| 00:35.20 | Oksana | tracker-status -fd it kind-of-log. Says when it's indexing, optimising, or idle |
| 00:36.06 | Oksana | 'tracker-status -fd' is* kind-of-log |
| 00:37.10 | Oksana | To be fair, it indexed all the images nicely, afaik, and there are much more of them. And videos are alright, too. So it's struggling with audio, only. |
| 00:37.53 | Oksana | blames Mussorgsky's clumsy attempts at modifying album art |
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| 02:28.04 | Oksana | Moin. Anybody know how to fix a mess with mediaartlocal which stops tracker from indexing audio files (images and videos are not affected) ? |
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| 04:46.10 | Sicelo | Oksana: yes, i didn't like Mussorgsky's results |
| 04:47.47 | Sicelo | what you can do is tracker-processes -k (kills tracker without removing databases). short while later, do tracker-stats ... this seems to "remind" tracker to index. good luck |
| 04:48.00 | Sicelo | or try non-tracker-based players |
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| 05:03.42 | Maxdamantus | uses mpd./qmpc. |
| 05:04.48 | Maxdamantus | s/\.// |
| 05:20.19 | Oksana | likes tracker... Unfortunately, tracker-stats does not help. Is there a log somewhere? When I open a non-indexed file, Media Player is fine, knows the album and the cover - but the tracker does not remember it... |
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| 08:02.24 | bencoh | Maxdamantus: mpd on device ? |
| 08:04.15 | Maxdamantus | Yes. |
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| 08:26.26 | zGrr | moin :) |
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| 10:28.43 | Maxdamantus | I saw it on the news this mroin. |
| 10:29.09 | Oksanaa | By the way, tracker selectively avoided all ogg-and-flac files, so it is not random - it's tracker-extractor-vorbis broken by strange files somehow |
| 10:36.13 | Sicelo | Oksanaa: why you like tracker? |
| 10:36.34 | Sicelo | not saying you should not .. but 'everyone' hates it |
| 10:44.23 | Oksanaa | Because it knows everything? I do not want to organize everything myself. Especially when metadata can store lots of info which does not translate well to filepaths |
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| 10:50.11 | jonwil | anyone here know anything about wpa_supplicant? |
| 10:51.11 | Sicelo | Oksanaa: :) |
| 10:51.21 | Sicelo | fyi, i'm not in the 'everyone' above |
| 10:51.24 | Maxdamantus | jonwil: what about it? |
| 10:51.37 | Maxdamantus | Whether it works on the N900? Yes. |
| 10:52.04 | jonwil | there was a discussion going on the other day about using it to replace the N900 WiFi subsystem and plugging it into everything |
| 10:52.44 | Maxdamantus | I'd like to do that when I get around to freeing myself from the rest of Maemo. |
| 10:53.39 | jonwil | What are you doing about the tricky stuff like pulseaudio and the cellular bits? |
| 10:54.16 | Maxdamantus | I'm not doing much about it atm .. "when I get around to .." |
| 10:54.33 | jonwil | do you have any plans? |
| 10:55.12 | Maxdamantus | Wait until another N900 appears on trademe so I can experiment with a device other than my main phone. |
| 10:56.19 | jonwil | I cant imagine there are that many N900s floating around in New Zealand... |
| 10:56.26 | Maxdamantus | but I'd ultimately probably try to avoid pulseaudio other than for telephony if that's required. |
| 10:56.59 | Maxdamantus | (and just create a small number of alsa devices for specific things) |
| 10:57.21 | jonwil | pulseaudio is necessary for proper operation of the N900 audio system in all sorts of funky ways |
| 10:57.41 | Maxdamantus | I think there are basically two funky ways. |
| 10:57.56 | Maxdamantus | one is telephony, the other is avoiding blowing the speakers. |
| 10:58.41 | Maxdamantus | I imagine avoiding blowing the speakers is possible through a mixer in alsa. |
| 10:58.59 | Maxdamantus | atm pulseaudio just goes through alsa, as usual. |
