| 00:30.02 | sixwheeledbeast | I'd agree but you will have to grab a TMO mod for that. |
| 01:20.33 | *** join/#maemo infobot (ibot@rikers.org) |
| 01:20.33 | *** topic/#maemo is Welcome to #maemo http://maemo.org/intro/ | N9/harmattan related questions please in #harmattan ! | "firmware" see ~lf (or ~tabletsdev ~combined ~emmc ~flasher) sdk: ~sb | http://wiki.maemo.org/Community_Council | Source: http://wiki.maemo.org/Sources | Chanlog: http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog | #maemo-ssu is where the (few) devels and maintainers of the maemo-future meet |
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| 05:42.11 | brolin_empey | My father, who is an electrical/electronics engineer, said that he thinks a USB cable has sufficient capacitance to be sensed by a capacitive touch panel because of the metal shielding in the cable. A different brand/make and model of USB cable we have at work also worked to control the capacitive touch screen even while the USB cable is not connected to anything. |
| 06:13.30 | Oksana | Isn't that how styluses for capacitive touch screens work? |
| 06:26.53 | brolin_empey | Oksana: Maybe, I do not know off hand. |
| 06:30.29 | brolin_empey | I also forgot much of what I learned about optical fibre technology probably at least a decade ago by now but now the wired ISP at both my home and work (same ISP) has finished installing optical fibre for customers who want to upgrade from ADSL. |
| 06:32.22 | brolin_empey | I mean I studied optical fibre technology probably at least a decade ago but by now I have forgotten much of what I learned about the subject. |
| 06:36.46 | brolin_empey | Internet service via optical fibre has only recently become available in my area because my home and work are in a low-density suburb, not in the high-density areas closer to the center of the metropolitan area. Those areas have had optical fibre Internet service available for probably over five years by now. |
| 06:38.54 | brolin_empey | I gather that metropolitan Ethernet is used by ISPs at least in Moscow but it is not used here (Metro Vancouver, Canada) as far as I know. |
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| 10:14.18 | sixwheeledbeast | FTTP is pretty rare for domestic here. Most people have either ADSL, VDSL or DOCSIS. Once the backbone network is fully upgraded to fibre everyone on xDSL connection will be switched to IP only, POTS will be switched off (5 years). No one is certain how they are going to implement that at the subscriber end. |
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| 11:20.23 | sy | so I've tried to uninstall kernel power, which or wouldn't let me do, so i rebooted |
| 11:20.42 | sy | now I'm getting bootloops |
| 11:22.04 | sy | i also can't get to uboot |
| 11:25.02 | Wizzup | that is weird? |
| 11:25.05 | Wizzup | did you set up u-boot? |
| 11:25.15 | Wizzup | Open the keyboard if you want u-boot |
| 11:26.29 | sy | trying now |
| 11:27.30 | sy | nope same thing |
| 11:28.18 | sy | gonna stick it on charge for a little bit |
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| 11:32.46 | zGrr | moin :) |
| 11:36.17 | sy | i don't think i can even download the stock ROMs anymore... |
| 11:37.19 | sixwheeledbeast | I would assume you have no kernel installed, device may not charge if bootlooping. I don't think its recommended to "uninstall" kernel-power. |
| 11:37.24 | sixwheeledbeast | ~bootloop |
| 11:37.24 | infobot | somebody said bootloop was when your device has broken rootfilesystem, so during reboot it fails on some service startup or kernel module load and thus reboots. This *drains* battery! And you can't reflash to stop bootloop when battery is drained. Recharge your battery by other means before reflashing. E.g. using ~rescueOS. Or external charger or BL-5J compatible other device. |
| 11:39.45 | sy | fuck |
| 11:40.16 | sy | well i can just charge it directly |
| 11:43.16 | sy | only took me two days to brick |
| 11:44.29 | sixwheeledbeast | they are pretty unbrickable. I imagine it won't be the first or last time you need to reflash it. |
| 11:47.32 | sy | heh |
| 11:47.58 | sy | still have to charge it the redneck way though |
| 11:48.10 | sy | had to do this when i bought it too |
| 11:53.57 | sixwheeledbeast | be careful when charging lithium batteries via "redneck" means. I suggest rescueos maybe worth a look. I have an inexpensive external charger for BL5J |
| 11:54.03 | sixwheeledbeast | ~rescueos |
| 11:54.03 | infobot | rescueos is probably http://n900.quitesimple.org/rescueOS/ |
| 11:54.24 | sy | what do i do with this? |
| 11:55.00 | KotCzarny | educate yourself |
| 11:55.06 | KotCzarny | hack |
| 11:55.08 | KotCzarny | charge |
| 11:55.11 | KotCzarny | you name it |
| 11:55.33 | KotCzarny | think of it as a usb loaded os |
| 11:56.21 | KotCzarny | in your case probably you want to flash kernel and maybe update modules dir |
| 11:58.12 | sixwheeledbeast | Worth a read -> https://github.com/quitesimpleorg/N900_RescueOS/blob/master/documentation.txt |
| 11:58.35 | sixwheeledbeast | I was thinking charging with bootlooping device. |
