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| 09:34.55 | Vajb | hmm screen brightness applet didn't fix problem with chess |
| 09:35.20 | Vajb | after some time without doing anything chess jumps back to start screen |
| 09:35.40 | Vajb | so there is something more there than just screen time |
| 09:35.58 | Vajb | i suppose it is closed and wont fix? |
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| 10:19.57 | Vajb | ok. So chess follows screen saver time, but even if screen saver is disabled from brightness applet chess still goes by last know screen saver setting. |
| 10:20.24 | KotCzarny | maybe it has its own screen saver? |
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| 10:25.28 | Vajb | could be, but it still respects user set screen saver |
| 10:25.44 | Vajb | if i set two minutes it stays two minutes |
| 10:26.02 | KotCzarny | hmm, just compile xgnuchess ? |
| 10:26.27 | KotCzarny | x/xgnuchess/xboard/ |
| 10:26.32 | KotCzarny | s/xgnuchess/xboard/ |
| 10:27.42 | Vajb | i guess magic happens in file osso_chess.so or something |
| 10:28.18 | Vajb | there was also dbus com.nokia.osso_chess but that didn't reveal anything |
| 10:28.31 | bencoh | Vajb: dbus monitor |
| 10:28.51 | Vajb | also found few ggonf settings but that was for level settings etc |
| 10:29.12 | Vajb | i ran mdbus2 against it but no joy |
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| 11:17.37 | sixwheeledbeast^ | ~closed |
| 11:17.37 | infobot | it has been said that closed is http://wiki.maemo.org/Why_the_closed_packages or https://wiki.maemo.org/Fremantle_closed_packages, or http://elinux.org/N900 |
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| 11:40.56 | Vajb | so chess should be os |
| 11:41.05 | KotCzarny | um? |
| 11:42.01 | Vajb | second link |
| 11:42.12 | KotCzarny | sorry, my isp f*cked up bigtime |
| 11:42.32 | KotCzarny | my net is not stable, missed almost every message |
| 11:43.31 | Vajb | ah |
| 11:43.40 | Vajb | ~closed |
| 11:43.40 | infobot | closed is, like, http://wiki.maemo.org/Why_the_closed_packages or https://wiki.maemo.org/Fremantle_closed_packages, or http://elinux.org/N900 |
| 11:44.17 | Vajb | second link shows that osso-graphics-game-chess has opensource alternative or something like that |
| 11:44.31 | KotCzarny | xboard is a gui for gnuchess |
| 11:44.46 | Vajb | gonna investigate better when i get to bigger screen |
| 11:48.00 | KotCzarny | i've used it for a long time (when i was playing online chess) |
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| 11:49.04 | KotCzarny | i think it should be playable on 800x480 |
| 11:49.48 | Vajb | i see |
| 11:50.53 | Vajb | actually i gave up with osso chess for quite some time and practised with my old travel chess computer and now i game back to osso. |
| 11:51.07 | Vajb | still got beaten tho |
| 11:51.19 | Vajb | but managed to stretch it to 46 moves |
| 11:51.27 | Vajb | pathetic, yes i know |
| 11:51.44 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 11:52.25 | Vajb | gonna practise some more weeks and make another try |
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| 18:55.03 | Sicelo | had to go back to twitter again ... any known working client for N900? |
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| 19:29.47 | ceene | i tried a couple that didn't work :/ |
| 19:29.53 | ceene | but i don't remember the names, sorry |
| 19:41.27 | Sicelo | :) |
| 19:41.56 | Sicelo | do you think we'll still be able to use Yappari in 2017? |
| 19:42.19 | ceene | doesn't look like it, at least for the moment |
| 19:42.27 | Sicelo | yeah |
| 19:42.28 | ceene | i was about to port yappari to use coderus' code |
| 19:42.34 | ceene | but his is as S40 as mine |
| 19:43.10 | L29Ah | S40? |
| 19:43.26 | ceene | so i got disheartened about that as well, so for now no textsecure either |
| 19:43.32 | Sicelo | L29Ah: nokia feature phone |
| 19:44.01 | ceene | L29Ah: yappari fakes being a nokia s40 |
| 19:44.15 | ceene | my sister in law had one of them |
| 19:44.20 | ceene | and it's pretty cool in fact |
| 19:44.33 | ceene | it has wifi, SIP |
| 19:45.07 | ceene | pretty nice for an almost dumb phone |
| 19:45.22 | ceene | probably it does 90% of what 90% people use |
| 19:46.07 | bencoh | ceene: have you talked to coderus about that? |
| 19:46.29 | ceene | bencoh: not yet |
| 19:46.39 | bencoh | well, maybe you should :) |
| 19:46.42 | ceene | i'm quite bored of yappari and all of this, to be honest |
| 19:46.53 | ceene | yep |
| 19:46.55 | bencoh | yeah I kinda understand it |
| 19:48.10 | ceene | i had lots of ideas and objectives, but when i get down to the code... just the idea of updating current code to libwa api looks like a draining task |
| 19:48.24 | bencoh | I'm afraid quite a significant amount of maemo users have been able to stick to n900 because of it, though |
