| 00:09.48 | *** join/#openmoko siti (n=siti@clix-jaquesmartin-nz.cpe.clix.net.nz) |
| 00:18.49 | *** join/#openmoko merriam_ (n=merriam@85-211-239-240.dyn.gotadsl.co.uk) |
| 00:19.56 | linux_galore | heh, people are just starting to realise how locked down and restrictive the iPhone is and that the things have not sold out |
| 00:20.48 | balrog-kun | i don't think people care much about it being locked down |
| 00:21.05 | linux_galore | balrog-kun: they do when it doesnt work with their PC |
| 00:21.16 | Elrond | hehe. |
| 00:21.25 | balrog-kun | all phones since the 90s, since the beginning of mobile phones, were locked down |
| 00:21.34 | balrog-kun | and nobody was bothered |
| 00:21.54 | Elrond | Well, not locked to providers. |
| 00:22.12 | Elrond | Or you could at least buy non-simlocked ones. |
| 00:22.16 | Elrond | Anyway. |
| 00:22.20 | Elrond | Good night people. :-) |
| 00:23.02 | balrog-kun | iPhones are *all* simlocked? |
| 00:23.24 | Elrond | I assume so? |
| 00:23.48 | SpeedEvil | Elrond: night |
| 00:23.56 | Elrond | Night. :-) |
| 00:27.04 | *** part/#openmoko j_ack (n=j_ack@p508D9393.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
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| 00:36.26 | loufoque | you could always unlock the old phones |
| 00:37.55 | linux_galore | yeah, if you paid the reserve you could ask for the phone to be unlocked |
| 00:38.45 | linux_galore | the Telco support people would panic so I would just say Ive got another new phone and want to pass this unit on to a friend before hand |
| 00:39.29 | *** join/#openmoko wildfire (n=wildfire@203.7.227.146) |
| 00:40.01 | linux_galore | you can buy a nice HTC phone with "more features" than the iPhone unlocked |
| 00:40.18 | linux_galore | for under $600 |
| 00:42.50 | linux_galore | Apple tried to put the hard word on the local major Telco (Telstra) on distributing the iPhone, Telstra basically said 1. blow it out your back end 2. we have no use for it in our product line up as we now use 3G GSM |
| 00:43.23 | cjb | huh? Apple have locked it to AT&T; Telstra couldn't use it anyway. |
| 00:43.44 | linux_galore | cjb: AT&T dont exists in Australia |
| 00:44.01 | linux_galore | mainly because Telstra is so dominant here |
| 00:44.13 | cjb | oh, ok. when does it release in Australia? |
| 00:44.48 | linux_galore | cjb: well it depends if Apple update to 3G |
| 00:45.05 | linux_galore | I can buy 3G phones now |
| 00:45.57 | SpeedEvil | Anyone happen to know id there are 'AT' modem modules for 3G? |
| 00:46.38 | SpeedEvil | Sparkfun has GSM ones. |
| 00:46.47 | linux_galore | SpeedEvil: all I know is you can get a 3G card for your laptop |
| 00:47.20 | *** join/#openmoko darmou (n=darmou@ppp121-44-238-129.lns2.mel4.internode.on.net) |
| 00:47.22 | SpeedEvil | Yeah, not exactly what I'm looking for. |
| 00:47.36 | linux_galore | although with wimax rolling out next year that wont last long |
| 00:47.40 | SpeedEvil | Well. |
| 00:47.46 | SpeedEvil | Wimax is vastly overhyped |
| 00:47.53 | darmou | Has anyone had a look at the iPhone now it's released? |
| 00:48.20 | SpeedEvil | Not to mention that it looks like you're going to need a hugely complex reciever to do the wiimax thing worldwide. |
| 00:49.05 | darmou | I definitly think that an OpenMoko based phone will be better because the iPhone is totally locked as far as development goes except for ajax apps. |
| 00:49.17 | SpeedEvil | Depends. |
| 00:49.25 | SpeedEvil | Openmoko may not take off fast enough. |
| 00:49.29 | linux_galore | SpeedEvil: not really, you can buy multi bandwidth adaptive antenna for a few years now |
| 00:49.33 | SpeedEvil | It may just be yet another stalled product. |
| 00:49.48 | SpeedEvil | I hope not, and am doing all I can to make it not, but... |
| 00:49.57 | SpeedEvil | linux_galore: now look at price/power/volume |
| 00:50.12 | darmou | And we certainly don't want another Zaurus situation |
| 00:50.19 | linux_galore | SpeedEvil: yeah, if wimax takes of the price will drop |
| 00:50.24 | SpeedEvil | Opensource helps. |
| 00:50.40 | SpeedEvil | It doesn't fix it all. |
| 00:50.46 | darmou | Zaurus = low popularity got taken off the shelves within a short period of time |
| 00:51.06 | juri_ | zaurus was nice, i owned one. ;P |
| 00:51.23 | SpeedEvil | linux_galore: it's not so much that. The problem is that there are lots of seperate widely seperated frequencies. |
| 00:51.39 | darmou | I have a clam shell spitz and collie 5500 |
| 00:51.49 | SpeedEvil | linux_galore: this pretty much means that you have to have a fairly complex tranciever. |
| 00:52.03 | juri_ | i just ordered a 770 to go with my openmoko, when the openmoko comes out. :) |
| 00:52.17 | linux_galore | SpeedEvil: if you go to Malaysia motorola make gsm/cdma multi frequency mobiles |
| 00:52.36 | darmou | juri_ which Zaurus did you have? |
| 00:53.24 | juri_ | darmou: 5500. had a ethernet CF card, and a cf wireless. it made a great network traffic sniffer. |
| 00:53.31 | darmou | Here in australia there a a group called Unwired http://www.unwired.com.au, I thought you needed a special arial for wimax? |
| 00:53.35 | linux_galore | SpeedEvil: software adaptive receiver IC's have been around for well over 10 years now |
| 00:54.06 | SpeedEvil | linux_galore: and look at the power and RF input requirements. |
| 00:54.10 | SpeedEvil | It's not that simple. |
| 00:54.17 | SpeedEvil | 'Software radio' is not magic. |
| 00:54.32 | *** join/#openmoko gcb77 (n=gbarta@c-24-16-154-132.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) |
| 00:54.35 | SpeedEvil | I'm not saying it can't be done. |
| 00:55.04 | SpeedEvil | I'm saying that the first and second generation of phones with it in will be only a few frequencies. |
| 00:55.38 | linux_galore | darmou: unwired use a very similar setup to wimax and the antena's are very small |
| 00:55.41 | SpeedEvil | Rather than completely tunable as would be nice. |
| 00:56.03 | *** join/#openmoko Tetraden (n=FU-gibts@Qc3e0.q.pppool.de) |
| 00:56.04 | Tetraden | hi |
| 00:56.04 | linux_galore | darmou: OPEL will be doing WiMAX though |
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| 00:56.46 | linux_galore | I must admit the base station antena's for wimax are anything but small |
| 00:56.51 | darmou | linux_galore: so unwired use a different standard? |
| 00:57.06 | SpeedEvil | As they are moderately cheap now. |
| 00:57.32 | linux_galore | darmou: yes, wimax wasnt a standard when unwired started so they used what was available |
| 00:57.40 | juri_ | speed: they have bluetooth, so it should be possible to have a NK770/openmoko solution to "constant wired". |
| 00:57.42 | Tetraden | Is there any source where i can get the emu, which is not down on the net? |
| 00:57.55 | SpeedEvil | juri_: and wifi. |
| 00:58.04 | SpeedEvil | juri_: meaning it can bridge to wifi nets. |
| 00:58.25 | juri_ | thats what i meant. :) |
| 00:58.38 | linux_galore | N770 second hand is pretty cheap |
| 00:58.44 | linux_galore | USD$150 |
| 00:58.44 | SpeedEvil | New is 70 quid |
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| 00:59.04 | SpeedEvil | $150 |
| 00:59.06 | SpeedEvil | http://www.expansys.com/p.aspx?i=141019&partner=froogle |
| 00:59.24 | linux_galore | N800 though is pretty nice |
| 00:59.33 | SpeedEvil | If it turns up. |
| 01:00.36 | linux_galore | 73 quid is like USD$210 |
| 01:01.16 | SpeedEvil | New though. |
| 01:01.22 | SpeedEvil | With an actual guarantee. |
| 01:01.44 | linux_galore | ouch 284 quid for a N800 |
| 01:01.53 | SpeedEvil | Indeed. |
| 01:01.58 | linux_galore | thats over USD$600 |
| 01:02.05 | SpeedEvil | For that money, I'd get two neos :) |
| 01:02.22 | paulproteus | Or four N770s! (-; |
| 01:02.22 | linux_galore | bugger that get a NEO lol |
| 01:02.39 | linux_galore | or wait fr the GTA02 |
| 01:02.41 | linux_galore | for* |
| 01:02.52 | SpeedEvil | Current annoyance is I can't find anyone to sell me a FM radio chip that I want. |
| 01:03.13 | *** join/#openmoko poffy (n=poffy@cpe-70-116-144-238.houston.res.rr.com) |
| 01:03.30 | SpeedEvil | 2*3mm, 6 or so external components makes a complete FM radio. |
| 01:05.47 | Tetraden | Can anyone help me? I just want to set up a Neo1973 emu. So I need the modification for the qemu and some kind of image I hope. |
| 01:06.07 | *** join/#openmoko j_ack (n=j_ack@p508D9393.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 01:07.20 | gcb77 | Tetraden: have you tried: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/OpenMoko_under_QEMU |
| 01:07.28 | Tetraden | yes |
| 01:07.44 | Tetraden | my first problem there is, that the download link is down |
| 01:08.02 | Tetraden | http://mdk.linux.org.tw/~jserv/openmoko/openmoko-emulator-win32-bin-20070625.zip |
| 01:09.27 | Tetraden | I get timeouts all the time. |
| 01:09.56 | peepsalot | is there any pre-made vm image of openmoko out there? |
| 01:09.56 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@qiqinebs.chi.il.us) |
| 01:10.02 | Tetraden | so if anyone knows a working mirror. pleasy tell me :) |
| 01:11.02 | peepsalot | for vmware? or something that would run in linux, not windows |
| 01:11.03 | Tetraden | or if anyone is willed to send it by jabber or sth. |
| 01:13.19 | Tetraden | peepsalot: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Qemu |
| 01:14.31 | balrog-kun | the zip actually contains a premade vm image that would work on linux |
