| 00:04.42 | fishbulb | I don't really like debian |
| 00:05.16 | fishbulb | maxdamantus would it still do phone stuff then? |
| 00:05.49 | Maxdamantus | fishbulb: potentially. |
| 00:06.01 | fishbulb | I don't like the potentially part |
| 00:06.12 | fishbulb | the best is still "what it came with" |
| 00:06.18 | Maxdamantus | Debian has ofono in its repositories, which comes with example scripts to do things like send/receive SMSes and make calls. |
| 00:06.41 | fishbulb | sounds like poor battery life and at BEST an irritating interface |
| 00:06.55 | Maxdamantus | (I think I heard earlier this week that you can pretty much make calls in mainline) |
| 00:07.33 | Maxdamantus | Yeah. I'm not sure what there is in the way of convenient UIs around something like ofono. |
| 00:07.46 | Maxdamantus | which aren't highly coupled with larger phone OS packages. |
| 00:08.48 | fishbulb | does maemo run on anything else |
| 00:08.59 | fishbulb | actually what would the point even be. |
| 00:09.59 | Maxdamantus | The point would be to not be locked in to a bunch of highly coupled software. |
| 00:14.07 | andril | hello |
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| 03:14.54 | Sicelo | cannot understand how people appreciate N900 only for Yappari/Whatsapp |
| 03:15.13 | Sicelo | ceene is doing a great job with Yappari of course :) |
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| 04:38.45 | *** topic/#maemo is Welcome to #maemo http://maemo.org/intro/ | N9/harmattan related questions please in #harmattan ! | "firmware" see ~tabletsdev ~combined ~emmc ~flasher sdk: ~sb | http://wiki.maemo.org/Community_Council | Source: http://wiki.maemo.org/Sources | Chanlog: http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog | #maemo-ssu is where the (few) devels and maintainers of the maemo-future meet |
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| 05:54.26 | ds3 | is maemo.org still the best place to find apps for the N900? |
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| 07:40.19 | DocScrutinizer05 | sure |
| 07:40.52 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~pkg |
| 07:40.52 | infobot | somebody said pkg was http://maemo.org/packages/ |
| 07:45.01 | DocScrutinizer05 | though, for generic search you are prolly better off with sth like https://www.google.de/search?q=site%3Ahttp%3A%2F%2Fmaemo.org%2F+whatsapp |
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| 08:54.58 | fishbulb | where's the link for the new whatsapp |
| 08:59.52 | Vajb | appmanager -> updates... |
| 09:01.18 | Vajb | btw lately omp has been unresponsive quite some time after start up. Anyone experiencing the same? |
| 09:01.35 | KotCzarny | strace it? |
| 09:01.55 | Vajb | strace omp? |
| 09:02.01 | KotCzarny | yes |
| 09:02.39 | Vajb | seems i don't have it installed |
| 09:02.51 | KotCzarny | essential for debugging |
| 09:04.15 | Vajb | will check first if apt has upgrade for omp |
| 09:04.58 | Vajb | there is quite a bit of upgrades... |
| 09:05.21 | Vajb | is looking forward to new cssu version soonish |
| 09:06.21 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 09:09.13 | Vajb | 34 upgrades but no omp |
| 09:09.20 | Vajb | will install strace |
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| 09:11.27 | Vajb | hmm seems i don't have correct repo |
| 09:11.42 | Vajb | it's not in devel nor testing |
| 09:11.47 | KotCzarny | i think you can juts unpack bibary to /usr/local |
| 09:12.10 | Vajb | oh |
| 09:12.23 | KotCzarny | darn typos |
| 09:13.01 | Vajb | well while looking stra for app manager i stumpled on interesting sounding strategy game. So will try that instead lol |
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| 09:13.14 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 09:13.20 | Vajb | gigalomania |
| 09:13.33 | KotCzarny | appman wont show you console apps i think |
| 09:13.39 | KotCzarny | use apt-get |
| 09:15.01 | Vajb | oh will try cache search to see |
| 09:15.37 | Vajb | yup there it is |
| 09:21.08 | sixwheeledbeast^ | Vajb: cssu? testing or stable? |
| 09:22.04 | Vajb | testing |
| 09:22.34 | Vajb | also devel repo enabled so wont be doing apt upgrade |
| 09:22.49 | Vajb | altho im tempted coz of somany upgrades :p |
| 09:23.13 | Vajb | so i ran strace omp and it spit loads of stuff |
| 09:24.17 | sixwheeledbeast^ | There have been updates to qt to increase loading times, have you noticed this with any other qt packages. |
| 09:25.15 | sixwheeledbeast^ | I would strongly recommend you avoid -devel. |
| 09:25.26 | Vajb | well i tried facebrick which claims to be written in qt, but it was so slow i uninstalled it immediatelly |
| 09:27.08 | KotCzarny | vajb: you are interested in stalls or failed polls |
| 09:27.13 | fishbulb | the whatsapp thing is in devel |
| 09:27.15 | sixwheeledbeast^ | I believe my testing only device with all the devel packages, has started eat through battery recently but no idea why. Haven't had time to investigate. They are not for general consumption away. |
| 09:27.20 | fishbulb | that';s the only reason I can still use this phone |
| 09:27.28 | fishbulb | it hoses battery |
| 09:28.04 | sixwheeledbeast^ | dont get confused between cssu-stable/testing/devel and Extras-stable/testing/devel |
| 09:28.15 | Vajb | i don't install many apps nor do apt-get upgrade and yes yappari is on devel |
| 09:28.29 | fishbulb | I probably am getting confused |
| 09:28.53 | fishbulb | I didn't mean to insult anyone who makes yappari, that's literally the only reason I can still use this phone |
