IRC log for #maemo on 20170713

00:20.27*** join/#maemo infobot (~infobot@rikers.org)
00:20.27*** topic/#maemo is Welcome to #maemo http://maemo.org/intro/ | DONT FORGET TO VOTE FOR COUNCIL! https://maemo.org/vote/ | N9/harmattan related questions please in #harmattan ! | "firmware" see ~lf ~tabletsdev ~combined ~emmc ~flasher sdk: ~sb | http://wiki.maemo.org/Community_Council | Source: http://wiki.maemo.org/Sources | Chanlog: http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog
00:21.28*** join/#maemo xes (~xes@unaffiliated/xes)
08:56.24*** join/#maemo infobot (~infobot@rikers.org)
08:56.24*** topic/#maemo is Welcome to #maemo http://maemo.org/intro/ | DONT FORGET TO VOTE FOR COUNCIL! https://maemo.org/vote/ | N9/harmattan related questions please in #harmattan ! | "firmware" see ~lf ~tabletsdev ~combined ~emmc ~flasher sdk: ~sb | http://wiki.maemo.org/Community_Council | Source: http://wiki.maemo.org/Sources | Chanlog: http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog
08:56.25DocScrutinizer05~sb
08:56.25infobotmethinks scratchbox is a cross-compiling system that uses binfmt_misc, rpc calls, and an nfs mount to make a cross-build appear to be 100% native, and is found at http://www.scratchbox.org/, hosted by maemo now. Also at http://maemo.merlin1991.at/files/SB
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08:58.21DocScrutinizer05vahe[m]: http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide
08:58.50DocScrutinizer05http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide/Development_Environment/Maemo_SDK
08:59.14vahe[m]I'm not familiar with scratchbox, but be sure to get acquainted now
08:59.17vahe[m]thanks again :)
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08:59.57DocScrutinizer05get the VM, most easy way to use sb
09:00.04DocScrutinizer05http://maemo.merlin1991.at/files/SB
09:00.49DocScrutinizer05it's a VM image
09:01.18DocScrutinizer05virtualbox etc
09:03.14vahe[m]ah ok
09:03.26DocScrutinizer05installing scratchbox is a tad annoying and tedious otherwise
09:03.42enycDocScrutinizer05: hrrm why 10.04 outdated system ooi ???
09:04.04DocScrutinizer05hm?
09:04.11KotCzarnybecause maemo is old. 2010.
09:04.19enycthe txt along with that image suggests 10.04 lts
09:04.24enycno longer in pattches
09:04.51DocScrutinizer05so what? you're not supposed to browse the internet with this VM
09:05.13DocScrutinizer05it has all the tools you need and they fit together
09:05.30enycright, but what about compiler bugs, kernel,  things like update for stack-clash vulnerability, ....
09:06.19DocScrutinizer05when you're interested in keeping sb up to date, you rather install genuine
09:06.27KotCzarnyyou didnt get the 'maemo is old' part, did you?
09:06.29DocScrutinizer05good luck!
09:06.41KotCzarnyn900 runs with 2.6.28 kernel
09:08.42merlin1991enyc: actually maemo packages require such old autotools, it craps itself on some things on kernels > 2.6 ...
09:11.23enychrrrrrrrm
09:14.20merlin1991also libtool and autotools in sdk repo don't excalty play along which is why the scratchbox makes some vodoo, which in turn isn't available if you install a recent version of scratchbox...
09:14.31merlin1991it's a big everything too old clusterfuck
09:14.59merlin1991you notice ie. that argz.m4 is missing but used if you install the latest scratchbox natively
09:21.12bencoh"'s a big everything too old clusterfuck" indeed :/
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09:38.26bencohhttp://muarf.org/~bencoh/maemo/libmatrix.so no fucking idea whether this is supposed to work, but ... feel free to try
09:44.46enyci see ;p
09:45.09enycKotCzarny: the 2.6.28 kernel being heavily-patched from original for drivers and allsorts?