| 01:14.37 | balrog-kun | if the server wasn't down |
| 01:14.52 | peepsalot | ah ok |
| 01:15.14 | Tetraden | summatusmentis: the name says win32 |
| 01:15.19 | SpeedEvil | Tetraden times out for me |
| 01:15.32 | balrog-kun | beside the (sic!) windows binaries |
| 01:15.32 | peepsalot | balrog-kun, in that case, the wiki is misleading, since it sounds like it will only work in windows |
| 01:15.40 | Tetraden | arrgh, auto tabbing sux |
| 01:15.52 | balrog-kun | peepsalot: yes, the qemu in this zip will only work for windows |
| 01:15.58 | summatusmentis | Tetraden: :-D |
| 01:16.04 | balrog-kun | peepsalot: but it contains a vm image, that's platform independent |
| 01:16.06 | Tetraden | :) |
| 01:16.21 | peepsalot | balrog-kun, ok, thanks |
| 01:16.36 | peepsalot | will have to check it out if/when the server comes back up |
| 01:16.36 | Tetraden | does anyone already have this zip and can send it to me? I need it :/ |
| 01:16.49 | balrog-kun | peepsalot: it's quite trivial making the image yourself |
| 01:16.59 | peepsalot | i ran the mokomakefile once before, but it took forever |
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| 01:17.09 | peepsalot | and wasn't completely trivial |
| 01:17.17 | peepsalot | lots of hiccups |
| 01:17.27 | balrog-kun | the instructions in this page take about 15 minutes to complete and have a working vm |
| 01:17.34 | linux_galore | be cool if there was a ubuntu package |
| 01:17.36 | gcb77 | balrog-kun: could you make the image from a linux build? |
| 01:17.51 | peepsalot | maybe it has improved since last time i tried, was a few months ago |
| 01:18.10 | balrog-kun | gcb77: you mean make the flash image and pack it up? |
| 01:18.34 | linux_galore | might look into making a ubuntu package so people can easily run it |
| 01:18.41 | balrog-kun | peepsalot: no, it's because the instructions in this page don't touch MokoMakefile |
| 01:18.45 | balrog-kun | which is what takes long |
| 01:19.52 | gcb77 | balrog-kun: I was thinking of building the emulator-win32-bin image |
| 01:20.31 | balrog-kun | gcb77: i'm not sure what you mean |
| 01:21.37 | gcb77 | balrog-kun: lol, nm. I was wondering if its easy to build the openmoko-emulator-win32-bin-##.zip from a MokoMakefile envrionment |
| 01:22.18 | *** join/#openmoko fastPrint (i=fastPrin@59-115-226-239.dynamic.hinet.net) |
| 01:22.28 | balrog-kun | gcb77: oh, i think it's mostly automatic, except for win32 you have to apply a couple of patches made by jserv2 |
| 01:22.39 | balrog-kun | jserv2 will also know how long it takes |
| 01:23.31 | balrog-kun | i personally have nothing to do with the win32 image, will never support anything win32 and will never upload any binaries (and optimally don't want to ever have anything to do with anything win32) |
| 01:23.48 | gcb77 | lol |
| 01:24.07 | gcb77 | I just went through a few painfull days getting the MokoMakefile to build on openSUSE 10.2 |
| 01:24.29 | gcb77 | win32 image almost sounds better |
| 01:25.00 | balrog-kun | i wouldn't know |
| 01:28.22 | balrog-kun | i will add a note to the qemu wiki page mentioning that MokoMakefile takes *long* so that people don't always try to use MokoMakefile if they only want to see the emulator |
| 01:28.45 | balrog-kun | as it stands now it sounds as if MokoMakefile was the recommended way of using the emulator |
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| 01:48.38 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[OpenMoko_under_QEMU]] [[Press_Coverage]] |
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| 02:39.28 | happycube | hummm... i wonder if there's a way to get mokomakefile/oe to download the next source pkg while building the current one |
| 02:39.50 | happycube | my opty 165 couldn't get to 1x cpu usage ;) |
| 02:40.11 | happycube | (not measuring on my macbook - oops) |
| 02:42.01 | peepsalot | balrog-kun, How to get it running: Using MokoMakefile: This is arguably the easiest way of building qemu-neo1973 ... |
| 02:42.16 | balrog-kun | yup |
| 02:43.04 | peepsalot | so the instructions on this page say to use mokomakefile, are you saying the other instructions are easier>? |
| 02:44.00 | balrog-kun | peepsalot: frankly, i haven't used MokoMakefile, but i know a number of people reported success with MakeMokofile, and added that to the wiki |
| 02:44.14 | balrog-kun | peepsalot: i'm not saying easier, i'm only saying faster |
| 02:49.32 | *** join/#openmoko quitte (n=quitte@stgt-d9bea5fb.pool.mediaWays.net) |
| 02:55.15 | paulproteus | Dudes, http://fakesteve.blogspot.com/2007/06/freetards-are-trying-to-make-iphone.html is great. |
| 02:55.30 | paulproteus | Surely most of you saw it on community; I'm reading the archives now. (-: |
| 02:56.26 | *** join/#openmoko kiney_ (n=kiney@p548826D0.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 02:56.50 | peepsalot | balrog-kun, ok, i am trying the instructions here |
| 02:57.08 | peepsalot | balrog-kun, do you know what it means "see --cc="? # GCC 3.x will be required, see --cc= |
| 02:57.16 | peepsalot | i have gcc 4.1, so it's complaning |
| 02:58.58 | hads | Look at the '--cc= |
| 02:59.04 | hads | Look at the '--cc=' option |
| 02:59.15 | peepsalot | option of what? how would i look at it? |
| 02:59.28 | balrog-kun | peepsalot: you need a gcc 3.x to build qemu |
| 02:59.34 | peepsalot | argh |
| 02:59.48 | peepsalot | can i have multiple gcc version alongside each other? |
| 02:59.56 | balrog-kun | yes |
| 03:00.09 | balrog-kun | that's not an openmoko related requirement, it's in official qemu docs |
| 03:00.10 | peepsalot | gcc versions are not backwards compatible? |
| 03:01.06 | peepsalot | i would normally think a newer version of a compiler should not break existing builds |
| 03:01.24 | balrog-kun | they are supposed to be backwards compatible but that's not always the case, and here it's more because qemu uses a feature of gcc 3.x that wasn't really intentioanl and shouldn't be relied on |
| 03:01.45 | Tv | somebody needs to take a side-by-side shot of iphone and openmoko |
| 03:01.49 | balrog-kun | qemu uses a lot of assembler tricks |
| 03:02.36 | AntonTakk | uhoh |
| 03:03.00 | AntonTakk | make errored out making ncurses |
| 03:03.26 | peepsalot | balrog-kun, so how would i go about getting a different version of gcc installed, without overwriting my existing install? i am on ubuntu if that matters |
| 03:07.19 | balrog-kun | peepsalot: iirc the ubuntu-wiki has a neat tutorial about Qemu |
| 03:07.27 | hads | `aptitude search gcc` find the package you want and install. |
| 03:07.31 | balrog-kun | it should have a good explanation on gcc too |
| 03:08.29 | *** part/#openmoko SunZhiyong (n=sunzy@218.242.154.170) |
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| 03:15.10 | peepsalot | thx hads, i didn't think it would let me do it like that |
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| 03:35.22 | peepsalot | i got some horrendous error on the last step of setting up qemu: http://pastebin.ca/599297 |
| 03:35.40 | *** join/#openmoko mosno (n=bmc@203-173-40-74.perm.iinet.net.au) |
| 03:36.43 | balrog-kun | looks like a broken shell, is it the dash based Ubuntu? |
| 03:37.05 | balrog-kun | iirc there were remarks about dash somewhere on the wiki |
| 03:37.40 | peepsalot | agh, yeah... i thought i fixed this before. checking... |
| 03:38.50 | peepsalot | well, no it looks like /bin/sh is pointing to bash |
| 03:39.22 | *** join/#openmoko dcsmith_ (n=dcsmith@ool-4351bc6d.dyn.optonline.net) |
| 03:39.34 | balrog-kun | hmm, then i have no idea, but someone here http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Talk:OpenMoko_under_QEMU reports the same problem |
| 03:40.38 | dcsmith_ | am I missing something, or is the svn for apps way out of date? |
| 03:40.39 | aloril | dcsmith_: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (Hopefully this link answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) |
| 03:42.06 | peepsalot | balrog-kun, maybe the script is expecting some different command also named sleep? |
| 03:44.40 | peepsalot | nvm, don't think that's it at all |
| 03:44.58 | balrog-kun | as far as i can tell it expects only the normal sleep command that sleeps a given number of seconds |
| 03:45.20 | balrog-kun | this brekage looks mor einteresting that other breakages though :p |
| 03:47.09 | peepsalot | anything to keep things interesting :-/ |
| 03:48.58 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Buying_Interest_List]] |
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| 03:57.34 | peepsalot | hmm, so i noticed the program #! /usr/bin/env bash |
| 03:57.52 | peepsalot | i mean the script is marked as this ^ |
| 03:58.18 | peepsalot | but what does that mean? why not #! /bin/bash ? |
| 04:00.14 | peepsalot | eh, well doesn't make a difference anyways |
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| 04:19.33 | ravan | balrog-kun: ping |
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| 04:32.48 | balrog-kun | ravan: pong |
| 04:35.04 | linux_galore | I cant wait till the NEO hits the community, with some luck we get some serious hacking going |
| 04:35.52 | cjb | peepsalot: because not everyone's bash is in /bin. |
| 04:36.01 | linux_galore | should setup a sponsor for a prize GYA02 for the best 2007 hack |
| 04:36.03 | cjb | peepsalot: so, it uses bash wherever the environment finds it first. |
