| 00:00.31 | juco2 | the talk generated a lot of excitement |
| 00:00.46 | *** join/#openmoko poffy (n=poffy@c-76-30-222-129.hsd1.tx.comcast.net) |
| 00:01.00 | *** join/#openmoko El_Salvador[Away (n=Brescia@adsl-ull-196-154.44-151.net24.it) |
| 00:01.08 | juco2 | an exec from SAS (a big company in the area) was there and very interested in the device |
| 00:01.21 | doc|home | the airline? |
| 00:01.33 | abraxa_ | Nice :o |
| 00:01.33 | juco2 | http://www.sas.com/ |
| 00:02.14 | juco2 | you can't tell from their website, but their core business is statistics software |
| 00:02.28 | juco2 | they are also one of the largest private companies |
| 00:02.33 | juco2 | they have a ton of money |
| 00:03.12 | juco2 | well, I really wanted to pop in and report on the event and say "yay" that my CC was charged for the neo |
| 00:03.17 | *** join/#openmoko CIA-23 (n=CIA@208.69.182.149) |
| 00:03.38 | juco2 | goodnight everyone |
| 00:03.50 | abraxa_ | Night night |
| 00:04.33 | Vegar | juco2: meh, I thought you meant http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scandinavian_Airlines |
| 00:04.55 | daMaestro | hmmm my usb hub seems to really get in the way of a lot of stuff with the neo |
| 00:08.51 | *** join/#openmoko no_mind_ (n=orion@59.176.111.177) |
| 00:09.18 | *** join/#openmoko zipola (n=zipola@w2626.wlan.asm.fi) |
| 00:10.27 | abraxa_ | daMaestro: How so? |
| 00:13.30 | daMaestro | for example, i can't get the usb networking going when working through the hub |
| 00:13.40 | abraxa_ | Ouch |
| 00:14.30 | daMaestro | hmmm |
| 00:14.38 | daMaestro | it might have been the port i was using... this is strange |
| 00:15.13 | daMaestro | yeah, strange.. i changed ports i have the switch plugged into and now it works |
| 00:15.53 | daMaestro | soooo, i've still not gotten a voice call to work |
| 00:16.22 | daMaestro | 'alsactl -f /etc/alsa/gsmhandset.state restore' is all i should have to do right? |
| 00:18.44 | *** join/#openmoko merriam__ (n=merriam@82-133-115-120.dyn.gotadsl.co.uk) |
| 00:19.33 | *** part/#openmoko mdt (n=mdt@littlelun.emdete.de) |
| 00:27.30 | *** join/#openmoko FuzzyCat (n=ScaredyC@81.187.78.218) |
| 00:29.39 | *** join/#openmoko DukeOfURL_ (n=chatzill@introspect.com) |
| 00:29.46 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[User_talk:THe_IkkE]] [[Manually_using_GPRS]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_San_Francisco]] |
| 00:31.29 | *** join/#openmoko no_mind_ (n=orion@59.176.111.177) |
| 00:32.10 | *** join/#openmoko nosyjoe (n=philipp@host-82-135-95-87.customer.m-online.net) |
| 00:37.04 | *** join/#openmoko daniel_bergamini (n=danieber@70-41-167-177.cust.wildblue.net) |
| 00:40.36 | daMaestro | how can i play some test sound while trying to get audio working? |
| 00:41.03 | sagacis | I copied an mp3 to the device and ran madplay |
| 00:41.09 | sagacis | You also have ogg123 available. |
| 00:41.15 | sagacis | The ringtones are on there somewhere... |
| 00:41.47 | daMaestro | oh nice. |
| 00:41.54 | daMaestro | i have no mp3s.. ogg +1 |
| 00:42.04 | sagacis | Wait a sec... |
| 00:42.41 | sagacis | madplay /usr/share/openmoko/sounds/ringtone_ringnroll.mp3 |
| 00:42.45 | *** join/#openmoko ubuntu (n=chatzill@STRATTON-THREE-SIXTY-TWO.MIT.EDU) |
| 00:43.23 | sagacis | Got it? |
| 00:43.30 | daMaestro | i do |
| 00:43.32 | daMaestro | thanks. |
| 00:43.37 | sagacis | de nada |
| 00:44.48 | daMaestro | grr... well still no go |
| 00:45.02 | *** part/#openmoko nnn0 (n=nnn0@unaffiliated/nnn0) |
| 00:47.29 | daMaestro | http://opensource.wolfsonmicro.com/~gg/neo1973/gsmhandset.working.state ... alsactl -f [...] ; madplay /usr/share/openmoko/sounds/ringtone_ringnroll.mp3 and i should hear music? |
| 00:48.29 | ljp | user stereoout.state |
| 00:48.35 | ljp | err use, that is |
| 00:50.51 | daMaestro | wow.. first time my neo has said anything; good work ljp |
| 00:51.10 | daMaestro | ljp, do you know how i can actually make a voice call with the handset? |
| 00:53.13 | ljp | i think the dialer should work |
| 00:53.29 | daMaestro | it does, but i can't get audio working |
| 00:53.38 | ljp | or do you mean ausio part? |
| 00:53.41 | ljp | audio |
| 00:53.47 | daMaestro | audio. |
| 00:53.53 | ljp | i think its gsmhandset.state |
| 00:54.22 | daMaestro | i should be able to test with madplay still? |
| 00:54.45 | ljp | doubt it, because the internal routing is different. |
| 00:59.19 | sagacis | daMaestro: I think the wolfsonmicro.com state files don't work for our phones |
| 00:59.36 | sagacis | I've been using the ones on the phone. Not that I've made a pile of phone calls... |
| 00:59.51 | daMaestro | wow |
| 01:00.18 | daMaestro | well i just tried making a call with 'alsactl -f /etc/alsa/gsmhandset.state restore' and my head is still ringing |
| 01:00.44 | sagacis | A bit loud? |
| 01:00.45 | daMaestro | (it just sounded a *really* loud tone; hurt my head) |
| 01:00.48 | sagacis | So, it worked? |
| 01:00.52 | sagacis | Oh, maybe not |
| 01:00.53 | daMaestro | well... it was not a ring |
| 01:01.02 | sagacis | Feedback |
| 01:01.08 | sagacis | You need to turn down the mic or speaker |
| 01:01.33 | noon | sleep well |
| 01:02.32 | daMaestro | sagacis, do you know what mixer channel i need to deal with? |
| 01:02.51 | daMaestro | i think it was pcm? |
| 01:03.43 | daMaestro | holy shit that hurts |
| 01:03.48 | daMaestro | *not pcm* |
| 01:06.36 | *** join/#openmoko fgau_ (n=fgau@pD95398F8.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 01:08.02 | *** join/#openmoko telconta1 (n=adam@dsl081-165-219.sea1.dsl.speakeasy.net) |
| 01:12.32 | daMaestro | yessss... it's the headphone channel |
| 01:12.58 | daMaestro | and it was at 100, which gave the feedback. awesome. first time i have actually had a phone call :-D |
| 01:14.02 | *** join/#openmoko Kensan (n=ken@gw.ptr-80-238-206-248.customer.ch.netstream.com) |
| 01:14.53 | sagacis | daMaestro, what does the ring sound like? |
| 01:15.25 | daMaestro | so, what's the plan to be able to lock the screen while talking so you don't accidentally close the connection? also, how would one send tones while in a call (aka be able to check voicemail) ? |
| 01:15.49 | daMaestro | sagacis, like the normal us ring; i was calling my other cellular carrier to check my voicemail |
| 01:16.59 | borg_ | i have set up openembedded now |
| 01:17.22 | borg_ | what exactly do i havte to tell bitbake that it builds OM-2007.2 for me? ;) |
| 01:19.11 | abraxa_ | borg_: Can't |
| 01:19.30 | borg_ | mh |
| 01:19.45 | abraxa_ | The changes for OE to build 2007.2 aren't committed yet as far as I know |
| 01:19.59 | sagacis | people are building it, right? |
| 01:20.13 | abraxa_ | Yeah, though manually I suppose |
| 01:20.15 | borg_ | i think so |
| 01:20.17 | borg_ | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/OpenMoko2007.2 |
| 01:20.24 | sagacis | daMaestro, I was wondering what an incoming call sounds like |
| 01:20.27 | borg_ | here it says "Run bitbake <package name> (e.g. openmoko-devel-image)." |
| 01:20.38 | borg_ | but does this actually build OM-2007.2? |
| 01:21.14 | daMaestro | ohh, i've not hear the phone "ring" |
| 01:21.23 | borg_ | i can just test it, but it will take half a day.... |
| 01:21.23 | borg_ | ;) |
| 01:21.24 | daMaestro | heard* |
| 01:22.01 | *** join/#openmoko ahbritto (n=guest@adsl-64-161-117-110.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net) |
| 01:25.57 | *** join/#openmoko Pupeno (n=Pupeno@89-125-118-144.dhcp-ripwave.irishbroadband.ie) |
| 01:27.03 | daMaestro | any way to get vim installed? |
| 01:28.44 | ckuethe | vim on a touchscreen... oy. |
| 01:29.12 | ckuethe | though vim is my preferred editor... |
| 01:30.17 | *** join/#openmoko daniel_bergamini (n=danieber@70-41-167-177.cust.wildblue.net) |
| 01:32.02 | *** join/#openmoko Tv (n=tv@207.181.6.54) |
| 01:32.58 | Kensan | Is buildhost.openmoko.org down? |
| 01:33.21 | daMaestro | was for me |
| 01:34.05 | Kensan | maybe there's some restructuring :) |
| 01:34.49 | *** join/#openmoko CIA-23 (n=CIA@208.69.182.149) |
| 01:39.58 | daMaestro | ok, awesome... made my first voice call :-D |
| 01:40.58 | daMaestro | Kensan, it's really worth having a local build env |
| 01:41.18 | daMaestro | using mokomakefile is quite easy... but it took me ~15 hours to do the initial build |
| 01:42.20 | rwhitby | some things are worth waiting for ... |
| 01:42.57 | Kensan | daMaestro: Sure, I was just wondering if anybody knew what's up with that server. |
| 01:43.29 | rwhitby | abraxa_, sagacis: I have an nslu2-linux master makefile which can be used to automatically build OE/Angstrom. Then just change conf/auto.conf to make it build OM2007.2 |
| 01:44.23 | abraxa_ | rwhitby: Ohh, nice =) |
| 01:49.54 | *** join/#openmoko ZerothCloned (n=tyler@S010600195bd5cfe1.ok.shawcable.net) |
| 01:50.20 | ZerothCloned | hey all |
| 01:51.06 | ZerothCloned | does anyone know what the prospected range of the wifi antenna will be? |
| 01:51.26 | jaebird | is there a distributed build system in place? |
| 01:52.04 | jaebird | how fast is buildhost.openmoko.org normally? |
| 01:52.16 | rwhitby | abraxa_: I can probably set up ipkg.nslu2-linux.org to build angstrom for fic-gta01 |
| 01:53.54 | jaebird | what is the max signal strength reported by the gsm modem? |
| 01:54.11 | abraxa_ | rwhitby: Might wanna coordinate such an effort with Mickey since he's busy with the images atm |
| 01:54.41 | rwhitby | abraxa_: if openmoko is building and uploading them, then I wouldn't duplicate |
| 01:54.42 | jaebird | I heard...here on this channel that Mickey is going to try to release 2007.2 within the next 5-7 days |
| 01:56.26 | jaebird | i've been comparing SIP/SIMPLE with XMPP for a presence aware address book... |
| 01:56.41 | *** join/#openmoko lynx_ (n=lynx@port-83-236-15-172.dynamic.qsc.de) |
| 01:56.52 | jaebird | it seems like xmpp uses less bandwidth |
| 01:57.43 | ZerothCloned | presence aware address book? Basically, something that shows the friends nearby/online at the top? |
| 01:58.11 | jaebird | ZerothCloned: sure..also free SMS via XMPP messaging |
| 01:58.25 | jaebird | on the ml we've been beating around some ideas |
| 01:59.06 | jaebird | obviously configurable...but if on wifi or unlimitted gprs, openmoko could favor xmpp as the communication layer for im and sms type messages |
| 01:59.16 | jaebird | also thinking about avatars too |
| 01:59.23 | ZerothCloned | which mailing list jaebird? |
| 01:59.25 | jaebird | think gtalk |
| 01:59.32 | jaebird | community |
| 01:59.50 | ZerothCloned | ah, okay. |
| 02:00.29 | jaebird | my thoughts were to allow people to register their phone numbers with some xmpp service, this would be used as a lookup table to see if real or fake SMS could be used |
| 02:00.41 | ZerothCloned | well, I had similar ideas, but p2p basis. |
| 02:00.50 | jaebird | there are so many thoughts going through my head... |
| 02:00.56 | *** join/#openmoko LetoTo (n=paul@76-10-144-1.dsl.teksavvy.com) |
| 02:01.11 | jaebird | p2p is also workable, but there needs to be some proxy to keep the connection alive |
| 02:01.12 | ZerothCloned | an easy way, would be to have the phone generate a unique 14 digit acii key, when you "share" your contact info. |
| 02:01.31 | jaebird | exactly...xmpp already contains auth in the spec |
| 02:01.55 | ZerothCloned | then, when one phone contacts another phone, it uses that key to encrypt, whatnot, and the recieving phone can also verify that that number has that specific key |
| 02:02.00 | jaebird | you could "beam" info to each others phones also...like direct voicemail |
| 02:02.11 | ZerothCloned | exactly what I had in mind |
| 02:02.27 | jaebird | we should start to formulate some use cases on the wiki |
| 02:03.04 | jaebird | the issue of the proxy server is for presence |
| 02:03.34 | jaebird | i just traveled cross country (US) listening to an internet radio station while driving...my ip address changed a lot |
| 02:04.10 | ZerothCloned | well, if the phones supported ipv6, that wouldn't be an issue |
| 02:04.12 | jaebird | both SIP and XMPP use a server to maintain presence info |
| 02:04.32 | jaebird | what about the networks? :) that is still a ways of imho |
| 02:04.47 | ZerothCloned | they'd get one ip address, and then when communicating with other phones, use that. Is it possible to do both ipv4 and ipv6? |
| 02:05.11 | daMaestro | sure |
| 02:05.23 | jaebird | the issue is that they use dhcp and you don't know what your going to get |
| 02:05.33 | jaebird | kinda like ddns |
| 02:05.39 | daMaestro | well ipv6 "solves" that issue |
| 02:05.39 | daMaestro | lol |
| 02:05.51 | ZerothCloned | Then why not do that. Then, if networks move over to ipv6, then you truly have presence, no matter where you go. |
| 02:06.13 | jaebird | how do i know what your ipv6 address is so that i can "ping" it? |
| 02:06.23 | jaebird | where will that information be published? |
| 02:06.27 | ZerothCloned | that would be shared in the contact info ;-) |
| 02:06.33 | daMaestro | i doubt we will see ipv6 for quite some time |
| 02:06.37 | jaebird | so it would never change.... |
| 02:06.40 | daMaestro | no |
| 02:06.48 | jaebird | i don't buy that |
| 02:07.02 | ZerothCloned | buy what? |
| 02:07.12 | jaebird | the carriers will do whatever they want... |
| 02:07.16 | daMaestro | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IPv6 ... read |
| 02:07.29 | ZerothCloned | I know... this was discussed on slashdot the other day. |
| 02:07.37 | jaebird | they are not going to give out a static address for a handheld that will never change |
| 02:08.18 | ZerothCloned | the address could be tied to your identity with the carrier. |
| 02:08.49 | jaebird | perhaps |
| 02:08.58 | jaebird | but they already use the sim for that |
| 02:09.28 | rwhitby | most carriers have phones behind nat anyway, so you won't be able to ping another phone |
| 02:09.32 | jaebird | my point is that whatever we do needs to be abstracted from the network layer |
| 02:09.58 | ZerothCloned | I know someone here said that the phones will use 5.6 ghz |
| 02:10.00 | jaebird | reason: when on wifi network, you can use that as your presence connection |
| 02:10.09 | rwhitby | you need a central server outside of the phone network which both phones connect to. |
| 02:10.10 | jaebird | when on the road...gprs, umts, etc |
| 02:10.11 | ZerothCloned | whats the range for the antennas for the antennas? |
| 02:10.22 | ZerothCloned | agh... sorry. |
| 02:10.31 | jaebird | :) |
| 02:10.52 | ZerothCloned | looong day at work. XD |
| 02:11.26 | jaebird | i use an n800 and the contacts app has some features i really like that should work nice in the openmoko paradigm |
| 02:11.32 | jaebird | ie cell phone |
| 02:11.36 | jaebird | which the n800 is not |
| 02:11.51 | ZerothCloned | rwhitby: There is so much commercial potential for this phone... purely because its an open phone. To me, it would be profitable to provide such a server for teenagers/businessmen on the go. |
| 02:12.22 | jaebird | my problem is that i have diarea of the ideas right now :) |
| 02:12.44 | rwhitby | ZerothCloned: absolutely, and anyone can just by an NSLU2 and do it anyway with open source |
| 02:12.59 | ZerothCloned | well, diarrhea of ideas is better than diarrhea of the mouth is what I say. |
| 02:13.12 | jaebird | :) nice |
| 02:13.50 | jaebird | of course, i'm still waiting for my 2g att sim card |
| 02:14.07 | ZerothCloned | lol |
| 02:14.18 | ZerothCloned | do you find the keyboard clunky jaebird? |
| 02:14.34 | jaebird | openmoko? very |
| 02:14.40 | jaebird | i ssh for now |
| 02:14.46 | ZerothCloned | *nods* Sound idea. |
| 02:15.00 | ZerothCloned | I can't really make any ui designs until I get one in my hands |
| 02:15.12 | jaebird | have you seen the atomik keyboard for palm? |
| 02:16.19 | rwhitby | ZerothCloned: I'm doing the porting of openwrt to devices like the nslu2, which can then be used for distributed openmoko servers. |
| 02:17.14 | jaebird | it stylus based, but allows user to "type" without having to take the pen off of the screen |
| 02:17.42 | ZerothCloned | ooh, very nice |
| 02:17.54 | jaebird | there is some research papers out on that type of entry, some claim 40+ wpm |
| 02:18.05 | ZerothCloned | funded by palm? |
| 02:18.14 | jaebird | no third party app |
| 02:18.34 | ZerothCloned | really? I doubt it ;-) |
| 02:18.36 | jaebird | search for myKbd |
| 02:19.12 | ZerothCloned | I dunno, is a stylus more efficient than fingers? |
| 02:19.32 | jaebird | there is T9 for fingers |
| 02:19.50 | jaebird | standard keypad style alphanumeric entry |
| 02:20.07 | ZerothCloned | *nods* Well, with a stylus, you can use smaller buttons |
| 02:20.20 | ZerothCloned | with fingers, they have to be bigger, and the size of the screen becomes an issue. |
| 02:20.26 | jaebird | i haven't used it, but looks like the idea is worth an adventure |
| 02:21.12 | ZerothCloned | ooh, they're onto a good idea with the hex keys there. |
| 02:21.13 | jaebird | i was thinking as i was trying to use the openmoko keyboard with my fingers is that my fingers get "fairly" close to the intended key |
| 02:21.26 | jaebird | why not use the same dictionary lookup to "correct" any miss types |
| 02:21.35 | ZerothCloned | *nods* Like the iphone does? |
| 02:21.40 | jaebird | does it? |
| 02:21.47 | ZerothCloned | thats what the iphone does. |
| 02:22.08 | ZerothCloned | I work in electronics,and our biggest profit maker is cell-phones ;-) I get access to industry info. |
| 02:22.22 | jaebird | huh..i honestly did NOT know that...i hate it when i think of something independently after someone else |
| 02:22.38 | jaebird | they probably patented it somehow |
| 02:22.42 | ZerothCloned | well, still its a good idea. |
| 02:22.44 | ZerothCloned | likely' |
| 02:22.55 | *** join/#openmoko Writchie (n=bigW@rrcs-24-172-122-130.midsouth.biz.rr.com) |
| 02:23.36 | ZerothCloned | so, anyone know what the range will be on the wifi antennas? |
| 02:23.59 | jaebird | the only info i can provide is what my n800 does. |
| 02:24.01 | rwhitby | ZerothCloned: I'd ask nbd |
| 02:24.18 | jaebird | it works as good as my laptop, actually seems better sometimes |
| 02:24.37 | *** join/#openmoko khaije1|bb (n=khaije1|@person1.constellation.com) |
| 02:24.40 | jaebird | so if they use they same "kind" of antenna, the perf should be somewhat similar |
| 02:24.49 | rwhitby | nbd: I thought I saw you check ar6k stuff into svn ... ? |
| 02:24.59 | ZerothCloned | weren't the antennas 5.6ghz? |
| 02:25.13 | jaebird | 5.6GHz? |
| 02:25.16 | nbd | rwhitby: it's not working yet. i'm still hacking on the code |
| 02:25.36 | jaebird | ZerothCloned: for what? |
| 02:25.41 | rwhitby | ZerothCloned: if nbd doesn't know, then I doubt anyone else here will. |
| 02:26.21 | *** join/#openmoko holtmann (n=holtmann@nikita.holtmann.net) |
| 02:28.03 | *** join/#openmoko jaebird_ (n=jae@53-89.netblk-69-41-89.coolaccess.net) |
| 02:30.06 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[User:Historybuff/notes]] |
| 02:30.40 | *** join/#openmoko poffy (n=poffy@c-76-30-222-129.hsd1.tx.comcast.net) |
| 02:35.28 | *** join/#openmoko rtyler (i=tyler@morningsun.geekisp.com) |
| 02:37.24 | *** join/#openmoko MDK (n=mdk@cs181222091.pp.htv.fi) |
| 02:49.40 | *** join/#openmoko Vegar (i=vegar@51-142-151-213.mtulink.net) |
| 02:57.29 | *** join/#openmoko LetoTo (n=paul@76-10-144-1.dsl.teksavvy.com) |
| 02:58.56 | *** join/#openmoko leppoc (n=ycoppel@72.14.228.89) |
| 02:58.59 | leppoc | hello |
| 03:00.58 | *** join/#openmoko SP-8472 (i=8472@dslb-084-056-228-007.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 03:01.23 | *** join/#openmoko JWynia (n=j@dsl001-154-010.msp1.dsl.speakeasy.net) |
| 03:06.26 | abraxa_ | Heyas, leppoc |
| 03:07.07 | leppoc | someone can tell me if when it is compiling libsdl-x11, am I far away from the end of make openmoko-devel-image ? |
| 03:07.13 | leppoc | hi abraxa_ :) |
| 03:08.16 | leppoc | (a kind of statement "Compiling component X/Y" before each step would be nice :) ) |
| 03:08.51 | abraxa_ | No idea, sorry |
| 03:09.21 | leppoc | hehe, not really important, I am just too impatient ;) |
| 03:09.36 | *** part/#openmoko JWynia (n=j@dsl001-154-010.msp1.dsl.speakeasy.net) |
| 03:11.49 | nbd | LaF0rge: ping |
| 03:20.47 | *** join/#openmoko Chairboy (n=chatzill@c-24-22-81-82.hsd1.or.comcast.net) |
| 03:32.10 | *** join/#openmoko Vegar (i=vegar@51-142-151-213.mtulink.net) |
| 03:38.34 | BryceLeo | man there's a whole ton in oe that doesn't build, I must be doing something wrong |
| 03:38.38 | Writchie | anybody having trouble reaching buildhost? is it off the air |
| 03:39.09 | BryceLeo | Writchie: are you building old or 2007.2? |
| 03:39.12 | *** join/#openmoko bluelightning (n=blueligh@219-89-46-199.dialup.xtra.co.nz) |
| 03:39.49 | *** join/#openmoko raster (n=raster@p2141-ipbf2304marunouchi.tokyo.ocn.ne.jp) |
| 03:39.50 | Writchie | no - I'm having trouble accessing buildhost at all. |
| 03:40.24 | BryceLeo | Writchie: then it's probably down because of the upcoming switch to 2007.2... it's just a guess but that's my bet |
| 03:40.44 | Writchie | is there an image yet of any 2007.2 build? |
| 03:41.12 | BryceLeo | alphaone has some rough builds up, there's a wiki article on building it |
| 03:41.37 | BryceLeo | it's all in OE but anyone using mokomakefile and the old system won't be able to get to it because of they're overlay |
| 03:41.40 | *** join/#openmoko Moriarty_ (n=jv@adsl-230-94-155.mco.bellsouth.net) |
| 03:41.49 | BryceLeo | best bet is to knock out what you've got and start again |
| 03:42.07 | *** join/#openmoko ^leo^``` (n=user@r190-64-7-8.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy) |
| 03:42.12 | BryceLeo | when it gets officially released they'll have details and bulid instrucitons up |
| 03:42.58 | BryceLeo | Writchie: however if you're looking for mrxvt packages or lua5 they're up at pics.and-a-half.com/ipk/ |
| 03:43.03 | Writchie | I'll probably just wait until release. I'm working on low level stuff that doesn't need the ui |
| 03:43.17 | BryceLeo | Writchie: are you one of those crazy hardware radio guys? |
| 03:43.26 | Writchie | certifable |
| 03:43.36 | Writchie | s/certifable/certifiable |
| 03:43.46 | *** join/#openmoko icman (n=icman@123-240-172-33.cctv.dynamic.lsc.net.tw) |
| 03:43.55 | BryceLeo | Writchie: hahaha i get so lost in the confusing words and googling them that i never look at the names |
| 03:44.00 | BryceLeo | the only one i really remember is speed evil |
| 03:46.38 | *** join/#openmoko raster (n=raster@p2141-ipbf2304marunouchi.tokyo.ocn.ne.jp) |
| 03:46.43 | leppoc | you mean that I have been building a soon-to-be-deprecating version for more than 7 hours ? |
| 03:46.46 | leppoc | :D |
| 03:47.11 | leppoc | s/deprecating/deprecated/ |
| 03:50.11 | BryceLeo | leppoc: yes... yes that's right |
| 03:50.40 | BryceLeo | leppoc: but think of how much you're learning! |
| 03:50.54 | BryceLeo | while you're at it http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Application_Development_Crash_Course |
| 03:51.00 | BryceLeo | build your first app for the phone! |
| 03:51.07 | BryceLeo | practice makes perfect :-D |
| 03:54.16 | *** join/#openmoko LetoTo (n=paul@76-10-144-1.dsl.teksavvy.com) |
| 03:54.21 | *** join/#openmoko kaplandj (n=kaplan@c-71-224-204-136.hsd1.pa.comcast.net) |
| 03:55.03 | *** part/#openmoko kaplandj (n=kaplan@c-71-224-204-136.hsd1.pa.comcast.net) |
| 03:55.15 | *** join/#openmoko khester (n=khester@c-24-4-236-98.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 03:55.17 | leppoc | lol |
| 03:55.47 | leppoc | yes, but I must finish the build before :D |
| 03:55.56 | *** join/#openmoko kaplandj (n=kaplan@c-71-224-204-136.hsd1.pa.comcast.net) |
| 03:56.02 | leppoc | I haven't learned so much untill now :D |
| 03:56.44 | leppoc | Is there like a "TODO list" of apps/libs/other stuff that you (openmoko) really want on the phone ? |
| 03:57.12 | leppoc | (nothing low level... I don't have the phone (yet) ) |
| 03:57.14 | BryceLeo | leppoc: it's pretty much an open forum for whereever you mind takes you |
| 03:57.53 | BryceLeo | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Freshman_todo |
| 03:58.22 | BryceLeo | leppoc: there's the freshmen todo that's a little stale but follow that right ot the todo category and it gives you a good bit of things to work on |
