| 00:00.07 | cesarb | Writchie: it seems it locks up every first boot after changing the SIM |
| 00:00.43 | Writchie | cesarb: i guess i'm lucky, my gsmd never starts |
| 00:01.23 | cesarb | Writchie: yup, was locked up, just did the hold-down-until-it-turns-off and hold-down-until-it-turns-on dance |
| 00:01.48 | cesarb | Writchie: I suspect these lockups are the same reported on a bugzilla bug... speaking of which I didn't check the buglog archives yet today |
| 00:02.47 | cesarb | yay, I have GUI |
| 00:03.28 | Writchie | cesarb: poor you |
| 00:03.34 | Writchie | ;) |
| 00:04.36 | cesarb | And, as usual, gsmd was stuck on "ATZ" "AT+CFUN=1" "AT+COPS=0" with no answer from the modem... killing and restarting it on the foreground works (again, as usual) |
| 00:04.55 | cesarb | RSTR=`+CSTA: (129,145)' |
| 00:05.15 | Writchie | that's the same as here. |
| 00:05.54 | Writchie | try dialing first by doing an AT+CSTA=145 and then an ATDT+55xxxxxxxxx; |
| 00:06.18 | cesarb | AT+CSTA? returns +CSTA: 129 |
| 00:06.19 | Writchie | then repeat with an AT+CSTA=129 first |
| 00:07.59 | cesarb | tried dialing first without doing any CSTA manipulations, to see what happens |
| 00:08.19 | cesarb | it got connected, and after a few moments a release, and the landline didn't ring |
| 00:09.28 | Writchie | cesarb: so if you do an AT+CSTA=145 and then check with an AT+CSTA? it still shows 129? |
| 00:09.41 | cesarb | Writchie: no, now it shows 145 |
| 00:10.24 | cesarb | Writchie: dialing has the same effect, connect then after a few moments release |
| 00:10.39 | Writchie | and your dialing +5521xxxxxxxxx where xxxxxxxxxxx is the local number |
| 00:11.03 | cesarb | Writchie: if the headset phone output worked (it never did for me), I could know if it's the recorded message... |
| 00:11.10 | Writchie | ah |
| 00:11.12 | cesarb | Writchie: yeah, +5521 plus 8 local digits |
| 00:11.40 | Writchie | are you getting call progress indications? |
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| 00:12.28 | cesarb | Writchie: yeah, several |
| 00:12.40 | cesarb | managed to hear the voice... very low... saying the number was incomplete... |
| 00:13.40 | cesarb | "the number dialed is incomplete; please, verify the desired number" |
| 00:13.47 | cesarb | that was with 129, let me see with 145... |
| 00:14.03 | Writchie | can you dial a US number using +1xxxyyyzzzz - 11 digits total and see if you get the same thing |
| 00:14.32 | Writchie | forget it that won't work |
| 00:14.42 | Writchie | international is probably barred |
| 00:14.50 | cesarb | Writchie: hm, with 145 it has a _different_ message... the one I got with my razr |
| 00:15.58 | cesarb | with 145: "It wasn't possible to complete your call. Please, check the number and dial again." |
| 00:17.39 | Writchie | cesarb: 129 is the default and is probably equivalent to what the razr is using. |
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| 00:19.28 | cesarb | Writchie: well, then why does the razr give me the error message I get for 145? |
| 00:19.39 | cesarb | Writchie: perhaps it sees the + and know it can switch to 145? |
| 00:19.53 | cesarb | Writchie: (which would make a lot of sense) |
| 00:19.56 | Writchie | yes when you use the + it uses 145 |
| 00:20.00 | Writchie | otherwise 129 |
| 00:20.04 | Writchie | by default |
| 00:20.26 | Writchie | you might try setting it to 145 and then dialing without the + |
| 00:20.43 | Writchie | dialing the full number 5521xxxxxxxx |
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| 00:21.29 | cesarb | the same error message |
| 00:21.50 | cesarb | the modem seems to simply ignore the + |
| 00:21.51 | Writchie | cesarb: there are supplementary service codes that may be used in these networks for carrier selection. |
| 00:22.12 | Writchie | i'll do some research. |
| 00:22.24 | cesarb | which would make sense for the 129 number being "incomplete", since it's lacking the carrier selection code |
| 00:22.41 | cesarb | while the 145 number is complete, but it "cannot complete the call"... |
| 00:22.48 | Writchie | cesarb: except its not complete for an E.164 number in brasil |
| 00:23.25 | cesarb | Writchie: the number I dialed is my E164 number (5521nnnnnnnn), so it's complete... |
| 00:23.45 | Writchie | the ATDT+5521xxxxxxx format gives you can't complete call? |
| 00:23.47 | cesarb | Writchie: it's the "national" number scheme which is not complete, since you have to use the carrier selection code |
| 00:24.07 | cesarb | Writchie: which one I get depends on AT+CSTA, the + doesn't seem to matter |
| 00:24.43 | Writchie | are you internal calls enabled by any chance |
| 00:25.26 | cesarb | Writchie: nope |
| 00:25.48 | cesarb | Writchie: but these aren't international calls, so it shouldn't matter (unless their routing is really funky) |
| 00:26.18 | Writchie | i just wanted to compare what it did for numbers outside of brasil |
| 00:26.41 | cesarb | Writchie: I just tried in the other direction, landline->neo |
| 00:26.47 | Writchie | is the razr a brazilian version |
| 00:26.59 | cesarb | Writchie: yep |
| 00:27.08 | cesarb | Writchie: a "subsidy lock"ed one even |
| 00:27.30 | cesarb | I got a CLIP of 021nnnnnnnn when dialing to the neo |
| 00:27.44 | Writchie | you might try entering a couple of numbers in your sim using the + format and we can later look on the neo to see what it stored. |
| 00:27.57 | Writchie | what was the type of number? |
| 00:28.00 | cesarb | +CLIP: "021nnnnnnnn",161,"",,"Casa",0 |
| 00:28.10 | Writchie | ah, 161 is national number |
| 00:28.24 | cesarb | (it says "Casa" because it's the single number in the SIM's address book) |
| 00:28.35 | Writchie | Casa == home |
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| 00:29.18 | cesarb | Writchie: yeah, creative isn't it? :D |
| 00:29.38 | Writchie | the sim card stores type of number as well as possibly some extra foo for call by call supplementary services |
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| 00:30.43 | cesarb | urgh, libgsmd-tool -m shell's phonebook read SEGVs |
| 00:31.00 | Writchie | cu is your friend |
| 00:31.11 | cesarb | Writchie: or libgsmd-tool -m atcmd ;-) |
| 00:31.23 | cesarb | Writchie: do you know without having to look up what's the phonebook read command? |
| 00:32.37 | Writchie | cesarb: +CPBR=? |
| 00:33.10 | Writchie | then +CPBR=n where n is index |
| 00:33.33 | cesarb | RSTR=`+CPBR: 1,"nnnnnnnn",129,"Casa"' |
| 00:33.45 | cesarb | (the 8 "n" are the number) |
| 00:34.23 | Writchie | if you get a chance later put a number in from the razor using +5521 and see what gets stored. |
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| 00:35.50 | cesarb | Writchie: ok... (I can do it right now if you can stand the slow shutdown-swap-shutdown-swap cycle) |
| 00:36.02 | Writchie | whenever you get the chance. |
| 00:36.18 | Writchie | i think the network is going to turn out to be non-compliant with gsm spec |
| 00:36.26 | Writchie | it can be fixed. |
| 00:36.42 | Writchie | but it needs a hack around the dialing from phone book commands |
| 00:37.33 | Writchie | when a neo user travels to brasil, his +5521 or other numbers can be handled exceptionally |
| 00:37.38 | Writchie | prompt for carrier code |
| 00:37.46 | Writchie | then dial per national plan |
| 00:38.02 | Writchie | this allows only canonical numbers to be stored in phone book. |
| 00:38.13 | Writchie | perhaps roaming customers are treated differently |
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| 00:38.36 | cesarb | oh, cool +CPBR: 1,"190",129,"Policia" (with AT+CPBS="SD") |
| 00:39.02 | cesarb | Writchie: dunno... I can only test with this SIM so far (and Vivo's, but well... Vivo is GSM850) |
| 00:39.06 | Writchie | except when the cell is in a favella |
| 00:39.32 | Writchie | then its replaced by "Nobody" |
| 00:39.45 | cesarb | Writchie: nah, it would be "MilÃcia" |
| 00:40.08 | Writchie | my portuguse sucks |
| 00:40.17 | Writchie | like my spelling |
| 00:40.20 | cesarb | Writchie: (rogue policemen/firemen which go against the traffickers... and then act worse than them) |
| 00:48.54 | cesarb | cool, if I ATDT*544#; I get a +CUSD reply back with the prepaid credits left |
| 00:49.06 | cesarb | however, for some reason AT+CUSD=1,"*544#",15 doesn't |
| 00:51.07 | Writchie | cesarb: what do you get from AT+CUSD=? |
| 00:51.31 | cesarb | Writchie: the expected RSTR=`+CUSD: (0,1,2)' |
| 00:53.52 | cesarb | Writchie: well, what's cool is that I have some way to get the answer to *544#, which is a must have for me (amount of credits left) |
| 00:54.30 | Writchie | cesarb: i'm not sure of the format on the CUSD command being correct - will have to check |
| 00:56.12 | cesarb | wtf the neo rebooted itself! |
| 00:56.49 | Writchie | copied the feature from XP SP2 |
| 00:57.00 | cesarb | Writchie: lol |
| 00:57.49 | Writchie | the other day trying to install windows serial driver to make u-boot work gave me an instant black screen of death on XP |
| 00:58.07 | Writchie | so no more testing with live systems for me |
| 01:00.37 | Writchie | cesarb: you CUSD string looks ok - strange it doesn't work |
| 01:01.29 | Writchie | s/you/your/ |
| 01:03.36 | cesarb | Writchie: it returns +CME ERROR: 100 exactly like the ATDT one, but the ATDT one also returns the unsolicited +CUSD response |
| 01:05.38 | Writchie | cesarb: the AT+CUSD command for me returns OK followed by a +CUSD: 4 response |
| 01:05.52 | Writchie | but that's with cu |
| 01:06.14 | Writchie | as I said before , i don't trust gsmd/libgsm |
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| 01:09.26 | cesarb | Writchie: it can be a SIM or network difference |
| 01:09.40 | Writchie | yes |
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| 01:20.22 | cesarb | Just created on http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/User:CesarB/Requirements a list of what I think must be working before the Neo can actually be used as someone's primary cell phone |
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| 01:29.51 | Writchie | cesarb: are you getting CB down there? |
| 01:31.25 | cesarb | Writchie: only a dumb one on channel 50 saying "Claro RJ 21" |
| 01:31.43 | Writchie | at least that's more than we get ;) |
| 01:31.49 | cesarb | Writchie: (in fact, it shows your current state and area code... kinda useful on 12-hour-long bus trips) |
| 01:32.20 | cesarb | Writchie: on my razr, it turns it off because it's incredibly dumb UI puts the CB on top of the current date |
| 01:32.23 | Writchie | i hope they don't charge you for it |
| 01:32.29 | cesarb | Writchie: s/it turns/I turn it/ |
| 01:33.09 | cesarb | Writchie: why would they charge me for it, if it's enabled on every single phone they sell? (and isn't a broadcast? how can one charge for a broadcast?) |
| 01:33.46 | Writchie | bell shaped head will try to charge you for everything |
| 01:34.30 | Writchie | sms message cost $0.0001 and is priced at $0.25 retail |
| 01:35.29 | Writchie | cesarb: EMS is relatively simple |
| 01:35.57 | Writchie | cesarb: MMS is going to require WAP stack |
| 01:36.20 | Writchie | IMHO this is a must but core developer don't agree at all with that |
| 01:37.24 | Writchie | MMS probably needs to be moved to nice to have along with STK which is another no-no for the core team |
| 01:38.32 | cesarb | Writchie: well, as it's noted on the top, that page is solely my opinion |
| 01:38.32 | Writchie | I would, however, like to at least decode the OTA setup messages from the SMS |
| 01:38.33 | cesarb | Writchie: (in fact, I made it to keep track of where I should focus my hacking) |
| 01:38.48 | cesarb | Writchie: if you want a carrier to accept the phone, it probably will need WAP, MMS and STK... |
| 01:39.09 | Writchie | well first it has to even comply with basic MMI requirements for GSM |
| 01:39.11 | cesarb | Writchie: for instance, some banking stuff might be acessible only via WAP |
| 01:39.15 | Writchie | which it does not. |
| 01:39.37 | Writchie | no carrier would want a phone without MMS |
| 01:39.39 | Writchie | or WAP |
| 01:40.20 | cesarb | Writchie: what is the requirements spec number? I had it somewhere, but don't recall the number, and the filenames only have numbers in them... |
| 01:40.23 | Writchie | nor would most ordinary users consider MMS prevention to be a feature ;) |
| 01:41.00 | cesarb | Writchie: why? MMS is mostly a NOP, I never saw it actually being used |
| 01:41.04 | SpeedEvil | Carriers accepting the neo - I'd be astonished if it's an issue this year. |
| 01:41.18 | cesarb | Writchie: other than a friend trying (and failing) to send me two photos of a buswreck |
| 01:41.30 | cesarb | SpeedEvil: heh, we can dream ;-) |
| 01:41.56 | cesarb | Writchie: the most important part of that page is the "must have", which is what I need to actually be able to USE the phone |
| 01:41.58 | Writchie | cesarb: TS 122 030 |
| 01:42.07 | cesarb | Writchie: the rest is just trying to sort the extra |
| 01:42.25 | cesarb | Writchie: urgh, the numbers I use are the 3GPP ones :P (like 07.07...) |
| 01:42.43 | cesarb | Writchie: I think there's a page somewhere where I can convert the spec number |
| 01:43.02 | Writchie | http://webapp.etsi.org/key/queryform.asp |
| 01:43.11 | Writchie | this will pull them all up |
| 01:43.30 | Writchie | with either number |
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| 01:47.28 | cesarb | Writchie: found it, thanks |
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| 01:52.11 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[User:CesarB/Requirements]] |
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| 01:56.03 | Writchie | cesarb: in US MMS revenue is about $700 million per quarter |
| 01:56.17 | Writchie | WAP is about $1 billion per quarter |
| 01:56.47 | Writchie | MMS + WAP + Downloads are greater than SMS |
| 01:57.27 | daMaestro | still it's just like "WTF" |
| 01:57.46 | daMaestro | and i'm sitting here with ~300kbps! lame. |
| 01:58.01 | Writchie | cesarb: 77 million MMS users, 74 million WAP users and 148 Million SMS users in US |
| 01:59.38 | bmidgley | ipkg repositories changed? |
| 02:00.14 | bmidgley | can't get buildhost.openmoko.org/OM2007.2/tmp/deploy/glibc/ipk/{all,armv4t,fic-gta01}/Packages.gz |
| 02:01.17 | Writchie | bmidgley: much seems to be changing at the moment |
| 02:02.35 | bmidgley | i was really hoping I wouldn't have to keep flashing the rootfs |
| 02:02.45 | bmidgley | just do ipkg upgrades and the occasional kernel reflash |
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| 02:16.08 | sagacis | morning, all |
| 02:16.22 | sagacis | any recommendations on which kernel I should be using? |
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| 02:33.30 | calamous | Anyone know when the neo will be ready to use GSM850? |
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| 03:06.15 | technil | Has anyone mentioned a libelf_0.8.6.bb error in a snapshot openmoko-devel-image build for today? |
| 03:07.45 | cesarb | technil: I'm failing on binutils-cross-2.18-r0, do not know if it's related |
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| 03:13.30 | mentax | hi all |
| 03:14.38 | mentax | where i may get last image? I not may find it |
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| 03:31.22 | abraxa_ | * LaF0rge has quit ("today is a black day in the project") <~ I wonder if that means anything |
| 03:33.34 | mentax | where i may get last image? I not may find it |
| 03:36.37 | *** join/#openmoko skyfaller (n=nelson@wikipedia/Skyfaller) |
| 03:36.49 | technil | mentax: try http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Repositories |
| 03:37.00 | cesarb | http://www.vanille-media.de/images/psplash-on-gta02v1.jpg <- photo of a real GTA02? |
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| 03:37.21 | cesarb | It looks... |
| 03:37.25 | cesarb | The same as a GTA01 :P |
| 03:37.47 | skyfaller | hey folks... I'm considering getting a Neo 1973 consumer model when it comes out, but my friends are telling me that it will only do GPRS, and that that's even slower than the iPhone's EDGE... |
| 03:37.48 | technil | mentax: also this may help http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Phase_1_Software_Testing |
| 03:38.27 | skyfaller | will there be any way to upgrade the phone to a faster network later? |
| 03:38.27 | aloril | skyfaller: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1, SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) (Hopefully these links answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) |
| 03:38.52 | abraxa_ | skyfaller: Yes, it'll only do GPRS for now - phones with faster network tech will come out in '08 |
| 03:38.59 | abraxa_ | And no, you can't upgrade it |
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| 03:39.53 | skyfaller | abraxa_: ah, thank you... that's kind of sad |
| 03:40.10 | abraxa_ | skyfaller: Not really, I think people just expect too much at this point in time |
| 03:40.50 | abraxa_ | This is a product driven by ideology, not consumer demands |
| 03:41.03 | abraxa_ | For now, that is |
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| 03:41.44 | skyfaller | makes sense... is the 3G delay b/c there isn't good... open hardware for it right now? |
| 03:42.09 | abraxa_ | I would suppose so |
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| 03:52.11 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[OpenMoko:Community_Portal]] |
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| 04:13.11 | *** join/#openmoko disguy__22 (i=disguy__@gateway/tor/x-7931a6525581f7c7) |
| 04:16.07 | CM | *sigh* Why is this uic3 thing not fixed yet? |
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| 04:22.49 | abraxa_ | CM: uic3? |
| 04:24.00 | technil | CM: do you mean uicmoc4-native_4.3.1.bb Bug #747 http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=747 |
| 04:25.52 | technil | CM: I'm pretty sure there are solutions on that bugzilla page |
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| 04:28.59 | CM | technil: Yes, I mean it, and I know how to get around it |
| 04:29.34 | CM | But I have no clue why adding QT += network to that tools uic3.pro works |
| 04:29.43 | CM | And it's been broken for quite a while |
| 04:29.59 | CM | technil: thanks anyway |
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| 04:33.18 | bedboi | ahaahah |
| 04:33.33 | bedboi | i guess LaF0rge is quite pessimistic |
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| 04:53.55 | CM | aloril: Hmm.. Maybe GTA02 is delayed further? |
| 04:54.30 | aloril | CM: yeah, hopefully nothing more 'serious' |
| 04:54.58 | CM | *nod* |
| 04:55.18 | ckuethe | "duh" |
| 04:56.37 | mkrufky | is there any openmoko phone that verizon wireless carries? |
| 04:56.37 | aloril | Currently sold Neo1973 GTA01B_v04 (P1) doesn't have WiFi, GTA02 (P2) which is scheduled for October will have WiFi with free (libre) drivers (Atheros AR6K): http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ#Q:_What_is_the_rationale_behind_the_exclusion_of_WiFi.3F |
| 04:56.58 | blindcoder | moin |
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| 05:10.50 | don-o | i think i can get my hands on a P0 |
| 05:11.06 | don-o | whee. |
| 05:11.21 | *** part/#openmoko mkrufky (n=mk@unaffiliated/mkrufky) |
| 05:11.44 | don-o | CM: what laf0rge news are you referring to? |
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| 05:20.21 | *** join/#openmoko hifolk (n=hifolk@59.92.196.123) |
| 05:20.30 | hifolk | Hi all, |
| 05:20.53 | hifolk | When is the Neo 1973 Pahse 2 releasing?? |
| 05:20.53 | aloril | hifolk: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1, SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) (Hopefully these links answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) |
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| 05:27.20 | doc|home | "There will also be 5 more OpenMoko devices - some not phones in the traditional sense - announced by FIC in September" that's news to me |
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| 05:32.02 | CM | don-o: aloril and me were referring to: 04:35 -!- LaF0rge [n=laforge@rd.tw.openmoko.org] has quit ["today is a black day in the project"] |
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| 06:06.08 | aloril | doc|home: where did you read that? (I remember seeing only 3 and no announcement in September) |
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| 06:08.14 | doc|home | aloril: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ#Q:_What_can_we_expect_in_future_versions.3F |
| 06:08.31 | doc|home | of course it's a wiki, so may be inaccurate |
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| 06:10.49 | CM | doc|home: I remember that rumour too |
| 06:11.09 | doc|home | CM: looks like these might be interesting times :) |
| 06:11.17 | doc|home | I hope they come sooner rather than later, whatever they are |
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| 06:11.39 | CM | Heh, well, so far everything is later than late. ;) |