09:47.40DocScrutinizer05no
09:48.30DocScrutinizer05it just has dirivers that are not, or were not, upstreamed back when. Most are now, though
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10:13.19enycSo, what's involved in producing a 2.6.32 -or- 3.2 or 3.16 or 4.9/newer kernel for N900 // old-maemo ??   would that be driver-interface-incompatible with older software?
10:13.51enycwas pointed out to me  2.6.32 maintaned by RHEL6 / centos 6.9  so could at least build a security-patched 2.6.32 kernel  in first-instance...
10:18.15enyc(if that would work with the drivers-for-2.6.28 ??)
10:27.32merlin1991enyc: even if it works that would mean you have a recent kernel, yay
10:27.38merlin1991now go and update *everyhing else*
10:28.22merlin1991actually people do have recent kernel with patches ontop to export interfaces for old maemo running
10:28.40merlin1991but as far as security goes that is like a single drop ontop a forestfire
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10:29.35enycmerlin1991: that figures
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12:20.13enycmerlin1991: what does this mean//say about usefulness of porting  maemo to newer hardware, neo900 or otherwise...?
12:20.55enycmerlin1991: vs. just making a newer debian//devuan//whatever linux work on open//semi-open HW gadget ?
12:21.15enyclinux / gnu / whatever desktop, i should say
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12:39.48bencohenyc: actually some are already trying to port/rebase (bits of) maemo on top of de{bi,vu}an
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12:42.39enycbencoh: ok that makes sense, where are repos, wikis, IRC channels,  testable versions, ???
12:43.37KotCzarnyin the git
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12:43.46KotCzarnyand you are on the channel
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12:45.30enycjoin #fptp
12:45.50enychrrm err there was a fptf at some poi too...
12:45.57enyclooks confused
12:46.19enycKotCzarny: what git where? what wiki?  whats' workable//installable at the moment?
14:55.10merlin1991enyc: you can check out https://github.com/fremantle-gtk3/
14:55.31merlin1991it has lots of bits that are part of the core maemo experience there already
14:57.35merlin1991hm at least I think that is the right one
14:59.06sicelo[D
14:59.07sicelosorry,
14:59.44merlin1991was that the gtk crapper utf code that breaks xchat on maemo? :D
15:01.34sicelohaha. no. some crap i had in my irssi
15:01.50freemangordonmerlin1991: enyc: https://github.com/fremantle-gtk2/
15:02.00merlin1991uh
15:02.02merlin1991hides
15:02.05freemangordongtk3 port is suspended for a while
15:02.33merlin1991is gtk2 still seeing upstream support?
15:02.44freemangordonafaik yes
15:02.54freemangordonsupport == bugfixes
15:03.21freemangordonafter all there are a couple of DEs still using it
15:03.39merlin1991what's that gnome fork that sticks with gtk2?
15:03.49freemangordonlxde?
15:04.05freemangordonor was it xfce, not sure
15:04.35merlin1991looks like they are still doing stuff on gtk2.x
15:04.36merlin1991https://git.gnome.org/browse/gtk+/log/?h=gtk-2-24
15:04.52merlin1991what made you suspend the gtk3 efforts?
15:05.08freemangordontoo many pieces are missing
15:05.39freemangordonso I would have lost focus fighting with gtk instead of maemo as a whole
15:05.44sicelognome fork was mate iirc
15:14.10enycMATE, ported to gtk3 enitrely  in latest  Mint 18.2 release...
15:14.28enycbut MATE versions using gtk2 still about // in use
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16:23.58bencohnow that's strange .... http://maemo.org/packages/repository/builds/fremantle_extras-devel_free_source/all/
16:24.25bencohthe "latest builds" preview on the right side is outdated
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18:03.16DocScrutinizer05not strange, that's called "midgard" ;-)
18:04.03DocScrutinizer05prolly one of the midgard "cronjobs" (some really weird thing) craped his pants
18:06.15DocScrutinizer05only a 2 or maybe 3 people on this planet would know where to look at to start trying to fix it. I'm not one of them
18:16.34DocScrutinizer05don't ask me to understand this: http://wstaw.org/m/2017/07/13/plasma-desktopvI8317.png
18:21.59DocScrutinizer05say this loud and fast, 5 times: >>Packages Package Packageevent<< !   http://wstaw.org/m/2017/07/13/plasma-desktophr8317.png
18:23.16DocScrutinizer05sorry, feeling this headache again. Already forgot about it the last few years as long as I didn't look at that shit anymore
18:24.40DocScrutinizer05>>Comments Comment<< >>Favourites Favourite<<
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18:26.00DocScrutinizer05sings "tag link - linktagtag, tag link linktagtag"
18:26.31DocScrutinizer05got that midgard madness again :-S WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!