| 10:59.20 | jonwil | based on my analysis of the PulseAudio blobs, there are several reasons they exist. One is the speaker protection, one is feeding audio to the cellular modem and then the rest of it is mostly a bunch of sophisticated algorithms to make the audio sound much better |
| 10:59.31 | Maxdamantus | except for telephony, because there are some crazy proprietary plugins for that that don't use alsa. |
| 11:00.29 | Maxdamantus | Speaking of sound, just made a pretty cool-feeling epoxy-based angle connector. |
| 11:00.59 | Maxdamantus | (because you need something like that on the N900) |
| 11:01.24 | Maxdamantus | just hopes it isn't destroyed somehow as it cures. |
| 11:01.26 | jonwil | I can tell you that no you will not be able to deal with the speaker protection just by going through alsa |
| 11:01.49 | Maxdamantus | "just by going through alsa" |
| 11:01.57 | Maxdamantus | outputting to the hw device itself, no. |
| 11:02.19 | Maxdamantus | but I imagine you could add a mixer in the middle that would do the sort of capping pulseaudio does. |
| 11:02.31 | Maxdamantus | (just using alsa) |
| 11:03.04 | jonwil | Its not that simple, trust me (says the guy who has been knee deep inside the nokia pulseaudio blobs many times) |
| 11:03.37 | jonwil | Also even if you ignore cellular telephony and speaker protection, feeding audio through the speakers unprocessed would probably sound like crap |
| 11:04.01 | jonwil | since you wont get all the nice stuff the Nokia blobs do to make the audio sound good on such crappy speakers as the N900 has |
| 11:04.26 | Maxdamantus | I wouldn't be particularly concerned about that anyway tbh |
| 11:04.43 | Maxdamantus | I don't really expect decent quality listening to speakers. |
| 11:04.58 | jonwil | Not just speakers but all audio output |
| 11:05.07 | jonwil | including both wired and wireless earphones |
| 11:05.34 | jonwil | As the closest thing this community has to an expert on the nokia pulseaudio blobs, I can say that trying to replace them (and reinvent the wheel) is not worth the effort |
| 11:05.46 | Maxdamantus | Well, they can't really make wireless earphones sound "better". |
| 11:06.00 | Maxdamantus | unless they make assumptions about what "better" is. |
| 11:06.49 | Maxdamantus | you should be able to send the PCM desired by the audio author over Bluetooth. |
| 11:07.20 | jonwil | well I know it does something to bluetooth audio (and to FM radio too) but I dont know what |
| 11:07.22 | Maxdamantus | maybe there are hardware issues regarding the DAC attached to the audio plug. |
| 11:07.37 | Maxdamantus | if it does something to the Bluetooth audio, I'm inclined not to trust it. |
| 11:07.48 | Maxdamantus | at least, not to trust that it does something useful. |
| 11:08.19 | jonwil | as for wpa_supplicant, how would all the UI for it be handled, i.e. the UI for connecting to networks, inputting passwords for password protected networks etc? |
| 11:08.31 | jonwil | Does wpa_supplicant do that or would we need something new for it? |
| 11:08.47 | Maxdamantus | wpa_supplicant usually comes with wpa_gui, which works. |
| 11:08.57 | Maxdamantus | It's a bit fiddly on the N900 though ime |
| 11:09.20 | Maxdamantus | I'd probably just rely on invoking shell scripts. |
| 11:09.48 | Maxdamantus | (fiddly because it's not designed for a touchscreen) |
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| 11:19.17 | Maxdamantus | is currently listening to music through alsa directly. |
| 11:22.28 | jonwil | getting wpa_supplicant to work is much easier than making all the bits that talk to the existing WiFi subsystem talk to the new WiFi subsystem |
| 11:23.49 | Maxdamantus | I don't think there are really many bits that talk to the "WiFi subsystem" |
| 11:24.19 | Maxdamantus | there's basically just the DNS server that asks to connect if something tries to do a lookup through it and it's not already connected. |
| 11:24.27 | Maxdamantus | otherwise I don't think anything really cares. |