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| 06:13.49 | notserpe | man there is a serious air of negativity lately. |
| 06:16.37 | CM | notserpe: Some positive too I think. Finally calling is starting to work :D |
| 06:18.07 | notserpe | I'm just glad that qt/opia thread died on the list. |
| 06:19.42 | doc|home | that calling is starting to work and sale of GTA02 devices was supposed (although probably not going) to happen next month is a bit disconcerting :/ |
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| 06:22.56 | folken | openmoko-mediaplayer2 almost works. :) |
| 06:23.05 | folken | but you'll have to write your own playlist in xml. |
| 06:23.33 | zash_se | xml? for a playlist? |
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| 06:24.25 | folken | zash_se: yes: http://www.xspf.org/quickstart/ |
| 06:24.53 | folken | zash_se: its easy to read and easy to write. |
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| 06:29.32 | ScaredyCat | meep |
| 06:32.16 | MMN-o | What's the point with a giant XML overhead for something as simple as a playlist? |
| 06:32.27 | cw666 | when gsm is powered down (sorta) serial console is enabled which doesn't actually work |
| 06:32.30 | cw666 | is anyone else seeing this? |
| 06:32.52 | *** part/#openmoko Risto (n=christop@p508CFA7B.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 06:32.53 | cw666 | i use echo 0 > /sys/bus/platform/devices/gta01-pm-gsm.0/power_on, etc. to reset the AT command intepreter when gsm hangs |
| 06:33.38 | cw666 | but doing do breaks networking and changing it back doesnt seem to help |
| 06:34.00 | abraxa_ | MMN-o: http://xspf.org/xspf-v1.html#rfc.section.3.3 is one of the main reasons |
| 06:34.11 | folken | MMN-o: because people want to include meta data, playlists that aren't local... |
| 06:35.04 | ScaredyCat | that's a lame excuse abraxa_ |
| 06:35.40 | zash_se | folken: metadata, thats what id3-tags ar for |
| 06:35.41 | ScaredyCat | folken's is better, but it's still pointless on an embedded device. |
| 06:36.07 | MMN-o | folken: metadata should be in the files themselves |
| 06:36.07 | ScaredyCat | zash_se: that only works with mp3's |
| 06:36.16 | MMN-o | Like ID3 tags for MP3 or similar for other files |
| 06:36.24 | ScaredyCat | if the filetype doesn't support it... |
| 06:36.30 | folken | MMN-o: metadata such as author of the playlist. |
| 06:36.40 | zash_se | what mediafile dosent support metadata? |
| 06:36.41 | MMN-o | Then you'd only get the metadata with the playlist anyway, ScaredyCat |
| 06:36.48 | MMN-o | zash_se: wav? :) |
| 06:37.14 | MMN-o | folken: Touché. |
| 06:37.19 | ScaredyCat | .au, .raw, .gsm.... |
| 06:37.37 | folken | plus.. when i load an aribtuary mp3 collection in some media player.. 10-15% of the meta data is broken. |
| 06:37.45 | zash_se | container-formats ala .avi/.ogg etc? |
| 06:37.56 | folken | especially encodings. ID3 tags that are actually ID2 and vice a versa. |
| 06:37.57 | MMN-o | I wouldn't say that arbitrary playlist files would be any better. |
| 06:38.07 | ScaredyCat | most players understand the m3u formats... |
| 06:38.22 | abraxa_ | ScaredyCat, zash: The main point for me to use XSPF was shareability/the content resolver indeed. Imagine you have a media server at home whose files are mounted at different points in the file system on the PC and the Neo - both can still find and play the data from the meta data XSPF stores |
| 06:39.02 | ScaredyCat | use upnp ... |
| 06:39.04 | folken | ScaredyCat: XMMS doesn't understand pls for example. |
| 06:39.13 | MMN-o | abraxa_: Ok, I'm gonna start reading about XSPF, but does it actually have any other way to store that than ordinary relative paths? |
| 06:39.43 | abraxa_ | ScaredyCat: UPnP doesn't help you if the file names differ from what I know |
| 06:39.59 | ScaredyCat | it presents the data to the client.. |
| 06:40.10 | ScaredyCat | (admititly it uses xml too) |
| 06:40.13 | abraxa_ | MMN-o: What do you mean by "store that"? |
| 06:40.17 | MMN-o | The only benefit I see from using an XML playlist is that you can specify character encoding. |
| 06:40.24 | ScaredyCat | ~spell admitidly |
| 06:40.52 | MMN-o | abraxa_: As in, how does it save the paths in a better format than m3u? For transferability? |
| 06:41.10 | MMN-o | Remembering that only insane people, or crap software, store absolute paths. |
| 06:41.37 | ScaredyCat | /sbin/ifconfig |
| 06:41.37 | abraxa_ | MMN-o: Every track in the list can have one or more URLs (file://, http:// etc.) associated with it, along with meta data |
| 06:42.03 | ScaredyCat | the thing is, how relavant is that on the neo... |
| 06:42.26 | ScaredyCat | it's a low powered device.. |
| 06:42.28 | MMN-o | Exactly, ScaredyCat |
| 06:42.35 | abraxa_ | To you. |
| 06:42.51 | MMN-o | Is it necessary to use the XML overhead? |
| 06:43.16 | ScaredyCat | what you're also asking people to do is change all their playlists to another format.. |
| 06:43.34 | ScaredyCat | or at least have them in both |
| 06:43.35 | abraxa_ | No but the overhead is so small that I don't see how it would be a problem - it only has an effect when loading or saving a playlist |
| 06:43.41 | MMN-o | That wouldn't be a bad idea, since M3U in general sucks. |
| 06:44.03 | ScaredyCat | it might suck, but it's the standard |
| 06:44.09 | abraxa_ | ScaredyCat: The player will be able to import M3U, too, of course |
| 06:44.14 | MMN-o | It's the varying standard. :) |
| 06:44.27 | ScaredyCat | that's not so bad abraxa_... |
| 06:44.41 | ScaredyCat | now make it scan the entire path and generate the xml too :P |
| 06:45.02 | abraxa_ | Matter of fact that's what I'm working on right now ;) |
| 06:45.07 | ScaredyCat | actually, a helper app would help |
| 06:45.11 | ScaredyCat | hehe |
| 06:45.32 | abraxa_ | Well the player will allow you to edit the playlists so the format will be transparent anyway |
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| 06:45.49 | ScaredyCat | but i still thein there's more of an overhead parsing an xml file than just reading a line for a file |
| 06:45.54 | ScaredyCat | think |
| 06:46.07 | ScaredyCat | and on a low powered device it matters |
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| 06:46.38 | MMN-o | Well, support for more formats is always beneficial. I'll just keep storing relative paths in a text file. |
| 06:47.11 | MMN-o | However, I wonder if it's such a good idea to use xspf as a default format. |
| 06:47.12 | notserpe | any guesses about "the black day" |
| 06:47.45 | ScaredyCat | it's cloudy? |
| 06:48.23 | abraxa_ | ScaredyCat: I see what you mean - if performance becomes an issue I can still switch but unless this becomes a serious issue I probably won't |
| 06:48.24 | spamhead | Well put Scaredycat :D |
| 06:51.51 | *** join/#openmoko yacc (n=andreas@62-2-90-134.static.cablecom.ch) |
| 06:52.00 | CM | Heh, song length, in milliseconds |
| 06:52.13 | MMN-o | Only a hint apparently. :) |
| 06:52.17 | CM | I can't say I know the length of my songs in milliseconds |
| 06:52.34 | ScaredyCat | you will soon :P |
| 06:52.45 | CM | ScaredyCat: Hehe :P |
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| 06:53.44 | CM | Well, I guess the playlist will be just a list of tracks anyway, and the info from the id3-tags |
| 06:54.08 | spamhead | ohh crap I thought this room was an open source OS for motorola, I read OpenMOTO my bad |
| 06:54.23 | ScaredyCat | heheheh |
| 06:54.53 | Psi_ | heh |
| 06:54.58 | CM | spamhead: Well, they have gotten OpenMoko to run on some motorola phones |
| 06:54.59 | zash_se | didnt someone get openmoko to run on some motorola? |
| 06:55.06 | zash_se | :D |
| 06:55.14 | ScaredyCat | what they said ^^ |
| 06:55.47 | ScaredyCat | although, why they did it is a bigger question :) |
| 06:55.47 | Hopscotch | good morning |
| 06:55.59 | CM | spamhead: Look at the second pic: http://www.vanille-media.de/site/index.php/2007/09/04/openmoko-and-openezx-at-mobile-developer-days-2007/ |
| 06:56.57 | spamhead | WTH!!! Openmoko is a open source phone?!?!? That's incredible! |
| 06:56.57 | aloril | spamhead: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1, SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) (Hopefully these links answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) |
| 06:57.35 | ScaredyCat | "It is our goal to release an OpenEZX preview image before the end of September" .... i wish they'd get their priorities right |
| 06:57.49 | spamhead | Thanks CM, I don't know everything, but I do know a lot about what I know |
| 06:58.17 | CM | spamhead: I know barely anything about mostly everything, so I guess we're a good match. ;) |
| 06:58.59 | ScaredyCat | get a room you two |
| 06:59.02 | spamhead | *LOL* |
| 07:00.20 | spamhead | So lets move to San Francisco and raise Orchids ;) |
| 07:01.14 | *** join/#openmoko ecraven (i=nex@eutyche.swe.uni-linz.ac.at) |
| 07:02.13 | spamhead | I guess openmoko doesn't have much need for a C# developer then |
| 07:08.03 | spamhead | Okay all it's 2AM here I need to pretend to care about my job so I'm going to sleep |
| 07:08.06 | spamhead | later haters! |
| 07:08.29 | *** part/#openmoko notserpe (n=eric@67.55.26.38) |
| 07:08.57 | *** part/#openmoko spamhead (n=matthew@cpe-70-122-55-218.austin.res.rr.com) |
| 07:10.36 | ScaredyCat | ppffff.... |
| 07:10.45 | ScaredyCat | it needs all the developers it can get |
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| 07:34.51 | ScaredyCat | CM : did you build get past that again ? |
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| 08:14.23 | ScaredyCat | errm |
| 08:16.28 | Richard | hi |
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| 08:23.03 | CM | ScaredyCat: Yes, worked fine once I got past that uic3 thing |
| 08:23.19 | CM | NOTE: build 200709050615: completed |
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| 08:41.48 | CIA-23 | openmoko: 03laforge * r2912 10/trunk/src/target/kernel/patches/ (series yaffs2-20070304.patch yaffs2-20070905.patch): update to more recent yaffs2 snapshot |
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| 09:04.29 | ScaredyCat | "Recipe format - Read about the .bb file format and variables used by OpenEmbedded." |
| 09:04.43 | ScaredyCat | http://www.openembedded.org/wiki/Bbfile |
| 09:04.48 | *** join/#openmoko blogic (n=john@acme.areaserver.it) |
| 09:04.56 | ScaredyCat | and they wonder why we get it 'all wrong' |
| 09:05.37 | Stephmw | haha |
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| 09:06.40 | XorA | ScaredyCat: sounds like http://www.openembedded.org/wiki/StyleGuide needs adapted for non devs |
| 09:08.13 | ScaredyCat | that sould be copied to the bb file one |
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| 09:09.15 | ScaredyCat | doing the simplest thing like adding a single file to the image seems like a hellish process |
| 09:15.38 | *** join/#openmoko wansti (n=wansti@a064.apm.etc.tu-bs.de) |
| 09:16.38 | CM | me right now: http://www.explosm.net/db/files/Comics/Rob/caffeine.png |
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| 09:16.55 | zedstar | for testing stuff i just copy the file/ipk to the neo rather than mess about with new images... i have not tried to get networking working on QEMU though |
| 09:17.10 | zedstar | anyone get networking with QEMU running? |
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| 09:35.46 | *** join/#openmoko lick_me_f (i=Whore_19@78.128.37.98) |
| 09:37.41 | mdt_ | qemu does not compile (http://nopaste.com/p/al7g02rXv) someone a idea what's wrong? |
| 09:39.13 | *** join/#openmoko florian (n=fuchs@217.146.132.69) |
| 09:39.55 | *** join/#openmoko alex-weej (n=alex@cpc2-darl3-0-0-cust237.midd.cable.ntl.com) |
| 09:42.26 | *** join/#openmoko lalo (n=lalo@sourcemage/mage/lalo) |
| 09:43.02 | lick_me_f | http://vans.tbc.bg/uploaded |
| 09:52.36 | *** join/#openmoko rwhitby (n=nnnnnnnr@nslu2-linux/rwhitby) |
| 09:53.14 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[User:ChrisLord]] |
| 09:53.19 | emdete | qemu does not compile (http://nopaste.com/p/al7g02rXv) - someone an idea what's wrong? |
| 09:59.41 | *** join/#openmoko kayon (n=kayon@124-168-193-160.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 09:59.41 | *** join/#openmoko gyaresu (n=gyaresu@ppp121-44-223-200.lns1.hba1.internode.on.net) |
| 10:03.06 | Stephmw | rwhitby: we need to start logging build times across different machines/distros :) |
| 10:06.22 | *** join/#openmoko SP8472 (i=8472@dslb-084-056-219-198.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 10:08.03 | *** join/#openmoko MrWGW (n=opera@cpe-76-173-142-140.socal.res.rr.com) |
| 10:08.37 | MrWGW | I'm really tempted to get the full development kit version of the phone...that looks like it would be a lot of fun |
| 10:08.48 | MrWGW | has anyone, at this early stage, had any success getting the phone to run on AT&T? |
| 10:08.53 | MrWGW | which is the network I'm contractually bound to :( |
| 10:09.04 | MrWGW | (GSM, at the very least) |
| 10:09.46 | XorA | MrWGW: AT&T 3g sims are currently causing problems, see bug #666 |
| 10:10.17 | tuukkah | i also heard something about 850MHz not working in the neo, is that true? |
| 10:10.37 | XorA | I think no-one has tried due to above problem |
| 10:10.46 | XorA | cant get onto the network unless the SIM works |
| 10:10.55 | ynezz | !ombug 666 |
| 10:10.56 | cdbot2 | * * Bug 666, Status: NEW, Created: Unknown |
| 10:10.56 | cdbot2 | * * steven.demetrius(AT)fiwwi.com: 3G SIM capability |
| 10:10.56 | tuukkah | no-one has 2g sim? |
| 10:10.56 | rwhitby | there have been no reports of it working, and multiple reports of it not working, and no official word from FIC/OpenMoko Inc. |
| 10:10.56 | cdbot2 | * * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=666 |
| 10:10.58 | *** join/#openmoko DeeDeND (n=daniele@host30-108-dynamic.8-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 10:11.00 | MrWGW | hmm yeah |
| 10:11.03 | MrWGW | that figures |
| 10:11.04 | MrWGW | :-P |
| 10:11.20 | MrWGW | but it does run on T Mobile? |
| 10:11.28 | XorA | runs on t-mobile UK |
| 10:11.36 | rwhitby | (my response was to 850MHz, not to AT&T question) |
| 10:11.37 | MrWGW | T Mobile UK is a tad different from the US one |
| 10:11.47 | MrWGW | I used to use T Mobile in the US and was unable to get my phone to run at all on the UK network |
| 10:12.00 | MrWGW | I hate T Mobile anyway...well actually, I really hate all the cellphone providers |
| 10:12.05 | MrWGW | they all suck, completely and in every way |
| 10:12.43 | *** join/#openmoko some1_ (n=some1@p54A0D295.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 10:13.05 | grasu | I also tought my sim was not working ... I had to but some paper between it and the battery |
| 10:13.20 | rwhitby | I've been happy with all three providers that I've used in Australia. They were all pretty much equally expensive, but the always provided the functionality they advertised, and I've had no problems in US, UK, Asia with any of the three. |
| 10:13.28 | grasu | otherwise it had no contact |
| 10:13.56 | MrWGW | I think the problem is probably more with US providers than anything else |
| 10:14.02 | MrWGW | the mergers that occured in 2005 made a bad situation worse |
| 10:14.07 | MrWGW | in 2004-2005 |
| 10:14.30 | MrWGW | is there still going to be a "second stage" release in October? |
| 10:14.31 | *** join/#openmoko amarsh04 (n=amarsh04@CPE-124-182-113-157.sa.bigpond.net.au) |
| 10:14.35 | rwhitby | That, and the US not really understanding the "global" part of GSM. |
| 10:14.49 | MrWGW | what I'm really most interested in getting is that cool hardcase with all the hacking tools etc |
| 10:15.04 | *** join/#openmoko emdete (n=mdt@total-communication.vfnet.de) |
| 10:15.13 | MrWGW | well Verizon and Sprint invested so much in CDMA that the decision to stick with it is understandable, if somewhat annoying |
| 10:15.58 | *** part/#openmoko DeeDeND (n=daniele@host30-108-dynamic.8-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 10:16.20 | tuukkah | MrWGW, don't care about your contract, get a new one for another operator if that's what it takes for you to use the neo :-) |
| 10:17.01 | MrWGW | I probably will, but T Mobile is seriously pathetic in the US |
| 10:17.20 | MrWGW | the big question is whether or not that SIM card bug is fixable |
| 10:17.36 | *** join/#openmoko thomasg__ (n=thomasg@p57AFCF48.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 10:17.54 | MrWGW | the other big reason why I'm interested in this phone is that my Motorola RAZR likes to fail (requiring a warranty replacement) every three weeks...I'm on my fourth one now...it would be nice to have a backup :-P |
| 10:17.59 | tuukkah | there's a comment at #666 that it's something for the gsm chip manufacturer to report back on |
| 10:18.13 | MrWGW | ominous bug number at any rate |
| 10:19.19 | ScaredyCat | rwhitby: ... I meant to ask |
| 10:19.36 | MrWGW | hmm looks some ATT sim cards work |
| 10:19.39 | MrWGW | just probably not the one in my phone :-P |
| 10:19.50 | ScaredyCat | if you're installing openssh ... wtf are you keeping dropbear for ? |
| 10:20.03 | MrWGW | that said, I suppose I could get a prepaid sim card for running the OpenMoko on until the compatibility problem is fixed |
| 10:20.28 | tuukkah | there are some positive reports too here: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Carriers/ATT |
| 10:21.03 | MrWGW | heck, I could get a prepaid T Mobile SIM card for running the unit on until the AT&T problem is fixed |
| 10:21.30 | XorA | MrWGW: see if there is a Neo user near you |
| 10:22.20 | MrWGW | weird...my card isn't on the list |
| 10:22.25 | MrWGW | its a 64295G |
| 10:22.55 | MrWGW | how would I do that XorA? |
| 10:24.49 | Stephmw | wear an OpenMoko tshirt and parade around your neighbourhood for a few weeks |
| 10:24.55 | MrWGW | hahaha |
| 10:25.11 | ScaredyCat | hehe |
| 10:25.16 | MrWGW | I'm a member of the local LUG but I know for a fact no one's using the OpenMoko |
| 10:25.21 | MrWGW | people are a tad afraid of it not working |
| 10:25.27 | *** join/#openmoko felipe (n=felipe@my.nada.kth.se) |
| 10:26.28 | MrWGW | anyway, thanks for your help...I'm definitely going to order one, probably in a month or two |
| 10:26.32 | MrWGW | bye |
| 10:26.35 | XorA | MrWGW: there is a wiki page with people listed |
| 10:26.36 | *** part/#openmoko MrWGW (n=opera@cpe-76-173-142-140.socal.res.rr.com) |
| 10:28.07 | ScaredyCat | they shouldn't be afraid of it not working, it doesn't, well not as a proper phone ;) |
| 10:34.17 | tuukkah | can i get a serial console login via usb somehow? |
| 10:34.45 | ScaredyCat | tuukkah: ssh to the phone |
| 10:34.58 | ScaredyCat | do you have usb networking setup ? |
| 10:35.12 | tuukkah | ScaredyCat, the boot hangs before the network interface is brought up :-( |
| 10:37.05 | *** join/#openmoko xkill (n=wntrmut@krombacher-pils.oph.RWTH-Aachen.DE) |
| 10:40.42 | tuukkah | i was thinking if there was a way to not change from ACM to CDC |
| 10:45.51 | tuukkah | what about instructions on what to put on the sd card to be able to boot from that? |
| 10:48.30 | tuukkah | found them: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Booting_from_SD |
| 11:01.11 | *** join/#openmoko denis_da (n=anno@p5B07D1FB.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 11:04.29 | *** join/#openmoko Danker (n=tadas@65.203.46.84.ip.erdves.lt) |
| 11:06.14 | *** join/#openmoko baird (n=cbaird@brushtail.apana.org.au) |
| 11:19.46 | *** join/#openmoko agui (n=GuiyongZ@222.190.111.98) |
| 11:23.57 | *** join/#openmoko white_gecko (n=natanael@1Cust5.tnt2.ber2.deu.da.uu.net) |
| 11:25.50 | white_gecko | hello |
| 11:26.00 | white_gecko | now i have openmoko in qemu running |
| 11:26.06 | CM | :) |
| 11:26.15 | white_gecko | an realy I god it to open a terminal emulation |
| 11:26.36 | white_gecko | and i know the command xtscal |
| 11:27.06 | white_gecko | i have to use it to get the poiterreaction in the right way |
| 11:27.18 | white_gecko | but how can i get a keyboard? |
| 11:27.34 | CM | white_gecko: Is it in 2007.2? |
| 11:27.43 | white_gecko | and how to use it in 90° rotation of the pointerinput to the screen |
| 11:27.51 | white_gecko | yes 2007.2 |
| 11:27.52 | CM | Start the Input Manager in the "All list" |
| 11:28.01 | white_gecko | aha |
| 11:28.08 | white_gecko | and how to get there? |
| 11:28.23 | CM | It's the middle tab, where all programs are |
| 11:29.30 | *** part/#openmoko wotcha (n=jim@cust4716.qld01.aanet.com.au) |
| 11:30.45 | white_gecko | no |
| 11:30.45 | CM | ~seen cb22 |
| 11:30.48 | apt | cb22 <n=cb22@dsl-245-145-221.telkomadsl.co.za> was last seen on IRC in channel #openmoko, 18h 33m 40s ago, saying: 'do you think abiword would run ok on the neo?'. |
| 11:31.07 | CM | white_gecko: no? |
| 11:31.21 | *** join/#openmoko alex-weej (n=alex@cpc2-darl3-0-0-cust237.midd.cable.ntl.com) |
| 11:31.58 | rwhitby | white_gecko: change "Applications" to "All" |
| 11:32.17 | *** join/#openmoko pavelm (i=machek@atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz) |