| 04:36.08 | linux_galore | GTA02* |
| 04:36.30 | peepsalot | cjb, so why couldn't it just say #! bash ? |
| 04:36.49 | cjb | because the kernel (which is what interprets #! lines) requires an absolute path. |
| 04:37.23 | *** join/#openmoko chris^ (n=kraetzi@p548AD6A5.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 04:38.26 | cjb | "bash" makes sense to your shell, which has an environment and a set of paths to look in, but the kernel doesn't have any of those things. |
| 04:45.33 | linux_galore | heh, love Microsofts response to the iPhone, enter the HTC 7500, yep now tiny 3.5 inch touch screen for us, nope were going all Texas on your ass with a 5" LCD and a 640Mhz arm cpu, yeeeahw take that Apple http://www.geardiary.com/2007/05/28/the-htc-advantage-x7500-so-far/ |
| 04:46.20 | linux_galore | Microsoft "making big assed product today" |
| 04:46.26 | linux_galore | products* |
| 04:46.51 | cjb | linux_galore: the iPhone also has a 640MHz ARM CPU. Probably the same one. |
| 04:47.52 | balrog-kun | 640MHz wouldn't be bad |
| 04:48.14 | siti | I am amazed the battery life is ok with a 640Mhz cpu + 3d accelerator |
| 04:49.47 | linux_galore | 2200mah batteries |
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| 06:14.57 | micapam | Hi there. |
| 06:15.55 | micapam | I just found out about OpenMoko. It sounds very interesting. I wonder if I might be able to get involved in some way. Could someone tell me the core technologies involved - programming languages, protocols ? |
| 06:15.55 | aloril | micapam: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (Hopefully this link answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) |
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| 06:16.04 | micapam | Thanks, I'll check ther.e |
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| 06:35.34 | aloril | counter_msg (last update 2007-07-02T06:19) http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter 60% for P1 in |
| 06:35.34 | aloril | aloril changed counter prefix message to (last update 2007-07-02T06:19) http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter 60% for P1 in |
| 06:36.27 | aloril | <PROTECTED> |
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| 07:09.47 | TRIsoft | morning |
| 07:13.02 | cdbot2 | * * OM Bug 624 has been created by osazon(AT)gmail.com |
| 07:13.03 | cdbot2 | * * Server hosting windows pre-built binaries not responding |
| 07:13.04 | cdbot2 | * * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=624 |
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| 07:19.47 | BlackFog | morning |
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| 07:57.42 | bedboi | hi there. |
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| 07:59.41 | sixfeet | moin |
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| 08:14.19 | Stephmw | mornin' |
| 08:15.45 | PMT | mornin |
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| 08:22.03 | bluelightning | argh... can anyone remember the u-boot environment variable to set to stop auto power-down? I can't find it in the wiki :( |
| 08:22.35 | *** join/#openmoko florian (n=fuchs@217.146.132.69) |
| 08:22.56 | bluelightning | ok, got it... |
| 08:25.09 | florian | good morning |
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| 08:29.14 | ScaredyCat | Waaaaaaa! |
| 08:29.31 | ScaredyCat | @catnip:/home/moko/build> bitbake openmoko-devel-image |
| 08:29.31 | ScaredyCat | NOTE: Not using a cache. Set CACHE = <directory> to enable. |
| 08:29.31 | ScaredyCat | ERROR: no files to build. |
| 08:29.31 | ScaredyCat | NOTE: Parsing finished. 0 cached, 0 parsed, 0 skipped, 0 masked. |
| 08:29.31 | ScaredyCat | ERROR: Nothing provides dependency openmoko-devel-image |
| 08:29.36 | ScaredyCat | wtf.... |
| 08:30.47 | florian | ScaredyCat: set up your environment variables |
| 08:32.36 | ScaredyCat | export OMDIR=/home/moko |
| 08:32.36 | ScaredyCat | export BBPATH=$OMDIR/build:$OMDIR/openmoko/trunk/oe:$OMDIR/openembedded |
| 08:32.50 | ScaredyCat | ahhh... |
| 08:32.59 | ScaredyCat | but i did that in the other shell, gah! |
| 08:33.03 | ScaredyCat | thanks florian |
| 08:33.12 | florian | ScaredyCat: :-) yw |
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| 08:39.19 | Elrond | ScaredyCat - Use MokoMakefile. |
| 08:39.48 | ravan | is anyone using an image other than openmoko-devel-image ? |
| 08:40.43 | Elrond | I guess koen is ;o) |
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| 08:42.16 | ravan | koen: which image are you using? |
| 08:43.28 | Elrond | ravan - Probably some angstrom image. There was a prebuild one somewhere. |
| 08:44.33 | ravan | i'm not able to get usb networking working with any rootfs image other than the one from buildhost |
| 08:44.51 | ravan | (i'm building my images using bitbake) |
| 08:46.12 | Elrond | ravan - Maybe that one: http://www.angstrom-distribution.org/unstable/images/fic-gta01/ |
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| 08:52.16 | ewon | morning |
| 08:52.23 | Elrond | Is g_serial in the prebuild kernels? |
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| 09:15.19 | ScaredyCat | lardman, lardman does whatever lard can... frys an egg any size, frys bacon, also fries ... watch out it's lard man.... </spiderman theme> |
| 09:16.00 | lardman | :) |
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| 09:17.04 | florian | hi bedboi |
| 09:17.20 | bedboi | hey florian :) |
| 09:17.26 | bedboi | what's up? |
| 09:19.21 | florian | enough to stay busy ;) |
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| 09:49.18 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Neo1973_compatible_cellphone_providers]] |
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| 10:33.09 | bluelightning1 | hmm, that's interesting... the gsm modem in my v4 is no longer responding :/ |
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| 11:13.01 | cdbot2 | * * OM Bug 625 has been created by ticktock35(AT)gmail.com |
| 11:13.02 | cdbot2 | * * t stat `ftl_format': No such file or directory |
| 11:13.03 | cdbot2 | * * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=625 |
| 11:13.33 | ewon | I guess ftl_format is ftl... |
| 11:13.37 | ewon | *badumtish* |
| 11:13.45 | ewon | thanks, I'll be here all week. Try the veal. |
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| 11:22.33 | CM | counter |
| 11:22.33 | aloril | (last update 2007-07-02T06:19) http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter 60% for P1 in a week 00:37:26 (7.026±1.0 days) (1661;242) |
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| 11:34.14 | nnpiggy | Greetings nox-Hand. |
| 11:34.29 | nox-Hand | Good day to you, nnpiggy |
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| 11:49.58 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Wish_List_-_Hardware]] |
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| 12:11.58 | aloril | (script) openmoko-devel: "Michael 'Mickey' Lauer" <mickey at openmoko.org> Re: future OpenEmbedded updates |
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| 12:18.46 | Basheri | yay, just got my friend to buy a neo instead of an iphone |
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| 12:20.31 | Basheri | well, actually all i did was show him the facts and compared those two ^^ |
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| 12:21.55 | ScaredyCat | did you explain that it's not complete yet ? |
| 12:23.09 | Ycros | I have a fear that too many non-developers will buy the first round of phones |
| 12:23.27 | ScaredyCat | yes... 'just because' |
| 12:23.34 | Ycros | "ooh, shiny" |
| 12:23.51 | Elrond | mickeyl - Just an idea: You might _consider_ posting job announcments to the announce list as well. |
| 12:23.54 | ScaredyCat | "ooh, shiny, unlocked" |
| 12:24.47 | Basheri | ScaredyCat: i sure did =) |
| 12:25.00 | ScaredyCat | :) |
| 12:25.06 | koen | Elrond: the qualified people are on the oe-devel list |
| 12:25.12 | ScaredyCat | good... they wouldn't be friendly if you didn't ;) |
| 12:26.33 | Elrond | koen - I know. This was more on "any job announcement", not the oe-specific one. |
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| 12:28.33 | Elrond | I wonder, how many will buy it and then brick it within one week. ;o) |
| 12:30.56 | ScaredyCat | I wonder how many realise how ong it takes to do a build |
| 12:30.58 | ScaredyCat | :) |
| 12:31.19 | Elrond | ScaredyCat - hehe, yeah. ;-) |
| 12:31.26 | Elrond | ScaredyCat - Not to mention the initial download. |
| 12:31.56 | ScaredyCat | I'm pretty sure openmoko owes me a week.... |
| 12:32.07 | ScaredyCat | .. and it's still not building ... |
| 12:32.20 | ScaredyCat | ..and i need fewd... |
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| 12:32.54 | ScaredyCat | if only i had the space.. he cried |
| 12:34.22 | SpeedEvil | Can anyone comment on if SPI is present on the debug connector? |
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| 12:44.58 | Elrond | SpeedEvil - http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Category:Neo1973_Hardware#Changes_from_GTA01Bv3 |
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| 12:45.00 | Elrond | SpeedEvil - point "2." |
| 12:45.00 | SpeedEvil | From memory, I don't think that answers it. |
| 12:45.00 | Elrond | "Add I2C, SPI and one irq and wakeup capable GPIO pin to debug port plus have test pads for all these signals (for soldering wires directly on the pcb)" sounds like an answer. |
