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| 00:21.39 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[OpenMoko_under_QEMU]] [[Bluetooth_Support]] [[Neo1973_Audio_Subsystem]] |
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| 00:51.19 | _ASK | hey |
| 00:54.33 | _ASK | a friend of mine brought a nec mobilepro 900c with him. it uses xscale PXA255 at 400 MHz, with 64 MB of RAM. Seems to be a very decent device. Do you think it could run open moko? |
| 00:55.27 | SuN | Why Openmoko? |
| 00:55.39 | SuN | Plain Angstrom would be more obvious. |
| 00:55.49 | _ASK | well, very few distros are focused on handhelds |
| 00:56.06 | _ASK | Angstrom. Ok. |
| 00:56.52 | SuN | The OpenMoko gui wouldn't make much sense on that screen, I think. Better off with a plain GPE desktop or perhaps IceWM or XFCE. |
| 00:57.07 | _ASK | well, that's the easy part, I guess |
| 00:57.17 | _ASK | what i have no idea is how to boot linux on that device |
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| 00:59.42 | SuN | That would be the hard part, yes. |
| 00:59.53 | SuN | WinCE HPC's are usually not very Linux-friendly. |
| 01:00.08 | balrog-kun | _ASK: if you manage the port linux kernel to it, OpenMoko should run without problems |
| 01:00.41 | balrog-kun | but tas SuN suggested there are nicer distros for handhelds that are not phones |
| 01:00.46 | balrog-kun | and even for phones |
| 01:02.02 | _ASK | well, the device is getting older and microsoft/nec doesn't seem to care about obsolecense; it's a big shame that there is less and less support each day; the hardware specs are quite decent, even for current devices |
| 01:02.46 | balrog-kun | the kernel already boots on the Nec mobilepro 7X0 and 8X0 models according to http://www.handhelds.org/moin/moin.cgi/SupportedHandheldSummary |
| 01:03.04 | balrog-kun | maybe the port wouldn't be very difficult then |
| 01:03.44 | _ASK | the problem is that 700/800 series are mips based and this one is ARM |
| 01:03.47 | SuN | Don't assume too much on just that :) |
| 01:03.56 | balrog-kun | oh |
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| 01:04.05 | SuN | Yep, HPC's are often very different. |
| 01:04.14 | _ASK | in theory, it would be easier as most devices today are ARM; and this one is XScale |
| 01:05.23 | balrog-kun | XScale is also quite popular in handhelds and widely supported by linux but there's always the peripheral chips and other thigns that need making drivers |
| 01:06.05 | SuN | There's one problem with these machines... if NEC wasn't kind enough to enable boot loader access, you can only boot it through WinCE hacks. |
| 01:06.44 | balrog-kun | that's what HaReT is for :) |
| 01:06.45 | SuN | And because of that, the newer the device is, the harder it gets (WinCE 2.11 had a fairly blatant bug that enabled Linux to boot from within CE, for instance). |
| 01:07.26 | _ASK | well, windows mobile and ce are essentially the same thing, isn't it? i've seen many bootloaders that work from whitin windows |
| 01:07.27 | SuN | Worth a try, I guess. |
| 01:07.49 | SuN | Yes, but they differ for every flavor (CE version and platform). |
| 01:10.05 | *** join/#openmoko kW_ (n=kwkw@prj-496-66.sfac.auckland.ac.nz) |
| 01:10.23 | SuN | And... after boot... there's power management :D |
| 01:10.45 | SuN | Meaning you'll have a working Linux machine, but it'll not suspend. |
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| 01:11.03 | SuN | Not trying to discourage you or anything, but be prepared for a long and difficult journey. |
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| 01:11.41 | neostrider | hello folks |
| 01:11.58 | _ASK | =) |
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| 03:16.08 | _ASK | what happens to the neo if your battery runs out of power? |
| 03:16.14 | _ASK | data gets lost? |
| 03:19.49 | aloril | _ASK: flash memory doesn't need power to keep its content |
| 03:21.23 | _ASK | there is a difference between losing the content of what is stored in ROM and RAM; many programs have a real time information that should be preserved even if the battery runs out of power |
| 03:21.33 | _ASK | for example, call log and things like that |
| 03:22.22 | aloril | keeping RAM content doesn't need much power, though why would call log be in RAM only? |
| 03:22.44 | _ASK | if you store a copy of certain parts of the RAM in the ROM, you create a non volatile file system, but it's awfuly slow |
| 03:23.26 | _ASK | i ask because checking things on the nec mobilepro, i noticed some neat trick that could be very useful in the neo |
| 03:23.58 | _ASK | it has two batteries: one standard, rechargeable |
| 03:24.12 | _ASK | the other is a standard watch coin cell |
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| 03:24.23 | _ASK | if the device runs out of power from the main battery |
| 03:24.32 | _ASK | it falls back to the coin battery |
| 03:25.12 | _ASK | this way you don't need to use flash to mantain the contents of critical parts of RAM and the device should work faster |
| 03:30.19 | aloril | well.. call log, gps trace logs, etc.. its quite little amount of memory really, doesn't take long to write that |
| 03:30.30 | aloril | IMHO |
| 03:30.37 | _ASK | belive me, it's a big issue |
| 03:30.49 | _ASK | when palm implemented the NVFS in the treo, performance got shitty |
| 03:32.12 | _ASK | most programs assume that the content of ram is protected |