| 09:29.10 | fishbulb | but maybe it's 3g going all the time, but the battery is halved |
| 09:29.38 | fishbulb | I can't even afford a modern phone if I wanted one. |
| 09:29.40 | Vajb | KotCzarny: can i do strace omp to some file? |
| 09:29.49 | KotCzarny | yes |
| 09:30.02 | KotCzarny | strace ompbinary >some/path 2>&1 |
| 09:30.22 | KotCzarny | strace -r ompbinary >some/path 2>&1 |
| 09:30.29 | KotCzarny | will add some timing info too |
| 09:30.32 | sixwheeledbeast^ | but still as a rule:- devel is "in development" expect it to crash. -testing is "in testing" expect bugs and stable is well hopefully that. |
| 09:31.11 | Vajb | well i have all the repos =) |
| 09:31.19 | Vajb | extras and cssu |
| 09:31.26 | Vajb | testing and devel |
| 09:31.41 | Vajb | got to get them all |
| 09:32.24 | fishbulb | nothing goes to stable anymore |
| 09:32.28 | fishbulb | there are what |
| 09:32.31 | sixwheeledbeast^ | thorws a pokeball at Vajb |
| 09:32.32 | fishbulb | 200 300 users worldwide? |
| 09:32.43 | KotCzarny | :> |
| 09:33.03 | KotCzarny | vajb, you should either have devel or testing |
| 09:33.09 | KotCzarny | having both is pointless |
| 09:33.50 | sixwheeledbeast^ | package don't get tested in extras so packages filtering through is slow. cssu updates require time to build and test by devs. |
| 09:33.58 | Vajb | i enabled them to get some latest programs |
| 09:36.58 | Vajb | >some/path = >/media/mmc1/omp.txt? |
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| 09:40.26 | Vajb | answer to myself <- u got it right |
| 09:45.27 | Vajb | i have no idea what to look |
| 09:45.47 | Vajb | i search for failed and stall, but no result |
| 09:45.59 | Vajb | poll i did found in many instances |
| 09:47.01 | Vajb | think i'll have to open that on pc to get better view of it |
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| 10:08.25 | Oksanaa | Nokia N900 media player stutters on webm 640x360 videos. Is it matter of RAM, CPU, bitrate, or decoding? |
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| 11:28.39 | KotCzarny | oksana: probably cpu decoding |
| 11:29.28 | KotCzarny | vajb: if you see that it tries to poll the same resource thousands times per second, timing out, its one of the things to look for |
| 11:29.46 | KotCzarny | you can upload the file somewhere |
| 11:31.03 | Vajb | will look at it in computer. Text in bigger screen makes more sense to me and it's easier to pick patterns |
| 11:31.21 | Vajb | just tomorrow don't have access to it |
| 11:33.46 | Vajb | and to jump some other matter. I saw some discussion about pidgin and facebook and what i understood was it's not gonna happen. Sad times. Tho i posted complaint to facebook for dropping xmmp support. I know it's not gonna make a difference, but at least i spoke it out loud for them. |
| 11:33.55 | KotCzarny | vajb: curl --upload-file some/path http://transfer.sh/ |
| 11:39.31 | Vajb | will that contain some sensitive info? I mean strace omp |
| 11:39.41 | KotCzarny | shouldn't |
| 11:39.50 | KotCzarny | unless omp does something funky |
| 11:40.06 | KotCzarny | its all about media files only, right? |
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| 11:40.49 | Vajb | media files but also internet radio streaming |
| 11:41.11 | KotCzarny | are you using some paid/private servers? |
| 11:41.24 | KotCzarny | or something to be ashamed of? :> |
| 11:41.46 | Vajb | nah |
| 11:41.58 | Vajb | meh seems i don't have curl |
| 11:43.41 | KotCzarny | offtopic, i'm playing with banana/orange pi |
| 11:43.44 | Vajb | hmm seems it's not doing anything |
| 11:44.09 | KotCzarny | and wonderful thing is that it's using current official debian repo (+some repos for device specific things) |
| 11:44.28 | KotCzarny | and just having ANY debian app running in no time feels great |
| 11:44.57 | KotCzarny | so i guess once n900 receives current glibc and kernel it would be similar feeling |
| 11:45.39 | Vajb | i guess it's not quite "holding your breath" phase yet ;) |
| 11:46.12 | Maxdamantus | Slightly more than glibc and kernel. Maemo isn't derived from Debian, so you can't just randomly install Debian packages on it. |
| 11:46.18 | Vajb | https://transfer.sh/12Npqa/omp.txt |
| 11:46.28 | Vajb | there goes |
| 11:46.29 | Wizzup | Maxdamantus: works form e |
| 11:46.48 | KotCzarny | maxd, i was thinking about similar integration, debian + some maemo specific bits |
| 11:47.23 | Maxdamantus | Wizzup: coincidentally in some cases, sure. |
| 11:48.05 | Maxdamantus | Wizzup: because a bunch of packages have the same names and happen to have similar installation layouts (since it's usually the same across distributions anyway) |
| 11:49.03 | Wizzup | I really don't want to go down the same path/discussion again |
| 11:51.56 | Maxdamantus | Okay, but just because I can force install things with dpkg on Gentoo and have them work doesn't mean it's a good thing to do. |
| 11:52.54 | KotCzarny | maxd: i've said about having some distro (put debian as an example) working with a layer of n900 specific bits |
| 11:52.57 | Wizzup | sure. I would say the same about recent debian packages on a very old debian |
| 11:55.05 | Maxdamantus | KotCzarny: yeah, that would be okay. Maemo should just consist of a bunch of distro-agnostic components. |
| 11:55.14 | KotCzarny | yup |
| 11:55.37 | KotCzarny | it can include wm, but should work with generic wm too |
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| 12:33.30 | fishbulb | what about arch |
| 12:33.51 | fishbulb | I've had problems with literally every distro and their stupid little things that they're precious about |
