| 00:00.06 | jackey | woops |
| 00:00.10 | jackey | seems no one |
| 00:00.36 | rwhitby | jackey: don't ask to talk, just talk. |
| 00:00.51 | cjb | dude. what screws are used to hold the top cover on? |
| 00:00.54 | rwhitby | if you're interesting enough, people will talk back :-) |
| 00:01.08 | cjb | gah, T6? My set doesn't have that. |
| 00:01.09 | rwhitby | cjb: I think the disassembly page said torx |
| 00:01.14 | *** join/#openmoko msroest (n=msroest@S01060040f41dad58.cg.shawcable.net) |
| 00:01.30 | rwhitby | yeah T6. |
| 00:02.31 | Lumpio- | A lot of Nokia phones seem to use T6s |
| 00:23.08 | cjb | hm, confused about what to do once the debug cable (is that JTAG?) is connected and I have a zImage+jffs2 img to flash to the board. |
| 00:27.41 | *** join/#openmoko BenC (n=bcollins@collinsap1.phunnypharm.org) |
| 00:27.46 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@dsl093-060-111.pit1.dsl.speakeasy.net) |
| 00:30.16 | Elrond | cjb - Ask me in 12 hours. :-) |
| 00:30.26 | Elrond | <-- falls into bed. ;) |
| 00:32.08 | cjb | Elrond: d'oh! |
| 00:37.39 | cjb | Huh. The debug board's serial console connects to a PC with a USB A<->USB A cable? |
| 00:45.28 | jackey | haha |
| 00:45.37 | *** join/#openmoko twistx (n=twistx@75.75.82.191) |
| 00:45.39 | jackey | sorry guys |
| 00:45.52 | jackey | how do i able to get hardware |
| 00:47.57 | jackey | looking forward to get a development board |
| 00:48.21 | CoreDump|home | jackey: see topic, first public phones will be available in late march |
| 00:48.30 | CoreDump|home | for 350$ a pop |
| 00:48.44 | jackey | how about the source |
| 00:49.07 | jackey | I met David Huang in Shanghai before. |
| 00:49.12 | CoreDump|home | jackey: it's already available, see wiki.openmoko.org for details |
| 00:50.09 | jackey | anyway, i can get couple in China? |
| 00:50.18 | jackey | Can I? |
| 00:50.35 | CoreDump|home | jackey: eh I really dunno. I don't work for OM or FIC =) |
| 00:50.57 | CoreDump|home | I'd assume so w/ FIC being kinda big in china |
| 00:51.39 | jackey | I am in Toronto right. Going to find out this when I got back to China next month. |
| 00:51.56 | jackey | FIC is big |
| 00:52.21 | CoreDump|home | it is, but kinda "under the radar" in my part of the world =) |
| 00:52.44 | jackey | What do you think about OpenMoko vs QTopia? |
| 00:53.20 | jackey | Where are you now, buddy? |
| 00:53.50 | *** join/#openmoko k-s (n=gustavo@20150141125.user.veloxzone.com.br) |
| 00:54.35 | CoreDump|home | and the QT thingy doesn't even come close to the openness of OM |
| 01:02.47 | *** join/#openmoko Syg (n=zip@adsl-074-239-164-036.sip.rmo.bellsouth.net) |
| 01:04.13 | *** join/#openmoko Sufflope (n=Sufflope@crj95-3-82-237-151-219.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 01:04.25 | *** join/#openmoko j2sentient (n=opera@p2015-ipbfp501fukuokachu.fukuoka.ocn.ne.jp) |
| 01:09.25 | *** join/#openmoko BenC_ (n=bcollins@collinsap1.phunnypharm.org) |
| 01:23.53 | ljp | qtopia is as open as openmoko is |
| 01:24.10 | gw280 | LJP! |
| 01:24.57 | ljp | hey |
| 01:25.25 | gw280 | ljp: was good to finally meet you :) |
| 01:25.59 | ljp | ya, |
| 01:26.09 | ljp | i met a few people there :) |
| 01:32.34 | *** join/#openmoko danilos (n=danilo@adsl-233-130.eunet.yu) |
| 01:33.46 | *** join/#openmoko mindspan (n=mindspan@74.94.10.118) |
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| 01:45.25 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03laforge * r1165 10/trunk/src/target/u-boot/patches/uboot-neo1973-resume.patch: |
| 01:45.25 | CIA-7 | openmoko: * re-order start.S to make sure resume gets handled in the correct order |
| 01:45.25 | CIA-7 | openmoko: * increase timeout waiting for refresh (the current one is very high, but |
| 01:45.25 | CIA-7 | openmoko: works reliably. this can receive some tuning |
| 01:45.25 | CIA-7 | openmoko: * first init UPLL then MPLL, not the other way around |
| 01:45.27 | CIA-7 | openmoko: * introduce 7 nop delay between UPLL and MPLL init |
| 01:45.29 | CIA-7 | openmoko: * initialize UART at the very beginning, this makes it easier for resume debugging |
| 01:52.07 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03laforge * r1166 10/trunk/src/target/u-boot/patches/uboot-mokoversion.patch: bump mokoversion to '4' to indicate resume support |
| 01:57.51 | *** join/#openmoko StylusEater (n=adutko@ip70-191-114-7.cl.ri.cox.net) |
| 01:59.57 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03laforge * r1167 10/trunk/oe/packages/linux/linux-gta01/ (defconfig-2.6.20-fic-gta01 defconfig-2.6.20.1-fic-gta01): |
| 01:59.57 | CIA-7 | openmoko: * disable PM_DEBUG since it deadlocks if loglevel=8 |
| 01:59.57 | CIA-7 | openmoko: * disable CRC checking of SDRAM (potential source of problem and unacceptable delay) |
| 01:59.57 | CIA-7 | openmoko: * statically link button driver (for resume) |
| 02:04.36 | *** join/#openmoko mschuoi (n=typn@unaffiliated/chairuou) |
| 02:07.30 | *** join/#openmoko wiix (n=vetetix@156.26-218-195.adsl.internet.lu) |
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| 02:30.13 | aevin | CIA (not the US govt agency) is great! I love those commit messages :) |
| 02:30.57 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03zhiyong_sun * r1168 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007/applications/openmoko-taskmanager/src/misc.c: bug fixed: update client list filter function |
| 02:32.46 | *** part/#openmoko mindspan (n=mindspan@74.94.10.118) |
| 02:38.20 | aloril | counter |
| 02:38.20 | aloril | P0: 3 days 16:40:50 (3.695 +-3.7 days); P1: 25.390 +-10.0 (see faq) (428) |
| 02:38.32 | *** join/#openmoko stryderjzw (n=stryderj@216.232.85.137) |
| 02:39.11 | aloril | updating, based on 2007-02-28 21:40:53 <koen> aloril: "we will send you the current phone no later than Monday, March 5" |
| 02:39.13 | aloril | counter |
| 02:39.13 | aloril | P0: 2 days 16:40:23 (2.695 +-2.7 days); P1: 25.389 +-10.0 (see faq) (429) |
| 02:44.27 | jackey_ | the actual hardware is ready for shipment? |
| 02:44.35 | *** part/#openmoko jackey_ (n=jackey@CPE0016b6230168-CM0014e827107e.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 02:44.37 | *** join/#openmoko jackey_ (n=jackey@CPE0016b6230168-CM0014e827107e.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 02:45.29 | *** join/#openmoko jackey (n=jackey@CPE0016b6230168-CM0014e827107e.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 02:46.02 | jackey | try to get the hardware, anyone how? |
| 02:46.03 | aloril | jackey: that is P0 device for selected developers, P1 for any developer is for anybody |
| 02:46.11 | aloril | faq |
| 02:46.11 | aloril | See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ |
| 02:46.40 | jackey | what is the difference between P0 and P1 |
| 02:47.13 | aloril | P0 is free and those who receive it has been selected more than month ago ;-) |
| 02:47.15 | rwhitby | $350 |
| 02:47.27 | rwhitby | and one month |
| 02:47.32 | aloril | based on their track record on doing stuff |
| 02:47.55 | aloril | Phase 1 requirements are listed on FAQ |
| 02:47.57 | jackey | u working for FIC? |
| 02:48.01 | aloril | no |
| 02:48.19 | aloril | just followed things closely ;-) |
| 02:48.20 | jackey | ok let me take a look first |
| 02:50.38 | jackey | will p1 get all sources? |
| 02:50.49 | jackey | include necessary driver source codes |
| 02:51.19 | rwhitby | all source is available now |
| 02:51.40 | jackey | i heard there is AGPS module there |
| 02:52.00 | jackey | is that right? |
| 02:52.18 | aloril | hmm... I think its possible to make it so that you practically need hackers to use JTAG to bypass thief protection |
| 02:52.25 | aloril | counter? |
| 02:52.25 | aloril | source: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/MokoMakefile ; 2 days 16:33:47 (2.690 +-2.7 days) for devices for selected developers (2007-03-02); a month (25.380 +-10.0 days) for devices for *ANYBODY* for $350 (targeting developers) (preorders: not yet) (2007-03-25); 7 months (199.380 +-15.0 days) for mass market (2007-09-15): see topic for more info (430) |
| 02:53.15 | aloril | jackey: see http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973_Hardware (linked from FAQ) |
| 02:53.22 | CoreDump|home | aloril: the mail says march, 5th for p0 |
| 02:53.53 | aloril | CoreDump|home: yes, I understood that is upper limit |
| 02:54.09 | jackey | cool |
| 02:54.13 | aloril | CoreDump|home: or is it exact? |
| 02:54.45 | CoreDump|home | "we will send you the current phone no later than Monday, |
| 02:54.46 | CoreDump|home | March 5." |
| 02:54.50 | CoreDump|home | *shrug* |
| 02:55.04 | rwhitby | dunno whether that is ship date or recieve date |
| 02:55.23 | CoreDump|home | I bet on ship date |
| 02:55.31 | rwhitby | jackey: plenty of info on the wiki about the AGPS |
| 02:55.44 | aloril | CoreDump|home: hmm.. yeah, it could mean upper limit or at that date, anyway 2.690 +-2.7 days should cover it ;-) |
| 02:56.09 | aloril | P0 counter moves at 1/2 speed, P1 at full speed (until it also meets lower limit) |
| 02:56.13 | *** join/#openmoko disguy__160148 (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-f432cd7aea50ff09) |
| 02:56.23 | aloril | I guess I could move lower limit estimate for P0, humm... |
| 02:56.44 | aloril | 2007-03-03 reasonable lower limit? |
| 02:58.08 | jackey | thx lots, guys. Sorry about my sutpid questions. I am a newbie here. |
| 03:02.56 | CoreDump|home | I'd think so aloril |
| 03:03.18 | aloril | hmm.. faq autotrigger worked once when it shouldn't and didn't work when it should |
| 03:03.42 | aloril | CoreDump|home: OK, I'll take a 'risk' that they are faster than that ;-) |
| 03:03.49 | aloril | counter |
| 03:03.49 | aloril | P0: 4 days 08:56:10 (4.372 +-1.0 days); P1: 25.372 +-10.0 (see faq) (431) |
| 03:03.55 | CoreDump|home | hehe |
| 03:04.05 | CoreDump|home | w00t |
| 03:04.20 | aloril | counter is now further, but it also moves now at full speed ;-) |
| 03:05.00 | aloril | umm... I need to take into account that its latest possible 2007-03-05 time .. |
| 03:06.24 | aloril | that is -4 days for earliest 2007-02-03 compared to latest 2007-02-05 ;-) |
| 03:06.26 | aloril | counter |
| 03:06.26 | aloril | P0: 3 days 08:53:33 (3.371 +-2.0 days); P1: 25.371 +-10.0 (see faq) (432) |
| 03:07.28 | aloril | 3.371 actually should now be roughly when Earth gets to 2007-03-05 |
| 03:07.38 | aloril | -2 hours |
| 03:08.10 | aloril | rwhitby: I would except them to mail you again when they ship it (hopefully with tracking number) |
| 03:19.58 | aloril | hmm.. in a sense those who want wifi probably will get, but phone is delayed only for those that insist on it ;-) |
| 03:29.55 | aloril | mind if I babble about "recover lost phone" before actually mailing about it? |
| 03:30.47 | aloril | probably not, there are some further ideas to protect phone: |
| 03:31.24 | aloril | u-boot/dfu password: no booting from anywhere except thief protected kernel, no updating of flash without knowing password |
| 03:32.09 | aloril | of course you can still pass this using JTAG, but decrease amount of thieves that know how to pass protections |
| 03:32.59 | *** join/#openmoko nm (n=hongtd@58.187.131.236) |
| 03:33.00 | aloril | by default probably no password, its advanced option (this increases probability of bricking device: forget password, update non working kernel, brick without JTAG or password) |
| 03:33.43 | aloril | also initial message when whoever finds phone by default would be: "If you found this phone, press here to contact owner" |
| 03:34.23 | aloril | user could change it to "If you found this phone, press here to contact owner and when he gets phone back you will get finders fee of 50 EUR" |
| 03:34.51 | aloril | if you make that bigger than what potential thief would get by selling it as stolen, this it increases probability of getting it back |
| 03:34.52 | CoreDump|home | as I understand it, JTAG is not easiely accessible w/o the debug board. So P1+ folks would be pretty screwed |
| 03:35.09 | aloril | CoreDump|home: yup, so password protection should be optional |
| 03:35.43 | aloril | and there should be warning that you must remember it or you risk bricking it |
| 03:36.15 | aloril | CoreDump|home: that is the idea, make it as thief unfriendly as possible ;-) |
| 03:36.31 | CoreDump|home | that is probably not acceptable for a commercial device. You have to protect the users before their own idiocy |
| 03:36.40 | aloril | also if you keep security updates up to date, then no root shell either for script kiddies ;-) |
| 03:36.51 | aloril | CoreDump|home: hide it ;-) |
| 03:36.55 | *** join/#openmoko darmou (n=darmou@203-206-183-196.perm.iinet.net.au) |
| 03:37.21 | aloril | CoreDump|home: also forgetting password doesn't really brick device, it just means you can't reflash/rekernel it |
| 03:37.39 | aloril | actually, you can rekernel, but you can't recover from that |
| 03:37.58 | aloril | and umm.. how many stupid users will set password and update to non working kernel? |
| 03:38.17 | CoreDump|home | aloril: probably enough to worry OM / FIC =) |
| 03:38.21 | aloril | so with u-boot password I mean: password for non default boot |
| 03:39.19 | aloril | CoreDump|home: with iPod that reportedly happens often: users reflash arbitrary images from web and brick their device |
| 03:40.13 | aloril | here you have additional possibility to recover: if no password: then dfu; else: password + dfu |
| 03:40.13 | darmou | What do you have to do to get wi fi enabled on Neo device, plug in powered hub and usb wi fi stick and ensure driver is loaded into the kernel? |
| 03:40.16 | aloril | darmou: for P0/P1 device: yeah |
| 03:40.52 | aloril | some future device: it will be included, earliest possible date for version like that is June, latest date sometime 2008 |
| 03:40.56 | darmou | aloril sorry what is P0/P1 device? |
| 03:41.03 | aloril | counter? |
| 03:41.03 | aloril | source: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/MokoMakefile ; 3 days 08:18:57 (3.346 +-2.0 days) for devices for selected developers (2007-03-03); a month (25.346 +-10.0 days) for devices for *ANYBODY* for $350 (targeting developers) (preorders: not yet) (2007-03-25); 7 months (199.346 +-15.0 days) for mass market (2007-09-15): see topic for more info (433) |
| 03:41.09 | darmou | ah you mean origonal Neo ? |
| 03:41.15 | aloril | counter |
| 03:41.15 | aloril | P0: 3 days 08:18:44 (3.346 +-2.0 days); P1: 25.346 +-10.0 (see faq) (434) |
| 03:41.29 | darmou | ok thanks aloril |
| 03:43.12 | aloril | with having ssh access to stolen device you could turn microphone on, though this is probably illegal in many countries |
| 03:43.37 | aloril | also this gives new espionage idea: "lose" phone near company you want to spy on and then listen ... |
| 03:47.44 | aloril | about that reasonably high finder fee: if somebody stole it on purpose (broke in to your car for example), then you can wait with police ;-) |
| 03:48.14 | aloril | however, if you lose it accidentally, then there are 2 modes: person wants to return | person wants to thief |