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| 03:36.37 | __ASK | everything on the system assumes ram integrity. unless you do 1:1 backup of every change on the flash, there is no warranty that data will be ok |
| 03:41.46 | aloril | umm.. yes, but what (desktop) linux programs assumes that what is in ram is not lost? |
| 03:42.01 | aloril | mostly they assume things on ram can be lost at any time |
| 03:42.24 | *** part/#openmoko baird (n=cbaird@brushtail.apana.org.au) |
| 03:43.58 | _ASK | but you don't want to lose things; that's the issue |
| 03:44.22 | _ASK | saving on each time is not really practical |
| 03:45.26 | _ASK | linked chains, for example, is something quite tricky to store in ROM without much overhead |
| 03:47.31 | _ASK | well, it's something to watch out. let's leave it at that. |
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| 05:27.37 | mrcucumber | what's the idea behind developing a set of openmoko PIM apps instead of building on the GPE stuff |
| 05:28.07 | SpeedEvil | Consistency. |
| 05:28.20 | SpeedEvil | You pretty much need dedicated phone apps. |
| 05:28.33 | SpeedEvil | Optimised for small screens. |
| 05:28.40 | SpeedEvil | And touchscreens, and ... |
| 05:28.56 | SpeedEvil | Also, to be integrated with each other. |
| 05:29.49 | mrcucumber | k |
| 05:29.56 | SpeedEvil | Oops - /me misread that as GPL |
| 05:30.17 | SpeedEvil | But the same sort-of-applies. |
| 05:30.23 | CM | What about Pimlico or what it's called? |
| 05:30.25 | SpeedEvil | This is a phone that's got to work for everyone. |
| 05:30.46 | CM | o-hands PIM suit |
| 05:33.42 | mrcucumber | Could I get like a mentor to help me get involved, I'm a College student with C++/Java/Ruby/Scheme experience and I'm really excited about the openmoko project. I have set up the dev environment but I'm having trouble getting started. |
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| 05:37.52 | wiml | counter |
| 05:37.52 | aloril | http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter (probability guess: 60%) P1: 4 days 03:11:13 (4.133 +-4.1 days) (1259;212) |
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| 06:17.20 | aloril | counter_msg http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter (probability guess: 55%) |
| 06:17.20 | aloril | aloril changed counter prefix message to http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter (probability guess: 55%) |
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| 06:26.39 | aloril | (script) openmoko-community: Werner Almesberger <werner at openmoko.org> Re: Few comments after reading Wiki |
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| 06:37.48 | wehttamb | counter |
| 06:37.49 | aloril | http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter (probability guess: 55%) P1: 4 days 02:41:15 (4.112 +-4.1 days) (1260;212) |
| 06:38.00 | wehttamb | counter? |
| 06:38.01 | aloril | "/msg aloril counter?" for actual long message, giving short version here: http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter (probability guess: 55%) P1: 4 days 02:41:09 (4.112 +-4.1 days) (1261;212) |
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| 06:56.20 | Hopscotch | good morning |
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| 07:26.22 | Rakshasa | Morning |
| 07:29.31 | __ASK | hi there |
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| 07:44.12 | TRIsoft | morning |
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| 08:48.39 | XorA | ooops |
| 08:48.43 | xuxa | are Openmoko phones available anywhere yet? |
| 08:48.43 | aloril | xuxa: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (Hopefully this link answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) |
| 08:48.50 | xuxa | aha |
| 08:49.42 | xuxa | aha, September. Guess I'll have to get an interim phone... :) |
| 08:50.26 | XorA | you could haul around a powerbrick with a P1 phone :-) |
| 08:50.33 | xuxa | :) |
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| 09:11.09 | cheesy | counter |
| 09:11.09 | aloril | http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter (probability guess: 55%) P1: 4 days 01:24:35 (4.059 +-4.1 days) (1262;212) |
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| 09:18.16 | florian | good morning |
| 09:19.07 | XorA | hey florian |
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| 10:05.50 | hrw | morning |
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| 10:22.16 | CIA-24 | openmoko: 03mickey * r2075 10/trunk/oe/packages/gtk+/ (51 files in 4 dirs): oe: add overlay for gtk+ to apply lower-quality-scaling-in-pixbuf-engine.patch. patch courtesy Thomas Wood, thanks! |
| 10:22.39 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Wish_List]] |
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| 11:11.02 | CIA-24 | openmoko: 03thomas * r2076 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007/applications/openmoko-dialer/src/ (dialer-main.c dialer-window-dialer.c moko-dialer-autolist.c): |
| 11:11.02 | CIA-24 | openmoko: Patch by Neil J Patel <njp@o-hand.com> |
| 11:11.02 | CIA-24 | openmoko: openmoko-dialer: Add threaded support for autolist |
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| 11:17.39 | webjames | morning all, morning hrw, florian |
| 11:18.12 | florian | hi webjames |
| 11:18.55 | hrw | hi webjames |