| 03:58.25 | leppoc | I know. but lets say that for a cellphone, there are things that must not be mussing. I mean, nobody wants to buy a phone like that if there are no good calendar app (just an example) |
| 03:58.39 | leppoc | ok :) cool |
| 03:59.14 | BryceLeo | leppoc: applications like that are usually done by the core team, you're more than welcome to submit patches to them and heck you might even get a job! |
| 03:59.53 | leppoc | ok. (but I am fine at google for now ;) ) |
| 04:00.08 | BryceLeo | i've put my self into the role of setting up docs to get new guys started, however with the advent of 2007.2 there's gonna be tons of work to do porting docs and making them right again |
| 04:00.32 | BryceLeo | leppoc: if you want a good start http://www.angstrom-distribution.org/ |
| 04:00.33 | leppoc | well, I could help you, since I will get started soon :) |
| 04:00.43 | BryceLeo | the angstrom distro is what OM 2007.2 is based off of |
| 04:00.53 | leppoc | ok |
| 04:00.59 | BryceLeo | on their main page they have a link to a OpenEmbedded userguide pdf so that's a great resource as well |
| 04:01.41 | BryceLeo | leppoc: haha trust me, i'll be needing the help of new guys like you, so we'll be in touch |
| 04:01.53 | leppoc | :) |
| 04:02.12 | BryceLeo | i'm currently spending alot of time building OE ipk's so that we can have a distro repo relatively soon |
| 04:03.17 | leppoc | cool. As a app developper, could I use only binaries and header files for example, without having to compile everything ? |
| 04:06.01 | BryceLeo | leppoc: well, you're probably going to want to compile everything to get a feel for how the build system works, it's a little wonky, but it really depends on the langs you want to develop it |
| 04:06.04 | BryceLeo | what langauges do you do? |
| 04:06.27 | *** join/#openmoko matthew (n=matthew@adsl-80-81-61.sdf.bellsouth.net) |
| 04:06.48 | leppoc | I usually use (in order of personal preference) java, python, C++ and C |
| 04:07.29 | leppoc | but I am guessing that C and C++ are more appropriated for openmoko... (GTK...) |
| 04:08.28 | leppoc | oh nice, the Wish List :) |
| 04:10.57 | BryceLeo | leppoc: |
| 04:11.00 | BryceLeo | whoops |
| 04:11.15 | BryceLeo | leppoc: i've heard that python runs fairly well on the device |
| 04:11.32 | *** join/#openmoko hhf423_ (n=chatzill@A7196.a.strato-dslnet.de) |
| 04:11.55 | BryceLeo | i'd still suggest C or C++ because it's an embeded device and the less resources you need the less power you need the longer batterylife you get |
| 04:12.24 | leppoc | yes, I think that for some tools, it might be ok (like small scripts), bui UI stuff should run in C/C++ |
| 04:12.28 | leppoc | exactly :) |
| 04:13.52 | BryceLeo | leppoc: how familiar are you with autotools? |
| 04:14.41 | BryceLeo | leppoc: or shall i ask what build system do you usually use? |
| 04:15.52 | leppoc | I could not be less familiar.... :-S I use them as a "user", but as a developper, I have always been writing my own makefiles, since I have never be really concerned by the portability of my projects. |
| 04:16.03 | leppoc | (and at Google, we use our own build tools...) |
| 04:16.25 | BryceLeo | http://www.shlomifish.org/lecture/Autotools/ |
| 04:16.41 | BryceLeo | go through "The Autbook" |
| 04:16.49 | BryceLeo | that's a pretty good place to lear |
| 04:16.51 | BryceLeo | n |
| 04:17.01 | leppoc | ok :) thanks |
| 04:17.05 | BryceLeo | no problem |
| 04:17.11 | BryceLeo | and don't feel like you have to do this all tonight! |
| 04:17.15 | leppoc | I have always found autotools way too complicated.... |
| 04:17.21 | leppoc | ;) |
| 04:17.22 | BryceLeo | make some bookmarks and go through it slowly |
| 04:17.27 | leppoc | sure |
| 04:17.36 | BryceLeo | lol leppoc i build these fantastically complicated script files |
| 04:17.44 | BryceLeo | and some by hand make files |
| 04:17.55 | BryceLeo | i'm still getting up with this autotools voodoo |
| 04:18.19 | leppoc | hehe :) voodoo is actually the perfect word for this situation :D |
| 04:19.23 | *** join/#openmoko disguy__ (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-f2b048f8b013d0d8) |
| 04:19.29 | BryceLeo | leppoc: lol wait till you figure out bitbake that's crazy |
| 04:20.42 | leppoc | I am sure it is :) I don't think that the open source community is using really "stupid" things. Otherwise there would be tons of forks of it, and autotools would be dead :D |
| 04:20.56 | *** join/#openmoko sublime (n=richard@mollynet.com) |
| 04:21.45 | BryceLeo | lol there's always people who like their own tools. The only competitor that really comes to mind for autotools is qmake |
| 04:21.51 | BryceLeo | though there are more for sure |
| 04:23.25 | BryceLeo | and bitbake is arguably bad as it just simplifies applying patches that in some cases need to go up-stream... however, since these patches are just because they're gonna be running on an embedded system they don't ever go up stream |
| 04:23.54 | BryceLeo | i'm personally a bitbake fan and think that it's a great solution, but i'm really just a happy kinda guy who likes anything useful |
| 04:24.59 | leppoc | I have been using scons as a make replacement. it's really nice :) |
| 04:25.01 | leppoc | hehe :) |
| 04:25.55 | *** join/#openmoko Richard_ (n=tgr@221.137.146.122) |
| 04:26.15 | BryceLeo | scons is pretty sweet, that's what linuxdcpp uses |
| 04:26.25 | leppoc | yep |
| 04:27.31 | BryceLeo | leppoc: well now ya get something new to learn! how exciting eh? :D |
| 04:27.46 | leppoc | sure it is ! |
| 04:28.01 | leppoc | MokoMakefile seems to be really sweet too |
| 04:28.21 | BryceLeo | leppoc: yeah it is rwhitby did a great job with it |
| 04:28.23 | *** join/#openmoko ashnazg (n=chuckles@adsl-226-20-147.bhm.bellsouth.net) |
| 04:33.17 | *** join/#openmoko heikkit (n=chatzill@c-67-188-122-139.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 04:34.26 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Carriers/ATT]] |
| 04:36.51 | raster | BryceLeo: patches done WELL should be able to be accepted upstream |
| 04:37.09 | raster | (as long as your upstream are decent) |
| 04:37.26 | raster | ie make embedded options #ifdefed and --enabled via configure |
| 04:37.30 | raster | or even able to be configured runtime |
| 04:37.37 | raster | or plugged in and out runtime |
| 04:37.40 | BryceLeo | very true raster |
| 04:38.43 | raster | personally i think all thngs for embedded systems should not have patches |
| 04:38.49 | raster | it should only be a matter of config |
| 04:38.55 | raster | preferably 100% runtime config |
| 04:39.08 | raster | so its actualyl the exact same upstream "desktop" program |
| 04:39.08 | BryceLeo | raster: yes but many of these apps aren't designed or were even thought about for embedded use |
| 04:39.10 | raster | compield for arm |
| 04:39.21 | raster | with different config files and maybe different modules |
| 04:39.22 | BryceLeo | raster: i agree with you, that would be ideal |
| 04:39.39 | raster | thats where either your upsteram is embedded friendly |
| 04:39.39 | raster | ie |
| 04:39.43 | raster | they are hapy to help |
| 04:40.05 | raster | or you go to the effort of making a patch that makes it possible to, in future, make these changes, without having to send patches upstream |
| 04:40.30 | BryceLeo | raster: alot of the apps have been very good about that |
| 04:40.42 | raster | of course doing that is a lot more work - in the short term |
| 04:40.59 | BryceLeo | but when you're working with volunteers you take what you can get |
| 04:41.03 | raster | surew |
| 04:41.49 | BryceLeo | raster: you don't happen to be the guy who's the big cheese with Enlightenment? |
| 04:42.21 | raster | i'm the big gouda i guess |
| 04:42.31 | raster | all smelly and stuff |
| 04:43.07 | BryceLeo | raster: hahaha, well it's a pleasure to meet you, and I love your work |
| 04:43.28 | raster | thanks - but it's a bit slow these days |
| 04:43.31 | raster | way too much to do |
| 04:43.33 | raster | and too little time |
| 04:44.00 | raster | though i am makign e17 embedded-friendly |
| 04:44.07 | BryceLeo | i've always liked your choice of using pawn for embryo |
| 04:44.09 | raster | a lot of the core features are (now) modules |
| 04:44.15 | *** join/#openmoko CIA-24 (n=CIA@208.69.182.149) |
| 04:44.35 | raster | it was a tossup between lua and pawn (was small at the time) |
| 04:44.36 | BryceLeo | wow, heh, a whole lot of work that most people will never notice |
| 04:44.47 | raster | the runtime for embry is a LOT smaller than lua tho |
| 04:44.51 | raster | and a lot faster |
| 04:44.57 | BryceLeo | heh yeah, i used to use small to write simple automation programs on my home router |
| 04:45.12 | raster | actually last i checked it beats the jvm's runtime bytecode engine by 2.5 to 1 |
| 04:45.18 | raster | beats perl by 20:1 |
| 04:45.18 | BryceLeo | haha yeah i actually started getting into lua once i got my treo and got plua for it |
| 04:45.26 | raster | and python 40:1 |
| 04:45.36 | BryceLeo | wow, that's quick |
| 04:45.36 | raster | in terms of speed of command execution |
| 04:45.44 | raster | its about 1/7th the speed of compiled C |
| 04:46.05 | raster | which isn't too bad |
| 04:46.08 | BryceLeo | which is damn good, for desktops that's close enough to native, hell, look at how quick pythons' gotten |
| 04:46.13 | raster | for a non-jit vm engine |
| 04:46.17 | raster | and at 2000 lines of co code |
| 04:46.23 | raster | it probably one of the smallest vm's around |
| 04:46.38 | BryceLeo | and one of the most stable, and memory efficent to boot |
| 04:46.45 | raster | but something like python or perl etc. woudl have been a wrong chocie for me |
| 04:46.56 | raster | embryo is simply a logic clue and description lang |
| 04:46.59 | raster | intended for things like |
| 04:47.10 | raster | "if (this state) then (do this) else (this" |
| 04:47.12 | raster | kind of stuff |
| 04:47.16 | raster | set/get states |
| 04:47.18 | raster | store |
| 04:47.26 | raster | for each of these tiems do this |
| 04:47.26 | raster | etc. |
| 04:47.29 | BryceLeo | it beats writing your own that's for sure |
| 04:47.33 | raster | yeah |
| 04:47.43 | raster | though i had to majorly rework small's code |
| 04:47.48 | raster | i pretty much rewrote the runtime vm |
| 04:47.54 | BryceLeo | yowch |
| 04:47.58 | raster | fixed up all the big vs litle endian bugs |
| 04:48.04 | raster | fixed 32 vs 64bit issues |
| 04:48.05 | BryceLeo | that musta taken a while |
| 04:48.12 | leppoc | raster = rasterman ? the real one ? wow :) |
| 04:48.13 | raster | the compiler is still almost verbatim |
| 04:48.22 | raster | but the runtime is almsot entirely new |
| 04:48.27 | raster | anyway |
| 04:48.29 | leppoc | (sory for interrupting this discussion ;)) |
| 04:48.36 | raster | it's proven nice for its intende use - edje |
| 04:48.38 | raster | intended |
| 04:48.50 | raster | leppoc: actually i'm a wee little leprechaun :) |
| 04:49.30 | leppoc | :D |
| 04:49.38 | BryceLeo | well i should figure you wouldn't need to modify the compiler |
| 04:49.53 | raster | BryceLeo: i did - it wasnt big and little endian safe |
| 04:49.55 | raster | nor 64bit safe |
| 04:50.17 | raster | it is now |
| 04:50.18 | BryceLeo | raster: heh, yeah i knew about the endian problem but i didn't know about the 64bit |
| 04:50.18 | raster | :) |
| 04:50.25 | BryceLeo | raster: that's awesome |
| 04:50.28 | raster | well embryo_cc is |
| 04:50.39 | raster | so i have a guaranteed known compiler and version |
| 04:50.58 | raster | <PROTECTED> |
| 04:51.12 | raster | instead of loading pawn src - compiling in-memory to bytecode then running it |
| 04:51.17 | *** join/#openmoko phrozen77 (n=phrozen7@unaffiliated/phrozen77) |
| 04:51.21 | BryceLeo | that makes sense |
| 04:51.24 | raster | thats why lua is so much fatter runtime |
| 04:51.28 | raster | it needs to parse runtime |
| 04:51.30 | BryceLeo | modular is way easier to debug |
| 04:51.55 | BryceLeo | but still comparatively though lua isn't terribly large |
| 04:52.01 | raster | oh no |
| 04:52.05 | raster | thats why it was a close contender |
| 04:52.11 | raster | other than writign my own from scratch |
| 04:52.18 | raster | i was toying with the idea of that |
| 04:52.22 | raster | but decided not to |
| 04:52.23 | raster | :) |
| 04:52.31 | raster | i've got enough to do |
| 04:52.35 | BryceLeo | which makes sense, why use the effort on that, someone already did a bunch of the work! |
| 04:52.50 | raster | adding a whole language compiler/vm/engine/whatever to it wasn't too desireable |
| 04:52.56 | raster | i'm also a graphcis nerd |
| 04:53.05 | raster | not a compiler/parsing/vm nerd :) |
| 04:53.12 | raster | indeed |
| 04:53.24 | raster | thank god small/pawn existed |
| 04:53.24 | raster | :) |
| 04:53.32 | BryceLeo | hahaha that's for sure! |
| 04:53.40 | raster | it just needed some beating into shape |
| 04:54.12 | BryceLeo | heh, and as long as you don't have to mess with the compiler that keeps it nice, because pawn is ll1 iirc |
| 04:54.14 | *** join/#openmoko Sup3rkiddo (n=sudharsh@unaffiliated/sudharsh) |
| 04:54.31 | raster | ll1? |
| 04:54.46 | BryceLeo | means that there's no ambiguity pretty much |
| 04:55.02 | raster | there shouldnt be in a language |
| 04:55.03 | raster | imho |
| 04:55.07 | BryceLeo | i learned it in my compilers course, i got to implement all sorts of things and make sure that all was still ll1 |
| 04:55.17 | BryceLeo | haha you'd like everything separated out into modules? |
| 04:55.26 | BryceLeo | and libraries |
| 04:55.38 | raster | all languages should be explicit and unambiguous |
| 04:55.48 | raster | yes |
| 04:56.01 | raster | right now e17 has every main config dialog as a module |
| 04:56.13 | BryceLeo | wow.... |
| 04:56.30 | raster | actually comes with about 47 modules |
| 04:56.33 | raster | by default |
| 04:56.43 | raster | the idea is that if you dont like it |
| 04:56.47 | raster | u can remove the module entirely |
| 04:56.54 | BryceLeo | that's fantastic |
| 04:56.57 | raster | no code needs to exist in memory mappings |
| 04:57.02 | BryceLeo | exactly |
| 04:57.03 | raster | u can remove from disk if space is tight |
| 04:57.07 | raster | but even more importantly |
| 04:57.08 | *** join/#openmoko mrface (n=bradpitc@c-71-236-214-109.hsd1.or.comcast.net) |
| 04:57.13 | raster | you can REPLACe the moduel with a different one |
| 04:57.19 | raster | providing the same basic features |
| 04:57.24 | raster | BUT implementing them differently |
| 04:57.25 | raster | eg |
| 04:57.27 | raster | for smaller screens |
| 04:57.34 | raster | or more limtied input devices |
| 04:57.38 | raster | :) |
| 04:57.43 | BryceLeo | or more complex |
| 04:57.47 | raster | sure |
| 04:58.15 | BryceLeo | lol imagine if projects like gnome or java were done like this |
| 04:58.20 | raster | i need to start having canonical module provides |
| 04:58.22 | leppoc | enlightenment is definitely great |
| 04:58.28 | raster | so another module can say it provides feature X |
| 04:58.43 | BryceLeo | that'd be a really sweet feature |
| 04:58.44 | raster | and thus e can smartly go "i have 3 moduels that provide "exebuf" - which do u want?" |
| 04:59.18 | BryceLeo | that would make multi lang easier, have a screen optomized for kanji or symbols and one for characters |
| 05:00.10 | BryceLeo | haha yes but you better hide that from new users or they'll be so confused |
| 05:00.32 | BryceLeo | I already chose enlightenment now you mean i get another choice??? |
| 05:00.48 | raster | hahahaha |
| 05:00.52 | raster | yes |
| 05:00.55 | raster | i'm all for choice |
| 05:00.58 | raster | i love features |
| 05:01.00 | BryceLeo | lol yeah, i'm totally with you on that |
| 05:01.02 | raster | the more - the merrier |
| 05:01.06 | raster | BUT |
| 05:01.12 | raster | implement them in a way that means u dont bloat |
| 05:01.13 | BryceLeo | they have to be well done and useful |
| 05:01.29 | BryceLeo | exactly |
| 05:01.38 | raster | if i include evas's emodules |
| 05:01.51 | raster | e17 loads about 51 module .so's for me |
| 05:01.55 | raster | i have disabled 1 or 2 |
| 05:02.03 | raster | but the main aim is that i have a lot of choice |
| 05:02.14 | raster | i agree with gnome's idea of "just make it work" |
| 05:02.17 | raster | but u need to do both |
| 05:02.26 | raster | have it as close to "it just works" as you can - out of the box |
| 05:02.27 | raster | make it smart |
| 05:02.31 | BryceLeo | wow, yeah but just being able to really strip down and genuinely strip down not just turn off is exactly how computing should be |
| 05:02.34 | raster | but also provide the little twiddle buttons |
| 05:02.37 | raster | under the bonnet |
| 05:02.49 | raster | so the power user can go "ummm - no - i DONT wantthat - i want THIS" |
| 05:03.03 | BryceLeo | hahaha exactly that's how it fricken should be |
| 05:03.09 | *** join/#openmoko dirak2 (n=Mami@c-24-62-62-82.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 05:03.22 | *** join/#openmoko tholin (n=tholin@85.8.6.155.se.wasadata.net) |
| 05:03.26 | *** join/#openmoko phrozen77 (n=phrozen7@unaffiliated/phrozen77) |
| 05:03.27 | raster | yup |
| 05:03.51 | BryceLeo | other than E and e related what other projects are you working on? |
| 05:04.06 | raster | well - depends what you mean by "work" |
| 05:04.09 | raster | i "work" for a bank |
| 05:04.17 | raster | i dont do any open soruce or e stuff for work |
| 05:04.38 | raster | so e stuff i do in my spare time (evenings, weekends - when i get time) |
| 05:04.40 | raster | so really |
| 05:04.44 | raster | i dont have time other than for e |
| 05:04.56 | ljp | would you work on e for work if you could? |
| 05:04.57 | BryceLeo | haha well that makes sense |
| 05:04.58 | raster | e + libs in cvs is something not shy of a million lines of c code |
| 05:05.09 | BryceLeo | holy poo.... |
| 05:05.30 | raster | so last i checked - linux kernel was 6 or so million lines of c code |
| 05:05.40 | *** join/#openmoko ozarka (n=edlin@cpe-76-184-78-54.tx.res.rr.com) |
| 05:05.42 | BryceLeo | damn |
| 05:05.47 | raster | just the core libs needed for e17 itself + e |
| 05:06.46 | raster | is |
| 05:06.48 | raster | um... |
| 05:07.52 | BryceLeo | alot ;) |
| 05:07.52 | leppoc | :D |
| 05:07.52 | raster | <PROTECTED> |
| 05:07.52 | raster | so about 1/3rd of cvs is just e17 core |
| 05:07.52 | BryceLeo | wow, that's actually reasonable |
| 05:07.58 | raster | lots of other stuff there too |
| 05:08.02 | raster | anyway |
| 05:08.04 | raster | keeps me busy |
| 05:08.04 | BryceLeo | heh that's awesome |
| 05:08.26 | BryceLeo | what sort of bank work do you do? like do you work tech for them or do you do bank type work |
| 05:08.26 | *** part/#openmoko Writchie (n=bigW@rrcs-24-172-122-130.midsouth.biz.rr.com) |
| 05:08.54 | raster | ljp: ooh - and yes - if the offer was right- i would do e fulltime |
| 05:09.01 | raster | :) |
| 05:09.08 | raster | BryceLeo: morgan stanley |
| 05:09.16 | raster | i'm in IT |
| 05:09.20 | raster | pays the bills |
| 05:09.56 | BryceLeo | no shame in that, i work and go to school at The College of New Jersey and i shoot weddings as an associate or second for Laura Eaton photography and book some of my own clients when i have the time |
| 05:10.53 | BryceLeo | lol hhf423 then again i check that daily so.... |
| 05:10.55 | hhf423 | BryceLeo: :-) not my yesterday :-) |
| 05:11.09 | BryceLeo | lol btw raster my brother idolizes you |
| 05:11.15 | raster | BryceLeo: that'll keep you busy |
| 05:11.16 | BryceLeo | hhf423: touche! |
| 05:11.36 | raster | BryceLeo: eek |
| 05:11.42 | BryceLeo | raster: haha yeah it does, that's why i stick with writing docs and getting other people started developing |
| 05:11.58 | BryceLeo | raster: the only project i have planned if it doesn't get fixed is this keyboard debacle |
| 05:12.26 | BryceLeo | raster: lol no no he's harmless, just over zealous |
| 05:13.15 | BryceLeo | man, building every package in OE takes some time |
| 05:13.16 | BryceLeo | that's for sure |
| 05:13.22 | *** join/#openmoko cjb (n=cjb@pullcord.laptop.org) |
| 05:13.23 | raster | i never really go with the thing of having heros and idols and stuff |
| 05:13.23 | BryceLeo | shit... i forgot to upade before i started this |
| 05:13.30 | pjz | ouch |
| 05:13.37 | raster | i always look at objective goals and work at them |
| 05:13.59 | BryceLeo | raster: i'm in your boat, there are people who you gotta respect for there work, but don't have heores or idolize people use them as a reason to kick your own ass into gear |
| 05:14.05 | raster | indeed |
| 05:14.07 | BryceLeo | he's 23 and still lives at home because he can't get out |
| 05:14.10 | raster | respect - absolutely |
| 05:14.27 | raster | theres are a tonne of very gifted, hard working, smart people who have written tonnes of software |
| 05:14.30 | raster | that is not easy to do |
| 05:14.42 | raster | and they have every ounce of respect from me |
| 05:14.46 | raster | they deserve it |
| 05:15.18 | BryceLeo | exactly, he's an english major and tends toromantazice things |
| 05:15.34 | raster | aaah that might explain it |
| 05:15.46 | raster | i think i lost that romantic gene somewhere along the way |
| 05:15.46 | raster | :) |
| 05:15.56 | raster | i'm probably overly anylitical |
| 05:16.28 | BryceLeo | lol nothing wrong with that |
| 05:17.14 | BryceLeo | gets the job done quicker and more correctly mostof the time |
| 05:18.37 | raster | yeah |
| 05:18.41 | raster | but it sucks sometimes |
| 05:18.53 | raster | as u sit and anylise to death |
| 05:18.53 | *** join/#openmoko ^leo^```` (n=user@r190-64-53-225.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy) |
| 05:19.01 | BryceLeo | true bu that's how it is with all things |
| 05:19.04 | raster | i need to trust my instincts more often and skip the analysis |
| 05:19.17 | raster | i've found my insticts seem to be spot on most of the time |
| 05:19.21 | raster | i just hate not knowing WHY |
| 05:19.35 | BryceLeo | for me that's always one of the most important questions |
| 05:19.59 | pjz | instinct that's that right isn't really instinct, it's high order pattern recognition |
| 05:20.53 | pjz | "this thing I'm looking at reminds me most of this past experience which means that the analagous place to look for the problem is ..." |
| 05:20.59 | hhf423 | but still, if you don't contious know why something is, thats difficult |
| 05:21.06 | raster | pjz: i know |
| 05:21.33 | raster | pjz: thats why i should try avoid the continual "i must find out why" |
| 05:21.37 | raster | and save myself time |
| 05:21.39 | pjz | the other thing that works for me is having lots of different mental 'tools' |
| 05:21.41 | BryceLeo | but instinct is so much quicker to say and gets the point accross |
| 05:21.42 | raster | i need to prioritise better |
| 05:21.47 | pjz | analyize something from several points of view |
| 05:21.52 | raster | as i will sink lots of time into finding the why's of trivial simple things |
| 05:21.58 | raster | that i should ignore |
| 05:22.03 | BryceLeo | raster: task freak is a pretty sweet app |
| 05:22.11 | raster | the problem is |
| 05:22.17 | raster | someone wants to do X |
| 05:22.23 | hhf423 | raster, I think I disagree, you need to get to know why something is every now and then to refine your unconcious pattern matcher |
| 05:22.27 | raster | my instircts go "ewwww - yuk yuk.. no no!" |
| 05:22.35 | raster | and i tel them "don't do that!" |
| 05:22.36 | BryceLeo | works for me for balancing work and foss stuff |
| 05:22.42 | pjz | raster: well, that can be good or bad. good b/c you end up knowing a whole lot more about how tings work; bad because it does tend to be a bit time consuming and no immediate payoff |
| 05:22.52 | raster | but then they require me to formulate a damn document on detailign why they shouldnt |
| 05:22.55 | pjz | raster: consider like 'pure research' |
| 05:23.02 | hhf423 | see? :-) |
| 05:23.05 | raster | so i go sink a tonne of time into dissecting my instincts |
| 05:23.07 | pjz | raster: not immediately useful, but someday |
| 05:23.27 | raster | hhf423: yes- every now and again - but most of the time? no. |
| 05:23.59 | raster | pjz: i know :) the problem now is the time sink |
