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| 12:18.07 | Sicelo | lol .. oftc/#debian being spammed by someone who hates Poettering/Systemd |
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| 12:50.20 | KotCzarny | a bit sad |
| 12:51.10 | Juesto | gg |
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| 12:55.42 | sixwheeledbeast | All this trolling doesn't help really does it, just throws more fuel on the fire. |
| 12:57.41 | KotCzarny | swb: but most people are too dumb for meaningful arguments anyway 'because debian and everyone uses it 11!!11one!' |
| 12:57.55 | KotCzarny | s/dumb/deaf/ |
| 12:59.46 | KotCzarny | and it's especially sad when some of those people are distro maintainers |
| 13:03.35 | Sicelo | afaik there was a public vote as far as debian is concerned? |
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| 13:06.34 | KotCzarny | sicelo, public majority isn't the best decision maker, you know |
| 13:07.16 | Sicelo | oh .. no idea :-) |
| 13:07.26 | Sicelo | what is the best? |
| 13:11.24 | KotCzarny | peer review of people experienced in particular area |
| 13:14.00 | Sicelo | makes sense .. but is it realistical? i.e. is it something really doable, or it's an ideal? |
| 13:15.09 | Sicelo | s/tical/tic/ |
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| 13:40.38 | KotCzarny | <PROTECTED> |
| 14:17.41 | Sicelo | hmm |
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| 14:44.48 | DocScrutinizer05 | nothing wrong with systemd per se. Just why the heck it needs incompatible API that everybody and their dog link against? So you're forced to have systemd installed to get e.g. KDE or Gnome desktop |
| 14:46.37 | DocScrutinizer05 | let alone systemd is pathetic design and code quality, unbearable for PID1. Also a monster while every sane sysop wants a *lean* process for PID1 |
| 14:47.00 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~nosystemd |
| 14:47.06 | infobot | i guess nosystemd is https://devuan.org http://without-systemd.org/wiki/index.php/Arguments_against_systemd http://blog.darknedgy.net/technology/2015/10/11/0/ |
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| 15:25.10 | DocScrutinizer05 | https://www.agwa.name/blog/post/systemd_is_not_magic_security_dust |
| 16:13.19 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~seen pali |
| 16:13.21 | infobot | pali <~pali@Maemo/community/contributor/Pali> was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo, 9d 18h 4m ago, saying: '(in past there were problem with that compression because of patents)'. |
| 16:13.31 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~seen freemangordon |
| 16:13.31 | infobot | freemangordon <~ivo@46.249.74.23> was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo, 4d 23h 25m 36s ago, saying: ':)'. |
| 16:32.50 | bencoh | :) |
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| 17:42.11 | sixwheeledbeast | I second Doc. I have no issue with systemd but I want freedom to choose the system I want |
| 18:17.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | also: |
| 18:17.38 | DocScrutinizer05 | newbie:/etc/zypp/repos.d.bak_pre_suse42.2_JR # shutdown -r 60 |
| 18:17.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | Failed to set wall message, ignoring: Unknown method 'SetWallMessage' or interface 'org.freedesktop.login1.Manager'. |
| 18:17.41 | DocScrutinizer05 | Failed to call ScheduleShutdown in logind, proceeding with immediate shutdown: Unknown method 'ScheduleShutdown' or interface 'org.freedesktop.login1.Manager'. |
| 18:17.42 | DocScrutinizer05 | newbie:/etc/zypp/repos.d.bak_pre_suse42.2_JR # reboot |
| 18:17.44 | DocScrutinizer05 | Connection to newbie.neo900.org closed by remote host. |
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| 18:18.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | W*T*F?!?? |
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| 18:25.12 | DocScrutinizer05 | ok, should have been shutdown -r +60, but... |
| 18:26.00 | DocScrutinizer05 | logind my ass |
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| 19:00.19 | DocScrutinizer05 | >> Yet what Iâm hearing is that with GNOME v3 the goal is to promote their âbrandâ and make it dominant, in part by greatly limiting what users can change on their own systems, and partly by breaking or simply removing whatever support theyâre no longer promoting as âThe Wayâ. The reach of this selfish and narrow-sighted development goes beyond GNOME and affects GTK apps in general.<< https://igurublog.wordpress.com/2012/11/05/ |
| 19:00.21 | DocScrutinizer05 | gnome-et-al-rotting-in-threes/ |
| 19:00.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | https://igurublog.wordpress.com/2012/11/05/gnome-et-al-rotting-in-threes/ |
| 19:00.27 | DocScrutinizer05 | sorry |
| 19:02.06 | DocScrutinizer05 | strange thing: I noticed this very attitude ever since I first touched Gnome |
| 19:07.11 | DocScrutinizer05 | Gnome, freedesktop, systemd, and buntkuh. They all understood the concept of "when you don't pay for it then *you* are the product" and blackhat hacker in https://xkcd.com/792/ |
| 19:09.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | aka the very simple concept of "nothing id for free, ever. Some stuff is free for you since you (are supposed to) contribute to it" |
| 19:09.41 | DocScrutinizer05 | s/ id / is / |
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| 19:13.37 | DocScrutinizer05 | and tell me: why the fsck I need bullcrap like logind on a *server*?? |
| 19:15.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | https://www.freedesktop.org/software/systemd/man/systemd-logind.html MY ASS! |
| 19:16.07 | DocScrutinizer05 | I literally want NOTHING of all that shit |
| 19:17.36 | DocScrutinizer05 | multiseat, what an anacronism |
| 19:23.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | the only reason to have logind on every damn server is the fact that systemd doesn't scale |
| 19:26.40 | DocScrutinizer05 | gor a multitude of reasons, first and foremost the incompatible APIs and the intra_systemd*_crap dependencies this creates, as well as the laziness of distro maintainers to take any care about providing configs that e.g. allow systemd but without logind, or any other arbitrary permutations |
| 19:47.10 | Wizzup | | grep -v systemd |
| 19:47.51 | TheKit | how about logind on phone? :) |
| 19:55.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | won't fly on maemo since we can't use systemd - it's incompatible to traditional use of cgroups by core system |
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| 19:56.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | maemo has its own (better) means to accomplish all that systemd does |
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