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| 07:43.14 | itsnotabigtruck | <PROTECTED> |
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| 07:56.04 | scoobertron | I just bought an n9 in the uk, I believe it was originally a finnish model (at least it was showing helsinki weather). It updated to pr1.1 when I first started up, but the pr1.2 update doesn't seem to be available. Is there a reason why I wouldn't be able to update ota in the uk? |
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| 08:05.11 | itsnotabigtruck | scoobertron: fwiw i think they all default to helsinki weather |
| 08:05.33 | itsnotabigtruck | you probably have a product code that doesn't have pr1.2 yet |
| 08:06.01 | itsnotabigtruck | which is typical nokia, the same release mismanagement happens with their symbian phones |
| 08:06.22 | itsnotabigtruck | you should simply download the europe-1 generic image and flash it |
| 08:06.38 | itsnotabigtruck | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=82693 check that out |
| 08:06.46 | itsnotabigtruck | (/me is getting tired of telling people about flashing...) |
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| 10:22.21 | juhaj | itsnotabigtruck: You should not need to tell people about flashing any more, not with the guide you have written... it is just perfect |
| 10:27.12 | juhaj | itsnotabigtruck: About the product code mismanagement I wonder, why do they even have so many different versions of a single product anyway? I understand localisations to China and Europe, or some carrier branded versions, but there are several different Northern Europe versions, too! And quite a few country-specific ones from within Europe as well. Any idea what they gain by that, except management nightmares? |
| 10:27.49 | jonni | because operators demand their own custom versions |
| 10:29.13 | juhaj | jonni: So the "Spanish" version is not actually a generic Spanish, but some Spanish operator's carrier branded image? |
| 10:29.21 | jonni | and if operator doesnt get custom version they dont buy&sell it. Life would be so much easier if operators would just be happy with vanilla. |
| 10:30.57 | jonni | pretty much is spanish operator wants to have some tacoes / tapas foods or whatever in gallery default pictures, then they need their own variant. |
| 10:31.07 | juhaj | Like I said, I understand the carrier branding, but not dozens and dozens of country specific images. Are you saying those are just named after a country (in the firmware downloader) but are actually carrier images? |
| 10:31.37 | jonni | not all, some are carrier and some not. |
| 10:32.14 | juhaj | Ok. So counting the number of "country" specific versions gave me a wrong impression after all |
| 10:33.10 | jonni | most of the variants just flash 001, 003, 005 or 009, and they just flash suplementary image for their customization |
| 10:34.04 | jonni | and if they havent made the suplementary image yet, then ssu is not offered, even if in reality it would just use 001 |
| 10:34.15 | juhaj | ok |
| 10:34.16 | jonni | (+ some random changes in files) |
| 10:35.43 | jonni | anyways image creation is now much faster than it was between 1.0 and 1.1 |
| 10:35.50 | juhaj | Does the carrier branding actually benefit anyone? Carrier A may get a benefit by having a nice extra added, but that is a loss to carrier B, so carriers in total come up with no benefit. I find it hard to see how a user would benefit at all and it looks like it is a nightmare to the phone vendor... |
| 10:37.10 | jonni | life is, operators want to differ from other operators, (to be more attractive and whatnot), and in the end its just nightmare :) |
| 10:37.19 | juhaj | For example, I have an Orange-branded 5800 XpressMusic (the most horrible phone ever created, I am sure – I almost decided against N9 because of my experiences with 5800) and I never used any of their extras on it. |