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| 12:45.01 | Elrond | Unless I'm completely confused. |
| 12:45.02 | SpeedEvil | Oh - right |
| 12:45.02 | SpeedEvil | you're right |
| 12:45.02 | SpeedEvil | I'd missed the debug port bit the last time I read it. |
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| 12:45.02 | Elrond | You might want to check the history and verify, that the info was added by someone, who you trust. ;o) |
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| 12:46.30 | Elrond | SpeedEvil - Harald added it, so I guess, it's mostly okay ( http://wiki.openmoko.org/index.php?title=Neo1973_Hardware&diff=5483&oldid=5481 ) |
| 12:47.22 | SpeedEvil | Wow - community has way more signal than normal. |
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| 12:48.42 | Elrond | "signal"? Huh? |
| 12:48.46 | SpeedEvil | Just putting together a post on amongst other things - expanding the USB connector. |
| 12:49.00 | SpeedEvil | there is noise, and signal |
| 12:49.07 | Elrond | Ahh. :-) |
| 12:49.13 | SpeedEvil | There is actual on-topic stuff without flamage. |
| 12:49.18 | SpeedEvil | err |
| 12:49.25 | SpeedEvil | expanding the debug connector |
| 12:49.41 | SpeedEvil | For GTA02 |
| 12:49.49 | Elrond | My current problem with the debug connector: It's undocumented. |
| 12:50.06 | SpeedEvil | yeah |
| 12:50.52 | Elrond | Not to mention, that I can't see a big trade secret in there... except getting people to buy the debug board instead of creating their own. |
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| 12:52.25 | SpeedEvil | Indeed. |
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| 13:44.20 | ScaredyCat | ... left the capitol .... :P |
| 13:44.30 | ScaredyCat | </i'm here all week> |
| 13:44.32 | raster | good boy! |
| 13:44.33 | raster | :) |
| 13:45.05 | *** part/#openmoko kslater (n=kslater@24.svnf1.xdsl.nauticom.net) |
| 13:45.30 | raster | SpeedEvil: i imagine openmoko will be happy to give specs for the connector |
| 13:45.39 | raster | though they may end up being pretty fuzzy |
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| 13:50.12 | tr1 | hi |
| 13:50.51 | tr1 | is there anywhere a description of the svn structur (http://svn.openmoko.org/trunk/) ? |
| 13:50.58 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Neo]] |
| 13:51.49 | Elrond | tr1 - Not really. You're welcome to write on into the wiki, if you like. |
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| 13:52.33 | Elrond | tr1 - Ahh, found it: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Development_resources#SVN_Tree_Layout |
| 13:52.39 | tr1 | ah ok thx |
| 13:52.43 | tr1 | i have a look there |
| 13:53.07 | tr1 | how is the system build know - with openembedded ? |
| 13:54.19 | Elrond | tr1 - http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/MokoMakefile |
| 13:54.52 | Elrond | tr1 - Which is a wrapper around openembedded, etc. Make life lots easier. |
| 13:55.13 | *** join/#openmoko cesarb (n=cesarb@wikipedia/cesarb) |
| 13:56.40 | cesarb | I just managed to build openmoko (using mokomakefile) with dash as my /bin/sh, and it took only 4 small patches (only 3 of them were dash-related) |
| 13:58.41 | tr1 | wouldn't it be nicer to use a full build system like t2 or opensde ? |
| 14:00.34 | hrw | tr1: OpenEmbedded is full build system |
| 14:00.38 | Elrond | tr1 - It's openembedded/bitbake a full build system? |
| 14:00.51 | Elrond | Ahh, hrw already answered my question. |
| 14:01.16 | Elrond | cesarb - Ask rwhitby if he wants to consider those patches for inclusion in mokomakefile. |
| 14:01.51 | cesarb | rwhitby: are you here? |
| 14:02.14 | ravan | mickeyl: how far has the merging back into OE come along? |
| 14:02.56 | rwhitby | cesarb: pastebin the patches and I'll take a look at them. |
| 14:03.22 | cesarb | rwhitby: ok |
| 14:07.02 | cesarb | rwhitby: the first one is http://www.pastebin.ca/599844 which when added to the quilt list fixes the perl build failures with dash |
| 14:07.07 | *** part/#openmoko sid (n=unstable@tor/regular/sid) |
| 14:09.02 | cesarb | rwhitby: the second one is http://www.pastebin.ca/599848 which when added to the quilt list fixes a mtpaint build failure with dash (by forcing it to use /bin/bash) |
| 14:10.18 | *** join/#openmoko tri (n=Richter@pd95b2df8.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 14:10.21 | tri | re |
| 14:10.36 | cesarb | rwhitby: the third one is http://www.pastebin.ca/599853 which imports an openembedded fix to a ltrace build failure when you have a native libelf (not dash related) |
| 14:10.40 | florian | tr2x: wb |
| 14:12.50 | cesarb | rwhitby: and the last one is http://www.pastebin.ca/599859 which makes clean-package-% (and build-package-% which has the same code) work with dash |
| 14:13.38 | cesarb | rwhitby: the first three go into patches/openembedded-<huge number>, the last one applies directly to the makefile |
| 14:14.51 | CIA-17 | openmoko: 03rwhitby * r99 10mokomakefile/trunk/ (5 files in 2 dirs): Added patches to support dash - thanks to cesarb |
| 14:15.41 | rwhitby | cesarb: when OM finally get projects.openmoko.org working and stable, you'll be getting commit access for the MokoMakefile project. |
| 14:16.09 | rwhitby | That's a perfect example of how a contribution should be done. |
| 14:16.45 | cesarb | rwhitby: that's because I'm already used to contributing to free software projects |
| 14:16.53 | Basheri | =) |
| 14:17.10 | rwhitby | cesarb: yep, it certainly shows. |
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| 14:21.13 | CoreDump|home | hi |
| 14:21.40 | raster | ho |
| 14:22.50 | CoreDump|home | Mr. Eyecandy himself has joined us =) |
| 14:23.22 | cesarb | rwhitby: hm, the build order for "make update" seems wrong... it runs update-openembedded before update-patches, which means people will have to run "make update" twice for these new patches to apply |
| 14:25.13 | CIA-17 | openmoko: 03rwhitby * r100 10mokomakefile/trunk/Makefile: Fixed order of make update - need to update patches before applying them to openembedded. |
| 14:25.18 | rwhitby | thx |
| 14:25.41 | zecke_ | rwhitby: it is working nowadays |
| 14:26.03 | zecke_ | rwhitby: stable is another issue, e.g. I can't add new files... in a specific directory but I blame subversion for that |
| 14:26.21 | rwhitby | zecke_: I saw you complaining about it just yesterday :-) |
| 14:26.49 | rwhitby | so the question is "is there an attentive admin who can fix things like that for you?: |
| 14:27.22 | zecke_ | rwhitby: yes there is. The workflow is file a bug, ping stefan_schmidt and he pokes the FIC guy |
| 14:27.58 | rwhitby | ok, I'll put migrating back there back on my todo list ... |
| 14:31.36 | *** join/#openmoko Magon (n=Magon@213.155.227.226) |
| 14:39.47 | ScaredyCat | I just don't get it... |
| 14:39.57 | tri | wouldn't it be nice to use a full build system like rpath, t2 or opensde ? |
| 14:40.16 | ScaredyCat | <PROTECTED> |
| 14:40.16 | raster | ? |
| 14:40.16 | ScaredyCat | | checking gelf.h presence... no |
| 14:40.16 | ScaredyCat | | checking for gelf.h... no |
| 14:40.16 | ScaredyCat | | configure: error: ***** gelf.h not found ***** |
| 14:40.32 | ScaredyCat | I have the elf devel stuff... I can sodding well see it |
| 14:40.49 | raster | your sods are too dry |
| 14:40.53 | raster | add more water |
| 14:41.39 | ewanm89_laptop | Um, I'm having a similar problem with installing monotone, I have boost_filesystem, I can see it, you even have 2 versions to choose from. |
| 14:41.40 | Basheri | or alcohol |
| 14:42.13 | koen | tri: what makes you thing OE isn't a full buildsystem? |
| 14:42.39 | raster | koen: oe is good |
| 14:42.49 | raster | except its nowhere near as convenient for developers as scratchbox :( |
| 14:43.08 | koen | raster: that's why we say it's a build tool, not a development tool |
| 14:43.26 | raster | :) |
| 14:43.39 | koen | it's source -> installable package :) |
| 14:43.43 | balrog-kun | tri: haven't you asked the same an hour ago and were answered? |
| 14:43.47 | raster | yeah |
| 14:43.48 | raster | i know |
| 14:43.54 | raster | i guess i'm a developer |
| 14:44.06 | raster | so i think with my myopic view of the world |
| 14:44.20 | koen | raster: we do want to improve on making it more developer friednly a la scratchbox, but that's somewhere in the middle of the TODO |
| 14:44.39 | raster | of trying to make the path between ./configure; make; make install; ... make; make install; .. make; make install |
| 14:44.47 | *** part/#openmoko herbyle (n=pascal@p54A349CB.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 14:45.00 | *** join/#openmoko Q_Continuum (n=Q@rrcs-67-52-219-78.west.biz.rr.com) |
| 14:45.25 | raster | (ad nauseum 0 with running your software in between the make installs) as simple and streamlines and fast as possible |
| 14:45.42 | raster | being able to use scratchobx |
| 14:45.52 | raster | then nfs mount the sb /usr/local |
| 14:45.55 | raster | it heavenly |
| 14:45.56 | raster | is |
| 14:46.03 | koen | bitbake <foo> -c compile -f ; bitbake foo -c package_write is the closest thing to fast rebuilds |
| 14:46.16 | koen | raster: btw, OE can generate scratchbox toolchains :) |
| 14:46.35 | koen | so openmoko can hand that to scratchbox die-hards |