| 05:24.07 | raster | i've spent most of my life figuring out the whys |
| 05:24.12 | raster | i suspect i've done enough |
| 05:24.14 | hhf423 | raster: no, not most of the time. For me, I think whats work is "reputation", which is just a measuremet on how little you have to explain :-) |
| 05:24.20 | raster | tiem to just makie use of that training |
| 05:24.41 | raster | hhf423: i know - the problem is - if you work in a company with 60,000 employees |
| 05:24.49 | raster | reputation doesnt go around very fast or far |
| 05:25.04 | raster | the "just trust me" line doesn't seem to buy a lot |
| 05:25.39 | hhf423 | raster: hmm, I work in a 300,000+ company and I seem to meet the same people all the time ;-) |
| 05:26.26 | raster | hhf423: i tend to spread myself out |
| 05:26.30 | raster | but thats my position |
| 05:26.42 | raster | i'm unix systems architect for equities for all of asia |
| 05:26.52 | raster | (trade plant engineering) |
| 05:26.58 | raster | so i tend to have a very wide reach |
| 05:27.02 | raster | and since its a bank |
| 05:27.06 | raster | they doint give a crap who u are |
| 05:27.08 | raster | they dont know it |
| 05:27.13 | raster | what matters is your title |
| 05:27.14 | raster | eg |
| 05:27.18 | raster | VP ED or MD |
| 05:28.14 | hhf423 | yeah, I know. Being IT in a non-IT company is not so nice, because youre just there so that the bloody computers work |
| 05:28.55 | raster | aye |
| 05:29.06 | hhf423 | one of the reasons why I will not switch to a non-IT company I think |
| 05:29.34 | hhf423 | then again, of all the non IT companies Banks probably realize best that IT is really important |
| 05:30.21 | hhf423 | I just talked to some IT guys from a ship building co, and there they often get "we're in ships, not IT so get out of my hair" treatment |
| 05:31.39 | BryceLeo | raster: you still lookin for a sercer? |
| 05:31.43 | BryceLeo | server* |
| 05:31.55 | hhf423 | hmmm, should have said "retail banks" when I said banks. In investment, they still thinks its the brilliant analysts who make the money, not the computers ... |
| 05:32.10 | BryceLeo | i think i could get my hands on a 4u rackmount 2 xeons's 3.4ghz runs on 220 current |
| 05:33.12 | *** join/#openmoko mickeyl (i=mickey@srv043.dedi23.de) |
| 05:33.19 | *** join/#openmoko Dmitry_Platonov (n=hawk@user-89-248-176-130.gagarino.net) |
| 05:34.23 | *** join/#openmoko telconta1 (n=adam@dsl081-165-219.sea1.dsl.speakeasy.net) |
| 05:35.10 | *** part/#openmoko mickeyl (i=mickey@srv043.dedi23.de) |
| 05:36.37 | *** part/#openmoko ozarka (n=edlin@cpe-76-184-78-54.tx.res.rr.com) |
| 05:38.33 | BryceLeo | well it's been fun guys but i bid you goodnight |
| 05:39.21 | BryceLeo | raster it was damn cool getting to chat, keep up the killer work and i look forward to seeing the work you continue to do, |
| 05:39.28 | BryceLeo | bye all |
| 05:39.32 | *** part/#openmoko BryceLeo (n=bryce@nj-71-48-102-108.dhcp.embarqhsd.net) |
| 05:39.33 | leppoc | bye |
| 05:41.02 | raster | night! |
| 05:42.05 | hhf423 | gnight |
| 05:46.47 | hhf423 | hmm, wiki way slowww |
| 05:49.29 | Dmitry_Platonov | Heh. At least, 2007.2 splashscreen changed from Angstrom to OM. But still does not work in qemu (no touchscreen calibration on first boot, black screen with icons alog top) |
| 05:53.37 | *** join/#openmoko dkirker (n=dkirker@c-24-6-210-139.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 06:00.34 | daMaestro | hmmm so to be able to sign up for tmobile myTmobile ... you need to be able to receive a sms with a password |
| 06:00.47 | daMaestro | is there any way to manually get the sms? |
| 06:02.13 | *** join/#openmoko mickeyl (i=mickey@srv043.dedi23.de) |
| 06:03.09 | raster | umm |
| 06:03.14 | raster | isntsms a push service |
| 06:03.14 | raster | ie |
| 06:03.20 | raster | when the provider wants to send u the sms |
| 06:03.33 | raster | the gsm subsystem will get data from the tower and wake up |
| 06:03.44 | raster | interrupt whoever is listening to the device |
| 06:03.57 | raster | and thus userspace needs to read the sms data? |
| 06:04.05 | doc|home | yup |
| 06:04.11 | Dmitry_Platonov | daMaestro, check GSM 07.05 |
| 06:17.41 | blindcoder | moin |
| 06:20.45 | daMaestro | wow, nice there it is, thanks raster, doc|home, Dmitry_Platonov |
| 06:25.57 | daMaestro | and somehow i've managed to not use any minutes; awesome |
| 06:26.08 | *** join/#openmoko phrozen77 (n=phrozen7@unaffiliated/phrozen77) |
| 06:26.29 | mrface | is buildhost down? |
| 06:27.23 | daMaestro | it was when i last looked |
| 06:27.30 | mrface | damn |
| 06:27.40 | mrface | I have no qemu :( |
| 06:32.00 | *** join/#openmoko rmoravcik (n=rmoravci@ip-89-103-152-149.karneval.cz) |
| 06:33.51 | *** join/#openmoko phrozen77_ (n=phrozen7@unaffiliated/phrozen77) |
| 06:34.46 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[User:Shadowjack]] [[OpenMoko]] [[Main_Page]] [[Minimo]] [[Category:Neo1973_phase_1_related_OpenMoko_documentation]] [[Comenzando_desde_el_principio_con_su_Neo1973]] [[Category:Documentation]] [[Hardware:NearlyTouchScreen]] [[P1_Owners]] |
| 06:36.00 | *** join/#openmoko mzb_d800 (n=mzb@ppp108-88.static.internode.on.net) |
| 06:43.29 | doc|home | does anyone know does the treo 650 (which openmoko supports) have wifi? I don't think it does :/ |
| 06:43.38 | CIA-24 | openmoko: 03mickey * r2638 10/trunk/oe/packages/ (4 files in 3 dirs): |
| 06:43.38 | CIA-24 | openmoko: oe/uboot: resync w/ OE |
| 06:43.38 | CIA-24 | openmoko: FYI: In OpenEmbedded, uboot-gta01 has just been renamed uboot-openmoko (by me) |
| 06:46.33 | *** join/#openmoko cyphi (n=cyphi@a91-153-116-247.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 06:46.38 | hads | doc|home: No |
| 06:46.44 | doc|home | ok, thanks |
| 06:48.02 | *** join/#openmoko Q_Continuum (n=Q@rrcs-67-52-219-78.west.biz.rr.com) |
| 06:51.40 | *** join/#openmoko phrozen77_ (n=phrozen7@unaffiliated/phrozen77) |
| 07:00.04 | *** join/#openmoko dkirker_ (n=dkirker@c-24-6-210-139.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 07:01.06 | daMaestro | well, building updates is quite nice |
| 07:01.11 | daMaestro | took 15 minutes |
| 07:06.05 | leppoc | building everything for the first time is painfull :) 11hours 'till now :) |
| 07:10.36 | daMaestro | more then 11 here |
| 07:20.18 | *** join/#openmoko Taco (n=rtm@pool-151-199-18-133.bos.east.verizon.net) |
| 07:20.46 | Taco | Hi - does anyone know the proper way to set the timezone on the neo1973? |
| 07:28.11 | *** join/#openmoko jpozlovsky (n=jindra@rb5cc115.net.upc.cz) |
| 07:28.52 | *** join/#openmoko Q_Continuum (n=Q@rrcs-67-52-219-78.west.biz.rr.com) |
| 07:37.43 | *** join/#openmoko buz (n=buz@84-73-66-71.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 07:39.24 | *** join/#openmoko guillaum1 (n=Guillaum@AMontsouris-153-1-9-31.w86-212.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 07:42.57 | *** join/#openmoko unmadindu (n=sayamind@gnu-india/admin/unmadindu) |
| 07:46.20 | *** part/#openmoko rmoravcik (n=rmoravci@ip-89-103-152-149.karneval.cz) |
| 07:48.26 | *** join/#openmoko Freed (n=jecsar@mac33-2-82-225-98-209.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 07:48.31 | *** join/#openmoko l4rs (n=laprican@hsiproxy.astra-net.com) |
| 07:48.46 | aloril | (script) planet: Jon Phillips: CC Desktop Integration Progress http://rejon.org/2007/08/05/cc-desktop-integration-progress/ |
| 07:48.56 | *** part/#openmoko Freed (n=jecsar@mac33-2-82-225-98-209.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 07:50.32 | *** join/#openmoko sudharsh_ (n=sudharsh@59.92.70.217) |
| 07:50.58 | *** join/#openmoko n0on3 (n=n0on3@81-208-83-247.fastres.net) |
| 08:00.46 | *** join/#openmoko denis^da (n=denis@p5B07FA68.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 08:04.15 | *** join/#openmoko wooKieface (n=benjamin@x1-6-00-03-2f-29-99-b9.k961.webspeed.dk) |
| 08:07.58 | ScaredyCat | sannes: ping |
| 08:08.22 | *** part/#openmoko holtmann (n=holtmann@nikita.holtmann.net) |
| 08:08.47 | sannes | hey :) |
| 08:09.54 | sannes | ScaredyCat: pong |
| 08:10.38 | ScaredyCat | you still after gdb for arm ? |
| 08:11.19 | sannes | yes, so I can do some debugging on vacation :) |
| 08:11.37 | ScaredyCat | I've put it on my site .... help yourself :) http://www.automated.it/openmoko/build/linux-arm-gdb.tar.gz |
| 08:12.55 | sannes | ScaredyCat: Thanks :) |
| 08:15.41 | daMaestro | ummmmmmmmmmmmmm |
| 08:15.47 | daMaestro | i just noticed i got charged twice |
| 08:23.27 | *** join/#openmoko remiss (i=roger@remiss.org) |
| 08:27.21 | *** join/#openmoko morricone (n=foobar@dslb-084-057-144-178.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 08:32.06 | *** join/#openmoko jgm (n=jgm@host-87-74-179-156.bulldogdsl.com) |
| 08:33.46 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Flashing_openmoko]] [[User_talk:Alf]] [[Kernel/it]] [[Buying_Interest_List]] |
| 08:38.14 | *** join/#openmoko morricone (n=foobar@dslb-084-057-144-178.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 08:43.52 | *** join/#openmoko PBeck (n=PBeck@HSI-KBW-091-089-102-236.hsi2.kabelbw.de) |
| 08:44.07 | *** join/#openmoko l4rs (n=laprican@hsiproxy.astra-net.com) |
| 08:44.08 | PBeck | hi |
| 08:45.58 | *** join/#openmoko greghunt (n=greg@87-194-105-11.bethere.co.uk) |
| 08:48.59 | *** join/#openmoko _Qwerty_ (n=qwerty@83.172.69.22) |
| 08:52.31 | *** join/#openmoko Magon (n=Magon@213.155.227.226) |
| 08:55.45 | ScaredyCat | wtf |
| 08:55.56 | ScaredyCat | daMaestro got charge twice?1!! |
| 08:56.25 | CIA-24 | openmoko: 03laforge * r2639 10/trunk/oe/packages/linux/linux-gta01/ (defconfig-2.6.21.6-fic-gta01 defconfig-2.6.22.1-fic-gta01): use NWFPE instead of FASTFPE |
| 08:59.33 | rtyler | woot! it apears my account has been charged for about $325 |
| 09:01.37 | *** join/#openmoko chris^ (n=kraetzi@p548AD7BD.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 09:04.33 | *** join/#openmoko zipola (n=zipola@zip.kortex.jyu.fi) |
| 09:07.01 | cdbot2 | * * OM Bug 686 has been created by <laforge> |
| 09:07.02 | cdbot2 | * * USB descriptor incorrectly claims 5 interfaces |
| 09:07.03 | cdbot2 | * * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=686 |
| 09:11.02 | *** join/#openmoko Sup3rkiddo (n=sudharsh@unaffiliated/sudharsh) |
| 09:11.49 | *** join/#openmoko mdt (n=mdt@littlelun.emdete.de) |
| 09:11.49 | *** join/#openmoko olv (n=olvaffe@218-166-221-116.dynamic.hinet.net) |
| 09:13.09 | SpeedEvil | da: to recieve SMS - see the 'manually using SMS on the webpage |
| 09:14.29 | *** join/#openmoko n0on3_ (n=n0on3@81-208-83-247.fastres.net) |
| 09:21.01 | *** join/#openmoko meandtheshell (n=markus@85.127.109.10) |
| 09:22.23 | ScaredyCat | so, why in my builds are all the main images missing? |
| 09:24.00 | *** join/#openmoko tHe_IkkE (n=tHe_IkkE@84.27.74.7) |
| 09:27.59 | *** join/#openmoko zell1983 (n=zell1983@host123-56-dynamic.14-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 09:32.28 | *** part/#openmoko guillaum1 (n=Guillaum@AMontsouris-153-1-9-31.w86-212.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 09:33.48 | SpeedEvil | Anyone know if it's possible to get cell-site information? I've found network information, signal information, but no cell-site info. |
| 09:34.23 | *** join/#openmoko deepank (n=deepank@59.176.34.129) |
| 09:36.18 | mdt | SpeedEvil, when i played around with libgsmd-tool it told me a cell-id i think |
| 09:36.48 | mdt | but libgsmd-tool does not work anymore since the update yesterday :/ |
| 09:39.11 | Kliment_ | SpeedEvil: there's an AT command for it |
| 09:40.10 | SpeedEvil | Kliment_: yes - two even. |
| 09:40.27 | *** join/#openmoko deepank_ (n=deepank@59.176.34.129) |
| 09:40.31 | SpeedEvil | mdt: hmm |
| 09:40.40 | mdt | SpeedEvil, hm, it just does not startup gsmd... the tool works. |
| 09:41.08 | SpeedEvil | I was - perhaps foolishly - assuming that the wiki listed all available commands. |
| 09:41.14 | Kliment_ | at+creg=2 |
| 09:41.20 | Kliment_ | and then |
| 09:41.22 | Kliment_ | at+creg? |
| 09:41.47 | mdt | does gsmd that by default with 'O'? |
| 09:41.47 | SpeedEvil | On anohter topic. |
| 09:41.53 | ScaredyCat | at+creg=2 |
| 09:42.00 | Kliment_ | sadly I don't have a neo so can't test |
| 09:42.01 | ScaredyCat | at+creg? |
| 09:42.11 | ScaredyCat | =2 turns it on |
| 09:42.19 | SpeedEvil | Does anyone get a 20-30s delay sometimes when sshing to the phone? |
| 09:42.34 | mdt | SpeedEvil, no, a dns prob? |
| 09:42.40 | SpeedEvil | nope |
| 09:42.41 | *** join/#openmoko Henrikw (n=henrik@38.80-203-113.nextgentel.com) |
| 09:42.45 | SpeedEvil | specifying ip |
| 09:43.00 | mdt | SpeedEvil, theere no resolv.conf on the phone when delivered - don't know what that means... |
| 09:43.24 | mdt | nono, the neo resolves your host |
| 09:43.37 | mdt | put the host ip in /etc/hosts |
| 09:43.43 | mdt | (with a name... ;) ) |
| 09:43.44 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@141.80-202-161.nextgentel.com) |
| 09:44.10 | SpeedEvil | Ah - my phone had crashed. |
| 09:44.18 | SpeedEvil | well - powered off |
| 09:44.23 | mdt | oups |
| 09:44.25 | *** join/#openmoko rxr (n=rene@port-212-202-170-151.dynamic.qsc.de) |
| 09:44.34 | SpeedEvil | mdt: it means that you have to set it up before doing the GPRS thing. |
| 09:44.38 | Taco | Does anyone know of a way to set the timezone on a neo? |
| 09:44.46 | mdt | mine sometimes powers off after some seconds in u-boot. is that normal? |
| 09:44.59 | Taco | mdt: Yes |
| 09:45.09 | mdt | SpeedEvil, you are logging into it via gprs? :D |
| 09:45.16 | SpeedEvil | No. |
| 09:45.24 | SpeedEvil | You can't do outbound connections. |
| 09:45.27 | mdt | Taco, whatfor? |
| 09:45.27 | SpeedEvil | err |
| 09:45.29 | SpeedEvil | inbound |
| 09:45.35 | SpeedEvil | at least via my provider |
| 09:45.38 | Taco | mdt: If you hit the AUX button every 15 seconds or so, that won't happen. |
| 09:45.40 | mdt | SpeedEvil, depends on you opertor |
| 09:45.57 | mdt | Taco, ah, that explains exactly what i saw - thnx! |
| 09:46.04 | Kliment_ | inbound is usually a nono independent of operator |
| 09:46.06 | Taco | mdt: I think it's acknowledged to be a bug. |
| 09:46.09 | SpeedEvil | I would not want inbound packets at 3 quid a meg, without some cryptologically signed packets. |
| 09:46.10 | sannes | hm, anyone have a work around for for gsm dying (modem dead timer) |
| 09:46.13 | Kliment_ | and very good reasons for that |
| 09:46.22 | Kliment_ | precisely, SpeedEvil |
| 09:46.36 | SpeedEvil | Anyone in the UK. |
| 09:46.39 | SpeedEvil | T-mobile. |
| 09:46.49 | ScaredyCat | AT+CREG? |
| 09:46.49 | ScaredyCat | +CREG: 2,5,"0168","9E5F" |
| 09:46.58 | Kliment_ | ScaredyCat: that's a cellid |
| 09:47.13 | mdt | ScaredyCat, and now you need the operators database to know where u are... |
| 09:47.14 | ScaredyCat | that's what he wanted isn't it |
| 09:47.21 | SpeedEvil | They currently have an offer on PAYG phones - buy one phone with 10 quid top-up on the SIM, and get 10 free days of GPRS |
| 09:47.51 | mdt | SpeedEvil, does /etc/host solve your problem? |
| 09:48.03 | SpeedEvil | mdt: No, turning the phone back on did. |
| 09:48.07 | ScaredyCat | of course... if the gps was working... it'd be very easy to generate a coverage map of our own |
| 09:48.32 | *** join/#openmoko phrozen77 (n=phrozen7@unaffiliated/phrozen77) |
| 09:48.38 | SpeedEvil | The GPS hardware works, the software should be along real soon now |
| 09:48.52 | Kliment_ | mdt: ever heard of placelab? |
| 09:49.19 | ScaredyCat | the hardware is as good as broken without the software |
| 09:49.53 | Kliment_ | ScaredyCat: not exactly true |
| 09:50.05 | ScaredyCat | Kliment_: sorry, didn't see that you'd posted the AT+CREG info... |
| 09:50.19 | Kliment_ | no worries |
| 09:50.23 | mdt | Kliment_, no, what's that? |
| 09:50.38 | Kliment_ | mdt: a free database of radio beacons and locations |
| 09:50.53 | mdt | Kliment_, ah, yes, heard of it but did not know the name |
| 09:51.06 | Kliment_ | it's the nicest thing to come out of intel research |
| 09:51.10 | Kliment_ | some very good people there |
| 09:51.16 | mdt | so we put a daemon into the neo sending location & cell info there ? :D |
| 09:51.31 | Kliment_ | mdt: yes |
| 09:52.00 | Kliment_ | problem is it has a java dependency at the moment |
| 09:52.01 | *** join/#openmoko fabiand (n=fabiand@wlan-client-302.informatik.uni-bremen.de) |
| 09:52.15 | mdt | Kliment_, how that? |
| 09:52.27 | Kliment_ | just the way it's implemented |
| 09:52.42 | mdt | large parts of the code? |
| 09:52.48 | Kliment_ | essentially all |
| 09:53.11 | mdt | should not be so compliceted... is it a http request? |
| 09:53.22 | Kliment_ | it does calculation locally |
| 09:53.39 | mdt | Kliment_, hm, did u write that? |
| 09:53.43 | Kliment_ | grab the source and have a look |
| 09:53.46 | Kliment_ | no, I didn't |
| 09:53.54 | Kliment_ | intel research guys did |
| 09:54.02 | Kliment_ | but I've used it for several projects |
| 09:54.41 | mdt | but u have source access..? |
| 09:54.53 | Kliment_ | mdt: it's open source |
| 09:55.06 | mdt | is placelab owned by intel? |
| 09:55.14 | Kliment_ | http://placelab.org/toolkit/ |
| 09:55.59 | ScaredyCat | mdt: surely it'd be better to put it into a sqlite db and then sync it once a week or somehting... |
| 09:56.22 | ScaredyCat | but also keep a copy on the neo... |
| 09:56.35 | Kliment_ | ScaredyCat: I think that's pretty much what it does |
| 09:56.41 | ScaredyCat | so that when gps was down you could still map yourself |
| 09:56.46 | Kliment_ | yes |
| 09:56.53 | Kliment_ | that's the whole point of it |
| 09:57.02 | ScaredyCat | good |
| 09:57.07 | ScaredyCat | :D |
| 09:57.14 | SpeedEvil | what is this - GSM cell-site ID to alphanumeric and coords? |
| 09:57.28 | Kliment_ | it's an adaptable location source |
| 09:57.33 | Kliment_ | it uses gps if available |
| 09:57.46 | Kliment_ | if not it triangulates a location using any available radio beacon |
| 09:57.53 | Kliment_ | cellid, bluetooth, wifi |
| 09:58.03 | raster | nice |
| 09:58.07 | raster | all wrapped up |
| 09:58.10 | raster | is it reliable? |
| 09:58.20 | ScaredyCat | as reliable as the data ;) |
| 09:58.21 | Kliment_ | as reliable as the radio and the database |
| 09:58.24 | Kliment_ | genau |
| 09:58.28 | mdt | ScaredyCat, there is no oe-ipkg sqlite3 or am i wrong? |
| 09:58.29 | raster | and is it efficient enough to call multiple times per second |
| 09:58.30 | raster | :) |
| 09:58.36 | ScaredyCat | well... |
| 09:58.40 | raster | hehehe |
| 09:58.43 | Kliment_ | raster: the processing is pretty light |
| 09:58.44 | ScaredyCat | I hav it built for the go.. |
| 09:58.47 | ScaredyCat | ttgo |
| 09:58.53 | raster | ok |
| 09:58.54 | raster | cool |
| 09:59.03 | ScaredyCat | and ttgo apps run w/o mods on neo |
| 09:59.04 | SpeedEvil | ah - right. |
| 09:59.05 | Kliment_ | raster: but it requires java as it is |
| 09:59.15 | raster | i'd love maybe one day to see games that can use gps, accelerometers etc. |
| 09:59.25 | raster | to play things like "capture the flag" |
| 09:59.30 | raster | or other games |
| 09:59.31 | Kliment_ | raster: yeah, I'm working with some people working on such stuff |
| 09:59.32 | raster | butin real life |
| 09:59.35 | raster | with your phone |
| 09:59.40 | raster | run around a real city and real "map" |
| 09:59.43 | Kliment_ | raster: mixed reality and related concepts |
| 09:59.49 | *** join/#openmoko chris^^ (n=kraetzi@p548AD7BD.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 09:59.56 | raster | phone can keep up with orientation and location at a reasonable hz |
| 09:59.57 | ScaredyCat | so it should be pretty easy to fix for oe packagining |
| 10:00.04 | raster | oooh ewww |
| 10:00.05 | raster | java |
| 10:00.13 | Kliment_ | raster: the euro-commission projects IPCITY and PASION are working on this sort of thing |
| 10:00.14 | raster | there goes efficiency |
| 10:00.21 | raster | might just port it to c |
| 10:00.21 | raster | :) |
| 10:00.22 | ScaredyCat | lol |
| 10:00.24 | Kliment_ | raster: the code is simple grab the source and port |
| 10:00.35 | raster | java is ok cpu-wise these days |
| 10:00.42 | raster | buty the jvm's memory footprint is a beast |
| 10:00.48 | Kliment_ | raster: the only nonportable thing is the interface to other parts |
| 10:00.51 | *** join/#openmoko henla464_ (n=henla464@c-5863e455.019-357-6c6b701.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se) |
| 10:00.52 | SpeedEvil | raster: accelerometers can't be used for inertial navigation like that. |
| 10:01.10 | Kliment_ | SpeedEvil: accels can be used for inertial navigation |
| 10:01.15 | SpeedEvil | raster: Well - not without getting about 5 orders of magnitude better than the state of the art. |
| 10:01.26 | Kliment_ | SpeedEvil: so you poll gps once a second and use accels in between |
| 10:01.55 | SpeedEvil | The ones mentioned in the mailing list are of debatable use even for that. |
| 10:01.57 | doc|home | are there any efforts to reverse engineer the gsm stack or is that a completely unreasonable idea? |
| 10:02.05 | doc|home | (unofficial of course :) ) |
| 10:02.06 | SpeedEvil | It's impossible |
| 10:02.16 | SpeedEvil | we don't ahve access to the flash image, or how to flash it |
| 10:02.17 | Kliment_ | SpeedEvil: there was a virtual reality conference recently where a company was demoing an accel-based motion capture suit |
| 10:02.34 | Kliment_ | doc|home: why would you want to do that? |
| 10:02.36 | doc|home | SpeedEvil: can't it be lifted off the chip? |
| 10:02.52 | doc|home | Kliment_: theoretically, to replace the one non FOSS piece of it |
| 10:03.15 | Kliment_ | doc|home: and make it noncompliant and illegal to use anywhere |
| 10:03.20 | SpeedEvil | Kliment_: the accels mentioned on the mailing list are some 16 times worse than the state of the art. For motion capture, it works well, as you know all the limbs are attached. This _drastically_ reduces the number of variables. |
| 10:03.31 | doc|home | Kliment_: reverse engineering is legal |
| 10:03.38 | SpeedEvil | It would actually make the phone illegal to sell in the UK. |
| 10:03.44 | Kliment_ | doc|home: but running it with a modified firmware is not |
| 10:03.45 | raster | doc|home: the whole point is - why? |
| 10:03.45 | SpeedEvil | And to add the open-source bit. |
| 10:03.46 | *** join/#openmoko deepank__ (n=deepank@59.176.34.129) |
| 10:03.46 | doc|home | how? |
| 10:03.55 | doc|home | raster: what I just said |
| 10:04.01 | raster | thats not a good reason imho |
| 10:04.04 | SpeedEvil | Changing the GSM stack means that some people will do bad stuff with it. |
| 10:04.11 | raster | just to replace with oss is not a good idea |
| 10:04.19 | raster | when it means its basically non-compliant |
| 10:04.22 | doc|home | raster: as it stands now, if there's a bug in the firmware, the phones have to be sent back |
| 10:04.29 | raster | is likely to bring lawsuits and other crap from telco's |
| 10:04.31 | Kliment_ | if I have a software defined radio on that band I can completely jam the airwaves for everybody |
| 10:04.43 | raster | in the end it will result in telcos finding a way to ban devices from a manufacturer like openmoko |
| 10:04.44 | Kliment_ | doc|home: oh, you can reflash with a new image from software |
| 10:04.47 | raster | and everyone loses |
| 10:04.50 | SpeedEvil | This being a mass-market phone, do you really want tens of thousands of twelve-yearolds having a 'free data transfer' app that blocks everyone elses radio comms? |
| 10:05.13 | raster | in the end |
| 10:05.19 | raster | the gsm firmware is like the vga bios |
| 10:05.20 | doc|home | Kliment_: I didn't think you could. Wasn't there something that was buggy but would require people to send back the phones to fix? |
| 10:05.23 | raster | or any other bios/firmware |
| 10:05.26 | ScaredyCat | SpeedEvil: that should be automatic on trains ;) |
| 10:05.28 | raster | it is inside the gsm device |
| 10:05.31 | raster | and can stay there |
| 10:05.43 | raster | consider a firmware bug in the gdm subsystem a full hardware bug |
| 10:05.46 | raster | and is non-correctable |
| 10:06.03 | Kliment_ | I do remember someone implementing a sub-dsl data transfer system that ran on phone lines |
| 10:06.08 | raster | the questions is - where do u stops with the "open source" |
