| 00:08.54 | rwhitby | Any outstanding MokoMakefile problems? |
| 00:09.05 | *** join/#openmoko grgehunt (n=greg@88-108-93-51.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com) |
| 00:12.51 | MacNorth | so far no :) |
| 00:13.06 | MacNorth | (now that i have the right Makefile) |
| 00:13.20 | MacNorth | (and fixed my buggy router) |
| 00:16.29 | *** part/#openmoko pingu (i=pingu@gentoo/developer/pingu) |
| 00:17.54 | rwhitby | cool - so the only problems I know about at the moment are both stock OpenEmbedded 64-bit support problems, |
| 00:19.14 | MacNorth | i'm at glibc right now, so it'll be a few more hours before it finishes. |
| 00:20.42 | Psi | is all this recompiling that i see people doing in here because FIC/phase0 guys are coming out with a new patch for some bug every day or so? |
| 00:43.40 | aevin | Psi: yes, kind of. |
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| 01:04.36 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03werner * r1365 10/trunk/src/host/devirginator/environment.in: |
| 01:04.36 | CIA-7 | openmoko: - ${mtdparts} was missing in menu_1 bootargs |
| 01:04.36 | CIA-7 | openmoko: - added sd_image_name mechanism from |
| 01:04.36 | CIA-7 | openmoko: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Booting_from_SD |
| 01:06.11 | *** join/#openmoko stryderjzw (n=stryderj@216.232.85.137) |
| 01:10.32 | rwhitby | Is werner in IRC? |
| 01:12.53 | *** join/#openmoko dirakx (n=pilar@69.79.145.81) |
| 01:14.54 | loufoque | rwhitby: no one is in IRC |
| 01:15.13 | rwhitby | loufoque: just wondering if we went under a different nick. |
| 01:15.59 | aevin | the wener online at freenode now isn't him, at least. |
| 01:16.04 | aevin | *werner |
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| 01:16.35 | aevin | rwhitby: send him a mail or something. if he's working, he's probably checking mail as well. |
| 01:16.53 | rwhitby | aevin: already communicating by email - hoping to speed up the interaction |
| 01:17.38 | aevin | aha. |
| 01:18.56 | aevin | btw, on his reply to you on the devel-ML about devirginator, did he mean the package had to be called something else that devirginator? what's wrong with that name? |
| 01:19.02 | aevin | *than |
| 01:19.37 | loufoque | aevin: it's too sex biased |
| 01:19.59 | rwhitby | no, he was talking about setup,sh |
| 01:20.50 | aevin | okay. |
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| 01:57.46 | Agrajag- | rwhitby: im using mokomakefile and my CPU fan has suddenly started making horrible noises. if i kill it now (doing make openmoko-devel-image at the moment), is it going to do all this stuff again when i run it again? |
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| 02:11.13 | rwhitby | Agrajag-: where is it up to? |
| 02:11.40 | rwhitby | if it's in the middle of building packages, then yeah, you can stop and restart it and it will pick up where it left off. |
| 02:12.38 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03caowai_song * r1366 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007/applications/openmoko-keyboard/ (configure.ac layouts/Makefile.am src/Makefile.am): Update the config files, change matchbox to openmoko |
| 02:13.00 | Agrajag- | rwhitby looks like it's building glibc |
| 02:13.48 | Agrajag- | ta.. i think i'll stop it anyway |
| 02:14.09 | rwhitby | MokoMakefile is a good machine stress test .... |
| 02:14.59 | Agrajag- | heh |
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| 02:36.28 | peepsalot | lol, a review of Gnome 2 Dev Guide Book: http://www.amazon.com/gp/discussionboard/discussion.html/ref=cm_rdp_st_rd/103-2663263-8195863?ie=UTF8&ASIN=1593270305&store=yourstore&cdThread=TxP1TNBJU43D14&reviewID=R39E6IGJZ6GAA5&displayType=ReviewDetail |
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| 03:06.07 | Draconicus | Hey there. |
| 03:07.41 | Draconicus | While I can't really provide much in terms of direct development, I'd love to supply testing and feedback. I'm rather good at that... |
| 03:08.41 | parag0n | hey Draconicus, fancy meeting you here |
| 03:09.26 | Draconicus | Hehe |
| 03:09.45 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03zhiyong_sun * r1367 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007/applications/openmoko-mainmenu/src/ (callbacks.c mokoiconview.c mokoiconview.h): bug fix: add mokoiconview cursor move up and down functions to avoid call sinal 'move cursor' cb function |
| 03:09.58 | Draconicus | Well, one important question is: How will the phone system work in terms of providing? |
| 03:09.58 | aloril | Draconicus: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (Hopefully this link answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) |
| 03:11.13 | SpeedEvil | providing?? |
| 03:12.44 | Draconicus | Well, how do you intend to make this work as a phone if it's entirely open? You can't sell the design to cell phone providers... |
| 03:13.20 | parag0n | there is a phone linked to the project, the FIC neo1973 |
| 03:13.20 | SpeedEvil | user buys phone |
| 03:13.39 | Draconicus | Yeah... |
| 03:13.46 | Draconicus | I mean service, though... |
| 03:13.47 | parag0n | which is available at the end of the month direct from FIC for developers, just add a GSM SIM |
| 03:13.53 | Draconicus | Oh. |
| 03:14.33 | parag0n | or you can wait till september, when it'll go on sale to the general public, through carriers |
| 03:15.43 | Draconicus | Gotcha. |
| 03:16.39 | parag0n | the developer branch wont have completed software on it when it ships, it'll be an incremental upgrade over the next few months |
| 03:17.05 | parag0n | but apparently it'll have phone & sms functionality |
| 03:18.47 | Draconicus | What I need most is the ability to set schedule alarms that displays its purpose in a text notice, but I imagine that sort of thing is wishlist material at best. |
| 03:18.52 | SpeedEvil | yes |
| 03:19.04 | Draconicus | If somebody ports cron onto it I can mess around with that, at least. |
| 03:20.44 | SpeedEvil | No need to port |
| 03:20.45 | Draconicus | Oh? |
| 03:20.49 | SpeedEvil | It's a linux computer |
| 03:20.58 | SpeedEvil | it just looks like a phone |
| 03:21.00 | Draconicus | Right... I thought maybe for the architecture. |
| 03:21.05 | Draconicus | Wasn't sure. |
| 03:21.13 | Draconicus | So... does it have a local compiler, I imagine? |
| 03:21.18 | SpeedEvil | You just compile. |
| 03:21.22 | SpeedEvil | Not usually |
| 03:21.39 | SpeedEvil | No reason you couldn't thiough |
| 03:21.43 | Draconicus | Well, how do I go about compiling for it, anyway? |
| 03:22.00 | SpeedEvil | cross-compile. |
| 03:22.05 | SpeedEvil | Look on the wiki |
| 03:22.14 | Draconicus | Eh... I'm not very experienced with that. Oh. Good. Wiki. Yeah, I'll look it up. Thanks. |
| 03:22.26 | Draconicus | This is great. Perfect timing for me to start needing one badly, eh? |
| 03:23.04 | Draconicus | It recently occured to me that I've become horribly disorganized and need something portable that can help with it. |
| 03:23.12 | Draconicus | Linux based, though. :P |
| 03:23.26 | Draconicus | Anyway, I must try to avoid off-topicness |
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| 03:26.44 | Draconicus | Hmm... For the sake of convenience, I think my first action will be trying to compile gcc for use with this device. Will I be running into any unusual dependencies? |
| 03:28.34 | parag0n | have a look at mokomakefile Draconicus |
| 03:29.50 | Draconicus | Ah. Handy. :D |
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| 06:01.23 | jipi | counter |
| 06:01.23 | aloril | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973 P1: 2 weeks, 3 days 05:58:36 (17.249 +-7.0 days) (541) |
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| 07:03.14 | xkr47 | hmm, what do you mean ?-) |
| 07:03.31 | xkr47 | do they have the same flashing interface? |
| 07:03.45 | xkr47 | or.. does the same software work for both? |
| 07:04.28 | rwhitby | I mean instead of plugging the debug board and neo into a linux desktop, i have cross-compiled all the tools (ftdi, openocd, dfu-util, etc) to arm, and have run devirginator on the nslu2 to reflash the neo |
| 07:04.43 | rwhitby | this means that you could use a neo (which is also an ARM) to reflash another neo. |
| 07:05.20 | xkr47 | :D |
| 07:05.31 | rwhitby | (the flashing interface for the bootloader is the debug board, which has a usb interface, and the flashing interace for the kernel and rootfs is direct to the neo via usb. the nslu2 has two usb ports :-) |
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| 07:05.32 | xkr47 | but you still need the debug board.. |
| 07:05.39 | rwhitby | only for the bootloader. |
| 07:06.10 | xkr47 | yeah |
| 07:06.13 | rwhitby | the rest you could do from neo to neo with just a cable (and maybe a powered hub in between - dunno yet, cause I don't have two neos) |
| 07:06.25 | xkr47 | I already thought you meant you could do without the debug board.. :) |
| 07:06.58 | xkr47 | rwhitby, maybe you could have neo flash itself if you had a cable from neo to its own debug board :D |
| 07:07.49 | aloril | for flashing root filesystem you might want to have it in microSD |
| 07:08.18 | aloril | (current one that is, usually not good idea to change active filesystem at low level ;-) |
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| 07:15.24 | gambler | any openmoko enthusiasts in aussie? |
| 07:15.43 | rwhitby | yup, there is a phase0 device here in Adelaide. |
| 07:19.05 | gambler | your one of the lucky ones |
| 07:22.19 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03caowai_song * r1368 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007/applications/openmoko-keyboard/layouts/ (4 files): Remove old config file |
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| 07:26.16 | rwhitby | U-Boot 1.2.0-moko6 (Mar 15 2007 - 07:11:11) |
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| 07:26.54 | aloril | rwhitby: cool |
| 07:27.31 | rwhitby | ... built by MokoMakefile of course, on a CentOS 4 box. |
| 07:27.57 | rwhitby | Linux version 2.6.20.2-moko8 (rwhitby@ ... |
| 07:29.19 | rwhitby | OpenMoKo .dev-snapshot-20070310 fic-gta01 ttySAC0 |
| 07:30.02 | aloril | what does this output?: |
| 07:30.03 | aloril | time dd bs=1k if=/dev/mmcblk0p1 of=/dev/zero count=100000 |
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| 07:34.53 | gambler | is there an openmoko emulator like TT ships with the greenphone? |
| 07:35.23 | CM | Does the greenphone run full X? |
| 07:35.39 | aloril | faq? |
| 07:35.39 | aloril | See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ |
| 07:35.40 | gambler | no |
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| 07:36.17 | CM | Ok. You can test openmoko with Xoo/Xephyr on regular X :) |
| 07:36.52 | CM | But I don't think there's any finished package or setup yet |
| 07:37.15 | pH5 | aloril: that command took real 27.71s (user 0.1s, sys 24.96s) here. |
| 07:38.03 | aloril | pH5: cool, quite fast, a bit below 4MB/s |
| 07:38.10 | rwhitby | aloril: is the phase0 review page linked onto the main page? I can never find it |
| 07:38.51 | aloril | hmm.. probably not, its linked from FAQ and Neo1973 pages though |
| 07:40.47 | rwhitby | real 0m 38.18s, user 0m 0.18s, sys 0m 35.96s |
| 07:41.27 | pH5 | rwhitby: running at 200MHz? |
| 07:41.28 | aloril | pH5: do you have bundled card or some other? |
| 07:41.36 | pH5 | aloril: bundled 128M sandisk at 266MHz |
| 07:41.54 | rwhitby | 200MHz here |
| 07:41.57 | pH5 | does the sd controller frequency change with the cpu frequency? |
| 07:42.00 | rwhitby | (debug board connected) |
| 07:47.19 | aloril | added link to [[Main Page]] below "Neo1973 Phase 0" |
| 07:47.26 | rwhitby | aloril: thx |
| 07:48.47 | aloril | [[Neo1973]] page too surprising amount of time, will try to keep it up to date (a bit wiki presence to counter) |
| 07:48.58 | aloril | s/too/took |
| 07:52.45 | xkr47 | aloril, wasn't it so you could run openmoko at max 200MHz with debug board connected |
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| 07:53.53 | rwhitby | no, it's 200 by default, but you can bump that up to 266 with a u-boot command. But 266 is apparently unstable when debug board is attached (I haven't tried it myself). |
| 07:54.54 | xkr47 | okay :) |
| 07:55.02 | aloril | xkr47: hmmm.. speed_difference_ratio / (266/200) = 1.036 |
| 07:55.25 | aloril | so.. if it has extra effect, its not big but might be there? |
| 07:56.13 | rwhitby | I'm glad that the latest kernel is much quieter now. |
| 07:56.40 | xkr47 | is that a general 2.6 feature or some moko-specific ? |
| 07:57.14 | rwhitby | there was just a whole lot of continuous kernel debug stuff being printed to the console for P0 devices (pcf50606 stuff). It's now gone. |
| 07:57.31 | xkr47 | oh |
| 07:57.33 | xkr47 | yeah :) |
| 07:58.25 | rwhitby | now I just need a second neo to really test the self-hosting for bare-metal reflash assertion, |
| 07:58.35 | rwhitby | counter |
| 07:58.36 | aloril | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973 P1: 2 weeks, 3 days 04:01:24 (17.168 +-7.0 days) (542) |
| 07:59.19 | *** join/#openmoko mrlua (n=typn@unaffiliated/chairuou) |
| 07:59.59 | aloril | hmm.. I will add new autotrigger at some point: blurb here if www.openmoko.com changes |
| 08:00.07 | *** join/#openmoko zween (n=zween@80-47-43-169.lond-hex.dynamic.dial.as9105.com) |
| 08:00.29 | *** join/#openmoko dullard (n=jim@adsl-static-1-30.uklinux.net) |
| 08:00.43 | aloril | maybe blurb for announce mailing list mails too? |
