| 00:03.24 | *** join/#openmoko sagacis (n=sagacis@cpe-76-185-118-188.tx.res.rr.com) |
| 00:08.44 | *** join/#openmoko switch3r (n=switch3r@bbclaptop.student.umd.edu) |
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| 00:52.28 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@qiqinebs.chi.il.us) |
| 00:54.11 | *** join/#openmoko jfreels (n=jfreels@c-24-98-137-104.hsd1.ga.comcast.net) |
| 00:54.12 | *** join/#openmoko openfanss (n=df@218.79.149.94) |
| 01:04.04 | openfanss | i use"bitbake mpg123" command to generate a mpg123-*.ipk file, but it don't know how to merge the package into rootfs |
| 01:06.11 | *** join/#openmoko Braguz (n=Zagrub@CPE000d88f15c73-CM0019477615ce.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
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| 01:26.57 | *** part/#openmoko chrisphoneman (i=chris@75-134-181-201.dhcp.bycy.mi.charter.com) |
| 01:31.57 | *** part/#openmoko sagacis (n=sagacis@cpe-76-185-118-188.tx.res.rr.com) |
| 01:34.47 | *** join/#openmoko hozer (n=hozer@excalibur.hozed.org) |
| 01:35.38 | galexande | :( |
| 01:35.51 | galexande | i don't want anyone towork through the weekend or anything, but i do want to get my neo before august |
| 01:35.53 | jfreels | o_O |
| 01:36.10 | hozer | what is the status anyway.. |
| 01:36.11 | jfreels | i'll bet yours will work ;) so you might be better off than me |
| 01:36.26 | galexande | hozer, they charged like 4 people on wednesday and apparently hit some sort of snag |
| 01:36.31 | hozer | jfreels: did you get one that was busted? |
| 01:36.33 | galexande | because nothing since |
| 01:36.44 | hozer | doh |
| 01:36.46 | jfreels | yeah |
| 01:36.48 | *** join/#openmoko Skwid_ (n=Skwid@adsl-64-173-169-47.dsl.frsn01.pacbell.net) |
| 01:37.05 | *** join/#openmoko khaije1 (n=khaije1@unaffiliated/khaije1) |
| 01:37.50 | SpeedEvil | The shipping computer went on fire, and burnt down the warehouse and 996 neos :) |
| 01:38.04 | khaije1 | something i was wondering about, is it possible to use the 2 3d accelerometers for biometric input suitable for authentication? |
| 01:38.11 | bmidgley | jfreels: what is wrong with it |
| 01:38.26 | hozer | jfreels: when did you get it? |
| 01:38.30 | jfreels | won't boot |
| 01:38.32 | jfreels | I got it weeks ago |
| 01:38.38 | jfreels | free demo unit |
| 01:38.46 | Skwid_ | hey everyone |
| 01:38.46 | hozer | ah, okay |
| 01:38.55 | Skwid_ | I just built openmoko with mokomakefile |
| 01:38.56 | bmidgley | jfreels does the screen show anything? |
| 01:39.01 | Skwid_ | but i cant manage to build qemu |
| 01:39.11 | galexande | khai, what do you mean? |
| 01:39.17 | SpeedEvil | khaije1: in principle. |
| 01:39.18 | hozer | Skwid_: do you have lynx installed? |
| 01:39.27 | hozer | and gcc3 |
| 01:39.30 | SpeedEvil | khaije1: they are very insensitive in some ways. |
| 01:39.33 | Skwid_ | hozer: yes |
| 01:39.36 | Skwid_ | i ran make download-images |
| 01:39.38 | Skwid_ | and then |
| 01:39.48 | Skwid_ | make flash-qemu-official doesnt work |
| 01:39.53 | SpeedEvil | khaije1: you can accurately tell where down is - it's probably not suitable for more than casual security. |
| 01:40.01 | jfreels | I only see the splash screen, and I can get to the boot menu, that's it |
| 01:40.07 | jfreels | working on re-flashing the device |
| 01:40.42 | Skwid_ | openmoko/flash.sh: line 77: /home/moko/build/qemu/arm-softmmu/qemu-system-arm: No such file or directory |
| 01:40.49 | khaije1 | SpeedEvil: i see, but it could still be used as a wand-based input paradigm |
| 01:41.17 | SpeedEvil | khaije1: Sure. |
| 01:41.26 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[User:Gilesjuk]] |
| 01:41.35 | khaije1 | iow 3d gestures to launch macros, this would be so cool! |
| 01:42.19 | khaije1 | i asked a little while ago, but is there any news about the gta03 or other devices yet? |
| 01:42.33 | SpeedEvil | Nope. |
| 01:42.46 | SpeedEvil | 2 is as far as details have been announced. |
| 01:42.54 | SpeedEvil | And even some of those are not firm. |
| 01:43.07 | Skwid_ | anyone É |
| 01:43.08 | Skwid_ | ? |
| 01:43.09 | khaije1 | i guess i shouldn't expect anything until sales of gta02 have ramped up |
| 01:44.47 | Skwid_ | can anyone give me advice ? |
| 01:45.48 | gcb77 | Skwid_: did you run make build-qemu |
| 01:46.56 | ckuethe | SiRF gets scrappy with Global Locate ... http://edisweb.usitc.gov/edismirror/337-596/Violation/269333/310905/40/81c6e8.pdf |
| 01:47.13 | ckuethe | includes nice high level introduction to GPS |
| 01:47.46 | Skwid_ | gcb77: i dont think so |
| 01:47.57 | *** join/#openmoko PirateHead (n=piratehe@AC865B92.ipt.aol.com) |
| 01:48.17 | PirateHead | wow, lots of people in #openmoko. I haven't been in here for months. |
| 01:49.24 | jfreels | appears you're missing a file skwid ;) |
| 01:50.09 | gcb77 | Skwid_: make build-qemu downloads and builds the qemu emulator package... it needs gcc3 and lynx |
| 01:50.21 | Skwid_ | gcb77: ok just ran it |
| 01:50.40 | Skwid_ | what do i need to run after make flash-qemu-official |
| 01:51.21 | *** join/#openmoko X704 (n=me@shr-46.oregoncoast.com) |
| 01:51.37 | gcb77 | Skwid_: make run-qemu |
| 01:51.42 | Skwid_ | ok |
| 01:51.44 | Skwid_ | thx ! |
| 01:51.51 | Skwid_ | the wiki didnt mention all this |
| 01:52.00 | X704 | w00t! go moko! |
| 01:52.24 | X704 | sorry, could not resist ;) |
| 01:52.51 | mil_ | Skwid_: it does.. need to read the paragraphs not only headlines ;) |
| 01:54.27 | gcb77 | Skwid_: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/MokoMakefile#QEMU |
| 01:55.05 | *** join/#openmoko Zword (n=Zword@bos94-3-82-226-234-106.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 01:55.25 | Skwid_ | gcb77 + mil_: it doesnt say anything about build-qemu ! |
| 01:56.08 | gcb77 | Skwid_: which page are you looking at? |
| 01:56.20 | Skwid_ | mokomakefile |
| 01:56.51 | Skwid_ | awesommmee it boots:) |
| 01:57.00 | mil_ | it does.. at least for me.. |
| 01:57.38 | Skwid_ | do i have to run qemu as root ? |
| 01:57.44 | mil_ | Skwid_: nice! try to ssh in.. |
| 01:58.01 | mil_ | nope |
| 01:58.13 | Skwid_ | because i had to compile everything as root |
| 01:58.17 | Skwid_ | in /home/moko |
| 01:59.46 | *** join/#openmoko holycow (n=hello@S01060016b6b53675.vf.shawcable.net) |
| 01:59.46 | mokobot | Hallelujah! |
| 01:59.53 | Skwid_ | well i couldnt write to /home/moko otherwise :( |
| 02:00.01 | Skwid_ | i guess i should've chowned |
| 02:00.03 | *** join/#openmoko kuyky (n=kuyky@85.138.202.113) |
| 02:00.06 | mil_ | linux gamer: root or die ;) |
| 02:00.27 | Skwid_ | so how do I choose 'boot' in the boot screen ? enter goes to the next option |
| 02:00.57 | Skwid_ | o |
| 02:00.58 | Skwid_ | space :) |
| 02:01.11 | mil_ | space? you can config that |
| 02:01.29 | jfreels | through qemu? |
| 02:02.20 | Skwid_ | yeah |
| 02:03.11 | sagaci3 | So, just four charges so far? |
| 02:03.32 | cesarb | Skwid_: you know, it prints to the console after you build the image, "space does this, enter does that..." |
| 02:04.36 | Skwid_ | sorry i didnt see :( |
| 02:04.47 | *** join/#openmoko LaF0rge (n=laforge@122-124-71-98.dynamic.hinet.net) |
| 02:05.56 | Skwid_ | nice :D |
| 02:08.44 | kiney | counter |
| 02:08.44 | aloril | (last update 2007-07-19 00:49) http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter : Order https://direct.openmoko.com/ ; Shipping prob. 65% in 04:55:37 (0.205±0.2 days) (1764;249) |
| 02:11.58 | *** join/#openmoko chrisphoneman (i=chris@75-134-181-201.dhcp.bycy.mi.charter.com) |
| 02:13.21 | aloril | so 4 people charged now? |
| 02:14.46 | sagaci3 | aloril: that was my question 10 minutes before |
| 02:14.54 | sagaci3 | I guess it's true.... |
| 02:15.12 | sagaci3 | or everybody else already has the phone and is too busy calling everybody with it |
| 02:15.35 | aloril | hehe, just saw that mention, well at least 2 should have been charged |
| 02:20.39 | jfreels | I got the rootfs flashed |
| 02:20.40 | jfreels | didn't help |
| 02:20.41 | X704 | openmoko uses GCC, right? |
| 02:21.33 | mellon | o yes |
| 02:22.34 | X704 | ok, good |
| 02:24.20 | cesarb | jfreels: if it will not boot, what is missing wouldn't be the root fs, what's missing would be the _kernel_ partition, right? or, another possibility, the commands on the environment partition are wrong |
| 02:25.00 | jfreels | yeah, that's what I figured, but since I don't have the debug board, i'm doing it through screen |
| 02:25.04 | cesarb | (before anyone asks "how many partitions are there?", IIRC uboot, uboot env, kernel, root, splash, and the bad blocks table at the end) |
| 02:25.12 | jfreels | and I only had that one file on my SD card |
| 02:25.56 | cesarb | jfreels: you can get to uboot via the serial, right? you could try to run the commands to ask it to boot by hand, instead of using the menu... |
| 02:25.59 | *** join/#openmoko charkins (n=casey@pdpc/supporter/active/charkins) |
| 02:26.33 | jfreels | yeah, that doesn't work either |
| 02:26.48 | jfreels | trust me, I have tried almost everything....that's why i'm flashing |
| 02:27.45 | bmidgley | fwiw, fic sent me a p1 with mismatched kernel/rootfs |
| 02:27.53 | bmidgley | had to flash it before any modules would load |
| 02:28.14 | Skwid_ | so can qemu have access to the internet ? i guess not since gta-01 has no wifi |
| 02:28.27 | cesarb | I wonder which bizarre misbehaviour will the first shipped phones (SH1) have... missing rootfs? missing kernel? something even more random? |
| 02:28.43 | cesarb | We will only know after the SH1 wiki page is updated... |
| 02:28.48 | dcorking | skwid - why not use gprs or bluetooth? |
| 02:29.03 | bmidgley | cesarb: broken images on the home screen, won't place calls most likely |
| 02:29.03 | cesarb | Skwid_: you can do some crazy USB dance to make qemu use the network IIRC |
| 02:29.18 | *** join/#openmoko kiney_ (n=kiney@p548824A8.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 02:29.18 | Skwid_ | cesarb: ok, i wont :) |
| 02:29.19 | cesarb | Skwid_: it's documented somewhere in the wiki IIRC |
| 02:29.22 | *** part/#openmoko Skwid_ (n=Skwid@adsl-64-173-169-47.dsl.frsn01.pacbell.net) |
| 02:29.27 | *** join/#openmoko Skwid_ (n=Skwid@adsl-64-173-169-47.dsl.frsn01.pacbell.net) |
| 02:29.46 | dcorking | bye |
| 02:30.01 | bmidgley | the home screen icons have been broken for a few weeks now |
| 02:32.06 | Skwid_ | sorry i clicked the wrong button :) |
| 02:32.23 | Skwid_ | so its a pain to have internet on qemu i guess |
| 02:33.48 | X704 | when is the dev edition scheduled to ship with a wireless card? |
| 02:33.49 | aloril | Currently sold Neo1973 GTA01B_v04 (P1) doesn't have WiFi, GTA02 (P2) which is scheduled for October will have WiFi with free (libre) drivers (Atheros AR6K): http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ#Q:_What_is_the_rationale_behind_the_exclusion_of_WiFi.3F |
| 02:33.54 | hozer | seems the qemu emulator needs '-net,qprs' ;) |
| 02:34.09 | *** join/#openmoko holtmann (n=holtmann@nikita.holtmann.net) |
| 02:34.10 | hozer | err, -net,gprs |
| 02:34.26 | *** join/#openmoko romulus_ (n=romulus@S0106000625a403af.vc.shawcable.net) |
| 02:38.08 | *** join/#openmoko Marex (n=Marex@85.132.236.161) |
| 02:40.12 | *** part/#openmoko romulus_ (n=romulus@S0106000625a403af.vc.shawcable.net) |
| 02:40.53 | Skwid_ | hum |
| 02:41.00 | *** join/#openmoko verbal (n=romulus@S0106000625a403af.vc.shawcable.net) |
| 02:41.02 | Skwid_ | does anybody have the rss reader working in qemu ? |
| 02:41.51 | *** join/#openmoko verbal (n=romulus@S0106000625a403af.vc.shawcable.net) |
| 02:42.49 | *** part/#openmoko verbal (n=romulus@S0106000625a403af.vc.shawcable.net) |
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| 02:50.26 | Skwid_ | does anybody have the rss reader or contacts working in qemu ? |
| 02:54.01 | cesarb | Skwid_: does anything beyond the dialer work at all, in qemu or not? |
| 02:54.55 | Skwid_ | cesarb: i dont know, that's why im asking :) |
| 02:56.13 | cesarb | Skwid_: heck, even _terminal_ misbehaves |
| 02:56.30 | Skwid_ | ok :) |
| 02:56.45 | cesarb | Skwid_: and the keyboard thingy.... well, let's say it never worked for me, until I asked here where it was, at which point it proceeded to always show up, as if to mock me |
| 02:57.01 | Skwid_ | :) |
| 02:57.55 | *** join/#openmoko |R (i=bob@modemcable241.28-203-24.mc.videotron.ca) |
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| 03:08.49 | *** part/#openmoko X704 (n=me@shr-46.oregoncoast.com) |
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| 03:37.14 | cesarb | openembedded is headache-inducing... WHY, for instance, does it build gcc two times? |
| 03:41.35 | *** join/#openmoko mil_ (n=talusha@jabber.hst.ru) |
| 03:41.46 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[P1_Owners]] [[Press_Coverage]] |
| 03:43.32 | *** join/#openmoko fiveplusone (n=six@207-237-141-181.c3-0.avec-ubr14.nyr-avec.ny.cable.rcn.com) |
| 03:44.53 | lysanderslair | does it build libraries with it after the first time? |
| 03:46.14 | *** join/#openmoko fiveplusone (n=six@207-237-141-181.c3-0.avec-ubr14.nyr-avec.ny.cable.rcn.com) |
| 03:57.29 | *** join/#openmoko wiml (n=wiml@underhill.hhhh.org) |
| 04:06.24 | hads | Probably builds gcc and then builds gcc with the built gcc. |
| 04:17.22 | Skwid_ | is libxml included in openmoko ? |
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| 04:22.26 | Mandarino | Helloo |
| 04:24.35 | *** join/#openmoko vallor (n=Rock@frenzy.wba.ponzo.net) |
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| 04:33.43 | mellon | cesar: because it's a cross-build. |
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| 04:46.13 | Mandarino | Do you if GTA02 come with 3g support? |
| 04:50.51 | aloril | faq |
| 04:50.52 | aloril | See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) |
| 04:50.57 | aloril | (answer is no) |
| 04:51.47 | aloril | some future device: good guess would be that there will be device with 3G at some point ;-) |
| 04:52.45 | *** join/#openmoko rtyler (i=tyler@morningsun.geekisp.com) |
| 04:53.05 | rtyler | has anybody yet prebuilt a xoo rootfs image or qemu image I could borrow ;) |
| 04:58.32 | *** join/#openmoko charkin1 (n=casey@68-114-222-250.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com) |
| 05:01.02 | Skwid_ | what's the advantage of using xoo instead of qemu ? |
| 05:01.20 | rtyler | Skwid_: Xoo actually installed on my frakking machine >_< |
| 05:01.34 | Skwid_ | lol ok |
| 05:01.36 | rtyler | on my Xubuntu box Qemu just won't find SDL, and in turn won't install |
| 05:02.30 | rtyler | too bad Virtual Box doesn't do arm |
| 05:03.01 | Skwid_ | i have an application in C / Gtk that i would like to port to openmoko, but im not sure where to start |
| 05:03.28 | Skwid_ | oh, i just found the hello world tutorial |
| 05:03.30 | Skwid_ | i'll start there |
| 05:03.36 | rtyler | Skwid_: same place I am, purchasing the dev machine, and then start trying to emulate :P |
| 05:04.53 | Skwid_ | now what i want is to get some test code running on the emulator :) |
| 05:05.00 | rtyler | ditto :P |
| 05:05.20 | *** join/#openmoko summatusmentis (n=summatus@72.168.202.219) |
| 05:05.48 | Skwid_ | rtyler: then we should write it on the wiki, when we manage to do it ;) |
| 05:06.04 | rtyler | Skwid_: I work at a web 2.0 company, I'm going to blog about it :P |
| 05:06.21 | Skwid_ | ill paste it int the wiki then :) |
| 05:07.44 | juri_ | blogging is truely a body function. ;) |
| 05:08.33 | *** join/#openmoko Linux_Galore (n=richard@60-242-20-212.static.tpgi.com.au) |
| 05:09.01 | Skwid_ | is there any other paege that tells how to start programming for openmoko ? the hello world one isnt really helpful |
| 05:09.26 | rtyler | Skwid_: it depends on what you're doing I think |
| 05:11.22 | *** join/#openmoko cibomahto (n=metsmatt@ip215.coronado-crossing.phx.ygnition.net) |
| 05:12.07 | Skwid_ | like how to get your app to show up in the menu, how to package it, how to include the libs you need etc |
| 05:12.14 | mil_ | :( /trunk/src/host/qemu-neo1973/block-qcow.c:26:18: zlib.h: No such file or directory |
| 05:12.14 | mil_ | /h yesterday make qemu worked on that machine or is this due to changes in moko trunk? any help |
| 05:13.52 | rtyler | mil_: I'm still at the point of getting QEMU working :'( |
| 05:18.06 | *** part/#openmoko ozarka (n=Compaq_O@cpe-76-184-78-54.tx.res.rr.com) |
| 05:19.34 | *** join/#openmoko Skwid1 (n=Skwid@adsl-64-173-169-47.dsl.frsn01.pacbell.net) |
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| 05:23.14 | Sup3rkiddo | howdy everyone |
| 05:23.37 | Skwid1 | hey |
| 05:30.57 | *** join/#openmoko Cyphi^ (n=cyphi@a91-153-116-247.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
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| 05:39.41 | Mandarino | aloril thanks :) I didn't your response until now |
| 05:40.56 | rtyler | huzzah, qemu from the openbox repo is finally building |
| 05:41.06 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Basic_End-user/ru]] [[%D0%98%D0%BD%D1%84%D0%BE%D1%80%D0%BC%D0%B0%D1%86%D0%B8%D1%8F_%D0%B4%D0%BB%D1%8F_%D0%BF%D0%BE%D0%BB%D1%8C%D0%B7%D0%BE%D0%B2%D0%B0%D1%82%D0%B5%D0%BB%D0%B5%D0%B9]] [[Main_Page/ru]] |
| 05:49.48 | rtyler | Skwid1: figure it out man :) |
| 05:50.03 | Skwid1 | i'm trying |
| 05:50.23 | rtyler | if it wasn't *vomits* Gtk, I could help :P |
| 05:50.36 | Skwid1 | well the Gtk part is taken care of |
| 05:50.48 | Skwid1 | it's the whole distribution thing |
| 05:51.00 | *** join/#openmoko icman (n=icman@123-240-172-33.cctv.dynamic.lsc.net.tw) |
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| 06:04.21 | cibomahto | Skwid1: Im having lots of fun with that as well |
| 06:04.41 | Skwid1 | cibomahto: with what ? |
| 06:06.30 | cibomahto | skwid1: getting a patch to be used by the qemu image |
| 06:06.54 | cibomahto | skwid1: im pretty new to most of these tools, so its taking time to go through everything |
| 06:06.54 | Skwid1 | yeah |
| 06:06.58 | Skwid1 | me too |
| 06:07.03 | Skwid1 | i'm completely confused |
| 06:07.07 | cibomahto | haha |
| 06:07.10 | cibomahto | yeah... |
| 06:07.26 | Skwid1 | i just want to add a test application that can be accessed through the main menu |
| 06:07.32 | Skwid1 | but I haven't been successful yet :) |
| 06:07.36 | cibomahto | right, right |
| 06:07.55 | cibomahto | im just trying to patch gsmd |
| 06:08.13 | cibomahto | eventually, it will work |
| 06:08.25 | Skwid1 | :) |
| 06:08.37 | *** join/#openmoko holtmann (n=holtmann@nikita.holtmann.net) |
| 06:10.02 | Skwid1 | i wish there was more docs on the wiki |
| 06:11.30 | cibomahto | yeah |
| 06:16.41 | Skwid1 | i give up for toda |
| 06:16.42 | Skwid1 | today |
| 06:19.24 | rtyler | hrm, for some reason, I can't get the qemu image to respond to the keyboard |
| 06:19.36 | rtyler | neo_vib_switch: Vibrator stopped. |
| 06:19.36 | rtyler | neo_bl_switch: LCD Backlight now on. |
| 06:19.36 | rtyler | pcf_write: Power-off requested. |
| 06:19.46 | cibomahto | skwid1: well, dont get too discouraged :-) |
| 06:19.50 | mellon | Keyboard meaning the USB keyboard? |
| 06:19.55 | mellon | Or the screen keyboard? |
| 06:20.05 | rtyler | I don't get past the bootloader |
| 06:20.10 | rtyler | (with QEMU) |
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| 06:20.15 | mellon | ah |
| 06:21.01 | rtyler | any thoughts? |
| 06:21.43 | mellon | Well, I'd be surprised if it would respond to keypresses at that point - it probably will only respond to touch screen presses (that is, mouse clicks)./ |
| 06:22.10 | rtyler | it says "Press [AUX] to select, [POWER] to execute |
| 06:22.36 | mwester | Well, press power! |
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| 06:22.38 | mellon | Ah. It's talking about a hard button on the unit. |
| 06:22.49 | rtyler | I don't have a unit >_> |
| 06:22.56 | rtyler | this is with qemu |
| 06:23.00 | mellon | I know, but it probably thinks you have one. |
| 06:23.00 | cibomahto | mellon: this is mapped to [space] on my keyboard |
| 06:23.00 | mwester | Enter and Spacebar map to Power and AUX on qemu |
| 06:23.10 | mellon | ah, okay. |
| 06:23.14 | rtyler | or do I actually need the hardware somehow for QEMU o_O |
| 06:23.40 | mellon | nono, you just need it to emulate something that looks like the hardware. |
| 06:23.40 | rtyler | mwester: I thought so, but it doesn't do anything :/ |
| 06:23.55 | rtyler | (running over X11 over SSH) |
| 06:24.00 | rtyler | using these: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/OpenMoko_under_QEMU |
| 06:24.01 | mellon | Does qemu do the "capture the mouse and keyboard" thing? |
| 06:24.06 | *** part/#openmoko holtmann (n=holtmann@nikita.holtmann.net) |
| 06:25.12 | rtyler | not responding to anything >_< |
| 06:25.21 | *** join/#openmoko SiO2 (n=sarge@p54B3B59A.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 06:25.46 | aloril | counter_msg (last update 2007-07-21 06:20) http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter : Order https://direct.openmoko.com/ ; Shipping prob. 75% in |
| 06:25.46 | aloril | aloril changed counter prefix message to (last update 2007-07-21 06:20) http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter : Order https://direct.openmoko.com/ ; Shipping prob. 75% in |
| 06:25.46 | rtyler | jbt6k74_command: Display on. |
| 06:25.48 | rtyler | neo_vib_switch: Buzz, buzz. |
| 06:25.55 | rtyler | chuckles* rather |
| 06:26.05 | mellon | that wiki page seems to be talking about what to do after you've gotten it to boot. |
| 06:26.06 | aloril | just adjusted guess ;-) |
| 06:26.07 | aloril | counter |
| 06:26.07 | aloril | (last update 2007-07-21 06:20) http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter : Order https://direct.openmoko.com/ ; Shipping prob. 75% in 4 days 17:33:52 (4.732±2.5 days) (1765;249) |
| 06:27.13 | rtyler | mellon: yeah I noticed :P |
| 06:27.16 | rtyler | any ideas? :/ |
| 06:27.34 | mellon | I'm pretty clueless at this point. Check back with me when I've gotten it to work. :'} |
| 06:27.47 | mellon | Right now I'm still waiting for it to build. |
| 06:28.34 | rtyler | GAH >_< |
| 06:28.47 | mellon | But anyway, the thing that's going to trigger hardware buttons is not an emulated USB channel. |
| 06:30.45 | mellon | Can you click on the image and *then* try typing? |
| 06:30.51 | mellon | the screen image, I mean. |
| 06:30.54 | rtyler | yeah, no dice :/ |
| 06:31.00 | rtyler | BUT |
| 06:31.00 | rtyler | http://www.flickr.com/photos/agentdero/863257156/ |
| 06:31.02 | rtyler | that's hot :P |
| 06:31.22 | mellon | Is that you? |
| 06:31.30 | rtyler | yep |
