| 00:00.21 | SpeedEvil | Small relatively cheap bluetooth keyboards would seem to be the solution. |
| 00:01.38 | Elrond | And the usb-host-switching code still has "TODOs" in it, that sound like "some GPIOs have to be set correctly to get pull-up/down thingies correct" or the like... |
| 00:01.42 | SpeedEvil | Yeah. |
| 00:01.53 | CIA-24 | openmoko: 03alphaone * r2047 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007/applications/openmoko-footer/ (5 files in 3 dirs): |
| 00:01.53 | CIA-24 | openmoko: * data/icon_app_task{list,switch}.png: Added. |
| 00:01.53 | CIA-24 | openmoko: Add the old images for the footer. |
| 00:01.53 | CIA-24 | openmoko: * data/Makefile.am, src/footer.c (footer_init): |
| 00:01.53 | CIA-24 | openmoko: Show the old images instead of the new ones. |
| 00:03.13 | Elrond | Huh, why old/new? |
| 00:03.19 | babbleback | why would a new product have old USB on it? |
| 00:04.50 | SpeedEvil | Because USB2 is expensive to implement. |
| 00:04.56 | Elrond | babbleback - It's an old (but stable and nice) SoC. |
| 00:04.57 | SpeedEvil | In terms of power and silicon area. |
| 00:05.06 | SpeedEvil | That too. |
| 00:05.14 | cjb | SpeedEvil: do you know if it has a higher polling burden, too? |
| 00:05.22 | SpeedEvil | Umm. |
| 00:05.27 | SpeedEvil | I don't, no. |
| 00:05.29 | *** part/#openmoko shawarma (n=sh@atlas.linux2go.dk) |
| 00:05.35 | SpeedEvil | I think it's still 1Khz. |
| 00:05.40 | Elrond | Okay... I did not even understand the question. |
| 00:06.09 | cjb | I mean burden on the kernel, I guess. USB1 sucks power because you don't get host interrupts the way you would on sane technology. |
| 00:06.14 | alphaone | Elrond: Because the "old" images look cleaner |
| 00:06.40 | Elrond | alphaone - Okay. :-) |
| 00:06.45 | cjb | So I was wondering if they made anything more interrupt-like for USB2. I don't know much about it. |
| 00:06.48 | alphaone | So old images are the new ones :-) |
| 00:07.32 | Elrond | cjb - Ahh. I don't know, if OHCI is better than UHCI in this area. |
| 00:07.59 | cjb | certainly you can save about a watt in UHCI by turning on CONFIG_USB_SUSPEND. |
| 00:08.01 | cjb | (!) |
| 00:10.01 | *** join/#openmoko greentux_ (n=lemke@Z68d0.z.pppool.de) |
| 00:11.08 | Elrond | cjb - We have ohci on the SoC. |
| 00:11.57 | Elrond | Good night people. :-) |
| 00:12.06 | CIA-24 | openmoko: 03alphaone * r2048 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007/artwork/themes/openmoko-standard/gtk-2.0/openmoko-footer: |
| 00:12.06 | CIA-24 | openmoko: * openmoko-footer: Change text color to white to improve readability |
| 00:12.06 | CIA-24 | openmoko: and fix indentation |
| 00:12.22 | babbleback | what is SoC |
| 00:13.44 | SpeedEvil | System On Chip |
| 00:13.48 | stefan_schmidt | night folks |
| 00:13.55 | stefan_schmidt | ~soc |
| 00:13.59 | apt | somebody said soc was System On Chip - many embedded cpus include a variety of peripherals as well which makes them more than just a CPU. |
| 00:14.34 | SuN | Be careful though, it's often used as Summer of Code as well in this channel. |
| 00:17.26 | *** join/#openmoko merriam_ (n=merriam@85-211-245-180.dyn.gotadsl.co.uk) |
| 00:19.35 | babbleback | is that summer of code for college students only? |
| 00:24.38 | balrog-kun | no, for all (or most) kinds of students |
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| 00:59.17 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Talk:Messages]] [[Talk:System_Info]] [[Buying_Interest_List]] |
| 01:15.22 | sparq | Bother. MokoMakefile has shat itself. |
| 01:25.20 | sparq | Hmm... "warnings are being treated as errors." Does anyone know how to tell it to treat warnings as warnings? |
| 01:31.36 | balrog-kun | remove -Werror from CFLAGS? |
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| 01:53.22 | sparq | Wow, this package is completely borked. |
| 01:54.44 | sparq | Anyone know how one can just skip rssreader? |
| 02:00.15 | DukeOfURL | mine crashed on rssreader as well... |
| 02:04.03 | *** join/#openmoko Psi (n=benw@ip-58-28-158-238.ubs-dsl.xnet.co.nz) |
| 02:16.04 | sparq | Let's see if a noop Makefile will let me go on |
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| 02:31.34 | sparq | OK... so far so good... now let's see if I can remove it from the dependency list of task-openmoko-pim |
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| 02:40.17 | sparq | ye gods, this is complicated |
| 02:47.40 | *** join/#openmoko aesci7E (n=aesci99@221.221.134.148) |
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| 03:02.08 | sparq | Oh. Heh. Debian-style builddeps. |
| 03:03.53 | sparq | Huzza! It lives! |
| 03:05.43 | *** join/#openmoko rd_ (n=rd@vnsecurity.net) |
| 03:12.09 | Vitaly | counter |
| 03:12.10 | aloril | http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter (probability guess: 65%) P1: 6 days 08:48:07 (6.367 +-5.0 days) (1224;210) |
| 03:19.03 | DukeOfURL | sparq: how did you do it? |
| 03:27.24 | *** join/#openmoko kart_ (i=kartik@202.141.96.29) |
| 03:27.40 | sparq | DukeOfURL: edit moko/build/tmp/deploy/ipk/all/Packages |
| 03:29.13 | sparq | from the stanza "Package: task-openmoko-pim", remove openmoko-rssreader from the Depends: line |
| 03:30.01 | sparq | DukeOfURL: I do not reccomend this generally. I would consider the tree "broken" having performed this, but I just wanted to to boot the thing up. |
| 03:30.34 | sparq | I'm sure it can be cleaned up, of course, but nevertheless. |
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| 04:27.25 | sparq | d'oh. sshd not installed by default. |
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| 04:58.17 | *** topic/#openmoko is OpenMoko Community Lounge <> Free Your Phone <> wiki.openmoko.org <> Anyone can buy for $350 starting perhaps late May. <> Mass market in September. |
