for $1 |
| 23:03.32 | SpeedEvil | it'll be a few years though. |
| 23:04.00 | cw666 | SpeedEvil: there were SoCs down at that level, but most of the newer stuff is actually a LOT more powerful and and also more power hungry |
| 23:04.04 | mwester | The Linksys NAS200 is an x86-compatible SOC device. |
| 23:04.19 | SpeedEvil | I know. It's annoying. |
| 23:04.45 | tuukkah | SpeedEvil, so why do you want x86? |
| 23:04.49 | SpeedEvil | For many things I would really quite like a 20Mhz SoC, not a 200MHz one. |
| 23:04.55 | mwester | Floating point? |
| 23:05.07 | cw666 | mwester: there are arm cores with FP, mips too |
| 23:05.19 | *** join/#openmoko jackol (n=jubuntu@cs181008020.pp.htv.fi) |
| 23:05.24 | cw666 | SpeedEvil: why not just have one with decent PM and a good HALT state? |
| 23:05.26 | SpeedEvil | mwester: just to forget about the embedded programming side, and pretend that everything is a PC. Pretty much. |
| 23:05.49 | SpeedEvil | Because to have PM low enough it practically means reloading the core from RAM each resume. |
| 23:06.00 | cw666 | SpeedEvil: btw, i work (as my real job) on embedded mips and x86 ... and the people i deal with do pretends it's a PC --- and that *SUCKS* because they produce much bloaty shit |
| 23:06.00 | roh | cw666 even then you cannot get below 1W for the whole system |
| 23:06.11 | roh | in power-on state |
| 23:06.16 | cw666 | SpeedEvil: yes, it's easier but it encourages dumb people to do really bad things |
| 23:06.23 | *** join/#openmoko joao (n=joao@35-165.5-85.cust.bluewin.ch) |
| 23:06.43 | Linux_Galore | roh: Intels new x86 umpc low powered chipset http://linuxdevices.com/news/NS5285316667.html |
| 23:06.49 | SpeedEvil | cw666: for example - I'm currently sort-of-contemplating a bluetooth thingy. Which would be _so_ easy if I could use the bluez* drivers. |
| 23:07.13 | cw666 | that article has some details wrong |
| 23:07.50 | cw666 | SpeedEvil: why does bluez require x86? |
| 23:07.52 | folken | SpeedEvil: i operate bluez on arm. |
| 23:07.56 | roh | between 13 and 25 Watts... heh.. thats 25 times our current power consuption |
| 23:07.59 | cesarb | Yay, this time I managed to DIAL to my landline too |
| 23:08.07 | cw666 | roh: it's probably 50x as fast too |
| 23:08.19 | cw666 | roh: actually, hard to say how much, but it's decently powerful as a core |
| 23:08.27 | SpeedEvil | folken: It doesn't of course - nor an MMU even strictly. But it does require 32 bit, and a fair chunk of RAM. |
| 23:08.31 | roh | cw666 so what... when i then only can use it half a day that helps me nothing |
| 23:08.34 | Linux_Galore | roh: umpc's are a bigger form factor so a 4000->7000MAH battery is normal |
| 23:09.07 | cw666 | roh: it depends what the usage model is, if you have a finite amount of work to do and halt cost near zero then it's not so bad, if you have a lot of little bits of work to do then i agree, it's useless |
| 23:09.10 | roh | Linux_Galore yep. and i accredit their effort. but thats more ubuntu-embedded than openmoko what youre looking at |
| 23:09.17 | cw666 | roh: for a phone x86 makes no sense, not yet anyhow |
| 23:09.28 | folken | SpeedEvil: sorry I don't know much about hardware, but I use my bluetooth mini-pcmcia card in my zaurus daily. |
| 23:09.32 | roh | cw66 ack |
| 23:09.34 | cw666 | x86 has much silicon (and therefore power) used to do things you just dont care about in a phone |
| 23:09.44 | folken | SpeedEvil: and it does use a bluez module. |
| 23:09.54 | Linux_Galore | HTC with dont use x86 with their unit its based on ARM |
| 23:09.59 | *** join/#openmoko sdsadas (n=jubuntu@dsl-hkibras1-ff42c000-142.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 23:10.02 | Linux_Galore | s/with// |
| 23:10.14 | SpeedEvil | folken: I'm meaning embedding bluetooth into stuff - think a really smart pair of earphones, not a PDA. |
| 23:10.43 | folken | SpeedEvil: ah. |
| 23:11.13 | cw666 | SpeedEvil: arm is fine for that, get a gumstix as a proto device even |
| 23:11.44 | SpeedEvil | Yes, arm is fine for that - I was more meaning 'any architecture similar in performance to' rather than strictly 386 |