| 06:31.40 | mellon | Nice, so you have it running on your Mac. |
| 06:31.45 | rtyler | heh, nope |
| 06:31.56 | rtyler | SSH tunnel to the dual core opteron sitting next to me |
| 06:32.05 | mellon | Ah. |
| 06:32.11 | mellon | Close enough. |
| 06:32.24 | rtyler | if it ran |
| 06:32.45 | mellon | typing to the shell window that you're running qemu under doesn't work, I take it. |
| 06:32.51 | mellon | that is, e.g., hitting space or ret. |
| 06:32.58 | mellon | (urn) |
| 06:33.07 | rtyler | nope :/ |
| 06:33.20 | mellon | Shoot. |
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| 06:34.06 | rtyler | GARRRHHH |
| 06:34.16 | mellon | I'm stumped. These things are always easier to get working when you can put your hands on the thing. :'( |
| 06:34.33 | rtyler | made the order, haven't heard anything from them :/ |
| 06:35.13 | mwester | Your X server is running on a mac, then? |
| 06:35.18 | rtyler | yes |
| 06:35.30 | mwester | and the X client is qemu... |
| 06:36.05 | mwester | so what does ssh have to do with this once qemu is running and has a window open on the X server? |
| 06:36.15 | rtyler | nothing |
| 06:36.17 | rtyler | :) |
| 06:37.09 | mwester | Yep - you need to give focus to the qemu window, and X should pass the key events to the client. If you can fire up and interact with xterm, you should expect that it would work with qemu |
| 06:39.23 | mwester | I would try googling to see if anyone has encountered general issues with your X server software and qemu. Otherwise, you might have to put a keyboard and mouse, and cable your display over to the opteron. |
| 06:40.51 | mwester | (Or I suppose you could try VNC as well -- I use VNC to export the desktop from my Linux system to my Windows box.) |
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| 06:47.56 | rtyler | SDL might be an issue |
| 06:49.16 | SiO2 | has anyone a datasheet of the omap850 from ti? by ti it isn't available |
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| 06:50.57 | cibomahto | Si02: i think thats under NDA |
| 06:51.31 | SiO2 | fu**. :( |
| 06:51.52 | SiO2 | why? i think a lot of developers would b8uild good stuff |
| 06:51.55 | SiO2 | -8 |
| 06:54.18 | khaije1 | oh ya, i never was clear on that |
| 06:54.25 | *** join/#openmoko jeddy3 (n=data@h-193-67.A148.cust.bahnhof.se) |
| 06:54.42 | khaije1 | certain specs say GTA02 has video hw acceleration |
| 06:54.51 | khaije1 | what does that really mean |
| 06:55.00 | mellon | It means it can play video. |
| 06:55.10 | khaije1 | so a codec chip? |
| 06:55.19 | mellon | I think it's multiporpoise. |
| 06:55.34 | mellon | I thought there was some detail about this in the wiki. |
| 06:55.51 | khaije1 | i'll double check, the wiki rocks |
| 06:58.15 | cibomahto | Si02: wait, what are you thinking about the omap850? |
| 06:58.47 | mellon | Blech, no, it doesn't actually do H.264, although it does do MPEG4. |
| 06:59.18 | cibomahto | Si02: i was thinking it was the Calypso baseband for the OpenMoko, but I can't find that information. Whatever is in the phone, its under NDA |
| 06:59.20 | mellon | You need the 3370 for H.264. Too bad, without H.264 you really don't have video. |
| 06:59.39 | rtyler | hrmph |
| 06:59.40 | *** join/#openmoko k-s (n=gustavo@20150212228.user.veloxzone.com.br) |
| 06:59.50 | rtyler | it doesn't seem to like the nvidia driver on my linux box |
| 06:59.50 | mellon | http://www.smediatech.com/product3362.htm |
| 07:01.24 | *** join/#openmoko buz (n=buz@84-73-66-71.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 07:01.39 | mellon | Of course, the 3370 won't support the LCD, so it's a catch-22. |
| 07:02.20 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@qiqinebs.chi.il.us) |
| 07:02.30 | khaije1 | this is why im confused |
| 07:02.38 | *** join/#openmoko n0on3 (n=n0on3@81-208-83-247.fastres.net) |
| 07:02.50 | mellon | Sorry, why? |
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| 07:03.22 | khaije1 | in the comparison chart it lists 2d/3d, what do them mean by that? is it analogus to a desktop machines video card? |
| 07:03.42 | khaije1 | if thats the case, would compiz type effects be possible? |
| 07:03.43 | mellon | Not necessarily, but it's enough to enable accelerated OpenGL, I think. |
| 07:03.46 | mellon | Yes. |
| 07:03.47 | *** join/#openmoko dotmef (n=mef@mx1.bitwise.org) |
| 07:03.55 | mellon | Although why you'd want to burn battery on that I don't know. |
| 07:04.06 | mellon | The main thing that I think is a real win is scaling. |
| 07:04.32 | mellon | If you can do scaling without burning a lot of battery, that would let you do an iPhone-style browser. |
| 07:05.00 | khaije1 | there are lots of potential uses, on a small touchscreen to create more logical space in a physical space, thats pretty exciting news imho |
| 07:05.12 | mellon | Sure, that's what scaling gets you! |
| 07:05.36 | khaije1 | no contest, but that isn't the *only* advantage |
| 07:05.51 | mellon | Scaling lets you visualize a larger workspace. And actually on a screen as fine as the Neo's, that's a big deal. |
| 07:06.05 | mellon | I guess the other stuff is okay too... :') |
| 07:06.56 | khaije1 | my only point is that on a device where the upper limits are going to be explored, it's nice to know they are set rather high |
| 07:07.10 | mellon | Sure. |
| 07:07.58 | khaije1 | is the device the 3365 or the 3362? |
| 07:08.28 | mellon | THe parts are the same except for the resolution. |
| 07:08.37 | mellon | The Neo requires the higher-resolution part, which is the 3362. |
| 07:09.29 | khaije1 | is the reported (per the chart) difference in audio significant? |
| 07:10.16 | mellon | I can make up an answer for you if you want... :') I think the answer is no, because they're not using this chip for audio, but that's just a guess. |
| 07:10.32 | juri_ | yay! done qemu hacking for the night. :) |
| 07:10.34 | aloril | "The stalker in your pocket" http://www.computerworld.com/action/article.do?command=viewArticleBasic&articleId=9027438&pageNumber=1 |
| 07:10.34 | rtyler | mellon: IT'S ALIVE! |
| 07:10.43 | mellon | w00t! what was the problem? |
| 07:10.43 | rtyler | running on my native linux desktop, Linux is booting ^_^ |
| 07:10.50 | aloril | 6. Get Neo1973 (or other OpenMoko using phone) |
| 07:11.00 | rtyler | Configuring gnome-vfs... |
| 07:11.53 | openfanss | Can anyone access the uboot prompt successfully via virtual usb serial device when use QEMU to emulate neo1973 |
| 07:13.14 | mellon | Okay, well, drunk in the glory of your success, rtyler, I think I am going to hit the sack. You kids have fun now! |
| 07:14.26 | rtyler | mellon: did you figure this all out already? :/ |
| 07:14.33 | mellon | no! |
| 07:14.46 | rtyler | mellon: then don;t go to sleep :P |
| 07:14.48 | rtyler | KEEP HACKING! |
| 07:14.51 | mellon | I'm actually starting to think of installing Gutsy on my Macbook. |
| 07:15.08 | rtyler | Gutsy? |
| 07:15.14 | mellon | Feh, I'm waiting for an endless compile. Sleep is an excellent opportunity for some pipelining. |
| 07:15.16 | mellon | Gutsy Gibbon. |
| 07:15.24 | rtyler | is that next after Feisty? |
| 07:15.26 | mellon | It's pretty sweet. Not OSX, mind you. |
| 07:15.28 | mellon | Yeah, I think so. |
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| 07:23.56 | adjaxio | Hello |
| 07:24.30 | rtyler | ahoy |
| 07:26.17 | rtyler | anybody able to actually get network connectivity from open moko on QEMU? |
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| 07:33.36 | openfanss | rtyler, i'm tring to do the same thing with u, but when my host failed recoginze usb0 device |
| 07:34.14 | rtyler | man, that main menu interface is not fucking intuitive at *all* |
| 07:34.21 | rtyler | is there no network settings pane? :/ |
| 07:34.35 | doc|home | rtyler: it's still very much beta software |
| 07:34.43 | rtyler | yes, I am aware :) |
| 07:34.59 | *** join/#openmoko pH5 (n=ph5@e178205239.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 07:36.49 | rtyler | ahhh, mouse is stuck in a vertical scroller cursor >_< |
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| 07:41.48 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Wish_List_-_Hardware]] [[Wish_List]] [[WM8753]] |
| 07:42.16 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@qiqinebs.chi.il.us) |
| 07:50.45 | rtyler | doc|home: oh man, I'm making a flickr album, but I'm building lots of bug reports off of it :P |
| 07:57.35 | rtyler | http://www.flickr.com/photos/agentdero/sets/72157600934925721/ |
| 07:58.13 | cibomahto | rtyler: very nice |
| 07:59.19 | rtyler | now if I can get networking to actually work, I can access the device, and start hacking on Mono on OpenMoko :D |
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| 08:26.16 | buz | that economist article about phones mentioning the neo is quite positive |
| 08:26.25 | buz | in some way even overly so |
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| 08:30.04 | rtyler | buz: link? |
| 08:30.28 | BobOfDoom | http://www.economist.com/science/displaystory.cfm?story_id=9531007 |
| 08:30.44 | khaije1 | yup reading it now |
| 08:33.59 | rtyler | not bad |
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| 08:35.08 | cibomahto | I like how they mention it will get a software upgrade for the next version :-) |
| 08:36.14 | *** join/#openmoko jgm (n=jgm@host-87-74-179-156.bulldogdsl.com) |
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| 08:40.29 | khaije1 | wow, what a great article, it seems a little unprofessional since it doesn't clearly differentiate between proposed, and deliverables |
| 08:45.35 | ScaredyCat | how do you 'calibrate' the touchscreen in qemu ? |
| 08:46.12 | cibomahto | ScaredyCat: you can click on the screen with the mouse |
| 08:46.17 | rtyler | I believe it's done by X11 |
| 08:46.23 | buz | still its good to see that one of the very major, if not THE major magazine takes note |
| 08:46.41 | cibomahto | ScaredyCat: if you can see the mouse, anyway. there might be a small black dot in the QEMU window |
| 08:46.50 | ScaredyCat | cibomahto: that's what I thought, but not working |
| 08:47.33 | cibomahto | the calibration program? |
| 08:48.04 | ScaredyCat | wait.. it just did 1 crosshair... but I can't get it to o the next :/ |
| 08:48.18 | rtyler | jesus, running tightvncserver off my high end opteron workstation pegs the CPU at 90% just so I can run my QEMU :/ |
| 08:50.05 | ScaredyCat | nm working now... wasn't easy tho. |
| 08:50.13 | cibomahto | ScaredyCat: hmm, thats no fun |
| 08:50.53 | ScaredyCat | I think it's eating all my cpu |
| 08:52.18 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@qiqinebs.chi.il.us) |
| 08:55.44 | ScaredyCat | hahha.. |
| 08:55.56 | ScaredyCat | my dot is offset from the mouse pointer |
| 08:56.34 | xkr47 | yo morning guys |
| 08:57.03 | SiO2 | xkr47, a very expensive meal |
| 08:57.17 | xkr47 | it's a duron, they taste best :) |
| 08:59.08 | cibomahto | xkr47: with a side of DRAM? |
| 08:59.23 | xkr47 | cibomahto, yeah, salad is good for your health :) |
| 09:00.31 | rtyler | but shit isn't |
| 09:00.34 | rtyler | stop eating it :P |
| 09:01.58 | *** join/#openmoko PBeck (n=PBeck@HSI-KBW-091-089-102-236.hsi2.kabelbw.de) |
| 09:02.11 | PBeck | hi |
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| 09:17.56 | ScaredyCat | "On most PCs you will notice the virtual Neo running faster than a real one..." |
| 09:17.58 | rtyler | so, any of you gotten network working with it? |
| 09:18.06 | rtyler | ScaredyCat: scary eh? :P |
| 09:18.09 | ScaredyCat | then it needs a faster processor, no doubt |
| 09:18.21 | rtyler | (network in QEMU that is) |
| 09:18.42 | cibomahto | eeks |
| 09:19.10 | openfanss | rtyler, me either.... so what is ur problem |
| 09:19.32 | rtyler | openfanss: I'm too introverted |
| 09:19.34 | *** join/#openmoko slomo (n=slomo@ubuntu/member/slomo) |
| 09:19.39 | openfanss | scaredycat, for "the dot offset the mouse" |
| 09:19.45 | rtyler | oh, you mean with regards to the QEMU network bit :P |
| 09:20.10 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@qiqinebs.chi.il.us) |
| 09:20.12 | rtyler | openfanss: there's absolutely no indication of how to get it running with network |
| 09:20.25 | rtyler | /dev/usb0 seems to be pulling a private IP from somewhere though O_o |
| 09:21.07 | ScaredyCat | iirc it sets it to 192.168.0.222 ? |
| 09:21.12 | rtyler | 202 in my case :) |
| 09:21.16 | rtyler | no clue why >_> |
| 09:21.41 | openfanss | rtyler, i don't know, seems it can not work for QEMU, |
| 09:21.46 | *** join/#openmoko nosyjoe (n=philipp@host-82-135-95-87.customer.m-online.net) |
| 09:21.46 | ScaredyCat | 200 not 222 |
| 09:21.51 | ScaredyCat | :O |
| 09:21.55 | ScaredyCat | 202 .... |
| 09:22.06 | rtyler | openfanss: so how can I get data back and forth onto it? :/ |
| 09:22.39 | openfanss | rtyler, i dont know ... |
| 09:24.11 | rtyler | reading over "Setting up USB connection" which seems to be it |
| 09:24.54 | gcb77 | that is soooo coool.... running top on a phone emulator :) |
| 09:25.09 | openfanss | i start just from there........ |
| 09:25.31 | rtyler | gcb77: looking at my screenshots? :P |
| 09:25.58 | gcb77 | rtyler: lol, no got my own... |
| 09:26.17 | gcb77 | running inside VMWare on Xubuntu |
| 09:26.24 | gcb77 | and sshd in |
| 09:26.32 | *** join/#openmoko disguy__ (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-e11a4bb9b7a067f2) |
| 09:26.33 | rtyler | gcb77: you sshd in to the phone O_O |
| 09:26.42 | gcb77 | yep |
| 09:26.50 | gcb77 | Had to do terrible things to get that to work |
| 09:26.51 | rtyler | wait, the phone, or the emulator? |
| 09:26.56 | gcb77 | emulator |
| 09:26.58 | rtyler | HOW! |
| 09:27.21 | gcb77 | rebuilt modules (gadgetfs and cdc_ether) |
| 09:27.22 | *** join/#openmoko tri (n=tri@p57AD8CC7.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 09:27.28 | openfanss | gcd77, so the network is working ? |
| 09:27.34 | rtyler | gcb77: tell ussssss :) |
| 09:27.42 | gcb77 | I'm sshd in, don't think out works |
| 09:28.08 | openfanss | i plug this modules successfully, but didn't detect the usb0 device |
| 09:28.11 | gcb77 | I wish I could upload the image... |
| 09:28.29 | gcb77 | 3GB takes over 20 hours at my throttled speed |
| 09:28.39 | gcb77 | last time I did it it eneded up there corrupt |
| 09:29.05 | *** join/#openmoko n0on3 (n=n0on3@81-208-83-247.fastres.net) |
| 09:29.27 | gcb77 | but, I do have notes on how I got it working, I can try and help |
| 09:32.04 | rtyler | gcb77: feel like blogging or writing them up somewhere? :P |
| 09:32.40 | gcb77 | oh yeah, like the wiki :) |
| 09:32.54 | rtyler | yeah that works too :P |
| 09:33.09 | gcb77 | Its mostly notes... I've tried 3 different systems (openSUSE, Ubuntu, and Xubuntu) |
| 09:33.34 | *** join/#openmoko herbyle (n=pascal@p54A36EAD.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 09:33.39 | gcb77 | Xubuntu is the easiest, it has most of the needed stuff already there |
| 09:35.03 | rtyler | there :D |
| 09:36.11 | *** join/#openmoko grahamperrin (n=grahampe@bb-87-81-165-9.ukonline.co.uk) |
| 09:36.54 | *** join/#openmoko Dmitry_Platonov (n=hawk@user-89-248-176-130.gagarino.net) |
| 09:36.57 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@qiqinebs.chi.il.us) |
| 09:38.35 | ewanm89_laptop | gcb77: Did you find out about that -16 error I hot when I tried? |
| 09:38.55 | *** join/#openmoko Marex-notebook (n=marex@85.132.236.161) |
| 09:39.06 | gcb77 | ewanm89_laptop: I'm pretty sure it has to do with dummy_hcd |
| 09:39.14 | gcb77 | I had to remove net2280 altogether |
| 09:39.20 | gcb77 | then rebuild gadgetfs |
| 09:39.40 | gcb77 | otherwise it loaded net2280 as a dependency |
| 09:39.58 | gcb77 | now it loads dummy_hcd |
| 09:40.43 | *** join/#openmoko MDK (n=mdk@cs181222091.pp.htv.fi) |
| 09:41.25 | gcb77 | Looks like I can ssh from the Emulator back into the host system, so if I followed the directions on how to make it a host I'd have networking... and internet |
| 09:41.28 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[P1_Owners]] [[Buying_Interest_List]] |
| 09:41.54 | *** join/#openmoko nosyjoe (n=philipp@host-82-135-95-87.customer.m-online.net) |
| 09:42.02 | ewanm89_laptop | All I have is dummy_hcd compiled in to the kernel. |
| 09:42.54 | gcb77 | does dmesg show anything? |
| 09:43.30 | *** join/#openmoko borg_ (n=olaf@80.149.17.21) |
| 09:46.58 | ewanm89_laptop | gadgetfs: USB Gadget filesystem, version 24 Aug 2004 |
| 09:46.58 | ewanm89_laptop | dummy_udc dummy_udc: binding gadget driver 'nop' |
| 09:47.11 | rtyler | hrm, openmoko bugzilla hasn't sent me my confirm email :/ |
| 09:48.55 | gcb77 | ewanm89_laptop: what kernel are you running? |
| 09:49.18 | ewanm89_laptop | 2.6.22.1 |
| 09:51.34 | gcb77 | have not seen that msg |
| 09:51.45 | gcb77 | I used stock Xubuntu kernel |
| 09:52.00 | ewanm89_laptop | When I load g_ether I get |
| 09:52.03 | ewanm89_laptop | dummy_udc dummy_udc: binding gadget driver 'ether' |
| 09:52.11 | *** join/#openmoko dft__d (n=df@218.79.146.31) |
| 09:52.58 | gcb77 | g_ether is not loaded, I think it conflicts with something |
| 09:53.01 | *** join/#openmoko pvanhoof (n=pvanhoof@81.187.73.203) |
| 09:53.08 | gcb77 | on my system |
| 09:54.54 | ewanm89_laptop | it's coming up "could not add USB device 'gadget:1'" |
| 09:58.59 | gcb77 | ewanm89_laptop: my bet would be on one of the other modules (I've seen g_zero, g_ether, net2280) causing conflicts with gadgetfs |
| 09:59.51 | *** join/#openmoko ravan_ (n=ravan@59.93.83.159) |
| 09:59.51 | gcb77 | Is there any interest in a 3G(expands to 7G) VMWare image fully set up with OpenMoko emulator and SSH over USB? |
| 10:07.27 | *** join/#openmoko cga (n=cga@213-140-6-101.ip.fastwebnet.it) |
| 10:10.17 | *** join/#openmoko Freed (n=jecsar@mac33-2-82-225-98-209.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 10:10.40 | *** join/#openmoko rob_w (n=bob@M9ca1.m.pppool.de) |
| 10:11.26 | rtyler | gcb77: definitely :D |
| 10:12.23 | *** join/#openmoko lalo (n=lalo@sourcemage/mage/lalo) |
| 10:16.26 | gcb77 | I'll take it work and upload it from there sometime |
| 10:18.00 | *** join/#openmoko mmp (n=mmp@adsl-d152.87-197-146.t-com.sk) |
| 10:18.48 | *** join/#openmoko Dodji (n=dodji@torimasen.com) |
| 10:21.56 | *** join/#openmoko openfansss (n=df@218.79.146.16) |
| 10:23.21 | *** join/#openmoko nosyjoe (n=philipp@host-82-135-95-87.customer.m-online.net) |
| 10:25.39 | *** join/#openmoko tr2x (n=alvar@80-218-185-55.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 10:26.20 | *** join/#openmoko some1_ (n=some1@p54A0F985.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 10:29.17 | ScaredyCat | gcb77: you'll probably win some friends if you provide one ;) |
| 10:29.20 | *** join/#openmoko gyaresu (n=gyaresu@ppp121-44-212-102.lns1.hba1.internode.on.net) |
| 10:30.07 | rtyler | gcb77: can you go to work...now :P |
| 10:30.43 | ScaredyCat | although, i guess unless you have a stonking machine, emulation running under emulation might not be much fun :) |
| 10:31.09 | ynezz | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Test_Openmoko_Emulation_with_chroot_image |
| 10:31.16 | ynezz | this one don't work for you? |
| 10:32.20 | ScaredyCat | in might if i had an additional 15gb free on my laptop |
| 10:32.26 | ynezz | :)) |
| 10:32.27 | *** join/#openmoko mdt (n=mdt@littlelun.emdete.de) |
| 10:32.28 | jgm | ScaredyCat: actually vmware is pretty good, I run a Ubuntu image on WinXP on my laptop and it moves very nicely |
| 10:33.00 | *** join/#openmoko RbdPngn (n=ningerso@uslink-66.173.44-135.uslink.net) |
| 10:33.44 | ScaredyCat | yeah, except it generally breaks on kernel updates |
| 10:34.44 | ScaredyCat | ..ok, that's only a 5 minute fix, but it's a annoying.. |
| 10:34.57 | ScaredyCat | of course you don;t get that with windows :) |
| 10:39.58 | *** join/#openmoko zedstar (n=john@82-44-202-121.cable.ubr08.haye.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 10:42.38 | *** join/#openmoko vosen (n=v0@86-63-84-163.asta-net.com.pl) |
| 10:57.10 | *** join/#openmoko openfanss (n=df@218.79.146.16) |
| 11:14.48 | rtyler | man, I'm so excited |
| 11:14.55 | rtyler | getting closer :D |
| 11:17.10 | spliffy_ | i just heard google is probably going to bid for us mobile frequencies. what do you think, would they support openmoko? |
| 11:17.29 | rtyler | heh, I don't think that matters ;/ |
| 11:18.04 | minime | spliffy_, they'd probably buy openmoko as they usually buy things ;) |
| 11:18.04 | spliffy_ | hehe yeah... damn |
| 11:18.38 | *** join/#openmoko zedstar (n=john@82-44-202-121.cable.ubr08.haye.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 11:19.04 | rtyler | hrm, has anybody built usbnet for Ubuntu? |
| 11:22.16 | *** join/#openmoko ScaredyCat (n=andy@net-pbx.demon.nl) |
| 11:23.00 | phrozen77_ | http://www.theinquirer.net/default.aspx?article=41147 |
| 11:25.18 | buz | seems fair enough |
| 11:25.18 | *** join/#openmoko ScaredyCat (n=andy@net-pbx.demon.nl) |
| 11:26.06 | buz | oh please dont let google buy openmoko |
| 11:26.48 | mmazur | Google is Good. How dare you defy it?! |
| 11:26.51 | mmazur | Strike that. |
| 11:26.53 | mmazur | Google isn't Evil. |
| 11:27.54 | rtyler | anybody know of any prebuilt Ubuntu/Debian kernel images with usbnet? |
| 11:28.34 | SpeedEvil | Google might buy FIC |
| 11:28.36 | SpeedEvil | not OM |
| 11:29.13 | minime | won't stop them from doing it ;) |
| 11:29.28 | Psi_ | whats the relationship between FIC and OM ? |
| 11:29.39 | minime | FIC produces the neo1973 |
| 11:29.39 | rtyler | FIC created the phone and the project >_> |
| 11:30.10 | minime | wasn't it initiated by sean, mickeyl, laf0rge, etc? |
| 11:30.19 | Psi_ | i mean if google might buy FIC and that isnt OM, then how are they related? |
| 11:30.22 | rtyler | no clue actually :P |
| 11:30.22 | SpeedEvil | No |
| 11:30.30 | SpeedEvil | As I understand it. |
| 11:30.40 | SpeedEvil | Sean was working for FIC in some way. |
| 11:30.45 | minime | yeah right |
| 11:30.52 | SpeedEvil | FIC had a customer for a phone - that fell over. |
| 11:31.01 | SpeedEvil | The phone was the Neo1973 |
| 11:31.27 | SpeedEvil | Sean then had an idea, pitched it to bosses at FIC, and got support to bring several people onboard with actual funding |
| 11:31.40 | SpeedEvil | This was the core team. |
| 11:32.33 | Psi_ | and |
| 11:32.35 | SpeedEvil | Then they worked a bit, and released the OM source, while making claims that hardware would be real soon now |
| 11:32.52 | minime | lol |
| 11:33.07 | rtyler | the whole project is just a farse to get us to buy make believe phones actually ;) |