| 05:09.11 | *** join/#openmoko apt (i=ibot@pdpc/supporter/active/TimRiker/bot/apt) |
| 05:09.11 | *** topic/#openmoko is OpenMoko Community Lounge <> Free Your Phone <> wiki.openmoko.org <> Anyone can buy for $350 starting perhaps late May. <> Mass market in September. |
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| 05:30.40 | tigert | morning here also |
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| 05:57.35 | *** topic/#openmoko is OpenMoko Community Lounge <> Free Your Phone <> wiki.openmoko.org <> Anyone can buy for $350 starting perhaps late May. <> Mass market in September. |
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| 06:06.07 | CM | Hmm... http://www.reghardware.co.uk/2007/05/17/samsung_8gb_microsd/ |
| 06:06.38 | CM | Has anyone even seen a 4gb micro sd that's actually for sale? |
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| 06:27.02 | DukeOfURL | When I |
| 06:27.52 | DukeOfURL | When my RAZR is in a known good coverage, the number of "bars" indicates signal strength. |
| 06:28.41 | DukeOfURL | However, the "bars" sometimes gos to zero. Does this mean all voice channels are occupied, or does it indicate signal strength? |
| 06:28.51 | DukeOfURL | s'gos'goes' |
| 06:29.25 | CM | It's no signal |
| 06:30.30 | DukeOfURL | I see here "AT+CSQ" to get signal strength. Does anyone have any experience with this? |
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| 06:34.20 | Rakshasa | morgen. |
| 06:34.23 | Rakshasa | counter |
| 06:34.24 | aloril | http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter (probability guess: 65%) P1: 6 days 05:25:53 (6.226 +-5.0 days) (1225;210) |
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| 06:59.14 | *** topic/#openmoko is OpenMoko Community Lounge <> Free Your Phone <> wiki.openmoko.org <> Anyone can buy for $350 starting perhaps late May. <> Mass market in September. |
| 07:06.12 | *** join/#openmoko Virtuall (n=virtuall@87.110.198.224) |
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| 07:37.18 | aloril | (script) openmoko-community: Sean Moss-Pultz <sean at openmoko.com> Re: FCC Approval |
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| 08:03.20 | wehttamb | counter? |
| 08:03.20 | aloril | "/msg aloril counter?" for actual long message, giving short version here: http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter (probability guess: 65%) P1: 6 days 03:56:56 (6.165 +-5.0 days) (1226;210) |
| 08:04.14 | wehttamb | counter? |
| 08:04.15 | aloril | "/msg aloril counter?" for actual long message, giving short version here: http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter (probability guess: 65%) P1: 6 days 03:56:02 (6.164 +-5.0 days) (1227;210) |
| 08:06.14 | *** join/#openmoko zwnj (n=behnam@213.207.210.231) |
| 08:07.34 | Hopscotch | good morning |
| 08:07.42 | xkr47 | gug |
| 08:07.47 | *** join/#openmoko _alcik_ (n=kahuna@iv-nat.matrix.pl) |
| 08:09.49 | *** join/#openmoko ossman (n=drzeus@alcatraz.cendio.se) |
| 08:10.23 | Pander | good morning |
| 08:12.05 | *** join/#openmoko Ming_LT (i=Tom@82-38-152-43.cable.ubr02.roth.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 08:13.26 | wehttamb | counter |
| 08:13.27 | aloril | http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter (probability guess: 65%) P1: 6 days 03:46:50 (6.158 +-5.0 days) (1228;210) |
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| 08:50.00 | Pander | does anyone know where to find the scalable openmoko logo? thanks |
| 08:51.33 | LuitvD | hmm, don't know... |
| 08:51.41 | LuitvD | I'll take a look on the wiki |
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| 08:58.36 | Stephmw | mornin' |
| 08:59.18 | LuitvD | morning |
| 08:59.18 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[FAQ]] [[User_talk:Idarwin]] [[Main_Menu]] [[Category:Neo1973_Hardware]] |
| 09:01.33 | _alcik_ | PANDER write to Sean... he will give U something :-) |
| 09:01.57 | Pander | _alcik_: thanks |
| 09:02.51 | _alcik_ | PANDER I saw something a long time ago but hell, cant remember where... |
| 09:03.27 | _alcik_ | and I think this was not on wiki |
| 09:03.55 | Mukunda | Damn... The delay of the Neo1973 is making me feel like I should just go grab an iPaq. |
| 09:04.21 | *** join/#openmoko tr2x (n=alvar@80-218-185-55.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 09:05.57 | sparq | Pander: I just peeked at all the .svg files that MokoMakefile has splattered arcros my drive, and I don't see any of the OpenMoko logo |
| 09:06.22 | *** join/#openmoko Kensan (n=ken@zux006-004-203.adsl.green.ch) |
| 09:07.01 | sparq | Pander: Perhapse an Opie logo? Or a GPE logo? There are lots of those. ^_^ |
| 09:10.30 | *** join/#openmoko florian (n=fuchs@217.146.132.69) |
| 09:10.50 | florian | good morning |
| 09:13.20 | ewon | greets |
| 09:13.35 | ewon | I knew a Florian from Deggendorf in Germany. Good archer. |
| 09:14.20 | Pander | sparq: any scalable format is actuially oke |
| 09:14.51 | sparq | Pander: shall I check for PDFs an PS files? |
| 09:15.25 | Pander | sparq: here is one inside a PDF: http://www.openmoko.com/files/OpenMoko_Neologics.pdf |
| 09:16.05 | sparq | Heh. Anyone got Acrobat? |
| 09:18.04 | guaqua | kpdf here |
| 09:18.57 | sparq | Pander: I presume that author of the presentation must have a scalable logo somewhere |
| 09:19.19 | sparq | By the way, who owns the OpenMoko tradmarks and logos? Are they free to redistribute? |
| 09:19.31 | Kaloz | sparq: http://209.85.135.104/search?q=cache:65q1psbiEOgJ:www.openmoko.com/files/OpenMoko_Neologics.pdf+http://www.openmoko.com/files/OpenMoko_Neologics.pdf&hl=hu&ct=clnk&cd=1&client=opera |
| 09:19.35 | Kaloz | :) |
| 09:19.37 | Pander | someone told me to look in the COPYING files but those were empty |
| 09:21.25 | sparq | Yarr. |
| 09:22.44 | sparq | I hope that they are CC or something. It would be a pain in the ass to have a firefox/iceweasel ordeal. |