| 03:48.39 | aloril | high finder fee would probably convert many second kind of person to first kind |
| 03:48.49 | SpeedEvil | darmou: the hub has to accept totally non-powered hosts, some don't. In that case, you will need a special cable, and some source of power (the hub may also provide this). |
| 03:48.57 | aloril | especially if finders fee is higher than thief can get for selling it |
| 03:49.28 | SpeedEvil | I've considered something like this - with a built in registry number. |
| 03:49.33 | SpeedEvil | Based on the IMEI. |
| 03:50.01 | SpeedEvil | You get an account on fic.com (or somewhere) when you get the phone. |
| 03:50.22 | SpeedEvil | You then login, and can supply details as to how to get the phone back to you. |
| 03:50.45 | SpeedEvil | There are 'I sold the phone to' 'I am selling the phone' 'I lost the phone' options. |
| 03:51.12 | SpeedEvil | You don't buy a phone that is not in the 'I am selling the phone' state. |
| 03:53.05 | SpeedEvil | On the 'user bricks phone' option - the option of 'signed kernels only from FIC' unless you login to the same account and disable may be an interesting one. |
| 03:53.21 | SpeedEvil | Or supply the previously supplied 'unlock' key. |
| 03:53.53 | aloril | yeah, good idea |
| 03:55.26 | SpeedEvil | The account 'URL' would be printed on the phone - and lead to contact details. Maybe under the battery cover. |
| 03:55.57 | aloril | thief would remove that though |
| 03:56.22 | aloril | how many thiefs have access to JTAG? |
| 03:56.25 | SpeedEvil | On another topic: http://rapidshare.com/files/18781887/rect.avi - 66M talk, with visible text, and zommed on the screen. |
| 03:56.33 | SpeedEvil | the thief would remove the URL. |
| 03:56.40 | aloril | (either themselves or know somebody with one?) |
| 03:56.57 | SpeedEvil | It's not for the theif though, as it doesn't really help them - the account number is based on the IMEI. |
| 03:57.16 | SpeedEvil | And can be gotten to if you have the phone (in a read-only way) |
| 03:57.51 | SpeedEvil | with the details you supply ("email neo58858@yahoo.com, or "contact police station at ....") |
| 03:58.26 | SpeedEvil | It's for people considering buying the phone |
| 03:59.24 | SpeedEvil | For example, if there is no URL, or if the account page says "some bastard stole my phone", then... If the status is "I'm selling my phone", then you've got more reason to be not so worried about the purchase. |
| 03:59.49 | loufoque | SpeedEvil: what's that video? |
| 04:00.13 | SpeedEvil | It's the 350M talk, with the screen zoomed, rectangularised, denoised - and a bit to the right of the screen too. |
| 04:00.35 | SpeedEvil | And the text is _almost_ as readable as the base 350M one. |
| 04:01.01 | aloril | btw.. you can make phone call out in thief mode even without SIM: to emergency number ;-) |
| 04:01.10 | SpeedEvil | Not in the UK. |
| 04:01.21 | SpeedEvil | BASTARDS. |
| 04:02.00 | aloril | however, I think this should need some hacking so that user forgetting to insert their SIM doesn't bring police to ask about stolen phone ;-) |
| 04:02.30 | aloril | or it needs deliberate enabling after it has been stolen |
| 04:03.14 | SpeedEvil | The option for the phone to ping its 'account' daily, for 'I've been stolen' if you don't login to it, and it's not where it usually is (GPS) over a period of a day is another one. |
| 04:03.49 | SpeedEvil | lost/stolen, lost, or stolen, on reflection, as they are different cases. |
| 04:04.43 | aloril | I think you should assume its lost by default, not stolen |
| 04:05.33 | aloril | SpeedEvil: you can't call emergency in UK without SIM? in Finland you can, I think its in law that requirement |
| 04:05.47 | SpeedEvil | No, I mean the phone pings the account if it thinks it might be lost or stolen (not in a known location for 1 day, no familiar BT nodes, ...) then it pings the 'account' to check to see if the user has set a status. |
| 04:06.04 | SpeedEvil | No, you can't. |
| 04:06.28 | SpeedEvil | It just says 'no network' or somethign, after 'attempting emergency call'. |
| 04:07.20 | aloril | in Finland requirements are actually too stringent: you must be able to call emergency even when keyboard is locked! |
| 04:07.31 | aloril | this leads to many emergency calls from pockets :-( |
| 04:08.07 | aloril | I mean.. whats is the problem pressing 2 extra buttons (which device clearly tells you to do) and then dial emergency? |
| 04:08.44 | SpeedEvil | Injured/blind/someone elses phone/... |
| 04:08.55 | aloril | (device tells: press "Open" to unlock keyboard and once you press it it says press "*") |
| 04:09.01 | SpeedEvil | I agree, on the balance of probabilities. |
| 04:09.07 | aloril | blind I can see, but other cases don't hold |
| 04:09.22 | SpeedEvil | why not the someone elses phone with PIN set case? |
| 04:09.33 | aloril | ie.. if you can read, then you know how to unlock ;-) |
| 04:10.06 | aloril | umm.. unlocking phone does not ask PIN, it just asks you to press "Open" and then "*" buttons (clearly told on screen) |
| 04:10.22 | aloril | and you can dial emergency when it asks PIN |
| 04:11.10 | aloril | so.. I think cases where you aren't able to press 2 keys to unlock keyboard (keys which are told on screen) and still need to dial emergency are quite rate |
| 04:11.39 | aloril | however, pocket 112 dialing is common, something like 10% (or was it even 30%) of emergency calls are those :-( |
| 04:12.24 | aloril | hmm.. actually that 'lost' screen should also have "dial emergency" button in it |
| 04:12.57 | SpeedEvil | Hmm. |
| 04:13.06 | SpeedEvil | An emergency call app may not be a bad idea. |
| 04:13.34 | aloril | I think there is separate button for that, but finder probably doesn't know about it ;-) |
| 04:13.40 | SpeedEvil | Send SMSs to predetermined locations, with a couple of second voice clip. |
| 04:14.01 | SpeedEvil | along with GPS, with a button on the screen 'say GPS position' |
| 04:14.44 | aloril | power button + emergency button AIUI |
| 04:15.32 | aloril | and easy way to enable speaker mode from emergency center (press 1 to enable speaker mode) |
| 04:15.51 | aloril | actually, there could be emergency mode that you could enable: |
| 04:16.19 | aloril | press this button every 15 minutes or it calls emergency with prerecorded message |
| 04:16.54 | aloril | (if you feel bad and are not sure if its actually dangerous, but fear you might lose unconsciousness) |
| 04:17.03 | aloril | s/un/un |
| 04:17.31 | SpeedEvil | And squeal loudly if you lose GSM coverage. |
| 04:18.09 | SpeedEvil | I'm writing up the account idea (lost/stolen/...) in the wiki [[My Account]] (empty ATM) |
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| 04:35.15 | *** join/#openmoko dottedmag (i=bur@ccfit.nsu.ru) |
| 04:36.03 | aloril | list of P0 hardware bugs: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv3 |
| 04:37.27 | aloril | SpeedEvil: you might be interested in P1 hardware changes too |
| 04:37.34 | aloril | (I guess you have seen those already) |
| 04:37.46 | *** join/#openmoko amarsh04_ (n=amarsh04@CPE-124-177-204-181.sa.bigpond.net.au) |
| 04:39.47 | SpeedEvil | I tend to watch recent changes. Just occasionally :) |
| 04:39.56 | SpeedEvil | Currently editing though. |
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| 04:52.46 | aloril | some extra hidden battery: when thief removes battery, "Hey, you removed battery, please insert it back again!" "Oh and while you are at it, please plug to USB too..." |
| 04:53.02 | aloril | would probably spook a thief ;-) |
| 04:53.48 | SpeedEvil | Well - beat on [[My Account]] maybe. (when up) |
| 04:55.18 | *** join/#openmoko bluelightning (n=blueligh@125-237-67-171.jetstream.xtra.co.nz) |
| 04:56.00 | aloril | ( http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Wishlist:Tracking_lost_phone page is related page, which you know of course) |
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| 05:10.01 | SpeedEvil | It's related, I'm not going to tie the two together myself. |
| 05:13.43 | SpeedEvil | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/My_Account - now upo. |
| 05:15.13 | SpeedEvil | I2C and GPIO on solderable pads is nice. |
| 05:15.20 | SpeedEvil | Connector would be nicer, but... |
| 05:16.43 | rwhitby | woohoo: "Add I2C, SPI and one irq and wakeup capable GPIO pin to debug port plus have test pads for all these signals (for soldering wires directly on the pcb)" |
| 05:17.05 | rwhitby | oh, SpeedEvil saw it too :-) |
| 05:17.57 | SpeedEvil | :) |
| 05:18.07 | SpeedEvil | P0 - that's a horrible bug. |
| 05:18.18 | SpeedEvil | (no suspend to RAM and nice wakeup) |
| 05:18.59 | *** join/#openmoko bluelightning_ (n=blueligh@222-155-143-102.jetstream.xtra.co.nz) |
| 05:19.07 | aloril | yeah, this means P0 is really P0 and not resalable (still would probably fetch nice price at ebay (and be bad form of course)) |
| 05:19.45 | SpeedEvil | Well... |
| 05:20.02 | aloril | SpeedEvil: maybe add {{Wishlist}} tag to top (which would be removed if FIC actually implements it)? |
| 05:20.26 | SpeedEvil | Even with all the bugs, in idle mode - at 80mW, you're still looking at battery life of a day. |
| 05:20.35 | aloril | and yeah, I agree its separate item from recovering lost phone |
| 05:20.38 | SpeedEvil | For daily charging, it's still a useful device. |
| 05:21.00 | aloril | SpeedEvil: yeah, but resale value is significantly lower still ;-) |
| 05:21.12 | SpeedEvil | It could - in principle - for example, make it easier and safer to sell on ebay. (my account) |
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| 05:21.41 | aloril | if I use CPU as heavily as I suspect it would not matter for me, I need to charge it several times/day anyway (thus external AA's for charging) |
| 05:22.05 | SpeedEvil | I'm not convinced on AAs. |
| 05:22.12 | SpeedEvil | I think a couple of spare bats may be easier. |
| 05:22.26 | aloril | that means rebooting? |
| 05:22.36 | SpeedEvil | True, I suppose. |
| 05:23.01 | aloril | that alone means AA's are worth of it for me ;-) |
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| 05:24.45 | SpeedEvil | I wish they'd picked up my idea for an actual connector for I2C/USB internally. |
| 05:24.46 | aloril | hmm... belt cradle with USB socket that would charge it from belt battery (at least 10Ah, maybe 20Ah) |
| 05:24.59 | SpeedEvil | That'd have made user-add-ons a lot easier. |
| 05:25.02 | aloril | SpeedEvil: space? |
| 05:25.08 | SpeedEvil | Well... |
| 05:25.20 | SpeedEvil | There is some space next to the battery, if you look at the mouldings. |
| 05:27.05 | aloril | hmm.. no USB socket, that is too cumbersome, something that needs less accuracy |
| 05:27.58 | aloril | (like just plates with enough distance between poles) |
| 05:28.03 | SpeedEvil | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Disassembling_Neo1973 - the empty case frame - just next to the vibrator motor, between that and the battery connector is some space. |
| 05:28.11 | SpeedEvil | I wasn't meaning a USB socket. |
| 05:29.11 | SpeedEvil | Just a connector, with battery + USB d+ and d-, 3*I2C, and a couple of grounds. |
| 05:29.21 | SpeedEvil | 8-10 pins. |
| 05:31.23 | aloril | "no USB socket" was refering to earlier "belt cradle" comment |
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| 05:36.54 | SpeedEvil | Oh. |
| 05:40.01 | aloril | plates would mean less wear on USB socket too: having cable connected might eventually make solder points lose |
| 05:40.30 | aloril | if there is some weakness on Neo1973, I will probably discover it, I have that tendency ;-) |
| 05:43.26 | SpeedEvil | Yeah - that was one idea I was having for [[expansion back]] |
| 05:44.02 | SpeedEvil | The needed connector would only be around $.25 per. |
| 05:44.04 | SpeedEvil | Oh well. |
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| 07:38.58 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03caowai_song * r1169 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007/applications/openmoko-keyboard/layouts/ (10 files): Add different config file of each keyboard. |
| 07:39.38 | *** join/#openmoko denis^da (n=denis@p549BDF3C.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 07:43.46 | aloril | random blog: http://www.personalbee.com/215/10617285 |
| 07:45.36 | CM | It's nice to see that OpenMoko is getting more and more known |
| 07:45.50 | aloril | another set of picks with OLPC and Neo1973: http://mako.cc/copyrighteous/freesoftware/20070228-00.html |
| 07:45.55 | CM | The name is unlike anything else, and easy to remember :) |
| 07:46.01 | aloril | s/picks/pics |
| 07:46.58 | aloril | uups, http://mako.cc/copyrighteous/freesoftware/20070228-00 |
| 07:47.27 | aloril | (ah, nb, it works with .html too ;-) |
| 07:49.36 | *** join/#openmoko friedel (n=fwolff@dsl-242-218-82.telkomadsl.co.za) |
| 07:50.34 | aloril | s/nb/np |
| 07:52.32 | bluelightning | aloril: perhaps it's better to wait until there are devices out |
| 07:52.33 | *** join/#openmoko dom__ (n=dom@juicy.ecs.soton.ac.uk) |
| 07:52.36 | chihchun | how many people have the device in this channel ? :) |
| 07:54.23 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03zhiyong_sun * r1170 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007/panel-plugins/openmoko-panel-gsm/ (5 files in 2 dirs): convert to matchbox-panel-2 |
| 07:55.46 | aloril | bluelightning: yeah or building source code is easier |
| 07:55.48 | dilinger | i don't know what mako did to the colors in that image, but that's my hand in the picture (holding the openmoko) |
| 08:00.07 | *** join/#openmoko t0nY1 (n=nengyu@59-124-92-123.HINET-IP.hinet.net) |
| 08:00.28 | aloril | google offers openmg when you search on {news,blogsearch}.google.com (OpenMG is DRM method) |
| 08:00.45 | aloril | could consider that as insult ;-) |
| 08:07.17 | *** join/#openmoko Rac0r (n=Rac0r@p5081D5C2.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 08:09.09 | *** join/#openmoko dottedmag (i=bur@ccfit.nsu.ru) |
| 08:09.18 | CM | dilinger: Cool. How come you have one already? :) |
| 08:10.32 | dilinger | CM: right place, right time? |
| 08:11.29 | *** join/#openmoko mschuoi (n=typn@unaffiliated/chairuou) |
| 08:11.52 | CM | Tried to update the flash image or anything yet? |
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| 09:07.02 | xkr47 | http://www.fukung.net/v/2806/phonead.jpg |
| 09:07.04 | *** part/#openmoko dwery (n=dwery@nslu2-linux/dwery) |
| 09:07.37 | mjr | 2,5 |
| 09:07.59 | koen | cute |
| 09:08.21 | thresh_ | xkr47: :] |
| 09:11.44 | koen | It's amazing how open FIC is about those |
| 09:12.45 | Syg | Yeah, it is amazing. It shouldn't be; it should be industry standard. They're brave :) |
| 09:12.54 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03tony_guan * r1171 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007/applications/openmoko-dialer/ (25 files in 2 dirs): solved history window treeview problem,updated some png files,removed some bugs. |
| 09:13.03 | koen | "Add I2C, SPI and one irq and wakeup capable GPIO pin to debug port plus have test pads for all these signals (for soldering wires directly on the pcb)" |