| 11:35.00 | *** part/#openmoko Freed (n=jecsar@mac33-2-82-225-98-209.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 11:35.16 | ScaredyCat | mmazur: Google is evil. You just haven't realized it yet |
| 11:36.09 | ScaredyCat | in 10 years after they've profiled you to death, they'll know what you are going to buy next - before you do. |
| 11:38.10 | SpeedEvil | If they then use their massive buying power to send it to me cheap, so I wake up in the morning and have the option to accept a really cheap foo at the door, ... |
| 11:38.18 | *** join/#openmoko woglinde (i=woglinde@e178096074.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 11:39.03 | mmazur | Ah, so openmoko is just a way to salvage the neo. |
| 11:39.10 | mmazur | So much for idealism ;) |
| 11:39.17 | minime | sort of ;) |
| 11:39.32 | minime | and the proof for this is: |
| 11:40.33 | kristian-m | so why have they started developing with the samsung devboard then? - did they just replace the cpu? |
| 11:40.34 | woglinde | hi |
| 11:40.36 | minime | if it was a true opensource project, the neo would be vaporware! |
| 11:40.56 | ScaredyCat | lo |
| 11:41.02 | SpeedEvil | FIC wants to make money. |
| 11:41.06 | minime | and not being vaporware means it's not real ;) |
| 11:41.24 | SpeedEvil | They are currently building phones for Nokia et-al - at lowest bid prices. |
| 11:41.25 | minime | meaning: it's real therefore it can't be real ;) |
| 11:41.28 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Wish_List_-_Hardware]] [[P1_Owners]] [[Advertising]] [[Press_Coverage]] [[Category:Hardware_ideas]] [[OpenMoko_under_QEMU_on_MacOSX]] [[Buying_Interest_List]] [[User:Gcasse]] |
| 11:41.35 | SpeedEvil | They want to sell them to customers. |
| 11:41.43 | SpeedEvil | This gets _much_ higher margin. |
| 11:41.48 | SpeedEvil | But you need an OS. |
| 11:41.50 | ScaredyCat | ~p1 |
| 11:41.51 | mokobot | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/P1_Owners |
| 11:41.57 | SpeedEvil | To take it in PC terms. |
| 11:42.16 | ScaredyCat | no new mails then |
| 11:42.39 | SpeedEvil | They want to be IBM, not the subcontractor that makes the IBM PC. |
| 11:44.33 | *** join/#openmoko zell1983 (n=zell1983@host139-123-dynamic.6-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 11:46.38 | *** join/#openmoko dcordes (n=ucordes@f048065009.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 11:48.41 | Psi_ | does anyone know of any tickets larger than 1880 that have had payment conf yet? |
| 11:51.04 | buz | how far along are the python bindings these days? |
| 11:51.05 | ynezz | everybody is in packaging proccess, no commits etc... |
| 11:52.19 | openfanss | rtyler: have u fixed the network problem under QEMU? have u checked the gadget build into QEMU |
| 11:52.22 | buz | and scripting languages are a lot easier to test |
| 11:52.37 | buz | ~/scripting/interpreted/ |
| 11:52.53 | rtyler | openfanss: yes and no, I don't have any bloody usbnet device even though it shows up in lsmod |
| 11:53.06 | Psi_ | wonder if will be possible to get Lazarus apps working on the neo |
| 11:53.52 | buz | sounds like an udev issue |
| 11:54.12 | openfanss | what's the output when type " usb_add gadget:1" in QEMU monitor device? |
| 11:54.34 | rtyler | QEMU monitor device? >_> |
| 11:54.58 | openfanss | rtyler, i find that QEMU didn't actually build in gadget. |
| 11:55.37 | openfanss | rtyler, sorry , QEMU console (ctrl+alt+2) will get it |
| 11:56.13 | rtyler | couldn't add device gadget:1 |
| 11:56.54 | ScaredyCat | wooohooo1!!! |
| 11:57.14 | ScaredyCat | Your credit card has now been charged by the following amount: |
| 11:57.32 | woglinde | scaredycat hehe |
| 11:57.34 | rtyler | $Shitton |
| 11:57.34 | woglinde | gratz |
| 11:57.39 | openfanss | rtyler, must be that QEMU did not build in gadget! |
| 11:57.44 | rtyler | >_< |
| 11:57.59 | Psi_ | ScaredyCat, whats your ticket? |
| 11:58.14 | kristian-m | anyone ever got this error? http://nopaste.eof.name/ |
| 11:58.33 | rtyler | a blank paste page? yep |
| 11:58.37 | kristian-m | fixing around this from the beginning - as if pwd would be defect |
| 11:58.45 | kristian-m | http://nopaste.eof.name/180 |
| 11:58.49 | buz | usually people DONT like if their card is charged ;) |
| 11:58.55 | kristian-m | rtyler sry ;-) |
| 11:59.03 | ScaredyCat | #1826 |
| 11:59.10 | ScaredyCat | Psi_: |
| 11:59.33 | Psi_ | yeah, i suspect atleast up to 1880 have already been charged |
| 12:00.12 | Psi_ | did you just get it now? |
| 12:00.13 | ScaredyCat | Psi_: I don't think that's what happened... |
| 12:00.16 | ScaredyCat | yes |
| 12:00.25 | Psi_ | hm. yeah, im wrong then |
| 12:00.35 | ScaredyCat | Today 13:03:14 |
| 12:00.38 | SpeedEvil | IMO - no. |
| 12:01.01 | Psi_ | ScaredyCat, hehe that doesnt mean much, i dont know where you are |
| 12:01.03 | SpeedEvil | I would expect >3 confirmed payments if we've got 60 charged |
| 12:01.07 | ScaredyCat | .nl |
| 12:01.18 | ScaredyCat | it's 13:05 now :) |
| 12:02.31 | ScaredyCat | shipping was still $80 |
| 12:02.44 | rtyler | damnit, where's my shipping email :( |
| 12:02.58 | ScaredyCat | rtyler: I haven't had a shipping email |
| 12:03.03 | Psi_ | rtyler, whats your ticket? |
| 12:03.06 | ScaredyCat | just a 'we took your money' one |
| 12:03.24 | rtyler | 3824 :( |
| 12:03.31 | Psi_ | haha |
| 12:03.56 | rtyler | I assumed they'd charge immediately, so I had to make sure I had rent paid &stuff ;) |
| 12:04.08 | LarstiQ | ScaredyCat: doh! |
| 12:04.34 | ScaredyCat | LarstiQ: ? |
| 12:05.37 | LarstiQ | ScaredyCat: I only now realize our physical proximity |
| 12:05.54 | ScaredyCat | ahh. yes... |
| 12:05.57 | ScaredyCat | oopsey |
| 12:06.13 | ScaredyCat | brb -> library |
| 12:06.14 | LarstiQ | ah well, 99$ for two persons isn't _that_ bad |
| 12:08.12 | ScaredyCat | mine is the advanced so prolly heavier... |
| 12:08.23 | ScaredyCat | anyway - definately -> library |
| 12:09.43 | LarstiQ | ScaredyCat: we ordered two hackers lunch boxes :) |
| 12:09.46 | woglinde | oh I am reading laforges last blog entry |
| 12:11.46 | *** join/#openmoko ecraven (i=nex@eutyche.swe.uni-linz.ac.at) |
| 12:14.08 | *** join/#openmoko miip (n=miip@p54A54CD8.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 12:15.07 | rtyler | you guys need to keep me posted when your tickets get updated |
| 12:15.13 | rtyler | 3800 is a long fucking way away :'( |
| 12:18.13 | *** join/#openmoko grobian (n=grobian@L071c.l.pppool.de) |
| 12:18.35 | grobian | hi |
| 12:22.20 | grobian | Anyone know how long it takes to boot? At the moment!? |
| 12:22.20 | aloril | grobian: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) (Hopefully this link answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) |
| 12:23.45 | grobian | ? |
| 12:27.39 | BryceLeo_Away | grobian: no idea dude |
| 12:27.52 | BryceLeo_Away | the ones that are out in the wild that i've heard of don't even boot |
| 12:28.23 | grobian | ok |
| 12:29.41 | BryceLeo_Away | at this point i'd settle for minimo building, the new contacts app getting committed, or even them asking me to drive to their distribution point and help them get them shipped |
| 12:29.53 | rtyler | heh |
| 12:30.03 | rtyler | let's get a minivan and go pitch in :) |
| 12:30.24 | grobian | lol |
| 12:30.46 | BryceLeo_Away | where in the world are you to? i'm in nj, USA |
| 12:30.55 | rtyler | San Francisco |
| 12:31.06 | rtyler | they're shipping from China, so let's meet on my coast :P |
| 12:31.08 | BryceLeo_Away | yeah when the f* dies the new today app come in |
| 12:31.14 | BryceLeo_Away | lmao, deal |
| 12:32.01 | BryceLeo_Away | wait a bit,SF it's like 5 where you are? |
| 12:32.11 | rtyler | yes >_> |
| 12:32.14 | BryceLeo_Away | or 4? so you must still be up and haven't gone to bed |
| 12:32.19 | *** join/#openmoko edistar_ (n=edwinloc@ip503ddd09.speed.planet.nl) |
| 12:32.29 | rtyler | yep, I have sleeping problems it seems ;) |
| 12:32.30 | BryceLeo_Away | jeez, i remember when i used to do that |
| 12:32.50 | BryceLeo_Away | lol, now that i have a female PITA i ge tto go to bed at the uber late 11:00 |
| 12:33.07 | BryceLeo_Away | however I do have to head out and photograph a wedding today so i should probably be getting ready |
| 12:33.13 | rtyler | BryceLeo_Away: shit happens :P |
| 12:33.15 | grobian | What time is it in NY? |
| 12:33.20 | BryceLeo_Away | 8:33 |
| 12:33.27 | grobian | am? |
| 12:33.31 | BryceLeo_Away | yup |
| 12:33.37 | BryceLeo_Away | i've been up since 6:30 am |
| 12:34.14 | grobian | its 2:33 pm here |
| 12:34.20 | rtyler | holy shit, it's done |
| 12:34.27 | grobian | or like we call it 14:33 |
| 12:34.34 | rtyler | my import of Wikipedia into a local SQL store, after 3 days, finished! |
| 12:34.37 | BryceLeo | groban you're in the EU? |
| 12:34.44 | grobian | yes |
| 12:34.53 | BryceLeo | nice |
| 12:35.06 | BryceLeo | rtyler: wait... so you're mirroring wikipedia |
| 12:35.22 | rtyler | BryceLeo: a separate hack i'm working on alongside mono on openmoko ;) |
| 12:35.27 | sagacis_ | rtyler: And now it's out of date.... :) |
| 12:35.34 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@qiqinebs.chi.il.us) |
| 12:35.54 | BryceLeo | rtyler: so you're gonna bring mono to openmoko? |
| 12:35.54 | sagacis_ | rtyler: jaebird is also very interested in mono on moko |
| 12:36.04 | *** join/#openmoko Vndmtrx (n=Ox0ff@unaffiliated/vndmtrx) |
| 12:36.14 | rtyler | sagacis_: he may be the one i've been talking with on the mono-dev list then :) |
| 12:36.17 | BryceLeo | haha looks like silverlight will run on the openmoko before flash will |
| 12:36.27 | rtyler | fucking good >_> |
| 12:36.39 | sagacis_ | rtyler: Probably. I'll ask him. We work together |
| 12:36.56 | BryceLeo | we should probably start hacking on gnash |
| 12:36.57 | jgm | rtyler: If you're blogging about openmoko can you add yourself to the list of external feeds on the wiki? http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/External_Feeds |
| 12:37.53 | BryceLeo | we know apple is powerful enough to get flash for their device, however i don't really know if we are.... |
| 12:37.59 | rtyler | damnit! somehody stole the 'tyler' nick on the wiki :P |
| 12:38.14 | rtyler | BryceLeo: Flash lite exists on most Nokia's, specifically the S90 platform |
| 12:38.16 | *** join/#openmoko baze (n=baze@xdsl-213-196-195-123.netcologne.de) |
| 12:38.16 | BryceLeo | sacre bleu!! !there's more than one tyler!!! :-P |
| 12:38.18 | rtyler | jgm: working on |
| 12:38.22 | rtyler | BryceLeo: HERESY! |
| 12:38.40 | BryceLeo | rtyler: there's flash on the n800? |
| 12:38.47 | grobian | I have been working on an embedded device with montavista linux and Intel arm xscale ! It took about 40-60 sec to boot |
| 12:38.54 | grobian | pxa255 |
| 12:39.00 | rtyler | BryceLeo: sick huh? :P |
| 12:39.05 | sagacis_ | Last night, I was looking at bugzilla. Has nobody reported the broken icons on the main screen, or is it just me? |
| 12:39.30 | grobian | hope will be better on neo1973 |
| 12:39.47 | rtyler | grobian: I'm not worried about boot so much as sleep/wake |
| 12:39.55 | *** join/#openmoko zecke (n=ich@88.134.98.145) |
| 12:39.58 | BryceLeo | rtyler: the flash on the N800 is from gnash though |
| 12:40.20 | BryceLeo | rtyler: atleast as far as i can tell |
| 12:40.23 | rtyler | jgm: can you add http://unethicalblogger.com/ to the list? my mail server seems to have trouble receiving confirm emails :'( |
| 12:40.34 | grobian | rtyler: that could be a problem! suspend mode! |
| 12:40.43 | rtyler | oh noes! |
| 12:41.15 | rtyler | s/S90/S60/ |
| 12:42.10 | BryceLeo | hmmm perhaps flash might get there after all, we just need to ship enough units |
| 12:42.21 | rtyler | you say that like it's something to be desired O_O |
| 12:42.36 | grobian | =) |
| 12:42.51 | BryceLeo | haha i worked on a project that used basic flash 6 functions to get sweet stable ajax |
| 12:42.55 | BryceLeo | even worked with gnash |
| 12:43.04 | BryceLeo | they've since switched |
| 12:43.33 | rtyler | mmm, 11GB of MySQL'fied wikipedia |
| 12:43.37 | BryceLeo | but anywhoo i must be off to get read |
| 12:43.39 | BryceLeo | ready* |
| 12:43.40 | BryceLeo | c ya guy |
| 12:43.41 | BryceLeo | s |
| 12:43.44 | rtyler | adios |
| 12:43.45 | grobian | cu |
| 12:44.18 | mickeyl | morning fellows! |
| 12:44.22 | rtyler | g'day |
| 12:44.23 | jgm | rtyler: can you filter the feeds from drupal based on tag? If so I'll set it up so that only openmoko posts show up... |
| 12:44.35 | rtyler | i'm trying to figure that out now actually :P |
| 12:44.50 | mickeyl | Elrond: ping |
| 12:44.55 | rtyler | I'll just make another category for it |
| 12:45.08 | jgm | Okay let me know when you have the URL for a suitable feed |
| 12:45.29 | sagacis_ | ps |
| 12:45.39 | sagacis_ | oops sorry. Wrong window focus |
| 12:46.05 | *** part/#openmoko mil_ (n=talusha@jabber.hst.ru) |
| 12:46.57 | rtyler | jgm: http://unethicalblogger.com/blog_categories/openmoko |
| 12:52.16 | C7 | Payment received ;) |
| 12:52.23 | rtyler | what number!? |
| 12:52.29 | C7 | #1834 |
| 12:52.36 | rtyler | damnit! |
| 12:53.09 | jgm | Ooh |
| 12:53.13 | jgm | <waits> |
| 12:53.30 | jgm | rtyler: want your name and a description of what bit of openmoko you're blogging about on there too? |
| 12:53.30 | sagacis_ | Cool. Getting closer. Update P1 Owners, please... |
| 12:53.42 | rtyler | jgm: sure :) |
| 12:53.47 | *** join/#openmoko Marex (n=Marex@85.132.236.161) |
| 12:55.54 | jgm | Go on then :) |
| 12:56.07 | rtyler | jgm: R. Tyler Ballance, porting Mono to OpenMoko |
| 12:56.48 | koen | rtyler: 'bitbake mono' and you're done |
| 12:56.59 | rtyler | koen: huh? |
| 12:57.17 | koen | you said 'porting Mono' |
| 12:57.45 | rtyler | ahuh? |
| 12:58.07 | rtyler | koen: do you have Mono on openmoko already?! :-o |
| 12:58.26 | koen | I have a mono binary on my neo1973, yes |
| 12:58.47 | koen | so you'd better spend your time improving the current effort than reinventing the wheel |
| 12:58.56 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@qiqinebs.chi.il.us) |
| 12:59.39 | rtyler | koen: what system are you using bitbake on? |
| 13:00.01 | koen | debian and ubuntu |
| 13:00.30 | rtyler | can you build it on OpenMoko too? |
| 13:00.50 | koen | ? |
| 13:00.55 | koen | just do 'bitbake mono' |
| 13:01.11 | jgm | rtyler: sorted |
| 13:01.21 | rtyler | i.e. against the OpenMoko SDK and such, instead of just moving the binaries over |
| 13:01.59 | koen | just follow http://www.openembedded.org/wiki/GettingStarted and do 'bitbake mono' |
| 13:02.16 | *** join/#openmoko olv (n=olvaffe@123-193-215-175.ethome-ip.ethome.com.tw) |
| 13:02.20 | rwhitby | koen: what do you think the performance on monotone on the neo would be like ;-) |
| 13:02.36 | koen | OE is already self-hosting |
| 13:02.47 | koen | rwhitby: monotone on the slug worked quite well |
| 13:03.41 | rwhitby | yeah, I guess the neo does have much more ram than a slug, so it should work nicely. |
| 13:03.48 | compbrain | rwhitby: good to see familiar faces here. |
| 13:03.48 | *** join/#openmoko behdad (n=behdad@81.187.73.203) |
| 13:03.52 | rtyler | koen: ideally I'd like to see the build able to be integrated into the usual Mono build and release processes so we can put binaries/installers in with the regular mono distribution http://mono-project.com/Downloads |
| 13:04.08 | rwhitby | compbrain: long time no see |
| 13:04.45 | koen | rtyler: that's backwards |
| 13:05.03 | rtyler | why's that? |
| 13:05.04 | koen | rtyler: the openmoko distro (and others) are perfectly capable of providing their own packages |
| 13:05.43 | koen | and 'embedded' (read ARM) has too many incompatible flavours to make hosting them on mono-project usefull |
| 13:06.12 | rwhitby | koen: amen - nslu2-linux builds optware for no less than 11 different embedded targets |
| 13:06.30 | rwhitby | and OE builds for far more than that |
| 13:06.47 | koen | rwhitby: and for each target you can vary the ABI, glibc, etc |
| 13:06.56 | koen | compinatorial explosion |
| 13:07.07 | mickeyl | nod |
| 13:07.08 | rwhitby | koen: yeah, did you know that Freecom just released commercial firmware with big endian EABI? |
| 13:07.09 | koen | s/p/b/ |
| 13:07.19 | koen | rwhitby: yes, you told me earlier :) |
| 13:07.36 | mickeyl | rwhitby: for which device? |
| 13:07.39 | rwhitby | it was a private alpha earlier, now they've actually released it. |
| 13:07.39 | koen | "here is mono for arm, pick one of the 40 options" |
| 13:07.47 | rwhitby | mickeyl: Freecom FSG-3 version 4.2.7 firmware |
| 13:07.54 | rtyler | koen: as soon as I can get a VM up that can get thrashed with my kernel recompiles I'll give it a whirl :P |
| 13:07.57 | mickeyl | ~google fsg-3 |
| 13:08.03 | *** join/#openmoko Markinoko (n=Markinok@82.238.213.101) |
| 13:08.23 | rwhitby | mickeyl: http://www.nslu2-linux.org/wiki/FSG3/HomePage or www.openfsg.com |
| 13:08.37 | rtyler | FWIW, the qemu-neo1973 code definitely does *not* agree with gcc-3.3 on Mac OS 10.4 |
| 13:09.14 | rwhitby | they're using a codesourcery 2005q3-2 toolchain, but a big-endian version of it which doesn't exist on the csl website. |
| 13:09.29 | koen | most likely because that's not actually gcc-3.3, but apple-gcc-3.3 |
| 13:09.52 | rtyler | I like to pretend the terms are interchangable :P |
| 13:11.08 | *** join/#openmoko BlackBsd (n=brian@72.168.193.117) |
| 13:12.17 | xzcvczx | Psi_: pity i didnt realise you were also based in nz otherwise we could have saved a bit on shipping |
| 13:13.20 | jgm | Ooh, just got a payment confirmation :) #1839 |
| 13:14.32 | jgm | So that's about one every four minutes in case someone is working on a run rate |
| 13:16.00 | sagacis_ | Now they're ticking up... I'm getting a bit excited. Still a way to go, but closer than ever... |
| 13:16.43 | rtyler | only 2000 more until they get close to me :'( |
| 13:17.18 | vallor | good morning! -- they're running a backlog of orders? |
| 13:18.40 | LarstiQ | rtyler: relax, I'm even further away than that. |
| 13:19.03 | openfanss | rtyler, a little progress, i make usb0 show up in my host computer, but still failed to communicate with emulate QEMU >_<~ |
| 13:21.56 | *** join/#openmoko mil_ (n=talusha@jabber.hst.ru) |
| 13:22.27 | rtyler | openfanss: I can't thrash my normal linux workstation since I need it for work, so I need to setup an entirely new VM just for this :/ |
| 13:27.00 | Markinoko | openfanss: seems we're running in the same issues with usb stuff... |
| 13:27.43 | openfanss | Markinoko, so what's your problem |
| 13:28.48 | Markinoko | openfanss: well, it changes from time to time. Right now I having a "unknown filesystem type 'gadgetfs'" while the gadgetfs module is loaded in the kernel... funny |
| 13:28.57 | *** join/#openmoko ml8128_ (n=ml8128@108.105.100-84.rev.gaoland.net) |
| 13:29.03 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@qiqinebs.chi.il.us) |
| 13:29.41 | *** join/#openmoko Sufflope (n=Sufflope@crj95-3-82-237-151-219.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 13:29.53 | Markinoko | openfanss: I do have the usb0 interface though. once gadgetfs works, things should get better |
| 13:31.22 | Markinoko | aaah |
| 13:31.25 | Markinoko | I see... |
| 13:31.46 | Markinoko | gadgetfs needs to be loaded before the other moules it seems. |
| 13:32.10 | kristian-m | Markinoko ah, okay, can you put that to the wiki? |
| 13:33.01 | Markinoko | kristian-m: I guess I'll create an account, yes |
| 13:33.12 | kristian-m | great :-) |
| 13:33.24 | Markinoko | hmm, even better, don't load gadgetfs at boot-time |
| 13:33.50 | Markinoko | I'll have to try to reboot to get that right I suppose. |
| 13:34.39 | Markinoko | ok |
| 13:34.51 | *** join/#openmoko dcordes_ (n=ucordes@f048052182.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 13:35.01 | Markinoko | who has a "Warning: could not find USB gadgetfs" when running qemu while gadgetfs is mounted in /dev/gadget ? |
| 13:35.15 | Markinoko | did anyone solve this one ? |
| 13:40.12 | Markinoko | moreover "/dev/gadget" is hardcoded in qemu's gadget driver... so you can't be wrong about the path. wtf |
| 13:41.28 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Main_Page/fr]] [[Getting_Started_with_your_Neo1973/fr]] [[Wishlist:Extension_Framework]] [[Neo1973]] [[WM8976]] [[GTA01_Hardware]] [[P1_Owners]] [[External_Feeds]] [[User:Jgm]] [[Hardware]] [[Wish_List_-_Hardware]] [[Buying_Interest_List]] |
| 13:43.04 | *** join/#openmoko Sup3rkiddo (n=sudharsh@unaffiliated/sudharsh) |
| 13:44.08 | mickeyl | rwhitby: i'm still undecided, but probably going for a qnap ts 201 |
| 13:44.27 | mickeyl | together with 2 500G drives |
| 13:44.58 | rwhitby | mickeyl: have you spoken with the linkstationwiki guys? |
| 13:45.19 | mickeyl | rwhitby: don't think so |
| 13:45.27 | rwhitby | they're moving to an OE-based distro |
| 13:45.38 | rwhitby | www.linkstationwiki.net |
| 13:45.57 | mickeyl | oh cool |
| 13:46.36 | rwhitby | nslu2-linux and linkstationwiki have teamed up to buy a new grunty server together at OSUOSL to host all our NAS-related sites |
| 13:46.40 | galexande | #1839?!?!?!!!! |
| 13:47.04 | openfanss | Markinoko, i can access the NEO QEMU finally from host ..... |
| 13:47.08 | openfanss | Markinoko, u gadgetfs is not successfully load |
| 13:47.08 | galexande | i should get one in less than 8 minutes!! |
| 13:47.12 | openfanss | check this, Device Drivers -> USB support -> USB Gadget Support -> USB Peripheral Controller and set it to Dummy HCD (DEVELOPMENT) |
| 13:47.13 | grobian | whats that number youre talking about? |
| 13:47.37 | galexande | grobian, <jgm> Ooh, just got a payment confirmation :) #1839 |
| 13:47.44 | sagacis | galexande: I dont' know if they are in order |
| 13:47.46 | grobian | oh ok |
| 13:47.54 | galexande | of course, that was 20 minutes ago |
| 13:48.01 | Markinoko | openfanss: yup I have the Dummy HCD |
| 13:48.04 | galexande | they apparently aren't in order. how unfair. |
| 13:48.13 | Markinoko | so gadgetfs is not mandatory ? |
| 13:48.14 | sagacis | #1880 already got one |
| 13:48.22 | grobian | i think neo1973 will be a big success |
| 13:48.30 | *** join/#openmoko PBeck (n=PBeck@HSI-KBW-091-089-102-236.hsi2.kabelbw.de) |
| 13:48.39 | rtyler | openfanss: wikify it! |
| 13:48.44 | mickeyl | grobian: i agree :D |
| 13:48.55 | grobian | many fans and developer |
| 13:49.37 | openfanss | rtyler, ok , i'll put it there |
| 13:50.08 | rtyler | grobian: I hope so, Sean might have an anurism otherwise :P |
| 13:51.14 | grobian | :) |