| 11:32.24 | pavelm | Hello, everyone! |
| 11:32.45 | pavelm | I should do talk on openmoko, next week... |
| 11:33.04 | pavelm | ...and I guess I should install some reasonable/latest version. |
| 11:33.20 | pavelm | Is there something newer than http://buildhost.openmoko.org/snapshots/2007.08/images/ ? |
| 11:33.28 | white_gecko | CM: this is, what i see: http://comiles.eu/~natanael/omoko/omoko13.png |
| 11:35.39 | kayon | On a ipkg update on the Neo I'm starting to see http 404's ( Not Found) |
| 11:35.44 | kayon | on http://buildhost.openmoko.org/OM2007.2/tmp/deploy/glibc/ipk/armv4t/Packages.gz. |
| 11:35.55 | kayon | Have I missed some change info somewhere? |
| 11:36.10 | rwhitby | pavelm: I start from 2007.08, and the ipkg upgrade |
| 11:36.18 | rwhitby | s/the/then/ |
| 11:37.13 | pavelm | rwhitby: I'm not sure I have networking in usable-enough state, but I guess I should try that. |
| 11:37.52 | *** join/#openmoko yoyo (n=yoyo@nat.zegrze.maverick.com.pl) |
| 11:37.55 | yoyo | hi all |
| 11:38.32 | pavelm | I got pygps to work, lately, and now I'm actually using openmoko as a GPS... with build-in maps, too. |
| 11:38.37 | rwhitby | pavelm: although I haven't tried ipkg upgrade since all the srcrev changes of the last few days |
| 11:39.13 | pavelm | rwitby: There used to be half-weekly snapshots on buildhost, but that directory is now gone :-( |
| 11:39.15 | CIA-23 | openmoko: 03thomas * r2913 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/applications/openmoko-today2/ (ChangeLog libtaku/taku-launcher-tile.c src/today-launcher.c): |
| 11:39.15 | CIA-23 | openmoko: * libtaku/taku-launcher-tile.c: (taku_launcher_tile_class_init): Update with |
| 11:39.15 | CIA-23 | openmoko: changes in r1644 of upstream (matchbox-desktop-2: Rename TakuIcon icon size to |
| 11:39.15 | CIA-23 | openmoko: taku-icon, to match GTK+.) |
| 11:39.15 | CIA-23 | openmoko: * src/today-launcher.c: (today_launcher_page_create): Update for above changes |
| 11:39.31 | *** join/#openmoko switch3r (n=switch3r@c-69-143-234-84.hsd1.md.comcast.net) |
| 11:43.23 | *** join/#openmoko Skyline_Nismo (i=Whore@85.187.187.84) |
| 11:43.28 | CM | white_gecko: Ah, change to "Today" by pressing the upper left corner (menubar) |
| 11:43.41 | *** join/#openmoko ecraven (i=nex@eutyche.swe.uni-linz.ac.at) |
| 11:44.14 | *** join/#openmoko aloril_ (n=aloril@kaar72.airix.fi) |
| 11:44.22 | CM | white_gecko: You should be able to get something like this: http://scap.linuxtogo.org/files/03ab1f5b4f7aa041d1d7791943eeb2ec.png |
| 11:44.55 | CM | white_gecko: But set it to "all", or you'll get the calculator instead of the input manager |
| 11:45.49 | rwhitby | kayon: looks like the OM autobuilder is broken |
| 11:45.53 | SpeedEvil | Ok - we have A, S, what about L? |
| 11:46.25 | white_gecko | CM: ok |
| 11:50.05 | *** join/#openmoko cb22 (n=cb22@dsl-245-145-221.telkomadsl.co.za) |
| 11:51.20 | CM | cb22: About Abiword, just noticed this one week old screenshot: http://scap.linuxtogo.org/files/34dadfa8a954df30e243bb1862f3a856.png |
| 11:51.32 | white_gecko | CM: now i have this http://comiles.eu/~natanael/omoko/omoko14.png |
| 11:51.39 | cb22 | ooh, nice CM |
| 11:51.55 | CM | white_gecko: No png there yet |
| 11:51.57 | white_gecko | it is very difficult to press the right area |
| 11:52.13 | white_gecko | now |
| 11:52.25 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[User:ChrisLord]] [[Providers]] [[Provider]] [[GSM]] [[Operators]] [[Operator]] [[Carrier]] |
| 11:52.40 | CM | white_gecko: Good. Just start it, but be careful to only start one |
| 11:53.04 | CM | You'll get the standard white box up in the middle |
| 11:53.06 | white_gecko | ok do i have to start it with a single click or with a double click? |
| 11:53.27 | CM | white_gecko: I've only tried on the real neo, and there I need two |
| 11:53.39 | *** join/#openmoko aloril2 (n=aloril@kaar72.airix.fi) |
| 11:53.41 | white_gecko | does it matter whete to click on this line? |
| 11:53.57 | CM | Not afaik |
| 11:54.06 | white_gecko | icon or text |
| 11:54.06 | white_gecko | ok |
| 11:55.33 | *** join/#openmoko Sup3rkiddo (n=sudharsh@unaffiliated/sudharsh) |
| 11:55.39 | white_gecko | its orange now |
| 11:55.45 | white_gecko | but there is no white box |
| 11:56.41 | CM | Maybe you have to change to All |
| 11:56.44 | CM | To see the complete list |
| 11:56.53 | CM | Been something weird with that application list |
| 11:57.28 | CM | white_gecko: I mean select All from that drop down next to Utilites |
| 11:58.51 | white_gecko | hm |
| 11:59.05 | white_gecko | but now i have mines running ;-) |
| 12:00.06 | white_gecko | now im back in all |
| 12:00.13 | *** join/#openmoko fcarvalho (n=fcarvalh@200.184.118.132) |
| 12:00.17 | white_gecko | and its orange again |
| 12:00.24 | white_gecko | but i cant start it with double click |
| 12:00.33 | SpeedEvil | Try right clicking. |
| 12:00.41 | SpeedEvil | Put the stylus in the other hand :) |
| 12:04.28 | white_gecko | lol |
| 12:04.37 | white_gecko | right click is also nothning |
| 12:05.55 | *** join/#openmoko yacc (n=andreas@62-2-90-134.static.cablecom.ch) |
| 12:06.25 | white_gecko | no i'm here: http://comiles.eu/~natanael/omoko/omoko15.png |
| 12:08.52 | *** join/#openmoko ebel (n=rory@212.2.183.192) |
| 12:10.26 | white_gecko | CM: are you shure there has to be a white box? |
| 12:16.19 | alphaone | white_gecko: stefan_schmidt will fix that real soon (tm) |
| 12:16.28 | alphaone | (i.e. on his next commit) |
| 12:16.33 | CM | :D |
| 12:16.56 | CM | white_gecko: Well, at least now you have Input manager selected, but it's not started |
| 12:17.35 | *** join/#openmoko teksturi (n=teksturi@217.140.202.239) |
| 12:23.56 | emdete | i can't currently build with mokomakefile... any hints? |
| 12:23.59 | *** join/#openmoko madewokherd (n=urk@cpe-71-67-167-185.neo.res.rr.com) |
| 12:24.59 | pavelm | bye |
| 12:25.05 | CM | emdete: Depends on what's wrong. Show it in pastebin.ca |
| 12:25.18 | CM | pavelm: Good luck with the presentation :) |
| 12:25.29 | pavelm | CM: nothing should go wrong :-) |
| 12:26.26 | emdete | CM: http://nopaste.com/p/al7g02rXv |
| 12:26.46 | *** join/#openmoko slux (n=slux@host240-211-dynamic.17-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 12:27.05 | slux | hello |
| 12:27.27 | slux | i've a problem with the emulating of openmoko with qemu |
| 12:27.41 | slux | hao cai i set the correct coordinates of the cursor? |
| 12:27.49 | slux | it seems uncalibrated :\ |
| 12:27.54 | slux | *how |
| 12:28.47 | ScaredyCat | remove /etc/pointercal and run xtscal ? |
| 12:29.09 | slux | from the guest machine? (openmoko?) |
| 12:29.24 | slux | or my linux box? |
| 12:29.25 | ScaredyCat | in quemu |
| 12:29.31 | slux | how? :\ |
| 12:29.33 | ScaredyCat | qemu |
| 12:29.46 | ScaredyCat | ssh into it? |
| 12:29.51 | slux | :O |
| 12:29.54 | slux | i try |
| 12:30.11 | slux | emm.. |
| 12:30.19 | emdete | CM: any idea? |
| 12:30.20 | slux | what address? :\ |
| 12:30.35 | yoyo | 192.168.0.202 |
| 12:31.16 | *** part/#openmoko baird (n=cbaird@brushtail.apana.org.au) |
| 12:31.35 | *** join/#openmoko sluxArch (n=slux@87.19.230.69) |
| 12:31.52 | white_gecko | stefan_schmidt: thank you il be patient (T) |
| 12:31.57 | white_gecko | no not (T) |
| 12:31.59 | white_gecko | (Y) |
| 12:32.12 | white_gecko | *THUMPS UP* |
| 12:32.54 | stefan_schmidt | CM: Patch for a nicer keyboard applet is now in newest OE.dev |
| 12:33.17 | ScaredyCat | ~lart stefan_schmidt |
| 12:33.17 | apt | takes out a cattle prod and gives stefan_schmidt a good jolt |
| 12:33.40 | ScaredyCat | 7/8 's through a build : |
| 12:34.33 | stefan_schmidt | ScaredyCat: eh? After you are done you just need to rebuild the single package... |
| 12:34.43 | *** join/#openmoko mzb_d800 (n=mzb@ppp108-88.static.internode.on.net) |
| 12:35.05 | ScaredyCat | I know.. but it's a pita because of whatever else might be broken |
| 12:35.13 | *** join/#openmoko Weiss (i=taw27@pip.srcf.societies.cam.ac.uk) |
| 12:35.30 | ScaredyCat | wtf is libmupflap ? |
| 12:35.35 | ScaredyCat | wtf is libmudflap ? |
| 12:36.28 | zash_se | WTF? |
| 12:36.46 | zash_se | htf names things? |
| 12:36.58 | *** part/#openmoko white_gecko (n=natanael@1Cust5.tnt2.ber2.deu.da.uu.net) |
| 12:37.27 | *** join/#openmoko white_gecko (n=natanael@1Cust5.tnt2.ber2.deu.da.uu.net) |
| 12:37.48 | white_gecko | oh how can I shut down the openmoko? |
| 12:37.54 | *** join/#openmoko mmp (n=mmp@TheWide.ubyt.sdjls.uniba.sk) |
| 12:37.56 | tuukkah | why does the phone sometimes boot when i plug the usb cable? is it meant to be usb storage mode? |
| 12:38.46 | *** join/#openmoko mortenlysgaard (n=mortenly@ti500720a080-2275.bb.online.no) |
| 12:40.02 | mortenlysgaard | Hmm.. got this problem with svn. I get: "Permission denied (publickey). svn: Connection closed unexpectedly" Even though i'm quite certain i'm doing things rigth :S Anyone migth know whats wrong? |
| 12:40.08 | white_gecko | can i just close th qemu |
| 12:40.16 | *** join/#openmoko poffy (n=poffy@c-76-30-222-129.hsd1.tx.comcast.net) |
| 12:40.50 | zash_se | white_gecko: shutdown -P now |
| 12:40.55 | mortenlysgaard | white_gecko, I don't know but i would shut the "neo" down first |
| 12:41.03 | *** part/#openmoko teksturi (n=teksturi@217.140.202.239) |
| 12:41.09 | mickeyl | anyone with a current snapshot online? |
| 12:41.14 | white_gecko | hm but without keyboard? |
| 12:41.32 | white_gecko | how do I connect my computer keyboard to the qemu? |
| 12:42.06 | mortenlysgaard | Issn't it a command line arg? |
| 12:42.36 | tuukkah | hmm, was qemu -usb enough |
| 12:42.42 | white_gecko | i've used -usb on startup but my keyboard doesn't take any effect |
| 12:43.20 | *** join/#openmoko DeeDeND (n=daniele@host123-107-dynamic.2-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 12:43.39 | *** join/#openmoko edistar (n=edwinloc@ip503ddd09.speed.planet.nl) |
| 12:44.00 | CM | emdete: Sorry, I'm at work so I'm busy at times |
| 12:44.13 | mortenlysgaard | white_gecko, try with a -keyboard |
| 12:45.16 | emdete | CM: no problem. me too. i just wonder why nobody else has this kind of error. i rebuilded everything (make clobber)... |
| 12:45.26 | CM | emdete: Not sure, but I I think I've heard some people having problems with i686-linux. i486 worked. It's somewhere in bugzilla, either openmokos or openembeddeds |
| 12:45.47 | white_gecko | okey but first i have to close the existing qemu |
| 12:46.55 | white_gecko | mortenlysgaard: "qemu-system-arm: invalid option -- '-keyboard'" |
| 12:47.01 | minthome | after a sucessful build using mokomakefile where are the actual uImage and rootfs stored? |
| 12:47.11 | mortenlysgaard | white_gecko, Ok, just wait a sec |
| 12:47.46 | CM | minthome: For me it's /home/moko/build/tmp/deploy/glibc/images/fic-gta01/ |
| 12:47.53 | mortenlysgaard | white_gecko, Damn, I had a .sh to lunch qemu for openmoko, but i've deleted it |
| 12:48.02 | white_gecko | hm |
| 12:48.15 | minthome | mortenlysgaard, cool, i thought so, but i had grepped out a few others. |
| 12:48.36 | white_gecko | ill try later to build mokomakefile |
| 12:49.02 | white_gecko | i've tried it already but it doesn't work |
| 12:49.13 | mortenlysgaard | Anyone have gotten svn on projects.openmoko.org working. I've never used svn before an i'm a little stumped |
| 12:49.46 | zecke | mortenlysgaard: yes |
| 12:49.59 | white_gecko | btw, what is the current date of the GTA-02 release? |
| 12:50.15 | *** part/#openmoko DeeDeND (n=daniele@host123-107-dynamic.2-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 12:50.23 | white_gecko | the device with wifi :-) |
| 12:50.33 | zash_se | does qemu-stuff have networking? |
| 12:51.27 | mortenlysgaard | zecke, Ok, when i try to connect to my proj. i get: "Permission denied (publickey). svn: Connection closed unexpectedly" |
| 12:52.17 | *** join/#openmoko fcarvalho (n=fcarvalh@200.184.118.132) |
| 12:52.42 | mortenlysgaard | zecke, The command i use is: "svn checkout svn+ssh://mulgrom@svn.projects.openmoko.org/svnroot/finger-keyboard" |
| 12:53.08 | *** join/#openmoko duplex (n=duplex@p57A856DD.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 12:53.54 | *** join/#openmoko krau (n=cktakaha@200.184.118.132) |
| 12:53.58 | *** join/#openmoko switch3r (n=switch3r@128.8.37.122) |
| 12:54.49 | *** join/#openmoko tr2x (n=alvar@80-218-185-55.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 12:57.17 | *** join/#openmoko cb22_ (n=cb22@dsl-245-145-221.telkomadsl.co.za) |
| 13:03.04 | *** join/#openmoko lsobral (n=sobral@200.184.118.132) |
| 13:03.33 | *** join/#openmoko olv (n=olvaffe@123-193-215-175.ethome-ip.ethome.com.tw) |
| 13:03.42 | *** join/#openmoko dcordes (n=tsingtao@e181243089.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 13:05.32 | dcordes | is there any recent information about gta02 production status? |
| 13:06.04 | CM | ARGH! Tried to rebuild just to get the new keyboar, but of cause bitbake breaks down completely.. |
| 13:07.41 | dcordes | CM: why not just rebuilding the keyboard? |
| 13:08.23 | *** join/#openmoko mzb_d800 (n=mzb@ppp108-88.static.internode.on.net) |
| 13:08.36 | *** join/#openmoko darmou (n=darmou@ppp59-167-91-227.lns1.mel6.internode.on.net) |
| 13:08.38 | CM | dcordes: You have a point there.. ;) |
| 13:08.57 | ScaredyCat | what's special about the kb, any pics? ? |
| 13:09.10 | CM | ScaredyCat: I don't know, but I wanted to find out |
| 13:09.18 | ScaredyCat | hehhe |
| 13:10.48 | dcordes | is it any usable in landscape resolution? |
| 13:11.58 | dcordes | "GTA02 will even allow you to change the battery without shutting down the device" (from http://gnumonks.org/~laforge/weblog/2007/09/01#20070901-uboot_passthrough) How is that achieved? |
| 13:12.14 | dcordes | I mean- there has to be some extra battery to supply currency while you change |
| 13:12.21 | CM | dcordes: USB power |
| 13:12.25 | dcordes | ah I see |
| 13:12.26 | roh | dcordes there is no production status before the is any production. all what happened now was that there are 2 succesive build prototypes (count <10) which get used for evaluation of the hardware design. thats actually quite some way still to even think about producing them |
| 13:12.27 | CM | :) |
| 13:13.09 | ScaredyCat | so not october then :P |
| 13:13.18 | dcordes | so october is not really possible? |
| 13:13.48 | roh | ScaredyCat i have no clue. |
| 13:13.53 | ScaredyCat | they didn't say which october... |
| 13:13.55 | *** join/#openmoko k-s[WORK] (n=gustavo@200.184.118.132) |
| 13:13.59 | CM | ScaredyCat: Hehe |
| 13:14.20 | *** join/#openmoko awesomo4000 (n=awesomo4@c-76-26-145-175.hsd1.dc.comcast.net) |
| 13:14.38 | dcordes | hrhr |
| 13:14.41 | roh | before they are getting sold there will be devices for some p0 tests to make shure we have not forseen anything. but i really cannot predict any real 'will be sold then' date. the latter also depending on the state of software |
| 13:15.17 | roh | eh. s/for/over |
| 13:16.08 | CM | XorA: Is there any way I can see what changed in OE since yesterday in regard to a certain bb file? binutils-cross_2.18.bb in this case |
| 13:16.50 | XorA | CM: it was added |
| 13:16.55 | XorA | CM: and breaks here |
| 13:17.07 | CM | Here too, and the paths look weird |
| 13:17.27 | CM | "rmdir: `/home/moko/build/tmp/cross//home/moko/build/tmp/cross/lib/gcc-lib': No such file or directory" |
| 13:18.14 | emdete | CM: hm, is set BUILD_ARCH = "i486" in build/conf/local.conf but get the same error :/ |
| 13:18.19 | roh | CM i also get that a lot. |
| 13:18.24 | emdete | s/is/i/ |
| 13:18.31 | roh | since minday evening |
| 13:18.35 | roh | monday |
| 13:18.38 | *** join/#openmoko ccube (n=ccube@87.230.22.107) |
| 13:18.58 | CM | roh: How do I get around it? |
| 13:19.25 | *** join/#openmoko ozzloy_ (n=ozzloy@unaffiliated/ozzloy) |
| 13:19.34 | roh | CM not.Ã i'm still researching what it is.. seems so change behaviour depending non what i wanna build and how |
| 13:19.44 | mickeyl | XorA: so should we pinpoint 2.17.something ? |
| 13:20.03 | mickeyl | i don't trust binutils .0 releases anyways |
| 13:20.06 | CM | roh: Ok, thanks |
| 13:20.08 | rwhitby | interestingly, binutils-cross-2.18 builds here fine. 32-bit debian etch and xubuntu 7.04 |
| 13:20.43 | ScaredyCat | compild here too |
| 13:20.57 | rwhitby | and ScaredyCat's stuff usually breaks first! |
| 13:21.04 | ScaredyCat | this is true |
| 13:21.20 | ScaredyCat | but that's by design :) |
| 13:21.53 | CIA-23 | openmoko: 03chris * r2914 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/applications/openmoko-today2/ (4 files in 2 dirs): Synchronise with upstream matchbox-desktop-2 |
| 13:22.16 | *** join/#openmoko rd_ (n=rd@88.198.85.37) |
| 13:22.22 | CM | My build was from scratch yesterday evening, so maybe some other bug in there too. |
| 13:22.58 | XorA | rwhitby: I see it build at work 32bit, fail at home 64bit |
| 13:23.19 | ScaredyCat | 64bit pussys |
| 13:23.23 | rwhitby | 64-bit strikes again. |
| 13:23.28 | *** join/#openmoko LeRrA (n=lerra@h-89-233-204-164.wholesale.rp80.se) |
| 13:24.22 | CM | emdete: Sorry, can't find any other bug like that eiher :/ |
| 13:24.26 | CIA-23 | openmoko: 03chris * r2915 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/applications/openmoko-today2/ (ChangeLog libtaku/launcher-util.c): Fix function to match prototype in header in launcher-util.c |
| 13:25.02 | *** join/#openmoko cga (n=cga@213-140-6-101.ip.fastwebnet.it) |
| 13:25.22 | ScaredyCat | oh dear |
| 13:25.36 | CM | ScaredyCat: The boot menu? |
| 13:25.52 | ScaredyCat | no.. |
| 13:25.59 | CM | I've been unable to get it back lately.. Even a new mtdblock1 doesn't seem to help :( |
| 13:26.09 | CM | So I don't have a boot menu any more |
| 13:26.09 | ScaredyCat | gets part way through the boot sound and sticks |
| 13:26.48 | ScaredyCat | just seems to take twice as long o boot now |
| 13:27.24 | ScaredyCat | jffs2 errors |
| 13:27.46 | *** join/#openmoko Ryback_ (n=ulisses@200.184.118.132) |
| 13:28.18 | ScaredyCat | I can her my phone get sinal... |
| 13:29.00 | ScaredyCat | hey! |
| 13:29.18 | ScaredyCat | who took the 'upload screenshot' away from the menu |
| 13:29.52 | mickeyl | try holding AUX |
| 13:30.05 | ScaredyCat | another menu ? |
| 13:30.08 | mickeyl | yes |
| 13:30.11 | ScaredyCat | :O |
| 13:30.16 | mickeyl | one for power-related things, one for non-power related things now |
| 13:30.22 | ccube | ^:-D |
| 13:30.24 | ccube | nice |
| 13:30.25 | ScaredyCat | ahh good move |
| 13:30.30 | mickeyl | more consistent |
| 13:30.34 | ccube | yeah |
| 13:30.48 | mickeyl | and gives us room for some more functions we would like to have quickly accessible |
| 13:30.55 | mickeyl | also added a "toggle fullscreen" |
| 13:30.58 | mickeyl | which works quite nice |
| 13:31.08 | roh | mickeyl i'm still not conviced by the short powerbutton press... i'd like make that 2 within 1 or 2 seconds. i pretty often kill a app by accident |
| 13:31.09 | ScaredyCat | just make sure gta02 has more buttons ;) |
| 13:31.27 | *** join/#openmoko mzb (n=mzb@ppp108-88.static.internode.on.net) |
| 13:31.33 | roh | ScaredyCat i will not. thats for certain. same case. |
| 13:31.38 | mickeyl | roh: hmm... really? i don't fancy double clicks :) |
| 13:31.45 | rwhitby | I thought gta02 had to have the exact same form factor as gta01 to amortise the tooling costs for the case |
| 13:31.48 | mickeyl | roh: we need a usability screening anyways |
| 13:31.51 | roh | one of the not many things we are shure about |
| 13:31.53 | ScaredyCat | I hold the power till it 'poop's at me... |
| 13:32.03 | mmazur | It does what? |
| 13:32.10 | mickeyl | it sounds |
| 13:32.11 | ScaredyCat | roh, you mean it (rather than i) |
| 13:32.13 | ScaredyCat | ? |
| 13:32.18 | XorA | reminds me, must fix power buttons on my devices |
| 13:32.36 | *** join/#openmoko andrunko (n=andrunko@200.184.118.132) |
| 13:32.38 | rwhitby | what is the fix for the sunken power button? |
| 13:32.53 | ScaredyCat | a biro |
| 13:34.28 | mickeyl | rwhitby: disassemble the device and make the powerbutton reseat in the middle of ins enclosing |
| 13:34.31 | mickeyl | s/ins/its/ |
| 13:34.34 | mickeyl | reassemble then |
| 13:34.58 | rwhitby | mickeyl: thx |
| 13:34.58 | mickeyl | that fixed it for most of my devices here |
| 13:35.06 | ScaredyCat | the buttons could be like on the ps2: aux + power + aux +aux +power+ aux = do something rather special |
| 13:35.08 | mickeyl | not all though |
| 13:35.35 | roh | japp. all gta01bv4 with green pcb at least. they all have the new panasonic keys |
| 13:36.32 | mickeyl | *cough* i have yet to have a green gta01bv4 |
| 13:36.43 | roh | with the very early preseries devices (nothing we have taken money for) there were some problems with the switches itself. no pressure point due to soldering problems. but thats fixed now quite a while |
| 13:37.10 | roh | mickeyl i meant the color of the main pcb. |
| 13:37.13 | *** part/#openmoko white_gecko (n=natanael@1Cust5.tnt2.ber2.deu.da.uu.net) |
| 13:37.35 | mickeyl | roh: me too |
| 13:37.38 | mickeyl | was just abbreviating |
