| 00:02.00 | cesarb | jaebird: speaking of answering when it rings |
| 00:02.08 | juri_ | still no ship notice... |
| 00:02.09 | cesarb | jaebird: one of my pet annoyances with the Razr |
| 00:02.18 | juri_ | i want my moko! gimme! |
| 00:02.23 | cesarb | jaebird: if you put it on vibrate then ring, it vibrates twice and then rings... |
| 00:02.33 | cesarb | jaebird: EXACTLY at the point when you are ALMOST opening the screen |
| 00:02.46 | cesarb | jaebird: couldn't it vibrate just once more? |
| 00:03.05 | MacNorth | now that the first phones are in the US, we may need to switch timezones. working time monday isn't for another 15 hours or so |
| 00:05.57 | daxxar | cesarb: Set a ringtone that has a few seconds of silence? ;-) |
| 00:06.04 | daxxar | cesarb: (prepended to it) |
| 00:06.16 | jaebird | cesarb: i don't know...i have an E2 ROKR and i just hit the red button and it ignores instantly and goes to voicemail |
| 00:06.50 | cesarb | daxxar: good idea, I'd try it if I weren't already getting a new phone :D |
| 00:07.08 | jaebird | moto's flip phones are notorious for not allowing an ignore...the side button just silences |
| 00:07.56 | daxxar | cesarb: :-) |
| 00:08.30 | *** join/#openmoko michaelshiloh (n=chatzill@ip2.fa1-0-2.occ.iinet.com) |
| 00:09.07 | daxxar | I wonder how long it'll take before SMS & power-management is in a usable state. (those are, tbh, my only requirements for dumping this crap WM5.0 mobile) |
| 00:09.25 | *** join/#openmoko borg_ (n=olaf@80.149.17.21) |
| 00:09.35 | daxxar | But the SMS-part is more than just a frontend missing? |
| 00:09.51 | daxxar | (problem with gsmd or whatever handles it?) |
| 00:10.01 | cesarb | daxxar: the SMS part will probably have an army of geeks over it soon, so it'll end up working quite fast (I hope) |
| 00:10.26 | cesarb | daxxar: the problem is mostly with gsmd AFAIK, which IIRC gets confused by the modem's replies or something like that |
| 00:10.52 | cesarb | daxxar: but the power management part is harder, because it's not just coding (and it could even need kernel-level coding, which can be scary) |
| 00:11.02 | jaebird | i don't think people should underestimate the amount of work left before openmoko is useable |
| 00:11.27 | jaebird | i'm reading bugzilla (unless it is out of date!) there are lots of outstanding bugs that are really important :) |
| 00:12.02 | daxxar | Hm, okay. |
| 00:12.06 | daxxar | Well, good night. :-) |
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| 00:38.22 | cesarb | counter |
| 00:38.22 | aloril | (last update 2007-07-21 06:20) http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter : Order https://direct.openmoko.com/ ; Shipping prob. 75% in 2 days 23:21:37 (2.973±2.5 days) (1769;249) |
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| 00:59.57 | SpeedEvil | jaebird: It has been suggested - not-completely-in-jest that 'October' may in fact be a codename, not the actual month :/ |
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| 01:27.14 | jaebird | SpeedEvil: heh |
| 01:30.19 | cesarb | SpeedEvil: hah |
| 01:30.32 | daMaestro | yeah, we're going to be lucky if we see GTA02 before the end of year holiday |
| 01:30.46 | cesarb | SpeedEvil: much like YES_I_DO has an specific meaning around here |
| 01:31.42 | cesarb | daMaestro: I do not think it's impossible, we don't know how far ahead they are with it (they are quite tight-lipped (sp?) about that... don't they always report after the fact) |
| 01:31.52 | galexande | i'll be lucky to see gta01 before hanukah |
| 01:31.53 | jaebird | DO_I?_YES |
| 01:31.55 | cesarb | daMaestro: however, I don't know if the software will be ready by then... |
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| 01:43.08 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Current_events]] |
| 01:46.08 | xL0giC | i wouldn't mind just having gta02 hardware by october. i imagine for a device like this, the software will never be "ready" right? |
| 01:46.19 | xL0giC | it'll always be improved and modified. |
| 01:52.49 | cesarb | xL0giC: we can have a definition of "ready" which means it will sometime |
| 01:53.08 | cesarb | xL0giC: just make a list of needed features (dialing, sms, etc), and as soon as they work correctly, it's ready |
| 01:53.35 | cesarb | xL0giC: ready as in "a non-programmer can pick it up and use it fine" |
| 01:53.45 | xL0giC | i see.. |
| 01:54.00 | xL0giC | and what about releasing the hardware with the unfinished software? is that a possibility? |
| 01:54.29 | rwhitby | well it's happening for GTA01 ... |
| 01:54.51 | cesarb | xL0giC: bad idea, due to the negative publicity it would generate (unlike the "hackers-only you know what you doing right? say YES_I_DO" GTA01 release) |
| 01:55.46 | ajmitch | although there are undoubtably people ordering now who just want their hands on a nice shiny phone, even though they're not hackers |
| 01:57.37 | xL0giC | so what exactly does openmoko need to get gta02 w/software released in october? a miracle? more developers? |
| 01:57.49 | SpeedEvil | More active developers. |
| 01:57.50 | juri_ | both? :) |
| 01:57.58 | SpeedEvil | Maybe even funding of some of them. |
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| 01:58.30 | rwhitby | of course all this assumes the october date won't slip, which is a pretty poor assumption given history ... |
| 01:59.04 | cesarb | rwhitby: hm, good to see you. I have one more bashism patch, and a general "better error checking" patch for mokomakefile |
| 01:59.24 | rwhitby | cesarb: pastebin please |
| 02:00.51 | ajmitch | do patches need to get discussed on the mailing list, or is leaving them on bugzilla generally enough? |
| 02:01.26 | cesarb | rwhitby: http://www.pastebin.ca/630284 is the bashism one |
| 02:03.05 | *** join/#openmoko daMaestro (n=jon@fedora/damaestro) |
| 02:03.08 | cesarb | rwhitby: http://www.pastebin.ca/630288 is the mokomakefile one, which changes a lot of ; to && so that for instance a missing directory will not run things like "quilt pop" in the wrong directory |
| 02:03.33 | cesarb | rwhitby: the bashism one goes into patches/openembedded-<hugenumber> as usual |
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| 02:05.11 | cesarb | rwhitby: I made these while playing with EABI, see [[User:CesarB/Compiling for EABI]] if you are interested in that |
| 02:05.35 | ferric | mooo. |
| 02:05.50 | ferric | rwhitby: thanks for makemokofile - you rock. |
| 02:06.11 | CIA-24 | openmoko: 03rwhitby * r101 10mokomakefile/trunk/patches/openembedded-e2dbb52fe39df7ef786b6068f6178f29508dfded/ (fix-bashism-kernel-headers.patch series): Fix bashism in kernel headers |
| 02:06.16 | ferric | or mokomakefile, really. |
| 02:06.30 | CIA-24 | openmoko: 03rwhitby * r102 10mokomakefile/trunk/Makefile: Robustness fixes - thx to cesarb |
| 02:06.35 | rwhitby | cesarb: thx, done. |
| 02:06.41 | rwhitby | ferric: thx |
| 02:08.14 | ferric | sure |
| 02:14.13 | sublime | jesus christ |
| 02:14.23 | sublime | ok this has nothing to do with moko or fic or anything |
| 02:14.33 | sublime | you guys are the closest vent i have right now |
| 02:14.58 | sublime | but i jsut spent the last hour doing the wrong god damn diff eq problem for homework |
| 02:15.00 | sublime | i hate life |
| 02:15.13 | sublime | i need a smoke |
| 02:15.21 | SpeedEvil | Was it a similar dif eq to the one you were supposed to do? |
| 02:15.40 | *** join/#openmoko empty_mind_ (n=orion@59.176.111.177) |
| 02:15.42 | sublime | about the same |
| 02:15.59 | SpeedEvil | Could always try submitting it - noting your error. |
| 02:16.00 | cibomahto | sublime: you at UofA? |
| 02:16.08 | sublime | yeah |
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| 02:16.48 | sublime | my prof already hates me |
| 02:16.56 | sublime | hes looking for every excuse possible to fail me |
| 02:17.08 | sublime | afk |
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| 02:17.34 | mrcucumber | Anyone know if works has been done on power consumption for the open moko project? |
| 02:17.48 | mrcucumber | would approaches like intel's powertop make sense in this context? |
| 02:17.51 | SpeedEvil | No. |
| 02:17.54 | SpeedEvil | Sort-of. |
| 02:18.05 | SpeedEvil | But the hardware drivers are not there. |
| 02:18.19 | SpeedEvil | And you need hardware to work on those. |
| 02:18.19 | cesarb | SpeedEvil: powertop would be useful... to find excess bogus wakeups at least |
| 02:18.27 | SpeedEvil | True. |
| 02:18.49 | SpeedEvil | Even just slowing down the CPU will help lots. |
| 02:19.19 | SpeedEvil | But that's not implemented yet |
| 02:19.27 | mrcucumber | it's just a regular linux kernel so I should be able to compile it to include the timmers needed to catch bogus wakeups |
| 02:19.38 | cjb_ie | cesarb: i hope that burst didn't use a lot of power... |
| 02:19.39 | mrcucumber | or would my effort be better spent elsewhere? |
| 02:19.55 | cesarb | Would it be useful for the programs to be able to signal their "intent" (as in, "I'm finished for now" or "I'm gonna need the CPU")? |
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| 02:20.16 | cesarb | So that, for instance, we could power down the CPU without having to wait a little bit on higher power mode "just in case"? |
| 02:20.18 | SpeedEvil | Not especially. |
| 02:20.33 | SpeedEvil | AIUI - speedup or slowdown should be really quite fast. |
| 02:20.54 | SpeedEvil | The hard part is deciding about deeper powersaving modes. |
| 02:21.04 | cjb_ie | should just be a matter of switching clocks, which should be doable within one or two slow clock cycles |
| 02:21.21 | SpeedEvil | AIUI - not quite. |
| 02:21.26 | SpeedEvil | The PLL isn't nearly that fast. |
| 02:21.33 | SpeedEvil | Few hundred clocks, but still... |
| 02:21.44 | cjb_ie | ah, of course, one doesn't want to generate the fast clock when one isn't using it. |
| 02:22.05 | SpeedEvil | If you want the screen, I think you have to be on fast clock. |
| 02:22.23 | SpeedEvil | It's about a half CPU, and a half backlight. |
| 02:22.24 | cjb_ie | SpeedEvil: why does that make me think of the ZX81? |
| 02:22.29 | SpeedEvil | Speaking very roughly. |
| 02:22.32 | SpeedEvil | :) |
| 02:22.46 | cjb_ie | though of course the ZX81 was the opposite |
| 02:22.56 | SpeedEvil | Turning off the screen will make memory bound tasks faster. |
| 02:23.04 | devilCMKRNL | ummm, my first love... |
| 02:23.05 | SpeedEvil | As it frees memory bus bandwidth. |
| 02:23.08 | cjb_ie | you set it to fast mode for serious numbercrunching, and screen refresh didn't get serviced |
| 02:23.20 | SpeedEvil | For low values of serious :) |
| 02:23.43 | cjb_ie | when you really needed every clock cycle you could get out of that 3.5MHz Z80 |
| 02:24.57 | cjb_ie | let's be kind... for 1981 values of serious :p |
| 02:26.01 | cjb_ie | the moko will probably run faster in powersaving mode |
| 02:26.20 | SpeedEvil | Well - cycle per instruction, 12Mhz, 32 bit. |
| 02:26.23 | SpeedEvil | Not even close. |
| 02:26.48 | BlackBsd | it would be nice if firefox-lite becomes.. |
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| 02:27.06 | cjb_ie | wow, the Z80 took a minimum of four clocks per instruction, and that was for a NOP |
| 02:27.06 | SpeedEvil | Lite. |
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| 02:27.18 | SpeedEvil | 12 IIRC for a typical one. |
| 02:27.27 | SpeedEvil | Involving a memory read |
| 02:27.59 | BlackBsd | yes lite, they are asking the team to create a stripped down version of ff |
| 02:28.26 | BlackBsd | http://slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=07/07/22/0711249&from=rss |
| 02:28.33 | SpeedEvil | FF doesn't need stripped down. |
| 02:28.49 | SpeedEvil | It needs some decent allocation monitoring tools so the leaks can be found. |
| 02:29.00 | SpeedEvil | And so that devs can get an idea where the memory is leaking. |
| 02:29.12 | BlackBsd | well it might run faster and on less hardware if it didnt have fav's, tabs, addons |
| 02:29.17 | SpeedEvil | Currently, you write an extension, and you have no idea where it's leaking. |
| 02:29.17 | cesarb | SpeedEvil: the leaks aren't the worse... the bad ones have already been fixed... |
| 02:29.25 | cesarb | SpeedEvil: the problem is the memory caching |
| 02:29.31 | SpeedEvil | I mean leaks in all senses. |
| 02:29.42 | cesarb | SpeedEvil: as in, it caches all the images. uncompressed. in memory. twice (once on X and once on FF) |
| 02:29.49 | BlackBsd | are you guys talking about the software for the phone? |
| 02:29.52 | SpeedEvil | Actually - no. |
| 02:30.05 | SpeedEvil | It stores them only in the server AIUI. |
| 02:30.12 | cesarb | SpeedEvil: not to mention the page structure, bfcache, and lots of other memory-hogging "optimizations" |
| 02:30.57 | SpeedEvil | The fundamental problem is that if I add code there is no easy way of telling how much memory I'm making it use :( |
| 02:31.06 | SpeedEvil | Or how much extra CPU |
| 02:31.13 | SpeedEvil | This does not lead to tight code. |
| 02:31.43 | unknown_lamer | SpeedEvil: there are a few impossible to fix leaks in gecko |
| 02:31.47 | SpeedEvil | Especially if to understand what it might be doing 'under the hood' when writing an extension might take years of study. |
| 02:31.55 | unknown_lamer | thanks to refcounting and gc interacting poorly |
| 02:32.05 | BlackBsd | can i build some of the sys with only 6.2gb free?? |
| 02:32.13 | BlackBsd | at least some apps |
| 02:32.26 | unknown_lamer | it is also *really* easy to accidentally set up a cyclic reference between an xpcom object and some js so that neither is ever gced |
| 02:32.33 | mrcucumber | is the card slot a Mirco SDHC ? |
| 02:32.40 | SpeedEvil | yes, cucumber. |
| 02:32.55 | mrcucumber | What's the largest card you can actually buy these days? |
| 02:33.00 | SpeedEvil | unknown_lamer: however. I'm using FF ATM on 128M and it's working OK for me. |
| 02:33.09 | SpeedEvil | mrcucumber: 4G - but only 2G has been tested |
| 02:33.10 | mrcucumber | I heard that an 8gig was announced but what is actually for sale? |
| 02:33.11 | unknown_lamer | SpeedEvil: yeah, but I doubt you're doing much else |
| 02:33.15 | SpeedEvil | 8G is sampling |
| 02:33.16 | BlackBsd | so ff works on moko? |
| 02:33.25 | SpeedEvil | unknown_lamer: 12 shells, ... |
| 02:33.32 | unknown_lamer | SpeedEvil: running conkerorxr on raw xulrunner gets me down to 40M vs 65M as a startup heap size ... |
| 02:33.44 | SpeedEvil | BlackBsd: yes - however it's _not_ going to be the optimal solution. |
| 02:33.54 | unknown_lamer | I'd like to have memory to run lots of apps instead of having to quit everything for the browser |
| 02:34.00 | BlackBsd | but a lite might work?? |
| 02:34.10 | BlackBsd | just looking into the future |
| 02:34.16 | SpeedEvil | 2752 ff 15 0 174m 56m 9732 S 5.5 45.8 433:17.94 firefox-bin |
| 02:34.20 | SpeedEvil | Maybe. |
| 02:34.27 | unknown_lamer | khtml is nice |
| 02:34.41 | BlackBsd | you mean webkit |
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| 02:35.25 | SpeedEvil | Netscape 3 or 4? |
| 02:35.54 | unknown_lamer | non-free |
| 02:36.10 | unknown_lamer | and eww motif :-) |
| 02:36.32 | SpeedEvil | I don't know there was a free graphical browser back then. |
| 02:36.56 | unknown_lamer | I switched over in 99 |
| 02:36.59 | BlackBsd | mozilla |
| 02:37.01 | unknown_lamer | so there was early moz |
| 02:37.02 | BlackBsd | sea-monkey |
| 02:37.06 | unknown_lamer | M11ish? |
| 02:37.16 | SpeedEvil | IIRC mozilla was horrible compared to NS |
| 02:37.28 | SpeedEvil | It's been a while though. |
| 02:37.33 | BlackBsd | yes but it was supposed to be used as a reference platform |
| 02:37.39 | SpeedEvil | This was a 486/75 lappy. |
| 02:37.51 | BlackBsd | ns was made to be for end user use |
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| 03:43.08 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[MokoMakefile]] |
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| 04:30.38 | blindcoder | moin |
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| 04:42.09 | Sublime | jesus does themokomakefile ever end or is it some kind of sick loop joke that the openmoko team is playing |
| 04:43.06 | blindcoder | what, you're not at the stage where it prints a huge smiley with its tongue out and playing a Nelsonesque "HA-HA" over your pc speaker/ |
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| 04:43.32 | dennisharrison | holy crap this channel is getting popular |
| 04:43.36 | dennisharrison | hello everyone! |
| 04:44.12 | cibomahto | 'allo |
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| 05:01.56 | summatusmentis | still not shipped? :-/ |
| 05:02.19 | Sublime | they ship from california |
| 05:02.28 | Sublime | its 9pm in cali on a sunday |
| 05:02.33 | Sublime | no, they havent shipped |
| 05:02.50 | summatusmentis | Sublime: lol, that's true. I didn't purchase one, but I was hoping there'd be more info on them once they'd shipped |
| 05:03.58 | grobian | can anyone telll me something about the boottime of neo1973 !? |
| 05:03.59 | Sublime | lol, we all hope that but its jsut speculation now as to when they actually will ship and i guarantee once people start getting them there will be a TON more info outthere |
| 05:04.03 | grobian | P0 |
| 05:04.31 | *** join/#openmoko linux_galore (n=Richard@dsl-220-253-69-10.NSW.netspace.net.au) |
| 05:04.50 | grobian | how long does it take to boot? |
| 05:04.59 | linux_galore | Dont feed the squirrels beer http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ikH9ZRcF2Q |
| 05:05.09 | Sublime | false |
| 05:05.19 | Sublime | feed squirrels as much beer as possible |
| 05:05.30 | Sublime | dont know how long it takes to boot |
| 05:05.59 | summatusmentis | ideally it won't take much longer than a 'normal' phone |
| 05:09.04 | BlackBsd | so does any dev use eclipse when working with openmoko? |
| 05:09.09 | *** join/#openmoko ScaredyCat (n=andy@81-187-78-211.multithread.co.uk) |
| 05:09.09 | Sublime | the guy with it running on his treo said it took about 1:30 to start |
| 05:09.46 | summatusmentis | does Jason1 have his yet? |
| 05:10.49 | grobian | Sublime: thats what i guessed ! |
| 05:11.31 | grobian | What cpu has treo ? |
| 05:12.30 | Sublime | 312mhz intel xscale |
| 05:13.31 | grobian | ok |
| 05:15.21 | grobian | well its not that critical. |
| 05:16.03 | grobian | normaly you dont shut off youre mobile phone. |
| 05:16.18 | summatusmentis | good point |
| 05:16.31 | Sublime | i never shut mine off |
| 05:16.35 | summatusmentis | but it'll be quite a bit more than a mobile phone by the time people are done with it, ideally |
| 05:16.38 | Sublime | cant remember the last time |
| 05:16.56 | linux_galore | yeah, Im not fussed about the boot time, the general battery life is more important to me |
| 05:17.12 | Sublime | that is the important thing really |
| 05:17.13 | grobian | just call it mobil kommunikator |
| 05:17.20 | grobian | moko |
| 05:17.23 | Sublime | as long isboot time isnt like 30min i dont really care |
| 05:17.45 | ScaredyCat | *blink* |
| 05:18.03 | grobian | 30 min ^^ |
| 05:18.06 | linux_galore | you could easily decrease the boot time but then you would lose some of the flexibility |
| 05:18.22 | Sublime | i was exagerating, relax kids |
| 05:18.43 | ScaredyCat | what about suspend2 + keep mode |
| 05:19.08 | linux_galore | suspend will have to be implemented |
| 05:19.55 | linux_galore | pretty easy to do though, just have the init script look for an image, if none start from scratch |
| 05:20.11 | ScaredyCat | yeah, but with keep mode you're bascially booting as if you'd done a suspends to disk .. each time you boot |
| 05:20.44 | ScaredyCat | then the longest boot is when you build a mew image to upgrade the device... |
| 05:21.00 | ScaredyCat | 9the same image) |
| 05:21.15 | ScaredyCat | need to have data on a separate partition... |
| 05:32.38 | aevin | I have to "reboot" my phone whenever my battery gets flat (unintentionally) e.g. while calling, which I guess could happen quite often. |
| 05:35.11 | grobian | So you use a second battery (akku) to change? |
| 05:37.25 | *** join/#openmoko _law_ (n=law@mail.stiftadmont.at) |
| 05:40.54 | *** join/#openmoko wooKieface (n=benjamin@x1-6-00-03-2f-29-99-b9.k958.webspeed.dk) |
| 05:40.54 | *** join/#openmoko SunZhiyong (n=sunzy@218.242.154.170) |
| 05:45.35 | grobian | How much is the SAR Value of Neo1973 ? |
| 05:46.14 | *** join/#openmoko cyphi (n=aasss@28.100.141.lpoy.fi) |
| 05:51.35 | *** join/#openmoko meandtheshell (n=markus@85.127.102.246) |
| 05:52.01 | ScaredyCat | http://www.ericsson.com/ericsson/corporate_responsibility/health/files/English/EN_Why_not_compare_sar_values_2004.pdf |
| 05:53.03 | grobian | :-) |
| 05:59.15 | *** join/#openmoko eMb (i=emb@loliserv.org) |
| 06:01.43 | *** join/#openmoko DynWind (n=vikas@zresearch.com) |
| 06:01.46 | grobian | hmmm, This is from Sony ericsson. |
| 06:02.02 | *** join/#openmoko erik_ (n=erik@gw.sbg.se) |
| 06:03.10 | eMb | Wow, lots of people in here. How many plan to develop for the openmoko platform? |
| 06:03.11 | aloril | eMb: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) (Hopefully this link answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) |
| 06:04.05 | aloril | hmm.. quite many I suspect |
| 06:04.07 | Sublime | mokomakefile has been running for almost 3 hours now |
| 06:04.16 | Sublime | christ when will it end |
| 06:05.00 | gcb77 | It builds for me in 5-6 hours on core2 duo |
| 06:05.17 | ckuethe | it will fail with some inscrutable error about 3 minutes before UPS shows up with your handset. |
| 06:05.21 | Sublime | lol, guess i didnt know what i was getting myself into |
| 06:05.39 | *** join/#openmoko empty_mind_ (n=orion@59.176.111.177) |
| 06:05.40 | Sublime | well 5-6 hours is hardly the 2 years im predicting |
| 06:06.55 | gcb77 | I have a VMWare image set up with the MokoMakefile if you're interested |
| 06:09.38 | *** join/#openmoko cel_ (n=cel@86.59.65.236) |
| 06:10.04 | Sublime | nah its cool, its going on my laptop so i can let it sit and run as long as it needs |
| 06:10.19 | *** join/#openmoko _law_ (n=law@mail.stiftadmont.at) |
| 06:10.23 | gcb77 | what distro are you running? |
| 06:10.29 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@qiqinebs.chi.il.us) |
| 06:10.45 | Sublime | ubuntu fiesty |
| 06:11.29 | *** join/#openmoko freskog_work (n=fredriks@hst3.eget.fi) |
| 06:14.10 | gcb77 | good, that won't be as painful as some of the others |
| 06:14.56 | Sublime | ubutnu is the absolute shit |
| 06:15.26 | Sublime | first distro i ever used and havent found one i like more or even as much |
| 06:15.28 | ScaredyCat | s/the// |
| 06:16.40 | *** join/#openmoko fresko1 (n=fredrik@213-204-48-247.bredband.aland.net) |
| 06:17.19 | grobian | I like debian |
| 06:18.14 | Sublime | debian was built by alumni from my university, i have to like it or one of my ECE profs will kill me cause he helped get it out there lol |
| 06:18.40 | grobian | XD |
| 06:18.48 | Sublime | no but seriously its a great distro too |
| 06:19.38 | *** join/#openmoko agoode (n=agoode@2001:4830:1633:0:212:3fff:fe70:6222) |
| 06:19.46 | Sublime | actually its really weird because my university hosts a debian repo server but all the computers in the CS department use fedora |
| 06:20.02 | Sublime | freekin traitors |
| 06:20.05 | grobian | lol |
| 06:20.45 | ScaredyCat | s/of/off/ |
| 06:21.23 | cjb_ie | redhat was fine on my laptop but fedora was crashtacular |
| 06:21.30 | cjb_ie | so i moved to libranet and then to ubuntu |
| 06:21.41 | cjb_ie | still using ubuntu on it now |
| 06:21.51 | cjb_ie | legacy hardware ++ |
| 06:22.01 | ScaredyCat | ubuntu is fine... |
| 06:22.04 | ScaredyCat | ...if you like brown |
| 06:22.14 | *** join/#openmoko rob_w|laptop (n=rob_w@p549BB2A9.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 06:22.20 | cjb_ie | oh, i use fluxbox. legacy hardware, remember |
| 06:22.20 | Sublime | actually im using linux mint |
| 06:22.28 | Sublime | which is basically a prettier ubuntu |
| 06:22.36 | Sublime | ill see if i can get a screenshot |
| 06:22.42 | ScaredyCat | you mean it's not brown |
| 06:22.45 | Sublime | no |
| 06:22.46 | cjb_ie | so it's all shades of grey for me |
| 06:22.49 | Sublime | its very nice |
| 06:23.14 | Sublime | nope it doesnt |
| 06:23.30 | *** join/#openmoko geaaru (n=geaaru@81-208-74-190.ip.fastwebnet.it) |
| 06:23.32 | *** join/#openmoko buz (n=buz@84-73-66-71.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 06:23.38 | cjb_ie | lucky raspberries! |
| 06:23.50 | ScaredyCat | arf arf |
| 06:24.50 | Sublime | http://members.cox.net/sccr182/Screenshot.jpg |
| 06:24.53 | *** join/#openmoko empty_mind_ (n=orion@59.176.111.177) |