| 08:01.22 | aloril | (btw.. added SD read speed results to wiki) |
| 08:01.54 | aloril | read speed was faster than I thought, always nice surprise |
| 08:07.50 | pH5 | aloril: and I have this in my log: |
| 08:07.54 | pH5 | <4>mmc0: Problem switching card into high-speed mode! |
| 08:07.57 | pH5 | <6>s3c2410-sdi s3c2410-sdi: running at 16625kHz (requested: 25000kHz). |
| 08:09.51 | aloril | usually small cards are slow, so I guess not surprise |
| 08:10.12 | *** join/#openmoko Elixir- (i=mixed@cpe-66-68-172-127.austin.res.rr.com) |
| 08:10.24 | aloril | but still interesting, ultra II could be 1.5x faster? |
| 08:13.19 | pH5 | aloril: I guess. ultra 2 is advertised with min. 10M/s read speed. theoretical max. would be 12M/s instead of currently 8, so a factor 1.5 doesn't sound entirely unreasonable. |
| 08:14.38 | aloril | that poses dilemma: get 1GB Ultra II or 2GB normal? (though I guess 2GB normal might already be enough fast) |
| 08:14.49 | pH5 | aloril: get 2GB ultra II ;) |
| 08:16.48 | aloril | it is available (just not locally yet) |
| 08:23.33 | *** join/#openmoko vlad-7 (n=chatzill@verniyi-mihayilov9-vpn-450.tsnet.ru) |
| 08:27.49 | *** join/#openmoko atla (n=atla@p3EE3DCA8.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 08:30.57 | *** join/#openmoko fredl (n=b@h8441149092.dsl.speedlinq.nl) |
| 08:31.27 | fredl | Hi guys. Just checking out the Wiki about the WiFi question... |
| 08:31.44 | fredl | I see the AR6K is mentioned there as one of the possibilities. |
| 08:32.24 | fredl | How about the AR5006 chips? Anybody know the difference? |
| 08:35.08 | CM | Does anyone know if they have GPL drivers for it? |
| 08:37.15 | fredl | I don't know for sure but I researched a bit last night and it seems the AR5006 chips work with madwifi. |
| 08:41.55 | *** join/#openmoko l4rs (n=laprican@hsiproxy.astra-net.com) |
| 08:42.29 | *** join/#openmoko buz (n=buz@80-218-148-33.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 08:42.44 | guaqua | it's not 100% open source |
| 08:42.48 | guaqua | there's a bin hal |
| 08:46.09 | *** join/#openmoko rob_w (n=rob_w@p549B9ED5.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 08:46.50 | fredl | Hrmm |
| 08:47.43 | guaqua | and for what it says on the web page i gather it's meant for laptops etc |
| 08:48.08 | fredl | looks like it yeah, while the AR6K chips aren't. |
| 08:49.01 | fredl | I wonder if for any of these chips you could even get near the source of the firmware. |
| 08:49.33 | fredl | would be kinda fun to be able to put your Neo in host mode :P |
| 08:50.01 | guaqua | you can do that, i think |
| 08:50.17 | fredl | well I mean access point host mode. |
| 08:50.28 | guaqua | mm |
| 08:50.38 | *** join/#openmoko florian__ (n=fuchs@217.146.132.69) |
| 08:50.40 | fredl | and you can't do that yet as there's no wifi chip in it yet. |
| 08:51.38 | guaqua | yeah |
| 08:53.58 | fredl | well I'd be thrilled if it could do WPA-E... |
| 08:58.26 | fredl | hmm check out http://www.windowsfordevices.com/news/NS3141723896.html |
| 09:00.18 | ecraven | so the neo might have wifi after all? |
| 09:01.22 | guaqua | if a proper chip is found...that's the consensus at the moment |
| 09:02.32 | ecraven | wow, very cool! |
| 09:03.25 | fredl | you read that page guaqua? |
| 09:03.30 | guaqua | nothing's certain, however |
| 09:03.38 | guaqua | fredl: the one in sean's e-mail? |
| 09:03.53 | fredl | no the URL I just pasted. |
| 09:03.58 | guaqua | yes |
| 09:04.04 | aloril | also its for P1+ (June or later) |
| 09:05.04 | *** join/#openmoko empty_mind (n=test@59.176.103.149) |
| 09:05.13 | empty_mind | LaF0rge, there ? |
| 09:05.36 | fredl | do you already have any pricing indications for the Wifi chipset? The STLC4420 is $9 each for 100.000 units. |
| 09:06.51 | fredl | planned for Q4 2006, I wonder if they're available already and if they truely support Linux. |
| 09:07.21 | buz | most importantly, the drivers need be gpl |
| 09:08.17 | fredl | *nod* |
| 09:08.25 | florian | good morning |
| 09:08.33 | buz | the zcomax and embeddedworks modules could work |
| 09:08.45 | buz | but not at the current pricing |
| 09:09.01 | dottedmag | buz: strictly GPL or BSD is also ok? :) |
| 09:09.13 | buz | i dont see why BSD should not be ok |
| 09:09.21 | buz | iirc, you can simply GPL BSD stuff so... |
| 09:10.16 | *** join/#openmoko mikesh (n=mikesh@x133.net.upc.cz) |
| 09:10.33 | parag0n | so, mokomakefile actuelly worked last night! |
| 09:10.58 | dottedmag | buz: just nitpicking |
| 09:11.04 | *** join/#openmoko rob_w (n=rob_w@p549B9ED5.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 09:13.32 | fredl | hmm ST microelectronics is headquartered in Switzerland. |
| 09:14.05 | *** join/#openmoko darmou (n=darmou@ppp143-161.lns3.mel6.internode.on.net) |
| 09:14.18 | fredl | I could call them and ask about the STLC4420 having a GPL driver, would that be helpfull? |
| 09:14.58 | guaqua | i think it wouldn't hurt :) |
| 09:15.11 | guaqua | you should also write about your efforts to the wiki |
| 09:18.03 | sameo | fredl: ST is in France, Italy, Switzerland, UK. |
| 09:18.11 | guaqua | but writing it down on the wiki first is a good idea |
| 09:18.12 | sameo | fredl: at least for their dev centers. |
| 09:19.20 | aloril | asking for votes of which autotrigger features I should add: |
| 09:19.24 | aloril | a) blurb here if http://www.openmoko.com changes |
| 09:19.29 | aloril | b) blurb here if new announce mail |
| 09:19.32 | aloril | c) blurb here if new mail from Sean Moss-Pultz to community,openmoko-devel |
| 09:19.33 | *** join/#openmoko mjr (i=mjrauhal@myntti.helsinki.fi) |
| 09:19.37 | aloril | d) blurb here if new mail from Harald Welte or Michael 'Mickey' Lauer |
| 09:19.43 | aloril | e) blurb here if new mail from Mike <fromlists@talkingspider.com> or Renaissance Man |
| 09:20.20 | rd_ | aloril, f) none |
| 09:20.31 | rd_ | :) |
| 09:21.45 | aloril | rd_: that is easiest thing to add ;-) |
| 09:21.46 | fredl | I added the STLC4420 to the wiki, I might get a chance today to ask them if they have any GPL'ed drivers. |
| 09:21.48 | fredl | brb |
| 09:22.04 | aloril | e) is joke of course ;-) |
| 09:22.08 | *** join/#openmoko raynet (i=raynet@thalassa.inside.org) |
| 09:22.18 | *** join/#openmoko MDK (n=mdk@cs181209253.pp.htv.fi) |
| 09:22.20 | mjr | what, a joke? aww.... |
| 09:23.10 | mjr | anyway, no opinion reallly |
| 09:24.25 | *** join/#openmoko dottedmag (n=mag@ccfit.nsu.ru) |
| 09:24.35 | parag0n | aloril, update here on every single wiki change |
| 09:25.40 | aloril | parag0n: hmm.. yeah, I guess that makes sense (though bundle them if many of course) |
| 09:26.02 | aloril | and not for 'm' |
| 09:29.19 | parag0n | maybe once an hour provide links to all the hour's changes |
| 09:29.20 | parag0n | grouping anything thats been edited multiple times |
| 09:31.38 | aloril | or alternatively react immediately, but then go to 15 min 'sleep' and bundle all updates (if any), also group for same page (maybe filter out translations/user pages) |
| 09:32.18 | mjr | well, as long as wiki mods won't be popping up every minute :) |
| 09:32.31 | aloril | mjr: yeah |
| 09:32.38 | Stephmw | mornin' |
| 09:33.27 | *** join/#openmoko wbx (n=wbx@213.23.202.22) |
| 09:33.59 | aloril | maybe just list pages that have been edited last hour (and be quiet of course if none) |
| 09:34.39 | *** join/#openmoko dneary (n=dneary@mne69-9-88-163-116-163.fbx.proxad.net) |
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| 09:47.35 | *** join/#openmoko mrlua (n=typn@unaffiliated/chairuou) |
| 09:54.54 | Draconicus | Hey, the name and physical details of the graphics chip are all well and good, but how does it perform? What can it do? Can somebody give me a rough benchmark? |
| 09:58.45 | *** join/#openmoko wansti (n=wansti@b062.apm.etc.tu-bs.de) |
| 10:00.41 | aloril | add some test request here: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Wishlist:Neo1973_P0_Review ? |
| 10:01.50 | *** join/#openmoko TRIsoft (n=mac@p57a2e238.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 10:02.03 | aloril | morning mickeyl |
| 10:02.08 | TRIsoft | morning |
| 10:04.33 | aloril | Draconicus: in general, its dumb framebuffer device though |
| 10:05.24 | Draconicus | Hmm.. Well, I was hoping I might be able to get an SDL based SNES emulator working on it. :P |
| 10:05.25 | rwhitby | hey mickeyl: did you see the devirginate from a slug? |
| 10:05.31 | aloril | this is not autotrigger, but you might be interested on this change: http://wiki.openmoko.org/index.php?title=Main_Page&curid=1&diff=6504&oldid=6499 |
| 10:05.41 | mickeyl | rwhitby: yes, that's a nice achievement! |
| 10:05.49 | balrog-kun | Draconicus: yes, it should work i think |
| 10:06.32 | *** join/#openmoko SpeedEvil (n=mauve@tor/regular/SpeedEvil) |
| 10:07.03 | rwhitby | mickeyl: got the debug board reset button hooked up to a serial controlled relay too (which also controls the power to the slug), so it's a fully remote test rig. |
| 10:07.07 | *** join/#openmoko zecke (n=ich@dsl-62-220-14-162.berlikomm.net) |
| 10:07.10 | aloril | (+8 hours) |
| 10:07.51 | rwhitby | http://www.flickr.com/photos/rwhitby/sets/72157594574977123/ |
| 10:08.25 | pH5 | Has anybody made voltage measurements for bug #255? I'm considering to let my battery run out, recording battemp/battvolt to sd. |
| 10:08.26 | rwhitby | (having the jtag header pins on the debug board saved me having to solder to the actual switch) |
| 10:10.02 | balrog-kun | basically a bash script that sleeps 5 secs and then makes 5 measuremens and echoes them to a file on the SD, in a loop |
| 10:11.22 | balrog-kun | you can make a nice gunplot graphic afterwards :) |
| 10:15.21 | fredl | It would be nice if I could have a functioning Neo over the summer, to bring with me on vacation! |
| 10:15.46 | fredl | dang that'd be cool. Are there european maps available already? |
| 10:16.52 | *** join/#openmoko tr2x (n=alvar@80-218-185-55.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 10:17.02 | aloril | fredl: umm.. anywhere there is GSM? |
| 10:17.52 | SpeedEvil | If you mean for GPS - well, no. |
| 10:18.15 | fredl | yeah I mean GPS. |
| 10:18.16 | SpeedEvil | Theere are no free maps of most areas. |
| 10:19.10 | fredl | Hmm |
| 10:19.50 | SpeedEvil | Tomtom may be a solution, if they decide to release one for the neo. |
| 10:20.45 | aloril | also look at http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/ |
| 10:22.03 | rwhitby | of course you all realise that GPS doesn't work yet, right? |
| 10:22.50 | fredl | nope. |
| 10:22.55 | fredl | didn't realize that. |
| 10:23.01 | fredl | no driver? |
| 10:23.13 | SpeedEvil | No. |
| 10:23.20 | SpeedEvil | They are working on it. |
| 10:24.25 | SpeedEvil | They being the GPS vendor |
| 10:24.31 | fredl | that's a nice mapviewer they have on that site aloril. |
| 10:24.38 | fredl | reminds me a fair bit of google maps. |
| 10:25.40 | fredl | Google has tons of maps, hmm. |
| 10:26.38 | fredl | couldn't google maps somehow be used I wonder. |
| 10:26.38 | SpeedEvil | Not legally. |
| 10:26.44 | SpeedEvil | You can't legally download whole regions and use in your own mapper |
| 10:27.19 | wookieface | what if you get a permission from google? |
| 10:27.23 | SpeedEvil | You won't. |
| 10:27.26 | wookieface | ok |
| 10:27.34 | fredl | information wants to be free right? :) |
| 10:27.38 | SpeedEvil | Because their map providers won't let them. |
| 10:27.44 | aloril | unless you have boatloads of money maybe ;-) |
| 10:27.49 | SpeedEvil | Map information is _expensive_ to buy. |
| 10:27.50 | wookieface | :p |
| 10:27.58 | Agrajag- | i think viking caches google maps images (viking.sf.net) |
| 10:28.43 | thresh | read the googlemaps eula |
| 10:28.52 | fredl | well you could, say, do some sort of spot loading. When you want to find out where the heck you are, through your phone connection you could download some area centered around your GPS readings. |
| 10:29.32 | thresh | should be a hell of expensive to dl stuff via gprs |
| 10:29.46 | SpeedEvil | Depends. |
| 10:29.54 | SpeedEvil | In some cases it's free |
| 10:30.04 | thresh | well, here it's ~0.25$ / Mb |
| 10:30.09 | SpeedEvil | flat rates are available in some places cheap - $us15/mo |
| 10:30.19 | SpeedEvil | Here it's $90/mo++ |
| 10:30.25 | SpeedEvil | (UK) |
| 10:30.26 | rwhitby | here is $5/MB |
| 10:30.45 | SpeedEvil | Or around that per meg if you don't go flat. |
| 10:30.50 | SpeedEvil | 5 |
| 10:31.00 | Agrajag- | rwhitby: you're in adelaide right? im guessing it'd be the same all around australia |
| 10:31.01 | fredl | hmm, coffee time. |
| 10:31.42 | Elrond | Is OpenID used by anything currently? |
| 10:31.50 | XorA | SpeedEvil: I pay £7.50 a month |
| 10:32.05 | SpeedEvil | In the UK? |
| 10:32.08 | XorA | SpeedEvil: yes |
| 10:32.09 | Elrond | Good Midday, people. ;-) |
| 10:32.09 | *** join/#openmoko hyakuhei1 (n=rob@omg.plz.dont.haxx.us) |
| 10:32.14 | XorA | SpeedEvil: Web N Walk tariff |
| 10:32.16 | SpeedEvil | Who with |
| 10:32.22 | SpeedEvil | Isn't that 3G only? |
| 10:32.27 | XorA | SpeedEvil: nope |
| 10:32.32 | SpeedEvil | who with? |
| 10:32.36 | XorA | SpeedEvil: t-mobile |
| 10:33.23 | *** join/#openmoko hyakuhei1 (n=rob@omg.plz.dont.haxx.us) |
| 10:37.14 | SpeedEvil | Or in total a 30 quid/mo contract. |
| 10:37.32 | SpeedEvil | I don't really make enough calls to make a contract worthwhile otherwise. |
| 10:38.00 | SpeedEvil | So that'd realistically put it all onto the net pricing. |
| 10:38.03 | SpeedEvil | :( |