| 13:38.36 | CIA-23 | openmoko: 03chris * r2916 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/applications/openmoko-today2/ (ChangeLog src/today-main.c src/today-pim-summary.c): Launch "openmoko-dates" instead of "dates" |
| 13:38.54 | roh | mickeyl if your keys click feelable then its propably the new ones |
| 13:39.48 | ScaredyCat | mickeyl: what does toggle fullscreen do? doesn't seem to to anything here... or is it 'while in an app' |
| 13:40.15 | mickeyl | ScaredyCat: i disabled it for the today app |
| 13:40.16 | CIA-23 | openmoko: 03thomas * r2917 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/applications/openmoko-today2/ (. libkoto/): * Switch to using the upstream version of libkoto via svn:externals |
| 13:40.20 | mickeyl | ScaredyCat: it works for all other apps |
| 13:40.29 | ScaredyCat | ahh ok. thank |
| 13:40.30 | ScaredyCat | s |
| 13:40.52 | mickeyl | if you see merit in it, i can enable for today as well |
| 13:40.57 | mickeyl | just didn't thought it would be that helpful |
| 13:41.02 | mickeyl | s/thought/think/ |
| 13:41.59 | mickeyl | rwhitby: :) |
| 13:42.03 | mickeyl | soonish |
| 13:42.21 | emdete | rwhitby: you meant revisions? |
| 13:42.41 | mickeyl | no, we want revisions |
| 13:42.43 | mickeyl | we don't want dates |
| 13:43.01 | rwhitby | oh-puzzles, settings-daemon, matchbox-keyboard-inputmethod |
| 13:43.02 | ScaredyCat | CM: I get that terminal bug now... i don;t think it;s me |
| 13:43.55 | rwhitby | openocd-native |
| 13:44.16 | rwhitby | so 4 packages to go and we're there. |
| 13:45.31 | ScaredyCat | w00h00! |
| 13:46.19 | *** join/#openmoko falllout (n=Miranda@c-76-31-20-71.hsd1.tx.comcast.net) |
| 13:46.30 | ScaredyCat | did you remove the splash too mickeyl? |
| 13:46.36 | ScaredyCat | psplash |
| 13:46.40 | mickeyl | no |
| 13:46.53 | *** join/#openmoko poffy (n=poffy@c-76-30-222-129.hsd1.tx.comcast.net) |
| 13:46.57 | mickeyl | this is probably due to a bug in OE |
| 13:47.01 | falllout | is the release date for end users still october? |
| 13:47.01 | aloril | falllout: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1, SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) (Hopefully these links answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) |
| 13:47.11 | ScaredyCat | k |
| 13:47.25 | *** join/#openmoko geaaru (n=geaaru@host217-172-dynamic.14-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 13:47.32 | CIA-23 | openmoko: 03thomas * r2918 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/applications/openmoko-today2/ (ChangeLog src/today-pim-summary.c): |
| 13:47.32 | CIA-23 | openmoko: * src/today-pim-summary.c: (today_pim_summary_visible_cb): Sync to |
| 13:47.32 | CIA-23 | openmoko: upstream libkoto |
| 13:47.37 | emdete | we would like to compile openmoko for another platform. what would we have to do for that? |
| 13:48.21 | stefan_schmidt | emdete: Add your platform to OE and use it as MACHINE. |
| 13:48.27 | *** join/#openmoko mdt_ (n=mdt@total-communication.vfnet.de) |
| 13:48.49 | emdete | just a second - switch the client ;) |
| 13:48.56 | stefan_schmidt | emdete: Or if you like to have some of the apps just use a crosscompiler for your platform and care about dep hell yourself |
| 13:49.09 | stefan_schmidt | <stefan_schmidt> emdete: Or if you like to have some of the apps just use a crosscompiler for your platform and care about dep hell yourself |
| 13:49.52 | *** join/#openmoko Ryushin (i=proxy@windwalker.openinnovations.com) |
| 13:50.04 | emdete | we are thinking of the greenphone, where a cross-compiler is already there and the kernel can't be build because it contains closed source drivers |
| 13:50.31 | roh | we do not have any support for binary components yet afaik. |
| 13:50.54 | roh | i mean in the buildsystem.. and if i'm right in big parts of the community |
| 13:51.17 | stefan_schmidt | emdete: Sounds like a really hard job |
| 13:51.41 | roh | emdete sounds like a lot of work.. does somebody pay for it? |
| 13:51.59 | stefan_schmidt | emdete: OpenMoko is not suited for keybad input yet. So you would have to use the ts the whole time. |
| 13:52.35 | stefan_schmidt | roh: Personally I would start with adding grennphone machine support to OE and take a look at the just started QVGA theme stuff. |
| 13:52.39 | stefan_schmidt | ehh |
| 13:52.46 | stefan_schmidt | s/roh/emdete/ |
| 13:52.50 | XorA | emdete: OE already handles this situation for binary sharp ROM |
| 13:52.53 | emdete | i wouldnt mind for the keyboard. but oe&bitbake is a really great tool |
| 13:53.14 | XorA | emdete: check out sharprom-compatible distro |
| 13:53.24 | stefan_schmidt | emdete: For just ts and QVGA support we already done some work for EZX and HTC devices |
| 13:53.32 | emdete | i started with the greenphone and did all the steps myself. noe with the neo i see the benefit of the bb |
| 13:53.53 | *** join/#openmoko chris^ (n=kraetzi@p548ADD20.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 13:54.07 | stefan_schmidt | emdete: Another _real_ big problem is that you are stucked with a 2.4 kernel which will not support everything you would need in OpenMoko |
| 13:54.11 | *** join/#openmoko Marex_Yggdrasil (n=Marex@gwfm4-3-0-240.802.cz) |
| 13:54.29 | emdete | the most important stuff we would like to use is the build (mokomakefile/bb/...) - is it possible to use a given kernel & crosscompiler? |
| 13:54.41 | emdete | yes, 2.4 and nothing more. :( |
| 13:54.47 | *** join/#openmoko Marex_Yggdrasil (n=Marex@gwfm4-3-0-240.802.cz) |
| 13:54.59 | stefan_schmidt | emdete: Add 18 binary only modules to the pain list. |
| 13:55.15 | zecke | stefan_schmidt: 17 IIRC ;) |
| 13:55.25 | stefan_schmidt | zecke: got me :) |
| 13:56.00 | roh | isn't it unimportant how often somebody shoots the dog? isnt it dead after the first few hits? |
| 13:56.45 | stefan_schmidt | roh: What if you are able to RE 10 of them but not the rest? |
| 13:57.00 | stefan_schmidt | roh: :) |
| 13:57.01 | zecke | roh: technically you are right. But if you plan to shoot the dog 17 times then it is a new level of... |
| 13:57.15 | roh | stefan_schmidt then it still will never be sold as openmoko.. see our trademark policy |
| 13:57.38 | roh | if there is openmoko on the flyer, its opensource. at least in kernelland |
| 13:58.03 | stefan_schmidt | roh: Yeah, but if people like to hack on it that's fine. As long as it is a private hobby. |
| 13:58.03 | CM | zecke: Maybe you've seen it already? http://www.atoker.com/blog/2007/09/05/webkitgtk-at-linuxconf-europe-2007/ |
| 13:58.17 | zecke | yes, nice slides |
| 13:58.52 | roh | stefan_schmidt i did not want to put that into the wrong light. on the contrary.. running on all devices is a neccessary step for world domination, isnt it? |
| 13:59.26 | stefan_schmidt | roh: psst, don't talk to loud about our world domination plans. ;) |
| 13:59.33 | roh | zecke will gtk-webkit be merged upstream somehow in the future? |
| 13:59.42 | *** join/#openmoko mindCrime__ (n=chatzill@66.83.208.218.nw.nuvox.net) |
| 13:59.59 | zecke | roh: what is upstream for you? apple's webkit svn repository? |
| 14:00.27 | roh | zecke dunno. as long as it looses 3 of the 4 buildsystems wrapped around it |
| 14:01.37 | zecke | roh: hehe, the buildsystems where not a issue for debian developer. And everything I created is in the official webkit tree and we still have a lot to do... |
| 14:01.49 | roh | i see. |
| 14:02.09 | *** join/#openmoko orpheus (n=scott@lawn-143-215-205-16.lawn.gatech.edu) |
| 14:02.25 | zecke | roh: the good thing of using qmake is, apple developers will fix the Gtk+ build. This is unlikely to happen with an autotools based system |
| 14:02.27 | roh | then ill be quiet and wait and hope... the onlöy thing that bothers me is that there seems to be no browser-engine on this planet which can be taken seriously and which is not c++ |
| 14:03.13 | roh | zecke hehe.. i also do not like autotools. i never understood why people do not use gnumake and pkgtool and be happy till the end of their days |
| 14:03.18 | *** join/#openmoko alexzhang (n=alexzhan@59.40.230.167) |
| 14:03.32 | orpheus | would anyone here be able (and willing) to explain to me how kernels get built from OE? |
| 14:03.41 | orpheus | bitbake is... different |
| 14:04.47 | roh | orpheus not very different from a vanilla built. with the difference that bitbake builds the crosscompiler for you and takes care of patching via quilt series file |
| 14:05.32 | orpheus | actually, i guess I didn't really ask the right question |
| 14:05.39 | roh | zecke for starters it would be cool when somebody breaks qmake out of the qt* stuff. it is till the only part ot the qt-world i use |
| 14:06.02 | CM | zecke: Did Alp write WebWorks in 1995? Wasn't he like 10 years old back then or so? |
| 14:06.10 | orpheus | where does the kernel (and it's modules) get tossed into a uIage? |
| 14:06.25 | zecke | since ~yesterday qt-x11-4 should not be build when building webkit |
| 14:06.28 | zecke | CM: no idea |
| 14:06.45 | roh | orpheus the modules aren't. uImage is just the kernel qith a wrapper for uboot |
| 14:06.47 | CM | Just reading the slides |
| 14:06.51 | orpheus | I've been trying to see where openmoko-devel-image eventually causes that to happen, but no such luck so far |
| 14:07.38 | orpheus | roh: doh! I should have known that, this isn't doinig any multi-boot stuff; the rootfs is separate |
| 14:08.12 | orpheus | thanks |
| 14:08.49 | *** join/#openmoko jpozlovsky (n=jindra@98.176.broadband4.iol.cz) |
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| 14:09.33 | orpheus | would you happen to know what the lowest bitbake target is that will rebuild the rootfs? Also, how does bitbake know which kernel to use the modules from? |
| 14:09.40 | *** join/#openmoko emdete (n=mdt@total-communication.vfnet.de) |
| 14:11.05 | *** join/#openmoko Magon (n=Magon@213.155.227.226) |
| 14:11.24 | emdete | stefan_schmidt: can you explain where i could start? didn't find the list you mentioned |
| 14:11.51 | stefan_schmidt | emdete: List? |
| 14:12.18 | emdete | you said to add binary packages to a list |
| 14:13.43 | stefan_schmidt | emdete: Hmm, seems to have been miscommunicated. |
| 14:14.15 | stefan_schmidt | emdete: As start, but that is my personal opinion, I would add support for the greenphone in OE |
| 14:14.57 | *** join/#openmoko PBeck (n=PBeck@HSI-KBW-091-089-102-236.hsi2.kabelbw.de) |
| 14:14.59 | emdete | stefan_schmidt: yes, i think that would be the best way |
| 14:15.02 | stefan_schmidt | emdete: I have never done this personally so you have to read up some stuff on their website and perhaps asked some questions on ml or IRC afterwards |
| 14:15.15 | PBeck | hi |
| 14:15.45 | stefan_schmidt | emdete: OpenEmbedded also got a free greenphone for testing. But until now there is not much support for it. |
| 14:15.55 | *** join/#openmoko Marex (n=Marex@gwfm4-3-0-240.802.cz) |
| 14:16.15 | *** join/#openmoko ozarka (n=elineber@12.106.220.2) |
| 14:16.16 | stefan_schmidt | zecke: Who has the greenphone atm? Anyone emdete can talk to for working together on OE suport? |
| 14:16.33 | *** join/#openmoko emdete_ (n=mdt@total-communication.vfnet.de) |
| 14:17.02 | CM | stefan_schmidt: ljp maybe? |
| 14:17.24 | zecke | stefan_schmidt: florian has one where I failed to get the serial working, and woglinde is using the 2nd as primary phone |
| 14:17.31 | *** join/#openmoko balthamaisteri (n=balthama@statip-80-95-136-74.kopteri.net) |
| 14:17.39 | stefan_schmidt | CM: Does he _really_ work on this? I never saw a commit from him about this... |
| 14:18.14 | stefan_schmidt | zecke: But no active work to support in in OE? Makes no sense before there is a working 2.6 kernel? |
| 14:18.36 | CM | stefan_schmidt: I don't know, but I'm sure he has some green phones |
| 14:18.47 | zecke | stefan_schmidt: I didn't want to be the one adding the binary modules to OE :} |
| 14:18.55 | *** join/#openmoko emdete (n=mdt@total-communication.vfnet.de) |
| 14:19.01 | *** join/#openmoko airjump (n=MZ@p508ABE3D.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 14:19.12 | stefan_schmidt | CM: Of course, but the work still needs to be done manually. ;) |
| 14:19.26 | stefan_schmidt | zecke: I understand this. |
| 14:19.40 | ScaredyCat | mickeyl: /etc/init.d/psplash does not exist <--- might be the cause of that one :) |
| 14:19.45 | *** join/#openmoko emdete_ (n=mdt@total-communication.vfnet.de) |
| 14:19.56 | zecke | I felt stupid and ashamed to not get the serial working and gave the phone to florian at linuxtag |
| 14:20.02 | CM | stefan_schmidt: I know, it's always like that. I keep staring at my screen, but the code just doesn't write itself. ;) |
| 14:20.15 | stefan_schmidt | CM: :) |
| 14:20.30 | *** join/#openmoko fkdkdfjik (n=fkdkdfji@mauve.plus.com) |
| 14:20.35 | stefan_schmidt | zecke: And you have enough other phones around. |
| 14:20.49 | emdete_ | sry, o was off for a minute. did you say saomething more about the greenphone? |
| 14:21.00 | stefan_schmidt | emdete_: no |
| 14:21.14 | florian | Is someone working on 2.6 for the Greenphone?! |
| 14:21.26 | stefan_schmidt | emdete_: As start you can ask florian and woglinde about their status. |
| 14:21.28 | zecke | florian: haha ;) |
| 14:21.33 | florian | ~lart myself for lacking time to connect the serial port |
| 14:21.33 | apt | stabs myself for lacking time to connect the serial port |
| 14:21.34 | stefan_schmidt | heh, there you go. :) |
| 14:21.55 | emdete_ | florian: you need the tffs driver for that |
| 14:22.40 | florian | emdete_: First I need to put the pieces for the serial port together... |
| 14:22.40 | zecke | or boot from sdcard... |
| 14:23.07 | *** join/#openmoko emdel (n=emdel@host176-209-dynamic.10-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 14:23.18 | mickeyl | ScaredyCat: ooh odd |
| 14:23.20 | *** part/#openmoko emdel (n=emdel@host176-209-dynamic.10-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 14:23.54 | *** join/#openmoko emdete_ (n=mdt@total-communication.vfnet.de) |
| 14:24.11 | florian | we need boot_usb for the greenphone :-) |
| 14:24.26 | dcordes | yuck, greenphone |
| 14:24.37 | SpeedEvil | u-boot needs to be able to do boot over GPRS |
| 14:24.49 | stefan_schmidt | florian: Grab the source. :) |
| 14:25.32 | *** join/#openmoko duplex|away (n=duplex@p57A856DD.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 14:26.13 | florian | stefan_schmidt: hum well... the source and the motivation is never a problem, but you should know what the major source of problem is by now, right? |
| 14:26.15 | florian | :-) |
| 14:27.01 | *** join/#openmoko miip (n=miip@p54A57AF4.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 14:27.02 | *** join/#openmoko emdete_ (n=mdt@total-communication.vfnet.de) |
| 14:27.02 | stefan_schmidt | florian: :) |
| 14:28.01 | cdbot2 | * * OM Bug 801 has been created by christoph.gysin(AT)gmail.com |
| 14:28.01 | cdbot2 | * * qemu-native fails to build on gentoo/gcc-3.4.6 |
| 14:28.02 | cdbot2 | * * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=801 |
| 14:28.19 | florian | btw. anyone here who intends to come to OSiM? |
| 14:28.44 | XorA | OSiM? |
| 14:29.06 | zecke | XorA: OpenSource in Mobile |
| 14:29.10 | florian | XorA: http://www.osimconference.com/ |
| 14:29.53 | stefan_schmidt | florian: You mean paying 3500$ for listening to business speach people? :) |
| 14:30.06 | CIA-23 | openmoko: 03chris * r2919 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/applications/openmoko-today2/ (8 files in 3 dirs): |
| 14:30.06 | CIA-23 | openmoko: Change the way launching apps work so as to not require changes to |
| 14:30.06 | CIA-23 | openmoko: upstream matchbox-desktop-2. |
| 14:30.52 | florian | stefan_schmidt: There is a contact for sponsored community member tickets... I'd expect quite some interesting people to be there. |
| 14:31.21 | florian | ... and no, I did not pay 3500$ :-) |
| 14:31.44 | stefan_schmidt | florian: :) |
| 14:31.55 | stefan_schmidt | florian: I'm on vacation at this time anyway. |
| 14:32.24 | stefan_schmidt | florian: And core-team cancled the trip due to much time waste. |
| 14:37.05 | *** join/#openmoko ferric (n=aditya@dsl081-134-176.nyc1.dsl.speakeasy.net) |
| 14:37.47 | ScaredyCat | the 10 second force power off is back too ? |
| 14:39.26 | ScaredyCat | mickeyl: also errors on boot trying to create /etc/rc5.d/35gsmd |
| 14:39.40 | ScaredyCat | S35gsmd |
| 14:39.49 | *** join/#openmoko Demitar (n=demitar@c-212-031-190-120.cust.broadway.se) |
| 14:43.59 | *** join/#openmoko j_ack (n=j_ack@p508D81E2.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
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| 14:49.22 | orpheus | So i'm gonna ask again, sorry for cluttering up the irc channel |
| 14:49.44 | orpheus | but what all do I have to tell bitbake to rebuild if I want to try out a kernel change? |
| 14:50.32 | orpheus | the kernel's package, then the whole image to get the modules re-packaged? |
| 14:50.51 | orpheus | (re-packaged into the rootfs) |
| 14:50.57 | *** join/#openmoko emdete (n=mdt@total-communication.vfnet.de) |
| 14:52.43 | *** join/#openmoko fcarvalho (n=fcarvalh@200.184.118.132) |
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| 14:56.05 | *** join/#openmoko psymin (n=psymin@smtpstatic.blackfoot.net) |
| 14:56.56 | ScaredyCat | bitbake -crebuild <blah> |
| 14:57.28 | emdete | sry for reconnecting... network probs here. stefan_schmidt you said there are already people working on the greenphone. is there a mailing list or something? do you know if one can participate? |
| 14:58.43 | stefan_schmidt | emdete: It more like people who have one and had some thoughts about hacking on it. I don't think there is an ml. |
| 14:59.01 | stefan_schmidt | emdete: florian and woglinde, hanging out here, are the two I know |
| 14:59.28 | emdete | perhaps joint forces can solve the problem ;) |
| 15:00.04 | CM | orpheus: bitbake -c rebuild linux-gta01 even, then the rootfs |
| 15:00.20 | *** join/#openmoko neocoretech_ (n=neocoret@84.245.167.194) |
| 15:01.31 | florian | emdete: My current focus is to get the serial port working and playing with the crappy original kernel a little bit, but I'm definitely not going to port 2.6 to it. |
| 15:01.56 | emdete | florian: what do you mean with 'serial port'? |
| 15:02.06 | emdete | florian: gsm? |
| 15:02.31 | florian | emdete: console |
| 15:03.39 | emdete | florian: hm, don't understand that. the usb does ethernet as in the neo... which serial device are you talking about? |
| 15:04.31 | stefan_schmidt | emdete: A real hardware serial port available throught the debug points of the phone |
| 15:05.06 | florian | emdete: and you do not want to start with a usb console if you intend to port a new kernel to it :-) |
| 15:05.53 | florian | I wonder if I can resist trying OpenMoko and G(PE)^2 on it ;) |
| 15:06.20 | mortenlysgaard | Hmm. having this problem with ssh. what do you guys get when you try: svn checkout svn+ssh://mulgrom@svn.projects.openmoko.org/svnroot/finger-keyboard |
| 15:06.20 | orpheus | CM: thanks, that's what I was trying (well, linux-openmoko), but i think it may have just svn co'ed over my added patch |
| 15:07.23 | orpheus | wouldn't we need your password? |
| 15:07.36 | emdete | florian: how would you start to port moko to it? |
| 15:08.01 | mortenlysgaard | Yes you would, but i don't get to the auth. process |
| 15:08.04 | orpheus | mortenlysgaard: Ekk! |
| 15:08.06 | orpheus | Permission denied (publickey). |
| 15:08.06 | orpheus | svn: Connection closed unexpectedly |
| 15:08.13 | edistar | would you think that it is possible to port the openmoko OS to the nokia 770? without the gsm bit of course.. |
| 15:08.14 | mortenlysgaard | Same as me :S |
| 15:08.30 | *** join/#openmoko El_Salvador (n=Brescia@adsl-160-182.38-151.net24.it) |
| 15:08.40 | orpheus | mort: it looks broken to me as well |
| 15:08.48 | *** join/#openmoko bmidgley2 (n=brad@c-24-2-92-215.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) |
| 15:08.50 | florian | emdete: Building an OM based image for it... |
| 15:08.59 | mortenlysgaard | orpheus, am i doing something wrong, should the pswd be in the command, or will i be phtomted to enter it? |
| 15:09.17 | orpheus | it should look just like an ssh prompt |
| 15:09.26 | emdete | florian: i have not the expirience with that - could you help? |
| 15:09.49 | *** part/#openmoko ozarka (n=elineber@12.106.220.2) |
| 15:09.52 | *** join/#openmoko behdad (n=behdad@CPE001217b19226-CM0012c9c84bc4.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 15:09.58 | orpheus | mort: it looks like ssh is confused on that machine |
| 15:10.01 | mortenlysgaard | orpheus, Ok, so there's somthing wrong with projects.openmoko? because i can't see i'm doing enything wrong |
| 15:10.28 | mortenlysgaard | s/enything/anything/ |
| 15:10.28 | florian | emdete: sure, the first step would be to get basic support for the device into OE - I guess zecke has some bits to do that. |
| 15:10.33 | orpheus | either that, or we're both missing something big (which is entirely possible) |