| 06:25.10 | *** join/#openmoko Any_Key (n=Any_Key@rt94.highlink.ru) |
| 06:25.17 | ScaredyCat | you're right..... |
| 06:25.22 | ScaredyCat | ... it's not brown... |
| 06:26.06 | Sublime | no its completely different from ubuntu yet exactly the same as ubuntu all at the same time |
| 06:26.37 | linux_galore | Im on Kubuntu Gutsy |
| 06:26.44 | ScaredyCat | you mean it's brown underneath |
| 06:26.47 | CM|Vacation | Sublime: Looks nice :) |
| 06:27.01 | *** join/#openmoko __law__ (n=law@mx2.stiftadmont.at) |
| 06:27.40 | ScaredyCat | CM|Vacation: they took my money, finally ;) |
| 06:27.42 | Sublime | it uses all the same repos as ubuntu, its just sugar coated |
| 06:28.05 | *** join/#openmoko __law__ (n=law@mx2.stiftadmont.at) |
| 06:28.09 | CM|Vacation | ScaredyCat: Hehe.. Don't be so happy for that! Let's hope they send the phones soon too.. |
| 06:28.30 | linux_galore | Gutsy is definitely allot easier to use than all the other releases, more meta packages too so you dont have to stuff around with lots of odds and ends |
| 06:28.50 | ScaredyCat | I suspect, but don't *know*, that they were packing at the weekend and will ship today (their time) |
| 06:28.56 | Sublime | i dont really see how it can be any easier to setup and use than fiesty |
| 06:29.00 | *** join/#openmoko __law__ (n=law@mail.stiftadmont.at) |
| 06:29.13 | Sublime | need ati or nvidia drivers? click install, thats it |
| 06:29.26 | linux_galore | Sublime: 1 package that install java/Flash/Video Codecs |
| 06:29.32 | linux_galore | installs* |
| 06:29.45 | Sublime | i thought thats what automatix was for |
| 06:29.49 | Sublime | thats what i use |
| 06:30.08 | ScaredyCat | smart install somestuff |
| 06:30.13 | linux_galore | Sublime: automatix is actually not an ubuntu thing its third party so can stuff up your install |
| 06:30.30 | Sublime | i know its third party but ive never had any problems with it |
| 06:31.15 | linux_galore | Sublime: KDE has a similar thing thats nicer called Kubxtra |
| 06:31.18 | Sublime | oh well, if ubuntu's works ill use that instead |
| 06:31.27 | Sublime | one less package i have to download |
| 06:31.34 | *** part/#openmoko DynWind (n=vikas@zresearch.com) |
| 06:32.12 | Sublime | ive been using kde in slax and knoppix, dont like it as much as gnome |
| 06:32.12 | linux_galore | gives you a graphical interface to install jave/Nvidia/Flash etc |
| 06:32.13 | *** join/#openmoko snatches (n=slapnik@rrcs-70-62-108-130.midsouth.biz.rr.com) |
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| 06:32.43 | snatches | I can't be the only one awake in here |
| 06:33.00 | Sublime | no |
| 06:33.03 | linux_galore | Sublime: each to his own, to be honest I prefer xfce over gnome |
| 06:33.13 | Sublime | ive never used it |
| 06:33.43 | Sublime | anybody ever use sabayon? the beryl distro |
| 06:33.50 | linux_galore | Sublime: apt-get install xubuntu-desktop its a prety small install, watch as your machine boots 10 seconds faster |
| 06:33.59 | ScaredyCat | yeah ... too orange... |
| 06:34.04 | ScaredyCat | :) |
| 06:34.11 | Sublime | i never got to the orange part |
| 06:34.28 | Sublime | when it booted it looked like every other kde desktop |
| 06:34.50 | Sublime | i got none of the sabayon icons or anything |
| 06:34.55 | ScaredyCat | but.. it's orange from the start... |
| 06:34.57 | linux_galore | run xfce (xubuntu) on a Intel Core 2 duo, boots in 5 seconds with scsi raid 5 |
| 06:35.02 | ScaredyCat | how could you miss the orange |
| 06:35.11 | Sublime | ill tell you the story |
| 06:35.15 | Sublime | hold on its long |
| 06:35.47 | ScaredyCat | linux_galore: unless it's a dell machine, then the scsi raid contrller takes a month to get started |
| 06:35.57 | linux_galore | ScaredyCat: lol |
| 06:36.10 | ScaredyCat | whooaaa!!! |
| 06:36.20 | ScaredyCat | I've just been monter-spammed! |
| 06:36.31 | linux_galore | I find it amusing that gnome is becoming like xfce and xfce is becoming more like gnome |
| 06:36.32 | ScaredyCat | monster-spammed! |
| 06:37.18 | cjb_ie | what does monster-spamming entail? |
| 06:37.20 | linux_galore | although some of the new themes for xfce are bloody awesome |
| 06:37.26 | ScaredyCat | getting a shitload of spam |
| 06:37.47 | cjb_ie | oh, i thought it'd be more entertaining than that :( |
| 06:37.53 | ScaredyCat | I checked my email, 2 messages... checked it 5 mins later and whoosh |
| 06:38.11 | ScaredyCat | 600 so far |
| 06:38.40 | ScaredyCat | as soon as I get my shipping email I'm greylisting |
| 06:39.21 | Sublime | aside from the missing all the sabayon goodies, i realized something was wrong when it destroyed grub, completely, couldnt get into ubuntu or windows. eventually got into ubuntu screwing with grub command line, got into ubuntu and for some reason the desktop had changed to kde and there were all the sabayon icons and wallpapers. so it decided it didnt like my ubuntu install so it installed on top of it screwing with the permissions, des |
| 06:39.27 | Sublime | christ thats long |
| 06:39.34 | cjb_ie | ScaredyCat: you could ask people who've already got their where it came from, and whitelist that. |
| 06:39.42 | *** join/#openmoko FourDollars (n=FourDoll@59-104-128-171.adsl.dynamic.seed.net.tw) |
| 06:39.47 | *** join/#openmoko ninHer (n=ninHer@179.Red-88-9-91.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net) |
| 06:40.02 | cjb_ie | Sublime: truncated at "screwing with the permissions, des" |
| 06:40.12 | Sublime | crap |
| 06:40.19 | *** join/#openmoko VladoK (n=vlado@adsl-dyn38.91-127-103.t-com.sk) |
| 06:40.25 | Sublime | <PROTECTED> |
| 06:40.36 | ninHer | hi all |
| 06:41.03 | ScaredyCat | ... yeah but who is des? |
| 06:41.04 | ScaredyCat | ;) |
| 06:41.33 | Sublime | alright well im going to go grab a coffee and pie |
| 06:41.43 | Sublime | later |
| 06:41.45 | *** part/#openmoko Sublime (n=Sublime@ip70-162-246-65.ph.ph.cox.net) |
| 06:43.25 | jeddy3 | has anyone gotten shipment tracking numbers yet? |
| 06:43.49 | CM|Vacation | jeddy3: Not me at least |
| 06:44.07 | jeddy3 | CM|Vacation, oh, strange |
| 06:44.25 | *** join/#openmoko bluelightning (n=blueligh@219-89-45-99.dialup.xtra.co.nz) |
| 06:44.57 | CM|Vacation | I'm guessing that they take a while packageing as many neos and they can, then get a big pickup from UPS |
| 06:44.59 | aevin | i guess a monday should be great day to do some shipping. |
| 06:45.13 | jeddy3 | aevin, hopefully :) |
| 06:45.53 | jeddy3 | CM|Vacation, yeah thats possible |
| 06:46.41 | *** join/#openmoko empty_mind_ (n=orion@59.176.111.177) |
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| 06:47.50 | linux_galore | time they get this lot shipped out the GTA02 will arrive heh |
| 06:48.22 | *** join/#openmoko sixfeet (i=sixfeet@p5484D10E.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 06:48.37 | *** part/#openmoko linux_galore (n=Richard@dsl-220-253-69-10.NSW.netspace.net.au) |
| 06:49.14 | jeddy3 | :) |
| 06:50.06 | ynezz | i don't think that they'll ship gta02 sooner then in Q1-Q2/2008 |
| 06:50.15 | *** part/#openmoko VladoK (n=vlado@adsl-dyn38.91-127-103.t-com.sk) |
| 06:50.24 | CM|Vacation | I'm not complaining any more about delays.. Won't be back home until august 6th |
| 06:50.38 | *** join/#openmoko phrozen77 (n=phrozen7@unaffiliated/phrozen77) |
| 06:50.39 | ynezz | so, have fun! |
| 06:51.23 | ynezz | xkr47: btw, have you been charged? |
| 06:51.31 | sandos | ynezz: thats too bad... I want one of those |
| 06:51.44 | jeddy3 | CM|Vacation, I'm in same situtiation as you a week ago :P |
| 06:51.50 | *** join/#openmoko evanpro (n=evan@pdpc/supporter/silver/evanpro) |
| 06:51.55 | xkr47 | ynezz, haven't checked, I can't do it per internet.. |
| 06:52.01 | jeddy3 | CM|Vacation, leaving at end of week |
| 06:52.06 | *** join/#openmoko dkirker (n=dkirker@c-24-6-210-139.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 06:52.28 | *** join/#openmoko zecke (n=ich@88.134.98.145) |
| 06:53.03 | ynezz | xkr47: ah ok, you're part of another group order so that's why I ask. it seems, that they've blackholed our group orders :p |
| 06:53.07 | *** part/#openmoko holtmann (n=holtmann@nikita.holtmann.net) |
| 06:53.21 | xkr47 | blackholded |
| 06:53.22 | xkr47 | ? |
| 06:53.38 | ynezz | black hole, something like /dev/null |
| 06:53.58 | xkr47 | doh |
| 06:54.05 | ynezz | i don't know if "blackholed" is correct in english :p |
| 06:54.16 | *** part/#openmoko mdt (n=mdt@littlelun.emdete.de) |
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| 06:58.59 | CM|Vacation | rtfm: http://xkcd.com/c293.html |
| 06:59.00 | *** join/#openmoko codeshepherd (n=codeshep@61.8.208.15) |
| 06:59.55 | codeshepherd | anyone from Singapore ? or Malasiya ? I want to buy Neo.. |
| 07:00.16 | codeshepherd | 115$ for delivery to Singapore is quite costly : |
| 07:01.35 | CM|Vacation | codeshepherd: Is it still that high? |
| 07:01.53 | codeshepherd | yes, CM|Vacation |
| 07:01.59 | CM|Vacation | I ordered one to Sweden, and it said 81 USD in the store, but they only took 30 when shipping it |
| 07:02.49 | codeshepherd | would be great if I can buy it locally |
| 07:03.10 | *** join/#openmoko jpozlovsky (n=jindra@rb5cc115.net.upc.cz) |
| 07:04.04 | CM|Vacation | codeshepherd: Won't happen with phase 1, but at the real release of the phone there's a chance |
| 07:04.07 | *** join/#openmoko rob_w|lappi (n=rob_w@p549BB2A9.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 07:04.55 | codeshepherd | CM|Vacation: when is the real release expected to happen ? what do I loose by buying the phase 1 instrument ? |
| 07:05.08 | CM|Vacation | faq? |
| 07:05.08 | aloril | See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) |
| 07:05.26 | CM|Vacation | codeshepherd: There's some good answers there in the FAQ |
| 07:05.51 | CM|Vacation | But basically, P2 is said to be released in October but we guess it will be a bit later |
| 07:06.29 | CM|Vacation | It will have wifi, faster processor, 3d graphics accelerator, more flash and two accelerometers |
| 07:07.11 | codeshepherd | thanks am reading it CM|Vacation aloril |
| 07:08.34 | CM|Vacation | codeshepherd: There's good instructions how to get qemu or Xoo running if you want to develop for OpenMoko in the wiki too |
| 07:08.51 | *** part/#openmoko snatches (n=slapnik@rrcs-70-62-108-130.midsouth.biz.rr.com) |
| 07:09.30 | buz | codeshepherd: if you dont need/want neo right now i'd wait |
| 07:09.35 | buz | it's what i do ;9 |
| 07:10.02 | codeshepherd | fine.. I will wait.. am not planning for serious development |
| 07:10.35 | codeshepherd | what does GTA mean ? |
| 07:12.39 | *** join/#openmoko orion__ (n=orion@59.176.111.177) |
| 07:13.33 | CM|Vacation | codeshepherd: I just know that 01 is the Phase1 and GTA02 is the version to be released in P2 |
| 07:13.59 | *** join/#openmoko danilos (n=danilo@163.pool85-48-166.static.orange.es) |
| 07:15.15 | codeshepherd | The wiki does not say the release date for P2 .. any ideas ? |
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| 07:17.04 | sixfeet | moin |
| 07:17.41 | guerby | counter |
| 07:17.41 | aloril | (last update 2007-07-21 06:20) http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter : Order https://direct.openmoko.com/ ; Shipping prob. 75% in 2 days 16:42:18 (2.696±2.5 days) (1770;249) |
| 07:18.01 | *** join/#openmoko dneary (n=dneary@mne69-9-88-163-116-163.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 07:18.14 | gcb77 | any way to tell the menu to reload after installin a new package? (in the emulator) |
| 07:18.16 | CM|Vacation | codeshepherd: As I said before, October is the officalyl mentioned date, but I'm guessing it will be later |
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| 07:43.28 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[P1_Owners]] |
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| 07:50.28 | *** join/#openmoko Sublime (n=Sublime@ip70-162-246-65.ph.ph.cox.net) |
| 07:51.31 | daxxar | CM|Vacation: Cheat! I ordered one to Norway, and it said 100 USD in the store, but they charge ~75. :-( |
| 07:51.43 | daxxar | CM|Vacation: I wonder why Sweden << Norway |
| 07:53.33 | ScaredyCat | cos you shoot seals |
| 07:53.36 | jeddy3 | sweden < sweden also :P, mine was $57 to sweden |
| 07:53.47 | guaqua | : |
| 07:55.45 | CM|Vacation | daxxar: Because Sweden is >> Norway! :P |
| 07:56.01 | CM|Vacation | Naa, weird.. but maybe it's an EU thing? |
| 07:56.24 | CM|Vacation | daxxar: Norway is expensive with almost everything |
| 07:57.12 | daxxar | Perhaps. |
| 07:57.15 | *** join/#openmoko herbyle (n=pascal@p54A367BD.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 07:57.20 | daxxar | ScaredyCat: Huhu |
| 07:57.25 | blindcoder | daxxar: did they charge 100 usd and 75 local currency? |
| 07:57.26 | daxxar | I ordered the basic too. :-) |
| 07:57.57 | daxxar | blindcoder: No, they said the shipping cost was $100 in the order-view, and when I got the "you've been charged"-mail they said they charged $75 instead. |
| 07:58.11 | daxxar | (Since they had gotten a better deal on shipping since I ordered) |
| 07:58.32 | blindcoder | daxxar: well, nothing to complain about I guess :) |
| 07:59.02 | daxxar | blindcoder: Nah, not complaining, just curious why sweden is so much cheaper than norway, when they're right next to eachother ;-) |
| 07:59.03 | ScaredyCat | you evil seal shooter |
| 07:59.04 | daxxar | Bloody EU. :p |
| 07:59.06 | ScaredyCat | :P |
| 08:00.48 | *** part/#openmoko mil_ (n=talusha@jabber.hst.ru) |
| 08:04.17 | Fatal | meh, have you guys been starting to recieve your orders? :) |
| 08:04.45 | *** join/#openmoko guillaum1 (n=gzba4143@AMontsouris-153-1-85-246.w90-2.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 08:05.20 | Sublime | mental note to self: do not attempt diff eq while inebriated. Incorrect answers will appear out of no where. |
| 08:06.59 | ewanm89_laptop | Sublime: With diffrential eq. don't incorrect answers appear anyway? |
| 08:08.10 | Sublime | yewah but now im getting answers like: fuck i hate this, yellow and coffee |
| 08:08.47 | ScaredyCat | :( |
| 08:08.50 | ScaredyCat | he's lost |
| 08:08.51 | *** join/#openmoko vosen (n=v0@86-63-84-163.asta-net.com.pl) |
| 08:11.21 | goxboxlive | daxxar: i just order one now, and the order view said $66 for express and $56 for regular. |
| 08:11.33 | daxxar | To norway? |
| 08:11.36 | goxboxlive | yes |
| 08:11.40 | daxxar | Cheating! |
| 08:11.44 | daxxar | Where in Norway, though? |
| 08:11.46 | goxboxlive | oslo |
| 08:11.55 | daxxar | Hmkay, mine was to Trondheim |
| 08:11.59 | goxboxlive | i c |
| 08:12.00 | daxxar | 'tis a bit further. |
| 08:12.01 | CIA-24 | openmoko: 03stefan * r2383 10/trunk/oe/conf/distro/include/sane-srcdates.inc: * Catch up with some recent bug fixes and icon changes in matchbox-panel-2 |
| 08:12.26 | goxboxlive | yes, one more plain trip :-) |
| 08:13.42 | *** join/#openmoko khester_ (n=khester@c-24-4-236-98.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 08:14.00 | Fatal | meh, still no charge on my cc :/ :) |
| 08:14.22 | Fatal | :) |
| 08:14.53 | ewanm89_laptop | I'm sorry, no mokobot for most of the day, bye |
| 08:15.09 | ScaredyCat | gah |
| 08:15.17 | mokobot | bye |
| 08:17.28 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@qiqinebs.chi.il.us) |
| 08:17.54 | *** join/#openmoko zedstar (n=john@82-44-202-121.cable.ubr08.haye.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 08:20.11 | *** join/#openmoko slomo (n=slomo@ubuntu/member/slomo) |
| 08:23.20 | *** join/#openmoko Kensan (n=rueegseg@zux006-004-203.adsl.green.ch) |
| 08:25.12 | *** join/#openmoko mdt (n=mdt@littlelun.emdete.de) |
| 08:25.57 | *** part/#openmoko Sublime (n=Sublime@ip70-162-246-65.ph.ph.cox.net) |
| 08:26.13 | *** join/#openmoko RP (i=1000@tim.rpsys.net) |
| 08:30.36 | *** join/#openmoko grobian (n=grobian@L19c7.l.pppool.de) |
| 08:31.39 | andylock1an | good morning mokoers! |
| 08:34.43 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@qiqinebs.chi.il.us) |
| 08:35.57 | *** join/#openmoko nimu (i=kitakota@59.89.112.153) |
| 08:37.08 | nimu | hellllllllllllllllllllllllllllllloooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo |
| 08:37.17 | rwhitby | g'day |
| 08:37.55 | CM|Vacation | Interesting http://pavelmachek.livejournal.com/43356.html |
| 08:38.04 | nimu | hello from where are u rwhitbhy |
| 08:38.10 | CM|Vacation | (I'm one day late, I know..) |
| 08:38.16 | rwhitby | nimu: down under |
| 08:38.59 | CM|Vacation | 99.5% of the population of earth lives sounth of me |
| 08:39.17 | nimu | what is your intention about down under |
| 08:39.28 | rwhitby | CM|Vacation: I expect much the same figure lives north of me |
| 08:39.32 | nimu | who is cm vacation |
| 08:39.51 | nimu | are we on opera mail |
| 08:40.05 | nimu | lounge |
| 08:40.08 | *** join/#openmoko Any_Key (n=Any_Key@rt94.highlink.ru) |
| 08:40.43 | nimu | i just want chat rather than opera |
| 08:41.01 | nimu | <PROTECTED> |
| 08:41.55 | nimu | u dont want to sent me reply |
| 08:42.32 | nimu | ok! im leaving |
| 08:42.37 | nimu | buy |
| 08:44.15 | grobian | I found another bug in the openmoko-calculator! |
| 08:44.39 | blindcoder | 1+1=3? |
| 08:44.43 | rtyler | You + Me does not equal Us? |
| 08:44.44 | grobian | no |
| 08:44.46 | grobian | ;) |
| 08:45.27 | grobian | wait my english is not so good |
| 08:45.33 | grobian | have to look it up |
| 08:46.16 | grobian | try a division by zero! puts out strange things |
| 08:46.27 | grobian | it should be cuaght |
| 08:46.58 | grobian | but im using qemu ! maybe on neo its different |
| 08:47.32 | grobian | but i guess this case is not caught. |
| 08:48.15 | grobian | something like 1 / 0 = nan 2e304005 |
| 08:48.23 | grobian | nan = not an number |
| 08:48.38 | grobian | but 2e2858588 is strange |
| 08:48.56 | blindcoder | 2e... isn't that 2*10^2858588 |
| 08:49.05 | rtyler | yes |
| 08:49.06 | grobian | yes |
| 08:49.23 | rtyler | grobian: let this be a lesson to you |
| 08:49.27 | rtyler | never divide by zero >_> |
| 08:49.35 | grobian | i know |
| 08:49.42 | Fatal | I can see forever! |
| 08:49.49 | grobian | but this case must be caught by software |
| 08:50.01 | grobian | lucky it didnt crash |
| 08:50.55 | grobian | Just doing a little testing. Doing things developer never would thought of |
| 08:53.17 | gamin | if phones are delivered cheaply by ups -as the topic states- why does shipping cost so much? UPS USA -> Europe should be more like 20$... |
| 08:54.18 | gamin | or is that in order to make up for the 50$ "reduction" from 350 to 300, now hidden in the shipping? |
| 08:54.20 | rtyler | gamin: because they made the shipping estimates without knowing what kind of discounts they could get |
| 08:54.55 | gamin | rtyler: yes, I read harald's blog, but you can check prices on their webpage... |
| 08:54.57 | *** join/#openmoko nosyjoe (n=philipp@host-82-135-95-87.customer.m-online.net) |
| 08:55.07 | LarstiQ | gamin: and the charged prices will be lower than that... |
| 08:55.18 | rtyler | gamin: actually, Sean's trying to buy a Porsche |
| 08:55.26 | rtyler | that's why there's the padding on the shipping costs >_> |
| 08:55.44 | grobian | well i will reoprt it to bugzilla |
| 08:56.08 | cjb_ie | gamin: $20 sounds very cheap to get a phone US->EU |
| 08:57.43 | buz | sounds about right for 10day shipping of a sub 1kg parcel |
| 08:58.34 | buz | heck i can get 2kg parcels 2-3day for ~80usd |
| 08:58.46 | cjb_ie | oh, 10day |
| 08:58.52 | cjb_ie | i was presuming something quick |
| 08:59.00 | cjb_ie | i didn't think UPS did anything as slow as 10 day |
| 08:59.02 | buz | might get it 3-5 even |
| 08:59.18 | buz | if you ship enough you get deep discounts |
| 08:59.27 | buz | 80usd was consumer pricing |
| 09:00.02 | buz | however, prices will skyrocket once VAT processing is added |
| 09:00.03 | gamin | rtyler: 1000 * 50$ should get Sean there :-P |
| 09:00.20 | buz | not sure you can get a new porsche for 50K |
| 09:00.35 | gamin | not a new one, but a nice used one |
| 09:00.49 | grobian | Audi A4 |
| 09:01.03 | buz | way too many of those on the streets |
| 09:01.05 | rtyler | I'd settle for that :P |
| 09:01.13 | buz | nissan 350z |
| 09:01.18 | buz | that one definitely is below 50K |
| 09:01.21 | gamin | and hey, there will be more than 1000 shippings - at least let's hope that :) |
| 09:02.13 | buz | that would mostly depend on the LCD guys i guess |
| 09:02.14 | gamin | are there any numbers known of how many phones are available? |
| 09:02.38 | rtyler | I have ticket #38xx |
| 09:03.10 | buz | gamin <1000 i think |
| 09:03.40 | *** join/#openmoko zecke (n=ich@dsl-62-220-14-162.berlikomm.net) |
| 09:04.07 | gamin | buz - so for those ordering now there will be no shipping for some weeks? |
| 09:04.16 | buz | maybe |
| 09:04.34 | buz | i dont really know, i think there were 2x500 unit runs |
| 09:04.45 | grobian | maybe i will wait until september |
| 09:04.51 | grobian | for P3 |
| 09:04.54 | buz | i wait until gta02 ;) |
| 09:05.01 | grobian | ok gta02 |
| 09:05.02 | buz | i doubt that will be in september |
| 09:05.07 | buz | or october for that matter |
| 09:05.07 | grobian | what i meant |
| 09:05.39 | grobian | i guess not |
| 09:05.57 | grobian | will take some time to get things running |
| 09:06.07 | buz | tho i have read that prototypes do exist |
| 09:06.23 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@qiqinebs.chi.il.us) |
| 09:06.39 | buz | so who knows, maybe they can do october |
| 09:07.01 | grobian | i hope so but .... |
| 09:07.13 | grobian | something tells me |
| 09:07.19 | grobian | it will be 2008 |
| 09:08.03 | buz | i'm hoping xmas ;) |
| 09:08.03 | andylockran | df |
| 09:08.13 | grobian | yes |
| 09:08.49 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@qiqinebs.chi.il.us) |
| 09:10.44 | *** part/#openmoko SunZhiyong (n=sunzy@218.242.154.170) |
| 09:11.34 | buz | mhh intel quad core is dirt cheap now |
| 09:11.44 | buz | if only i could stuff one into a laptop |
| 09:12.23 | grobian | why not! :) |
| 09:12.34 | Tronic | Doesn't it use over 100 W of power? |
| 09:12.40 | buz | 105W |
| 09:12.45 | Tronic | Probably not such a good idea for a laptop. |
| 09:12.47 | *** join/#openmoko florian (n=fuchs@217.146.132.69) |
| 09:12.48 | buz | the laptop would burst into fire likely |
| 09:12.57 | Tronic | Unless you want a molten pile of plastic on your lap. |
| 09:12.59 | buz | never mind that most laptop come with 90w PSU at most |
| 09:13.36 | Tronic | Btw, I just ordered a Q6600 for my home box about 15 minutes ago. |
| 09:13.39 | florian | good morning |
| 09:13.54 | zecke | florian: moin :) |
| 09:13.56 | Tronic | They still display 543.90 € as its price, but I expect that to drop before they can actually deliver :P |
| 09:14.08 | buz | in switzerland they display 340CHF |
| 09:14.16 | grobian | how much does a GPU waste in most laptops? |
| 09:14.27 | buz | grobian: that mostly depends on the gpu |
| 09:14.37 | buz | a high end one up to 40w |
| 09:15.01 | buz | an integrated one muuuuch less |
| 09:15.02 | grobian | sounds like a lot |
| 09:15.36 | buz | basically, integrated is good for anything but gaming and 3d engineering |
| 09:15.37 | grobian | How much does the arm 266 MHZ use ? 5 -10 W ? |
| 09:15.44 | buz | <1W |
| 09:15.49 | grobian | < 1W |
| 09:15.51 | grobian | wow |
| 09:15.52 | *** join/#openmoko squalyl (n=squalyl@139.100.140.131) |
| 09:15.57 | squalyl | hi guys |
| 09:16.08 | buz | battery wouldnt last an hour with 10W likely ;) |
| 09:16.34 | buz | 3.6*1700 |
| 09:16.41 | buz | much less than an hour |
| 09:16.50 | Tronic | The cheapest ones in Finland are around 250 €. |
| 09:16.50 | buz | no wait |
| 09:17.11 | grobian | 1700 Ah |
| 09:17.19 | buz | mAh |
| 09:17.28 | buz | so 3.6*1.7=6.12 |
| 09:17.29 | grobian | oh right |
| 09:17.53 | buz | little over 30min with 10W ;) |
| 09:18.24 | grobian | =) |
| 09:19.39 | grobian | i guess the LCD Backlight is using the most ! |
| 09:20.15 | hrw | on my d400 it does |
| 09:20.25 | buz | when calling the gsm probably uses the most |
| 09:21.31 | grobian | How much Voltage does the CPU need ? 9V |
| 09:21.33 | grobian | ? |
| 09:22.14 | grobian | I remember that intel arm xscale pxa277 needed 2 different Voltage to work |
| 09:22.37 | grobian | or 3 |
| 09:23.04 | grobian | but im not sure |
| 09:23.45 | squalyl | LCD backlights are energy monsters. On my ipaq 4700, when I turn it off with tcpmp, I multiply battery life by 4! |
| 09:24.03 | *** join/#openmoko koen (n=koen@dominion.kabel.utwente.nl) |
| 09:24.57 | grobian | to concede as true |
| 09:25.10 | eMb | With normal usage, minimal backlight while still usable, how long are your records in battery lives? |
| 09:25.31 | squalyl | my openmoko-devel-images refuses to build because of libgsmd do_install, is it a known problem or is it local to me? |
