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| 00:20.48 | *** topic/#maemo is Welcome to #maemo http://maemo.org/intro/ | N9/harmattan related questions please in #harmattan ! | "firmware" see ~lf ~tabletsdev ~combined ~emmc ~flasher sdk: ~sb | http://wiki.maemo.org/Community_Council | Source: http://wiki.maemo.org/Sources | Chanlog: http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog | #maemo-ssu is where the (few) devels and maintainers of the maemo-future meet |
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| 06:56.52 | NeKit | https://2.taobao.com/item.htm?spm=2007.1000337.16.4.hx4eZE&id=540823535194 |
| 06:57.11 | NeKit | does it look real from photos? |
| 06:57.31 | KotCzarny | page requires login |
| 06:57.38 | KotCzarny | throw a link to the photo |
| 06:58.52 | NeKit | https://img.alicdn.com/bao/uploaded/i4/6000000002394/TB2u0CYXY_0UKFjy1XaXXbKfXXa_!!0-fleamarket.jpg_728x728.jpg https://img.alicdn.com/bao/uploaded/i4/6000000006759/TB2cPfVc4RDOuFjSZFzXXcIipXa_!!0-fleamarket.jpg_728x728.jpg |
| 06:59.48 | KotCzarny | i would bet on a fake |
| 07:00.20 | NeKit | also https://img.alicdn.com/bao/uploaded/i1/6000000000268/TB23TXrjmFmpuFjSZFrXXayOXXa_!!0-fleamarket.jpg_728x728.jpg |
| 07:02.05 | KotCzarny | https://nagomartin.wordpress.com/2010/07/09/be-careful-if-you-want-to-buy-nokia-n900/ |
| 07:02.26 | KotCzarny | few notes to spot most obvious differences |
| 07:04.17 | jonwil | hi |
| 07:05.25 | KotCzarny | and: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t27QMN5AH2c |
| 07:05.31 | KotCzarny | which confirms it's a fake |
| 07:06.21 | NeKit | thank you |
| 07:06.40 | NeKit | never supposed they could actually fake this form-factor |
| 07:06.50 | KotCzarny | you should message the dealer and/or taobao to inform about it |
| 07:07.29 | NeKit | there was discussion there already if it's a fake or not, but seller tried to prove otherwise |
| 07:07.42 | KotCzarny | post a link to yt vid |
| 07:08.02 | KotCzarny | that should nail him down |
| 07:09.01 | KotCzarny | otoh, it's funny people are still trying to sell fake n900 after it's EOL in ~2011 ;) |
| 08:04.44 | KotCzarny | nekit: remember that n900 was sold for quite a sum at the time of release |
| 08:05.59 | freemangordon | KotCzarny: I wouldn't call it funny, rather sad |
| 08:06.07 | NeKit | those fakes seem to be based on MTK chips |
| 08:06.09 | KotCzarny | it's a sad laugh |
| 08:06.29 | freemangordon | there is no replacement for 6 years already |
| 08:06.38 | KotCzarny | who needs a replacement? |
| 08:06.49 | KotCzarny | it's working perfectly fine for me |
| 08:06.53 | freemangordon | how's your browser? |
| 08:07.03 | KotCzarny | and web browsing on any screen <10" is a pain |
| 08:07.03 | freemangordon | etc. |
| 08:07.13 | freemangordon | no, it wasn't back then |
| 08:07.17 | KotCzarny | other than browser it suits me perfectly |
| 08:07.42 | KotCzarny | fmg: but sad state of the web today is that everything has to have 2cm blank space around it + tons of js |
| 08:08.18 | freemangordon | all the multimedia and communication functionality n900 has in 2010 are gone, with some exclusions |
| 08:08.26 | KotCzarny | irc is there |
| 08:08.31 | freemangordon | yeah |
| 08:08.51 | KotCzarny | and other fluffs are just that, fluffs, that go with the wind after a year or two |
| 08:08.57 | freemangordon | I am sure you got what I mean |
| 08:09.01 | KotCzarny | and i think xmpp is also supported |
| 08:09.21 | freemangordon | it is all about the choice, now we don;t |
| 08:09.23 | KotCzarny | yup, it's not a feature phone with flashy interface for regular-joe |
| 08:09.31 | freemangordon | but it was, back then |