| 12:34.04 | fishbulb | recently changed to arch, that's the end of distro hopping. |
| 12:35.33 | fishbulb | thank fuck. |
| 12:39.14 | kerio | what about an actual unix system |
| 12:39.17 | kerio | like openbsd |
| 12:39.26 | Wizzup | I want a rainbow bikeshed |
| 12:39.39 | KotCzarny | kerio, go ahead and port it |
| 12:39.46 | KotCzarny | unless it can run under linux kernel |
| 12:39.57 | Wizzup | fishbulb: not sure why you're cursing, but ok |
| 12:40.10 | Wizzup | I find quite some distros ok, arch breaks too often for me personally |
| 12:40.12 | fishbulb | because I have a potty mouth and curse all the time |
| 12:40.19 | Wizzup | debian seems by far the best choice here |
| 12:40.28 | Wizzup | Also the easiest |
| 12:40.33 | fishbulb | I found debian to be one of the worst |
| 12:40.39 | Wizzup | great, run arch on your n900. |
| 12:40.40 | KotCzarny | also systemd ridden, unfortunatelly |
| 12:40.48 | fishbulb | but that was their philosophy behind laptop stuff |
| 12:40.50 | Wizzup | KotCzarny: devuan/debian same thing when it comes to packaging :) |
| 12:40.53 | fishbulb | I mean computer distros |
| 12:41.06 | Wizzup | fishbulb: why are you even suggesting arch then? we are talking about maemo on the n900 |
| 12:41.06 | KotCzarny | wizzup, but important thing to keep in mind |
| 12:41.21 | Wizzup | KotCzarny: I use gentoo mostly, with openrc (also on n900) |
| 12:41.25 | fishbulb | I dunno, not really related are they |
| 12:41.26 | Wizzup | but yeah, sure |
| 12:41.47 | Wizzup | KotCzarny: if you want I can poke jaromil at the office this week and see if they are interested in n900 port(s) |
| 12:41.51 | fishbulb | I mean debian is supposed to be stable |
| 12:42.10 | KotCzarny | wizzup, we first need working mainline kernel |
| 12:42.17 | Wizzup | yes :) |
| 12:42.25 | Wizzup | KotCzarny: many things are working on mainline kernel |
| 12:42.30 | fishbulb | what's mainline |
| 12:43.00 | fishbulb | like "the" linux kernel? |
| 12:43.13 | KotCzarny | fishbulb: any kernel that is still supported status on kernel.org mostly |
| 12:43.23 | KotCzarny | or you can just think 'newest' |
| 12:43.58 | fishbulb | ok. will that ever happen on an obscure 7+ year old "phone" ? |
| 12:44.14 | KotCzarny | pali and fmg are working on it |
| 12:44.37 | fishbulb | someone was working on arch and it never worked |
| 12:44.38 | KotCzarny | (and some other folks) |
| 12:45.45 | Wizzup | I have 4.1-rc2 running on my n900 |
| 12:45.50 | Wizzup | should rebuild using the latest sources |
| 12:46.18 | Wizzup | by 'working' I think KotCzarny means: make maemo work with mainline kernel |
| 12:46.21 | fishbulb | I think you think people use arch becuase "it's the latest and best and whatever" and gamers use it too |
| 12:46.35 | Wizzup | fishbulb: great, but this is maemo - just go to the arch fan channel? |
| 12:46.35 | fishbulb | personally I find it unflavoured |
| 12:46.48 | fishbulb | I'm not a fan though |
| 12:46.52 | fishbulb | I hate it the least :) |
| 12:47.09 | Wizzup | well, you keep bringing it up in unrelated discussions :) |
| 12:47.24 | fishbulb | ok I'm trying to clear my name as a fanboy |
| 12:47.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | Wizzup: Jaromil is aware |
| 12:47.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | since at least 5 months |
| 12:47.38 | Wizzup | I know |
| 12:48.11 | fishbulb | tell him that all the rest of life isn't important and people want this stuff now |
| 12:49.07 | fishbulb | whatever happened to PDAs |
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| 12:49.35 | fishbulb | how come there aren't little things with keyboards that do a lot of things, we have smudgy touchscreen pieces of crap |
| 12:49.38 | fishbulb | it's what apes would design |
| 12:49.59 | DocScrutinizer05 | I'm pushing since 12 months to 'rebase' maemo to devuan, since debian is no longer compatible to maemo |
| 12:50.02 | KotCzarny | kids prefer finger pointing |
| 12:50.17 | KotCzarny | electronics mostly sells to kids (and grown kids) |
| 12:50.21 | fishbulb | I'm not a fan of kids |
| 12:50.30 | fishbulb | they shouldn't have anything |
| 12:50.37 | freemangordon | KotCzarny: well, at least my 10yo daughter prefers kbd :) |
| 12:50.37 | fishbulb | maybe calculators |
| 12:50.53 | KotCzarny | fmg: what about 6yo ? ;) |
| 12:51.18 | fishbulb | with some "encouragement" |
| 12:51.22 | freemangordon | and I really doubt those keyboardless devices are what lusers prefer, they just have no option |
| 12:51.31 | freemangordon | and it is waaay easier to be manifactured |
| 12:51.35 | fishbulb | kids are pliable and can learn anything |
| 12:51.43 | freemangordon | *manufactured |
| 12:51.46 | fishbulb | the entire earth is being dumbed down |
| 12:51.48 | KotCzarny | fmg, well, there are quite many droids with hw kb |
| 12:52.02 | freemangordon | example, please |
| 12:52.04 | fishbulb | like which ones?!! |
| 12:52.06 | KotCzarny | it's just that those are bigger |
| 12:52.11 | fishbulb | I'd get one immediately! |
| 12:52.25 | freemangordon | the last one was when? 5 years ago? |
| 12:52.31 | DocScrutinizer05 | freemangordon: there was a 'no holes, no keys' paradigm back in ~2007 |
| 12:52.35 | fishbulb | that one sucked |
| 12:52.44 | KotCzarny | http://thedroidguy.com/2014/03/top-7-android-smartphones-physical-qwerty-keyboards-87556 |
| 12:53.25 | DocScrutinizer05 | freemangordon: ..most likely right from Jobs' arse |
| 12:53.50 | KotCzarny | http://www.cnet.com/news/great-qwerty-smartphones-for-texting-enthusiasts-roundup/ |
| 12:54.04 | fishbulb | those are all terrible |
