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| 04:10.21 | CatButts | [00:28] <Maxdamantus> CatButts: I imagine you would just use a debian root for such things. |
| 04:10.30 | CatButts | like SSH-ing into a device |
| 04:10.32 | CatButts | ? |
| 04:10.48 | CatButts | sadly, I am windows user all around :P |
| 04:23.43 | CatButts | oh goody, apparently there is Qt Creator for Maemo |
| 04:24.10 | CatButts | now I can create bloated fartapps on the go! |
| 04:31.11 | KotCzarny | or just learn python/pygtk/pyqt and stop whining |
| 04:31.38 | CatButts | rolls over KotCzarny on his cat butt |
| 04:31.57 | KotCzarny | /me moves higher and away from disturbances |
| 04:32.16 | CatButts | farts under KotCzarny's location |
| 04:32.33 | KotCzarny | /me farts back stronger |
| 04:33.08 | CatButts | you're already high up, fumes will rise |
| 04:33.17 | CatButts | I FART IN YOUR GENERAL DIRECTION |
| 04:33.30 | KotCzarny | mine just take over whole space |
| 04:34.00 | CatButts | "you think that's air you're breathing now?" |
| 04:34.29 | KotCzarny | you know that after cooling heavier gases drop down? |
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| 04:42.25 | CatButts | I want C |
| 04:42.32 | CatButts | and I want it right meow |
| 04:42.42 | KotCzarny | then use gcc, what problem is that? |
| 04:43.43 | CatButts | that's the compiler bit solved |
| 04:43.53 | KotCzarny | solved? |
| 04:44.07 | CatButts | meow I need an IDE to spoil me |
| 04:44.15 | CatButts | what's a makefile? |
| 04:44.18 | CatButts | hahahahaha |
| 04:46.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | stop that! |
| 04:50.25 | CatButts | stop what |
| 04:53.11 | Maxdamantus | 17:10:30 < CatButts> like SSH-ing into a device |
| 04:53.48 | Maxdamantus | No, just put a normal debian armel root somewhere on your system and chroot into it for things you can't do on maemo itself. |
| 04:55.49 | Maxdamantus | Eventually people should just be running a normal system like debian/devuan/arch instead of the custom "maemo" one that everyone is currently using. |
| 04:56.54 | Maxdamantus | When that happens, you wouldn't bother asking if something works on maemo, just as you wouldn't ask if something works on i5-4570 using integrated graphics. |
| 04:57.44 | Maxdamantus | unless it's something that actually involves special hardware support. |
| 04:57.51 | Maxdamantus | which an IDE shouldn't. |
| 04:59.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | that fart talk |
| 04:59.28 | CatButts | so I'd have Maemo as main and some debian as backup |
| 04:59.39 | CatButts | purrhaps I will |
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| 05:21.58 | Maxdamantus | Loads, but it has the WM hinting issue, so can't type: https://maxdamantus.eu.org/qtcreator.png |
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| 06:30.26 | bencoh | Maxdamantus: hmm how comes a qt app has wm_hints issues? |
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| 06:43.55 | Maxdamantus | bencoh: dunno. Is the `InputHint` or whatever it is set by all Qt applications? (not just ones compiled for Maemo) |
| 06:45.33 | bencoh | good question |
| 06:46.25 | Maxdamantus | It's apparently not set on Chromium on my main system (compiled through nix). |
| 06:46.46 | Maxdamantus | wonders if he has any Qt programs installed still. |
| 06:46.47 | Maxdamantus | hates Qt. |
| 06:47.08 | KotCzarny | ldd /usr/bin*|grep -i qt ? |
| 06:48.51 | Maxdamantus | Mk, loading bitcoin-qt |
| 06:49.20 | Maxdamantus | <PROTECTED> |
| 06:49.40 | Maxdamantus | So I guess that one has it. |
| 06:51.01 | Maxdamantus | Hm. Apparently qtcreator on the device has it too. |
| 06:51.50 | CatButts | I guess I will have to learn to use makefiles, huh |
| 06:52.07 | KotCzarny | or just write a script |
| 06:52.27 | Maxdamantus | or use an alternative window manager. |
| 06:52.33 | CatButts | compile_dlls.bat |
| 06:52.35 | CatButts | :p |
| 06:52.39 | Maxdamantus | or fix hildon-desktop |
| 06:52.54 | Maxdamantus | looks into using dwm. |
| 06:53.04 | KotCzarny | fluxbox ftw |
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| 07:02.51 | DocScrutinizer05 | (([2017-10-21 Sat 12:00:42] <sicelo> someone's having a problem flashing N900 - http://picpaste.com/flasher_problem-pOxDCer5.jpg)) did you solve this? |
| 07:09.58 | DocScrutinizer05 | on a sidenote re above topic about developing: generally not supposed to be done on device, it's slow like hell and pretty inconvenient, mostly due to lack of RAM and partially due to lack of CPU power and IO bandwidth. Use scratchbox or madde instead |
| 07:10.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~madde |
