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| 10:46.21 | DocScrutinizer05 | success! http://wstaw.org/m/2016/07/05/plasma-desktopyw2277.png |
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| 11:26.17 | DocScrutinizer05 | and the silego SLG46531V has a temperature sensor \o/ Great for IR LED monitoring |
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| 19:46.48 | pigeons | https://techcrunch.com/2016/07/05/silent-circle-silently-snuffs-out-its-warrant-canary-but-claims-its-a-business-decision/ |
| 19:47.39 | pigeons | "blackphone" makers. Also please interpret this line for me, "The decision was a business decision and not related to any warrant for user data which we have not received." |
| 19:47.52 | pigeons | So it was not for the warrants that they didn't receive. |
| 19:47.58 | pigeons | just for the ones they did? |
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| 20:28.51 | DocScrutinizer05 | hehe |
| 20:36.38 | DocScrutinizer05 | to me this sounds like somebody made an offer to them which they 'cannot reject' |
| 20:37.41 | DocScrutinizer05 | well, blackphone always been pretty half-assed approach |
| 20:37.43 | pigeons | yep "business decision" |
| 20:38.08 | pigeons | and warrant canaries are an interesting idea but stupid in practice |
| 20:38.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | why? |
| 20:38.53 | DocScrutinizer05 | other than the concept of a service that relies on server side integrity is stupid by design |
| 20:39.45 | pigeons | well i dont think they will hold up. common sense and legal precedent may say you can't be compelled by the law to lie, but absolutely they will, and they will hold you in contempt of court for whatever they want |
| 20:40.06 | DocScrutinizer05 | the way more interesting detail in this article is about the mandatory OS update with reduced user control |
| 20:40.28 | DocScrutinizer05 | indeed |
| 20:40.45 | pigeons | hm |
| 20:42.11 | Arch-TK | er... what? |
| 20:42.21 | Arch-TK | has had quite enough "OS updates" recently |
| 20:42.51 | pigeons | i havent looked but i would doubt they were selling too many anyway |
| 20:42.52 | Arch-TK | mandatory update (how did that even happen to begin with?) for a phone which is supposedly designed for people who care about privacy and control which decreases control... |
| 20:42.54 | Arch-TK | wtf? |
| 20:43.31 | DocScrutinizer05 | yep, exactly |
| 20:43.32 | Arch-TK | is starting to get sick of cyanogenmod |
| 20:44.54 | Arch-TK | I don't really use this phone for too much anyway but since I've discovered extras-devel for the N900 I am starting to see a much greater appeal in a phone with a slightly poorer experience of the web with far more features that I actually want. |
| 20:45.26 | Arch-TK | It seems like extras-devel is where all the fabled "semi-decent web browsers" were hiding |
| 20:45.42 | Arch-TK | not to say that microb isn't decent, but the "modern internet" absolutely shits on it |
| 20:46.20 | DocScrutinizer05 | ack |
| 20:46.28 | pigeons | well i have yet to find a web browser on a desktop that can handle twitter, or slack, or "modern internet stuff", so I don't know who uses that stuff |
| 20:46.35 | pigeons | with javascript enabled |
| 20:46.53 | Arch-TK | Oh yeah... even on a desktop web browsers struggle and burn CPU / eat RAM like mad. |
| 20:46.59 | DocScrutinizer05 | yeah it sucks |
| 20:47.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | big time |
| 20:47.05 | Arch-TK | I don't use twitter though or slack (not sure what that is) |
| 20:47.38 | pigeons | its like a web interface for irc, except the server is a private company's proprietary system |
| 20:47.44 | DocScrutinizer05 | slack is the web based integrated services IRC |
| 20:48.10 | DocScrutinizer05 | with history and file sharing and whatnot |
| 20:48.15 | Arch-TK | hmm, I see... so like an IRC based web based communication thing for companies. |
| 20:48.18 | pigeons | and surprisingly lots of "open projects" are using it instead of irc, because "user friendly" |
| 20:48.22 | zakx_ | the IRC comparisation is misleading |
| 20:48.28 | zakx_ | "chat" yes, "IRC" no |
| 20:48.50 | pigeons | i thought you could not possibly design worse chat than irc, but slack did it by far |
| 20:48.58 | pigeons | its unusable |
| 20:49.03 | zakx_ | they actually have an IRC "compatibility layer" where you can use it via IRC protocol and that'll quickly show how it isn't IRC at all |
| 20:49.04 | Arch-TK | IRC isn't bad :P |
| 20:49.39 | pigeons | irc is good enough for me, but people have plenty of valid complaints. its just those are certainly not fixed bty the direction of slack |