| 15:11.22 | mortenlysgaard | orpheus, Hmm.. how irritating. Then i can't get my release up in svn :S |
| 15:12.30 | orpheus | anyone know more than me about svn on projects.openmoko.org? |
| 15:12.35 | orpheus | maybe? |
| 15:13.02 | *** join/#openmoko gcb77_ (n=gcb77@c-24-16-154-132.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) |
| 15:14.21 | mortenlysgaard | orpheus, I don't know. I have to say i'm a bit irritated on the page. I hasn't updated it's news in several weeks. All in all, it's a bit buggy. I want to get m app out to the people, and i just won't work :S |
| 15:16.43 | ScaredyCat | CM: are your builds behaving oddly? |
| 15:18.11 | ScaredyCat | that new keyboard... |
| 15:18.26 | ScaredyCat | doesn't work... or t least the app launcer seems broken |
| 15:18.55 | *** join/#openmoko ozarka (n=elineber@12.106.220.2) |
| 15:19.10 | ScaredyCat | it's about as stable as my last girlfriend |
| 15:20.53 | ScaredyCat | ok, so it does start, you just get no indication that its started... surely it should also only run once |
| 15:22.38 | ScaredyCat | stefan_schmidt: where is this new keyboard then? |
| 15:23.10 | stefan_schmidt | ScaredyCat: Install matchbox-keyboard-applet |
| 15:23.22 | stefan_schmidt | The reminds me to add it to the default image |
| 15:26.17 | CM | ScaredyCat: Yes, it behaves a bit oddly :) |
| 15:27.05 | *** join/#openmoko summatusmentis (n=summatus@umm-yrless170.morris.umn.edu) |
| 15:27.17 | ScaredyCat | I had to force psplash uninstall (it didn;t exist) then install it... |
| 15:27.26 | folken | buildhost has still not fully recoverd, i presume? |
| 15:28.14 | ScaredyCat | this build is bad imho |
| 15:28.57 | CM | Well, it no longer builds at all :P |
| 15:29.07 | CIA-23 | openmoko: 03andrew * r2920 10/trunk/src/host/qemu-neo1973/ (gnokiigsm/at-emulator.h hw/neo1973.c hw/s3c.h hw/s3c2410.c): |
| 15:29.07 | CIA-23 | openmoko: Scale the S3C ADC readings to natural values from a GTA01, fixes bug #736. |
| 15:29.07 | CIA-23 | openmoko: Take AT error constants from the specs. |
| 15:29.26 | *** join/#openmoko Marcel_M (n=Marcel_M@86.59.65.236) |
| 15:29.55 | ScaredyCat | i can has cheezburgr ? |
| 15:32.05 | *** join/#openmoko miip_ (n=miip@p54A57AF4.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 15:32.59 | CIA-23 | openmoko: 03laforge * r2921 10/trunk/src/target/kernel/patches/gta02-core.patch: Implement GTA02 bluetooth power switching |
| 15:34.40 | Jiten | I was wondering, can the touchscreen detect when a finger is close to the screen? |
| 15:34.50 | SpeedEvil | No. |
| 15:35.02 | SpeedEvil | Only when it touches it, and depresses it by 0.1mm or so. |
| 15:35.21 | ScaredyCat | stefan_schmidt: do i get an icon or what? |
| 15:35.23 | SpeedEvil | (no feeling - as the force is in the .1-1g range) |
| 15:35.37 | ScaredyCat | the keyboard no longer appears on the panel |
| 15:36.14 | stefan_schmidt | ScaredyCat: Install the package and restart X and you should find a keyboard icon on the top panel |
| 15:36.17 | CIA-23 | openmoko: 03thomas * r2922 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/artwork/themes/openmoko-standard-2-qvga/gtk-2.0/gtkrc: * Set taku-icon size to 32x32 |
| 15:36.34 | ScaredyCat | I even tried rebooting stefan_schmidt... nada |
| 15:36.46 | stefan_schmidt | ScaredyCat: hmm, scy |
| 15:36.54 | stefan_schmidt | scarry |
| 15:37.20 | stefan_schmidt | ScaredyCat: I'll investigate. But shopping some food before |
| 15:37.30 | ScaredyCat | but even the standard one isn't working how it should either... |
| 15:37.50 | ScaredyCat | (and that was before adding yours) |
| 15:37.55 | stefan_schmidt | ScaredyCat: The autopopup or the input manager? |
| 15:38.15 | ScaredyCat | input manager |
| 15:38.21 | ScaredyCat | autopopup pops up |
| 15:39.43 | Jiten | is it possible to use the bluetooth to find where other bluetooth devices are? Or if not a direct way, does bluetooth give information on the signal strength? |
| 15:39.47 | ScaredyCat | ok, 3 reboots later i get a tiny tiny keybord icon |
| 15:40.01 | stefan_schmidt | ScaredyCat: What does it not do? Add itself to the panel? (The white rectangle) |
| 15:40.14 | stefan_schmidt | ScaredyCat: ok, that's it |
| 15:40.59 | SpeedEvil | Jiten: No, don't know |
| 15:41.07 | ScaredyCat | http://scap.linuxtogo.org/files/3951efa3dd1017ada927bfdc8d5fc63a.png |
| 15:41.21 | Writchie | Jiten: there is RSSI available at least at the lower layers |
| 15:41.38 | Writchie | Jiten: this might not be all that useful. |
| 15:41.59 | SpeedEvil | Jiten: basically - you get _some_ information - but for example, rotating the phone 180 degrees may reduce signal by 50% |
| 15:42.28 | Writchie | Jiten: i recall years ago some discussion about location services oriented profile but I don't think this made to official protocol list. |
| 15:42.56 | Writchie | Jiten: there was also a WAP group involved in this many years ago. |
| 15:43.17 | *** join/#openmoko simon_ (n=simon@w208.wist.uni-linz.ac.at) |
| 15:44.09 | Jiten | SpeedEvil: those effects might actually help more than they hurt the case of figuring out where the source is ... especially if we have accelerometers. |
| 15:44.56 | Jiten | that is, unless they're completely random :) |
| 15:45.13 | ScaredyCat | Jiten: yes |
| 15:45.24 | ScaredyCat | lq == link quality |
| 15:45.39 | ScaredyCat | take a look at asterisks btpd |
| 15:45.50 | SpeedEvil | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Technical:Accelerometer_Fundamentals |
| 15:45.54 | ScaredyCat | should work fine on the neo |
| 15:46.03 | SpeedEvil | you can't get roll about the gravity axis |
| 15:46.14 | SpeedEvil | Jiten : |
| 15:46.31 | ScaredyCat | (sorry scrollback - RE: is it possible to use the bluetooth to find where other bluetooth devices are?) |
| 15:47.25 | *** join/#openmoko zmedico (n=zmedico@ip68-4-152-120.oc.oc.cox.net) |
| 15:48.01 | *** join/#openmoko Stephmw (n=steph@212.69.51.139) |
| 15:51.29 | SpeedEvil | ScaredyCat: was that the beginning of a statement, or a question? |
| 15:52.01 | ScaredyCat | it was the begining of one on Jiten's questions |
| 15:53.04 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Buying_Interest_List]] [[Freshman_todo]] |
| 15:53.41 | *** join/#openmoko ccube (n=ccube@87.230.22.107) |
| 15:53.50 | *** join/#openmoko buz (n=buz@84-73-66-71.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 16:01.59 | Jiten | SpeedEvil: ok, looks like the accelerometers will be fairly useless. |
| 16:02.16 | Jiten | for pretty much anything I was thinking about. |
| 16:04.33 | DPThought | Jiten: why that? What could you get more than three axis? |
| 16:04.59 | DPThought | a gyro would be more fun. But pricy... |
| 16:05.01 | Jiten | well, I was mostly thinking of user interface stuff. |
| 16:05.05 | SpeedEvil | Unfortunately, you need maybe 3 orders of magnitude better to get to inertial stuff. |
| 16:05.17 | SpeedEvil | You can basically tell accurately where 'down' is. |
| 16:05.20 | CIA-23 | openmoko: 03andrew * r2923 10/trunk/src/host/qemu-neo1973/ (monitor.c readline.c vl.h): An old patch for persistent monitor commands history. |
| 16:05.24 | SpeedEvil | this means that you can do accurate tilting. |
| 16:05.36 | DPThought | ah, ok |
| 16:05.48 | SpeedEvil | But little more. |
| 16:06.08 | DPThought | As long as i can reject calls by shaking the phone and accept with tapping it... |
| 16:06.28 | Jiten | I was thinking about using the accelerometers for sliding viewport over a large virtual space with applications but ... it seems they're way too inaccurate to be useful |
| 16:06.37 | SpeedEvil | Unfortunately, yes. |
| 16:06.53 | *** join/#openmoko Sup3rkiddo (n=sudharsh@unaffiliated/sudharsh) |
| 16:07.41 | DPThought | i don't thing this would be really ergonomic anyway. Sorry for my pessimism. |
| 16:07.57 | ScaredyCat | mickeyl: who looks after buildhost? |
| 16:09.21 | Jiten | also, I was thinking of some input methods where you'd move the phone around with some gesture system but if the noise is that bad ... that's also toast. |
| 16:09.49 | ScaredyCat | you could reject the call by throwing it at a wall |
| 16:10.11 | DPThought | lol |
| 16:10.12 | cb22_ | ScaredyCat, nice thinking |
| 16:10.27 | cb22 | lets hope the accelorometers can pick *that* up |
| 16:10.32 | DPThought | dice games would be fun too :) |
| 16:10.42 | cjb_ie | i actually did that with my p910i, and broke the screen :( |
| 16:10.52 | Jiten | however, the touchscreen input methods are looking more promising than I thought they would be :) |
| 16:10.54 | ScaredyCat | best thing for it cjb_ie |
| 16:11.19 | cjb_ie | ScaredyCat: actually, i spent the 50 eur or so on a new screen |
| 16:11.32 | cb22 | are all accelerometers like this, or are the neo ones just bad? |
| 16:11.34 | *** join/#openmoko zipola (n=zipola@zip.kortex.jyu.fi) |
| 16:11.34 | *** join/#openmoko borg__ (n=olaf@80.149.17.21) |
| 16:11.38 | ScaredyCat | you should have given me 50 euro for my p910i |
| 16:11.57 | ScaredyCat | was that db extract any use btw? |
| 16:11.58 | SpeedEvil | cb22: two things. |
| 16:12.00 | DPThought | or tamagotchis. (Plaease beat me hard!) |
| 16:12.33 | SpeedEvil | cb22: the accelerometers that have been mentioned in the mailing list are especially bad - some 16* worse than best available. |
| 16:12.51 | DPThought | is the WiiMote better? |
| 16:13.01 | SpeedEvil | cb22: but in the under $1000 or so price-range - the ones in the wiimote are about the best |
| 16:13.09 | SpeedEvil | you may get about a factor of 2 better |
| 16:13.14 | cb22 | hmm |
| 16:13.15 | SpeedEvil | but not more. |
| 16:13.35 | ScaredyCat | so if i pretend to play tennis it'll be ok ;) |
| 16:13.45 | cb22 | i dont suppose they have a standard interface :) |
| 16:14.10 | SpeedEvil | no |
| 16:14.34 | SpeedEvil | Either analog, or digital |
| 16:14.49 | cb22 | boo... so there will be no ripping apart wiimotes? |
| 16:14.53 | DPThought | never seen any with digital out |
| 16:15.07 | SpeedEvil | there are digital out ones. |
| 16:15.18 | DPThought | cb22: you can connect a wiimote via bluetooth if you need it ;) |
| 16:15.20 | SpeedEvil | The wiimote one is widely available at $5-7 |
| 16:15.35 | *** join/#openmoko jipi (n=jipi@bb121-7-50-32.singnet.com.sg) |
| 16:15.49 | Jiten | why not use the wiimote ones? too proprietary? |
| 16:15.59 | cb22 | DPThought, heh, but unless it supports > 1 bt connection, then what will i do with my bluetooth keyboard :p |
| 16:16.04 | cb22 | or is it < 1 |
| 16:16.18 | *** join/#openmoko tnb (n=tnb@sdgsystems.net) |
| 16:16.22 | DPThought | SpeedEvil: the wiimote chip is ditigal? |
| 16:16.55 | DPThought | that would be nice. Im planning (or dreaming) to do some inertial navigation on a mini sub... |
| 16:17.50 | SpeedEvil | No, it's analog. |
| 16:18.02 | SpeedEvil | DPThought: see the above page - http://pastebin.com/m4c2cf02f |
| 16:18.04 | SpeedEvil | oops |
| 16:18.13 | SpeedEvil | the link to the wiki |
| 16:18.20 | daxxar | DPThought: DP as in Double Penetration? :o |
| 16:18.23 | SpeedEvil | basically - it's almost useless - at best it gives you tilt |
| 16:18.48 | SpeedEvil | after 1 min, you have 1m/s or so velocity uncertainy |
| 16:19.01 | SpeedEvil | you really need a couple of gyros. |
| 16:19.05 | cb22 | will it be able to register sharp 'jerks'? |
| 16:19.06 | SpeedEvil | See sparkfun.org |
| 16:19.12 | SpeedEvil | yes. |
| 16:19.18 | SpeedEvil | See sparkfun.com |
| 16:19.24 | *** join/#openmoko PBeck_ (n=PBeck@HSI-KBW-091-089-102-236.hsi2.kabelbw.de) |
| 16:19.28 | *** join/#openmoko ossman_ (n=drzeus@gateway.drzeus.cx) |
| 16:19.31 | cb22 | so i could move my hand rapidly to the right and have it do x? |
| 16:19.34 | DPThought | cb22: i never understood if that is possible. But i have seen computers with mouse and keyboard via bluetooth. So i probably just misunderstood the whole multiple connection stuff with bluetooth... |
| 16:19.54 | cb22 | DPThought, it is possible, my laptop does it and my ipaq too. |
| 16:20.02 | DPThought | SpeedEvil: oh, thx. the wii chip is analog. |
| 16:20.20 | SpeedEvil | the links on that page above also show links |
| 16:20.25 | SpeedEvil | to digital ones |
| 16:20.39 | DPThought | ah, ok |
| 16:22.54 | *** join/#openmoko holymoly (n=new@mail.wjsgroup.com) |
| 16:26.19 | *** join/#openmoko yacc (n=andreas@gateway1.tpn.ch) |
| 16:30.27 | *** join/#openmoko sssSCH (n=ssssch@77.116.77.227) |
| 16:33.58 | *** join/#openmoko bedboi (n=8118f8a5@xen.linuxtrent.it) |
| 16:34.08 | bedboi | hi there. |
| 16:34.17 | *** join/#openmoko jpozlovsky (n=jindra@98.176.broadband4.iol.cz) |
| 16:35.20 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@139.80-202-160.nextgentel.com) |
| 16:36.11 | *** join/#openmoko alex-weej (n=alex@cpc2-darl3-0-0-cust237.midd.cable.ntl.com) |
| 16:37.00 | *** join/#openmoko j_ack (n=j_ack@p508D81E2.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 16:37.25 | *** join/#openmoko hhf423 (n=user@tmo-108-1.customers.d1-online.com) |
| 16:37.43 | hhf423 | moin |
| 16:38.12 | SpeedEvil | Due to? |
| 16:38.20 | hhf423 | i just did ipkg update |
| 16:38.59 | hhf423 | the matchbox session file was overwritten without question |
| 16:39.43 | hhf423 | now mrxvt does no longer autostart an my neo is practically useless |
| 16:40.18 | hhf423 | because the return key in the new terminal does not work |
| 16:40.29 | ferric | bloody hell! |
| 16:40.36 | *** join/#openmoko dcordes (n=tsingtao@f048000075.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 16:40.40 | hhf423 | and input manager refuses to start |
| 16:41.37 | hhf423 | and as i can not ssh into the neo because i am on vacation with no pc thats it now |
| 16:41.41 | ScaredyCat | hhf423: the input manager is starting... you probably have 20000 of them |
| 16:41.50 | ScaredyCat | it doesn;t show the icon :( |
| 16:42.00 | ScaredyCat | unless you install matchbox-keyboard-applet |
| 16:42.18 | hhf423 | ah, but no icon no selection |
| 16:42.23 | ScaredyCat | yes |
| 16:42.36 | ScaredyCat | but it should auto popup |
| 16:43.06 | ScaredyCat | but you'reright mrxvt is broken |
| 16:43.21 | hhf423 | i can not install nothing because the return key of the new keyboard does not work |
| 16:43.54 | *** join/#openmoko miip__ (n=miip@p54A55C78.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 16:43.57 | ScaredyCat | and of course for some reason they removed the app manager applet |
| 16:44.03 | hhf423 | only the new keyboard does autopopup |
| 16:44.41 | ScaredyCat | can't you ssh in from your 770 ? |
| 16:45.19 | hhf423 | so unless i can get input manager (old keyboard) or the return key to work, i am done |
| 16:46.27 | *** join/#openmoko wansti (n=wansti@a064.apm.etc.tu-bs.de) |
| 16:46.27 | hhf423 | ScaredyCat: i can not as the neo does not host a NAP by default |
| 16:47.07 | *** join/#openmoko LaF0rge (n=laforge@122-124-64-240.dynamic.hinet.net) |
| 16:47.17 | ScaredyCat | that'll teach you to go on holiday without a laptop |
| 16:47.40 | hhf423 | why the bloody hell does the return key not work? |
| 16:47.47 | ScaredyCat | aliens |
| 16:47.47 | cb22 | hhf423, it was probably sabotage by your wife / girlfriend :) |
| 16:48.01 | bedboi | hhf423: i guess you are on vacation with your wife/girlfrend |
| 16:48.03 | bedboi | ahahah |
| 16:48.11 | bedboi | cb22: AHAHA |
| 16:48.39 | bedboi | wife/girlfriends are always the same in all the countries |
| 16:48.55 | hhf423 | bedboi: sure ;-) she'll probably like the turn |
| 16:48.59 | ScaredyCat | s/wife\/girlrfriend/mythical\ wife\/gilfriend/ |
| 16:49.25 | SpeedEvil | If your girlfriend divides your wife, what do you do with the body? |
| 16:49.39 | polz | hhf423: install the .. what was that lib.. vtc or something |
| 16:49.39 | ScaredyCat | cook it? |
| 16:49.40 | *** join/#openmoko sssSCH (n=ssssch@77.116.77.227) |
| 16:50.14 | polz | the new terminal should depend on it (but doesn't) |
| 16:50.23 | hhf423 | polz: how can i install anything if i have no return key? |
| 16:50.46 | *** join/#openmoko heikkit (n=chatzill@c-67-188-122-139.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 16:50.46 | polz | how are you able to access the net ? |
| 16:50.47 | cb22 | IE, you cant press enter |
| 16:51.17 | ScaredyCat | hhf423: use ctrl M |
| 16:51.25 | polz | cb22: I think the new terminal doesn't really work at all unless you install some lib |
| 16:51.30 | hhf423 | cb22: pressing the enter key on the new keyboard gives nothing |
| 16:51.43 | *** join/#openmoko freelock (n=john@74.95.125.46) |
| 16:51.43 | SpeedEvil | can you copy/paste? |
| 16:51.46 | hhf423 | aaaaaah! |
| 16:51.51 | polz | and it appears as if "return" doesn't work |
| 16:51.56 | cb22 | ctl-m works? |
| 16:52.02 | ScaredyCat | yes |
| 16:52.08 | hhf423 | ScaredyCat: youre the man! |
| 16:52.08 | cb22 | nifty |
| 16:52.23 | hhf423 | ctrl m works |
| 16:52.31 | hhf423 | brilliant! |
| 16:53.23 | polz | you need to install vte, AFAIK |
| 16:54.06 | hhf423 | vte? ipkg install vte? |
| 16:54.42 | hhf423 | any alternative for backspace ? does also not work |
| 16:55.19 | ScaredyCat | ctrl h ? |
| 16:56.03 | *** join/#openmoko Sufflope (n=Sufflope@crj95-3-82-237-151-219.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 16:56.15 | hhf423 | right |
| 16:56.49 | hhf423 | ah, backspace works, it just does not show property |
| 16:59.41 | ScaredyCat | so why was vte removed from standard images? |
| 16:59.45 | hhf423 | can the terminal emulation be fixed? at the moment its broken |
| 17:01.23 | hhf423 | installing vte fixes it? |
| 17:01.40 | polz | hhf423: it did for me |
| 17:02.00 | hhf423 | ok, let me try that |
| 17:02.03 | bedboi | it is really unbelievable that gtk file chooser widget is still that slow in 2007 |
| 17:02.04 | hhf423 | brb |
| 17:02.09 | *** part/#openmoko hhf423 (n=user@tmo-108-1.customers.d1-online.com) |
| 17:04.07 | bedboi | i don't see any reasons about not spawning a thread which reads the directory and as long as the files are read displaying them |
| 17:04.16 | bedboi | as qt guys done |
| 17:04.21 | *** join/#openmoko some1_ (n=some1@p54A0FA2A.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 17:04.25 | bedboi | it's really too annoying |
| 17:05.30 | *** join/#openmoko yacc (n=andreas@62-2-90-134.static.cablecom.ch) |
| 17:07.22 | *** join/#openmoko Philippe (n=fille@a91-153-17-113.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
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| 17:09.16 | *** join/#openmoko webar7 (n=webart@198.62.158.205) |
| 17:09.23 | webar7 | seen sean |
| 17:09.40 | *** join/#openmoko Pupeno_ (n=Pupeno@193.120.148.177) |
| 17:10.02 | *** join/#openmoko Vanasarn (n=Tommy@d83-183-27-4.cust.tele2.se) |
| 17:10.16 | *** join/#openmoko greghunt (n=greg@87-194-105-11.bethere.co.uk) |
| 17:12.10 | *** join/#openmoko pH5 (n=ph5@e178237018.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 17:12.57 | *** join/#openmoko philippe_work (n=fille@a91-153-17-113.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 17:14.39 | stefan_schmidt | pH5: Hi. You have seen the commits about qvga stuff in OE and OM? Still work to do, but with the right PPI and the other stuff it looks not that bad. |
| 17:15.23 | *** join/#openmoko hhf424 (n=user@tmo-108-1.customers.d1-online.com) |
| 17:15.37 | hhf424 | re |
| 17:16.03 | hhf424 | ipkg install vte does not work for me |
| 17:16.20 | hhf424 | is theg name correct ? |
| 17:16.21 | aloril | hhf424: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1, SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) (Hopefully these links answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) |
| 17:16.38 | ScaredyCat | hhf424: update from my repo |
| 17:16.48 | ScaredyCat | or install it from |
| 17:17.00 | pH5 | stefan_schmidt: yes, I've seen them. still need to try them though |
| 17:17.15 | polz | hhf424: yes. |
| 17:17.20 | *** join/#openmoko kayon (n=kayon@124-168-193-160.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 17:17.21 | polz | hhf424: does "ls" work ? |
| 17:17.29 | hhf424 | ScaredyCat: i did that, your repo is in my setup |
| 17:17.42 | ScaredyCat | that's what i used to update mine |
| 17:17.56 | polz | ScaredyCat: what should I read to learn how to set up a repo of my very own ? |
| 17:18.11 | ScaredyCat | errm... there's nothing.. |
| 17:18.46 | *** join/#openmoko marsan (n=marsan@ti500720a080-2485.bb.online.no) |
| 17:18.53 | ScaredyCat | well, other than needing a webserver |
| 17:18.57 | hhf424 | polz: i think, but let me try. just rebooting |
| 17:19.04 | polz | OK, assuming I've set up a local overlay as specified on http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Application_Development_Crash_Course |
| 17:19.07 | ScaredyCat | and copying the packages dir |
| 17:19.14 | polz | where do I find the ipkgs ? |
| 17:19.20 | *** join/#openmoko geaaru_ (n=geaaru@host139-22-dynamic.21-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 17:19.35 | ScaredyCat | build/tmp/deploy/..../ipk |
| 17:20.04 | ScaredyCat | build/tmp/deploy/glibc/ipk/ |
| 17:20.10 | hhf424 | polz: ls works |
| 17:20.52 | CIA-23 | openmoko: 03laforge * r2924 10/trunk/src/target/kernel/patches/pcf50633.patch: |