| 07:10.32 | infobot | i heard madde is http://wiki.maemo.org/MADDE http://sourceforge.net/projects/madde/ https://gitorious.org/meego-developer-tools/maddeâ |
| 07:10.36 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~sb |
| 07:10.36 | infobot | rumour has it, scratchbox is a cross-compiling system that uses binfmt_misc, rpc calls, and an nfs mount to make a cross-build appear to be 100% native, and is found at http://www.scratchbox.org/, hosted by maemo now. Also at http://maemo.merlin1991.at/files/SB |
| 07:21.33 | DocScrutinizer05 | ((generally not supposed)) also because of limited size available in rootfs |
| 07:22.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | none of the generic install procedures for any tools or libs will work natively on maemo |
| 07:22.07 | DocScrutinizer05 | on device |
| 07:23.10 | DocScrutinizer05 | you need a chroot or optify till you're blue in the face |
| 07:23.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~optification |
| 07:23.15 | infobot | optification is a inventive duct tape workaround to reclaim space in fs root, done due to the fact the systeminit *and* partitioning is FUBAR, http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide/Packaging,_Deploying_and_Distributing/Installing_under_opt_and_MyDocs, or ""OMG - I wish they looked into FHS and moved /usr to eMMC"", http://www.pathname.com/fhs/pub/fhs-2.3.html#PURPOSE2 bullet1,2 and fhs-2.3.html#PURPOSE16 dot3" |
| 07:23.38 | Maxdamantus | or just put everything on a partition on eMMC. |
| 07:23.52 | Maxdamantus | did that. |
| 07:24.20 | KotCzarny | or just pay someone to do the dirty work |
| 07:24.24 | Maxdamantus | is building/testing dwm on device atm |
| 07:24.44 | brolin_empey | KotCzarny: Off-topic time for me? |
| 07:24.44 | DocScrutinizer05 | note that MyDocs is FAT and thus not exactly ideal for anything development related, since you don't have proper file owner and permissions, nor symlinks |
| 07:25.02 | KotCzarny | brolin_empey: if it's about thinkpads, h3droid or oscp, sure |
| 07:25.58 | brolin_empey | KotCzarny: No but I noticed that DuckDuckGo serves a paid advertisement for a penis enlargement product in results of a query for âpaul atreidesâ. 0_o |
| 07:26.33 | KotCzarny | happens, but remember ads are often profiled to search terms |
| 07:27.09 | KotCzarny | not only current one, but previous |
| 07:28.12 | Maxdamantus | Is that the guy in Dune? |
| 07:28.18 | KotCzarny | yup |
| 07:28.33 | brolin_empey | KotCzarny: Do you get this advertisement in the results of the same query? |
| 07:28.43 | KotCzarny | starts humming ~~behind blue eyes~~ |
| 07:29.02 | KotCzarny | brolin_empey: i'm sticking to google |
| 07:29.07 | KotCzarny | for better or worse |
| 07:29.35 | Maxdamantus | doesn't seem to see any ads, though he isn't familiar with DuckDuckGo. |
| 07:29.42 | KotCzarny | http://www.moserware.com/2009/09/stick-figure-guide-to-advanced.html |
| 07:29.45 | Maxdamantus | notices it's fucking around with webfonts. |
| 07:30.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | www.startpage.com/ |
| 07:30.51 | brolin_empey | Apparently âbiteâ means âdickâ or âcockâ in the French language. |
| 07:32.07 | brolin_empey | http://bai.se/ is apparently a real business, not a domain hack. |
| 07:34.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | relevance? |
| 07:34.41 | Maxdamantus | Mm, dwm seems easy enough to modify. |
| 07:34.42 | brolin_empey | DocScrutinizer05: Relevance of Nokia N900 in 2017? ;-) |
| 07:34.59 | DocScrutinizer05 | no, of this topic in #maemo |
| 07:35.10 | Maxdamantus | Changed it so it uses `ctrl-backspace` to trigger waiting for the command key, instead of using a modifier. |
| 07:35.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | your comment sounds rather rude |
| 07:35.50 | Maxdamantus | Though need to get Xorg to not still send the input to the last-focused window at the same time. |
| 07:36.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | like "who gives a shit about maemo and if or if not I'm abusing the #maemo cjhannel" |
| 07:36.35 | bencoh | Maxdamantus: dwm is highly hackable and meant to be configured that way |
| 07:36.58 | bencoh | and someone even started developing some kind of tablet UI based on it |
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| 07:43.10 | brolin_empey | DocScrutinizer05: I guess I should privately message KotCzarny instead of beginning off-topic discussions in this channel. Honestly, though, as we have already discussed multiple times over the years, I stopped using Maemo in 2014 because my user experience was too bad, especially in Canada. I suspect that part of the reason why Nokia never released the N900 in Canada is because the cellular data connectivity of the N900 in Canada is very slow. |