| 09:13.32 | koen | anyone have a SPI wifi chip? |
| 09:13.56 | Syg | I have some tortilla chips |
| 09:18.52 | *** join/#openmoko borg_ (n=olaf@80.149.17.21) |
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| 09:22.23 | LarstiQ | koen_: looks good indeed |
| 09:25.39 | *** join/#openmoko greghunt (n=greg@88-108-12-5.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com) |
| 09:26.10 | hrw | koen: marvell 8385 can do SPI iirc |
| 09:29.11 | LuitvD | so those are the software/hardware problems om the p0 devices... |
| 09:29.37 | LuitvD | are all these problems solvable by upgrading firmware? ... |
| 09:30.18 | xkr47 | (at request) |
| 09:30.28 | *** join/#openmoko ecraven (i=nex@eutyche.swe.uni-linz.ac.at) |
| 09:30.53 | LuitvD | completely off? |
| 09:31.27 | LuitvD | why would you want that? :S |
| 09:31.36 | xkr47 | yeah, or adjusted between on and off in say levels 0-10 |
| 09:31.53 | xkr47 | well for teleconferencing perhaps? |
| 09:32.33 | LuitvD | it should just be software adjustable... |
| 09:32.50 | *** join/#openmoko meandtheshell (n=markus@85-124-233-202.work.xdsl-line.inode.at) |
| 09:32.59 | xkr47 | well it's in the gsm part, so it might not be.. |
| 09:33.01 | LuitvD | the mic and earpiece have the codec between them and the GSM module right? |
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| 09:41.54 | koen | LuitvD: the wiki page I linked to specifies what can be solved in software/firmware/hardware |
| 09:42.30 | LuitvD | koen: well... not really what I really wanted to ask... can the gsm firmware be flashed at home? |
| 09:42.31 | *** join/#openmoko etf|work (n=etf|work@proxy.salfordsoftware.co.uk) |
| 09:42.42 | koen | yes |
| 09:42.46 | koen | via the headphone socket |
| 09:44.16 | LuitvD | ah... |
| 09:44.16 | LuitvD | that's odd... |
| 09:44.16 | LuitvD | :) |
| 09:46.16 | LuitvD | koen: what kind of programming protocol? ... |
| 09:46.26 | koen | no idea |
| 09:46.32 | LuitvD | okay |
| 09:46.36 | koen | and I don't think they'll give us the flasher + blob |
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| 09:53.36 | *** join/#openmoko guaqua (i=che@lakka.kapsi.fi) |
| 09:53.45 | guaqua | did someone download the pdf and have a mirror? |
| 09:54.04 | guaqua | i can offer a mirror too, since the main site seems to be rather slow |
| 09:54.37 | *** join/#openmoko nm (n=hongtd@58.187.131.236) |
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| 09:59.42 | koen | which pdf? |
| 09:59.51 | guaqua | the one i got an e-mail link for |
| 10:00.07 | guaqua | this one: http://www.openmoko.com/files/OpenMoko_Neologics.pdf |
| 10:00.08 | rwhitby | fosdem slides |
| 10:00.29 | guaqua | can't download it |
| 10:01.34 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03werner * r1172 10/trunk/src/host/devirginator/ (11 files): |
| 10:01.35 | CIA-7 | openmoko: Next iteration. Stage 0 and stage 1 should work. Documentation is still |
| 10:01.35 | CIA-7 | openmoko: incomplete. Needs OpenOCD delay patch. |
| 10:01.52 | rwhitby | love the name of that tool. |
| 10:02.02 | hrw | yeah |
| 10:04.37 | rwhitby | 3Kbytes/sec downloading that pdf :-) |
| 10:05.07 | guaqua | that's why i'm asking if someone has it so i could mirror it |
| 10:05.08 | mikesh | guaqua: i can wget it, try it too |
| 10:05.22 | guaqua | getting 30 kb/s now |
| 10:05.27 | guaqua | 45... |
| 10:05.34 | *** join/#openmoko disguy__160148 (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-258d135d8821a9d4) |
| 10:05.36 | guaqua | ~25% done |
| 10:08.33 | koen | http://www.openembedded.org/~koen/openmoko/OpenMoko_Neologics.pdf |
| 10:09.10 | SirCrow | koen, Much faster :-) |
| 10:10.03 | Syg | Thanks so much koen! |
| 10:10.17 | koen | it suddenly jumped to 2MB/s |
| 10:11.01 | hrw | full pipe here |
| 10:12.09 | Syg | Wow, I really don't understand any of these analogies. They want to be God, and use amino acids to build phones, except for the Big Fleas getting in the way. |
| 10:12.18 | Syg | Do I have that right? O_o |
| 10:12.32 | *** join/#openmoko jeddy3 (n=mattiast@gw.sbg.se) |
| 10:12.39 | guaqua | mirrors: http://users.tkk.fi/~aeh/OpenMoko_Neologics.pdf and http://www.a3h.net/~gua/OpenMoko_Neologics.pdf |
| 10:12.49 | vmaster | Syg: i'd guess so ;) |
| 10:15.54 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@dsl093-060-111.pit1.dsl.speakeasy.net) |
| 10:16.20 | koen | Syg: they want us to damage the buildingblocks and create crazy forms |
| 10:18.20 | *** join/#openmoko vlo (n=valentin@lsa1pc7.epfl.ch) |
| 10:21.14 | Syg | I imagine a future of grotesquely mutated organic cellphones. |
| 10:21.38 | Syg | ... awesome! |
| 10:23.08 | mjr | There was a (private) question about a Finnish channel; I've started, experimentally, #openmoko-fi for Finnish discussion. FYI. |
| 10:23.32 | CM | Perkele! ;) |
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| 10:24.34 | *** join/#openmoko sumasuma (n=kurukko@61.14.86.23) |
| 10:24.37 | sumasuma | hi |
| 10:24.57 | sumasuma | where can i submit new projects for openmoko ? |
| 10:25.10 | stefan_schmidt | sumasuma: projects.openmoko.org |
| 10:25.30 | sumasuma | stefan_schmidt: thanks |
| 10:26.31 | buz | hum openmoko org is reaaaaly slow? |
| 10:26.50 | buz | oh wait thats .com |
| 10:27.03 | buz | anyone got a mirror of that presentation? |
| 10:27.16 | Elrond | HI people. |
| 10:27.23 | koen | buz: scroll up |
| 10:28.04 | buz | oh |
| 10:28.10 | buz | dont even need to scroll ;) |
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| 10:32.08 | *** part/#openmoko friedel (n=fwolff@dsl-242-218-82.telkomadsl.co.za) |
| 10:36.33 | Elrond | counter |
| 10:36.33 | aloril | P0: 3 days 01:23:26 (3.058 +-2.0 days); P1: 25.058 +-10.0 (see faq) (435) |
| 10:45.09 | buz | i still dont get why the feed reader would be a stylus app |
| 10:45.27 | Syg | So you can stab feeds you don't like? |
| 10:47.57 | buz | i could still poke them in the eye with my finger |
| 10:48.15 | SpeedEvil | Or if you can find a handy one, with a stick. |
| 10:50.46 | buz | reading feeds would seem to be a mostly non input based activity |
| 10:50.54 | SpeedEvil | Yeah. |
| 10:51.04 | SpeedEvil | I have that comment about some other things. |
| 10:51.27 | buz | one that would GREATLY benefit from p900 ingenious multi dimensional scrollwheel, btw |
| 10:51.30 | SpeedEvil | some of them could pretty much do with the scrollwheel, and stab the window to |
| 10:51.38 | buz | hehe |
| 10:51.41 | koen | buz, SpeedEvil: please send such feedback to one of the mailinglists |
| 10:51.47 | SpeedEvil | click |
| 10:52.06 | SpeedEvil | yeah. |
| 10:52.06 | buz | i think i actually did |
| 10:52.10 | buz | at some point |
| 10:53.03 | CM | SpeedEvil: Do you ever sleep btw? There's comments from all hours of the day from you on here ;) |
| 10:55.30 | *** join/#openmoko silwo1 (n=silwol@teacheradsl241.eduhi.at) |
| 10:57.42 | SpeedEvil | I have unfortunately unreliable sleep patterns. |
| 11:00.31 | *** join/#openmoko zecke (n=ich@91.64.160.193) |
| 11:04.21 | xkr47 | SpeedEvil, but you always wake up ?-) |
| 11:05.37 | SpeedEvil | Have so far. |
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| 11:06.28 | xkr47 | 99.996% reliable automatic wakeup |
| 11:09.58 | SpeedEvil | I'm going for 99.999. |
| 11:10.17 | Stephmw | pretty good SLA |
| 11:14.14 | xkr47 | SpeedEvil, either you wake up 4 times a day until you're 70 or then you'll live til 280 and wake up once a day :) |
| 11:15.31 | Stephmw | I hear scientists had good results with electroshocks on dogs |
| 11:15.42 | Stephmw | maybe wire the Neo for such usage? |
| 11:16.28 | *** part/#openmoko __tim (n=tim@dsl-217-155-195-89.zen.co.uk) |
| 11:16.29 | xkr47 | install bluetooth receiver in dog brains ?-) |
| 11:17.13 | Stephmw | I'd say just add a fine electrifiable mesh to the neo casing |
| 11:19.18 | *** part/#openmoko Syg (n=zip@pixfw.ent.ncsu.edu) |
| 11:28.24 | *** join/#openmoko gyaresu (n=gyaresu@124.243.158.56) |
| 11:35.40 | Stephmw | does anyone here crimp their own cat6 cables? I'm wondering if there's anything very different from doing cat5 ones |
| 11:40.03 | LuitvD | Stephmw: I only use cat5... what's so special about cat6? |
| 11:40.09 | LuitvD | better data rate? |
| 11:40.26 | benJIman | Nah |
| 11:40.29 | koen | shielding |
| 11:40.43 | koen | and having actually all 8 wires connected |
| 11:40.46 | LuitvD | better then FTP cable? |
| 11:40.54 | benJIman | Tbh you'd have to be doing pretty insane stuff to need the shielding |
| 11:41.03 | benJIman | Cat5 is quite happy even outdoors |
| 11:41.13 | XorA|gone | benJIman: think the other way |
| 11:41.18 | koen | gbit runs quite happy over my cat5 cables as well |
| 11:41.35 | benJIman | and you can do 2 on one cable with cat5 |
| 11:41.35 | XorA|gone | benJIman: imagine a sensitive application with a base frequency at 100Mhz or 1Ghz |
| 11:41.45 | XorA|gone | with cables running near it |
| 11:41.49 | hrw | koen: cat5e usually have 8 wires too |
| 11:42.01 | benJIman | hrw: only half are used |
| 11:42.18 | hrw | benJIman: depends on cards used |
| 11:42.40 | hrw | benJIman: 100TX4 use all pairs |
| 11:42.41 | SpeedEvil | <PROTECTED> |
| 11:42.47 | benJIman | ah yes |
| 11:42.51 | madwoota | and cat5e |
| 11:43.01 | SpeedEvil | it has more exacting specifications in many ways. |
| 11:43.16 | madwoota | like better shielding |
| 11:43.44 | SpeedEvil | Pretty soon, if you don't have shielding, the cable will start to glow :) |
| 11:43.56 | madwoota | the wires are thicker too arent they ? |
| 11:44.18 | hrw | benJIman: 100TX4 are rare cards as 100TX are able to work on 2 pairs |
| 11:44.30 | koen | coax ftw |
| 11:44.55 | LuitvD | lol, there's an AWACS flying around over my house |
| 11:44.57 | *** join/#openmoko danilos (n=danilo@adsl-233-130.eunet.yu) |
| 11:46.45 | LuitvD | :) |
| 11:47.00 | LuitvD | of what? |
| 11:47.19 | LuitvD | of this? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Awacscrash.jpg |
| 11:47.24 | SpeedEvil | Precision guided munitions. |
| 11:49.09 | LuitvD | yeah sure... fired by the NATO? on dutch soil? |
| 11:49.11 | LuitvD | :P |
| 11:49.27 | LuitvD | why would the NATO want to bomb utrecht :) |
| 11:51.26 | SpeedEvil | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marvin_the_martian |
| 11:51.50 | SpeedEvil | To clear the view to venus of course. |
| 11:51.54 | LuitvD | :P |
| 11:52.11 | koen | calendar looks a bit funny: http://scap.linuxtogo.org/files/31412a884e75fc053ba706378ea06712.png |
| 11:52.13 | LuitvD | marvin is flying this awacs plane? |
| 11:52.14 | LuitvD | :) |
| 11:52.36 | LuitvD | koen: broken image? :P |
| 11:52.55 | LuitvD | koen: and there will be no tomorrow? :P |
| 11:53.07 | LuitvD | or wait... that was yesterday :P |
| 11:53.31 | *** join/#openmoko cprf (n=rzinkov@oss-staff.rutgers.edu) |
| 11:56.38 | koen | http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=223 |
| 11:57.34 | koen | if thos keeps fixing bugs as fast as always PIM might be actually useable when we get our p0 phones |
| 11:57.36 | LuitvD[foo] | koen: does it show only monday tuesday and wednesday, or does it only show the days until the current day? |
| 11:57.59 | koen | LuitvD[foo]: I had the exact same view yesterday |
| 11:58.08 | LuitvD[foo] | :P |
| 11:58.22 | LuitvD[foo] | koen: is it me, or is wednesday highlighted? |
| 11:58.38 | koen | it is |
| 11:58.43 | LuitvD[foo] | koen: even though it's thursday? |
| 11:59.05 | koen | I'm starting to like the openmoko look more and more |
| 11:59.12 | LuitvD[foo] | :) |
| 12:00.13 | *** join/#openmoko msroest (n=msroest@S01060040f41dad58.cg.shawcable.net) |
| 12:00.17 | *** join/#openmoko GaKkGaKk (n=Viko@pat-wlan-gsw2.ntnu.no) |
| 12:01.32 | LuitvD[foo] | :( |
| 12:01.58 | *** join/#openmoko mschuoi (n=typn@unaffiliated/chairuou) |
| 12:02.46 | *** join/#openmoko morricone (i=foobar@dslb-084-057-171-158.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 12:03.17 | Stephmw | LuitvD[foo]: I'm moving my home lan to GigE, my existing cat5 can't sustain it |
| 12:04.01 | LuitvD[foo] | Stephmw: hmm... what's the max distance? |
| 12:04.12 | Stephmw | LuitvD[foo]: 100m iirc |
| 12:04.36 | Stephmw | aha.. 90m |
| 12:04.38 | LuitvD[foo] | I mean the max distance you'll need in your house... |
| 12:04.38 | SpeedEvil | I think that's for 100M, isn't gigE smaller? |
| 12:04.40 | SpeedEvil | oh |
| 12:04.47 | Stephmw | oh, right |
| 12:04.50 | Stephmw | no longer than 25m |
| 12:05.07 | *** join/#openmoko danilos (n=danilo@adsl-233-130.eunet.yu) |
| 12:05.50 | LuitvD[foo] | Stephmw: that's odd... my cat5 unshielded cable seems to do fine at 30m... |
| 12:06.10 | Stephmw | LuitvD[foo]: at 1000TX? |
| 12:06.25 | LuitvD[foo] | at gigabit speed, yes |
| 12:06.38 | Stephmw | LuitvD[foo]: I do have to share conduits with lots of other cables, power included |
| 12:07.20 | *** part/#openmoko GaKkGaKk (n=Viko@pat-wlan-gsw2.ntnu.no) |
| 12:07.35 | *** join/#openmoko GaKkGaKk (n=Viko@pat-wlan-gsw2.ntnu.no) |
| 12:10.40 | *** join/#openmoko disguy__160148 (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-cb0f429c9519025a) |
| 12:12.11 | *** join/#openmoko incinerator (n=sabine@80-192-23-26.cable.ubr04.edin.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 12:16.34 | *** join/#openmoko danilos (n=danilo@adsl-233-130.eunet.yu) |
| 12:22.01 | *** part/#openmoko GaKkGaKk (n=Viko@pat-wlan-gsw2.ntnu.no) |
| 12:22.05 | *** join/#openmoko GaKkGaKk (n=Viko@pat-wlan-gsw2.ntnu.no) |
| 12:23.44 | *** join/#openmoko SirCrow (n=sircrow@sd511685b.adsl.wanadoo.nl) |
| 12:27.45 | *** join/#openmoko woglinde (n=heinold@leningrad.mi.fu-berlin.de) |
| 12:29.16 | *** join/#openmoko silwol (n=silwol@teacheradsl241.eduhi.at) |
| 12:31.44 | *** join/#openmoko infernix (i=nix@unaffiliated/infernix) |
| 12:31.47 | *** join/#openmoko amarsh04 (n=amarsh04@CPE-124-177-204-181.sa.bigpond.net.au) |
| 12:32.21 | *** join/#openmoko |Lupin| (n=seb@zen.loria.fr) |
| 12:32.32 | |Lupin| | Hi |
| 12:39.16 | *** part/#openmoko GaKkGaKk (n=Viko@pat-wlan-gsw2.ntnu.no) |
| 12:43.42 | *** join/#openmoko StylusEater (n=adutko@ip70-191-114-7.cl.ri.cox.net) |
| 12:43.53 | *** join/#openmoko disguy__160148 (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-de643db870c77988) |
| 12:45.55 | *** join/#openmoko buz (n=buz@80-218-148-33.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 12:46.15 | *** join/#openmoko denis^da (n=denis@84.155.209.239) |
| 12:54.49 | SpeedEvil | I see they're now adding erratas till we decide that P0 is not worth buying on ebay :) |
| 12:55.52 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03werner * r1173 10/developers/werner/openocd-wait-patiently.patch: |
| 12:55.52 | CIA-7 | openmoko: src/target/target.c (handle_wait_halt_command): let user override the default |
| 12:55.52 | CIA-7 | openmoko: maximum delay of 5 seconds |
| 12:57.58 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03werner * r1174 10/developers/werner/notes/openocd: Added application of openocd-wait-patiently.patch |
| 13:00.25 | LuitvD[foo] | what's openocd? |
| 13:00.48 | koen | On Chip Debugger |