| 19:48.28 | bencoh | so that'd be quite sad |
| 19:48.43 | ceene | yep |
| 19:48.56 | bencoh | ceene: dont sailfish have an official client? |
| 19:49.07 | bencoh | are they gonna stop support for that one too? |
| 19:49.08 | ceene | they've all been lucky that once scorpius stopped mainting yappari i took over |
| 19:49.33 | ceene | official client? no, either coderus' or android's |
| 19:49.35 | bencoh | indeed |
| 19:49.37 | Sicelo | sailfish? i think they are in trouble like the resot of us :) |
| 19:49.41 | bencoh | ah |
| 19:49.50 | bencoh | what about windows phone? |
| 19:50.10 | ceene | they do have an official client |
| 19:50.28 | bencoh | cant we just identify as one? |
| 19:50.47 | ceene | i guess, or as an android |
| 19:50.59 | bencoh | yeah, that one too |
| 19:51.05 | ceene | but i assume the protocol is gonna have big changes on them |
| 19:51.09 | bencoh | maybe |
| 19:51.16 | ceene | also, one cool thing about s40 was that it was written on java |
| 19:51.20 | ceene | so we could just decompile it |
| 19:51.39 | ceene | and look at an obfuscated version of the code, which was enough to understand the protocol |
| 19:52.02 | bencoh | that should probably still be possible with the android version (?) |
| 19:52.20 | ceene | as far as i know, the apk includes a few .so libraries |
| 19:52.26 | ceene | in which the protocol is implemented |
| 19:52.33 | ceene | so they are not as easily looked at as the java version |
| 19:53.14 | bencoh | it works on x86 as well |
| 19:53.25 | ceene | yes, they attach .so versions for several processors |
| 19:53.28 | bencoh | ah |
| 19:53.51 | ceene | i guess the yowsup team will be able to continue their development |
| 19:54.03 | ceene | i think they're at least a handful of quite competent developers |
| 19:54.13 | ceene | they implemented textsecure even before whatsapp did :) |
| 19:55.04 | bencoh | if they can stay in the game "we" should be able to follow their work :) |
| 19:55.30 | ceene | i think so |
| 19:55.41 | ceene | if only yappari had a competent developer too... :) |
| 19:55.55 | bencoh | you dont look that incompetent :p |
| 19:56.05 | ceene | because it's all done |
| 19:56.08 | ceene | i don't really understand c++ |
| 19:56.10 | ceene | nor qt |
| 19:56.23 | ceene | i'm a pure c coder |
| 19:56.37 | ceene | all these slots and signals just drive me mad |
| 19:57.04 | ceene | it reminds me of when i started to learn how to code, it was on visual basic |
| 19:57.46 | ceene | nah, a passionate coder would be now more useful than a competent one |
| 19:58.16 | ceene | or someone to finally make an open source android-apps-running-thingy |
| 19:58.32 | ceene | i don't quite get why that's so difficult to develop |
| 19:59.03 | Sicelo | there was apkenv by thp .. don't know what happened :( |
| 19:59.14 | bencoh | ceene: well, I guess you could write a pure C lib and find a GUI dev |
| 19:59.26 | bencoh | I'm a pure C dev as well (and low-level, at that) |
| 19:59.28 | ceene | Sicelo: apkenv isn't really an android app running thingy |
| 19:59.50 | ceene | although, to be honest, that'd be the thing that could be used for whatsapp |
| 20:00.16 | ceene | all it does is substitute the java parts (which you have to write) and invoke functions from a .so file |
| 20:00.19 | ceene | that's why it runs games |
| 20:00.31 | ceene | most games are real binaries in order to gain performance |
| 20:00.43 | ceene | bencoh: i could do so many things... :P |
| 20:01.11 | Sicelo | ah, i see. never could get it up and running in the first place, haha |
| 20:01.24 | ceene | but in the end it's all very exhausting, and the benefits aren't that much clear to me now |
| 20:01.30 | ceene | we're just buying time |
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| 20:02.52 | ceene | i was able to run world of goo |
| 20:02.55 | ceene | it's quite fun |
| 20:03.03 | ceene | and pretty |
| 20:03.39 | ceene | and the soundtrack is excellent |
| 20:10.56 | ceene | maintainer of yowsup received a cease and desis letter from whatsapp |
| 20:11.04 | ceene | didn't seem to bother anyone |
| 20:11.09 | ceene | but they know for sure it exists |
| 20:12.12 | bencoh | well, in Europe REing is legal for interoperability purposes |
| 20:12.34 | ceene | yeah, i wouldn't give a damn either if they threatened me |
| 20:12.36 | bencoh | even when working around DRMs |
| 20:13.49 | ceene | but it's reasonable to believe that once they stop supporting s40 they'll try pretty hard to stop us from continuing |
| 20:13.56 | ceene | as they won't have to support those old devices |
| 20:14.18 | ceene | they can do more complex things on android/iphones/windows devices |