| 10:38.13 | jonni | lucklily you can switch to vanilla versions when pr updates comes out. |
| 10:38.37 | jonni | but ofcourse that is not that userfriendly |
| 10:38.53 | juhaj | The N9 is vanilla, no problem there. |
| 10:39.29 | juhaj | Or, it *was* vanilla until I installed "unauthorised" stuff, like inception, on it =) |
| 10:41.20 | juhaj | Now I am just wrestling with a problem of installing Kontach Touch on it: Kontact Touch was the main reason to choose N9 instead of some android device, but now it seems installing Kontact Touch might land me in trouble. At least itsnotabigtruck advises against it... The packagers of course say it is safe... |
| 10:46.53 | jonni | well yes is your running pr1.2then installing kontact touch is not possible, unless you disable aegis security |
| 10:48.49 | jonni | or well you can if you use exploits and sign packages as com.nokia.maemo etc, but thats only for advanced users who know what they are doing. |
| 11:09.23 | juhaj | Well, the problem seems to be virtuoso trying to put things where they do not belong. But that is apparently done by the postinst script, so I was considering editing THAT so it does not attempt it at all. Or simply repackaging the .deb. |
| 11:10.06 | juhaj | These are things I am quite familiar with (I might call myself an advanced user in that, although I am certainly a newbie in what comes to N9 specific things) |
| 11:10.39 | juhaj | I do not even know how to disable aegis, so I think I wlil skip that option =) |
| 11:27.45 | jonni | if the sw is opensource then you can ofcourse repackage it and repackage the libs it uses not to conflict with nokia ones. But if its closed source, then your in trouble. |
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| 11:31.38 | juhaj | jonni: Well, it is kontach touch's dependency, virtuoso. At least I see it in Debian "main", so should be quite open source =) |
| 11:35.44 | jonni | ah yes virtuoso trying to wrtite to etc/init.d, but also you migh need to customize libgpg-error1, libgmp3c2 and libgcrypt12. |
| 11:37.20 | jonni | (you should never use --force-overwrite if you want to avoid malf) |
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| 12:39.20 | juhaj | jonni: Well, that is too late already =( |
| 12:40.35 | juhaj | Can I get the original packages back somehow? [I was afraid something like this would happen, because for a newbie, it is almost impossible to tell the difference between people who *know* how things should be done and people who just do them anyway (and tell newbiew to do the same).] |
| 12:42.27 | jonni | if you have malf screen then reflash is the only way to recover, and if still have ssh login to shell you can --reinstall to get nokia packages back |
| 12:42.31 | juhaj | It seems the whole thing needs repackaging with dependencies tweaked so that the Nokia-supplied libgpg-error1 and libgcrypt12 are sufficient. Actually, from what I read, that should not be a problem at all. It looks like the originals are fine, but the packager just chose to use newer versions |
| 12:43.01 | juhaj | jonni: I can ssh, but I cannot --reinstall because apt does not see the originals. |
| 12:43.39 | jonni | ah if packages are not in repo, then only way to recover is reflash |
| 12:43.52 | juhaj | jonni: Which repo should I add? (Another problem for a newbie: impossible to know which repos are "trustworthy" and which are not; indeed, even knowing which repos *exist* is quite hard: google gives mostly dead repos |
| 12:44.51 | jonni | by default you should not add any repoes, only repo that you need is aegis.ssu-keyring-001.list |
| 12:44.55 | juhaj | jonni: Well, the only versions of libgpg-error1 and libgcrypt12 that apt sees are the ones from files.kolab.org. The originals, I assume, came with the firmware image. Does Nokia not have the originals in any repo? |