| 10:06.09 | raster | thing |
| 10:06.13 | raster | eg |
| 10:06.26 | raster | you dont have the source to the microcode that lies underneath the arm instructionset |
| 10:06.34 | raster | (well ok- i dont know if there is - but x86 cpus do have it) |
| 10:06.35 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@qiqinebs.chi.il.us) |
| 10:06.39 | Kliment_ | it is nontrivial but possible to implement GSM in an SDR |
| 10:06.39 | ScaredyCat | if RS had his way.. it'd be everyhting |
| 10:06.47 | raster | but it doesnt prevent you doing things the device was designed to do |
| 10:06.50 | doc|home | raster: in a sense, that's why I'm wondering. I mean, I'm completely hypothesising here, maybe going to far, but it could be fixed in software, but they won't even release a firmware update. It seems a bit silly really. |
| 10:07.05 | SpeedEvil | Having GSM in a SDR is not the problem. |
| 10:07.13 | doc|home | s/to far/too far |
| 10:07.14 | Kliment_ | SpeedEvil: it's noncompliant |
| 10:07.21 | Kliment_ | SpeedEvil: illegal to use |
| 10:07.42 | doc|home | what's illegal about it by the way? |
| 10:07.42 | Kliment_ | SpeedEvil: because you can tell it to transmit whenever the hell you want and destroy TDMA |
| 10:07.43 | raster | i think open source is a valid thing *IF* it brings value and flexibiility to an aspect of the dev ice/hardwares features that it wouldnt normally have |
| 10:07.44 | SpeedEvil | Having open-source GSM easily hackable by the asocial 14 year-old hacker and distributable to tens of thousands of other 12 year olds on their already existing phone is. |
| 10:08.00 | raster | ths gsm raido subsyste, is a delicate path to tread |
| 10:08.17 | raster | and the consequences of making it open and hackable are none to do with license and copyright etc. issues |
| 10:08.23 | SpeedEvil | Too many IT people tend to think of radio waves as the internet. |
| 10:08.32 | Kliment_ | radio licensing is messy |
| 10:08.36 | raster | they are going to be consequences that likely woudl impact the project as a whole to its detriment |
| 10:08.37 | SpeedEvil | When they are really a party line, or a shared ethernet segment. |
| 10:08.41 | raster | and you want to stick clear of those |
| 10:08.45 | raster | even *IF* it is possible |
| 10:08.51 | Kliment_ | though I love the new EU rules on radios |
| 10:09.01 | SpeedEvil | ? |
| 10:09.13 | Kliment_ | the power regulations for unlicensed devices |
| 10:09.14 | *** join/#openmoko helb (n=helb@84.244.90.159) |
| 10:09.17 | SpeedEvil | Ah. |
| 10:09.19 | SpeedEvil | 2.4G? |
| 10:09.23 | SpeedEvil | Sigh. |
| 10:09.26 | Kliment_ | and everything else unlicensed |
| 10:09.57 | Kliment_ | if you listen to the channel before you send, you can send at any power when the channel is clear |
| 10:09.57 | Kliment_ | for a short burst |
| 10:09.57 | SpeedEvil | Sigh - as the solution to interference now becomes 'buy a new longer device'. |
| 10:10.04 | SpeedEvil | Only if you can recieve the interference. |
| 10:10.07 | Kliment_ | yes |
| 10:10.16 | Kliment_ | and if you can't you're not allowed to send |
| 10:10.21 | SpeedEvil | s/longer/high-power/ |
| 10:10.56 | SpeedEvil | Going to higher power in the face of interference just causes an arms race. |
| 10:11.06 | Kliment_ | yes |
| 10:11.09 | SpeedEvil | And means that mobile devices lose. |
| 10:11.23 | Kliment_ | but this regulation actually makes sense |
| 10:11.26 | Magon | Kliment_: but you have to be able to detect interferences at long distance in order to confirm it the channel is clean |
| 10:11.32 | Kliment_ | Magon: of course |
| 10:11.44 | Kliment_ | Magon: you have to be able to detect it as far as you are sending it |
| 10:11.52 | SpeedEvil | You cannot demodulate the signal from a thousand background devices. |
| 10:11.54 | doc|home | so, what's the difference between an open gsm setup and an open wifi setup? why is the latter less unlikely? |
| 10:12.13 | *** join/#openmoko slomo (n=slomo@ubuntu/member/slomo) |
| 10:12.13 | Kliment_ | doc|home: I don't understand your question |
| 10:12.17 | SpeedEvil | doc|home: because with an open GSM network it takes only several radios to stop people making emergency calls. |
| 10:12.29 | doc|home | SpeedEvil: and wifi can't do that? |
| 10:12.31 | SpeedEvil | And people actually will die. |
| 10:12.32 | Kliment_ | SpeedEvil: it only takes one |
| 10:12.33 | SpeedEvil | No. |
| 10:12.35 | doc|home | ok |
| 10:12.37 | doc|home | thanks |
| 10:12.41 | Magon | doc|home: gsm is cell site..it you can control your GSM you can destroy one cell |
| 10:12.54 | SpeedEvil | Not quite one cell. |
| 10:12.54 | doc|home | sweet! er, forget I said that :o |
| 10:12.55 | Kliment_ | this is changing though |
| 10:13.00 | SpeedEvil | But you can kill one frequency. |
| 10:13.03 | *** join/#openmoko El_Salvador (n=Brescia@adsl-240-190.37-151.net24.it) |
| 10:13.05 | SpeedEvil | which is 8 users |
| 10:13.10 | SpeedEvil | 8-16 |
| 10:13.14 | Kliment_ | 4th generation phones will be IP-only |
| 10:13.20 | Kliment_ | with microcells |
| 10:13.26 | SpeedEvil | Err. |
| 10:13.28 | doc|home | so that could potentially be opened up? |
| 10:13.33 | SpeedEvil | microcells only work in the city |
| 10:13.39 | *** join/#openmoko tr2x (n=alvar@80-218-185-55.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 10:13.53 | Kliment_ | SpeedEvil: yes, that is true |
| 10:13.57 | SpeedEvil | The fundamental problem is: Radio is a shared medium. |
| 10:14.13 | Kliment_ | SpeedEvil: so 4G will eventually work in cities only at first |
| 10:14.14 | *** join/#openmoko disguy__ (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-118ac4b1f89b0103) |
| 10:14.15 | Magon | and it is easy to DOS |
| 10:14.30 | SpeedEvil | This means: Range at the moment is gotten not by ramping the power up - but by having all the other nodes silent when transmitting. |
| 10:14.43 | SpeedEvil | This _vastly_ improves performance. |
| 10:14.45 | Kliment_ | SpeedEvil: the idea is to have user-owned or co-owned access points |
| 10:14.52 | SpeedEvil | And the cell-site coordinates all of this. |
| 10:15.04 | mdt | u know what? i just did my first call with the neo including sound! wow... :D but it only works with headset, not with handset :/ |
| 10:15.06 | Kliment_ | SpeedEvil: yes and this is the idea behind the new eu regulation |
| 10:15.34 | mdt | ...and everything using libgsmd-tool. nice thing. |
| 10:15.45 | Magon | putting more power in transmition is careless...wont help that much |
| 10:16.12 | Kliment_ | the point of this is hugh-power short bursts |
| 10:16.16 | Kliment_ | like UWB |
| 10:16.19 | Kliment_ | high( |
| 10:16.21 | Kliment_ | high* |
| 10:16.29 | SpeedEvil | But in an unlicensed band - you can't listen to the eleventy million protocols. |
| 10:16.36 | SpeedEvil | As you can't understand them. |
| 10:16.46 | Kliment_ | SpeedEvil: no, you treat them as a noise floor |
| 10:17.00 | Kliment_ | SpeedEvil: if noise is over a threshold you don't send |
| 10:17.22 | *** join/#openmoko Pupeno (n=Pupeno@cl-241.dub-01.ie.sixxs.net) |
| 10:17.26 | SpeedEvil | Well - that's one way to fix interferance - reduce the number of transmitters. |
| 10:17.38 | Kliment_ | I have the document somewhere, hold on |
| 10:17.47 | Kliment_ | ETSI EN 300 220-1 V2.1.1 |
| 10:17.48 | *** join/#openmoko pvanhoof (n=pvanhoof@d54C0EE14.access.telenet.be) |
| 10:19.17 | *** join/#openmoko helb (n=helb@84.244.90.159) |
| 10:19.19 | Kliment_ | For LBT equipment, the device shall listen on the next intended frequency before transmitting. If it is intended to move |
| 10:19.22 | Kliment_ | to a different channel then this channel can be monitored whilst still transmitting at its first channel. If it is not intended |
| 10:19.26 | Kliment_ | to move to a different channel then it should be treated as a single frequency device waiting for a free channel. |
| 10:19.37 | Kliment_ | then you can ignore all duty cycle requirements while transmitting |
| 10:19.55 | Kliment_ | you just listen to each slot before you use it |
| 10:20.33 | Kliment_ | so you do frequency hopping and skip the channels that are busy |
| 10:20.52 | *** join/#openmoko xzcvczx (n=nosdr4g@gentoo/user/xzcvczx) |
| 10:20.54 | mjr | Kliment_, umm, when you say "any power", exactly what do you mean? |
| 10:20.57 | SpeedEvil | Assuming that you're not using the whole band. |
| 10:21.03 | SpeedEvil | 802.11n anyone? |
| 10:21.06 | Kliment_ | mjr: sorry I got confused there |
| 10:21.08 | xzcvczx | i think my touchscreen has died :( |
| 10:21.21 | Kliment_ | mjr: I meant ignoring duty cycles |
| 10:21.45 | Kliment_ | mjr: so theoretically you can transmit at your maximum output for 100% |
| 10:22.00 | SpeedEvil | xzcvczx: have you rebooted. |
| 10:22.03 | Kliment_ | mjr: and not step on anyone's toes |
| 10:22.31 | Kliment_ | this is new, from last year |
| 10:22.52 | xzcvczx | SpeedEvil: about 8 times |
| 10:22.54 | Kliment_ | it's been technically possible for a whilem now it's legally possible |
| 10:23.05 | Kliment_ | while* |
| 10:23.18 | SpeedEvil | xzcvczx: have you tried pulling the battery and leaving it for a few mins? |
| 10:23.34 | mjr | but yeah, frequency hopping with listening checks seems reasonable for some use |
| 10:23.38 | mjr | s |
| 10:23.41 | SpeedEvil | xzcvczx: After that, I think your next option is the community list. |
| 10:23.45 | xzcvczx | SpeedEvil: no, tried removing battery for about 10 secs |
| 10:24.05 | xzcvczx | SpeedEvil: will try that soon |
| 10:24.07 | Kliment_ | mjr: it makes a lot of sense, and now it's legal to transmit at 100% if the channels are clear |
| 10:24.19 | xzcvczx | SpeedEvil: is there a way to get it to redo the calibration |
| 10:24.48 | Kliment_ | mjr: before there were duty cycle classes, so a class 1 device could only transmit at 0.1% DC, even if the air was clear |
| 10:25.00 | mdt | xzcvczx, there is a tool called x..cal something that does that i think |
| 10:25.10 | SpeedEvil | xzcvczx: it completely doesn't respond at all? |
| 10:25.19 | xzcvczx | SpeedEvil: not one little bit |
| 10:25.29 | *** join/#openmoko MDK_ (n=mdk@cs181222091.pp.htv.fi) |
| 10:26.00 | xzcvczx | bbs trying the remove battery for few mins |
| 10:26.34 | mdt | what is the ts-device anyway? there is no /dev/ts..? |
| 10:27.37 | tHe_IkkE | mdt: /dev/input/touchscreen0 |
| 10:27.47 | xzcvczx | mdt: the kernel module loads successfully so that probably exists anyway |
| 10:28.12 | mdt | do a `cat /dev/input/touchscreen0 ` and touch the screen... |
| 10:29.58 | *** join/#openmoko ewanm89 (n=ewanm89@host86-152-203-130.range86-152.btcentralplus.com) |
| 10:30.37 | xzcvczx | mdt: good point will try that |
| 10:31.46 | xzcvczx | hmmm seems to be also /class/input/input2 |
| 10:33.11 | *** join/#openmoko thomasg (n=thomasg@p57AFF337.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 10:33.11 | tHe_IkkE | xzcvczx: On my neo touchscreen0 is a symlink to event1 |
| 10:33.14 | xzcvczx | pulling battery didnt work unfortunately |
| 10:33.16 | mdt | xzcvczx, kill x-session before... |
| 10:33.46 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Application_Development_Crash_Course]] [[Manually_using_GSM]] [[Devirginator/it]] [[P1_Owners]] [[Gsmd]] [[User:Emdete]] |
| 10:36.03 | xzcvczx | mdt: hmm killed x and tried it but its always transmitting data so bit hard to test that way |
| 10:36.21 | mdt | xzcvczx, how do u mean? |
| 10:36.49 | xzcvczx | well you try cat'ing touchscreen0 |
| 10:37.06 | mdt | yes. |
| 10:37.19 | mdt | it starts printing garbage on the screen, when i touch the screen |
| 10:37.29 | tHe_IkkE | exactly |
| 10:37.32 | xzcvczx | mdt: mine is always printing garbage on the screen |
| 10:37.53 | mdt | xzcvczx, hm, something stuck under the cover? :D |
| 10:38.10 | tHe_IkkE | Have you got something lik breadcrump stuck in your screen? |
| 10:38.28 | xzcvczx | hmmmm time to find a screwdriver i guess then |
| 10:39.59 | doc|home | mental note: no eating near the phone :) |
| 10:40.59 | mdt | hm, did someone successfully got an sms by neo? |
| 10:41.07 | tHe_IkkE | doc|home: Only liquids, they won't get stuck ;) |
| 10:41.11 | doc|home | haha |
| 10:44.00 | mdt | my gsmd crashed when a sms arrived. perhaps a breadcrump stuck there too? :D so anyone successfull received a sms? |
| 10:44.22 | SpeedEvil | xzcvczx: I'd wayit |
| 10:44.24 | SpeedEvil | wait |
| 10:44.30 | SpeedEvil | they may want failed units for debug |
| 10:44.43 | SpeedEvil | mail on community list - then dissasemble |
| 10:44.51 | SpeedEvil | if no response |
| 10:45.11 | SpeedEvil | IMO, at this stage - finding hardware bugs is more important than anything else. |
| 10:45.31 | sannes | mdt: what did your log say? |
| 10:46.40 | sannes | gsmd exits all the time on the one I've got here, think there is a bug in gsmd |
| 10:47.11 | xzcvczx | sannes: put sim in another phone and clear texts? |
| 10:47.22 | ml8128 | mdt: sms worked in manual mode, i was able to send and receive them, dunno if that answers your question |
| 10:47.55 | xzcvczx | SpeedEvil: if its just something under the cover i would rather fix it now than have to wait ages |
| 10:48.28 | xzcvczx | ml8128: what was the command you used? |
| 10:49.01 | SpeedEvil | xzcvczx: at least post on the community list - they have to know about this sort of stuff. |
| 10:49.02 | ml8128 | xzcvczx: those on the wiki page http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Manually_using_SMS |
| 10:49.28 | sannes | xzcvczx: Is that the reason why I get "gsmd.c:78:alive_tmr_cb() modem dead!" ? |
| 10:50.12 | ml8128 | hmm... typing halt from gtkterm2 freezes the phone, works via ssh though.... |
| 10:50.55 | *** join/#openmoko Risto (n=Christop@p508CE219.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 10:51.51 | ml8128 | anyways, off to lunch |
| 10:52.00 | xzcvczx | sannes: well i get gsmd crashing as well with the same thing |
| 10:52.16 | xzcvczx | sannes: and i think it only started after i sent a couple of texts to it |
| 10:52.42 | Kliment_ | is there a way to dump the gsmd-gsm communication? |
| 10:53.13 | mdt | only gsm-stuff in dmesg is <6>gta01-pm-gsm gta01-pm-gsm.0: powering up GSM, thus disconnecting serial console |
| 10:53.14 | SpeedEvil | strace |
| 10:53.52 | Kliment_ | xzcvczx: can you strace a crash? |
| 10:53.56 | SpeedEvil | nohup strace -p $gsmpid -s 9999 -o /media/card/gsmd.strace |
| 10:53.58 | mdt | ml8128, what do u mean with manual mode? libgsmd-tool? yes i try that too. 'sl' coredumps the tool |
| 10:54.00 | SpeedEvil | or similar |
| 10:55.44 | xzcvczx | SpeedEvil: well i cant pull apart the phone tonight anyway will have to be done tomorrow as dont have a T6 |
| 10:55.47 | SpeedEvil | On an unrelated topic. |
| 10:55.57 | SpeedEvil | UK - phone insurance? |
| 10:56.02 | SpeedEvil | Recommendations? |
| 10:56.10 | *** join/#openmoko emdel (n=emdel@host228-209-dynamic.10-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 10:57.02 | mdt | phone-insurance? what's that? against breadcrump stuck in your screen? |
| 10:57.19 | SpeedEvil | Theft, fire, third-party, ... |
| 10:57.32 | *** join/#openmoko nosyjoe (n=philipp@host-82-135-95-87.customer.m-online.net) |
| 10:57.55 | mdt | wow, that exists? |
| 10:57.56 | remiss | accidently dropping it in the ground when a new version comes out ... |
| 10:58.12 | SpeedEvil | Well - yes. |
| 10:59.12 | SpeedEvil | It's usually included in mobile phone contracts - at least here. |
| 10:59.19 | xzcvczx | remiss: dropping it 'in' the ground? that would require quite a drop |
| 10:59.44 | SpeedEvil | remiss is a spelunker. |
| 11:00.00 | xzcvczx | remiss: yeah hi insurance company x i just accidentally dropped my phone off the eiffel tower and its embedded itself 2 inches in the pavement |
| 11:00.04 | *** join/#openmoko rd_ (n=rd@vnsecurity.net) |
| 11:00.27 | remiss | haha :p |
| 11:01.23 | remiss | but seriously.. $400 isn't much for a phone |
| 11:02.18 | remiss | and with wifi as well |
| 11:02.48 | mdt | depends how often new releases come out... |
| 11:03.05 | *** join/#openmoko Kensan (n=ken@gw.ptr-80-238-206-248.customer.ch.netstream.com) |
| 11:03.24 | xzcvczx | ahh i see buildhost is down |
| 11:03.25 | remiss | hmm... yeah.. better get insurance then |
| 11:03.41 | mdt | openmoko.com is down too... |
| 11:03.51 | xzcvczx | oh lol |
| 11:07.59 | mdt | if i use gsm-tool, doing 'o' (off) and 'O' (on) again. does that reset the gsm chip? |
| 11:08.42 | SpeedEvil | my GPRS script has echo 0 > /sys/bus/platform/devices/gta01-pm-gsm.0/power_on |
| 11:08.42 | SpeedEvil | sleep 5 |
| 11:08.42 | SpeedEvil | echo 1 > /sys/bus/platform/devices/gta01-pm-gsm.0/power_on |
| 11:08.42 | SpeedEvil | sleep 2 |
| 11:09.09 | mdt | is that the same gsmd does? |
| 11:09.14 | SpeedEvil | dunno |
| 11:09.44 | mdt | you do not like gsmd? :D |
| 11:09.52 | SpeedEvil | It does not do GPRS |
| 11:09.56 | SpeedEvil | AIUI |
| 11:10.03 | SpeedEvil | Yet. |
| 11:10.05 | mdt | 0710 still missing |
| 11:10.51 | Magon | do anyone know how 'magic sms' works? the sms for setting your phone by provider |
| 11:11.03 | mdt | there is a port number in a sms |
| 11:11.10 | sannes | xzcvczx: hm, it seems more random to me (always had smses on the sim card) .. but, lets see how it acts after a AT+CMGD=0,4 :P |
| 11:11.18 | mdt | that specifies the receiver on the phone |
| 11:12.08 | Magon | ok so it is SMS but on different port? |
| 11:12.23 | mdt | yes. in fact even a mms is a sms |
| 11:12.36 | mdt | you also can register a java app to be reciever for sms |
| 11:12.50 | mdt | (if you are allowed to do so) |
| 11:13.23 | Magon | that is nice |
| 11:13.45 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@qiqinebs.chi.il.us) |
| 11:13.47 | mdt | an there are also different type, i.e. 'on screen' |
| 11:14.03 | mdt | some handsets just diplay those and they disapear after reading |
| 11:14.08 | Magon | ok so sms hell :-) |
| 11:14.15 | mdt | yes |
| 11:14.33 | Magon | but i hope we can handle all SMS by our way |
| 11:14.40 | mdt | shure |
| 11:14.41 | Magon | like logging and dumping it |
| 11:14.57 | mdt | but if you want to be complient you have to follow the rules |
| 11:15.21 | *** join/#openmoko lynx (n=lynx@port-83-236-15-172.dynamic.qsc.de) |
| 11:16.17 | Magon | yes..but beside that i would like to log in separate file all in/out going SMS including special ones |
| 11:16.22 | xzcvczx | is there any way to print out what the touch screen is sensing in human terms like touch @ 0,0 |
| 11:17.17 | mdt | Magon, shure, that's the minimum i think ;) |
| 11:17.28 | Magon | if you read the interface that are absolute location values on screen |
| 11:17.32 | SpeedEvil | xzcvczx: xev |
| 11:17.51 | SpeedEvil | start xev through SSH |
| 11:18.10 | xzcvczx | SpeedEvil: tryed that didnt print anything.... but that only works if the touching is inside the box doesnt it? |
| 11:18.21 | mdt | is the protocol on /dev/input/touchscreen0 documented somewhere? |
| 11:18.26 | SpeedEvil | it should work for the entire window |
| 11:18.32 | SpeedEvil | it's probably 'event' format |
| 11:20.14 | SpeedEvil | hexdump -C /dev/input/touchscreen0 seems to imply that it's 32 byte packets |
| 11:21.00 | kristian-m | has anyone ever had a problem with an empty battery? - I just had a situation where the neo could not boot, even with usb attached - had to use the second battery just to switch it on, after that the empty battery could be used again... |
| 11:21.08 | mdt | you may use `ts_print` |
| 11:21.31 | SpeedEvil | or ts_print_raw |
| 11:21.41 | SpeedEvil | for the raw uncalibrated info |
| 11:22.16 | xzcvczx | kristian-m: give it some time to charge the flat battery next time |
| 11:22.23 | *** join/#openmoko helb (n=helb@84.244.90.159) |
| 11:22.34 | xzcvczx | kristian-m: 10-15 will do |
| 11:23.12 | kristian-m | xzcvczx hmmkay |
| 11:25.53 | *** join/#openmoko ashnazg (n=chuckles@adsl-147-127-34.bhm.bellsouth.net) |
| 11:28.03 | mdt | kristian-m, i read about that |
| 11:28.44 | mdt | kristian-m, its somewhere in the wiki. an emptry battery will be charged some time first before u can boot |
| 11:29.09 | *** join/#openmoko Husare (n=AD@stgt-590ea731.pool.einsundeins.de) |
| 11:30.54 | mdt | and now for something completly different... i would like to compile some small tools for the neo. what would be the fastest way to do so? i wouldn't like to learn bitbake/.../whatever. an ipkg would be enough i think. how can i create one? |
| 11:31.59 | ewanm89_laptop | With bitbake. |
| 11:32.44 | *** join/#openmoko ashnaz1 (n=chuckles@adsl-155-155-248.bhm.bellsouth.net) |
| 11:33.22 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@qiqinebs.chi.il.us) |
| 11:34.27 | SpeedEvil | Hmm. |
| 11:34.31 | SpeedEvil | Most stuff works OK. |
| 11:34.40 | SpeedEvil | xvkbd is actually a better keyboard IMO. |
| 11:35.20 | mdt | ewanm89_laptop, seems to be complicated... |
| 11:36.13 | mdt | ewanm89_laptop, can you explain to me how that works? |
| 11:39.24 | Kensan | mdt: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Application_Development_Crash_Course |
| 11:40.11 | mdt | Kensan, that sounds promising :D thanks! |
| 11:40.49 | Kensan | mdt: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Create_a_package_from_existing_sources |
| 11:41.43 | mdt | okay, the first seems wrong because i don't want to change the flash image. i would prefere to get a ipkg |
| 11:42.05 | *** join/#openmoko miip (n=miip@p54A54DE0.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 11:43.25 | mdt | Kensan, can bitbake do packages? |
| 11:43.54 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@qiqinebs.chi.il.us) |
| 11:47.08 | *** join/#openmoko wurzel (n=chatzill@adsl-151.200.166.194.arpa.as1901.net) |
| 11:47.54 | *** join/#openmoko fgau (n=fgau@pD95398F8.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 11:49.14 | *** join/#openmoko lmveloso (n=lmveloso@200-193-152-9.mganm702.dsl.brasiltelecom.net.br) |
| 11:52.31 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@qiqinebs.chi.il.us) |
| 11:54.21 | *** join/#openmoko Henrikw (n=henrik@38.80-203-113.nextgentel.com) |
| 11:55.33 | *** join/#openmoko El_Salvador (n=Brescia@adsl-ull-220-182.42-151.net24.it) |
| 11:58.31 | SpeedEvil | I am _really_ surprised as to the screen. |
| 11:58.55 | SpeedEvil | I realised this when I noticed I was using an 80*25 xterm, and had more stuff on screen. |
| 11:59.10 | SpeedEvil | And snow was piling up on top of my window. |
| 12:04.07 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@141.80-202-161.nextgentel.com) |
| 12:06.56 | Elrond | SpeedEvil - You use fvwm, xterm, etc. remotely on the neo? |
| 12:07.12 | *** join/#openmoko xzcvczx (n=nosdr4g@gentoo/user/xzcvczx) |
| 12:07.50 | SpeedEvil | yes. |
| 12:08.07 | SpeedEvil | I like xvkbd _much_ better than the stock keyboard |
| 12:08.37 | madwoota | i like pie |
| 12:09.25 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@qiqinebs.chi.il.us) |
| 12:13.43 | Stephmw | SpeedEvil: may I dig your brain on a few hw questions? it's tengentially related to OM ;-) |
| 12:13.53 | SpeedEvil | Yes. |
| 12:14.02 | Stephmw | thanks :) |
| 12:14.27 | Stephmw | I'm curious about putting a photobank together from components... |
| 12:14.32 | *** join/#openmoko baze (n=baze@xdsl-195-14-220-90.netcologne.de) |
| 12:14.46 | Stephmw | I just don't need the extra mp4/mp3 rubbish offered by current commercial stuff |
| 12:14.46 | SpeedEvil | You mean a 'digital photo frame' type thingy? |
| 12:15.05 | SpeedEvil | Or a portable one. |
| 12:15.16 | sannes | I still don't know exact cause, but gsmd hasn't crashed since all sms was remmoved .. |
| 12:15.19 | Stephmw | pretty much - depending on screen size it's either a frame or a portable |
| 12:15.34 | sannes | (like xzcvczx said) |
| 12:16.08 | *** join/#openmoko DeeQx (n=Zwain@85-156-87-182.elisa-mobile.fi) |
| 12:16.13 | *** join/#openmoko rmoravcik (n=rmoravci@ip-89-103-152-149.karneval.cz) |
| 12:16.21 | SpeedEvil | Stephmw: basically. It's going to be much more expensive than normal ones. As you're buying in single unit quantities. Then there is the problem that graphical LCDs fall into an awkward place. |
| 12:17.17 | SpeedEvil | You can't get microcontrollers with enough RAM to drive them, even if they are fast enough, so you have to go with a CPU+ROM+RAM, which is large enough to drive the LCD, which may be very tricky if it's LVDS, and to decode JPEGs. |