| 10:39.05 | SpeedEvil | Hmm. |
| 10:39.43 | SpeedEvil | 7p/K capped at a pound per day. |
| 10:40.27 | SpeedEvil | Realistically, that'd be around the same - as I'd be hitting the cap every day. |
| 10:42.56 | Elrond | SpeedEvil - You do a lot gprs?! |
| 10:43.16 | XorA | Elrond: I do around 100M a month |
| 10:43.50 | *** join/#openmoko antenagora (n=antenago@147.162.137.243) |
| 10:44.12 | SpeedEvil | No. |
| 10:45.01 | SpeedEvil | On that plan - the PAYG data - you get a capped price (1 pound) at over 14K |
| 10:45.07 | SpeedEvil | Which isn't really hard to hit. |
| 10:47.07 | Elrond | ahh |
| 11:01.37 | *** join/#openmoko vlad-7 (n=chatzill@verniyi-mihayilov9-vpn-450.tsnet.ru) |
| 11:08.10 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03laforge * r1369 10/trunk/oe/packages/openocd/ (4 files): we want to have the _native_ openocd in the deploy directory, not the target crosscompiled one (Noted by XorA) |
| 11:12.33 | *** join/#openmoko SirCrow (n=sircrow@sd511685b.adsl.wanadoo.nl) |
| 11:14.21 | rwhitby | LaF0rge: i reported that one as http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=235, including a patch. |
| 11:14.25 | *** join/#openmoko dotmef (n=mef@mx1.bitwise.org) |
| 11:17.36 | rwhitby | LaF0rge: I think you'll need to add FILESDIR to openocd-native_svn.bb, so it can find the openocd-link-static.patch (since it's in an openocd subir, instead of a common 'files' subdir) |
| 11:17.53 | *** join/#openmoko Cred_ (n=teemu@130.232.3.146) |
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| 11:22.34 | *** join/#openmoko terrex (n=terrex@84.122.65.39.dyn.user.ono.com) |
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| 11:35.05 | sannes | counter |
| 11:35.06 | aloril | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973 P1: 2 weeks, 3 days 00:24:54 (17.017 +-7.0 days) (543) |
| 11:36.22 | *** join/#openmoko jsgotangco (n=jsg123@ubuntu/member/jsgotangco) |
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| 11:40.59 | *** join/#openmoko krau (n=cktakaha@200.184.118.141) |
| 11:41.34 | markit | hi, is there the responsable of http://www.openmoko.com/press/index.html ? the "Neoforms" link near the bottom is broken |
| 11:44.55 | *** join/#openmoko Cindy (n=cindy@c-24-60-31-160.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 11:46.40 | SpeedEvil | http://www.openmoko.com/files/OpenMoko_Neologics.pdf is ther ight link |
| 11:46.53 | SpeedEvil | dunno whp's the site maintainer. |
| 11:47.12 | *** join/#openmoko morricone (i=foobar@dslb-084-057-137-168.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 11:48.29 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03rwhitby * r56 10mokomakefile/trunk/patches/openmoko-HEAD/ (openocd.patch series): Removed openocd patch - an equivalent patch has been committed in OM svn. |
| 11:48.36 | fredl | God... why do houses in this country need to be SO futtbucking ugly! |
| 11:48.40 | fredl | </rant> |
| 11:49.22 | Stephmw | it's no better in the UK |
| 11:49.32 | fredl | it's WAY better in the UK Stephmw |
| 11:49.42 | Stephmw | give me some examples ;) |
| 11:49.56 | Stephmw | I dispair here, the insides *and* the outsides are utter trash |
| 11:50.13 | fredl | well II can't right now, what triggered me was a mailing that I get, being a company, for a combined home/office. |
| 11:50.48 | fredl | so I don't have an URL now, but damn, it's rectangular, gloomy, and incredibly overpriced. |
| 11:51.27 | fredl | I looked at the BBC this morning, and there was one of those new homeowner/buyer shows. |
| 11:51.43 | fredl | ehr watched, what's happening with my english. |
| 11:52.09 | fredl | those were fairly nice homes, relatively nice chunks of land in the country side. |
| 11:52.14 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03dodji * r1370 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007/applications/openmoko-today/src/ (today-events-area.c today-events-area.h): |
| 11:52.14 | CIA-7 | openmoko: Expose meaning signals, support on demand page switching |
| 11:52.15 | CIA-7 | openmoko: * src/today-events-area.c,h: expose signals |
| 11:52.15 | CIA-7 | openmoko: event-added, event-selected, page-switched. |
| 11:52.15 | CIA-7 | openmoko: Make the internals use these. |
| 11:52.16 | CIA-7 | openmoko: added today_events_area_switch_to_prev_page() and |
| 11:52.20 | CIA-7 | openmoko: today_events_area_switch_to_next_page(). |
| 11:52.29 | Stephmw | yeah, there are nice houses around |
| 11:52.49 | Stephmw | they're not the majority though |
| 11:53.24 | fredl | I imagine it's like here, when you get to the country side where nobody can afford to live because of commuting expenses, all of the sudden the houses look like *houses* again |
| 11:54.20 | fredl | but when it's near the work opportunities it quickly starts to look like some idiot architect felt he needed to make a rectangular gloomy point again, demonstrating his/her 'leet home designing skillz. |
| 11:54.26 | Stephmw | aye |
| 11:55.19 | fredl | I've been looking into moving just over the Dutch/German border. |
| 11:56.10 | fredl | at least the Germans have some decent looking homebuilding skills, nicer bigger lots, less taxation, and friendlier people. |
| 11:56.12 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@24.crcr10.xdsl.nauticom.net) |
| 11:56.34 | fredl | well okay, the latter being debatable :P |
| 11:57.44 | fredl | or just tell socialist Europe to go screw itself altogether and move to Oz or something. |
| 11:58.15 | Stephmw | and as I need to be within easy commute of London, it means: shitty looking house (or flat!) and outrageous prices... the average now has gone above 250k GBP |
| 11:58.20 | *** join/#openmoko aCiDBaSe (n=osantana@200.184.118.132) |
| 11:58.54 | fredl | that's insane isn't it? Well from what it looks like in the US, the housing bubble may soon burst. |
| 11:59.09 | *** join/#openmoko empty_mind (n=test@59.180.102.222) |
| 11:59.59 | fredl | problem is, timing is everything. I used to live in California, moved back to Europe just before I thought the housing bubble would burst... |
| 12:00.32 | fredl | But the couple that bought my house must've made a killing out of it coz the prices went up even faster after we moved. |
| 12:03.38 | *** join/#openmoko wookieface (n=benjamin@x1-6-00-03-2f-29-99-b9.k334.webspeed.dk) |
| 12:06.08 | *** join/#openmoko mikesh (n=mikesh@x133.net.upc.cz) |
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| 12:08.49 | SpeedEvil | It's only a killing if you sell the house and buy in a lower priced region, or don't need a house any more. |
| 12:09.51 | SpeedEvil | Houses as investment is an evil concept. |
| 12:11.02 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03thomas * r1371 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007/applications/openmoko-today/src/ (today-events-area.c today-main.c): |
| 12:11.02 | CIA-7 | openmoko: * openmoko-today/src/today-main.c: Pack the event area without an extra icon and |
| 12:11.02 | CIA-7 | openmoko: set some size and theme properties. |
| 12:11.02 | CIA-7 | openmoko: * openmoko-today/src/today-events-area.c: Set an appropriate widget name for the |
| 12:11.02 | CIA-7 | openmoko: left hand side area (for use by the theme) |
| 12:13.34 | *** join/#openmoko msroest (n=msroest@coloc1.beyond.ca) |
| 12:19.12 | *** join/#openmoko SpeedEvil (n=jfjfjf@tor/regular/SpeedEvil) |
| 12:19.55 | *** join/#openmoko Rac0r (n=Rac0r@p5081fa25.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 12:24.35 | *** part/#openmoko davi (i=davi@41.Red-217-127-236.staticIP.rima-tde.net) |
| 12:26.49 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03thomas * r1372 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007/artwork/themes/openmoko-standard/gtk-2.0/ (4 files): * Add images and a gtkrc for openmoko-today |
| 12:30.22 | *** join/#openmoko parag0n__ (n=parag0n@popeshoe.gotadsl.co.uk) |
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| 12:32.04 | *** part/#openmoko Cindy (n=cindy@c-24-60-31-160.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 12:32.30 | *** join/#openmoko empty_mind (n=test@59.176.103.149) |
| 12:34.31 | *** join/#openmoko CM (i=cm@shaka.acc.umu.se) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 12:34.34 | *** join/#openmoko larstobi (i=larstobi@theseus.fa-s.ntnu.no) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 12:34.37 | fredl | Well if you can afford to buy a house in a cheaper region, rent it out, and let it increase in value before you sell it, what's wrong with that? |
| 12:34.39 | *** join/#openmoko aevin (n=brootvor@150.80-203-127.nextgentel.com) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 12:34.43 | Jkx | Hy guys, I just tried to build OpenMoko (with the makefile); but I get this error: cp: cannot stat `/opt/moko/openembedded/packages/linux/linux/defconfig': No such file or directory |
| 12:34.44 | *** join/#openmoko morricone (i=foobar@dslb-084-057-137-168.pools.arcor-ip.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 12:35.17 | *** join/#openmoko Cindy (n=cindy@c-24-60-31-160.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 12:35.53 | *** part/#openmoko Cindy (n=cindy@c-24-60-31-160.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 12:35.59 | *** join/#openmoko mako_ (n=mako@bork.hampshire.edu) |
| 12:36.12 | *** join/#openmoko dottedmag (i=bur@ccfit.nsu.ru) |
| 12:37.36 | SpeedEvil | fredl: Nothing - for you. It kind of screws those in that area though. |
| 12:38.00 | fredl | why? They could buy a house themselves couldn't they? |
| 12:38.01 | SpeedEvil | Especially as it's likely to be a low wage area. Meaning they now can't buy homes at all as the prices have shot up. |
| 12:38.21 | fredl | Hmm |
| 12:38.24 | Stephmw | SpeedEvil: aye, buy-to-let inventors should be shot. |
| 12:38.36 | noidd | I keep being told to move to CA where I'd get paid 20% more |
| 12:38.52 | SpeedEvil | Also means that women are forced to work, even if they don't want to, as staying at home to look after the children won't keep a roof over their heads. |
| 12:38.59 | fredl | yeah but as it is you won't be able to buy a home in CA. |
| 12:39.08 | noidd | thing is, I bought a 2100sq ft house for $130,000 - that's four times the size of the house I had in the UK for half the price |
| 12:39.14 | *** join/#openmoko friedel (n=fwolff@dsl-242-218-21.telkomadsl.co.za) |
| 12:39.15 | SpeedEvil | As average male income in many prices won't cope with a house. |
| 12:39.28 | fredl | which area do you live noidd? |
| 12:39.28 | noidd | the same house in CA is in the $800,000's |
| 12:39.43 | *** join/#openmoko TeringTuby (n=maarten@139-100-dyn.ipact.nl) |
| 12:39.46 | noidd | I live in Charlotte, NC - USA. It's awesome. |
| 12:39.57 | fredl | oh near Redhat? :) |
| 12:40.12 | noidd | High standard of living, low cost - second largest banking city in the US so a ton of UNIX jobs. |
| 12:40.28 | noidd | bout 4 hours away |
| 12:40.49 | fredl | Hmm sounds interesting. I've been looking into Texas. Lots of IT jobs there as well and reasonably priced homes. |
| 12:40.57 | fredl | Thing is my wife wouldn't want to live there. |
| 12:41.00 | noidd | that's also true |
| 12:41.12 | noidd | Where are you living now? |
| 12:41.38 | fredl | I've never been there, but she says it's hot as Hades over there, and even flatter than the Netherlands, where I live now. |
| 12:41.48 | noidd | Yeah, it's pretty hot. |
| 12:42.00 | noidd | Thing is, everything and everywhere is air conditioned |
| 12:42.13 | fredl | well I remember that from living in CA. |
| 12:42.17 | noidd | AC in house, Car, Work etc. |
| 12:42.20 | fredl | towering energy bills.... |
| 12:42.39 | noidd | oh, and Charlotte doesn't have rolling blackouts :-) |
| 12:42.51 | fredl | Canada also still seems like an attractive country to move to, as does Oz. |
| 12:43.15 | *** join/#openmoko krau (n=Claudio@200.184.118.141) |
| 12:43.22 | Jkx | nobody can help me with the build process ? |
| 12:43.32 | noidd | Jkx: what problem are you having? |
| 12:43.50 | fredl | sorry Jkx, didn't mean to ignore you, I just haven't set up any build environment yet. |
| 12:43.58 | Jkx | with the makefile; but I get this error: cp: cannot stat `/opt/moko/openembedded/packages/linux/linux/defconfig': No such file or directory |
| 12:44.04 | *** join/#openmoko friede1 (n=fwolff@dsl-242-218-21.telkomadsl.co.za) |
| 12:44.38 | fredl | In fact I'm not getting anything done, as my dog died on Sunday and I'm kinda drained still :/ |
| 12:45.30 | fredl | poor Zorro :/ |
| 12:45.33 | noidd | Hmm, did you make any edits to the makefile before you ran it? |
| 12:45.39 | noidd | I'm sorry man. |
| 12:46.03 | fredl | thanks. He has been my family's pal for nearly 7 years. |
| 12:46.31 | noidd | When our dog died he knew it was comming and was ok with it. |
| 12:46.44 | noidd | Dogs almost seem more aware and mature when it comes to such things |
| 12:47.07 | *** join/#openmoko dottedmag (i=bur@ccfit.nsu.ru) |
| 12:47.09 | fredl | well Zorro died far too young and he had every reason to live, but heck it didn't work out that way. |
| 12:47.30 | noidd | what did he die of? |
| 12:49.25 | fredl | we don't know for sure. Most likely a heart attack or aneurism. |
| 12:50.07 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03dodji * r1373 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007/applications/openmoko-today/ (ChangeLog src/today-events-area.c): |
| 12:50.07 | CIA-7 | openmoko: Emit the events-added signal |
| 12:50.07 | CIA-7 | openmoko: * src/today-events-area.c: don't forget to emit the signal |