| 12:54.08 | freemangordon | KotCzarny: comeon, BB is not a real qwerty |
| 12:54.17 | freemangordon | fishbulb: :nod: |
| 12:54.34 | KotCzarny | motorola? |
| 12:54.39 | fishbulb | this is the last of the v8 interceptors and it came out with a 4 cylinder at the time :/ |
| 12:54.41 | DocScrutinizer05 | I'm not one of the Apple followers that think each concept Apple ever came up with is the crown of ingenuity |
| 12:54.43 | KotCzarny | it even has shift and tab |
| 12:54.44 | freemangordon | KotCzarny: Announced 2012, July |
| 12:55.09 | fishbulb | I can only see one use for apple products |
| 12:55.10 | freemangordon | where are your new devices? |
| 12:55.18 | KotCzarny | didnt say NEW |
| 12:55.28 | freemangordon | (14,52,23) freemangordon: the last one was when? 5 years ago? |
| 12:55.44 | KotCzarny | well, 2016-2012 == 4 |
| 12:55.47 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 12:55.47 | freemangordon | great |
| 12:55.50 | fishbulb | that is if you are some kind of world travelling coder, need an IDENTICAL computer anywhere in the world at like 3am, and have to buy it then and there and install your own stuff on it |
| 12:56.23 | fishbulb | you can get apple crap anywhere and you'll get the same product without having to wait |
| 12:56.58 | kerio | System Information: Model: MacBook Pro (15-inch, Retina, Late 2013) ⢠CPU: Intel Core i7-4850HQ (8 Threads, 4 Cores) @ 2.30 GHz ⢠Memory: 16,00 GB ⢠Uptime: 2 days ⢠Disk Space: 337,99 GB ⢠Graphics: Intel Iris Pro, NVIDIA GeForce GT 750M ⢠Screen Resolution: 1440 x 900 (HiDPI Mode) ⢠OS: OS X El Capitan (Version 10.11.3, Build 15D21) |
| 12:57.06 | freemangordon | KotCzarny: no kbd phones are easier ot mfg. and who rally cares what iusers want, anyway those will be outdated in 6-12 moths. IMO |
| 12:57.08 | fishbulb | otherwise, a customised thinkpad is the computer for me. because I can wait |
| 12:57.25 | KotCzarny | http://www.phonearena.com/phones/Internet/QWERTY+keyboard#/phones/Internet/QWERTY+keyboard |
| 12:57.29 | KotCzarny | some are from 2014 |
| 12:57.32 | fishbulb | who doesn't like matt black |
| 12:57.47 | KotCzarny | (not saying they are great, but you wanted rel dates) |
| 12:57.50 | fishbulb | batman likes matt black |
| 12:58.02 | KotCzarny | sort by date after opening link |
| 12:58.23 | fishbulb | the n900 is not AS BAD as all of those phones are |
| 12:58.54 | Wizzup | Should I take the latest linux kernel from pali's repo for more mainline testing? |
| 12:59.00 | KotCzarny | but i'm not arguing they are great, i've just said there are kb phones released |
| 12:59.29 | fishbulb | I don't get why there aren't little extremely powerful devices with keyboards available |
| 13:00.00 | KotCzarny | fishbulb: i think you need subnotebook with current i5/i7 |
| 13:00.08 | fishbulb | netbooks were popular, but not very good |
| 13:00.13 | freemangordon | Wizzup: I am thinking to pester him to upgrade to 4.5-rc1, there are more stuff upstreamed |
| 13:00.17 | Wizzup | They don't cater to arch users with potty mouths? :) |
| 13:00.24 | Wizzup | freemangordon: cool! ok |
| 13:00.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | because of lusers |
| 13:00.29 | fishbulb | what's a subnotebook? I'm already using an "ultraportable" |
| 13:00.58 | KotCzarny | A subnotebook (also called an ultraportable or mini notebook) is a class of laptop computers that are smaller and lighter than a typical notebook. |
| 13:01.02 | fishbulb | 12" screen, it's good enough for everything, it's even slightly too big for my backpack |
| 13:01.10 | fishbulb | yeah, I'm using one now |
| 13:01.31 | fishbulb | x220t |
| 13:01.55 | fishbulb | it's a good size for a "laptop" |
| 13:02.42 | fishbulb | I have a gaming "laptop" that's like a desktop replacement. that's good for power stuff. |
| 13:02.56 | fishbulb | half an hour of battery. |
| 13:03.40 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer05: no, really, I think it is not the lusers to blame, what she can do if the only options in the store is a panful with no kbd? |
| 13:04.16 | fishbulb | people can learn |
| 13:04.21 | fishbulb | especially young people |
| 13:04.25 | DocScrutinizer05 | arguably right, my totally completely non-techy GF would prefer a N900 kbd |
| 13:04.51 | freemangordon | my too, but she knows about that option because of you, correct? |
| 13:04.55 | freemangordon | *mine |
| 13:04.58 | fishbulb | it's old execs |
| 13:05.18 | fishbulb | my dad is like 60 or whatever, and loves his ipad |
| 13:05.57 | fishbulb | if he had to come up with his ideal computer, he'd probably just want a better ipad |
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| 13:08.01 | freemangordon | DocScrutinizer05: my daughter has about 4 android phones, but she took my GF's old n900 and this is the only phone she uses since then. But still, if she wasn't my daughter, where she would have learned from that anything else but iCrap and android exists? |
| 13:09.54 | freemangordon | Pali: would you mind to rebase linux n900 on github to 4.5-rc1, so we can make new patches on recent codebase? like revisiot, etc |
| 13:10.05 | freemangordon | *revision |
| 13:10.41 | fishbulb | android is the lesser evil |
| 13:10.57 | freemangordon | is it? |
| 13:11.09 | fishbulb | it's linux "lite" |
| 13:11.17 | fishbulb | and it's free. what's bad about it? |
| 13:11.29 | freemangordon | ios is unix-lite :) |
| 13:11.47 | fishbulb | ios is the enemy. |
| 13:11.58 | kerio | whose enemy? |
| 13:12.03 | freemangordon | why enemy? |
| 13:12.08 | fishbulb | the planet |