| 13:00.55 | koen | vmaster's brainchild |
| 13:01.00 | *** join/#openmoko pvanhoof (n=pvanhoof@d54C0EE14.access.telenet.be) |
| 13:02.20 | stefan_schmidt | LuitvD[foo]: He software part to JTAG |
| 13:02.45 | koen | "Due to an error in the production process, the factory-programmed NAND bad block information has been lost. This means that some blocks in the flash will wear out rapidly, which might become as bad as rendering the device unusable." |
| 13:03.32 | SpeedEvil | I don't see why. |
| 13:03.43 | SpeedEvil | It will cause excessive early bad blocks. |
| 13:04.03 | SpeedEvil | Ah. |
| 13:04.23 | SpeedEvil | Unless you've got JTAG, you may not be able to recover from a bad block early enough in the process. |
| 13:04.40 | LuitvD[foo] | what, did the GTA01-Bv3 get bad NAND? |
| 13:04.46 | SpeedEvil | No. |
| 13:04.47 | *** join/#openmoko dneary (n=dneary@mne69-9-88-163-116-163.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 13:04.53 | SpeedEvil | All nand comes with bad blocks. |
| 13:04.58 | LuitvD[foo] | hmm... |
| 13:05.02 | SpeedEvil | Some mapped at the factory. |
| 13:05.25 | SpeedEvil | It also develops bad blocks - and there is a proper strategy to handle ones that develop in use. |
| 13:05.51 | SpeedEvil | There is enough margin, so that at 100K cycles, it's supposed to be at the 'nominal' figure - 64M |
| 13:08.07 | *** join/#openmoko disguy__160148 (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-176aa64a2533cc98) |
| 13:15.07 | *** join/#openmoko msroest (n=msroest@coloc1.beyond.ca) |
| 13:20.51 | aloril | counter |
| 13:20.52 | aloril | P0: 2 days 22:39:08 (2.944 +-2.0 days); P1: 24.944 +-10.0 (see faq) (436) |
| 13:21.24 | CM | LuitvD[foo]: Is this your robot? http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/robots/robot-sex-its-here-240486.php |
| 13:21.34 | LuitvD[foo] | heheheh |
| 13:21.39 | LuitvD[foo] | nope |
| 13:21.47 | CM | Had to ask.. ;) |
| 13:21.52 | LuitvD[foo] | I'm glad it's not :) |
| 13:22.22 | CM | Hilarious video [SFW!] |
| 13:22.30 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03werner * r1175 10/trunk/src/host/devirginator/ (README environment.in openocd.in): |
| 13:22.31 | CIA-7 | openmoko: environment.in: corrected file name in header |
| 13:22.31 | CIA-7 | openmoko: openocd.in: use new "wait_halt [<seconds>]" |
| 13:22.31 | CIA-7 | openmoko: README: added prerequisites and miscellaneous text |
| 13:23.27 | LuitvD[foo] | CM: that robot is fun :) |
| 13:23.40 | LuitvD[foo] | and the program is even nicer :P |
| 13:24.02 | *** join/#openmoko disguy__160148 (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-081609814bfb7bcf) |
| 13:24.25 | LuitvD[foo] | that thing is full of servo's |
| 13:25.16 | LuitvD[foo] | my robot only has 2 gear motors :( |
| 13:29.26 | aloril | hehe: "You can't join that many channels" |
| 13:30.19 | LuitvD[foo] | on what? |
| 13:30.19 | aloril | (20 is limit) |
| 13:30.23 | LuitvD[foo] | lol |
| 13:30.27 | aloril | on freenode server |
| 13:30.41 | LuitvD[foo] | that's a lot... |
| 13:30.54 | LuitvD[foo] | well... not for a bot... but for a person... :P |
| 13:31.11 | *** join/#openmoko MoRpHeUz (n=morphbr@200.184.118.132) |
| 13:32.34 | *** join/#openmoko gyaresu (n=gyaresu@124.243.158.56) |
| 13:32.59 | *** join/#openmoko quitte_ (n=quitte@stgt-d9beb9ef.pool.mediaWays.net) |
| 13:33.57 | koen | hmm |
| 13:34.13 | koen | I hope the neo arrives in time to take it to the bossa conference |
| 13:34.29 | buz | LuitvD: do you think that is a real robot? or more of a stop motion stunt |
| 13:34.42 | LuitvD | buz: it's real |
| 13:34.51 | buz | impressive |
| 13:35.06 | LuitvD | buz: it's a very cool robot, with about 20 mini-servo's |
| 13:35.13 | buz | now make it life size and give it a girl skin |
| 13:35.19 | LuitvD | heheheh |
| 13:35.41 | CM | I like the flexing muscles poses |
| 13:35.49 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03laforge * r1176 10/trunk/src/target/u-boot/patches/ (4 files): |
| 13:35.49 | CIA-7 | openmoko: * introduce Hardware ECC support for the S3C2410 NAND driver |
| 13:35.49 | CIA-7 | openmoko: ** big speedup compared to software ECC |
| 13:35.49 | CIA-7 | openmoko: ** detects single and multi-bit errors |
| 13:35.49 | CIA-7 | openmoko: ** doesn't correct 1-bit errors yet |
| 13:35.50 | CIA-7 | openmoko: * enable hardware ECC in the neo1973 config |
| 13:35.52 | CIA-7 | openmoko: * add a patch to really mark bad blocks as bad |
| 13:35.58 | CM | And showing his bling-bling ;) |
| 13:36.34 | LuitvD | yeah :) |
| 13:38.01 | LuitvD | CM: most robot-tournaments host a tournament for those bots too :) |
| 13:38.07 | *** join/#openmoko gyaresu (n=gyaresu@124.243.158.56) |
| 13:38.29 | LuitvD | CM: fights between bots like that look like american wrestling :) |
| 13:38.38 | CM | I've seen some of those |
| 13:38.51 | CM | One live fight in a store in Tokyo |
| 13:39.02 | buz | you know how much they cost? |
| 13:39.05 | LuitvD | nope |
| 13:39.11 | buz | must be a bitch to control |
| 13:39.33 | CM | I don't know that model, but the ones I saw was between 1-2000 USD |
| 13:39.48 | CM | And they were pretty small (1000-2000 of course..) |
| 13:39.51 | LuitvD | with an object oriented programming language it should be quite easy |
| 13:40.25 | koen | robot.fight() |
| 13:40.36 | koen | robot.fight(dirty) |
| 13:41.15 | LuitvD | :) |
| 13:41.31 | buz | if he can bring beer, i might buy one |
| 13:41.35 | LuitvD | heheheh |
| 13:41.44 | LuitvD | it might even be able to do that... |
| 13:42.05 | LuitvD | anyways, my robot is an inverted pendulum robot |
| 13:42.08 | *** join/#openmoko Marex (n=Marex@85.132.236.161) |
| 13:42.17 | buz | well somehow i dont see it putting beer on the table |
| 13:42.22 | LuitvD | like this one, only smaller: http://www.geology.smu.edu/~dpa-www/robo/nbot/ |
| 13:43.01 | LuitvD | buz: if you drop a step-ladder it might be able to climb up... |
| 13:43.24 | buz | lol |
| 13:43.59 | LuitvD | drag a can of beer to the table, put a rope around it, climb up with the other end of the rope, and finally pull it up to the tabletop :) |
| 13:44.02 | *** join/#openmoko l4rs (n=laprican@hsiproxy.astra-net.com) |
| 13:44.38 | *** join/#openmoko gyaresu (n=gyaresu@124.243.158.56) |
| 13:44.50 | buz | iiieeew canned beer |
| 13:45.00 | buz | i was more thinking of bottles then pouring it perfectly |
| 13:45.11 | LuitvD | :) |
| 13:45.34 | koen | "You can add events by double clicking in the calendar area." |
| 13:45.41 | koen | that's not intuitive |
| 13:45.50 | LuitvD | koen: not? |
| 13:45.59 | koen | not on a touchscreen |
| 13:46.06 | LuitvD | koen: then what is? dragging a range? |
| 13:46.13 | koen | tap or tap&hold is intuitive |
| 13:46.16 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@24.crcr10.xdsl.nauticom.net) |
| 13:46.21 | koen | or like you say, dragging a range |
| 13:46.25 | LuitvD | :) |
| 13:46.32 | buz | double click on a touchscreen is weird |
| 13:46.47 | LuitvD | in weekview it can be quite hard to drag a precise range though... |
| 13:46.49 | LuitvD | i guess |
| 13:46.50 | *** join/#openmoko disguy__160148 (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-979f9d801017d863) |
| 13:46.51 | buz | i thought we pretty much did away with doubleclicking anyway |
| 13:47.00 | koen | buz: I hoped so as well |
| 13:47.05 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03laforge * r1177 10/trunk/src/target/u-boot/patches/uboot-mokoversion.patch: increase to 'moko5' for hwecc changes |
| 13:47.18 | koen | buz: the o-hand people doing the PIM don't seem to agree, though |
| 13:47.34 | buz | shouldnt be that hard to change? |
| 13:47.51 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03laforge * r1178 10/trunk/oe/packages/linux/linux-gta01/ (defconfig-2.6.20-fic-gta01 defconfig-2.6.20.1-fic-gta01): |
| 13:47.52 | CIA-7 | openmoko: * add hardware ECC support |
| 13:47.52 | CIA-7 | openmoko: * increase version to -moko8 |
| 13:47.52 | CIA-7 | openmoko: WARNING: Kernels >= moko8 are incompatible with uboot < moko5 |
| 13:47.58 | buz | i can see doubleclicking to create events in some ical like desktop app, maybe |
| 13:48.56 | koen | buz: add your thoughts to http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=222 |
| 13:49.34 | koen | I don't think the filter menu should filter for 'day' 'week' or 'month', but filter categories |
| 13:49.47 | koen | like "study" "work" , etc |
| 13:50.48 | LuitvD | damn, I hate my chip's A/D converters |
| 13:50.49 | CM | I'm not convinced of that.. |
| 13:51.04 | CM | I'd rather see week or month |
| 13:51.07 | *** join/#openmoko gyaresu (n=gyaresu@124.243.158.56) |
| 13:52.04 | buz | <b>Email sent to:</b> thomas@openedhand.com, koen@openembedded.org<br> <br><center>If you wish to tweak the kinds of mail Bugzilla sends you, you can <a href="userprefs.cgi?tab=email">change your preferences</a></center> |
| 13:52.11 | buz | bugzilla itself is kinda broken it seems |
| 13:52.17 | buz | where do i file meta bugs ;) |
| 13:52.22 | LarstiQ | bugzilla.org? :P |
| 13:53.11 | koen | it took me 2 weeks + bugzilla comment to figure out how to add events |
| 13:54.03 | SpeedEvil | Cool - http://www.eetimes.com/news/latest/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=197008416 one of the electronics industry papers. |
| 13:55.03 | SpeedEvil | Though only in passing. |
| 13:55.08 | buz | "At issue is U.S. carriers' practice of restricting their networks to approved handsets and applications sold by the carriers themselves" |
| 13:55.12 | buz | i still think thats wrong |
| 13:55.15 | buz | its true for cdma |
| 13:55.20 | buz | but there its kinda obvious why |
| 13:55.42 | buz | plus nobody forces you to go cdma |
| 13:56.31 | buz | anyway, i cant see skype working with current pingtimes in umts |
| 13:57.56 | guaqua | err? |
| 13:57.57 | guaqua | what are the pingtimes like? |
| 13:58.42 | guaqua | i've done lots of skypeing over gprs |
| 13:59.22 | SpeedEvil | With good results? |
| 13:59.24 | *** join/#openmoko vlo (n=valentin@lsa1pc7.epfl.ch) |
| 13:59.32 | guaqua | though granted, for skype to achieve the critical call quality to make it standard the connection needs to be better |
| 13:59.40 | guaqua | SpeedEvil: it workds |
| 13:59.46 | *** join/#openmoko gyaresu_ (n=gyaresu@124.243.158.56) |
| 13:59.51 | SpeedEvil | Well? Or bearably. |
| 14:00.15 | guaqua | it works |
| 14:00.22 | guaqua | not bearably and not well |
| 14:00.29 | SpeedEvil | Ah. |
| 14:00.43 | SpeedEvil | I think pish to talk is probably about the limit. |
| 14:00.50 | SpeedEvil | Err - push :) |
| 14:00.52 | guaqua | sometimes it clips the sound, but it's usable |
| 14:01.27 | guaqua | and thinking - if i can get unlimited calling and data for 10 euros a month...it's good enough deal :) |
| 14:02.02 | SpeedEvil | That's nice. Here it's more like e50 |
| 14:02.25 | guaqua | where is your here? |
| 14:02.32 | SpeedEvil | UK |
| 14:02.55 | guaqua | figured ;) |
| 14:03.16 | Stephmw | yeah, all of us in the UK are getting royally screwed |
| 14:03.40 | Elrond | SpeedEvil - BTW: You also saw the errata in the wiki. Did anyone mention specifics of the gsm firmware update? |
| 14:03.52 | SpeedEvil | no. |
| 14:04.02 | SpeedEvil | It's a factory thing AIUI. |
| 14:04.07 | aloril | why implement TCP twice and shoot UDP to foot? |
| 14:04.15 | koen | iirc sean said FIC can't hand out the firmware due to NDAs |
| 14:04.26 | guaqua | SpeedEvil: i'm in the impression it's the situation there. broadband, computer price and mobile price-wise :) |
| 14:04.26 | SpeedEvil | they won't/can't let users flash. |
| 14:04.52 | Elrond | So all the people already having a phone are screwed. ;) |
| 14:05.08 | SpeedEvil | Broadband is the problem of BT - they charge ISPs about 1 euro per gigabyte of transfer to the users. |
| 14:05.11 | Elrond | s/screwed/"screwed" ;) |
| 14:05.27 | SpeedEvil | So, unsurprisingly, they introduce quotas/capping/shaping. |
| 14:05.53 | SpeedEvil | As otherwise someone maxing out an 8M line can wipe out the profits from many hundred users. |
| 14:06.10 | guaqua | does BT charge also when the other ISP:s provide their own fiber to the DSLAMs? |
| 14:06.15 | *** join/#openmoko disguy__160148 (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-e09d49b289541567) |
| 14:06.19 | SpeedEvil | No. |
| 14:06.22 | koen | Elrond: yes |
| 14:06.24 | guaqua | okay |
| 14:06.41 | koen | Elrond: one of the reasons why p0 people get to choose when they want to get their phone |
| 14:06.42 | *** join/#openmoko Elixir- (i=mixed@cpe-66-68-172-127.austin.res.rr.com) |
| 14:06.51 | guaqua | i think the finnish law states against that kind of deals to customers |
| 14:07.00 | guaqua | here all the connections are unlimited |
| 14:07.03 | SpeedEvil | However, that's moderately expensive to do too. 'LLU' exchanges are of course only in populated areas though. |
| 14:07.11 | Elrond | koen - Ahh, they have an option to say "Now?" :) |
| 14:07.28 | *** part/#openmoko t0nY (n=nengyu@59-124-92-123.HINET-IP.hinet.net) |
| 14:07.33 | SpeedEvil | Most people outside cities, BT provides the virtual circuit back to the NOC. |
| 14:07.44 | guaqua | yeah |
| 14:07.59 | Elrond | SpeedEvil - sounds much like the same fun in .de ;) |
| 14:08.04 | guaqua | so the ISP:s are basically virtual operators |
| 14:08.18 | guaqua | virtual operators of the existing phone network |
| 14:08.30 | SpeedEvil | Apart from those exchanges where it's worthwhile putting in their own kit, yues. |
| 14:08.51 | koen | Elrond: where "now" read "20070305", yes |
| 14:09.08 | guaqua | you'd just need more government regulation to the prices |
| 14:09.14 | guaqua | it's pretty much the only way |
| 14:10.08 | Elrond | koen - 0305 equates to *Bv04? |
| 14:10.58 | SpeedEvil | The fundamental problem is that now BT's various arms have been spun off, it pretty much has to make money off the central network, which means bandwidth charges... |
| 14:11.06 | SpeedEvil | Elrond: IIRC it was said so on the wiki |
| 14:11.15 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03werner * r1179 10/trunk/src/host/devirginator/README: |
| 14:11.15 | CIA-7 | openmoko: - added stages overview |
| 14:11.15 | CIA-7 | openmoko: - updated description of how stage 2 ends |
| 14:12.07 | guaqua | in english that pretty much means it's fucked business-wise, if it doesn't take everything out as long as it can. in the process it's slowing down the development of broadband related activity |
| 14:12.42 | SpeedEvil | Yeah. |
| 14:12.45 | SpeedEvil | ; GTA01Bv4 |
| 14:12.45 | SpeedEvil | This is the version that will be shipped in Phase 1 |
| 14:12.45 | SpeedEvil | Changes from GTA01Bv3 |
| 14:12.46 | SpeedEvil | <PROTECTED> |
| 14:12.53 | SpeedEvil | :) |
| 14:13.14 | SpeedEvil | guaqua: For more fun - the virtual circuit model means that broadcast can't work. |
| 14:13.16 | Elrond | I asked about P0 ;) |
| 14:13.22 | SpeedEvil | Ah. |
| 14:13.37 | *** join/#openmoko gyaresu (n=gyaresu@124.243.158.56) |
| 14:13.39 | SpeedEvil | P0 are basically geting buggy hardware AIUI. |
| 14:13.55 | Elrond | Good I'm not on P0 ;) |