| 12:50.07 | CIA-7 | openmoko: events-added, when edited. |
| 12:50.21 | fredl | he had an infection on his chin, we had been treating it for a week or so and it was nearly gone. On sunday we woke up, he had barfed on the floor, well dogs do that sometimes... |
| 12:50.55 | fredl | but shortly after we woke up he started barfing so violently that we think something might've popped. |
| 12:51.40 | Stephmw | poor dog :( |
| 12:52.01 | fredl | yeah, and poor kids, poor us too. |
| 12:52.16 | Stephmw | sudden departures are always traumatic |
| 12:52.34 | *** join/#openmoko dottedmag (i=bur@ccfit.nsu.ru) |
| 12:53.03 | fredl | may be kinda hard to understand if you don't have pets... |
| 12:53.34 | fredl | but they become part of the family, particularly Zorry, he had travelled all over the world with us, he was born in the US. |
| 12:53.50 | Stephmw | we currently have a cat, she's the family baby |
| 12:54.18 | Stephmw | http://www.flickr.com/photos/stephmw/117758971 |
| 12:55.13 | *** join/#openmoko MoRpHeUz (n=morphbr@200.184.118.132) |
| 12:55.15 | fredl | *smile* I like cats too, we used to have a deaf albino cat before and while we had Zorro as a puppy. |
| 12:55.17 | *** part/#openmoko friede1 (n=fwolff@dsl-242-218-21.telkomadsl.co.za) |
| 12:55.40 | fredl | and Zorro would sneak up on her from behind and jump on her back with his big labrador puppy paws. |
| 12:56.17 | Stephmw | lol, must've scared the poor thing |
| 12:56.49 | *** join/#openmoko Matt_x (n=chatzill@209.198.66.141) |
| 12:56.51 | fredl | nah, she knew she had nothing to fear from him. |
| 12:58.12 | fredl | my wife put some pictures up on her livejournal, http://torenheksje.livejournal.com/ |
| 12:59.04 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03laforge * r1374 10/trunk/src/host/devirginator/setup.sh: always explicitly indicate the usb vendor/product id of the neo1973 to prevent accidential use with other DFU capable devices |
| 13:02.56 | Stephmw | fredl: he was a cute dog :( |
| 13:07.29 | fredl | tnx. |
| 13:07.45 | stefan_schmidt | German only: http://chaosradio.ccc.de/cre042.html |
| 13:08.17 | *** join/#openmoko empty_mind (n=test@59.176.103.149) |
| 13:08.48 | *** join/#openmoko rboehme (n=rboehme@dsl001-156-033.blt1.dsl.speakeasy.net) |
| 13:11.48 | *** join/#openmoko sureshkumar (n=suresh@196.12.43.162) |
| 13:12.20 | sureshkumar | Hi all, can anyone help me with the information of the expected march 11th release of openmoko? |
| 13:13.40 | fredl | somebody's *giving* away a 3 year old golden labrador because his kids are allergic to the dog.... |
| 13:13.43 | fredl | fool. |
| 13:13.55 | XorA | fredl: yeah ditch the kids |
| 13:14.22 | fredl | make 'em wear masks. |
| 13:14.31 | Stephmw | ;) |
| 13:14.50 | Stephmw | get them de-sensitised |
| 13:15.12 | Stephmw | my dear mother got herself desensitised from her cat allergy... drat. |
| 13:15.22 | noidd | sorry guys, I'm just rendering the final frames of my TV show |
| 13:15.34 | fredl | aww this is a cutie... http://fotos.marktplaats.nl/kopen/c/d8/z.b91e6471cd84a74cbddff861f83e2960.jpg |
| 13:15.43 | LarstiQ | sureshkumar: I'm not aware of a release at that date |
| 13:15.51 | LarstiQ | counter |
| 13:15.52 | aloril | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973 P1: 2 weeks, 2 days 22:44:08 (16.947 +-7.0 days) (544) |
| 13:16.10 | fredl | that's so freaking adorable.. |
| 13:16.19 | LarstiQ | sureshkumar: the next big thing is planned to happen in roughly two weeks |
| 13:16.22 | *** join/#openmoko mikesh (n=mikesh@x133.net.upc.cz) |
| 13:16.42 | fredl | but I couldn't stand just going and buying another dog so soon after ours has died. |
| 13:17.33 | *** join/#openmoko jave (n=user@ua-83-227-131-3.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se) |
| 13:18.21 | *** join/#openmoko dottedmag (i=bur@ccfit.nsu.ru) |
| 13:19.43 | aloril | sureshkumar: read http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973 too |
| 13:29.08 | *** join/#openmoko koen|galinhas (n=koen@189.16.225.25) |
| 13:35.51 | *** join/#openmoko bkuhn (n=bkuhn@thurgood-marshall.sflc.info) |
| 13:38.51 | *** join/#openmoko MetaBookfoziS (n=sajt@3e44be55.adsl.enternet.hu) |
| 13:39.22 | vmaster | stefan_schmidt: thanks for the ccc link, very nice interview |
| 13:39.48 | stefan_schmidt | vmaster: yeah :) |
| 13:48.09 | *** join/#openmoko nocloud1 (n=mhfan@60.168.80.197) |
| 13:52.25 | nocloud1 | hi, where can I get a openmoko/neo1973? |
| 13:52.25 | aloril | nocloud1: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (Hopefully this link answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) |
| 13:53.32 | SpeedEvil | you can't yet - 350$, late march. |
| 13:54.56 | nocloud1 | ok. thanks. |
| 13:55.11 | SpeedEvil | The wiki explains it all. |
| 13:55.44 | *** join/#openmoko kmeyer (n=konrad@unaffiliated/konrad/x-000001) |
| 13:56.27 | aloril | actually you can get first part: OpenMoko (FAQ has links) |
| 13:56.50 | SpeedEvil | yeah |
| 13:56.56 | SpeedEvil | faq? |
| 13:56.56 | aloril | See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ |
| 14:08.50 | *** join/#openmoko theholyduck (n=theholyd@ti541210a080-12045.bb.online.no) |
| 14:12.20 | *** join/#openmoko pH5 (n=ph5@e178207016.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 14:13.48 | *** join/#openmoko SpeedEvil_ (n=speedevi@tor/regular/SpeedEvil) |
| 14:18.33 | *** part/#openmoko sureshkumar (n=suresh@196.12.43.162) |
| 14:23.21 | aloril | openmoko.com, mailing list and recent changes trigger in effect... |
| 14:23.46 | aloril | (recentchanges is once/hour) |
| 14:23.50 | *** join/#openmoko joss193 (n=joss193@dhcp-18-128.cable.infonet.ee) |
| 14:23.59 | joss193 | hi |
| 14:24.00 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Wishlist:Neo1973_P0_Review]] |
| 14:24.20 | aloril | hi joss193 |
| 14:24.27 | joss193 | possible to send fm radio signal to radio reciever with openmoko neo ? |
| 14:24.28 | aloril | joss193: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (Hopefully this link answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) |
| 14:25.20 | aloril | joss193: not with default hardware, but using some USB gadget maybe? |
| 14:25.30 | aloril | (needs powered USB hub) |
| 14:25.56 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03rob * r1375 10/trunk/oe/packages/openmoko-pim/ (openmoko-contacts_svn.bb openmoko-dates_svn.bb): |
| 14:25.56 | CIA-7 | openmoko: Import the openmoko-{dates|contacts} bb files from OE since they include fixed |
| 14:25.57 | CIA-7 | openmoko: dependency info. |
| 14:26.04 | joss193 | perhaps bluetooth gadgets available also to do that? |
| 14:26.35 | guaqua | would be nice to have :) |
| 14:26.43 | *** join/#openmoko marcel__ (n=marcel@khalid.faho.RWTH-Aachen.DE) |
| 14:26.44 | aloril | ah, that could work with stock Neo1973 I guess |
| 14:27.09 | guaqua | with drivers for the purpose |
| 14:27.39 | joss193 | alaril: has not anyone thouught about it? |
| 14:28.21 | Vegar | bluetooth->wifi thing? |
| 14:28.40 | Vegar | or are we talking FM radio? |
| 14:28.46 | *** join/#openmoko lmveloso (n=lmveloso@201-40-93-254.mganm702.dsl.brasiltelecom.net.br) |
| 14:28.58 | joss193 | Vegar: yeah the one that ipod has |
| 14:29.03 | joss193 | fm transmitter |
| 14:29.17 | guaqua | we could fight ipod! :> |
| 14:29.36 | guaqua | it's not impossible to build a usb device to do that... |
| 14:29.55 | joss193 | just to do a wireless connection with a car amplifier and radio reciever |
| 14:29.56 | vmaster | isn't a headphone out all you really need for those fm transmitters? |
| 14:29.59 | *** join/#openmoko ajturner (n=irc@d14-69-228-190.try.wideopenwest.com) |
| 14:29.59 | aloril | joss193: its possible somebody has thought about it, just doesn't come to my mind now |
| 14:30.25 | joss193 | aloril: ok with default hardware? |
| 14:31.21 | guaqua | it's not possible with default hardware |
| 14:31.29 | guaqua | and i doubt it will be |
| 14:31.34 | guaqua | err |
| 14:31.36 | aloril | there is no fm transmitter |
| 14:31.37 | guaqua | i think it's not gonna be |
| 14:31.57 | *** join/#openmoko cktakahasi (n=Claudio@200.184.118.141) |
| 14:31.57 | aloril | but maybe there is suitable bluetooth gadget? |
| 14:33.01 | aloril | (random etel report which mentions openmoko too: http://mobileopportunity.blogspot.com/2007/03/etel-open-source-phone-crowd-talks-to.html ) |
| 14:34.07 | guaqua | the funny thing with business people is that they sometimes have no idea, how the products they sell are linked together |
| 14:35.01 | buz | omg gimme that with openomoko http://feeds.feedburner.com/~r/weblogsinc/engadgetmobile/~3/101888788/ |
| 14:35.02 | *** join/#openmoko loufoque (n=loufoque@smj33-1-82-233-64-48.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 14:40.22 | *** join/#openmoko Ryback_ (n=ulisses@200.184.118.132) |
| 14:40.32 | ajturner | buz - $800+ ?!?! |
| 14:40.47 | ajturner | the Neo1973 was in the latest Mac|life compared to the iphone & prada phone |
| 14:40.59 | aloril | 2.5 neos ;-) |
| 14:41.04 | ajturner | the features stacked up comparably but was $150 less than the iphone & less than half the prada |
| 14:41.18 | ajturner | and *doesn't* require a 2-yr life-binding agreement :) |
| 14:41.41 | aloril | buz: I guess v2 will be what you really want |
| 14:41.56 | buz | i also dont want to wait |
| 14:42.02 | aloril | hehe |
| 14:42.02 | rd_ | ajturner, have u check N800? :) |
| 14:42.35 | aloril | so far no spamming by script .. hopefully it stays that way |
| 14:43.05 | Ryback_ | guys, where can I get gsmd source code? |
| 14:43.06 | aloril | Ryback_: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (Hopefully this link answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) |
| 14:43.16 | Ryback_ | :-) |
| 14:43.17 | rd_ | 360USD for N800 and u get alot of things |
| 14:43.28 | SpeedEvil | Not a V12. |
| 14:43.31 | buz | but no gsm |
| 14:43.38 | ajturner | rd_ I have an N800 |
| 14:43.49 | rd_ | ajturner, how is it? |
| 14:43.55 | ajturner | it is nice, but lacking real s/w |
| 14:44.05 | ajturner | which I think is OpenMoko's (Sean's) worry |
| 14:44.09 | ajturner | great hardware, lacking what to do with it |
| 14:44.10 | SpeedEvil | IMO, unless you can use the hardware for what you want, you can't really cout it fully. |
| 14:44.16 | SpeedEvil | count |
| 14:44.21 | ajturner | there are many cool project coming up for it, but it's def not consumer-ready |
| 14:44.39 | SpeedEvil | For example, cameras that you can only send pics as mms, and can't save them to computer. |
| 14:44.42 | ajturner | rd_ and it still requires a phone for GPRS :) |
| 14:44.43 | buz | i would have wished to have n800 sceen on neo |
| 14:44.54 | SpeedEvil | Or ringtones that you can only purchase. |
| 14:44.57 | ajturner | buz - the neo has the highest rez phone of the iPhone & Prada which was another + |
| 14:45.11 | ajturner | i haven't seen an neo in person, but sounds like it will be comparable |
| 14:45.26 | ajturner | the N800 does have Wifi & bt, which is a plus, but no built-in gps |
| 14:46.20 | ajturner | I think the N800 & the Neo will make a great pair |
| 14:46.31 | ajturner | esp if they can sync ;) |
| 14:46.35 | Hadaka | me too! |
| 14:46.49 | ajturner | or the neo can serve it's GPS over BT to the N800 |
| 14:46.53 | Hadaka | well, ofcourse they can sync, we'll just make them :) |
| 14:47.10 | ajturner | Hadaka, well, exactly, when that happens - I added some notes on that to the SoC wiki page |
| 14:47.13 | ajturner | re: SyncML support |
| 14:47.13 | *** join/#openmoko dottedmag (i=bur@ccfit.nsu.ru) |
| 14:47.15 | Hadaka | and ofcourse neo can serve it's GPS over BT to the N800, because there should be no hardware limitation to that - only software |
| 14:47.33 | ajturner | Hadaka - still a big leap |
| 14:48.04 | ajturner | well, work |
| 14:48.12 | Hadaka | having the Neo act as a "standard" bluetooth GPS appliance is such a common use case, that I'm betting 1 month tops before someone does it |
| 14:48.19 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03rob * r1376 10/trunk/oe/packages/openmoko-pim/openmoko-dates_svn.bb: Remove old build fix patch that is no longer needed. |
| 14:50.03 | *** join/#openmoko TeringTu1y (n=maarten@139-100-dyn.ipact.nl) |
| 14:55.49 | loufoque | bluetooth can actually work on linux? |
| 14:56.11 | Clint | sure, why not? |
| 14:56.49 | PBeck | hi |
| 14:58.32 | loufoque | because bluetooth is a mess |
| 14:58.32 | ajturner | btw - wasn't there a link to a VMWare image for OE? |
| 14:58.37 | ajturner | I can't find the link |
| 14:58.44 | loufoque | a qemu image rather |
| 14:59.12 | ajturner | loufoque - found that, was trying to convert it to a vmware image :) |
| 14:59.21 | ajturner | thought I saw an VMWare one as well |
| 14:59.24 | vmaster | loufoque: in my experience the linux bt stack is a lot more stable than any other - windows drivers were a mess, my nokia phone is just horrible, but on linux it just works |
| 14:59.31 | ajturner | had trouble converting it (or running it) on mymac |
| 15:00.14 | ajturner | vmaster - the bt stack on my nokia 6600 (series60) is great |
| 15:00.43 | vmaster | i've got a 6230, and it regularly locks up |
| 15:00.51 | vmaster | but then, the whole firmware isn't really that great |
| 15:01.12 | vmaster | it's one of the first though, and maybe an upgrade could solve that |
| 15:02.13 | ajturner | well my 6600 is wonked in other ways, won't run nokia widsets, opera, and others, but the BT always works! :) |
| 15:02.39 | vmaster | hehehe |