| 09:25.40 | squalyl | the error is "make: *** No rule to make target `install'. Stop." that's weird |
| 09:26.15 | squalyl | anyone else gets that? |
| 09:26.37 | stefan_schmidt | squalyl: Which version of bitbake do you use? |
| 09:26.46 | squalyl | 1.8.7 |
| 09:26.47 | grobian | do you want to cross compile ? or run on PC ? |
| 09:26.53 | squalyl | both :) |
| 09:26.56 | stefan_schmidt | squalyl: That'S the problem |
| 09:27.13 | stefan_schmidt | squalyl: Our overlay works only with 1.6.x atm |
| 09:27.13 | squalyl | what? bitbake version or target platform? |
| 09:27.21 | squalyl | okay |
| 09:27.28 | squalyl | I'll try this |
| 09:27.38 | stefan_schmidt | squalyl: With the coming oe merge that will change and we use a more recent bitbake again. |
| 09:27.46 | squalyl | do I have to clean all, or can I resume the build with 1.6? |
| 09:28.11 | stefan_schmidt | squalyl: I never tried a resume with it. |
| 09:28.23 | stefan_schmidt | squalyl: But you can try and let us know. :) |
| 09:28.25 | *** join/#openmoko lar5 (n=laprican@hsiproxy.astra-net.com) |
| 09:28.44 | squalyl | OK |
| 09:30.46 | squalyl | I have 1.6.9 now :) (I hope I do not need to uninstall the old one, I just reinstalled it :) ) |
| 09:34.10 | *** join/#openmoko some1_ (n=some1@p54A0F605.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 09:34.28 | grobian | squalyl: good luck |
| 09:34.49 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@qiqinebs.chi.il.us) |
| 09:37.03 | squalyl | Still handling bb files. |
| 09:37.18 | squalyl | I don't fully understand the relation between oe and openmoko |
| 09:37.30 | squalyl | there are parts of openmoko in oe, but not all |
| 09:37.39 | squalyl | how does it work and what is the final goal? |
| 09:37.56 | mdt | as i understand openmoko uses oe |
| 09:38.14 | squalyl | for common packets like X11 or other libs, OK |
| 09:38.15 | mdt | oe has a nice build env |
| 09:38.17 | stefan_schmidt | squalyl: oe is a metabuildsystem for distributions. (/me hopes that was the right description for koen ;)) |
| 09:38.33 | stefan_schmidt | squalyl: openmoko is a distro build with the oe metadata |
| 09:38.43 | squalyl | oe also contain disto-specific packages? |
| 09:38.47 | stefan_schmidt | squalyl: And the missing parts will be merged soon |
| 09:38.50 | squalyl | distro-specific |
| 09:38.54 | squalyl | ok |
| 09:39.33 | stefan_schmidt | squalyl: Most of the time it is only different configurations for different distros |
| 09:40.01 | stefan_schmidt | squalyl: But yes, it also contains packages that are only used by one distro. |
| 09:40.20 | squalyl | OK the goal is to gather everything in one place |
| 09:40.45 | squalyl | and openmoko subversion is a "development" tree |
| 09:42.57 | stefan_schmidt | squalyl: More an overlay, but our current local stuff yes. |
| 09:43.28 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[P1_Owners]] [[Talk:Developer_preview]] |
| 09:44.14 | stefan_schmidt | squalyl: After the merge is finished and we have catched up with introduced bugs we will use a small branch for our stuff. Monotone branch so we can do easy cherry picking |
| 09:44.43 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@qiqinebs.chi.il.us) |
| 09:46.34 | squalyl | another think. I use the recommended MTN revision given in the wiki, but what are the changes between this and mtn "head" revision? Last time I tried "mtn update" I had to use bitbake 1.8 and nothing worked anymore :) |
| 09:48.46 | stefan_schmidt | squalyl: Our overlay is based on this fixed version. MTN head needs bitbake 1.8 these days |
| 09:49.24 | squalyl | got it |
| 09:49.25 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@141.80-202-161.nextgentel.com) |
| 09:58.14 | *** join/#openmoko Odin- (n=sbkhh@s121-302.gardur.hi.is) |
| 09:59.24 | rtp | stefan_schmidt: hi. I've noticed too late your mail. I've already sent the patch to Harald :) |
| 09:59.42 | stefan_schmidt | rtp: Ah, that's fine. |
| 10:00.35 | rtp | stefan_schmidt: but that should not prevent you to test it if you want :) |
| 10:00.36 | stefan_schmidt | rtp: It's the normal way for kernel patches anyway. I should thought I could get this work done for him. |
| 10:00.43 | stefan_schmidt | rtp: heh |
| 10:00.58 | stefan_schmidt | rtp: I need to fully update my v4 and test |
| 10:02.58 | rtp | stefan_schmidt: well, if you don't want to update your v4, do it on your v3 :) |
| 10:03.21 | stefan_schmidt | rtp: Elrond has my v3. |
| 10:03.34 | stefan_schmidt | rtp: v4 is fine. Doing all my devel on it |
| 10:03.51 | stefan_schmidt | rtp: Just not up to date because of travelling |
| 10:04.24 | rtp | I see. rmll and guadec I bet |
| 10:04.40 | stefan_schmidt | rtp: You have won. |
| 10:05.33 | *** join/#openmoko friedel (n=fwolff@dsl-242-217-191.telkomadsl.co.za) |
| 10:05.54 | rtp | :) |
| 10:09.54 | *** join/#openmoko XorA (n=xora@www.xora.org.uk) |
| 10:10.21 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@qiqinebs.chi.il.us) |
| 10:19.09 | *** join/#openmoko MickTaiwan (n=mick@lan31-6-82-238-147-130.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 10:19.41 | *** join/#openmoko rd_ (n=rd@vnsecurity.net) |
| 10:21.03 | *** join/#openmoko daxxar (i=daxxar@daxxar.com) |
| 10:24.30 | *** join/#openmoko yveslu (n=yves@217.31.69.98) |
| 10:25.58 | *** part/#openmoko yveslu (n=yves@217.31.69.98) |
| 10:26.24 | *** join/#openmoko crunchywelch (n=welch@ool-18b9456b.dyn.optonline.net) |
| 10:28.25 | *** join/#openmoko n0on3 (n=n0on3@81-208-83-247.fastres.net) |
| 10:30.10 | Elrond | rtp - What kernel patch? |
| 10:30.26 | *** join/#openmoko njpatel (n=njp@host86-138-105-250.range86-138.btcentralplus.com) |
| 10:31.26 | rtp | Elrond: the one fixing the jbt6k74 resume on openmoko-kernel |
| 10:32.03 | Elrond | rtp - Ahh. |
| 10:32.07 | Elrond | *checking mail* |
| 10:32.15 | *** join/#openmoko thomasg (n=thomasg@p57AFFF6A.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 10:32.36 | grobian | jbt6k74 ? |
| 10:32.52 | stefan_schmidt | grobian: LCM controller chip |
| 10:33.01 | grobian | ahhhhhhhhh ok |
| 10:34.12 | Elrond | stefan_schmidt - Hi BTW! :) |
| 10:34.59 | stefan_schmidt | hi Elrond |
| 10:35.46 | Elrond | stefan_schmidt - BTW: Do you know any openmoko people near FFM except mickey, abraxa and me? |
| 10:36.02 | grobian | yes ! |
| 10:36.06 | grobian | me |
| 10:36.11 | stefan_schmidt | heh |
| 10:36.31 | grobian | i`m from mainz |
| 10:36.39 | Elrond | Ahh |
| 10:37.13 | grobian | its about 40 minutes with DB |
| 10:37.33 | grobian | but im only a user! |
| 10:37.45 | eMb | FFM? |
| 10:38.01 | Elrond | eMb - "Frankfurt am Main" |
| 10:38.03 | grobian | Frankfurt |
| 10:38.05 | eMb | ah |
| 10:38.13 | eMb | I am in Swedorn :( |
| 10:38.20 | Elrond | eMb - FFM is the airport sign |
| 10:38.21 | eMb | There are no big OSS conventions around here. Yet. |
| 10:38.43 | Elrond | eMb - Well, big hehe... 4 people currently. ;o) |
| 10:38.52 | eMb | But I get by, there are huge amounts of lectures on google vide |
| 10:39.11 | eMb | engedu, toorcon.org, 22c3, authors@google are all great terms to search for |
| 10:39.34 | Elrond | grobian - Well, I guess, you can come anyway :) |
| 10:39.40 | eMb | Also! Search for openmoko and you'll find two 1h talks by our beloved FIC people. |
| 10:39.42 | grobian | well thx |
| 10:40.07 | grobian | i do some bugfixing if u like! |
| 10:51.42 | *** join/#openmoko mrossow (n=mrossow@134.123.9.213.dsl.getacom.de) |
| 10:52.07 | *** join/#openmoko danilos (n=danilo@163.pool85-48-166.static.orange.es) |
| 10:54.16 | Dmitry_Platonov | Elrond, hi! I have some more progress. |
| 10:55.28 | XorA | <4>end_request: I/O error, dev mmcblk0, sector 241 |
| 10:55.28 | XorA | <3>Buffer I/O error on device mmcblk0p1, logical block 2 |
| 10:55.28 | XorA | <4>lost page write due to I/O error on mmcblk0p1 |
| 10:55.38 | XorA | not much improvement on mmc then :-( |
| 10:55.50 | Elrond | Dmitry_Platonov - Ahh, great! :) |
| 10:56.20 | Elrond | XorA - Bv3 or Bv4? |
| 10:56.33 | XorA | bv4 |
| 10:57.39 | *** join/#openmoko ruoso (n=ruoso@static-b5-252-25.telepac.pt) |
| 11:00.06 | Elrond | XorA - BTW: Can you try "dd if=/dev/mtdblock2 of=/tmp/kernel.bin" and then "ls -l /usr/lib" (the later is just to see, if the flash is still accessible) I have the problem that flash gets inaccessible after this dd on Bv3. |
| 11:00.39 | Elrond | XorA - Oh, and to get the neo to reboot, if you've hit the same problem: "echo go >/dev/wattchdog" |
| 11:01.19 | Elrond | Dmitry_Platonov - Ahh, I see your mail on the ML archive. :-) I'll change decode.py for you, when I'm home (in 6 hours) |
| 11:01.20 | Dmitry_Platonov | Elrond, i have some insights into algorithm wich achives reg11 ls half == 0x37 target. and seems it caclulates doppler (reg 05/06) too. |
| 11:01.23 | Elrond | Dmitry_Platonov - Anything else? |
| 11:01.50 | ScaredyCat | it's 4 am in ca - surely someone's there loading up the ups truck ;) |
| 11:02.21 | Elrond | Dmitry_Platonov - Ahh, great! :-) |
| 11:02.55 | Dmitry_Platonov | I'll post it in list today. |
| 11:03.33 | Dmitry_Platonov | we need terminology for different phases of coldstart. |
| 11:03.50 | Elrond | Hmm, yeah. |
| 11:03.55 | Elrond | Any suggestions? |
| 11:04.11 | *** join/#openmoko borg_ (n=olaf@80.149.17.21) |
| 11:04.28 | Dmitry_Platonov | hm. first phase = global search? |
| 11:04.43 | Elrond | Yeah. |
| 11:05.09 | Elrond | It tries some doppler's there and tries to find out, if there might be an SV. |
| 11:05.19 | Elrond | s/'// |
| 11:06.24 | Dmitry_Platonov | reg 11 > threshold (possibly =0800) - "candidate found" event |
| 11:06.38 | Elrond | I still have no idea, how it really notices, that there might be an SV. Especialy not for the reg5==0 case. Because the cmd23-max (ms word of reg11) is often 0xfff there, even for non-existant sats. |
| 11:06.39 | Dmitry_Platonov | or something like that |
| 11:07.04 | *** join/#openmoko tr2x (n=alvar@80-218-185-55.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 11:07.08 | Dmitry_Platonov | s/reg 11/ms part of reg 11/ |
| 11:07.16 | Elrond | Yep. |
| 11:07.47 | Elrond | But that probably only works for reg5 != 0 (I mean 0 + REG5_BASE of course) |
| 11:08.13 | Elrond | The 0 case confuses me totally. |
| 11:08.26 | Dmitry_Platonov | I doubt it. do not see how reg5 is different from other |
| 11:08.40 | Dmitry_Platonov | any examples? |
| 11:09.10 | Elrond | I once thought, that it might be some correlation bewtween the other channels or so. So I changed all the other channels to other PRNs and -420000 for reg5, but still got 0xfff sometimes. |
| 11:10.09 | Dmitry_Platonov | s/reg 5/reg 5 == 0/ |
| 11:10.30 | Skuff_ | what do u think about converting gtkguitune for openmoko ? ... its a guitar-tuning app |
| 11:10.53 | Elrond | Skuff_ - Just do it? :-) |
| 11:11.20 | Skuff_ | yeah, i dont think its too much work |
| 11:11.33 | XorA | root@fic-gta01:~$ ls /usr/lib |
| 11:11.33 | XorA | ls: /usr/lib/ao: Input/output error |
| 11:11.33 | XorA | ls: /usr/lib/web: Input/output error |
| 11:11.33 | XorA | ls: /usr/lib/ipsec: Input/output error |
| 11:11.33 | XorA | ls: /usr/lib/glib-2.0: Input/output error |
| 11:11.33 | XorA | ls: /usr/lib/gnome-vfs-2.0: Input/output error |
| 11:11.35 | XorA | ls: /usr/lib/openmoko-panel-demo: Input/output error |
| 11:11.37 | XorA | X11 libgdk_pixbuf_xlib-2.0.so.0 |
| 11:11.38 | Elrond | Dmitry_Platonov - I don't have data handy... only bad example: http://www.flickr.com/photos/elrond/696712853/ there it's >0x800 for non-existant sat and reg5==0. |
| 11:11.53 | Elrond | XorA - Hah, so you can reproduce it? |
| 11:12.14 | Elrond | XorA - "echo go >/dev/watchdog" to reboot. Because you will not be able to reboot in any other way. |
| 11:12.42 | XorA | Elrond: pulling battery out always works :-) |
| 11:12.42 | Skuff_ | http://www.geocities.com/harpin_floh/kguitune_page.html ... just have to change the gui layout |
| 11:13.25 | Elrond | XorA - Yeah, that also works. I just don't like doing that while a "computer" is fully running. ;o) |
| 11:13.40 | *** join/#openmoko rob_w|laptop (n=rob_w@p549BB2A9.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 11:14.06 | Elrond | XorA - Can you please just say "reproduced on GTA01Bv04" at http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=567 ? |
| 11:14.08 | XorA | squeal baby sqeal :-) |
| 11:14.44 | Elrond | XorA - Oh and possibly add your kernel version. ;-) |
| 11:17.02 | XorA | Elrond: can you log it on my behalf, I forgot my password/email address I used for bugtracker |
| 11:17.06 | XorA | Elrond: uImage-2.6.21.6-moko10-r1_0_0_2360 |
| 11:17.24 | *** join/#openmoko jannu (n=jannu@hoas-fe3cdd00-15.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 11:19.09 | Elrond | XorA - Okay, will do. |
| 11:19.44 | hrw | <PROTECTED> |
| 11:19.52 | *** join/#openmoko rd__ (n=rd@vnsecurity.net) |
| 11:19.56 | Elrond | XorA - What name should I put for you? "XorA on #openmoko"? |
| 11:20.30 | XorA | Elrond: yeah, that'll do, as the sound driver writer everyone knows me anyway :-) |
| 11:20.49 | Elrond | Ahh, 'Graeme "XorA" Gregory' ? |
| 11:21.57 | *** part/#openmoko Dunedan (n=dunedan@phoenitydawn.de) |
| 11:22.02 | *** join/#openmoko Dunedan (n=dunedan@phoenitydawn.de) |
| 11:23.29 | *** join/#openmoko ruoso (n=ruoso@static-b5-252-25.telepac.pt) |
| 11:23.43 | *** join/#openmoko koen (n=koen@dominion.kabel.utwente.nl) |
| 11:25.13 | Elrond | XorA - Thanks for testing, I've posted for you (<http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=567#c8>) |
| 11:26.09 | SpeedEvil | Elrond: As I understand it (which may of course be wrong) this sort of reciever should give a signal directly at any doppler. Basically as the possible 'slip' due to doppler over one bit period is relatively small - under a part in 1500 or so. This means that you will always get the majority of the energy in one bin. |
| 11:28.34 | rtp | XorA: oh, you're Graeme Gregory. Now I know who to ping before sending a patch for ASoC on the neo :) |
| 11:29.22 | eMb | Out of curiosity, how well do you think the basics will work in time for the GTA02 ? |
| 11:29.28 | eMb | you as in all of you |
| 11:29.36 | SpeedEvil | The doppler is +-5Km/s or so, which is 300000Km/s(C) /10 = 1/30000, over 20ms, or 20000 chip periods. Or a little under one chip. |
| 11:29.42 | SpeedEvil | eMb: hardware - probably. |
| 11:29.47 | Dmitry_Platonov | SpeedEvil, it seems that it searches through doppler (but band is pretty wide) |
| 11:29.54 | SpeedEvil | eMb: software - well - october is damn optimistic. |
| 11:30.10 | eMb | Yeah, I suspected as much. |
| 11:30.16 | Dmitry_Platonov | SpeedEvil, we need doppler not only for chip, but for carrier too. |
| 11:30.25 | SpeedEvil | Dmitry_Platonov: The sensitivity will be a bit down at the edges as I understand it. |
| 11:30.25 | Dmitry_Platonov | carrier period <<< chip |
| 11:30.36 | SpeedEvil | Dmitry_Platonov: I know - some 1200 times. |
| 11:31.08 | Dmitry_Platonov | SpeedEvil, it is lowered in RF part (before ADC) |
| 11:31.53 | *** join/#openmoko wbx (n=wbx@gw.aurisp.de) |
| 11:32.12 | Dmitry_Platonov | I think part that do it is called mixer |
| 11:32.41 | SpeedEvil | Dmitry_Platonov: Hmm. How fast can carrier phase locking be. You can - I think - from the above mini-analysis - get the fact that there is a satellite there quite fast. (yes, it's a mixer) |
| 11:33.26 | SpeedEvil | Dmitry_Platonov: The actual process of locking ot the carrier phase must be much slower, and require you to alter the searched-for doppler quite a lot. |
| 11:34.26 | SpeedEvil | Dmitry_Platonov: if it's done entirely in software, it'd make some rough guesses based on the movement of the correlated peak. set the doppler, and repeat. |
| 11:34.27 | Dmitry_Platonov | cold start: 11 sec/channel/prn (finds rough doppler), +some seconds fine tuning doppler, +<1s what I believe is phase lock |
| 11:35.05 | SpeedEvil | Sounds plausible. |
| 11:35.17 | SpeedEvil | The seek phase will be lots slower than the actual lock. |
| 11:36.05 | Dmitry_Platonov | and yes, it tunes doppler according correlation peak movement. |
| 11:36.41 | SpeedEvil | Even just doing it 'dumb' - 10s of observing the code phase - will get you the doppler to within 30m/s. I think. |
| 11:37.04 | *** join/#openmoko lar5 (n=laprican@hsiproxy.astra-net.com) |
| 11:37.16 | SpeedEvil | Hmm. |
| 11:37.34 | SpeedEvil | I have 100m of coax that might just work at this freq. |
| 11:37.56 | SpeedEvil | On thursday a 80cm satellite dish is coming up at a local retailer. |
| 11:38.29 | SpeedEvil | The results of chopping this 400ns delay in and out may be revealing. |
| 11:38.50 | Dmitry_Platonov | ? |
| 11:39.20 | Dmitry_Platonov | do not understand how dish has anything to do with GPS. |
| 11:40.17 | buz | you would have to track the satellite with the dish, no? |
| 11:40.21 | buz | sounds kinda painful |
| 11:40.42 | SpeedEvil | Yes. |
| 11:40.47 | SpeedEvil | It's slow - 12m |
| 11:40.50 | SpeedEvil | err |
| 11:40.52 | SpeedEvil | 12h orbits |
| 11:41.02 | *** join/#openmoko jpozlovsky (n=jindra@rb5cc115.net.upc.cz) |
| 11:41.04 | buz | well but only one satellite at a time |
| 11:41.05 | SpeedEvil | it's basically to boost one PRN by several hundred times. |
| 11:41.30 | SpeedEvil | So that experiments can be done directly on one PRN signal. |
| 11:41.32 | eMb | http://rapidshare.com/files/44519416/acxiom_members_weekly_extract_2004_to_present.7z.html |
| 11:41.37 | buz | ah well if that's the point |
| 11:41.54 | Dmitry_Platonov | SpeedEvil, is antenna active? if no, I suspect cable will pick up more noise than built-in antella |
| 11:41.58 | eMb | Hm, mirror that for freedom |
| 11:42.17 | SpeedEvil | The sillier application is that some basic sums reveal you can use a 1.2m or so dish to receive GPS out by the moon :) |
| 11:42.20 | *** join/#openmoko harzi (n=dani@84-73-140-176.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 11:42.42 | SpeedEvil | No, it's a dumb app. |
| 11:42.42 | SpeedEvil | dish |
| 11:42.58 | SpeedEvil | For some odd reason, they sell the dish/LNB/receiver as seperate lines. Even though they only get a batch of the whole lot in once a year. |
| 11:43.39 | Dmitry_Platonov | GPS sat emit signal only toward the Earth, afaik |
| 11:43.48 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[P1_Owners]] [[Translation]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Switzerland]] [[User:CesarB/Compiling_for_EABI]] |
| 11:44.06 | SpeedEvil | They do - mostly. But there is overspill where satellites are just coming over the earths horizon |
| 11:44.08 | buz | since power is expensive in space, most satellites will do that |
| 11:44.19 | SpeedEvil | As seen from the moon |
| 11:44.25 | cjb_ie | SpeedEvil: ah, lidl/aldi do that here too |
| 11:44.52 | *** join/#openmoko cbrake (n=cbrake@oh-69-34-21-229.sta.embarqhsd.net) |
| 11:47.10 | *** join/#openmoko Dodji (n=dodji@torimasen.com) |
| 11:47.27 | *** join/#openmoko Obri (i=daniel@sonne.alt-f4.ch) |
| 11:47.32 | Obri | Moin |
| 11:47.34 | SpeedEvil | And yeah - it's Aldi. |
| 11:48.08 | Dmitry_Platonov | SpeedEvil, moon must be near horison too. +dual iono/tropo delay. do now know practical value. |
| 11:48.42 | SpeedEvil | Dmitry_Platonov: Not really. Atmosphere is 20Km. satellites orbit at 25000(?)Km |
| 11:49.09 | SpeedEvil | Dmitry_Platonov: the time they shine through the atmosphere is very small. |
| 11:49.10 | squalyl | non, about 11600 but there's not so much atmosphere there |
| 11:49.35 | SpeedEvil | Ionosphere is a bit higher though. |
| 11:50.27 | squalyl | (sorry not 11600 km but 20000 km) |
| 11:50.59 | Dmitry_Platonov | I think transmitter antenna cone is just slightly wider than earth (+1000 km, maybe) |
| 11:51.27 | SpeedEvil | It is - from some very basic sums - this is enough to give a navigation solution - 3-4 sats - most of the time. |
| 11:51.41 | SpeedEvil | Not a good solution, but a solution. |
| 11:52.32 | Dmitry_Platonov | hm. sounds interesting. Just point antenna to moon and recieve solution? how did you come with this idea? |
| 11:53.08 | SpeedEvil | I was just idly wondering about positioning solutions on the moon over on sci.space.policy on useent. |
| 11:53.10 | SpeedEvil | usenet |
| 11:56.21 | *** join/#openmoko Any_Key (n=Any_Key@rt94.highlink.ru) |
| 11:56.36 | quinton | i know it depends on the network, but does anyone know how likely it would be to be able to use something like IM or IRC, where you stay connected but only send/recv a few bytes at a time? |
| 11:56.47 | SpeedEvil | very |
| 11:56.56 | SpeedEvil | GPRS basically does that just fine. |
| 11:57.04 | quinton | outstanding |
| 11:57.23 | quinton | i wasn't sure about the 'staying connected' part |
| 11:57.29 | *** join/#openmoko Any_Key (n=Any_Key@rt94.highlink.ru) |
| 11:57.42 | SpeedEvil | quinton: it does drop when you get a voice call |
| 11:57.51 | mjr | well, the connection does go on hold when you... yeah |
| 11:57.54 | quinton | fair enough |
| 11:57.55 | mjr | mind you, not drop, on hold |
| 11:58.02 | *** join/#openmoko Any_Key_ (n=Any_Key@rt94.highlink.ru) |
| 11:58.04 | mjr | though it may drop if the call is not short, of course |
| 11:58.25 | *** join/#openmoko Any_Key (n=Any_Key@rt94.highlink.ru) |
| 11:58.47 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@66.37.59.194.nauticom.net) |
| 11:58.50 | mjr | for IRC and other stuff that don't handle that gracefully, you probably want a bouncer |
| 11:59.14 | quinton | so, stay connected on a home computer, and connect to home rather than directly? |
| 11:59.21 | SpeedEvil | Dmitry_Platonov: Musings on carrier lock: over 1s of locking, something like that. |
| 11:59.23 | SpeedEvil | oops |
| 11:59.29 | SpeedEvil | something like that |
| 12:00.09 | quinton | if we get pidgin working nicely, would openmoko be the first to do messaging, or has it been done before? |
| 12:00.57 | quinton | er, you know what i mean |
| 12:01.57 | mjr | there are irc/IM clients for smartphones |
| 12:02.11 | mjr | buy with Moko I'd hope it'll be more integrated |
| 12:02.35 | sandos | and not use up the battery in no time at all? |
| 12:02.47 | sandos | thats a big problem with J2ME apps on phones afaik |
| 12:03.01 | mjr | that'll remain to be seen, hopefully not :] |
| 12:03.12 | *** join/#openmoko cassidy (n=cassidy@44.201-136-217.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be) |
| 12:03.50 | Stephmw | sandos: Eh? |
| 12:04.27 | ozark1 | sandos: IM works well on the BlackBerry (J2ME) without an impact on the battery. |
| 12:05.04 | ozark1 | And google chat is nicely integrated with the BB messaging and alert system. |
| 12:05.38 | Stephmw | I can't really see the correlation between battery life and J2ME specifically... any intensive cpu usage (regardless of platform) will suck battery tbh |
| 12:09.20 | cjb_ie | right, but java's perceived as being an inefficient user of cpu. |
| 12:09.38 | XorA | tell that to GSM sims |
| 12:10.35 | Elrond | SpeedEvil - Well about doppler tuning while searching (assuming reg5/6 are doppler, whicih seems to be quite likely): The interesting point is: if reg==0, there is a way too high signal, tuning away few percent of the usual "global search range" takes it down by a factor of 5.-10 |
| 12:11.34 | cjb_ie | XorA: do they run java bytecode natively or...? |
| 12:11.49 | XorA | on a VM |
| 12:12.07 | SpeedEvil | Elrond: I've not looked at the regs adequately. Are 5/6 per-sat? |
| 12:12.08 | *** join/#openmoko Sup3rkiddo (n=sudharsh@unaffiliated/sudharsh) |
| 12:12.14 | *** join/#openmoko C7_ (n=C7@zux006-058-029.adsl.green.ch) |
| 12:12.41 | Elrond | SpeedEvil - Yes. |
| 12:13.33 | SpeedEvil | Hmm. |
| 12:14.39 | Elrond | The reg5 global search range is -420000 - 420000. And having it at 0 gives a 0xfff for some PRN, having it at 4000 gives 0x200. |
| 12:15.28 | sandos | Stephmw: my boss tried some MSN app on his W880. I think this was J2ME, and it drained his battery in a lot less time than without it running. Why it would use cpu while mostly waiting for I/O I dont know |
| 12:16.32 | Elrond | sandos - rotating the earth ball like IE, because users love that? ;o) |
| 12:17.00 | *** join/#openmoko switch3r (n=switch3r@dsktop.student.umd.edu) |
| 12:17.17 | DukeOfURL_ | ll |
| 12:17.20 | Stephmw | sandos: without being biased against MS or SE... both of their implementations suck |
| 12:17.36 | SpeedEvil | Elrond: what does gllin use for the search range - is that how you got 420K- -420K? |
| 12:17.37 | Stephmw | sandos: MS isn't used to writing MIDlets, and SE outsources a shitty VM |
| 12:18.22 | Elrond | SpeedEvil - Yeah, exactly. It does 0, 105k, -105k, 210k, -210k, ..., -420k |
| 12:18.32 | sandos | ok :) |
| 12:18.44 | SpeedEvil | Elrond: so it's _really_ rough. |