| 20:50.19 | Arch-TK | I'm curious, what complaints? |
| 20:51.02 | Arch-TK | Maybe I have different expectations but I've always found IRC to do a good job at being a "chatroom" thing. |
| 20:51.05 | zakx_ | IRC won't work for companies as it doesn't have backlog and rich-text bs |
| 20:51.27 | zakx_ | nobody wants to teach the janitor to use irssi |
| 20:51.38 | DocScrutinizer05 | lol |
| 20:51.38 | zakx_ | instead, they can just install the Slack smartphone app and be done with it |
| 20:51.40 | Arch-TK | hmm, backlog can be fixed using an irc bouncer, but rich-text... oh my |
| 20:51.41 | pigeons | well, i'm being charitable to the complainers, because i can't think of any at the moment. not very efficent compared to some protobuf based thingee maybe? |
| 20:52.11 | pigeons | you can have rich bs with irc |
| 20:52.40 | Arch-TK | I would stop using IRC if the standard got "updated" to support long messages and rich-text / html and then freenode changed to a server which supports the new standard |
| 20:52.43 | Arch-TK | How I hate html emails |
| 20:53.07 | zakx_ | you could possibly have everything that slack "offers" with some ambitious IRC client setup, but that won't "just work everywhere" |
| 20:53.20 | Arch-TK | It's like giving children a pack of crayons and asking them to paint the Mona Lisa |
| 20:53.32 | Arch-TK | you just end up with an unholy mess of colours |
| 20:54.07 | pigeons | slack doesn't"just work everywhere" either. just on their servers |
| 20:54.15 | Arch-TK | At work I saw an email which was written in comic sans and some "Fantasy" font thing |
| 20:54.28 | zakx_ | pigeons: yeah sure, but i mean it works on every client platform |
| 20:54.55 | zakx_ | people can install the client on their computers, smart phones, etc. (as long as they run supported mainstream OS's) |
| 20:55.19 | zakx_ | and it will be the same experience on every computer they come across |
| 20:55.28 | DocScrutinizer05 | umm, slack works moderately OKish on firefox |
| 20:56.11 | zakx_ | in the real world, people just download "the Slack app" from "the App Store" |
| 20:56.30 | pigeons | i get cpu spinning heating up and long delays, and it decides if i scroll up a bit that i really meant i wanted to go a certain percentage rather than where i scrolled, the hotkeys are really laking, several things i need to reach the mouse for |
| 20:56.32 | zakx_ | (which is just a containerized webbrowser, mind you) |
| 20:56.33 | DocScrutinizer05 | I'm not a people ;-) |
| 20:57.00 | pigeons | but worse is it cant handle slow connections, i cant even display a little text it wont load up at all if it cant hog a lot of bandwidth |
| 20:57.11 | DocScrutinizer05 | and I already hate having to use FF for slack since konqueror doesn't work for it |
| 20:57.21 | Arch-TK | basically web applications in a nutshell |
| 20:57.24 | pigeons | yeah i tried the app which is just "electrum" and actually it oes seem to work better |
| 20:57.47 | zakx_ | i hope you realize how you are not the target audience for this company |
| 20:57.56 | zakx_ | :) |
| 20:58.52 | DocScrutinizer05 | indeed I'm not |
| 20:59.10 | Arch-TK | me neither |
| 20:59.18 | pigeons | i think its not appropriate a lot of the open projects that have started using it |
| 20:59.22 | DocScrutinizer05 | thus I use IRC client for almost everything slack |
| 20:59.38 | Arch-TK | But I also don't see how "developers" ever became the target audience (as pigeons says) |
| 21:00.07 | pigeons | if people like it and get value from it great |
| 21:00.14 | pigeons | (spit) |
| 21:00.37 | DocScrutinizer05 | well, you often have no choice |
| 21:00.54 | Arch-TK | because some "higher ups" decide for you? |
| 21:01.02 | pigeons | yeah i know. with "networking/communications" apps you have to go where the people are |
| 21:01.07 | DocScrutinizer05 | or some clients or supporters |
| 21:01.10 | Arch-TK | but that begs the question why those people didn't ask you (the person who will have to use it) first |
| 21:01.31 | DocScrutinizer05 | Arch-TK: hehe |
| 21:02.34 | pigeons | i cant think of any but i know there are people who facebook is a horrible fit for but have to use it because network effect of the people they need to communicate with, some things have no website, instead a facebook apge, and would neer send an email list when they havve a facebook group |