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| 11:46.39 | aloril | (script) openmoko-community: Sean Moss-Pultz <sean at openmoko.com> Re: Salesman & neo1973 |
| 11:49.30 | webjames | give this a read when you have time, http://www.linuxdevcenter.com/pub/a/linux/2004/08/06/kernel_patent_risks.html |
| 11:50.33 | webjames | after that read comment 2 at the bottom |
| 11:59.02 | webjames | this also: http://www.vnunet.com/vnunet/news/2169024/ballmer-warns-linux-lawsuits |
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| 12:09.23 | webjames | and this http://www.vnunet.com/vnunet/news/2187886/windows-patent-tax-pegged-21 |
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| 12:41.46 | quitte | counter |
| 12:41.46 | aloril | http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter (probability guess: 55%) P1: 3 days 23:39:16 (3.986 +-4.0 days) (1263;212) |
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| 12:57.09 | DukeOfURL | Has anyone been able to install gcc 3.x on a FC6 box? |
| 12:57.34 | XorA | DukeOfURL: if you look inside the qemu srpm there is a gcc3 for FC6 hidden inside |
| 12:57.55 | LuitvD | hmm, how do I delete the touchscreen calibration data? :P |
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| 12:58.04 | XorA | rm /etc/pontercal |
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| 12:59.08 | LuitvD | XorA: thanks :) |
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| 13:02.51 | Elrond | LuitvD - Why do you want to delete it? |
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| 13:03.36 | LuitvD | Elrond: clicked like a maniac at calibration :P |
| 13:04.26 | LuitvD | does anyone know the image type of openmoko-flash.image? |
| 13:04.56 | balrog-kun | raw |
| 13:05.04 | DukeOfURL | XorA: is ftp://rpmfind.net/linux/fedora/extras/development/SRPMS/qemu-0.9.0-2.fc7.src.rpm the latest? |
| 13:05.05 | LuitvD | so how do I mount it? |
| 13:05.27 | Elrond | LuitvD - You're on qemu? And openmoko-flash.image is 64MB? |
| 13:05.51 | balrog-kun | actually no, it changed to qcow2 format by default yesterday |
| 13:06.06 | balrog-kun | if it's 64MB (67 to be exact) it's raw |
| 13:06.13 | LuitvD | Elrond: yes, it is |
| 13:06.28 | Elrond | Then the rootfs has a spefific offset in there. |
| 13:06.46 | Elrond | You first need a looß on that one, thaen mtd emulation on that, then jffs2 on the mtd. ;o) |
| 13:06.57 | Elrond | s/looß/loop/ |
| 13:07.13 | LuitvD | err... |
| 13:07.17 | LuitvD | not sure how to do that... |
| 13:07.21 | balrog-kun | the mtd emulation part is the most tricky :) |
| 13:07.28 | LuitvD | XD |
| 13:07.42 | Elrond | balrog-kun - really? (never tried it. A friend tried but it seems he failed) |
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| 13:08.15 | Elrond | LuitvD - Why do you want to mount it anyway? |
| 13:08.16 | balrog-kun | i have also never tried, i don't know if any kind of tool exists to do that |
| 13:08.33 | LuitvD | Elrond: to delete /etc/pontercal |
| 13:08.34 | LuitvD | :P |
| 13:08.37 | Elrond | balrog-kun - MTD emulation on a blockdevice is a standard kernel feature. |
| 13:08.52 | balrog-kun | Elrond: ah, didn't know about it |
| 13:08.57 | Elrond | LuitvD - Boot qemu, ssh into the system and do "rm /etc/pontercal" |
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| 13:09.09 | balrog-kun | Elrond: then the format of the image is probably not the raw format that the MTD emulation expects |
| 13:09.25 | LuitvD | Elrond: I can ssh into qemu? :| |
| 13:09.36 | balrog-kun | it's /etc/pointercal (/etc/*cal will do) |
| 13:09.56 | Elrond | balrog-kun - That's why I say "first convert the part of the imge to a loop device". Check losetup(8) |
| 13:10.12 | Elrond | LuitvD - If you setup the networking correctly, yes. |
| 13:10.19 | balrog-kun | i see |
| 13:10.33 | Elrond | balrog-kun - losetup accepts offsets. |
| 13:11.12 | XorA | DukeOfURL: no idea, I did it a year or so ago |
| 13:11.29 | balrog-kun | Elrond: however the format of the image is more "raw" than even losetup may be expecting |
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| 13:12.11 | Elrond | balrog-kun - Oh wait. It has the oob data in it? |
| 13:12.20 | balrog-kun | Elrond: if you dissect a NAND chip, except normal data (page data) there is also a small OOB (out of band) area after each page |
| 13:12.23 | balrog-kun | yeah |
| 13:12.36 | balrog-kun | it's interleaved after the end of every page |
| 13:12.42 | Elrond | yuck. |
| 13:13.03 | Elrond | losetup will happily conert that to normal bytes in the blockdevice. ;-) |
| 13:13.18 | Elrond | But I have no idea, how MTD-on-blockdev really works. |
| 13:13.36 | balrog-kun | i guess the MTD emulator might be easily hacked to use that OOB parts |
| 13:13.38 | Elrond | s/MTD/MTD-emulation |
| 13:13.59 | Elrond | possibly. But someone has to do it. ;) |
| 13:14.06 | Elrond | So it might not be "out of the box". |
| 13:14.21 | balrog-kun | actually i have seen something called nand simulator in the kernel sources, it was an awful piece of code, with an amazing amount of typos |
| 13:14.53 | balrog-kun | all the comments and strings in it were non-gramatical and with typos too |
| 13:15.13 | Elrond | yuck. |
| 13:15.38 | XorA | whats wrong with mtdram??? |
| 13:15.48 | Elrond | Hmmm... thinking again about it: Does neo-qemu support normal networking... and do our default kernels support it? |