| 11:28.31 | jonwil | you would be surprised, there are a few things that care |
| 11:28.54 | Maxdamantus | Like what? |
| 11:30.17 | jonwil | well for starters it depends if you are replacing icd2 completly or whether you just rip out the WiFi bits and write new ICD2 plugins that use wpa_supplicant to do their work |
| 11:31.15 | jonwil | but there are also a few things tied into the connectivity UI that might get in the way a little |
| 11:31.31 | jonwil | especially if you want/need to keep the GPRS bits unchanged and just deal with the WiFi bits |
| 11:32.54 | Maxdamantus | I'd just avoid using it for connecting to WiFi. |
| 11:33.05 | jonwil | avoid using what? ICD2? |
| 11:33.09 | Maxdamantus | Yes. |
| 11:33.24 | jonwil | its not that simple either, lots of things are tied into ICD2 |
| 11:33.33 | Maxdamantus | Like what? |
| 11:33.43 | jonwil | checking now |
| 11:33.52 | Maxdamantus | If they are, they shouldn't be. |
| 11:34.09 | Maxdamantus | It should really only affect configuration things. |
| 11:34.22 | Maxdamantus | eg, the effects of changing networking options in the settings menu. |
| 11:35.24 | jonwil | ok so even if we ignore connui-* (connectivity UI bits), I can see intellisyncd talking to icd2 over dbus |
| 11:35.26 | Maxdamantus | When things trigger the connection dialogue to pop up, that's just the DNS server responding. You avoid that by not using whatever the system that creates /etc/resolv.conf is. |
| 11:35.45 | jonwil | libconic as well |
| 11:35.52 | jonwil | libconninet |
| 11:35.54 | Maxdamantus | (and use a normal DHCP client that creates it, like dhcpcd or dhclient) |
| 11:36.10 | jonwil | libhildonfm uses it for some reason |
| 11:36.22 | jonwil | .libqicdbearer wants it |
| 11:36.30 | jonwil | as does libqtbearer |
| 11:36.36 | jonwil | and libqtnetwork |
| 11:36.41 | jonwil | and libqtsysteminfo |
| 11:36.50 | Maxdamantus | Are you just looking at this through ldd? |
| 11:36.50 | jonwil | oh and wappushd |
| 11:36.55 | Maxdamantus | ldd is transitive. |
| 11:37.00 | jonwil | no, this is stuff talking to it via dbus |
| 11:37.19 | Maxdamantus | "libqtnetwork" is talking to it? |
| 11:37.21 | jonwil | I am grepping a local copy of the N900 root filesystem for anything with the string "com.nokia.icd" |
| 11:37.35 | jonwil | to see anything that might be talking to icd2 via dbus |
| 11:37.50 | jonwil | I think a few of these are just talking to it for status reasons |
| 11:37.58 | jonwil | i.e. they are listening for a "hey, network status has changed |
| 11:38.01 | jonwil | signal |
| 11:38.03 | Maxdamantus | might be talking, or happens to include some particular string in its compiled code? |
| 11:38.11 | Maxdamantus | I think those things are completely different. |
| 11:39.52 | jonwil | these binaries also include the string /com/nokia/icd (for the dbus path) and in most cases the name of one or more methods/signals I know are on that dbus interface |
| 11:40.18 | jonwil | I have been pulling N900 binaries apart for long enough to know how to tell which binaries are talking to which dbus interfaces :) |
| 11:41.02 | jonwil | That said a lot of what talks to ICD2 is foss (e.g. all the QT stuff0 and the few bits that aren't can probably be handled somehow |
| 11:41.52 | Maxdamantus | And since they're libraries, they probably just have methods that applications *CAN* use, but don't necessarily. |
| 11:42.18 | Maxdamantus | eg, that libqtnetwork sounds like an extension of something from QT itself. |
| 11:42.45 | Maxdamantus | so there are probably plain QT programs that naturally use that but not the specific Maemo functionality to do with WiFi. |
| 11:42.48 | jonwil | anyhow, auditing who talks to what in the way of dbus stuff, gconf stuff and other things is what I have been doing and will be doing (see http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=96108 for the start of that) |
| 11:43.20 | Maxdamantus | Practically, I don't think most of it would affect me. |