| 13:51.23 | mickeyl | you ain't seen nothing yet. we're building a kick-ass team right now and then start to really rock |
| 13:51.28 | openfanss | <PROTECTED> |
| 13:51.51 | rtyler | mickeyl: so we'll all get major discounts on phase 2 phones right ;) |
| 13:52.05 | rtyler | especially if we promise to show them off to those iPhone touting coworkers we might have? |
| 13:52.18 | mickeyl | haha |
| 13:52.20 | mickeyl | lets see :) |
| 13:52.21 | rtyler | "AJAX is not an SDK fool!" |
| 13:52.34 | rtyler | *gtk*! |
| 13:53.48 | rtyler | mickeyl: is there some secret settings pane somewhere? I would really like to tell my emulated phone that the date is not epoch |
| 13:53.51 | Markinoko | openfanss: the warning is generated by qemu |
| 13:54.11 | mil_ | whats the way of adding files / libs to rootfs.. did compile the package with bitbake allready? |
| 13:54.13 | mickeyl | rtyler: heh, sorry, not yet. preferences will come soon. as will a major UI overhaul. |
| 13:54.13 | openfanss | Markinoko, QEMU "usb_gadget_init" function not successfully execute, |
| 13:54.14 | grobian | im starting qemu with 512 MiB its to solw on my maschine! |
| 13:54.29 | rtyler | mickeyl: are we talking more or less orange brushed metal >_> |
| 13:54.29 | Markinoko | openfanss: yup, I figured that out... |
| 13:54.46 | Markinoko | openfanss: still can't see why though |
| 13:55.01 | mickeyl | rtyler: first less... then 1 year later much more :D |
| 13:55.05 | openfanss | Markinoko, check the file ~MOKODIR/build/qemu/config-host.h, make sure "#define CONFIG_GADGETFS 1" |
| 13:55.25 | galexande | mickey, so do you think there is enough development capacity within FIC/OpenMoko to get the core dialing/PIM apps up to speed without community assistance? |
| 13:55.28 | openfanss | make sure u build gadgetfs for QEMU |
| 13:55.45 | rtyler | it's no fun without community assistance :P |
| 13:56.03 | rtyler | p.s. MokoWebkit looks *hawt* |
| 13:56.10 | Markinoko | openfanss: hehe, not there :-) can that be activated at compile time ? |
| 13:56.31 | mickeyl | i think it makes more sense to involve the community, however our resources in the future might be enough to make it without additional input. wouldn't be half as fun though |
| 13:57.31 | rtyler | mickeyl: I wish my company was less of a web company to where I could justify openmoko on their time too :/ |
| 13:57.32 | grobian | how about crosscompiler? |
| 13:57.56 | vallor | zowie, y'all are running a neo1973 simu w/qemu? |
| 13:57.58 | openfanss | Markinoko, it generate by "configure" automatically, should copy kernel headers |
| 13:58.01 | davidv_ | woohoo - just got payment confirmation email #1836 |
| 13:59.17 | galexande | god dammit |
| 13:59.45 | grobian | vallor: i?am |
| 13:59.58 | *** join/#openmoko Jason1 (n=ws1@c-24-15-3-175.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 14:00.28 | *** join/#openmoko drath_ (i=vmaster@p5B07D13A.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 14:00.32 | Jason1 | Hello Everyone! |
| 14:00.43 | vallor | grobian: that's what I asked! ;P |
| 14:00.58 | rtyler | I would like to personally thank the OpenMoko team for the sleep already lost thanks to OpenMoko and the many hours I plan to lose along the way :P |
| 14:01.14 | Jason1 | I see that more people have gotten payment confirmations! |
| 14:01.27 | *** join/#openmoko Kensan (n=ken@gw.ptr-80-238-206-248.customer.ch.netstream.com) |
| 14:01.36 | grobian | XD |
| 14:02.04 | vallor | seriously, though, if there's a neo simulator, that might tide me over with something to code on, until deliver... |
| 14:02.18 | *** join/#openmoko SiO2 (n=sarge@p54B3B59A.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 14:02.22 | rtyler | vallor: QEMU... :) |
| 14:02.37 | vallor | rtyler: snazzy! :) |
| 14:02.42 | Kensan | vallor: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/MokoMakefile#QEMU |
| 14:02.48 | rtyler | beat me to it, drats :P |
| 14:03.07 | rtyler | fun fact, the openmoko-dialer will simply chop the number after a certain number of entries |
| 14:03.18 | grobian | qemu running on PID 7639 |
| 14:06.44 | Kensan | rtyler: did you report it to bugzilla? |
| 14:07.57 | rtyler | Kensan: been waiting on the confirmation email all night/morning :/ |
| 14:08.51 | *** join/#openmoko |R (i=bob@modemcable241.28-203-24.mc.videotron.ca) |
| 14:09.02 | Kensan | rtyler: does not seem to be in bugzilla... |
| 14:09.33 | rtyler | because I can't log in silly |
| 14:09.34 | Kensan | rtyler: did it get caught in your spam-filter or is your mail-server grey-listing? |
| 14:09.41 | rtyler | not sure on either |
| 14:09.48 | rtyler | I've been getting emails from mono-dev still |
| 14:11.42 | Kensan | rtyler: did you try to request a passwd change? (http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/query.cgi?GoAheadAndLogIn=1) |
| 14:12.42 | *** join/#openmoko Zoolooc (i=muciipec@p549512A9.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 14:14.20 | rtyler | we'll see if that works :P |
| 14:15.56 | mil_ | hurray little sister ruby :D http://img522.imageshack.us/img522/5436/bild2an2.png |
| 14:16.05 | *** join/#openmoko loufoque (n=loufoque@smj33-1-82-233-64-48.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 14:18.11 | ScaredyCat | galexande: I got mine too |
| 14:19.37 | *** join/#openmoko jackey (n=jackey@CPE001839cfbf96-CM0014e827107e.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 14:20.24 | *** join/#openmoko SiO2 (n=sarge@p54B3B59A.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 14:21.19 | galexande | scaredycat, were you #1844? |
| 14:21.27 | rtyler | oh woot, QEMU running OpenMoko running in Ubuntu running on Virtual Box running on an SSH X11 tunnel running on Xubuntu |
| 14:21.32 | ScaredyCat | 1826 |
| 14:22.02 | galexande | oh that's not so bad. if they get through the 40s and don't get me i'll be distraught |
| 14:22.38 | *** join/#openmoko ewanm89 (n=ewanm89@host81-159-214-205.range81-159.btcentralplus.com) |
| 14:22.50 | ScaredyCat | they did 39/34 |
| 14:23.03 | *** join/#openmoko chreekat (n=b@ip68-98-141-186.dc.dc.cox.net) |
| 14:23.39 | mil_ | nice even rubygems works.. now controlling openmoko with ruby classes eg native c extentions for arm ruby on timeline :) |
| 14:23.49 | ewanm89_laptop | ScaredyCat: How long since mokobot had a read error? |
| 14:23.57 | rtyler | mickey|tea: wicked :) |
| 14:24.04 | rtyler | erm |
| 14:24.08 | rtyler | mil_: wicked |
| 14:24.15 | ScaredyCat | dunno, I was out ewanm89_laptop |
| 14:24.43 | ewanm89_laptop | I wondered how long the timeout is. |
| 14:25.30 | ScaredyCat | well, it was before 12:25 today |
| 14:25.43 | *** join/#openmoko lynx (n=lynx@port-87-234-114-48.dynamic.qsc.de) |
| 14:26.10 | ScaredyCat | I'm pretty sure I used it to ~p1 |
| 14:26.16 | ScaredyCat | ~p1 |
| 14:26.27 | *** join/#openmoko j_ack (n=j_ack@p508DB9CD.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 14:26.32 | rtyler | have any of you booted the QEMU image off an NFS share yet? |
| 14:26.34 | ScaredyCat | so actually it must have been around 13:00 |
| 14:26.39 | *** join/#openmoko pomelo (n=pomelo@218.82.95.242) |
| 14:26.58 | ewanm89_laptop | Ah, um |
| 14:29.27 | *** join/#openmoko mokobot (n=ewanm89@host81-159-214-205.range81-159.btcentralplus.com) |
| 14:31.22 | *** join/#openmoko ericthefish (n=ivan@82-71-36-214.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk) |
| 14:31.48 | *** join/#openmoko zedstar (n=john@82-44-202-121.cable.ubr08.haye.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 14:36.43 | Markinoko | it appears that qemu's usb-linux-gadget.c includes linux/usb_gadgetfs.h which is a "in-tree" kernel header. this is heresy |
| 14:37.37 | sagacis | ~p1 |
| 14:37.37 | mokobot | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/P1_Owners |
| 14:37.43 | sagacis | That worked |
| 14:39.04 | *** join/#openmoko MacNorth (n=daijobu@c-75-71-250-33.hsd1.co.comcast.net) |
| 14:41.15 | *** join/#openmoko _rob (n=rob@77.47.0.11.static.cablesurf.de) |
| 14:41.17 | SpeedEvil | ~prof |
| 14:41.47 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@qiqinebs.chi.il.us) |
| 14:42.16 | ewanm89_laptop | sagacis: Why wouldn't it when I restarted the bot? |
| 14:42.19 | *** join/#openmoko idarwin (n=ian@69-17-146-104.kingkom.com) |
| 14:44.56 | *** join/#openmoko miip_ (n=miip@p54A54CD8.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 14:46.22 | *** join/#openmoko clinton_ (n=clinton@c-68-49-173-78.hsd1.md.comcast.net) |
| 14:46.59 | grobian | i have noticed 2 bugs in the calculaor ! |
| 14:47.33 | rtyler | subtract one from the other and you'll have zero bugs! |
| 14:47.50 | grobian | ;) |
| 14:47.56 | PBeck | grobian: fix it :> |
| 14:47.56 | mil_ | is the responding of typing in gtkterm smoth on real hardware? can i type with fingers? |
| 14:48.03 | grobian | okay |
| 14:48.08 | grobian | where is the source |
| 14:48.19 | jackey | mokobot, my order 2013 |
| 14:48.28 | jackey | it is not on the list why |
| 14:48.37 | jackey | I said YES_I_DO |
| 14:48.53 | *** join/#openmoko Tyrael (n=tyrael@213-140-6-114.ip.fastwebnet.it) |
| 14:49.14 | ewanm89_laptop | jackey: What list are you talking about? The owners list? |
| 14:49.14 | Tyrael | Hi all! |
| 14:49.15 | PBeck | grobian: i think it is in the svn-repo? |
| 14:49.15 | Tyrael | I got charged! |
| 14:49.25 | jackey | yes |
| 14:49.26 | galexande | tyrael, order no? |
| 14:49.30 | Tyrael | 18xx |
| 14:49.36 | galexande | 4x? |
| 14:49.39 | jackey | i have been waiting for a long time |
| 14:49.41 | Tyrael | 182x |
| 14:49.45 | galexande | oh good |
| 14:49.55 | grobian | but i dont think i have the permissions to write on rep! |
| 14:50.02 | rtyler | alright gents, it's been a delightful 12 hours of OpenMoko'ing after the previous 10 hours of actual working, if somebody gets everything sorted with QEMU, can they update the page: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/OpenMoko_under_QEMU |
| 14:50.10 | Tyrael | and the shipping cost was lower |
| 14:50.18 | rtyler | grobian: submit patches to the dev lists |
| 14:50.23 | Tyrael | 54 instead 77 (to Italy) |
| 14:50.41 | galexande | tyrael, fic gets a ups discount which they were unable to incorporate in the original estimate |
| 14:50.41 | ewanm89_laptop | jackey: The owners list is voluntary, add yourself if you wish. |
| 14:51.21 | jackey | i c, sorry i tought it was updated by openmoko |
| 14:51.36 | *** join/#openmoko nosyjoe (n=philipp@host-82-135-95-87.customer.m-online.net) |
| 14:51.39 | galexande | it would be neat ifit were :) |
| 14:51.55 | Tyrael | yeah, great! |
| 14:51.55 | Tyrael | also thanks to the Euro I pay 256,39€ |
| 14:52.16 | grobian | rtyler: ok, i have never done that bevore. How do i do that ? a patch is a diff between my source code and the repositroy , isnt it? |
| 14:52.34 | grobian | i just use the diff command? |
| 14:52.36 | rtyler | yes |
| 14:52.39 | rtyler | svn diff will do :) |
| 14:52.45 | grobian | ok |
| 14:53.09 | mickeyl | NOTE: please upload patches to bugzilla -- that way they don't get lost / overlooked etc. |
| 14:53.29 | Tyrael | Bye, I go out |
| 14:53.47 | vallor | so what's the word -- is it worth it to load up with the neo1973 emu, or is openmoko itself sufficiently complete to develop using the "PC" option? |
| 14:53.47 | *** part/#openmoko Tyrael (n=tyrael@213-140-6-114.ip.fastwebnet.it) |
| 14:53.50 | grobian | mickeyl: i will do so |
| 14:54.05 | vallor | (regarding qemu as illustrated here: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/OpenMoko_under_QEMU ) |
| 14:55.25 | vallor | ah, battery readings... |
| 14:55.53 | galexande | vallor, depends what you're writing i'd imagine. |
| 14:56.23 | galexande | if you're not interacting with the matchbox panel then you might as well just write in gtk, maybe using the mokoui libs |
| 14:56.28 | Kensan | grobian: you should file a bug on bugzilla and then attach your patch. |
| 14:56.39 | vallor | galexande: I was thinking of getting a mini-mini usb webcam working, so that one could snap pics ala mms-style messaging |
| 14:56.39 | galexande | and run it on the pc in a 480x~600 window :) |
| 14:57.26 | vallor | ,,, OHCI USB Works |
| 14:57.28 | vallor | :) :) |
| 14:57.41 | vallor | I'm going to go full-on hardware emulation |
| 14:57.54 | galexande | if you can get the camera to work with the neo then it will probably act the same as the camera hooked up to your pc |
| 14:58.02 | galexande | i.e., the same v4l or usbdevfs kind of interface |
| 14:58.04 | grobian | kensan: thx |
| 14:58.31 | galexande | though make sure you are using 2.6 kernel on your pc, in my experience v4l has changed a good deal |
| 14:58.48 | Sup3rkiddo | anyone know whats the highest rt charged till now? |
| 14:58.55 | buz | are there people who still use 2.4 on a desktop? |
| 14:59.02 | galexande | super, 1880 has been charged but 182x/183x has been almost all charged |
| 14:59.07 | galexande | so far as i know there are no 184x charges yet |
| 14:59.08 | vallor | galexande: I'm running F7, 2.6 has been around for a while :) |
| 14:59.28 | galexande | buz, me a month ago |
| 14:59.36 | SpeedEvil | <They could be doing it by the order of /YES I DO emails |
| 14:59.37 | buz | but why |
| 14:59.48 | galexande | buz, i don't go lookin for trouble |
| 15:00.05 | galexande | speed, thhat would be most unfortunate |
| 15:00.22 | buz | drivers alone would push most desktop users to 2.6 |
| 15:00.41 | galexande | well my hardware is a little bit old but i haven't yet found anything not supported by 2.4 |
| 15:01.02 | galexande | the stupid glibc threads dependency is what finally forced me to upgrade |
| 15:01.27 | galexande | the only difference i note is that now my nfs-over-openvpn sometimes creates some sort of DoS |
| 15:01.36 | buz | well i just track whatever ubuntu uses ;) |
| 15:01.52 | *** join/#openmoko ozarka (n=Compaq_O@cpe-76-184-78-54.tx.res.rr.com) |
| 15:03.17 | Kensan | buz: there are legacy system that can't upgrade in a "sane" way. 2.6 touched/reworked many subsystems |
| 15:03.34 | buz | yeah but desktop generally is not legacy |
| 15:03.51 | Kensan | buz: depends on definition of desktop ;) |
| 15:04.22 | *** join/#openmoko khester_ (n=khester@c-24-4-236-98.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 15:05.43 | idarwin | 191x has been charged as of this morning |
| 15:06.50 | galexande | i don't know what 'legacy' is. do you mean "still works?" |
| 15:07.09 | idarwin | gelexande, if you can switch from openvpn to ipsec you may get better performance due to the kernel buffer boundary issue which is done right in the kernel & probably can't be in user space openvpn. YMMV. |
| 15:07.20 | galexande | i have a 5 year old ipaq running a 4 year old version of familiar, is it legacy? |
| 15:07.27 | galexande | right now it's more likely to make a phone call than my neo is :( |
| 15:07.38 | SpeedEvil | legacy = systems that have to run for some reason to support certain hardware or software. |
| 15:07.42 | *** join/#openmoko zecke|shopping (n=ich@88.134.98.145) |
| 15:07.48 | galexande | idarwin, ipsec is *hideous* |
| 15:07.51 | SpeedEvil | Rahter than you haven't just upgraded yet |
| 15:07.54 | galexande | maybe i'm thinking of pptp |
| 15:07.59 | idarwin | legacy = the new old. :-) |
| 15:08.14 | idarwin | hideous as in setup or as in theory? |
| 15:10.33 | galexande | oh, l2tp is what i hate. i need to learn ipsec. thanks that may be what i'm looking for. |
| 15:10.49 | *** join/#openmoko ewanm89 (n=ewanm89@host86-153-88-123.range86-153.btcentralplus.com) |
| 15:11.50 | idarwin | gladly, and the ipsec setup is getting easier now on BSD it's like 3 or 4 lines of config, I presume it's getting simple on Linux as well - see http://www.securityfocus.com/infocus/1859 |
| 15:12.30 | idarwin | "Many people give up on IPSec after their first peek at the horrible and complex software documentation, ..." |
| 15:12.34 | idarwin | :-) |
| 15:12.36 | galexande | i think ipsec may make more sense than a vpn in my condition anyways... i just have an open wireless on my lan so i don't want unencrypted traffic |
| 15:13.22 | idarwin | give it a try while you wait for your phone to ship ... you've got time. |
| 15:13.26 | galexande | yup |
| 15:14.03 | ozarka | ~p1 |
| 15:14.10 | *** join/#openmoko amarsh04 (n=amarsh04@CPE-124-182-100-214.sa.bigpond.net.au) |
| 15:14.58 | *** join/#openmoko dcordes (n=ucordes@e181241043.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 15:17.16 | *** join/#openmoko pvanhoof (n=pvanhoof@81.187.73.203) |
| 15:18.23 | *** join/#openmoko Markinoko (n=Markinok@bgn92-4-82-238-213-101.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 15:23.12 | buz | uhm isnt ipsec one of several ways to do vpns? |
| 15:23.20 | *** join/#openmoko krzysiek_ (n=krzysiek@87-205-37-188.adsl.inetia.pl) |
| 15:23.33 | *** part/#openmoko mdt (n=mdt@littlelun.emdete.de) |
| 15:23.37 | idarwin | yes, i think he was contrasting it with openvpn. |
| 15:24.21 | mjr | buz, among other thing, such as opportunistic encryption |
| 15:25.56 | *** join/#openmoko Freed (n=jecsar@mac33-2-82-225-98-209.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 15:27.15 | *** join/#openmoko rd_ (n=rd@vnsecurity.net) |
| 15:31.17 | Qwell | any idea what software is being used for the touchscreen stuff? or is it just like a mouse driver? |
| 15:32.00 | mjr | pretty much |
| 15:34.39 | *** join/#openmoko tri (n=tri@p57AD8CC7.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 15:36.27 | vallor | it's awful hard to read the actual text of the emails in the emulator |
| 15:36.36 | vallor | gray-on-gray |
| 15:38.00 | cdbot2 | * * OM Bug 643 has been created by bmidgley(AT)gmail.com |
| 15:38.01 | cdbot2 | * * images on today screen are all "broken" images |
| 15:38.02 | cdbot2 | * * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=643 |
| 15:39.01 | cdbot2 | * * OM Bug 644 has been created by bmidgley(AT)gmail.com |
| 15:39.02 | cdbot2 | * * no way in gui to start today screen |
| 15:39.03 | cdbot2 | * * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=644 |
| 15:39.08 | *** part/#openmoko Freed (n=jecsar@mac33-2-82-225-98-209.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 15:40.00 | *** join/#openmoko rd__ (n=rd@vnsecurity.net) |
| 15:40.01 | galexande | ipsec in transport mode doesn't alter the routing of the packet at all |
| 15:41.48 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[P1_Owners]] [[Getting_Started_with_your_Neo1973/fr]] [[User_talk:Michaelshiloh]] [[OpenMoko_under_QEMU]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Toronto]] [[Talk:Getting_Started_with_your_Neo1973/fr]] |
| 15:44.28 | cjb_ie | so has anyone got a phone yet? |
| 15:44.29 | lysanderslair | theres text in the emails ? i wondered why they were empty |
| 15:45.22 | vallor | lysanderslair: if you look very carefully, you can see that there's text (but there is practically no contrast against the background) |
| 15:45.48 | *** join/#openmoko MickTaiwan (n=mick@lan31-6-82-238-147-130.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 15:46.06 | Markinoko | at last ! I'm connected to qemu with ssh... |
| 15:46.08 | MickTaiwan | Hi |
| 15:46.12 | Markinoko | what an adventure that was... |
| 15:46.27 | MickTaiwan | How can I update dist-bzip2 to 1.6 in order to build the gsm lib ? |
| 15:46.32 | *** join/#openmoko abraxa_ (n=abraxa@pD95FE0B2.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 15:47.34 | *** join/#openmoko calamous (n=harry@c-67-175-201-140.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 15:47.41 | calamous | Woot my CC has been charged |
| 15:50.31 | ScaredyCat | !google $530 as GBP |
| 15:50.32 | cdbot2 | Images @ http://images.google.com/images?hl=en&q=%24530+as+GBP&safe=off&lr=lang_all&um=1&sa=N&tab=wi | eBay.com.sg: ASUS F25BT55DD (F2J) NOTEBO @ http://cgi.ebay.com.sg/ASUS-F25BT55DD-F2J-NOTEBOOK-LAPTOP_W0QQitemZ220103818796QQihZ012QQcategoryZ80208QQcmdZViewItem%20class=l | VIP for SLA Members - Special Libraries @ http://www.sla.org/content/membership/mbrbenefits/vip.cfm%20class=l |
| 15:50.41 | ScaredyCat | lardy |
| 15:51.00 | mmazur | That was... smart. |
| 15:51.25 | vallor | btw, does the neo1973 have the iphone-esq 2-finger touchscreen? |
| 15:51.39 | vallor | i.e., undertands two-finger commands? |
| 15:51.44 | vallor | +s |
| 15:53.12 | cjb_ie | vallor: someone asked that a couple of days back. i think the answer was that the screen on gta01 doesn't, but gta02 might. |
| 15:53.24 | vallor | ah k |
| 15:53.40 | *** join/#openmoko Aria (n=aredride@betelgeuse.theinternetco.net) |
| 15:53.55 | ScaredyCat | you mean is it multi touch... |
| 15:53.59 | vallor | yes |
| 15:53.59 | ScaredyCat | the anser is no |
| 15:54.06 | ScaredyCat | answer |
| 15:54.12 | vallor | dang! |
| 15:54.25 | ScaredyCat | it's a possible feature on later hardware... |
| 15:54.27 | ScaredyCat | but... |
| 15:54.49 | ScaredyCat | they do seem to have had some luck with detecting accelerated movement |
| 15:54.55 | ScaredyCat | eg in lists |
| 15:55.12 | vallor | that would be helpful |
| 15:55.16 | ScaredyCat | slow start -> accelerate = speed scroll |
| 15:55.32 | vallor | the iphone zoom/unzoom with the two fingers is pretty slick |
| 15:55.39 | ScaredyCat | so you could do stuff with 1 fingetr, but with speed too |
| 15:55.55 | ScaredyCat | I assume that's like the microsoft table thing |
| 15:56.34 | ScaredyCat | where 2 fingers 'drag' from the centre in opposite directions? |
| 15:56.55 | vallor | yes |
| 15:56.55 | cjb_ie | yeah, i think you "pinch" to make things smaller and "spread" to make them bigger |
| 15:57.07 | vallor | exactly |
| 15:57.23 | vallor | I can think of some unique drag gestures that could do the same think in om |
| 15:57.27 | cjb_ie | i couldn't think for a word that was the opposite of "pinch" that doesn't make me think of goatse |
| 15:57.33 | cjb_ie | :( |
| 15:57.37 | vallor | haha |
| 15:58.17 | ScaredyCat | unpinch ;) |
| 15:59.21 | ScaredyCat | 91. Jackey Yang Nanjing, China Black/Silver 5x Advanced, #2013, YES_I_DID 14 July |
| 15:59.24 | ScaredyCat | !!! |
| 15:59.29 | ScaredyCat | galexande: ^^ |
| 15:59.32 | vallor | okay! I guess getting sshd working is the next step |
| 16:01.25 | jackey | ScaredyCat: haha |
| 16:01.30 | jackey | ScaredyCat: what is u? |
| 16:01.34 | jackey | u |
| 16:01.36 | jackey | up |
| 16:01.44 | jackey | damn keyboard |
| 16:01.51 | ScaredyCat | #1826 - btI've been charged :) |
| 16:01.53 | *** join/#openmoko bendo (i=bendo@irc.cnet.sk) |
| 16:02.07 | jackey | really? |
| 16:02.11 | ScaredyCat | ya |
| 16:02.14 | ScaredyCat | :D |
| 16:02.24 | Aria | Woot! |
| 16:02.30 | vallor | the terminal emulator could use some work |