| 13:16.10 | XorA | just create an mtdram device dd if=image of=/dev/mtdX mount /dev/mtdX |
| 13:16.14 | Elrond | XorA - LuitvD needs mtd-emulation-on-blockdev, not mtdram. |
| 13:16.27 | Elrond | Ahh, that might work. |
| 13:16.37 | Elrond | XorA - Which leaves the oob-question. |
| 13:16.56 | balrog-kun | Elrond: what's normal networking? |
| 13:17.08 | balrog-kun | it supports almost exactly what the physical device supports |
| 13:17.11 | XorA | Elrond: all he asked was to mount mtd, thats how you mount mtd without a nand driver :-) |
| 13:17.16 | Elrond | balrog-kun - Using non-usb. ;-) |
| 13:17.46 | Elrond | balrog-kun - Or is this usbfs thingy now stable? |
| 13:18.12 | balrog-kun | Elrond: well, it works for me :p dunno how stable it is |
| 13:18.21 | Elrond | hehe ;) |
| 13:18.32 | Elrond | (Guess NOW I know, why I like the real thingy ;o) ) |
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| 13:18.53 | balrog-kun | except for the bluetooth it supports the same kinds of networking as an actual Neo |
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| 13:19.33 | Elrond | ppp-over-rs232 ;o) |
| 13:20.43 | Elrond | HOw does one do the initial flashing of it? |
| 13:21.36 | balrog-kun | using devirginator |
| 13:22.05 | balrog-kun | (if you mean the real Neo) |
| 13:22.14 | Elrond | No, I mean the emulator. |
| 13:22.18 | Elrond | I know for the real hw. |
| 13:22.31 | Elrond | *admits* I haven't looked a lot at the emulator. |
| 13:22.46 | balrog-kun | then using something very similar to devirginator too |
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| 13:23.15 | balrog-kun | i.e. loading the u-boot binary directly to the ram while the processor is suspended |
| 13:23.42 | balrog-kun | so it's 100% realistic from the beginning :) |
| 13:24.33 | Elrond | Ahh. Using gdbserver inside qemu? |
| 13:24.39 | LuitvD | it says it can't mount... |
| 13:24.58 | LuitvD | I dd'ed the image to /dev/mtd1 and tried to mount that ... |
| 13:25.11 | LuitvD | am I missing someting? |
| 13:25.31 | Elrond | LuitvD - Yep, the offset. ;o) |
| 13:25.32 | balrog-kun | Elrond: nope, just reading the image file and writing the contents to the RAM before the VM starts |
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| 13:26.03 | Elrond | balrog-kun - So qemu has now an option to preload RAM? |
| 13:26.03 | LuitvD | Elrond: how? :P |
| 13:26.23 | Elrond | LuitvD - Using dd trickery. ;-) But don't ask me about the offsets. |
| 13:26.25 | balrog-kun | Elrond: that's what -kernel does in qemu for all architectures |
| 13:26.42 | Elrond | balrog-kun - Ahhh. I never looked at that. |
| 13:26.53 | balrog-kun | the PC emulator also can load bios images and vgabios from files |
| 13:27.15 | balrog-kun | and PXE rom for network booting |
| 13:27.47 | Elrond | Yeah, I know that. :-) |
| 13:28.05 | Elrond | Thinking about it, I should have guessed on that. |
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| 13:36.19 | sannes | counter |
| 13:36.20 | aloril | http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter (probability guess: 55%) P1: 3 days 23:12:00 (3.967 +-4.0 days) (1264;212) |
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| 13:57.16 | kiney | counter? |
| 13:57.17 | aloril | "/msg aloril counter?" for actual long message, giving short version here: http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter (probability guess: 55%) P1: 3 days 23:01:31 (3.959 +-4.0 days) (1265;212) |
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| 14:01.30 | Elrond | Does the counter-URL work for anyone? |
| 14:02.05 | Elrond | Oh, now it works. |
| 14:02.59 | ewon | counter |
| 14:03.00 | aloril | http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter (probability guess: 55%) P1: 3 days 22:58:39 (3.957 +-4.0 days) (1266;212) |
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| 14:11.36 | tholin | It would be really anticlimactic if the counter would reach negative numbers. |
| 14:11.56 | Elrond | ;o) |
| 14:12.03 | ewon | heh |
| 14:14.05 | Stephmw | tholin: nah, that'll never happen |
| 14:14.10 | Stephmw | tholin: just increase the error margin |
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| 14:16.24 | CoreDump|home | hi |
| 14:16.42 | Stephmw | heya |
| 14:17.51 | CIA-23 | openmoko: 03thomas * r2077 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007/applications/openmoko-dialer/src/dialer-window-dialer.c: |
| 14:17.51 | CIA-23 | openmoko: openmoko-dialer: remove autolist functionality again as threads don't seem to |
| 14:17.51 | CIA-23 | openmoko: work too well |
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| 14:51.27 | DukeOfURL | FYI: To 'make qemu' on FC6, I had to 'yum install compat-gcc*' and 'yum install SDL_*'y |
| 14:52.01 | DukeOfURL | s/'y/'/ |
| 14:54.29 | DukeOfURL | However, I get 'too many arguments to function `pxa27x_timer_init' in pxa2xx.c |
| 14:54.56 | ewon | hah |
| 14:55.04 | ewon | every time I see compat-gcc I twitch |
| 14:55.08 | ewon | it means haxoring is afoot |
| 14:56.53 | DukeOfURL | I really can't downgrade the box to an earlier FC, so my only option is to build new hardware $$$ |
| 14:56.53 | LuitvD | "make qemu" doesn't work here either... though "make flash-qemu-local" does work... |
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| 15:04.54 | mwester | DukeOfURL: VMware |
| 15:05.07 | DukeOfURL | yikes! |
| 15:05.18 | XorA | its FC6 just use Xen |
