| 00:00.37 | DocScrutinizer05 | people known to break their USB receptacles when not taking care by e.g. following the procedure in this video |
| 00:01.12 | DocScrutinizer05 | vectis3_: it seems solid until it falls off the PCB :-) Doesn't mean it's not defect already |
| 00:01.38 | Wizzup | vectis3_: if you're unlucky the traces are gone |
| 00:01.46 | Wizzup | then spare parts do not help a lot |
| 00:02.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | Wizzup: >>I bought it for spare parts<< |
| 00:03.05 | Wizzup | Ah, sorry |
| 00:03.41 | DocScrutinizer05 | np :-) |
| 00:15.19 | DocScrutinizer05 | ; /msg nickserv info bencoh |
| 00:16.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | damn konversation! |
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| 06:19.37 | bencoh | DocScrutinizer05: hmmm ? :) |
| 06:19.58 | DocScrutinizer05 | sorry, accidental highlight |
| 06:20.25 | DocScrutinizer05 | I tested "scripting" in konversation |
| 06:21.07 | DocScrutinizer05 | happened to use your nick in userlist to test my whois-info quickbutton |
| 06:22.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | meanwhile I'm doing more ambitioned stuff that finally ended with somebody pointing me at https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=114237#c12 and the general shortcomings of konversation when it comes to scripting |
| 06:22.56 | povbot_ | 04Bug 114237: was not found. |
| 06:23.53 | DocScrutinizer05 | #c11 (above) is also very much to the point |
| 06:26.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | ((quickbuttons)) just if you wonder: it's defined to do /WHOIS %s,%%u%n/msg nickserv info %u%n now, %n being the trick |
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| 07:27.55 | sixwheeledbeast | Reading over what happened early is vectis3_ using 64bit OS or a USB hub? |
| 07:28.38 | sixwheeledbeast | I had similar issue using the front USB port on my desktop instead of the rear ones for example. |
| 07:30.48 | sixwheeledbeast | If the flasher is known to flash another device this will not be the case, but just a thought |
| 07:33.06 | KotCzarny | worth a try |
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| 07:50.33 | DocScrutinizer05 | sixwheeledbeast: a hub or low quality hostport/cable/whatever will usually result in lots of -101 errors in syslog |
| 07:50.59 | sixwheeledbeast | ok |
| 07:59.46 | DocScrutinizer05 | could also be -78 or whatever, though I seem to recall -101 was most common |
| 08:02.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | usb 5-1: device descriptor read/64, error -71 |
| 08:03.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | and eventually hub 5-0:5.1: unable to enumerate USB device |
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| 11:03.27 | Youbi | Hello all o/ |
| 11:05.37 | CatButts | uhllo |
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| 11:17.26 | fishbulb | how can I watch youtube on an n900? |
| 11:18.08 | KotCzarny | cutetube2 |
| 11:18.36 | fishbulb | there's a sequel? |
| 11:19.51 | fishbulb | which repo is it in? |
| 11:20.03 | KotCzarny | probably extras-devel |
| 11:20.11 | fishbulb | and it does work? |
| 11:20.31 | KotCzarny | few months ago it worked, i dont use it, so you just have to install it and check |
| 11:20.34 | fishbulb | cutetube doesn't anymore |
| 11:20.55 | KotCzarny | did i say cutetube or cutetube2? |
| 11:21.31 | bencoh | cutetube2 does work |
| 11:21.31 | fishbulb | please don't hit me! |
| 11:22.27 | bencoh | ah that reminds me marxoft killed the local videos plugin |
| 11:22.31 | bencoh | marxian* |
| 11:22.51 | KotCzarny | bencoh, why so? |
| 11:22.54 | bencoh | (well actually he didn't fully re-implement external plugin support with his new plugin system) |
| 11:23.09 | bencoh | so afaict it doesn't work thus far |
| 11:23.33 | bencoh | the thing is he's not on irc so .... |
| 11:23.45 | bencoh | (discussing that kind of stuff on TMO isn't exacctly handy) |
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| 12:17.01 | Youbi | youtube-dl does work. |
| 12:17.26 | Youbi | Itâs cli, though. You have to open yt in the web browser, get the URL, and download the video. |
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| 16:33.55 | atk | Any way to test if a physical key is working on the N900 (or does anyone have any ideas why my ctrl, fn, shift, t, down arrow and right arrow keys stopped working? |
| 16:50.21 | APic | Maybe Dirt stuck under the physical Keyboard. On my Replacement-N900 i recently received per physical Snail-Mail, some Keys are stuck because of Dirt stuck under the physical Keys. So when my current N900 will stop working (i hope never) i will have to screw it up, shake the Dirt out, and then reassemble. |
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| 18:10.05 | DocScrutinizer05 | atk: see http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_Hardware_Subsystems#Keyboard |
| 18:10.33 | atk | APic: I have taken it apart a few times now, no dirt found |
| 18:10.37 | DocScrutinizer05 | looks like your QROW4 is dead, for whatever reasons |
| 18:10.53 | atk | Yep |
| 18:10.55 | atk | hmm |
| 18:11.47 | atk | I did get a tiny amount of water on the keys on friday, it was raining |
| 18:12.42 | DocScrutinizer05 | atk: if you like (logical) puzzles, you might read my explanation about key ghosting aka rollover in http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_Hardware_Subsystems#Keyboard and maybe exploit that to determine what's actually wrong with QROW4 |
| 18:13.01 | atk | I was just reading that, indeed. |
| 18:13.05 | atk | Seems interesting. |
| 18:14.15 | atk | So there is no diode for each key? |
| 18:16.33 | DocScrutinizer05 | no, not in N900 |
| 18:16.51 | DocScrutinizer05 | no diodes at all |