| 12:17.46 | SpeedEvil | This is all possible, but it's decidedly non-trivial. |
| 12:18.00 | Stephmw | I'd thought as much, what about cannibalising an existing frame? |
| 12:18.13 | Stephmw | the problem for me is that existing ones are all SD, I need CF |
| 12:18.21 | SpeedEvil | Basically, you're limited to the firmware that's on there. It _may_ be possible to hack it. |
| 12:18.24 | Stephmw | and I'd need to somehow add raw support |
| 12:18.43 | SpeedEvil | The 'easy' alternative is an old laptop. |
| 12:18.54 | SpeedEvil | Re-wrapped with the display outside. |
| 12:19.25 | Stephmw | hmm, so an old one with a 5" screen could do |
| 12:19.29 | SpeedEvil | Unless you happen to want a 2.8" LCD one :) |
| 12:20.29 | Stephmw | I'm not too fussed about ultra-portable really... |
| 12:20.42 | Stephmw | but 10" is way too big to lug around on a trip |
| 12:20.55 | *** join/#openmoko chris^ (n=kraetzi@p548AD7BD.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 12:22.14 | SpeedEvil | If you can find a photo-frame type thing that will take input from a USB mass-storage device, then you could use the neo + CF reader |
| 12:22.50 | mdt | how are all the package-file build for ipkg? i do not want to flash the whole rootfs every time i want to test my app... any hints? |
| 12:23.06 | raster | why not |
| 12:23.09 | raster | reflashing is fun! |
| 12:23.10 | raster | : |
| 12:23.12 | raster | :) |
| 12:23.41 | Stephmw | SpeedEvil: aye, true enough |
| 12:24.25 | Stephmw | SpeedEvil: and power use is something I don't even want to think about.. I know it'll be a pain |
| 12:26.14 | Elrond | mdt - scp the new .ipk on the neo; ipkg install new.ipk |
| 12:27.20 | mdt | Elrond, i have no ipk, how do i create on? |
| 12:27.23 | mdt | on->one |
| 12:27.53 | mdt | Elrond, using mokomakefile i get a flash image |
| 12:28.05 | mdt | Elrond, but where do the ipk files come from? |
| 12:28.33 | ScaredyCat | Stephmw: a guy I know did this http://www.awooga.nl/gallery/modding/projectbling/ |
| 12:29.05 | *** join/#openmoko cindy (n=cindy@c-24-218-180-68.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 12:30.33 | *** join/#openmoko edistar_ (n=edwinloc@ip503ddd09.speed.planet.nl) |
| 12:31.07 | ScaredyCat | plus I created a distro based on TS that would scan the network for a framePIx share, and display all the pics it found.. |
| 12:32.38 | ScaredyCat | mdt: why not scp it to the phone |
| 12:32.53 | Stephmw | ScaredyCat: interesting, looking it over now |
| 12:32.54 | *** join/#openmoko jpozlovsky (n=jindra@rb5cc115.net.upc.cz) |
| 12:33.08 | mdt | ScaredyCat, you got me wrong. i /have/ no .ipk file. i want to create one. |
| 12:33.14 | ScaredyCat | he's not very good at the text bit Stephmw ;) |
| 12:33.34 | ScaredyCat | yeah, mdt, I meand why not just scp you app to the phone... |
| 12:33.46 | ScaredyCat | s/you/your/ |
| 12:34.17 | mdt | ScaredyCat, it is an app and lots of libs crying for package managment |
| 12:34.24 | ScaredyCat | ah ok.. |
| 12:34.31 | ScaredyCat | tar it then ;) |
| 12:34.52 | *** join/#openmoko abraxa_ (n=abraxa@pD95FC4EA.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 12:34.53 | mdt | ScaredyCat, i haven't even build it |
| 12:35.06 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[P1_Owners]] [[OpenMoko_Local_groups:_Boston]] |
| 12:35.21 | ScaredyCat | oh... |
| 12:35.23 | raster | mdt: tar uo just the app and libs - scp the tarball and untar? |
| 12:35.24 | mdt | someone here told me to use bitbake/... i looked into it and think this would be very helpful |
| 12:35.25 | *** join/#openmoko unmadindu (n=sayamind@gnu-india/admin/unmadindu) |
| 12:35.32 | *** join/#openmoko pygi (n=mario@158-38.dsl.iskon.hr) |
| 12:35.39 | pygi | any idea why openmoko.com is down? :P |
| 12:35.41 | raster | technically using bitbake (oe) would be best |
| 12:35.58 | raster | but if u are mostly doign development - ie modifying code regularly and hacking it up - compile, copy, test in fast cycles |
| 12:36.02 | ScaredyCat | the whole process for adding even the simplest ap with oe/bitbake is just crap |
| 12:36.04 | raster | packages will be waaay overkill |
| 12:36.07 | mdt | raster, ScaredyCat i know how to tar but as i said: the build is not done, package managment is what i am looking for. |
| 12:36.28 | *** join/#openmoko lextul (n=thomas@80.64.176.30) |
| 12:36.29 | mdt | ScaredyCat, does not look so for me |
| 12:36.38 | mdt | raster, really? |
| 12:36.45 | raster | imho |
| 12:36.47 | raster | they would be |
| 12:36.50 | Stephmw | ScaredyCat: yeah, it's not a recipe for making a photoframe, but it's another example |
| 12:36.55 | raster | as frankly a package is also a tarball |
| 12:36.57 | raster | effectively |
| 12:37.00 | raster | plus extra |
| 12:37.06 | mdt | i like the plus extra |
| 12:37.19 | raster | in the end a simple tarball of the relevanty files is good enough for development |
| 12:37.30 | mdt | and: i am talking about ~40 libs i need, some already avaiable on oe. |
| 12:37.35 | raster | if you aim is to make packages for other people to use on their mokos |
| 12:37.39 | raster | then a package is a good idea |
| 12:37.42 | raster | for just yourslef |
| 12:37.45 | raster | i'd go a tarball |
| 12:37.47 | raster | in fact |
| 12:37.56 | raster | i might be tempted to use rsync |
| 12:37.56 | mdt | raster, okay, then how do i build? |
| 12:38.03 | raster | aaah |
| 12:38.06 | mdt | raster, i did that the last time. yes |
| 12:38.15 | raster | for that - u need a cross-compiler |
| 12:38.24 | raster | frankly scratchbox might work |
| 12:38.25 | mdt | oh! really? :D |
| 12:38.33 | raster | it makes building brain-dead easy |
| 12:38.42 | mdt | i have one already. mokomakefile did one for me |
| 12:38.44 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@qiqinebs.chi.il.us) |
| 12:38.46 | raster | it includes a cross-compiler |
| 12:38.52 | raster | as well as arm libs etc. |
| 12:38.53 | raster | in a chroot |
| 12:39.01 | raster | so the chrooted env looks like an arm system |
| 12:39.06 | raster | but running on x86 |
| 12:39.20 | raster | it uses the kernels misc binary support + qemu to make arm binaries work |
| 12:39.31 | mdt | but why doing different, when the openmoko guys use bitbake? |
| 12:39.34 | raster | so u compile under scratchbox'es chroot like u do anywhere |
| 12:39.39 | raster | and tar up /usr/local |
| 12:39.40 | raster | or whatever |
| 12:39.46 | raster | i know |
| 12:40.27 | raster | bitbake can do it too |
| 12:40.27 | raster | its not as easy |
| 12:40.27 | raster | or as convenient |
| 12:40.27 | raster | imho |
| 12:40.32 | ScaredyCat | it sucks more than a hooker on a saturday night |
| 12:40.36 | mdt | okay, back to the question: where do the packages come from? |
| 12:41.57 | olv | mdt: after an app is compiled, bitbake packs it |
| 12:42.19 | mdt | the benefit of using the moko way would be to get new version easy |
| 12:42.20 | olv | mdt: under build/tmp/deploy/ipk |
| 12:42.47 | mdt | olv, it did not for me. i run it once and there is not one .ipk file - have i to tell him to do so? |
| 12:43.20 | olv | mdt: you use mokomakefile, right? |
| 12:43.42 | mdt | olv, shit, my fault, typo in my find .... |
| 12:43.49 | mdt | olv i try ;) |
| 12:44.40 | mdt | problem here is the following: i would like to drive the neo without X11. i use directfb and lots of libs already in oe. i would like to get all those. easy, i think |
| 12:44.45 | *** join/#openmoko lextul (n=thomas@80.64.176.30) |
| 12:45.23 | mdt | olv, thanks. next question: where is the list of .bb that are build for openmoko? can i easily eedit that? |
| 12:46.03 | olv | mdt: bitbake directfb, then copy the .ipk's to neo |
| 12:46.16 | olv | mdt: or check /etc/ipkg/base-feed.conf in neo out |
| 12:46.22 | mdt | oh, that would be too easy ;) |
| 12:47.15 | ewanm89_laptop | If it's in OE then you can most likely just bitbake it. |
| 12:47.16 | mdt | olv, what do u mean 'check ...'? |
| 12:47.34 | olv | mdt: take a look at :) |
| 12:47.49 | mdt | there are urls in there.... shure, i know that file |
| 12:48.18 | mdt | so what - these point to the openmoko packages... or am i wrong? |
| 12:48.50 | olv | mdt: you can edit it to point to your local build directory |
| 12:49.00 | olv | mdt: then ipkg update; ipkg install <some-package> |
| 12:49.14 | olv | mdt: it will resolve dependencies automagically |
| 12:49.31 | olv | mdt: just like apt-get |
| 12:49.44 | mdt | oh! it does the packeges-files too! wow! bitbake rocks.... |
| 12:50.59 | mdt | is it also easy to merge in some options to the ./configure step with bitbake? |
| 12:51.59 | *** join/#openmoko poffy (n=poffy@c-76-30-222-129.hsd1.tx.comcast.net) |
| 12:53.44 | olv | mdt: I would modify .bb files directly for that |
| 12:55.07 | *** join/#openmoko miip_ (n=miip@p54A566FC.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 12:55.26 | ml8128 | mdt: I was away for lunch when you asked me about manual GSM |
| 12:56.26 | mdt | ml8128, yes... how did you send/receive sms... i used libgsm-tool. my gsmd crashed on receive. |
| 12:56.50 | *** join/#openmoko borg_ (n=olaf@80.149.17.21) |
| 12:56.53 | *** join/#openmoko juco2 (n=vickeryj@cpe-076-182-044-240.nc.res.rr.com) |
| 12:57.01 | raster | bad gsmd |
| 12:57.02 | raster | bad |
| 12:57.17 | mdt | olv, aren't they overwritten at some point? |
| 12:57.32 | ml8128 | mdt: according to the wiki there are problems with gsmd, I used cu and sent manually the commands to the gsm chip via serial line |
| 12:57.56 | ml8128 | mdt: read http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Manually_using_SMS and http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Manually_using_GSM |
| 12:58.14 | mdt | ml8128, :D i saw that - try |
| 12:58.42 | mdt | ml8128, but u have to encode the sms pdu yourself then... i thought someone does that for me |
| 12:59.10 | ScaredyCat | fancy powering off the hardware when the app fails to run... |
| 12:59.20 | ScaredyCat | makes porting so much harder |
| 12:59.48 | *** join/#openmoko DukeOfURL (n=chatzill@introspect.com) |
| 12:59.52 | ml8128 | mdt: the gsm chip has an "sms mode" allowing to type simple ascii commands, so nothing to encode. it's detailed in the wiki |
| 13:00.05 | mdt | ml8128, cool |
| 13:00.22 | mdt | ml8128, i liked the gsmd aproach... :/ |
| 13:00.47 | olv | mdt: no |
| 13:01.44 | olv | mdt: the recipes won't be modified during the baking process |
| 13:02.00 | ScaredyCat | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Manually_using_SMS |
| 13:02.23 | ScaredyCat | oops |
| 13:04.48 | mdt | is there something with the ts driver? i tried ts_test. it draws straight lines vertically. but if u do horizontal moves the lines get really shaky.... |
| 13:05.01 | mdt | someone else saw that? |
| 13:06.08 | *** join/#openmoko kuyky (n=kuyky@85.138.202.45) |
| 13:13.04 | *** join/#openmoko cktakahasi (n=cktakaha@189.13.182.151) |
| 13:13.18 | ml8128 | mdt: when i rotate my neo, the previously vertical lines get shaky, to me it seems like my hand is less stable when doing horizontal lines... :D |
| 13:13.21 | SpeedEvil | It's results from the hardware. |
| 13:13.29 | SpeedEvil | It may or may not be configurable to be better |
| 13:14.13 | ml8128 | argh, my neo isn't working anymore.. it froze while i was drawing the lines, then switched off... can't switch it on :( |
| 13:14.38 | SpeedEvil | battery? |
| 13:15.08 | ml8128 | removed it, doesn't help... and when plugged to usb doesn't work either |
| 13:15.38 | ml8128 | SpeedEvil: what is the lower threshold before deep disacharge state ? |
| 13:16.40 | ml8128 | battvolt was still around 3680 like 5 minutes ago... |
| 13:19.02 | SpeedEvil | 2.8V |
| 13:19.13 | ml8128 | SpeedEvil: well, seems it's the battery, my neo works with the second one |
| 13:19.19 | SpeedEvil | It won't work when USB only no battery |
| 13:19.45 | ml8128 | SpeedEvil: meant usb + battery 1, and I was way over 2.8volts, unless the meters is flawed |
| 13:21.45 | ml8128 | SpeedEvil: doesn't work with battery 1, even when plugged to usb. I'll leave it plugged a bit longer to see... |
| 13:23.55 | *** join/#openmoko frob (n=frob@host51-148-dynamic.11-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 13:30.34 | *** join/#openmoko phrozen77 (n=phrozen7@unaffiliated/phrozen77) |
| 13:33.34 | *** join/#openmoko Writchie (n=bigW@rrcs-24-172-122-130.midsouth.biz.rr.com) |
| 13:38.28 | *** join/#openmoko Weteor (n=Weteor@i59F6380A.versanet.de) |
| 13:40.56 | *** join/#openmoko rob_w (n=bob@X1d35.x.pppool.de) |
| 13:46.25 | *** join/#openmoko Zword (n=Zword@bos94-3-82-226-234-106.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 13:48.42 | *** join/#openmoko anandanbu (n=phoenix@59.92.119.56) |
| 13:49.11 | *** join/#openmoko madewokherd (n=urk@c-71-206-250-206.hsd1.pa.comcast.net) |
| 13:51.37 | anandanbu | How to test a custom build GTK+ app in openmoko simulator in Ubuntu 7.04 |
| 13:53.41 | *** join/#openmoko batti112 (n=batti@blfd-4db51d1b.pool.einsundeins.de) |
| 13:56.02 | olv | anandanbu: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Qemu#Setting_up_USB_connection |
| 13:56.41 | olv | anandanbu: if you are running qemu |
| 13:57.48 | anandanbu | olv: but how to test an app in the simulator |
| 13:57.50 | *** join/#openmoko borg_ (n=olaf@80.149.17.21) |
| 14:01.22 | anandanbu | ok |
| 14:04.22 | *** join/#openmoko Sup3rkiddo (n=sudharsh@unaffiliated/sudharsh) |
| 14:12.29 | *** join/#openmoko kuyky (n=kuyky@85.138.202.45) |
| 14:13.44 | ml8128 | SpeedEvil: the battery goes from 3300 to 3000 in about 110 seconds then the neo shuts down... |
| 14:13.58 | *** join/#openmoko diogenes_ (n=diogenes@hoas-fe2cdd00-242.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 14:14.08 | *** join/#openmoko Vndmtrx (n=0x0fff@unaffiliated/vndmtrx) |
| 14:14.20 | *** join/#openmoko noon (n=noon@p57B2505A.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 14:14.23 | noon | hello |
| 14:15.42 | *** join/#openmoko hhf423_ (n=chatzill@A7196.a.strato-dslnet.de) |
| 14:18.35 | *** join/#openmoko deepank_ (n=deepank@59.176.34.129) |
| 14:21.22 | *** join/#openmoko daMaestro (n=jon@fedora/damaestro) |
| 14:25.37 | *** part/#openmoko anandanbu (n=phoenix@59.92.119.56) |
| 14:27.34 | SpeedEvil | ml8128: 3.3V is way down the curve. |
| 14:27.55 | SpeedEvil | It will start plummeting at 3.5V or so. |
| 14:28.21 | SpeedEvil | 3.7V or so is where the knee starts. |
| 14:29.13 | *** join/#openmoko sudharsh_ (n=sudharsh@59.92.24.0) |
| 14:29.44 | Henrikw | noon: hi there :) |
| 14:30.11 | *** join/#openmoko j_ack (n=j_ack@p508DA393.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 14:30.15 | ml8128 | SpeedEvil: ok, thank you |
| 14:34.05 | *** join/#openmoko deepank__ (n=deepank@59.176.34.129) |
| 14:35.26 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[MacOS_X]] [[Buying_Interest_List]] [[Hardware:Neo1973:Alternate_Cases:Ambient_light_sensor]] |
| 14:38.42 | Shoragan | !seen balrogg |
| 14:38.42 | cdbot2 | Shoragan, I don't remember seeing balrogg. |
| 14:39.31 | *** join/#openmoko PBeck (n=PBeck@HSI-KBW-091-089-102-236.hsi2.kabelbw.de) |
| 14:39.38 | Elrond | Shoragan - I think, he's on vacation for some time. |
| 14:41.25 | Shoragan | hmm |
| 14:41.39 | *** join/#openmoko borg_ (n=olaf@80.149.17.21) |
| 14:43.42 | Elrond | Hmm, there must be some software mitigating factors to #482. My Bv3 survives a day in off. But I never switch on the modem. ;o) |
| 14:48.46 | *** join/#openmoko phrozen77 (n=phrozen7@unaffiliated/phrozen77) |
| 14:59.30 | SpeedEvil | Hmm. JOSM - the OSM editor works quite OK on the screen. |
| 14:59.35 | noon | does somebody know, when ph5 is back? |
| 14:59.39 | SpeedEvil | The 'livegps' plugin works well too. |
| 14:59.47 | SpeedEvil | On the downside. |
| 14:59.48 | *** join/#openmoko Pupeno (n=Pupeno@cl-241.dub-01.ie.sixxs.net) |
| 15:00.01 | noon | SpeedEvil: josm on this small screen? |
| 15:00.07 | noon | SpeedEvil: is it useable? |
| 15:00.07 | SpeedEvil | It does mean I've got to keep the neo connected to my laptop. |
| 15:00.48 | Kliment_ | we really need to get java working on the thing |
| 15:01.13 | SpeedEvil | It need the 'convert short drag to click' plugin |
| 15:01.20 | SpeedEvil | but seems to pretty much work. |
| 15:01.22 | SpeedEvil | However. |
| 15:01.40 | SpeedEvil | It's pretty much solely usable as a moving map showing OSM data. |
| 15:01.53 | SpeedEvil | To see where you're about to fall off the map. |
| 15:02.53 | SpeedEvil | You can do the normal editing - but you wouldn't want to do much. |
| 15:03.44 | *** join/#openmoko BasiC (n=ish@p4FC4F8E1.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 15:04.11 | Kliment_ | BasiC: everybody here does |
| 15:04.21 | Kliment_ | except the lucky ones that have it already\ |
| 15:05.02 | Kliment_ | of course it isn't |
| 15:05.08 | Kliment_ | that's the fun bit about it |
| 15:05.31 | BasiC | why? |
| 15:05.32 | remiss | BasiC: I'm pretty sure you don't have to prepend /me to all your sentences |
| 15:05.40 | *** join/#openmoko borg_ (n=olaf@80.149.17.21) |
| 15:05.50 | Kliment_ | if everything goes to plan the hardware might just make it in time |
| 15:05.54 | Kliment_ | the software...no |
| 15:06.14 | SpeedEvil | The software might - if they start paying 100-several00 people. |
| 15:06.32 | *** join/#openmoko emdel (n=emdel@host168-207-dynamic.10-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 15:06.37 | BasiC | yeah i think many ppl will buy it |
| 15:06.54 | Kliment_ | SpeedEvil: no, I don't think that will really help |
| 15:07.24 | SpeedEvil | Kliment_: I mean - basically - a large fraction of the people coding on it could do more if paid fulltime. |
| 15:07.55 | *** join/#openmoko olv (n=olvaffe@123-193-215-175.ethome-ip.ethome.com.tw) |
| 15:08.19 | Kliment_ | SpeedEvil: you are probably right about that |
| 15:08.31 | Kliment_ | SpeedEvil: but paying several hundred people would be a huge mess |
| 15:08.48 | BasiC | how many ppl owning the p1? |
| 15:08.55 | BasiC | 100?200? |
| 15:09.02 | SpeedEvil | Kliment_: indeed. |
| 15:09.04 | Kliment_ | SpeedEvil: and most of those people have full time jobs anyway |
| 15:09.16 | mmazur | Yeah :( |
| 15:09.20 | mmazur | And the .uni. |
| 15:09.21 | Kliment_ | SpeedEvil: it's not like you can just quit your job for a month or two to do this |
| 15:09.23 | mmazur | And the second job. |
| 15:09.27 | mmazur | And other interests. |
| 15:09.31 | BasiC | second job? wtf :P |
| 15:09.51 | Kliment_ | BasiC: 500 have been sent, 500 more getting sent next week |
| 15:09.54 | mmazur | I always wanted to have ulcers ;) |
| 15:10.10 | Kliment_ | mmazur: why |
| 15:10.49 | mmazur | ;) |
| 15:10.58 | Kliment_ | I mean, I could get away with doing some work on this as part of my job, as I do UI programming on mobile devices for a living |
| 15:11.19 | *** join/#openmoko Vndmtrx (n=0x0fff@unaffiliated/vndmtrx) |
| 15:11.29 | Kliment_ | but I wouldn't quit my job to work on openmoko, only to have to find another one in two months |
| 15:11.34 | Kliment_ | even if I was paid decently |
| 15:13.09 | Kliment_ | SpeedEvil: getting a couple hundred people to work on this is much easier than hiring a couple hundred people |
| 15:13.11 | Kensan | FIC should first and foremost establish their own software dev team(!) |
| 15:13.28 | Kliment_ | Kensan: I'm not convinced that is a good idea |
| 15:13.29 | *** join/#openmoko PBeck (n=PBeck@HSI-KBW-091-089-102-236.hsi2.kabelbw.de) |
| 15:13.37 | Kliment_ | Kensan: for things like gpsd maybe |
| 15:13.48 | Kliment_ | Kensan: but not for the UI and userspace stuff |
| 15:13.54 | Kensan | Kliment_: Of course they need a software dev team. |
| 15:14.05 | Kliment_ | yes, and they have it |
| 15:14.28 | *** join/#openmoko BryceLeo (n=bryce@nj-71-48-102-108.dhcp.embarqhsd.net) |
| 15:14.48 | Kensan | Kliment_: and if it's only for the skae of taking off work from the core devs. Judging from LaF0rge's last post it's not really setup. |
| 15:14.55 | Kensan | sake |
| 15:15.40 | BasiC | Kliment_: damn this many ppl are developing it? |
| 15:15.49 | BryceLeo | what're we setting up? |
| 15:19.08 | Kensan | BryceLeo: sorry about that. Here you go: http://pastebin.ca/646420 |
| 15:19.10 | *** join/#openmoko icman (n=icman@123-240-172-33.cctv.dynamic.lsc.net.tw) |
| 15:20.48 | *** join/#openmoko borg_ (n=olaf@80.149.17.21) |
| 15:21.07 | BasiC | how can i start qemu-neo :> |
| 15:21.11 | BasiC | never worked with qemu |
| 15:21.22 | *** join/#openmoko ben_goodger (n=ben@host217-44-221-52.range217-44.btcentralplus.com) |
| 15:22.23 | BryceLeo | ahh ok thanks Kensan i thought we were organizing something |
| 15:22.54 | BryceLeo | BasiC: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/MokoMakefile |
| 15:23.03 | Kensan | BasiC: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/OpenMoko_under_QEMU |
| 15:24.08 | BryceLeo | hmmm go with kensans the one i posted is a bit more developer oriented |
| 15:24.17 | BasiC | yeah i read that |
| 15:24.39 | BasiC | but |
| 15:24.50 | BasiC | ive already compiled it but i dont know to start it |
| 15:25.28 | BasiC | g2g .. |
| 15:25.55 | *** join/#openmoko dantalizing (n=dan@wsip-70-184-147-28.ga.at.cox.net) |
| 15:26.28 | Kensan | BasiC: did you read that: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/MokoMakefile#QEMU ? |
| 15:26.40 | BryceLeo | Kensan: he already bounced |
| 15:28.41 | Kensan | Seriously though, it's ALL in the wiki. Otherwise we must blamed it on SpeedEvil not putting it there ;) |
| 15:29.34 | SpeedEvil | The edit history lies somewhat. A lot of the reasons I'm last editor on many pages is the wikivandals and reversion. |
| 15:32.57 | BryceLeo | lol i hate it when people refuse to read the wiki |
| 15:36.16 | BryceLeo | anyone with a vanilla OM build or minimal extra packages wanna run "ls -l | wc -l" on thier $omdir/build/tmp/deploy/ipk/armv4t |
| 15:37.52 | *** join/#openmoko zecke (n=ich@gprs-pool-1-001.eplus-online.de) |
| 15:38.03 | daxxar | BryceLeo: daxxar@unsane:~/openmoko$ ls -l build/tmp/deploy/ipk/armv4t|wc -l |
| 15:38.03 | daxxar | 3521 |
| 15:38.20 | BryceLeo | holy poop..... |
| 15:38.30 | daxxar | That's AFAIK 100% vanilla |
| 15:38.38 | BryceLeo | wow... didn't realize i build that many.... i'm at 4079 |
| 15:38.46 | BryceLeo | i wrote a script to compile allllllll of oe |
| 15:38.51 | daxxar | :-) |
| 15:38.51 | Kensan | Can anybody point me to a document or website with "in-depth" info about GSM-Data connections (CSD & HSCSD)? |
| 15:38.59 | BryceLeo | so this is even with some failing |
| 15:39.45 | SpeedEvil | ? |
| 15:39.58 | BryceLeo | sounds like something you'd know about :-D |
| 15:40.25 | SpeedEvil | I haven't got a build environment setup |
| 15:41.41 | BryceLeo | SpeedEvil: about the indepth info on the gsm-data connections |
| 15:42.23 | SpeedEvil | Ah. |
| 15:42.33 | SpeedEvil | Dunno. |
| 15:42.42 | SpeedEvil | I just use the stuff. |
| 15:42.47 | SpeedEvil | I've not gone into GSM much. |
| 15:43.11 | BryceLeo | ahh, well sorry to bother SpeedEvil |
| 15:43.48 | Writchie | Kensan: All of the approved ETSI standards for GSM and UMTS can be found (for free) at www.etsi.org |
| 15:43.59 | *** join/#openmoko borg_ (n=olaf@80.149.17.21) |
| 15:44.08 | Writchie | All of the draft standards and in process work for each year can be found at www.3gpp.org |
| 15:44.12 | abraxa_ | zecke: Just curious... how do you get your SVN commit messages formatted so neatly? |
| 15:44.13 | *** join/#openmoko jpozlovsky (n=jindra@rb5cc115.net.upc.cz) |
| 15:45.04 | Kensan | Writchie: I know, but there's hundreds of docs there, I thought somebody could provide me with a shortcut ;) |
| 15:45.16 | Writchie | what is you want to know |
| 15:45.39 | zecke | LC_ALL=C REAL_NAME="bla" EMAIL_ADDRESS="foo@bar.de" ./scripts/prepare-ChangeLog from within the openmoko-feedreader2 directory |
| 15:46.19 | abraxa_ | zecke: Danke =) |
| 15:47.24 | Kensan | Writchie: basically the differences about GRPS vs. CSD plus what features CSD provides. |
| 15:47.42 | Kensan | GPRS. damnit, it's my typo day. |
| 15:47.50 | *** join/#openmoko juco2 (n=vickeryj@cpe-076-182-044-240.nc.res.rr.com) |
| 15:48.02 | Writchie | you can probably start with GSM and GPRS on wikipedia |
| 15:48.36 | Writchie | probably the best way to understand capabilities is to look at the AT commands in GSM 7.07 and its references |