| 15:09.56 | DukeOfURL | is moko ok for x86_86 yet? about a month ago it threw errors. |
| 15:10.13 | roh | can you guys please add a section for using mokomakefile on fc to the wiki if the informations there are not good enough? |
| 15:10.26 | roh | i think that would help alot :) |
| 15:10.46 | XorA | DukeOfURL: ah you are using x86_64? |
| 15:10.56 | XorA | DukeOfURL: you are fairly fucked with regards to qemu then |
| 15:10.56 | DukeOfURL | I tried about a month ago. |
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| 15:12.09 | DukeOfURL | what FC includes gcc-3.x? |
| 15:12.28 | DukeOfURL | or am I on the wrong distro? |
| 15:13.37 | XorA | DukeOfURL: debian/ubuntu is the easiest for OE work |
| 15:13.41 | XorA | DukeOfURL: gentoo next |
| 15:13.48 | XorA | DukeOfURL: then FC6, then SuSe |
| 15:14.18 | DukeOfURL | can I boot Ubuntu from CD? |
| 15:14.29 | XorA | DukeOfURL: yes, it comes as a live CD |
| 15:14.56 | DukeOfURL | so I wouldn't have to reorg the development box? |
| 15:15.02 | DukeOfURL | file system wise? |
| 15:15.12 | XorA | DukeOfURL: you could just replace / |
| 15:15.26 | DukeOfURL | k |
| 15:15.30 | DukeOfURL | thanks |
| 15:15.48 | XorA | DukeOfURL: then apt-get install gcc-3.4 will get you a gcc3 |
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| 15:16.23 | XorA | DukeOfURL: and if you look at OEAndYourDistro page in wiki there is a debian package that automatically installs all dependencies for OE |
| 15:16.41 | DukeOfURL | k |
| 15:16.54 | hrw | ~change 60 eur to gbp |
| 15:17.00 | XorA | just watch out for the dash gotcha |
| 15:17.48 | CoreDump|home | !google 60 EUR in GPB |
| 15:17.50 | cdbot2 | Did you mean: 60 EUR in GBP ? | Sign in @ https://www.google.com/accounts/Login?continue=http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=60+EUR+in+GPB&safe=off&btnG=Search&lr=lang_all&hl=en | Layout 1 @ http://www.fidelity.co.uk/wealthmanager/funds/updates/16_euro.pdf%20class=l |
| 15:17.55 | CoreDump|home | !google 60 EUR in GBP |
| 15:17.56 | cdbot2 | 60 Euros = 40.9378485 British pounds |
| 15:18.14 | CoreDump|home | !praise google |
| 15:19.06 | CoreDump|home | !google 60 EUR in CHF |
| 15:19.06 | cdbot2 | 60 Euros = 99.3597 Swiss francs |
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| 15:32.01 | nnpiggy | 60 EUR in PGK does not work... |
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| 15:35.51 | simon_ | counter? |
| 15:35.51 | aloril | "/msg aloril counter?" for actual long message, giving short version here: http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter (probability guess: 55%) P1: 3 days 22:12:14 (3.925 +-3.9 days) (1267;212) |
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| 15:36.19 | prpplague | LaF0rge: you guys decide on a wireless chipset? |
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| 15:36.45 | nnpiggy | Harald identified one in email... |
| 15:37.02 | nnpiggy | That was a few weeks ago--I don't see it in my recently-read list... |
| 15:38.24 | *** join/#openmoko TimRiker (n=timr@216.49.181.128) |
| 15:38.46 | roh | ar6k |
| 15:42.32 | prpplague | yea, the post said they had pretty much decided on the ar6k, just didn't know if it was finally set in stone |
| 15:42.45 | prpplague | TimRiker: hey timmy |
| 15:47.04 | TimRiker | prpplague: ols? |
| 15:48.45 | prpplague | TimRiker: probably not this year |
| 15:49.13 | prpplague | TimRiker: just getting the family moved back from overseas |
| 15:49.28 | *** join/#openmoko Marex-notebook (n=marex@85.132.236.161) |
| 15:49.34 | prpplague | TimRiker: plus i didn't see any presentations that really jumped out at me on the list for this year |
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| 15:59.15 | *** join/#openmoko calvin_ (i=calvin@nat/novell/x-2933db04913d1824) |
| 16:01.16 | *** join/#openmoko Marex (n=Marex@85.132.236.161) |
| 16:01.33 | CIA-23 | openmoko: 03thomas * r2078 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007/applications/openmoko-dialer/src/ (3 files): openmoko-dialer: remove more unused code, add some debugging messages |
| 16:10.52 | *** join/#openmoko borg_ (n=olaf@80.149.17.21) |
| 16:15.32 | TRIsoft | gtg cu |
| 16:18.11 | *** join/#openmoko ossman (n=drzeus@85.8.24.16.se.wasadata.net) |
| 16:21.39 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Buying_Interest_List]] |
| 16:23.18 | *** join/#openmoko vaiursch (n=erwin@84-72-190-106.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 16:24.43 | DukeOfURL | SpeedEvil: is this time from the GPS receiver GMT? |
| 16:28.44 | *** join/#openmoko Bish (n=arne@pD9E56BF5.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 16:29.34 | tholin | I'm guessing it's gps time. |
| 16:29.51 | Bish | xD |
| 16:29.57 | Bish | good guess |
| 16:30.21 | tholin | gps time does exist. It has an offset of 13 sec or something like that. |
| 16:31.04 | mjr | that an artifact of time dilation and leap seconds or something? |
| 16:31.52 | tholin | gps don't use leap seconds but real time does. |
| 16:32.19 | mjr | yes, that's what I figured... |
| 16:32.56 | *** join/#openmoko borg_ (n=olaf@80.149.17.21) |
| 16:33.29 | DukeOfURL | tholin: offset from GMT? |
| 16:33.42 | tholin | don't remember |
| 16:35.41 | *** join/#openmoko wansti (n=wansti@b131.apm.etc.tu-bs.de) |
| 16:43.26 | *** join/#openmoko Zoolooc (i=muciipec@p54952D90.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 16:43.59 | *** join/#openmoko pleemans (n=peter@d51A5E76A.access.telenet.be) |