| 07:43.35 | KotCzarny | brolin_empey: do you own allwinner h3 based board? |
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| 07:45.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | fails to see the relevance of >>as we have already discussed multiple times over the years, I stopped using Maemo in 2014<< in this context either |
| 07:45.47 | brolin_empey | KotCzarny: Not that I know of but I am guessing from the context that h3droid is some form of the Android OS for the allwinner h3-based board? |
| 07:45.57 | KotCzarny | correct |
| 07:46.20 | KotCzarny | if you like playing with arm, buy one (they are cheap, starting from under 10usd) |
| 07:46.35 | KotCzarny | preferably get one with 16gb emmc though |
| 07:46.42 | KotCzarny | oranges are the best hw wise |
| 07:47.08 | KotCzarny | that way you could even help with porting maemo to devuan |
| 07:48.53 | brolin_empey | DocScrutinizer05: Seriously, if your Maemo 5 user experience is the same as mine, I do not know how you can be satisfied with your Maemo 5 user experience. |
| 07:49.29 | DocScrutinizer05 | I'm not interested in discussing this question |
| 07:50.22 | DocScrutinizer05 | particularly not when it feels like a sidetrack to excuse off-topic discussion |
| 07:50.44 | KotCzarny | it could even be used as a sb box (4x1.2ghz > 1x0.5ghz) |
| 07:50.53 | brolin_empey | DocScrutinizer05: OK. |
| 07:51.26 | KotCzarny | so 8 times faster n900 packages compilation! ;) |
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| 07:52.04 | DocScrutinizer05 | not if the bottlenack is elsewhere |
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| 07:56.40 | KotCzarny | a bit offtopic, but heck if it's not a legendary: https://scontent-waw1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/22688334_1499574290157911_3979573211749576218_n.jpg?oh=60c63393c8dac5e04bef7db67a809131&oe=5A714B5F |
| 07:57.28 | DocScrutinizer05 | could you please comment about what *are* the URLs you paste? |
| 07:57.45 | KotCzarny | i've added 'offtopic', so you can skip it most likely |
| 07:58.00 | DocScrutinizer05 | you're aware users are strongly encouraged to NOT click and URL bait you throw at them? |
| 07:58.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | s/and/any/ |
| 07:59.20 | brolin_empey | DocScrutinizer05 prefers URN bait over URL bait. ;-) |
| 08:00.40 | DocScrutinizer05 | folks, honored veteran users approached me about poor S/N ratio in this channel. So I gonna do sth about it |
| 08:02.20 | DocScrutinizer05 | I'm generally not averse to a good percentage of social chatter, but it needs to be within a few formal limits. "farts" and "penis_enlargement" are clearly not within those, neither is URL spamming |
| 08:06.36 | sicelo | DocScrutinizer05: i dont know if that flasher problem was solved. i was asking on behalf of someone else on facebook who subsequentky went MIA. i would still be interested to know what could cause that |
| 08:07.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | poor USB cable, wrong USB port, USB hub |
| 08:08.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | and issues on PC, like modules not blacklisted |
| 08:09.04 | sicelo | its XP |
| 08:09.46 | DocScrutinizer05 | sorry, can't really comment on windows, no first hand experience. Maybe PC_suite installed and interfering? |
| 08:10.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | or whatever else app that messes with USB... no idea |
| 08:10.38 | DocScrutinizer05 | there's prolly a zillion of apps / tools in windows that could cause trouble like this |
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| 08:11.41 | DocScrutinizer05 | sicelo: did you manage to contact Ryan Abel? |
| 08:13.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | aka generalantilles aka maemo GC |
| 08:14.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | (ex) freenode staff approached me about the chanop situation |
| 08:14.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | so I guess it's about time to solve this issue |
| 08:18.35 | sicelo | we discussed it and juice was going to handle that. he's on of the secondary group contacts too. will follow-up this evening during meeting |
| 08:19.28 | DocScrutinizer05 | fine :-D Maybe it helps that warfare and me are in Maemo e.V. board and Maemo e.V. holds maemo assets |
| 08:20.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | actually you *could* even delegate to maemo e.V., but I'd personally prefer council manages this with freenode directly |
| 08:21.08 | sicelo | Maxdamantus: why you don't like Qt |