| 16:02.32 | ScaredyCat | they did a few today... |
| 16:02.39 | *** join/#openmoko mokobot (n=ewanm89@host86-153-88-123.range86-153.btcentralplus.com) |
| 16:02.45 | vallor | or is it the shell? is it just running busybox? |
| 16:03.01 | LarstiQ | ScaredyCat: 5x? |
| 16:03.33 | ScaredyCat | 8 |
| 16:03.53 | LarstiQ | nice |
| 16:04.09 | *** join/#openmoko j_ack (n=j_ack@p508DB9CD.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 16:04.10 | jackey | ScaredyCat: you ordered 8 neo? |
| 16:04.22 | ScaredyCat | no.. :) |
| 16:04.41 | jackey | ScaredyCat: I order 5x advanced |
| 16:04.56 | *** join/#openmoko Skwid_ (n=Skwid@adsl-64-173-169-47.dsl.frsn01.pacbell.net) |
| 16:04.58 | jackey | i had another basic |
| 16:05.23 | jackey | will order more late, could be a first mass production customer for openmoko |
| 16:05.57 | LarstiQ | jackey: do you eat them for breakfast? :) |
| 16:06.16 | ScaredyCat | heheh |
| 16:06.35 | *** join/#openmoko _kaiser_ (n=kaiser@74-140-187-27.dhcp.insightbb.com) |
| 16:06.47 | ScaredyCat | jackey: you have 5 devs ready to work on them ? |
| 16:06.52 | jackey | LarstiQ: haha, you bet |
| 16:07.43 | jackey | ScaredyCat: I have not receive those phones yet |
| 16:09.07 | jackey | ScaredyCat: U developer? |
| 16:09.14 | ScaredyCat | ya |
| 16:09.20 | jackey | ScaredyCat, in bay area? |
| 16:09.33 | ScaredyCat | no.. in .nl and uk |
| 16:09.56 | ScaredyCat | 2 weeks in .nl, 2 weeks in uk till i sell the house in .nl |
| 16:09.56 | ewanm89_laptop | ScaredyCat: Where abouts in the UK? |
| 16:10.10 | ScaredyCat | working in suffolk |
| 16:10.26 | ScaredyCat | just outside ipswich |
| 16:10.28 | ewanm89_laptop | A long way from me then. |
| 16:10.41 | ScaredyCat | where are you? |
| 16:10.47 | ewanm89_laptop | Dorset |
| 16:10.55 | ScaredyCat | ooo... miles away :) |
| 16:11.10 | ewanm89_laptop | cjb_ie: lol |
| 16:11.14 | cjb_ie | erm. no pun intended with 'waves' - honest. |
| 16:11.16 | *** join/#openmoko PBeck_ (n=PBeck@HSI-KBW-091-089-102-236.hsi2.kabelbw.de) |
| 16:11.31 | mmazur | ipswitch? :) |
| 16:12.00 | ewanm89_laptop | madwoota: I think he spelt it right. |
| 16:12.03 | jackey | damn it |
| 16:12.08 | ewanm89_laptop | mmazur: I think he spelt it right. |
| 16:12.13 | jackey | my credit card is still uncharged |
| 16:12.46 | ScaredyCat | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ipswich |
| 16:12.47 | jackey | made an order on July 9th morning, but still ... |
| 16:12.51 | cjb_ie | just because we're geeks doesn't mean ipswich becomes an IP switch :-) |
| 16:13.12 | mmazur | cjb_ie, would be fun though :) |
| 16:13.23 | mmazur | My cc card still unchard too :( |
| 16:13.57 | *** join/#openmoko empty_mind (n=shark@59.176.111.177) |
| 16:14.49 | mmazur | There's something extremely decadent about not wanting to wait any longer for someone to take your money. |
| 16:15.10 | *** join/#openmoko icman (n=icman@123-240-172-33.cctv.dynamic.lsc.net.tw) |
| 16:15.44 | ScaredyCat | holy crap - look at those floods |
| 16:16.53 | orospakr | mmazur: hear hear. ;) |
| 16:17.17 | orospakr | My card is, of course, uncharged. :( |
| 16:17.54 | jackey | orosakr, when u made the order? |
| 16:19.43 | vallor | in the om emulator, will time be accurate if I get networking working? |
| 16:20.51 | ewanm89_laptop | vallor: If your system time is accurate then the time in the emulator should be accurate. |
| 16:21.02 | kristian-m | vallor you can use date -s - after a fresh installation my time is systemtime in qemu now... |
| 16:21.44 | galexande | or you can run date +%m%d%H%M%C%y.%S on your host, and run date with that output as its parameter on the emulator |
| 16:21.48 | vallor | system time = ntp synced, but the emu thinks it's the ubiquitous 1970 |
| 16:22.05 | vallor | galexande: snazzy! :) |
| 16:22.17 | *** join/#openmoko Tob1 (n=tobi@p5B0079AD.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 16:24.53 | *** join/#openmoko jeddy3 (n=data@h-193-67.A148.cust.bahnhof.se) |
| 16:25.13 | mil_ | how to set LANG in openmoko shell? |
| 16:26.41 | jackey | it is hopeless now |
| 16:27.02 | jackey | lots of people ordered late than me have received phones |
| 16:27.20 | vallor | jackey: I ordered on the 9th, but still haven't gotten the phone |
| 16:27.25 | vallor | I'm playing with the emulator |
| 16:27.26 | *** join/#openmoko mkmks (n=user@nfrolov.dialup.corbina.ru) |
| 16:27.39 | jackey | emulator? |
| 16:27.43 | vallor | why yes :) |
| 16:28.03 | jackey | i need the debug board, current software stack is so buggy |
| 16:28.05 | vallor | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/MokoMakefile#QEMU |
| 16:28.13 | ewanm89_laptop | It works quite nicely in the emulator. |
| 16:29.19 | ScaredyCat | jackey: I don't think may - if any - have received a pdevice |
| 16:29.21 | ScaredyCat | -p |
| 16:29.42 | ScaredyCat | we've just had our cc's charged |
| 16:30.04 | jackey | ScaredyCat: what is your order number and the date you made the order? |
| 16:30.25 | ScaredyCat | #1826 and the 8th |
| 16:30.50 | jackey | the manufacturer is an hour and half driver from my city and i paid for internaltional shippment :( |
| 16:31.02 | ScaredyCat | ouch! |
| 16:31.22 | ScaredyCat | they'll fix the shipping I suspect.. |
| 16:31.30 | ewanm89_laptop | jackey: Unfortunatly they are going via califonia. |
| 16:31.36 | ScaredyCat | they seem to be charging what it actually costs |
| 16:32.01 | jackey | ewanm89_laptop, u kidding me right? |
| 16:32.06 | ScaredyCat | no |
| 16:32.08 | ScaredyCat | he's not |
| 16:32.09 | ewanm89_laptop | No |
| 16:32.16 | ScaredyCat | they shipped them to the USA ... |
| 16:32.28 | Kensan | galexande: (from backlog) IPsec is much more powerfull than Openvpn/TLS. It depends on your scenario what to use but current IPsec implementations with their good documentation flatten the learning curve. |
| 16:32.30 | jackey | do they have a store that i can send someone to get it? |
| 16:32.40 | pomelo | so jackey, guess ur leaving in Shanghai/Nanjin? |
| 16:32.48 | ScaredyCat | no jackey... |
| 16:33.05 | galexande | kensan, i'm waiting for the kernel modules to build :) |
| 16:33.05 | jackey | I am in Nanjing, but now is in Toronto, Canada |
| 16:33.14 | jackey | pomelo, u chinese? |
| 16:33.30 | pomelo | u bet, living in shanghai now |
| 16:34.00 | jackey | pomelo, why u are here then? |
| 16:34.12 | ewanm89_laptop | jackey: Not at the moment, they hope to have a distribution net set up for the main release. |
| 16:34.22 | jackey | pomelo, shanghai has lots of design house |
| 16:34.28 | Kensan | galexande: The new IPsec rfcs have greatly simplified the underlying protocols, especially the key exchange (IKEv2). |
| 16:34.36 | pomelo | hmm, may u right |
| 16:34.51 | pomelo | i am working here |
| 16:34.59 | jackey | ewanm89_laptop, they should have told me about that, so i can let then ship to CA first. I got team there too. |
| 16:35.01 | mmazur | So FIC is taiwaneese, but the factory is in china? |
| 16:35.17 | galexande | kensan, i don't know anything about it but i think i have a racoon config that will work for me...i just need to finish upgrading all of the involved kernels |
| 16:35.20 | jackey | factory is in Shuzhou |
| 16:35.58 | kristian-m | pomelo why is it, that shanghai does not have a linux user group? |
| 16:36.10 | Kensan | galexande: Just out of curiosity: what's your vpn scenario ? |
| 16:36.10 | jackey | at middle between Nanjing and Shanghai |
| 16:36.31 | jackey | pomelo, u are in mobile business too |
| 16:36.35 | pomelo | kristian-m, we do have this, shlug i think is the name |
| 16:36.47 | *** join/#openmoko baird (n=cbaird@brushtail.apana.org.au) |
| 16:36.56 | pomelo | actually, im working 4 an erp company |
| 16:37.12 | galexande | kensan, at the moment i have one computer running several instances of openvpn and vtun, and a bunch of clients which connect to it. |
| 16:37.19 | jackey | pomelo, ERP outsourcing company? |
| 16:37.32 | jackey | same question, why u are here then? |
| 16:37.33 | kristian-m | pomelo oh, i havn't found one 2 years ago - nice to hear though |
| 16:37.43 | galexande | kensan, i use vpn over lan because my lan is open to wifi, mostly to authenticate that the IP is owned by the proper NFS client |
| 16:38.14 | pomelo | kristian-m, you can check geekbone.org to see if it works |
| 16:38.17 | *** join/#openmoko ahbritto (n=guest@adsl-64-161-117-110.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net) |
| 16:38.21 | Vndmtrx | :) |
| 16:39.01 | pomelo | and jackey, not quite get ur question, here for openmoko or why i am located in SH? |
| 16:39.30 | LarstiQ | ScaredyCat: where in .nl is the house you are selling? |
| 16:39.49 | jackey | pomelo, i mean why you are also interested in openmoko? |
| 16:40.02 | jackey | i thought you are from wireless industry like i do |
| 16:40.29 | vallor | hmm.... is there some trick to getting sound from the qemu working? |
| 16:40.29 | ewanm89_laptop | I'm not in any business, yet I'm interested in FOSS and openmoko. |
| 16:41.06 | jackey | FOSS? |
| 16:41.07 | ScaredyCat | LarstiQ: Leleystad |
| 16:41.13 | ScaredyCat | -e |
| 16:41.14 | pomelo | an interesting gizmo to play around, mobile devices always raise my apetites |
| 16:41.44 | LarstiQ | ScaredyCat: ah, a bit too far away for me unfortunately. |
| 16:41.48 | ewanm89_laptop | jackey: Free and Open Source Software |
| 16:41.56 | pomelo | 100% for personal interests |
| 16:41.56 | jackey | haha |
| 16:42.22 | ScaredyCat | LarstiQ: :'( |
| 16:42.42 | LarstiQ | ScaredyCat: but if you happen to be selling a house in Delft, let me know ;) |
| 16:42.51 | SpeedEvil | Chief-executive of T-mobile-UK on Radio 4 now |
| 16:42.52 | LarstiQ | ScaredyCat: good luck with yours |
| 16:42.55 | SpeedEvil | About iphone |
| 16:43.00 | jackey | pomelo, nice to meet u man. I am from www.archermind.com, a mobile outsourcing company |
| 16:43.13 | ScaredyCat | LarstiQ: ta. ... it's slow sadly :( |
| 16:43.26 | SpeedEvil | A 'interview important buisness people' program |
| 16:44.06 | jackey | SpeedEvil, iPhone is great but evil |
| 16:44.57 | SpeedEvil | Open hardware would be good. |
| 16:45.11 | SpeedEvil | Otherwise... |
| 16:45.13 | pomelo | jackey: so i guess u guyz may wanna dig some possibilities on openmoko? |
| 16:46.04 | jackey | pomelo, some kind of, we do not do product. But couple customers are interested in this platform |
| 16:46.16 | jackey | we are requested to do some investment for them. |
| 16:46.52 | kristian-m | jackey oh, I read you've got quite a rich boss :) |
| 16:46.55 | jackey | we did phone product before, i would like to contribute my industrial experience to make openmoko a product |
| 16:47.23 | Skwid_ | zecke: are you here ? |
| 16:47.29 | *** part/#openmoko baird (n=cbaird@brushtail.apana.org.au) |
| 16:47.38 | jackey | kristian-m, u mean Jiping Wang? Yep, he is quite famous in mobile software area. |
| 16:47.44 | *** join/#openmoko lrg (n=liam@lrg2.demon.co.uk) |
| 16:47.50 | jackey | also he is rich |
| 16:47.58 | zecke | sort of |
| 16:48.32 | Skwid_ | zecke: sorry to bother you, you wrote the rss reader application right ? |
| 16:48.46 | zecke | Skwid_: sort of :) |
| 16:49.07 | mickeyl | heh. zecke is too modest (as always) |
| 16:49.12 | Skwid_ | zecke: I have a C / Gtk app that reads an xml file, and I would like to port it to openmoko, but i'm not sure how to add an application to my local copy etc |
| 16:49.18 | Skwid_ | is there any documentation on that ? |
| 16:49.36 | Skwid_ | I would like to duplicate the rss reader app, and go from there to learn |
| 16:49.45 | ewanm89_laptop | Skwid_: bitbake and quilt. |
| 16:49.50 | Skwid_ | but I'm not sure how to add an entry to the menu etc |
| 16:50.02 | zecke | mickeyl: well, I need get around to send a mail to your designers to get a spec for the config dialog |
| 16:50.19 | Skwid_ | I looked last night, but the applications didn't seem to be in packages |
| 16:50.41 | Skwid_ | the openmoko-* ones |
| 16:51.17 | zecke | Skwid_: I started with looking at the chordmaster example application and documented the short comings of my approach in a text file |
| 16:51.32 | Skwid_ | where could i find that example ? |
| 16:51.47 | zecke | Skwid_: as to your "local copy" question. I have OpenMoko compiled against gtk+ 2.10 on my desktop and run it like any other app on my desktop |
| 16:52.01 | Skwid_ | ah, i see |
| 16:52.22 | zecke | Skwid_: the base directory: https://svn.openmoko.org/trunk/src/target/OM-2007/ |
| 16:52.25 | Skwid_ | i run it under qemu for now |
| 16:52.45 | zecke | Skwid_: https://svn.openmoko.org/trunk/src/target/OM-2007/applications/openmoko-chordmaster/ chordmaster |
| 16:53.09 | zecke | Skwid_: it is easy to let it run on your desktop. You just need to build eds-dbus, libgsmd and the moko libraries |
| 16:53.11 | Skwid_ | oh cool |
| 16:53.24 | ewanm89_laptop | I run under qemu, the openmoko ones are grabbed from svn and compiled on make openmoko-dev-image |
| 16:54.19 | Skwid_ | i'll look at the chordmaster app |
| 16:54.23 | vallor | an announcement in the topic regarding the emulator being available might be useful :) |
| 16:54.47 | Skwid_ | so if i add something to /home/moko/openmoko/trunk/src/target/OM-2007/applications and compile it |
| 16:55.01 | Skwid_ | will it show up somewhere on my qemu if i reflash ? |
| 16:55.10 | SpeedEvil | val: it is in the faq... |
| 16:56.23 | ewanm89_laptop | Skwid_: not quite |
| 16:56.59 | Skwid_ | ewanm89_laptop: ah :( |
| 16:57.14 | Skwid_ | once I figure all this out, i'll be glad to make a wiki page for the following courageous souls ;) |
| 16:57.32 | ewanm89_laptop | Skwid_: create a bitbake recipe to say how to build it, then edit tasks/task-openmoko to depend on that recipe. |
| 16:57.41 | mil_ | Skwid_: need to add it to trunk/oe/packages/tasks/task-openmoko.bb's bitbake file like discribed in the wiki. or your app is not in the om-devel-image |
| 16:57.56 | ewanm89_laptop | Skwid_: It's on the mokomakefile page. |
| 16:58.30 | Skwid_ | hum i didn't find it there |
| 16:58.50 | *** join/#openmoko Cyphi^ (n=cyphi@a91-153-116-247.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 16:58.51 | Skwid_ | thank you very much mil_ and ewanm89_laptop for the info ! |
| 17:00.23 | Skwid_ | ewanm89_laptop: oh, now I see it |
| 17:01.04 | Skwid_ | but I was confused because when I looked in the packages/ directory, none of the openmoko-* apps were there, and in the openmoko-* apps directories, there are no .bb files |
| 17:01.10 | Skwid_ | so I wasn't sure if they used the same mechanism |
| 17:03.31 | Skwid_ | so I can create a package and have it in the target/OM-2007/applications folder ? |
| 17:05.56 | Skwid_ | oh, i see this: https://svn.openmoko.org/trunk/oe/packages/openmoko-apps/ |
| 17:06.40 | *** join/#openmoko openfanss (n=df@218.79.146.16) |
| 17:07.15 | *** join/#openmoko Magon (n=Magon@213.155.227.226) |
| 17:12.28 | *** join/#openmoko fgau (n=fgau@pD95398EE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 17:12.46 | Skwid_ | so, my only remaining questions are, where should i put my application's folder in the tree ? and where should i put the dependency in task-openmoko.bb |
| 17:12.47 | Skwid_ | ? |
| 17:12.49 | vallor | hmm, even if I explicitly configure & build qemu-system-arm with "--enable-alsa", I still don't see any "Valid sound card names" when starting it with "-soundhw ?" -- is it using alsa, or is the driver lower-level than that? (p.s. I see in the qemu faq that asound.conf has to be set up correctly, investigating that...) |
| 17:15.35 | *** join/#openmoko ravan (n=ravan@59.93.83.79) |
| 17:16.28 | *** join/#openmoko wbx (n=wbx@static-87-79-68-60.netcologne.de) |
| 17:16.29 | Skwid_ | ewanm89_laptop: where should i put the app folder in the tree ? |
| 17:16.31 | vallor | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973_Audio_Subsystem |
| 17:17.51 | *** join/#openmoko empty_mind (n=shark@59.176.111.177) |
| 17:22.52 | *** join/#openmoko Sirclown82 (n=Sirclown@adsl-75-53-40-243.dsl.rcsntx.sbcglobal.net) |
| 17:23.06 | vallor | ALSA device list: |
| 17:23.06 | vallor | <PROTECTED> |
| 17:23.30 | *** join/#openmoko tg (i=tg@x-net.hu) |
| 17:23.35 | vallor | (using -serial stdout to read the boot messages) |
| 17:24.27 | ewanm89_laptop | Skwid_: You don't |
| 17:25.14 | Skwid_ | ewanm89_laptop: ok now i'm totally confused :) |
| 17:25.36 | ewanm89_laptop | Skwid_: Put the source in a tar.gz |
| 17:26.15 | Skwid_ | oh, right |
| 17:26.20 | Skwid_ | and use the SRC_URI |
| 17:27.20 | Skwid_ | so then, i only add a folder to the packages directory ? and where do i add my dependency in the task-openmoko.bb |
| 17:27.24 | Skwid_ | does it even matter ? |
| 17:27.49 | ewanm89_laptop | Skwid_: You got it, then you use quilt to make a patch that adds that .bb file and edits task-openmoko.bb |
| 17:28.25 | Skwid_ | hum, i think i'm starting to get it :) |
| 17:28.35 | ewanm89_laptop | Folder with .bb inside (use quilt else it will get destroyed by svn update. |
| 17:29.34 | Skwid_ | ah |
| 17:29.44 | Skwid_ | so everything that gets added needs to be through quilt |
| 17:30.18 | Skwid_ | last question i promise :) |
| 17:30.36 | Skwid_ | does it matter where i put the line in task-openmoko.bb ewanm89_laptop ? |
| 17:30.55 | ewanm89_laptop | Then edit task-openmoko.bb, increase PR number by one and add it tor RDEPENDS just before # update-alternatives \ |
| 17:31.20 | ewanm89_laptop | Evrything in the tree should be edited through quilt. |
| 17:31.33 | ewanm89_laptop | s/Evr/Ever/ |
| 17:31.41 | Skwid_ | ok |
| 17:31.43 | Skwid_ | makes perfect sense |
| 17:31.57 | *** join/#openmoko jpozlovsky (n=jindra@ip-85-160-81-38.eurotel.cz) |
| 17:31.59 | Skwid_ | thank you very much ! i think i'll be able to manage from here :) |
| 17:32.36 | Skwid_ | bye ! |
| 17:32.40 | *** part/#openmoko Skwid_ (n=Skwid@adsl-64-173-169-47.dsl.frsn01.pacbell.net) |
| 17:37.41 | *** join/#openmoko pigpen (n=mark@fw.seamans.cc) |
| 17:39.11 | *** join/#openmoko hads (n=hads@202.4.237.154) |
| 17:41.28 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Wish_List_-_Hardware]] [[User:Moko_bunny]] [[P1_Owners]] [[Anti-Theft_Mode]] [[Wish_List]] [[OSvS]] [[Shipping_Notes:phase1_Poland]] [[Application_UI_Design_Recommendations]] [[Translation]] |
| 17:43.36 | *** join/#openmoko tg (i=tg@x-net.hu) |
| 17:49.01 | *** join/#openmoko mellon (n=mellon@dsl093-162-135.tus1.dsl.speakeasy.net) |
| 17:51.11 | *** join/#openmoko mokobot (n=ewanm89@host86-153-88-123.range86-153.btcentralplus.com) |
| 17:51.45 | *** join/#openmoko ewanm89 (n=ewanm89@host86-153-88-123.range86-153.btcentralplus.com) |
| 17:51.54 | happycube | my card got charged! |
| 17:52.07 | woglinde | gratz |
| 17:52.13 | happycube | thx |
| 17:53.01 | calamous | Does anyone know about ATMs? |
| 17:53.13 | *** join/#openmoko Vndmtrx (n=Ox0ff@unaffiliated/vndmtrx) |
| 17:53.18 | woglinde | know about what? |
| 17:53.29 | calamous | Chase's ATMs use windows |
| 17:53.49 | calamous | I went to make a deposit at one and loe and behold there was a windows error up then (in the regular winxp theme) |
| 17:54.00 | woglinde | oh ATMs != at the moment |
| 17:54.12 | calamous | and had to go to the next block where the atm's were working |
| 17:54.23 | calamous | But now I'm weary about using them if they run windows |
| 17:54.40 | calamous | With all the security flaws I would have figured that the bank would not want to use windows |
| 17:54.45 | Ganneff | nearly all ATMs run windows |
| 17:54.54 | Ganneff | like - 80 til 90% at least |
| 17:55.02 | calamous | really? why? |
| 17:55.11 | Ganneff | because they do. |
| 17:55.19 | Ganneff | no, dont ask me why, its just this way |
| 17:55.42 | LarstiQ | calamous: my observations agree with Ganneff. No idea why they want to, but they do. |
| 17:55.48 | calamous | I took some pics of the error msg and the atm, is there a place where I can submit them to like a broken embedded windows site |
| 17:56.00 | calamous | or does anyone want them emailed |
| 17:56.06 | Ganneff | its not only an observation, its also what banks and the atm manufacturers say :) |
| 17:57.20 | kristian-m | Ganneff thought they where using os2 |
| 17:57.27 | Ganneff | no, not the ATMs |
| 17:57.28 | calamous | Knowing microsoft. I'm wondering if I can enter a really long pin number and cause a buffer overflow |
| 17:57.47 | calamous | overwrite the return address to the giveMeMoney subrouteine |
| 17:57.52 | LarstiQ | Ganneff: ah, I've never actually been party to bank communications like that :) |
| 17:58.12 | woglinde | hm the terminals of my bank uses pc hardware I spotted them serval times booting |
| 17:58.28 | woglinde | but without escape key no bios |
| 17:58.33 | woglinde | entry |
| 17:58.34 | woglinde | *g* |
| 17:58.54 | *** join/#openmoko empty_mind (n=shark@59.176.111.177) |
| 17:59.09 | calamous | Does anyone know of people cracking an ATM? |
| 17:59.19 | woglinde | yes |
| 17:59.25 | calamous | all ATMs expect the magnetic card to be encoded a certain way |
| 17:59.45 | cjb | usually people just use the default operator password. |
| 17:59.47 | woglinde | the deliverded them and didnt change the factory key |
| 17:59.59 | woglinde | and the factory key was in one document |
| 18:00.01 | calamous | If someone got a card writer and put something it didnt except that may work (of course it would be more soficistaated) |
| 18:00.13 | calamous | Ohh wow |
| 18:00.20 | woglinde | so they change the code that the automat puts out 50$ instaed of $20 notes |
| 18:00.21 | calamous | default passwords |
| 18:00.27 | woglinde | let me see if I find the story |
| 18:00.36 | calamous | woglide: thats funny |
| 18:01.02 | kristian-m | woglinde but it was accounting for $50 though |
| 18:01.19 | woglinde | dont know |
| 18:01.32 | woglinde | If I remeberd correctly |
| 18:01.38 | woglinde | they only spoted it |
| 18:01.43 | cjb | actually, it put out $20 while thinking it was putting out $1. |
| 18:01.48 | cjb | it's a *very* common ATM hack. |
| 18:01.54 | woglinde | because he once forget to switch the firmware back |
| 18:01.54 | kristian-m | :-) |
| 18:02.01 | *** join/#openmoko fiveplusone (n=six@dyn-160-39-255-216.dyn.columbia.edu) |
| 18:02.10 | woglinde | and other customers got that |
| 18:02.13 | woglinde | too |
| 18:02.49 | ferric | lol |
| 18:03.02 | calamous | I see ATMs in public all the time, the old school ones, that have a phone line going to wall |
| 18:03.02 | ferric | so, we're upto rt #2053 now... |
| 18:03.15 | calamous | It would be nice to tap that line and cap the session |