| 16:48.00 | *** part/#openmoko kslater (n=kslater@24.svnf1.xdsl.nauticom.net) |
| 16:49.40 | tholin | is gpsd working with the neo? |
| 16:53.22 | *** join/#openmoko MDK (n=mdk@cs181222091.pp.htv.fi) |
| 16:56.29 | guaqua | haven't seen anything new on the gps issue so i think no |
| 16:58.57 | *** join/#openmoko greentux_ (n=lemke@Z6c87.z.pppool.de) |
| 17:02.50 | kiney | counter |
| 17:02.50 | aloril | http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter (probability guess: 55%) P1: 3 days 21:28:44 (3.895 +-3.9 days) (1268;212) |
| 17:09.52 | *** join/#openmoko borg_ (n=olaf@80.149.17.21) |
| 17:10.15 | Elrond | How can one make bitbake a bit more chaty? So I see each cmpile? |
| 17:10.25 | *** join/#openmoko nnpigg1 (n=nnpiggy@24.crcr10.xdsl.nauticom.net) |
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| 17:56.30 | *** join/#openmoko woglinde (i=woglinde@e178096218.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 17:57.27 | woglinde | someone knows whats going wrong here with gsmd? |
| 17:57.29 | woglinde | http://www.pastebin.ca/507614 |
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| 18:21.39 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[User:DaraParsavand]] |
| 18:28.11 | pH5 | woglinde: I don't see anything wrong with gsmd. this looks like the dialer was killed? |
| 18:28.19 | *** join/#openmoko MetaMorfoziS (n=sajt@dsl54007F4C.pool.t-online.hu) |
| 18:28.37 | *** join/#openmoko borg_ (n=olaf@80.149.17.21) |
| 18:28.53 | MetaMorfoziS | Hy all!:) |
| 18:32.35 | *** join/#openmoko Eludias (n=eludias@wingding.demon.nl) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 18:32.36 | *** join/#openmoko florian (n=fuchs@217.146.132.69) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 18:35.54 | woglinde | ph5 no I just used libgsmd-tool |
| 18:35.59 | woglinde | but R dont work |
| 18:36.04 | woglinde | it dont ask for my pin |
| 18:36.59 | woglinde | uh |
| 18:37.02 | woglinde | now it works |
| 18:37.31 | pH5 | woglinde: oh, ok. I always use the atcmd mode and AT+CPIN :) |
| 18:37.41 | woglinde | hm strange |
| 18:38.33 | woglinde | nice |
| 18:39.09 | woglinde | hm phonebook service segfautls |
| 18:40.23 | goxboxlive | pH5: do you have gsmd working again right out of OE using magician? |
| 18:43.23 | CIA-23 | openmoko: 03laforge * r2079 10/trunk/src/target/kernel/patches/hxd8-core.patch: HXD8: Set LCM type S3C2410_LCDCON1_TFT (Johnny Wu) |
| 18:51.15 | *** join/#openmoko behdad (n=behdad@63.250.163.171) |
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| 19:03.24 | *** join/#openmoko ninHer (n=ninHer@42.Red-88-24-250.staticIP.rima-tde.net) |
| 19:06.55 | Bish | <3 openmoko project |
| 19:12.31 | Elrond | BTW: Has anyone ever seen the battery chgmode in something else then fast_cccv? |
| 19:19.28 | *** join/#openmoko buz (n=buz@84-72-54-173.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
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| 19:20.51 | pjz | counter |
| 19:20.51 | aloril | http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter (probability guess: 55%) P1: 3 days 20:19:44 (3.847 +-3.8 days) (1269;212) |
| 19:22.26 | *** join/#openmoko eshep (n=eric@x024012.ppp.asahi-net.or.jp) |
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| 19:25.59 | *** join/#openmoko eshep (n=eric@x024012.ppp.asahi-net.or.jp) |
| 19:27.11 | CIA-23 | openmoko: 03andrew * r2080 10/trunk/src/host/qemu-neo1973/ (59 files in 8 dirs): Sync this week's changes from upstream. |
| 19:34.53 | *** join/#openmoko cathal (n=cathal@89.100.101.244) |
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| 20:17.39 | aloril | (script) openmoko-neo1973: Harald Welte <laforge at openmoko.org> Re: high speed parallel access to the CPU |
| 20:20.33 | [psy] | what bot are you guys using to show those svn commits? |
| 20:20.34 | [psy] | :) |
| 20:20.47 | woglinde | hm cia? |
| 20:21.39 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Wish_List_-_Hardware]] |
| 20:21.43 | balrog-kun | cia.vc |
| 20:30.49 | *** join/#openmoko atla (n=atla@p3EE3E2C2.dip.t-dialin.net) |
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| 20:56.17 | *** part/#openmoko herbyle (n=pascal@p54A35429.dip.t-dialin.net) |
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| 21:06.10 | *** join/#openmoko calvin_ (i=calvin@nat/novell/x-1e67e6cc3c2cd24e) |
| 21:16.24 | Stephmw | hmmm, anybody know of a page summarising the binary sizes of tinyx (kdrive) and its various optional libs (fonts, etc)? |
| 21:17.39 | *** join/#openmoko C7 (n=C7@77-56-189-210.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
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| 21:29.30 | Mandarino | counter |
| 21:29.30 | aloril | http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter (probability guess: 55%) P1: 3 days 19:15:24 (3.802 +-3.8 days) (1270;212) |
| 21:29.50 | *** join/#openmoko prpplague (n=billybob@mail.americanmicrosystems.com) |
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| 21:49.21 | *** part/#openmoko rayjward (n=ray@h-67-103-3-66.chcgilgm.covad.net) |
| 21:53.32 | don-o | confidence dropping |
| 21:59.36 | Elrond | Weeee.... I finally have a cross-compile-environment on my box. :) |
| 22:00.17 | don-o | Elrond: how many hours did it take to set that up? |
| 22:00.55 | Elrond | don-o - You mean except 5 hours compile time? |