| 18:18.25 | atk | Well, certainly the actual physical keys are all working fine, I can cause ghosting using the keys in row 4 |
| 18:18.27 | DocScrutinizer05 | with N-Key rollover you should be able to determine if QROW4 is disconnected from chip (broken trace) so no signal reaches chip, or if QROW4 is shorted to GND or whatever and thus will short other QROWs to GND as well with N-key rollover |
| 18:22.17 | atk | For example fn+ctrl + h gives me hj |
| 18:23.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | when pressing Shift+T+X you should see X+E when QROW4 floating (broken solder joint or trace), and you see no keypress at all (after initial settling) when QROW4 is shorted to GND |
| 18:23.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | yeah, fn+ctrl+h ->j means your QROW4 is floating |
| 18:23.51 | atk | ah, it appears there must be a broken solder joint or trace. |
| 18:23.56 | DocScrutinizer05 | yes |
| 18:23.57 | atk | Darn |
| 18:24.00 | DocScrutinizer05 | sorry |
| 18:24.27 | atk | I would need to remove the domesheet and attempt to inspect the board I presume? |
| 18:24.39 | atk | Unless it goes to an internal layer, but I can't image how that would break. |
| 18:24.45 | DocScrutinizer05 | might help, might fail |
| 18:25.01 | atk | I guess I did only pay £40 for this N900 :P |
| 18:25.17 | atk | It has lasted me a year (although I only started using it not long ago) |
| 18:25.28 | DocScrutinizer05 | odds are a ball of TPS65950 aka GAIA aka TWL4030 came loose |
| 18:25.48 | DocScrutinizer05 | or a via broke |
| 18:25.53 | atk | :( |
| 18:26.19 | atk | If it's a ball, I could test it by applying pressure to the chip. |
| 18:26.56 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://maemo.cloud-7.de/Gallery-N900-exploded/platine_01.jpeg |
| 18:27.01 | DocScrutinizer05 | yes |
| 18:27.21 | atk | It appears there are a few chips on there that are BGA chips |
| 18:27.57 | atk | Any idea which one? |
| 18:28.05 | atk | (also, most of those are under a shield) |
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| 18:29.27 | atk | Well I certainly do plan on using an N900 until the Neo900 comes, so any idea where I can get a good relatively cheap refurbished / new replacement? (I don't mind if it's more than £40, that was a deal of a lifetime I feel) |
| 18:31.27 | DocScrutinizer05 | dang, QROW4 is *not* via ESD chip Z4302, that would have been a great chance for an easy fix, one way or another |
| 18:32.03 | atk | :( |
| 18:32.39 | atk | Is the shield soldered down or is it a press fit between a shield fence thing (metal bit around the periphery) and a lid? |
| 18:32.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | check ownta,com |
| 18:32.49 | atk | It looks like the latter. |
| 18:33.10 | DocScrutinizer05 | yes, shiled can opening is a zen thing |
| 18:34.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | you need to carefully pry it open, latch by latch, with a pinpoint tiny knife or something. Takes easily 10 min per lid |
| 18:34.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | start at a corner |
| 18:34.47 | atk | 109 USD, and that comes up to around £108 after conversion + tax + paperwork |
| 18:35.01 | DocScrutinizer05 | yup |
| 18:35.15 | atk | I have some fine point tweezers, will they work? |
| 18:35.20 | DocScrutinizer05 | at least I already used ownta, they seem to be no scam |
| 18:35.46 | DocScrutinizer05 | (tweezers) if you don't mind to ruin them, yes |
| 18:35.47 | atk | Do they give any warranty? |
| 18:35.55 | atk | Ah, I'd rather not ruin them. |
| 18:36.03 | atk | I use them for doing fiddly electronics things. |
| 18:36.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | I think the ususal DOA warranty, yes |
| 18:38.05 | DocScrutinizer05 | atk: http://wstaw.org/m/2016/08/21/plasma-desktopNQ2277.png TWL5030 |
| 18:39.41 | DocScrutinizer05 | get Nokia_N900_RX-51_Schematics.pdf |
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| 18:40.33 | DocScrutinizer05 | https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&pid=sites&srcid=ZGVmYXVsdGRvbWFpbnxuaXRkcm9pZHxneDo0ZDBkZThmOGFiZThlNmU0 for example |
| 18:45.09 | atk | success! |
| 18:45.15 | atk | That really did take about 10 minutes |
| 18:45.35 | atk | But the shield looks like I haven't even touched it. |
| 18:45.57 | atk | Hmm... Is this some kind of tiered design? |
| 18:46.07 | atk | (for the big chip on the right) |
| 18:49.15 | atk | nope, no amount of light tapping or pressure appears to allow any kind of t to appear on the screen of xterm |
| 18:50.55 | atk | Well, I am certainly confused as to how this came to be. But I can guess that unfortunately there's not much I can do about it. |
| 18:51.21 | atk | DocScrutinizer05: Another question: do the refurbished N900s come with a supercap to replace the battery out of the box? |
| 18:51.29 | atk | Or will I need to replace the battery after a year too? |
| 18:53.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | I guess you should replace it right away, I'm pretty sure they didn't fix that |
| 18:54.31 | DocScrutinizer05 | I admit I didn't even test bupbat on the refurbs I got so far |
| 18:54.51 | atk | I guess I'll just remove it when it fails (I don't even really need it that much) |
| 18:54.57 | DocScrutinizer05 | no surprise since I'll kick out the mobos and fit in NeoN boards anyway |
| 18:55.09 | atk | I don't take the battery out and when I do I have the device set to receive the time from the network. |
| 18:55.22 | DocScrutinizer05 | :nod: same here |
| 18:55.49 | atk | I presume the NeoN doesn't have the issue of a leaky hard wired battery and uses a durable supercap instead/ |
| 18:56.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | yes, of course :-D |