| 12:19.00 | SpeedEvil | Elrond: with what - 8 values? |
| 12:19.48 | Elrond | SpeedEvil - Yes. But when it has a lock/fix, gllin slowly modifies it, probably to follow the sat. |
| 12:20.20 | SpeedEvil | It starts to track as it picks up the sat at all - or after it locks? |
| 12:20.26 | Elrond | SpeedEvil - It uses the channels for different PRN and uses new measurements for new reg5. |
| 12:21.22 | Elrond | What do you mean? |
| 12:21.50 | *** join/#openmoko neonum6 (n=neonum6@2001:4b88:7000:f1ca:c0ca:1d3:14fd:1112) |
| 12:22.27 | SpeedEvil | How early in the lock process does it start to adjust the PLL - does it stick at -105k - then snap to -27495 and slowly move from there as the sat moves. Or does it home on -27495 in an iterative manner |
| 12:23.17 | Elrond | Huh, good question. I think, it keeps the -105k for about 4 iterations, then snaps to -27495- |
| 12:23.23 | Elrond | s/-$/./ |
| 12:23.53 | SpeedEvil | Sigh. I need to look at the actual output :) Alas at the moment, I am repairing my car brakes. |
| 12:24.05 | SpeedEvil | Caliper started sticking, so I've torn it down. |
| 12:24.13 | Elrond | Ahh. |
| 12:25.00 | Elrond | SpeedEvil - Let me know, if you need help using the decoding-tools we wrote. :) |
| 12:25.16 | SpeedEvil | I may just rewrite my own in awk :) |
| 12:25.23 | *** join/#openmoko vosen (n=v0@86-63-84-163.asta-net.com.pl) |
| 12:25.23 | Elrond | ... or I can just create a parsed .log and put it somewhere for you to download. |
| 12:25.40 | SpeedEvil | That would be of use - the long log |
| 12:25.48 | SpeedEvil | probably a good idea anyway to link from the wiki |
| 12:25.58 | Dmitry_Platonov | Elrond, see mail on doppler calculation/tuning 8) |
| 12:26.11 | Elrond | Dmitry_Platonov - *checking* |
| 12:26.27 | Elrond | SpeedEvil - http://projects.linuxtogo.org/pipermail/sphyrna-devel/2007-July/000002.html |
| 12:26.28 | SpeedEvil | Dmitry_Platonov: Any chance of a cc? |
| 12:26.43 | *** join/#openmoko Devestate (n=Devestat@adsl-69-232-86-30.dsl.sndg02.pacbell.net) |
| 12:27.19 | SpeedEvil | Oh - an actual mailing list. |
| 12:29.28 | Stephmw | sandos: it'd be great if you could append a quick 'testing ideas' to the Java wiki entry and add the MSN midlet as a test against battery life :) |
| 12:29.30 | *** part/#openmoko p0rg1 (n=jans@hst3.eget.fi) |
| 12:30.35 | Dmitry_Platonov | oh, one mistake found (factual one) |
| 12:30.51 | *** join/#openmoko redgibson (n=Jeff@74.92.98.121) |
| 12:31.33 | sandos | hehe ok, Ill try and find it |
| 12:33.50 | *** join/#openmoko alex-weej (n=alex@cpc2-darl3-0-0-cust237.midd.cable.ntl.com) |
| 12:34.51 | *** join/#openmoko freskog_work (n=fredriks@hst3.eget.fi) |
| 12:35.12 | rtp | XorA: does "can't set hw platform params" ring a bell to you ? I happens when I try to play /usr/share/openmoko/sounds/notify_doorbell.mp3 with 2.6.23-rc1 |
| 12:35.49 | *** join/#openmoko crunchywelch (n=welch@pool-96-224-43-11.nycmny.east.verizon.net) |
| 12:35.54 | *** join/#openmoko rob_w|laptop (n=rob_w@p549BB2A9.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 12:35.59 | Dmitry_Platonov | ok. posted correction. threading seems a bit off. Is it my e-mail client (web-based one)? |
| 12:36.21 | Elrond | No, threading looks right in mutt. |
| 12:36.27 | XorA | rtp: normally means the speed, or stereoness is not agreeable to alsa |
| 12:36.41 | XorA | rtp: you can only really debug alsa stuff with aplay |
| 12:37.04 | Dmitry_Platonov | I mean in archive. |
| 12:37.41 | Elrond | Dmitry_Platonov - Yeah, saw it. |
| 12:38.15 | XorA | rtp: I havent tried 2.6.23-rcX yet, so I havent seen any new breakage that is implemented :-) |
| 12:39.01 | Dmitry_Platonov | does my explanation makes any sense? |
| 12:39.22 | rtp | XorA: ok. fwiw, notify_doorbell.wav works fine with aplay |
| 12:39.44 | XorA | rtp: good to know, so not totally borked then :-) |
| 12:39.56 | *** join/#openmoko Devestate_ (n=Devestat@72.34.82.226) |
| 12:41.05 | rtp | XorA: yeah :) |
| 12:41.22 | rtp | XorA: any hint on how to debug that ? |
| 12:41.57 | XorA | check what speed mp3 is trying to play at, and whether its stereo or not |
| 12:42.58 | rtp | XorA: 32kHz joint-stereo |
| 12:43.36 | SpeedEvil | Would a table of PRN/current doppler be of use? Elrond Dmitry_Platonov |
| 12:44.17 | *** join/#openmoko koen (n=koen@dominion.kabel.utwente.nl) |
| 12:46.51 | XorA | rtp: I notice that 32000 is missing in neo1973_wm8753.c |
| 12:48.27 | *** join/#openmoko meandtheshell (n=markus@85.127.104.34) |
| 12:49.12 | CIA-24 | openmoko: 03shoragan * r2384 10/trunk/oe/packages/coreutils/ (10 files in 2 dirs): Pull from current OE to fix name conflict with current glibc (futimens). |
| 12:49.52 | Dmitry_Platonov | SpeedEvil, _current_? Right now? For wich point? |
| 12:50.18 | rtp | XorA: interesting :) |
| 12:52.02 | Shoragan | rtp, do you have 2.6.23-rc1 running on your neo? |
| 12:52.19 | SpeedEvil | Dmitry_Platonov: I'm just working out how to get xephem to spit out a nice data table |
| 12:52.57 | SpeedEvil | It could be some time into the past - but will degrade after some time due to orbital uncertainties. should be accurate over many months though. |
| 12:53.24 | rtp | Shoragan: yeah even if it's a git pull made 1 days before -rc1 :) |
| 12:53.45 | *** part/#openmoko DukeOfURL_ (n=chatzill@introspect.com) |
| 12:53.48 | Shoragan | you've ported all the patches? |
| 12:53.55 | XorA | rtp: I dont think we can do 32K |
| 12:54.04 | XorA | rtp: well not without plkaying with pll frequencies |
| 12:54.12 | XorA | rtp: as there is no dvide by six |
| 12:55.16 | Dmitry_Platonov | well, I have archive of rinex ephemerides. and some sp3, too. Do you know what programs accept such data? |
| 12:55.41 | SpeedEvil | Dunno. |
| 12:56.05 | SpeedEvil | I know I can get reasonable results from xephem though and the published TLEs. |
| 12:57.35 | rtp | XorA: ok. Maybe the defaults sounds should be changed then :) |
| 12:57.37 | Dmitry_Platonov | I have algorithms which will integrate ephemeris, but no simple program which will read files and spit out data. |
| 12:58.23 | Shoragan | rtp, i've just ported most patches (except alsa/soc) to 2.6.22, is your work published somewhere? |
| 12:58.27 | SpeedEvil | I knew how to do this - just remembering the way through the interface. |
| 12:59.11 | XorA | rtp: although 32K works on 2.6.21.6 |
| 12:59.43 | *** join/#openmoko tnb (n=tnb@sdgsystems.net) |
| 12:59.46 | XorA | rtp: damnation, Ill bet this is just a bug in what I do/dont reject at certain levels in driver |
| 13:00.25 | rtp | Shoragan: see PV |
| 13:00.31 | rtp | XorA: doh :( |
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| 13:08.24 | *** join/#openmoko radiorental (n=pauricoc@ip-151-104-122-52.corp.ne.3com.com) |
| 13:09.36 | SpeedEvil | Okaaay - that now calculates and tracks the sats properly - according to my GPS all the right birds are up. |
| 13:09.52 | SpeedEvil | Now to work out how to get it to output this data |
| 13:10.28 | XorA | rtp: you have discovered bad range checking on my part, trust me to use someone elses code :-) |
| 13:11.08 | *** join/#openmoko jserv2 (n=jserv@linux3.cc.ntu.edu.tw) |
| 13:11.59 | Shoragan | rtp, we should try to avoid this duplicate work in the future ;) |
| 13:12.04 | SpeedEvil | Ok - got it |
| 13:12.14 | rtp | XorA: ok :) |
| 13:13.08 | squalyl | OK, finally I get an openmoko-devel-image, libgsmd does not compile with bb 1.8 but everything is OK with bb 1.6.9 |
| 13:13.18 | squalyl | no need to delete anything, resume worked |
| 13:13.27 | rtp | Shoragan: I don't know how we can do that but I agree with this idea :) |
| 13:13.33 | XorA | rtp: but the codec cant really do 32K so 2.6.23 gets it right |
| 13:13.44 | Shoragan | announce it on the devel list |
| 13:13.45 | XorA | rtp: unfortunealty I think by luck |
| 13:13.48 | *** join/#openmoko openfanss (n=df@218.79.146.16) |
| 13:14.13 | ScaredyCat | SpeedEvil: can we get the equivalent of GPZDA out of the gps ? |
| 13:14.59 | rtp | Shoragan: iirc I did it long time ago on the openmoko-kernel ml |
| 13:15.25 | SpeedEvil | ScaredyCat: pretty much. |
| 13:15.26 | rtp | XorA: hm. So it's working on 2.6.21 even if the hardware can't do it ? |
| 13:15.40 | Shoragan | ah, ok, so its my fault :/ |
| 13:15.49 | SpeedEvil | ScaredyCat: sample line for me |
| 13:16.13 | Dmitry_Platonov | ScaredyCat, what is GPZDA? |
| 13:16.42 | ScaredyCat | http://www.werple.net.au/~gnb/gps/nmea.html#gpzda |
| 13:16.43 | rtp | Shoragan: you must check on the mailing list if I really did it before saying that. :) Don't also forget I'm not using linus tree as basis |
| 13:16.45 | SpeedEvil | ScaredyCat : GPS BIIA-12 (PRN 25) sub lat -5:52:27 Sub long -105:09:12 Range 28573 range m/s 518 |
| 13:17.04 | SpeedEvil | That's for a satellite just under the horison, and moving towards me at 518m/s. |
| 13:17.16 | ewon | nice |
| 13:17.24 | Shoragan | rtp, yes, but most changes are the same |
| 13:17.25 | Elrond | SpeedEvil - Where did you get that data? |
| 13:17.26 | ScaredyCat | :D |
| 13:17.38 | Elrond | Ahh, probably heavens-above. ;) |
| 13:17.39 | SpeedEvil | Elrond: pushing two line elements into xephem |
| 13:17.46 | Elrond | SpeedEvil - Ahh. |
| 13:18.12 | SpeedEvil | I'm now working out how to get it to push out a nice table of alt/az/range-rate for a given location over a range of times |
| 13:18.33 | XorA | rtp: I guess looking at my bad code it runs at 48K |
| 13:21.11 | Dmitry_Platonov | Elrond, does my explanation in list makes any sense? |
| 13:22.00 | Elrond | Dmitry_Platonov - Somewhat. I never looked at reg b, so I can't say. |
| 13:22.28 | *** join/#openmoko jsgotangco (n=jsg123@ubuntu/member/jsgotangco) |
| 13:23.13 | rtp | XorA: ok |
| 13:24.57 | *** join/#openmoko gdiebel (n=gdiebel@adsl-69-217-146-185.dsl.mdsnwi.ameritech.net) |
| 13:25.12 | rtp | Shoragan: yeah, probably :) |
| 13:25.13 | *** join/#openmoko kuyky (n=kuyky@85.138.202.113) |
| 13:25.29 | rtp | Shoragan: btw, you're in charge of the kernel now ? |
| 13:25.48 | *** join/#openmoko kusileuka (n=cyphi@a91-153-116-247.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 13:26.10 | Shoragan | rtp, not really, but i told mickey i would try to port it to 2.6.22 and he told me to go ahead |
| 13:30.22 | rtp | Shoragan: ok :) |
| 13:31.18 | *** join/#openmoko Chairboy_ (n=chatzill@c-24-22-81-82.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) |
| 13:31.41 | Dmitry_Platonov | Elrond, did you experiment with bytes other than CMD23-L of REG 03? |
| 13:31.50 | *** join/#openmoko Chairboy_ (n=chatzill@c-24-22-81-82.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) |
| 13:32.11 | Elrond | Dmitry_Platonov - No. I only tried the CMD23-L and reg5/6. |
| 13:32.46 | *** part/#openmoko Cyphi^ (n=cyphi@a91-153-116-247.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
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| 13:43.48 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Talk:Supported_microSD_cards]] [[User:TimoJyrinki]] [[Talk:Building_a_hello_world_application]] [[FAQ]] [[OpenMoko_under_QEMU]] |
| 13:44.37 | duffyd | hi is anyone here from Openmoko internal? |
| 13:44.54 | duffyd | just wondering if my YES_I_DO message was received or not (starting to worry a little) |
| 13:45.40 | ynezz | you're not alone if it helps :p |
| 13:46.53 | duffyd | ynezz: thanks :-) |
| 13:47.39 | Kero | definitely not alone....... |
| 13:47.46 | ynezz | you might hit some shippingzilla bug and so your email might ended in /dev/null or similar destination... |
| 13:48.50 | duffyd | ynezz: thanks for the confidence boost ;-) |
| 13:49.13 | ynezz | you should try to read some thread about shipping on community list |
| 13:49.16 | ynezz | it's fun :) |
| 13:49.55 | *** join/#openmoko empty_mind (n=orion@59.176.111.177) |
| 13:50.02 | Kero | random order shipping. but noone knows the rationale behind the sequence... |
| 13:50.04 | sannes | I think they should have added a response when you send yes_i_do back .. |
| 13:50.30 | ynezz | or at least they should try to answer some questions on that lists |
| 13:50.38 | ynezz | s/lists/list/ |
| 13:51.05 | ynezz | now it seems, that nobody care |
| 13:51.10 | sannes | Kero: maybe the order is the order of which they received the yes_i_do .. :P |
| 13:51.35 | Kero | maybe. I doubt it. |
| 13:52.22 | ynezz | me too |
| 13:53.58 | sannes | Anyways, got my payment received e-mail atleast :) |
| 13:54.03 | *** join/#openmoko pvanhoof (n=pvanhoof@d54C0EE14.access.telenet.be) |
| 13:54.05 | Kero | I sent two emails in response to the original order. one of them somewhat unusual (no response whatsoever to that, tho). Perhaps that defers my order? To which position? 501? 1001? why? |
| 13:56.27 | ynezz | what's your # ? |
| 13:56.44 | duffyd | sannes: +100 |
| 13:57.12 | sannes | duffyd: ? |
| 13:57.32 | duffyd | sannes: that was a delayed response to your comment re. receiving a response to the YES_I_DO email |
| 13:57.41 | duffyd | sorry bit distracted over here :-) |
| 13:58.34 | sannes | #1848 was my order number :) |
| 13:58.40 | sannes | duffyd: ah :) |
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| 14:00.26 | *** join/#openmoko bassinboy (n=yep@c-76-31-13-187.hsd1.tx.comcast.net) |
| 14:00.35 | bassinboy | is there any open moko forums ? |
| 14:00.52 | ynezz | s/forums/lists/ |
| 14:00.53 | ynezz | yes |
| 14:01.00 | duffyd | bassinboy: you should have a look through the community mailing list re. this |
| 14:01.06 | duffyd | bassinboy: it has been a hot topic recently! |
| 14:01.26 | *** join/#openmoko ozarka (n=elineber@12.106.220.2) |
| 14:02.01 | *** join/#openmoko jfreels (n=jfreels@server2k3.terragotech.com) |
| 14:02.06 | *** join/#openmoko drath_ (i=vmaster@p5B07CC31.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 14:02.14 | bassinboy | duffyd: Odd, i am on the mailing list |
| 14:02.15 | jfreels | now it's really messed up |
| 14:02.41 | duffyd | bassinboy: oh, strange you didn't see the thread - it's bit! |
| 14:02.54 | duffyd | the 'Community Mailing List' |
| 14:03.00 | jfreels | anyone have their phone where they can't screen to it? |
| 14:03.02 | duffyd | s/bit/big |
| 14:03.14 | bassinboy | i'll get on that one :) |
| 14:03.21 | duffyd | cool |
| 14:05.30 | *** join/#openmoko cheesy (n=daniel@pd95b5e66.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 14:06.01 | Kero | *mumble* forum *mumble* |
| 14:06.21 | *** join/#openmoko Tyrael (n=tyrael@213-140-6-114.ip.fastwebnet.it) |
| 14:06.30 | bassinboy | :P ..... forums are much better than lists ;) |
| 14:06.47 | Kero | If people write applications for my Neo that are just as bad as forums, from usability point of view, our freedom will give us a lot of bad applications.... |
| 14:07.13 | Ycros | there are a multitude of bad applications out there already |
| 14:07.17 | Ycros | why would this be any different? |
| 14:07.28 | Tyrael | Hi, it's Monday morning at Fic in California right? |
| 14:07.46 | Kero | Ycros: excellent point. That's why I'll have to help |
| 14:07.57 | ScaredyCat | did openmoko get removed from the funambol 'community partners' list ? |
| 14:08.27 | Kero | but meanwhile, I'd better shut up about forums, 'coz I simply do not understand what people like about them. |
| 14:10.03 | guaqua | forums are bad |
| 14:10.05 | ScaredyCat | :o |
| 14:10.08 | Bricked_Neo1973 | mmmkay |
| 14:10.12 | juco | I'm going to a conference in Raleigh North Carolina (US), on August 4th, and I'm wondering if there is any chance of having a Neo 1973 there |
| 14:10.20 | ScaredyCat | Bricked_Neo1973: !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1 |
| 14:10.26 | Bricked_Neo1973 | yo! |
| 14:10.26 | juco | I have one on order, but I'm #2903 |
| 14:10.27 | ScaredyCat | you broke it |
| 14:10.37 | guaqua | lists are not the best thing in the world either...people try to use them as a chatting medium - and that's what irc is for |
| 14:10.40 | ewon | wtf |
| 14:10.43 | Bricked_Neo1973 | their latest rootfs broke it |
| 14:10.55 | ScaredyCat | :/ |
| 14:11.09 | Bricked_Neo1973 | threw it on there and now I can't screen to the device |
| 14:11.24 | *** part/#openmoko bassinboy (n=yep@c-76-31-13-187.hsd1.tx.comcast.net) |
| 14:11.29 | Ycros | I've seen google groups attached to mailing lists |
| 14:11.36 | Ycros | they provide a sort of forumish interface to them |
| 14:12.10 | Bricked_Neo1973 | any ideas? |
| 14:12.54 | bmidgley | install an older rootfs? |
| 14:13.10 | writchie | juco, what kind of conference |
| 14:13.11 | *** join/#openmoko mindCrime (n=chatzill@66.83.208.219.nw.nuvox.net) |
| 14:13.22 | Bricked_Neo1973 | no, it was new |
| 14:13.53 | Bricked_Neo1973 | at least I think so...I flashed the u-boot and uImage also...but everything worked fine after that |
| 14:13.54 | bmidgley | I mean you could try an older rootfs... they may have regressed something |
| 14:14.09 | Bricked_Neo1973 | it's when I did the rootfs when things took a turn for the worse |
| 14:14.17 | Bricked_Neo1973 | but I can't screen into the device anymore |
| 14:14.20 | bmidgley | don't flash u-boot unless you know you need to |
| 14:14.31 | bmidgley | that's one way people really do brick the thing |
| 14:14.33 | duffyd | ScaredyCat: I'm hoping my Kubuntu 6.10 install will support the Qemu image :-( |
| 14:14.43 | Bricked_Neo1973 | I flashed that last week, everything was fine |
| 14:14.53 | Elrond | Bricked_Neo1973 - Does it still get into the menu mode when you hold the AUX button while powering on? |
| 14:15.12 | SpeedEvil | Elrond: Argh - xephem bug with many-element tables. Downloading/compiling new version - |
| 14:15.29 | Bricked_Neo1973 | Elrond: yes, but I don't have as many choices |
| 14:15.32 | *** join/#openmoko dtx (n=dtx@cdf-imaging.com) |
| 14:15.32 | mokobot | Hey, it's Bill Gates' lover boy |
| 14:15.54 | dtx | haha |
| 14:15.56 | dtx | wow |
| 14:17.31 | Bricked_Neo1973 | when I try and screen to it, it appears that it connects fine...but I just sit there at a blank screen. If I turn the phone off, it dumps me out of screen |
| 14:17.40 | Bricked_Neo1973 | almost like the phone is busy doing something |
| 14:18.10 | *** part/#openmoko Arumnus_ (n=Moray@67-135-71-242.dia.static.qwest.net) |
| 14:18.20 | *** join/#openmoko Sublime (n=Sublime@ip70-162-246-65.ph.ph.cox.net) |
| 14:18.25 | XorA | the phrase "screen to it" is breaking my comprehension filters |
| 14:18.39 | *** part/#openmoko dtx (n=dtx@cdf-imaging.com) |
| 14:18.43 | *** join/#openmoko dtx (n=dtx@cdf-imaging.com) |
| 14:18.43 | mokobot | Please don't let this man torture me. |
| 14:18.44 | Elrond | XorA - Same for me. |
| 14:18.52 | dtx | There we go |
| 14:18.57 | Bricked_Neo1973 | sorry, "screen" to the device?!? wtf should I say? |
| 14:19.01 | Bricked_Neo1973 | terminal |
| 14:19.06 | Bricked_Neo1973 | whatever, you should know what I mean anyway |
| 14:19.12 | XorA | ssh? minicom? picocom? |
| 14:19.17 | Elrond | Bricked_Neo1973 - ssh? minicom? picocom? |
| 14:19.20 | guaqua | and you have ordered a neo? |
| 14:19.34 | Elrond | XorA - Heh, you stole my question! |
| 14:19.36 | Elrond | ;o) |
| 14:19.44 | XorA | heh heh |
| 14:19.48 | Bricked_Neo1973 | directed towards me? |
| 14:19.53 | XorA | Bricked_Neo1973: yes |
| 14:19.54 | writchie | juco, you asked about a neo, i have two coming in (charged) - might be able to make this |
| 14:20.02 | Elrond | Bricked_Neo1973 - ssh? minicom? picocom? |
| 14:20.08 | *** join/#openmoko jpozlovsky (n=jindra@rb5cc115.net.upc.cz) |
| 14:20.25 | Bricked_Neo1973 | wtf? sure, i'll try using another terminal program |
| 14:20.39 | Elrond | Bricked_Neo1973 - Which one are you using currently? |
| 14:21.16 | Bricked_Neo1973 | i use SCREEN SCREEN....do i need to say it again? |
| 14:21.35 | Dmitry_Platonov | oh |
| 14:21.41 | Elrond | Bricked_Neo1973 - use picocom. |
| 14:21.53 | Elrond | Bricked_Neo1973 - And press <enter> once after connecting. |
| 14:22.16 | XorA | Bricked_Neo1973: screen is a terminal multiplexer, it has bugger all to do with talking to devices |
| 14:22.25 | Bricked_Neo1973 | uh...okay give me a bit |
| 14:22.38 | Elrond | XorA - I think, one can abuse screen as a serial terminal. ;o) |
| 14:22.43 | ynezz | screen can talk to serial |
| 14:22.52 | dtx | Can it? |
| 14:22.57 | ynezz | yes |
| 14:23.06 | writchie | juco: are you still there? |
| 14:23.10 | Elrond | dtx - Nobody except Bricked_Neo1973 and ynezz use it for that. ;o) |
| 14:23.32 | ynezz | google pls :) |
| 14:25.34 | *** part/#openmoko duffyd (n=tim@220-131-85-110.HINET-IP.hinet.net) |
| 14:25.39 | Elrond | ynezz - google does not like me. Years ago it would have offered me "serial screen" on ebay ;o) Today it would probably just guve me "Amazon.de: Serial Television: Big Drama on the Small Screen ..." ;o) |
| 14:25.53 | ynezz | 'screen /dev/tty' for abuse report :) |
| 14:26.21 | XorA | this is kinda like using a tower crain to crack a nut |
| 14:26.28 | *** join/#openmoko Chairboy (n=chatzill@c-24-22-81-82.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) |
| 14:26.33 | Dmitry_Platonov | I like gtkterm (for cisco configuration, better than minicom. If you have X/Gtk). |
| 14:26.43 | ynezz | and you can save logs/sessions from picocom? |
| 14:27.15 | Elrond | ynezz - If I want logs/sessions, I'm using this serial daemon thingy. ;o) |
| 14:27.27 | squalyl | YAY openmoko functional on my qemu! |
| 14:27.34 | ynezz | well use what you want :) |
| 14:27.44 | Elrond | ynezz - Exactly. :-) |
| 14:27.44 | ynezz | i'll stay with cu/screen :) |
| 14:27.49 | squalyl | hum, where are the bottom images gone? |
| 14:27.50 | Bricked_Neo1973 | thank you! |
| 14:28.10 | Elrond | Bricked_Neo1973 - What's up now? |
| 14:28.15 | Bricked_Neo1973 | i'll try another since cu/screen isn't working for me...but I don't think another will work |
| 14:28.26 | Bricked_Neo1973 | sry, have a meeting in two mins...i'll be back to report |
| 14:28.36 | Elrond | Ahh, okay. |
| 14:29.46 | *** join/#openmoko zedstar (n=john@82-44-202-121.cable.ubr08.haye.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 14:31.08 | dtx | When you disconnect from serial and reconnect does it maintain the same state as before? |
| 14:31.21 | dtx | I've never connected to LInux through serial, obviously. |
| 14:32.00 | XorA | dtx: pretty much, but pulling the cable out tends to send duff characters, also a lot of the UART initialisation send duff chars as well |
| 14:33.05 | Elrond | dtx - the target keeps state. You terminal program might reset some state. |
| 14:33.13 | *** join/#openmoko RbdPngn (n=ningerso@uslink-66.173.44-135.uslink.net) |
| 14:33.21 | Elrond | XorA - Well, for usbserial, there shouldn't be any duff chars. :) |
| 14:33.24 | *** part/#openmoko zecke (n=ich@dsl-62-220-14-162.berlikomm.net) |
| 14:33.37 | XorA | Elrond: I hope not :-) |
| 14:33.37 | ynezz | usb is causing most problems to me |
| 14:33.47 | *** join/#openmoko VladoK (n=vlado@adsl-dyn38.91-127-103.t-com.sk) |
| 14:34.04 | ynezz | they seem to have big buffers |
| 14:34.18 | *** join/#openmoko PBeck (n=PBeck@HSI-KBW-091-089-102-236.hsi2.kabelbw.de) |
| 14:34.21 | Elrond | ynezz - u-boot via usbserial works mostly. Except for people pasting too much at once into it. ;o) |
| 14:34.28 | PBeck | hi |
| 14:34.30 | ynezz | and the packet nature of usb cause problems to some serial protocols like x-modem or so |
| 14:35.01 | ynezz | (it should be bad protocol implementation of course) |
| 14:35.11 | *** join/#openmoko bedboi (n=bedboi@c3lab.poliba.it) |
| 14:35.14 | bedboi | hi there |
| 14:35.23 | ynezz | but the problems don't happen without usb |
| 14:35.55 | Elrond | I wonder where Bricked_Neo1973 got his neo from. Are they already shipping neos? |
| 14:36.21 | ynezz | don't make such jokes pls :) |
| 14:36.50 | Elrond | Hmm? |
| 14:37.06 | ynezz | i mean about shipping |
| 14:37.06 | Elrond | I'm a bit outdated on the shipping status anyway. |
| 14:37.37 | ozarka | Bricked_Neo1973 used to be jfreels |
| 14:37.55 | ozarka | and he said that he got the device about a month ago |
| 14:38.04 | redgibson | <PROTECTED> |
| 14:38.55 | bedboi | wtf, choosing a health insurance (for USA) is one of the most exhausting experiences I had. |
| 14:39.01 | *** join/#openmoko RbdPngn_ (n=ningerso@uslink-66.173.44-135.uslink.net) |
| 14:39.17 | *** join/#openmoko Arumnus (n=Moray@67-135-71-242.dia.static.qwest.net) |
| 14:40.21 | grobian | Mrs Clinton will regulate that |
| 14:40.40 | ynezz | I'll vote Bart Simpson! |
| 14:40.49 | ynezz | bart > clinton |
| 14:40.59 | grobian | ^^ |
| 14:41.02 | mmazur | o. j. |
| 14:41.35 | ewon | bedboi: what does your health insurance cost you? |
| 14:41.56 | dtx | bedboi: are you a spambot? |
| 14:43.49 | bedboi | dtx: unfortunately not :( |
| 14:44.06 | juco | writchie: http://barcamp.org/BarCampRDU |