| 22:01.06 | prpplague | Elrond: oe i assume? |
| 22:01.17 | Elrond | prpplague - oe / openmoko. |
| 22:02.03 | Elrond | don-o - Except the 5 hours compile time, it was like 2 hours fighting with mokomakefile. ;) |
| 22:02.23 | prpplague | Elrond: what distro are you running on your box? |
| 22:02.32 | don-o | Elrond: what cpu/os did you build it on? |
| 22:03.16 | Elrond | prpplague - debian. But that's really unimportant, as this thing just builds everything, even for the host. |
| 22:04.15 | Elrond | don-o - cpu: pII-300 (except for the oe-monotone-download. I had to use a 2.6GHz p4 dual core to get that one in 120 cpu minutes), OS: Debian. |
| 22:05.55 | *** join/#openmoko helb (n=helb@84.244.90.159) |
| 22:07.00 | prpplague | Elrond: more important that you think, oe is pretty unforgiving on redhat/fedora |
| 22:07.06 | prpplague | s/that/than |
| 22:07.50 | Elrond | Oh, didn't know that. |
| 22:08.17 | Stephmw | prpplague: I asked earlier, but you may know... just how big are the X binaries (aka kdrive)? |
| 22:09.40 | Elrond | -rwxr-xr-x 1 root root 1025244 Jan 1 00:00 /usr/bin/Xfbdev |
| 22:10.38 | prpplague | Stephmw: sorry, i don't know specifically for the openmoko builds, i just hang around here to listen to the dev talk regarding the s3c24xx processors |
| 22:11.02 | Stephmw | Elrond: thanks! |
| 22:11.10 | Stephmw | Elrond: any deps? |
| 22:11.32 | *** part/#openmoko overseer (n=overseer@dsl092-044-123.lax1.dsl.speakeasy.net) |
| 22:11.43 | *** join/#openmoko overseer (n=overseer@dsl092-044-123.lax1.dsl.speakeasy.net) |
| 22:12.21 | Elrond | root@fic-gta01:~$ ipkg info xserver-kdrive-fbdev | grep Depends |
| 22:12.21 | Elrond | Depends: xserver-kdrive, libxfont1 (>= X11R7.1-1.2.0), libfreetype6 (>= 2.1.10), libxau6 (>= X11R7.1-1.0.1), libfontenc1 (>= X11R7.1-1.0.2), libxdmcp6 (>= X11R7.1-1.0.1), libz1 (>= 1.2.3), libts-0.0-0 (>= 1.0), libc6 (>= 2.5), libgcc1 (>= 4.1.1) |
| 22:12.27 | *** join/#openmoko ich (n=ich@91.64.161.147) |
| 22:12.53 | Stephmw | Elrond: right, hmm |
| 22:13.25 | Stephmw | Elrond: instead of asking you all the time, should I just download an image and mount it? |
| 22:14.06 | Elrond | Stephmw - There is a .tar.gz of the impage on buildhost/tmp/deploy/. |
| 22:14.22 | Elrond | Stephmw - Just unpack and be happy. :) |
| 22:14.31 | *** join/#openmoko Demitar (n=demitar@c-212-031-190-120.cust.broadway.se) |
| 22:15.00 | Stephmw | Elrond: great :) |
| 22:15.20 | Elrond | Stephmw - What are you looking for specifically anyway? |
| 22:16.07 | Stephmw | Elrond: I'm trying to push a proposal at Sun to provide a proper headless version of java... one that understands about fbdev for instance |
| 22:16.29 | Stephmw | Elrond: right now I have to argue about why I don't think having a separate x-server is a good idea |
| 22:16.45 | Stephmw | Elrond: on a single-purpose device for instance |
| 22:17.25 | Stephmw | Elrond: imo the app on the device should just export its display to a proper x server elsewhere... or use a local fbdev |
| 22:17.31 | Elrond | Ahh, so you're looking for arguments why an X-Server is "bad". ;) |
| 22:17.32 | Stephmw | Elrond: directly. |
| 22:17.43 | Stephmw | bad only for this usecase :) |
| 22:17.59 | Elrond | That's why I put the "bad" in quotes. |
| 22:18.02 | Stephmw | if the has a need for multiple apps, then it's necessary |
| 22:18.18 | Stephmw | it's ok, I'm just a bit frazzled |
| 22:19.29 | Elrond | What's the meaning of "frazzled"? |
| 22:19.29 | rwhitby | DukeOfURL: I test MokoMakefile on Debian Etch and CentOS 4 |
| 22:19.40 | dilinger | frazzle rock |
| 22:19.50 | DukeOfURL | ok |
| 22:19.50 | Stephmw | Elrond: ya know, hair everywhere after being hit by lightning |
| 22:20.10 | Elrond | Ahh. ;) |
| 22:20.15 | Elrond | Stephmw - For you: |
| 22:20.17 | Stephmw | Elrond: Sun is still full of politics, the initial replies to my proposal weren't all encouraging |
| 22:20.25 | Elrond | <PROTECTED> |
| 22:20.31 | webjames | !google define:frazzled |
| 22:20.32 | cdbot2 | edgy; nervous; worn-out; at the end of one's endurance or tolerance. @ http://www.artistwd.com/joyzine/australia/strine/f-3.php ( http://www.google.com/search?hl=all&q=define:frazzled ) |
| 22:20.35 | Elrond | <PROTECTED> |
| 22:20.40 | ar1 | see you tomorrow |
| 22:20.47 | *** part/#openmoko ar1 (i=root@gateway/tor/x-3fa81360493bff25) |
| 22:20.50 | Stephmw | 7mb resident. wow. |
| 22:21.11 | Stephmw | I wonder if that would be less without the font dependencies |
| 22:21.34 | Elrond | I haven't looked into fonts on it for now. |
| 22:23.39 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Buying_Interest_List]] [[Wish_List]] [[Wish_List_-_Hardware]] [[Guitar_Tuning]] [[GPS_Navigation]] |
| 22:27.42 | Stephmw | Elrond: in case you're wondering about the font bits, Java provides its own TTF rasteriser, so X doesn't really need to support that in my usecase |
| 22:28.48 | *** join/#openmoko orospakr (n=orospakr@ottawa-hs-209-217-84-191.d-ip.magma.ca) |
| 22:29.08 | *** join/#openmoko madewokherd (n=urk@c-24-3-50-207.hsd1.pa.comcast.net) |
| 22:29.26 | Elrond | Stephmw - Ahh. |
| 22:30.42 | *** join/#openmoko madewokherd (n=urk@c-24-3-50-207.hsd1.pa.comcast.net) |
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| 22:36.05 | Elrond | Good night people. :) |
| 22:36.10 | Stephmw | see ya! |
| 22:36.23 | LuitvD | bye Elrond |
| 22:37.28 | Elrond | :) |