| 08:21.11 | Maxdamantus | Hacky, but seems like a decent starting point: https://gist.github.com/Maxdamantus/5fdbe47fba69826b7bb19d7aa2cdc8e2/revisions |
| 08:21.12 | DocScrutinizer05 | it looks strange when maemo e.V. asks for GC for themselves |
| 08:22.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | though technically/legally maemo e.V. would be the entity to do it |
| 08:22.33 | Maxdamantus | sicelo: well, I told nix to build a simple Qt program a few hours ago (mkvtoolnix-gui), and it's still compiling the dependencies. |
| 08:23.24 | sicelo | haha |
| 08:24.03 | sicelo | so you prefer gtk? |
| 08:25.12 | Maxdamantus | Well, I'm pretty sure you don't need to spend hours compiling Gtk-specific libraries before you can use Gtk, so yes. |
| 08:25.45 | bencoh | well, as a matter of fact ... you do |
| 08:25.57 | bencoh | looks like you kinda forgot about it ;) |
| 08:26.08 | bencoh | (either that or you never tried building gtk from scratch) |
| 08:26.20 | sicelo | cool. people tend to prefer Qt for being more compatible with Windows, etc. |
| 08:26.32 | sixwheeledbeast | cross platform |
| 08:26.34 | Maxdamantus | Pretty sure I've compiled it from scratch before, pretty sure it doesn't take hours. |
| 08:26.41 | freemangordon_ | yes, it takes |
| 08:27.04 | freemangordon_ | compiling gtk takes about the same time as compiling qt |
| 08:27.09 | sicelo | DocScrutinizer05: is warfare very active on IRC? |
| 08:27.19 | DocScrutinizer05 | no |
| 08:27.36 | DocScrutinizer05 | but he's our master admin on all maemo infra |
| 08:27.47 | sicelo | ceene: i'm looking at the UI for palm on yt |
| 08:27.57 | DocScrutinizer05 | IOW the keeper of *all* keys |
| 08:28.25 | DocScrutinizer05 | he took over that role from me |
| 08:29.41 | DocScrutinizer05 | you'll notice he's chan-owner/founder of all channels that we have complete control over |
| 08:29.55 | ceene | sicelo: what do you think of it? |
| 08:30.03 | ceene | PIM applications were easier to use back then |
| 08:30.14 | ceene | all information about a contact is visible at a glance |
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| 08:31.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | while GeneralAntilles is not even in ACL of this channel |
| 08:32.13 | DocScrutinizer05 | so GC role needs to get delegated or transfered from GeneralAntilles to somebody more present |
| 08:32.48 | sicelo | yes. agreed |
| 08:33.17 | DocScrutinizer05 | ideally a member of maemo e.V. since that ... just feels natural |
| 08:34.06 | DocScrutinizer05 | at least as long as those members actually are active on IRC |
| 08:34.42 | DocScrutinizer05 | and understand the requirements involved with GC role |
| 08:35.04 | KotCzarny | nope. criterium should be 'available, reachable and responsive' |
| 08:35.11 | ceene | sicelo: there's a palmos emulator or something like that for n900 |
| 08:35.25 | DocScrutinizer05 | luckily there are one or two that qualify for all those criteria ;-) |
| 08:37.20 | DocScrutinizer05 | the supposed procedure is: council asks Ryan abel (recent GC) to contact freenode to transfer GC role to maemo e.V. aka warfare + me |
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| 08:38.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | if that doesn't pan out, probably freenode will insist in maemo e.V contacting them directly since maemo e.V. is owner of the maemo name asset |
| 08:38.34 | DocScrutinizer05 | so council needs to delegate that jib to maemo e.V then |
| 08:39.25 | DocScrutinizer05 | if juiceme also is primary GC (or secondary with full permissions) then he can also do all that's needed |
| 08:39.36 | DocScrutinizer05 | no need for Ryan then |
| 08:46.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | anyway our channel ACL is 7.5 years old, and the only one who instantly can do anything about it (x-fade) is MIA since 2 years and rejected to do anything since 5 years |
| 08:46.42 | DocScrutinizer05 | this neeeds to get fixed |
| 08:47.53 | DocScrutinizer05 | even freenode staff emeritus starts wondering what's up |
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| 09:02.57 | Maxdamantus | Hah. Closing the widget windows alters the actual saved state of the desktop layout? |
| 09:03.25 | Maxdamantus | Replaced hildon-desktop with dwm and closed all the widget windows .. now after rebooting, the widgets are gone. |
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| 09:38.54 | CatButts | anyone here have experience running GarnetVM on the N900, regarding stability and performance with heavier apps, like say, Bhajis Loops? |
| 09:39.20 | CatButts | I remember trying StyleTap on a Symbian s60v5 phone |