| 11:43.29 | jonwil | probably not |
| 11:43.53 | jonwil | but in this case I am thinking from the perspective of replacing the wifi subsystem with wpa_supplicant going forward for maemo in general (i.e. cssu) |
| 11:43.57 | Maxdamantus | I just use a few basic things and hack things away when they prevent me from doing things the way I want to. |
| 11:44.10 | jonwil | since that has all sorts of positives |
| 11:44.48 | Maxdamantus | most of my usage atm is ssh, mpd/qmpc, Opera, camera-ui |
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| 13:06.11 | Sicelo | on another note, my 2nd N900 does not "see" headphones/headset/tv-out when connected. however dmesg shows that the associated gpio gets activated |
| 13:09.35 | bencoh | most probably software then |
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| 13:13.00 | Sicelo | i think so too. probably should just reflash. lazy though |
| 13:13.16 | Sicelo | where's stryngs with community image? |
| 13:13.54 | Sicelo | let me install dbu-monitor meantime |
| 13:18.36 | Sicelo | bencoh: might actually be hardware :) |
| 13:19.04 | Sicelo | 2nd N900 shows "ButtonPressed" event in dbus, which doesn't show on other N900 |
| 13:19.46 | KotCzarny | if you reflash you will know |
| 13:19.49 | KotCzarny | for sure |
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| 13:34.39 | Sicelo | not keen on reflash. will test jack properly in the evening, with multimeter |
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| 14:57.48 | Sicelo | i |
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| 17:26.06 | xes | <PROTECTED> |
| 17:28.00 | xes | destroys the mouse |
| 17:28.14 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 17:28.38 | KotCzarny | always reselect after pasting to clear the buffer |
| 17:30.27 | xes | yep... or cut the mouse's tail |
| 17:30.36 | xes | ;) |
| 17:30.58 | KotCzarny | some buggers went tailless |
| 17:31.34 | KotCzarny | borgmouses with the red glowing eye |
| 17:31.54 | xes | now there is another one without tail.. |
| 17:36.42 | xes | anyway, using at the same time VirtMachines capturing mouse, guake self hiding terminal and weechat with mouse support seems to grant a good level of mess |
| 17:37.16 | KotCzarny | alwaysreselect, always |
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| 17:43.37 | klopsi-u3 | <PROTECTED> |
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| 20:03.49 | Oksanaa | Tracker is quite broken somewhere. I hide all ogg files except one, and it still refuses to index it |
| 20:04.19 | KotCzarny | maybe it doesnt know about ogg format |
| 20:08.06 | Oksanaa | Well, I have to purge-and-install-again ogg-support, then. Media player plays it, but tracker does not index it |
| 20:09.13 | Sicelo | did you have another nick in the past, before Oksanaa? |
| 20:09.52 | Oksanaa | There is tracker-extractor-vorbis, and when called manually, tracker-extract does understand ogg file |
| 20:10.32 | Oksanaa | Oksanaa is mobile. Oksana is desktop. Wikiwide is main nick, rarely used. And there is also Anasko ... |
| 20:11.55 | Oksanaa | was probably using Wikiwide in the past |
| 20:12.03 | Sicelo | yea :) |
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| 20:14.26 | KotCzarny | oksana, but it refuses one particular ogg file? (ie. there are ogg files that tracker indexes when available? |
| 20:22.44 | Oksanaa | Nay, any ogg file |
| 20:23.20 | KotCzarny | then the problem is narrowed to ogg support in tracker |
| 20:24.00 | Oksanaa | Yes, and it's frustrating. It was working before I tried to mess with media art in Mussorgsky |
| 20:24.25 | KotCzarny | i just disabled tracker |
| 20:24.27 | KotCzarny | and use oscp |
| 20:24.29 | KotCzarny | :) |
| 20:35.41 | Oksanaa | tracker-extract works, so what's the problem with indexing, I do not get... |
| 20:37.33 | KotCzarny | http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=853235&postcount=14 |
| 20:37.36 | KotCzarny | related? |