| 08:09.52 | KotCzarny | was it? i got an idea that it was hacker's phone since the beginning |
| 08:10.15 | freemangordon | besides that, it was fully-functional multimedia and communication device |
| 08:10.21 | KotCzarny | it still is |
| 08:10.37 | freemangordon | mhm |
| 08:10.42 | KotCzarny | oscp runs perfectly fine, whereas many android phones lack such features |
| 08:11.53 | KotCzarny | so i can play lots of file formats in one app with flexible interface |
| 08:12.19 | KotCzarny | (audio of course) |
| 08:16.10 | KotCzarny | someone recently said that regular users are quite dumb computer-wise |
| 08:16.28 | KotCzarny | which also explains why simple devices/software are selling |
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| 09:17.05 | NeKit | how to avoid DSME rebooting system on Devuan due to MMC failed to mount? |
| 09:18.18 | KotCzarny | recompile dmse to just oops instead of rebooting? |
| 09:18.23 | KotCzarny | *dsme |
| 09:18.57 | KotCzarny | test on the device with mmc reader ? |
| 09:19.10 | KotCzarny | fake it some other way? |
| 09:20.22 | NeKit | I asked because there should be a workaround already if freemangordon has it running on his VM, or I did something wrong |
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| 14:55.17 | freemangordon | NeKit: I doubt it is because of no mmc |
| 14:57.36 | freemangordon | most probably it is because of a missing /var/lib/dsme/saved_state |
| 14:58.21 | NeKit | where should it come from? |
| 14:58.32 | freemangordon | for now, create it by hane |
| 14:58.36 | freemangordon | *hand |
| 14:59.28 | freemangordon | it should contain "USER" |
| 15:00.25 | freemangordon | it comes from /sbin/preinit script, which is missing in devuan |
| 15:04.13 | freemangordon | NeKit: if doing "echo USER > /var/lib/dsme/saved_state" doesn't help, please provide syslog |
| 15:04.27 | NeKit | it helped, thank you |
| 15:04.53 | freemangordon | cool |
| 15:05.02 | freemangordon | we should fix that at some point |
| 15:05.18 | freemangordon | Pali: what is the sane way ^^^ ? |
| 15:05.44 | Pali | run getbootstate |
| 15:05.55 | Pali | that program generates saved_state |
| 15:06.06 | freemangordon | sure, but what it will do on x86? |
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| 15:06.12 | Pali | and should work with upstream kernel too (if you install it from cssu) |
| 15:06.25 | freemangordon | Pali: x86-64 devuan here :) |
| 15:06.26 | Pali | it is for n900, not idea then |
| 15:06.34 | Pali | create USER with echo |
| 15:06.59 | freemangordon | Pali: the point was - can we get similar stuff on x86? acpi call or something? |
| 15:07.27 | Pali | no, there is nothing like that in x86 world, or at least not standard |
| 15:07.32 | freemangordon | ok |
| 15:07.40 | Pali | there are some proprietary extensions for notebook manufactors |
| 15:07.46 | Pali | but nothing documented... |
| 15:08.02 | NeKit | maybe just default to USER in init script if there is no such file? |
| 15:09.53 | freemangordon | mhm |
| 15:09.57 | freemangordon | make sense |
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| 15:15.26 | freemangordon | NeKit: so, you have it booting to hildon-desktop now? |
| 15:15.48 | NeKit | not yet, still missing deps for it |
| 15:15.57 | NeKit | did you build osso-af-utils? it's required by osso-af-init, but not in fremantle-gtk2 |
| 15:16.13 | freemangordon | yes, it should be in maemo repos |
| 15:16.19 | freemangordon | checks |
| 15:17.07 | NeKit | it's there, yes |
| 15:17.14 | NeKit | community-ssu on github |
| 15:17.23 | freemangordon | yes, but I guess I should put it in the repo |