| 09:39.38 | CatButts | not a very pretty sight |
| 09:44.46 | CatButts | and I suppose programming a Maemo application is like programming for linux, but with outdated tools and dependencies |
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| 09:50.53 | KotCzarny | CatButts: yes, but you also have to hildonize your apps and optify your packages |
| 09:51.56 | CatButts | and by hildonize, you mean using specific APIs? |
| 09:52.08 | CatButts | say if I want to go the SDL1 route |
| 09:52.50 | KotCzarny | https://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide |
| 09:53.29 | KotCzarny | while stock linux apps should compile and run, there might be display/usability gotchas you would have to look for |
| 09:53.56 | KotCzarny | see https://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide/Porting_Software |
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| 10:51.36 | CatButts | 33USD for an N900 with scratchy screen |
| 10:52.39 | *** join/#maemo xy2_ (~xy2_@94.239.177.175) |
| 10:53.44 | buZz | CatButts: nice |
| 10:53.48 | buZz | CatButts: you buying or selling? :D |
| 10:53.53 | CatButts | buying |
| 10:53.56 | buZz | aw :P |
| 10:54.01 | CatButts | found local |
| 10:54.05 | CatButts | still wary |
| 10:54.22 | buZz | i find them for ~50 euros with near mint conditions all the time :) |
| 10:54.32 | buZz | ppl just go 'meh , not android' and sell it cheap :P |
| 10:55.02 | CatButts | I think he sells same phone for 17USD without the battery |
| 10:55.40 | Wizzup | buZz: how many do you have :p |
| 10:55.49 | CatButts | that's kinda silly |
| 10:55.53 | buZz | 3 now :) but one had a cocacola bath :( |
| 10:56.17 | KotCzarny | mmm bubbles |
| 10:56.47 | Wizzup | buZz: nurdxperiments? ;) |
| 10:57.09 | buZz | no, can exploded in my backpack |
| 10:57.25 | Wizzup | never drink (coke) and walk |
| 10:58.02 | CatButts | did you sit on pack? |
| 10:58.23 | buZz | no, the can was just in the bottom after a while with a lot of tech on top of it |
| 10:58.30 | Wizzup | X-/ |
| 10:58.39 | CatButts | close enough |
| 10:58.57 | buZz | i need some isopropyl so i can at least refurb the screen |
| 10:59.22 | CatButts | oh, so scratchy screen can be mended |
| 10:59.30 | CatButts | it's plastic, right? |
| 10:59.36 | buZz | well |
| 11:00.14 | buZz | the -screen- is probably not scratchy |
| 11:00.20 | buZz | the touchlayer in front might be |
| 11:00.45 | CatButts | ouch |
| 11:01.04 | CatButts | I'd assume a touchlayer is put behind something |
| 11:01.13 | buZz | in front |
| 11:01.31 | buZz | i think they coated it with something touch-ish |
| 11:01.35 | buZz | but its in front |
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| 11:13.25 | sunshavi | CatButts: Almost six months ago. I was developing an app for palm. I did not have problems with it. Probably I am going to retake it in 4 or six months. I have not had any issues with the GarnetVM. 2 Years ago I was still using an n800. And GarnetVM worked well there also. Even the POSE have been ported lo android. I have tryied it a table also. My app worked nice on all these devices |
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| 11:21.51 | CatButts | how's the PalmAPI? |
| 11:22.17 | CatButts | https://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Programming_for_Palm_OS/C/HelloWorld this looks kinda cozy |
| 11:23.32 | CatButts | #palm channel is dead, lol |
| 11:23.46 | CatButts | even #symbian has more life |
| 11:24.49 | sunshavi | right. But You could create the palm channell again. |
| 11:25.26 | sunshavi | i have done a couple of apps recently. One that display dynamic ui. I am also porting the same app for n900 but no time right now |
| 11:25.50 | sunshavi | And the second app is a network connection that sync a products database to the palm device |
| 11:28.52 | CatButts | I am interested in music and drawing tools |
| 11:29.01 | CatButts | what's your area, sunshavi |
| 11:29.05 | CatButts | ? |
| 11:30.01 | CatButts | wanted to get a Palm TX, but found the N900 cheaper |
| 11:31.26 | sunshavi | i do it cos. I was a palm developer in the year 2k. |
| 11:31.43 | sunshavi | i develop an accounting system on C |
| 11:32.12 | CatButts | I am more of a DIY hobyist |
| 11:32.15 | sunshavi | but one of my customers want to sale from a mobile device |
| 11:33.31 | sunshavi | there is a drawing app on n900 |
| 11:33.58 | sunshavi | I do not remember the name right now. |
| 11:34.22 | sunshavi | nice drawing app I can say. Very similar to one that was present on palm |
| 11:36.44 | CatButts | ah, one more thing |
| 11:36.56 | CatButts | I've had a Nintendo DS before |
| 11:37.02 | CatButts | (RIP) |