| 15:03.04 | *** join/#openmoko TobiX (i=tobias@zoidberg.org) |
| 15:03.25 | TobiX | Hi! |
| 15:04.03 | joss193 | does anyone know the solution for this fm media transmission? |
| 15:05.46 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03rob * r1377 10/trunk/oe/packages/openmoko-pim/openmoko-dates_svn.bb: Add missing '"'. |
| 15:09.32 | *** join/#openmoko prpplague (n=dave@mail.americanmicrosystems.com) |
| 15:13.32 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03mickey * r1378 10/trunk/oe/packages/images/openmoko-image.bb: oe/images: add missing openmoko-image.bb. NOTE: require doesn't work across COLLECTIONS |
| 15:14.37 | *** join/#openmoko TeringTuby (n=maarten@139-100-dyn.ipact.nl) |
| 15:19.16 | *** join/#openmoko inz (i=inz@inz.fi) |
| 15:22.23 | *** join/#openmoko terrex (n=terrex@84.122.65.39.dyn.user.ono.com) |
| 15:22.45 | *** part/#openmoko nocloud1 (n=mhfan@60.168.80.197) |
| 15:26.09 | pH5 | my battery voltage is down to 3630mV after 5h of running idle at 200MHz with full display brightness... |
| 15:28.25 | noidd | Ok, I now have two job offers and I'm torn between the two |
| 15:28.31 | noidd | what the hell do I do. |
| 15:28.53 | Stephmw | both local? |
| 15:28.54 | DesktopMa | does the irc announcer take data from svn? |
| 15:29.01 | DesktopMa | if so how does it work, I'd like that in my project |
| 15:29.02 | noidd | yeah, 1 block away from eachother |
| 15:29.11 | noidd | one is with my existing company and they've moved me already |
| 15:29.14 | noidd | the other just came through |
| 15:29.40 | Stephmw | DesktopMa: http://cia.navi.cx/ |
| 15:30.35 | DesktopMa | great! thanks |
| 15:31.01 | DesktopMa | hmm can you keep the project private? |
| 15:32.01 | Stephmw | that I have no idea |
| 15:32.08 | Stephmw | I just knew where to google :) |
| 15:32.31 | DesktopMa | :) |
| 15:36.10 | *** join/#openmoko dottedmag (i=bur@ccfit.nsu.ru) |
| 15:36.37 | *** join/#openmoko _law_ (n=_law_@213.173.86.202) |
| 15:38.08 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03dodji * r1379 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007/applications/openmoko-today/ (ChangeLog src/today-events-area.c src/today-events-area.h): (log message trimmed) |
| 15:38.08 | CIA-7 | openmoko: Properly set widget name to get proper styling |
| 15:38.08 | CIA-7 | openmoko: * applications/openmoko-today/src/today-events-area.c: |
| 15:38.08 | CIA-7 | openmoko: today_events_area_get_nb_pages(): new function |
| 15:38.09 | CIA-7 | openmoko: When events get added, compute the widget name accordingly. |
| 15:38.12 | CIA-7 | openmoko: The widget name depends on wheter there are multiple event |
| 15:38.14 | CIA-7 | openmoko: pages in the widget or not. Based on that name, the widget |
| 15:41.29 | *** join/#openmoko DukeOfURL (n=chatzill@vc7-1-39.dsl.netrack.net) |
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| 15:48.58 | *** join/#openmoko TeringTuby (n=maarten@139-100-dyn.ipact.nl) |
| 15:52.44 | SpeedEvil | pH5: any actual confirmation that that is the real battery voltage? |
| 15:53.08 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Summer_of_code]] |
| 15:54.42 | stefan_schmidt | aloril2: Is this a rss feed to IRC script? |
| 15:55.19 | SpeedEvil | There is a RSS feed of recent changes to the wiki? |
| 15:55.36 | SpeedEvil | Or does it just poll [[special:recent changes]] |
| 15:57.36 | *** join/#openmoko libervisco (n=libervis@tuxhacker/libervis) |
| 15:58.24 | *** join/#openmoko Marex (n=Marex@85.132.236.161) |
| 15:59.07 | Stephmw | ... should be finished by tomorrow |
| 15:59.13 | pH5 | SpeedEvil: it's the BATVOLT adc reading from the pcf50606. |
| 15:59.33 | SpeedEvil | pH5: True - it'd be nice to get actual confirmation that it's sort-of-right. |
| 15:59.57 | SpeedEvil | Anyway - the curve tells you lots. |
| 16:00.15 | *** join/#openmoko Marex (n=Marex@85.132.236.161) |
| 16:00.40 | aloril2 | stefan: it polls recentchanges once/h using lynx -dump and notes certain new links and lists up to limit changed topics |
| 16:01.15 | stefan_schmidt | aloril: oh, isn't there a rss fed function in mediawiki for recent changes? |
| 16:01.36 | aloril2 | also announce mails and sean/forge/mickey mails to community/devel trigger it |
| 16:01.59 | aloril2 | also www.openmoko.com changes trigger it |
| 16:02.12 | stefan_schmidt | aloril2: cool :) |
| 16:02.15 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@206.80-202-161.nextgentel.com) |
| 16:02.36 | SpeedEvil | Being optimistic, idle with display fully on should last some 10 hours. |
| 16:03.01 | SpeedEvil | If GSM is off. maybe half an hour less if it's on. |
| 16:03.15 | pH5 | SpeedEvil: it just died, didn't even last 20000 seconds |
| 16:03.25 | SpeedEvil | Oh well. |
| 16:03.32 | SpeedEvil | Guess that's too optimistic :) |
| 16:03.33 | *** join/#openmoko Marex (n=Marex@85.132.236.161) |
| 16:04.01 | aloril2 | mail is polled every minute and openmoko.com every 15 min |
| 16:04.42 | SpeedEvil | What did it start out at? V=? 4.2? |
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| 16:13.08 | prpplague | SpeedEvil: 10 hours? on a 850mAh battery? |
| 16:13.12 | SpeedEvil | 1200 |
| 16:13.32 | pH5 | SpeedEvil: yes. http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=255#c1, that's the gzipped text file. |
| 16:13.52 | SpeedEvil | 200mW or so for the backlight. 150mW for the published idle current of the CPU, for a total of 350mW. |
| 16:13.55 | prpplague | SpeedEvil: even for 1200, all of our designs use at min of 2200mAh batteries, and we just barely get 10 hours |
| 16:14.54 | SpeedEvil | you get about 4000mWh out of the battery after an efficient converter, so 4000/350 = 11 hours. |
| 16:16.11 | prpplague | SpeedEvil: our cpu board with flash+sdram+cpu runs about 140mA idle |
| 16:16.15 | SpeedEvil | To get to 5.5 hours, you have to come up with 770mW or so of load. |
| 16:16.31 | SpeedEvil | At what voltage? |
| 16:16.42 | *** join/#openmoko TeringTu1y (n=maarten@139-100-dyn.ipact.nl) |
| 16:16.46 | prpplague | SpeedEvil: 7.2v input |
| 16:17.03 | prpplague | SpeedEvil: i think you might have |
| 16:17.49 | guaqua | there is a minor difference between the two :) |
| 16:17.56 | SpeedEvil | indeed |
| 16:18.05 | SpeedEvil | I'm pretty sure I diddn't - but... |
| 16:18.30 | prpplague | SpeedEvil: our total current draw with 802.11b max peak is about 425mA |
| 16:18.50 | prpplague | SpeedEvil: with typical around 280mA |
| 16:19.15 | SpeedEvil | with what hardware? |
| 16:19.46 | prpplague | SpeedEvil: http://www.elinux.org/wiki/M5900 |
| 16:19.52 | SpeedEvil | pH5: the bat discharge curve looks nominal. |
| 16:19.54 | prpplague | SpeedEvil: easier to just give you an url |
| 16:20.09 | SpeedEvil | I.E. there isn't much energy left in it. |
| 16:21.27 | *** join/#openmoko atla (n=atla@p3EE3DCA8.dip.t-dialin.net) |
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| 16:22.55 | prpplague | SpeedEvil: thats our low end device thats available, the high end is still in development phase |
| 16:23.07 | CM | http://blogs.gnome.org/view/lucasr/2007/03/15/2 |
| 16:25.59 | prpplague | SpeedEvil: for the high end device we are looking to use a battery design similiar to this - http://www.batteryspace.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=3120 |
| 16:27.43 | prpplague | SpeedEvil: with power supply optimizations along with running everything at 3.3v or below, we are getting around 20 hours of continuous(not idle) use |
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| 16:35.45 | SpeedEvil | 'typical idle power mode' is given as 124mW |
| 16:35.49 | SpeedEvil | at 200Mhz |
| 16:37.20 | SpeedEvil | typical normal power mode at 200Mhz, as 259mW, 'playing matrix2.wmv' |
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| 17:02.07 | aloril | (script) openmoko-devel: "Michael 'Mickey' Lauer" <mickey at openmoko.org> Re: Makefile Issue |
| 17:06.46 | mikesh | counter |
| 17:06.47 | aloril | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973 P1: 2 weeks, 2 days 18:53:13 (16.787 +-7.0 days) (545) |
| 17:10.20 | *** join/#openmoko silwol (n=silwol@teacheradsl241.eduhi.at) |
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| 17:28.16 | DukeOfURL | \\ |
| 17:28.30 | DukeOfURL | I didn't change anything! |
| 17:28.49 | DukeOfURL | Anyhow, how does u-boot find the kernel image? tftp? |
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| 17:44.16 | MacNorth | MokoMakefile success :) |
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| 17:58.15 | zecke | Hey, reporting the bug worked. Autobuild failed :) |
| 18:03.24 | *** join/#openmoko LuitvD (n=luitvd@beigetower/luitvd) |
| 18:04.50 | prpplague | SpeedEvil: thats at 3.3v? |
| 18:05.20 | *** join/#openmoko pleemans (n=peter@d51A5E76A.access.telenet.be) |
| 18:05.47 | prpplague | SpeedEvil: if so, thats pretty darn good |
| 18:06.39 | SpeedEvil | Err - I think 2.5V core |
| 18:07.48 | SpeedEvil | 1.8V at 200Mhz, 2 at 266 |
| 18:07.52 | SpeedEvil | and 3.3V IO |
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| 18:20.49 | pavelm | Heya, everyone. |
| 18:21.47 | helb | Hi, Pavel. :) |
| 18:24.19 | zecke | pavelm: your scratchbox toolchain is not true EABI :) |
| 18:25.58 | pavelm | zecke: I have to admit I know very little about EABI/OABI. |
| 18:25.58 | pavelm | zecke: Anyway I have new and working toolchain by now. |
| 18:27.24 | pavelm | ...and got dialing working, using touchscreen :-). |
| 18:27.53 | zecke | pavelm: is tui using gpm as a input device? |
| 18:28.32 | *** join/#openmoko greghunt (n=greg@88-108-108-82.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com) |
| 18:31.00 | pavelm | zecke: I use rxvt mouse handling as an input devices. It stays text mode :-). |
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| 18:33.30 | *** join/#openmoko Stephmw (n=steph@212.69.51.139) |
| 18:34.43 | prpplague | SpeedEvil: thats actual measurements made from the neo ? |
| 18:35.38 | *** join/#openmoko law|ibook (n=_law_@213.173.86.202) |
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| 18:38.18 | pavelm | Hi, helb ;) |
| 18:38.43 | pavelm | Does anyone know what will openmoko gsm part do on sms reception? |
| 18:38.48 | pavelm | ...automagically store it on sim? |
| 18:39.03 | pavelm | ...forward it to ARM CPU, sms is lost when CPU can't handle it? |
| 18:39.10 | pavelm | ...reject sms at GSM level? |
| 18:41.55 | *** join/#openmoko silwol (n=silwol@teacheradsl241.eduhi.at) |
| 18:42.12 | pH5 | pavelm: if I'm not entirely mistaken, this can be configured via AT+CPMS commands |
| 18:43.22 | atla | anybody in germany got a neo already? |
| 18:43.51 | *** join/#openmoko denis^da (n=denis@p54929C72.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 18:45.42 | pH5 | atla: sure, look at planet.openmoko.org |
| 18:45.46 | *** join/#openmoko Magon (n=Magon@archangel.kolej.mff.cuni.cz) |
| 18:48.33 | atla | what did they pay in euros? |
| 18:48.48 | vmaster | they got them for free |
| 18:49.16 | vmaster | once they're available for purchase (first week of april), they'll be 350$ + shipping + tax |
| 18:49.20 | pavelm | ph5; Ok, I'll take a look. I just hope that default is something reasonable |
| 18:49.25 | pavelm | ph5: ...like reject. |
| 18:50.42 | *** join/#openmoko terrex (n=terrex@84.122.65.39.dyn.user.ono.com) |
| 18:53.08 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[FAQ/de]] [[Buying_Interest_List]] |
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| 19:07.12 | pH5 | is the pcf50606 chgcur reading supposed to be always zero in the p0 devices? |
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| 19:12.05 | Elrond | counter |
| 19:12.05 | aloril | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973 P1: 2 weeks, 2 days 16:47:54 (16.700 +-7.0 days) (546) |
| 19:12.11 | Elrond | pH5 - I don't think so. |
| 19:12.45 | *** join/#openmoko rbs-tito (n=tito@host86-128-188-102.range86-128.btcentralplus.com) |
| 19:14.14 | pH5 | Hm. I can see battvolt increase (slowly) - after 12k sec I'm now back at 4100mV - but chgcur is 0 all the time. |
| 19:20.25 | *** join/#openmoko cathal (n=cathal@89.100.101.244) |
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| 19:27.30 | atla | uhm |
| 19:27.49 | atla | is there any plan about opengl stuff on openmoko? |
| 19:28.00 | cjb | I doubt the graphics hardware supports GL. |
| 19:28.10 | rbs-tito | atla: It's a phone... |
| 19:28.14 | pH5 | there is no graphics hardware in v1 |
| 19:28.32 | atla | hardware accelerated 2D in the endproduct? |
| 19:29.50 | rbs-tito | atla: Even if you managed to configure it I doubt the battery would hold out on anything powerful |
| 19:30.15 | atla | k |
| 19:30.33 | atla | what toolkits would games use on the moko? |
| 19:30.48 | balrog-kun | there's no 2D acceleration in the graphics chip, other than for full-screen scrolling |
| 19:31.11 | pH5 | atla: I'd guess gtk or sdl, mostly. |
| 19:31.23 | atla | k |
| 19:32.05 | balrog-kun | samsung LCD controller allows you to scroll the whole framebuffer in any dirction by moving the start of the framebuffer in memory and this costs nothing, other operations are not accelerated |
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| 19:44.40 | pavelm | (pavel is back) |
| 19:45.12 | pavelm | (got answering calls working in tui/openmoko in the meantime, and I needed sim card from gprs modem for testing) |
| 19:45.34 | pavelm | ...openmoko kernel does not seem to include ppp support, that's probably something that should be fixed. |
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| 19:55.03 | atla | are the openmoko libs more C++ or C based? |