| 14:44.08 | juco | sorry about that |
| 14:44.16 | juco | I got pulled away |
| 14:44.28 | bedboi | ewon: i don't know i'm not american, i'm leaving for the States this summer (2 months on J-1 Visa) and I have to buy an health insurance |
| 14:46.07 | don-o | any news of UPS tracking codes? |
| 14:46.31 | *** join/#openmoko j_ack (n=j_ack@p508D8DA7.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 14:47.34 | *** join/#openmoko orospakr (n=orospakr@132.213.238.4) |
| 14:47.44 | Bricked_Neo1973 | ozarka: you are correct |
| 14:48.42 | *** join/#openmoko dtx (n=dtx@cdf-imaging.com) |
| 14:48.42 | mokobot | Please don't let this man torture me. |
| 14:49.12 | Bricked_Neo1973 | so I got minicom running, but then what? |
| 14:50.29 | squalyl | haha I control bitbake now :D I have built a custom package in my own overlay :D |
| 14:50.42 | squalyl | finally after 3 days of hard work... :D |
| 14:50.43 | dtx | Good job |
| 14:50.53 | dtx | Now put up a simplified tutorial on the wiki |
| 14:51.05 | grobian | yes plz |
| 14:51.05 | squalyl | Nice idea! |
| 14:52.13 | squalyl | But for now I will get back home ! |
| 14:52.31 | squalyl | bye everyone! |
| 14:52.35 | guillaum1 | squalyl, yeah a tutorial would be cool |
| 14:52.42 | guillaum1 | bye |
| 14:52.47 | squalyl | No problem, I will write that asap |
| 14:53.11 | squalyl | see you tomorrow or tonight |
| 14:53.17 | mintee | any new news on shipping? |
| 14:53.40 | Elrond | Bricked_Neo1973 - Press enter once after being connected. |
| 14:53.58 | Elrond | Bricked_Neo1973 - But anyway, if you get the menu, you should be able to update kernel/rootfs via DFU |
| 14:54.09 | Bricked_Neo1973 | yeah, DFU has never worked for me |
| 14:54.39 | *** join/#openmoko MacNorth (n=daijobu@c-75-71-250-33.hsd1.co.comcast.net) |
| 14:55.28 | dtx | I always thought bitbake recipes were fairly simple |
| 14:55.50 | Bricked_Neo1973 | let me try again since I have the new rootfs on there |
| 14:56.40 | Bricked_Neo1973 | gonna go smoke some crack, brb |
| 14:57.03 | *** join/#openmoko empty_mind_ (n=orion@59.176.111.177) |
| 14:57.17 | don-o | is the bricked neo a P1? |
| 14:58.18 | Elrond | don-o - I don't know. |
| 14:58.29 | Elrond | I'm happy with my P0. :) |
| 14:58.51 | dtx | p30n |
| 14:58.55 | don-o | Elrond: :) |
| 14:59.45 | XorA | rtp: what happends if you add 32000 to case statement in neo1973_wm8753 where 8k and 16k are defined? |
| 15:00.26 | XorA | rtp: I think the speed should work, just I didnt understand what part of codec driver did |
| 15:04.49 | *** join/#openmoko empty_mind (n=orion@59.176.111.177) |
| 15:06.47 | mintee | ...any new news on shipping? |
| 15:06.55 | mintee | it's the 23rd afterall |
| 15:07.52 | *** join/#openmoko Sup3rkiddo (n=sudharsh@unaffiliated/sudharsh) |
| 15:08.47 | *** part/#openmoko mdt (n=mdt@littlelun.emdete.de) |
| 15:08.48 | ozarka | mintee: I don't think anyone has received a Neo or a UPS tracking number. |
| 15:09.05 | XorA | summatusmentis: one plane white Neo1973 box, £100 |
| 15:09.11 | mintee | it's confirmed that they are going to send out a tracking number though? |
| 15:09.19 | summatusmentis | XorA: lol, YAY!!! |
| 15:09.38 | XorA | supllied with OpenMoko CD :-) |
| 15:09.40 | ferric | mintee: yes - from Sean's email |
| 15:10.26 | Bricked_Neo1973 | don-o: bricked neo is a GTA01B_V4, I believe that's P1 |
| 15:10.47 | ozarka | mintee: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Direct.openmoko.com_order_process |
| 15:10.52 | XorA | Bricked_Neo1973: you didnt flash u-boot did you? |
| 15:11.04 | ozarka | It says so in the wiki (UPS). |
| 15:11.13 | Bricked_Neo1973 | i did that last week....i didn't have any problems with that |
| 15:12.29 | Bricked_Neo1973 | rootfs is what i flashed today |
| 15:12.42 | *** join/#openmoko fiveplusone (n=six@cpe-66-65-15-60.nyc.res.rr.com) |
| 15:14.16 | mintee | thanks ozarka |
| 15:14.35 | ozarka | np |
| 15:16.24 | *** join/#openmoko SpeedEvil (n=root@tor/regular/SpeedEvil) |
| 15:17.59 | rtp | XorA: if it's like this : http://www.rtp-net.org/ipaq/neo1973_snd_32khz.patch, it doesn't work. Same error message :( |
| 15:20.32 | XorA | rtp: hmm, looks like Ill need to delve into that |
| 15:20.53 | XorA | rtp: is your .bb file anywhere I can get it so I can build a kernel and test tomorrow? |
| 15:20.55 | *** join/#openmoko zell1983 (n=zell1983@host197-122-dynamic.6-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 15:21.49 | *** join/#openmoko sunix (n=sunix@sunix.org) |
| 15:21.57 | *** join/#openmoko mmazur (i=mmazur@troll.linux.net.pl) |
| 15:22.35 | rtp | XorA: I don't use bb. I'm using directly a kernel tree :) |
| 15:22.55 | XorA | rtp: oh, how much of neo is in 2.6.23? |
| 15:24.30 | rtp | XorA: I've my own tree and patchset. iirc only the sound is the neo specific stuff merged mainline :) |
| 15:24.40 | *** join/#openmoko duffyd (n=tim@220-131-85-110.HINET-IP.hinet.net) |
| 15:26.27 | XorA | rtp: maybe you could publish you patchset, I can get the 2.6.23-rc1 from git |
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| 15:27.37 | *** join/#openmoko Sup3rkiddo (n=sudharsh@unaffiliated/sudharsh) |
| 15:28.00 | Kensan | rtp: do you have a git-repo that one can pull from? |
| 15:28.44 | *** join/#openmoko nop (n=nop@p54A0ACA9.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 15:28.54 | Shoragan | rtp: do you have an alsa soc patch for the neo based on 2.6.22? or just 2.6.23? |
| 15:28.58 | Shoragan | -rc1 |
| 15:29.03 | *** join/#openmoko mikesh (n=mikesh@x133.net.upc.cz) |
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| 15:29.17 | XorA | Shoragan: alsa-soc for neo is in alsa-kernel repo |
| 15:29.29 | XorA | Shoragan: I pushed it to alsa-project.org a month ago or so |
| 15:29.52 | rtp | XorA: for the kernel : git://git.rtp-net.org/h1940.git and git://git.rtp-net.org/h1940-wip.git#neo for the neo specific part |
| 15:29.55 | Shoragan | i can't figure out how to extract a patch from that |
| 15:30.17 | *** join/#openmoko jannu (n=jannu@hoas-fe3cdd00-15.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 15:30.34 | *** join/#openmoko koen (n=koen@dominion.kabel.utwente.nl) |
| 15:30.34 | XorA | Shoragan: just check out repo, replace the files, do a diff |
| 15:30.42 | rtp | Shoragan: for 23-rc1 you don't need any asoc patch and before it was against 2.6.21 |
| 15:31.28 | XorA | Shoragan: then shout at me when they fail |
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| 15:34.21 | *** join/#openmoko ewanm89 (n=ewanm89@host81-159-254-36.range81-159.btcentralplus.com) |
| 15:34.41 | XorA | rtp: I shall try and debug that problem tomorrow morning |
| 15:35.07 | rtp | XorA: thanks :) |
| 15:35.17 | *** join/#openmoko linux-bastler (n=linux-ba@p5B12D8BF.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 15:35.24 | XorA | rtp: Im figuring its probably a simple thinko |
| 15:36.07 | *** join/#openmoko empty_mind (n=orion@59.176.111.177) |
| 15:36.07 | ewanm89_laptop | ScaredyCat: ping |
| 15:36.13 | ScaredyCat | pong |
| 15:36.29 | rtp | XorA: I'll probably also upload a patchset to get quicker download :) |
| 15:36.38 | ewanm89_laptop | ScaredyCat: I didn't have to turn mokobot off as I thought I would :) |
| 15:37.08 | *** join/#openmoko harzi_ (n=dani@84-73-140-176.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 15:37.16 | ScaredyCat | hehehe |
| 15:37.54 | ScaredyCat | not the diff :) |
| 15:38.06 | ScaredyCat | 650km commute this morning |
| 15:38.55 | ewanm89_laptop | ScaredyCat: What's that in miles? |
| 15:39.14 | ewon | what's a good name for a room with a pool table in it |
| 15:39.25 | ewanm89_laptop | games room? |
| 15:39.32 | *** part/#openmoko friedel (n=fwolff@dsl-242-217-191.telkomadsl.co.za) |
| 15:39.36 | ScaredyCat | about 410 or so |
| 15:39.39 | don-o | the parlour |
| 15:40.01 | *** part/#openmoko sunix (n=sunix@sunix.org) |
| 15:40.31 | ewanm89_laptop | ScaredyCat: 403.89127 |
| 15:41.36 | *** join/#openmoko empty_mind_ (n=orion@59.176.111.177) |
| 15:41.50 | *** join/#openmoko wolog (n=wolog@82.251.185.243) |
| 15:43.43 | Shoragan | rtp: did you port s3c2410_udc.patch? |
| 15:44.01 | ScaredyCat | ewanm89_laptop: give or take a detour or 2 ;) |
| 15:44.13 | ewanm89_laptop | lol |
| 15:44.28 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Main_Page/de]] [[User:Aevin]] [[Buying_Interest_List]] [[Finger_Scrolling]] [[Talk:P1_Owners]] [[Introduction/de]] [[User_talk:Aevin]] [[Main_Page/fr]] [[Neo1973_Hardware/de]] [[P1_Owners]] [[User:Secureoffice]] [[User_talk:Secureoffice]] and other changes |
| 15:47.13 | *** join/#openmoko jannu (n=jannu@hoas-fe3cdd00-15.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 15:48.45 | rtp | Shoragan: I never needed it :) If you want a patch, take it from there : http://git.kernel.org/?p=linux/kernel/git/torvalds/linux-2.6.git;a=commit;h=3fc154b6b8134b98bb94d60cad9a46ec1ffbe372 |
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| 15:53.44 | CIA-24 | openmoko: 03laforge * r2385 10/trunk/src/target/kernel/patches/gta01-jbt6k74.patch: Fix jbt6k74 resume: we need to enable display after entering normal state (Arnaud Patard) |
| 15:56.09 | ScaredyCat | clim.... is that some sort of disease |
| 15:56.10 | ScaredyCat | ? |
| 15:56.16 | ewon | heh |
| 15:56.28 | unknown_lamer | common lisp interface manager |
| 15:56.41 | unknown_lamer | not quite as nice as the dylan uim, but close (given that it was the predecessor) |
| 15:57.50 | Sup3rkiddo | ~lart fate |
| 15:57.50 | apt | flings poo at fate |
| 15:58.07 | ewon | the suspense would kill me : |
| 15:58.09 | ewon | :) |
| 15:58.22 | ScaredyCat | so it is some sort of disease then... |
| 15:58.34 | ewon | lol |
| 15:58.37 | unknown_lamer | ScaredyCat: how so? |
| 15:58.56 | *** join/#openmoko Freed (n=jecsar@mac33-2-82-225-98-209.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 15:59.26 | ScaredyCat | the common list interface technologies |
| 15:59.46 | unknown_lamer | huh? |
| 16:03.58 | *** join/#openmoko ewanm89 (n=ewanm89@host81-159-254-36.range81-159.btcentralplus.com) |
| 16:04.33 | *** join/#openmoko empty_mind (n=orion@59.176.111.177) |
| 16:08.45 | empty_mind | counter |
| 16:08.45 | aloril | (last update 2007-07-21 06:20) http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter : Order https://direct.openmoko.com/ ; Shipping prob. 75% in 2 days 09:55:37 (2.414±2.4 days) (1771;250) |
| 16:11.58 | *** join/#openmoko gabaug (n=gabe@c-67-167-90-105.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 16:12.06 | *** part/#openmoko jsmanrique (n=jsmanriq@cme-staticIP-212-89-8-169.telecable.es) |
| 16:14.06 | *** join/#openmoko babble (n=babble@36.sub-75-197-148.myvzw.com) |
| 16:15.06 | babble | anyone home? |
| 16:15.06 | aloril | babble: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) (Hopefully this link answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) |
| 16:15.23 | *** join/#openmoko kuyky (n=kuyky@85.138.202.113) |
| 16:16.12 | *** part/#openmoko VladoK (n=vlado@adsl-dyn38.91-127-103.t-com.sk) |
| 16:16.23 | ferric | what's up babble |
| 16:16.33 | empty_mind | once we waited for neo to start shipping, now we wait for neo to be shipped. Alas! |
| 16:17.03 | babble | sup |
| 16:18.22 | Kero | bwahaha, on the ML: "Did it arrive ? Yes!?! Aaaaaargh." (dies anyway). |
| 16:18.28 | babble | at work.. they've got irc locked out.. so I bust out the Treo and found an irc client... very much looking forward to an alternative to this Treo |
| 16:20.02 | empty_mind | what is the email id of sean ? |
| 16:20.06 | babble | does anyone know what US carriers are available for the Neo? |
| 16:20.47 | *** join/#openmoko DukeOfURL (n=chatzill@166.129.83.204) |
| 16:21.12 | mwester | babble: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki |
| 16:21.16 | don-o | babble: any carrier that supports GSM |
| 16:22.03 | ozarka | Which at least includes TMO and ATT. |
| 16:22.07 | *** part/#openmoko Freed (n=jecsar@mac33-2-82-225-98-209.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 16:22.37 | *** join/#openmoko chris^ (n=kraetzi@p548AD7AA.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 16:24.13 | babble | thanks |
| 16:24.26 | *** join/#openmoko jpozlovsky (n=jindra@rb5cc115.net.upc.cz) |
| 16:24.29 | babble | was looking there but not for the correct words |
| 16:24.54 | *** join/#openmoko rob_w (n=bob@M8355.m.pppool.de) |
| 16:24.59 | *** join/#openmoko bkuhn (i=bkuhn@sflc/staff/conservancy.president.bkuhn) |
| 16:25.27 | ozarka | babble: You need to read the entire wiki. |
| 16:25.32 | ozarka | Several times. |
| 16:25.43 | ozarka | There will be a pop quiz later in the week. :-) |
| 16:26.18 | *** join/#openmoko empty_mind_ (n=orion@59.176.111.177) |
| 16:26.21 | babble | grin |
| 16:27.32 | *** join/#openmoko MDK (n=mdk@cs181222091.pp.htv.fi) |
| 16:29.46 | *** join/#openmoko tnb (n=tnb@sdgsystems.net) |
| 16:29.47 | ferric | oh, and if you fail - you don't get a neo. |
| 16:31.47 | ozarka | But you can earn extra credit by typing "Anybody get their Neo yet?" in this room. |
| 16:32.12 | phrozen77 | lol |
| 16:32.31 | babble | anybody break their Treo yet? |
| 16:33.40 | *** join/#openmoko chouse (n=chadh@142.163.211.34) |
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| 16:34.59 | *** part/#openmoko guillaum1 (n=gzba4143@AMontsouris-153-1-85-246.w90-2.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 16:35.09 | *** join/#openmoko Kensan (n=ken@gw.ptr-80-238-206-248.customer.ch.netstream.com) |
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| 16:44.06 | empty_mind | looks like orders are sent at random and not by order number received at the time of order placement |
| 16:46.03 | *** join/#openmoko empty_mind__ (n=matrix@59.176.111.177) |
| 16:51.32 | *** join/#openmoko senikk (n=senikk@178.84-48-47.nextgentel.com) |
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| 16:56.49 | *** join/#openmoko empty_mind__ (n=matrix@59.176.111.177) |
| 16:57.17 | kristian-m | anyone else having that problem with MokoMakefile? http://nopaste.eof.name/182 |
| 16:57.18 | *** join/#openmoko n0on3 (n=n0on3@81-208-83-247.fastres.net) |
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| 16:59.49 | DukeOfURL | does anyone know the status of the Funambol collaboration? |
| 17:01.44 | ScaredyCat | I asked that on the list :) |
| 17:01.51 | ScaredyCat | noticed the logo had gone |
| 17:02.10 | hhf423 | and one more: will openmoko.com mail out UPS tracking codes, does anyone know? |
| 17:02.10 | aloril | hhf423: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) (Hopefully this link answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) |
| 17:02.37 | ScaredyCat | ~lart aloril |
| 17:02.37 | apt | gives aloril a "free" copy of Windows and then charges double for "Upgrades" |
| 17:02.41 | grobian | does the neo1973 fulfilled the german EMV norm ? |
| 17:03.12 | ynezz | hhf423: yes, when they hand it over to ups |
| 17:03.13 | *** join/#openmoko empty_mind__ (n=matrix@59.176.111.177) |
| 17:03.24 | ynezz | (I guess) |
| 17:03.38 | hhf423 | ynezz: you hope :-) |
| 17:03.42 | ScaredyCat | s/when/if they ever/ |
| 17:04.07 | hhf423 | grobian: who cares? ;-) |
| 17:04.24 | ScaredyCat | 15:30 seems to be ups cut off each day |
| 17:04.29 | grobian | i do XD |
| 17:05.26 | calamous__ | Anyone know of any tracking numbers? |
| 17:05.57 | *** part/#openmoko Sublime (n=Sublime@ip70-162-246-65.ph.ph.cox.net) |
| 17:05.58 | grobian | we in germany care about nature an maybe use some energy saving lamp |
| 17:06.08 | kristian-m | grobian good question - it does feature the CC-label though |
| 17:06.09 | ScaredyCat | hippy |
| 17:06.11 | ScaredyCat | ;) |
| 17:06.28 | grobian | it could intefear |
| 17:06.32 | *** join/#openmoko Skwid_ (n=Skwid@adsl-75-36-44-15.dsl.sndg02.sbcglobal.net) |
| 17:06.54 | Shoragan | kristian-m, it should fall back to pulling the patches from svn... |
| 17:07.31 | kristian-m | Shoragan it does, still should'n happen, right? |
| 17:07.46 | Kensan | kristian-m: what command did you issue? the kernel patch-set it tries to download is not where it is looking. |
| 17:08.16 | Shoragan | the buildhost hasn't built the new kernel yet, so there is no svn-snapshot |
| 17:08.28 | hhf423 | doh, I am annoyed as I can not see if _my_ credit card already got charged or not |
| 17:08.59 | Shoragan | kristian-m, this is just how bitbake works :) |
| 17:09.06 | SpeedEvil | Just spent >an hour trying to chase down an obscure bug in the xephem source, to generate GPS info. |
| 17:09.31 | SpeedEvil | Turns out I misspelled favorite. |
| 17:09.47 | grobian | CC-lable ok |
| 17:10.04 | SpeedEvil | ~p1 |
| 17:10.04 | *** part/#openmoko Skwid_ (n=Skwid@adsl-75-36-44-15.dsl.sndg02.sbcglobal.net) |
| 17:10.37 | grobian | you mean CE ? |
| 17:10.44 | *** join/#openmoko calamous__ (n=harry@c-67-175-201-140.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 17:11.10 | ynezz | it's rohs, enough... |
| 17:11.17 | kristian-m | Kensan i did a make update-makefile ; make update ; make setup and then make openmoko-devel-image |
| 17:11.47 | SpeedEvil | CE label. |
| 17:14.58 | *** join/#openmoko PBeck (n=PBeck@HSI-KBW-091-089-102-236.hsi2.kabelbw.de) |
| 17:16.31 | *** join/#openmoko Mandarino (n=Mandarin@153.pool85-50-115.dynamic.orange.es) |
| 17:17.18 | hhf423 | grobian: your question is answered in the FAQ |
| 17:17.40 | hhf423 | there is FCC and CE certification |
| 17:17.53 | grobian | thank you |
| 17:18.03 | grobian | CE is fine ! |
| 17:19.03 | *** join/#openmoko empty_mind__ (n=matrix@59.176.111.177) |
| 17:19.55 | kristian-m | grobian any plans to re sell the phone in de? |
| 17:20.23 | grobian | yes ! |
| 17:20.26 | grobian | :) |
| 17:20.41 | grobian | no just kidding |
| 17:21.02 | *** join/#openmoko ewanm89 (n=ewanm89@host86-151-100-255.range86-151.btcentralplus.com) |
| 17:22.18 | hhf423 | I am sure that someone will re-sell the phones in .de. But probably not the developer version. |
| 17:22.38 | hhf423 | gawd, I hate waiting |
| 17:23.10 | grobian | could be a success selling it in germany |
| 17:23.35 | hhf423 | probably, the first ones will be available via ebay :-) |
| 17:23.57 | hhf423 | but at the moment there is nothing |
| 17:25.28 | kristian-m | well I guess som people will take it as development platform for some strange embedded-do-something-and-transmit-mobile-buzz-project and re-sell the think for twice the price or more... |
| 17:25.47 | Bricked_Neo1973 | so i got picocom running and it says |
| 17:25.48 | grobian | yes |
| 17:25.53 | *** join/#openmoko orospakr (n=orospakr@132.213.238.4) |
| 17:26.00 | Bricked_Neo1973 | Terminal ready, but I can't do anything else |
| 17:26.05 | grobian | maybe for some crypt phone or something like that |
| 17:26.19 | sandos | kristian-m: doesnt really matter, does it? If they dont sell the HW at a loss... |
| 17:26.24 | kristian-m | Bricked_Neo1973 try to disable flow controll |
| 17:26.27 | *** join/#openmoko orospakr (n=orospakr@132.213.238.4) |
| 17:26.29 | Bricked_Neo1973 | okay |
| 17:26.42 | Bricked_Neo1973 | it is dissabled |
| 17:26.51 | kristian-m | sandos i hope so :) |
| 17:27.12 | Bricked_Neo1973 | still nothing (just to update you, updated rootfs this morning and now I can't terminal into the phone) |
| 17:27.23 | SpeedEvil | Have there been any indications that anything at all has shipped? I guess if the payment confirmed rate on P1_owners is reflective of the mass, then you're looking at something like 600 orders being charged. |
| 17:27.27 | kristian-m | Bricked_Neo1973 you try to communicate to the device or to QEMU? |
| 17:27.39 | Bricked_Neo1973 | device |
| 17:28.19 | *** join/#openmoko wrzecu (n=cel@86.59.65.236) |
| 17:28.40 | kristian-m | Bricked_Neo1973 through usb-serial? |
| 17:28.43 | Bricked_Neo1973 | yes |
| 17:28.52 | *** join/#openmoko ckuethe (n=ckuethe@desdemona.cns.ualberta.ca) |
| 17:28.56 | Bricked_Neo1973 | sorry, I have a surprise meeting here at work...bblw |
| 17:29.06 | *** join/#openmoko orospakr (n=orospakr@132.213.238.4) |
| 17:29.32 | *** join/#openmoko yerga (n=yerga@87.223.216.236) |
| 17:29.36 | kristian-m | Bricked_Neo1973 hmm no clue - bitrate comes to mind - minicom, screen, ... |
| 17:38.35 | *** join/#openmoko mokobot (n=ewanm89@host86-151-100-255.range86-151.btcentralplus.com) |
| 17:40.52 | *** join/#openmoko Skwid_ (n=Skwid@adsl-75-36-44-15.dsl.sndg02.sbcglobal.net) |
| 17:42.14 | *** part/#openmoko Skwid_ (n=Skwid@adsl-75-36-44-15.dsl.sndg02.sbcglobal.net) |
| 17:42.19 | calamous__ | I resorted the P1_Owners page with the magic of sed and sort so nows it by order number. Do you think thats good or I should put it back? |
| 17:43.15 | *** join/#openmoko daMaestro (n=jon@fedora/damaestro) |
| 17:43.48 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Create_a_package_from_existing_sources]] [[P1_Owners]] [[FAQ/fr]] [[Reader]] [[Web_Browser]] [[Development_resources/fr]] [[Main_Page/fr]] [[Look_%26_Feel/fr]] [[Look_%26_Feel]] [[IM]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Norway]] [[IPhone/fr]] and other changes |
| 17:44.06 | writchie | i like it |
| 17:44.23 | *** join/#openmoko Skuff (n=michael@i3ED6EFC7.versanet.de) |
| 17:44.26 | ckuethe | i like it |
| 17:44.42 | don-o | i like it |
| 17:45.52 | *** join/#openmoko Any_Key (n=Any_Key@rt94.highlink.ru) |
| 17:47.38 | abraxa_ | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Hear_Me_FIC - I wonder what that's supposed to be... isn't that just pointless spam? |
| 17:48.34 | daMaestro | anyone get a shipping trackig number yet? |
| 17:48.46 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@141.80-202-161.nextgentel.com) |
| 17:49.05 | daMaestro | "community forums?" |
| 17:49.16 | daMaestro | blah.. tell them to just join irc |
| 17:49.36 | daMaestro | i hate all forum software |
| 17:49.57 | *** join/#openmoko stryderjzw (n=stryderj@216.232.85.137) |
| 17:50.22 | *** join/#openmoko some1_ (n=some1@p54A0F605.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 17:51.00 | don-o | no kidding, i wish i could mute the forum thread. |
| 17:52.27 | grobian | yes tell them to join irc |
| 17:52.36 | daMaestro | Sup3rkiddo, you must smoke them too ;-) |
| 17:52.52 | Sup3rkiddo | :P |
| 17:52.56 | orospakr | daMaestro: yeah, IRC and lists are more than good enough. |
| 17:54.07 | Kero | and a wiki, too ! |
| 17:54.21 | pjz | Sup3rkiddo: ever tried to *run* phpbb? |
| 17:54.41 | Sup3rkiddo | pjz, what, can't you get some sarcasm |
| 17:54.41 | pjz | Sup3rkiddo: can you say, 'security nightmare' ? |
| 17:54.46 | Sup3rkiddo | ~lart ojz |
| 17:54.46 | apt | acting on orders from an unspecified client drags ojz into court suing for $200 million |
| 17:54.51 | Sup3rkiddo | ~lart pz |
| 17:54.51 | apt | judo chops pz |
| 17:55.21 | Sup3rkiddo | doh!! |
| 17:55.38 | Sup3rkiddo | ~lart pj |
| 17:55.38 | apt | whacks pj upside the head |
| 17:55.47 | Sup3rkiddo | i give up |
| 17:58.02 | daMaestro | http://gizmodo.com/photogallery/techcake/889496 ... don't you just want to take a nice stab at that! :-D |
| 17:59.11 | Kero | pft, spamassassin has troubles with the big-ish mail from Jeff Rush. |
| 18:00.13 | CoreDump|home | hi |
| 18:00.22 | *** join/#openmoko trivex (n=trivex@yukon.ncct.uottawa.ca) |
| 18:01.36 | Sup3rkiddo | night all |
| 18:02.07 | *** join/#openmoko Dodji (n=dodji@torimasen.com) |
| 18:03.55 | *** join/#openmoko poffy (n=poffy@c-76-30-222-129.hsd1.tx.comcast.net) |
| 18:05.00 | *** join/#openmoko yveslu (n=yves@194.235.200.67) |
| 18:05.59 | aloril2 | ScaredyCat: I think one of those pages in auto faq reply does answer that UPS question |
| 18:06.21 | ozarka | calamous__: just got back from lunch. Love the sorted p1 page. |
| 18:06.39 | ozarka | I can see the charges creeping toward my name. |
| 18:06.45 | *** part/#openmoko yveslu (n=yves@194.235.200.67) |
| 18:06.53 | ozarka | This false sense of hope is making me woozy. :-) |
| 18:08.44 | *** join/#openmoko VladoK (n=vlado@158.195.16.154) |
| 18:08.49 | don-o | i was hoping some P1s would have shipped in time for OSCON |
| 18:11.37 | Bricked_Neo1973 | kristian-m: I was always using screen, now that's not working and someone suggested using another terminal program |
| 18:12.39 | ewanm89_laptop | Bricked_Neo1973: What terminal program? |
| 18:12.54 | Bricked_Neo1973 | picocom now is what i'm trying to use |
| 18:13.13 | Bricked_Neo1973 | no luck though....or I just don't know how to use picocom. Says "terminal ready" but I can't type in any commands |
| 18:13.35 | ewanm89_laptop | Bricked_Neo1973: What did you use? |
| 18:13.44 | Bricked_Neo1973 | screen, previously |
| 18:13.56 | Bricked_Neo1973 | and it worked great till i flashed a new rootfs this morning |
| 18:14.00 | ewanm89_laptop | screen is a lot different to picocom. |
| 18:14.21 | *** join/#openmoko cesarb (n=cesarb@copacabana.nitnet.com.br) |