18:28.05DocScrutinizer05Alt+F4 to the rescue
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19:27.18kalinHi guis
19:29.19kalini'm trying to install python 2.4 with synaptic on my n900, but synaptic still try to use old repos
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19:39.17kalinis the muarf mirror work?
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19:40.07DocScrutinizer05yes
19:40.53kalinso why synaptic can't work with it?
19:40.56DocScrutinizer05but I doubt it has python2.4
19:41.30kalincrap
19:42.02DocScrutinizer05you should probably check:
19:42.02DocScrutinizer05~plg
19:42.02DocScrutinizer05~pkg
19:42.03infobotpkg is probably http://maemo.org/packages/
19:42.03DocScrutinizer05~packages
19:42.25DocScrutinizer05~ping
19:42.25infobot~pong
19:42.27kalinits very important to me to get pyobd on my n900
19:42.30DocScrutinizer05~rtt
19:42.30infobothmm... rtt is round trip time
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19:44.03DocScrutinizer05kalin: why python2.4?
19:44.56kalinpyobd dependecies...
19:45.14kalinand pyserial
19:47.33kalinI need to run this app to finish my education
19:47.43DocScrutinizer05seems like python.2.4.4 (final bugfix release) was released in 2005 and since then python2.5 is recommended?
19:48.49DocScrutinizer05I doubt you could find python2.4 for maemo, when it shipped with python2.5 a 8 years ago
19:49.09kalinwhat you suppose to i do?
19:49.25siceloeducation?
19:49.55kalinyes
19:49.55DocScrutinizer05try running your progrom on python2.5, if there are compatibility issues, go and fix them in the program code
19:50.22DocScrutinizer05program*
19:50.35DocScrutinizer05https://www.python.org/download/releases/2.4.4/
19:50.36kalineasy to say :D
19:51.11sicelopyobd on n900 runs just fine. what dependencies you don't meet?
19:51.53kalinpython 2.4 and pyserial
19:51.59DocScrutinizer05lol, even their website is already rotten and dust: https://www.python.org/download/releases/2.4.4/NEWS.txt  404
19:52.21sicelon900's pyobd uses python 2.5
19:53.55DocScrutinizer05looks like a nice educational lesson to make a python2.4 program run on python2.5
19:54.53DocScrutinizer05https://www.python.org/doc/versions/
19:55.54DocScrutinizer05https://docs.python.org/release/2.5/whatsnew/whatsnew25.html
19:56.19kalinsicelo, how to show my terminal to see
19:56.56siceloscreenshot, or pipe to a text file or pipe directly to a pastebin
19:57.08DocScrutinizer05https://docs.python.org/release/2.5/whatsnew/porting.html
19:58.31DocScrutinizer05echo "this is your program that creates output"  | netcat termbin.com 9999
19:59.38DocScrutinizer05particularly:  ssh user@N900 echo "this is your program that creates output"  | netcat termbin.com 9999
20:01.14kalini have idea
20:01.25kalinwill use ssh from notebook to login in my n900
20:05.16sicelo~repos
20:05.16infobotfrom memory, repos is "deb http://maemo.muarf.org/apt-mirror/mirror/downloads.maemo.nokia.com/fremantle/ssu/apps/ ./ ;; deb http://maemo.muarf.org/apt-mirror/mirror/downloads.maemo.nokia.com/fremantle/ssu/mr0/ ./", or see http://wiki.maemo.org/Repository#List_of_Maemo_repositories, or see ~jrrepos
20:05.55sicelokalin: also check your repos against the abovve
20:08.59sicelo<PROTECTED>
20:20.11DocScrutinizer05http://maemo.org/packages/view/pyobd/
20:20.22DocScrutinizer05even in testing :-)
20:20.36DocScrutinizer05err maemo-extras
20:21.11DocScrutinizer05~jrrepos
20:21.12infobotextra, extra, read all about it, jrrepos is http://maemo.cloud-7.de/maemo5/et_al/HAM-catalogs/
20:21.17DocScrutinizer05~ham
20:21.17infobotham is, like, Hildon Application Manager.  Slow as molasses. Anticipate you got time for a beer or two until it finishes whatever it does, or see ~speedyham
20:21.42kalin/home/user # apt-get install pyobd                                                                                  
20:21.42kalinReading package lists... Done                                                                                      
20:21.42kalinBuilding dependency tree                                                                                            
20:21.42kalinReading state information... Done
20:21.46kalinE: Couldn't find package pyobd
20:21.48kalin/home/user # apt-get install pyobd
20:21.50kalinE: Could not get lock /var/lib/dpkg/lock - open (11 Resource temporarily unavailable)
20:21.52kalinE: Unable to lock the administration directory (/var/lib/dpkg/), is another process using it?