| 14:13.55 | guaqua | so all in all, bad service for little money and with no chance of actual development |
| 14:13.59 | SpeedEvil | There are no _critical_ bugs that will stop it working as a phone with a battery life of a couple of days. |
| 14:14.44 | SpeedEvil | guaqua: And broadcast not working means all 'broadband TV' stuff gets horribly expensive. |
| 14:14.52 | *** join/#openmoko disguy__160148 (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-cceb6f41a63f97f7) |
| 14:15.13 | guaqua | we have an isp in finland that actually offers dvb over adsl |
| 14:15.24 | guaqua | but there's only one |
| 14:15.45 | SpeedEvil | Of course - this sort of stuff can be done - if you're in a LLU (local loop unbundled) exchange, but... |
| 14:16.30 | guaqua | i think BT is just too big |
| 14:16.54 | guaqua | there won't be any changes as long as it remains in power |
| 14:16.57 | *** join/#openmoko dottedmag (i=bur@ccfit.nsu.ru) |
| 14:18.21 | *** join/#openmoko borg__ (n=olaf@80.149.17.21) |
| 14:18.26 | guaqua | i wonder what the broadband service is like in france and italy, are the problems the same as in uk and germany? |
| 14:18.32 | SpeedEvil | There is no political impetus to. The users can from their perspective pick different ISPs or telcos. |
| 14:19.07 | SpeedEvil | They don't understand the reasons why the ISPs quota. |
| 14:21.22 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03laforge * r1180 10/trunk/oe/packages/openocd/ (openocd-native_130.bb openocd_130.bb openocd_svn.bb): |
| 14:21.22 | CIA-7 | openmoko: * add 'wait-patiently.patch' from werner |
| 14:21.22 | CIA-7 | openmoko: * add revision 130 as 'known-good' version |
| 14:21.24 | *** join/#openmoko tigert (n=tigert@nblzone-208-37.nblnetworks.fi) |
| 14:23.10 | *** join/#openmoko dottedmag (i=bur@ccfit.nsu.ru) |
| 14:24.49 | vmaster | revision 131 would have been known-better... ;) |
| 14:28.07 | *** join/#openmoko chrustinho (n=christop@p57B025CE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 14:30.11 | stefan_schmidt | vmaster: heh |
| 14:30.14 | *** join/#openmoko disguy__160148 (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-23dd0b77d64a435e) |
| 14:30.43 | *** join/#openmoko vlo (n=valentin@lsa1pc7.epfl.ch) |
| 14:31.29 | vmaster | nah, working on a larger update for 132 which is certainly going to break some stuff ;) |
| 14:32.20 | vmaster | 131 contains only a fix for libftdi, which openmoko prefers over the free libftdi |
| 14:33.52 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03laforge * r1181 10/trunk/oe/packages/openocd/ (openocd_130.bb openocd_svn.bb): put the openocd binary in deploy_dir |
| 14:33.53 | *** join/#openmoko vlo (n=valentin@lsa1pc7.epfl.ch) |
| 14:34.18 | *** part/#openmoko MoRpHeUz (n=morphbr@200.184.118.132) |
| 14:35.40 | vmaster | s/free libftdi/proprietary ftd2xx/ |
| 14:36.11 | *** join/#openmoko libervisco (n=libervis@tuxhacker/libervis) |
| 14:36.58 | *** join/#openmoko sixfeet (n=sixfeet@84.132.249.81) |
| 14:37.31 | sixfeet | moin |
| 14:37.37 | SpeedEvil | Mornign. |
| 14:37.42 | SpeedEvil | Well - afternoon. |
| 14:38.04 | sixfeet | ^^ not in eurpoe |
| 14:38.29 | SpeedEvil | I gathered. |
| 14:38.42 | sixfeet | if you sleep by daylight ... the morning comes later |
| 14:40.06 | sixfeet | counter |
| 14:40.06 | aloril | P0: 2 days 21:19:53 (2.889 +-2.0 days); P1: 24.889 +-10.0 (see faq) (437) |
| 14:40.14 | *** join/#openmoko disguy__160148 (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-fcb61545f1e9f37f) |
| 14:40.38 | sixfeet | is there a shop avaliable? |
| 14:40.48 | SpeedEvil | can't buy yet. |
| 14:40.56 | SpeedEvil | faq? |
| 14:40.56 | aloril | See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ |
| 14:40.59 | SpeedEvil | ^^ |
| 14:41.03 | sixfeet | ahh ok |
| 14:41.35 | *** join/#openmoko jzs (n=king@cpe.atm2-0-10282.0x50a09aee.bynxx12.customer.tele.dk) |
| 14:41.45 | SpeedEvil | Maybe a month or so till the general public can buy one. |
| 14:41.59 | *** join/#openmoko ajturner (n=irc@d14-69-228-190.try.wideopenwest.com) |
| 14:41.59 | SpeedEvil | They are re-rolling the PCB now. |
| 14:42.48 | vmaster | hehehe, amazing how the two '?' trigger works |
| 14:44.19 | Stephmw | hahaha, you know something's fubar'd when your hardware dumps core via the serial interface ;) |
| 14:45.49 | sixfeet | hmm sep. so i have to take care of my samsung so long |
| 14:46.25 | SpeedEvil | Sep - for 'end userable' hardware, yes. |
| 14:48.45 | aloril | vmaster: actually this time it was "faq?" that triggered |
| 14:48.58 | noidd | <guaqua> i think BT is just too big |
| 14:48.58 | noidd | <guaqua> there won't be any changes as long as it remains in power |
| 14:49.04 | noidd | You talking about British Telecom? |
| 14:49.07 | sixfeet | i think i'm trying some apps but no dev. ;) |
| 14:50.03 | *** join/#openmoko vlo (n=valentin@lsa1pc7.epfl.ch) |
| 14:50.25 | *** join/#openmoko clem-vangelis (n=vangelis@AOrleans-152-1-4-71.w90-20.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 14:50.26 | SpeedEvil | noidd: he was. |
| 14:50.28 | *** join/#openmoko disguy__160148 (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-1cf00d9d41b3618a) |
| 14:50.53 | SpeedEvil | It sounds like P0 - in a few days will have a working phone, but little more. |
| 14:51.24 | SpeedEvil | The state come P1 time - in a month or so should be much better, it's going to be a hell of a long way from finished though. |
| 14:51.40 | SpeedEvil | Probably not usable if you just want a device. |
| 14:52.32 | stefan_schmidt | That's why user launch is september. |
| 14:52.46 | SpeedEvil | Yep. |
| 14:53.39 | LarstiQ | but I expect most of us here should be able to cope just fine |
| 14:55.41 | sixfeet | us?? europa is the market ;) |
| 14:58.20 | *** join/#openmoko christoph_ (n=christop@p57B0322F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 14:59.24 | koen | buz: "Tap and drag is already used for lassooing items." |
| 14:59.40 | buz | wtf would one lasso items in a calendar |
| 14:59.46 | koen | buz: that sounds like "we have broken behaviour because we have broken behaviour" |
| 15:00.05 | hrw | koen: I was able to add new events in dates without problems. does openmoko-dates is so different? |
| 15:00.14 | koen | hrw: it is :( |
| 15:00.18 | buz | unintuitive behavior leads to even more unintuitive behavior |
| 15:01.00 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03werner * r1182 10/developers/werner/openocd-link-static.patch: Link everything statically, for better binary compatibility. |
| 15:01.13 | *** join/#openmoko disguy__160148 (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-18bbc59ea11c9251) |
| 15:03.44 | koen | buz: I've added another comment to #222 |
| 15:03.52 | buz | so did i |
| 15:05.09 | koen | "Lassoing? It's highly unlikely people would need to lasso items. This seems like |
| 15:05.09 | koen | a case of unintuitive behavior leads to even more unintuitive behavior. |
| 15:05.09 | koen | Is the design spec for openmoko-dates available somewhere? It seems someone |
| 15:05.09 | koen | completely unfamiliar with a touchscreen implemented openmoko-dates." |
| 15:05.53 | buz | i agree |
| 15:06.03 | buz | i have used a touchscreen phones for 3 year now |
| 15:06.06 | koen | the regular dates app rocks |
| 15:06.17 | buz | it NEVER occured to me that one would want to lasso stuff |
| 15:06.24 | koen | but regular dates is created for a zaurus clamshell |
| 15:06.44 | koen | or rather "something with buttons" |
| 15:06.53 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03laforge * r1183 10/trunk/oe/packages/openocd/ (openocd_130.bb openocd_svn.bb): build a statically linked version |
| 15:06.54 | koen | it works quite ok on the nokia tables |
| 15:07.28 | koen | tablets* |
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| 15:17.26 | *** join/#openmoko clem-vangelis (n=vangelis@AOrleans-152-1-76-67.w90-21.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 15:19.06 | *** join/#openmoko disguy__160148 (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-8d3c274dd4f70b69) |
| 15:20.01 | *** join/#openmoko t0nY (n=nengyu@61-230-75-67.dynamic.hinet.net) |
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| 15:25.51 | *** join/#openmoko ninHer (n=ninHer@unaffiliated/ninher) |
| 15:26.34 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03laforge * r1184 10/trunk/oe/packages/ (dfu-util/ openocd/openocd_130.bb): bitbake wants 'rev' not 'revision' |
| 15:26.54 | ninHer | hi all |
| 15:27.44 | aloril | hi ninHer |
| 15:27.56 | ninHer | hi aloril |
| 15:30.19 | *** join/#openmoko dottedmag (i=bur@ccfit.nsu.ru) |
| 15:30.42 | mako | aloril: it's actually the same openmoko in the pictures .. i am keeping my phones at olpc because cjb and others who are interested in them are there |
| 15:32.09 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03werner * r1185 10/trunk/src/host/devirginator/ (Makefile README config.example crc32.pl): |
| 15:32.09 | CIA-7 | openmoko: Makefile: updated "devirginate" dependencies. |
| 15:32.09 | CIA-7 | openmoko: README: added run-time requisites for setup and installation. |
| 15:32.09 | CIA-7 | openmoko: README: added partial description of setup. |
| 15:32.09 | CIA-7 | openmoko: config.example: removed variable "MODULES" (for kernel modules). |
| 15:32.11 | CIA-7 | openmoko: crc32.pl: fixed 64 bit compatibility |
| 15:33.27 | *** join/#openmoko disguy__160148 (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-dc5a6526bcf68661) |
| 15:33.54 | aloril | mako: how readable is 80x25 text? (I guess it should be quite good?) |
| 15:33.56 | *** join/#openmoko bipolar (n=bflong@146.145.26.91) |
| 15:34.45 | aloril | comparing http://www.mobile-review.com/pda/review/htc-vox-en.shtml to Neo1973 I feel that Neo1973 offers at least twice more for half price (including P1 device which will come bundled only with few apps) |
| 15:36.39 | *** join/#openmoko dottedmag (i=bur@ccfit.nsu.ru) |
| 15:39.25 | *** join/#openmoko disguy__160148 (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-994b9043028f9fc7) |
| 15:39.42 | CM | Totally off topic and clearly useless, but cool none the less: Amiga Workbench in js och dhtml: http://www.chiptune.com/ |
| 15:40.07 | SpeedEvil | aloril: if your display is 100dpi, then put up a 640*480 window, and back off till you can't read it easily. |
| 15:40.14 | SpeedEvil | Then divide by three. |
| 15:41.21 | aloril | SpeedEvil: yeah, duh, I proposed that myself in past ;-) |
| 15:41.38 | SpeedEvil | Oh :) |
| 15:42.16 | CM | Just get some binoculars and use them backwards ;) |
| 15:42.34 | buz | totally offtopic: but where can i get a cheap low power board with 4sata and lan??? |
| 15:43.10 | CM | buz: How low power? I've been thinking about something like that too |
| 15:43.25 | buz | think no more than 10W |
| 15:43.29 | buz | the less the better |
| 15:43.53 | buz | if via wasnt that stupid i'd simply go mini itx but alas those idiots rather add 2 pata ports than 4 sata |
| 15:44.02 | *** join/#openmoko disguy__160148 (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-939045e7aa5efe54) |
| 15:44.35 | buz | and 4port pci sata controller costs more than a cheap AMD board |
| 15:45.25 | CM | I was surfing on some nice board.. I'll try to find it again |
| 15:45.25 | aloril | should be quite OK I think (actually I proposed to backoff until it fills same size as 2.8" screen at 20cm distance) |
| 15:45.26 | buz | the thing in the apple tv would be perfect if it had sata (we dont know yet) |
| 15:45.34 | buz | 5W pentium m plus gf7400 |
| 15:46.34 | mako | aloril: on which one? |
| 15:47.16 | aloril | -> seems quite readable |
| 15:47.42 | aloril | mako: Neo1973 (though I guess you don't get landscape orientation with current software ;-) |
| 15:48.00 | mako | aloril: well, depends on if you've started x |
| 15:48.29 | mako | but yes, it's a very high resolutio display.. more than enough to do a full screen of text if you're up close |
| 15:48.43 | CM | buz: Was thinking of this one: http://www.itox.com/pages/products/mothers/revcontrol/g5c100-n-g.php |
| 15:48.50 | mako | quite like the olpc xo in that respect as well |
| 15:48.51 | aloril | mako: about 2000 characters in screen is easily readable I guess |
| 15:48.54 | CM | buz: But unfortunately only 2 sata |
| 15:49.07 | buz | intel sucks too much power |
| 15:49.15 | buz | and ULV chips are hideously expensive |
| 15:49.28 | buz | its gotta be either VIA C* or arm |
| 15:49.34 | buz | tho i'd prefer via |
| 15:49.38 | CM | ok |
| 15:50.32 | buz | if its via, i can simply slap ubuntu on it |
| 15:50.54 | CM | But that G5C100-N-G with a ULV U1500 would be sweet :) |
| 15:51.13 | aloril | mako: I was just wondering if I could assume that what could be done in past using VGA monitor can be done with Neo1973 too and you can also see it (ie.. not too small pixels ;-) |
| 15:51.21 | SpeedEvil | Yes. |
| 15:51.25 | SpeedEvil | If you hold it at 20cm. |
| 15:51.33 | SpeedEvil | And can focus on it at that range. |
| 15:52.03 | *** join/#openmoko disguy__160148 (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-327495542c8c97f9) |
| 15:52.05 | aloril | but I think you can see 0.09mm pixels but not much smaller |
| 15:52.29 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03laforge * r1186 10/trunk/src/host/dfu-util/src/main.c: |
| 15:52.29 | CIA-7 | openmoko: * only print error message if usb_reset() returns error != -ENODEV, since that seems to be |
| 15:52.29 | CIA-7 | openmoko: somewhat standard ?!? |
| 15:53.06 | aloril | so.. 1280x960 resolution on same physical size would probably still be same as VGA: same amount of things to see, except a bit more clear |
| 15:53.26 | *** join/#openmoko _rob (n=rob@ACB319BE.ipt.aol.com) |
| 15:53.32 | aloril | ie.. you can't have 4x more text and except to see it much better than on VGA |
| 15:53.51 | SpeedEvil | yeah. |
| 15:53.56 | SpeedEvil | You get a _little_ better. |
| 15:54.11 | SpeedEvil | As 14*10 fonts are much more visible than 7*5 |
| 15:54.18 | SpeedEvil | Well - slightly. |
| 15:55.28 | *** join/#openmoko behdad (n=behdad@63.250.163.171) |
| 15:55.39 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03werner * r1187 10/trunk/src/host/devirginator/ (README setup.sh): |
| 15:55.39 | CIA-7 | openmoko: setup.sh: added test for possibly missing "external" executables |
| 15:55.39 | CIA-7 | openmoko: README: more setup description |
| 15:55.46 | *** join/#openmoko SirCrow (n=sircrow@sd511685b.adsl.wanadoo.nl) |
| 15:56.17 | PBeck | hi |
| 15:57.12 | *** join/#openmoko disguy__160148 (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-500ea179326f3670) |
| 15:58.20 | fluffs | careful to keep the drool away from the device |
| 16:00.36 | *** join/#openmoko suspence (n=spencer@208.187.196.34) |
| 16:01.23 | aloril | fluffs: not a problem, unfortunately |
| 16:02.08 | mjr | hmm, supersonic drool... |
| 16:04.02 | *** join/#openmoko disguy__160148 (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-5ad68fbb837cab84) |
| 16:11.00 | aloril | hmm.. consider this: Neo1973 will be released on September, so we get it 0.5 year ahead ;-) |