| 15:48.43 | Kensan | Writchie: I am interested in the differences in "link" properties. |
| 15:48.56 | Kensan | Writchie: ok many thanks. |
| 15:49.15 | Writchie | CSD is like a modem point to point connection. |
| 15:49.43 | Writchie | GPRS is basically IP packets transported over PPP |
| 15:49.57 | Kensan | Writchie: yes I understand, but simply circuit-switched vs. packet-switched is not detailed enough for me... |
| 15:50.34 | Kensan | Writchie: I will read up a bit. Maybe I will pester you with questions later :) |
| 15:50.49 | Writchie | feel free |
| 15:51.11 | Writchie | I'll be traveling though for next 8 hours or so. |
| 15:51.12 | zecke | mickey|sports: are you back yet? |
| 15:51.13 | anrp | LC_ALL=C? boo, whatever happened to using unicode |
| 15:51.37 | zecke | anrp: ?? |
| 15:51.53 | Kensan | Writchie: well it's not that urgent/important, but thanks for the offer. |
| 15:51.55 | anrp | does it not work in a non 'C' locale? ~_~ |
| 15:52.46 | Kero | give me an excuse to bring my Neo on holiday; Does the alarmclock work ? |
| 15:52.48 | anrp | csd is old school but can be useful in limited circumstances, you basically bypass the codec and use a voice slot |
| 15:52.57 | anrp | so you get time-guarenteed delivery |
| 15:53.01 | Kero | and make enough noise to wake me up ? :) |
| 15:53.30 | anrp | i haven't gotten my neo to make any noise at all yet, but if you're desperate sleep $(( 8 * 3600)) ; mplayer path/to/loud_file.mp3 works for me |
| 15:53.34 | BryceLeo | Kero: a quick test would be bettre than asking |
| 15:53.45 | *** join/#openmoko deepank_ (n=deepank@59.176.34.129) |
| 15:54.16 | Kero | BryceLeo: one technica problem: UPS still has my Neo |
| 15:54.33 | SpeedEvil | Wow. |
| 15:54.37 | SpeedEvil | no cron or at. |
| 15:54.40 | BryceLeo | Kero: lol well then how do you expect to set the alrarm through the box? |
| 15:54.58 | anrp | it actually works very well for me; i think "I want 8 hours of sleep" and just hit it on the way to bed |
| 15:55.22 | anrp | and yeah its primitive, i know |
| 15:55.54 | *** join/#openmoko borg_ (n=olaf@80.149.17.21) |
| 15:56.03 | BryceLeo | lol anrp i think it's a unique solution |
| 15:56.23 | SpeedEvil | Not really. |
| 15:56.31 | SpeedEvil | I wrote something trivial like that. |
| 15:56.47 | SpeedEvil | Though with the ability to raise the volume at a percent every 10s. |
| 15:57.07 | Kero | 'k, I'll have a laptop to do that with. |
| 15:57.38 | anrp | someone should get samuel l jackson to record an mp3 with a long stream of insults telling the listener to get their lazy ass up |
| 15:57.43 | buz | mhh htc is supposed to build the google phone and it will run linux? strange |
| 15:58.13 | SpeedEvil | Locked down though. |
| 15:58.21 | SpeedEvil | If it's going to be ad-supported. |
| 15:59.36 | Kero | anrp: creative alarmbells and ringtones rule |
| 16:00.23 | anrp | nod |
| 16:01.21 | *** join/#openmoko amarsh04 (n=amarsh04@CPE-124-178-192-223.sa.bigpond.net.au) |
| 16:01.55 | cesarb | What is the highest RT ticket # charged so far? |
| 16:03.05 | Kensan | cesarb: afaik #3531 (from community ml) |
| 16:04.07 | cesarb | Sooo near mine :P |
| 16:04.59 | *** join/#openmoko borg_ (n=olaf@80.149.17.21) |
| 16:07.23 | ewanm89_laptop | :( |
| 16:07.41 | BryceLeo | ewanm89_laptop: isn't yours more at undefined? |
| 16:07.58 | ewanm89_laptop | Well, um ok, 1/0 |
| 16:07.58 | mjr | if someone wants to toy with a fully functional if unpolished media player / whatever you want remote suitable for the Neo, http://mjr.iki.fi/software/remote-0.9.0.tar.gz |
| 16:08.11 | mjr | (requires python) |
| 16:08.22 | *** join/#openmoko Sirclown82 (n=Sirclown@adsl-76-201-178-4.dsl.rcsntx.sbcglobal.net) |
| 16:08.41 | Fatal | gah, just my luck, they were processing my order 6 hours ago, but my CC didn't work, I'm starting to hate my CC, it always behave like this when I'm ordering something I _really_ want. (last time they had to submit the information twice inorder for it to process) |
| 16:08.44 | mjr | (can be run over X11 though, so no python strictly required on the Neo) |
| 16:09.58 | *** join/#openmoko drWyrM (n=wyrm@201.2.68.83) |
| 16:11.58 | *** join/#openmoko mboldisc (n=mike@c-66-41-225-167.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) |
| 16:15.34 | *** join/#openmoko ossman (n=drzeus@85.8.24.16) |
| 16:16.01 | *** join/#openmoko Pupeno (n=Pupeno@89-125-118-171.dhcp-ripwave.irishbroadband.ie) |
| 16:18.06 | BryceLeo | grr this modchip crackdown is such crap. You own the f*ing hardware if you want to piss on it you can, if you want to smash it you can, if you wanna solder a chip to it YOU CAN |
| 16:19.05 | *** part/#openmoko Writchie|gone (n=bigW@rrcs-24-172-122-130.midsouth.biz.rr.com) |
| 16:19.53 | *** join/#openmoko Cairdazar (n=Cairdaza@hd5e24dca.gavlegardarna.gavle.to) |
| 16:20.04 | *** join/#openmoko deepank__ (n=deepank@59.176.34.129) |
| 16:20.55 | cjb | BryceLeo: that's an assertion, but sadly it doesn't have any basis in law. |
| 16:21.32 | BryceLeo | which is crap though... i mean if you lease the console then sure i could see it.... |
| 16:21.40 | cjb | at least, assuming you live somewhere where the DMCA is in law. |
| 16:21.51 | BryceLeo | hahaha, yes that is a shame, moving is on the todo |
| 16:21.55 | CoreDump|home | well, the law needs changing then |
| 16:22.15 | *** join/#openmoko PBeck (n=PBeck@HSI-KBW-091-089-102-236.hsi2.kabelbw.de) |
| 16:22.15 | BryceLeo | gah, sorry guys gotta go whip up some breakfast for She who must not be named |
| 16:22.25 | noon | mjr: did I hear python? |
| 16:22.28 | PBeck | re |
| 16:22.49 | noon | mjr: python and gtk works fine for me on the om |
| 16:22.59 | BryceLeo | and as an update 602 sucessfuly built OE packages that aren't in OM have been built |
| 16:23.15 | cjb | CoreDump|home. BryceLeo: I agree. I suggest contacting your senator is much more productive than ranting on IRC. |
| 16:23.35 | BryceLeo | cjb lol i've actually talked with him a few times |
| 16:23.39 | cjb | :) |
| 16:23.43 | BryceLeo | cjb he's a bit of a prick and doesn't get it |
| 16:24.20 | BryceLeo | cjb they know me pretty well, i send them faxes alot and they "read them" and i stop in when something really bothers me |
| 16:24.38 | BryceLeo | anywhoo off to make food |
| 16:25.44 | *** join/#openmoko BlackBsd (n=brian@72.168.193.117) |
| 16:27.06 | *** join/#openmoko borg_ (n=olaf@80.149.17.21) |
| 16:30.08 | *** part/#openmoko Cairdazar (n=Cairdaza@hd5e24dca.gavlegardarna.gavle.to) |
| 16:30.50 | kristian-m | noon how did you compile python-gtk? - is there a bitbake repository? |
| 16:31.32 | *** join/#openmoko Weteor_ (n=Weteor@i59F60A5C.versanet.de) |
| 16:34.06 | *** join/#openmoko El_Salvador (n=Brescia@adsl-106-183.37-151.net24.it) |
| 16:34.36 | noon | kristian-m: it was on Elrond neo. so you have to ask him. |
| 16:34.41 | kristian-m | noon ah, found it. |
| 16:34.48 | noon | <-- doesn't own a neo |
| 16:34.50 | *** join/#openmoko rob_w (n=bob@X1f62.x.pppool.de) |
| 16:34.52 | *** join/#openmoko romulus (n=romulus@S0106000625a403af.vc.shawcable.net) |
| 16:35.08 | kristian-m | noon it was just a strange naming convention python-pygtk2 |
| 16:35.26 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Current_events]] [[Main_Page]] [[Main_Page/ru]] [[P1_Owners]] |
| 16:35.39 | noon | the nice thing is, you can develop your application on the desktop with the OM theme and if it work, you can copy it on the device |
| 16:35.58 | *** join/#openmoko romulus (n=romulus@S0106000625a403af.vc.shawcable.net) |
| 16:35.58 | noon | (and with vim you can edit it directly on the device :-) |
| 16:36.58 | *** join/#openmoko romulus (n=romulus@S0106000625a403af.vc.shawcable.net) |
| 16:38.07 | zecke | later |
| 16:39.35 | *** join/#openmoko romulus (n=romulus@S0106000625a403af.vc.shawcable.net) |
| 16:40.31 | *** part/#openmoko drWyrM (n=wyrm@201.2.68.83) |
| 16:40.44 | *** join/#openmoko romulus (n=romulus@S0106000625a403af.vc.shawcable.net) |
| 16:41.48 | *** join/#openmoko romulus (n=romulus@S0106000625a403af.vc.shawcable.net) |
| 16:44.38 | *** join/#openmoko romulus (n=romulus@S0106000625a403af.vc.shawcable.net) |
| 16:46.29 | *** join/#openmoko romulus (n=romulus@S0106000625a403af.vc.shawcable.net) |
| 16:48.25 | *** join/#openmoko spliffy (n=spliffy@p54B1CC1C.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 16:49.24 | *** join/#openmoko Aria (n=aredride@224x182.ouraynet.com) |
| 16:49.42 | Elrond | SpeedEvil - BTW: If you want a decoding of your "strace"s, let me know. |
| 16:52.05 | *** join/#openmoko BlackBsd (n=brian@72.168.193.117) |
| 16:53.21 | *** join/#openmoko baze (n=baze@xdsl-195-14-220-90.netcologne.de) |
| 16:53.28 | *** join/#openmoko romulus (n=romulus@S0106000625a403af.vc.shawcable.net) |
| 16:55.01 | *** join/#openmoko romulus (n=romulus@S0106000625a403af.vc.shawcable.net) |
| 16:57.02 | *** join/#openmoko ossman (n=drzeus@85.8.24.16) |
| 16:57.43 | *** join/#openmoko romulus (n=romulus@S0106000625a403af.vc.shawcable.net) |
| 16:57.59 | *** join/#openmoko Aria (n=aredride@224x182.ouraynet.com) |
| 16:58.41 | tHe_IkkE | If anyone is interested, I made a simple panel-applet to switch alsa profiles, great if your listening to MP3 over the speaker and suddenly want to take a call with the handset ;) |
| 16:58.59 | *** join/#openmoko romulus (n=romulus@S0106000625a403af.vc.shawcable.net) |
| 16:59.04 | tHe_IkkE | It could need some more testing (no problems for me) |
| 16:59.17 | tHe_IkkE | It can be found at http://84.27.74.7/files/ |
| 17:00.21 | *** join/#openmoko romulus (n=romulus@S0106000625a403af.vc.shawcable.net) |
| 17:01.10 | SpeedEvil | Elrond: I've not been having much luck. |
| 17:01.21 | *** join/#openmoko romulus (n=romulus@S0106000625a403af.vc.shawcable.net) |
| 17:01.36 | Elrond | SpeedEvil - huh? |
| 17:02.27 | SpeedEvil | Elrond: been trying decoding myself. |
| 17:04.24 | *** join/#openmoko DukeOfURL (n=chatzill@introspect.com) |
| 17:05.45 | Elrond | SpeedEvil - with sphyrna or speedevil's-own-cool-tools? ;-)) |
| 17:05.58 | SpeedEvil | Myself. |
| 17:06.20 | SpeedEvil | I was trying to come at it clean - to see if you've been missing something. |
| 17:07.56 | Elrond | Ahh. :) |
| 17:08.19 | daxxar | What're you trying to decode? |
| 17:08.24 | SpeedEvil | GPS |
| 17:08.27 | daxxar | Ah. :-) |
| 17:08.38 | daxxar | Some big bad mystical secret you're trying to decipher? |
| 17:08.44 | daxxar | REing gllin? |
| 17:09.11 | kristian-m | tHe_IkkE I'll try it - thanks :-) |
| 17:09.37 | *** join/#openmoko j_ack (n=j_ack@p508DA393.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 17:11.39 | *** join/#openmoko leppoc (n=ycoppel@72.14.228.89) |
| 17:12.57 | leppoc | hey, is there a "make clean" that just clean the builded files ? |
| 17:18.48 | *** join/#openmoko ^leo^` (n=user@r190-64-0-234.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy) |
| 17:22.06 | *** join/#openmoko lextul (n=thomas@80.64.176.30) |
| 17:22.19 | freelock | Strange... having trouble with MokoMakeFile and flash-qemu-local... |
| 17:22.29 | *** part/#openmoko _diego__ (n=diego@host-84-223-118-175.cust-adsl.tiscali.it) |
| 17:22.39 | freelock | It keeps flashing rootfs from 20070802, not anything newer |
| 17:26.14 | *** join/#openmoko mbuf (n=mbuf@gprs-ggsn5-nat.mobil.telenor.no) |
| 17:27.13 | mbuf | what are the steps to be followed before libgsmd-tool should work? i get cannot open gsm error message; but manually using gsm with cu works though |
| 17:27.30 | BryceLeo | freelock: did you make openmoko-devel-image? |
| 17:27.35 | abraxa_ | freelock: Maybe because the buildhost is down since then |
| 17:27.45 | Aria | ? |
| 17:27.58 | BryceLeo | Aria: i |
| 17:28.07 | freelock | Yes, I've made it several times, and while I can flash it to the neo, I can't get it running in qemu |
| 17:28.09 | Aria | Wrong window, oops. |
| 17:28.11 | BryceLeo | aria i'm doing a full OE bulid now, we'll be intouch |
| 17:28.13 | BryceLeo | lol |
| 17:28.18 | Aria | BryceLeo: Okey |
| 17:28.53 | BryceLeo | freelock: that's odd.... possibly a bug with an updated makefilE? |
| 17:28.56 | *** join/#openmoko awu (n=Miranda@port-212-202-174-105.dynamic.qsc.de) |
| 17:29.12 | freelock | Possibly. I've updated the makefile... |
| 17:29.27 | BryceLeo | i'm diffing from mine right now |
| 17:29.34 | freelock | I was trying to flash the OM2007.2 image a few days back... must've screwed something up |
| 17:29.47 | BryceLeo | try a make update-makefile |
| 17:29.52 | BryceLeo | that'll bring you back to a fanilla |
| 17:30.07 | *** join/#openmoko spliffy (n=spliffy@p54B1CC1C.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 17:30.26 | BryceLeo | freelock: flash-neo-local works for you? |
| 17:30.39 | freelock | I haven't used that. |
| 17:31.05 | freelock | I've just been running ./dfu-util in build/tmp/images, directly on the build I want... |
| 17:31.09 | BryceLeo | do you have any special packages built in that require you to re-build task-base? |
| 17:31.16 | freelock | No, not yet |
| 17:31.37 | BryceLeo | ok then try "make qemu-local" and tell me what you get |
| 17:31.58 | BryceLeo | if you get no target backup your current makefile if you want any changes you've made then make update-makefile |
| 17:32.35 | freelock | Looks like it's building openmoko-devel-image |
| 17:32.40 | freelock | (again) |
| 17:32.46 | BryceLeo | stick with it for me |
| 17:32.54 | leppoc | Hi BryceLeo :) |
| 17:32.56 | freelock | I did remove the rootfs images it was trying to flash... |
| 17:33.16 | BryceLeo | leppoc: hey there |
| 17:33.34 | BryceLeo | freelock: good, so it should at the very least fail at flashing |
| 17:33.43 | leppoc | BryceLeo: you remember that you told me "you will learn a lot while compiling everything" ? |
| 17:33.44 | BryceLeo | and if it doesn't we've got another conundrum |
| 17:33.56 | BryceLeo | leppoc: lol yeah, why do you ask? |
| 17:34.21 | freelock | It did fail the first time... I ran make setup again, and since then it builds openmoko-devel-image first, and then flash-qemu. |
| 17:34.35 | leppoc | basically, I have learn that I MUST replace fic-gta01 by x86 BEFORE compiling everything :S |
| 17:34.52 | leppoc | I have lost 1 day compiling the wrong thing :( LOL |
| 17:35.01 | SpeedEvil | L/ |
| 17:35.03 | SpeedEvil | :/ |
| 17:35.31 | leppoc | is there a way to clean all those wrong binaries before recompiling ? |
| 17:35.37 | leppoc | (except rm -rf....) |
| 17:35.57 | *** join/#openmoko ossman (n=drzeus@85.8.24.16) |
| 17:36.22 | BryceLeo | leppoc: why do you need to do that?? in your local.conf? |
| 17:36.23 | leppoc | (applying patches should not be re-required for instance....) |
| 17:36.28 | leppoc | yes |
| 17:36.50 | leppoc | I think that I have cros-compiled for the Neo, not for X86 |
| 17:36.50 | *** join/#openmoko romulus (n=romulus@S0106000625a403af.vc.shawcable.net) |
| 17:36.58 | BryceLeo | you changed machine=? |
| 17:37.37 | BryceLeo | freelock: that's really weird.... |
| 17:37.42 | freelock | BryceLeo: Okay, build finished, qemu started, and hung at the same place it's been hanging... |
| 17:37.46 | *** join/#openmoko romulus (n=romulus@S0106000625a403af.vc.shawcable.net) |
| 17:37.54 | leppoc | I didn't before (now it's ok, but I have compiled everything with the wrong value) |
| 17:38.02 | freelock | Yeah, it used to work, but not the last few days... |
| 17:38.04 | BryceLeo | freelock: weird.... i dunno why it's failing then... |
| 17:38.05 | *** join/#openmoko romulus (n=romulus@S0106000625a403af.vc.shawcable.net) |
| 17:38.11 | BryceLeo | freelock: sorry dude |
| 17:38.13 | freelock | Maybe I'll start over... :-( |
| 17:38.24 | BryceLeo | freelock: just wait til lthe announce of 2007.2 |
| 17:38.34 | BryceLeo | freelock: it'll be a bit of a departure from where we arenow |
| 17:38.45 | freelock | Not waiting is probably what got me into this pickle... |
| 17:38.51 | leppoc | when can we expect it ? |
| 17:38.57 | *** join/#openmoko romulus_ (n=romulus@S0106000625a403af.vc.shawcable.net) |
| 17:39.07 | BryceLeo | leppoc: your machine var should read "machine=fic-gta01" |
| 17:39.40 | leppoc | well, I want to compile for my laptop, I don't have the fic neo. so are you sure ? |
| 17:39.46 | BryceLeo | leppoc: if you're using the make file and running in qemu emulating arm. If you're using xoo and xephyr then you switch machine to x86 |
| 17:39.56 | leppoc | ok |
| 17:40.00 | leppoc | I see :) |
| 17:40.11 | BryceLeo | leppoc: yes the qemu that gets setup by the mokomakefile emulates arm |
| 17:40.45 | BryceLeo | freelock: it'll get done soon enough.... though it never really is soon enough |
| 17:40.54 | *** part/#openmoko BryceLeo (n=bryce@nj-71-48-102-108.dhcp.embarqhsd.net) |
| 17:41.23 | leppoc | ok. but anyway, I have changed the value, and tried to recompile, untill my hardrive was full :-S |
| 17:41.33 | *** join/#openmoko BryceLeo (n=bryce@nj-71-48-102-108.dhcp.embarqhsd.net) |
| 17:41.38 | BryceLeo | whoops |
| 17:41.39 | leppoc | (I wanted to use xoo....) |
| 17:41.40 | leppoc | :D |
| 17:41.44 | freelock | tHe_IkkE: Trying your .ipk... got it installed, rebooted, but not seeing anything. ? |
| 17:41.59 | leppoc | is qemu faster or slower than the real phone ? |
| 17:42.12 | BryceLeo | leppoc: depends on your machine |
| 17:42.16 | mbuf | leppoc, faster |
| 17:42.19 | SpeedEvil | usually slower. |
| 17:42.23 | pygi | xD |
| 17:42.28 | leppoc | LOL |
| 17:42.35 | pygi | so much answers, so little useful information =) |
| 17:42.43 | leppoc | :))))) |
| 17:42.46 | SpeedEvil | Anyone have a qemu image ATM? |
| 17:43.07 | BryceLeo | SpeedEvil: sadlly no.... |
| 17:43.10 | leppoc | so the BryceLeo answer seems to be the good one ;) |
| 17:43.13 | mbuf | SpeedEvil, yes, i haven't updated it for more than a week |
| 17:43.57 | leppoc | SpeedEvil: I have a runing qemu. but il looks like some pixmaps are missing... |
| 17:44.17 | leppoc | (I didn't compile anything for that...) |
| 17:44.59 | SpeedEvil | leppoc: time dd if=/dev/urandom of=/dev/zero bs=1024 count=10000 |
| 17:45.21 | mjr | noon, yeah I have python on my OM working, just noted that don't necessarily need it there to run said software |
| 17:47.48 | leppoc | SpeedEvil: real 0.589s |
| 17:47.54 | leppoc | user : 0.000s |
| 17:48.03 | leppoc | sys 0.592s |
| 17:48.30 | SpeedEvil | On urandom? |
| 17:48.54 | leppoc | well, I ran you command there, so yes... |
| 17:48.56 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@141.80-202-161.nextgentel.com) |
| 17:48.56 | SpeedEvil | real 0m 36.10s |
| 17:49.01 | SpeedEvil | (on neo) |
| 17:49.08 | leppoc | oh :D |
| 17:49.15 | leppoc | damn :D sory |
| 17:49.17 | SpeedEvil | I thought it was slower. |
| 17:49.43 | leppoc | wait, this is on the computer, not under qemu (so stupid...) |
| 17:50.33 | leppoc | it's hard to type commands on qemu ;S |
| 17:50.41 | SpeedEvil | Yes - 'normal' computers would be really faster. |
| 17:50.51 | leppoc | yes of course :) |
| 17:50.58 | freelock | tHe_IkkE: Nevermind... added it to the list of applets in /etc/matchbox/session. Very nice! |
| 17:51.05 | mbuf | leppoc, ssh to qemu? |
| 17:51.34 | leppoc | hmm, would be nice. how can I do that ? |
| 17:52.35 | SpeedEvil | As a comparison - My PII/300 does it in 20s |
| 17:54.01 | tHe_IkkE | freelock: Sorry, wasn't paying attention (eating) I'm glad it works for you! |
| 17:54.27 | *** join/#openmoko SiO2 (n=sarge@p54B3A9BA.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 17:54.42 | tHe_IkkE | freelock: The only thing missing is the mute.state file... i just copied the stereoout.state file and set the PCM controls to 0.... |
| 17:54.56 | sagacis | freelock, how do I restart the panel? |
| 17:54.57 | *** join/#openmoko deepank_ (n=deepank@59.176.34.129) |
| 17:55.02 | leppoc | 1.27s |
| 17:55.03 | freelock | Ah, was just going to ask what state that mode used... |
| 17:55.17 | SpeedEvil | leppoc: CPU? |
| 17:55.21 | tHe_IkkE | freelock: bummer, too late... |
| 17:55.46 | leppoc | what ? this is under qemu. I have a centrino duo |
| 17:55.53 | SpeedEvil | I mean the host CPU |
| 17:56.01 | freelock | sagacis: I actually edited /etc/init.d/xserver-nodm ... |
| 17:56.09 | freelock | removed the "-e x" from the ps line |
| 17:56.12 | tHe_IkkE | I did too.... |
| 17:56.23 | tHe_IkkE | Maybe a nice patch would be in place..... |
| 17:56.26 | freelock | then used /etc/init.d/xserver-nodm stop/ start |
| 17:56.48 | leppoc | (I don't even know the speed lol, this is my company computer. wait a second :) ) |
| 17:57.26 | *** join/#openmoko paroneayea (n=paroneay@fsf/member/paroneayea) |
| 17:57.28 | Vegar | heh |
| 17:57.36 | Vegar | my time dd is still running |
| 17:57.36 | tHe_IkkE | What stopped me from committing a patch is that i don't know if the same scripts are used with non-busybox ps versions... |
| 17:57.37 | *** part/#openmoko SiO2 (n=sarge@p54B3A9BA.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 17:57.48 | leppoc | centrino duo 2.16Mhz |
| 17:58.23 | sagacis | freelock, Thanks |
| 17:58.34 | sagacis | Much easier that using init |
| 17:58.59 | SpeedEvil | Vegar: on what? |
| 17:59.02 | Vegar | on qemu |
| 17:59.14 | SpeedEvil | Vegar: on what host CPU? |
| 17:59.21 | Vegar | Athlon XP 3000+ |
| 17:59.32 | *** join/#openmoko jean (n=jean@85-18-201-163.ip.fastwebnet.it) |
| 17:59.39 | Vegar | oh, wait |
| 17:59.41 | Vegar | I forgot count |
| 17:59.43 | sagacis | tHe_lkke, Nice panel app! |
| 17:59.44 | Vegar | no wonder |
| 17:59.50 | SpeedEvil | :) |
| 17:59.57 | tHe_IkkE | sagacis: Thnx! |
| 18:00.32 | Vegar | argh |
| 18:00.38 | tHe_IkkE | I was showing my neo off to a friend (with no PC around) and had to fiddle with the stylus and the terminal to set the correct state and make a phone-call. |
| 18:00.50 | leppoc | SpeedEvil: so you think that qemu is way faster than the real phone. but it is already so slow !! |
| 18:00.58 | tHe_IkkE | I'm too lazy for that kinda crap so I wrote an applet.... |
| 18:01.08 | Vegar | how do I rotate the display? |
| 18:01.13 | thomasg | xrandr -o 12 |
| 18:01.15 | thomasg | -2 |
| 18:01.25 | spliffy | is buildhost.openmoko.org down? |
| 18:01.28 | *** join/#openmoko deepank (n=deepank@59.176.34.129) |
| 18:01.29 | kristian-m | tHe_IkkE okay, the audio-panel-applets are in place and working - somehow my mplayer is blocking X though |
| 18:01.31 | SpeedEvil | leppoc: as another test - what percentage of CPU does madplay use? |
| 18:01.36 | SpeedEvil | It should be around 20& |
| 18:01.37 | spliffy | i can't resolve it's ip |
| 18:01.38 | SpeedEvil | It should be around 20% |
| 18:01.46 | SpeedEvil | the earlier test may be unrepresentative. |
| 18:02.00 | tHe_IkkE | leppoc: In my experience qemu is alot slower... (I tested with the precompiled windoze-qemu version running on XP through VMWare on a dual Xeon 3.0) |
| 18:02.08 | Vegar | thanks thomasg |
| 18:03.00 | Vegar | ah, there we go |
| 18:03.10 | leppoc | ok. My laptop CPU is used at 0.5% right now... |
| 18:03.21 | Vegar | real: 0m 44.56s |
| 18:03.25 | tHe_IkkE | kristian-: Please explain... |
| 18:03.51 | freelock | leppoc: I'm seeing 18.0 to 19.8% for madplay CPU usage right now... |
| 18:03.55 | mbuf | has anyone used libgsmd-tool successfully? |
| 18:04.01 | spliffy | ah .. no it resolves but it doesn't answer http requests and pings :( ... is it supposed to be down? (buildhost.openmoko.org) |
| 18:04.18 | freelock | mbuf: yes |
| 18:04.21 | tHe_IkkE | mbuf: Yups, me and quite a few others.... |
| 18:04.32 | leppoc | freelock: on you computer right ? not under qemu |
| 18:04.46 | kristian-m | tHe_IkkE whenever i start mplayer - using ssh x is ignoring touchpad-input |
| 18:04.55 | freelock | No, on the neo |
| 18:05.16 | mbuf | freelock, tHe_IkkE what steps did you have to follow before running it? i get cannot connect to gsm error message; but manually using gsm works with cu |
| 18:05.25 | SpeedEvil | mplayer - not gmplayer - doesn't do anything with clicks on the video window. |
| 18:05.43 | kristian-m | tHe_IkkE i'll just revert /etc/matchbox/session before i get into this |
| 18:05.46 | leppoc | freelock: looks like madplay is not even runing... |
| 18:06.08 | kristian-m | SpeedEvil thats what i think... |
| 18:06.08 | tHe_IkkE | mbuf: I usually have to restart gsmd but after that it works as described in the wiki... |