| 17:20.52 | CIA-23 | openmoko: work around what seems like a PCF50633 bug: If we ever set the duty cycle |
| 17:20.52 | CIA-23 | openmoko: of the backlight LED PWM to '0', we need to first switch off the entire LED |
| 17:20.52 | CIA-23 | openmoko: boost converter, and then re-enable it to get any output voltage again. |
| 17:20.55 | polz | ScaredyCat: 10x. |
| 17:21.08 | ScaredyCat | 10x? |
| 17:21.29 | polz | thanks, as in thank you. |
| 17:21.48 | ScaredyCat | ok.. lol - doh |
| 17:21.53 | polz | 10x -> ten X -> thanks. |
| 17:22.27 | hhf424 | funny, if i do a ipkg list | grep vte it is there |
| 17:23.09 | hhf424 | so why can i not install? |
| 17:23.24 | polz | how about libvte9 _ |
| 17:23.26 | polz | ? |
| 17:23.51 | hhf424 | polz: also there |
| 17:23.55 | florian | bbl |
| 17:23.59 | polz | can you install it ? |
| 17:24.12 | hhf424 | let me try |
| 17:24.15 | hhf424 | brb |
| 17:24.17 | *** part/#openmoko hhf424 (n=user@tmo-108-1.customers.d1-online.com) |
| 17:24.36 | polz | btw, is the screen on the neo1973 really supposed to be transflective ? |
| 17:24.53 | polz | because... well... in the sun, I can't see a thing on the screen |
| 17:25.10 | *** join/#openmoko SiO2 (n=sarge@p54B3A418.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 17:25.30 | ScaredyCat | root@fic-gta01:~$ |
| 17:25.30 | ScaredyCat | root@fic-gta01:~$ ipkg install vte |
| 17:25.30 | ScaredyCat | Installing vte (0.16.8-r2) to root... |
| 17:25.30 | ScaredyCat | Downloading http://buildhost.automated.it/OM2007.2/packages/armv4t/vte_0.16.8-r2_armv4t.ipk |
| 17:25.30 | ScaredyCat | Configuring vte |
| 17:25.30 | ScaredyCat | root@fic-gta01:~$ |
| 17:26.53 | pH5 | stefan_schmidt: I read in the backlogs yesterday you'll be at OEDEM? |
| 17:29.14 | *** part/#openmoko SiO2 (n=sarge@p54B3A418.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 17:29.50 | *** join/#openmoko conley (n=ibcliffo@spode.cs.vt.edu) |
| 17:30.47 | *** join/#openmoko DukeOfURL (n=chatzill@introspect.com) |
| 17:30.50 | conley | Hey, everyone. Sorry if you get this question a lot. The wiki says "DO NOT expect to be able to use it as an everyday phone until October 2007 at the soonest, and probably later." What is the real date looking like? |
| 17:31.15 | thomasg | mickeyl, here? |
| 17:31.21 | *** join/#openmoko cb22 (n=cb22@dsl-245-145-221.telkomadsl.co.za) |
| 17:31.38 | polz | conley: ask a crystal ball |
| 17:32.43 | conley | polz: I did, it's not responding |
| 17:32.46 | *** join/#openmoko poffy (n=poffy@c-76-30-222-129.hsd1.tx.comcast.net) |
| 17:33.36 | polz | conley: probably it's not even human, it does not feel pain, it can't be reasoned with ! |
| 17:33.52 | conley | Yea, I didn't expect a real answer. I know how development is. When you have 90% of the work done, you still have 90% left to do |
| 17:34.10 | polz | conley: but seriously, if you don't have a phone, buy something cheap and wait until GTA02 comes out |
| 17:34.19 | polz | or perhaps even until GTA03 |
| 17:34.44 | conley | Is that a release? |
| 17:35.17 | polz | GTA02 is going to be the next hardware revision |
| 17:35.28 | *** join/#openmoko pavelm (n=pavel@gprs189-60.eurotel.cz) |
| 17:35.36 | conley | ah, ok |
| 17:35.37 | CIA-23 | openmoko: 03laforge * r2925 10/trunk/src/target/u-boot/patches/ (ext2load_hex.patch series): remove ext2load_hex.patch. this information is stored in the filesize environment variable anyway |
| 17:35.51 | conley | I didn't realize the hardware was not finalized |
| 17:35.55 | polz | and I'm guessing GTA03 is going to appear about 6 months later (but you have to remember I'm purely guessing, I have no relation to the company whatsoever) |
| 17:36.07 | CIA-23 | openmoko: 03laforge * r2926 10/trunk/src/target/u-boot/patches/uboot-cmd_s3c2410.patch: the command is called s3c24xx, not s3c24x0 |
| 17:36.15 | polz | conley: they're working on the prototypes for the 2. revision |
| 17:36.30 | CIA-23 | openmoko: 03laforge * r2927 10/trunk/src/target/u-boot/patches/uboot-serial_terminal.patch: add serial terminal CMD constant to list of all CMD's |
| 17:36.37 | polz | conley: the current hardware works, but it doesn't have WiFi or the accelerometers |
| 17:37.06 | polz | and the CPU is a bit slow, and there's no graphic accelerator |
| 17:37.12 | CIA-23 | openmoko: 03laforge * r2928 10/trunk/src/target/u-boot/patches/ (uboot-s3c2410-nand.patch uboot-s3c2440.patch): remove commented-out old code from s3c24xx nand driver |
| 17:37.15 | conley | ok,...I think I'm going to break down and get a cellphone then...I've gone without for a long time. Even as evil as cell phone companies are, I really need one. |
| 17:37.24 | pavelm | Hello, everyone |
| 17:37.37 | polz | conley: buy a used one |
| 17:37.49 | pavelm | I'm about to play with gsmd... SMS support is must-have for me. |
| 17:37.49 | polz | conley: or ask a friend if they can spare one to tide you over |
| 17:37.50 | CIA-23 | openmoko: 03laforge * r2929 10/trunk/src/target/u-boot/patches/ (neo1973-gsmver.patch series): add command to read out gsm firmware version using u-boot (jserv) |
| 17:37.59 | conley | polz: I was thinking about just getting whatever the place gave me |
| 17:38.04 | conley | I wasn't getting a nice one |
| 17:38.08 | polz | pavelm: I thought gsmd supported SMS send/recv |
| 17:38.08 | pavelm | Is there already agreed-on protocol for SMSes between gsmd and rest of the system? |
| 17:38.19 | conley | Is there a *good* service provider? |
| 17:38.20 | polz | pavelm: and all that was missing was a GUI |
| 17:38.30 | pavelm | polz: does it work for you? |
| 17:38.41 | polz | pavelm: I don't dare receive them :P |
| 17:38.58 | polz | but listing the pending SMSs seems to work :) |
| 17:39.03 | pavelm | polz: Good, that should make situation easier. |
| 17:39.23 | pavelm | polz: fortunately receiving SMS is free around here. |
| 17:39.31 | pavelm | polz: try to do it few times :-) |
| 17:40.16 | pavelm | polz: so applications are expected to do PDU decoding? |
| 17:41.04 | polz | pavelm: here, it's definetly not free |
| 17:41.39 | *** join/#openmoko tomjoad4400 (n=tomjoad4@adsl-70-130-142-88.dsl.stlsmo.swbell.net) |
| 17:41.41 | polz | conley: only if they're your employer - the rest are blood-sucking leeches, regardless of the part of the world you're living in ;) |
| 17:42.02 | polz | pavelm: I really don't know |
| 17:42.17 | conley | polz: ugh... |
| 17:42.33 | stefan_schmidt | pH5: Very likely yes. I was able to schedule other trips around it. |
| 17:45.03 | pH5 | stefan_schmidt: great |
| 17:45.05 | *** join/#openmoko rmoravcik (n=rmoravci@ip-89-103-152-149.karneval.cz) |
| 17:45.54 | stefan_schmidt | pH5: Not sure if we will take all days, but we should have some time for hacking |
| 17:45.57 | *** join/#openmoko yacc (n=andreas@62-2-90-134.static.cablecom.ch) |
| 17:48.06 | *** join/#openmoko poffy_ (n=poffy@c-76-30-222-129.hsd1.tx.comcast.net) |
| 17:48.34 | *** join/#openmoko orpheus (n=scott@lawn-128-61-17-90.lawn.gatech.edu) |
| 17:49.15 | pavelm | polz: you pay for receiving sms? that's backwards... |
| 17:49.32 | *** join/#openmoko burton__ (n=burt0n`@ASte-Genev-Bois-152-1-82-69.w86-218.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 17:50.26 | polz | pavelm: you pay to send them |
| 17:50.43 | *** join/#openmoko TimRiker (n=timr@72.11.78.6) |
| 17:50.46 | polz | pavelm: but I'm afraid to read the ones I have because they might just get lost |
| 17:51.25 | polz | argh. |
| 17:51.29 | pavelm | polz: ok, so I have exactly same problem here. |
| 17:51.40 | polz | /etc/init.d/gsmd restart now causes a hard lock |
| 17:51.43 | pavelm | polz: I guess I should just get a scratch sim card. |
| 17:51.44 | *** join/#openmoko switch3r (n=switch3r@128.8.37.122) |
| 17:53.24 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Technical:Accelerometer_Fundamentals]] |
| 17:56.32 | thomasg | openembedded seems to use system-libs for some of the *-native packages. is there a way to make sure, that OE uses only it's own libs and no system libs at all? |
| 17:58.46 | Elrond | pavelm - Hi! :-) |
| 17:59.25 | pavelm | Hi, elrond! |
| 17:59.40 | pavelm | ...I'm now actually using openmoko as my gsps... with maps, too :) |
| 18:00.05 | Elrond | pavelm - Ohh? What maps? |
| 18:00.15 | Elrond | pavelm - So you still use oabi? |
| 18:00.18 | pavelm | self-calibrated images from the net. |
| 18:00.34 | *** join/#openmoko emdete (n=mdt@ip75.3.1411K-CUD12K-01.ish.de) |
| 18:00.35 | pavelm | yep, I think so. |
| 18:01.14 | pavelm | ...would like to get openstreetmap maps to work, and it should not be that hard, but I guess SMSes are more urgent now. |
| 18:01.46 | Elrond | hehe, yeah. |
| 18:02.13 | polz | pavelm: how did you manage to get the position ? |
| 18:02.26 | pavelm | polz: gllin binary. |
| 18:02.35 | polz | where do I get that ? |
| 18:02.49 | polz | forget it, I can read the wiki |
| 18:02.51 | Elrond | polz - You need a oabi chroot to use it. |
| 18:03.12 | pavelm | polz: good question ;-). Ask anyone who got original phase1 openmoko. |
| 18:03.24 | pavelm | elrond: did you get chroot to work? |
| 18:03.29 | pavelm | ..how big is it? |
| 18:03.43 | Elrond | pavelm - Well... I'm on strike due to this mess. ;o) |
| 18:04.19 | pavelm | Ok, does that mean that update to 2007.02 is not _that_ cool idea |
| 18:04.24 | pavelm | ? |
| 18:04.29 | Elrond | pavelm - Yesterday I thought to "come back", but then buildhost.openmoko.org did not have anything to download. ;o) |
| 18:04.47 | pavelm | :-) |
| 18:04.59 | Elrond | pavelm - If you want to use gllin: Bad idea. Unless you intend to work on the chroot. |
| 18:05.10 | polz | note to self: do not remove the battery while the phone is connected to USB |
| 18:05.12 | pavelm | THere seems to be new secret place for new images. It is on "flashing openmoko" page. |
| 18:06.28 | pavelm | elrond: Hmm, I need new images for fixed microSD support, and at the same time I'll oose gps that way. |
| 18:06.52 | pavelm | ...I guess it will be "one openmoko for mp3 player, second for gps"... |
| 18:06.58 | Elrond | pavelm - Fixed microsd: You can use the new kernwls and modules on the old images. |
| 18:07.44 | pavelm | elrond: Yep, I could do that. |
| 18:08.51 | Elrond | pavelm - Last time I wanted to "stop my strike", I considered upgrading the kernel/modules. Then I heard, that serial stuff was b0rked in the kernel. ;o) (hopefully fixed by now) |
| 18:10.06 | *** join/#openmoko C7 (n=C7@77-56-188-232.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 18:10.06 | *** join/#openmoko C7_ (n=C7@77-56-188-232.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 18:11.00 | Elrond | Ahh, seems ficed, it seems. |
| 18:11.02 | *** join/#openmoko buz (n=buz@84-73-66-71.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 18:11.13 | Elrond | http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=256#c21 |
| 18:11.47 | pavelm | I must say games on 2007.2 image are addictive :-) |
| 18:11.47 | *** join/#openmoko hanicker (n=Nicola@217.202.208.250) |
| 18:12.47 | *** join/#openmoko Henrikw (n=henrik@51.84-48-54.nextgentel.com) |
| 18:14.11 | *** join/#openmoko hhf423 (n=user@tmo-110-1.customers.d1-online.com) |
| 18:14.24 | hhf423 | re |
| 18:14.49 | pavelm | hmm... libgsmd-tool -m shell, sl. segfault |
| 18:15.18 | hhf423 | ScaredyCat: how do i tell ipkg to install from your repo, do you know? |
| 18:15.55 | synalx | hi openmoko people! |
| 18:16.59 | *** join/#openmoko calamous (n=harry@144.89.184.62) |
| 18:17.15 | Elrond | Hi synalx |
| 18:17.23 | pavelm | what is needed to make gsmd talk to me? |
| 18:17.42 | pavelm | it does not react even to simple commands such as Q.... does it have something to do with simcard being inactive? |
| 18:17.44 | synalx | is there anything special i need to do to get a dev environment set up on amd64? |
| 18:17.46 | Elrond | pavelm - On 2007.2? |
| 18:18.35 | CM | synalx: Nope, I suggest you start following this: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/MokoMakefile |
| 18:18.45 | pavelm | elrond: yep, on 2007.2. |
| 18:19.13 | Elrond | pavelm - See the bug-url I posted a few minutes ago: http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=256#c21 |
| 18:19.14 | pavelm | ...libgsmd-tool seems to be enhanced, so it probably makes no sense to test with older gsmd. |
| 18:19.16 | Elrond | pavelm - Maybe it helps. |
| 18:19.21 | synalx | CM: okay :D |
| 18:19.25 | synalx | i'm so excited about this project |
| 18:19.30 | CM | synalx: There's an issue with binutils-cross in oe right now, but they're working on it atm |
| 18:19.31 | *** join/#openmoko disguy__22 (i=disguy__@gateway/tor/x-3d0a9e8a5c2773c0) |
| 18:19.44 | CM | Besides that, 64bit works well |
| 18:20.17 | pavelm | elrond: aha, so 2007.2 was released with broken gsmd? wow. |
| 18:20.39 | *** join/#openmoko Tv (n=tv@71-95-177-182.static.mtpk.ca.charter.com) |
| 18:20.48 | CM | pavelm: I'm using a newer image (scaredy cats) from sunday, and it's the first one where I've been able to call with 2007.2 |
| 18:21.00 | CM | Directly with the dialer that is |
| 18:21.12 | *** join/#openmoko joao (n=joao@35-165.5-85.cust.bluewin.ch) |
| 18:21.13 | hhf423 | pavelm: yes, gsmd is still broken most of the time, but not always |
| 18:21.36 | synalx | CM: i think last time i tried this, i ran into problems because psycho is maked in portage for amd64 |
| 18:21.47 | hhf423 | also see phase 1 software testing in the wiki |
| 18:21.59 | CM | synalx: You don't need psycho, it doesn't work in 64-bit |
| 18:22.08 | synalx | ah okay |
| 18:22.10 | pavelm | CM: do you have url for the newer image? |
| 18:22.17 | pavelm | ...I guess I should just be using latest... |
| 18:22.18 | *** part/#openmoko hanicker (n=Nicola@217.202.208.250) |
| 18:22.21 | synalx | it's listed in the OpenEmbedded setup instructions |
| 18:22.46 | *** join/#openmoko doc|work (n=doc@gentoo/contributor/doc-007) |
| 18:22.58 | doc|work | hmmm, iphone price drop |
| 18:22.59 | CM | pavelm: No, the latest one is messed up again |
| 18:23.04 | MetaMorfoziS | what is the name of the city in china |
| 18:23.06 | doc|work | 8gb for $399 |
| 18:23.12 | MetaMorfoziS | where neo's manufactured? |
| 18:23.15 | CM | pavelm: I have these ones on my neo right now: http://claesmogren.com/~cm/neo/2007.2/ |
| 18:23.40 | CM | pavelm: They are bigger because ScaredyCat added scummvm to it, and some other things I think |
| 18:23.56 | doc|work | anyone think fic will counter that? |
| 18:24.06 | synalx | doubt it |
| 18:24.42 | CM | pavelm: But you'll have to find Monkey Island on your own.. ;) |
| 18:24.43 | hhf423 | doc|work: how much price drop? |
| 18:25.27 | doc|work | hhf423: $200 |
| 18:25.43 | hhf423 | wow, thats significant |
| 18:25.50 | ferric | yeah... |
| 18:25.56 | ferric | fic doesn't really care about apple, though. |
| 18:26.18 | hhf423 | thats a third or so |
| 18:26.55 | MetaMorfoziS | so? where neo manufactured? |
| 18:27.00 | pavelm | well... neo is open, while half a world is working to _make_ iphone open. |
| 18:27.03 | synalx | MetaMorfoziS: mainland china afaik |
| 18:27.09 | MetaMorfoziS | thx |
| 18:27.09 | pavelm | ...or at least unlocked. |
| 18:27.11 | CM | ScaredyCat: Btw, how about cleaning out old or bad builds from http://buildhost.automated.it/OM2007.2/ ? :D |
| 18:27.36 | pavelm | ...but pavelm lives in europe... |
| 18:27.52 | synalx | ah, ~amd64. life on the edge! |
| 18:28.07 | pavelm | Ok, I have to go now, I'll be back in 2 hours or so. |
| 18:28.20 | synalx | so how many people here have P1 hardware? |
| 18:28.21 | pavelm | synalx: try making GPRS/EDGE your only network connection. _That's_ living on edge. |
| 18:28.23 | doc|work | pavelm: sure, I'm willing to cough up, but a lot won't, and it was nice to say "but this phone is $150 less than that crappy iphone". Now the iphone is cheaper than the neo and has 8gb of storage :/ |
| 18:28.37 | synalx | pavelm: haha, i've lived like that for a week |
| 18:28.55 | pavelm | many, I'd say. |
| 18:28.55 | synalx | it was especially fun because technically i *had* no internet plan |
| 18:29.20 | synalx | pavelm: T-Mobile just didn't have their system locked down, so I was able to use my phone as a modem for a while |
| 18:29.23 | synalx | XD |
| 18:29.27 | pavelm | heh, 5 years here |
| 18:29.31 | synalx | wow |
| 18:30.08 | pavelm | doc: iphone cheaper than neo? But that's with "subscribe your soul for paying for two years, right"? |
| 18:30.13 | synalx | yeah |
| 18:30.14 | pavelm | doc: not really fair comparison. |
| 18:30.21 | synalx | of course, all cell phone companies do that really |
| 18:30.34 | synalx | 1 year contract minimum |
| 18:30.36 | CM | synalx: Not in europe |
| 18:30.38 | pavelm | doc: I mean, neo with two years subsciption would be $1 here. |
| 18:30.41 | synalx | CM: ah, true |
| 18:30.45 | synalx | US companies suck |
| 18:30.48 | CM | I've only had unlocked phones, ever |
| 18:31.09 | synalx | CM: it's not really the phones that's the problem |
| 18:31.12 | pavelm | synax: We have prepaid cards here. For $6 or so. |
| 18:31.23 | *** join/#openmoko El_Salvador[Away (n=Brescia@adsl-165-182.38-151.net24.it) |
| 18:31.31 | synalx | CM: contracts and cancellation fees :( |
| 18:31.38 | synalx | pavelm: yeah, i'd read about that |
| 18:31.57 | pavelm | I did have locked phone... for two days :-). $6 or something like that was enough to unlock it. |
| 18:32.03 | synalx | lol |
| 18:32.11 | CM | Hehe |
| 18:32.18 | *** join/#openmoko bkruse (i=bkruse@nat/digium/x-08ec0ece99a4db41) |
| 18:32.28 | synalx | so CM/pavelm do you have a neo? |
| 18:32.35 | CM | yes |
| 18:32.47 | synalx | how is it? :) |
| 18:32.56 | CM | Unfinished.. |
| 18:32.58 | synalx | lol |
| 18:33.03 | CM | But the screen is great! :D |
| 18:33.07 | CM | Slow too |
| 18:33.08 | *** join/#openmoko _rob (n=rob@85.233.59.8.static.cablesurf.de) |
| 18:33.08 | hhf423 | does anyone know how to make ipkg use a specific repository? |
| 18:33.17 | *** join/#openmoko mintee (n=mintee@72-165-177-90.dia.static.qwest.net) |
| 18:33.27 | synalx | what's the plan, to finish the software before the P2 release? |
| 18:33.30 | CM | hhf423: Nope, I've wondered about that too. Was something in the wiki about it that I updated.. |
| 18:33.40 | mintee | Anyone need a neo1973? I think i'm gonna throw mine on ebay... |
| 18:33.50 | CM | synalx: Yes, and P2 was supposed to be in October, but I guess next year is more likely |
| 18:33.54 | doc|work | mintee: not without wifi :/ |
| 18:33.57 | mintee | i'm just really freakin broke |
| 18:33.57 | synalx | CM: :-/ |
| 18:34.08 | mintee | GTA02 isn't due out for months |
| 18:34.15 | pavelm | synalx: Yep, I have neo here. Screen sux. Read my blog for more thinks that suck ;-). |
| 18:34.23 | *** part/#openmoko conley (n=ibcliffo@spode.cs.vt.edu) |
| 18:34.29 | synalx | pavelm: screen sucks because no acceleration? |
| 18:34.43 | CM | pavelm: Well, I live in Sweden and the winter with eternal darknes is on it's way.. |
| 18:34.53 | hhf423 | CM: i thought maybe -f, but that does not seem to work |
| 18:34.57 | CM | Unreadable in sunligt isn't an issue ;) |
| 18:34.58 | *** join/#openmoko jonib1 (n=jonas@ua-83-227-144-18.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se) |
| 18:35.04 | *** join/#openmoko Eludias (n=eludias@wingding.demon.nl) |
| 18:35.09 | pavelm | screen sucks because of flicker and poor readability in daylight. |
| 18:35.26 | CM | pavelm: I haven't had any flicker on mine. When does it happen? |
| 18:35.38 | pavelm | CM: Ok, so neo will rock in Sweden for half a year :-) |
| 18:36.02 | CM | Yes, the other half it's all sunshine and partying, so no need to look at the Neo ;) |
| 18:36.07 | pavelm | CM: always. It is more visible when cpu is loaded. |
| 18:36.09 | hhf423 | sweden is nice |
| 18:36.21 | pavelm | CM: maybe my two neos are defective. |
| 18:36.39 | CM | pavelm: That sucks. You have a gta01v3 or v4? |
| 18:36.55 | pavelm | ok, I really have to go. |
| 18:36.56 | synalx | i wonder if FIC will release GTA02 before the software is finished, so devs can play with it |
| 18:36.59 | CM | later |
| 18:37.11 | pavelm | cm: both |
| 18:37.16 | hhf423 | but never ask a swede for a deadline. sweds don't have a concept of deadlines |
| 18:37.30 | CM | hhf423: I'll get back to you on that! :P |
| 18:37.37 | pavelm | cm: If you do not see a flicker, it is not a problem, and it is really usable. But I see flicker clearly when I look closely. |
| 18:37.39 | hhf423 | hahaha |
| 18:38.14 | *** join/#openmoko morricone (n=foobar@dslb-084-057-159-240.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 18:39.53 | hhf423 | hmm, so i can not install vte because its not on builthost even though ipkg thinks its there. |
| 18:40.23 | hhf423 | probably builthost borked (again) |
| 18:41.05 | synalx | it's quite sad that this will be pushed back into 08 |
| 18:41.12 | synalx | i'd really like to see it make the october release date |
| 18:41.21 | synalx | what's the current hold-up? |
| 18:41.56 | doc|work | synalx: it will? :( |
| 18:41.57 | CM | synalx: Judging from what Harald has said, it's a heap of small delays and a very small staff |