| 12:45.19 | juhaj | jonni: Without adding any repos, I do not get many software either =) |
| 12:45.27 | jonni | juhaj: well we ofcourse have all the originals in internal repo, but that doesnt help you |
| 12:46.11 | juhaj | jonni: Why not make the officials available in a repo for hackers to fix their borked phones? |
| 12:46.59 | jonni | people will bork their phones even more :) |
| 12:48.26 | juhaj | That's a possibility, yes. |
| 12:49.20 | juhaj | So, I need to reflash my phone... you sure I cannot get those two debs any other way? Like dig them out from the fw image (which I already have)? |
| 12:52.00 | jonni | juhaj: well yes, if you have opensh will all capas, you can still recover |
| 12:52.17 | juhaj | jonni: I can get that (it is on my todo-list anyway) |
| 12:52.19 | jonni | dig out files, from .bin and resign refhashlist and restok |
| 12:54.21 | juhaj | I am afraid I need a bit more elaborate help.. =) "resign refhashlist and restok" tells me absolutely nothing... [And yes, I do realise I am a stupid newbie who caused himself problems by being overenthusiastic, but then again, how would I have known given the problems described above?] |
| 12:58.08 | jonni | flasher -u can decompres bin, unzlo http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1043548#post1043548 can convert rootfs to ext4, you can get files out of there |
| 12:58.50 | jonni | for resigning or exploited opensh you would have to read inception threads etc, and harmattan security dev pages |
| 13:00.07 | juhaj | And this process is how safe? |
| 13:00.32 | juhaj | Reflashing is quite safe I understand, but does kill all my programs (not that I can not reinstall them anyway) |
| 13:00.46 | jonni | lets say that you safe 5 hours work by reflashing :) |
| 13:00.53 | jonni | save |
| 13:01.22 | jonni | yes downside on reflashing is that you need to reinstall apps |
| 13:02.10 | juhaj | Ok. Will do that then. And then I need to be more careful about installing stuff in the future... Is it safe to install stuff from "random" (no offence to anyone) repos if not using any --force:s? |
| 13:03.32 | jonni | personally I would say no, atleast I would first check with dpkg -x what files each package contains before trying to install |
| 13:04.04 | jonni | but yes if there is no conflicting nokia package, then its semi safe |
| 13:04.15 | juhaj | Hm... So if I try to rebuild the kontact touch packages with --prefix=/home/MyDocs/someplace, I should be safe? |
| 13:04.46 | jonni | well MyDocs is vfat, so you cannot have any binaries in MyDocs |
| 13:05.11 | jonni | thats why for binaries you use /opt/package/bin |
| 13:06.01 | juhaj | And MyDocs needs to be vfat? Or is /opt/ safe from conflicts? |
| 13:06.56 | itsnotabigtruck | juhaj: are you sure the originals aren't in the SSU repo? |
| 13:06.57 | jonni | opt is for 3rd party apps, so there wont be any conflicts to nokia apps |
| 13:07.08 | juhaj | itsnotabigtruck: SSU repo? |
| 13:07.15 | itsnotabigtruck | try apt-get --reinstall install foo, after having removed the unwanted repo and apt-get update'ing |
| 13:07.25 | itsnotabigtruck | juhaj: that's the default repo, the downloads.maemo.nokia.com |
| 13:07.26 | juhaj | jonni: Following the FHS? Nice. |
| 13:07.28 | jonni | itsnotabigtruck: means that if you remove other repoes, does it still not find the packages |
| 13:07.51 | jonni | juhaj even |
| 13:07.54 | jonni | typo day |
| 13:08.10 | jonni | but i'm off now.bbl |
| 13:08.34 | itsnotabigtruck | as for the extract and resign route...sounds like overkill |
| 13:08.58 | itsnotabigtruck | i mean, it's good stuff to know how to do, but i highly doubt it's necessary for something routine like this |
| 13:09.42 | juhaj | itsnotabigtruck: Well... I have to check. There is no libgpg-error1, but there IS libgpg-error0 there... Perhaps the package name got changed, not just replaced with different libraries |