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| 20:17.44 | ceene | https://github.com/davidgfnet/whatsapp-purple |
| 20:17.59 | ceene | this is also quite active, it seems |
| 20:18.04 | ceene | and also implements textsecure |
| 20:18.26 | ceene | or will do soon |
| 20:21.32 | ceene | maybe it'd be good to transform yappari to a libpurple gui |
| 20:22.04 | ceene | or see if there's libpurple support for telepathy |
| 20:24.08 | ceene | telepathy-haze |
| 20:24.15 | ceene | <PROTECTED> |
| 20:24.15 | ceene | <PROTECTED> |
| 20:24.15 | ceene | <PROTECTED> |
| 20:26.34 | bencoh | ceene: see the telegram thread |
| 20:26.43 | bencoh | (especially toward the end) |
| 20:27.41 | ceene | there's some primitive gui? |
| 20:28.39 | ceene | there's already a telegram libpurple for maemo |
| 20:28.58 | ceene | i think it'd be feasible to integrate that with telepathy |
| 20:29.04 | bencoh | yeah, but we can't use too recent libpurple (or haze) because of glib version issues |
| 20:29.09 | ceene | oh :( |
| 20:29.20 | bencoh | exactly |
| 20:30.41 | ceene | we should get in contact with musk and convince him to use maemo on his tesla cars |
| 20:30.51 | ceene | so he contracts a handful of people to update all of this for us :) |
| 20:31.45 | ceene | i can't even convince people to switch to telegram because we don't have a full on client either |
| 20:31.53 | ceene | so we really don't have a nice alternative |
| 20:36.11 | ceene | https://np.reddit.com/r/Android/comments/496sn3/lets_clear_up_the_confusion_regarding_storage_in/ |
| 20:36.23 | ceene | the overall storage of the device is sectioned off into many partitions (there are 42!!!) |
| 20:36.26 | ceene | may goodness |
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| 20:41.21 | Sicelo | :) |
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| 21:03.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | and guess how many of those partitions are non-free |
| 21:04.13 | DocScrutinizer05 | you however will learn a lot about how to build a decent free phone from studying that 42 partitions mess |
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| 21:05.21 | freemangordon | by reading through that story, I am not sure those 42 are really partitions or some of them are bind mounts |
| 21:05.51 | freemangordon | or stuff like /proc /sys /sys/kernel/debugfs etc |
| 21:07.07 | freemangordon | also, it makes sense to have persistent data ( the same what is known as CAL on N900) on a separate storage |
| 21:07.37 | DocScrutinizer05 | check Jolla phone, and weep |
| 21:07.55 | freemangordon | no jolla phone around ;) |
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| 21:09.29 | DocScrutinizer05 | without checking any actual android phone, I'm pretty sure they have a complete modem OS in closed encrypted partitions, and that is started first and runs Android OS as a 'VM' in modem OS host |
| 21:09.50 | freemangordon | also, N900 storage is not that innocent as well, onenand is divided to 6 parts, emmc to 3, do the math yourself :) |
| 21:10.00 | freemangordon | :nod:, I suspect the same |
| 21:10.10 | freemangordon | but that still makes sense |
| 21:11.19 | DocScrutinizer05 | sure, particularly for the NSA ;-) |
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| 21:12.27 | freemangordon | well, if you aim a closed system, all this makes lots of sense. Esp when modem and MPU are on the same silicon |
| 21:12.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | from within Android yiu have as much control over what your device really does, as you have control over your PC from inside a VM |
| 21:12.50 | freemangordon | :) |
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| 21:15.01 | ceene | Partitions - No. The devices in /dev/block literally number up to mmcblk0p42. I used DiskInfo. Link me: DiskInfo |
| 21:20.05 | DocScrutinizer05 | >>Android doesn't even break down your used storage properly - my used space + my free space never adds up to the total available space.<< sounds like a prety normal effect of a compressing filesystem like the ubifs we have on root partition |
| 21:20.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | at least if the sum of available + used > total |
| 21:21.04 | ceene | i think the biggest problem regarding that is that they don't take into account some of the partitions, or even folders |
| 21:21.15 | ceene | since they are not intended to be user accesible |
| 21:21.47 | ceene | they do strange things and you can see "300MB free" and trying to install a 5MB app ends on "Insufficient disk space" |
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| 21:40.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | yeah, I've read the article now, and I have to say Android storage is a bizarre nightmare |
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