| 18:06.15 | freelock | leppoc: I have put some music on the card... so that was playing one of them in one shell, top in another |
| 18:06.36 | *** join/#openmoko agoode (n=agoode@2001:4830:1633:0:212:3fff:fe70:6222) |
| 18:06.37 | mbuf | tHe_IkkE, how do you restart gsmd? |
| 18:06.47 | tHe_IkkE | kristian-m: What did you change? |
| 18:06.52 | freelock | mbuf: seems like gsmd has gotten less stable in recent builds, it used to work first time, but now I have to restart gsmd, too... |
| 18:06.55 | tHe_IkkE | mbuf: /etc/init.d/gsmd start |
| 18:07.00 | freelock | don't have a sim in, at the moment |
| 18:07.14 | mbuf | freelock, tHe_IkkE ok, let me try, brb |
| 18:08.39 | kristian-m | tHe_IkkE i added your applet there, in start and in stop... - hmm |
| 18:09.34 | leppoc | freelock: ah ok. anyway. I am a newbie, I have to read more before :) (I don't know how to do that...) |
| 18:09.44 | kristian-m | i quess it's a bad idea to start X in the background at the same terminal where i start mplayer.. |
| 18:10.13 | tHe_IkkE | kristian-m: You need to add the applet to the list --end-applets=..... |
| 18:10.49 | *** join/#openmoko ossman (n=drzeus@85.8.24.16.se.wasadata.net) |
| 18:10.58 | kristian-m | tHe_IkkE okay, thats where i have it now - whyever it is in _this_ list |
| 18:11.24 | tHe_IkkE | kristien-m: What dou you mean? |
| 18:14.03 | kristian-m | tHe_IkkE I want it to start with the panel - so i guessed it would belong into the start-list... anyway it's working now - and I got one applet :-) |
| 18:14.26 | tHe_IkkE | kristian-m: nice :) |
| 18:15.07 | *** join/#openmoko nilweed (n=nilweed@c-71-198-152-23.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 18:15.51 | kristian-m | tHe_IkkE okay so handset and headset are not enabling sound - but speaker works - enables the speaker and headset - i dont have bluetoot though - but all in all nice new feature :-) |
| 18:17.12 | tHe_IkkE | kristian-m: The default handset and headset profiles route the GSM audio to the *set. NOT the "hifi" audio! |
| 18:18.00 | kristian-m | tHe_IkkE ah, okay that explains it. great :-) |
| 18:18.24 | tHe_IkkE | All the applet does is set the state defined in the various .state files... You can mess them up as much as you like ;) |
| 18:19.48 | *** join/#openmoko ale_2323 (n=ale_2323@host85.200-82-90.telecom.net.ar) |
| 18:19.49 | *** join/#openmoko deepank_ (n=deepank@59.176.34.129) |
| 18:21.35 | *** part/#openmoko ale_2323 (n=ale_2323@host85.200-82-90.telecom.net.ar) |
| 18:23.38 | *** part/#openmoko Henrikw (n=henrik@38.80-203-113.nextgentel.com) |
| 18:26.19 | freelock | (stepped away for a bit) leppoc: madplay just plays media files. This is easiest from an ssh shell: |
| 18:26.46 | freelock | scp mediafile.ogg root@192.168.0.202:/media/card/ |
| 18:27.09 | freelock | You run that on your computer, to copy a file to the neo. |
| 18:27.16 | freelock | Then, ssh to the neo, and run: |
| 18:27.29 | freelock | madplay /media/card/mediafile.ogg |
| 18:27.44 | leppoc | ok, let's go :) |
| 18:27.55 | freelock | ... and you should hear it coming out the speakers, if you've loaded one of the alsa state files |
| 18:28.35 | tHe_IkkE | the stereoout.state file is from matchbox on startup.. |
| 18:29.15 | *** join/#openmoko deepank__ (n=deepank@59.176.34.129) |
| 18:30.06 | mjr | hmm, madplay also plays oggs? Cool. I'd noticed that ogg123 is on the flash, but didn't notice that. |
| 18:30.29 | mjr | handier if it does both |
| 18:30.39 | *** join/#openmoko jpozlovsky (n=jindra@rb5cc115.net.upc.cz) |
| 18:31.27 | leppoc | hmm How can I know/setup the IP address ? I have a "No root to host" |
| 18:33.05 | mjr | route |
| 18:33.21 | freelock | leppoc: see http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Getting_Started_with_your_Neo1973#By_using_Ethernet_emulation_over_a_USB_cable |
| 18:33.50 | *** join/#openmoko molkko (n=username@a84-231-232-237.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 18:33.58 | SpeedEvil | I don't know if that works on qemu though. |
| 18:34.23 | freelock | Oh, is this qemu? I haven't figured out how to connect to that... |
| 18:34.30 | leppoc | yes qemu :) |
| 18:34.45 | freelock | Sorry... don't have an answer there... |
| 18:35.05 | leppoc | I have no usb device for qemu when I lsusb |
| 18:35.07 | leppoc | no problem |
| 18:35.26 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[User:Tetraden]] [[P1_Owners]] [[Other_OSes]] [[Talk:OpenMoko_under_QEMU]] |
| 18:35.39 | *** join/#openmoko twistx (n=twistx@64.30.190.171) |
| 18:36.56 | *** join/#openmoko El_Salvador (n=Brescia@adsl-189-188.37-151.net24.it) |
| 18:36.59 | borg_ | mh |
| 18:37.17 | noon | Elrond: did you get an answer to your gps-connector question? |
| 18:37.24 | borg_ | should'nt i be able to turn to landscape mode with "xrandr -o 1"? |
| 18:37.49 | borg_ | root@fic-gta01:~$ xrandr -o 1 |
| 18:37.49 | borg_ | Can't open display |
| 18:37.50 | SpeedEvil | borg: I can |
| 18:38.03 | SpeedEvil | export DISPLAY=:0 |
| 18:38.15 | borg_ | ouch |
| 18:38.16 | borg_ | yes |
| 18:38.19 | borg_ | thx :) |
| 18:39.15 | Kensan | SpeedEvil: I saw you last edited http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/OSvS Do you know the status of that project or any other info? |
| 18:40.03 | SpeedEvil | Kensan: what's the page about? |
| 18:41.17 | SpeedEvil | Kensan: no |
| 18:42.04 | Kensan | SpeedEvil: k, thanks. |
| 18:42.29 | SpeedEvil | AIUI - over GPRS, it will work - with a delay, or push-talk mode. |
| 18:42.31 | XorA|gone | I think OSvS is impossible in full duplex |
| 18:42.49 | SpeedEvil | The datarate is fine, but the delay is nasty. |
| 18:42.59 | freelock | mjr: Just tried an ogg, and it's not decoding correctly, so maybe not... |
| 18:43.05 | SpeedEvil | In GSM data-call mode, it is probably possible. |
| 18:43.07 | freelock | mp3s work fine... |
| 18:43.20 | mjr | freelock, right. Well, ogg123 then. |
| 18:43.38 | XorA|gone | SpeedEvil: ah, misread it, I thought it was a recoccurance of the analogue encryption |
| 18:43.38 | freelock | Yup, that works fine... |
| 18:43.44 | *** join/#openmoko ewanm89 (n=ewanm89@host86-152-203-130.range86-152.btcentralplus.com) |
| 18:44.01 | *** join/#openmoko ossman (n=drzeus@85.8.24.16.se.wasadata.net) |
| 18:44.31 | mjr | seems that ogg123 uses a lot of cpu though, maybe uses floating point, which is fixable |
| 18:45.15 | freelock | Yes, I'm seeing right around 40% |
| 18:45.17 | *** join/#openmoko barmeier (n=barmeier@dslb-088-072-016-025.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 18:45.25 | Kensan | XorA|gone: what do you mean by "analogue encryption"? crypto-over-gsm-voice? |
| 18:45.26 | noon | mjr: isn't there a ogg decoder with fixed math? |
| 18:45.37 | mjr | noon, yes, that's why it's fixable if indeed it's that |
| 18:45.41 | XorA|gone | Kensan: exactly |
| 18:46.10 | tHe_IkkE | mjr: You could try to compile ogg123 with softfloat. That should speed things up a bit at least (bigger binary....) |
| 18:46.17 | noon | mjr: do you know if it work, or are they still working on it? |
| 18:47.19 | Kensan | XorA|gone: I found some interesting papers about that but in essence the data-rate is too low. |
| 18:47.21 | mjr | tHe_IkkE, I kinda assume it's softfloat already, but again, don't know, haven't checked. Still better do fixed point, if indeed it doesn't already |
| 18:47.42 | tHe_IkkE | mjr: true... |
| 18:47.50 | SpeedEvil | Kensan: it falls into the 'just possible' realm - 1300bits/sec. |
| 18:48.05 | mjr | noon, afaik it works |
| 18:48.33 | XorA|gone | Kensan: when you chop things up in the analogue domain you dont have to convert them to a digital stream |
| 18:49.25 | mjr | http://xiph.org/vorbis/ for Tremor. But again, I haven't checked if OM doesn't use it already, just talking out of my ass. |
| 18:51.20 | XorA|gone | mjr: tremor is in OE |
| 18:51.29 | mjr | ack |
| 18:51.43 | mjr | it's a hog, then :] |
| 18:52.52 | tHe_IkkE | Does anyone know if there is a way to tell a "tap" from a "tap-and-hold" using the stylus? |
| 18:53.03 | tHe_IkkE | I can't find anything on the wiki |
| 18:53.40 | SpeedEvil | yes |
| 18:53.44 | SpeedEvil | basically. |
| 18:53.54 | SpeedEvil | tap = 'mouse button click' |
| 18:54.02 | SpeedEvil | tap and hold = mouse button hold |
| 18:54.09 | SpeedEvil | It works just like a mouse |
| 18:54.16 | SpeedEvil | except it doesn't move between clicks when up |
| 18:54.17 | *** join/#openmoko Xamindar_ (n=zaurus@32.144.63.154) |
| 18:54.54 | *** join/#openmoko Demitar (n=demitar@c-212-031-190-120.cust.broadway.se) |
| 18:54.55 | tHe_IkkE | SpeedEvil: hmmm... could have guessed... The problem is to tell the difference... |
| 18:55.26 | tHe_IkkE | SpeedEvil: a "right-click" would be easier.... |
| 18:56.23 | SpeedEvil | what do you mean how to tell the difference? |
| 18:56.34 | SpeedEvil | you tell the difference just like you do with a mouse. |
| 18:57.22 | tHe_IkkE | I'd like to show a "slider" when someone clicks on the profile applet (to change volume) and a menu on clik-and-hold to change profiles... |
| 18:57.58 | tHe_IkkE | The problem is that when i click-and-hold I just get the "click" not the "hold" ..... |
| 18:58.09 | SpeedEvil | If the user does not lift the pen, then it's a hold |
| 18:58.24 | SpeedEvil | !apt |
| 18:58.29 | tHe_IkkE | Yes but I receive a "clicked" event before the stylus is released... |
| 18:58.46 | SpeedEvil | That's not a clicked event. |
| 18:58.46 | *** join/#openmoko emdel (n=emdel@host168-207-dynamic.10-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 18:58.50 | SpeedEvil | It's a 'pen down' event. |
| 18:59.06 | *** join/#openmoko twistx (n=twistx@64.30.190.171) |
| 18:59.06 | SpeedEvil | you have to listen for the presence or absence of a 'pen up' event |
| 18:59.43 | *** join/#openmoko Henrikw (n=henrik@225.80-203-245.nextgentel.com) |
| 18:59.49 | Elrond | noon - No, that I remember. |
| 19:00.49 | tHe_IkkE | Is there somewhere a list of "events" you can subscribe to when using g_signal_connect ? |
| 19:00.56 | noon | Elrond: so it must be a special fic-neo gps-connector ;-) |
| 19:01.16 | SpeedEvil | I've seen it before. |
| 19:01.25 | SpeedEvil | I'm pretty sure it's not custom |
| 19:02.12 | SpeedEvil | !logs |
| 19:02.13 | cdbot2 | Channel logs for #openmoko are archived at: |
| 19:02.14 | cdbot2 | http://hentges.net/tmp/logs/irc/%23openmoko |
| 19:02.15 | cdbot2 | Live-logs are available at |
| 19:02.16 | cdbot2 | http://hentges.net/tmp/logs/irc/livelogs/%23openmoko.livelog |
| 19:02.18 | cdbot2 | See ?? help-logs for usage instructions |
| 19:03.17 | SrRaven | so hows openmoko-dev going? |
| 19:03.31 | ewanm89_laptop | Well, it exists |
| 19:03.52 | ewanm89_laptop | With 7 of us in there. |
| 19:04.32 | tHe_IkkE | SpeedEvil: Ahhh, I found it! |
| 19:04.38 | SpeedEvil | :) |
| 19:08.03 | tHe_IkkE | SpeedEvil: Really should not smoke a joint when programming, but hey it's weekend! |
| 19:08.58 | kristian-m | tHe_IkkE http://mput.de/~kristian/.openmoko/ <- 2 new states for heaphones-only and speakers-only |
| 19:11.46 | *** join/#openmoko marsan (n=marsan@ti500720a080-2350.bb.online.no) |
| 19:12.16 | tHe_IkkE | kristian-m: Thnx! You need to change the NUM_PROFILES too if you want to add states.... |
| 19:13.05 | kristian-m | tHe_IkkE ahkay - got a full harddrive-problem right now - will try later - building a openmoko-panel-profiles.bb file too |
| 19:13.33 | tHe_IkkE | I have a bb ready if you want... |
| 19:13.58 | tHe_IkkE | I added the bitbake in the same way as the other panel-applets. |
| 19:14.24 | tHe_IkkE | Then tricked bitbake with a fake tgz containing my files claiming it to be from svn :) |
| 19:14.51 | kristian-m | tHe_IkkE ah, yes i dont know if mine is working yet - still compiling some updated packages |
| 19:15.07 | tHe_IkkE | kristian-m: nice work huh ;) |
| 19:15.20 | tHe_IkkE | Compiling is such fun. |
| 19:15.28 | kristian-m | well, yes. ;-) |
| 19:19.48 | *** join/#openmoko ckuethe (n=ckuethe@S0106000024c38a18.ed.shawcable.net) |
| 19:22.05 | *** join/#openmoko wooKieeface (n=benjamin@x1-6-00-03-2f-29-99-b9.k961.webspeed.dk) |
| 19:26.35 | *** join/#openmoko ferric (n=aditya@m015f36d0.tmodns.net) |
| 19:31.06 | *** join/#openmoko Eludias (n=eludias@wingding.demon.nl) |
| 19:44.17 | *** join/#openmoko Aria (n=aredride@acrux.theinternetco.net) |
| 19:44.26 | thomasg | whats the reason for the openmoko rootfs-images for having 31 MB every time? |
| 19:47.05 | *** join/#openmoko romu1us (n=romulus@S0106000625a403af.vc.shawcable.net) |
| 19:48.18 | *** join/#openmoko Taco (n=rtm@151.204.254.171) |
| 19:50.43 | kristian-m | thomasg from how i understand it, it depends on how it is created - when using dd you'll get the size provided - when using mkfs.jffs2 -d you'll get one that is the size of the data |
| 19:56.10 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@141.80-202-161.nextgentel.com) |
| 19:57.05 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@141.80-202-161.nextgentel.com) |
| 19:58.28 | thomasg | thx. I just wonder what the "real" data size would be |
| 19:58.51 | Taco | Does anyone know how to set the timezone on a neo? |
| 20:00.24 | jgm | Taco: there is an /etc file with the details in, can't remember it offhand but just booting my Neo so will take a look |
| 20:00.48 | Taco | jgm: Thanks! |
| 20:00.53 | kristian-m | thomasg i think 31 MB is the real size |
| 20:01.58 | thomasg | well, I have a buidhost image here that has 31 mb. and I have a image from alphaone with about 20 games and 2007.2 and it has exactly 31 mb, too :) |
| 20:02.02 | jgm | Taco: It's /etc/profile, change 'TZ="UTC"' to whatever your timezone is |
| 20:02.37 | SpeedEvil | <PROTECTED> |
| 20:02.46 | Taco | jgm: Thanks, again. |
| 20:03.06 | SpeedEvil | copy from /usr/share/zoneinfo/wherever to /etc/localtime |
| 20:07.36 | *** join/#openmoko romu1us (n=romulus@S0106000625a403af.vc.shawcable.net) |
| 20:08.48 | alphaone | thomasg: Yeah, but that's built with angstrom |
| 20:09.53 | alphaone | thomasg: It's just coincidence. :-) I have images here that are 27MB big |
| 20:10.49 | thomasg | will 2007.2 contain a standard scrollbar or just that iphone-like scrolling? |
| 20:11.26 | Elrond | thomasg - 2007.2 is based on stock gtk. So all the standard gtk widgets are available. |
| 20:11.44 | thomasg | Elrond, I meant for the gui itself |
| 20:12.01 | Elrond | You mean, if it's configurable? |
| 20:12.02 | thomasg | e.g. the applications menu and so on |
| 20:12.14 | thomasg | however :) |
| 20:12.30 | Elrond | I don't know. |
| 20:12.46 | thomasg | personally I don't like that kind of scrolling, a scrollbar makes more sense for me |
| 20:13.02 | thomasg | and at moment there is no scrollbar for the OM UI |
| 20:13.12 | borg_ | there is no menu in the panel any more |
| 20:13.12 | *** join/#openmoko ewanm89 (n=ewanm89@host81-151-184-109.range81-151.btcentralplus.com) |
| 20:13.25 | borg_ | you can get to the menu bei clicking a button on the buttom |
| 20:13.39 | thomasg | I know, but the menu doesn't matter for me now :) |
| 20:13.41 | borg_ | und this menu has this iphone-like scrolling |
| 20:13.48 | borg_ | the rest is the same |
| 20:13.54 | thomasg | yes, that's the problem |
| 20:13.57 | *** join/#openmoko yveslu (n=yves@194.235.200.127) |
| 20:13.57 | borg_ | at least in the alphaone image |
| 20:14.01 | *** part/#openmoko jgm (n=jgm@host-87-74-179-156.bulldogdsl.com) |
| 20:14.06 | borg_ | but thats pretty old tho |
| 20:14.54 | *** join/#openmoko Vndmtrx (n=0x0fff@unaffiliated/vndmtrx) |
| 20:14.56 | borg_ | i think the iphone like scrolling ist ok for looking at webpages for example |
| 20:15.05 | borg_ | but i dont like the new menu too |
| 20:15.08 | borg_ | :\ |
| 20:15.41 | alphaone | the problem is that a scrollbar eats screen realestate |
| 20:15.55 | borg_ | the old menu didnt need a scrollbar |
| 20:15.57 | borg_ | ;) |
| 20:16.06 | *** part/#openmoko yveslu (n=yves@194.235.200.127) |
| 20:16.33 | SpeedEvil | iphone like scrolling means that you lose valuable glyphspace though... |
| 20:17.38 | Elrond | SpeedEvil - How do you mean that? |
| 20:17.58 | thomasg | I like the smooth scrolling, but not in menus as the contact menu and so on. imho thats slow and costs much time |
| 20:18.08 | SpeedEvil | As I understand it, you scroll by moving your finger over the main display window? |
| 20:18.18 | *** join/#openmoko slomo (n=slomo@ubuntu/member/slomo) |
| 20:18.20 | SpeedEvil | either up-down, or left-right |
| 20:18.35 | Elrond | SpeedEvil - Over the content itself, yes. |
| 20:18.40 | SpeedEvil | These are four of the basic possible glyphs. |
| 20:18.43 | Elrond | s/content/to-be-scrolled content |
| 20:19.00 | SpeedEvil | of a stroke recogniser. |
| 20:19.04 | Elrond | Ahh, you mean gestures by "glyphs"? |
| 20:19.13 | Elrond | Ahh, yeah. |
| 20:19.37 | Elrond | Well, the iphone scrolling is a thing, that the app has to "enable". |
| 20:20.07 | SpeedEvil | A 'virtual scrollbar' would work well. |
| 20:20.07 | Elrond | So I wonder, if stroke recognition makes sens in the main menu. ;-) |
| 20:20.26 | SpeedEvil | D - dialer |
| 20:20.32 | SpeedEvil | ... |
| 20:20.36 | Elrond | Ahh. |
| 20:20.50 | SpeedEvil | So you can do stuff without looking at the screen |
| 20:21.35 | Elrond | Hmm, yeah. |
| 20:21.44 | Elrond | file a bug. ;-) |
| 20:24.06 | *** join/#openmoko jonib1 (n=jonas@ua-83-227-144-18.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se) |
| 20:24.07 | thomasg | btw. is the handwriting recognition in om2007 xstroke? |
| 20:30.14 | Vegar | is openmoko.com down? |
| 20:30.24 | Psi_ | looks like it |
| 20:30.38 | borg_ | yes |
| 20:30.42 | Psi_ | maybe they are updating some 2007.2 stuff? |
| 20:30.53 | borg_ | now buildhost and openmoko.com is down |
| 20:31.40 | *** join/#openmoko fabiand (n=fabiand@wlan-client-302.informatik.uni-bremen.de) |
| 20:31.47 | Vegar | crap |
| 20:31.57 | Vegar | anyone got some nice pictures of a device? |
| 20:32.25 | *** join/#openmoko jpozlovsky (n=jindra@rb5cc115.net.upc.cz) |
| 20:33.47 | *** join/#openmoko MDK (n=mdk@cs181222091.pp.htv.fi) |
| 20:36.06 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Buying_Interest_List]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_North_Texas]] [[Screen_Shots]] [[User_talk:Secureoffice]] |
| 20:36.11 | Psi_ | Vegar, openmoko.org is still going just very slow |
| 20:36.44 | Vegar | Psi_: yes, but I'm unable to find pics there |
| 20:36.58 | SpeedEvil | what sort of pics do you want? |
| 20:37.09 | SpeedEvil | pop over to flickr, and seearch on neo1973 |
| 20:37.30 | Vegar | oh, yeah, good idea |
| 20:37.42 | Vegar | I want some pics that makes it look all cool and stylish |
| 20:37.44 | henla464_ | in the wiki it says that the music player is not implemented, has anyone started to implement it? |
| 20:38.08 | Vegar | SpeedEvil: the kind of pics that can be used to convince a friend |
| 20:38.18 | SpeedEvil | The not-implemented tags are basically a guess. |
| 20:38.35 | Psi_ | madplay works, if you just want to hear it play something |
| 20:38.41 | SpeedEvil | they were best-guess based on the page contents, and my assumptions. |
| 20:38.57 | SpeedEvil | madplay!=media player though. |
| 20:39.05 | Psi_ | yep |
| 20:39.07 | SpeedEvil | Anymore than telnet is an IRC client. |
| 20:39.18 | Psi_ | but its good to just get some mp3 playing :) |
| 20:39.23 | Elrond | henla464_ - Ask abraxa_ |
| 20:39.30 | henla464_ | Psi_: yep i know, have written a tiny script that uses madplay to play the content of the memory card |
| 20:39.31 | Vegar | http://wiki.openmoko.org/images/thumb/f/f2/Neo1973_uboot_splash.jpg/399px-Neo1973_uboot_splash.jpg - what's that nomad logo? |
| 20:39.56 | SpeedEvil | I have done irc over telnet over GPRS, using the virtual keyboard. |
| 20:40.01 | SpeedEvil | Painfull :) |
| 20:40.07 | borg_ | lol |
| 20:40.16 | Psi_ | haha |
| 20:40.20 | Elrond | [X] SpeedEvil is mad. ;o) |
| 20:40.42 | borg_ | especially because you cant use backspace :) |
| 20:40.58 | SpeedEvil | Simply using the phone as a modem is actually much easier. |
| 20:41.04 | SpeedEvil | Well - GPRS router. |
| 20:41.23 | Psi_ | borg_, somethings it works even though it doesnt look like it has |
| 20:41.27 | SpeedEvil | Or if I had a BT keyboard. |
| 20:41.36 | Psi_ | *asnt |
| 20:41.51 | borg_ | Psi_: oh, i have to test that :) |
| 20:42.18 | Psi_ | i notice it alot when using tab complete |
| 20:42.29 | *** join/#openmoko woglinde (i=woglinde@e178091008.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 20:42.33 | Psi_ | the tab corrects it |
| 20:42.42 | Psi_ | well.. corrects whats on the screen |
| 20:42.56 | borg_ | yes |
| 20:42.58 | *** join/#openmoko Spydon (n=lukas@h39n7c1o1036.bredband.skanova.com) |
| 20:43.00 | borg_ | you are right :) |
| 20:45.19 | abraxa_ | henla464_: Yeah, the music player and media player are being merged - I'll finish the wiki as soon as I find the time |
| 20:45.29 | abraxa_ | I mean... I'll update the wiki |
| 20:46.17 | henla464_ | abraxa_: great, what stage are the music/media player in now? |
| 20:47.06 | abraxa_ | henla464_: It needs to be done till the 20th so you can be sure it'll be usable by then :) |
| 20:47.54 | henla464_ | abraxa_: you have a deadline? why the 20th? |
| 20:48.32 | SpeedEvil | That's when the mothership is coming for him? |
| 20:48.43 | *** join/#openmoko lrg (n=liam@lrg2.demon.co.uk) |
| 20:49.26 | abraxa_ | Yes, the mothership has "google" printed all over it |
| 20:49.34 | borg_ | :P |
| 20:49.41 | SpeedEvil | Not. Evil. (aliens). |
| 20:49.57 | *** join/#openmoko BlackBsd (n=brian@72.168.193.117) |
| 20:50.00 | henla464_ | lol |
| 20:50.20 | abraxa_ | borg_: Sorry, not you guys - gotta try harder next time |
| 20:50.48 | *** part/#openmoko mdt (n=mdt@littlelun.emdete.de) |
| 20:51.02 | *** join/#openmoko mdt (n=mdt@littlelun.emdete.de) |
| 20:51.23 | mdt | is there a .bb file for tui? |
| 20:51.41 | juri_ | abraxa: google will let just about anyone in nowadays. ;P |
| 20:52.04 | Kensan | abraxa_: so where do you come in here? (http://www.flickr.com/photos/jurvetson/21470089/) ;) |
| 20:52.07 | *** join/#openmoko daniel_bergamini (n=danieber@70-41-166-57.cust.wildblue.net) |
| 20:52.12 | *** join/#openmoko ahbritto (n=guest@adsl-64-161-117-110.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net) |
| 20:52.31 | *** join/#openmoko morricone (n=foobar@dslb-084-057-144-178.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 20:53.29 | abraxa_ | Kensan: What do you mean? I wrote the master plan. |
| 20:54.19 | Kensan | abraxa_: speaking of which: this is quite fun to watch: http://masterplanthemovie.com/ |
| 20:55.15 | abraxa_ | Man, I am disappointed |
| 20:55.35 | abraxa_ | Nowhere on that blackboard do I see the word "beta" |
| 20:59.06 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@141.80-202-161.nextgentel.com) |
| 21:04.35 | SpeedEvil | I notice a 'tomtom remote' - is this a bluetooth or IR remote? |
| 21:04.46 | SpeedEvil | Because if it's bluetooth - it's cheap and a 'remote'. |
| 21:04.54 | *** join/#openmoko drath_ (i=vmaster@p5B07E3D9.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 21:07.44 | *** join/#openmoko PBeck (n=PBeck@HSI-KBW-091-089-102-236.hsi2.kabelbw.de) |
| 21:09.39 | *** join/#openmoko IRC (n=rmoreira@87-196-53-235.net.novis.pt) |
| 21:10.55 | *** join/#openmoko MDK (n=mdk@cs181222091.pp.htv.fi) |
| 21:14.07 | *** join/#openmoko mmp (n=mmp@adsl-d144.87-197-128.t-com.sk) |
| 21:17.34 | CIA-24 | openmoko: 03zecke * r2640 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/applications/openmoko-feedreader2/ (6 files in 2 dirs): (log message trimmed) |
| 21:17.34 | CIA-24 | openmoko: 2007-08-05 Holger Hans Peter Freyther <zecke@selfish.org> |
| 21:17.34 | CIA-24 | openmoko: Implement filtering of feeds again. Switch the position |
| 21:17.34 | CIA-24 | openmoko: of Prev/Next and use the right stock items in feed_item_view_init. |
| 21:17.34 | CIA-24 | openmoko: * src/feed-data.c: |
| 21:17.38 | CIA-24 | openmoko: (feed_filter_filter_category): Implement |
| 21:17.40 | CIA-24 | openmoko: (feed_filter_filter_text): Implement (similiar to _category) |
| 21:22.06 | Spydon | all .po files are already translated into Swedish >_< |
| 21:25.20 | SpeedEvil | What is the name of the type of USB connector on the neo? |
| 21:26.29 | *** join/#openmoko mzb_d800 (n=mzb@ppp108-88.static.internode.on.net) |