| 18:42.07 | *** join/#openmoko conley (n=ibcliffo@spode.cs.vt.edu) |
| 18:42.11 | doc|work | man, I'd been waiting for the neo :( |
| 18:42.39 | *** part/#openmoko conley (n=ibcliffo@spode.cs.vt.edu) |
| 18:43.42 | doc|work | how do you know there's a delay? there's nothing on announce |
| 18:44.04 | *** join/#openmoko grasu (n=christia@fire2.tngtech.com) |
| 18:44.11 | SpeedEvil | No, there isn't. |
| 18:44.24 | SpeedEvil | There is probably a good reason for this, but nobody can work out what it is. |
| 18:44.51 | *** part/#openmoko mintee (n=mintee@72-165-177-90.dia.static.qwest.net) |
| 18:45.18 | stefan_schmidt | ~pastebin |
| 18:45.18 | apt | from memory, pastebin is a place to paste your stuff without flooding the channel - try http://pastebin.ca, or http://channels.debian.net/paste, or http://rafb.net/paste/, or http://pastebin.com is usually painfully too slow and unresponsive to use, use one of the other pastebin sites, or dpaste.com is a very nice pastebin as well |
| 18:46.19 | doc|work | there's a mention in the wiki of new devices being announced in sept, not sure how accurate that is |
| 18:46.44 | SpeedEvil | The problem again is - no info. |
| 18:47.07 | doc|work | yep |
| 18:47.53 | fgau | SpeedEvil: the problem is OC open communication :) |
| 18:48.03 | SpeedEvil | The general consensus is that October is unlikely for GTA02 - however, there have been a month? ago no comment that it would be delayed. |
| 18:48.49 | synalx | i'd love to get GTA02 hardware even if the software isn't finished |
| 18:49.03 | cb22 | synalx, +1 |
| 18:49.04 | *** join/#openmoko daMaestro (n=jon@fedora/damaestro) |
| 18:49.11 | doc|work | synalx: yep |
| 18:49.51 | doc|work | personally, I'd be happy with working calls, sms, wifi and web browser. |
| 18:49.56 | synalx | haha, same |
| 18:50.13 | doc|work | really, that's the primary reason I'm interested in the thing :) |
| 18:50.51 | *** join/#openmoko spliffy_ (n=spliffy@p54B1C4F1.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 18:51.31 | synalx | what are the current plans for all the cool features you hear people talking about (like the phone automatically turning off if GPS says it's in a movie theater) |
| 18:51.44 | synalx | is that third party stuff or built into openmoko proper? |
| 18:52.59 | CM | SpeedEvil: Had to look around in the logs: http://rafb.net/p/my8tl240.html |
| 18:54.11 | *** join/#openmoko holymoly (n=new@mail.wjsgroup.com) |
| 18:54.11 | synalx | haha |
| 18:54.20 | SpeedEvil | Indeed - however, that's not actually a status report. |
| 18:54.23 | synalx | CM: what day was that? |
| 18:54.28 | *** part/#openmoko sheskar (n=sheskar@ltw.loris.tv) |
| 18:54.37 | CM | synalx: Sunday night, as the title of the paste is ;) |
| 18:54.39 | doc|work | oh bugger |
| 18:54.47 | SpeedEvil | There are at least two models of GTA02, to evaluate several GPS solutions reportedly. |
| 18:54.49 | doc|work | burning pcbs = not inducive to good sales :) |
| 18:55.05 | CM | SpeedEvil: True it's not an official statement, but it sure isn't good either |
| 18:55.14 | *** join/#openmoko heikkit (n=chatzill@c-67-188-122-139.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 18:57.24 | synalx | well, the bright folks at FIC can figure it out |
| 18:57.34 | SpeedEvil | My problem is how the hell do you decide which off-hand comment is current. |
| 18:57.36 | SpeedEvil | http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/community/2007-August/009491.html |
| 18:58.03 | *** join/#openmoko Siliconburner (n=sarge@p54B3A418.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 18:58.22 | CM | SpeedEvil: Or Haralds gloomy log-off message the other day |
| 18:58.45 | CM | Something like "[This is a dark day for the project]" or similar |
| 18:58.55 | SpeedEvil | Indeed. |
| 18:59.21 | SpeedEvil | I mean, is that a random message by his client, or a report that he's going to have to fix the lighting. |
| 19:00.08 | *** join/#openmoko TOS (n=not@38.115.145.100) |
| 19:00.15 | synalx | so will there be any difference, hardware-wise, between GTA02 phase 1 for developers and GTA02 phase 2 mass-market |
| 19:00.18 | synalx | ? |
| 19:01.28 | roh | synalx that should be the plan |
| 19:01.39 | doc|work | I don't think there's to be a gta02 developer phase afaik |
| 19:01.53 | SpeedEvil | Ah - comment from someone with a clue! |
| 19:01.58 | SpeedEvil | Thanks. |
| 19:02.07 | doc|work | me? :) |
| 19:02.23 | SpeedEvil | s/a/at/ |
| 19:02.38 | borg_ | lol |
| 19:02.41 | synalx | :) |
| 19:02.45 | abraxa_ | Genius :) |
| 19:02.54 | hhf423 | haha |
| 19:02.57 | doc|work | er, so, there will be a dev phase? when did that plan come about? |
| 19:03.13 | doc|work | last I heard, gta02 *was* the mass-market |
| 19:03.17 | SpeedEvil | Indeed. |
| 19:03.30 | *** part/#openmoko Siliconburner (n=sarge@p54B3A418.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 19:03.34 | synalx | well, it stands to reason that there will be some dev work with the gta02 hardware |
| 19:03.39 | synalx | ex: wifi network browser |
| 19:03.47 | doc|work | hmmm |
| 19:04.11 | ScaredyCat | lol - if they think for one second I'm buying another dev version they're on acid. |
| 19:04.20 | doc|work | hahaha |
| 19:04.45 | synalx | well |
| 19:04.48 | synalx | the hardware should be fixed |
| 19:04.50 | doc|work | I'd hope they'd freeze the hardware+non-upgradeable firmware at that stage |
| 19:05.02 | synalx | i just mean that the gta02 release date will not be the mass-market release date |
| 19:05.23 | SpeedEvil | Yes, the hardware should be fixed. However we have been told for >5 months that October is mass market release date. |
| 19:05.34 | synalx | true |
| 19:05.40 | synalx | true |
| 19:05.41 | roh | massmarket will be when software is ready. |
| 19:05.42 | borg_ | SpeedEvil: you now the status of the software |
| 19:05.52 | SpeedEvil | Of course. |
| 19:05.57 | synalx | XD |
| 19:05.57 | borg_ | s/now/know/ |
| 19:05.59 | SpeedEvil | I was meaning hardware time. |
| 19:06.07 | *** join/#openmoko Placid (n=placid@unaffiliated/placid) |
| 19:06.07 | hhf423 | ScaredyCat: say, do you know how to make ipkg choose a specific repository? |
| 19:06.22 | SpeedEvil | One line of status per week per dev would resolve all of this. |
| 19:06.34 | synalx | haha |
| 19:06.36 | ScaredyCat | erm.. no... try moving the other conifg files to your ~/ |
| 19:06.42 | ScaredyCat | then ipkg update. |
| 19:06.51 | doc|work | will there be a stable software base for the end of oct? e.g. wifi, browser, sms + calls? |
| 19:06.59 | roh | and hardware. the hardware could be first ad needs to be tested first. thus there will be a period of time before the massmarket release (aka money against hardware) where some people will have a gta02, doing testing. |
| 19:07.02 | synalx | doc|work: likely yes |
| 19:07.03 | mjr | doc|work, bwahahahaha |
| 19:07.12 | doc|work | I mean, it'd be usable at that which you could then build on with updates |
| 19:07.29 | doc|work | mjr: :( |
| 19:07.45 | ScaredyCat | I'd settle for some actual real core development |
| 19:07.53 | hhf423 | ScaredyCat: will try that |
| 19:08.05 | doc|work | most people wouldn't care all that much about gps, accel and the other stuff in the short term. |
| 19:08.28 | ScaredyCat | fewd!!! |
| 19:09.00 | borg_ | ack |
| 19:09.03 | *** join/#openmoko summatusmentis (n=summatus@umm-yrless170.morris.umn.edu) |
| 19:09.18 | roh | the only thing which seems to be confusing for some people is that the coreteam chose to overlap the first and last phase from gta01 and gta02 |
| 19:09.25 | TOS | Right now I would settle for the webkit-gtk to build. |
| 19:09.51 | *** join/#openmoko Benoitb (n=Benoitb@86.66.136.225) |
| 19:10.15 | hhf423 | brb |
| 19:10.17 | *** part/#openmoko hhf423 (n=user@tmo-110-1.customers.d1-online.com) |
| 19:10.22 | synalx | does the OM build really take 11 hours? XD |
| 19:10.22 | doc|work | hhf423: sure, but for the shortterm, it'd be good to get it out as just a phone :) |
| 19:10.48 | *** join/#openmoko waldo323 (n=waldo323@h69-129-95-226.69-129.unk.tds.net) |
| 19:10.59 | TOS | OM took about that time for me to build (before what ever broke in the last update) |
| 19:11.03 | synalx | wow |
| 19:11.14 | synalx | on what spec system? |
| 19:11.51 | synalx | model name : AMD Turion(tm) 64 X2 Mobile Technology TL-50 |
| 19:11.51 | synalx | cpu MHz : 1600.000 |
| 19:11.55 | TOS | Dual Core AMD (I forget the speed) 4Gb RAM and 250Gb Hd on ubuntu |
| 19:12.23 | synalx | fun |
| 19:12.28 | borg_ | synalx: you build a whole distribution |
| 19:12.32 | borg_ | that takes some time |
| 19:12.56 | synalx | yeah |
| 19:12.57 | synalx | i guess |
| 19:13.02 | *** join/#openmoko summatusmentis (n=summatus@umm-yrless170.morris.umn.edu) |
| 19:13.06 | synalx | well, this should be fun :) |
| 19:13.08 | CM | It doesn't build on 64-bit now |
| 19:13.12 | synalx | aww |
| 19:13.29 | CM | binutils-cross is broken |
| 19:13.32 | TOS | It did last week. |
| 19:13.33 | synalx | don't i need a cross-compiler suite set up? or is that only for actual hardware |
| 19:13.53 | CM | TOS: I build successfully this morning, so it happened today |
| 19:14.27 | CM | synalx: It builds everything, since you emulate the neo in qemu if that's what you're going to run. Or do you plan on using Xoo? |
| 19:14.34 | synalx | CM: how soon into the build would i notice a problem |
| 19:14.34 | TOS | I am getting puzzling errors in webkit |
| 19:14.35 | synalx | CM: qemu |
| 19:14.58 | CM | TOS: Webkit compiled for me this morning |
| 19:15.00 | TOS | for me its on step 2728 |
| 19:16.05 | synalx | do i need qemu installed before i initiate the build? |
| 19:16.10 | CM | So far, the standard way to fix build problems have been to restart from scratch, just copying my old local.conf |
| 19:16.14 | *** join/#openmoko tomjoad4500 (n=tomjoad4@adsl-70-130-142-88.dsl.stlsmo.swbell.net) |
| 19:16.22 | TOS | oh fun. |
| 19:16.37 | TOS | I figured that was going to be my resolution |
| 19:16.40 | CM | synalx: No, but you need monotone and sqlite3 and pysqlite2 and the other stuff that the wiki lists |
| 19:16.45 | TOS | I was hoping to avoid it. |
| 19:16.49 | CM | TOS: Just let it build over night |
| 19:17.01 | synalx | i don't see sqlite on there :o |
| 19:17.09 | TOS | Thats what I did last time. |
| 19:17.24 | TOS | synalx: check out http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/MokoMakefile |
| 19:17.36 | TOS | makes life much easier |
| 19:17.39 | synalx | yeah, i'mm using that |
| 19:18.21 | synalx | i didn't see any mention of sqlite in deps though |
| 19:18.54 | CM | synalx: It's a dependancy of bitbake-1.8.x |
| 19:19.02 | CM | I should update that |
| 19:19.19 | synalx | ah okay |
| 19:19.31 | synalx | thanks |
| 19:21.24 | *** join/#openmoko buz (n=buz@84-73-66-71.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 19:21.55 | *** join/#openmoko Risto (n=christop@p508CC699.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 19:25.04 | *** join/#openmoko _kaiser_ (n=kaiser@74-140-168-50.dhcp.insightbb.com) |
| 19:26.02 | *** join/#openmoko punto_de (n=chatzill@adsl190-28-99-156.epm.net.co) |
| 19:26.11 | punto_de | hola |
| 19:26.27 | davprog | hola |
| 19:26.33 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@139.80-202-160.nextgentel.com) |
| 19:28.07 | synalx | boost takes forever to compile |
| 19:28.08 | synalx | XD |
| 19:31.00 | borg_ | wait for webkit |
| 19:32.19 | synalx | lol |
| 19:32.21 | synalx | borg_: what's webkit? |
| 19:32.45 | doc|work | webbrowser |
| 19:33.17 | synalx | openmoko has its own browser? |
| 19:33.57 | *** join/#openmoko parag0n (n=parag0n@cpc2-bagu2-0-0-cust912.bagu.cable.ntl.com) |
| 19:33.59 | pH5 | s/webbrowser/engine/ |
| 19:34.01 | pH5 | http://www.atoker.com/blog/2007/09/05/webkitgtk-at-linuxconf-europe-2007/ |
| 19:34.40 | doc|work | sorry, yeah |
| 19:37.45 | synalx | do i need qemu installed for this? |
| 19:37.50 | *** join/#openmoko behdad (i=behdad@nat/redhat-ca/x-0147a49fa07a9ed1) |
| 19:40.19 | synalx | probably not |
| 19:40.31 | *** join/#openmoko Pupeno_ (n=Pupeno@89-125-144-76.dhcp-ripwave.irishbroadband.ie) |
| 19:42.53 | *** join/#openmoko Kakooch (n=Kaveh@85.15.25.172) |
| 19:45.06 | CM | synalx: You can speed up building glibc by specifying the locales you want, or disable them completely: http://claesmogren.com/~cm/neo/local.conf |
| 19:45.12 | Elrond | Hi pH5! :-) |
| 19:45.33 | CM | synalx: Either of the bottom rows. rm_work makes the build take about 2gb instead of 14 gb. |
| 19:45.57 | CM | synalx: That's my build/conf/local.conf |
| 19:46.17 | El_Salvador[Away | <doc|work> webbrowser |
| 19:46.22 | El_Salvador[Away | webkit is a engine |
| 19:46.31 | El_Salvador[Away | like gecko |
| 19:47.54 | CM | Good summary of webkit and webkit-gtk+: http://www.atoker.com/blog/2007/09/05/webkitgtk-at-linuxconf-europe-2007/ |
| 19:49.17 | synalx | CM: is rm_work a good idea though? |
| 19:49.31 | El_Salvador[Away | http://wiki.openmoko.org/index.php?title=Neo1973&curid=1375&diff=18331&oldid=17502 |
| 19:49.33 | El_Salvador[Away | ufficial? |
| 19:50.02 | synalx | i can live with December |
| 19:50.07 | CM | synalx: Yes, it just removes temporary build files |
| 19:50.17 | synalx | CM: ok, sweet |
| 19:50.33 | Vegar | El_Salvador[Away: look at the log message |
| 19:50.38 | *** join/#openmoko ufo76 (n=ufo76@86.158.59.133) |
| 19:50.39 | Vegar | "Random date bump - no recent confirmation, recent reported hardware problems" |
| 19:51.31 | synalx | CM: so "make qemu" would give me downloaded builds + qemu-neo? |
| 19:52.44 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[User:PhilipNeustrom]] [[Buying_Interest_List]] [[Neo1973]] |
| 19:52.54 | CM | synalx: It would build qemu, then you have to "make qemu-image", then "make run-qemu" :) |
| 19:53.09 | El_Salvador[Away | <Vegar> El_Salvador[Away: look at the log message |
| 19:53.10 | El_Salvador[Away | right |
| 19:53.17 | El_Salvador[Away | i don't see it XD |
| 19:53.26 | synalx | CM: but does that use my locally built copy? |
| 19:53.28 | El_Salvador[Away | *saw |
| 19:53.33 | *** join/#openmoko _buz (n=buz@84-73-66-71.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 19:53.50 | synalx | isn't that "make qemu-image-local" |
| 19:54.12 | synalx | erm, make flash-qemu-local |
| 19:54.13 | synalx | XD |
| 19:54.14 | CM | synalx: Yes, all is built locally |
| 19:54.19 | TOS | Is there a specific reason not to just "make all" (the target exists) |
| 19:54.21 | CM | Heh, that's it |
| 19:54.23 | CM | :) |
| 19:54.43 | synalx | super, okay |
| 19:54.58 | synalx | i don't need a copy of qemu installed on the host for this right? |
| 19:55.09 | synalx | since OM has its own branch |
| 19:55.35 | SpeedEvil | roh - so sales to developers of GTA02 will only happen when the software is ready? |
| 19:56.09 | synalx | SpeedEvil: i don't think that's what he said |
| 19:56.41 | SpeedEvil | 20:04 <roh> massmarket will be when software is ready. |
| 19:56.41 | SpeedEvil | 20:05 <roh> and hardware. the hardware could be first ad needs to be tested |
| 19:56.41 | SpeedEvil | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:56.41 | SpeedEvil | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:56.42 | SpeedEvil | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:58.23 | cw666 | i want kernels on gta01 to stop breaking because of what seem to be gta02 changes |
| 19:58.57 | SpeedEvil | Which I at least read as no sales of GTA02 hardware before massmarket-ready software is there. |
| 19:59.05 | *** join/#openmoko bedboi (n=8118f852@xen.linuxtrent.it) |
| 19:59.17 | bedboi | is there any news about shipping times of the new batch? |
| 19:59.37 | SpeedEvil | No. |
| 19:59.46 | SpeedEvil | other than that on direct.openmoko.com |
| 20:00.04 | cw666 | SpeedEvil: ok, can i ask you more (repititious) questions about power drain? :-) |
| 20:00.09 | SpeedEvil | Sure. |
| 20:00.32 | cw666 | SpeedEvil: so, i dont get more than about 24-36hrs with GSM modem on... i figure i should be seeing 2x that given it's likely draw |
| 20:00.45 | SpeedEvil | Have you turned the audio amp off? |
| 20:00.48 | cw666 | the difference i wonder might be the mixer; so using alsamixer im checking the speaker is off |
| 20:00.51 | cw666 | right |
| 20:00.56 | cw666 | well, i'm not 100% clear if im doing the right thing there |
| 20:01.01 | *** join/#openmoko ckuethe (n=ckuethe@desdemona.cns.ualberta.ca) |
| 20:01.11 | SpeedEvil | Do you own a multimeter? |
| 20:01.27 | cw666 | yeah, several, but ive not bothered digging any of this out of the closet, i should i know |
| 20:01.35 | El_Salvador[Away | [21:57:18] * cb22 wants a gta02 |
| 20:01.54 | cb22 | yes El_Salvador[Away? |
| 20:02.00 | cb22 | heh |
| 20:02.02 | cb22 | i want both |
| 20:02.08 | cb22 | then i can have my cake and eat it |
| 20:02.09 | synalx | lol |
| 20:03.03 | _buz | if having the gta02 is an option, i much prefer it to news |
| 20:03.15 | _buz | cake you dont eat simply goes stale |
| 20:03.15 | *** join/#openmoko Henrikw (n=henrik@51.84-48-54.nextgentel.com) |
| 20:04.10 | cb22 | the news i really want to know about is the smedia chip |
| 20:04.12 | synalx | what are the keys for qemu? |
| 20:04.13 | synalx | XD |
| 20:04.17 | doc|work | mmmcake |
| 20:04.24 | SpeedEvil | I randomly bumped the date for GTA02 on the neo1973 page to decembet |
| 20:05.01 | cb22 | so... beryl on the gta02 anyone? |
| 20:05.03 | synalx | hey, it works :D |
| 20:05.09 | synalx | cb22: HAHAHA |
| 20:05.11 | El_Salvador[Away | lol |
| 20:05.12 | SpeedEvil | r |
| 20:05.19 | synalx | cb22: connect beryl to the accelerometers |
| 20:05.22 | cb22 | hehe |
| 20:05.25 | cb22 | that would rock |
| 20:05.25 | synalx | so that when you shake the openmoko the screen shakes in reverse |
| 20:05.31 | doc|work | that *would* rock |
| 20:05.33 | synalx | to dampen the effect |
| 20:05.35 | abraxa_ | cb22: I hate to be a penny pincher, but I figured I should link you to http://wsu.edu/~brians/errors/eatcake.html - might be nice to know |
| 20:05.38 | synalx | or when you flip it over it flips the 3d cube |
| 20:05.39 | synalx | XD |
| 20:05.39 | doc|work | except when trying to sms on the bus |
| 20:05.43 | synalx | that would RULE |
| 20:06.24 | cb22 | lol abraxa_ |
| 20:06.31 | doc|work | *stylus press* *miss because window has moved* *press* *miss* *press* *miss* *stab* *break* |
| 20:06.32 | synalx | is qemu supposed to take forever to start up? |
| 20:06.45 | cb22 | synalx, yes, on a pentium 2 it will |
| 20:06.56 | synalx | cb22: amd64 turion X2 |
| 20:06.59 | cb22 | but seriously, are you running freebsd?> |
| 20:07.04 | synalx | oh, hey, the progress bar is moving... |
| 20:07.05 | synalx | nope |
| 20:07.08 | synalx | gentoo 64 bit |
| 20:07.17 | cb22 | mm'k, cause with freebsd you have to kldload afs first |
| 20:07.24 | cb22 | that was my problem |
| 20:08.26 | El_Salvador[Away | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Talk:OpenMoko_under_QEMU#calibration_problem |
| 20:08.28 | El_Salvador[Away | solution? |
| 20:09.14 | synalx | :D it's almost loaded! |
| 20:09.16 | roh | El_Salvador[Away rebuild your qemu from latest sources. should be fixed |
| 20:09.28 | El_Salvador[Away | good |
| 20:09.34 | El_Salvador[Away | thanks |
| 20:09.58 | *** join/#openmoko hp__ (i=hp@ladderzat.student.utwente.nl) |
| 20:12.18 | synalx | man this emulation is sloooooooooow |
| 20:12.18 | synalx | XD |
| 20:12.30 | synalx | i'm guessing that's to be expected? |
| 20:12.38 | SpeedEvil | yes |
| 20:13.09 | *** join/#openmoko ufo76 (n=ufo76@86.158.59.133) |
| 20:13.23 | roh | synalx depending on the machine youre on |
| 20:13.26 | synalx | SpeedEvil: even to the point where it takes 5 minutes to open the dialer? |
| 20:13.28 | hp__ | synalx buy a faster PC :D |
| 20:13.50 | synalx | uh |
| 20:14.00 | synalx | model name : AMD Turion(tm) 64 X2 Mobile Technology TL-50 |
| 20:14.00 | synalx | cpu MHz : 1600.000 |
| 20:14.07 | cb22 | pah, you need a nice c2d |
| 20:14.13 | synalx | c2d? |
| 20:14.13 | doc|work | ssht |
| 20:14.15 | hp__ | there you.. *evil grin* |
| 20:14.23 | *** join/#openmoko orpheus (i=scott@lawn-143-215-205-16.lawn.gatech.edu) |
| 20:14.25 | hp__ | +go.. |
| 20:14.44 | synalx | is that slow? XD |
| 20:14.46 | hp__ | dual core 2.8Hz work ok with qemu here |
| 20:14.57 | *** join/#openmoko a__thing (n=notroot@c-98-193-50-46.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 20:15.11 | hp__ | if you fix the click bug in qemu that is.. |
| 20:16.11 | *** join/#openmoko fgau (n=fgau@pD953AB31.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 20:16.21 | *** join/#openmoko tri (n=tri@p57AD8F76.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 20:16.24 | synalx | click bug? |
| 20:16.24 | *** join/#openmoko hhf424 (n=user@tmo-108-1.customers.d1-online.com) |
| 20:16.53 | hhf424 | re |
| 20:17.21 | *** join/#openmoko tri (n=tri@p57AD8F76.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 20:18.38 | synalx | this is unusably slow at the moment |
| 20:18.44 | synalx | is it supposed to be like that |
| 20:18.59 | CM | quemu is slower than the actual hw |