20:21.54kalin/home/user # apt-get install pyobd
20:21.56kalinReading package lists... Done
20:21.58kalinBuilding dependency tree      
20:22.00kalinReading state information... Done
20:22.02kalinYou might want to run `apt-get -f install' to correct these:
20:22.04kalinThe following packages have unmet dependencies:
20:22.06kalin<PROTECTED>
20:22.08kalin<PROTECTED>
20:22.10kalin<PROTECTED>
20:22.12kalinE: Unmet dependencies. Try 'apt-get -f install' with no packages (or specify a solution).
20:22.16*** mode/#maemo [+o DocScrutinizer05] by ChanServ
20:22.35DocScrutinizer05please use pastebin!
20:22.45kalinok, sorry
20:22.52*** mode/#maemo [-o DocScrutinizer05] by ChanServ
20:23.59DocScrutinizer05check in package interface ^^^ where the missing dependencies are from
20:24.14DocScrutinizer05prolly should fix your catalogs
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20:24.26DocScrutinizer05or did you forget to apt-get update?
20:26.34DocScrutinizer05actually why did you issze the same command three times? and more weird, why did you get different results on all three runs?
20:26.58kalinwhen i try apt-get update i gives me keyexpired
20:27.08DocScrutinizer05honestly you probbaly rather should use HAM
20:27.22DocScrutinizer05keyexpired is a warning
20:27.26DocScrutinizer05ignore it
20:27.39sicelo+1 re- HAM
20:30.04kalinhow to ignore this
20:31.00DocScrutinizer05look into a different direction ;-)
20:31.00kalin:D
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20:32.31sicelokalin: first step is to ensure you have corect repos. infobot gave you links
20:33.34kalini did use microb install link
20:33.46DocScrutinizer05yes, and ideally use ~jrrepos
20:34.11sicelowhich ones you adfed?
20:34.30DocScrutinizer05then check "catalogs" in HAM, disable obsolete/defective ones
20:34.57DocScrutinizer05sicelo: btw congrats!
20:35.52kalinsicelo, both muarf and linenoise
20:36.05DocScrutinizer05no, please don't install both
20:36.19DocScrutinizer05it doesn't help, only slows down stuff
20:36.32DocScrutinizer05muarf is it
20:36.34sicelothanks DocScrutinizer05 :)) .. now the hard work begins
20:38.21kalinok, so now i must remove linenoise repo?
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20:39.04siceloyes
20:39.04DocScrutinizer05http://maemo.cloud-7.de/maemo5/et_al/HAM-catalogs/recommended.install
20:39.55DocScrutinizer05or, use http://maemo.cloud-7.de/maemo5/et_al/HAM-catalogs/muarf_devel_tools.install and disbale the tools and devel repos
20:40.16kalinDocScrutinizer05, only this one or with muarf?