| 09:24.46 | CIA-24 | openmoko: 03rwhitby * r94 10mokomakefile/trunk/patches/openembedded-e2dbb52fe39df7ef786b6068f6178f29508dfded/ (libelf-mv_cv_target_elf.patch series): Proposed patch for libelf build problems with x86 target (backporting of patch already in OE .dev latest version). |
| 09:25.47 | rwhitby | thanks to _alcik_ for pointing out the patch ... |
| 09:33.52 | Pander | so the copyrights to all the source code, documentation, artwork etc. is .... |
| 09:34.44 | koen | if COPYING is empty, it's plain old copyright |
| 09:35.39 | Pander | aha: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/License |
| 09:36.48 | sparq | Pander: thought that doesn't really address branding |
| 09:37.04 | sparq | Though, the wiki pages are soggy with OpenMoko branding, and they are tagged GNU FDL. |
| 09:39.28 | sparq | XorA: curse you and your logic! |
| 09:40.01 | XorA | sparq: :-D |
| 09:40.48 | XorA | and will make debian cry |
| 09:41.52 | Elrond | Ohh, please not again. |
| 09:41.55 | Pander | so hypothetically: if I would create some t-shirts with openmoko logo/artwork and sell them, that would be perfectly legal and upsetting people in the community? |
| 09:42.19 | sparq | That would be sad. I've seen Debian a developer cry. It's just not right. |
| 09:42.34 | XorA | icemoko :-) |
| 09:42.38 | ewon | heh |
| 09:42.41 | koen | mokoweasel |
| 09:42.54 | sparq | what is a "moko", anyway? Can it have an opposite? |
| 09:42.54 | XorA | although amusingly iceweasel is the most unstable form of firefox I ever used |
| 09:42.56 | ewon | if gentoo are the boyracers of the linux world, debian are the emo kids |
| 09:44.20 | sparq | ewon: With a generous sprinkling of angry system administrators |
| 09:44.31 | ewon | not as angry as the RHEL ones |
| 09:44.58 | ewon | i've seen redhat packet manager cause angry pulsating veins to start throbbing on sysadmins' foreheads |
| 09:45.04 | XorA | ewon: yeah but they are angry with reason, they see Fedora Core working :-) |
| 09:45.09 | Pander | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moko |
| 09:45.26 | ewon | no, they see people using CentOS with apt-functionality and other shinyness |
| 09:45.42 | sparq | ewon: Oh, no -- Debian sysadmins like Debian. They just hate the world. |
| 09:47.48 | sparq | Moko is the Ruler King of Lizards! |
| 09:48.48 | XorA | so SuseMoko :-D |
| 09:49.55 | sparq | I guess Debian could release it as OpenPere, to keep within the Cook Island mythology theme. |
| 09:50.28 | XorA | Cook island wasnt the one where all the males got arrested a couple of years ago was it? |
| 09:51.28 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@qiqinebs.chi.il.us) |
| 09:52.02 | sparq | XorA: no, that's Pitcairn |
| 09:52.23 | XorA | sparq: phew! |
| 09:54.03 | sparq | XorA: the Cook Islands were featured in Jared Diamond's book "Collapse: How Societies Choose to Fail or Succeed" as one of the cases where people were smart, and didn't wreck their environment. |
| 09:54.27 | XorA | sparq: you sound far too intelligent to be talking to a lowlife like me :-) |
| 09:54.39 | sparq | pfft. |
| 09:55.09 | sparq | This is IRC. We are all lowlifes. |
| 09:57.11 | sparq | That is why it is fun. |
| 09:58.24 | XorA | amarsh04: you should know that bugs.debian.org is about the same as /dev/null with a lot of package maintainers |
| 09:58.35 | ewon | I love Ulrich |
| 09:58.40 | ewon | he broke backtrace() |
| 09:58.46 | ewon | and he refuses to fix it |
| 09:58.55 | sparq | amarsh04: threaten to file more bugs against his/her packages. I'm sure you can find an embarassing policy violation or two. |
| 09:59.10 | amarsh04 | yes, but I have had good success XorA, ususally using reportbug and replying promptly to any further queries from the developer |
| 09:59.20 | amarsh04 | hehehe sqarq |
| 09:59.41 | XorA | amarsh04: you must be a lucky one that packages you care about have an active developer :-) |
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| 10:00.44 | sparq | amarsh04: Remember, Debian is a bureaucracy. The way you punish people in a bureaucracy is to generate paperwork for them. |
| 10:01.55 | Elrond | *G* |
| 10:02.13 | sparq | amarsh04: *especially* if the paperwork in question forces them into a public test of loyalty. |
| 10:02.26 | ewon | http://sources.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=956 <-- Ulrich Drepper at his finest |
| 10:02.27 | Stephmw | hmmm, interesting new product, http://www.amazegps.com/index.php?page=register |
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| 10:03.21 | Elrond | sparq - What was this "Pitcairn" story? |
| 10:03.56 | CM | Elrond: A culture involving child abuse |
| 10:05.15 | CM | Elrond: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pitcairn_sexual_assault_trial_of_2004 |
| 10:05.54 | amarsh04 | I thought that the trial took more than a year |
| 10:06.43 | CM | Well, that WP page says: "2007 Brian Michael John Young is found guilty of rape and indecent assault, and sentenced to six-and-a-half years in prison." |
| 10:07.44 | sparq | Elrond: Remember the HMS Bounty (as in the mutiny thereon)? Pitcairn is where the mutineers settled with some women they found (abducted? I can't remember) elsewhere. |
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| 10:10.38 | sparq | Elrond: The island is part of the the Brittish Commonwealth, though it isn't really a viable long term settlement (it was settled before by Polyniesians, but it was far too inhospitibal, so they either left or died) |
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| 10:17.14 | sparq | </blather> |
| 10:18.36 | amarsh04 | pity about the Cutty Sark )-: |
| 10:20.17 | Stephmw | yeah, just found out myself |
| 10:20.43 | Stephmw | from the bbc article it seems that most of the stuff was offsite, thankfully |