| 11:37.17 | CatButts | the resistive screen does actually register pressure |
| 11:37.34 | CatButts | how are things on the n900 side? |
| 11:38.09 | sunshavi | after palm I moved here. never went on the symbian side (but the microkernel OS seems interesting) |
| 11:38.25 | CatButts | did stay a while on Symbian |
| 11:38.28 | CatButts | s60v5 |
| 11:38.30 | sunshavi | n900 is very nice for my use case |
| 11:38.48 | sunshavi | I have seen the n8 very nice device more powerful than n900 |
| 11:38.58 | sunshavi | taking about hw |
| 11:39.17 | KotCzarny | isnt it an n9 clone? |
| 11:39.24 | sunshavi | but what n900 gives me no android device could give me |
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| 11:39.33 | CatButts | on Symbian they have C++ |
| 11:39.41 | sunshavi | KotCzarny: not the os |
| 11:39.43 | CatButts | some twisted variant of it |
| 11:39.46 | KotCzarny | yeah, but hw is |
| 11:39.56 | sunshavi | KotCzarny: right |
| 11:40.24 | sunshavi | yes. I personally do not like C++ but I could do it if needed |
| 11:40.40 | CatButts | me neither :p |
| 11:41.26 | CatButts | how would you describe working with Palm API? |
| 11:41.32 | CatButts | I know that is C |
| 11:41.46 | sunshavi | It is very nice. |
| 11:42.12 | sunshavi | You would need a couple of old dated pdf |
| 11:42.23 | sunshavi | You would need the palm sdk |
| 11:42.27 | CatButts | I hoarded some PDFs |
| 11:42.29 | sunshavi | You would need prctools |
| 11:42.39 | sunshavi | you would need pose |
| 11:42.57 | CatButts | I don't think POSE does Palm 5 |
| 11:43.16 | sunshavi | no. pose emulates any device from palm III on |
| 11:43.29 | sunshavi | why would You need palm 5 |
| 11:43.30 | sunshavi | ? |
| 11:43.48 | CatButts | palm 5 has sound APIs, right? |
| 11:44.07 | CatButts | and the more beefy ARM CPU |
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| 11:44.19 | sunshavi | I am not very sure about it |
| 11:44.28 | CatButts | oh, there's this for the masochistic http://onboardc.sourceforge.net/ |
| 11:44.28 | sunshavi | yes the cpu right |
| 11:44.32 | CatButts | :P |
| 11:44.46 | sunshavi | lol. I have tried it on n900 once |
| 11:45.01 | sunshavi | but time is precious |
| 11:45.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | the "touch layer" is the digitizer, which consists of two plastic sheets with transparent electrically conducting resistive coating facing towards each other, and a drop of oil as separator in between |
| 11:46.09 | CatButts | ah, so if that get's pierced, good bye |
| 11:46.15 | CatButts | *gets |
| 11:46.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | yep |
| 11:46.19 | sunshavi | i never tried the arm development on palm. Even I still have a device for it the tapwave Zodiac |
| 11:46.41 | CatButts | well, I've ported C to ActionScript 3 by hand |
| 11:46.51 | CatButts | took me 6 months on first try |
| 11:46.51 | DocScrutinizer05 | also highly discouraged to touch that thing with any solvents |
| 11:47.02 | CatButts | so I more than qualify for time and masochism :P |
| 11:47.18 | sunshavi | never heard of actionScript |
| 11:47.19 | CatButts | *time available |
| 11:47.19 | DocScrutinizer05 | though isoprop might work. i'd not dare testing it |
| 11:47.32 | sunshavi | I am going to check online |
| 11:47.48 | CatButts | sunshavi, Macromedia/Adobe Flash |
| 11:48.07 | CatButts | it's OOP |
| 11:48.12 | CatButts | class-based |
| 11:48.41 | sunshavi | right. You could do also OOP on C there is a book about it |
| 11:48.56 | sunshavi | I tried to do it. On my daily work |
| 11:49.15 | sunshavi | s/tried/try/ |
| 11:49.53 | CatButts | on the flip side, you can write procedurally in AS3 if you use classes as structs:P |
| 11:50.28 | DocScrutinizer05 | CatButts: ((if that get's pierced, good bye)) that's why I said "looks like leaked and bubbles" regarding that 17 bucks device |
| 11:51.11 | CatButts | I called him and it's two devices |
| 11:51.17 | CatButts | thankfully |
| 11:51.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | and I checked, didn't find any hint it's a screen protector that has the bubbles |
| 11:51.52 | sunshavi | CatButts: I need to go now. Let me know If You need more info. As I have told You this year I have been developing Palm . And I pretend going on with it in a 4 or six months period of time |
| 11:52.17 | CatButts | I'll keep in touch |
| 11:52.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | you usually can spot screen protectors from their cutouts arounf camera/ALS/proxy and earpiece aperture |
| 11:52.24 | CatButts | rolls on his cat butt |
| 11:53.22 | CatButts | https://www.olx.ro/oferta/telefon-nokia-n900-ID8YVan.html this is the one I'm going for |