| 18:56.31 | atk | I wonder, the N900 apparently also had some issues with balls cracking for the chip which deals with the sim card (and sim cards randomly losing connectivity) |
| 18:57.17 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://neo900.org/stuff/block-diagrams/neo900/neo900.html |
| 18:57.34 | DocScrutinizer05 | hover over "backup battery" |
| 18:57.53 | DocScrutinizer05 | atk: yes |
| 18:58.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | the dreaded No-SIM bug |
| 18:58.22 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~springfix |
| 18:58.23 | infobot | hmm... springfix is http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1243160#post1243160 and http://www.jabawok.net/?p=14 |
| 18:59.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | ((chip which deals with the sim card)) aka Modem aka BB5 aka Rapuyama and friends |
| 19:00.49 | atk | Was it a chip issue? |
| 19:00.59 | atk | Or a manufacturing issue? |
| 19:01.10 | DocScrutinizer05 | solder points snapping open is my wild guess |
| 19:01.45 | DocScrutinizer05 | manuf issue with reflow temperature profile or somesuch, which also might be culprit of several of the USB-loose issues |
| 19:02.31 | DocScrutinizer05 | or maybe not temp profile but a simple sloppy solderpase stencil print |
| 19:02.51 | DocScrutinizer05 | IOW too few solderpaste |
| 19:03.11 | atk | Have you guys done any durability tests on the USB (it has been a constant fear of mine for the N900 :P) |
| 19:03.41 | DocScrutinizer05 | I'm using several N900 since they 'were born' and never had any USB incident |
| 19:03.53 | atk | (For the Neo900) |
| 19:04.04 | DocScrutinizer05 | and I actually didn't reinforce my USB |
| 19:04.30 | DocScrutinizer05 | Neo900 will use a different design that makes it wirtually impossible for USB kack to come off |
| 19:04.46 | DocScrutinizer05 | Neo900 will use a different design that makes it virtually impossible for USB jack to come off |
| 19:04.49 | atk | Cool |
| 19:05.01 | DocScrutinizer05 | bizzword through hole |
| 19:05.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | damn, my typing sucks. lack of caffeine |
| 19:05.17 | atk | Ah, very cool. |
| 19:05.37 | atk | Hmm. |
| 19:06.33 | kerio | DocScrutinizer05: can you use a microusb cable to fling a neo900 without the musb port breaking |
| 19:06.37 | atk | I wonder, you know how USB specifies that A is for the host and B is for the device? And apparently phones which support OTG are supposed to use micro AB? |
| 19:06.47 | atk | Do phones that support OTG actually use micro AB? |
| 19:06.53 | kerio | atk: yeah but nobody ever cared about that |
| 19:06.54 | kerio | i think |
| 19:07.19 | kerio | starting from the samsung galaxy s...3? |
| 19:07.27 | atk | I've been wondering this ever since I got a device which came with a "OTG" cable for plugging it into a phone. |
| 19:07.30 | DocScrutinizer05 | atk: yes, Neo900 uses micro-AB |
| 19:07.43 | atk | the cable is B on both sides |
| 19:07.45 | kerio | which had a musb B plug - usb A port adapter |
| 19:08.11 | kerio | atk: the op pyra has an actual microusb 3 A port |
| 19:08.12 | kerio | it looks super dumb |
| 19:08.15 | atk | I wonder why the USB-IF doesn't get unnecessarily angry about it :P |
| 19:08.28 | kerio | because samsung? |
| 19:08.41 | atk | I guess |
| 19:09.31 | atk | They seem to have completely done away with the A B stuff with usb C which appears to be both without needing an AB variant. |
| 19:09.47 | atk | It probably still has an ID pin I presume. |
| 19:10.29 | atk | Although, oddly enough I have a Teensy 3.2 which supports switching between device and host mode but doesn't seem to detect if it is being used as a host with an ID pin |
| 19:10.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | fsck USB, next year they will replace mains outlets worldwide by USB-E |
| 19:10.51 | atk | I guess the ID pin isn't actually needed. |
| 19:11.11 | atk | Heh |
| 19:11.13 | DocScrutinizer05 | ;-) |
| 19:11.31 | atk | I wouldn't be surprised. |
| 19:11.41 | DocScrutinizer05 | atk: in N900 it would have been friggin mad useful if used correctly |
| 19:11.45 | atk | I also wonder if usb C will have the same issue that apple's lightning connector has |
| 19:11.51 | atk | i.e. breaking after a single use |
| 19:12.17 | DocScrutinizer05 | LOL, didn't hear that |
| 19:12.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | sounds convenient... for apple |
| 19:12.33 | atk | I know a few apple users (who complain about apple but still use it) who are always going on about the new connectors. |
| 19:12.51 | atk | No matter if you purchase from apple or not, the connectors have about a week of lifetime in them. |
| 19:13.05 | atk | sometimes you're lucky and get a month, sometimes you're unlucky and get a day. |
| 19:13.19 | DocScrutinizer05 | ouch |
| 19:13.23 | atk | I have no idea how they've engineered a design that can't be implemented in a reliable way. |
| 19:14.28 | DocScrutinizer05 | micro-USB is basically rather sturdy regarding this. Way better than mini-USB |
| 19:14.35 | atk | But I guess it was probably on purpose, I mean apple don't seem to have managed to design a laptop which doesn't have one fundamental flaw (as can be seen from louis rossman's videos) |
| 19:15.10 | DocScrutinizer05 | needs coffee |
| 19:15.15 | atk | Coffee is good |
| 19:15.25 | atk | Especially freshly ground coffee. |
| 19:15.45 | atk | With some cow extract and just enough sugar (less than half a teaspoon) to break through the bitterness. |
| 19:16.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | cow juice that is |
| 19:16.33 | atk | Brewed with hot but not boiled or boiling water. |
| 19:16.35 | *** join/#maemo Wizzup (~Wizzup@a82-161-36-93.adsl.xs4all.nl) |
| 19:16.39 | atk | Just before boil (white boil as some call it) |
| 19:16.59 | DocScrutinizer05 | wow, an expert. I'm an ignorant |