| 15:17.29 | freemangordon | is it there? |
| 15:17.32 | freemangordon | hmm |
| 15:20.46 | freemangordon | NeKit: it doesn;t build, I am going to fix it |
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| 15:26.26 | NeKit | so it was not needed before? |
| 15:29.37 | freemangordon | it was, I have fixed it locally |
| 15:29.43 | freemangordon | but didn;t put it on github |
| 15:29.47 | freemangordon | will do it now |
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| 16:09.54 | freemangordon | NeKit: it is ready |
| 16:10.24 | freemangordon | NeKit: you will also need to pull maemo-system-services as well, I fixed dh_installxsession too |
| 16:12.57 | freemangordon | NeKit: please report (or open issue on github) if there are more missing/broken/etc packages |
| 16:13.29 | freemangordon | hmm, why are not issues enabled by default? |
| 16:15.02 | freemangordon | NeKit: do you want me to add you as a member of fremantle-gtk2 org? |
| 16:19.55 | freemangordon | Wizzup: the same question to you, I guess you're going to be the release manager, so you need write access to the repos to update debian/changelog files |
| 16:21.56 | Wizzup | that will be useful, but I don't need access right now |
| 16:22.34 | freemangordon | Wizzup: no maemo timeslice? |
| 16:23.03 | Wizzup | I meant that I'll need it when amprolla is set up properly |
| 16:23.28 | freemangordon | Wizzup: parazyd said he is working on it, so soon or later it will be ready |
| 16:23.41 | freemangordon | I think it is better to have the packages ready by that time |
| 16:23.53 | Wizzup | agreed. ok, yes please, then :) |
| 16:24.29 | freemangordon | Wizzup: most, if not all of the packages need their debian/changelog fixed for devuan (and versions as well) |
| 16:24.41 | freemangordon | what is you github nick? |
| 16:24.51 | freemangordon | wizzup? |
| 16:25.05 | Wizzup | no |
| 16:25.10 | Wizzup | 'MerlijnWajer' |
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| 16:28.12 | freemangordon | Wizzup: you should have an invitation |
| 16:30.33 | NeKit | freemangordon, thanks, but no need for now, I think |
| 16:31.27 | freemangordon | NeKit: ok. but still, please report if you find issues so I can fix them |
| 16:35.50 | NeKit | should upstart-dev be replaced by maemo-system-services-dev? |
| 16:35.59 | freemangordon | yes |
| 16:36.34 | freemangordon | NeKit: you should install upstream upstart |
| 16:36.49 | freemangordon | and maemo-system-services, maemo-system-services-dev |
| 17:17.03 | NeKit | how to go around osso-icons-default conflict with hicolor-icon-theme? |
| 17:22.01 | freemangordon | hmm, I can;t remember of a such conflict |
| 17:23.11 | freemangordon | NeKit: what is the conflict? |
| 17:24.14 | NeKit | dpkg: error processing archive osso-icons-default_2.5.0+0m5_all.deb (--install): |
| 17:24.14 | NeKit | <PROTECTED> |
| 17:25.31 | NeKit | removing it will also going to remove gtk-3.0 and clutter |
| 17:25.40 | freemangordon | you don;t need gtk3.0 |
| 17:26.02 | freemangordon | hmm, wait |
| 17:27.05 | freemangordon | now I remember I had to repackage it |
| 17:28.45 | freemangordon | NeKit: try with http://46.249.74.23/devuan/osso-icons-default_2.5.0+0m5_all.deb |
| 17:29.12 | freemangordon | can't remember why I had to repackage it, maybe because I had to remove some dependencies |
| 17:31.47 | freemangordon | NeKit: there is something weird, dpkg -L hicolor-icon-theme | grep index gives empty result here |
| 17:34.11 | NeKit | that's interesting |
| 17:34.12 | NeKit | hicolor-icon-theme/stable,now 0.13-1 all [installed,automatic] |
| 17:34.15 | NeKit | is it same version? |