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| 12:03.51 | sixwheeledbeast | Yep, if your new to N900 you have lots to learn. Even if your familiar with Debian etc. |
| 12:04.08 | KotCzarny | 'you're' |
| 12:04.19 | sixwheeledbeast | ~reflash |
| 12:04.19 | infobot | methinks reflash is zImage and/or initrd.bin on CF and press C+D+Reset (collie) OR updater.sh, zimage.bin and/or initrd.bin on CF/SD and press OK while rebooting, then option 4, then CD or SF, then HAI (yes), then wait and cross fingers (all other models) |
| 12:04.29 | sixwheeledbeast | ~grammer |
| 12:04.29 | infobot | it's grammar, dammit. |
| 12:04.52 | KotCzarny | :> |
| 12:05.06 | KotCzarny | ~your |
| 12:05.06 | infobot | it has been said that your is the possessive of you, and is not "you're", which means "you are" |
| 12:05.09 | sy | oh it's literally a flash |
| 12:05.20 | sy | doesn't even persist |
| 12:05.25 | KotCzarny | btw. for flashing: |
| 12:05.26 | sixwheeledbeast | ~flashing |
| 12:05.27 | infobot | i guess maemo-flashing is http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware, or - on linux PC - download&extract http://maemo.cloud-7.de/maemo5/patches_n_tools/maemo-my-private-workdir.tgz, cd into it, do sudo ./flash-it-all.sh; or see ~flashing-cmdline, or see ~lazyflashing |
| 12:05.38 | sixwheeledbeast | ~snap |
| 12:05.38 | infobot | i heard sfsnap is http://sfsnap.babylonia.flatirons.org/bzflag/, or http://bzflag.org/cvs/ |
| 12:05.52 | sixwheeledbeast | ok i didn't expect that |
| 12:05.56 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 12:06.43 | sixwheeledbeast | cloud7 should have the image you need |
| 12:07.02 | KotCzarny | afair the script gets the image automatically |
| 12:08.36 | sixwheeledbeast | :nod: |
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| 12:11.46 | sy | yeah I'll use my redneck method |
| 12:11.51 | sy | already had to do it once |
| 12:12.01 | sy | but nice to know i have an alternative |
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| 13:43.55 | sixwheeledbeast | 'you are' probably going to need it for repairing the problem. Unless you are just doing to flash the image to stock. |
| 13:51.34 | sicelo | cleanup |
| 13:51.45 | sicelo | sorry .. |
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| 15:57.08 | brolin_empey | sixwheeledbeast: ACK. |
| 15:57.46 | sixwheeledbeast | ? |
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| 16:42.41 | *** topic/#maemo is Welcome to #maemo http://maemo.org/intro/ | N9/harmattan related questions please in #harmattan ! | "firmware" see ~lf (or ~tabletsdev ~combined ~emmc ~flasher) sdk: ~sb | http://wiki.maemo.org/Community_Council | Source: http://wiki.maemo.org/Sources | Chanlog: http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog | #maemo-ssu is where the (few) devels and maintainers of the maemo-future meet |
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| 20:53.58 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~kp |
| 20:53.58 | infobot | extra, extra, read all about it, kp is http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=94287 |
| 20:54.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~uboot |
| 20:54.09 | infobot | N900 uBoot is a siamese twin binary [uBoot+stockMaemoKernel] that resides in kernel NAND partition /dev/mtd3 aka "kernel". You can't uninstall it, rather you'll nuke it when you flash/install another kernel like stock maemo kernel or powerkernel. To start other than stock maemo kernel via uBoot, you have to provide the according kernel image files, or http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=81613 |
| 20:55.44 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~tell sy about lf |
| 20:57.25 | sy | oh |
| 21:15.33 | DocScrutinizer05 | >>Uninstalling kernel itself is possible only via menu entry "Nokia Kernel". NEVER UNINSTALL KERNEL POWER PACKAGES!!! IT CAN MAKE YOUR DEVICE UNBOOTABLE.<< |
| 21:16.25 | DocScrutinizer05 | you can't uninstall kernel on any OS |
| 21:22.52 | sy | you live you learn |
| 21:23.28 | sy | the more i think the nokia does some special things with their os, the more i realise its just plain boring old linux |
| 21:24.52 | sy | i unbricked it! |
| 21:24.57 | sy | wait what >enter your code |
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| 21:33.44 | DocScrutinizer05 | yes, maemo is boring old linux, that's the nice part about it. It's even 99% debian (pre-systemd). The nasty part is about "middleware" like liblocation, ncd2 (connection manager), mce, bme, whatnot else. All those are not exactly "system", at least not core system, but they are needed to make maemo run the way we want it, incl WLAN and phonecalls and all. And many of that middleware are closed bobs |
| 21:34.46 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~closed |
| 21:34.46 | infobot | methinks closed is http://wiki.maemo.org/Why_the_closed_packages or https://wiki.maemo.org/Fremantle_closed_packages, or http://elinux.org/N900, or https://wiki.maemo.org/Free_Maemo |
| 21:35.45 | Wizzup | DocScrutinizer05: ncd2, do you mean icd2? |