| 14:47.17 | ravan | does the BUILD machine also need to have dummy_hcd and gadgetfs support in the kernel(headers?) for usb networking to work? |
| 14:47.24 | raster | sb just is so... well.. convienent |
| 14:47.27 | raster | and being a developer |
| 14:47.39 | raster | i'm all about laziness and convenience |
| 14:47.42 | *** join/#openmoko herbyle (n=pascal@p54A349CB.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 14:47.49 | raster | when it comes to stuff i'm not actually coding on |
| 14:47.49 | raster | :) |
| 14:48.01 | koen | raster: http://dominion.kabel.utwente.nl/koen/cms/using-openembedded-toolchains-in-scratchbox |
| 14:49.04 | ScaredyCat | ... you're trying to force me to use debian system ... aren't you ... :. |
| 14:49.06 | *** part/#openmoko DynWind (n=vikas@zresearch.com) |
| 14:49.19 | raster | koen: bookmarked for my weekend pleasures :) |
| 14:49.48 | tri | i think rpath,t2 or opensde is much simpler to use then oe |
| 14:49.57 | koen | raster: I think that stuff like that will be available when the phones go on sale |
| 14:51.09 | raster | koen: :) |
| 14:51.31 | raster | koen: i can live without |
| 14:51.48 | raster | i originally did my cross-compiling years ago with custom shell scripts |
| 14:52.06 | raster | i just became lazy and spoiled by SB |
| 14:52.08 | raster | :) |
| 14:53.08 | ravan | balrog-kun: does the BUILD machine also need to have dummy_hcd and gadgetfs support in the kernel(headers?) for usb networking to work? |
| 14:53.29 | raster | not for building |
| 14:54.22 | ScaredyCat | this build is retarded |
| 14:54.57 | *** join/#openmoko Rac0r (n=rac0r@p54AA4FD4.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 14:55.17 | koen | raster: fwiw, scratchbox has some weirdness with python since the interpreter runs on the host and the modules in the emulator, so beware of that |
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| 14:56.02 | raster | koen: doesnt bother me. i'm pytho-free |
| 14:56.03 | raster | :) |
| 14:56.09 | raster | python |
| 14:56.21 | koen | cool |
| 14:56.28 | koen | python makes my eyes bleed |
| 14:56.30 | ScaredyCat | someone, please, explain why it can't find the f%^&%^&ing gelf.h file, it's there! I can see it.... WTF |
| 14:56.31 | koen | m4 too |
| 14:56.58 | raster | some people say my C makes peoples eyes bleed too |
| 14:57.01 | raster | but hey |
| 14:57.07 | raster | i like my bnleeding! |
| 14:57.08 | raster | :) |
| 14:58.02 | balrog-kun | ravan: yes, the build machine has to have the right kernel headers |
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| 14:58.26 | koen | raster: I saw your 'compact c' demo file a few years ago :) |
| 14:58.46 | raster | compact c? |
| 14:59.50 | koen | it seemed you thought line endings were overrated |
| 15:00.05 | raster | hmm |
| 15:00.07 | raster | that was me? |
| 15:00.18 | raster | i tend to like lots of lines |
| 15:00.23 | raster | except in cetain situations |
| 15:00.26 | raster | sometimes i do |
| 15:00.32 | raster | a = 1; b = 2; c = 3; |
| 15:00.35 | raster | or |
| 15:00.37 | xkr47 | http://xkr47.outerspace.dyndns.org/tmp/myself.c |
| 15:00.44 | raster | x = a + y; w = a * y; |
| 15:00.46 | raster | etc. |
| 15:00.52 | *** join/#openmoko j_ack (n=j_ack@p508D878A.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 15:00.58 | raster | if i have groups of assignments that are simple arithmetic |
| 15:01.11 | ravan | balrog-kun: the build and lab machines are different in my case |
| 15:01.35 | ravan | balrog-kun: lab is running qemu and has the support |
| 15:01.40 | raster | unless this was some throw-away bit of c i did for giggles |
| 15:01.44 | raster | :) |
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| 15:04.03 | balrog-kun | ravan: it is quite obvious that the build machine has to have the appropriate build environment, and the host machine the host environment |
| 15:04.15 | balrog-kun | headers are part of build environment |
| 15:08.28 | *** part/#openmoko tri (n=Richter@pd95b2df8.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
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| 15:37.26 | *** join/#openmoko Tetraden (n=FU-gibts@Qc686.q.pppool.de) |
| 15:37.28 | Tetraden | hi |
| 15:37.53 | mtnbkr-laptop | hello. |
| 15:40.06 | mtnbkr-laptop | it's quiet in here. :) I just stopped by to pass the time until July 9th when I can order my openmoko Neo1973 phone. :) |
| 15:40.42 | nox-Hand | Right |
| 15:40.45 | SpeedEvil | :) |
| 15:40.47 | nox-Hand | Hunger strike |
| 15:40.49 | Tetraden | is there any alternative mirror for the win32 emu? |
| 15:41.28 | *** join/#openmoko Rac0r_ (n=rac0r@p54AA57DF.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 15:42.14 | Tetraden | the one in the wiki is down and i need it so bad :/ |
| 15:42.53 | Elrond | Tetraden - *duck* Run linux inside virtualbox, run qemu in linux. ;o) |
| 15:42.54 | Tetraden | or does anyone have it and can send it to me? |
| 15:43.06 | Tetraden | lol :D |
| 15:43.17 | Elrond | Or even better: Install linux. |
| 15:43.27 | balrog-kun | run linux in qemu and qemu in it :) |
| 15:44.10 | Tetraden | maybe i could finally reinstall my kernel package so the real linux is running again |
| 15:44.14 | Elrond | balrog-kun - That was basicly my comment already. ;-) |
| 15:44.29 | balrog-kun | well, yes :p |
| 15:44.32 | koen | balrog-kun: http://bugs.openembedded.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2589 has a patch for qemu cvs that is supposed to fix segfaults on 64bit, could you have a look at it? |
| 15:44.52 | balrog-kun | one moment |
| 15:45.12 | koen | takes as much time as you want :) |
| 15:45.16 | Tetraden | but i'm to stupid to figure out how to install a .deb package from my harddrive :S |
| 15:45.52 | balrog-kun | koen: oh it's for qemu-user |
| 15:45.58 | summatusmentis | Tetraden: .deb is already on your HD? dpkg -i <path to .deb> |
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| 15:46.28 | Tetraden | okay, so i will try |
| 15:46.51 | Tetraden | I'll be back... ;) |
| 15:46.51 | jserv2 | Tetraden: hi! |
| 15:46.52 | Elrond | Tetraden - "dpkg -i foo.deb" |
| 15:47.32 | jserv2 | Tetraden: I am sorry that the host for win32 build of qemu-neo1973 is offline at the moment. |
| 15:47.59 | Tetraden | ah lol, you are this jserv :) |
| 15:48.17 | balrog-kun | koen: afaik some of these patches were discussed on qemu-devel numerous times |
| 15:48.52 | balrog-kun | i just don't pay attention to the qemu-user part (and imho the glibc locale generation should be rewritten to not require qemu or execution on host, which is a design flaw) |
| 15:49.05 | Tetraden | jserv2: its no big problem. I just want to migrate the data from my old WM2003 already. |
| 15:49.17 | koen | balrog-kun: glibc should be rewritten :) |
| 15:49.30 | koen | it's drepper-ware |
| 15:49.30 | Tetraden | but first of all i will reinstall my kernel |
| 15:49.34 | jserv2 | Tetraden: ok, thanks for your interest. :-) |
| 15:49.35 | balrog-kun | heh |
| 15:50.02 | Tetraden | jserv2: maybe you have the zip on your HDD? |
| 15:50.38 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Buying_Interest_List]] [[MokoMakefile]] |
| 15:50.50 | jserv2 | Tetraden: However, I am confident to set up the host this week again. And, the host is planned to be used for OE/OM mirror in Taiwan. |
| 15:51.46 | jserv2 | Tetraden: yes, I have one, but not for my laptop. I have to go to my office to prepare win32 build. |
| 15:51.52 | balrog-kun | does someone know if we want to support both PDU and TEXT modes in gsmd for SMS handling? |
| 15:52.08 | *** join/#openmoko neocoret1ch (n=neocoret@gw.transporeon-hq.com) |
| 15:53.48 | guaqua | jserv2: i can host the files |
| 15:55.10 | Tetraden | it would be great if you could upload it somewhere along the way and post it temporarily into the wiki. |
| 15:55.33 | *** join/#openmoko Freed (n=jecsar@mac33-2-82-225-98-209.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 15:55.48 | jserv2 | Tetraden: good idea. Thanks! |
| 15:56.08 | Elrond | balrog-kun - Is TEXT used at all? |
| 15:56.48 | balrog-kun | Elrond: on init, gsmd switches to TEXT, but later there are some comments about PDU |
| 15:56.56 | Tetraden | my favourite webhoster is www.yousendit.com because the reciever don't have to wait |
| 15:57.05 | Elrond | balrog-kun - Ahh, okay. |
| 15:57.23 | SpeedEvil | Tetraden: p2p is another option |
| 15:57.53 | Elrond | If it's large, p2p is even better. Look, what OOo does for example. |
| 15:57.57 | Tetraden | SpeedEvil: Yes, but a bit slow i think |
| 15:57.59 | ewanm89_laptop | Or run your own webserver? |
| 15:58.17 | Elrond | Tetraden - It's faster in parts. |
| 15:58.34 | Elrond | If the number of people serving it is enough, of course. |
| 15:58.38 | balrog-kun | Tetraden: it's not like windows users can't build qemu and linux users can |
| 15:58.39 | Tetraden | depending on what you want to download |
| 15:59.29 | balrog-kun | i don't see why you would have to wait for the binaries |
| 16:00.45 | *** part/#openmoko jsmanrique (n=jsmanriq@cme-212-89-8-169.telecable.es) |
| 16:00.51 | Tetraden | because i don't want an ordinary ARM emulation, but the Neo1973 tree of qemu and I don't know any other way to get it on win (sorry) |
| 16:00.54 | *** join/#openmoko LuitvD (n=luitvd@beigetower/luitvd) |
| 16:01.26 | balrog-kun | mostly same way as on linux |
| 16:01.56 | LuitvD | hi all |
| 16:02.01 | balrog-kun | or any other system for that matter :) |