| 16:11.17 | aloril | what other company allows anybody to buy product 0.5 year ahead of its actual release? |
| 16:11.33 | dottedmag | aloril: many software companies release betas :) |
| 16:12.22 | *** join/#openmoko disguy__160148 (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-16d28752a9fd9adc) |
| 16:12.23 | aloril | dottedmag: haha |
| 16:15.11 | buz | CM: http://www.ewayco.com has some really cheap embedded boards |
| 16:16.05 | *** join/#openmoko prpplague (n=dave@mail.americanmicrosystems.com) |
| 16:16.46 | buz | but no sata :( |
| 16:16.47 | *** join/#openmoko clem-vangelis (n=vangelis@AOrleans-152-1-76-67.w90-21.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 16:17.09 | *** join/#openmoko disguy__160148 (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-06f5485466cb769a) |
| 16:20.42 | koen | can we agree that anything having an x86 cpu disqualifies as 'embedded'? |
| 16:21.03 | prpplague | koen: don't think you'll get everyone to agree on that |
| 16:21.08 | *** join/#openmoko tango (i=naz@unyew.silverninja.net) |
| 16:21.26 | koen | prpplague: agreed, but I can try :) |
| 16:21.34 | SpeedEvil | koen: no. |
| 16:21.38 | SpeedEvil | Absolutely not. |
| 16:21.40 | prpplague | koen: hehe |
| 16:21.47 | SpeedEvil | My garmin GPS12 has a 386 |
| 16:22.57 | *** join/#openmoko MDK (n=mdk@cs181209253.pp.htv.fi) |
| 16:23.50 | koen | my printer an i486 |
| 16:24.36 | koen | but slapping a mini-itx board in a case and going EMBEDDED!!!!!!! is a stretch |
| 16:24.40 | *** join/#openmoko disguy__160148 (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-c8ee4da66c3a2677) |
| 16:25.00 | buz | well i'm happy to take pointer to true embedded boards with 4 sata ;) |
| 16:25.02 | SpeedEvil | IMO, not. Can the user use it as a PC. |
| 16:25.12 | *** join/#openmoko dottedmag (i=bur@ccfit.nsu.ru) |
| 16:27.53 | *** join/#openmoko TimRiker (n=timr@216.49.181.128) |
| 16:28.12 | buz | http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS8859436106.html |
| 16:29.18 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@195.159.97.196) |
| 16:30.35 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03laforge * r1188 10/trunk/src/host/dfu-util/src/main.c: print interface info once we have selected the one that we actually want to flash |
| 16:31.17 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03laforge * r1189 10/trunk/src/host/dfu-util/src/sam7dfu.c: |
| 16:31.17 | CIA-7 | openmoko: * correctly call dfu_download with NULL data buffer at the end |
| 16:31.17 | CIA-7 | openmoko: * add scaled progress bar instead of hash printing |
| 16:32.02 | *** join/#openmoko disguy__160148 (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-5731ee52c1263c3c) |
| 16:33.02 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03laforge * r1190 10/trunk/src/host/dfu-util/src/sam7dfu.c: fprintf typo |
| 16:35.17 | *** join/#openmoko disguy__160148 (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-b9620032b3ba1622) |
| 16:37.08 | aevin | so, what's the latest openmoko news? :-) |
| 16:40.49 | *** join/#openmoko mschuoi (n=typn@unaffiliated/chairuou) |
| 16:41.10 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03laforge * r1191 10/trunk/src/host/dfu-util/src/Makefile.am: add build rule for dfu-util_static |
| 16:41.21 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03laforge * r1192 10/trunk/src/host/dfu-util/autogen.sh: use autoreconf |
| 16:44.18 | *** join/#openmoko Seeker` (n=cjo20@ip-62-105-182-26.dsl.twang.net) |
| 16:45.50 | *** join/#openmoko disguy__160148 (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-f75e87d033d5059f) |
| 16:46.56 | bipolar | Does anyone know if the syncml work is already done for openmoko? |
| 16:49.33 | *** join/#openmoko disguy__160148 (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-cd7b7169481eef5f) |
| 16:50.08 | *** join/#openmoko MoRpHeUz (n=morphbr@200.184.118.132) |
| 16:52.17 | buz | theres a funambol guy on the mailinglist |
| 16:52.24 | buz | might want to ask there |
| 16:52.48 | *** join/#openmoko k-s (n=gustavo@200.184.118.132) |
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| 17:03.23 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03werner * r1193 10/trunk/src/target/u-boot/patches/boot-menu.patch: |
| 17:03.23 | CIA-7 | openmoko: u-boot/common/console.c, include/console.h, board/neo1973/bootmenu.c: |
| 17:03.24 | CIA-7 | openmoko: console_poll_hook now has an argument indicating console activity |
| 17:03.24 | CIA-7 | openmoko: board/neo1973/bootmenu.c (bootmenu_hook): reset the timeout on console activity |
| 17:03.24 | CIA-7 | openmoko: and if executing a command |
| 17:03.53 | *** join/#openmoko koen_ (n=koen@dominion.kabel.utwente.nl) |
| 17:04.40 | SpeedEvil | Interesting - 24 dls of the google video, 56 of the rapidshare one. |
| 17:04.47 | SpeedEvil | (of the talk). |
| 17:06.11 | ynezz | talk about what? |
| 17:06.11 | jzs | funny you mentioned it SpeedEvil. I just watched it 5 minutes ago |
| 17:06.58 | vmaster | ynezz: openmoko talk at fosdem |
| 17:07.26 | ynezz | ah, link pls :) |
| 17:07.30 | *** join/#openmoko MoRpHeUz (n=morphbr@200.184.118.132) |
| 17:08.15 | vmaster | http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-3742589179435830945&q=openmoko+fosdem |
| 17:08.33 | ynezz | thanks |
| 17:08.58 | SpeedEvil | the rapidshare one is _much_ better. |
| 17:09.10 | *** join/#openmoko pH5 (n=ph5@e178224252.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 17:09.11 | SpeedEvil | http://rapidshare.com/files/18781887/rect.avi |
| 17:09.11 | jebba | openmoko/qemu-r1190 uploaded |
| 17:09.15 | SpeedEvil | as you can actually rtead much of the text |
| 17:09.31 | SpeedEvil | Same size, but no seeking of course. |
| 17:09.35 | ynezz | ok |
| 17:09.44 | koen_ | the pdf is online, so google vid + pdf would be the optimal solution |
| 17:09.55 | koen_ | http://www.openembedded.org/~koen/openmoko/OpenMoko_Neologics.pdf |
| 17:10.18 | SpeedEvil | Well, the rapidshare one is actually much better quality just to watch. |
| 17:10.31 | ynezz | SpeedEvil: hm, i can't wget that link |
| 17:10.37 | SpeedEvil | no, you can't. |
| 17:10.42 | SpeedEvil | rapidshare is annoying. |
| 17:11.03 | dottedmag | ynezz: http://ia311529.us.archive.org/0/items/OpenMoko_speech_FOSDEM2007_video/SNV38175.AVI |
| 17:11.16 | SpeedEvil | That's the 350M version. |
| 17:11.18 | ynezz | thanks |
| 17:11.20 | dottedmag | ah, yes |
| 17:11.46 | ynezz | thats smaller or bigger? |
| 17:12.00 | SpeedEvil | the rapidshare one is 66M |
| 17:12.11 | SpeedEvil | and the 350M version is not actually more readable. |
| 17:12.12 | ynezz | ok |
| 17:12.55 | SpeedEvil | The google one is very poor quality. |
| 17:13.19 | SpeedEvil | True. |
| 17:13.46 | *** join/#openmoko disguy__160148 (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-99f5b3f004e2a126) |
| 17:17.01 | sixfeet | lool ein tor |
| 17:23.20 | *** join/#openmoko dottedmag (i=bur@ccfit.nsu.ru) |
| 17:23.50 | denis^da | LuitvD, did you gut reply untill now ? :> |
| 17:24.46 | LuitvD | denis^da: nope |
| 17:29.04 | *** join/#openmoko disguy__160148 (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-92950de6ace536dc) |
| 17:30.56 | *** part/#openmoko |Lupin| (n=seb@zen.loria.fr) |
| 17:33.19 | *** join/#openmoko clem-vangelis (n=vangelis@AOrleans-152-1-91-53.w90-21.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 17:34.21 | *** join/#openmoko disguy__160148 (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-9243f34150347842) |
| 17:35.00 | sannes | counter |
| 17:35.00 | aloril | P0: 2 days 18:24:59 (2.767 +-2.0 days); P1: 24.767 +-10.0 (see faq) (438) |
| 17:41.57 | *** part/#openmoko dirakx (n=pilar@69.79.145.81) |
| 17:43.27 | *** join/#openmoko f00bs (n=ryan@rrcs-24-227-247-12.sw.biz.rr.com) |
| 17:44.10 | *** join/#openmoko jackey (n=jackey@CPE0016b6230168-CM0014e827107e.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 17:44.11 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03laforge * r1194 10/trunk/src/target/kernel/patches/gta01-pcf50606.patch: * leave DEBUG enabled but make it a bit less verbose |
| 17:45.51 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03laforge * r1195 10/trunk/oe/packages/xserver-kdrive-common/xserver-nodm-init/xserver-nodm: * make sure X11 always starts even after unclean shutdown |
| 17:46.06 | XorA|gone | LaF0rge: YAY |
| 17:46.59 | *** join/#openmoko loufoque (n=loufoque@smj33-1-82-233-64-48.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 17:48.25 | *** join/#openmoko rejo1 (n=rejon@adsl-75-5-124-98.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net) |
| 17:48.27 | hrw | LaF0rge: fosdem bug will not return ;) |
| 17:48.42 | *** part/#openmoko rejo1 (n=rejon@adsl-75-5-124-98.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net) |
| 17:49.08 | *** join/#openmoko disguy__160148 (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-75a00c35577d5c5e) |
| 17:49.23 | koen | I don't think that's mergeable into OE |
| 17:49.29 | *** join/#openmoko ecraven (i=nex@eutyche.swe.uni-linz.ac.at) |
| 17:49.32 | koen | <PROTECTED> |
| 17:49.33 | koen | <PROTECTED> |
| 17:49.33 | koen | <PROTECTED> |
| 17:50.00 | guaqua | anyone tried the qemu openmoko stuff? |
| 17:50.06 | koen | sounds like you just need to put /tmp in tmpfs and it will work after an unclean shutdown |
| 17:50.28 | koen | XorA|gone: they don't, debian cleans /tmp on boot |
| 17:51.05 | guaqua | debian also boots notoriously slowly |
| 17:51.18 | Lumpio- | Meh |
| 17:51.22 | hrw | 18:51 hrw@home:~$ grep lock /etc/init.d/*|grep X |
| 17:51.22 | hrw | /etc/init.d/bootclean: rm -f .X*-lock |
| 17:51.32 | Lumpio- | I can't decide whether to buy an OpenMoko phone or not |
| 17:51.41 | Lumpio- | The FICwhatever seems like the best alternative out of all phones on the market but... |
| 17:52.43 | SpeedEvil | It's not on the market... |
| 17:52.45 | SpeedEvil | yet. |
| 17:52.55 | Lumpio- | It was just a figure of speech -_- |
| 17:53.28 | Lumpio- | I'm still using my ancient N-Gage. Works well enough for IRC and web and stuff. Emulators too. |
| 17:54.42 | Lumpio- | But having something more... modern would be nice. |
| 17:54.55 | *** join/#openmoko ntnp_ (n=ntnp@63.187.103-84.rev.gaoland.net) |
| 17:56.04 | buz | if you want to run game emulators the neo might not be terribly useful to you |
| 17:56.21 | buz | the absence of any real buttons doesnt seem particularly nice for gaming |
| 17:58.00 | *** join/#openmoko disguy__160148 (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-c424ac31bcbb2170) |
| 17:58.01 | *** join/#openmoko zween (n=zween@80-47-43-169.lond-hex.dynamic.dial.as9105.com) |
| 17:58.07 | buz | are there any bluetooth gamepad? |
| 17:58.25 | SpeedEvil | There are bluetooth mice. |
| 17:58.35 | vmaster | Nintendo's WIImote uses bluetooth |
| 17:58.42 | vmaster | iirc |
| 17:58.52 | xkr47 | that would look funny |
| 17:59.17 | xkr47 | one hand holding a openmoko, with the user trying to see what the screen reads, then other hand swinging wildly a wiimote :D |
| 17:59.26 | buz | LOL |
| 18:00.09 | SpeedEvil | 'No, I diddn't mean to kill him officer, I was just playing Doom'. |
| 18:00.16 | k-y | vmaster: it's IR isnt it? |
| 18:00.27 | xkr47 | baseballmote |
| 18:00.32 | SpeedEvil | No. |
| 18:00.41 | SpeedEvil | It has IR camera, to pick up IR LEDs |
| 18:00.44 | mjr | the freedom mini seems somewhat compelling to me... http://msmobiles.com/news.php/4989.html |
| 18:00.50 | SpeedEvil | to desaturate the gryoscopes. |
| 18:01.00 | mjr | (no, not a game controoler, though it does sport arrow keys arranged funnily ;) |
| 18:01.03 | SpeedEvil | accellerometers. |
| 18:02.20 | mjr | 'course, there's the thing that even a mini-keyboard really requires that you have something to put the Neo against while using it, for effective use... |
| 18:02.21 | DesktopMa | wiimote is fine for gamepad :) |
| 18:02.24 | DesktopMa | just turn it sideways |
| 18:04.37 | mjr | 'course, there's frogpad, which claims one-handed use... maybe that could be a skill to learn |
| 18:05.21 | Stephmw | hmm |
| 18:05.30 | Stephmw | one-handed, not two-thumbed |
| 18:05.41 | mjr | oh wait |
| 18:05.48 | mjr | "Offers exceptional portability when in use because it can be held in one hand and operated with the other" |
| 18:05.51 | mjr | pfft |
| 18:06.00 | mjr | I _was_ wondering how practical that would really be with one hand |
| 18:06.03 | DesktopMa | how is that one handed :D |
| 18:06.04 | Stephmw | :D |
| 18:06.14 | Stephmw | they see it one-handed on a desk |
| 18:06.27 | Stephmw | ... hell, my 104-key fullsize keyboard can be used one-handed! |
| 18:06.30 | *** join/#openmoko jfm3 (n=user@165.230.132.126) |
| 18:06.58 | Stephmw | DesktopMa: http://www.frogpad.com/Images/FrogPadEasyBrilliant_260pix.gif |
| 18:07.10 | DesktopMa | lol! |
| 18:08.05 | *** part/#openmoko jfm3 (n=user@165.230.132.126) |
| 18:08.58 | *** join/#openmoko greghunt (n=greg@88-108-12-5.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com) |
| 18:09.58 | buz | how much does that freedom thingy cost |
| 18:10.15 | *** join/#openmoko disguy__160148 (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-2953b0ccf35786d8) |
| 18:10.30 | jackey | buz: $350 |
| 18:10.40 | buz | for real? |
| 18:10.45 | jackey | i have not figure out where I can get one for this |
| 18:11.00 | jackey | it is on openmoko wiki's FAQ |
| 18:11.16 | jackey | the description is not very clear |
| 18:11.32 | buz | uhm i'm not refering to neo, really |
| 18:11.35 | jackey | i am not sure if i can use it for making/receiving call |
| 18:11.36 | buz | more to the freedom keyboard |
| 18:11.42 | buz | that cant possibly cost 350$ |
| 18:12.04 | buz | http://www.freedominput.com/site/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=13&Itemid=30 one might be able to attach that somehow to neo |
| 18:13.16 | buz | i dont like razresque keys very much |
| 18:13.34 | jackey | come neo screen is too small |
| 18:13.40 | *** join/#openmoko disguy__160148 (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-98913877904f268e) |
| 18:13.58 | jackey | keyboard for neo does not make sense to me at all |
| 18:14.53 | jackey | i was in a congress, there is an laser keyboard available in market |
| 18:14.56 | jackey | pretty cool |
| 18:15.02 | buz | and mostly useless |
| 18:15.06 | DesktopMa | makes perfect sense to me |
| 18:15.13 | DesktopMa | 2 hr busride + msn |
| 18:15.14 | DesktopMa | :P |
| 18:15.35 | jackey | for what? |
| 18:16.24 | *** join/#openmoko greentux (n=lemke@195.227.105.180) |
| 18:16.27 | buz | irc on train |
| 18:16.31 | jackey | FIC tried hard on neo |
| 18:16.49 | jackey | but i do not think neo will be 100% open source |
| 18:16.59 | buz | if you dont use the gps, it is |
| 18:17.03 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03laforge * r1196 10/trunk/oe/packages/ (32 files in 11 dirs): |
| 18:17.03 | CIA-7 | openmoko: we just want to have our own inittab, but apparently need to fork the whole |
| 18:17.03 | CIA-7 | openmoko: sysvinit package. time for mainline OE merge ;) |
| 18:17.31 | buz | (and i'm still hoping hammerhead gets replaced for p1+) |