| 18:14.33 | ewanm89_laptop | picocom is a terminal emulator, screen is a multiterminal program. |
| 18:15.05 | Bricked_Neo1973 | yeah, and screen worked great...i guess I just don't know how to use picocom *shrugs* |
| 18:15.35 | ewanm89_laptop | picocom Won't do what screen can, it's for a different purpose. |
| 18:16.15 | Bricked_Neo1973 | can I use it to flash? (rather, what CAN i do with it?) |
| 18:16.58 | ozarka | This screen vs picocom conversation sounds _very_ familiar... |
| 18:17.22 | ewanm89_laptop | Bricked_Neo1973: It's is for connecting to a computer via a UART/modem connection usually, or similar raw connection. |
| 18:17.24 | Bricked_Neo1973 | yes, and now i am trying to use picocom...not saying that one is better than the other |
| 18:18.10 | ewanm89_laptop | screen does non of those things. |
| 18:18.45 | Bricked_Neo1973 | ok, so once connected, how do I send commands to the device? |
| 18:18.52 | *** join/#openmoko babble (n=babble@36.sub-75-197-148.myvzw.com) |
| 18:19.06 | ewanm89_laptop | Bricked_Neo1973: You have to send connection commands first. |
| 18:19.21 | ewanm89_laptop | e.g. AT commands. |
| 18:19.40 | babble | atm |
| 18:19.44 | CIA-24 | openmoko: 03zecke * r2386 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007/applications/openmoko-rssreader/ (6 files in 2 dirs): (log message trimmed) |
| 18:19.44 | CIA-24 | openmoko: 2007-07-23 Holger Hans Peter Freyther <zecke@selfish.org> |
| 18:19.44 | CIA-24 | openmoko: Switch to the newly created WebKit/Gtk API |
| 18:19.45 | CIA-24 | openmoko: * configure.ac: |
| 18:19.45 | CIA-24 | openmoko: * src/Makefile.am: |
| 18:19.46 | CIA-24 | openmoko: * src/application-data.h: |
| 18:19.48 | CIA-24 | openmoko: * src/callbacks.c: |
| 18:19.58 | ewanm89_laptop | Bricked_Neo1973: Do you remember manually connecting a modem? |
| 18:20.11 | Bricked_Neo1973 | no |
| 18:20.23 | ewanm89_laptop | Bricked_Neo1973: How old are you? |
| 18:20.32 | Bricked_Neo1973 | 14 |
| 18:20.43 | Bricked_Neo1973 | jeez, does it matter...heh |
| 18:21.35 | ckuethe | nearly every new technology is first used to emulate an old technology |
| 18:21.52 | ozarka | Everybody watch their language. Bricked is only 14 and we don't want to expose him to ugly words. |
| 18:22.01 | ckuethe | the first computer "network" was first used to emulate a dumb teletype |
| 18:22.03 | Bricked_Neo1973 | yes please, I have a fragile little mind |
| 18:22.08 | ewanm89_laptop | Just wondered, too young to know connecting modems then, at 18 I done it too many times. |
| 18:22.30 | ckuethe | and so, this whizzy new cellular/gsm/utms/etc emulates a dumb hayes modem |
| 18:22.31 | ewanm89_laptop | Bricked_Neo1973: You need the History lesson. |
| 18:22.50 | Bricked_Neo1973 | HA, you were hardly born when I was programming on my apple IIc |
| 18:22.54 | ozarka | I've done it, but thankfully purged that memory from my mind. :-) |
| 18:23.04 | ewanm89_laptop | Lovely thing a Dumb Hayes modem. |
| 18:23.23 | ckuethe | i remember the joy of getting a 2400bps modem for xmas |
| 18:23.31 | ewanm89_laptop | ozarka: lol, maybe time to remember again. |
| 18:23.38 | grobian | lol |
| 18:23.44 | ckuethe | i remember running a bbs off my pee-cee |
| 18:24.01 | cdbot2 | * * OM Bug 648 has been created by autobuild-reports(AT)openmoko.org |
| 18:24.02 | cdbot2 | * * openmoko-rssreader-0.0.1+svnnow-r1_2386-do_configure |
| 18:24.03 | cdbot2 | * * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=648 |
| 18:24.10 | ewanm89_laptop | ckuethe: I've only done it with 56k after fighting with horrible winmodems for years. |
| 18:24.11 | *** join/#openmoko DukeOfURL (n=chatzill@63-227-5-180.hlrn.qwest.net) |
| 18:24.18 | Bricked_Neo1973 | ok, so no one can help me? |
| 18:24.26 | ewanm89_laptop | Then did fancy things. |
| 18:24.27 | ozarka | 2400bps?!? Lucky. |
| 18:24.55 | ckuethe | maybe i'll just go to the mall so i can feel really depressed about being old. |
| 18:25.27 | ckuethe | Bricked_Neo1973: short version of the problem? |
| 18:25.27 | ckuethe | you flashed a new image and now it doesn't work? |
| 18:26.11 | ckuethe | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Bootloader |
| 18:26.16 | Bricked_Neo1973 | correct...flashed the rootfs and now I can't use screen to connect |
| 18:26.23 | ckuethe | screeen won't connect |
| 18:26.31 | Bricked_Neo1973 | I have memorized that page, please, no one link me to it again ;) |
| 18:26.58 | ckuethe | screen is just a way to run multiple programs inside one terminal, much like x11 is a way to run multiple gui apps on a physical monitor |
| 18:27.11 | don-o | screen rules! |
| 18:27.40 | ckuethe | you will need to use a serial program... like cu, tip, minicom, this picocom thing... |
| 18:27.53 | nbd | screen can also do it |
| 18:27.56 | Bricked_Neo1973 | ok, I don't need and explanation on what screen is. I was using screen to flash my device... |
| 18:28.24 | Bricked_Neo1973 | i tried minicom, but I guess I need a lesson on how to use it (not what it's used for) |
| 18:28.27 | ewanm89_laptop | Bricked_Neo1973: So it starts fine? |
| 18:28.35 | ozarka | Bricked, have you wikified your experience so far? |
| 18:28.43 | Bricked_Neo1973 | no, never has booted...even the day I received it |
| 18:28.50 | ckuethe | the short tour of minicom |
| 18:28.53 | ckuethe | # minicom |
| 18:28.54 | Bricked_Neo1973 | no, I have not, I will have too |
| 18:29.21 | *** join/#openmoko ratur (n=ratur@192.74-242-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be) |
| 18:29.23 | Shoragan | can you get to the booloader? |
| 18:29.53 | ckuethe | ^ao |
| 18:30.02 | ckuethe | [serial port setup] |
| 18:30.08 | ckuethe | A |
| 18:30.25 | ckuethe | point it at your tty (/dev/ttyUSB0 ?) |
| 18:30.41 | ckuethe | enter a couple of times |
| 18:30.42 | grobian | Ctrl a o |
| 18:30.43 | ckuethe | [exit] |
| 18:30.55 | Bricked_Neo1973 | wtf? |
| 18:31.06 | ckuethe | minicom.... |
| 18:31.13 | Bricked_Neo1973 | okay |
| 18:31.16 | ckuethe | after exiting from the minicom set up menu |
| 18:31.18 | Shoragan | ckuethe, you don't need minicom |
| 18:31.32 | ckuethe | true, you don't but i like minicom as a terminal program |
| 18:31.52 | Bricked_Neo1973 | yes, don't need it, but i'm asking how to connect with it. Let me give it a shot |
| 18:31.54 | Shoragan | Bricked_Neo1973, can you get to the bootloader? |
| 18:32.03 | grobian | No sorry its Ctrl A and O |
| 18:32.15 | Bricked_Neo1973 | yes |
| 18:32.29 | Bricked_Neo1973 | DFU has never worked for me though |
| 18:33.29 | grobian | ^aw is useful |
| 18:33.58 | Shoragan | Bricked_Neo1973, which version does the bootloader display? |
| 18:34.05 | *** join/#openmoko ewanm89 (n=ewanm89@host86-151-100-255.range86-151.btcentralplus.com) |
| 18:34.52 | Bricked_Neo1973 | 1.2.0-moko9_r10.................july 4 2007 |
| 18:35.17 | *** join/#openmoko rob_w (n=bob@M8355.m.pppool.de) |
| 18:35.54 | *** join/#openmoko empty_mind (n=orion@59.176.111.177) |
| 18:36.13 | Shoragan | do you have a v3 or v4? |
| 18:36.26 | Bricked_Neo1973 | 4 |
| 18:36.35 | Bricked_Neo1973 | GTA01B-V4 |
| 18:36.48 | Bricked_Neo1973 | date code: 20070420 |
| 18:36.53 | Bricked_Neo1973 | s/n: 000243 |
| 18:37.18 | Shoragan | then select 'set console to USB' |
| 18:37.25 | *** part/#openmoko Tyrael (n=tyrael@213-140-6-114.ip.fastwebnet.it) |
| 18:37.26 | *** join/#openmoko Tyrael (n=tyrael@213-140-6-114.ip.fastwebnet.it) |
| 18:37.36 | *** part/#openmoko Tyrael (n=tyrael@213-140-6-114.ip.fastwebnet.it) |
| 18:37.43 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@141.80-202-161.nextgentel.com) |
| 18:37.47 | Bricked_Neo1973 | does nothing but take me back to the bootloader |
| 18:37.51 | Shoragan | and run 'screen /dev/ttyACM0' as root |
| 18:37.53 | grobian | u get a help in minicom with CTRL-A Z |
| 18:37.54 | Shoragan | thats ok |
| 18:38.12 | Bricked_Neo1973 | screen is not working with it now |
| 18:38.27 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@141.80-202-161.nextgentel.com) |
| 18:38.30 | Bricked_Neo1973 | screen was working this morning, but not after a rootfs flash |
| 18:38.44 | Shoragan | then check with dmesg if your kernel sees the neo |
| 18:39.04 | Shoragan | you should have: "cdc_acm 2-1:1.0: ttyACM0: USB ACM device" |
| 18:39.48 | *** join/#openmoko woglinde (i=woglinde@85.178.67.130) |
| 18:40.33 | Bricked_Neo1973 | correct |
| 18:40.40 | *** join/#openmoko IR1 (n=rmoreira@87-196-80-105.net.novis.pt) |
| 18:41.07 | Shoragan | what did you use to flash the rootfs? |
| 18:41.25 | Bricked_Neo1973 | screen |
| 18:41.28 | *** join/#openmoko Markinoko (n=Markinok@bgn92-4-82-238-213-101.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 18:41.51 | Bricked_Neo1973 | screen with the jffs2 on the mmc |
| 18:41.56 | Shoragan | ah |
| 18:42.13 | Shoragan | are you sure that you used the correct partition? |
| 18:42.29 | *** join/#openmoko SiO2 (n=sarge@p54B39B80.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 18:42.43 | Bricked_Neo1973 | unless the documentation on the wiki is wrong, I just did what it states |
| 18:43.04 | Markinoko | they always say that :-) |
| 18:43.07 | woglinde | what did you do? |
| 18:43.34 | *** join/#openmoko Odin- (n=sbkhh@s121-302.gardur.hi.is) |
| 18:43.52 | Shoragan | do you get an error message from screen? |
| 18:44.06 | dtx | If you only flash the rootfs why would it brick it? |
| 18:44.41 | Bricked_Neo1973 | no error message, OK was returned... |
| 18:44.46 | Bricked_Neo1973 | dtx: that's what i'm sayin! |
| 18:44.58 | *** join/#openmoko marsan (n=marsan@ti500720a080-2350.bb.online.no) |
| 18:45.00 | Skuff | somehow i get a lot of missung include-files errors after the last update |
| 18:45.22 | Shoragan | i mean do you *now* get an error message from screen? |
| 18:46.01 | woglinde | what did he try? |
| 18:46.06 | woglinde | I have no backloh |
| 18:46.09 | woglinde | backlog |
| 18:46.15 | Bricked_Neo1973 | no....screen actually seems to do nothing...I type the command in, the screen goes blank and it just sits there....when I unplug neo, the screen terminates |
| 18:46.15 | woglinde | flashing kernel over uboot |
| 18:48.10 | dtx | oooh |
| 18:48.20 | dtx | flashing kernel over uboot no es bueno |
| 18:48.29 | dtx | if its untested |
| 18:49.06 | woglinde | hm I meant flashing the kernel uboot partiton with a kernelimage |
| 18:49.07 | Markinoko | that's why they build emulators... well... if the emulator does not crash ones whole system ;-) |
| 18:49.08 | Shoragan | do you get a prompt if you press return in screen? |
| 18:49.13 | woglinde | uImage != uboot |
| 18:49.36 | Bricked_Neo1973 | Shoragan: no |
| 18:49.56 | Bricked_Neo1973 | blinking cursor |
| 18:49.57 | Shoragan | then your bootloader or environment may be damaged |
| 18:50.09 | *** join/#openmoko Eludias (n=eludias@wingding.demon.nl) |
| 18:50.14 | Bricked_Neo1973 | ok, anything I can do about it? |
| 18:50.20 | Shoragan | what was the problem with dfu-util? |
| 18:50.33 | Shoragan | ah! |
| 18:50.43 | Bricked_Neo1973 | dfu never worked...before and after this |
| 18:50.55 | Shoragan | do 'ls /dev/ttyACM*' |
| 18:51.08 | Shoragan | are there other ones besides ACM0? |
| 18:51.30 | Bricked_Neo1973 | nope, just ACM0 |
| 18:52.12 | *** join/#openmoko Rodolphe12 (n=ortalo@laf31-1-81-56-84-23.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 18:52.24 | Bricked_Neo1973 | gtkterm does the same thing |
| 18:52.34 | Rodolphe12 | hi |
| 18:53.32 | *** join/#openmoko BenC (n=bcollins@debian/developer/bcollins) |
| 18:53.36 | Bricked_Neo1973 | i imagine the device is not salvageable |
| 18:53.41 | Shoragan | you can use 'dfu-util -l' to look for the neo |
| 18:54.02 | Bricked_Neo1973 | let me try again... |
| 18:54.04 | Shoragan | what does that say? |
| 18:54.35 | Bricked_Neo1973 | give me a few...honestly I didn't try that today. It wasn't working friday though. |
| 18:55.08 | *** part/#openmoko Rodolphe12 (n=ortalo@laf31-1-81-56-84-23.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 18:55.15 | Shoragan | it would help if you could be more specific that 'it wasn't working' ;) |
| 18:55.31 | *** join/#openmoko Rodolphe12 (n=ortalo@laf31-1-81-56-84-23.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 18:55.39 | Bricked_Neo1973 | HA, i know |
| 18:55.52 | Rodolphe12 | Unable to join #openmoko-devel, is it normal? |
| 18:55.52 | aloril | Rodolphe12: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) (Hopefully this link answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) |
| 18:56.47 | Bricked_Neo1973 | INTERESTING |
| 18:57.02 | ewanm89_laptop | Rodolphe12: #openmoko-devel is for employees only, (due to some NDAs and stuff). |
| 18:57.23 | Bricked_Neo1973 | Found Runtime: [0x1457:0x5119] devnum=8, cfg=0, initf=2, alt=0, name="USB Device Firmware Upgrade" |
| 18:57.40 | Bricked_Neo1973 | looks like I didn't do a rootfs flash this morning |
| 18:58.03 | Rodolphe12 | Do you know where the artwork/icons/ should be installed? (Trying to have the correct icons in openmoko-today under xoo+xnest local PC emulation...) |
| 18:58.11 | Bricked_Neo1973 | last week it said something else....can't remember what though |
| 18:58.18 | woglinde | bricked lucky than :) |
| 18:59.15 | grobian | any employees here? |
| 18:59.17 | Shoragan | Bricked_Neo1973, that looks good |
| 18:59.32 | Bricked_Neo1973 | looks good? meaning there is something I could do? |
| 18:59.39 | woglinde | grobian hm not at the moment |
| 18:59.45 | Shoragan | get a uImage and rootfs from buildhost.openmoko.org |
| 18:59.49 | woglinde | bricked yes |
| 18:59.51 | *** join/#openmoko Aria (n=aredride@betelgeuse.theinternetco.net) |
| 19:00.03 | woglinde | and uImage == kernel |
| 19:00.08 | woglinde | not uboot |
| 19:00.11 | Markinoko | ewanm89_laptop: If I recall you've been playing a bit with the emulator... Did you manage to get a full system freeze with it ? (on exit for instance) |
| 19:00.17 | woglinde | so flash the right partition |
| 19:00.22 | Bricked_Neo1973 | so uImage is what I want to load? |
| 19:00.34 | ewanm89_laptop | Markinoko: No, emulator has been fine for me. |
| 19:00.38 | Shoragan | uImage and rootfs |
| 19:01.00 | Shoragan | http://buildhost.openmoko.org/tmp/deploy/images/openmoko-devel-image-fic-gta01-20070704215706.rootfs.jffs2 |
| 19:01.12 | Shoragan | http://buildhost.openmoko.org/tmp/deploy/images/uImage-2.6.21.5-moko10-r1_0_0_2359_0-fic-gta01.bin |
| 19:01.15 | Shoragan | download both |
| 19:01.25 | Markinoko | ewanm89_laptop: do you use a generic kernel on the host, or do you have anything exotic ? |
| 19:01.45 | Shoragan | then use dfu-util -a kernel -D uImage-2.6.21.5-moko10-r1_0_0_2359_0-fic-gta01.bin |
| 19:02.00 | ewanm89_laptop | Markinoko: I have 2.6.22.1 vanilla on the host. |
| 19:02.07 | Shoragan | and dfu-util -a rootfs -D openmoko-devel-image-fic-gta01-20070704215706.rootfs.jffs2 |
| 19:02.16 | grobian | i wouldnt flash uboot! only if neccessary! my opinion. |
| 19:02.17 | *** join/#openmoko crunchywelch (n=welch@74.92.159.94) |
| 19:02.36 | woglinde | grobian right or with someone with debugboard near |
| 19:02.39 | Shoragan | grobian, exactly |
| 19:02.48 | Markinoko | ewanm89_laptop: then I may have stumbled on a bug with 2.6.21.1-rt1-tickless... huhu |
| 19:02.56 | Shoragan | but it seems like the uboot is ok |
| 19:02.59 | Markinoko | let's upgrade that crappy kernel |
| 19:03.07 | *** join/#openmoko TimRiker (n=timr@rikers.org) |
| 19:03.24 | Bricked_Neo1973 | Shoragan: you are the man....bblw, i'll give it a shot |
| 19:03.45 | ewanm89_laptop | Markinoko: It's possible. |
| 19:03.48 | Rodolphe12 | hmm, pretty low level, no one in the icons install job yet? ;) |
| 19:04.43 | woglinde | bricked that stands in the wiki too |
| 19:04.49 | woglinde | wonder where you looked |
| 19:05.11 | Bricked_Neo1973 | yes, but dfu wasn't working for me last week, so I didn't think to try it today |
| 19:05.36 | Bricked_Neo1973 | does it say on the wiki, "if your terminal emulator doesn't work, try dfu"?? |
| 19:06.32 | woglinde | ah right you need access to the host-device use sudo or chmod |
| 19:06.42 | Markinoko | Bricked_Neo1973: I'm pretty sure I saw that in the hardware list archives |
| 19:07.12 | woglinde | common mistake I fall into it sometimes |
| 19:07.22 | Markinoko | Bricked_Neo1973: which BTW is a good place for bricked device recovery stories |
| 19:07.28 | Bricked_Neo1973 | okay |
| 19:10.31 | *** join/#openmoko chris^ (n=kraetzi@p548AD7AA.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 19:14.28 | *** part/#openmoko Rodolphe12 (n=ortalo@laf31-1-81-56-84-23.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 19:16.25 | *** join/#openmoko zecke_ (n=ich@dsl-62-220-14-162.berlikomm.net) |
| 19:16.34 | zecke_ | sorry, I broke the build :) |
| 19:16.44 | *** join/#openmoko dietricha (n=dietrich@c-67-166-84-16.hsd1.or.comcast.net) |
| 19:16.49 | *** join/#openmoko chris^^ (n=kraetzi@p548AD7AA.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 19:17.49 | woglinde | he zecke |
| 19:17.52 | woglinde | you broke leg? |
| 19:18.24 | zecke_ | woglinde: I just landed some bits of the WebKitGtk API and switched the feedreader to it |
| 19:18.40 | *** join/#openmoko _rob (n=rob@77.47.0.11.static.cablesurf.de) |
| 19:19.03 | *** join/#openmoko ScaredyCat (n=andy@AC8E25BB.ipt.aol.com) |
| 19:19.44 | ewon | last place I worked in, I set up a commit triggered build system that would email the entire team with the name of the person that broke the build :) |
| 19:20.32 | zecke_ | ewon: http://ewi546.ewi.utwente.nl/tinderbox/showbuilds.pl?tree=OpenMoko a bug is getting filed and mickey gets a mail |
| 19:21.42 | ewon | ah, utwente.nl |
| 19:21.46 | ewon | good archers. |
| 19:23.15 | *** join/#openmoko docdoc (n=timoteus@d515323B9.access.telenet.be) |
| 19:23.43 | docdoc | hi all |
| 19:23.50 | woglinde | hi |
| 19:23.56 | docdoc | is the G1 already shipping |
| 19:24.02 | woglinde | yes |
| 19:24.11 | woglinde | gta01v4 |
| 19:24.16 | docdoc | do u have it in your hand |
| 19:24.27 | woglinde | yes |
| 19:24.32 | docdoc | what about the speed of the x11 |
| 19:24.45 | woglinde | its okay |
| 19:24.51 | docdoc | the qemu is very slow in booting to x11 environment |
| 19:25.04 | zecke_ | woglinde: You should ask which benchmark he has :) |
| 19:25.13 | docdoc | i know about the speed, hopefully the neo is faster |
| 19:25.19 | *** join/#openmoko Tv (n=tv@38.98.11.186) |
| 19:25.27 | woglinde | speed is relative |
| 19:25.31 | zecke_ | docdoc: everything is slow in qemu. just get a faster host |
| 19:25.34 | woglinde | you can say its 10 or 20 ms |
| 19:25.36 | docdoc | what about the touchscreen |
| 19:25.40 | woglinde | cannt |
| 19:25.54 | zecke_ | docdoc: e.g. debian is proud they can emulate a nslu2 with the twice the speed on a quad xeon system |
| 19:25.56 | docdoc | zecke faster host wick one |
| 19:26.15 | docdoc | wich one |
| 19:26.39 | docdoc | seems the vga screen is very beautifull? correct? |
| 19:26.40 | kristian-m | woglinde your in de, right? - when have you gotten your ups-id? |
| 19:26.46 | Kensan | for people asking about tracking numbers: http://xkcd.com/281/ |
| 19:26.50 | woglinde | kristian aeh |
| 19:26.58 | woglinde | I got my as developer |
| 19:27.04 | docdoc | how many did get the phone already |
| 19:27.10 | kristian-m | woglinde ah i see |
| 19:27.13 | ynezz | Kensan: :) |
| 19:27.55 | ynezz | aloril: this image should be added to 'UPS tracking number' trigger |
| 19:27.59 | docdoc | will the mobo from G2 be transferable to the G1 case |
| 19:28.27 | ynezz | no, p2 will be bigger |
| 19:28.55 | docdoc | p2 = G2 |
| 19:29.25 | ynezz | should be same, but who knows |
| 19:30.23 | docdoc | zecke wich faster host do u mean for building openmoko on |
| 19:30.46 | docdoc | xephyr or xoo?? |
| 19:31.28 | zecke_ | docdoc: You run qemu on your host. If your host is faster (think of more GHZ) the emulated system will be faster |
| 19:33.08 | *** join/#openmoko Frostshoc (n=Sionic@c-1fb4e255.017-347-6c756c10.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se) |
| 19:33.42 | docdoc | see u around |
| 19:34.19 | Frostshoc | what will the retail price be? |
| 19:34.20 | aloril | Frostshoc: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) (Hopefully this link answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) |
| 19:35.02 | *** join/#openmoko ossman (n=drzeus@craffe.se) |
| 19:35.15 | Bricked_Neo1973 | holy shit, its downloading |
| 19:35.23 | grobian | lol |
| 19:35.24 | woglinde | bricked hehe |
| 19:35.39 | woglinde | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:35.48 | Bricked_Neo1973 | MAYBE! |
| 19:36.00 | Skuff | ll |
| 19:36.07 | Aria | Frostshoc: USD$450 Or so |
| 19:36.36 | Frostshoc | Aria: ok |
| 19:36.40 | Bricked_Neo1973 | YAY, "No error condition is present" |
| 19:36.51 | Frostshoc | so how long has this project been active? |
| 19:36.53 | Bricked_Neo1973 | so now boot? |
| 19:38.45 | Bricked_Neo1973 | still doesn't boot :\ |
| 19:40.29 | grobian | i dont know. but does minicom show boot messages as soon usb is up? |
| 19:40.55 | Bricked_Neo1973 | no |
| 19:41.19 | *** join/#openmoko netx (n=rlange@osiris.darkempire.org) |
| 19:41.31 | woglinde | ??? |
| 19:41.38 | woglinde | why you use console? |
| 19:42.09 | woglinde | you can see booting on the device |
| 19:42.24 | Bricked_Neo1973 | well I just used dfu-util to flash the uImae |
| 19:42.26 | Bricked_Neo1973 | uImage* |
| 19:42.51 | woglinde | you dont need a terminal programm |
| 19:42.59 | grobian | ok |
| 19:43.06 | woglinde | and when I suggest you should try cutecom |
| 19:43.14 | woglinde | its muchbetter then minicom |
| 19:43.22 | woglinde | only send break is missing |
| 19:43.27 | Bricked_Neo1973 | cool, doesn't help if NONE of them work |
| 19:43.28 | woglinde | or I dindt find it |
| 19:43.28 | grobian | cutecom |
| 19:44.01 | Bricked_Neo1973 | everyone has their own preference |
| 19:44.01 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Epdf-view]] [[Talk:OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Norway]] [[P1_Owners]] [[Create_a_package_from_existing_sources]] |
| 19:44.06 | guaqua | Bricked_Neo1973: read the wiki |
| 19:44.21 | woglinde | yeah one take 1970 citroen when he can use a 911 carrera |
| 19:44.30 | Bricked_Neo1973 | i have, do you know what my problem is? |
| 19:44.47 | guaqua | Bricked_Neo1973: no, but i bet it's already covered in the wiki |
| 19:44.59 | Bricked_Neo1973 | jesus....then quiet you |
| 19:45.17 | grobian | take a break Bricked |
| 19:45.36 | grobian | tomorrow as a new day |
| 19:45.42 | Bricked_Neo1973 | I should, i'll go have a cig and then come back and whine |
| 19:45.52 | grobian | lol :-(( |
| 19:46.06 | woglinde | *g* |
| 19:46.18 | Bricked_Neo1973 | yeah, the only thing about tomorrow is, i'll have to explain the problem OVER and OVER again and get links to the wiki and arguments over what is the best term prog |
| 19:46.40 | *** part/#openmoko Mandarino (n=Mandarin@153.pool85-50-115.dynamic.orange.es) |
| 19:46.51 | guaqua | as you are yourself unable to even understand the ways to connect to the phone itself |
| 19:46.54 | Bricked_Neo1973 | OH, and over and over "qemu?" and "how did you get that phone" |
| 19:47.06 | grobian | lol |
| 19:47.07 | Bricked_Neo1973 | I was doing it fine all last week |
| 19:47.38 | Bricked_Neo1973 | I was connecting fine with screen up till this morning when I flashed the rootfs |
| 19:48.07 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@141.80-202-161.nextgentel.com) |
| 19:48.27 | Bricked_Neo1973 | guaqua: do you have the device? |
| 19:48.30 | guaqua | no |
| 19:48.43 | Bricked_Neo1973 | ok, well I have had mine for a month and it has not worked one minute of it |
| 19:49.00 | grobian | so this is not so trivial |
| 19:49.14 | guaqua | but i could've hacked an iphone to run solaris with the same amount of energy you are using to ask the wrong kind of questions here |
| 19:49.41 | kristian-m | Bricked_Neo1973 do you have a jtag-adapter? |
| 19:49.43 | Bricked_Neo1973 | how am I asking the wrong questions? You're stating the wrong answers since you can't speak from experience |
| 19:49.46 | kristian-m | Bricked_Neo1973 maybe the TX line of your cable is broken... |
| 19:50.07 | Bricked_Neo1973 | my USB cable works fine, I do not have a debug board |
| 19:50.43 | *** join/#openmoko tr2x (n=alvar@80-218-185-55.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 19:50.44 | guaqua | and also, bugging for attention with that nick only irritates |
| 19:50.50 | guaqua | doesn't help you at all |
| 19:51.24 | auqaug | better? jesus |
| 19:51.29 | guaqua | wanker |
| 19:51.32 | guaqua | going to ignore |
| 19:51.47 | grobian | this is an engineering task. you cant force it! |
| 19:52.02 | grobian | patience |