| 19:17.19 | DocScrutinizer05 | basically I was a tea person |
| 19:17.23 | atk | Or you can use an old fashioned coffee machine which manages to get the temperature perfect using the integrated pot warming water boiling water pumping design. |
| 19:17.36 | DocScrutinizer05 | switxched to coffee because... lazyness |
| 19:17.57 | dkbrz | therw when tey grow it, they sez milk and sugar is for killing the taste of bad coffee |
| 19:18.03 | atk | In fact, those coffee machines are pretty amazing: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4j4Q_YBRJEI |
| 19:19.12 | DocScrutinizer05 | dbthey also have a saying that there are two qualities of coffee they sell, the global good one and the crap for Germany where nobody cares |
| 19:19.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | dkbrz: ^^^ |
| 19:21.09 | atk | :P |
| 19:21.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | changes his mind |
| 19:22.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | prepares some 10EurCt/g fine tea instead some crappy instant coffee |
| 19:22.35 | atk | Tea can be very good too. |
| 19:22.47 | DocScrutinizer05 | also need fewer cow juice to be tasty |
| 19:22.49 | atk | It's also seems easier to get right. |
| 19:22.59 | atk | It doesn't need any cow extract! Just lemon |
| 19:23.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | basically yes |
| 19:23.17 | atk | Nobody here in the UK seems to know about tea with lemon |
| 19:23.27 | atk | Everyone seems to prefer the tea with cow extract. |
| 19:23.47 | KotCzarny | isnt that actually german invention? |
| 19:24.05 | KotCzarny | bavarian etc |
| 19:24.42 | dkbrz | DocScrutinizer05: I buy some coffee via Germany :) it's a bit of politics, but 'Estrella Negra' via aroma-zapatista.de is good :) |
| 19:26.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | yeah, some few sources here know and trade good coffee |
| 19:26.27 | atk | The black market? |
| 19:26.40 | DocScrutinizer05 | however what 99% of unwashed masses consome is the junk from production |
| 19:27.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | Eduscho, Tchibo, even Moevenpick are basically crap |
| 19:30.31 | sicelo | KotCzarny: by the way, oscp uses gstreamer for general audio playback, or only when processing videos? |
| 19:30.51 | atk | Hmm I found a 12 month warranty "grade A" n900 for £80 on ebay |
| 19:30.53 | KotCzarny | only for playing videos, when disabled it decodes audio via libav |
| 19:31.07 | atk | (I know, ebay, paypal scum) |
| 19:34.23 | atk | Lacks charger and cables |
| 19:35.38 | KotCzarny | stolen? |
| 19:35.39 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 19:36.41 | atk | I would be very sad if someone stole my N900 |
| 19:37.19 | DocScrutinizer05 | not like it would really matter, those chargers are legion and allegedly genuine Nokia are cheap |
| 19:37.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | but sounds weird for a "grade A" n900 |
| 19:38.23 | atk | DocScrutinizer05: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/361628670128 |
| 19:38.34 | DocScrutinizer05 | an AV-cable is of higher value than a cheesy USB charger |
| 19:39.02 | KotCzarny | atk, try craigslist |
| 19:39.15 | KotCzarny | and other local classifieds sites |
| 19:39.15 | atk | Does the Ownta one come with an av cable? |
| 19:41.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | atk: looks good |
| 19:41.20 | DocScrutinizer05 | (Ownta) nope |
| 19:41.23 | atk | craigslist.org -> N900 -> prebuilt pc |
| 19:41.25 | DocScrutinizer05 | not afaik |
| 19:42.23 | atk | Well, unless I can find something cheaper locally, I'll just go for that. |
| 19:42.39 | atk | If they can get it here within the week I can even collect it |
| 19:43.41 | DocScrutinizer05 | https://www.amazon.com/Nokia-Video-Video-Out-Cable-CA-75U/dp/B0026H9HN6 waaay too expensive, you can find cheaper ones though. And you need only one or two anyway |
| 19:44.33 | atk | Hmm, apparently this craigslist thing has a "prohibited button" which lets random people on the internet irreversibly flag a posting for deletion. |
| 19:44.47 | atk | So I may have irreversibly flagged this poor guy's listing for deletion. |
| 19:44.53 | atk | I have no idea why such a feature exists. |
| 19:45.07 | DocScrutinizer05 | https://www.amazon.com/HDE-3-5mm-Composite-Audio-Video/dp/B00GO4EPKC/ref=pd_sim_sbs_107_10 |
| 19:46.15 | *** join/#maemo mp107 (~mp107@109.125.220.120) |
| 19:46.29 | KotCzarny | atk, they still check it before deletion i think |
| 19:46.51 | atk | It seems like even if the post doesn't break guidelines, you have to repost it :P |
| 19:47.07 | atk | I don't know, I see buttons on a website and I always have an urge to click them all. |
| 19:47.32 | KotCzarny | dangerous habit |
| 19:47.51 | atk | Not at all. |
| 19:48.27 | atk | What are other "craigslist" style websites for the UK? |
| 19:48.33 | atk | ah, that was it "gumtree" |
| 19:48.55 | KotCzarny | yeah |
| 19:49.57 | atk | https://www.gumtree.com/p/nokia/nokia-n900-phone-linux-phone/1184138244 |
| 19:50.21 | KotCzarny | good deal if true |
| 19:50.49 | atk | Manchester though |
| 19:50.51 | atk | I don't have a car |
| 19:50.56 | KotCzarny | but i always suspect 'no charger no cable' to be stolen goods |
| 19:50.59 | atk | The bus ticket to get there would cost more than the phone |
| 19:51.06 | KotCzarny | up to you |
| 19:51.27 | atk | It comes with the AV cable though :PO |
| 19:51.39 | KotCzarny | and a box |
| 19:51.43 | atk | AV cable and 2 BL-5J |
| 19:51.48 | KotCzarny | and a box |
| 19:51.49 | KotCzarny | ;) |
| 19:51.55 | DocScrutinizer05 | (AV cable) however watch out! AHS vs normal pinout https://www.amazon.com/review/R1E5TR0T16E6YG/ref=cm_cr_dp_title?ie=UTF8&ASIN=B00GO4EPKC&channel=detail-glance&nodeID=172282&store=electronics |