| 16:02.14 | LuitvD[eating] | (gone again) |
| 16:02.30 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@141.80-202-161.nextgentel.com) |
| 16:03.12 | Tetraden | and (even if you will hang me for this) I don't really want to deal with qemu for just trying this os. |
| 16:04.06 | koen | you can try the linux OS without qemu |
| 16:04.36 | Tetraden | lol, other vm software :P |
| 16:04.50 | Tetraden | hmm, brb, 2 minutes |
| 16:04.52 | SpeedEvil | You don't need to do emu |
| 16:05.00 | SpeedEvil | ytou can just run it on x86 |
| 16:11.18 | aloril | (script) openmoko-community: Sean Moss-Pultz <sean at openmoko.com> Re: An alternative gaming top case |
| 16:11.51 | kiney_ | counter |
| 16:11.52 | aloril | (last update 2007-07-02T06:19) http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter 60% for P1 in 6 days 19:48:08 (6.825±1.0 days) (1662;242) |
| 16:11.55 | Tetraden | re |
| 16:12.34 | ewon | er |
| 16:12.52 | SpeedEvil | a7 |
| 16:15.52 | koen | with a big thumb sized button saying "enable bluetooth gps" |
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| 16:18.19 | PBeck | hi |
| 16:18.42 | ewanm89_laptop | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:24.04 | ravan | balrog-kun: do you make your own openmoko-image ? |
| 16:24.30 | balrog-kun | ravan: i used only the ones from buildhost so far |
| 16:26.58 | *** join/#openmoko empty_mind (n=orion@59.176.111.177) |
| 16:27.35 | *** join/#openmoko BenC_ (n=bcollins@collinsap1.phunnypharm.org) |
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| 16:33.06 | Basheri | koen: same :P |
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| 16:47.51 | don-o | using the neo as a bluetooth gps device is kind of a neat idea. |
| 16:48.15 | *** join/#openmoko some1___ (n=some1@p54A0D8D0.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 16:48.20 | ScaredyCat | it's an agps device.... |
| 16:48.42 | galexande | i have a dream |
| 16:48.44 | galexande | that that doesn't matter |
| 16:49.09 | *** join/#openmoko waecky (n=waecky@p549CEF56.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 16:50.18 | SpeedEvil | ScaredyCat: At teh moment the A bit is not functional. |
| 16:56.20 | *** join/#openmoko ravan (n=ravan@202.140.50.194) |
| 16:56.39 | ScaredyCat | ... k... |
| 16:56.55 | ravan | balrog-kun: sorry for troubling you again.. but have you faced ---> gadget_read: event error: 22 |
| 16:57.42 | ravan | this comesup when i do a usb_add gadget:1 |
| 16:58.05 | balrog-kun | ravan: lemme check what i get when i do usb_add gadget:1 |
| 16:59.00 | Elrond | don-o - neo-as-bt-gps: pavel does that, seems to work. |
| 16:59.20 | balrog-kun | ravan: yes, i'm getting the same |
| 16:59.25 | balrog-kun | it can be ignored |
| 17:00.02 | koen | Elrond: yes, but I want to use a non-hackish way with a good UI |
| 17:00.58 | Elrond | koen - I think, pavel started a python based thingy or so... |
| 17:01.05 | koen | Elrond: the problem with all the stuff that pavelm is doing that it is either the wrong way or flawed by design |
| 17:01.06 | ravan | balrog-kun: ok. one last question.. do you know if any userspace programs are responsible for part of the usb networking communication(on the neo1973 side)? |
| 17:01.42 | happycube | i think thats mostly usb gadget drivers |
| 17:01.53 | happycube | with usual ifconfig |
| 17:02.08 | Elrond | koen - I haven't looked too closely. I never tried to run gllin on "my" neo. I probably should, so I know, that the gps chip works 100& instead of knowing, that it works 80% ;o) |
| 17:02.29 | ravan | happycube: the networking works when i use the rootfs from the build server(and with my kernel image), but not with my own rootfs image |
| 17:02.47 | happycube | how's pavel doing it? |
| 17:02.51 | happycube | odd |
| 17:03.05 | balrog-kun | ravan: afaik there's nothing more that ifconfig in the userspace |
| 17:03.26 | ravan | balrog-kun: ok |
| 17:03.28 | balrog-kun | ravan: hmm, there may be some ifup scripts that sets the IP cause it's always the same, not sure |
| 17:03.59 | ravan | balrog-kun: ip config is in /etc/network/interfaces. i checked that it is right |
| 17:04.06 | ravan | (on the device side) |
| 17:04.29 | balrog-kun | ravan: hmm i'm not getting the error 22 thing if i do usb_add gadget:1 after OpenMoko is fully booted |
| 17:04.55 | balrog-kun | only two times "s3c_udc_handle_packet: EP0 overrun" |
| 17:05.12 | ravan | balrog-kun: did networking work when you got the error 22 thing? |
| 17:05.25 | Elrond | <-- heads home. |
| 17:05.29 | balrog-kun | ravan: i'll try again |
| 17:05.33 | ravan | balrog-kun: thanks |
| 17:07.34 | Sup3rkiddo | just wondering, any word on the usage policies about the GPS daemon, isnt it closed source?, |
| 17:07.59 | koen | it's closed source at the moment |
| 17:08.37 | koen | everybody with a neo should help the sphyrna dudes: http://projects.linuxtogo.org/plugins/scmsvn/viewcvs.php/?root=sphyrna |
| 17:10.11 | Sup3rkiddo | koen, will the agpsd API eventually find its way in libgsmd?, forgive me for the weird question |
| 17:10.31 | ScaredyCat | koen, you mean with a faster website? |
| 17:11.24 | balrog-kun | ravan: i tried like 8 times now at different points during the booting and didn't get that error 22 again :p only the first time |
| 17:11.26 | koen | Sup3rkiddo: afaik agpsd only needs a network connection |
| 17:11.37 | ravan | balrog-kun: :( |
| 17:11.52 | balrog-kun | and networking was okay |
| 17:12.21 | Sup3rkiddo | koen, so there wont be any API for apgsd?, would be swell if it becomes open |
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| 17:12.55 | balrog-kun | ravan: did you also set up /etc/network/interfaces on the host so that the ip is always assigned? |
| 17:13.06 | balrog-kun | i didn't do that |
| 17:15.57 | *** join/#openmoko ravan (n=ravan@202.140.50.194) |
| 17:16.05 | ravan | crashed |
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| 17:21.10 | ScaredyCat | ,,,,,,,,,,,, |
| 17:21.50 | balrog-kun | ravan: did you also set up /etc/network/interfaces on the host so that the ip is always assigned? |
| 17:22.49 | ravan | balrog-kun: no. i run ifconfig after the usb0 interface comes up |
| 17:23.35 | balrog-kun | ravan: ok, that's what i do too |
| 17:23.38 | ravan | balrog-kun: btw, the gadged_read error disappeared, but there are three EP0 overruns. it only works on my machine where are are two |
| 17:24.07 | ScaredyCat | I really wish there was some indication of progress on a build.. (in terms of %age) |
| 17:24.35 | ravan | ScaredyCat: me too.. the whole image took 7 hours today! |
| 17:24.38 | balrog-kun | ravan: hmm, seems the whole usb-gadget support will need some more work |
| 17:25.02 | ScaredyCat | mine still isn't complete ravan - it fell over after 5 hours |
| 17:25.22 | ScaredyCat | bluez-utils atm :> |
| 17:25.32 | balrog-kun | i don't know if it's worth improving the kernel side support or it's better to keep working around the annoyances |
| 17:25.33 | ravan | balrog-kun: it works when i use the openmoko-devel-image which i build or the one from build host |
| 17:25.58 | balrog-kun | ravan: which is the one that doesn't work? |
| 17:26.01 | CM | ScaredyCat: Mine failed 3 times during the 7.5h build, but it was always svn-now failures |
| 17:26.09 | ravan | balrog-kun: would using a version after 2.6.20 on the host help? |
| 17:26.10 | CM | Just had to restart it and it worked |
| 17:26.39 | ScaredyCat | I'm still fighting with gelf.h existing in a parallel universe |
| 17:26.43 | balrog-kun | ravan: i don't think so, the gadgetfs driver had no significant changes for like 3 years |
| 17:27.45 | balrog-kun | i'm pretty sure i'm one of below 10 users that use it, globally |
| 17:28.15 | balrog-kun | things are rarely broken this way in the kernel |
| 17:28.27 | SpeedEvil | Isn't it used for gumstix? |
| 17:28.58 | balrog-kun | SpeedEvil: i'm not sure, but gadgetfs is not used normally, |
| 17:29.15 | balrog-kun | it's marked as experimental in menuconfig and it definitely is |
| 17:29.24 | SpeedEvil | Sup3rkiddo: look on http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Hardware:AGPS |
| 17:29.39 | ravan | balrog-kun: the one built with the following diff to openmoko-image.bb ---> http://rafb.net/p/TBVHWP48.html |
| 17:29.41 | Sup3rkiddo | SpeedEvil, doint it |
| 17:29.46 | Sup3rkiddo | *doing |
| 17:30.28 | balrog-kun | ravan: hmm, should really matter. did you change the guest kernel config? |
| 17:30.40 | ravan | balrog-kun: no |
| 17:30.53 | ravan | balrog-kun: just that diff and then bitbake openmoko-image |
| 17:30.58 | ravan | (not devel-image) |
| 17:31.28 | balrog-kun | ravan: are you getting any NAND read errors when linux scans the rootfs during boot for the first time? |
| 17:31.47 | *** join/#openmoko fabiand (n=fabiand@p548939C5.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 17:31.47 | balrog-kun | well, even this should really matter |
| 17:32.59 | ravan | balrog-kun: no. no erros |
| 17:33.33 | ravan | balrog-kun: you mean it matters or it doesn't? |
| 17:33.54 | balrog-kun | oops, shouldn't |
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| 17:34.30 | ravan | balrog-kun: that's what i thought |
| 17:35.22 | ravan | balrog-kun: is there any other way to mount the neo file system on the host? |
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| 17:36.05 | balrog-kun | ravan: no easy way that i know of |