| 13:12.09 | kerio | ios is android's enemy |
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| 13:12.35 | fishbulb | more like android is ios's enemy, and in that situation, you can almost trust them |
| 13:12.36 | fishbulb | plus |
| 13:12.41 | fishbulb | the dev kit is totally free. |
| 13:12.46 | fishbulb | anyone can make android apps |
| 13:12.46 | kerio | xcode is free |
| 13:12.58 | fishbulb | android is slightly more transparent |
| 13:13.13 | fishbulb | there's the whole cyanogenmod thing |
| 13:13.22 | freemangordon | fishbulb: because linux people cannot pull themselves together and bring a descent phone distro out, it doesn't mean apple is evil. |
| 13:13.35 | freemangordon | TBH i'd rather say google is evil |
| 13:13.38 | Maxdamantus | You can make iOS apps for free .. you just can't use them without having your device tethered to your computer, last I knew. |
| 13:14.01 | fishbulb | I haven't really heard about the suicide nets and other horrific shit to do with android devices |
| 13:14.06 | freemangordon | Maxdamantus: so? don't buy iPhone :) |
| 13:14.11 | fishbulb | it's the LESSER evil |
| 13:14.12 | kerio | fishbulb: lmao |
| 13:14.16 | fishbulb | IOS and apple is the enemy |
| 13:14.24 | freemangordon | not mine |
| 13:14.37 | fishbulb | it's the whole planet's enemy |
| 13:14.43 | kerio | System Information: Model: MacBook Pro (15-inch, Retina, Late 2013) ⢠CPU: Intel Core i7-4850HQ (8 Threads, 4 Cores) @ 2.30 GHz ⢠Memory: 16,00 GB ⢠Uptime: 2 days ⢠Disk Space: 337,99 GB ⢠Graphics: Intel Iris Pro, NVIDIA GeForce GT 750M ⢠Screen Resolution: 1440 x 900 (HiDPI Mode) ⢠OS: OS X El Capitan (Version 10.11.3, Build 15D21) |
| 13:14.50 | fishbulb | it's a bigger corporation than nearly anything |
| 13:14.55 | fishbulb | that alone is bad. |
| 13:15.03 | fishbulb | they only exist to make more profit by any means |
| 13:15.06 | freemangordon | fishbulb: apple?!? |
| 13:15.11 | fishbulb | they are totally the enemy. |
| 13:15.12 | freemangordon | what about sammy? |
| 13:15.53 | freemangordon | anyway /me is back to clock-ui |
| 13:15.57 | fishbulb | whoever sammy is |
| 13:16.13 | freemangordon | samsung |
| 13:16.28 | fishbulb | I dunno. I have a nexus 7 |
| 13:16.30 | fishbulb | it's alright. |
| 13:17.02 | fishbulb | I don't have any other modern phones or use any of them |
| 13:17.17 | fishbulb | I don't have any modern THINGS. apart from socks and undies |
| 13:17.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | what a pointless discussion |
| 13:17.58 | fishbulb | all this technology has blood of less fortunate people all over it, I try to minimise that by making it work longer so I don't have to buy new crap |
| 13:18.35 | KotCzarny | fishbulb: word of the day for you: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planned_obsolescence |
| 13:18.44 | fishbulb | yeah thinkpads |
| 13:19.47 | fishbulb | if schools land businesses use them, they're always gonna be around, and hopefully easily servicable |
| 13:20.16 | fishbulb | times |
| 13:20.19 | fishbulb | they are a changin |
| 13:21.16 | fishbulb | it doesn't matter, as soon as trump is president we'll all either get superpowers from all the radiation, or like... the other thing you get from radiation |
| 13:21.32 | kerio | 362 days |
| 13:21.43 | KotCzarny | if trump becomes the president, you will get what you deserve |
| 13:21.49 | KotCzarny | (as a nation) |
| 13:21.58 | fishbulb | um |
| 13:22.07 | fishbulb | I live in australia |
| 13:22.55 | fishbulb | whatever australians "deserve" I am not a citizen of here either |
| 13:25.19 | DocScrutinizer05 | wonders how to handle http://wstaw.org/m/2016/01/24/plasma-desktopFW3616.png |
| 13:28.44 | DocScrutinizer05 | anyway, about the "blood of less fortunate people all over it" I tend to agree and Neo900 tries (and most likely succeeds) to not use any tantalum capacitors. That's about as good as it gets, apart from using a semi-refurbish scheme for people to upgrade their N900 |
| 13:34.11 | fishbulb | handle a .jpg ? |
| 13:34.46 | fishbulb | you can only try. I don't eat meat on purpose |
| 13:34.58 | fishbulb | but threshers kill whole fields of animals |
| 13:35.26 | fishbulb | there's probably animal parts in the vegetables I buy. I try not to eat rat faeces either but there's an accetable level of that in chocolate bars |
| 13:36.55 | Pali | freemangordon: no 4.5-rc1 yet: https://www.kernel.org/ |
| 13:37.14 | freemangordon | hmm, ok |
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| 14:33.30 | fishbulb | how much power should having 3g data on all the time use? |
| 14:33.43 | fishbulb | is it actively connected and doing things constantly? |
| 14:34.45 | fishbulb | because I went from over a day of normal use to maybe half a day using yappari every hour or so |
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| 16:10.38 | DocScrutinizer05 | "having data on" is no criterion. frequency of packet sending/receiving, signal strength, and to a minor degree size of packets, is what counts for energy consumption |
| 16:12.19 | DocScrutinizer05 | particularly noteworth that for 3G there's virtually no difference between a 50byte ping every 2 seconds and a continuous data stream of several hundered kbit/s |
| 16:13.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | also it's virtually completely irrelevant if the data is inbound or outbound |
| 16:14.21 | DocScrutinizer05 | so yes, yappari as well as skype will most likely cause *massive* impact on energy consumption, no matter if idling or actively used |