| 17:35.39 | freemangordon | yes |
| 17:36.05 | freemangordon | ii hicolor-icon-theme 0.13-1 |
| 17:37.39 | NeKit | https://packages.debian.org/jessie/all/hicolor-icon-theme/filelist |
| 17:38.06 | freemangordon | no idea :) |
| 17:39.06 | freemangordon | http://pastebin.com/nCXFrQmv |
| 17:41.39 | freemangordon | NeKit: http://pastebin.com/acW8aW4R |
| 17:42.31 | NeKit | yes, the same |
| 17:42.46 | NeKit | is there a possibility that hicolor-icon-theme was also repackaged though? |
| 17:43.05 | freemangordon | no |
| 17:43.30 | freemangordon | lemme reinstall it |
| 17:44.01 | freemangordon | hmm |
| 17:44.03 | freemangordon | trying to overwrite '/usr/share/icons/hicolor/index.theme', which is also in package osso-icons-default 2.5.0+0m5 |
| 17:44.16 | freemangordon | maybe I used --force-all to install osso icons |
| 17:44.49 | freemangordon | can't really remember |
| 17:45.18 | NeKit | makes sense then, it installed with that flag |
| 17:45.34 | NeKit | do you still have the source you used to repackage icons package? |
| 17:45.44 | freemangordon | I repackaged from .deb |
| 17:45.55 | freemangordon | don't have a source package |
| 17:47.44 | freemangordon | we need to find another packge with free icons |
| 17:48.02 | KotCzarny | gnome like or ? |
| 17:48.06 | freemangordon | the license for osso-icons-default does not allow redistribution |
| 17:48.11 | freemangordon | KotCzarny: maemo-like :) |
| 17:48.27 | KotCzarny | and gpled most likely? |
| 17:48.48 | freemangordon | KotCzarny: yeah |
| 17:48.51 | KotCzarny | we need a graphics designer |
| 17:49.03 | freemangordon | but I think there are already such packages in maemo repos |
| 17:49.36 | freemangordon | KotCzarny: like https://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=65801 |
| 17:50.12 | KotCzarny | i think i saw that icon pack somewhere |
| 17:50.45 | KotCzarny | google: clarity icon theme |
| 17:51.14 | KotCzarny | (and yeah, i've snatched them into oscp too ;) |
| 17:51.42 | freemangordon | hmm, what? https://apps.ubuntu.com/cat/applications/lucid/hildon-icons/ |
| 17:52.10 | freemangordon | hehe |
| 17:52.11 | freemangordon | http://archive.debian.org/debian//pool/main/h/hildon-icons/ |
| 17:52.37 | KotCzarny | heeh |
| 17:53.00 | KotCzarny | maybe in sdk there is another icon theme package? |
| 17:54.09 | freemangordon | hmm, how to remove a package while installing a replacement? |
| 17:54.19 | KotCzarny | --ignore-deps ? |
| 17:54.22 | KotCzarny | or something |
| 17:55.13 | freemangordon | --forece-all did the job |
| 17:55.18 | freemangordon | *--force-all |
| 17:55.26 | KotCzarny | yeah, i'm always forgetting the names |
| 17:59.24 | KotCzarny | i love how m$ 'antimalware service executable' brings the system to a grind, irony runs deep here |
| 18:14.47 | ShadowJK | And sadly it's the lightest one out there |
| 18:23.49 | KotCzarny | ShadowJK: hehe, but i think eset is quite decent and much better than m$ offering |
| 18:23.56 | KotCzarny | not free though |
| 18:44.48 | DocScrutinizer05 | wonders how long till nausea kicks in, reading https://www.xda-developers.com/diving-into-sdcardfs-how-googles-fuse-replacement-will-reduce-io-overhead/ |
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| 19:28.59 | ShadowJK | At what part does it kick in? |
| 19:31.26 | ShadowJK | At some point I lose track of why they want/need vfat/fat32 on internal emmc-type storage |
| 20:02.44 | KotCzarny | 17% more slowly |
| 20:02.46 | KotCzarny | buahahahaha |
| 20:02.52 | KotCzarny | shittalk |
| 20:03.46 | KotCzarny | oh, hey, it will take 117s instead of 100s, its horrible |