| 18:03.23 | empty_mind | hmm |
| 18:03.24 | calamous | and you can study bank-atm-money-protocol |
| 18:03.28 | cjb | calamous: hm? it's not just old school ones that use a modem. |
| 18:03.30 | empty_mind | how do we track rt numbers ? |
| 18:03.57 | empty_mind | mine happens to be 1204th order |
| 18:04.14 | calamous | cjb: At banks I see tell terminals with their computer backs facing the customer. I dont think it would be hard to disconnect the network and but a tapping device between it |
| 18:04.15 | ferric | empty_mind: how'd you get that? |
| 18:04.25 | ferric | i'm just going by: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/P1_Owners |
| 18:04.25 | empty_mind | well someone told me a calculation |
| 18:04.33 | empty_mind | rt no. minus 1820 |
| 18:04.34 | calamous | Or take the keyboard out and put a key logger |
| 18:04.39 | *** join/#openmoko Skwid_ (n=Skwid@adsl-64-173-169-47.dsl.frsn01.pacbell.net) |
| 18:04.48 | ferric | empty_mind: that might not be foolproof :) |
| 18:04.52 | calamous | they make small key loggers that fit between the ps2 port and kb |
| 18:05.02 | *** join/#openmoko Sirclown82 (n=Sirclown@adsl-75-53-40-243.dsl.rcsntx.sbcglobal.net) |
| 18:05.24 | calamous | they hold about 32K of data |
| 18:05.31 | ferric | i think if you took a keylogger to a bank and were trying to install it, someone would be suspicious :) |
| 18:05.42 | ewon | wear a jumpsuit and look like you belong |
| 18:05.43 | calamous | not software |
| 18:05.47 | calamous | its hardware |
| 18:05.52 | ferric | i know |
| 18:05.53 | Aria | Ever see the movie Chaos? Damn good movie. |
| 18:05.57 | ferric | 'install' applies to both |
| 18:06.06 | empty_mind | well my rt no was 3024 i think, let me check |
| 18:06.37 | calamous | ferric: alright. but bank employees seem so absent minded set a bag down and "acidently" knock it out. say "i'm sorry let me connect that for you" |
| 18:07.15 | empty_mind | ah yes my rt no is 3024 |
| 18:07.28 | SpeedEvil | ferric: there was a recent case where a 6 year old was used to install a keylogger on a member of parliaments computer. |
| 18:07.31 | calamous | At my school we have the usually college meal plan and you swipe your college ID. the machies connect to the regualar network |
| 18:07.54 | calamous | SpeedEvil: where was that? |
| 18:08.00 | SpeedEvil | ferric: for a newspaper - UK. |
| 18:08.38 | SpeedEvil | ferric: distract MP, who doesn't expect 6yo to do anything bad. They unplug the keyb and plug it into logger, and plug logger back in |
| 18:08.50 | calamous | SpeedEvil: Who did they find out? |
| 18:08.56 | ferric | scary! |
| 18:08.59 | calamous | Since its in the news I assume that it was foiled |
| 18:09.39 | woglinde | sorry |
| 18:09.43 | woglinde | dont find it now |
| 18:09.46 | woglinde | maybee later |
| 18:09.54 | calamous | SpeedEvil: Do you know who they found out? |
| 18:11.45 | *** join/#openmoko Dmitry_Platonov (n=hawk@user-89-248-176-130.gagarino.net) |
| 18:14.43 | calamous | Does anyone think it was a little odd that some people were billed on saturday? |
| 18:14.59 | Aria | No |
| 18:15.24 | galexande | i wish i was |
| 18:15.37 | writchie | me too |
| 18:16.06 | SpeedEvil | calamous: It was a stunt by a newspaper. |
| 18:17.18 | mellon | calamous:they might have been billed on friday, and it showed up on saturday. normally banks clear their billing after close of business. |
| 18:18.10 | *** join/#openmoko tri (n=tri@p57AD8CC7.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 18:18.59 | calamous | Ok alright. |
| 18:20.56 | galexande | well the confirmation mail was sent on saturday |
| 18:21.53 | *** join/#openmoko duplex (n=duplex@p57A85BF3.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 18:22.41 | kristian-m | fyi - just read in the latest ADC-mail: http://developer.apple.com/iphone/ |
| 18:23.59 | *** join/#openmoko Skuff (n=michael@i3ED6FE4A.versanet.de) |
| 18:24.54 | *** join/#openmoko charkins (n=casey@pdpc/supporter/active/charkins) |
| 18:26.06 | ferric | so google is trying to buy wireless spectrum in th US... and release an open phone |
| 18:26.35 | ferric | only there willbe text ads on the phone, heh! |
| 18:27.29 | kristian-m | ferric .oO(Pizza-Key) |
| 18:28.32 | ferric | hehe |
| 18:30.08 | *** part/#openmoko mellon (n=mellon@dsl093-162-135.tus1.dsl.speakeasy.net) |
| 18:31.28 | *** join/#openmoko Tetraden (n=FU-gibts@Qe0c4.q.pppool.de) |
| 18:31.35 | *** join/#openmoko Eludias (n=eludias@wingding.demon.nl) |
| 18:38.31 | *** join/#openmoko j0nas` (n=tim@fctnnbsc16w-156034237244.nb.aliant.net) |
| 18:38.53 | j0nas` | any word on dual mode wifi/gsm yet? |
| 18:38.54 | aloril | Currently sold Neo1973 GTA01B_v04 (P1) doesn't have WiFi, GTA02 (P2) which is scheduled for October will have WiFi with free (libre) drivers (Atheros AR6K): http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ#Q:_What_is_the_rationale_behind_the_exclusion_of_WiFi.3F |
| 18:39.48 | j0nas` | for next gen hardware release, that is |
| 18:41.52 | *** join/#openmoko _rob (n=rob@77.47.0.11.static.cablesurf.de) |
| 18:44.23 | *** join/#openmoko switch3r (n=switch3r@bbclaptop.student.umd.edu) |
| 18:45.20 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@141.80-202-161.nextgentel.com) |
| 18:47.35 | ewanm89_laptop | mokobot: wifi is <reply> Currently sold Neo1973 GTA01B_v04 (P1) doesn't have WiFi, GTA02 (P2) which is scheduled for October will have WiFi with free (libre) drivers (Atheros AR6K): http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ#Q:_What_is_the_rationale_behind_the_exclusion_of_WiFi.3F |
| 18:47.35 | mokobot | ewanm89_laptop: okay |
| 18:47.43 | ewanm89_laptop | ~wifi |
| 18:47.46 | apt | i heard wifi is see wireless or for a small compact non-port-blocking card, get one of these a) linksys wcf12 for only $65 shipped from buy.com b) netgear MA701NA for $65 shipped from buy.com c) socket LOW POWER wlan (amazing battery life) for $160 + shipping on buy.com, or better than nothing |
| 18:47.46 | mokobot | Currently sold Neo1973 GTA01B_v04 (P1) doesn't have WiFi, GTA02 (P2) which is scheduled for October will have WiFi with free (libre) drivers (Atheros AR6K): http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ#Q:_What_is_the_rationale_behind_the_exclusion_of_WiFi.3F |
| 18:49.51 | ewanm89_laptop | counter |
| 18:49.51 | aloril | (last update 2007-07-21 06:20) http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter : Order https://direct.openmoko.com/ ; Shipping prob. 75% in 4 days 05:10:08 (4.215±2.5 days) (1766;249) |
| 18:56.32 | *** part/#openmoko j0nas` (n=tim@fctnnbsc16w-156034237244.nb.aliant.net) |
| 18:57.08 | aloril | (script) planet: Koen Kooi: Guadec 2007 http://dominion.kabel.utwente.nl/koen/cms/guadec-2007 |
| 18:59.24 | *** join/#openmoko Ophelia (n=Ophelia@p54B912BF.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
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| 19:10.39 | *** join/#openmoko Magon (n=Magon@213.155.227.226) |
| 19:11.10 | ScaredyCat | moo |
| 19:11.18 | guillaum1 | hi all |
| 19:11.20 | ferric | what up Pussy? |
| 19:11.37 | Ophelia | miaoo |
| 19:11.40 | Sup3rkiddo | ScaredyCat, |
| 19:11.42 | Sup3rkiddo | hi all |
| 19:12.07 | ScaredyCat | Greetings earthlings |
| 19:12.18 | Ophelia | Pussy? |
| 19:12.18 | Ophelia | ow god |
| 19:12.30 | ferric | heh |
| 19:12.50 | Skwid_ | ewanm89_laptop: i managed to add the package and everything, but when i do 'make update all' i get this error: make[3]: *** No rule to make target `hotspots.o', needed by `hotspots'. Stop. |
| 19:13.06 | Skwid_ | ewanm89_laptop: i just zipped one of the examples |
| 19:13.58 | ewanm89_laptop | It should be make "update openmoko-devel image" |
| 19:14.02 | *** join/#openmoko some1_ (n=some1@p54A4EBE6.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 19:14.11 | Skwid_ | a |
| 19:14.15 | *** join/#openmoko some1_ (n=some1@p54A4EBE6.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 19:14.29 | ewanm89_laptop | s/make "update openmoko-devel image"/"make update openmoko-devel image" |
| 19:14.33 | ewanm89_laptop | s/make "update openmoko-devel image"/"make update openmoko-devel image"/ |
| 19:15.10 | Skwid_ | thanks :) |
| 19:15.31 | Skwid_ | i'll see if this works |
| 19:16.39 | Skwid_ | Now at patch hotspots.patch |
| 19:16.40 | Skwid_ | make: *** No rule to make target `openmoko-devel'. Stop. |
| 19:17.00 | Skwid_ | oops |
| 19:17.04 | Skwid_ | i think it needs a dash |
| 19:17.44 | *** join/#openmoko orospakr (n=orospakr@bas12-ottawa23-1088847327.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 19:18.32 | ewanm89_laptop | Skwid_: Yes it does. |
| 19:18.37 | Skwid_ | :) |
| 19:22.18 | Skwid_ | ewanm89_laptop: i still get the same error |
| 19:22.59 | ewanm89_laptop | Skwid_: Can you pastebin a little more output please? |
| 19:23.20 | Skwid_ | sure |
| 19:23.35 | loufoque | how long does the battery of the GTA01 hold? |
| 19:23.55 | SpeedEvil | loufoque: Nobodies actually done reports. |
| 19:23.59 | Skwid_ | http://pastebin.com/m608d3468 |
| 19:24.10 | SpeedEvil | At least as far as I'm aware, which means it hasn't happened :) |
| 19:24.19 | SpeedEvil | Or on the power managment page on the wiki |
| 19:24.25 | SpeedEvil | ~Power |
| 19:24.26 | apt | [power] for newer opie releases you need to have apmd installed to have a working power button. or see external power, or the derivative of energy with respect to time |
| 19:24.41 | SpeedEvil | Oh - I thought that was a special wiki title matching thing |
| 19:25.44 | loufoque | SpeedEvil: you don't have one? |
| 19:25.51 | ewanm89_laptop | SpeedEvil: No, um I see if I could implement one. |
| 19:25.55 | SpeedEvil | I don't. |
| 19:26.02 | loufoque | how come? |
| 19:26.12 | SpeedEvil | loufoque: Because I don't. |
| 19:26.26 | Skwid_ | :) |
| 19:26.42 | loufoque | Not delivered yet? |
| 19:26.43 | kristian-m | Skwid_ was there anny error before hotspots.o couldn't be found? |
| 19:27.13 | SpeedEvil | loufoque: I have had an offer from someone who bought 2, to get one from them. |
| 19:28.02 | *** join/#openmoko Dodji (n=dodji@torimasen.com) |
| 19:30.46 | Skwid_ | kristian-m: i don't think so |
| 19:30.48 | *** join/#openmoko IR2 (n=rmoreira@87-196-90-82.net.novis.pt) |
| 19:31.08 | Skwid_ | kristian-m: that's the whole log file right there |
| 19:32.20 | ewanm89_laptop | Skwid_: Was it hotspots you added? |
| 19:32.51 | *** join/#openmoko ossman (n=drzeus@85.8.24.16) |
| 19:35.36 | Skwid_ | ewanm89_laptop: yes |
| 19:36.48 | Skwid_ | ewanm89_laptop: and for the source file, i just zipped up the application there: http://svn.openmoko.org/trunk/src/target/OM-2007/examples/openmoko-panel-demo/ |
| 19:36.54 | Skwid_ | with the right folder name (hotspots-1) |
| 19:37.06 | Qwell | t-mobile hotspots? |
| 19:37.25 | Skwid_ | oh actually, it was the stylus demo, but i don't think it makes a difference |
| 19:37.33 | Skwid_ | Qwell: uh ? |
| 19:37.39 | Qwell | nothing :p |
| 19:38.03 | ewanm89_laptop | Um, that's made to compile from svn as defined by it's bitbake file? |
| 19:38.36 | Skwid_ | ah, ok |
| 19:39.29 | Skwid_ | is there another sample app i can use ? |
| 19:39.52 | kristian-m | Skwid_ can you go to hotspots-1-r0 adn run ./temp/run_do_comp<tab> - and then pastbin the output? |
| 19:40.02 | guillaum1 | openmoko-theme-standard.postinst seems to do things wrong since I updated my tree: line 3: echo 'include "/usr/share/themes/openmoko-standard/gtk-2.0/gtkrc"' > /etc/gtk-2.0/gtkrc. It tries to replace my gtkrc ! |
| 19:41.28 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Wish_List_-_Hardware_-_Atmospheric]] [[P1_Owners]] [[Development_resources]] |
| 19:42.04 | Skuff | is there a way to modprobe dummy_hcd with ubuntu? |
| 19:42.06 | *** join/#openmoko Aria (n=aredride@224x184.ouraynet.com) |
| 19:42.16 | Skwid_ | kristian-m: http://pastebin.com/d35c23402 |
| 19:42.45 | woglinde | skuff sure |
| 19:43.02 | woglinde | hm oh |
| 19:43.07 | woglinde | whats dummy_hcd? |
| 19:43.12 | kristian-m | Skwid_ uh, ./temp/run_do_compile.30257 |
| 19:43.18 | *** join/#openmoko morricone (n=foobar@dslb-084-057-172-118.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 19:43.19 | woglinde | if you have it as module you cann load it |
| 19:43.23 | guillaum1 | woglinde, wb |
| 19:43.31 | woglinde | he guillaum1 |
| 19:43.35 | Skuff | one of there modules u need for the usb-connection |
| 19:43.48 | woglinde | I am now watching basketball u19 wm after that I will on the packages |
| 19:44.01 | woglinde | work |
| 19:44.10 | Skwid_ | kristian-m: i get the same error as in the first pastebin |
| 19:45.00 | Skwid_ | http://pastebin.com/d7bd0aa3 |
| 19:45.27 | Skuff | do i have to compile the kernel or is there a precompiled dummy_hcd somewhere? |
| 19:45.28 | kristian-m | Skwid_ you've just replaced the name of the package? |
| 19:45.34 | guillaum1 | woglinde, cool. ping me when ready |
| 19:46.08 | kristian-m | Skwid_ have you changed any configuration in there already? - created new sourcefiles? |
| 19:46.13 | Skwid_ | kristian-m: yeah, no |
| 19:46.25 | Skwid_ | just changed the name of the folder |
| 19:46.33 | Skwid_ | and created the .bb file |
| 19:46.39 | Skwid_ | and modified the task bb file |
| 19:47.46 | kristian-m | Skwid_ i guess the buildsystem somehow expects you to have the main file of the application named after the projectname - but there must be a tuturial on that somewhere |
| 19:48.09 | Skwid_ | i couldn't find anything |
| 19:48.18 | Skwid_ | i'll try changing all the name occurences |
| 19:51.34 | kristian-m | Skwid_ have a look at: http://www.openembedded.org/user-manual&dpage=recipes_examples |
| 19:52.02 | Skwid_ | ok thanks ! |
| 19:52.09 | kristian-m | have fun :) |
| 19:52.30 | Skwid_ | i just looked on the openmoko wiki, i should have looked on OE as well |
| 19:52.33 | Skwid_ | thank you very much ! :) |
| 19:53.16 | *** join/#openmoko gamin (n=m@car06-3-82-240-156-91.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 19:53.20 | *** part/#openmoko Skwid_ (n=Skwid@adsl-64-173-169-47.dsl.frsn01.pacbell.net) |
| 19:55.03 | gamin | just came back from holidays... reading the topic there is no experience as of now what the customs/vat charges for europe are, I assume? |
| 19:55.27 | Aria | Nope. Nothing's shipped quite yet, apparently. |
| 19:55.40 | Aria | a few people got cards charged though. Hasn't hit 1860 yet though |
| 19:55.44 | woglinde | gamin germany 19% |
| 19:55.45 | gamin | thanks Aria |
| 19:56.07 | gamin | woglinde: so no customs duty? |
| 19:56.17 | woglinde | aeh plus |
| 19:56.29 | woglinde | shipping plus 19% vat |
| 19:56.57 | gamin | okay, so just vat but no customs duty - or whatever that is called |
| 19:57.51 | gamin | Aria: 1860? is that the number of avail phones? |
| 19:58.07 | Aria | No -- order numbers. They start at 1820ish. |
| 19:58.26 | gamin | just 40 orders? |
| 19:58.29 | Aria | (and go on over 3K now) |
| 19:58.34 | Aria | Less than 40 have been charged. |
| 19:58.50 | Aria | Assuming they charge in order. |
| 19:59.02 | gamin | ah okay, so some 1200 orders |
| 19:59.06 | Aria | At least. |
| 19:59.34 | gamin | so it will take some more time... |
| 20:00.11 | charkins | Looks like #2088 is the highest charged according to http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/P1_Owners |
| 20:00.14 | Aria | Yeah. I suspect they're processing manually at first. |
| 20:00.26 | Aria | OH, wow. Some higher numbers in there. |
| 20:00.52 | mjr | 1851, to be exact |
| 20:00.55 | mmazur | 2088? |
| 20:00.56 | Aria | 1859 here. |
| 20:00.58 | charkins | All the higher ones seem to be advanced though. |
| 20:00.58 | mmazur | They're getting close! |
| 20:01.03 | mmazur | Aria, :( |
| 20:01.55 | gamin | charkins: thanks for the link |
| 20:02.17 | gamin | so most people order one and a few order two... |
| 20:02.18 | charkins | It's funny how anxious everyone is. I'm guilty of it as well. :-) |
| 20:02.42 | sagacis | Me to |
| 20:02.43 | sagacis | too |
| 20:03.15 | gamin | thanks god I was on holidays with no internet at all :-P |
| 20:03.38 | Demitar | charkins: http://xkcd.com/c281.html might be appropriate in this context. ;) |
| 20:03.53 | Aria | I've just been struggling with the build environment, trying to get things in order. |
| 20:04.06 | charkins | Demitar: lol |
| 20:04.19 | mmazur | Aria, struggle, document, package. We wouldn't want to waste my time, now would we ;) |
| 20:04.25 | gamin | so I haven't missed out anything - |
| 20:04.33 | gamin | good to know |
| 20:04.45 | Aria | So unless you want a 300mb RPM... |
| 20:05.19 | mmazur | Take your time, take your time :) |
| 20:12.18 | Moriarty_ | hmm. |
| 20:12.28 | Moriarty_ | I'm having some difficulty building openmoko via mokomakefile. |
| 20:13.15 | Moriarty_ | can't find the openmoko-mainmenu package, therefore can't satisfy task-openmoko-base, followed by an attempt to write to /etc/gtk-2.0/gtkrc. |
| 20:13.39 | Moriarty_ | has anyone seen this before, or do I just need to back up and start again somewhere? |
| 20:15.54 | Moriarty_ | I get the feeling it needs to be chroot'ed and it's not. |
| 20:16.42 | kristian-m | Moriarty_ what is the output of your build? |
| 20:16.57 | kristian-m | Moriarty_ can you pastebin tit? |
| 20:17.04 | Moriarty_ | sure. |
| 20:18.22 | *** join/#openmoko orospakr (n=orospakr@bas12-ottawa23-1088847327.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 20:19.04 | *** join/#openmoko nosyjoe (n=philipp@host-82-135-95-87.customer.m-online.net) |
| 20:19.29 | Moriarty_ | http://pastebin.com/d2e361f3e |
| 20:19.48 | Moriarty_ | It does say 'successfully terminated', but I'm not sure it all got finished due to the errors. |
| 20:20.30 | *** join/#openmoko slomo (n=slomo@ubuntu/member/slomo) |
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| 20:21.57 | kristian-m | Moriarty_ hmm it seems as if you would have to allow write access to /etc/gtk-2.0/gtkrc - maybe a chroot is a good idea though |
| 20:22.38 | *** join/#openmoko bkruse_home (n=kruz@69.73.127.92) |
| 20:22.39 | Moriarty_ | well, I'm running the whole shebang in its own virtual machine (I didn't want the openembedded packages cluttering up my main environment) |
| 20:23.10 | Moriarty_ | this looks to me like ipkg isn't chrooted into the new rootfs properly. |
| 20:24.07 | kristian-m | you are starting make from a chrooted shell, right? |
| 20:24.22 | Moriarty_ | chrooted into where? |
| 20:24.36 | Moriarty_ | I'm using the mokomakefile at the moment. |
| 20:25.04 | kristian-m | what kind of virtual mashine are you using? |
| 20:25.17 | Moriarty_ | it's a xen guest. |
| 20:25.34 | Moriarty_ | I doubt that would affect it though. |
| 20:29.52 | zecke | mickey|dinner: when to use G_SIGNAL_ACTION? |
| 20:30.27 | kristian-m | Moriarty_ sry i haven't used xen yet - but i guess you could allow writing to /etc/gtk-2.0/gtkrc if its a virtual machine anyway... |
| 20:31.15 | Moriarty_ | I could , but that's so... inelegant. |
| 20:31.24 | Moriarty_ | :) |
| 20:31.53 | Moriarty_ | I think the root problem is still the lack of openmoko-mainmenu, which doesn't seem to exist according to bitbake. |
| 20:35.20 | *** join/#openmoko jpozlovsky (n=jindra@ip-85-160-81-38.eurotel.cz) |
| 20:35.53 | *** join/#openmoko wooKieface (n=benjamin@x1-6-00-03-2f-29-99-b9.k958.webspeed.dk) |
| 20:36.41 | *** join/#openmoko pitux (n=sonny@i05m-213-44-25-207.d4.club-internet.fr) |
| 20:36.58 | pitux | hi |
| 20:38.39 | *** join/#openmoko Vndmtrx (n=Ox0ff@unaffiliated/vndmtrx) |
| 20:40.19 | Ophelia | hi pitux |
| 20:41.06 | pitux | neo1973 can open pdf file? |
| 20:41.12 | SpeedEvil | The answer to almost all software questions is 'no'. There is very little working software - the dialer just about works. |
| 20:41.27 | SpeedEvil | At some point in the future, it will be able to. |
| 20:42.04 | Aria | Woot! Hacking through the bb files to eliminate references to *-native speeds the build way up. |
| 20:42.16 | Aria | I'm impressed it's that transparent. |
| 20:42.33 | SpeedEvil | Well - you can now, using xpdf and stuff. |
| 20:42.40 | pitux | :) |
| 20:42.46 | SpeedEvil | But, it's not a 'proper' pretty app. |
| 20:43.07 | *** join/#openmoko chreekat (n=b@ip68-98-141-186.dc.dc.cox.net) |
| 20:44.06 | mickeyl | zecke: whenever you want 3rd party to be able to emit your signal |
| 20:44.29 | mickeyl | zecke: usually, only the gobject itself is allowed to emit its signals |
| 20:44.48 | mickeyl | zecke: ACTION means "yes, 3rd party can emit this signal as well to trigger something" |
| 20:47.00 | *** join/#openmoko mdt (n=mdt@littlelun.emdete.de) |
| 20:47.48 | zecke | mickeyl: RUN_FIRST vs. RUN_LAST? |
| 20:48.16 | zecke | mickeyl: virtual functions vs. signals with default handlers, what is your opinion on that one? |
| 20:49.33 | pitux | why there is Accelerometer on the neo1973? |
| 20:50.10 | *** join/#openmoko morricone (n=foobar@dslb-084-057-172-118.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 20:50.54 | mickeyl | zecke: RUN_FIRST or RUN_LAST only is relevant when you have default handlers, which I usually wouldn't recommend. |
| 20:51.07 | mickeyl | zecke: I think virtual functions are more sane |
| 20:51.21 | mickeyl | but that's just a gut feeling |
| 20:51.42 | zecke | mickeyl: who are you anyway? What am I doing here? |
| 20:51.59 | kristian-m | I'll try out epdfview next... :-) |
| 20:52.06 | mickeyl | i'm just a random CS guy with a doctoral degree thinking I have any talent :D |
| 20:52.20 | mickeyl | zecke: you are a student with talent trying to find things you like :D |
| 20:52.21 | zecke | mickeyl: if you want to play mentor you could take a look at my API |
| 20:52.40 | mickeyl | sure thing. where can i review that? |
| 20:53.23 | zecke | mickeyl: http://bugs.webkit.org/show_bug.cgi?id=14678 and I can give you a pointer to the WebView (mac) and WebKitQt (Qt) API |
| 20:53.45 | mickeyl | zecke: fair enough. i'm going to look at that tomorrow |
| 20:53.50 | *** join/#openmoko morricone (n=foobar@dslb-084-057-172-118.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 20:54.03 | mickeyl | pitux: gta02 has accellerometer because you can use them to enhance the UI significantly |
| 20:54.06 | zecke | mickeyl: BTW: I don't think we need e17 on the neo, we should just use WebKit for all the rendering :) |
| 20:54.21 | mickeyl | zecke: hahaha, I figured that all the GTK work would pollute your mind. |
| 20:54.35 | pitux | mickeyl ok thx |
| 20:55.10 | koen | zecke: and is piro? |
| 20:55.13 | koen | use* |
| 20:55.26 | koen | (or whatever that guadec online desktop thingy is called) |