| 10:22.10 | amarsh04 | I mean, the Endeavour and Bounty replicas are nice, but they're still replicas |
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| 10:23.31 | amarsh04 | wonders how much FLOSS gets decent long-term archiving |
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| 10:25.22 | Fletch | counter |
| 10:25.23 | aloril | http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter (probability guess: 65%) P1: 6 days 01:34:54 (6.066 +-5.0 days) (1229;210) |
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| 10:27.53 | BlackFog | hi |
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| 10:49.07 | Elrond | sparq, CM - Thanks for tha answers (I was distracted by RL) |
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| 11:15.42 | CIA-24 | openmoko: 03mickey * r2049 10/trunk/oe/packages/settings-daemon/settings-daemon_svn.bb: oe/settings-daemon: catch up with new o-hand default theme |
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| 11:20.34 | Elrond | Hi mickeyl! :) |
| 11:27.27 | mickeyl | hi. will be back in 2h. need to visit a T* store to sort out my network problems :/ |
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| 12:09.30 | kiney_ | counter |
| 12:09.30 | aloril | http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter (probability guess: 65%) P1: 5 days 23:50:47 (5.994 +-5.0 days) (1230;210) |
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| 12:24.48 | DukeOfURL | What about Cutty Sark? |
| 12:25.03 | ewon | arson attack |
| 12:25.16 | DukeOfURL | In Greenwich, correct? |
| 12:25.39 | DukeOfURL | bad? |
| 12:26.17 | koen | wooden ship in dry dock + fire |
| 12:26.26 | XorA | boom |
| 12:26.39 | DukeOfURL | that's a shame |
| 12:26.49 | DukeOfURL | put extra guards on Victory |
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| 13:28.24 | minime | + |
| 13:30.23 | webjames | hello |
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| 14:21.45 | Mandarino | counter |
| 14:21.46 | aloril | http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter (probability guess: 65%) P1: 5 days 21:38:31 (5.902 +-5.0 days) (1231;210) |
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| 15:01.56 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Wishlist:Text_Input]] [[Wishlist:BuiltInScriptingLanguage]] [[Wish_List]] |
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| 15:12.22 | filippo | counter |
| 15:12.22 | aloril | http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter (probability guess: 65%) P1: 5 days 20:47:55 (5.867 +-5.0 days) (1232;210) |
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| 16:03.13 | TRIsoft | gtg cu |
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| 18:43.33 | MacNorth | hrmmm.... 'will be FCC certified' |
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| 18:46.06 | Magon | MacNorth: yes that is terrifiing |
| 18:47.28 | keesj | does the operator know what kind of phone you use? |
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| 18:49.01 | keesj | I like the looks of the openmoko ui |
| 18:49.25 | Magon | keesj: it know IMEI |
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| 18:51.14 | kiney_ | counter |
| 18:51.14 | aloril | http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter (probability guess: 65%) P1: 5 days 17:09:03 (5.715 +-5.0 days) (1233;210) |
| 18:51.45 | baze | hi |
| 18:52.26 | keesj | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Mobile_Equipment_Identity#IMEI_and_the_law at least you apparently don't need to be regulated for an imei |
| 18:52.34 | baze | maybe somebody could clear things up a bit for me with this whole gnome mobile stuff.. |
| 18:53.02 | baze | is gnome mobile some kind of desktop which you can run on top of openmoko or is it a replacement? |
| 18:53.20 | cjb | well, it doesn't exist yet |
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| 18:53.27 | cjb | but it would be a replacement, when it exists, I think |
| 18:53.47 | baze | hm |
| 18:54.18 | LoDown | counter |
| 18:54.19 | aloril | http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter (probability guess: 65%) P1: 5 days 17:05:58 (5.712 +-5.0 days) (1234;210) |
| 18:54.41 | baze | sad to hear, i hoped these projects would both help each other to provide one great free basis for phones and such |
| 18:54.44 | timtimred | hi, is the perhaps end of may handset mentioned in the topic a final hardware rev? |
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| 18:56.23 | Elrond | timtimred - It is assumed to be final. Software of course is a completely different story |
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| 18:56.36 | timtimred | im not too bothered about the software :) |
| 18:56.46 | MacNorth | final of the 'old' hardware, though, as i understand it |
| 18:57.00 | MacNorth | the slower processor, no wiki 'final' revision |
| 18:57.06 | MacNorth | s/wiki/wifi/ |
| 18:57.37 | Elrond | Right. |
| 18:57.49 | timtimred | cool, um, i think... thanks :) |
| 18:57.51 | Elrond | Still a nice thing. Just a little slow. |
| 18:58.54 | Elrond | Hi bkuhn |
| 18:59.06 | bkuhn | Hello Elrond. :) |
| 18:59.55 | bkuhn | Elrond: I usually just idle here to see what's going on. But, SFLC is anxiously awaiting the developer purchase release of the phone; we're planning on making it the standard device for the organization. |
| 19:00.15 | balrog-kun | i think there doesn't have to be a final version, there's no reason for the board to stop evolving at any point (especially when bugs are discovered along the way) |
| 19:00.44 | MacNorth | heh, what do you mean? the hardware is perfect :-P |
| 19:00.48 | MacNorth | the software, otoh... |
| 19:02.35 | balrog-kun | i'm sure there will be tons of things changed between P1.5 and P2 |
| 19:02.35 | balrog-kun | assumming both P1.5 and P2 come some day |