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| 20:19.57 | KotCzarny | and it all could be solved by some symlinking :P |
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| 21:00.00 | merlin1991 | why the fuck would one want to emulate fat32... |
| 21:00.05 | merlin1991 | headdesks |
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| 21:09.58 | KotCzarny | 640kB is enough for everyone! |
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| 21:18.34 | DocScrutinizer05 | ShadowJK: (at what part) I simply can't make up my mind |
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| 21:19.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | prolly depends on how many BS the particular reader can take before it's too much |
| 21:19.51 | DocScrutinizer05 | starting at ancient legacy, to most recent decisions, and the complete lack of common sense in all that |
| 21:22.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | with introduction of MTP the latest, they lost any reason to keep that VFAT crap around, and thus could have reverted to sane ACLs and whatnot, all proven age old unix stuff to solve age old "problems" like access permissions |
| 21:22.38 | DocScrutinizer05 | or DUH ... SElinux? |
| 21:22.44 | DocScrutinizer05 | apparmor? |
| 21:23.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | mount namespaces? |
| 21:28.25 | jonwil | A big part of why fat/fat32 continues to exist is that its the best filesystem when a device wants to expose its data via USB Mass Storage (i.e. MyDocs on N900) |
| 21:28.29 | DocScrutinizer05 | to start with: it's the responsibility of $APP to keep any security critical stuff confidential against other processes under same user/permission |
| 21:28.53 | DocScrutinizer05 | jonwil: see what I said (and they wrote) about MTP |
| 21:30.59 | Maxdamantus | So does MTP have seek now? |
| 21:33.17 | Maxdamantus | Mm, Wikipedia lists "GetPartialObject64" and "SendPartialObject" under the Android extension of it. |
| 21:34.14 | Maxdamantus | oh, there's some MTP 1.1 that has at least "GetPartialObject" |
| 21:34.26 | Wizzup | freemangordon: got the invite, will accept it when I get home tomorrow eve, I'll resume the package building and note taking, maybe automate the building with a simple script until parazyd finishes amprolla |
| 21:34.44 | Wizzup | this week is sightly busy due to the tor dev meeting in amsterdam |
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| 21:43.18 | buZz | > An N900 with pali's U-Boot installed. |
| 21:43.22 | buZz | how do i get this? |
| 21:43.54 | buZz | i guess it refers to https://github.com/pali/u-boot-maemo/ ? |
| 21:44.15 | Pali | https://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=81613 |
| 21:44.48 | buZz | oh hi pali :D |
| 21:45.35 | buZz | hmm ok, so i should first get this n900 over to CSSU ? |
| 21:46.26 | Pali | u-boot is independent of cssu |
| 21:48.09 | *** join/#maemo xy2_ (~xy2_@119.245.16.93.rev.sfr.net) |
| 21:48.49 | buZz | hm ok |
| 22:06.35 | *** join/#maemo dafox_ (~dafox@2a02:a448:c25a:1:7061:3b2a:37df:ded3) |
| 22:09.08 | buZz | blocked by some third party policy setting that i cant find |
| 22:09.09 | buZz | dangit |
| 22:11.04 | *** join/#maemo Smily (~SmilzOrg@ip5f5bd58b.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) |
| 22:20.49 | *** join/#maemo xy2_ (~xy2_@119.245.16.93.rev.sfr.net) |
| 22:24.05 | DocScrutinizer05 | hm? |
| 22:24.48 | buZz | np |
| 22:25.01 | buZz | seems some earlier extra-devel install wrekked dependancies |
| 22:25.08 | buZz | blocking u-boot to get installed |
| 22:27.45 | DocScrutinizer05 | !BEFORE INSTALLING THIS U-BOOT ALL OTHER INCOMPATIBLE U-BOOT VERSIONS MUST BE UNINSTALLED! |