| 20:19.07 | CM | At least on my amd 3000+ |
| 20:19.09 | synalx | yeah, but clicking a button takes 5 minutes |
| 20:19.27 | CM | *lol* |
| 20:19.35 | CM | Wasn't that slow when I tried it this summer |
| 20:19.43 | synalx | yeah, i figured |
| 20:19.47 | synalx | my processor is doing nothing |
| 20:19.49 | synalx | just seems slow |
| 20:19.55 | synalx | what are the qemu controls |
| 20:20.00 | synalx | left click = touch? |
| 20:20.24 | CM | Yes, and I think enter and space are aux and power |
| 20:20.42 | synalx | hmm |
| 20:20.44 | synalx | then this is really slow |
| 20:20.45 | synalx | XD |
| 20:21.06 | synalx | oh well |
| 20:21.52 | psymin | El_Salvador[Away, Thanks for the link to the wiki for the qemu issue I'm having .. didn't even need to ask :) |
| 20:23.04 | hp__ | synalx yeah when i tried 2007.2 it didn't calibrate my mouse clicks |
| 20:23.21 | hp__ | so you needed to start some program manualy to calibrate |
| 20:23.47 | psymin | try right clicks instead of left clicks |
| 20:24.07 | cb22 | ^^ lol |
| 20:25.03 | cw666 | hp__: rm /etc/pointercal ? |
| 20:25.43 | cw666 | oh, nm, for qemu i doubt that suffices, i misread |
| 20:25.45 | hp__ | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Talk:OpenMoko_under_QEMU#calibration_problem |
| 20:27.14 | *** join/#openmoko ozarka (n=elineber@12.106.220.2) |
| 20:28.27 | *** join/#openmoko slomo (n=slomo@ubuntu/member/slomo) |
| 20:28.27 | psymin | hp__, -portrait made it line up for me |
| 20:31.30 | synalx | what *is* bitbake anyways? |
| 20:31.47 | *** join/#openmoko ufo76_ (n=ufo76@86.155.31.43) |
| 20:32.03 | *** join/#openmoko mmp (n=mmp@TheWide.ubyt.sdjls.uniba.sk) |
| 20:32.22 | psymin | synalx, interesting .. a google says its like portage? |
| 20:33.16 | _buz | makes cake from bits |
| 20:33.16 | _buz | SCNR |
| 20:33.20 | synalx | lol |
| 20:33.51 | *** join/#openmoko philippe1work (n=fille@a91-153-17-113.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 20:34.58 | hp__ | [quote] BitBake is a simple tool for the execution of tasks. It is derived from Portage, which is the package management system used by the Gentoo Linux {/quote] |
| 20:35.29 | synalx | sweet |
| 20:35.41 | synalx | "execution of tasks" makes no sense though |
| 20:35.49 | synalx | cron is a tool for execution of tasks, hahaha |
| 20:35.53 | dcordes | bitbake is like a baking oven- for your computer |
| 20:36.18 | synalx | lol |
| 20:37.48 | ozarka | I may be late to this hate on bitbake discussion |
| 20:37.49 | hhf424 | even executing pepole, if required |
| 20:37.55 | synalx | lol |
| 20:37.59 | ozarka | but this link give some justification: |
| 20:37.59 | ozarka | http://bitbake.berlios.de/manual/ch01s02.html |
| 20:38.20 | synalx | 4595 tasks |
| 20:38.20 | synalx | whoa |
| 20:38.24 | synalx | XD |
| 20:39.52 | psymin | even uses python like portage? |
| 20:40.26 | synalx | yeah |
| 20:40.31 | ozarka | cron can use python, too |
| 20:40.33 | *** join/#openmoko Zoolooc (n=fredsiba@p54952B0D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 20:40.38 | ozarka | sadly, a hammer cannot |
| 20:41.22 | synalx | but a python can use a hammer |
| 20:41.26 | psymin | although .. a pyth .. damn |
| 20:41.30 | synalx | XD |
| 20:41.46 | *** join/#openmoko bedboi (n=8118f933@xen.linuxtrent.it) |
| 20:41.52 | bedboi | hi there |
| 20:41.55 | synalx | hi |
| 20:42.03 | bedboi | is there any info about shipping time of the new batch? |
| 20:42.34 | *** join/#openmoko MDK_ (n=mdk@cs181222091.pp.htv.fi) |
| 20:45.59 | hhf424 | bedboi: is there not a note on the openmoko shop? |
| 20:51.01 | psymin | bedboi, unless you mean GTA02 as the new batch? |
| 20:52.54 | *** join/#openmoko Skwid_ (n=Skwid@bas1-montreal42-1178045936.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 20:53.00 | *** part/#openmoko Skwid_ (n=Skwid@bas1-montreal42-1178045936.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 20:53.47 | fgau | hhf424: northern lowlands from the best side |
| 20:54.32 | *** join/#openmoko ufo76 (n=ufo76@host86-150-110-91.range86-150.btcentralplus.com) |
| 20:55.42 | hhf424 | fgau: whats up? |
| 20:56.59 | *** join/#openmoko pavelm (n=pavel@gprs189-60.eurotel.cz) |
| 20:57.26 | hp__ | i wonder if silverlight will be runable on embedded devices |
| 20:58.09 | cb22 | silverlight? |
| 20:58.19 | cb22 | the .net thing? |
| 20:58.27 | *** join/#openmoko infernixx (n=nix@unaffiliated/infernix) |
| 20:58.39 | pavelm | hi, everyone |
| 20:58.45 | hhf424 | ok, gone for sleep , tty all later |
| 20:59.30 | *** part/#openmoko hhf424 (n=user@tmo-108-1.customers.d1-online.com) |
| 20:59.30 | fgau | hhf424: nothing? |
| 20:59.32 | hp__ | cb22 yup |
| 20:59.51 | *** join/#openmoko Aztlek (n=lbernal@190.156.58.45) |
| 20:59.52 | cb22 | Microsoft® Silverlight™ is a cross-browser, cross-platform plug-in for delivering the next generation of .NET |
| 20:59.53 | cb22 | hmm |
| 21:00.07 | cb22 | by cross-platform i take it it works on 2000, xp and vista |
| 21:00.17 | cb22 | and cross-browser, ie6 and ie7 |
| 21:00.23 | emdete | so we port mono? |
| 21:00.37 | ozarka | Not Vista. You're being far too optimistic. |
| 21:00.39 | cb22 | s/port/compile/ ? |
| 21:00.47 | *** join/#openmoko goatmale (n=goatmale@d47-69-195-217.try.wideopenwest.com) |
| 21:00.49 | cb22 | hmm, true |
| 21:00.51 | borg_ | cb22: it works on mac |
| 21:01.02 | goatmale | yay open moko |
| 21:01.22 | cb22 | goatmale, (...) |
| 21:01.25 | cb22 | nice nick :p |
| 21:01.34 | emdete | cb22: is there a .bb? let me look.... |
| 21:01.35 | borg_ | and it may work earlier on openmoko as flash |
| 21:01.57 | cb22 | flash videos are easy |
| 21:02.06 | borg_ | depends on how fast the mono people can port it |
| 21:02.24 | cb22 | simply make a plugin for the browser (yet to be built... :p) that takes youtube vids, gets the flv location and plays it with mplayer |
| 21:02.27 | borg_ | thats not about videos |
| 21:02.29 | goatmale | I have a question. Is open moko Gnu/linux or just linux? |
| 21:02.30 | aloril | goatmale: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1, SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) (Hopefully these links answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) |
| 21:02.42 | cb22 | goatmale, linux is a kernel |
| 21:02.50 | goatmale | yar. |
| 21:02.52 | cb22 | like, you dont call an engine a car |
| 21:03.22 | goatmale | well does it use busybox? |
| 21:03.30 | borg_ | it does |
| 21:03.38 | borg_ | so it does not use that much gnu tools |
| 21:04.13 | goatmale | yay. |
| 21:05.46 | *** join/#openmoko tnt_ (n=tnt@75.92-244-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be) |
| 21:07.12 | goatmale | I know this isnt the place but I need help with busybox |
| 21:08.04 | *** join/#openmoko zell1983 (n=zell1983@host155-86-dynamic.7-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 21:08.07 | *** join/#openmoko chris^ (n=kraetzi@p548ADD20.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 21:08.12 | goatmale | oh |
| 21:08.27 | *** join/#openmoko chris^ (n=kraetzi@p548ADD20.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 21:09.05 | pavelm | goatmale: I'm afraid this really is not the place. Maybe #busybox channel exists? |
| 21:09.06 | *** join/#openmoko jujun (n=JulienN@LPuteaux-151-42-19-56.w193-252.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 21:09.39 | goatmale | Its mereged with uclibc I think.. |
| 21:10.03 | *** join/#openmoko ufo76_ (n=ufo76@host217-43-27-208.range217-43.btcentralplus.com) |
| 21:11.08 | hp__ | cb22 M$ is porting it to linux they say |
| 21:11.18 | cb22 | yes, i saw |
| 21:11.24 | cb22 | unless it is opensource |
| 21:11.26 | cb22 | and small |
| 21:11.28 | bedboi | any orders placed now will not be shipping before September 10, 2007: this is not telling when they are shipping |
| 21:11.32 | cb22 | i dont see it running |
| 21:11.44 | bedboi | this is just a lower bound |
| 21:11.45 | hp__ | true.. its a long shot for sure |
| 21:12.01 | bedboi | i guess i'll buy an a1200 then |
| 21:12.24 | *** join/#openmoko nab_ (n=nab@64-172-115-2.ded.pacbell.net) |
| 21:12.47 | hp__ | the a1200 is a bit old no? |
| 21:12.51 | psymin | thats 5 days away right? |
| 21:13.11 | *** join/#openmoko Demitar (n=demitar@c-212-031-190-120.cust.broadway.se) |
| 21:13.11 | bedboi | psymin: no the announce tells that "they will not ship BEFORE" |
| 21:13.38 | bedboi | that's huge difference |
| 21:13.48 | psymin | Also the GTA01 is the developer version, I'm guessing that you might be wanting GTA02 .. |
| 21:14.04 | bedboi | psymin: i happen to be a developer :) |
| 21:15.31 | ozarka | You don't want it, bedboi. |
| 21:15.37 | hp__ | bedboi.. active dev or.. laying low? |
| 21:15.42 | psymin | gotcha, just assumed that the a1200 was a non-linux non-dev version |
| 21:15.50 | ozarka | Ever since I got mine in Aug. I haven't had a chance to look at it. |
| 21:16.00 | hp__ | the a1200 is a linux dev.. |
| 21:16.42 | bedboi | hp__: I used to be quite active in gpe. if you don't have the device it is difficult to be active |
| 21:16.44 | psymin | Oo |
| 21:17.08 | hp__ | bedboi yah to have hw is a bless.. |
| 21:17.09 | bedboi | hp__ that's exactly why i'm telling... it also ships with a good CPU |
| 21:17.24 | hp__ | but i just bought me a nslu2 to tinker with a little :) |
| 21:17.37 | hp__ | bedboi 400Mhz :) |
| 21:18.01 | bedboi | what about neo? |
| 21:18.09 | bedboi | btw it lacks wifi |
| 21:18.29 | pavelm | bedboi: you don't want a1200. |
| 21:19.08 | bedboi | why that? |
| 21:19.16 | bedboi | pavelm: is there something wrong with it? |
| 21:19.40 | bedboi | the big problem is that i can't wait for one month (possibly more) for a neo |
| 21:20.25 | pavelm | bedboi: they played with DRM so that it is hard to install your own kernel, and even your own apps. |
| 21:21.13 | bedboi | hmm, i know there's some effort on http://www.openezx.org/ |
| 21:21.37 | hp__ | bedboi why can't you wait? |
| 21:21.45 | pavelm | yep, but you'll be breaking into your own cellphone. |
| 21:21.48 | bedboi | hp__: because i have no phone. |
| 21:21.59 | pavelm | where are you from? |
| 21:22.08 | hp__ | get an el cheapo phone in the meantime :) |
| 21:22.17 | hp__ | nokia S40 range |
| 21:22.22 | hp__ | for instance :) |
| 21:22.23 | bedboi | i'm from italy, right now i'm based in usa |
| 21:22.46 | bedboi | that's too bad, i have some motorola shitty phone from cingular |
| 21:22.52 | bedboi | it sucks too much |
| 21:23.11 | bedboi | it takes ages to load data from the sim card and it has shitty antenna |
| 21:23.23 | pavelm | well, neo is not really usable as a phone yet... |
| 21:23.34 | bedboi | cool |
| 21:24.04 | *** join/#openmoko Eludias__ (n=eludias@wingding.demon.nl) |
| 21:24.09 | pavelm | you can get some windows phone (see hh.org) and then just run linux on it. It is probably cheaper than a1200, and as you are breaking in your own phone, anyway... |
| 21:24.25 | pavelm | ...well but if you only want to play with applications maybe a1200 is not that bad... |
| 21:24.35 | *** join/#openmoko summatusmentis (n=summatus@umm-yrless170.morris.umn.edu) |
| 21:25.33 | pavelm | does sms support in gsmd work for you? |
| 21:25.54 | pavelm | sr=*anything* gives me +CMS ERROR: 321 |
| 21:25.58 | bedboi | what's the status right now? Can you place and receive calls? |
| 21:26.59 | pavelm | almost :-). You can if 4h standby is okay for you... and I have shell script to ring for me. |
| 21:27.09 | pavelm | ...but maybe 2007.2 snapshot is better... |
| 21:27.31 | bedboi | 4h standby is too shitty, what's up with power managment? |
| 21:28.12 | bedboi | it is just software issue or hardware? |
| 21:28.27 | pavelm | bedboi: pm software is missing. hw should be ok. |
| 21:28.39 | bedboi | ah ok |
| 21:28.49 | *** part/#openmoko goatmale (n=goatmale@d47-69-195-217.try.wideopenwest.com) |
| 21:29.27 | psymin | bedboi, You can test out the software by using qemu if ya want :) The wiki and svn make it quite easy. |
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| 21:36.42 | _diego_ | gsmd crash all the way for me ^^ |
| 21:37.04 | pavelm | actually scaredycat's version seems to "work". |
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| 21:52.28 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Phase_1_Software_Testing]] [[Hardware:Neo1973:Alternate_Cases:Camera]] [[Translation]] [[Buying_Interest_List]] [[External_Feeds]] [[Getting_OpenMoko_working_on_host_with_Xephyr]] [[Getting_OpenMoko_working_on_host_with_Xephyr/it]] and other changes |
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| 22:03.51 | polz | argh |
| 22:04.09 | polz | I've done an ipkg upgrade... |
| 22:04.20 | cb22 | uh oh |
| 22:04.25 | polz | and now I get a hard lock if I restart X or gsmd |
| 22:05.22 | mickeyl | Robert Schuster in da house? |
| 22:05.24 | polz | and since the official repositories seem to be offline, ScaredyCat's repository is likely to blame |
| 22:05.50 | polz | hehe, that's what I get for trying to "stay on the edge" |
| 22:06.09 | cb22 | staying on the edge is fine, you fell over :) |
| 22:06.29 | polz | It's my fault anyway |
| 22:06.45 | *** part/#openmoko DeeDeND (n=daniele@host123-107-dynamic.2-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 22:06.51 | polz | if I were made from the right stuff, I'd have my own repository set up by now ;) |
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| 22:34.02 | ScaredyCat | don't be blaming my repo! |
| 22:35.03 | pavelm | thanks for your repo, btw. |
| 22:35.26 | ScaredyCat | no probs... |
| 22:35.51 | pavelm | are scumvm games actually playable on screen this small? |
| 22:35.59 | ScaredyCat | although I cocked up earlier.. rsync'd with a delete in the wrong place... |
| 22:36.01 | ScaredyCat | yes.. |
| 22:36.18 | ScaredyCat | I play monkey island and indiana jones regularly |
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| 22:36.39 | *** join/#openmoko Vndmtrx (n=0x0fff@unaffiliated/vndmtrx) |
| 22:36.48 | pavelm | :-) nice. I remember indiana jones from DOS days... |
| 22:37.26 | ScaredyCat | hehe |
| 22:37.53 | ScaredyCat | right .. bed time .. night all |
| 22:38.18 | pavelm | good night. |
| 22:40.06 | satadru | So the iPhone is now $399... assuming that it is easy to unlock... perhaps openmoko could be ported to it... ;-) |
| 22:40.37 | pavelm | stadru: $400+2years contract, AFAICT. |
| 22:40.47 | andylockran | satadru: I'd hardly say easy to unlock.. |
| 22:41.32 | pavelm | plus openmoko will not be able to use multitouch features... so you are better with neo hw... |
| 22:41.48 | cw666 | pavelm: patent reasons? |
| 22:41.48 | *** join/#openmoko mindCrime__ (n=chatzill@cpe-065-190-188-124.nc.res.rr.com) |
| 22:41.49 | pavelm | but go wild, linux-on-iPhone will certainly get lots of publicity. |
| 22:42.27 | *** part/#openmoko Marcel_M (n=Marcel_M@86.59.65.236) |
| 22:42.43 | pavelm | cw? No patents, AFAICT, just missing support in X and apps. |
| 22:44.32 | *** part/#openmoko waldo323 (n=waldo323@h69-129-95-226.69-129.unk.tds.net) |
| 22:44.53 | cw666 | pavelm: can the sensor even detect 2+ pressure points? |
| 22:45.00 | cb22 | um, what is multitouch used for anyways |
| 22:45.06 | cb22 | except resizing bloody images |
| 22:45.25 | psymin | cb22, two chicks at the same time .. .. can be using the gui? |
| 22:45.28 | pavelm | cw: not on openmoko, AFAICT. |
| 22:45.37 | cb22 | psymin, heh |
| 22:46.37 | synalx | cb22: multitouch -> pinch UI |
| 22:46.53 | cb22 | yes, but i just dont see the point |
| 22:47.09 | cw666 | pavelm: im not talking about sw, i mean can the *hardware* actually detect 2+ points of contact at once? |
| 22:47.18 | cw666 | many touch sensors will just give you an everage of a point inbetween |
| 22:47.28 | pavelm | cb: point is that their sensor is capacitive, so it _works_, unlike stuff in neo |
| 22:47.31 | *** part/#openmoko poke (n=poke@net12.mlyniec.gda.pl) |
| 22:47.33 | synalx | iphone uses the pinch UI |
| 22:47.44 | cb22 | i'm talking about the pinch ui |
| 22:47.47 | cb22 | it just seems |
| 22:47.48 | synalx | cw666: the hardware can't |
| 22:47.51 | pavelm | cw: Yes. Actually, I believe iPhone will be able to sense your fingers _close_ to the phone. |
| 22:47.55 | cb22 | well, not that amazing |
| 22:47.58 | synalx | cw666: that's cool |
| 22:48.18 | cw666 | iphone probably is capacitive, which IMO is way nicer and more duable |
| 22:48.21 | pavelm | synalx: I don't think so. Capacitive sensors can do that, AFAIK. |
| 22:48.27 | cw666 | pavelm: they can :-) |
| 22:48.41 | synalx | pavelm: even the one in the neo? |
| 22:49.01 | cw666 | i assume the neo's sensor is resistive |
| 22:49.07 | cb22 | probably |
| 22:49.32 | pavelm | synalx: no, the one in neo is resistive, AFAICT, so it detects only one point. |
| 22:49.47 | synalx | ah okay |
| 22:49.49 | pavelm | (I may be wrong. I never even seen iPhone. But I seen some synaptic touchpads). |
| 22:50.00 | cb22 | how does the touchscreen hardware 'know' to go to the middle of the two points |
| 22:50.13 | cw666 | cb22: it doesnt, electrically that's what happens |
| 22:50.31 | cb22 | right, so it actually thinks there is simply one in the middle? |
| 22:50.35 | cw666 | yes |
| 22:50.47 | pavelm | cb: and it is not middle, if you apply different pressure to the two places. Try it. |
| 22:50.48 | cw666 | you only have two outputs, and X & Y |
| 22:50.56 | cw666 | well, and maybe a pressure output |
| 22:50.58 | cb22 | pavelm, yes, its quite fun :) |
| 22:51.02 | cw666 | i think the nokia's have that and use it |
| 22:51.09 | cw666 | do they can detect a stylus vs a finger |
| 22:51.14 | cw666 | that might be doable on the neo |
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| 22:51.38 | cb22 | any idea why pressure makes a difference? |
| 22:51.48 | cw666 | cb22: difference in what? |
| 22:51.56 | cb22 | the location of the point |
| 22:51.59 | cw666 | cb22: you mean baising towards one point or another? |
| 22:52.04 | cb22 | yeah |
| 22:52.14 | cw666 | because more pressure means more current flows there |
| 22:52.16 | pavelm | cw: I'd assume neo to have pressure info, yes. |
| 22:52.30 | cw666 | so that pressure point is a stronger influence |
| 22:52.42 | cb22 | right |
| 22:52.54 | cw666 | see a high school textbook on series vs parallel resistors :-) |
| 22:53.38 | cb22 | heh, here in south africa the lions eat all our textbooks :( |
| 22:54.17 | pavelm | cb: wikipedia? |
| 22:54.36 | pavelm | cb: lions obviously have not ate your internet connection, yet :-) |
| 22:55.09 | cb22 | nah, wireless :p |
| 22:55.21 | cb22 | although they like to eat up our bandwidth |
| 22:55.28 | cb22 | considering i have 512kb/s |
| 22:56.32 | pavelm | (because it is still better than man-eating lion, and should be fun to look at) |
| 22:57.32 | cb22 | sure, come over, just try not to get mugged, raped and murdered on the way |
| 22:57.42 | cw666 | cb22: where in .za are you? |
| 22:57.55 | cb22 | cape town cw666 |
| 22:57.56 | pavelm | ok, I guess people are still worse than lions. |
| 22:58.04 | cb22 | you been here? |
| 22:58.29 | cw666 | cb22: no, but when i lived in .nz there were a lot of .za immigrants i worked with |
| 22:58.48 | cb22 | yeah, most people go there or to aus |
| 22:58.49 | cw666 | northern transvaal sounds like a lot of bad news |
| 22:58.56 | cw666 | really bad news, all bad and no good news |
| 22:59.00 | cb22 | yip |
| 22:59.06 | cb22 | joberg and pretoria |
| 22:59.14 | cb22 | cape town is still fairly safe |
| 22:59.25 | cb22 | compaired to those cities |
| 23:00.05 | pavelm | "fairly safe" as in "have to carry gun but don't have to use it more than twice a month?" |
| 23:00.21 | cb22 | nah, more like 4 times a month |
| 23:01.03 | pavelm | cb: come to czech republic, no lions, but you can only get robbed here, not murdered... |
| 23:01.43 | pavelm | cb: that 4 times a month... that was joke, right? |
| 23:01.49 | cb22 | nah, thats no fun |
| 23:01.57 | cb22 | pavelm, yeah :) |
| 23:02.19 | *** join/#openmoko miip (n=miip@p54A55C78.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 23:03.33 | pavelm | how is the weather in cape town? around 0C in winter, around 30C in summer? |
| 23:03.55 | cb22 | nope, we have a nice stable climate |
| 23:04.03 | cb22 | its 12C now |
| 23:04.16 | cb22 | and gets up to 30 in summer, but normally around 20-25C |
| 23:04.39 | cb22 | too bad it doesnt snow though |
| 23:05.56 | pavelm | snow is fun... it does not normally stay too long here, but sometimes it gets interesting. |
| 23:06.37 | pavelm | (as in "buses stuck in snow", "cars stuck in snow" and even "horse almost stuck in snow") |
| 23:06.44 | cb22 | lol |
| 23:06.47 | pavelm | Ok, I should get some sleep. Good night! |
| 23:06.55 | cb22 | heh same |
| 23:06.58 | cb22 | its 1am |
| 23:07.00 | cb22 | night |
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| 23:52.48 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Press_Coverage/es]] [[Getting_Started_with_your_Neo1973/fr]] [[Talk:OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Norway]] |
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