| 19:53.51 | KotCzarny | atk, you might search for few more classifieds sites |
| 19:54.09 | atk | I have no experience with these :P |
| 19:54.41 | KotCzarny | google? |
| 19:54.51 | KotCzarny | try: nokia n900 <your city> |
| 19:55.17 | atk | (Actually, I would need to take a train to get to manchester, that would definitely end up costing at least as much as I paid for my current N900 |
| 19:55.57 | atk | Hmm, nope (google doesn't usually update that fast anyway) |
| 19:55.58 | DocScrutinizer05 | don't you have parcels in UK? |
| 19:56.11 | atk | Nope |
| 19:56.15 | atk | :P |
| 19:56.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | o.O |
| 19:56.29 | atk | (of course we do |
| 19:56.30 | KotCzarny | google updates FAST |
| 19:56.35 | KotCzarny | you would be surprised |
| 19:56.53 | *** join/#maemo Smily (~SmilzOrg@93-103-85-111.dynamic.t-2.net) |
| 19:57.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | I think for GBP10 plus a 5 for parcel shipping you can't go wrong |
| 19:58.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | I need to test a script ;-) |
| 19:58.07 | atk | Gumtree appears to insist that shipping items is a bad idea though. |
| 19:58.08 | *** mode/#maemo [+o DocScrutinizer05] by ChanServ |
| 19:58.12 | *** kick/#maemo [DocScrutinizer05!~saturn@openmoko/engineers/joerg] by DocScrutinizer05 (T900: "User terminated!") |
| 19:58.21 | *** join/#maemo geaaru (~geaaru@host34-150-dynamic.2-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 19:58.36 | *** join/#maemo DocScrutinizer05 (~saturn@openmoko/engineers/joerg) |
| 19:58.52 | KotCzarny | yeah, you can get a potato |
| 19:58.52 | KotCzarny | ;) |
| 19:59.15 | KotCzarny | and you wouldnt have anything to do about it |
| 19:59.25 | atk | Of course |
| 20:00.14 | KotCzarny | s/wouldnt have/couldnt do/ |
| 20:00.28 | KotCzarny | uh. but you know what i mean |
| 20:00.31 | atk | That makes less sense. |
| 20:00.34 | DocScrutinizer05 | nfc how that craigslist stuff works, but can't you contact seller, possibly *after* purchase? |
| 20:01.04 | KotCzarny | also, those classifieds are all about dealing locally |
| 20:01.09 | atk | I think what black cat means is that if the seller decides to take your money and run, you can't do much. |
| 20:01.10 | KotCzarny | face to face |
| 20:01.50 | KotCzarny | which city you are in? |
| 20:01.51 | atk | I have always wondered about your name KotCzarny, even in polish CzarnyKot is more common than KotCzarny. |
| 20:01.55 | DocScrutinizer05 | whatever... |
| 20:01.57 | atk | Nottingham |
| 20:02.00 | DocScrutinizer05 | sips his tea |
| 20:02.25 | atk | (It's a more common way of saying black cat, I mean) |
| 20:03.17 | atk | (Of course, since Polish is.... Polish... "Kot Czarny" is still perfectly ok.) |
| 20:03.20 | DocScrutinizer05 | black cat? ooh |
| 20:03.37 | atk | It's what Kot Czarny means in polish. |
| 20:04.27 | KotCzarny | try https://www.google.pl/#hl=en&q=%22Nottingham%22+classifieds |
| 20:05.29 | atk | Why is it called a "classified" ad? |
| 20:06.00 | KotCzarny | who knows, english is my second language |
| 20:06.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | (OT) >>Others will have to wait until we fix bug #114119<< (https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=114237#c3) *awesome* |
| 20:06.04 | povbot_ | 04Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/114119 was not found. |
| 20:06.05 | povbot_ | 04Bug 114237: was not found. |
| 20:06.10 | KotCzarny | try m-w.com for definitions |
| 20:06.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | povbot_: shut up! |
| 20:06.18 | povbot_ | DocScrutinizer05: Error: "shut" is not a valid command. |
| 20:07.17 | DocScrutinizer05 | ponders to pester mgedmin to fix this useless function |
| 20:08.45 | DocScrutinizer05 | 'classified' like 'XXX rated' ;-P |
| 20:09.48 | DocScrutinizer05 | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Classified_advertising |
| 20:10.35 | atk | ah, classified in the "sorted into classifications" sense |
| 20:10.39 | atk | I thought that might be the case |
| 20:14.33 | DocScrutinizer05 | product group classifications? |
| 20:14.57 | atk | service classifications too |
| 20:15.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | nfc |
| 20:16.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | maybe it doesn't matter anymore. Prolly a term that meanwhile lost its original meaning and gained a new unique one |
| 20:17.03 | atk | KotCzarny: Well, none of the ones on the first page have any N900 listings |
| 20:17.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | when you dig deep enough you will find more than 50% of words are of this type |
| 20:17.42 | DocScrutinizer05 | chauvinism |
| 20:18.31 | KotCzarny | atk, browsing ads is similar to hunting, you have to spend some time before you get your prize |
| 20:18.46 | KotCzarny | might take some time if game is alredy rare :P |
| 20:18.48 | DocScrutinizer05 | lost its meaning in common usage, rather used as an almost synonym to sexism |
| 20:19.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | there are lost more |
| 20:19.58 | dkbrz | hmm... maybe someone is aware of existing rx51-us console keymaps which would resemble standard maemo keyboard behaviour with toggless stickiness? looks like everybody are using https://raw.githubusercontent.com/archlinuxarm-n900/n900-keymaps/master/rx51_us.map |
| 20:20.28 | DocScrutinizer05 | hmm? |
| 20:20.59 | dkbrz | it's difficult to type when you need several fingers :) |
| 20:21.02 | *** join/#maemo andril (~andril@c-66-229-28-40.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) |
| 20:21.17 | atk | KotCzarny: Can I pay you £10 to hunt for me? :P |
| 20:21.43 | KotCzarny | atk, n900 is PLENTY in .pl usually priced between 10 and 20 quids |