| 23:12.03 | Linux_Galore | At the moment its next to impossible to find a Linux based UMPC with a 5/6" LCD under US$800 that is halfway decent other than the N800, the problem with the N800 is the hardware is gutless |
| 23:12.17 | cw666 | SpeedEvil: a 386 (in order shallow core) is pretty slow, for a given amount of power i suspect a decent arm core will spank one |
| 23:12.50 | cb22_ | i think the next neo should have a nice quad core xeon built in :) |
| 23:12.53 | SpeedEvil | cw666: I'm not meaning a 386/20, I mean something that can do the same amount of processing, with MMU/... |
| 23:13.01 | cb22_ | that way, we avoide all the speed issues |
| 23:13.08 | spikebike | n800 gutless? |
| 23:13.13 | cw666 | SpeedEvil: so when you say 386 you mean a recent x86-like CPU then? |
| 23:13.21 | cw666 | SpeedEvil: it's not clear how much processing power you want |
| 23:13.27 | spikebike | I've got a n770 |
| 23:13.40 | spikebike | n800's supposed to be pretty good |
| 23:14.03 | *** join/#openmoko Zoolooc (n=fredsiba@p54951CB2.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 23:14.07 | SpeedEvil | cw666: no - I mean any 34 bit processor, with similar performance to a 386/20Mhz, with several meg of RAM/ROM in a SOIC8 or so. |
| 23:14.08 | Linux_Galore | spikebike: only 300mhz cpu, I can buy an older generation iPAQ with a 400-520Mhz xscale cpu for next to nothing now |
| 23:14.13 | spikebike | it is after all 180 grams, relatively thin, has an 800x480 lcd, and lasts for hours even while running wifi on a 1000mha battery |
| 23:14.14 | SpeedEvil | s/4/2 |
| 23:14.40 | cw666 | SpeedEvil: 386/20 is slow though, you can get ARMs core that are way faster, with FP even |
| 23:14.44 | spikebike | galore right, with a worse screen, often no wifi, and often bigger battery |
| 23:14.54 | spikebike | 800 does also have a dsp btw |
| 23:14.54 | *** join/#openmoko hp__ (i=hp@ladderzat.student.utwente.nl) |
| 23:15.03 | SpeedEvil | cw666: I know this. I don't want speed, I want low power and small size. |
| 23:15.38 | SpeedEvil | brick: wander around rswww.com, farnell.com - looking round their knobs section |
| 23:15.44 | SpeedEvil | oops |
| 23:15.48 | cw666 | SpeedEvil: so the issue is you want the x86 ISA then? |
| 23:15.51 | Linux_Galore | spikebike: the only thin I like about the N800 is the screen |
| 23:15.53 | spikebike | some enterprising hacker even wrote a module to create /dev/mp3 so you could play mp3's with zero battery load |
| 23:15.55 | Linux_Galore | thing* |
| 23:16.14 | cb22_ | /dev/mp3? |
| 23:16.17 | SpeedEvil | cw666: no - I mean any 34 bit processor, with similar performance to a 386/20Mhz, with several meg of RAM/ROM in a SOIC8 or so. |
| 23:16.19 | cw666 | cesarb: ok, i tried you patch and see no differences, i wonder if things rebuilt when i thought they should have |
| 23:16.22 | cb22_ | do you cat your mp3 into there or something? |
| 23:16.26 | spikebike | yeah |
| 23:16.29 | Linux_Galore | I would love the N800 with the GTA02 hardware specs heh |
| 23:16.33 | spikebike | and use the dsp for decompression |
| 23:16.54 | spikebike | I just want a gsm I can attach via bluetooth (like a gps) that does data AND voice |
| 23:17.02 | cw666 | SpeedEvil: ok, but you can get those already, we have boxes of them at work, though i think those are maybe 6W or so |
| 23:17.02 | spikebike | then the n800 would make a reasonable cellphone |
| 23:17.08 | cw666 | (400MHz 4kc) |
| 23:17.31 | SpeedEvil | cw666: no, you can't, not in a SOIC8 (8 pin small-outline IC) and not for $1 |
| 23:17.33 | cesarb | cw666: sometimes (about 1/3 of the time) my patch also doesn't work for me |
| 23:17.53 | cw666 | oh, no, sorry |
| 23:18.02 | cw666 | cesarb: well, i wonder if it's even there |
| 23:18.16 | cw666 | cesarb: i'm not sure that patching it in place and doing make work ... should it have? |
| 23:18.41 | cesarb | cw666: dunno |
| 23:18.52 | cw666 | cesarb: so how do you rebuild then? |
| 23:18.53 | cesarb | cw666: as I said, I use a overlay for everything |
| 23:19.11 | cw666 | yeah, you told me... but that's not entirely obvious to me what you mean there |