| 13:10.03 | itsnotabigtruck | juhaj: libgcrypt11 |
| 13:10.15 | itsnotabigtruck | and libgpg-error0 |
| 13:10.23 | itsnotabigtruck | both *appear* to be in the original nokia repos |
| 13:10.28 | itsnotabigtruck | first, you need to lose the kolab repo |
| 13:10.32 | itsnotabigtruck | it's hiding the original packages |
| 13:10.36 | itsnotabigtruck | then you need to apt-get update |
| 13:10.42 | itsnotabigtruck | then do the apt-get --reinstall install |
| 13:10.54 | itsnotabigtruck | if it's working right the packages it installs will be listed as com.nokia.maemo |
| 13:10.58 | itsnotabigtruck | in the messages that appear |
| 13:11.30 | itsnotabigtruck | also, as for kontakt, well, first you need to set up a scratchbox |
| 13:12.14 | juhaj | itsnotabigtruck: Thanks. I failed to notice the packages from the kolab repo had a different name from the originals. So, libgpg-error0 and libgcrypt11 are the originals and they really seem to be available. |
| 13:12.30 | itsnotabigtruck | so what are the names of the new packages |
| 13:12.36 | itsnotabigtruck | you can swap them out in one fell swoop then with |
| 13:12.36 | juhaj | Is the apt in N9 "fully functional", i.e. can I pin packages with it, too? |
| 13:12.46 | itsnotabigtruck | apt-get install xyzold- xyznew |
| 13:12.59 | itsnotabigtruck | yeah, you can set pins |
| 13:13.03 | juhaj | libgpg-error1 and libgcrypt12, so apt-get install libgpg-error0 libgcrypt11 libgpg-error1_ libgcrypt12_ shoudl do it |
| 13:13.44 | juhaj | Or does apt-get understand _ for purge like aptitude does? I almost never use apt-get... |
| 13:13.51 | itsnotabigtruck | i think so but does an underscore do anything? |
| 13:13.57 | itsnotabigtruck | the manual page only talks about + and - |
| 13:13.59 | itsnotabigtruck | just do - |
| 13:14.22 | itsnotabigtruck | and i wasn't joking about those packages being liable to screw up your phone x_x next time don't install packages built by idiots |
| 13:15.44 | juhaj | Aargh.. the kolab packages do not even bother to Conflict: libgpg-error0 and libgcrypt11, they simply install alongside those1 |
| 13:16.18 | itsnotabigtruck | well, that's why you specified all 4 packages on the line, right? |
| 13:16.22 | juhaj | So I should be fine with simply apt-get --reinstall install libgpg-error0 libgcrypt11 |
| 13:16.26 | itsnotabigtruck | though i guess one might have clobbered the other |
| 13:16.53 | itsnotabigtruck | ok, do that |
| 13:16.56 | juhaj | Oh, but then if I ever remove the other ones, it will try to remove files belonging to libgpg-error0 libgcrypt11 |
| 13:17.02 | itsnotabigtruck | but are you sure they don't clobber each other |
| 13:17.05 | itsnotabigtruck | ok, so they do |
| 13:17.11 | itsnotabigtruck | ffs, just do the remove and then the install |
| 13:17.23 | juhaj | Looks like the best option, yes |
| 13:19.45 | juhaj | Hmm... One more check before I continue: on a normal Debian, I could do this in two steps: apt-get --purge remove libgpg-error1 libgcrypt12 and then apt-get --reinstall install libgpg-error0 libgcrypt11. Is there any reason I can not do that now? |
| 13:20.06 | juhaj | I do not think I can do this in one go, because I need to --reinstall the stock packages, not just install |
| 13:20.35 | itsnotabigtruck | oh ffs, just do it...except... |
| 13:20.53 | itsnotabigtruck | i just realized that aegis and apt use gpg which uses libgpg-error0 |
| 13:20.55 | itsnotabigtruck | lol |
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| 13:21.22 | itsnotabigtruck | just do the single-command invocation we talked about and stop fussing about it |
| 13:21.40 | itsnotabigtruck | apt-get install libgpg-error0 libgcrypt11 libgcrypt12- libgpg-error1- |
| 13:21.43 | itsnotabigtruck | and pray :p |