| 21:26.43 | *** join/#openmoko PBeck (n=PBeck@HSI-KBW-091-089-102-236.hsi2.kabelbw.de) |
| 21:27.33 | Kliment_ | SpeedEvil: mini-b |
| 21:28.13 | Kliment_ | if I remember correctly |
| 21:30.04 | *** join/#openmoko spliffy_ (n=spliffy@p54B1F540.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 21:33.29 | *** join/#openmoko ben_goodger (n=ben@host86-148-9-32.range86-148.btcentralplus.com) |
| 21:37.09 | *** join/#openmoko slomo_ (n=slomo@ubuntu/member/slomo) |
| 21:40.45 | CIA-24 | openmoko: 03zecke * r2641 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/applications/openmoko-feedreader2/ (ChangeLog src/feed-data.c src/feed-selection-view.c): (log message trimmed) |
| 21:40.45 | CIA-24 | openmoko: 2007-08-05 Holger Hans Peter Freyther <zecke@selfish.org> |
| 21:40.45 | CIA-24 | openmoko: Implement category filtering (and made sure it compiles). Feature wise |
| 21:40.45 | CIA-24 | openmoko: it is 'enpar' with the old application again. |
| 21:40.45 | CIA-24 | openmoko: * src/feed-data.c: |
| 21:40.49 | CIA-24 | openmoko: (rss_filter_entries): Use FeedFilter::category for filtering categories |
| 21:40.51 | CIA-24 | openmoko: * src/feed-selection-view.c: |
| 21:43.39 | *** join/#openmoko zecke (n=ich@gprs-pool-1-012.eplus-online.de) |
| 21:44.14 | zecke | hey |
| 21:44.23 | *** part/#openmoko ulmen (n=ulmen@cryptomilch.de) |
| 21:46.23 | SpeedEvil | Hmm. |
| 21:46.53 | *** join/#openmoko Pupeno (n=Pupeno@cl-241.dub-01.ie.sixxs.net) |
| 21:47.17 | stefan_schmidt | zecke: Work day? |
| 21:47.34 | zecke | stefan_schmidt: no, grand-ma's party is over |
| 21:47.41 | stefan_schmidt | zecke: heh |
| 21:47.43 | aevin | is every openmoko application going version 2? |
| 21:47.51 | zecke | the app looks like crap though :) |
| 21:48.05 | stefan_schmidt | aevin: Every app we control, yes |
| 21:48.12 | stefan_schmidt | zecke: It builds? |
| 21:48.13 | zecke | aevin: yes, every app will be rewritten in Qt (even the kernel!) and will have version 2. |
| 21:48.28 | aevin | stefan_schmidt: okay, so OM 2007.2 is supposed to have all openmoko-*2 applications ? |
| 21:48.30 | SpeedEvil | ah - got it. |
| 21:48.35 | stefan_schmidt | aevin: yes |
| 21:48.48 | zecke | stefan_schmidt: it builds, runs, shouldn't crash |
| 21:49.01 | stefan_schmidt | zecke: ok, I'll test it on the camp |
| 21:49.16 | aevin | wow, I didn't know the v2 apps were going Qt! that is quite huge news to me, I think. |
| 21:49.18 | zecke | stefan_schmidt: the only known issue is: moko-finger-scroll refuses to draw the indicator on top of the WebKitGtkPage |
| 21:49.19 | aevin | interesting :) |
| 21:49.29 | zecke | stefan_schmidt: are you at the camp yet? |
| 21:49.37 | stefan_schmidt | aevin: Don't trust zecke :) |
| 21:49.43 | stefan_schmidt | zecke: No, tuesday |
| 21:49.58 | aevin | stefan_schmidt: okay ;-) he got me. |
| 21:50.31 | zecke | aevin: this "even the kernel!" didn't make you ...? |
| 21:51.07 | stefan_schmidt | zecke: No I understand the job offer from TT. Bitching about QT in OM ;) |
| 21:51.14 | stefan_schmidt | s/No/Now/ |
| 21:51.19 | aevin | zecke: lol. it should have, but I read it hastily. |
| 21:51.41 | zecke | stefan_schmidt: well, it could have been QuickTime ;) |
| 21:51.56 | *** join/#openmoko helb (n=helb@84.244.90.159) |
| 21:52.35 | aevin | zecke: you got an offer -- and rejected it? |
| 21:53.38 | zecke | I just listen to radiohead and feel like a creep |
| 21:54.12 | woglinde | hm |
| 21:54.50 | *** join/#openmoko PBeck (n=PBeck@HSI-KBW-091-089-102-236.hsi2.kabelbw.de) |
| 21:54.52 | zecke | hehe :) |
| 21:56.17 | zecke | stefan_schmidt: actually, I feel a lot like homer simpson. Specially as in the episode Tingle-Tangle-Bob is out of prison (again) and the simpsons go to the withness-protection program |
| 21:56.59 | Kensan | zecke: so you love driving through the cactus fields then? ;) |
| 21:57.03 | stefan_schmidt | zecke: Yeah, that one is cool. I like the t-shirts he wear for the project or learning his new name. :) |
| 21:57.38 | zecke | stefan_schmidt: When it goes to job offers, I'm like homer learning his new name |
| 21:57.55 | *** join/#openmoko Pupeno (n=Pupeno@89-125-118-244.dhcp-ripwave.irishbroadband.ie) |
| 21:58.55 | stefan_schmidt | zecke: So why? You have the talent to really change stuff. Seems I need to get you drunk at the camp and let you sign a OM contract. mickey|sports would love me for this. ;) |
| 21:59.59 | zecke | stefan_schmidt: hehe. I found out if you say "Flickr photos" to a dutch guy he is going to think you are gay :) |
| 22:00.34 | stefan_schmidt | zecke: :D |
| 22:00.54 | mmazur | Yeey. I should get my neo tomorrow/the day after. |
| 22:01.20 | *** part/#openmoko jonib1 (n=jonas@ua-83-227-144-18.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se) |
| 22:01.33 | zecke | http://page.mi.fu-berlin.de/freyther/feedreader2.png |
| 22:02.27 | borg_ | :) |
| 22:03.33 | zecke | crap as in missing icons (going to send a mail now) |
| 22:04.07 | stefan_schmidt | zecke: The above filter menu is just for the different feeds? |
| 22:04.29 | Vegar | zecke: can it be used without a stylus? |
| 22:04.41 | zecke | Vegar: my macbook doesn't have a stylus :) |
| 22:05.01 | Vegar | zecke: on a neo? |
| 22:05.33 | zecke | Vegar: I'm going to try it on tuesday but I assume I will have plenty of time from wednesday to sunday to fix any issues |
| 22:05.56 | Vegar | ok |
| 22:05.57 | Vegar | cool |
| 22:12.24 | *** join/#openmoko danilos (n=danilo@adsl-236-193.eunet.yu) |
| 22:16.05 | Kliment_ | SpeedEvil: what do you need a mini-b shell for? |
| 22:16.21 | zecke | brb |
| 22:16.34 | Kliment_ | SpeedEvil: it's also called mini-usb since OTG showed up |
| 22:19.57 | *** join/#openmoko Jeffrey23 (n=desolato@83.101.15.150) |
| 22:20.43 | *** join/#openmoko daMaestro (n=jon@fedora/damaestro) |
| 22:22.18 | SpeedEvil | Kliment: I want as close to a right-angle flush connector as I can get. |
| 22:23.02 | Jeffrey23 | hi everyone, i have a question about the logitech Z5450 surround set, is the internal decoder capable of transforming a stereo signal into a quadrofonic sound |
| 22:23.22 | Jeffrey23 | like that the two front and the two rear boxes will play sound |
| 22:26.14 | *** join/#openmoko zecke (n=ich@gprs-pool-1-012.eplus-online.de) |
| 22:26.19 | zecke | re |
| 22:27.13 | *** join/#openmoko ben_goodger_ (n=ben@host81-153-83-241.range81-153.btcentralplus.com) |
| 22:27.15 | *** part/#openmoko rmoravcik (n=rmoravci@ip-89-103-152-149.karneval.cz) |
| 22:27.50 | ljp | hi zecke |
| 22:29.00 | zecke | ljp: how are you? |
| 22:29.02 | SpeedEvil | Kliment_: which practically means fabricating one. |
| 22:29.07 | ljp | good. |
| 22:30.21 | *** join/#openmoko rtm_ (n=rtm@151.204.254.171) |
| 22:30.21 | daMaestro | so is om2007.2 just mainly a ui related branch? |
| 22:30.47 | zecke | ljp: awesome :) |
| 22:30.57 | ljp | and you? |
| 22:31.02 | zecke | ljp: can you say something about Qtopia4.3? |
| 22:31.12 | ljp | it looks better than 4.2 |
| 22:31.27 | zecke | ljp: well, my grand-ma just turned 90 and tomorrow I'm flying back home |
| 22:31.27 | ljp | and there will be some good news soon |
| 22:31.50 | zecke | like Knut going to the camp as well? |
| 22:32.01 | zecke | stefan_schmidt: did you convince mickeyl to join us at the camp? |
| 22:33.06 | ljp | dont know what knut is doing |
| 22:33.19 | zecke | I think he has vacations |
| 22:34.02 | stefan_schmidt | zecke: I fear he is still undecided. I should try to bait him with your presence. :) |
| 22:34.05 | *** join/#openmoko behdad (n=behdad@CPE000fb55e466d-CM0012c9c84bc4.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 22:34.25 | stefan_schmidt | mickey|sports: You _must_ come to the camp. Even zecke is coming. :) |
| 22:34.34 | *** join/#openmoko javier_galicia (n=Javier@189.130.233.249) |
| 22:34.46 | ljp | 2007.2 looks heaps better |
| 22:34.55 | thomasg | definately, yes |
| 22:35.10 | SpeedEvil | Is there an actual 2000.7 downloadable image? |
| 22:35.21 | zecke | SpeedEvil: no but 2007.2 |
| 22:35.24 | thomasg | on buildhost (if it is up again) |
| 22:35.28 | SpeedEvil | Ah |
| 22:35.31 | thomasg | erm |
| 22:35.32 | aevin | haha! |
| 22:35.35 | thomasg | didn't see the 7 :) |
| 22:35.44 | zecke | folks.o-hand.com/~chris had images as well |
| 22:35.45 | thomasg | http://people.openmoko.org/alphaone/images/ |
| 22:36.01 | SpeedEvil | Is there a 'upgrading from inside linux, not u-boot'? |
| 22:36.07 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Norway]] [[Application_Development_Crash_Course]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Oslo]] |
| 22:37.31 | thomasg | SpeedEvil, don't think so |
| 22:39.04 | jaebird | SpeedEvil, that would be pretty sweet...upgrade on the go |
| 22:43.59 | daMaestro | lol, i've had to resort to dialing via the gsm shell... |
| 22:44.00 | daMaestro | :-D |
| 22:44.56 | Elrond | Wee... mickey is doing sports for 15 hours? ;-) |
| 22:45.38 | thomasg | when are the next olympic games? :) |
| 22:46.11 | CIA-24 | openmoko: 03zecke * r2642 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/applications/openmoko-feedreader2/ (ChangeLog src/feed-data.c): (log message trimmed) |
| 22:46.11 | CIA-24 | openmoko: 2007-08-06 Holger Hans Peter Freyther <zecke@selfish.org> |
| 22:46.11 | CIA-24 | openmoko: Remove old feed posts from the model only once the new posts |
| 22:46.11 | CIA-24 | openmoko: were fetched and parsed. |
| 22:46.11 | CIA-24 | openmoko: * src/feed-data.c: |
| 22:46.12 | CIA-24 | openmoko: (remove_old_items): |
| 22:46.16 | CIA-24 | openmoko: (feed_update_thread): |
| 22:47.59 | daMaestro | so far, it seems i'm more interested in fixing up gsmd |
| 22:48.03 | Kliment_ | when/where is this camp? |
| 22:48.08 | daMaestro | first thing i want to fix is the damn init scripts |
| 22:48.14 | woglinde | ccc camp |
| 22:48.18 | zecke | Kliment_: events.ccc.de |
| 22:48.35 | *** join/#openmoko ericthefish (n=ivan@82-71-36-214.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk) |
| 22:48.41 | Kliment_ | ah crap |
| 22:48.54 | Kliment_ | it had to be at the time when I'm at the OTHER end of germany |
| 22:48.58 | Kliment_ | so close and yet so far |
| 22:49.54 | zecke | germany has another end? |
| 22:50.03 | Kliment_ | zecke: Köln |
| 22:50.10 | zecke | cya :) |
| 22:50.28 | Kliment_ | during the time of the ccc, I have to |
| 22:50.28 | zecke | Kliment_: take a cheap airplane to berlin? |
| 22:50.30 | aevin | in 2009 (or whenever it is next time) I think I'll have to make sure my vacation coincide with CCC |
| 22:50.33 | Kliment_ | get a work permit |
| 22:50.40 | Kliment_ | fix my contract with the university |
| 22:50.46 | Kliment_ | find an apartment |
| 22:50.57 | Kliment_ | arrange for bank, internet and phone stuff |
| 22:50.59 | zecke | apartments and contracts are overrated |
| 22:51.13 | Kliment_ | get health insurance |
| 22:51.14 | woglinde | zecke get some sleep |
| 22:51.21 | Kliment_ | etc etc |
| 22:51.31 | zecke | woglinde: why? :) |
| 22:51.39 | Jeroen | you can just sleep in a tent the coming week, no need for an apartment :-P |
| 22:51.55 | Kliment_ | Jeroen: uhm, I'm moving to germany next month |
| 22:52.19 | Kliment_ | and unlike finland, you can't just sleep in a tent anywhere you like |
| 22:52.47 | Kliment_ | here you can just set up a tent in a park or forest and noone will mind |
| 22:52.47 | woglinde | nite |
| 22:54.07 | Kliment_ | I'll hack on eye movement stuff until my phone gets here |
| 22:54.20 | Kliment_ | then I get to do power consumption and UI work |
| 22:54.20 | daMaestro | i got charged twice :-( |
| 22:54.33 | Kliment_ | daMaestro: that is very bad |
| 22:54.36 | daMaestro | and have yet to hear back from support@ for a refund |
| 22:54.50 | daMaestro | yeah, i really don't want to go to my bank's fraud dept. |
| 22:54.50 | DukeOfURL | daMaestro: did you get your phone yet/ |
| 22:54.53 | DukeOfURL | ? |
| 22:54.55 | daMaestro | yes |
| 22:54.58 | Kliment_ | daMaestro: but maybe you can give one to one of those poor souls with a very high order number |
| 22:55.14 | daMaestro | no, i only got one phone |
| 22:55.17 | daMaestro | and got charged twice |
| 22:55.22 | Kliment_ | oh I see |
| 22:55.26 | DukeOfURL | daMaestro: are you in Denver? |
| 22:55.31 | daMaestro | DukeOfURL, yes |
| 22:55.46 | DukeOfURL | we should get serious about a user's group meeting |
| 22:55.55 | *** part/#openmoko javier_galicia (n=Javier@189.130.233.249) |
| 22:55.56 | daMaestro | DukeOfURL, i'm all for it |
| 22:56.05 | daMaestro | DukeOfURL, i'm actually at a cafe right now about to meet up for a hack session |
| 22:56.07 | DukeOfURL | MacNorth is in Ft Collings |
| 22:56.32 | *** join/#openmoko MetaMorfoziS (n=khmhm@53d8273e.adsl.enternet.hu) |
| 22:56.34 | DukeOfURL | what are you doing tomorrow? |
| 22:56.37 | daMaestro | work |
| 22:56.43 | DukeOfURL | ugh |
| 22:56.50 | Kliment_ | DukeOfURL: go meet them at that cafe |
| 22:56.58 | DukeOfURL | which one? |
| 22:57.35 | Kliment_ | no idea, maybe daMaestro will tell you |
| 22:57.57 | Kliment_ | but I must sleep |
| 22:58.07 | Kliment_ | up in 5 hours, flying in te |
| 22:58.09 | Kliment_ | ten* |
| 22:58.34 | Kliment_ | and I still have to pack clothes |
| 22:58.40 | Kliment_ | night all |
| 23:00.23 | mdt | Kliment_, see you in koeln? :D |
| 23:01.20 | *** join/#openmoko arw_ (i=familia@190.24.90.129) |
| 23:02.06 | *** part/#openmoko mdt (n=mdt@littlelun.emdete.de) |
| 23:02.16 | borg_ | is there anything like dhclient on the neo? |
| 23:03.24 | *** join/#openmoko Ryushin (i=proxy@windwalker.openinnovations.com) |
| 23:05.34 | *** join/#openmoko Kragnerac (n=Michael_@cpe-65-26-156-138.cinci.res.rr.com) |
| 23:05.50 | *** join/#openmoko Henrikw (n=henrik@225.80-203-245.nextgentel.com) |
| 23:06.39 | zecke | night |
| 23:09.15 | *** join/#openmoko linux_galore (n=Richard@dsl-220-253-69-10.NSW.netspace.net.au) |
| 23:09.48 | kristian-m | 'night |
| 23:13.56 | Elrond | SpeedEvil - BTW: Did you have a current probe on the battery? |
| 23:15.14 | SpeedEvil | I do, yes, though at the moment it's twisted wire only. |
| 23:16.04 | SpeedEvil | I found the most convenient way to measure current was to take a USB lead, with the power wire cut, and measure the battery current. |
| 23:16.29 | SpeedEvil | This way it measures the current in the mode you care about. |
| 23:16.44 | Elrond | Huh? |
| 23:17.01 | SpeedEvil | You don't care about USB current - as it's plugged in then. |
| 23:17.05 | Elrond | Ahh, so that you can do usbnet, while the neo runs on battery. Yeah. |
| 23:17.08 | SpeedEvil | You only care about battery drain. |
| 23:17.17 | SpeedEvil | As I have no bluetooth keyboard. |
| 23:17.47 | Elrond | Yeah, I still did not convince myself to buy a BT dongle for my desktop. |
| 23:17.47 | SpeedEvil | I need to make a script to do this properly. |
| 23:18.10 | SpeedEvil | And find out how to switch off the WM* chip, and the LM* chip. |
| 23:19.03 | SpeedEvil | !logs |
| 23:19.05 | cdbot2 | Channel logs for #openmoko are archived at: |
| 23:19.07 | cdbot2 | http://hentges.net/tmp/logs/irc/%23openmoko |
| 23:19.07 | cdbot2 | Live-logs are available at |
| 23:19.08 | cdbot2 | http://hentges.net/tmp/logs/irc/livelogs/%23openmoko.livelog |
| 23:19.11 | cdbot2 | See ?? help-logs for usage instructions |
| 23:19.34 | Elrond | WM: I don't know. |
| 23:19.34 | Elrond | LM: alsamixer, I think. |
| 23:20.06 | SpeedEvil | the WM* is the wolfson media 'sound-card'. the LM is the audio amp. |
| 23:20.07 | Elrond | What I'm wondering: Did you measure battery current in "off" mode? |
| 23:20.13 | borg_ | where should i fill in the dns server on openmoko? |
| 23:20.24 | SpeedEvil | Actually - I diddn't. Only suspend. |
| 23:20.29 | Elrond | borg_ - Like on any linux system: /etc/resolv.conf |
| 23:20.35 | borg_ | there is no /etc/resolv.conf |
| 23:20.40 | SpeedEvil | Make one! |
| 23:20.43 | borg_ | ok :) |
| 23:20.46 | SpeedEvil | nameserver 1.2.3.4 |
| 23:20.51 | SpeedEvil | nameserver 3.4.5.6 |
| 23:20.56 | SpeedEvil | a couple is a good plan. |
| 23:20.57 | Elrond | Buy one! I sell them for $10. ;o) |
| 23:21.03 | SpeedEvil | (note, neither of those are real ones) |
| 23:21.37 | borg_ | aaah |
| 23:21.39 | borg_ | it works :) |
| 23:21.39 | borg_ | yeha |
| 23:21.55 | Elrond | borg_ - Send $5 to SpeedEvil and $5 to me ;o) |
| 23:22.06 | borg_ | ohuh :) |
| 23:22.08 | Kragnerac | :) |
| 23:22.09 | cesarb | SpeedEvil: shouldn't the pppd do it for you? |
| 23:22.14 | SpeedEvil | Well. |
| 23:22.17 | daMaestro | echo nameserver 1.2.3.4 > /etc/resolv.conf |
| 23:22.19 | daMaestro | send me some money too |
| 23:22.20 | borg_ | i have a bridge between eth0 and usb0 now |
| 23:22.20 | daMaestro | ;-) |
| 23:22.23 | SpeedEvil | I can only say that in my case, it did not. |
| 23:22.30 | borg_ | so my neo is really in my network now :D |
| 23:22.37 | *** join/#openmoko khester (n=khester@c-24-4-236-98.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 23:22.59 | cesarb | SpeedEvil: did you use usepeerdns? |
| 23:23.43 | SpeedEvil | I used the script on the wiki |
| 23:24.00 | SpeedEvil | Modified a little to kill gsmd and turn the modem off and on |
| 23:24.07 | cesarb | SpeedEvil: (of course, even with usepeerdns, it's the ip-up script which actually does the resolv.conf mangling) |
| 23:25.17 | daMaestro | gsmd crashes on my every few calls; but i'm normally able to use the dialer now, and if need be i can use the libgsm shell |
| 23:25.41 | Elrond | daMaestro - Can you receive calls? |
| 23:26.01 | daMaestro | not via the gui |
| 23:26.09 | daMaestro | but via the libgsm shell, yes |
| 23:26.40 | SpeedEvil | If anyone cares - http://www.mauve.plus.com/gprs-connect-chat is the chat script I used. |
| 23:26.47 | SpeedEvil | t-mobile-uk |
| 23:29.27 | SpeedEvil | Elrond: lowest mode I tested was 'echo mem >/sys/power/state' which came out at 120mW |
| 23:30.02 | SpeedEvil | Which is some 36 hours |
| 23:30.22 | SpeedEvil | GPS _seems_ to be 20mW or so. |
| 23:30.44 | SpeedEvil | This may not be in the fully powered up condition though. |
| 23:30.59 | Elrond | Huh? |
| 23:31.18 | Elrond | How did you power it up? |
| 23:32.00 | SpeedEvil | I simply echoed 1 to pwron |
| 23:32.29 | Elrond | Ahh. That's not enough. ;o) |
| 23:32.46 | SpeedEvil | What does that do? |
| 23:33.16 | Elrond | Hmmm... if you ran gllin before... it probably is close to power up. |
| 23:33.20 | SpeedEvil | Interestingly, clock speed 100Mhz and clock speed 200Mhz - as set by u-boot - use the same. |
| 23:33.24 | SpeedEvil | I don't think I had. |
| 23:33.44 | Elrond | Otherwise it just puts some GPIO to high. ;-) |
| 23:33.57 | SpeedEvil | Oh - it's a chip enable then. |
| 23:34.03 | Elrond | Yes. |
| 23:34.07 | SpeedEvil | rather than a turn voltage rails on. |
| 23:34.22 | Elrond | The hammerhead has various voltages, that it loves. |
| 23:34.41 | Elrond | And it loves them to be switched on in the right order. With delays here and there. |
| 23:35.20 | Elrond | "echo power_up > power_sequence" comes close. |
| 23:35.35 | *** join/#openmoko BlackBsd (n=brian@72.168.193.117) |
| 23:35.39 | SpeedEvil | does power_down kill it properly? |
| 23:35.54 | Elrond | No. |
| 23:35.59 | SpeedEvil | Oh well. |
| 23:36.04 | Elrond | Or I don't think so. |
| 23:36.04 | SpeedEvil | I guess echoing 0 to all the voltages will. |
| 23:36.55 | Elrond | for i in power_*; do; echo -n "$i: "; cat $i; done |
| 23:36.59 | SpeedEvil | I'm trying to work out a nice way to do this semi-accurately. |
| 23:37.04 | Elrond | All those with 1: Put a 0 in there. |
| 23:37.05 | SpeedEvil | yeah |
| 23:37.33 | Elrond | I will fixup the python gps power-modules soon. It's currently modeled after gllin, which is also broken. |
| 23:39.48 | Elrond | The gps power stuff is very unclean. :-| |
| 23:40.26 | abraxa_ | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Image:Neo1973_uboot_splash.jpg - just curious... does anyone know the meaning of the 'nomad' branding of that prototype? |
| 23:40.30 | Marex | hi, anyone who can update the wiki page about wifi? http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/WiFi_support_in_OpenMoko |
| 23:40.47 | Marex | I have some more detailed info about marvell wifi stuff and palmld if you are interested |
| 23:40.57 | Elrond | abraxa_ - No. |
| 23:41.03 | *** join/#openmoko borg_ (n=olaf@80.149.17.21) |
| 23:41.17 | *** join/#openmoko BlackBsd (n=brian@72.168.193.117) |
| 23:41.34 | SpeedEvil | Yes, anyone can. |
| 23:41.44 | Marex | Im too lazy to register ... |
| 23:41.48 | Marex | :-B |
| 23:42.22 | SpeedEvil | do you have it in a blob of text? |
| 23:42.38 | SpeedEvil | If so, DCC it to me, and I may put it in if I've got time. |
| 23:42.42 | Marex | ok ... I already registered ... |
| 23:42.45 | Marex | lesse |
| 23:42.45 | SpeedEvil | Or do that. |
| 23:43.32 | borg_ | if i do |
| 23:43.32 | borg_ | allow-hotplug usb0 |
| 23:43.38 | borg_ | iface usb0 inet manual |
| 23:43.57 | borg_ | then the following should be called if i put in the neo |
| 23:44.04 | borg_ | or? |
| 23:44.04 | borg_ | in /etc/network/interfaces |
| 23:44.57 | Elrond | Yes. |
| 23:45.07 | borg_ | mh |
| 23:45.07 | Elrond | Works nicely for me. |
| 23:45.07 | borg_ | it works if i do it manuelly |
| 23:45.17 | borg_ | i test it with |
| 23:45.17 | borg_ | <PROTECTED> |
| 23:45.28 | borg_ | there is not /home/olaf/test if i put in the neo ... |
| 23:45.39 | Elrond | Works to the point, that I can ssh into neo, unplug neo, take it outside, come back, plug back in, continue to use the ssh. |
| 23:45.39 | borg_ | if i do ifup usb0 it works |
| 23:45.39 | borg_ | that sucks |
| 23:45.52 | Elrond | borg_ - Do you have udev or some other hotplug manager? |
| 23:46.12 | borg_ | yes, udv |
| 23:46.14 | borg_ | +e |
| 23:46.19 | borg_ | olaf@pc:~$ ps aux | grep udev |
| 23:46.22 | borg_ | root 2580 0.0 0.1 2908 1192 ? S<s 01:39 0:00 /sbin/udevd --daemon |
| 23:46.22 | borg_ | (ubuntu feisty) |
| 23:46.37 | Elrond | Hmm, strange. |
| 23:46.44 | borg_ | hotplug worls with a bunch of other devices |
| 23:46.47 | Elrond | debian testing here, works really nice. |
| 23:47.26 | borg_ | i made a bridge with |
| 23:47.28 | borg_ | auto br0 |
| 23:47.29 | borg_ | iface br0 inet dhcp bridge_ports eth0 |
| 23:47.29 | borg_ | and |
| 23:47.36 | borg_ | iface usb0 inet manual up ifconfig $IFACE 0.0.0.0 up post-up brctl addif br0 usb0 |
| 23:47.44 | borg_ | it works too |
| 23:47.50 | borg_ | but not automatically with hotplug |
| 23:48.00 | *** join/#openmoko ckuethe (n=ckuethe@S0106000024c38a18.ed.shawcable.net) |
| 23:48.37 | borg_ | oh, irssi has eaten some word wraps ;) |
| 23:49.00 | thomasg | I just checked out a OE-monotone-snapshot but when I try to update it it complains about a wrong version. I have monotone 0.29 |
| 23:49.13 | thomasg | what version does the latest snapshot want? |
| 23:49.30 | borg_ | olaf@pc:~$ mtn --version |
| 23:49.30 | borg_ | monotone 0.35 (Basis-Revision: f92dd754bf5c1e6eddc9c462b8d68691cfeb7f8b) |
| 23:50.01 | borg_ | i dont know if 0.35 is needed |
| 23:50.10 | borg_ | but it does work with 0.35 ;) |
| 23:50.26 | thomasg | ok, 0.29 seems to be a *bit* older :) |
| 23:50.32 | *** join/#openmoko fridim (n=fridim@AStDenis-105-1-16-54.w81-248.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 23:50.36 | Elrond | debian stable's monotone is enough. |
| 23:50.53 | Elrond | monotone 0.31 works for me. |
| 23:50.54 | thomasg | what's debian stable's monotone? |
| 23:51.25 | XorA|gone | 0.35 is a whole shitload faster for some operations |
| 23:51.34 | borg_ | mmh |
| 23:51.38 | thomasg | however, I'm updating at moment |
| 23:51.40 | borg_ | Elrond: i had some problems with Version: 0.31-7 |
| 23:51.51 | borg_ | thats the feisty version |
| 23:52.01 | Elrond | borg_ - Hmm. I have -8. |
| 23:52.05 | borg_ | so i did apt-get -t gutsy install monotone |
| 23:52.12 | borg_ | Elrond: ah, ok |
| 23:52.22 | borg_ | but the gutsy version of monotone works well :) |
| 23:52.30 | Elrond | XorA|gone - Ahh, good to know. monotone pull is just a CPU killer. |
| 23:52.35 | borg_ | and it really seems to be a lot faster as XorA|gone said |
| 23:53.00 | XorA|gone | 0.35-etch0.1 on my ubuntu |
| 23:55.04 | *** part/#openmoko fridim (n=fridim@AStDenis-105-1-16-54.w81-248.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