| 19:52.09 | mmazur | Wonder if there are going to be emails about actually sending stuff. |
| 19:52.09 | auqaug | I am just looking for help and sorry if it irritates me that I have noobs telling me over and over to read the wiki |
| 19:52.21 | *** join/#openmoko alech (n=alech@IP-213188106106.dialin.heagmedianet.de) |
| 19:53.01 | jfreels | I can wait for someone else to have this problem, or I can try and fix it and post the results...we all win |
| 19:54.58 | ynezz | or you can read that wiki :) |
| 19:55.18 | *** join/#openmoko baze (n=baze@xdsl-213-168-118-104.netcologne.de) |
| 19:55.21 | jfreels | the problem is, the answer for me is not on the wiki |
| 19:55.47 | ynezz | it's about using dfu-util, right? |
| 19:55.52 | jfreels | I guess I just have a bricked device and I should give up |
| 19:56.01 | ynezz | send it over to me :D |
| 19:56.16 | ynezz | or that devirginator |
| 19:56.17 | jfreels | I first used a terminal to get the flash files off the mmc, then I used dfu |
| 19:56.49 | jfreels | I was successfull with both, but still don't have a working device |
| 19:56.59 | ynezz | terminal files flash, what? |
| 19:57.30 | jfreels | used screen, and used nand to put a new rootfs on the device |
| 19:57.37 | ynezz | ah ok |
| 19:57.55 | ynezz | so it's rootfs broken or uboot? |
| 19:57.58 | jfreels | now I can't use screen anymore...or picocom or gtkterm or minicom or cu |
| 19:58.26 | jfreels | well I thought it was the kernel, but I just used dfu to replace that |
| 19:58.32 | jfreels | and that didn't work |
| 19:58.37 | *** join/#openmoko devilCMKRNL (n=devilCMK@adsl-216-103-214-183.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net) |
| 19:59.48 | ynezz | so you have uboot working? |
| 20:00.09 | jfreels | well I can get into the bootloader, so yes |
| 20:00.24 | ynezz | so it's not bricked |
| 20:00.31 | ynezz | it's just fucked-up |
| 20:00.33 | ynezz | :) |
| 20:01.01 | *** join/#openmoko mbuf (n=mbuf@gprs-ggsn6-nat.mobil.telenor.no) |
| 20:01.29 | ynezz | i don't know uboot but in other bootloaders it's possible to load kernel into mem by hand from flash |
| 20:01.47 | ynezz | and run/exec it from bootloader by hand |
| 20:02.32 | daMaestro | someone should change the /topic if anyone gets an actual tracking number |
| 20:02.40 | ynezz | if I were you I would read more about booting proccess and uboot in general |
| 20:02.43 | daMaestro | i've now been charged and still have no tracking number |
| 20:03.09 | ynezz | what's your # ? |
| 20:04.33 | mbuf | can the Neo1973 be turned horizontally and GTK+ applications used on it? |
| 20:04.48 | mbuf | if yes, how can I get this display on qemu? |
| 20:05.01 | Shoragan | jfreels, what does it display if you boot from the bootloader menu? |
| 20:05.28 | guaqua | mbuf: the applications don't work in horizontal mode by default, but in the future it should be an option |
| 20:05.34 | Shoragan | you should first see the bootloader displaying some info about the kernel, version, size... |
| 20:05.45 | guaqua | some work has been done, but mainly it's unimplemented |
| 20:05.47 | Shoragan | and the a linux framebuffer console with the boot messages |
| 20:06.41 | mbuf | guaqua, because in ninjutsu part 2, i saw an image viewer application used by the "doctor" that used the phone in landscape view |
| 20:07.59 | *** join/#openmoko Husare (n=AD@stgt-590e39a9.pool.einsundeins.de) |
| 20:08.29 | dietricha | does anyone know if any phones have shipped yet? |
| 20:08.53 | guaqua | no |
| 20:10.26 | Husare | nice question, i'd like to know the answer too. |
| 20:10.58 | don-o | dietricha: when they do, you'll see a mark on this page http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/P1_Owners |
| 20:11.16 | daMaestro | ynezz, 1964 |
| 20:11.23 | dietricha | don-o: thanks sir |
| 20:13.53 | *** join/#openmoko marsan (n=marsan@ti500720a080-2350.bb.online.no) |
| 20:14.08 | *** join/#openmoko tr2x_ (n=alvar@80-218-185-55.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 20:14.18 | *** join/#openmoko ajmitch (n=ajmitch@ubuntu/member/ajmitch) |
| 20:16.35 | *** join/#openmoko grobian (n=grobian@L19c7.l.pppool.de) |
| 20:18.33 | *** join/#openmoko grobian (n=grobian@L19c7.l.pppool.de) |
| 20:19.01 | ynezz | thomasg: so someone already have received neo? |
| 20:19.27 | *** join/#openmoko grobian (n=grobian@L19c7.l.pppool.de) |
| 20:19.29 | ynezz | thomasg: do you know their rt # ? |
| 20:19.29 | *** join/#openmoko MrFeetio (n=david@c-71-230-5-247.hsd1.pa.comcast.net) |
| 20:20.52 | thomasg | ynezz, don't know if sb recieved. but many got charged, so the shipping should start. hope I'll have mine at the end of the week |
| 20:21.42 | ynezz | hm, its just wrong assumption I think |
| 20:21.50 | woglinde | no |
| 20:22.06 | *** join/#openmoko baze (n=baze@xdsl-213-168-118-104.netcologne.de) |
| 20:22.06 | ynezz | it looks that they don't started to ship it anyway |
| 20:22.16 | woglinde | <PROTECTED> |
| 20:22.16 | ynezz | even if they were charged |
| 20:22.17 | *** join/#openmoko Devestate (n=Devestat@72.34.82.226) |
| 20:22.41 | ynezz | woglinde: that would be nice... |
| 20:23.56 | *** join/#openmoko grobian1 (n=grobian@L19c7.l.pppool.de) |
| 20:26.43 | jfreels | ok back....dfu won't send anything to the device anymore |
| 20:28.44 | *** join/#openmoko grobian (n=grobian@gentoo/developer/grobian) |
| 20:28.58 | *** join/#openmoko pavelm (n=pavel@gprs189-60.eurotel.cz) |
| 20:29.20 | hrw | jfreels: what you did? |
| 20:29.47 | jfreels | flashed it with the -R flag and now dfu won't let me flash again |
| 20:29.53 | jfreels | should have not used that flag |
| 20:29.53 | pavelm | hello, everyone. |
| 20:29.57 | jfreels | yo! |
| 20:30.03 | hrw | jfreels: ok. but you still have u-boot working? |
| 20:30.05 | hrw | pavelm: hi |
| 20:30.19 | hrw | jfreels: unplug usb, take battery off |
| 20:30.31 | hrw | jfreels: insert battery, keep AUX, press power |
| 20:30.41 | hrw | jfreels: you should get bootmenu. |
| 20:30.49 | *** join/#openmoko crunchywelch (n=welch@74.92.159.94) |
| 20:31.10 | SpeedEvil | Elrond: what's the longest GPS trace out there. I want to generate a file giving the doppler for each. |
| 20:31.14 | jfreels | yeah, I get the boot menu, then when I connect the USB, it doesn't go into flash mode |
| 20:31.41 | hrw | jfreels: dfu-util sometimes does not connect by first time - retry then |
| 20:31.53 | pavelm | jfreels: as long as you have boot menu, you have machine, not a brick :-) |
| 20:31.57 | hrw | jfreels: sometimes it need to be started with root permissions |
| 20:32.01 | pavelm | jfreels: try connecting using ttyACM0 |
| 20:32.07 | hrw | jfreels: and -R switch is safe |
| 20:32.08 | pavelm | (minicom) |
| 20:32.21 | jfreels | yeah, minicom won't work...hasn't worked all day |
| 20:32.24 | jfreels | was working last week though |
| 20:32.39 | woglinde | (cutecom) |
| 20:32.42 | woglinde | as I said |
| 20:33.09 | hrw | in that order ;D |
| 20:33.49 | jfreels | none of them work, should have clarified |
| 20:33.49 | woglinde | hrw try cutecom |
| 20:33.52 | woglinde | one day |
| 20:33.53 | pavelm | speed: If you really want.. I can generate 4 hours trace. |
| 20:34.16 | hrw | woglinde: does it support 'scripts' like minicom does? |
| 20:34.46 | woglinde | hrw hm oh |
| 20:34.50 | woglinde | dont know |
| 20:34.58 | woglinde | didnt know minicom has script support |
| 20:35.17 | hrw | woglinde: 'script' == text file send over serial |
| 20:35.32 | hrw | woglinde: handy for devices which bootloaders require setup on each boot |
| 20:35.36 | jfreels | you were correct sir....I connected/dissconnected over and over and eventually it went into firmware upgrade mode |
| 20:35.47 | woglinde | hrw cutecom has history support |
| 20:35.59 | hrw | jfreels: as long as you do not fsckup uboot you are safe |
| 20:36.12 | woglinde | hrw try it dont know if it fit you needs |
| 20:36.19 | thomasg | a few month and none of my devices and gadgets has a proprietary OS :) |
| 20:36.20 | hrw | woglinde: and do not support fullscreen apps. I just started it and it reminded me why I dropped it |
| 20:36.45 | woglinde | ah right one more cutecome has better linebreaks support |
| 20:36.46 | pavelm | jfreels: there's flashing openmoko page in wiki, perhaps you could write "what to do if something goes wrong" section? :-) |
| 20:37.04 | *** join/#openmoko BenC (n=bcollins@debian/developer/bcollins) |
| 20:37.16 | woglinde | I am alwasy pissed if cant see the linuxargs command line when kernel boots |
| 20:37.29 | pavelm | still no image newer than jul07? :-( |
| 20:37.29 | hrw | woglinde: I need vi and mc working in terminal |
| 20:37.45 | woglinde | hrw ah right okay |
| 20:37.49 | hrw | pavelm: you still unable to write 'make openmoko-devel-image'? |
| 20:38.12 | hrw | woglinde: and this is when minicom comes. |
| 20:38.13 | pavelm | hrw: /dev/sda2 50G 48G 1.8G 97% /data |
| 20:38.22 | pavelm | hrw: / has 150MB free. |
| 20:38.25 | pavelm | :-( |
| 20:38.31 | galexande | they're really determined not to charge my card. |
| 20:38.51 | hrw | pavelm: I was thinking that you work for suse... you do not have any machines at company? |
| 20:39.14 | hrw | pavelm: /dev/mapper/home--vg-homefs 396G 250G 130G 66% /home |
| 20:39.48 | pavelm | hrw: actually my coworker got buildsystem to work, so I guess I should use some other excuse. |
| 20:40.19 | hrw | ;) |
| 20:40.45 | pavelm | ...but what about all those poor souls that bought neos now. There should be something better than jul7 image for them ;-) |
| 20:40.51 | pavelm | (does that sound good enough?) |
| 20:41.12 | hrw | pavelm: what problems are with that image? someone reported them? |
| 20:41.15 | pavelm | hrw: In the meantime, I got python to work, so I can do developemnt w/o buildsystem. |
| 20:41.56 | *** join/#openmoko babble (n=babble@25.sub-70-208-241.myvzw.com) |
| 20:43.42 | gcb77_ | I have the VMWare image with a pre-set-up MokoMakefile env available as well |
| 20:44.28 | gcb77_ | And there's a chroot image availabe |
| 20:44.36 | jfreels | trying a new uImage |
| 20:45.02 | pavelm | hrw: Bug 606 is what I'm thinking about. I'd like to create "daemon" that producs sound on incoming calls... ...so that I know when someone's calling. |
| 20:45.32 | pavelm | hrw: But I guess I should be able to just cross-compile gsmd by hand. |
| 20:47.38 | Elrond | SpeedEvil - I guess, longtrace from ph5. But sphyrna's decode.py has soe issues on it. |
| 20:47.54 | Elrond | SpeedEvil - Shall I create a sphyrna decode output for you? |
| 20:48.24 | vallor | too bad I couldn't swing by their place and pick up my neo :\ |
| 20:49.40 | *** join/#openmoko borg_ (n=olaf@80.149.17.21) |
| 20:49.41 | SpeedEvil | Elrond: ok I'll generate dor that. |
| 20:50.10 | Elrond | "dor"? |
| 20:50.20 | *** join/#openmoko DukeOfURL (n=chatzill@introspect.com) |
| 20:50.20 | SpeedEvil | typo |
| 20:50.39 | SpeedEvil | doppler figures for that time/date/position. |
| 20:50.51 | Elrond | SpeedEvil - Ahh :) |
| 20:51.20 | jfreels | anyone here flash using dfu before? |
| 20:51.29 | Elrond | jfreels - Me. |
| 20:51.40 | Elrond | jfreels - Nicely documented at wiki... *searching* |
| 20:51.41 | jfreels | safe to do rootfs? |
| 20:51.55 | *** join/#openmoko madewokherd (n=urk@c-71-61-62-105.hsd1.pa.comcast.net) |
| 20:52.01 | cdbot2 | * * OM Bug 649 has been created by pavel(AT)ucw.cz |
| 20:52.01 | cdbot2 | * * command-line parameter for dialing specific number would be nice |
| 20:52.02 | cdbot2 | * * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=649 |
| 20:52.04 | Elrond | I never tried the rootfs. |
| 20:52.09 | jfreels | would take a long time I would imagine? |
| 20:52.10 | jfreels | okay |
| 20:52.24 | jfreels | have you ever seen "Bad Magic number" error before? |
| 20:52.26 | Elrond | Yes, will take a while. But not tooo long with current u-boot. |
| 20:52.30 | pavelm | jfreels: few minutes, depending on uboot version. |
| 20:52.34 | jfreels | when you select "boot" from the boot loader menu |
| 20:52.57 | Elrond | Then the DFU went wrong. |
| 20:52.59 | pavelm | jfreels: look at "flashing openmoko" section. |
| 20:53.12 | Elrond | jfreels - http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Flashing_openmoko |
| 20:53.13 | jfreels | maybe I need an older version of uboot...I am using the latest uboot |
| 20:53.24 | jfreels | looking at that now....i have tried flashing several times |
| 20:53.27 | jfreels | two different methods |
| 20:53.32 | jfreels | still no go |
| 20:53.44 | *** part/#openmoko dantalizing (n=dantaliz@n128-227-50-36.xlate.ufl.edu) |
| 20:54.03 | Elrond | jfreels - Make sure to connect neo directly to PC, using the supplied cable or a known good cable. |
| 20:54.14 | jfreels | check |
| 20:54.34 | jfreels | everything goes fine during the flash, I receive the OK when done...it's just not working |
| 20:54.48 | *** join/#openmoko slomo (n=slomo@ubuntu/member/slomo) |
| 20:55.29 | Elrond | jfreels - Try a "bootd" on the u-boot usbserial, it will give you the output of u-boot, better for putting in a pastebin |
| 20:56.03 | pavelm | jfreels: be careful about flashing uboot. That's a known way to a brick. |
| 20:56.11 | jfreels | gotchia |
| 20:56.36 | happycube | yeah don't flash u-boot without jtag |
| 20:57.15 | Elrond | happycube - Well, you can flash u-boot, if you're 100% sure, what you're doing. I did, after verifying all parts three times. |
| 20:58.04 | happycube | *nod* |
| 20:58.25 | happycube | ok, don't flash u-boot without jtag unless you absolutely sure it's not a bad idea ;) |
| 20:58.28 | woglinde | elrond I only looked double time |
| 20:58.36 | *** join/#openmoko Skwid_ (n=Skwid@cpe-72-130-168-187.san.res.rr.com) |
| 20:58.39 | happycube | *you're |
| 20:58.39 | woglinde | but I know where to get debugboard |
| 20:58.40 | *** join/#openmoko ds3 (n=dpfleger@nat0.xsigo.com) |
| 20:58.45 | *** part/#openmoko Skwid_ (n=Skwid@cpe-72-130-168-187.san.res.rr.com) |
| 20:59.37 | Elrond | woglinde - Well, third time was "make sure a debugboard is within <50km ;o)" ;o) |
| 21:00.14 | *** join/#openmoko chrisphoneman (i=chris@75-134-181-201.dhcp.bycy.mi.charter.com) |
| 21:00.15 | pavelm | is there way to tell configure to produce static binary? |
| 21:00.38 | Elrond | pavelm - ./configure CFLAGS=-static |
| 21:00.44 | woglinde | ./configure --help should tell you |
| 21:03.44 | pavelm | ./configre --help is useless |
| 21:04.57 | woglinde | haeh? |
| 21:07.02 | *** join/#openmoko morpheus (n=morpheus@DSL01.83.171.152.218.ip-pool.NEFkom.net) |
| 21:07.27 | pavelm | ....something still manages to pass -dynamic to libtool, so I get ...-static -static -dynamic... on its commandline. |
| 21:08.07 | ewanm89_laptop | night |
| 21:08.31 | woglinde | pavelm hm |
| 21:09.05 | pavelm | night, ewan. |
| 21:10.59 | pavelm | ...ok, I managed to hand-edit makefile, good. |
| 21:13.09 | *** join/#openmoko Devestate (n=Devestat@72.34.82.226) |
| 21:14.39 | woglinde | normaly --enable-static should e enough |
| 21:15.16 | jfreels | are the modules required? |
| 21:15.34 | pavelm | woglinde: aha... Perhaps I should not have been using CFLAGS by hand. |
| 21:16.31 | woglinde | pavelm yes |
| 21:16.52 | woglinde | jfreels only when you need sound |
| 21:16.59 | woglinde | and mmc support |
| 21:17.00 | jfreels | okay, thank you |
| 21:17.05 | woglinde | but It can crash the kernel |
| 21:17.13 | jfreels | not having them? |
| 21:17.58 | woglinde | having them |
| 21:18.07 | jfreels | okay |
| 21:19.10 | cxreg | no FIC or Moko at oscon right? |
| 21:20.28 | *** join/#openmoko jpozlovsky (n=jindra@rb5cc115.net.upc.cz) |
| 21:21.49 | jfreels | HA, "The software installed on your device is a factory variant with very limited functionality. In fact, it may not even boot Linux."...that's me |
| 21:22.10 | Elrond | *lol* |
| 21:22.21 | jfreels | never looked at that wiki page, since I didn't order it |
| 21:23.04 | *** join/#openmoko lar5 (n=laprican@hsiproxy.astra-net.com) |
| 21:23.22 | *** join/#openmoko bkuhn (i=bkuhn@conference/oscon/x-9051f5f7b2adc117) |
| 21:23.31 | jfreels | good luck guys....those of you that are waiting to get yours. Hopefully you don't have to go through this much trouble |
| 21:23.45 | jfreels | if I get mine working, I will document it |
| 21:25.06 | pavelm | uhuh. I just sent sms to openmoko. gsmd did not produce any event :-( |
| 21:25.41 | ynezz | gsmd should work? :p |
| 21:25.48 | pavelm | jfreels: look at "flashing openmoko" and just follow the steps. |
| 21:25.58 | pavelm | ...but be sure to select phase1 binaries... |
| 21:25.59 | jfreels | HAHA |
| 21:26.00 | jfreels | okay |
| 21:26.14 | jfreels | way ahead of you, buddy |
| 21:26.14 | pavelm | is your uboot new enough? |
| 21:26.38 | jfreels | that's what I'm having the issue with...I flashed using what I thought was the latest one...but that was like taking a step back... |
| 21:27.52 | jfreels | i'm gonna try another one real quick, before I leave work |
| 21:28.53 | pavelm | ok, so openmoko at least stored those messages on a SIM card. good. |
| 21:29.22 | *** join/#openmoko DukeOfURL_ (n=chatzill@introspect.com) |
| 21:29.42 | *** join/#openmoko SpeedEvil (n=fjfjfjf@mauve.plus.com) |
| 21:30.25 | cxreg | so there's a bof on thursday, but that's it. i guess that's something. |
| 21:30.29 | cxreg | http://conferences.oreillynet.com/cs/os2007/view/e_sess/14810 |
| 21:30.46 | jfreels | hold the phone....... |
| 21:31.03 | jfreels | I just flashed an older uboot file, but the date still shows the newer date...jul 4 |
| 21:31.10 | *** join/#openmoko foodelpish (n=thomas@DSL01.83.171.162.56.ip-pool.NEFkom.net) |
| 21:31.10 | SpeedEvil | Elrond: now on the wiki - the orbits seem to backpropagate OK to march - the positions match to within a degree of the observed GPGSV lines. |
| 21:31.16 | jfreels | the uboot I tried to use was from june and I didn't receive an error |
| 21:31.19 | jfreels | flashing |
| 21:31.26 | SpeedEvil | Elrond: I was wrong on the rate too - it's around +-600m/s max |
| 21:32.06 | pavelm | that's seriously strange. Are you using the right commandline? |
| 21:32.34 | Elrond | SpeedEvil - Huh, that's in the order of this law restriction, isn't it? |
| 21:32.51 | SpeedEvil | Elrond: yes. |
| 21:32.55 | kristian-m | pavelm are there any messages generated at /dev/ttySAC0 on receiving SMS? |
| 21:32.56 | jfreels | yeah, and it succeeds, that's the weird thing |
| 21:33.17 | pavelm | jfreels: What commandline do you use? |
| 21:33.41 | pavelm | kristian: I did not check that. I believe smsnotification needs to be turned on via at command. |
| 21:33.42 | jfreels | dfu-util -a 1 -R -D ./uboot.bin |
| 21:34.08 | pavelm | speed: So you are decoding hammerhead now? |
| 21:34.13 | SpeedEvil | kristian-m: and as GSMd is what's talking to the modem, you'll need to do that. |
| 21:34.26 | Kensan | jfreels: can you post/pastebin the output from "./dfu-util --list"? |
| 21:34.40 | SpeedEvil | pavelm: no - this was taking current orbital elements, and printing out what the dopplers of the satellites would have been at that time |
| 21:34.45 | pavelm | jfr: Strange... that should work. |
| 21:34.48 | SpeedEvil | Back in march |
| 21:34.58 | SpeedEvil | kristian-m: hack gpsd that is |
| 21:35.04 | *** join/#openmoko zedstar (n=john@82-44-202-121.cable.ubr08.haye.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 21:35.32 | SpeedEvil | kristian-m: hack gsmd that is |
| 21:35.32 | jfreels | Found Runtime: [0x1457:0x5119] devnum=72, cfg=0, intf=2, alt=0, name="USB Device Firmware Upgrade" |
| 21:35.44 | woglinde | jfreels that looks good |
| 21:35.59 | jfreels | yeah =( |
| 21:36.08 | grobian1 | =) |
| 21:36.25 | pavelm | jfreels: Well, you still have openmoko and not a brick ;-) |
| 21:36.34 | jfreels | I just flashed the u-boot-gta01bv4-r9 90........0 2198.bin file |
| 21:36.35 | kristian-m | SpeedEvil well, i which i could... ;-) |
| 21:36.38 | jfreels | very true |
| 21:36.45 | Kensan | jfreels: so your neo is *not* in dfu-mode... |
| 21:37.02 | jfreels | Kensan: it is now |
| 21:37.20 | Kensan | jfreels: ok, then issue the command again, it should have different output. |
| 21:37.42 | pavelm | kristian: Actually, any gsm phone should have mostly same AT command set, so you can start patching gsmd now. |
| 21:38.04 | jfreels | why would the "-l" have a different output the second time? |
| 21:38.20 | Kensan | jfreels: see http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Dfu-util#--list |
| 21:38.23 | jfreels | if I go out of DFU mode, I see the 6 different interfaces |
| 21:38.32 | hrw | jfreels: and this is ok |
| 21:38.39 | jfreels | yes |
| 21:38.52 | jfreels | so why are my flashes not taking effect? |
| 21:38.58 | jfreels | any ideas? |
| 21:38.58 | hrw | jfreels: neo return 1 or 6 dfu items |
| 21:39.06 | hrw | jfreels: kernel or rootfs flashing? |
| 21:39.09 | jfreels | 6 |
| 21:39.16 | jfreels | u-boot flashing |
| 21:39.20 | *** join/#openmoko baze (n=baze@xdsl-213-168-118-104.netcologne.de) |
| 21:39.27 | jfreels | already flashed kernel and rootfs...no go |
| 21:39.35 | jfreels | they flashed fine, but didn't make my phone work |
| 21:39.45 | hrw | so how it behave? |
| 21:39.59 | jfreels | I turn it on, I see tux and he just stares at me |
| 21:39.59 | pavelm | jfr: On some uboot version, erase of flash was neccessary before dfu |
| 21:40.07 | pavelm | jfr: but those were _old_ versions. |
| 21:40.12 | kristian-m | pavelm i have to write a test on thursday, and have to hand in coding-course-solutions on wednesday - just doing a python websearchbot rigth now... |
| 21:42.10 | jfreels | flashed uboot again..."No Error condition present" is returned |
| 21:42.16 | jfreels | lets see what happens this time |
| 21:42.48 | jfreels | STILL JULY 4 WTF!!!!!!11 |
| 21:42.58 | jfreels | ok, I gotta leave work...I'll try again tomorrow |
| 21:43.10 | woglinde | bye jfreels |
| 21:43.17 | pavelm | jfr: Try asking around if july 4 uboot works for people. |
| 21:43.26 | pavelm | If it does... you do not want to touch it. |
| 21:43.38 | jfreels | will do, i'll ask tomorrow, thanks guys for your help! much appreciated! |
| 21:43.48 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[P1_Owners]] [[Hammerhead/Protocol]] [[Variometer]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Ottawa]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Trondheim]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Norway]] |
| 21:45.07 | hrw | bye |
| 21:45.29 | pavelm | bye, hrw |
| 21:45.54 | *** join/#openmoko idarwin (n=ian@207.81.133.5) |
| 21:48.09 | *** join/#openmoko Devestate (n=Devestat@72.34.82.226) |
| 21:48.32 | *** join/#openmoko switch3r (n=switch3r@dsktop.student.umd.edu) |
| 21:48.42 | pavelm | does pin enter work for you? |
| 21:50.52 | harzi | anyone at the camp near berlin, showing off his neo1973? |
| 21:51.33 | grobian1 | camp near berlin? |
| 21:51.39 | grobian1 | CCC ? |
| 21:52.21 | woglinde | harzi yes |
| 21:52.30 | woglinde | please read the wiki |
| 21:52.47 | woglinde | lazy peoples |
| 21:52.52 | woglinde | *g* |
| 21:53.08 | grobian1 | i read the wiki |
| 21:53.13 | woglinde | ccc wiki |
| 21:53.16 | harzi | CCC yes, hm let me check the wiki |
| 21:53.28 | woglinde | or camp wiki |
| 21:53.30 | grobian1 | but i dont memorize it |
| 21:53.30 | harzi | in the ccc wiki is nothing about |
| 21:53.46 | harzi | camp wiki i mean |
| 21:53.52 | woglinde | sure? |
| 21:54.15 | harzi | hm, don't hurt me, if you find... but i didn0t |
| 21:54.55 | woglinde | I will hurt you *g* |
| 21:54.58 | *** join/#openmoko mil_ (n=talusha@jabber.hst.ru) |
| 21:55.10 | woglinde | https://events.ccc.de/camp/2007/GSM_Village |
| 21:55.50 | harzi | ah, a village |
| 21:56.08 | harzi | i searched the "Fahrplan" and stuff |
| 21:56.25 | woglinde | now I will hurt you |
| 21:56.33 | woglinde | *g* |
| 21:56.48 | woglinde | one week using win 3.11 |
| 21:57.46 | ferric | counter |
| 21:57.47 | aloril | (last update 2007-07-21 06:20) http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter : Order https://direct.openmoko.com/ ; Shipping prob. 75% in 2 days 07:01:06 (2.292±2.3 days) (1772;251) |
| 21:58.24 | grobian1 | http://chaosradio.ccc.de/cre042.html |
| 21:58.29 | grobian1 | german |
| 21:59.52 | harzi | woglinde: oh, that isn't to bad, better than vista |
| 22:00.14 | woglinde | I have no problems with vista |
| 22:00.25 | woglinde | only lack of some 64bit apps |
| 22:01.20 | *** join/#openmoko summatusmentis (n=summatus@216.17.28.226.ip.usinternet.com) |
| 22:01.28 | summatusmentis | join ##apple |
| 22:01.32 | summatusmentis | crap, sorry |
| 22:01.37 | woglinde | lol |
| 22:01.50 | harzi | never played with it, but there are rumours that e.g. mobile-sync-soft works badly |
| 22:01.54 | Elrond | woglinde - www.badvista.org ;-) |