| 19:02.36 | MacNorth | and that the FCC blesses them for the yanks :) |
| 19:02.36 | timtimred | can you sum up the state of the software in two words? |
| 19:02.36 | balrog-kun | yeah, this is optimistic :p |
| 19:02.49 | timtimred | mostly working? mostly broken? :) |
| 19:03.22 | MacNorth | mostly complicated |
| 19:03.46 | timtimred | thats not really helpful :) |
| 19:04.05 | MacNorth | two words is too few :) |
| 19:04.19 | timtimred | nahh it isnt... :) |
| 19:10.15 | Elrond | bkuhn - SFLC? |
| 19:10.31 | bkuhn | Elrond: Software Freedom Law Center, www.softwarefreedom.org |
| 19:11.18 | Elrond | Ahh :-) |
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| 19:24.11 | webjames | arghh, all these delays |
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| 20:47.46 | billl_ | counter |
| 20:47.47 | aloril | http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter (probability guess: 65%) P1: 5 days 15:12:30 (5.634 +-5.0 days) (1235;211) |
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| 20:54.56 | DukeOfURL | is the lat/lon of Cingulat and T-Mobile base stations available? |
| 21:01.19 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Talk:MokoMakefile]] |
| 21:03.59 | Elrond | rwhitby - You there? |
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| 21:09.12 | rwhitby | Elrond: yup |
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| 21:10.55 | Hopscotch | hmmm |
| 21:10.56 | Elrond | rwhitby - I'm currently using MokoMakfile and I wonder, why it checks out the whole openmoko svn and not only trunk? |
| 21:11.26 | rwhitby | Elrond: cause that's what the official build instructions said. |
| 21:11.38 | rwhitby | (it is true that it could only check out trunk) |
| 21:12.00 | rwhitby | but it is nice to see what's in werner's development branch ;-) |
| 21:12.17 | Elrond | hehe. ;) |
| 21:14.21 | Elrond | rwhitby - The other thing: Makefile-target "setup-openmoko-developer" and "setup-openmoko" look very similiar. Is that on purpose / why not factor the common part out in its own rule? |
| 21:14.41 | *** part/#openmoko summatusmentis (n=summatus@72.168.202.219) |
| 21:15.22 | rwhitby | the developer target is a once-off only for people with write access to the openmoko svn repo. |
| 21:15.35 | rwhitby | (it could probably do with a better name) |
| 21:16.14 | Elrond | rwhitby - Ahh. :-) |
| 21:16.58 | Elrond | rwhitby - Final thing: One usually uses "( cd FOO && somecommand )" not with ";" in the middle. ;-) |
| 21:17.57 | rwhitby | true |
| 21:18.23 | rwhitby | when the preceeding command was [ -e FOO ] || mkdir FOO it doesn't matter too much ;-) |
| 21:18.48 | rwhitby | (since that makefile command will fail if the dir couldn't be created) |
| 21:19.08 | Elrond | ( cd bitbake ; svn revert -R . ) <-- no preceding [ .. ] && ;o) |
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| 21:19.42 | *** join/#openmoko pavelm (n=pavel@gprs189-60.eurotel.cz) |
| 21:19.48 | Elrond | Hi pavelm! :-)) |
| 21:19.50 | pavelm | Hello, everyone. |
| 21:20.03 | bkuhn | hi pavelm |
| 21:20.06 | pavelm | I was browsing bugzilla... and we are searching for ringtones. |
| 21:20.12 | pavelm | ..is there midi support planned? |
| 21:20.15 | pavelm | Hi, Elrond! |
| 21:20.19 | rwhitby | Elrond: in both cases, there is either an existence test for bitbake (or a subdirectory) or a dependency on stamps/bitbake (which does the same thing) |
| 21:21.46 | Elrond | rwhitby - Heh :-) It was just a "would look nicer to old school make guys like me" thing. :-)) |
| 21:22.03 | Elrond | pavelm - Can you do me a favour with your v3? |
| 21:22.23 | rwhitby | Elrond: but you did find a bug - make setup-patches on it's own (not part of make setup) is missing dependencies on stamps/bitbake and stamps/openembedded |
| 21:22.25 | pavelm | elrond: Depends on what kind of favour :) |
| 21:23.08 | rwhitby | Elrond: I only do the && thing if there is the slightest chance that the former clause can fail. |
| 21:24.18 | Elrond | rwhitby - The slightest chance is people like me, who put stamps without the real thing existing. ;o) |
| 21:24.40 | pavelm | elrond: But tell me what the favour is... |
| 21:24.49 | CIA-24 | openmoko: 03rwhitby * r95 10mokomakefile/trunk/Makefile: Added missing dependencies for setup-patches on setup-bitbake and setup-openembedded. Thanks Elrond for spotting them. |
| 21:26.02 | Elrond | pavelm - Can you please test u-boot-gta01bv3-r8_70124c2602ae2d4c5d3dba05b482d91548242de8_0_2040.bin from buildhost on it and tell me, if it works and its md5sum |
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| 21:27.37 | pavelm | elrond: If I brick the v3, I'll have very hard time bringing it back up :-( |
| 21:27.53 | pavelm | elrond: I can tell you known good version of uboot (+md5sum) if that helps? |
| 21:28.05 | Elrond | pavelm - That would also help. :-) |
| 21:28.11 | Elrond | pavelm - You don't have a debug board? |
| 21:29.18 | pavelm | elrond: Have debug board but do not know how to use it. |
| 21:29.34 | pavelm | elrond: I'm using u-boot-gta01bv3-r5_9877d7dcd1eebe61aa5d8b8ffe9c048ea426e6f6_0_1910.bin |
| 21:29.48 | pavelm | elrond: md5: d8965b38d11ac679fdc1fe227e4e31a8 |
| 21:30.34 | Elrond | pavelm - Ahh. :-)) |
| 21:30.45 | Elrond | pavelm - The debug board usage is described on the wiki. ;-) |
| 21:31.13 | pavelm | elrond: Yes... just... I'd prefer not to go through that. |
| 21:33.58 | Elrond | pavelm - Okay. :-) |
| 21:34.40 | pavelm | elrond: So you have v3 but not v4 hardware near you? |
| 21:35.41 | pavelm | Did anyone get python to work on openmoko? |
| 21:35.50 | Elrond | pavelm - Exactly. :-) |
| 21:36.06 | Elrond | pavelm - python is on my list, when I have the buildenv working. ;) |
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| 21:36.38 | pavelm | elrond: Ouch, it seems buildenv is "little tricky" to get to work :( |