| 13:22.28 | juhaj | For the record, apt-get does not understand _ for purge |
| 13:22.45 | itsnotabigtruck | hopefully you don't have anything irreplaceable on your N9 |
| 13:23.53 | juhaj | *lol* It wants to remove mp-harmattan-001-pr, too... |
| 13:23.58 | itsnotabigtruck | no no no no no |
| 13:24.00 | itsnotabigtruck | stop |
| 13:24.12 | juhaj | I already did, I am not *that* newbie =) |
| 13:24.18 | itsnotabigtruck | ok |
| 13:24.24 | itsnotabigtruck | lots of people who should know better kept going anyway |
| 13:24.30 | juhaj | There is nothing important on the phone, just as long as I can reflash it |
| 13:24.31 | itsnotabigtruck | and often they didn't realize they did |
| 13:24.46 | itsnotabigtruck | and it doesn't ruin your phone immediately |
| 13:24.52 | itsnotabigtruck | it primes it to be ruined at the next available opportunity |
| 13:25.24 | itsnotabigtruck | why would it want to remove mp-harmattan-001-pr thoug |
| 13:25.36 | juhaj | So, why would removing non-system-packages cause apt to think a system package needs to be removes? |
| 13:25.38 | itsnotabigtruck | we weren't removing system packages |
| 13:25.39 | juhaj | removed |
| 13:25.53 | juhaj | Heh, both asking the same question |
| 13:26.49 | itsnotabigtruck | juhaj: try doing apt-get -s install... |
| 13:26.52 | itsnotabigtruck | the -s is for simulate |
| 13:26.57 | itsnotabigtruck | see what it thinks it's doing |
| 13:29.00 | juhaj | That tells me nothing new. It simply wants to remove those three (the two we WANT to remove and mp-harmattan-001-pr) and then install the two we want to reinstall. |
| 13:29.52 | juhaj | I wonder if I could simply --reinstall those two now to save myself from MALF? Those are the ones which overwrote stuff in system packages, so should this not work? |
| 13:30.22 | itsnotabigtruck | hmm, try this |
| 13:30.37 | itsnotabigtruck | apt-get install mp-harmattan-001-pr libgpg-error0 libgcrypt11 libgcrypt12- libgpg-error1- |
| 13:40.42 | juhaj | itsnotabigtruck: Aah! Found the reason: some community repo has never libgpg-error0 libgcrypt11 available and hence apt-get tries to install them instead of the originals. Time to remove all community repos... |
| 13:41.32 | juhaj | Or pin... Or can I just do libgpg-error0=version, like aptitude can... (not really a question, I am already testing) |
| 13:45.25 | juhaj | Yes, it understands. Now --simulate goes through ok, but with a strange comment about *upgrading* mp-harmattan-001-pr libgpg-error0 libgcrypt11. |
| 13:46.01 | juhaj | But I think that is bogus: the version numbers it shows in brackets are identical, so it is just apt using incorrect term. I *HOPE*... |
| 13:46.24 | juhaj | Though... is there any danger in upgrading mp-harmattan-001-pr? I doubt there are others around except Nokias |
| 13:55.33 | juhaj | Ok. The install went through, BUT I got some warnings: "file /var/lib/dpkg/tmp.ci/digsigsums cannot be opened", "No digsigsums file", "Package mp-harmattan-001-pr: File '/var/lib/dpkg/info/mp-harmattan-001-pr.postinst' not in digsigsums -- warning", and one final "No digsigsums file" |
| 13:55.55 | juhaj | Are those warnings benign or will I need to reflash after all? |
| 14:02.07 | itsnotabigtruck | juhaj: which repo is it |
| 14:02.12 | itsnotabigtruck | i need to pester whoever is responsible then |
| 14:02.41 | itsnotabigtruck | and...that's not good |
| 14:02.48 | itsnotabigtruck | don't reboot or install anything |
| 14:02.50 | juhaj | https://downloads.maemo.nokia.com says apt-ache |
| 14:02.56 | juhaj | cache |
| 14:02.59 | itsnotabigtruck | i meant the community repo |
| 14:03.17 | itsnotabigtruck | obviously *.nokia.com isn't that lol |
| 14:03.19 | juhaj | You mean the one with newer versions? |
| 14:03.20 | itsnotabigtruck | yeah |
| 14:03.31 | juhaj | Ah. I thought you meant the digsigsums' |