| 20:21.53 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~listvalues vi.*kbd |
| 20:22.01 | atk | Well, hmm, I guess I am visiting poland in a few weeks. |
| 20:22.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~listvalues vi*kbd |
| 20:22.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~awesome-keymap |
| 20:22.16 | infobot | methinks awesome-keymap is http://wiki.maemo.org/Remapping_keyboard/user_vis_awesome_kbdmapping |
| 20:22.23 | atk | Maybe I can hold out with the softkeyboard |
| 20:22.35 | atk | throws up at the thought of softkeys) |
| 20:23.15 | dkbrz | DocScrutinizer05: it's about using it outside maemo - like debian900 or rescueOS-like on pure console tty, without x |
| 20:23.46 | KotCzarny | grab some cheapo bt kb? |
| 20:24.03 | atk | Although, when I am going to Poland I will be going to the middle of nowhere effectively. |
| 20:24.26 | dkbrz | KotCzarny: I use n900 because of the keyboard :)) |
| 20:24.27 | atk | Not like Warszawa or Bydgoszcz or somewhere big, but a small place near EÅk |
| 20:24.37 | KotCzarny | dkbrz, sorry, that was meant to atk ;) |
| 20:24.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://wiki.maemo.org/Remapping_keyboard |
| 20:24.54 | KotCzarny | atk, you will still go through airport in warsaw |
| 20:25.18 | KotCzarny | plan your journey before and contact the potential seller, or buy via parcel |
| 20:25.33 | atk | Well, apparently not, apparently there's an airport in Olsztyn |
| 20:25.37 | KotCzarny | or if you'll be staying at friends/family place make them do the deal |
| 20:25.39 | atk | Flights from london apparently can get there |
| 20:26.01 | atk | Ah, buy via parcel, yes, excellent idea |
| 20:26.51 | atk | Any reliable place to buy from which can get me a good deal? (good condition and all, don't care if there's a battery or not, recently bought a procell replacement) |
| 20:27.28 | KotCzarny | olx.pl (but requires knowing language) |
| 20:27.33 | KotCzarny | and allegro.pl |
| 20:27.43 | atk | I know polish |
| 20:29.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | dkbrz: ((standard maemo keyboard behaviour with toggless stickiness)) please elaborate |
| 20:29.23 | atk | "Sprzedam lub zamieniÄ telefon Nokia N900!" - "Will sell or exchange Nokia N900 phone!" exchange?? |
| 20:29.35 | atk | People exchange phones? |
| 20:29.51 | DocScrutinizer05 | yep, for chainsaws |
| 20:29.57 | atk | 210 pln is already very cheap |
| 20:30.11 | KotCzarny | nah, go for ~100pln range |
| 20:30.23 | KotCzarny | you can get a deal |
| 20:30.55 | DocScrutinizer05 | tries to decode "toggless stickiness" |
| 20:31.03 | atk | All I actually need is a new mainboard |
| 20:31.40 | KotCzarny | look for bad screen ones, they show up sometimes |
| 20:31.46 | KotCzarny | you have few weeks |
| 20:34.48 | dkbrz | DocScrutinizer05: In Maemo whan I press blie arrow with one finger, and release it, and then press T/5 key, I get '5'. In console i need to press blue arrow and T simultaneoulsy to get '5'. |
| 20:35.19 | dkbrz | toggle - next key is 5. sticky - all keys are 5 |
| 20:36.13 | *** part/#maemo Kooda (~Kooda@natsu.upyum.com) |
| 20:36.21 | DocScrutinizer05 | dbalas that's a maemo closed blob doing that |
| 20:36.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | dkbrz: dang your nick puzzles me |
| 20:36.52 | DocScrutinizer05 | :-) |
| 20:37.46 | dkbrz | DocScrutinizer05: it's russian for porcupine :) |
| 20:38.37 | *** join/#maemo ilmanowar (2506f719@gateway/web/freenode/ip.37.6.247.25) |
| 20:38.44 | DocScrutinizer05 | aaah russian, that explains why the char sequences are just breaking my fingers (and tongue if I'd try to speak it) |
| 20:39.02 | dkbrz | DocScrutinizer05: ok then' i'll try to reimplement it via standard means and put it on github if ok. just being lazy, hoping someone already did it for me :( |
| 20:39.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | sure ok :-D |
| 20:39.41 | DocScrutinizer05 | alas nobody dared to touch that stuff so far, not even jonwil |
| 20:39.53 | DocScrutinizer05 | weird |
| 20:42.32 | *** join/#maemo RedW (~redw@89-76-164-87.dynamic.chello.pl) |
| 20:47.24 | *** join/#maemo ilmanowar1 (~ilmanowar@adsl-25.37.6.247.tellas.gr) |
| 20:55.45 | *** join/#maemo lxp (~lxp@unaffiliated/lxp) |
| 20:56.42 | *** join/#maemo fishbulb (~fishbulb@unaffiliated/fishbulb) |
| 20:57.15 | atk | http://olx.pl/oferta/malowanie-obudowy-telefonu-np-nokia-n900-CID619-IDc3FSd.html#a7ef6ca056 |
| 20:57.30 | fishbulb | does anyone have a confirmed working version of fmms |
| 20:57.35 | atk | I am not sure about orange, but apparently the N900 is so popular in poland that people offer to paint it. |
| 20:58.05 | fishbulb | anything can be painted :) |
| 20:58.28 | dkbrz | omg. orange. |
| 20:59.47 | atk | fishbulb: oh yes, but this ad is specifically about the N900 :P |
| 20:59.48 | dkbrz | i've seen it before. in 'Hackers' movie. where zero-cool paints his keyboard in camouflage... |
| 21:00.49 | fishbulb | dkbrz, when you could only get mostly beige computer shit, that's what you had to do. we used vinyl dye on monitors and stuff. CRT. |
| 21:01.07 | fishbulb | the n900 isn't popular anywhere |
| 21:01.45 | dkbrz | http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_WVU7t3YRWRk/Slyv02gQq-I/AAAAAAAAAHk/oh66JDZ6VtI/s400/vlcsnap-522755.png |
| 21:02.45 | fishbulb | I neve rwatched that movie and I probably never will |
| 21:03.35 | dkbrz | fishbulb: that's why now I usually paint consumer electronics beige |
| 21:03.47 | atk | hahaha |
| 21:04.03 | atk | you pain them beige to bring back the memories? |
| 21:04.40 | dkbrz | atk: i will not elaborate on religious topics :P |
| 21:06.17 | dkbrz | fishbulb: it's a good movie. especially at the end, when cast titles start, you can compare them with early phrack magazine |