| 21:37.41 | Elrond | pavelm - MokoMakefile seems to do a good job. Except you need 100 cpu-minutes on a 2.9GHz machine just for the openembedded "download". ;o) |
| 21:39.17 | pavelm | I added bugs into the bugsystem... about too small fonts, and need to lock touchscreen after inactivity. I hope they are not duplicates. |
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| 21:39.33 | pavelm | elrond: Hmm, I wonder how long "build" takes... |
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| 21:40.19 | Elrond | pavelm - I'm trying to build gtk+ just now... it reads bitbake files on my 300MHz desktop... slowly. ;o) |
| 21:42.05 | pavelm | elrond: I guess you should get slightly faster cpu... |
| 21:42.20 | pavelm | elrond: 300MHz desktop is still going to be slightly faster than native compiling |
| 21:42.30 | pavelm | elrond: ...but I guess the keyword is "slightly". |
| 21:44.14 | Elrond | No, it will be quite faster. My box has lots more RAM :) |
| 21:44.19 | Elrond | ... and more cache. ;) |
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| 21:51.01 | webjames | does ram make a massive difference? |
| 21:52.01 | cjb | cache does. |
| 21:52.45 | pavelm_afc | cjb/web: both cache and ram make huge difference |
| 21:52.53 | pavelm_afc | native compiling on neo would be very bad idea. |
| 21:53.01 | pavelm_afc | question: |
| 21:53.13 | pavelm_afc | on both bv3 and bv4 hardware, I see significant screen flicker. |
| 21:53.16 | *** join/#openmoko kW_ (n=kwkw@prj-496-66.sfac.auckland.ac.nz) |
| 21:53.40 | pavelm_afc | main menu shows it nicely, and when white rectangle is present, it makes it more visible. |
| 21:53.48 | pavelm_afc | do you see it, too? |
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| 21:55.39 | pavelm_afc | running find / over ssh makes it _very_ visible. |
| 21:56.11 | pavelm_afc | ...should I just bugzilla it? |
| 21:56.13 | Elrond | pavelm_afc - Let me try. |
| 21:56.41 | balrog-kun | 128MB is not that bad for compiling C |
| 21:57.16 | Elrond | Right. |
| 21:57.16 | ewon | I suspect something is making the vblank interrupt la |
| 21:57.18 | ewon | lag |
| 21:57.26 | ewon | irq conflict? |
| 21:57.40 | pavelm_afc | ewon: Do you see the flicker? |
| 21:57.40 | webjames | the main menu shows it nicely? |
| 21:57.55 | ewon | pavelm_afc: I would if I had the hardware, I susepct |
| 21:58.06 | webjames | i get the white bit where you can select the keyboard |
| 21:59.28 | webjames | is that something to do with ram? |
| 21:59.41 | pavelm_afc | webjames: Yes, main menu is good at it, and ssh with find / makes it more visible |
| 21:59.50 | Elrond | pavelm_afc - No flicker here. I get flicker in u-boot, when it shows the menu and there is this coloured part on the bottom. When I look in the "right" angle on it, it flickers. |
| 22:00.48 | pavelm_afc | elrond: can you try to ssh in, type find / |
| 22:02.06 | Elrond | pavelm_afc - I did. |
| 22:02.52 | Elrond | pavelm_afc - Any idea how I can get the CPU frequency in the running linux? /proc/cpuinfo only has bogomips. |
| 22:03.24 | pavelm_afc | elrond: Ok, but I seen it on both v3 and v4... I guess I'm just too sensitive? But my brother seen it too (without me telling him). |
| 22:03.54 | pavelm_afc | elrond: it is in /sys/ somewhere. |
| 22:04.13 | Elrond | pavelm_afc - I'm quite senstive to flicker (I have no idea why. I have _very_ bad eyes). But nothing. My current suspection is: The cpu runs only in 100MHz mode. |
| 22:05.26 | pavelm_afc | it is in /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cpufreq/cpuinfo_cur_freq on pc, but moko has no cpufreq dir :-( |
| 22:05.47 | balrog-kun | you can enable it |
| 22:05.59 | Elrond | pavelm_afc - Right. And /proc/cpuinfo also nothing. |
| 22:06.17 | Elrond | balrog-kun - Huh? |
| 22:06.35 | balrog-kun | Elrond: in menuconfig |
| 22:06.56 | balrog-kun | you can also ask u-boot about the current clocking |
| 22:08.05 | Elrond | balrog-kun - u-boot told me 100MHz ;) |
| 22:09.23 | balrog-kun | Elrond: you can also tell u-boot to ramp it up :P |
| 22:09.58 | Elrond | Yeah, I might do that. ;-) |
| 22:10.13 | Elrond | Or update my u-boot and see, if the frequency default has changed. ;) |
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| 22:32.37 | pavelm_afc | hmm, I thought kernel _needs_ to do frequency changes if want reasonable power consumption... |
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| 22:37.50 | Elrond | pavelm - Yes. But the frequency scaling is not yet done. It's an open bug. |
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| 22:39.44 | pavelm | elrond: well, maybe it is not _that_ important on arm platform. |
| 22:41.06 | balrog-kun | the commercial linux PDAs and phones i know don't do cpufreq by default |
| 22:41.15 | balrog-kun | neither does my PDA |
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| 22:42.55 | pavelm | balrog: It has something to do with race-to-idle vs. idle-as-little-as-possible. |
| 22:43.06 | pavelm | balrog: PIIs and similar want the latter. |
| 22:43.38 | pavelm | balrog: even newer intel designs need the former, so it is possible that it is right thing to do on samsung, too. |
| 22:43.51 | balrog-kun | pavelm: i don't know, but all the SoCs support idling and Linux uses it |
| 22:44.37 | balrog-kun | on the pxa Linux does change the clock frequency just before suspending but that's hardcoded and i'm not sure why it does it, it's not cpufreq |
| 22:45.09 | pavelm | balrog: PIIs support idling, too, but it is so inefficient that you want to lower cpu speed and make computations take longer. |
| 22:45.25 | balrog-kun | also i'm not sure if cpufreq was supported in 2.4 |
| 22:45.28 | pavelm | balrog: I guess that lowering cpufreqency is neccessary step for suspend on pxa. |
| 22:45.44 | balrog-kun | the Zaurus PDAs for example come with 2.4 by default |