| 14:03.42 | itsnotabigtruck | do this: accli -c tcb-verify -F /var/lib/aegis/refhashlist | less |
| 14:03.51 | itsnotabigtruck | make sure it produces a complex looking file with sha-1 hashes |
| 14:03.53 | juhaj | I'll get back to you about that, I need to go now, but ... about the digsigsums: I will need to reflash after all? |
| 14:03.54 | itsnotabigtruck | not error messages |
| 14:04.17 | itsnotabigtruck | last time someone mentioned they got similar errors during an install it bricked their phone |
| 14:04.20 | itsnotabigtruck | but that might have been an isolated case |
| 14:04.23 | itsnotabigtruck | it's probably harmless |
| 14:04.25 | itsnotabigtruck | but do that verify |
| 14:06.05 | juhaj | accli -c tcb-verify -F /var/lib/aegis/refhashlist | less is full of hashes and accli -c tcb-verify -F /var/lib/aegis/refhashlist > /dev/null gives no output. I take those as good signs... |
| 14:06.35 | juhaj | "Bricked" as in "in need of reflash" or "in need of replacement"? |
| 14:09.04 | juhaj | I really need to go now, there is a bus and three trains to catch... Thanks a *LOT* for all the help. I hope I can be a constructive member #N9 in the future instead of needing lots of help... |
| 14:09.13 | itsnotabigtruck | in need of reflash |
| 14:09.15 | itsnotabigtruck | later |
| 14:09.36 | juhaj | In need of reflash is not too bad. Inconvenient, but not bad. See you |
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| 17:33.44 | mlpug | hello, "something is wrong with the network connection" when I try to use my wlan. Any idea how fix this? In Nokia Support Discussion they end up in talking about certificates in this context. I wonder if I should I install some certificates to get the connection? |
| 17:36.41 | mlpug | wlan has authenticationtype: open key, encryption: 64bit. all other gadgets my own or my visitors tend to work with this wlan hasslefree. Therefore I assume my wlan settings are quite "normal" so to say. |
| 17:45.50 | itsnotabigtruck | mlpug: whoa, that is super weak |
| 17:46.10 | itsnotabigtruck | there's no certificates involved though |
| 17:46.19 | itsnotabigtruck | that's for an entirely different sort of wlan setup |
| 17:46.35 | itsnotabigtruck | consider switching to wpa2-psk though... |
| 18:03.51 | mlpug | itsnotabigtruck, this ancient wlan supports wep64 and 128 and thats it. Do you suspect that if I would be able to turn it into wpa2-psk then N9 would be able to use this wlan? |
| 18:04.18 | mlpug | In that case I consider upgrading my wlan alltogether |
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| 18:18.45 | itsnotabigtruck | mlpug: no guarantee since i have no idea what's wrong :p |
| 18:18.52 | itsnotabigtruck | check out your syslog |
| 18:21.20 | mlpug | ok. I should study how to do it. However, somebody else with the very same symptoms posted this into Nokia Support Discussion forum: |
| 18:21.24 | mlpug | eb 7 12:46:29 (2012) icd2 0.201.2+0m6[1271]: WLAN: Asked data for ssid "mobily" but got 5 results but no req ssid, ignoring all results (up=0x1249c), Feb 7 12:46:30 (2012) EAP[2691]: EAP 2.1.50+0m6 quitting., Feb 7 12:46:30 (2012) kernel: [ 465.324401] wl1271: down, Feb 7 12:46:31 (2012) icd2 0.201.2+0m6[1271]: Removing active IAP 0x367b8/(nil)/(nil)/(nil), Feb 7 12:46:38 (2012) wlancond[1037]: Scan command failed: -100 |
| 18:22.29 | mlpug | I guess I will find something like this in my logs. Does this trigger new ideas how to proceed |
| 18:22.44 | itsnotabigtruck | hmm |
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| 19:33.15 | mlpug | itsnotabigtruck, thanks for your ideas. I did put into developer mode. Studied my own syslog. It was different from the one I posted. I have the connection now up-and-running. case closed. |
| 20:11.20 | itsnotabigtruck | ummmmmmm, s/he could have said what the problem was :| |
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