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| 19:07.01 | Vajb | KotCzarny: did you harvest any usefull data from my omp.txt? |
| 19:07.18 | KotCzarny | um, must have missed the link, can you repaste? |
| 19:07.35 | Vajb | https://transfer.sh/12Npqa/omp.txt |
| 19:07.52 | Vajb | i suppose it doesn't expire... |
| 19:08.05 | KotCzarny | i think it expires in a week |
| 19:11.36 | DocScrutinizer05 | wtf?! Konqueror linux killer |
| 19:13.25 | KotCzarny | argh, it opens so many images |
| 19:13.30 | DocScrutinizer05 | I really wonder what those coders smoked to come up with the idea to instantiate an object for each single char of a text |
| 19:18.04 | ceene | i've succesfully booted pali's kernel |
| 19:18.17 | ceene | which is something good, of course |
| 19:18.25 | ceene | but i can't get usb0 up |
| 19:20.00 | Pali | ceene: do you mean usb network? |
| 19:20.07 | ceene | yes |
| 19:20.30 | Pali | ceene: there is bug in musb: https://lkml.org/lkml/2016/1/9/69 |
| 19:20.45 | ceene | ph |
| 19:20.46 | ceene | oh |
| 19:21.08 | ceene | i should subscribe to lkml and just read your posts |
| 19:21.09 | Pali | call that echo and it should work |
| 19:21.43 | ceene | let's try it :) |
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| 19:29.36 | KotCzarny | vajb, that log was taken during startup and letting it idle for quite a bit? |
| 19:31.11 | Vajb | yes |
| 19:31.51 | Vajb | also i opened one artist and album to see when it came responsive |
| 19:37.55 | ceene | root@portatil:/tmp/N900_RescueOS# ping 192.168.215.1 |
| 19:37.55 | ceene | PING 192.168.215.1 (192.168.215.1) 56(84) bytes of data. |
| 19:37.55 | ceene | 64 bytes from 192.168.215.1: icmp_seq=1 ttl=64 time=0.901 ms |
| 19:37.57 | ceene | :) |
| 19:45.52 | KotCzarny | vajb, hrm, nothing special in that log |
| 19:45.57 | KotCzarny | lots of images loading |
| 19:47.19 | KotCzarny | and those ioctl/read/write on 8 is 0.002289 socket(PF_FILE, SOCK_STREAM, 0) = 8 |
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| 19:51.45 | ceene | Pali: now i can telnet the n900, so extracting data and logs is feasible now |
| 19:51.53 | ceene | do you have anything that would like me to test? |
| 19:52.21 | ceene | just ask whenever something crosses your mind! |
| 19:53.40 | Pali | ceene: I think nothing for testing... I already tested parts and sent emails about regressions :-) (one link above ^^^ ) |
| 19:53.52 | Pali | what is needed is to finish drivers! |
| 19:54.11 | ceene | i don't know if i can help much with this, though... |
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| 19:54.59 | Pali | look at red parts on http://elinux.org/N900 |
| 19:55.06 | Pali | thats what is needed |
| 19:55.28 | ceene | it's not very much, at least compared with what's already been done |
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| 19:55.43 | ceene | but i guess it's because the remaining bits are the most difficult, ain't them? |
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| 19:57.19 | Pali | status about camera: does not work for unknown reason |
| 19:57.43 | Pali | broken between v3.5 and v3.8 |
| 19:58.24 | ceene | that should be at least bisectable? |
| 19:58.40 | Pali | very very hard, but should be |
| 19:58.42 | KotCzarny | vajb: cat omp.txt |awk '{ sum+=$1; print sum $0} END {print sum}' (will add execution time at the beginning) |
| 19:59.03 | Pali | camera support in those versions was not part of mainline kernel |
| 19:59.18 | ceene | i guess it exposes a video4linux device |
| 19:59.21 | Pali | so bisecting would mean to apply all patches on top of commit for testing |
| 19:59.30 | Pali | ceene: yes v4l2 device |
| 19:59.40 | ceene | so maybe it's somewhat easier to read the datasheet and try to find any discrepancies |
| 19:59.43 | Pali | but it use mediactl for config |
| 20:00.12 | Pali | problem is that camera do not send data |
| 20:00.37 | ceene | doesn't answer to anything or is it only video that is not working? |
| 20:00.57 | DocScrutinizer05 | I'd guess N900 camera support never will go to mainline, since it's yet another extremely unique design, with a mux switching two camera moodules to one SoC interface |
| 20:01.17 | Pali | ceene: camera do not send any data |
| 20:01.33 | KotCzarny | move camera driver to userspace? |
| 20:01.34 | Pali | that mux is not a big problem for mainline |
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| 20:02.04 | Pali | sre created virtual gpio driver which act as that "gpio" mux |
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| 20:02.42 | Pali | bluetooth status: original nokia driver was rejected and sre written new one (which use correct api), but for unknown reason do not work, just send unknown error |
| 20:02.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | well, the mux must get set correctly before the kernel driver starts initializing the cam module |
| 20:02.58 | ceene | ok, i'll try to see if I understand something and, who knows, maybe dumb luck gets me somewhere :) |
| 20:03.44 | Pali | ceene: what is missing is also ir driver |
| 20:04.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | CIR? |
| 20:04.05 | Pali | driver is in mainline kernel but needs fixing for multiarch API |
| 20:04.27 | Pali | yes, that rx51 cir driver |
| 20:06.06 | Pali | ceene: that ir-rx51.c should be the easiest missing part |
| 20:06.10 | Pali | some info on https://lkml.org/lkml/2016/1/2/61 |
| 20:08.07 | ceene | i'll see what i can do... can't promise anything, thouh |
| 20:09.26 | Pali | or something different... fix tidspbridge driver (for DSP video hw accel), currently there are compile errors so it is disabled |