| 19:55.15 | atla | s/libs/toolkits |
| 19:55.22 | pavelm | it is gtk+... |
| 19:55.25 | pavelm | c based afaict. |
| 19:55.51 | CM | zecke has done some basic python bindings for all moko libs too |
| 19:56.08 | balrog-kun | ewww |
| 19:57.47 | pavelm | is openmoko bugzilla down? |
| 19:57.51 | atla | wiki too |
| 19:57.53 | atla | seems so |
| 19:57.57 | pavelm | :-( |
| 19:58.20 | stefan_schmidt | scheduled downtime |
| 19:58.37 | atla | k |
| 19:58.47 | pavelm | aha, when is it expected to go back up? |
| 19:59.22 | stefan_schmidt | Today. Should hopefully take not longer then one hour |
| 19:59.30 | pavelm | :-) okay, good luck. |
| 19:59.41 | stefan_schmidt | thanks |
| 19:59.54 | pavelm | Does anyone have a kernel with ppp support for openmoko? |
| 20:00.32 | *** join/#openmoko woglinde (i=woglinde@e178079043.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 20:00.40 | woglinde | counter |
| 20:00.53 | rbs-tito | Is the OpenMoko going to be as user friendly as, for example, the iPhone? Are we going to be compiling kernels on the market erelease? |
| 20:01.00 | *** join/#openmoko krau (n=Claudio@200.184.118.132) |
| 20:01.18 | woglinde | userfriendly as iphone? |
| 20:01.34 | woglinde | How do you know the iphone is userfriendly? |
| 20:01.38 | pavelm | rbs: I'd expect kernel compilation on _developer_ release, but not for endusers. |
| 20:01.52 | pavelm | rbs: I certainly hope it is _more_ user friendly than iPhone. |
| 20:02.32 | Elrond | pavelm - How went your "get my toolchain to create something, that the neo runs" odysee? |
| 20:03.34 | pavelm | elrond I got scratchbox with 4.1.X gcc, and it works okay. |
| 20:03.45 | pavelm | elrond: So now I have tui working on neo, can dial and accept calls :-) |
| 20:05.32 | buz | how about sms? |
| 20:06.11 | buz | that are the two things (plus powersave but thats partly hardware) that absolutely must work for p1 |
| 20:07.32 | balrog-kun | normal calls are not even ready to use yet and you're worrying about SMS already :) |
| 20:07.55 | balrog-kun | i don't think SMSing should be difficult to implement |
| 20:07.57 | buz | pavelm just said he can call with his |
| 20:08.02 | pavelm | buz: You'd not want to use _my_ hacks for p1 |
| 20:08.11 | pavelm | buz: How do you like pressing invisible buttons on touchscreen? |
| 20:08.20 | buz | sounds like fun |
| 20:08.30 | buz | makes sure nobody uses your phone without asking |
| 20:08.34 | pavelm | buz: You are welcome to download tui and help improve it |
| 20:08.37 | pavelm | buz :-)))))))))))) |
| 20:08.44 | buz | i dont have a neo |
| 20:08.49 | *** join/#openmoko lmveloso (n=lmveloso@201-40-93-254.mganm702.dsl.brasiltelecom.net.br) |
| 20:08.53 | pavelm | buz: You can run it on your pc :-) |
| 20:09.07 | pavelm | buz: I had sms reading implemented in _very_ hacky way. |
| 20:09.30 | pavelm | balrog: sms are ugly can of worms. SMS, long sms standard, EMS, configuration SMS, picture SMS, animations, ... |
| 20:09.42 | pavelm | balrog: But basic support is indeed quite easy. |
| 20:09.48 | balrog-kun | is there a library to handle all these somewhere? |
| 20:10.07 | pavelm | balrog: No _good_ library I know of. |
| 20:10.23 | pavelm | balrog: I cut©&pasted from scmxx. |
| 20:10.48 | *** join/#openmoko guerby (n=guerby@gut75-4-82-235-162-148.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 20:10.52 | pavelm | buz: Unfortunately with current state of things noone can use my phone even _after_ asking :-) |
| 20:11.02 | *** join/#openmoko cathal (n=cathal@89.100.101.244) |
| 20:11.57 | balrog-kun | still i don't think it's more complicate than getting, say current kernel drivers to work and someone managed to write all of this |
| 20:12.41 | balrog-kun | i think we're past the worst part |
| 20:13.58 | pavelm | balrog: No, it is not nightmare. agreed about "past the worst part". |
| 20:15.17 | pavelm | balrog; It is just... I'd expect sms support to be 2+ weeks of work (in one person) to do properly. |
| 20:15.49 | balrog-kun | that's a lot |
| 20:15.56 | balrog-kun | but i have no experience with modems |
| 20:18.13 | pavelm | balrog: to do _properly_. I did it over weekend :-) |
| 20:18.21 | pavelm | balrog: But I did not have to deal with gtk+ etc... |
| 20:20.56 | balrog-kun | pavelm: i think the gtk+ part will be separate from gsmd |
| 20:21.28 | aloril | counter |
| 20:21.28 | aloril | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973 P1: 2 weeks, 2 days 15:38:31 (16.652 +-7.0 days) (548) |
| 20:21.36 | Elrond | Did anyone ever get anything from the gps? Or is it some bulk, which might break for P0 or P1 owners? |
| 20:22.30 | pavelm | elrond: gps protocol is undocumented :-( |
| 20:22.55 | balrog-kun | is the wiki down BTW? |
| 20:23.04 | pavelm | root@fic-gta01:/var/tmp$ ipkg update |
| 20:23.06 | pavelm | Downloading http://downloads.openmoko.org/snapshots/20070301/ipk/Packages.gz |
| 20:23.06 | pavelm | wget: server returned error 404: HTTP/1.1 404 Not Found |
| 20:23.09 | Elrond | balrog-kun - Yes, documented downtime. |
| 20:23.18 | pavelm | ...is there way to switch to working ipkg feed? |
| 20:23.35 | aloril | balrog-kun: I guess outage is still in progress (or update ;-) |
| 20:23.45 | mikesh | pavelm: hi, all *.openmoko.org are down |
| 20:23.56 | pavelm | mikesh: downloads is up & running. |
| 20:24.15 | pavelm | mikesh: Nice nick ;-) |
| 20:24.15 | aloril | www.openmoko.com too |
| 20:24.19 | balrog-kun | outage is in development |
| 20:24.22 | mikesh | pavelm: oh, ok :) |
| 20:25.31 | pavelm | ...heh, getting mp3s working was really easy. |
| 20:25.32 | pavelm | madplay 05-Pysna_ruze.mp3 |
| 20:26.07 | pH5 | pavelm: play an mp3 into the call speaker and dream of that voice quality :) |
| 20:26.26 | *** join/#openmoko _rob (n=rob@AC9E9403.ipt.aol.com) |
| 20:27.08 | buz | with umts it might work |
| 20:27.15 | buz | with gsm, not really ;) |
| 20:27.25 | pavelm | buz: with edge, it might work. |
| 20:27.35 | buz | yeh edge would do |
| 20:27.39 | pavelm | ...but you are probably limited by mic quality. |
| 20:27.53 | buz | can the neo encode mp3 in realtime? |
| 20:28.03 | pavelm | buz: actually probably gprs 4+2 would do... thats 32kbit/sec in both directions. |
| 20:28.11 | pavelm | buz: probably depends on quality. |
| 20:28.46 | buz | i remember it taking well, forever, on pentium class hardware |
| 20:28.47 | buz | and pentium is about my reference for neo |
| 20:28.47 | balrog-kun | i bet it can't do 128kbps in real-time |
| 20:28.47 | buz | probably not |
| 20:29.02 | buz | then again 32kbit speex would beat the living shit out of just about any voice solution in current use |
| 20:32.34 | *** join/#openmoko grge (n=greg@88-108-93-110.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com) |
| 20:34.12 | *** join/#openmoko yos87 (n=1033A01D@dxb-as83281.alshamil.net.ae) |
| 20:35.28 | SpeedEvil | GPRS has shit latency. |
| 20:35.45 | SpeedEvil | So it'll beat it - for push to talk applications. |
| 20:35.47 | Stephmw | aye |
| 20:35.50 | SpeedEvil | Not bidirectional. |
| 20:35.59 | yos87 | hi |
| 20:36.06 | yos87 | What is openmoko? |
| 20:36.07 | aloril | yos87: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (Hopefully this link answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) |
| 20:36.58 | *** join/#openmoko Tv (n=tv@38.98.1.19) |
| 20:37.20 | zecke | woglinde: hey |
| 20:37.42 | woglinde | he zecke |
| 20:39.02 | yos87 | I did not understand |
| 20:39.44 | yos87 | Openmoko is software or harware? |
| 20:40.01 | koen|recife | there is no spoon |
| 20:40.38 | hrw | hi |
| 20:40.49 | hrw | can someone give me archive with devirginator? |
| 20:41.01 | hrw | yos87: software |
| 20:41.05 | pavelm | hi, hrw. |
| 20:41.19 | hrw | hi pavel |
| 20:41.48 | hrw | can someone give me archive with devirginator? whole package used to fill phase0 devices |
| 20:42.03 | pavelm | Is there way to do ipkg update on openmoko.. to pull zaurus packages or something? |
| 20:42.08 | hrw | copy of (unreachable) http://people.openmoko.org/werner/devirginate-20070301.tar.gz |
| 20:42.08 | *** join/#openmoko Matt_x__ (n=chatzill@209.198.66.141) |
| 20:42.41 | hrw | pavelm: you probably need to change feeds to proper ones as they moved theem |
| 20:43.20 | yos87 | hrw: where to download the Openmoko platform? |
| 20:43.28 | SpeedEvil | yos87: read the FAQ - openmoko is an open source phone platform. |
| 20:43.41 | SpeedEvil | The Neo1973 is the first phone designed for this. |
| 20:43.44 | stefan_schmidt | hrw: people is up again |
| 20:43.49 | SpeedEvil | Again, in the FAQ. |
| 20:44.07 | hrw | stefan_schmidt: THXX |
| 20:44.19 | SpeedEvil | There are assorted ways to do it, depending on if your aim is to make something that'll run on a phone, or on a PC. |
| 20:44.28 | hrw | 34 minutes.... argh |
| 20:44.35 | hrw | ~lart hotel network |
| 20:44.40 | hrw | cu then |
| 20:44.43 | prpplague | SpeedEvil: or some other type of handheld, hehe |
| 20:48.03 | *** join/#openmoko prom (n=prom@fuckup.club.berlin.ccc.de) |
| 20:49.02 | pavelm | ...any ideas how to do the switch to proper feeds? |
| 20:49.33 | stefan_schmidt | pavelm: Why not use the offcial one? |
| 20:49.38 | stefan_schmidt | official even |
| 20:50.01 | pavelm | stefan: I'd like to: |
| 20:50.03 | pavelm | Downloading http://downloads.openmoko.org/snapshots/20070301/ipk/Packages.gz |
| 20:50.03 | pavelm | wget: server returned error 404: HTTP/1.1 404 Not Found |
| 20:50.04 | pavelm | :-( |
| 20:51.23 | stefan_schmidt | pavelm: Oh. But it's better to fix this instead trying other, perhaps incompatible, feeds. I ping Harald about it. |
| 20:52.09 | pavelm | Thanks, stefan. I did not think such option exists :-) |
| 20:52.46 | libervisco | Hello |
| 20:53.29 | libervisco | just to let you guys know that mobiLiberty.com is launched: http://www.mobiliberty.com/libervis_network_joins_open_mobile_revolution :) |
| 20:53.34 | libervisco | it's all inspired by OpenMoko |
| 20:53.43 | libervisco | thank you :) |
| 20:54.11 | *** join/#openmoko Taras_Bulba (n=gorkem@81.214.127.147) |
| 20:54.40 | Elrond | hrw - BTW: Did you unbrick your neo? |
| 20:55.13 | stefan_schmidt | pavelm: Empty downloads is correct. Harald suggest to use http://buildhost.openmoko.org/tmp/deploy/ipk/ instead. We don't have real releases yet. |
| 20:55.28 | stefan_schmidt | pavelm: The feed should work anyway. :) |
| 20:58.11 | pavelm | stefan: Not sure... so what should I do if I want to install packages? |
| 20:58.22 | pavelm | stefan: Or are all the supported packages already installed? |
| 20:58.29 | pavelm | stefan: I was hoping for mutt, etc. |
| 20:58.50 | Elrond | hihi ;) |
| 21:00.08 | zecke | stefan_schmidt: why did you try to run at fb at 8bit? Can you save power this way? |
| 21:00.16 | SpeedEvil | Probably. |
| 21:00.35 | SpeedEvil | My laptop actually uses measurably less power at 4 bit, than 24 |
| 21:00.36 | stefan_schmidt | pavelm: No mutt yet. If you like other packages you should try building them. |
| 21:00.54 | MacNorth | 4 bit? |
| 21:01.03 | SpeedEvil | 16 shades of grey. |
| 21:01.07 | SpeedEvil | Just fine for ebooks. |
| 21:01.35 | pavelm | stefan: my toolchain is not up for compiling mutt, I'm afraid. |
| 21:01.43 | stefan_schmidt | zecke: Power saving and a 320x240x8 mode. |
| 21:02.13 | stefan_schmidt | zecke: We add a option to switch to real qvga on the LCM later. |
| 21:02.18 | SpeedEvil | Every little bit is important. |
| 21:03.04 | SpeedEvil | Any knowledge on if the LCM can in fact draw/refresh from SPI? |
| 21:03.17 | SpeedEvil | Not video rate of course. |
| 21:03.54 | stefan_schmidt | SpeedEvil: We can switch to real QVGA via SPI.:) |
| 21:04.05 | *** join/#openmoko Zoolooc_ (n=Zoolooc@p54954078.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 21:04.07 | SpeedEvil | Yeah - however. |
| 21:04.16 | SpeedEvil | The LCM has RAM. |
| 21:04.34 | stefan_schmidt | SpeedEvil: I don't have the docs yet. And when I have, I have signed a NDA. :( |
| 21:04.39 | SpeedEvil | The sony (toshiba) chip has no docs available |
| 21:04.40 | SpeedEvil | ah |
| 21:05.08 | SpeedEvil | :( |
| 21:05.47 | stefan_schmidt | ~lart NDA issues |
| 21:05.51 | SpeedEvil | All we really need is 'self refresh' 'plot pixel(s)'. |
| 21:06.15 | stefan_schmidt | SpeedEvil: I hope the source we can provide gives you a good overview over the LCM handling. ;) |
| 21:06.22 | SpeedEvil | :) |
| 21:06.45 | SpeedEvil | That would be nice - as it means that the LCM could be used with low backlight in 'dim' mode. |
| 21:06.46 | buz | how much power do the leds need on minimum brightness? |
| 21:06.57 | SpeedEvil | My guess was 200mW or so. |
| 21:07.10 | SpeedEvil | based on similar displays. |
| 21:07.15 | buz | thats not gonna last long then |
| 21:07.24 | SpeedEvil | Err - rather, with the CPU in 'slow' mode. |
| 21:07.42 | SpeedEvil | CPU in slow mode (50mW) backlight at half is a total of 150mW or so. |
| 21:07.51 | *** join/#openmoko tr2x (n=alvar@80-218-185-55.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 21:07.58 | SpeedEvil | Gives you over a day. |
| 21:08.29 | buz | oh so 200w is max power |
| 21:08.32 | buz | not minimum |
| 21:08.47 | SpeedEvil | IYes. |
| 21:09.15 | SpeedEvil | Minimum power is - IIRC 50uW. |
| 21:09.25 | SpeedEvil | Which is 1/4000 brightness |
| 21:09.31 | *** join/#openmoko bmidgley_ (n=bmidgley@IP-155-101-217-109.media.utah.edu) |
| 21:09.31 | SpeedEvil | which won't usually be visible. |
| 21:09.58 | pavelm | speed: Brightness set to 200 is still somehow visible. |