| 17:36.09 | SpeedEvil | NFS? |
| 17:36.19 | SpeedEvil | sshfs? |
| 17:36.21 | balrog-kun | unless you want to boot from the SD and use a filesystem like ext2 |
| 17:36.35 | SpeedEvil | Oh |
| 17:37.17 | thomasg_gpm | I wonder if nxclient/nxserver runs on the neo without optimizing |
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| 17:37.59 | ravan | balrog-kun: ok, i have to go home and sleep now. thanks for the help |
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| 17:39.43 | cesarb | ScaredyCat: sorry for being afk earlier, but I fixed the libelf issue a few hours ago, and sent the fix to rwhitby. Just do a mokomakefile update. |
| 17:40.27 | ScaredyCat | ahhh much goodness cesarb .... |
| 17:40.31 | ScaredyCat | thanks |
| 17:40.55 | cesarb | ScaredyCat: the problem is not that it isn't there, is that it is there (it's finding the libelf from your host filesystem, which shouldn't be used in a cross-compile, and a sanity check notices it's doing something wrong and stops the build) |
| 17:41.18 | cesarb | ScaredyCat: btw, unless you update your mokomakefile first, you have to run the update twice to get the patch |
| 17:41.44 | ScaredyCat | I'll redo the build completely ... just to make it clean |
| 17:42.08 | ScaredyCat | I have 7 hours to kill.. :P |
| 17:42.14 | cesarb | ScaredyCat: no need to, just a update will be enough |
| 17:42.35 | ScaredyCat | ... but I started a manual build.... |
| 17:42.46 | ScaredyCat | 'official' one... |
| 17:43.10 | ScaredyCat | I suppse I could grab the makefile now.. |
| 17:43.15 | ScaredyCat | that should work... |
| 17:44.26 | ScaredyCat | I'll wget it, update and then kick off the build.... at least some of the stuff should be downloaded... it'd be really nice if it downloaded everything it needed, then started the build..... |
| 17:45.03 | ScaredyCat | that way I could grab all the tar.gz's svn stuff etc before going on the road and compile it any time |
| 17:45.32 | cesarb | ScaredyCat: you'll have to copy your downloaded files to the "sources" directory (which is usually created when downloading the first package; you can create it manually) |
| 17:47.02 | ScaredyCat | yah I have 416 in there atm |
| 17:47.23 | ScaredyCat | ctually half that.. |
| 17:47.30 | ScaredyCat | forgot about the md5's |
| 17:47.55 | ScaredyCat | ok, I'll be back in about an hour cesarb .... |
| 17:48.02 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@141.80-202-161.nextgentel.com) |
| 17:48.12 | ScaredyCat | I';ll kick off the makefile build and let you know, if you are about... |
| 17:49.00 | ScaredyCat | are you in the US ? |
| 17:49.03 | ScaredyCat | ... |
| 17:49.22 | ScaredyCat | k, bbl.. ta much cesarb ... |
| 17:51.18 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Wishlist:Accessories]] [[Wish_List_-_Hardware]] [[Buying_Interest_List]] |
| 17:51.22 | cesarb | ScaredyCat: Brazil |
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| 18:07.32 | nobody96 | moin |
| 18:13.44 | juri_ | moinmoin. |
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| 18:24.51 | zecke | alp: a hint: andersca can't run away |
| 18:25.50 | alp | zecke: i find poking for review/landing works much better in the late evening |
| 18:25.59 | alp | (uk time) |
| 18:26.21 | alp | kind of patch-o-clock |
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| 19:12.11 | nobody96 | damn network issues... |
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| 19:28.12 | ScaredyCat | ./. |
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| 19:41.27 | balrog-kun | pH5: ping. have you done any gsmd hacking since the multiline support patches, in particular anyting sms related? |
| 19:41.50 | balrog-kun | pH5: also do you know whether we want to support sms'es through TEXT or PDU or both? |
| 19:43.15 | pH5 | balrog-kun: no, but I'd be very happy if anybody could point out why my patches hang the usock code after a successful multi-line reply. |
| 19:44.15 | pH5 | iirc, he wanted to support both. but that memory is kind of vague. |
| 19:44.17 | balrog-kun | pH5: ok, i will be trying to add SMSes so figuring this out will be part of it |
| 19:44.21 | Elrond | pH5 - Hi! |
| 19:45.10 | pH5 | balrog-kun: great. sms support is the most important missing part for me, but I lost interest a bit because there was nobody to communicate with about this. |
| 19:45.29 | pH5 | hi Elrond. any news insights into the hammerhead? |
| 19:45.33 | pH5 | s/news/new/ |
| 19:46.13 | Elrond | pH5 - Only few... I'm just commiting some bits into sphyrna. |
| 19:49.08 | *** join/#openmoko gdiebel (n=gdiebel@adsl-69-217-146-185.dsl.mdsnwi.ameritech.net) |
| 19:51.18 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Buying_Interest_List]] |
| 19:54.09 | Elrond | pH5 - decode.py can now read your longtrace.txt :-) |
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| 20:15.38 | kiney_ | counter |
| 20:15.38 | aloril | (last update 2007-07-02T06:19) http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter 60% for P1 in 6 days 15:44:21 (6.656±1.0 days) (1663;242) |
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| 20:39.33 | summatusmentis | does anyone know of the link for openmoko on the treo 650? |
| 20:39.50 | koen | planet.gnome.org |
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| 20:41.16 | summatusmentis | thanks koen |
| 20:41.18 | CIA-17 | openmoko: 03andrew * r2356 10/trunk/src/host/qemu-neo1973/ (58 files in 11 dirs): Merge changes from cvs.savannah.nongnu.org:/sources/qemu. |
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| 20:48.08 | CIA-17 | openmoko: 03andrew * r2357 10/trunk/src/host/qemu-neo1973/ (gnokiigsm/at-emulator.c target-arm/cpu.h target-arm/helper.c): |
| 20:48.08 | CIA-17 | openmoko: Set default ARM System Config reset value. |
| 20:48.08 | CIA-17 | openmoko: Report correct caller numbers. |
| 20:48.32 | *** join/#openmoko robydrupo (n=robydrup@ppp-151-158.25-151.libero.it) |
| 20:48.42 | daMaestro | is phase X going to be multitouch? |
| 20:48.53 | daMaestro | phase 1,2,3 etc |
| 20:49.25 | guaqua | if you write the software to emulate multitouch capabilities |
| 20:49.45 | SpeedEvil | 2 = no |
| 20:50.32 | *** join/#openmoko Tetraden (n=FU-gibts@Qc686.q.pppool.de) |
| 20:50.36 | Tetraden | hi |
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| 20:54.10 | robydrupo | what language do you use to develop openmoko? |
| 20:54.11 | aloril | robydrupo: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (Hopefully this link answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) |
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| 21:00.08 | Moo^^ | robydrupo: C |
| 21:00.33 | guaqua | there are python bindings available |
| 21:03.20 | cesarb | Is it just me that's getting an error compiling the latest and greatest qemu-neo1973? |
| 21:03.23 | cesarb | gcc-3.4: pl031.o: Arquivo ou diretório inexistente |
| 21:03.40 | cesarb | looks like a file is missing from r2356 from 15 min ago... |
| 21:04.36 | daMaestro | cesarb, i've had issues on i386 > 2344 |
| 21:04.44 | daMaestro | and 2355 built on x86_64 for me |
| 21:04.51 | daMaestro | have not tried 2356 |
| 21:05.02 | cesarb | daMaestro: x86_64 here |
| 21:07.03 | balrog-kun | cesarb: no, the file was forgotten from the last ocmmit |
| 21:07.34 | balrog-kun | i wonder where it got lost, i triple checked to make sure nothing is left out this time... |
| 21:08.43 | CIA-17 | openmoko: 03andrew * r2358 10/trunk/src/host/qemu-neo1973/hw/ (jazz_led.c pl031.c): Add files missing in last merge. |
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| 21:20.38 | edistar | it may sound stupid but as building the dev environment, is there a virtual machine image that I can just install? |
| 21:20.41 | edistar | I mean run.. |
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| 21:35.38 | aloril | (script) planet: Jouston Huang: First week in OpenMoko http://jouston.no-ip.com/archives/000225.html |
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| 21:39.06 | zecke | mokoNinja nice |
| 21:40.41 | woglinde | zecke lol |
| 21:40.46 | woglinde | yes I read it too |
| 21:40.49 | zecke | http://www.youtube.com/user/mokoNinja |
| 21:44.54 | *** part/#openmoko Freed (n=jecsar@mac33-2-82-225-98-209.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 21:50.58 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Neo1973_compatible_cellphone_providers]] [[GPS]] [[Hardware:AGPS]] [[Gpsd]] |
| 21:51.16 | thomasg_gpm | zecke, yeah, videos! |
| 21:53.29 | pH5 | heh, bsg slideshow on gta01 |
| 21:53.38 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@qiqinebs.chi.il.us) |
| 21:53.46 | woglinde | mickeyl is now famous |
| 21:53.49 | woglinde | hahaahaaa |
| 21:54.00 | don-o | the soundtrack is annoying as hell |
| 21:54.15 | don-o | FIC headquarters. whoho. |
| 21:54.45 | zecke | ninja's :) |
| 21:55.00 | don-o | woah. blueprints. |
| 21:57.29 | aevin | nice work, ninja! :-D |
| 21:57.57 | don-o | mokoNinja++ |
| 21:59.29 | miip | hehehe droptest video is funny |
| 22:06.08 | *** part/#openmoko charkins (n=casey@pdpc/supporter/active/charkins) |
| 22:07.27 | edistar | anyone managed to build the mokomakefile in debian lenny? |
| 22:07.30 | ynezz | hm funny...like 2 weeks ago someone pirated TV broadcasting of major(national) TV in Czechia - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MzaN2x8qXcM |
| 22:07.36 | ynezz | that's funny :) |