| 11:53.25 | CatButts | looks saner |
| 11:54.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | I'm worried about lower right corner of screen |
| 11:54.31 | DocScrutinizer05 | actually whole right corner... but wait |
| 11:55.40 | DocScrutinizer05 | this actually *might* be a screen protector, with a huge piece of rubbush under itright above U|I |
| 11:56.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | or that's a scratch/leak |
| 11:57.34 | DocScrutinizer05 | if I could zoom in to that picture... |
| 11:57.53 | DocScrutinizer05 | impossible to tell |
| 12:00.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | anyway the whole screen looks like: bubbles, a scratch, and leaked silicon oil (the matte stains) |
| 12:03.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | might be a matter of just cleaning it, or even artifacts in the photo. No idea |
| 12:04.25 | DocScrutinizer05 | if the latter then seller didn't care much to make the device look good. If the former then they picked the photo that shows least of it |
| 12:06.47 | DocScrutinizer05 | I never had any severe scars in any of my N900 screens. But I heard of people who carried their N900 in trouser pocket together with nails and a garden rake, and the screen didn't really like that treatment |
| 12:07.34 | DocScrutinizer05 | also sharing pocket with keys is a poor idea |
| 12:08.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | no surprising find once you start to think about it, which is sth users sometimes just don't do |
| 12:11.00 | DocScrutinizer05 | wondering what been there first, careless users or gorilla glass screens, I'd bet on the former |
| 12:11.12 | KotCzarny | yup |
| 12:11.37 | KotCzarny | stupidity predates all tech |
| 12:11.47 | DocScrutinizer05 | hehe, to the point |
| 12:14.58 | DocScrutinizer05 | can't stop imafining a guy with a fur coat hitting own head with a wooden club |
| 12:16.07 | DocScrutinizer05 | probably been needed to get the idea ro hit others likewise |
| 12:16.25 | KotCzarny | http://weknowmemes.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/no-use-it-for-talking-coimc.jpg |
| 12:16.27 | DocScrutinizer05 | ;-) |
| 12:16.45 | DocScrutinizer05 | hehehe |
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| 13:12.36 | pkill9 | does anyone know how to make this? https://github.com/archlinuxarm-n900/xf86-video-fbdev-sgx |
| 13:25.52 | bencoh | wait, where does that come from? |
| 13:26.26 | bencoh | pkill9: I'd say dpkg-buildpackage, as usual |
| 13:26.29 | bencoh | (in scratchbox) |
| 13:26.56 | bencoh | or just ./autogen.sh and ./configure && make |
| 13:27.00 | pkill9 | cool thanks |
| 13:27.11 | pkill9 | this is for archlinux arm not debian |
| 13:27.12 | bencoh | it all depends on your env and target actually |
| 13:27.21 | pkill9 | i'm running archlinux arm on the n900 |
| 13:27.35 | Wizzup | then don't use scratchbox |
| 13:42.49 | jonwil | pkill9: Do you have the right PowerVR blobs that go with xf86-video-fbdev-sgx? |
| 13:44.00 | pkill9 | are blobs aprt of the kernel? |
| 13:44.05 | pkill9 | part* |
| 13:44.08 | jonwil | no, the blobs are in userspace |
| 13:44.16 | jonwil | and no I dont know where you get them from |
| 13:45.07 | pkill9 | i'm using this guide https://github.com/archlinuxarm-n900/alarm-n900/wiki/PowerVR-SGX |
| 13:45.36 | jonwil | Looks like the ti-omap3-sgx-bin package has the blobs you need |
| 13:45.37 | pkill9 | i'm fairly new to compiling and stuff so i'm kinda doing it by trial and error lol, but i've used linux for a while and can work my way around stuff |
| 13:45.52 | pkill9 | yeah |
| 13:46.19 | pkill9 | so what's the userspace blob? is it closed source stuff necessary to work with proprietary hardware? |
| 13:46.50 | jonwil | yes |
| 13:46.52 | pkill9 | here is that package https://github.com/archlinuxarm-n900/ti-omap3-sgx-bin |
| 13:47.15 | jonwil | Its the same thing as the graphics drivers on a desktop PC basically |
| 13:47.43 | jonwil | Same purpose anyway |
| 13:50.31 | pkill9 | i thought maybe i could try it without the blob and maybe it would just mean not being able to use 3D accelaration for now |
| 13:50.47 | pkill9 | then try it with the blob if X doesn't start |
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| 13:54.40 | bencoh | pkill9: good luck with building the ti-omap3-sgx-bin package you just linked |
| 13:54.47 | bencoh | it refers to pub.meego.com |
| 13:54.51 | pkill9 | ha yeah |
| 13:55.20 | bencoh | pkill9: you can retrieve maemo sgx binaries from maemo/nokia mirrors |
| 13:57.25 | pkill9 | hmm i may not need it afterall, i used this repo to compile the kernel https://github.com/pali/linux-n900 |