| 22:45.58 | pavelm | balrog: I'm pretty sure cpufreq was in 2.4. |
| 22:46.04 | balrog-kun | pavelm: from the specs it doesn't seem so but maybe some hardware quirk |
| 22:46.52 | pavelm | balrog: I did not read the specs, so I can't comment on that. |
| 22:47.04 | balrog-kun | i thought non-constant HZ was introduced recently |
| 22:47.23 | pavelm | balrog: non-constant HZ is 2.6.21 stuff, but cpufreq is _way_ older than that. |
| 22:47.50 | balrog-kun | pavelm: i see |
| 22:51.52 | Elrond | Ahh. |
| 22:58.07 | *** join/#openmoko palmino (n=upirc@213-156-52-100.fastres.net) |
| 23:00.52 | pavelm | ..ahha, phase0 hw + recent kernels = non-working sound :-( |
| 23:01.42 | palmino | :-(( |
| 23:02.08 | bmidgley | pavelm: what are you able to run to test the audio? |
| 23:02.55 | bmidgley | I can't get the dialer to work, no media player, etc |
| 23:02.55 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Buying_Interest_List]] [[Wish_List_-_Hardware]] |
| 23:02.55 | pavelm | ANTS from phase1 :-) |
| 23:02.56 | Elrond | pavelm - You need the right modules. |
| 23:02.56 | pavelm | it calls alsamixer, and it becomes rather obvious that there are no soundcards there. |
| 23:03.01 | Elrond | pavelm - Which kernel do you have? |
| 23:03.20 | pavelm | uImage-2.6-moko10-r0_0_2006_0-fic-gta01.bin |
| 23:03.31 | pavelm | 2.6.21.1-moko10 |
| 23:03.48 | Elrond | pavelm - Ahh. You need to get the modules*2006*.tgz and get the modules you'd like to have. |
| 23:04.57 | Elrond | pavelm - Can you see, if the backlight works with that kernel? |
| 23:05.15 | Elrond | root@fic-gta01:/sys/class/backlight/gta01-bl$ cat actual_brightness |
| 23:05.41 | pavelm | so I need to flash openmoko-devel-image-fic-gta01-20070519034607.rootfs.jffs2 and then add modules? |
| 23:06.00 | palmino | Hello, I'm trying Message Ease on my Palm T3. |
| 23:06.04 | pavelm | cat actual_brightness |
| 23:06.05 | pavelm | 0 |
| 23:06.39 | Elrond | pavelm - use any rootfs you like. Just add the modules. ;-) |
| 23:06.50 | pavelm | ...it seems broken here. |
| 23:07.00 | Elrond | What is broken? The backlight? |
| 23:07.18 | Elrond | "echo 1000 > brightness" <-- to change backlight. |
| 23:07.45 | palmino | cool |
| 23:08.13 | Elrond | palmino - Hmm? |
| 23:08.14 | pavelm | elrond thanks -- mdules are indeed a problem |
| 23:08.15 | *** join/#openmoko t[cc]smar (n=[cc]smar@gw.ptr-62-65-142-223.customer.ch.netstream.com) |
| 23:08.30 | Elrond | pavelm - Does the backlight setting work? |
| 23:08.30 | pavelm | elrond: actual_brightness shows 0, but brightness is definitely not zero. |
| 23:09.02 | DukeOfURL | hey, someone with a Neo. does it have a serial number? is the IMEI printed on the outside of the phone? |
| 23:09.04 | bmidgley | Elrond: is there a list of which of the modules are worth copying over? |
| 23:09.04 | pavelm | elrond: I can echo values into brightness but see no effect. |
| 23:09.57 | Elrond | DukeOfURL - For P0: No. |
| 23:10.10 | Elrond | bmidgley - I can paste my list. ;o) |
| 23:10.23 | Elrond | pavelm - *arg* So still bugged. |
| 23:10.27 | *** part/#openmoko palmino (n=upirc@213-156-52-100.fastres.net) |
| 23:10.46 | pavelm | duke: Not sure. It has "date code", "S/N", Part No:, and code below barcode. |
| 23:11.16 | pavelm | duke: why? |
| 23:11.17 | DukeOfURL | do you know what the barcode is? |
| 23:11.36 | Elrond | neo% echo *module* | sed -e 's/kernel-module-//g' -e 's/_2.6.21.[^ ]*ipk//g' |
| 23:11.36 | Elrond | bluetooth hci-usb ohci-hcd snd-soc-neo1973-wm8753 snd-soc-s3c24xx-i2s snd-soc-s3c24xx snd-soc-wm8753 |
| 23:12.02 | DukeOfURL | I'll have to provision/manage a large number of phones for employees. |
| 23:12.02 | pavelm | duke: But of course it has IMEI. You need imei to talk to gsm network. |
| 23:12.11 | pavelm | duke: Why do you ask? |
| 23:12.16 | DukeOfURL | Right. Is IMEI printed with the S/N? |
| 23:12.31 | bmidgley | Elrond: please do pastebin the list |
| 23:13.30 | pavelm | duke: I do not know, but I guess that the number below barcode is imei. |
| 23:13.32 | Elrond | bmidgley - Just pastebin from my stuff here yourself? |
| 23:13.39 | Elrond | bmidgley - It's my minimal list. |
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| 23:18.08 | bmidgley | Elrond: pastebin.com would be handy for that |
| 23:18.36 | *** join/#openmoko [psy] (n=psy0rz@lounge.datux.nl) |
| 23:19.58 | pavelm | elrond: Is it possible that my backlight problems are because of missing modules? |
| 23:23.51 | hamada | where does one buy a hardware hit? |
| 23:23.52 | aloril | hamada: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (Hopefully this link answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) |
| 23:23.54 | Elrond | pavelm - I considered that possiblility, but I looked twice through modules*.tgz and didn't find anything, that looked promissing. You're welcome to recheck. |
| 23:23.55 | hamada | where does one buy a hardware kit? |
| 23:24.16 | Elrond | hamada - You mean a phone? |
| 23:24.53 | hamada | yes |
| 23:24.59 | balrog-kun | pavelm: if you have a directory /sys/class/backlight/gta01-bl then the driver is loaded |
| 23:25.07 | balrog-kun | and then it's not a modules issue |
| 23:25.50 | pavelm | balrog: Right... I even have the files so no, I'm not having module issue. |
| 23:25.58 | Elrond | hamada - Do "/msg aloril counter?" |
| 23:26.01 | CIA-24 | openmoko: 03alphaone * r2051 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007/applications/openmoko-mainmenu/ (ChangeLog src/callbacks.c src/main.c): |
| 23:26.01 | CIA-24 | openmoko: * src/callbacks.c (moko_icon_view_selection_changed_cb): |
| 23:26.01 | CIA-24 | openmoko: * src/main.c (handle_sigusr1): |
| 23:26.01 | CIA-24 | openmoko: Use the new moko_window_set_status_message functions to convey |
| 23:26.01 | CIA-24 | openmoko: information to the footer. I still kept all the dbus deps since |