| 22:07.57 | *** join/#openmoko mosno (n=bmc@203-173-40-74.perm.iinet.net.au) |
| 22:08.37 | edistar | whats funny about that? |
| 22:09.26 | woglinde | they not really hacked the tv |
| 22:09.31 | woglinde | they hacked a webcam |
| 22:09.37 | ynezz | yep |
| 22:09.38 | woglinde | which shows the pictures |
| 22:10.19 | edistar | okey..? |
| 22:11.54 | Tetraden | the funny thing is: it was live on tv this morning |
| 22:12.07 | ynezz | edistar: well it would be better if you pastebin.com your problem... |
| 22:13.39 | don-o | now we could use an actual counter bot. |
| 22:13.40 | *** join/#openmoko besonen_mobile2 (n=besonen_@71-220-233-253.eugn.qwest.net) |
| 22:15.00 | ynezz | and one of the most discussed topic here in Czechia and Poland is if we should have US radar/missiles here, so I find that nuclear explosion really funny :p |
| 22:16.19 | woglinde | ynezz you know against whom this missile would be used |
| 22:16.27 | ynezz | russia! |
| 22:16.42 | woglinde | yes |
| 22:17.06 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@141.80-202-161.nextgentel.com) |
| 22:17.11 | ewon | counter |
| 22:17.11 | aloril | (last update 2007-07-02T06:19) http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter 60% for P1 in 6 days 13:42:48 (6.571±1.0 days) (1664;242) |
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| 22:23.27 | nox-Hand | Would it disturb you to find an application called "PonyFrog" preinstalled on your PC? |
| 22:23.46 | Aria | Yes |
| 22:24.19 | nox-Hand | Aria: So did it me |
| 22:24.23 | nox-Hand | Just got my laptop |
| 22:24.33 | *** join/#openmoko amarsh04 (n=amarsh04@CPE-144-137-208-23.sa.bigpond.net.au) |
| 22:24.58 | paulproteus | Hmm, preinstalled? |
| 22:25.04 | balrog-kun | looks like most of the hardware in the iPhone is already implemented in qemu |
| 22:25.47 | woglinde | yes |
| 22:25.49 | woglinde | why not |
| 22:26.20 | summatusmentis | nox-Hand: kiddie game? |
| 22:26.33 | nox-Hand | summatusmentis: Something scienc´:| |
| 22:26.40 | woglinde | hm google doesnt find much about ponyfrog |
| 22:26.41 | nox-Hand | Preinstalled college apps |
| 22:26.51 | summatusmentis | lol, a science related tool called PonyFrong |
| 22:26.56 | summatusmentis | PonyFrog* |
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| 22:31.19 | *** part/#openmoko yveslu (n=yves@194.235.200.5) |
| 22:31.20 | ewon | have my superwaba app running on my Zire71 and my Vx |
| 22:31.24 | ewon | \o/ |
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| 22:50.01 | balrog-kun | yay, i got away with building gsmd in qemu, won't need to install the whole build environment shebang to hack gsmd |
| 22:50.18 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@141.80-202-161.nextgentel.com) |
| 22:50.26 | balrog-kun | much quicker and in a fraction of diskspace requierd by OE |
| 22:50.52 | woglinde | hm *sigh* |
| 22:51.00 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@141.80-202-161.nextgentel.com) |
| 22:51.04 | woglinde | alreay fixe bluez-tools with uclibc |
| 22:51.19 | woglinde | changing a kernel has ugly side affects |
| 22:51.24 | woglinde | +header |
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| 22:55.31 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@141.80-202-161.nextgentel.com) |
| 23:07.12 | Elrond | BTW: Is the rtc working for anyone on the real hardware? |
| 23:07.22 | Elrond | (I assume, it's only a software problem) |
| 23:07.36 | dietricha | will neo1973 support external keyboard? |
| 23:07.55 | *** join/#openmoko linux_galore (n=Richard@dsl-220-253-67-149.NSW.netspace.net.au) |
| 23:08.04 | happycube | yup - bt keyboards and ext. powered usb |
| 23:08.08 | Elrond | dietricha - BT keyboards, yes. I think, that was tested even. |
| 23:08.23 | dietricha | Elrond: ok, thanks! |
| 23:08.30 | linux_galore | YO! |
| 23:09.11 | Elrond | Oh, yeah, usb ones, if you have a powered hub. |
| 23:09.20 | Elrond | ... I think, _that_ part was not tested. |
| 23:09.43 | *** join/#openmoko acidjazz_ (i=acidjazz@notchill.com) |
| 23:09.51 | acidjazz_ | 300bux eh? |
| 23:09.51 | aloril | acidjazz_: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (Hopefully this link answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) |
| 23:10.13 | happycube | yup, 300bux |
| 23:10.37 | acidjazz_ | any other supported device comin out soon? |
| 23:10.43 | acidjazz_ | like w/ a qwerty :) |
| 23:11.16 | balrog-kun | Elrond: there at least three RTC's :) |
| 23:11.30 | Elrond | balrog-kun - three?! |
| 23:11.41 | Elrond | balrog-kun - In the SoC and the PMU... which one else? |
| 23:11.56 | balrog-kun | Elrond: in the modem there's one more |
| 23:12.56 | balrog-kun | the modem, iirc even has a separate usb controller and more stuff :) |
| 23:13.16 | cesarb | balrog-kun: don't forget the fact that the GPS can also give you the time ;-) |
| 23:13.50 | balrog-kun | cesarb: oh, yes, and maybe it even has a whole SoC in it :p |
| 23:13.59 | balrog-kun | but we won't know |
| 23:14.23 | Elrond | Well, according to our findings, it's mid-dumb. |
| 23:14.38 | Elrond | balrog-kun - Huh, the gsm modem has an RTC?! |
| 23:14.46 | Elrond | ... and usb? |
| 23:15.00 | balrog-kun | Elrond: btw. do you have an idea abotu how to emulate the GPS at this point already? |
| 23:15.06 | balrog-kun | Elrond: yeah, an entire ARM based SoC |
| 23:15.17 | balrog-kun | but no MMU |
| 23:15.44 | happycube | that way they could make a usb-based data plugin... not that anyone would buy a gprs-only unit now |
| 23:16.59 | Elrond | balrog-kun - We have some ideas on the gps chip... but writing an emulator is way beyond our ideas... |
| 23:17.51 | balrog-kun | Elrond: is there many possible messages that we can send *to* the GPS to which it must respond? |
| 23:18.24 | balrog-kun | we could just hardcode some responses and output some other messages hardcoded in the emulator, without really understanding what they mean |
| 23:18.37 | *** join/#openmoko mzb (n=ubernut@ppp108-88.static.internode.on.net) |
| 23:19.08 | Elrond | balrog-kun - Hmm, a few bunches, yes... |
| 23:19.18 | Elrond | Like 20 or so in both directions. |
| 23:19.29 | balrog-kun | i see :/ |
| 23:20.40 | Elrond | I can extract some blobs... but writing an emulator is not yet on our list. |
| 23:20.57 | Elrond | ... it might of course also help, because we could feed gllin with fake data and see, how it reacts. |
| 23:21.38 | balrog-kun | yeah, and actually not understanding the protocol doesn't necesarily make the emulation harder |
| 23:22.07 | Elrond | hehe. |
| 23:22.15 | balrog-kun | because we don't parse the requests, we just hardcode the responses and have a good excuse for lack of GPS logic |
| 23:23.02 | *** join/#openmoko mzb (n=ubernut@ppp108-88.static.internode.on.net) |
| 23:24.35 | balrog-kun | heh, we could simulate funny thing like a configuration of satellites that would be seen from outter space :) |
| 23:24.49 | Elrond | *G* |
| 23:25.07 | balrog-kun | or satellites having speeds higher than they normally should |
| 23:27.20 | Elrond | How hard would it be to connect a python program as the gps? |
| 23:27.47 | Elrond | Or a C program for that matter. |
| 23:27.53 | balrog-kun | rather trivial, no qemu code modification |
| 23:28.24 | Elrond | Well, the gps is on the second rs232... qemu emulates both? |
| 23:28.41 | balrog-kun | there are already hooks for connecting the serials to named pipes, ttys, serial ports, unix sockets or potentially python programs |
| 23:28.51 | balrog-kun | yup, and a third one too |
| 23:29.23 | Elrond | Ahh, great. |
| 23:30.23 | balrog-kun | i think the syntax is something like -serial vc -serial pipe:<somepipe> |
| 23:31.36 | balrog-kun | in particular it could be connected over ssh to a real hammerhead |
| 23:33.17 | *** join/#openmoko Moo^^ (n=moo@oul110-gw4.netplaza.fi) |
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| 23:34.15 | Elrond | hehe. :-)) |
| 23:34.53 | Elrond | Still the dream is a g_serial, that can redirect to another local serial port. ;-) |
| 23:35.54 | *** part/#openmoko ruimoreira (n=rmoreira@87-196-126-157.net.novis.pt) |
| 23:37.02 | *** join/#openmoko nop_ (n=nop@p54A0A108.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 23:42.01 | Elrond | balrog-kun - Well, the rtc in the pmu is probably the best option, because it has the connection to the battery. |
| 23:43.15 | balrog-kun | yeah |
| 23:43.41 | balrog-kun | i know there is a driver for it but i don't know if there are any userspace tools to tackle RTCs |
| 23:43.53 | balrog-kun | i know you can set the time in it from under u-boot |
| 23:44.38 | Elrond | Ahh. I haven't seen that part in u-boot |
| 23:45.19 | balrog-kun | humm, i should check maybe |
| 23:46.38 | balrog-kun | i may have remembered wrong |
| 23:47.20 | Elrond | Well, "I haven't seen" does not mean, that it's not there. Just means, I haven't yet looked closely. |
| 23:47.38 | Elrond | It starts to bother me, that the neo always has 1970. ;-) |
| 23:48.00 | cesarb | Elrond: true, it should be 1973 instead |
| 23:48.31 | Elrond | *lol* |
| 23:48.33 | Elrond | Yeah. |
| 23:49.13 | Elrond | Anyway. I need to go to bed now. :-) |
| 23:49.17 | Elrond | Good night people. |
| 23:50.46 | balrog-kun | good night |
| 23:51.18 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Neo1973_case_schematics]] [[Category:Neo1973_Hardware]] [[FAQ]] |
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