| 20:55.40 | zecke | mickeyl: it went so far, I started annoy/confuse antenna. Being a KDE hacker, using a Mac and doing Gtk+ development wanting to relocate to Cupertino |
| 20:55.52 | ewanm89_laptop | mickeyl: And I'm just a random guy that hopes to go to university next year to study CS and thinks I got a little talent. |
| 20:56.03 | zecke | koen: that is firefox :) |
| 20:56.13 | zecke | koen: but it looks like a nice idea, specially the compositing |
| 20:56.31 | zecke | koen: but it is a lame rip off of smalltalk |
| 20:57.07 | *** join/#openmoko morricone (n=foobar@dslb-084-057-172-118.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 20:57.07 | koen | mickeyl: did you like the 'table' clutter demo? |
| 20:57.17 | koen | the one with the pictures and movie on a surface |
| 20:57.22 | mickeyl | koen: I must confess i didn't see that yet |
| 20:57.27 | mickeyl | zecke: :) |
| 20:57.43 | mickeyl | zecke: sounds like i must meet you again to slap some sanity into your mind again ;) |
| 20:57.47 | ScaredyCat | is that the microsoft one? |
| 20:58.03 | *** join/#openmoko daniel_bergamini (n=danieber@72-173-28-77.cust.wildblue.net) |
| 20:58.16 | zecke | spank me all night through |
| 20:58.28 | ScaredyCat | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rP5y7yp06n0 |
| 20:58.35 | koen | mickeyl: it's a virtual table with items on it you can drag, enlarge, shrink, rotate, etc with you finger(s) |
| 20:58.46 | mickeyl | koen: sounds like fun |
| 20:58.50 | ScaredyCat | koen: ^^ |
| 20:58.50 | ewanm89_laptop | If it is the microsoft one, I've seen the vid, and the sunlight coming throught the window would make it useless. |
| 20:59.15 | zecke | talking about microsoft http://hideapod.com/ |
| 20:59.29 | ScaredyCat | the spoof one is amusing too http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CZrr7AZ9nCY |
| 20:59.29 | mmp | ewanm89_laptop: I believe the concept is more important than implementation here:) |
| 20:59.41 | *** join/#openmoko Aria (n=aredride@224x184.ouraynet.com) |
| 20:59.47 | koen | mickeyl: it's like that youtube video ScaredyCat just linked |
| 21:00.04 | koen | "it's our getto surface demo" in mallums words |
| 21:00.10 | ewanm89_laptop | mmp: I don't like the implementor either, they lied on there website. |
| 21:00.26 | ScaredyCat | koen: someone did a make on how to create your own |
| 21:00.47 | koen | I know how to create my own :) |
| 21:00.51 | abraxa_ | mickeyl: Am I right to assume that GConf will be used to store configuration data? If so, have there already been rules decided on which path to use? |
| 21:00.52 | koen | I'm just too lazy |
| 21:01.34 | mickeyl | abraxa_: hey. yes, feel free use GConf. no, we don't have any fixed paths yet. |
| 21:01.52 | mickeyl | abraxa_: btw., did you fax everything necessary to google? otherwise you don't get money from them. ask zecke which and what to fax to where |
| 21:02.18 | mickeyl | abraxa_: oh and another thing... do you have time for a phone call monday or tuesday? there are some things i want to ask you, but I'm too lazy to type everything :) |
| 21:02.28 | *** join/#openmoko some1_ (n=some1@p54A4EBE6.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 21:02.34 | ewanm89_laptop | Great spoof. |
| 21:02.40 | koen | zecke: you mean VAX |
| 21:03.04 | ScaredyCat | yeah, but not the computer... the vacuum :) |
| 21:03.10 | zecke | koen: for money I'm everything you want |
| 21:03.27 | abraxa_ | mickeyl: Yeah, google has been happy for a while now and of course we can talk - as I said I'm pretty much home all day, though, so I'll leave it up to you to decide on the time |
| 21:03.44 | mickeyl | abraxa_: cool. please mail me a landline and I'll call you on monday |
| 21:03.58 | abraxa_ | mickeyl: Okay, will do =) |
| 21:04.00 | mickeyl | thx |
| 21:04.12 | mickeyl | ~curse people not catching up with APIs |
| 21:04.13 | apt | May you be reincarnated as a Windows XP administrator, people not catching up with APIs ! |
| 21:04.16 | mickeyl | ~curse abiword |
| 21:04.17 | apt | May the fleas of a thousand camels infest your most sensitive regions, abiword ! |
| 21:04.36 | mickeyl | then again |
| 21:04.39 | mickeyl | ~shoot people breaking APIs |
| 21:04.40 | apt | ACTION shoots people breaking APIs in the ear with a quantum singularity weapon! |
| 21:05.21 | koen | well, you can't catch up with API changes that haven't happened yet :) |
| 21:05.36 | mickeyl | yay |
| 21:06.15 | ewanm89_laptop | ScaredyCat: see http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yzNh31q61gc |
| 21:06.57 | ewanm89_laptop | Or anyone else that wants to know about real multitouch. |
| 21:08.55 | mmp | ewanm89_laptop: but the $2 probably do not include camera :) |
| 21:09.31 | ewanm89_laptop | mmp: lol, but any webcam will do. |
| 21:09.49 | Aria | Which can be had at a thrift shop for $2 ;-) |
| 21:10.51 | galexande | yeah shoot people breaking apis |
| 21:13.46 | *** join/#openmoko pavelm (n=pavel@gprs189-60.eurotel.cz) |
| 21:13.54 | pavelm | Hello, everyone. |
| 21:14.41 | pavelm | On http://buildhost.openmoko.org/tmp/deploy/images/, latest image seems to be from 04 jul... that's way too old... is there newer image somewhere? |
| 21:15.10 | *** join/#openmoko NeoStrider (n=daniel@cm-tvcidade-nri-C8B1D634.dynamic.brdterra.com.br) |
| 21:16.35 | *** join/#openmoko mellon__ (n=mellon@dsl093-162-135.tus1.dsl.speakeasy.net) |
| 21:16.43 | pavelm | uhuh, pretty quiet around here, am I on the right channel...? |
| 21:16.55 | mellon__ | dunno, what channel do you think you're on? |
| 21:17.13 | NeoStrider | hello folks |
| 21:17.17 | woglinde | hi pavelm |
| 21:17.52 | pavelm | hi, woglinde |
| 21:18.03 | ewanm89_laptop | Hi pavelm |
| 21:18.15 | pavelm | mellon: the one about openmoko, it is normally pretty busy :-) |
| 21:18.18 | pavelm | hello, ewan! |
| 21:18.24 | tri | multitouch with mpx: http://www.youtube.com/v/olWjnfBoY8E |
| 21:18.36 | ynezz | everybody is into shipping and CC charging :p |
| 21:19.03 | pavelm | ynezz: I'd hope buildhost can still compile :-) |
| 21:19.05 | mellon__ | CAN I HAS NEO |
| 21:19.07 | mellon__ | ? |
| 21:19.56 | mickeyl | i has break my phone |
| 21:20.09 | pavelm | Hi, mickeyl! |
| 21:20.20 | mickeyl | yo pavelm, how are things? |
| 21:20.48 | mellon__ | pavelm, it's the weekend, and we are all out bicycling and sailing, enjoying our lack of connectivity. ;') |
| 21:21.01 | pavelm | ...searching for newer openmoko images... than jul4. I'd like to get phone ringing to work, so that neo can be used as a real phone.. |
| 21:21.22 | pavelm | ...well... as a "call me" real phone :-) |
| 21:21.47 | woglinde | pavelm wait till oktober |
| 21:21.49 | IR2 | pavelm: is it broken ? in any way ? |
| 21:22.21 | mickeyl | ~shoot woglinde |
| 21:22.22 | apt | ACTION shoots woglinde in the head with a quantum singularity weapon! |
| 21:23.02 | *** join/#openmoko zedstar (n=john@82-44-202-121.cable.ubr08.haye.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 21:23.08 | IR2 | where can i find a list of things broken that need fixing ? |
| 21:23.22 | pavelm | phones are being shipped... Is there some reasonably good image to load on phase1? |
| 21:23.29 | pavelm | IR2: bugzilla.openmoko.org |
| 21:24.28 | ewanm89_laptop | night guys. |
| 21:24.53 | pavelm | night, ewan. |
| 21:27.00 | *** join/#openmoko jannu (n=jannu@hoas-fe3cdd00-15.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 21:33.16 | ScaredyCat | http://www.microsoft.com |
| 21:33.19 | ScaredyCat | :) |
| 21:33.30 | ScaredyCat | tht was for you IR2 |
| 21:33.36 | mickeyl | pavelm: unfortunately not. the best bet is my last snapshot |
| 21:33.50 | mickeyl | i'm working hard to provide a new snapshot for the P1 owners by the end of this month |
| 21:34.25 | ScaredyCat | you mena we'll get them before the end of the month? |
| 21:34.28 | pavelm | mickeyl: where is your last snapshot? |
| 21:34.29 | ScaredyCat | ;) |
| 21:34.40 | mickeyl | pavelm: buildhost/snapshots iirc |
| 21:34.44 | mickeyl | let me check |
| 21:35.20 | mickeyl | http://buildhost.openmoko.org/snapshots/2007.04/ |
| 21:35.22 | mickeyl | old, but somewhat working |
| 21:36.19 | pavelm | mickey: thanks for pointer... I'm using images from tmp/deploy; they are jul4... |
| 21:36.45 | pavelm | ...there must be newer version somewhere :-) |
| 21:37.00 | mellon__ | you can always build one... |
| 21:37.19 | pavelm | mellon: Do you have buildsystem working? |
| 21:37.19 | cesarb | mellon__: no, you must always have a "known good" image |
| 21:37.32 | cesarb | mellon__: so you can be sure it's your fault when it doesn't work |
| 21:37.43 | mellon__ | cesarb: true enough |
| 21:37.52 | mellon__ | pavelm: yeah, I finally got a build this morning. |
| 21:38.17 | mellon__ | I just installed gutsy gibbon on my macbook so I can do my builds there, though, so I haven't actually tried it yet. |
| 21:38.21 | ScaredyCat | cesarb: but how do you know if any image you create is good, without testing it |
| 21:38.47 | cesarb | mellon__: I would recommend feisty instead, I've heard some reports here on IRC of strange errors on gutsy IIRC... |
| 21:39.12 | cesarb | ScaredyCat: it's not to know if your image is good, it's to know, when it doesn't work, if the problem is with your image or not |
| 21:39.16 | mellon__ | cesarb: naw, I'd rather be on the bleeding edge. if it fails, I can always boot back into my OSX partition. |
| 21:39.30 | *** join/#openmoko Aria (n=aredride@224x184.ouraynet.com) |
| 21:39.31 | cesarb | mellon__: I prefer being on the bleeding edge other ways... |
| 21:39.47 | mellon__ | cesarb: your choice. it's working pretty nicely for me. |
| 21:39.52 | Aria | I missed that last |
| 21:40.08 | pavelm | cesarb: do you have eabi gllin? |
| 21:40.24 | cesarb | pavelm: I don't even have the hardware yet, so I'm not worrying about gllin yet |
| 21:40.42 | cesarb | pavelm: and I could always enable OABI emul in the kernel and copy over an OABI glibc, and chroot gllin |
| 21:41.03 | cesarb | pavelm: in fact, I've been planning on chrooting and non-rooting that daemon since the beginning |
| 21:41.32 | cesarb | (closed source should NOT have ful access to the system. give it the serial, gpsd and a clock, and it's enough) |
| 21:41.41 | pavelm | cesarb: Yep, that would be _very_ useful. |
| 21:41.45 | cesarb | s/ful/full/ |
| 21:41.48 | pavelm | cesarb: I hate it running as root. |
| 21:42.04 | cesarb | pavelm: EVERYTHING seems to be running as root, which is evil |
| 21:42.20 | SpeedEvil | serial - named pipe to gpsd |
| 21:42.21 | pavelm | cesarb: but gllin is more evil than the rest :-) |
| 21:42.22 | cesarb | pavelm: I know "yeah, it's a single user machine", but I don't want an accident to clobber the root stuff |
| 21:42.28 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[P1_Owners]] [[Wish_List]] [[User:Samon007]] [[Buying_Interest_List]] [[Talk:Neo1973_Battery]] |
| 21:42.56 | cesarb | pavelm: actually, it's probably a OS-independent blob together with a thin shim, so it shouldn't be that much evil |
| 21:43.18 | cesarb | pavelm: think of is a some sort of "virtualized firmware" for the hammerhead |
| 21:43.57 | cesarb | pavelm: as long as you can contain it as good as you could contain it if it were running on an ARM core directly on the hammerhead itself, it shouldn't cause any real problems |
| 21:44.30 | cesarb | and shouldn't be any more problematic than what the other two processors on the device are running |
| 21:44.46 | pavelm | strange... I try to read smses using libgsmd-tool, and it sometimes reads contacts, instead....? |
| 21:45.09 | pavelm | cesarb: well... if it was on separate core, communicating nmea over serial, there would be no security considerations. |
| 21:45.12 | cesarb | pavelm: isn't the SMS support on gsmd still sorta broken from what I've heard? |
| 21:45.36 | pavelm | cesarb: having it running on main cpu, it can access (for example) the network, and could send your location to CIA or whoever. |
| 21:45.55 | cesarb | pavelm: if it's correctly chrooted/firewalled on the main CPU, there should be no security considerations too |
| 21:46.00 | SpeedEvil | pavelm: I haven't seen any 'A'GPS functionality. |
| 21:46.06 | SpeedEvil | pavelm: Is there any? |
| 21:46.07 | cesarb | pavelm: the main problem is if your isolation is faulty |
| 21:46.25 | pavelm | cesarb: Yes, and ensuring good isolation is problematic on linux. |
| 21:47.09 | SpeedEvil | chroot, as a untrusted user with nothing else in the noexec filesystem, is pretty good. |
| 21:47.09 | pavelm | speed: it seems to have some AGPS functionality |
| 21:47.10 | pavelm | -g <URL> SUPL Server URL or IP address; |
| 21:47.10 | pavelm | <PROTECTED> |
| 21:47.18 | cesarb | pavelm: OS bugs (kernel local root exploits) don't factor, because if (for instance) the gsmd has buggy code, and the gsm module can exploit it, it's the same kind of problem; you should avoid bugs on it after all |
| 21:47.21 | pavelm | speed: It can still talk to netwrok :-) |
| 21:47.28 | SpeedEvil | pavelm: hmm. |
| 21:47.46 | cesarb | SpeedEvil: you also need to make it run as a separate UID, and use netfilter to drop all packets from that UID |
| 21:47.50 | SpeedEvil | yeah |
| 21:47.57 | kristian-m | mellon__ the problem on gutsy is, that you need an older verion of glibc - which is hard to downgrade. - I'd try in a chrooted edgy |
| 21:47.59 | *** join/#openmoko fiveplusone (n=six@cpe-66-65-15-60.nyc.res.rr.com) |
| 21:48.15 | *** join/#openmoko some1_ (n=some1@p54A4B902.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 21:48.45 | cesarb | kristian-m: feisty should also work fine... it's what I'm using |
| 21:49.03 | *** join/#openmoko Skwid_ (n=Skwid@adsl-64-173-169-47.dsl.frsn01.pacbell.net) |
| 21:49.29 | cesarb | pavelm: BTW, no matter what Linus says, this is THE greatest advantage of a microkernel: isolation |
| 21:49.38 | kristian-m | cesarb eh, rigth me too, mixed that up |
| 21:49.59 | cesarb | kristian-m: it's not hard to mess up with these crazy code names |
| 21:50.19 | kristian-m | yap |
| 21:50.46 | cesarb | kristian-m: the versions are simpler ("7.04" says a lot), but people for some reason like the code names... |
| 21:51.04 | pavelm | cesarb: yes, u-kernel would be useful for that. But I'll keep linux for now. |
| 21:51.31 | mellon__ | kristian-m: seriously? |
| 21:52.04 | kristian-m | mellon__ yes, if you linke you can download my chroot image |
| 21:52.04 | mellon__ | speaking of isolation (lack thereof)! |
| 21:52.25 | pavelm | is there some easy way to pull contacts from "contacts"? |
| 21:52.34 | mellon__ | that seems like something to fix rather than accept. |
| 21:52.56 | kristian-m | mellon__ right, have fun then ;-) |
| 21:53.03 | mellon__ | kristian-m: heh, thanks. |
| 21:53.38 | cesarb | mellon__: good luck... I already made the thing compile with dash instead of bash (as long as you use mokomakefile), so I also think the same way ;-) |
| 21:53.53 | pavelm | cesarb: ptrace can act as a syscall whitelist, see subterfugue.org |
| 21:53.58 | mellon__ | cesarb: yeah. I need to apply that patch actually. |
| 21:55.55 | cesarb | armv4t-openmoko-linux-gnueabi |
| 21:56.48 | *** part/#openmoko herbyle (n=pascal@p54A36EAD.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 21:58.39 | ynezz | there is nothing like grsec/selinux for arm? |
| 21:58.47 | cesarb | Hm... according to slashdot, xen has been merged into 2.6.23... I wonder who will be the first to actually run xen on the neo ;-) |
| 21:59.05 | cesarb | ynezz: it wouldn't surprise me if you could run selinux itself on the neo |
| 21:59.51 | pavelm | cesarb: that would need xen/arm port, first, I'd say. |
| 22:01.11 | ynezz | maybe xen would make sense if neo would have 4 arm cores or more powerful cpu and more ram |
| 22:01.35 | mellon__ | cesarb: many many. :') |
| 22:01.46 | mellon__ | cesarb: I'm planning to turn mine into a LISP machine. |
| 22:04.08 | unknown_lamer | mellon__: which implementation? |
| 22:04.34 | mellon__ | unknown_lamer: otter |
| 22:04.36 | *** join/#openmoko daniel_bergamini (n=danieber@72-173-28-77.cust.wildblue.net) |
| 22:04.37 | pavelm | does anyone here have working openmoko-dialer? |
| 22:04.44 | pavelm | (mine segfaults :-() |
| 22:04.48 | mellon__ | unknown_lamer: it's a new one. |
| 22:05.36 | unknown_lamer | mellon__: why not clisp? |
| 22:05.55 | unknown_lamer | mellon__: someone got the ffi working on arm a few weeks ago |
| 22:06.39 | mellon__ | unknown_lamer: cool. if you're talking about cmucl, the problem is that nobody understands the compiler. |
| 22:07.01 | unknown_lamer | I mean clisp |
| 22:07.45 | kristian-m | has anyone ever had this one before: http://nopaste.eof.name/181 <- "cc1: internal compiler error: in add_path, at c-incpath.c:362" |
| 22:08.33 | mellon__ | unknown_lamer: in general I'm not very fond of common lisp - otter is more scheme-like. but then also most lisp compilers I've seen really do a lousy job of optimizing. |
| 22:08.50 | mellon__ | so the goal of otter is to actually produce code that's similar in speed to C for the same operations. |
| 22:08.51 | unknown_lamer | mellon__: have you ever used sbcl? I've found to be quite fast. |
| 22:09.06 | mellon__ | unknown_lamer: string handling is painfully slow. |
| 22:09.17 | unknown_lamer | how so? |
| 22:09.20 | mellon__ | unknown_lamer: but yeah, in general it's one of the nicer compilers out there. |
| 22:09.26 | unknown_lamer | They map onto uniform byte arrays |
| 22:09.36 | unknown_lamer | so the string ops should be as fast as in C |
| 22:09.45 | mellon__ | unknown_lamer: compile some code to do a lexical search in sbcl and then in C. look at the generated code. get back to me. |
| 22:09.46 | mellon__ | :') |
| 22:10.02 | mellon__ | I already did that - unfortunately sbcl doesn't do all that well in comparison. |
| 22:10.17 | mellon__ | T has a pretty nice compiler, but they don't support i386. |
| 22:11.27 | unknown_lamer | CL is nice because you have access to a large set of libraries |
| 22:11.41 | unknown_lamer | a branch new lisp ... yech, time to rewrite *all* of those things *again* |
| 22:14.47 | *** join/#openmoko pixelstick (n=dwpage@d-74-214-40-122.metrocast.net) |
| 22:15.30 | abraxa_ | kristian-m: Maybe you ran out of memory and/or have corrupt memory? |
| 22:16.29 | cesarb | kristian-m: ICE should not happen |
| 22:16.44 | kristian-m | abraxa_ hmm I have to find out later - clearing ccache does not help the error is reproducable - just try using sdl - i disabled sdl now |
| 22:16.49 | cesarb | kristian-m: try compiling again, if it fails at the same exact place, your compiler is faulty |
| 22:17.02 | Elrond | mickeyl - *pong* |
| 22:17.02 | kristian-m | cesarb ack :-/ |
| 22:17.05 | cesarb | kristian-m: but, if it works or fails somewhere else, it's hardware problems |
| 22:17.21 | kristian-m | cesarb it hapened again. |
| 22:17.24 | pavelm | Hi, mickeyl! |
| 22:17.31 | cesarb | kristian-m: at the same place? |
| 22:17.37 | Elrond | pavelm - Hi! |
| 22:17.47 | *** part/#openmoko meandtheshell (n=markus@85.127.111.2) |
| 22:18.52 | *** join/#openmoko pipomolo42 (n=alex@ALille-152-1-38-178.w83-198.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 22:19.00 | pavelm | elrond: any progress with your gps fight? |
| 22:20.12 | Elrond | pavelm - Not really. I took a vacation, because it started to get frustrating. I now have a small idea, I'll probably try tomorrow. |
| 22:20.29 | kristian-m | cesarb yes. after i cleared th ccache-cache. - compiling lib-sdl |
| 22:20.48 | mickeyl | Elrond: we're still planning to meet next saturday in FFM? |
| 22:21.09 | cesarb | kristian-m: so, it's probably a compiler bug (it might be also ICE-in-invalid-code, where both the compiler and the code being compiled are buggy) |
| 22:21.44 | kristian-m | cesarb I'll try to find out later |
| 22:22.09 | Elrond | mickeyl - Ahh, I asked a friend today, if he wants to join in, still no answer. |
| 22:22.23 | Elrond | mickeyl - Any idea where to meet / for how long? |
| 22:22.35 | pavelm | ..any idea if incoming sms is at least stored on simcard? |
| 22:22.42 | *** join/#openmoko BenC (n=bcollins@debian/developer/bcollins) |
| 22:22.47 | pavelm | ...I'd hate to loose messages while experimenting with neo. |
| 22:23.01 | Elrond | pavelm - I'd really assume so... but no idea. |
| 22:25.23 | Psi_ | yay |
| 22:25.50 | SpeedEvil | :/ |
| 22:26.00 | woglinde | pse gratz |
| 22:26.02 | woglinde | psi |
| 22:26.07 | Psi_ | ya |
| 22:26.46 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@141.80-202-161.nextgentel.com) |
| 22:27.30 | mickeyl | Elrond: I'd vote for one or two latte macchiato in the "Cantina Mescal, Schweitzerstrasse, 60598 Frankfurt", e.g. from 15:00 to 17:00 or so |
| 22:28.10 | *** part/#openmoko jgm (n=jgm@host-87-74-179-156.bulldogdsl.com) |
| 22:28.33 | ynezz | 2xlatte, 5xbeers, 1L vodka and it's almost 3am |
| 22:28.40 | woglinde | lol |
| 22:28.45 | mickeyl | heh |
| 22:29.29 | Elrond | ynezz - *LOL* |
| 22:29.44 | Elrond | ynezz - I need to take the train back and/or my friend needs to drive back. :-) |
| 22:30.15 | ynezz | you know, day after is also day... |
| 22:30.51 | Elrond | mickeyl - Sounds good to me. I don't know that location, I hope it's not too smokey and they have some non-coffeine non-alcoholic other drinks? |
| 22:31.06 | mickeyl | Elrond: for sure (on both points) |
| 22:31.33 | Elrond | Ahh :) |
| 22:32.22 | Elrond | Do we have anyone else to invite nearby? I thought, Coredump was in the region? |
| 22:32.53 | mickeyl | dunno offhand. anyone can come, if he or she wants |
| 22:32.54 | mickeyl | CoreDump|afk: ? |
| 22:33.39 | abraxa_ | mickeyl, Elrond: I'd be happy to come if you don't mind =) |
| 22:33.51 | kiney_ | counter |
| 22:33.52 | aloril | (last update 2007-07-21 06:20) http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter : Order https://direct.openmoko.com/ ; Shipping prob. 75% in 4 days 01:26:08 (4.060±2.5 days) (1767;249) |
| 22:34.12 | mickeyl | abraxa_: cool! |
| 22:34.44 | abraxa_ | mickeyl: What day? |
| 22:35.05 | Elrond | mickeyl, abraxa_ - I think, it's just some informal meetup, nothing planned, etc. Don't expect anything. :-) |
| 22:35.07 | mickeyl | abraxa_: next Saturday, 28th |
| 22:35.33 | mickeyl | ya, expect it to be just a random gathering of open source mobile phone guys |
| 22:35.46 | mickeyl | i might have a chance to complete that next snapshot image by then |
| 22:35.49 | mickeyl | phew |
| 22:36.03 | abraxa_ | Elrond: Oh I know, but I want to meet my mentor anyway and you're a nice fellow to talk to as well ;D |