| 13:57.32 | pkill9 | and it mentions fbdev and stuff |
| 13:57.41 | pkill9 | actually idk |
| 13:57.50 | pkill9 | are kernel modules userspace or kernelspace? |
| 13:58.21 | pkill9 | cos the systemd service in that sgx package just seems to modprobe the driver |
| 13:59.28 | pkill9 | well i'll make the xorg driver and see if it works |
| 13:59.33 | pkill9 | but i'm recharging my phone atm |
| 14:01.40 | pkill9 | sorry my attention is all over the place, gonna go have lunch |
| 14:13.21 | bencoh | pkill9: I dunno if this repo includes sgx patches |
| 14:14.47 | bencoh | you need an (opensource, never merged - distributed as patches) kernel driver, the xorg fbdev-sgx driver, egl blobs, and the closed pvr2d bridge blobs |
| 14:14.53 | bencoh | afaict |
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| 14:44.09 | pkill9 | oh ok bencoh, i guess it's gonna be a mission :D |
| 14:50.54 | bencoh | pkill9: maemo worked with kernel built from this repo at some point afaiu, so it might work, assuming you extracted the blobs from a maemo system |
| 14:51.01 | bencoh | it shouldn't be that difficult |
| 14:51.08 | bencoh | and their are only 2/3 packages to include |
| 14:51.10 | bencoh | there* |
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| 16:11.43 | pkill9 | hmm, i get an error from autogen.sh, and configure, complaining of 'syntax error near unexpected token 'RANDR,', and the line is 'XORG_DRIVER_CHECK_EXT(RANDR, randrproto)' |
| 16:26.18 | pkill9 | hmm found this, this probably explains why (need xorg-server-devel package) https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=79509&p=67 |
| 16:37.16 | bencoh | pkill9: do you build on-device or in a cross env? |
| 16:37.41 | pkill9 | on device, but i would much prefer to use a cross env :p |
| 16:38.15 | pkill9 | compiling at downloading ate half my battery after i recharged it lol |
| 16:38.20 | pkill9 | s/at/and |
| 16:39.30 | pkill9 | bencoh: is there a decent guide to compiling for ARM on x86_64? |
| 16:39.47 | pkill9 | I'm somewhat new to compiling |
| 16:40.11 | pkill9 | though I compiled the kernel for the N900 on this PC |
| 16:40.27 | pkill9 | but I barely knew what was happening :P |
| 16:41.08 | bencoh | a decent guide, dunno |
| 16:41.22 | bencoh | but the keyword is crosscomiling |
| 16:41.26 | bencoh | +p |
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| 16:59.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | sgx driver blobs: http://software-dl.ti.com/dsps/dsps_public_sw/sdo_sb/targetcontent/gfxsdk/index.html |
| 17:01.49 | pkill9 | cool thanks :) |
| 17:04.31 | freemangordon | pkill9: I don;t think those are compatible with the kernel on Pali's tree |
| 17:04.41 | pkill9 | ah |
| 17:04.45 | freemangordon | you really should use the blobs comming with the device |
| 17:05.00 | freemangordon | *coming |
| 17:05.27 | pkill9 | how would i get them from the device to my archlinux arm installation? |
| 17:05.45 | freemangordon | copy them? |
| 17:05.56 | DocScrutinizer05 | also useful: https://pandorawiki.org/SGX_drivers |
| 17:06.11 | pkill9 | where would i copy them from? |
| 17:06.19 | freemangordon | all the *pvr* and *gl* nad *GL* and *IMG* from /usr/lib |
| 17:06.24 | freemangordon | and symlinks as well |
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| 17:07.00 | freemangordon | ok, boot maemo and check which packages contain *sgx* or *img* in the package name |
| 17:07.09 | freemangordon | "dpkg -l | grep sgx" |
| 17:07.16 | freemangordon | "dpkg -l | grep img| |
| 17:07.20 | freemangordon | ops |
| 17:07.27 | freemangordon | "dpkg -l | grep img" |
| 17:07.42 | freemangordon | then check the content of those packages with dpkg -L |
| 17:07.55 | freemangordon | and you'll know the files. nore or less |
| 17:08.10 | freemangordon | pkill9: is your arch armel or armhf? |
| 17:10.03 | pkill9 | uname -a says armv7l so i assume armel |
| 17:10.24 | pkill9 | (run in maemo) |
| 17:10.51 | freemangordon | I meant archlinux arch |
| 17:15.14 | pkill9 | armv7l on archlinux |
| 17:18.55 | freemangordon | ok, might work then |
| 17:26.45 | freemangordon | pkill9: you may need https://github.com/freemangordon/pvr to replace one of the blobs |
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| 17:36.21 | pkill9 | ooo you uploaded that a couple days ago? |
| 17:38.01 | pkill9 | i'm setting up a guide to installing archlinux arm, one that's hopefully more complete than the random posts on the maemo forum |
| 17:38.42 | pkill9 | currently it's just notes for myself, but i'll change it into a guide in the future |
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