20:40.28DocScrutinizer05both include muarf
20:40.34kalinok
20:40.56DocScrutinizer05recommended is a symlink to muarf.install
20:41.32DocScrutinizer05also read my comment on bottom of that webpage
20:44.38DocScrutinizer05why the F* I got the muarf installfiles twice, with %20 amd with space?
20:46.40kalinHAM is so slow...
20:48.42DocScrutinizer05bencoh: uri = http://maemo.muarf.org/apt-mirror/mirror/downloads.maemo.nokia.com/fremantle/ssu/apps/  vs  uri = http://mirrors.muarf.org/maemo/apt-mirror/mirror/downloads.maemo.nokia.com/fremantle/ssu/apps/  ??
20:49.35DocScrutinizer05bencoh: I gather I can discard the urglier of both (mirrors.muarf)?
20:50.12DocScrutinizer05bencoh: which one is the recommended correct URL?
20:55.06DocScrutinizer05~tell kalin about speedyham
20:59.06bencohDocScrutinizer05: maemo.muarf.org
20:59.17DocScrutinizer05I have to admit http://maemo.org/packages/view/pyobd/ leaves my totally clueless about what exactly this program *does*. >OBD-II (SAE-J1979) compliant scantool software< AAAHA hmmm
20:59.21bencohunfortunately google decided to index mirrors. first
21:00.17DocScrutinizer05prolly best to have a forward 302, will even re-educate google afaik
21:08.06DocScrutinizer05I realy wonder what I had on my mind when I created those .install
21:10.16DocScrutinizer05http://maemo.cloud-7.de/maemo5/et_al/HAM-catalogs/muarf.install  aka recommended.install looks halfway decent, right. But what the heck is http://maemo.cloud-7.de/maemo5/et_al/HAM-catalogs/Nokia_Apps_-_mirror_maemo.muarf.org.install - looks borkd ( [install] ! instead [catalogs] )
21:18.51DocScrutinizer05is so lazy, can't get around to test both versions to see which works
21:20.29DocScrutinizer05gmmmmm http://maemo.cloud-7.de/maemo5/et_al/HAM-catalogs/BM.install
21:30.10*** join/#maemo infobot (~infobot@rikers.org)
21:30.10*** topic/#maemo is Welcome to #maemo http://maemo.org/intro/ | DONT FORGET TO VOTE FOR COUNCIL! https://maemo.org/vote/ | N9/harmattan related questions please in #harmattan ! | "firmware" see ~lf ~tabletsdev ~combined ~emmc ~flasher sdk: ~sb | http://wiki.maemo.org/Community_Council | Source: http://wiki.maemo.org/Sources | Chanlog: http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog
21:53.20*** join/#maemo Kabouik_ (~kabouik@32.232.202.84.customer.cdi.no)
21:53.45sicelopyobd is for communicating with your car via obd to see engine fault codes and clear them
21:54.07DocScrutinizer05aaah
21:54.16DocScrutinizer05thanks! :-)
21:55.57siceloalso can fo live capture of many sensors .. although thus is dlow in pyobd n900. i found obdgpslogger to be much better on n900 for that.
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23:11.03mike727Help... I'm worried that I might of bricked my N9. #harmattan
23:13.08mike727I was on Australia firmware (with CMT using 003) & telephony was not working. I tried "--erase...." flash with 005 & it failed.  https://pastebin.com/Lg1f3GkT
23:17.00DocScrutinizer05exactly why I lost all interest in N9
23:20.43mike727James T. Kirk: Give it too me straight. Is she dead?
23:21.45DocScrutinizer05Idunno Jim, possibly yes
23:22.43DocScrutinizer05though a Nokia repair shop - so you find one - might still be able to downgrade-flash it
23:24.12DocScrutinizer05also there might be hacks invented by community to cope with this situation. I might have missed those since... like I said I lost all interest in HARM / N9 because of that design
23:24.35mike727Okay, will have to be patient and see. Still looking at the bright side, just won an auction for a n900 with otterbox at a nice price :D
23:24.50mike727thanks
23:25.03DocScrutinizer05:-)
23:25.12DocScrutinizer05otjers in here might be more savvy with HARM
23:25.44DocScrutinizer05so linger on, repeat question every 12h or somesuch
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