| 21:06.54 | fishbulb | I grew up somewhere there was nothing TO hack |
| 21:07.16 | dkbrz | oh.. Soviet Union? |
| 21:07.59 | fishbulb | but I built computers, because the internet basically didn't exist, and my first computer was pretty cool, but I never gave a fuck about hacking, I liken it to sniffing someone elses underwear |
| 21:08.27 | fishbulb | nah I mean there were BBS's and whatever, the internet cost a fortune and there was nothing on it. |
| 21:08.46 | KotCzarny | there is hacking, and there is cracking |
| 21:09.02 | KotCzarny | hacking is fiddling with something until it works (this or that way) |
| 21:09.10 | KotCzarny | cracking is about doing something illegal |
| 21:09.11 | fishbulb | I like hardware hacking |
| 21:09.48 | dkbrz | fishbulb: c'mon, real men allways remember times wher men were men and were soldering their computers themselves. mine was illegal copy of Sinclair ZX Spectrum |
| 21:10.24 | fishbulb | ok then, I liken cracking to breaking into someone's house then bragging about how they only had this transparent stuff between the outside and the inside and all it took was a rock |
| 21:11.20 | fishbulb | dkbrz, I mean if you want to build a computer now, it's almost like lego, if you wanted to build a computer back when everything was beige, you basically didn't |
| 21:11.39 | fishbulb | the internet almost didn't exist and was barely worth using |
| 21:12.30 | fishbulb | I mean like 20 years ago, I was a young teenager and the only way I could get a computer was by building it, but you couldn't just google it |
| 21:12.33 | atk | "back when everything was beige" |
| 21:12.41 | atk | you make it sound like the beige was the cause of the problem :P |
| 21:12.47 | fishbulb | 20 years ago |
| 21:13.59 | dkbrz | fishbulb: I did. and all guys in our yard. had to learn how to solder a bit.. buy parts on a black market... retype firmware machine codes from paper magazine... download software fia FM radio night broadcasts.. renting professional equipment for debugging from state enterprice employees wanting to make couple of extra bucks |
| 21:14.01 | fishbulb | there was hardly any information, people didn't really build their own computers. you went to a computer store and bought one for about 2 or 3 grand, and it was actually cheaper to build one |
| 21:14.36 | fishbulb | I just built computers for other people for slightly cheaper than the stores sold them for |
| 21:15.07 | dkbrz | fishbulb: 'Soviet Union' part was not a joke :))) |
| 21:15.18 | fishbulb | it was new zealand, so it was pretty isolted |
| 21:15.52 | fishbulb | there was still all the same stuff, but the internet was expensive, bulletin boards were alright |
| 21:16.39 | fishbulb | but we mostly did normal stuff outside, becuase none of us had money |
| 21:17.51 | atk | I spent a lot of my childhood outside, can confirm, nobody had money, outside was more interesting than inside. |
| 21:18.18 | KotCzarny | fishbulb, you can now get sbc board (4x1.2ghz arm, 2gb ram, hdmi, 40pin gpio etc) cheap and have fun building devices |
| 21:18.32 | KotCzarny | and it can be as small as matchbox |
| 21:20.39 | dkbrz | KotCzarny: tra'ts cool. when my son asks me to buy him a computer, i'm not going to be cruel and offer him soldering iron, but buy him one of these :) |
| 21:21.29 | KotCzarny | yeah, and grab some sensors/motors/relays |
| 21:21.39 | KotCzarny | and order him to make something useful ;) |
| 21:23.30 | dkbrz | KotCzarny: yea, kids: 'if you want to have an internet, you must break the encryption' |
| 21:24.35 | KotCzarny | bad thing docs/google arent available without net ;) |
| 21:26.15 | dkbrz | you can allways knock to father's room and have a nice bedtime discussion on mitm attack vectors |
| 21:28.35 | dkbrz | there are also plenty of old paper books and blueprinte there |
| 21:33.28 | vectis3_ | DocScrutinizer05: Hi, I have done a continuity test on the usb port of this n900, using this as a guide: http://talk.maemo.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=28426&stc=1&d=1347051101 I'm getting continuity on all four points. Would it be reasonable of me to assume that this indicates a problem elsewhere with this board? |
| 21:35.43 | *** join/#maemo xes (~xes@unaffiliated/xes) |
| 21:44.21 | fishbulb | KotCzarny, I don't like the raspi and etc boards |
| 21:44.48 | DocScrutinizer05 | vectis3_: yes |
| 21:45.06 | fishbulb | right tool for right job, the digital gpio pins have never been very useful, I got one, soldered a 16x2 to it, and it was like 5 things that weren't very useful now it's gathering dust |
| 21:46.08 | KotCzarny | i made me a player/router/server out from one. ~2W power usage. pretty impressive comparing to 20-60 of the x86 |
| 21:46.10 | fishbulb | arduino projects end up being more useful and fun. except I would never all C fun |
| 21:46.44 | fishbulb | well if it's a job that might use a crappy old pc, then it's perfect |
| 21:46.45 | DocScrutinizer05 | vectis3_: though take care to actually probe <1Ohm |
| 21:47.18 | vectis3_ | DocScrutinizer05: ok, thankyou. That saves me wasting time and effort trying to solder something that I can barely see. |
| 21:47.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | sure thing :) |
| 21:48.29 | DocScrutinizer05 | (1Ohm is right from my rear, might be 2 or 3) |
| 21:49.29 | DocScrutinizer05 | check schematics |
| 21:50.36 | DocScrutinizer05 | https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&pid=sites&srcid=ZGVmYXVsdGRvbWFpbnxuaXRkcm9pZHxneDo0ZDBkZThmOGFiZThlNmU0 |
| 21:51.38 | DocScrutinizer05 | next suspect in my book is PHY chip |
| 21:53.20 | DocScrutinizer05 | aka "HS USB transceiver" |
| 21:54.13 | DocScrutinizer05 | or a fried and shorted V5301 OVP component |
| 21:55.31 | DocScrutinizer05 | s/OVP/ESD/ |