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| 20:09.50 | Pali | on older kernels when there were no compile errors I think it worked |
| 20:10.41 | ceene | compile errors are my favorite... just don't screw up anything! |
| 20:12.34 | Pali | ceene: for enabling tidspbridge add these config options: CONFIG_TIDSPBRIDGE=m CONFIG_TIDSPBRIDGE_DVFS=y CONFIG_TIDSPBRIDGE_MEMPOOL_SIZE=0x600000 |
| 20:20.47 | ceene | the first problem is it looks for some functions that do not exist anymore |
| 20:20.55 | ceene | maybe i can trace when they were removed and what is the alternative |
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| 20:24.01 | ceene | well... |
| 20:24.06 | ceene | <PROTECTED> |
| 20:24.10 | ceene | <PROTECTED> |
| 20:25.24 | Pali | yes, needs to look into git log and find what those function did... |
| 20:26.26 | Pali | anyway, omap-pm-* is somehow missing, now I sent email about it: https://lkml.org/lkml/2016/1/24/153 |
| 20:27.01 | Pali | looks like you found same problem as me at same time :D |
| 20:27.13 | ceene | yeah |
| 20:27.20 | ceene | it looks like they were removed just because |
| 20:27.29 | Pali | I think that omap-pm is some old api |
| 20:27.41 | Pali | and noop implementation was there just was old drivers to compile |
| 20:27.49 | Pali | no idea where is pm now.... |
| 20:28.40 | Pali | if you are going to play with tidspbridge, disable CONFIG_TIDSPBRIDGE_DVFS first |
| 20:29.03 | Pali | and once you get working version, then able also DVFS... |
| 20:30.18 | ceene | there are other compile errors besides that |
| 20:30.37 | ceene | it looks like there were some struct changes |
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| 20:35.46 | Pali | possible, you can see in git, that last time I fixed compilation for 3.12 |
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| 20:53.51 | freemangordon | ceene: the biggest problem is onenand corruption |
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| 21:00.54 | ceene | freemangordon: i haven't mounted yet any mtd partition |
| 21:01.37 | freemangordon | (21,51,51) ceene: do you have anything that would like me to test? |
| 21:02.06 | ceene | sure |
| 21:02.14 | ceene | how should i test that? |
| 21:02.33 | freemangordon | no idea |
| 21:02.40 | ceene | lol |
| 21:02.40 | ceene | ok |
| 21:02.47 | ceene | so what happens, what can you tell me about it? |
| 21:03.11 | freemangordon | but the problem is that if you boot to maemo on onenand, after the first reboot/poweroff rooftfs becomes FUBAR |
| 21:03.13 | sixwheeledbeast^ | freemangordon: clock-ui 0.7-0+0cssu7 seems great :) I haven't found any new or reproduced any older issues. |
| 21:03.22 | freemangordon | sixwheeledbeast^: I found :) |
| 21:03.28 | freemangordon | wel, GF did ;) |
| 21:03.31 | freemangordon | *well |
| 21:03.34 | ceene | ok, so i can mount it from non-maemo |
| 21:03.34 | sixwheeledbeast^ | :( |
| 21:03.37 | ceene | and see if that happens too |
| 21:03.46 | freemangordon | sixwheeledbeast^: cosmetic, but still |
| 21:03.52 | ceene | so at least we can check if it's just mount/umount or if there's something else |
| 21:03.53 | freemangordon | ceene: yeah |
| 21:04.14 | freemangordon | it is something else, mounting it in rescueos does not ruin it |
| 21:06.17 | ceene | by the way |
| 21:06.21 | ceene | [ 7.692749] mmc0: card never left busy state |
| 21:06.21 | ceene | [ 7.698425] mmc0: error -110 whilst initialising SD card |
| 21:06.24 | sixwheeledbeast^ | Must have played with it for longer ;) |
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| 21:11.28 | freemangordon | sixwheeledbeast^: I am fixing the last glitches as we speak, I guess there will be new version in a couple of minutes |
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| 21:17.43 | sixwheeledbeast^ | freemangordon: great, I have just found something. While editing/checking an old alarm, it automatically resets that alarm to tomorrow. |
| 21:18.09 | freemangordon | sixwheeledbeast^: this is a feature, not a bug :) |
| 21:18.24 | sixwheeledbeast^ | freemangordon: is that the same as stock? |
| 21:19.48 | freemangordon | there is not dates in stock, but editing alarm time, makes alarm active today or tomorrow, depending on whether the time has passed or not |
| 21:19.54 | freemangordon | *there are |
| 21:20.57 | freemangordon | sixwheeledbeast^: which makes sense to me |
| 21:21.40 | sixwheeledbeast^ | I forgot stock didn't have date. I would find it annoying, if I only wanted to check on the alarm and it changes the date? IMO |
| 21:22.04 | freemangordon | it doesn't work like that |
| 21:22.18 | freemangordon | if you change nothing, the date won;t be changed |
| 21:22.33 | sixwheeledbeast^ | I am finding that is not the case |
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| 21:22.59 | freemangordon | sixwheeledbeast^: gimme a minute to issue a new version, ok? |
| 21:23.12 | sixwheeledbeast^ | :) |
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| 21:27.36 | freemangordon | sixwheeledbeast^: http://46.249.74.23/maemo/clock-ui_0.7-0+0cssu7_armel.deb |
| 21:27.48 | freemangordon | can you recreate the issue with ^^^? |
| 21:31.18 | freemangordon | ceene: hmm, never had that issue |
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| 21:32.14 | freemangordon | sixwheeledbeast^: still here? |
| 21:32.29 | fishbulb | hey does someone have the link to the .deb file for yappari? |
| 21:32.39 | sixwheeledbeast^ | freemangordon: yep, just downloading it now |
| 21:32.45 | freemangordon | oh, ok |