| 18:18.18 | SpeedEvil | <PROTECTED> |
| 18:18.34 | *** join/#openmoko disguy__160148 (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-c1e76e00bbf2ab1c) |
| 18:18.36 | SpeedEvil | It's not going to be that hard to reverse engineer. |
| 18:18.39 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03laforge * r1197 10/trunk/oe/packages/dfu-util/dfu-util-native_svn.bb: copy+paste mistake |
| 18:19.03 | buz | because there is http://www.wifinetnews.com/archives/007315.html |
| 18:19.03 | jebba | buz, if you don't use GPS or GSM it is, you mean... ;) |
| 18:19.12 | jackey | come on, buz do not do that. U can send to me |
| 18:19.20 | jackey | like to take a look the real thing |
| 18:19.31 | buz | ?!?!? |
| 18:19.47 | SpeedEvil | 'the company wants to' != shipping product. |
| 18:20.11 | SpeedEvil | hammerhead is shipping. |
| 18:20.11 | buz | read it again |
| 18:20.14 | DesktopMa | it's not like most people need to do low level hammerhead |
| 18:20.20 | buz | wants to seems to refer to keeping market share |
| 18:20.23 | buz | not developing a chip |
| 18:20.45 | buz | or maybe it does it wants to develop it http://www.engadget.com/2007/01/16/britains-csr-developing-uber-sensitive-bluetooth-gps-hybrid-c/ |
| 18:21.05 | SpeedEvil | Look after that. |
| 18:21.10 | SpeedEvil | It's all future tense. |
| 18:21.38 | buz | "Already being hit up by a few anonymous mobile producers, CSR plans to get these things shipping "during the first half of this year," |
| 18:21.38 | jackey | check on www.sandbridgetech.com |
| 18:21.46 | jackey | software base band |
| 18:22.07 | SpeedEvil | plans != shipping product. |
| 18:22.25 | SpeedEvil | Show me the chips. |
| 18:22.26 | buz | i dont have a f***** clue what sandbridge tries to tell me on that page |
| 18:22.53 | buz | wtf is a sandblaster core |
| 18:23.01 | DesktopMa | dunno but sounds awesome |
| 18:23.03 | buz | is that something that will destroy kids sandcastles at the beach? |
| 18:23.46 | SpeedEvil | Software radios are cool. But at the moment, more expensive and power hungry than application specific chips. |
| 18:23.47 | jackey | buz: like i said. I had a sandbridgetech development board like mainstone (huge) |
| 18:24.06 | jackey | i like to take a look on neo, but do not know how to get one. |
| 18:24.14 | buz | thats because it doesnt ship yet |
| 18:24.16 | *** part/#openmoko MoRpHeUz (n=morphbr@200.184.118.132) |
| 18:24.17 | CM | counter |
| 18:24.17 | aloril | P0: 2 days 17:35:42 (2.733 +-2.0 days); P1: 24.733 +-10.0 (see faq) (439) |
| 18:24.28 | CM | P1 = anyone can order a Neo |
| 18:24.30 | jackey | Samsung Evil Plan (confidential) |
| 18:24.55 | jackey | any return policy |
| 18:24.55 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03laforge * r1198 10/trunk/oe/packages/openocd/ (4 files in 2 dirs): use -static instead of -Bstatic (in local copy of patch) |
| 18:25.18 | SpeedEvil | warranty. |
| 18:25.20 | CM | Highly doubt that, it's only $350 anyway |
| 18:25.31 | SpeedEvil | And presumably the standard EU 7 day return thing. |
| 18:25.36 | SpeedEvil | Distance selling regs. |
| 18:25.44 | SpeedEvil | But that's only if you don't use it. |
| 18:26.18 | jackey | will this including JTAG for debugging? |
| 18:26.28 | buz | you can get jtag |
| 18:26.29 | jackey | saw extra $200 for development board |
| 18:26.36 | buz | yeah |
| 18:26.43 | SpeedEvil | You shouldn't need JTAG. |
| 18:26.44 | jackey | total will be $550 right? |
| 18:26.52 | buz | most wont ever need jtag |
| 18:26.52 | SpeedEvil | Unless you're developing uboot |
| 18:27.14 | jackey | haha, unless you mess up with blob, u do need that then |
| 18:27.16 | vmaster | or if you were otherwise clever enough to ruin the bootloader |
| 18:27.31 | buz | uhm there is no blob |
| 18:27.36 | SpeedEvil | u-boot supports booting an image from RAM. |
| 18:27.38 | jackey | my engineers did that couple times in lab |
| 18:28.01 | buz | u-boot can even boot from sd |
| 18:28.01 | SpeedEvil | So you never need to flash a non-tested image. |
| 18:28.05 | SpeedEvil | yeah. |
| 18:28.17 | buz | so if your image is broken, you can still boot from sd |
| 18:28.21 | jackey | i had lots of questions, if you do not mind |
| 18:28.34 | buz | unless if you're clever enough to flash u-boot AND the image at the same time |
| 18:28.41 | vmaster | heh, just because it's possible to test new images without flashing doesn't mean that people aren't going to try |
| 18:28.45 | jackey | Neo's filesystem is on SD or DOM ? |
| 18:28.48 | SpeedEvil | It's probaly worth reading the FAQ page on the wiki. |
| 18:28.58 | SpeedEvil | the SD is user replaceael |
| 18:29.08 | SpeedEvil | all of the base software fits on the NANAD |
| 18:29.10 | SpeedEvil | NAND |
| 18:29.13 | jackey | I knew that you can use SD for running a demo, but possible flash on to DOM? |
| 18:29.17 | SpeedEvil | which is 64M. |
| 18:29.23 | SpeedEvil | DOM? |
| 18:29.29 | buz | NAND is not strictly DOM |
| 18:29.35 | loufoque | can you boot from the SD? |
| 18:29.45 | buz | says so in the u-boot docs |
| 18:29.49 | jackey | no, boot application from SD |
| 18:29.59 | SpeedEvil | you can run programs from SD. |
| 18:30.03 | buz | you dont boot applications |
| 18:30.04 | jackey | that is what i mean |
| 18:30.11 | jackey | sorry about my poor english |
| 18:30.11 | buz | sure |
| 18:30.12 | nbd | wow, 64M is a lot of space |
| 18:30.14 | buz | this is linux, why not |
| 18:30.17 | nbd | i bet you can throw in lots of apps there |
| 18:30.24 | loufoque | well, of course you can run applications from SD. |
| 18:30.35 | SpeedEvil | If you put the core apps on the SD, it means you can't change it. |
| 18:30.39 | buz | (in 2.6.20 you can even yank out the running kernel and replace it on the fly, iirc) |
| 18:30.44 | jackey | nbd, you are right. Such as fat Qtopia |
| 18:30.46 | SpeedEvil | Or at least it's much more difficult to change. |
| 18:30.54 | buz | of course most will never change sd |
| 18:30.58 | buz | microsd is a pain to handle |
| 18:31.02 | SpeedEvil | Yeah. |
| 18:31.10 | SpeedEvil | Or upgrade size of SD. |
| 18:31.16 | buz | yeah i really hope for that |
| 18:31.26 | *** join/#openmoko Zoolooc (n=Zoolooc@p54953576.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 18:31.27 | jackey | when will neo support MMC |
| 18:31.33 | SpeedEvil | 5-stage process to access the SD isn't promising. |
| 18:31.42 | buz | externally accesible |
| 18:31.44 | SpeedEvil | jackey: never - the first version. |
| 18:31.44 | koen | jackey: about a year ago |
| 18:31.57 | buz | if you manage to cram mmc into microsd slot, immediately |
| 18:32.11 | SpeedEvil | (turn off, open back, remove sim, remove SD) |
| 18:32.12 | koen | micro-mmc? |
| 18:32.22 | buz | i think there's mmcmobile |
| 18:32.27 | buz | but i have no idea what size that one has |
| 18:32.30 | SpeedEvil | they are different sizes though. |
| 18:32.46 | jackey | hehe, SIM card has a revolution on MMC channel |
| 18:33.07 | jackey | high speed coumminication implementation via MMC |
| 18:33.34 | buz | i like the usb sim better |
| 18:33.50 | SpeedEvil | I want the microSD vapourware to emerge. |
| 18:33.50 | jackey | no good for operators like China Telcom |
| 18:33.52 | koen | didn't sandisk block sim-mmc? |
| 18:33.55 | SpeedEvil | The non-contact one. |
| 18:33.56 | jackey | or China Mobile |
| 18:34.30 | buz | rf microsd? |
| 18:34.37 | loufoque | what's not good for China Mobile? |
| 18:34.37 | buz | thats gonna work really well |
| 18:34.40 | jackey | buz: no |
| 18:34.41 | buz | very power preserving |
| 18:35.00 | *** join/#openmoko Psi_ (n=benw@ip-58-28-158-238.ubs-dsl.xnet.co.nz) |
| 18:35.14 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03laforge * r1199 10/trunk/oe/packages/linux/gta01-kernel_2.6.bb: we want 2.6.20.1 by default |
| 18:35.19 | jackey | next genernation SIM will have a ARM CPU + 512M |
| 18:35.34 | SpeedEvil | It's supposed to be couple of centimetre range, with a few tens of K/second. |
| 18:35.45 | buz | sounds terribly useless to me |
| 18:36.21 | jackey | buz: haha, told u evil plan by SxxxG |
| 18:36.39 | buz | whats evil about improving sim |
| 18:36.50 | buz | i'd very much welcome sims based on a sane protocol |
| 18:37.08 | jackey | China Mobile lost control of mobile vendors in china, the only way to turn over is using those kind of SIM card |
| 18:37.55 | buz | the whole reason gsm took off in the first place was the sim idea |
| 18:38.25 | jackey | will FIC release neo hardware principle chart in the future? |
| 18:42.32 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03laforge * r1200 10/trunk/oe/packages/openocd/openocd_130.bb: fix openocd build |
| 18:43.15 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03laforge * r1201 10/trunk/oe/packages/openocd/openocd_130.bb: -EOPEN |
| 18:43.42 | noidd | damn, Glad I'm an arms dealer then. |
| 18:45.16 | *** join/#openmoko buz (n=buz@80-218-148-33.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
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| 18:48.12 | *** join/#openmoko Rac0r (n=Rac0r@p5081D53E.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 18:48.40 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03werner * r1202 10/trunk/src/host/devirginator/ (environment.in setup.sh): |
| 18:48.41 | CIA-7 | openmoko: environment.in: don't "saveenv" after changing the console to usbtty or serial |
| 18:48.41 | CIA-7 | openmoko: setup.sh: look for UIMAGE and ROOTFS with -r, not -f, so that one can use |
| 18:48.41 | CIA-7 | openmoko: /dev/null for stage 1 only setups |
| 18:49.52 | *** join/#openmoko zecke (n=ich@91.64.160.193) |
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| 18:53.24 | *** join/#openmoko Virtuall (n=virtuall@who.is.virtuall.info) |
| 18:56.09 | *** join/#openmoko woglinde (i=woglinde@e178077133.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 18:56.41 | *** join/#openmoko MacNorth (n=daijobu@70-59-58-234.hlrn.qwest.net) |
| 18:56.48 | woglinde | counter |
| 18:56.49 | aloril | P0: 2 days 17:03:11 (2.711 +-2.0 days); P1: 24.711 +-10.0 (see faq) (440) |
| 18:58.08 | *** join/#openmoko vmaster_ (i=vmaster@p5B07FC58.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 18:58.59 | Psi_ | hehe, someones probably noticed this before, but http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Look_%26_Feel |
| 18:59.11 | Psi_ | check out the picture for "Low Battery" |
| 19:05.48 | loufoque | Psi_: where is that picture? |
| 19:06.50 | loufoque | Warring? |
| 19:07.42 | *** join/#openmoko disguy__160148 (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-44b3cadf4b6efe40) |
| 19:12.07 | SpeedEvil | IIRC I commented on the talk page |
| 19:15.32 | Psi_ | loufoque, about half way down |
| 19:16.05 | Psi_ | i was just laughing at if the phones came with that spelling mistake for the word Please |
| 19:16.43 | koen | probably |
| 19:16.50 | koen | geeks are usually bad at spelling |
| 19:16.56 | loufoque | and shouldn't it be warning instead of warring? |
| 19:17.19 | Psi_ | hehe didnt notice that one |
| 19:17.32 | Psi_ | "Pelase recharge the battery" hehe |
| 19:18.17 | *** join/#openmoko greghunt (n=greg@88-108-12-5.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com) |
| 19:19.13 | *** join/#openmoko clem-vangelis (n=vangelis@AOrleans-152-1-104-81.w90-21.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 19:19.44 | Psi_ | its gunna be so cool that we can change all the messages like that to whatever we want |
| 19:20.04 | Psi_ | change "Battery Low" to "ZPM depleted" hehe |
| 19:20.29 | koen | ZPMs are overrated |
| 19:20.50 | Psi_ | could even put a picture of a ZPM flashing on/off |
| 19:20.51 | *** join/#openmoko apardo (n=apardo@87.217.144.4) |
| 19:20.54 | SpeedEvil | It needs to make the 'phaser on overload' noise when it's finished charging. |
| 19:21.00 | Psi_ | heh |
| 19:21.30 | SpeedEvil | I've wondered why paramount hasn't done a bluetooth combadge. |
| 19:21.37 | SpeedEvil | I mean, it's so obvious. |
| 19:22.17 | Psi_ | heh |
| 19:23.35 | prpplague | SpeedEvil: hehe, several homebrew electronics people have |
| 19:24.17 | *** join/#openmoko _buz (n=buz@80-218-148-33.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 19:25.07 | SpeedEvil | Oh I know, making a replica is trivial. |
| 19:25.31 | SpeedEvil | (assuming you simply gut an earpiece) |
| 19:25.58 | *** join/#openmoko theike01 (n=istuart@67-131-153-130.dia.static.qwest.net) |
| 19:27.00 | Psi_ | you would need to add a bigger battery and an amp, since its designed to fit in ya ear |
| 19:27.23 | Psi_ | wouldn't be loud enough otherwise |
| 19:28.36 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03laforge * r1203 10/trunk/src/target/kernel/patches/ (config-nr-tty-devices.patch series): |
| 19:28.36 | CIA-7 | openmoko: * decrease the number of VT devices to four, this gives a udev speedup. |
| 19:28.36 | CIA-7 | openmoko: Also, we won't use that many VT's anyway. It's a phone, after all |
| 19:28.38 | SpeedEvil | Well - there are bluetooth car adaptors that'd suit. |
| 19:29.23 | koen | robtaylor: check the commit above :) |
| 19:30.36 | Elrond | LaF0rge? |
| 19:30.47 | koen | aka Harald |
| 19:30.51 | woglinde | jupp |
| 19:31.03 | Elrond | koen - Yeah. I hope for him to awake here. ;) |
| 19:31.08 | Psi_ | yeah, car adaptors would be much better |
| 19:31.31 | Elrond | car adaptor for what? |
| 19:31.37 | Psi_ | i dont think i would be brave enough to walk around with a st combadge tho |
| 19:32.21 | *** join/#openmoko billstevenson (n=billstev@c-71-58-61-130.hsd1.pa.comcast.net) |
| 19:32.26 | Psi_ | Elrond, SpeedEvil was thinking ya could mod a bt adaptor to make a startrek combadge |
| 19:32.47 | cjb | Elrond: 'lo. |
| 19:32.53 | Elrond | cjb - Hi! |
| 19:33.26 | cjb | Elrond: so, I was wondering which port on the debug board v2 is serial once the debug cable is hooked up, and if I use a USB A<->A to hook that up. |
| 19:34.09 | Elrond | cjb - Huh... isn't that documented on the connecting debug board wiki page? |
| 19:34.20 | koen | cjb: aren't it a bunch of foo-> usb IC connected to a usb hub? |
| 19:34.21 | cjb | Elrond: Hi. I meant to ask how you're involved with the project, by the way -- it sounds like you have hardware? Or maybe you're just smart enough to have worked all this out from the diagrams. :) |
| 19:34.58 | cjb | Elrond: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Connecting_Neo1973_with_Debug_Board_v2 just tells me how to hook up the cable itself, which I've done. |
| 19:35.25 | Elrond | Ahh. |
| 19:35.42 | Elrond | The second A port is just "for nothing". ;) |
| 19:35.50 | koen | cjb: see the diagram on top of http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Debug_Board |
| 19:35.51 | Elrond | The serial console is within the jtag connector. |
| 19:36.05 | Elrond | See koen. I looked at the same pic. :) |
| 19:36.13 | cjb | ooh. and it's presented over the "uplink" USB B? |
| 19:36.22 | Elrond | cjb - Involvement: I've read all hardware pages on the wiki ;) |