| 22:27.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | ;-D |
| 22:28.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | Hildon Application Manager will not allow you to install this U-Boot if there are some problems. |
| 22:32.59 | buZz | i just wiped the n900 using lazyway |
| 22:33.04 | buZz | w/e :P |
| 22:33.17 | buZz | almost have extras-devel back and will retry |
| 22:35.23 | buZz | same result with a clean n900 |
| 22:35.25 | buZz | :( |
| 22:41.30 | buZz | right, apt-get install u-boot-flasher does something, lets see |
| 22:43.39 | buZz | alright, this is getting somewhere :D |
| 22:52.17 | enyc | merlin1991: iirc qemu has a fat32 emulator ;p |
| 22:54.43 | *** join/#maemo pagurus (~user@p4FDC39EB.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 22:55.02 | buZz | Wizzup: on your devuan-on-n900 tries, did you run devuan from internal flash? or SD |
| 23:01.53 | Wizzup | buZz: sd card |
| 23:02.00 | buZz | k k |
| 23:02.08 | buZz | i'm following https://github.com/dderby/debian900 atm |
| 23:02.37 | Wizzup | patazyd has a ddable image |
| 23:02.43 | Wizzup | parazyd |
| 23:02.49 | Wizzup | going to sleep. |
| 23:02.49 | buZz | dont mind, i have time |
| 23:02.53 | buZz | sleep well Wizzup \o |
| 23:10.18 | Maxdamantus | I didn't really understand where that article was talking about the FAT32 emulation happening. |
| 23:11.17 | Maxdamantus | I imagine it would be sensible to just have FAT32 emulation for the UMS (so you'd point g_mass_storage to a dynamic file in the FUSE mount) |
| 23:11.45 | Maxdamantus | but it sounded like every operation had to do with this "VFAT emulator" |
| 23:14.12 | Maxdamantus | all you need is a FAT32 emulator for UMS .. handling permissions for different applications shouldn't really need a special filesystem. |
| 23:15.29 | Maxdamantus | if you're restricting that at a kernel level, you'd probably just have each program have its own mount namespace where the diruectories it's meant to see are bind mounted into the expected place in a tmpfs. |
| 23:18.58 | Maxdamantus | tbh on the former thing, I'd quite like an implementation of that that doesn't depend on any Android stuff ... so I could just do `virtfat normal-directory /tmp/fat-normal-directory` |
| 23:19.25 | Maxdamantus | then make g_file_storage point to that /tmp/fat-normal-directory file. |
| 23:20.55 | Maxdamantus | Usually when transferring things to normal people's computers using my N900, I'll just have various FAT images sitting in files on my SD card, and I'll point g_file_storage at them when needed. |
| 23:21.19 | Maxdamantus | Would be nicer to export a normal directory as a FAT image instead. |
| 23:22.40 | Maxdamantus | I've thought about looking into qemu's FAT virtualisation thing before, that enyc alluded to. |
| 23:28.38 | Maxdamantus | Hm, there's a project on GitHub under bwimm/libvirtual_fat that says it does the read-only version of that. |
| 23:30.12 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~uboot |
| 23:30.12 | infobot | N900 uBoot is a siamese twin binary [uBoot+stockMaemoKernel] that resides in kernel NAND partition /dev/mtd3 aka "kernel". You can't uninstall it, rather you'll nuke it when you flash/install another kernel like stock maemo kernel or powerkernel. To start other than stock maemo kernel via uBoot, you have to provide the according kernel image files, or http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=81613 |
| 23:33.19 | DocScrutinizer05 | it's really tricky :-) |
| 23:35.01 | DocScrutinizer05 | new kernel flasher pkgs have some nifty check to see if the installed (in NAND) primary kernel is ok to get replaced |