| 21:32.49 | freemangordon | ~repos |
| 21:32.49 | infobot | extra, extra, read all about it, repos is "deb http://maemo.muarf.org/apt-mirror/mirror/downloads.maemo.nokia.com/fremantle/ssu/apps/ ./ ;; deb http://maemo.muarf.org/apt-mirror/mirror/downloads.maemo.nokia.com/fremantle/ssu/mr0/ ./", or see http://wiki.maemo.org/Repository#List_of_Maemo_repositories |
| 21:33.27 | freemangordon | fishbulb: http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/pool/fremantle-1.3/free/y/yappari/ |
| 21:33.38 | fishbulb | no the new yappari |
| 21:33.49 | ceene | http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/pool/fremantle-1.3/free/y/yappari/yappari_2.0.23_armel.deb |
| 21:34.01 | sixwheeledbeast^ | installing... |
| 21:34.03 | fishbulb | haha thanks |
| 21:34.07 | fishbulb | now burp me! |
| 21:34.11 | freemangordon | 23-Jan-2016 12:18 should be new enough by any means |
| 21:34.46 | freemangordon | sixwheeledbeast^: BTW, does it feel faster? |
| 21:35.02 | sixwheeledbeast^ | freemangordon: yes I can reproduce still and yes it feels a lot better |
| 21:35.23 | freemangordon | hmm, weird, could you gimme steps to reproduce? |
| 21:35.32 | fishbulb | (that's what you do after you spoonfeed an infant isn't it? I don't have any babies so I don't know) |
| 21:36.18 | freemangordon | sixwheeledbeast^: just clickong on an alarm should not change the date, unless it has recurence |
| 21:36.56 | sixwheeledbeast^ | freemangordon: create new alarm exactly one month ahead, save. edit same alarm, do not change settings and save, alarm is now tomorrow. |
| 21:39.14 | freemangordon | sixwheeledbeast^: oh, yes, stupid me :) |
| 21:39.26 | sixwheeledbeast^ | freemangordon: :) |
| 21:40.13 | sixwheeledbeast^ | I will have to play about with it for a bit longer, but yes it's great a lot faster. |
| 21:42.27 | freemangordon | sixwheeledbeast^: just wait to fix that last one before playing with it |
| 21:42.46 | sixwheeledbeast^ | :nod: |
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| 21:59.16 | freemangordon | sixwheeledbeast^: please re-download the deb and retry |
| 21:59.46 | fishbulb | are you making a "better" alarm clock? |
| 22:00.20 | fishbulb | because it actually could be better. I use my android tablet for anything to do with alarms |
| 22:00.22 | freemangordon | fishbulb: I am fixing the so-called adeclock - FOSS replacement of the stock clock-ui |
| 22:00.40 | freemangordon | fishbulb: if you heave any ideas, please open an issue on github |
| 22:01.00 | fishbulb | no I can't really code so |
| 22:01.13 | freemangordon | code? |
| 22:01.24 | fishbulb | wait you mean ideas for your clock thing? |
| 22:01.40 | freemangordon | :nod: |
| 22:01.49 | fishbulb | I'd need to install it |
| 22:02.10 | freemangordon | https://github.com/community-ssu/clock-ui/issues |
| 22:02.28 | sixwheeledbeast^ | freemangordon: will do |
| 22:02.36 | fishbulb | hey how can I open a terminal through (for example usb) in my phone, and then do things that way? |
| 22:02.47 | fishbulb | instead of manually typing things into the phone |
| 22:03.48 | fishbulb | ssh into it like a pi? |
| 22:05.20 | freemangordon | fishbulb: install openssh |
| 22:05.51 | fishbulb | hey I'm using cssu, should I use [08:32] <ceene> http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/pool/fremantle-1.3/free/y/yappari/yappari_2.0.23_armel.deb |
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| 22:10.44 | fishbulb | that's a dumb question, I wonder if I you can create a state of ADHD with no sleep and too much caffiene |
| 22:11.36 | fishbulb | because this recipe seems perfect but it might not port to other people's brains |
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| 22:16.52 | fishbulb | freemangordon install openssh where? I'm using arch but prior to this I've only distro hopped and KDE didn't require much terminal use |
| 22:22.00 | fishbulb | hey is it possible that someone else can ssh into my n900 |
| 22:22.32 | fishbulb | I haven't reinstalled or reflashed anything for a pretty long time |
| 22:27.50 | fishbulb | what's a good working n900 worth these days? I've seen people posting wanted ads |
| 22:28.57 | fishbulb | willing to pay 200 bucks, but I've seen ebay items for 5x that and probably made from hong kong pieces, I have 1 genuine one left and one that's parts now |
| 22:29.34 | ceene | i've just bought my second one for 30 euros |
| 22:29.58 | ceene | and i know KotCzarny has bought a few for even less than that, although not perfectly working |
| 22:30.07 | fishbulb | traces came off the motherboard of the parts one, and I don't have soldering equipment small enough to do the hack required |
| 22:30.27 | fishbulb | for the usb port |
| 22:32.18 | fishbulb | if both parties know what they are, what do you think a good one is actually worth? |
| 22:33.06 | fishbulb | last time I looked for one, I saw people who just thouht they were outdated "smartphones" asking between 100 and 200usd |
| 22:34.18 | ceene | it's only worth what both parties agree on |
| 22:35.22 | fishbulb | http://www.ebay.com/itm/Nokia-N900-32GB-Black-Unlocked-Smartphone-BRAND-NEW-IN-SEALED-BOX-/141861937870?hash=item2107a162ce:g:Eo0AAOSwKtlWkYiQ |
| 22:35.46 | fishbulb | these can't be new and unopened surely |
| 22:37.01 | fishbulb | I believe that they are sealed in a box |
| 22:37.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | they look genuine |
| 22:37.40 | fishbulb | maybe someone should grab those |
| 22:37.48 | DocScrutinizer05 | and price about correct |
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