| 23:26.04 | CIA-24 | openmoko: I'm not sure whether we still need it in the mainmenu. |
| 23:26.28 | Elrond | pavelm - Can you check for a bug and/or file one? |
| 23:27.02 | pavelm | elrond: I'm too sleepy for that. |
| 23:28.14 | Elrond | pavelm - Okay. I'll do it tomorrow. :-) |
| 23:28.57 | Elrond | bmidgley - My firefox is already closed. And like pavelm I'm too sleepy to use a pastebin now. Not for 2 lines. |
| 23:29.00 | DukeOfURL | with two batteries, is there an appliance to charge the second battery while the first is in the phone? |
| 23:29.05 | hamada | thanks Elrond |
| 23:31.11 | Elrond | DukeOfURL - http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973_Battery |
| 23:32.36 | Elrond | Good night people. :-) |
| 23:35.28 | pavelm | good night! |
| 23:35.28 | miip | gn8 |
| 23:37.48 | *** part/#openmoko hamada (n=hamada@192.18.191.9) |
| 23:38.48 | webjames | night all |
| 23:40.12 | Elrond | pavelm - Your neo's backlight is on in reality, but the driver says "0" for brightness? |
| 23:41.15 | pavelm | Elrond: I copied all the modules... and still no sound :-* |
| 23:41.16 | *** join/#openmoko hadara_ (i=hadara@bsd.ee) |
| 23:41.19 | pavelm | :-( |
| 23:42.32 | Elrond | pavelm - modprobe snd-soc-neo1973-wm8753 |
| 23:42.34 | pavelm | elrond: root@fic-gta01:~/DM2$ cat /sys/class/backlight/gta01-bl/actual_brightness |
| 23:42.34 | pavelm | 0 |
| 23:42.34 | pavelm | ...and backlight is on. |
| 23:42.35 | Elrond | Okay, so it's definitely buggy. |
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| 23:42.56 | pavelm | wow, that did the trick. Sound now works in phase0 neo, good. |
| 23:42.56 | Elrond | With a working one, I just noticed, that there must be a different "on/off"-switch. Because the screensaver switched it off and doing "echo 1000>brightness" did not switch it on. |
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| 23:44.55 | Elrond | This discharging thing in the P0 is annoying. I guess I really need to put the battery out, when not using it. :-( |
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| 23:45.21 | CIA-24 | openmoko: 03andrew * r2052 10/trunk/src/host/qemu-neo1973/ (16 files in 2 dirs): |
| 23:45.22 | CIA-24 | openmoko: "savevm"/"loadvm" support for ARM cores, the S3C peripherals and random other hardware. |
| 23:45.22 | CIA-24 | openmoko: Allow snapshot storing in mtdblock images and rip out some of the hardcoded HDD snapshot checks. |
| 23:45.42 | pavelm | elrond: Yes, battery needs to be 10 cm from the neo, so that neo can't drain it :-) |
| 23:48.32 | pavelm | hmm... and now my phase0 neo oopses during boot. I should really get some sleep. |
| 23:48.32 | Elrond | pavelm - Well, sometimes it surprised me possitively. |
| 23:49.07 | pavelm | elrond: like "I left it turned off for a day, and batery was more than 10% full! Amazing hw!" ? ;-) |
| 23:49.49 | Elrond | pavelm - After being at a friend with it, I didn't switch it off correctly. Just the screen was dark. It happily survived all the travel home, etc. (some many hours). And I still found files in tmpfs we put there. ;-) (abusing the neo as a usb-stick ;o) ) |
| 23:50.35 | pavelm | elrond: It is a cellphone. Cellphones should do that. |
| 23:50.45 | Elrond | pavelm - Like "I left it turned of for half a day and it still had more than 60% the battery.". |
| 23:50.50 | pavelm | elrond: Like "survive in standby for a week". |
| 23:50.59 | Elrond | Yep, they should. |
| 23:51.06 | pavelm | elrond: That's good for phase0 openmoko. Mine died after 4 hours. |
| 23:51.16 | Elrond | I guess, even the P1 will not survive the week. :-( |
| 23:51.19 | pavelm | Good night! |
| 23:51.33 | Elrond | Good night (I really should go to bed too) |
| 23:51.51 | pavelm | (no, p1 will likely not survive a week, but it should last 3 days, or it is unusable on mass market). |
| 23:52.03 | pavelm | (for me, 24 hours standby is okay, but I'm strange). |
| 23:53.49 | Elrond | Yeah, mass market really need 3 days or more. |
| 23:54.05 | Elrond | My currennt phone has between 7-14 days. |
| 23:54.21 | pavelm | elrond: well, I basically empty any battery within 8 hours... |
| 23:54.32 | Elrond | *G* :-) |
| 23:54.37 | pavelm | elrond: unlimited data plan on gprs :-) |
| 23:54.51 | don-o | Elrond: what phone is your current phone? |
| 23:55.00 | Elrond | don-o - Siemens ME45. |
| 23:55.01 | DukeOfURL | pavelm: what's the data rate? |
| 23:55.26 | Elrond | don-o - It's gsm only, no "smart" thing. |
| 23:55.29 | pavelm | duke: 25kilobytes per second at home, 5 kilobytes per second outside. |
| 23:55.45 | don-o | i lost my phone yesterday (ericsson t-29) that i had for years. i think its a sign to buy a neo but alas they arent available yet |
| 23:56.12 | Elrond | don-o - You wouldn't want it NOW to replace a real phone. |
| 23:56.35 | Elrond | don-o - Like the backlight control is currently b0rked. (I'll file the bug tomorrow) |
| 23:56.45 | don-o | Elrond: all it has to do is make calls. it can do that much, right? |
| 23:56.56 | Elrond | Reportedly. |
| 23:57.16 | Elrond | I never had a sim in "mine" ;) |
| 23:57.19 | pavelm | don-o: Well... not reliably. |
| 23:57.35 | don-o | what about receive calls? |
| 23:57.39 | Elrond | pavelm - I'm not surprised. :) |
| 23:57.58 | don-o | i figure it'll be horribly buggy for a while, but i think i can live with that. |
| 23:58.13 | pavelm | don-o: Yep, receiving calls worked once. |
| 23:58.30 | pavelm | don-o: Get old t68i -- these were nice beasts. Should last half a year before neo is usable. |
| 23:58.40 | Elrond | don-o - Well, if you don't need it for "professional work" ;) |
| 23:59.10 | Elrond | The me45 is also still a nice rugged phone. |
| 23:59.13 | pavelm | bye bye. |
| 23:59.21 | Elrond | (I like it's rugged feeling!) |
| 23:59.26 | Elrond | pavelm - Bye. :-) |
| 23:59.46 | don-o | id like to get an iPhone until the neo is ready :) |