| 21:02.56 | Arch-TK | Then you can say: "Well I like irc, it doesn't cost any money, and all the people that would actually benefit from this endeavour (the development team) probably have the mental power required to work out how to use IRC (if they don't already know how to use IRC). I can also set up an IRC server for us in 20 minutes and everyone can pick their favourite IRC client and then you don't have to spend a month |
| 21:02.58 | Arch-TK | investigating "potential solutions" to the problem of people in different parts of the building being able to discuss things." |
| 21:03.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | on a sad sidenote: now even that friggin ISIS has negative impact on Neo900 project, in that it causes mess in Saudi Arabia, particularly with banks and international payments |
| 21:03.41 | pigeons | we just can't have nice things anywhere |
| 21:03.46 | Arch-TK | Find an issue in the world: ISIS will probably claim they caused it. |
| 21:04.08 | Arch-TK | "Neo900 project suffers delays from banking issues in Saudi Arabia - ISIS claims responsibility." |
| 21:04.19 | Arch-TK | I can just see the newspaper headlines. |
| 21:05.13 | Arch-TK | All things considered, I'm surprised ISIS hasn't been eradicated yet. Surely it doesn't take this long to (in the modern day and age) eradicate even a large terrorist organisation. |
| 21:05.33 | Arch-TK | But then what do I know about eradicating terrorist organisations. |
| 21:05.57 | DocScrutinizer05 | the point being SA stopped all international money transfers |
| 21:07.17 | Arch-TK | Also, I remember something being hinted about some potential "investor." some half a year ago. Did that go anywhere? |
| 21:07.28 | DocScrutinizer05 | see above |
| 21:07.47 | DocScrutinizer05 | and above (slack) |
| 21:08.34 | Arch-TK | uses his "backlog" |
| 21:08.57 | Arch-TK | wait, how far above? |
| 21:09.28 | DocScrutinizer05 | one screen for international money transfers, a tad further for reasons why you have to use slack sometimes |
| 21:10.16 | Arch-TK | right, so the investor is some company in Saudi Arabia which uses slack? |
| 21:10.59 | DocScrutinizer05 | the investor likes to stay anonymous |
| 21:11.06 | Arch-TK | alright |
| 21:11.16 | pigeons | he must have a blackphone |
| 21:11.20 | Arch-TK | Well, this investor sounds like a nice guy. |
| 21:11.22 | Arch-TK | ahaha |
| 21:12.11 | DocScrutinizer05 | anyway no investor, rather a supporter |
| 21:12.33 | DocScrutinizer05 | investor would imply obligations on our side |
| 21:13.13 | Arch-TK | Well this supporter sounds like a nice guy. |
| 21:14.53 | DocScrutinizer05 | nice guy, nice gal, nice bunch of people, nice alien, yes, a nice one anyway |
| 21:15.26 | Arch-TK | a nice something |
| 21:15.33 | DocScrutinizer05 | :-D |
| 21:15.54 | Arch-TK | so how are the Neo900 purchases looking then? |
| 21:16.05 | DocScrutinizer05 | stale |
| 21:16.11 | DocScrutinizer05 | :-/ |
| 21:16.28 | Arch-TK | Will that not be as big of an issue because of the supporter? |
| 21:17.44 | DocScrutinizer05 | we're short a 300 devices, which evaluates as 300kâ¬. Support is only a fraction of that |
| 21:18.11 | Arch-TK | hmm |
| 21:18.28 | Arch-TK | how many devices required in total? |
| 21:18.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | min 600 |
| 21:18.50 | Arch-TK | hmm |
| 21:19.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | we're halfway there |
| 21:19.28 | DocScrutinizer05 | sorry, afk |
| 21:27.52 | DocScrutinizer05 | for a pastime meanwhile, a nice read about the silego chips we gonna use for simmux and IR control, and maybe even for IO-extenders: http://www.silego.com/uploads/Products/product_479/details/AN-1111 Sine Wave Generator.pdf |
| 21:28.25 | DocScrutinizer05 | no, we won't use them as a sound chip ;-) |
| 21:30.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://www.silego.com/uploads/Products/product_479/details/AN-1111%20Sine%20Wave%20Generator.gp5 |
| 21:30.59 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://www.silego.com/softdoc/app_notes.html?filterPN=SLG46531V |
| 21:37.44 | Arch-TK | For sound you need a chip from some old [portable] game console |
| 21:44.47 | pigeons | neo900, now with MOS 6581 sound chip |
| 21:45.52 | Arch-TK | 10/10 would buy |
| 21:50.30 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://hackaday.com/2014/10/23/a-complete-c64-system-emulated-on-an-stm32/ >>now [Mathias] has emulated everything (**except the SID**, thatâs still black magic) in a single ARM microcontroller.<< https://www.c64-wiki.com/index.php/SID |
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| 22:21.16 | Arch-TK | should fix his ZX Spectrum finally |
| 22:23.31 | Arch-TK | (not that it can produce such amazing sounds as that chip) |
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