| 21:57.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | you may want to make sure there's no short from D+/- to GND |
| 21:58.37 | vectis3_ | Didn't find any short. |
| 22:00.52 | DocScrutinizer05 | thne it's PHY, or CPU |
| 22:01.32 | vectis3_ | Safe to say that it's u/s then? |
| 22:01.54 | fishbulb | is the fmms person here? |
| 22:02.07 | DocScrutinizer05 | u/s? |
| 22:02.13 | fishbulb | is there a version that works with the latest cssu stable |
| 22:02.15 | *** join/#maemo Venusaur (~wdwrwf@wikipedia/Antonio-Lopez) |
| 22:02.21 | DocScrutinizer05 | fmms = frals |
| 22:02.28 | vectis3_ | UnServiceable |
| 22:02.41 | DocScrutinizer05 | yes, unless you swap PHY 1707 |
| 22:03.03 | vectis3_ | Ok, thanks again. |
| 22:03.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | which possibly is a nasty task, since 1704 is common, 1707 not |
| 22:03.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | or was it the other way around? |
| 22:04.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_Hardware_USB_PHY |
| 22:05.50 | fishbulb | is there a version of FMMS that works with cssu stable? |
| 22:08.07 | DocScrutinizer05 | FMMS (like every other app) works with CSSU like it does with stock maemo |
| 22:08.30 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~cssu |
| 22:08.30 | infobot | extra, extra, read all about it, cssu is http://wiki.maemo.org/Community_SSU, or (Community Seamless Software Update) |
| 22:10.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | >>So this CSSU is the recommended update method for Maemo 5 Fremantle. It's **not a new version of maemo distribution**.<< |
| 22:12.46 | DocScrutinizer05 | when you *really* (really REALLY! verified and checked) found an app that *works* under stock maemo but doesn't under CSSU updated stick maemo, then that's an issue to report to CSSU team, NOT to the app maintainer |
| 22:13.25 | DocScrutinizer05 | s/stick/stock/ |
| 22:13.30 | fishbulb | a version: that works |
| 22:14.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | does this make any sense? |
| 22:15.27 | DocScrutinizer05 | when I expand you rpost that looks like >>is there a FMMS version that works?<< which is a weird question |
| 22:17.48 | fishbulb | Awesome and useful answer |
| 22:18.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~question |
| 22:18.02 | infobot | [question] If you have a question and want people to give useful answers, make sure you have read this first: http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html |
| 22:18.21 | fishbulb | if you have an answer that's just bitching about the question, then fuck off? |
| 22:18.33 | *** mode/#maemo [+o DocScrutinizer05] by ChanServ |
| 22:18.37 | *** kick/#maemo [fishbulb!~saturn@openmoko/engineers/joerg] by DocScrutinizer05 (T900: "User terminated!") |
| 22:18.39 | *** mode/#maemo [-o DocScrutinizer05] by ChanServ |
| 22:25.01 | DocScrutinizer05 | I wish he would accept advice and actually *read* http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html |
| 22:33.11 | DocScrutinizer05 | >>In the world of hackers, the kind of answers you get to your technical questions depends as much on the way you ask the questions as on the difficulty of developing the answer. This guide will teach you how to ask questions in a way more likely to get you a satisfactory answer.<< |
| 22:35.28 | DocScrutinizer05 | maybe actually not helpful to people like fishbulb who think the question is always fine and when they don't get the answer they expected they are entitled to bitching and swearing at those who gave the "wrong answer" |
| 22:37.58 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~literal question |
| 22:37.58 | infobot | "question" is "If you have a question and want people to give useful answers, make sure you have read this first: http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html" |
| 22:38.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~question is also >>In the world of hackers, the kind of answers you get to your technical questions depends as much on the way you ask the questions as on the difficulty of developing the answer. This guide will teach you how to ask questions in a way more likely to get you a satisfactory answer.<< |
| 22:38.23 | infobot | ACTION grabs is by arms and slams them into a chair and starts questioning is about also >>In the world of hackers, the kind of answers you get to your technical questions depends as much on the way you ask the questions as on the difficulty of developing the answer. This guide will teach you how to ask questions in a way more likely to get you a satisfactory answer.<<. |
| 22:38.47 | DocScrutinizer05 | stupid bot |
| 22:40.59 | DocScrutinizer05 | infobot: no, question is f you have a question and want people to give useful answers, make sure you have read this first: http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html - >In the world of hackers, the kind of answers you get to your technical questions depends as much on the way you ask the questions as on the difficulty of developing the answer. This guide will teach you how to ask questions in a way more likely to get you a |
| 22:40.59 | infobot | okay, DocScrutinizer05 |
| 22:41.00 | DocScrutinizer05 | satisfactory answer.<< |
| 22:41.06 | DocScrutinizer05 | fsck |
| 22:45.30 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~question |
| 22:45.30 | infobot | rumour has it, question is if you have a question and want people to give useful answers, make sure you have read this first: http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html >>This guide will teach you how to ask questions in a way more likely to get you a satisfactory answer.<< |
| 23:25.39 | *** join/#maemo Oksana (~chatzilla@Maemo/community/ex-council/Wikiwide) |