| 21:35.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | sorry, yes |
| 21:36.12 | Wizzup | btw - https://github.com/maemo-leste/icd2 |
| 21:36.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | :-) yeah great achievement |
| 21:36.36 | Wizzup | done by fmg :) |
| 21:37.00 | DocScrutinizer05 | maemo-leste rapidly converges with our dreams of what maemo should have been from beginning |
| 21:38.13 | Wizzup | nice :) there's likely quite some big hurdles left, but we're making decent progress |
| 21:38.38 | DocScrutinizer05 | yes, (PL) you're doing an incredible job |
| 21:39.30 | DocScrutinizer05 | btw parazyd has devel devices now :-) |
| 21:40.08 | parazyd | oh thanks for reminding! |
| 21:40.15 | parazyd | i'll drop you an email now |
| 21:40.21 | DocScrutinizer05 | ta |
| 21:40.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | I need a receipt for accounting |
| 21:44.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | parazyd: you as well might want to re-read the concept of uBoot on N900 |
| 21:44.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~uboot |
| 21:44.54 | infobot | N900 uBoot is a siamese twin binary [uBoot+stockMaemoKernel] that resides in kernel NAND partition /dev/mtd3 aka "kernel". You can't uninstall it, rather you'll nuke it when you flash/install another kernel like stock maemo kernel or powerkernel. To start other than stock maemo kernel via uBoot, you have to provide the according kernel image files, or http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=81613 |
| 21:45.52 | DocScrutinizer05 | those kernel image files of course can live on uSD as well |
| 21:46.04 | parazyd | we boot everything from microsd for now |
| 21:46.22 | Wizzup | well, u-boot is not on microsd right now |
| 21:46.33 | Wizzup | (obviously) |
| 21:47.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | *theoretically* I gather there's also an option to keep MLO (1st stage bootloader, when assuming ROMBL=0stage) on either uSD or eMMC as well |
| 21:47.40 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~boot |
| 21:47.40 | infobot | methinks boot is http://omappedia.org/wiki/Bootloader_Project |
| 21:48.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | MLO ala x-loader |
| 21:50.01 | DocScrutinizer05 | MLO and NOLO are a siamese twin in N900 like uBoot+kernel |
| 21:51.23 | Wizzup | I like the term siamese twin here, hehe |
| 21:55.45 | DocScrutinizer05 | the boot sequence in N900 (with uBoot) is: ROMBL -> [X-Loader->NOLO] --chainload--> [uBoot--*?-->StockKernel] ===> rootfs |
| 21:56.21 | DocScrutinizer05 | *? may divert to other kernels |
| 21:56.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | like uSD-residing leste |
| 21:57.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | ROMBL however searches uSD or eMMC (I'm not sure which) too, to find a xloader |
| 21:59.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | IroN900:~# bin/omap34xx-boot-order |
| 21:59.36 | DocScrutinizer05 | sys_boot[5:0]: 0x10 |
| 21:59.38 | DocScrutinizer05 | Boot order: OneNAND USB UART3 MMC1 -- |
| 22:00.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | so when you nuke NOLO, you can boot from MMC1 |
| 22:00.55 | DocScrutinizer05 | watch out, maemo renames/swaps MMC1 and MMC0(?) during boot, if a uSD is inserted |
| 22:04.19 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://maemo.cloud-7.de/maemo5/patches_n_tools/unsorted-whatever/omap34xx-boot-order |
| 22:08.31 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://blog.csdn.net/yasin_lee/article/details/7229349 seems to be a copy, but... |
| 22:12.59 | DocScrutinizer05 | The SDCard x-loader looks for a FAT32 partition on the first MMC controller and scans the top level directory for a file named "u-boot.bin". It then transfers the file into main memory and transfers control to it. |
| 22:13.33 | DocScrutinizer05 | Bokia's xloader will not do that, you need a geberic xloader from TI for that |
| 22:14.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | oops forgot >>quote marks<< |
| 22:14.17 | DocScrutinizer05 | >>The SDCard x-loader looks for a FAT32 partition on the first MMC controller and scans the top level directory for a file named "u-boot.bin". It then transfers the file into main memory and transfers control to it.<< http://blog.csdn.net/yasin_lee/article/details/7229349 |
| 22:21.13 | sy | so some packages depend on kernel for power user, but I installed the uboot package variant instead |
| 22:25.22 | DocScrutinizer05 | umm, which packages depend on kernel-power? |
| 22:25.48 | DocScrutinizer05 | they should depend on a property instead |
| 22:26.20 | DocScrutinizer05 | if at all |
| 22:26.55 | DocScrutinizer05 | actually any package that needs powerkernel specific features should determine if those are available, at runtime, not install time |
| 22:27.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | since obviously you could boot same rootfs from different kernels, via uBoot |
| 22:29.12 | DocScrutinizer05 | sy: *which* packages depend on KP? |
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