| 21:10.04 | pavelm | ...but it should be better night. |
| 21:10.19 | pavelm | ...anyway, Some displays work even without a backlight...? |
| 21:10.24 | SpeedEvil | Alas, not. |
| 21:10.29 | SpeedEvil | There is a compromise. |
| 21:10.30 | buz | transreflective ones |
| 21:10.32 | buz | but only barely |
| 21:10.32 | pavelm | ...like collie display, which is very readable on sunlight. |
| 21:10.44 | SpeedEvil | You either have a reflective layer at the back of the display, and lose half the backlight light |
| 21:11.02 | SpeedEvil | Or you don't, and have twice the backlight for the power |
| 21:11.17 | buz | can you read neo screen in bright sunlight? |
| 21:11.35 | buz | (because with transreflective ones you can) |
| 21:11.46 | SpeedEvil | The display is _not transreflective_ |
| 21:11.52 | buz | i know |
| 21:11.57 | buz | which is why i ask ;) |
| 21:12.04 | SpeedEvil | Oh - if you ramp up the backlight. |
| 21:12.43 | pavelm | speed: Actually collie had frontlight. |
| 21:12.51 | SpeedEvil | :) |
| 21:12.58 | Elrond | The idea is: Maybe does *something* reflect anyway, despite not designed to do so. |
| 21:13.10 | SpeedEvil | Apparently not. |
| 21:13.16 | SpeedEvil | It's like notebook displays. |
| 21:13.24 | SpeedEvil | If the backlight goes out, you see nothing. |
| 21:13.25 | pavelm | ok, "modern" displays are nicer, but tend to suck in daylight. |
| 21:13.39 | pavelm | ...which is why I love olpc. |
| 21:13.44 | SpeedEvil | Unless you press a flashlight right up against the screen, and look round the edges. |
| 21:14.11 | SpeedEvil | That is one nice facet of the OLPC. |
| 21:14.33 | SpeedEvil | Though I've never seen one in the flesh. |
| 21:15.13 | pavelm | speed; It is not as nice as e-paper, but it is good enough. |
| 21:15.27 | SpeedEvil | The e-ink people are bastards though. |
| 21:15.30 | *** join/#openmoko MoRpHeUz (n=morphbr@200.184.118.132) |
| 21:15.44 | *** part/#openmoko MoRpHeUz (n=morphbr@200.184.118.132) |
| 21:15.48 | SpeedEvil | They only want to talk to _large_ manufacturers. |
| 21:16.06 | SpeedEvil | I had interesting ideas for a _cheap_ ebook type device. |
| 21:16.14 | SpeedEvil | Which was basically an electrostatic printer. |
| 21:16.30 | SpeedEvil | open the display, and drag the film past a write head, to 'print'. |
| 21:16.40 | SpeedEvil | close the device, and it erases. |
| 21:17.15 | buz | strip down the olpc |
| 21:17.42 | SpeedEvil | This is better than the OLPC in some ways for simple ebook reading. |
| 21:17.58 | buz | sounds like it could fail quickly |
| 21:18.04 | buz | moving parts and all that |
| 21:18.14 | SpeedEvil | Not really. The parts are all simple. |
| 21:18.28 | SpeedEvil | And the printer has no moving parts. |
| 21:18.40 | buz | plus people are lazy |
| 21:18.48 | buz | they dont want to drag stuff ;) |
| 21:19.12 | SpeedEvil | People are lazy - but this would be a _cheap_ solution, as well as pocketable. |
| 21:19.20 | zecke | later |
| 21:19.27 | SpeedEvil | wave. |
| 21:21.59 | hrw | Elrond: I'm unbricking it now |
| 21:22.07 | *** join/#openmoko Zoolooc__ (n=Zoolooc@p54953758.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 21:22.11 | hrw | Elrond: now I have smiley face on screen |
| 21:22.23 | *** join/#openmoko mrlua (n=typn@unaffiliated/chairuou) |
| 21:23.03 | Elrond | hrw - Cool! What did you change? |
| 21:23.10 | rwhitby | hrw: new device or new technique? |
| 21:23.12 | hrw | Elrond: charged battery |
| 21:23.29 | hrw | rwhitby: charged battery (in other neo1973) |
| 21:24.01 | rwhitby | hmm - maybe I should "say" my neo is bricked to get a second one too ;-) |
| 21:24.31 | Elrond | Hey, send one to me! ;o)) |
| 21:24.52 | hrw | rwhitby: second one is from other Polish developer which also is on conference |
| 21:25.00 | hrw | he will talk about openmoko tomorrow |
| 21:25.13 | pavelm | hrw: what conference, btw? |
| 21:25.26 | hrw | pavelm: Pingwinaria - near Slovak border |
| 21:25.46 | SpeedEvil | rwhitby: It's got to start off with an obscure chaos theory bit. |
| 21:25.47 | hrw | rwhitby: I need to prepare presentation for my OE talk on saturday 17:00 |
| 21:25.58 | pavelm | hrw: sounds close enough to me. |
| 21:26.05 | MacNorth | rwhitby: MokoMakefile success last night :) |
| 21:26.15 | rwhitby | SpeedEvil: yeah, I'll probably just use those slides as-is. |
| 21:26.16 | hrw | pavelm: Krynica Zdroj |
| 21:26.16 | *** join/#openmoko Zoolooc (n=Zoolooc@p54953666.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 21:26.19 | rwhitby | MacNorth: sweet |
| 21:26.21 | SpeedEvil | Maybe 'Openmoko will be the butterfly that causes hurricanes to sweep through the mobile market'... |
| 21:26.23 | MacNorth | always good to use the right one ;) |
| 21:27.03 | rwhitby | MacNorth: yeah, sorry about that - I forgot you were the other one with old svn access. |
| 21:27.59 | Elrond | hrw - Use the newest u-boot, it has updates for charging. |
| 21:28.03 | MacNorth | no worries, here's hoping projects.om.org gets updated in this maintainence cycle |
| 21:28.36 | buz | in that case neo's hostname should ready katrina |
| 21:28.38 | *** join/#openmoko grgehunt (n=greg@88-108-3-116.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com) |
| 21:28.40 | buz | read |
| 21:28.43 | SpeedEvil | And it needs to be fully slashdot capable. |
| 21:29.20 | hrw | Elrond: GREAT |
| 21:29.40 | hrw | Elrond: can you remind me proper url? |
| 21:30.00 | Elrond | hrw - Huh... The wiki (down currently) has the links on the front page. |
| 21:30.05 | hrw | Elrond: working environment dump would be great too |
| 21:30.22 | hrw | ok, I got link |
| 21:30.48 | Elrond | hrw - This one? http://buildhost.openmoko.org/tmp/deploy/images |
| 21:31.01 | hrw | yes |
| 21:31.47 | guaqua | could i get that devel image working straight in a qemu? |
| 21:34.51 | hrw | guaqua: rather not |
| 21:34.51 | guaqua | :> |
| 21:34.51 | guaqua | meaning :< |
| 21:34.54 | *** join/#openmoko AndrewB (n=andy@tuxhacker/pdpc.supporter.student.AndrewB) |
| 21:35.20 | AndrewB | http://digg.com/gadgets/Libervis_Network_joins_the_open_mobile_revolution -) |
| 21:38.22 | pavelm | does anyone have details on phase 0 pm problem? |
| 21:38.39 | pavelm | GSM is not wired to resume cpu from suspend? |
| 21:38.57 | hrw | pavelm: bug #212 |
| 21:40.03 | *** join/#openmoko greghunt (n=greg@88-108-112-56.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com) |
| 21:40.43 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@206.80-202-161.nextgentel.com) |
| 21:41.13 | Elrond | pvanhoof - wiki -> Neo hardware -> Errata. |
| 21:41.17 | Elrond | huh. |
| 21:41.24 | Elrond | pavelm - wiki -> Neo hardware -> Errata. |
| 21:44.52 | pavelm | hrw: #212? That's battery charging problem. It should not cut standby time to 5 hours or so. |
| 21:45.07 | *** join/#openmoko jkx1 (n=jkx@86.72.16.33) |
| 21:46.44 | Elrond | pavelm - http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973_Hardware#Stand-by_time_extremely_low |
| 21:47.46 | hrw | Elrond: can you share uboot environment dump from device? |
| 21:48.13 | Elrond | hrw - What do you mean? |
| 21:48.28 | Elrond | hrw - You mean, "transfer from one device to another"? |
| 21:48.44 | hrw | dfu-util -a 2 -U uboot.env |
| 21:49.12 | Elrond | Yeah, that's used to put the env on the neo. So what? |
| 21:49.29 | Elrond | It is portable ASCII. Just edit to your taste. |
| 21:49.56 | hrw | Elrond: -U == get from neo not put |
| 21:50.04 | Elrond | Ahh. |
| 21:50.14 | Elrond | I don't know, if dfu supports this yet... |
| 21:50.18 | Elrond | I somewhat doubt it. |
| 21:50.50 | hrw | it is used by devirginator |
| 21:51.20 | hrw | IT BOOTED!!!! |
| 21:51.27 | Elrond | Cool! :) |
| 21:52.01 | hrw | tomorrow I will use neo as geek factor increase device |
| 21:52.06 | Elrond | Huh, -U is really "backup". Fun. |
| 21:52.35 | Elrond | hrw - Remove the battery, now that it's loaded. Reading the errata, it feels like it will discharge even if the phone is off. |
| 21:52.37 | pavelm | hrw: Congrats. |
| 21:53.29 | hrw | Elrond: I have charger and laptop here so it can charge now |
| 21:53.29 | pavelm | elrond: No, I still don't get it |
| 21:53.37 | pavelm | we have poor standby time. |
| 21:53.46 | pavelm | ...because 30mA power drain. |
| 21:53.52 | pavelm | ...but 30mA is 40 hours |
| 21:54.04 | pavelm | ...and our standby time is 5. |
| 21:54.13 | Elrond | Huh, that's strange. |
| 21:54.28 | pavelm | ...gsm can't wake us from sleep. |
| 21:54.35 | pavelm | ...maybe that's the bad problem? |
| 21:54.49 | Draconicus | brb |
| 21:54.51 | pavelm | ...could we work around it be sleepig for second, picking up any GSM messages, sleeping for second...? |
| 21:54.53 | Elrond | Well, it means, that you wont ever notice a call, if the CPU gone asleep. ;) |
| 21:55.25 | pavelm | elrond: we can "poll" the GSM, no? |
| 21:55.43 | Elrond | Yeah, might work. I don't know, what the gsm's UART does, when the CPU's UART is down. |
| 21:56.02 | Elrond | pavelm - The GSM is a simple modem after all. Nothing more. |
| 21:58.06 | *** join/#openmoko atla (n=atla@p3ee3dca8.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 21:59.44 | pavelm | ...hehe, 'PMU rtc alarm' can't wake the cpu from sleep, according to same page :-( |
| 21:59.51 | pavelm | ...is there another timer that could be used? |
| 22:00.39 | Elrond | Hmm, very good question. |
| 22:01.07 | *** join/#openmoko Zoolooc_ (n=Zoolooc@p54953A47.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 22:02.41 | *** join/#openmoko Zoolooc__ (n=Zoolooc@p54952A21.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 22:03.37 | *** join/#openmoko SpeedEvil (n=fjjfjf@tor/regular/SpeedEvil) |
| 22:04.10 | *** join/#openmoko guerby (n=guerby@gut75-4-82-235-162-148.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 22:04.29 | Elrond | divirg* really downloads the env, modifies it and uploads to device. Fun! |
| 22:04.55 | *** part/#openmoko _law_ (n=_law_@213.173.86.202) |
| 22:05.21 | hrw | Elrond: and it does not work when environment is empty on device ;) |
| 22:05.31 | hrw | Elrond: now I have env fixed |
| 22:08.11 | hrw | but now it discharged battery so much that reset loop came... |
| 22:09.33 | *** join/#openmoko msroest (n=msroest@S01060040f41dad58.cg.shawcable.net) |
| 22:11.14 | hrw | cu guys |
| 22:11.19 | hrw | time to finally sleep |
| 22:13.43 | pavelm | good night, hrw |
| 22:14.06 | Elrond | Huh, that discharging was quick. |
| 22:15.06 | pavelm | Is there any AT command that takes _long_ time to complete? I'd like to test that "just poll gsm once a second" theory. |
| 22:15.15 | cjb | ATZ? |
| 22:15.34 | pavelm | atz returns ok immendiately |
| 22:15.44 | Elrond | Put SIM in and call the neo. ;-) |
| 22:16.19 | pavelm | elrond : Not enough SIMs there to do that and still keep irc up, but will do that if there's no other chance. |
| 22:19.04 | pavelm | AT+CFUN takes long enough. |
| 22:19.40 | pavelm | ...the neo headset is annoying. I can hear slightest touch of the cable :-(. |
| 22:19.54 | pavelm | ...and I can't hear anything around me :-(. |
| 22:22.57 | *** join/#openmoko ebel (n=rory@213-202-171-224.bas504.dsl.esat.net) |
| 22:24.30 | *** join/#openmoko MetaBookfoziS (n=sajt@dsl54009E04.pool.t-online.hu) |
| 22:24.31 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03dodji * r1380 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007/applications/openmoko-today/ (4 files in 2 dirs): (log message trimmed) |
| 22:24.31 | CIA-7 | openmoko: Add proper GObject properties for all the getters/setters |
| 22:24.32 | CIA-7 | openmoko: * applications/openmoko-today/src/today-events-area.c,h: |
| 22:24.32 | CIA-7 | openmoko: add a bunch a GObject properties for all the getters/setters. |
| 22:24.32 | CIA-7 | openmoko: Use g_object_new() in the constructors. |
| 22:24.35 | CIA-7 | openmoko: Add a today_events_area_new_from_events() for better convenience. |
| 22:24.37 | CIA-7 | openmoko: * applications/openmoko-today/src/today-main.c: use the |
| 22:26.04 | MacNorth | what OM will never be short on ;) http://youtube.com/watch?v=8To-6VIJZRE |
| 22:36.43 | pavelm | Is the binary-only module for gps available somewhere? |
| 22:36.51 | cjb | It's not a kernel module. |
| 22:36.57 | cjb | It's a userspace daemon. |
| 22:37.14 | Elrond | cjb - Or a userspace loadable module for standard gpsd, I hear. |
| 22:37.15 | balrog-kun | it isn't available afaik, even the FIC doesn't have it yet |
| 22:37.25 | Elrond | Waaa. |
| 22:37.34 | Elrond | So P1 phones come with untested gps? |
| 22:37.36 | balrog-kun | cjb: it could easily be made into a kernel module i believe |
| 22:37.59 | Elrond | balrog-kun - Nobody wants a kernel module, if it can be done in userspace. |
| 22:38.11 | balrog-kun | the bianry you get from the manufacturer is not an executable in any known format, you have to wrap it in a lot of your own code |
| 22:38.54 | Elrond | mickeyl - May you tell use, if the GPS in any neo revision has been tested at all? |
| 22:38.58 | cjb | balrog-kun: I don't want it to be a kernel module. |
| 22:39.02 | Elrond | s/use/us/ |
| 22:39.18 | mickeyl | Elrond: yes and no |
| 22:39.38 | mickeyl | yes: the GL people worked together at the FIC manufacturing plant to make this working |
| 22:39.43 | balrog-kun | yes, you may tell and no it hasn't? :p |
| 22:39.49 | mickeyl | no: we don't have any code yet so we can't reproduce their results :/ |
| 22:40.19 | Elrond | So there is a slight chance, that P1 ships with broken gps? |
| 22:40.32 | mickeyl | not p1 |
| 22:40.41 | mickeyl | we won't ship p1 until we had a chance to test GPS |