| 22:48.05 | *** join/#openmoko cjb (n=cjb@pullcord.laptop.org) |
| 22:51.40 | *** join/#openmoko Lorphos (n=sn@unaffiliated/lorphos) |
| 22:52.25 | Lorphos | FYI, I posted a bunch of new phase0 Neo1973 pictures taken tonight (at LUG-BS) @ http://www.flickr.com/photos/lorphos/sets/72157600262308147/ |
| 22:54.36 | LuitvD | hmm, nice pictures |
| 22:54.58 | Lorphos | Thanks |
| 22:55.00 | LittleIdiot | *sigh* |
| 22:55.08 | Lorphos | the phone feels very nice, too |
| 22:55.23 | LuitvD | I can imagine... |
| 22:55.34 | LuitvD | what kind of cam did you use? |
| 22:55.39 | Lorphos | but the software needs more lovin |
| 22:56.03 | Lorphos | a Canon EOS 350D with EF 50mm f/1.8 and also some pictures using a Sigma 17-70mm macro |
| 22:56.24 | LuitvD | 1.8 :) lovely |
| 22:57.57 | LuitvD | sorry, saw that EOS 350D part on flickr just after I asked :P |
| 22:57.57 | LuitvD | XD |
| 22:57.58 | Lorphos | np :) |
| 22:58.06 | LuitvD | who'se P0 device is it? yours? |
| 22:58.14 | Lorphos | i wish |
| 22:58.28 | LuitvD | :P |
| 22:58.37 | LuitvD | the same wish here |
| 22:58.47 | Lorphos | i went to this: http://www.datenfreihafen.org/~stefan/weblog//archives/2007/05/#e2007-05-09T16_11_28.txt |
| 22:59.02 | Lorphos | and they had like 3 phase0 units |
| 22:59.49 | Lorphos | actually some where P1 i think |
| 22:59.55 | Lorphos | not sure how to tell them apart really |
| 23:00.05 | LuitvD | lol |
| 23:00.15 | LuitvD | the internals are a little different |
| 23:00.15 | Lorphos | do you know? |
| 23:00.32 | LuitvD | not really visible on the outside except for battery life |
| 23:00.34 | Lorphos | well that makes it hard to tell them apart i guess.. without opening them |
| 23:00.49 | LuitvD | endurance-test :P |
| 23:01.01 | Lorphos | well.. time to sleep.. laters |
| 23:01.06 | LuitvD | later |
| 23:02.44 | webjames | Lorphos: nice pics, thanks |
| 23:02.44 | webjames | Lorphos: night |
| 23:03.26 | *** join/#openmoko webjames (n=james@cpc1-oxfd9-0-0-cust930.oxfd.cable.ntl.com) |
| 23:04.36 | LuitvD | webjames: pics so nice, they make you jump? :P |
| 23:05.18 | webjames | LuitvD: jump? ahh i see, a case of mistaken window identity |
| 23:05.27 | LuitvD | :P |
| 23:05.35 | webjames | went a bit 'X' happy |
| 23:06.12 | LuitvD | :P |
| 23:06.51 | webjames | pics were good though, that screen is amazing, crisp and bright |
| 23:07.12 | webjames | can't wait to get my hands on one, hope to hear news monday |
| 23:07.21 | LuitvD | yeah, the EOS and that F/1.8 lens really does that device good :P |
| 23:07.22 | *** join/#openmoko amarsh04 (n=amarsh04@CPE-124-178-209-223.sa.bigpond.net.au) |
| 23:07.23 | LuitvD | counter |
| 23:07.23 | aloril | http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter (probability guess: 55%) P1: 3 days 18:26:28 (3.768 +-3.8 days) (1271;212) |
| 23:08.34 | webjames | i think if they're going to announce anything, prob be at the start of the week, as then end would not be in may |
| 23:08.34 | LuitvD | on other pictures, the screen seemed to lack brightness, because of the bad lighting |
| 23:08.51 | *** join/#openmoko sannes_ (i=ace@har.sagt.no) |
| 23:08.58 | Stephmw | g'night guys |
| 23:09.06 | LuitvD | 'night Stephmw |
| 23:09.17 | webjames | yeah, looks good, the casing also looks of an excellent quality |
| 23:09.26 | webjames | night Stephmw[Zzzzz] |
| 23:10.45 | webjames | i might have to go for the outrageous orange, but the black does look good |
| 23:11.11 | CIA-23 | openmoko: 03laforge * r2081 10/trunk/src/target/u-boot/patches/ (5 files): |
| 23:11.11 | CIA-23 | openmoko: * merge set-hwswp.patch into uboot-s3c2410_fb.patch |
| 23:11.11 | CIA-23 | openmoko: * move LCD controller register initialization into per-board function |
| 23:11.11 | CIA-23 | openmoko: * implement this function for neo1973 and qt2410 |
| 23:11.28 | *** join/#openmoko calvin_ (n=calvin@205.208.235.225) |
| 23:11.33 | *** join/#openmoko donut (n=donut@c-24-6-151-58.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 23:12.10 | CIA-23 | openmoko: 03laforge * r2082 10/trunk/src/target/u-boot/patches/uboot-gta02.patch: |
| 23:12.10 | CIA-23 | openmoko: * make sure memory bank configuration is correct for smedia |
| 23:12.10 | CIA-23 | openmoko: * add smedai framebuffer driver stub (just skeleton) |
| 23:14.58 | alphaone | http://www.flickr.com/photos/lorphos/sets/72157600262308147/ |
| 23:15.19 | CIA-23 | openmoko: 03laforge * r2083 10/trunk/src/target/u-boot/patches/uboot-hxd8.patch: implement [untested] hxd8 multiple nand chip support |
| 23:17.10 | *** join/#openmoko daniel_bergamini (n=danieber@70-41-167-23.cust.wildblue.net) |
| 23:26.38 | *** join/#openmoko samlo (n=upirc@166.132.167.82) |
| 23:27.23 | *** part/#openmoko samlo (n=upirc@166.132.167.82) |
| 23:32.44 | *** join/#openmoko amarsh04 (n=amarsh04@CPE-124-178-209-223.sa.bigpond.net.au) |
| 23:34.22 | CIA-23 | openmoko: 03laforge * r2084 10/trunk/src/target/u-boot/patches/uboot-hxd8.patch: enable framebuffer support on hxd8 |
| 23:34.47 | balrog-kun | yay, AIUI one of the hxd8 NAND chips is 512MB |
| 23:39.11 | CIA-23 | openmoko: 03laforge * r2085 10/trunk/src/target/u-boot/patches/uboot-20061030-qt2410.patch: * add dummy udc_ctrl() function to qt2410 code (fix compilation) |
| 23:51.35 | *** join/#openmoko orospakr (n=orospakr@ottawa-hs-209-217-84-191.d-ip.magma.ca) |
| 23:53.58 | *** join/#openmoko cathal (n=cathal@89.100.101.244) |