| 23:19.26 | Linux_Galore | the N800 is getting updated next year to include Wimax for the US market I see |
| 23:19.46 | cw666 | SpeedEvil: there are PICs with similar packages that are close to that, but PIC isa is horrible |
| 23:19.47 | cesarb | cw666: I copy the recipe to the overlay, edit it to add the patch and tack a +cesarb1 at the end of the package revision, and run "make build-package-<package> build-package-package-index" |
| 23:19.54 | spikebike | what does wimax mean? |
| 23:19.56 | spikebike | fast wan? |
| 23:20.00 | cw666 | SpeedEvil: if you were more relaxed about the package, AVR32 has a lot of nice options |
| 23:20.02 | SpeedEvil | spikebike sort-of. |
| 23:20.04 | cesarb | cw666: then I go to the phone and do a ipkg update and ipkg upgrade |
| 23:20.06 | spikebike | or access to voice as well? |
| 23:20.14 | cesarb | cw666: since I already pointed the phone to my computer |
| 23:20.22 | Elrond | cw666 - What's the current topic? |
| 23:20.35 | Linux_Galore | spikebike: Wimax is the next step up from WiFi, up to 50km range and high speed data transfer |
| 23:20.37 | cw666 | Elrond: ? |
| 23:20.40 | SpeedEvil | cw666: none with integrated RAM, and all with sucky power. |
| 23:20.45 | SpeedEvil | Linux_Galore: not quite |
| 23:20.46 | Elrond | cw666 - With speedevil. |
| 23:20.49 | spikebike | ah, I'm hoping to be able to use it as a phone as well |
| 23:20.51 | SpeedEvil | wimax is not peer-peer |
| 23:21.09 | SpeedEvil | See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/wimax |
| 23:21.11 | spikebike | so openmoko, or iphone (if apple catches a clue) |
| 23:21.25 | cw666 | SpeedEvil: it has to be SOIC8, or just a 2.54mm spaced DIP so you can use it easily? |
| 23:22.00 | spikebike | frustratingly motorola seems to be adopting linux in a big way and pushing it for developers |
| 23:22.01 | cw666 | cesarb: hmm, i have zero experience with OE & bitbake, ill have to figure out how that works |
| 23:22.10 | SpeedEvil | cw666: I mean any generic small package - QFN32 or something would be fine. I have looked, and I know that it basically isn't available from any vendor at teh moment. |
| 23:22.10 | spikebike | all the while requiring windows for developers... very strange. |
| 23:22.12 | cw666 | cesarb: i was sorta planning on throwing it all away and just doing makefiles at some point |
| 23:22.20 | cesarb | cw666: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/User:CesarB/Using_a_local_overlay |
| 23:22.36 | Linux_Galore | wonder if anyone is looking at putting Linux on the iPhone |
| 23:23.05 | folken | dfu_upload error -84 |
| 23:23.07 | folken | hmm |
| 23:23.25 | SpeedEvil | folken: what are you trying to do? |
| 23:23.29 | cw666 | Linux_Galore: it's been talked about, i wouldn't mind having a go myself |
| 23:23.49 | *** join/#openmoko poffy_ (n=poffy@c-76-30-222-129.hsd1.tx.comcast.net) |
| 23:24.10 | SpeedEvil | folken: you do have the neo plugged directly into a USB port, not through a hub? |
| 23:24.22 | folken | SpeedEvil: I'm trying to upload the http://buildhost.openmoko.org/OM2007.2/tmp/deploy/glibc/images/fic-gta01/OpenMoko-openmoko-devel-image-glibc-ipk-P1-September-Snapshot-20070908-fic-gta01.rootfs.jffs2 rootfs. I do this with -a 5 -R -D <filename> |
| 23:24.44 | Elrond | SpeedEvil - What are you looking for in QFN32? |
| 23:24.46 | Linux_Galore | cw666: It would be easier to get a Meizu M8 (iPhone look alike) and put Linux on it |
| 23:24.49 | folken | SpeedEvil: I'll try a different port on my laptop. |
| 23:24.55 | SpeedEvil | folken: and the neo is on the u-boot screen? - after pressing the aux-button? |
| 23:25.09 | cw666 | Linux_Galore: does it have a capacitive touch sensor? |
| 23:25.20 | SpeedEvil | Elrond: Basically something equivalent to a 386/20, with 4M RAM and ROM. |
| 23:25.23 | spikebike | I thought the m8 had linux |
| 23:25.28 | folken | SpeedEvil: yes it is. It flashed the kernel image fine.. |
| 23:25.33 | SpeedEvil | Elrond: for $1 - which I was saying don't exist, tthen it got involved. |