| 22:01.55 | ozarka | We're all friends here. No judgment. |
| 22:05.48 | *** join/#openmoko dcordes (n=ucordes@e179103133.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 22:07.48 | *** join/#openmoko morpheus (n=morpheus@DSL01.83.171.168.204.ip-pool.NEFkom.net) |
| 22:09.30 | pavelm | Is there an easy way to read line from stdin in python? |
| 22:09.40 | pavelm | ...I know how to read files, but this one needs to be interactive. |
| 22:09.49 | *** join/#openmoko mindCrime (n=chatzill@cpe-065-190-188-124.nc.res.rr.com) |
| 22:10.05 | *** join/#openmoko Tyrael (n=tyrael@213-140-6-114.ip.fastwebnet.it) |
| 22:10.30 | Elrond | pavelm - sys.stdin.readline() |
| 22:10.45 | *** join/#openmoko IamJAX (n=jax@202.83.42.27) |
| 22:10.48 | Elrond | pavelm - Or do you want readline something? I'd need to check that. |
| 22:11.14 | pavelm | thanks, elrond. That does the trick. |
| 22:13.03 | woglinde | pavelm with zecke's python bindings? |
| 22:13.39 | *** join/#openmoko NooN (n=noon@lis1.ph-freiburg.de) |
| 22:13.44 | NooN | hello |
| 22:14.33 | woglinde | hi noon |
| 22:14.44 | *** part/#openmoko IamJAX (n=jax@202.83.42.27) |
| 22:15.51 | pavelm | woglinde: No, with libgmsd-tool -m shell and lots of ugly hackery ;-) |
| 22:16.00 | Tyrael | Hi, news on shipping? |
| 22:16.18 | woglinde | pavelm hm python bindings not good enough? |
| 22:16.47 | *** join/#openmoko danilos (n=danilo@163.pool85-48-166.static.orange.es) |
| 22:17.21 | pavelm | woglinde: Never got to get them working... |
| 22:17.30 | pavelm | wog: Yep, shame on me... |
| 22:17.34 | woglinde | hehe |
| 22:20.10 | pavelm | wog: you know, dbus... too advanced technology |
| 22:20.59 | *** join/#openmoko radiorental_ (n=radioren@ip-151-104-73-83.corp.ne.3com.com) |
| 22:21.59 | radiorental_ | heyhey! just had a call from my cc company 'we noticed a strange debit on your card for 309 USD" YAY! |
| 22:22.07 | orospakr | pavelm: everything is exposed via dbus, right? |
| 22:22.27 | Stephmw | evenin' |
| 22:22.34 | radiorental_ | heyup |
| 22:22.47 | orospakr | I assume Dialer application talks to the GSM service over dbus, and receives rings as signals...? |
| 22:22.54 | orospakr | pavelm: I sure hope you're kidding :P |
| 22:23.25 | pavelm | oro: NOt sure, I thought it talks to gsmd via socket. |
| 22:23.32 | orospakr | yuck. |
| 22:23.33 | Vegar | radiorental_: Was shipping only 9 USD? |
| 22:23.35 | orospakr | that needs fixing. |
| 22:23.42 | radiorental_ | basic shipping in the US |
| 22:23.45 | orospakr | well, once I get my Neo I can fart around with this stuff. :) |
| 22:24.32 | *** join/#openmoko _kaiser_ (n=kaiser@74-140-187-27.dhcp.insightbb.com) |
| 22:24.39 | ozarka | radiorental_: what was your order #? |
| 22:24.41 | radiorental_ | So, I'm a linux noob. I'm trying to build an enviroment based on the instructions at http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/MokoMakefile |
| 22:24.55 | pavelm | oro: actually it is not broken. Sockets are suitable for this thing. |
| 22:25.03 | radiorental_ | 4 - Set up the environment: make setup |
| 22:25.33 | radiorental_ | and I get: make: *** No rule to make target `setup'. Stop. |
| 22:25.33 | orospakr | pavelm: using dbus means that you're factoring out all the IPC stuff; it also means that you can have multiple programs subscribe to events from the GSM daemon. |
| 22:25.38 | radiorental_ | what am I missing? |
| 22:26.20 | summatusmentis | what's the screen res on the neo? |
| 22:26.21 | Elrond | orospakr - dbus uses sockets anyway. |
| 22:26.21 | radiorental_ | ozarka: no order no. Just a call from my cc company that I've been debited 309, which is what the total was |
| 22:27.07 | orospakr | pavelm: and it would be more consistent with the direction of the Linux desktop stuff. |
| 22:27.12 | orospakr | Elrond: yup. |
| 22:27.51 | pavelm | oro: gsmd seems to handle multiple readers just fine, and it is right that it is not dependend on dbus. It is lower-level service. |
| 22:28.26 | Elrond | orospakr - While you are a dbus advocat: How's performance with dbus vs. dce/rpc over sockets? |
| 22:28.32 | *** part/#openmoko herbyle (n=pascal@p54A367BD.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 22:28.54 | writchie | pavelm: the gsmd code i'm looking at doesn handle multiple app streams at all! |
| 22:29.04 | *** join/#openmoko MDK (n=mdk@cs181222091.pp.htv.fi) |
| 22:29.08 | orospakr | Elrond: for simple message passing? the different is negligible, I expect. dbus is being used on other embedded platforms. |
| 22:29.15 | orospakr | it is used very extensively by OLPC> |
| 22:29.21 | orospakr | s/OLPC>/OLPC./ |
| 22:29.28 | daMaestro | olpc++ |
| 22:29.33 | orospakr | ^5! |
| 22:29.40 | ozarka | radiorental_: what distro are you using? |
| 22:29.46 | radiorental_ | ubunut |
| 22:29.49 | Elrond | orospakr - I consider dbus for a server thing. |
| 22:29.52 | radiorental_ | hehe, sorry |
| 22:30.00 | ozarka | (I went through the MokoMakefile last week without to much trouble) |
| 22:30.03 | pavelm | writchie: are you sure? it seems to work here. |
| 22:30.36 | woglinde | elrond using corba? |
| 22:30.40 | woglinde | *g* |
| 22:30.40 | SpeedEvil | summatusmentis: 480*640 |
| 22:30.40 | ozarka | 7.0.4? |
| 22:30.45 | woglinde | corba is ugly |
| 22:30.56 | radiorental_ | I dont know what 'no rule to make target' means exactly but it sounds pretty fundamentally basic (o; |
| 22:31.05 | writchie | writchie:what multiple apps work say fax + sms at same time? |
| 22:31.12 | orospakr | Elrond: sorry, I don't quite grok your statement. what do you mean exactly? |
| 22:31.18 | Elrond | woglinde - I'm currently using dce/rpc over sockets, homegrown, optimised. |
| 22:32.04 | Elrond | orospakr - I have a server box, with multiple daemons, they need to talk to each other. |
| 22:32.07 | pavelm | hmm, is there any kind of signal that incoming call is no longer incoming? |
| 22:32.17 | orospakr | Elrond: that is a good use for dbus, certainly. |
| 22:32.25 | writchie | yes |
| 22:32.39 | woglinde | elrond whats dce for? |
| 22:32.44 | writchie | all the synchronization and serialization needs to be in gsmd |
| 22:32.45 | Elrond | orospakr - Well, use: maybe. Performance is the question. |
| 22:32.47 | orospakr | Elrond: but it is also a good way for privileged daemons and user-level GUI applications to interact. NetworkManager is a good case study. |
| 22:32.48 | writchie | and exported via dbus |
| 22:33.10 | *** join/#openmoko pixelstick (n=dwpage@d-74-214-40-122.metrocast.net) |
| 22:33.32 | ozarka | radiorental_ : Did you add all the packages in step 1? |
| 22:33.48 | Elrond | woglinde - dce/rpc != onc/rpc != corba/rpc. Different ways of doing RPC. |
| 22:34.04 | radiorental_ | yup, but there was one thing I didnt 'get'.... |
| 22:34.07 | woglinde | yeah thats why I asked about dce |
| 22:34.17 | woglinde | I am too lazy to ask wiki |
| 22:34.18 | woglinde | now |
| 22:34.26 | ozarka | What didn't you 'get'? |
| 22:34.27 | Elrond | Distributed Computing Environment. |
| 22:34.32 | Elrond | Old, very old. |
| 22:34.34 | radiorental_ | ozarka: on the openembedded page "If the ipkg-build script is not installed on your system, get it from here: http://www.openembedded.org/repo/org.openembedded.packaged-staging/contrib/scripts/ipkg-build" |
| 22:34.45 | radiorental_ | how do I check that? |
| 22:35.07 | radiorental_ | ozarka: http://www.openembedded.org/wiki/OEandYourDistro |
| 22:35.28 | orospakr | Elrond: nicks dcbw (Dan Williams) and J5 (John Palmieri), both on this server, are dbus guys. |
| 22:35.46 | woglinde | elrond all in c? |
| 22:35.54 | orospakr | Elrond: I'm sure they'd be happy to answer questions. |
| 22:35.56 | Elrond | woglinde - We need dce/rpc to talk to other proprietary services anyway, so doing dce/rpc for internal use was/is simple. |
| 22:36.00 | orospakr | gotta run! |
| 22:36.04 | ozarka | radiorental_: Weird... I didn't even notice that step and mine built fine. |
| 22:36.08 | Elrond | woglinde - Yes, all C. |
| 22:36.31 | woglinde | http://www.opengroup.org/dce/tech/ |
| 22:36.32 | woglinde | hm |
| 22:36.33 | radiorental_ | I'll go back and do it again tomorrow, thanks for your help! time to head home and dig holes in the lawn |
| 22:36.46 | radiorental_ | ozarka: thanks for your help |
| 22:37.04 | ozarka | np |
| 22:37.09 | *** join/#openmoko pixistick (n=dwpage@d-74-214-40-122.metrocast.net) |
| 22:37.19 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@qiqinebs.chi.il.us) |
| 22:37.32 | *** part/#openmoko pixistick (n=dwpage@d-74-214-40-122.metrocast.net) |
| 22:37.50 | ozarka | I don't think he's in the right directory when he's typing 'make setup' |
| 22:38.03 | *** join/#openmoko Skwid_ (n=Skwid@cpe-72-130-168-187.san.res.rr.com) |
| 22:38.10 | *** part/#openmoko Skwid_ (n=Skwid@cpe-72-130-168-187.san.res.rr.com) |
| 22:38.12 | ozarka | I mean, it should do something. |
| 22:38.24 | Elrond | woglinde - Yeah, opengroup still tries to get people to use dce/rpc. They even tried to opensource the main dce tools. |
| 22:38.26 | *** join/#openmoko pixistick (n=dwpage@d-74-214-40-122.metrocast.net) |
| 22:38.29 | NooN | Elrond: do you recrute new people for dce/rpc ;o) |
| 22:38.46 | Elrond | NooN - No. Trying to investigate dbus for possible replacement uses. |
| 22:39.15 | woglinde | I only did rpc with java |
| 22:40.10 | radiorental_ | ozarka: I' |
| 22:40.19 | radiorental_ | sheit |
| 22:40.30 | radiorental_ | ozarka: I'm in /home/moko |
| 22:40.42 | ozarka | radiorental_: Take your mittens off. You can type better. :-) |
| 22:41.01 | radiorental_ | tell me about it, fat fingered fumbler |
| 22:41.14 | ozarka | Is the makefile you got in step 2 or 3 in that directory? |
| 22:42.05 | *** join/#openmoko tr2x (n=alvar@80-218-185-55.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 22:42.10 | radiorental_ | step 3, yup.. but doing it again |
| 22:42.30 | NooN | Elrond: aah |
| 22:42.57 | *** join/#openmoko lmveloso (n=lmveloso@200-193-152-9.mganm702.dsl.brasiltelecom.net.br) |
| 22:43.28 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@qiqinebs.chi.il.us) |
| 22:44.00 | radiorental_ | ozarka: As I said I'm a linux noob, I didnt sudo. Forgive me for this basic question, how do I permantly switch to super user? |
| 22:44.12 | woglinde | sudo su -? |
| 22:44.21 | woglinde | but dont do all as root |
| 22:44.29 | radiorental_ | no, why not? |
| 22:44.42 | *** part/#openmoko Tyrael (n=tyrael@213-140-6-114.ip.fastwebnet.it) |
| 22:44.44 | radiorental_ | ok, this isnt the forum to learn linux, but thanks |
| 22:45.18 | woglinde | hm bitbake should yerk that you are running with root rights |
| 22:45.22 | Elrond | s/sudo su -/sudo -i/ |
| 22:45.22 | radiorental_ | thnx all, make setup now burning, I didnt notice the privellege warning before |
| 22:45.28 | NooN | sudo -i should also do the trick |
| 22:45.53 | pavelm | good night! |
| 22:45.59 | woglinde | nite pavelm |
| 22:46.12 | Elrond | Good night pavelm |
| 22:46.24 | NooN | is it possible to get 100MB/s through dbus? |
| 22:47.01 | woglinde | lol |
| 22:47.13 | pavelm | good night, elrond. (And good luck with hammerhead) |
| 22:47.19 | NooN | woglinde: whats so funny? |
| 22:47.31 | woglinde | think about it |
| 22:47.50 | ozarka | Is there any reason Mokomakefule needs to be run as root? |
| 22:47.56 | woglinde | nope |
| 22:48.25 | ozarka | I think the directions on the wiki are a little confusing, then. |
| 22:48.30 | woglinde | if moko where closer to oe bitbake would jerk about it |
| 22:48.56 | radiorental_ | oh for the love of god: "svn: Can't connect to host 'svn.berlios.de': Connection timed out |
| 22:48.56 | radiorental_ | make: *** [setup-bitbake] Error 1 |
| 22:48.56 | radiorental_ | " |
| 22:49.12 | woglinde | hehe bitbake |
| 22:49.23 | cesarb | radiorental_: try again until it gets through :( |
| 22:49.52 | radiorental_ | thanks (o; |
| 22:49.54 | ozarka | If you put the file in /home/moko then unless your login is 'moko' you need change user or the access to that directory. |
| 22:50.16 | cesarb | what's this /home/moko stuff? I just put it somewhere under my own home |
| 22:50.27 | cesarb | It makes no sense at all to make a "/home/moko" |
| 22:50.41 | ozarka | That's what I did. But the wiki says /home/moko |
| 22:50.42 | Elrond | woglinde - NooN's question is quite valid. It gets close to my performance question. |
| 22:50.49 | ozarka | which makes no sense at all. :-) |
| 22:51.33 | woglinde | elrond I dont know why you would send 100mb through an dbus approach |
| 22:51.58 | cesarb | ozarka: that's completely bogus advice, and will confuse almost all newbies... ~/openmoko makes much more sense |
| 22:51.58 | Elrond | Okay, that's the answer: Don't use dbus. ;o) |
| 22:52.09 | *** join/#openmoko Jason1 (n=ws1@c-24-15-3-175.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 22:52.32 | woglinde | its made for messaging not file transfer |
| 22:52.47 | woglinde | but maybe I will handle 100mb |
| 22:52.52 | woglinde | dont know |
| 22:53.08 | Elrond | Well, 10e6 messages/s of 10byte are 100mb/s ;-) |
| 22:53.33 | NooN | *g* |
| 22:53.57 | *** join/#openmoko miip (n=miip@p54A54E97.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 22:54.08 | Jason1 | Any news on our Neos? |
| 22:54.30 | ozarka | You didn't get yours?!? |
| 22:54.39 | ozarka | You might want to call the 800 number. |
| 22:54.41 | *** join/#openmoko C7 (n=C7@77-56-188-114.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 22:54.46 | Jason1 | ozarka: funny |
| 22:54.56 | cesarb | ozarka: done |
| 22:55.09 | ozarka | Mokobot thinks you have one. :-) |
| 22:55.30 | Jason1 | I would have bet that they would have shipped today. |
| 22:55.51 | Jason1 | ozarka: mokobot is just jealous b/c I should be the first one to get mine |
| 22:56.25 | ozarka | My cc hasn't even been charged. :-( |
| 22:56.36 | Aria | Nor mine. |
| 22:56.48 | Jason1 | ozarka: aHHH. Now I see. It is people like you that are holding up the shipping process ;) |
| 22:56.56 | Aria | Oo! |
| 22:56.58 | Aria | Woot! |
| 22:57.04 | cesarb | I have a theory as to why nothing has shipped yet |
| 22:57.13 | Jason1 | cesarb: please share |
| 22:57.17 | cesarb | Which is also a theory of why they suddenly got a better rate on the UPS |
| 22:57.24 | Jason1 | k |
| 22:57.34 | ozarka | You must tell us! Type faster! |
| 22:57.38 | cesarb | Simply, they probably got a volume discount, which means they would need to ship everything in a single batch |
| 22:57.54 | ozarka | Wow. Sucks to be Jason1. |
| 22:57.57 | cesarb | ozarka: hey, I just moved my keyboard to the right, I didn't get used to it yet <g> |
| 22:58.49 | Jason1 | ozarka: :( |
| 22:59.10 | *** join/#openmoko Risto (n=christop@p508CFCCE.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 22:59.32 | Jason1 | cesarb: I am sticking to my theory that something went wrong and they are re-flashing, re-packaging, repairing 1000 devices. |
| 22:59.44 | Elrond | Night people. |
| 22:59.48 | Jason1 | Elrond: g/n |
| 22:59.51 | woglinde | nite elrond |
| 23:00.26 | Jason1 | cesarb: Thats why they split the shipment from China. Half the factory is fixing, and held FIC America is scrambling ot fix |
| 23:00.37 | cesarb | Jason1: there's a hole on yours: they wouldn't need to reflash the phones in the fancy black boxes, only the phones in the plain white boxes |
| 23:00.51 | ozarka | The bulk shipment doesn't explain why they can only process a few cc's each day. |
| 23:01.08 | cesarb | Jason1: since the ones in the fancy black boxes can be reflashed by the end-guinea pig |
| 23:01.19 | Jason1 | ozarka: Maybe b/c they exchange rates keep changing on 'em? |
| 23:01.24 | cesarb | ozarka: no, but it explains why there's no shipment confirmation yet |
| 23:01.30 | ozarka | But if they fixed one and charged one cc, why not ship it? |
| 23:01.54 | cesarb | ozarka: if I'm right, we will get a huge batch of shipment confirmations after all (or a large part of) the cc cards are charged |
| 23:02.05 | Jason1 | ozarka: Wish I knew. FIC is REALLY, REALLY good at keeping quiet. |
| 23:02.18 | Aria | Nearly as good as Apple. |
| 23:02.29 | cesarb | (and the reason for the slowness of CC charging is obvious: manual process, with only a few people doing it) |
| 23:02.33 | Jason1 | cesarb: CCs are lookign fairly good now accoriding to the wiki. |
| 23:03.11 | *** join/#openmoko _rob_ (n=rob@77.47.0.11.static.cablesurf.de) |
| 23:03.13 | Jason1 | Aria: At least when apple leaks info, it is usaully accurate. |
| 23:03.19 | *** join/#openmoko gabaug (n=gabe@c-67-167-90-105.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 23:03.28 | writchie | I expect that as we speak they are handing over a big batch of shipments to ups. |
| 23:03.46 | Jason1 | cesarb: It seems like 1000 CCs would be a walk in the park. Couple days work? |
| 23:03.47 | writchie | I don't think they would have charged cards they didn't expect to ship next business day or two |
| 23:04.02 | mmazur | We can hope. |
| 23:04.17 | cesarb | Jason1: not if you go process each one by hand (no crazy batch scripts this time), print each label by hand, and stick it on the correct box |
| 23:04.19 | Jason1 | writchie: I was charged last Wednesday... more than a few business days for me... |
| 23:04.46 | writchie | 3 is not a few? |
| 23:05.15 | writchie | the first couple were test cases. Most were charged from friday on |
| 23:05.56 | Jason1 | writchie: ok, ok. maybe I am jumping hte gun a little, but come one. Even they were anticipating a faster delivery. |
| 23:06.18 | writchie | things never work out has you plan |
| 23:06.19 | Jason1 | cesarb: most likely. |
| 23:06.21 | writchie | or didn't plan |
| 23:06.35 | Jason1 | writchie: 'didnt' is more like it ;) |
| 23:06.46 | writchie | i think harold was pissed because for a while the site was confusing. |
| 23:06.54 | writchie | looked like this was a real phone |
| 23:07.02 | Jason1 | writchie: he wrote it, didnt he? |
| 23:07.13 | writchie | this will lead to bad press and disappointed user who had no business ordering this |
| 23:07.13 | cesarb | writchie: no, he was annoyed because he had to write it on a hurry |
| 23:07.20 | Jason1 | writchie: I know he did all the shopping cart stuff |
| 23:07.47 | writchie | yes he did it because he had to |
| 23:08.30 | Jason1 | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hofstadter's_Law |
| 23:08.35 | writchie | i think he was trying to recover was a potential disaster. |
| 23:08.45 | cesarb | Jason1: yeah, I tyoped, that name is impossible to type |
| 23:08.54 | *** part/#openmoko Risto (n=christop@p508CFCCE.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 23:09.11 | Jason1 | cesarb: had to look it up :) |
| 23:09.39 | Jason1 | So, are we still keeping odds on projected ship dates? |
| 23:10.07 | writchie | will ship sometime in the future for sure |
| 23:10.17 | *** join/#openmoko orospakr (n=orospakr@ottawa-hs-209-217-93-173.d-ip.magma.ca) |
| 23:10.28 | *** join/#openmoko nop_ (n=nop@p54A09076.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 23:11.03 | Jason1 | writchie: Maybe they shipped earlier today, and the email server is clogged with all the tracking numbers.... |
| 23:11.18 | Jason1 | hey, it COULD happen! |
| 23:11.34 | SpeedEvil | More importantly. |
| 23:11.42 | SpeedEvil | Has someone pressed the button on the next lot. |
| 23:11.53 | writchie | good question. |
| 23:12.18 | Jason1 | SpeedEvil: Well, next lot is confusing since the shipment from China was broken into 2 shipments AFAIK |
| 23:12.26 | writchie | unless they're really stupid, they could have easily just printed up the airbills and forget about the tracking |
| 23:12.32 | *** join/#openmoko dietricha (n=dietrich@c-67-166-84-16.hsd1.or.comcast.net) |
| 23:12.36 | SpeedEvil | Next lot as in manufacturing. |
| 23:12.57 | writchie | depends on real number of orders. |
| 23:13.09 | writchie | many cards will reject the nt dollar stuff |
| 23:13.16 | Jason1 | SpeedEvil: I think they should worry about the first lot first :). Actually they really need to order the next batch. Order are at 4188, right? |
| 23:13.41 | writchie | ticket number 4188 !- order number |
| 23:13.43 | Jason1 | writchie: the Fraud Depot called me... |
| 23:13.49 | Jason1 | Depot=Dept |
| 23:14.10 | writchie | of course - how many time you been in taiwan |
| 23:14.14 | SpeedEvil | Jason1: pressing hte button on the next lot may be a completely core-team uninvolved process though. If they have got it setup for mass production, they have this sort of thing down. Making the phones isn't a problem. |
| 23:14.19 | Jason1 | writchie: I know, but it should be around =(4188-1830) |
| 23:14.48 | writchie | 500 - 1000 is a small run - depends on parts |
| 23:14.57 | Jason1 | SpeedEvil: true, so does that mean we get to blame FIC upper management? :) |
| 23:15.27 | writchie | blame for what. These are really just a couple of thousand developer articles. |
| 23:15.38 | SpeedEvil | under 1K were made |
| 23:15.49 | Jason1 | writchie: blame for my discomfort |
| 23:16.04 | Jason1 | :) |
| 23:16.09 | writchie | i'm assuming they will run another batch to match orders |
| 23:16.28 | writchie | i don't think they wan't to be stuck with these in inventory. |
| 23:17.01 | writchie | no design survives first contact with real customers |
| 23:17.10 | Jason1 | I dont think they were expecting ~2200 orders... |
| 23:17.29 | cesarb | Jason1: I think they were |
| 23:17.32 | cesarb | Jason1: but not as fast |
| 23:17.37 | writchie | 2000 phones is nothing. |
| 23:17.43 | cesarb | Jason1: they probably expected some 1000 a month |
| 23:17.57 | writchie | typical model run is more like 100K - 1 million |
| 23:18.03 | Jason1 | cesarb: What evidence of that do you see. From thee looks of things, it doesnt seem that they were prepared to ship more than a few hundered, if that |
| 23:18.23 | cesarb | Jason1: no evidence, just wild guessing |
| 23:18.39 | Jason1 | cesarb: I know, just playing devil's advocate. |
| 23:19.14 | *** join/#openmoko daMaestro (n=jon@fedora/damaestro) |
| 23:19.16 | writchie | the software is 6 months away from being a usable phone you could give someone to use. |
| 23:19.56 | writchie | btw - that is not a problem. |
| 23:20.08 | writchie | design cycle for most phones is 18 months |
| 23:20.10 | *** join/#openmoko alex-weej (n=alex@cpc2-darl3-0-0-cust237.midd.cable.ntl.com) |
| 23:20.15 | daMaestro | so, anyone get shipping information yet? |
| 23:20.36 | Jason1 | daMaestro: yup, you didnt get your's yet? |
| 23:20.48 | daMaestro | Jason1, no... don't think so |
| 23:21.06 | Jason1 | daMaestro: Yup, should be here, someday. |
| 23:21.14 | daMaestro | Jason1, nope... i got the "we took ur $$" message |
| 23:21.18 | daMaestro | Jason1, but no tracking information |
| 23:21.33 | daMaestro | it's coming up on end of day pickup for EDT |
| 23:21.56 | Jason1 | daMaestro: nah, j/k. You know FIC, silent as usual. Noboday has got shipment info... |
| 23:23.18 | daMaestro | i'm really, really glad i didn't splurg on next day shipping |
| 23:23.32 | daMaestro | it would have been more then pointless |
| 23:23.36 | Jason1 | daMaestro: Just rub it in. |
| 23:23.41 | daMaestro | ;-) |
| 23:23.42 | daMaestro | lol |
| 23:23.49 | daMaestro | hey, i did get 2nd day air |
| 23:23.57 | Jason1 | I got the super-duper express overnight. |
| 23:24.01 | SpeedEvil | IMO, you have a cast-iron right to a refund. |
| 23:24.15 | SpeedEvil | It was never said that the shipping would not take place next day |
| 23:24.20 | SpeedEvil | at least a refund on shipping |
| 23:24.39 | SpeedEvil | If you are in fact charged more for next day |
| 23:25.57 | Jason1 | Apparently I picked the wrong option and got "Someday Shipping" instead of "Next Day" |
| 23:26.20 | Jason1 | my mistake... |
| 23:26.22 | writchie | someday express |
| 23:26.30 | Jason1 | excatly :) |
| 23:27.26 | Jason1 | Once it ships, it should be hear next day. :) My luck though, UPS will lose the package. |
| 23:27.36 | Jason1 | doh! |
| 23:27.53 | Jason1 | hear=here |
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| 23:40.06 | *** part/#openmoko Markinoko (n=Markinok@bgn92-4-82-238-213-101.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 23:43.08 | kuyky | hey, is there a site that explains the qemu network thingy for noob ubuntu users? |
| 23:43.30 | woglinde | at the qemu site? |
| 23:44.04 | kuyky | well it's the openmoko that i want to connect |
| 23:44.06 | calamous__ | Do you think they are waiting to shit them in batch? |
| 23:44.08 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[P1_Owners]] [[Wish_List]] [[MokoMakefile]] [[Talk:Mokopedia]] [[Translation]] [[User:Alekcxjo]] [[Variometer]] |
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