| 19:36.32 | cjb | that's the part that was confusing me, 'cause I'd never seen a USB A<->A cable before. |
| 19:36.35 | koen | cjb: yes |
| 19:36.42 | cjb | awesome, that's easy. |
| 19:36.43 | koen | (on the uplink) |
| 19:36.47 | Elrond | cjb - Yes, presumably over the uplink as "usb-serial". |
| 19:36.55 | cjb | excellent. |
| 19:37.19 | cjb | sounds like I get to try putting a new kernel/jffs2 on in a few hours, then. |
| 19:37.23 | koen | you might need a kernel module on your host |
| 19:37.35 | cjb | yeah, that's all fine. |
| 19:38.03 | cjb | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:38.17 | Elrond | Yeah! |
| 19:38.33 | Elrond | Get minicom or tiny-whatever-com up and connect it to this! |
| 19:38.51 | cjb | yup. have $realwork to do first, though. |
| 19:39.04 | Elrond | Ahh. |
| 19:39.06 | *** part/#openmoko billstevenson (n=billstev@c-71-58-61-130.hsd1.pa.comcast.net) |
| 19:39.15 | koen | Elrond,cjb: I'd use usb-dfu for that |
| 19:39.19 | Elrond | cjb - the debug board is half a usb hub. :) |
| 19:39.31 | koen | much faster and shouldn't require the debug board |
| 19:39.31 | cjb | whst's usb-dfu? |
| 19:39.50 | Elrond | koen - For uploading kernel/rootfs? The svn has dfu-util for this. |
| 19:39.52 | koen | Device Firmware Upload |
| 19:40.02 | koen | Elrond: I know |
| 19:40.07 | cjb | ah, I see. |
| 19:40.21 | Elrond | But this only works, if you have a recent u-boot. |
| 19:40.37 | koen | ah, right |
| 19:40.45 | koen | so you might have to upload a new uboot |
| 19:41.03 | *** join/#openmoko hoepen (n=hoepen@thor.hrz.uni-oldenburg.de) |
| 19:42.48 | Elrond | Which either works by microSD or jtag ;o) |
| 19:42.57 | Elrond | ... or a running linux. ;) |
| 19:43.07 | koen | cjb: the debug board is only needed if you manage to mess up uboot or want to use jtag debugging with gdb |
| 19:43.29 | cjb | yup. well, I might need to update uboot. |
| 19:43.59 | koen | uboot should present you with a usb serial console as well |
| 19:44.09 | koen | via the mini-usb connector |
| 19:44.14 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03werner * r1204 10/trunk/src/host/devirginator/environment.in: Change default console to usbtty. |
| 19:44.38 | Elrond | Yep. |
| 19:44.53 | Elrond | Can u-boot accept stuff via the console? A la zmodem? |
| 19:44.59 | koen | it should |
| 19:45.22 | cjb | Elrond: the instructions seem to prefer using the microsd. |
| 19:45.24 | koen | maybe it even supports loading a new uboot from sd |
| 19:45.45 | Elrond | koen - _that_ is the preferred way. See cjb |
| 19:46.05 | prpplague | first thing i'm gonna do with my neo, is dump uboot |
| 19:46.19 | Elrond | prpplague - Huh? |
| 19:46.31 | prpplague | Elrond: much prefer apex |
| 19:46.32 | koen | prpplague: and use apex? |
| 19:46.35 | prpplague | koen: yea |
| 19:47.15 | *** join/#openmoko cying (n=cying@adsl-75-18-222-174.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net) |
| 19:49.12 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03laforge * r1205 10/trunk/oe/packages/tslib/tslib-1.0/fic-gta01/tslib.sh: it's now 'event1' since 'event0' was taken by the gta01kbd driver for 911 key |
| 19:49.39 | koen | heh |
| 19:49.59 | koen | told you hardcoding eventX would end in tears |
| 19:49.59 | Elrond | What's better with apex? |
| 19:51.20 | noidd | 911 key? |
| 19:51.28 | noidd | I'm scared to ask. |
| 19:51.31 | prpplague | Elrond: just thats its much smaller and easier to customize(IMHO) |
| 19:51.43 | koen | it sends your coordinates to the chinese governmnet |
| 19:51.54 | prpplague | Elrond: i already have usb and sd support for the s3c24xx series |
| 19:52.37 | *** join/#openmoko disguy__160148 (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-e5dc7c8205ca4fb2) |
| 19:52.44 | Elrond | prpplague - Ahh. |
| 19:52.57 | Elrond | koen - Not to the no such agency? ;) |
| 19:53.19 | koen | Elrond: seriously, it was in the specs earlier on |
| 19:53.27 | koen | Elrond: that's why it's called 911 button |
| 19:53.41 | koen | but that part of the spec got dropped, but the name stayed |
| 19:54.02 | prpplague | Elrond: during production we actually jtag on a super small version of apex(around 2k) which then executes to download the actually apex bootloader |
| 19:54.14 | koen | sean answered a lot of "911 button, wtf?" like questions at fosdem :) |
| 19:54.24 | Elrond | hehe. |
| 19:54.47 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03werner * r1206 10/trunk/src/host/devirginator/environment.in: Don't pass "mtdids" to kernel, because its use is u-boot internal. |
| 19:55.06 | *** join/#openmoko rob_w (n=bob@p85.212.28.26.tisdip.tiscali.de) |
| 19:55.22 | Elrond | prpplague - That sounds like fun. :) |
| 19:55.40 | prpplague | koen: need something to generate sound effects, i.e. sounds of traffic so you can effectively lie about you whereabouts |
| 19:56.14 | stefan_schmidt | prpplague: You can inject a mp3 in the voice call |
| 19:56.20 | koen | *crumble paper* tunnel, sorry *more crumbling" |
| 19:56.23 | prpplague | stefan_schmidt: lovely |
| 19:57.18 | *** join/#openmoko Matt_x (n=chatzill@209.198.66.141) |
| 19:57.25 | Matt_x | http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=conewsstory&refer=conews&tkr=AAPL:US&sid=ayU3qJTMZ62w |
| 19:57.43 | Matt_x | Apple Says IPhone to Sell Since Free Phones Worthless |
| 19:58.05 | koen | "Apple Says IPhone to Sell Since Free Phones Worthless " |
| 19:58.05 | Matt_x | wonder if they are talking about Openmoko LOL |
| 19:58.11 | koen | that's missing a verb |
| 19:58.20 | guaqua | what does that mean? |
| 19:58.24 | guaqua | i can't make up the meaning |
| 19:58.32 | Matt_x | read the link |
| 19:58.32 | koen | this sentence no verb |
| 19:58.41 | Matt_x | its a headline |
| 19:58.55 | koen | it's a sucky headline |
| 19:58.57 | LarstiQ | koen: you sure? Looks grammatical to me |
| 19:59.27 | koen | you could clame ellipsis |
| 19:59.27 | Matt_x | and Journalists and Editors major in English |
| 19:59.39 | _buz | suppose apple thinks that the gratis phones are useless |
| 19:59.41 | _buz | but english it is not |
| 20:00.13 | *** join/#openmoko rob__w (n=bob@p85.212.35.142.tisdip.tiscali.de) |
| 20:00.29 | koen | heh |
| 20:00.32 | Elrond | It's bad english imho. |
| 20:01.27 | neclimdul | do you speak dutlish? |
| 20:01.29 | benJIman | needs a "will" |
| 20:01.32 | *** join/#openmoko borg_ (n=olaf@80.149.17.21) |
| 20:01.40 | koen | neclimdul: only engrish |
| 20:01.42 | *** join/#openmoko dneary (n=dneary@mne69-9-88-163-116-163.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 20:02.38 | Matt_x | I speak Strine |
| 20:02.39 | LarstiQ | neclimdul: it's not as as bad as Engrish, it's just a hybrid form |
| 20:03.12 | Matt_x | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strine |
| 20:06.11 | DesktopMa | "Apple Says iPhone will sell since free phones are worthless" |
| 20:06.13 | DesktopMa | that's what I'd say |
| 20:06.22 | DesktopMa | or "because" |
| 20:06.27 | benJIman | 20:01:29 < benJIman> needs a "will" |
| 20:06.47 | DesktopMa | it's also missing "are" |
| 20:06.58 | DesktopMa | "Since Free Phones Worthless" |
| 20:07.07 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03laforge * r1207 10/trunk/oe/packages/alsa/alsa-state_svn.bb: add the alsa state files for various audio scenarios |
| 20:07.56 | *** join/#openmoko gw280 (n=george@vm.gwright.org.uk) |
| 20:09.16 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03laforge * r1208 10/trunk/oe/conf/machine/fic-gta01.conf: |
| 20:09.16 | CIA-7 | openmoko: * we want dfu-util and openocd to be built |
| 20:09.16 | CIA-7 | openmoko: * gta01kbd is now statically linked into the kernel |
| 20:12.53 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@206.80-202-161.nextgentel.com) |
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| 20:16.18 | *** join/#openmoko Tv (n=tv@38.98.1.19) |
| 20:16.19 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03laforge * r1209 10/trunk/oe/packages/tasks/task-openmoko.bb: add alsa state |
| 20:26.05 | *** join/#openmoko pleemans (n=peter@d51A5E76A.access.telenet.be) |
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| 20:34.52 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03laforge * r1210 10/trunk/oe/packages/linux/ (linux-gta01_2.6.20.1.bb linux-gta01_2.6.20.bb): * build uboot-gta01 when building the kernel |
| 20:36.09 | *** join/#openmoko shingoki (n=goki@pdpc/supporter/active/shingoki) |
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| 20:36.22 | *** part/#openmoko dougt (n=chatzill@67.188.65.30) |
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| 20:57.55 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03rwhitby * r30 10mokomakefile/trunk/patches/openmoko-HEAD/linux-gta01.patch: Refreshed kernel patch (STAGING_BINDIR prefix to uboot-mkimage call). |
| 20:58.55 | rwhitby | that's http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=224 |
| 21:01.11 | *** join/#openmoko bjvest (n=chingo@0x55511640.adsl.cybercity.dk) |
| 21:02.09 | Elrond | cjb - How's stuff going? |
| 21:02.37 | *** part/#openmoko bjvest (n=chingo@0x55511640.adsl.cybercity.dk) |
| 21:03.16 | Elrond | rwhitby - Yeah, me too. |
| 21:03.30 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03laforge * r1211 10/trunk/oe/conf/distro/openmoko.conf: add the prospective feed uri of this snapshot |
| 21:04.03 | Elrond | Except I wouldn't be able to connect a debug board. ;) |
| 21:06.30 | *** join/#openmoko maven (n=maven@71-33-185-151.hlrn.qwest.net) |
| 21:08.32 | cjb | Elrond: expect to start in around two hours. |
| 21:09.07 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03laforge * r1212 10/trunk/src/host/devirginator/environment.in: add quiet=1 to reduce printout in nand read |
| 21:10.33 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@206.80-202-161.nextgentel.com) |
| 21:12.25 | *** part/#openmoko TarasBulba (n=gorkem@81.214.127.147) |
| 21:15.04 | *** join/#openmoko xkr47 (i=xkr47@a88-112-19-233.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 21:17.22 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03rwhitby * r31 10mokomakefile/trunk/patches/openmoko-HEAD/uboot-gta01.patch: Fix ordering of do_deploy to be compatible with rm_work |
| 21:18.38 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03laforge * r1213 10/trunk/oe/packages/tslib/tslib-1.0/fic-gta01/tslib.sh: * use /dev/input/touchscreen0, the symlink created by udev (XorA) |
| 21:20.51 | *** join/#openmoko pauls (n=pauls@ip4da177b6.direct-adsl.nl) |
| 21:21.34 | CM | It's really nice to see all patches going in.. :) |
| 21:21.41 | CM | counter |
| 21:21.41 | aloril | P0: 2 days 14:38:18 (2.610 +-2.0 days); P1: 24.610 +-10.0 (see faq) (441) |
| 21:21.43 | *** join/#openmoko SirCrow (n=sircrow@sd511685b.adsl.wanadoo.nl) |
| 21:21.48 | CM | One month to go.. |
| 21:24.27 | *** join/#openmoko TarasBulba (n=gorkem@81.214.127.147) |
| 21:27.13 | *** join/#openmoko TarasBulba (n=gorkem@81.214.127.147) |
| 21:32.25 | *** join/#openmoko holyduck (n=holyduck@ti541210a080-11984.bb.online.no) |
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| 21:53.48 | rwhitby | hmm dfu-util-native do_depoy fails |
| 21:54.15 | rwhitby | can't find dfu-util_static to deploy, cause it isn't even built |
| 21:55.27 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03rwhitby * r32 10mokomakefile/trunk/patches/openmoko-HEAD/dfu-util-native.patch: Fix the name of the executable in do_deploy |
| 21:56.00 | *** join/#openmoko grgehunt (n=greg@88-108-56-162.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com) |
| 21:58.05 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03rwhitby * r33 10mokomakefile/trunk/patches/openmoko-HEAD/series: Enable uboot and dfu-util workarounds |
| 21:58.05 | rwhitby | ok, that one might now build |
| 21:59.31 | *** join/#openmoko tr2x (n=alvar@212-41-100-221.adsl.solnet.ch) |
| 22:00.01 | *** join/#openmoko bkuhn (n=bkuhn@fsf/member/bkuhn/bkuhn) |
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| 22:46.24 | CoreDump|home | hi |
| 22:46.40 | *** join/#openmoko LuitvD (n=luitvd@beigetower/luitvd) |
| 22:51.04 | LuitvD | hello!` |
| 22:51.17 | LuitvD | who's awake? |
| 22:51.28 | denis^da | good nigth :P |
| 22:51.34 | denis^da | night :> |
| 22:51.36 | holyduck | i am |
| 22:51.37 | holyduck | i guess |
| 22:51.40 | mjr | me, hopefully not long |
| 22:51.54 | holyduck | but my body is trying to kill me by getting sick. so i have to sleep soon :( |
| 22:54.18 | *** join/#openmoko TarasBulba (n=gorkem@81.214.127.147) |
| 22:56.03 | LuitvD | holtmann: what's the time there? |
| 23:00.21 | LuitvD | holtmann: sorry, i meant holyduck |
| 23:00.27 | LuitvD | holyduck: what's the time there? |
| 23:01.21 | *** join/#openmoko pauls (n=pauls@ip4da177b6.direct-adsl.nl) |
| 23:04.08 | *** join/#openmoko TarasBulba (n=gorkem@81.214.127.147) |
| 23:07.41 | holyduck | 0008 |
| 23:07.42 | holyduck | atm |
| 23:07.42 | holyduck | :P |
| 23:07.55 | holyduck | just gonna organize up my partition layout a bit |
| 23:08.01 | holyduck | then il sleep |
| 23:08.19 | *** join/#openmoko Zoolooc_ (n=Zoolooc@p54952A9D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 23:08.36 | rwhitby | morning all |
| 23:09.18 | jebba | heya rwhitby |
| 23:09.32 | rwhitby | hey jebba |
| 23:10.43 | *** join/#openmoko Zoolooc__ (n=Zoolooc@p549516D7.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 23:11.16 | LuitvD | hi you two |
| 23:16.41 | *** join/#openmoko TarasBulba (n=gorkem@81.214.127.147) |
| 23:18.52 | *** join/#openmoko l4rs (n=laprican@hsiproxy.astra-net.com) |
| 23:25.36 | Elrond | Hi l4rs |
| 23:25.39 | Elrond | Hi LuitvD |
| 23:27.04 | LuitvD | hi Elrond |
| 23:27.42 | LuitvD | until this afternoon, I doubted that I'd ever have to use more then my 5 desktops... now I have 6 :P |
| 23:28.17 | *** join/#openmoko TarasBulba (n=gorkem@81.214.127.147) |
| 23:28.29 | Elrond | Huh? |
| 23:28.42 | Elrond | counter |
| 23:28.42 | aloril | P0: 2 days 12:31:17 (2.522 +-2.0 days); P1: 24.522 +-10.0 (see faq) (442) |
| 23:28.44 | jebba | short interview... http://gigaom.com/2007/03/01/openmoko-phone/ |
| 23:29.32 | *** join/#openmoko andymk (n=andy@adsl-static-1-193.uklinux.net) |
| 23:33.24 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03werner * r1214 10/trunk/src/host/devirginator/openocdcmd.pl: Improved child process error detection. |
| 23:44.01 | cjb | ok, mokotime. |
| 23:46.08 | rwhitby | woohoo! |
| 23:46.46 | LuitvD | lol |
| 23:46.51 | LuitvD | stop.... mokotime? |
| 23:48.32 | LuitvD | oeh... somebody can get me many pieces of K750i hardware... maybe something to use to create my own, openmokophone? |
| 23:49.32 | CIA-7 | openmoko: 03werner * r1215 10/trunk/src/host/devirginator/README: Point out that uou probably have to be root for full USB access. (E.g., reset.) |
| 23:49.33 | LuitvD | custom-hardware in the K750i case... |
| 23:54.16 | *** join/#openmoko msroest (n=msroest@S01060040f41dad58.cg.shawcable.net) |
| 23:57.36 | LuitvD | wow... nokia pays many kernel developers... :S |
| 23:57.44 | LuitvD | http://developers.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=07/03/01/1613253&from=rss |