| 20:37.55 | Oksanaa | tracker-update-ontology is nice command to know... |
| 20:38.42 | KotCzarny | http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=902329&postcount=17 |
| 20:40.29 | KotCzarny | thread ends at this post, wonder if OP's problem was fixed by it |
| 20:42.26 | Oksanaa | May be related. Hopefully, r4ei"stallig ogg-support will fix it once and not break it again |
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| 20:46.53 | Oksanaa | Hooray! It works! Now, how do I convert mp3 into ogg? |
| 20:49.44 | Oksanaa | And, as metadata editor, Mussorgsky is horrendously limited, I think. Audio:ReleaseDate, Audio:TrackNo , for example |
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| 20:58.46 | KotCzarny | um |
| 20:58.56 | KotCzarny | converting lossless formats is a bad idea |
| 20:59.53 | KotCzarny | also, you can post to that thread or to notify cssu people (if you use cssu) and/or notify ogg-support people |
| 21:00.15 | KotCzarny | also, my google skills rock |
| 21:02.01 | Oksanaa | ogg-support works... Until I break it by messing with media art |
| 21:03.01 | Oksanaa | will likely post to that thread, yes |
| 21:07.29 | Sicelo | tracker-extract is in N900? |
| 21:08.12 | Sicelo | ah, i see |
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| 21:50.48 | Sicelo | freemangordon: i want to reinstall 720p support. however, hitting a snag with Preparing to replace omap3-dsp-hd-codecs 0.3.8-7+0m6 (using omap3-dsp-hd-codecs_0.3.8-7+0m6_armel.deb) ... |
| 21:50.52 | Sicelo | --23:46:49-- https://qa9recEP:*password*@downloads.maemo.nokia.com/harmattan/rm680/omap3-dsp-hd-codecs_0.3.8-7+0m6_armel.deb |
| 21:54.42 | jonwil | downloads.maemo.nokia.com no longer exists |
| 21:54.45 | kerio | rip |
| 21:54.59 | jonwil | http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=1467566&postcount=112 has details of a mirror you can use |
| 21:55.08 | jonwil | its what I am using on my N900 right now |
| 21:55.28 | Sicelo | have extracted the files .. and editing the preinstall script .. it's hardcoded for that URL |
| 22:03.52 | Oksana | Hardcoded is no-good... |
| 22:04.02 | freemangordon | Sicelo: just check what preinst or posinst does (dpkg -x) |
| 22:04.10 | freemangordon | and do that by hand |
| 22:08.06 | bencoh | jonwil: muarf.org doesn't host any harmattan mirror |
| 22:08.19 | bencoh | (I really feel stupid for not doing so) |
| 22:08.38 | jonwil | its good that we have a mirror of the fremantle nokia repos |
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| 22:08.54 | jonwil | otherwise it would be impossible to reinstall any of the stock packages if you needed to for some reason |
| 22:09.14 | bencoh | it's "good enogh", but I really wish I mirrored harmattan and older Maemos as well |
| 22:10.06 | bencoh | Sicelo: do you have a copy of omap3-dsp-hd-codecs_0.3.8-7+0m6_armel.deb or do you need it? |
| 22:12.14 | Sicelo | i would like to have it. thanks |
| 22:13.07 | Sicelo | i can see omap3-dsp-hd-codecs_0.3.9-6+0m6_armel.deb |
| 22:13.32 | bencoh | wow, my only copy is on my n900... anyway, looks like there's still a copy around on the internet :) |
| 22:13.37 | Sicelo | btw, harmattan mirror exists :) http://maemo-repos.com/apt-mirror/all-mirror/n9mirror/ |
| 22:15.38 | Sicelo | bencoh: the 0.3.9 should work on N900? |
| 22:15.52 | bencoh | no idea |
| 22:16.44 | bencoh | might as well ask freemangordon after his night of sleep :) |
| 22:17.32 | Sicelo | will use 0.3.8 to be on safe side. i should be sleeping too, haha |
| 22:19.39 | bencoh | oh, btw ... .debs are attached to tmo post |
| 22:19.48 | bencoh | (?) |
| 22:20.14 | Sicelo | not hd-codecs... always thought so too |
| 22:20.19 | Sicelo | it's just a script |
| 22:20.35 | bencoh | ah, nevermind, right |
| 22:23.40 | Sicelo | part of my problem with videos was .. i had hd-codecs installed, but something restored original libgstdsp.so to original state |
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