| 23:25.44 | Linux_Galore | cw666: yes, its also slightly smaller then the iPhone |
| 23:25.57 | spikebike | motorola sells an iphone like widget |
| 23:26.01 | spikebike | e6 maybe? |
| 23:26.15 | cw666 | speaking of widgets, anyone here know x11 overly well? |
| 23:26.17 | Elrond | SpeedEvil - Huh, 4M ram and rom is a lot for something that small. |
| 23:26.28 | SpeedEvil | Elrond: I know - several years time. |
| 23:26.44 | Elrond | SpeedEvil - What do you wanna do with it? |
| 23:26.45 | Linux_Galore | I noticed Sharp have mad a new phone that basically looks like the iPhone with a square dpad down the bottom |
| 23:26.50 | Linux_Galore | made* |
| 23:26.53 | spikebike | http://developer.motorola.com/products/handsets/motorokre6/ |
| 23:27.48 | Elrond | SpeedEvil - Except "rule the world" of course. ;o) |
| 23:27.59 | SpeedEvil | Elrond: stuff - basically. A generic microcontroller replacement, that lets me run already existing linux ppp/bluetooth/usb/... stacks, with minimal coding. |
| 23:28.37 | cw666 | SpeedEvil: except for your *desire* to use USB and BT i can understand that though |
| 23:28.42 | SpeedEvil | Rather than hand-coding or using libraries of dubious quality with missing features. |
| 23:28.46 | folken | SpeedEvil: I start flashing, but i see no progress bar. |
| 23:28.55 | SpeedEvil | Hmm. |
| 23:28.58 | SpeedEvil | ->folken |
| 23:29.01 | Linux_Galore | Meizu M8 -> http://www.engadget.com/2007/02/13/meizu-m8-minione-closer-to-production-litigation/ |
| 23:29.10 | folken | SpeedEvil: its stuck at Transfer Size = 0x1000 |
| 23:29.36 | folken | oh.. and now it just rebooted. |
| 23:29.38 | SpeedEvil | folken: sorry - I'm out, and have no real suggestions - other than to turn it off and turn it on again. |
| 23:30.42 | Elrond | folken - Bv04 from china? |
| 23:31.20 | *** join/#openmoko mzb_d800 (n=mzb@ppp108-88.static.internode.on.net) |
| 23:32.05 | Elrond | SpeedEvil - Ahh. Like a friend and me playing with an 8051 and I always think "oh well, we have to code _everything_". And you want to avoid that. :-) |
| 23:33.53 | SpeedEvil | Elrond: basically. Implementing TCP/IP with a novel set of bugs is not entirely rewarding, forex. |
| 23:34.25 | Elrond | Oh yeah. |
| 23:34.35 | *** join/#openmoko arw_ (i=familia@201.244.107.105) |
| 23:34.39 | Elrond | I _know_ exactly that quite well. (as a user) |
| 23:35.20 | Elrond | compiled some of my networking tools for a new OS. Instead of debugging my tools and making them run better, I neded up debugging the kernels networking stack. ;o) |
| 23:35.39 | *** join/#openmoko hp__ (i=hp@ladderzat.student.utwente.nl) |
| 23:36.06 | *** join/#openmoko switch3r (n=switch3r@c-69-143-234-84.hsd1.md.comcast.net) |
| 23:38.17 | folken | Elrond: yes gta01bv4 made in china. |
| 23:38.59 | folken | what i also don't get is, that the phone turns on as soon as i plug in usb. |
| 23:39.07 | folken | i don't think it did that before. |
| 23:40.32 | cesarb | folken: if I read the datasheet correctly, it turns on if the difference between battery and charger voltage is above a certain threshold |
| 23:41.10 | cesarb | folken: the best thing would be if uboot was able to detect that, stop booting and charge instead... requiring a button press to actually boot (oh, and turn off again when the charging is done) |
| 23:44.34 | folken | cesarb, Elrond, SpeedEvil i uploaded a new uboot version now.. at least i'm seeing a progress bar now when i try to flash the rootfs. |
| 23:48.22 | Linux_Galore | hmm LG KU990U looks interesting (new Prada) |
| 23:48.29 | Linux_Galore | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AAjQUVwdmag |
| 23:48.41 | *** join/#openmoko ufo76 (n=ufo76@host81-132-50-52.range81-132.btcentralplus.com) |
| 23:55.28 | *** part/#openmoko cindy (n=cindy@c-24-218-180-68.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 23:55.42 | spikebike | Linux_Galore what os/platform is it? |
| 23:55.51 | spikebike | i.e. can you write aps for it? |
| 23:57.43 | Linux_Galore | spikebike: dont know to be honest |
| 23:58.01 | Linux_Galore | spikebike: I think its a in house OS |
| 23:59.03 | hypa7ia | so probably montavista :p |