| 22:36.17 | Elrond | pavelm - BTW: Did you see *ninja* on youtube with this gps tool on the neo? Any idea, where that tool is? |
| 22:36.53 | Elrond | abraxa_ - :) |
| 22:39.02 | *** join/#openmoko Sublime (n=Sublime@ip70-162-246-65.ph.ph.cox.net) |
| 22:39.25 | pavelm | elrond: no, I do not remember any ninjas. Do you have url? |
| 22:39.50 | C7 | pavelm: http://youtube.com/watch?v=5D6i6vLlhGA |
| 22:39.51 | Elrond | pavelm - Huh, let me try, if youtube works on this box. I was at a friend while watching it. |
| 22:40.15 | Elrond | Ah, c7 was faster anyway. |
| 22:41.24 | cesarb | why is it that people use 'if [ "${VAR}" == "foo" ];'? bash's own "help test" says it's =, not == |
| 22:43.42 | Elrond | cesarb - Because they come from C? ;o) |
| 22:44.44 | loufoque | cesarb: because bash sucks hard |
| 22:45.25 | loufoque | if only bash were good, people would try to write good code with it |
| 22:45.57 | mickeyl | i don't buy that equation. C sucks a bit, but people are writing ROCKING code with it |
| 22:46.00 | mickeyl | :D |
| 22:46.32 | vallor | I'm assuming everyone is using gcc-3.4.6 for their qemu builds? /me is doing a "make bootstrap" on an old i386 box, since x86_64->i386(mips-softmmu) yielded an error about a compiler flag: |
| 22:46.35 | vallor | /usr/src/Openmoko/wk/target-arm/op.c:1: error: -mpreferred-stack-boundary=2 is not between 4 and 12 |
| 22:46.39 | *** join/#openmoko cel (n=cel@adsl-023.230.166.194.arpa.as1901.net) |
| 22:46.58 | vallor | cross-compiling is new to me |
| 22:47.23 | mickeyl | I'm afraid I never have seen this one. I build my qemu w/ OpenEmbedded |
| 22:47.58 | vallor | I'm just using the new hardware emu, learned about it this morning |
| 22:48.47 | vallor | I'm redoing a "make bootstrap" on gcc-3.4.6 on the host that gave that error, I don't think that's "supposed to happen" |
| 22:48.57 | Vegar | new hardware emu? |
| 22:49.46 | vallor | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/OpenMoko_under_QEMU |
| 22:51.42 | Elrond | mickeyl - Just asking my friend about next Saturday. Does that "location" have a housenumber in that street? |
| 22:52.34 | cesarb | vallor: mips-softmmu? |
| 22:52.37 | cesarb | vallor: mips? |
| 22:52.38 | *** join/#openmoko miip_ (n=miip@p54A55536.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 22:53.36 | mickeyl | Elrond: Cantina Mescal Sachsenhausen Schweizer Str.77 |
| 22:53.43 | vallor | cesarb: yes, there was lots of chatter this morning getting the thing running |
| 22:54.07 | mickeyl | pavelm: yay, make a photo! |
| 22:54.10 | pavelm | ...and it appears usable! |
| 22:54.17 | vallor | pavelm: :) :) |
| 22:54.38 | *** join/#openmoko RbdPngn (n=ningerso@uslink-66.173.44-135.uslink.net) |
| 22:55.09 | Vegar | pavelm: screenshots |
| 22:55.10 | Vegar | now |
| 22:55.24 | vallor | okay, installing the rebuild -- this time, I have a prefix and a program-suffix set for gcc |
| 22:55.55 | vallor | gcc rebuild -- but what's puzzling is the --cpu=i386 not working |
| 22:59.30 | cesarb | wow, I just pressed alt-space by accident... and katapult (which I'd never heard of before) came up |
| 22:59.43 | cesarb | I wonder how many more of these useful random apps kubuntu installs by default |
| 23:01.40 | vallor | okay, on a native i386, it built without an error -- but try --cpu=i386 on an x86_64 machine, and it gives that error about "preferred-stack-boundary" -- ugh |
| 23:01.51 | *** join/#openmoko noon (n=noon@p57B2647B.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 23:01.55 | noon | hello |
| 23:02.00 | Elrond | Hi noon. |
| 23:02.04 | vallor | the qemu-neo1973 I mean |
| 23:02.05 | Elrond | mickeyl - My friend, noon. ;-) |
| 23:02.11 | mickeyl | yo noon |
| 23:02.16 | noon | woo lots of people here |
| 23:02.21 | noon | hello mickeyl |
| 23:02.37 | Elrond | noon - They're all sleeping and/or lurking. ;o) |
| 23:02.43 | mickeyl | indeed. OpenMoko generates a lot of attention. Imagine what happens when we finally ship software that no longer sucks ;) |
| 23:03.13 | ynezz | well, ship neos first :p |
| 23:03.18 | mickeyl | ynezz: right. |
| 23:03.39 | noon | mickeyl: the # i normaly hang out have 4 max. 10 users :-) |
| 23:03.41 | mickeyl | noon: prepared for a nice Latte Macchiato (or anything else) on Saturday? I'm going to bring my Neo and show you the current state of affairs |
| 23:03.48 | pavelm | mickeyl: You mean, in about 2019? |
| 23:03.56 | mickeyl | pavelm: heh. don't be nasty. in 2009 |
| 23:04.00 | cesarb | mickeyl: actually, I think that the software simply being not there will have a positive effect on openmoko |
| 23:04.02 | noon | defently. I love coffee |
| 23:04.06 | pavelm | mickeyl: software that does not suck does not exist. |
| 23:04.10 | mickeyl | noon: excellent! :) |
| 23:04.24 | cesarb | mickeyl: think about it: if the neo already came with everything working well, most people would settle for just using it |
| 23:04.46 | mickeyl | cesarb: i can see what you mean, however it needs to at least be a phone, i.e. working PIM + dialer. everything else is where the experimentation can start. |
| 23:04.48 | cesarb | mickeyl: on the other hand, if it didn't work at all, people would not be interested.. the barrier to doing anything with it would be too high |
| 23:04.54 | mickeyl | nod |
| 23:05.01 | Elrond | mickeyl - hehe, noon usually sees "my" neo every second weekend. ;) |
| 23:05.14 | mickeyl | Elrond: but not with the super secret new UI :D |
| 23:05.21 | cesarb | mickeyl: but the way it's right now, with just the kernel working, a very basic "window" manager, and the dialer... and you will get lots of people going into wild insane tangents |
| 23:05.24 | noon | jep. and we try to get this gps thing working |
| 23:05.35 | cesarb | mickeyl: some of these tangents might end up surprising us |
| 23:05.36 | mickeyl | ah the gps... an insane story |
| 23:05.37 | Elrond | mickeyl - *G* You mean the one from guadec? ;o) |
| 23:05.42 | mickeyl | Elrond: yep |
| 23:05.47 | robster | heh |
| 23:05.54 | robster | ;-) |
| 23:06.00 | mickeyl | and to robster |
| 23:06.06 | mickeyl | ~lart tab completion just because |
| 23:06.06 | apt | forces tab completion just because to use Outlook Express |
| 23:06.16 | mickeyl | hmm... mokobot? |
| 23:06.28 | noon | mickeyl: yes it is. looking at funny hex values and trying to figure out what they mean |
| 23:06.32 | robster | mickeyl: we missed each other at GUADEC, i was running around trying to keep everything running smoothly. did you enjoy yourself? |
| 23:06.54 | pavelm | what is the the "supersecret new ui"? |
| 23:07.21 | ynezz | ncurses |
| 23:07.22 | mickeyl | robster: ya, too bad. hopefully soon somewhere around your offices. guadec: absolutely, it was great. i really enjoyed all the technical talks. organization was -very- well, hats off |
| 23:07.42 | noon | ncurses? nice. with or without colors? |
| 23:08.46 | mickeyl | heh |
| 23:08.48 | mickeyl | not quite |
| 23:08.55 | mickeyl | a bit more on the 'G' of GUI |
| 23:08.57 | noon | has the new ui a working gps? |
| 23:09.17 | mickeyl | no, it's "just" more finger-friendly set of PIM+dialer apps |
| 23:09.17 | ScaredyCat | but less heavy mickeyl ? |
| 23:09.26 | SpeedEvil | :) |
| 23:09.32 | pavelm | mickey: Congrats! |
| 23:09.39 | Elrond | pavelm - It's now using card puncher for input. ;o) |
| 23:09.39 | mickeyl | since we finally found out that there is no compartment for a stylus in the device |
| 23:09.41 | loufoque | who needs a GUI? I only need a terminal. |
| 23:09.42 | SpeedEvil | mickeyl: with slightly larger fonts? |
| 23:09.46 | mickeyl | SpeedEvil: you bet |
| 23:09.48 | pavelm | mickey: finger-friendly pim/dialer is really needed. |
| 23:10.06 | mickeyl | i know. about the end of the month there will be both an announcement and some new commits in svn |
| 23:10.07 | ScaredyCat | you'd need a big device for that stylus |
| 23:10.15 | pavelm | mickeyl: :-))))) |
| 23:10.31 | cjb_ie | the sonyericsson p910i's attempt at finger-friendly isn't |
| 23:10.39 | pavelm | mickey: I'd say that explains why there are no new images on the buildhost. |
| 23:10.54 | Elrond | gcarrier - I still wonder, where that gui tool is. |
| 23:10.59 | gcb77 | Is it too much to ask for a phone that can yell out "ouch" whend dropped? |
| 23:11.11 | pavelm | gcb: drop test? |
| 23:11.19 | Elrond | pavelm - In the same video. |
| 23:11.33 | Elrond | gcb77 - I still wonder, where that gui tool is. |
| 23:11.33 | cjb_ie | my sinclair QL screamed once, when a screw fell out of the underside of the keyboard onto the main PCB |
| 23:11.36 | pavelm | gcb: When I dropped mine (on carpet, from pretty low height) it opened itself. |
| 23:11.44 | *** join/#openmoko nop (n=nop@p54A0BDC2.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 23:11.47 | pavelm | elrond: Aha, ok. |
| 23:11.58 | gcb77 | pavelm: lol, "open" moko |
| 23:12.01 | pavelm | elrond: It is trivial to run ssh -X :-) |
| 23:12.05 | noon | btw: is there an 'easy' way to geht openmoko apps running on my local linuxbox without wasting hours playing with monotone? |
| 23:12.21 | pavelm | gcb: I called it "too open moko" :-) |
| 23:12.37 | Elrond | pavelm - Yes. But I think, that gui tool gives more info from the chip than gllin. |
| 23:12.56 | pavelm | the "on-screen-qwerty-for-fingers" is now in tui cvs... If someone wants to generate screenshots. |
| 23:13.15 | pavelm | it is basically 6x6 array of buttons. Miracle is it is actually usable. |
| 23:13.23 | pavelm | (actually I should probably go 5x7) |
| 23:13.36 | pavelm | ...it is the same mokomenu.py I'm always hacking. |
| 23:13.56 | *** join/#openmoko grobian_ (n=grobian@L09c8.l.pppool.de) |
| 23:14.52 | noon | Elrond: have you tried the different options of gllin? |
| 23:14.57 | ScaredyCat | sorry what is 'tui' cvs ? |
| 23:15.04 | noon | there are some debuging switches |
| 23:15.24 | gcb77 | Elrond: gui tool? |
| 23:15.26 | Elrond | noon - Only "-low 3" and "-interval 3" |
| 23:15.38 | mickeyl | nop: sure. you can build all the stuff for x86, no need to download openembedded and cross-compile |
| 23:15.43 | mickeyl | s/nop/noon/ |
| 23:15.53 | Elrond | gcb77 - From the gps-and-drop-test video, the guy has this gui tool to show gps info, etc. |
| 23:16.26 | vallor | does the gps not send nmea data? or ... ? |
| 23:16.31 | SpeedEvil | vallor: no |
| 23:16.38 | vallor | ay carumba |
| 23:16.42 | SpeedEvil | vallor: Look on 'Hammerhead' page on the wiki |
| 23:16.54 | vallor | I shall, thanks |
| 23:16.55 | SpeedEvil | It's basically a dumb chip - the position is generated in software. |
| 23:17.02 | SpeedEvil | This isn't wholly a bad thing. |
| 23:17.03 | Elrond | vallor - There is some "gllin", which creates nmea from the gps data. But nmea has less data than the gui tool from the video. |
| 23:17.21 | SpeedEvil | Elrond: what was it showing? |
| 23:17.51 | Elrond | SpeedEvil - Hmm, signal strength, I think. Or is that in nmea?! |
| 23:17.55 | SpeedEvil | yes |
| 23:17.57 | pavelm | scaredycat: tui.sf.net, cvs |
| 23:18.01 | SpeedEvil | GPGSV IIRC |
| 23:18.19 | gcb77 | Signal Strength, satelite positions, raw location data |
| 23:18.26 | SpeedEvil | you get PRN/alt/az/signal strength quads |
| 23:18.34 | noon | Elrond: i think there are nmea messages which provide the signal strength |
| 23:19.12 | pavelm | elrond: hmm, that's certainly an interesting tool. Looks very proprietary to hammerhead :-( |
| 23:19.12 | SpeedEvil | Well - it's not really signal strength - it's some number indicating the goodness of the signal. |
| 23:19.12 | noon | Elrond: this is a nice nmea reference http://gpsd.berlios.de/NMEA.txt |
| 23:19.34 | pavelm | elrond: but "press button to download ephermesis" is certainly interesting option. |
| 23:19.46 | *** join/#openmoko RbdPngn_ (n=ningerso@uslink-66.173.44-135.uslink.net) |
| 23:20.05 | SpeedEvil | From reading the GL site |
| 23:20.10 | SpeedEvil | they want to charge for this. |
| 23:20.14 | noon | pavelm: yes, but you need a server where you get this |
| 23:20.24 | Elrond | pavelm - Ahh, right. |
| 23:20.30 | SpeedEvil | noon: some bits of the server are trivial to implement though. |
| 23:20.43 | SpeedEvil | noon: some are _much_ more interesting. |
| 23:21.02 | Elrond | SpeedEvil - So that option "download ephemeris" looks very coupled to hammerhead. |
| 23:21.08 | noon | SpeedEvil: i didn't look at the doenload thing in gllin. |
| 23:21.12 | SpeedEvil | I doubt it. |
| 23:21.16 | Psi_ | im guessing there will be no work done on order processing in the weekend? |
| 23:21.21 | Elrond | Because the gllin-nmea is oneway only. No way to talk back to gllin. |
| 23:21.24 | SpeedEvil | Elrond: I'd imagine it's a testing thing. |
| 23:21.31 | vallor | a very nice ephermeris for X11 is "Xephem" |
| 23:21.40 | Elrond | SpeedEvil - Yeah, exactly. I want it anyway. ;-) |
| 23:21.42 | vallor | ephemeris |
| 23:21.42 | SpeedEvil | vallor: utterly unrelated |
| 23:21.45 | *** part/#openmoko guillaum1 (n=Guillaum@AMontsouris-153-1-93-202.w90-2.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 23:21.54 | vallor | SpeedEvil: sorry, will scroll back |
| 23:22.09 | SpeedEvil | Elrond: as for testing, you want it to be up and running ASAP, not cold-starting |
| 23:22.19 | noon | SpeedEvil: it would be interessint what gllin saves in the nvram |
| 23:22.39 | SpeedEvil | vallor: ephemeris is downloaded from the satellites. |
| 23:22.46 | SpeedEvil | noon: no NVRAM |
| 23:23.02 | SpeedEvil | noon: it'll be storing it in files - there isn't any NVRAM in the hammerhad |
| 23:23.04 | Elrond | SpeedEvil - gllin saves two files to "disk": NVRAM{1,2}.DAT |
| 23:23.08 | SpeedEvil | oh |
| 23:23.48 | noon | thats why i assumed it uses nvram to store the data... |
| 23:24.13 | SpeedEvil | Possibly in some devices there may be actual physical nvram |
| 23:24.22 | mickeyl | g'night guys |
| 23:24.26 | SpeedEvil | Night. |
| 23:24.34 | Elrond | Good night mickey|zzZZzz |
| 23:24.35 | noon | bye mickey|zzZZzz |
| 23:24.37 | pavelm | good night! |
| 23:25.07 | Elrond | noon - It's just files on the normal jffs2. |
| 23:25.08 | pavelm | ...actually, 8x7 soft keyboard is still usable by finger. Wow. |
| 23:25.17 | *** join/#openmoko dkirker (n=dkirker@c-24-6-210-139.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 23:25.23 | *** join/#openmoko RbdPngn (n=ningerso@uslink-66.173.44-135.uslink.net) |
| 23:26.07 | noon | SpeedEvil: but the download from the satellites take some time. |
| 23:27.00 | noon | if the receiver has some fresh ephemeris data the fix could be faster arquierd |
| 23:27.19 | SpeedEvil | Indeed, which is why you want it for testing. |
| 23:27.33 | SpeedEvil | Waiting for a full navigation message would suck. |
| 23:28.04 | SpeedEvil | As you want to plug phone in and see if it works, not wait ages for it to download stuff from space. |
| 23:29.24 | Elrond | And doing it cold takes ages really. |
| 23:30.28 | noon | SpeedEvil: is there a way to use the ephemeris data from my sirfIII receiver and put this into the hammerhead? |
| 23:30.36 | SpeedEvil | noon: in principle. |
| 23:30.54 | SpeedEvil | Not as yet in practice |
| 23:31.29 | SpeedEvil | Also you may find [[Category:GPS]] on the wiki of use |
| 23:31.40 | pavelm | 5x7 softkeyboard produces square buttons.. and seems to work pretty much ok. |
| 23:31.41 | vallor | maybe it can sit on a web server or servers |
| 23:32.06 | pavelm | right now I'm using abcde... layout. I wonder if some variation on qwerty would be better? |
| 23:32.22 | SpeedEvil | pavelm: eta... |
| 23:32.36 | SpeedEvil | (letter frequency based) |
| 23:32.42 | SpeedEvil | Dunno |
| 23:33.32 | pavelm | speed: modern qwerty for 5x7 layout... |
| 23:33.34 | ScaredyCat | Das Keyboard |
| 23:33.45 | SpeedEvil | Engineered to have the minimal likelyhood of confusion for common triglyphs |
| 23:33.50 | *** join/#openmoko switch3r (n=switch3r@dsktop.student.umd.edu) |
| 23:34.24 | SpeedEvil | So that typos are wasier to manually find. |
| 23:34.32 | SpeedEvil | s/manually/automatically/ |
| 23:35.13 | vallor | pavelm: are you doing this "portrait" or "landscape" (90 degree rotation of key glyphs?) ? |
| 23:35.24 | noon | when will there be a qwertz keyboard? ;o) |
| 23:35.32 | pavelm | vallor: portrait. |
| 23:35.59 | cjb_ie | dvorak for the win! |
| 23:36.15 | loufoque | dvorak ftw |
| 23:36.18 | pavelm | vallor: xrandr is hard ... hmmm. xrandr just works. Wow. |
| 23:36.20 | pavelm | DISPLAY=:0.0 xrandr -o right |
| 23:36.23 | ScaredyCat | you still trying to push that cjb_ie |
| 23:36.25 | ScaredyCat | ? |
| 23:36.31 | cjb_ie | maybe ;-) |
| 23:36.36 | ScaredyCat | :) |
| 23:36.39 | pavelm | vallor: hmm, but that needs completely different layout :-) |
| 23:37.12 | ScaredyCat | it basically needs to be a decision made by the user. |
| 23:37.20 | cjb_ie | if you go with dvorak you won't have to worry about localising qwerty, qwertz, azerty etc... everyone will complain equally except a few happy geeks :-) |
| 23:37.22 | vallor | pavelm: :) I'd say, give the user the option of any of a number of layouts |
| 23:37.42 | noon | SpeedEvil: i've looked at [[category:gps]] but there is nothing new. the pakets 10,23,9d are still a mistery |
| 23:37.50 | pavelm | vallor: Not in my poor perl script :-) |
| 23:38.03 | pavelm | vallor: actually user is free to edit that python script. |
| 23:38.04 | SpeedEvil | noon: sorry - I thought you were new to the situation. |
| 23:38.06 | pavelm | s/perl/python/ |
| 23:39.53 | ScaredyCat | mmm... that seems about as likely to encourage users as stabbing them in the head |
| 23:40.23 | Elrond | noon - 10 has some ideas now. |
| 23:40.54 | noon | Elrond: woo. speak up |
| 23:41.28 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[OpenMoko_under_QEMU]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Canberra]] [[P1_Owners]] |
| 23:41.32 | vallor | pavelm: if you wanted to be slick, you could base the layouts on standard keyboard locales |
| 23:41.37 | Elrond | noon - Some russian guy contacted ph5 and me ;o) |
| 23:41.44 | *** part/#openmoko Sublime (n=Sublime@ip70-162-246-65.ph.ph.cox.net) |
| 23:41.46 | cjb_ie | really, it should be configurable, with a sensible default perhaps dependent on language |
| 23:41.51 | vallor | or whatever it's called when you select a language in Linux |
| 23:41.53 | cjb_ie | vallor: damn, you got there first. |
| 23:42.01 | Elrond | noon - with some idea on 10. I'm trying to write some data-gatherer to see, if there is anything. |
| 23:42.10 | vallor | cjb_ie: ;P |
| 23:42.21 | *** join/#openmoko switch3r (n=switch3r@dsktop.student.umd.edu) |
| 23:42.26 | cjb_ie | and you expressed it better too. sigh. |
| 23:43.14 | noon | Elrond: so next saturday a new hacking session? |
| 23:43.43 | Elrond | noon - Well, a mickeyl-meetup session ;) |
| 23:44.06 | Elrond | Neo's gps does not work indoors, at least not the one in my neo. |
| 23:44.07 | vallor | cjb_ie: I did? dang, even a blind squirrel finds a nut now and then (and in this case, I'm the nut...) |
| 23:44.20 | hozer | oh where oh where is my neo ;0 |
| 23:46.27 | *** part/#openmoko tessier (n=treed@kernel-panic/sex-machines) |
| 23:46.52 | noon | Elrond: even if you get the fix outside? |
| 23:47.40 | *** join/#openmoko gdiebel (n=gdiebel@adsl-76-204-97-155.dsl.mdsnwi.sbcglobal.net) |
| 23:47.42 | Elrond | noon - Even then it looses it very quickly. |
| 23:47.45 | *** join/#openmoko Linux_Galore (n=richard@60-242-20-212.static.tpgi.com.au) |
| 23:48.32 | noon | okey. its time for the bed. |
| 23:48.34 | noon | bye |
| 23:49.05 | galexande | well, ipsec worked for a couple brief minutes |
| 23:52.24 | pavelm | elrond: my neo works indoors... somehow. i guess it depends how deep indoors you are. |
| 23:52.49 | ckuethe | i was digging across global locate's site last night and they indicated a few basic modes of operation: autonomous (regular gps), enhanced autonomous (basically regular gps, with GL's proprietary long term ephemeris model), apgs mobile-assist (base station calculates position) and agps mobile-based (handset computes position with some hints from the base station). see http://www.globallocate.com/SEMICONDUCTORS/SEMI_LIBRARY_Frameset. |
| 23:52.54 | Elrond | pavelm - Well, my roof is metalic ;o) |
| 23:53.35 | SpeedEvil | ckuethe: look at wikipedia: A-GPS |
| 23:53.43 | ckuethe | yes, i've seen that |
| 23:54.20 | *** join/#openmoko RbdPngn (n=ningerso@uslink-66.173.44-135.uslink.net) |
| 23:54.34 | SpeedEvil | Enhanced autonomous would be fairly easy to do. |
| 23:54.58 | SpeedEvil | Based on precise satellite orbits, and a better orbital/satellite model. |
| 23:55.16 | ckuethe | sure. regular gps, but with a more complicated but better orbital model |
| 23:55.31 | SpeedEvil | The orbits in the almanac are not very accurate AIUI. |
| 23:55.38 | ckuethe | the almanac is crap |
| 23:55.57 | ckuethe | the ephemeris is what you need to get a meaningful position |
| 23:56.01 | SpeedEvil | err |
| 23:56.15 | ckuethe | i don't call 100m error a meaningful position |
| 23:56.26 | ckuethe | but then again, maybe i'm just too picky |
| 23:56.32 | SpeedEvil | I basically mean the ephemiris is not as accurate as it might be. |
| 23:56.39 | ckuethe | that too |
| 23:56.54 | ckuethe | that is why there is a market for ultra-precise orbits |
| 23:57.11 | ckuethe | but they currently require postprocessing so they're not really available in real-time |
| 23:58.07 | Elrond | ckuethe - BTW: Do you know a nice online website which shows a list of "probably visible" Sats for a given sat/lon? |
| 23:58.24 | ckuethe | http://www.ngs.noaa.gov/GPS/GPS.html <- precise orbits |
| 23:58.27 | SpeedEvil | Elrond: heavans-abocve.com |
| 23:58.39 | vallor | Elrond: I don't think they are geostationary |
| 23:58.39 | SpeedEvil | hevans-above.com |
| 23:58.42 | SpeedEvil | err |
| 23:58.46 | vallor | in fact, I know they aren't |
| 23:58.47 | ckuethe | http://heavens-above.com/ |
| 23:58.51 | SpeedEvil | however you spell that word |
| 23:59.02 | SpeedEvil | they are in 12 hour orbits. |
| 23:59.07 | SpeedEvil | (more or less) |
| 23:59.11 | Elrond | Hmm, heavens-above.com... huh, I thought, I checked that. |
| 23:59.20 | ckuethe | they're not geostationary, but he wants a site to tell him "if i look up right now, what will i see" |
| 23:59.21 | pavelm | hmm... so my attempt at |
| 23:59.27 | pavelm | qwerty |
| 23:59.29 | pavelm | uiop |
| 23:59.34 | SpeedEvil | heavens above will work. |
| 23:59.37 | ckuethe | hopefully that includes "you will see the following gps satellites here here and here" |
| 23:59.37 | SpeedEvil | AIUI. |
| 23:59.42 | SpeedEvil | Or download xpehem. |
| 23:59.48 | SpeedEvil | xephem. |