| 22:40.47 | mickeyl | p0 has a minimum chance |
| 22:40.52 | SpeedEvil | Will this delay P1? |
| 22:41.01 | SpeedEvil | Beyond 'late march' ? |
| 22:41.23 | pavelm | Is there a way to kick gps so that it at least sends it binary blobs my way? |
| 22:41.31 | mickeyl | can't tell atm. there will be a one week meeting in Taiwan starting w/ Saturday, so I'm confident a lot of issues will be resolved after that |
| 22:41.35 | SpeedEvil | Not public |
| 22:41.39 | aloril | (script) openmoko-devel: "Michael 'Mickey' Lauer" <mickey at vanille-media.de> Re: [oe] Why EABI matters |
| 22:41.46 | SpeedEvil | IOW - nobody has worked out how to. |
| 22:42.06 | SpeedEvil | Apparently connecting to it after the power is on, and sending it lots of 0x80's will sync the UART |
| 22:42.10 | SpeedEvil | train the UART |
| 22:42.19 | SpeedEvil | then it may respond in some manner. |
| 22:42.34 | Elrond | It shall respond to 0xfa, I think. |
| 22:42.34 | SpeedEvil | I'd try cat /dev/urandom >/dev/ttySwhatever to see. |
| 22:42.37 | pavelm | speed : do you remember how to turn on the power? |
| 22:42.42 | SpeedEvil | No. |
| 22:42.52 | SpeedEvil | And I have unfortunately just lost all my logs. |
| 22:42.59 | *** join/#openmoko zecke (n=ich@88.134.99.50) |
| 22:43.01 | SpeedEvil | Due to a really annoying dual hardware failure. |
| 22:43.10 | Elrond | pavelm - /sys/..../gta-something-gps-pm.0/ cat power_on > something. |
| 22:43.30 | zecke | mickeyl: hey, is "Trained Monkey" an appropriate title for the gforge account? |
| 22:43.41 | mickeyl | zecke: sounds very good to me :D |
| 22:43.58 | balrog-kun | iirc you reset the chip by either powering it off through the pcf50606 or just resetting through a gpio |
| 22:44.27 | Elrond | balrog-kun - Right. But the reset pin implementation in the kernel is possibly broken. |
| 22:44.52 | Elrond | At least *I* think it's broken. |
| 22:44.59 | balrog-kun | i haven't looked at all the _pm things yet |
| 22:46.52 | SpeedEvil | What would be interesting to many of us would be a canned 'this is how to turn on the GPS' 'This is how to initiate the GPS sending a packet' without any format at all might be interesting. |
| 22:47.11 | Elrond | balrog-kun - My review. *Any comments* appreciated! http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-kernel/2007-February/000000.html |
| 22:47.17 | SpeedEvil | Sigh - 80 char compose window and lack of short term memory sucks. |
| 22:48.08 | Elrond | SpeedEvil - Yeah. |
| 22:50.41 | balrog-kun | Elrond: this is suspicious to me too |
| 22:51.55 | Elrond | balrog-kun - Okay, thanks! This tells me, that I'm not asking complete *censored*. :-) |
| 22:52.35 | balrog-kun | Elrond: well, i wouldn't know if it was something censored :p |
| 22:53.00 | Elrond | echo power_up > power_sequence |
| 22:53.03 | SpeedEvil | mickeyl: Does 5.5 hours - idle with the backlight full on seem reasonable for P0? It's significantly over the simplistic estimate that might be gotten from the datasheets. Or is it P0 problems? |
| 22:53.25 | mickeyl | 5.5 idle sounds pretty good for p0 |
| 22:53.28 | mickeyl | i can hardly believe that |
| 22:53.28 | SpeedEvil | under - timewise |
| 22:53.32 | rwhitby | SpeedEvil: my understanding as a P0 receipient was it was more like 2 hours. |
| 22:53.32 | mickeyl | i.e. with backlight full |
| 22:53.49 | mickeyl | LaF0rge managed 4 hours without backlight |
| 22:53.52 | rwhitby | (i.e. I've never run it on batteries :-) |
| 22:53.52 | pavelm | speed: It is less than 10 hours with backlight off. |
| 22:54.06 | SpeedEvil | K. |
| 22:54.15 | SpeedEvil | Sigh - I can't find the quote. |
| 22:54.29 | SpeedEvil | It was 20000 seconds. |
| 22:55.44 | Elrond | *arg* The power-on sequence of the GPS has the "nRESET"-pin in, two times. Before even starting to give power to the gps, and close to the end. |
| 22:56.10 | Elrond | And as the nreset pin IMHO is not at all changed from the kernel on Bv03... the gps wont do anything. |
| 22:56.25 | SpeedEvil | It may well power on reset. |
| 22:56.34 | guaqua | what kind of functionality is there at the moment on the phone? |
| 22:56.43 | SpeedEvil | Basically no end user. |
| 22:56.45 | guaqua | it boots and gives out the menu, and there's the today-app? |
| 22:56.50 | SpeedEvil | Other that 'ohh shiny' |
| 22:56.54 | CoreDump|home | hi |
| 22:57.10 | Elrond | +/* nRESET must be asserted low */ |
| 22:57.10 | Elrond | +gps_rst_set(0); |
| 22:57.11 | Elrond | ... |
| 22:57.25 | SpeedEvil | The dialer does not work, and it's not usable. |
| 22:57.26 | Elrond | ... apply power here, apply power there ... |
| 22:57.42 | Elrond | +msleep(3); /* Is 3ms enough? */ |
| 22:57.46 | SpeedEvil | At the moment, it's basically a small linux box, with some very prototype software. |
| 22:57.52 | Elrond | +/* De-asert nRESET */ |
| 22:57.52 | Elrond | +gps_rst_set(1); |
| 22:58.06 | Elrond | +/* Switch power on */ |
| 22:58.06 | Elrond | +gps_pwron_set(1); |
| 22:58.13 | Elrond | That's the power-on sequence. |
| 22:58.20 | SpeedEvil | That sounds bogus. |
| 22:58.33 | SpeedEvil | If it resets before power on. |
| 22:58.38 | Elrond | Igps_pwron_set is setting a gpio, that goes to the gps chip. |
| 22:58.54 | balrog-kun | gpr_rst_set() being a nop for the GTA01Bv3_SYSTEM_REV |
| 22:59.12 | Elrond | balrog-kun - Right. And I think, this is a bug. |
| 22:59.39 | Elrond | And assuming, that the crazy chip needs an edge on the reset pin while getting power... it wont init ever. ;) |
| 22:59.49 | SpeedEvil | Most hardware power on resets just fine if the power comes up fast. |
| 22:59.52 | balrog-kun | maybe a forgotten line in gta01_pm_gps.c? |
| 22:59.53 | SpeedEvil | However. |
| 23:00.04 | *** part/#openmoko wansti (n=wansti@b062.apm.etc.tu-bs.de) |
| 23:00.07 | SpeedEvil | If it's not set, and the initial state is reset active, then... |
| 23:00.29 | Elrond | Hmm, I don't know, what the gpio's default is. |
| 23:01.05 | SpeedEvil | The easy way would be to simply expose it in /sys or /proc |
| 23:01.26 | SpeedEvil | Long enough to find out if it helps. |
| 23:02.35 | Elrond | SpeedEvil - Oh, you mean expose *all* GPIOs there. |
| 23:02.36 | SpeedEvil | No |
| 23:02.36 | SpeedEvil | just the reset one |
| 23:02.36 | SpeedEvil | so you can do echo 1 >gps reset |
| 23:02.36 | Elrond | Hmm. Wait. |
| 23:02.36 | Elrond | It is! |
| 23:02.58 | balrog-kun | may be even easier in u-boot |
| 23:03.07 | Elrond | But the gps_rst_get is also b0rked. |
| 23:03.33 | Elrond | So the /sys interface to the reset-pin is also not useable. |
| 23:05.30 | Elrond | The fix is simple. Add a "case TA01Bv3_SYSTEM_REV:". |
| 23:06.47 | Elrond | <Mike>We need an official comment on this </Mike> ;o))) |
| 23:07.12 | balrog-kun | that's the forgotten line i was thinking of, but we don't know if it's orrect |
| 23:07.25 | Elrond | Right. |
| 23:07.32 | balrog-kun | pity i can't make much sense of schematics |
| 23:07.48 | Elrond | Are the schematics public?! |
| 23:07.53 | SpeedEvil | Post them on the wiki! :) |
| 23:07.59 | balrog-kun | public, nope |
| 23:08.31 | pavelm | for the record, I could not make the gps reply to stream of 0x80s or 0xfes. |
| 23:08.45 | Elrond | pavelm - 0xfa. ;-) |
| 23:09.57 | balrog-kun | the stream of 0x80 has to be sent immeditely after reset as i understand it, and the 0xfa once, when the UART is configured |
| 23:10.26 | balrog-kun | the specs don't say if it responds to 0xfa if the chip is awake, but it looks like it always should respond to it |
| 23:10.32 | balrog-kun | they only talk of the SLEEP mode |
| 23:10.56 | pavelm | balrog: I assume this specs is not public...? |
| 23:11.02 | balrog-kun | it isn't :( |
| 23:11.04 | SpeedEvil | Are the software specs of the GPS basically Global Locate only? |
| 23:11.41 | pavelm | Ok, this needs small app, not me doing cat file_full_of_whatever > /dev/ttySAC1 |
| 23:13.08 | balrog-kun | i don't know |
| 23:14.17 | pavelm | This makes me want to cry: according to their pages, hammerhead is "Standards compliant" :( |
| 23:14.42 | mjr | SpeedEvil, I've the impression that openmoko (inc) has the lib source, if that's what you mean; they just can't release |
| 23:14.50 | mjr | (and that's just my impression) |
| 23:15.00 | *** part/#openmoko Laibsch (n=Laibsch@F73f7.f.ppp-pool.de) |
| 23:15.28 | Elrond | balrog-kun - The s3c2410 should have some GPIO pin labeled "C0". Can you try to walk the line and see, if it meets the gps chip? |
| 23:15.41 | *** join/#openmoko Rac0r (n=Rac0r@p5081D2BD.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 23:16.25 | balrog-kun | lemme see what version of the GTA this is in the first place.. |
| 23:17.05 | Elrond | Bv03. |
| 23:18.14 | Elrond | This pin should be wired to the gps starting in GTA01v04 (no B). And probably never changed afterwards. |
| 23:18.54 | balrog-kun | ok the documents are all for GTA01Bv03 too |
| 23:19.47 | Elrond | Good, right one. |
| 23:20.59 | Elrond | If the gps has any useful labels, you might want to start at its reset pin. ;-) |
| 23:26.39 | balrog-kun | they start on one layer and end on some other layer |
| 23:29.37 | Elrond | Which means? |
| 23:31.09 | SpeedEvil | PCBs are made up of a sandwitch of copper and insulator layers |
| 23:31.34 | SpeedEvil | To route dense PCBs - with lots of connections, you need 4 or even 6 layers. |
| 23:31.50 | Elrond | yuck. |
| 23:32.05 | Elrond | So balrog-kun is lost in some pcb maze now? |
| 23:32.09 | SpeedEvil | Connections are made between these layers, and wires often dip up and down layers. |
| 23:32.23 | SpeedEvil | It depends on what you have as information. |
| 23:32.57 | SpeedEvil | It can be a nice connection list, or a hard to interpret maze of coloured lines that you can sort-of-understand with a very large magnifying glass. |
| 23:34.08 | Stephmw | nick Stephmw[Zzzzz] |
| 23:34.50 | Stephmw[Zzzzz] | ;) |
| 23:35.32 | Elrond | SpeedEvil - Oh well. So balrog-kun is doing that latter. :-| |
| 23:36.17 | balrog-kun | Elrond: i was looking at it like at an abstract painting |
| 23:36.24 | balrog-kun | SpeedEvil: not even colored :( |
| 23:37.22 | *** join/#openmoko libervisco (n=libervis@tuxhacker/libervis) |
| 23:37.28 | Elrond | I completely underestimated the complexity of the pcb. :-| |
| 23:37.33 | balrog-kun | so, POWERON or GPS_PWRON is GPB1 (which is also TOUT1 which means you can wire a timer to it, if you want), which is the pin F1 on the cpui |
| 23:37.37 | balrog-kun | *cpu |
| 23:38.06 | balrog-kun | RESET (active low) ot GPS_RST is connected to GPC0 |
| 23:38.33 | balrog-kun | whose othe name is LEND:STH and it's the pin I4 on the cpu |
| 23:38.42 | balrog-kun | i don't know what LEND:STH means |
| 23:39.13 | balrog-kun | so you were right about C0 |
| 23:39.30 | Elrond | Cool! |
| 23:40.12 | balrog-kun | there are 16 layers (possibly not all one a single PCB) |
| 23:40.41 | SpeedEvil | 16 layers would be _RARE_. |
| 23:40.53 | SpeedEvil | Maybe exotic microwave stuff with buried waveguides. |
| 23:41.12 | SpeedEvil | 6 or 8 is a likely limit. |
| 23:42.06 | Elrond | balrog-kun - Can I cite you? Or can you write a response to my posting and note, that according to the schematics, the pin is still connected? |
| 23:42.24 | balrog-kun | it's probably different parts on the same layer split into separate pages, for readability |
| 23:42.31 | balrog-kun | it's much more readable than i was expecting |
| 23:42.53 | balrog-kun | Elrond: i would prefer no |
| 23:43.19 | balrog-kun | what you can do for sure, is submit a ptch to bugzilla |
| 23:43.20 | Elrond | (You're aware, that this channel has publicly available logs?) |
| 23:44.35 | balrog-kun | yeah, i'm not sure if what i'm doing is ok, but i've seen guys on the official OMAP mailing list paste whole chapters of NDAed documents when asked |
| 23:45.05 | balrog-kun | with people from texas instruments being subscribed to the same list |
| 23:45.26 | SpeedEvil | Generally. |
| 23:45.40 | Elrond | *G* |
| 23:45.53 | SpeedEvil | Passing out information from the datasheet is different from copying chunks and making them publically available. |
| 23:45.58 | SpeedEvil | This varies of coursel |
| 23:45.59 | TobiX | rwhitby: Does MokoMakefile really need to check out the complete OpenMoko Subversion repository? I currently dont have a good overview of the build process, but I think only /trunk/ is needed... Currently this won't save much, but later branches and releases may make the checkout much longer and bigger... |
| 23:46.26 | Elrond | balrog-kun - For the wiring, I don't think, that FIC would be very angry. You basicly said "yes" to my question about reset being wired to GPC0. :) |
| 23:46.29 | rwhitby | TobiX: you are correct, and at some point I might change it. The initial plan was to replicate the official build instructions. |
| 23:46.33 | balrog-kun | the kernel sources (also openmoko patches) are full of information that is only in NDAed documents other than in code |
| 23:47.00 | TobiX | rwhitby: Ah, ok. Then I won't give it too much though at the moment :) |
| 23:47.02 | rwhitby | (also MokoMakefile might do things like building trunk/src/target without using bitbake for xoo or something) |
| 23:49.51 | TobiX | But the MokoMakefile and BitBake look much more polished then the hell that is the Agenda toolchain... |
| 23:50.10 | TobiX | Maybe I should try to port OpenMoko on the Agenda just for fun ;) |
| 23:50.31 | TobiX | But then, that may not be so much fun at all... |
| 23:57.05 | *** join/#openmoko Zoolooc_ (n=Zoolooc@p54952da5.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
